From Oil Fields to Entrepreneurship: Building a Construction Business

Send us a text

When Dayton Rivera looked around at his colleagues in the oil and gas industry, he noticed something troubling – out of thousands of workers, only a handful maintained solid relationships with their families. That observation changed everything, propelling him from a traveling heat treatment specialist at nuclear plants to the founder of his own construction business, Leaf and Lumber.

Dayton's entrepreneurial journey breaks all the conventional rules. With no formal business education, he turned to YouTube to learn everything from creating an LLC to generating invoices. "YouTube is the number one tool I have at my disposal," he explains, highlighting how accessible knowledge has transformed career possibilities for anyone willing to learn.

His resourcefulness extends to creative business strategies – like using his ice fishing trailer (from his Two Scoops podcast) as both a construction materials storage unit and mobile office, allowing him to legitimately write off expenses. While building decks and fences throughout Wisconsin and Minnesota, he's developed a reputation for meticulous craftsmanship and clear communication with clients.

The conversation explores practical wisdom for aspiring entrepreneurs in the trades: the importance of calling Diggers Hotline before excavation, navigating building permits across state lines, managing seasonal transitions from construction to snow removal, and knowing when to walk away from jobs that don't feel right. "Trust your gut, trust your judgment, trust yourself," Dayton advises, highlighting why proper insurance and business structure are non-negotiable from day one.

Whether you're considering starting your own construction business or simply appreciate authentic conversations about entrepreneurship, Dayton's story demonstrates how success comes from balancing technical expertise with smart business practices while never losing sight of what matters most – family and relationships.

Have you been thinking about starting your own business? What's holding you back? Share your thoughts or questions in the comments!

0:06 Introduction to Dayton Rivera

5:31 Tax Write-Offs and Ice Castle Uses

14:40 Diggers Hotline and Utility Safety

24:20 Starting a Construction Business

38:10 The Art of Deck Building

47:48 Working With Permits and Inspectors

54:20 Trade Rivalries and Concrete Work

Check out our sticker packs at OnTapWithTheBoiz.com

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode
of the ONTAP podcast.
Today we have a wonderfuledition of Blue Collar Happy
Hour.
You got me, my good friend Samand our new friend Dayton Rivera
.
What's going on, man?
Not much, guys, thanks forhaving me on.
So, dayton, you do a lot ofstuff.
You are host of the Two Scoopspodcast, ice fishing podcast.

(00:22):
You have your own videographycompany, vx media.
You do a little bit ofconstruction, a little bit of
carpentry with leaf and lumber.
Let's let's dive into the leafand lumber man.
What do you?
What do you do exactly?

Speaker 2 (00:33):
so it's.
It's just me leaf and lumber.
We started doing our own thinglast year, um, just navigating
the business side of it, whichmelts my mind.
But we I focus a lot on decksand fences around our area.
We'll do doors, windows, somesiding projects, but mostly
within the scope of a one-manjob, not to say I've got buddies

(00:57):
that can come help me.
But for the most part we'rekeeping it pretty small, taking
my time between both the videoproduction stuff and
construction stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
Totally yeah.
So you're a small businessowner.
I want to get right into it andtalk tax evasion.
How are you using your right?
I'm just kidding, I'm justkidding, I actually I had heard
on another podcast that you wereon you talk about.
You wrote off your ice housefor that.
You use for the two scoopspodcast because you use it as a
trailer for leaf and lumber.

Speaker 2 (01:26):
Yes, so I talked to my certified tax guy.
This is not just me, he's likewell, at first he's like I need,
I need a list of all your tools, equipment, you know, truck
trailer tools, batteries,whatever.
I need a hard list of this.
And I had my dump trailer onthere.
And then I'm also like you knowwhat I use my?

(01:48):
I use my ice castle as atrailer totally, because like
I'm not gonna put trim in mydump trailer and have it all
rained on and stuff totally, soslap it in there also, use it as
my office.
Really, like my house is prettysmall, it's like 800 square
feet, so like I pop out to myshack at my whole like editing
studio and do all my book workand stuff in there.
So he's like but you do use itfor personal use.

(02:11):
I'm like, obviously, yeah.
He's like, oh, we can do halfof it.

Speaker 3 (02:13):
I'm like perfect, awesome half is better than zero
.

Speaker 2 (02:17):
Yeah, I would have never thought about it honestly,
like, yeah, the tax game issomething like I'm super curious
about because it is a game I'mnot good at it, right now
totally I will be good at it,but well.

Speaker 1 (02:31):
One thing that we've learned, I think, while doing
these blue collar happy hours,is finding out like a lot of
these really successfulconstruction guys, or just guys
in the trades, are the peoplethat learn how to navigate those
small little things really well.
Like these are the guys thathave these huge navigate those
small little things really well.
Like these are the guys thathave these huge cabins.
That's like this cabin also hasa big shed and that's where I
keep my material or whatever youknow.

(02:52):
Like there's all these littlethings that you can kind of play
the game.
You know Right, so you just got.
Next you can upgrade to afull-size cabin.
That's your office.

Speaker 3 (03:03):
Yep, do you drive the ice castle up to job site,
sometimes if it's cold enoughyeah used as a worm shack,
motherfucker sleeping out here.

Speaker 1 (03:11):
Yeah, it's cooking, cooking in there, that's
brilliant.
Yeah, a job site kitchen.
Yeah, dude a bathroom.

Speaker 2 (03:18):
I mean, if this was like if some dude brought his
ice castle to like a wholeconstruction crew, the thing
would be destroyed in a week.

Speaker 3 (03:27):
I can't even imagine I'm sitting here thinking about
I work for a masonry company Onthe job site.
If you got to go take a piss,you just go into the trailer,
lock up the doors.
It's dark as fuck.
It's hot as fuck in there.
You feel like you're going todie.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
But holy fuck, if I could go sit up in the ice
castle for a little bit.
No one's leaving there.
You got heat, you got ac.
Yeah.
You got a fridge, probably.
Yep, oh my god that's a full rv.

Speaker 2 (03:51):
There's a fancy one.

Speaker 1 (03:52):
Does it have a fireplace in it?

Speaker 2 (03:53):
no, it doesn't have a fireplace.

Speaker 1 (03:55):
It's not that fancy okay rising bed, you hit a
button.
No, okay, if I did.

Speaker 2 (03:59):
There are things like me and my wife want to upgrade
this in the future and, yes,that is like the number one
thing like before, like thehydraulic lifts.
It's that freaking bed in theback, like I hate making the bed
.

Speaker 1 (04:12):
I want it to just yeah, that's the first time I
ever stayed in one of those.
I was like how reliable arethese things?
Like am I gonna crash down ontothis person?

Speaker 2 (04:22):
sleeping on the bed below me.

Speaker 3 (04:25):
Yeah, so I was a little hesitant, but yeah,
they're.

Speaker 1 (04:28):
They're a lot more sturdy than I would have thought
, honestly, but uh, so you, youstore a lot of material in there
.
What is when you're not usingit for fishing?
Are you just storing materialin there all the time?

Speaker 2 (04:38):
no, no, I'm you're like camping.

Speaker 1 (04:40):
It's my office like yeah, I suppose do you literally
treat it like an office, likeyou got your laptop in there, oh
, dude, I've got my laptop, I'vegot my external monitor up
there, my speakers.

Speaker 2 (04:51):
So you know, I've got kind of like your setup a
little bit, your main computer,hdmi to a bigger screen,
whiteboards everywhere, like soI can keep my schedule right,
dude that's so much.

Speaker 3 (05:04):
Literally it's a job trailer Like you see at the
corporate.
You know the union jobs, excepton crack.

Speaker 2 (05:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (05:10):
I love it, dude it's great, you got my mind fucking
twisted.
Okay, listen, now that the taxguys are done listening.
Do you actually use this thingas an office?

Speaker 2 (05:18):
I do.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
I'm not even kidding.
I I'll send you a picture.
No, I'm just kidding, and it'skind of.

Speaker 2 (05:24):
I don't know if I could play this, but you know,
with filming Two Scoops in there, like it's kind of marketing
for Leaf and Lumber, 100%.

Speaker 1 (05:33):
Yeah, not only that, but like Two Scoops is its own
business itself, especially ifyou start doing ad reads yeah, I
guess.

Speaker 2 (05:37):
So it's sponsored a little bit.
If you make any money from that, that's a business.

Speaker 1 (05:40):
Yep, that's a business, yep.
You know, dude, you're ontosomething here.
Right off those DGI mics, youread off the scoops already.

Speaker 2 (05:47):
I didn't read all the fishing gear because you're
fishing $5.

Speaker 1 (05:50):
You're buying rods and reels on the tax man's
dollar next year.

Speaker 3 (05:54):
And I think it's more than fair.

Speaker 1 (05:57):
It's all.
It's all showbiz, it's all partof showbiz.
So, um, it's all part ofshowbiz.
So you say you primarily focuson decks and fences.
Now I think when I think guysthat do decks and fences by
themselves, I think someonewho's had to learn the hard way
and has hit into some sort ofutilities.
Have you ever dug into powerlines, water lines, septic,

(06:21):
anything like that?

Speaker 2 (06:23):
I have line septic, anything like that I have.

Speaker 1 (06:32):
I have dug into a cord which I use my gas ice
auger to drill.

Speaker 2 (06:34):
Some of them posts dude, it's fucking terrifying at
times because if you do notanticipate it like catching,
it'll rip your fucking arms offoh, I bet bet.

Speaker 1 (06:43):
So like you hit a tree root and this thing is
ripping, yeah, it's violent man,it sucks.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
But so before I do any drilling or anything, call
Digger's Hotline, you know, dothe right thing and make sure
you stay within their parameters, you know, because there's.
Yeah, I would hate to actuallyhit a live wire, just you know.
Know for my safety too.

Speaker 1 (07:05):
Like that'd be a bad day, dude, that'd be crazy
especially you're using a iceauger, like you're getting every
bit of that electricity iceblades on it, so usually it cuts
the small roots pretty good.

Speaker 2 (07:15):
But I did hit this, this line, this wire, and like,
immediately saw like oh, that'snot a root, that thing is might
be spicy.
I'm looking at it, I'm likenothing's marked out over here
and it just ended up being a Idon't know weird telephone line
or some thank god, extensioncord some bullshit.

Speaker 1 (07:32):
You gotta like when you see that your heart's got to
drop a little bit oh, yeah,yeah, yeah, it's just an old
landline, yeah I like, went tothe homeowner I'm like is your
internet working?

Speaker 2 (07:43):
is any power breakers ?

Speaker 3 (07:45):
like no, we're good, I'm like is your internet
working?

Speaker 2 (07:46):
Is any power breakers like no, we're good.
I'm like okay, cause your car'sextended warranty still intact.

Speaker 3 (07:51):
I'm not asking because anything happened.
I'm just curious.

Speaker 2 (07:54):
But no, I haven't had really any like horror stories
with striking like a gas line oranything.

Speaker 1 (07:59):
Well, dude, good on you, because I feel like there's
been some people that have hadto learn the hard way.

Speaker 2 (08:04):
I mean, just call Digger's Hotline, it's free,
it's a free service.

Speaker 1 (08:08):
Just do it Peace of mind, save your ass, even if
you're going to do this yourselfat home.
I just built a deck at my houselast summer and I had someone
come and market out themselves.
What's the process of callingDigger's Hotline?
You say like, hey, I'm going tobe digging in this spot.
Do they come out and market, ordo they give you coordinates
where shit is?

Speaker 2 (08:27):
Nope.
So the process with that is, ifyou get some paint like they
use on football fields, ornormal spray paint, just roughly
spray paint on your yard whereyou want your fence to go or
anything you're digging, andthen you call 8-1-1 I think it's

(08:48):
8-1-1, just google diggershotline you'll get a number,
then they'll.
They'll ask you some questions.
You know, are you a homeowner,are you a contractor?
Are you blah, blah, blah?
Where are you located?
At what's your address?
When's a good time to come out?
They'll get all yourinformation like how far are you
digging down?
Okay, then they'll have allthis data about you.
Know what utilities are in thatarea, and they'll be like we're

(09:11):
gonna send a guy out there.
He'll mark where those linesare.
Oh, they do, okay, and you can.
You can be like can you markthe safety zones within like
five feet of this line?
So they get out there.
They mark where their lines are.
They'll put flags down too.

Speaker 1 (09:27):
So yeah, see I, I was really bad about that.
When they came out marked mine,I literally mowed the next day
and didn't move a single flag,shot the flags all over my yard.
So thank god they spray paint,because I would have never known
where my stuff is at and it'stotally free.

Speaker 2 (09:45):
Like you don't give them a credit card, you don't
give them anything.

Speaker 1 (09:47):
That's insane it's so when they, when they first call
you know and they ask you know,are you a contractor, are you a
homeowner or whatever I mean,my first thought is like what
are you a cop?
Why do you need to know that?
What kind of a database am I?

Speaker 2 (10:02):
on right now.
I'm sure it goes somewhere.
I mean weirdos tracks.
That's why it's free they'retracking your data I think
they're free because they justdon't want any dipshits like
swiss cheesing.
That probably makes more sense.
Yeah, that probably makes moresense.

Speaker 1 (10:15):
Yeah, well, we have a buddy who's a lineman, who he
fucks up all the time he'staking down power lines
embarrassing embarrassing.
Yeah, he's terrible.
He barely made it through lineschool.
So that's why I asked you know,he said he went through the
trenches in line school.
So you know it's kind of thethe running joke.
He's just kind of the the hackof the lineman industry.
So I'm glad to hear that you dothings the right way, because

(10:38):
I've always actually reallywondered about that.
When I did my deck, I I don'teven think I even set it up for
them to come and do it I thinkmy electrician did.

Speaker 2 (10:46):
Yeah, sometimes they'll take care of that too
yeah okay, well, that's good.

Speaker 3 (10:49):
So I was just curious before you started your company
, where did you get yourexperience?
Did you pick it up growing up?

Speaker 2 (10:56):
Did you work for somebody else.

Speaker 3 (10:58):
I'm just kidding.

Speaker 2 (11:00):
So right out of high school I went and worked.
This is kind of off topic, butI worked in the oil and gas
industry doing heat treatment.
So I'd work at, like nuclearplants and gas refineries all
across the country and so I'dhave the busy like turnaround
seasons where they'd shut theseplants down.
We'd come in, we'd do our joband on like the off seasons I'd

(11:25):
come back and work with someconstruction crews here, just
kind of pivoted between the two,and then finally I was like I
told myself, out of thethousands of dudes that I've
worked with, only a couple ofthem had pretty solid
relationships with their wivesand kids, and that was super
important to me.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (11:46):
To to not have that.
Okay, Let me preface it To nothave that.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
I don't want to be close to my wife and kids.

Speaker 2 (11:52):
It was super important to me that my
relationship with my wife andkids are going to be like rock
solid.
So I was like I can't.
I can't do this being in thisindustry, so promised myself
when I got married that's itdone.

Speaker 3 (12:05):
So got married, quit that traveling job, started with
the company out of luck, andthen worked with them for one or
two years and then was like Ididn't do my own thing yeah,
absolutely, and that's why I washoping that that was your
origin story, because that'swhat I love about the world we
live in today is, with ouraccess to google, anyone can

(12:27):
start a company.
You know, you get your, you go.
You gotta learn the trade,don't get me wrong.
Get some experience, but yougotta self-teach yourself.
It's the availabilities there.
You don't have to go to thefucking library yeah, dude,
that's the crazy thing.

Speaker 1 (12:41):
People think it's a joke that, like you know,
literally you can learn onYouTube.
People call it YouTubeUniversity.
I love YouTube University, dude.
I completely agree with you Inever would know how to run
cameras, how to do half thethings I do, if I didn't have
access to something like YouTube.
Absolutely, it's insane.

Speaker 3 (13:02):
Dude, I just bought a Traeger pellet grill the other
day.
I have looked up.
Here we go every single thingthat I've.
I've looked up multiple recipes.
I've watched youtube videos.

Speaker 1 (13:12):
Oh yeah, I would have been just fucking dead in the
water, oh yeah well, it's alittle bit different, obviously,
than what you're probably usedto cooking on and yeah, but like
yeah, dude, it changed my lifeyoutube is the number one tool.
I would say my number one tool,like hands down, that is, the
most valuable tool that I haveat my disposal is youtube 100

(13:33):
because the thing is too likepeople are out there trying to
make a living just teach, justshowing you how to do what you
want to do, and they get moneyby you viewing it anyway.
So like it's just a full circlething, like how could you not
before that?

Speaker 2 (13:47):
when, when I tell you guys that I I split from my, my
construction crew and was likeI'm doing my own thing, it was
literally like this I had noidea.
No idea how to start a business, how to make an llc, how to
create invoices, how toeverything, and everything was

(14:07):
like all right, I need to buckledown for like a week of
straight of just likeresearching how to set up a
business and get my insuranceand everything.
And it was literally on youtube.
That was it.
So it was like I love youtubeso much dude.

Speaker 3 (14:23):
100 mean you know, if you're anything like me,
sometimes I need to put myselfin a position where it's like,
if I don't figure this out, I'mfucked, and that's when I
succeed, and so I can onlyimagine you're like fuck it, I
can't do this anymore, I'm goingto start my own, and it's go
time from that very second, howwas that received from the crew

(14:45):
that you left?

Speaker 1 (14:45):
because I know this is like a very common thing that
people don't do what they wantto do on their own in fear of
like, oh these guys are gonnahate me or I'm gonna leave on
bad terms or they're gonna makefun of me, um, I think I don't
think we left on the best terms,but I will say this has never
been like really publicly.

Speaker 2 (15:05):
So I used to work with bio builders ryan bile was
his name been super great to me.
We left on kind of rocky termsbut I will say, like that dude
and him in austin I don't knowif there's anybody else there
they are solid carpenters likeeven though I branched away with
them, I would, if there'ssomething like I do not know how
to do, I would send them to himevery single time because

(15:27):
they're so good.

Speaker 1 (15:29):
And I think that's rare.
I think a lot of times whathappens when people break off.
They're like fuck those guys.
They're dead to me Because alot of times they don't receive
it well that you're trying to doyour own thing as well.

Speaker 2 (15:41):
I don't think it was received well or anything.
It was not the best situation,but I've got a lot of respect
for him and he was very, verygood to me too.

Speaker 1 (15:47):
That's sweet.
So what?
What were some of the hurdlesthat you had to overcome?
Quitting your thing Like howdid you navigate?
Okay, I need to do an LLC.
I need to figure out how to gethow to source materials.
I need to figure out how to dobilling.
Did you go for the first stepsto learn?

Speaker 2 (16:02):
youtube.
We just went over youtube.
Yeah, of course but, I didn'tknow.

Speaker 1 (16:05):
Like a lot of times there's like someone that you
know that's done it in the pastor that you look up to.

Speaker 2 (16:10):
That's like, hey, let me see if I had me on game.
Yeah, if I had any like mentorsor oh, let me think, killer
question, yeah, no, yeah, okay,so youtube.
Youtube was a big, big help withthat.
I mainly just was like allright, I can't just take cash
jobs and just under the tableeverything I need to make this

(16:35):
legitimate, yep.
So the first step was creatingan LLC, which in the past it was
daunting thinking about goingthrough the legal process of
actually making an llc.
Well then, I mean, it's just,it's just like everything it's.
It's extremely like scary orwhatever.

(16:56):
Just it's only because it'sunfamiliar, like once you're
familiar with something likesecond nature.
So once we just got the firststeps rolling then it was like
all right, this is manageable,like this is actually not that
bad.
And yeah, youtube helped a lotwith it, with the steps and
processes.
But then after that, insurancewas not super hard because my
wife's an insurance agent.

(17:17):
Oh, jensen sunquist, so likeeverything insurance is like
this is your department, honey.

Speaker 3 (17:23):
You help me with this please Do you have the wife
help you out with your business?
Does she have a role that sheplays, or is it mostly something
you handle?

Speaker 2 (17:32):
No, it's mostly me Actually.
No, she's like the schedulekeeper.
I'll be good.
I love Google calendars.
Yeah, I don't put likenotifications on there, so she
will be like hey, did yourealize you have this meeting?
I'll be like yes, I did, buthonestly I didn't.
She catches me quite a bit withthat, oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:55):
No, I get that.
I get that.
I'm a big fan of using thecalendar on my phone because if
I didn't, I'd be so screwedRight.
I'm so bad at keeping that inthe front of mind.
Also, like when you're doingactively doing a job and trying
to schedule a job look, thoseare two totally different things
.
Yeah, it's like while you'redoing it you almost forget about
the scheduling aspect and thenlike to have to come in and out
of that role.

(18:15):
That's tough for a lot ofpeople.

Speaker 2 (18:17):
It's.
The tough part for me right nowis from being on a job and then
like trying to find the time topull away for just just a
little bit, pull away from it tokind of get the ball rolling
for the next project.
Like I always in in the firstyear, that was kind of my main
struggle was I'm on a job, I gotthe bid, whatever customer

(18:40):
likes it, I'm gonna knock thisout and be done with it, then
onto the next one.
But that's really not superefficient because then I'm
scrambling, like I got this lagtime of like getting materials
to the next one.
So I think this year is more oflike a scheduling hurdle for me
is where I need I'd be on a job, take a step back, plan for the

(19:00):
next one, get materials runningfor the next one and just roll,
roll, which seems on paper.
It's simple, like just do it,but it's not always easy.
It's like running five miles.
The concept is simple, likejust put one foot in front of
the other, but it's not easy.

Speaker 3 (19:17):
Especially once it starts getting hot as fuck.

Speaker 2 (19:20):
For sure, dude, I'd rather work in hot than cold.
I hate working out in thewinter, and if anybody tells you
they do, they're fucking lyingto you.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
Yeah God, I hate that , yeah 100%.

Speaker 3 (19:29):
Dude.
Especially I always feel forthe framing guys, Seeing them
put their fucking car, hearts on.
Yep.
It's like holy fuck.
The only time they get a dayoff is if it's fucking negative
40.
They don't even get the snowoff.

Speaker 1 (19:41):
No rain days in the winter we were talking with our
buddy bode.
He's a framer and or he doesframing and uh, he was telling
us one time about we actuallyhad him on for blue collar happy
hour.
He was talking about thedifferent layers that he'll put
on if it's cold out yep, andlike layering up and it's like
damn I didn't realize how muchthought went into just what
you're wearing when you'reoutside all day and it's like
zero degrees.

Speaker 2 (20:01):
That would would suck and you think you'd wear like
negative or zero.
Most guys don't wear below zero, I think, as like a standard.

Speaker 3 (20:11):
It's a good rule of thumb, yeah.

Speaker 2 (20:13):
But I think most people think that everyone's
super bundled up but really like, once you get moving and stuff,
you don't really need that.
So that's why we have layers.

Speaker 3 (20:23):
That's how you know.
He knows what he's talkingabout.

Speaker 2 (20:25):
Dude, that's exactly what bode said my, my thing was
it.
It's all about your outer shelllike it just needs to be
windproof.

Speaker 3 (20:33):
That's it, I'm 100 oh my god, dude, even like, I
think of like my hunting gear,because that's when I bundle up
the most during deer hunting,and none of my shit is
waterproof.
So I'm warm, I'm good.
As soon as it starts raining,my day is fucked.

Speaker 2 (20:50):
I turn into an instant bitch when I get wet.

Speaker 3 (20:53):
Instantly.
I can co-sign that all day.

Speaker 1 (20:57):
Yeah, it's not fun.
Especially you add cold to wetand then it's double F-less.
I did security for a little bitfor this company.
That was like a contractor forsecurity, and I did the red bull
crash dice when I was a kid.
Oh, that sounds fun I was right,like 16, you know, but I all I
had was my hunting boots likethese, just irish setter hunting
boots.
They're not insulated.
It was like negative 20 and myfeet got wet as I'd stepped in a

(21:20):
puddle.
This was when it was downtownst paul stepped in a puddle.
This was when it was downtownSt Paul.
I stepped in a puddle.
My feet are soaking wet.
My boots are rock hard.
There's no insulation.
I started feeling like I washaving hypothermia because I'm
so cold and so tired.
Dude, it sucked.
I legitimately kept walkingback to this job trailer that
they had there and I was like Ijust got to warm up.

Speaker 2 (21:40):
It would have been nice if it was an ice castle.
Yeah, it would have A littledrop down bed, take a little
snooze Dryer in there.

Speaker 3 (21:48):
Light a cigarette off the electric fireplace.
Yeah, dude, that's cold feet,that's my kryptonite right there
, I'll just call it a day.
At that point, there's nothingworse, especially I used to rip
like rubber, insulated boots,like 800 grams of insulate, huge
rubber boots, and it got a holein them.

(22:08):
And so these, thesemotherfuckers are already heavy
as fuck.
And then all of a sudden,you're trudging through some
bullshit, you think you're goodto go, and now that boot's
filled up, now you're cold andit's three times as heavy.

Speaker 1 (22:20):
It's not the move no, that's like uh, I don't know if
you're hunting at all.
Do you ever wear waders?
Do you ever go duck hunting?

Speaker 2 (22:26):
Dude.
No, I actually I think I mighthave an opportunity to film some
guys' duck hunts and that's theone thing I was worried about.
I'm like I don't know if I wantmy filming gear to be all in
the marsh you got insurance.

Speaker 1 (22:39):
It's worth more damage than it is working.

Speaker 2 (22:41):
Yep, no, I've never been duck hunting.
No, it is fun.

Speaker 1 (22:44):
The only reason why I ask is because the only thing
that I can think of worse thangetting regular work boots
hunting boots wet is gettingwater in your waders.

Speaker 2 (22:53):
No, that's happened to me.
I used to fly fish down at clamfalls and I I got into a hole,
oh, and all the water seeped inthere.
I thought I was gonna die yeah,I got to the bottom and did
like the spring up.
Thankfully got above it out ofthat hole.
But I thought that was it forme.

Speaker 3 (23:09):
Oh, dude, yeah, there's nothing worse, I wonder
how many people a year die byway of waiters and no, because
it literally will weigh you downwhen it starts getting a lot of
them they float.
Now that's like a big sellingpoint is that they float and it
it.
I don't know if it's true, butit makes people buy their shit I
mean, yeah, I would hope.

Speaker 1 (23:29):
I guess I've never there's been.
I can count on one hand howmany times I've been in deeper
than the waiters, but I can tellyou all five times.
I remember very distinctlybecause, dude, you do not forget
that it's cold, it's wet, it'slike okay, now this sucks and
usually duck hunting, it's neverwarm.

Speaker 2 (23:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (23:45):
You know, sometimes you're breaking ice out there to
go grab a duck that's just likeclose enough, you guys are
dedicated.
So, yeah, that sucks, butanyways, back to the, back to
decks and fences, right?
So now, um, I've we have acouple friends that do decks
that are always very particularabout how level that thing gets.
Yeah, like, how do you, how doyou keep these things perfectly

(24:09):
level?
Like, are you very meticulouswith your details?

Speaker 2 (24:11):
on it meticulous okay , most guys are.

Speaker 1 (24:14):
That's why I asked yep most deck guys are, like in
my experience, a different breedof you know, maybe on the
spectrum a little bit becauseit's like the attention to
detail it's like so crazy, justjust in my business too, it's
like I don't.

Speaker 2 (24:28):
I don't want to have this broad range of things that
I do.
I want to be absolutely likethe best at this, so that's,
that's super important to me.
Like, if one, if one board islike crowned or something, I
will snap a line to see how itplanes out and I will hand plane
it out.

Speaker 1 (24:46):
So it's flat, I don't want to see any humps in there
as a person who builds decks,what is your thoughts on getting
lumber from menards?

Speaker 2 (24:53):
totally fine, really.
Um they're, yeah, I use a lotof their cedar cedar tone yeah,
cedar tone, damn.
Okay, I mean so you siftthrough a lot of bullshit yeah,
okay.

Speaker 1 (25:06):
So, like I said, I just built the deck last summer.
I made the mistake of doing thedeck builder on menardscom.
Right, so I I had all thethings delivered to me oh yeah,
no, okay, caveat to this.

Speaker 3 (25:18):
I I am going to go there and pick out every single
board, yeah you literally gottahold them up, look down, you
gotta really give it some timeyeah, so I did not do that.

Speaker 1 (25:28):
I'm assuming some minimum wage 16 year old kid was
probably picking out my stuff.
Yeah, because I have never seenboards shaped like this in my
entire life.
So we put my deck together, meand my father-in-law, and dude
this thing was was bad whippy.
He luckily he's really good atfixing this kind of stuff and
he's really handy.
But we like we had to saw somuch of this and sand so much of

(25:52):
this to make it somewhat level.
And then we're likecompensating the boards by like
screwing different parts down soit looks level what does this
tree have?

Speaker 2 (26:00):
scoliosis?

Speaker 1 (26:01):
yeah, dude this thing was like whoa and it didn't
help.
That like from the time it gotdelivered to the time we put up
the deck was like, let's say,two weeks and it was raining, oh
, when they dropped it off andnone of it was covered and so,
like the sonal tubes got messedup in the rain, the lumber all
was sitting there wet, and thenit dried, and then it got wet

(26:21):
and then it dried.

Speaker 2 (26:22):
That's bad.
Yeah, dude it was really bad.

Speaker 1 (26:24):
Some of it was not even sitting on level ground.

Speaker 3 (26:26):
See, that's why you need an ice castle.

Speaker 1 (26:28):
I know you can put it all in there, I gotta talk to
my accountant.

Speaker 3 (26:32):
I'm gonna get an ice castle it's a storage shed?

Speaker 1 (26:35):
yep, it's a storage shed with an electric fireplace
I wish my mind had the drop downbecause, like everything like
the toy hauler ramp everythingthat I fit into.

Speaker 2 (26:45):
It has to like go through the door I didn't even
think about that I ripped offwhen I drove my ice castle down
to my house like a littledriveway with the woods and I I
rented a tree trimming thingbecause I knew there's some
branches that might take off theawning like oh no, and I ripped
my whole awning no oh yeah

Speaker 1 (27:06):
boo luckily you got a good in with your insurance
agent oh, I'd never even thoughtabout the insurance claim.
You should do it that's whatyou got insurance for, yep I
might just tell her, hey afterthis hey, listen, this
deductible better not go up.

Speaker 3 (27:20):
This is your thing too okay let's let's figure
something out here so, when itcomes to the decks, do you do
just new construction decks orwill you do repair work?

Speaker 2 (27:29):
I'll do repair work.

Speaker 3 (27:30):
Yeah, get all the landmines out, and yeah do you
ever walk up to a deck where youthey want it repaired and
you're like buddy, this thing isso fucked yeah.

Speaker 2 (27:39):
There has been a couple where homeowners are like
there's a couple landmines inhere, and then I'll kind of peek
in there and look at the joistsand I'm like, oh, my God.
I'm like, hey, man, I can fixthis, but I've got to fix
everything.
It's easier to just go with anew deck.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
Yeah, it's safer too, when you look at it and you
almost want to tell them hey,you probably shouldn't even walk
on this motherfucker until I dothis work.

Speaker 2 (28:08):
It hasn't been that bad, but just get it taken care
of the right way the first timeand just be done with it.

Speaker 1 (28:17):
One thing I think that people don't think of when
they're starting their owncompanies like this too is
dealing with the homeownersHaving to put that customer
service hat on.
Have you had any nightmareclients that you've built extra
fences for?

Speaker 2 (28:30):
No, I've honestly have never had an issue with
someone paying.
There's never been acommunication issue.
I think that's that.
That has been one of my, mymain priorities and I'm not the
best of this.
Who any customers who kind ofdrop the ball and but like I
strive to be a bettercommunicator with my customers
because I feel like that'ssomewhat lacking in the industry

(28:54):
.
It's like, hey, I'll get you abid and you never get a call
back, which I have,unfortunately done this, but I
do try to fucking get better atthis yeah you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (29:04):
Like it's that's something you can always improve
on, for sure, likecommunicating with these people
on their expectations, and Ithink that's where a lot of
people get caught up, you know,because they promise everything
and then deliver half of that,and then that's when it gets
messed up yeah it's like oh dude, you said you're gonna do a
good job.
These boards look like theyhave swoleosis.

Speaker 2 (29:22):
Did you get this from menards dropped off?

Speaker 1 (29:24):
you didn't pick these .
Yeah, did cody hughes pick thisdeck wood out?
What the hell is going on?
Yeah, no, I I will say I.
I'm very surprised about youranswer about the menards thing,
because a lot of the other deckguys that I know are like never
get it from Menards.

Speaker 3 (29:36):
When I told them that they're like why would you do
that?

Speaker 1 (29:38):
I'm like dude.

Speaker 2 (29:39):
Because it was cheap or cheaper, I guess yeah there's
circumstances, I will say Iprimarily use ABC in Siren.
I know they're a chain, but ifit's any like the TimberTech
Trex, the composite deckingmaterial, any of the Westbury
Tuscany rails, I go with them,that's it.

Speaker 1 (30:00):
That's what I got also.

Speaker 2 (30:02):
You got.

Speaker 1 (30:02):
Tuscany no.

Speaker 2 (30:04):
Trex, trex, yeah, good stuff.

Speaker 1 (30:07):
Yeah, but again it's like maybe the Menards version.

Speaker 2 (30:12):
But again they're like I'm holding these things up
and there are so many waves inthis, I'm like god damn, I will
not get menards composite.
I will get menards like justregular deck boards, like their
green treat or their cedar tone,but I don't push for any of the

(30:32):
composite stuff with menardsyeah, I wish I would have met
you a year and a half ago.

Speaker 1 (30:37):
Yeah, because I really screwed myself.
It looks good now.
It's not actually fullyfinished yet either.

Speaker 2 (30:42):
A good, phrase we have is like I don't know, man,
if something's iffy, they'relike it looks good from my house
.

Speaker 1 (30:47):
You live like 50 miles away.

Speaker 2 (30:48):
I'm like I know, yeah , what do they?

Speaker 1 (30:50):
say Good, from far good.
It's a.
It's a 30 foot deck, for sure.
It's a 30 foot like it looksgood from 30 feet away.
Yeah, you know, it actuallylooks really nice now but it
took took took some work to kindof get it to look that way and
also, like I said, it's notfully finished yet either.
Some stairs and some railingsome railing gone, so we'll

(31:10):
maybe have to chat afterwardsabout maybe having you come look
at this thing and finish it upfor me.

Speaker 2 (31:14):
But oh my God, Don't walk on this.
Yeah, no, I'm kidding.

Speaker 1 (31:18):
Yeah, he's going to come look on it and he's like
God damn dude, you said Menards,what the?
This looks like some Step 2Rainbow Playground work here.

Speaker 3 (31:27):
So I was just thinking about going back to
YouTube University and withhaving the ability to use Google
.
One big part of my job is I'mconsistently pulling permits and
I'm sure that's something thatyou're doing a lot with your
deck building and needing to geta ship permit to go get your
inspections.
And I've only had to do onepermit old school and that's

(31:52):
because it was a historical oneso I had to go in to the off the
main office in saint paul.
Go get, go get the permit, fillit up, bringing it in person.
But any other permit I look itup online.
I find exactly where to get it.
Grab it.
It's a fillable pdf, send it anemail, send my payment in,
approved, and that has changedmy life so much, yeah, and so

(32:15):
like it's it's all the simplethings that that change up small
businessmen's mind and like Iwould have never even known
where to go or how to doanything and I just it.
It changed everything, yeah,and I was just wondering, with
with your work, to figure outall the technicalities of it how

(32:35):
, how did you know, like, whendo you need to pull a permit for
this or when do you need to getthat inspected?

Speaker 2 (32:40):
And a lot of the cool things too is like, if the deck
frame is solid, like I don'thave to touch it, so I'm keeping
the same footprint of thestructure, like I don't need to
pull a permit for that.
If I do have to pull a permitwith that, um, if I do, if I do
have to pull a permit with it,like it's just you just go to
the town hall and stuff and justfill it out.

(33:01):
But there there are places,like by koiland, where you don't
need any like building permits,which is great oh damn okay
cool, it's crazy.

Speaker 3 (33:10):
City to city, it changed every single fucking
city's never thought about thatwith like code wise too.

Speaker 2 (33:15):
Like, the only really code that I have to really deal
with is your stair height, howit can't differ from
three-eighths from each tread.
The balusters can't be morethan four inches apart.
Just simple codes like that.
I'm not getting into the hugehome building, it's fine.
No fire blocking code, nothinglike that.

Speaker 1 (33:37):
So yeah, it's cold side is very minimal I would
imagine too, like the guys thatare issuing the permits are
different in every place.
When I did the permit for mydeck, it was literally like the
guy showed up and he's likewhere's it gonna be well?

Speaker 3 (33:49):
did you call diggers hotline?
No, no, I didn't.
Fucking bullshit, dude oh, theyare heated because it's like
what are we're paying you?

Speaker 1 (33:56):
just to be like yeah, you can do that well, the guy
asked me he's like, do you havethe plans?
And I'm like the plans likewhat?
What the blueprints?
And I'm like what do you?
Mean he's.
He just hands me a piece ofpaper and a pen.
Can you draw it out?
Yes, drew like a top-downsquare, stares off the side.
He's like all right, here'syour permit, okay.

Speaker 3 (34:15):
Okay, it's fucking bullshit Sounds good, Especially
like, so.
A lot of the permits I have topull are for chimneys.
They're obviously up on theroof and most of the inspections
you don't even have to be therefor and I know this
motherfucker is not bringing hisladder with his shirt and tie
and going up on the roof.
They just walk up.

Speaker 1 (34:33):
Yeah, looks good, that's awesome yeah, I mean I
would say that's probably theeasiest thing to go through.
Then I mean, you would thinkthat that's such like a nuanced
process and it's very official.
But I imagine they probablydeal with so much that they just
don't care.
They want to like get it goingas long as it doesn't seem like
something's off they probablywon't even dig into it.

Speaker 2 (34:50):
there's I know that there's a lot of trust too with
some builders where, if they hada good relationship, like did
you get this done?
Yes, that inspector can be likeall right, I trust this guy.
Like that's kind of nice.

Speaker 1 (35:04):
So get in with the inspector.

Speaker 2 (35:06):
Oh for sure it did.

Speaker 3 (35:07):
You definitely don't want the inspectors to not like
dude.

Speaker 2 (35:10):
I've been on a job where the inspector did not like
my boss.

Speaker 1 (35:14):
Really.

Speaker 2 (35:15):
It was so bad.

Speaker 1 (35:16):
Like he's going through everything with a
fine-tooth comb.
Like check this, check this,check this.

Speaker 3 (35:21):
It's like bad cops where they like will run through
, like how can I get thismotherfucker?
It's the same thing.
How can I ruin this?

Speaker 1 (35:31):
motherfucker's day.
Yeah, I would imagine they gotthe ability to really change up
the job pretty quick, oh yeah,oh yeah.
By the way, this is wrong.
Somebody need you to tear itall out, Yep.

Speaker 2 (35:42):
What happened?

Speaker 1 (35:43):
Did they ever find anything?

Speaker 2 (35:45):
So we were fastening the bottom plates to this house,
to the concrete slab, and whenyou drill those, we had to use,
like I don't know, a 5-8thsdrill with these tapcons or
redheads and so fasten them down, bolt them on you know what I
mean the bottom plate right tothe concrete.

(36:05):
And he gets there and he goes.
Did you blow out the holesbefore you put those bolts in?
And he's like, well, I didn'tsee it.
I'm like I I need to redo allthese no way yeah, dude, he did
this like three times.
Then he's like did you use epoxyin them?
No, you need to do that andredo the second time, like the

(36:26):
whole house and like I was likeoh my god, he really doesn't
like you man.
Like I'll keep doing this.

Speaker 1 (36:32):
I get paid by the hour yeah, just in labor alone
he start.
He starts adding on to thatcost of that job pretty quick, I
would think.
But it's done.
Yeah, that sucks, or?

Speaker 3 (36:44):
dude like osha can pull up to your job and ruin
your life in one stop I've heardthat, like we, we use
scaffolding and you put pins inall the legs of the scaffolding.
Every pin that's missing is$10,000.
Sometimes you pull up to sitesthey've got 40 different sets of
scaffolding up.
They're not using pins.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
It's a bad day to be that guy Dude scaffold at my
other job with the heat treating.
They do not joke around withscaffold tags.
Do you have tags on yours?
Yeah, every morning shift comesin checks every single square
inch of it signs off, done Ifthere's anything wrong with it

(37:26):
your whole crew, shut it down,fix it.

Speaker 1 (37:27):
Okay, if they find something, who's liable?
The company or the person whosigned off on it?

Speaker 3 (37:31):
That's a damn good question actually.

Speaker 2 (37:34):
I would never.

Speaker 3 (37:34):
That's a good way for the business to be like hey,
it's that guy's fucking fault,Right.

Speaker 1 (37:39):
We'll take it out of your check for the next two
years buddy.

Speaker 2 (37:41):
Oh man, I mean, I would think.

Speaker 1 (37:44):
Probably the company.
If it's coming from OSHA, Iwould think it's the guy Really.

Speaker 2 (37:47):
I would think it'd be the guy.

Speaker 1 (37:48):
I suppose it would depend on the company because
they could probably put it onyou.
I mean it's like okay in myhead I know this is nothing
similar, but if you're abartender and you serve someone
who's underage, the bartender'sliable and the establishment, I
think, is liable too.

Speaker 2 (38:03):
Is it kind of both yeah?

Speaker 1 (38:05):
Or it could I guess.

Speaker 3 (38:06):
Yeah, no, it does affect both.
Oh, you had a situation youworked at a gas station so
embarrassing.
I young kid still in highschool, I work at a gas station
liquor store.
Like one side liquor store, turnto the other you were the
teller, yep, and I was it waslike probably my third day ever

(38:28):
working there and the owner,he's he's now like actually a
friend.
At the time it was just likethis guy I knew that was really
nice to me, gave me a good jobopportunity and uh, so I I
wanted to impress him.
You know, I didn't want to fuckup.
Third day on the job.
Guy comes in big ass beard Iwas too scared to ask for his id
, pays cash, walks outimmediately.

Speaker 1 (38:49):
The school cop like the one that I would sit at
school watching he's like hey,how's it going?

Speaker 3 (38:54):
sam, did you just sell this alcohol?
Yeah, he sets it down.
He's like well, that man rightthere was 20 years old and he
didn't check his ID and I waslike fuck, and luckily because I
was young, it was my third dayand it was the first strike on
this place.
He gave a warning, but if youget three of them, you lose your
liquor license.

Speaker 2 (39:15):
Really that's tough.
They only have a certain amountof those.
That's a huge fucking deal.

Speaker 3 (39:19):
And so I got off easy .
I thought I was going to getfired and.
I did the right thing.
I called my boss, shout out Redright away and told him and
he's like you, fucking idiot, Inever fucking messed it up again
, that's for sure.

Speaker 2 (39:33):
I can't believe you did that.

Speaker 1 (39:38):
I'm mess it up again, that's for sure you did that.
I'm kidding dude.
I went to I live right by aspeedway and I went in there the
other day and I asked to buy atin.
And I I go in there at leastonce or twice a week.
The lady knew me and, as a joke, she's like can I see your id?
And I was like, oh my god, Idon't have my wallet on me, like
all I have is my apple pay andI was gonna pay with apple pay.
She's like well, now I can'tsell it to you.
I was like well, you know, I'mlike, I was literally just here

(40:00):
a couple days ago.
She's like no, I can't sell itto you like fuck, what if I
would have been a part of asting?
I wish I was and I wouldn't.

Speaker 3 (40:08):
I wouldn't have felt as bad I think you'd have been
an easy call.
I would have sold it to you.
What are?
You trying to say I wouldn'thave been too worried on that
one.

Speaker 2 (40:16):
I just feel so like when I get carded.
I'm 31.
29.
, 25.
I just feel kind of good.
Can I card you?

Speaker 1 (40:28):
You don't look 31.
Would I look older, I would sayyou don't look a day under 42.

Speaker 2 (40:35):
Okay, perfect.
No, I'm just kidding.

Speaker 3 (40:36):
I would say upper 20s for sure.
When it comes to gettingcarding.
So I obviously still have ababy face, 25 years old.
When I first turned 21, peoplewere looking at me like, hmm,
all right, motherfucker, let'ssee, and I didn't kick that
probably until about a year ago,where I can confidently give it
to them and they don't thinkI'm trying to pass a fake id.

(40:58):
Yeah, it was, or forever itwould be.
I was, I'd be 21 for eightmonths.
Oh, just made it fuck you bitchI'm a 99.

Speaker 1 (41:08):
I actually I kind of fucked myself on.
The last time I got a driver'slicense is I I had shaved the
top of my head like just keptthe sides like an old man look,
and I had mustache.
Yeah, and so I just thought itwas funny for a video that we
had did.

Speaker 2 (41:21):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (41:22):
And went to get my driver's license renewed right
after we had did it and I didn'tshave the rest of my head, so
that was how my driver's licensephoto looked and it definitely
it never stopped me from gettinganything.
But there was a few timesthat's like wait, hold on.
Like hey, you know, they callsomeone else over.
Like look at this, look at thisguy.
Like all right, you know.

(41:43):
But there was definitely timeswhere they're like should we
even serve this guy?
this looks nothing like that'shilarious, though I came in
originally with like these bigold guy glasses on too, and the
lady was not having it at thedmv, so this was in fargo, so
it's like one of the real dmvs.
You pull a number and you wait.
I was in there for like an hourand then I get called up and

(42:04):
the lady's like do you wearthose glasses normally?
I'm like no.
She's like if you don't takethose off, I will put on the
back that you need glasses andif you get pulled over you will
be in trouble for not havingglasses.

Speaker 3 (42:15):
I was like damn.
Seems like a very friendly lady.
I was like damn.

Speaker 1 (42:18):
Yeah, it was like a real DMV, Like we're spoiled at
a small town DMV here becauseeveryone here is nice as hell,
dude, you get a smile.

Speaker 3 (42:25):
How's your morning?

Speaker 1 (42:26):
Everyone here is nice as hell.
This lady was taking no shit.

Speaker 3 (42:29):
This place was packed .

Speaker 1 (42:31):
She was going slow, I was low, oh my god.
Yeah.
So anyways, I don't know how wegot on.
You know driver's license talk,but yeah.
So anyways, back to decks andfences.
Yeah, um, if you had someadvice for someone who wanted to
start their own carpentrycompany or just construction job
in general, if they wanted tobranch off on their own, what's
some of the best advice that youcould give that you wish you
had known?

Speaker 2 (42:52):
it's like a really good question, best advice I
would give someone who wants tostart out go on youtube
definitely youtube.
Maybe you know reach out ifreach out to me.
If you hell, I'll try to helpyou out the dms are open yeah,
the dms are open.
um, youtube works a lot, youknow, get your ducks in a row
with your insurance and get yourllc started up, so you know

(43:17):
that's kind of a part ofinsurance too.
It's where, you know, keep theliability off of you.
And then I would focus so muchon like trying to learn the
business side, cause I'massuming most people that start
out with trying to do their ownthing is like I need to be on
the tools.
But really that's like half thebattle when you're doing your

(43:38):
own thing.
Like it's the scheduling, it'sthe keeping track of your money
after that, like it's not just ayou clock in, you clock out.
You don't have a set time.
Like you're, you're alwaysfiguring some problem out.
So just roll, roll with thepunches, be be malleable,
flexible with what works anddoesn't work, and like just look

(43:59):
for the signs that this doesn'twork, that something doesn't
feel right.
Don't do it Absolutely.
If there's something, you knowwhat.
Here's a good thing too.
It's like I'm a huge fan oflike just trusting your gut.
There's a couple jobs where I'mlike something doesn't feel
right with this.
I'm just I'm not going to likesky this bid.
I'm just not going to take it.

Speaker 3 (44:19):
Yeah, don't be afraid to walk away.

Speaker 2 (44:21):
That's a, that's a really good Yep.

Speaker 3 (44:23):
We at Unlimited.
We say that all because we'llgo to some jobs where it's like
holy fuck, this is way over ourhead, right.

Speaker 2 (44:29):
And honestly so.
When you're starting out youalmost take everything you can
get, but it might.
It might fuck you.
It might fuck you.
If you take that job you don'tfeel good about.
You're like something's notright here.
It you might end up like lowballing the bid and then you dig
into something and it costs youx amount of dollars more.
And now you're under like trust.

Speaker 3 (44:50):
Trust your gut, trust your judgment, trust yourself
yeah, absolutely I agree witheverything you said, and
especially going off ofinsurance.
That's one thing I tell a lotof people is.
Especially if you're starting asmall company, they think, oh,
I'm just going to start doing afew jobs, I'll worry about the
LLC and the insurance later,once I get my money built up.

(45:10):
Insurance doesn't cost thatmuch.
And it is very, very worthhaving because if something
happens, you just got to make acouple phone calls, your life
isn't over.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
So I mean the other hack to it.
The little cheat code is justmarry your insurance agent yeah
you know?
Second piece of advice then youget it a little bit cheaper
even yet you don't get anydiscounts I just thankful like
that.

Speaker 2 (45:37):
That's her world, like she knows the ins and out
of it, not my world, I don'thave to deal with it.
Very thankful for that.

Speaker 3 (45:44):
Oh, absolutely, Sam you should start doing insurance
.
Dude, there was a period in mylife where I was pretty set that
I was going to be an insurancesalesman and didn't end up going
that way, but it's not out ofthe question.
I think I would kill.

Speaker 1 (45:57):
it didn't play baseball and or football at a
high school or college level, sokind of takes you out of the
qualifications to be aninsurance agent well, according
to my grandpa with dementia, Iplayed baseball my entire life I
would be damn.
I didn't even realize 23.

Speaker 3 (46:15):
how's baseball going?
Haven't played since I waseight Gramps, Damn.

Speaker 1 (46:23):
Oh, that's tough.
Well, congrats on the extendedcareer.

Speaker 3 (46:26):
Yeah, I actually just re-signed with the twins.
You know it's a big contract.
Took the family out, bought mymom a house Good time.

Speaker 1 (46:35):
You ever just run with it.

Speaker 3 (46:37):
Dude.
Every time I'll be like goinggood, Thanks for asking, Hell
yeah, that's why I'm hurt rightnow.

Speaker 1 (46:43):
I actually took a ball to the leg here, grant,
excuse me.
Yeah, dude.

Speaker 3 (46:52):
I don't even know, dude.
It's crazy Because it's likeconsistently, every time I saw
him up until he passed, it wasbaseball, awesome Does he live
around here.
Yeah, good, grandpa he lived inHudson, wisconsin, over in
fucking Cheeseheadville.

Speaker 2 (47:07):
Yes, yes, sir.

Speaker 3 (47:08):
Jesus Christ.

Speaker 1 (47:09):
Yeah, so when you cross over you're a Wisconsin
guy but you're really close toMinnesota.
Do you do jobs in both statesor no?
Yes, is it tougher doing jobsacross state lines?
Is there any like nuance tolike doing jobs in different
states?

Speaker 2 (47:26):
no, no, I haven't really had any.
The, the people that I've donejobs for, are literally friends
yeah, okay yeah, well, thathelps.
Yeah, I don't know if this,this is illegal or something,
but they're my friends.
I help them with no money and alegend.

Speaker 3 (47:44):
All right, we got them.
Boys, come on in.

Speaker 1 (47:46):
Ah shit the tax man's waiting outside the door yeah,
um, I would say that'sdefinitely something that I
would have thought would wouldbe a lot different, like you'd
have to have different insuranceor different permits, different
qualifications if, if, what isit?

Speaker 2 (48:04):
oh man, my tax guy said this to me if your income
it doesn't come out of minnesota, he obviously we're
specifically talking aboutwisconsin, minnesota.
He's like if you're, if 40 orless comes from Minnesota,
you're fine.
Otherwise.

Speaker 1 (48:23):
Oh, you probably got to pay a different tax rate.

Speaker 2 (48:25):
Yeah, there's something weird with that.
I'm no expert, but I know,there's some percentage there.
If you are primarily working inMinnesota, then we have to set
up something different for you.
But that's not the case.
I don't really work in.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
Yeah.
So basically your accountantsaid if it don't make dollars,
it don't really work in.
Yeah, so basically youraccountant said if it don't make
dollars, it don't make sense.
Yes, he's good, I like him.
He's a finesser.

Speaker 3 (48:45):
It sounds like so with your work does it basically
shut off when the winter comes,or are you able to stay busy
with different projects?

Speaker 2 (48:55):
So I shot myself in the foot this year because Leaf
Lumber also does snow removaland I banked on quite a bit of
that because this past winter Iwanted to film a bunch of ice
fishing content, so I wanted tokeep the schedule a little clear
.
I doubled my plow accounts,thinking we were going to just
get destroyed with snow.

(49:16):
But not the case.
Yeah, and that's kind of mybusiness model in in the winter
is I want to film a bunch ofcontent, ice fishing wise, try
to get into that scene.
More snow plow.
That's it.
But next year we're gonna have,we're gonna try to get some
construction stuff, hopefullysome interior stuff on the books

(49:39):
Hell yeah, what are you tryingto get into?

Speaker 1 (49:41):
Are you trying to get into, like, flooring, yeah,
whatever.

Speaker 2 (49:46):
Whatever?

Speaker 1 (49:46):
you can get your hands on.
I'm just trying to figure outhow we can send some business
your way.
I know, I know.
I know If we got to redo thefloor in the studio, we just
know who to call now.
Yep.

Speaker 2 (49:54):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (50:01):
It's definitely, definitely, definitely can help
with that.
It's like the hesitation inyour voice makes me think you're
really.

Speaker 2 (50:04):
Let me just watch a couple videos and I'll get back
to you.

Speaker 1 (50:06):
Yeah, so back to youtube yeah, no, I, I
completely understand.
But you're right, though thereis a fine line between wanting
to take on as much work as youcan to stay busy, but also
maintaining that quality,maintaining that good reputation
and being able to deliver agood quality project.
Yes, and I definitely am guiltyof that.

(50:27):
You know, when it comes to likethe photography, videography,
graphic design stuff, like Ifeel like it's helped me now
after doing it for so long, butat the beginning, like if
someone hit me up, it was like,hey, I want to do this animation
, I'm like, yeah, I well, I'venever done that.
Like I have no clue what to do,so literally how to do this and

(50:47):
that has saved my ass a lot oftimes.
But sometimes it's like whoa, Ididn't realize how many steps
I'm missing.
Like, oh wait, I gotta learnthis whole of the program too.
Shit, yeah.
So I would imagine it transfersover to that world from the
standpoint of like yeah, I'll dothat.
And then knowing like okay, I'mgonna have to buy these new
tools, but yep, I don't know howto use that.
I don't know what.

(51:08):
I don't know what the bestpractice is to use a floor
sander.
Do I rent one?
Do I buy one?
You know?
Yeah, um, do you ever do anyconcrete?
You ever do any concrete?

Speaker 2 (51:18):
I've I've worked with concrete, with a buddy, but I
don't know.

Speaker 3 (51:21):
Dude, concrete sucks.
I don't know why people likedoing it so much, Because around
here it's a big concretecommunity.
People get fucking hyped up forCrete.

Speaker 1 (51:31):
It's fucking Crete boys.

Speaker 3 (51:34):
And it's hot as fuck, especially on poor day, because
the concrete's hot and it justsucks dude.
It can go so wrong too.

Speaker 1 (51:41):
That's one thing.

Speaker 3 (51:43):
We do a lot of chimney work.
If you fuck up one of yourcourses of the chimney, you can
just tear it down easily,rebuild it back up.
If you're pouring Crete andyou're, let's just say, one of
your form boards busts out inthe middle of the pour.

Speaker 2 (51:56):
Oh, my goodness.
All of a sudden also you'retrying to do whatever you can to
get it back.
You can't.
Now you got this.
The only thing you canguarantee with concrete is that
it'll crack and it's gonna gethard, and no one's gonna steal
it.

Speaker 1 (52:09):
No one's gonna steal it.
Yeah, I suppose it's probablynot walking off with a lot of
decks, but definitely easierthan concrete, yeah yeah, I do
fuck concrete.
No, I fuck guys, I do it as as acarpenter, you know this kind
of a bit that we do on the bluecollar happy hours.
Is there any other trades thatyou got beef with?
That's like okay.
Like if I'm on a site and Iknow these guys are here and
it's a new builder, whatever,like what.

(52:31):
What are your thought process,that going through your mind?
What trades do you not want tosee in the same place as you?

Speaker 2 (52:37):
okay, all right, so with me.
Personally.
I don't work with a lot ofother trades right now, but when
I was working with other crewsand it was and was working with
heat treating, it was always theelectricians it seems like
those guys get a lot of the hatethese motherfuckers?

Speaker 3 (52:56):
did the electricians always get the stink?
Yep, so we've gotten theelectrician answer a lot of
times, but a lot of times theyhave different reasonings on why
they hate.
What is the reason why you hate?

Speaker 2 (53:08):
because sometimes they're just leaving shit
everywhere.

Speaker 3 (53:10):
That's it, and their attitudes are shit wires and
they smell weird.

Speaker 1 (53:17):
Nah, they smell weird .
I know a couple.
I know a couple electriciansthat don't really smell normal.

Speaker 2 (53:22):
I was working with heat treating in Superior on a
union job, which was weirdbecause I couldn't be on the
tools, I was mostly just like asupervisor.
Which was really strangeBecause me as heat treating the
company I was with was non-union, so I was on a union job so I
couldn't touch any tools.
But those guys were allelectricians and the crew that I

(53:43):
was working with up there.
They were freaking great.
I love those dudes.
I miss those guys a lot.

Speaker 1 (53:48):
I don't know if you'll see this, but so you
don't want to necessarily seeelectricians on the same spot
you're in, you don't want to seethose little cable ties, little
wrappers, everywhere or whenthey cut those zip ties at an
angle.

Speaker 2 (54:02):
I'm going to fight someone?

Speaker 1 (54:04):
Do you know what I mean when you cut?

Speaker 2 (54:06):
them square.

Speaker 1 (54:07):
Because it gets sharp as hell.
Stab yourself on one of thosethings.

Speaker 2 (54:11):
God, you pricks.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
And you're in the thick of it.

Speaker 2 (54:14):
You're rubbing up against the framing.
I'm not saying I hate them oranything.
There's always beef.
No, let's stand on business.

Speaker 1 (54:21):
Fuck those guys.
I'm just kidding.
We know a lot of electricians.
Personally, we've been tryingto get on the podcast, so we're
trying to just make it as asmuch.
Uh, you know beef there, thatthere can be so that we can
finally get these guys on,because there's a couple of our
friends that we've been tryingto convince for a while that
they just won't come on like no,eventually they're gonna have
to answer they're gonna have tospeak for the whole electric

(54:41):
community and we're gonna haveto find the perfect one because,
like you said, not only arethey speaking for the whole
community, but there's a lot ofheat coming on them.
That's a good point.
That's a really good point.
So if there's any electriciansthat are listening, um, we need
you to reach out because we needsomeone to represent, because
we're getting a lot of give andnot a lot of take.

Speaker 3 (55:01):
Yeah, dude, I mean, it only backs up the claims even
more that electricians suckbecause we know, like you said,
a handful of them.
We can't get one of them tocome up.

Speaker 1 (55:11):
I like that I can see the episode now.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
Like the most hated, I will say.
When I was on Framing Cruise,everything led, shit rolled
downhill.
If something wasn't square, itwould always land on the dudes
who poured the concrete at theend.
Their job.
They get there, they pour theconcrete.
They're never coming back.
Good point Even if you shit onthem, they're not there to

(55:38):
defend themselves.
Everything went oh, this is notsquare because of this.
And then it boils down Fuckingconcrete guys.

Speaker 1 (55:46):
That's what you got to respect for the concrete guys
though, Because they get a lotof the flack for stuff not being
level whatever, but also theseguys are the ones that are 20,
30 years old, looking likethey're 50.

Speaker 3 (55:59):
These- guys are ruining their body off cigarette
hanging off, just danglingthere these guys living off of
caffeine and nicotine and beersin the lunch cooler nicotine and
a fucking dream baby yeah,heard that you ever see like so
concrete finishers?
They're always bent over, likeyou're either on your knees or
you're bent over.

(56:19):
And you can tell when you see aguy that's had 50 years of
finishing experience becausethey walk like all hurtled over
I feel like concrete guys havethe biggest johnsonville sausage
fingers.
They're just all muscle aroundtheir bones yeah, just calloused
as fuck for sure, like allconcrete dude's hands are just
like catcher's mitts're huge.

Speaker 1 (56:39):
That's one thing I have learned about brick guys
too.

Speaker 3 (56:42):
Lifetime brick guys have so much hand strength that
it is crazy.
Dude, even Bean Boy's littlebitch ass.
He grabs my wrist.
I'm fucking done.
He can make me his bitch dude.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
This guy's like five foot, nothing as well.
It's crazy to watch a manhandle Sam around.

Speaker 3 (57:00):
Oh yeah, he knows what he's doing, Sam go over
there with a smile.
I like to be a little spoonsometimes.
Stop it, I'm just kidding.

Speaker 1 (57:11):
I don't like it so well, dayton, while we're at the
tail end of this thing here, isthere any knowledge bomb that
you want to drop on thelisteners?
Anything that you want to shoutout before we head out of here?

Speaker 2 (57:25):
Man, just this is cliche, but it boils down to
something like I really believein is like you just treat people
how you want to be treated.
That's it Like be respectful,like you might not know what
someone's going through.
And, yeah, just treat everyonewith respect, be kind, try to do

(57:46):
something good for somebody.

Speaker 1 (57:47):
Except electricians.

Speaker 2 (57:50):
No, we'll, we'll throw them in there.
All right, he's too nice.
These electricians aren'tgetting fired up enough yet,
right, all right.

Speaker 1 (57:57):
Well, where can people find you on socials?
You got a couple of things toplug I got a couple leaf and
lumber.

Speaker 2 (58:02):
Where can they find leaf and lumber, leaf and lumber
, leaf and lumber facebook, Ithink it's just leaf and lumber
and then youtube you got ayoutube channel so youtube?
My youtube is dayton rivera.

Speaker 3 (58:13):
My instagram is dayton rivera vx media I never
mind vx media is we're growingthat okay.

Speaker 1 (58:20):
It's in the early stages.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
I'd say most of the stuff I post is on my personal
Instagram, dayton Rivera.
All the longer form YouTubevideos is on YouTube, dayton
Rivera boom Dayton Rivera.

Speaker 1 (58:31):
Yeah, check out Dayton's pod.
Oh yeah, two.

Speaker 3 (58:33):
Scoops Podcast.

Speaker 1 (58:34):
Ice Fishing Podcast cool concept the microphones are
on Two Ice fishing scoops.
Go listen to it.
Go check it out.
Dayton, thank you for coming ontoday.

Speaker 3 (58:43):
I appreciate it guys absolute pleasure.