The Skyjacker Who Vanished: The Case of D.B. Cooper

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
I want to dance with the mothman at the ID shop,
baked in the moonlight at the IDshop.
Creep through the graveyard tothe ID shop.
The door's always open at theOddity Shop.

(00:29):
What's up, oddballs?
Welcome back to the Oddity Shop, the podcast, where we bring
you creepy, odd, weird, bizarreand strange stories from around
the globe.
I am one of the two lovelycurators, zach, sitting here
with the most fantastic curator,kara.

(00:51):
Hello, good morning, kara.
What the hell I know?
Is there any better way, though, than to start our day with
recording, because at leastwe're starting it weird, and
with coffee?

Speaker 2 (01:02):
Well, so this is.
I was kind of thinking that weshould.
I was going to vote that.
I think this we should recordearly.

Speaker 1 (01:09):
I'm not upset about it Usually we record late at
night, but it is like nine inthe morning nine in the morning.
We've both gotten a whole daydone already, because we knew we
had to record at nine.

Speaker 2 (01:19):
And now?
Yeah, now we have a whole dayahead of us to do whatever we
want, because we don't have tobe back at a certain time to
record tonight.
So it's great.
I love it.
I'm voting for this.

Speaker 1 (01:30):
All right, all right, we'll see what happens.
We just have to make sure wehave two days off that are the
same, which almost never happens.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
No, I'm saying, we get up at 6 am.

Speaker 1 (01:40):
Oh God, no, no, no, no, no, no, no no.

Speaker 2 (01:43):
Listen.
Official podcasters always berecording at like 7am 7.30am.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
I'm like damn, I don't need to be official that
bad.
What's new with you, dude?

Speaker 2 (01:53):
I've had a really bad week, so I lost my little fur
sibling and I'm really goingthrough it, so I have barely
slept.
So if you see extra baggageunder my eyes, shut the fuck up.
I have barely slept.
So if you see extra baggageunder my eyes, shut the fuck up.

Speaker 1 (02:05):
No, you didn't Okay.
First of all, there's no extrabaggage.
You look amazing.
And second, everyone make sureyou send Kara some love, because
and my parents.
And her parents, because losinga fur sibling is the worst
thing ever.

Speaker 2 (02:16):
And we love you.

Speaker 1 (02:18):
That's really hard, okay, I know we won't linger on
it.
We won't linger on it, but doyou have anything good going on,
or just shit week?
Is this the good part of theweek?

Speaker 2 (02:27):
This is the good part of the week.
You know why?
Because the week is done thereyou go.
And now I'm here recording this, and I'm glad that we did it in
the morning, because now I haveto start my day.
Wonderful.

Speaker 1 (02:40):
Yeah, I don't think I have anything else for you.
What do you have for me?
I had a very interesting weekthis week, so we all know that I
don't handle blood well at alloh god, no, zach doesn't.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
And I think people think you exaggerate or not
exaggerate, but they just don'tknow the extent the extent of
how squeamish I am.

Speaker 1 (02:55):
So I cut the webbing between my finger and my thumb
like a pointer finger and thumband I'm gonna be honest, it's
not nearly as bad as I thoughtit was at the beginning.
But when I first saw it Ithought like I really split it
and would have to go getstitches.
So I did what any normal personwould do and immediately threw
a bandaid on it so that I didn'thave to see it, covered it with

(03:17):
a rag and just held it thereuntil I figured out what to do.
So because I never looked athow bad it was in what to do.
So because I never looked athow bad it was, I in my head, I
made it way worse.
So I went to rinse it and thenmy arm went cold and I went Okay
, I need to get to my phone tocall my roommate.
And then I tried to go up thestairs to get my phone and the
rest of my body went clammy andcold.

(03:38):
And then I woke up at thebottom of the stairs because I
fainted, because my own bloodand the cut is literally less
than an inch big like it is.

Speaker 2 (03:46):
Remember that, that it like it's always like those
thin pieces of skin though thatbleed like so much, so like it's
hard to understand.
Oh shit, I forgot to tell yousomething, but let's finish this
because it correlates.
I can't believe I forgot totell you this oh but anyway, I'm
sitting at Starbucksresearching and I get a random
call from Zach.
I'm that's strange because it'sthe middle of the day and like

(04:07):
we don't normally call eachother in the middle of the day
unless it's like an emergency,oh, this kind of was.
He's like it was.
I'm like hey, are you OK?
You're like no, I'm like OK,what's wrong?
And he tells me he's like Ipassed out, I fell down out I

(04:29):
just woke up.

Speaker 1 (04:29):
I'm like what?
Literally, because I saw my ownblood.
So, thankfully, where's julia?
Like well, right before Icalled you, I called her.
I'm like, hey, um, is there anychance you're coming home from
work early today?
She's like yeah, I'm on my wayhome.
I'm like, great, I need you.
Uh.
So I started to tell her andshe's just like yeah, I could
use my first aid kit like shewas actually like, probably
because she knew it wasn't evengoing to be that bad oh my god,
I love it.
But yeah, so that was my week.

Speaker 2 (04:48):
Yeah, so the thing that I had to tell you was,
obviously, because my week hasbeen so terrible, I didn't get
to tell you.
So that night we also had torecord.
So you were good to recordbecause you were, you were all
banished up and you are right.
So we record pretty late andwell, and we ended pretty late
with recording and so I jumpedin the shower and I'm in the
shower.

(05:08):
This, you and I have to stop.
We have to fucking stop.
I don't know how we can stop it, but we have to stop.
I'm in the shower and all of asudden, as soon as the water
hits my right hand, right whereyou slammed your finger, it
starts fucking burning.
It is like on fire, like Icaught myself.
Like you know, when you get inthe shower, first, get in the
shower and the water, and I'mlike looking at my hand

(05:31):
everywhere, I'm like I'm sofucking confused and then it
dawns on me it's because you'rea fucking idiot and you hurt
yourself and now I am suffering.

Speaker 1 (05:38):
Well, if it makes you feel any better right after we
finished recording.
I went and put an alcohol padon it to really clean it out for
the first time.
Maybe that's when it was prettymuch the same time.
Oh, I hate you.
We gotta stop this like aconnection.
You know what we have to do wehave to open this damn shop.

Speaker 2 (05:55):
Oh yeah, okay, I have a question before you even ask
are you ready?

Speaker 1 (05:58):
yeah, I'm not.
No god, I didn't even have timeto prepare.

Speaker 2 (06:02):
Yes, I, I can make myself ready right, let me give
you a disclaimer before I askyou your question.
Okay, the disclaimer is notabout the question.
You're probably, at one point,going to realize what we're
talking about.

Speaker 1 (06:14):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (06:15):
Zip it, you and the listeners just dwell in it for a
while, and then I'll ask you ata certain point if you know
what we're talking about.

Speaker 1 (06:23):
I will do my best, I know.

Speaker 2 (06:25):
I just want, I want, I want us to all just like sit
in the mystery.
Ok, all right.
Ok, how do you feel aboutplanes?

Speaker 1 (06:34):
OK.
Well, there was a point in mylife where I wanted to become a
pilot and I really liked them.
But also sometimes if I thinkabout planes too much, when I'm
on planes I remember that I'mthousands of feet off the ground
and then I get that little pitin my stomach.
But for the most part, I reallyreally like planes.

Speaker 2 (06:50):
Okay, I was.
My next was going to be likehave you ever been afraid of
flying?

Speaker 1 (06:53):
Like I know, planes don't just fall out of the sky,
but I feel like it's more everytime.
It's always on the takeoff.
I always just get like a littleadrenaline rush, like it's
excitement to travel.
It's that I'm out of control ofwhatever happens from here on
out.
Well, honestly, that happensthe second you walk in an
airport.
Let's be for real, but I hatethat I've only.

Speaker 2 (07:15):
It was probably about six years ago.
We took a janky flight and I,honestly, was trying to like the
entire part of the flight.
I was trying to figure out howI could get a message to my mom
just telling her that I lovedher because I swore we were
going to die.

Speaker 1 (07:31):
Like.

Speaker 2 (07:31):
Aaron and I were like I mean, like it was bad, bad.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
Where was that?

Speaker 2 (07:37):
Florida we were coming home.
Yeah, we were coming home fromFlorida.
Because I remember, by the timeI got out of the airport and
got in the car because myparents were picking me up, I
had to lay in the backseatbecause I was so nauseous and
still so nerved up because Itruly thought I was going to die
.
And ever since then I'm likeyou, like where you said, like
I'll be fine, and then I reallystart to think about the fact
that we are in a plane in theair and then I kind of start to

(08:00):
spiral.
So I just have to watch a movieor something and just like it's
kind of like when you think toomuch about eggs.

Speaker 1 (08:05):
Eggs are disgusting but they're good.
You know what?
I did have one recently where Ithought I was going to die.
It was when I went to arizonaand all there was like that
month where all the planes werefalling out of the sky.
That's right.
And we go to land at mesagateway, which is the tiniest
airport in the world, and likeI'm always one who takes my
airplane mode off early and theperson who's picked me up I'm
like just landed, and then I go,jk, we literally got about six

(08:28):
feet off the ground, pulled backup, the pilot never said
anything, and then we went fullaltitude and did a loop and came
back down.
I'm like I don't want to know.
I was like JK, I guess we'regoing back up.
And then my service went awayagain.
She's like is everything good?
You're like no, I don't have noidea, but I survived what about
skydiving?

Speaker 2 (08:47):
would you go?

Speaker 1 (08:48):
I have always wanted to go and I honestly think,
though, that when it got time tojump, either I would need to be
pushed or there's a good partof me that would pull back,
because, at the end of the day,I really hate heights, and I
don't think they'll push you.

Speaker 2 (09:02):
I think that's part of like the thing if you don't
willingly go, they don't.
Yeah, but so, scott, a couplesummers back I remember already
and it was like booked and aaronwas like I just really don't.
He's like I'm just notcomfortable with you going.
He's like I'm just afraidsomething's gonna happen and I
can respect that.
And I was really afraid too,where I was like do I really
want to spend this much money tojump on a fucking plane?

(09:25):
All right.
So according to skydivecalifornia, though, the most
recent data, um for the unitedstates parachute association,
shows that the number offatalities is actually a hundred
thousand jumps.
It's 0.51 fatality.
That was in 2022 so that's not.
That's not bad, that's good oddsif you translate it into like

(09:49):
easier math.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
Thank you, I was trying.

Speaker 2 (09:50):
It's too early for head math it's one fatality for
every 200 000 jumps.
That's a lot of jumps I.
I feel like that's surprisinglylow I do too, and in 1961, it
was 11.12 fatalities per 100,000skydive jumps.
So it's dramatically changed.

Speaker 1 (10:10):
We've gotten better technology, apparently.

Speaker 2 (10:12):
I was just gonna say so.
Basically, it's a testament toour technology.
Okay.

Speaker 1 (10:16):
Is that also because they now force you to do tandem?
Because I feel like maybe Idon't?
Know like in like the 70s, whenyou just go, you just they gave
you like instructions and youwent and now you have like the
jumper.

Speaker 2 (10:29):
All right, so going back to like a regular flight
for a little bit.
Would you ever be a flightattendant?

Speaker 1 (10:35):
I've thought about it , but I get way too dehydrated.
My ears bother me too much thatI would always be uncomfortable
.

Speaker 2 (10:41):
I think you get used to it eventually, but it would
be awful, and this is what I wasthinking about.
They have so muchresponsibility, so they have the
safety and the security, butthey're also customer service.
They have to manage the cabin.
They have to have like reallygreat communication skills,
because you have to be able totalk to passengers in a
different way, that you'd beable to communicate with the
pilot and the co-pilot andthings like that.

(11:02):
So it's just like the list goeson.

Speaker 1 (11:04):
I don't know if I would never sleep in your own
bed.

Speaker 2 (11:06):
I always look to them , though If I'm uncomfortable.
I look to the flight attendantslike to see if they're
panicking anyway, because then Iknow if I should be or
shouldn't be.
Okay, so you know how youalways get that little
demonstration from your flightattendants and during that
they're like, hey, in case ofemergency, this is what you do
and what you don't do.
And then they talk about thoseemergency exit seats and this is

(11:28):
a little bit of a rant, but thethought of having the pressure
of sitting there gives me a lotof anxiety.
But nobody ever says no.
They're like, hey, are you goodto help and assist everybody if
needed?
And everybody always says yeah,because they don't want to get
up, give up that extra leg space.
But you know damn well, they'renot going to help and assist.

(11:49):
I just can't.
No, I don't believe that.
Every single flight between youand me, have you ever had
somebody say no?

Speaker 1 (11:55):
No, but I'm also that same person because I want that
leg room.
Okay.

Speaker 2 (12:00):
Well, let me just tell you something, and again,
this is kind of a little siderant, but I want all you little
shits like Zachary to rememberthis you actually can be liable.

Speaker 1 (12:08):
I mean, I would probably stand like, stand up
and help, but I think you'd passout.

Speaker 2 (12:29):
I have no argument to stand on here.
Affecting the liability is ifit's good faith and effort.
So if you're a passenger andyou attempt to fulfill your
duties but you're just unable tobecause of circumstances beyond
your control, then you're notgoing to be held liable.
If it's like negligence, like apassenger could be held liable
because their actions orinaction directly cause injuries
or damages during theevacuation, you could be held
liable, okay.
Or the passenger has the dutyto assist to the extent possible
and if they fail to do so, youcould be found liable.

(12:50):
So if, for whatever reason,something happens, you guys all
survive but you were negligentin agreeing to sit there, y'all
could be held reliable.
So, like I said, that's just alittle rant, but I wanted you to
know the responsibility, littlebitches.

Speaker 1 (13:05):
What did I say?
Health, reliable?
I think it would be theopposite Liable, liable.

Speaker 2 (13:11):
Shut up.
You're still reliable for mylife.
Okay, right, I'll let thatslide, all right anyway, All
right, I'm going to talk abouttwo flight attendants, tina
Mucklow and Florence Schaefer.
Okay, zach's trying so hard tosee if he knows this already.

Speaker 1 (13:26):
The name of the Tina sticks out to me, but I'm not
there yet.

Speaker 2 (13:31):
You're probably just thinking of Napoleon Dynamite.

Speaker 1 (13:34):
No.

Speaker 2 (13:36):
All right, it doesn't matter, stop guessing.

Speaker 1 (13:37):
Okay, okay, okay.

Speaker 2 (13:38):
All right.
So the flight we're working for, or the flight that they were
working for, is Northwest OrientAirlines, and it was flight 305
.
And, if you wanted to know, itwas a Boeing 727-100.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
Why is it always a Boeing?
Damn it.

Speaker 2 (13:55):
So the flight contained 36 passengers and a
total of six crew members, whichincluded Tina and Florence.
Okay, and on the eve ofThanksgiving 1971, Flight 305
was leaving PortlandInternational Airport heading to
Seattle Tacoma InternationalAirport.
Sea tech.
I realize I have buttons on myvest.
I'm trying very hard not to hitthem, Sorry, guys, All right.

(14:21):
So, like a lot of stories aredifferent accounts and some
details change.
With that being said, I'm goingto do my best to give you all
the information that I can, butwe've got different you know
what is it Perspectives from alot of different people.

Speaker 1 (14:33):
Look at you sounding your own words out in the
morning, 305 departed on time at2.50 pm.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
Now it's either shortly after taking off or
somewhere around three-ish whenthe plane, like after the plane
was taking off.
So these are those smalldetails that it's like.
I don't know if it matters, butI'm just letting you know.
Okay, A passenger in 18E gave anote to Florence.
Now some accounts say that herand Tina were getting passengers

(15:05):
drinks, which would mean thatthey were well into the air,
because you don't start servingdrinks.

Speaker 1 (15:10):
Yeah, you have to be at altitude again.

Speaker 2 (15:12):
I don't know, but they were serving drinks.
The passenger in 18E ordered abourbon and a soda before giving
Tina the note.

Speaker 1 (15:22):
Bourbon on a flight is my kind of guy or girl.

Speaker 2 (15:25):
She either looked at it right away or she took it.
It's, it's again.
But either way, she either putit in her purse, thinking that
it was like a lonely businessmangiving her her number because
apparently that had happened.
So if we go with that story,with her putting it in her purse
, the passenger then whisperedto her miss you better.

(15:46):
Look at the note.
I have a bomb.
I don't again.
I don't know if she put it inher purse and he said that after
her handed it to her and shedidn't look right away.
Either way, that's what thispassenger is quoted telling her
I feel like okay, it kind ofthat.

Speaker 1 (15:59):
I don't want to give the criminal any credence here,
but I would be so like if heplanned this whole thing out and
was like I'm gonna give her thenote and then he still has to
say it audibly like defeatingthe purpose of the note well, I
think it's because she didn't, Iwould be his plan is already
falling apart I think that shedidn't look at it right away
yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Like he planned the whole thingout for him to look at it right
away, then still has to audiblysay it now.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
Either way, I think that this plan, this plane, had
to have been in the air for sometime, because you wouldn't hand
a note stating that if you werestill taking off, or, shortly
after, because they would justland the plane yeah, yeah, no,
like the flight attendants can'teven get up until right, all
right.
So at this part in the flight,though, the ladies were supposed
to be buckling into their jumpseats, but florence stood up and

(16:44):
she sat next to the passengerin 18E.
So Tina recounts in a RollingStone article.
This is her quote.
This was not the normalprocedure, because at this point
we're almost lifting off therunway.
See, this is why it's like very, it's very wishy-washy, because
Tina says different things thanFlorence says, so it's hard to

(17:04):
determine if you're in firstclass, though, you also get
service on the ground still he'sall the way in the last row.
He's 18e.
It's the last, like the lastrow, I know I'm telling you.
It was hard for me to actuallypinpoint what was then again it
was the 70s, maybe everybody gotthis is also very true and I
just put in here.

(17:25):
so this is where I say much ofthe little details are different
because of different accountsTina, florence, whatever, gotcha
.
So at this moment, againthinking that this is very
strange and not protocol, tinasees Florence motion to her to
pick up a piece of paper thatshe had dropped.
So apparently Florence droppedthis piece of paper on the
ground and was kind of motioningto Tina like get your ass over

(17:45):
here and look at it.

Speaker 1 (17:46):
Gotcha.

Speaker 2 (17:46):
She reaches for this note and the note read Miss, I
have a bomb here and I wouldlike you to sit by me.
So now Tina knows that Florencesaw this note, is now sitting
next to him because that's theinstruction.
And so she's like I havegoosebumps right now because,
like, what the hell?
Yeah, what do you do?
I don't know Either.

Speaker 1 (18:02):
I have goosebumps right now because like what the
hell yeah?

Speaker 2 (18:04):
What do you do?
I don't know Either way.
Whoever saw the note first orwhatever, that was what it was.
That's everybody collectivelysays.
That's what it says.

Speaker 1 (18:10):
It was written in neat, all capital letters, I
feel like at that point my notfear of heights or plane or
anything but claustrophobiawould set in.

Speaker 2 (18:24):
Yeah, probably.
I don't know what would happento me.
To be honest, I think I mightget an adrenaline kick and be
like I don't know, I reallydon't, yeah.
So Tina calls Captain William AScott and explains what's
happening.
So she calls the cabin and waslike shit's gone down.
Quite literally Florence isstill sitting next to 18E, as
we'll kind of call him, and shekind of asked to see the bomb.
I think probably because shewanted to know if this is real

(18:46):
or not.
But I'm sorry, if somebodyshowed me anything that remotely
looked strange, I'd be like,yeah, that's a bomb, I don't
know.
So she is shown a briefcasewith two rows of four red
cylinders, which she assumedwere dynamite.
Attached to the cylinders werea wire and a large cylindrical
cylindrical battery.

Speaker 1 (19:04):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (19:05):
Which also resembled a bomb.
So she has no idea what thefuck this shit is.
She's like bomb dynamite.
I don't know, but this lookscrazy.
All right, so then she proceedsto write out his demands.
So he requests $200,000 in aknapsack by 5 pm.
He wants two front parachutes,two back parachutes, and he

(19:25):
wants the money in negotiableAmerican currency.
So with him requesting two setsof parachutes, it was implied
that he is planning to takehostage.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:35):
Now if I were fucking Tina writing all this shit out,
I'm just going to assume.
No, I'm sorry, Florence, If I'mFlorence writing all this shit
out, I would assume that I'mgoing to be this hostage.

Speaker 1 (19:44):
Yeah, yeah, that second parachutes for you, girl.

Speaker 2 (19:47):
But you know, this is obviously to discourage the
authorities from supplying themwith non-functional equipment,
because if they think one of thepassengers or flight attendants
or crew is going to be harmed,they're not going to do that.

Speaker 1 (19:58):
Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (19:59):
Florence now takes the demands to the captain,
while Tina then has to take thespot sitting next to him.
That's why I keep gettingconfused.
Okay, so now Florence is theninstructed to just take mental
notes of everything that isgoing on, like everything that
she notices.
So she comes back out and andshe's basically just she's not
sitting next to him anymore.

Speaker 1 (20:18):
now tina is, but she is told to just take a mental
note by the captain or she'stold by captain mental note the
shit out of everything that'shappening, keep everybody calm.

Speaker 2 (20:27):
But just okay, whatever, and I'm sorry I am
losing my voice y'all, Iapologize.
So I'm the delusional, though,because I think I would honestly
just be like chilling with himand be like what you want, like
I'll make it happen, like he'smy new bestie and wherever we're
going, I'm just gonna still bea ride or die after, like what
do you need from me?

Speaker 1 (20:47):
just keep bringing him bourbon until eventually he
passes out, and then you're goodmaybe um, okay.

Speaker 2 (20:51):
so after informing the cockpit of the original
demands, the hijacker adds somemore details.
So, once landing at SeaTac,fuel trucks were to be met at
the plane and all passengerswere to remain seated while Tina
brought the money aboard.
He stated he would release thepassengers after he gets the
money and then the last itemsbrought on board would be the

(21:12):
four parachutes.
Items brought on board would bethe four parachutes.
Now I need you to remember that36, well, now 35, because he's
not really considered apassenger are on this flight and
they have no idea any of thisis happening.

Speaker 1 (21:25):
Which also speaks to the intensity of a job, of the
flight attendant.

Speaker 2 (21:31):
That's why I couldn't do it.

Speaker 1 (21:32):
Yeah, because now, all of a sudden, you're bomb
squad and if either of them showfear, that entire plane is
devolving into chaos.

Speaker 2 (21:41):
All right.
So Tina said I can rememberlooking at the seat pocket in
front of me and seeing that barfbag.
Instead of reaching for it, Iprayed for him, for his family,
and for forgiveness for him too,and then I kind of let it go
and I felt at peace.
Peace and I just focused onwhat I had, what had to be done.
So all these people are mostlikely flying to their families

(22:03):
for Thanksgiving the next dayand she's literally thinking of
how she's responsible for all ofthose people if they don't make
it Like that is what she'stelling herself but that's what
she's telling herself to justget through it, Like if I just
do this and all of these peopleare going to get home safely.
We've now made the SeattlePolice Department aware and the
FBI of the hijacking which iswhat they call the FBI in Grand

(22:27):
Theft Auto.
That's funny.
So the ransom was authorizedand everyone was ordered to
cooperate with the hijacker.
This flight is only 30 minuteslong.

Speaker 1 (22:39):
That's what I was thinking.
It can't be.
It's not a very far distance.
They're going.

Speaker 2 (22:42):
So co-pilot Bill Ratajk, I believe, is how you
say it started, blaming theflight delay on needing to burn
fuel because of minor mechanicalproblems, because they needed
to delay the flight so that theground could get all the demands
and be collected for the timeof arrival.
Because, you know, they're allafraid if we don't have
everything by the time this planlanes, he's going to detonate

(23:04):
the bomb they don't know.
So again, all of these peopleare freaking oblivious, which is
mind blowing to me.
Okay.
So, as you can imagine, tina'strying to keep it together and
so she starts kind of likechatting with him because she's
like, okay, this man is playingGod with like 40 people's lives
right now, or over 40.

(23:24):
I just need to keep him calm,I'm just gonna start chatting
with him.
So she asks him why NorthwestAirlines?
And he chuckled and respondedit's not because I have a grudge
against your airlines, it'sjust because I have a grudge.

Speaker 1 (23:38):
Do you remember Northwest and Southwest?
That used to be the best to fly.

Speaker 2 (23:42):
Well, this wasn't technically Northwest Orient.

Speaker 1 (23:45):
So I think it changed .
But yeah, I just remember as akid they had good food.

Speaker 2 (23:48):
I would be pissed, though, if that was the answer
that I got from him.

Speaker 1 (23:52):
Like I need a little bit more than that, buddy him
like I need a little bit morethan that, buddy, but again, I'm
still gonna be your bestie,yeah, I mean, at least I'd be
like well, at least you're notmad at like I don't know, I'd
feel a little bit better becauseif he the grudge was actually
against the specific airline I'dbe a lot more fearful like if
he's just pissed at the world,then you know yeah all right.

Speaker 2 (24:10):
So, uh, he kind of kept chatting, even telling her
that you know, she was tellinghim where she's from, where she
lives, and he even told her likeit's a very nice place where
she lives.
So in return, tina asked likewhere he was from and he kind of
became upset and refused toanswer, obviously because that's
like an identifying factor tohim.
So I get it.
He asked her if she smoked andoffered her a cigarette.

(24:31):
She informed him that she doesnot, she quit, but she's still
wild but she's still accepted.

Speaker 1 (24:36):
While that you used to be able to smoke on a
pressurized.

Speaker 2 (24:40):
Here's the thing You're hijacking a plane.
Even he probably would try tosmoke it regardless.

Speaker 1 (24:45):
But I mean in the 70s , they had ashtrays at your seat
in the planes.

Speaker 2 (24:48):
All right.
So now we've been circling overSeattle for some time like
burning fuel roughly two hoursto be exact.
So obviously passengers aregetting frustrated because this
30-minute flight is now you know, like two hours and they don't
really know what's happening.
So george labosaner, I believe,stated that he visited the

(25:11):
restroom that was behind tinaand the hij multiple times.
He clearly had bladder issues.
He said that during one visit apassenger with a cowboy hat was
stopped in the walkway talkingto Tina and asking her questions
about the delay and themechanical issues.
And George stated that the manthat was sitting next to her
seemed amused at first but thengot really annoyed at all the

(25:33):
questioning and eventuallypersuaded the man with the
cowboy hat to sit back down.
Tina remembers it a littledifferently, which everybody I
don't know because she's so highstrung and she knows what's
happening.
I can see your memory beingeither like really on point or
just all over the place, right.
She remembers this interactionas the man in the hat asked for

(25:54):
something to read, like amagazine, because he was getting
really bored and he wantedsomething to pass the time.
So she proceeded to lookthrough some that were kind of
sitting behind that chair, likein her little area or whatever.
So she, him and the guy withthe cowboy hat started to kind
of like filter through.
I think they found like a timemagazine.
He settled on that and then,after he picked out the magazine

(26:15):
, the hijacker said to her likehe threatened, threatened if
that is a sky marshal.
I don't want any more of that,because he was thinking that
this was kind of like some sortof like setup.

Speaker 1 (26:24):
Oh, yeah, which to me .
Why would he have like toldthis person to sit down?
Because I feel like that if youtell and start to like one
passenger demand what anotherpassenger does in a place where
everyone's already tense, likethat could devolve so quickly.

Speaker 2 (26:40):
It could, but I don't know if it was like
aggressively said that or if hewas just like persuaded him like
hey, man, it's going to be OK,just like have a seat type of
deal.
I don't know, it wasn't reallysaid.
So, on the ground, fbi iscollecting whatever Seattle
banks like, from whatever banksthey can, and they got ten
thousand unmarked $20 bills.
I mean, you know it takes timeto get the money together, all

(27:02):
right, Now, just because theyaren't marked doesn't mean that
the FBI didn't take some sort ofprecaution.
So the bills were photographedto have the record of all the
serial numbers.
So they did have all that.
So that also took a lot of timebecause that is a lot of damn
bills $10,000, $20 bills you'retaking pictures of.

Speaker 1 (27:20):
And there ain't no digital cameras back then.

Speaker 2 (27:22):
Right.
So while that was beingcollected, the FBI, the setup
from the FBI the Seattle PoliceDepartment was able to collect
two front parachutes from askydiving school and two back
ones from a local stunt pilotwhat are front parachutes like
you wear it literally on thefront of your body I think
there's different types.
I'm gonna be completely honestwith you.
There's so much details in thisthat I didn't even have time to

(27:45):
look at that shit.
Y'all can tell me in thecomments.
So around 5 24, the messagethat the money that and the
parachutes were waiting and thehijacker was informed that they
were preparing to land.
So now we're already behindschedule because he wanted it
all by five but it ain'thappening, bitch.
So at 546, flight 305 landed atSeaTac 18E, gave permission on

(28:08):
where to park and he wanted itaway from the main terminal and
he also demanded that only onerepresentative be chosen to
approach the plane.
The front door to the plane wasto be the only entrance and
exit.
So Al Lee was chosen to be theone delivering the money in the
parachutes and he was aNorthwest Seattle operations
manager and I found this partreally surreal to me because he

(28:32):
obviously just came to work thatday.
So he had his airline uniformon and they actually made him
change into like street clothesbecause they wanted it to be
less likely of the potential tobe mistaken for law enforcement
when he walked.

Speaker 1 (28:45):
Yeah, that makes sense Because a lot of times,
like the airport, uniforms kindof look really official yeah.

Speaker 2 (28:51):
So I just that was so like, oh, I got goosebumps
because I'm like can you imagineyou just went to work one day
just to do your normal shit andthen this is what you're having
to deal with.
No thanks, I'm good.
So Tina collected the moneyfrom Al and then she walked it
all the way down the aislethrough all the passengers and
she handed it to the hijacker.

Speaker 1 (29:09):
What are the passengers think at this point?
Because that now parking faraway like they don't know
anything.

Speaker 2 (29:25):
They literally just they know they, I, I looked and
nobody knew until aftereverybody was off the plane that
any sort of anything happened.
Wow, and really that's justbecause when they got off the
plane they were all rushed byofficials, reporters, because
everyone on ground knew what washappening At this point.
Uh, he received the money, likeI would just said, the
passengers still don't know.
He's kind of counting it andinspecting it for any tracking
devices, um, and tina's tryingto make like nervous small talk,

(29:46):
like kind of kiddingly askedfor some of the money, and I
think I would have done thegoddamn same shit oh yeah, we
would have been making sarcasticremarks the whole time.
Proceeded to hand her a packetof bills.
Oh well, at least she'sthoughtful.
That's what I thought.
I don't think he's an assholethis entire time.
To be completely honest, Likehe's giving her cigarettes, he's

(30:06):
talking to her.
I mean, I know he's hijacking aplane.
He's not rude to anybody.
He's not threatening passengersLike listen, he had one agenda.
I know she explains that it'sagainst policy to accept tips.
What a queen.
But bitch, I'm taking it.

Speaker 1 (30:19):
I would have taken it .
I'm like you're FBI, Got yousome back.
Where's my cut?

Speaker 2 (30:23):
Apparently he had already tried to tip her and
another attendant earlier andthey both said that they
couldn't take it.
He can't be that bad.

Speaker 1 (30:31):
I feel like, though, if I was in the tina or uh
florence's position, right, likethat would give me so much
peace to know, like, if wecomply, things are gonna go well
, because, like he's trying togive me.
You want to tip somebody ifyou're gonna kill them no or
maybe you would, I don't know.
Yeah, he could get it backreally easy exactly okay.

Speaker 2 (30:50):
So now all the passengers are off the plane um,
it's just the crew and thehijacker.
Tina retrieves the parachutesfrom al, which took her a couple
trips because you know they'rekind of heavy and she's right,
whatever.
At one point, while tina wascollecting the parachutes, which
took multiple trips, like Ijust said, um, she asked if she
could get her purse.
I'm not quite sure why heresponded with I won't bite you,

(31:13):
basically like, yeah, go getyour fucking purse.
So another flight attendantasked if she could leave and he
allowed her and Florence toleave, saying whatever you girls
would like.
They left Tina.

Speaker 1 (31:28):
I mean you know.

Speaker 2 (31:30):
No.

Speaker 1 (31:37):
If I was Tina, though .
I would rather a couple, likeeveryone who can get to safety,
get to safety okay, as we'refeeling, if I have the chance,
I'm leaving you with a person atthe bottom all I'm saying fuck
you, I would never leave you.

Speaker 2 (31:44):
I'd have to take care of Delilah.
Goodbye, aaron would be here asrefueling was started.
There ended up being like adelay.
I don't know what the issue wasthat there actually ended up
being a real issue, not evenjust because they were trying to
delay this.
There really was an issue withrefueling.
So I cannot imagine the crew,though, because they're just
thinking we just want to get upin this plane, go where the fuck

(32:04):
we need to go and be done, andnow we're having issues like I
want to get over, get thisunwanted adventure over, Right?
So he ends up telling Tina thatthe money was brought in the
incorrect bag and not a knapsack, because that's what he
specifically asked for.
So then he kind of was tellingher that he had to have a
hiccups from coffee to improviseand he had to cut open a canopy

(32:27):
from one of the reserveparachutes and he shoved the
money into an empty parachutebag.
So she kind of watched him dothis like she's whatever.
Oh, he wanted something secureparachute bag, so she kind of
watched him do this like she'swhatever.
Oh, he wanted something secure.
So, still trying to fuel theplane, the federal aid of
aviation administration asked toface to have a face-to-face
meeting with the hijacker, whichhe obviously fucking refused,

(32:47):
prompting him to get upset.
And then he was relaying themessage to tina like this
shouldn't take so long, let'sget this show on the road.
Like he's started to getirritated.
It ended up taking three trucksto finally be able to properly
fuel, and then, once thathappens, he gave his directives.
So a southeast course towardMexico City at the minimum

(33:10):
airspeed possible, withoutstalling the aircraft,
approximately 100 knots altitude.
He also specified the landinggear must remain deployed, the
wing flaps must be lowered 15degrees and the cabin must
remain unpressurized.
So he was informed, though,that there would be a need to

(33:30):
stop to refuel, and the crew andhimself settled on Reno to be
the stop.
Additionally, he demanded totake off with the rear exit door
opened and its air stairextended, so he was denied this
due to safety concerns and hesnapped yeah, that would create
so much drag.
So he snapped and said it can bedone, do it.

(33:53):
However, he didn't really argueanymore.
I think probably because he'sjust trying, like let's get this
going.

Speaker 1 (33:58):
I can see the door being open.
But this how would you fly thatplane with the stair out?

Speaker 2 (34:03):
well, I don't know.
So he didn't argue anymore andhe just said he would lower the
staircase when they went in theair.
Okay, so again he's like ah,fuck it.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
Whatever, he's very easy going, you know if I'm
gonna be hijacked by anybody, Ithink I'd rather be him, yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:17):
So flight 305 took off again at 740.
So it is quite a delay.

Speaker 1 (34:23):
Yeah, he's way behind schedule.

Speaker 2 (34:24):
So Tina was instructed to stay with him and
there were three jets that tookoff and followed the plane.
Now, this was they followedvery far behind.
This was like no one kind ofknew about it, like he didn't,
and they were to fly in like anS shaped pattern as to not be in
view of the plane, so that youwould never from the plane, you
would never be able to see.

Speaker 1 (34:45):
Right, they would always be like going the
opposite direction.

Speaker 2 (34:48):
OK, after the plane took off, he instructed Tina to
lower the staircase, or that airstair or whatever.

Speaker 1 (34:55):
OK, see, now this is the worst thing he's asked Tina
to do, because everything elseis fine.
Getting near the open door nofucking thank you.

Speaker 2 (35:02):
She hesitated because she was worried that she'd be
sucked out the door.
So it was suggested that sheuse an emergency emergency rope
from the cockpit to tie itaround her waist and secure
herself to a seat.
He denied that because hedidn't want her going to the
cockpit, like he didn't want hertalking to them.
He didn't want her going upthere.
So then she was so very fearfuland very hesitant.

(35:23):
She asked if she could use oneof the cords from the parachute
to basically do the same thingand be like a secure line, and
he told her he would just openit himself.
Good Again, he's just like veryeasygoing, like all right,
whatever.

Speaker 1 (35:37):
He should have done that in the first place, and
then she should have kicked hislittle booty.

Speaker 2 (35:40):
So Tina was then told to go to the cockpit, close the
curtains between coach andfirst class and do not return.
So before leaving she beggedhim to take the bomb with him
and he told her it would eitherbe disarmed or he would take it
with him.
So as she turned to close thecurtain.
So she's walking down the aisle, she kind of turns to close the
curtain.
This is when she sees him tyingthat parachute bag with the

(36:01):
money around his waist.
So he's just tying it aroundhis waist and securing it.
Tina entered the cockpit around8 pm and the indicator light
turned on, stating that thatstair or that air stair had been
lowered okay okay.
So over the intercom they askedif any assistance was needed and
they received a no as a reply.

(36:22):
At least he's responsive, Iknow.
So now they're in a positionthat they can't see what's
happening.
They're not allowed to go outthere and fear that something's
gonna happen and, honestly, theydon't know what he has other
than a bomb.
So they're just stuck in there.
They cannot see anything that'shappening.
They know that the indicatorwent off, that it's open, but
they have no idea what's goingon other than that.

Speaker 1 (36:42):
At least, though, with all his actions so far,
like I wouldn't be too worriedanymore.

Speaker 2 (36:48):
I don't think I would .
I mean I would be nerved up,but I don't know I'd be as
worried either.
Right, so with the possibilityhe could still be on board.
Tina informs him over theintercom that they were
approachingno to refuel and theyneeded to raise that air stair.
She repeats the message twicewith no reply.
Now this is at 1102, so ateight o'clock is when the

(37:11):
indicator light came on again.
We have no idea what happened,but at 1102 they managed to land
with the stair thing stilldeployed that would be be.

Speaker 1 (37:21):
I mean, I don't.
I've never flown a plane.
Well, actually I did get tohold the controls of a plane
once, but I can't imagine that'seasy to do, no.

Speaker 2 (37:30):
And honestly I didn't even get into it, but there was
a lot of issues like when thatopened the pressure through, the
whole thing changed the planelowered and dipped Like it was
not a good ride.
Changed the plane lowered anddipped like it was not a good
ride.
It was crazy, but they managedto safely land.
Fbi agents, state troopers,sheriff deputies and Reno police
surrounded the perimeter of theplane but not wanting to enter

(37:53):
in case he was still in thereand the bomb gets detonated.
So Captain Scott did a searchof the cabin and concluded that
the passenger, the money andsome parachutes were gone and he
searched for like 30 minuteslike he did a search of the
cabin and concluded that thepassenger, the money and some
parachutes were gone and hesearched for like 30 minutes
like he did a thorough likesearch.
Yeah, just to make sure hedidn't like stow away.
Yep, and then the bomb squadthen did an additional search,
concluding the plane was safe,all right.
So 18E had a legitimate ticketfor this flight upon checking,

(38:19):
and the name on the ticket readand here's where I will let you
guess db cooper well, you'd bewrong because it was dan cooper
oh, come on, I was still rightum.
So, as we find often in thepress, uh, they like to stick
their nose into anything.
And because this was allhappening, um, that's no
different in the case ofhijacking of a plane full of
passengers.

(38:40):
So James Long, rushing to hithis deadline, reported the
passenger in 18E was DB Cooper,and it was Dan Cooper.
So DB was an error.
Oh really.

Speaker 1 (38:51):
Yes, I've always just thought that was initials.

Speaker 2 (38:54):
I'm not entirely sure how that mistake happened,
because if you look at theticket it clearly says Dan and
FYI tickets were handwrittenthen.
But it clearly says Dan and fyitickets were handwritten then.
But it clearly says dan cooperreally yes I had no idea that
that was an error so reporterclyde jabin from the united
states press international wireservice actually reported.

(39:16):
Uh, he published the error thatwas made by james but it
already went off on a wildfire.
So regardless of that, the nameis the hijacker's nickname Then
became as we know Cooper theinfamous DB Cooper, who I am so
fascinated and absolutely inlove with DB Cooper.
I've wanted to cover this for avery long time.

Speaker 1 (39:38):
I know I'm surprised it took you this long.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
I love him.
Sorry, guys, all right.
So, having to take all avenuesto try to locate the identity of
the man, they let that lovefrom the plane.
They started with theassumption that he did use his
real name, dan Cooper, which Ithink is crazy that quickly
eliminated clearing.
They did find a Dan Cooper, butthey eliminated it.

(40:00):
He was good.
Then they kind of went off onlooking actually at DB Cooper's,
which doesn't make sense to mebecause that was an error in the
reporting, but they did itanyway.
I mean, it's not like they hadmuch else to go off of, so the
more realistic thing would havebeen that this was like an alias
or like maybe an anagram of hisactual name.

Speaker 1 (40:19):
Right.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
But here's what we do know, other than the snarky
comments.
Db cooper was described as aquiet man.
He was a white man, possibly inmid-40s.
He was white man, a white man.
He was wearing a dark coloredsuit with a white shirt and a
black tie.

Speaker 1 (40:35):
He also had a black raincoat and brown dress shoes
you know, I know that like inthe 70s flying a tire, like you,
dressed up for flight, but ifI'm planning to jump out of the
plane, I don't think I'm wearingall that.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
Appearance wise, he had dark hair and brown eyes, so
not really identifyingcharacteristics, because that's
pretty common.
Here's what I found interesting, though the clothes he's
wearing doesn't stand out assomeone that would jump out of a
plane.
Zach just had to interrupt, um,and he didn't have an
additional like, any additionalbags like of clothing or

(41:09):
anything.
However, when casually talkingwith him Tina, like with Tina
during the flight, he madecomments of the area just from
looking out the window andimplying that he knew exactly
where he was in all hissurroundings.
So he kept making comments likeoh, that's this, that's that
Like.
So he knew where he was Right.
Additionally, when bringing theparachutes to DB, as we'll call

(41:32):
him, she gave him aninstruction guide on how to use
them and he told her he wouldnot be needing that.
So he clearly knew.
He's so confident, I know I Ilove it so, not knowing exactly
when he jumped, it was somewherebetween seattle and reno.
That's really all we do know.
Flight 305 didn't see anyindication that the jets or the

(41:52):
jets following never sawanything of the man flying, you
know, free, falling out of theplane.
Now it was dark, it was cloudy,like it's hard to see and if
there's no indication so 12 dayslater, the air force uh was
approved to use a sr71 blackbirdto retrace that's my favorite
photograph photograph the flightpath and overall.

(42:16):
The blackbird made five tripsback and forth um attempting to
find any indication of the jump,but nothing came up and, uh,
all the photographs were justbecause of the weather.
They just weren't clear.
So fbi agents did additionaltests, like recreating the cabin
pressure and the flight pathwith um even pushing a 200 pound
sled out of the air stair, justto kind of do like a whole,

(42:40):
like replay of what happened,what the um, the flight crew,
felt and things like that, tokind of get a better idea I
guess you might like feel himjump from the plane and they
could almost like pinpoint time,sort of thing no, but they can
indicate when the like from theflight path when the plane went
down, like when the nose wentdown when it had to go back up.
So based on that and the time,they can kind of indicate, okay,

(43:03):
so it opened here, pressurechanged here, so they kind of
had like a timeline we're donewith this stuff, but they kind
of path out a timeline and whereit actually would have been.

Speaker 1 (43:13):
They're narrowing down the like where he could
have possibly jumped yes.

Speaker 2 (43:17):
So with all of that it was better determined that db
most likely landed near thesouthernmost outreach of Mount
St Helens, located near ArielWashington.
So now having like a location.
The FBI did a door to doorsearches.
They did on farms, they did itin homes, largely forest terrain

(43:38):
, they all did by foot and did ahelicopter search from above.
They did the works.
So they even had patrol boatslocated in the local rivers and
man-made lakes, like they were,you know, looking everywhere.
Uh, oregon army national guarddid another repath of the flight
plan and they did find brokentree tops and pieces of plastic

(43:58):
and what could be parachute-likeresidue, but nothing relevant
ever came up.

Speaker 1 (44:03):
Okay, yeah, I do remember that part.

Speaker 2 (44:05):
Yeah.
So once spring hit, acollection of 200 soldiers and
volunteers army, everything likeall kinds of people conducted
another ground search andnothing was found except for,
sadly, a skeleton that ended upbelonging to a missing teenage
girl, barbara and deary.
That was actually murdered.
Um, that's kidnapped andmurdered like a week terrible

(44:28):
but at least they found her.

Speaker 1 (44:30):
I was gonna say at least the her family probably
got some peace from it.
I know it's really sad so Icould go on.

Speaker 2 (44:36):
I just gleeked everywhere.
Hopefully you guys saw thatcute.
I could go on forever on thedetails of the search because it
was extensive and all of thescientific things that go into
it, but we don't have all dayand we don't actually know what
we're talking about, so it'd bepointless.

Speaker 1 (44:54):
But we do have all day.
We already told everyone westarted early.

Speaker 2 (44:58):
But nothing was ever found, which is wild to me.

Speaker 1 (45:01):
So crazy.

Speaker 2 (45:03):
The list of all the serial numbers that were stolen
on those bills were distributedto banks, casinos, racetracks,
pretty much everywhere.
Rewards of like the money wereoffered to find if you found any
of those serial numbers allkinds of crazy stuff.
And actually in 1973, theserial numbers were published
again in the Oregon Journal,just as another like hey, we'll

(45:26):
give you some reward money ifanybody has found this.
In 2016, fbi announced theactive investigation of the
Cooper case was suspended andbasically it was due to the fact
that we've been doing this nowfor how many years.
We need to put these resources?

Speaker 1 (45:46):
What is that?
35, 45 years, 45.

Speaker 2 (45:48):
Yeah, we need to put the resources somewhere else.
And also, if he was still alive, he would be roughly 85 years
old at that time.
In 1980, though, aneight-year-old found $5,800 of
the stolen bills while he wasvacationing with his family in
Vancouver, washington.
Crazy, just found them.

Speaker 1 (46:11):
Where was it?

Speaker 2 (46:12):
It was like in a little river thing, like near
that.
There were around 80 suspectsthat they narrowed down.
Pretty extensive suspects thatthey narrowed down pretty
extensive the prime.
The prime suspect, though, wasrichard floy mccoy jr.
Due to him having been arrestedfor a similar hijacking just
five months after, but gettingcaught down to the parachutes,

(46:34):
everything.
So it was kind of like one ofthose things where it's like oh,
that's you know.

Speaker 1 (46:38):
Yeah but see, maybe if I was planning I would try to
blame a cop or, you know like,make it look like somebody
else's MO, so that they chasedthe wrong.
What is that?
The red herring fallacy?

Speaker 2 (46:51):
Well, I think that this guy just saw that this guy
got away with it and was likeI'm going to yeah.

Speaker 1 (46:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:58):
Fair.
He didn't get Fair enough.
But what I will say is hisfamily is now claiming that it
was him due to them finding aparachute in their house after
he passed away.

Speaker 1 (47:10):
Oh.

Speaker 2 (47:11):
So there was some stuff on that but there wasn't
too much or like investigation,but there wasn't too much
reported about it.
So I don't know.
But we do have DNA.
So this could end up beingsolved one day because we have
the tie he was wearing.
Because he took it off, hedon't need a tie to jump.

Speaker 1 (47:27):
You know, boo boo no, you don't want that getting
tangled on anything uh, we dohave multiple fingerprints.

Speaker 2 (47:34):
I mean he had a drink , he sat there, I mean we they
had hundreds of fingerprintsfrom the entire plane that they
took.

Speaker 1 (47:40):
But we have the cigarette butts oh yeah, I
didn't even think about thatthey do have some hair samples,
so this definitely could besolved one day.

Speaker 2 (47:49):
But I did want to read what our redditors think
and so I have a few okay fewredditors.
Okay, I think he lived like 70%die.
I lean more on the survive sidebecause nothing was ever found
except for that $5,800.
Not a bit of parachute cords, ashoe briefcase et cetera.

(48:10):
I also think he probably didlose some money in the jump.
I do not think he buried it onpurpose or any such, and
certainly not to go back andretrieve it later.
He had it and he earned it thehard way.
I don't see him letting go ofit for two seconds.
I also don't believe in thegovernment conspiracies like the
FBI is covering it up or theyinstigated the hijacking.

(48:32):
If they wanted to do that, theydidn't need a guy to jump out
of a back of a plane.
They could have just had himhijack it regular like and then
protected him.
I also don't believe two peoplewere involved, mostly because I
don't think two people can be.
Keep quiet.
They turned on each are likeLeopold and Leob.

(48:52):
They turned on each otherinstantly.

Speaker 1 (48:54):
I don't know the reference.

Speaker 2 (48:55):
I don't either, or I don't think it was Walt Recca.
I believe the story therebecause there's a whole theory
there.
Don't think it was Walt Reca.
I believe the story therebecause there's a whole theory
there, but it may be a storythere is.
He made a call and shoved somemoney in his friend's pocket and
said now you're involved too,or something like that.
That's like a whole other thing, but I don't think it's true.
That's not the way conspiracieswork.
This is what this person says.

Speaker 1 (49:20):
If you have to.

Speaker 2 (49:20):
Oh, this person's the expert on conspiracies.
All right, I guess if hisfriend didn't turn him in at
some point it's because, oh,some after the fat crime, but
not by merely shoving evidenceon you.
Anyway, I apologize for mylengthy posts and my opinions,
and I have probably gone too far, too long, or mistakes.
I tend to think it's somebody,someone not on any of the

(49:40):
suspect lists.
I tend to think it's somebody,someone not on any of the
suspect lists.
Okay, so then this is anotherone.
It's tempting to say he died,since the case has gone so long
and unsolved, but the jump wasvery survivable and the
suspected drop zone is closeenough to residence for him to
have hitched a ride home.
Maybe he was very good atkeeping a low profile after the

(50:01):
crime and it's highly unlikelyhe was any of the names.
It was highly unlikely he wasany of the names that is
frequently suggested.
Then somebody says he opened alittle B&B that was destroyed in
Mount St Helens.
He lived, lost his money andmost of it, and he lived an
unremarkable and lonely lifethereafter.
He was so unremarkable enoughthat he no longer, that no

(50:25):
longer came up on the FBI'sradar.

Speaker 1 (50:29):
And then that's how I want to be remembered.
I know Not remarkable.

Speaker 2 (50:32):
Not remarkable.
So then somebody wrote themoney never hit circulation.
That tells you everything,unless he was just a thrill
seeker who had no interest insuspend or spending the money.
He died on impact and either inthe forest claimed him or he
swept away with the current.
They just miscalculated wherehe jumped from, explaining why
some of the money was found in adifferent location than the

(50:54):
search zone.
What do you think?

Speaker 1 (50:57):
So do you want to hear what I think?

Speaker 2 (50:58):
first, oh, go first.
Okay, I 100% think he survivedOkay.
Okay, he is definitely dead nowbecause I think he'd be like
104.
But I think he survived.
I think, like he said to Tina,he had a grudge and so I believe
that we know who he is based on.
I'm sure something comingforward, but I think that he

(51:22):
survived.
I think that he just had toprove a point and I think
somebody in this case knowsexactly who he is and knew the
grudge that he was holding.
Somebody knows.
So I think it's a little bit ofa cover up.
I don't think he really wantedthe money.
I think it was just part of thecircus act that he put
everybody through.
I think he most likely part ofthe circus act that he put
everybody through.
I think he most likely hadclothing and supplies near where

(51:44):
he jumped because he knewexactly where he was going.
That's why he put them on agoose chase.
He knew when he was going tojump, exactly where, he knew the
surroundings and then, oncelanding, he just grabbed his
little shit, whether he buriedthe money or took it with him,
but he knew it was being tracked.
If he knew all of this, he knewthat that money was going to be
tracked.
It's dumb to think that hedidn't think that.

(52:05):
So I don't think he was evergoing to spend that money.
So he either buried it or it'shiding somewhere.
We're going to find it in awall one year, but I think he
just grabbed his little knapsackand his stuff and he either
just is so unremarkable that hewent undetected or he lived in
the mountain off the land, andthat's kind of what I think.
What do you think?

Speaker 1 (52:24):
Okay, I think that is the way that the story sounds
like.
It makes it way moreinteresting and more conspiracy
based.
But I have always just had afeeling that something went
wrong in the jump and that hedied because I just like.

Speaker 2 (52:37):
But how have we not?

Speaker 1 (52:37):
found anything I mean look at how many people go
missing.
I don't know it could have,except you found money in a
river.
I don't know To me like that,but only five, like almost
$6,000 of it.
Yeah, I don't know, dude, Idon't think he survived that.

Speaker 2 (52:53):
He survived, shut the hell up.

Speaker 1 (52:54):
He survived Because, like you know, there was never
any evidence afterwards,afterwards, and those bills
didn't make it in circulationlike you would have at least a
couple of them just to test it.
No see, I think he thought hewas so smart that he could
outplay anybody, that I feellike he would have tested a
couple of bills to see if theygot tracked or not.
I just I have never thought hesurvived it.

Speaker 2 (53:13):
I don't think he was trying to outplay anybody other
than just the circus act.
That's why he's just so chillwith everything he knew he.
His job in real, in life issomething to do where he knew
protocols.
He knew exactly that you couldlower that staircase,
unpressurize and be safe.
He knew that it could landwithout it.
Like he knew everything.
He knew the flight right.

(53:34):
He knew where he was, he knewthe area.
He knew how to jump withoutneeding instructions, like he
knew what to ask for.
I just don't think.
I think he was super prepared.
I think he had a grudge, andsomebody knows what that grudge
is.
We're just not coming forwardwith it.
I think he survived.

Speaker 1 (53:50):
I mean we probably do know who he is I'm excited for
the update episode one day whenthis goes the way of jack the
ripper, because you know well,there has to be with everything
going on with ancestry, maybewe're going to find out a lot
less stuff of dna, because, godonly knows, did you hear about
that?
no, ancestry dot com just uhwent bankrupt and everyone's

(54:11):
saying that if you got your dnaresults from them, delete it
from their online database,because nobody has any idea
who's going to buy it why areyou ruining my life?

Speaker 2 (54:18):
I just spent hundreds of dollars on there Did you do
Ancestry or 23andMe?
You told me to do Ancestry, you, mom, and somebody else told do
Ancestry, not 23andMe.

Speaker 1 (54:27):
It might be 23andMe Hold on.

Speaker 2 (54:29):
It better be, because I literally just sent Aunt
Pat's and I haven't even gothers back yet.

Speaker 1 (54:33):
Okay, don't freak out .
It's 23andme go and delete itfrom the online database,
because you don't know who'sgonna buy correction correction.
But anyways though, dude,nicely done, I.

Speaker 2 (54:47):
I love that story it's a lot of information.
I know I was probably talkingfaster than I normally do, but I
was trying to get through allof it so that we could have a
good amount of like discussion.
Yeah, but this is somethingthat I love this.
So I have had a fascinationwith db cooper forever and if
you guys ever watch.

Speaker 1 (55:05):
You think it is?

Speaker 2 (55:06):
I don't know who it is.
I just think it's somebody that, just being so vague like I,
have a grudge.
If you had, you don't just doall that just because you have a
vague grudge.
Somebody knows who this is andsomebody knows why he did that.
This was to get attention, tolet somebody know like.

Speaker 1 (55:26):
Maybe he got, though, because they always try to
contribute it to like otherfamous like cases and criminals
and stuff.
I don't think this was somebodyelse.

Speaker 2 (55:34):
Oh, I don't either if you ever watched prison break,
I you know I never watched thatshow I'm gonna re-watch it
because I never finished it.
Uh yeah, because what's hisname is?
Wentworth miller is so fuckinghot and he's gay.
Maybe you can get with himanyway in, he's so hot he's gay,
so he must be in love with himhe's in a music video too, fyi,

(55:55):
but anyway, in prison breakthere's a character I can't
remember his name, but it'salluded that he's db cooper and
Cooper and everybody asks himlike are you DB Cooper?
I never finished Prison Break,so I don't know if it ever came
out that he was supposed to beDB Cooper, but that's another
thing is that people think thathe just got caught in another
crime and he was actually injail, like prison, like.
There's so many differenttheories that I couldn't even

(56:16):
give them all to you.
But he survived and I thinkthat he lived his life just
chill, and the point that he hadto get across was made to
whoever it was supposed to go to.

Speaker 1 (56:27):
I think he got squished like a bug.

Speaker 2 (56:28):
I'm going to do a seance and talk to DB Cooper.

Speaker 1 (56:31):
There you go.
If you figure it out, let meknow.
Are you doing a seance or areyou going to hit up Sam and do a
Sam-once?

Speaker 2 (56:36):
Oh, I'll do a Sam-once.

Speaker 1 (56:38):
There you go.
No nicely done dude.
Uh I I can't believe that ittook us almost three years to do
that story, but thank you yeah,I was like really pumped.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
I actually was up at 6 30 finishing it because I was
adding more shit today.
I'm impressed, all right, uh,so this is a lengthy one, so
we'll let you guys go.
Obviously I want a money bagand a plane for the emojis
perfect, didn't even have tothink about it.
And I don't even know when thisepisode is going up, so I'm not
going to remind you of anythingspecific because I don't know

(57:08):
when you're going to hear this,but I'll remind you of listener
write ins.

Speaker 1 (57:12):
We need like one more for a bonus episode.
Hit me.
One of you guys has a story.
Hit me with your best shot.
You know what shot?
You know what?
If you don't have a story, atleast hit us with your write-in
of who you think DB Cooper was.

Speaker 2 (57:22):
Or actually no.
Can you call us and leave adetailed voicemail about who DB
Cooper is?

Speaker 1 (57:27):
There you go.
Phone number is down in theshow notes.

Speaker 2 (57:30):
Yep, thank you so much.
My voice is.
I can feel it being gone.
I love you, I appreciate you.
Zach loves and appreciates you,and the most important do for
us is to creep a really littleoddballs and goodbye.
Outro Music.

(58:09):
The door's always open and ifyou're in a shop,

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