October 22, 2025 • 57 mins
Mass channels can cut price, but they can’t replace trust. We sat down with a veteran of 36 years in natural products to unpack how independent retailers win by returning to the industry’s roots: education, transparency, and community. From the Soho stage to day-to-day floor conversations, we trace what actually moves the needle—reading labels with intent, demanding real third-party testing, and training staff to ask smarter, open-ended questions that turn brand requests into problem solving.
You’ll hear how “read the label” becomes a strategy, not a slogan. We break down clinically studied ingredients, effective doses, and why vague “third-party tested” claims aren’t enough without naming the lab, the scope, and the frequency. We dive into proof—batch-by-batch verification for probiotics, rigorous mushroom identity testing, and a zero-citation FDA audit that signals robust quality systems. Then we tackle pricing head-on: the danger of perpetual discounts, how inflated “40% off” programs distort value, and a saner path that keeps Amazon at MSRP while helping brick-and-mortar stay competitive.
If your floor team sells what they’re trained on, make the training count. We share quick scripts that open conversations—“What brought you in today?”—and show how to pair needs with high-impact supports like K2 for bone and heart health. You’ll get practical ways to make value visible with simple comparison charts, non-GMO and organic standards, and electrolyte formulas that meet performance shoppers’ expectations without fillers. Finally, we talk community: why being present locally, stating your store standards out loud, and highlighting everyday essentials can pull trips from big-box back to your door.
Want the manufacturer checklist we mention in the episode? Shoot me a note at tina@naturalproductsmarketer.com, and I'll send it your way.
If this resonated, subscribe, share with a fellow retailer, and leave a quick review. Got a question or a challenge you want us to tackle on the show? Email info@naturalproductsmarketer.com and we’ll bring the right expert to the mic.
Connect with us:
Email: info@naturalproductsmarketer.com
About Tina Maddock
Since 2014, Tina has worked with multiple natural products businesses, discovering how to market their CBD products online, without having their payment processor shut them down, to letting customers talk about their health issues those products have helped them solve. She knows first hand how experts like you offer the best products and a superior customer experience, that is why she is committed to helping you find an easy way to grow your natural product business.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tina Maddock (00:00):
Welcome to the Natural Products Marketer
Podcast.
I'm your host, Tina Mattock.
On this podcast, you'll hearfrom manufacturers, retail
owners and operators, and otherbusiness experts that will help
you grow your business so youcan serve more people and change
more lives.
I really wanted to talk to youbecause you were in you went to
(00:20):
Soho.
Brian Hall (00:21):
I did go to Soho.
Tina Maddock (00:23):
You were the speaker at Soho.
Brian Hall (00:26):
I yeah, it was it was fantastic.
It was uh it was an honor, youknow.
Um, I think Ryan called me andI did a a talk at uh one of his
stores in Florida.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (00:34):
Um and he called and said, Hey, you know, you were
did great, and I think you'd bea good speaker, and I was I was
honored.
So got down there and uh didthe breakfast event, I think, on
Friday, um, to kind of kick offthe show, which was uh super
exciting.
And we had a full room.
Tina Maddock (00:50):
So yeah, tell me, um, I I heard a lot of great
things from retailers whoattended the talk.
Um, so tell me a little bitabout what you felt in the room,
what kind of questions you gotfrom people while you after you
presented, and just tell me alittle bit about what was going
on there.
Brian Hall (01:10):
Yeah, I think you know, the title of the talk
really was getting back to theroots of our industry, you know,
Tina.
So I mean, I think I've been inthe industry since I was a kid,
you know, 15 years old.
Um, and so that that's datingme.
I can't even do the mathanymore at my age.
I think it's like 36 years.
Um, and so I was kind oftelling that story and sitting
down and really getting into thesoul, into the heart, uh, and
(01:33):
the roots of the industry andwhat this industry was built on,
which was uh, you know,education and you know, like you
said, passion.
And, you know, I ask theaudience, and I do this all the
time.
I travel around and I visithundreds of health food stores
uh, you know, a quarter as Itravel across the country.
And I always sit down with theowners and the buyers and they
(01:53):
say, Hey, what are yourchallenges?
What are you looking for?
You know, what you know in yourbusiness?
And you know, those challengesthey were echoed in that
segment.
Uh, you know, they were thechallenges of uh, you know, the
the all the changes that haveoccurred with, you know, the POS
and the systems and the datamanagement and you know, and
(02:14):
then also you know, you have awhole new level of marketing and
advertising to try and bringnew customers in the door.
And you have a lot of thebrands that have been so loyal
to the industry uh for manyyears, you know, that they're
they're have been purchased,they've been sold, they've been,
you know, and their pathschanged, and they're going into
(02:35):
a lot of the you know massmarket stores and stuff like
that.
And so independent retailersreally need to be at the on the
top of their game uh to be ableto compete.
And you know, there's one areawhere they can compete and win,
and that's on being involved inthe community and winning an
education.
And that's what I took from it,Tina.
Tina Maddock (02:57):
Yeah, I mean, we hear that so much.
Like people continue to go tothe independent retail stores
because they can getrecommendations, they can get
educated on what is the thingthat I am about to take and
where's its source.
Like part of that to me, too,their differentiation is picking
the right products to be on theshelves so that it's something
(03:21):
that consumers can trust thatthe label is what it says it is,
and that there aren't anycontaminants, heavy metals,
those sorts of things that arein the product.
And I think the independentretailers have become the
gatekeeper of um products thatare worth spending money on
(03:43):
because they have efficacy forall the reasons that I just
talked about.
Brian Hall (03:47):
100%.
And you know, I and I Iannounced in the room there too,
I said True Race is starting anew campaign in 2026.
Really, it's multifaceted, butyou know, the main campaign is
gonna be it's gonna be read thelabel, Tina.
Tina Maddock (04:03):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Brian Hall (04:05):
I mean, you think about this, I mean, independent
retailers they're bombardedwith, you know, I talk uh do a
lot of Teams calls and I talk tosome category managers and I
looked, you know, behind theirtheir desk and their shelf,
Tina, and there's like 250products.
But that's where you know yousee the uh the retailers, they
look in the back and they'regetting so inundated with
(04:25):
products.
And a lot of times they're justlooking at like the front of
the pack or the fancy marketingand you know, a lot of these
things, and they're not actuallyturning over and diving into
and looking at the ingredientsand the efficacy.
And are they using clinicallystudied ingredients?
You know, that's another thingthat you know at True Grace, our
(04:49):
tagline is meaningfulingredients at affected doses,
and we focus a lot on clinicallystudied ingredients.
Um and you know, a lot ofretailers, you know, they they
either either don't dive in tothat and see it.
Um, and you know, it's all youknow, kind of the marketing and
you know, and we're trying toremind them that.
(05:09):
And then the other thing, thethe other part of that campaign
in 2026 is we're redefining oneducation.
So our our whole theme at TrueGrace is excellence in
education.
And as CEO, I'm putting thatthrough my whole company that I
want excellence in educationcoming from True Grace.
I want to be the source whereretailers can um look to, you
(05:33):
know, for something that's uh,you know, for for their staff to
be able to educate themselveson on all these clinically
studied ingredients andinnovations and different things
like that.
So we're gonna be ramping up in26 for the independent
retailers and coming out with aplatform that they can uh use
themselves and their associatesand new hires and all that
stuff.
So we're gonna double downwhere the industry's void is.
Tina Maddock (05:56):
Yeah, thank you for doing that and saying that
because here's um something thatwe've found too that the
retailers will be very honestabout it.
The products that their floorpeople are trained on are the
ones that get sold.
So the fact that you guys areinvesting in this just means
(06:18):
that's gonna be better for theretailer, the consumer, and for
you because that's the productpeople are gonna focus on.
Um, and so I love that you guysare doing that.
And one other thing that sortof came up for me while you were
just talking was um read thelabel is great.
And can you trust the label isa whole other question.
(06:42):
And I think it's a big onebecause you know, Amazon will
let anyone sell anything on thatplatform.
And again, reading the label, Ithink is the beginning.
The second thing is do youtrust the manufacturer?
Are there third-party teststhat are going into this?
How do we know that we'regiving our consumers good
(07:05):
products?
And I think you guys do a lotto help people understand like
we are giving you what's in whatis on that label in that
package.
Brian Hall (07:15):
Yeah.
And I talked about that in our,you know, and I I'm I'm honest
with the retailers.
I talked to the retailers aboutone of our products, our
probiotic.
You know, we're the onlyprobiotic, Tina, I believe in
North America.
You can fact check that for me,but we're the only probiotic in
North America carrying athird-party seal from Purity IQ,
an independent testing lab inuh Guelph, Ontario.
(07:38):
Check them out.
Your listeners got to checkthem out.
They're amazing.
They do, they do mushrooms,they do probiotics, they do DNA
identity, all this stuff.
But they actually can test andhave tested our probiotic every
batch, every lot.
You know, so I pay around$6,000 per lot, right, to have
this test and that seal on mybottle.
And, you know, what it says isthat, hey, we've done the test.
(08:00):
Not only are these specificstrains that are clinically
studied, you know, andreferenced on PubMed, not only
are they in there, but they'rein there at the amount they say
they're in there.
And we actually got a letterfrom them saying that, hey,
congratulations over the lastthree years, you've had like, I
don't know how many lots it was,six, seven, eight lots, where
(08:21):
every lot, Tina, had a 99%, or Ithink it was 98.7%
batch-to-batch consistency,meaning every capsule in every
lot over three years was on thatlabel claim.
Tina Maddock (08:37):
That's saying a lot.
And you know, we are gonnainterview them on the podcast.
We've scheduled.
Well, you are.
Yeah, yeah.
Brian Hall (08:42):
Oh, awesome.
Tina Maddock (08:43):
Yeah, I'm Dilio.
Brian Hall (08:44):
Are you gonna email you're gonna talk to Dilio?
Tina Maddock (08:46):
Yes.
Brian Hall (08:47):
Awesome.
I love her.
She's great.
She's dear friend of mine.
Tina Maddock (08:50):
Yeah, she's great.
And I can't wait to have her onthe podcast.
She's coming up soon.
Um, so that'll be great for allthe listeners to hear.
But um, I think, you know,sometimes um the retailers talk
about price and that it'sdifficult for them to maintain
margin and have the consumer paya certain price level.
(09:11):
Some of the things that you'retalking about, you're spending
extra money getting that proofthat what is on the label is in
the package.
And I think the consumer can beeducated around that, that
there's extra value there andthat people don't have to worry
as much about squishing theirmargins down to be more
competitive with another brandthat's more affordable, but
(09:33):
doesn't have all of the processin it that a brand like yours
has.
Brian Hall (09:38):
And that's third-party testing.
And you know, another thingthat we do, we use a company
called Alchemist Labs out ofSouthern California, and they're
testing all of our, you know,our mushrooms and they're
testing our fish oil to makesure that it has the level of
VPA and DHR.
And we actually put those logoson our bottle.
And here's where you have to becareful, Tina, is because now I
knowing this now as a as anowner of a company, and I'm
(10:00):
involved in all the you knowregulatory and formulations and
and all that stuff.
And you know, I see somecompanies go out there and it's
it says on the the front of thelabel or the side or the back,
whatever, wherever it's a thirdparty tested.
And that's all it says.
It's like, what am I supposedto trust you?
I mean, like, well, you I couldthere's no regulatory around
(10:24):
that.
I can say that it's third-partytested.
How many times is it the thirdparty tested?
Is it every lot?
What are you testing for?
You know, and the retailersneed to ask these questions,
right?
Ask me.
I want you to ask me.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Right.
Brian Hall (10:36):
Because be if you're asking me, that means that you
care about it.
And if you care about it, itmay not have the answer that
day, but I'm gonna go back andI'm gonna get you what you need.
You know, and and I had a I hada call yesterday.
You mentioned price.
It's so funny.
I had a call with a retaileryesterday, and she calls and
she's like, Well, you know, wereally love your maltis, but you
know, you're more expensivethan you know, this other whole
(11:00):
food-based brand.
And, you know, you're moreexpensive than this other whole
food-based brand.
And you're more and I I was I Iovercame the objection in 30
seconds.
It wasn't a big deal.
But here's here's here's what Iwant to.
I I came up with an analogylast night.
I was sitting on the couch, Iwas thinking about that
conversation.
But do you, Tina, do you havean iPhone?
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (11:20):
You do?
Okay.
Most people probably dolistening to this, right?
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Yep.
Brian Hall (11:26):
iPhones, the new iPhone just came out, iPhone 17.
What is that thing, Tina?
But 13, 14, 1500 bucks?
Tina Maddock (11:33):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (11:33):
We don't bat an eye.
Tina Maddock (11:35):
Oh, right.
Brian Hall (11:36):
We don't bat an eye.
Hey, I want the iPhone 17.
I'm gonna stand in line fornine hours to pay $1,300 for a
phone.
Okay?
Now, Tina.
They still sell flip phonesthat you can get.
Tina Maddock (11:52):
I did not know that.
Brian Hall (11:53):
They still, yeah, you can go into Verizon ATT and
they still sell the you know thelittle phones.
You can get them for $79.
Now, Tina, they both callpeople.
They both text people.
But what would you think appwhen somebody comes and says,
Oh, I can't sell your iPhonebecause this you know phone over
(12:18):
here is $79.99.
Tina Maddock (12:20):
Yeah, no.
Brian Hall (12:22):
That's the difference, guys, between True
Grace and a lot of the otherwhole food-based multis out
there.
You can't compare.
unknown (12:31):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (12:31):
You know, you when you when you pull them off the
shelf and they're you know$23.99 and ours is $29.99, we're
there's no Menic7, clinicallystudied Menic 7 K2 at an
efficacy efficacious dose of 60micrograms.
They have none.
We have 60 micrograms.
(12:52):
You know, um, we're at at TrueGrace, we're using things like
clinically studied ergoactiveergothionine.
That'll that product alonesells for 30 bucks a month, just
if you were to buy fivemilligrams of it.
You get where I'm going, Tina?
It's like you can't just comedown to price.
You have to look at value.
Um, and so that's where we'retrying to tell people.
(13:14):
You know, we're using fruitingbody mushrooms that are
third-party tested by AlchemistLabs.
We're using Menic 7K2, we'reusing, you know, fermented
glycoprotein-bound nutrients.
These are all extra steps andmeasures that we take that bring
the quality up.
Tina Maddock (13:30):
Yeah, I mean, and part of this is educating the
consumer, but I also think theconsumer's more educated than
they used to be because TikTokand whatever, and there's plenty
of misinformation out there,but they have some knowledge
around some of these things thatyou're talking about.
So just highlighting them mightbe enough for many people to
(13:54):
say, okay, this is worth itbecause it has these items in
it.
I mean, when you start talkingabout fermented um those
ingredients are important in theconversation around
paramenopause, which is blowingup online right now.
And so just highlighting thatingredient alone might be enough
(14:18):
to be like, oh, this is the oneif I'm a woman that I would
want to take over another brand.
So I do think sometimes it'sjust highlighting the
difference.
And we've talked about thingsthat really work comparison
charts, um, this versus otherbrands.
Um, and then also being able tohave educated conversations
(14:42):
with a consumer about this.
So again, we go back to thenthe team on the floor needs to
be educated about all of thesethings as well.
Brian Hall (14:52):
Yeah, and I think, you know, the team on the floor,
and that's key.
And you know, here's theproblem is you got, you know,
some of these brands out therethat are owned by, you know, the
big, you know, you know whothey are.
Your listeners know, you know.
I don't have to reiterate, Idon't want to do that.
But they, you know, people comein into the store and be like,
oh, do you have this, you know,whole food-based multivitamin?
(15:13):
You know, and then what we doas retailers is we what we do,
we take them over the shelf, wesay, here it is, and then we
walk away.
And you know, what we need totrain the staff to do is when
they come in and they say, I'mlooking for XYZ brand.
Oh, it's a great brand.
What made you interested in it?
Oh, I saw it on TikTok.
(15:34):
Oh, you saw it on TikTok.
Okay, great.
Um, it's a great brand, youknow, but some of the things in
that that they're missing inhere are things like you know,
the Manicue 7K2, and uh, youknow, it's not non-GMO or it's
you know not fermented, youknow, all of those things, those
highlights that we can engagethe staff at the floor level to
(15:54):
say, oh, and then the you know99% of the time, Tina, the
people are gonna be like, Oh,I'll take that brand.
Is that what you take?
Tina Maddock (16:02):
Yeah.
You know, and they walk out.
We talk a lot about howimportant it is for the floor
team to start the conversationwith what brought you in today?
You know, just a simpleopen-ended question like that,
it might still elicit the sameanswer of, I'm looking for this
brand.
(16:22):
But actually, when you startthe conversation with what
brought you in today, or did youcome in to solve something
specific?
Are you looking to reach aspecific goal?
When you when you sort of um dothose questions a little bit
differently at the very start ofthe conversation, then you
become collaborative and helpingthem solve a problem versus I
(16:45):
want a brand, I want this item,which can also happen.
You can still point them inthat same direction, but then
you've got a bunch of resourcesyou can point them to in the
store, which leads to betterservice for them because they're
trying to solve a problem, andhigher um baskets for you,
because hey, you're not just youdon't just need a multivitamin,
(17:09):
you're actually looking forsomething specific related to
what, because you're trying tosolve a problem.
And then, oh, well, that'sgreat.
And do you know this makes iteven better when you pair these
two things together?
You start having really goodconversations that lead the
consumer to get what they needinstead of just what they came
(17:29):
in the store thinking that theyneeded.
Brian Hall (17:32):
A hundred percent.
You know, um, and that's uhthat's the education, that's the
excellence in education thatwe're gonna be striving for.
And then, you know, you'relooking at some brands too,
where you know, they'll come inand they'll ask for a specific
brand or they see it on socialmedia and they see you know
these other things.
I had a retailer the other day,you know, uh, we have an
electrolyte product and uh I usethat.
Oh, you do?
(17:52):
Oh, awesome.
Electromag, yeah, it's amazing.
Tina Maddock (17:55):
Great fruit is my favorite.
Brian Hall (17:57):
Awesome.
And then we just launched PinkLemonade, you know, so it's
coming out uh here shortly too.
But you know, what'sinteresting with that is you
know, we launched this view,it's skyrocketing in sales.
I mean, it's it's everywhereselling, it's just like top,
top, top.
Um, you know, but there's somecompetition out there, and
there's some you know, bigcompetition out there, and
there's a lot of mass markettype competition um, you know,
(18:21):
in that realm.
And you know, you look at itand you know, it's the
retailers.
I don't know.
I mean, there's you have someof the things where there was
some media uh centered aroundexactly what you said, which you
guys, you know, your listenerscan look this stuff up, but is
what's in there, is is what's inthere, what they're saying is
in there.
(18:41):
Is there other things in there?
Is there testing, you know, umall of those things?
And it's been brought out, youknow, that it's not.
And you know, the other thingthen is like it's not non-GMO.
And I'm not gonna mention thebrand's name, but it's not
non-GMO.
It's not using organic naturalflavors.
Um, it's you know, in Targetfor, and you know, you can get
(19:04):
an eight-pack in Target for ninebucks.
And it's like, what do we whatdo Tina, you tell me what do
independent retailers want?
Do they want us to take all ofour money and put it into
TikTok?
Or you guys have standards thatyou want us to meet, which is
non-GMO, which is organic, whichis you know, um, no other
(19:27):
filler ingredients in anelectrolyte product, um, and you
don't want us en masse, thenwhat do we have to do else,
Tina, to get independentretailers to double down on
Electromag or True Grace?
And I'm using that as a wholeindustry standard because
there's other great brands outthere too that are doing what
(19:48):
we're doing.
Yeah, you know, what is itgonna take?
There's another big brand,whole food-based brand, that
just launched into you know amassive retailer um across the
country, and if they'readvertising it on their social
media like crazy.
Um, and it's it's convenience,Tina.
The customers are going tothose stores every day.
And if they see it there, whydo I have to make the extra trip
(20:12):
to the independent health foodstore?
Here it is, right here, andit's half the price.
It's like what do we what do wedo?
Tina Maddock (20:19):
Yeah, well, I mean, a couple of things um that
I think about that.
I don't think that independentsare talking enough about things
like that non-GMO organic.
Um, and and this is across theboard in different products.
I mean, essential oils, anumber of products you can
really highlight that on.
(20:40):
And if you think aboutsomething like um the
electrolyte category, that'stypically for people who are
very in tune with I'm I want toput the best in my body because
I want high performance, or I'mtrying to solve a health issue.
So I'm trying to put clean,good products in my body.
(21:04):
And again, I'm just saying likehighlighting or a simple
comparison chart goes a long wayhaving that on your website,
having it like hanging on ashelf so that people can take a
look.
And it doesn't need to call outa different brand, it can just
say other brands, you know, thisbrand versus other brands.
Brian Hall (21:25):
Leading, yeah, leading brand A, leading brand
B.
You know, you can drawconclusions.
Tina Maddock (21:30):
You don't have to point fingers, it can be really
easy, but but the people thatare buying that specific
product, other sports nutritioncategories, um, they they care
about that being pure organicand that they're getting in
their body because they'retrying to do something for
performance or some sort ofhealth issue.
(21:51):
So I think you know, justhighlighting things like that is
a big deal.
And exactly.
And yeah, and people areconstantly also like, what do I
put on social media?
There you go.
Super easy.
They're always like, What's thecontent?
What do we do?
Super easy to highlight branddifferences.
And I I think it it's also adifferentiator for stores when
(22:14):
they start to say, This is whywe carry brands, you can start
to trust the store more thatthey're only gonna bring you
what it has some efficacy aroundit for the health goals that
people are trying to solve.
I think that's when you win andpull people into the store,
even though they've got to buysome other essentials in a depth
(22:35):
in another place.
Um, but one of the things thatwe're talking about right now is
highlighting essentials thatyou do have.
I mean, many of the storescarry toilet paper or coffee or
something else that people buyevery day and they are buying it
somewhere.
Why not be buying it from youbecause they're loyal, you're
(22:56):
local, you're in theircommunity.
This does get back to that.
If you're not in the community,then it's harder to make that
pull in for a system.
Brian Hall (23:05):
100%.
100%.
Tina Maddock (23:07):
But getting in the community, if you're seen
regularly as contributing tothat community, man, you're
gonna pull people over forsimple things.
Brian Hall (23:16):
Absolutely.
And that's you know, that'swhat's key is uh, you know, and
it's interesting you talk aboutquality and some of those things
in non-GMO.
Like that's what this industrywas built out.
You know, I was at Infra, theshow um, you know, a couple
months ago, and you know, theywere they brought up those kind
of pioneers on stage of thenon-GMO movement.
And you know, these are thethat that was the that's what
(23:37):
the industry was built on, yeah,you know, is these types of
pioneers and thought leaders andmissionaries and you know
making change and standing trueto their values when when when
they were up against it.
And look at what happened 10,15, 20 years later, Tina.
I mean, that's the root ofthat's the root of the industry,
and that's what I want to getback to.
(23:59):
Um, and it's interestingbecause I went out to, I was uh
formulating this electrolyteproduct, Electramag, and I and I
went out to this uh pretty goodsized chain in California, um,
and their quality standards arelike I mean, in the independents
have high quality standards.
But this one, Tina, I was like,you mean I gotta do what to get
(24:23):
a product in here?
And you know, I had to sendthem every bit of certificate of
analysis of documentation ofnot just the final product,
Tina, but every ingredient inthe product, where it was
sourced, what processing aidswent into making every single
one of those ingredients,because they had a list a mile
(24:46):
long of banned substances andagain things in their in their
store.
And I I said, okay.
And I took it back and I wentto my contract manufacturer.
I said, Boom, here, can you dothis?
Yeah, yeah, we can do this, butit's gonna, yeah, you're gonna
pay more, it's gonna cost you.
Yeah, your cogs are gonna be alittle bit higher, you know.
And I'm like, okay.
(25:07):
And so we did it, we wedelivered, and it's now the
number one selling electrolytein that chain.
And you know, you look at thatand you you we have to know and
ask the questions.
There's a couple, you know, newbrands that just launched,
Tina, right?
You know, in the in the spaceand the whole food realm and
stuff like that.
And we don't even know who theowner is.
(25:28):
Like who's behind the company?
Ask those questions.
Who's the owner?
You know, when somebody comesin and I talk to independent
retailers all the time, youknow, um, and it's like, you
know, Bruce and you know, um,Ryan and Brian and all these,
you know, the retailers inFlorida, and you know, Joe Nolan
and Good Harvest and Jimbo andyou know, um, all these stores
(25:50):
across the country.
I have their cell phones andthe personal relationships.
It's like, who owns True Grace?
Christy Hall.
Oh, I know her husband, Brian.
I got a cell right here.
You got a question?
You don't get that with anyoneelse.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (26:03):
Um, and and that's one of the key things.
And a funny story with thesecontract manufacturers, with
knowing that and asking thosequestions, because a lot of
these companies use contractmanufacturers for their product,
right?
Ask who they are, you know, andin true transparency.
And I was I was uh actuallyhave never been fired in my
(26:24):
career, Tina.
I've never had the feeling ofbeing fired, uh you know, thank
goodness.
But I was fired nine monthsago.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
Uh-oh.
Brian Hall (26:32):
Yeah, I was fired.
So we had this contractmanufacturer that we were doing
some work with, and we werealways having problems.
Always having problems withthem.
And I got the phone call oneday.
And you know what they said,Tina?
They said, you know what?
True gray standards, yourquality standards are just too
(26:54):
high for us to meet.
So we can't do business withyou anymore.
And I was like, excuse me?
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (27:06):
Our quality standards are too high that
you're firing us?
I got fired nine months ago.
Um and we since moved on andand partnered with some um
bigger and uh you know strongerand button-up supply chain and
contract manufacturers in someareas where uh I I I apply.
(27:28):
I had the FDA come in here,Tina, like a year ago.
I gotta tell you that story.
Yeah, it was hilarious.
Okay, so um I had the FDA comein.
I'm I'm sitting at this desk,Tina.
Okay, it's my beautiful officehere in Pewkey.
I don't know if people, if thisis video, people can see it or
if it's just audio, but youknow, I'm out in Lake Country in
Wisconsin, beautiful area, andthree black SUVs pull up, Tina.
(27:52):
Right by my window here.
Tina Maddock (27:55):
And I'm like from a movie that doesn't like the
real FDA would come lookingback.
Brian Hall (28:02):
I know.
I'm like, what the heck?
And I I'm like, that's weird.
Three black SUVs, and they pullin the parking lot, and then
I'm sitting here and my my dooris right there.
Honest to God, Tina.
They walk in, they don't knock.
They walk in, hold up, theywe're here for a surprise, uh
surprise audit.
And I was like, awesome.
(28:26):
I did.
I said, this is my I wasn'tnervous.
I said, this is my time toshine.
I've been waiting for thismoment for three years, Tina.
And they came in and they sat,came in into my office here.
I got our uh COO and ourdirector of RD and Education
Regulatory all on the Zoom rightaway.
I knew exactly what to do.
Opened up the filing cabinets,you know, have at it.
(28:48):
And they sat here, Tina, fromeight o'clock in the morning on
a Tuesday till five o'clockTuesday night.
We're back on Wednesday ateight o'clock in the morning
till five o'clock Tuesday night,and then Thursday they were
back at eight in the morninguntil one thirty.
Eight hours.
I had to order lunch in, I hadto sit in a chair.
(29:09):
They went through everything.
You know, oh you're sayingthird-party tested purity IQ.
How did you can you verify eachlot and batch and pull up this?
They went through everything.
And at the end, you know, I'msat there and they close the
books and the blah blah blah.
(29:30):
And um I said, so what's thewhat's the thing here?
And they're like, Well, you'vegot a letter in the mail.
You know, blah, blah, blah,blah, blah.
And then, you know, becausethey see if you have citations
or any of that.
Tina, she says to me, she says,I just want to w let you know.
I've been doing this for threeyears.
I've been with the FDA for Xamount of years, I've been doing
(29:52):
this for, you know, three yearsin this space.
I wish every company was asbuttoned up as True Brace.
Tina Maddock (30:00):
Oh nice, yeah.
Brian Hall (30:01):
She she closed her book.
She left.
Zero citations, Tina.
That's what you want as anindependent retailer.
Right?
And that's the that but thattakes that takes money.
And that takes a lot ofexpenses with the testing and
the quality and the regulatory.
And you know, you can't trustany of these contract
(30:22):
manufacturers.
You can't trust them.
You got to verify, trust butverify.
And that's what we do because Iwant the independent retailer,
if you're listening, when youput a bottle of true grace in
someone's hand, that's yourreputation.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
Mm-hmm.
Brian Hall (30:36):
At the core of it.
Right?
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (30:40):
And I I've been in this industry for 36 years.
I love this industry.
I love the independentretailers.
I'll do ever anything I can tosupport them at True Grace and
to be that brand that they cantrust.
Tina Maddock (30:54):
Yeah.
So here's uh something I thinkcould be useful for the
listeners.
If they're an independentretailer, before they bring a
brand in their store or talk tothe ones they already have, what
are five or ten things theyshould be asking every
manufacturer?
Brian Hall (31:12):
I think number one is, you know, like uh who's
who's behind the brand?
You know, who's the owner?
That's one of the biggestthings.
What are the values?
What are the mission?
What's the values in themission and the guiding
principles and the formulation?
That's probably the first thingI would ask is who's behind it?
And what are theirformulations, philosophies?
(31:34):
What is their mission?
What is their guidingprinciple?
Because the first thing I woulddo as a business owner if I
owned an independent health foodstore is I would want to align
with partners that share myvalues and mission.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (31:45):
Right?
And we forget to do that.
You know, if I had somebodycome and say, Tell me, Jim, how
does your brand align with mymission and values?
Okay, good.
Boom.
It checks that box.
Great.
Uh, you know, and then the nextthing is the formulation
philosophy, like I talk about.
You know, and then diving intoyou know what is your
(32:07):
omnichannel strategy, is a bigone, right?
Um, and you know, because a lotof brands, you know, are
focused solely on this is whathappens.
I know this all too well.
Okay, you have to be careful asan independent retailer because
a lot of these brands have beenD2C, direct-to-consumer.
(32:27):
They put a ton of money intothe TikTok and into the
Instagram, and you know, timeand time again, they spend, I
was talking to somebodyyesterday with this one brand
where they were spending amillion dollars a month on meta
advertising.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (32:43):
A million a month.
And they you know, they had athree ROS, four ROS.
I mean, they were pretty it wasa printing press of money,
right?
Um, but you know what the valueof the company was?
Nothing.
unknown (32:57):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (32:57):
Because they didn't have a retail presence.
And these companies that wantto come in and buy companies and
you know, look at all thesedifferent things or invest in
companies, they want a brandthat has a, you know, that
that's well balanced and has ayou know fair pricing strategy
and all of those things acrossthe board.
Um, and so I would ask thatquestion, you know, what is your
(33:19):
omni straddle chat strategy?
Are you trying to because thena lot of these brands now they
go into the retailers and say,oh, we need to get into the
retailers.
We need, you know, because thisis you know, to do this, we
need to do that, you know, kindof thing.
We didn't do that at TrueGrace.
You know, like our omnichannel,our our foundation is brick and
mortar, is health food stores,because we're on a mission to
(33:42):
support, we're proud supportersof regenerative agriculture, you
know, and there's a lot ofthings that we do to support
regenerative agriculture outsideof True Grace that your
listeners could take a deep diveon and take a look at.
You know, my wife's uh familyfoundation sponsored the white
paper at Rodale Institute tocreate the standard for
regenerative agriculture.
You know, there's a lot ofthings that we've done there
(34:02):
behind the scenes to do that.
But the regenerativeagriculture movement and a lot
of the non-GMO movement, a lotof these movements, those were
changed by pioneers in theindustry that were feet on the
health food store, independenthealth food store floor.
And that's what we want tosupport at True Grace.
And that's why we have, youknow, we offer the same pricing
(34:24):
strategy across all.
And I was talking to a retaileryesterday in Ohio, and she
said, Oh, I'm priced at this.
And I'm like, that's great.
You're priced below our Amazonprice.
That's what I want.
You know, I want somebody tocome in and say, Oh, you know,
Tina, this is more expensive onAmazon.
Can I please buy it at yourstore, Tina?
Tina Maddock (34:44):
Yeah.
And people are looking up.
So I, you know, I used to hearthis from retailers um that
people would come in and theywould Amazon shop while they're
in the store to see if that samebrand is on there in the
pricing.
And I was like, I don't know.
I I don't know, but I saw it ina store the other day,
(35:05):
electrolytes specifically.
They were going online to lookand they were like, uh, it's
it's cheaper here.
Let's just get this.
And I was like, good job.
Brian Hall (35:17):
That's true, Grace.
I priced or you know, I pricedit on Amazon at MSRP.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (35:22):
You know, and and that's what I'm trying to tell
you know the retailers.
And I give I give retailers alot of discounts and promotions
and different things like that.
Um, and um, you know, they passit on, which is great.
I love that they do that.
Um, but you also you know thatthat promote us more because
that's it's in your store, it'sless expensive, it's not in the
(35:46):
Targets, it's not in the youknow, the Walgreens, it's not
we're we're trying to supportthis industry.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (35:52):
Um, you know, and so get behind that.
Uh, you know, so those that'sanother key thing.
And then, you know, coming backto the third-party testing,
Tina, and a lot of a lot ofcompanies won't answer it, but
you know, like who's your youknow, who's your contract
manufacturer?
Where are you making this?
You know, I had uh, you know,uh somebody the other day, it
was funny as a probioticcompany, and and oh yeah,
(36:17):
they're making it right there attheir office, and blah blah
blah.
I'm like, are you sure aboutthat?
And oh yeah, they're making itright there, and the buttons and
I'm like, you sure?
Oh yeah, and I'm like have youbeen?
(36:39):
Yeah, have you seen it withyour own eyes?
And then she's like, No.
And I'm like, you might want tofact check that.
Okay.
Um, and then when somebodycomes to me and they say, Brian,
who's your contractmanufacturer for your
probiotics?
I say Lalamont in Montreal, thesecond largest probiotic
(37:05):
manufacturer in the entireworld, who has an actual
dedicated institute, RoselleInstitute, that does studies on
their actual specific strainsthat they've developed over the
course of a hundred years thatare have over 400 studies on
them.
Do you want to go with me?
I'm going in August.
You want to come?
Tina, you want to come toMontreal and see Lalaman?
Tina Maddock (37:27):
I would love to.
Brian Hall (37:27):
Let's go.
Let's go.
Tina Maddock (37:29):
Let's do it.
Brian Hall (37:30):
Yeah.
And then, you know, if somebodysays it, so that's
transparency, Tina.
Tina Maddock (37:37):
Yeah, and I I don't understand, like, if it if
someone's not willing to answerthat, like where, who, and how.
I I don't know how you cantrust, right?
Like without without someoneanswering those questions and
being transparent about thosethings.
I don't know how you then trustthat they're doing what they're
(37:58):
saying they're doing.
Brian Hall (37:59):
Exactly.
And that, you know, and that'sthe thing.
And it happens all the timewhere um, you know, uh you just
you trust you can't trust thecontent, you can't trust them
because you gotta verify.
Yeah, and that's the third,that's where the third party
testing comes in, that's wherethe proper regulatory testing
comes in, that's where, youknow, that's why we're so
buttoned up at True Grace.
Um, and I I put that into theDNA of our company.
(38:22):
We invested heavily there upfront.
Um, and then you know, anotherso that's one thing.
And then another big thing thatuh a lot of stores, retailers,
I think miss the kind of themark on or the boat on, too, is
like, oh, well, so and so brandTina gives me 40 off every day.
Tina Maddock (38:42):
Oh, right, yeah.
Brian Hall (38:44):
And I'm sitting there and like, and I'm very
respectful, but uh, you know,I've been doing this for 36
years.
I was on the I was I led a bigcompany.
I don't know if you know, I ledthis uh company called New
Chapter with a fantastic team ofpeople.
Um, not just me.
I've taken you know hardly anycredit for it, but we had a
great team, and that companywent, you know, and skyrocketed
(39:07):
and then sold to Procter andGamble.
And you know, I worked therefor four years and you know,
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
So but which we have to becareful of, Tina, is that when
somebody's coming in and they'reoffering you 40% off every day,
they know they have to do that,so they build it into their
pricing model.
Does that make sense?
Tina Maddock (39:28):
Yeah, totally.
Um that a lot, like havinghaving a running thing like
that, then the price is notright.
Brian Hall (39:38):
Right.
And that's that's where I'mstruggling a lot.
And I need your help, Tina.
Maybe you can help me with thisand guide me in the right
direction.
Um, you know, so if if we dothe math, okay, um, Tina, let's
do the math real quick.
I have a product at True Grace,and it's six dollars.
Okay, that's my MSRP.
(40:01):
Okay, now if we take tenpercent off of six dollars,
Tina, that's sixty cents, right?
So six dollars minus sixtycents is five dollars and forty
cents.
Okay, for for widget A.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
Okay.
Brian Hall (40:20):
Now, widget B, Tina, is ten dollars MSRP.
But it's forty percent off.
Speaker 2 (40:30):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (40:32):
So now forty percent off of ten dollars is six
dollars.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Right.
Brian Hall (40:38):
Which one do you want to buy, Tina?
The one that's forty percentoff at six dollars or the one
that's ten percent off at fiveforty?
Tina Maddock (40:45):
Right, exactly.
Brian Hall (40:47):
Which one?
Tina Maddock (40:48):
The five forty.
Um the five.
Brian Hall (40:50):
You you you would think, yeah.
You would think so.
But but people don't.
People don't.
They're like, oh my god, thisis such an amazing deal.
It's 40% off at $6.
Tina Maddock (41:02):
Yeah.
Do you think there's a littlebit of um of that law of price
um setting where it's where it'slike if you level someone
thinking that the value's here,and when you're like, but I'll
give it to you for this.
And then people think they'regetting that much value when
really the thing just costs thatmuch, right?
Brian Hall (41:25):
It's unbelievable.
And I know what this stuffcosts, and you know, I'm and I'm
um, you know, kind of you know,speaking out in this industry,
and probably, you know, not themost well-like guy in the
industry, but you know, peopleTina, if somebody comes if if
somebody comes to you and says,Hey Tina, I'm gonna give this
product to you for free.
Tina Maddock (41:46):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (41:48):
And I'm gonna give it to you for 90 days, and I'm
gonna guarantee it.
And if it doesn't move, I'mgonna take it back and I'm gonna
ship it back to my warehouse.
Do you ever think like, wow,what value does that product
(42:11):
have if I have to give if if Ican give it away for free?
Right?
Like if some my probiotic, Iknow what my probiotic costs,
Tina, a bottle, and what thatpurity IQ testing per bottle is,
and you know, the fact that I'musing a patented CSP bottle
that protects it from moisturelightened oxygen, and that I'm
(42:34):
using patenteddigestive-resistant capsules and
I'm using clinically studiedstrains.
If somebody comes and asks mefor my probiotic for free, I you
know what I say, Tina?
I say, you know what?
I say, you know what, Tina,with all due respect, it doesn't
seem like our relation or or oryou know, we're aligned.
Speaker 2 (42:55):
Right.
Brian Hall (42:56):
You know, I can't give free product, I'm sorry, I
have to walk away.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (43:01):
Right?
Because we're we're conditionedas humans now at the retailers,
that it has to be free filled,that it has to be, you know,
these massive deals.
Um, and you know, I hear it allthe time.
There's another big brand outthere that, and the retailers
hate it, I know you do.
They come in and they say,okay, well, we're launching 18
new products.
We're gonna give you 40% off,and then if you don't take these
(43:25):
18 products at this discount,you're gonna lose your discount
on these other 22 products.
And then I've gone intoretailers and I've said, Hey,
you brought in all that product,it just launched last month,
and she Tina, she had it on aclearance rack for 70% off.
Yeah, the whole stack.
And I said to the lady, I said,I said, with all due respect, I
(43:48):
was like, this just launched,you just brought it in.
It just launched a month ago.
She's like, they forced me totake it.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
Oh, yeah.
Brian Hall (43:55):
Otherwise, I wouldn't get my discount on
anything else.
I didn't want it.
So as soon as it came in, Iimmediately put it on a
clearance rack.
Speaker 2 (44:03):
Oh wow.
Brian Hall (44:03):
I'm like, I said, what?
That's what we're at right now.
And here I come hat in hand.
Here I come hat in hand andbeing like, you know, hey, we'll
buy one, buy two, buy three,buy 144, Tina.
I don't care.
I'll give you the samediscount.
What am I doing wrong, Tina?
(44:25):
Tell me.
Tina Maddock (44:27):
No, I mean, look, there are strategies that you
can use for short periods oftime to do things that I think,
you know, we're all we all dotests to see like what works and
what doesn't.
But if it's consistent acrossthe board, then I do think
there's a pricing issue.
And things that we've foundbefore are when you just lower
(44:47):
the price and like this is theprice, um, you get higher volume
and higher than you would havegotten doing that old discount
strategy at higher marginsbecause you're not like pulling
discounts here to push discountsthere.
(45:07):
So you end up with a lot moremoney in the end when the consum
because the consumer is savvyaround pricing.
And so when you inflate it topull it down, then they're just
gonna wait until you pull itdown or expect that you're
always gonna offer 30%, 40%,whatever it is.
Brian Hall (45:30):
Which they are, which they are now, and that's
the new floor, you know, and andthat's where you know.
Um, I remember back in the day,you know, as a as a 16-year-old
kid working in a health foodstore in Cleveland and Ohio.
I forget what the product is itwas like, remember when shark
cartilage?
Tina Maddock (45:45):
I don't know if you oh my gosh, yes.
Brian Hall (45:48):
You remember?
unknown (45:49):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (45:50):
Shark cartilage, right?
You know, I won't go into allthe specifics on what they said
it did, but you know, there wasbooks out there, and and and
Tina, we I I was a 16-year-oldkid.
I had working in the healthfood store at the register on a
Saturday, and the guy had itstacked behind the register
because it was selling for ahundred bucks a bottle.
And this was 36 years ago.
Speaker 2 (46:11):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (46:12):
Remember?
Nobody batted an eye.
I was selling, you know, 24 aday.
Tina Maddock (46:18):
Yeah, I'm yes.
And I I I've seen otherproducts come through like that.
Um so it's very interestingthat you've been in the industry
for so long that you've seenlike trends come through.
Brian Hall (46:35):
You've seen them all.
Tina Maddock (46:36):
Yeah.
unknown (46:37):
Yeah.
Tina Maddock (46:37):
Not all.
Brian Hall (46:38):
I mean 36 years of trends.
Tina Maddock (46:40):
You've seen a while, right?
Um, of trends that are comingthrough.
So I speak to that a littlebit, the trends versus like what
actually is effective for theconsumer.
What are you seeing right now?
Brian Hall (46:58):
Oh, goodness gracious.
Um uh, yeah, I think trends,you know, you know, I spent a
lot of time in uh after I leftNew Chapter, I went to a
practitioner brand.
Um and I I went to a pretty bigone.
It was one of the top threepractitioner brands and had a
great time there, and it wasamazing.
And it was it was reallyinteresting, Tina, because I had
spent so much time on retail,and I knew I knew quite a bit.
(47:20):
You know, I was trained by somepretty powerful individuals in
formulation and herbalism andyou know stuff like that.
But I'll tell you what, Tina,when I went to this company, it
was like I was in kindergarten.
I was like, oh my goodness.
Like, and I've now these arefunctional medicine doctors and
chiropractors and you know, um,naturopathic doctors, and you
(47:44):
know, I like holy cow, I reallygotta up my game on the
education side of things, right?
Um, and you know, that's whereI learned that you know, um
there's there's trends, there'sfads, but you know, always
diving back into the clinicalresearch.
Right?
You know, for for example,Tina, okay, so like vitamin K2.
(48:07):
I said this in my talk.
I think myself that vitamin K2is the most important nutrient.
And I may get this wrong.
People please don't take myword for it here, fact-check it.
But I think they the stat islike 80 or 85% of people in the
America are deficient in K2.
I think.
(48:27):
So fact-check me, people.
Go online and take a look.
But think about that, Tina.
85% of people are deficient inK2.
K2 is essential for boneremodeling and shuttling calcium
from the arteries into thebone.
You know, it need K2 and D3 forthe immune system, K2 and D3
for osteoblasts.
You know, osteoblasts buildbone and they're K, you know, K2
(48:50):
dependent and D3 dependent andneed K2 to activate it, you
know, that whole thing.
Very important nutrient.
Okay, so retailer, do the math.
Okay, I'm gonna give you asecond, Mr.
and Mrs.
Retailer, to pull out your padand paper.
Okay.
Want you to write down rightnow how many customers a day
come through your health foodstore.
Speaker 2 (49:10):
Mm-hmm.
Brian Hall (49:12):
Okay.
Now, what I want you to do iswrite down how many bottles a
day of Menicue 7K2 you sell.
Tina Maddock (49:19):
Right.
Brian Hall (49:20):
Okay, so if you have a hundred people coming in a
day and you're not selling 85bottles a day, we're missing the
mark.
Does that make sense, Tina?
Tina Maddock (49:31):
Totally.
And we talk about things likethis all the time.
Like if you are educated, youknow that there are products
that every single person wouldfind useful and should be
taking.
And so that is easy to have aconversation with people if
you're willing to openly have aconversation about health goals
(49:54):
and they're gonna talk to youabout something, and you're
gonna say, okay, great.
And did you know also that youshould be using this product?
Here's where you can find it.
Um, and having that oneconversation, if you're helping
them solve a health goal, whatwe've seen is 80% of people will
buy the product that you'rerecommending as a partner to
(50:17):
whatever else they're they'rebuying.
Um if they don't have a healthgoal or a problem that they're
talking to you about and you'renot talking to them about the
product solving, still 20% ofpeople will buy it if you just
talk about it.
So that's always a way to helpthe consumer.
(50:38):
And and we talk about that toobecause a lot of people are
like, upsell.
I don't I can't upsell.
That seems fishy, you know,snake oil salesman kind of
thing.
And I'm like, you're notoffering them something that
they shouldn't be using, you'reactually offering them something
that every person needs.
It's really easy.
Brian Hall (50:57):
And you know, you know, the other thing I you know
talk to retailers too, it'slike you don't have to sell them
to educate them.
Tina Maddock (51:02):
Right?
Brian Hall (51:03):
You have you know, think about it it really as
planting a seed.
Okay.
So, you know, and I tell thisall the time when somebody comes
in and says, Oh, I'm lookingfor XYZ for I'm looking for
calcium for this, or you know,whatever for my bone health or
cardiovasculars, uh, runs in myfamily.
I'm looking for, you know, I'mlooking for cayenne for my heart
(51:24):
or niacin, you know, for my uh,you know, to look at my blood
lipids and stuff like that.
That's great.
Doctor told you to come in andtake niacin.
Boom, here you go.
Niacin helps with blood lipidsand lipoprotein A and you know,
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Have you heard of K2?
Right.
No, my doctor didn't mentionK2.
Go home and do some research onMenic7K2 and the importance of
(51:47):
that for your heart and for yourbones.
Okay, here's your niacin.
Okay, go see ya, love you, bye.
See you next week.
You know what's gonna happen,Tina?
They're gonna come in nextweek, and they're gonna be like,
hey, Tina, you told me aboutthat thing.
It's I don't know, it had a Mand a K in it.
Oh, Menic 7K2?
Yeah.
I went home and I did theresearch and I saw on the
(52:08):
website that it can really helpwith you know getting the camp,
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,blah.
And I'm probably deficient init.
Yeah, come over here.
I got it right over here.
Speaker 2 (52:15):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (52:15):
Now you're an expert.
That's the difference.
Um, and what's great is youknow, the biggest challenge
right now with consumers, Tina,is that they're they're face
this is a big problem forretailers.
So listen up is pill fatigue.
Tina Maddock (52:31):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (52:32):
There's the consumers, I've we've done
analysis on it.
It's one of the top sixcomplaints, not complaints, but
just concerns in regards totaking dietary supplements, is
the fear of taking too manypills.
Um, and that's why to yourpoint, Tina, true grace, our
multi, our whole tagline andformulation philosophy, getting
back to point two of whatretailers should ask brands,
(52:55):
what is your formulationphilosophy?
Ours is meaningful ingredientsat effective doses.
So your consumer doesn't haveto worry about taking too many
pills.
We're the only whole food-basedmulti using Menicue 7K2 at 60
micrograms.
So now there's more valuethere, and they don't have to
take as many pills.
Tina Maddock (53:12):
Right.
Brian Hall (53:13):
But you need education to get that across,
right?
So yeah.
Tina Maddock (53:21):
So many good things.
We could talk for a very longtime, I think.
Brian Hall (53:25):
We could.
We should do another one.
Tina Maddock (53:27):
Happy to do it.
We'll definitely have you onagain.
This has been great.
Um, anything that you wouldlove to leave the listeners
with, and of course, I want youto talk about how to get in
touch with you and your team forbringing you in or talking to
you about products that maybethey don't have yet.
But anything else you want toleave the independent retailers
(53:48):
with last thoughts about?
Brian Hall (53:50):
Um Yeah, no, I mean, I think I love you guys.
I mean, I sincerely do.
True grace, my wife, Christy.
Uh, we love you guys.
We love your mission.
Um, you're our friends, you'reour family.
We share pictures, you know, alot of the retailers, you know,
that I go across.
It's it's just it's so muchjoy, you know.
Um, Tina, it's like we go tothe retailers and Christy and I,
(54:14):
and it's it's like, you know,we're we're sitting at dinner
tables and you know, we're outat their farm.
And I mean, that's that's whatwe enjoy, that's what we love.
That's what that's why westarted this company.
We didn't start this companybecause of money, or we, you
know, it was it was a differentmission.
Um, and we're here for you.
And you know, and one thing Iwould ask maybe Tina is that
just share the message, youknow, if you're if you're if you
(54:36):
have true grace, you know,because we're only in 25, 30
percent of stores.
That's it.
You know, um, share share themessage with a friend and say,
hey, you know, we got this truegrace and they're really, you
know, doing this for us and thatfor us, and give us a plug.
That's that's what we need, youknow, to keep the mission
moving.
Tina Maddock (54:55):
Yeah, that's great.
And um just while you weretalking about their friends and
everything, uh just being atSoho myself, I can't tell you
how many retailers came up tohug my neck.
That's how much of a family itfeels like.
So and if you haven't been toSoho to experience that,
definitely go because it doesfeel it's such a small,
(55:20):
connected network that everyoneis so friendly and welcoming and
excited to see each other.
And I think, oh man, learningfrom other retailers is um one
of the best things that aretailer can do because they've
they've been through the sameexperiences that you've been
(55:40):
through, and having them haveconversation with you and be
like, oh, well, when I saw that,I did this, or these are the
people I use for this perfectplace to get to the right
manufacturers, to the right umeven employees.
They they can help you withjust about any problem.
Brian Hall (56:00):
Yeah, and it's it's it's your industry, guys.
Yeah, you know, I mean this isit's your you dictate where this
industry grows, you know, goes.
You dictate what brands do.
You dictate, you know, you havethe power, you know.
True Grace, we don't have it.
We have none.
You guys have it all.
We rely on you.
Um that's what that's thefriends and the family, and
(56:21):
that's the support, and that'sthat network, you know.
Um, and and ask thesequestions, dive deep, you know,
understand who these brands are,and let's get back to the roots
of our industry, which was uheducation, which is soul, which
is purpose, which is passion,which is integrity, which is you
know, all of those things thatthis industry was built on.
Tina Maddock (56:43):
That's awesome.
Thank you so much for beingpart of the podcast.
And for everyone else that'slistening today, thank you for
spending your time with us.
And we will see you on the nextepisode.
Brian Hall (56:54):
Awesome.
Thanks, Tina.
Take care, everyone.
Tina Maddock (56:56):
Thank you so much for joining us for the latest
episode of the Natural ProductsMarketer Podcast, where we're
here to help you grow yourbusiness so you can serve more
people and change more lives.
If you have any questions thathave come up during this episode
or others, or there's just aretail challenge that you're
facing today, I would love foryou to reach out to us at info
(57:18):
at naturalproductsmarketer.com.
We're here to answer questions.
But most of all, if you have aquestion, then another retailer
probably also has that question.
So we can bring experts ontothe podcast to give you the
information that you reallyneed.
And if you liked what youheard, give us a thumbs up or
give us a review on uh YouTube,Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or
(57:43):
wherever you're listening today.
All right, it was great to seeyou.
Welcome to the Natural Products Marketer
Podcast.
I'm your host, Tina Mattock.
On this podcast, you'll hearfrom manufacturers, retail
owners and operators, and otherbusiness experts that will help
you grow your business so youcan serve more people and change
more lives.
I really wanted to talk to youbecause you were in you went to
(00:20):
Soho.
Brian Hall (00:21):
I did go to Soho.
Tina Maddock (00:23):
You were the speaker at Soho.
Brian Hall (00:26):
I yeah, it was it was fantastic.
It was uh it was an honor, youknow.
Um, I think Ryan called me andI did a a talk at uh one of his
stores in Florida.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (00:34):
Um and he called and said, Hey, you know, you were
did great, and I think you'd bea good speaker, and I was I was
honored.
So got down there and uh didthe breakfast event, I think, on
Friday, um, to kind of kick offthe show, which was uh super
exciting.
And we had a full room.
Tina Maddock (00:50):
So yeah, tell me, um, I I heard a lot of great
things from retailers whoattended the talk.
Um, so tell me a little bitabout what you felt in the room,
what kind of questions you gotfrom people while you after you
presented, and just tell me alittle bit about what was going
on there.
Brian Hall (01:10):
Yeah, I think you know, the title of the talk
really was getting back to theroots of our industry, you know,
Tina.
So I mean, I think I've been inthe industry since I was a kid,
you know, 15 years old.
Um, and so that that's datingme.
I can't even do the mathanymore at my age.
I think it's like 36 years.
Um, and so I was kind oftelling that story and sitting
down and really getting into thesoul, into the heart, uh, and
(01:33):
the roots of the industry andwhat this industry was built on,
which was uh, you know,education and you know, like you
said, passion.
And, you know, I ask theaudience, and I do this all the
time.
I travel around and I visithundreds of health food stores
uh, you know, a quarter as Itravel across the country.
And I always sit down with theowners and the buyers and they
(01:53):
say, Hey, what are yourchallenges?
What are you looking for?
You know, what you know in yourbusiness?
And you know, those challengesthey were echoed in that
segment.
Uh, you know, they were thechallenges of uh, you know, the
the all the changes that haveoccurred with, you know, the POS
and the systems and the datamanagement and you know, and
(02:14):
then also you know, you have awhole new level of marketing and
advertising to try and bringnew customers in the door.
And you have a lot of thebrands that have been so loyal
to the industry uh for manyyears, you know, that they're
they're have been purchased,they've been sold, they've been,
you know, and their pathschanged, and they're going into
(02:35):
a lot of the you know massmarket stores and stuff like
that.
And so independent retailersreally need to be at the on the
top of their game uh to be ableto compete.
And you know, there's one areawhere they can compete and win,
and that's on being involved inthe community and winning an
education.
And that's what I took from it,Tina.
Tina Maddock (02:57):
Yeah, I mean, we hear that so much.
Like people continue to go tothe independent retail stores
because they can getrecommendations, they can get
educated on what is the thingthat I am about to take and
where's its source.
Like part of that to me, too,their differentiation is picking
the right products to be on theshelves so that it's something
(03:21):
that consumers can trust thatthe label is what it says it is,
and that there aren't anycontaminants, heavy metals,
those sorts of things that arein the product.
And I think the independentretailers have become the
gatekeeper of um products thatare worth spending money on
(03:43):
because they have efficacy forall the reasons that I just
talked about.
Brian Hall (03:47):
100%.
And you know, I and I Iannounced in the room there too,
I said True Race is starting anew campaign in 2026.
Really, it's multifaceted, butyou know, the main campaign is
gonna be it's gonna be read thelabel, Tina.
Tina Maddock (04:03):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Brian Hall (04:05):
I mean, you think about this, I mean, independent
retailers they're bombardedwith, you know, I talk uh do a
lot of Teams calls and I talk tosome category managers and I
looked, you know, behind theirtheir desk and their shelf,
Tina, and there's like 250products.
But that's where you know yousee the uh the retailers, they
look in the back and they'regetting so inundated with
(04:25):
products.
And a lot of times they're justlooking at like the front of
the pack or the fancy marketingand you know, a lot of these
things, and they're not actuallyturning over and diving into
and looking at the ingredientsand the efficacy.
And are they using clinicallystudied ingredients?
You know, that's another thingthat you know at True Grace, our
(04:49):
tagline is meaningfulingredients at affected doses,
and we focus a lot on clinicallystudied ingredients.
Um and you know, a lot ofretailers, you know, they they
either either don't dive in tothat and see it.
Um, and you know, it's all youknow, kind of the marketing and
you know, and we're trying toremind them that.
(05:09):
And then the other thing, thethe other part of that campaign
in 2026 is we're redefining oneducation.
So our our whole theme at TrueGrace is excellence in
education.
And as CEO, I'm putting thatthrough my whole company that I
want excellence in educationcoming from True Grace.
I want to be the source whereretailers can um look to, you
(05:33):
know, for something that's uh,you know, for for their staff to
be able to educate themselveson on all these clinically
studied ingredients andinnovations and different things
like that.
So we're gonna be ramping up in26 for the independent
retailers and coming out with aplatform that they can uh use
themselves and their associatesand new hires and all that
stuff.
So we're gonna double downwhere the industry's void is.
Tina Maddock (05:56):
Yeah, thank you for doing that and saying that
because here's um something thatwe've found too that the
retailers will be very honestabout it.
The products that their floorpeople are trained on are the
ones that get sold.
So the fact that you guys areinvesting in this just means
(06:18):
that's gonna be better for theretailer, the consumer, and for
you because that's the productpeople are gonna focus on.
Um, and so I love that you guysare doing that.
And one other thing that sortof came up for me while you were
just talking was um read thelabel is great.
And can you trust the label isa whole other question.
(06:42):
And I think it's a big onebecause you know, Amazon will
let anyone sell anything on thatplatform.
And again, reading the label, Ithink is the beginning.
The second thing is do youtrust the manufacturer?
Are there third-party teststhat are going into this?
How do we know that we'regiving our consumers good
(07:05):
products?
And I think you guys do a lotto help people understand like
we are giving you what's in whatis on that label in that
package.
Brian Hall (07:15):
Yeah.
And I talked about that in our,you know, and I I'm I'm honest
with the retailers.
I talked to the retailers aboutone of our products, our
probiotic.
You know, we're the onlyprobiotic, Tina, I believe in
North America.
You can fact check that for me,but we're the only probiotic in
North America carrying athird-party seal from Purity IQ,
an independent testing lab inuh Guelph, Ontario.
(07:38):
Check them out.
Your listeners got to checkthem out.
They're amazing.
They do, they do mushrooms,they do probiotics, they do DNA
identity, all this stuff.
But they actually can test andhave tested our probiotic every
batch, every lot.
You know, so I pay around$6,000 per lot, right, to have
this test and that seal on mybottle.
And, you know, what it says isthat, hey, we've done the test.
(08:00):
Not only are these specificstrains that are clinically
studied, you know, andreferenced on PubMed, not only
are they in there, but they'rein there at the amount they say
they're in there.
And we actually got a letterfrom them saying that, hey,
congratulations over the lastthree years, you've had like, I
don't know how many lots it was,six, seven, eight lots, where
(08:21):
every lot, Tina, had a 99%, or Ithink it was 98.7%
batch-to-batch consistency,meaning every capsule in every
lot over three years was on thatlabel claim.
Tina Maddock (08:37):
That's saying a lot.
And you know, we are gonnainterview them on the podcast.
We've scheduled.
Well, you are.
Yeah, yeah.
Brian Hall (08:42):
Oh, awesome.
Tina Maddock (08:43):
Yeah, I'm Dilio.
Brian Hall (08:44):
Are you gonna email you're gonna talk to Dilio?
Tina Maddock (08:46):
Yes.
Brian Hall (08:47):
Awesome.
I love her.
She's great.
She's dear friend of mine.
Tina Maddock (08:50):
Yeah, she's great.
And I can't wait to have her onthe podcast.
She's coming up soon.
Um, so that'll be great for allthe listeners to hear.
But um, I think, you know,sometimes um the retailers talk
about price and that it'sdifficult for them to maintain
margin and have the consumer paya certain price level.
(09:11):
Some of the things that you'retalking about, you're spending
extra money getting that proofthat what is on the label is in
the package.
And I think the consumer can beeducated around that, that
there's extra value there andthat people don't have to worry
as much about squishing theirmargins down to be more
competitive with another brandthat's more affordable, but
(09:33):
doesn't have all of the processin it that a brand like yours
has.
Brian Hall (09:38):
And that's third-party testing.
And you know, another thingthat we do, we use a company
called Alchemist Labs out ofSouthern California, and they're
testing all of our, you know,our mushrooms and they're
testing our fish oil to makesure that it has the level of
VPA and DHR.
And we actually put those logoson our bottle.
And here's where you have to becareful, Tina, is because now I
knowing this now as a as anowner of a company, and I'm
(10:00):
involved in all the you knowregulatory and formulations and
and all that stuff.
And you know, I see somecompanies go out there and it's
it says on the the front of thelabel or the side or the back,
whatever, wherever it's a thirdparty tested.
And that's all it says.
It's like, what am I supposedto trust you?
I mean, like, well, you I couldthere's no regulatory around
(10:24):
that.
I can say that it's third-partytested.
How many times is it the thirdparty tested?
Is it every lot?
What are you testing for?
You know, and the retailersneed to ask these questions,
right?
Ask me.
I want you to ask me.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Right.
Brian Hall (10:36):
Because be if you're asking me, that means that you
care about it.
And if you care about it, itmay not have the answer that
day, but I'm gonna go back andI'm gonna get you what you need.
You know, and and I had a I hada call yesterday.
You mentioned price.
It's so funny.
I had a call with a retaileryesterday, and she calls and
she's like, Well, you know, wereally love your maltis, but you
know, you're more expensivethan you know, this other whole
(11:00):
food-based brand.
And, you know, you're moreexpensive than this other whole
food-based brand.
And you're more and I I was I Iovercame the objection in 30
seconds.
It wasn't a big deal.
But here's here's here's what Iwant to.
I I came up with an analogylast night.
I was sitting on the couch, Iwas thinking about that
conversation.
But do you, Tina, do you havean iPhone?
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (11:20):
You do?
Okay.
Most people probably dolistening to this, right?
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Yep.
Brian Hall (11:26):
iPhones, the new iPhone just came out, iPhone 17.
What is that thing, Tina?
But 13, 14, 1500 bucks?
Tina Maddock (11:33):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (11:33):
We don't bat an eye.
Tina Maddock (11:35):
Oh, right.
Brian Hall (11:36):
We don't bat an eye.
Hey, I want the iPhone 17.
I'm gonna stand in line fornine hours to pay $1,300 for a
phone.
Okay?
Now, Tina.
They still sell flip phonesthat you can get.
Tina Maddock (11:52):
I did not know that.
Brian Hall (11:53):
They still, yeah, you can go into Verizon ATT and
they still sell the you know thelittle phones.
You can get them for $79.
Now, Tina, they both callpeople.
They both text people.
But what would you think appwhen somebody comes and says,
Oh, I can't sell your iPhonebecause this you know phone over
(12:18):
here is $79.99.
Tina Maddock (12:20):
Yeah, no.
Brian Hall (12:22):
That's the difference, guys, between True
Grace and a lot of the otherwhole food-based multis out
there.
You can't compare.
unknown (12:31):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (12:31):
You know, you when you when you pull them off the
shelf and they're you know$23.99 and ours is $29.99, we're
there's no Menic7, clinicallystudied Menic 7 K2 at an
efficacy efficacious dose of 60micrograms.
They have none.
We have 60 micrograms.
(12:52):
You know, um, we're at at TrueGrace, we're using things like
clinically studied ergoactiveergothionine.
That'll that product alonesells for 30 bucks a month, just
if you were to buy fivemilligrams of it.
You get where I'm going, Tina?
It's like you can't just comedown to price.
You have to look at value.
Um, and so that's where we'retrying to tell people.
(13:14):
You know, we're using fruitingbody mushrooms that are
third-party tested by AlchemistLabs.
We're using Menic 7K2, we'reusing, you know, fermented
glycoprotein-bound nutrients.
These are all extra steps andmeasures that we take that bring
the quality up.
Tina Maddock (13:30):
Yeah, I mean, and part of this is educating the
consumer, but I also think theconsumer's more educated than
they used to be because TikTokand whatever, and there's plenty
of misinformation out there,but they have some knowledge
around some of these things thatyou're talking about.
So just highlighting them mightbe enough for many people to
(13:54):
say, okay, this is worth itbecause it has these items in
it.
I mean, when you start talkingabout fermented um those
ingredients are important in theconversation around
paramenopause, which is blowingup online right now.
And so just highlighting thatingredient alone might be enough
(14:18):
to be like, oh, this is the oneif I'm a woman that I would
want to take over another brand.
So I do think sometimes it'sjust highlighting the
difference.
And we've talked about thingsthat really work comparison
charts, um, this versus otherbrands.
Um, and then also being able tohave educated conversations
(14:42):
with a consumer about this.
So again, we go back to thenthe team on the floor needs to
be educated about all of thesethings as well.
Brian Hall (14:52):
Yeah, and I think, you know, the team on the floor,
and that's key.
And you know, here's theproblem is you got, you know,
some of these brands out therethat are owned by, you know, the
big, you know, you know whothey are.
Your listeners know, you know.
I don't have to reiterate, Idon't want to do that.
But they, you know, people comein into the store and be like,
oh, do you have this, you know,whole food-based multivitamin?
(15:13):
You know, and then what we doas retailers is we what we do,
we take them over the shelf, wesay, here it is, and then we
walk away.
And you know, what we need totrain the staff to do is when
they come in and they say, I'mlooking for XYZ brand.
Oh, it's a great brand.
What made you interested in it?
Oh, I saw it on TikTok.
(15:34):
Oh, you saw it on TikTok.
Okay, great.
Um, it's a great brand, youknow, but some of the things in
that that they're missing inhere are things like you know,
the Manicue 7K2, and uh, youknow, it's not non-GMO or it's
you know not fermented, youknow, all of those things, those
highlights that we can engagethe staff at the floor level to
(15:54):
say, oh, and then the you know99% of the time, Tina, the
people are gonna be like, Oh,I'll take that brand.
Is that what you take?
Tina Maddock (16:02):
Yeah.
You know, and they walk out.
We talk a lot about howimportant it is for the floor
team to start the conversationwith what brought you in today?
You know, just a simpleopen-ended question like that,
it might still elicit the sameanswer of, I'm looking for this
brand.
(16:22):
But actually, when you startthe conversation with what
brought you in today, or did youcome in to solve something
specific?
Are you looking to reach aspecific goal?
When you when you sort of um dothose questions a little bit
differently at the very start ofthe conversation, then you
become collaborative and helpingthem solve a problem versus I
(16:45):
want a brand, I want this item,which can also happen.
You can still point them inthat same direction, but then
you've got a bunch of resourcesyou can point them to in the
store, which leads to betterservice for them because they're
trying to solve a problem, andhigher um baskets for you,
because hey, you're not just youdon't just need a multivitamin,
(17:09):
you're actually looking forsomething specific related to
what, because you're trying tosolve a problem.
And then, oh, well, that'sgreat.
And do you know this makes iteven better when you pair these
two things together?
You start having really goodconversations that lead the
consumer to get what they needinstead of just what they came
(17:29):
in the store thinking that theyneeded.
Brian Hall (17:32):
A hundred percent.
You know, um, and that's uhthat's the education, that's the
excellence in education thatwe're gonna be striving for.
And then, you know, you'relooking at some brands too,
where you know, they'll come inand they'll ask for a specific
brand or they see it on socialmedia and they see you know
these other things.
I had a retailer the other day,you know, uh, we have an
electrolyte product and uh I usethat.
Oh, you do?
(17:52):
Oh, awesome.
Electromag, yeah, it's amazing.
Tina Maddock (17:55):
Great fruit is my favorite.
Brian Hall (17:57):
Awesome.
And then we just launched PinkLemonade, you know, so it's
coming out uh here shortly too.
But you know, what'sinteresting with that is you
know, we launched this view,it's skyrocketing in sales.
I mean, it's it's everywhereselling, it's just like top,
top, top.
Um, you know, but there's somecompetition out there, and
there's some you know, bigcompetition out there, and
there's a lot of mass markettype competition um, you know,
(18:21):
in that realm.
And you know, you look at itand you know, it's the
retailers.
I don't know.
I mean, there's you have someof the things where there was
some media uh centered aroundexactly what you said, which you
guys, you know, your listenerscan look this stuff up, but is
what's in there, is is what's inthere, what they're saying is
in there.
(18:41):
Is there other things in there?
Is there testing, you know, umall of those things?
And it's been brought out, youknow, that it's not.
And you know, the other thingthen is like it's not non-GMO.
And I'm not gonna mention thebrand's name, but it's not
non-GMO.
It's not using organic naturalflavors.
Um, it's you know, in Targetfor, and you know, you can get
(19:04):
an eight-pack in Target for ninebucks.
And it's like, what do we whatdo Tina, you tell me what do
independent retailers want?
Do they want us to take all ofour money and put it into
TikTok?
Or you guys have standards thatyou want us to meet, which is
non-GMO, which is organic, whichis you know, um, no other
(19:27):
filler ingredients in anelectrolyte product, um, and you
don't want us en masse, thenwhat do we have to do else,
Tina, to get independentretailers to double down on
Electromag or True Grace?
And I'm using that as a wholeindustry standard because
there's other great brands outthere too that are doing what
(19:48):
we're doing.
Yeah, you know, what is itgonna take?
There's another big brand,whole food-based brand, that
just launched into you know amassive retailer um across the
country, and if they'readvertising it on their social
media like crazy.
Um, and it's it's convenience,Tina.
The customers are going tothose stores every day.
And if they see it there, whydo I have to make the extra trip
(20:12):
to the independent health foodstore?
Here it is, right here, andit's half the price.
It's like what do we what do wedo?
Tina Maddock (20:19):
Yeah, well, I mean, a couple of things um that
I think about that.
I don't think that independentsare talking enough about things
like that non-GMO organic.
Um, and and this is across theboard in different products.
I mean, essential oils, anumber of products you can
really highlight that on.
(20:40):
And if you think aboutsomething like um the
electrolyte category, that'stypically for people who are
very in tune with I'm I want toput the best in my body because
I want high performance, or I'mtrying to solve a health issue.
So I'm trying to put clean,good products in my body.
(21:04):
And again, I'm just saying likehighlighting or a simple
comparison chart goes a long wayhaving that on your website,
having it like hanging on ashelf so that people can take a
look.
And it doesn't need to call outa different brand, it can just
say other brands, you know, thisbrand versus other brands.
Brian Hall (21:25):
Leading, yeah, leading brand A, leading brand
B.
You know, you can drawconclusions.
Tina Maddock (21:30):
You don't have to point fingers, it can be really
easy, but but the people thatare buying that specific
product, other sports nutritioncategories, um, they they care
about that being pure organicand that they're getting in
their body because they'retrying to do something for
performance or some sort ofhealth issue.
(21:51):
So I think you know, justhighlighting things like that is
a big deal.
And exactly.
And yeah, and people areconstantly also like, what do I
put on social media?
There you go.
Super easy.
They're always like, What's thecontent?
What do we do?
Super easy to highlight branddifferences.
And I I think it it's also adifferentiator for stores when
(22:14):
they start to say, This is whywe carry brands, you can start
to trust the store more thatthey're only gonna bring you
what it has some efficacy aroundit for the health goals that
people are trying to solve.
I think that's when you win andpull people into the store,
even though they've got to buysome other essentials in a depth
(22:35):
in another place.
Um, but one of the things thatwe're talking about right now is
highlighting essentials thatyou do have.
I mean, many of the storescarry toilet paper or coffee or
something else that people buyevery day and they are buying it
somewhere.
Why not be buying it from youbecause they're loyal, you're
(22:56):
local, you're in theircommunity.
This does get back to that.
If you're not in the community,then it's harder to make that
pull in for a system.
Brian Hall (23:05):
100%.
100%.
Tina Maddock (23:07):
But getting in the community, if you're seen
regularly as contributing tothat community, man, you're
gonna pull people over forsimple things.
Brian Hall (23:16):
Absolutely.
And that's you know, that'swhat's key is uh, you know, and
it's interesting you talk aboutquality and some of those things
in non-GMO.
Like that's what this industrywas built out.
You know, I was at Infra, theshow um, you know, a couple
months ago, and you know, theywere they brought up those kind
of pioneers on stage of thenon-GMO movement.
And you know, these are thethat that was the that's what
(23:37):
the industry was built on, yeah,you know, is these types of
pioneers and thought leaders andmissionaries and you know
making change and standing trueto their values when when when
they were up against it.
And look at what happened 10,15, 20 years later, Tina.
I mean, that's the root ofthat's the root of the industry,
and that's what I want to getback to.
(23:59):
Um, and it's interestingbecause I went out to, I was uh
formulating this electrolyteproduct, Electramag, and I and I
went out to this uh pretty goodsized chain in California, um,
and their quality standards arelike I mean, in the independents
have high quality standards.
But this one, Tina, I was like,you mean I gotta do what to get
(24:23):
a product in here?
And you know, I had to sendthem every bit of certificate of
analysis of documentation ofnot just the final product,
Tina, but every ingredient inthe product, where it was
sourced, what processing aidswent into making every single
one of those ingredients,because they had a list a mile
(24:46):
long of banned substances andagain things in their in their
store.
And I I said, okay.
And I took it back and I wentto my contract manufacturer.
I said, Boom, here, can you dothis?
Yeah, yeah, we can do this, butit's gonna, yeah, you're gonna
pay more, it's gonna cost you.
Yeah, your cogs are gonna be alittle bit higher, you know.
And I'm like, okay.
(25:07):
And so we did it, we wedelivered, and it's now the
number one selling electrolytein that chain.
And you know, you look at thatand you you we have to know and
ask the questions.
There's a couple, you know, newbrands that just launched,
Tina, right?
You know, in the in the spaceand the whole food realm and
stuff like that.
And we don't even know who theowner is.
(25:28):
Like who's behind the company?
Ask those questions.
Who's the owner?
You know, when somebody comesin and I talk to independent
retailers all the time, youknow, um, and it's like, you
know, Bruce and you know, um,Ryan and Brian and all these,
you know, the retailers inFlorida, and you know, Joe Nolan
and Good Harvest and Jimbo andyou know, um, all these stores
(25:50):
across the country.
I have their cell phones andthe personal relationships.
It's like, who owns True Grace?
Christy Hall.
Oh, I know her husband, Brian.
I got a cell right here.
You got a question?
You don't get that with anyoneelse.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (26:03):
Um, and and that's one of the key things.
And a funny story with thesecontract manufacturers, with
knowing that and asking thosequestions, because a lot of
these companies use contractmanufacturers for their product,
right?
Ask who they are, you know, andin true transparency.
And I was I was uh actuallyhave never been fired in my
(26:24):
career, Tina.
I've never had the feeling ofbeing fired, uh you know, thank
goodness.
But I was fired nine monthsago.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
Uh-oh.
Brian Hall (26:32):
Yeah, I was fired.
So we had this contractmanufacturer that we were doing
some work with, and we werealways having problems.
Always having problems withthem.
And I got the phone call oneday.
And you know what they said,Tina?
They said, you know what?
True gray standards, yourquality standards are just too
(26:54):
high for us to meet.
So we can't do business withyou anymore.
And I was like, excuse me?
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (27:06):
Our quality standards are too high that
you're firing us?
I got fired nine months ago.
Um and we since moved on andand partnered with some um
bigger and uh you know strongerand button-up supply chain and
contract manufacturers in someareas where uh I I I apply.
(27:28):
I had the FDA come in here,Tina, like a year ago.
I gotta tell you that story.
Yeah, it was hilarious.
Okay, so um I had the FDA comein.
I'm I'm sitting at this desk,Tina.
Okay, it's my beautiful officehere in Pewkey.
I don't know if people, if thisis video, people can see it or
if it's just audio, but youknow, I'm out in Lake Country in
Wisconsin, beautiful area, andthree black SUVs pull up, Tina.
(27:52):
Right by my window here.
Tina Maddock (27:55):
And I'm like from a movie that doesn't like the
real FDA would come lookingback.
Brian Hall (28:02):
I know.
I'm like, what the heck?
And I I'm like, that's weird.
Three black SUVs, and they pullin the parking lot, and then
I'm sitting here and my my dooris right there.
Honest to God, Tina.
They walk in, they don't knock.
They walk in, hold up, theywe're here for a surprise, uh
surprise audit.
And I was like, awesome.
(28:26):
I did.
I said, this is my I wasn'tnervous.
I said, this is my time toshine.
I've been waiting for thismoment for three years, Tina.
And they came in and they sat,came in into my office here.
I got our uh COO and ourdirector of RD and Education
Regulatory all on the Zoom rightaway.
I knew exactly what to do.
Opened up the filing cabinets,you know, have at it.
(28:48):
And they sat here, Tina, fromeight o'clock in the morning on
a Tuesday till five o'clockTuesday night.
We're back on Wednesday ateight o'clock in the morning
till five o'clock Tuesday night,and then Thursday they were
back at eight in the morninguntil one thirty.
Eight hours.
I had to order lunch in, I hadto sit in a chair.
(29:09):
They went through everything.
You know, oh you're sayingthird-party tested purity IQ.
How did you can you verify eachlot and batch and pull up this?
They went through everything.
And at the end, you know, I'msat there and they close the
books and the blah blah blah.
(29:30):
And um I said, so what's thewhat's the thing here?
And they're like, Well, you'vegot a letter in the mail.
You know, blah, blah, blah,blah, blah.
And then, you know, becausethey see if you have citations
or any of that.
Tina, she says to me, she says,I just want to w let you know.
I've been doing this for threeyears.
I've been with the FDA for Xamount of years, I've been doing
(29:52):
this for, you know, three yearsin this space.
I wish every company was asbuttoned up as True Brace.
Tina Maddock (30:00):
Oh nice, yeah.
Brian Hall (30:01):
She she closed her book.
She left.
Zero citations, Tina.
That's what you want as anindependent retailer.
Right?
And that's the that but thattakes that takes money.
And that takes a lot ofexpenses with the testing and
the quality and the regulatory.
And you know, you can't trustany of these contract
(30:22):
manufacturers.
You can't trust them.
You got to verify, trust butverify.
And that's what we do because Iwant the independent retailer,
if you're listening, when youput a bottle of true grace in
someone's hand, that's yourreputation.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
Mm-hmm.
Brian Hall (30:36):
At the core of it.
Right?
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (30:40):
And I I've been in this industry for 36 years.
I love this industry.
I love the independentretailers.
I'll do ever anything I can tosupport them at True Grace and
to be that brand that they cantrust.
Tina Maddock (30:54):
Yeah.
So here's uh something I thinkcould be useful for the
listeners.
If they're an independentretailer, before they bring a
brand in their store or talk tothe ones they already have, what
are five or ten things theyshould be asking every
manufacturer?
Brian Hall (31:12):
I think number one is, you know, like uh who's
who's behind the brand?
You know, who's the owner?
That's one of the biggestthings.
What are the values?
What are the mission?
What's the values in themission and the guiding
principles and the formulation?
That's probably the first thingI would ask is who's behind it?
And what are theirformulations, philosophies?
(31:34):
What is their mission?
What is their guidingprinciple?
Because the first thing I woulddo as a business owner if I
owned an independent health foodstore is I would want to align
with partners that share myvalues and mission.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (31:45):
Right?
And we forget to do that.
You know, if I had somebodycome and say, Tell me, Jim, how
does your brand align with mymission and values?
Okay, good.
Boom.
It checks that box.
Great.
Uh, you know, and then the nextthing is the formulation
philosophy, like I talk about.
You know, and then diving intoyou know what is your
(32:07):
omnichannel strategy, is a bigone, right?
Um, and you know, because a lotof brands, you know, are
focused solely on this is whathappens.
I know this all too well.
Okay, you have to be careful asan independent retailer because
a lot of these brands have beenD2C, direct-to-consumer.
(32:27):
They put a ton of money intothe TikTok and into the
Instagram, and you know, timeand time again, they spend, I
was talking to somebodyyesterday with this one brand
where they were spending amillion dollars a month on meta
advertising.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (32:43):
A million a month.
And they you know, they had athree ROS, four ROS.
I mean, they were pretty it wasa printing press of money,
right?
Um, but you know what the valueof the company was?
Nothing.
unknown (32:57):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (32:57):
Because they didn't have a retail presence.
And these companies that wantto come in and buy companies and
you know, look at all thesedifferent things or invest in
companies, they want a brandthat has a, you know, that
that's well balanced and has ayou know fair pricing strategy
and all of those things acrossthe board.
Um, and so I would ask thatquestion, you know, what is your
(33:19):
omni straddle chat strategy?
Are you trying to because thena lot of these brands now they
go into the retailers and say,oh, we need to get into the
retailers.
We need, you know, because thisis you know, to do this, we
need to do that, you know, kindof thing.
We didn't do that at TrueGrace.
You know, like our omnichannel,our our foundation is brick and
mortar, is health food stores,because we're on a mission to
(33:42):
support, we're proud supportersof regenerative agriculture, you
know, and there's a lot ofthings that we do to support
regenerative agriculture outsideof True Grace that your
listeners could take a deep diveon and take a look at.
You know, my wife's uh familyfoundation sponsored the white
paper at Rodale Institute tocreate the standard for
regenerative agriculture.
You know, there's a lot ofthings that we've done there
(34:02):
behind the scenes to do that.
But the regenerativeagriculture movement and a lot
of the non-GMO movement, a lotof these movements, those were
changed by pioneers in theindustry that were feet on the
health food store, independenthealth food store floor.
And that's what we want tosupport at True Grace.
And that's why we have, youknow, we offer the same pricing
(34:24):
strategy across all.
And I was talking to a retaileryesterday in Ohio, and she
said, Oh, I'm priced at this.
And I'm like, that's great.
You're priced below our Amazonprice.
That's what I want.
You know, I want somebody tocome in and say, Oh, you know,
Tina, this is more expensive onAmazon.
Can I please buy it at yourstore, Tina?
Tina Maddock (34:44):
Yeah.
And people are looking up.
So I, you know, I used to hearthis from retailers um that
people would come in and theywould Amazon shop while they're
in the store to see if that samebrand is on there in the
pricing.
And I was like, I don't know.
I I don't know, but I saw it ina store the other day,
(35:05):
electrolytes specifically.
They were going online to lookand they were like, uh, it's
it's cheaper here.
Let's just get this.
And I was like, good job.
Brian Hall (35:17):
That's true, Grace.
I priced or you know, I pricedit on Amazon at MSRP.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (35:22):
You know, and and that's what I'm trying to tell
you know the retailers.
And I give I give retailers alot of discounts and promotions
and different things like that.
Um, and um, you know, they passit on, which is great.
I love that they do that.
Um, but you also you know thatthat promote us more because
that's it's in your store, it'sless expensive, it's not in the
(35:46):
Targets, it's not in the youknow, the Walgreens, it's not
we're we're trying to supportthis industry.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (35:52):
Um, you know, and so get behind that.
Uh, you know, so those that'sanother key thing.
And then, you know, coming backto the third-party testing,
Tina, and a lot of a lot ofcompanies won't answer it, but
you know, like who's your youknow, who's your contract
manufacturer?
Where are you making this?
You know, I had uh, you know,uh somebody the other day, it
was funny as a probioticcompany, and and oh yeah,
(36:17):
they're making it right there attheir office, and blah blah
blah.
I'm like, are you sure aboutthat?
And oh yeah, they're making itright there, and the buttons and
I'm like, you sure?
Oh yeah, and I'm like have youbeen?
(36:39):
Yeah, have you seen it withyour own eyes?
And then she's like, No.
And I'm like, you might want tofact check that.
Okay.
Um, and then when somebodycomes to me and they say, Brian,
who's your contractmanufacturer for your
probiotics?
I say Lalamont in Montreal, thesecond largest probiotic
(37:05):
manufacturer in the entireworld, who has an actual
dedicated institute, RoselleInstitute, that does studies on
their actual specific strainsthat they've developed over the
course of a hundred years thatare have over 400 studies on
them.
Do you want to go with me?
I'm going in August.
You want to come?
Tina, you want to come toMontreal and see Lalaman?
Tina Maddock (37:27):
I would love to.
Brian Hall (37:27):
Let's go.
Let's go.
Tina Maddock (37:29):
Let's do it.
Brian Hall (37:30):
Yeah.
And then, you know, if somebodysays it, so that's
transparency, Tina.
Tina Maddock (37:37):
Yeah, and I I don't understand, like, if it if
someone's not willing to answerthat, like where, who, and how.
I I don't know how you cantrust, right?
Like without without someoneanswering those questions and
being transparent about thosethings.
I don't know how you then trustthat they're doing what they're
(37:58):
saying they're doing.
Brian Hall (37:59):
Exactly.
And that, you know, and that'sthe thing.
And it happens all the timewhere um, you know, uh you just
you trust you can't trust thecontent, you can't trust them
because you gotta verify.
Yeah, and that's the third,that's where the third party
testing comes in, that's wherethe proper regulatory testing
comes in, that's where, youknow, that's why we're so
buttoned up at True Grace.
Um, and I I put that into theDNA of our company.
(38:22):
We invested heavily there upfront.
Um, and then you know, anotherso that's one thing.
And then another big thing thatuh a lot of stores, retailers,
I think miss the kind of themark on or the boat on, too, is
like, oh, well, so and so brandTina gives me 40 off every day.
Tina Maddock (38:42):
Oh, right, yeah.
Brian Hall (38:44):
And I'm sitting there and like, and I'm very
respectful, but uh, you know,I've been doing this for 36
years.
I was on the I was I led a bigcompany.
I don't know if you know, I ledthis uh company called New
Chapter with a fantastic team ofpeople.
Um, not just me.
I've taken you know hardly anycredit for it, but we had a
great team, and that companywent, you know, and skyrocketed
(39:07):
and then sold to Procter andGamble.
And you know, I worked therefor four years and you know,
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
So but which we have to becareful of, Tina, is that when
somebody's coming in and they'reoffering you 40% off every day,
they know they have to do that,so they build it into their
pricing model.
Does that make sense?
Tina Maddock (39:28):
Yeah, totally.
Um that a lot, like havinghaving a running thing like
that, then the price is notright.
Brian Hall (39:38):
Right.
And that's that's where I'mstruggling a lot.
And I need your help, Tina.
Maybe you can help me with thisand guide me in the right
direction.
Um, you know, so if if we dothe math, okay, um, Tina, let's
do the math real quick.
I have a product at True Grace,and it's six dollars.
Okay, that's my MSRP.
(40:01):
Okay, now if we take tenpercent off of six dollars,
Tina, that's sixty cents, right?
So six dollars minus sixtycents is five dollars and forty
cents.
Okay, for for widget A.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
Okay.
Brian Hall (40:20):
Now, widget B, Tina, is ten dollars MSRP.
But it's forty percent off.
Speaker 2 (40:30):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (40:32):
So now forty percent off of ten dollars is six
dollars.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Right.
Brian Hall (40:38):
Which one do you want to buy, Tina?
The one that's forty percentoff at six dollars or the one
that's ten percent off at fiveforty?
Tina Maddock (40:45):
Right, exactly.
Brian Hall (40:47):
Which one?
Tina Maddock (40:48):
The five forty.
Um the five.
Brian Hall (40:50):
You you you would think, yeah.
You would think so.
But but people don't.
People don't.
They're like, oh my god, thisis such an amazing deal.
It's 40% off at $6.
Tina Maddock (41:02):
Yeah.
Do you think there's a littlebit of um of that law of price
um setting where it's where it'slike if you level someone
thinking that the value's here,and when you're like, but I'll
give it to you for this.
And then people think they'regetting that much value when
really the thing just costs thatmuch, right?
Brian Hall (41:25):
It's unbelievable.
And I know what this stuffcosts, and you know, I'm and I'm
um, you know, kind of you know,speaking out in this industry,
and probably, you know, not themost well-like guy in the
industry, but you know, peopleTina, if somebody comes if if
somebody comes to you and says,Hey Tina, I'm gonna give this
product to you for free.
Tina Maddock (41:46):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (41:48):
And I'm gonna give it to you for 90 days, and I'm
gonna guarantee it.
And if it doesn't move, I'mgonna take it back and I'm gonna
ship it back to my warehouse.
Do you ever think like, wow,what value does that product
(42:11):
have if I have to give if if Ican give it away for free?
Right?
Like if some my probiotic, Iknow what my probiotic costs,
Tina, a bottle, and what thatpurity IQ testing per bottle is,
and you know, the fact that I'musing a patented CSP bottle
that protects it from moisturelightened oxygen, and that I'm
(42:34):
using patenteddigestive-resistant capsules and
I'm using clinically studiedstrains.
If somebody comes and asks mefor my probiotic for free, I you
know what I say, Tina?
I say, you know what?
I say, you know what, Tina,with all due respect, it doesn't
seem like our relation or or oryou know, we're aligned.
Speaker 2 (42:55):
Right.
Brian Hall (42:56):
You know, I can't give free product, I'm sorry, I
have to walk away.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (43:01):
Right?
Because we're we're conditionedas humans now at the retailers,
that it has to be free filled,that it has to be, you know,
these massive deals.
Um, and you know, I hear it allthe time.
There's another big brand outthere that, and the retailers
hate it, I know you do.
They come in and they say,okay, well, we're launching 18
new products.
We're gonna give you 40% off,and then if you don't take these
(43:25):
18 products at this discount,you're gonna lose your discount
on these other 22 products.
And then I've gone intoretailers and I've said, Hey,
you brought in all that product,it just launched last month,
and she Tina, she had it on aclearance rack for 70% off.
Yeah, the whole stack.
And I said to the lady, I said,I said, with all due respect, I
(43:48):
was like, this just launched,you just brought it in.
It just launched a month ago.
She's like, they forced me totake it.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
Oh, yeah.
Brian Hall (43:55):
Otherwise, I wouldn't get my discount on
anything else.
I didn't want it.
So as soon as it came in, Iimmediately put it on a
clearance rack.
Speaker 2 (44:03):
Oh wow.
Brian Hall (44:03):
I'm like, I said, what?
That's what we're at right now.
And here I come hat in hand.
Here I come hat in hand andbeing like, you know, hey, we'll
buy one, buy two, buy three,buy 144, Tina.
I don't care.
I'll give you the samediscount.
What am I doing wrong, Tina?
(44:25):
Tell me.
Tina Maddock (44:27):
No, I mean, look, there are strategies that you
can use for short periods oftime to do things that I think,
you know, we're all we all dotests to see like what works and
what doesn't.
But if it's consistent acrossthe board, then I do think
there's a pricing issue.
And things that we've foundbefore are when you just lower
(44:47):
the price and like this is theprice, um, you get higher volume
and higher than you would havegotten doing that old discount
strategy at higher marginsbecause you're not like pulling
discounts here to push discountsthere.
(45:07):
So you end up with a lot moremoney in the end when the consum
because the consumer is savvyaround pricing.
And so when you inflate it topull it down, then they're just
gonna wait until you pull itdown or expect that you're
always gonna offer 30%, 40%,whatever it is.
Brian Hall (45:30):
Which they are, which they are now, and that's
the new floor, you know, and andthat's where you know.
Um, I remember back in the day,you know, as a as a 16-year-old
kid working in a health foodstore in Cleveland and Ohio.
I forget what the product is itwas like, remember when shark
cartilage?
Tina Maddock (45:45):
I don't know if you oh my gosh, yes.
Brian Hall (45:48):
You remember?
unknown (45:49):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (45:50):
Shark cartilage, right?
You know, I won't go into allthe specifics on what they said
it did, but you know, there wasbooks out there, and and and
Tina, we I I was a 16-year-oldkid.
I had working in the healthfood store at the register on a
Saturday, and the guy had itstacked behind the register
because it was selling for ahundred bucks a bottle.
And this was 36 years ago.
Speaker 2 (46:11):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (46:12):
Remember?
Nobody batted an eye.
I was selling, you know, 24 aday.
Tina Maddock (46:18):
Yeah, I'm yes.
And I I I've seen otherproducts come through like that.
Um so it's very interestingthat you've been in the industry
for so long that you've seenlike trends come through.
Brian Hall (46:35):
You've seen them all.
Tina Maddock (46:36):
Yeah.
unknown (46:37):
Yeah.
Tina Maddock (46:37):
Not all.
Brian Hall (46:38):
I mean 36 years of trends.
Tina Maddock (46:40):
You've seen a while, right?
Um, of trends that are comingthrough.
So I speak to that a littlebit, the trends versus like what
actually is effective for theconsumer.
What are you seeing right now?
Brian Hall (46:58):
Oh, goodness gracious.
Um uh, yeah, I think trends,you know, you know, I spent a
lot of time in uh after I leftNew Chapter, I went to a
practitioner brand.
Um and I I went to a pretty bigone.
It was one of the top threepractitioner brands and had a
great time there, and it wasamazing.
And it was it was reallyinteresting, Tina, because I had
spent so much time on retail,and I knew I knew quite a bit.
(47:20):
You know, I was trained by somepretty powerful individuals in
formulation and herbalism andyou know stuff like that.
But I'll tell you what, Tina,when I went to this company, it
was like I was in kindergarten.
I was like, oh my goodness.
Like, and I've now these arefunctional medicine doctors and
chiropractors and you know, um,naturopathic doctors, and you
(47:44):
know, I like holy cow, I reallygotta up my game on the
education side of things, right?
Um, and you know, that's whereI learned that you know, um
there's there's trends, there'sfads, but you know, always
diving back into the clinicalresearch.
Right?
You know, for for example,Tina, okay, so like vitamin K2.
(48:07):
I said this in my talk.
I think myself that vitamin K2is the most important nutrient.
And I may get this wrong.
People please don't take myword for it here, fact-check it.
But I think they the stat islike 80 or 85% of people in the
America are deficient in K2.
I think.
(48:27):
So fact-check me, people.
Go online and take a look.
But think about that, Tina.
85% of people are deficient inK2.
K2 is essential for boneremodeling and shuttling calcium
from the arteries into thebone.
You know, it need K2 and D3 forthe immune system, K2 and D3
for osteoblasts.
You know, osteoblasts buildbone and they're K, you know, K2
(48:50):
dependent and D3 dependent andneed K2 to activate it, you
know, that whole thing.
Very important nutrient.
Okay, so retailer, do the math.
Okay, I'm gonna give you asecond, Mr.
and Mrs.
Retailer, to pull out your padand paper.
Okay.
Want you to write down rightnow how many customers a day
come through your health foodstore.
Speaker 2 (49:10):
Mm-hmm.
Brian Hall (49:12):
Okay.
Now, what I want you to do iswrite down how many bottles a
day of Menicue 7K2 you sell.
Tina Maddock (49:19):
Right.
Brian Hall (49:20):
Okay, so if you have a hundred people coming in a
day and you're not selling 85bottles a day, we're missing the
mark.
Does that make sense, Tina?
Tina Maddock (49:31):
Totally.
And we talk about things likethis all the time.
Like if you are educated, youknow that there are products
that every single person wouldfind useful and should be
taking.
And so that is easy to have aconversation with people if
you're willing to openly have aconversation about health goals
(49:54):
and they're gonna talk to youabout something, and you're
gonna say, okay, great.
And did you know also that youshould be using this product?
Here's where you can find it.
Um, and having that oneconversation, if you're helping
them solve a health goal, whatwe've seen is 80% of people will
buy the product that you'rerecommending as a partner to
(50:17):
whatever else they're they'rebuying.
Um if they don't have a healthgoal or a problem that they're
talking to you about and you'renot talking to them about the
product solving, still 20% ofpeople will buy it if you just
talk about it.
So that's always a way to helpthe consumer.
(50:38):
And and we talk about that toobecause a lot of people are
like, upsell.
I don't I can't upsell.
That seems fishy, you know,snake oil salesman kind of
thing.
And I'm like, you're notoffering them something that
they shouldn't be using, you'reactually offering them something
that every person needs.
It's really easy.
Brian Hall (50:57):
And you know, you know, the other thing I you know
talk to retailers too, it'slike you don't have to sell them
to educate them.
Tina Maddock (51:02):
Right?
Brian Hall (51:03):
You have you know, think about it it really as
planting a seed.
Okay.
So, you know, and I tell thisall the time when somebody comes
in and says, Oh, I'm lookingfor XYZ for I'm looking for
calcium for this, or you know,whatever for my bone health or
cardiovasculars, uh, runs in myfamily.
I'm looking for, you know, I'mlooking for cayenne for my heart
(51:24):
or niacin, you know, for my uh,you know, to look at my blood
lipids and stuff like that.
That's great.
Doctor told you to come in andtake niacin.
Boom, here you go.
Niacin helps with blood lipidsand lipoprotein A and you know,
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Have you heard of K2?
Right.
No, my doctor didn't mentionK2.
Go home and do some research onMenic7K2 and the importance of
(51:47):
that for your heart and for yourbones.
Okay, here's your niacin.
Okay, go see ya, love you, bye.
See you next week.
You know what's gonna happen,Tina?
They're gonna come in nextweek, and they're gonna be like,
hey, Tina, you told me aboutthat thing.
It's I don't know, it had a Mand a K in it.
Oh, Menic 7K2?
Yeah.
I went home and I did theresearch and I saw on the
(52:08):
website that it can really helpwith you know getting the camp,
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,blah.
And I'm probably deficient init.
Yeah, come over here.
I got it right over here.
Speaker 2 (52:15):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (52:15):
Now you're an expert.
That's the difference.
Um, and what's great is youknow, the biggest challenge
right now with consumers, Tina,is that they're they're face
this is a big problem forretailers.
So listen up is pill fatigue.
Tina Maddock (52:31):
Yeah.
Brian Hall (52:32):
There's the consumers, I've we've done
analysis on it.
It's one of the top sixcomplaints, not complaints, but
just concerns in regards totaking dietary supplements, is
the fear of taking too manypills.
Um, and that's why to yourpoint, Tina, true grace, our
multi, our whole tagline andformulation philosophy, getting
back to point two of whatretailers should ask brands,
(52:55):
what is your formulationphilosophy?
Ours is meaningful ingredientsat effective doses.
So your consumer doesn't haveto worry about taking too many
pills.
We're the only whole food-basedmulti using Menicue 7K2 at 60
micrograms.
So now there's more valuethere, and they don't have to
take as many pills.
Tina Maddock (53:12):
Right.
Brian Hall (53:13):
But you need education to get that across,
right?
So yeah.
Tina Maddock (53:21):
So many good things.
We could talk for a very longtime, I think.
Brian Hall (53:25):
We could.
We should do another one.
Tina Maddock (53:27):
Happy to do it.
We'll definitely have you onagain.
This has been great.
Um, anything that you wouldlove to leave the listeners
with, and of course, I want youto talk about how to get in
touch with you and your team forbringing you in or talking to
you about products that maybethey don't have yet.
But anything else you want toleave the independent retailers
(53:48):
with last thoughts about?
Brian Hall (53:50):
Um Yeah, no, I mean, I think I love you guys.
I mean, I sincerely do.
True grace, my wife, Christy.
Uh, we love you guys.
We love your mission.
Um, you're our friends, you'reour family.
We share pictures, you know, alot of the retailers, you know,
that I go across.
It's it's just it's so muchjoy, you know.
Um, Tina, it's like we go tothe retailers and Christy and I,
(54:14):
and it's it's like, you know,we're we're sitting at dinner
tables and you know, we're outat their farm.
And I mean, that's that's whatwe enjoy, that's what we love.
That's what that's why westarted this company.
We didn't start this companybecause of money, or we, you
know, it was it was a differentmission.
Um, and we're here for you.
And you know, and one thing Iwould ask maybe Tina is that
just share the message, youknow, if you're if you're if you
(54:36):
have true grace, you know,because we're only in 25, 30
percent of stores.
That's it.
You know, um, share share themessage with a friend and say,
hey, you know, we got this truegrace and they're really, you
know, doing this for us and thatfor us, and give us a plug.
That's that's what we need, youknow, to keep the mission
moving.
Tina Maddock (54:55):
Yeah, that's great.
And um just while you weretalking about their friends and
everything, uh just being atSoho myself, I can't tell you
how many retailers came up tohug my neck.
That's how much of a family itfeels like.
So and if you haven't been toSoho to experience that,
definitely go because it doesfeel it's such a small,
(55:20):
connected network that everyoneis so friendly and welcoming and
excited to see each other.
And I think, oh man, learningfrom other retailers is um one
of the best things that aretailer can do because they've
they've been through the sameexperiences that you've been
(55:40):
through, and having them haveconversation with you and be
like, oh, well, when I saw that,I did this, or these are the
people I use for this perfectplace to get to the right
manufacturers, to the right umeven employees.
They they can help you withjust about any problem.
Brian Hall (56:00):
Yeah, and it's it's it's your industry, guys.
Yeah, you know, I mean this isit's your you dictate where this
industry grows, you know, goes.
You dictate what brands do.
You dictate, you know, you havethe power, you know.
True Grace, we don't have it.
We have none.
You guys have it all.
We rely on you.
Um that's what that's thefriends and the family, and
(56:21):
that's the support, and that'sthat network, you know.
Um, and and ask thesequestions, dive deep, you know,
understand who these brands are,and let's get back to the roots
of our industry, which was uheducation, which is soul, which
is purpose, which is passion,which is integrity, which is you
know, all of those things thatthis industry was built on.
Tina Maddock (56:43):
That's awesome.
Thank you so much for beingpart of the podcast.
And for everyone else that'slistening today, thank you for
spending your time with us.
And we will see you on the nextepisode.
Brian Hall (56:54):
Awesome.
Thanks, Tina.
Take care, everyone.
Tina Maddock (56:56):
Thank you so much for joining us for the latest
episode of the Natural ProductsMarketer Podcast, where we're
here to help you grow yourbusiness so you can serve more
people and change more lives.
If you have any questions thathave come up during this episode
or others, or there's just aretail challenge that you're
facing today, I would love foryou to reach out to us at info
(57:18):
at naturalproductsmarketer.com.
We're here to answer questions.
But most of all, if you have aquestion, then another retailer
probably also has that question.
So we can bring experts ontothe podcast to give you the
information that you reallyneed.
And if you liked what youheard, give us a thumbs up or
give us a review on uh YouTube,Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or
(57:43):
wherever you're listening today.
All right, it was great to seeyou.
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