From Forbes Honors to Financial Planning: Andrew Martin's Journey

Episode Transcript
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Tim Shoop (00:05):
Hey everybody, welcome to another fantastic
show of Nerds On Tap, where youget to get nerdy with us for an
hour with me and my specialguest.
Nerds On Tap is always broughtto you by Digital Boardwalk,
america's top managed servicesprovider, and SmarterWeb, your
go-to marketing experts in theworld of digital marketing.

(00:26):
Today, on Nerds, we bring youMr Andrew Martin, founder of
Atlas Financial Strategies.
Andrew is the founder andpresident of Atlas.
Andrew has been a financialadvisor since 2011 and was
honored to be named in the top50 financial security

(00:46):
professionals in the state ofFlorida by Forbes magazine for
two consecutive years.
He has a passion for helpingclients gain clarity on their
financial plan and helping themfind creative solutions to
address their needs.
He holds a bachelor's inbusiness administration from the

(01:06):
University of South Alabama.
He is passionate about businessplanning, financial planning
and retirement planning.
Welcome to the show, andrew.
Thank you, tim.
Thanks for having me.

Andrew Martin (01:17):
Thank you, I like your suspenders.
Oh, thanks man.
I'm either professional orhomeless.

Tim Shoop (01:22):
Professor or homeless , I think.

You're a furrier, my attire is homeless.
No, no, no, that's dressing upfor me, man, I don't know why.

Tim Shoop (01:29):
I'm a T-shirt and jeans guy when you see, I think
the only time you've ever seenme.
Well, the only time you've everseen me, I've been dressed up.
Yeah, yeah, you're a shnazzy.
Yeah, man, this is my incognitomode.
So you get to.
Now you're going to spot me outin the back and go.
That's Tim over there.
That looks like the homeless.

I was going to say, when I see people out that
are used to seeing me like this,you know you can tell there's
like a second where they're likeis that?

Tim Shoop (01:54):
is that the same guy?
I dig the suspenders, I toldyou that last?
time I ran into you.
So, andrew, you know what thisshow's all about.
We're going to talk about whatyou do and how you engage with
your clients and help yourclients, but we also do
something else on this show.
It wouldn't be called Nerds onTap if we didn't have a good
beer to crank it up.

(02:14):
All right, suds, what do we got?
Ladies and gentlemen, welcometo Nerds on Tap.
I'm your host, tim Schu, and Icouldn't be more excited to
embark on this nerdy adventurewith all of you.
So grab your favorite brew,because things are about to get

(02:36):
exciting.
Three, two, one go.

Jared Shoop (02:43):
All right.
Our first beer of the day isthe Tate's Hellest German style
lager from Oyster City BrewingCompany in Appalachicola,
Florida.
A brewer describes it as atraditional lager utilizing all
German malts and hops to producemalt.
Accident, lightly hopped,golden crisp and crushable
experience for the drinker.
It's named after the localTate's Hell State Force in
Appalachicola.

(03:04):
That's real good.

Tim Shoop (03:05):
That is real good yeah.

Where's that from Appalachicola?
Appalachicola Stone's throw manright down the road.
That's very good.

Tim Shoop (03:14):
That's tasty.
I'm going to sip on that whilewe get into your background,
Andrew.
So tell me so your journey as afinancial advisor.
We talked about how you startedin 2011.
Tell me, you know.
Let's start just by talkingabout how you got into it.

(03:37):
What started this journey forMr Andrew?

Sure, I knew from an early age that I needed to
work for myself.
I just don't have the kind ofpersonality to be a good
employee.
So I knew from an early age Iwould want to work for myself,
be in control of my destiny andincome and all the things.
And so I went to college forbusiness, thinking I wanted to
own a gym.
And because you know, I can owna business and be in the gym

(04:02):
all day, that sounds great.

Tim Shoop (04:05):
Stay fit and you know , and build your future while
you do it.

Right Getting to college and start kind of
looking at the business model ofthat and kind of what it takes
to do that, and I was like Idon't think that's for me no
disrespect to the gym owners outthere but just seemed like, wow
, that's a lot of work and a lotof upfront costs there, lot of
overhead, yeah yeah.

(04:31):
And so I was lost there for alittle bit and remember taking a
personal finance course as anelective, which is a kind of
whole conversation in and ofitself that it's not a mandatory
course, that it was an elective.
I remember taking that courseand kind of immediately after a
few weeks being like, wow, allof this is super useful

(04:53):
information and will have adirect impact on the rest of my
life.
Found it terribly interestingbecause, you know it's like I,
this, you know, this will, youknow, really have an impact on
my financial health and thingslike that.
And all of this is superapplicable to, you know, the
rest of my life.
And I remember being terriblyinterested in it and kind of

(05:16):
talking to other students in theclass and you know wondering
like why is this the first timeI've ever heard this?
Why is this an elective and nota required course and all that
sort of stuff.
Everybody else kind of felt thesame way.
And then you know, you starttalking to your parents about
the things that you're learningassuming that they know those
things and kind of quickly findout like, oh y'all, y'all
weren't taught these thingseither.

Tim Shoop (05:35):
Hey, let me tell you something.
I had to help my fifth grader,my fifth grade daughter, with
math one night, and I had torelearn math the new way in one
evening and it wasn't fun.
So I can only imagine go ahead,yeah.

I talked to the parents and realized that they
never learned these thingseither, or they've had to learn
it the hard way, taught to otheradults, and kind of find it's
that's the commonality with 90plus percent of people.
And I remember thinking I wasso enthralled by it, so
interested in it, that I waslike if I could do the I didn't
really know what it looked like,but I was like if I could do

(06:15):
something like this as a careerand help educate people on these
things, like what a great wayto make a living, right To help
people with things that you know.
Unfortunately, most things costmoney and most people struggle
with money.
So like what a great way tomake a living if you can help
people with that and make aliving while doing that.

(06:36):
And then started kind of onthat journey of all right, well,
what does it look like to whatyou know?
There's different ways to getinto that industry and different
things that you could do, andkind of happened upon that and
started in that direction.
So that's why I would haveneeded to go another year to get
my finance degree and I waslike, well, I don't really need
a degree to do this.
There's all sorts of licensesyou have to pass to do you know.

(06:57):
So the degree doesn't actuallydo any good, but I started down
that path of taking more financecourses before I graduated and
things like that, but graduatedwith my business degree, I guess
with an emphasis in finance, ifyou will.
But again it is.
It's very, it's very nice to beable to make a living having an

(07:18):
impact on people's lives viatheir finances.

Tim Shoop (07:24):
So I'm thinking about that and I'm thinking about
myself, as I, you know, wasgrowing up and experiencing the
world and, you know, movingaround and figuring out my
future.
And in my 20s, investing in theworld of finance was pretty.

(07:47):
You know, it was far fetch forme because I didn't make a lot
of money.
Sure, I was homeless at onepoint, I think.
I told you that for a couplemonths and technically lived in
a tent.
And I will tell you that peoplewere telling me oh yeah, it's
your job, yeah, you shouldn't.
You know, do the 401k, do thisand that?

(08:08):
And all I saw in my 20s was howthat took away from my weekend
beer money and how it wouldimpact me very short-sighted, in
a very short-sighted way.
What is your demographic?
I'm going off script a littlebit because this hits home.
You know, I started late inlife investing.

(08:29):
I wish I had started earlier.
I had the capability to startearlier.
I just didn't know where tostart.
So your demographic?
It's all over the place, isn'tit?
Young and old.

It is, and I just will say, saying what you said.
Everyone says they wish theywould have started earlier or
gotten serious about it earlier,or taken the advice of whoever
gave them some advice earlier inlife.

Tim Shoop (08:56):
I think part of it is it rolls down generationally
too, because my father wasn't aninvestor.
Unless it was a short-term CD,sure, he wasn't investing oh,
that's gambling.
But then when he got older andhe was retired and mom was gone,
he was gambling all the time.

(09:16):
So instead of investing he'd goto the casino.
But your demographic's all overthe place.
Talk to me about that and talkto me what happens when somebody
comes to Mr Martin, whensomebody says, hey, I just where
do?

I start Sure, I'll start by saying that, being
young-ish, right, getting mystart fresh out of college and
this industry kind of by default, a lot of your clients end up
looking like you, right?
So I mean, those are your peersand that's who you know, and
you end up getting a lot ofclients that look like you.

(09:55):
And I'll say, I guess, before Idive into that real quick, I
think the traditional model inthe industry is broken in a lot
of ways in this industry becausethe traditional model is the
assets under management model orAUM model.
So, like back in the day, thereused to be stock brokers and

(10:18):
they would make a 1% commissionfor buying and selling stocks
and that's just the way it wasdone.
There wasn't really financialadvisors, it was stock brokers,
right?
And then people kind of wisedup to the very glaring, obvious
conflicts of interest with thatmodel.
So you're getting paid everytime you buy and sell.
What if it's in my bestinterest to buy the stock and

(10:38):
hold it for a long period oftime or something like that,
right?
So you can see that they'reencouraged to churn, right,
whether you need to buy or sellthis stock right now or not,
they want you to buy or sell it,because that triggers a
commission for them.
People kind of wised up to thatand then it moved to like the
rap fee, right?
So that 1% or 2% fee that mostadvisors are going to charge

(10:59):
nowadays to manage your assets.
I think the inherent conflictsof interest with that model is
one you know your ability towork with that advisor is
contingent upon you having asizable amount of money to
invest.
Number one.

(11:19):
Number two, that you arewilling to let them manage it
for you and you're willing tolet them charge that 1% or 2%
fee to manage the assets.
So that leaves a lot of youngpeople out, right.
That leaves a lot of you know.
So I mean, even if you had andyou know, even if you had a
million dollars in your 401k orsomething like that, the advisor
can't take custody of thatmoney to manage for you and

(11:40):
charge the 1% or 2% fee.
So even still, even if you have, you know, a sizable portfolio,
if it's not in the form thatthe advisor can take, manage,
can take custody of and managefor you, you're not a client for
them, right?
And so there's a lot of thefirms, some of the firms that
everybody would know the namesof that.
The advisors get paid nothingon accounts under $250,000.

(12:03):
So you can imagine, right, themajority of people, particularly
younger people, don't have thatamount of investment, so it's
not somewhere that the advisorcan take custody of.
So it leaves a lot of peopleunserved or underserved.
And again there's a lot ofconflicts and because again it's
basically do you have money toinvest, is it sizable, are you

(12:26):
willing to let me manage it andcharge you the 1% or 2% fee?
And then usually the advicekind of begins and ends with
what to do with that money,right, how to invest it.
And that's all theconversations.
Here's what the stock market isdoing, here's what we're doing,
here's whatever changes we'vemade.
And generally the advicedoesn't go outside sorry,
doesn't go outside that circleof what to do with that money.

(12:50):
No-transcript.
You know you might come to theadvisor and say, hey, I have
this money, what should I dowith it?
And maybe that money should goto paying down debt, maybe
should go to padding savings,maybe you want to invest in
other types of assets, like realestate or something like that,
or your business or what haveyou.

Tim Shoop (13:06):
But so you help.
You help them plan with thingsthat even fall outside of your
portfolio.
Like that you'll help themmanage their assets.
If it's real estate, obviouslyyou're not.
You know you're not beingcommissioned or or your fees on
the real estate, but you'rehelping them go.
I think that's.
I mean, do you help them decideon the investment?
Probably not.

Yeah, no, I mean we're not helping them pick out
which property to buy oranything but the planning that
goes around, that as as as itpertains to the cash flow that
may or may not come from thatproperty, the cash outlay of
that property, the costsassociated with it, how it fits
into the other things thatthey're doing, the asset
protection and the estateplanning that needs to be
involved with this new assetaddition to your portfolio, and

(13:51):
things like that.

Tim Shoop (13:53):
So if they come to you and they go hey, I found
this great piece of property,I'm going to borrow.
You know I'm going to.
I'm going to borrow the moneyto do this instead of using cash
, but unfortunately the interestrates are pretty high.
I'm paying.
You know, maybe they didn't getsuch a great deal as far as
their investment, even thoughthey had money, but it's all

(14:14):
tied up.
Are you going to just kind ofyou're going to give them tips
that that might not be?

I'll give you a a recent example.
So we have a client that owns abusiness and you know her
thought process was, and she,she would like to sell the
business in maybe five-ish yearsis kind of the plan.
And she's, you know, 50-ish orso and she's, you know,

(14:41):
wondering she's renting hercommercial property that she's
running her business out of.
Now.
She's like I'd like to buy itand you know, I don't know about
renting it.
I'd love to, you know, havethat asset and things like that.
And I'm like, okay, so let'sassume that you're talking about
a million dollar piece ofproperty, which is probably
pretty reasonable for what she'slooking at.
I was like, all right, you'regoing to have to put 20% down
typically, so that's $200,000.
And then it's going to beclosing costs and things like

(15:02):
that.
Let's call it to call that$250,000.
And then there's going to beinevitable you know the
likelihood of it being acompletely turnkey piece of
property and obviously you'regoing to have to fill it with
stuff.
You know you're either going tohave to want to paint it,
you're going to put furniture ordecorations or things, and
anyway, so let's call it another$50,000.

(15:23):
And now you're talking about$300 or $1000, you know, cash
outlay for that property andthen of course you have the
payment for it and things likethat.
And I'm like you're going tosell the business in the next
five years.
So I mean, we, you know, wejust got to kind of look at does
that $300,000 investment makemore sense in that piece of
property If you're going to sellit in five years which totally

(15:45):
could make sense or does it makemore sense at this stage in
your business to spend thatmoney reinvested back into your
business to grow it to get ahigher sale price in five years,
right?
So where's the best return onthat capital and where's the
best flexibility with that moneyand things like that?
Right Now?
You're talking my language.

Tim Shoop (16:02):
Yeah, reinvesting back into the business yeah.

I'm going to you know that's, that's one of the
things that we preach tobusiness owners, because I think
, if you look at so I'm sorryfor getting off script oh it's
okay.

Tim Shoop (16:16):
I just know from my own perspective a business
owner's biggest asset is theirbusiness 100%.
You know you've got your, yourhomes, your real estate, your
home real estate.
You know your vehicles, thisand that you've got appreciation
and depreciation.
But a business, if it's managedwell, it is always going to

(16:39):
grow.

Yeah, and I I could, um, I could, just really
you could take a nap and I couldtalk for the next couple hours
about that.
But, um, yeah, so a couple ofthings.
One, a lot of business ownersdon't own a business.
They own a job and they hireother people to help them with
that job.
So it's not the type ofbusiness, you know what I mean.
If the business is too overlyreliant upon them, you're just

(17:01):
self employed and hired otherpeople with that job.
Right.
So that's working in it, not onit, that's right.
So that's that's number one.
Um, yes, the business typically,for most business owners, is
far and away the biggest asset.
Unfortunately, most businessowners 80 plus percent never get
to capitalize on this assetthat they built.
So 80 something percent ofbusinesses never sell because

(17:24):
they're the value, becausethey're the value typically, and
they just, um, I think,beginning with the end in mind,
I think being intentional,beginning with the end in mind,
understanding.
So I was just talking to, um,uh, a client, uh, you know a
buddy about this yesterday.
He's not a client yet, but and,um, yeah, right, he, uh the

(17:47):
type of company that he has.
Um, and it's just him and oneother guy and you know, just
trying to tell him, cause hetalked about selling it one day
and but it's just you and thisguy right now, like it's not,
it's not a business.
It's just you're just sellingyour service Like it's not a
business, this is not sellableat all.
Like there's a lot of things yougot to do and you just got to
decide do you want to make thisa business?

(18:08):
And you're going to have to,you know.
You know your leadership.
You're going to have to grow asa, as a entrepreneur and as a
leader to do that, which isgoing to be uncomfortable and
it's going to be hard and it'sgoing to take time.
Or you can just say I'm justfine on this job, I'm going to
take income, you know, createincome by doing this thing and
then I'll invest that incomeelsewhere.

(18:28):
Or do you want to invest in thebusiness and make it a business
?
Anyways, I say that to say youknow, 80 something percent of
businesses never sell this.
You know of the smallpercentage that do.
The vast majority of them donot sell for anywhere near what
the business owner is hoping toget or think it's worth or any
of that stuff.
Right, so that's a whole othershow.

Tim Shoop (18:48):
That's a whole other show and and I I get passionate
when we talk about that becausethere's a lot of little things
that business, business ownerscould be doing within their
business to maximize their value.
But I'm going to have to savethat for another show.
Sure, sure.

Um, in my opinion , wisely reinvesting back into a
well run business is arguablyone of the best things that you
can do.
Not saying that you shouldn'tdiversify outside of the
business.
Obviously there's, there'sbenefit to diversification, but
most business owners would liketo grow the value of the
business.
If they're that forwardthinking, um number one, number

(19:26):
two every business owner wouldlike to reduce taxes, right.

Tim Shoop (19:31):
So no, you don't know , that's the last thing on our
minds.
So we talked about that when wehad a, had a bourbon one night,
right.

Um, so weirdly.
A weird uh kink in the tax codeis income is taxed at the
highest rate.
Capital gains taxes are taxedat a much lower rate.
Okay, income tax right nowhighest is 37%.
Highest capital gain tax rightnow is 20%.
So you look like you havesomething.

Tim Shoop (20:01):
I'm all too familiar with all those numbers, yeah.

Yeah, um.
So if you can reinvest backinto the business in a way to
reduce your highest rate, suchas income, and grow the value of
the business, which is arguably, arguably, going to be a better
return on that capital than ona lot of other places, and you
don't have to pay taxes on thegrowth of the business until
it's sold, and then, dependingon how you structure the sale,
whether it be an asset sale orstock sale, and even if it's

(20:25):
asset sale, depending on howthat's structured, hopefully the
majority of it is going to becapital gains taxes, which are
going to be taxed at a muchlower rate.

Tim Shoop (20:33):
And those, those are going to be your, your
shareholder distributions fromownership Right.
So so, just speaking to ouraudience from from a business
owner's viewpoint, if you'regoing to reinvest back into your
business, what is the mostexpensive thing to reinvest back
in your business, where you'regoing to get your biggest return

(20:54):
?
I don't, in my opinion.
I don't think it's real estate,I don't think it's, uh,
physical things.
I think it is your talent, yourpeople, the people that that
are your friends, your frontline and and are going to
replicate what your vision wasfor that business moving forward

(21:14):
.
You invest in people and and,and, of course, the evolution of
your product offerings.
You are going to maximize yourreturn.

Yeah, so, um, obviously, caveat being, it
depends on the industry and youknow the industry the business
is in and so on.
But, yeah, generally speaking,um, it's whatever the revenue
drivers of the business areRight.
So, um, that could be peopleright If you're in a type of
business, um, that that's thecase.
But whatever is going toincrease the cash flow and or

(21:48):
revenue slash profitability ofthe business?
Um, because you know, probably,as you well know, most
businesses sell for multiple ofEBITDA.
There's all sorts of different,you know ways that businesses
sell, but that's a prettytypical one.
Ebitda is earnings beforeinterest, taxes, depreciation,
amortization, and it's a fancyaccounting metric for what
basically boils down to profit,right, so profit and that's
another thing too with a lot ofbusiness owners is they'll say

(22:11):
you know how much revenuethey're doing and I'm like
that's great, how much of thatis profit?

Tim Shoop (22:15):
Yeah, you don't multiply times, uh, the amount
of revenue you have.
You multiply times the amountof profit.
That's right.
That's right.

Yeah.
So I think, investing insomething that's uh, you know,
in revenue drivers of thebusiness, um, obviously making
things more efficient.
But to your point, um, yes,people, um, and I think there's
a lot of business owners thattry to not pay more than they

(22:43):
have to for certain positions,or they're too caught up on
what's the market rate of thisposition, like, basically, how,
how much can I get away withpaying this?

Tim Shoop (22:52):
person.
I think it's how valuable thatperson is to to the growth of
the business, more so than justwhat the role is.
Now you have to structure it.
Of course you have to structurethat.
People know this is whatthey're projecting.
But if you see a top performerand you see somebody that's
really killing it, you know andand you're going to want to keep

(23:16):
them around a lot longerbecause they're going to help
you grow.
And turnover, which is a um,what's the word I'm looking for?
It's a.
It's an outcome from not payingpeople enough.
When you have high turnover andyou have to replace those
people.
What do you think?
Does it actually cost more tobring a new person on in the

(23:39):
form of training and gettingthem ramped up, and maybe the
loss of business in the meantimebecause people are missing
their you know their star um, oris it just par for?

the course.
I think that, um, I forget whatthe name of the HR, the
national, like HR group,whatever they have some sort of
association or group, I forgetthe name of, of theirs, uh, of
that group, but they say that onaverage.
Obviously industry and thingslike that play a role, but um, I
think they say on average, um,it costs uh three months salary

(24:13):
to replace a person.

Tim Shoop (24:15):
Yeah, that sounds right, yeah.

So, um, yeah, a players want to play where a
players can play best, right.
So I mean you have, you have touh build an organization that a
players want to play in.
And you know a lot of businessowners miss.
I think it was Henry Ford thatsaid.
You know, he went through anddoubled the, the salary for all

(24:37):
of his workers across the boardand he called it his best money
saving thing he ever did.

Tim Shoop (24:44):
Was.
This was where was that in themilestone of Ford?
Was that after the Model T, orwas that down the road?
I don't know.

See, I don't know either.

Tim Shoop (24:52):
I'm going to have to look that up because it's
interesting to know where he wasin the evolution of that
company.
That's true.
Oh, that's cool.

Yeah, and you know, so I think you know,
paying for a position, beingwilling to pay 30, 50% above
what the market is to attract aplayers, uh, if not more than
that, um, because an A player isgoing to be three to five times
more productive than a kind oftypical uh employee, right.

(25:24):
So if I mean, if you can pay50% or even 100% more but get
three to five times ofproductivity from that person,
right.
And if you're paying reallywell, people are.
So, just like with Henry Ford,he paid double the the pay for
everybody.
The people working there feltvery grateful to um to work
there.
They're happy to work, they'rehappy to be employees, a

(25:44):
productive employee and um.
And then you know he had peoplefrom other uh car companies
beaten down his door to want towork there, right.
So I mean he drastically skewedthe supply demand, uh the labor
supply demand, in his favorbecause everybody wanted to work
there.
So everybody worked there.
No, as soon as I leave, this isthe best job I'm going to get,

(26:05):
yeah, uh, and there's a line ofpeople waiting to take my job,
so I better be.

Tim Shoop (26:10):
Well, before we get into our next beer, let's talk
about so, and we kind of alreadytouched on some of these things
.
But I mean, when I know, when Iinvest, I you know, and I focus
on financial goals, which areone of the key things.
I look at, um, I look atmilestones, wealth creating and
sort of building a plan for myfuture and my eventual

(26:32):
retirement, whatever that isthese days.
So I mean, we talked about that.
What is retirement Right?
Tell us about some of thethings you may not have
discussed already, uh, and whatyou do and your role in in
helping someone secure theirfuture.
Maybe, um, I mean, even ifthere's a case study or
something that we can talk aboutto kind of take our audience

(26:57):
down a little bit of a path onthings they may not have thought
about.

So I'll just say so, uh, this is for, let's just
say, personal financial planning, not business planning or
anything.
So, just just, and becauseevery business owner needs
personal financial planning too,so I'll just talk about
personal financial planning,since it will apply to most
people.
Uh, yeah, to your point.
There's a lot of things thatthere's a lot of things that we
know, there's a lot of thingsthat we know we don't know, and

(27:24):
there's a lot of things that wedon't know we don't know, right.
So I think, for the averageperson, um, there's what we call
your financial foundation.
All the not sexy stuff, rightState planning, emergency fund,
insurances, all that sort ofstuff, right, but things that we
need to make sure to have thesethings in place, um, because
that's the foundation to yourfinancial plan, right, that kind

(27:45):
of props everything up, andwithout those things, um,
everything can kind of crumbleif, uh, that crack in the
foundation becomes exposed.
So there's a lot of that sortof stuff.
And if you're younger, really inany stage, but particularly if
you're younger um, small things.
Usually there's not hugedrastic changes we have to make

(28:09):
to a person's plan to have avery meaningful impact.
It's usually just smallinefficiencies, right.
So I feel like most people.
They're like I'm doing goodthings, I'm saving, I'm
investing and I'm paying downdebt all objectively good things
.
I feel like what they they'renot exactly sure if what they're
doing is the most efficient wayto do it and if what they're

(28:30):
doing is going to allow them toachieve their goals.
So they're just focused on kindof the short term.
I know I'm doing good things.
I don't know if I'm what I'mdoing is the best thing Right.

Tim Shoop (28:39):
So this is what I hear when you say that and
correct me if I'm wrong.
But if you're, uh, if you'reusing a credit card that has a
22% interest rate and you've gotmoney, well, let me rephrase
that.
Let me let me do this in a wayI can understand.

(28:59):
Let's say you have a loanthat's at 3% on a house or
whatever it is, and you havemoney that you want to invest,
but you know that you can investit in a short term CD and I'm
going to use these things short,short, kind of short term

(29:20):
things as a, as a, as a concepthere and you can get five and a
quarter back on that in sixmonths.
Let's say should I, should Ipay down that loan or should I
put it towards a CD?

I'll say there's there's, you know, I'll say
there's, there's, there's,there's, there's behavioral
finance is a very big part ofthis.
So if it's just dollars andcents, this job is easiest job.

Tim Shoop (29:45):
So is that what I'm talking about?
Behavioral?

So there's two parts to it.
Okay, so there's the dollarsand cents part of it and then
there's a behavioral part.
So just numbers, right?
Just you know numbers on paper.
Obviously you know, from anefficiency of the dollar
standpoint, simple math.
Yeah, this is a right If you'repaying 3% on a mortgage and you
can take that money and investit somewhere in a CD or how
you'll save Making extra two anda quarter percent.

(30:08):
But even if it was 4% orsomething you net it had 1%.
So that's that's number one.
Number two I hear a lot ofpeople, particularly with
mortgages, like well, I'm payingextra towards one mortgage
because I want to get it paidoff and once it's paid off it's
going to bring me a lot ofcomfort to have it paid off.
It's like all right, well, youknow, based on the pace of how
much extra you're puttingtowards, that you'll get it paid
off in 20 years instead of 30.

(30:29):
That's still 20 years thatthings can hit the fan.
That's still a long time.
Right that you still got thatpayment.
Number one.
Number two if things did hitthe fan, would you rather not
have a $2,000 a month mortgageor would you rather have tens of
thousands of dollars or in thesix figures, maybe of money
somewhere that you can get yourhands on if you needed it.
I think that's a pretty obviousright.

(30:49):
You'd rather have a bucket ofmoney somewhere that you can get
your hands on instead of nothaving a $2,000 a month payment
yeah, I think we all likebuckets of money?
I think so too, right?
So, um, having said that, right, it's our job to give the
context and the information andall that about that.
And then if somebody saysyou've done your job and showing

(31:10):
me that from a financialstandpoint this might not be the
best decision and I realize Iwill likely lose money by paying
down the house, as opposed toputting that money somewhere
else, however, it will help mesleep better at night to have
the house paid off.
Great, let's move forward withthat assumption.
I've done all I can do.
We're all adults here.
I've given you the information.
That's what this is.

(31:31):
I'm here to help you make aneducated decision.
I've given you the, theeducation to be able to make
that decision.
This is a decision you're makingand we will move forward with
that assumption, right?
So to your point.
Yes, it was.
You know, generally it's it'sarbitrage, right?
So, whether it be interest ratearbitrage or, as a business
owner, time arbitrage, laborarbitrage, right, it's all
arbitrage.
How can we leverage things in away that's going to give us the

(31:54):
best bang for a buck?

Tim Shoop (31:56):
So one short tip for the audience out there on what
they can do, just one short tipthat they may not know about
before we grab another beer,cause I'm ready to get another
beer, okay.

Um, from a personal planning standpoint,
yeah.

Tim Shoop (32:13):
Why don't we take that?
I think we've got a well.
We have a lot of businessowners watching this too.

So, um, I'll say one of the things that I see
most.
I could probably count on onehand, if I was missing some
fingers, how many people we'vemet with who have their estate
planning done and up to date.
So and again, that doesn't.
That's not anything that, uh,you know you need to see an
attorney to do that, right, wecan help with the planning of

(32:40):
that, but the actual writing upthe, the documents you need to
see an attorney for, but that isone of the main things that we
see, and I mean we could all.
So you're telling me they don'thave it, they don't have it
done.
Okay, yeah, so I mean I've.
I literally I struggle thinkingof um.
There's probably only two orthree people in my entire career
that I've met with who hadtheir estate planning done and

(33:02):
it was up to date.

Tim Shoop (33:04):
We did ours two or three years ago.
I feel like somehow I'movercompensating later in life
for all the things I didn't doearly in life.

At least you're doing it now.
Well, that's good.

Tim Shoop (33:17):
That is a good segue into beer number two, but you
know I I hate when I see a gueston here that hasn't finished
their first be.
Oh, it's gone, seds.
What do we?

have All right.
Our second beer of the night isthe red drum amber ale from the
ravenous pig brewery in winterpark, florida.
It's described as deliciouslybalanced, medium bodied, hoppy
amber ale, emerald on cascadehops lead the charge and
compliment the toffee andcaramel notes.

Oh, that's nice and smooth.

Tim Shoop (33:48):
You like that one?
Yeah, yeah, that's good.
Yeah, this is a.
This is a good evening goodevening beer.

Yeah, I feel like this is something my mom would
like.
She's not a big beer drinker,but if we go out to eat she'll
get one, and she usually likessomething.

Tim Shoop (34:03):
I think that last beer that we had from
Appalachicola, I think, would bemore of a simple go to.
I think this beer is that I gothim from work.
I just want to sit down andrelax, maybe with a meal.
Where's that from Jared?

This is from winter park, Florida.
The rat was pig brewery.

Sorry, suds, now everybody knows you really do no
Cat out of the bag, all right.

Tim Shoop (34:28):
So let's talk about so.
Segment two achieving financialsecurity.
How do we get there?
So first I want to start bytalking about top achievement
here Top 50 financial securityprofessionals recognized by
Forbes magazine in 22 and 23.

(34:49):
Is that you?
Yes, sir, yeah.

That's when I got there and I was asking for kind
of an application you knowprocess and qualification
process and when I originallygot the email about it asking to
apply, I thought it was likespammy or something like that.
I was like, ah, this probably.

Tim Shoop (35:13):
They probably said we get a lot of those where you're
like, is this real?
Yeah, am I really did?
I really yeah, but this isForbes.

Yeah.
And so I was like, ah, theyprobably send this to everybody.
This isn't meant for me.
And so the first one, I thinkwe didn't respond to at all.
And then they followed back upand I was like, all right, well,
you know what the heck?
Well, we'll apply.
I'm not really, you know, don'thold a lot of hope that we'll
get it.
It'd be cool if we did.
But you know we'll, we'll applyanyways.

(35:43):
We didn't know that theapplication process was going to
be as arduous as it was, butluckily I have, you know, great
team members that will do theheavy lifting on that for me.
And then, you know, it tookthem.
I think they got theinformation either early in the
year or late, you know, late inthe year, but they announced it

(36:04):
I think it was like July orsomething like that.
But so I, you know, kind offorgot about it.
And then we got the email.
So what is this?

Tim Shoop (36:10):
award.
Is this an award for topadvisors or does this impact any
other verticals?

So I, what I'm going to tell you what I believe
it to be is yeah, I meanthey've, and again, the
application process wasn't, wasthorough.
So I, I believe they looked atyou know everybody, at least
everybody who implied in thestate, or they looked at the
folks in the state and I'm Ithink they had their metrics on

(36:41):
whether it be, you know,production method, methodology
or I'm not really sure what theylooked at, but I mean we had to
give them all sorts ofinformation, so they were kind
of looking at everything and Iknow, I know all too well how

(37:02):
those work, because I meandigital boardwalk.

Tim Shoop (37:03):
We've won what?
Over 20, 20 industry awards.
Good for you, man, and and thethe administrative process of
that.
As far as applying, I mean,it's all essay driven and you're
you're writing a and I thinkthat's going to be.
You know how are they going toknow the difference nowadays, if
people are leveraging it AI, wedon't use AI.

(37:25):
We write everything by hand.
We do leverage AI to help, forinstance, structure the show,
but we don't use it for originalcontent Copy man, it's just you
.
You, you always know, yeah, youcan always see certain words,
god who uses that word?
But you know, I, I know aboutthat.
I mean, most of these thingsare really essay focused and and

(37:50):
if you know your stuff, you'regoing to, you're going to rank,
yeah, if you don't know yourstuff, you're not going to rank.
So, kudos to you, man, oh,thank you.
Kudos to you, that's a big deal.
So tell me, I want to know.
I want to know from businessowner to business owner, two
completely different industries.
I want to hear about yourchallenges and opportunities,

(38:11):
both challenges andopportunities In the
ever-evolving world of thefinancial industry.
So go.

Challenges in this industry are from a
operational standpoint, and thismight be the case in your
industry, it's the case in a lotof industries, but the
obviously it's highly regulated,and for good reason, right,
there's been a lot of challengesin the industry, and for good
reason, right, there's been alot of bad actors, and I mean,
you got to create guardrails anddo things like that, but it

(38:52):
just is hard to.
Every year they, there's morethings, there's more forms we
have to fill out in paper and,and you know their, their
rationale is like well, this ismeant to protect the average
person and what did?
The adverse side effect of thatis that it makes financial help
less attainable because itmakes it more expensive to for

(39:15):
us to operate.
So we can't, you know, we haveto charge a certain amount for
clients and things like that, oronly take on certain clients or
whatever it is to be able tooperate profitably, right?
So that's some of the biggeststruggles.
And then and then things like,for the most part until maybe

(39:41):
last year, as I think, when thewhen the rule on this changed.
But I don't know if you've evernoticed in the past, but you've
never seen any liketestimonials or reviews on
planners or advisors websites orany of that stuff, because
you're not allowed to have them,even if it was something as so
that's a compliance thing inyour industry.

Tim Shoop (40:02):
Is that FINRA, or is that?

It's the SEC.
The SEC, yeah, it could beFINRA as well, I don't know.
But but they, that rule hasbeen on the books since, I think
, either the 60s or the 60s orthe 80s, so obviously
pre-internet and they just nowchanged the rule on that and
even with changing the rule,saying, yeah, we allow that now.
So we've, you know, on thewebsite.

(40:24):
What you want to is that.
So you see, the Forbes thing,and I don't know how compliance
approves the Forbes things.
Maybe it's because it's Forbes,I don't know.
Right, you know, we've beenlucky enough to have been voted
best financial advisor inPensacola for 17 times and they
can't be on the website.
Yeah, that's impressive, um,and because they can't prove

(40:46):
that we didn't pay for it or wedid.
I don't know, I don't know whattheir rationale is, but we,
they, you know, we can't have iton the website.
We can't even have, even if youwanted to say, like Andrew, a
nice guy testimonial on on thewebsite or something like that
can't be there.
So they just recently changedthe rule.
And then, when they changed therule, um, I was all excited
about it, right, saw it come inand it was uh, you know, nothing

(41:08):
happens quickly.
So we knew it was coming for alittle while and, uh, reached
out to compliance.
About it.
I was like, hey, this is great.
When can we do that?
And they said well, you know,us and many other companies have
reached out to the SEC becausethe the guidance on it isn't
very clear.
So we've reached out forfurther guidance and

(41:29):
clarification and the SECbasically says we think it's
clear enough.

Tim Shoop (41:36):
Okay, literally.
So prior to that change, wereyou able to come on a show like
this?
I mean it's?
Is that a gray area?
Is that?

Yeah, I think, um , I think probably you could,
but obviously you just got to becareful about what you say.

Tim Shoop (41:53):
Okay.

Yeah, so, um, but yeah, you can't have anyway, so
and there, so it's, it's.
You know you have the SEC thatis making the rules and forcing
the rules.
Um, you know, judge, jury, allthe stuff, right.
So, um, basically they're likeno, we think it's clear enough.
Um, do what you think is bestand hope we don't come around

(42:14):
and find you if you break ourrules that we didn't, we
wouldn't answer questions aboutor clarify so that, so that
those are challenges.

Tim Shoop (42:23):
Um, wow, yeah, yeah, that's, and I already knew about
that um to a degree, um, but uh, it's great to be able to tell
the world about it, because I'msure they go to a website and
they're like, but nobody'stalking about it.

Yeah, yeah, I mean, in today's world with
Google and everything else,obviously reviews help a lot and
you know, obviously I mean we.
You know there's social proof.
People like to see that like,oh, there's lots of other people
who are happy with this personor with this firm or whatever,
and we just can't have that.
So, um, that's from anoperational standpoint.
I'll I'll say from a client.

(42:58):
You know, talking with clientsthere's a lot of, especially
with.
You know, we live in the in theinformation age.
So, you know, having theability to Google things, um is
great because you can learn alot.
Um, but the problem isobviously, as you can imagine, I
get people send me, you know,reels and ticktocks and you know

(43:19):
YouTube videos and differentthings of.
We don't use ticktock.

Tim Shoop (43:23):
Okay, yeah Well, I mean, that's cyber security
industry.
We don't use ticktocks.

Yeah, I don't either, but that's a whole other
show.
Yeah, and I'll, if people sendme, you know, clips and little
short videos and stuff of youknow whatever person on there
talking about whatever financialor business thing, financial
bros.
Yeah.

That's right.

Yeah, yeah, sipping their white claws and
it's fun.

Tim Shoop (43:45):
You know what I I'm going to.
I'm going to segue into this.
So, I'm watching a uh, oh God,what is the name of it?
It's about that kid that uh ranup the uh GameStop stock.

I have that on my Netflix list.
I haven't watched it.

Tim Shoop (44:00):
I'm in the middle of it right now and it's so
entertaining and it's got SethRogen in it A few others Dumb
money, dumb money.
Of course Suds knows, um, butthank you, suds.
Uh, it's, yeah, and and it'sneat.
I mean this guy ran by the nameof what Exploding Kitty, or
what was his handle?
Uh, yeah, something like that.

(44:20):
Something Something like thatLike explain any work cat, a cat
shirt, and he had cats that hewould put up on the screen.
But he also had his portfoliothat he shared on the screen and
talked about it, and he hadyoung people, uh, other
millennials, um, going on andlistening to them and investing

(44:42):
and and throwing money into it,and it ran up the stock.
What is your from knowing what?
You know, what, what maybe meand the audience don't know.
How in the world does somethinglike that happen and what did
it do?
Or how?
How would that impact the hedgefund guys, the guys you know,

(45:05):
the, the, the guys that are init for the money, that are in it
for the big money?
How did it impact them?
Or can we not talk about that?

on this show.
So a couple of references youmentioned.
Your dad said, oh, that'sgambling.
Now that's gambling, that's notinvesting, right.
So um, and then you knowreferencing I talked about
behavioral finance.
So there is all sorts of um,there's what's called herding,

(45:33):
there's, you know, recency biasthere.
I mean there's all sorts of youknow um, you know kind of
mental things.
I guess that, uh, trip you upwhen it comes to making
decisions in general, butcertainly financial decisions.
So that's a classic case ofhurting right and fear of
missing out, right, and so, um,and social media and the

(45:56):
internet is, is great at kind ofproliferating.
That I say great kind of tonguein cheek, right, so, um, it's
not great, but you know a lot ofit can, it can catch on and a
lot of people I mean you seethat with some cryptocurrencies
and things like that, wherepeople are like to the moon and
everybody piles in and piles in,and so that drives the price up
and then at some point it comesback down.

Tim Shoop (46:17):
Yeah.

Um, I think that's kind of those classic
cases of that's what's happening.
So people don't understand, umwhy they make the decisions that
they make.
I know that sounds really, umKind of like a crazy thing to
say, but it's influencers.

Tim Shoop (46:36):
It's it's, it's.
You know, anybody watching thisshow might be influenced by
this show.
Sure, uh, and you know we don't.
I think he at the time only hadlike 400, 400 followers, and
the people that were investingin them were just people that
were trying to learn a littlebit of this and a little bit of
that, and then when he gave themthat tip, they just threw their

(46:59):
money in what little bit ofmoney they they had at the time.
And so did they, and I haven'tfinished that show and I know
you haven't watched it yet, butdid they make money?

Oh, there's a certain amount of people that I
mean, just like withcryptocurrencies and GameStop
and AMC and some of those other.
You know some of those tradeslike, but it's gambling it is
gambling.
Okay, it is, it is game.
You know it's investing.
If you made money right, youcan justify it yourself to say

(47:31):
like I made money.

Tim Shoop (47:32):
I'm gonna do it again .
I'm gonna lose it.
Yep, I'm the same way.
You put a, put money in theslot, you want a thousand bucks,
and then you start feedinganother slot.
It pays out a little bit andthen after the end of the day,
you're back to ground zero.

Yeah, gambling.
So casinos really do have thatfigured out like they understand
behavior.
And they understand again.
You know, these companiesunderstand what makes us tick
more than we do and they I don'twant to say manipulate that,
but they, they take advantage ofit.
Yeah, right, so they understandthat.
Yeah, that little bit ofdopamine hit every time you like

(48:06):
, oh, you want a little bit, andso it'll keep you right.
But you know, right at the timeyou're at the slots and you're
like you know what I'm done withthis, and then you went a
little bit.
You're like well, you know.

Tim Shoop (48:14):
Okay, that's probably why they issue those cards so
they can track you around thecasino.

Mm-hmm.

Tim Shoop (48:19):
That's.
That was a member when I gotone of those cards and I don't
go to the casino there.
I haven't been in the casino, Ithink, since my dad passed away
Quite a while ago.
I used to go with him to takehim there and you know, and I
remember putting my card in thatmachine going, all I saw was a

(48:39):
tracking device.

Yeah, yeah, guess why else would you need yeah?

Tim Shoop (48:43):
I know, yeah, but they give it to you going,
you're gonna get perks, you'regonna get a free hotel stay,
whatever.
But what they're really doingis tracking your behavior.
Now I would if I want athousand bucks on a machine.
One thing they can't they don'tknow about me is I'll take 20
out of that thousand bucks,gamble it to waste a little bit
of time and leave, yeah, so well, and there was another, I

(49:05):
forget.

So this was.
Somebody told me this the otherday and I think it was a Casino
.
But yeah, they had a card,right.
So they have your email andthey have your other information
.
And I guess he hadn't gone in awhile.
So they sent him an email likehey, we're giving you 20 bucks
or 100 bucks, whatever it waslike on your card.
So, yeah, to come to that timeyou come.
You got 20 bucks or 100 bucksor whatever the dollar you know,

(49:29):
whatever the number Sucking youin.
Yeah.
So I mean, you know thepsychology of I'm not gonna wait
, I can only spend this $20.
I'm not gonna waste 20 dollars,I'm just, you know, I'm just
not not gonna spend this $20.
So I need to go spend the $20,right, I need to go.
It's a free $20.
It's free money, right?
So yeah, they again, they knowall these little it's all.

Tim Shoop (49:48):
It's kind of my lash.
Our last show Was on marketingand how, how smarter web uses
data To help steer thosecampaigns for companies, and
that's what the world is now.
It is a world of datacollection and using that data
to analyze behavioral patternsso you can get marketed to and

(50:11):
sold to, and and whatever else,and so this is a good segue into
you, because I can gamble, ICan or I can use, for instance,
an app.
There's tons of apps out therenow by a, a number of different

(50:32):
organizations where you can loadit on your phone and invest in
the stock market, but what I seethere is I'm having to read and
learn by reading, and I don'thave anybody sitting there
really truly understanding myassets, where I am in life, who

(50:54):
I am, what my passions are.
It is just mere data.
Now.
Data uses algorithms.
So from once you invest in maybea stock, it's gonna do a very
similar thing to what you mightdo, but Tell me, from your
perspective, your innovativeapproach To helping me with my

(51:20):
strategic planning and theninvesting in those things that
you, that somebody, would investin on that app, but through you
, and what the differences areand and you know, on the surface
, it's the personal relationshipand the fact that I can call
you and go hey man, you know, IGot a little bit of money here

(51:41):
and I don't know what to do withit.
I think I'm gonna, I think I'mgonna spend it on a Depreciation
, depreciating assets like acyber truck.
Well, that might not be, Idon't know, we'll have to see.
But you know, and I really wantit, but I want to make money.
Where do you come in and whatare you gonna say to me and and

(52:05):
where's that conversation gonnago?

so I think the point that I started to make
earlier that I never got tobecause I went on a rabbit trail
was you know, the informationage and googling stuff and my
googles or whatever you know,when you're searching for stuff,
it's gonna show you what you'researching for, not other things
that you may not know to searchfor.
So I mean I run into thatsometimes, where you know
somebody will come and say, hey,I want to do this thing.
It's like all right, well, why?

(52:30):
Well, I'm trying to do this,okay, well, there's probably a
better way.
You know, did you know aboutthis thing?
Because this is a better way todo that thing that you say
you're trying to do?
Well, no, I didn't know aboutthem, right.
So that's kind of the problemwith with you know the
information age is, you know,and even if that thing was good
and good, you know who knows ifit was the right thing for you

(52:51):
to do in your situation.

Tim Shoop (52:52):
So the approach that so the apps, in my opinion, or
for a younger person thatdoesn't have that minimum To
spend with an advisor, is that,is that?
Is that?

what I see is that some people just like doing
it just for the fun of it, andso that's why and again, I
promise I'll answer yourquestion here in this moment but
you know, we, we I thinkworking with a fee based firm
that charge for charges fortheir time and advice Kind of
democratizes that.
So we work with a lot ofyounger people who, I mean, you

(53:26):
know you have to pay us for ourservices, but it doesn't matter
to us if you have a little moneyor a lot of money or if you
want to self-manage or any ofthat other Kind of stuff,
because I mean, you're payingfor the, for the advice, which
is what you're here for.
I think most people wantthorough, unbiased advice that
isn't contingent upon you buyingsomething from me or me
managing your money.
They just want good, thorough,unbiased advice, and there's not

(53:48):
a lot of ways to get that right.
So that and the approach wetake is we want to, if we can
help you with your finances,help you achieve the things in
life that you want to achieve.
That's the biggest one for us.
So to be able to help youachieve the things in life that

(54:08):
you want to achieve, we need tohave a good, thorough
understanding of you and whatmakes you tick and your
experiences and what's importantto you and what your goals are
not just personal goals butfamily goals and all that sort
of stuff.
And to People's goals change,right, people's, my you know
ideas about things change and sonot just like, great, here's
your, you know, here's yourprofile, and I'm assuming that

(54:31):
you're a static person thatnever things don't change and so
this is the way we're gonna dothings.
No, I mean having you know therelationship with the person,
understanding them, reallyunderstanding them and their and
their family and the dynamicsand all those things Is what's
most important.
So we generally start With whatI call the you know, kind of
touchy-feely questions.

(54:51):
So like, all right, we'rereally not talking about money
much, but I need to have a goodunderstanding of you and your
family and what makes you tickand your experiences.
And one of the first questionswe ask is, like, when you were
growing up, what was yourfamily's experience and attitude
around money?
And you'll get all sorts ofdifferent answers, right, so you
were either was an area ofanxiety and they didn't grow up
with much, or they just didn'ttalk about it, or they were

(55:14):
spenders, or I, you know, youknow you'll hear all sorts of
stuff.
And then the next question iswell, so that experience, how
does that Shape the way you feelabout money and finances today?
Right, because that willinevitably have some sort of
direct impact on that.
So just to give you an ideafunny.

Tim Shoop (55:31):
I'm thinking about the psychology of it for my own
personal experiences and I thinkabout myself and my my I'm a
baby is six children, so I'm thebaby.
So I had something to prove, Ithink, growing up.
But my next oldest, my brother,he's seven years apart from me,
so I came along way.

(55:53):
Way, baby, yeah, I'm the baby,baby.
They were all kind of groupedtogether and then here I come
along and you know, they savedthe smartest guy for last.

That's right, I'm not humble, yeah.

Tim Shoop (56:03):
So no, but my brother spent money like it was going
out of style still does.
He's that guy that has to havethe latest flashy boat, the lay,
the biggest truck, the.
You know everything and Love mybrother and he, of course, you
know I, I support him, I love to.
You know, go over there and andand hang out with him and and

(56:25):
uses.
You know, help him use thisstuff.
But here I am.
I saved my money as a kid.
I still save money today.
You know, when I make money I'mlooking at ways to turn that
money into more money toEstablish a good retirement for
me and my wife and and and helpmy kids as they get older.

(56:46):
But when we were kids I would.
I Would I once a week I wouldpour my piggy bank out and count
my money and every now and thenmy money would come up a little
short.
My brother was coming into myroom and taking my money.

Seven years, six.
Seven years old.

Tim Shoop (57:13):
Yeah, but he knew I always had money and he couldn't
figure out why it's cuz I neverspent it and oh my god.
But it's funny how I mean thisis as I was a little kid when I
was saving that money, and nowhere we are in our in our 50s
and 60s and we're the same way.
We're the same way, but it'sjust funny.

I know we got off topic.

Tim Shoop (57:38):
I had to use an analogy here because it's all
about psychology and who you areas a person and where you
really want to put your money.

Yeah, and I again back to like the behavioral
finance and like I'll never bethe type of planner that tells
somebody like no, you can't buythat thing or you shouldn't buy
that thing, right, it's.
It's my job to Show youfinancially what the
consequences are, positive ornegative, of the decision that
you're making, right, whateverthat decision is.
So, as an example, we workedand this is a younger couple and

(58:06):
they came to us and they're upto their eyeballs and stupid
debt.
I mean up to their eyeballs.
And you know we had to reallygonna get creative on how we're
gonna tackle this.
And because they didn't workthe kind of jobs where they can,
you know, business owners islike, well, we can work harder
and make more money, hopefully,right, but you know, when you're
w2 95 job, you can't do that.

(58:27):
So we really had to get creativeon how we're gonna try to
tackle this debt and what we'regonna do.
And so obviously one of thethings that they had that was a
big expense, a big monthlyexpense, was a boat.
And I was like, look, you know,you got some of these things
that just From the outsidelooking at, looks like can be
easily cut.
So I'm just kind of putting infront of you to help you make

(58:47):
the decisions, and the boat wasone of those things and they're
like the boat is what we do as afamily for fun and like that's
how we hang out with friends andstuff like that.
So we would really like and notthe boat, yeah, boat and I, you
know, and I like I get that,like I you know, so okay, so
that's just so.
Something else has got to goright.

(59:08):
So we are, or like here's theconsequences of that and that's
fine, keep the boat like Itotally understand that, because
if that's your thing, thatthat's what you do as a family,
Totally get that they haveyounger kids and all that stuff.
It's like you know, that's,that's experiences, and that's
certainly worth something.
So here's some other ways thatwe can do that right.
So I Just think get a smallerboat.

Yeah.

Yeah, you know.
Just point is, though, is thatthere's things that make sense
on paper, and then there'sthings that make sense to a
person, right.
So yeah, it's not my job to tellthem how to live their lives,
but I do want to have a reallygood understanding of them and
what makes them tick and what'simportant to them.
So, again, the boat wasimportant.
So, okay, that that's a that'skind of a non-negotiable that
can't be cut great, we have tomake other decisions, right, we

(59:57):
have to.
We have to make othersacrifices elsewhere if the boat
is kind of a non-negotiable.
So but yeah, I just think thatHaving a really good
understanding of the person,instead of just looking at
Dollars and cents and numbersand what's on paper, obviously
that's important but yeah.

Tim Shoop (01:00:15):
So this is fantastic.
This is exactly what you're notgoing to get from a nap.
This is what you're going toget from from Andrew Martin.
This is what you're going toget from your financial advisor.
It's going to sit down with youand map out your financial
future and help you manage andgrow your wealth or lack of, in
the case of of those folks, butit sounds like you help them

(01:00:39):
maintain their lifestyle whileyou know growing their wealth
and attempting to get out ofdebt.
So this is a good segue intotechnology.
We're on nerds on tap.
We always get nerdy on here.
We have to talk abouttechnology.
That's part of our MO, it's inour DNA and so Tell me so.

(01:01:02):
In the tech industry, we'realways adapting To the changing
world of tech to stay on thecutting edge for our clients.
How often do you have to adapt,and the adapt in the world of
financial planning?

Andrew Martin (01:01:14):
in Go ahead, yeah so, you know, covid, for a lot
of people, was a very kind of aRecent real-world example of
that right, people workingremotely and stuff like that.
So we were lucky in the factthat we had been working with
clients via zoom for, you know,years before that or a good

(01:01:37):
while before that, workingvirtually with clients, and so
we didn't have to.
There wasn't a big adjustment,right, it was just, you know,
great, we've been doing this,we're used to it and and all
that I will say as an industry,the cybersecurity obviously
being a very important part ofthat, because you know, you have
people's information.

Tim Shoop (01:01:58):
I Know a good company that can help everyone.
Uh-huh, yeah and I boardwalk.

Yeah, and I mean seriously.
I mean you know as well asanybody that that is a
ever-growing concern on allsorts of fronts, right, and
becomes increasingly importantbecause these, the Criminals or
whatever, are becoming more andmore sophisticated and how
they're utilizing that.
But so that's a big concern.
But you know, I think, likewith AI and stuff like that, so

(01:02:24):
obviously in this, in ourindustry at least, there's it's
just buzz about it kind of ingeneral with everybody.
But you know, I think there's alot of Fear with some of the
folks about like, oh, is thatgonna replace us or is that
gonna?
It's like, well, it's the samething with the internet, right,
it's just there's just gonna bea Ever-growing gap between the

(01:02:47):
people who are using technologyand people who aren't.
Just like with the internet,right, yeah, and the internet
came around, you know, maybesome advisors Didn't hop on that
train, some did, and I thinkthere just became kind of a
growing gap between the successof the ones who did and didn't
or who were late to the party,and I think, same thing with, I

(01:03:09):
think AI is gonna be kind of oneof those pivotal moments as
well, just in how they utilizeit.
But yeah, I mean.

Tim Shoop (01:03:17):
AI has been around for a long time.
People just don't know itbecause now it's a buzzword in
the media.
That's right.
You know chat, gpt and Google'sGoogle solution there, you know
they're, they're shaping thefuture and you know AI is is
driving more things than peoplerealize nowadays.
And AI in in terms of Roboticprocess automation, as far as

(01:03:44):
making apps talk to one anotherand software talk to one another
, algorithms in the world offinance Right, I mean it.
It helps shape Someone'sfinancial future.
Because behind the scenes,under the hood of Andrew
Martin's Atlas, you guys areprobably leveraging AI, or at

(01:04:08):
least you know your back officesright.
And they're leveraging AI tofind the best investments for
your clients.

It's going to be really interesting to the
marriage between AI and quantumcomputing, and you can probably
speak to them much better than Icould, but yeah, the relatively
near future is going to beinteresting.

Tim Shoop (01:04:32):
Yeah, and I'm not going to get into a lot of those
topics.
We actually talked about it onthe episode before last when we
had James Todd from DigitalBoardwalk on.
We talked all aboutcybersecurity.
You need to check out thatepisode, andrew, because that he
he's one of our top lieutenants.
I've known James for going on16 years now, since since I

(01:04:57):
brought him in as a young pupand we we kind of grew up
together in the in the world ofcybersecurity and he is a.
He is a top resource for thatand if you listen to that
episode, it'll open your eyes towhat's going out, what's going
out on the landscape.
So let's have a beer, suts.

Jared Shoop (01:05:16):
Alrighty, our next beer is from is the Maduro Brown
Ale from the Scar City Breweryin Tampa, florida.
It's a Northern English brownale brewed with flaked oaks,
full in body and silky on thepalate.
Maduro's brown ale chocolateand expressive notes, are
rounded out by toffee-likequalities and a light woody hop
presence.
That's another evening one.

Tim Shoop (01:05:37):
Yeah, and I'm not when I hear nuts in beer.
I'm not a big nut beer or brownyou know nut guy.
But yes, that is definitelyevening one.
Oh, I'll finish it.
It's not my favorite of thefour here, so it's got a nice
aftertaste, I think.
Yeah, the aftertaste is good.

That's the toasty, nutty aftertaste.
Yeah, the eat-a-lake.

Tim Shoop (01:06:02):
Yeah, yeah, well, maybe I lied, I'm a less hoppy
guy.

I don't like super hoppy, bitter.

Tim Shoop (01:06:09):
You know it's funny.
When IPAs came out, I was allabout the IPA.
Ipas give me headaches.
Really it's I.
Can I drink two IPAs Next day?
I'm going to wake up with aheadache.
Oh man, yeah, so I, my wife'sthe same way.
We were all about the IPAsbecause I liked the zing, you
know, at the end of the beer.
Yeah, but we don't.
I'm more of a logger Pilsnerguy these days.

(01:06:32):
And bourbon Well.
I'm learning, yeah, I'm learningthe world of bourbon and I'm
really becoming fascinated by it, to be honest with you.
So we're going to get into wegot a little bit of time left.
We're going to go into ourfinal segment and then conclude
the show.
We're going to talk aboutnavigating financial

(01:06:52):
uncertainties.
Let's talk about your expertisein helping clients navigate
those uncertainties.
I mean, we don't we don't havea crystal ball or sporting sport
betting book like Martin McFlydid.
So how do you, how do you, mrMartin?

(01:07:13):
How do you predict the futurewhen it comes to how to handle
my money?

Sure, I think, creating a plan that we've
stressed us at everything asmuch as we can, or right.
So when we we'll do cash flowanalyses and we'll look at, all
right, if we were to make thesedecisions over a long period of
time based on these assumptions,how does this turn out?
Then we start throwing curveballs at it.
What happens if this happens,what happens if this happens,

(01:07:38):
what happens if this happens,and so on, and then you know
that'll give us a good kind ofidea of all right, well, what
happens if there's a really badrecession right after you retire
?
What happens if one of thespouses needs long-term care,
which there's a 91% chancebetween a married couple that
one of you will need long-termcare?

(01:07:59):
Yeah, what happens if there'san early death of a spouse?
Right?
So there's what's called thewidows widows penalty tax, which
is kind of a made up term for aphenomenon that happens.
That you know, if you're asurviving spouse, you're going
to realize a loss in income, atleast via social security.
The surviving spouse gets tokeep the higher of the two
social securities, but not both.

(01:08:20):
So they're going to lose one ofthe social securities and
you'll probably you're going togo from being married finally
jointly, to now being a singlefiler, so you're probably going
to be in higher tax brackets.
So if you're making $50, $60,$70, $80,000 a year, married
finally jointly, that puts youin a 12% tax bracket.
If you're a single filer making$50, $60, $70, $80,000 a year,
that puts you in a 22% taxbracket, right?

(01:08:42):
So kind of the double way.
And you have loss of income,higher taxes, which is another
form of loss of income.
And so how do things look overa long period of time with that?
So, anyways, that's just someexamples, but point is that we
start throwing curveballs at theplan and say, all right, here's
how this holds up in all thesedifferent scenarios, right, and
if one of those scenarios wouldreally kind of break the plan,

(01:09:03):
all right, we've identified thisas a risk.
What do we need to do to startmitigating against this risk,
because there's always answersto things, right.
So how do we mitigate againstthat?
What do we need to do?
So, I think, just having a good, well thought out plan that, to
the extent that we can.
You know, one of the scenariosis not an alien invasion or a

(01:09:29):
zombie apocalypse, right, we'renot looking at those sorts of
things.
But to the extent that we canand what makes sense, we're
trying to stress test things.
And so I think, having a planthat you know, whatever you give
me there's a gotcha right.
So, if we can, all right, we'regoing to do this with this
amount of money or with thisasset or what have you, and
here's the reasons why, andwe're going to have to give up

(01:09:49):
this to get what this is goingto give us.
But this is going to give usright.
This, this makes sense incontext with everything else.
So I think, again, I'm a bigbalance guy.
So I think, looking ateverything in perspective and
context of all, right, we havethis type of asset or we have
this here that it's going to dothis for us, there's strengths

(01:10:12):
and weaknesses to this part, andso what can we do to counter
those weaknesses with anotherpart, all right.
So I think, boil it down into asentence, I think creating a
plan that is, I don't want tosay bulletproof, but as well
thought out, to make sure that,to the extent that we can,
whatever life throws at us, thatwe're able to withstand that

(01:10:37):
stressor, yeah.

Tim Shoop (01:10:38):
I mean it's, it's crazy.
The world is crazy right nowright.
I mean there's a lot of crazythings going on out there.
You know, like in the words ofmy 11 year old daughter's
favorite singer, olivia Rodrigo,it's brutal out here.
Indeed.
So the so let's this is alwaysour shortest segment of the show

(01:11:04):
.
Before we conclude, tell meabout and I think you touched on
one earlier, but a successstory.
I'd like to hear a successfulstory and an example from your
career and this success storycould be anything pivotal along

(01:11:24):
your career where you reallymade someone or a family very
happy with what with somethingyou might have done for them.
Now, I know we talked about theboating family.
That was a good example of howyou helped steer a family.
But tell me because I knowthere's got to be gratification

(01:11:45):
in this for you and it's notjust a job for you.
You're you really, I thinkgratification when you see
smiles, when you're getting areturn for those customers.
Let's talk about that becauseyou're creating someone's
retirement.

Yeah and yes to your point, the kind of living
vicariously through otherpeople's situations and knowing
that, like all right, I albeitit was a very small part, but
you know and those successesyou're like, I had a part in
that and that felt good.
So there's been times thatpeople have gone through and

(01:12:25):
maybe I don't want to share toomany details, just for you know,
no, I understand, yeah, butthere's been times that people
have gone through really toughthings that you know afterwards
they're you know I've gottenmessages and emails and I mean
we've gotten cards from clientsand stuff like that and they're

(01:12:47):
like I'm just so thankful thatyou came into our lives and you
were like this would have been atotally different experience
had it not been for you.
And what you've done with us,done for us over the last couple
of years and it's you know,it's emotional even to you know
kind of think about.
But you know it feels real good, albeit.
You know like that was a youknow tough situations and stuff

(01:13:09):
like that, but it feels realgood that the gratitude that you
get from those people and justthe working with great people
that can you know, after they'vegone through something terrible
, still have the mindset ofbeing thankful for you know the
things that they're thankful for.
Yeah that's a really neatexperience.

Tim Shoop (01:13:31):
Am I going to make you cry on the show man?

it's tough.
I'm thinking about a case inparticular that is tough, but
yeah, it is really.
It is.

Tim Shoop (01:13:42):
It's been nice.
I understand we can't talkabout that case on the show
because obviously you haveobligations you have the
fiduciary obligations andprivacy obligations to that
family but I like hearing aboutit and I like seeing you light
up and I enjoy seeing youremotional reaction to it.
Folks, you may want to watchthis one on YouTube because,

(01:14:07):
andrew, it's the first time Ithink I've gotten a guest to cry
on the show.
But that's great because that'sit's the beer.

I'm an emotional- .

Tim Shoop (01:14:15):
Ah, it's the beer?
No, but it shows your personal,passionate involvement with
your customers and I think thatsays a lot about you and it says
a lot about what you can do forthe folks out there.
So I want to kind of jump overhere a little bit and let's talk

(01:14:38):
about a call to action forlisteners to seek professional
financial guidance, steer themin the right direction, and I'm
going to dump a bunch ofquestions here and let you
answer them how you will.
When should they startinvesting?
So I know the answer to that,but I'm going to let you answer
it.
How do they start?

(01:14:59):
What if they don't have anymoney to invest?
Or is that a short-sighted wayof looking at it?
And then we can maybe toast abeer to all your answers.

Go ahead.
Obviously, getting started isso right.
Everybody we talk to that isthey always say I wish I would
have gotten started earlier.
I mean, just across the boardeverybody says that.
So I think, just taking thefirst step.

(01:15:32):
So, again, talking aboutpsychology, taking the first
step, getting started doingsomething, is the hardest, just
like getting the ball rollingright.
So that old analogy and thehardest is just getting it
moving at all.
And then the faster it getsmoving, the easier it is to keep
it moving right.
But the hardest part is thathuge push to get it moving.

(01:15:54):
And so, just like getting offthe couch, the hardest part is
getting off the couch right,taking that first step.
So whatever that looks like foryou whether that be to sign up
for your retirement plan throughwork and start putting in 1%
into it or something like thatwhether that be to reach out to

(01:16:14):
a financial professional orstart reading books and watching
YouTube pages or doingsomething like that to try to
educate yourself on some thingsand that's the interesting thing
about education, skills andknowledge, is that the
compounding effect on skills andknowledge is amazing and nobody

(01:16:37):
can take those things from you.
Right, you can lose money, youcan't lose skills and knowledge.
So building your own skills andknowledge, I think, is a good
place to start, and that couldcome from seeking help from
somebody who in trust or whathave you?
Or, of course, picking up booksand doing that sort of stuff,
but I think that's a good placeto start.
The younger you are, so againto your point, right when you're

(01:17:01):
in your 20s or something likethat, and you think like, oh
well, this is beer money thatI'm putting in my 401K or
whatever it is and I should be-.
They don't take my beer money.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So you know what's interesting.
It takes $27.40 a day to blowin frivolous spending, to blow
$10,000 a year, especially ifyou shop at.

Tim Shoop (01:17:22):
Starbucks.
Right right right, theyshouldn't say that on the show.
My 11 year old daughter,Starbucks and Stanley Cups.
I have no idea.

Yeah.

Tim Shoop (01:17:35):
I was just and you saw me looking back here at our
backdrop.
I have a lot of books here andI thought I brought in.
I think I have a book calledthe Beginner's Guide to
Investing, which is a very thinshort read which gives you the
basic outline of how to getstarted and what you should be
doing.
Do you have a book?

recommendation yeah, there's a psychology of
money, which is a great one.
There is behavioral financebooks out there.
So, again, I think, reallyunderstanding some of our own
biases and some of the thingsthat can you know again back to
like the gambling and these, youknow, the casinos understand

(01:18:15):
what makes us tick and how wemake decisions better than we do
, yeah, so understanding thosethings will really help.
The psychology of money there'ssome behavioral finance books.
There's the intelligentinvestor.

Tim Shoop (01:18:30):
That's how I like the title of that one Is that?
So that's a book you readcoming up.

Mm-hmm.

Tim Shoop (01:18:36):
And what is that?
The intelligent investor.
Yeah, I think that one is moreon like the stock picking or
stuff like that, but that's notgoing to help someone when they
first get started, right.

It.
Could you know if they are onthe apps and choosing individual
stocks or something like that?
Maybe instead of chasing youknow, the GameStop stocks or
something like that, maybe theycan take a more intelligent
approach to what stocks theyhold if they choose to go that
round.
But there's lots of other booksout there that I'm sure I'm not
mentioning.
And you know, when you're young, you know I don't agree with

(01:19:15):
everything that Dave Ramsey hasto say.
In fact, I probably disagree.
You know, agree with less thanyou know, disagree with more
than what I agree with.
But his, you know, thought onlike budgeting and debt
elimination and things like thatare pretty good.
You know universal stuff thatif you're just starting out,

(01:19:36):
what can really hinder yourgrowth is not knowing how to
budget.
Again, you know you can budgetfor beer money, right.
So not knowing how to budgetand getting yourself in debt and
then having to climb out ofthat.

Tim Shoop (01:19:48):
You know how I budgeted for beer money when I
lived in the tent Mm-hmm, Ilimited my food intake to ramen
noodles, beanie weenies andcrackers and I had enough money
left over for beer.

There's calories in beer, right you?

Tim Shoop (01:20:05):
know I had enough money to buy beer.
I wasn't.
I won't eat ramen noodles today, but hey, it is what it is.
It was a long, long time ago inmy life.
And you know what?
I'm glad I did it, because itreally made me work harder
through life and understand thevalue of family and growth

(01:20:28):
personal growth.
So tell our audience before wetoast our last beer and
introduce our last beer.
They can find you a on yourwebsite at
atlasfinancialstrategiescom.
Tell them how else they canfind you.
Look at this camera on the left.
Oh sure, talk to the audienceand just tell them how they can

(01:20:53):
find you, andrew.

Yeah, we have a YouTube page as well.
It's relatively new, so there'sa couple dozen videos on there,
but we're adding to it, ofcourse, every week.
So we you know again, hopefullyit's good, useful content there
.
And of course, you know I'mhappy to take phone calls if you
and again, just take it as youropportunity to get free advice.

(01:21:15):
I'm not trying to say anything,I'm not trying to talk into
working with me, but if there'ssomething that you've, you know,
from a financial planningstandpoint or business planning
standpoint, it's like you know Ireally need somebody's help or
advice with these things andyou're not sure where to go, I'm
happy to take a phone call,help you as much as I can.
If I need to refer you tosomebody to get the help that
you need or whatever, I'm happyto do that.

(01:21:35):
But the point is is that youget the help that you need, so
that'll be free.
And again, nobody's trying tosell you anything.
I'm not going to try to talkinto working with me, but it's
just meant to be a valuable,free piece of you know some free
information hopefully.

Tim Shoop (01:21:50):
Andrew, it's been a pleasure having you on the show
today.
Suds, tell us about our it'sall right.
Tell us about our final beerand let's toast and toast.
What a great episode.

All right.
So this beer?
The beer distributor wasloading them up and he said you
have to try this one.
It's really good.
But I don't know if I'mtrusting him.
He seemed like a frat guy.
It's the Boom Sauce double IPAfrom the Lord Hobo Brewhouse and
Woburn Mass, a big boat IPAwith a complex hop profile.
With five different hops ithits you with a strong tropical
fruit flavors before mellowingout to finish with a hint of

(01:22:24):
earthiness.
That's pretty mild.

It's hoppy.

It starts out like it's going to really hit you,
but it doesn't get that finishthat you're expecting.

It doesn't.

Tim Shoop (01:22:34):
You don't get that, that back throat bite that you
get in an IPA, yeah, but you getit up.
You get it all as you're takingit in.
Yup, that's 8%.
It's much more mild than Ithought.
Well, we need more of that ifit's 8%.
No, I kid, I kid.
Thank you everybody for gettingnerdy with us for an hour, well
, an hour and a half, and thankyou, mr Andrew Martin, for

(01:22:57):
coming on the show.
You guys go check outatlasfinancialstrategiescom.
Become a client if you will.
Otherwise, take his advice.
Go make money, ladies andgentlemen.
Grow your wealth, build yourretirement.
Have a great day.
Thank you, cheers my fellownerds and beer lovers.

(01:23:19):
Stay tuned for more nerds ontap.
Oh, and one more thing Help usspread the nerdy love and the
love for great brews by sharingthis podcast with your friends,
colleagues and fellow beerenthusiasts.
Build a community that embracescuriosity, innovation and the

(01:23:42):
enjoyment of a cold one.

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