August 10, 2025 • 24 mins
Dive into the messy, dramatic world of Greek deities and discover why their flaws make them surprisingly effective spiritual allies in modern life. Unlike distant, perfect beings judging your life choices, these gods and goddesses understand what it means to be beautifully, messily imperfect – because they are too.
The psychological advantage of working with Greek gods lies in their relatability. When your deity once turned a lover into a tree because they were having a bad day, suddenly your own relationship mistakes don't seem so catastrophic. There's solid psychological research supporting this approach: working with imperfect divine figures can significantly reduce shame and self-criticism, making it easier to practice self-compassion. But make no mistake – honoring a deity's humanity doesn't mean excusing toxic behavior. Zeus's serial cheating doesn't make infidelity acceptable; these are cautionary tales showing what happens when power goes unchecked.
Meet four powerful Greek allies who can transform your life: Athena, goddess of strategic wisdom, helps overthinkers make decisions and navigate complex situations with clarity. Aphrodite, fiercer than Valentine's cards suggest, teaches self-worth and healthy relationships – she's less "draw your soulmate to you" and more "stop settling for people who don't appreciate you." Apollo cuts through bullshit with his truth-telling energy, perfect for creative blocks and honest self-assessment. And Persephone, whose journey from sheltered daughter to Underworld Queen represents the ultimate transformation, shows how sometimes apparent disasters are breakthroughs in disguise.
Working with these deities doesn't require literal belief – many practitioners view them as psychological archetypes or symbolic representations of human experience. What matters is whether engaging with these energies helps you live better, make wiser choices, and become more authentically yourself. Through simple practices like offerings, meditation, or asking for guidance, you can access divine perspectives that complement your own thinking.
Join our community through the podcast website or the Pagan Temple Discord server at thepagantemple.com to share your experiences with Greek deities or ask questions about incorporating these practices into your life. Remember, even the gods make mistakes – the trick is learning from them. That's where wisdom comes from.
Website
The Pagan Temple
Facebook
Instagram
Youtube
Elder Futhark Runebook
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hey there and welcome back to Old Gods and New Pagans
.
I'm your host, matt Holloway,and if you're just joining us,
welcome to the party.
We're exploring how ancientdeities translate into modern
life.
Today we're diving into theGreek Pantheon and boy oh boy,
do we have some stories tounpack.
Do you think your family hasdrama?
Let me tell you about Zeus andhis relatives.
(00:21):
Seriously, the Olympians makereality TV look pretty tame.
We've got affairs, revengeplots, family feuds that last
centuries and more daddy issuesthan a psychology textbook.
Zeus alone has morerelationship scandals than a
politician.
But here's the thing, and thisis what we're going to explore
(00:41):
today.
All that messy, complicated,very human drama is exactly what
makes Greek gods so damneduseful to modern life.
These aren't distant, perfectbeings sitting on clouds judging
your life choices.
These are deities with tempers,bad habits and serious
character flaws.
In other words, they're a lotlike us.
(01:02):
So why should you care about abunch of ancient soap opera
characters?
Well, because sometimes thebest teachers are the ones
who've made all the mistakesthat you're trying to avoid, and
sometimes you need spiritualallies who understand that being
human or human-like means beingbeautifully, messily, imperfect
.
(01:23):
Today, we're going to look atwhy Greek gods are surprisingly
relatable, how their flaws canactually help us, and practical
ways to work with some of themajor players like Athena,
aphrodite, apollo and PersephonePlus.
We'll talk about how to do thiswithout falling into some
common traps.
Are you ready?
Let's dive in.
So let's start with the obviousquestion why would you want to
(01:48):
work with gods who are basicallycosmic-level disasters waiting
to happen?
Well, here's the thing aboutGreek gods they're not trying to
be perfect role models.
They're not asking you to liveup to some impossible standard
of purity or righteousness.
They're flawed.
They're passionate and oftenpetty beings who understand that
(02:10):
life is complicated andemotions are quite messy,
compared to some other religioustraditions where the divine is
presented as perfect,all-knowing and, frankly, kind
of intimidating.
When your god never makesmistakes, it can make your own
mistakes feel pretty damnshameful.
But when your god once turnedhis lover into a tree because he
(02:31):
was having a bad day looking atyou, apollo, suddenly your own
relationship screw-ups don'tseem quite so catastrophic.
There's actually solidpsychological research behind
this.
Working with imperfect divinefigures can help reduce shame
and self-criticism.
It's easier to practiceself-compassion when your
(02:54):
spiritual allies also needtherapy.
Now let me be clear aboutsomething, and this is important
.
Honoring a deity's humanitydoesn't mean excusing their bad
behavior.
Zeus, being a serial cheater,doesn't make cheating okay.
Ares, starting wars for fundoes not make violence
(03:15):
acceptable.
We're not here to justify toxicbehavior just because a god did
it.
Let me tell you about Zeus andhis terrible relationship
choices, because this is aperfect example of what not to
emulate.
This guy couldn't keep it in hispants if his life depended on
it.
He cheated on Hera constantly,usually by shapeshifting into
(03:37):
some random animal or object.
I mean, the man wants to seducesomeone by turning into a swan
Fucking swan.
Who looks at a swan and thinks,yep, that's attractive?
But here's the thing Zeus'sstories aren't not meant to be
instruction manuals.
They're cautionary tales thatshow us what happens when power
goes unchecked, when youprioritize your desires over
(04:00):
other people's well-being, whenyou think rules don't apply to
you.
The Greek gods give uspermission to be flawed while
still working towards somethingbetter.
They show us that you can bepowerful and make mistakes.
You can be wise and still actlike a fool sometimes.
(04:21):
You can be capable of greatlove and still hurt the people
you care about.
You could be capable of greatlove and still hurt the people
you care about.
This is huge for those of uswho struggle with perfectionism
or imposter syndrome.
If Athena, goddess of wisdom,once got so jealous of a
mortal's weaving skills that sheturned the woman into a spider,
then maybe it's okay that Isometimes get petty about stupid
(04:41):
stuff too.
The key is learning from thesestories, not repeating them.
When we work with Greek gods,we're not worshiping their flaws
.
We're acknowledging that growthcomes through experience, and
experience includes makingmistakes.
So that's the psychologicaladvantage of the Greek gods they
(05:02):
meet you where you are mess andall, and they help you work
with your humanity instead oftrying to transcend it.
Because, spoiler alert, you'rehuman.
You're going to stay human.
Might as well.
Get good at it.
Let's talk about Athena becauseshe's more than just the wise
owl lady that you may have seenon a university logo.
(05:23):
Yes, athena is the goddess ofwisdom, but she's specifically
the goddess of strategic wisdom.
This isn't the kind of wisdomyou get from meditation retreats
or fortune cookies.
This is practical,get-stuff-done wisdom.
Athena is the deity you callwhen you need to figure out how
to navigate office politics,plan a major life change or
(05:47):
solve complex problems thatdon't have an obvious answer.
She's perfect for students,professionals or anyone dealing
with complicated situations thatrequire both intelligence and
strategy.
Think of her as your cosmicconsultant, who specializes in
seeing the big picture whilemanaging all the moving pieces.
Here's a practical Athenatechnique you can use all the
(06:12):
time.
When facing a difficult decision, ask yourself three questions
First, what would be the wisestchoice long term?
Second, what would be the moststrategic approach?
And third, what solution wouldcreate the most benefit for
everyone involved?
That's Athena thinking inaction.
(06:33):
Remember, athena is also thegoddess of skilled crafts and
creative projects.
If you're an artist, writer ormaker struggling with a project,
athena can help you approachyour work strategically instead
of just hoping inspirationstrikes.
She's the voice that says okay,this isn't working, let's try a
(06:54):
different approach.
Now here's where Athena getsreally interesting for the
modern people.
She's incredibly useful foroverthinkers and people pleasers
.
You know those of us whoanalyze every situation to death
and worry about making everyonehappy.
Athena gets it.
She's thoughtful andconsiderate, and she's also
decisive and willing to makethose tough choices.
(07:16):
When you're stuck in analysis,paralysis, channel Athena energy
by asking what would Athena do?
She'd gather the information.
She'd consider the options,make a decision and then act on
it.
She wouldn't spend three weeksresearching the perfect choice
or worry about whether everyoneapproves.
(07:38):
Let's say you're dealing with adifficult co-worker who keeps
dumping their responsibilitieson you.
The people pleaser in.
You wants to just keep helpingto avoid the conflict.
But Athena would look at thisstrategically.
She'd see that constantlyrescuing this person isn't
helping anyone.
It's enabling their behaviorand burning you out.
She'd help you figure out howto set boundaries professionally
(08:00):
and effectively.
Athena energy is especiallyuseful in work conflicts because
she's diplomatic but firm.
She's not interested in dramaor power games.
She wants solutions thatactually work.
When someone tries to drag youinto the office gossip or
work-paced politics ask yourselfwhat would Athena do?
(08:22):
Probably something like I'mhere to get the job done.
Well, how can we make thathappen?
The shadowy side of Athenabecause, frankly, every person
and every deity has a shadowside is that she can be a bit
cold and overly rational.
Sometimes you need to feel yourfeelings instead of
strategizing your way out ofthem, but for those of us who
(08:43):
tend to get stuck in emotionalspirals, a little Athena energy
can be incredibly grounding.
Okay, now let's talk aboutAphrodite, and I want to start
by throwing out everything youthink you know about her from
Valentine's Day cards and lovespell Pinterest boards.
Yes, aphrodite is a goddess oflove, but she's not the fluffy
(09:07):
romantic love deity that modernculture has turned her into.
Aphrodite is fierce.
She's about passion, self-worthand knowing your own value.
She's less draw your soulmateto you and more stop settling
for people who don't appreciateyou.
The most important thing tounderstand about working with
(09:27):
Aphrodite is this you cannotlove others in a healthy way if
you don't love yourself.
I know, I know that's becomesuch a cliche that it's
practically meaningless at thispoint, but Aphrodite doesn't
deal in empty platitudes.
She deals in truth.
Aphrodite energy is aboutrecognizing your own worth and
refusing to accept less than youdeserve.
(09:49):
It's about setting boundariesin relationships, knowing when
to walk away and understandingthat healthy love requires two
whole people, not two halvestrying to complete each other.
Let me tell you about one of myfavorite Aphrodite stories that
perfectly illustrates this wholeconcept.
Aphrodite's stories.
(10:10):
That perfectly illustrates thiswhole concept.
When Psyche was forced tocomplete impossible tasks to win
back Eros, aphrodite wasn'tbeing cruel.
She was teaching Psyche thatlove without self-respect and
personal strength doesn't last.
Psyche had to prove she wasworthy of an equal partnership
and not just someone to berescued.
Here's some real talk.
If you're using spiritualpractices to try to make someone
(10:33):
love you who doesn't, you'remissing the whole fucking point.
Aphrodite isn't interested inhelping you manipulate people
into relationships.
She's interested in helping youbecome the kind of person who
attracts healthy love.
Naturally, working withAphrodite for healthy
relationships means asking thehard questions.
(10:55):
Are you compromising yourvalues to keep someone happy?
Are you giving more than you'rereceiving?
And are you afraid to beyourself because you think the
real you isn't lovable?
Aphrodite would say that thatlast one is complete bullshit,
by the way.
(11:16):
Now let's talk about some ofAphrodite's revenge stories,
because they're actually lessonsin self-respect disguised as
ancient gossip when peopledisrespected her or tried to
deny her power.
Aphrodite didn't just get mad,she got even.
And while I'm not advocatingfor cursing your exes, there's
something to be learned.
There's something to be learnedhere about not letting people
(11:40):
treat you badly.
Aphrodite's message is clearyou teach people how to treat
you by what you accept.
If someone consistently showsyou that they don't value you,
believe them and act accordingly.
(12:01):
So what are some practical,non-instagram ways to work with
Aphrodite?
Energy?
Start with self-care thatactually matters.
I'm not talking about bubblebaths and face masks.
Those are quite nice, but thehard stuff, set boundaries.
Say no to things that drainyour energy.
Do work that feels meaningful.
Surround yourself with peoplewho actually like you for who
(12:27):
you are.
Practice we call it Aphroditehonesty about being truthful
about what you want and need inrelationships, instead of trying
to be the cool person or theeasygoing guy who never has
preferences or complaints andhere's a big one.
Stop apologizing for taking upspace.
Aphrodite is unapologeticallyherself and she expects the same
(12:51):
from you.
You don't need to shrinkyourself to make others
comfortable.
The shadow side of Aphrodite isvanity and manipulation, using
your attractiveness or charm toget things instead of developing
genuine connections.
When you're working with herauthentic energy, you're not
(13:16):
trying to trick people intoloving you.
You're becoming genuinelylovable.
Remember that.
Let's move on to Apollo andPersephone.
These are two deities who areabsolutely essential for anyone
dealing with healing and majorlife changes.
First, apollo Most people knowhim as the sun god, but that's
actually his you could saypart-time job.
Apollo's main gigs are healing,music, poetry and prophecy.
(13:38):
Basically, he's the god oftruth-telling and creative
expression.
He's also the god of medicine,which in ancient times meant
understanding that physical,mental and spiritual health are
all connected.
Apollo energy is perfect foranyone dealing with, say,
creative blocks, struggling withself-expression or trying to
(13:58):
see their situation clearly.
He's the voice that cutsthrough bullshit and helps you
face reality, even when realityis uncomfortable.
If you're an artist, a writer,musician or any kind of creative
person, apollo can help you getunstuck.
But his approach isn't alwaysgentle.
Apollo's creative inspirationoften comes with a dose of stop
(14:20):
making excuses and just do thefucking work.
He's less follow your bliss andmore follow your discipline.
Apollo is also incrediblyuseful for honest
self-assessment.
When you're stuck in patternsthat aren't working, apollo
energy helps you see clearlywhat needs to change.
He's the deity to work withwhen you need to have difficult
(14:43):
conversations with others andwith yourself.
Here's a practical Apolloexercise that you can trump Once
a week, do an Apollo check-in.
Ask yourself three questionswhat truth have I been avoiding?
What creative project have Ibeen putting off?
What do I need to?
Heal, then actually listen tothe answers, even if they're
(15:06):
uncomfortable.
Heal, then actually listen tothe answers, even if they're
uncomfortable.
Now Persephone Her story isprobably one of the most
misunderstood myths in all ofGreek mythology other than
Medusa, and we covered thatpreviously.
The popular version is that shewas kidnapped by Hades and
forced to live in the underworld, but the older versions of the
(15:27):
story suggest something a littledifferent that Persephone chose
to go to the underworld, thatshe claimed her power there and
that she became queen, not as avictim, but as a sovereign.
Persephone is, we can say, theoriginal glow-up story.
She goes from being Demeter'ssheltered daughter to being
(15:50):
queen of the fucking underworld.
That's not tragedy, that'stransformation.
Working with Persephone energyis about recognizing that
sometimes you have to go throughdark periods to claim your
power.
Sometimes you have to leavebehind who you were to become
who you were meant to be.
Sometimes the thing that lookslike disaster is actually your
(16:11):
breakthrough in disguise.
I've been thinking a lot aboutthis lately, because
transformation is messy and ourculture doesn't really prepare
us for that.
We get sold this idea thatpersonal growth should be smooth
and linear.
You read some self-help books,you do some meditation and you
(16:34):
become your best self, butthat's not how any of this works
.
Real transformation often lookslike everything falling apart
before it comes back together.
It looks like outgrowingrelationships, careers and
versions of yourself that usedto fit but, frankly, don't
anymore.
It looks like spending time inyour own underworld, facing the
parts of yourself you have beenavoiding.
Persephone energy helps younavigate these transitions with
(16:57):
grace and purpose.
She reminds you that theunderworld isn't a punishment.
It's where you learn whatyou're made of.
Both Apollo and Persephone areguides through life transitions,
but they approach itdifferently.
Apollo illuminates what needsto change with harsh but
necessary light.
Persephone holds your handthrough the dark periods and
(17:20):
reminds you that you're strongerthan you know.
If you're going through a majorlife change say divorce, career
shift, health crisis, loss of aloved one, etc.
These deities can help you seethe transformation potential in
what feels like destruction.
They remind you that sometimesyou have to let parts of your
old life die to make room forsomething better.
(17:43):
The key with both of them isaccepting that growth isn't
always comfortable.
Apollo won't let you lie toyourself and Persephone won't
let you stay stuck in victimmode.
They're compassionate, butthey're not interested in
enabling your small thinking.
So let's get practical.
(18:06):
How do you actually work withGreek gods in 2025 without
feeling like you're playingancient dress-up?
First, let's address theelephant in the room.
Do you have to literallybelieve in these deities as real
individual beings?
Honestly, no, many people do,and that's great for them.
Others see them aspsychological or human
(18:27):
archetypes or symbolicrepresentations of different
aspects of human experience.
Both approaches are meaningful,valid and effective.
What matters is whether workingwith these energies helps you
live better, make betterdecisions and become more
yourself.
If thinking about what Athenawould do helps you navigate a
(18:49):
difficult situation moreskillfully, then it's working.
If channeling Aphrodite energyhelps you set better boundaries
in relationships, it's working.
Here are some simple ways tostart working with Greek gods
Offerings.
They don't have to becomplicated.
Athena, from what we know,likes olive oil, herbs or
(19:12):
anything related to learning andcrafts.
Leave her a book you'vefinished or light a candle while
you work on a creative project.
Aphrodite Likes flowers, honey,anything beautiful and sweet.
Apollo appreciates music,poetry or anything related to
healing.
Persephone, it's known to likepomegranates, flowers or symbols
(19:34):
of transformation, but honestly, the most important offering
you can make is attention.
Spend time thinking about whatthese deities represent and how
their energies show up in yourlife.
Meditation doesn't have to beformal sitting practice.
You can meditate on deity'squalities while you're walking,
(19:56):
cooking or doing other routinetasks.
Ask yourself how would Athenaapproach this problem.
What would Aphrodite say aboutthis relationship?
How would Apollo see me?
How would Apollo help me seethis situation more clearly?
Simply asking for guidance isincredibly powerful.
(20:16):
Before making a big decision,you can literally ask Apollo
help me see this clearly.
Athena, what's the wisestchoice?
Or Aphrodite, what would servemy highest good in this
relationship?
Question that was kind ofbrought up, you know like is
this just therapy with extrasteps?
(20:37):
You know what?
Maybe it is, and maybe that'sexactly the point.
If thinking about Athena helpsyou make better strategic
decisions, if Aphrodite energyhelps you value yourself, if
Apollo guidance helps you facedifficult truths, then therapy
with extra steps sounds prettygood to me.
The goal isn't to replaceprofessional help when you need
(20:59):
it or to avoid doing your ownemotional work.
The goal is to have additionaltools and perspectives that help
you navigate life moreskillfully.
Let me give you some warningsabout some red flags when
working with any deity, greek orotherwise.
If working with a deity makesyou feel superior to other
people or, like you, havespecial knowledge that others
(21:20):
don't, that's a red flag.
Even spiritual ego is still egoand you might want to work on
that.
If you find yourself usingdeity work to avoid taking
responsibility for your choices,like the gods told me to do
this, that's also a problem.
Deities can offer guidance, butyou're still responsible for
(21:43):
your own decisions, your ownchoices and your own actions.
If working with a deityincreases your anxiety, makes
you feel worse about yourself orencourages unhealthy behaviors,
step back and reassess, becausegenuine spiritual connection
should generally make you feelmore centered and empowered, not
more chaotic.
And finally, if you findyourself getting obsessed with
(22:09):
signs, omens and messages, tothe point where you can't make
decisions without some divineinput, that's not a spiritual
connection.
That's spiritual dependency.
The Greek gods can be amazingallies and teachers, but they're
not meant to run your life foryou.
They're meant to help you runyour own life better.
So here's what we've coveredtoday.
(22:32):
The Greek gods are usefulprecisely because they're flawed
and human-like.
They give us permission to beimperfect while still striving
to grow and do better.
Athena helps us thinkstrategically and make wise
decisions, aphrodite teaches usits self-worth and healthy
relationships, apolloilluminates truth and supports
(22:55):
creative expression, andPersephone guides us through
transformation and helps usclaim our own power in darkness.
These aren't distant,judgmental deities demanding
perfection, cosmic allies whounderstand that being human is
complicated, messy, but alsovery beautiful.
(23:16):
The next episode we're going todive into the Celtic paths and
separating some authenticpractice from touristy nonsense.
Trust me, we need to talk aboutwhat's real and what's
marketing when it comes toCeltic spirituality.
I want to hear from you guyshave you worked with any of the
Greek gods?
What's been your experience?
What questions do you haveabout this approach?
(23:37):
You can reach me through thepodcast website, social media
I'll put some links in the shownotes.
Check us out on the PaganTemple Discord server.
Just go to thepagantemplecomand you can find our community
through that, because, remember,even the gods make mistakes.
The trick is learning from them.
Learn from their mistakes andyour own.
(23:59):
That's where wisdom comes from.
Thanks for listening to OldGods and New Pagans.
I'm Matt Holloway and I willsee you in the next one.
Hey there and welcome back to Old Gods and New Pagans
.
I'm your host, matt Holloway,and if you're just joining us,
welcome to the party.
We're exploring how ancientdeities translate into modern
life.
Today we're diving into theGreek Pantheon and boy oh boy,
do we have some stories tounpack.
Do you think your family hasdrama?
Let me tell you about Zeus andhis relatives.
(00:21):
Seriously, the Olympians makereality TV look pretty tame.
We've got affairs, revengeplots, family feuds that last
centuries and more daddy issuesthan a psychology textbook.
Zeus alone has morerelationship scandals than a
politician.
But here's the thing, and thisis what we're going to explore
(00:41):
today.
All that messy, complicated,very human drama is exactly what
makes Greek gods so damneduseful to modern life.
These aren't distant, perfectbeings sitting on clouds judging
your life choices.
These are deities with tempers,bad habits and serious
character flaws.
In other words, they're a lotlike us.
(01:02):
So why should you care about abunch of ancient soap opera
characters?
Well, because sometimes thebest teachers are the ones
who've made all the mistakesthat you're trying to avoid, and
sometimes you need spiritualallies who understand that being
human or human-like means beingbeautifully, messily, imperfect
.
(01:23):
Today, we're going to look atwhy Greek gods are surprisingly
relatable, how their flaws canactually help us, and practical
ways to work with some of themajor players like Athena,
aphrodite, apollo and PersephonePlus.
We'll talk about how to do thiswithout falling into some
common traps.
Are you ready?
Let's dive in.
So let's start with the obviousquestion why would you want to
(01:48):
work with gods who are basicallycosmic-level disasters waiting
to happen?
Well, here's the thing aboutGreek gods they're not trying to
be perfect role models.
They're not asking you to liveup to some impossible standard
of purity or righteousness.
They're flawed.
They're passionate and oftenpetty beings who understand that
(02:10):
life is complicated andemotions are quite messy,
compared to some other religioustraditions where the divine is
presented as perfect,all-knowing and, frankly, kind
of intimidating.
When your god never makesmistakes, it can make your own
mistakes feel pretty damnshameful.
But when your god once turnedhis lover into a tree because he
(02:31):
was having a bad day looking atyou, apollo, suddenly your own
relationship screw-ups don'tseem quite so catastrophic.
There's actually solidpsychological research behind
this.
Working with imperfect divinefigures can help reduce shame
and self-criticism.
It's easier to practiceself-compassion when your
(02:54):
spiritual allies also needtherapy.
Now let me be clear aboutsomething, and this is important
.
Honoring a deity's humanitydoesn't mean excusing their bad
behavior.
Zeus, being a serial cheater,doesn't make cheating okay.
Ares, starting wars for fundoes not make violence
(03:15):
acceptable.
We're not here to justify toxicbehavior just because a god did
it.
Let me tell you about Zeus andhis terrible relationship
choices, because this is aperfect example of what not to
emulate.
This guy couldn't keep it in hispants if his life depended on
it.
He cheated on Hera constantly,usually by shapeshifting into
(03:37):
some random animal or object.
I mean, the man wants to seducesomeone by turning into a swan
Fucking swan.
Who looks at a swan and thinks,yep, that's attractive?
But here's the thing Zeus'sstories aren't not meant to be
instruction manuals.
They're cautionary tales thatshow us what happens when power
goes unchecked, when youprioritize your desires over
(04:00):
other people's well-being, whenyou think rules don't apply to
you.
The Greek gods give uspermission to be flawed while
still working towards somethingbetter.
They show us that you can bepowerful and make mistakes.
You can be wise and still actlike a fool sometimes.
(04:21):
You can be capable of greatlove and still hurt the people
you care about.
You could be capable of greatlove and still hurt the people
you care about.
This is huge for those of uswho struggle with perfectionism
or imposter syndrome.
If Athena, goddess of wisdom,once got so jealous of a
mortal's weaving skills that sheturned the woman into a spider,
then maybe it's okay that Isometimes get petty about stupid
(04:41):
stuff too.
The key is learning from thesestories, not repeating them.
When we work with Greek gods,we're not worshiping their flaws
.
We're acknowledging that growthcomes through experience, and
experience includes makingmistakes.
So that's the psychologicaladvantage of the Greek gods they
(05:02):
meet you where you are mess andall, and they help you work
with your humanity instead oftrying to transcend it.
Because, spoiler alert, you'rehuman.
You're going to stay human.
Might as well.
Get good at it.
Let's talk about Athena becauseshe's more than just the wise
owl lady that you may have seenon a university logo.
(05:23):
Yes, athena is the goddess ofwisdom, but she's specifically
the goddess of strategic wisdom.
This isn't the kind of wisdomyou get from meditation retreats
or fortune cookies.
This is practical,get-stuff-done wisdom.
Athena is the deity you callwhen you need to figure out how
to navigate office politics,plan a major life change or
(05:47):
solve complex problems thatdon't have an obvious answer.
She's perfect for students,professionals or anyone dealing
with complicated situations thatrequire both intelligence and
strategy.
Think of her as your cosmicconsultant, who specializes in
seeing the big picture whilemanaging all the moving pieces.
Here's a practical Athenatechnique you can use all the
(06:12):
time.
When facing a difficult decision, ask yourself three questions
First, what would be the wisestchoice long term?
Second, what would be the moststrategic approach?
And third, what solution wouldcreate the most benefit for
everyone involved?
That's Athena thinking inaction.
(06:33):
Remember, athena is also thegoddess of skilled crafts and
creative projects.
If you're an artist, writer ormaker struggling with a project,
athena can help you approachyour work strategically instead
of just hoping inspirationstrikes.
She's the voice that says okay,this isn't working, let's try a
(06:54):
different approach.
Now here's where Athena getsreally interesting for the
modern people.
She's incredibly useful foroverthinkers and people pleasers
.
You know those of us whoanalyze every situation to death
and worry about making everyonehappy.
Athena gets it.
She's thoughtful andconsiderate, and she's also
decisive and willing to makethose tough choices.
(07:16):
When you're stuck in analysis,paralysis, channel Athena energy
by asking what would Athena do?
She'd gather the information.
She'd consider the options,make a decision and then act on
it.
She wouldn't spend three weeksresearching the perfect choice
or worry about whether everyoneapproves.
(07:38):
Let's say you're dealing with adifficult co-worker who keeps
dumping their responsibilitieson you.
The people pleaser in.
You wants to just keep helpingto avoid the conflict.
But Athena would look at thisstrategically.
She'd see that constantlyrescuing this person isn't
helping anyone.
It's enabling their behaviorand burning you out.
She'd help you figure out howto set boundaries professionally
(08:00):
and effectively.
Athena energy is especiallyuseful in work conflicts because
she's diplomatic but firm.
She's not interested in dramaor power games.
She wants solutions thatactually work.
When someone tries to drag youinto the office gossip or
work-paced politics ask yourselfwhat would Athena do?
(08:22):
Probably something like I'mhere to get the job done.
Well, how can we make thathappen?
The shadowy side of Athenabecause, frankly, every person
and every deity has a shadowside is that she can be a bit
cold and overly rational.
Sometimes you need to feel yourfeelings instead of
strategizing your way out ofthem, but for those of us who
(08:43):
tend to get stuck in emotionalspirals, a little Athena energy
can be incredibly grounding.
Okay, now let's talk aboutAphrodite, and I want to start
by throwing out everything youthink you know about her from
Valentine's Day cards and lovespell Pinterest boards.
Yes, aphrodite is a goddess oflove, but she's not the fluffy
(09:07):
romantic love deity that modernculture has turned her into.
Aphrodite is fierce.
She's about passion, self-worthand knowing your own value.
She's less draw your soulmateto you and more stop settling
for people who don't appreciateyou.
The most important thing tounderstand about working with
(09:27):
Aphrodite is this you cannotlove others in a healthy way if
you don't love yourself.
I know, I know that's becomesuch a cliche that it's
practically meaningless at thispoint, but Aphrodite doesn't
deal in empty platitudes.
She deals in truth.
Aphrodite energy is aboutrecognizing your own worth and
refusing to accept less than youdeserve.
(09:49):
It's about setting boundariesin relationships, knowing when
to walk away and understandingthat healthy love requires two
whole people, not two halvestrying to complete each other.
Let me tell you about one of myfavorite Aphrodite stories that
perfectly illustrates this wholeconcept.
Aphrodite's stories.
(10:10):
That perfectly illustrates thiswhole concept.
When Psyche was forced tocomplete impossible tasks to win
back Eros, aphrodite wasn'tbeing cruel.
She was teaching Psyche thatlove without self-respect and
personal strength doesn't last.
Psyche had to prove she wasworthy of an equal partnership
and not just someone to berescued.
Here's some real talk.
If you're using spiritualpractices to try to make someone
(10:33):
love you who doesn't, you'remissing the whole fucking point.
Aphrodite isn't interested inhelping you manipulate people
into relationships.
She's interested in helping youbecome the kind of person who
attracts healthy love.
Naturally, working withAphrodite for healthy
relationships means asking thehard questions.
(10:55):
Are you compromising yourvalues to keep someone happy?
Are you giving more than you'rereceiving?
And are you afraid to beyourself because you think the
real you isn't lovable?
Aphrodite would say that thatlast one is complete bullshit,
by the way.
(11:16):
Now let's talk about some ofAphrodite's revenge stories,
because they're actually lessonsin self-respect disguised as
ancient gossip when peopledisrespected her or tried to
deny her power.
Aphrodite didn't just get mad,she got even.
And while I'm not advocatingfor cursing your exes, there's
something to be learned.
There's something to be learnedhere about not letting people
(11:40):
treat you badly.
Aphrodite's message is clearyou teach people how to treat
you by what you accept.
If someone consistently showsyou that they don't value you,
believe them and act accordingly.
(12:01):
So what are some practical,non-instagram ways to work with
Aphrodite?
Energy?
Start with self-care thatactually matters.
I'm not talking about bubblebaths and face masks.
Those are quite nice, but thehard stuff, set boundaries.
Say no to things that drainyour energy.
Do work that feels meaningful.
Surround yourself with peoplewho actually like you for who
(12:27):
you are.
Practice we call it Aphroditehonesty about being truthful
about what you want and need inrelationships, instead of trying
to be the cool person or theeasygoing guy who never has
preferences or complaints andhere's a big one.
Stop apologizing for taking upspace.
Aphrodite is unapologeticallyherself and she expects the same
(12:51):
from you.
You don't need to shrinkyourself to make others
comfortable.
The shadow side of Aphrodite isvanity and manipulation, using
your attractiveness or charm toget things instead of developing
genuine connections.
When you're working with herauthentic energy, you're not
(13:16):
trying to trick people intoloving you.
You're becoming genuinelylovable.
Remember that.
Let's move on to Apollo andPersephone.
These are two deities who areabsolutely essential for anyone
dealing with healing and majorlife changes.
First, apollo Most people knowhim as the sun god, but that's
actually his you could saypart-time job.
Apollo's main gigs are healing,music, poetry and prophecy.
(13:38):
Basically, he's the god oftruth-telling and creative
expression.
He's also the god of medicine,which in ancient times meant
understanding that physical,mental and spiritual health are
all connected.
Apollo energy is perfect foranyone dealing with, say,
creative blocks, struggling withself-expression or trying to
(13:58):
see their situation clearly.
He's the voice that cutsthrough bullshit and helps you
face reality, even when realityis uncomfortable.
If you're an artist, a writer,musician or any kind of creative
person, apollo can help you getunstuck.
But his approach isn't alwaysgentle.
Apollo's creative inspirationoften comes with a dose of stop
(14:20):
making excuses and just do thefucking work.
He's less follow your bliss andmore follow your discipline.
Apollo is also incrediblyuseful for honest
self-assessment.
When you're stuck in patternsthat aren't working, apollo
energy helps you see clearlywhat needs to change.
He's the deity to work withwhen you need to have difficult
(14:43):
conversations with others andwith yourself.
Here's a practical Apolloexercise that you can trump Once
a week, do an Apollo check-in.
Ask yourself three questionswhat truth have I been avoiding?
What creative project have Ibeen putting off?
What do I need to?
Heal, then actually listen tothe answers, even if they're
(15:06):
uncomfortable.
Heal, then actually listen tothe answers, even if they're
uncomfortable.
Now Persephone Her story isprobably one of the most
misunderstood myths in all ofGreek mythology other than
Medusa, and we covered thatpreviously.
The popular version is that shewas kidnapped by Hades and
forced to live in the underworld, but the older versions of the
(15:27):
story suggest something a littledifferent that Persephone chose
to go to the underworld, thatshe claimed her power there and
that she became queen, not as avictim, but as a sovereign.
Persephone is, we can say, theoriginal glow-up story.
She goes from being Demeter'ssheltered daughter to being
(15:50):
queen of the fucking underworld.
That's not tragedy, that'stransformation.
Working with Persephone energyis about recognizing that
sometimes you have to go throughdark periods to claim your
power.
Sometimes you have to leavebehind who you were to become
who you were meant to be.
Sometimes the thing that lookslike disaster is actually your
(16:11):
breakthrough in disguise.
I've been thinking a lot aboutthis lately, because
transformation is messy and ourculture doesn't really prepare
us for that.
We get sold this idea thatpersonal growth should be smooth
and linear.
You read some self-help books,you do some meditation and you
(16:34):
become your best self, butthat's not how any of this works
.
Real transformation often lookslike everything falling apart
before it comes back together.
It looks like outgrowingrelationships, careers and
versions of yourself that usedto fit but, frankly, don't
anymore.
It looks like spending time inyour own underworld, facing the
parts of yourself you have beenavoiding.
Persephone energy helps younavigate these transitions with
(16:57):
grace and purpose.
She reminds you that theunderworld isn't a punishment.
It's where you learn whatyou're made of.
Both Apollo and Persephone areguides through life transitions,
but they approach itdifferently.
Apollo illuminates what needsto change with harsh but
necessary light.
Persephone holds your handthrough the dark periods and
(17:20):
reminds you that you're strongerthan you know.
If you're going through a majorlife change say divorce, career
shift, health crisis, loss of aloved one, etc.
These deities can help you seethe transformation potential in
what feels like destruction.
They remind you that sometimesyou have to let parts of your
old life die to make room forsomething better.
(17:43):
The key with both of them isaccepting that growth isn't
always comfortable.
Apollo won't let you lie toyourself and Persephone won't
let you stay stuck in victimmode.
They're compassionate, butthey're not interested in
enabling your small thinking.
So let's get practical.
(18:06):
How do you actually work withGreek gods in 2025 without
feeling like you're playingancient dress-up?
First, let's address theelephant in the room.
Do you have to literallybelieve in these deities as real
individual beings?
Honestly, no, many people do,and that's great for them.
Others see them aspsychological or human
(18:27):
archetypes or symbolicrepresentations of different
aspects of human experience.
Both approaches are meaningful,valid and effective.
What matters is whether workingwith these energies helps you
live better, make betterdecisions and become more
yourself.
If thinking about what Athenawould do helps you navigate a
(18:49):
difficult situation moreskillfully, then it's working.
If channeling Aphrodite energyhelps you set better boundaries
in relationships, it's working.
Here are some simple ways tostart working with Greek gods
Offerings.
They don't have to becomplicated.
Athena, from what we know,likes olive oil, herbs or
(19:12):
anything related to learning andcrafts.
Leave her a book you'vefinished or light a candle while
you work on a creative project.
Aphrodite Likes flowers, honey,anything beautiful and sweet.
Apollo appreciates music,poetry or anything related to
healing.
Persephone, it's known to likepomegranates, flowers or symbols
(19:34):
of transformation, but honestly, the most important offering
you can make is attention.
Spend time thinking about whatthese deities represent and how
their energies show up in yourlife.
Meditation doesn't have to beformal sitting practice.
You can meditate on deity'squalities while you're walking,
(19:56):
cooking or doing other routinetasks.
Ask yourself how would Athenaapproach this problem.
What would Aphrodite say aboutthis relationship?
How would Apollo see me?
How would Apollo help me seethis situation more clearly?
Simply asking for guidance isincredibly powerful.
(20:16):
Before making a big decision,you can literally ask Apollo
help me see this clearly.
Athena, what's the wisestchoice?
Or Aphrodite, what would servemy highest good in this
relationship?
Question that was kind ofbrought up, you know like is
this just therapy with extrasteps?
(20:37):
You know what?
Maybe it is, and maybe that'sexactly the point.
If thinking about Athena helpsyou make better strategic
decisions, if Aphrodite energyhelps you value yourself, if
Apollo guidance helps you facedifficult truths, then therapy
with extra steps sounds prettygood to me.
The goal isn't to replaceprofessional help when you need
(20:59):
it or to avoid doing your ownemotional work.
The goal is to have additionaltools and perspectives that help
you navigate life moreskillfully.
Let me give you some warningsabout some red flags when
working with any deity, greek orotherwise.
If working with a deity makesyou feel superior to other
people or, like you, havespecial knowledge that others
(21:20):
don't, that's a red flag.
Even spiritual ego is still egoand you might want to work on
that.
If you find yourself usingdeity work to avoid taking
responsibility for your choices,like the gods told me to do
this, that's also a problem.
Deities can offer guidance, butyou're still responsible for
(21:43):
your own decisions, your ownchoices and your own actions.
If working with a deityincreases your anxiety, makes
you feel worse about yourself orencourages unhealthy behaviors,
step back and reassess, becausegenuine spiritual connection
should generally make you feelmore centered and empowered, not
more chaotic.
And finally, if you findyourself getting obsessed with
(22:09):
signs, omens and messages, tothe point where you can't make
decisions without some divineinput, that's not a spiritual
connection.
That's spiritual dependency.
The Greek gods can be amazingallies and teachers, but they're
not meant to run your life foryou.
They're meant to help you runyour own life better.
So here's what we've coveredtoday.
(22:32):
The Greek gods are usefulprecisely because they're flawed
and human-like.
They give us permission to beimperfect while still striving
to grow and do better.
Athena helps us thinkstrategically and make wise
decisions, aphrodite teaches usits self-worth and healthy
relationships, apolloilluminates truth and supports
(22:55):
creative expression, andPersephone guides us through
transformation and helps usclaim our own power in darkness.
These aren't distant,judgmental deities demanding
perfection, cosmic allies whounderstand that being human is
complicated, messy, but alsovery beautiful.
(23:16):
The next episode we're going todive into the Celtic paths and
separating some authenticpractice from touristy nonsense.
Trust me, we need to talk aboutwhat's real and what's
marketing when it comes toCeltic spirituality.
I want to hear from you guyshave you worked with any of the
Greek gods?
What's been your experience?
What questions do you haveabout this approach?
(23:37):
You can reach me through thepodcast website, social media
I'll put some links in the shownotes.
Check us out on the PaganTemple Discord server.
Just go to thepagantemplecomand you can find our community
through that, because, remember,even the gods make mistakes.
The trick is learning from them.
Learn from their mistakes andyour own.
(23:59):
That's where wisdom comes from.
Thanks for listening to OldGods and New Pagans.
I'm Matt Holloway and I willsee you in the next one.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce
Football’s funniest family duo — Jason Kelce of the Philadelphia Eagles and Travis Kelce of the Kansas City Chiefs — team up to provide next-level access to life in the league as it unfolds. The two brothers and Super Bowl champions drop weekly insights about the weekly slate of games and share their INSIDE perspectives on trending NFL news and sports headlines. They also endlessly rag on each other as brothers do, chat the latest in pop culture and welcome some very popular and well-known friends to chat with them. Check out new episodes every Wednesday. Follow New Heights on the Wondery App, YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to new episodes early and ad-free, and get exclusive content on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And join our new membership for a unique fan experience by going to the New Heights YouTube channel now!
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.