September 25, 2025 • 43 mins
TMSA’s On the Move Podcast – Featuring Andrew Silver
Andrew Silver, host of The Freight Pod, knows how to ask the right questions to spark real conversations. This October, he’ll take that skill from the recording studio to the main stage as moderator of the TMSA Executive Summit Shipper’s Panel featuring KeHe Distributors, Google, and Mitsubishi Power. In this episode, Andrew shares his approach to drawing out honest, thought-provoking insights from leaders across such different industries, what makes a panel truly engaging, and how he plans to connect the dots between shippers, carriers, and the broader supply chain audience.
Check out the Transportation Sales and Marketing Association (TMSA) website or engage with us on LinkedIn.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:22):
Hello everybody and welcome to a special edition of
On the Move.
Really excited to have AndrewSilver with me, the host of the
Freight Pod.
Our schedules have not been ourfriends so we had to reschedule
this, but excited that we wereable to get together and give
you guys this episode.
So I am Jennifer Karpis-Romain,executive Director of the
(00:43):
Transportation Marketing andSales Association, which is a
trade nonprofit educating andconnecting marketing and sales
professionals in transportationand logistics.
And welcome to On the Move.
Welcome to the show, andrew.
How are you doing today?
Speaker 2 (00:58):
I'm doing.
Well.
This is a little weird for me.
I don't often go on otherpeople's podcasts.
I'm usually the one who doesthe introduction and asks all
the questions, so this is alittle different than my usual
cadence.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Well, I'm excited for that.
I started my career injournalism, so this is the side.
I'm comfortable on it.
Definitely, when I have to goon other people's shows, it is.
It's weird being asked.
It took me a while to be likewhy are people asking me
questions?
Why do they care what I have tosay?
(01:31):
So that takes a minute, buthappy to have you and your
insights because you have beenin the industry for a long time.
So can you give us kind of yourrundown on your origin story
and how you got in the industry?
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Yeah, sure.
So I started in the industry atCoyote Logistics, a business
that my parents had founded in2006.
I was 16 years old at the timeand started working as a carrier
up.
I fell in love with it Just thecompetitive nature of the
business and how you couldreally make your own path and
(02:00):
make your own opportunity if youjust were willing to put in the
work.
And I really loved working withowner-operators.
I had a lot of guys who I dealtwith every day and they became
very close friends of mine and Irealized that it was my job to
take care of them.
And the better I took care ofthem, the more success I had and
the more success they had, andI never left.
(02:20):
So I stayed with that companyfor 10 years.
Um did every role I could andeventually kind of had the itch
to want to build a business ofmy own.
So I called up a buddy of mine,matt bogrich, and we started
molo solutions freight brokeragebased in chicago, and that was
in july of 2017.
Um, we ran that business andloved every second of it.
(02:44):
Well, I don't know about everysecond of it, but we loved a lot
of it and in 2021, we wereactually out trying to raise
money to keep building thebusiness and look for a, you
know, a partner that could helpus go from.
I think we were doing about 600million in revenue at the time
and we wanted to make it like amulti-billion dollar brokerage,
and we actually ended up meetingour best, and they wanted to
make it like a multi-billiondollar brokerage, um, and we
(03:05):
actually ended up meeting arcbest, and, and they wanted to
buy the whole thing, and so wewent through that whole deal and
um stayed around for a year anda half, uh, which wasn't really
the plan.
We were planning to stay on fora little longer, but um,
sometimes that's not how thecookie crumbles and um, so I
left that business two and ahalf years ago, with a brutal
(03:27):
non-compete, I should say, andthat is what led me to
podcasting, because podcastingisn't competing with
transportation brokers.
So I started my show, theFreight Pod, I guess about two
years ago now, and that's whatI've been doing ever since, and
along with playing golf andpickleball.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Well, amazing.
That really sums up, yeah, yourcareer.
I love when people, especiallyones who start in like a family
business, really do like workthrough all the different
pockets of the business, becauseI feel like it just speaks
volumes to the knowledge and thebreadth of information that
people have.
It's not just like, oh yeah,this is what we did, and so I
(04:12):
sat on the top.
It's like, no, I did the work,I figured it out, I worked all
the pieces and then now whatelse am I going to do with my
life than talk about freight allday, because that's what I know
and what I love.
And so, yes, now you're the hostof the Freight Pod.
So why?
It's weird for you to be on theinterview side of this, and
your podcast is known for really, you know, taking those deep
(04:34):
explorations of how logisticsinnovators forge their path,
having this so kind of similar.
This is what I like to do.
I love to interview people andhear their stories and what they
did and how they got there.
I like to do.
I love to interview people andhear their stories and what they
did and how they got there.
So why did when you decided tostart your show a couple of
years ago.
Why was that the focus for you?
Why are those the stories thatyou wanted to tell?
Speaker 2 (04:55):
That's a good question.
So I think a couple of things.
One it felt like something thatI could relate well to and
could add Like, I always amtrying to think about how, like,
(05:18):
if you're a freight broker, asa salesperson, I spent so much
time thinking about how to bedifferent, right and like,
because that's your whole job istrying to get new business and
brokerages.
There's thousands of brokersand it's so hard to stand out.
So you constantly have to askyourself that question like how
am I different than everyoneelse?
And so when I looked atpodcasting, I thought the same
(05:39):
thing.
I was like okay, there's abunch of podcasts that exist
today in the space.
How do I stand out?
And it's not like you couldbuild some technology for a
podcast.
It's not like you could buildsome network asset.
All you really have to offer isyourself and your experiences
and your curiosity and thequestions you ask and such, and
so for me it's like how am Igoing to stand out?
(06:01):
It's like how am I going tostand out?
Like you know, my journey, Ithink, is is you know, I've,
I've had this experience infreight, that, um, and in
building a business that, youknow, I think really meshes well
with the kind of people I wantto interview Um, and I think it
leads to a differentconversation than I think some
other podcasts can have, and sothat's kind of why I focused on
it and also it's interesting.
(06:22):
I think these are some I try tointerview the most interesting
people I can find um.
You know it's it's it.
It certainly didn't start as ajob um, I eventually added some
sponsors and really justcompanies that I knew and
trusted and believed in, and soI was like I'm happy to you know
, align you with my show.
Like rapido solutions group isone of them.
(06:43):
Uh, two guys who I've known fora long time and and trust and
would happily push businesstowards um.
But for me it was just like Ihadn't.
I couldn't work in the industryand I didn't want to try
something different.
Um, because I mean different inthe terms of like leaving the
industry altogether.
I know one day I will bebrokering freight again, whether
(07:03):
that's in a year or later, Idon't know but I wanted to stay
frankly relevant in the industrywith my customer base, the
companies that I'd worked withfor years, and knowing I
couldn't really work with themdirectly, I figured you know why
not try to add some value bybringing the right kind of
conversation to the table withthe kind of leaders that people
(07:24):
want to hear from?
And so you know, I've spent thebetter part of two years trying
to reach out to CEOs andfounders of logistics companies,
of technology companies, oftrucking companies, even
shippers and different levelswithin shippers.
I'm just trying to like bringas many different elements of
our industry into this kind ofenvironment I've created in the
(07:47):
FreightPod and you know, havefun conversations.
And you know, if I'm beingperfectly honest, like I love
the conversations, I hateeverything else about podcasting
.
Like as soon as we hit record, Ilove it and I love it until
we're done recording everythingbefore and after.
I can't, I don't enjoy it atall and I don't like doing.
(08:09):
I don't like the social mediaelement, I don't like any of it
I mean, I get that like.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
So one of the reasons why I started this podcast for
tmsa one I wanted a space wherewe could focus on people who are
so like are yes, one I likethat.
You're like where am Idifferent?
What can I offer that otherpeople can't?
I did the same thing.
I think it's important whenyou're doing things, to be like
what is the point of what I'mdoing and can it matter to
(08:34):
people?
So for me, I wanted people whowere associated with TMSA in
some way and we'll get to howyou are later in this interview.
But I have people who email meall the time.
They're like I have the bestperson to appear on your show.
I'm like oh, are you going tobecome a TMSA member?
No, crickets, Okay.
(08:55):
Well, like that's no.
I want to highlight people whoare members, people who are
speakers, people who are engagedin our community, because I
love elevating their voices andhave it.
Especially on the marketingside.
I found that marketers arespending so much time pushing
out their like presidents andstuff on to podcasts.
People aren't necessarilyasking them to appear on the
show.
So I've had so many people thatwhen we're done, they're like
(09:16):
that was the first podcastinterview I ever did.
I'm like, oh, I love that, LikeI love that Now you have a
space to share your expertise inyour story and people get to
know you more.
Because, yeah, when I was adirector of marketing, no, I sat
in the corner, I pushed mypresident out, I did my thing
and then we carried on.
That was actually one of thebiggest things becoming
executive director of TMS.
I'm like, oh no, I'm now.
I'm now that person that has toappear in front of the camera.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Now you're getting pushed.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Yeah, and it's a big change and so I love that and I
love that focus and, yeah, it'sthe stories.
For me, and just hearing thatvalue point people's experiences
and having different viewpointsis really great, so I like that
you focus on that stuff too,and I want to.
(10:01):
So one yes, you will be ourmoderator for our shippers panel
at executive summit this year,which is in Chicago October 22nd
through the 23rd, so I'mexcited for you to appear there
and come there.
It'll be your first TMSA event,so we're excited to.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
That's.
That's another side effect ofthe podcast, that is a positive
one is people asking me tomoderate panels.
I've never done that before orconsidered it, and in the last
two years this is I think myfourth or fifth opportunity to
moderate a panel and like, whata cool thing to do.
Like you know, instead ofhaving to be the guy who's like
(10:40):
I don't know sharing my opinions, I get to drill into like from,
in this case, google andMitsubishi and and Kehi, and
like, especially shippers, man.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Like do you know how many emails I used to?
Speaker 2 (10:51):
have to send to just talk to a shipper.
Now you're just putting me onstage with three of them, like
that's like three very, and I'vemet these guys, they're awesome
.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
I'm like yes, I love this shippers panel.
Yes, I will being able tomoderate it.
So, as an event planner, Idon't think that everyone always
thinks about how important thatmoderator seat is, because
things can really really gosideways If you don't have a
strong matter.
I also, because of my role indoing stuff like this, get asked
(11:20):
to moderate, like, yes, becauseI can direct conversation and
direct people to go or like knowwhen to be, like okay, this
person's talking a little long,let's cut it off and move on.
But not everyone can do that.
So I think it is a skill setthat you learn and so, yeah,
when you look at the podcastcommunity, like that guy, he
knows how to talk and listen.
Great.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
I'm going to ask a question that, if you don't, if
you haven't seen it, this isgoing to be super irrelevant,
but have you ever seen the show?
Curb your enthusiasm.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
There's.
There's an episode where theyare focused on, like, a dinner
table party and how they talkabout how, like it's whoever
sits in the middle seat at thedinner table, you have to like
be capable of sitting in themiddle seat, and if you don't
sit, if you're sitting in themiddle and you're not capable of
(12:10):
owning and driving theconversation, it could ruin the
whole dinner party.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
It really can.
You have to be able to focus onboth sides and yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
And I bring that up because it's like the moderator,
like my job is not to have theinsight, but if I'm, if if you
or I, as the moderator, aren'tcapable, capable of managing all
the people and navigating theconversation, driving the
conversation effectively, it'sgoing to be a bad panel.
So the moderator is such animportant role, despite the fact
that they don't have toactually provide any of the
(12:35):
insight, but if they don't dotheir job well, effectively, of
driving the dinner party, it'sgoing to be a bad party.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
So I don't know, I just think it's really
interesting, it is, and I'vestarted to enjoy doing it and uh
, yeah, I like being themoderator too, and of course you
can add like scope or flair,and a lot of times that's like.
So, like I know, I always umtalk to the people, like my
panelists, ahead of time, andyou can tell when they have a
really good point but they haveforgotten it to say it on stage,
and so to me, that's part of myjob as the moderator to like
(13:03):
cue them up to remember thatgreat point that they had to
then be able to be like yes,that's the thing, cause you
don't want them to leave thestage and be like oh man, I
forgot to say the best thing Ihad like that.
So that's, to me, part of thejob as the moderator is to like
help get them through that.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Yeah, I've done that before and it's you're.
It's really frustrating.
You walk off the stage andthere's no turning back.
You can't go back in time andsay it it's over.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
I would have sounded so smart if I would have just
been there.
So like that's.
I don't ever want my paneliststo feel that way, so I do that
and I'll think about ways tolike set them up.
So, but part of the executivesummit.
So, yes, powerhouse of ashippers panel big highlight.
I so, yes, powerhouse of ashippers panel big highlight.
I'm so excited for it.
But it really is a leadershipevent for the industry.
(13:49):
So we have the decision makersthere and I'm curious about kind
of your perspective on when wetalk about building
high-performing teams inlogistics, what do you think is
one thing that leaders overlookwhen they're building those
teams?
Speaker 2 (14:08):
is one thing that leaders overlook when they're
building those teams.
What is something that leadersoverlook when building teams?
So well, I think, well, onething I feel like people focus
on a lot is metrics, and metricsare important.
Everyone will tell you thatKPIs, I get it.
You have to set fairexpectations, like, if you don't
(14:30):
have KPIs for your team, thenit's unreasonable to think that
people are living up to, or notliving up to your expectations,
because, frankly, you haven'tset expectations.
I think the challenge, though,is when people are too focused
on KPIs and that's all thatmatters.
I think it's sometimes it's hardto see the forest through the
(14:50):
trees, and what I mean by thatis we're talking about human
beings and we're especially infreight.
It's like a high paced fast.
It's a fast paced, high energy,high stress in, at times,
chaotic business.
It's it's like a relentlessbusiness that never stops, and
people get worn out, and peopleget beat down from, like the
(15:14):
challenges they deal with everyday, and so like I think there's
an element of trust that can belost if you are too heavily
weighted into KPIs and notenough into, kind of the human
element, and like empathy, andso like one of the things that I
think we did really well atMolo was we had a lot of trust
between our, our people and ourleadership.
(15:35):
And you know people say trustand it's like you know, I think
sometimes people are like oh,foo foo.
Like, yeah, trust, you have totrust each other.
Like, yeah, okay, but if youactually want people to be
bought into, if you want peopleto perform at their best, they
have to be bought in to whatyou're doing.
They have to trust you as aleader.
They have to trust theirmanager.
They have to trust theorganization has their best
(15:56):
interests and, at the same time,the leadership has to trust the
employees.
And it's hard because takeremote work, for example it's
something that everyone wants tobe able to work from home, or
not.
I shouldn't say everyone, butthe majority of people want some
element of freedom to workremotely here and there.
(16:16):
But that's a privilege and it'sone that can easily be
manipulated or lost becausepeople take advantage of it and
so like it's hard because two orthree people who are supposed
to be working from home onFriday, on a summer day, are
actually sitting by the pool andnot doing their job, and that
(16:38):
might lose the ability foreveryone to work from home
because we realize, okay, thisis a problem.
So at the end of the day, whatI'm saying is like there are a
lot of complexities and nuanceto leading people, and if you
just super focus on KPIs andreally strict requirements, I
think you lose people.
(16:59):
I think that it's hard to buildthe kind of trust you need to
build a high-performingorganization, and so it's the
right delicate balance of trustin your team and giving them the
leash and freedom to be willingto innovate, because there's
like an element of likepsychological safety that people
have to feel like they're in aplace that they can be at their
(17:21):
best.
But if you just drill KPIs atthem all day, they're working
out of fear.
They're working out of like Ihave to hit this number.
If I don't hit this number, Iget fired next week.
And then it's less about likehow do I come up with like a
creative solution to a problem,and more how do I make sure my
manager has me meeting abenchmark that they've set for
me?
Does that make sense?
It does.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
We actually.
So this year's keynote forexecutive summit is Nicole Glenn
from Pandora, and she's goingto be talking about building
high performing teams, kind ofin this turbulent time.
But the last time we were inChicago for executive summit
2023, we actually had ourkeynote was this man named Corey
Shearer who talked about trust,and he also was like here how
(18:05):
you add trust KPIs into yourself.
So it's actually really funny.
It is such a key component andI think that I mean we've all
been in this industry and likeand at that point there was
company after like I rememberdoing like my prep call with him
.
I'm like there was companyafter like I remember doing like
my prep call with him.
I'm like there has now beenlike three to four major
companies who have gone bankruptand did not tell their
(18:27):
employees ahead of time.
It's very important foremployees to understand that
they're getting like transparentand information first, and it
is very like people in thisindustry are very like in the
fields with that kind of stuffright now, because there are
like mergers and acquisitionscoming out all the time, there's
bankruptcies, there's changes,and if your employees don't know
(18:49):
and you're if they're findingout by the news that it doesn't
feel good and they don't trustthat.
And I do think there has to bea trust between leadership and
employee and and vice versa.
So I just it was kind of funnythat you dove into that without
knowing the scope.
I was like, yeah, we reallybelieve in that.
We talk about that like weactually had a guy come and
(19:10):
speak to that because it isreally important.
Um, and I do think, likeacknowledging the kind of market
that we're in is importantbecause you can set the KPI, but
you also have to acknowledgethat maybe we're in a different
place than we thought we wouldbe, and so if they're not
hitting that Y and that's I'mspeaking at Women in Trucking's
(19:32):
Accelerate in November.
That's kind of my topic how tobuild your best team, and part
of that is like okay, what isour actual capacity?
How are we best engaging ourworkers?
Are they in their like bestzone of like things, are
passionate about things theylike and things they're good at,
but also like are we puttingtoo much on one person?
Because I feel like I mean,I've been that human who works
(19:55):
really hard and just keepsgetting more added to my plate
because they know I'll do it,but you don't want to burn out
your rock stars either, and sohow do you find that balance?
And there has to be a trustthat like, oh, you're giving
them enough to be successful butthen not overloading them
because they're picking up theslack of other people either.
So it's all.
I think it's all good.
(20:15):
There's so much to considerwhen you're building a high
performing team.
I'm fascinated by the idea oftrust KPIs.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
I need to look into trust KPIs.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
I will find his presentation and send it to you.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
I actually when I said that.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
I'm like you're going to ask me what they are, and it
was a discussion two years ago.
I don't remember them off thetop of my head.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Send it to me please, I will do my own.
I just had never thought oftrust KPIs specifically.
And I really like the idea ofkind of creating a bucket just
for that.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Yep, shout out Corey Shearer.
He was a great speaker andreally great, thoughtful,
because it is so true how muchtrust matters.
And I'm excited for NicoleGlenn to take the stage as our
keynote this year to really talkabout building those teams and
like through turbulence andthrough change and how do we
make them successful.
So I think Executive Summit isshaping up to be a great show.
(21:07):
As we talked about, you havethe shippers panel we kind of
mentioned.
We have Google, mishpishi Powerand Kihei Distributors.
So you are then that moderatorin charge of steering that
conversation with shippersspanning CPG, tech, energy.
How do you plan, if you have aplan yet, to kind of bridge
(21:28):
their unique supply chainchallenges and priorities but
still give that information toour attendees?
Speaker 2 (21:36):
So I am a master procrastinator so I can't sit
here and honestly tell you Ihave a well-developed plan for
the panel we're going to do inover a month.
But I have thought a little bitabout it and when you first
sent me the list of thesecompanies, my first instinctual
(21:57):
thought was oh my God, how am Igoing to put all these three
together?
There's nothing in common amongthese companies.
But then I really thought aboutit and, at the end of the day,
freight is freight and whilethere are completely significant
intricacies among these threecompanies that make them very,
very different, the underlyingchallenges they have are
(22:18):
probably all very similar,whether it's visibility, supply
chain resilience, sustainability, talent, like these issues are
common.
Fraud, I mean fraud is like youknow, it doesn't matter who you
are, everyone's dealing with it.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
We have a session on that, too, at Executive Summit.
We're hitting all the bigtopics, yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
So, like, I think my job as the moderator is to kind
of toe the line and highlight,you know, the differences among
these companies and allow themto talk about the things that
make them unique, because Ithink that's what an audience
wants to understand.
I think an audience absolutelywants to understand Kehi
Distributors and that foodbusiness, like what's unique to
their world.
And then we go to Google andit's going to be completely
(23:03):
different, and so, like, we wantto talk about the things that
make them different, but, at thesame time, there are those
kinds of commonalities that Ithink all of them deal with.
And, you know, risk is like a,an incredible one that, like,
each of them probably have verykind of different answers with
respect to, like, how they thinkabout risk in their supply
chain and how they navigate it.
(23:24):
But, at the same time, I betthere's commonalities among the
answers in terms of, um, kind ofwhy they're thinking about it,
the way they are right, and so,like, you might be protecting
different things, but, at theend of the day, freight is
freight and transportation istransportation.
So, um, I think there will be alot more in common that we can
(23:44):
see, but at the same time, wewant to also pull out some of
the differences, just becauseit's what makes these companies
unique and interesting.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
Yeah, I definitely think one commonality I always
see is that, and so when I wentto journalism school, the
biggest takeaway was always likeknow who your audience is.
And I just take that througheverything, no matter what I'm
doing, if I'm writing, when I'mtalking to people, when I'm
talking to my kid trying to gethim to read, you know.
Know who your audience is andwhat's going to entice them to
(24:12):
do what you want.
And I feel like I've seen a lotof logistic, sales and
marketing messages that are like, oh, we can do it all.
We can do everything.
They don't care about that.
They want to know what you cando for them.
And so I do think like hittingon all those points of how those
individual companies like whatthey need, but really like
(24:33):
that's part of it Like don'tshow up to a meeting and be like
, oh, we can handle everything,but you're not talking about how
you can actually service theCPG market, and like how you're
a differentiator there for them.
I feel like that's the kind ofstuff that I love hearing from
our shippers talking about islike this is the stuff that
matters to me, and like don't dothat all.
Like, yes, they want a partnerthat could potentially scale
(24:56):
with their business and whatthey need, but like they don't
care what you can do for othersectors.
They just want to know what youcan do for them and really
honing in on that.
So I think it'll be reallyinteresting to hear, probably,
that they've gotten that type ofmessaging.
But then what about thosedifferent sectors should we be
focusing on?
Speaker 2 (25:14):
Yes, I would piggyback off of that statement
just to say that anytime I'vespoken at a conference or, you
know, now, moderate a panel andI haven't asked you this yet,
but I will I'm going to do itnow, I guess but is to see the
attendee list in advance, andit's it's.
I almost spend as much time ormore looking at the attendee
(25:34):
list as I do the panelists, andthe reason for that is, like you
said, it's understanding theaudience and what they're
interested in, because, like youknow, I could talk to these
three folks about the thingsthat are most interesting to me,
but if the audience has nointerest, I will be looking out
to a group of 50, a hundred, 500people staring at their
fricking phones, and it is.
(25:55):
It is not fun to be on stagetalking while you look out at
either an empty audience or onethat is just completely
disengaged.
So I wholeheartedly agree withthe idea of knowing your
audience and catering to theaudience and giving them what
they're looking for.
Otherwise you won't have anaudience.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
Well, I will add that to my thanks to send to you
after this.
Thank you, anyone that'slistening to this.
If you want to check out thisawesome shipper panel and all
the other things that we'retalking about, it is October
22nd.
Through the 23rd.
You can register for ExecutiveSummit at eventstmsatodayorg and
we are offering on the movelisteners a 10% discount that
(26:34):
you can use the discount codeMOVETOSUMMIT10.
Okay, enough of my promotionalstuff about executive summit,
but I am really excited about it.
But you have been in thisindustry for a really long time
and so you have seen, like yousaid at the beginning, like I
used to beg to talk to shippersand now you're just putting me
on stage with three of them.
(26:55):
So I'm curious how you seerelationships between shippers
and carriers kind of evolvingover the next few years and what
you've seen over the past fewyears.
Ooh, just a simple, easyquestion.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Well, as a guy who's been sitting out for two and a
half years, I can't say I'vebeen engaging with shippers
often to know or see.
This is one of the benefits ofthe podcast is like trying to
just stay informed with what theheck's going on.
And it feels like if you wereto look at any two and a half
year window in the history ofour industry like where has
there been the most change?
I think we're looking at itlike this is the one that has
(27:31):
had the most change.
So I I don't love being on thesidelines for this part, um, and
I'm specifically thinking abouttechnology.
So I think there's anopportunity for a number of
things to happen and ultimatelythere's not one answer right,
because not all shippers behavethe same way.
Not all brokers behave the sameway.
(27:52):
So I had plenty of shippersthat were super
relationship-focused throughoutour time together, and I had
plenty who were just all theycared about was the math and the
numbers and how they could getthe cheapest cost of
transportation.
And then I had, you know, mostof them were somewhere in the
middle.
What we're seeing the mostchange in is technology, and
what I mean by that is, you know, there's plenty of stuff about
(28:15):
AI and automation, butconnectivity and, frankly, like,
I think of a company, likewhat's it called Good Ship.
I don't know if you're familiarwith this company, but their
role is a technology platformthat sits on top of a TMS and in
(28:35):
doing so, it becomes a bridgefor communication between
brokers, carriers and theshipper itself, and what you now
have is a way for shippers andbrokers to talk and carriers to
talk to each other within theTMS in a way that they never
have before.
So what does that allow for?
It just allows for a heightenedand enhanced relationship.
(28:57):
Where there's just such ahistory of enhanced relationship
, where, like there, there'sjust such a history of you know
how many qbrs I've sat in, whereyou know that's our formal
engagement with a shipper, andonce a quarter we go and meet
with them.
They put some numbers in frontof us and say, hey, this is how
you're doing, and I'm like, wait, no, I don't think I'm doing
that.
Well, these are my numbers forhow I'm doing, and there's a
little bit of disagreement there.
(29:18):
Um, and then we waste you know,I don't know half of a meeting
talking about it, and it's justnot the most efficient way to
have a relationship versus atechnology now is available
where, at any point in time, wecould be artic or communicating
with one another and gettingaligned on our metrics and our
numbers, so that when we do gomeet in person, we're not
(29:39):
wasting time and we're alreadylike 10 steps ahead of where we
would be.
This is just one example, andI'm sure there are plenty of
other companies out there doingsimilar things or different
things but also enhancing theopportunity for relationships to
develop and get better.
So the answer is, I think thatshippers and brokers and
carriers.
The answer is, I think thatshippers and brokers and
(30:00):
carriers, like, there is theopportunity for them to do more
better together, leveragingtechnology in a way they haven't
in the past.
But, like anything, there'salso a way for shippers and
brokers to leverage probablymore so, shippers to leverage
technology in a way that, like,removes some of the relationship
(30:21):
.
I mean, that's some of what ishappening with technology and
you could argue it the other way.
But you know, when you look atsome of these systems that are
coming out whether it's the AIvoice companies like Happy Robot
or Fleetworks or Clone Ops wenow have AI talking directly to
the carrier to book loads.
We now have AI talking directlyto the carrier to book loads.
(30:43):
There's I'm I'm hard pressed tobe sold that that's going to
improve relationships betweenthe carrier and the broker
because, like you know, I knowthere's a movie, I think called
her, where this guy has arelationship with the AI, but,
like it's, it's not likesomething we want to look
forward to.
Is is being, you know, is arelationship with a robot, you,
(31:06):
I believe this will always be ahuman business in the sense that
humans are the ones drivingdecisions, and relationships are
going to matter forever, buttechnology should be able to
enable them in a way thatdoesn't take away from that, and
I don't think anyoneopportunity to.
(31:27):
But I think today, where thistechnology is, it may allow for
brokers to do more with less,and what I mean by that is, if I
deploy clone ops into my system, I may be able to operate with
I don't know 30% less headcountto execute my business, with I
(31:49):
don't know 30% less headcount toexecute my business, but I
don't know that anybody yet hasa solution that won't detract
somewhat from the relationshipand that may not be the
technology's job.
It may be the broker.
It probably is.
I'm thinking out loud, so allowme to just do this, but it
really is.
I think, the broker's job tobring in the technology and then
(32:12):
craft your people around it ina way that allows the
relationship not to diminish.
But the simple way I think a lotof companies will do it wrong
is just to throw the technologyinto the system, see efficiency
in that like loads get coveredwith fewer people and then call
that a success.
But what they won't see is overtime there will be diminished
(32:38):
returns in their relationshipswith the carriers because
carriers will be less loyal tothem because there's not a
person that they're dealing withevery day who they feel loyal
to.
I have carriers owner-operatorsthat to this day I could call
right now and having not bookedthem on a load in 10, 15 years,
and if I asked them for a favorthey'd do it in a second.
And if they asked me for afavor, I would do it in a second
(32:59):
.
That's kind of what the benefitor beauty of a relationship is
is people who want to work foreach other and look out for each
other and take care of eachother.
I don't see how you get thatwith technology, but yeah,
long-winded answer, hopefullysome of it made sense.
Speaker 1 (33:14):
Well, it did, and it was great because my next
question was talking about liketrends and technology, so you
just answered both questions inone.
Two for one, special Two for one.
And I'm like, wow, me andAndrew stand on very similar
soap boxes when we getpassionate about stuff, because
this is something I talk aboutall the time.
Like you're human, like Ibelieve our technologies AI and
(33:35):
not should be able to equip ourhumans to do the human things
better, to be able to beempathetic, to be able to talk
to people when things go wrong,if the load gets lost, freight
fraud, all that stuff yourcomputer isn't going to make
your customer feel better whenthings like that happen.
Your humans will, and so I so,like when you were going, I'm
(33:56):
like, yeah, like this is what Italk about too.
Like I like tools like sentimentanalysis.
If you could put on my phone,every time it rings or text me,
what kind of mood the person onthe other side is before I talk
to them.
Give me that tool, because thatthat you know what I mean.
Like if a customer is callingand you're like, hey, this
person sounds chipper versusthis person wants to bite your
(34:16):
head off, let me be prepared forthat, because that will then
help me move, and I am a prettysane human.
I like to believe, but nothingmakes me more irate than when I
call and I have to click eightbuttons to talk to the person
that can actually help me.
And so and that is what I feellike some of these tools are
making people do, and that'slike when you're talking about
(34:38):
like the humans are being takenout of that equation, and they
do.
Yes, will that load get bookedfaster?
Maybe, but what happens ifsomething goes wrong?
And how quickly can ourcustomers get to a human to be
able to fix the problem?
And those are the types of KPIsand that we need to be paying
attention to too, because if wedon't and we only think about
(35:00):
the front end, then I absolutelyagree that we're going to be
losing so much of that.
I feel like we could do thisinterview for another like four
hours, and nobody would listento us, but I think it's valuable
.
I hope someone's listening butregardless.
No, I think it's all good and Ithink that these are the
(35:21):
conversations people should behaving, because there are so
many technology tools out thereand how are we using them, how
are we using them the best thatwe can and how are we getting
roi from them?
Like I know, especially on thesales and marketing side of
things, we get asked thosethings all the time Okay, why am
I paying for that?
What is the value of that?
And we need to be able toanswer those questions and I do
(35:41):
think for me, the best ROI arethe ones that are allowing our
people to actually be moreefficient and to be able to
handle the relationship stuffmore, like if we can focus on
the relationships more and theputting in like data points less
.
That's the type of solutionsthat I'm personally most
interested in for our teams youand me both Similar soapbox, so
(36:04):
anyway, yeah, I jumped off mineand you jumped right on, yeah
perfect.
I was like, yeah, good, my turn.
But this takes us to the lastof our interview.
Jumped off mine and you jumpedright on yeah, perfect.
I was like, yeah, good, my turn.
Um, but this takes us to thelast of our interview.
This is a question I askeverybody who comes on the show.
So, um, if you could go back intime and advise a younger
andrew anything, personally orprofessionally, when would you
go back to and what would youtell them?
(36:24):
I know it's my favoritequestion.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
You ask this to everybody.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Every single person who I've ever interviewed on
this show, and even like beforeI started the official podcast
and did LinkedIn, lives for TMSA.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
Yep, I should have watched an old show.
I would have been prepared forthis question I don't know when,
so what would I say to myself?
And if you?
Speaker 1 (36:49):
could go back in time and advise a younger version of
yourself, and it could be apersonal thing or a professional
thing.
What would you go back to?
Speaker 2 (36:57):
I mean, I'm such an idiot throughout my life that
there's so many things I wish Ihad learned a long time ago.
Um sorry, I don't want to justspit something out.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
I'm thinking, trying to just I want to give you a
good answer?
It doesn't have to be profoundit can just be okay.
Speaker 2 (37:22):
Okay, yeah, I mean, I think learning to manage my
emotions better younger wouldhave been would have served me a
lot better, I think.
What I've learned in life, Ithink, is that the difference
between someone who effectivelycan manage their emotions and
(37:45):
someone who can't is massive,and it shows up everywhere in
your life.
Not to get political at all,and and and this is not my point
in bringing this up, but youknow, we're seeing there was
there was a political, there wasthe death of Charlie Kirk last
week and the there's a lot ofemotion around that, regardless
(38:10):
of what side you're on, andthere are a lot of people
speaking out now and sayingthings, and they're not always
necessarily the nicest things,but it's a very emotional thing,
and there are a lot of peoplewho are losing their jobs now,
and, whether you agree ordisagree that they should, the
reality is it's happening.
Whether you agree or disagreethat they should, the reality is
(38:33):
it's happening.
And what I'm noticing now is, aweek later, people are still
saying things and still losingtheir jobs, and so my point is,
like I understand, the first dayof it happening, people said
some things that they wouldlater regret and then they lost
their job and that's unfortunate.
But a week later people arestill saying things and then
they're like surprised thatthey're losing their job and
(38:54):
it's like, okay, well, we justwatched a bunch of other people
lose their job for saying thesethings.
You're reacting so emotionally,it's costing you your job.
And my point in all of this isthat, like, as a society, I
don't think that many, I don'tthink most, I don't think think
the majority of people are veryeffective at managing their
emotions and it's why we seethese kind of explosive
(39:15):
outbursts from people all thetime.
And then there areramifications and consequences
of those explosive outbursts andthat's a critical thing.
And to get away from that partof it and to go just to like
working in transportation, whichis a highly stressful business,
to go just to like working intransportation, which is a
highly stressful business.
(39:41):
I remember there were variouspoints in my leadership journey
where I am deeply ashamedsending to my team out of
frustration when we werescrewing up for a very large
customer that I personally helda relationship with and my team
was working their butts off totry to make it work.
But there was an issue and itgot screwed up and it was a
(40:03):
mistake, but it was a Fridaynight and I wasn't in the right
mind space and I wasn't managingmy emotions effectively and I
just went off on my team andthey didn't deserve that.
And so the lesson is like youknow, take a breath, take a beat
before you react to things anddo the work to understand that,
(40:24):
like, anger is a complex emotion.
It's a healthy emotion to have,it's a normal emotion, but how
you manage it is the differencebetween being a good leader and
a complex emotion.
It's a healthy emotion to have,it's a normal emotion, but how
you manage it is the differencebetween being a good leader and
a bad one.
And I think it's not justleadership, it's how you show up
in your relationships with yourfriends, with your spouse, with
your siblings, your family,your parents, whatever, and it's
(40:46):
it's one of the most importantthings in your life is like how
you show up in the world and howyou manage when things happen
to you and how you react tothings.
So, um, it's not something thatI learned at an early age and
it's not something I worked onuntil the last few years, and so
the advice I would give myselfat an early age at 16 would be
(41:06):
like really focus onunderstanding your emotions and
how to manage them in a way thatis not reactive and not
destructive.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
I think that's great advice and I'm going to show
this clip to my son, who's eight, and we had this whole
conversation last night about.
I was like I want you to knowthat it is okay to have emotions
and feelings, because we do,and shutting them down doesn't
really help anything, but how wereact to those feelings and we
(41:37):
can't control other people, wecan only control ourselves, and
I do.
I think it shows up everywhere,personally and professionally,
in how we handle those and Iagree, taking a breath.
We all have that email, we allhave that moment, but we didn't
act our best selves and so beingable to navigate through that I
think is great.
So I like that advice and I amI never.
I mean, my son gets boredpretty easily on things that I
(41:59):
show him.
He thinks it's very cool thatI'm on youtube, but he I'm not
like what he watches on youtube.
Yeah, um, you're not minecraft.
No, oh my god, no, no, I'm notnot um, but he does.
He tells people that his mom ison youtube and then they get
excited, but he's like, but shedoes this, and then my niece
will be like anja, your officewas very messy behind you.
(42:20):
Can you please clean it beforeyou go on camera again?
I'm like, can you like justlisten to what I'm saying, not
how my office looks, but wellanyways it was a pleasure to
have you on the show.
I'm very excited for you to cometo Executive Summit Again.
You can register for ExecutiveSummit eventstmsatodayorg, and
listeners of the show can usethe code MOVETOSUMMIT10.
(42:43):
I'm excited to have you andjust yeah, our lineup touches on
all of the stuff we reallytalked about today, from the
shippers panel to leadingthrough turbulent times, a case
study on freight fraud, all thestuff in between.
So excited to see you nextmonth and thank you for coming
on the show today.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
Thank you.
It's great being here.
I look forward to the summit.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Perfect.
Have a good one you too.
Hello everybody and welcome to a special edition of
On the Move.
Really excited to have AndrewSilver with me, the host of the
Freight Pod.
Our schedules have not been ourfriends so we had to reschedule
this, but excited that we wereable to get together and give
you guys this episode.
So I am Jennifer Karpis-Romain,executive Director of the
(00:43):
Transportation Marketing andSales Association, which is a
trade nonprofit educating andconnecting marketing and sales
professionals in transportationand logistics.
And welcome to On the Move.
Welcome to the show, andrew.
How are you doing today?
Speaker 2 (00:58):
I'm doing.
Well.
This is a little weird for me.
I don't often go on otherpeople's podcasts.
I'm usually the one who doesthe introduction and asks all
the questions, so this is alittle different than my usual
cadence.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Well, I'm excited for that.
I started my career injournalism, so this is the side.
I'm comfortable on it.
Definitely, when I have to goon other people's shows, it is.
It's weird being asked.
It took me a while to be likewhy are people asking me
questions?
Why do they care what I have tosay?
(01:31):
So that takes a minute, buthappy to have you and your
insights because you have beenin the industry for a long time.
So can you give us kind of yourrundown on your origin story
and how you got in the industry?
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Yeah, sure.
So I started in the industry atCoyote Logistics, a business
that my parents had founded in2006.
I was 16 years old at the timeand started working as a carrier
up.
I fell in love with it Just thecompetitive nature of the
business and how you couldreally make your own path and
(02:00):
make your own opportunity if youjust were willing to put in the
work.
And I really loved working withowner-operators.
I had a lot of guys who I dealtwith every day and they became
very close friends of mine and Irealized that it was my job to
take care of them.
And the better I took care ofthem, the more success I had and
the more success they had, andI never left.
(02:20):
So I stayed with that companyfor 10 years.
Um did every role I could andeventually kind of had the itch
to want to build a business ofmy own.
So I called up a buddy of mine,matt bogrich, and we started
molo solutions freight brokeragebased in chicago, and that was
in july of 2017.
Um, we ran that business andloved every second of it.
(02:44):
Well, I don't know about everysecond of it, but we loved a lot
of it and in 2021, we wereactually out trying to raise
money to keep building thebusiness and look for a, you
know, a partner that could helpus go from.
I think we were doing about 600million in revenue at the time
and we wanted to make it like amulti-billion dollar brokerage,
and we actually ended up meetingour best, and they wanted to
make it like a multi-billiondollar brokerage, um, and we
(03:05):
actually ended up meeting arcbest, and, and they wanted to
buy the whole thing, and so wewent through that whole deal and
um stayed around for a year anda half, uh, which wasn't really
the plan.
We were planning to stay on fora little longer, but um,
sometimes that's not how thecookie crumbles and um, so I
left that business two and ahalf years ago, with a brutal
(03:27):
non-compete, I should say, andthat is what led me to
podcasting, because podcastingisn't competing with
transportation brokers.
So I started my show, theFreight Pod, I guess about two
years ago now, and that's whatI've been doing ever since, and
along with playing golf andpickleball.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Well, amazing.
That really sums up, yeah, yourcareer.
I love when people, especiallyones who start in like a family
business, really do like workthrough all the different
pockets of the business, becauseI feel like it just speaks
volumes to the knowledge and thebreadth of information that
people have.
It's not just like, oh yeah,this is what we did, and so I
(04:12):
sat on the top.
It's like, no, I did the work,I figured it out, I worked all
the pieces and then now whatelse am I going to do with my
life than talk about freight allday, because that's what I know
and what I love.
And so, yes, now you're the hostof the Freight Pod.
So why?
It's weird for you to be on theinterview side of this, and
your podcast is known for really, you know, taking those deep
(04:34):
explorations of how logisticsinnovators forge their path,
having this so kind of similar.
This is what I like to do.
I love to interview people andhear their stories and what they
did and how they got there.
I like to do.
I love to interview people andhear their stories and what they
did and how they got there.
So why did when you decided tostart your show a couple of
years ago.
Why was that the focus for you?
Why are those the stories thatyou wanted to tell?
Speaker 2 (04:55):
That's a good question.
So I think a couple of things.
One it felt like something thatI could relate well to and
could add Like, I always amtrying to think about how, like,
(05:18):
if you're a freight broker, asa salesperson, I spent so much
time thinking about how to bedifferent, right and like,
because that's your whole job istrying to get new business and
brokerages.
There's thousands of brokersand it's so hard to stand out.
So you constantly have to askyourself that question like how
am I different than everyoneelse?
And so when I looked atpodcasting, I thought the same
(05:39):
thing.
I was like okay, there's abunch of podcasts that exist
today in the space.
How do I stand out?
And it's not like you couldbuild some technology for a
podcast.
It's not like you could buildsome network asset.
All you really have to offer isyourself and your experiences
and your curiosity and thequestions you ask and such, and
so for me it's like how am Igoing to stand out?
(06:01):
It's like how am I going tostand out?
Like you know, my journey, Ithink, is is you know, I've,
I've had this experience infreight, that, um, and in
building a business that, youknow, I think really meshes well
with the kind of people I wantto interview Um, and I think it
leads to a differentconversation than I think some
other podcasts can have, and sothat's kind of why I focused on
it and also it's interesting.
(06:22):
I think these are some I try tointerview the most interesting
people I can find um.
You know it's it's it.
It certainly didn't start as ajob um, I eventually added some
sponsors and really justcompanies that I knew and
trusted and believed in, and soI was like I'm happy to you know
, align you with my show.
Like rapido solutions group isone of them.
(06:43):
Uh, two guys who I've known fora long time and and trust and
would happily push businesstowards um.
But for me it was just like Ihadn't.
I couldn't work in the industryand I didn't want to try
something different.
Um, because I mean different inthe terms of like leaving the
industry altogether.
I know one day I will bebrokering freight again, whether
(07:03):
that's in a year or later, Idon't know but I wanted to stay
frankly relevant in the industrywith my customer base, the
companies that I'd worked withfor years, and knowing I
couldn't really work with themdirectly, I figured you know why
not try to add some value bybringing the right kind of
conversation to the table withthe kind of leaders that people
(07:24):
want to hear from?
And so you know, I've spent thebetter part of two years trying
to reach out to CEOs andfounders of logistics companies,
of technology companies, oftrucking companies, even
shippers and different levelswithin shippers.
I'm just trying to like bringas many different elements of
our industry into this kind ofenvironment I've created in the
(07:47):
FreightPod and you know, havefun conversations.
And you know, if I'm beingperfectly honest, like I love
the conversations, I hateeverything else about podcasting
.
Like as soon as we hit record, Ilove it and I love it until
we're done recording everythingbefore and after.
I can't, I don't enjoy it atall and I don't like doing.
(08:09):
I don't like the social mediaelement, I don't like any of it
I mean, I get that like.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
So one of the reasons why I started this podcast for
tmsa one I wanted a space wherewe could focus on people who are
so like are yes, one I likethat.
You're like where am Idifferent?
What can I offer that otherpeople can't?
I did the same thing.
I think it's important whenyou're doing things, to be like
what is the point of what I'mdoing and can it matter to
(08:34):
people?
So for me, I wanted people whowere associated with TMSA in
some way and we'll get to howyou are later in this interview.
But I have people who email meall the time.
They're like I have the bestperson to appear on your show.
I'm like oh, are you going tobecome a TMSA member?
No, crickets, Okay.
(08:55):
Well, like that's no.
I want to highlight people whoare members, people who are
speakers, people who are engagedin our community, because I
love elevating their voices andhave it.
Especially on the marketingside.
I found that marketers arespending so much time pushing
out their like presidents andstuff on to podcasts.
People aren't necessarilyasking them to appear on the
show.
So I've had so many people thatwhen we're done, they're like
(09:16):
that was the first podcastinterview I ever did.
I'm like, oh, I love that, LikeI love that Now you have a
space to share your expertise inyour story and people get to
know you more.
Because, yeah, when I was adirector of marketing, no, I sat
in the corner, I pushed mypresident out, I did my thing
and then we carried on.
That was actually one of thebiggest things becoming
executive director of TMS.
I'm like, oh no, I'm now.
I'm now that person that has toappear in front of the camera.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Now you're getting pushed.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Yeah, and it's a big change and so I love that and I
love that focus and, yeah, it'sthe stories.
For me, and just hearing thatvalue point people's experiences
and having different viewpointsis really great, so I like that
you focus on that stuff too,and I want to.
(10:01):
So one yes, you will be ourmoderator for our shippers panel
at executive summit this year,which is in Chicago October 22nd
through the 23rd, so I'mexcited for you to appear there
and come there.
It'll be your first TMSA event,so we're excited to.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
That's.
That's another side effect ofthe podcast, that is a positive
one is people asking me tomoderate panels.
I've never done that before orconsidered it, and in the last
two years this is I think myfourth or fifth opportunity to
moderate a panel and like, whata cool thing to do.
Like you know, instead ofhaving to be the guy who's like
(10:40):
I don't know sharing my opinions, I get to drill into like from,
in this case, google andMitsubishi and and Kehi, and
like, especially shippers, man.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Like do you know how many emails I used to?
Speaker 2 (10:51):
have to send to just talk to a shipper.
Now you're just putting me onstage with three of them, like
that's like three very, and I'vemet these guys, they're awesome
.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
I'm like yes, I love this shippers panel.
Yes, I will being able tomoderate it.
So, as an event planner, Idon't think that everyone always
thinks about how important thatmoderator seat is, because
things can really really gosideways If you don't have a
strong matter.
I also, because of my role indoing stuff like this, get asked
(11:20):
to moderate, like, yes, becauseI can direct conversation and
direct people to go or like knowwhen to be, like okay, this
person's talking a little long,let's cut it off and move on.
But not everyone can do that.
So I think it is a skill setthat you learn and so, yeah,
when you look at the podcastcommunity, like that guy, he
knows how to talk and listen.
Great.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
I'm going to ask a question that, if you don't, if
you haven't seen it, this isgoing to be super irrelevant,
but have you ever seen the show?
Curb your enthusiasm.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
There's.
There's an episode where theyare focused on, like, a dinner
table party and how they talkabout how, like it's whoever
sits in the middle seat at thedinner table, you have to like
be capable of sitting in themiddle seat, and if you don't
sit, if you're sitting in themiddle and you're not capable of
(12:10):
owning and driving theconversation, it could ruin the
whole dinner party.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
It really can.
You have to be able to focus onboth sides and yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
And I bring that up because it's like the moderator,
like my job is not to have theinsight, but if I'm, if if you
or I, as the moderator, aren'tcapable, capable of managing all
the people and navigating theconversation, driving the
conversation effectively, it'sgoing to be a bad panel.
So the moderator is such animportant role, despite the fact
that they don't have toactually provide any of the
(12:35):
insight, but if they don't dotheir job well, effectively, of
driving the dinner party, it'sgoing to be a bad party.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
So I don't know, I just think it's really
interesting, it is, and I'vestarted to enjoy doing it and uh
, yeah, I like being themoderator too, and of course you
can add like scope or flair,and a lot of times that's like.
So, like I know, I always umtalk to the people, like my
panelists, ahead of time, andyou can tell when they have a
really good point but they haveforgotten it to say it on stage,
and so to me, that's part of myjob as the moderator to like
(13:03):
cue them up to remember thatgreat point that they had to
then be able to be like yes,that's the thing, cause you
don't want them to leave thestage and be like oh man, I
forgot to say the best thing Ihad like that.
So that's, to me, part of thejob as the moderator is to like
help get them through that.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Yeah, I've done that before and it's you're.
It's really frustrating.
You walk off the stage andthere's no turning back.
You can't go back in time andsay it it's over.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
I would have sounded so smart if I would have just
been there.
So like that's.
I don't ever want my paneliststo feel that way, so I do that
and I'll think about ways tolike set them up.
So, but part of the executivesummit.
So, yes, powerhouse of ashippers panel big highlight.
I so, yes, powerhouse of ashippers panel big highlight.
I'm so excited for it.
But it really is a leadershipevent for the industry.
(13:49):
So we have the decision makersthere and I'm curious about kind
of your perspective on when wetalk about building
high-performing teams inlogistics, what do you think is
one thing that leaders overlookwhen they're building those
teams?
Speaker 2 (14:08):
is one thing that leaders overlook when they're
building those teams.
What is something that leadersoverlook when building teams?
So well, I think, well, onething I feel like people focus
on a lot is metrics, and metricsare important.
Everyone will tell you thatKPIs, I get it.
You have to set fairexpectations, like, if you don't
(14:30):
have KPIs for your team, thenit's unreasonable to think that
people are living up to, or notliving up to your expectations,
because, frankly, you haven'tset expectations.
I think the challenge, though,is when people are too focused
on KPIs and that's all thatmatters.
I think it's sometimes it's hardto see the forest through the
(14:50):
trees, and what I mean by thatis we're talking about human
beings and we're especially infreight.
It's like a high paced fast.
It's a fast paced, high energy,high stress in, at times,
chaotic business.
It's it's like a relentlessbusiness that never stops, and
people get worn out, and peopleget beat down from, like the
(15:14):
challenges they deal with everyday, and so like I think there's
an element of trust that can belost if you are too heavily
weighted into KPIs and notenough into, kind of the human
element, and like empathy, andso like one of the things that I
think we did really well atMolo was we had a lot of trust
between our, our people and ourleadership.
(15:35):
And you know people say trustand it's like you know, I think
sometimes people are like oh,foo foo.
Like, yeah, trust, you have totrust each other.
Like, yeah, okay, but if youactually want people to be
bought into, if you want peopleto perform at their best, they
have to be bought in to whatyou're doing.
They have to trust you as aleader.
They have to trust theirmanager.
They have to trust theorganization has their best
(15:56):
interests and, at the same time,the leadership has to trust the
employees.
And it's hard because takeremote work, for example it's
something that everyone wants tobe able to work from home, or
not.
I shouldn't say everyone, butthe majority of people want some
element of freedom to workremotely here and there.
(16:16):
But that's a privilege and it'sone that can easily be
manipulated or lost becausepeople take advantage of it and
so like it's hard because two orthree people who are supposed
to be working from home onFriday, on a summer day, are
actually sitting by the pool andnot doing their job, and that
(16:38):
might lose the ability foreveryone to work from home
because we realize, okay, thisis a problem.
So at the end of the day, whatI'm saying is like there are a
lot of complexities and nuanceto leading people, and if you
just super focus on KPIs andreally strict requirements, I
think you lose people.
(16:59):
I think that it's hard to buildthe kind of trust you need to
build a high-performingorganization, and so it's the
right delicate balance of trustin your team and giving them the
leash and freedom to be willingto innovate, because there's
like an element of likepsychological safety that people
have to feel like they're in aplace that they can be at their
(17:21):
best.
But if you just drill KPIs atthem all day, they're working
out of fear.
They're working out of like Ihave to hit this number.
If I don't hit this number, Iget fired next week.
And then it's less about likehow do I come up with like a
creative solution to a problem,and more how do I make sure my
manager has me meeting abenchmark that they've set for
me?
Does that make sense?
It does.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
We actually.
So this year's keynote forexecutive summit is Nicole Glenn
from Pandora, and she's goingto be talking about building
high performing teams, kind ofin this turbulent time.
But the last time we were inChicago for executive summit
2023, we actually had ourkeynote was this man named Corey
Shearer who talked about trust,and he also was like here how
(18:05):
you add trust KPIs into yourself.
So it's actually really funny.
It is such a key component andI think that I mean we've all
been in this industry and likeand at that point there was
company after like I rememberdoing like my prep call with him
.
I'm like there was companyafter like I remember doing like
my prep call with him.
I'm like there has now beenlike three to four major
companies who have gone bankruptand did not tell their
(18:27):
employees ahead of time.
It's very important foremployees to understand that
they're getting like transparentand information first, and it
is very like people in thisindustry are very like in the
fields with that kind of stuffright now, because there are
like mergers and acquisitionscoming out all the time, there's
bankruptcies, there's changes,and if your employees don't know
(18:49):
and you're if they're findingout by the news that it doesn't
feel good and they don't trustthat.
And I do think there has to bea trust between leadership and
employee and and vice versa.
So I just it was kind of funnythat you dove into that without
knowing the scope.
I was like, yeah, we reallybelieve in that.
We talk about that like weactually had a guy come and
(19:10):
speak to that because it isreally important.
Um, and I do think, likeacknowledging the kind of market
that we're in is importantbecause you can set the KPI, but
you also have to acknowledgethat maybe we're in a different
place than we thought we wouldbe, and so if they're not
hitting that Y and that's I'mspeaking at Women in Trucking's
(19:32):
Accelerate in November.
That's kind of my topic how tobuild your best team, and part
of that is like okay, what isour actual capacity?
How are we best engaging ourworkers?
Are they in their like bestzone of like things, are
passionate about things theylike and things they're good at,
but also like are we puttingtoo much on one person?
Because I feel like I mean,I've been that human who works
(19:55):
really hard and just keepsgetting more added to my plate
because they know I'll do it,but you don't want to burn out
your rock stars either, and sohow do you find that balance?
And there has to be a trustthat like, oh, you're giving
them enough to be successful butthen not overloading them
because they're picking up theslack of other people either.
So it's all.
I think it's all good.
(20:15):
There's so much to considerwhen you're building a high
performing team.
I'm fascinated by the idea oftrust KPIs.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
I need to look into trust KPIs.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
I will find his presentation and send it to you.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
I actually when I said that.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
I'm like you're going to ask me what they are, and it
was a discussion two years ago.
I don't remember them off thetop of my head.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Send it to me please, I will do my own.
I just had never thought oftrust KPIs specifically.
And I really like the idea ofkind of creating a bucket just
for that.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Yep, shout out Corey Shearer.
He was a great speaker andreally great, thoughtful,
because it is so true how muchtrust matters.
And I'm excited for NicoleGlenn to take the stage as our
keynote this year to really talkabout building those teams and
like through turbulence andthrough change and how do we
make them successful.
So I think Executive Summit isshaping up to be a great show.
(21:07):
As we talked about, you havethe shippers panel we kind of
mentioned.
We have Google, mishpishi Powerand Kihei Distributors.
So you are then that moderatorin charge of steering that
conversation with shippersspanning CPG, tech, energy.
How do you plan, if you have aplan yet, to kind of bridge
(21:28):
their unique supply chainchallenges and priorities but
still give that information toour attendees?
Speaker 2 (21:36):
So I am a master procrastinator so I can't sit
here and honestly tell you Ihave a well-developed plan for
the panel we're going to do inover a month.
But I have thought a little bitabout it and when you first
sent me the list of thesecompanies, my first instinctual
(21:57):
thought was oh my God, how am Igoing to put all these three
together?
There's nothing in common amongthese companies.
But then I really thought aboutit and, at the end of the day,
freight is freight and whilethere are completely significant
intricacies among these threecompanies that make them very,
very different, the underlyingchallenges they have are
(22:18):
probably all very similar,whether it's visibility, supply
chain resilience, sustainability, talent, like these issues are
common.
Fraud, I mean fraud is like youknow, it doesn't matter who you
are, everyone's dealing with it.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
We have a session on that, too, at Executive Summit.
We're hitting all the bigtopics, yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
So, like, I think my job as the moderator is to kind
of toe the line and highlight,you know, the differences among
these companies and allow themto talk about the things that
make them unique, because Ithink that's what an audience
wants to understand.
I think an audience absolutelywants to understand Kehi
Distributors and that foodbusiness, like what's unique to
their world.
And then we go to Google andit's going to be completely
(23:03):
different, and so, like, we wantto talk about the things that
make them different, but, at thesame time, there are those
kinds of commonalities that Ithink all of them deal with.
And, you know, risk is like a,an incredible one that, like,
each of them probably have verykind of different answers with
respect to, like, how they thinkabout risk in their supply
chain and how they navigate it.
(23:24):
But, at the same time, I betthere's commonalities among the
answers in terms of, um, kind ofwhy they're thinking about it,
the way they are right, and so,like, you might be protecting
different things, but, at theend of the day, freight is
freight and transportation istransportation.
So, um, I think there will be alot more in common that we can
(23:44):
see, but at the same time, wewant to also pull out some of
the differences, just becauseit's what makes these companies
unique and interesting.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
Yeah, I definitely think one commonality I always
see is that, and so when I wentto journalism school, the
biggest takeaway was always likeknow who your audience is.
And I just take that througheverything, no matter what I'm
doing, if I'm writing, when I'mtalking to people, when I'm
talking to my kid trying to gethim to read, you know.
Know who your audience is andwhat's going to entice them to
(24:12):
do what you want.
And I feel like I've seen a lotof logistic, sales and
marketing messages that are like, oh, we can do it all.
We can do everything.
They don't care about that.
They want to know what you cando for them.
And so I do think like hittingon all those points of how those
individual companies like whatthey need, but really like
(24:33):
that's part of it Like don'tshow up to a meeting and be like
, oh, we can handle everything,but you're not talking about how
you can actually service theCPG market, and like how you're
a differentiator there for them.
I feel like that's the kind ofstuff that I love hearing from
our shippers talking about islike this is the stuff that
matters to me, and like don't dothat all.
Like, yes, they want a partnerthat could potentially scale
(24:56):
with their business and whatthey need, but like they don't
care what you can do for othersectors.
They just want to know what youcan do for them and really
honing in on that.
So I think it'll be reallyinteresting to hear, probably,
that they've gotten that type ofmessaging.
But then what about thosedifferent sectors should we be
focusing on?
Speaker 2 (25:14):
Yes, I would piggyback off of that statement
just to say that anytime I'vespoken at a conference or, you
know, now, moderate a panel andI haven't asked you this yet,
but I will I'm going to do itnow, I guess but is to see the
attendee list in advance, andit's it's.
I almost spend as much time ormore looking at the attendee
(25:34):
list as I do the panelists, andthe reason for that is, like you
said, it's understanding theaudience and what they're
interested in, because, like youknow, I could talk to these
three folks about the thingsthat are most interesting to me,
but if the audience has nointerest, I will be looking out
to a group of 50, a hundred, 500people staring at their
fricking phones, and it is.
(25:55):
It is not fun to be on stagetalking while you look out at
either an empty audience or onethat is just completely
disengaged.
So I wholeheartedly agree withthe idea of knowing your
audience and catering to theaudience and giving them what
they're looking for.
Otherwise you won't have anaudience.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
Well, I will add that to my thanks to send to you
after this.
Thank you, anyone that'slistening to this.
If you want to check out thisawesome shipper panel and all
the other things that we'retalking about, it is October
22nd.
Through the 23rd.
You can register for ExecutiveSummit at eventstmsatodayorg and
we are offering on the movelisteners a 10% discount that
(26:34):
you can use the discount codeMOVETOSUMMIT10.
Okay, enough of my promotionalstuff about executive summit,
but I am really excited about it.
But you have been in thisindustry for a really long time
and so you have seen, like yousaid at the beginning, like I
used to beg to talk to shippersand now you're just putting me
on stage with three of them.
(26:55):
So I'm curious how you seerelationships between shippers
and carriers kind of evolvingover the next few years and what
you've seen over the past fewyears.
Ooh, just a simple, easyquestion.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Well, as a guy who's been sitting out for two and a
half years, I can't say I'vebeen engaging with shippers
often to know or see.
This is one of the benefits ofthe podcast is like trying to
just stay informed with what theheck's going on.
And it feels like if you wereto look at any two and a half
year window in the history ofour industry like where has
there been the most change?
I think we're looking at itlike this is the one that has
(27:31):
had the most change.
So I I don't love being on thesidelines for this part, um, and
I'm specifically thinking abouttechnology.
So I think there's anopportunity for a number of
things to happen and ultimatelythere's not one answer right,
because not all shippers behavethe same way.
Not all brokers behave the sameway.
(27:52):
So I had plenty of shippersthat were super
relationship-focused throughoutour time together, and I had
plenty who were just all theycared about was the math and the
numbers and how they could getthe cheapest cost of
transportation.
And then I had, you know, mostof them were somewhere in the
middle.
What we're seeing the mostchange in is technology, and
what I mean by that is, you know, there's plenty of stuff about
(28:15):
AI and automation, butconnectivity and, frankly, like,
I think of a company, likewhat's it called Good Ship.
I don't know if you're familiarwith this company, but their
role is a technology platformthat sits on top of a TMS and in
(28:35):
doing so, it becomes a bridgefor communication between
brokers, carriers and theshipper itself, and what you now
have is a way for shippers andbrokers to talk and carriers to
talk to each other within theTMS in a way that they never
have before.
So what does that allow for?
It just allows for a heightenedand enhanced relationship.
(28:57):
Where there's just such ahistory of enhanced relationship
, where, like there, there'sjust such a history of you know
how many qbrs I've sat in, whereyou know that's our formal
engagement with a shipper, andonce a quarter we go and meet
with them.
They put some numbers in frontof us and say, hey, this is how
you're doing, and I'm like, wait, no, I don't think I'm doing
that.
Well, these are my numbers forhow I'm doing, and there's a
little bit of disagreement there.
(29:18):
Um, and then we waste you know,I don't know half of a meeting
talking about it, and it's justnot the most efficient way to
have a relationship versus atechnology now is available
where, at any point in time, wecould be artic or communicating
with one another and gettingaligned on our metrics and our
numbers, so that when we do gomeet in person, we're not
(29:39):
wasting time and we're alreadylike 10 steps ahead of where we
would be.
This is just one example, andI'm sure there are plenty of
other companies out there doingsimilar things or different
things but also enhancing theopportunity for relationships to
develop and get better.
So the answer is, I think thatshippers and brokers and
carriers.
The answer is, I think thatshippers and brokers and
(30:00):
carriers, like, there is theopportunity for them to do more
better together, leveragingtechnology in a way they haven't
in the past.
But, like anything, there'salso a way for shippers and
brokers to leverage probablymore so, shippers to leverage
technology in a way that, like,removes some of the relationship
(30:21):
.
I mean, that's some of what ishappening with technology and
you could argue it the other way.
But you know, when you look atsome of these systems that are
coming out whether it's the AIvoice companies like Happy Robot
or Fleetworks or Clone Ops wenow have AI talking directly to
the carrier to book loads.
We now have AI talking directlyto the carrier to book loads.
(30:43):
There's I'm I'm hard pressed tobe sold that that's going to
improve relationships betweenthe carrier and the broker
because, like you know, I knowthere's a movie, I think called
her, where this guy has arelationship with the AI, but,
like it's, it's not likesomething we want to look
forward to.
Is is being, you know, is arelationship with a robot, you,
(31:06):
I believe this will always be ahuman business in the sense that
humans are the ones drivingdecisions, and relationships are
going to matter forever, buttechnology should be able to
enable them in a way thatdoesn't take away from that, and
I don't think anyoneopportunity to.
(31:27):
But I think today, where thistechnology is, it may allow for
brokers to do more with less,and what I mean by that is, if I
deploy clone ops into my system, I may be able to operate with
I don't know 30% less headcountto execute my business, with I
(31:49):
don't know 30% less headcount toexecute my business, but I
don't know that anybody yet hasa solution that won't detract
somewhat from the relationshipand that may not be the
technology's job.
It may be the broker.
It probably is.
I'm thinking out loud, so allowme to just do this, but it
really is.
I think, the broker's job tobring in the technology and then
(32:12):
craft your people around it ina way that allows the
relationship not to diminish.
But the simple way I think a lotof companies will do it wrong
is just to throw the technologyinto the system, see efficiency
in that like loads get coveredwith fewer people and then call
that a success.
But what they won't see is overtime there will be diminished
(32:38):
returns in their relationshipswith the carriers because
carriers will be less loyal tothem because there's not a
person that they're dealing withevery day who they feel loyal
to.
I have carriers owner-operatorsthat to this day I could call
right now and having not bookedthem on a load in 10, 15 years,
and if I asked them for a favorthey'd do it in a second.
And if they asked me for afavor, I would do it in a second
(32:59):
.
That's kind of what the benefitor beauty of a relationship is
is people who want to work foreach other and look out for each
other and take care of eachother.
I don't see how you get thatwith technology, but yeah,
long-winded answer, hopefullysome of it made sense.
Speaker 1 (33:14):
Well, it did, and it was great because my next
question was talking about liketrends and technology, so you
just answered both questions inone.
Two for one, special Two for one.
And I'm like, wow, me andAndrew stand on very similar
soap boxes when we getpassionate about stuff, because
this is something I talk aboutall the time.
Like you're human, like Ibelieve our technologies AI and
(33:35):
not should be able to equip ourhumans to do the human things
better, to be able to beempathetic, to be able to talk
to people when things go wrong,if the load gets lost, freight
fraud, all that stuff yourcomputer isn't going to make
your customer feel better whenthings like that happen.
Your humans will, and so I so,like when you were going, I'm
(33:56):
like, yeah, like this is what Italk about too.
Like I like tools like sentimentanalysis.
If you could put on my phone,every time it rings or text me,
what kind of mood the person onthe other side is before I talk
to them.
Give me that tool, because thatthat you know what I mean.
Like if a customer is callingand you're like, hey, this
person sounds chipper versusthis person wants to bite your
(34:16):
head off, let me be prepared forthat, because that will then
help me move, and I am a prettysane human.
I like to believe, but nothingmakes me more irate than when I
call and I have to click eightbuttons to talk to the person
that can actually help me.
And so and that is what I feellike some of these tools are
making people do, and that'slike when you're talking about
(34:38):
like the humans are being takenout of that equation, and they
do.
Yes, will that load get bookedfaster?
Maybe, but what happens ifsomething goes wrong?
And how quickly can ourcustomers get to a human to be
able to fix the problem?
And those are the types of KPIsand that we need to be paying
attention to too, because if wedon't and we only think about
(35:00):
the front end, then I absolutelyagree that we're going to be
losing so much of that.
I feel like we could do thisinterview for another like four
hours, and nobody would listento us, but I think it's valuable
.
I hope someone's listening butregardless.
No, I think it's all good and Ithink that these are the
(35:21):
conversations people should behaving, because there are so
many technology tools out thereand how are we using them, how
are we using them the best thatwe can and how are we getting
roi from them?
Like I know, especially on thesales and marketing side of
things, we get asked thosethings all the time Okay, why am
I paying for that?
What is the value of that?
And we need to be able toanswer those questions and I do
(35:41):
think for me, the best ROI arethe ones that are allowing our
people to actually be moreefficient and to be able to
handle the relationship stuffmore, like if we can focus on
the relationships more and theputting in like data points less
.
That's the type of solutionsthat I'm personally most
interested in for our teams youand me both Similar soapbox, so
(36:04):
anyway, yeah, I jumped off mineand you jumped right on, yeah
perfect.
I was like, yeah, good, my turn.
But this takes us to the lastof our interview.
Jumped off mine and you jumpedright on yeah, perfect.
I was like, yeah, good, my turn.
Um, but this takes us to thelast of our interview.
This is a question I askeverybody who comes on the show.
So, um, if you could go back intime and advise a younger
andrew anything, personally orprofessionally, when would you
go back to and what would youtell them?
(36:24):
I know it's my favoritequestion.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
You ask this to everybody.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Every single person who I've ever interviewed on
this show, and even like beforeI started the official podcast
and did LinkedIn, lives for TMSA.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
Yep, I should have watched an old show.
I would have been prepared forthis question I don't know when,
so what would I say to myself?
And if you?
Speaker 1 (36:49):
could go back in time and advise a younger version of
yourself, and it could be apersonal thing or a professional
thing.
What would you go back to?
Speaker 2 (36:57):
I mean, I'm such an idiot throughout my life that
there's so many things I wish Ihad learned a long time ago.
Um sorry, I don't want to justspit something out.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
I'm thinking, trying to just I want to give you a
good answer?
It doesn't have to be profoundit can just be okay.
Speaker 2 (37:22):
Okay, yeah, I mean, I think learning to manage my
emotions better younger wouldhave been would have served me a
lot better, I think.
What I've learned in life, Ithink, is that the difference
between someone who effectivelycan manage their emotions and
(37:45):
someone who can't is massive,and it shows up everywhere in
your life.
Not to get political at all,and and and this is not my point
in bringing this up, but youknow, we're seeing there was
there was a political, there wasthe death of Charlie Kirk last
week and the there's a lot ofemotion around that, regardless
(38:10):
of what side you're on, andthere are a lot of people
speaking out now and sayingthings, and they're not always
necessarily the nicest things,but it's a very emotional thing,
and there are a lot of peoplewho are losing their jobs now,
and, whether you agree ordisagree that they should, the
reality is it's happening.
Whether you agree or disagreethat they should, the reality is
(38:33):
it's happening.
And what I'm noticing now is, aweek later, people are still
saying things and still losingtheir jobs, and so my point is,
like I understand, the first dayof it happening, people said
some things that they wouldlater regret and then they lost
their job and that's unfortunate.
But a week later people arestill saying things and then
they're like surprised thatthey're losing their job and
(38:54):
it's like, okay, well, we justwatched a bunch of other people
lose their job for saying thesethings.
You're reacting so emotionally,it's costing you your job.
And my point in all of this isthat, like, as a society, I
don't think that many, I don'tthink most, I don't think think
the majority of people are veryeffective at managing their
emotions and it's why we seethese kind of explosive
(39:15):
outbursts from people all thetime.
And then there areramifications and consequences
of those explosive outbursts andthat's a critical thing.
And to get away from that partof it and to go just to like
working in transportation, whichis a highly stressful business,
to go just to like working intransportation, which is a
highly stressful business.
(39:41):
I remember there were variouspoints in my leadership journey
where I am deeply ashamedsending to my team out of
frustration when we werescrewing up for a very large
customer that I personally helda relationship with and my team
was working their butts off totry to make it work.
But there was an issue and itgot screwed up and it was a
(40:03):
mistake, but it was a Fridaynight and I wasn't in the right
mind space and I wasn't managingmy emotions effectively and I
just went off on my team andthey didn't deserve that.
And so the lesson is like youknow, take a breath, take a beat
before you react to things anddo the work to understand that,
(40:24):
like, anger is a complex emotion.
It's a healthy emotion to have,it's a normal emotion, but how
you manage it is the differencebetween being a good leader and
a complex emotion.
It's a healthy emotion to have,it's a normal emotion, but how
you manage it is the differencebetween being a good leader and
a bad one.
And I think it's not justleadership, it's how you show up
in your relationships with yourfriends, with your spouse, with
your siblings, your family,your parents, whatever, and it's
(40:46):
it's one of the most importantthings in your life is like how
you show up in the world and howyou manage when things happen
to you and how you react tothings.
So, um, it's not something thatI learned at an early age and
it's not something I worked onuntil the last few years, and so
the advice I would give myselfat an early age at 16 would be
(41:06):
like really focus onunderstanding your emotions and
how to manage them in a way thatis not reactive and not
destructive.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
I think that's great advice and I'm going to show
this clip to my son, who's eight, and we had this whole
conversation last night about.
I was like I want you to knowthat it is okay to have emotions
and feelings, because we do,and shutting them down doesn't
really help anything, but how wereact to those feelings and we
(41:37):
can't control other people, wecan only control ourselves, and
I do.
I think it shows up everywhere,personally and professionally,
in how we handle those and Iagree, taking a breath.
We all have that email, we allhave that moment, but we didn't
act our best selves and so beingable to navigate through that I
think is great.
So I like that advice and I amI never.
I mean, my son gets boredpretty easily on things that I
(41:59):
show him.
He thinks it's very cool thatI'm on youtube, but he I'm not
like what he watches on youtube.
Yeah, um, you're not minecraft.
No, oh my god, no, no, I'm notnot um, but he does.
He tells people that his mom ison youtube and then they get
excited, but he's like, but shedoes this, and then my niece
will be like anja, your officewas very messy behind you.
(42:20):
Can you please clean it beforeyou go on camera again?
I'm like, can you like justlisten to what I'm saying, not
how my office looks, but wellanyways it was a pleasure to
have you on the show.
I'm very excited for you to cometo Executive Summit Again.
You can register for ExecutiveSummit eventstmsatodayorg, and
listeners of the show can usethe code MOVETOSUMMIT10.
(42:43):
I'm excited to have you andjust yeah, our lineup touches on
all of the stuff we reallytalked about today, from the
shippers panel to leadingthrough turbulent times, a case
study on freight fraud, all thestuff in between.
So excited to see you nextmonth and thank you for coming
on the show today.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
Thank you.
It's great being here.
I look forward to the summit.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Perfect.
Have a good one you too.
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