Beyond the Pipes: The Hidden Truth About Plumbing

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Ever wondered what plumbers really think when they walk into your home? Reid and Tyler—a master plumber and his apprentice—pull back the curtain on the modern plumbing industry with startling honesty. Their conversation reveals how the business of fixing your pipes has transformed into a sales-driven enterprise where technicians are monitored by AI, evaluated on upselling metrics, and incentivized to find problems you never knew existed.

The duo shares jaw-dropping stories from the field—including floating cat turds in a flooded basement, accidental sewage spills, and discovering that modest-looking homeowners sometimes have multimillion-dollar incomes. They explain why some plumbers intentionally remain "apprentices" despite years of experience, how commission structures can influence recommendations, and why the guy who shows up to fix your toilet might actually be more of a salesman than a technician.

Beyond the war stories, they provide valuable knowledge every homeowner should possess: understanding your water quality could save thousands in premature appliance replacements; knowing where your main water shutoff valve is located could prevent catastrophic damage; and realizing that white crusty buildup on your fixtures signals problems throughout your entire plumbing system.

Whether you're a homeowner wanting to protect yourself from unnecessary repairs or simply curious about the realities of blue-collar work, this candid conversation delivers both entertainment and practical wisdom. You'll never look at your plumber—or your plumbing—the same way again.

Subscribe to hear more unfiltered conversations with skilled tradespeople who keep our modern world functioning behind the scenes. Leave a review to help others discover these vital perspectives from the people who literally keep the shit flowing downhill.

0:14 Welcome to Blue Collar Happy Hour
3:52 Apprentice vs. Master Plumbers
16:29 AI in the Plumbing Industry
35:16 Service Plumbing and Sales Tactics
49:11 Plumber Stereotypes and Uniforms
1:13:57 Nightmare Service Calls
1:31:32 Hard Water and Household Systems
56:46 The Truth About Plumbing Commissions
1:05:13 Commercial vs. Residential Plumbing

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right boys.
Welcome back to another episodeof the on tap podcast.
Today we have a wonderfuledition of the blue collar happy
hour.
We got a couple of plumbers inhere.
We actually haven't seen theircracks yet, but we assume and
we're going to take their wordfor it that they are really
plumbers.
You got me Cody Sam and our twoplumbers in the building, mr
Reed and T-Cav.

(00:22):
Yes, sir, regular Welcome boys.
So you're both plumbers.
Is there different?
Like categorization of plumbing, of plumbers, is there?
like you have to start at arookie and work your way up to a
veteran.
Like what's the steps?

Speaker 2 (00:37):
Well, there's obviously like an apprenticeship
and a journeyman and then amaster.
Know there's three main stepsto it, but there are like drain
cleaners, you know.
So they'll work for a plumbingcompany they're not plumbers
yeah, they're not plumbers.
They're drain cleaners.

Speaker 4 (00:53):
They're not plumbers so, like plumbers, know their
place though, like correct.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
I ain't no fucking drain cleaner yeah, do they call
themselves plumbers, the draincleaners?

Speaker 2 (01:01):
I don't know, do they ?

Speaker 1 (01:03):
like if someone were to ask do they say I'm a?

Speaker 3 (01:06):
drain cleaner, which I can't imagine.
That's like people give a lotof flack to doctors.

Speaker 1 (01:11):
Uh, when they say like oh yeah, I'm a doctor, and
they're like dude, you're a,you're a chiropractor yeah, yeah
like you're a dentist it's kindor like, how like.

Speaker 2 (01:18):
Uh, I know mitch would know better than me but
they talk about linemen.
There's like the low wirelinemen, like the low, like low
voltage, low voltage, or it'slike internet lines but, they
call themselves linemen, butthey're not actually linemen.

Speaker 4 (01:31):
I've heard him rant about that.
Yeah, it's the same sort ofconcept, you know one thing that
I love about this episode todayis, first of all, you know,
these are two of my bros, soit's always a pleasure to get to
sit next to the homies here.
But we actually have anapprentice and we have his
fucking master, the leader, theman in charge here too.

(01:53):
Like I can't imagine thedynamic.
We have two bros that see eachother every day.
You get to teach Tyler yourtrade Every day.
And I just love that for youguys.
The chemistry between you isbest friend chemistry.

Speaker 2 (02:09):
You can tell you talk every day.
Yeah, it's definitely like meand Rita both said to each other
.
You know they switch Like a lotof plumbing companies will
switch workers out.
You'll have a journeyman or amaster and an apprentice with
them and they'll switch workersout.
You'll have an apprentice for amonth and and they'll switch
workers out.
You'll have an apprentice for amonth and they'll switch a
different apprentice with thejourneyman or whatever.
Me and Reed have been togetherfor about eight months now and

(02:31):
we've definitely came to theconclusion when we get separated
, we're going to be very, verybored at work.

Speaker 1 (02:36):
Have you guys had your first fight yet?

Speaker 2 (02:38):
No, I don't think so.

Speaker 1 (02:40):
You've been together for eight months.

Speaker 3 (02:42):
I wouldn't say fight, no, just the way we do things.
I would say yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:48):
A little different order of operations.

Speaker 4 (02:50):
Nothing like a fight, though.

Speaker 2 (02:51):
No, I guess the first month is like.

Speaker 3 (02:53):
We're both too understanding, I think.

Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yeah, like the first month of working with anyone,
regardless of what trade you arewho the apprentice is, you kind
of have to figure out eachother's role.
Sure, yeah, you are who theapprentice is.
You kind of have to figure outeach other's role, sure, you
know.
Yeah, so any job, if you'reteaching someone anything, you
kind of have to, you know,figure out what each other is
good at.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
Yeah, and the fights don't come till after the year
mark probably yeah, you're stillin the honeymoon phase, yeah,
so in.
In every single trade there'sbeen a little peak of AI and a
little bit of technology that'scrept into all these different
fields.
Is there any AI or anytechnology that's creeping into

(03:34):
the plumbing space that wouldlead you to believe that a robot
is going to be able to replaceyour job?

Speaker 3 (03:41):
I?
No, I don't think that'spossible.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
No, I don't think that's possible.
No, I don't think so.

Speaker 3 (03:46):
But, as far as AI goes, there's this app we pulled
the mic up to your face.
There's this app, or technologythat we are kind of getting
into.
It's called Zilla, okay, andthey record everything that you
say to a customer.

Speaker 1 (04:02):
Oh interesting.
It's like a body cam for aplumber, yep it is Does they
record video or just audio?

Speaker 3 (04:07):
right, just audio.

Speaker 1 (04:08):
I think it's just audio damn I feel like video is
not far off, if they'rerecording your conversation well
, it's for a sales tactic oh,sales tactic really okay we know
some plumbers and withdifferent companies that they
record video audio in the vanseriously so you're watched 24,
7, yeah, and I suppose they'retracking where you're at how
long you're there to see alsolike your efficiency numbers

(04:31):
correct yeah but the zilla thingis more um so like.

Speaker 2 (04:36):
When you go into a home, when you introduce
yourself and talk to a customer,it records every word you say
and every word they say, andwhen you're done at that call it
will tell you don't say thisword, you use this, this word,
where you should use this wordthis is all automatic, correct.

Speaker 1 (04:52):
It's all ai correcting your speech.

Speaker 3 (04:55):
It's all for sales, it will also paraphrase like you
.

Speaker 1 (04:59):
Like you spent too long explaining this thing.
Yep, you should have just saidthis in the job notes.

Speaker 3 (05:04):
It'll paraphrase for you what this tech did, what he
said, what he offered, how itwent wow ai is getting freaking,
freaky yeah, and luckily thecompany we work for they offer
it.

Speaker 2 (05:17):
But you don't have to have it.
So some companies require it.
Some companies have a recordingon you as you're driving the
van audio and video, and whenyou go into the home, you a
recording on you as you'redriving the van, audio and video
, and when you go into the homeyou're recorded as well.
So you're the whole day you'reat work, you're, every single
thing you do is recorded.
So thankfully the company wework for don't enforce that.

(05:37):
But if you want to become abetter salesman and you want to
use that Zilla or whatever, youcan, but they're not going to
force you.

Speaker 1 (05:44):
They treat it as a self-improvement thing not
you're forced to do it for thecompany exactly, yeah yeah, okay
.
So that, wow, that's insane,I'd never okay.
So how much of, would you say?
The plumbing industry isselling new products and
actually fixing water stuffwater stuff.
I like, you know like I'm justtrying to be as broad as I can.

Speaker 3 (06:06):
I guess I mean so yeah, go ahead say it again I
like, how much how much of it issales and how much of it is
actually doing the work inservice work, which is so the
company we work at is, I wouldsay, 60% is sales and 40% is

(06:36):
doing the work and getting itdone Wow.

Speaker 1 (06:39):
That's actually crazy .
That's way less than I wouldhave thought In the plumbing
world.

Speaker 3 (06:44):
There's hotels being brought.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
Hotels being built, factories being made to where
that's like commercial.

Speaker 3 (06:55):
Yeah, commercial, no sales, because they already got
their contracts which I don'tknow anything about.

Speaker 4 (07:00):
That's more of like the union plumber, I assume.

Speaker 2 (07:02):
Yeah, it's like you're just there to do your job
.
You're nine tofive and head up.
You don't have to talk toanyone.
You can have your headphones inall day, whatever.
But if you're a service plumber, you're talking to people all
the time and you can be the bestplumber in the world.
But if you're not a good talker, yeah Well, because it's

(07:23):
relation, relationshiprelationships versus
transactional.

Speaker 1 (07:27):
Yeah, yeah wow, that's crazy actually.
I, I guess I just assumed thatit was just so cut and dry like,
yep, this is the problem, bringyou right to the problem, you
fix the problem, you're out ofthere.
But and that's obviously thebusiness isn't made on service
calls, it's made on selling themnew stuff.

Speaker 3 (07:43):
Right, you know, like I would imagine, that's where
the real money is.
The first thing you said, bringme to the problem.
That's my mindset.

Speaker 1 (07:49):
Yeah, bring me to the problem.

Speaker 3 (07:52):
Show me what's wrong.
If I see something super major,I'll bring it up.
If you don't want to do it,great, but I'm not here to sell
you nothing.
If you don't want it, right, Ito fix the problem okay.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
So I mean, let's get right into some stereotypes of
plumbing here.
Obviously, the main one thatcomes to mind plumbers crack.
Is there any sort of likeshielding that the company
provides you so that when you'rein someone's home and you're
bent over at a faucet, you'rebent over at a toilet, you're in
a shower drain, you're notshowing crack?

Speaker 3 (08:27):
I think that comes down to the man that's servicing
you honestly definitely I mean,everyone could tell if you got
crack I've personally never beenserviced by.

Speaker 4 (08:36):
I got some crack I got some crack you ever bent
down.
It comes up my back a long ways, dude you get a little bit of
wind you, he's got that longcrack.

Speaker 3 (08:45):
So we, as us, where we work, we have uniforms we've
got to wear, we've got to tuckin.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
Do they purposely make the pants sit up higher on
your waist?

Speaker 2 (08:54):
Yeah, yeah, they sit up a little higher, do they
really yeah?

Speaker 1 (08:58):
So they're trying to mitigate the stereotype.
It's good to see that there'simprovement Well actually the
company we work for.

Speaker 2 (09:05):
Since me and Reed are installers, we can get by with
a little more, so typically, ifyou are a salesman, they want
your pants to be pressed Likethey want the crease down your
thigh crease down your calf andshirt tucked in.
No stains on your white shirtand if you walk into the shop in
the morning before you go doyour calls and you have a

(09:26):
caulking stain on your pants orsomething, you will get yelled
at.
But me and Reed can get awaywith a little more, since we're
not the salesmen typically we'rethe installers.
So if the salesman sellssomething, we go install it.
We have to deal with thecustomers a little less than
they do.
So if we're dirty, dirty, theystill yell at us, but we can use

(09:47):
the excuse.
As you know, we're the onedoing it.

Speaker 1 (09:50):
We're gonna get dirty are the salesmen's plumbers
themselves as well.
Are they going to?
Look at a problem barely barelyyeah if someone calls and say
like hey, my faucet's superleaky.
Would a salesman go out there?

Speaker 2 (10:03):
yes, oh, okay, yeah, so the the difference is, if me
and if reed and I have nothingto do in a day and a salesman
has nothing to do in a day andsomeone calls and says their
water heater is leaking, they'regoing to send the salesman
there before us because that'sprobably more profitable,
because they're, they're more ofa yapper.

Speaker 1 (10:21):
They're more of a seller, so you're gonna try to
get more product correct a new,a new faucet all together rather
than put the band-aid on.

Speaker 3 (10:28):
Yeah they go there for a faucet.
They're trying to build atwenty thousand dollar ticket
yeah, they're not going therefor the faucet.

Speaker 2 (10:35):
Whatever, it's right, or?

Speaker 1 (10:36):
wrong yeah, dude I dread making calls to plumbers
when anything happens at myhouse, because I know that if
it's, if it's enough, where I'mcalling someone I for sure can't
do it, yep, and if I'm callingsomeone officially, no one I
know can also do it.
And uh, you know, to be honestwith you, I realize why they pay
good money because I had asuper old house was built in

(11:00):
like early 1900s when I was incollege and I had to redo the
the plumbing underneath on thesecond level, like on in the
basement, and like get thelittle little copper cutter out.
It was all copper and likesolder in a piece but like it
would, did you blow.
I don't even know what thatmeans, that's I probably did it
wrong.
Oh yeah, yeah, so I, so Isoldered it together, I know

(11:23):
because it then then it startedbreaking solder joints all over
the whole basement because itlike heated up everything you
know.
I'm like heating up one partand it blows lines all over Dude
.

Speaker 4 (11:34):
So you're just kind of like freaking out Like what
the fuck have I done?

Speaker 1 (11:36):
Oh, yeah, and I definitely.
I'm sure this isn't what you'resupposed to do, but I'm like
you can do that for materials.

Speaker 4 (11:44):
Okay, someone had told me, like you're not
supposed to connect differentmaterials.

Speaker 1 (11:46):
You got to replace everything.
I'm like, absolutely not, I'mnot replacing everything.
I made it work.

Speaker 2 (11:50):
Well, if you had that salesman come to your house, he
would say listen, man this isgoing to be 30 grand.
You got to get everything donehere, probably the right way to

(12:11):
do it.
That's the difference betweenthose salesmen and reed and I is
reed and I are more of aproblem solver, like if
someone's toilet is running andwe get a service call to go
check out the toilet, we go tothe toilet and we want to fix
the toilet, because that's wheretheir issue is, to where if a
salesman gets called out there,they're gonna check the toilet
and they're gonna check thewater heater they're gonna check
the water softener, they'regonna check the drain lines and
they're going to try to buildthat ticket as big as they can,
because they say like not onlydid I fix the issue in your
toilet, but I did notice,correct this, this, this

Speaker 3 (12:33):
this, this, and it's honestly no shame on them.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
I believe because that's how they make their
living.
That and are they?

Speaker 1 (12:39):
commission based correct.
They are.
Oh okay, yep, so that's whythey're trying to run it up.
Yep, exactly, dang, so you justgot.
You just got a card like a carsalesman in your house fixing
water lines 100.

Speaker 4 (12:53):
That's exactly what it is and that scares the fuck
out of me, because until I hadfriends that were car salesmen,
I didn't realize how fucked upit was like I lived my life so
naive, I didn't realize,especially now that I'm in sales
myself like everyone's out tojust make their buck, and I
respect it.
But you gotta watch yourselfbecause you will get fucked if
you don't exactly, and that'sthe pressure behind doing it

(13:15):
when it's not needed or you'rejust trying to make a buck.

Speaker 3 (13:19):
That's the sole purpose.
That's wrong man dude.

Speaker 4 (13:23):
I've been in those situations where, like, let's
say, I bid a job a little higherthan I I probably should have,
we won it and I feel fuckingguilty and I remember talking to
my dad like I just feel wrongabout he's fuck that yeah, they
could have got more quotes, thatthey went for it.

Speaker 2 (13:38):
That's how they are exactly.
That's where.

Speaker 3 (13:41):
That's where we differ a little bit me and reed
versus that's what I gotinstilled in me when I started
working where we work.
So that's one question.

Speaker 4 (13:50):
I have for you because, growing up with you, I
know your background, where,when you first got out of high
school, you started with a smalloutfit out of our town and you
were working with masterplumbers that have been in the
industry for plus 20 years, Icould assume at that point.
And so when you at step onewith master plumbers that have
been in the industry for plus 20years, I could assume at that
point.
Yeah, and so you.
When you at step one, you werelearning from masters that have
spent more than half of theirlife in it.

(14:11):
Do you think that you got moreof an upper hand in that
situation?
Or do you think Tyler has moreof an upper hand working with
somebody who also has experienceunder their belt, but is a
friend, someone he's comfortableasking these questions, even if
it seems dumb?

Speaker 3 (14:26):
That helps a lot.
I feel like I could have hadthe upper hand, but I was just
so young At that point.
I still didn't know what Iwanted to do, so you weren't
trying to absorb it.
Yeah, exactly, I was doing itfor a paycheck when I first
started, actually here in PineCity.

Speaker 4 (14:45):
And, if you don't mind me saying this, I remember,
so this would have been like2017.
I remember you telling me thatyou were getting 17 an hour and
being like 14 holy fuck, I can'timagine getting that.

Speaker 2 (14:56):
I'm getting paid like 825 at the pizza hut, thinking
like I would fucking killsomeone

Speaker 4 (15:02):
for 14 right now we'd go to the casino.
I'd be like you can spend$60,000 on the blackjack table.
I don't think you got $20,000to gamble.

Speaker 3 (15:12):
Yeah, no, it was different times back then.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
Do you think that plumbing has made millionaires,
like, do you think there's theseOGs in the industry?
That?

Speaker 4 (15:21):
are just stacking money like crazy yeah in the
industry that are just stackingmoney like crazy.

Speaker 1 (15:25):
Can you now, as someone just getting into it now
, like let's say, there's an18-year-old apprentice out there
watching this Do you think thatthere's a realm where they can
make a lot of money?

Speaker 3 (15:38):
Yes, go to the bigger companies and do what we're
doing.

Speaker 2 (15:43):
Yeah, if you go to any bigger company like a
well-known company, not like asmall town company, and you
prove yourself, you're going todo well and the difference is
you can be great at sales or youcan be great at installing.
Either way you're going to makemoney because all those bigger
companies have a commission base, even for the installers they

(16:04):
have a commission base.
So you know the installers theyhave a commission base.
So you know, the faster you getthe job done, you get a
percentage of that.
So most plumbing, most goodplumbers or good salesmen are on
the commission base.
But you can be hourly if youwant to.
Oh, you get to choose.
Yeah, so once, you once you getout on your own.
You get to choose if you wantto be on hourly or if you want

(16:28):
to be on commission.
If you know you're good and youknow you can get shit done
quick, then it's smarter for youto go on commission, because
you know, if a job gets sold forseven thousand dollars and I'll
just make up a random numberyou know you can get eight
percent on it by installing itand you know you can beat that
time of four hours, you can getit done in two.
You make 8% on that, and if youget sent home for the rest of

(16:49):
the day it doesn't matter.
You made your 8% on that or godo another one.
So salesmen and installers canboth be on commission.
Or if an installer wants to beon hourly or a salesman beyond
hourly, you can do that as well,or a salesman beyond hourly.

Speaker 1 (17:05):
You can do that as well.
Damn how long, or I guess.
What's the pay gap between anapprentice and a master, that's
a complicated question that isIs it significant?

Speaker 2 (17:18):
Residential?
No, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (17:21):
Should we?

Speaker 1 (17:25):
No TCAP's, like is it ?
What do you make?

Speaker 2 (17:28):
hourly.
It is hourly.
Yes, you're about to have yourfirst fight.
Yeah, hourly.
Yes, there's a big differencehourly.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
Okay, yeah.
But your commission is roughlythe same.

Speaker 3 (17:39):
Like I, like we were talking about earlier.
When I first started, I wasmaking $14 an hour.
That was around this area, notin the cities.
You go to the cities, you makedouble that approximately.

Speaker 2 (17:51):
Yeah, starting out pretty much yeah.

Speaker 3 (17:54):
And as a licensed guy meaning journeyman or master
you'd make double than what youmake in the cities as an
apprentice.
Okay, Sure.

Speaker 4 (18:05):
So the the extra cause you have to take classes,
you have to pass a test tobecome a journeyman and master.
So you, at least you're gettingcompensated for the work you've
done in the experience ofyou've had.

Speaker 3 (18:16):
it's worth progressing and that's how I
feel.
Percentage based or commissionhas kind of wrecked a lot of
people, including includingmyself.

Speaker 4 (18:28):
Sure, because you don't have as much of a drive to
get that dollar an hour Right.

Speaker 2 (18:33):
Exactly yeah.
If everyone was on hourly,everyone would want to be a
journeyman, right.
But if, when everyone's onpercentage, there's no really
drive to become a journeymanbecause you don't have to, to
make you don't have to.

Speaker 4 (18:47):
Yeah, so if you never take the journeyman test, you
can be like a 15 year apprenticewe have those, yeah, we have
those, whatever, yeah, we haveapprentices that make six
figures, that just won't taketheir journeyman test and
apprentices making six figures.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
That are salesmen that do a damn good job at what
they do, but they are stillapprentices yeah, because they
know if they get theirjourneyman, unless they're
hourly they're not, their payreally isn't going to change.

Speaker 1 (19:13):
Yeah so well, okay.
So if someone was dead set onfrom the time they start being a
plumber, like I'm going to be ajourneyman, how long from the
time you're an apprentice tillyou can be a journeyman?
Is it based off hours?
Four years?

Speaker 3 (19:26):
or 7,000 hours, okay.
And you can only log $1,750 ayear, which equals 7,000 hours,
okay.

Speaker 2 (19:33):
So four years Dang, okay, so yeah if you're looking
at becoming a union plumber oran hourly plumber, it is 100%
all day worth it to get yourjourneyman's or your master's.
It's kind of like when a nursebecomes an RN.
Yeah, Like that's like theirgolden ticket, Like if you're a
journeyman you can get a jobwherever you want and you're
pretty much going to get causeyou can go anywhere.

(19:55):
Yeah, and you can go beresidential, you can go be
commercial and you're going toget minimum 40, 45 an hour
period.
It's your golden ticket.
But if you're residential, 40,45 an hour period, it's your
golden ticket.

Speaker 4 (20:09):
But if you're residential commission based,
that's where, if you don't wantto get your journeyman, you can
kind of get you can, you'll getby, and I can assume that an
older man in the trade isprobably looking more towards
the dollar an hour versus thesalary you know you get some
years and you know you're notmoving as quick that's just it
yeah everyone older in the inthe company and other companies
that I know, they prefer thedollar sure they want that

(20:30):
consistency.

Speaker 1 (20:31):
Yeah, that makes total sense.

Speaker 3 (20:33):
It's a it's a security net.
You know, you know you're gonnabe making now, um, residential
to commercial.

Speaker 1 (20:40):
Is it like a totally different animal?
Like obviously it's treatedmuch differently?
Yep, but uh, is it like?
Is it almost?
Does it almost feel like adifferent industry?
Like is it a different way ofdoing the whole entire job?
Yes, where at?

Speaker 3 (20:55):
least to me, where I'm at very, I think I'm a very
good plumber.
But if I went to commercial itwould be a whole different ball
game.
There's different things yougot to do way more complicated a
lot of code and shit.

Speaker 4 (21:09):
I assume that you don't deal with no we deal.

Speaker 2 (21:11):
We deal with code, but commercial yeah, it's way
more, yeah, everything is.
I feel it's different.
So everything in like aresidential home is pretty much
going to be the same code.
Like you know, you have ashower.
Shower drain it has to be twoinch.
Everyone knows that it's ahouse.
But to where you're insomewhere, a commercial building

(21:33):
, where there's going to be sixurinals in a row, you have to
figure out the fixture units ofthose urinals, what size the
pipe needs to be.
That's where it gets more like,because reed here has taken his
.
He took his master's test.
Hasn't gotten his results backon it yet but last week he was,
he was going through, we was inthe van and he was reading me
the questions and things out ofthe code book for the like, the

(21:55):
commercial part of it, and I waslike, oh my god, this is the
most confusing shit.
Everyone says plumbers are likeoh, shit flows downhill, can't
be that hard.
But when you get in that codebook and you're reading the
commercial code, it is a mathequation it is very hard to
figure out versus a two-bathroomhome.
You know you're like oh, I knowthis pipe has to be three inch,

(22:17):
I know this pipe has to be twoinch.
But when you're in a building,a factory, with tons of drains,
and all that.

Speaker 3 (22:22):
Hundred bathrooms a hundred to figure out what size
water main you need to servicethose hundred bathrooms.
You need to count everything.

Speaker 1 (22:32):
Yeah, that makes total sense.
Yeah, I mean, that sounds likeit would suck.
You just literally got tomemorize the code.
I'm sure it changes all thetime too.

Speaker 3 (22:42):
Absolutely, I think.
I wish I knew more on that, butI think they change it every
five or so years do you have toretake?

Speaker 1 (22:51):
your test?
No, how do you get?
How do they know that you're upto the new code?
You need to do just thecontinuing education.

Speaker 3 (22:57):
Oh okay, yeah, yep and for us, for as plumbers,
it's pretty light compared tosome of the trades I hear you
don't think I do 16 every twoyears as a licensed guy
Apprentice.
You need to do two hours a year.

Speaker 1 (23:11):
Dang.

Speaker 3 (23:12):
Yeah, that's not bad at all, it's not bad, but those
days that you got to sit down inthe classroom when you're used
to go, go, go.

Speaker 4 (23:18):
Yeah, especially someone that wasn't a guy that
enjoyed school to start with.
I can only imagine.
But I want to get into thenitty gritty.
I know why the people are hereand I don't want to bring you
into some flashbacks, some wartimes, but I can only assume

(23:39):
you've run into some prettynasty stuff in your days of
plumbing.
Is there anything that kind ofhits you as like this was the
worst day?
I can't believe I did this.

Speaker 2 (23:51):
Walk off the job type day one of those.

Speaker 4 (23:53):
You go home, you're just staring straight at the
road and it's like why do I evendo?

Speaker 2 (23:57):
this no radio on the drive home type day.

Speaker 4 (24:00):
Have you ever had a situation and this is it could
be.
When you guys are together, youguys could have separate
stories, but have you ever had asituation and this is it could
be.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
when you guys are together, you guys could have
separate stories, but I knowReid has one pretty good story
about a flooded basement.

Speaker 3 (24:10):
When I first got my own van I was pretty new to the
company.
Two or three months in twoyears plumbing I go to this
lady's house in the cities.
I can't remember where, and Iwalk in and there's boxes
stacked everywhere, just like ahoarder's house.
Okay, I've always been taughtnot to judge a book by its cover

(24:31):
, so I I'm trying not to and shepoints me in the direction of a
base in the, in her basement,and she doesn't go first.
I go first.

Speaker 4 (24:40):
That's already a red flag you got to follow the trail
through the house.

Speaker 3 (24:43):
Oh, yes, and right.
When you walk in you hear birdssquawking in cages and that's
another red flag to me.
Birds, birds, yeah, bird peopleare weird One.
Cool, I like a good parrot, butmore than that, no.
And if you walk in it smellslike urine, pneumonia, cats.

(25:06):
I walk in the basement andthere's two inches of water and
just floating cat turdseverywhere, just still water.
Yep.
And now I'm realizing why shelet me go first, because it was
bad.

Speaker 1 (25:20):
It was bad.
Was this a clogged drain, I'massuming, or what?

Speaker 3 (25:26):
So this was a water main coming into her basement
broke open, there's a leak andon top of the water main, before
I even knew, there was clotheseverywhere on top of this water
main and I didn't even knowwhere the water main was at that
point because there's so manyfucking, fucking clothes.

(25:47):
Oh god, dude, I'm just gettingsick thinking about it and at
the time I had I don't have niceboots anymore because they're
worn out, but I had nice boots,waterproof boots, I I went down
there, I treaded in it and Itook one.
Look, I saw the cat shiteverywhere where I was going to
have to work Floating.
And at that time my boss priorhe told me if you're ever in a

(26:14):
situation like this, just berespectful and just say you got
to go grab a tool.
So I said I got to go grab atool.
I walked out and hit the gas.

Speaker 1 (26:23):
And you just left.

Speaker 3 (26:24):
I left.

Speaker 1 (26:25):
Did you have to?

Speaker 3 (26:26):
And I felt so bad, I really did.

Speaker 4 (26:30):
So she called you in because the water was starting
to build Because the main wasbroke.
Yeah, oh my God, so do youthink it had been sitting for a
while, or all the turds werejust on the floor and now it
broke.

Speaker 3 (26:43):
No, the turds had been sitting for a while.

Speaker 1 (26:46):
They have been.
Did you touch one?

Speaker 3 (26:48):
Was it hard?
No, I haven't touched thosetype of turds, oh God.
If anyone knows me, they know Idon't like cats.
Okay, I do like cats, just Idon't want to own one.
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (27:02):
You definitely don't want to wait around in their
shit, not for me.

Speaker 1 (27:06):
Yeah, I've heard a lot of plumbers say that there's
two kinds of cats there's agood cat and there's a live cat.

Speaker 4 (27:12):
Yes, Dude, I hate all these cats.

Speaker 2 (27:15):
Slender we had one job we were at as a three and we
were repairing a sewer stack,so the main stack, where your
tub, your lav, your toilet,everything, all drains in the
main stack Shit.
We had to fix that.
So everything ends up in thisstack.
So we cut everything apart andwe specifically told the

(27:38):
homeowner do not use thebathroom.
We have everything taken apartdown here and luckily the toilet
was probably 20 feet away fromthe stack where we were working
and we were just working,working on the stack, whatever
Another day at work, and then wehear a thump, like the sound of
a toilet flushing.

Speaker 4 (27:59):
You know what it sounds like.

Speaker 2 (28:00):
And when it's coming through a three-inch pipe it
echoes.
You hear it.
You hear it hit that 90, you,you hear it, drop it and the
splash of the water hit that 90and me and reed both.
It was like a movie scene weboth looked right at each other
and locked eyes and then we werelike where's a bucket?
where's a bucket?
We're searching around for abucket and we couldn't find a
bucket and we weren't worriedabout it landing on us because

(28:22):
we knew it had 20 feet of run toget to us, so we had probably
about five to ten Mississippisbefore it got to us.
And we couldn't find a bucket.
So we just backed up and wewere just like well, here it
comes.
Guess we're getting the mop,though, and we watched it, you
know, come out of the pipe,toilet paper, everything just
splashed on the ground, theystraight up went.
Number two no it was a number,it was a girl, so it was a

(28:43):
number one okay, it was a cutenumber one.

Speaker 1 (28:45):
They don't poop, they don't girls don't poop, you
know so but either way, it'sgross.

Speaker 2 (28:49):
We're not worried about the fact of it landing on
us we knew it wasn't gonna landon us but it's the fact of we
have to clean that up.
Yeah, what I mean.

Speaker 1 (28:57):
So it happened, we cleaned it up and then, uh, it
happened again about three hourslater she flushed again, and
that time Did you have to go upand be like hey, quit using the
toilet.
I should have.

Speaker 2 (29:10):
That time we had a bucket and we were able to catch
it, but we had a discussion inthe van on the way home.
We were like next time we'reworking on a stack we're going
to go to the toilet and turn thewater off to the toilet, so
this doesn't happen again, thewater was off, but we didn't
flush the toilet.
Yeah, so when?

Speaker 3 (29:27):
the water's off.
You get one flush per toilet.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
Yeah, the tank has water in it, exactly yeah.

Speaker 3 (29:33):
So we're going to flush it, turn the water off.

Speaker 1 (29:35):
Yeah, this is actually so in my line of work,
when I do real estatephotography, this is always a
big thing with doing likeAirbnbs or like vacation homes
or when they're someone's goingto sell it and you go to take
photos of it.
There is this a very commonthing, where photographers will
use the bathroom but if they'veshut off the water, there's been
so many cases of people that'slike I don't know what to do,

(29:58):
like I can't flush.
Yeah, these guys take a dump inthis empty toilet.
You got to go get a bucket ofwater from somewhere to get this
thing to flush.

Speaker 3 (30:07):
So you know you can do that well, now I know because
of this.
Yeah, a lot of people don'tknow that, dude I actually just
learned that recently.

Speaker 1 (30:14):
Shout out he taught me it of all people I'd imagine
he's been in some stickysituations with some empty
toilets.

Speaker 4 (30:21):
Oh yeah, dude, especially with him being my old
landlord, he'd be fixing mytoilet.
I'll do some work on that oldgirl every time I fucking get a
phone call god bless, dude.
that is the thing, and I guessthat kind of leads into my next
question, like is it fuckingannoying being the only plumber?
Now you got t-cab in the mixbut, like I know, so many of our

(30:42):
friends call you for everything, get you to come in, dad, and
he still brings this up.
He had Reed come all the wayover to his house to help him
fix something and it took himfive seconds total.
It was something so simple.
Like, I guess, fuck all thatbullshit.
My question is is it fuckingannoying having people call you
all the time?

Speaker 3 (31:02):
Not at all.
I appreciate it.

Speaker 4 (31:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (31:04):
I love that shit.
It makes annoying having peoplecall you all the time.
Not at all I appreciate it.

Speaker 4 (31:06):
Yeah, I love that shit.
It makes me feel useful thatI'm gonna clip that and keep
that, because as soon as I buy ahouse, you're gonna regret the
fuck out of that reed, will youcome to my inspection?

Speaker 1 (31:15):
please be looking at it.
Yeah, so uh, cash, this isgonna run you about 10 grand do
you?

Speaker 4 (31:23):
do you take financing ?

Speaker 2 (31:24):
Yeah, Actually, yeah, yeah, we're supposed to offer
that.
Well, it's just more.
I mean, I'm not mad about it.
It's another opportunity tomake money, whatever get a side
job.

Speaker 4 (31:35):
We have to pay your friends Fuck.

Speaker 2 (31:37):
A little bit, maybe 10% on top.
I'll give you a brew, give youa couple of beers.

Speaker 4 (31:42):
Is it?

Speaker 1 (31:43):
more annoying to drive somewhere super far to get
something that's super easy todo or somewhere close that
you're spending hours and hoursand hours on Super far for
something minuscule.
Because now you're wasting time, wasting time.

Speaker 3 (31:57):
I feel like to the customer, whoever it is.

Speaker 1 (32:00):
Well, I suppose, especially if a big part of your
pay is commission, that's a lotless that you're able to get
done if you're driving for along time.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
Yep, yep.
So a huge thing is when we geta call, a service call, when the
homeowner calls our office,they have to give a description
of what's going on.
So they have to say, hey, I'mlooking for a water softener
Quote my water heater is leakingmy toilet.

(32:30):
I'm looking for a watersoftener quote my water heater
is leaking, my toilet won'tflush, or something like that.
So if Reed and I have noinstalls to do and there's
nothing to do, sometimes they'llsend us on service calls and we
will get a call and we'll readin the job notes.
In the description it saystoilet runs intermediately or
something.
And me and Reed and I know it'seither a toilet flapper or a
fill valve and both of thosearen't expensive fixes and it'll
be 55 minutes away.

(32:51):
You know it'll be a drive awayand I'm on hourly so it doesn't
affect me too much, but reed ison commission.
So right when we see thedescription, we know it's a
toilet flapper and how much it'sgoing to cost, and reed will be
like, fuck, I have to go herefor a flapper.
I know we, we know what it'sgoing to be and it's.

Speaker 4 (33:07):
I mean, it's kind of more of an annoyance, but it's
whatever that's where you gotupsell bud, that's where you got
, that's where they want you toupsell you know, all the pipes
in this house are fucked, yeahyeah, that's a, that's a huge
part of it is.

Speaker 2 (33:20):
You know, you gotta keep that, uh, that conversion
rate up.
They want you to sell stuff.

Speaker 1 (33:24):
So have you guys had to unclog any nasty drains more?

Speaker 3 (33:29):
just toilets.

Speaker 1 (33:30):
Yeah, we have like a little at what point is a toilet
clogged enough where you gottacall a plumber?

Speaker 3 (33:36):
it's like, hey, there's some shit going down, so
literally I don't know whatmedications, but I've in my
experience, older people takecertain medications and they're
just rock hard shits okay, andthey just don't go down you need
a pain medication.

Speaker 1 (33:52):
Yes, pain medication, yeah, and I don't know they
won't shit forever, but I I knowthat to be true, and uh, we so.

Speaker 3 (34:00):
We have a six foot auger.
That's all we carry with us,which is a toilet auger.
If it's anything past that, wecall a drain cleaner in because
a six footer yep, which isbasically the size.

Speaker 1 (34:12):
You're fishing out shit that's deeper than six feet
.
Well, that's the basically thesize of the trap okay, toilet
yeah and probably two feet pastthat.

Speaker 3 (34:21):
Okay, so in the main drain at that point or the
toilet drain.
If it's past that, we don'tdeal with it.

Speaker 1 (34:27):
Yes, like hey, you're gonna have to fish out this
rock, so that's a that's a thing.

Speaker 2 (34:31):
So we were talking about drain cleaners.
You know, if we can, we don'treally deal with nasty stuff
like that.
Um, so if, if reed and I get acall, do a toilet that's not
flushing and it's not too niceof a place and we know it's a
clogged drain, we take advantageof that we take advantage of it
.
We're like, yeah, we'll get adrain tech out here and we kind

(34:54):
of call it at that because weknow what it is Damn.
And at that point it's like,yeah, we can put a toilet in,
but it's not going to fixanything yeah, I love that they
dress it up and call them adrain tech as well yeah, we're
all techs.
That's a bad job and and it'suh, it's so sometimes they at
least get paid well I don't knowso

Speaker 3 (35:13):
if they're good, if they're good at if they're good
at selling, if they're good atfishing shit out of the getting
cross leads yeah, we have adrain tech that uh, so we're
also supposed to look at theHVAC system and the electrical
system and if we see anythingwrong with it, we're supposed to
get an electrician out there oran HVAC guy.

Speaker 1 (35:35):
Oh my God, Imagine this You're 60 years old, you've
been on this pain medication,you haven't shit.
In three weeks you drop arock-solid turd.
It gets stuck seven feet downthe drain.
You got to have this drain techcome out.
And then they tell you well,not only is your toilet clogged
with this rock hard turd and yougot all these problems.
But listen, buddy, you got toredo your hvac, you got to redo

(35:58):
your whole electric.

Speaker 2 (35:59):
That's what they want us to do.
But the initiative behind thatis whether you're hourly or
commission.
If you're're at a home, let'ssay you're just doing a simple
water heater install every otherday, you know, and you see that
the furnace is old.
And the homeowner said yeah,the furnace is kind of wonky,
you know, it kicks on every nowand then.

Speaker 4 (36:16):
That's your cue, that's your cue.

Speaker 2 (36:18):
And if you get an HVAC guy out there to sell a
furnace, you get a percentage ofthat.
Oh, because you gave you.
Teed it up, cross lead, whether, whether you are hourly or
commission based so that's whereyou, just that's where the
salesmen get really cut throatsomeone's listening to this like
that.

Speaker 1 (36:35):
I just got a new water heater and then no, no, a
lot of people are and I get it.

Speaker 3 (36:41):
That's not.

Speaker 1 (36:41):
I don't, I don't believe that's us none of that
is cheap is cheap is really whatit comes down to.
There's nothing in that wholerealm that's cheap.

Speaker 2 (36:49):
No, and if you, like you said, about the drain
cleaners making money, like, adrain cleaner that just drains,
that cleans drains, isn't goingto make a lot of money.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
But if you're good at talking, we have a drain
cleaner and he makes well intosix figures, and it's just
because he is he drain cleanerand he makes a well into six
figures, and it's just becausehe gives so much other cross.

Speaker 2 (37:07):
He's just good at talking, you know.
He's just good at.
I know his furnace is old.
So even if you're not a goodplumber and you're not a good
drain cleaner, you can stillmake well into six figures
that's kind of a cool businessmodel, though, and I do want to
say that there's a differencebetween the snakes out there
yeah, and making, oh, it's justlike any industry.

Speaker 3 (37:26):
Yeah, totally, if you're actually looking out for
them.

Speaker 1 (37:30):
There's a big difference between that and just
setting up a lead yeah, totally, because there is times when
you go into someone's house it'slike okay, this is genuinely
messed up, like I would getchecked you're right 100 like
you might not be thinking aboutit now, but it's worth having
someone at least look at it.

Speaker 3 (37:46):
I feel like in our company the people above us weed
those people out pretty quick.

Speaker 2 (37:52):
They do, they weed out the con men pretty well.
Sometimes there's a couple thatmight get a little job.
That might not be done but it'snot super often.
It's a tough game because youwant good salesmen but you don't
want the bad reputation that acon salesman gives you it's a
fine line, but at that point youdo have to see where it sounds

(38:15):
bad, but you do have to seewhere they're coming from as
well.
A salesman might have a wifeand daddy wants a new side by
side and two new, two newborn athome.
You know, and and they need to.

Speaker 4 (38:29):
They need to pay their bills and they see water.

Speaker 2 (38:31):
That water heater that's 12 years old.
It works fine.
But they know that they got tomake the payment and they got to
buy diapers that week, so theymight kind of push that a little
more yeah, but I could seethere's also around it's like
might not be replaced right now,but it will need to be replaced
at some point don't trust thismotherfucker.

Speaker 4 (38:49):
Yeah, he's played these fucking games.
That's how I kind of feelcommission or percentage base
salaries yeah, that's where itgets tricky.

Speaker 3 (38:59):
It's all perception it can, it really is a person
real quick oh, I believe it.

Speaker 4 (39:04):
Oh, dude I.
I deal with it all the time,even just with simple masonry
bids where it's like theybrought me in for their chimney.
But I noticed the facade hadsome issues.

Speaker 2 (39:12):
Yeah, exactly yep, and you're gonna take that
because it has an issue.
But there are salesmen that itdoesn't have an issue and
they're like this is fucked yeah, and they try to sell.

Speaker 1 (39:24):
Yeah, well, right before we started, I told you
guys about my water softenerconundrum.
I had someone come out and justlook at my water softener and
it was.
I knew it was a simple thing.
It was just one little thingthat wasn't letting it
regenerate.
But they were basically tellingme I needed a whole new water
softener.
I was like well, I mean, you'requoting me 10 times what it
would cost for me to go get onefrom Menards and just do it

(39:45):
myself.

Speaker 2 (39:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (39:46):
So that's our biggest rebuttal.

Speaker 1 (39:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (39:48):
Which I sort of agree with you totally can.

Speaker 1 (39:53):
But for what I eat it for?
I could just get oh, I bet theyare, but I mean, I'm not
running that much through it it.

Speaker 2 (40:00):
so the only thing that helps my conscience in that
is I I think reed feels thesame way is if, if we go to a
home and and one specific item,like on the water heater, is
broken and we can fix that itemfor 300, we'll write a quote to
fix that item for 300, but wewill also write a quote to

(40:21):
replace the water heater youknow, along with it with it, so
we'll say, hey, we can fix itand it might get some more time
out of it, but we can just put anew one into.
It's up to you to where thesalesman side of it is more of
push that new one instead offixing what's wrong with it yeah
or me, and you were happy.
Yeah.
And if they go with that newwater heater, sure, but we, we

(40:49):
don't feel guilty.
Static at that point, yeah, butwe don't feel guilty because we
weren't like this shit's fucked, you need a new one now, so
this question kind of leads intothis topic.

Speaker 4 (40:55):
I was wondering do you guys ever have heartbreakers
where like you realize, oldpeople this this.
Their shit's fucked you.
They made it pretty clear theydon't have the money to do it
and you're just sitting therelike, oh my God, I want to do it
for free.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
Yeah, that does happen.

Speaker 4 (41:10):
It just kills you, and that must be a tough part of
the industry.

Speaker 3 (41:14):
That is, and that's what's driving me, and probably
you, to opening our own shithere eventually.

Speaker 2 (41:19):
That's the number one factor I would say yeah,
because I don't know you do haveto make money and there is a
difference between like I knowold guy plumbers that don't make
any money because somethingwill be broken and they'll have
a 30-cent washer in their toolbin and they know that's going
to fix it and they do it andthey make their 80 bucks and

(41:41):
then they go out to lunch.
So there is a fine line betweenlike being stupid and like,
yeah, not making any money, youknow.
But yeah you do have to makemoney at a certain point.
So that that's where that fineline kind of goes back and forth
.

Speaker 1 (41:57):
You know, you guys know what I mean so, with some
of these snaky salesmen that youguys have seen in your time
that you've been in the industry, what's the biggest ticket that
you've seen someone ride updollar amount wise we, we, just,
we just did one.

Speaker 2 (42:10):
For what?

Speaker 3 (42:10):
45 or something, wasn't sneaky they actually
needed it, but the biggestticket was 46 000.

Speaker 1 (42:15):
Yeah, damn that is insane.

Speaker 3 (42:18):
All right, now um, or I mean that's not insane when
you think about plumbing.
Do they finance that, are they?

Speaker 1 (42:24):
financing $45,000?

Speaker 3 (42:26):
I can't remember if they did I think they did.

Speaker 2 (42:28):
They financed it yeah .

Speaker 3 (42:29):
But most of the re-pipes we do like whole house
re-pipes draining the watersmost of the time they they
finance it but sometimes youthat story you know.

Speaker 2 (42:39):
The saying you don't judge a book by its cover is
definitely true.
Yeah, like we went to a homewhere, where we re-piped the
water for the house, it was all.
It was an old well, so the thewell was, you know, tons of iron
.
They had no softener, so therewas literally a needle hole oh,
that's a good story there was aneedle hole through the water
line, so they had like no waterpressure.

(43:01):
It was a farmer that owned thehome and he built it himself, he
plumbed it himself, he dideverything himself, and and you
could tell some hack plumbingjobs and, to be honest, it
wasn't that bad.
No, like the guy did for notknowing, not being a plumber, he
did a pretty decent job, damngood job.
But there was, like you, 50cats outside litter boxes
everywhere.

Speaker 3 (43:21):
Just a farm.

Speaker 2 (43:22):
It was a farm and it looked like they barely got by.
So this lady it was like a$40,000 ticket and her husband
was away, he was in Arizona, andshe was like I didn't tell him
about this, I'm just going to doit.
All new faucets, all new water.

Speaker 3 (43:38):
And me and Reed are like they're going to get
divorced when he comes home, youknow, like this is a big deal.

Speaker 4 (43:44):
And this was his work .

Speaker 2 (43:46):
Yes, this was his work, so we do all this work and
it looked really good.
Me and Reed worked super hard.
It looked beautiful and we weredone and all that and she was
really happy with us and shefinanced it just like anyone
would.
You know it's $40,000.
Whether you're rich or not,you're going to finance that
period, Especially at 0%financing.

Speaker 1 (44:05):
Yeah, especially at 0% financing.
If it's 0%, borrow the moneyfrom someone else.

Speaker 2 (44:09):
So, anyways, we get the job done, and then the woman
goes to pay on our financingapp and she goes to type in her
yearly income and, honest to GodI would say they made 40 000 a
year like I would say they madeit by and that was insane.
Concrete floors, like you know,not a nice place.
Six million dollars a year iswhat they is what they made, and

(44:35):
it was like never in a millionyears would I ever think that
they made that much money.

Speaker 1 (44:40):
But that's the thing the people that live modestly
are usually the people that gotit like that.

Speaker 2 (44:44):
Yeah, she said we own tons of rental properties in
arizona and texas and all thisstuff.

Speaker 3 (44:48):
Yeah, little do we know, but yeah, and everything
in that.

Speaker 2 (44:51):
You know, like I said , it was a, it was a farmhouse,
it was as farmhouse as afarmhouse can be.

Speaker 1 (44:56):
Oh wow, that's crazy.
Six milli and you got catsright then, and there honestly,
yeah, it definitely.

Speaker 3 (45:03):
I another a second lesson for don't judge your book
by its cover oh, 100.

Speaker 1 (45:07):
Actually, when I sold cars it was a very similar
situation happened right when Ifirst started.
There was this guy that walkedin.
I mean the guy could have beenhomeless, stained up clothes.
He comes in, I would assumemaybe a farmer, whatever blue
collar dude.
Um, everyone basically was likeI'm not taking this guy.
You see him walking around onthe lot.
I'm not taking this guysomeone's like, all right, I'll
go out and help him.

(45:28):
He ends up buying like threecars I've seen paid cash all
videos, just like that boom,like yeah, you're saying I want
this one, this one, this one,this is for me, this for my wife
, this for my daughter, whatever.

Speaker 2 (45:40):
Yeah, I was like okay yeah, done the other salesman
probably like shit.
Yeah, they're like damn it.

Speaker 1 (45:45):
Yeah, yeah, so I learned a brutal lesson that day
, like I from.
From that, like first week thatI was there, I was like all
right, yeah, I'm you.
You as much as you think youcan tell how someone has it, you
definitely cannot, youdefinitely cannot, absolutely
not, and then on the young ageon the flip side.
I would imagine you guysprobably go into a lot of really
nice houses and these peopledon't get approved for finance.

(46:07):
Yeah, yeah, right becausethey're leveraged to the max,
like they have all of theirmoney wrapped up in a bank they
can't get approved for sevengrand.

Speaker 2 (46:15):
Yeah, we've.
We've had that before right.

Speaker 1 (46:17):
When you're like dude , you live in a $500,000 house.
Yeah, how can you not?

Speaker 3 (46:21):
they put all their money towards that.

Speaker 1 (46:24):
Oh, it's a very very real thing oh yeah, because I
can't tell you how many timesagain when I sold carpets I'll
get this guy would come in in aloaded up truck, brand new thing
would probably be 70 grand andyeah, dude, can't get approved
for a new one.
Yeah sorry, buddy, you'rekeeping this thing, I guess that
is nothing anyone can get indebt yeah, dean, for sure, shout

(46:45):
out dean yeah, you know I.

Speaker 4 (46:50):
I just have to point out that I want to thank
plumbers for guys like you,because I just had the ability
to go take an amazing piss inindoor plumbing and you know you
should thank a plumber everyday.

Speaker 3 (47:02):
For those of you that are listening, thank a plumber
well, I appreciate that, but Ialso want to say I don't know
who you rent this from, but youhad a couple issues in that
toilet definitely write us up aticket.

Speaker 1 (47:13):
We'll give it to the landlord.

Speaker 4 (47:14):
Need to be looked at, dude so that's one thing with
selling brick.
Everywhere I go, I'm like thatchimney needs to be replaced.
When you go into places, do youbreak things down in your head
Like, oh, that water softener isfucked.

Speaker 2 (47:27):
Oh, yeah, yes.

Speaker 3 (47:29):
We're actually required to test the water no
matter what, no matter what.
So we test the water forhardness, chlorine, iron if
you're on a well, stuff likethat.
So we're required to do that inevery household that we enter
in, and a lot of times asoftener is not working or they
need a softener.
But at what point do you offerthis?

Speaker 2 (47:53):
It's hard to bring that up when you're there to fix
the kitchen sink.

Speaker 1 (47:55):
Right, You're there because they're like hey, listen
, I didn't call you for that.

Speaker 2 (48:00):
Yeah, I don't care about that.
Some people, some people go forit and some people are like why
the fuck are you in mymechanical room?

Speaker 1 (48:08):
you're here to fix my kitchen sink what are you doing
down here?
Do you have to explain it?
Let's, I have to, so sometimes.

Speaker 2 (48:14):
Sometimes that happens in a bad case we're told
we're not supposed to say thisis my job, this is what I have
to do.
Yeah, but in some cases if ahomeowner is mad, you know, and
they're, they're not on yourvibe.
Yeah, sometimes you once in awhile you got to play the card.
Listen, I'm just here to do myjob.
What would the zilla?

Speaker 1 (48:30):
app say if you said oh, the zilla app I would say
fire this guy right now.

Speaker 2 (48:35):
Yeah yeah, yeah so on .

Speaker 4 (48:37):
Your guys's day-to-day is there like a
certain menial task that youfind yourself doing a lot that
you just fucking hate.
You know whether it's replacinga water heater, what it is
that's gravy I I mean.

Speaker 3 (48:51):
So we're installers, as, as he said earlier,
everything.
As an installer, I don't likethe sales aspect of it.
What would you say?
I would say the shitty partabout, I would say tune-ups,
which is another discussion.

(49:12):
If you're not a salesman,tune-ups suck, tune-ups suck.
So we sell memberships A lot ofbig companies do Like a monthly
subscription yep, you will comeout and check up your check on
your stuff.
Find that stuff around hereunless it's connecticut yeah,
that's rich people's stuff noteven rich people, it's just it's
city stuff, which is fine.

(49:34):
I agree with those.
But we have to write upeverything that we find wrong in
the house.
A simple shutoff of it turns alittle bit, but it's hard.

Speaker 2 (49:46):
Like it works, but it's hard to turn.

Speaker 1 (49:47):
We're supposed to write it up, Put it on the quote
it's genius from the company'sstandpoint, because this is the
way you pick up on the smallstuff Absolutely, and this is
how they sell the jobs I meanthat's got to be a massive
source of leads.
It's these monthlysubscriptions?

Speaker 3 (50:03):
absolutely, yeah, we had.
We have 8 000 subscriptions.

Speaker 1 (50:07):
Oh my god, between the, the tri-brand electric hvac
and plumbing, wow 8 000, thecheapest is just plumbing is 12
dollars a month yeah, that'sactually not bad, and someone
comes out every single month andchecks on it Every year.
Oh, once a year they come onand check on it.
So the thing about the.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
I don't 100% disagree with the subscription thing At
all.
Not at all, because you get 10%off installs and 20% off
service work.
So if you're going to even getsomething as simple as a new
water heater, that pays foritself pretty it does pay for
itself immediately and you knoweverything is your kitchen drain

(50:44):
plugs up.
You can get it cleaned for 20or something.
So it's.
It does kind of pay for itself.

Speaker 4 (50:50):
But you have to expect once a year a plumber is
going to come to your house andtry to sell you fifteen thousand
dollars do you find plumbingbeing similar to masonry,
whereas, like if somebody's, youknow, let's talk brick for a
masonry, whereas if somebody's,let's talk brick for a second?
If somebody's top three coursesare fucked up and their crown's
cracked and we know water'sworking its way down there.

Speaker 3 (51:13):
The rest of the chimney will be fucked sooner
than later at this point, andthat's what helped him switching
from masonry to plumbing.
So you understand the concept.

Speaker 4 (51:23):
He understood it already it's it's bad right now
but it's gonna get worse andit's going to get worse quickly
and so like, almost with thismembership, having someone
checking one time a year, itcould save you some serious
fucking.

Speaker 2 (51:36):
It could like a huge.
So to go eye to eye with themasonry world, you see an old
Chicago chimney with a crackedcrown.
You know that's a moneymaker.
Oh yeah, you're good at sellingthat.

Speaker 4 (51:49):
You've done it a hundred times.

Speaker 2 (51:51):
But so to a plumber standpoint it would be.
Reed and I just had this.
Last week we went to ahomeowner and her water heater
was leaking after four years.
Now the only thing that's goingto make that water heater leak
after four years is hard water.
So she did have a watersoftener but it wasn't working.
So the hardness of the waterdeteriorates, the softener and

(52:11):
it will make it leak prematurely.

Speaker 4 (52:13):
So she wasn't having any of our shit.

Speaker 2 (52:16):
She wasn't happy with us because we were trying to
sell her a softener because herwater heater was going bad.

Speaker 4 (52:21):
She's like why do I?

Speaker 2 (52:21):
need a softener.
My water heater is going badand we were like, well, it's
because it's not working and thewater is hard.
She didn't want to grasp thatconcept, but that would be the
same thing Like if you have hardwater, it's hard on your
faucets, it's hard on your waterheater, it's hard on your
shower, everything in the home.
So if a softener isn't workingand you want to save the life of

(52:42):
everything that has watertouching it in your entire home
Including you, including- youand your skin and everything a
softener is the answer to that.
So to answer your question,that's like the three-course old
Chicago chimney rebuild is awater softener, that's not
working.

Speaker 4 (53:00):
You can display them the big picture of what the
inevitable is.

Speaker 2 (53:04):
What I did to her is the union that attaches to the
water heater was all rusty andit was only three years old and
it looked like it was 50 yearsold because the softener wasn't
working.
And I showed her, I took thepart off and I was like, look,
this is three years old and itlooks like it's destroyed.
It's because your softener'snot working.
Now most customers this isgoing to work because they're
more understanding.

(53:24):
She wasn't having any of ourshit, so she was like yeah, yeah
, yeah, whatever, but in theKanye words.
You know she was Jewish, she was.

Speaker 4 (53:36):
Jewish.
I said it.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
It's done, I said it, but yeah, she wasn't having any
of our stuff, but nine timesout of ten.

Speaker 4 (53:44):
She was busy rubbing her panties Nine times out of
ten.

Speaker 2 (53:47):
That's your golden ticket.
No way.

Speaker 4 (53:51):
Damn.
Yeah, I forgot about thatalready.
This has opened my eyes up.

Speaker 1 (53:55):
I never saw plumbing like this.
To be honest with you, I havelearned so much.

Speaker 4 (54:01):
One thing that I'm really curious about and I hope
this helps other people becauseit's going to help me do you
have a tip that you can give thelisteners?
Something that everyone shouldknow, that the average man
doesn't, that can make theirlives a little easier?
Just something you should.
If you're listening to thispodcast, you're gonna walk away
with something that might helpyou for the rest of your life I
would say number one know whereyour main shut off is, and make

(54:26):
sure it works, make sure itworks number two, or for me at
least hardness in the water.

Speaker 3 (54:34):
What's in your water.
What's in your water determineshow long your plumbing in your
home is going to last.

Speaker 2 (54:41):
Yeah, so like a great-.

Speaker 3 (54:42):
Down to your faucets, water piping, water heater.
It determines a lot, so like ifyour water is really bad.
You should get a very high-endfiltration device of some sort,
absolutely, it doesn't even haveto be high-end, just something.

Speaker 2 (54:56):
Just so like.
Here's an example let's say youown a home.
You live there for 10 years.
Everything works great, noproblem.
You shower every day.
Look at the shower head, it'sfine.
And then, let's say, a yeargoes by and you start noticing a
bunch of white crusty stuff onyour shower head, like where the
water comes out.

Speaker 4 (55:17):
That's a sign that your water softener is not
working, because that whitecrusty stuff is calcium and my
entire shower head is literallywhite yeah, so that means you
have hard water tell scrat toget on that.

Speaker 3 (55:24):
You have.

Speaker 2 (55:26):
You have, you know, two guys yeah, you have hard
water and your softener isn'tworking and, like I said before,
that's hard on everything thatwater touches, including you and
your entire house even yoursoap.

Speaker 3 (55:38):
You guys know that if you have a water softener,
you'll you will use half thesoap you use currently.

Speaker 2 (55:45):
It won't it won't set up.
Yeah, if you have really hardwater and you're it takes a lot
more to set up it'll take twiceas much soap to set up on your
body.

Speaker 4 (55:53):
Spoken like a salesman I like yeah, see that's
the stuff I don't buy, becausethat's facts yeah, seriously
though like it was dry your skinout hard water so when I, where
I grew up, my parents have nowater softener and they have the
best water I've ever drank andthey're on a well right yeah
yeah, it's amazing water youcome across that every once in a

(56:15):
while.
Yeah, it's amazing dude, then Ilived at my grandparents.
They have a full system, thehardest water I've ever dealt
with.
It's like a whole differentsubstance that you're dealing
with.
And now where I live right now,it's about right in the middle,
so I've seen all the spectrums.

Speaker 2 (56:29):
Every city is different.
Here in Pine City we havehorseshit water.

Speaker 3 (56:32):
Yeah, horseshit.

Speaker 2 (56:33):
Horseshit Rune baby.

Speaker 3 (56:35):
Including PFAS.

Speaker 2 (56:37):
Yeah, including PFAS and a little example.
Is so anything over-?

Speaker 3 (56:41):
What's PFAS?
Forever Chemicals, foreverChemicals.
Yeah, you've heard of them,right yeah?

Speaker 2 (56:46):
So like hardness in your water.
What is it?
Anything over?
Is it four or seven grains hard?

Speaker 3 (56:50):
Anything over three.

Speaker 2 (56:51):
they consider hard Anything over three they say you
should have a softener forAnything over 11 grains.
Hard is considered extremehardness water.
Pine city has 25 grains hardwater holy our water.

Speaker 4 (57:05):
That's the shit you're drinking over at nickels
dude yeah, and he's right, bythe water tower.

Speaker 3 (57:10):
Yeah, my water my.

Speaker 2 (57:12):
So the shutoff valves in my in my apartment.
I lived at my apartment for ayear and they're already seized.
They don't move.
So if a leak were to happen, Ican't shut my water off because
the water is so hard.
They already seized everythingup, whoa so, depending on what
was that?
20 something 25 yeah sodepending on where you live.
Like I know, minneapolis haspre-treated water, so by the

(57:33):
time the water enters your homeit's usually like four grains
hard.
It's pretty good but if youlive in like brooklyn park, they
have really hard water.
Or every city, every watertower has a different, different
water like hardness.

Speaker 3 (57:46):
I love hearing this guy talk because, dude, you're
like the jedi mask dude, make meso proud of you.
I'm literally about to tear up.
This is amazing, do you?

Speaker 4 (57:57):
guys, do you?
Oh, my god, dude, I totallyforgot my question.

Speaker 1 (58:03):
I pulled a Cody dude.
Oh my god, it's probably fromthat P-Foss in the water.

Speaker 4 (58:06):
I lost it.
I'm fucking dying dude.

Speaker 1 (58:08):
It's all those microplastics.
It is, I remember.

Speaker 4 (58:12):
Do you guys have any opinion On fluoride in the water
?

Speaker 3 (58:14):
That's the P-Foss.
I don't know much about it, Ijust know.
No, fluoride in the water isthe best.
That's what, bobby.

Speaker 4 (58:20):
Kennedy said, and I'll believe it until I die.
Oh, Bobby.

Speaker 3 (58:23):
Kennedy no, yeah, like I said, I don't have much
opinion.
I just know fluoride is better.

Speaker 4 (58:31):
Fuck fluoride.

Speaker 2 (58:32):
Fuck.
Fluoride.
Lowers that T dude.
Now one question we always askit does.

Speaker 3 (58:36):
I did not.
Okay, I'm going to add that oneto that.
I can't afford it.

Speaker 1 (58:39):
I just heard this recently actually, and Taylor
and I got into a big argumentover this because she talks to
the doctors at her work and theysay fluoride is perfectly fine,
where does she work?
I'm not going to say it, butshe works at a hospital,
actually at a clinic that'sattached to a hospital.

Speaker 3 (58:53):
What's that called?

Speaker 1 (59:03):
So, anyways, she was saying that they're saying the
fluoride perfectly fine,perfectly normal.
They recommend that you have acertain amount of fluoride
because it prevents cavities inyour mouth and dental health
outweighs the health benefits orthe health disadvantages that
you get from consuming it.
But I'd heard back in the daywhen fluoride first was
introduced into the water supply, it was actually a byproduct of
aluminum manufacturing and theywere trying to figure out, like
what the hell do we do with allthis stuff?
And they figured out like oh,prevents cavity oh, they found

(59:26):
money.
They found a way to make moneyoff of it pretty much, ah makes
sense pretty much, pretty muchyeah yeah, it's hard to deny
dude.

Speaker 4 (59:33):
Everything's about getting that buck baby heard
that.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
But hey, we got good teeth.
Now I don dude, did you?

Speaker 3 (59:39):
grow up on fluoride City water?

Speaker 1 (59:41):
No, I've always lived on well.

Speaker 3 (59:43):
I don't even think Pine City has fluoride in their
water?

Speaker 1 (59:45):
I'm sure they do, do they?
I don't even know.
I don't even know.

Speaker 4 (59:49):
We got that hard fucking water.
We got to talk to a smart guy.

Speaker 1 (59:50):
Where's TK?
Tk went to the bathroom.

Speaker 4 (01:00:03):
You grew up on was crazy, though it smelled like
blood, like it's, oh it's.
I mean, there's so much ironlike you have the orange bathtub
.

Speaker 3 (01:00:07):
Oh yeah, yes, yeah, like the bathtub was white at
some point, but it's orangegarden hose oh yeah, but there's
nothing more refreshing on an80 degree day than ice, cold
iron water.

Speaker 4 (01:00:15):
Oh good dude, I slammed hose water like I,
especially before.
It was like a meme thing.
That was something I couldreally relate to once I got
older and sat on social media,because that was one of my
favorite things in the world wasturning that little bitch on
and fucking slurping her off.

Speaker 1 (01:00:32):
Imagine how much nasty shit that picks up coming
through that hose after it'sbeen sitting there for weeks.

Speaker 3 (01:00:36):
And what is that hose made out of?

Speaker 1 (01:00:38):
Yeah right, PFAS.

Speaker 3 (01:00:40):
Plastic.

Speaker 1 (01:00:41):
You're just drinking microplastics, everything's made
with forever chemicals.
Yeah, that's going to be ourgeneration's asbestos.
I think, Absolutely.
It's going to be plastics.
We put plastics in everything.
I think our generation isdealing with everything.
Yeah, I feel like we got theasbestos, we got the lead.

Speaker 2 (01:01:02):
We got the asbestos, we got the lead, we got the
plastics.

Speaker 3 (01:01:03):
Don't touch those papers.

Speaker 1 (01:01:04):
That's why we need RFK.
Baby Boys.
I think that's a good place towrap this thing up.
Is there anything that you guyswant to add?
Hell of a time.

Speaker 4 (01:01:09):
Thank you so much for coming out?

Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
Yeah, thank you very much for having us.
Is there anything you want toadd before we dip out of here?

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
If you need any work done, you can hit up me or Reed.
We'll put a heater in yourhouse softener, absolutely it
doesn't matter, we'll be there.
Have a case of beer for us.

Speaker 1 (01:01:24):
Hell yeah, and they won't even show any crack if you
don't want them to.

Speaker 4 (01:01:26):
So one thing before we go.
I know that you guys don't workdirectly with a lot of
different trades, but is there atrade you want to call out to
just say fuck you to them, Fuckyou, electricians, are pussies.

Speaker 2 (01:01:38):
HVAC you are too.
Hvac is nerds and electriciansare pussies.

Speaker 1 (01:01:45):
We can end it on that All right now.
We got to get an electrician on.

Speaker 3 (01:01:47):
Fucking right.

Speaker 1 (01:01:48):
No, don't do that, we'll see you later.