Faithful Leadership in the Midst of Failure

In this episode, Brody addresses the painful issue of moral failure among pastors and its impact on the church. He explores what Biblical leadership should look like, drawing from 1 Peter 5, and shares practical advice on how pastors can stay faithful, avoid isolation, and stay accountable. Brody reflects on his own experience with his father’s moral failure and how it shaped his view of ministry.

Whether you're in church leadership or just part of a congregation, Brody offers helpful insights on what to look for in a pastor and how to support your leaders. He encourages listeners to serve one another in humility and love, emphasizing that a healthy church thrives when everyone is involved. Brody also shares updates about upcoming events like SWO25 Summer Camp and Winter SWO, and encourages prayer and support for your pastor. 

1 Peter 5:1-5
When Heroes of the Faith Fall NSR Episode
A Shepard Looks at Psalm 23 by Phillip Keller
WinterSWO Youth Retreat
SWO25 Summer Camp
 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Well, in this week's episode of NSR I'm recording
from the voice memo app on myphone.
You might have picked up onthat.
A couple of weeks ago we hadsome weird sound quality and
that might happen again today.
But y'all, I'm so hard onequipment and I'm sure that I'm
the only person that has apodcast who and everybody's got

(00:21):
a podcast.
These days Podcasts are likeyou know, everybody's got one.
Y'all know the saying.
Podcasts are like blankEverybody's got one.
If you don't know the saying,then you didn't grow up in the
70s or 80s and that's okay.
But anyway, I think I'mprobably the only person who
broke their podcast or thepodcasting equipment.

(00:42):
So I got some parts ordered.
Adam Garner got me some partsordered.
Have that back up and running.
So the sound quality may beweird.
The acoustics I'm justrecording straight onto my phone
and that came through reallyweird a couple weeks ago when I
did that.
But today I want to talk in thewake of the constant it seems
like never ending flow and tideof men who are in pastoral

(01:05):
ministry, who fall into somesort of moral failure and it
becomes such a widespread bit ofinformation and knowledge and
the impact it has.
A few years ago.
I did an episode a few seasonsback where I talked about I
think it might have been theRavi Zacharias incident.
I don't remember, but men thatI've looked up to.

(01:29):
I think it was titled somethinglike when Giants of the Faith
Fall, and we'll link thatepisode in the notes to this
episode so you can go back andlisten to that if you hadn't
heard in a while.
But today I just want to walkthrough God's design and plan
and instruction for whatbiblical leadership looks like.
How do we know if a pastor or aleader is doing and being what

(01:52):
he needs to do and be biblically?
I think what we find is thatoftentimes we're really shocked
when somebody falls.
You know there's a moralfailure, there's a moral failure
, but to be honest, I thinkprobably more times than not not
always, but more times than notthe signs and symptoms were

(02:12):
probably there, but that personlives on such an isolated island
or a high pedestal that nobodysees it, and so we'll look at
some biblical qualificationstoday and safeguards that I
think help.
Like.
If you're attending a churchwhere these safeguards aren't in
place, then I'd be concernedabout the potential for failure

(02:35):
within the leadership.
Some things that I think needto be in place that are biblical
and things that we'veimplemented both at Snowbird
Wilderness Outfitters and at thechurch where I'm a pastor,
elder Red Oak Church.
So I hope it'll be helpfulinformation and maybe an
encouragement if you've beenhurt or wounded by the failure,
the moral failure, of a man inministry.
So we'll get into it.

(02:58):
We're going to go and deep divehere and look at what the Bible
says about this.
Welcome to no Sanity Required.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
Welcome to no Sanity Required from the Ministry of
Snowbird Wilderness Outfitters.
A podcast about the Bible,culture and stories from around
the globe.

Speaker 1 (03:21):
Before we get into this episode, I do want to give
a shout out to a family in Ohiothat listens to NSR.
It's BJ and Kate, and thentheir kids, aubrey I don't know
if Aubrey listens to NSR andshe's a 17-year-old senior in

(03:42):
high school and then their boys,case and Cohen, 14 and 11.
I don't know if those guyslisten or not they may not but I
know BJ and Kate do.
Mom and dad, they have recentlyshown an incredible amount of
hospitality to my family.
We were looking for a place tomeet up with our oldest boy,
tucker, who a lot of ourlisteners know that Tucker is.

(04:05):
He plays football at VirginiaTech and he's taking a medical
red shirt this year because ofan injury, and so he recently
had a bye week where they didn'tplay, so he had two days off.
And then the team recently hada long distance road game and
Tuck had a day and a half off.
So over the span of a couple ofweeks he had about three and a

(04:28):
half days free, and we werelooking for a really cool place
to meet up.
Do some deer hunting, somearchery hunting, take our bows,
do some hunting Something thatTuck grew up doing and hasn't
been able to do a lot of sincehe's been in college and we went
and stayed with that family andthey opened up their home.
They opened up a home on theirfarm that belonged to BJ's

(04:53):
grandmother, who has since goneto be with the Lord, and let us
stay there and they fed us, theytook care of us.
I just I wanted to say thankyou from the NSR platform to
this family.
That made an amazing series ofmemories for me and my son and
my wife, and it was awesome.
A lot of you probably saw thebuck that Tuck killed.

(05:14):
I think he posted a really coolcouple of videos on Instagram.
If you don't follow him, tuckerHolloway on Instagram.
Anyway, a couple of cool videos.
He shot a real nice buck and wesaw a lot of deer and just had
a good time of fellowship food,watched some ball games in the
evenings.
Anyway, thank you to the Coxfamily, bj and Kate.

(05:37):
Y'all are incredibly graciousand I'm so thankful to have you
as friends and look forward togetting y'all to SWO soon.
Bj's been here to some BeStrong events, looking forward
to getting the whole family down.
So, anyway, thank y'all.
That being said, I've had a lotof time in the last couple of
weeks in a deer stand.

(05:58):
Y'all know I love to get in atree and hunt and I spend most
of November doing that.
I take a lot of time out of theoffice.
A lot of that time is not abouthunting, it's not about the
deer.
I haven't even shot anything.
I shot some does early in theseason just to put meat in the
freezer.
But I had the last couple ofweeks.

(06:18):
I've hunted a lot and killednothing.
But I've spent so much time inthe woods with the Lord alone,
just reflectively, and have beenable to already put together a
lot of material for SWO 25.
The teaching content ispredominantly going to come out
of Romans 8.
And so I've been working onthat content.

(06:38):
I think I'm probably going to,on Monday night, intro the week
with the last few verses ofRomans 7, that struggle between
the, you know, the battlebetween the flesh and the spirit
.
I may do an episode.
I'm sure we'll do an episode onthat soon.
I've been doing a lot ofwriting.
So Romans 7, romans 8, reallytrying to work on that.

(07:00):
Winterswove we're going to beworking through the book of
Philippians and I've not reallyactually dove into that yet
because I've been really excitedabout and getting a lot of
traction on the Romans 8 contentmaterial for SWO 25.
So that's been good.
But I've been.
There was a guy his name's SteveLawson Steve or Stephen Lawson

(07:20):
Steve, I think is what he goesby.
He's a pastor.
Lawson Steve, I think is whathe goes by.
He's a pastor, real, connectedto John MacArthur Master's
Seminary, grace Church, graceCommunity Church in California.
He was the teaching.
I don't think he was on staff,but he was the main teacher at a

(07:42):
church in Dallas I think it wascalled Trinity.
A lot of you are familiar withSteve Lawson.
Steve Lawson is kind of ano-transcript through texts in

(08:15):
the Bible, a passage ofscripture, and draws out the
main point of that text andmakes that the main point of the
sermon and then givessupporting application,
illustrations, things like that.
So it's a very pure way ofpreaching.
It's a very clean and safe andpractical way of preaching and

(08:35):
it keeps you from getting intothe danger of just sharing your
own opinions.
It sort of drives you into thetext and the text guides the
sermon.
But anyway, steve Lawson,that's what he's really known
for and it recently came out hehad had a moral failure.
This dude's probably gosh.
He's a good bit older than me,I think, seems to me like he's

(08:58):
probably in his 60s or 70s andhe was having an affair,
apparently with a girl that waslike in her 20s.
So you know, aside from thefact that it's kind of shocking
and repulsive, it's disorienting.
As Christians, it really throwsus off when that happens.
You know what I mean.
And it threw me off and spun meout and just kind of broke my

(09:21):
heart.
And he wasn't a guy that I hadreally looked up to, he wasn't a
guy that I really connectedwith.
But it just reiterated thatthis happens all too often and
there have been a lot of moralfailures with guys that I really
looked up to.
And again, I said in the introthat that earlier episode that

(09:42):
we did a few years ago, that waswhen Ravi Zacharias he had died
and after his death it came outthat he had had moral failure.
I mean horrific stuff and Idon't know how truthful or
accurate it was.
But there's another guy namedJohnny Hunt who I love and so

(10:04):
many of our listeners I knowadmire and look up to, and he's
a personal family friend.
My wife grew up in his churchand we were married in that
church and he became thepresident of the Southern
Baptist Convention and then itcame out that he had had a moral
failure.
And I still love him.
But it's just heartbreakingwhen it happens and it's to me,

(10:26):
to be honest, it's, it'sdisorienting, you know.
And then, um, a lot of you knowone of the early episodes of
NSR.
I talked about my dad's failure.
My dad was a pastor who, when Iwas young, growing up, he
pastored churches and then, youknow, once I was a little older,
he had a moral failure and itcame out that he had had

(10:49):
multiple moral failures.
I mean, it had been a patternof this and he explained things
to me later in his life he diedyoung.
He died about the age I am now.
When he was explaining to mewhat had happened, it was just
shocking to find out the depthof his, you know, of his moral
corruption or or or sin.

(11:10):
And and then I remember when,when all that came out with my
dad, I went off to college and Iwas, I was going to church, I
was a new believer.
I think it really came to faithas a 19 year old and I was
going to church at a churchcalled Living Word Baptist
Church and that was, uh, thatwas in just outside of Lynchburg

(11:32):
, virginia, and the pastor therewas a good friend of my dad's
and he really helped me navigate, just kind of healing from my
dad's failure.
And then that guy years laterlater he had a moral failure.
He's like dadgum, what in theworld's going on?
And then the guy that sort oftook over at that church after

(11:54):
him some years later he had amoral failure and I recently
heard that dude's wife on apodcast kind of tell that story.
His ex-wife now that theirmarriage ended.
That guy went crazy.
His name was Jason and I meanit was like every time I turn
around I feel like in my lifeI've run into this and I know
that some of y'all feel that way.

(12:15):
My mother in law every time ithappens she'll text me.
Did you hear about this?
And you can tell it's just likebreaking her heart and I had a
conversation with her recentlyabout this and for a lot of us
that have spent a lot of time inministry it's infuriating, it's
frustrating.
You know, it's kind of likeevery time this happens you got

(12:35):
to go through what's that thingwhere they you know they talk
about the different stages ofgrief where you're angry, then
you're frustrated, then you'reanxious, then you're depressed,
then you're afraid.
That may not be exactly whatthose different stages of grief
are, but it's something likethat and you might be familiar
with that.
But I feel like I go throughthat and for me, my tendency is

(12:57):
to be mad and just to get angry.
You know, and I was talking toTucker the other day and I said
you know, I don't think I thinkyou know.
And I was talking to Tucker theother day and I said you know,
I don't think I think you knowwhen, when Paul says there, but
for the grace of God, go, I.
I don't think if my dad hadn'thave committed adultery and and

(13:17):
and made the mistakes that hemade, I don't think I would have
been aware of how dangerous itis to just live life, especially
in ministry, and I don't thinkI would have been as alert as I
have been and I wouldn't besurprised if I would have had a

(13:38):
moral failure, because I thinkit's such commonplace for people
.
I'd be scared to know how manypeople just people, not pastors,
not men in ministry leadership,but how many people have
committed adultery.
I'm not talking about.
You know, jesus said commitadultery in your heart, then

(13:58):
you've committed adultery.
If you lust with your eyes,you've committed adultery.
I'm not talking about thatprinciple lust with your eyes,
you've committed adultery.
I'm not talking about thatprinciple.
I mean, like the physical act ofeither a sexual affair or even
an emotional affair.
You'll hear people talk aboutthat and I used to think what's
that?
What's that got to do withanything?
Until I walked through thatwith some people, a couple of

(14:18):
different guys, one pastorfriend who his wife had had a
quote unquote emotional affairwith a man in their church, and
walking through that with thatfamily it kind of helped me get
some context for it.
And I mean, I only had two orthree conversations with that
husband, that pastor friend, butit helped me go.

(14:39):
Okay, that's what this lookslike and I think typically an
emotional affair is going toturn into a physical or sexual
affair just a matter of time.
But I think in that case, byGod's grace, the Lord intervened
before that woman and that manwere able to go that far with it
.
But what I'm getting at is, Ithink, the moral failure of

(15:04):
other people, the way that I'vetried to make it a positive
thing in my life is make it,make it, um, use it to, to keep
a healthy level of fear in myown heart, in my own mind, that
man, this can happen to anybody,um, and I think there are times
where godly dudes have falleninto sexual sin with with you

(15:27):
know, in an adultery orinfidelity, fornication.
But I, I also and I'm focusingon men in leadership Every time
a man does this, there's a womaninvolved too, and so I'm not
saying that women don't do this,but why is it that this seems
to happen to men in ministry sooften?
And I want to give a fewthoughts on it.

(15:48):
And then I want to walk througha passage of Scripture, and we
may stretch this into a coupleof different episodes, we'll see
.
But we've got a lot coming upwith the holidays, so I always
like to do something aroundThanksgiving.
I also like to do somethingaround Christmas and also I do
something around Christmas.
But at NSR we just try to keepdrilling into culture and the

(16:10):
Bible and gospel stories ofpeople from around the world.
So we'll spend at least thisepisode.
We'll see how far we get here.
We've already been going for 15minutes or so, so let's see how
far we get and if we need tofollow up.
I do have just so much writtendown and I'm going to try to
read a lot, but how do men stayfaithful?

(16:31):
I guess that's one part of thisdiscussion and the other part is
, if you're not in ministry,you're a man or a woman, a young
man, a young woman, a husband,a wife, whatever and you're
looking at church leadership,what are the signs that need to
be important to you?
What do you need to see in yourpastor?
These are the things that Ihope people will see in me and

(16:54):
I'm not a lead pastor at achurch, but I am the lead pastor
at SWO and I am a pastor, anelder, at a church and I have
been at one time kind of like alead pastor I guess you would
call it at that church before webrought our pastor, joseph
Tucker, in.
So what are the characteristicsI'm looking for in my pastor

(17:15):
and that I want to help himmaintain and achieve?
And what do I want to maintainand hold and achieve in my own
life as a pastor, primarily leadpastor at Swoak?
So let's walk through thatscripturally.
So what are the things you'relooking for and how can you help
your pastor in those areas andthen, on the other hand, how do

(17:38):
you keep yourself from fallinginto this type of moral failure
or sexual sin?
So that's how I want to unpackthis.
So first off, let me just sayfor people that are married, and
especially for men that listento this, who are youth pastors
or pastors, let me just say somethings that I think have been

(18:01):
practical in my 30 years ofmarriage that I hope I can
continue to improve on and focuson, and one is don't live on an
island, don't isolate yourself.
A lot of times the nature ofministry sort of forces you into
isolation.
I talk to so many pastors andleaders that are serving in

(18:22):
churches where they feel likeman, I don't have any real
meaningful friendships oraccountability.
That can be tough, and so we'vegot to pursue that.
So if you're at a church let'ssay you're a youth pastor or an
associate pastor of some sortyou're at a church where the
senior pastor is not really he'snot investing in you.
I talked to a guy recently thatsaid he's never seen his

(18:45):
pastor's house.
I thought, well dang, that'sweird.
Now I know there are people atRed Oak that have never been to
my house, but there aren't manypeople at Red Oak that haven't
been to my house because ifthey're members, we host
membership course at our house.
So if you're joining our church, the pastors and elders at Red
Oak each take turns hosting oneof the membership courses.

(19:08):
Like our membership class takesa month, it's like four
Wednesdays and we cover all ofthe distinctives of our church
and anytime we do that, one ofthose Wednesdays we'll host at
our home, and so I know we havepeople in our home that way.
And then recently we've had twoevents in the last month.
One was a Halloween party andone was like a house show.

(19:31):
A couple of artists came in andplayed music at our in our home
, and so lots of people in thehouse.
And I think one thing that thata pastor needs to do is he needs
to be interacting with peopleon a personal level, and so if
you're a guy that is workingunder a pastor that doesn't do

(19:53):
that, then you're going to haveto create that in your own space
.
So be accessible to people.
Don't put yourself, becausewhen you put yourself on an
island, it can tend to.
You know, isolation is not good.
We were made for community, nowthere needs to be.
You need to be able to escapeto places of solitude, but don't

(20:16):
live your life in isolation.
We're made for brotherhood andfellowship and accountability
and availability, so do that.
I think that's important.
If you're serving under apastor that doesn't do that, I'd
be real concerned about that, Ithink I'd be real concerned.
And then the second thing isthere needs to be transparency

(20:36):
in your life.
So accountability, transparency, people that are going to ask
you hard questions, people thatyou can lean into.
I got a couple of friends thatare outside of this ministry,
that are not directly connectedto SWO, that I know I can lean
into and ask hard questions toand they're going to ask me hard
questions to and they're goingto ask me hard questions.
But also within this ministry,I'm thankful for the fellowship

(20:58):
that we have within thisministry, where we hold one
another accountable, and itdoesn't mean that somebody
couldn't slip through the cracksand that certainly has happened
, but in leadership it hasn'thappened here and there's a deep
level of accountability, butthere's's a deep level of
accountability, but there's alsoa deep level of fellowship, and
so I think that's important.

(21:19):
So don't isolate yourself.
And then I think you knowthere's this biblical principle
that we live in the light.
We don't do things in the dark.
When you enter into the dark,what you're doing is you're
making an opportunity for theflesh.
To make an opportunity for theflesh is to make an opportunity
for the devil, and those twothings are powerful in this

(21:39):
world your flesh, the internalstruggle with sinful desires,
and then what the devil's goingto put in front of you.
Don't give opportunity.
It's already going to be atough enough battle.
And what do I mean by don'tgive opportunity?
Well, untethered access to theinternet, private accounts on
things like Facebook andInstagram or Netflix or Prime

(22:00):
Video, where you can watchthings, see things, and not have
accountability.
We need accountability, whetherthat's accountability software
on your phone or iPad ortransparency with your wife or
your husband or whatever.
Just don't have secret spaces.
That creates what we would callopportunity for the flesh, and
a lot of us have fallen intotemptation in that arena, and so

(22:24):
I want to be very transparentwith that.
I don't know how many peopleI've talked to that have had
affairs.
This especially happened earlyon by reconnecting with old
flames on Facebook.
You know.
So need accountability andtransparency there, and there's
other things, but what I want tofocus on right now is this is

(22:46):
not, first and foremost, anepisode about hey, here are the
things that you need to be doingto stay faithful.
This is how we can help pastorsand view those in leadership
with a healthy and balanced doseof discretion and grace.
Let me say that again how do weview those in leadership with a

(23:09):
healthy and balanced dose ofdiscretion and grace?
So you wanna see those inleadership with some discretion.
They're not perfect, but alsoextend grace for their
imperfections, and what thiswould look like is knowing that
they're not perfect and so notbeing so critical and judgmental

(23:29):
of them, but having somediscretion.
Where a guy who has been like inthe Pentecostal or charismatic
churches one of the things thatI get frustrated with is a guy
will have a sexual failure,moral failure, and real quick.
They'll have him right back inthe pulpit because he's a
charismatic or dynamic preacher,when the reality is he's

(23:51):
disqualified now from thatposition.
He shouldn't be allowed topastor anymore.
There's other usefulness forhim in ministry once he's been
through the steps of repentanceand shown fruit of that
repentance with accountability.
But, gosh, he doesn't need tobe back up in the pulpit.
I've seen that happen a lot,and so discretion and grace

(24:12):
balance those things and I thinkone of the things what I want
to do is right now I want tolook at a passage of Scripture
in 1 Peter 5.
1 Peter, chapter 5.
So I'll read this and you canget over there and look at it,
if that works for you, but ifnot, I'll just read it to you
and then we're going to unpacksome things that I think will

(24:33):
help you as a leader, an elder,a deacon or just a man or woman
who's attending church and youwant to really help your pastor
or have a dose of reality whenit comes to, like you know, is
this guy leading in a biblicalmanner?
Let's get into this.
So let me read 1 Peter 5,beginning in verse 1.

(24:56):
I'm reading from the CSB thismorning, or whatever time of day
you're listening to this, forme it's morning the Christian
Standard Bible and thesubheading for this is about the
elders, about the elders.
Now for semantics.
The word elder here what we'rereferring to as a pastor,
someone in a pastoral job.

(25:16):
So pastor, elder, overseer,these are words that'll be used
in scripture.
So he says I exhort the eldersamong you as a fellow elder.
So exhort means stronglyencourage and motivate you.
I challenge and encourage andmotivate you.

(25:37):
Think of a really good coachwho motivates his players to get
the best out of those players.
So he exhorts the elders amongyou as a fellow elder.
So Peter's saying hey, I'm oneof y'all.
This is a pastor speaking topastors, an elder or overseer
speaking to elders and overseers.
And then he says and as awitness to the sufferings of

(25:57):
Christ, as well as one whoshares in the glory about to be
revealed.
So he's saying I'm a pastor andI'm speaking to pastors and we
need a lot of pastors and weneed overseers and elders and
pastors.
And I'm speaking to you and Iwant to challenge and exhort you
.
And I want to do so because I'man eyewitness to the ministry
of Jesus, to the glory of Jesusrevealed.

(26:19):
And think about Peter saw theglory of Jesus revealed on the
Mount of Transfiguration andthen he saw the glory of Jesus
revealed through theresurrection.
He was an eyewitness to theresurrection.
So Peter is basically speakingas one who has authority.
So what is this pastor, thisearliest pastor, some would say

(26:42):
the first pastor in theChristian church?
What does he say to otherpastors and elders as an
exhortation, a challenge, anencouragement.
I think the first thing he saysis that there's more than one
elder, there's more than onepastor.
Now he could be speaking topastors in different
congregations, but one of thethings that I think are

(27:06):
important is that a church hasand practices what we would call
a plurality of elders.
So I can give you the exampleof at Red Oak we have our lead
pastor Some churches would callthat the senior pastor or lead
pastor and then we have a teamof what we would call lay
pastors.
These are men who don't do thisas their job, but they meet the

(27:30):
qualifications of an elder.
Now, this is not an episodewhere we're going to get into
the qualifications of elders,but if you don't know what those
are, paul breaks that down inhis letters to Timothy and Titus
.
And so what are the roles andcharacteristics of an elder,
whether he's paid for the job ornot?
So a healthy church is going tohave probably a mix of paid

(27:54):
pastoral staff and non-paidpastoral staff.
I think that's a healthy andbiblical dynamic, and think of
it this way.
Again, I use the example of ourchurch, where each of us sort
of fits a little bit of adifferent role, feels a little
bit of a different role, andthat being some of us teach more

(28:16):
, some of us do more of theday-to-day work of
administration.
Some do the work of counselingand pastoral care.
Some are going to be moregifted in that area and then
some are going to be moreconnected to the discipleship
side of what the church is doing, whether that's working with

(28:37):
the deacons or the discipleshipgroup leaders in our small
groups.
So different jobs.
Think about, a church gets realunhealthy when you've got one
guy that's kind of doingeverything, calling all the
shots.
And you tend to see this in twodifferent arenas.
One, small churches, wherenobody steps up and leads and

(28:58):
one guy gets stuck doingeverything.
That guy's going to burn outand he's going to get unhealthy
spiritually, physically,psychologically, emotionally.
Or mega churches, where one guyreally all he does is gets to
be on stage in front of thescreen, in front of the camera,
and he's a really dynamicspeaker.

(29:18):
So he's preaching and teaching,but that guy he's not real
accessible to people.
The thing I love about theplurality a group of folks
sharing responsibility.
When I was a kid I've mentionedthis before there was a place
called Ghost Town in the Sky.
Ghost Town in the Sky was anamusement park in maggie valley,
north carolina, set up on topof the mountain and it bordered

(29:39):
the great smokies national park.
You could look over into thepark and some of y'all, I'm sure
, maybe visited, uh, ghost townin the sky, but it was a western
.
It was like an old cowboy, oldwest themed amusement park and
so there was like a main streetwith the saloon and different
things, a general store and thenthey would have these I mean,

(30:00):
you just saw cowboys walkingaround like you're in the old
West Guys would ride in on theirhorses and there was a bank
there and they would do theseenactments where these bandits
or outlaws would ride into townand they're going to rob the
bank and then the sheriff wouldhave a shootout with them.
And it was kind of like you'restepping onto the scene of one
of those old Western shows, youknow cowboy shows that a lot of

(30:23):
old guys like to watch.
Well, they had in the saloon.
They always had liveentertainment, some kind of show
going on, and it was all familyfriendly.
And I remember they had a guythere and he was just called the
one man band and I don't knowif you've ever seen a one man
band, but he's got, like youknow, one of these contraptions
that holds a harmonica right infront of his mouth and then he's

(30:43):
got a drumstick, you know,strapped to the bill of his hat
where he can hit a hi-hat cymbal.
And then he's got, you know, atambourine taped to one foot and
he's hitting a kick drum withthe other foot and he's playing
a banjo with one hand and adobro or guitar with the other
hand.
Whatever, he's playing allthese instruments.

(31:04):
But I'll be honest, I canremember, even as a kid,
thinking this is obnoxious.
I like it a whole lot betterwhen one person each is playing
one of those instruments.
There's a more symphoniconic,orchestrated sound to it.
So, a lot of churches, you endup with a one man band.

(31:24):
You got a guy up there and he'she's doing everything.
And then other churches, you'vegot a power structure where the
guy at the top he's calling allthe shots but he's not very
personable or accessible.
And so Peter is saying, hey, I'man elder among you, we're all
in this together, and so let'sshare the responsibility and
let's do this thing the way Godwould have us to do it.
So he says after that shepherdGod's flock among you.

(31:48):
So he tells the elders orpastors shepherd God's flock
among you.
Then he gives instruction onhow to do that, not overseeing
out of compulsion, but willinglyas's flock among you.
Then he gives instruction onhow to do that, not overseeing
out of compulsion, but willinglyas God would have you, not out
of greed for money, but eagerly,not lording it over those
entrusted to you, but beingexamples to the flock.
And when the chief shepherdappears, you will receive the
unfading crown of glory.

(32:09):
In the same way, you who areyounger be subject to the elders
.
All of you clothe yourselveswith humility toward one another
, because God resists the proudbut gives grace to the humble.
So let me give you a quote fromthis passage by a commentator
named Daniel Doriani.
This is really good.

(32:31):
Oh, actually.
No, I'm sorry, this is my.
I think this is my quote andI'll get to the Doriani quote,
not that it matters.
Okay, this is something I wrote, being an asset, not a
liability.
There's often a differencebetween a true leader and an
effective influencer.
Recognize that True leadershipembraces responsibility that is
often carried out behind thescenes and without appreciation

(32:54):
or approval from others.
Stress and demands ofhigh-level leadership will never
be understood by those inmiddle management or
ground-level leadership.
So for those of you that arepastors, youth pastors, lay
elders, deacons, small groupleaders, what I would say there
is.
What I'm saying is there aregoing to be a lot of things that
you do behind the scenes thatyou're not going to get credit

(33:15):
for, nobody's going toappreciate it.
But just serve and be faithfulto the Lord and his calling on
your life, knowing that the Lordis the one that rewards us, and
a lot of that reward is simplyin the gratification of
faithfulness, knowing that I'mserving faithfully.
Okay, now, now I want to readsomething from Daniel Doriani,
his First Peter commentary.

(33:37):
Leadership is a paradox.
It is a glory and a ruin, aprivilege and a torment.
People look for leaders who arein short supply and look to
leaders whose skills are oftenexaggerated.
People assist and advise them,favor and flatter them, haunt
them and hover over them, butothers suspect, criticize and

(34:01):
condemn they, drown theirleaders and delight in their
demise.
It's so much easier to review abook or movie than to write or
direct one, and it's so mucheasier to rail at a leader than
to be one.
Every step up is simultaneouslya step down.
Every leader knows theparadoxes of headship, sees them

(34:23):
, hears them, smells them comingin a way that fits his room.
A judge has great power.
He ferrets out the truth,protects the defenseless,
punishes evildoers.
He finds petty miscreants,jails the wicked, acquits the
innocent.
But every sound judgment'sgoing to disappoint someone a
little, and a few earn a leaderfull-blooded enemies.

(34:44):
Presidents and prime ministersare the most loved and the most
detested persons in their lands,the objects of fevered
adulation and plottedassassination In the circle of

(35:19):
being in leadership.
When you're a pastor, you'renever going to please everybody
and it's probably good ifthere's a healthy amount of
tension.
I say healthy.
You shouldn't live in constantconflict, but a little bit of
tension and some conflict thatyou have to sort of work through
is going to be good.
But I would say to people thatare disheartened and frustrated

(35:40):
by the failure of pastors again,this goes back to make sure
that you're not just critical orsuspicious, that you're
extending grace, but that youhave some discretion.
How can I help this personsucceed?
That should be the questionyou're asking of your pastor.
So again, it's a specificchallenge.
When Peter's saying I exhort theelders, he's speaking to the

(36:02):
leadership of the church, butit's important for all of us and
I think it's really importantfor those who are choosing a
home church.
It's important for theaccountability of leaders.
Those in pastoral leadershipare not called to some different
level of holiness.
They're not supposed to be likesuper Christians, but there's a
level of accountability andthat's addressed in James,

(36:24):
chapter three, verse one.
It says not many of you shouldbecome teachers because we will
receive a stricter judgment.
And so you think about againwhen a pastor falls the sexual
failure, financial failure,marital failure, abuse of power,
something like that.
It's very catastrophic anddestructive to a lot of people
and a lot of people lose heartand lose faith over that.

(36:46):
This is an intense moment for me.
By the way, for me when I readthis, it's like Peter's looking
right into my eyes, same waythat when Jesus looked at Peter
and he challenged him.
You remember this where Jesussaid.
This was in John 21,.
Jesus said Peter, feed my sheep.
And it's like I feel the weightof Jesus saying that to Peter.

(37:06):
When Peter is saying this to me, I exhort you, shepherd, the
flock that is among you.
It's very personal to me and,especially because he is a
fellow elder, he has this uniqueauthority and I appreciate that
.
It's kind of like I've talked.
I didn't serve in the militarybut I talked to men in the

(37:27):
military that say when anofficer starts off as an
enlisted man, he has morecredibility with the enlisted
men once he becomes an officer,same with a chaplain.
A chaplain who just comes instraight into the chaplaincy
doesn't have quite the sameequity with the men.
There's a guy named JeffStruker.
Many of you will have heard ofhim.
I think he's a professor, maybea teacher at Southeastern

(37:49):
Seminary now, but he used topastor a church in Columbus,
Georgia, and he was JeffStricker, was the Ranger of the
Year.
He was an Army Ranger.
He was in that Black Hawk Downdeal.
He was the driver of the leadHumvee and his book is crazy I
forget what it's called, butit's awesome.
He tells the Black Hawk Downstory from his perspective.
But the latter part of hismilitary career he was a

(38:12):
chaplain and I've always thought, man, that dude, you know guys,
those young rangers or younginfantrymen, they had to respect
him so much and so Peter's likethat he had failed miserably
and so he wasn't perfect.
When he says I'm a fellow elder, he's not saying, hey, do what
I say.
He's saying I've learned and Iwant to share from that and

(38:34):
that's a good example.
And then he you know the partwhere he says, as a partaker in
the glory that's going to berevealed, peter was a witness of
the part you know and and apartaker in the so much of what
Jesus had revealed, and wementioned that.
Uh, um, you know the fact thathe was there for so much,
including the, the, theresurrection of Jesus and what

(38:55):
you call it the transfiguration.
I think there was a commentator, I jotted this down.
He says this Peter notes thatthis revelation of God's glory
is not a single event but acontinuous act.
The unfolding of divine glory isan unbroken process and I
appreciate that, peter.

(39:16):
It's kind of like, hey, I wasthere when Jesus revealed his
glory in so many ways, but he'scontinuing to reveal his glory.
And I would say to you, brotheror sister, when you open God's
word in the morning, he'srevealing his glory to you.
When you look at the sunrise,he's revealing his glory to you.
The heavens declare the gloryof God.
This morning I looked at themountains and I'm spoiled.

(39:37):
I live in a place where I havea beautiful view from my front
porch, a beautiful view fromanywhere on the property at SWO,
a beautiful view from our NorthCampus.
I get to see the glory of Godin creation every day, but all
of us have that opportunity,even if you look up, if you
consider that we've just comeout of a full moon, and it was
so bright last night as I'mrecording this, it was so bright

(40:00):
last night, which was Sundaynight.
We see the glory of God in somany ways, and it's a constant
unfold and a continuous,unbroken process of God
revealing his glory to us.
And so, when we're you know,when we are serving in ministry,
we need to be aware of that,that God would reveal his glory

(40:24):
to us each and every day.
So then, what is it that he'sexhorting them to?
Well, he wants them to shepherdthe flock of God.
Now, I like this part that isamong you.
So the shepherding analogy isvery heavy.
In Scripture, jesus callshimself the good shepherd, the
great or chief shepherd.
Peter refers to him in thistext, in verse 4, the chief

(40:47):
shepherd.
The shepherd is conscious, he'saware of the needs of the sheep
.
It's a great honor, it's aresponsibility to serve and
protect these sheep.
And so for the pastor it shouldbe a very high calling to be
among the sheep.
The pastor isn't to liveseparate lives from the sheep,

(41:08):
he should.
You know there's the old sayinga shepherd smells like sheep.
Or he should smell like thesheep Because in the shepherd
world if you read like sheep, orhe should smell like the sheep
Because in the shepherd world ifyou read like the Philip Keller
books are great.
If you've never read A ShepherdLooks at the 23rd Psalm, oh man
, it's so good.
I love that book.
But a shepherd, he lives outamong the sheep and so he smells

(41:29):
like sheep.
And I think a lot of pastorsthey isolate themselves away
from the sheep.
You know, and um, and and.
So I think when, when he saysshepherd, the flock that is
among you he's, he's drawingthat conclusion that, hey,
you're going to be among thesepeople, you're going to be going
to ball, little league ballgames, high school ball games,
whatever.
You're going to be attendingfolks you know that are having

(41:52):
the cookouts and birthdayparties and you're going to
attending folks that are havingthe cookouts and birthday
parties.
The pastoral job is aninteractive job, but I would say
to you who are not pastors andelders don't be overly critical
of the pastor when he doesn'tattend that birthday party or
that cookout.
I mean, there's got to be someebb and flow, some discretion

(42:14):
and grace.
Remember, he's not going to beperfect.
Don't be offended if he doesn'tcome to your thing Like get
over yourself.
He's got a life to live too.
So, again, discretion and grace, ebb and flow.
A pastor shouldn't be completelyisolated, but he's not going to
be able to attend everythingfor everybody.
You know, I think about ourchurch, gosh.

(42:35):
This is why plurality is soimportant A team of elders, a
team of deacons, so thateveryone's needs are met and
people are ministered to.
The primary role, by the way, Ibelieve, biblically the primary
role of the pastor, the teacher, the overseer, the elder,
primary role is the teachingministry.

(42:56):
The teaching ministry.
Now, listen to this, because Ihear a lot of people say, man,
he gives a really good sermon,but he's just not very
personable.
Okay, then, be thankful that hepreaches faithfully.
Be thankful for that.
Now, I'm not talking aboutcelebrity pastors who are
completely out of touch, who areuntouchable, unreachable.

(43:17):
I'm talking about a guy whotries to interact with folks as
best he can, whether that's onSundays, at the end of the
service or he tries to get tothe events where he can interact
with folks.
But if he's faithfullypreaching the Word of God,
you're going to know it.
You're going to know he'sputting in the time.
He can't fake it Like you can'tfake it till you make it.

(43:39):
When it comes to rightlydividing the word of truth and
that's where it's a little bitdisturbing when something
happens like what happened withthis guy, steve Lawson, because
he was such an expositor but Ithink he was also it would seem
to me that maybe he had becomevery mechanical with his
exposition and he was.
This is going to sound verycritical and sound like I'm a

(44:01):
know-it-all, because it's ahindsight thing.
I never have really enjoyed histeaching a whole lot because it
was so polished andpresentation-oriented I don't
even know what I'm trying to say.
There needs to be a level ofhumanity and personality with
the speaker.
I don't know if that makessense, but at the end of the day

(44:26):
, the bottom line is the primaryrole is the teaching ministry
of the pastor.
Don't be offended if he don'tcome to your thing if he's
speaking and teaching andpreaching faithfully.
Listen to this quote fromMacArthur this is intense man.
This is called the man of God.
I wrote this down years ago.
I didn't write it down for thispodcast episode.

(44:48):
This is something that I readoften.
I'm going to get this put up onmy wall when I one day have an
office or a study or somethinglike that.
Macarthur this is on the man ofGod.
Now, this isn't part of thesermon.
This is an excerpt, by the way,from a MacArthur sermon, but
listen to this.
Here are some suggestions for apreacher.
Fling him into his office.

(45:08):
Tear the office sign from thedoor.
Nail up a sign Study.
Take him off the mailing list.
Lock him up with his books andhis Bible.
Slam him down on his kneesbefore texts and broken hearts
and the lives of a superficialflock and a holy God.
Force him to be the one man inthe community who knows about
God.
Throw him into the ring to boxwith God until he learns how

(45:30):
short his arms are.
Engage him to wrestle with Godall night long and let him come
out only when he's bruised andbeaten into being a blessing.
Shut his mouth forever spoutingremarks.
Stop his tongue forevertripping lightly over every
non-essential.
Require him to have somethingto say before he dares.
Break the silence and bend hisknees in the lonesome valley of

(45:51):
suffering.
Burn his eyes with weary study,wreck his emotional poise with
worry over his life before God.
Make him exchange his piousstance for a humble walk with
God and man.
Make him spend and be spent forthe glory of God.
Take away his telephone, burnup his ecclesiastical success

(46:13):
sheets, put water in this gastank.
Give him a Bible and time to thepulpit and make him preach the
word of the living God.
Test him, quiz him, examine him, humiliate him for his
ignorance of things divine.
Shame him for his goodcomprehension of finances, game
scores and politics.
Laugh at his frustrated effortto play psychiatrist Form a

(46:37):
choir and raise a chant andhaunt him with it night and day.
Sir, we would see Jesus.
And when at last he does enterthe pulpit, ask him if he has a
word from God.
If he doesn't, then dismiss him.
Tell him you can read themorning paper.
You can digest the televisioncommentaries.
You can think through the day'ssuperficial problems.

(46:57):
You can manage the community'sweary fun drives.
You can bless assorted bakedpotatoes and green beans at
infinitive.
Better than he can Command himnot to come back until he's read
and reread, written andrewritten until he can stand up
worn and forlorn and say thussays the Lord, break him across

(47:20):
the board of his ill-gottenpopularity, smack him hard with
his own prestige, corner himwith questions about God, cover
him with demands for celestialwisdom and give him no escape
until he's back against the wallof the word.
Sit down before him and listento the only word he has left
God's word.
Let him be totally ignorant ofthe downstreet gossip, but give

(47:42):
him a chapter and order him towalk around it, camp on it, sup
with it and come at last tospeak it backward and forward,
until all he says rings with thetruth of eternity.
And when he's burned out by theflaming word, when he's
consumed at last by the fierygrace blazing through him, when
he's privileged to translate thetruth of God to man and finally

(48:05):
transferred from earth toheaven, then bear him away
gently and blow a muted trumpetand lay him down softly.
Man, I just had to take a breakand step away.
I know you didn't feel thatbecause JB just edited it right

(48:32):
back in, but that gets me firedup and emotional to read that,
especially that last paragraph.
Finally, when he's transferredfrom earth to heaven, bear him
away gently, blow a mutedtrumpet, lay him down softly and
place a two-edged sword on hiscoffin and raise the tomb
triumphant, for he was a bravesoldier of the word and ere he
died he had become a man of God.
I hope it's said of me when myday comes.

(48:55):
It's powerful.
So a reminder there fromMacArthur that the number one
responsibility of the elder isto faithfully preach the word of
God.
So if your pastor is faithfulto the word, he may not be the
most dynamic communicator, butis he faithful to the scriptures
?
That's what's most important.

(49:15):
He may not tell the beststories or have a great sense of
humor, but is he faithful?
One of the things that reallyinfluenced and informed my
teaching and preaching ministryapproach to it was reading the
Martin Lloyd Jones book, thePreacher and Preaching early in
my ministry.
I appreciate it so much and itgives so much instruction on

(49:38):
these things.
But anyway, the last thing Iwant to do is give you these
three contrasts that we need tosee from the pastor from this
text.
He says this is in verse two.
After he says shepherd theflock of God among you, he says
not overseeing out of compulsion, but willingly.

(50:01):
So one of the qualifications ofa pastor is that he desires the
office.
When you read like, you'll readthat someone will say to me I'm
wrestling with the call topreach.
Now I'm going to say somethingright now that might be
controversial.
Someone will say when were youcalled to preach?
And then other people say man,I ran from the call to preach
for so long.
I hear so many guys say thatthat does not make sense to me.

(50:23):
Run from the call to preach?
The Bible says if any of youdesires the office of overseer
or pastor elder, I think we.
I don't even know what to dowith that.
When someone says I ran from thecall to preach and a lot of
times they'll quote um, they'lltalk about Jonah, and I do not
think that's the context of anew Testament pastor, um.

(50:45):
So it's just weird.
Jonah was given a very specificmission to go to a pagan,
barbaric people that he hated,they hated him and to street
preach, you know, and he ranaway from it, um, but eventually
he went and then he had a badattitude and it's like it's just
it's, it's it's wrong contextto say that that I ran from the

(51:06):
call to preach the way Jonah ranfrom.
I don't know this, haven't,haven't totally unpacked that in
my own heart and mind, but oneof the qualifications of a
pastor is that he desires it.
I'll read that to you, okay, sothis is in 1 Timothy 3,
beginning of verse 1, and thisis a section entitled
Qualifications for Overseers andDeacons.

(51:27):
1 Timothy 3, verse 1,.
This saying is trustworthy.
If anyone aspires to be anoverseer, he desires a noble
work.
So the idea is that theoverseer desires this.
There's a desire for it.
I have young guys a lot of timesask me hey, how did you know
you were called to preach, orwhat was it like?

(51:48):
They want me to share thatexperience and, to be honest,
initially some folks hadmentioned to me when I was in my
late twenties.
I didn't start preaching untilI was almost 30, 29, 30, right
in there.
I'd been working in ministry.
We're building SWO.
We started to work at SWO whenI was 25.
And so by about year two I wasI was teaching like small groups

(52:11):
, more like what a small groupleader would do.
You know, sunday year two I was, I was teaching like small
groups, more like what a smallgroup leader would do.
You know, sunday school teacher, I was doing a lot of teaching,
interacting with students.
But I was I was 29 the summerthat I preached my first sermon,
and I preached one sermon ninetimes each week of that summer.
Um, and by that next year, whenI was 30, of that summer, and
by that next year, when I was 30, I started to preach fairly

(52:34):
consistently.
But I found that there was anaspiration or a desire to do it.
And so one of the qualificationsof a pastor is he should desire
the office.
And so when Peter says, don'toversee out of compulsion, but
willingly, man, there should bea desire for this.
You'll see that in your pastor.
You should see the pastordesires to preach and teach and

(52:57):
shepherd and lead.
He's going to have joy in thework.
Now, a lot of times there's afight for joy in ministry, but
it's worth fighting for.
And then with that not undercompulsion but willingly, I
think there will be humility.
Pastors will be approachable.
There'll be a humility aboutthose guys and a lot of times
these dudes that fall when youlook back, there was a lot of

(53:17):
celebrity status or there was alack of humility.
It always makes me nervous, Itell you.
You see it a lot.
There's been so much moralfailure in the independent,
fundamental world and there's somuch haughtiness and aggressive
condescension in that world.
Pastors should be humble, okay.
The next thing he says is I gotto hurry, man, I've been going
a long time and this episode'sstretching out here, but

(53:41):
hopefully you're still hangingwith me and we're about to land
the plane here.
So the next thing he says is asGod would have you, not out of
greed for money, but eagerly.
Says is as God would have you,not out of greed for money, but
eagerly.
So it's not for shameful gainor greediness for money, but
eagerly.
The pastor doesn't lead becausehe's greedy for personal gain.
Financial gain can be adistraction and it's ruined a

(54:05):
lot of ministries and I hate tosay it, but there are pastors
who pastor for financial gainand I've known guys a lot of
times.
I think this is how this goes.
I've known guys that theystarted off faithful and then
they lost the desire and thepassion, but they didn't know
how to get another job, theydidn't know what to do with
themselves, they didn't have amarketable skill or trade, and

(54:29):
so they just keep working tocollect a paycheck.
They just keep pastoring.
He's saying that and I wouldsay guys like that.
Their days are numbered, butthere needs to be an eagerness
to carry out the calling thatGod's given us.
He says it this way.
He says not out of greed formoney, but eagerly.
We need to be eager to carryout the calling.

(54:51):
And then the last sort ofcontrast.
He says not domineering overthose in your charge, but being
examples to the flock.
Or, in the CSB, not lording itover those entrusted to you, but
being examples to the flock.
Lording it over is beingdomineering.
So, as a Christ follower, thepastor needs to use this

(55:14):
position to serve and strengthenand encourage others.
The principle has to beconsidered, I think, by anybody
in leadership, even in parenting, mothers and fathers, employers
, teachers, coaches, businessowners, especially, I would say,
people in public office.

(55:34):
There needs to be aservant-hearted mindset and then
a desire to set an example forpeople.
Thomas Schreiner he wrote acommentary on 1 Peter.
He said this Elders are not toenter the ministry so they can
boss others around, but so theycan exemplify the character of
Christ to those under theircharge.
That's a good way to live, byexample and then, I think, being

(55:58):
an example in humility and afear of the Lord.
Humility and a fear of the Lord.
As a man of God who's pastoringand leading, I need to be
fearful.
That is a scary thing to thinkabout.
I'm going to answer to God forhow I lead and the way I treat
people, and that's especiallyguys that have moral sexual
failure or who are likedomineering, you know, like

(56:23):
abuse of power.
I think, man, it's scary tothink about answering to God for
that, you know.
So some sobering thoughts there.
In verses four and five he sayswhen the chief shepherd appears
, you'll receive the fadingcrown of glory.
Jesus is the chief shepherd.
And so you know, as a pastor,an elder, I'm an under shepherd,

(56:45):
but he's the chief, he's theboss.
You know, I'm not the boss man.
Sometimes ministry hours will bereally late.
Situations can be difficult.
Those times I try to imagine Ireally do this.
I try to imagine that theperson I'm ministering to at
that late hour, that difficultsituation that could be an
inconvenience for me or little.

(57:06):
I try to imagine the person onthe other end is one of my kids,
like, imagine that I'm dead andgone and one of my children,
whether they're grown, they're aparent, they're a teenager,
whatever that they're in asituation where they need
pastoral care.
How do I want them to beministered to?
That's the way I try tominister.

(57:28):
But and what he's saying therein verse four is that if the
elder or the pastor is faithful,the reward will be worth more
than we can imagine.
He says you will receive theunfading crown of glory Y'all.
I don't know what that is, butI want to get one.
I really want to get one ofthose.
So that's kind of motivating,you know.
And then last he said besubject to the elders.

(57:48):
In the same way you who areyounger be subject to the elders
, in the same way you who areyounger be subject to the elders
.
All of you clothe yourselveswith humility toward one another
.
So as Christians and believers,we should submit to one another
.
This is a beautiful idea of howthe church works.
It functions this way weencourage one another,
strengthen one another in anorderly manner, with biblical
leadership within the church,just doing what you know.

(58:09):
This is God's way, god's planfor the church.
And God's plan, by the way, is100% of the time the best plan.
It needs to be the only plan.
So we're called to have deeprelationships, responsibility
and sharing one another's lives,bearing one another's burdens,
being willing to say and do hardthings in each other's lives,
to each other.

(58:29):
Tough love is part of theChristian life.
But it's not just that.
It's part of the Christian life.
It's driven by compassion andmercy, not judgmentalism or like
.
I'm going to say hard things topeople I care about, not out of
condescension or judgmentalismor arrogance.
I'm going to do it because Ilove them and I care about them.
I'm going to do it withhumility and a fear before the

(58:51):
Lord, so we can all fight thehypocrisy that's made so many
people turn away from the churchby just loving each other.
Well, so many people haveturned away because of the
failure of those in leadershipor the hypocrisy of Christians,
and so let's love one anotherwell, let's show kindness and

(59:13):
compassion and humility.
I would encourage you to be partof a biblical church that has a
good small group structure.
So that would be like at ourchurch.
We call them D groups.
I know some churches call themcommunity groups or impact
groups or grow groups, whatever.
But some churches are moretraditional and they still have
what's called Sunday school.
But the last line of ourpassage is God resists the proud

(59:35):
but gives grace to the humblebeing a part of a group where
you can share in one another'slives and extend compassion and
humility to one another, orspeak into each other and be
transparent.
That requires some humility andGod gives us grace in that.
And then also concluding thought, I would encourage you to pray

(59:56):
for your pastor.
It's easy to criticize a guyyou haven't prayed for.
And I don't mean whisper aprayer, I mean pray for those in
leadership, pray hard for themand try to see the grace of God
in their lives.
One of the most beautiful andpowerful things we can do is to
encourage one another and learnto give each other the benefit

(01:00:16):
of the doubt.
A healthy church is not achurch where the pastor does all
the work, but where everyoneserves one another.
We care for one another and welive in humility.
And I'll close with a quote fromTom Schreiner, another quote
from his commentary Smoothrelations in the church will be
preserved in the entirecongregation if the entire

(01:00:37):
congregation adorns itself withhumility.
When believers recognize thatthey are creatures and sinners,
they are less apt to be offendedby others.
Humility is the oil that allowsfor relationships in the church
to run smoothly and lovingly.
Pride gets upset when anotherdoes not follow our own

(01:00:59):
suggestions.
Peter grounds this admonitionwith a citation from Proverbs
3.34, and James also quotes thisHumility does not try to
impress or intimidate others,but places oneself under God's
authority and sovereignty.
That's where he says that Godresists the proud but gives
grace to the humble.
Believers should heed theinjunction to be humble, because

(01:01:22):
God sets his face against theproud but lavishes his grace on
the humble.
So I wanted to read this quotefrom Schreiner to get to that
line.
The last line in our passage isGod resists the proud but gives
grace to the humble.
So I wanted to read this quotefrom Shriner to get to that line
.
The last line in our passage isGod resists the proud but gives
grace to the humble.
Shriner says believers shouldheed the injunction to be humble
, because listen to how he saysthis God sets his face against

(01:01:45):
the proud that's a scary thoughtbut lavishes his grace on the
humble.
Humility moves the heart of God, and so does pride.
Those who submit to God'ssovereignty and humility will
find that God will lift them upand reward them.
So that's a good word fromSchreiner.
So, anyway, no one-man bands.

(01:02:07):
Here we're in this thingtogether.
Let's encourage one another.
And when you are praying foryour pastor here.
We're in this thing together.
Let's encourage one another.
And when you are praying foryour pastor, I think pastors
that are supported well, thatare held to accountability for
how they preach and teach, thatare given the opportunity, but
also the expectation, to befaithful to teaching and
preaching the word of God, andthen they're part of a loving

(01:02:27):
community.
Listen, your pastor is notperfect.
He ain't Jesus.
Jesus is the pastor, he's thesenior pastor, he's the chief
shepherd in 1 Peter 5.
But give your guy some grace.
If he don't come to your thingor he doesn't dress the way you
wish he would, or he's a littleoverweight, or don't let those
things be the things that driveyou.

(01:02:48):
Don't pay attention tosuperficial things.
Does he love the Lord?
Does he love the scripture?
Is he doing his best?
Give him some grace and thenuse some discretion.
If the guy's obsessed with howhe looks and what he drives,
then yeah, there maybe is aproblem.
Or if he's completelyundisciplined in his personal
life, that's going to show thereare things that we need to use

(01:03:09):
some discretion, but there's aloving way to confront those
things.
So let's pray for our pastorsand leaders and let's hold them
accountable, but let's hold eachother accountable and let's
operate with humility.
And anyway, those are mythoughts that I've got from
First Peter five after therecent, the recent goings on of

(01:03:30):
a couple of pastors that havefallen.
There's this whole thing downin Texas right now where in the
last year multiple pastors havehad moral failure this guy
Lawson, and then several otherguys from some other
denominations.
So it can be disheartening anddiscouraging.
But pastors aren't the onlyones that are hypocrites.
We all do it.
We're all guilty of some levelof hypocrisy.

(01:03:51):
Let's strive to be faithful toJesus first and foremost and
then give grace to one another.
So hope y'all have an awesomeweek.
Cool weather finally cominghere.
I'm so thankful I am planningto.
I'm actually, if you're in theI don't usually do this, but if
you're in the Raleigh Durham,cary area, I'm going to be

(01:04:18):
speaking this Thursday here, ina couple of days, at Campus
Crusade at NC State.
So maybe I'll see you there,Looking forward to that and I am
excited to be.
I just love this time of year.
So I'm planning on getting awood some this week here in the
mountains locally and do alittle hunting, and then next
week, thanksgiving, we'll spendtime with family, so excited
about that.
Kilby and Greg are home.
They're stateside with mygranddaughter, alma Ruth, and I

(01:04:42):
will tell you a lot of you askedabout that.
It has been amazing Just met mygranddaughter for the first
time.
She's five months old and she'spretty amazing, so we've been
having fun.
She loves to ride on thefour-wheeler, so we ride the
four-wheeler every day andthat's been awesome.
And Greg is doing an awesomejob as a dad and Kilby's doing
an awesome job as a mama and I'mjust so thankful for them and

(01:05:06):
it's been awesome.
So it's going to be a specialThanksgiving, first Thanksgiving
as a granddad.
I'm excited about that and theentire holiday season coming up.
So hopefully you're coming tosomething at SWO and this winter
we got a lot of winter stuffgoing on.
We've got Winter SWO, severalof those student ministry events
, we've got the Pure and Holyevent, we've got the college
retreat and then right there atthe end of winter going into

(01:05:28):
spring, we've got our Men's BeStrong event for March and then
our Women's Respond Conferencewill be in April.
So lots of activity coming upin the months ahead.
So hopefully we'll seesomething.
And yeah, enjoy, enjoy thisseason.
It's an awesome, awesome seasonof the year.
I'm grateful for it.
See you guys, we'll see y'all.

(01:05:49):
Grateful for it.
See you guys, let's see, we'llsee y'all, lord willing, next
week, right here at no SanityRequired my favorite podcast.
Thank y'all for supporting us.

Speaker 2 (01:06:01):
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