October 25, 2023 • 66 mins
Are you ready to embark on a voyage that bridges the past with the present? Our conversation today offers a rich exploration of Freemasonry, from its ancient roots to its current evolution. We begin our journey with a nostalgic look back at the early days of Star Trek and the 80s-era tech that shaped our childhoods. This trip down memory lane serves as an intriguing springboard into a deeper exploration of the timeless craft of Freemasonry. We discuss the behind-the-scenes preparation that goes into a competition degree team and the importance of understanding the "why" in our practices.
From there, we venture into the heart of contemporary Freemasonry, touching on the tensions between the old and new guards in Texas and the debates within the Florida Mason's Facebook group. The conversation gets real as we discuss recent controversies and the potential role of Masonry in helping young men navigate modern crises. We also face head-on the challenging conversations happening within our ranks, such as the transgender policy in Ohio Freemasonry and the responses from Grand Lodges across the country.
Diving deeper, we reflect on the role of District Deputy Grandmasters, the importance of dress code and presentation, and the broader implications of recent rulings on transgender Freemasons. We debate the wisdom of requiring formal attire and examine the different approaches lodges take to dress. We unpack the emotions stirred by these issues and consider how these debates reflect on our fraternity's core values. Our talk concludes on a thoughtful note, as we explore the role of leadership within Freemasonry and the importance of promoting the fraternity's values. We trust you will leave this conversation with a fresh perspective on our ancient craft and its place in the modern world. Join us on this fascinating journey!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hey, chris, yeah, fred, what's a Mason?
Speaker 2 (00:08):
That's a really good question, fred.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
You've reached the internet's home for all things
masonry.
Join Chris and I as we plumbthe depths of our ancient craft.
From the common gavel to thetrowel.
Nothing is off the table, sograb your tools and let's get to
work.
This is, on the Level Space,the final frontier.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Oh, somebody's been watching some Star Trek.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
I've been watching a little too much Star Trek.
I gotta be honest with you.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Really, I don't know.
Is that possible?
No, wow, it's not possible.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Our levels are very high right now.
Woo Like it, man.
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
I'll tell you what.
They don't make television likethat anymore.
Star Trek used to almost everyepisode be some kind of
commentary on society.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Yeah right, yep, that's very true it was.
I've been watching NextGeneration.
I started at season one and I'minto season two now and at
first it's kind of hard to watch, you know.
Yeah, it's a little cheesy inthe beginning.
In the beginning it's yeah,they're still trying to figure
things out, you know.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
The budget wasn't there, right, yeah, clearly the
budget wasn't there.
The actors didn't really knowtheir characters yet.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
Right and Picard didn't have his Picard voice
really down.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
Yeah, you know like he does now you know.
Picard maneuver.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Yeah, you know that one right.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
He talks his shirt every minute.
Oh, right, right, yes, that'sright, apparently, the shirts
rode up all the time.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Oh my gosh, we're recording.
This is a show, oh hey.
Heck Hi people.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Hey, what's up?
Speaker 1 (01:41):
guys Wow.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
You're not a nerd.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
We're nerding out on some Star Trek, which is
appropriate.
I mean, it's a great show.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
It is the greatest show ever to grace the
television screen.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
You know, I remember when next generation first came
out Me too, season one, I hadbelieve it or not, this is
really weird I had a portabletelevision what?
Yeah, it was a handheldportable television.
Now, this is what you got acell phone.
Eighties, it was the season.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
I don't remember what year it came out.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
It was in the eighties, I believe it was, yeah
, late eighties.
Anyways, I was so into it thatI was carrying my 87.
87.
I was carrying my portabletelevision.
It was super fuzzy, it had abig antenna.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
It was cool, this was .
I just got a portabletelevision in 87.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
It was a handheld television man.
I'm telling you, I'm taking mykids on Halloween trick or
treating and I'm watching nextgeneration.
This is how much I was into it.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Wow, very cool.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Yeah, I guess my poor kids, they probably knew I was
a freak.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
That was the precursor to cell phones.
You got your TV in your handand you just it was pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Everyone thought my cool factor was through the roof
.
For the eighties man, that wasa big deal.
I wonder what ever happened outthere.
I bet it would be worth a tonof money these days.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Oh God, yeah, Absolutely it would.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
I'm sure it lasted all of a couple of weeks and
then something malfunctioned andit blew up.
That was Tacking the eightieswas pretty sketchy at best.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
It's true, we had a lot of cool technology, but
nothing worked.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Nothing really worked and it was big and bulky and
kind of a concept.
Now it's just every day we'rechained to it.
Now it knows more than we do.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
That's not a false statement.
That's right.
That's right.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Brother, what's been going on with you man?
What's the latest?
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Me or nothing, just the usual.
We did a really awesomepractice last night for a
competition degree team withWright, warshfield Ron Baber,
who brought in Wright HonorableJJ Albreton and Warshfield Kevin
Sopio to the team we have.
Literally he's talking aboutbringing one more big, huge name
(03:58):
to help coach.
I can't even imagine who thatmight be.
Wow, that's awesome.
We already got all the heataround here.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Who else is he?
Speaker 2 (04:06):
bringing.
Speaker 1 (04:07):
I was only a little intimidated before now.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Well, they're so nice .
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Yeah, they're good guys.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
The practice is like on level I've never experienced
in all my years of Freemasonry.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
This is ridiculous that I'm even there.
I'm a second year, Mason Wellyeah, I guess.
Second, almost three year Mason, I'm sitting in the junior
warden's chair and I am clearlythe weak link.
I mean, I am just likeay-ya-ya-ya, I got to work at it
.
I can't be there and make andlose those points.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
It can't happen.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
I cannot allow that.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Well, he said last night, we're gunning for a
perfect score.
By the time we do our finalpractice, we will be doing it at
a perfect score level.
He said, if we lose, it will bebecause somebody made a mistake
they didn't make in practice.
That's almost always you got tokeep your head in the game,
because you'll know it.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
You got to get through the fear factor.
That's a big factor.
You could know it and know itreally well.
And then the day of when you'reup at bat man, you're swinging
for the fence and strike three,you're out.
That's what happens.
So you got to.
For me, in my mind, if I haveto know it, I mean I have to not
(05:24):
only know the material, but Igot to know the why behind it.
Once I own it, then I'mcomfortable with it, I can have
fun with it and I'm good.
I'm there now.
I know all the words.
I can do it from memory withoutan issue.
So it's what is this?
He's showing me something,folks, for those of you
(05:46):
listening to the podcast and notwatching it, because you can't
watch it.
He has handed me his phone andI'm looking at.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
I have a picture box in my hand.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
I got a picture box in my hand of Mr Baber.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
He's dropping a golf ball.
This was one of the exerciseswe did last night.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
We dropped it on the mosaic pavement and it was the
junior warden's job to have hiscolumn down before the ball hit
the ground and the seniorwarden's job to have his up by
the time the ball reached hishand.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Oh, what a great idea we were doing exercises like
that.
Oh man, I'm so sorry I missedthat.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
I've never practiced in this way and it was so
dynamic and engaging.
Everybody was having so muchfun.
But learning, really learning,oh man.
Yeah, this is all inpreparation.
We haven't even started toactually practicing.
We're just learning how tolearn properly right now.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
Right yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:39):
How to read a floorwork book, how to use your
floorwork book as an open books,as you were there when we went
through open books and readevery letter, every letter, jot
and tittle, one at a time.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Yeah, it made a difference.
Oh God, it made a hugedifference to me.
I always just do it from memoryand Baber even said he said all
right, I can tell you're justdoing it from memory, You're not
actually reading it.
Go through it again and readevery single word, Every letter.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
And it was like whoa, this is hard.
Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
But it does cement it a little better into your mind
and for me the stress of doingit the day of is going to give
way to just the fun and the joyof it.
And that's the way I am.
If I know the material and Ican have fun with it, then I
know that I'll do fine.
(07:30):
And the junior warden part isnot all that difficult.
You know you're just doing alot of standing and sitting and
very little talking.
I feel for the well, for theworst, for master position
obviously, and the senior wardenthey got a lot of talking to do
.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Big chairs.
It's like difficulties, youknow them are super easy, but I
would say the senior deacon,because he moved so much.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
Oh yeah, that's right .
Speaker 2 (07:59):
And talks arguably has the harder job.
That's correct, yeah, but themaster being the focus of all
the attention, that is a layerof difficulty that people don't
realize.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
Right, right yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
And be challenging on top of the words and other
floorwork.
So I could see that case beingmade that the master is the
harder than the senior deacon,but I would argue the senior
deacon is actually tough.
Right as tough as the master.
Yeah, yeah so what are wetalking about?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
What are we talking about?
You guys still out there.
Sorry, sorry, it's us banteringagain, so I want to talk a
little bit about Texas.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Just a little bit.
You know there are things goingon outside of Florida, in the
world of free masonry there are.
There's another one that wecould bring up, but let's go
with Texas, let's go with Texas.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
So apparently there's a huge controversy going in the
Grand Lodge of Texas and on thelevel of Fred, and Chris is not
taking a side or a stand herein any way.
But it's interesting to me thatthis is a controversy.
It seems to us from here inFlorida and just what we've seen
(09:09):
online is that the old guard isnot wanting to give way to the
new guard.
Am I wrong about that?
Speaker 2 (09:16):
That is exactly what the issue is, and it's gotten so
detrimental to the craft.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Absolutely yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
That things are looking a little scary for them
right now.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Like they might actually split to two Grand
Lodges.
Is that even possible?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
It's totally possible .
Wow, that's how.
There's a free mason's ofFlorida Facebook group and this
is where we've been kind ofgetting some.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Right yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
And that's Texas are posting about it and their
passions are getting the betterof them.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
A lot of them Right.
Yeah, it happens, it happensyeah.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
People are digging into camps, they're calling each
other names.
They're not engaging in masonicdialogue, right?
I literally see people, see,say this is why people aren't
coming to Lodge.
I'm leaving this group.
What they're doing is they'redriving people away.
Their passion, their inabilityto circumscribe their passions,
(10:13):
is driving people away, right,and what's the end goal?
Speaker 1 (10:16):
here.
You know what is the goal, guysout there in Texas you know, is
the goal to make new masons?
Because I don't think you'regoing about the right way if
that is the ultimate goal.
So we were wanting to.
There's a mason, a brother outthere who's trying to.
(10:37):
I guess he's on the new, thenew upcoming side.
What's his name?
Can we say his name on the air?
Speaker 2 (10:45):
Sure, so I believe the grandmaster's name is Clay
Smith.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
And the issue is I believe he accepted masonic
charges against the juniorgrandmaster of Texas.
All right, whose name is right?
Most worshipful rumsie.
Okay, does that sound right?
I'm trying to find his firstname.
I think his last name is rumsie.
Yes, he was trying to run forgrand secretary and so these
(11:17):
charges came at installation andthat prevented him, according
to Texas law, from running forthe secretary's chair if he was
under masonic charges.
That was their first attempt.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
So that smells like a political move.
Yeah, in the grandest of terms,correct.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Yeah, I mean when you accept the charges at an
installation.
It's pretty clear.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
It's pretty clear you're making a statement.
Yeah, there's something notright there.
Yeah, and my statement was youknow, is this the old guard not
giving way to the new guard?
It just seems like that'salways the case.
You know there's a but I youknow I could be wrong.
We would love to get rumsie,brother rumsie, on the show to
talk to him.
So we're trying to reach out tohim and see if he'd be willing
(12:03):
to come on and just tell uswhat's going on out there,
because, at the end of the day,all of us Masons need to be
doing what we can to help Texas,kind of kind of go, go, go home
, go in the lodge, close thedoor, all of you, men, men and
Masons, face to face and workthis out, man, and make, make
Texas great again.
For goodness sakes, come on,man no-transcript Right Worshful
(12:27):
Jim Rumsey.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Okay, what's the name ?
Speaker 1 (12:30):
So he's the one that we tried to reach out to him to
see if we could get him tointerview him on the show and
talk about what's going on.
He may not be able to talkabout it, but if he is willing
and able to talk about it, we'dlove to hear.
You know what's going on.
And then maybe from the otherside as well, here are some
things going on and maybeFlorida can help Texas and
(12:50):
someday maybe Texas can helpFlorida, because that's what we
do, we're Masons, right.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Yeah, so I think the Grandmaster removed the
Grandtreasurer.
He removed a brother who wasthe chairman of finance.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
When he became Grandmaster and then proceeded
to file charges against thisbrother and another named
Billings.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Who was, that is, who was running for grand secretary
, was Billings and charges werefiled against all these people.
The whole state is up andbecause, apparently, the
brothers who are under chargesare beloved by the state.
They had fantasticcontributions.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
They brought change.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
They were visible, they communicated, and there's a
certain older guard that is nota fan of this change.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
Right, right, we want things to stay the way they've
always been, and we're nostranger to that Not on the
grand lodge level here, but inour own backyard.
We're no stranger to thateffect, for sure.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
I'm sure anyone anywhere in the world must
experience that Right.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
I would say so, yeah, when the new comes in.
But you know, it's the samething.
Look at our Congress theaverage age.
Believe it or not, the averageage in the Congress of the
United States of America is 74years old people.
That's it 74 years old.
Can you imagine that?
And a lot of the top names thatyou're thinking of right now,
(14:18):
they're in their 80s man.
So, and I've always believedthat, you know, the future
cannot be carved out by the past.
You cannot make a future basedon the past and the elders are
supposed to give way to theyounger and be there to support
them and, to you know, to helpthem.
(14:39):
You know, carve out this newdirection, and we just don't
have that anywhere.
Can we please try it in masonry, Maybe?
If we try it in the masonicworld, maybe we can.
It's, like I said, one of theswitching here to another rabbit
hole the symposium that we havein January, the talk that Chris
(15:02):
and I are going to work on, andit's not going to be an
in-depth talk because we've gotsome really great speakers who
are going to take the show.
Oh yeah, but our quick, brieftalk is going to be about a
project that Chris and I aregoing to start working on, which
is does masonry have somethingto offer to our hurting country?
And I've been digging into somestats on young men, young
(15:25):
American men, in this countryand it is disheartening, fellas,
it's really dishearteningwhat's going on with our young
men in this country right now,and we are definitely in a
crisis with regard to young men.
And my question is and thequestion that we want to answer
during this symposium we don'thave a lot of time to develop it
, but we're going to do it inparts and pieces and we'll do
(15:46):
some of it on the show as well,but does masonry offer something
to young men that could helpthem navigate this world and do
better in this world?
Because young men in thiscountry are failing, and failing
greatly, on a huge scale, andmy question is does masonry have
something to offer to help usWell?
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Texas.
I know the answer to that.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
The answer is Texas.
You've got to get yourselftogether and we challenge you in
love, as brothers, to get ittogether, man, and to join the
rest of masonry in helping.
We've got to help this country.
If masonry can help young menfind their direction, find their
(16:28):
way, find a cause, findintegrity, find a way to
circumscribe their passions andbe contributors to a future,
then I say we should doeverything we can to make that a
reality.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Yeah, absolutely.
That's kind of what we'recharged to do as masons in the
three charges that we take.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
That's right.
The degrees that's right.
I think we did a couple ofshows on that.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Yeah Well, texas, apparently their grand lodge
meets in January.
This is all going to be settledin January, but they're calling
for a special session to bemade.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Who's calling for it?
The old guard of the new Crap?
Speaker 2 (17:07):
The traditions are designed by lodges.
Oh, I love that Submitted togrand lodge the people have been
activated, yeah.
Lodges are getting involved.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
Oh, this is great.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Yeah, that's why it's dangerous.
Yeah, right, yeah, absolutely,yeah, People are actually
getting behind again or facingoff against their grand lodge.
So where does that take them?
Because they have no authorityover grand lodge.
Right, right, people have allthe authority.
They're curious to watch andsee how our brothers in Texas
handle this.
(17:37):
I see a lot of vitriol, yeahyeah, anger A lot of emotion.
Passions getting away frompeople online.
Some people are steady,steadfast, Masonic people, but
they're not getting listened tofrom what I can see online.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
It's kind of a mess, but other Masonic news.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
Other Masonic news Go ahead.
Speaker 2 (18:02):
This is the state of Ohio.
Okay, the grand lodge hasissued a ruling on transgenders.
Okay, which is interesting innews, I believe, and what it
boils down to is that they havedetermined that they will follow
the sex given to you at yourbirth.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
As a male only fraternal society.
A petitioner must be born amale and continue to live as a
male.
As a private organization, ourbusiness meetings are private
and we respect the privacy ofour members but they're saying
that, yes, if you were born aman, you can be a Mason.
If you're transitioned to awoman.
(18:44):
You're no longer living as aman and therefore can't be a
Mason.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
And vice versa.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
I suppose, If you were born a woman and
transitioned to man.
You cannot be a Mason CorrectBecause they're going by your
sex at birth.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Okay, so you have to have both Born a man and living
as a man, right?
So you're not a Mason or anytransgender woman becoming a man
out of the mix and anytransgender man becoming a woman
out of the mix All right.
Well, you're not a Mason inOhio.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
So the first thing in my mind is that they kudos on
them for just for for taking astand, whether you agree with it
or disagree with it.
They actually stood up and saidthis is what we're about, which
is lacking in this country forsure.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
I presume it's because they were presented with
it.
Probably so, right, yeah, itcame up.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
So it had to be addressed and this is the way
they decided to address it.
It does.
It does purport to the originsof Freemasonry.
I think whenever you're,whenever you're presented as an
organization with a new worldproblem or a new world situation
, it's important to go back towho you are from the beginning.
(19:54):
Who are you and what do youstand for in the beginning, what
are your principles and whatare your?
You know, what is it that hasmade you what you are, and then
stand on that.
It sounds like that's whatthey're doing, men.
It's a fraternity.
So you know, and right now, Iknow, I know this became as a
(20:14):
political football almostimmediately, but people are
beginning to take a step back onthis issue and talk about it a
little bit more, especiallybecause the women's sports and
all that stuff that came out andnow it's just blowing up, you
know on.
You know it's the unintendedconsequences you know of, of
(20:37):
issues that come up andeverybody just runs in one
direction and then all of asudden it's like, wait, wait,
the house is still on fire.
The house is on fire and we gotto stop and put it out and
figure this thing out, and Ithink that's what's happening
now?
I take no, I don't know, Ihaven't really thought about it.
So I should keep my mouth shutuntil I know how I feel about
(20:58):
the whole thing.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
I did think about it and obviously my political views
tend to be we call them centerleft Correct.
So I tend to try to protectpeople's civil rights and
initially I was like wait, thisisn't fair.
But I read this and I thoughtabout it more and we are a
private organization.
Correct we make our own rules.
We don't have to follow that'sright.
(21:21):
We have to follow the titlenorms, whether they're good or
bad.
We can stick to who we are, andI think I agree with the
decision, personally, that ifyou're born a man, be a Mason.
If you're born a woman, you'renot gonna be a Mason.
If you wanna be a woman, whywould you wanna be a Mason?
Correct, correct?
So the Grand Lodge of England,however, has ruled the opposite.
(21:42):
Oh, no kidding.
They see it as a civil rightsissue and they say that gender
reassignment should be treatedwith the utmost compassion and
sensitivity, and they allow menwho transition to women to
remain Masons.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
And women who become men to become Masons.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
Now I do know that.
I do believe in Canada and inEngland it is illegal.
You could be arrested literallyfor disagreeing with that
standard.
So they may be just kowtowingto government regulation because
it's different there.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Yeah, it's really different.
You don't have the right.
They have female Freemasonryover there, so they really
changed.
So they, yeah, they've changeda lot of stuff over there, yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
And I'm not commenting on good or bad, it's
not my house.
It's somebody else's house,it's across the pond.
That's their deal, not ours.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
Correct.
Speaker 1 (22:36):
I do know here we do have we still kinda almost still
have the right to freeexpression.
It's eroding daily, but westill have that right to free
expression and, as I said, fromyour position, we are a private
organization and we should anddo have the right to determine
our own destiny as based on whatwe, as a craft, want it to be
(23:01):
and our landmarks existed beforethe transgender issue.
Absolutely right.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
I get.
At some point something had tobe said and we haven't in
Florida.
To my knowledge, no State ofFlorida had to deal with that at
the grand lodge level.
I'm in Florida.
I'd be surprised if it came upin the near future, but it might
, it might and I'd be curious tosee how they handle it.
I don't think the majoritypeople would disagree with how
(23:27):
Ohio's handle it.
Personally, yeah.
I think the majority wouldagree.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
It's a fair stance.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
I suppose, so I suppose so.
Either you were born a woman oryou chose not to be a man,
correct.
And if you're choosing not tobe a man, okay, it's a
fraternity of men.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Right.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
And the argument's pretty easy to make that you
should not be a mason Right.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
I mean, at the end of the day it is an emotional,
it's a choice.
I shouldn't say emotional,wrong word but it certainly is a
choice because your DNA willalways remain the sex that you
were born in.
It doesn't matter.
They've dug up bones that arehundreds and hundreds of years
old and they do testing on theDNA and they can tell if it's a
male or a female.
(24:10):
So it's always going to be thatway.
You can make superficialchanges to your body and to your
personality.
You can do that through moderntechnology, but you will never
change the total makeup of yourDNA strands.
It won't change.
You can't.
You were made that way, youwere born that way and you will
(24:31):
die that way.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
So that part's just true.
Let's get off this and on towhat are we talking about today?
Speaker 2 (24:37):
That's your current affairs.
There you go, texas and Ohio.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
Texas and Ohio.
Yeah, go Texas, come on guys,let's see you guys work through
this in a Masonic way and comeout on the other side as better
men.
That would be on the level withFred and Chris's desire, and if
there's anything this show cando, to help facilitate that.
Let us know, email us and letus know.
(25:02):
We've got some listeners inTexas, so shout out.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
We'll distract you so much from the issue You'll have
no idea what you wereoriginally talking about.
That's right, we're done withyou.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
That's kind of like what we're good at right.
We'll take you down a rabbithole.
You ain't never seen comments.
Exactly All right.
So we're still in the etiquettebook, yes, which is great.
I'm good here.
I kind of like it.
We're getting a lot of reallypositive feedback from folks all
over the world that they dig it.
(25:32):
It's the book they almost neverread.
Do they see Sweden, sweden,correct?
Our brother from Sweden shoutedout to us, and I think he has a
really cool Swedish name.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
So Heard yeah, something cool.
Heard Ironside or something, Idon't know Something.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Jorn, something totally cool like that.
Yeah, yeah, maybe, yeah, yeah,maybe.
But anyway, svirgin, yeah, heshouted out to us and let us
know that he was listening andthat he was digging the content
with regard to the etiquettebook, and I think he made the
comment Forgive me, brother, Idon't have your email right in
(26:14):
front of me but I think he madethe comment that he, like most
people, never really read thething.
Most people don't look at it andread it.
So we go through thesedocuments of ours here in the
Florida Grand Lodge documentsand booklets that we have, that
which we can share.
We don't share stuff that we'renot allowed to share or that is
(26:36):
part of our secret rituals, butwe don't go totally in depth on
this stuff.
What we try to do is get youguys to be like hey, these guys
are talking about this.
I've never opened it up.
Maybe I'll just open it up formyself, I'll read through it and
(26:56):
maybe I'll encourage mybrothers and my lodge to do more
with it and read through it.
And that's a lot of theresponses that we've gotten over
the years with regard to whatwe do here.
That's what people do.
We're not diving deep intoMasonic truth here on the show.
(27:18):
You guys probably already knowthat we're pretty superficial
with it by design.
We want you to do the work.
We want you to go home and openit up and read and figure out
what it is you believe aboutmasonry and why on earth you
would believe it in the firstplace.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
This week we've said it many times we're not teaching
anybody, we're not teaching.
We're just giving you ouropinions on things.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
We're giving you our opinions and we're encouraging
you to go and teach yourself andfind out for yourself.
Open up some books, talk tosome people, ask some important
questions and get those answersthat you need to make yourself a
better mason, which makes you abetter man Go.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
I have the email from Johann Lindqvist.
Yes, johann Lindqvist, shoutout to Johann way across the
pond.
Johann Lindqvist, from StJohn's Lodge, solomon and Troy,
zorurus and Goltar ProvincialLodge under the Grand Lodge of
Sweden Wow, sweden.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
That's mouthful.
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
He sent a big ping from Sweden, where he listens to
the podcast, although he'salways a couple of weeks behind.
Come on, come on, brotherJohann, I thoroughly enjoyed the
discussion, but I tend to skipinterviews from Florida Masonic
officers.
See, this is why we can't justinterview people from Florida,
because we do have listeners allover.
We are in Florida, so it's easyfor us to access people.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
Johann, send us an email.
We'll interview you from acrossthe pond.
That'll be fun.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
Lindqvist, you stay away from things that cannot be
discussed openly.
I do learn a lot about thesimilarities and differences
between both our ritualtraditions and organizations, so
thanks for bringing this showto us.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (28:55):
Thank you for listening, brother.
Yeah, brother.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
It means the world to us, man.
That's why we do what we do andwhy we get here at 6 30 AM on a
Thursday morning to do what wedo, and apologies, this podcast
will be released 30 minutes fromthe time.
we record it as soon as we turnthis thing off.
We're going to post it becausewe missed yesterday, and our
(29:20):
apologies, guys.
We are really struggling withtime these days to consistently
get it out on Wednesday mornings, which I know you guys are used
to, and we do get emails.
We hear you guys You'reshooting us stuff.
Hey, where's the podcast?
What's going on?
What happened?
Was there a nuclear holocaustthat I was unaware of?
The answer is no.
Fred and Chris are just stupidbusy and sometimes we just
(29:43):
cannot get our sorry butts inhere at an ungodly hour of the
morning.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
OK, I want to get going on this I have one more.
Ok go, Go yes of course Go, butI don't know why this was sent
to me.
This is from Brother FrankDoring.
Brother Frank Doring said goodmorning.
Where's your brother Burns?
Just want to let you know thatI love your podcast and look
forward to every new one eachweek.
Keep up the great work ineducation you and Fred are doing
.
Two of you are making a bigdifference.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
That's awesome, Thanks bro.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
That means a lot.
He's a past master of HancockLodge 229 in Ellensworth
Wisconsin.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
Woo-hoo, I've helped Cheesehead, yes cheesehead.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
I've held many grand lodge offices over my 20 years
being Freemason and lastly, theposition of district deputy of
our district.
Two oh ties in perfectly.
Speaker 1 (30:32):
District deputy.
That's right, district deputy.
Where's that going to come up?
Speaker 2 (30:36):
Go.
As such, I saw a great need fortrue basic Masonic education.
We've always tried to raise thecalling and have forgotten to
raise the floor.
This year, by your inspiration,I've started an open book club,
similar to what your brothersdo in Florida.
I could use some help andguidance that on trikes endeavor
, as you already have experiencewith what works and what
doesn't.
Could you please help me outwith this?
(30:57):
Also, I'm very interested inthe promotional program you
developed, which I understand isnow sponsored by the Grand
Lodge of Florida.
I want to learn how this works.
I want to bring it to the GrandLodge of Wisconsin.
As I said before, he's been adistrict deputy, discovered some
important needs in the lodges.
Wisconsin has less than 8,000active Freemasons, many of whom
are very advanced and aged, andhe believes, as we do, that
(31:19):
there's a great opportunity tostrengthen our ranks with the
right tools.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Brother, you are singing our song.
Man, you are singing our song.
Yes, I know somebody who'sinfluential in the reimbursement
program.
He's sitting right across fromme, so that is not a problem.
Gladly to help out there.
Speaker 2 (31:37):
Yes, absolutely, will help with that and I'm going to
email Brother Dury and maybewe'll have him on the show if he
has any success with thesethings.
That would be great, it'shappened over there.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
That would be absolutely awesome as far as
what we have learned withsitting down with a group of men
and openly discussing Masonic,whatever it is.
We have a discussion groupesoteric discussion group and we
sat down and we just opened upthe Mentor's Manual and started
just talking about EA stuffthat's in the manual and pushing
(32:10):
the conversation.
In that way I can tell you whatdoesn't work.
What doesn't work is one personreading and just kind of a
teaching.
A teacher student format doesnot seem to work.
We've tried it once or twiceand it just bombs.
What works is an openconversation, but you have to
have somebody directing trafficin there, kind of keeping things
(32:35):
going, somebody who'sexperienced.
I have a lot of experience inthat kind of stuff because I've
just done this kind of stuffMen's Ministry stuff for 30
years.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
You're doing a great job at our events, yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
I don't like it being just me, so I'm actively
recruiting people to start doingit as well as me.
But anyways, brother, what I'msaying to you is that an open
forum with one or two guyssitting kind of in the front,
facilitating not leading, notdirecting, but facilitating open
conversations and reinforcingsome of the rules of the group.
(33:10):
One of our rules in the groupis you can share anything you
want.
It doesn't matter what it is,as long as it's done with
gentleness and respect for thebelief structures of everybody
in the room.
Some people think that's notpossible.
It is possible.
We have proven it over and overagain.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
I think we've done four or five of those now yes,
so figure Very successful.
Probably 10 hours ofdiscussions.
We've done Correct In those 10hours.
We had one situation where wehad to change the subject, I
think.
I think so yeah it's likebarely anything compared to the
heavy stuff we were actuallytalking about.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Right In, but to and.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
The degree.
It ain't just your words.
We're talking about life.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Yeah, no, we Allady.
We went into some deep, deeptruths and a lot of social
issues.
We even had a conversationabout racism and and race
relations.
We have.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
They don't hear about that.
No, no, they don't.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Every time we use that word, everybody tunes out.
I don't know why that word isdeath to podcast.
Never put that word in yourtitle, by the way, if you're a
podcast.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
No, no one will listen to it.
101 we.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
We don't want to hear about it.
I wonder why we?
I guess that means we probablyshould.
Okay, there's a rabbit hole foryou now.
Can we finally get, please, tothe etiquette Manual?
That's GL 208, revised in 2010.
You'll find it with a yellowcover.
It was given to you when youbecame an entered apprentice by
(34:37):
your secretary and it was thelast book on the bottom of the
pile and that's probably why itremained there.
Get it out, mm-hmm, when youget a chance, get it out and
read through it.
You won't you won't regret it.
We'll do it with you right now.
We'll do it with you.
Now to the.
The heading today, which is onpage four Are you kidding me?
We're only on page four isdistrict deputy grandmaster, is
(35:00):
the heading, and I'll just readthe first paragraph or so.
The district deputy grandmasteris the personal representative
of the grandmaster and whenvisiting a lodge, whether it be
formally or informally, heshould be accorded all respect.
He should never be addressed byhis first name during any part
of lodge ceremonies.
Such conduct demeans his office.
(35:21):
The district deputy grandmastershould be received in
accordance with provisionsadopted at the hundred and
eightieth Grand Lodge in 2010.
So that's the reason why thisbook is revised for 2010 mm a
district deputy grandmaster isrequired by our constitutional
law to officially visit everylodge in his district district
(35:44):
at least once during his term.
He comes there to performcertain specific duties required
by Grand Lodge.
And to Changing the page, mygoodness and to give the
brethren the message of thegrandmaster.
This message contains mattersof importance concerning with
Concerning, which thegrandmaster, in his wisdom,
(36:05):
deems it necessary to inform thecraft.
The remarks of the deputy, then, are of supreme importance.
It is his, it is his evening.
No programs or speeches otherthan his should be allowed.
What he has to say should standout.
Nothing must detract from it.
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
So this is something that I've heard from several
district deputies, past districtdeputies.
They People don't understandthe role of the district.
Deputy grandmaster.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
I did not understand it.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Yeah, they have told me, peep.
They don't understand whypeople get scared when they
enter the room.
They get nervous when they'rearound the district.
Deputy grandmaster, becausethey have no power.
Their pot, their job, is tobring the grandmasters message
to the district.
Right yeah, they can't takeyour charter, they can't on make
(36:57):
you a Mason, they can't evengive you any kind of Masonic
Discipline.
They are simply there as theeyes and ears of the grandmaster
.
So if they see something,they're supposed to report it to
the grandmaster right, yeahgrandmaster tells them to do
something, they have to do whatthey're told.
They don't have a whole lot ofpower and autonomy right as the
(37:17):
district deputy grandmaster, butbecause it's such a position of
Admirations to Masons, I guesswe do review the district deputy
correct as the most Importantperson in our district at that
time.
Yeah, because they represent usat the Grand Lodge and he, he
(37:38):
literally Represents thegrandmaster.
Speaker 1 (37:41):
Yes, sitting in your lodge so the Grandmaster cannot
be everywhere at all times.
He is not omnipresent.
Therefore, his representativeswith in each district Represent
him.
I, like you said, eyes and earsin the lodge.
When he comes in he isrepresenting the grandmaster.
He's representing mostworshipal bishop.
(38:02):
When right worshipful districtdeputy grandmaster Davies comes
into our lodge he is reprepresenting most worshipal
bishop and we are to afford himthe same respect we would most
worshipal bishop.
That's the idea here yeah, andI have.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
I always ask every outgoing district deputy
grandmaster ever since I was asenior steward.
I used to.
I don't know why.
I was always curious like, hey,was there anything that
surprised you I didn't preparefor?
And every single one of themhas said the same thing for the
last six years.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
I can guess.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
I had no idea how bad things were oh, oh, is that
right.
No idea how unmasked peoplebehave.
Oh right, oh wow.
Wow that's what shocks them,that's what they weren't
prepared for is some of the badstuff they wind up seeing
inevitably.
And that's the job, right,that's the job.
People come to you when there'sa problem and they tell you
there's a problem, right, youwind up seeing all the problems.
(39:04):
You see all the bad stuff andyou're used to being in your
lodge and you know your lodgesdeal and you know what the
problems are right and you think, ah, we got big problems.
But then you go out and look atthe other lodges and you see, oh
, there's some really bigproblem, really bad stuff, right
yeah yeah masters need to getremoved, charters need to be
pulled, masonic trials are beingheld like yeah, he's stuff that
(39:27):
you're dealing with, and sosome of them I've seen needed to
take a minute to recover fromall that negativity they were
surrounded by.
It can be a very difficult job,it seems.
I don't know, I've never doneit and hopefully don't get asked
to do it but it seems to methat the people that have done
it unanimously agree that youshould be prepared Mentally for
(39:50):
dealing with some interestingthings you probably don't want
to have to deal with yeah,that's right.
Speaker 1 (39:55):
It ain't all sunshine and rainbows and I know we're
remiss in inviting our currentDeputy deputy district
grandmaster.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
It really is here at all the time.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
District deputy grandmaster Davies.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
Yes, there you go.
Speaker 1 (40:12):
Shout out to brother Tom, and we have.
We are apologies, we have beenremiss in inviting you.
Speaker 2 (40:20):
He's been busy.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
I know, I know how busy.
Every time I talk to me, he'slike I travel, I travel, I keep,
I travel, I keep traveling.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Well, I think they have to do four lodge visits
this year.
He told me it was eight Eightfor the whole year.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
Yes, so he has to go to every lodge four times.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Yes, and we've got nine lodges, so that's 36 lodge
visit 36 lodges.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
Visits all over the district.
Speaker 2 (40:43):
The district deputy is also expected to be at the
grandmaster's official visitsthroughout the state.
Speaker 1 (40:48):
Oh right, so there's another all those, there's
another 13, or whatever 20something 20 something.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Yeah, 60, 70 things to do.
Speaker 1 (40:56):
Yeah, so he spends his time traveling a lot.
So I we understand that and weare planning on on asking him
and hopefully he'll be graciousenough to To come on and we can
do an interview with our, ourcurrent.
We want to, we want tointerview.
We're a little lax guys.
It's end of the year, theholidays are starting and things
just crept up on us.
We've got a thousand things inthe fire right now and that's
(41:19):
the one thing that kind of fellby the way.
So we want to get.
We want to get our, ourinstructor, our district
instructor, justin broom, onagain.
We want to get Tom Davey on andwe want to get a couple of
other people on before the endof the year.
We're trying like crazy, butit's just wish I'll.
Speaker 2 (41:37):
Barry Hart will be the next interview.
Speaker 1 (41:39):
Very hard will be the next in yes, a Stalworth in our
district.
Oh yeah, if very hard is he's?
He's the George George Burns ofDistrict 23.
George Burns once said I Ican't die, I'm too booked and
that's booked, that's that'sright, we're full heart.
He can't go anywhere.
(41:59):
Nothing can happen to him,because he's just too darn
booked.
He is going to be somewhere,even tonight, I'm sure of it, or
tomorrow night, any.
Any day of the week.
He's somewhere, is doingsomething for our district, and
we are blessed to have him forsure.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
Two more George Burns quotes that could be very hard
quotes.
Oh yeah, go sex at 90s liketrying to shoot pool with a rope
.
I Could see Barry saying thatHappiness is having a large,
loving, caring, close-knitfamily in another city.
Speaker 1 (42:31):
Love George Burns.
George Burns is awesome.
What's the other one?
He said had I listened to mydoctor and quit smoking cigars,
I would not have lived longenough to attend his funeral.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
He said when I was a boy the Dead Sea was only sick,
but he lived to be like 90,something, right oh yeah, he was
up there, man, he was up there,quite he was a.
Last actor yep Was George Burns.
Speaker 1 (42:59):
Oh, that's right.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
Yeah, your name is George Burns.
My middle name is George.
I'm Christopher George.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Burns, I'm sitting across from George.
Speaker 2 (43:05):
Burns yeah, I'm trying to make that tie so I can
get some of that inheritance.
Okay, let me know how they'regoing out there can help me with
that any lawyers any?
Speaker 1 (43:13):
lawyers yes, from the Burns estate yes, the other
Burns estate, yes, please callthe show Okay.
So the Constitution alsorequires that the district
deputy inspect the records andaccounts of the lodges and sees
that the same are In properorder, and then it cites the
section.
There have been instances wherelodges have gotten into
(43:33):
difficulties Because ofirregularities which such an
inspection would have disclosed,but we're not discovered until
too late because thisconstitutional requirement has
not been complied with.
This being a duty imposed uponthe district deputy by our
Constitution, the master shouldformally tender the the lodge
records to the district deputybefore such an official
(43:57):
Visitation, and preferably at atime convenient to the district
deputy to examine the same.
So that the Consciceness, justso that the consents, the
consent, yes, district deputy,will not be put to the
embarrassment of asking forrecords.
I, conscientious sorry,conscientious I, I, I can't.
(44:20):
I did not bring my book.
I'm reading it off my computer,sorry, yeah that I did that
this year.
Speaker 2 (44:27):
Well, I was a treasurer when he came in there.
Yeah, we both did that together.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
That's right, yeah, and he interesting.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
It's a very thorough look that they do.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
Yeah, it is, it is and it's.
It should be it should not be.
You shouldn't be afraid, evenif you've got work to do inside
your lodge as far as your recordkeeping goes, you should
welcome it.
I, I know I certainly did,because I know that as the
treasure, I just becametreasurer in June, late June,
(44:55):
july maybe and there's a lot ofwork to do in there and and the
secretary and I have been beenworking through it, you know,
little by little, as as we can.
We were not, I'll be honestwith everybody.
We were not as prepared as Iwould have liked to have been.
There's no discrepancies or orany anything, you know, negative
like that going on.
(45:16):
But I think we could have donea better job with regard to
keeping things in order.
And you know, for me, I'm aproject manager.
I've been a project manager fora long, long time, so for me, a
ready information is everythingto me.
So if I walk into an office andI ask somebody who works under
me for information that they'resupposed to have, if they don't
(45:40):
have it, that raises a major redflag to me.
So when the when the districtdeputy grandmaster comes in and
is asking for ready informationand I don't have it, I don't
like that.
That ain't that, ain't the wayit's supposed to be.
We're supposed to have thatinformation should be a click
away.
You know that that whateverthey're asking for and that is
(46:00):
our goal that our lodge 147 willhave that under control.
Our lodge is a little unique inthat we have a lot of money so,
and it's a big lodge, it'sdowntown Sarasota, the property
is extremely valuable and We'vegot a lot of members of pretty
large membership, so it's not aseasy as a lot of the.
(46:22):
I asked one treasurer he's beentreasurer forever and ever of
another lodge if he could, youknow, if I could hang out with
him and ask him a Few questions.
He said don't bother, bro, ittakes me two minutes to do to do
our treasury work because wedon't have any money.
Oh yeah, and it's true, with alot of lodges they it's not high
finance, there's not a lotgoing on there, but in our lodge
(46:42):
that's not the case.
It's actually, yeah, there's alot going on, a lot, a lot
coming and going, and you'regonna have a lot more.
Speaker 2 (46:48):
We did some big stuff this year we did we did.
We signed a contract that weare and we have entered into, to
sell our parking lot in the airrights above our building.
Speaker 1 (46:58):
Yeah, a.
Significant some of money verysignificant and that's going to
change things even more.
So I'm trying to get us ready.
It's probably that had probablyhappened in a year from now,
maybe a year and a half from now.
I'm trying to get everythingready to receive said funding
and then, and then hopefully,turn it over to a competent
Person to take over as treasurerand I hope you're in for life.
(47:21):
I'm not in for life.
Don't listen to that voice.
It is not true.
I will not be secretary forlife or life.
Yeah, no, thank you, I don'tmind it.
I love untangling wires.
That's my thing.
I love big giant balls of wirethat are tangled and gnarled up
and.
I I love to untangle them, butonce I untangle them I'm bored
(47:43):
with it and I want to move on tothe next big bundle of wires.
So, and that is very much thethe way I am, I will of course
stay, because all Mason shouldbe faithful in their position
and if you're needed there, staythere.
Brother, if you're listening,that's for you.
Let's move on.
When making an official visit toa lodge in his district, the
district deputy shall beformally received with grand
(48:05):
honors.
On such occasions, all guestswho are not entitled to grand
honors but whom it is desired tohonor by a special introduction
at the altar, should be Shouldbe received first.
What I want to try that again,on such occasions, all guests
who are not entitled to grandhonors but whom it is desired to
(48:28):
honor by a special introductionat the altar, should be
received first.
Thereafter, the district deputymay prefer to be received alone
, ahead of other others Entitledto grand honors, in order that
he may himself preside at thereception and the rendering of
grand honors to such otherguests, or he may desire to
(48:50):
enter with such otherdistinguished guests, in which
case, it being his officialvisitation, where, in the
absence of the grand master, heis directly exercising his
function as the personalrepresentative of the said grand
master okay, that's becausethere's only one other situation
that you would issue grandhonors to a brother in the state
(49:11):
of Florida, and that's when hereceives his 50 year award.
Speaker 2 (49:14):
Oh right, so they're saying imagine that you had a 50
year presentation.
They don't want that to likekill his juju.
Oh gotcha bring him in, do hispresentation, then bring in the
grand master and do his pomp andcircumstance.
Speaker 1 (49:26):
Gotcha, gotcha.
Okay, so that that makes sense,and and I know that he comes in
with his counsel behind him,right?
Speaker 2 (49:34):
Yes, his committee, committee, committee men,
committee men come in with him.
He leads the whole group in.
Yep, he's the first one sat inthe east, correct?
And then the committee men areintroduced in sat as well, right
?
Speaker 1 (49:48):
Yeah, it's, it's actually, it's a, it's.
It's pretty cool.
I like it.
I like that stuff.
That's why because I'm kind ofweird.
Speaker 2 (49:54):
I guess.
Speaker 1 (49:55):
Yeah, the ritual of it is good, especially when it's
done correctly.
The last time we did it it wentpretty well, man, actually it
was, it was real good.
I know our, our instructor, ourdistrict instructor, was there
with his notepad out.
Yes making, making notes as wewere doing it, and never came
back to us with any corrections.
So that was pretty encouraging,you know, I think well.
Speaker 2 (50:16):
This year, I think, is the first year they've asked
a district deputy to grade eachofficer Individually on how he
performs during the ritualopening and closing, and I was
told that we did very well, sothat's encouraging.
I hope he doesn't say that toeverybody.
Yeah right but I felt like wedid really well.
Speaker 1 (50:35):
It went, it went, it went real smooth.
There was no was anaccidentally practiced.
We practiced it and there wasnone of those cringy moments.
No, you know where things arelike.
Oh, that didn't go well, youknow there's none of that.
It flowed right through frombeginning to end and it was a
great evening.
It was a really good evening.
All right, next is dress.
Oh, and we've got about.
I don't know, we got about 25minutes less.
(50:56):
Let's try it.
Uh, yes, shall a lodge requireof its officers that they were
formal dress Question mark.
The wisdom of doing so dependsentirely upon circumstances and
is a point which it is theprerogative of each of each
Constituted lodge to decide.
(51:18):
Though much may be said infavor of formal dress, cut away
coat, tuxedo or full eveningdress, since it is a mark of a
respectable, it is a mark of therespect for the fraternity.
Mm-hmm in any event, one thingis certain if any of the
officers are required to wearformal attire, all the officers
(51:40):
should wear it without exception.
And if he and his colleagueswear it, the worshipful master
should use a hat to correspond,not a Soft hat.
Straw hat or a cap Makes sense.
The members will dressaccording to to private taste
and it is proper that they enterthe lodge room with Apron,
(52:03):
properly arranged beforehand andand any other regalia, regalia,
jewels etc.
In do order.
So that's interesting.
It was a little bit of acontroversy last year.
Speaker 2 (52:12):
Yes, dress, it came up.
Speaker 1 (52:13):
That was the big deal , it came up.
Speaker 2 (52:17):
That was the big deal , the Grand Lodge last year was
the big deal.
Speaker 1 (52:20):
Yeah, they were um poor, most worshipful Lambert
he's a great guy, shout out towork to a most worshipful
Lambert.
But but even he, when weinterviewed him, he even said
you know it was it was.
It was something that hethought would be a good idea,
but the craft did not and heaccepted it.
(52:41):
Yeah because he's a true masonand and moved on.
There was no hard feelings,there was nothing like that.
It was discussed and Moved onand his, his thing was just.
I think the overall idea behindit was just the decorum, yeah,
of of the dress.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
We we wear black, black suits with bow tie black
suits, black bow tie, yeah shirtwhite, gloves white gloves.
Speaker 1 (53:06):
So we, we go, we go all out.
I enjoy it.
My wife loves the fact that I Idress that way twice, so twice
Really to go out.
She loves it, yep.
Nice, and we look sharp when wedress like we really do, we
really do, and it just brings anair of Importance to the
evening different when I put thesuit on?
Yeah, absolutely do.
Speaker 2 (53:25):
I do, I feel different.
And then the gloves come on andit's like, all right, I Am,
nothing I touch is all withpurity now.
And you know, you go throughthe ritual opening.
You're like, wow, I'm afreemason right and this is
awesome now I have been to otherlodges in the state of Florida
where I've seen their officerattire is, for example, like
(53:46):
dress shirts but at short sleeve.
I've seen polo shirts yeah, ourlodge shirts.
That that's what the officerswear.
I was just at a lodge and oneof the officers had a like a
sports jersey t-shirt with thelodge logo on it, and that was
the shirt.
Speaker 1 (54:05):
Right.
Speaker 2 (54:05):
Yeah, it's wildly different and Some lodges have
they're just in normal clothesand they don't match.
And when the officers don'tmatch it is kind of off-putting
and it's a little confusing too.
Speaker 1 (54:18):
It is confusing, yeah , absolutely.
Speaker 2 (54:20):
Did the guy just come off the street and fill that
rollers?
He was one of the officers,right.
So it's like I like the idea ofokay it, all of you should
dress the same.
We're not saying how to dress,but you got to wear the same
stuff.
Speaker 1 (54:32):
Yeah, I think I could be mistaken.
Shout out guys if I am, but Ithink wrong, wrong, I think.
Who's the lodge down?
Who's Bob's Lodge down?
South Inglewood?
Inglewood Lodge?
They wear I think they calleach other or they call out the
dress of the evening, becauseit's different.
Sometimes they're suited out tothe max and then sometimes you
(54:55):
come down and they're all intheir lodge shirts and they've
got some cool lodge shirts.
Man, somebody knows whatthey're doing down there because
their lodge stuff is awesome.
But but they they dress thesame, but not always decked out
in suit, you know, jacket andand vest.
So they, they kind of take it,they take it seriously, but
(55:16):
sometimes they don't have todress in the monkey suit.
Sometimes they're just, youknow, dressed, dressed casually,
but they're all the same.
Yeah you know, which I think isgreat.
We should probably try that onetime, one time or two maybe,
maybe next year, maybe the newworshipful master?
I'll do that, I can't do that.
Speaker 2 (55:32):
You listening, I can't.
We got to do black suits.
It's what our tire is, that'sright.
Speaker 1 (55:38):
I'm all about it, man , I'm fine with that.
The custom prevails in somelodges of having the worshipful
master wear one type of dressclothing While the other
officers wear different stylesof dress.
The harmony of good taste wouldbe better served if all dressed
alike.
Hint hint On that one.
This is a philosophy in dress.
(55:58):
There is a philosophy in dressas in so many other things, and
the dress proper and the dressproper to masonic occasion Is no
exception.
Its principle is good taste.
Its practice is to wear suchattire as shows respect to the
brotherhood and express thedignity of masonry.
(56:18):
There it is, there.
That's.
That's the reason for it.
And I hear a lot of people come.
You know, some people come inand they want to wear shorts and
yeah sandals and all this stuff.
Well, I'm just sitting in the.
You know, I'm just on thesidelines sitting, I'll sit in
the back.
It's like.
Well, that's not the point,brother, you know that's not the
point, though.
The point is is that you shoulddress different here than you
do anywhere else.
Speaker 2 (56:39):
Right, and I know people get off work and come to
lodge and so they don't havemuch choice.
But Some people have the choiceand they can, you know.
I it's like tough on this one.
I Travel a lot in the state andI see a lot of different
cultures and in the lodges andI've started trying to adapt my
(56:59):
attire to where I'm going.
So I almost feel like it'sdisrespectful to me to walk into
a lodge who's typically wearinglike jeans and a t-shirt in a
suit.
Speaker 1 (57:10):
It's like, yeah right , I don't want to be that guy.
Speaker 2 (57:12):
So I try to dress more like I think they're gonna
dress, because I want to blendin with my brother right.
Speaker 1 (57:18):
Yeah, that makes sense, that makes, and that's
kind of the point.
But at the end of the day, thatlast statement makes it clear
that you know the philosophyhere is that no matter what you
do, make sure it brings honor Tothe fraternity.
That's, that's what reallymatters here.
As far as our dress goes, Iknow that for me, being in
(57:38):
church for the last 35 years,the dress thing has evolved back
and forth over and over again.
If you go to a church on Sundayand everybody's in suits, it
typically it's typically anolder congregation of people and
the way they dress it meanssomething to them.
(57:59):
I came up in a time where thedress code was kind of frowned
upon and everybody was wearingshorts and t-shirts and the way
you dress doesn't matter and allthis stuff, and in my opinion
it did kind of cheapen thedignity of it a little bit.
So there is something to besaid about dressing.
(58:21):
Dressing in a way that youdon't normally dress, I guess is
the point.
If you're an executive in amulti-billion dollar corporation
, you wear expensive suits everyday.
I mean.
So for you it's no big deal,but for those of us shlubs down
here, putting on a suit, puttingon a certain type of clothes,
(58:43):
does honor the occasion, and Iguess that's the point.
I'm beating that one to death,brother.
We have got just a few minutesleft on this particular
broadcast.
So election to office is thenext one.
Emblems and symbols, flagceremony, funerals coming up.
(59:03):
I guess we'll do that on thenext one.
This will be a little bitshorter of a broadcast this week
, only because it is justinsanely busy these days, which
is no excuse.
Chris and I will endeavor tofind a better time slot for us
to do this.
Like we told you from the verybeginning, over a year ago, I
(59:27):
think that we don't actuallyknow what we're doing.
So just so you understand that,I wanna remind you.
Speaker 2 (59:34):
It ain't getting better either.
It ain't getting any better,man.
It is what it is.
We're gonna die not knowingwhat we're doing.
Speaker 1 (59:40):
This is how we do it.
This is probably how we willalways do it.
But listen, if you're listeningright now, if you got anything
out of today, we appreciate youlistening, we appreciate your
support.
We're getting support, like Isaid, from all over the world
and it really means a lot.
Chris and I want our fraternityto survive.
(01:00:01):
We want our fraternity to makea difference, to do something
great.
There was a time when Masonrywas very prevalent in this
country and it could be that wayagain, bringing all men
together, regardless of theirfaith, their financial
background, their familialstatus, any and all men coming
(01:00:23):
together for the betterment ofthemselves and the community
around them.
What's wrong with that man?
Where are you gonna find that?
You're not gonna find thatanywhere.
Speaker 2 (01:00:31):
No.
Speaker 1 (01:00:33):
And are you gonna find it in Masonry is the
question that we're asking andthe question that we're gonna be
asking.
And as young men come intoMasonry, the old guard is
looking at them, I think, in thewrong way.
It's not your fraternity, it'sour fraternity and it belongs to
(01:00:55):
the young men.
The young men coming in, teachthem well, teach them what
Masonry is and hand the reinsover to them and support them.
That's the only way it survives.
Otherwise, it goes the way of Idon't know name, an
organization that's no longeryou know.
Speaker 2 (01:01:10):
Boy Scouts.
Speaker 1 (01:01:11):
Boy Scouts.
Yeah, there you go.
There's an organization thatforgot what it was and paid the
price for it, and now it is nomore, so well, almost no more.
Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
But anyway, no, they're still kicking, I think.
Speaker 1 (01:01:23):
I hope, so I hope.
Speaker 2 (01:01:24):
Different than it was , maybe, but yeah absolutely,
they're still doing fine.
I think they have girls now.
That's what I was told.
I thought that was Girl Scoutsno no, they have girls that are
Boy Scouts now.
Speaker 1 (01:01:36):
Girls that are Boy Scouts.
It's changed a lot.
Yeah, see, that's what I'mtalking about.
Speaker 2 (01:01:40):
But you know it's like I get it.
I get it.
I've been bleeding in my lodgefor years Sweat, tears, blood,
everything and I've justfinished a year of having
leadership after all, this timeof the direction of the lodge,
and now it's time to go away andbe quiet, and that's hard to do
(01:02:01):
.
Speaker 1 (01:02:02):
I get it, I get it.
Speaker 2 (01:02:03):
I understand you brothers, and past masters and
past grandmasters and pastdistrict deputies.
You gave so much to thefraternity.
You gave life time, everythingwhat's more important than your
time, and you gave a lot of itto this fraternity and so you
love it and you don't wanna seeit degraded.
But change isn't always bad.
We can't look at all change isbad and we should try new ideas.
(01:02:26):
And if they fail, they fail, butif they help, then it's your
fraternity that's being helpedtoo.
So let them have theiropportunity.
You're there to try to guidethem and say we tried that,
here's what happened when we didit.
Has anything changed that?
Maybe it would work now?
We did that in our lodge theywere talking about doing
spaghetti dinners or somethingand we tried that didn't make
(01:02:48):
any money, and then it came out.
Yeah, but when you did it, lookat the situation, it's a little
different now.
So, situations do change throughtime.
Just cause something didn'twork in the past doesn't mean it
won't work now, but they needyour feedback.
Speaker 1 (01:03:02):
Yeah, that's right.
They need your engagement, theyneed your wisdom and guidance.
That's right.
The only way an organizationcan survive into the future is
to bring young people into it,train them in the ways of the
fraternity or organization andthen put them in place and leave
them alone.
Let them do what they're gonnado, let them make their mistakes
(01:03:23):
, let them learn and guide themin the ways and precepts of the
organization so that they don'tveer off from it.
But you gotta bring them in,you gotta let them in.
The old guard has got to giveway to that young and new, the
new way.
Speaker 2 (01:03:38):
I mean it's you wanna talk about old guard who gets
it?
Talk about RayWarshall-Ron-Baber.
Speaker 1 (01:03:43):
Yeah, that's right.
Last night.
Speaker 2 (01:03:45):
He's one of the older guard right.
He won competitions.
He was master districtinstructor.
He worked for the district sohard for many years.
He's paid his dues, he's donehis time, he's helped a lot of
people and at this point hestood in front of us last night
and said here's the thing aboutbeing a teacher of leaders
(01:04:06):
You're not teaching them how todo their job.
You're teaching them the systemthat they're working in and
you're encouraging them to bethemselves, because they will
have hesitance, they will bescared, and so you have to
encourage them to be themselves,because good leaders embrace
who they are.
Speaker 1 (01:04:25):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2 (01:04:26):
So you're just teaching them the system they're
working in, the rules theygotta follow.
You're like you don't teachthem how to do the job.
Speaker 1 (01:04:31):
Right.
Speaker 2 (01:04:32):
Just, you can't do this, you can't do that, you
have to do this, you have to dothat.
Now.
Go out there and do a good job.
Speaker 1 (01:04:37):
Right, yeah, this is who we are, this is what we
believe.
Now Go, make it your own.
Speaker 2 (01:04:42):
Give them some room.
Give them some room to fly.
Speaker 1 (01:04:45):
Yeah, man, I love it, I absolutely love it.
Speaker 2 (01:04:48):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:04:50):
Whoa, that was a burp .
Speaker 2 (01:04:51):
Woo, here we go, oh man.
Speaker 1 (01:04:54):
Well, you know, brother, once again I am in awe
of this crazy podcast that youand I started so long ago, based
on an idea and a thought, andit's grown into something that
I'm pretty proud of.
Man, it's quite an experience,it's quite an honor, it's
(01:05:15):
humbling to meet people out ofnowhere who, hey, you're Fred.
From Fred and Chris, I'm like,oh yep, I am.
What did I do wrong?
I'm sorry.
And they're just encouraging usand thankful for everything
that we have, that we've triedto do here.
All of it is for love of thefraternity.
We really do believe thatMasonry does have something to
offer to this hurting countryand all of us together, we can
(01:05:39):
go back to our guidingprinciples and we can make them
our own and move things forwardand maybe make a difference in
this world.
What do you got, chris, on theway out?
Nothing, thank you.
Hey, chris, yeah, fred, what's a Mason?
Speaker 2 (00:08):
That's a really good question, fred.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
You've reached the internet's home for all things
masonry.
Join Chris and I as we plumbthe depths of our ancient craft.
From the common gavel to thetrowel.
Nothing is off the table, sograb your tools and let's get to
work.
This is, on the Level Space,the final frontier.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Oh, somebody's been watching some Star Trek.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
I've been watching a little too much Star Trek.
I gotta be honest with you.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Really, I don't know.
Is that possible?
No, wow, it's not possible.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Our levels are very high right now.
Woo Like it, man.
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
I'll tell you what.
They don't make television likethat anymore.
Star Trek used to almost everyepisode be some kind of
commentary on society.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Yeah right, yep, that's very true it was.
I've been watching NextGeneration.
I started at season one and I'minto season two now and at
first it's kind of hard to watch, you know.
Yeah, it's a little cheesy inthe beginning.
In the beginning it's yeah,they're still trying to figure
things out, you know.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
The budget wasn't there, right, yeah, clearly the
budget wasn't there.
The actors didn't really knowtheir characters yet.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
Right and Picard didn't have his Picard voice
really down.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
Yeah, you know like he does now you know.
Picard maneuver.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Yeah, you know that one right.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
He talks his shirt every minute.
Oh, right, right, yes, that'sright, apparently, the shirts
rode up all the time.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Oh my gosh, we're recording.
This is a show, oh hey.
Heck Hi people.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Hey, what's up?
Speaker 1 (01:41):
guys Wow.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
You're not a nerd.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
We're nerding out on some Star Trek, which is
appropriate.
I mean, it's a great show.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
It is the greatest show ever to grace the
television screen.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
You know, I remember when next generation first came
out Me too, season one, I hadbelieve it or not, this is
really weird I had a portabletelevision what?
Yeah, it was a handheldportable television.
Now, this is what you got acell phone.
Eighties, it was the season.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
I don't remember what year it came out.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
It was in the eighties, I believe it was, yeah
, late eighties.
Anyways, I was so into it thatI was carrying my 87.
87.
I was carrying my portabletelevision.
It was super fuzzy, it had abig antenna.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
It was cool, this was .
I just got a portabletelevision in 87.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
It was a handheld television man.
I'm telling you, I'm taking mykids on Halloween trick or
treating and I'm watching nextgeneration.
This is how much I was into it.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Wow, very cool.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Yeah, I guess my poor kids, they probably knew I was
a freak.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
That was the precursor to cell phones.
You got your TV in your handand you just it was pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Everyone thought my cool factor was through the roof
.
For the eighties man, that wasa big deal.
I wonder what ever happened outthere.
I bet it would be worth a tonof money these days.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Oh God, yeah, Absolutely it would.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
I'm sure it lasted all of a couple of weeks and
then something malfunctioned andit blew up.
That was Tacking the eightieswas pretty sketchy at best.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
It's true, we had a lot of cool technology, but
nothing worked.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Nothing really worked and it was big and bulky and
kind of a concept.
Now it's just every day we'rechained to it.
Now it knows more than we do.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
That's not a false statement.
That's right.
That's right.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Brother, what's been going on with you man?
What's the latest?
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Me or nothing, just the usual.
We did a really awesomepractice last night for a
competition degree team withWright, warshfield Ron Baber,
who brought in Wright HonorableJJ Albreton and Warshfield Kevin
Sopio to the team we have.
Literally he's talking aboutbringing one more big, huge name
(03:58):
to help coach.
I can't even imagine who thatmight be.
Wow, that's awesome.
We already got all the heataround here.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Who else is he?
Speaker 2 (04:06):
bringing.
Speaker 1 (04:07):
I was only a little intimidated before now.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Well, they're so nice .
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Yeah, they're good guys.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
The practice is like on level I've never experienced
in all my years of Freemasonry.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
This is ridiculous that I'm even there.
I'm a second year, Mason Wellyeah, I guess.
Second, almost three year Mason, I'm sitting in the junior
warden's chair and I am clearlythe weak link.
I mean, I am just likeay-ya-ya-ya, I got to work at it
.
I can't be there and make andlose those points.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
It can't happen.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
I cannot allow that.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Well, he said last night, we're gunning for a
perfect score.
By the time we do our finalpractice, we will be doing it at
a perfect score level.
He said, if we lose, it will bebecause somebody made a mistake
they didn't make in practice.
That's almost always you got tokeep your head in the game,
because you'll know it.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
You got to get through the fear factor.
That's a big factor.
You could know it and know itreally well.
And then the day of when you'reup at bat man, you're swinging
for the fence and strike three,you're out.
That's what happens.
So you got to.
For me, in my mind, if I haveto know it, I mean I have to not
(05:24):
only know the material, but Igot to know the why behind it.
Once I own it, then I'mcomfortable with it, I can have
fun with it and I'm good.
I'm there now.
I know all the words.
I can do it from memory withoutan issue.
So it's what is this?
He's showing me something,folks, for those of you
(05:46):
listening to the podcast and notwatching it, because you can't
watch it.
He has handed me his phone andI'm looking at.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
I have a picture box in my hand.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
I got a picture box in my hand of Mr Baber.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
He's dropping a golf ball.
This was one of the exerciseswe did last night.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
We dropped it on the mosaic pavement and it was the
junior warden's job to have hiscolumn down before the ball hit
the ground and the seniorwarden's job to have his up by
the time the ball reached hishand.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Oh, what a great idea we were doing exercises like
that.
Oh man, I'm so sorry I missedthat.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
I've never practiced in this way and it was so
dynamic and engaging.
Everybody was having so muchfun.
But learning, really learning,oh man.
Yeah, this is all inpreparation.
We haven't even started toactually practicing.
We're just learning how tolearn properly right now.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
Right yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:39):
How to read a floorwork book, how to use your
floorwork book as an open books,as you were there when we went
through open books and readevery letter, every letter, jot
and tittle, one at a time.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Yeah, it made a difference.
Oh God, it made a hugedifference to me.
I always just do it from memoryand Baber even said he said all
right, I can tell you're justdoing it from memory, You're not
actually reading it.
Go through it again and readevery single word, Every letter.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
And it was like whoa, this is hard.
Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
But it does cement it a little better into your mind
and for me the stress of doingit the day of is going to give
way to just the fun and the joyof it.
And that's the way I am.
If I know the material and Ican have fun with it, then I
know that I'll do fine.
(07:30):
And the junior warden part isnot all that difficult.
You know you're just doing alot of standing and sitting and
very little talking.
I feel for the well, for theworst, for master position
obviously, and the senior wardenthey got a lot of talking to do
.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Big chairs.
It's like difficulties, youknow them are super easy, but I
would say the senior deacon,because he moved so much.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
Oh yeah, that's right .
Speaker 2 (07:59):
And talks arguably has the harder job.
That's correct, yeah, but themaster being the focus of all
the attention, that is a layerof difficulty that people don't
realize.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
Right, right yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
And be challenging on top of the words and other
floorwork.
So I could see that case beingmade that the master is the
harder than the senior deacon,but I would argue the senior
deacon is actually tough.
Right as tough as the master.
Yeah, yeah so what are wetalking about?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
What are we talking about?
You guys still out there.
Sorry, sorry, it's us banteringagain, so I want to talk a
little bit about Texas.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Just a little bit.
You know there are things goingon outside of Florida, in the
world of free masonry there are.
There's another one that wecould bring up, but let's go
with Texas, let's go with Texas.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
So apparently there's a huge controversy going in the
Grand Lodge of Texas and on thelevel of Fred, and Chris is not
taking a side or a stand herein any way.
But it's interesting to me thatthis is a controversy.
It seems to us from here inFlorida and just what we've seen
(09:09):
online is that the old guard isnot wanting to give way to the
new guard.
Am I wrong about that?
Speaker 2 (09:16):
That is exactly what the issue is, and it's gotten so
detrimental to the craft.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Absolutely yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
That things are looking a little scary for them
right now.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Like they might actually split to two Grand
Lodges.
Is that even possible?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
It's totally possible .
Wow, that's how.
There's a free mason's ofFlorida Facebook group and this
is where we've been kind ofgetting some.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Right yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
And that's Texas are posting about it and their
passions are getting the betterof them.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
A lot of them Right.
Yeah, it happens, it happensyeah.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
People are digging into camps, they're calling each
other names.
They're not engaging in masonicdialogue, right?
I literally see people, see,say this is why people aren't
coming to Lodge.
I'm leaving this group.
What they're doing is they'redriving people away.
Their passion, their inabilityto circumscribe their passions,
(10:13):
is driving people away, right,and what's the end goal?
Speaker 1 (10:16):
here.
You know what is the goal, guysout there in Texas you know, is
the goal to make new masons?
Because I don't think you'regoing about the right way if
that is the ultimate goal.
So we were wanting to.
There's a mason, a brother outthere who's trying to.
(10:37):
I guess he's on the new, thenew upcoming side.
What's his name?
Can we say his name on the air?
Speaker 2 (10:45):
Sure, so I believe the grandmaster's name is Clay
Smith.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
And the issue is I believe he accepted masonic
charges against the juniorgrandmaster of Texas.
All right, whose name is right?
Most worshipful rumsie.
Okay, does that sound right?
I'm trying to find his firstname.
I think his last name is rumsie.
Yes, he was trying to run forgrand secretary and so these
(11:17):
charges came at installation andthat prevented him, according
to Texas law, from running forthe secretary's chair if he was
under masonic charges.
That was their first attempt.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
So that smells like a political move.
Yeah, in the grandest of terms,correct.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Yeah, I mean when you accept the charges at an
installation.
It's pretty clear.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
It's pretty clear you're making a statement.
Yeah, there's something notright there.
Yeah, and my statement was youknow, is this the old guard not
giving way to the new guard?
It just seems like that'salways the case.
You know there's a but I youknow I could be wrong.
We would love to get rumsie,brother rumsie, on the show to
talk to him.
So we're trying to reach out tohim and see if he'd be willing
(12:03):
to come on and just tell uswhat's going on out there,
because, at the end of the day,all of us Masons need to be
doing what we can to help Texas,kind of kind of go, go, go home
, go in the lodge, close thedoor, all of you, men, men and
Masons, face to face and workthis out, man, and make, make
Texas great again.
For goodness sakes, come on,man no-transcript Right Worshful
(12:27):
Jim Rumsey.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Okay, what's the name ?
Speaker 1 (12:30):
So he's the one that we tried to reach out to him to
see if we could get him tointerview him on the show and
talk about what's going on.
He may not be able to talkabout it, but if he is willing
and able to talk about it, we'dlove to hear.
You know what's going on.
And then maybe from the otherside as well, here are some
things going on and maybeFlorida can help Texas and
(12:50):
someday maybe Texas can helpFlorida, because that's what we
do, we're Masons, right.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Yeah, so I think the Grandmaster removed the
Grandtreasurer.
He removed a brother who wasthe chairman of finance.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
When he became Grandmaster and then proceeded
to file charges against thisbrother and another named
Billings.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Who was, that is, who was running for grand secretary
, was Billings and charges werefiled against all these people.
The whole state is up andbecause, apparently, the
brothers who are under chargesare beloved by the state.
They had fantasticcontributions.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
They brought change.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
They were visible, they communicated, and there's a
certain older guard that is nota fan of this change.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
Right, right, we want things to stay the way they've
always been, and we're nostranger to that Not on the
grand lodge level here, but inour own backyard.
We're no stranger to thateffect, for sure.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
I'm sure anyone anywhere in the world must
experience that Right.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
I would say so, yeah, when the new comes in.
But you know, it's the samething.
Look at our Congress theaverage age.
Believe it or not, the averageage in the Congress of the
United States of America is 74years old people.
That's it 74 years old.
Can you imagine that?
And a lot of the top names thatyou're thinking of right now,
(14:18):
they're in their 80s man.
So, and I've always believedthat, you know, the future
cannot be carved out by the past.
You cannot make a future basedon the past and the elders are
supposed to give way to theyounger and be there to support
them and, to you know, to helpthem.
(14:39):
You know, carve out this newdirection, and we just don't
have that anywhere.
Can we please try it in masonry, Maybe?
If we try it in the masonicworld, maybe we can.
It's, like I said, one of theswitching here to another rabbit
hole the symposium that we havein January, the talk that Chris
(15:02):
and I are going to work on, andit's not going to be an
in-depth talk because we've gotsome really great speakers who
are going to take the show.
Oh yeah, but our quick, brieftalk is going to be about a
project that Chris and I aregoing to start working on, which
is does masonry have somethingto offer to our hurting country?
And I've been digging into somestats on young men, young
(15:25):
American men, in this countryand it is disheartening, fellas,
it's really dishearteningwhat's going on with our young
men in this country right now,and we are definitely in a
crisis with regard to young men.
And my question is and thequestion that we want to answer
during this symposium we don'thave a lot of time to develop it
, but we're going to do it inparts and pieces and we'll do
(15:46):
some of it on the show as well,but does masonry offer something
to young men that could helpthem navigate this world and do
better in this world?
Because young men in thiscountry are failing, and failing
greatly, on a huge scale, andmy question is does masonry have
something to offer to help usWell?
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Texas.
I know the answer to that.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
The answer is Texas.
You've got to get yourselftogether and we challenge you in
love, as brothers, to get ittogether, man, and to join the
rest of masonry in helping.
We've got to help this country.
If masonry can help young menfind their direction, find their
(16:28):
way, find a cause, findintegrity, find a way to
circumscribe their passions andbe contributors to a future,
then I say we should doeverything we can to make that a
reality.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Yeah, absolutely.
That's kind of what we'recharged to do as masons in the
three charges that we take.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
That's right.
The degrees that's right.
I think we did a couple ofshows on that.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Yeah Well, texas, apparently their grand lodge
meets in January.
This is all going to be settledin January, but they're calling
for a special session to bemade.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Who's calling for it?
The old guard of the new Crap?
Speaker 2 (17:07):
The traditions are designed by lodges.
Oh, I love that Submitted togrand lodge the people have been
activated, yeah.
Lodges are getting involved.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
Oh, this is great.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Yeah, that's why it's dangerous.
Yeah, right, yeah, absolutely,yeah, People are actually
getting behind again or facingoff against their grand lodge.
So where does that take them?
Because they have no authorityover grand lodge.
Right, right, people have allthe authority.
They're curious to watch andsee how our brothers in Texas
handle this.
(17:37):
I see a lot of vitriol, yeahyeah, anger A lot of emotion.
Passions getting away frompeople online.
Some people are steady,steadfast, Masonic people, but
they're not getting listened tofrom what I can see online.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
It's kind of a mess, but other Masonic news.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
Other Masonic news Go ahead.
Speaker 2 (18:02):
This is the state of Ohio.
Okay, the grand lodge hasissued a ruling on transgenders.
Okay, which is interesting innews, I believe, and what it
boils down to is that they havedetermined that they will follow
the sex given to you at yourbirth.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
As a male only fraternal society.
A petitioner must be born amale and continue to live as a
male.
As a private organization, ourbusiness meetings are private
and we respect the privacy ofour members but they're saying
that, yes, if you were born aman, you can be a Mason.
If you're transitioned to awoman.
(18:44):
You're no longer living as aman and therefore can't be a
Mason.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
And vice versa.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
I suppose, If you were born a woman and
transitioned to man.
You cannot be a Mason CorrectBecause they're going by your
sex at birth.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Okay, so you have to have both Born a man and living
as a man, right?
So you're not a Mason or anytransgender woman becoming a man
out of the mix and anytransgender man becoming a woman
out of the mix All right.
Well, you're not a Mason inOhio.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
So the first thing in my mind is that they kudos on
them for just for for taking astand, whether you agree with it
or disagree with it.
They actually stood up and saidthis is what we're about, which
is lacking in this country forsure.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
I presume it's because they were presented with
it.
Probably so, right, yeah, itcame up.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
So it had to be addressed and this is the way
they decided to address it.
It does.
It does purport to the originsof Freemasonry.
I think whenever you're,whenever you're presented as an
organization with a new worldproblem or a new world situation
, it's important to go back towho you are from the beginning.
(19:54):
Who are you and what do youstand for in the beginning, what
are your principles and whatare your?
You know, what is it that hasmade you what you are, and then
stand on that.
It sounds like that's whatthey're doing, men.
It's a fraternity.
So you know, and right now, Iknow, I know this became as a
(20:14):
political football almostimmediately, but people are
beginning to take a step back onthis issue and talk about it a
little bit more, especiallybecause the women's sports and
all that stuff that came out andnow it's just blowing up, you
know on.
You know it's the unintendedconsequences you know of, of
(20:37):
issues that come up andeverybody just runs in one
direction and then all of asudden it's like, wait, wait,
the house is still on fire.
The house is on fire and we gotto stop and put it out and
figure this thing out, and Ithink that's what's happening
now?
I take no, I don't know, Ihaven't really thought about it.
So I should keep my mouth shutuntil I know how I feel about
(20:58):
the whole thing.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
I did think about it and obviously my political views
tend to be we call them centerleft Correct.
So I tend to try to protectpeople's civil rights and
initially I was like wait, thisisn't fair.
But I read this and I thoughtabout it more and we are a
private organization.
Correct we make our own rules.
We don't have to follow that'sright.
(21:21):
We have to follow the titlenorms, whether they're good or
bad.
We can stick to who we are, andI think I agree with the
decision, personally, that ifyou're born a man, be a Mason.
If you're born a woman, you'renot gonna be a Mason.
If you wanna be a woman, whywould you wanna be a Mason?
Correct, correct?
So the Grand Lodge of England,however, has ruled the opposite.
(21:42):
Oh, no kidding.
They see it as a civil rightsissue and they say that gender
reassignment should be treatedwith the utmost compassion and
sensitivity, and they allow menwho transition to women to
remain Masons.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
And women who become men to become Masons.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
Now I do know that.
I do believe in Canada and inEngland it is illegal.
You could be arrested literallyfor disagreeing with that
standard.
So they may be just kowtowingto government regulation because
it's different there.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Yeah, it's really different.
You don't have the right.
They have female Freemasonryover there, so they really
changed.
So they, yeah, they've changeda lot of stuff over there, yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
And I'm not commenting on good or bad, it's
not my house.
It's somebody else's house,it's across the pond.
That's their deal, not ours.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
Correct.
Speaker 1 (22:36):
I do know here we do have we still kinda almost still
have the right to freeexpression.
It's eroding daily, but westill have that right to free
expression and, as I said, fromyour position, we are a private
organization and we should anddo have the right to determine
our own destiny as based on whatwe, as a craft, want it to be
(23:01):
and our landmarks existed beforethe transgender issue.
Absolutely right.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
I get.
At some point something had tobe said and we haven't in
Florida.
To my knowledge, no State ofFlorida had to deal with that at
the grand lodge level.
I'm in Florida.
I'd be surprised if it came upin the near future, but it might
, it might and I'd be curious tosee how they handle it.
I don't think the majoritypeople would disagree with how
(23:27):
Ohio's handle it.
Personally, yeah.
I think the majority wouldagree.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
It's a fair stance.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
I suppose, so I suppose so.
Either you were born a woman oryou chose not to be a man,
correct.
And if you're choosing not tobe a man, okay, it's a
fraternity of men.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Right.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
And the argument's pretty easy to make that you
should not be a mason Right.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
I mean, at the end of the day it is an emotional,
it's a choice.
I shouldn't say emotional,wrong word but it certainly is a
choice because your DNA willalways remain the sex that you
were born in.
It doesn't matter.
They've dug up bones that arehundreds and hundreds of years
old and they do testing on theDNA and they can tell if it's a
male or a female.
(24:10):
So it's always going to be thatway.
You can make superficialchanges to your body and to your
personality.
You can do that through moderntechnology, but you will never
change the total makeup of yourDNA strands.
It won't change.
You can't.
You were made that way, youwere born that way and you will
(24:31):
die that way.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
So that part's just true.
Let's get off this and on towhat are we talking about today?
Speaker 2 (24:37):
That's your current affairs.
There you go, texas and Ohio.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
Texas and Ohio.
Yeah, go Texas, come on guys,let's see you guys work through
this in a Masonic way and comeout on the other side as better
men.
That would be on the level withFred and Chris's desire, and if
there's anything this show cando, to help facilitate that.
Let us know, email us and letus know.
(25:02):
We've got some listeners inTexas, so shout out.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
We'll distract you so much from the issue You'll have
no idea what you wereoriginally talking about.
That's right, we're done withyou.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
That's kind of like what we're good at right.
We'll take you down a rabbithole.
You ain't never seen comments.
Exactly All right.
So we're still in the etiquettebook, yes, which is great.
I'm good here.
I kind of like it.
We're getting a lot of reallypositive feedback from folks all
over the world that they dig it.
(25:32):
It's the book they almost neverread.
Do they see Sweden, sweden,correct?
Our brother from Sweden shoutedout to us, and I think he has a
really cool Swedish name.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
So Heard yeah, something cool.
Heard Ironside or something, Idon't know Something.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Jorn, something totally cool like that.
Yeah, yeah, maybe, yeah, yeah,maybe.
But anyway, svirgin, yeah, heshouted out to us and let us
know that he was listening andthat he was digging the content
with regard to the etiquettebook, and I think he made the
comment Forgive me, brother, Idon't have your email right in
(26:14):
front of me but I think he madethe comment that he, like most
people, never really read thething.
Most people don't look at it andread it.
So we go through thesedocuments of ours here in the
Florida Grand Lodge documentsand booklets that we have, that
which we can share.
We don't share stuff that we'renot allowed to share or that is
(26:36):
part of our secret rituals, butwe don't go totally in depth on
this stuff.
What we try to do is get youguys to be like hey, these guys
are talking about this.
I've never opened it up.
Maybe I'll just open it up formyself, I'll read through it and
(26:56):
maybe I'll encourage mybrothers and my lodge to do more
with it and read through it.
And that's a lot of theresponses that we've gotten over
the years with regard to whatwe do here.
That's what people do.
We're not diving deep intoMasonic truth here on the show.
(27:18):
You guys probably already knowthat we're pretty superficial
with it by design.
We want you to do the work.
We want you to go home and openit up and read and figure out
what it is you believe aboutmasonry and why on earth you
would believe it in the firstplace.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
This week we've said it many times we're not teaching
anybody, we're not teaching.
We're just giving you ouropinions on things.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
We're giving you our opinions and we're encouraging
you to go and teach yourself andfind out for yourself.
Open up some books, talk tosome people, ask some important
questions and get those answersthat you need to make yourself a
better mason, which makes you abetter man Go.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
I have the email from Johann Lindqvist.
Yes, johann Lindqvist, shoutout to Johann way across the
pond.
Johann Lindqvist, from StJohn's Lodge, solomon and Troy,
zorurus and Goltar ProvincialLodge under the Grand Lodge of
Sweden Wow, sweden.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
That's mouthful.
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
He sent a big ping from Sweden, where he listens to
the podcast, although he'salways a couple of weeks behind.
Come on, come on, brotherJohann, I thoroughly enjoyed the
discussion, but I tend to skipinterviews from Florida Masonic
officers.
See, this is why we can't justinterview people from Florida,
because we do have listeners allover.
We are in Florida, so it's easyfor us to access people.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
Johann, send us an email.
We'll interview you from acrossthe pond.
That'll be fun.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
Lindqvist, you stay away from things that cannot be
discussed openly.
I do learn a lot about thesimilarities and differences
between both our ritualtraditions and organizations, so
thanks for bringing this showto us.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (28:55):
Thank you for listening, brother.
Yeah, brother.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
It means the world to us, man.
That's why we do what we do andwhy we get here at 6 30 AM on a
Thursday morning to do what wedo, and apologies, this podcast
will be released 30 minutes fromthe time.
we record it as soon as we turnthis thing off.
We're going to post it becausewe missed yesterday, and our
(29:20):
apologies, guys.
We are really struggling withtime these days to consistently
get it out on Wednesday mornings, which I know you guys are used
to, and we do get emails.
We hear you guys You'reshooting us stuff.
Hey, where's the podcast?
What's going on?
What happened?
Was there a nuclear holocaustthat I was unaware of?
The answer is no.
Fred and Chris are just stupidbusy and sometimes we just
(29:43):
cannot get our sorry butts inhere at an ungodly hour of the
morning.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
OK, I want to get going on this I have one more.
Ok go, Go yes of course Go, butI don't know why this was sent
to me.
This is from Brother FrankDoring.
Brother Frank Doring said goodmorning.
Where's your brother Burns?
Just want to let you know thatI love your podcast and look
forward to every new one eachweek.
Keep up the great work ineducation you and Fred are doing
.
Two of you are making a bigdifference.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
That's awesome, Thanks bro.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
That means a lot.
He's a past master of HancockLodge 229 in Ellensworth
Wisconsin.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
Woo-hoo, I've helped Cheesehead, yes cheesehead.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
I've held many grand lodge offices over my 20 years
being Freemason and lastly, theposition of district deputy of
our district.
Two oh ties in perfectly.
Speaker 1 (30:32):
District deputy.
That's right, district deputy.
Where's that going to come up?
Speaker 2 (30:36):
Go.
As such, I saw a great need fortrue basic Masonic education.
We've always tried to raise thecalling and have forgotten to
raise the floor.
This year, by your inspiration,I've started an open book club,
similar to what your brothersdo in Florida.
I could use some help andguidance that on trikes endeavor
, as you already have experiencewith what works and what
doesn't.
Could you please help me outwith this?
(30:57):
Also, I'm very interested inthe promotional program you
developed, which I understand isnow sponsored by the Grand
Lodge of Florida.
I want to learn how this works.
I want to bring it to the GrandLodge of Wisconsin.
As I said before, he's been adistrict deputy, discovered some
important needs in the lodges.
Wisconsin has less than 8,000active Freemasons, many of whom
are very advanced and aged, andhe believes, as we do, that
(31:19):
there's a great opportunity tostrengthen our ranks with the
right tools.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Brother, you are singing our song.
Man, you are singing our song.
Yes, I know somebody who'sinfluential in the reimbursement
program.
He's sitting right across fromme, so that is not a problem.
Gladly to help out there.
Speaker 2 (31:37):
Yes, absolutely, will help with that and I'm going to
email Brother Dury and maybewe'll have him on the show if he
has any success with thesethings.
That would be great, it'shappened over there.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
That would be absolutely awesome as far as
what we have learned withsitting down with a group of men
and openly discussing Masonic,whatever it is.
We have a discussion groupesoteric discussion group and we
sat down and we just opened upthe Mentor's Manual and started
just talking about EA stuffthat's in the manual and pushing
(32:10):
the conversation.
In that way I can tell you whatdoesn't work.
What doesn't work is one personreading and just kind of a
teaching.
A teacher student format doesnot seem to work.
We've tried it once or twiceand it just bombs.
What works is an openconversation, but you have to
have somebody directing trafficin there, kind of keeping things
(32:35):
going, somebody who'sexperienced.
I have a lot of experience inthat kind of stuff because I've
just done this kind of stuffMen's Ministry stuff for 30
years.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
You're doing a great job at our events, yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
I don't like it being just me, so I'm actively
recruiting people to start doingit as well as me.
But anyways, brother, what I'msaying to you is that an open
forum with one or two guyssitting kind of in the front,
facilitating not leading, notdirecting, but facilitating open
conversations and reinforcingsome of the rules of the group.
(33:10):
One of our rules in the groupis you can share anything you
want.
It doesn't matter what it is,as long as it's done with
gentleness and respect for thebelief structures of everybody
in the room.
Some people think that's notpossible.
It is possible.
We have proven it over and overagain.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
I think we've done four or five of those now yes,
so figure Very successful.
Probably 10 hours ofdiscussions.
We've done Correct In those 10hours.
We had one situation where wehad to change the subject, I
think.
I think so yeah it's likebarely anything compared to the
heavy stuff we were actuallytalking about.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Right In, but to and.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
The degree.
It ain't just your words.
We're talking about life.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Yeah, no, we Allady.
We went into some deep, deeptruths and a lot of social
issues.
We even had a conversationabout racism and and race
relations.
We have.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
They don't hear about that.
No, no, they don't.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Every time we use that word, everybody tunes out.
I don't know why that word isdeath to podcast.
Never put that word in yourtitle, by the way, if you're a
podcast.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
No, no one will listen to it.
101 we.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
We don't want to hear about it.
I wonder why we?
I guess that means we probablyshould.
Okay, there's a rabbit hole foryou now.
Can we finally get, please, tothe etiquette Manual?
That's GL 208, revised in 2010.
You'll find it with a yellowcover.
It was given to you when youbecame an entered apprentice by
(34:37):
your secretary and it was thelast book on the bottom of the
pile and that's probably why itremained there.
Get it out, mm-hmm, when youget a chance, get it out and
read through it.
You won't you won't regret it.
We'll do it with you right now.
We'll do it with you.
Now to the.
The heading today, which is onpage four Are you kidding me?
We're only on page four isdistrict deputy grandmaster, is
(35:00):
the heading, and I'll just readthe first paragraph or so.
The district deputy grandmasteris the personal representative
of the grandmaster and whenvisiting a lodge, whether it be
formally or informally, heshould be accorded all respect.
He should never be addressed byhis first name during any part
of lodge ceremonies.
Such conduct demeans his office.
(35:21):
The district deputy grandmastershould be received in
accordance with provisionsadopted at the hundred and
eightieth Grand Lodge in 2010.
So that's the reason why thisbook is revised for 2010 mm a
district deputy grandmaster isrequired by our constitutional
law to officially visit everylodge in his district district
(35:44):
at least once during his term.
He comes there to performcertain specific duties required
by Grand Lodge.
And to Changing the page, mygoodness and to give the
brethren the message of thegrandmaster.
This message contains mattersof importance concerning with
Concerning, which thegrandmaster, in his wisdom,
(36:05):
deems it necessary to inform thecraft.
The remarks of the deputy, then, are of supreme importance.
It is his, it is his evening.
No programs or speeches otherthan his should be allowed.
What he has to say should standout.
Nothing must detract from it.
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
So this is something that I've heard from several
district deputies, past districtdeputies.
They People don't understandthe role of the district.
Deputy grandmaster.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
I did not understand it.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Yeah, they have told me, peep.
They don't understand whypeople get scared when they
enter the room.
They get nervous when they'rearound the district.
Deputy grandmaster, becausethey have no power.
Their pot, their job, is tobring the grandmasters message
to the district.
Right yeah, they can't takeyour charter, they can't on make
(36:57):
you a Mason, they can't evengive you any kind of Masonic
Discipline.
They are simply there as theeyes and ears of the grandmaster
.
So if they see something,they're supposed to report it to
the grandmaster right, yeahgrandmaster tells them to do
something, they have to do whatthey're told.
They don't have a whole lot ofpower and autonomy right as the
(37:17):
district deputy grandmaster, butbecause it's such a position of
Admirations to Masons, I guesswe do review the district deputy
correct as the most Importantperson in our district at that
time.
Yeah, because they represent usat the Grand Lodge and he, he
(37:38):
literally Represents thegrandmaster.
Speaker 1 (37:41):
Yes, sitting in your lodge so the Grandmaster cannot
be everywhere at all times.
He is not omnipresent.
Therefore, his representativeswith in each district Represent
him.
I, like you said, eyes and earsin the lodge.
When he comes in he isrepresenting the grandmaster.
He's representing mostworshipal bishop.
(38:02):
When right worshipful districtdeputy grandmaster Davies comes
into our lodge he is reprepresenting most worshipal
bishop and we are to afford himthe same respect we would most
worshipal bishop.
That's the idea here yeah, andI have.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
I always ask every outgoing district deputy
grandmaster ever since I was asenior steward.
I used to.
I don't know why.
I was always curious like, hey,was there anything that
surprised you I didn't preparefor?
And every single one of themhas said the same thing for the
last six years.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
I can guess.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
I had no idea how bad things were oh, oh, is that
right.
No idea how unmasked peoplebehave.
Oh right, oh wow.
Wow that's what shocks them,that's what they weren't
prepared for is some of the badstuff they wind up seeing
inevitably.
And that's the job, right,that's the job.
People come to you when there'sa problem and they tell you
there's a problem, right, youwind up seeing all the problems.
(39:04):
You see all the bad stuff andyou're used to being in your
lodge and you know your lodgesdeal and you know what the
problems are right and you think, ah, we got big problems.
But then you go out and look atthe other lodges and you see, oh
, there's some really bigproblem, really bad stuff, right
yeah yeah masters need to getremoved, charters need to be
pulled, masonic trials are beingheld like yeah, he's stuff that
(39:27):
you're dealing with, and sosome of them I've seen needed to
take a minute to recover fromall that negativity they were
surrounded by.
It can be a very difficult job,it seems.
I don't know, I've never doneit and hopefully don't get asked
to do it but it seems to methat the people that have done
it unanimously agree that youshould be prepared Mentally for
(39:50):
dealing with some interestingthings you probably don't want
to have to deal with yeah,that's right.
Speaker 1 (39:55):
It ain't all sunshine and rainbows and I know we're
remiss in inviting our currentDeputy deputy district
grandmaster.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
It really is here at all the time.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
District deputy grandmaster Davies.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
Yes, there you go.
Speaker 1 (40:12):
Shout out to brother Tom, and we have.
We are apologies, we have beenremiss in inviting you.
Speaker 2 (40:20):
He's been busy.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
I know, I know how busy.
Every time I talk to me, he'slike I travel, I travel, I keep,
I travel, I keep traveling.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Well, I think they have to do four lodge visits
this year.
He told me it was eight Eightfor the whole year.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
Yes, so he has to go to every lodge four times.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Yes, and we've got nine lodges, so that's 36 lodge
visit 36 lodges.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
Visits all over the district.
Speaker 2 (40:43):
The district deputy is also expected to be at the
grandmaster's official visitsthroughout the state.
Speaker 1 (40:48):
Oh right, so there's another all those, there's
another 13, or whatever 20something 20 something.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Yeah, 60, 70 things to do.
Speaker 1 (40:56):
Yeah, so he spends his time traveling a lot.
So I we understand that and weare planning on on asking him
and hopefully he'll be graciousenough to To come on and we can
do an interview with our, ourcurrent.
We want to, we want tointerview.
We're a little lax guys.
It's end of the year, theholidays are starting and things
just crept up on us.
We've got a thousand things inthe fire right now and that's
(41:19):
the one thing that kind of fellby the way.
So we want to get.
We want to get our, ourinstructor, our district
instructor, justin broom, onagain.
We want to get Tom Davey on andwe want to get a couple of
other people on before the endof the year.
We're trying like crazy, butit's just wish I'll.
Speaker 2 (41:37):
Barry Hart will be the next interview.
Speaker 1 (41:39):
Very hard will be the next in yes, a Stalworth in our
district.
Oh yeah, if very hard is he's?
He's the George George Burns ofDistrict 23.
George Burns once said I Ican't die, I'm too booked and
that's booked, that's that'sright, we're full heart.
He can't go anywhere.
(41:59):
Nothing can happen to him,because he's just too darn
booked.
He is going to be somewhere,even tonight, I'm sure of it, or
tomorrow night, any.
Any day of the week.
He's somewhere, is doingsomething for our district, and
we are blessed to have him forsure.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
Two more George Burns quotes that could be very hard
quotes.
Oh yeah, go sex at 90s liketrying to shoot pool with a rope
.
I Could see Barry saying thatHappiness is having a large,
loving, caring, close-knitfamily in another city.
Speaker 1 (42:31):
Love George Burns.
George Burns is awesome.
What's the other one?
He said had I listened to mydoctor and quit smoking cigars,
I would not have lived longenough to attend his funeral.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
He said when I was a boy the Dead Sea was only sick,
but he lived to be like 90,something, right oh yeah, he was
up there, man, he was up there,quite he was a.
Last actor yep Was George Burns.
Speaker 1 (42:59):
Oh, that's right.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
Yeah, your name is George Burns.
My middle name is George.
I'm Christopher George.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Burns, I'm sitting across from George.
Speaker 2 (43:05):
Burns yeah, I'm trying to make that tie so I can
get some of that inheritance.
Okay, let me know how they'regoing out there can help me with
that any lawyers any?
Speaker 1 (43:13):
lawyers yes, from the Burns estate yes, the other
Burns estate, yes, please callthe show Okay.
So the Constitution alsorequires that the district
deputy inspect the records andaccounts of the lodges and sees
that the same are In properorder, and then it cites the
section.
There have been instances wherelodges have gotten into
(43:33):
difficulties Because ofirregularities which such an
inspection would have disclosed,but we're not discovered until
too late because thisconstitutional requirement has
not been complied with.
This being a duty imposed uponthe district deputy by our
Constitution, the master shouldformally tender the the lodge
records to the district deputybefore such an official
(43:57):
Visitation, and preferably at atime convenient to the district
deputy to examine the same.
So that the Consciceness, justso that the consents, the
consent, yes, district deputy,will not be put to the
embarrassment of asking forrecords.
I, conscientious sorry,conscientious I, I, I can't.
(44:20):
I did not bring my book.
I'm reading it off my computer,sorry, yeah that I did that
this year.
Speaker 2 (44:27):
Well, I was a treasurer when he came in there.
Yeah, we both did that together.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
That's right, yeah, and he interesting.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
It's a very thorough look that they do.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
Yeah, it is, it is and it's.
It should be it should not be.
You shouldn't be afraid, evenif you've got work to do inside
your lodge as far as your recordkeeping goes, you should
welcome it.
I, I know I certainly did,because I know that as the
treasure, I just becametreasurer in June, late June,
(44:55):
july maybe and there's a lot ofwork to do in there and and the
secretary and I have been beenworking through it, you know,
little by little, as as we can.
We were not, I'll be honestwith everybody.
We were not as prepared as Iwould have liked to have been.
There's no discrepancies or orany anything, you know, negative
like that going on.
(45:16):
But I think we could have donea better job with regard to
keeping things in order.
And you know, for me, I'm aproject manager.
I've been a project manager fora long, long time, so for me, a
ready information is everythingto me.
So if I walk into an office andI ask somebody who works under
me for information that they'resupposed to have, if they don't
(45:40):
have it, that raises a major redflag to me.
So when the when the districtdeputy grandmaster comes in and
is asking for ready informationand I don't have it, I don't
like that.
That ain't that, ain't the wayit's supposed to be.
We're supposed to have thatinformation should be a click
away.
You know that that whateverthey're asking for and that is
(46:00):
our goal that our lodge 147 willhave that under control.
Our lodge is a little unique inthat we have a lot of money so,
and it's a big lodge, it'sdowntown Sarasota, the property
is extremely valuable and We'vegot a lot of members of pretty
large membership, so it's not aseasy as a lot of the.
(46:22):
I asked one treasurer he's beentreasurer forever and ever of
another lodge if he could, youknow, if I could hang out with
him and ask him a Few questions.
He said don't bother, bro, ittakes me two minutes to do to do
our treasury work because wedon't have any money.
Oh yeah, and it's true, with alot of lodges they it's not high
finance, there's not a lotgoing on there, but in our lodge
(46:42):
that's not the case.
It's actually, yeah, there's alot going on, a lot, a lot
coming and going, and you'regonna have a lot more.
Speaker 2 (46:48):
We did some big stuff this year we did we did.
We signed a contract that weare and we have entered into, to
sell our parking lot in the airrights above our building.
Speaker 1 (46:58):
Yeah, a.
Significant some of money verysignificant and that's going to
change things even more.
So I'm trying to get us ready.
It's probably that had probablyhappened in a year from now,
maybe a year and a half from now.
I'm trying to get everythingready to receive said funding
and then, and then hopefully,turn it over to a competent
Person to take over as treasurerand I hope you're in for life.
(47:21):
I'm not in for life.
Don't listen to that voice.
It is not true.
I will not be secretary forlife or life.
Yeah, no, thank you, I don'tmind it.
I love untangling wires.
That's my thing.
I love big giant balls of wirethat are tangled and gnarled up
and.
I I love to untangle them, butonce I untangle them I'm bored
(47:43):
with it and I want to move on tothe next big bundle of wires.
So, and that is very much thethe way I am, I will of course
stay, because all Mason shouldbe faithful in their position
and if you're needed there, staythere.
Brother, if you're listening,that's for you.
Let's move on.
When making an official visit toa lodge in his district, the
district deputy shall beformally received with grand
(48:05):
honors.
On such occasions, all guestswho are not entitled to grand
honors but whom it is desired tohonor by a special introduction
at the altar, should be Shouldbe received first.
What I want to try that again,on such occasions, all guests
who are not entitled to grandhonors but whom it is desired to
(48:28):
honor by a special introductionat the altar, should be
received first.
Thereafter, the district deputymay prefer to be received alone
, ahead of other others Entitledto grand honors, in order that
he may himself preside at thereception and the rendering of
grand honors to such otherguests, or he may desire to
(48:50):
enter with such otherdistinguished guests, in which
case, it being his officialvisitation, where, in the
absence of the grand master, heis directly exercising his
function as the personalrepresentative of the said grand
master okay, that's becausethere's only one other situation
that you would issue grandhonors to a brother in the state
(49:11):
of Florida, and that's when hereceives his 50 year award.
Speaker 2 (49:14):
Oh right, so they're saying imagine that you had a 50
year presentation.
They don't want that to likekill his juju.
Oh gotcha bring him in, do hispresentation, then bring in the
grand master and do his pomp andcircumstance.
Speaker 1 (49:26):
Gotcha, gotcha.
Okay, so that that makes sense,and and I know that he comes in
with his counsel behind him,right?
Speaker 2 (49:34):
Yes, his committee, committee, committee men,
committee men come in with him.
He leads the whole group in.
Yep, he's the first one sat inthe east, correct?
And then the committee men areintroduced in sat as well, right
?
Speaker 1 (49:48):
Yeah, it's, it's actually, it's a, it's.
It's pretty cool.
I like it.
I like that stuff.
That's why because I'm kind ofweird.
Speaker 2 (49:54):
I guess.
Speaker 1 (49:55):
Yeah, the ritual of it is good, especially when it's
done correctly.
The last time we did it it wentpretty well, man, actually it
was, it was real good.
I know our, our instructor, ourdistrict instructor, was there
with his notepad out.
Yes making, making notes as wewere doing it, and never came
back to us with any corrections.
So that was pretty encouraging,you know, I think well.
Speaker 2 (50:16):
This year, I think, is the first year they've asked
a district deputy to grade eachofficer Individually on how he
performs during the ritualopening and closing, and I was
told that we did very well, sothat's encouraging.
I hope he doesn't say that toeverybody.
Yeah right but I felt like wedid really well.
Speaker 1 (50:35):
It went, it went, it went real smooth.
There was no was anaccidentally practiced.
We practiced it and there wasnone of those cringy moments.
No, you know where things arelike.
Oh, that didn't go well, youknow there's none of that.
It flowed right through frombeginning to end and it was a
great evening.
It was a really good evening.
All right, next is dress.
Oh, and we've got about.
I don't know, we got about 25minutes less.
(50:56):
Let's try it.
Uh, yes, shall a lodge requireof its officers that they were
formal dress Question mark.
The wisdom of doing so dependsentirely upon circumstances and
is a point which it is theprerogative of each of each
Constituted lodge to decide.
(51:18):
Though much may be said infavor of formal dress, cut away
coat, tuxedo or full eveningdress, since it is a mark of a
respectable, it is a mark of therespect for the fraternity.
Mm-hmm in any event, one thingis certain if any of the
officers are required to wearformal attire, all the officers
(51:40):
should wear it without exception.
And if he and his colleagueswear it, the worshipful master
should use a hat to correspond,not a Soft hat.
Straw hat or a cap Makes sense.
The members will dressaccording to to private taste
and it is proper that they enterthe lodge room with Apron,
(52:03):
properly arranged beforehand andand any other regalia, regalia,
jewels etc.
In do order.
So that's interesting.
It was a little bit of acontroversy last year.
Speaker 2 (52:12):
Yes, dress, it came up.
Speaker 1 (52:13):
That was the big deal , it came up.
Speaker 2 (52:17):
That was the big deal , the Grand Lodge last year was
the big deal.
Speaker 1 (52:20):
Yeah, they were um poor, most worshipful Lambert
he's a great guy, shout out towork to a most worshipful
Lambert.
But but even he, when weinterviewed him, he even said
you know it was it was.
It was something that hethought would be a good idea,
but the craft did not and heaccepted it.
(52:41):
Yeah because he's a true masonand and moved on.
There was no hard feelings,there was nothing like that.
It was discussed and Moved onand his, his thing was just.
I think the overall idea behindit was just the decorum, yeah,
of of the dress.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
We we wear black, black suits with bow tie black
suits, black bow tie, yeah shirtwhite, gloves white gloves.
Speaker 1 (53:06):
So we, we go, we go all out.
I enjoy it.
My wife loves the fact that I Idress that way twice, so twice
Really to go out.
She loves it, yep.
Nice, and we look sharp when wedress like we really do, we
really do, and it just brings anair of Importance to the
evening different when I put thesuit on?
Yeah, absolutely do.
Speaker 2 (53:25):
I do, I feel different.
And then the gloves come on andit's like, all right, I Am,
nothing I touch is all withpurity now.
And you know, you go throughthe ritual opening.
You're like, wow, I'm afreemason right and this is
awesome now I have been to otherlodges in the state of Florida
where I've seen their officerattire is, for example, like
(53:46):
dress shirts but at short sleeve.
I've seen polo shirts yeah, ourlodge shirts.
That that's what the officerswear.
I was just at a lodge and oneof the officers had a like a
sports jersey t-shirt with thelodge logo on it, and that was
the shirt.
Speaker 1 (54:05):
Right.
Speaker 2 (54:05):
Yeah, it's wildly different and Some lodges have
they're just in normal clothesand they don't match.
And when the officers don'tmatch it is kind of off-putting
and it's a little confusing too.
Speaker 1 (54:18):
It is confusing, yeah , absolutely.
Speaker 2 (54:20):
Did the guy just come off the street and fill that
rollers?
He was one of the officers,right.
So it's like I like the idea ofokay it, all of you should
dress the same.
We're not saying how to dress,but you got to wear the same
stuff.
Speaker 1 (54:32):
Yeah, I think I could be mistaken.
Shout out guys if I am, but Ithink wrong, wrong, I think.
Who's the lodge down?
Who's Bob's Lodge down?
South Inglewood?
Inglewood Lodge?
They wear I think they calleach other or they call out the
dress of the evening, becauseit's different.
Sometimes they're suited out tothe max and then sometimes you
(54:55):
come down and they're all intheir lodge shirts and they've
got some cool lodge shirts.
Man, somebody knows whatthey're doing down there because
their lodge stuff is awesome.
But but they they dress thesame, but not always decked out
in suit, you know, jacket andand vest.
So they, they kind of take it,they take it seriously, but
(55:16):
sometimes they don't have todress in the monkey suit.
Sometimes they're just, youknow, dressed, dressed casually,
but they're all the same.
Yeah you know, which I think isgreat.
We should probably try that onetime, one time or two maybe,
maybe next year, maybe the newworshipful master?
I'll do that, I can't do that.
Speaker 2 (55:32):
You listening, I can't.
We got to do black suits.
It's what our tire is, that'sright.
Speaker 1 (55:38):
I'm all about it, man , I'm fine with that.
The custom prevails in somelodges of having the worshipful
master wear one type of dressclothing While the other
officers wear different stylesof dress.
The harmony of good taste wouldbe better served if all dressed
alike.
Hint hint On that one.
This is a philosophy in dress.
(55:58):
There is a philosophy in dressas in so many other things, and
the dress proper and the dressproper to masonic occasion Is no
exception.
Its principle is good taste.
Its practice is to wear suchattire as shows respect to the
brotherhood and express thedignity of masonry.
(56:18):
There it is, there.
That's.
That's the reason for it.
And I hear a lot of people come.
You know, some people come inand they want to wear shorts and
yeah sandals and all this stuff.
Well, I'm just sitting in the.
You know, I'm just on thesidelines sitting, I'll sit in
the back.
It's like.
Well, that's not the point,brother, you know that's not the
point, though.
The point is is that you shoulddress different here than you
do anywhere else.
Speaker 2 (56:39):
Right, and I know people get off work and come to
lodge and so they don't havemuch choice.
But Some people have the choiceand they can, you know.
I it's like tough on this one.
I Travel a lot in the state andI see a lot of different
cultures and in the lodges andI've started trying to adapt my
(56:59):
attire to where I'm going.
So I almost feel like it'sdisrespectful to me to walk into
a lodge who's typically wearinglike jeans and a t-shirt in a
suit.
Speaker 1 (57:10):
It's like, yeah right , I don't want to be that guy.
Speaker 2 (57:12):
So I try to dress more like I think they're gonna
dress, because I want to blendin with my brother right.
Speaker 1 (57:18):
Yeah, that makes sense, that makes, and that's
kind of the point.
But at the end of the day, thatlast statement makes it clear
that you know the philosophyhere is that no matter what you
do, make sure it brings honor Tothe fraternity.
That's, that's what reallymatters here.
As far as our dress goes, Iknow that for me, being in
(57:38):
church for the last 35 years,the dress thing has evolved back
and forth over and over again.
If you go to a church on Sundayand everybody's in suits, it
typically it's typically anolder congregation of people and
the way they dress it meanssomething to them.
(57:59):
I came up in a time where thedress code was kind of frowned
upon and everybody was wearingshorts and t-shirts and the way
you dress doesn't matter and allthis stuff, and in my opinion
it did kind of cheapen thedignity of it a little bit.
So there is something to besaid about dressing.
(58:21):
Dressing in a way that youdon't normally dress, I guess is
the point.
If you're an executive in amulti-billion dollar corporation
, you wear expensive suits everyday.
I mean.
So for you it's no big deal,but for those of us shlubs down
here, putting on a suit, puttingon a certain type of clothes,
(58:43):
does honor the occasion, and Iguess that's the point.
I'm beating that one to death,brother.
We have got just a few minutesleft on this particular
broadcast.
So election to office is thenext one.
Emblems and symbols, flagceremony, funerals coming up.
(59:03):
I guess we'll do that on thenext one.
This will be a little bitshorter of a broadcast this week
, only because it is justinsanely busy these days, which
is no excuse.
Chris and I will endeavor tofind a better time slot for us
to do this.
Like we told you from the verybeginning, over a year ago, I
(59:27):
think that we don't actuallyknow what we're doing.
So just so you understand that,I wanna remind you.
Speaker 2 (59:34):
It ain't getting better either.
It ain't getting any better,man.
It is what it is.
We're gonna die not knowingwhat we're doing.
Speaker 1 (59:40):
This is how we do it.
This is probably how we willalways do it.
But listen, if you're listeningright now, if you got anything
out of today, we appreciate youlistening, we appreciate your
support.
We're getting support, like Isaid, from all over the world
and it really means a lot.
Chris and I want our fraternityto survive.
(01:00:01):
We want our fraternity to makea difference, to do something
great.
There was a time when Masonrywas very prevalent in this
country and it could be that wayagain, bringing all men
together, regardless of theirfaith, their financial
background, their familialstatus, any and all men coming
(01:00:23):
together for the betterment ofthemselves and the community
around them.
What's wrong with that man?
Where are you gonna find that?
You're not gonna find thatanywhere.
Speaker 2 (01:00:31):
No.
Speaker 1 (01:00:33):
And are you gonna find it in Masonry is the
question that we're asking andthe question that we're gonna be
asking.
And as young men come intoMasonry, the old guard is
looking at them, I think, in thewrong way.
It's not your fraternity, it'sour fraternity and it belongs to
(01:00:55):
the young men.
The young men coming in, teachthem well, teach them what
Masonry is and hand the reinsover to them and support them.
That's the only way it survives.
Otherwise, it goes the way of Idon't know name, an
organization that's no longeryou know.
Speaker 2 (01:01:10):
Boy Scouts.
Speaker 1 (01:01:11):
Boy Scouts.
Yeah, there you go.
There's an organization thatforgot what it was and paid the
price for it, and now it is nomore, so well, almost no more.
Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
But anyway, no, they're still kicking, I think.
Speaker 1 (01:01:23):
I hope, so I hope.
Speaker 2 (01:01:24):
Different than it was , maybe, but yeah absolutely,
they're still doing fine.
I think they have girls now.
That's what I was told.
I thought that was Girl Scoutsno no, they have girls that are
Boy Scouts now.
Speaker 1 (01:01:36):
Girls that are Boy Scouts.
It's changed a lot.
Yeah, see, that's what I'mtalking about.
Speaker 2 (01:01:40):
But you know it's like I get it.
I get it.
I've been bleeding in my lodgefor years Sweat, tears, blood,
everything and I've justfinished a year of having
leadership after all, this timeof the direction of the lodge,
and now it's time to go away andbe quiet, and that's hard to do
(01:02:01):
.
Speaker 1 (01:02:02):
I get it, I get it.
Speaker 2 (01:02:03):
I understand you brothers, and past masters and
past grandmasters and pastdistrict deputies.
You gave so much to thefraternity.
You gave life time, everythingwhat's more important than your
time, and you gave a lot of itto this fraternity and so you
love it and you don't wanna seeit degraded.
But change isn't always bad.
We can't look at all change isbad and we should try new ideas.
(01:02:26):
And if they fail, they fail, butif they help, then it's your
fraternity that's being helpedtoo.
So let them have theiropportunity.
You're there to try to guidethem and say we tried that,
here's what happened when we didit.
Has anything changed that?
Maybe it would work now?
We did that in our lodge theywere talking about doing
spaghetti dinners or somethingand we tried that didn't make
(01:02:48):
any money, and then it came out.
Yeah, but when you did it, lookat the situation, it's a little
different now.
So, situations do change throughtime.
Just cause something didn'twork in the past doesn't mean it
won't work now, but they needyour feedback.
Speaker 1 (01:03:02):
Yeah, that's right.
They need your engagement, theyneed your wisdom and guidance.
That's right.
The only way an organizationcan survive into the future is
to bring young people into it,train them in the ways of the
fraternity or organization andthen put them in place and leave
them alone.
Let them do what they're gonnado, let them make their mistakes
(01:03:23):
, let them learn and guide themin the ways and precepts of the
organization so that they don'tveer off from it.
But you gotta bring them in,you gotta let them in.
The old guard has got to giveway to that young and new, the
new way.
Speaker 2 (01:03:38):
I mean it's you wanna talk about old guard who gets
it?
Talk about RayWarshall-Ron-Baber.
Speaker 1 (01:03:43):
Yeah, that's right.
Last night.
Speaker 2 (01:03:45):
He's one of the older guard right.
He won competitions.
He was master districtinstructor.
He worked for the district sohard for many years.
He's paid his dues, he's donehis time, he's helped a lot of
people and at this point hestood in front of us last night
and said here's the thing aboutbeing a teacher of leaders
(01:04:06):
You're not teaching them how todo their job.
You're teaching them the systemthat they're working in and
you're encouraging them to bethemselves, because they will
have hesitance, they will bescared, and so you have to
encourage them to be themselves,because good leaders embrace
who they are.
Speaker 1 (01:04:25):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2 (01:04:26):
So you're just teaching them the system they're
working in, the rules theygotta follow.
You're like you don't teachthem how to do the job.
Speaker 1 (01:04:31):
Right.
Speaker 2 (01:04:32):
Just, you can't do this, you can't do that, you
have to do this, you have to dothat.
Now.
Go out there and do a good job.
Speaker 1 (01:04:37):
Right, yeah, this is who we are, this is what we
believe.
Now Go, make it your own.
Speaker 2 (01:04:42):
Give them some room.
Give them some room to fly.
Speaker 1 (01:04:45):
Yeah, man, I love it, I absolutely love it.
Speaker 2 (01:04:48):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:04:50):
Whoa, that was a burp .
Speaker 2 (01:04:51):
Woo, here we go, oh man.
Speaker 1 (01:04:54):
Well, you know, brother, once again I am in awe
of this crazy podcast that youand I started so long ago, based
on an idea and a thought, andit's grown into something that
I'm pretty proud of.
Man, it's quite an experience,it's quite an honor, it's
(01:05:15):
humbling to meet people out ofnowhere who, hey, you're Fred.
From Fred and Chris, I'm like,oh yep, I am.
What did I do wrong?
I'm sorry.
And they're just encouraging usand thankful for everything
that we have, that we've triedto do here.
All of it is for love of thefraternity.
We really do believe thatMasonry does have something to
offer to this hurting countryand all of us together, we can
(01:05:39):
go back to our guidingprinciples and we can make them
our own and move things forwardand maybe make a difference in
this world.
What do you got, chris, on theway out?
Nothing, thank you.
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