Dave Grohl

Dave Grohl and Norah hang out in Foo Fighters' studio to play through some choice songs from his epic career. Dave talks about why he decided to take the hard road after Nirvana, getting lost in the White House, and asks Norah to take him to music school. Norah and Dave duet on a song that he hasn't played in 20 years, and he makes her day by lending his powerful drumming to one of her songs. This warm and wide-ranging episode gives an intimate peek into the mind of one of modern rock's most beloved legends. Recorded 4/26/23.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, I'm Norah Jones and today I'm playing along with
Dave Grohl.

Speaker 2 (00:04):
I'm just playing long with you.

Speaker 1 (00:11):
I'm just playing lone with you.

Speaker 3 (00:17):
Hey.

Speaker 1 (00:18):
There, I'm Nora with me as always is Sarah Oda. Hello, Hello,
Welcome to the show. Welcome.

Speaker 4 (00:24):
How are you doing.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
I'm good. We're on FaceTime.

Speaker 4 (00:27):
Yeah, this is a first for us.

Speaker 1 (00:29):
It's the first separated intro. I feel together though, yes,
I feel you. Okay.

Speaker 4 (00:36):
So today we had the incredible honor of hosting a
guest artist that I know, for me and I think
for both of us, was completely a dream come true.
And by host, I mean we went to his studio
and yes, he hosted us really and ate his dunkin Donuts.
But yeah, our guest today is the incomparable singer, songwriter, storyteller,

(01:00):
extraordinary frontman of the Foo Fighters and drummer of Nirvana,
consummate artists in every sense of the word, and just
badass human all around, Dave Grol.

Speaker 1 (01:12):
We had so much fun hanging out. I have not
really got to hang with Dave in many, many years.
We recorded together about twenty years ago for one of
his albums, and that was the first time I met
him We've hung over the years many times, and we
have a shared manager, John Silva, who we talk about
a little bit in this episode. We also talk about

(01:34):
songwriting and a lot of music nerds stuff.

Speaker 4 (01:40):
Yeah, as like kids of the nineties growing up with
Nirvana and the Foo Fighters. It's hard to imagine not
being influenced by him and these bands and these songs
are just sort of the soundtrack to so much of
my life, like from back then through now. In fact,
they just released their latest studio album earlier this year

(02:00):
called but Here We Are and you've got to check
it out.

Speaker 1 (02:03):
It's really beautiful. And we caught up with Dave around
I think it was the same week they released the
first song from this album, so it's a little bit backdated.
But yeah, we had a great time hanging talking playing music.
He graced me with his drumming on one song. So
I hope you really enjoyed this episode. We had so

(02:24):
much fun hang in. We're gonna drop you in when
Dave is talking about the Kennedy Center Honors, which is
an event every year they hold in DC to honor
the arts, and we were together one year honoring Paul McCartney.
So that's why we got on that subject. So that's
what we start out talking about. I hope you enjoy
the episode, and please enjoy Dave Girl.

Speaker 4 (02:43):
Don't forget to like us and subscribe to Nora Jones
is playing along wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 5 (02:49):
Yay.

Speaker 6 (03:03):
The funniest part of that whole Kennedy Center experience was
hanging out with Stephen Tyler.

Speaker 1 (03:11):
Oh, he was a hoot.

Speaker 6 (03:13):
He was amazing. But I got stuck behind him at
a metal detector and it was like a good twenty
minutes of my life.

Speaker 1 (03:25):
Why is he made out of a metal ring?

Speaker 2 (03:28):
Oh?

Speaker 6 (03:28):
Ring ring ring, necklace, necklas necklace, necklace.

Speaker 1 (03:35):
It was just like, that's hilarious.

Speaker 6 (03:36):
I know, I felt like I was at Tiffany's. It
was completely insane. But yeah, what a crazy experience. You know.
One of the coolest things about that that weekend was
there was that rehearsal stage. It was off to the side.
First of all, I grew up in DC. I grew
up outside. That's right where in Alexandria, Virginia, just outside,

(03:59):
and so you know, as a kid, we would go
to the Kennedy Center on like field trips or sometimes
like there'd be a show and the family would go.
I saw Beatlemania there i could, And so the Kennedy
Center was always this really really special place, even just
to go, you know, it seemed like one of the museums,

(04:20):
almost like a museum of music. You had the Smithsonian,
but then to go to the Kennedy Center it was
such a huge deal. And then to be invited to
it to play, so I was I was freaking out,
like I'm like, oh my god, this is the coolest
thing I've ever done in my life.

Speaker 1 (04:36):
That was the first time you'd been invited to do
something there.

Speaker 6 (04:41):
No, Okay, I went once when they were honoring the
who ah, And it was during you guys can come in,
It's fine. It was during the w. Bush administration, so well, yes,

(05:06):
I didn't necessarily agree with a lot of the politics
at the time. But one of the things that was
really cool about those Kennedy Center events was that people
could kind of put aside their differences and just be
there for the music.

Speaker 3 (05:24):
Yeah, and.

Speaker 6 (05:28):
You know, you'd go to those receptions and you would
meet people from both sides of the aisle. And having
grown up outside of DC. The reason why my family
moved to d C was because my father was a journalist,
he was a writer, and he was a conservative Republican.
My mother was a public school teacher and she was
much more at liberal Democrat. So I kind of grew

(05:48):
up in this world where both of those things can coexist,
be divorced but whatever. Like, I was kind of in
the middle.

Speaker 1 (05:56):
Of those two things.

Speaker 6 (05:58):
So, you know, I could hang out out with my
father's friends on the weekend when I was a kid,
and we'd go to Georgetown and you know, they'd sit
at this bar and have cocktails and talk politics and
not really everybody agreed on everything, but they could at
least like sit and have a cocktail and talk politics
without like a brawl.

Speaker 1 (06:17):
That's kind of what we're missing totally.

Speaker 6 (06:19):
Yeah, that old environment that fun like all the president's
men like VW bugs and Corduroys and cigarettes and the
elevator and Scotch on the weekends or whatever. That's how
I remember Washington, DC. Much different than it is now.
But anyway, but being at those events, getting to really

(06:39):
sit and talk to different people. At that one with
George Bush.

Speaker 7 (06:45):
W.

Speaker 6 (06:47):
You know, they do the metal ceremony in the East
Room of the White House and afterwards it was around Christmas,
and afterwards they said, hey, do you want to get
your picture taken with the president. And there was that
part of me that was like really kind of politically conflicted,

(07:12):
but then I decided, well, we're here, and we're here
to be a part of this event, and we're here
to honor the musicians whatever. So I, my wife and
I walked into the room next to the Christmas tree
to get our picture taken, and I greeted the first
lady and then I said hello to him, and I mean,
I look like this right. I don't look like a

(07:33):
marine or a Republican or a politician or anything. And
he looks at me and he goes really loud. He goes,
where are you from? And I was like, uh, just
right over the bridge over there. We're facing like the
South lawn. I'm like, just over in Virginia. He's like, oh,
what are you doing here? I said, I'm doing a
song with the for the Who. He's like, oh cool.

(07:56):
And we got a picture taken and then I go downstairs.
At the time, Jordan, my wife was pregnant, and she
had left her coat in the coat room and I
was going to try to find it before we went
down to the Kennedy Center. So I was downstairs looking
for the coat room and was lost in the White House,
and all of a sudden, these secret Service people come

(08:18):
through the hallway and they're like, they're like, everybody step beside,
the President's coming through. And I kind of like hugged
the wall and here he comes, and he's walking and
he looks me dead in the eyes and he goes,
see you down there, dude, And I was like, oh
my god, I want to get wasted with this guy,
Like I want to totally hang and have cocktails and stuff.

Speaker 1 (08:38):
That was the thing.

Speaker 6 (08:40):
Oh but the one, the one for Paul that was
so cool. There was that rehearsal space that was sort
of on the side of the main stage, and I
was sitting there waiting. I think Stephen Tyler was performing,
rehearsing his thing. And I looked and I saw there's
a house band, and I saw one of the horn

(09:02):
players was Blue Lou Marini from the Blues Brothers band Wow.
And when I was a kid, I was obsessed, fucking
obsessed with I had Beatles records, Steve Martin records, and
the Blues Brothers record and that was like, that's my
musical foundation, like Steve Martin and the Beatles. That's it.

Speaker 1 (09:22):
That's perfect.

Speaker 6 (09:23):
But then to see Blue Lou and he was kind
of sitting by himself in the corner and I walked up.
I star fucked him so hard. It was just like
mister Marine. He's like, yeah, I'm like, oh my god,
I freaked out so bad on him.

Speaker 1 (09:37):
That's so fun. Yeah, I mean yeah, meeting people like that,
you probably made his day too. He was probably stoked.

Speaker 6 (09:45):
I just I still honestly feel like that first of all,
like meeting those heroes, like, it's never lost on me.

Speaker 1 (09:54):
Yeah, I never go it doesn't seem like it is.

Speaker 6 (09:58):
Yeah, it doesn't feel like that at all. It's that
first moment of feeling like, oh my god, that person's real.
This is like three D this is actually happening right now. Yes,
But then over time you start to realize like, oh,
it's kind of just like this community of people that
like to play music. Yeah it is, Like it can

(10:18):
be as simple as that, or you could flip out
and you know, meet one of your big heroes and
lose your mind. But I do that. You know, there
are also times where I get more nervous to meet
people who are relatively unknown, like punk rock heroes. Then
there was once when we played a music Cares thing
and we were doing a song for Neil Diamond. I

(10:40):
didn't grow up listening to Neil Diamond. I did it
for this friend of mine who passed away. His mom
was a huge Neil Diamond fan, so I flew her
out from Virginia because I thought, oh shit, if we
do this, she'll get to meet Neil Diamond, this will
be huge after losing her son, Like this will be huge.
But I never listened to Neil Diamond, so when I
met him, it was just like, oh, yeah, I's like

(11:01):
this cool dude. Like I didn't freak out at all.
But then, like the first time I met the singer
of like the Jesus Lizard or The Dead Kennedy's, I'm
just like, you know, completely lose my mind.

Speaker 1 (11:13):
When I met you, I felt really like a stone,
like I don't know what your memory of it is.
But when I came in to sing Virginia Moon, yeah,
I was like so excited to meet you, but I
don't know how to show it sometimes and it gets
inward and then I look like I'm a stone. There's

(11:36):
something I do that's weird like that, because I grew
up air drumming to you.

Speaker 6 (11:41):
Oh really? Yes? Oh shit.

Speaker 1 (11:43):
I have this vivid memory of listening to never Mind
in my aunt and uncle's bedroom spare room and just
like air drumming the shit out of it.

Speaker 6 (11:56):
Are you a drummer?

Speaker 1 (11:57):
I'm a drummer on the inside waiting to come out?

Speaker 6 (12:01):
What are you waiting for?

Speaker 8 (12:04):
No?

Speaker 1 (12:04):
But I would just like go nuts and I don't know.
So I was excited to meet you.

Speaker 6 (12:09):
Wow, that's so weird, But I was, well, I was
nervous to meet you because you're an actual musician and
there's not too many of those around here.

Speaker 8 (12:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (12:17):
Well, in our world, it's just a bunch of people.

Speaker 1 (12:19):
That like I feel like we all are though. I mean,
you know, actual musicians, we're all actual musicians.

Speaker 9 (12:27):
That makes me feel so much.

Speaker 1 (12:28):
You're an actual musician. I'm an actual musician.

Speaker 6 (12:31):
You are an actual musician.

Speaker 1 (12:32):
Sometimes I don't feel like it's doing this. I'm like,
what the fuck am I doing?

Speaker 6 (12:36):
How do I.

Speaker 1 (12:36):
Play this song?

Speaker 6 (12:37):
Really?

Speaker 1 (12:38):
And usually when I get in the room with the
person and then we're doing it together, it's like, oh yeah,
I do know how to do this, but I don't know.
Sometimes it's like you go in a room with someone
and you overthink the moment, and then the moment is
just an easy moment, and then if you overthink it
it becomes difficult.

Speaker 6 (12:57):
Well, there's also like, I'm sure at this point you've
feel like with your voice, your voice sounds so beautiful
and so natural that I can't imagine you have to
think much about singing. And that's kind of the way
I am with drums, Like I don't really have to

(13:19):
think about what I'm going to do next, And there's
sort of this and not that I'm the best drum
in the world, but it's like there's this, there's this
there's this disconnect from like or maybe it's a connection
from my head to my hands, and my body will
just do the thing that fits with the music, you know.

(13:43):
So whenever I sit down and play the drums, it's
like I feel totally at home. I feel totally comfortable
and just like, good, okay, well, this is like it's
relaxing to me, even if it's like beating the fucking
shit out of the drums. To me, it makes me
feel really really happy because I just get to let

(14:05):
loose and not think about stuff.

Speaker 1 (14:07):
That's the best.

Speaker 6 (14:08):
It's the best, whereas everything else I do, like in
the Food Fighters.

Speaker 1 (14:12):
You've made it hard on yourself totally why.

Speaker 6 (14:15):
I mean, I honestly think like after Nirvana ended, I
had the opportunity to go keep playing the drums for
other people, but I kind of knew that I could
do it. And then there was this other weird thing
that I had just experimented within the studio where I
was playing guitar and I was singing and stuff. I

(14:37):
was unsure if I could do that, and that was
really a big part, like, Okay, I did that, I
know I can do that, so I'm going to try
doing this other thing. And the intention really was like
basically just to keep playing music, but also to do
something that I didn't really know that I could do it,

(15:01):
and that was sort of the excitement of doing it.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
I think the challenge is exciting, right without questions, and
then once you do it, it's like.

Speaker 6 (15:09):
Yes, yeah, like if you really nail something, yeah. I
was explaining this to someone recently that we were talking
about my daughter Violet, who has this fucking beautiful voice.
She's amazing she's got this great voice, and she's just
like intrinsically musical and can figure out instruments really quickly.

(15:35):
And she's got amazing pitch and this really soulful voice,
and she has it. She's the real deal. And she
sings with this confidence which is kind of beyond her years.
It's almost like she's been doing it her whole life,

(15:56):
which she has. But when she gets out to play
live and someone said, God, she's so confident, does she
get nervous? I'm like, oh, absolutely. But we were talking
about those like thirty steps from the side of the
stage to the microphone, and the courage that it takes

(16:18):
just to go from here to there and then go
do it that that those thirty steps, that's ninety nine
percent of it, just to like run out there and
have the courage to bury your soul to a bunch
of people or you know, yeah, what she does. She's
such a sensitive, beautiful, brilliant person. But like most artist,

(16:44):
she has this real vulnerability for her to like just
stand out there and do it, and then to do
it the way she does it.

Speaker 1 (16:51):
Is like wow, Yeah, it's the thing. She's got a
beautiful voice, she had a great voice. Okay, you want
to try you want to try statues?

Speaker 6 (17:02):
Yeah, let me see what does this is?

Speaker 1 (17:05):
You on piano?

Speaker 6 (17:06):
On the recording, it is, Oh my god, this is
so dumb.

Speaker 1 (17:08):
It sounds great.

Speaker 6 (17:10):
Okay, So this is a long time ago. This is
I don't know, fifteen years ago or something. Fourteen years ago.
My birthday was coming up and my dream car was
like an old Dodge Hemy I think the car from

(17:32):
Blue Velvet. I can't remember if it's a Challenger or
a Charger, but like a really badass, like seventies like
muscle car. And I've been talking about it a lot
with my wife, kind of hinting but not obnoxiously. And
my birthday was coming up and she's like, she's like, wait,
do you see what I got your career birthday? And

(17:54):
I'm like okay. She goes, you need to be here
on Tuesday. It's arriving and I'm like, she called me
the fucking car. I was so fucking psyched. And we
have this long driveway that comes up to the house
and she's like, okay, it's here, and we were standing
at the front door. I'm like, I'm like, I'm gonna
hear a muscle car coming up the driveway. It's gonna
be fucking amazing. And I'm see there waiting and waiting,

(18:15):
and all of a sudden, I look and there's two
guys pushing a fucking piano up my driveway. I had
never played piano before, never, no, ever, and I was like, oh,
thank you, and so so eventually I started sitting down
at it and just figuring it out. And you know,

(18:37):
it was really cool because having done this my whole life,
this is guitar is my first instrument, and having done that,
just like having this new like template or palette and
the notes are kind of funny play and in your
hands are doing these weird things. It was really like
I felt like a kid. I felt like I was
just starting over with this thing. And I started writing

(19:00):
a bunch of piano songs and yeah, this is maybe
like sixteen years ago, and this is one of the songs.
And one of the things that I loved about about
the piano was that it kind of opened up my
love of Am Gold radio like in the seventies, that's

(19:22):
the shit I grew up on, like Cherry Rafferty and
Andrew Gold and Phoebe Snow and Helen Ready and Carly
Simon shit like that. That's the kind of stuff I
listened to when I was a little kid driving around
in the car with my mom. So I still have
this love of kind of really gentle, melancholy, pretty melody

(19:43):
and harmony. And the guitar line in this is totally
Baker Street by Jerry Rafferty. Okay, it's exactly what, yeah,
i'd see if I really remember. I'm totally just trying

(20:16):
to remember it. Okay.

Speaker 1 (20:26):
I think that's cool though, because I think when I
started playing guitar, I wrote a bunch of songs that
were totally different from anything I would have ever written
on the piano because I was limited to certain chords
that were just different than what I would normally play.
And I think that's the best.

Speaker 6 (20:41):
Well also, and I'll explain it and maybe some of
the other songs that we do. I really only took
a couple of guitar lessons when I was young, and
then I just started to kind of figure it out.
But I kind of look at the guitar as a
drum set in a weird way. So a lot of
the stuff that I do is sort of perk ussive
and they're all kind of syncopated drum patterns, like a

(21:07):
song like ever long like that, And so I'll use
like the lower strings as as like kicks and snares,
and then I'll use the higher strings as symbols, and
so when a chorus comes around, I'll do more like

(21:30):
and let those sort of those notes hang out like
I was washing on a symbol. But yes, it was
cool to figure.

Speaker 1 (21:41):
Out songs on the That's cool the way you think
about it.

Speaker 6 (21:46):
Okay, let's see wait, I like.

Speaker 1 (21:50):
You use all these two chords. I used what two chords?

Speaker 3 (21:57):
That is?

Speaker 8 (22:01):
That?

Speaker 1 (22:01):
What that is? No, I'm not going to it's funny.

Speaker 6 (22:06):
Actually there was once when there was this. We decided
to take Violet, my daughter, when she's little, she was
like four or five, to this class called piano play
and there was just these little kids and the first
thing they do is they try to teach you sound recognition.
And you don't have a flight or something. You have

(22:28):
to get to. I talk a lot. I can help it.
So I have a book called The Storyteller. It's available
on day Street books. Where they sit down. The first
thing they do is they do sound recognition, and they're
like they teach them the sound of like a saxophone
and then the sound of like you know, a cello
and things like that, just to attune their ear to whatever.

(22:52):
And I would take her and we'd sit on the
floor and it's really fun. They would do this thing
with puppets where there was like there was like I
think the lion and the mouse, and the lion was
like the low notes, and the mouse like I know,
it's whatever. And then one day she comes in and
she puts a white board down, like a dry erase board,

(23:16):
and she goes, okay, and she drives a circle and
she goes, this is a whole note. And I was like,
oh my god, I'm gonna learn how to fucking reduce
it right now.

Speaker 2 (23:28):
He finally was like.

Speaker 1 (23:31):
Hysterical, all right, let's see if we can do this.

Speaker 6 (23:37):
One, two, three four.

Speaker 10 (24:01):
You and I were too old and tortured souls repaired
by love, broken things.

Speaker 3 (24:11):
In alife, just somebody's growing up.

Speaker 6 (24:15):
No fear of here, benife.

Speaker 3 (24:21):
We're g storedinary people, you and me.

Speaker 6 (24:32):
Time will turn us into statue.

Speaker 10 (24:36):
Essentially, we got by though we never needed much slive
of hope, diamond rings.

Speaker 11 (24:53):
We got high.

Speaker 3 (24:55):
It was heaven. It was help fly over them.

Speaker 6 (25:01):
Broken wings. We are just stortin every people.

Speaker 8 (25:08):
You and me.

Speaker 10 (25:15):
Tom will turn us in the statues eventually, just to
ordinary people.

Speaker 6 (25:30):
Human me tam will turn us send the statues then.

Speaker 12 (25:47):
Upbone storee and stone mine humans.

Speaker 4 (25:53):
So lie.

Speaker 10 (25:57):
To the says andry fanmust fade away time.

Speaker 3 (26:29):
We're just stornerry people.

Speaker 6 (26:33):
You me Samuel turns in the statues.

Speaker 10 (26:43):
Eventually 'sous stordinied people.

Speaker 13 (26:54):
You and me.

Speaker 3 (27:01):
Tamil turnis in the statues.

Speaker 6 (27:05):
Itally, Oh that's nice. Wow, I haven't done that. I
got choked up while I was saying that.

Speaker 2 (27:17):
It's a heavy song.

Speaker 1 (27:19):
It's really really beautiful. That was so pretty. Holy moly,
thanks for letting me playing piano. You should play it?

Speaker 6 (27:28):
Do you fucking kidding me? There's no way I would
have been able to pull that off. I don't even
know the chords.

Speaker 1 (27:37):
Well, there's a CE size and then there's a that's
the best one. It's like a B flat, but it's
got all these extensions, got like a major seven and
a nine. You know, I noticed learning these. It's like
a it's like numbers to say what what note? You're
playing corp It's pretty because you do a lot of what.

Speaker 6 (28:00):
God, I'm gonna learn how to read music right now?

Speaker 1 (28:03):
You do a lot of like major seven chords in
these songs.

Speaker 6 (28:07):
I'll play a major seven?

Speaker 8 (28:13):
Wait?

Speaker 6 (28:13):
What was that?

Speaker 3 (28:18):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (28:21):
Is that it?

Speaker 2 (28:22):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (28:23):
I mean it's funny because I literally don't know the names.
I know, like the Cowboy chords, but I don't know,
which is kind of awesome because I don't ever know
like if something's right or wrong. Like I don't have
any version of right or wrong. It's like there's no wrong.
Well yeah, but sometimes, like I would never encourage someone

(28:46):
to not take lessons, because I think it's great to
like you know your hands and the thing where you're
going or whatever. But I do like the mystery of
really not knowing. Uh, you know, when I was writing
that I cannot play Virginia Moon, I totally forgot it.

Speaker 1 (29:05):
But yeah, I know, we gotta do it. I mean,
that's it's like a jazz song.

Speaker 6 (29:15):
Wait, ship, what are those chords?

Speaker 1 (29:28):
I don't know? Honestly, I had a hard time figuring
them out. D dunder right, But I feel like you're
going chromatic? Is that how you wrote it? You just
kind of went chromatic and then use your ears. But
that's the way you have to do it, right.

Speaker 6 (29:49):
Okay, Well let's move on before we get to that,
because who knows that's anyway?

Speaker 1 (29:55):
So so music music, sad, I I want to ask you.
I was I was at the Gordon show yesterday and
I got to meet like Billie Eilish for a second. Yeah,
and I was stone cold, sober, like nothing. I'm a fan, like,
I love her. I think she's amazing. Sure, and I

(30:19):
I just said the stupidest thing, you know, Like when
you get to meet somebody that you like and you
want to you want them to think you're cool, but
you also want them to know that you think they're cool.

Speaker 6 (30:29):
And what do you think I've been doing this whole time?

Speaker 1 (30:32):
So this is my question for you. How do you
do what you do? I feel like everybody, as I've learned,
everybody is just awkward and nervous all the time. I
used to think it was just me, but it's everybody.
But you don't seem like that. Oh do you still
have that stuff inside? Because you just seem like one
of the least I'm a mass you seem the least
like that of everyone I've ever met.

Speaker 6 (30:52):
Well, I think maybe I definitely get nervous when I
meet people that i'd really admire or people that I've
wanted to meet. But no, you know, I think that
it might be that both of my parents were very social.

Speaker 2 (31:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (31:17):
So my dad working on Capitol Hill or working in politics,
it's like he dealt with people right, and he could
work a room, like he could hang with the jazz
musicians and talk jazz. He was a classically trained flatus
and a super jazz nerd. He could hang with the

(31:39):
jazz musicians or like Alan Ginsburg and then go like
party with Bob Dole or whatever. Like he could really exactly,
so he could do that. And my mother is a
public school teacher. You know, both of them also were
like in communications. I know that sounds so nerdy, but
you know, my father was really good at public speaking.
You could write speeches, He wrote speeches, and he was

(32:01):
like a pr guy. And then my mother, she taught
public speaking and she dealt with fucking teenagers, you know,
Like it's one of the reasons why I think I
had such a great childhood. I really did, because, you know,
being raised by a public school teacher, it's like she

(32:23):
understood the mind of a child in in all of
its phases and could really like sympathize or empathize or whatever.
It is, like the shit I was going through as
a teenager, as like a rebellious punk rocker. It's like
she dealt with that bullshit all day long. But I
was her kids, so like, you know, there was real love.

(32:46):
But I don't know. I mean I always think, like
imagine you imagine a backstage like you're hosting your friends
at a barbecue or something, and you know, I like
to make sure everyone's got a d and its happy.
But then also when you go out in front of
a bunch of people to play music, I used to

(33:09):
get I used to get really fucking nervous, like nervous nervous.
I had an anxiety attack once on stage at a
Nirvana gig, and this set off like a good ten
years of anxiety before every show. Really where it was
before the record Nevermind came out and we were opening
or no, maybe it was our own show. I can't remember.

(33:29):
It might have been opening for Dinosaur Junior. But it
was at the Warfield and the curtain was closed and
we were we were gonna we were opening the set
with the song Polly, which is just Kurt on guitar
and me just sitting there and singing backups and then
like hitting one symbol. So no way to like exercise
any weird nerves or anxiety.

Speaker 1 (33:52):
It's like your hands are tied down a little bit.

Speaker 6 (33:53):
It's terrible. And so you're like strapped into this ride.
It's not moving. And so the stage hand guy who
was probably like wired on blow or whatever, he kept
coming over like two minutes, are you ready? Two minutes.
I'm like no, I'm totally fine. I've never been nervous
before in my life. And then he's like one minute.
You got one minute? Oh my god, and I'm just
like okay, Jesus fun Christ. And I wanted to make

(34:16):
sure that my kick drum was in place. I go
doush and hit it and the PA was on it.
Boom and the audience goes wow. Right as the curtains
open and the war field it's like it's it's like
a wall of people, you know, it's really tall with
a balcony. And I was just like and I started
having this, I almost fainted. Whoa god. It was terrible.

(34:36):
At every show from then on, I was fucking terrified.

Speaker 1 (34:42):
Every show for ten food fighters whatever festivals. That's crazy.
It just set it off.

Speaker 8 (34:48):
Dude.

Speaker 6 (34:48):
I couldn't get I couldn't get rid of it. It
was terrible. And then I don't remember why I changed.
But now when I walk out on stage, it's like
I see people that I've seen for like thirty years almost,
and like that the kid in the front row who

(35:12):
was always in the front row is now an adult
with a mustache and his kid is on his shoulders.

Speaker 1 (35:18):
You remember these people in the front.

Speaker 6 (35:20):
I remember faces, like I swear, you know. But that's
the thing, because I also like engage with the audience,
and I like to say, like, Hey, what's up. We're here,
you know, Hiah, let's go for the next three hours
or whatever. But to be able to like really to
feel comfortable in that sort of connection or communication where
you're just like you can really see the people in
the nosebleeds. Yeah, and I got way off track with

(35:44):
that fucking question, but but no, it.

Speaker 1 (35:46):
Relates to everything. I mean, it's interesting because you know,
you seem so good at being around people. Is basically
the question I do.

Speaker 6 (35:57):
But I also like getting stuck in traffic. Sometimes you like.

Speaker 1 (35:59):
It getting stuck in try myself so that you can
like look at people next to you.

Speaker 6 (36:04):
And I'm like here in my car, now that is that? Yeah,
Like I just get to go like.

Speaker 1 (36:12):
Because you are you exhausted yourself.

Speaker 6 (36:16):
It's so tired of being myself.

Speaker 1 (36:18):
No, but like yeah, I mean it's hard to be alone.
I mean you also have a big family, you have, yes,
a big band, and it's really rare to be alone.

Speaker 6 (36:29):
Right, well, this is one of the reasons. But like
I'll wake up before the sun, Like I wake up
at fucking four thirty or five in the morning. Oh wow,
just so I get a good two hours.

Speaker 1 (36:37):
Of like quiet and then it's like wow, yeah.

Speaker 6 (36:41):
But no, I mean you know, I also love I
like to meet people.

Speaker 1 (36:46):
Yeah, well cool, it is fucking you.

Speaker 6 (36:49):
Get to meet so many people doing this thing where
it's like I really do like meeting people and talking
with them, and it's great. You know in Virginia, growing
up in people talk to each other in.

Speaker 1 (37:01):
Virginia, That's true. It's a different thing.

Speaker 6 (37:03):
You kind of like you're like you're at the subway,
sandwich place or whatever, and you wind up having a
conversation for like seven minutes. Maybe this is why I
talk too much? I don't know.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
I talk a lot sometimes, Like if somebody asked me
directions in New York City, I'll go above and beyond
and they're like walking away, like okay, dude, I'm I'm
sorry I asked you know, like no, but you got
to go left. But then there's that store. Oh, and
there's a coffee shop. I'll talk to strangers like that,
but I won't, you know, I don't know how to
talk to people that I'm meeting always.

Speaker 6 (37:37):
Hey, I want to play drums.

Speaker 1 (37:39):
I want you to play drums so bad. It's my
favorite thing. Really in my mind I wanted. I was like,
I just want him to play drums on something and
maybe everything. Do you want to do this song? I'm
so stoked you wanted to do this song because this

(37:59):
is a good this is a good drummer song.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
I am Lena.

Speaker 14 (38:26):
You are the Jesus my twin in flames to win
me again. I am the last came before my twiny flames.

Speaker 8 (38:39):
Let me from the ground.

Speaker 1 (38:51):
You are the harder.

Speaker 15 (38:53):
I am the second, my twin. I'm in flames, moling.

Speaker 3 (39:00):
I have a names you call me by.

Speaker 15 (39:04):
Now's when I'm on fire. Hot me.

Speaker 16 (39:27):
Sky's my witness, the child to be stop for my
swim on fire, don't swim take you from semple, you
go over might swear I haven't clean read onto fi

(40:05):
my pockets an empty too hearty stripped back my twin
Kim flame when na even.

Speaker 15 (40:25):
Patsy basketball also.

Speaker 3 (40:28):
Time sweating flame.

Speaker 16 (40:30):
I'm sorry, hold stirle Loo conten years as plain as.

Speaker 3 (40:36):
Gam I love Empy.

Speaker 15 (40:39):
I should let him. You have the learner.

Speaker 14 (41:06):
I'm the chaser, my twin flames.

Speaker 2 (41:10):
Do we meet again?

Speaker 17 (42:09):
You just made my heart saying give me in bloom.

Speaker 1 (42:58):
Oh my god, I just died. I just died inside
my sixth grade self just died. That's the best way
to end that song ever.

Speaker 5 (43:17):
That was great.

Speaker 1 (43:18):
Thanks for that. Now I need a cigarette.

Speaker 6 (43:20):
When did you start singing?

Speaker 1 (43:26):
It's like church choir age five? Yeah, but I always sang.
I think, yeah, I think singing is just oh like
when I was twenty, Yeah, I wrote a song in
high school. I was in this like synth. I went
to a performing arts high school. It was pretty great
and we had this like synthesis group synth ensemble. Wow,

(43:49):
I know nerd alert. Actually it was incredible. It was incredible.
There are these three seniors that were my idols, and
it was awesome. But the guy had, the teacher, Ken Ellingson,
had us write a song and we all like played,
you know, somebody would take the moog base and some

(44:10):
all these guys played drums too. They grew up in
the church playing everything. Wow, and my song, like, I
was so scared, you know, I had never written a
song before, so I wrote this like my teacher hit
the time had just told me how to like outline
chords on the piano.

Speaker 18 (44:28):
It was like.

Speaker 1 (44:30):
It was very like smooth sort of no, no, I
mean it was not I don't know. And then the
teacher had us put all these synth strings on it.
He's like, yeah, let's build it up like the production
will be like super Yanni, and that just deflated everything
for me. I was like, I came home crying. I

(44:53):
didn't think Yanni was cool. Then now I kind of
kind of into it. I kind of Piani it's incredible,
but like at the time, that was not what I
was going for, and so I came home crying. Molly
he said I sounded like Yanni, and then I clammed
up after that, and I didn't write another song until
I moved to New York, and I, you know, I
was playing jazz gigs and singing all these songs that

(45:14):
were eighty years old. And then I went to this
songwriter club and got hooked up with all these songwriters.
I picked up a guitar and I learned four chords,
and I wrote like come Away with Me Amazing, and
it's kind of a country song, you know. And it
was that simplified thing where it's just like, Okay, now
I'm inspired.

Speaker 6 (45:33):
You know, that's kind of this when I was a kid.
So I took the couple guitar lessons and then it
was like Mary had a little lambshit. And then my
mother bought me the complete Beatles anthology that just had
the chord charts right and the silvertone guitar with the

(45:54):
amp in the case. And I had the Beatles record.
So I would just sit around and look at the
chords and play along with the record and look at
the chords. And that's basically how I learned to play guitar,
but also the idea of composition, arrangement and harmony and

(46:20):
you know, melody and whatever. But you know, and then
I was listening to rush and things like that and
starting to get interested in the drums. But I didn't
have a drum set. So I had this weird like
captain's bed that was like this bed that had like
drawers under it or whatever, and I would put on
records my mother would bring home. We didn't have a

(46:42):
record player, so my mother would bring home those public
school record players, yeah, where like you take the lid
off and it like as a tiny speaker, and I
would listen to records on that and I would set up.
I had this chair that I would use as a
high hat, and then I put a pillow between my
legs as a snare, and then my bed be the
toms and the cymbals and stuff, and I would drum. Yeah,

(47:03):
that's how I learned how to play really crashaw and
then I would I would do that all day.

Speaker 1 (47:09):
Long, and it didn't bother anybody, no, because it was.

Speaker 6 (47:12):
Only quiet, like my mom's So lucky totally. But I
didn't have a normal drum set. My room was so
tiny too, but I didn't I didn't learn to play
on a drum set. So but I was, you know,
listening to rock songs and trying to figure out like
guitar leads, but I wasn't really good and like listening

(47:33):
to you know, Zeppelin, and but I wasn't any good.
And then I saw a punk rock band. The first
time I ever saw a band on stage was a
punk rock band in Chicago and they were called Naked
Raygun and they had It was at this tiny little bar.
There were maybe forty fifty people there. But they had

(47:55):
four dudes in the band. There was a bass player,
guitar player, singer, and drummer and they like, you know,
they weren't a amazing band, but it was so simple
and that's what inspired me the most. Where I was
just like, ye, shit, that song is three chords.

Speaker 1 (48:08):
It doesn't have to be Oh my god, you started
playing trying to play rush.

Speaker 19 (48:13):
I know. I was like.

Speaker 8 (48:16):
This guy.

Speaker 6 (48:18):
I was like, oh my god, I could do that.
We can totally do that.

Speaker 1 (48:20):
Totally. That makes sense. You start simple and just do it.
That's the best.

Speaker 8 (48:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (48:26):
And I think for kids too, it's important to to
recognize the the simplicity and the relatability and that it's attainable,
you know, Like it's one of the things when you
see stuff on TV where you know you're singing these

(48:48):
seeing these singers with these like amazing voices, these really soulful,
established like voices, and then like this huge production and
you kind of forget that it's really as simple as
like your dad's old guitar that's in the garage he
hasn't touched in twenty years, like and I prefer it. Yeah,
pick it up and just start doing stuff and don't

(49:09):
be you know, don't be worried about sounding like that
or something else. Just like just kind of suck, you know,
and then keep sucking and then like get better and
then have your friends come over. Like I do also
think that it's important for when you're young to play

(49:30):
with people that you can relate to that your age,
your little tribe. You find your weird friends, so you
start doing weird shit, and before you know it, you
know you have a band.

Speaker 1 (49:42):
So it's like the thrillingest thing, the most thrilling thing.

Speaker 6 (49:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (49:47):
Also, I think when kids or or even adults even
me now, like taking a pottery glass, you know, when
you do something simple and you succeed at it, it
makes you want to keep doing it. When you do
something hard and you suck at it, you don't want
you put it down like me, It's me at the wheel. Basically,
I put that ship down and I make masks instead,

(50:07):
you know, weird creepy masks.

Speaker 6 (50:09):
You make creepy masks I do. Really?

Speaker 1 (50:12):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (50:13):
Cool?

Speaker 1 (50:15):
Is it? So? The new album you just announced it
this week and I'm very very excited. And I loved
the songs I've heard because you sent me a couple
and they're really really great. They're beautiful. And I love

(50:39):
that one that your daughter Violet sings on Geez show
me how wow. She does have a super haunting voice, which.

Speaker 6 (50:50):
Is she has an amazing voice. And the cool thing
we've recorded some things together. She has amazing taste of music,
by the way, Like I mean, she's she's just as
much about Joni Mitchell as she is like the Misfits
or the Garden or young punk rock shit or like

(51:12):
crazy Electronica or Billie Holiday, and you know, she goes
deepest stuff. So when she sings, she really sings with
this beautiful with soul, you know. But one of her
favorite punk rock bands is the band X, which she

(51:34):
loves so much. And years ago we recorded an X
song together, the song called Nausea and uh, and we
did a duet and it was really cool because she
when we sing together, we totally lock in together, like

(51:58):
we're so I mean, I taught her how to talk,
so real thing. Yeah, it was really amazing. But yeah,
that that song in particular, I mean, the new records
really heavy. There's a lot of emotional stuff on it.

(52:18):
And so my mother passed away last year. I know, God,
it was hard. Sorry, But while I was with her,
towards the end, I was saying, I would just sit
and play guitar for her every day, all day long.

(52:39):
And I came up. I came up with this melody
and it was really pretty. And I remember at one
point I'd been working on it for a while and
I said to her. I was like, hey, I've got
this thing I've been working on. What do you think
And she kind of went yeah. But that's why I

(53:05):
turned it into the song Show Me How, which is
basically about my mother and her passing and Violet. I
thought it would be very cool because in the song,
you know, I'm basically saying like, don't worry, I'll take

(53:26):
care of everything, and towards the end of the song,
you have my daughter singing the same thing. So it's
kind of this cycle of life trip. It's terrible.

Speaker 1 (53:42):
It's beautiful, It's really beautiful.

Speaker 6 (53:44):
It is the most beautiful song on the entire record.

Speaker 1 (53:47):
It's so beautiful in the way she sings the melody. Yeah,
it's really special, and I mean, yeah it's heavy, but
that's that's life. That's the ship that everybody you know
deals with. And yeah, it's so you know, it's so raw,
and and I think people people feel the same, you know.

Speaker 6 (54:09):
I know, I wish i'd remembered it.

Speaker 15 (54:14):
Oh.

Speaker 6 (54:14):
I know one thing that's kind of cool that I
was thinking could be sort of Neto. I was talking
about like how I played the guitar like the drums.
So at some point I started getting really into this
sort of like fingerpicky pull off sort of thing, and
and just messing around with with patterns of just like

(54:42):
things that I guess sound kind of like I don't know,
blue grassy or country. I don't I don't even know
it's called. But like there was once where there was
once years ago where someone from a record company called
and they said, they said, have you heard about this

(55:05):
mine collapse in Australia a place called Beaconsfield. They're like
there's there's this mine collapse and there were two miners.
I think there were three, and maybe one didn't make it,
but there were two miners that were stuck in this
mine shaft for days, and so the rescuer was drilled
down I guess next to the mine shaft and contacted them.

(55:29):
Two of them were still alive, and they asked them
if they needed anything before they could like get them
out of there, and they said they wanted water and
an iPod with Foo Fighters music on it.

Speaker 1 (55:42):
Oh my god.

Speaker 6 (55:43):
And so the people are record companies, like are you
aware of what's going on? We said no, and so
they told me, and so I sent them a message
like hey, fellas, I hope you're doing okay. We're all
thinking about you. And when you come out, like, beer's
on me, like let's go, let's do this. So so
the next time we went down to Australia, we were

(56:05):
actually doing a show at the Sydney Opera House. We
were doing this acoustic thing and I heard that Brent
Webb was his name, one of the miners. He was
going to come to the show, and so the night
before I thought I would write him a song and
perform this song just for him at the Sydney Opera
House thing, and I sat in bed and I kind

(56:26):
of did that thing where it was like sort of
like a drum riff thing. I called it the Ballad
of the beacon Siealed Miners.

Speaker 20 (57:42):
It it.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
Oh my god, that is awesome.

Speaker 6 (59:03):
It was pretty cool. And then afterwards we had beers
that have been incredible at the hotel and he was like,
we were about to make the same record that Virginia
Moon is is it on that one? And he said,
he guess where you can put it on the record, right,
And I'm like, yeah, totally totally forgot about it.

Speaker 1 (59:23):
I never thought of it.

Speaker 6 (59:23):
Could till the last day of recording the record. I'm like, oh, fuck,
I promise that miner dude, So.

Speaker 1 (59:31):
Is it on the record?

Speaker 6 (59:32):
Yeah? Yeah, It's called the Ballad of the beacons Field Miners.

Speaker 1 (59:35):
I love it. And you said Razor was hard. That
looks much harder.

Speaker 6 (59:38):
Razor is a weird one.

Speaker 1 (59:39):
Razor is hard, though, but that looks harder to me
as a layman.

Speaker 6 (59:45):
It's sort of the same idea I wrote it to.
I wrote it for a gig. Really, there's a benefit
gig here in Los Angeles and it was acoustic, and
I had to go up. I'm like, God, am I
going to do the same shit over and over again?
I thought, you know, write something cool.

Speaker 1 (01:00:07):
That's always fun when it happens. Yeah, it's a great
song because it's kind of it's kind of indian y.

Speaker 6 (01:00:16):
Yeah, you mentioned that.

Speaker 1 (01:00:18):
It really is, and I don't know if it was
in my head because you sent me that story about
going to the George Fest and seeing my dad and
my sister and stuff, but something about it just it's
very drony and well that's like the sharp four?

Speaker 6 (01:00:32):
What which that?

Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
A lot?

Speaker 6 (01:00:36):
There's this, you know, as a kid listening to a
lot of Beatles and a lot of Zeppelin, you know,
both of them really sort of did blend Eastern influence
into a lot of their music, you know, yea, whether
it's you know, Zeppelin and Jimmy Page and John Paul Jones.

(01:00:58):
You know, John Paul Jones is really like such an
unsung hero. I got to play in that band named
Crooked Vultures with him, and I never for one second
eased into the idea that John Paul Jones is a
normal human being. I never, not once whenever we jammed
where we hung Out is just such a phenomenal musician

(01:01:22):
and such a huge part of led Zeppelin. I really
think that he's instrumental in making John Bonham sound even bigger,
which is kind of this. It's hard to imagine, but
the way that John Paul Jones glues to and enhances
the groove of whoever he's playing with. Oh my god. Also,

(01:01:45):
did you ever hear that Diamanna Gallas record? Do you
know about her? Oh my god? Wicked, crazy, amazing sort
of goth legend who made a record called The Sporting
Life with John Paul Jones playing bass, Pete Thomas from

(01:02:05):
The Attractions playing drums, and her singing I have to
play it for you, You'll lose your mind. It's one
of the coolest things in the world. But it also
has sort of that sort of influence. God, this is
gonna be hard.

Speaker 1 (01:02:18):
We don't have to do it.

Speaker 6 (01:02:20):
I tried it this morning.

Speaker 1 (01:02:22):
It's just a good song. Okay, can I sing some
harmonies on it?

Speaker 6 (01:02:27):
Could you go do whatever you want to do. It's
seriously been so long. This is gonna be so good.
I haven't done this in a really long time. Oh
my god, I'm sweating I'm sweating.

Speaker 1 (01:02:41):
I've been sweating all day.

Speaker 6 (01:02:42):
What are you talking about? All right? Rady, Wait, go,

(01:03:11):
it's time. We need to find a bed, a place to.

Speaker 13 (01:03:20):
Hide me Go, you're mine.

Speaker 9 (01:03:32):
I need to know. I need to know, to know, Sweet.

Speaker 3 (01:03:42):
If didn way, Oh my.

Speaker 11 (01:03:56):
Sweet Ray.

Speaker 21 (01:04:20):
Pays, my dear, we could spend a lot of time
with you.

Speaker 9 (01:04:36):
Maybe this time, I hope I get the chance to
say goodbye, sweet.

Speaker 3 (01:04:54):
Devine. Red Dayer, Oh my sweet dim Raier.

Speaker 19 (01:05:18):
Wait shine, day after day, cold.

Speaker 12 (01:05:34):
Away, day after day. Wait, wait, wait, it's time.

Speaker 13 (01:06:10):
We need to find a bed, a place to hide.

Speaker 22 (01:06:18):
Bay your mind.

Speaker 9 (01:06:25):
I need to know, I need to know, to.

Speaker 3 (01:06:29):
Know, sweet Javie praise, Oh my sweet way.

Speaker 2 (01:07:01):
Whoa wasn't it pretty?

Speaker 3 (01:07:30):
Wow?

Speaker 6 (01:07:31):
I haven't done that in twenty years.

Speaker 9 (01:07:33):
Really, yeah, we did a bunch we did.

Speaker 6 (01:07:36):
It was for that, for that record.

Speaker 3 (01:07:38):
Actually we.

Speaker 6 (01:07:40):
Went on tour where we like played a bunch of
rock shows and then we did this acoustic tour thing.

Speaker 1 (01:07:44):
Yeah, because wasn't it a double Was it a double album?

Speaker 6 (01:07:48):
It was a double album. I remember we made a
double album and someone from the record company came to
listen to it, and the first thing they said was,
I think maybe before even hearing it, they're like, so, so,
why did you make a double record?

Speaker 2 (01:08:02):
Don't you love that?

Speaker 6 (01:08:04):
Like, I don't know, No, that was really that was
really fun to be able to do that. I honestly
think that the acoustic side of that album was better
than the rock side.

Speaker 1 (01:08:17):
Well, it seems like you wanted maybe you wanted to
make an acoustic album, but you didn't feel like you
couldn't rock.

Speaker 6 (01:08:23):
Was that and maybe that's what it was.

Speaker 1 (01:08:26):
That's the hindsight thing. Probably, Yeah, we.

Speaker 6 (01:08:29):
Don't know what we're doing ever. Like it's like never
I remember on the rock record, the song best of
You is on that record and we recorded it and
we're like, you know what, that sucks? Fuck that And
we played it for John Silva, our manager. Yes, And

(01:08:52):
then a long time later he was like, we played
on a bunch of other stuff and he's like, what
about that song that says best of you one hundred times? Yeah?

Speaker 8 (01:09:02):
What happened to that?

Speaker 6 (01:09:03):
Guess it's kind of cool.

Speaker 1 (01:09:05):
That's funny how your perceptions of things.

Speaker 6 (01:09:08):
Don't you do the same thing.

Speaker 1 (01:09:09):
I mean, I don't have hits in the same way.

Speaker 2 (01:09:12):
That you do.

Speaker 6 (01:09:13):
Yeah, but you know, when a song is a good
song I think I do.

Speaker 1 (01:09:17):
But then sometimes I'll do stuff that I don't think
is good, and then I feel like I get fed
by If other people end up it's one of their favorites.
I get fed by that and my brain thinks it's good.
Then Yeah, is that a needy part of me?

Speaker 7 (01:09:32):
Maybe?

Speaker 6 (01:09:34):
Well, I mean I think maybe as a performer, you
want people to appreciate what you do. It's maybe not
first priority if you're a musician or but if you're performing,
it's nice to play songs that people enjoy hearing, have

(01:09:56):
fun exactly, rather than just go I get it, Like,
you know, there have been times where we'll record things
that are you know, very like inward or sort of
self indulgent, and you know, things that might please us
greatly but won't necessarily translate to when we go out.

(01:10:19):
Like I really loved going out and playing songs that
if it's a song they don't know, it has to
be fucking amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:10:29):
Yeah, I've learned that you can't just be yeah, yeah,
it's more fun.

Speaker 6 (01:10:36):
Oh you know what we were talking about the new
record thing? The new record Okay, so so I mean
Rescued is so screamy. Yeah, you don't want me fucking
screaming rescue that you you can. You can come over
next door and hear us rehearse it.

Speaker 1 (01:10:51):
You can do whatever you want. But I love rescued,
and I could hear I could hear you doing it,
you know, kind.

Speaker 2 (01:10:56):
Of the way you do.

Speaker 1 (01:10:59):
Times like these. You know, I've heard you do it
in so many different incarnations. Yeah, and then I went
back to the record version of Oh yeah, it's like crazy, crazy,
different each time.

Speaker 6 (01:11:12):
Well, you know it's crazy. It's this guitar that I've
basically written all of our music for the last thirty
years on this really, yes, what is it? I don't know.
It's an old Gibson. It's a Gibson country Western model.
I know nothing about gear, drums or guitar. But yeah,
pretty much everything from the first record to the Learned

(01:11:38):
Flies and the ever Lungs and all of that stuff
was this thing. And that's what happens is I'll write
a song and I'll come up with a melody before
the lyrics or anything, and I'll sit on the I'll
sit on the couch and I'll be like, I mean,

(01:11:59):
I think the dance and I'll like sing it sort
of falsetto and they're getting the studio and it just
doesn't sound the same at all. And then I realized, like,
oh ship, I had to scream that yeah, like I
don't sit around.

Speaker 1 (01:12:19):
The house otherwise it sounds too like yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:12:23):
And then the first time, the first time I sing
any of our songs is always in front of the
mic to record.

Speaker 1 (01:12:31):
You don't play it for them before.

Speaker 6 (01:12:33):
I'll play them sort of demos, and even in the demos,
I'm like, shy Ronnie.

Speaker 1 (01:12:38):
For the moment.

Speaker 6 (01:12:40):
I save it for the moment, and then in that moment,
I'm like, oh fuck, god, damn, I have to scream
on this one.

Speaker 3 (01:12:48):
So I'm like.

Speaker 6 (01:12:51):
And then to fucking sing that scream that every night.

Speaker 1 (01:12:55):
That's a lot.

Speaker 6 (01:12:57):
You're up for it. I'm up for it.

Speaker 3 (01:12:59):
You're the man job.

Speaker 6 (01:13:03):
I remember. The reason why we first started doing acoustic
versions of our songs was because we went on the
Howard Stern Show, Oh Boy, and it was whatever, like
seven in the morning, and he's like, hey, bring a guitar.
They might want you to play a song. And I

(01:13:26):
don't know if we'd ever done an acoustic song or
an acoustic version of a song. Ah and the night
before I was in the hotel room. I'm just like,
oh my god, what are we going to?

Speaker 7 (01:13:37):
Like?

Speaker 6 (01:13:38):
What can we play? At the time, I think we
were only on our second record, but that song had
I mean that record had like my Hero and ever
Long and stuff like that. Then I thought, Wow, every
Long is probably the easiest to sing at seven in
the morning with an acoustic guitar. And we did it,

(01:14:01):
and it kind of opened up this whole new dynamic
in this whole new world for us to try some
of our songs on acoustic guitars.

Speaker 1 (01:14:12):
It felt exciting.

Speaker 6 (01:14:14):
What's that?

Speaker 1 (01:14:14):
It felt fun and like exciting.

Speaker 6 (01:14:16):
Yeah, it was just nice to be we Actually we
did it on the radio on his radio show, and
then they kept playing it and Silva was like, oh
my god, we need to record a version of it. Ah,
And then that wound up on the radio and since then,
at least once or twice a year, people will come

(01:14:40):
up to me and be like, that was our song
at our weddings version acoustic version.

Speaker 3 (01:14:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:14:49):
But that's also I feel like when you strip a
song back from whatever it becomes production wise or full
band wise, and it still works. I mean, it's just
a great song. So it's it's it's. If it didn't
sound good acoustic, you'd be exposed. But because they're great songs,
they work, you know, I know, so lucky you.

Speaker 6 (01:15:13):
We're gonna do everylong right now.

Speaker 1 (01:15:17):
I don't know that one as well.

Speaker 6 (01:15:19):
Nourah, We're gonna do it. Okay, what's this chord? You
know what, let's music pick it out.

Speaker 1 (01:15:24):
Let's go to music school. It's a D major seven
with a major seven.

Speaker 6 (01:15:32):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:15:32):
Then this is a B minor with the minor seven
and a nine, then.

Speaker 6 (01:15:44):
Then backs up to the.

Speaker 1 (01:15:47):
Yeah, yeah it goes Okay, I get it. I mean
I know the song too.

Speaker 6 (01:15:52):
Just so used to ask you what the chords are.

Speaker 1 (01:15:54):
I need you to know that I do know this.

Speaker 6 (01:15:56):
This succord one time was.

Speaker 1 (01:15:58):
This D major seven okay, B minor seven with a
nine B minor seven nine, it's G two omit the three.

Speaker 2 (01:16:13):
I'm sorry, but I am serious.

Speaker 6 (01:16:17):
Right, that's right.

Speaker 3 (01:16:45):
I've waited here for you.

Speaker 9 (01:16:50):
Ef long.

Speaker 3 (01:16:56):
Your face.

Speaker 8 (01:17:02):
Out of the red, out of my head.

Speaker 3 (01:17:04):
She said, do do do do do do do do
do do do do do do do do do do
do do do do do do do do do.

Speaker 9 (01:17:18):
Come down.

Speaker 6 (01:17:21):
And waste away with me, down with me.

Speaker 11 (01:17:30):
Slow?

Speaker 9 (01:17:30):
Well you wanted to be.

Speaker 6 (01:17:37):
It's over my hand, out of my head because a
bread creak, and I wanda when I sing along with you,
if everything could ever feel this real?

Speaker 8 (01:17:59):
Thought?

Speaker 6 (01:18:00):
Well, if anything could ever be this good? Uh, the
only thing I'll ever ask of you.

Speaker 8 (01:18:15):
Got a promise.

Speaker 6 (01:18:18):
I'm torture you.

Speaker 3 (01:18:35):
Breathe out.

Speaker 6 (01:18:38):
So I can breathe you well.

Speaker 3 (01:18:47):
And now I know you boy as been.

Speaker 23 (01:18:55):
Out of your hat, out of my head, I said,
any time, and I sing along with you.

Speaker 6 (01:19:15):
If everything good ever feel this real?

Speaker 9 (01:19:17):
Foe else.

Speaker 6 (01:19:22):
Anything good ever be this good?

Speaker 9 (01:19:25):
Up again?

Speaker 6 (01:19:30):
The only thing I ever ask of you, God, a
promise not to stop when I say.

Speaker 8 (01:19:40):
She said, it's all year enough.

Speaker 24 (01:20:38):
And I wonder and I sing along with you. Everything
could have a feel? This will fall in.

Speaker 6 (01:21:00):
If anything could ever be this good? The only thing
I'll ever ask of you. Got a promise not to
stop when I say Jess saying.

Speaker 1 (01:21:30):
Fuck yes, I feel like I'm not wearing any pants.

Speaker 6 (01:21:35):
That's a lot to ask you to play a song
that you've never played before, and you just did it.

Speaker 1 (01:21:42):
I loved it me too. I was slightly unprepared, but
I enjoyed every second. Great, that's a great one. It
also does that drowney thing that you do.

Speaker 2 (01:21:52):
You like, you do that a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:21:53):
I love it. I do the Indian and me loves it.

Speaker 6 (01:21:58):
What is that?

Speaker 1 (01:22:00):
I don't know, but I like it and I write
songs like that too. Sometimes. I just like there's something
about like the pedal and the drone of it not
changing keys or like almost never going to the five.
I know it went to the five chord a couple
of times in that bridgy bit, but there's something circular
about it that gets sort of like haunting and under
your skin. I feel like songs like that.

Speaker 6 (01:22:22):
You know a lot of the droning, well, it comes
from two different people. Zeppelin. There's this one song called
in the Light off a Physical Graffiti. There's this one
like whatever not it is that hangs out over the
whole riff and it just lends to this beautiful, sort

(01:22:45):
of spacey, trippy drone thing. But then there's this punk
rock band called Husker Doo who I loved so much
when I was young, and the guitar player, singer Bob Mold,
the way that he played guitar, he always had these
like the notes that would ring out over the riff
or chord structure that just sort of sustained notes. I

(01:23:05):
don't even know what I'm talking about, how would you
call them? But it's always cool just to have that
weird sort of anything. But then also that whatever that is,
what do you call that? Nour is it?

Speaker 1 (01:23:19):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (01:23:21):
So I'm selling the.

Speaker 1 (01:23:22):
D Yeah, you're playing it, you do, and it's got
the dissonance. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I love that.

Speaker 6 (01:23:34):
I feel like I just went to fucking music school.

Speaker 1 (01:23:36):
This is the learner episode. I feel like when I
came in to sing Virginia Moon, you guys thought I
was a nerd that day too, I don't.

Speaker 6 (01:23:47):
I don't know if you remember coming in and me
showing you the song and you were like, oh, I
kind of was hoping we were going to do a
rock song. Do you remember that? Well?

Speaker 1 (01:23:56):
I think I said that.

Speaker 6 (01:23:58):
I did say that, didn't you?

Speaker 1 (01:24:00):
You had already sent me the song though, right, didn't
I already know?

Speaker 2 (01:24:03):
No?

Speaker 6 (01:24:03):
I feel like you fucking figured it out.

Speaker 1 (01:24:05):
Oh yeah, because when I got the call to do it,
I was so excited and confused why you would call me?
Also because you're fucking rock band, you know, and so
I get there and it's a boss and Nova and
it's beautiful, and I was like, I thought I was
going to get to rock.

Speaker 6 (01:24:26):
Well, whenever you want to make a rock record, I do. Actually, wait,
didn't you have another? You had a band? Didn't you were?
You were in a like a rock band thing, weren't you?

Speaker 2 (01:24:37):
Yeah?

Speaker 11 (01:24:37):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (01:24:37):
I had this band called El Madmo and we were
kind of kind of it was kind of a rock band.

Speaker 6 (01:24:43):
Was it back then?

Speaker 1 (01:24:43):
It was back then? And it was around then actually
right after then. And I had started playing guitar. That's
how I was. I was learning how to play guitar
on that That was pretty fun. But I came in
to do Virginia Moon. Did I deflate the moment by saying.

Speaker 6 (01:25:00):
That, No, you just scared me?

Speaker 1 (01:25:02):
Did I more?

Speaker 6 (01:25:03):
Because as if I weren't nervous enough, I felt like that.
I'm like, oh great, I'm already disappointing her.

Speaker 3 (01:25:08):
I'm sorry song.

Speaker 1 (01:25:10):
Yet I was so young and confused by everything at
that time. I was like, who am I?

Speaker 8 (01:25:16):
God?

Speaker 6 (01:25:16):
Damn, that was like twenty years.

Speaker 1 (01:25:17):
That was twenty years ago. Oh shit, and I had
just become successful and I was just like, what the
fuck is happening, you know, and you had me come
in and do this song and I loved it. It
was beautiful. I just was so confused because.

Speaker 6 (01:25:33):
Because you're you so full of fucking shit right now.

Speaker 1 (01:25:36):
No, it was amazing. And then and then I loved
that song forever. And we've never sang it together.

Speaker 6 (01:25:43):
After that, No, and we never will because now I
know how much you didn't want to do it.

Speaker 1 (01:25:48):
No, I did want to do it. I just didn't
know what I was stop it. Are we in a fight?
I just did question why did you call me because
you thought it would be nice?

Speaker 6 (01:25:58):
Well, you know, one of the things that we were
doing on that record, as we were asking people to
come guest with us, John Paul Jones is on that,
That's right. He was, Oh god, John Ball Jones. You
Kaki King? Do you remember Kaki King?

Speaker 2 (01:26:12):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (01:26:13):
She played on this song Razor with me. I think
either Razor or Beaconsfield Minors. It's actually how we got Ronny,
our keyboard player, to join the band. He came and
played all over it. Okay, I don't remember who else,
but yeah, we were having a bunch of people come
guest on the record, and I came up with that melody,

(01:26:34):
and having heard your voice, I'm like, oh my god,
this will beautiful, This'll be perfect.

Speaker 1 (01:26:38):
I totally agree. It makes sense. Yeah, like I get
I got why you called me after I heard the song.
But whatever it is, I thought I was going to
get to air drum with you. No I knew it.

Speaker 6 (01:26:53):
I know you can air drum, but can you play drums?

Speaker 1 (01:26:55):
I can play a backbeat, yeah, but I'm not great.
I mean I play in this band, put some boots,
I play some drums on a few songs. Yeah, I
feel too much. I like get too excited, Like I
try to do fills because I'm so excited to be
behind the drums, and I lose everything.

Speaker 6 (01:27:13):
The best drum lesson ever, I only took two drum lessons,
one from this crazy jazz drummer in DC.

Speaker 2 (01:27:20):
My mom.

Speaker 6 (01:27:20):
His name is Lenny Robinson. He might be in New
York now, but my mom used to take me to
this jazz club on Sundays outside of Georgetown in DC.
It's called One Step Down Fun, and they on Sundays
they'd had this jazz workshop where the house band was
a dude named Lawrence Wheatley, and then Lenny played drums.

(01:27:44):
And dude named Maurice played sacks. I think I can't
remember anyway, but seeing him play the drums and seeing
a jazz drummer, it was just like I was so
used to punk rock drummers. Yeah, I was like, I
need to learn how to do that. And I think
I was like fifteen or sixteen. I went up to him.

(01:28:05):
I'm like, excuse me, mister Robinson, do you give lessons?
He was like yeah, sure. It was like thirty bucks
an hour for him to come in and tell me, like,
you're holding your sticks backwards. I was like what, And
so then I was just on a pad go like
for thirty dollars, I had to mow like six lawns
in order to get the money. But then the and

(01:28:26):
then I just kind of learned on the pillows. But
then the the best lesson I ever got was I
joined this local punk rock band in DC called Scream,
and they were all older than me. I was eighteen,
and they like toured and stuff. They toured Europe and
toward America, and that was my dream to like get

(01:28:47):
in the van of a bunch of dudes and play
punk rock shows and so but I was such an
incredibly busy, hyperactive, over the top drummer, the same where
I was just throwing stuff in everywhere. And there was
once where I went over to the bass player's house
or he said like once I joined the band. He's like,

(01:29:08):
let's Jim, and he's like, we're going to smoke a
huge joint and we're going to sit down and play,
and we're going to play the same riff for half
an hour and you're not going to do a drum roll.

Speaker 18 (01:29:21):
Whoa.

Speaker 6 (01:29:21):
And I was like okay, And so we smoke this
huge spliff and I sat down and name was Skeeter
and he was he was really like a groovy, laid
back bass player. And so I don't even remember what
we played, but it was like probably like something like
like the song that I just played with you. Yeah,
and like thirty seconds go by and I'm like why

(01:29:44):
and he would look at me and he broke me
like a horse.

Speaker 2 (01:29:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:29:46):
Oh my gosh, I swear it worked. It was the
best lesson I ever had in my entire life.

Speaker 1 (01:29:50):
That is interesting, And I just wish I had a
video of it.

Speaker 6 (01:29:54):
Yeah, it was in a bedroom. Okay, there's a drum
set in there.

Speaker 1 (01:29:58):
It GROLs Oh my god, that's true. It's the best lesson. Yeah,
maybe I'll do that.

Speaker 5 (01:30:05):
Well.

Speaker 1 (01:30:06):
Should we try virginumine? Oh too much?

Speaker 6 (01:30:10):
Yeah, let's try it.

Speaker 1 (01:30:11):
Okay, I mean if we can't get it's fine.

Speaker 6 (01:30:15):
My god. These lyrics, I'm trying to be all fucking
what romantic, and.

Speaker 1 (01:30:20):
They are romantic. Honestly, this is really sweet. These lyrics
are I don't even feel like the romantic. I almost
feel like it's a like a prayer, like a morning
you know what I meant.

Speaker 6 (01:30:37):
Damn Sam, it's hard. It's hard.

Speaker 1 (01:30:42):
We haven't done it in twenty Did you ever play
this live? We need that tour never.

Speaker 6 (01:30:46):
I would never do this without you.

Speaker 1 (01:30:48):
Oh, Violet would sound pretty on this.

Speaker 6 (01:30:50):
Actually, yeah, we've got this. Please, we totally have it.

Speaker 2 (01:30:57):
We have it.

Speaker 1 (01:30:58):
It's in us.

Speaker 6 (01:30:59):
It's happening right.

Speaker 25 (01:31:01):
On to the fos constantat sh.

Speaker 3 (01:31:22):
Surrounding you. Stay soft, Dame Blue Virginia. I'll wait for
you to know.

Speaker 6 (01:31:43):
Sweets and.

Speaker 3 (01:31:49):
Shot pray.

Speaker 7 (01:31:54):
The day tune like God, dude, virgin your move. I
wait for you till night.

Speaker 22 (01:32:14):
And now she has become shadows.

Speaker 3 (01:32:18):
In your life. In morning, will way through and tomorrow
refuse you. I will say.

Speaker 2 (01:32:34):
Good night.

Speaker 11 (01:32:40):
See Fasten.

Speaker 3 (01:32:48):
With spa guide tune.

Speaker 13 (01:32:56):
She me come.

Speaker 3 (01:33:03):
Marge you how wait for you tube night?

Speaker 22 (01:33:11):
And now what she's become shadows in your life in
the morning railway through.

Speaker 7 (01:33:25):
And tonwus you. I will say, purching.

Speaker 3 (01:34:01):
Your move, I wait for you to night, and now
shit's become shadows in your light.

Speaker 7 (01:34:19):
In the morning, way way through and tomorrow rescues you.

Speaker 8 (01:34:26):
I will say.

Speaker 15 (01:34:29):
Good night.

Speaker 8 (01:34:35):
I will say good night.

Speaker 3 (01:34:43):
I will say good night.

Speaker 2 (01:35:08):
We did it.

Speaker 6 (01:35:09):
Oh my god, I'm I know, I know God. I
haven't done that so long.

Speaker 1 (01:35:16):
I'm glad we did it because we had to do it.

Speaker 3 (01:35:21):
We did it.

Speaker 8 (01:35:22):
We did it.

Speaker 6 (01:35:23):
Noa, we did it.

Speaker 2 (01:35:24):
We did.

Speaker 6 (01:35:25):
Remember that thing you were talking about, that feeling you
get when you do something you don't know if you
can do, and then you do it.

Speaker 1 (01:35:31):
It's like, yeah, it's great. Thank you, thanks for doing
this with me.

Speaker 3 (01:35:37):
We did.

Speaker 1 (01:35:38):
We did several of the twenty songs we talked about doing.
I know, no, I just want to say something you.
Thank you.

Speaker 6 (01:35:49):
Thanks Norah.

Speaker 1 (01:35:50):
I love you so much and this was so fun
for me. Thanks for doing music with me.

Speaker 6 (01:35:56):
You're welcome.

Speaker 1 (01:35:57):
Do you want to hear what I said to Billie
Eilish what I said, I'm just I'm so happy that
I'm so happy that you're people love you because.

Speaker 3 (01:36:08):
I love you.

Speaker 1 (01:36:10):
It was hysterical.

Speaker 6 (01:36:11):
That's a nice thing to say.

Speaker 1 (01:36:13):
It was super awkward, though, and I don't think it
came out what I meant to say in the right words.
But it was funny. And I feel the same about you, Dave.

Speaker 6 (01:36:25):
That's what I'm trying to say.

Speaker 1 (01:36:30):
Damn, Hey, will you do a rock song with me
one day?

Speaker 18 (01:36:35):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (01:36:46):
That was so fun. Thanks for listening everyone.

Speaker 4 (01:36:48):
That was great. I'm so impressed by his unjadedness, you know,
like in conversation, but also like musically.

Speaker 1 (01:36:56):
It's like it's like he's achieved.

Speaker 4 (01:36:59):
So much much in his career and yet it's like
he's nervous every time and still can get as excited
as ever afterwards, like Wow, we did it.

Speaker 2 (01:37:07):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:37:08):
I love that he's definitely got a childlike wonder with
music in a way that I hope he never loses.
And I hope I never lose. I don't always have it,
but it's the best when you do.

Speaker 4 (01:37:20):
Yeah, please never change.

Speaker 1 (01:37:22):
I hope you enjoyed the episode. If you want to
know what songs we played. The first song was Statues
from Echoes, Silence, Patients and Grace, the two thousand and
seven Food Fighters album. The second song we played was
Flame Twin, which is one of mine from Pick Me
Up Off the Floor in twenty twenty. The acoustic guitar
number was Ballad of the Beaconsfield Miners and it's on
the album Echoes, Silence, Patience and Grace. Also we did

(01:37:45):
Razor from In Your Honor, the two thousand and five
Food Fighters album, ever Long from The Color and the
Shape nineteen ninety seven album from the Food Fighters, and
Virginia Moon from In Your Honor in two thousand and five.

(01:38:06):
Today's episode was recorded at Studio six oh seven in
Los Angeles, California. Recorded by Oliver Roman, assisted by Jared Polacci,
studio manager Ali Christi, mixed by Jamie Landry, edited by
Sarah Oda, Additional engineering by Greg Tobler and Pete rem
artwork by Eliza Frye. Photography by Shervin Linez. Coordinating producer

(01:38:29):
Rachel Ward. Produced by Nora Jones and Sarah Oda

Speaker 2 (01:38:33):
Yay