March 7, 2025 • 55 mins
In this enlightening episode, host Todd McLaughlin is joined by Reverend Jaganath Carrera and Margabandhu Martarano, two esteemed figures in the world of yoga, both sharing a profound bond through their shared teacher, Swami Satchidananda. This episode explores their individual journeys of how they met, their teaching philosophies, and how they have built thriving communities over decades of dedicated practice. Reverend Jaganath and Margabandhu offer their wisdom, emphasizing the importance of community within yoga and how it contributes to personal growth and enlightenment.
Visit Rev. Jaganath here: https://www.yogalifecenter.org/
Visit Margabandhu on his website: https://iyinj.org/
Key Takeaways:
- The value of friendship and community in yoga is immense, often guiding personal and collective growth.
- Teaching philosophy inspired by Swami Satchidananda emphasizes fostering understanding and personal transformation rather than dictating behavior.
- Maintaining a spiritual practice and community support can significantly impact personal well-being and spiritual advancement.
- Humor and cultural understanding play significant roles in developing and sustaining long-term spiritual associations.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:33):
Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast,so happy you are here. My goal
with this channel is to bringinspirational speakers to the
mic in the field of yoga,massage, body work and beyond.
Follow us at @nativeyoga andcheck us out at
nativeyogacenter.com. All right,let's begin.
(01:04):
Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast,and welcome to the show. And I'm
really excited for what you areabout to hear in this episode. I
got an opportunity to dosomething I haven't done yet,
and which is interview bothReverend Jaganath and
(01:25):
Margabandhu together. And Ohman, I'm so excited for you to
hear this, because, you know,both of these gentlemen have
cultivated a friendship, and,you know, studied and practiced
yoga together with the sameteacher, Swami Satchidananda,
(01:46):
you know, well over 50 yearsago. And I think there's just
something really special aboutbeing in the company of a long
term friendship like this. Andthe first time I had the chance
to speak with both of them. Itwas to discuss doing this
podcast interview with with one,one on one, with each of them.
(02:07):
And through that, I had thefeeling that, well, this is
what's really interesting here.
So please, if you're just comingin on this episode, definitely
go back to episode 207 where Ihad a chance to interview one on
one, Margabandhu. Episode 208the one just previous, where I
had a chance to interviewReverend Jaganath, one on one.
And now here, episode 209 wherewe bring both of them together.
(02:29):
And I know I'll be listening tothis one. Re listening to this
one a few times, because I feellike there's a lot of really
amazing tidbits and nuggets ofwisdom here. I hope you enjoy.
Please click on the links in thedescription so that you can see
where both Reverend Jaganath andMargabandu are located. Make a
(02:51):
visit to their centers. And Ithink the overarching theme here
is, let's continue to uphold thedeeper meaning and teachings of
yoga and build a really strongcommunity within our own studios
circles, but even on the bigpicture around the globe. So
(03:14):
with that being said, let's getstarted. Hello, Reverend
Jaganath and Margabandhu. Thankyou so much for joining me here
today for our episode where, onepisode number 207 I got a
chance to interview one on one.
Margabandhu, on the last episodenumber 208 I got a chance to
(03:38):
interview, interview you,Reverend Jaganath and through
the process of arranging forthese interviews, the first one
was a pre interview where I gota chance to speak to both of you
just like this. And I found itso refreshing and invigorating
having the two of you heretogether, because I got a sense
(03:59):
of the history the both of youhave, and I have a friend that
I've been he teaches yoga, Iteach yoga, and we've been
communicating over the last 20years and helping each other out
along the way and and I guess Iwant to bring a little attention
to how valuable and important itis To have a friend along to
(04:22):
travel with along this journey,and the feeling that you both
had, and when I was listening toyou, felt special, and that's
why I'm grateful to have thischance to have the two of you
together here and hear somestories about yoga. Thank you so
much. Thank you on that note,how did you guys meet?
(04:47):
I remember the first timeMargabandhu wanted you must have
been in a program, yeah, yeah.
And then you had called and wewent, and then I went to New
Brunswick, right? Is thatright? That's right. I forgot
about. At that Yeah, yeah.
Margabandhu would come everySaturday. We had a center in New
Brunswick, and at that time youwere in Garfield, yes, yes. In
(05:12):
Garfield spent an hour apart.
And I don't remember how itstarted, but Margabandhu would
come every Saturday, and that'swhen I got the letter from
Gurudev to say that how great ofa teacher he was, and just to
learn from him. And that's whatdid. I observed and how he
treated people. And I saw thepower that comes from serving
(05:35):
others, you know, a selflessservice, that there's a power
there. And he, you know, he'sincredibly knowledgeable and on
all these healing aspects ofyoga in life. But I think just
having him around is there'ssomething about him that speaks
of the essence of yoga. So I'malways feeling like indebted to
(05:59):
him. I just heard I've neversaid, don't change the protocol.
So I'm sticking with it. I justwatch him and learn from him.
Yeah, there's a mutual feelingright here. You know, between
the two of us, we're likebrothers, and we respect one
(06:21):
another's opinion and the way heruns things is really admirable.
Really, you have to see peoplerespond to him, you know, I
believe that there's a mutualfeeling, and that helps both
centers, you know,yeah, that's cool. That's That's
neat to think about how you knoweach of you running your own
program, are able to supporteach other, but the energy would
(06:42):
be feeding off of each otherlike that, to have a whole hours
distance between. Did you guyshave students that would travel?
You know, one weekend we'd begoing over to your studio,
Reverend Juggernaut, and thenone weekend you guys would trade
off and set up like little fieldtrip situations? Or was it more,
more that you, each of you,would just travel and support
(07:03):
each other's communities,each other's communities. He
would give talks here. See,everybody gravitated towards
Reverend Jagannath. You know,he's a little humble about
things, but you know, we he'sspeaking, we all gravitate
towards him, you know, he's theman. No, we have a sentence, and
we both run our sentence verywell, but when it comes to
(07:28):
speaking his philosophy is justevery word of his is like, like,
spiritually involved, you know?
So there's a lot of respect forhim right now.
We have some of our students seehim regularly and go to classes
(07:50):
there. It's really part of onelineage. I think that's part of
the if there's a secret, that'spart of it, that we really are
following the teachings of SwamiSatchidananda, ultimately. So
both of us are students of SwamiSatchidananda have a lot of
things in common over the years.
So these students come in andthey see that there really isn't
(08:12):
a big divide between the twodifferent centers, and they
students in my center, they loveMarga Bandu, and I love
referring people to him often.
So that's something that I thinkmore yoga centers should have.
(08:33):
That attitude, my experience hasbeen sometimes it's not that
way, actually at a really higherlevel teacher in another
organization, and she wasmeeting with other teachers with
my book on the Yoga Sutras, andwhen the person who's the head
of it heard threatened to kickher out. Where you've seen that
(08:58):
book, this is yoga sutras. Youknow, I'm not getting married to
them in this person. I wasn'tteaching there, but she had come
to some talks that I've done,and she thought it was really
great to have these, thesemeetings. And they said, No, you
couldn't do that. It's differentfrom us. She got paid so she
(09:20):
would lose her income. It's kindof a sad thing to see that kind
of thing happen.
Well, that's a really goodpoint. I think the aspect of
competitiveness, within therealm of the challenge to
survive and make a living,probably is one of the big
(09:41):
dividing factors in trying tohelp support a neighboring
studio. But I think obviously,in the spirit of yoga, we aim
and hope that that won't be thecase, but then we see that
sometimes, can you both help meunderstand. And how, how do you
(10:03):
both receive compensation forthe time and energy that you put
in, beyond the good feedbackthat you have from the feedback
that you receive? Because I'mcurious what kind of model
you've been able to adopt thathas worked harmoniously like
this.
Well, at the I have my ownpractice, and it happens to be
(10:24):
at the institute, see, so I seepeople during the, you know,
during the day, and, you know,they come to me for new
nutritional counseling, and Iwork on them, you know, yeah,
and, and, but in between, I'llbe I teach at Philly Dickinson
University, and we've beenteaching here, I think, 54
(10:45):
years. It's accredited course,so that money, because I teach
yoga, goes to the institute, sothat so in between, I do both
kind of my own at the Institute,and then I teach a class. I
teach a class on Sundaymornings. It's called art of
self healing, Antarctica andnecklace. So any whatever I
teach yoga, Glee goes to theinstitute my own personal
(11:07):
practice. You know, I That's mymy business. Like, understood,
I'm an herbalist. So,yeah, understood, thank you. Is
that a similar pretty good isthat a similar setup? Reverend
jaganoff,no, money is different. I'm
trying to think where to startwith it. Partially, my wife is a
nurse, hospice nurse, so thatwas income coming in. And she
(11:32):
said over the years, likeanything I do that makes money
for me doesn't work. I have to.
Always seems like I have to notdo it for money. But this group
of students that gathered aroundme, they wanted to know what was
like tradition. They really wereinterested in tradition. They
said, Well, you have have yourteacher. It's not that you paid
(11:57):
the teacher, but you helpedsupport them with, the food,
clothing, the basic needs,that's what you do. It as an
offering. So one person, who's abookkeeper, asked me to
calculate, what are my expenses,monthly expenses, and that's
what I get. I get whatever the Idon't even know what the number
(12:18):
is, but that was the idea. It'snot thought of. It's like a
payment for service. But that'shelping to support me so that I
can't dedicate myself toservice. So that's, it's a
little different situation thanMargo bond do, yeah,
that's, that's interesting sofar. I mean, yeah, I hear you,
(12:40):
and I think like when you seethe outcome of the camaraderie
that can occur from that, that'sa clear indicator that something
worked well. Did Swami SachinAnanda ever receive payment from
you guys in the time that youwere studying with him, or did
he keep that on a very similarthread where you, like, I loved
(13:03):
your story. Margo Bandu, aboutdriving him on out in California
and getting dropped off, butlike, you know you were helping
him to be with him while he'sdriving, you know, that type of
thing. You know, you'resupporting him, you're helping
along the way. Is that how hekept it the whole time?
Almost like the same, right?
Jagannath, I mean, basically thesame. We supported him. And, you
know, most of the time he wasspeaking, he was visiting
(13:26):
different centers, so all thattraveling and housing had to be
gotten from somewhere. So he wassupported by the whole
organization, right? His I guessthat was, is that? Right?
Juggernaut, yeah,yeah, yeah, there would be a,
wasn't a fee. He never, as faras I know, he never asked for a
(13:48):
certain amount of money. Yeah,you know, it was never, never
even a part of the conversation.
We just did it as an offeringthat that made sense to us, and
that covered, you know, all thetravel, if you had to fly, or
the hotels or whatever, we wouldtake care of that. And then I'm
sure it's similar Margot Bonner,anything actually would go to
(14:09):
him as well, because you knowwhat the feeling is, what we
receive from that kind ofexpertise and care. We really
want to support that, but Idon't remember him ever asking,
yeah, that's pretty amazing.
That's an amazing trait. That'sa very admirable trait. We don't
see that very often these days,no, yeah.
(14:37):
Way that he earned money otherthan when he would teach
Marco bando, I heard you saythat you, prior to seeing record
that you offered your teachertraining for free over these
years, that that's um, can youexplain a little bit about how
you structure your training andwhat what kind of energy comes
(14:58):
out of of offering somethinglike. This to people. I mean,
it'snot me just offering you that we
have a teacher's trainingprogram, and people come, people
that have been taking classes ordoing yoga for a while, and they
want to, you know, take teacherstraining, and we have a certain
fee, and our teachers that teachthe teachers training don't get
paid. All that money goes tosupport the institute. We have a
(15:18):
rent here. We have a mortgagehere. We have expenses, you
know, so and then we have peoplethat we have a secretary and
who, who does calm yoga as well,and she takes care of all the
bills. So anything that's madefinancially, we give to her, and
she allocates it, got it, paysmortgage, she pays the bills.
And then it's similar to whatjuggernaut center does, too. And
(15:40):
basically, you know, yeah. And,you know, even good of I used to
have him when he said PhillyDickinson, and he would get a
fee, you know, and then he wouldjust give it to the center. He'd
pay the bills. He would neverkeep it, yeah, you know, yeah.
And if he wanted something. Youknow, he got it. He just, can I
(16:01):
tell you funny story, jacket, doyou know the story? Gert ever
got the car? No. Car? No, thatwas that green. Yeah? Imperial,
right? I think, yeah. Atthe time, how I met the Gerda
was through the rascals, theyoung rascals. I don't know if
you rememberwho they were. Todd, I do, I do.
I do the rest. Yes, Rosie, Eddiebrigadian, and I was always with
(16:26):
him. And then Miss Swamy, such aand that's how you got to meet
Swami. Said none. So they wouldsee him a lot, especially Felix
Cavalieri. He was really intothe philosophy of yoga. And he
was, you know, so we, we were onSwami session on a lot. So a lot
of times we would take him someplaces. And at that time, the
(16:46):
rascals had their own car. Theyhad an organization. Car was a
brand new LeBaron, beautiful leBaron. And we used to, they used
to pick up Swami session on.
Then the car was a verycomfortable car. It was a
luxurious car. And he said, hesaid, really like it? So Eddie
Bugatti would say, you like thiscar? Oh, he's very comfortable
(17:08):
for me. Because, you know, Swamihas to go places, so he has to
be very comfortable. So theysaid, you want it, you got it.
So they gave me the cook, youknow, that basic term you
wanted, you got it. It wasfamiliar. It was It wasn't that
familiar to Swami Satchidananda,and he picked up on it. He
picked up very quickly on ourlanguage discussion. So after he
(17:31):
gave him the car, he's given atalk at the same John the Divine
church. And somebody asked him,good of I would like to see God.
He says, you want it? You gotit. You asked him to go. He
would see, is it possible forme? They would say, you want to
You got it. You know, use thatterm in the lecture. How they
(17:55):
gave him the green labarron,beautiful car.
How was his English when hefirst came over to the states?
Was he like peopledidn't send the vowels and
consonants were a little off,but most, most of us could
understand, we understand thegist of it. Yeah, you know?
Yeah. It was close quarter. Sohe would noise to be with him.
In the beginning, we had privateconsultations. So those private
(18:19):
consultations, you got tounderstand, my first
consultation with him was, itwas like a psychiatric, you
know, visit, you know, yes,you know, he was in the chin. We
talked about things, but, youknow, he explained to me drugs,
you know, talking about thedrugs I did. And, you know, and
he would always ask questions,and it seemed like, even though
(18:42):
he asked questions, he seemed toknow everything about it. So one
time he asked me, What is thisokay to talk about you?
Absolutely. Oh my gosh, yes,please, please. He asked
me about LSD. And so I wastelling him, he goes, Well, he
explained. He says, what thatreally does he and he told me.
(19:03):
He says, when you take a certainchemical, it activates the
serotonin, and what happens yourthird eye, it raises the channel
up, and then when the drug goesup, it closes down. So that's
why you have something called abad trip. You know? You explain
that to me. He says, withmeditation, it throws up the
serotonin, opens up the eye, butdoesn't close back down. And
(19:24):
that was really clear to meabout meditation and how so
that's how he explained thingsto us, yeah, about how accepted
that. He brought everything downto the lowest common
denominator. He explained thephysiology of it, mechanics of
it, and then that's how heaccepted it nice, that's was and
he did. He even in thebeginning, he didn't tell us to
become a vegetarian. He told usthe mechanics of eating and
(19:47):
about the food and you know, andthat's how he did everything
with us. He never demandedanything of us. He explained it
to us very clearly, and webought into that philosophy. Is
that jaganna Isthat sounds perfect. Yeah,
that's exactly what it what itwas like with him. Never
demanded. He once said to me,said, anything that's good, I
(20:07):
can't keep you from doinganything that's bad. I can never
make you will do, like, thinkingof the whole Sangha that way,
that, I mean, that's like aguiding force, in a way, to not
think of like changing people,but like Margo bonded says, you
just simply present. That's whathe would do. He was, there was
(20:29):
never a sense of being forced todo anything. Yeah,
I love that, because I rememberMargo bond to the story you told
me on the last session about howwhen you went to give the speech
to on celibacy that he had saidto you, just remind them that
it's not a sacrifice. And I wasthinking about that the last few
(20:49):
days, since I heard you say thatthat's such a interesting way to
approach teaching, in the senseof what you both are reiterating
now on letting almost likeencouraging us to make our own
minds up. So it's not likesomebody telling me what to do,
but I Oh, and like thatinspiration I can come from.
(21:11):
I was, you know, when heexplained to me, because there
was nuns and priests and I'msaying, Where am I, you know?
And that's first he told me,it's not a sacrifice. They told
me the physiology of it. And he,just after I gave the talk,
there was a one of the priestswas a scientist. He taught
science, and he explained thatwas very interesting. They
enjoyed it, you know, because Iwas a little nervous about it,
(21:34):
in a way, yeah, I say, okay, buthe explained to me physiology of
it, and I hadn't heard it thatway before, you know, the way he
explained, he explained to meover the phone. I kept calling
him, you know, and, and that'swhat he said, very clear, very
interesting, you know, rebuildsyour system. Regenerates every
(21:56):
cell, increases the product. Imean, you had to buy into it.
And I mean, the way he explainedit. You know, Reverend,
Reverend Jack, not Was thereever a time that he asked you to
do something that you felt alittle nervous about in relation
to teaching or presenting?
It's interesting because storycame to mind that was really to
(22:18):
me, uh, Pivotal on a lot oflevels. I was at Rutgers
University. I was part of thecampus ministry, and it was one
point in time the ministersadmit. They said, we want to do
programs to help the students,like anti drug and whatever they
were talking about. And so I wasat a talk. There was me,
(22:41):
Catholic priest, and I don'tknow what very conservative
Christian young woman, and Idon't remember what the topic
was, but towards the end, we hadquestions and answers that one
young man raised his hand and headdressed the question to me,
and it was very intellectual.
And it always was. Every certainsentence was started with, if
(23:04):
God wants, if God wants, if Godwants, I'm listening to it. And
I was studying that time a lotof Yana yoga, so I was in that
state of mind. So I was saying,well, basically it's not that
God wants anything. God haseverything. And next to me is
this woman, and she startsshaking, literally shaking, and
I see her vibrating it. Andaccording to her, I said she's
(23:27):
going to explode, and she did.
She leapt over to me, she's andput her hand over my mouth and
said, I don't like your God. Oh,somehow I felt calm. I said,
Okay, I was sitting there and apriest I was got to be friendly
with. He said, Well, this iswhat he was trying to say. He
(23:50):
kind of smoothed it over. Nextday, I had to call Gurudev for
some business reason. After wedid the business part, I told
him what happened. I said, Whatcould I have done better? Like,
what could I do? And he wasgiving me some advice. And you
know about he said, you youshouldn't have started with
(24:10):
that, that kind of heavyphilosophy, just like, find the
where you that's what it was,find what your point in unison,
that you have what do you have?
In unison, and then give it ayogic twist to find something.
And then there was this pause.
This is the part that really wasinteresting to me, he says. And
(24:33):
his his whole demeanor changedin the world, he said, Now I
remember now I want you to callthat minister and tell her
everything that we said, tellher that you called me, and say
everything that I said to her.
And I said, this is one of thosekind of Guru moments I'm just
going to do. Hung up. I calledthe phone. And so she's this
(24:55):
very nice woman, veryconservative, very conservative.
Christian. So I said, Well, Icalled my guru this morning, and
this is what he said. And I wentthrough the whole thing with
her, and he didn't tell me whatto do after saying it, so I just
stopped, and for a while therewas just silence, because you
didn't tell me to do anything.
I'm just waving. And then shesaid, I never heard anything
(25:17):
like that before. Let's talk. Ireally where I was, I forget
what state she was in. Was wayin the country. Said I never
even saw a Jewish person till Icame to New Jersey. And I went
to her house. She said, Comeover, like, two o'clock or
something. I went there. Andbetween the time we talked, when
I got there, she came to me andsaid, there's a cherry tree in
(25:40):
the backyard, and I was pickingthe cherries, and I made a
cherry pie for you. Oh, had acherry pie, too much chocolate.
And she just said, I neverunderstood this until you went
to like, went through thisexplanation of why you said,
what you said, and and I thoughtthere's a couple things there
(26:01):
about how he taught us. Therewas a little bit of a challenge.
He says, then just go and do it.
He didn't. And I could haveasked, What should I say, or
more information, but he wasvery definitive. And I think he
felt that maybe I had theability to just, you know,
convey the teachings to him asit was delivered to me, so there
can be a challenge as well. Andthen at the same time you see
(26:25):
these teachings in the properlight, you have someone who
really was as far away as youcan get from these teachings.
And she found something thatopened her heart, and she
started talking to me like, Idon't have many friends here. I
don't know what to do. Verydifferent culture. And so she
and I became very close thosefriends. So that, to me, was
(26:47):
illustrative, yeah, thedifferent ways that a master can
teach. Sometimes it's achallenge, sometimes it's laid
right in your lap. And this onewasn't this one required with
me, I felt to just follow histeachings and see where it leads
me.
Great story. Great story. Yeah,that would be that would make me
(27:12):
feel a little nervous. Also bequiet. Stop talking. You're
You're really making meuncomfortable. Yeah? Margo
Banda, did you ever have amoment where he asked something
of you and you had a hard time,or or an easy time doing, like,
what Reverend Jagannath said, oflike, I'm just gonna do this.
(27:34):
Like, this is uncomfortable, Idon't know, but I'm just, I'm
just gonna do this.
I gotta, I gotta tell you astory. This is like a real test
years ago, you know, like whenit first Gerda was in New York,
and there was a couple that usedto take them around different
places. And so one morning, theycalled me up, and they says,
(27:56):
maka, Bandu, we would good. EV,and he wants to invite you to
lunch. And he says, we pick youup and we take it to
Connecticut. I was living in NewJersey here, you know. So I
said, Yeah, it's fine. So Ihappy the staying at this friend
of mine's house, and I invitedher to come too, you know. And I
(28:18):
we drive up to Connecticut, thefour of us, you know. So we get
there, and there was two womenthat served Swami session at
that time, Amma and Shanti. SoI'm sitting there. We're waiting
for great Evan, and Shanti comesout. She's got this weird look
on her face, and she says, MargaBondo, the girl wasn't invited.
She has to leave. I said, Whoa,no, I have to make a decision.
(28:44):
They hear with her, or leavewith her, or listen to the guru.
I mean, I was like, and it justhappened, I know that feels
Cavalier with the rascals. Hadbought a house near Guru Dev, so
I called him up. I says, Yougotta do me a favor, like I ran
into this little problem. Couldyou I have a friend? Could I
bring her over? Could stay withyou for a while? Figures only
(29:05):
for lunch. 11 O'clock, 12o'clock, there's no problem.
Make a long story short, seveno'clock, and I am still there.
Oh yeah, yeah. And he's saying,and now he's testing me. Smart.
Gabon, do you want to see the Ireally good video. You want to
watch that? And I'm like, and hesaid, Then he then he stops. He
(29:28):
said, Listen. He says, I'm justshowing you how it is, you know,
if you want to, when you get tothe fire, when you get close to
the fire, it gets hot. He says,and to be with a guru. He says,
it's challenging for me is it isfor you to do this, you know?
And he says, go pick up theyoung lady. He says, You explain
(29:49):
to her, and if she doesn't getupset, then she's, you know,
that person, you can, you knowshe's okay. If not, then she
doesn't understand. I. Yeah, soI went back, we picked her up,
and being there, she was, feelsCavalier, delicious all day, I
guess she didn't really mind.
She's like, No, leave me herelonger. Yeah.
(30:12):
But she was, oh, you know, shewas okay, and it worked out
okay, you know, yeah, but thatwas, I was really freaked out. I
mean, really was, you know,that's so interesting. But she
wasn't invited.
He they called this couple tocall me and I just come. I want
you to just come, like, youknow, like, really informal,
yeah, but something like that,you know. And that was a real
(30:33):
lesson. Soit sounds like, though, like, in
some way, he cheekily, cheekilyknew, yeah, like he was teaching
something,yeah, you might as, you know, it
was, yeah, it was, that was areal test. That's
a good one. That's a good yeah.
He said other things with me,but that was, that was one in
(30:55):
the beginning, yeah, you know,then the other time, when he did
certain things, I then I got tounderstand what he was doing to
me, you know, like he wouldleave me. He left me on a Santa
Monica freeway. One time he leftme at a lecture. This is we. He
was speaking at saddle BrookHigh School. And to come I used
(31:18):
to work on him. He said I usedto massage you know. So there
was this motel, the MarriottHotel. It was about a mile or
two from the high school, so Ifigured, well, I work on him,
and then we'll just drive to thehigh school. So there was two
rooms. So the room that I workedon, it was one separate motel
room, and he was with guests inthe other motel room. He said,
(31:39):
So I work on he says, Stay hereuntil I call you, and then we'll
go together, you know. So it wasabout six o'clock. I finished
him, and the lecture was atseven o'clock, something like
that. So I'm waiting in theroom, you know, 630 I says,
Well, we should start gettingover. I'm talking to myself,
seven o'clock. He's still notgetting me, and I don't want to
(32:01):
go knock on the door, because hesays, wait here until wait here
until I call you. So I was goingto listen. Now it's 730 and I'm,
like, a little concerned, butI'm still not going to knock on
the door. Eight o'clock. Shock.
You do it again. No. Phone,actually, sure. Yeah, he was
(32:21):
walking. He came to the schoolshock. He's waiting him. And
they wonder where I am, and I'mstill in the motel, you know,
waiting for him. I'm watchingsome television show, you know,
now it's eight o'clock, 830 andand then Shakti calls me. Where
are you? I said, I'm waiting forgood. He finished the talk
already, so now I rushed to thehigh school, and he comes
(32:43):
walking eyes. Got this big grinon his face, like I did it again
to you, plus, I don't know how Iknew how to get to high school,
right? Yeah, good point. I hearyou that that test of that
patience to to know wind sensorso but, and he's done a number
(33:05):
of things over the and it wasjust like, no words. I was a
type you couldn't holler at mebecause I'd disappear. I didn't
respond to that type oftreatment. Yeah, you know, yeah.
And some people, you'd yell out,scream and discipline with me.
He just left me places number oftimes, and then I would figure
out what, what I was doing orsomething, you know, but that's
how I was. He responded to me.
(33:27):
Just leave me there. You know,do
you that's so classic I have. Doyou guys ever feel like with
students, you're having toconsciously think about how to
teach in the best way to thatperson's capacity. Because it
seems like, you know, it soundslike, from the stories you're
(33:49):
telling me, he had this a goodcapacity, an amazing capacity
for knowing, a really good a wayto teach a lesson without just
coming out and saying, This iswhat I want you to know, you
know, and have you been, haveyou both been able to kind of
adopt that in your in yourteaching, you've had a lot of
(34:10):
time to practice, so I'mguessing your answer is going to
be yes. But can you shed anyinsights in in some of the how
to do that? Maybe for a buddingteacher, for a teacher coming up
the ranks, or someone interestedin teaching that's listening.
What kind of advice could youlend and how to be ready for
each person?
(34:32):
Jagannath would be good at that.
Human beings are complexteachings of yoga are complex,
right? So the palette you haveis, like huge I think if as a
yogi, it's a secret, you gothrough years of sadhana,
(34:54):
different kinds of practice,different kinds of things. You
study and you learn kind of theways of the mind, how the mind.
Mind can aid or get in the wayof your of your growth. So I
think the first part of it isyour own experiences and your
own sadhana, and then you startseeing that kind of universal
(35:17):
thinking and activity in people,and what will help that person
come to the next level, where tosee it another way is like, Are
they ready to face somedifficulty? Not. I'm not talking
about anything really heavy withkind of like, the kind of
stories we have which have this,maybe a sense of humor, but that
(35:39):
there the students, faith iswhat drives them. So you're
always looking for, like, whatwould increase faith in that
person? So you watch, I mean,that's what I do, watching how
they sit, what they do, youknow, how they interact with
each other, where they'rerelaxed. And then there's also
those students coming andsaying, I you know, can you help
(36:00):
me with this situation I have inmy life? And you start adding
that all together, along withyour own insight, and it's a
little bit of prodding here, orlike unit of they said, often,
sometimes people have to screwtoo loose, and sometimes, so you
get to do, which is a screw twotype person, a screw two loose
(36:23):
person. And what's also reallyimportant, though, is Sangha,
yeah, that they peoplesupporting each other because
they can't always come to themain teacher, or they may not
want it because they'reembarrassed, or whatever it is.
So to have, I think youmentioned it earlier on, Todd in
(36:43):
the beginning, about having afriend or someone having a
viable, active Sangha is really,in some ways, that alone can
take you to enlightenment overtime. I love that. That's really
important. There's a quote fromAdi Shankara Acharya, great
(37:06):
philosopher from, I think,eight, the eight hundreds, or
somewhere there. And basicallyit's when you're in good
company, you're not in badcompany. When you're not in bad
company, you lead a morevirtuous life, you could read a
more virtuous life the mind, themind becomes steady. The mind
becomes steady liberation. So intotal enlightenment is this
(37:30):
chain comes out after a chain ofevents that begins with just
being with community, communityof fellow seekers, so that
that's really important. And Iknow in Marga bondu, and what I
do like thinking of programsthat will help boost that things
that they have interest in, andthings that could be interesting
(37:51):
to them, that they've neverthought of before and feel
supported no matter wherethey're where they're at on the
scale of yogic accomplishment.
Everybody wants to, like, move alittle bit further, and
everybody wants to feel thatthey have value, which is
something that I think of a lot,that if you don't feel your life
has value, nothing works, thatthat has to be, you know, part
(38:16):
of the process at the verybeginning, that you are valued,
valuable, not because you'recomparing it to anyone else, but
you have a reason to be born.
You have a reason to be here,and you have something to do
that no one else can do. And Ithink that is is part of that
picture of sangha, that eachperson is invaluable. So I think
(38:41):
that's what I would say. And I'msay, Mark about it, how you
wouldwell said, Very well said, with
Swami Satchidananda instilled inus and Reverend jagada does the
same thing that we actuallysupport each other in our in our
journey in Karma Yoga, weunderstand different fallacies
and what we're doing wrong andwhat we could do better, and we
(39:05):
understand each other, and thenwe support each other, even if
we're doing something wrong. Wetry to encourage instead of
getting mad at them, we try tosupport them and say that. You
know, this is what we feel.
Reverend Jack and I, we know 50never had, like, a bigger than
one second, not even one bicker.
Yeah, that's amazing. Like, it'samazing, really.
(39:30):
That is amazing, though. Thatactually is really amazing,
because anytime I have long termrelationships that have had lots
of bickering, so to be able tohave one where there's a common
thread, there's a certainrespect, mutual respect, that
maybe, why do you think that is,though, and even if we were to
(39:51):
remove ourselves from ourselvesin the sense just analyzing it
from afar, how? How does thatwork? Is it that you, you guys,
feel? Like, you know, there's acertain level of joy that each
of you are able to maintain. Sotherefore, each time you come
together, you just want tocelebrate in that joy and and, I
mean, because that is an amazingthing I do, I always hold the
hope and the belief and faiththat we could all do that a
(40:15):
little bit more on planet Earthand in our communities, we
have the same key Guru Dev, andhe instilled that us, but our
personalities are that are likethat too. Yeah, yeah. I mean,
yeah, that's personality, my butbasically, almost like the same.
It's like he's a brother. Inever have four sisters and I
had a brother. I always wanted abride. Say I need a brother.
(40:40):
Four girls, you know, Jack Nickcame along, and I was okay.
I think a lot of it is, is, isthe faith you have, but it's an
extreme faith, in a way, yes,make it sound bad, but it's an
extreme faith. And I think also,as I was listening to Margaret
speak, it's having a good senseof humor. Yes, there's a lot of
(41:03):
laughing when we aren't Mondaynight together. There's a lot of
laughing, and there's a lot ofwarmth and and a lot of, I mean,
it's almost like it'sunnecessary, but there is this
sense of like we are who we areas individuals. And he's not
trying to change me. I'm nottrying to change him. We're
respecting who we are, how weare, yeah, yeah. And all the
(41:28):
differences we may have and whatwe eat or do or like, those are,
like, all minor. That's my myspiritual brother, and this is a
great respect and love for him.
I think it's just that it's ahigher degree, and that's why
you don't see it that often. Itjust so happened that, you know,
our karma put us together 50years ago.
(41:57):
Todd, yeah,so I was certainly somebody the
other day. It was fine mine, andthey have a lot of respect for
jogging, I, you know, and theyknow his value. So I said, Yeah,
we talking about the Yankee hetalks about the Yankees. That
was like, it was a good baseballbut it was good baseball
(42:17):
players. Oh, eating, coming fromheaven. He was well, he had
about the father too. Theycouldn't believe it. They
didn't know this story. Yeah,yeah, okay, doesn't
(42:41):
it seem like the more we bringit down to earth and people see
how normal and human we are,that that really fosters a
healthy spiritual community.
Yes, yes,definitely, definitely, yeah.
But I am really appreciating,though, the value that you both
are bringing in my mind tohaving how important the
(43:05):
community is, and that justseems like, I guess that's
something that I feel verygrateful to be a part of the
yoga community. I feel like I'mvery grateful to have to be in
this community, and I feel likealmost any yoga practitioner in
(43:26):
the world, we all are a part oflike one same community. And yet
it is really fascinating how wehave all these smaller
communities building up intothis one large community, and
then probably even taking it astep further as a human, the
human community that's evenbeyond like, obviously, there's
(43:46):
a lot of humans on Earth thatdon't have never heard of yoga,
or they think it's yogurt. Butum, I, um, I guess I, that's
what I'm really appreciatingabout meeting both of you is, is
this, this feeling of largercommunity that, that I guess I'm
(44:08):
dreaming of, and wanting to holdon to it and build more of I
think it just feels so importantright now.
Yeah, go everyone. I just thinksometimes a lot of groups or
yoga and organizations andjuggernaut speaks have more
centers than I do. Some of themlost their whole concept of Yoga
(44:29):
itself, what it really means,and that's when they run into
difficulties. You know, thewhole concept like, how do how
good have taught us. He brokeeverything down to the lowest
common denominator, I mean, andhe explained it very clearly to
us. And I don't think a lot ofgroups had that experience that
we had with Swami sachidananda.
I mean, he just explainedeverything very clearly, the
(44:52):
purpose of service, the purpose.
He explained everything, andeven in the beginning, the base,
it. Gave us the mechanics ofeating, not being lustful to
food. And, you know, withouttelling us to do anything, he
just explained the benefits.
That's it, you know, and most ofus at that time in the 60s, was
like there was a lot of drugsand poor diet and bad behavior.
(45:14):
And he came in, and even in NewYork, people were chastising
him. What do you Well, theselike animals for their long
hair, they're freaks. They'redirty, you know? And he said
this to my children, and hebrought us up, and look what he
did. He created this city for usin Virginia, a lotus a temple
which represents all thereligions. Nobody even thought
(45:37):
of that,you know, yeah, his thinking is
amazing, aboveand beyond any master, any
teacher I've seen. And I was,you know, I was into Catholicism
when I was, he was a multi boy,you know, and I believed in God.
But there's nothing that couldbe compared to his teaching. And
he even had other yoga masters,because he was so giving of
(46:00):
himself and giving of his ownpersonal leadership to express
himself to other organizationsand give himself to other
people. You know, yes,it shows, it shows the value of
having a very strong, clearminded teacher.
Yes, so and i He's when I'veseen him with prisoners, I've
(46:24):
seen him with intellects. I'veseen him with no he was
basically the same, just, herelated to everybody. Was just,
he was comfortable in anysituation,
even with children. Oh my god,the best, right? Watching him
with with children is amazing,like preschoolers and all. It's
just just, there's a beauty andelegance in everything he did,
(46:50):
even with these young kids andhow they would, you know, crowd
around him. And yet, they knewthat if there was something that
was off kilter, he would correctit and they would follow it.
Wow, they knew that there wasthat there too. What
do you guys both know about hischildhood? Did he ever convey
(47:10):
what his growing up? What hislife was like growing up?
Yeah, there's a biography, apossible piece.
I apologize I haven't read ityet, but I will now that you
brought it up. Thank you.
Yeah. I mean, his family wasvery religious. They had all
kinds of great yogis come andvisit their place, and they
(47:33):
would host them. So hisexperience with the teachings
goes from birth, he was marriedfor a while, and then his wife
passed away, and at that point,he said, It's time for me. He
was drawn to the life of asanyasi renunciate, and I
(47:55):
studied with several famousteachers, Aurobindo Ramakrishna
was actually chit bhavananda,one of the disciples of
Paramahansa, Ramakrishna andothers as well. And then he
found his guru, Swami Sivananda.
And I don't know how many yearshe was there, for years as a
(48:16):
student, and was ordained orinitiated into renunciate
sanyas. And you know, we knowhow he revered his master, and
how he related to him, and allthese things. Are talking about
the tests and the prodding andthen the supporting and always
(48:38):
coming, it seems, at the righttime. So I think a lot of he got
from his master as well. Andthen was it 1966 right? Margo
bonded. He came to New York,supposed to be with two days or
three day trip, yeah,then he had a 30 day visa. They
were supposed to leave.
(49:01):
Didn't happen. Didn't happen. Hedidn't have people just wanted
him to stay. Yeah,he befriended two teachers,
brother David and Rabbigovernment. Brother David was a
Benedictine monk who became veryclose to great heaven, Rabbi
government and and they helped,like, prolong his visa. Do you
know the whole story, talkingabout
(49:25):
all of it, but I know it wasreally important, because at
that time, the idea of any kindof interfaith and someone a
Hindu monk, is how they wouldthink of it. What's he going to
tell people here? How was he?
What is his what is the contentof his teaching? Is it going to
lead to more drug abuse, or whatis it? And Rabbi gelberman and
brother David, both veryrespected, both really worked
(49:46):
hard that he would get this as apermanent visa. I forget what it
was called, the Minister ofdivine words or something, yes,
yeah, something like that. Yeah,yeah, wow. And that's how he got
a visa to stay. But. Basicallypeople our age, you know, the
hippie type of folks, who's alot of the that was the
organization. And there wassomething exciting about that,
(50:07):
the idea that you could changereally, you know, we wanted
peace on earth, and all thesethings. Did a lot of things that
didn't work. But here was a manwho gave us something that does
work. Maybe it's a littledifferently. It's like one
person at a time. But lookwhat's happened over the years.
He's had like, 1000s ofstudents. I don't know if he
never kept track, and we don't,we don't know how many. We know
(50:30):
that he spoke several timesaround the world,
yes, yeah. And spoke 1000 sohe fit where we were in the 60s,
and that's when I think 60s andearly 70s, I guess in yoga
really grew at that time reallyrapidly. And it's still here. It
(50:51):
still has a good message fortoday's world.
I I'm so excited to hear thesestories, because, from my very
first glimpse of his picture onthe Yoga Sutras of Patanjali
commentary, I, you know, likeyou'll I see a picture, and I
(51:13):
just feel attracted, you know,and but now to have the
opportunity To speak with bothof you and hear these stories
from direct you know you havethis direct contact just feels
really good. It feels, it feels,uh, brings it to life. Brings
(51:36):
more life to it, more life thanI knew about. To feel the
history and to get a chance tospeak with both of you, I feels
like a little bit of a fullcircle moment for me. So I, I'm,
I'm really thankful you bothhave been so generous, and since
my first meeting, it's been areal pleasure. And I don't, I
(51:56):
know this is not the last timeI'm going to get a chance to see
and speak with you, and I can'twait for it to actually be in
person. I love zoom and all, butI really want to see both of
your centers, so I will make ita point to travel up and please,
if you, either of you are everin Florida, we would be so
honored to have you in ourhumble little studio here. It's
not huge. I don't know if itwould be big enough for you
(52:18):
guys, but it would be a realit'd be a real honor. It really
was. Whattown are you in? A town called
JunoBeach. We're in Juneau Beach,
which is about like 20 minutesnorth of West Palm 20 minutes
north of West Palm Beach, aboutan hour and 15 north of
Miami. That might be in Floridain April. Oh, man. Margo bond,
you please. I have a well, Imean, I would love to host you.
(52:42):
If you So, please keep stay.
I'll stay in touch with you andcheck out. But if you do come,
don't hesitate to just let meknow. I won't feel like that's
being overbearing in any way,like just reach out and say,
hey, guess what? Todd, youmentioned it. I'm coming, and I
would be honored to have Haveyou, have you here. That would
be amazing. So if you ever docome, and I will come visit, and
I really do appreciate yourgenerosity, and I can feel your
(53:06):
generosity, from your sadhana,from your practice, from your
devotion and and I'm justgrateful for it. Thank you.
Thank you very, very generous,and we really appreciate you.
Really, yeah, yeah.
I think how I always think atthe end of a talk like this,
(53:29):
said the same thing every time Ithink, spend a little time every
day for your health and peace,then share it with everyone. We
just had that. Keep that inmind. We can accomplish a lot, a
lot of good in this world.
I think those are perfectclosing words. Reverend
Jagannath, thank you so much.
Thank you. Thank you. Marcobondu, this has been a real
(53:50):
treat. All right, until nexttime. Until next time. Thank
you. Thank you. Thank you. Godbless you. You're doing good
work. Thankyou. You too. Well, we'll keep
supporting each other here.
Yeah.
(54:16):
Native yoga. Todd cast isproduced by myself. The theme
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(54:37):
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(55:06):
Oh, for you know you.
Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast,so happy you are here. My goal
with this channel is to bringinspirational speakers to the
mic in the field of yoga,massage, body work and beyond.
Follow us at @nativeyoga andcheck us out at
nativeyogacenter.com. All right,let's begin.
(01:04):
Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast,and welcome to the show. And I'm
really excited for what you areabout to hear in this episode. I
got an opportunity to dosomething I haven't done yet,
and which is interview bothReverend Jaganath and
(01:25):
Margabandhu together. And Ohman, I'm so excited for you to
hear this, because, you know,both of these gentlemen have
cultivated a friendship, and,you know, studied and practiced
yoga together with the sameteacher, Swami Satchidananda,
(01:46):
you know, well over 50 yearsago. And I think there's just
something really special aboutbeing in the company of a long
term friendship like this. Andthe first time I had the chance
to speak with both of them. Itwas to discuss doing this
podcast interview with with one,one on one, with each of them.
(02:07):
And through that, I had thefeeling that, well, this is
what's really interesting here.
So please, if you're just comingin on this episode, definitely
go back to episode 207 where Ihad a chance to interview one on
one, Margabandhu. Episode 208the one just previous, where I
had a chance to interviewReverend Jaganath, one on one.
And now here, episode 209 wherewe bring both of them together.
(02:29):
And I know I'll be listening tothis one. Re listening to this
one a few times, because I feellike there's a lot of really
amazing tidbits and nuggets ofwisdom here. I hope you enjoy.
Please click on the links in thedescription so that you can see
where both Reverend Jaganath andMargabandu are located. Make a
(02:51):
visit to their centers. And Ithink the overarching theme here
is, let's continue to uphold thedeeper meaning and teachings of
yoga and build a really strongcommunity within our own studios
circles, but even on the bigpicture around the globe. So
(03:14):
with that being said, let's getstarted. Hello, Reverend
Jaganath and Margabandhu. Thankyou so much for joining me here
today for our episode where, onepisode number 207 I got a
chance to interview one on one.
Margabandhu, on the last episodenumber 208 I got a chance to
(03:38):
interview, interview you,Reverend Jaganath and through
the process of arranging forthese interviews, the first one
was a pre interview where I gota chance to speak to both of you
just like this. And I found itso refreshing and invigorating
having the two of you heretogether, because I got a sense
(03:59):
of the history the both of youhave, and I have a friend that
I've been he teaches yoga, Iteach yoga, and we've been
communicating over the last 20years and helping each other out
along the way and and I guess Iwant to bring a little attention
to how valuable and important itis To have a friend along to
(04:22):
travel with along this journey,and the feeling that you both
had, and when I was listening toyou, felt special, and that's
why I'm grateful to have thischance to have the two of you
together here and hear somestories about yoga. Thank you so
much. Thank you on that note,how did you guys meet?
(04:47):
I remember the first timeMargabandhu wanted you must have
been in a program, yeah, yeah.
And then you had called and wewent, and then I went to New
Brunswick, right? Is thatright? That's right. I forgot
about. At that Yeah, yeah.
Margabandhu would come everySaturday. We had a center in New
Brunswick, and at that time youwere in Garfield, yes, yes. In
(05:12):
Garfield spent an hour apart.
And I don't remember how itstarted, but Margabandhu would
come every Saturday, and that'swhen I got the letter from
Gurudev to say that how great ofa teacher he was, and just to
learn from him. And that's whatdid. I observed and how he
treated people. And I saw thepower that comes from serving
(05:35):
others, you know, a selflessservice, that there's a power
there. And he, you know, he'sincredibly knowledgeable and on
all these healing aspects ofyoga in life. But I think just
having him around is there'ssomething about him that speaks
of the essence of yoga. So I'malways feeling like indebted to
(05:59):
him. I just heard I've neversaid, don't change the protocol.
So I'm sticking with it. I justwatch him and learn from him.
Yeah, there's a mutual feelingright here. You know, between
the two of us, we're likebrothers, and we respect one
(06:21):
another's opinion and the way heruns things is really admirable.
Really, you have to see peoplerespond to him, you know, I
believe that there's a mutualfeeling, and that helps both
centers, you know,yeah, that's cool. That's That's
neat to think about how you knoweach of you running your own
program, are able to supporteach other, but the energy would
(06:42):
be feeding off of each otherlike that, to have a whole hours
distance between. Did you guyshave students that would travel?
You know, one weekend we'd begoing over to your studio,
Reverend Juggernaut, and thenone weekend you guys would trade
off and set up like little fieldtrip situations? Or was it more,
more that you, each of you,would just travel and support
(07:03):
each other's communities,each other's communities. He
would give talks here. See,everybody gravitated towards
Reverend Jagannath. You know,he's a little humble about
things, but you know, we he'sspeaking, we all gravitate
towards him, you know, he's theman. No, we have a sentence, and
we both run our sentence verywell, but when it comes to
(07:28):
speaking his philosophy is justevery word of his is like, like,
spiritually involved, you know?
So there's a lot of respect forhim right now.
We have some of our students seehim regularly and go to classes
(07:50):
there. It's really part of onelineage. I think that's part of
the if there's a secret, that'spart of it, that we really are
following the teachings of SwamiSatchidananda, ultimately. So
both of us are students of SwamiSatchidananda have a lot of
things in common over the years.
So these students come in andthey see that there really isn't
(08:12):
a big divide between the twodifferent centers, and they
students in my center, they loveMarga Bandu, and I love
referring people to him often.
So that's something that I thinkmore yoga centers should have.
(08:33):
That attitude, my experience hasbeen sometimes it's not that
way, actually at a really higherlevel teacher in another
organization, and she wasmeeting with other teachers with
my book on the Yoga Sutras, andwhen the person who's the head
of it heard threatened to kickher out. Where you've seen that
(08:58):
book, this is yoga sutras. Youknow, I'm not getting married to
them in this person. I wasn'tteaching there, but she had come
to some talks that I've done,and she thought it was really
great to have these, thesemeetings. And they said, No, you
couldn't do that. It's differentfrom us. She got paid so she
(09:20):
would lose her income. It's kindof a sad thing to see that kind
of thing happen.
Well, that's a really goodpoint. I think the aspect of
competitiveness, within therealm of the challenge to
survive and make a living,probably is one of the big
(09:41):
dividing factors in trying tohelp support a neighboring
studio. But I think obviously,in the spirit of yoga, we aim
and hope that that won't be thecase, but then we see that
sometimes, can you both help meunderstand. And how, how do you
(10:03):
both receive compensation forthe time and energy that you put
in, beyond the good feedbackthat you have from the feedback
that you receive? Because I'mcurious what kind of model
you've been able to adopt thathas worked harmoniously like
this.
Well, at the I have my ownpractice, and it happens to be
(10:24):
at the institute, see, so I seepeople during the, you know,
during the day, and, you know,they come to me for new
nutritional counseling, and Iwork on them, you know, yeah,
and, and, but in between, I'llbe I teach at Philly Dickinson
University, and we've beenteaching here, I think, 54
(10:45):
years. It's accredited course,so that money, because I teach
yoga, goes to the institute, sothat so in between, I do both
kind of my own at the Institute,and then I teach a class. I
teach a class on Sundaymornings. It's called art of
self healing, Antarctica andnecklace. So any whatever I
teach yoga, Glee goes to theinstitute my own personal
(11:07):
practice. You know, I That's mymy business. Like, understood,
I'm an herbalist. So,yeah, understood, thank you. Is
that a similar pretty good isthat a similar setup? Reverend
jaganoff,no, money is different. I'm
trying to think where to startwith it. Partially, my wife is a
nurse, hospice nurse, so thatwas income coming in. And she
(11:32):
said over the years, likeanything I do that makes money
for me doesn't work. I have to.
Always seems like I have to notdo it for money. But this group
of students that gathered aroundme, they wanted to know what was
like tradition. They really wereinterested in tradition. They
said, Well, you have have yourteacher. It's not that you paid
(11:57):
the teacher, but you helpedsupport them with, the food,
clothing, the basic needs,that's what you do. It as an
offering. So one person, who's abookkeeper, asked me to
calculate, what are my expenses,monthly expenses, and that's
what I get. I get whatever the Idon't even know what the number
(12:18):
is, but that was the idea. It'snot thought of. It's like a
payment for service. But that'shelping to support me so that I
can't dedicate myself toservice. So that's, it's a
little different situation thanMargo bond do, yeah,
that's, that's interesting sofar. I mean, yeah, I hear you,
(12:40):
and I think like when you seethe outcome of the camaraderie
that can occur from that, that'sa clear indicator that something
worked well. Did Swami SachinAnanda ever receive payment from
you guys in the time that youwere studying with him, or did
he keep that on a very similarthread where you, like, I loved
(13:03):
your story. Margo Bandu, aboutdriving him on out in California
and getting dropped off, butlike, you know you were helping
him to be with him while he'sdriving, you know, that type of
thing. You know, you'resupporting him, you're helping
along the way. Is that how hekept it the whole time?
Almost like the same, right?
Jagannath, I mean, basically thesame. We supported him. And, you
know, most of the time he wasspeaking, he was visiting
(13:26):
different centers, so all thattraveling and housing had to be
gotten from somewhere. So he wassupported by the whole
organization, right? His I guessthat was, is that? Right?
Juggernaut, yeah,yeah, yeah, there would be a,
wasn't a fee. He never, as faras I know, he never asked for a
(13:48):
certain amount of money. Yeah,you know, it was never, never
even a part of the conversation.
We just did it as an offeringthat that made sense to us, and
that covered, you know, all thetravel, if you had to fly, or
the hotels or whatever, we wouldtake care of that. And then I'm
sure it's similar Margot Bonner,anything actually would go to
(14:09):
him as well, because you knowwhat the feeling is, what we
receive from that kind ofexpertise and care. We really
want to support that, but Idon't remember him ever asking,
yeah, that's pretty amazing.
That's an amazing trait. That'sa very admirable trait. We don't
see that very often these days,no, yeah.
(14:37):
Way that he earned money otherthan when he would teach
Marco bando, I heard you saythat you, prior to seeing record
that you offered your teachertraining for free over these
years, that that's um, can youexplain a little bit about how
you structure your training andwhat what kind of energy comes
(14:58):
out of of offering somethinglike. This to people. I mean,
it'snot me just offering you that we
have a teacher's trainingprogram, and people come, people
that have been taking classes ordoing yoga for a while, and they
want to, you know, take teacherstraining, and we have a certain
fee, and our teachers that teachthe teachers training don't get
paid. All that money goes tosupport the institute. We have a
(15:18):
rent here. We have a mortgagehere. We have expenses, you
know, so and then we have peoplethat we have a secretary and
who, who does calm yoga as well,and she takes care of all the
bills. So anything that's madefinancially, we give to her, and
she allocates it, got it, paysmortgage, she pays the bills.
And then it's similar to whatjuggernaut center does, too. And
(15:40):
basically, you know, yeah. And,you know, even good of I used to
have him when he said PhillyDickinson, and he would get a
fee, you know, and then he wouldjust give it to the center. He'd
pay the bills. He would neverkeep it, yeah, you know, yeah.
And if he wanted something. Youknow, he got it. He just, can I
(16:01):
tell you funny story, jacket, doyou know the story? Gert ever
got the car? No. Car? No, thatwas that green. Yeah? Imperial,
right? I think, yeah. Atthe time, how I met the Gerda
was through the rascals, theyoung rascals. I don't know if
you rememberwho they were. Todd, I do, I do.
I do the rest. Yes, Rosie, Eddiebrigadian, and I was always with
(16:26):
him. And then Miss Swamy, such aand that's how you got to meet
Swami. Said none. So they wouldsee him a lot, especially Felix
Cavalieri. He was really intothe philosophy of yoga. And he
was, you know, so we, we were onSwami session on a lot. So a lot
of times we would take him someplaces. And at that time, the
(16:46):
rascals had their own car. Theyhad an organization. Car was a
brand new LeBaron, beautiful leBaron. And we used to, they used
to pick up Swami session on.
Then the car was a verycomfortable car. It was a
luxurious car. And he said, hesaid, really like it? So Eddie
Bugatti would say, you like thiscar? Oh, he's very comfortable
(17:08):
for me. Because, you know, Swamihas to go places, so he has to
be very comfortable. So theysaid, you want it, you got it.
So they gave me the cook, youknow, that basic term you
wanted, you got it. It wasfamiliar. It was It wasn't that
familiar to Swami Satchidananda,and he picked up on it. He
picked up very quickly on ourlanguage discussion. So after he
(17:31):
gave him the car, he's given atalk at the same John the Divine
church. And somebody asked him,good of I would like to see God.
He says, you want it? You gotit. You asked him to go. He
would see, is it possible forme? They would say, you want to
You got it. You know, use thatterm in the lecture. How they
(17:55):
gave him the green labarron,beautiful car.
How was his English when hefirst came over to the states?
Was he like peopledidn't send the vowels and
consonants were a little off,but most, most of us could
understand, we understand thegist of it. Yeah, you know?
Yeah. It was close quarter. Sohe would noise to be with him.
In the beginning, we had privateconsultations. So those private
(18:19):
consultations, you got tounderstand, my first
consultation with him was, itwas like a psychiatric, you
know, visit, you know, yes,you know, he was in the chin. We
talked about things, but, youknow, he explained to me drugs,
you know, talking about thedrugs I did. And, you know, and
he would always ask questions,and it seemed like, even though
(18:42):
he asked questions, he seemed toknow everything about it. So one
time he asked me, What is thisokay to talk about you?
Absolutely. Oh my gosh, yes,please, please. He asked
me about LSD. And so I wastelling him, he goes, Well, he
explained. He says, what thatreally does he and he told me.
(19:03):
He says, when you take a certainchemical, it activates the
serotonin, and what happens yourthird eye, it raises the channel
up, and then when the drug goesup, it closes down. So that's
why you have something called abad trip. You know? You explain
that to me. He says, withmeditation, it throws up the
serotonin, opens up the eye, butdoesn't close back down. And
(19:24):
that was really clear to meabout meditation and how so
that's how he explained thingsto us, yeah, about how accepted
that. He brought everything downto the lowest common
denominator. He explained thephysiology of it, mechanics of
it, and then that's how heaccepted it nice, that's was and
he did. He even in thebeginning, he didn't tell us to
become a vegetarian. He told usthe mechanics of eating and
(19:47):
about the food and you know, andthat's how he did everything
with us. He never demandedanything of us. He explained it
to us very clearly, and webought into that philosophy. Is
that jaganna Isthat sounds perfect. Yeah,
that's exactly what it what itwas like with him. Never
demanded. He once said to me,said, anything that's good, I
(20:07):
can't keep you from doinganything that's bad. I can never
make you will do, like, thinkingof the whole Sangha that way,
that, I mean, that's like aguiding force, in a way, to not
think of like changing people,but like Margo bonded says, you
just simply present. That's whathe would do. He was, there was
(20:29):
never a sense of being forced todo anything. Yeah,
I love that, because I rememberMargo bond to the story you told
me on the last session about howwhen you went to give the speech
to on celibacy that he had saidto you, just remind them that
it's not a sacrifice. And I wasthinking about that the last few
(20:49):
days, since I heard you say thatthat's such a interesting way to
approach teaching, in the senseof what you both are reiterating
now on letting almost likeencouraging us to make our own
minds up. So it's not likesomebody telling me what to do,
but I Oh, and like thatinspiration I can come from.
(21:11):
I was, you know, when heexplained to me, because there
was nuns and priests and I'msaying, Where am I, you know?
And that's first he told me,it's not a sacrifice. They told
me the physiology of it. And he,just after I gave the talk,
there was a one of the priestswas a scientist. He taught
science, and he explained thatwas very interesting. They
enjoyed it, you know, because Iwas a little nervous about it,
(21:34):
in a way, yeah, I say, okay, buthe explained to me physiology of
it, and I hadn't heard it thatway before, you know, the way he
explained, he explained to meover the phone. I kept calling
him, you know, and, and that'swhat he said, very clear, very
interesting, you know, rebuildsyour system. Regenerates every
(21:56):
cell, increases the product. Imean, you had to buy into it.
And I mean, the way he explainedit. You know, Reverend,
Reverend Jack, not Was thereever a time that he asked you to
do something that you felt alittle nervous about in relation
to teaching or presenting?
It's interesting because storycame to mind that was really to
(22:18):
me, uh, Pivotal on a lot oflevels. I was at Rutgers
University. I was part of thecampus ministry, and it was one
point in time the ministersadmit. They said, we want to do
programs to help the students,like anti drug and whatever they
were talking about. And so I wasat a talk. There was me,
(22:41):
Catholic priest, and I don'tknow what very conservative
Christian young woman, and Idon't remember what the topic
was, but towards the end, we hadquestions and answers that one
young man raised his hand and headdressed the question to me,
and it was very intellectual.
And it always was. Every certainsentence was started with, if
(23:04):
God wants, if God wants, if Godwants, I'm listening to it. And
I was studying that time a lotof Yana yoga, so I was in that
state of mind. So I was saying,well, basically it's not that
God wants anything. God haseverything. And next to me is
this woman, and she startsshaking, literally shaking, and
I see her vibrating it. Andaccording to her, I said she's
(23:27):
going to explode, and she did.
She leapt over to me, she's andput her hand over my mouth and
said, I don't like your God. Oh,somehow I felt calm. I said,
Okay, I was sitting there and apriest I was got to be friendly
with. He said, Well, this iswhat he was trying to say. He
(23:50):
kind of smoothed it over. Nextday, I had to call Gurudev for
some business reason. After wedid the business part, I told
him what happened. I said, Whatcould I have done better? Like,
what could I do? And he wasgiving me some advice. And you
know about he said, you youshouldn't have started with
(24:10):
that, that kind of heavyphilosophy, just like, find the
where you that's what it was,find what your point in unison,
that you have what do you have?
In unison, and then give it ayogic twist to find something.
And then there was this pause.
This is the part that really wasinteresting to me, he says. And
(24:33):
his his whole demeanor changedin the world, he said, Now I
remember now I want you to callthat minister and tell her
everything that we said, tellher that you called me, and say
everything that I said to her.
And I said, this is one of thosekind of Guru moments I'm just
going to do. Hung up. I calledthe phone. And so she's this
(24:55):
very nice woman, veryconservative, very conservative.
Christian. So I said, Well, Icalled my guru this morning, and
this is what he said. And I wentthrough the whole thing with
her, and he didn't tell me whatto do after saying it, so I just
stopped, and for a while therewas just silence, because you
didn't tell me to do anything.
I'm just waving. And then shesaid, I never heard anything
(25:17):
like that before. Let's talk. Ireally where I was, I forget
what state she was in. Was wayin the country. Said I never
even saw a Jewish person till Icame to New Jersey. And I went
to her house. She said, Comeover, like, two o'clock or
something. I went there. Andbetween the time we talked, when
I got there, she came to me andsaid, there's a cherry tree in
(25:40):
the backyard, and I was pickingthe cherries, and I made a
cherry pie for you. Oh, had acherry pie, too much chocolate.
And she just said, I neverunderstood this until you went
to like, went through thisexplanation of why you said,
what you said, and and I thoughtthere's a couple things there
(26:01):
about how he taught us. Therewas a little bit of a challenge.
He says, then just go and do it.
He didn't. And I could haveasked, What should I say, or
more information, but he wasvery definitive. And I think he
felt that maybe I had theability to just, you know,
convey the teachings to him asit was delivered to me, so there
can be a challenge as well. Andthen at the same time you see
(26:25):
these teachings in the properlight, you have someone who
really was as far away as youcan get from these teachings.
And she found something thatopened her heart, and she
started talking to me like, Idon't have many friends here. I
don't know what to do. Verydifferent culture. And so she
and I became very close thosefriends. So that, to me, was
(26:47):
illustrative, yeah, thedifferent ways that a master can
teach. Sometimes it's achallenge, sometimes it's laid
right in your lap. And this onewasn't this one required with
me, I felt to just follow histeachings and see where it leads
me.
Great story. Great story. Yeah,that would be that would make me
(27:12):
feel a little nervous. Also bequiet. Stop talking. You're
You're really making meuncomfortable. Yeah? Margo
Banda, did you ever have amoment where he asked something
of you and you had a hard time,or or an easy time doing, like,
what Reverend Jagannath said, oflike, I'm just gonna do this.
(27:34):
Like, this is uncomfortable, Idon't know, but I'm just, I'm
just gonna do this.
I gotta, I gotta tell you astory. This is like a real test
years ago, you know, like whenit first Gerda was in New York,
and there was a couple that usedto take them around different
places. And so one morning, theycalled me up, and they says,
(27:56):
maka, Bandu, we would good. EV,and he wants to invite you to
lunch. And he says, we pick youup and we take it to
Connecticut. I was living in NewJersey here, you know. So I
said, Yeah, it's fine. So Ihappy the staying at this friend
of mine's house, and I invitedher to come too, you know. And I
(28:18):
we drive up to Connecticut, thefour of us, you know. So we get
there, and there was two womenthat served Swami session at
that time, Amma and Shanti. SoI'm sitting there. We're waiting
for great Evan, and Shanti comesout. She's got this weird look
on her face, and she says, MargaBondo, the girl wasn't invited.
She has to leave. I said, Whoa,no, I have to make a decision.
(28:44):
They hear with her, or leavewith her, or listen to the guru.
I mean, I was like, and it justhappened, I know that feels
Cavalier with the rascals. Hadbought a house near Guru Dev, so
I called him up. I says, Yougotta do me a favor, like I ran
into this little problem. Couldyou I have a friend? Could I
bring her over? Could stay withyou for a while? Figures only
(29:05):
for lunch. 11 O'clock, 12o'clock, there's no problem.
Make a long story short, seveno'clock, and I am still there.
Oh yeah, yeah. And he's saying,and now he's testing me. Smart.
Gabon, do you want to see the Ireally good video. You want to
watch that? And I'm like, and hesaid, Then he then he stops. He
(29:28):
said, Listen. He says, I'm justshowing you how it is, you know,
if you want to, when you get tothe fire, when you get close to
the fire, it gets hot. He says,and to be with a guru. He says,
it's challenging for me is it isfor you to do this, you know?
And he says, go pick up theyoung lady. He says, You explain
(29:49):
to her, and if she doesn't getupset, then she's, you know,
that person, you can, you knowshe's okay. If not, then she
doesn't understand. I. Yeah, soI went back, we picked her up,
and being there, she was, feelsCavalier, delicious all day, I
guess she didn't really mind.
She's like, No, leave me herelonger. Yeah.
(30:12):
But she was, oh, you know, shewas okay, and it worked out
okay, you know, yeah, but thatwas, I was really freaked out. I
mean, really was, you know,that's so interesting. But she
wasn't invited.
He they called this couple tocall me and I just come. I want
you to just come, like, youknow, like, really informal,
yeah, but something like that,you know. And that was a real
(30:33):
lesson. Soit sounds like, though, like, in
some way, he cheekily, cheekilyknew, yeah, like he was teaching
something,yeah, you might as, you know, it
was, yeah, it was, that was areal test. That's
a good one. That's a good yeah.
He said other things with me,but that was, that was one in
(30:55):
the beginning, yeah, you know,then the other time, when he did
certain things, I then I got tounderstand what he was doing to
me, you know, like he wouldleave me. He left me on a Santa
Monica freeway. One time he leftme at a lecture. This is we. He
was speaking at saddle BrookHigh School. And to come I used
(31:18):
to work on him. He said I usedto massage you know. So there
was this motel, the MarriottHotel. It was about a mile or
two from the high school, so Ifigured, well, I work on him,
and then we'll just drive to thehigh school. So there was two
rooms. So the room that I workedon, it was one separate motel
room, and he was with guests inthe other motel room. He said,
(31:39):
So I work on he says, Stay hereuntil I call you, and then we'll
go together, you know. So it wasabout six o'clock. I finished
him, and the lecture was atseven o'clock, something like
that. So I'm waiting in theroom, you know, 630 I says,
Well, we should start gettingover. I'm talking to myself,
seven o'clock. He's still notgetting me, and I don't want to
(32:01):
go knock on the door, because hesays, wait here until wait here
until I call you. So I was goingto listen. Now it's 730 and I'm,
like, a little concerned, butI'm still not going to knock on
the door. Eight o'clock. Shock.
You do it again. No. Phone,actually, sure. Yeah, he was
(32:21):
walking. He came to the schoolshock. He's waiting him. And
they wonder where I am, and I'mstill in the motel, you know,
waiting for him. I'm watchingsome television show, you know,
now it's eight o'clock, 830 andand then Shakti calls me. Where
are you? I said, I'm waiting forgood. He finished the talk
already, so now I rushed to thehigh school, and he comes
(32:43):
walking eyes. Got this big grinon his face, like I did it again
to you, plus, I don't know how Iknew how to get to high school,
right? Yeah, good point. I hearyou that that test of that
patience to to know wind sensorso but, and he's done a number
(33:05):
of things over the and it wasjust like, no words. I was a
type you couldn't holler at mebecause I'd disappear. I didn't
respond to that type oftreatment. Yeah, you know, yeah.
And some people, you'd yell out,scream and discipline with me.
He just left me places number oftimes, and then I would figure
out what, what I was doing orsomething, you know, but that's
how I was. He responded to me.
(33:27):
Just leave me there. You know,do
you that's so classic I have. Doyou guys ever feel like with
students, you're having toconsciously think about how to
teach in the best way to thatperson's capacity. Because it
seems like, you know, it soundslike, from the stories you're
(33:49):
telling me, he had this a goodcapacity, an amazing capacity
for knowing, a really good a wayto teach a lesson without just
coming out and saying, This iswhat I want you to know, you
know, and have you been, haveyou both been able to kind of
adopt that in your in yourteaching, you've had a lot of
(34:10):
time to practice, so I'mguessing your answer is going to
be yes. But can you shed anyinsights in in some of the how
to do that? Maybe for a buddingteacher, for a teacher coming up
the ranks, or someone interestedin teaching that's listening.
What kind of advice could youlend and how to be ready for
each person?
(34:32):
Jagannath would be good at that.
Human beings are complexteachings of yoga are complex,
right? So the palette you haveis, like huge I think if as a
yogi, it's a secret, you gothrough years of sadhana,
(34:54):
different kinds of practice,different kinds of things. You
study and you learn kind of theways of the mind, how the mind.
Mind can aid or get in the wayof your of your growth. So I
think the first part of it isyour own experiences and your
own sadhana, and then you startseeing that kind of universal
(35:17):
thinking and activity in people,and what will help that person
come to the next level, where tosee it another way is like, Are
they ready to face somedifficulty? Not. I'm not talking
about anything really heavy withkind of like, the kind of
stories we have which have this,maybe a sense of humor, but that
(35:39):
there the students, faith iswhat drives them. So you're
always looking for, like, whatwould increase faith in that
person? So you watch, I mean,that's what I do, watching how
they sit, what they do, youknow, how they interact with
each other, where they'rerelaxed. And then there's also
those students coming andsaying, I you know, can you help
(36:00):
me with this situation I have inmy life? And you start adding
that all together, along withyour own insight, and it's a
little bit of prodding here, orlike unit of they said, often,
sometimes people have to screwtoo loose, and sometimes, so you
get to do, which is a screw twotype person, a screw two loose
(36:23):
person. And what's also reallyimportant, though, is Sangha,
yeah, that they peoplesupporting each other because
they can't always come to themain teacher, or they may not
want it because they'reembarrassed, or whatever it is.
So to have, I think youmentioned it earlier on, Todd in
(36:43):
the beginning, about having afriend or someone having a
viable, active Sangha is really,in some ways, that alone can
take you to enlightenment overtime. I love that. That's really
important. There's a quote fromAdi Shankara Acharya, great
(37:06):
philosopher from, I think,eight, the eight hundreds, or
somewhere there. And basicallyit's when you're in good
company, you're not in badcompany. When you're not in bad
company, you lead a morevirtuous life, you could read a
more virtuous life the mind, themind becomes steady. The mind
becomes steady liberation. So intotal enlightenment is this
(37:30):
chain comes out after a chain ofevents that begins with just
being with community, communityof fellow seekers, so that
that's really important. And Iknow in Marga bondu, and what I
do like thinking of programsthat will help boost that things
that they have interest in, andthings that could be interesting
(37:51):
to them, that they've neverthought of before and feel
supported no matter wherethey're where they're at on the
scale of yogic accomplishment.
Everybody wants to, like, move alittle bit further, and
everybody wants to feel thatthey have value, which is
something that I think of a lot,that if you don't feel your life
has value, nothing works, thatthat has to be, you know, part
(38:16):
of the process at the verybeginning, that you are valued,
valuable, not because you'recomparing it to anyone else, but
you have a reason to be born.
You have a reason to be here,and you have something to do
that no one else can do. And Ithink that is is part of that
picture of sangha, that eachperson is invaluable. So I think
(38:41):
that's what I would say. And I'msay, Mark about it, how you
wouldwell said, Very well said, with
Swami Satchidananda instilled inus and Reverend jagada does the
same thing that we actuallysupport each other in our in our
journey in Karma Yoga, weunderstand different fallacies
and what we're doing wrong andwhat we could do better, and we
(39:05):
understand each other, and thenwe support each other, even if
we're doing something wrong. Wetry to encourage instead of
getting mad at them, we try tosupport them and say that. You
know, this is what we feel.
Reverend Jack and I, we know 50never had, like, a bigger than
one second, not even one bicker.
Yeah, that's amazing. Like, it'samazing, really.
(39:30):
That is amazing, though. Thatactually is really amazing,
because anytime I have long termrelationships that have had lots
of bickering, so to be able tohave one where there's a common
thread, there's a certainrespect, mutual respect, that
maybe, why do you think that is,though, and even if we were to
(39:51):
remove ourselves from ourselvesin the sense just analyzing it
from afar, how? How does thatwork? Is it that you, you guys,
feel? Like, you know, there's acertain level of joy that each
of you are able to maintain. Sotherefore, each time you come
together, you just want tocelebrate in that joy and and, I
mean, because that is an amazingthing I do, I always hold the
hope and the belief and faiththat we could all do that a
(40:15):
little bit more on planet Earthand in our communities, we
have the same key Guru Dev, andhe instilled that us, but our
personalities are that are likethat too. Yeah, yeah. I mean,
yeah, that's personality, my butbasically, almost like the same.
It's like he's a brother. Inever have four sisters and I
had a brother. I always wanted abride. Say I need a brother.
(40:40):
Four girls, you know, Jack Nickcame along, and I was okay.
I think a lot of it is, is, isthe faith you have, but it's an
extreme faith, in a way, yes,make it sound bad, but it's an
extreme faith. And I think also,as I was listening to Margaret
speak, it's having a good senseof humor. Yes, there's a lot of
(41:03):
laughing when we aren't Mondaynight together. There's a lot of
laughing, and there's a lot ofwarmth and and a lot of, I mean,
it's almost like it'sunnecessary, but there is this
sense of like we are who we areas individuals. And he's not
trying to change me. I'm nottrying to change him. We're
respecting who we are, how weare, yeah, yeah. And all the
(41:28):
differences we may have and whatwe eat or do or like, those are,
like, all minor. That's my myspiritual brother, and this is a
great respect and love for him.
I think it's just that it's ahigher degree, and that's why
you don't see it that often. Itjust so happened that, you know,
our karma put us together 50years ago.
(41:57):
Todd, yeah,so I was certainly somebody the
other day. It was fine mine, andthey have a lot of respect for
jogging, I, you know, and theyknow his value. So I said, Yeah,
we talking about the Yankee hetalks about the Yankees. That
was like, it was a good baseballbut it was good baseball
(42:17):
players. Oh, eating, coming fromheaven. He was well, he had
about the father too. Theycouldn't believe it. They
didn't know this story. Yeah,yeah, okay, doesn't
(42:41):
it seem like the more we bringit down to earth and people see
how normal and human we are,that that really fosters a
healthy spiritual community.
Yes, yes,definitely, definitely, yeah.
But I am really appreciating,though, the value that you both
are bringing in my mind tohaving how important the
(43:05):
community is, and that justseems like, I guess that's
something that I feel verygrateful to be a part of the
yoga community. I feel like I'mvery grateful to have to be in
this community, and I feel likealmost any yoga practitioner in
(43:26):
the world, we all are a part oflike one same community. And yet
it is really fascinating how wehave all these smaller
communities building up intothis one large community, and
then probably even taking it astep further as a human, the
human community that's evenbeyond like, obviously, there's
(43:46):
a lot of humans on Earth thatdon't have never heard of yoga,
or they think it's yogurt. Butum, I, um, I guess I, that's
what I'm really appreciatingabout meeting both of you is, is
this, this feeling of largercommunity that, that I guess I'm
(44:08):
dreaming of, and wanting to holdon to it and build more of I
think it just feels so importantright now.
Yeah, go everyone. I just thinksometimes a lot of groups or
yoga and organizations andjuggernaut speaks have more
centers than I do. Some of themlost their whole concept of Yoga
(44:29):
itself, what it really means,and that's when they run into
difficulties. You know, thewhole concept like, how do how
good have taught us. He brokeeverything down to the lowest
common denominator, I mean, andhe explained it very clearly to
us. And I don't think a lot ofgroups had that experience that
we had with Swami sachidananda.
I mean, he just explainedeverything very clearly, the
(44:52):
purpose of service, the purpose.
He explained everything, andeven in the beginning, the base,
it. Gave us the mechanics ofeating, not being lustful to
food. And, you know, withouttelling us to do anything, he
just explained the benefits.
That's it, you know, and most ofus at that time in the 60s, was
like there was a lot of drugsand poor diet and bad behavior.
(45:14):
And he came in, and even in NewYork, people were chastising
him. What do you Well, theselike animals for their long
hair, they're freaks. They'redirty, you know? And he said
this to my children, and hebrought us up, and look what he
did. He created this city for usin Virginia, a lotus a temple
which represents all thereligions. Nobody even thought
(45:37):
of that,you know, yeah, his thinking is
amazing, aboveand beyond any master, any
teacher I've seen. And I was,you know, I was into Catholicism
when I was, he was a multi boy,you know, and I believed in God.
But there's nothing that couldbe compared to his teaching. And
he even had other yoga masters,because he was so giving of
(46:00):
himself and giving of his ownpersonal leadership to express
himself to other organizationsand give himself to other
people. You know, yes,it shows, it shows the value of
having a very strong, clearminded teacher.
Yes, so and i He's when I'veseen him with prisoners, I've
(46:24):
seen him with intellects. I'veseen him with no he was
basically the same, just, herelated to everybody. Was just,
he was comfortable in anysituation,
even with children. Oh my god,the best, right? Watching him
with with children is amazing,like preschoolers and all. It's
just just, there's a beauty andelegance in everything he did,
(46:50):
even with these young kids andhow they would, you know, crowd
around him. And yet, they knewthat if there was something that
was off kilter, he would correctit and they would follow it.
Wow, they knew that there wasthat there too. What
do you guys both know about hischildhood? Did he ever convey
(47:10):
what his growing up? What hislife was like growing up?
Yeah, there's a biography, apossible piece.
I apologize I haven't read ityet, but I will now that you
brought it up. Thank you.
Yeah. I mean, his family wasvery religious. They had all
kinds of great yogis come andvisit their place, and they
(47:33):
would host them. So hisexperience with the teachings
goes from birth, he was marriedfor a while, and then his wife
passed away, and at that point,he said, It's time for me. He
was drawn to the life of asanyasi renunciate, and I
(47:55):
studied with several famousteachers, Aurobindo Ramakrishna
was actually chit bhavananda,one of the disciples of
Paramahansa, Ramakrishna andothers as well. And then he
found his guru, Swami Sivananda.
And I don't know how many yearshe was there, for years as a
(48:16):
student, and was ordained orinitiated into renunciate
sanyas. And you know, we knowhow he revered his master, and
how he related to him, and allthese things. Are talking about
the tests and the prodding andthen the supporting and always
(48:38):
coming, it seems, at the righttime. So I think a lot of he got
from his master as well. Andthen was it 1966 right? Margo
bonded. He came to New York,supposed to be with two days or
three day trip, yeah,then he had a 30 day visa. They
were supposed to leave.
(49:01):
Didn't happen. Didn't happen. Hedidn't have people just wanted
him to stay. Yeah,he befriended two teachers,
brother David and Rabbigovernment. Brother David was a
Benedictine monk who became veryclose to great heaven, Rabbi
government and and they helped,like, prolong his visa. Do you
know the whole story, talkingabout
(49:25):
all of it, but I know it wasreally important, because at
that time, the idea of any kindof interfaith and someone a
Hindu monk, is how they wouldthink of it. What's he going to
tell people here? How was he?
What is his what is the contentof his teaching? Is it going to
lead to more drug abuse, or whatis it? And Rabbi gelberman and
brother David, both veryrespected, both really worked
(49:46):
hard that he would get this as apermanent visa. I forget what it
was called, the Minister ofdivine words or something, yes,
yeah, something like that. Yeah,yeah, wow. And that's how he got
a visa to stay. But. Basicallypeople our age, you know, the
hippie type of folks, who's alot of the that was the
organization. And there wassomething exciting about that,
(50:07):
the idea that you could changereally, you know, we wanted
peace on earth, and all thesethings. Did a lot of things that
didn't work. But here was a manwho gave us something that does
work. Maybe it's a littledifferently. It's like one
person at a time. But lookwhat's happened over the years.
He's had like, 1000s ofstudents. I don't know if he
never kept track, and we don't,we don't know how many. We know
(50:30):
that he spoke several timesaround the world,
yes, yeah. And spoke 1000 sohe fit where we were in the 60s,
and that's when I think 60s andearly 70s, I guess in yoga
really grew at that time reallyrapidly. And it's still here. It
(50:51):
still has a good message fortoday's world.
I I'm so excited to hear thesestories, because, from my very
first glimpse of his picture onthe Yoga Sutras of Patanjali
commentary, I, you know, likeyou'll I see a picture, and I
(51:13):
just feel attracted, you know,and but now to have the
opportunity To speak with bothof you and hear these stories
from direct you know you havethis direct contact just feels
really good. It feels, it feels,uh, brings it to life. Brings
(51:36):
more life to it, more life thanI knew about. To feel the
history and to get a chance tospeak with both of you, I feels
like a little bit of a fullcircle moment for me. So I, I'm,
I'm really thankful you bothhave been so generous, and since
my first meeting, it's been areal pleasure. And I don't, I
(51:56):
know this is not the last timeI'm going to get a chance to see
and speak with you, and I can'twait for it to actually be in
person. I love zoom and all, butI really want to see both of
your centers, so I will make ita point to travel up and please,
if you, either of you are everin Florida, we would be so
honored to have you in ourhumble little studio here. It's
not huge. I don't know if itwould be big enough for you
(52:18):
guys, but it would be a realit'd be a real honor. It really
was. Whattown are you in? A town called
JunoBeach. We're in Juneau Beach,
which is about like 20 minutesnorth of West Palm 20 minutes
north of West Palm Beach, aboutan hour and 15 north of
Miami. That might be in Floridain April. Oh, man. Margo bond,
you please. I have a well, Imean, I would love to host you.
(52:42):
If you So, please keep stay.
I'll stay in touch with you andcheck out. But if you do come,
don't hesitate to just let meknow. I won't feel like that's
being overbearing in any way,like just reach out and say,
hey, guess what? Todd, youmentioned it. I'm coming, and I
would be honored to have Haveyou, have you here. That would
be amazing. So if you ever docome, and I will come visit, and
I really do appreciate yourgenerosity, and I can feel your
(53:06):
generosity, from your sadhana,from your practice, from your
devotion and and I'm justgrateful for it. Thank you.
Thank you very, very generous,and we really appreciate you.
Really, yeah, yeah.
I think how I always think atthe end of a talk like this,
(53:29):
said the same thing every time Ithink, spend a little time every
day for your health and peace,then share it with everyone. We
just had that. Keep that inmind. We can accomplish a lot, a
lot of good in this world.
I think those are perfectclosing words. Reverend
Jagannath, thank you so much.
Thank you. Thank you. Marcobondu, this has been a real
(53:50):
treat. All right, until nexttime. Until next time. Thank
you. Thank you. Thank you. Godbless you. You're doing good
work. Thankyou. You too. Well, we'll keep
supporting each other here.
Yeah.
(54:16):
Native yoga. Todd cast isproduced by myself. The theme
music is dreamed up by BryceAllen. If you like this show,
let me know if there's room forimprovement. I want to hear that
too. We are curious to know whatyou think and what you want more
of what I can improve. And ifyou have ideas for future guests
(54:37):
or topics, please send us yourthoughts to info at Native yoga
center. You can find us atNative yoga center.com, and hey,
if you did like this episode,share it with your friends. Rate
it and review and join us nexttime you.
(55:06):
Oh, for you know you.
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