August 14, 2025 • 58 mins
Welcome To The Oddity Shop, Where The Bizarre is Always on Sale. This week, your Curator Zach is covering the Infamous 1947 Roswell UFO Crash in our 150th Episode!!!!
The mystery begins when pilot Kenneth Arnold spots nine crescent-shaped objects flying at impossible speeds over Washington State, coining the term "flying saucer" and kickstarting America's UFO obsession. But the story truly takes flight when rancher Mac Brazel discovers bizarre debris on his New Mexico property.
When Brazel reports his findings to the Roswell Army Air Field, something extraordinary happens: the military actually announces they've captured a "flying disc" before abruptly changing their story within 24 hours, claiming it was merely a weather balloon. Major Jesse Marcel, the intelligence officer who handled the original materials, would later break his silence, stating unequivocally: "It was not anything from this Earth. I'm absolutely sure of that."
We trace how this incident faded from public consciousness before roaring back to life in the 1970s with hundreds of new witnesses coming forward. We examine the government's evolving explanations, and all the bizarre inconsistencies that have kept researchers questioning the official narrative for 75+ years.
Leave us a voicemail with your thoughts on Roswell or share your own otherworldly experiences!
References:
· https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roswell_incident
· https://www.britannica.com/topic/unidentified-flying-object
· https://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/space-science/roswell-ufo-incident
· https://people.com/roswell-incident-true-story-unsolved-mysteries-8722935
· https://media.defense.gov/2 021/Jul/13/2002761373/-1/-1/0/GENERAL_ACCOUNTING_OFFICE_S_SCHIFF.PDF
Shop MI Mystical Forest on Etsy – where spirit meets craftsmanship.
For a limited time, enter code “oddball” at checkout to receive 10% off plus a free pendulum. Or simply Click Here
The Shop's phone lines are open! Give us a call and leave a voicemail (Or two!) with your creepy personal tale/oddity, and it could be featured on a future episode!
616.320.4935
JOIN US ON PATREON: Click Here!
Join the Oddity Shop on Patreon for Day Early Access to Episodes and tons of bonus content!!!
Visit our Website to learn more!
Email Us at: oddityshoppodcast.com
www.OddityShopPodcast.com
Disclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. Affiliate programs are designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to the partner site.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
I want to dance with the mothman at the IA shop,
Baked in the moonlight at the IAshop.
Creep through the graveyard tothe IA shop.
The door's always open at theIA shop.
(00:29):
Welcome back to the Oddity Shop, you little oddballs.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
The podcast where we tell you creepy, odd, weird,
strange stories from beyond theglobe.
Actually you know what thatstands for today.
This one does stand for today.
Oh spoiler, who am I?
Because you have failed atintroducing me for weeks.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
Because you just messed me up.
I'm your curator, kara.
This is your curator, zachary.
Oh hi, thank you, and what'snew?
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Okay, so you know I do on the side.
I have my little side job, myproperty management.
No, I didn't know, oh, okay,you didn't know.
I was doing a showing for thislovely group of human beings the
other day and they were so cute.
I say human beings, I am goingto assume pronouns were probably
in the they, them range.
(01:26):
Okay, I love them.
Okay, we got on splendidly.
It was not the property forthem, that's fine are you not
friends?
well, I we might be, becausebianca looked at me and goes um,
can I give this to you?
And she pulled a little baggieout of her purse and goes.
One of our roommates whocouldn't make it to the showing
tonight makes sun catchers, youknow, like the little and it has
(01:53):
a little amethyst at the end, Igo.
I'm a crystal boy.
How do you know she goes.
I just had a vibe.
So, anyways, I want you to havethem all over my plants now.
They gave me three of them andthey're really cute and really
darling.
I just I'll give you one.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Okay, they were they were great.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I was just like so surprised.
They were really sweet people,though, but I I love it, and
it's now hanging in one of my umphilodendrons and it catches
the sun and it just looks socool.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Cute, okay, so I can't remember, but I'm pretty
sure we maybe talked about this,but I can't remember.
I bought a book so I couldstart reading, because like to
de-stress, I think.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yeah, you were talking about that a couple of
weeks Okay.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
So then I don't think I talked about this, though,
and I don't even know if I toldyou this, then target or maybe I
did tell you, tell the podcast,I don't remember Target had a
sale where it was by two booksget one free, and so I was like
I have to go to Target and buythree books.
So I bought three more books,but I hadn't even gotten to page
100 of the first book.
So what is Kara doing?
(02:52):
Then you kind of made me spiralbecause you're like, oh well,
you can do like a book review.
And then I'm like, well, Ican't be Julia.
So then I ordered a book reviewsheet so that I can fill it out
and put in every book.
Then I had to buy a book lightbecause I'm like, okay, well,
this is the beginning of Kara'slibrarian arc.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
No, I can see where this is going.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
I'm like okay, but I kind of want to read at night,
because that's when you want tode-stress, but then it's dark
and like Aaron's sleeping.
So I bought a book light andit's awful, I have to get a new
one.
So then I kind of just wentcrazy.
Now I keep getting like ads andcoupons for books.
Here's the dumb part.
I don't have time to read and Iknow that's stupid.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
Here's the dumb part I don't know how to read.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
I don't.
I'm a very slow reader.
I will say that, okay, so what?
I am telling myself, though,because I almost did this the
three books that I bought and Ican't remember what they're
called.
The three books that I boughtand I can't remember what
they're called.
I really, really want to readthose, because the book I
started I'm not really vibingwith, but I told myself I could
not start another book and it'slike a, it's like a reward.
(03:56):
You can't start these greatbooks that you want, cause
when's a haunting, they're alllike, really like good ones.
And I kind of did reviewsActually, I think I did Might've
said, might've said thiscausebid had mentioned one.
Okay, but this book that I'mreading, I'm going to give you a
little bit of a review.
Okay, I thought I was going tolike it because it was supposed
to be like about a podcast andit's called how to find a
missing girl and it's presentedlike this host of this podcast.
So, like her friend goesmissing, she does a podcast, how
(04:19):
to find a missing girl, blah,blah, blah.
So I'm like, okay, okay, thismight be cool, like whatever,
like it's mystery, it's fine,except for this author uses
words over and over again thatneed to not be used over and
over again.
Like um, scrutinized, how manytimes can you?
Speaker 2 (04:37):
you, I'm on like page 200 and I think she's used
scrutinized 30 times minimumthat's where you just got to go
to Google and hit you knowsynonyms.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
The other thing and y'all can come for me.
I'm sorry.
Every person in this book issome sort of like LGBTQ plus,
and there's nothing wrong withthat.
But why is every like everybodyyou meet in this?
Speaker 2 (05:00):
book hey, we love representation, we do.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
But it's just crazy.
Like every one of her friends,cool.
Then you meet this person.
They have like two moms andthen all of a sudden they have a
lesbian flag on the wall and weneed to detail the lesbian flag
on the wall for like a verylong time.
I'm very happy that we havecharacters of all, but I don't
know why we have to have so manydetails about all of them.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Just let them be what they are.
She's a detailed writer.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
No, she's not.
It's awful, oh okay.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Well, maybe we pick a different book then.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Well, I have to finish it.
You have to encourage me, Kara.
Kara, it's going to be theright book, finish it.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
It's going to be great, finish it.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
It's not terrible.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
Let me say that it's not terrible, but it's just like
I don't think I should havepicked it for my first fair.
There's other books now.
Now you at least know what youdon't like.
That author fair, uh, oh my god.
What else is new, though?
Uh, we just got back fromkentucky and waverly hills and
hunters against hate, so youguys should ask us about that in
the comments, because we don'tknow what it's like right now.
For us in like real life becauseit's gonna happen to us in the
future, but for you guys, thathappened for us a week in the
past, so oh god, I was like wedidn't go anywhere you know what
(06:15):
?
do you have a question?
You know what this is?
First of all, before we get tothe question, do you know what
this is?
I do episode 150.
Somehow we're working on ourswearing for the algorithms uh,
150.
We have sat down and done this150 times.
You and I, in just three monthsshort of three years, have,
(06:36):
other than one january where wetook a break this january, have
not missed a week here's and Isaid this, I think, on our
hundredth episode.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
It doesn't feel like a lot to me because I feel like
we should have more, but it'sbecause it's weeks and I don't
my brain like calculating itthat way.
The work that goes into all ofthese episodes and like the
promoting of it and the socialsand stuff like that, is so much
more.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
And the writing and the research and the editing 150
episodes.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
That is mind blowing to me that it's only 150.
But I get it is that's a lotand I cannot believe it.
When you said it was 150, I waslike oh I realized it while I
was writing this one.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
I have to say, like real quick, let's float our own
boats.
I am so fucking proud of youand everything that you've done
why thank you?
And us dude like I'm proud ofyou I don't know.
150.
Wow, look at us.
Okay, we'll stop gloating for asecond.
We'll stop celebrating.
Are you ready for a question?
Speaker 1 (07:39):
yeah, we should stop celebrating ourselves, because
y'all should celebrate us.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Just kidding, you already do, but we also
celebrate you, because if youguys didn't listen, we would
have quit a long time ago.
Okay, let's open the shop forthe 150th time if you.
Oh, we have.
This is a good one too.
This is a good episode.
I picked this.
I scrapped the one I had when Irealized right, you told me
that that's crazy.
Okay, if you discoveredsomething really bizarre and
(08:02):
unusual other than me, who isthe first or what, or who is the
first place?
You're reporting it to likelocal news government media,
posting it to tiktok.
What are you doing?
Speaker 1 (08:12):
wait other than you other than me oh, my mom that's
it okay, if weird, thing, weird,bizarre things happen, it's you
and my mom and then you're whatyou're doing from there, just
not saying anything.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Covering, covering it up.
What is your plan?
Speaker 1 (08:26):
I guess it just depends on what it is.
I don't know, ok, um yeah, Iguess.
I guess let me re-answer when Iknow what.
What it's about.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
You're going to put it together pretty quick, but
not right away.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
I just want to know, like or like.
Once I know what it is, then Iwant to think about who I would
tell.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Okay, Okay, that's fair.
Okay, we'll go with that.
Okay, so are you ready for 150?
Woo, our story begins the 24thof June 1947.
Okay, pilot Kenneth Arnold isflying over the Cascade
Mountains in Washington State,his mission Helping the military
(09:06):
search for a crashed airplane.
However, what he sees iscompletely out of this world.
Kenneth sees ninecrescent-shaped flying objects
10,000 feet off the ground,going at extraordinary speeds.
Okay, you're lost, and youshould be.
He reports this to the mediaand it kicks off a new phrase as
(09:28):
well as a new phase, the phraseflying saucer, the phase the
UFO flap of the 40s and the 50s.
Oh, so it is Kenneth Arnold andhis story that makes headlines
around the world, that startsthe flying saucer craze.
Okay, okay, but our storydoesn't actually take place in
(09:50):
washington or in june.
In fact, we're gonna fastforward to a few weeks later and
a local rancher local to whereI can't tell you his name is mac
brazel, and he is out on hisranch called the foster ranch,
and he is looking over his umlivestock and the farm and the
(10:10):
entire ranch to see any damagethat would have occurred after a
violent thunderstorm the nightbefore.
However, he finds somethingthat intrigues him a little bit.
Okay, okay so let's get thegeography out of the way, and
this is going to tell youexactly what the story is.
The Foster Ranch sits in thestate of New Mexico,
(10:30):
approximately 75 miles from thecity of Roswell.
Ah, brazel discovers a strangedebris field on his ranch, and
this field stretches for severalhundred feet and was unlike
anything he had ever seen before.
So what he finds is as followscara, okay, foil like material
(10:53):
that returned to its originalshape after being crumpled, hit,
smashed, almost like a memorymetal.
He called it okay.
There are also thin,lightweight beams, some with
symbols or hieroglyphic-likemarkings, and pieces of
parchment that were resistant tofire and tearing.
Brazel notes that the debriswasn't from anything he had ever
(11:14):
seen before.
He had had a few things crashdown onto the branch in the past
, but he was not able torecognize any of the bits.
He did try to like, like wesaid, burn some of the material.
It wouldn't burn.
He tried to cut it.
It couldn't be cut, dented,scratched, nothing.
Locals do start to come onto theranch and who had like said
(11:37):
they handled pieces of it.
They said it felt like plasticmixed with metal, that it defied
physics.
So at first, though, brazeldoesn't think really like too
much into anything.
But then he starts to hear thenews go around from our buddy
kenneth arnold a few weeks agoand he starts to hear about
these flying saucers on theradio, and now eyewitness
(12:00):
accounts of these are popping upall over the country.
Okay, so he decides he needs toreport what he's found.
So Brazel loads up what he canof the metal debris from the
field into his truck.
He makes the 75 mile trek up toRoswell, where he first goes to
the sheriff, george Wilcox.
George realizes this is wayabove his head, realizes this is
(12:22):
way above his head and he sendshim to the Roswell Army Air
Force Nope Air Field or the RAAF.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Oh okay.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
So it's here that Braswell meets with a unit of
the United States Air Force.
Now, this isn't just any unitof the Air Force.
This is the same unit thatdeploys the atomic bombs over
hiroshima and nagasaki in uh,the world war hiroshima is that
what I said?
Speaker 1 (12:50):
hiroshima hiroshima yes I love when I can help you.
Thank you so.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
But so it's not like, just like some random outspurt
of you know the.
There he meets with Major JesseMarcel, the head of
intelligence, and Marcel takesthe materials from his truck.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
Okay, so are you saying, if I were to see these
things, who would I call?
Yes, I can't call you.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Like not including me .
We all know I'm going to be thefirst call.
Who are you going next?
Speaker 1 (13:25):
My mom.
But if I need to call somebodythat I just like I, I think I
would call tenny smart move I'mgonna I don't have his number,
but I'm gonna dm tenny and belike bro I know you believe me,
you'll judge me and you willprobably tell me what to do next
(13:46):
and yeah, no, he will tell youwhat to do with no questions, no
thoughts, no, no, here's.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Here's what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
So that's what comes to my mind Tenny, Perfect, OK,
no, I like that.
Shout out Tenny.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
All right.
So Brazel meets with MajorJesse Marcel, the head of
intelligence, right.
He takes the materials.
Major Marcel and the team thenhead out to the ranch where they
fill two more trucks withdebris that had been discovered,
and it's all taken back to theraaf for more analysis okay so a
couple of days later, july 8th1947, the roswell army air for
(14:25):
airfield I keep saying Airford,it's Airfield and Air Force, I'm
trying to say at the same time.
So the RAAF right.
They release a press release.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
OK.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
Remember, this is a branch of the military.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
And this is 19 what 47.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
Their official statement states that they had
captured a crashed flying saucer.
Immediately, the press goescrazy.
This is already in the newsbecause of Kenneth Arnold right.
Headlines go out such as RAAFcaptures flying saucer on ranch.
Let me start the sentence overRAAF captures flying saucer on
(15:08):
ranch in Roswell region.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
That is a tongue twister, that was a tongue
twister.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
And then, finally, army reveals it has a flying
disc.
Much easier to say.
So Major Marcel is immediatelyordered to board a B-29 bomber
and deliver the wreckage to FortWorth in Texas, specifically to
a general named Roger Ramey.
This is where things start toget really weird.
(15:36):
Major Marcel arrives at Ramey'soffice, they drop off the
material, all the debris.
So then the pair decide thatthey're going to visit the map
room and talk about it.
Okay, and upon their return tothe drop-off point, major Marcel
immediately becomes a littlebit confused, because where he
(15:56):
had left all the debris is now apile of rotting neoprene
balloons, some sticks, ashredded radar reflector, kite
and other random butidentifiable debris, including
duct tape and tinfoil.
Okay, so, major Marcel, do wethink it?
Speaker 1 (16:17):
changed or it was replaced.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Replaced.
Okay Okay.
He brings a bunch of stuff.
He goes on a walk with Rameythey come back.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, very different.
I'm just thinking in my head dowe think it was?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
no, it was replaced 100%, because Raimi then holds a
press conference.
Okay, Not.
However, before telling Marcelnot to breathe a word about what
happened to reporters or hisfamily.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
In the press conference.
Raimi claims that the wreckagewas nothing more than the
remnants of a crashed weatherballoon.
Marcel is photographed duringthis at the conference holding
what appears to be a bunch oftin foil foil.
This that picture you alwayssee of the guy sitting on the
ground with all the debris andhe looks like kind of pissed off
.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
I'm sure if I saw it I wouldn't know.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Oh yeah, you would recognize it.
All of this occurs within 24hours.
So within 24 hours of marcelgetting the original, not 24
hours of him getting theoriginal debris, but of his
original press release sayinghey, we have a flying saucer.
He takes it all, he goes totexas, they replace it and a new
press release is given and theold one is retracted.
(17:24):
So we don't have a flyingsaucer, it's just a weather
balloon Dumb.
Right about the same time, ourrancher, mac Brazel, he goes on
a little vacation forcefully.
So he is allegedly Excuse me,allegedly taken by the military
and detained for several days atsome sort of facility.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
Cute.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Right.
Then he returns home and hisstory changes.
He described the debris as justrubber, sticks, tape and tin
foil.
Uh, he even stated that if Iever found anything like it
again, I wouldn't even sayanything.
Okay, so we know the us loves agood cover-up.
Um, so some people would claimto say this wasn't you know
(18:09):
anything but a balloon.
Others are like well, there's alittle bit more going on here.
But because there was so muchtrust in the us military at this
time, everyone kind of skirtedover it.
But let's go over some of thestrangeness before we move on.
Yeah, so it's weather.
Balloons weren't unusual in1947.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Yeah, but they're not like common.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
They're common enough that Brazel has had them crash
on his ranch before.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
Okay, and if?
Speaker 2 (18:35):
it was just another weather balloon, he would never
have said anything.
He's seen these before Okay.
So then we have the originalpress release that's recanted
and retold within 24 hours.
Again, let's go back to theraaf.
This isn't just a little ruralpiece of the air force.
These are the guys who droppedthe atom bomb.
(18:57):
They are high ranking, hightrusted officials.
The military also crashes, orcrashes, steals off the crash
scene for four days.
Which, yeah, a local radiostation at the time attempts to
interview Brazel Okay, and thestation manager receives a
threat from the FCC that if theyran the interview they'd pull
(19:18):
their license.
That's totally normal.
Oh yeah, civilians in the areawho were either interested in or
had seen the crash site reportbeing intimidated by men in
uniform don't know if that'smilitary or other bodies, the
men in black.
Whatever.
Though, with all this weirdness,the cover up seems to work.
The story fades from the publicfor about three decades.
(19:42):
Actually, it doesn't researchuntil the 70s.
So it was kind of a reallysmall blip on the radar.
One, we already talked about,because of the high trust in the
military.
Two, because right after thiscrash there's a really
well-documented other UFO crash.
That was a huge hoax and itturned out to be all pieces from
a jukebox.
Okay, I don't know.
(20:05):
Just with what you know so farbefore we go fast forward into
the 70s.
What are your thoughts on theRoswell crash?
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Do you even have to ask me?
Okay, so how is it a no, it's acover up.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
It's a cover up of something for sure.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
So you're telling a man that has already had a hot
air balloon?
Speaker 2 (20:28):
Weather balloon.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
Weather balloon, i'm'm sorry crash on his
property.
He already knows what thatmeans and entails, and looks
like you're telling him that no,that was a weather balloon,
it's fine.
You're also disregarding ordiscrediting like material that
somebody brought and like oh,it's just like duct tape and
random shit like f.
Are you talking, okay, likethat's crazy.
And then, yeah, what did yousay?
(20:51):
It was like four hours, thatthey four days for, I'm sorry,
four days that they taped offthe.
I mean, I think that seemsreally crazy if you're trying to
tell me it's just a weatherballoon, right, so right.
I could, though, see it beinglike a while, depending on, like
, the debris and the things thatthey're like researching, so I
(21:13):
guess the four days could goeither way.
That could be really extreme tosome, or it could be like oh
yeah, but they're just doingtheir job, they're just trying
to figure it all out, and thisis what they concluded, but it
seems like four days does notneed to like.
It doesn't take four days toconclude that it was a weather
balloon.
What else are you doing?
And hiding and covering up?
I don't know.
I just think that it's, andthen for it to just be like
(21:35):
that's it yeah, well, we'll comeback to what else they were
hiding oh right, that's what I'msaying.
They're hiding stuff for sure.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
So a couple years go by.
Remember this happened in 47.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
We're now into the 70s.
Okay, so what's going on in the70s?
We are now at a pop culturaltheme on aliens, and the public
can't get enough of it, right.
So we have famous abductioncases going on.
We have movies, including CloseEncounters, star Wars.
We have Watergate and theVietnam War, which are building
(22:09):
a general distrust for themilitary and the government.
It's time for Roswell to beexplored again, and it does,
thanks to the help of agentleman named Stanton Friedman
.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
Okay, Friedman.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Friedman is a nuclear physicist and a UFO researcher,
oh, and so he's doing a bunchof different research and he
gets a tip from a radio stationmanager in Baton Rouge,
louisiana, who says you shouldspeak to a man named Major Jesse
Marcel.
He handled wreckage from aflying saucer crash back in 47.
(22:44):
Huh, friedman is like I'm in,he needs to track this guy down.
He finds him.
He's retired now he's living inlouisiana.
And friedman gets an interviewwith marcel, major marcel, who
starts to just spill the beans.
Okay, he again says thematerial was like, and or unlike
(23:05):
, anything found on earth.
Okay, foil, like indestructible, strange symbols.
He states he was ordered tokeep quiet and that the real
debris was replaced with aweather balloon for the media.
And here's some direct quotes.
It was not anything from thisEarth.
I'm absolutely sure of that.
And I am absolutely convincedthat what I recovered was not
(23:28):
any type of weather balloon orradar target, it was something
else.
Huh, so he claimed thateveryone who was involved with
the retrieval was clear that theobject had indeed been an
extraterrestrial spaceship.
Oh, he knew that.
Whoever sealed it off knew whatthey were dealing with and it
was a deliberate cover-up with.
(23:51):
And it was a deliberatecover-up.
Okay, he also lived with a lotof shame for going along with
the balloon story, saying thathe was following orders and that
he had been threatened okay,which we know that that stuff
happens all the time, so that'smakes sense so this was the
first time a military officialdirectly involved in the
recovery of an extraterrestrialobject publicly claimed that
(24:12):
something was extraterrestrialin nature.
Okay, he only comes forward,though, because he was mentally,
not mentally because hementally ill.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
That's sad, we're all mentally ill.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
He only comes forward , though, because he was
terminally ill and no longerworried about any of the threats
.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
Okay, that makes sense, because he was like,
listen, my life is coming to anend.
Let me just, oh, yeah, like,whatever happens happens.
Deathbed confessions Absolutely, we love them.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
So over the next couple of years, friedman, with
the help of and these mightsound familiar to you Charles
Berlitz and William Moore, startto research the incident.
These were guys who alsoresearched the Philadelphia
experiment.
Yes, so they do a lot ofresearch on the cover up.
They talk to anyone they canabout it.
They talk to Major Marcel, hisson His son was 10 at the time
(25:04):
of the incident, saw the crashright.
Any of the other locals who mayhave observed it.
They talk to military officials.
They talked to anybody theycould get their hands on to
gather as much evidence as theycould to prove what really
happened okay okay, that was the70s, in 1980.
(25:24):
Okay, more in burlitz, who haveexpanded now on friedman's
original research, publish abook called the Roswell Incident
.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Ah, have you read this?
No, I want to.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Okay, I have not read this, but there's some other
reports that we're talking aboutthat I actually found the full
versions of which is reallyinteresting to read through, all
in the show notes, okay.
Okay, so the Roswell incidentdetails Major Marcel's original
claims, but also with all theother witness testimony.
So now things start to come outthat alien bodies were
(25:58):
recovered and witnesses claim tohave seen them.
They're saying that the bodieswere taken to Wright-Patterson
Air Force Base, that thegovernment definitely did
orchestrate a major cover-up tosuppress the truth.
This is where, in this book, oneof the kind of now popularized
phrases comes out the mostimportant events in human
(26:19):
history are covered up by thegovernment yes, yes, yes so the
entire premise of the roswellincident book seems to claim
that the UFO was flying over theNew Mexico desert to observe
the nuclear weapons and wasstruck by lightning, crashed and
(26:39):
it killed the alien crew.
This is really interesting,though and this is kind of like
a side note why is it thatwhenever the threat of nuclear
war seems to get high is when weseem to have these flaps?
I think because they'reobserving what the fuck not to
do and this is where I think youand me get into our things.
Uh, aliens aren't from otherplanets.
(27:02):
They're either from otherdimensions or timelines or
something.
We can't effing go to theselimits no, yeah, it's like.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
I feel like it's like , or it's like a damn field trip
where it's like this is whatyou don't do, guys see I don't
think it's that.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
I think these are more the observers who are
trying to keep us from going tothat level of destruction where
we talked about.
Maybe ufos are from the futureor whatnot, but I.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
I don't know if they're trying to keep us from
destruction.
I don't know that part, I don't.
I don't know if they're tryingto keep us from destruction.
I don't know that part, I don't.
I don't know if I think that Ican get on board with it, but I
don't, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
I don't have a diff like I guess that's one of my
theories is that, yeah, whatwe're experiencing is ufos isn't
aliens from other planets, butit might be us from the future
trying, to like, keep them fromnot existing I don't think.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
I don't think that I think they're us from the future
.
I don't.
I think they're from adifferent realm or a different
planet, whatever you want to say.
I think that they really doobserve us and they're looking
at us like look at these fools,and this is what you don't do or
do like I think that there areobservers, like you said, but I
don't I don't know if Inecessarily think that they're
(28:09):
us from the future or whatever.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Like is it us from the future?
Or are they more like theuniversal watch dogs who are
like when you're getting thisclose to destruction?
Because maybe that okay, random, random thing here we talked
about how, like kennedy wantedto disclose ufos, like all of a
sudden all these presidentsdon't what.
If it is like this, I don'tknow security system or
something I don't know I we'regoing down a total side note now
(28:34):
.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
Oh yeah, I think they're just like a whole other
whole other like non-relatedentity okay yeah, I can get down
with that.
I mean, we don't know, so wejust don't know, and I guess I
think that's what I think.
That's maybe what I've alwaysbelieved.
So I mean, my belief in them islike grown differently, but I
think that they've always poppedup in every historical
(28:57):
generation.
I don't know how to explainwhat I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
Every bit of culture through written history has
mentioned something aboutsomething from the sky.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
Something like UFOs or skies.
So I don't necessarily thinkthey're from the future.
I think that they are justobserving us and they're, like,
watching us.
I think they're learning and Idon't think it's any different
from us spying on differentcountries.
I think that they're justspying on us.
They're learning, they'readapting and, whether they are
here, I do think that they comeand pretend to be us at times.
(29:26):
I really do think that, but Idon't think they're.
I don't think they're trying tolike warn us or protect us in
any way.
Maybe, maybe some of them arelike hey, we think that this
might happen in the media.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
I think they definitely at least try to
protect their anonymity when welook at the men in black.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
But yes, I think that I don't think that they want to
be known or seen, and I'm surethere's so many different
reasons as to why, but let'scontinue on with our story, okay
, yeah, so back to it.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
Yeah, they were killed in, you know, looking
over the nukes, they got struckby lightning.
Whatever Crash die.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
So the book goes on to state that the US government
quickly retrieves the wreckage,covers it up, tells us the
balloon story, whatever.
But the authors claim to haveinterviewed over 90 witnesses,
through the book or for the book, but only the testimony of 25
appear in it.
Only seven of those 25 claim tohave seen the debris and only
five claim to have handled itthat's a really big difference
(30:24):
and that's where I think some ofthe details of this book get
embellished.
But it's from these witnessesthat the stories so remember.
Marcel, major marcel and hisson never say anything about the
bodies.
That doesn't exist in the loreuntil the 70s and 80s when this
book comes out and this comesmostly from a gentleman named
(30:44):
glenn davis.
He's a funeral home.
He comes forward saying he gota strange phone call in 47 from
the base asking for child-sizehermetically sealed coffins.
He also said that a nursefriend of his described seeing
the bodies that were big-headedwith little bodies with no
(31:06):
internal organs like we know ofthem.
Oh, he is one of the mostsighted eyewitnesses who claims
to have been part of the autopsyof bodies, and discovery bodies
from this crash.
Now I will say about GlennDavis is that lots of people
have found holes in his stories,in some untruths and his added
(31:30):
details.
So whether or not it's trueabout the little bodies, right,
that has stuck with the Roswellcrash ever since, because we
always hear about the crash, thebodies, all that Okay.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Okay, but the original report had nothing to
do with the bodies.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
The original two press releases we have.
We call it a flying saucer, andthen JK, it's just a balloon
and then nothing more about ituntil this book comes out.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Okay, Interesting.
There's kind of two ways youcan take it right.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Yeah, glenn.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
Davis is telling the truth, yep, and he's being
discredited by other members ofthe military who say they never
saw this or that he is nottelling the truth and
embellishing Either one with theamount of evidence that we had,
I guess, can stand.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
I was going to say you could actually run with
either one.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
Right.
So due to the book, though, andits popularity throughout the
80s and 90s, dozens of peoplestart to come forward.
Right so now, now we have,after that book comes out, all
their military officers whoclaim to have seen or
transported the bodies.
We have civilians comingforward who are saying they were
threatened in 1947 about beingsilent about this, and now they
(32:39):
speak out because they're eitherretired from the military or
they're not afraid of thethreats.
Right, and they corroboratedifferent parts of the crash.
So it's just seeing the debrisfield, or what was in the makeup
of the debris, or maybe seeingsome bodies.
There was a military nurse whoallegedly described these aliens
, and they think it might be thesame nurse that glenn davis was
(33:00):
talking about.
She vanishes without a trace.
Stop it right.
So how old was she?
There's very, very littleidentifying details on no no, no
again.
Either very vague could be madeup or could be somebody who was
just lost.
Now this is also about the sametime that multiple witnesses
come to say that there was asecond crash site.
(33:21):
Oh, and I think most of ourpopular culture today, when you
hear about Roswell, mash thesetwo into one.
Okay, because from Marcel'sstory of the Roswell crash site
it's total debris, but most ofus remember it as like they
recovered a flying saucer.
So the second crash was not farfrom the first sort of oh, no,
(33:45):
but this was a entire intactship, with alien bodies being
recovered.
Now it's unclear whether theywere alive or dead or in a state
between, and it only happenedabout 27 miles away from the
first crash.
Okay were in a state between,and it only happened about 27
miles away from the first crash.
Okay, so it's one of thosethings where, like I feel like
sometimes when you see that,like the picture of the roswell
(34:06):
crash, it's like you know, theykind of skid it into a rock.
These are two different things.
There's a fully now intact shipwith either maybe dead, maybe
close to dead, or alive alienbodies being pulled from this.
Okay, so captain oliverhenderson of the first air
transport unit says that he flewthe alleged bodies out of
(34:26):
roswell from the second crash tothe right patterson air force
or airface air force based indayton.
Oh Okay, he never tells thestory, though it's his wife who
tells it after he dies.
No, so he never comes clean.
She says my husband told meabout the bodies.
(34:48):
They were small oh no, theirheads were large and their eyes
were rather sunken and slanted.
They were not of this earth.
So the wife says this in aninterview on the show unsolved
mysteries uh, she said, when myhusband, who is a man of truth,
tells me the story, I believedhim did you watch this part?
(35:10):
No, because this is the fourthepisode of unsolved mysteries
ever.
This is the original serieswait.
So they're covering this, likewhen it's happening in the early
or late 80s, early 90s I'm justwondering if people think it
was performative or if theybelieve her well, I that's
literally.
They're half in one camp, halfin another.
(35:32):
Right, because nobody in the40s ever talked about the bodies
or the second crash.
But these things come out laterand it's like some of the
stories.
They seem like the roswelldebris field is the second crash
or what.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
It's just very convoluted I don't know what,
the 40s, though you would betalking about this I know it
makes sense and if people werebeing threatened?
Right, the men in black areprobably surveilling your house.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
Oh, absolutely, you shut the hell up.
So then we also have SergeantMelvin Brown.
He's a cook at the Roswell base, the original RAAF.
He alleges peeking into a crateduring transport and saw bodies
under a tarp.
He doesn't know which crashthey came from, but he says he
saw them.
Speaker 1 (36:19):
Oh, I think I've heard this.
Speaker 2 (36:21):
Everybody who describes the bodies describes
them as small, gray, not human.
Large heads, small bodies,strange organs.
So in all these stories, allthese eyewitnesses' accounts
that came out from the 70s to90s, I will say, yes, it's weird
, they held onto it that long,but all these people who didn't
interact with each other give avery similar description.
(36:43):
Now we don't know if the bodiesare from marcel's crash,
because marcel also looked overeverything and never claimed
about bodies.
I think when they steal offthis site, this other crash
happened and I think they wereboth covered up at once and all
these people who were looselyrelated to it didn't know where
pieces and parts were comingfrom they just knew something
(37:04):
weird was going on that makessense.
I could, I could get down onthat all in all, from the 70s to
the 90s, over 200 interviews ofwitnesses to the original crash
or crashes, or who wereinvolved in the military
cover-up or something related toit.
All come out and have theirstories collected.
This incident is now totally inour pop culture, like it's not
(37:30):
going anywhere no okay, I knowyou already think it's real.
What do you think happens fromhere?
Now I'll say this we're in theearly 90s now at this point,
which is weird to me because,like I guess at eye level and I
remember growing up, because wewould have grown up in the early
or late 90s, right, like yeah,late, this is still really
popular.
(37:50):
We heard about this all thetime.
I just always assumed it wasall from the 40s.
I didn't realize.
So much of it came out later.
So what's your general thoughtsof the Roswell incident?
Speaker 1 (38:00):
What year were you born?
Speaker 2 (38:01):
93.
Speaker 1 (38:02):
Yeah, I don't know, because I feel like in my brain
I just always think aliens are70s.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
Right, which is why it had its resurgence.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
That's just like what I have in my head.
So 90 though I don't know.
So I was 89, so I was like a90s kid, but other than like
having pogs with alien faces orlike t-shirts with aliens and
all the bracelets and chokerswith alien heads, like green
alien heads, I don't know.
And aside from my grandmother,who told my grandparents told me
(38:37):
of their encounter of seeing aflying saucer UFO, I don't know
if I recall any, I can't thinkof any other alien thing, I just
I remember the Roswell thingand I think just because late
80s, early 90s was still a bigthing like being almost as
prevalent as like hearing aboutthe Bermuda Triangle and all
those things.
(38:58):
Yeah, so when did ET come out?
Because I saw it in theatersand then I think that was it
took 98 82 oh it was 82.
We did this last time where wethought it was I know and it's
not.
We just loved it because Ithought I swore I saw it in
theaters, but I didn't, becauseI wasn't even born.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
No.
Speaker 1 (39:18):
I just saw it.
Speaker 2 (39:19):
We have talked about that.
Speaker 1 (39:20):
We have, because I feel like I I guess it's because
it's such a prominent memorythat I feel like I saw it in
theaters.
But maybe I did, maybe itre-was watched or something or
re-shown and I thought that butsee, I don't know.
Here's what's weird.
I don't know why I thoughtaliens lived in my laundry room
and I would tell stories aboutthis, and you told your teachers
(39:40):
, you were an alien.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
It was still so big and there were so many stories,
I think between 70s let's say 70to like early 2000s.
Speaker 1 (39:47):
So it was just ingrained in our little brains.
We didn't even know anything.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
Still so many eyewitnesses were alive at this
time who were coming forwardabout it.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
I'm waiting for the aliens to come back for me.
I say this all the time oh, I'mready?
Speaker 2 (40:00):
Take me, here's the thing.
Speaker 1 (40:02):
They showed themselves to my grandparents.
They showed themselves to me.
I was so close to beingabducted.
You should have taken me thatsummer I don't understand.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
I mean, I'm sure you've been probed, at least.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
That's fine, take me now, don't return me.
Speaker 2 (40:17):
Okay, anyways, we love the rabbit holes.
This story you know the 70sthrough the 90s.
It's impossible to disprove somuch of what happened in the 40s
Like 30 years have gone by.
Well yeah, but there's enoughevidence, I think, to at least
support that something from outof this world was found covered
up and studied.
Like at I, we can agree to that, like it's weird enough,
(40:41):
there's enough.
We might not have the bodies,we might not have anything, but
something weird was recovered.
Somebody has the bodies.
So the us government felt theneed to respond with everybody
coming forward, the air force,through congressional pressure
in the 1990s, decided thatthey're going to reinvestigate
(41:02):
because not only the congressbut the public was also
demanding answers.
So now we get the 231 pagereport called the roswell report
fact or fiction in the newmexico desert.
This report replaces conspiracywith conspiracy.
They conclude that the crashwas part of a secret project
(41:23):
called project mogul.
Project mogul was allegedly atop secret us army air force
operation in the late 1940s.
Its purpose was to detectsoviet nuclear tests by
listening for subsonic soundwaves in the upper atmosphere
using high-altitude balloonarrays.
(41:46):
Oh my god.
So the project allegedlyoperated out of Alamogordo Army
Airfield in New Mexico, not toofar from Roswell.
Okay, scientists launched longstrings of weather balloon up to
600 feet in length withmicrowaves to pick up sound
waves, radar reflectors madefrom foil sticks and tape and
(42:08):
transmitting and trackingequipment.
A lot of times these thingswould crash, so secrecy was high
.
It was all done during the ColdWar, war, right where nuclear
tension was rampant.
And they specifically go on tostate that the crash that was
found was one of those mogulballoon arrays, specifically
flight number four.
Here's the thing.
(42:30):
I think that project mogul isprobably real, because that
would make sense.
We were using using things totest for Soviet nuclear strikes.
Yeah, but it's so weird that inthe 90s we're like oh, we're
just going to tell everyoneabout this secret mission now
that the Cold War threat is overand we know exactly which
flight it was that crashed andthat's why we didn't say
(42:53):
anything before- but also why,if no one was like kind of
bringing it up or it was, youknow what I mean, like it.
So they gave the why, but theirwhy was that?
People were really scared aboutnuclear wars and it had to be
classified, which is why theinitial press release was so
vague and contradictory theinitial press releases.
(43:16):
Here's my thing on this.
If Project Mogul existed asnotoriously as they said it did,
Okay, why are we talking aboutit?
Then the RAAF, who originallytook this to Texas, would have
been in the know.
They are the atomic scientistsin the US.
Why would they not have knownand been aware of this balloon
(43:40):
mission that was looking fornukes?
Speaker 1 (43:42):
yeah, they might not have been.
They might not have been aware.
I don't yeah, but or they hadto act like they weren't aware
but remember, this wasn't theguy, he wasn't acting.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
This is marcel, this is the original.
They had no reason.
You know, if they were acting,he wouldn't have said that they
caught like, yeah, you're right.
If he would have never said wegot a flying saucer.
If he had no, they would haveknown I think that they wouldn't
have made anybody.
I don't know now this reportright, that came out in 94 after
(44:12):
the investigation started in 90says nothing about the alien
bodies, no spacecraft, nogovernment cover-up, it's just
all Cold War secrecy.
Speaker 1 (44:21):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (44:22):
People didn't love this Kara.
Speaker 1 (44:24):
No, I think they should have just shut the hell
up and not said anything.
Speaker 2 (44:28):
They end up coming out with another report.
Okay, oh, so this is the report, the follow-up Roswell Report,
case Closed in 1997.
Because they're like, if wecall it case closed, we can just
be done with this yeah, yeah,we can't.
Speaker 1 (44:45):
We have any reason to not have to talk about it
anymore okay.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
so 1997, the 50th anniversary of the incident.
This report actually explainedaway the bodies.
So here's the thing, before weeven get into this report, up
until this point, when I wasdoing all the research, I'm like
, well, these bodies could beanything, okay, right, like they
came up only in the 70s.
(45:08):
Maybe they weren't actuallythere, or you know, all these
people are kind of making it upto get on the bandwagon.
Speaker 1 (45:15):
Okay, well, okay.
So what would your thought beif they weren't making them up?
And they did see some sort ofbodies?
What is your thought?
Speaker 2 (45:22):
My thought would be this report would come out, I
think, if they were making upthe bodies and nobody like, if
this was all kind of like a popculture we're going to talk
about it now and make it up, themilitary would have been like
the bodies never existed.
Speaker 1 (45:35):
Do you think these little weird bodies were
actually staged for some sort ofreason?
Speaker 2 (45:43):
I don't think they were staged for any reason.
Speaker 1 (45:45):
Okay, and when?
Speaker 2 (45:47):
we get into this report, you'll understand why I
honestly, until I read thesecond report, thought that
people were making up the bodiesyears later maybe having false
memories or wanting to get onthe bandwagon, because Marcel
never said anything about them.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
So the reason I said that, just so I can clarify I
don't know if I need to, but thereason I said that is because I
could see that being shown, sothat people would start talking
about it, and then thegovernment could make it like
they were covering it up becausethey were hiding something
bigger on the back end.
But people could talk aboutthis and make it like they were
covering it up because they werehiding something bigger on the
back end, but like people couldtalk about this and like make it
weird and discreet and likesecretive, and so people start
(46:25):
looking at that.
But there's really a biggerpicture in the background.
That's the only reason that Iwas thinking of that.
But no, I don't think it's that.
Speaker 2 (46:32):
OK, because the first report they just ignored it all
and right, we're hoping itwould go away again.
I think they really did recover, just two extraterrestrial
craft.
Okay, I don't think there'sanything bigger going on,
because in the 1997 the roswellreport case closed.
Uh, this report can't claimedthat the stories of the alien
(46:52):
bodies actually came frommisremembered high
altitudealtitude experimentsthat occurred in the 50s.
They're like this didn't evenhappen in 47.
You guys are so wrong.
What they were saying isOperation High Drive and Project
Excelsior is where mannequinswere dropped from air balloons
to test parachutes andhigh-altitude survival.
(47:17):
Now, these dummies, kara.
They were four to six feet tall, because why would we make them
the size of regular humanbeings?
Speaker 1 (47:25):
Because that makes sense for testing things.
Speaker 2 (47:27):
They made them out of gray rubber and used metal
joints so their insides weren'tlike normal humans.
Speaker 1 (47:33):
But we wouldn't know that if we dissected a thing of
rubber.
And after landing they wereoften damaged or distorted in
the high desert heat and theyresembled alien figures what I
do have to say is took them areally long time to come up with
that, but yeah I guess that'snot bad.
Speaker 2 (47:50):
1980 to 1997 17 years but it's not like to say oh my
god, you guys.
Actually you just remember ormisremember the year.
Speaker 1 (48:00):
If they would have said that right away, I would
have been like all right, that'snot that bad of a because.
What, like what would you havecome up with?
Speaker 2 (48:07):
well, hey, listen, if we're gonna go down, that's not
that bad route.
Speaker 1 (48:10):
Here's why people misremembered I'm not the crash
site being sealed off because itwas often recovery teams
getting the mannequins.
Speaker 2 (48:21):
They were dressed in a full military gear, which
might explain why there's allthese high security stories and
censored witnesses around.
Speaker 1 (48:30):
Why did it take four days?
Speaker 2 (48:31):
Why did it take 17 years for them to come up with
this damn story?
Speaker 1 (48:35):
I'm not saying it's good, I'm just saying people
would believe that.
Speaker 2 (48:39):
So well.
They did sort of, and thisreport included photos of actual
dummies and the balloons andtest sites, attempting to show
that mistaken identity was veryplausible.
Oh, so I don't know.
I mean, there's a lot ofweirdness, right.
We have Major Marcel Brazelwith their original discovery,
(48:59):
who didn't say anything aboutthe bodies.
Then we have this possiblesecond crash.
We have a cover-up.
We have years where it wentaway.
It had this resurgence, I don'tknow.
I this is one that, likethere's so much more we could go
into and there's 200 witnesstestimonies.
We could go through these.
You can find the militaryreports still online with so
(49:23):
much redacted information, butwe could spend days and days and
episodes, and episodes on this,I feel like 200, that's a lot.
It's a lot and the fact that thegovernment has come out twice
now to cover it up changing.
I guess I would believe themannequin thing more if they
addressed it in the first report.
But they're like oh shit, weactually have to talk about the
(49:45):
second part now that's what Iwas saying.
Speaker 1 (49:46):
The mannequin thing isn't really that off of a thing
.
It's kind of stupid.
I mean it is.
But if that were to come outright away and be like, yeah, we
didn't paint these mannequinsor we couldn't make them like
flesh colored tones and buthere's my thing, if you're
testing it out to be realistic,then they would have been
heights of different variationsof bodies and weights and stuff
(50:08):
like that.
So that doesn't make sense tome.
But let's get real.
People are naive, they'vealways been naive, and when the
government tells us stuff, a lotof people believe it.
So I can see that being abelievable thing if that had
happened right off the rip right, right, it's just 17 or 19,
whatever years later?
no, that's kind of just came outwith so many stories but I
(50:32):
could have seen that being athing that people would have
believed not me so anyway, guessmy personal beliefs, because
it's deep in American history.
Speaker 2 (50:41):
It's in all the lore now, like this story is not
going anywhere.
I have always thought that wedid recover something from the
crash site.
I think For sure Debris fromRoswell.
I think we got a full craftfrom the second one.
Speaker 1 (50:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (50:55):
Because there are other episodes we could do about
this.
Right, there are videos showingthat the us government at one
point was testing their ownflying saucers.
There's so many stories aboutthese crashed vehicles and these
alive bodies ending up at area51, you know, to be studied by
(51:19):
the doctors there in lockheedmartin, like I.
I think there's so much more tothis that we'll never know, but
I am 100 a believer that theroswell site was a a huge
cover-up and we definitely gotat least a craft, if not bodies,
for sure yeah, but anywaysepisode 150, that is the story
(51:42):
of the Roswell UFO crash andincident.
Speaker 1 (51:46):
Good job.
Yeah, that's just.
We can't be here forever, butwe could be here forever just
discussing this.
Speaker 2 (51:53):
That's okay, because I think this is going to be a
perfect lead in for a futureepisode on Area 151.
Not right away, not next week,but it's coming babies, oh my
god.
All right, that's all I got foryou.
Final thoughts on Roswell yeahit happened.
Speaker 1 (52:10):
It's aliens.
I do you think one day we'regoing to be like gone?
Like let's just say we havethis podcast for like so many
years and like we talk whatever,and then one day we just like
and people are like that's soweird, because Karen and Zach
are so consistent, They'vealways had a podcast.
It's just so weird, Likewhere'd they go?
(52:30):
They like dropped off the grid,but really like the government
wants to shut us up or aliensabduct us because we talk too
much the thing is, though, islike let's be honest with you
and I.
Speaker 2 (52:40):
If they wanted, they'd have to kill us, because
we can't keep our mouths shutfor more than five minutes no,
that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (52:46):
Like one day our podcast is going to get us in
trouble, okay, and we're gonnasay that, listeners take note I,
I everybody keep lock in.
Speaker 2 (52:55):
Pay attention right now.
Kara and I are not suicidal ifwe disappear.
It was not us.
Speaker 1 (53:01):
That's what I'm saying.
I'm just, I'm putting thatcaveat out there.
Are there search?
Speaker 2 (53:05):
histories.
Oh, we're already on every list.
There are lots.
I was talking about that withmy uh.
I was going to say my uhhairstylist today, but I almost
said my hair therapist because,let's be honest, she is my
therapist.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
She is.
That's cute.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
I'm gonna tell my mom that she's a hair therapist
hair therapist but yeah, no, Isaid something about we were
talking about our weirdness.
I'm like listen between mysearch history and everything
else I talk about in front of mygoogle home.
Speaker 1 (53:30):
I'm on every list there is, I'm sure 100, 100 it's
fine, but I mean, if wedisappear one day, it's's not
because we Well, I don't know,though because we do want to
disappear, well, okay.
Speaker 2 (53:42):
We do want to disappear by aliens, if you
think I got abducted by aliens?
Speaker 1 (53:46):
leave it alone.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
We'll leave some sort of something.
Let me be.
Yeah, don't bring us back.
Okay, so if we disappear, beconcerned, blame the government.
But if blame the government,but if it was aliens, still
blame the government becausethey need to go down anyway.
Alright, that's our final wordson Roswell, Kara, oh, I was
going to say what do they needto do?
But first we have to pick anemoji, An alien or a flying
saucer.
There's like the little alienface and I think like a bright
(54:11):
sun for the desert.
Oh, okay.
Speaker 1 (54:13):
Also, it's been bugging me since we started this
episode.
It's been bugging me since westarted this episode.
I was not saying that the bookhad too many gay people in it,
because I love the gays.
I was just saying that it wasweird that every character had
to have such a weird backgroundas to why they became gay.
Speaker 2 (54:33):
Okay, that's fair, that's a better way to word it.
Speaker 1 (54:34):
Thank you, it's been bugging me since we started
recording.
It's just like let them just begay.
Speaker 2 (54:40):
It's like if JK Rowling was trying to write gay
characters, although she neverwould, because Okay, anyways,
side note.
Speaker 1 (54:46):
Leave us a voicemail.
I don't even want to ask foranything else, I want a
voicemail.
What do you think about this?
Speaker 2 (54:52):
Or your own alien experiences, but voicemail
Number linked below.
Speaker 1 (54:57):
Alright, thank you for listening.
It was a great, wonderful time.
The most important thing youcan do for us is to creep a
really little eyeballs before wesay goodbye.
Speaker 2 (55:05):
Also, if anybody's been here since episode one,
thank you for sticking with usthrough a hundred and freaking
50 of these.
Speaker 1 (55:14):
Okay, I'm sorry.
Another little side note.
I don't know if we talked aboutthis Would you guys be okay, or
would you want it, if we tooksome of our first episodes and
we re-recorded them as we wrotethem in, like a better quality?
Would y'all be cool with that?
Speaker 2 (55:29):
Yes, let us know, because we're thinking about it.
Speaker 1 (55:32):
Because we did some really cool episodes that we're
proud of, but we just weren'tprepared as far as like we're
much better writers now andresearchers.
I don't know if I want torewrite and research them.
I think I want to do them asthey are, but I think we should
re-record them as we are becausewe're more confident, we have
better sound and just likebetter banter.
I don't know if I want to.
Speaker 2 (55:51):
If you want to rehear the first 50, you let us, let
us know okay, uh, but anyway.
Speaker 1 (55:57):
So the most important thing you can do for us is to
creep a real you little eyeballs.
Goodbye, bye.
I'm home with the dogman At theIrish shop, locked in the
(56:24):
shadows At the Irish shop.
At home with the oddballs Atthe Irish shop.
The door's always open.
At the Irish shop, I'm theAlicia.
The door's always open.
I'm the Alicia.
I want to dance with the mothman at the IA shop,
Baked in the moonlight at the IAshop.
Creep through the graveyard tothe IA shop.
The door's always open at theIA shop.
(00:29):
Welcome back to the Oddity Shop, you little oddballs.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
The podcast where we tell you creepy, odd, weird,
strange stories from beyond theglobe.
Actually you know what thatstands for today.
This one does stand for today.
Oh spoiler, who am I?
Because you have failed atintroducing me for weeks.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
Because you just messed me up.
I'm your curator, kara.
This is your curator, zachary.
Oh hi, thank you, and what'snew?
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Okay, so you know I do on the side.
I have my little side job, myproperty management.
No, I didn't know, oh, okay,you didn't know.
I was doing a showing for thislovely group of human beings the
other day and they were so cute.
I say human beings, I am goingto assume pronouns were probably
in the they, them range.
(01:26):
Okay, I love them.
Okay, we got on splendidly.
It was not the property forthem, that's fine are you not
friends?
well, I we might be, becausebianca looked at me and goes um,
can I give this to you?
And she pulled a little baggieout of her purse and goes.
One of our roommates whocouldn't make it to the showing
tonight makes sun catchers, youknow, like the little and it has
(01:53):
a little amethyst at the end, Igo.
I'm a crystal boy.
How do you know she goes.
I just had a vibe.
So, anyways, I want you to havethem all over my plants now.
They gave me three of them andthey're really cute and really
darling.
I just I'll give you one.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Okay, they were they were great.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I was just like so surprised.
They were really sweet people,though, but I I love it, and
it's now hanging in one of my umphilodendrons and it catches
the sun and it just looks socool.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Cute, okay, so I can't remember, but I'm pretty
sure we maybe talked about this,but I can't remember.
I bought a book so I couldstart reading, because like to
de-stress, I think.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yeah, you were talking about that a couple of
weeks Okay.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
So then I don't think I talked about this, though,
and I don't even know if I toldyou this, then target or maybe I
did tell you, tell the podcast,I don't remember Target had a
sale where it was by two booksget one free, and so I was like
I have to go to Target and buythree books.
So I bought three more books,but I hadn't even gotten to page
100 of the first book.
So what is Kara doing?
(02:52):
Then you kind of made me spiralbecause you're like, oh well,
you can do like a book review.
And then I'm like, well, Ican't be Julia.
So then I ordered a book reviewsheet so that I can fill it out
and put in every book.
Then I had to buy a book lightbecause I'm like, okay, well,
this is the beginning of Kara'slibrarian arc.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
No, I can see where this is going.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
I'm like okay, but I kind of want to read at night,
because that's when you want tode-stress, but then it's dark
and like Aaron's sleeping.
So I bought a book light andit's awful, I have to get a new
one.
So then I kind of just wentcrazy.
Now I keep getting like ads andcoupons for books.
Here's the dumb part.
I don't have time to read and Iknow that's stupid.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
Here's the dumb part I don't know how to read.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
I don't.
I'm a very slow reader.
I will say that, okay, so what?
I am telling myself, though,because I almost did this the
three books that I bought and Ican't remember what they're
called.
The three books that I boughtand I can't remember what
they're called.
I really, really want to readthose, because the book I
started I'm not really vibingwith, but I told myself I could
not start another book and it'slike a, it's like a reward.
(03:56):
You can't start these greatbooks that you want, cause
when's a haunting, they're alllike, really like good ones.
And I kind of did reviewsActually, I think I did Might've
said, might've said thiscausebid had mentioned one.
Okay, but this book that I'mreading, I'm going to give you a
little bit of a review.
Okay, I thought I was going tolike it because it was supposed
to be like about a podcast andit's called how to find a
missing girl and it's presentedlike this host of this podcast.
So, like her friend goesmissing, she does a podcast, how
(04:19):
to find a missing girl, blah,blah, blah.
So I'm like, okay, okay, thismight be cool, like whatever,
like it's mystery, it's fine,except for this author uses
words over and over again thatneed to not be used over and
over again.
Like um, scrutinized, how manytimes can you?
Speaker 2 (04:37):
you, I'm on like page 200 and I think she's used
scrutinized 30 times minimumthat's where you just got to go
to Google and hit you knowsynonyms.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
The other thing and y'all can come for me.
I'm sorry.
Every person in this book issome sort of like LGBTQ plus,
and there's nothing wrong withthat.
But why is every like everybodyyou meet in this?
Speaker 2 (05:00):
book hey, we love representation, we do.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
But it's just crazy.
Like every one of her friends,cool.
Then you meet this person.
They have like two moms andthen all of a sudden they have a
lesbian flag on the wall and weneed to detail the lesbian flag
on the wall for like a verylong time.
I'm very happy that we havecharacters of all, but I don't
know why we have to have so manydetails about all of them.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Just let them be what they are.
She's a detailed writer.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
No, she's not.
It's awful, oh okay.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Well, maybe we pick a different book then.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Well, I have to finish it.
You have to encourage me, Kara.
Kara, it's going to be theright book, finish it.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
It's going to be great, finish it.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
It's not terrible.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
Let me say that it's not terrible, but it's just like
I don't think I should havepicked it for my first fair.
There's other books now.
Now you at least know what youdon't like.
That author fair, uh, oh my god.
What else is new, though?
Uh, we just got back fromkentucky and waverly hills and
hunters against hate, so youguys should ask us about that in
the comments, because we don'tknow what it's like right now.
For us in like real life becauseit's gonna happen to us in the
future, but for you guys, thathappened for us a week in the
past, so oh god, I was like wedidn't go anywhere you know what
(06:15):
?
do you have a question?
You know what this is?
First of all, before we get tothe question, do you know what
this is?
I do episode 150.
Somehow we're working on ourswearing for the algorithms uh,
150.
We have sat down and done this150 times.
You and I, in just three monthsshort of three years, have,
(06:36):
other than one january where wetook a break this january, have
not missed a week here's and Isaid this, I think, on our
hundredth episode.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
It doesn't feel like a lot to me because I feel like
we should have more, but it'sbecause it's weeks and I don't
my brain like calculating itthat way.
The work that goes into all ofthese episodes and like the
promoting of it and the socialsand stuff like that, is so much
more.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
And the writing and the research and the editing 150
episodes.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
That is mind blowing to me that it's only 150.
But I get it is that's a lotand I cannot believe it.
When you said it was 150, I waslike oh I realized it while I
was writing this one.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
I have to say, like real quick, let's float our own
boats.
I am so fucking proud of youand everything that you've done
why thank you?
And us dude like I'm proud ofyou I don't know.
150.
Wow, look at us.
Okay, we'll stop gloating for asecond.
We'll stop celebrating.
Are you ready for a question?
Speaker 1 (07:39):
yeah, we should stop celebrating ourselves, because
y'all should celebrate us.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Just kidding, you already do, but we also
celebrate you, because if youguys didn't listen, we would
have quit a long time ago.
Okay, let's open the shop forthe 150th time if you.
Oh, we have.
This is a good one too.
This is a good episode.
I picked this.
I scrapped the one I had when Irealized right, you told me
that that's crazy.
Okay, if you discoveredsomething really bizarre and
(08:02):
unusual other than me, who isthe first or what, or who is the
first place?
You're reporting it to likelocal news government media,
posting it to tiktok.
What are you doing?
Speaker 1 (08:12):
wait other than you other than me oh, my mom that's
it okay, if weird, thing, weird,bizarre things happen, it's you
and my mom and then you're whatyou're doing from there, just
not saying anything.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Covering, covering it up.
What is your plan?
Speaker 1 (08:26):
I guess it just depends on what it is.
I don't know, ok, um yeah, Iguess.
I guess let me re-answer when Iknow what.
What it's about.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
You're going to put it together pretty quick, but
not right away.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
I just want to know, like or like.
Once I know what it is, then Iwant to think about who I would
tell.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Okay, Okay, that's fair.
Okay, we'll go with that.
Okay, so are you ready for 150?
Woo, our story begins the 24thof June 1947.
Okay, pilot Kenneth Arnold isflying over the Cascade
Mountains in Washington State,his mission Helping the military
(09:06):
search for a crashed airplane.
However, what he sees iscompletely out of this world.
Kenneth sees ninecrescent-shaped flying objects
10,000 feet off the ground,going at extraordinary speeds.
Okay, you're lost, and youshould be.
He reports this to the mediaand it kicks off a new phrase as
(09:28):
well as a new phase, the phraseflying saucer, the phase the
UFO flap of the 40s and the 50s.
Oh, so it is Kenneth Arnold andhis story that makes headlines
around the world, that startsthe flying saucer craze.
Okay, okay, but our storydoesn't actually take place in
(09:50):
washington or in june.
In fact, we're gonna fastforward to a few weeks later and
a local rancher local to whereI can't tell you his name is mac
brazel, and he is out on hisranch called the foster ranch,
and he is looking over his umlivestock and the farm and the
(10:10):
entire ranch to see any damagethat would have occurred after a
violent thunderstorm the nightbefore.
However, he finds somethingthat intrigues him a little bit.
Okay, okay so let's get thegeography out of the way, and
this is going to tell youexactly what the story is.
The Foster Ranch sits in thestate of New Mexico,
(10:30):
approximately 75 miles from thecity of Roswell.
Ah, brazel discovers a strangedebris field on his ranch, and
this field stretches for severalhundred feet and was unlike
anything he had ever seen before.
So what he finds is as followscara, okay, foil like material
(10:53):
that returned to its originalshape after being crumpled, hit,
smashed, almost like a memorymetal.
He called it okay.
There are also thin,lightweight beams, some with
symbols or hieroglyphic-likemarkings, and pieces of
parchment that were resistant tofire and tearing.
Brazel notes that the debriswasn't from anything he had ever
(11:14):
seen before.
He had had a few things crashdown onto the branch in the past
, but he was not able torecognize any of the bits.
He did try to like, like wesaid, burn some of the material.
It wouldn't burn.
He tried to cut it.
It couldn't be cut, dented,scratched, nothing.
Locals do start to come onto theranch and who had like said
(11:37):
they handled pieces of it.
They said it felt like plasticmixed with metal, that it defied
physics.
So at first, though, brazeldoesn't think really like too
much into anything.
But then he starts to hear thenews go around from our buddy
kenneth arnold a few weeks agoand he starts to hear about
these flying saucers on theradio, and now eyewitness
(12:00):
accounts of these are popping upall over the country.
Okay, so he decides he needs toreport what he's found.
So Brazel loads up what he canof the metal debris from the
field into his truck.
He makes the 75 mile trek up toRoswell, where he first goes to
the sheriff, george Wilcox.
George realizes this is wayabove his head, realizes this is
(12:22):
way above his head and he sendshim to the Roswell Army Air
Force Nope Air Field or the RAAF.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Oh okay.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
So it's here that Braswell meets with a unit of
the United States Air Force.
Now, this isn't just any unitof the Air Force.
This is the same unit thatdeploys the atomic bombs over
hiroshima and nagasaki in uh,the world war hiroshima is that
what I said?
Speaker 1 (12:50):
hiroshima hiroshima yes I love when I can help you.
Thank you so.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
But so it's not like, just like some random outspurt
of you know the.
There he meets with Major JesseMarcel, the head of
intelligence, and Marcel takesthe materials from his truck.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
Okay, so are you saying, if I were to see these
things, who would I call?
Yes, I can't call you.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Like not including me .
We all know I'm going to be thefirst call.
Who are you going next?
Speaker 1 (13:25):
My mom.
But if I need to call somebodythat I just like I, I think I
would call tenny smart move I'mgonna I don't have his number,
but I'm gonna dm tenny and belike bro I know you believe me,
you'll judge me and you willprobably tell me what to do next
(13:46):
and yeah, no, he will tell youwhat to do with no questions, no
thoughts, no, no, here's.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Here's what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
So that's what comes to my mind Tenny, Perfect, OK,
no, I like that.
Shout out Tenny.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
All right.
So Brazel meets with MajorJesse Marcel, the head of
intelligence, right.
He takes the materials.
Major Marcel and the team thenhead out to the ranch where they
fill two more trucks withdebris that had been discovered,
and it's all taken back to theraaf for more analysis okay so a
couple of days later, july 8th1947, the roswell army air for
(14:25):
airfield I keep saying Airford,it's Airfield and Air Force, I'm
trying to say at the same time.
So the RAAF right.
They release a press release.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
OK.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
Remember, this is a branch of the military.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
And this is 19 what 47.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
Their official statement states that they had
captured a crashed flying saucer.
Immediately, the press goescrazy.
This is already in the newsbecause of Kenneth Arnold right.
Headlines go out such as RAAFcaptures flying saucer on ranch.
Let me start the sentence overRAAF captures flying saucer on
(15:08):
ranch in Roswell region.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
That is a tongue twister, that was a tongue
twister.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
And then, finally, army reveals it has a flying
disc.
Much easier to say.
So Major Marcel is immediatelyordered to board a B-29 bomber
and deliver the wreckage to FortWorth in Texas, specifically to
a general named Roger Ramey.
This is where things start toget really weird.
(15:36):
Major Marcel arrives at Ramey'soffice, they drop off the
material, all the debris.
So then the pair decide thatthey're going to visit the map
room and talk about it.
Okay, and upon their return tothe drop-off point, major Marcel
immediately becomes a littlebit confused, because where he
(15:56):
had left all the debris is now apile of rotting neoprene
balloons, some sticks, ashredded radar reflector, kite
and other random butidentifiable debris, including
duct tape and tinfoil.
Okay, so, major Marcel, do wethink it?
Speaker 1 (16:17):
changed or it was replaced.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Replaced.
Okay Okay.
He brings a bunch of stuff.
He goes on a walk with Rameythey come back.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, very different.
I'm just thinking in my head dowe think it was?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
no, it was replaced 100%, because Raimi then holds a
press conference.
Okay, Not.
However, before telling Marcelnot to breathe a word about what
happened to reporters or hisfamily.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
In the press conference.
Raimi claims that the wreckagewas nothing more than the
remnants of a crashed weatherballoon.
Marcel is photographed duringthis at the conference holding
what appears to be a bunch oftin foil foil.
This that picture you alwayssee of the guy sitting on the
ground with all the debris andhe looks like kind of pissed off
.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
I'm sure if I saw it I wouldn't know.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Oh yeah, you would recognize it.
All of this occurs within 24hours.
So within 24 hours of marcelgetting the original, not 24
hours of him getting theoriginal debris, but of his
original press release sayinghey, we have a flying saucer.
He takes it all, he goes totexas, they replace it and a new
press release is given and theold one is retracted.
(17:24):
So we don't have a flyingsaucer, it's just a weather
balloon Dumb.
Right about the same time, ourrancher, mac Brazel, he goes on
a little vacation forcefully.
So he is allegedly Excuse me,allegedly taken by the military
and detained for several days atsome sort of facility.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
Cute.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Right.
Then he returns home and hisstory changes.
He described the debris as justrubber, sticks, tape and tin
foil.
Uh, he even stated that if Iever found anything like it
again, I wouldn't even sayanything.
Okay, so we know the us loves agood cover-up.
Um, so some people would claimto say this wasn't you know
(18:09):
anything but a balloon.
Others are like well, there's alittle bit more going on here.
But because there was so muchtrust in the us military at this
time, everyone kind of skirtedover it.
But let's go over some of thestrangeness before we move on.
Yeah, so it's weather.
Balloons weren't unusual in1947.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Yeah, but they're not like common.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
They're common enough that Brazel has had them crash
on his ranch before.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
Okay, and if?
Speaker 2 (18:35):
it was just another weather balloon, he would never
have said anything.
He's seen these before Okay.
So then we have the originalpress release that's recanted
and retold within 24 hours.
Again, let's go back to theraaf.
This isn't just a little ruralpiece of the air force.
These are the guys who droppedthe atom bomb.
(18:57):
They are high ranking, hightrusted officials.
The military also crashes, orcrashes, steals off the crash
scene for four days.
Which, yeah, a local radiostation at the time attempts to
interview Brazel Okay, and thestation manager receives a
threat from the FCC that if theyran the interview they'd pull
(19:18):
their license.
That's totally normal.
Oh yeah, civilians in the areawho were either interested in or
had seen the crash site reportbeing intimidated by men in
uniform don't know if that'smilitary or other bodies, the
men in black.
Whatever.
Though, with all this weirdness,the cover up seems to work.
The story fades from the publicfor about three decades.
(19:42):
Actually, it doesn't researchuntil the 70s.
So it was kind of a reallysmall blip on the radar.
One, we already talked about,because of the high trust in the
military.
Two, because right after thiscrash there's a really
well-documented other UFO crash.
That was a huge hoax and itturned out to be all pieces from
a jukebox.
Okay, I don't know.
(20:05):
Just with what you know so farbefore we go fast forward into
the 70s.
What are your thoughts on theRoswell crash?
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Do you even have to ask me?
Okay, so how is it a no, it's acover up.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
It's a cover up of something for sure.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
So you're telling a man that has already had a hot
air balloon?
Speaker 2 (20:28):
Weather balloon.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
Weather balloon, i'm'm sorry crash on his
property.
He already knows what thatmeans and entails, and looks
like you're telling him that no,that was a weather balloon,
it's fine.
You're also disregarding ordiscrediting like material that
somebody brought and like oh,it's just like duct tape and
random shit like f.
Are you talking, okay, likethat's crazy.
And then, yeah, what did yousay?
(20:51):
It was like four hours, thatthey four days for, I'm sorry,
four days that they taped offthe.
I mean, I think that seemsreally crazy if you're trying to
tell me it's just a weatherballoon, right, so right.
I could, though, see it beinglike a while, depending on, like
, the debris and the things thatthey're like researching, so I
(21:13):
guess the four days could goeither way.
That could be really extreme tosome, or it could be like oh
yeah, but they're just doingtheir job, they're just trying
to figure it all out, and thisis what they concluded, but it
seems like four days does notneed to like.
It doesn't take four days toconclude that it was a weather
balloon.
What else are you doing?
And hiding and covering up?
I don't know.
I just think that it's, andthen for it to just be like
(21:35):
that's it yeah, well, we'll comeback to what else they were
hiding oh right, that's what I'msaying.
They're hiding stuff for sure.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
So a couple years go by.
Remember this happened in 47.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
We're now into the 70s.
Okay, so what's going on in the70s?
We are now at a pop culturaltheme on aliens, and the public
can't get enough of it, right.
So we have famous abductioncases going on.
We have movies, including CloseEncounters, star Wars.
We have Watergate and theVietnam War, which are building
(22:09):
a general distrust for themilitary and the government.
It's time for Roswell to beexplored again, and it does,
thanks to the help of agentleman named Stanton Friedman
.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
Okay, Friedman.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Friedman is a nuclear physicist and a UFO researcher,
oh, and so he's doing a bunchof different research and he
gets a tip from a radio stationmanager in Baton Rouge,
louisiana, who says you shouldspeak to a man named Major Jesse
Marcel.
He handled wreckage from aflying saucer crash back in 47.
(22:44):
Huh, friedman is like I'm in,he needs to track this guy down.
He finds him.
He's retired now he's living inlouisiana.
And friedman gets an interviewwith marcel, major marcel, who
starts to just spill the beans.
Okay, he again says thematerial was like, and or unlike
(23:05):
, anything found on earth.
Okay, foil, like indestructible, strange symbols.
He states he was ordered tokeep quiet and that the real
debris was replaced with aweather balloon for the media.
And here's some direct quotes.
It was not anything from thisEarth.
I'm absolutely sure of that.
And I am absolutely convincedthat what I recovered was not
(23:28):
any type of weather balloon orradar target, it was something
else.
Huh, so he claimed thateveryone who was involved with
the retrieval was clear that theobject had indeed been an
extraterrestrial spaceship.
Oh, he knew that.
Whoever sealed it off knew whatthey were dealing with and it
was a deliberate cover-up with.
(23:51):
And it was a deliberatecover-up.
Okay, he also lived with a lotof shame for going along with
the balloon story, saying thathe was following orders and that
he had been threatened okay,which we know that that stuff
happens all the time, so that'smakes sense so this was the
first time a military officialdirectly involved in the
recovery of an extraterrestrialobject publicly claimed that
(24:12):
something was extraterrestrialin nature.
Okay, he only comes forward,though, because he was mentally,
not mentally because hementally ill.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
That's sad, we're all mentally ill.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
He only comes forward , though, because he was
terminally ill and no longerworried about any of the threats
.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
Okay, that makes sense, because he was like,
listen, my life is coming to anend.
Let me just, oh, yeah, like,whatever happens happens.
Deathbed confessions Absolutely, we love them.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
So over the next couple of years, friedman, with
the help of and these mightsound familiar to you Charles
Berlitz and William Moore, startto research the incident.
These were guys who alsoresearched the Philadelphia
experiment.
Yes, so they do a lot ofresearch on the cover up.
They talk to anyone they canabout it.
They talk to Major Marcel, hisson His son was 10 at the time
(25:04):
of the incident, saw the crashright.
Any of the other locals who mayhave observed it.
They talk to military officials.
They talked to anybody theycould get their hands on to
gather as much evidence as theycould to prove what really
happened okay okay, that was the70s, in 1980.
(25:24):
Okay, more in burlitz, who haveexpanded now on friedman's
original research, publish abook called the Roswell Incident
.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Ah, have you read this?
No, I want to.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Okay, I have not read this, but there's some other
reports that we're talking aboutthat I actually found the full
versions of which is reallyinteresting to read through, all
in the show notes, okay.
Okay, so the Roswell incidentdetails Major Marcel's original
claims, but also with all theother witness testimony.
So now things start to come outthat alien bodies were
(25:58):
recovered and witnesses claim tohave seen them.
They're saying that the bodieswere taken to Wright-Patterson
Air Force Base, that thegovernment definitely did
orchestrate a major cover-up tosuppress the truth.
This is where, in this book, oneof the kind of now popularized
phrases comes out the mostimportant events in human
(26:19):
history are covered up by thegovernment yes, yes, yes so the
entire premise of the roswellincident book seems to claim
that the UFO was flying over theNew Mexico desert to observe
the nuclear weapons and wasstruck by lightning, crashed and
(26:39):
it killed the alien crew.
This is really interesting,though and this is kind of like
a side note why is it thatwhenever the threat of nuclear
war seems to get high is when weseem to have these flaps?
I think because they'reobserving what the fuck not to
do and this is where I think youand me get into our things.
Uh, aliens aren't from otherplanets.
(27:02):
They're either from otherdimensions or timelines or
something.
We can't effing go to theselimits no, yeah, it's like.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
I feel like it's like , or it's like a damn field trip
where it's like this is whatyou don't do, guys see I don't
think it's that.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
I think these are more the observers who are
trying to keep us from going tothat level of destruction where
we talked about.
Maybe ufos are from the futureor whatnot, but I.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
I don't know if they're trying to keep us from
destruction.
I don't know that part, I don't.
I don't know if they're tryingto keep us from destruction.
I don't know that part, I don't.
I don't know if I think that Ican get on board with it, but I
don't, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
I don't have a diff like I guess that's one of my
theories is that, yeah, whatwe're experiencing is ufos isn't
aliens from other planets, butit might be us from the future
trying, to like, keep them fromnot existing I don't think.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
I don't think that I think they're us from the future
.
I don't.
I think they're from adifferent realm or a different
planet, whatever you want to say.
I think that they really doobserve us and they're looking
at us like look at these fools,and this is what you don't do or
do like I think that there areobservers, like you said, but I
don't I don't know if Inecessarily think that they're
(28:09):
us from the future or whatever.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Like is it us from the future?
Or are they more like theuniversal watch dogs who are
like when you're getting thisclose to destruction?
Because maybe that okay, random, random thing here we talked
about how, like kennedy wantedto disclose ufos, like all of a
sudden all these presidentsdon't what.
If it is like this, I don'tknow security system or
something I don't know I we'regoing down a total side note now
(28:34):
.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
Oh yeah, I think they're just like a whole other
whole other like non-relatedentity okay yeah, I can get down
with that.
I mean, we don't know, so wejust don't know, and I guess I
think that's what I think.
That's maybe what I've alwaysbelieved.
So I mean, my belief in them islike grown differently, but I
think that they've always poppedup in every historical
(28:57):
generation.
I don't know how to explainwhat I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
Every bit of culture through written history has
mentioned something aboutsomething from the sky.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
Something like UFOs or skies.
So I don't necessarily thinkthey're from the future.
I think that they are justobserving us and they're, like,
watching us.
I think they're learning and Idon't think it's any different
from us spying on differentcountries.
I think that they're justspying on us.
They're learning, they'readapting and, whether they are
here, I do think that they comeand pretend to be us at times.
(29:26):
I really do think that, but Idon't think they're.
I don't think they're trying tolike warn us or protect us in
any way.
Maybe, maybe some of them arelike hey, we think that this
might happen in the media.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
I think they definitely at least try to
protect their anonymity when welook at the men in black.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
But yes, I think that I don't think that they want to
be known or seen, and I'm surethere's so many different
reasons as to why, but let'scontinue on with our story, okay
, yeah, so back to it.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
Yeah, they were killed in, you know, looking
over the nukes, they got struckby lightning.
Whatever Crash die.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
So the book goes on to state that the US government
quickly retrieves the wreckage,covers it up, tells us the
balloon story, whatever.
But the authors claim to haveinterviewed over 90 witnesses,
through the book or for the book, but only the testimony of 25
appear in it.
Only seven of those 25 claim tohave seen the debris and only
five claim to have handled itthat's a really big difference
(30:24):
and that's where I think some ofthe details of this book get
embellished.
But it's from these witnessesthat the stories so remember.
Marcel, major marcel and hisson never say anything about the
bodies.
That doesn't exist in the loreuntil the 70s and 80s when this
book comes out and this comesmostly from a gentleman named
(30:44):
glenn davis.
He's a funeral home.
He comes forward saying he gota strange phone call in 47 from
the base asking for child-sizehermetically sealed coffins.
He also said that a nursefriend of his described seeing
the bodies that were big-headedwith little bodies with no
(31:06):
internal organs like we know ofthem.
Oh, he is one of the mostsighted eyewitnesses who claims
to have been part of the autopsyof bodies, and discovery bodies
from this crash.
Now I will say about GlennDavis is that lots of people
have found holes in his stories,in some untruths and his added
(31:30):
details.
So whether or not it's trueabout the little bodies, right,
that has stuck with the Roswellcrash ever since, because we
always hear about the crash, thebodies, all that Okay.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Okay, but the original report had nothing to
do with the bodies.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
The original two press releases we have.
We call it a flying saucer, andthen JK, it's just a balloon
and then nothing more about ituntil this book comes out.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Okay, Interesting.
There's kind of two ways youcan take it right.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Yeah, glenn.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
Davis is telling the truth, yep, and he's being
discredited by other members ofthe military who say they never
saw this or that he is nottelling the truth and
embellishing Either one with theamount of evidence that we had,
I guess, can stand.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
I was going to say you could actually run with
either one.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
Right.
So due to the book, though, andits popularity throughout the
80s and 90s, dozens of peoplestart to come forward.
Right so now, now we have,after that book comes out, all
their military officers whoclaim to have seen or
transported the bodies.
We have civilians comingforward who are saying they were
threatened in 1947 about beingsilent about this, and now they
(32:39):
speak out because they're eitherretired from the military or
they're not afraid of thethreats.
Right, and they corroboratedifferent parts of the crash.
So it's just seeing the debrisfield, or what was in the makeup
of the debris, or maybe seeingsome bodies.
There was a military nurse whoallegedly described these aliens
, and they think it might be thesame nurse that glenn davis was
(33:00):
talking about.
She vanishes without a trace.
Stop it right.
So how old was she?
There's very, very littleidentifying details on no no, no
again.
Either very vague could be madeup or could be somebody who was
just lost.
Now this is also about the sametime that multiple witnesses
come to say that there was asecond crash site.
(33:21):
Oh, and I think most of ourpopular culture today, when you
hear about Roswell, mash thesetwo into one.
Okay, because from Marcel'sstory of the Roswell crash site
it's total debris, but most ofus remember it as like they
recovered a flying saucer.
So the second crash was not farfrom the first sort of oh, no,
(33:45):
but this was a entire intactship, with alien bodies being
recovered.
Now it's unclear whether theywere alive or dead or in a state
between, and it only happenedabout 27 miles away from the
first crash.
Okay were in a state between,and it only happened about 27
miles away from the first crash.
Okay, so it's one of thosethings where, like I feel like
sometimes when you see that,like the picture of the roswell
(34:06):
crash, it's like you know, theykind of skid it into a rock.
These are two different things.
There's a fully now intact shipwith either maybe dead, maybe
close to dead, or alive alienbodies being pulled from this.
Okay, so captain oliverhenderson of the first air
transport unit says that he flewthe alleged bodies out of
(34:26):
roswell from the second crash tothe right patterson air force
or airface air force based indayton.
Oh Okay, he never tells thestory, though it's his wife who
tells it after he dies.
No, so he never comes clean.
She says my husband told meabout the bodies.
(34:48):
They were small oh no, theirheads were large and their eyes
were rather sunken and slanted.
They were not of this earth.
So the wife says this in aninterview on the show unsolved
mysteries uh, she said, when myhusband, who is a man of truth,
tells me the story, I believedhim did you watch this part?
(35:10):
No, because this is the fourthepisode of unsolved mysteries
ever.
This is the original serieswait.
So they're covering this, likewhen it's happening in the early
or late 80s, early 90s I'm justwondering if people think it
was performative or if theybelieve her well, I that's
literally.
They're half in one camp, halfin another.
(35:32):
Right, because nobody in the40s ever talked about the bodies
or the second crash.
But these things come out laterand it's like some of the
stories.
They seem like the roswelldebris field is the second crash
or what.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
It's just very convoluted I don't know what,
the 40s, though you would betalking about this I know it
makes sense and if people werebeing threatened?
Right, the men in black areprobably surveilling your house.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
Oh, absolutely, you shut the hell up.
So then we also have SergeantMelvin Brown.
He's a cook at the Roswell base, the original RAAF.
He alleges peeking into a crateduring transport and saw bodies
under a tarp.
He doesn't know which crashthey came from, but he says he
saw them.
Speaker 1 (36:19):
Oh, I think I've heard this.
Speaker 2 (36:21):
Everybody who describes the bodies describes
them as small, gray, not human.
Large heads, small bodies,strange organs.
So in all these stories, allthese eyewitnesses' accounts
that came out from the 70s to90s, I will say, yes, it's weird
, they held onto it that long,but all these people who didn't
interact with each other give avery similar description.
(36:43):
Now we don't know if the bodiesare from marcel's crash,
because marcel also looked overeverything and never claimed
about bodies.
I think when they steal offthis site, this other crash
happened and I think they wereboth covered up at once and all
these people who were looselyrelated to it didn't know where
pieces and parts were comingfrom they just knew something
(37:04):
weird was going on that makessense.
I could, I could get down onthat all in all, from the 70s to
the 90s, over 200 interviews ofwitnesses to the original crash
or crashes, or who wereinvolved in the military
cover-up or something related toit.
All come out and have theirstories collected.
This incident is now totally inour pop culture, like it's not
(37:30):
going anywhere no okay, I knowyou already think it's real.
What do you think happens fromhere?
Now I'll say this we're in theearly 90s now at this point,
which is weird to me because,like I guess at eye level and I
remember growing up, because wewould have grown up in the early
or late 90s, right, like yeah,late, this is still really
popular.
(37:50):
We heard about this all thetime.
I just always assumed it wasall from the 40s.
I didn't realize.
So much of it came out later.
So what's your general thoughtsof the Roswell incident?
Speaker 1 (38:00):
What year were you born?
Speaker 2 (38:01):
93.
Speaker 1 (38:02):
Yeah, I don't know, because I feel like in my brain
I just always think aliens are70s.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
Right, which is why it had its resurgence.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
That's just like what I have in my head.
So 90 though I don't know.
So I was 89, so I was like a90s kid, but other than like
having pogs with alien faces orlike t-shirts with aliens and
all the bracelets and chokerswith alien heads, like green
alien heads, I don't know.
And aside from my grandmother,who told my grandparents told me
(38:37):
of their encounter of seeing aflying saucer UFO, I don't know
if I recall any, I can't thinkof any other alien thing, I just
I remember the Roswell thingand I think just because late
80s, early 90s was still a bigthing like being almost as
prevalent as like hearing aboutthe Bermuda Triangle and all
those things.
(38:58):
Yeah, so when did ET come out?
Because I saw it in theatersand then I think that was it
took 98 82 oh it was 82.
We did this last time where wethought it was I know and it's
not.
We just loved it because Ithought I swore I saw it in
theaters, but I didn't, becauseI wasn't even born.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
No.
Speaker 1 (39:18):
I just saw it.
Speaker 2 (39:19):
We have talked about that.
Speaker 1 (39:20):
We have, because I feel like I I guess it's because
it's such a prominent memorythat I feel like I saw it in
theaters.
But maybe I did, maybe itre-was watched or something or
re-shown and I thought that butsee, I don't know.
Here's what's weird.
I don't know why I thoughtaliens lived in my laundry room
and I would tell stories aboutthis, and you told your teachers
(39:40):
, you were an alien.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
It was still so big and there were so many stories,
I think between 70s let's say 70to like early 2000s.
Speaker 1 (39:47):
So it was just ingrained in our little brains.
We didn't even know anything.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
Still so many eyewitnesses were alive at this
time who were coming forwardabout it.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
I'm waiting for the aliens to come back for me.
I say this all the time oh, I'mready?
Speaker 2 (40:00):
Take me, here's the thing.
Speaker 1 (40:02):
They showed themselves to my grandparents.
They showed themselves to me.
I was so close to beingabducted.
You should have taken me thatsummer I don't understand.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
I mean, I'm sure you've been probed, at least.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
That's fine, take me now, don't return me.
Speaker 2 (40:17):
Okay, anyways, we love the rabbit holes.
This story you know the 70sthrough the 90s.
It's impossible to disprove somuch of what happened in the 40s
Like 30 years have gone by.
Well yeah, but there's enoughevidence, I think, to at least
support that something from outof this world was found covered
up and studied.
Like at I, we can agree to that, like it's weird enough,
(40:41):
there's enough.
We might not have the bodies,we might not have anything, but
something weird was recovered.
Somebody has the bodies.
So the us government felt theneed to respond with everybody
coming forward, the air force,through congressional pressure
in the 1990s, decided thatthey're going to reinvestigate
(41:02):
because not only the congressbut the public was also
demanding answers.
So now we get the 231 pagereport called the roswell report
fact or fiction in the newmexico desert.
This report replaces conspiracywith conspiracy.
They conclude that the crashwas part of a secret project
(41:23):
called project mogul.
Project mogul was allegedly atop secret us army air force
operation in the late 1940s.
Its purpose was to detectsoviet nuclear tests by
listening for subsonic soundwaves in the upper atmosphere
using high-altitude balloonarrays.
(41:46):
Oh my god.
So the project allegedlyoperated out of Alamogordo Army
Airfield in New Mexico, not toofar from Roswell.
Okay, scientists launched longstrings of weather balloon up to
600 feet in length withmicrowaves to pick up sound
waves, radar reflectors madefrom foil sticks and tape and
(42:08):
transmitting and trackingequipment.
A lot of times these thingswould crash, so secrecy was high
.
It was all done during the ColdWar, war, right where nuclear
tension was rampant.
And they specifically go on tostate that the crash that was
found was one of those mogulballoon arrays, specifically
flight number four.
Here's the thing.
(42:30):
I think that project mogul isprobably real, because that
would make sense.
We were using using things totest for Soviet nuclear strikes.
Yeah, but it's so weird that inthe 90s we're like oh, we're
just going to tell everyoneabout this secret mission now
that the Cold War threat is overand we know exactly which
flight it was that crashed andthat's why we didn't say
(42:53):
anything before- but also why,if no one was like kind of
bringing it up or it was, youknow what I mean, like it.
So they gave the why, but theirwhy was that?
People were really scared aboutnuclear wars and it had to be
classified, which is why theinitial press release was so
vague and contradictory theinitial press releases.
(43:16):
Here's my thing on this.
If Project Mogul existed asnotoriously as they said it did,
Okay, why are we talking aboutit?
Then the RAAF, who originallytook this to Texas, would have
been in the know.
They are the atomic scientistsin the US.
Why would they not have knownand been aware of this balloon
(43:40):
mission that was looking fornukes?
Speaker 1 (43:42):
yeah, they might not have been.
They might not have been aware.
I don't yeah, but or they hadto act like they weren't aware
but remember, this wasn't theguy, he wasn't acting.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
This is marcel, this is the original.
They had no reason.
You know, if they were acting,he wouldn't have said that they
caught like, yeah, you're right.
If he would have never said wegot a flying saucer.
If he had no, they would haveknown I think that they wouldn't
have made anybody.
I don't know now this reportright, that came out in 94 after
(44:12):
the investigation started in 90says nothing about the alien
bodies, no spacecraft, nogovernment cover-up, it's just
all Cold War secrecy.
Speaker 1 (44:21):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (44:22):
People didn't love this Kara.
Speaker 1 (44:24):
No, I think they should have just shut the hell
up and not said anything.
Speaker 2 (44:28):
They end up coming out with another report.
Okay, oh, so this is the report, the follow-up Roswell Report,
case Closed in 1997.
Because they're like, if wecall it case closed, we can just
be done with this yeah, yeah,we can't.
Speaker 1 (44:45):
We have any reason to not have to talk about it
anymore okay.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
so 1997, the 50th anniversary of the incident.
This report actually explainedaway the bodies.
So here's the thing, before weeven get into this report, up
until this point, when I wasdoing all the research, I'm like
, well, these bodies could beanything, okay, right, like they
came up only in the 70s.
(45:08):
Maybe they weren't actuallythere, or you know, all these
people are kind of making it upto get on the bandwagon.
Speaker 1 (45:15):
Okay, well, okay.
So what would your thought beif they weren't making them up?
And they did see some sort ofbodies?
What is your thought?
Speaker 2 (45:22):
My thought would be this report would come out, I
think, if they were making upthe bodies and nobody like, if
this was all kind of like a popculture we're going to talk
about it now and make it up, themilitary would have been like
the bodies never existed.
Speaker 1 (45:35):
Do you think these little weird bodies were
actually staged for some sort ofreason?
Speaker 2 (45:43):
I don't think they were staged for any reason.
Speaker 1 (45:45):
Okay, and when?
Speaker 2 (45:47):
we get into this report, you'll understand why I
honestly, until I read thesecond report, thought that
people were making up the bodiesyears later maybe having false
memories or wanting to get onthe bandwagon, because Marcel
never said anything about them.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
So the reason I said that, just so I can clarify I
don't know if I need to, but thereason I said that is because I
could see that being shown, sothat people would start talking
about it, and then thegovernment could make it like
they were covering it up becausethey were hiding something
bigger on the back end.
But people could talk aboutthis and make it like they were
covering it up because they werehiding something bigger on the
back end, but like people couldtalk about this and like make it
weird and discreet and likesecretive, and so people start
(46:25):
looking at that.
But there's really a biggerpicture in the background.
That's the only reason that Iwas thinking of that.
But no, I don't think it's that.
Speaker 2 (46:32):
OK, because the first report they just ignored it all
and right, we're hoping itwould go away again.
I think they really did recover, just two extraterrestrial
craft.
Okay, I don't think there'sanything bigger going on,
because in the 1997 the roswellreport case closed.
Uh, this report can't claimedthat the stories of the alien
(46:52):
bodies actually came frommisremembered high
altitudealtitude experimentsthat occurred in the 50s.
They're like this didn't evenhappen in 47.
You guys are so wrong.
What they were saying isOperation High Drive and Project
Excelsior is where mannequinswere dropped from air balloons
to test parachutes andhigh-altitude survival.
(47:17):
Now, these dummies, kara.
They were four to six feet tall, because why would we make them
the size of regular humanbeings?
Speaker 1 (47:25):
Because that makes sense for testing things.
Speaker 2 (47:27):
They made them out of gray rubber and used metal
joints so their insides weren'tlike normal humans.
Speaker 1 (47:33):
But we wouldn't know that if we dissected a thing of
rubber.
And after landing they wereoften damaged or distorted in
the high desert heat and theyresembled alien figures what I
do have to say is took them areally long time to come up with
that, but yeah I guess that'snot bad.
Speaker 2 (47:50):
1980 to 1997 17 years but it's not like to say oh my
god, you guys.
Actually you just remember ormisremember the year.
Speaker 1 (48:00):
If they would have said that right away, I would
have been like all right, that'snot that bad of a because.
What, like what would you havecome up with?
Speaker 2 (48:07):
well, hey, listen, if we're gonna go down, that's not
that bad route.
Speaker 1 (48:10):
Here's why people misremembered I'm not the crash
site being sealed off because itwas often recovery teams
getting the mannequins.
Speaker 2 (48:21):
They were dressed in a full military gear, which
might explain why there's allthese high security stories and
censored witnesses around.
Speaker 1 (48:30):
Why did it take four days?
Speaker 2 (48:31):
Why did it take 17 years for them to come up with
this damn story?
Speaker 1 (48:35):
I'm not saying it's good, I'm just saying people
would believe that.
Speaker 2 (48:39):
So well.
They did sort of, and thisreport included photos of actual
dummies and the balloons andtest sites, attempting to show
that mistaken identity was veryplausible.
Oh, so I don't know.
I mean, there's a lot ofweirdness, right.
We have Major Marcel Brazelwith their original discovery,
(48:59):
who didn't say anything aboutthe bodies.
Then we have this possiblesecond crash.
We have a cover-up.
We have years where it wentaway.
It had this resurgence, I don'tknow.
I this is one that, likethere's so much more we could go
into and there's 200 witnesstestimonies.
We could go through these.
You can find the militaryreports still online with so
(49:23):
much redacted information, butwe could spend days and days and
episodes, and episodes on this,I feel like 200, that's a lot.
It's a lot and the fact that thegovernment has come out twice
now to cover it up changing.
I guess I would believe themannequin thing more if they
addressed it in the first report.
But they're like oh shit, weactually have to talk about the
(49:45):
second part now that's what Iwas saying.
Speaker 1 (49:46):
The mannequin thing isn't really that off of a thing
.
It's kind of stupid.
I mean it is.
But if that were to come outright away and be like, yeah, we
didn't paint these mannequinsor we couldn't make them like
flesh colored tones and buthere's my thing, if you're
testing it out to be realistic,then they would have been
heights of different variationsof bodies and weights and stuff
(50:08):
like that.
So that doesn't make sense tome.
But let's get real.
People are naive, they'vealways been naive, and when the
government tells us stuff, a lotof people believe it.
So I can see that being abelievable thing if that had
happened right off the rip right, right, it's just 17 or 19,
whatever years later?
no, that's kind of just came outwith so many stories but I
(50:32):
could have seen that being athing that people would have
believed not me so anyway, guessmy personal beliefs, because
it's deep in American history.
Speaker 2 (50:41):
It's in all the lore now, like this story is not
going anywhere.
I have always thought that wedid recover something from the
crash site.
I think For sure Debris fromRoswell.
I think we got a full craftfrom the second one.
Speaker 1 (50:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (50:55):
Because there are other episodes we could do about
this.
Right, there are videos showingthat the us government at one
point was testing their ownflying saucers.
There's so many stories aboutthese crashed vehicles and these
alive bodies ending up at area51, you know, to be studied by
(51:19):
the doctors there in lockheedmartin, like I.
I think there's so much more tothis that we'll never know, but
I am 100 a believer that theroswell site was a a huge
cover-up and we definitely gotat least a craft, if not bodies,
for sure yeah, but anywaysepisode 150, that is the story
(51:42):
of the Roswell UFO crash andincident.
Speaker 1 (51:46):
Good job.
Yeah, that's just.
We can't be here forever, butwe could be here forever just
discussing this.
Speaker 2 (51:53):
That's okay, because I think this is going to be a
perfect lead in for a futureepisode on Area 151.
Not right away, not next week,but it's coming babies, oh my
god.
All right, that's all I got foryou.
Final thoughts on Roswell yeahit happened.
Speaker 1 (52:10):
It's aliens.
I do you think one day we'regoing to be like gone?
Like let's just say we havethis podcast for like so many
years and like we talk whatever,and then one day we just like
and people are like that's soweird, because Karen and Zach
are so consistent, They'vealways had a podcast.
It's just so weird, Likewhere'd they go?
(52:30):
They like dropped off the grid,but really like the government
wants to shut us up or aliensabduct us because we talk too
much the thing is, though, islike let's be honest with you
and I.
Speaker 2 (52:40):
If they wanted, they'd have to kill us, because
we can't keep our mouths shutfor more than five minutes no,
that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (52:46):
Like one day our podcast is going to get us in
trouble, okay, and we're gonnasay that, listeners take note I,
I everybody keep lock in.
Speaker 2 (52:55):
Pay attention right now.
Kara and I are not suicidal ifwe disappear.
It was not us.
Speaker 1 (53:01):
That's what I'm saying.
I'm just, I'm putting thatcaveat out there.
Are there search?
Speaker 2 (53:05):
histories.
Oh, we're already on every list.
There are lots.
I was talking about that withmy uh.
I was going to say my uhhairstylist today, but I almost
said my hair therapist because,let's be honest, she is my
therapist.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
She is.
That's cute.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
I'm gonna tell my mom that she's a hair therapist
hair therapist but yeah, no, Isaid something about we were
talking about our weirdness.
I'm like listen between mysearch history and everything
else I talk about in front of mygoogle home.
Speaker 1 (53:30):
I'm on every list there is, I'm sure 100, 100 it's
fine, but I mean, if wedisappear one day, it's's not
because we Well, I don't know,though because we do want to
disappear, well, okay.
Speaker 2 (53:42):
We do want to disappear by aliens, if you
think I got abducted by aliens?
Speaker 1 (53:46):
leave it alone.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
We'll leave some sort of something.
Let me be.
Yeah, don't bring us back.
Okay, so if we disappear, beconcerned, blame the government.
But if blame the government,but if it was aliens, still
blame the government becausethey need to go down anyway.
Alright, that's our final wordson Roswell, Kara, oh, I was
going to say what do they needto do?
But first we have to pick anemoji, An alien or a flying
saucer.
There's like the little alienface and I think like a bright
(54:11):
sun for the desert.
Oh, okay.
Speaker 1 (54:13):
Also, it's been bugging me since we started this
episode.
It's been bugging me since westarted this episode.
I was not saying that the bookhad too many gay people in it,
because I love the gays.
I was just saying that it wasweird that every character had
to have such a weird backgroundas to why they became gay.
Speaker 2 (54:33):
Okay, that's fair, that's a better way to word it.
Speaker 1 (54:34):
Thank you, it's been bugging me since we started
recording.
It's just like let them just begay.
Speaker 2 (54:40):
It's like if JK Rowling was trying to write gay
characters, although she neverwould, because Okay, anyways,
side note.
Speaker 1 (54:46):
Leave us a voicemail.
I don't even want to ask foranything else, I want a
voicemail.
What do you think about this?
Speaker 2 (54:52):
Or your own alien experiences, but voicemail
Number linked below.
Speaker 1 (54:57):
Alright, thank you for listening.
It was a great, wonderful time.
The most important thing youcan do for us is to creep a
really little eyeballs before wesay goodbye.
Speaker 2 (55:05):
Also, if anybody's been here since episode one,
thank you for sticking with usthrough a hundred and freaking
50 of these.
Speaker 1 (55:14):
Okay, I'm sorry.
Another little side note.
I don't know if we talked aboutthis Would you guys be okay, or
would you want it, if we tooksome of our first episodes and
we re-recorded them as we wrotethem in, like a better quality?
Would y'all be cool with that?
Speaker 2 (55:29):
Yes, let us know, because we're thinking about it.
Speaker 1 (55:32):
Because we did some really cool episodes that we're
proud of, but we just weren'tprepared as far as like we're
much better writers now andresearchers.
I don't know if I want torewrite and research them.
I think I want to do them asthey are, but I think we should
re-record them as we are becausewe're more confident, we have
better sound and just likebetter banter.
I don't know if I want to.
Speaker 2 (55:51):
If you want to rehear the first 50, you let us, let
us know okay, uh, but anyway.
Speaker 1 (55:57):
So the most important thing you can do for us is to
creep a real you little eyeballs.
Goodbye, bye.
I'm home with the dogman At theIrish shop, locked in the
(56:24):
shadows At the Irish shop.
At home with the oddballs Atthe Irish shop.
The door's always open.
At the Irish shop, I'm theAlicia.
The door's always open.
I'm the Alicia.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, And Charlamagne Tha God!