Understanding Masonic Etiquette: A Deep Dive into the Brotherhood's Core Principles

Have you ever wondered about the intricacies of Masonic etiquette, and how it builds a sense of respect and courtesy within the fraternity? Join us as we decode the official GL 208 Revised 2010 version of the Masonic etiquette booklet, shedding light on the appropriate usage of Masonic tools, and highlighting the exemplary mentoring work of our brother, Wade Botkin. We delve into the core of Masonic principles, emphasizing the need to protect the honor of the fraternity, and reminding ourselves to always think before we speak. 

We also underscore the fraternity's commitment to taking care of our elderly members, discussing ideas like a Patriarch's Night or providing transportation to those unable to attend lodge. We talk about the importance of visiting our aged and infirm brothers, remembering them on special occasions, and gifting appropriately. Journey with us as we talk about the importance of revering the Masonic ritual, the precedence of the altar over the east, and delve into the significance of the ballot box and the master's responsibility to uphold the integrity of the fraternity.

Amidst all these enlightening discussions, we also confront some sensitive issues, including racism within the fraternity. We firmly believe that active racists have no place in Masonry and broach the controversial issue of a blackball being thrown due to a brother's race. We leave no stone unturned as we explore the master's power to overturn it if they suspect racism, and stress the importance of taking action against any discrimination based on race or religion. As we conclude our engaging conversation, we remind ourselves of the core tenants of Masonic fraternity: Education, Brotherly Love and Affection, Relief to the Community and Fellow Mason, and Truth. Tune in for an enlightening journey through the world of Masonic etiquette and customs.

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• Fred
• Chris

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hey, chris, yeah Fred .

Speaker 2 (00:07):
What's a Mason?

Speaker 1 (00:09):
That's a really good question, fred.

Speaker 2 (00:15):
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(00:35):
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It's not that the system's complicated, it's that
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Well, you're the master of this technology.
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There's knobs and twisty things.
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It's supposed to be, because there's lots of room for
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Speaker 1 (01:17):
Yes, Woo Alright, so up front it's gonna say it right
now we are pressed for time,we'll do an hour long episode
Monitoring the clock.
We cannot banter on.
Okay, we'll have a banterlessshow.
No, not banterless.
Come on now.

Speaker 2 (01:37):
And a crowd of cheers Yay, Finally.
So this week we're gonna jumpinto Masonic etiquette and I
know what?

Speaker 1 (01:44):
everybody out there is just clapping high-fiving and
hooting and hollering right nowit's not boring.

Speaker 2 (01:51):
This is good stuff.
It really is good stuff.
I perused the yellow copy.
This is the official GL 208revised 2010 version of the
Masonic etiquette the lodgesystem for Masonic education
booklet.
And it's actually, if you,there's a ton of stuff in here
we all should know.

(02:11):
There's a ton of stuff in herewe all don't know because I can
tell when you're in the lodge.
You can totally tell Folksdon't know this stuff.

Speaker 1 (02:21):
There's a, and a lot of the stuff we take as law we
assume is in the digest is inthis book.

Speaker 2 (02:28):
Yeah, that's right, that is correct.

Speaker 1 (02:30):
So that's an interesting.
I guess we talk about adoptedcustoms.
So these are it must be adoptedcustoms.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
These are our adopted customs.
That's right.

Speaker 1 (02:41):
Forever memorialized in the.
Very easy read of the Masonicdigest.

Speaker 2 (02:46):
Well, I would.
Yeah right, oh, yeah right.
There's a lot here and it'sbroken out in the same format.
So there's subheads throughouthere and a bunch of them like
aged and infirmed.
So it talks about thatAddressing the chair, altar
balloting, bible presentation.

(03:06):
It just goes on election tooffice.
It's all here how you'resupposed to behave, what you are
supposed to do, what you arenot supposed to do.
So I think it's certainly worthteaching.
I think that in mentorship it'staught.
I know, shout out to WadeBotkin when he does mentorship
he pulls this out and he goesthrough it with the fellas.

Speaker 1 (03:28):
Awesome.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
So I think that's awesome yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:30):
Yes, they're doing a great job this year.

Speaker 2 (03:33):
Yeah, he is.
We got to get him on.
We got to get him on Wade.
Where are you?

Speaker 1 (03:38):
He's doing some of his Southern draw.
He's doing a Southern, that'sright.

Speaker 2 (03:42):
That's right, ladies.
He is a single man, he's asuitor, he's a suitor.

Speaker 1 (03:50):
Well, where do we start with the Masonic etiquette
?

Speaker 2 (03:53):
I thought I'd read the first paragraph of the
forward.
I thought it was pretty good,so let me read that.

Speaker 1 (04:00):
Read the forward, backward and I'll be impressed.
I'll read the forward.
No, I won't Okay.

Speaker 2 (04:04):
So here's the forward .
It's found on page.
Well, it's found on the secondpage without any mark on it.
Freemasonry solicits no man tojoin it.
It permits no man to makeinnovations in its body of
principles and landmarks.
Its candidates come of theirown free will and because they

(04:24):
have heard good reports of itsreputation and formed a
favorable opinion of its work.
And by all means, throughoutits entire system and through
all its bodies and degrees,whatever by tradition, landmarks
, usage, custom, law, rule, ed,edict, regulation and
constitution, it is in every waysecured that a Mason shall

(04:48):
stand to it in an attitude ofreverence and respect.
Now that reverence and respect,etiquette is one of its forms.
In principle, masonic etiquettebelongs to the empire of good
manners.
That code by which gentlementhe world over govern their
conduct, by this principle withus in f, by this principle with

(05:12):
us, is found to apply in twodirections.
On the one hand it becomes amanifested respect for the craft
as a whole, on the other handit is a form of courtesy to the
individual.
So that second paragraph thereis kind of the Masonic etiquette

(05:34):
mission statement there.
That's kind of the definitionof Masonic etiquette right there
, the second paragraph on theforward.
So if you got your yellow bookand you're following along and
I'm sure you are I would readthat a couple of times and kind
of go through that andunderstand what it says.
In principle, masonic etiquettebelongs to the empire of good

(05:58):
manners.
We don't like that word.
Here in America we ain't got nomanners.

Speaker 1 (06:02):
I need no manners.
The empire of good manners,that sounds impressive.

Speaker 2 (06:06):
I love that the code by which gentlemen the world
over govern their conduct bythis principle with us is found
to apply in two directions.
On the one hand, it becomes amanifest respect for the craft
as a whole.
On the other hand, it is a formof courtesy to the individual.

Speaker 1 (06:26):
I like that.

Speaker 2 (06:26):
It's a form of courtesy to the individual man
is there anything lately goingon about courtesy towards your
fellow brother that we couldprobably expound on?
Yes, I'm sure there is.

Speaker 1 (06:38):
Yeah, and we have a lot of brothers in our
fraternity, so we're all indifferent stages of becoming
better.

Speaker 2 (06:44):
men, that's right.
I like it.

Speaker 1 (06:46):
There's lots of opportunity to improve ourselves
and be more courteous To theindividuals around us.

Speaker 2 (06:52):
Yeah, that's right and to always, always, always
think about.
You know, and it's kind of inthe, in that forward right there
always think about the, thereputation of the craft and the
reputation of yourself and yourbrother.
You know, if you're out therejust running your mouth, think
before you speak, man, becauseyou're, you're bringing

(07:14):
disrepute to yourself, possibly,and and and to the, to the
craft, which is not a good thing, you know you know, when you do
it publicly Against anotherbrother, what is the
inner-deprentice?

Speaker 1 (07:28):
Harge tell us.
We just talked about that.
Yeah, that the most importantthing is that we maintain the
honor of the fraternity, right?
That's how it ends.
It's like you know, so that wecan always make sure that,
whatever we do, don't bringsomebody in if they're not going
to follow our rules and youneed to follow our rules so that
the fraternity is a whole,maintains its integrity to the

(07:50):
public.
That's Prime.
So if you go out in the publicand don't act masonic, you're
hurting the whole fraternity.

Speaker 2 (07:58):
Yeah, that's right.
Not just yourself and, andspeaking of hurting yourself, I
was, I was just reminded of, Iknew this, this couple.
There were friends of ours andthe wife Would constantly run
her husband down, you know whenhe wasn't around.
Yeah, I've heard it both waysand and really sad, well, and

(08:18):
and what popped into my mindwhile she was going on one day
about it Was the first thing Ithought it was well, will you
married him, you know?
And and the point the point isis that what?
By talking bad about yourhusband, you're really
reflecting bad on yourself,because you're the one Okay, so
he's a slob and he doesn't takepick up after himself but you're

(08:40):
the one with really badjudgment.

Speaker 1 (08:43):
You married him.
He's a good salesman, you know.
That could be the case, I guess.

Speaker 2 (08:48):
I guess, sell themselves real good but I think
that this discerning people,masons and or men in general,
we'll see One person runningdown another person who's not
actually in the room and we'llsee the person for what they are
.
There a gossip.
Yeah, that's a warning sign,it's a warning sign right there
and their reputation at thatpoint is shot and would need to

(09:11):
be rebuilt.
If they were to change theirways and seek the forgiveness of
of their brothers and try toTry to repair their reputation.
You know, sometimes if you keepit up, your reputation will be
so bad You'd have to I don'tknow leave the dang state.
I don't know what the heckyou'd have to do.

Speaker 1 (09:27):
It'd be awful, I don't know next date Closest you
can go to.

Speaker 2 (09:30):
I think it's North Carolina.
Is it maybe Georgia?
No, no, not Georgia.
Mississippi, I think it's.

Speaker 1 (09:37):
Mississippi.

Speaker 2 (09:38):
That's the key Don't leave, don't let your reputation
get so bad that you got toleave your home and area.
Yeah, that's repair the damageor don't do the damage in the
first place.
Okay, the second, secondheading here in this wonderful
book is aged and infirmed.
Members of a lodge who, becauseof age or infirmity, find it

(09:59):
either difficult or impossibleto attend at the assembly, at
the assemblies of their brethren, stand in need of special
consideration at the hand oftheir lodge and, because of
their condition, no other are.
No others are so particularlyappreciative of the kindness and
courtesies that may be shownthem.
A lodge will maintain itscontacts with them Unbroken.

(10:23):
Mm-hmm, is this thing on?
A lodge will maintain itscontacts with them unbroken.
We'll see that they are visited.
I think this thing's broken, isit on?
Can any of you guys?

Speaker 1 (10:35):
hear me, yeah, no, definitely Is it all.

Speaker 2 (10:37):
We will see that they are visited, will send them
messages on special occasionsand perhaps encourage its
members To remember them now andagain with appropriate gifts
and other Reminders.
Some, for some reason, I hadthat one highlighted.
Some lodges follow an admirablecustom of setting aside, once
each year, a patriarch's nightin honor of its aged members.

(11:00):
Others make it a practice atcertain intervals to send a
vehicle for such as ourphysically unable to attend
lodge but have, our physicallyable to attend lodge but have no
means of transportation.

Speaker 1 (11:15):
I know that we have done that a couple of times this
year, but not nearly enough.
We don't have a set program weprobably need to talk to.
Well, we just need to bring itup in lodge, make it happen.
A whole committee who doesnothing but Volunteered to
transport people that need ridesto lodge, that can't drive

(11:36):
themselves anymore.

Speaker 2 (11:37):
Which will necessitate somebody taking that
list yes of active members andstart making phone calls now.
I have volunteered twice to doso.
I have yet to see the listworking on that, though We'll
get there.

Speaker 1 (11:47):
I do have the list.
You have the list send me thelist.

Speaker 2 (11:50):
We can do that.
I will start making calls.
I'll make three or four calls aday.
Committee yeah, man Just calland say hi, that's it.
That's what it says right here.
Unbroken, yeah, unbroken.
A lodge will maintain itscontact with them Unbroken it's
giving some good advice ofpatriarchs night.
I never thought about right,yeah, but and that seems like
it's annual an annual patriarchnight.

Speaker 1 (12:13):
Yeah, that's a great idea.
Right to have honor yourelderly members.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
Yeah, a lot I.
I can only imagine we have 328,300 somewhere around something
like that 330 active members.
But you know, on a busy nightwe'll have, you know we'll have
a dozen, 30 to 30 People inlodge and I know if you're
percent of our members.
Yeah, 10% of our members on agood night, and I know a lot of

(12:39):
lodges are shaking their head.
Yes, right now, and we allthey're agreeing with us because
it just happens out there.
But if you have, if you've gota list of Members that are out
there that are paying theirannual dues but you never hear
or see them, it's time to getthat list out.

Speaker 1 (12:54):
It's time to get a couple brothers together and
it's time to sign megasm owncalls baby, but is this also
telling us to be careful aboutinitiating olderly or infirm
brothers?
I Think it starts with acaution to be careful not to
initiate people that might beOverly aged or infirmed.
Is that is?

Speaker 2 (13:14):
that what I see what you're saying.

Speaker 1 (13:15):
Before they become made, yeah, they come to us at
85 years old and they can't it'slike saying, maybe think twice
about that, because it's gonnabe a big deal for us.
We're gonna, we're not gonnalet them go, we're gonna be our
responsibility.
And you know, I think thefraternity is a whole probably
wanted to get a couple decadesof work out of the person before
they became the let's call itthe legacy.

Speaker 2 (13:39):
Yeah, right, right.
Yeah, that's a tough call, man.
Yeah, I think you that wouldhave to be done on an individual
basis.
You know in the interviewprocess that we have.
You know, the vetting processthat we have would yield that
information right.

Speaker 1 (13:52):
And if you think about it, it's also in our
master Mason obligation, correct.
It specifically talks about whoyou should probably not let in
and and this is a topic thatalso arises in that area of the
chart of the Obligation.
So I guess they've thought thisone through and thought, hmm,
think twice about this, althoughit doesn't say you can't.

Speaker 2 (14:11):
No, you can't just cautions you right about the the
burden it's gonna place on thelarge, it allows me right, it
allows the lodge to use theirjudgment and, yeah, to use their
judgment correctly, and itwon't be a good fit for somebody
who's so terribly infirm.

Speaker 1 (14:28):
That they.

Speaker 2 (14:28):
You know that they're walking around right.

Speaker 1 (14:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (14:31):
Yeah, their time has passed, which is sad, but it's
yeah it's just true.
We're men, we have to make harddecisions sometimes.
Altar is the next one Ourcustoms and traditions.
Hey, we have one of those wehave one of those and we're
about to have a really really,really nice one.

Speaker 1 (14:45):
Right, honorable Justin.
Yes, sir, we have lookingforward to that we're looking
forward to that.

Speaker 2 (14:50):
What we're gonna have to do some kind of on location
Video.
When that thing shows up, it'sgonna be beautiful.
So what, fred's?

Speaker 1 (14:57):
talking about?
Is we, our lodge, voted to haveour district instructor Build
us new worn in master pedestalsand altar.
Yes, custom designed for us, sowe're really looking forward to
that.

Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah, and the lights too oh yeah, the lesser light.
So it's.
It's gonna be beautiful.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
I can't wait to see our rods in our lodge, which are
hand crafted, beautiful.

Speaker 2 (15:20):
Yeah, they're beautiful, yeah, so tell us
about the altar.
Sorry, alter up to our customsand traditions.
Prohibit any brother frompassing between the altar and
the worst full master whilelodges open?

Speaker 1 (15:33):
How many times have you seen people lose their mind
when that happens?

Speaker 2 (15:36):
I see when, as soon as they turn to walk towards it,
five guys in the in the in theaudience are like I've actually
seen people look away likesomeone's gonna incinerate, like
I can't look.
It's a beam.
It's a beam, it's dangerous.
Heard about this.

Speaker 1 (15:54):
But no, I don't think you incinerate.
You just kind of break theMasonic rules of etiquette in
front of everybody.

Speaker 2 (16:00):
Yeah, so don't do it.
Don't do it.
It's part of our tradition.
You don't, you don't break thebeam between the two.
Absolutely part of ourtradition.
Don't do it.
Remember it.
Remember your floorwork, knowyour floorwork.
They're at no time, if you'refollowing your floorwork, will
you ever cross between the two.
It won't happen.
From ancient time, the, thePrecinct, the Precinct, the

(16:27):
precedent between the altar andit's precedent from ancient
times, the precedent between thealtar and the east, has been
deemed sacred ground not to betrodden underfoot.
There should be no obstaclesbetween the east and the three
great lights, and since thegreat lights and the charter of
the lodge are the particularresponsibility of the worship of

(16:49):
the master, no brother shouldever obscure his view from them.
The fact that during theexemplification of the work,
candidates are sometimes placedthere does not mitigate against
the interpretation, but rathersupports it.
For if the ground between thealtar and east is otherwise held

(17:10):
sacred, the fact will make allthe more impressive those
initiation ceremonies whichrequire that the candidate be
placed there.

Speaker 1 (17:19):
Yeah, I guess later in life thinking, hey, I stood
there once.

Speaker 2 (17:23):
Right Cool, I remember that.

Speaker 1 (17:25):
Yeah, we did.
We do break the rules and Iknow when I was learning the
ritual work, it was a big topicof conversation Like why?
Why is it so important then?
But it's not now and no oneever gave us a good answer.
But there it is in theetiquette book.

Speaker 2 (17:39):
There it is in the etiquette book hey it's actually
a cool thing.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:43):
Because we're not in a stated meeting, we're
exemplifying a degree, and sowhen we place our new brothers
there later on, they'll lookback and think to themselves huh
, I was, wow, I must have beenreally important because they
put me in that place.
That, apparently, is off limits.

Speaker 2 (18:00):
Right, right, that's true.
The ballot box should neverrest upon the Bible, did we?

Speaker 1 (18:05):
switch to the ballot box.
No, no, it's still.
This is still the altar.

Speaker 2 (18:08):
Still talking about the altar, the ballot box should
never rest upon the Bible butby its side or on a little stand
at the altar.
The altar must not be coveredor decorated by the national or
any other flag.
Any embroidery sign or anyother indications of any
individual or any organizationother than the lodge itself or

(18:29):
grand lodge is strictly forbid-in.
So yeah.

Speaker 1 (18:33):
I see people following that generally.
I don't think I've ever seenbeen in a lodge where there was
something that wasn't supposedto be there, that that was there
.

Speaker 2 (18:42):
That's one we seem to be good at keeping, yeah, yeah.
And then, of course, there is aritual for draping it in black.

Speaker 1 (18:49):
Yes, and putting it there and removing it.
So when someone important tothe fraternity passes away, we
do drape our altar in a blackmaterial for a certain period of
time in memoriam of the person.
That's right.
When members of our lodge passaway, the altar is reserved for

(19:10):
grand lodge people.
But when a member of the lodgepasses away, we drape a small
piece of black over our owncharter Right.
Right, and that's how weremember our lodge members or
everyone knows that someone'spassed away in the lodge when
they come in and see that.

Speaker 2 (19:26):
Yes, anti-room etiquette, anti-room Subhead
Tyler to it's very star trek,isn't it?

Speaker 1 (19:33):
Isn't it, though, the anti-matter room Be mean to the
anti-room?

Speaker 2 (19:36):
It's the anti-matter room.
When you go in there you don'tcome back out.
Tyler to enforce.
As soon as a brother enters aMasonic hall to attend a
communication, he comes underthe sway of Masonic etiquette.
If he is late he should notindulge in loud talking that may
be heard in the lodge, and hisdemeanor toward other brethren

(20:00):
he may meet there should becourteous and respectful.
There, no more than elsewheredoes Masonry give any man
license to take personalliberties with another.
This is especially true if anycandidates are present waiting.
Their call to the preparationroom to give them the impression

(20:21):
that vulgar conduct, levity,practical joking or other forms
of disrespect are arecountenanced by the craft is a
misrepresentation of the lodgeand particularly a discurricy to
the Worshipful Master whostands to all candidates among
his many other functions as ahost in the name of the lodge.

(20:45):
I find, for some reason I thinkthat as candidates are getting
ready they're nervous and acoping mechanism for stress is
humor and joking and stuff.
So it's really important thatyou try to keep that to a
minimum.
This says none at all.

(21:05):
It should be quiet it should berespectful, but it kind of lends
itself to really freaking themout.

Speaker 1 (21:12):
man you got to think, I guess, about the long term in
this case.
When I was initiated, there wasa lot of joking and horse play
going on.
They were laughing their buttsoff at jokes I didn't even get.
I already felt excluded beforeI was even initiated.
Oh right, yeah, I felt wow,this is not cool.
I don't know if they'relaughing at me.

(21:33):
I don't know if they'relaughing at something that's
going to happen to me.
It was really not a greatexperience, to be honest, but
they were probably having agreat time.
They were like oh, this is our18th degree this year.
We're going to have a good oldtime, so it's like you got to
have a long term thinking.
It's not about you.
That night is not about you andyou shouldn't be trying to make

(21:54):
yourself have an enjoyableevening.
All of us should be aboutmaking them have an evening that
impresses on them theawesomeness of the fraternity
they join.
And they don't know anything.
So the jokes we're laughing at,they don't get.

Speaker 2 (22:09):
So I get what they're seeing here.

Speaker 1 (22:13):
First of all, give them the impression that that's
how we behave normally, thatwe're just going to put whoopee
cushions under each other'schairs and laugh at each other.
We're not silly, we're seriouspeople here doing serious work,
and you want to impress uponsomebody, make them a little
uncomfortable Be serious aboutit.
I've changed my thinking onthat and it can be done like you

(22:37):
can communicate with people andkind of set them at ease and
not have to resort to jokes andsilliness, right.

Speaker 2 (22:44):
Yeah, that's what I do.
That only because when I was anEA, going into the room the
Tyler was Dan Tibbets, danTibbets, and what he did was he
didn't allow any joking orvulgarity and stuff which was

(23:05):
guys were there trying to startthat.
He didn't allow it.
But what he did do is he saidyou know, hey, listen, just go
with it, just enjoy yourself.
You're only going to do thisdegree one time for yourself, so
just go with it, listen to whatis said.
Listen to what is said, relaxand just go with it and enjoy

(23:28):
yourself.
And those were good words forme.

Speaker 1 (23:30):
That's this that was really helpful.
That's what I tell people.
Yeah, every degree.
Hey, you are going to besomewhat limited in some of your
senses.

Speaker 2 (23:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (23:39):
But don't feel pressured, because no one, it's
not like your show.
You don't really have to domuch.
We're going to tell you what todo, we're going to take you
where you need to go, so justsit back and enjoy the
experience, like be present withthe senses you have as much as
you can.
That's about the best adviceyou can give somebody in that
situation, that's right.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
The Tyler has it especially in charge to see that
the anti room, his ownparticular quarters, observed
the same decorum as all otherprecents in the temple.
And while the principal purposeof his sword is to be a symbol
of his duty to keep out cowansand eavesdroppers, it is

(24:17):
scarcely a lesser meaning ofthat that he hold authority to
maintain order at the doors andto see that the portals are not
profane by disrespect.
Moreover, the Tyler, if herightly understands his own art,
will see that the anti room iskept clean and in order, the
aprons neatly piled, books,newspapers and litter not left

(24:39):
scattered about, and a fittingplace, in short, through which
it may make entrance into aMasonic lodge.
No person is to be admittedinto a Masonic lodge unless by
permission of the WorshuffleMaster.
When a would-be visitor appears, it is the duty of the Tyler to
notify the Worshuffle Master ofthe presence of the visitor.

(25:01):
The Worshuffle Master mayappoint a committee to examine
the visitor and report to theWorshuffle Master concerning the
visitor's qualifications.
If his documents are in orderand if he is convinced the
examination committee that he isa Mason, then in all
probability the WorshuffleMaster will grant him permission
to enter.

Speaker 1 (25:22):
Yeah, in all probability he will.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
He will, but you know that's a pretty loose rule.

Speaker 1 (25:27):
sometimes it is loose rules and I think the Grand
Lodge based on my personalexperience, the Grand Lodge of
Florida tends to err on the sideof caution and not trust
people's words.
From what I've seen, whereas Ithink as a master of a lodge,
you probably think differently.
You probably tend to err on theside of the brother because you

(25:49):
don't want to offend a visitingbrother to your lodge.
As the master, you want him togo away and be like ah, that
jerk, I knew everything, Ipassed all the tests, but I
didn't have that card, Icouldn't verify it, it will not
be in.
So it is a tough call to makeand that's why we have this
process where we have theTyler's Oath, where you know if

(26:09):
it's a Mason and they're goingto make an oath that they are
good standing, we should you nottrust them?
It's a tough question, but thebiggest part of this was about
the Tyler and what I findinteresting is that he's in
charge of the anti-room.

Speaker 2 (26:26):
I didn't know that.
Yeah, no, dan took it realseriously.
That was his room man, yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:30):
I mean, you gotta fly the plane.
That's what I tell people atwork you gotta fly the plane.
They're expecting the pilot tofly the plane.
So, before the lodge opens,tyler's really flying the plane,
right?

Speaker 2 (26:42):
yeah, he's in charge.

Speaker 1 (26:43):
He's the man that you need to check in with.
He's the man that can tell younot to come in, or at least slow
you down.
And he's in charge of thecandidates before they become
initiated, in the very room thatwe prepare them in is his
responsibility.
That's a lot more than mostpeople probably realize that
Tyler's responsible for.

Speaker 2 (27:01):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (27:02):
They think he just hangs out there and reads books
during the meetings.
But no, he has a lot of work todo, a lot of responsibility to
protect the lodge.

Speaker 2 (27:11):
Right, yeah.

Speaker 1 (27:13):
And protect the master.
He's kind of like a guard forthe master, making sure he keeps
him out of trouble.

Speaker 2 (27:18):
Yeah, and to you know that I think it says right here
the next paragraph, I think, isif a brother is late, he does
not enter the lodge untilpermission is obtained by the
master through the Tyler and thejunior deacon for him to do so.
This happens a lot.
I see this a lot.
People will just open the door.
I've seen that more than once.

(27:39):
You know, and I'm thinkingwhere's the Tyler In the middle
of a meeting.

Speaker 1 (27:41):
They'll just come in and salute the senior warden and
start high-fiving everybody ontheir way to wherever they're
gonna sit.
You're like, hey, we're havinga meeting over here.
It's like, how'd you get in?

Speaker 2 (27:51):
Who let you in.
And well, the Tyler did and theTyler should have, and I
remember back when Dan was there.
It's like you know you're notcoming in because you know he
has to.

Speaker 1 (28:02):
He'd wait for an appropriate moment to knock.

Speaker 2 (28:05):
That's why we have the people Hello, so he'd know,
and then he'd knock, and then,of course, the junior deacon
would do his thing, open thedoor, and there is a procedure
for that and it's quiteimpressive, actually Done
correctly.
It's quite impressive and youget the impression that those
guys really do care about this.
This matters to them, becausethey go through all of this, all

(28:28):
of this stuff.
You know that we do, and if wedon't care I've said this before
if we don't care about it, whyshould anybody else?

Speaker 1 (28:35):
You know, if we, we must care about it.
That's right.
This is what Freemasonry is.
It's a lot about how we behaveand it's counter to common
behavior.
Today in society, we're verycasual with each other, yeah.

Speaker 2 (28:47):
Very casual.

Speaker 1 (28:49):
This is telling us to have a little bit more decorum
than we're used to.

Speaker 2 (28:52):
Right.

Speaker 1 (28:53):
Don't force around, don't use foul language, don't
make like off color jokes.
I bet we're all guilty of that.
Oh, absolutely All of us.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
Absolutely, but it could be.
You know the one place in yourlife that you go to where you
have to take things veryseriously.
You know and show respect anddecorum, like you just said, and
I think that that's.
If you don't have that, I don'tcare who you are, you don't
have that anywhere in your life.
So if you're a Mason and you'renot experiencing it, you know

(29:22):
why not, because you know welive in a world that is just a
little too casual.
So, it's nice to know that atthe lodge there is decorum,
there is a process, there is,you know, manners and etiquette.

Speaker 1 (29:39):
Etiquette- there is etiquette and you have to
practice that etiquette and youshould do it.

Speaker 2 (29:43):
you should do it, well, you should.

Speaker 1 (29:45):
Yeah, and it's like it's difficult to force other
people to do things, but it'snot difficult for you personally
to do things, so just just tryit, just do it.
Yep, and watch what happens.
When I went to an installationa couple years ago, when I was
my master, I was awarded and themaster said I would like each
of you to come with me to aninstallation.

(30:05):
And I thought, oh, this is nice.
And we went to an installationand I said what should I dress?
And he said out of respect forthe fraternity, you were the
best that you've got.
So I did the whole suit, tie,everything, and so did he.
And we went to thisinstallation, which wasn't our
lodge, and the master gettinginstalled had a blinking neon
blue bow tie that he wore to hisown installation.

(30:28):
And they turned to my masterand I said, respecting the.
He said don't worry about him,you are representing our lodge.
You worry about you.
He's right.

Speaker 2 (30:40):
He's right.

Speaker 1 (30:41):
I can't complain or worry about that.
That's his lodge.

Speaker 2 (30:44):
That's his lodge man.
He's set in the precedent, yeah.

Speaker 1 (30:47):
And we need to set ours.

Speaker 2 (30:48):
Yeah, that's right, so you can police it or expect
other people, but you can setthe example.

Speaker 1 (30:53):
That's right.
That's something in yourcontrol.
Try it.

Speaker 2 (30:55):
Before entering, he should see that his apron and
other regalia are alreadyproperly in place.
He should enter through theouter door only and in a manner
to attract as little attentionand to avoid as much confusion
as possible.
Hello, is this thing on?
That's the main thing.
You're late, ok, but we'reletting you in anyways.

(31:16):
Just come in and sit down.
Keep it orderly.
Don't high five.
There's no reason to make afunny comment as to why you're
late.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
It doesn't help, just sit down and be quiet, and
every lodge is different.
I know.
I know Some are a little moreserious than others.

Speaker 2 (31:33):
The worst will master might make a comment at you for
being late.
Glad you could make it, brother.
That would be appropriate.

Speaker 1 (31:42):
To shame him publicly a little bit.

Speaker 2 (31:44):
To publicly shame.
Now, if you have a lodge wherethe worst will.
Master insists that you saluteWest of the altar every time you
come and go, whoever you are,then you're going to get
something for being late.
You're going to have to step upWest of the altar and salute.

Speaker 1 (31:58):
You know, what's funny about that is I said at
the beginning of the year Idon't want anyone doing that.
I want them to come to thealtar and salute me.
I'll stop and we'll do it.
But the thing is, people don'tcare, they're just their habit.
We're group of habit.

Speaker 2 (32:14):
And that's what they're used to.

Speaker 1 (32:16):
So it's hard to change these things from year to
year, because when you've beena mason for 15 years and one
guy's like do it different, it'sdifficult to change that
behavior.
And as the master you can't getthat angry.
We've seen brothers get angrybecause they give a directive
and it's not followed.
But sometimes it's not thatit's not followed out of disdain

(32:36):
or disrespect, it's just out ofhabit for something different,
and so you have to take thatinto account.
When you ask a group of peopleto change their behavior in
minutes that they've accumulatedover decades.
It may not happen quickly, youmight have to repeat it many
times and it might take morethan a year to get them to
change the behavior.

Speaker 2 (32:56):
Yeah, I think in our lodge the key would probably be
to get the senior warden whenthey come in.

Speaker 1 (33:03):
Yeah, don't do it, man, Just point to the altar.

Speaker 2 (33:06):
That's all you got to do.
No, no point to the altar andmake them go up there and after
a while people will get it and Ithink they are less likely to
leave in the first place or belate because of this, which I
think would hold them a littlemore accountable to doing it.

Speaker 1 (33:22):
It's so easy to just stroll out in the middle of a
meeting.

Speaker 2 (33:25):
Oh yes, it's way, like the junior deacon getting
up in the middle of the meetingand walking out during balloting
it's like hold on, Wait, wait,wait, hold on, Wow, wow.

Speaker 1 (33:35):
What Wait?
What just happened?
It can explode.

Speaker 2 (33:38):
If necessary, the inner door should be kept locked
except when Locked.

Speaker 1 (33:42):
That's what it says.

Speaker 2 (33:44):
If necessary.
The inner door should be keptlocked, except when the
preparation room is in use, toprevent brethren entering and
retiring through it, and thisapplies to past masters and
grand lodge officers as well asany other brother.
It is for the use of candidatesonly, and to permit it to be

(34:05):
used otherwise is a disturbanceand dislocation of the entire
system of the ritual.
That's true.
It is the tithers duty to seethat this rule is rigidly
enforced.
So, in other words, no one canuse that door to go in and out
of, and I've seen it.

Speaker 1 (34:22):
Oh, I have too.

Speaker 2 (34:23):
Yeah, that is absolutely crucial.
We all need to know that.

Speaker 1 (34:27):
This is something we need to cover as Masonic
education in our lodge.
I wasn't even aware that thatwas something that was frowned
upon.
I myself have walked throughthat door so many times.

Speaker 2 (34:38):
Right, you're not supposed to use that door and
it's a tithers responsibility tomake sure it's rigidly enforced
.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
We've got to cover that with our tithers.
Yeah, we need to let them knowthis stuff.

Speaker 2 (34:47):
Nobody goes in and out of that room.
Nobody.
It's not a hallway, it is, andit even says grand lodge
officers, past masters, don'tuse the inner door.
It's to be kept locked.
If it continues to happen, thenyou lock it, then you lock it
so nobody can go through it.
All right, wow, next.

Speaker 1 (35:09):
We're learning here.

Speaker 2 (35:10):
We're learning some stuff here.
Aprons it is an emblem ofinnocence.
It should be clean and white incolor.
It is also the badge of a Masonand should be worn with pride
and honor to the fraternity.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
There you go.
That's how we get our newaprons ordered.
We just come in and read it inlines.
Guys, we're supposed to haveclean aprons.
Everybody stand up.
That stain is no good.

Speaker 2 (35:36):
They're disgusting.
Yeah, we definitely need totalk about that.
Somebody said.
Somebody said I can get 100 ofthem.

Speaker 1 (35:43):
Brother Sean Cooney was talking.

Speaker 2 (35:45):
Of cotton made ones, but the price was something like
$1,000.
I was like what?

Speaker 1 (35:51):
Because of the volume .

Speaker 2 (35:52):
I guess I don't know, but we definitely need to do
something.
What was it?
I think it was Englewood Lodgehad paper ones.
I thought they were disposable,so after the meeting I crumpled
it up and threw it out and Igot stares.

Speaker 1 (36:05):
You reuse the paper.

Speaker 2 (36:06):
I apparently get to reuse the paper ones, oh wow.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
Wow, I didn't realize that.

Speaker 2 (36:12):
It was odd.

Speaker 1 (36:13):
Grand Lodge uses paper ones.

Speaker 2 (36:14):
Do they?
I had no idea it was a thing.
Until I went down there I waslike, wow, this is different.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
I guess that saves money.

Speaker 2 (36:21):
I thought it was a sanitary thing that you use it
one time and you throw it out.

Speaker 1 (36:27):
A disrespectful thing .
Like you throw an aprons awayman?

Speaker 2 (36:30):
What are you doing, man?
Get that out of the trash.

Speaker 1 (36:33):
It's like a Kleenex man, I threw it out.
It's gross.
You did that at your lowest$0.15.

Speaker 2 (36:39):
It is an endless Past .
Masters should wear their pastmasters apron, which can be any
design except gold.
Accents should never be used,except for Grand Lodge aprons.
The apron is to be worn underthe coat, unless you are wearing
a double-breasted coat or anovercoat.

Speaker 1 (36:59):
Wow, did you know we have that rule If you wear a
double-breasted coat or anovercoat.

Speaker 2 (37:05):
Double-breasted.

Speaker 1 (37:06):
Or an overcoat like a trench coat oh, a trench coat.
Then you wear it over thetrench coat.

Speaker 2 (37:11):
Yeah, don't wear a trench coat into Lodge.
Ok, Just don't do it.

Speaker 1 (37:15):
I've never seen that Well, we're in the South.
That's why who's wearing trenchcoats now?
Ain't nobody wearing In theSouth.

Speaker 2 (37:22):
You know what it's called in the South right?
Well, what it's called a duster.

Speaker 1 (37:26):
A duster, a duster.
Never heard that before.
That's right.
That's why it's trench.
What is it?

Speaker 2 (37:29):
dusting.
It's a trench coat.
It's called a duster in theSouth.

Speaker 1 (37:32):
Do you know why?

Speaker 2 (37:34):
Probably to keep dust off of you because it's long.
I have no idea Duster, butthey're cool.

Speaker 1 (37:40):
They're all leather and black, especially with a
nice fedora, a fedora, a cigar.

Speaker 2 (37:45):
And a cigar Sounds good.
What time is it Now?
It's 2 o'clock.
The dreaded ballot.
This is the part that everyonegets wrong.
We did.
We were in education, masoniceducation, last night with
Wright Worshipful.

Speaker 1 (38:03):
Wright, honorable Justin.

Speaker 2 (38:04):
Sorry, wright.
Honorable Justin Broom, thankyou, brother, for all your hard
work.
Yes, and we went over this, wewent over balloting and you
realize, and all of us werestanding there and the past
masters had to get into thepositions, and we went through
the ritual and Justin wasguiding us along the way and
showing us what's right andwrong.
And, for goodness sakes, man,we do a lot of stuff wrong.

Speaker 1 (38:27):
Wow, I was shocked.
Shocking.
I don't even, I've never.
It's October and I'm notballoted properly yet.

Speaker 2 (38:34):
Wow, only October.
Huh, I've got the words wrongEvery single time we ballot it.

Speaker 1 (38:39):
That's shocking.

Speaker 2 (38:40):
And that's why we have the education part of the
Master Mason Association meeting.

Speaker 1 (38:46):
Afterwards we have oh , the School of Instruction,
school of Instruction, district,school of.

Speaker 2 (38:51):
Instruction District.
School of Instruction with.

Speaker 1 (38:56):
Worshipful Wright.

Speaker 2 (38:57):
Honorable Justin, I don't know why I can't get right
.

Speaker 1 (38:59):
Honorable Sorry brother Wright, honorable Justin
, I know not all Master MasonAssociations do that.
I've been now traveled a littlebit and I see that they don't.
I think they I don't know whenthey do their School of
Instruction, but think about it.
If you're not, it's really agood time.
You have all of the majorplayers from all the lodges in
your district there, hopefully,hopefully.

(39:19):
And those are the guys that needthe instruction, because they
can bring it back to the lodgeand use it as instruction in
their lodge and everybody needsMasonic education topics to do.
Absolutely so there you go,every month they go, they get
the education, and that's one,if not two, masonic educations
you can do for your own craftabout what you learned there.

Speaker 2 (39:39):
That's right, and you can bring back what you learned
to your lodge.

Speaker 1 (39:42):
Imagine if your lodge was doing Florida work.

Speaker 2 (39:45):
And not lodge work, but Florida work In Florida,
sorry, in Florida, right InFlorida.
Work in Georgia.
If you're in Texas, do Texaswork, yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:53):
Imagine doing your jurisdiction's work instead of
your lodge's customary workRight.

Speaker 2 (39:57):
It matters.
It matters and getting it rightis awesome.
That's what Masonry is about,man.
We want to do it right.

Speaker 1 (40:03):
It's a way to show how much you care about the
fraternity Right that you tookthe time to study something, to
do it right when you were askedto do it.

Speaker 2 (40:10):
Yeah, I think there's just something good about a
group of guys that have decidedthat we're going to take this
and we're going to figure it out, we're going to do it right,
we're going to honor it.
I mean, it's just there'ssomething good and right about
that.
Man, that's just that's whatmakes Masonry what it is.
Our ritual work that we do iswhat binds us together.
It's for us only.

(40:30):
It's not for the rest of theworld.
It's ours, it's ours and it'swhat binds us together and it's
what makes this fraternity sospecial.

Speaker 1 (40:38):
Yep, so many people are amazed when you tell them
you're going to get the sameexperience that George
Washington got.
They get all wide eyed Likewhat, what?
So then do it.
You're telling them that, soget them the same experience
George Washington got, because Ibet they took the time to learn
it back then I bet they did itreal right yeah.

Speaker 2 (40:57):
Well, and the boys across the pond?
Those guys do it right.
I mean, and I've been, I'vetalked to guys from England and
they say that the degree workthat they do is different than
ours.
But one of the things that'sreally a stark contrast is the

(41:17):
seriousness by which they takeit over there.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
We've Americanized it , huh we have absolutely
Americanized it.

Speaker 2 (41:26):
We've carved off the corners where their corners are
straight and sharp and painful.
But if you've ever seen thedocumentary on the History
Channel about masonry and youwatch them do the things that
they do.
Show that they do, man, theyreally do.
It does look like the Queen'sabout to walk in, you know.

(41:48):
I mean those guys are like theyare dressed right.

Speaker 1 (41:50):
They stand correctly, the posture is paid attention
to and, of course, they speaklike they're from England.

Speaker 2 (41:55):
So it's really cool, so cool accent, the cool accent
to do all that stuff with it'syaw heel, they have the cuffs,
which we don't have.

Speaker 1 (42:04):
Which adds a little layer of coolness and more
professionalism and the jewelsare a little bit more ornate.

Speaker 2 (42:11):
Right, and they're all the same.
They're all dressed correct,all their suits White gloves
Everything's the same.
The same gloves, all of it.

Speaker 1 (42:18):
It's really impressive White gloves this
year.
Let me tell you, you look sharpin white gloves.
Yeah, it matters, yep.

Speaker 2 (42:25):
That's right.
You're set apart from everybodyelse in the room.
So when those officers arewearing the white gloves, you
know it sets you apart, it givesyou this prestige man, so I
think it's awesome.

Speaker 1 (42:39):
I love it.
Take it as an extension of myapron, you know if it's a symbol
of purity and factitude ofconduct, and everything I touch
will be pure.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
And you have those really cool leather ones, man,
which is sweet.

Speaker 1 (42:51):
They used to be.
I've been nervous in the Eastall year and I look down and
there's just pen all over mygloves.

Speaker 2 (42:58):
I guess I'm fidgeting , with the pen in my hands,
writing all over my gloves, mywhite gloves.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
Don't look at the palms.
You're going to be like what?
All right balloting.

Speaker 2 (43:07):
Everybody's yelling at the radio right now Balloting
, balloting, Move on, move on.
Good day, what a day in thefast.
Come on Good連.
In five minutes.
Fait toutes穿 deおい.
Oh, hello, Hi for the Lodge.
Wow, the ballot is both sacredand inviolable when it is taken.

(43:29):
Yeah, that's what it says.
That's a typo.
When it is taken, the act isfaithful for the candidate and
monumentous for the Lodge.
It is.
It is adequate for the Lodgeroom to be in complete silence.
Anybody listening?
Complete silence duringballoting.
The officers should remain attheir stations and place in
silence and dignity.
The Grand Lodge Constitutionsmake discussion of the ballot on

(43:56):
conviction, on convict, onconviction thereof, a Masonic
offense.
Wow, no kidding.
Except the Holy Bible, theballot is the most sacred thing
in the Lodge.
Every Mason owes it to hisLodge, the duty of protecting it
against poor material and pooragainst poor material.
And every Mason owes it toevery petitioner a fair ballot,

(44:20):
the only protection a petitionerhas against unfair
discrimination and unreasonableprejudice.
The upright man and Mason, trueto the tradition of the craft,
will never allow personal spiteor prejudice to influence his
behavior at the ballot box.
Ay, yai, yai.

Speaker 1 (44:37):
Wow, there's a lot there.
So this is one of the mostsolemn things that you're going
to do as a Mason Right, and it'sbecause you're affecting the
outcome of another man's lifewhen you ballot.
Yeah, that's right, you know,that's a pretty serious issue
and it says right there that theonly protection that person has

(44:58):
is that you're is an individualgoing to do the right thing?

Speaker 2 (45:02):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (45:02):
That's right.
Wow, that's a lot of faithbeing put into every single
individual.

Speaker 2 (45:08):
Well, and it's a sacred honor, right, it's it,
it's it.
Puts it on us.

Speaker 1 (45:14):
It puts it on us.

Speaker 2 (45:15):
You know to we have you have to be a Mason.
To use the ballot box to grindyour own acts on somebody is so
utterly unmasonic, it's just,it's un.
It's just not right, whetheryou're a Mason or not, it's just
absolutely.
It's absolutely wrong.
Man, on every level.

Speaker 1 (45:32):
You got to learn right from wrong.
When you become a Mason and,and you know, you may know
something about a person that'sbeing ballad and on in the lodge
, but don't you think you owe itto the lodge to share that
information with them, right,instead of just try to take it
out?
Uh, personally.

Speaker 2 (45:49):
Yeah, we've seen it, I do.

Speaker 1 (45:50):
I think you you know there's usually an opportunity
for discussion before it comesto a ballot, and I think that
that's a good time If you havesomething on your mind that's
worrying you about the Masonicreason that you might drop a
black ball to to say it, so thatother members can hear it and
they deserve to know who whothey're ballading on.

Speaker 2 (46:10):
Yeah, that's right, if you've got that really
important information.

Speaker 1 (46:13):
I wish you would share it and, uh, let let the
rest of us here.
But sometimes and I think we'veall seen this somebody got
personally offended by somebodyand then they get an opportunity
to drop a black cube to hurtthem.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (46:32):
And they do it because they want to hurt them.
Yeah, that's not a Masonicreason.

Speaker 2 (46:38):
No.

Speaker 1 (46:38):
You need to when you're standing there alone
before that box.
You really got to checkyourself for a minute.
Um, first of all, it's yourobligation to protect the lodge.

Speaker 2 (46:51):
Right.

Speaker 1 (46:51):
So black balls aren't bad.
They're there for a reason.
They should be used as a toolto protect the lodge.

Speaker 2 (46:56):
Right.

Speaker 1 (46:58):
And it's not a tool for you to exact personal
vengeance that you need to.
If you're doing that, youreally need to go home and look
in the mirror and ask yourselfif you really feel like you
should be in Masonry.

Speaker 2 (47:11):
Yeah right.

Speaker 1 (47:12):
And there's other clubs you can join that don't
have such high moral standards.
Yeah, and such trust in you asa person in faith and rely on
you the way that we do inMasonry rely on each other and
trust each other.
If you're not going to besomeone we can rely on and trust
on, I don't want you next to mebecause I am going to rely on
you and trust you, Right.

Speaker 2 (47:31):
And I have to doubt whether you have my, my, my best
interest at heart, you know,and the thing it it does really
drive home the fact that eachindividual is, you know, it's a
sacred trust, because once youthrow that, you throw a black
ball on somebody and yourmotivations aren't pure.
There's nothing that can bedone.
It's, it's done, it's over.
That vote stands.

(47:51):
And now you have cemented youknow into, you know into Masonic
history, something that wasbased solely on your own ego or
personality and it wasn't fairor right and and it just it, it
just reflects very badly, youknow, on the craft and I know
that, as far as it's probably abit of a controversial topic,

(48:17):
well, not a bit.
The most controversial topic isracism.
Okay, and and when?
When balloting for a brother tocome in who is from a race you
may or may not, you know,approve of, like you have a
right, well, and and you throwyou, blackball them, you know,
for that specific reason, youknow it's.

(48:38):
To me it's pretty obvious whathappens.
You know, if you get a you knowa person from an ethnic group I
don't even know what that meansbut a person from another non
Caucasian not sure, like apredominantly white lodge, that
is, has a brother who happens tobe African American petitioning
them and a blackball shows up.
But his qualifications are ahundred percent good, he's, well

(49:02):
recommended, he's, you knowhe's, he meets all the
qualifications and and there'sthat ball.
If you do that, you know thatthat brother came to the lodge
to be part of the brotherhood,part of the fraternity.
He was told some things aboutit and you, just, you just made
every one of us a liar.
Yeah, you know, you justtotally made every single one of

(49:23):
us a liar because of your ownignorance.

Speaker 1 (49:26):
Yeah, that goes against every tenant and
principal of our fraternity.

Speaker 2 (49:29):
Absolutely does, and I don't even know how it how.

Speaker 1 (49:32):
Okay, so here's the thing we talked about this once.

Speaker 2 (49:35):
Yeah, we did, you guys were loud and clear.

Speaker 1 (49:37):
You don't care about this.

Speaker 2 (49:39):
It's true, majority, we did it.

Speaker 1 (49:41):
Listeners did not want to hear about this issue.

Speaker 2 (49:44):
We did a whole issue on racism and masonry and no one
listened.
It was our least watched showLeast listened to show.
No one cares.

Speaker 1 (49:52):
So we get it.
It's not a popular thing totalk about, but those are the
things we like to talk about.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
Yeah, but and I think Chris and I have both made it
very clear where we stand on it,if you are, uh stand with
masonry we stand with masonry.
If you're in masonry and youare an active racist, you don't
belong there, man, and we willfind you out.
But be sure of this, your sinswill find you out.
It will become obvious to allthose around.
Eventually, and hopefullythere's enough brothers within

(50:19):
the lodge who will take action.

Speaker 1 (50:22):
Hopefully you know they.
It's gotten to the point wherethe Grand Lodge has taken steps
to provide powers and systems toprotect those members who might
be innocent and beingpersecuted by Masons not acting
masonic.
And so if the master believesthat the balacast had anything

(50:42):
to do with the race color of theskin, Right or religion of the
brother coming in, which are allthings that should be perfectly
fine.
He has the power to overthrowthat black cube and accept that
petition, and I think a lot ofmasters aren't aware that they
have that Power yeah, that'sawesome.
And, and even the masters thatare aware of it, probably the
vast majority would be afraid touse that power.

(51:05):
And I get that too, becauseit's your lodge members, right?
You don't want to like right?
Assume that you know betterthan them.

Speaker 2 (51:13):
Now I heard I once heard that what the the right
thing to do is, if you see itcoming as a worst-of-a-master,
then you tell your junior andsenior wardens that if you see a
black ball in there, you'regonna call it good.
You're gonna call it clear,call it clear I'll take
responsibility, for I'm theworst-of-a-master you call it
clear, even if you see a blackone in there, and then I will.

(51:35):
I will accept the ballot.
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (51:38):
I don't know Personally.
For me I'm the master this yearfor a little longer and I can't
imagine I would ever ask mywardens to do that, to Involve
them in something that's myresponsibility.
I don't think I would be a fanof taking that method right.
I would definitely, you know,say I'm watching this to them
and then let them know, becausethey're gonna be master someday,

(51:59):
so you can use it as a learningthing.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (52:02):
I guess I guess close .

Speaker 1 (52:03):
I watch what's gonna happen here and then if it comes
cube, and you call, was it?
And they say dark, dark whenyou look at it, you need to
stand there as the master andgive light to the craft and tell
them what's going on and why I,I agree, take full
responsibility.
Don't put it on your wardens.

Speaker 2 (52:19):
I, but I think the the concern is with the brother.
You know that he could net.
He'll never know that thishappened.
Yeah and the guy that threw theblack ball, it's, it's like it's
just all up in it's in his face.
It's like, dude, we, we knowwhat you did and we totally took
away your power, 100%, becausethe brother that you, that you

(52:43):
tried to black ball, won't evereven know that you did what you
did.
He was accepted as far as he'sconcerned.
He was accepted, and themajority of brothers who do
accept him on a whole, on aheart level, it'll just go
forward and move forward.
I don't know, I'm not sayingI'm a hundred percent fan of
that idea, but but I've heard itbeing done and yeah, I've heard
it too, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (53:04):
So you know, as long as Freemasonry is getting done,
I guess he can't be too mad.
And if it helps to get done, dowhat you got to do.
But you wouldn't have to if you, if all the brothers,
understood that you shouldn't,you shouldn't do that it's not
Masonic and you should feel badabout yourself coming along, sit
with your brothers and yeah,yeah that blatantly on Masonic.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
Yeah, I'm just gonna say it you, you are the absolute
definition of a hypocrite.
I mean you're sitting, all ofus right if you're sitting in
Lodge Talking about yourobligation and and all the
things about brotherly love andand relief and truth and
everything, but yet you harborthis thing in your heart which
is completely inappropriate,because you know everybody was

(53:49):
created by God equal.
There's, there is no, there isno distinction.
The only race that revelationTalks about is to run the race.

Speaker 1 (54:00):
Run the race with diligence run the race like the
running man.
Yeah, run the race.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
There is no race that that that, other than Running
the race, run it with diligence,integrity and honesty.
Run the race.
That's the only race thatmatters.
Any other race that you thinkmatters, you're wrong.
You're just wrong about it, man, because I've known people from

(54:26):
all walks of life and and inall situations and I can just
tell you from a lot ofexperience, seeing the good and
the really really bad ofHumanity there is no difference
with regard to skin color.
It just isn't a factor.

Speaker 1 (54:43):
Well, here's the thing in my mind.
If you're willing to breakMasonic law, in that case right.
Why wouldn't you be willing tobreak it in other cases?
In my mind, yeah right ifyou're willing to not be a Mason
in that area because of yourown personal Thoughts right.

(55:03):
Then if the opportunity came upfor you to grab some cash, would
you do it Right.
I mean, if you really needed itwith that guy, I could.
I trust him with my wallet.
I Could trust a Mason with mywallet because I know he took an
obligation.
He's not gonna break it right.
But that guy isn't a Mason, ishe?

Speaker 2 (55:19):
he's not really his obligation.
Mason and name only.

Speaker 1 (55:23):
So can I trust him with the other aspects of
Masonry?
For I mean, I don't know who itis, because we're we're pretty
Secretive and private and in ourballoting we're not supposed to
talk about this stuff.
But we have small lodges, it'spretty easy to tell a lot of
times you can tell who it is,and I mean, and you shouldn't

(55:46):
think that way.
I know like you should respecteverybody's doing the right
thing and all this, but inreality, people don't do the
right thing all the time.
And If you're willing to letthat slide, also like, what else
are you gonna let slide?
Are you gonna watch somebodytake some cash and not say
anything?
Right, are you gonna like letthem rape someone and not say
anything?
Like, how far are you gonna letthem go and not being Masonic

(56:07):
if you know?
right before you intervene anddo something about it.

Speaker 2 (56:11):
Yeah, we talked about this last night on the drive
home from the master MasonAssociation, which I didn't see
a lot of guys there, by the way.
Where are you guys?

Speaker 1 (56:19):
get out to the master Mason Association meeting the
holiday season.
They're starting to like.

Speaker 2 (56:23):
You know you're getting a break from Chris.
Chris is giving you a breakright now.
I Want it what we talked aboutgoing home.
Now you've you made me lose myheart at home.

Speaker 1 (56:34):
We were having a conversation on the way home
about Well, we had a bunch oftalks on that.
We talked about aliens, wetalked about politics politics.

Speaker 2 (56:43):
This is a great conversation.
We write works for heart and Ihad a little conversation going
about Creationism yes, and beingthat I'm a Christian.
Most people assume Christiansare young earth Creationists,
which I am not.
I do not hold to the doctrineof a young earth.

Speaker 1 (56:59):
I think that's a small minority of people.

Speaker 2 (57:02):
You'd be surprised.
You'd be surprised really, butit is.
It is an in-house debate.

Speaker 1 (57:06):
Just saying I never met one that told me they were
thinking of that way.

Speaker 2 (57:11):
The.
Whenever anybody says you, youcan't be a if you don't do this
and but it's outside of theaccepted, you know the accepted
mission of whatever organization, then then you know you're
dealing with somebody who'swho's zealous for the wrong
things, for the wrong thing,yeah, but anyways, we had a
great conversation.

(57:31):
I always enjoy Just doing all ofthis, this kind of Conversating
with right worst because heknows what he's talking about,
he knows what he believes, heknows why he believes it.
Yeah, and it's, it's always achallenge, and I, iron sharpens,
iron man, and he's never gonnaoffend you.

Speaker 1 (57:48):
No, he's just gonna tell you his thoughts on
something.

Speaker 2 (57:50):
Absolutely, and we can go back and forth and it's a
real lesson.
About things and that's how yougrow and that's how you learn,
man, you know, and that's that'swhat we're about.
We're about education, we'reabout, we're about brotherly
love and affection, we're aboutrelief to the community and the
fellow Mason and we're abouttruth.
Those are, those are ourtenants, those are, you know,

(58:11):
that's what we're about here, asMason.
So we promised an hour longbecause we are under a bit of a
time constraint this morning,but we wanted to knock one out
on a Friday morning so thatwe're back on schedule to get
get our drops on Wednesdaymorning.
So we won't leave you in thelurch for another week.
I hope this was educational foryou guys.

(58:33):
I know it might be a little dryand you might think it's a
little dry.
I know Chris does, because he'sbeen playing video games the
entire time.
What?

Speaker 1 (58:41):
we've been doing this .
I'm a multitasker.
I've actually read the Masonicetiquette book so many times
right and Reading it again.
I just picked up like threethings right did absolutely the
first three times I read throughit.
Yeah because I'm in a differentstation, in different place
every time, you know right sowell, like when you're the
junior deacon, you're payingattention to certain parts of

(59:02):
this absolutely.
But as you become like awarded,now you're looking at different
parts of the book, and then now,as a master, I'm like looking
at even different parts of thebooks right you should keep
going back to these resources ashe grow.

Speaker 2 (59:15):
I?
I brother came up to me justthe other day and said thank you
for reminding me about all theMaterial that Grand Lodge puts
out.
I have all of those books athome, yep, and I don't open them
.
So I began to open them andread them and I was like good on
you, brother, just it's, it'seasy Reading, it's not hard.
You guys can we're readingdirectly from it, guys, it's not

(59:36):
hard, it's very simple, butit's profound, you know, and you
could better yourself as aMason and your lodge, and that's
what, that's what this show isall about.

Speaker 1 (59:45):
Be an example for everybody else.
When they see you behaving thatway, they're gonna be like yeah
, one guy dresses a little nicer.
Watch how fast everybody elsestarts.

Speaker 2 (59:54):
Yeah, that's right, that's right, and if you take it
seriously, then others willbegin to take it seriously as
well, and, and and you won'tregret it, you won't regret it.
You will, you will, you will bea Leader within, within your
lodge next week.
We'll continue.
The next topic is Biblepresentation, so that'll be fun

(01:00:15):
We'll start off with that onenext week.

Speaker 1 (01:00:18):
That's an important moment in a mason's life.
Just became a master Mason andnow he's got his own Masonic
Bible, something you get to takehome that you, you know, you're
gonna have as a memento.
I, I love that thing.

Speaker 2 (01:00:32):
I absolutely love it.
I show it to people, I have itout of my book, I have it out on
my shelf.

Speaker 1 (01:00:37):
Yes, Like hey, look here and look at all those names
.
Yeah, they were all there forme.

Speaker 2 (01:00:43):
I it's, it's, I've gone through it, it's, it is the
.
It's the authorized King Jamesversion.
So it's that beautifulShakespearean Victorian language
.
So the Psalms are so rich toread through out of the kid, out
of the King Jimmy, which I just, I just love that version.
I originally learned all of mymemory verses in King James, so

(01:01:05):
whenever I think about you know,whenever verses come out of my
head, they're always in KingJames English, which I think is
very cool.

Speaker 1 (01:01:12):
I also got those awesome illustrations through
illustrations yes, yeah, it's,it's.
Illustrations right, so it kindof highlights.

Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
Well, it highlights the way Masonry uses the
scriptures to teach its lessons.
They're not always completelyTheological, but that's not the
point.
That's not the point, you know,but that's a different
conversation for one religion.

Speaker 1 (01:01:35):
You know, we are not a religion.
We are trying to get you toread it and look at it and think
about it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:39):
Yeah, that's right.
I recommend everybody read it.
It's there, read it, open it,read it, read it a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:01:44):
Sorry, we got ahead of our next episode.

Speaker 2 (01:01:46):
No, we did, we did.

Speaker 1 (01:01:49):
Well well we'll be it .

Speaker 2 (01:01:54):
We're going to a lodge next month.
We are in.
I can't remember.
I want to say Hillsboro, butit's not Hillsboro.

Speaker 1 (01:02:06):
We will be there, and maybe some people.

Speaker 2 (01:02:08):
Well, maybe Chris can figure that out before the
music runs out.
I don't know, but we'll see.
But as far as this show goes,it's over and if you're still
here then, like I say all thetime You're, you're one of our
heroes, man.
Thank you See, bring so much.
Seabring, seabring lodge.
We'll be there doing asymposium and a little bit of a
talk and doing goofy stuff likewe normally do.

(01:02:28):
If you can make it out there,please do.
What an honor it is for Chrisand I to be asked to go and
speak where we have no idea whyanybody would want us to show up
at their Lodge and speak.
But we will do it.

Speaker 1 (01:02:40):
Thursday October 12th .

Speaker 2 (01:02:41):
Thursday, october 12th.
So, anyways, you're our hero.
Thanks for being here, guys,and just Just just take what
you've learned if you've learnedanything back to your lodge and
make it a better place, and wewill see you all next time.