February 17, 2025 • 44 mins
Discover how former Harlem Globetrotters athletic trainer turned business coach, Michael Dickey, unravels his personal journey with ADHD—a revelation sparked by his son's experiences. Despite initial pushbacks from healthcare professionals, Michael sought a diagnosis that ultimately shed light on the struggles he faced throughout his career and life. His story is both enlightening and empowering as we uncover how recognizing and embracing ADHD can transform not just personal lives but also entrepreneurial paths, aligning them with inherent strengths and passions.
Join us as we explore the nuanced transition Michael experienced moving from the adrenaline-fueled world of athletic training to a more introspective role of coaching entrepreneurs with ADHD. We discuss the identity shifts faced by those stepping away from dynamic careers due to chronic illness or approaching retirement. Michael shares insights on how to turn these challenges into opportunities, advocating for the importance of self-awareness and leveraging strengths to guide the next generation of athletes and coaches.
In this enlightening episode, we dive into understanding one's unique problem-solving style and conquering executive dysfunction using the conative part of the mind. Learn from Michael about the four action modes that define problem-solving approaches and how to embrace your distinct style to boost productivity and avoid burnout. Tune in for practical strategies on organizing tasks by energy levels and finding balance through joy and extracurricular pursuits, ensuring a successful and fulfilling entrepreneurial journey.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Andi (00:00):
Welcome back to my Spoonie Sisters podcast.
Today's guest is Michael Dickey, a business coach who
specializes in helpingentrepreneurs with ADHD build
thriving and fulfillingbusinesses.
As a certified Colby consultantand a fellow ADHD entrepreneur,
michael has a uniqueperspective on the challenges
(00:20):
and opportunities that come withrunning a business while
navigating a deep.
Before becoming a coach,michael worked as an athletic
trainer, including an incrediblestint with the Harlem
Globetrotters.
How cool is that?
Now he combines his deepunderstanding of performance,
resilience and joy to helpothers build businesses that
(00:40):
align with their strength andtheir passions.
When he's not coaching, michaelkeeps busy training for
strongman competitions,attending live music events and
coaching his kids' flag footballteam.
Let's dive in and learn moreabout Michael's insights and
tips for entrepreneurs with ADHD.
Michael (00:57):
Welcome, Michael.
Thank you, Jenny and Andy.
I'm so excited to be here tochat with you.
Andi (01:02):
We're excited to have you here.
I'm so excited to be here tochat with you.
We're excited to have you here.
Can you share a bit about yourpersonal journey with ADHD and
how it has influenced yourcareer path?
Michael (01:19):
Yes, my journey really started with our eight-year-old
son, alex, who we adopted whenhe was two.
As he was getting older, infour and five or so, we noticed
that he had some realsignificant impulsivity issues
and inability to focus and sitstill, and more than a normal
four and five-year-old boy would.
That can be kind of typical forthat age, but it was more than
that.
His pre-K teacher wasfrustrated with him because he
couldn't sit still in circletime or was having these
(01:41):
outbursts and making noises.
And the final straw was that wewere going for a family walk
around the block and this mighthave been during the pandemic,
actually.
So we were home, we're goingfor a walk, and we said, okay,
we're going to cross the streetto go out.
And we were going thatdirection and he just started to
cross without waiting for us.
It was in the middle of thestreet, there wasn't a crossing
there or anything, and so wesaid this is, you know, this is
(02:03):
an issue, this is something weneed to have addressed.
And so we went to hispediatrician and she gave us the
questionnaires and I was goingthrough it my part of the
questionnaire and I said, oh, Ido that.
And then, oh, I got in troublefor that when I was little, you
know.
And finally it was like, oh mygosh, I think I have ADHD.
And it explained so much.
And then I went to my primarycare physician to talk about it
(02:25):
and see what my options were andhe said, yeah, it sounds like
you have ADHD, but there's a but.
And he said, but it's, theinsurance isn't going to pay for
it and it costs a lot.
And it's this whole process youhave to go through and you're
almost 40.
Like why you've gotten this far.
You're probably just fine.
And I said, well, I'm herebecause I have a problem and I
want you to help me address it.
(02:46):
And so that was reallyfrustrating and, looking back,
like I was a very good studentoverall.
I think a lot of it was.
I didn't want to disappoint myparents, who were teachers and I
masked very well and myparents' friends were also my
teachers and so very small townin rural Michigan, so everybody
knew everybody.
But I would have these thingswhere we had messy desk checks
and messy locker checks and Iwould always fill those and they
(03:08):
gave us a planner to keep trackof our homework.
And I never did it and I was astudent athletic trainer and I
had assignments after school towork with different sports teams
and I would just miss myassignments because I forgot to
check the schedule.
So a lot of these things arecoming back to me now like, oh,
this is an explanation.
It's not an excuse, but it's anexplanation.
And so after all of this it'sbeen, it took me about two years
and I was, you know,consistently letting my wife
(03:30):
down in our business that wewere working together on at the
time and I said I need to getthis actually like checked.
And so after that I gotofficially diagnosed and it was
way easier now than it was acouple years ago and it's just
made such a big difference in mylife and just being there for
my family and feeling that I'mnot a failure, which is a lot of
(03:52):
times.
I think that when you have this, you keep letting people down
because of something that youdon't really have control of
that you feel like you're afailure.
That's where I'm at now,personally.
Andi (04:02):
Did you feel like it ended up being as difficult or as
expensive as your doctor had ledon to?
Michael (04:07):
absolutely not no, there, and there are so many
options in that now that areonline that you can go in, and
it's either your insurance willpay for it or, if it's under 150
like just for that evaluation Imean to get that answer is, in
my opinion, worth the money forme, and I had to pay out of
pocket because my insurancedoesn't cover it.
But it's not a thousand, youknow, thousands of dollars, and
(04:28):
it was online.
She was like yep, you got it.
Okay, here's what we're goingto do.
It was just so easy, and so thered tape that I was expecting
to have to go through and waitedtwo years to avoid, like it was
, it was not a big problem.
How did your experience as anathletic trainer particularly?
Andi (04:40):
How did your experience as an athletic trainer,
particularly your time with theHarlem Globetrotters, shape your
perspective on performance andresilience?
Michael (04:49):
Well, this is all in hindsight, I think, right,
because it's been probably about15 years since I was with the
Globetrotters and that's alwaysmy.
You know, you play the threetruths and a lie game and that's
always my truth.
Is that a former HarlemGlobetrotter?
Because nobody expects that.
But you know, if I were notmarried I'd still be doing that
(05:10):
to this day.
But I was good at it.
I loved it.
I loved the guys Like they weremy friends and I loved the
spontaneity of the shows and Iloved that I didn't have to like
do administrative boring things.
I was just in the moment allthe time and treating injuries
and I didn't have to like doadministrative boring things.
I was just in the moment allthe time and treating injuries
and I didn't have to makeschedules and like I was doing
exactly what my strengths were.
(05:31):
And I think, looking back.
But my wife and I wanted tostart a family and she was
starting her own business at thetime and so that travel would
not wasn't conducive to thosethings that we wanted to do for
our goals and our dreams, and soI left that to help her with
her business and be astay-at-home dad, because at
that time we had our daughterCarmen, and that was an extreme
wake-up call because all of asudden I was in charge of my own
(05:52):
schedule, which I'm not greatat, and I had to do all these
tedious behind-the-scenescomputer things rather than
being out and urgently helpingsomebody and those type of
things and I kept dropping theball and not following through
and all these things.
But I would like I could touchstinky, sweaty athletes with
blood and broken bones all daylong and I love doing that.
So it was.
There's this dichotomy of likeI really like doing these things
(06:16):
that I think for a lot ofpeople would be like, oh gross,
you know that that doesn't soundfun at all.
And I'm doing these things,which a lot of people like I
would love to be able to do thatall day long.
So there's these two differentthings that I was thrust into
and if it was just looking back,I could see that I had my dream
job and then left somethingthat was really within my
(06:38):
purpose.
I would love to work with mywife and be a stay at home dad,
but it didn't line up with whatI was given, with my natural
strengths and what I knew how todo, and it made me realize that
a lot of performance is basedon our mental energy capacity
and that to do things and beresilient when it comes to doing
your job, you have to honorthat mental energy.
(06:58):
And if you can't honor yourmental energy and you're
constantly drained doing thethings you're supposed to be
doing, then that's where youknow.
If you're sitting in a job,that's where you probably leave
within six months.
And there are other.
You know, after being trainedin things and coaching people
for a long time, that there arestrategies that we can use to
make those tasks that don't seemquite within alignment with our
(07:18):
strengths actually do and getdone.
Jen (07:20):
I love everything about this conversation.
Right now I just I'm over herefangirling, but it is because we
are so similar.
I want to pick your brain aboutthe athletic trainer and the
feeling of failure, because Istruggled there.
Right, I'm an athletic trainerand I struggle there with the
not even it's not thefollow-through.
(07:41):
I think that I live off ofadrenaline because that doesn't
feel like work to me.
But when I have to sit down andmaybe do something else, that
feels more work.
Ish, and it's not even for methe administrative portion,
because I eat that up.
I love that.
The process, I can see it.
You tell me your big picture.
I can give you all the smallsteps.
My brain works like that.
But if you ask me to dosomething else, that isn't in
(08:04):
one of those two things, I takethe biggest side.
So, post my chronic illnessgoing rogue.
When I had to come off thecourt, I didn't know how to
function from behind the desk.
I didn't, and I realized thatme, my strength is that I lead
with my hands right, like I canbe with you, and literally the
(08:25):
lead by example.
That is my leadership style.
I'm gonna find your strong suitand then you lead.
You made that your own becauseyou use your talents.
But I realized that when I hadto come off the court, when
Jesus decided to sit me down for38 minutes, when I had to come
off the court and try to figurethat out again, I didn't know
how to exist as a coach with adifferent framework that wasn't
(08:50):
my hands.
Michael (08:52):
Yeah, I felt the same way when I finally said, you
know, I have to retire, like I'mliterally retiring my license,
and if I ever want to do thatagain, I have to go, literally
go back to school, take thecertification exam again, like
do all the things, and that'snot.
You know, that's not possibleanymore.
And and it's there's a realstruggle with, like your
identity, right Cause if youlike, I was an athletic trainer.
I have been doing that sincehigh school.
(09:14):
That's what I knew and love formy whole life.
And then all of a sudden that'sgone.
And if you're an athlete orthat's, that's your identity.
And then all of a sudden youhave to make this huge change
that is, I'm not going to bethat person anymore.
It's, I mean, it sucks, it'shard, and you have to find
another avenue that supportsthose strengths.
(09:37):
So you might not be I'm nottaping ankles, I'm not doing
those things anymore but what Ithink my strengths are is that I
find new and innovative ways tohelp people be more efficient
and get the biggest bang fortheir buck.
And so if I, if I, looking back, like that's the essence of
what I did as an athletictrainer, and now that's the
(09:58):
essence of what I do as a coachand so and everything else in
between is well, I got to learnhow to do that.
I got to learn how to be acoach.
I got to learn the business ofbeing in business, yeah, but,
but I still have the passion tohelp people and that's how I
naturally do that.
So I don't know if thatresonates.
Jen (10:14):
It does, because for me I was.
I was learning how to againcoach from a different angle, or
how to teach without my hands,or how to teach without my hands
, and so, although I'm not outthere carrying you off of the
field or off of the track or offof a court, I am now teaching
in a way that I'm teaching youhow to prevent it.
You're doing more prehab andyou're understanding your body
and performance and how itfunctions and the why.
(10:36):
And they get it from adifferent angle now, because I'm
chronically ill and I live in abody that's always in pain, and
so, as mad as I was about thatbody that's always in pain, and
so, as mad as I was about that,I had to come off the court.
For the time I had to come offthe court, it allowed me to
develop a framework for me thatmade these younger athletes
understand how their bodies workand ask more questions, and I
(10:56):
could teach the skill and youcould tape yourself and you
could understand what the tapeis doing and why it's there, for
it's not there just becauseit's cute.
It actually serves a function.
And so now I listen to my youngathletes, each one teach one.
They're our future, and so,although I had to come from
behind the you know the I got itand have the gurney and where's
my bag?
(11:17):
Although I don't do thatanymore, I now have the next
generations of kids that will becoaches, youth coaches or or
they're like here.
I learned this.
This is why she wasn't lying.
I tell them fact check me.
I'm not in the shoes with you.
I'm going to tell you thisbecause I know.
But fact check me and know foryourself, because what I tell
(11:38):
you, what your body will do,it's going to feel different.
And I'm not going to tell youyour body can do something that
I'm physically not in your body.
So your body may not be able todo that, and I hate when people
tell me but you should, youshould be able to do it.
My body's a storm, I should beable to do a lot of things, but
I can't.
And so that was the other thing.
It was me owning the days andthe instances in my life where I
(12:01):
knew I actually can't.
That was where I struggled,hearing myself say I can't do
this, but now I go, I can't dothat, then I'm okay with it.
Oh, I can't do this.
This will probably make meflare that I'm gonna have to
find a different way.
(12:21):
Maybe I should delegate this mycan is my can't for different
reasons other than failure.
Now it's just I can't.
I can't cause I don't have thecapacity, I can't.
I don't have the desire, Ican't because it doesn't align
with me.
I just use it in a differentway now.
Michael (12:36):
I love that.
It's a great perspective and itdoesn't mean that you and for a
lot of people, when you'redoing things that you literally
can't do, or you're havingtrouble because it's the
opposite of how you naturally dothings, it's not because you're
dumb the opposite of how younaturally do things.
It's not because you're dumb,it's not because you have
(12:57):
anything besides, just acapacity issue, really, whether
it's mental or emotional orphysical that we have these
capacities and it's okay.
It doesn't mean you're broken.
It means that you need somehelp.
Jen (13:05):
And it's okay to ask.
Michael (13:24):
Exactly so, michael, what inspired your transition
from athletic training tocoaching entrepreneurs,
specifically with ADHD?
It was just her and a part-timeassistant at that time when I
started helping her.
And now we have like a team of12 people and we have a lot of
amazing work that she's beenspearheading.
But I, you know, leaning into.
I kept being put in a place like, okay, you can do
administrative stuff, okay, andthen after a couple of weeks,
(13:46):
like this is horrible, I can'tdo this.
I got to be helping people, youknow, like real time helping
people, and then we startcoaching people and training
people to become coaches.
And so then it was like, okay,well, I think that my spirit and
my heart is just that I'm ateacher and a coach, like that's
what I have to be doing.
And so I just started to leaninto that more and more and more
, and I will talk about this ina little bit, I think.
(14:08):
But I learned about the Colbyassessment and got certified in
as a Colby consultant and that'swhere I was like this is
exactly what I need to be doingto help people.
And as I was helping more of ourclients that we were training
and coaching the ones that hadADHD and this is before I was
diagnosed or knew that I had itwere like this is so helpful
because I now know why I'mavoiding doing some of these
(14:30):
things, and I know that I'mavoiding it because it's the
energy is not aligned.
The energy needed is notaligned with what I have to give
, and so I think once I gotdiagnosed, it was just an
obvious like well, obviously I'mnot just going to help all
business owners and smallbusiness owners.
I have that with my people, andmy people are, you know,
because entrepreneurs with ADHD,because I learned the hard way
(14:51):
how to do some of these thingsin my own way and then it just
was a natural progression tohelp, like I went through this.
So I need to help the peoplethat are struggling like I did.
Jen (14:59):
So you mentioned the Coley framework.
Can you explain how it worksfor those who are maybe
unfamiliar?
The framework is amazing.
Guys, just buckle up, you're infor a treat.
Can you explain the frameworkto people who may be?
Michael (15:14):
unfamiliar.
Yeah, I love it and I'mprobably going to nerd out way
too much on it, but it's.
I'll nerd out with you, yeah,awesome.
So Kathy Colby, a quick littlebackground.
Kathy Colby is the originatorof this Colby theory and if
you've ever heard of theWunderlicht assessment I don't
know if anybody's heard of thatbefore, but it's an iq test.
The nfl used it for a long timeas their like nfl iq test lots
(15:36):
of executive c-suites, fortune500 companies to use it for
hiring.
Her dad invented thatassessment, so she grew up with
assessments, but it's all aboutlike intelligence, basically
like an iq, and she alwaysthought there was more to a
person than just yourintelligence.
She could never really figureout why, and she was working
with gifted and talentedchildren and she would do the
(16:00):
after-school programs for themwhere she would say here's the
experiment that we're going tobe doing today, here's your
lesson, go ahead.
And we know that these giftedand talented children are really
smart.
But she saw that each of themproblem solved differently to
get to the same answer at theend.
So if it's about smarts andintelligence, they would all do
it the same way, right?
But that's not the case, and soit's been about 40, 50 years
(16:22):
since she's kind of establishedthis and what we know and this
goes back to kind of Aristotleand Plato is that there are
three different parts of themind.
There's the cognitive part,which is what you know about
things, and it's yourintelligence, it's your
experience, it's your education.
We can assess it with, like,what do you know?
What course have you taken?
If you've ever taken a courseor workshop and they give you
(16:42):
that pre-test, you're like, ohman, I got a 25%.
And then you take the courseand you take that same test, get
100%.
Well, your cognitive abilityaround that got better, right.
So that's not what we'retalking about when we're talking
about COLE.
The second part of the mind isthe affective and this is
personality and this is youremotions, your motivation, your
values, those type of things.
(17:02):
And so we can assess that witha Myers-Briggs or an Enneagram
or any of those personalityassessments.
But if you think about that,what motivates you now and what
your values are now compared towhen you were, say, 16 in high
school, probably quite a bit ofa different person, right.
So we know that that can anddoes change over time, and so
that's not what we're talkingabout either.
But what we're talking aboutwith Colby is it's the conative
(17:24):
part of your mind which is maybenot a word.
You maybe not have heard itbefore, but it's conative and
it's how you problem solve.
And if I say, andy, here's aproblem, you can do it however
you want, go.
And I say, jenny, here's aproblem, go.
You might problem solvecompletely differently in how to
get there and differently thanI do.
And it's really a descriptionof how you problem solve and
it's your mental energy capacitywhen you're doing something.
(17:45):
So if you've ever donesomething and you sat down and
you're like I have to do thisfor three hours and I'm 20
minutes in and I am fried, soyou have a shot glass size cup
for that.
But there's other things thatyou're doing.
Maybe it's planning, it's theprocess or it could be lots of
other things that it's.
That's super energizing.
I have a big size cup to fillevery day for that, and so we
(18:09):
look at those, and theinteresting thing is about all
of these are is that it's it'snot genetic.
There's no correlation betweenyour parents' results and how
you problem solve.
It's not biased for race orgender or sex or age or anything
, and so it's.
I see it as like how amazinglytalented every single person in
the entire world is because weall have these amazing strengths
(18:32):
that we all can tap into.
Higher world is because we allhave these amazing strengths
that we all can tap into, andit's ridiculous to think that
you can't do some job simplybecause you are not the right
gender or sex or race or age.
It's this equalizer that we allhave, that we are all equally
great problem solvers, and theseare all strengths.
And so, really quickly, lastthing I'll say about this before
I go too far, is that when itcomes to how you problem solve
(18:53):
and maybe this will resonatewith a lot of you is that we use
four different action modes toproblem solve.
The first one's called factfinder and that just describes
how you gather and shareinformation and when you take
the assessment.
Maybe some of you have takenthe assessment.
The assessment it goes from oneto 10.
10 is not amazing.
One is not failure.
One is just as much of astrength as 10.
It just describes how much youuse that when you're problem
solving.
So if you're a 10 in FactFinder, you have to gather a lot of
(19:17):
information before you can makea decision or problem solve.
To move on, If you're a one ortwo or three, just give me the
bullet points.
That's all I need.
I don't need all the details.
The next one is called followthrough and that describes how
you plan and organize.
Are you a big time planner?
Do you follow step-by-stepprocedures or are you like me
and you do things randomly?
And you can?
Only you know you have to spinfive plates at the same time.
(19:38):
Quick start is the next onethat describes how you deal with
risk and uncertainty.
Are you, do you take lots ofrisks?
Do you improvise a lot or doyou want to follow the protocol?
Do you want to know exactly theright way to do things?
And the last one is calledimplementor, which describes how
you use tools or implements,using your hands to solve
problems all day.
So are you someone that's likea carpenter or electrician or a
surgeon and you're using yourhands all day?
(19:59):
Or do you solve more abstractproblems and so you're in
administration or internalmedicine rather than being a
surgeon?
So we all sit on these and themost important thing is they
don't change over time.
So I can't say Andy, Jenny, youneed to get more follow through
, you need to have less quickstart.
It doesn't work that way.
So we have to be obstinateabout that and say like this is
(20:21):
how I do things.
I'm not going to do thingsanybody else's way and I have to
find sometimes I just have tofind ways that I can do it my
own way and still be successful.
So that's the 10 cent tour ofGoldie.
Andi (20:29):
Wow, you talk about helping clients lean into their
strengths.
Can you share an example of howyou've helped someone do this
successfully?
Michael (20:37):
Yeah.
So I just had a client lastweek thinking about this, and
she is just a true entrepreneur.
She's very much jump it feefirst, you know, I'm just, I'm
just going to figure it out butalso she needs data to back that
up.
So she's a quick start and afact finder at the same time,
and one of those strengths isthat she naturally prioritizes
Like if and when, but also,because of her executive
(20:59):
dysfunction, struggles with theoverwhelm of prioritizing, and
so it's one of those thingswhere I have to have priorities
to work.
I have to know what's the mostimportant thing for me to be
working on, and so you may havemaybe heard the saying of if
nothing's a priority, theneverything's a priority, and
then you get overwhelmed becauseI have all of these things all
around me at the same time thatneed my attention.
I don't know what I need towork on.
(21:21):
So we started with and let me goback really quickly that was
like she just had inactionbecause she didn't know what to
work on, and so she was justkind of stuck in her business,
and so we started by settinggoals Like what are your goals
that you want to do, that youwant to work on that are
exciting to you and that are inline with, kind of the vision
that you have for your future,of where you want to be in three
years.
And then how can we break thosedown to like little baby steps?
(21:43):
Because if I say I'm going tomake $100,000 in my business, if
I do that, like, what are thesteps for me to get there?
That's a big, overwhelming goal.
But then if we sit down andtalk it out, what's the next
thing that has to happen?
What are all of the things thathave to happen?
And then let's get them inorder.
Let's just talk it out and sogiving her permission to set
those goals and then prioritizebased on what's exciting to her
(22:06):
and important to her, and thensay, hey, this is the next step,
let's set some due dates tothat.
Okay, then this is the next duedate and it gives that kind of
a plan also along withprioritizing.
So in her strength was that sheneeded those things, but her
executive dysfunction was notallowing her to do that for her.
Andi (22:21):
I think that's a great example, and I think many of us
were the idea person.
We have 20 ideas of the thingswe want to do someday or now or
whatever it is I know for me Ithink I've told Andy this before
I have this notepad that tellsme a list for different things,
like what has to be done today,what needs to be done this week,
what needs to be done thismonth, and I love it because it
(22:42):
helps me stay extremelyorganized and I live by that
because otherwise I'm going tohave 20 ideas and I'm going to
be all over the place.
Michael (22:50):
Absolutely.
And that's where that shinyobject syndrome can kind of get
in, because if you're notfocused and you know that I have
to get this done, it'simportant.
Might not be super fun, but nowthat I know, like, okay, I have
to give myself permission tonot seek those outside things,
because I know this is inalignment with what my goals are
, my dreams are and what'simportant to me.
Jen (23:09):
Exactly that was me.
That was me.
Last week I had to do a pitchdeck for something that was not
athletic Right and so, but lastnight I was doing the camp kits,
the kits that they get, sotheir gear and uniforms and all
the things, the interest meetingbut building that presentation.
I was so hyped and then I hadto do the stuff you want and I
(23:38):
was like I also do this, guys,and I'm super good at it, but I
also do this.
But I was like pulling teeth.
It took me all weekend tomuster the energy to sit down
and do the task.
That literally took me 30minutes.
I dreaded it all day.
It took me 30 minutes.
I dreaded it all day.
It took me 30 minutes.
I just wasn't fired up about it.
(23:58):
It was a necessary evil, Iguess, you know, for business
growth, but I wasn't fired upabout it.
Michael (24:04):
And when you after the fact, you're probably like that
was just 30 minutes, I can do it.
You know 30 minutes.
It was nothing but that leadingup to it, just the dread of
that energy.
It might as well have been afull day worth of dread.
Andi (24:19):
I second that, andy.
I think a lot of times thereare things that we just really
don't want to do.
Maybe we don't like to do it,maybe we don't feel like it's
our skill set and maybe it needsto be done this week, but I'd
really rather put it on the listof by the end of the month and,
like you said, 30 minutes andreally it wasn't that bad.
But sometimes it's really niceto have someone to bring us back
(24:41):
down to earth and say okay,maybe try this, this and this,
and it's only going to take you30 minutes, you're going to get
through it.
Jen (24:48):
I think it's super good because Jen's my checks and
balances, so I'll send an audiomessage.
I've got to do this thing andshe'll go.
I know you don't want to, butmaybe, if you just do it 10
minutes at a time, maybe just doone slide and although it's not
what you want to hear, it'swhat you need to hear.
And she was right.
She was like give me threereasons why you can't do one
slide right now.
Okay, but I do that to myfriends too.
(25:09):
For instance, give me threereasons why we can't do it right
now because in the time thatyou're telling me you could have
actually been done.
So give me the three reasonsand I talk myself down.
But sometimes you can't alwaystalk yourself down.
So, having other people whounderstand how your brain works,
that understand the languagethat registers with you when
you're being communicated withyou want to be communicated with
(25:31):
and not talked at, so that youcan bring your strengths
strengths out, so you can do thetask, even the tedious ones,
even the ones we don't quiteenjoy.
Michael (25:39):
Absolutely.
What kind of advice would yougive to Spoonies that are
navigating?
Is kind of what we talked abouta little bit, but is
identifying like literallyidentifying those things that
(26:00):
you do, whether it's home orit's at work, that put you into
that flow state that's why mybusiness is called Flow State
Executive Coaching.
What are those things that youdo that are fun and exciting and
you enjoy doing them?
They actually raise your energylevels.
They're super energizing.
Those things that you do thatare fun and exciting and you
enjoy doing them.
They actually like raise yourenergy levels, they're super
energizing.
And then figure out what arethose kryptonite kind of tasks
(26:22):
that still need to get done.
They're draining.
You dread doing them.
They're just awful, and 30minutes of them feels like a
full day.
And so what can we do?
How can we get those done?
And so you need to honor thatmental energy as much as
possible, as well as yourphysical and emotional energy
too.
And so here's a really easyexercise that you can do, and
I'm sure that most of yourlisteners have done something
(26:43):
similar.
But if you take a piece of paperand you make three columns, and
one column says draining andhate, the middle column says
okay, neutral.
And the third column says loveslash, energizing.
And you just start to thinkabout everything that you do
throughout the day oh, I lovedoing that.
Oh, my gosh, I hate, I hatethat.
That is, I can't even startthat.
I hate it so much.
Oh, that's okay.
Like, do I love it, no, but doI hate it no.
(27:04):
And and so you could actuallyyou come up with a list of the
love energizing.
That is my zone of genius,that's my flow state.
You know, whatever you want tocall it, this is what I need to
lean into.
The okay neutral is I canprobably keep doing those until
they I can't anymore.
Basically, would I love to givethat to someone else, probably,
but maybe I still do thatbecause it's not horrible yet.
(27:27):
But then the stuff that I hateand it's draining.
You immediately have to come upwith some way that it can still
get done, and there's reallyonly five.
But the hard part about that isthat means I might have to hire
someone, which is overwhelmingin its own right and cost money.
You can delete it or pause it.
You can say well, should Ireally be doing this right now?
What's the ROI of me actuallydoing this right now.
(27:48):
There's probably other thingsthat are way more important and
give me back more.
Right now we can build habits.
How can I build a habit in themorning to get something done
that doesn't take?
You know, a habit is just likebrushing your teeth, right?
You just naturally do that andyou know you have to do it, and
it's not a big deal.
You can automate it somehow.
And so if you're like one goodexample is if you send an email
(28:10):
and it's the same email over andover and you're writing the
same email over and over, youcan make a template and copy and
paste it, or use a CRM toautomate things, so you're not
manually sending things over andover again.
And then the last one and Ithink it's the most important is
how can you do that your ownway?
Because sometimes, as abusiness owner, you just have to
do it.
There's nobody else that can doit except for you.
(28:31):
And so for Andy's example of Iwas working on this for 30
minutes, but it felt like it wasgoing to be eight hours.
That's when maybe you've heardof the Pomodoro technique.
That's when something like thePomodoro works really well is
that I just have to get throughthis and it's going to take me
forever.
Well, you work for 20 minutes,take a five to 10 minute break.
You keep repeating that and itactually keeps you more
(28:55):
energized.
Now, some people would sayabout the Pomodoro method is why
I don't like that because itinterrupts me.
Well, it's not for when you'relike in the zone and you want to
get hyper focused, it's forwhen you need to break that up
because it's so draining and notenergizing that you want to
break it up to kind ofre-energize a little bit.
And then I also think one thingto think about is how you
organize your day in your weekand really organizing your
(29:17):
specific days by the energylevel that it takes to do those
things.
And so you might and these arewords that I use and they're a
little bit confusing but a flowday Like that is when I'm
working on things that areputting me in my flow state.
These are the things that I loveto do, these are the things
that make me my money, these aremy revenue generating things.
This is what I'm me personally,working with my clients.
You want to do those.
(29:37):
Say it's Wednesday, thursday,friday, and then there's a grow
day, which is those are thethings I'm spent growing my
business.
So it's administrative things,it's networking, it's when I'm
doing my CEO stuff, it's whenI'm doing my finances, and
what's the worst thing that canhappen is that you do an
administrative task that's superboring or you do whatever
activity that's super boring,and then you have to go into
(29:57):
that meeting with a client thathas to be super uplifting and
energizing.
Those two energies don't match.
So if you can start to planyour week in accordance to those
energies as much as possible,you're going to have the energy
will match.
You're not going to be havingthis roller coaster.
And the last day is that I callit a glow day, which is that
personal time that you do use tore-energize and kind of bring
joy into your life.
(30:18):
That's when you get your bestthinking done.
Andi (30:20):
I'm kind of geeking out on all this over here.
You've got me Googling whileI'm listening to you.
Jen (30:25):
So it's funny that you would bring up the Pomodoro,
right?
Because that's what I did whenI did the 30-minute presentation
.
I was like, okay, I'm going togive it 30 minutes and if at 30
minutes today and I'll just keepdoing it, but that was the
technique that I use, I'm goingto do it until my attention goes
somewhere else.
And the minute my attentiondiverts means I'm not supposed
(30:48):
to be working on it right now,because am I giving it
everything that I need to giveit, all of the attention, all of
the focus, the care, thenurture, all of the stuff before
I send this out?
Can I say that I did that?
So no, I set my good old timerand it was tick, tick, tick,
tick, ticking away and I'm like,and who would have thought?
30 minutes later I was done andI set the 30 minute timer and I
was gonna take my break at 15minutes.
(31:10):
I do 15 and 5, so 15 minutes onfive minutes, something fat fun
.
I'll dance, I'll sing, I watch,whatever.
And then 15 minutes back, justwant to get the blood flowing to
, to break up the monotony in mymind.
It's the whole party, maybe getsome creative juices going.
But when I afterwards I thensaid to myself again it was 30
minutes.
(31:30):
It was whether or not I had theemotional capacity to use my
energy to do that for 30 minutes, because my reality was I had
already been on socials for morethan 30 minutes.
I had already tinkered aroundthe house doing nothing for more
than 30 minutes, looking at thecomputer for me to do that
presentation, and had everyother reason of nothing to not
(31:52):
do it.
I just didn't have the mentalcapacity to do it.
I learned over the years togive myself grace.
When I was an athlete I didn'tunderstand the.
My mental capacity is exhaustedand I will push through things.
And when I was the student Iwould do that too.
And then, as the young coach,to prove a point, it was I'm
going to push through it.
And then, you know, I tried topush through it and I got sat
(32:14):
down and I realized that it'sokay to just not have the mental
capacity.
And the people that hear it howthey receive what you say, not
your business.
Once you say it, you know,respectfully, I don't have the
capacity.
A no is a no.
I can't is I can't, that's it.
I don't have the capacity.
Now, how they receive that,again, not your problem, but I
struggle with disappointment inhow they may receive my no or
(32:38):
I'm not going to do that.
It's real.
Michael (32:40):
It is, it really is, and that's the hard part, that
is.
I mean, setting boundariesright that's really what that
comes down to and holdingyourself to those boundaries.
But you're setting them, not ina selfish way, but you're
setting them for yourself, to besuccessful and honor yourself.
And for one, on one side, it'slike I'm doing this because this
is what I need to be successful.
(33:01):
But also, on the other side, Idon't want people to see me as a
pushover either.
You know, I think there'sthere's there's lots to that
about setting boundaries, andthat is honestly a hard thing
and I I struggle with that aswell of like saying no, and the
rejection, sensitivity tohearing no also is real, it's,
it's.
It's not an easy thing, butit's.
And I think Andy, you saidsomething earlier that but what
(33:24):
would?
How would I coach myself if Iwas my own client?
That can kind of be.
What would I tell somebody elseif I came to me with a bra?
And then it's like oh yeah, I'mright.
You know, I knew that the wholetime.
Jen (33:35):
Yeah, and to make it even worse, I force myself to go
stand in the mirror when I'mtalking to me.
What would you tell your client?
Ok, seriously, it's 30 minutes.
Break it up into chunks, itcould be 10 minute intervals,
whatever, but you can do it.
It's not that you can't, it'sthat you don't want to.
Why don't you want to?
This particular thing is boringto you, ok, but it's going to be
equally as boring when you sitdown to do it, whenever you
(33:56):
decide to do it.
And now you'll be rushing to doit and most likely frustrated
because now you're rushing to doit.
But I literally people thinkthat I'm crazy.
I will have a wholeconversation with myself in the
mirror.
I'm going to look myself in theeyes and give myself that
excuse out loud, because I spenta lot of time where I wouldn't
look myself in the face.
If the no was the no, I wouldbe like oh okay, you didn't
(34:18):
think it was good enough, ormaybe you're right, maybe I need
to do it your way.
No, now, my no means my way isnot necessarily wrong.
It may not be how you got to it, but my solution is still a
solution and is a mighty iconicone.
You can, you know, roll thedice if you want to or not, and
I'm not going to tell you to doit my way, but I'm gonna help
you find a way to do it your own.
And so when I talk to my friends, jenny included, hey, I got an
(34:41):
idea, let's brainstorm, find away for you to do it and make it
your own in a way that'scomfortable for you and where
you may feel weak.
It may be my strong suit and Ihave time, and it may be my zone
of genius, and it is.
So.
All of it had by chance, all ofthe things that Jenny dreads
doing it's my zone of genius andall of the cute, designsy
(35:06):
things that I hate doing thegraphics and the showing up on
the social media spaces, and allthe things that is her zone of
genius.
So we balance.
So, which is my next segue.
So we're talking a little bitabout balance, right?
So, between coaching andtraining for your strongmans and
coaching flag football, allthese hats that Michael Dickey
wears, what's Michael Dickey's?
Michael (35:25):
secret to balance?
That's a great question andI'll say I'm not there quite yet
.
You know, I'm not all the waythere yet.
I don't know if anybody reallyis Personally like what.
The first thing that I think Ireally had to do was just use my
calendar and live and die by it, and it's not natural to me to
be so scheduled, but it's just ahabit that you have to build.
And again, talking about habits, and it's one of those things
(35:47):
where my wife would say, hey,would you do this?
I'm like sure, I'll totallyremember to do that, I'll
totally, you know, and I neverdid so.
It's like okay, what do I haveto do?
Well, the moment that I know Ihave to do something got to put
it in my calendar, got to put itin my task app, just got to do
it and you build that habit.
And then when you get out ofthat habit, you're like, oh my
gosh, it was so much better whenI was in this habit.
What am I doing?
(36:08):
And so it's building thosehabits and using the resources
that you do have and technologydoes make those things a lot
easier, the technical side ofthese type of things.
But I also make sure that, likewe were saying, andy, that I
give myself breaks, whether it'sfive to 10 minutes, and
especially when I'm drained, andto some people that might
actually be kind ofcounterintuitive.
(36:28):
Well, I'm working on this.
If I take a break, isn't thatjust going to slow me down and
slow the whole process down?
But if you're working, takinglittle baby bites out, and then
you do something to re-energizerather than I'm just going to
plow through this and get itdone, the quality of the output
that you have is going to behigher because you're actually
at least maintaining that energylevel, not just constantly.
You know, you're not like if youever crammed in high school or
(36:51):
college by the end of the nightyou're like I'm not going to
remember any of this.
Why did I stay up to four inthe morning?
It's the same kind of thing.
It's not going to be as good.
So just using that time tore-energize.
But for me the when the Correct, that's okay.
Sorry For me, theseextracurricular and these hobby
things are like.
I actually do them because theyre-energize me and I think those
are fun.
And so if I'm not getting likethat, I'm not filling my cups by
(37:15):
work, then work, then I dothings that do fill up my cup
outside of work and honor thatmental energy outside of work
and working with like,especially with like football.
Like is it are seven and eightyear old football players.
Are they like amazing and arewe there to win championships?
No, but I like my purpose inlife and one of them is to like
uplift children and helping youhave those positive wins and
(37:37):
build those poor memories.
Like the globetrotters.
Like that was so fun to seethose kids just having the time
of their life with their momsand dads.
Because they went with theirmoms and dads when they were
little and like that's alwayskind of been a commonality of me
of.
That brings me joy too, and soit's balancing that energy by
doing the things that are fun toyou and making the time.
Andi (37:56):
It sounds like people being around people is what
bringing joy yeah, I think so.
Michael (38:01):
Yeah, just, I never thought about that way, but yeah
, it just blew my mind a littlebit, jenny, but yeah, I think I
think it's just the being withpeople and watching people enjoy
themselves and being andhelping them like have that in
their lives, so maybe they theydon't do it for themselves is is
super enjoyable for sure, sopeople are your purpose.
Jen (38:21):
Oh yeah, I think, so love that he likes it when he talks
about people.
You do so where there is balance, there is often a lot of joy
and you light up when you talkabout how you keep balance.
People is your, that is yourpurpose driven.
I put my feet on the ground andI this is what I want to do,
(38:43):
this is what I woke up to do,and it just radiates from you.
It just radiates from you.
So when you're working withyour clients because you are
you're, you're oozing joy andyou're you're saying I'm fired
up to work with you that is theenergy that you bring into the
space.
I'm assuming it's the energythat you brought into this
conversation.
But how do you help yourclients incorporate more joy
(39:06):
into their lives and into theirprocess so that they have less
stuck points and more sore areasin their journey than they have
?
The?
This is never going to getbetter, or maybe I just can't do
this.
How do you help them find thejoy?
Michael (39:19):
Yeah, it's a good question, or maybe I just can't
do this.
How do you help them find thejoy?
Yeah, it's a good questionthere's, I mean, as far as it
being just a part of a process,like I don't think to most ADHD
people and entrepreneurs thatprocesses are very fun and
enjoyable.
So that's why we don't do thosethings, we avoid those like,
but being able to help themthrough that process and just
make it fun and make it asenjoyable as possible and I'm
(39:41):
not a formal guy, Like I'm not.
I would rather I don't want to.
You know, I want to be friendswith everybody, which is not
always a great thing, but likethat's that's who I want to be.
Like I want to be your friend,holding your hand through this.
I don't want to be some stuffyconsultant that is telling you
what to do, but we're going todo it together and might as well
have some fun doing it.
(40:02):
So that's how, like, throughthe process, that's how I help
them.
But also it's important thatthey make time to incorporate
joy into their lives.
And what is it that they are notdoing?
You know, I had a client thathe was like I just want to have,
I don't want to have to worktill 10 o'clock at night, want
to have I don't want to have towork till 10 o'clock at night
and because I want to hang outwith my sons more and I want to
(40:23):
coach their soccer team and sohelping them realize that that
is the direction they want to go.
But here is where that block is, here's where that is Be like
let's.
But if we, if we work towardsthat, that's that's, that's your
heaven, right?
That's where you, that's yourideal dream of where you want to
be, is making sure that theyare leaning towards joy and that
the direction is always in joy.
And then also, let's talk aboutwhen you are in that zone where
(40:44):
it's just draining.
How can you, what are thosethings that bring you joy?
Is it putting out some musicand dancing?
Is it just calling a friend andchatting for 10 minutes?
Is it, you know, watch,listening to a quick standup
comedy routine or something likethat?
What is it that brings you joythat you can incorporate into
your life easily and to upliftyou and re-energize you?
Andi (41:01):
How can listeners connect with you and learn more about
your coaching services?
What is the best way for themto reach out to you?
Michael (41:08):
You can go to my website,
flowstateexecutivecoachingcomlongest website ever, sorry and
my Instagram is atflowstateexecutivecoaching, and
so you can go there and contactme there, check out all the tips
and tutorials I have on myInstagram, and then I'll say
that if anybody is interested inand I have a free workshop that
I do every year in the firstThursday and Friday of December
(41:31):
and it's all about goal settingso I help them through my
ADHD-friendly goal settingsystem that I use and two-day
events.
That's virtual, and so if you'veever had trouble, even if you
don't have ADHD, I would ratherhave you be there and use this
than be a client.
I just want people to takethese tools home, but I'm going
(41:52):
to hold your hand through it.
You just fill in the blanks,I'm going to coach you through
it and give you feedback andthen you have your goal set for
next year and then you knowexactly where you need to go.
So that is on my website aswell, but I'd love for anybody
and everybody to join you.
Thank you, it's been a pleasureand so much fun chatting with
you both.
Andi (42:07):
Thank you, michael.
Until next time, don't forgetyour spoof.
Welcome back to my Spoonie Sisters podcast.
Today's guest is Michael Dickey, a business coach who
specializes in helpingentrepreneurs with ADHD build
thriving and fulfillingbusinesses.
As a certified Colby consultantand a fellow ADHD entrepreneur,
michael has a uniqueperspective on the challenges
(00:20):
and opportunities that come withrunning a business while
navigating a deep.
Before becoming a coach,michael worked as an athletic
trainer, including an incrediblestint with the Harlem
Globetrotters.
How cool is that?
Now he combines his deepunderstanding of performance,
resilience and joy to helpothers build businesses that
(00:40):
align with their strength andtheir passions.
When he's not coaching, michaelkeeps busy training for
strongman competitions,attending live music events and
coaching his kids' flag footballteam.
Let's dive in and learn moreabout Michael's insights and
tips for entrepreneurs with ADHD.
Michael (00:57):
Welcome, Michael.
Thank you, Jenny and Andy.
I'm so excited to be here tochat with you.
Andi (01:02):
We're excited to have you here.
I'm so excited to be here tochat with you.
We're excited to have you here.
Can you share a bit about yourpersonal journey with ADHD and
how it has influenced yourcareer path?
Michael (01:19):
Yes, my journey really started with our eight-year-old
son, alex, who we adopted whenhe was two.
As he was getting older, infour and five or so, we noticed
that he had some realsignificant impulsivity issues
and inability to focus and sitstill, and more than a normal
four and five-year-old boy would.
That can be kind of typical forthat age, but it was more than
that.
His pre-K teacher wasfrustrated with him because he
couldn't sit still in circletime or was having these
(01:41):
outbursts and making noises.
And the final straw was that wewere going for a family walk
around the block and this mighthave been during the pandemic,
actually.
So we were home, we're goingfor a walk, and we said, okay,
we're going to cross the streetto go out.
And we were going thatdirection and he just started to
cross without waiting for us.
It was in the middle of thestreet, there wasn't a crossing
there or anything, and so wesaid this is, you know, this is
(02:03):
an issue, this is something weneed to have addressed.
And so we went to hispediatrician and she gave us the
questionnaires and I was goingthrough it my part of the
questionnaire and I said, oh, Ido that.
And then, oh, I got in troublefor that when I was little, you
know.
And finally it was like, oh mygosh, I think I have ADHD.
And it explained so much.
And then I went to my primarycare physician to talk about it
(02:25):
and see what my options were andhe said, yeah, it sounds like
you have ADHD, but there's a but.
And he said, but it's, theinsurance isn't going to pay for
it and it costs a lot.
And it's this whole process youhave to go through and you're
almost 40.
Like why you've gotten this far.
You're probably just fine.
And I said, well, I'm herebecause I have a problem and I
want you to help me address it.
(02:46):
And so that was reallyfrustrating and, looking back,
like I was a very good studentoverall.
I think a lot of it was.
I didn't want to disappoint myparents, who were teachers and I
masked very well and myparents' friends were also my
teachers and so very small townin rural Michigan, so everybody
knew everybody.
But I would have these thingswhere we had messy desk checks
and messy locker checks and Iwould always fill those and they
(03:08):
gave us a planner to keep trackof our homework.
And I never did it and I was astudent athletic trainer and I
had assignments after school towork with different sports teams
and I would just miss myassignments because I forgot to
check the schedule.
So a lot of these things arecoming back to me now like, oh,
this is an explanation.
It's not an excuse, but it's anexplanation.
And so after all of this it'sbeen, it took me about two years
and I was, you know,consistently letting my wife
(03:30):
down in our business that wewere working together on at the
time and I said I need to getthis actually like checked.
And so after that I gotofficially diagnosed and it was
way easier now than it was acouple years ago and it's just
made such a big difference in mylife and just being there for
my family and feeling that I'mnot a failure, which is a lot of
(03:52):
times.
I think that when you have this, you keep letting people down
because of something that youdon't really have control of
that you feel like you're afailure.
That's where I'm at now,personally.
Andi (04:02):
Did you feel like it ended up being as difficult or as
expensive as your doctor had ledon to?
Michael (04:07):
absolutely not no, there, and there are so many
options in that now that areonline that you can go in, and
it's either your insurance willpay for it or, if it's under 150
like just for that evaluation Imean to get that answer is, in
my opinion, worth the money forme, and I had to pay out of
pocket because my insurancedoesn't cover it.
But it's not a thousand, youknow, thousands of dollars, and
(04:28):
it was online.
She was like yep, you got it.
Okay, here's what we're goingto do.
It was just so easy, and so thered tape that I was expecting
to have to go through and waitedtwo years to avoid, like it was
, it was not a big problem.
How did your experience as anathletic trainer particularly?
Andi (04:40):
How did your experience as an athletic trainer,
particularly your time with theHarlem Globetrotters, shape your
perspective on performance andresilience?
Michael (04:49):
Well, this is all in hindsight, I think, right,
because it's been probably about15 years since I was with the
Globetrotters and that's alwaysmy.
You know, you play the threetruths and a lie game and that's
always my truth.
Is that a former HarlemGlobetrotter?
Because nobody expects that.
But you know, if I were notmarried I'd still be doing that
(05:10):
to this day.
But I was good at it.
I loved it.
I loved the guys Like they weremy friends and I loved the
spontaneity of the shows and Iloved that I didn't have to like
do administrative boring things.
I was just in the moment allthe time and treating injuries
and I didn't have to like doadministrative boring things.
I was just in the moment allthe time and treating injuries
and I didn't have to makeschedules and like I was doing
exactly what my strengths were.
(05:31):
And I think, looking back.
But my wife and I wanted tostart a family and she was
starting her own business at thetime and so that travel would
not wasn't conducive to thosethings that we wanted to do for
our goals and our dreams, and soI left that to help her with
her business and be astay-at-home dad, because at
that time we had our daughterCarmen, and that was an extreme
wake-up call because all of asudden I was in charge of my own
(05:52):
schedule, which I'm not greatat, and I had to do all these
tedious behind-the-scenescomputer things rather than
being out and urgently helpingsomebody and those type of
things and I kept dropping theball and not following through
and all these things.
But I would like I could touchstinky, sweaty athletes with
blood and broken bones all daylong and I love doing that.
So it was.
There's this dichotomy of likeI really like doing these things
(06:16):
that I think for a lot ofpeople would be like, oh gross,
you know that that doesn't soundfun at all.
And I'm doing these things,which a lot of people like I
would love to be able to do thatall day long.
So there's these two differentthings that I was thrust into
and if it was just looking back,I could see that I had my dream
job and then left somethingthat was really within my
(06:38):
purpose.
I would love to work with mywife and be a stay at home dad,
but it didn't line up with whatI was given, with my natural
strengths and what I knew how todo, and it made me realize that
a lot of performance is basedon our mental energy capacity
and that to do things and beresilient when it comes to doing
your job, you have to honorthat mental energy.
(06:58):
And if you can't honor yourmental energy and you're
constantly drained doing thethings you're supposed to be
doing, then that's where youknow.
If you're sitting in a job,that's where you probably leave
within six months.
And there are other.
You know, after being trainedin things and coaching people
for a long time, that there arestrategies that we can use to
make those tasks that don't seemquite within alignment with our
(07:18):
strengths actually do and getdone.
Jen (07:20):
I love everything about this conversation.
Right now I just I'm over herefangirling, but it is because we
are so similar.
I want to pick your brain aboutthe athletic trainer and the
feeling of failure, because Istruggled there.
Right, I'm an athletic trainerand I struggle there with the
not even it's not thefollow-through.
(07:41):
I think that I live off ofadrenaline because that doesn't
feel like work to me.
But when I have to sit down andmaybe do something else, that
feels more work.
Ish, and it's not even for methe administrative portion,
because I eat that up.
I love that.
The process, I can see it.
You tell me your big picture.
I can give you all the smallsteps.
My brain works like that.
But if you ask me to dosomething else, that isn't in
(08:04):
one of those two things, I takethe biggest side.
So, post my chronic illnessgoing rogue.
When I had to come off thecourt, I didn't know how to
function from behind the desk.
I didn't, and I realized thatme, my strength is that I lead
with my hands right, like I canbe with you, and literally the
(08:25):
lead by example.
That is my leadership style.
I'm gonna find your strong suitand then you lead.
You made that your own becauseyou use your talents.
But I realized that when I hadto come off the court, when
Jesus decided to sit me down for38 minutes, when I had to come
off the court and try to figurethat out again, I didn't know
how to exist as a coach with adifferent framework that wasn't
(08:50):
my hands.
Michael (08:52):
Yeah, I felt the same way when I finally said, you
know, I have to retire, like I'mliterally retiring my license,
and if I ever want to do thatagain, I have to go, literally
go back to school, take thecertification exam again, like
do all the things, and that'snot.
You know, that's not possibleanymore.
And and it's there's a realstruggle with, like your
identity, right Cause if youlike, I was an athletic trainer.
I have been doing that sincehigh school.
(09:14):
That's what I knew and love formy whole life.
And then all of a sudden that'sgone.
And if you're an athlete orthat's, that's your identity.
And then all of a sudden youhave to make this huge change
that is, I'm not going to bethat person anymore.
It's, I mean, it sucks, it'shard, and you have to find
another avenue that supportsthose strengths.
(09:37):
So you might not be I'm nottaping ankles, I'm not doing
those things anymore but what Ithink my strengths are is that I
find new and innovative ways tohelp people be more efficient
and get the biggest bang fortheir buck.
And so if I, if I, looking back, like that's the essence of
what I did as an athletictrainer, and now that's the
(09:58):
essence of what I do as a coachand so and everything else in
between is well, I got to learnhow to do that.
I got to learn how to be acoach.
I got to learn the business ofbeing in business, yeah, but,
but I still have the passion tohelp people and that's how I
naturally do that.
So I don't know if thatresonates.
Jen (10:14):
It does, because for me I was.
I was learning how to againcoach from a different angle, or
how to teach without my hands,or how to teach without my hands
, and so, although I'm not outthere carrying you off of the
field or off of the track or offof a court, I am now teaching
in a way that I'm teaching youhow to prevent it.
You're doing more prehab andyou're understanding your body
and performance and how itfunctions and the why.
(10:36):
And they get it from adifferent angle now, because I'm
chronically ill and I live in abody that's always in pain, and
so, as mad as I was about thatbody that's always in pain, and
so, as mad as I was about that,I had to come off the court.
For the time I had to come offthe court, it allowed me to
develop a framework for me thatmade these younger athletes
understand how their bodies workand ask more questions, and I
(10:56):
could teach the skill and youcould tape yourself and you
could understand what the tapeis doing and why it's there, for
it's not there just becauseit's cute.
It actually serves a function.
And so now I listen to my youngathletes, each one teach one.
They're our future, and so,although I had to come from
behind the you know the I got itand have the gurney and where's
my bag?
(11:17):
Although I don't do thatanymore, I now have the next
generations of kids that will becoaches, youth coaches or or
they're like here.
I learned this.
This is why she wasn't lying.
I tell them fact check me.
I'm not in the shoes with you.
I'm going to tell you thisbecause I know.
But fact check me and know foryourself, because what I tell
(11:38):
you, what your body will do,it's going to feel different.
And I'm not going to tell youyour body can do something that
I'm physically not in your body.
So your body may not be able todo that, and I hate when people
tell me but you should, youshould be able to do it.
My body's a storm, I should beable to do a lot of things, but
I can't.
And so that was the other thing.
It was me owning the days andthe instances in my life where I
(12:01):
knew I actually can't.
That was where I struggled,hearing myself say I can't do
this, but now I go, I can't dothat, then I'm okay with it.
Oh, I can't do this.
This will probably make meflare that I'm gonna have to
find a different way.
(12:21):
Maybe I should delegate this mycan is my can't for different
reasons other than failure.
Now it's just I can't.
I can't cause I don't have thecapacity, I can't.
I don't have the desire, Ican't because it doesn't align
with me.
I just use it in a differentway now.
Michael (12:36):
I love that.
It's a great perspective and itdoesn't mean that you and for a
lot of people, when you'redoing things that you literally
can't do, or you're havingtrouble because it's the
opposite of how you naturally dothings, it's not because you're
dumb the opposite of how younaturally do things.
It's not because you're dumb,it's not because you have
(12:57):
anything besides, just acapacity issue, really, whether
it's mental or emotional orphysical that we have these
capacities and it's okay.
It doesn't mean you're broken.
It means that you need somehelp.
Jen (13:05):
And it's okay to ask.
Michael (13:24):
Exactly so, michael, what inspired your transition
from athletic training tocoaching entrepreneurs,
specifically with ADHD?
It was just her and a part-timeassistant at that time when I
started helping her.
And now we have like a team of12 people and we have a lot of
amazing work that she's beenspearheading.
But I, you know, leaning into.
I kept being put in a place like, okay, you can do
administrative stuff, okay, andthen after a couple of weeks,
(13:46):
like this is horrible, I can'tdo this.
I got to be helping people, youknow, like real time helping
people, and then we startcoaching people and training
people to become coaches.
And so then it was like, okay,well, I think that my spirit and
my heart is just that I'm ateacher and a coach, like that's
what I have to be doing.
And so I just started to leaninto that more and more and more
, and I will talk about this ina little bit, I think.
(14:08):
But I learned about the Colbyassessment and got certified in
as a Colby consultant and that'swhere I was like this is
exactly what I need to be doingto help people.
And as I was helping more of ourclients that we were training
and coaching the ones that hadADHD and this is before I was
diagnosed or knew that I had itwere like this is so helpful
because I now know why I'mavoiding doing some of these
(14:30):
things, and I know that I'mavoiding it because it's the
energy is not aligned.
The energy needed is notaligned with what I have to give
, and so I think once I gotdiagnosed, it was just an
obvious like well, obviously I'mnot just going to help all
business owners and smallbusiness owners.
I have that with my people, andmy people are, you know,
because entrepreneurs with ADHD,because I learned the hard way
(14:51):
how to do some of these thingsin my own way and then it just
was a natural progression tohelp, like I went through this.
So I need to help the peoplethat are struggling like I did.
Jen (14:59):
So you mentioned the Coley framework.
Can you explain how it worksfor those who are maybe
unfamiliar?
The framework is amazing.
Guys, just buckle up, you're infor a treat.
Can you explain the frameworkto people who may be?
Michael (15:14):
unfamiliar.
Yeah, I love it and I'mprobably going to nerd out way
too much on it, but it's.
I'll nerd out with you, yeah,awesome.
So Kathy Colby, a quick littlebackground.
Kathy Colby is the originatorof this Colby theory and if
you've ever heard of theWunderlicht assessment I don't
know if anybody's heard of thatbefore, but it's an iq test.
The nfl used it for a long timeas their like nfl iq test lots
(15:36):
of executive c-suites, fortune500 companies to use it for
hiring.
Her dad invented thatassessment, so she grew up with
assessments, but it's all aboutlike intelligence, basically
like an iq, and she alwaysthought there was more to a
person than just yourintelligence.
She could never really figureout why, and she was working
with gifted and talentedchildren and she would do the
(16:00):
after-school programs for themwhere she would say here's the
experiment that we're going tobe doing today, here's your
lesson, go ahead.
And we know that these giftedand talented children are really
smart.
But she saw that each of themproblem solved differently to
get to the same answer at theend.
So if it's about smarts andintelligence, they would all do
it the same way, right?
But that's not the case, and soit's been about 40, 50 years
(16:22):
since she's kind of establishedthis and what we know and this
goes back to kind of Aristotleand Plato is that there are
three different parts of themind.
There's the cognitive part,which is what you know about
things, and it's yourintelligence, it's your
experience, it's your education.
We can assess it with, like,what do you know?
What course have you taken?
If you've ever taken a courseor workshop and they give you
(16:42):
that pre-test, you're like, ohman, I got a 25%.
And then you take the courseand you take that same test, get
100%.
Well, your cognitive abilityaround that got better, right.
So that's not what we'retalking about when we're talking
about COLE.
The second part of the mind isthe affective and this is
personality and this is youremotions, your motivation, your
values, those type of things.
(17:02):
And so we can assess that witha Myers-Briggs or an Enneagram
or any of those personalityassessments.
But if you think about that,what motivates you now and what
your values are now compared towhen you were, say, 16 in high
school, probably quite a bit ofa different person, right.
So we know that that can anddoes change over time, and so
that's not what we're talkingabout either.
But what we're talking aboutwith Colby is it's the conative
(17:24):
part of your mind which is maybenot a word.
You maybe not have heard itbefore, but it's conative and
it's how you problem solve.
And if I say, andy, here's aproblem, you can do it however
you want, go.
And I say, jenny, here's aproblem, go.
You might problem solvecompletely differently in how to
get there and differently thanI do.
And it's really a descriptionof how you problem solve and
it's your mental energy capacitywhen you're doing something.
(17:45):
So if you've ever donesomething and you sat down and
you're like I have to do thisfor three hours and I'm 20
minutes in and I am fried, soyou have a shot glass size cup
for that.
But there's other things thatyou're doing.
Maybe it's planning, it's theprocess or it could be lots of
other things that it's.
That's super energizing.
I have a big size cup to fillevery day for that, and so we
(18:09):
look at those, and theinteresting thing is about all
of these are is that it's it'snot genetic.
There's no correlation betweenyour parents' results and how
you problem solve.
It's not biased for race orgender or sex or age or anything
, and so it's.
I see it as like how amazinglytalented every single person in
the entire world is because weall have these amazing strengths
(18:32):
that we all can tap into.
Higher world is because we allhave these amazing strengths
that we all can tap into, andit's ridiculous to think that
you can't do some job simplybecause you are not the right
gender or sex or race or age.
It's this equalizer that we allhave, that we are all equally
great problem solvers, and theseare all strengths.
And so, really quickly, lastthing I'll say about this before
I go too far, is that when itcomes to how you problem solve
(18:53):
and maybe this will resonatewith a lot of you is that we use
four different action modes toproblem solve.
The first one's called factfinder and that just describes
how you gather and shareinformation and when you take
the assessment.
Maybe some of you have takenthe assessment.
The assessment it goes from oneto 10.
10 is not amazing.
One is not failure.
One is just as much of astrength as 10.
It just describes how much youuse that when you're problem
solving.
So if you're a 10 in FactFinder, you have to gather a lot of
(19:17):
information before you can makea decision or problem solve.
To move on, If you're a one ortwo or three, just give me the
bullet points.
That's all I need.
I don't need all the details.
The next one is called followthrough and that describes how
you plan and organize.
Are you a big time planner?
Do you follow step-by-stepprocedures or are you like me
and you do things randomly?
And you can?
Only you know you have to spinfive plates at the same time.
(19:38):
Quick start is the next onethat describes how you deal with
risk and uncertainty.
Are you, do you take lots ofrisks?
Do you improvise a lot or doyou want to follow the protocol?
Do you want to know exactly theright way to do things?
And the last one is calledimplementor, which describes how
you use tools or implements,using your hands to solve
problems all day.
So are you someone that's likea carpenter or electrician or a
surgeon and you're using yourhands all day?
(19:59):
Or do you solve more abstractproblems and so you're in
administration or internalmedicine rather than being a
surgeon?
So we all sit on these and themost important thing is they
don't change over time.
So I can't say Andy, Jenny, youneed to get more follow through
, you need to have less quickstart.
It doesn't work that way.
So we have to be obstinateabout that and say like this is
(20:21):
how I do things.
I'm not going to do thingsanybody else's way and I have to
find sometimes I just have tofind ways that I can do it my
own way and still be successful.
So that's the 10 cent tour ofGoldie.
Andi (20:29):
Wow, you talk about helping clients lean into their
strengths.
Can you share an example of howyou've helped someone do this
successfully?
Michael (20:37):
Yeah.
So I just had a client lastweek thinking about this, and
she is just a true entrepreneur.
She's very much jump it feefirst, you know, I'm just, I'm
just going to figure it out butalso she needs data to back that
up.
So she's a quick start and afact finder at the same time,
and one of those strengths isthat she naturally prioritizes
Like if and when, but also,because of her executive
(20:59):
dysfunction, struggles with theoverwhelm of prioritizing, and
so it's one of those thingswhere I have to have priorities
to work.
I have to know what's the mostimportant thing for me to be
working on, and so you may havemaybe heard the saying of if
nothing's a priority, theneverything's a priority, and
then you get overwhelmed becauseI have all of these things all
around me at the same time thatneed my attention.
I don't know what I need towork on.
(21:21):
So we started with and let me goback really quickly that was
like she just had inactionbecause she didn't know what to
work on, and so she was justkind of stuck in her business,
and so we started by settinggoals Like what are your goals
that you want to do, that youwant to work on that are
exciting to you and that are inline with, kind of the vision
that you have for your future,of where you want to be in three
years.
And then how can we break thosedown to like little baby steps?
(21:43):
Because if I say I'm going tomake $100,000 in my business, if
I do that, like, what are thesteps for me to get there?
That's a big, overwhelming goal.
But then if we sit down andtalk it out, what's the next
thing that has to happen?
What are all of the things thathave to happen?
And then let's get them inorder.
Let's just talk it out and sogiving her permission to set
those goals and then prioritizebased on what's exciting to her
(22:06):
and important to her, and thensay, hey, this is the next step,
let's set some due dates tothat.
Okay, then this is the next duedate and it gives that kind of
a plan also along withprioritizing.
So in her strength was that sheneeded those things, but her
executive dysfunction was notallowing her to do that for her.
Andi (22:21):
I think that's a great example, and I think many of us
were the idea person.
We have 20 ideas of the thingswe want to do someday or now or
whatever it is I know for me Ithink I've told Andy this before
I have this notepad that tellsme a list for different things,
like what has to be done today,what needs to be done this week,
what needs to be done thismonth, and I love it because it
(22:42):
helps me stay extremelyorganized and I live by that
because otherwise I'm going tohave 20 ideas and I'm going to
be all over the place.
Michael (22:50):
Absolutely.
And that's where that shinyobject syndrome can kind of get
in, because if you're notfocused and you know that I have
to get this done, it'simportant.
Might not be super fun, but nowthat I know, like, okay, I have
to give myself permission tonot seek those outside things,
because I know this is inalignment with what my goals are
, my dreams are and what'simportant to me.
Jen (23:09):
Exactly that was me.
That was me.
Last week I had to do a pitchdeck for something that was not
athletic Right and so, but lastnight I was doing the camp kits,
the kits that they get, sotheir gear and uniforms and all
the things, the interest meetingbut building that presentation.
I was so hyped and then I hadto do the stuff you want and I
(23:38):
was like I also do this, guys,and I'm super good at it, but I
also do this.
But I was like pulling teeth.
It took me all weekend tomuster the energy to sit down
and do the task.
That literally took me 30minutes.
I dreaded it all day.
It took me 30 minutes.
I dreaded it all day.
It took me 30 minutes.
I just wasn't fired up about it.
(23:58):
It was a necessary evil, Iguess, you know, for business
growth, but I wasn't fired upabout it.
Michael (24:04):
And when you after the fact, you're probably like that
was just 30 minutes, I can do it.
You know 30 minutes.
It was nothing but that leadingup to it, just the dread of
that energy.
It might as well have been afull day worth of dread.
Andi (24:19):
I second that, andy.
I think a lot of times thereare things that we just really
don't want to do.
Maybe we don't like to do it,maybe we don't feel like it's
our skill set and maybe it needsto be done this week, but I'd
really rather put it on the listof by the end of the month and,
like you said, 30 minutes andreally it wasn't that bad.
But sometimes it's really niceto have someone to bring us back
(24:41):
down to earth and say okay,maybe try this, this and this,
and it's only going to take you30 minutes, you're going to get
through it.
Jen (24:48):
I think it's super good because Jen's my checks and
balances, so I'll send an audiomessage.
I've got to do this thing andshe'll go.
I know you don't want to, butmaybe, if you just do it 10
minutes at a time, maybe just doone slide and although it's not
what you want to hear, it'swhat you need to hear.
And she was right.
She was like give me threereasons why you can't do one
slide right now.
Okay, but I do that to myfriends too.
(25:09):
For instance, give me threereasons why we can't do it right
now because in the time thatyou're telling me you could have
actually been done.
So give me the three reasonsand I talk myself down.
But sometimes you can't alwaystalk yourself down.
So, having other people whounderstand how your brain works,
that understand the languagethat registers with you when
you're being communicated withyou want to be communicated with
(25:31):
and not talked at, so that youcan bring your strengths
strengths out, so you can do thetask, even the tedious ones,
even the ones we don't quiteenjoy.
Michael (25:39):
Absolutely.
What kind of advice would yougive to Spoonies that are
navigating?
Is kind of what we talked abouta little bit, but is
identifying like literallyidentifying those things that
(26:00):
you do, whether it's home orit's at work, that put you into
that flow state that's why mybusiness is called Flow State
Executive Coaching.
What are those things that youdo that are fun and exciting and
you enjoy doing them?
They actually raise your energylevels.
They're super energizing.
Those things that you do thatare fun and exciting and you
enjoy doing them.
They actually like raise yourenergy levels, they're super
energizing.
And then figure out what arethose kryptonite kind of tasks
(26:22):
that still need to get done.
They're draining.
You dread doing them.
They're just awful, and 30minutes of them feels like a
full day.
And so what can we do?
How can we get those done?
And so you need to honor thatmental energy as much as
possible, as well as yourphysical and emotional energy
too.
And so here's a really easyexercise that you can do, and
I'm sure that most of yourlisteners have done something
(26:43):
similar.
But if you take a piece of paperand you make three columns, and
one column says draining andhate, the middle column says
okay, neutral.
And the third column says loveslash, energizing.
And you just start to thinkabout everything that you do
throughout the day oh, I lovedoing that.
Oh, my gosh, I hate, I hatethat.
That is, I can't even startthat.
I hate it so much.
Oh, that's okay.
Like, do I love it, no, but doI hate it no.
(27:04):
And and so you could actuallyyou come up with a list of the
love energizing.
That is my zone of genius,that's my flow state.
You know, whatever you want tocall it, this is what I need to
lean into.
The okay neutral is I canprobably keep doing those until
they I can't anymore.
Basically, would I love to givethat to someone else, probably,
but maybe I still do thatbecause it's not horrible yet.
(27:27):
But then the stuff that I hateand it's draining.
You immediately have to come upwith some way that it can still
get done, and there's reallyonly five.
But the hard part about that isthat means I might have to hire
someone, which is overwhelmingin its own right and cost money.
You can delete it or pause it.
You can say well, should Ireally be doing this right now?
What's the ROI of me actuallydoing this right now.
(27:48):
There's probably other thingsthat are way more important and
give me back more.
Right now we can build habits.
How can I build a habit in themorning to get something done
that doesn't take?
You know, a habit is just likebrushing your teeth, right?
You just naturally do that andyou know you have to do it, and
it's not a big deal.
You can automate it somehow.
And so if you're like one goodexample is if you send an email
(28:10):
and it's the same email over andover and you're writing the
same email over and over, youcan make a template and copy and
paste it, or use a CRM toautomate things, so you're not
manually sending things over andover again.
And then the last one and Ithink it's the most important is
how can you do that your ownway?
Because sometimes, as abusiness owner, you just have to
do it.
There's nobody else that can doit except for you.
(28:31):
And so for Andy's example of Iwas working on this for 30
minutes, but it felt like it wasgoing to be eight hours.
That's when maybe you've heardof the Pomodoro technique.
That's when something like thePomodoro works really well is
that I just have to get throughthis and it's going to take me
forever.
Well, you work for 20 minutes,take a five to 10 minute break.
You keep repeating that and itactually keeps you more
(28:55):
energized.
Now, some people would sayabout the Pomodoro method is why
I don't like that because itinterrupts me.
Well, it's not for when you'relike in the zone and you want to
get hyper focused, it's forwhen you need to break that up
because it's so draining and notenergizing that you want to
break it up to kind ofre-energize a little bit.
And then I also think one thingto think about is how you
organize your day in your weekand really organizing your
(29:17):
specific days by the energylevel that it takes to do those
things.
And so you might and these arewords that I use and they're a
little bit confusing but a flowday Like that is when I'm
working on things that areputting me in my flow state.
These are the things that I loveto do, these are the things
that make me my money, these aremy revenue generating things.
This is what I'm me personally,working with my clients.
You want to do those.
(29:37):
Say it's Wednesday, thursday,friday, and then there's a grow
day, which is those are thethings I'm spent growing my
business.
So it's administrative things,it's networking, it's when I'm
doing my CEO stuff, it's whenI'm doing my finances, and
what's the worst thing that canhappen is that you do an
administrative task that's superboring or you do whatever
activity that's super boring,and then you have to go into
(29:57):
that meeting with a client thathas to be super uplifting and
energizing.
Those two energies don't match.
So if you can start to planyour week in accordance to those
energies as much as possible,you're going to have the energy
will match.
You're not going to be havingthis roller coaster.
And the last day is that I callit a glow day, which is that
personal time that you do use tore-energize and kind of bring
joy into your life.
(30:18):
That's when you get your bestthinking done.
Andi (30:20):
I'm kind of geeking out on all this over here.
You've got me Googling whileI'm listening to you.
Jen (30:25):
So it's funny that you would bring up the Pomodoro,
right?
Because that's what I did whenI did the 30-minute presentation
.
I was like, okay, I'm going togive it 30 minutes and if at 30
minutes today and I'll just keepdoing it, but that was the
technique that I use, I'm goingto do it until my attention goes
somewhere else.
And the minute my attentiondiverts means I'm not supposed
(30:48):
to be working on it right now,because am I giving it
everything that I need to giveit, all of the attention, all of
the focus, the care, thenurture, all of the stuff before
I send this out?
Can I say that I did that?
So no, I set my good old timerand it was tick, tick, tick,
tick, ticking away and I'm like,and who would have thought?
30 minutes later I was done andI set the 30 minute timer and I
was gonna take my break at 15minutes.
(31:10):
I do 15 and 5, so 15 minutes onfive minutes, something fat fun
.
I'll dance, I'll sing, I watch,whatever.
And then 15 minutes back, justwant to get the blood flowing to
, to break up the monotony in mymind.
It's the whole party, maybe getsome creative juices going.
But when I afterwards I thensaid to myself again it was 30
minutes.
(31:30):
It was whether or not I had theemotional capacity to use my
energy to do that for 30 minutes, because my reality was I had
already been on socials for morethan 30 minutes.
I had already tinkered aroundthe house doing nothing for more
than 30 minutes, looking at thecomputer for me to do that
presentation, and had everyother reason of nothing to not
(31:52):
do it.
I just didn't have the mentalcapacity to do it.
I learned over the years togive myself grace.
When I was an athlete I didn'tunderstand the.
My mental capacity is exhaustedand I will push through things.
And when I was the student Iwould do that too.
And then, as the young coach,to prove a point, it was I'm
going to push through it.
And then, you know, I tried topush through it and I got sat
(32:14):
down and I realized that it'sokay to just not have the mental
capacity.
And the people that hear it howthey receive what you say, not
your business.
Once you say it, you know,respectfully, I don't have the
capacity.
A no is a no.
I can't is I can't, that's it.
I don't have the capacity.
Now, how they receive that,again, not your problem, but I
struggle with disappointment inhow they may receive my no or
(32:38):
I'm not going to do that.
It's real.
Michael (32:40):
It is, it really is, and that's the hard part, that
is.
I mean, setting boundariesright that's really what that
comes down to and holdingyourself to those boundaries.
But you're setting them, not ina selfish way, but you're
setting them for yourself, to besuccessful and honor yourself.
And for one, on one side, it'slike I'm doing this because this
is what I need to be successful.
(33:01):
But also, on the other side, Idon't want people to see me as a
pushover either.
You know, I think there'sthere's there's lots to that
about setting boundaries, andthat is honestly a hard thing
and I I struggle with that aswell of like saying no, and the
rejection, sensitivity tohearing no also is real, it's,
it's.
It's not an easy thing, butit's.
And I think Andy, you saidsomething earlier that but what
(33:24):
would?
How would I coach myself if Iwas my own client?
That can kind of be.
What would I tell somebody elseif I came to me with a bra?
And then it's like oh yeah, I'mright.
You know, I knew that the wholetime.
Jen (33:35):
Yeah, and to make it even worse, I force myself to go
stand in the mirror when I'mtalking to me.
What would you tell your client?
Ok, seriously, it's 30 minutes.
Break it up into chunks, itcould be 10 minute intervals,
whatever, but you can do it.
It's not that you can't, it'sthat you don't want to.
Why don't you want to?
This particular thing is boringto you, ok, but it's going to be
equally as boring when you sitdown to do it, whenever you
(33:56):
decide to do it.
And now you'll be rushing to doit and most likely frustrated
because now you're rushing to doit.
But I literally people thinkthat I'm crazy.
I will have a wholeconversation with myself in the
mirror.
I'm going to look myself in theeyes and give myself that
excuse out loud, because I spenta lot of time where I wouldn't
look myself in the face.
If the no was the no, I wouldbe like oh okay, you didn't
(34:18):
think it was good enough, ormaybe you're right, maybe I need
to do it your way.
No, now, my no means my way isnot necessarily wrong.
It may not be how you got to it, but my solution is still a
solution and is a mighty iconicone.
You can, you know, roll thedice if you want to or not, and
I'm not going to tell you to doit my way, but I'm gonna help
you find a way to do it your own.
And so when I talk to my friends, jenny included, hey, I got an
(34:41):
idea, let's brainstorm, find away for you to do it and make it
your own in a way that'scomfortable for you and where
you may feel weak.
It may be my strong suit and Ihave time, and it may be my zone
of genius, and it is.
So.
All of it had by chance, all ofthe things that Jenny dreads
doing it's my zone of genius andall of the cute, designsy
(35:06):
things that I hate doing thegraphics and the showing up on
the social media spaces, and allthe things that is her zone of
genius.
So we balance.
So, which is my next segue.
So we're talking a little bitabout balance, right?
So, between coaching andtraining for your strongmans and
coaching flag football, allthese hats that Michael Dickey
wears, what's Michael Dickey's?
Michael (35:25):
secret to balance?
That's a great question andI'll say I'm not there quite yet
.
You know, I'm not all the waythere yet.
I don't know if anybody reallyis Personally like what.
The first thing that I think Ireally had to do was just use my
calendar and live and die by it, and it's not natural to me to
be so scheduled, but it's just ahabit that you have to build.
And again, talking about habits, and it's one of those things
(35:47):
where my wife would say, hey,would you do this?
I'm like sure, I'll totallyremember to do that, I'll
totally, you know, and I neverdid so.
It's like okay, what do I haveto do?
Well, the moment that I know Ihave to do something got to put
it in my calendar, got to put itin my task app, just got to do
it and you build that habit.
And then when you get out ofthat habit, you're like, oh my
gosh, it was so much better whenI was in this habit.
What am I doing?
(36:08):
And so it's building thosehabits and using the resources
that you do have and technologydoes make those things a lot
easier, the technical side ofthese type of things.
But I also make sure that, likewe were saying, andy, that I
give myself breaks, whether it'sfive to 10 minutes, and
especially when I'm drained, andto some people that might
actually be kind ofcounterintuitive.
(36:28):
Well, I'm working on this.
If I take a break, isn't thatjust going to slow me down and
slow the whole process down?
But if you're working, takinglittle baby bites out, and then
you do something to re-energizerather than I'm just going to
plow through this and get itdone, the quality of the output
that you have is going to behigher because you're actually
at least maintaining that energylevel, not just constantly.
You know, you're not like if youever crammed in high school or
(36:51):
college by the end of the nightyou're like I'm not going to
remember any of this.
Why did I stay up to four inthe morning?
It's the same kind of thing.
It's not going to be as good.
So just using that time tore-energize.
But for me the when the Correct, that's okay.
Sorry For me, theseextracurricular and these hobby
things are like.
I actually do them because theyre-energize me and I think those
are fun.
And so if I'm not getting likethat, I'm not filling my cups by
(37:15):
work, then work, then I dothings that do fill up my cup
outside of work and honor thatmental energy outside of work
and working with like,especially with like football.
Like is it are seven and eightyear old football players.
Are they like amazing and arewe there to win championships?
No, but I like my purpose inlife and one of them is to like
uplift children and helping youhave those positive wins and
(37:37):
build those poor memories.
Like the globetrotters.
Like that was so fun to seethose kids just having the time
of their life with their momsand dads.
Because they went with theirmoms and dads when they were
little and like that's alwayskind of been a commonality of me
of.
That brings me joy too, and soit's balancing that energy by
doing the things that are fun toyou and making the time.
Andi (37:56):
It sounds like people being around people is what
bringing joy yeah, I think so.
Michael (38:01):
Yeah, just, I never thought about that way, but yeah
, it just blew my mind a littlebit, jenny, but yeah, I think I
think it's just the being withpeople and watching people enjoy
themselves and being andhelping them like have that in
their lives, so maybe they theydon't do it for themselves is is
super enjoyable for sure, sopeople are your purpose.
Jen (38:21):
Oh yeah, I think, so love that he likes it when he talks
about people.
You do so where there is balance, there is often a lot of joy
and you light up when you talkabout how you keep balance.
People is your, that is yourpurpose driven.
I put my feet on the ground andI this is what I want to do,
(38:43):
this is what I woke up to do,and it just radiates from you.
It just radiates from you.
So when you're working withyour clients because you are
you're, you're oozing joy andyou're you're saying I'm fired
up to work with you that is theenergy that you bring into the
space.
I'm assuming it's the energythat you brought into this
conversation.
But how do you help yourclients incorporate more joy
(39:06):
into their lives and into theirprocess so that they have less
stuck points and more sore areasin their journey than they have
?
The?
This is never going to getbetter, or maybe I just can't do
this.
How do you help them find thejoy?
Michael (39:19):
Yeah, it's a good question, or maybe I just can't
do this.
How do you help them find thejoy?
Yeah, it's a good questionthere's, I mean, as far as it
being just a part of a process,like I don't think to most ADHD
people and entrepreneurs thatprocesses are very fun and
enjoyable.
So that's why we don't do thosethings, we avoid those like,
but being able to help themthrough that process and just
make it fun and make it asenjoyable as possible and I'm
(39:41):
not a formal guy, Like I'm not.
I would rather I don't want to.
You know, I want to be friendswith everybody, which is not
always a great thing, but likethat's that's who I want to be.
Like I want to be your friend,holding your hand through this.
I don't want to be some stuffyconsultant that is telling you
what to do, but we're going todo it together and might as well
have some fun doing it.
(40:02):
So that's how, like, throughthe process, that's how I help
them.
But also it's important thatthey make time to incorporate
joy into their lives.
And what is it that they are notdoing?
You know, I had a client thathe was like I just want to have,
I don't want to have to worktill 10 o'clock at night, want
to have I don't want to have towork till 10 o'clock at night
and because I want to hang outwith my sons more and I want to
(40:23):
coach their soccer team and sohelping them realize that that
is the direction they want to go.
But here is where that block is, here's where that is Be like
let's.
But if we, if we work towardsthat, that's that's, that's your
heaven, right?
That's where you, that's yourideal dream of where you want to
be, is making sure that theyare leaning towards joy and that
the direction is always in joy.
And then also, let's talk aboutwhen you are in that zone where
(40:44):
it's just draining.
How can you, what are thosethings that bring you joy?
Is it putting out some musicand dancing?
Is it just calling a friend andchatting for 10 minutes?
Is it, you know, watch,listening to a quick standup
comedy routine or something likethat?
What is it that brings you joythat you can incorporate into
your life easily and to upliftyou and re-energize you?
Andi (41:01):
How can listeners connect with you and learn more about
your coaching services?
What is the best way for themto reach out to you?
Michael (41:08):
You can go to my website,
flowstateexecutivecoachingcomlongest website ever, sorry and
my Instagram is atflowstateexecutivecoaching, and
so you can go there and contactme there, check out all the tips
and tutorials I have on myInstagram, and then I'll say
that if anybody is interested inand I have a free workshop that
I do every year in the firstThursday and Friday of December
(41:31):
and it's all about goal settingso I help them through my
ADHD-friendly goal settingsystem that I use and two-day
events.
That's virtual, and so if you'veever had trouble, even if you
don't have ADHD, I would ratherhave you be there and use this
than be a client.
I just want people to takethese tools home, but I'm going
(41:52):
to hold your hand through it.
You just fill in the blanks,I'm going to coach you through
it and give you feedback andthen you have your goal set for
next year and then you knowexactly where you need to go.
So that is on my website aswell, but I'd love for anybody
and everybody to join you.
Thank you, it's been a pleasureand so much fun chatting with
you both.
Andi (42:07):
Thank you, michael.
Until next time, don't forgetyour spoof.
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