April 21, 2025 • 27 mins
What really makes a brand stand out... and stick? In this episode, I get to chat with branding expert Kylie Kullack, Head of Client Engagement at Struck, about how small business owners can create a brand that truly reflects who they are and how they want to be perceived. Kylie shares insights on building trust, showing up consistently, and creating a brand experience that feels intentional and aligned with your values.
If branding feels overwhelming or unclear, this conversation will help you take a step back and refocus. Kylie’s practical approach offers a clear starting point and thoughtful ways to strengthen how people experience your business.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Janice Hostager (00:04):
I'm Janice Hostager.
After three decades in themarketing business and many
years of being an entrepreneur,I've learned a thing or two
about marketing.
Join me as we talk aboutmarketing, small business and
life in between.
Welcome to My Weekly Marketing.
(00:28):
The word brand gets tossedaround a lot in business circles
, but what does it really mean?
It's hard to define what yourbrand is, but we all know a
well-branded company when we seeone, right?
We can all recognize aStarbucks from a McDonald's, a
Disney from a Netflix.
But how do you define your ownbrand?
(00:49):
And that's what my guest today,Kylie Kullack, is going to talk
about.
Kylie is the head of clientengagement for Struck.
Struck is a branding agencythat works with companies to
boost brand awareness,engagement and growth.
She's got some great brandingtips to share with us today, so
let's jump into my conversationwith Kylie.
Well, hey, Kylie, how are youtoday?
Kylie Kullack (01:09):
I'm doing very well.
Thank you for having me.
Janice Hostager (01:14):
I get giddy about the topic of branding, but
before we get into the details,we all start somewhere.
So tell me how you got intobranding, got into this world.
Kylie Kullack (01:27):
Sure, thank you.
Yes, I love branding and couldtalk about branding all day long
.
Once you get into this worldit's so interesting because you
see elements of it every day andit just sparks conversation and
who's doing it well, who isn'tdoing it well.
So, yes, great appreciation forthe importance of branding.
Thrilled to be here.
(01:49):
I started in the advertisingagency world, originally from
New York City, kind of wentthrough the ranks on the agency
side in Manhattan, more on themedia planning and buying side,
so you know where you investyour marketing dollars.
And then my now husband and Idecided to take a leap of faith
and get a little bit of a changeof pace and try living in Park
(02:11):
City, Utah, for a year and nowwe're coming up on 13 years.
Definitely a great shift inlifestyle and kind of
prioritization of work-lifebalance.
And I've been the head ofclient engagement at my current
agency Struck for the last 13years, where we really focus on
(02:32):
the importance of brand butensuring that your brand is
communicated effectively throughall of the channels and we can
talk a little bit about that alittle bit later and, in my role
, oversee kind of our clientengagements, ensuring that we're
understanding from our client'sperspective what their biggest
challenges are and how we canbring value as an agency partner
(02:54):
in helping them achieve theirgoals and building roadmaps and
kind of tactical plans on howthey can do that, but then also
employing the right strategickind of tools and initiatives to
help them achieve that and alsomeasure once they've engaged
with us.
Because the last thing we wantis for clients to come to us and
you know, with lofty goals andsay we can help them achieve
(03:17):
them but not actually track thator measure that on the back end
.
Janice Hostager (03:21):
Lots of questions about that one.
But before we jump into that,so a lot of my clients and I
would say people in general, Ithink brand seems sort of like
this nebulous thing, and I knowthat Jeff Bezos is widely
reported to have said your brandis what other people say about
you when you're not in the room.
Is there more to a brand thanthat?
(03:43):
Like, how would you definebrand if you could do it like in
a sentence, not to put you onthe spot here?
Kylie Kullack (03:49):
No, no you're fine, I would say.
I would add to what Jeff saidin terms of your brand should be
a personification of anindividual, right, how can you
articulate who and what thisbrand is?
If it was a person, your brandis not just your logo or your
logo mark, right, it is how yourcustomers, or potential
(04:11):
customers, interact with you,perceive you and then what their
experience is throughout thatprocess.
And so what we like to do isoften share with our clients,
going through that brandstrategy piece is building out
what your brand is as apersonification, if you will.
How does it look, how does itfeel, how does it articulate,
(04:32):
how does it speak?
What feelings is it evokingfrom your prospective clients?
And so I would plus up whatJeff said is it's, of course,
what they're saying about youwhen you're not in the room, but
what is that person thatthey're
talking about?
Janice Hostager (04:46):
I love that.
For many years I had a designagency, so people would come to
me and say, oh, I need mybranding done.
And what they meant, of course,was they need colors, they need
a font, they need a logo, thatsort of thing.
But brands, they really do runso much deeper than that.
So can you tell me somefoundational principles of
(05:06):
branding that small businessowners can use when they think
about their own brand?
Now you mentionedpersonification, like where do
you start with that?
Kylie Kullack (05:13):
Yeah.
So I think that that is areally important piece is,
before we start any engagement,whether it's designed to your
point.
You know what's the logo looklike.
You need to better understandwhat it is that we're looking to
communicate.
What is it about your businessthat is unique about you know,
in comparison to others?
What is that special kind ofshiny object piece that nobody
(05:36):
else has that you can own?
So it's kind of a reallythorough process to identify
what is it that you uniquelybring and you can offer and your
points of strength.
But more also equally importantis what are you not, what are
you not going to deliver on sothat you can even have a
stronger position moving forward?
(05:56):
And then, what does that looklike and how does that feel?
What is your voice and tone?
How do you communicate?
It's really important forparticularly you know your
listeners as you're buildingyour marketing plans, to have a
clear understanding of who youare, what your brand story is
and how you articulate it.
But then also, how are youdeploying your voice, you know
(06:17):
tone of voice across yourdifferent marketing channels?
So your social media is itconsistent?
Or are you maybe more playfulon your social and then more
serious on your website, right,you want to make sure there's
consistency with how you'recommunicating to your audiences,
so that they're always havingthe same brand experience
through the various touch points.
Janice Hostager (06:39):
And that can be hard right, especially if you
have a team.
You know everybody has to be onthat same, that same sheet.
You know a paper that know thatthis, this is how you talk at
all, in all cases, and this isthe.
.
.
Kylie Kullack (06:50):
Absolutely and we'll develop those you know and
I would recommend your team youknow your clients going through
a similar process.
It doesn't need to be tooin-depth or too cumbersome.
It should be something that'spretty inherent, particularly
for a founder or kind of thegroups of those who are working
particularly within the startupspace is who are we and what is
(07:11):
that short list of?
What are our brand attributesand how does that get expressed
from a communication perspective?
And it should be two or threepoints like very salient, very
succinct.
This is how we communicate, sothat they all are working from
the same playbook and they'reall speaking the same language.
Janice Hostager (07:40):
Now working backwards from that a little bit
.
So when I have a client thatsays, oh, you know, like I don't
know where to start with mybrand, so I always think of your
mission, your vision and whatthat is like a stone and you
throw that stone in a pond andit's like a series of concentric
circles that radiate outward,so from there, once you figure
out what that stone is, thenthey can determine who you're
about, then you can determinewhat's unique about your company
, what is your personality, andkind of go from there.
(08:01):
So it's not like you reallyhave to start somewhere.
Do you start with that missionand vision or is there another
place that you kind of startwithin that company?
Or maybe it's the founder'spersonality?
How do you start?
What within that company Do youstart?
Or maybe it's the founder'spersonality, or what?
How do you start?
What's that called?
Kylie Kullack (08:14):
Yeah, no, I think that is absolutely the place to
start with, because that'swhere the passion comes from,
the founders in particular.
Right, it's like why are youputting your blood, sweat and
tears into this idea?
What is it that you're lookingto achieve and how can your
offering uniquely do that?
So it's understanding, missionand vision.
But then it gets a little bitmore tactical, into kind of for
(08:39):
us, there are about two or threethings that we also like to
layer in.
Is targeting right?
So a prioritization of theaudience segments that are going
to have the highest potentialfor growth with whatever it is
that you're offering.
So, you know, particularly forstartup businesses, you want to
(09:00):
make sure that you're growing asquickly as possible, but you
also want to be growing smartlyand strategically, with the
audiences who are going toengage, re-engage, but then also
share and kind of advocate foryou or your product post
engaging with you.
So it's really important tomake sure that we prioritize
audiences and, for the moneythat you might be investing from
a marketing perspective, you'rebeing smart in how you're
(09:22):
investing, that you're not justmarketing to everybody.
Let's look at prioritizing yourinvestments so that you can
really focus on those high valueaudiences from a targeting
perspective.
We also then like to layer inkind of this brand positioning
piece, right?
So how do we develop a clear andcompelling brand positioning
statement, if you will, thatdefines how your brand should be
(09:45):
perceived in the minds of thosetarget audiences that we just
talked about, and how does thisdifferentiate the brand from
competitors but also aligns withkind of customer expectations?
And usually, you know, we do alot of work in terms of
understanding the competitionand kind of the competitive
landscape and where you fallwithin that mix, what is the
(10:05):
audience, what are the landscape, the industry factors that are,
you know, need to be front andcenter to get to this.
And it's usually a sentence ortwo, so that it's a very clear
distillation of who it is yourorganization is and what you
offered and who you offer it to,and it should be something that
everybody in your organizationcan repeat and can articulate
(10:26):
very clearly.
It's not your tagline, it's notexternal facing, it's not for
your consumers.
For the most part it's morethis is who we are and this is
what we offer and why it'simportant.
And then, as we get a littlebit further, then we can help
with kind of more of thatproduct positioning.
So if you're an organizationthat offers multiple products,
how can you make sure thatyou're building up strategic
frameworks on how you canposition those products that are
(10:49):
kind of nuanced for the variouscustomer needs?
Janice Hostager (10:55):
So they all align with the same brand?
Kylie Kullack (10:57):
Yes
Janice Hostager (10:59):
Okay, all right .
Are there instances where acompany will kind of offshoot
and kind of go with a separatebrand for a separate product or
separate lines of products?
Kylie Kullack (11:05):
Yes, absolutely, and we definitely recommend that
and making sure that, as you'relooking through, if you're an
organization that has multipledifferent products, kind of
going through a brandarchitecture process and really
defining that organization ofyour products and services to
help ensure clarity, consistencyand kind of synergy across all
(11:26):
the various brand touch points,right.
So if you have a house ofbrands versus a branded house.
How can you make sure thatyou're very clear in
articulating?
The various products all liveunder a specific brand.
Janice Hostager (11:39):
Is that something you'd recommend with a
smaller business, or do youfeel like that's maybe down the
road a little bit?
Kylie Kullack (11:44):
For the most part , for smaller businesses, I
would say it's focus on yourcore brand and getting the
awareness out of your brand andonce you get them into your
audience, into your funnel,that's where you can use your
various channels to helpintroduce or reintroduce other
products to clients.
Janice Hostager (12:02):
Okay, so I'm a small business owner.
I like to say it's hard for ajar to read its own label, right
?
So it's hard for us as smallbusiness owners to really kind
of get a grip about what ourbrand should be and to kind of
see ourselves from the outsidein.
So where do you start in theprocess?
(12:24):
If you're a small businessowner, where do you start in
that process?
(12:56):
think it's in articulationeven if it's just putting down
on paper of this is what Ibelieve my brand is and kind of
what is unique and the best wayyou could do, we recommend that,
we recommend is either withsmall businesses or through
larger organizations is let's dosome testing, right, put it out
into the marketplace and getfeedback from those who engage
and know the brand as it existstoday, equally important, those
who don't know your brand oryour offering, and have them
experience it and kind of shareback with you what they believe
the experience is or the brandis, because that will also help
better articulate, maybe, whattweaks need to be made or how
you're positioning.
It is maybe confusing, so theremight need to be a bit of a
(13:19):
clarification, if you will, ofwhat it is your product is and
how you're communicating it.
So we like to do a fair amountof testing, whether it's
primarily with those who arethat primary kind of target
audience that you're you'relooking to reach
Okay, just kind of put it out there, get some
feedback, kind of.
.
.
Kylie Kullack (13:39):
Yeah, and if you, have iterations of those you
know, put an option or two infront of those folks who know
the brand, um, but also have theoutsider perspective.
Uh, because it is true for smallbusiness owners, you can get
very into the weeds, um, andsometimes you just need that 10
000 foot view of clarity just tobe able to step back
Janice Hostager (13:59):
Yeah, yeah, so I have clients that will.
.
.
Um, I get this question actuallyquite a bit.
Um, what role is consistency?
How important is consistency, Iwould say, in your brand?
So let's say, your websitelooks a certain way I'm talking
in visual branding at this pointbut say, your website looks one
way and you're trying to keepthat consistent, but you know
(14:21):
your social media person's overon TikTok using some different
fonts and some different colors.
Is that a big deal?
Kylie Kullack (14:27):
Yes, yes, that is a big deal.
It is a cardinal rule withinbranding to ensuring that it is
consistent across the board.
You have no idea where and howyour customers will be engaging
with your brand and they need toknow that it is the same brand
through those various touchpoints.
(14:49):
So if someone has gone to yourwebsite and then happens to
follow you on TikTok but thensees a completely different
representation of the brand,that's misleading and it's not
clear.
Typically, consumers have aboutfour or five touch points with
a brand before fully engagingwith that product or brand and
we just need to make sure thatthey understand.
Oh, I see this is Janice'swebsite and Janice stands for
(15:11):
this and this is what she offers.
And then I see her again in aprint ad or I see her again on
my TikTok and I understand.
Oh, yes, okay, now I understandwhat it is that they offer and
I'm interested in that and Ineed to go find them right.
So, absolutely, we like to makesure and strongly recommend
that there is consistency acrossthe board.
Whether you're a startup andyou, you know your core brand is
(15:33):
your logo.
You know your color palette,your type.
Any photography treatment likethat is the core, that is the
holy grail that you want to makesure that you have really
strong rules about how they'reengaged and how they're employed
.
Also, equally important is thebrand voice and consistency and
how you're communicating, and itcan be a one sheet that you
(16:02):
share with any employee so thatthey are very clear from the
outset of okay, this is how andthese are the rules of
engagement, right,
Janice Hostager (16:07):
Yeah, that's a good way of putting it too.
Anything from like the logo youhave on a pen to the way people
pick up the phone and answer it, and you know and how helpful.
Well, even if you look atretail locations, if you go into
, say, Bath and Body Works, theyall smell the same, you know.
So they put a great deal ofthought and time and energy into
making sure that there's thisconsistency between what you see
(16:29):
online, what you see in theirdigital marketing and their
advertising, their social mediato write down to their
storefronts or Trader Joe's isanother good way.
I think if I go to any TraderJoe's, the cashiers are chatty
and friendly and down to earthand that's part of their brand.
So, yeah, so I mean, I think wedon't really need to be a big
(16:51):
corporation to startimplementing some of that.
It can be something that anysmall business can do, and I
know what the audience is goingto say is like if you have the
time right, so but I think thatthis is probably important for
anyone, at least initially, todo and keep up with it and keep
track of it.
Kylie Kullack (17:14):
Absolutely, and you know we are such big
believers in brand and how yourbrand is communicated.
One of the unique things aboutStruck is that you know we are
unique in that we have a veryrobust kind of branded
environment entity within ourorganization, right.
So to that retail point, wework with a lot of organizations
, whether it's your lobbyexperience to you know, a
full-on headquarters or retailexperience.
How do you ensure that you'rebringing the brand to life in an
(17:37):
authentic way, but a consistentway, so that you know you have
that same nuance of walking intoTrader Joe's and I know what
I'm going to expect.
There shouldn't be surprisesthere, right, because that's the
brand that you know and loveand that's why you chose Trader
Joe's over a competitor.
Janice Hostager (17:54):
Right, right, good point.
How do or maybe they don't, buthow do branding efforts kind of
contribute to customer loyaltyand repeat business for small
business?
It's probably just what you said, right, kind of like you know
what it's going to be, therefore.
.
.
Kylie Kullack (18:10):
Yeah, and you know you want to ensure that
there is the experience thatthey go through for their first
purchase cycle is consistentacross the board.
But, to your point, thecomponents that you can put into
play from a CRM perspective andkind of, once you have
customers within your database,how are you consistently
(18:33):
communicating to them andfollowing up with them and
executing on that brand vision,even when you don't have them
necessarily on your website,purchasing or in your retail
experience purchasing yourproduct?
(19:06):
And to your point, it's like youknow, when you have time, we
believe that the most importantinvestment for a new company or
organization who is reallyinvesting in marketing and
trying to get their product outthere.
This is the foundational piece,right, this is how you define
success, moving forward andhaving a strong brand, and it
doesn't have to be complex, itdoesn't have to be a huge lift,
right, but if you have that, onepager of this is who we are,
this is what we offer, this iswhy we're unique and this is how
we differ from competitors,this is how we communicate and
this is our brand within all ofour key channels.
(19:28):
That helps you scaleconsiderably and putting the
time into something like that isinvaluable and helps you scale
and as you bring on moreemployees, there's a playbook
from which everybody's workingfrom and it should be revisited,
right, because a brandshouldn't sit on a shelf.
Once it's set, you don't forgetit.
A brand is, as I said, a person, right, it's a living,
(19:49):
breathing thing.
So how do you make sure that,as you grow and evolve, that
you're ensuring that you'rereaddressing, kind of that one
sheeter, if you will, of who itis this brand is and how it's
being communicated?
Janice Hostager (20:03):
I was just going to ask you that, like,
what happens if, down the road,a few years into it, I'm
thinking, you know this, what Ithought it was initially isn't
really who we are now.
It's not really who mycustomers are.
How do you go about changingthat?
Do you do an abrupt phase?
Do you do some subtle changes,like where do you?
How do you address that?
Kylie Kullack (20:22):
Yeah, I think you have to evaluate the market
opportunity right.
If you're seeing that an abruptchange would dramatically and
you know you might see adramatic increase in sales by
making that shift, that issomething that is a very viable
option.
If you think it's a slower burn, then you need to better
understand kind of themarketplace and the impact some
(20:43):
of these changes might have.
It is a sound way, particularlyfrom a smaller business
perspective, is to start testingthe waters and seeing kind of
if you're getting more of aresponse on, let's say, this new
product offering or thisshifted tone, and then you can
start to implement across theboard.
Another key thing I think isyou know making sure I mean you
(21:03):
were talking about SEO beforeand particularly for small
businesses.
Yes, revenue sales is kind ofsuccess metric number one, right
yeah, is this working or is itnot right?
But as you're growing, it's alsoidentifying, kind of what are
those one or two other metricsthat you want to keep an eye on
(21:24):
that you can measure to see ifyou are getting the traction
that you're looking for.
And in this day and age, it'sjust so overwhelming how many
different metrics you can trackand it's just like data overload
, right, and you can get lost inanalysis paralysis, right.
And this happens with our large, large entertainment global
(21:44):
clients, right, like they haveso many different data points
that they're looking at thatthey're not actually making
strategic decisions because theydon't understand which one is
the most important.
And what we like to alwayscounsel our clients is there are
two or three major metrics thatyou need to focus on, of course
, pay attention to the otherones, but you need to keep your
eye on the prize with, kind ofthose top two or three metrics
(22:07):
and define how you're gonna bemeasuring them so that you can
really kind of adjust in yourbusiness model if you need to,
or product offering if you needto.
Janice Hostager (22:15):
And what are those metrics?
Kylie Kullack (22:17):
I mean, of course , sales, particularly for
smaller organizations.
It's brand awareness, right.
So how do people, do peopleeven know about you?
And how are we going to measurethat, whether that is just word
of mouth?
That's a really good way ofunderstanding, kind of oh, have
you heard of us?
And no, okay.
And then always asking thosefollow-up questions of how did
(22:38):
you hear about us?
Because you might haveevangelists who are huge fans,
who are telling their friendsleft, right and center and you
want to make sure that you areconnecting with those folks
because they are your brandambassadors and they are doing
this.
You know for the most I meanunderstandably, for free because
they are your brand ambassadorsand they are doing this, you
know for the most, I meanunderstandably, for free because
they believe in your productand they believe in, kind of the
(22:59):
solutions you're offering.
So how can you make sure toamplify the goodwill that
they're doing on your behalf aswell?
Janice Hostager (23:05):
That's, that's really good.
Um, so are there some commonbranding mistakes that you see,
especially with smallerbusinesses?
Do you what?
Do you see that you think, ooh,this is a brand issue.
Kylie Kullack (23:17):
I would say it's a really delicate dance
particularly for smaller startuporganizations who could see
either partnership,like our co-marketing
opportunities that could bereally profitable or lucrative
from a potential saleperspective but maybe aren't in
(23:38):
the best alignment with yourbrand, right?
So it's really important foryou to make sure that, as you're
, you know defining who it is,that your organization is and
what your products are and whatyou aren't.
As you're evaluatingpartnership opportunities or
sponsorship opportunities or anyplace that your brand is going
to be, among others, that you'reensuring that there's
(23:59):
consistency there and kind ofcommon value and speaking to the
right audiences and the sameaudiences, because the last
thing you want to do is put your, your brand, in a situation
where it's a different audiencein a different segment and it
confuses the audience as to whoyou are and what it is you're
offering.
Janice Hostager (24:17):
Okay, okay.
So how do you know if you'vegot a branding problem?
Are there some red flags?
Now, obviously, you can spot it, your customers can spot it,
but as a small business owner,okay, I realized that sales are
not where I hoped they'd be.
How do I know it's a brandingproblem?
Kylie Kullack (24:43):
I think a really good way that you could do that
is to ask a handful of folks whoknow your product and those who
don't, to give you somefeedback on your product and
very quick two or threequestions of you know what is it
that I do and what is it thatmy company offers?
And just elicit really directfeedback.
And if there is inconsistencyacross the board, then you have
a branding problem.
It's so interesting, right, likeyou don't have to have huge
(25:06):
budgets, particularly for smallbusinesses.
Right, like every investmentthat you make is one that needs
to be really considered, butthere are some ways that you can
make some decisions and getsome information that are not
all that costly.
And also, you know, the rise ofAI is also really helpful from
a small business perspective.
How can you leverage tools outthere that can help you propel
(25:29):
and kind of move your marketingefforts forward in a smart way?
And so, whether it's a surveythat you put together on
SurveyMonkey and send it out to20 people that you know, know,
engage with your product anddon't, and ask a very number of
questions of what is it thisbrand is, what is it that we do,
what is our offering that'sreally cost efficient and it can
(25:51):
give you a lot of informationon how folks are interacting and
engaging with your product.
Janice Hostager (25:57):
Oh, that's really really smart.
Thank you.
Kylie, thank you so much forall that you shared with us
today.
How can people find out moreabout you?
Kylie Kullack (26:07):
You can find me on LinkedIn, Kylie Kullack.
I'm sure we'll post somethingso you can sell it.
My last name is a little trickyto find, but on LinkedIn, but
also at Struckcom.
We also have a form there aswell.
Janice Hostager (26:19):
Okay, well, thank you so much, Kylie.
I appreciate you taking thetime to talk with us today.
Kylie Kullack (26:25):
It's been a pleasure to be here.
Thanks, Janice.
Janice Hostager (26:28):
I hope our episode left you feeling fired
up about taking your brand fromgeneric to uniquely You.
Remember, your brand is so muchmore than a logo or a catchy
tagline.
It's how you make people feel,how you show up consistently and
how you connect with youraudience.
For more information aboutKylie or anything we talked
about today, visitmyweeklymarketingcom.
(26:49):
Forward slash 104.
If today's tips gave you somelight bulb moments, I'd love to
hear about them.
Dm me on Instagram at at JaniceHostager Marketing, and share
your biggest takeaway.
And hey, if you're feelingextra generous, share this
episode with a fellow businessowner who's working on nailing
their own brand.
Also, make sure you'resubscribed so you don't miss any
(27:12):
future episodes.
We've got some great guestslined up that you'll definitely
want to hear from.
Thank you so much for joiningme today.
See you next time.
Bye for now.
I'm Janice Hostager.
After three decades in themarketing business and many
years of being an entrepreneur,I've learned a thing or two
about marketing.
Join me as we talk aboutmarketing, small business and
life in between.
Welcome to My Weekly Marketing.
(00:28):
The word brand gets tossedaround a lot in business circles
, but what does it really mean?
It's hard to define what yourbrand is, but we all know a
well-branded company when we seeone, right?
We can all recognize aStarbucks from a McDonald's, a
Disney from a Netflix.
But how do you define your ownbrand?
(00:49):
And that's what my guest today,Kylie Kullack, is going to talk
about.
Kylie is the head of clientengagement for Struck.
Struck is a branding agencythat works with companies to
boost brand awareness,engagement and growth.
She's got some great brandingtips to share with us today, so
let's jump into my conversationwith Kylie.
Well, hey, Kylie, how are youtoday?
Kylie Kullack (01:09):
I'm doing very well.
Thank you for having me.
Janice Hostager (01:14):
I get giddy about the topic of branding, but
before we get into the details,we all start somewhere.
So tell me how you got intobranding, got into this world.
Kylie Kullack (01:27):
Sure, thank you.
Yes, I love branding and couldtalk about branding all day long
.
Once you get into this worldit's so interesting because you
see elements of it every day andit just sparks conversation and
who's doing it well, who isn'tdoing it well.
So, yes, great appreciation forthe importance of branding.
Thrilled to be here.
(01:49):
I started in the advertisingagency world, originally from
New York City, kind of wentthrough the ranks on the agency
side in Manhattan, more on themedia planning and buying side,
so you know where you investyour marketing dollars.
And then my now husband and Idecided to take a leap of faith
and get a little bit of a changeof pace and try living in Park
(02:11):
City, Utah, for a year and nowwe're coming up on 13 years.
Definitely a great shift inlifestyle and kind of
prioritization of work-lifebalance.
And I've been the head ofclient engagement at my current
agency Struck for the last 13years, where we really focus on
(02:32):
the importance of brand butensuring that your brand is
communicated effectively throughall of the channels and we can
talk a little bit about that alittle bit later and, in my role
, oversee kind of our clientengagements, ensuring that we're
understanding from our client'sperspective what their biggest
challenges are and how we canbring value as an agency partner
(02:54):
in helping them achieve theirgoals and building roadmaps and
kind of tactical plans on howthey can do that, but then also
employing the right strategickind of tools and initiatives to
help them achieve that and alsomeasure once they've engaged
with us.
Because the last thing we wantis for clients to come to us and
you know, with lofty goals andsay we can help them achieve
(03:17):
them but not actually track thator measure that on the back end
.
Janice Hostager (03:21):
Lots of questions about that one.
But before we jump into that,so a lot of my clients and I
would say people in general, Ithink brand seems sort of like
this nebulous thing, and I knowthat Jeff Bezos is widely
reported to have said your brandis what other people say about
you when you're not in the room.
Is there more to a brand thanthat?
(03:43):
Like, how would you definebrand if you could do it like in
a sentence, not to put you onthe spot here?
Kylie Kullack (03:49):
No, no you're fine, I would say.
I would add to what Jeff saidin terms of your brand should be
a personification of anindividual, right, how can you
articulate who and what thisbrand is?
If it was a person, your brandis not just your logo or your
logo mark, right, it is how yourcustomers, or potential
(04:11):
customers, interact with you,perceive you and then what their
experience is throughout thatprocess.
And so what we like to do isoften share with our clients,
going through that brandstrategy piece is building out
what your brand is as apersonification, if you will.
How does it look, how does itfeel, how does it articulate,
(04:32):
how does it speak?
What feelings is it evokingfrom your prospective clients?
And so I would plus up whatJeff said is it's, of course,
what they're saying about youwhen you're not in the room, but
what is that person thatthey're
talking about?
Janice Hostager (04:46):
I love that.
For many years I had a designagency, so people would come to
me and say, oh, I need mybranding done.
And what they meant, of course,was they need colors, they need
a font, they need a logo, thatsort of thing.
But brands, they really do runso much deeper than that.
So can you tell me somefoundational principles of
(05:06):
branding that small businessowners can use when they think
about their own brand?
Now you mentionedpersonification, like where do
you start with that?
Kylie Kullack (05:13):
Yeah.
So I think that that is areally important piece is,
before we start any engagement,whether it's designed to your
point.
You know what's the logo looklike.
You need to better understandwhat it is that we're looking to
communicate.
What is it about your businessthat is unique about you know,
in comparison to others?
What is that special kind ofshiny object piece that nobody
(05:36):
else has that you can own?
So it's kind of a reallythorough process to identify
what is it that you uniquelybring and you can offer and your
points of strength.
But more also equally importantis what are you not, what are
you not going to deliver on sothat you can even have a
stronger position moving forward?
(05:56):
And then, what does that looklike and how does that feel?
What is your voice and tone?
How do you communicate?
It's really important forparticularly you know your
listeners as you're buildingyour marketing plans, to have a
clear understanding of who youare, what your brand story is
and how you articulate it.
But then also, how are youdeploying your voice, you know
(06:17):
tone of voice across yourdifferent marketing channels?
So your social media is itconsistent?
Or are you maybe more playfulon your social and then more
serious on your website, right,you want to make sure there's
consistency with how you'recommunicating to your audiences,
so that they're always havingthe same brand experience
through the various touch points.
Janice Hostager (06:39):
And that can be hard right, especially if you
have a team.
You know everybody has to be onthat same, that same sheet.
You know a paper that know thatthis, this is how you talk at
all, in all cases, and this isthe.
.
.
Kylie Kullack (06:50):
Absolutely and we'll develop those you know and
I would recommend your team youknow your clients going through
a similar process.
It doesn't need to be tooin-depth or too cumbersome.
It should be something that'spretty inherent, particularly
for a founder or kind of thegroups of those who are working
particularly within the startupspace is who are we and what is
(07:11):
that short list of?
What are our brand attributesand how does that get expressed
from a communication perspective?
And it should be two or threepoints like very salient, very
succinct.
This is how we communicate, sothat they all are working from
the same playbook and they'reall speaking the same language.
Janice Hostager (07:40):
Now working backwards from that a little bit
.
So when I have a client thatsays, oh, you know, like I don't
know where to start with mybrand, so I always think of your
mission, your vision and whatthat is like a stone and you
throw that stone in a pond andit's like a series of concentric
circles that radiate outward,so from there, once you figure
out what that stone is, thenthey can determine who you're
about, then you can determinewhat's unique about your company
, what is your personality, andkind of go from there.
(08:01):
So it's not like you reallyhave to start somewhere.
Do you start with that missionand vision or is there another
place that you kind of startwithin that company?
Or maybe it's the founder'spersonality?
How do you start?
What within that company Do youstart?
Or maybe it's the founder'spersonality, or what?
How do you start?
What's that called?
Kylie Kullack (08:14):
Yeah, no, I think that is absolutely the place to
start with, because that'swhere the passion comes from,
the founders in particular.
Right, it's like why are youputting your blood, sweat and
tears into this idea?
What is it that you're lookingto achieve and how can your
offering uniquely do that?
So it's understanding, missionand vision.
But then it gets a little bitmore tactical, into kind of for
(08:39):
us, there are about two or threethings that we also like to
layer in.
Is targeting right?
So a prioritization of theaudience segments that are going
to have the highest potentialfor growth with whatever it is
that you're offering.
So, you know, particularly forstartup businesses, you want to
(09:00):
make sure that you're growing asquickly as possible, but you
also want to be growing smartlyand strategically, with the
audiences who are going toengage, re-engage, but then also
share and kind of advocate foryou or your product post
engaging with you.
So it's really important tomake sure that we prioritize
audiences and, for the moneythat you might be investing from
a marketing perspective, you'rebeing smart in how you're
(09:22):
investing, that you're not justmarketing to everybody.
Let's look at prioritizing yourinvestments so that you can
really focus on those high valueaudiences from a targeting
perspective.
We also then like to layer inkind of this brand positioning
piece, right?
So how do we develop a clear andcompelling brand positioning
statement, if you will, thatdefines how your brand should be
(09:45):
perceived in the minds of thosetarget audiences that we just
talked about, and how does thisdifferentiate the brand from
competitors but also aligns withkind of customer expectations?
And usually, you know, we do alot of work in terms of
understanding the competitionand kind of the competitive
landscape and where you fallwithin that mix, what is the
(10:05):
audience, what are the landscape, the industry factors that are,
you know, need to be front andcenter to get to this.
And it's usually a sentence ortwo, so that it's a very clear
distillation of who it is yourorganization is and what you
offered and who you offer it to,and it should be something that
everybody in your organizationcan repeat and can articulate
(10:26):
very clearly.
It's not your tagline, it's notexternal facing, it's not for
your consumers.
For the most part it's morethis is who we are and this is
what we offer and why it'simportant.
And then, as we get a littlebit further, then we can help
with kind of more of thatproduct positioning.
So if you're an organizationthat offers multiple products,
how can you make sure thatyou're building up strategic
frameworks on how you canposition those products that are
(10:49):
kind of nuanced for the variouscustomer needs?
Janice Hostager (10:55):
So they all align with the same brand?
Kylie Kullack (10:57):
Yes
Janice Hostager (10:59):
Okay, all right .
Are there instances where acompany will kind of offshoot
and kind of go with a separatebrand for a separate product or
separate lines of products?
Kylie Kullack (11:05):
Yes, absolutely, and we definitely recommend that
and making sure that, as you'relooking through, if you're an
organization that has multipledifferent products, kind of
going through a brandarchitecture process and really
defining that organization ofyour products and services to
help ensure clarity, consistencyand kind of synergy across all
(11:26):
the various brand touch points,right.
So if you have a house ofbrands versus a branded house.
How can you make sure thatyou're very clear in
articulating?
The various products all liveunder a specific brand.
Janice Hostager (11:39):
Is that something you'd recommend with a
smaller business, or do youfeel like that's maybe down the
road a little bit?
Kylie Kullack (11:44):
For the most part , for smaller businesses, I
would say it's focus on yourcore brand and getting the
awareness out of your brand andonce you get them into your
audience, into your funnel,that's where you can use your
various channels to helpintroduce or reintroduce other
products to clients.
Janice Hostager (12:02):
Okay, so I'm a small business owner.
I like to say it's hard for ajar to read its own label, right
?
So it's hard for us as smallbusiness owners to really kind
of get a grip about what ourbrand should be and to kind of
see ourselves from the outsidein.
So where do you start in theprocess?
(12:24):
If you're a small businessowner, where do you start in
that process?
(12:56):
think it's in articulationeven if it's just putting down
on paper of this is what Ibelieve my brand is and kind of
what is unique and the best wayyou could do, we recommend that,
we recommend is either withsmall businesses or through
larger organizations is let's dosome testing, right, put it out
into the marketplace and getfeedback from those who engage
and know the brand as it existstoday, equally important, those
who don't know your brand oryour offering, and have them
experience it and kind of shareback with you what they believe
the experience is or the brandis, because that will also help
better articulate, maybe, whattweaks need to be made or how
you're positioning.
It is maybe confusing, so theremight need to be a bit of a
(13:19):
clarification, if you will, ofwhat it is your product is and
how you're communicating it.
So we like to do a fair amountof testing, whether it's
primarily with those who arethat primary kind of target
audience that you're you'relooking to reach
Okay, just kind of put it out there, get some
feedback, kind of.
.
.
Kylie Kullack (13:39):
Yeah, and if you, have iterations of those you
know, put an option or two infront of those folks who know
the brand, um, but also have theoutsider perspective.
Uh, because it is true for smallbusiness owners, you can get
very into the weeds, um, andsometimes you just need that 10
000 foot view of clarity just tobe able to step back
Janice Hostager (13:59):
Yeah, yeah, so I have clients that will.
.
.
Um, I get this question actuallyquite a bit.
Um, what role is consistency?
How important is consistency, Iwould say, in your brand?
So let's say, your websitelooks a certain way I'm talking
in visual branding at this pointbut say, your website looks one
way and you're trying to keepthat consistent, but you know
(14:21):
your social media person's overon TikTok using some different
fonts and some different colors.
Is that a big deal?
Kylie Kullack (14:27):
Yes, yes, that is a big deal.
It is a cardinal rule withinbranding to ensuring that it is
consistent across the board.
You have no idea where and howyour customers will be engaging
with your brand and they need toknow that it is the same brand
through those various touchpoints.
(14:49):
So if someone has gone to yourwebsite and then happens to
follow you on TikTok but thensees a completely different
representation of the brand,that's misleading and it's not
clear.
Typically, consumers have aboutfour or five touch points with
a brand before fully engagingwith that product or brand and
we just need to make sure thatthey understand.
Oh, I see this is Janice'swebsite and Janice stands for
(15:11):
this and this is what she offers.
And then I see her again in aprint ad or I see her again on
my TikTok and I understand.
Oh, yes, okay, now I understandwhat it is that they offer and
I'm interested in that and Ineed to go find them right.
So, absolutely, we like to makesure and strongly recommend
that there is consistency acrossthe board.
Whether you're a startup andyou, you know your core brand is
(15:33):
your logo.
You know your color palette,your type.
Any photography treatment likethat is the core, that is the
holy grail that you want to makesure that you have really
strong rules about how they'reengaged and how they're employed
.
Also, equally important is thebrand voice and consistency and
how you're communicating, and itcan be a one sheet that you
(16:02):
share with any employee so thatthey are very clear from the
outset of okay, this is how andthese are the rules of
engagement, right,
Janice Hostager (16:07):
Yeah, that's a good way of putting it too.
Anything from like the logo youhave on a pen to the way people
pick up the phone and answer it, and you know and how helpful.
Well, even if you look atretail locations, if you go into
, say, Bath and Body Works, theyall smell the same, you know.
So they put a great deal ofthought and time and energy into
making sure that there's thisconsistency between what you see
(16:29):
online, what you see in theirdigital marketing and their
advertising, their social mediato write down to their
storefronts or Trader Joe's isanother good way.
I think if I go to any TraderJoe's, the cashiers are chatty
and friendly and down to earthand that's part of their brand.
So, yeah, so I mean, I think wedon't really need to be a big
(16:51):
corporation to startimplementing some of that.
It can be something that anysmall business can do, and I
know what the audience is goingto say is like if you have the
time right, so but I think thatthis is probably important for
anyone, at least initially, todo and keep up with it and keep
track of it.
Kylie Kullack (17:14):
Absolutely, and you know we are such big
believers in brand and how yourbrand is communicated.
One of the unique things aboutStruck is that you know we are
unique in that we have a veryrobust kind of branded
environment entity within ourorganization, right.
So to that retail point, wework with a lot of organizations
, whether it's your lobbyexperience to you know, a
full-on headquarters or retailexperience.
How do you ensure that you'rebringing the brand to life in an
(17:37):
authentic way, but a consistentway, so that you know you have
that same nuance of walking intoTrader Joe's and I know what
I'm going to expect.
There shouldn't be surprisesthere, right, because that's the
brand that you know and loveand that's why you chose Trader
Joe's over a competitor.
Janice Hostager (17:54):
Right, right, good point.
How do or maybe they don't, buthow do branding efforts kind of
contribute to customer loyaltyand repeat business for small
business?
It's probably just what you said, right, kind of like you know
what it's going to be, therefore.
.
.
Kylie Kullack (18:10):
Yeah, and you know you want to ensure that
there is the experience thatthey go through for their first
purchase cycle is consistentacross the board.
But, to your point, thecomponents that you can put into
play from a CRM perspective andkind of, once you have
customers within your database,how are you consistently
(18:33):
communicating to them andfollowing up with them and
executing on that brand vision,even when you don't have them
necessarily on your website,purchasing or in your retail
experience purchasing yourproduct?
(19:06):
And to your point, it's like youknow, when you have time, we
believe that the most importantinvestment for a new company or
organization who is reallyinvesting in marketing and
trying to get their product outthere.
This is the foundational piece,right, this is how you define
success, moving forward andhaving a strong brand, and it
doesn't have to be complex, itdoesn't have to be a huge lift,
right, but if you have that, onepager of this is who we are,
this is what we offer, this iswhy we're unique and this is how
we differ from competitors,this is how we communicate and
this is our brand within all ofour key channels.
(19:28):
That helps you scaleconsiderably and putting the
time into something like that isinvaluable and helps you scale
and as you bring on moreemployees, there's a playbook
from which everybody's workingfrom and it should be revisited,
right, because a brandshouldn't sit on a shelf.
Once it's set, you don't forgetit.
A brand is, as I said, a person, right, it's a living,
(19:49):
breathing thing.
So how do you make sure that,as you grow and evolve, that
you're ensuring that you'rereaddressing, kind of that one
sheeter, if you will, of who itis this brand is and how it's
being communicated?
Janice Hostager (20:03):
I was just going to ask you that, like,
what happens if, down the road,a few years into it, I'm
thinking, you know this, what Ithought it was initially isn't
really who we are now.
It's not really who mycustomers are.
How do you go about changingthat?
Do you do an abrupt phase?
Do you do some subtle changes,like where do you?
How do you address that?
Kylie Kullack (20:22):
Yeah, I think you have to evaluate the market
opportunity right.
If you're seeing that an abruptchange would dramatically and
you know you might see adramatic increase in sales by
making that shift, that issomething that is a very viable
option.
If you think it's a slower burn, then you need to better
understand kind of themarketplace and the impact some
(20:43):
of these changes might have.
It is a sound way, particularlyfrom a smaller business
perspective, is to start testingthe waters and seeing kind of
if you're getting more of aresponse on, let's say, this new
product offering or thisshifted tone, and then you can
start to implement across theboard.
Another key thing I think isyou know making sure I mean you
(21:03):
were talking about SEO beforeand particularly for small
businesses.
Yes, revenue sales is kind ofsuccess metric number one, right
yeah, is this working or is itnot right?
But as you're growing, it's alsoidentifying, kind of what are
those one or two other metricsthat you want to keep an eye on
(21:24):
that you can measure to see ifyou are getting the traction
that you're looking for.
And in this day and age, it'sjust so overwhelming how many
different metrics you can trackand it's just like data overload
, right, and you can get lost inanalysis paralysis, right.
And this happens with our large, large entertainment global
(21:44):
clients, right, like they haveso many different data points
that they're looking at thatthey're not actually making
strategic decisions because theydon't understand which one is
the most important.
And what we like to alwayscounsel our clients is there are
two or three major metrics thatyou need to focus on, of course
, pay attention to the otherones, but you need to keep your
eye on the prize with, kind ofthose top two or three metrics
(22:07):
and define how you're gonna bemeasuring them so that you can
really kind of adjust in yourbusiness model if you need to,
or product offering if you needto.
Janice Hostager (22:15):
And what are those metrics?
Kylie Kullack (22:17):
I mean, of course , sales, particularly for
smaller organizations.
It's brand awareness, right.
So how do people, do peopleeven know about you?
And how are we going to measurethat, whether that is just word
of mouth?
That's a really good way ofunderstanding, kind of oh, have
you heard of us?
And no, okay.
And then always asking thosefollow-up questions of how did
(22:38):
you hear about us?
Because you might haveevangelists who are huge fans,
who are telling their friendsleft, right and center and you
want to make sure that you areconnecting with those folks
because they are your brandambassadors and they are doing
this.
You know for the most I meanunderstandably, for free because
they are your brand ambassadorsand they are doing this, you
know for the most, I meanunderstandably, for free because
they believe in your productand they believe in, kind of the
(22:59):
solutions you're offering.
So how can you make sure toamplify the goodwill that
they're doing on your behalf aswell?
Janice Hostager (23:05):
That's, that's really good.
Um, so are there some commonbranding mistakes that you see,
especially with smallerbusinesses?
Do you what?
Do you see that you think, ooh,this is a brand issue.
Kylie Kullack (23:17):
I would say it's a really delicate dance
particularly for smaller startuporganizations who could see
either partnership,like our co-marketing
opportunities that could bereally profitable or lucrative
from a potential saleperspective but maybe aren't in
(23:38):
the best alignment with yourbrand, right?
So it's really important foryou to make sure that, as you're
, you know defining who it is,that your organization is and
what your products are and whatyou aren't.
As you're evaluatingpartnership opportunities or
sponsorship opportunities or anyplace that your brand is going
to be, among others, that you'reensuring that there's
(23:59):
consistency there and kind ofcommon value and speaking to the
right audiences and the sameaudiences, because the last
thing you want to do is put your, your brand, in a situation
where it's a different audiencein a different segment and it
confuses the audience as to whoyou are and what it is you're
offering.
Janice Hostager (24:17):
Okay, okay.
So how do you know if you'vegot a branding problem?
Are there some red flags?
Now, obviously, you can spot it, your customers can spot it,
but as a small business owner,okay, I realized that sales are
not where I hoped they'd be.
How do I know it's a brandingproblem?
Kylie Kullack (24:43):
I think a really good way that you could do that
is to ask a handful of folks whoknow your product and those who
don't, to give you somefeedback on your product and
very quick two or threequestions of you know what is it
that I do and what is it thatmy company offers?
And just elicit really directfeedback.
And if there is inconsistencyacross the board, then you have
a branding problem.
It's so interesting, right, likeyou don't have to have huge
(25:06):
budgets, particularly for smallbusinesses.
Right, like every investmentthat you make is one that needs
to be really considered, butthere are some ways that you can
make some decisions and getsome information that are not
all that costly.
And also, you know, the rise ofAI is also really helpful from
a small business perspective.
How can you leverage tools outthere that can help you propel
(25:29):
and kind of move your marketingefforts forward in a smart way?
And so, whether it's a surveythat you put together on
SurveyMonkey and send it out to20 people that you know, know,
engage with your product anddon't, and ask a very number of
questions of what is it thisbrand is, what is it that we do,
what is our offering that'sreally cost efficient and it can
(25:51):
give you a lot of informationon how folks are interacting and
engaging with your product.
Janice Hostager (25:57):
Oh, that's really really smart.
Thank you.
Kylie, thank you so much forall that you shared with us
today.
How can people find out moreabout you?
Kylie Kullack (26:07):
You can find me on LinkedIn, Kylie Kullack.
I'm sure we'll post somethingso you can sell it.
My last name is a little trickyto find, but on LinkedIn, but
also at Struckcom.
We also have a form there aswell.
Janice Hostager (26:19):
Okay, well, thank you so much, Kylie.
I appreciate you taking thetime to talk with us today.
Kylie Kullack (26:25):
It's been a pleasure to be here.
Thanks, Janice.
Janice Hostager (26:28):
I hope our episode left you feeling fired
up about taking your brand fromgeneric to uniquely You.
Remember, your brand is so muchmore than a logo or a catchy
tagline.
It's how you make people feel,how you show up consistently and
how you connect with youraudience.
For more information aboutKylie or anything we talked
about today, visitmyweeklymarketingcom.
(26:49):
Forward slash 104.
If today's tips gave you somelight bulb moments, I'd love to
hear about them.
Dm me on Instagram at at JaniceHostager Marketing, and share
your biggest takeaway.
And hey, if you're feelingextra generous, share this
episode with a fellow businessowner who's working on nailing
their own brand.
Also, make sure you'resubscribed so you don't miss any
(27:12):
future episodes.
We've got some great guestslined up that you'll definitely
want to hear from.
Thank you so much for joiningme today.
See you next time.
Bye for now.
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy And Charlamagne Tha God!
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.