Syracuse History & Culture Part 2 - Ishmael Bey & Shiek EL - NYPTALKSHOW Podcast

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
what's going on?
Everybody?
It's ron brown lmt, thepeople's fitness professional,
aka soul brother number what,when I'm sold brother number
three?
Now hold on one second beforeyou talk.
Uh shake denim ill, can youturn the music off in the
background, cause I don't want.
Yeah, yeah, copyright strikesand all that.
Let me know when you turn itoff.
You turned it off, yep, yeah,so, uh.

(00:39):
So brother number one, I say onhere, but according to uh shake
denim denim number one, I sayon here, but according to Shake
Denim Ill, I'm soul brothernumber three.
Yes, sir, I'm soul brothernumber two.
He's soul brother number twoSince 1981, bro, all right,
that's peace.
So now, how you doing.
Oh, first off, I got on aTeenage Mutant Ninja Turtle

(01:01):
shirt, right Okay, and it'sgreen, so that's why it looks
like I'm a part of the graphics.
So, yeah, pardon me y'all, butyou can see me and, most
importantly, you can see ShakeDenim L.
So let's talk about it.
How you doing.
How you doing this evening.

Speaker 2 (01:23):
Yo bro, I'm good man, I'm chilling you, you know.
I'm saying taking it easy man,you know, got off work and just
relaxing man.
Yeah, I mean just it's cool nowain't doing much, that's peace
that's peace, so let's go intoit.

Speaker 1 (01:34):
We're talking about, uh ah, it's history.
It's the history of syracusepart two.
We're talking about syracusepart two.
Um, I just want to let everyoneknow.
So, brother, number three, put,put a different color on yo.
Yo, I can't now, I can't, it'sall.
I'm already stuck with it it iswhat it is now bro, you know, I

(01:57):
mean.
I'm a part of the screen now.
So now, um, I wanted to.
The reason, I want to leteveryone know that the the
reason why this Syracuse pieceis extremely important to me is
because the whole concept of NYPtalk show was not only to bring
, you know, the consciousmovements to the forefront and

(02:18):
and and try to put it into themedia, so to speak, is also to
highlight parts of New York thatpeople don't talk about.
People act like New York isjust the five boroughs, but that
is just not the case whatsoever.
There's so many great thingsgoing on in the state of New
York and we're kicking off thatpiece with Syracuse.

(02:42):
Oh, wow, we got Mikey Fever ontonight.
Mikey Fever on, hold on, holdon.
Yep, yo, mikey Fever, you seeme, you see my shirt.

Speaker 3 (02:56):
Oh yeah, yo that.
Oh no, what's up with thatgreen screen Green?

Speaker 1 (03:00):
screen.
Yeah, yeah.
So I was telling the people onhow important this Syracuse
piece is to us, because wewanted to highlight the whole
New York state.

Speaker 3 (03:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:15):
Yeah, so that's where we left off here.
So Shake Denim, let's go rightinto it.
I want to ask you what wasSyracuse like for Black
residents during the CivilRights era, if you have any
information on that.

Speaker 2 (03:30):
Yeah, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was
prosperous in a sense.
I mean, we had two family.
The two family structure wasvery, was very permanent at that
particular time.
It was very, it was veryapparent.
Most families lived in homes.

(03:50):
I mean, we did have, you know,by 1950, 1951, they had removed
A whole war.
The fifth war was removed andthey put up an infrastructure,
an interstate, and now it'sfunny because right now they're
removing that same interstatethat displaced a whole world of

(04:15):
Asiatic people.
You know what I'm saying.
So they're removing it now, youknow they're removing it.
But besides that, we had, therewas, everybody was working.
You know there were, there were, there were factories, a lot of
factories, people were working.
But there was also, there wasalso, from my understanding,
there was also a strong civilrights movement, because when I

(04:37):
came of age, when I got, youknow, when I came, I was born in
68.
So when I came about seven,eight years old, I was running
into organizations like Harambeeand all these different types
of organizations that werecentered around African learning
or cultural consciousness,things of that nature, and of
course that was stemming offprobably from the earliest, you

(04:59):
know the earlier things that washappening in the 60s.
But the family structure waspretty, pretty strong.
There were, there were, therewere.
I'm sure there was familiesthat didn't have, you know, two
parents or whatever, but themajority of my friends and their
parents, you know, they came upin with a structured household

(05:20):
and we had businesses.
Everybody had businesses.
Syracuse is full of Asiaticbusinesses and we had businesses
.
Everybody had businesses.
Syracuse is full of Asiaticbusinesses.
South side was full ofbusinesses grocery stores,
different types of clothingstores, tailors, all types of
different things right in thecommunity.
By the by the mid 70s into theearly 80s, a lot of those
businesses had begun to shutdown and were sold off or the

(05:42):
family members didn't want tocontinue the businesses of, you
know, of their parents orwhatever, when it's other things
.
So there was, there was, therewas prosperity.
You know the time was very, umwas very prosperous at a
particular point in time.
You know everybody worked,everybody had jobs, everything
was good.
Um, we had our own, we had.

(06:03):
We had little issues police,police brutality, certain little
situations that happened hereand there, but the civil rights
thing was pretty strong.
Syracuse was pretty strong.
With politics, the early themid-60s, early 60s, mid-60s
Syracuse was pretty strongpolitically, just having

(06:29):
political awareness.
Our communities were morepolitically aware than they are
now.
I would say in those timesDefinitely.

Speaker 1 (06:40):
All right, I'm going to Peace.

Speaker 4 (06:44):
Peace and blessings to the family so good to going
to peace-ish Peace, peace andblessings to the family.
So good to see everybody howy'all doing this evening.

Speaker 1 (06:49):
Great man, great great.
I like that setup your micsounds right, man, I appreciate
that.

Speaker 4 (06:56):
Thank you so much, king.
Try to invest in it.
I can't hear you, god.
You can't hear me.
You can't hear me.
I can't hear you, god.
Okay, can everybody else hearme?

Speaker 2 (07:08):
okay, yeah yeah, I hear you.
Okay, okay, that's crazy.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
Yeah, he's joking around Yo.
So the same question what wasSyracuse like for Black
residents during the CivilRights era?

Speaker 4 (07:25):
During the Civil Rights era.
I would definitely agree withmy brother.
As far as the civil rights, thecivil rights era, you had a lot
of leaders that would step upin Syracuse and those leaders
they were kind of in on anational level, but in Syracuse
we leaders, they were kind of ina on a national level, but in

(07:45):
Syracuse we're considered asmall city.
So there were a lot of thingsthat inflected us that then
affected people nationally.
Example we were one of thefirst people to get um the red
line district.
Historically, when you look atwhere it started at, it started
in syracuse wow actually had onthe first maps of syracuse.

(08:07):
They had negro section of townand they actually said negro on
the map.
So we were allocated theseareas of syracuse only for black
people, you know, and thathadn't been done before.
So they would experiment withus even with, like, the rico act
you just saw how diddy wasfacing rico charges on something

(08:27):
that was a manifestation of theman Act.
That man Act was of course putin creation to go against Jack
Johnson as a boxing champion.
They would use the man Actbecause he was running around
with white women and of coursethey couldn't get him, defeat
him in the ring.
So they created the man Act tocatch him on kidnapping charges
of the white women that he wasrunning with.

(08:49):
Well, that man Act evolved intothe RICO Act and they inflicted
the first RICO Act on theSyracuse black youth.
Those street gangs were beingseen as racketeering gangsterism
on a whole other level.
That had never been done beforethe experiment on Syracuse.
And then it goes off to otherareas because we're a small

(09:11):
quote-unquote city.

Speaker 3 (09:14):
That's crazy.
I have a question, being thatSyracuse, I believe, is close to
Canada, right?

Speaker 4 (09:21):
It is.
We're in central New York, yeah, but we get that Toronto,
buffalo and Toronto area.
We're in central New York, yeah, but we get that Toronto.
You know Buffalo and Torontoarea yeah.

Speaker 3 (09:27):
You don't believe, maybe I could be wrong.
Some of the remnants of thatprejudice redlining, came from
the time when so-called slaveswere running to the north,
because I know a lot of them hadlittle villages around that
borderline.

Speaker 4 (09:42):
That's true.
Just outside of Syracuse wehave a spot called Auburn New
York.
Auburn New York is one of thehomes of Harriet Tugman.
It was one of her last homesthat she lived in and it's a
museum today.
So it was very instrumental.
You accurately said of theUnderground Railroad and slavery
.
We have statues in Syracusecalled the Jerry Rescue.
That was where they actuallybroke into the courtroom and

(10:06):
broke that slave out of bondage.
So it was very instrumental.
That was spot on.
Yes, sir, brother Mikey.

Speaker 3 (10:15):
I remember that because one of my elders, mr Ray
May rest in peace, took myfather and I up there as I was a
child, I remember that justcame back.

Speaker 4 (10:24):
You actually have little tunnel areas too.
Too, in Syracuse you havetunnel areas where if you go
down to basements theyinterconnect.
That was the way that they wereable to kind of run some of the
slaves through.
Yes, sir.

Speaker 1 (10:37):
All right, Second question.
Mike, you want to go with thesecond question?

Speaker 3 (10:42):
Go ahead, all right, second question Go ahead.

Speaker 1 (10:44):
Gar.
Second question how was theblack population in Syracuse
changed over the decades?
Changed over the decades.

Speaker 2 (10:58):
First of all, I can't hear the brother and I can't
hear Ish.
I couldn't hear none of thatdialogue that just went on, oh
really.
Yeah, he was saying that Ican't hear Ish, I can't hear the
brother, I can't hear brotherMikey, I think it is.
Yeah, I can't hear them.

Speaker 3 (11:17):
You may have to log off and log back in.

Speaker 4 (11:18):
Yeah, you're about to go out and come back in,
because I can hear you andeverybody.

Speaker 1 (11:26):
I can't hear them.
I can hear you very well,brother.
What they're saying is log outand then come back in.

Speaker 2 (11:29):
Okay, I'm going to do that, all right.

Speaker 1 (11:35):
Islam peace, peace to Abin brother.
Shawnee said wow, that's what Iwanted to ask how big is
Syracuse?
Shawnee wants to ask how big isSyracuse?
Yeah with.

Speaker 4 (11:48):
Syracuse, although we're in central New York, we're
considered the small out of thebig three outside of New York
City.
Of course you have the boroughsand you have even the groups
outside of the boroughs, butwe're smaller than Albany, we're
smaller than Buffalo.
We're even smaller thanRochester.
For us, our population, for us,to get a dome was a big thing.

(12:10):
That dome was holding 50,000 or60,000 people, but it was a big
thing for us because we'resmall.
Everything revolves aroundquote unquote the university.

Speaker 3 (12:21):
We're smaller than Rochester.
I've been to Albany.
It's crazy he's saying this.
We got to take a trip up there,ron.
I got family Clinton inWashington and this was what 97.
They had it on the hill upthere where I saw like the
Nation of Gods on Earth hadtheir little center over there
and I remember no disrespect.
A lot of gods would come fromup north, you know, from prison

(12:43):
system.
You hear them out therebuilding.
It was in Albany.

Speaker 4 (12:47):
Absolutely.
Can you hear us?

Speaker 2 (12:50):
okay, now Definitely I can hear y'all now, you know
what I'm talking about.

Speaker 3 (12:55):
Clinton and Washington on that hill.

Speaker 1 (12:59):
That's the goal is to go around to different places
in New York.
However, we got to build this,build it more.
Syracuse has to be the firstspot we go to and for sure we
already been talking about goingout there.
We've been talking about goingout there now, since we've been
doing the podcast.

Speaker 3 (13:20):
Hell, yeah, it's that drive.
It's like drive.
You're like no, it's the drive.

Speaker 4 (13:26):
It's about four hours .

Speaker 2 (13:28):
Yeah, about three and a half four hours.
Yeah, about four hours.
You can do that, man, it's aneasy ride.

Speaker 3 (13:33):
We cut the road a little bit.

Speaker 2 (13:37):
You asked a question about how has the community
changed over the years.
It's changed significantly dueto a couple of factors.
One thing about Syracuse if youstudy it and how it was
designed and how it was builtIsh can bear witness, he can
verify it as well Syracuse, it'san experimental place.
It's an experimental city.
It's a place where they runtests and they do certain types

(14:01):
of things.
Syracuse was the first placethat RICO was utilized for
children, teenagers.
You know RICO was racketing.
You know the conspiracy lawsthat they were using to pin the
mafia, la Cosa Nostra.
Syracuse, new York.
They used that for some youthwho weren't even recognized, you

(14:24):
know, weren't technically agang at all.
It was just from a community,from a street or whatever, had
no hierarchy, had no name,titles or whatever, but they
were very.
They were very, you know,efficient at what they did,
though.
But that's just an example.
It's changed over the years dueto certain factors, and it got
worse.
We had an influx of heroin thatbegan to hit syracuse in the,

(14:51):
I'm gonna say, the mid 90s.
Um, we had a lot of.
We had a lot of what we calltransients coming from jersey
and they brought a lot of heroinwith them.
You know I'm saying the hustle.
You know the opiate game justkicked up because Syracuse is a
crack was, was, was a crackcocaine spot.

(15:11):
That's what it really.
That's what it was.
You know, the heroin thing justcame and took it by storm.
Downtown Syracuse became ahaven and it just is right now.
It's just it's digressedtremendously.
I mean, we were ranked numberone in childhood poverty
nationally just in the lastcouple of years.

Speaker 3 (15:31):
Right.

Speaker 2 (15:32):
Wow, wow, yeah, wow, yeah.
But you know what's crazy?
The places where that areconsidered the impoverished
areas is where the most storesare.
You know what I'm saying?
The most family dollars and youknow dollar trees and things of

(15:53):
that nature.
Yeah, interesting.

Speaker 4 (15:58):
Yeah, that's funny, you couldn't.
You couldn't hear what I wassaying, but I was pointing that
out also, so you're just spot on.
That shows that it was rightand exact.
We're talking about theexperimental city, us being a
small city, the ronco act.
That's exactly what we weretalking about, but you can hear
the conversation, so you're spoton mind detect, mind.
You know that, you know indeed,we, we got the roots.
Yes, sir you already.

Speaker 3 (16:20):
You already know I got this question.
Who were some of the unsunglocal heroes in Syracuse black
history.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
Man Oliver Lee.

Speaker 4 (16:31):
Brother Oliver, oliver Lee, definitely Oliver
Lee, one of the elders of thecity.
Yeah, brother, baba OmobuwaleOmobuwale.
For sure, ted Grace, definitely.
Mr Grace he was a martialartist.
He also created an academy.
It was for children, a culturalacademy, a haven for us and for

(16:54):
people to go to.
Young couples would be able totake their children there,
knowing that their childrenwould be safe at the academy.

Speaker 2 (17:04):
Definitely Things like that we had a lot of
influential elders that wouldyou know work in the community
and we knew all of them.
You know, I mean like we we sat, we sat with, with all of them
in some form.
You know.
I mean even even like it's abrother named bongo on south
bank he runs, he runs arestaurant.
Bongo has been a staple in thecommunity for 50 years, man.
Before he was a restaurateur,he had a store called Island on

(17:25):
South Salina Street and hebrought a lot of West Indian,
jamaican history and all thattype of stuff.
And he married an Americansister and he just became a
staple in the community as well.

Speaker 4 (17:39):
Man, and they lived across the street from me in
1976, so I've been influentialby a lot of these people you
know, just in the immediatecommunity.
We lived on maple street in 76and he was my neighbor across
the street yeah, yeah, there wasreverend.

Speaker 2 (17:54):
there was reverend walker and reverend theodore
jones.
Um, they were very influential,um, they did a lot of things
for the people.
It was just, you know, it was alot.
Actually, when you think aboutit, I know I'm missing people.
Right, it was so many.
We was around in those times.

(18:14):
Syracuse was very cultural.
It was culturally sound.
It was culturally renaissanceand it was culturally sound.
It was culturally Renaissance.
It was culturally sound.
We had culture.
I mean, we had cats, we had thehistorians, we had gods, we
were culture.
But it died, it got destroyed.

Speaker 4 (18:36):
We even had television shows too, like
Caramoo.
My mother was a poet, so sheused to do the Saturday or the
Sunday morning poetry sessionson a show called Karamu Very
African conscious, and thingslike that, and folk art gallery
and things like that.

Speaker 3 (18:52):
That's cool Indeed, indeed In our communities, man,
because over here in the city wehad, like it Is.
Remember that, ron.

Speaker 2 (19:02):
With that dude, with Bill Noble.

Speaker 3 (19:03):
And it's crazy, gil Noble, and it's so crazy Shout
out to Gil Noble.

Speaker 1 (19:08):
Gil Noble inspired this show.
I'm the new Gil Noble.

Speaker 3 (19:15):
It's crazy how that story is constantly repeated,
how crack came in and destroyedus.
We had the heroin in the 70s,60s, 70s, cocaine, but when that
crack came about it reallycracked our communities, man.

Speaker 2 (19:34):
Yeah, that was a great shot, man.
I mean you got to give theenemy, to give the enemy his,
his respect, because he's he'san admirable opponent.
He's an he's an admirableopponent.
It is what it is.
He's an admirable opponent.
That means that we, he studies,he researches and he knows

(19:55):
certain.
He knows things because theyset the environment in order to
do what they do.
Certain he knows things becausethey set the environment in
order to do what they do.
So when you design theenvironment, it is easy to take
control and put certain thingsin place because you already
know the needs of the people,not what they want, but the
needs you.
You take away the needs and yougive them what they want yeah,
man, he had patience alsopatience.

Speaker 3 (20:14):
Unity and patience, that's what it is.
They play the long run run andyou see what happened?

Speaker 2 (20:19):
right, they played the crack game so strong that
they forgot about heroin.
And they forgot.
They said oh, that's just anurban issue, leave it there and
let them go.
But now look, look today.

Speaker 3 (20:31):
Fentanyl is killing their own, and now it's epidemic
.

Speaker 4 (20:35):
Yeah, now it's cold red yeah now it's epidemic.

Speaker 2 (20:39):
It's so much so an epidemic that they've created
facilities where you can.
They have shooting facilitieswhere you can go shoot up.
There's a nurse there in caseyou, you know, I mean in case
you fall out.
They got the nox along and allthat stuff.
Man, you got actual shootingfacilities.
We used to have to go, and youknow shooting galleries in the
hood, somewhere in an abandonedbuilding or whatever, but they

(21:00):
actually created a resource harmreduction where they can
actually, you know, you go intoa place.
They give you needles, give youclean needles, give you
everything you need to cleanyour needle with and everything
man.

Speaker 3 (21:10):
All because little Dylan died right.

Speaker 4 (21:13):
Yeah, exactly Now, it's humanized yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:16):
Yeah, all right.

Speaker 1 (21:19):
Who were some of the unsung local heroes.

Speaker 2 (21:31):
You already said that .
Right, how has gentrificationaffected Syracuse's community?
Well, as you know about PioneerHomes, losses on, lost his
renewal contract right after 50years.
Right, correct, correct.
So that means that all of thosepeople living in that
particular housing project orhousing pilot will have to be
displaced and removed somewhereelse because she bought all of

(21:52):
that.

Speaker 4 (21:58):
So just to put perspective to it, he said
Pioneer Homes.
It's called Pioneer Homesbecause it was the first
projects in the state of NewYork.
The first projects in the stateof New York.
That's crazy.
Right Again, syracuse was anexperimental city, so that first
project in New York State isnow being moved out for them to

(22:21):
put a highway in thegentrification.
I used to live in a buildingthat was called Towns and Towers
.
They closed Towns and Towersdown to make it housing for
doctors, for the university.
So that's the gentrificationright, they clear out the
projects, they clear out thetowers, they put in the students

(22:42):
and that's how it becomesYuppieville.

Speaker 2 (22:46):
And they're removing the interstate now.
It's a billion dollar project.
They're removing the interstatethrough all.
Like I said earlier, they'reremoving that interstate that
displaced people originally inthe 50s.

Speaker 4 (22:56):
The 15th Ward was removed when they put I-81 up
and I explained to them that wehad the first red line district
in the country.
Yeah, yeah, that's what I wasexplaining to them.

Speaker 2 (23:10):
Yeah, exactly, definitely experimental.
So you can see, like he saidthe first, and it's crazy
because the way they builtpioneer homes, they didn't build
it like this, they didn't buildit like this, they didn't build
it up, they built it like rowhouses, like the old slave, like
row houses, slave quarters,slave quarters, just design, you

(23:36):
know that's crazy, because whatI do notice, wherever a project
is, there's always a highwaynearby.

Speaker 3 (23:46):
I just told somebody that the other day.

Speaker 2 (23:49):
Yeah, I think we spoke about that right, yeah me,
and you spoke about that aswell.

Speaker 3 (23:54):
It's like, as you said, it's an experiment.
And how is it that they have$100 million for a project but
can't defeat the poverty that'staking place up there?
Because it's real up there.
I heard stories, man, upstateNew York is real.

Speaker 4 (24:07):
Yeah, we were up at arms because you know there's so
much poverty that takes placein Syracuse.
They just spent over 80 milliondollars to put in an aquarium.
To put in an aquarium, whywould you take funds that the
state needs and you have so muchpoverty around but yet you
would spend over $85 million fora new aquarium?

Speaker 2 (24:28):
It's a damn shame.

Speaker 1 (24:30):
And I'd be on the edge man, I'd be on the edge.

Speaker 2 (24:33):
I'm sorry.
I apologize if I you know, Idon't know about profanity, so I
don't want to get you flaggedor anything.

Speaker 3 (24:39):
But I'd be all over it.

Speaker 2 (24:46):
It's one of.
You know it's definitelycriminal and it's again, it's by
design.
You know the brother mentionedpoverty.
He mentioned how up here, youknow it's real Poverty Isn't.
To me, poverty is a tool.
I mean the poverty that wascreated.
See, it's designed and at onepoint in time we were, we were,

(25:07):
we were well.
But then when you begin toremove resources from a
community, extracting themmethodically, you can cause a
ripple effect.
For instance, you have to getto the kids, right, because the
kids, if the kids ain't gotnothing to do, what happens?

(25:29):
They'll make something to do.
So if you take away somethingconstructed from them, like
summer jobs.
You remember Cedar?
I do, I remember.

Speaker 4 (25:40):
CEDA?
Yep, tell them what CEDA was.
Yeah, ceda was a program thatwas set up to give you know
children summer jobs and jobsthat they can do at a young age,
establishing a career.
But these were things that wereset up from the government for
the urban youth in order forthem to get their feet wet and
to start establishing thosethings.

Speaker 2 (26:00):
Exactly.
We had things like night gym.
We had a lot of things in placewhere a child would be safe, a
safe space, you know what I'msaying.
And even in these safe spacesthey had education and learning
was going on as well.
Tutoring, different types ofthings was happening.
So you begin to extract that.

(26:21):
So now you take away these safespaces and you take away these
resources for kids to work, toget money, to learn certain
things.
Now they're outside.
This was happening around.
It began happening in the early80s by the time crack hit.
It was perfect because whencrack hit, the kids was already
at the point where that was.
That was.
That was a perfect.
That was perfect.

(26:41):
That was a.
It was something to do.
See, when I was coming up, allthe hustlers was grown.
They were grown men.
There was no children hustling,but then children became
hustlers youngsters correctwithout up without Youngster
Correct, without guidance per se, life's experiences and so on

(27:05):
and so forth.
So we know the outcome of that.
We're all products of it.
I was 12 years old in 1980.
I turned 12.

Speaker 4 (27:17):
So we in the midst of it, man, Right, right, I did
want to point something out toofrom y'all prior program Y'all
were pointing about, y'alltalking about hip hop.
I do want to attest that SheikDenim L was one of the top break
dancers of the city.
That that that would.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
That's definitely true, he was getting down with
the get down.

Speaker 4 (27:38):
I was one of with the get down.

Speaker 2 (27:39):
I was one of the illest.
I was one of the illest.
I bear witness.

Speaker 4 (27:45):
I was not, but he was , so that is true it was an MC
but you were definitely one ofthe break dancers, for sure.
I was one of the illest, forsure.
And I wanted to point out alsois what was missed was we caught
a ground level of hip hop,because a lot of things revolved
around the university, right?

(28:06):
So a lot of the people wouldcome from their hometown, they
come from the Bronx or come fromBrooklyn and bring that in and
they would have the radiostations and they would have the
radio stations.
So we were able to catch aground level of people Maybe
their siblings were still in thecity or they were from the city
and come down with the music.
That's how we were able tocatch it so quickly, because it

(28:29):
revolved around the university.
That was an aspect that wasn'ttouched on.
But y'all that breakdown wasexcellent as far as what y'all
were breaking down last episode.

Speaker 2 (28:38):
Praise God, you know what we do man Also.
Far as what y'all were breakingdown last episode.
Oh, praise you know, you knowwhat we do man also.
You gotta remember I wasrunning, I was running like I
was running with g and them backin like like 80, 81 g man and
them, yeah, and he, and you knowhe was, he was a harlem, he was
a harlem baby.
You know he was going to thecity all the time and he was
bringing, he was bringing a lotof the mixtapes back and he was,
he was a dj as well, and youalso, you, you know, you know
rapski passed away, right, youknow, I do like two or three

(29:00):
weeks ago.
Yeah, yeah, rapski yeah, bootlegwas a bootleg rapski brother
robert harrison jr was was alegendary dj in the syracuse
hip-hop scene right and thelegendary crew called the koc
crew, right?
You just passed away, goodbrother man.
Yeah, we all.
We all got histories together,right?

Speaker 3 (29:23):
all right, I got one question that's like that's out
of the curriculum.
Um, how's the crime level upthen?
Is it hasn't intensifiedamongst the youth like a lot of
youth shootings and stuff?

Speaker 2 (29:33):
oh yeah, see, we got an influx.
We got it.
See, syracuse is a sanctuarycity, so you already know what
it is.
We got a lot of influx ofdifferent nationalities,
specifically Africans andspecifically different types of
Southeast Asian, okay, butmostly Africans, mostly Somali,

(29:56):
mostly Somali Bantu, and so much.
So there's an African mafia.
There's a bunch of youth, theystill kids, they off the chain.

Speaker 4 (30:07):
They do, they do.
Yeah, they definitelyparticipated in increasing the
crime that comes through,unfortunately.

Speaker 2 (30:15):
And then you got to think about what we call the
homegrown beef south side, eastside, north side, west side and
the little communities withinthese territories that's been
beefing for 70 years and shit.
Every generation is the sameshit.
They don't even know whythey're doing it.
Right now, man, it's justpoverty.
Yeah, the homegrown stuff.
They don't even know whythey're doing it.

Speaker 1 (30:36):
So do you have Bloods , Cribs, GDs.

Speaker 2 (30:40):
Eh, in the 90s there was running around, everybody
was a Bloods, the late 90s andall that.
But now you don't hear nothingabout Bloods and Crips.
Yeah, not so much thecommercial.

Speaker 4 (30:52):
like Bloods and Crips it go on blocks.

Speaker 1 (30:54):
You know, from certain block areas.

Speaker 4 (30:57):
Yeah, that's how it is in Syracuse 112 versus.
Lex, block Lex block versus.
You know, that's how Syracuseoperates.

Speaker 2 (31:04):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:07):
Were there any key uprising protests or movements
led by Syracuse residents?

Speaker 2 (31:19):
Led by Syracuse residents.

Speaker 4 (31:21):
Yeah.
I don't know.
I can't think of any, like anyspecific ones that we would know
.

Speaker 1 (31:28):
OK, ok, now I want to go into Nation of Islam
questions.
When and how did the Nation ofIslam first arrive in Syracuse?

Speaker 2 (31:36):
Well, for me, I ran into him when I got kicked out
of the Navy.
When I got kicked out I camehome.
It was what?
80?
I came home in 89.
And that's when I ran into themin 89, brother Kenneth Muhammad
.
So I'm assuming they wereprobably here 86, 86, 87, maybe
even earlier, because there wasa presence of the Nation of

(31:58):
Islam, the first resurrection,the first generation, pardon me,
under the Honorable ElijahMuhammad there was elders still,
there was brothers around whowas from that school of thought,
who was from that.
So they were.
I remember some of them.
They were still.
They were around.
You know what I mean.
But so the Nation of Islamunder the Honorable Elijah
Muhammad was around.
I got knowledge itself in 1980.

(32:23):
I got that from G because hegot it from the city.
I mean he brought the lessonsback.
I got it from him.
But when I came home in 89,that's when I ran into Farrakhan
in the Nation of Islam, hisNation of Islam was 89 for me.

Speaker 4 (32:34):
Yeah, I would agree.
When you were a child and youwould go downtown, you would see
Nation of Islam members sellingthe newspaper downtown.
That was in the 70s, yeah yeah.
The Balalian News.
The Balalian News, exactly.
So then, when Wharf Dean tookover the nation, you still had
members that would be in thedowntown area selling the
newspapers at that time thattime.

(32:55):
When Minister Farrakhan's grouphad started to come up in those
early in those 80s, you wouldstill have the Muslim presence.
When I was in Syracuse I gotout the military in 89.
Also After I got out, ministerKhalid would come again to speak

(33:19):
at the university.
I first met Dr Collin in theearly 90s by him coming up to
the university giving speeches,because him and Minister
Farrakhan would go to theuniversities in order to make
money.
They would do lectures.
So that's how I was able tomeet them.

Speaker 2 (33:30):
That's a fact.
And guess who guarded them atthat time?
The 5% Nation.
Any university they went to, itwas the guards that was
protecting them, correct?
He didn't have an FOI.

Speaker 4 (33:42):
No, it was still being formed, exactly.

Speaker 1 (33:45):
Wow, that's history right there.

Speaker 4 (33:49):
Yeah, I have a question.

Speaker 3 (33:52):
That's dope though.
Were there any key NOI templesor mosques established in
Syracuse?

Speaker 4 (33:59):
We always had what was called study groups not
actual mosques, but we had studygroups that were being
established.
After I got knowledge of self,I was still in the military in
San Diego and me and my wife hadjoined in San Diego and then
when I moved back to Syracuse wejust continue at that time so

(34:20):
we had study groups.
The main mosque would be comingout of Buffalo and then the
smaller groups like Rochesterand Syracuse would then follow
under that umbrella of Buffalo.

Speaker 1 (34:32):
Under Buffalo.

Speaker 3 (34:34):
Buffalo what to turn?

Speaker 1 (34:37):
around West Side.
What's his name?
Rick James.
Is he from Buffalo?
I?

Speaker 2 (34:43):
think.

Speaker 4 (34:44):
He is Rick.

Speaker 1 (34:46):
James, he got banned from Syracuse.

Speaker 4 (34:49):
He got banned.
Yeah, All he did was this wasaround like 79, this was about
1980.
I was one of the children.
He came to the Landmark Theater.
All Rick James did was light ajoint and then throw a couple
nickel bags in the audience.
That's all he did, and theybanned Rick James for life from

(35:09):
Syracuse.

Speaker 1 (35:11):
That's crazy.

Speaker 4 (35:12):
He saw Mary Jane and he started throwing nickel bags.
That's how old that was.
He was throwing nickel bags onthe audience.

Speaker 2 (35:20):
Rick James was the beast man.
I'm telling you, man, RickJames is something.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
Okay, now where were we?
So all right, what was MrFarrakhan's influence in the
area, if any?

Speaker 2 (35:36):
Mr Farrakhan had a lot of influence at that
particular time.
I mean, we were young, you knowwhat I'm saying and you know we
was God and he was spittinglessons.
He was speaking 120.
Like it was just what it wasand he had ventured into the,
into like the, what I call thehip popular arena.

(35:56):
He was not only just doing whathe was doing, but he started
getting popular with MCs andwith the culture, with the
culture, man, you know, and itjust went.
It just went, I mean it justwent for it, just just what it
was.
But later on in life you knowwhat I'm saying me and Ish had
to demonstrate some things, man,on that whole situation later

(36:17):
on in life, man.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
On a NOI man on that whole, on that whole situation
later on in life.
Man on, uh, on on it on the noiyeah, yeah, we did a whole
demonstration b it.

Speaker 2 (36:26):
The demonstration is the top demonstration.
Nobody has ever topped it.
Everybody borrowed from it andnever said where they got the
information from.
But we did a groundbreakingjoint b you know, I mean it and
it just, it's just kept, it'skept going, it's just kept going
.
He just kept, he's still, he'sstill going.
You know what I'm saying?
I was just.

(36:47):
I just happened to come homefrom South Africa and had been.
Remember I told you I was inSouth Africa and I and I had to
get my children back, so Iinfiltrated Scientology.
Remember I told you that.

Speaker 3 (36:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (36:59):
So I knew certain things.
So Ish sent me a picture with achair and it says COS on the
chair, and I remember he saidthis brother Malik Kasha sent me
this picture, brother, what doyou know about this picture?
Like, what do you know?
I said, oh see, that's theChurch of Scientology.
I said, oh, the Church ofScientology is coming to labor
meetings now, scientology.

(37:19):
I said, oh, the church inScientology is coming to labor
meetings now.
And then I just broke down andtold him everything, everything
I knew about the church, fromauditing from the OT operating
thetans.

Speaker 3 (37:28):
I went through the whole joint.

Speaker 4 (37:30):
He did.
He went through the wholeDianetics and deciphered all of
the questions that I had.
He knows more information aboutScientology.
He's forgotten more than I knowto this day.
I would defer to him.
If I needed information aboutwhat was the inner workings of
Scientology and what's beingapplied, I would bounce it off
of him.

(37:50):
So I would say, Professor, whatabout X, Y and Z?
So the first people I went towas Sheik Denim L and my teacher
Steve Coakley.
To was Sheikh Denim L and myteacher Steve Coakley.
When I started seeing that therewere these secret meetings
taking place between Scientologyand the Nation of Islam.
Those are the first two peoplethat I went to.

Speaker 3 (38:08):
Alright, so with the science.
I don't want them to come onhere and try to ban us for this
but I know with some of thesemethods is um, I'm going to be
honest, I picked up a book, Ipicked up Dianetics.
I'm going to be real with y'all, right, and as I was reading
and studying, a lot of past liferegression is practiced within
the science.

(38:29):
People don't want to admit, butI'll just leave it like that.
We live in.
It's real.

Speaker 2 (38:35):
You know what, brother?
I'm going to tell you something, man.
He called it the analytical andthe reactive mind.
That's what he termed it.
It's actually just the highestself and the lowest self.
Let me ask you a question,brother when is your mind at?
Can you point it to me, can't?
point it, right?
Right, we can point where thebrain is, though, right, see,
the mind is somewhere out here.

(38:56):
It's not a physical thing,right?
It's something you tap into, so, in a sense, that's a whole lie
.
It's actually he's dealing onthe science of your higher self
and your lower self, the God andthe devil.
That's within Z, that's all,but he had to put his own twist
on it, though.
You know what I'm saying, andyou know, if you don't

(39:17):
understand, that L Ron Hubbardwas a science fiction writer.
He wrote science fictionstories, comic books, characters
and the whole shit.
Excuse my language.
Then you would yeah, then youwould understand.
You know how he was good withthe wordplay.

Speaker 4 (39:32):
And one can't ignore the fact that you had the whole
him and Aleister Crowleyrelationship with him and Jack,
with him and Jack Parsons.
Jack Parsons yeah, yeah, whenyou deal with that part of the
history that can't be ignored.
I sat down with hisgreat-grandson for over three
hours for his great-grandson tobreak down to me the
documentation that he still has.

(39:53):
I spoke with Jamie DeWolf andin my speaking to him he was
showing me the stuff that hisgrandfather was into, you know.
So when elijah muhammad said toleave that stuff alone, they
asked elijah muhammad that,specifically, what about the
church of scientology?
He said it was of the devil,that it was a devil science and

(40:13):
that's what that's what hisgreat-grandson proved wow and we

Speaker 1 (40:17):
knew it, so hold on hold on.
We need a Scientology part twowith both you brothers on,
because we did a Scientologywith Ish probably like a year or
so ago.
Right, that'll be peace.

Speaker 4 (40:34):
And did anybody refute that information I
presented?
No, they can't they never will.

Speaker 1 (40:41):
I think they demonetized that video though my
apologies.

Speaker 2 (40:50):
That's a strong possibility, word up.
You know the thing is, man,it's crazy because we was even
getting little subtle pushback,but nobody, I mean bro, we, we,
we were so bold with it.
It was, it was, it was just, itwas just the, it was just bold.
The way it was, the way we did,it was just bold, man.

(41:12):
It wasn't no, it wasn't no,fear man, we just, we just did
it this way.

Speaker 4 (41:16):
They said that we were crazy because minister
farrakhan didn't admit it untilafter.
We came forward and pulled theveil back.
We said this is what they'redoing.
He came later on and admittedthat that's what he was doing.
That's how early we were.
There is no source referencethat we had to refer to because
we were the source referenceFacts.

Speaker 2 (41:37):
Facts.
We broke it down because seeFarrakhan speaks.
He spoke in riddles.
He talked about a new book.
There would be a new book thatwould come.
It would have new teachings.
He spoke about this.
I've seen that speak, yeah,well, it was Dianetics.

Speaker 4 (41:54):
That was a new book and we had the quote Right we
had the quote when his minister,tony Muhammad, said he was
going to put the Dianetics booknext to the Holy Quran.
Take it To Mecca and let thescholars Know.
You will never understand thisBook Quran, until you understand

(42:14):
this book.
Dianetics Ain't that something?

Speaker 2 (42:19):
I'll tell you, boy, I'll tell you, I'll tell you
that.

Speaker 4 (42:22):
I'll tell you that would have been a one-way ticket
if he would have did that.
But that's what they weretalking about.

Speaker 1 (42:26):
Yeah for sure.
All right Now.
The next question is Mike, youwant to go?

Speaker 3 (42:34):
Yeah, yeah, all right .
How did the NOI interact withthe local politics or police in
Syracuse?

Speaker 2 (42:41):
Ish could give a better description of that.

Speaker 4 (42:44):
Yeah, complex relationship.
One thing was, as we justtalked about a few minutes ago,
the RICO Act.
Right, we just talked about theRICO Act.
The RICO Act was enacted whenNation of Islam people would
come.
Dennis Muhammad would come,collect names of the street

(43:04):
organization members and thenhanded it to the police
department, collected all of thenames of these people.
The police then collected thenames of these individuals, put
cases on these individuals andput them under federal
indictment.
Put cases on these individualsand put them under federal
indictment.
Now you had another element ofthe Nation of Islam that had

(43:25):
nothing to do with the police.
Those were the Khalid babies.
Those are the ones who aregoing to be most likely the
rabble rousers, who are going tobe into the youth organizations
.
Dr Khalid was plugged into thegang members.
Whenever he would land in yourcity he would want to know where
are the drug dealers at, and hehad two major vehicles he used

(43:50):
to drive.
He had two Rolls Royces, awhite one and a black one, and
he called them his tanks.
So when he would roll up inyour city, he wanted to make
sure he was driving better thanthe biggest drug dealers and he
was dressed sharper than thebiggest drug dealers because he
would get their attention.
I'm driving better than you, Ilook better than you, I'm

(44:11):
dressed better than you and I'mplugged into God.
So come on down to the templeand get some of these teachings
and you can find out why I lookbetter than you, dress better
than you and drive better thanyou.
Young brother, that was histank, as he would call, so he
was plugged into that element ofthe Nation of Islam.
Two different relationshipsOkay.

Speaker 2 (44:32):
Powerful psychology Right.

Speaker 1 (44:35):
For sure, for sure, who were some prominent NOI
figures in Syracuse history Ish.

Speaker 4 (44:46):
I was assistant minister in Syracuse, new York.
I was influential when it comesdown to being in Syracuse and
being able to have someinfluence and I really came from
a 5% background.
You know, sheik Denim L hadknowledge of self about a year
before I did, but we were babies.
We were babies with theknowledge of self.
So us being plugged into theyouth.

(45:08):
We were already having streetciphers, we already engulfed in
the culture and understanding120 and the power being invested
in the youth.
So we're able to take thatenergy and go into the ranks.
So we're able to take thatenergy and go into the ranks, as
some individuals will go intothe more science temple.
I went further into the nationof islam to move up in the
ministry ranks because I wastaught by dr collin so I was

(45:30):
able to go that route when otherones went the more science
temple route directly taught bydr collin directly.

Speaker 1 (45:36):
Yeah, directly taught by Colin Colin was super smart
man Right.

Speaker 4 (45:43):
And I was around him for many, many times before I
would even ask a question.
It would benefit me to meet himin New York and see how he
walked through 125.
He would walk in like a mayor,go into this part of 125,
starting at this store, walk allthe way through and me just be
a fly on the wall over hisshoulder watching how he

(46:04):
politics, watching his diplomacy, watching how he moves in a
militant way as a baby.
And then he would just turnaround and say I'll be right
with you, brother, and I'll bethat person just waiting while
he's working the room.
But he would never forget thisyoung brother.
I'm young but asking thesequestions thinking I'm deep.

(46:24):
I wasn't deep at all, but I'masking these questions to him
while he's still working theactual room.
I was very blessed and to bearound this brother.
I was around Sheikh Danim Elfor 40 plus years.
Do you know how blessed I am byAllahah?
I'm blessed to have arelationship with sharif bay for

(46:46):
over 35 years.
I mean uninterrupted access togreat minds, so we were able to
all make each other greatbecause we all came from the
same school.
To have uninterrupted access tothat kind of knowledge from
this brother since the 70s intothe 80s.
Man, that's nothing but Allah'smercy.

Speaker 2 (47:09):
Praise Allah.
And you know, bro, I mean wecan do this all night, this
accolade stuff, man, you know wego way back, man.
Let me tell you something, man,I ain't want to tell nobody.
This man, but Ish, he like todance in strobe lights, oh Lord,
he like to pop lock on thestrobe light.

Speaker 4 (47:29):
He's giving a babysitter secrets.

Speaker 2 (47:33):
He like to pop lock on the strobe light.
I used to be the light thingclicking it on and off like this
.
That's hip-hop.

Speaker 4 (47:44):
I confess.
I confess we were together whenMTV first got debuted in 1981.
We were watching the TV whenMTV first started.
That's how far back we go.

Speaker 1 (47:58):
King Gabe said yes, you are, when men honor man.
You are when men honor man.
You honor Allah.
Peace, King Gabe.
The next one.
What's the next question?

Speaker 3 (48:13):
Nation of gods and earth.

Speaker 1 (48:14):
Nation of gods and earth, you ready?
We only got 10 minutes.

Speaker 3 (48:21):
How did the 5% you ready?
How did the 5% nation take rootin Syracuse?
I?

Speaker 1 (48:27):
already know the answer.
God answered that on the firstone, but go ahead.

Speaker 2 (48:32):
With me.
I got knowledge of self.
Like I said, you got to get himone day on here too, man, the
brother G.
His name is Eman Abu Hudayan,abu hudefa now, but um, he
brought knowledge itself, man.
He brought, he brought back 120.
One day we was in the basementbecause he had a basement.
His basement was like a, waslike a tunnel in new york city

(48:53):
and just a graffiti tunnel.
You walk down the stepsgraffiti all over the walls.
You get to the bottom, theturntables in the corner.
It's a.
It's a floor full of linoleumover here, burnt bomb walls,
anything man, that sound like myplace to be man yeah, man, you
know, I mean, so you know, downthere and him, it was him.
his name was born wise and itwas brother, uh, king justice,

(49:16):
born wise king justice.
And it was another brother.
I can't remember his name.
And I was just down there breakbreaking and you know, just
adding on and listening and I'mlike yo, what the hell is he
talking about?
Man?
But I got pulled in quick.
I liked it, I was like yo, so Iwent to G.
I was like yo, man, yo can youteach me that?
And he just gave me the lesson,he just gave them to me, and

(49:43):
after that it was a wrap.
I got to one.
I mastered 120 before myenlightener, before the person
who gave me, who gave me lessons?

Speaker 4 (49:47):
And that same individual was gave the same
information to my cousin Hisname.
His name was Smooth G andSmooth G is our parents or
siblings.
He gave that information to me,so that's how I was able to get
it.
In the early 80s also, the sameindividual was just giving out
life.
He was giving out life to theyouth he was doing his job.

Speaker 2 (50:09):
You know what's crazy ?
He was giving out life anddeath Because G had a kilo at 13
years old.
So I mean we talking a reallife history, we talking about a
cat.
I mean he was an ill DJ too.
Nice, real nice.
Him and Rapski had some of theiconic battles.

(50:30):
Dj Battles was between him andRapski, who just passed away
Iconic battle.
But he went on to do music withTrackmasters, with Rich Nice
and them Videos music studio.
But he was going back and forthbetween the drug game and the

(50:51):
music game.
But now he, for the last 20years, 20 plus years man, he's a
reformed Iman, muslim,beautiful children, got about
seven children, a wife,beautiful family.
He's doing great.

Speaker 4 (51:01):
And we would take trips to New York too.
Whenever we go to Harlem, we goto Mecca to make sure we're
able to get knowledge.

Speaker 2 (51:09):
Yeah, indeed, go to the parliaments as well.
Go to parliaments.
Yeah, we would also holdciphers right in the town.
I would start a cipher anywhere, anywhere.
If I seen God, I would start acypher anywhere, yes, anywhere.
If I seen God, I would just Iwould anywhere, correct.
But we would also meetuniformly in a place called

(51:29):
Wilson Park, Right, you rememberthat Ish?

Speaker 4 (51:33):
I remember Wilson Park Absolutely.
We had a cypher right there.

Speaker 2 (51:36):
Yeah, we had some cyphers right there.
That was a little bit in theold, that was in like the early
90s, going into like the early90s.
God rest their dead.
That was Mutaz, our brother,who's the other brother, the
other brothers that Sharif usedto run with Brother.

Speaker 4 (51:50):
Salaam.
We had.

Speaker 2 (51:51):
Zulu, you know, and brothers like that Brother
Salaam.
And.

Speaker 4 (51:55):
Malachi Z York.
Malachi Z York used to comethrough to Syracuse.
He had members.
He was running in Brooklyn, butyou see Imam Esau in Syracuse,
new York.
Yeah, I remember running intoImam Esau.

Speaker 2 (52:09):
I remember running into him and I remember running
into Dr York at the Gardenia.
Yeah, you would Right down theline of street when he had that
crew.
He had that group called she.
It was a singing group calledshe.
Yeah, man, yeah, dr York, yeah,because I got into the science
of Imam Issa when I went to theNavy in 86.
I ran into a cat named Hassan DGeronimo from Queens and he had

(52:32):
all the Dr York stuff.
But the gods was like yo,that's Dr Cork, don't mess with
that.
It's now siphoned in there, butyo, I'm a wise man, you know
what I mean.
I'm going to do the knowledgeand I found it.
I found things in it that wasintriguing, enlightening and
educating for me.

(52:57):
You know, I wasn't just, my mindwasn't closed just to 120.

Speaker 4 (53:00):
We were always seeking knowledge, you know, no
matter what the school ofthought was.
That's what we pride ourselveson?

Speaker 1 (53:03):
Yeah, indeed Me too, me too.
But when York started talkingabout aliens, he lost me with
that.
But you know what, though, I'mstarting to like look at it a
little bit nowadays, like youknow, like there could be a
possibility you know what I'msaying Like let's not close our
mind off to things that you knowwe don't truly understand,

(53:25):
right?

Speaker 2 (53:26):
Right, because I'm going to tell you something,
brother, we not alone.

Speaker 4 (53:32):
Right, we not alone, I agree.
And for Dr York, he made somemistakes as far as he had an
organization.
But they started going anti-5%and they put out a 5% book and
when you went against the godson that level.
There was no fly zone.
Yeah, it was a no yeah.

Speaker 2 (53:51):
He went against Noble Juali as well.
He went against all the rosters.
He went against everybody.

Speaker 3 (53:54):
Holly Selassie.

Speaker 4 (53:56):
Holly Selassie, exactly.
So he started burning somebridges and kind of putting
themselves on an island, youknow.

Speaker 3 (54:02):
Had to get G-checked.

Speaker 1 (54:04):
Right, were there any local?
Well, we already spoke aboutthe bills no parliaments or
nothing like that out there.

Speaker 2 (54:14):
We never had parliaments, we just had ciphers
.
We never had parliaments whereother gods came from other
places and you know what I'msaying besides gods from the
university or whatever, but no,we just had ciphers.

Speaker 1 (54:25):
What about artists into the 5% teaching?
I mean, you introduced me to agroup.
I forgot their name, but Ithink it was like, from what it
sounds like, it sounded like onewas a Moor and the other one
was a 5%-er.

Speaker 4 (54:43):
Or it sounded like oh , like two kings and a cypher.

Speaker 2 (54:45):
Two kings and a cypher.
Yeah, them cats was alright,they did their thing.
They did their thing.
Any other artists In regards towhat Coming out of Syracuse?
Coming out of Syracuse?
Coming out of syracuse or justcoming out of syracuse?
Oh no, the key, the cats whocame out of syracuse, wasn't

(55:07):
more, it wasn't more than fivepercenters.
Um right, who I, who Ireferenced you about syracuse
was um makiba and scratch right,right, makiba yep that's who I
referenced you um referencereference to you about Syracuse,
like somebody who they actuallyhad a deal.
They had a deal, but Scratch,you know he's just a dirty cat.

(55:29):
Man Took the money and ran withit, did something else, left
Makeba.
Makeba went back to work at UPSman.

Speaker 3 (55:38):
Right, right, good brother.

Speaker 2 (55:42):
Definitely a good brother.
I think he's in Atlanta nowselling cars or something, if
I'm not mistaken.

Speaker 3 (55:46):
I'm not laughing at the UPS thing, I'm like he just
spilled everything.

Speaker 2 (55:51):
Yeah, that's what he did.
He ripped a lot of people offman.
He had a little music studioand all that type of stuff and
people would come and spendmoney and they knew he had like
a little clout.

Speaker 4 (56:01):
but he used that to his advantage and syracuse had,
you know, some, some homegrowntalent that came through, you
know, like the artist uh postmalone post.

Speaker 2 (56:10):
Malone is from syracuse.
Yeah, yeah, yeah syracuse um.

Speaker 4 (56:14):
You got actors.

Speaker 3 (56:15):
Even though I don't like scientology, tom cruise
he's from syracuse so we've hadhad, you know, the Baldwin
family, alec Baldwin and theBaldwin family, mother.

Speaker 2 (56:24):
Baldwin, she's very sweet, richard Gere, richard.

Speaker 4 (56:28):
Gere yeah.

Speaker 2 (56:30):
Yeah, richard Gere.
Also the kid, the rapper.
What's his name?
Aaron Cooks Stolgaard, yeah,stolgaard.

Speaker 3 (56:39):
Yeah, he from over here.
Yeah, he's from Syracuse.
He's with Griselda right.

Speaker 4 (56:44):
Yeah, exactly, and he did some work with Lord Jamar.

Speaker 3 (56:50):
I believe the majority of them are either
Muslim or 5% is within that.
Griselda crew right.

Speaker 4 (56:57):
Yeah, and they're all from central New York and from
our area.
So we take a lot of pride inGriselda and what they represent
.
They speak for us.
You know a lot of the culture,of what we see.

Speaker 2 (57:06):
And put.

Speaker 4 (57:06):
New York City on their back.
They put all of New York ontheir back.

Speaker 3 (57:10):
There's nobody better Shout out to my fellow Zoe on
that team.

Speaker 1 (57:15):
Hey, shout out to Jim Jones.
Shout out to Jim Jones, jimmy.

Speaker 3 (57:21):
Jimmy's struggling, struggling hard Jimmy better
wait.

Speaker 2 (57:28):
Yo, mr Brown you know , Max.

Speaker 3 (57:30):
B coming home.
Jimmy nervous man, jimmynervous man.
Max B was that dude?

Speaker 2 (57:37):
Jimmy a little nervous man.
That's why he's starting tobeef with everybody.
He want to be relevant.

Speaker 1 (57:42):
He'll be alright.
Can you talk about streetknowledge and education clashed
or aligned?
Like street knowledge andeducation?
Did it clash or did it align?

Speaker 2 (57:56):
For me it aligned.
For me it aligned, it willalways align.
Street knowledge and education,or street knowledge and wisdom,
or the attainment of such andsuch street knowledge, if used
properly, will lead you to thosethings.
Street knowledge will guide youto heaven or it can guide you
to hell, but it's the intent ofthe user, whoever's using the

(58:18):
street knowledge or who's, youknow.

Speaker 4 (58:19):
I'm saying it's the intent right yeah, and I would
say it's not mutually exclusive.
You can have both.
You can be extremely wise withstreet knowledge.
That doesn't limit you.
You can still debate, you canstill have a body of knowledge
that nobody can compare that to.
It's all about your methodology.
How tight is your methodologyand the information that you're
pushing?
You know, if you look at ShakeDenim L, he has his bachelor's

(58:43):
degree, he has his master'sdegree, but he has street
knowledge first.
He merged both.
I have my college degree.
I just merged my foundation.
I was making six figures withjust the high school education.
I coupled that so I could putmore tools in my tool belt to
increase my value in my career.
But I was already making sixfigures with just a high school
education.
So it's about merging both.

Speaker 1 (59:06):
Right right Indeed.

Speaker 2 (59:08):
I say it simply like this you can either be a product
of your environment or you canmake your environment your
product.

Speaker 3 (59:20):
Facts, facts, facts.
Your environment, your product,facts, facts.

Speaker 1 (59:25):
I like that right there.
I like that right there you canuse it bro, you can hold it.
Thanks, man, I appreciate it.
I'm taking that yo.
But on that note, man, thanky'all for coming out this
evening.
I really appreciate y'all.
I got more questions, though.
I would love for y'all to comeout, and I got more questions,
though, so I would like fory'all to come back again and do

(59:46):
a part three and close it outwith, maybe part three.

Speaker 2 (59:50):
I got mad questions.

Speaker 1 (59:55):
I don't know if there's a part four to this man.

Speaker 2 (59:58):
Hey, man, we appreciate you, brother, for
just even giving the exposure toupstate New York, like you're
doing, man, we appreciate itbecause I've always felt you
know what I'm saying New YorkState is an entity in its own
anyway, you know what I'm saying.
I mean, we're one of theoriginal colonies, one of the
first original colonies.
There's more things going on inour past and in our present
that we ain't even touched onwith our people here in New York

(01:00:22):
State or the history of thisplace period.

Speaker 1 (01:00:25):
Man, I was listening to this audio book Occult in
America.
I'm listening to Occult inAmerica and it's just talking
about New York, new York, newYork, new York, new York.
I'm like damn, there'ssomething going on New York, new
York, new York, new.
York, new York, new York man,right, I'm like damn, there's

(01:00:45):
something going on up here man.

Speaker 2 (01:00:47):
It's full of witchcraft.
B Some of the areas you live in, some of them, locations and
them blocks are filled withincantations.
Man, Certainly like you gotdemons and certain things
controlling or overseeing areasastrally.
Man Like people, man likepeople.
Oh that brother crazy.
I.

Speaker 3 (01:01:04):
You're on burial grounds.

Speaker 4 (01:01:06):
All that We'll be able to break some of that down.
Yeah, have us back, we'll talkabout it.
And your interest in CentralNew York.
It doesn't go, you know,unrecognized.
Bless both of y'all for justhaving the interest.
You know, welcoming us on yourshow, I always feel like I'm at
home, so bless both of you andyour loved ones Likewise bro.

Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
Likewise, and we are out of here.
Peace.

Speaker 2 (01:01:29):
Peace, one love Y'all be easy.

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Syracuse History & Culture Part 2 - Ishmael Bey & Shiek EL

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Syracuse History & Culture Part 2 - Ishmael Bey & Shiek EL