6:5 - Camp One Clap 2024: Day 5
For notes and details about the episode, check out the website here:
https://www.oneclapspeechanddebate.com/post/camp-one-clap-2-episode-5-whitney-brooks-and-her-journey-from-competitive-champion-to-coaching-men
Join us for a conversation with Cheyenne Central assistant coach Whitney Brooks as she shares her unique perspective on navigating a world of Speech and Debate competition, coaching, and, yes, hypothetical apocalypses. Whitney opens up about the emotional rollercoaster of coaching, the highs of student successes, and the challenges of seeking validation from within rather than external accolades. Whitney shares how her coaching philosophy, rooted in prioritizing student needs and adhering to core values, has evolved over time.
Feel free to follow along as she navigates the world at: https://genuineknockoff.substack.com/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Lyle Wiley (00:10):
Well, hey, campers, it's another beautiful day here
at the Clapocalypse.
You've discovered day five ofCamp One Clap Two on the One
Clap Speech and Debate podcast,and we're in for an awesome
guest today here on the podcast.
Cheyenne Central assistantcoach Whitney Brooks is here to
help us survive in theclapocalypse, right after she
drinks her coffee and plays hergames.
But we'll get to that.
(00:30):
I'm your camp director and hostof the One Clap Speech and
Debate podcast, lyle Wiley.
I hope everyone is ready toface any horrors that might
stand in their way to be able toshare their voices with
confidence and joy this season.
Quick reminder check the OneClap socials for today's social
media challenge.
I really loved all thisengagement from competitors and
coaches on all those challengesso far.
(00:51):
You're getting me excited forthe upcoming year.
It's pretty great.
Let's learn more about ourguest on today's show, whitney
Brooks.
Whitney is excited to join CampOne Clap for the first time this
year.
In her three years competing onthe Wyoming Speech and Debate
Circuit, she became a bit of aphenomenon, racking up
accomplishments, includingearning her quadrupie, three
(01:12):
qualifications to nationals, twoindividual state championships,
breaks at multiple nationallevel tournaments and, the
greatest achievement of all,perfecting the Just Dance
routine for Rasputin.
She has now coached for thepast two years at Cheyenne
Central, earning her firstCoaching Excellence Award and
coaching many nationalqualifiers, state champions and
all-around awesome people alongthe way.
(01:32):
Whitney is a zealous fan ofDiet Coke, krusty, little Rot
Dogs, the Mountains and allthings Chapel Roan.
Although she possesses very fewpractical skills to avoid an
apocalypse, she sure has a lotof heart.
So feel free to follow Whitneyalong as she navigates the world
at GenuineKnockoffsubstackcomthat's Genuine Knockoff at
(01:54):
Substack.
Her writing is great.
You should totally check it out.
All right, I think it's time tojump right into my interview
with Whitney Brooks.
Welcome to Camp.
One Clap to the Clapocalypse.
Whitney Brooks, welcome backactually Welcome back to One
Clap.
It's great to have you here.
Whitney Brooks (02:13):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
It's great to be here.
Lyle Wiley (02:16):
I'm glad you're here because you can help us
navigate the Clapocalypse, whichis a really scary thing that
we're all trying to figure out,um, what it even is actually.
And uh, first, everything we'regonna do is like talk about
fears.
Uh, what's your favorite scarystory?
Could be like a movie or a bookor a spoken story, like a
(02:36):
campfire story.
Whitney Brooks (02:37):
Could be anything what's your favorite
scary story so, just as a bit ofbackground, as a kid I was like
such a scaredy cat I did notinteract at all with like horror
or scary stories or anything.
And then, just like in the pastcouple years, I've started to
kind of get into it.
So, uh, the impetus for thatwas actually buffy the vampire
(03:01):
slayer, which is objectivelylike not that scary.
But I started watching it inhigh school because I was going
through this phase like 90s,early 2000s trashy TV and I
loved it.
So then I started kind ofgetting more into horror.
So my favorite one that I'vewatched recently is Midsommar.
(03:21):
I finally watched it afterpeople telling me forever that I
needed to, and it was reallygood.
I really liked it.
I know lots of people have lotsof thoughts on it, but I enjoyed
it.
But I also love Anything byShirley Jackson.
All of her novels and shortstories really phenomenal.
But yeah, I mean any scarystory in the right environment,
(03:44):
I think is the key part of it.
Like you got to be by campfire,got some marshmallows, got some
spooky lighting, that's theperfect scary story, right there
.
Lyle Wiley (03:54):
That's some good stuff.
Buffy is like I mean, you know,I want to say underrated, but
like I don't, I don't know ifthat's like that pretty popular,
right, like buffy's always beenpretty popular.
But yeah but still sort of likeunderrated um as like a pop
sort of vampire tv show, becausewe I had took a vampire's class
(04:17):
for in my master's program andwe talked about buffy a lot and
I think that, yeah, has a lotmore interesting stuff going on
than people give it credit forum yeah, it has some good stuff.
John, sweden, knew what he wasdoing yeah it's, it's intriguing
, and then you know, uh,midsummer is is a really good,
like a really beautiful movie ina weird way like yeah I love
(04:38):
some of astor's transitionsespecially.
A lot of folks have talkedabout that movie on the podcast
like so I don't know a favoriteout there, cool, uh.
But yeah, we have always livedin the castle is really great.
Um, yes, shirley jackson.
Um, yes, very spooky storythere, yeah, yeah.
So some good choices.
I like good choices.
I am interesting to hear aboutyour thoughts on how long you
(05:03):
might last after, like, somesort of post-apocalyptic
situation where we have somesort of event like a zombie
apocalypse or something.
Uh, do you, do you feel likeyou would be a survivor on a
scale of one to ten?
How good of a chance ofsurvival you think you might
have?
You have any skills that youbring to the table here?
Whitney Brooks (05:20):
so I'm not sure about skills, but I do have like
some just kind of a sheer dumblook.
I think I have a pretty goodshot because somehow magically
my grandfather managed to keep ahold of his grandparents
homestead, like out in themiddle of nowhere in Wyoming,
(05:43):
and so there's like fifteen,1500 acres, which is just a
beautiful gift for my family tobe able to hold on to that.
But there's nothing out there.
It's like 25 minute drive tothe nearest neighbors.
So I think if I just poppedover there, like I just kind of
lived off the land, like I thinkI would have a pretty good shot
(06:03):
of just kind of avoidingeverything.
I don't think I have the skillsto like fight back, but I think
my flight response could bepretty, pretty strong there.
And my grandfather stockpiledcanned food and so there's like
40 years worth of chili up therewhich I could live off of for a
while in the apocalypse.
Lyle Wiley (06:24):
It's like going to destroy your digestive system
but you might make it a longtime and that's that's.
That's.
That sounds like a pretty likedecent survival sort of
situation.
Maybe I don't know, so you havelike survival skills, but in
terms of like conflict, if itgot scary and you had to like
(06:46):
try to like fight folks orwhatever, yeah, Probably not
ending well for me.
Let's just hope it never comesto that.
Whitney Brooks (06:54):
Yeah, exactly, let's just forget it, just don't
think about it.
Lyle Wiley (06:57):
Most of the speech and debate folks I've talked to
don't feel great about theirchances of survival.
Many have said, you know well,I have communication skills,
like maybe I could talk my wayout of it or whatever.
But yeah, not I just, I'm justhoping that maybe we can use our
communication skills to helpprevent it from happening,
hopefully, yes, yeah, let's be alittle more proactive, maybe
yeah.
(07:18):
Yeah, um, so I think maybe we'vetalked about this a little bit
before in the past, whitney, butI want to hear a little bit
about your speech and debate.
Origin story How'd you getstarted in this world?
Why'd you stick around?
Whitney Brooks (07:30):
Yeah.
So I was a little bit of alater joiner.
I didn't join right off the batwhen I got to high school.
But when I first started highschool I was really involved in
theater.
So I was doing all the shows atmy school my freshman year and
at that point in time thetheater director was also the
(07:50):
speech and debate coach.
So the fall of my sophomoreyear I was the lead in this like
school play.
It was a super heavy play.
If you've ever heard of amonster calls, especially on
down on Monster Calls,especially on Dowd, that's what
we were doing.
Yeah, very intense for like 15year olds.
(08:11):
But my theater director slashspeech and debate coach was like
, hey, you're doing pretty wellwith this, come be a humor kid
on my speech team.
So I joined the team.
There was a lot of overlap withthe kids between theater and
speech.
So I already had some friendsinvolved in it and I joined and
(08:32):
I kind of never looked back.
And then only then did I realizethat my mom had been in speech
and debate for a while when shewas in high school.
She absolutely loved it and Idon't know how, I'd never heard
of that before.
But then I learned about it andshe did extemp.
So I was like I guess I'll doextemp now and yeah.
(08:52):
Then I kind of bounced aroundall the events doing this and
that and I just really loved it.
And as I was graduating highschool, one of our assistant
coaches was on the way out.
She had some life changes andhad to move to a different place
and my head coach was like Iguess you could give this a shot
(09:13):
.
And I was like sure, I'll tryit and found out that I loved
coaching even more than I lovedcompeting.
So I've been around ever since,I guess.
Lyle Wiley (09:23):
It's kind of trapped you and never let go.
Whitney Brooks (09:26):
Yeah, exactly.
Lyle Wiley (09:29):
So your coaching situation?
You've been going to school atthe University of Wyoming,
laramie right.
And then helping coach at ShineCentral.
Yes, so a lot of like commutingkind of things for you.
Yes, commuting kind of thingsfor you yes, a lot of driving
which has its benefits and itsdrawbacks.
Whitney Brooks (09:50):
I mean, I am hi.
I have become such a podcastgirl so I love having my little
time, listen to my littlepodcasts, listen to some
audiobooks, like, just get someme time when I'm on the road,
but in the winter it's notalways the most fun, for sure.
Lyle Wiley (10:08):
Yeah, it's kind of stressful to drive on spooky
roads, but what are some of yourfavorite podcasts?
What are some of the ones youlike to listen to?
Whitney Brooks (10:16):
I lately have been listening to Rehash, which
is like these two random girlsthat yap about pop culture
phenomena that we all kind offorgot about, that they want to
revisit.
I really liked that.
One Stuff you're wrong about isa pretty good one that I've
been enjoying.
(10:37):
I'm kind of all over the place.
I'll listen to like one episodeof a million different podcasts
if I'm interested in the topic.
So that's cool, yeah, that'swell, and of course, one clap
well that one was implied.
Lyle Wiley (10:51):
Yeah, everyone I've assumed that if you're a human
and listen to content, thenyou're listening to one clap,
I'm sure exactly I was gonna ask.
Whitney Brooks (11:02):
If you're into podcasts, have you ever thought
about like You're listening toone clap?
I'm sure?
Exactly Number one on thecharts, if you're into podcasts.
Lyle Wiley (11:07):
Have you ever thought about starting your own
podcast, whitney?
Whitney Brooks (11:14):
Because I would totally listen to this.
I mean, I have certainlythought about it.
I am a prolific yapper and Ithink I could put those skills
to use, maybe rapper, and Ithink I could put those skills
to use maybe, but I just don'tknow like what I would talk
about, or you know, finding yourniche is kind of difficult.
So I think I'm waiting toreally find something where I
feel like I could just go.
Lyle Wiley (11:36):
Yeah, you're, you're kind of a good example of
someone who has, like just anexplosion of interests, because
you're, you have a lot of likeinterests and you kind of go
deep on a lot of them, right,cause you're really into music,
right, you're a big music person, you're a big speech and debate
person.
But then your areas of studyyou really deep dive in those as
well you like to write.
Whitney Brooks (11:57):
Yeah, you have a lot of interest.
Yeah, I'm kind of all over theplace, but I think sometimes
that's the way to do it.
Lyle Wiley (12:05):
Yeah, I'm kind of all over the place, but I think
sometimes that's the way to doit.
Yeah, no, that's beautiful, butI guess when you think about a
focused podcast it might getkind of tricky to figure out
what that looks like.
Whitney Brooks (12:11):
Yeah, exactly.
Lyle Wiley (12:13):
Do you like film too ?
Are you a movie buff?
Whitney Brooks (12:16):
You know, sometimes I mean I love watching
movies and thinking about themand talking about them, but
that's kind of more of a recentdevelopment.
So I mean I'm missing some ofthe classics and I'm starting to
work my way through them.
I think I'm probably just nevergoing to watch Pulp Fiction
(12:37):
because everybody thatrecommends it to me is like
super obnoxious about it.
Maybe that's just my experience.
Is like super obnoxious aboutit.
Maybe that's just my experience, uh, but some of the other ones
.
Lyle Wiley (12:51):
I'm working my way through.
You know it is funny how filmaficionados do kind of have this
like weird, like oh, you haveto see this film or else you're
not a true film buff or whateveryou know so it's really great
about the godfather, yeah fulldisclosure.
I I do think apocalypse now ismaybe one of the greatest movies
(13:12):
ever but the godfather movies Ijust I don't know like the
gangster stuff.
I know technically they're greator whatever, but it's just kind
of painful for me, not reallymy, really my bag yeah, and that
you know, that's okay I hope so.
Whitney Brooks (13:26):
Thanks thanks for the affirmation, whitney.
I appreciate that of course I'mhere to be your yes man today.
Lyle Wiley (13:32):
Yes, I like it.
Um so uh, we've already goneover some of this ground, but of
course you were a greatcompetitor at cheyenne central
uh, especially, like you know, astate champion in oratory twice
uh state champ, once in oratory, once in drama drama, that's
right.
Whitney Brooks (13:49):
Yeah, yeah, which I forget about sometimes,
because I only did drama forlike that year that I kind of
dipped out the drama dip.
Lyle Wiley (13:58):
The famous drama dip , yeah, yeah, drama's lovely but
also heavy.
So, um, yeah, so, two-timestate champion at Cheyenne
Central High School Prettyamazing.
Were you part of the statechampionship team as well?
You were right.
Whitney Brooks (14:12):
I was.
That was my senior year, so Iwas pretty happy to be part of
that as team president.
Yeah, lovely way to go outhonestly.
Lyle Wiley (14:23):
Yeah, you were team president and now you're a team
president and now and then nowyou're coaching, of course, and
we talked about that but Ithat's like uh, that is not an
easy transition and it's it'sgot some challenges uh to go
from, even from team captainslash team president to uh
coaching.
I mean I know there's overlap,like that's a big step with a
(14:46):
lot of moving pieces, and you'vealso coached two years now
through a coaching change and soyou've had some really unique
challenges.
I think, and I just think it'dbe interesting to talk to you
about you know some of thosechallenges of coming back to
coach with a team that you'refamiliar with and then you know
know what you enjoy aboutcoaching so far, but maybe some
of the things that, like that,you've had to figure out in
(15:10):
order to enjoy coaching and whatyou like to coach right now.
I know you're coaching a lot ofdifferent events, but what you
coach and what you enjoy.
So, yeah, I'll just give yousome time to chat about your
coaching experience yeah, forsure I.
Whitney Brooks (15:22):
I love talking this.
All of my friends at collegeare so sick of hearing about
speech and mate all the timethey're like we get it, dude,
leave us alone.
But yeah, I mean, for me, like Icame back to coach immediately
the fall, right after Igraduated, which is not
something that my school hadreally done before In the past.
(15:44):
You know, there was kind of awaiting period of like hey, get
at least one or two years outand then come back when you've
got a little more distance.
But I was kind of the onlyperson that was interested and
so they were like I guess you'regoing to go for it.
And I don't know if I wouldrecommend that path for
(16:08):
everybody, because I mean, therewere a lot of challenges,
there's a lot of boundarysetting that has to happen kind
of right off the gate, in a waythat maybe older, more
experienced coaches wouldn'thave to do, because there is
that kind of awkward thing oflike we used to be teammates and
now we're transitioning intothis relationship of like coach
(16:29):
and student and there are newthings that have to come along
with that, like what are therules about social media?
Or like people that alreadyhave your phone number, and like
what do we talk about, evenoutside of practice, in practice
, like how does all of this work?
And figuring all of that out,while also trying to figure out
just the basics of like, how doI coach these things.
(16:52):
It's definitely a lot.
With that being said, I think itwas a really great experience
for me.
I don't regret doing it.
I don't know if I wouldrecommend it for everybody, but
I don't regret it and I thinkthat I learned a lot about
myself.
I gained a lot of skills that Idon't think I would have gained
(17:13):
otherwise.
I mean, I definitely have hadto kind of learn to ride the
line between learning how togain respect and authority
without kind of going off thedeep end of, like
authoritarianism, which is areally important skill to have
for any leader, and I kind ofhad to learn that in an
(17:36):
interesting way, being kind ofthrown into the deep end, kind
of had to learn that in aninteresting way, being kind of
thrown into the deep end.
Uh, and then also, a challengethat you wouldn't necessarily
expect is to kind of there's alot of resetting your
expectations that you have to gothrough because as a competitor
, I mean I'm not that far outfrom it.
I remember what it's like yourcoaches do something that you
(17:58):
don't love and you're like, oh,if I was the coach, I would do
it this way and this way andeverything would be perfect and
there would be no problems.
And I understand everythingcompletely.
And it's really easy to thinkthat when you're not in that
position and then you kind oftake over as the coach and you
have to do a lot of like.
Okay, maybe this isn't as easyas I thought it was.
(18:19):
Some of these changes areharder to implement or
impossible to implement, givenall of the restrictions that
exist out there, and so there'sdefinitely a lot of like you go
into it thinking that you havethis experience and you're going
to have it all figured out andthen you don't, which is a
lesson everybody has to learneventually.
(18:40):
But I just had to learn thatkind of right away.
As for other challenges, I meanI this is kind of a silly one,
but my first year coaching I gotmistaken for a competitor at
like every tournament, at leastonce or twice, which I just
think is now.
(19:00):
I think it's kind of funny, butat the time I used to get kind
of annoyed by it because I waslike not even wearing a suit,
dude.
But yeah that, maybe that'sjust me.
Lyle Wiley (19:13):
Did you ever have a hard time getting into like the
hospitality rooms and stuff?
Like people like, hey, this isjust for coaches.
Whitney Brooks (19:21):
You know, that actually did happen to me once
my first year coaching atdistricts.
I I think it was mostly just meI was too scared that they were
going to kick me out.
So the first couple of times Iwent in there I made my head
coach at the time go in with meso that everybody was like, oh,
(19:42):
she's fine.
And then I would kind of likesay hi to the coaches.
I knew People were like, oh,there we go, like we get what's
happening here.
But I was very aware ofconstantly having like an ID
badge or some sort ofidentification on me Almost all
the time.
(20:02):
That proved that I was not justa high schooler wandering
around the halls of this highschool, you know.
Lyle Wiley (20:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You're probably going to haveto deal with this for a while,
honestly, so.
Whitney Brooks (20:15):
Yeah, probably I .
My outfit game has gotten a lotstronger though, so I think
that helps.
I've got like the coachingoutfits kind of down, turns out
puffer vests.
That's the secret.
Lyle Wiley (20:27):
Everybody's like oh, they're wearing a puffer vest,
They've got to be a coach.
Whitney Brooks (20:31):
Yep, that's just like the coach fit, apparently,
so it's worked out well for me.
Lyle Wiley (20:36):
It's a good trick.
It's people listening.
That'll help them out.
Yeah, what's been.
What's been the thing like whatdo you love most about coaching
?
Or like what is the mostenjoyable part for you?
Whitney Brooks (20:48):
Yeah, for me, I think, just the whole experience
of getting to like mentor andteach that's just something that
I've discovered for myself.
I really love that.
I didn't think I would love asmuch as I did.
And I mean I tell my studentsthis all the time, like we care
(21:10):
about them as competitors, yes,but we care about them as people
and as human beings first.
And so for me, getting to beable to kind of be that person
in their lives where they'relike how do I register for my
classes?
How do I like apply to college?
Hey, can you read over myscholarship essay?
Like those little things, evenoutside of just speech and
(21:32):
debate, coaching have been someof the most rewarding things for
me.
Just getting to kind of be thatperson that someone can turn to
and be like what am I doingwith my life, and being able to
tell them like hey, everybody iswondering that nobody knows the
answer, like it's okay, take adeep breath.
I really love that.
And then something that actuallywas originally kind of a
(21:57):
challenge that has turned out tobe one of my favorite parts is
kind of learning to take a stepback.
I think that as competitors, Imean there's a lot of this like
external validation.
That's going on right.
You're getting feedback all thetime.
I mean, if you're doing well,you're getting like big, shiny
(22:18):
trophies that you get to takehome and show your parents and
be like these are awesome.
And then you start coaching andit's a lot less of that.
And at first I mean it was kindof a difficult transition for me
just because I was like am Idoing well?
Like nobody's telling me thatI'm doing well, so therefore I
must not be doing well.
(22:38):
And it's realizing that it'smore about like the internal
validation of you know, I'm outof practice and a student is
like struggling with somethingand then we kind of work through
it and I'm like okay, these arethe moments where like that's
how I find out I'm doing well islike seeing these students do
well and so learning to kind ofnot take that credit for
(23:01):
yourself and like acknowledgingthat this is about them now.
At first that was one of thosekind of tricky transitions for
me, but I actually really loveit Just getting to like be at an
award ceremony and like my.
Again, my students make fun ofme because I'm a little
emotional sometimes and like atdistricts and state I of me,
because I'm a little emotionalsometimes and, like at districts
(23:21):
and state, I'm always a littleteary-eyed and I'm like I'm just
so proud of you guys but, likethat really is the.
The awesome moments for me islike when that kid that has had
a really tough season finally,you know, breaks into finals and
gets to stand up on that stage.
I'm always just like, oh, oh,my goodness.
Lyle Wiley (23:39):
You know, oh yeah, those are lovely moments.
Um yeah, Validation is a hardlike it's a.
It's a very difficult thing forteachers and coaches to uh
which you, which you step awayfrom the role of competitor into
the coaching spot.
It is difficult to figure outhow to feel validated, which
(23:59):
probably requires a lot of like,really, you know, clear, like,
confidence in yourself, lovingyourself, feeling good about
yourself in a general sense,because the hard thing about
kids is that they're lovely butthey're not going to give you
validation for almost anythingLike.
it's just not really the way itworks yeah.
(24:19):
Yeah, yeah, but it's it's notreally the way it works.
Like, yeah yeah, yeah, um, butit's also you got a chance to
work with some cool othercoaches.
Um, sounds like you got to dosome debate, um, coaching and
stuff, some some, maybe someevents that you're familiar with
but maybe not like as confidentin or whatever.
But like, what was that like todo events that you maybe
weren't as like confident in?
Whitney Brooks (24:39):
Yeah, I mean I coached at least a little bit of
basically everything this year.
My team doesn't do policy butwe do every other event and so I
was helping out at least alittle bit with every other
event and it was really a lot offun for me.
I mean it was a lot of growthas a person and as a teacher, as
(25:03):
a coach, uh, because my firstyear coaching I was just doing
the platform stuff and a littlebit of Congress, uh, maybe a lot
of bit of Congress, but likethat was kind of my niche but
like that was kind of my nichemy first year.
And so I competed in Interp andCongress and then like a tiny
(25:24):
little bit of debate when I wasin high school but I'd kind of
stepped away from that for alittle bit.
So it was really fun this yearactually to kind of step back
into the world of Interp alittle bit more and like getting
to block things out again andwork on characterization and
like I love the creative aspectsof interp where I can be like
(25:45):
hey, hold on, like this would bereally funny if we did this
here, and like this might have abe a really hard-hitting
emotional moment if we do thishere.
That kind of creativebrainstorming, like
collaborative aspect with thestudents was really great,
because a lot of what we do inplatform is like the student
writes something out and then weread it and we're like cool,
(26:08):
change this, this, this, Ireally like this, this, this.
And it's a little sometimesless of that like super creative
energy in the moment.
So I really loved getting to dothat with Interp.
And then, yeah, I did a littlebit of debate.
I've started studyingphilosophy as part of my, like
(26:28):
degree plan at the university,so getting to bring some of that
and chatting with my LDRs aboutsome of that has been really
neat.
I had a day where I just talkedwith all of my PFers about,
like logical fallacies andcognitive biases and all of
those types of things that I'vebeen learning in some of my
(26:49):
epistemology courses, and thatwas really neat.
Like breaking down you knowwhat even is an argument, what
does it mean from like aphilosophical angle, and getting
to kind of approach it fromthat was really cool.
So, yeah, I've had a lot of funthis year just kind of being
all over the place and hangingout in a little bit of
everything.
Lyle Wiley (27:10):
That's really cool that you get to share learning
that you're probably excitedabout.
You know stuff that you'relearning in your studies and
then you get to like immediatelyturn around and like share
while you're excited about it,while you're like it's like
fresh in your head and whileyou're thinking through things,
like you get to share it withkids.
I think starting judge, you'restarting coaching new events is
very humbling sometimes yeahlike I started where john did
(27:36):
with like no knowledge ofanything.
So my coaching experience earlywas very humbling.
But we started a new program sonone of the kids really knew
anything either.
So we all just kind of got tolearn together and I kind of
have sort of like taken thatphilosophy into my coaching.
For the entire time I've beencoaching, where it's just like
you know, I just try to likelearn with the kids and it
sounds like you're kind ofgetting that experience.
(27:57):
It's really fun.
Whitney Brooks (27:59):
Yes, yeah, my.
One of the things I struggledwith the most this year was
books, cause I did interp likeI'd competed in interp, but
never in poi or poetry, anythingwith book blocking.
So like I was learning a lotfrom some of my kids about like
how do you even like maneuverwith it Right, cause I would
(28:20):
have an idea of like hey, thiscould look really cool if you
did this and this and this, butthen we would have to kind of
figure out together how tophysically do that thing.
Uh, so that was a little bithumbling for me sometimes to
like drop this kid's point booklike six times in a row trying
to show them like my vision, youknow I've had those exact same
moments where I'm like why don'tyou do this?
Lyle Wiley (28:42):
they're like, because I physically can't do
that, yeah, that's, that's notactually possible, dude.
Like oh, oh, yeah, yeah, you'reright.
Like that's probably, there'sprobably no way to do that.
Okay, sorry, but yeah, exactly.
Is there anything else you wantto share about your coaching
experience?
Like, what about the, the, thetransitioning, the transitioning
(29:02):
, I mean for you maybe it all iskind of like a SERP, because
you you coached your first yearright out and then you coached
this year with a, with a newcoaching staff and a new, a kind
of a brand new situation in alot of ways.
What was it like to coach in anew situation this year?
What were some of thechallenges that came with that?
Whitney Brooks (29:23):
Some of the fun stuff.
Yeah, yeah, I mean like thisdefinitely has been a lot of
transition the past few years.
I mean my seniors thatgraduated this past year the
class of 24, the four-yearseniors had had six or seven
different coaches during theirhigh school experience, on a
team that has one head coach andtwo assistant coaches at a time
(29:46):
.
So that's a lot of turnoverthat they had had to deal with.
And this year I was the onlycoach that had stuck around from
last year.
So there was definitely a lotof challenges.
But something I really reliedon was kind of developing my own
personal coaching philosophyand, you know, when there were
(30:09):
tough moments, when there werechallenges, kind of being able
to return to that.
So something that I learnedfrom my like my head coach when
I competed in my first yearcoaching, who has a complex
legacy but who taught me a lot.
Something he always said was hehad a two-step plan.
So the first question he askedhimself when he had to make a
(30:29):
big decision was what is bestfor the students involved, not
for me, not for the standing orreputation of my team, but just
like, what do these studentsneed in this moment?
And you know when you'reevaluating the choice you want
to make.
If the answer is that it iswhat's best for those students,
(30:52):
then you move on to step numbertwo.
And the second question is doesit follow the rules?
And if the answer is yes, thenyou're good to go, and if the
answer is no, then refer back topart number one.
And if it's what's best for thekids, then, oh well, figure out
a way.
And that had its merits.
(31:12):
Sometimes it got us into stickysituations, but I really liked
taking that to kind of form myown beliefs on everything, and
that really helped me in termsof viewing my coaching as like,
what matters here is thesestudents and I'm not going to do
(31:33):
what's best for me.
I'm not going to do what makesme look like the perfect coach.
I'm going to do like what theyneed in this moment or what I
think would be best for them orwhat they think would be best
for them.
Sometimes it's a matter of likelistening to them and just
straight up asking what do youwant out of this?
And I'm going to do the bestthat I can to get you that.
(31:54):
So I think that that wassomething that was really
helpful.
During kind of tumultuoustransitional times is like what
are my values as a coach andthen, throughout any hard
moments, just returning to thoseand making sure that whatever
you're doing aligns with thosevalues.
I mean that's just going totake you where you need to be, I
(32:16):
think.
But I mean there was also a lotof fun.
I mean, there's a lot of fun ingetting to work with new people
and getting to learn differentcoaching styles and learn from
each other and, you know, learntogether from the students and
there was a lot of fun and youknow, I think overall we've all
had a pretty good experience, ifyou ask me Well that's good to
(32:40):
hear and I think your coachingphilosophy that you're kind of
establishing is like a reallyhealthy way to approach things.
Lyle Wiley (32:47):
That's really cool.
Do you think?
Do you see yourself likewhatever larger career that you
might get involved with in thefuture, which I know there's a
lot of different directions youcould potentially go.
We were talking about yourstudying situation and stuff.
But do you think you want totry to be involved in speech and
debate as a coach going forward?
Whitney Brooks (33:04):
I mean, I think that would be super awesome.
No matter what, I don't thinkI'll ever be totally away from
this community.
I think this is something thatyou can try your hardest, but it
just kind of follows you around, no matter what you're going to
be at a grocery store in 20years and run into somebody that
remembers debating against you.
(33:25):
My mom still remembers her archnemesis in Extemp in the 90s in
on the wyoming high schooldebate circuit, who I'm not
going to name but who is apublic figure now.
But yeah, I mean I would loveto be involved in this.
No matter what, it's a reallygreat community cool.
Lyle Wiley (33:46):
Yeah, it's kind of like it's like a virus or
something that gets inside you.
Yeah, it's like a littleparasite, like a virus or
something that gets inside you?
Whitney Brooks (33:51):
Yeah, it's like a little parasite, like a
healthy, healthy zombiesituation.
Yeah, Healthy one, mostly,mostly, yeah.
Lyle Wiley (33:59):
I think we've talked a lot about things you've
learned about yourself this year, but one of the questions I've
been asking people is like isthere something like uniquely,
just specific to this year, thatyou've learned about either the
activity or yourself over thecourse of this season?
Whitney Brooks (34:14):
Yeah, I mean this on a practical level.
I have gotten a lot better atmy tab room skills this year
because I was in that first kindof group of people.
I mean, my first year competingwe were still pretty much all
paper ballots and then it was2020 and all of a sudden
(34:37):
everything was online.
So I kind of taught myself alot of the student side of tab
room and I was still kind oflearning the coach side.
So this year I mean, I tabbed alot at our tournament.
I tabbed at a lot of randomother tournaments and that was a
really cool skill that Ilearned.
I feel a lot more confident inmy tabbing ability.
(34:58):
And then, on a more likeinterpersonal level, I think the
biggest thing I learned thisyear was just how supportive and
caring this community really is.
Without getting too personal,it was a pretty difficult year
for me and it was just reallyincredible to see the way that
(35:19):
this community kind of steps upand supports the people that are
in it and really just, you know, the support and care that
people showed me was reallygreat.
I mean I wasn't able to be atthe state tournament this year
with my team and just the waythat they were all so
understanding and, like othercoaches, were understanding and
(35:39):
reaching out and keeping me inthe loop without overwhelming me
.
It was just really great andthe empathy that kind of
radiates from speech and debatepeople is just so phenomenal and
I loved getting to reallyexperience that this year, even
if it wasn't under the best ofconditions yeah, that's very
lovely.
Lyle Wiley (36:00):
I also felt very uplifted and supported by this
community.
All that said, I think it'stime for a ghostly interlude.
Um oh, do you believe in ghosts?
I've been asking people this inthe middle of the interview,
like are you a paranormal person?
What do you think?
Is there anything out?
Whitney Brooks (36:15):
there.
I'm kind of I know this ismaybe the most annoying way to
respond, but I'm kind of in themiddle of the road where I'm
like I mean there's got to besomething going on that we don't
understand.
Like we barely even understandthe oceans.
(36:40):
There's no way we understand,like, what happens when we die.
You know what I mean.
Um, so there's got to besomething going on, but I don't
know if it's like the ghoststhat we see in like media and
whatnot.
You know, I want to believethere's something silly and
spooky out there, but I don'tknow exactly what it is or what
form it takes.
Lyle Wiley (36:53):
Yeah, that's fair.
Yeah, pretty measured response.
Whitney Brooks (36:57):
We all, we all want to believe, yeah, yeah.
Lyle Wiley (37:04):
And that's part of what we're like talking about
here at camp is like overcomingfears and obstacles and I want
to hear do you have any likeexamples or stories of times
that you had a spooky or scarytime in speech that like helped
you grow through something orlearn something important?
I bet you probably do.
Whitney Brooks (37:17):
Yeah, yeah, I mean I've had some very
interesting times with speech.
I mean, speech and debate hasjust been such a big part of my
life for so many years that it'skind of like big moments in
speech and debate are bigmoments in my life and vice
versa.
So I mean, like, like I said,my first year competing was
(37:39):
before COVID, in the, in thebefore times, uh, when we were
still on paper, still in person.
You know everything it's quote,unquote, normal.
And then you know I wassupposed to go to state that
year that was my first timegoing to Nats and all of a
sudden none of that washappening the way that we
thought it would.
(37:59):
We didn't even.
I mean there was kind of a ministate that was kind of thrown
together, which was really greatthat the state got together and
still kind of did something.
But you know, for all intentsand purposes, I missed my first
state.
And then my first Nats wasonline, which thankfully sort of
(38:20):
I was competing in XTEMP thatyear.
So I still got to do somethinglike live in the moment and feel
like I was, you know, doingnationals.
But it was like I was justsitting in front of my laptop at
my dining room table at home,which was maybe a little bit
anticlimactic for my firstNationals experience.
And then the next year, I mean,almost everything was online.
(38:43):
You know, district state Nats.
Once again, I did have a kindof silly experience that year
where my Wi-Fi cut out in themiddle of drama semifinals at
State and I was losing my mindbecause I was like in the middle
of performing and then all of asudden everything just went
down and I was like, oh no, likethis is the end of it for me,
(39:05):
like this is the end of my life,you know, as a high schooler
does.
And then the wi-fi at theschool turned back on and I
finished my performance and itwas fine, but that was.
You know, it was pretty scaryin the moment, uh, but just like
that time of having to like gofrom being in person to online
(39:27):
and then back in person wasreally scary.
I don't know if anybody elsehas really talked about this,
but I was absolutely terrifiedto go back in person after I'd
been online for a couple ofyears.
My first time doing my oratoryin person I guess ever because I
had started doing oratory whenwe were online was at districts,
(39:51):
my senior year, and so that wasa terrifying experience for me.
I was like I don't know whatI'm doing, blah, blah, blah.
And in those moments where I waskind of adapting to these new
situations, just kind of beingable to remind myself like you,
your, you know your body andyour mind just have this amazing
(40:16):
capability of like taking careof you in moments when you don't
know if they will, and kind ofrelying on that almost muscle
memory or just that routine oflike you know what you're doing,
you've done it before, even ifyou haven't, like you have those
baseline skills that are goingto carry you through, like.
That was something that becamereally important to me.
(40:37):
As we were kind of back andforth and there was all that
uncertainty was just like take adeep breath, like just trust
yourself and you're going tocarry yourself through this one
way or the other.
And I mean, even in my hardmoments in speech and debate.
This is, this is my own littlething, and if any of my students
(40:57):
are listening to this podcast,they're gonna be like oh my god,
she's talking about her coffeeagain.
But my thing that I talk aboutall the time is that I'm a big
coffee drinker and every morningit's kind of ritualistic me I
drink my cup of coffee and Iplay my silly little games.
You know, I do like the NewYork Times Connections that was
(41:17):
my favorite.
Sometimes I'll do the Wordle orwhatever, and this is like a
big thing for me.
Like every morning, this iswhat I do, and so when I have
those hard moments, somethingI've learned to do is tell
myself no-transcript, and sothat's something my students are
(42:00):
probably sick of hearing me say.
But whenever we have hardmoments as a team or as
individuals, I'm like what arewe going to do tomorrow?
We're going to wake up and we'regoing to drink our silly little
coffee and we're just going tokeep putting one foot in front
of the other because you?
Don't really get another choicein the matter and you're just
going to keep moving forward andthe world is going to keep
moving forward and everything isis going to be okay that's.
Lyle Wiley (42:23):
That's very lovely.
I'm gonna remember that I'llwake up, drink my solo coffee,
play my solo little games.
Are you still playingconnections?
Is that the game that you liketo play in the morning?
Yeah, that's kind of my main.
Play my silly little games, areyou still?
Whitney Brooks (42:34):
playing Connections.
Is that the game that you liketo play in the morning?
Yeah, that's kind of my mainone.
My mom and I, ever since Imoved away to college, we
maintain our connectionprimarily via silly little games
.
So every morning we will sendeach other our results for the
Connections or the Wordle orwhatever it is.
We're also friends on Duolingoand we keep each other our
(42:56):
results for, like theconnections or the wordle or
whatever it is.
We're also friends on Duolingoand we we keep each other
motivated for our Duolingostreaks.
Lyle Wiley (43:01):
You know the important stuff.
The important stuff, it'slovely.
Are you like a hardcore coffeedrinker, like do you have to
have a certain kind of coffee,or you can kind of go with
anything?
Whitney Brooks (43:09):
Yeah, I'm kind of cool with anything.
Yeah, I'm kind of cool withanything.
I did not start liking coffeeuntil a little bit later in my
life, so I'm not superpretentious about it.
It's just important that it'spresent and, uh, highly
caffeinated that's pretty doable.
Lyle Wiley (43:26):
So that's yeah, you can pretty much make that black
coffee, no matter what it is,I'm cool.
Nice, well, that is actually anice little uh.
I think that's a good way todeal with fears.
I think that'll be helpful topeople I do.
Uh, so tell me what's.
What's, what's coming up foryou next, like what?
What are you looking forward tothis year?
Whitney Brooks (43:47):
Yeah, I mean hopefully coaching again.
We're still waiting on allsorts of admin and everything.
But yeah, I've got someexciting stuff going on this
year.
I'm entering my junior year atcollege, starting a new
internship with the UniversityFoundation, doing some
philanthropy giving work, whichwill be really cool, and I'm
(44:12):
going to be doing a semesterabroad in the spring.
I'm going to be in theNetherlands at Utrecht
University, so that's prettyexciting.
Lyle Wiley (44:22):
Yeah, that's super exciting.
That'll be a great experience.
There's some big stuff comingup for you this year While
you're experiencing next year.
I'm sure a speech debate willbe part of that and I just like
to ask people like what for youright now?
Like what is it that you lovethe most about the speech and
debate situation, community teamcompetition, anything?
Whitney Brooks (44:43):
Yeah, I mean, there are so many things that I
love about it.
I love, I think maybe what Ilove most though which is tough
for me to pick one is that itreally teaches you a lot of
resiliency.
I mean, you're put into a lot ofnew situations, a lot of scary
(45:07):
situations Ooh, a clapocalypseand you just kind of have to
learn how to roll with thepunches.
And something that I love is itreally encourages you to just
keep learning and just keepmoving forward.
You know, there's something sobeautiful about this ability
(45:30):
that speech and debate peoplehave to, you know, have a
terrible weekend and come backon Monday and see your ballots
that are like straight sixes,like harsh feedback, and instead
of just, you know, kind ofthrowing your hands up in the
air and giving up, we're justlike, okay, cool, I'm going to
do this again next weekend andI'm going to do it slightly
(45:52):
better than I did last time.
And there next weekend, and I'mgoing to do it slightly better
than I did last time, andthere's just something so kind
of beautiful to me about thatthat we just we can keep rolling
with these punches and justkeep learning and keep getting
after it, no matter what.
Lyle Wiley (46:09):
I like that.
I like that.
I do think this is connected tomy question.
I've kind of been closinginterviews out with people,
which is like you know.
I mean public speaking is likepretty feared by the general
public.
I mean to the point thatthere's surveys and stories out
there about people being moreafraid of public speaking than
death.
I mean, I think we've all heardthat which, whether or not
that's totally true, it'sdefinitely like something that
(46:30):
people are not they, they'reterrified of, they're not like
cool with.
So you know, speech, innovate,like we actively put ourselves
in these situations where we'refacing this, this terror.
So what do you think?
Why, how and why is it worth it?
Whitney Brooks (46:46):
I mean, I think that the biggest thing that you
get out of speech innovate isjust learning how to do hard
things.
Like we as people are so muchmore capable than we think that
we are, we always, you know,kind of envision these limits
(47:09):
and these boundaries forourselves, and most of the time
we are actually able to totallyexceed those and we just don't
even realize it because we'retoo afraid to put ourselves in
the situation.
So what I love about speech anddebate is that you just kind of
have to get out there and dothe darn thing and if it doesn't
(47:29):
work out, thenucks at least Iknow now.
But at the end of the day, likeyou are going to gain so much
even just from trying, and ittakes a lot of courage and a lot
of vulnerability, whichsometimes to me are synonyms, uh
to be able to get up in frontof a room of people and talk to
(47:52):
them about something that youcare about, and so just being
able to do that, no matterwhether you get a lot of
external success and a lot ofexternal validation or not, that
is just so incredible to me,and I think that's part of why I
love speech and debate so much,because it is scary and you do
it anyways, and that experiencein and of itself is just so
(48:16):
amazing for you.
Lyle Wiley (48:17):
That's some great stuff, whitney.
I appreciate you being here anddoing the interview and helping
us through the clapocalypsehere this year at Camp One, clap
Two, so thank you so much forbeing a part of this.
Whitney Brooks (48:32):
Yeah, thank you so much for letting me be part
of this.
Lyle Wiley (48:36):
Thank you to Whitney for being here at Camp One Clap
.
It was an absolute joy to talkto Whitney and I learned a lot
from her.
And you know what?
You totally should check outher Substack Again.
That's Genuine Knockoff atSubstack, so
genuinenockoffsubstackcom.
What's new at camp tomorrow?
Well, good friend of thepodcast, uuun, will be here to
talk about choosing a platformtopic and writing a great speech
(48:58):
.
Don't forget, social media.
Challenges are live for everyday of camp this August and
we'll see you again tomorrow.
Campers, oh, quickly though,before you go, make sure you
watch out for flesh-eating beesout there in the Clapocalypse.
You know what those are called,right, yeah, zombies For Camp
on Clap.
This is Camp Director Wileysigning off.
Well, hey, campers, it's another beautiful day here
at the Clapocalypse.
You've discovered day five ofCamp One Clap Two on the One
Clap Speech and Debate podcast,and we're in for an awesome
guest today here on the podcast.
Cheyenne Central assistantcoach Whitney Brooks is here to
help us survive in theclapocalypse, right after she
drinks her coffee and plays hergames.
But we'll get to that.
(00:30):
I'm your camp director and hostof the One Clap Speech and
Debate podcast, lyle Wiley.
I hope everyone is ready toface any horrors that might
stand in their way to be able toshare their voices with
confidence and joy this season.
Quick reminder check the OneClap socials for today's social
media challenge.
I really loved all thisengagement from competitors and
coaches on all those challengesso far.
(00:51):
You're getting me excited forthe upcoming year.
It's pretty great.
Let's learn more about ourguest on today's show, whitney
Brooks.
Whitney is excited to join CampOne Clap for the first time this
year.
In her three years competing onthe Wyoming Speech and Debate
Circuit, she became a bit of aphenomenon, racking up
accomplishments, includingearning her quadrupie, three
(01:12):
qualifications to nationals, twoindividual state championships,
breaks at multiple nationallevel tournaments and, the
greatest achievement of all,perfecting the Just Dance
routine for Rasputin.
She has now coached for thepast two years at Cheyenne
Central, earning her firstCoaching Excellence Award and
coaching many nationalqualifiers, state champions and
all-around awesome people alongthe way.
(01:32):
Whitney is a zealous fan ofDiet Coke, krusty, little Rot
Dogs, the Mountains and allthings Chapel Roan.
Although she possesses very fewpractical skills to avoid an
apocalypse, she sure has a lotof heart.
So feel free to follow Whitneyalong as she navigates the world
at GenuineKnockoffsubstackcomthat's Genuine Knockoff at
(01:54):
Substack.
Her writing is great.
You should totally check it out.
All right, I think it's time tojump right into my interview
with Whitney Brooks.
Welcome to Camp.
One Clap to the Clapocalypse.
Whitney Brooks, welcome backactually Welcome back to One
Clap.
It's great to have you here.
Whitney Brooks (02:13):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
It's great to be here.
Lyle Wiley (02:16):
I'm glad you're here because you can help us
navigate the Clapocalypse, whichis a really scary thing that
we're all trying to figure out,um, what it even is actually.
And uh, first, everything we'regonna do is like talk about
fears.
Uh, what's your favorite scarystory?
Could be like a movie or a bookor a spoken story, like a
(02:36):
campfire story.
Whitney Brooks (02:37):
Could be anything what's your favorite
scary story so, just as a bit ofbackground, as a kid I was like
such a scaredy cat I did notinteract at all with like horror
or scary stories or anything.
And then, just like in the pastcouple years, I've started to
kind of get into it.
So, uh, the impetus for thatwas actually buffy the vampire
(03:01):
slayer, which is objectivelylike not that scary.
But I started watching it inhigh school because I was going
through this phase like 90s,early 2000s trashy TV and I
loved it.
So then I started kind ofgetting more into horror.
So my favorite one that I'vewatched recently is Midsommar.
(03:21):
I finally watched it afterpeople telling me forever that I
needed to, and it was reallygood.
I really liked it.
I know lots of people have lotsof thoughts on it, but I enjoyed
it.
But I also love Anything byShirley Jackson.
All of her novels and shortstories really phenomenal.
But yeah, I mean any scarystory in the right environment,
(03:44):
I think is the key part of it.
Like you got to be by campfire,got some marshmallows, got some
spooky lighting, that's theperfect scary story, right there
.
Lyle Wiley (03:54):
That's some good stuff.
Buffy is like I mean, you know,I want to say underrated, but
like I don't, I don't know ifthat's like that pretty popular,
right, like buffy's always beenpretty popular.
But yeah but still sort of likeunderrated um as like a pop
sort of vampire tv show, becausewe I had took a vampire's class
(04:17):
for in my master's program andwe talked about buffy a lot and
I think that, yeah, has a lotmore interesting stuff going on
than people give it credit forum yeah, it has some good stuff.
John, sweden, knew what he wasdoing yeah it's, it's intriguing
, and then you know, uh,midsummer is is a really good,
like a really beautiful movie ina weird way like yeah I love
(04:38):
some of astor's transitionsespecially.
A lot of folks have talkedabout that movie on the podcast
like so I don't know a favoriteout there, cool, uh.
But yeah, we have always livedin the castle is really great.
Um, yes, shirley jackson.
Um, yes, very spooky storythere, yeah, yeah.
So some good choices.
I like good choices.
I am interesting to hear aboutyour thoughts on how long you
(05:03):
might last after, like, somesort of post-apocalyptic
situation where we have somesort of event like a zombie
apocalypse or something.
Uh, do you, do you feel likeyou would be a survivor on a
scale of one to ten?
How good of a chance ofsurvival you think you might
have?
You have any skills that youbring to the table here?
Whitney Brooks (05:20):
so I'm not sure about skills, but I do have like
some just kind of a sheer dumblook.
I think I have a pretty goodshot because somehow magically
my grandfather managed to keep ahold of his grandparents
homestead, like out in themiddle of nowhere in Wyoming,
(05:43):
and so there's like fifteen,1500 acres, which is just a
beautiful gift for my family tobe able to hold on to that.
But there's nothing out there.
It's like 25 minute drive tothe nearest neighbors.
So I think if I just poppedover there, like I just kind of
lived off the land, like I thinkI would have a pretty good shot
(06:03):
of just kind of avoidingeverything.
I don't think I have the skillsto like fight back, but I think
my flight response could bepretty, pretty strong there.
And my grandfather stockpiledcanned food and so there's like
40 years worth of chili up therewhich I could live off of for a
while in the apocalypse.
Lyle Wiley (06:24):
It's like going to destroy your digestive system
but you might make it a longtime and that's that's.
That's.
That sounds like a pretty likedecent survival sort of
situation.
Maybe I don't know, so you havelike survival skills, but in
terms of like conflict, if itgot scary and you had to like
(06:46):
try to like fight folks orwhatever, yeah, Probably not
ending well for me.
Let's just hope it never comesto that.
Whitney Brooks (06:54):
Yeah, exactly, let's just forget it, just don't
think about it.
Lyle Wiley (06:57):
Most of the speech and debate folks I've talked to
don't feel great about theirchances of survival.
Many have said, you know well,I have communication skills,
like maybe I could talk my wayout of it or whatever.
But yeah, not I just, I'm justhoping that maybe we can use our
communication skills to helpprevent it from happening,
hopefully, yes, yeah, let's be alittle more proactive, maybe
yeah.
(07:18):
Yeah, um, so I think maybe we'vetalked about this a little bit
before in the past, whitney, butI want to hear a little bit
about your speech and debate.
Origin story How'd you getstarted in this world?
Why'd you stick around?
Whitney Brooks (07:30):
Yeah.
So I was a little bit of alater joiner.
I didn't join right off the batwhen I got to high school.
But when I first started highschool I was really involved in
theater.
So I was doing all the shows atmy school my freshman year and
at that point in time thetheater director was also the
(07:50):
speech and debate coach.
So the fall of my sophomoreyear I was the lead in this like
school play.
It was a super heavy play.
If you've ever heard of amonster calls, especially on
down on Monster Calls,especially on Dowd, that's what
we were doing.
Yeah, very intense for like 15year olds.
(08:11):
But my theater director slashspeech and debate coach was like
, hey, you're doing pretty wellwith this, come be a humor kid
on my speech team.
So I joined the team.
There was a lot of overlap withthe kids between theater and
speech.
So I already had some friendsinvolved in it and I joined and
(08:32):
I kind of never looked back.
And then only then did I realizethat my mom had been in speech
and debate for a while when shewas in high school.
She absolutely loved it and Idon't know how, I'd never heard
of that before.
But then I learned about it andshe did extemp.
So I was like I guess I'll doextemp now and yeah.
(08:52):
Then I kind of bounced aroundall the events doing this and
that and I just really loved it.
And as I was graduating highschool, one of our assistant
coaches was on the way out.
She had some life changes andhad to move to a different place
and my head coach was like Iguess you could give this a shot
(09:13):
.
And I was like sure, I'll tryit and found out that I loved
coaching even more than I lovedcompeting.
So I've been around ever since,I guess.
Lyle Wiley (09:23):
It's kind of trapped you and never let go.
Whitney Brooks (09:26):
Yeah, exactly.
Lyle Wiley (09:29):
So your coaching situation?
You've been going to school atthe University of Wyoming,
laramie right.
And then helping coach at ShineCentral.
Yes, so a lot of like commutingkind of things for you.
Yes, commuting kind of thingsfor you yes, a lot of driving
which has its benefits and itsdrawbacks.
Whitney Brooks (09:50):
I mean, I am hi.
I have become such a podcastgirl so I love having my little
time, listen to my littlepodcasts, listen to some
audiobooks, like, just get someme time when I'm on the road,
but in the winter it's notalways the most fun, for sure.
Lyle Wiley (10:08):
Yeah, it's kind of stressful to drive on spooky
roads, but what are some of yourfavorite podcasts?
What are some of the ones youlike to listen to?
Whitney Brooks (10:16):
I lately have been listening to Rehash, which
is like these two random girlsthat yap about pop culture
phenomena that we all kind offorgot about, that they want to
revisit.
I really liked that.
One Stuff you're wrong about isa pretty good one that I've
been enjoying.
(10:37):
I'm kind of all over the place.
I'll listen to like one episodeof a million different podcasts
if I'm interested in the topic.
So that's cool, yeah, that'swell, and of course, one clap
well that one was implied.
Lyle Wiley (10:51):
Yeah, everyone I've assumed that if you're a human
and listen to content, thenyou're listening to one clap,
I'm sure exactly I was gonna ask.
Whitney Brooks (11:02):
If you're into podcasts, have you ever thought
about like You're listening toone clap?
I'm sure?
Exactly Number one on thecharts, if you're into podcasts.
Lyle Wiley (11:07):
Have you ever thought about starting your own
podcast, whitney?
Whitney Brooks (11:14):
Because I would totally listen to this.
I mean, I have certainlythought about it.
I am a prolific yapper and Ithink I could put those skills
to use, maybe rapper, and Ithink I could put those skills
to use maybe, but I just don'tknow like what I would talk
about, or you know, finding yourniche is kind of difficult.
So I think I'm waiting toreally find something where I
feel like I could just go.
Lyle Wiley (11:36):
Yeah, you're, you're kind of a good example of
someone who has, like just anexplosion of interests, because
you're, you have a lot of likeinterests and you kind of go
deep on a lot of them, right,cause you're really into music,
right, you're a big music person, you're a big speech and debate
person.
But then your areas of studyyou really deep dive in those as
well you like to write.
Whitney Brooks (11:57):
Yeah, you have a lot of interest.
Yeah, I'm kind of all over theplace, but I think sometimes
that's the way to do it.
Lyle Wiley (12:05):
Yeah, I'm kind of all over the place, but I think
sometimes that's the way to doit.
Yeah, no, that's beautiful, butI guess when you think about a
focused podcast it might getkind of tricky to figure out
what that looks like.
Whitney Brooks (12:11):
Yeah, exactly.
Lyle Wiley (12:13):
Do you like film too ?
Are you a movie buff?
Whitney Brooks (12:16):
You know, sometimes I mean I love watching
movies and thinking about themand talking about them, but
that's kind of more of a recentdevelopment.
So I mean I'm missing some ofthe classics and I'm starting to
work my way through them.
I think I'm probably just nevergoing to watch Pulp Fiction
(12:37):
because everybody thatrecommends it to me is like
super obnoxious about it.
Maybe that's just my experience.
Is like super obnoxious aboutit.
Maybe that's just my experience, uh, but some of the other ones
.
Lyle Wiley (12:51):
I'm working my way through.
You know it is funny how filmaficionados do kind of have this
like weird, like oh, you haveto see this film or else you're
not a true film buff or whateveryou know so it's really great
about the godfather, yeah fulldisclosure.
I I do think apocalypse now ismaybe one of the greatest movies
(13:12):
ever but the godfather movies Ijust I don't know like the
gangster stuff.
I know technically they're greator whatever, but it's just kind
of painful for me, not reallymy, really my bag yeah, and that
you know, that's okay I hope so.
Whitney Brooks (13:26):
Thanks thanks for the affirmation, whitney.
I appreciate that of course I'mhere to be your yes man today.
Lyle Wiley (13:32):
Yes, I like it.
Um so uh, we've already goneover some of this ground, but of
course you were a greatcompetitor at cheyenne central
uh, especially, like you know, astate champion in oratory twice
uh state champ, once in oratory, once in drama drama, that's
right.
Whitney Brooks (13:49):
Yeah, yeah, which I forget about sometimes,
because I only did drama forlike that year that I kind of
dipped out the drama dip.
Lyle Wiley (13:58):
The famous drama dip , yeah, yeah, drama's lovely but
also heavy.
So, um, yeah, so, two-timestate champion at Cheyenne
Central High School Prettyamazing.
Were you part of the statechampionship team as well?
You were right.
Whitney Brooks (14:12):
I was.
That was my senior year, so Iwas pretty happy to be part of
that as team president.
Yeah, lovely way to go outhonestly.
Lyle Wiley (14:23):
Yeah, you were team president and now you're a team
president and now and then nowyou're coaching, of course, and
we talked about that but Ithat's like uh, that is not an
easy transition and it's it'sgot some challenges uh to go
from, even from team captainslash team president to uh
coaching.
I mean I know there's overlap,like that's a big step with a
(14:46):
lot of moving pieces, and you'vealso coached two years now
through a coaching change and soyou've had some really unique
challenges.
I think, and I just think it'dbe interesting to talk to you
about you know some of thosechallenges of coming back to
coach with a team that you'refamiliar with and then you know
know what you enjoy aboutcoaching so far, but maybe some
of the things that, like that,you've had to figure out in
(15:10):
order to enjoy coaching and whatyou like to coach right now.
I know you're coaching a lot ofdifferent events, but what you
coach and what you enjoy.
So, yeah, I'll just give yousome time to chat about your
coaching experience yeah, forsure I.
Whitney Brooks (15:22):
I love talking this.
All of my friends at collegeare so sick of hearing about
speech and mate all the timethey're like we get it, dude,
leave us alone.
But yeah, I mean, for me, like Icame back to coach immediately
the fall, right after Igraduated, which is not
something that my school hadreally done before In the past.
(15:44):
You know, there was kind of awaiting period of like hey, get
at least one or two years outand then come back when you've
got a little more distance.
But I was kind of the onlyperson that was interested and
so they were like I guess you'regoing to go for it.
And I don't know if I wouldrecommend that path for
(16:08):
everybody, because I mean, therewere a lot of challenges,
there's a lot of boundarysetting that has to happen kind
of right off the gate, in a waythat maybe older, more
experienced coaches wouldn'thave to do, because there is
that kind of awkward thing oflike we used to be teammates and
now we're transitioning intothis relationship of like coach
(16:29):
and student and there are newthings that have to come along
with that, like what are therules about social media?
Or like people that alreadyhave your phone number, and like
what do we talk about, evenoutside of practice, in practice
, like how does all of this work?
And figuring all of that out,while also trying to figure out
just the basics of like, how doI coach these things.
(16:52):
It's definitely a lot.
With that being said, I think itwas a really great experience
for me.
I don't regret doing it.
I don't know if I wouldrecommend it for everybody, but
I don't regret it and I thinkthat I learned a lot about
myself.
I gained a lot of skills that Idon't think I would have gained
(17:13):
otherwise.
I mean, I definitely have hadto kind of learn to ride the
line between learning how togain respect and authority
without kind of going off thedeep end of, like
authoritarianism, which is areally important skill to have
for any leader, and I kind ofhad to learn that in an
(17:36):
interesting way, being kind ofthrown into the deep end, kind
of had to learn that in aninteresting way, being kind of
thrown into the deep end.
Uh, and then also, a challengethat you wouldn't necessarily
expect is to kind of there's alot of resetting your
expectations that you have to gothrough because as a competitor
, I mean I'm not that far outfrom it.
I remember what it's like yourcoaches do something that you
(17:58):
don't love and you're like, oh,if I was the coach, I would do
it this way and this way andeverything would be perfect and
there would be no problems.
And I understand everythingcompletely.
And it's really easy to thinkthat when you're not in that
position and then you kind oftake over as the coach and you
have to do a lot of like.
Okay, maybe this isn't as easyas I thought it was.
(18:19):
Some of these changes areharder to implement or
impossible to implement, givenall of the restrictions that
exist out there, and so there'sdefinitely a lot of like you go
into it thinking that you havethis experience and you're going
to have it all figured out andthen you don't, which is a
lesson everybody has to learneventually.
(18:40):
But I just had to learn thatkind of right away.
As for other challenges, I meanI this is kind of a silly one,
but my first year coaching I gotmistaken for a competitor at
like every tournament, at leastonce or twice, which I just
think is now.
(19:00):
I think it's kind of funny, butat the time I used to get kind
of annoyed by it because I waslike not even wearing a suit,
dude.
But yeah that, maybe that'sjust me.
Lyle Wiley (19:13):
Did you ever have a hard time getting into like the
hospitality rooms and stuff?
Like people like, hey, this isjust for coaches.
Whitney Brooks (19:21):
You know, that actually did happen to me once
my first year coaching atdistricts.
I I think it was mostly just meI was too scared that they were
going to kick me out.
So the first couple of times Iwent in there I made my head
coach at the time go in with meso that everybody was like, oh,
(19:42):
she's fine.
And then I would kind of likesay hi to the coaches.
I knew People were like, oh,there we go, like we get what's
happening here.
But I was very aware ofconstantly having like an ID
badge or some sort ofidentification on me Almost all
the time.
(20:02):
That proved that I was not justa high schooler wandering
around the halls of this highschool, you know.
Lyle Wiley (20:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You're probably going to haveto deal with this for a while,
honestly, so.
Whitney Brooks (20:15):
Yeah, probably I .
My outfit game has gotten a lotstronger though, so I think
that helps.
I've got like the coachingoutfits kind of down, turns out
puffer vests.
That's the secret.
Lyle Wiley (20:27):
Everybody's like oh, they're wearing a puffer vest,
They've got to be a coach.
Whitney Brooks (20:31):
Yep, that's just like the coach fit, apparently,
so it's worked out well for me.
Lyle Wiley (20:36):
It's a good trick.
It's people listening.
That'll help them out.
Yeah, what's been.
What's been the thing like whatdo you love most about coaching
?
Or like what is the mostenjoyable part for you?
Whitney Brooks (20:48):
Yeah, for me, I think, just the whole experience
of getting to like mentor andteach that's just something that
I've discovered for myself.
I really love that.
I didn't think I would love asmuch as I did.
And I mean I tell my studentsthis all the time, like we care
(21:10):
about them as competitors, yes,but we care about them as people
and as human beings first.
And so for me, getting to beable to kind of be that person
in their lives where they'relike how do I register for my
classes?
How do I like apply to college?
Hey, can you read over myscholarship essay?
Like those little things, evenoutside of just speech and
(21:32):
debate, coaching have been someof the most rewarding things for
me.
Just getting to kind of be thatperson that someone can turn to
and be like what am I doingwith my life, and being able to
tell them like hey, everybody iswondering that nobody knows the
answer, like it's okay, take adeep breath.
I really love that.
And then something that actuallywas originally kind of a
(21:57):
challenge that has turned out tobe one of my favorite parts is
kind of learning to take a stepback.
I think that as competitors, Imean there's a lot of this like
external validation.
That's going on right.
You're getting feedback all thetime.
I mean, if you're doing well,you're getting like big, shiny
(22:18):
trophies that you get to takehome and show your parents and
be like these are awesome.
And then you start coaching andit's a lot less of that.
And at first I mean it was kindof a difficult transition for me
just because I was like am Idoing well?
Like nobody's telling me thatI'm doing well, so therefore I
must not be doing well.
(22:38):
And it's realizing that it'smore about like the internal
validation of you know, I'm outof practice and a student is
like struggling with somethingand then we kind of work through
it and I'm like okay, these arethe moments where like that's
how I find out I'm doing well islike seeing these students do
well and so learning to kind ofnot take that credit for
(23:01):
yourself and like acknowledgingthat this is about them now.
At first that was one of thosekind of tricky transitions for
me, but I actually really loveit Just getting to like be at an
award ceremony and like my.
Again, my students make fun ofme because I'm a little
emotional sometimes and like atdistricts and state I of me,
because I'm a little emotionalsometimes and, like at districts
(23:21):
and state, I'm always a littleteary-eyed and I'm like I'm just
so proud of you guys but, likethat really is the.
The awesome moments for me islike when that kid that has had
a really tough season finally,you know, breaks into finals and
gets to stand up on that stage.
I'm always just like, oh, oh,my goodness.
Lyle Wiley (23:39):
You know, oh yeah, those are lovely moments.
Um yeah, Validation is a hardlike it's a.
It's a very difficult thing forteachers and coaches to uh
which you, which you step awayfrom the role of competitor into
the coaching spot.
It is difficult to figure outhow to feel validated, which
(23:59):
probably requires a lot of like,really, you know, clear, like,
confidence in yourself, lovingyourself, feeling good about
yourself in a general sense,because the hard thing about
kids is that they're lovely butthey're not going to give you
validation for almost anythingLike.
it's just not really the way itworks yeah.
(24:19):
Yeah, yeah, but it's it's notreally the way it works.
Like, yeah yeah, yeah, um, butit's also you got a chance to
work with some cool othercoaches.
Um, sounds like you got to dosome debate, um, coaching and
stuff, some some, maybe someevents that you're familiar with
but maybe not like as confidentin or whatever.
But like, what was that like todo events that you maybe
weren't as like confident in?
Whitney Brooks (24:39):
Yeah, I mean I coached at least a little bit of
basically everything this year.
My team doesn't do policy butwe do every other event and so I
was helping out at least alittle bit with every other
event and it was really a lot offun for me.
I mean it was a lot of growthas a person and as a teacher, as
(25:03):
a coach, uh, because my firstyear coaching I was just doing
the platform stuff and a littlebit of Congress, uh, maybe a lot
of bit of Congress, but likethat was kind of my niche but
like that was kind of my nichemy first year.
And so I competed in Interp andCongress and then like a tiny
(25:24):
little bit of debate when I wasin high school but I'd kind of
stepped away from that for alittle bit.
So it was really fun this yearactually to kind of step back
into the world of Interp alittle bit more and like getting
to block things out again andwork on characterization and
like I love the creative aspectsof interp where I can be like
(25:45):
hey, hold on, like this would bereally funny if we did this
here, and like this might have abe a really hard-hitting
emotional moment if we do thishere.
That kind of creativebrainstorming, like
collaborative aspect with thestudents was really great,
because a lot of what we do inplatform is like the student
writes something out and then weread it and we're like cool,
(26:08):
change this, this, this, Ireally like this, this, this.
And it's a little sometimesless of that like super creative
energy in the moment.
So I really loved getting to dothat with Interp.
And then, yeah, I did a littlebit of debate.
I've started studyingphilosophy as part of my, like
(26:28):
degree plan at the university,so getting to bring some of that
and chatting with my LDRs aboutsome of that has been really
neat.
I had a day where I just talkedwith all of my PFers about,
like logical fallacies andcognitive biases and all of
those types of things that I'vebeen learning in some of my
(26:49):
epistemology courses, and thatwas really neat.
Like breaking down you knowwhat even is an argument, what
does it mean from like aphilosophical angle, and getting
to kind of approach it fromthat was really cool.
So, yeah, I've had a lot of funthis year just kind of being
all over the place and hangingout in a little bit of
everything.
Lyle Wiley (27:10):
That's really cool that you get to share learning
that you're probably excitedabout.
You know stuff that you'relearning in your studies and
then you get to like immediatelyturn around and like share
while you're excited about it,while you're like it's like
fresh in your head and whileyou're thinking through things,
like you get to share it withkids.
I think starting judge, you'restarting coaching new events is
very humbling sometimes yeahlike I started where john did
(27:36):
with like no knowledge ofanything.
So my coaching experience earlywas very humbling.
But we started a new program sonone of the kids really knew
anything either.
So we all just kind of got tolearn together and I kind of
have sort of like taken thatphilosophy into my coaching.
For the entire time I've beencoaching, where it's just like
you know, I just try to likelearn with the kids and it
sounds like you're kind ofgetting that experience.
(27:57):
It's really fun.
Whitney Brooks (27:59):
Yes, yeah, my.
One of the things I struggledwith the most this year was
books, cause I did interp likeI'd competed in interp, but
never in poi or poetry, anythingwith book blocking.
So like I was learning a lotfrom some of my kids about like
how do you even like maneuverwith it Right, cause I would
(28:20):
have an idea of like hey, thiscould look really cool if you
did this and this and this, butthen we would have to kind of
figure out together how tophysically do that thing.
Uh, so that was a little bithumbling for me sometimes to
like drop this kid's point booklike six times in a row trying
to show them like my vision, youknow I've had those exact same
moments where I'm like why don'tyou do this?
Lyle Wiley (28:42):
they're like, because I physically can't do
that, yeah, that's, that's notactually possible, dude.
Like oh, oh, yeah, yeah, you'reright.
Like that's probably, there'sprobably no way to do that.
Okay, sorry, but yeah, exactly.
Is there anything else you wantto share about your coaching
experience?
Like, what about the, the, thetransitioning, the transitioning
(29:02):
, I mean for you maybe it all iskind of like a SERP, because
you you coached your first yearright out and then you coached
this year with a, with a newcoaching staff and a new, a kind
of a brand new situation in alot of ways.
What was it like to coach in anew situation this year?
What were some of thechallenges that came with that?
Whitney Brooks (29:23):
Some of the fun stuff.
Yeah, yeah, I mean like thisdefinitely has been a lot of
transition the past few years.
I mean my seniors thatgraduated this past year the
class of 24, the four-yearseniors had had six or seven
different coaches during theirhigh school experience, on a
team that has one head coach andtwo assistant coaches at a time
(29:46):
.
So that's a lot of turnoverthat they had had to deal with.
And this year I was the onlycoach that had stuck around from
last year.
So there was definitely a lotof challenges.
But something I really reliedon was kind of developing my own
personal coaching philosophyand, you know, when there were
(30:09):
tough moments, when there werechallenges, kind of being able
to return to that.
So something that I learnedfrom my like my head coach when
I competed in my first yearcoaching, who has a complex
legacy but who taught me a lot.
Something he always said was hehad a two-step plan.
So the first question he askedhimself when he had to make a
(30:29):
big decision was what is bestfor the students involved, not
for me, not for the standing orreputation of my team, but just
like, what do these studentsneed in this moment?
And you know when you'reevaluating the choice you want
to make.
If the answer is that it iswhat's best for those students,
(30:52):
then you move on to step numbertwo.
And the second question is doesit follow the rules?
And if the answer is yes, thenyou're good to go, and if the
answer is no, then refer back topart number one.
And if it's what's best for thekids, then, oh well, figure out
a way.
And that had its merits.
(31:12):
Sometimes it got us into stickysituations, but I really liked
taking that to kind of form myown beliefs on everything, and
that really helped me in termsof viewing my coaching as like,
what matters here is thesestudents and I'm not going to do
(31:33):
what's best for me.
I'm not going to do what makesme look like the perfect coach.
I'm going to do like what theyneed in this moment or what I
think would be best for them orwhat they think would be best
for them.
Sometimes it's a matter of likelistening to them and just
straight up asking what do youwant out of this?
And I'm going to do the bestthat I can to get you that.
(31:54):
So I think that that wassomething that was really
helpful.
During kind of tumultuoustransitional times is like what
are my values as a coach andthen, throughout any hard
moments, just returning to thoseand making sure that whatever
you're doing aligns with thosevalues.
I mean that's just going totake you where you need to be, I
(32:16):
think.
But I mean there was also a lotof fun.
I mean, there's a lot of fun ingetting to work with new people
and getting to learn differentcoaching styles and learn from
each other and, you know, learntogether from the students and
there was a lot of fun and youknow, I think overall we've all
had a pretty good experience, ifyou ask me Well that's good to
(32:40):
hear and I think your coachingphilosophy that you're kind of
establishing is like a reallyhealthy way to approach things.
Lyle Wiley (32:47):
That's really cool.
Do you think?
Do you see yourself likewhatever larger career that you
might get involved with in thefuture, which I know there's a
lot of different directions youcould potentially go.
We were talking about yourstudying situation and stuff.
But do you think you want totry to be involved in speech and
debate as a coach going forward?
Whitney Brooks (33:04):
I mean, I think that would be super awesome.
No matter what, I don't thinkI'll ever be totally away from
this community.
I think this is something thatyou can try your hardest, but it
just kind of follows you around, no matter what you're going to
be at a grocery store in 20years and run into somebody that
remembers debating against you.
(33:25):
My mom still remembers her archnemesis in Extemp in the 90s in
on the wyoming high schooldebate circuit, who I'm not
going to name but who is apublic figure now.
But yeah, I mean I would loveto be involved in this.
No matter what, it's a reallygreat community cool.
Lyle Wiley (33:46):
Yeah, it's kind of like it's like a virus or
something that gets inside you.
Yeah, it's like a littleparasite, like a virus or
something that gets inside you?
Whitney Brooks (33:51):
Yeah, it's like a little parasite, like a
healthy, healthy zombiesituation.
Yeah, Healthy one, mostly,mostly, yeah.
Lyle Wiley (33:59):
I think we've talked a lot about things you've
learned about yourself this year, but one of the questions I've
been asking people is like isthere something like uniquely,
just specific to this year, thatyou've learned about either the
activity or yourself over thecourse of this season?
Whitney Brooks (34:14):
Yeah, I mean this on a practical level.
I have gotten a lot better atmy tab room skills this year
because I was in that first kindof group of people.
I mean, my first year competingwe were still pretty much all
paper ballots and then it was2020 and all of a sudden
(34:37):
everything was online.
So I kind of taught myself alot of the student side of tab
room and I was still kind oflearning the coach side.
So this year I mean, I tabbed alot at our tournament.
I tabbed at a lot of randomother tournaments and that was a
really cool skill that Ilearned.
I feel a lot more confident inmy tabbing ability.
(34:58):
And then, on a more likeinterpersonal level, I think the
biggest thing I learned thisyear was just how supportive and
caring this community really is.
Without getting too personal,it was a pretty difficult year
for me and it was just reallyincredible to see the way that
(35:19):
this community kind of steps upand supports the people that are
in it and really just, you know, the support and care that
people showed me was reallygreat.
I mean I wasn't able to be atthe state tournament this year
with my team and just the waythat they were all so
understanding and, like othercoaches, were understanding and
(35:39):
reaching out and keeping me inthe loop without overwhelming me
.
It was just really great andthe empathy that kind of
radiates from speech and debatepeople is just so phenomenal and
I loved getting to reallyexperience that this year, even
if it wasn't under the best ofconditions yeah, that's very
lovely.
Lyle Wiley (36:00):
I also felt very uplifted and supported by this
community.
All that said, I think it'stime for a ghostly interlude.
Um oh, do you believe in ghosts?
I've been asking people this inthe middle of the interview,
like are you a paranormal person?
What do you think?
Is there anything out?
Whitney Brooks (36:15):
there.
I'm kind of I know this ismaybe the most annoying way to
respond, but I'm kind of in themiddle of the road where I'm
like I mean there's got to besomething going on that we don't
understand.
Like we barely even understandthe oceans.
(36:40):
There's no way we understand,like, what happens when we die.
You know what I mean.
Um, so there's got to besomething going on, but I don't
know if it's like the ghoststhat we see in like media and
whatnot.
You know, I want to believethere's something silly and
spooky out there, but I don'tknow exactly what it is or what
form it takes.
Lyle Wiley (36:53):
Yeah, that's fair.
Yeah, pretty measured response.
Whitney Brooks (36:57):
We all, we all want to believe, yeah, yeah.
Lyle Wiley (37:04):
And that's part of what we're like talking about
here at camp is like overcomingfears and obstacles and I want
to hear do you have any likeexamples or stories of times
that you had a spooky or scarytime in speech that like helped
you grow through something orlearn something important?
I bet you probably do.
Whitney Brooks (37:17):
Yeah, yeah, I mean I've had some very
interesting times with speech.
I mean, speech and debate hasjust been such a big part of my
life for so many years that it'skind of like big moments in
speech and debate are bigmoments in my life and vice
versa.
So I mean, like, like I said,my first year competing was
(37:39):
before COVID, in the, in thebefore times, uh, when we were
still on paper, still in person.
You know everything it's quote,unquote, normal.
And then you know I wassupposed to go to state that
year that was my first timegoing to Nats and all of a
sudden none of that washappening the way that we
thought it would.
(37:59):
We didn't even.
I mean there was kind of a ministate that was kind of thrown
together, which was really greatthat the state got together and
still kind of did something.
But you know, for all intentsand purposes, I missed my first
state.
And then my first Nats wasonline, which thankfully sort of
(38:20):
I was competing in XTEMP thatyear.
So I still got to do somethinglike live in the moment and feel
like I was, you know, doingnationals.
But it was like I was justsitting in front of my laptop at
my dining room table at home,which was maybe a little bit
anticlimactic for my firstNationals experience.
And then the next year, I mean,almost everything was online.
(38:43):
You know, district state Nats.
Once again, I did have a kindof silly experience that year
where my Wi-Fi cut out in themiddle of drama semifinals at
State and I was losing my mindbecause I was like in the middle
of performing and then all of asudden everything just went
down and I was like, oh no, likethis is the end of it for me,
(39:05):
like this is the end of my life,you know, as a high schooler
does.
And then the wi-fi at theschool turned back on and I
finished my performance and itwas fine, but that was.
You know, it was pretty scaryin the moment, uh, but just like
that time of having to like gofrom being in person to online
(39:27):
and then back in person wasreally scary.
I don't know if anybody elsehas really talked about this,
but I was absolutely terrifiedto go back in person after I'd
been online for a couple ofyears.
My first time doing my oratoryin person I guess ever because I
had started doing oratory whenwe were online was at districts,
(39:51):
my senior year, and so that wasa terrifying experience for me.
I was like I don't know whatI'm doing, blah, blah, blah.
And in those moments where I waskind of adapting to these new
situations, just kind of beingable to remind myself like you,
your, you know your body andyour mind just have this amazing
(40:16):
capability of like taking careof you in moments when you don't
know if they will, and kind ofrelying on that almost muscle
memory or just that routine oflike you know what you're doing,
you've done it before, even ifyou haven't, like you have those
baseline skills that are goingto carry you through, like.
That was something that becamereally important to me.
(40:37):
As we were kind of back andforth and there was all that
uncertainty was just like take adeep breath, like just trust
yourself and you're going tocarry yourself through this one
way or the other.
And I mean, even in my hardmoments in speech and debate.
This is, this is my own littlething, and if any of my students
(40:57):
are listening to this podcast,they're gonna be like oh my god,
she's talking about her coffeeagain.
But my thing that I talk aboutall the time is that I'm a big
coffee drinker and every morningit's kind of ritualistic me I
drink my cup of coffee and Iplay my silly little games.
You know, I do like the NewYork Times Connections that was
(41:17):
my favorite.
Sometimes I'll do the Wordle orwhatever, and this is like a
big thing for me.
Like every morning, this iswhat I do, and so when I have
those hard moments, somethingI've learned to do is tell
myself no-transcript, and sothat's something my students are
(42:00):
probably sick of hearing me say.
But whenever we have hardmoments as a team or as
individuals, I'm like what arewe going to do tomorrow?
We're going to wake up and we'regoing to drink our silly little
coffee and we're just going tokeep putting one foot in front
of the other because you?
Don't really get another choicein the matter and you're just
going to keep moving forward andthe world is going to keep
moving forward and everything isis going to be okay that's.
Lyle Wiley (42:23):
That's very lovely.
I'm gonna remember that I'llwake up, drink my solo coffee,
play my solo little games.
Are you still playingconnections?
Is that the game that you liketo play in the morning?
Yeah, that's kind of my main.
Play my silly little games, areyou still?
Whitney Brooks (42:34):
playing Connections.
Is that the game that you liketo play in the morning?
Yeah, that's kind of my mainone.
My mom and I, ever since Imoved away to college, we
maintain our connectionprimarily via silly little games
.
So every morning we will sendeach other our results for the
Connections or the Wordle orwhatever it is.
We're also friends on Duolingoand we keep each other our
(42:56):
results for, like theconnections or the wordle or
whatever it is.
We're also friends on Duolingoand we we keep each other
motivated for our Duolingostreaks.
Lyle Wiley (43:01):
You know the important stuff.
The important stuff, it'slovely.
Are you like a hardcore coffeedrinker, like do you have to
have a certain kind of coffee,or you can kind of go with
anything?
Whitney Brooks (43:09):
Yeah, I'm kind of cool with anything.
Yeah, I'm kind of cool withanything.
I did not start liking coffeeuntil a little bit later in my
life, so I'm not superpretentious about it.
It's just important that it'spresent and, uh, highly
caffeinated that's pretty doable.
Lyle Wiley (43:26):
So that's yeah, you can pretty much make that black
coffee, no matter what it is,I'm cool.
Nice, well, that is actually anice little uh.
I think that's a good way todeal with fears.
I think that'll be helpful topeople I do.
Uh, so tell me what's.
What's, what's coming up foryou next, like what?
What are you looking forward tothis year?
Whitney Brooks (43:47):
Yeah, I mean hopefully coaching again.
We're still waiting on allsorts of admin and everything.
But yeah, I've got someexciting stuff going on this
year.
I'm entering my junior year atcollege, starting a new
internship with the UniversityFoundation, doing some
philanthropy giving work, whichwill be really cool, and I'm
(44:12):
going to be doing a semesterabroad in the spring.
I'm going to be in theNetherlands at Utrecht
University, so that's prettyexciting.
Lyle Wiley (44:22):
Yeah, that's super exciting.
That'll be a great experience.
There's some big stuff comingup for you this year While
you're experiencing next year.
I'm sure a speech debate willbe part of that and I just like
to ask people like what for youright now?
Like what is it that you lovethe most about the speech and
debate situation, community teamcompetition, anything?
Whitney Brooks (44:43):
Yeah, I mean, there are so many things that I
love about it.
I love, I think maybe what Ilove most though which is tough
for me to pick one is that itreally teaches you a lot of
resiliency.
I mean, you're put into a lot ofnew situations, a lot of scary
(45:07):
situations Ooh, a clapocalypseand you just kind of have to
learn how to roll with thepunches.
And something that I love is itreally encourages you to just
keep learning and just keepmoving forward.
You know, there's something sobeautiful about this ability
(45:30):
that speech and debate peoplehave to, you know, have a
terrible weekend and come backon Monday and see your ballots
that are like straight sixes,like harsh feedback, and instead
of just, you know, kind ofthrowing your hands up in the
air and giving up, we're justlike, okay, cool, I'm going to
do this again next weekend andI'm going to do it slightly
(45:52):
better than I did last time.
And there next weekend, and I'mgoing to do it slightly better
than I did last time, andthere's just something so kind
of beautiful to me about thatthat we just we can keep rolling
with these punches and justkeep learning and keep getting
after it, no matter what.
Lyle Wiley (46:09):
I like that.
I like that.
I do think this is connected tomy question.
I've kind of been closinginterviews out with people,
which is like you know.
I mean public speaking is likepretty feared by the general
public.
I mean to the point thatthere's surveys and stories out
there about people being moreafraid of public speaking than
death.
I mean, I think we've all heardthat which, whether or not
that's totally true, it'sdefinitely like something that
(46:30):
people are not they, they'reterrified of, they're not like
cool with.
So you know, speech, innovate,like we actively put ourselves
in these situations where we'refacing this, this terror.
So what do you think?
Why, how and why is it worth it?
Whitney Brooks (46:46):
I mean, I think that the biggest thing that you
get out of speech innovate isjust learning how to do hard
things.
Like we as people are so muchmore capable than we think that
we are, we always, you know,kind of envision these limits
(47:09):
and these boundaries forourselves, and most of the time
we are actually able to totallyexceed those and we just don't
even realize it because we'retoo afraid to put ourselves in
the situation.
So what I love about speech anddebate is that you just kind of
have to get out there and dothe darn thing and if it doesn't
(47:29):
work out, thenucks at least Iknow now.
But at the end of the day, likeyou are going to gain so much
even just from trying, and ittakes a lot of courage and a lot
of vulnerability, whichsometimes to me are synonyms, uh
to be able to get up in frontof a room of people and talk to
(47:52):
them about something that youcare about, and so just being
able to do that, no matterwhether you get a lot of
external success and a lot ofexternal validation or not, that
is just so incredible to me,and I think that's part of why I
love speech and debate so much,because it is scary and you do
it anyways, and that experiencein and of itself is just so
(48:16):
amazing for you.
Lyle Wiley (48:17):
That's some great stuff, whitney.
I appreciate you being here anddoing the interview and helping
us through the clapocalypsehere this year at Camp One, clap
Two, so thank you so much forbeing a part of this.
Whitney Brooks (48:32):
Yeah, thank you so much for letting me be part
of this.
Lyle Wiley (48:36):
Thank you to Whitney for being here at Camp One Clap
.
It was an absolute joy to talkto Whitney and I learned a lot
from her.
And you know what?
You totally should check outher Substack Again.
That's Genuine Knockoff atSubstack, so
genuinenockoffsubstackcom.
What's new at camp tomorrow?
Well, good friend of thepodcast, uuun, will be here to
talk about choosing a platformtopic and writing a great speech
(48:58):
.
Don't forget, social media.
Challenges are live for everyday of camp this August and
we'll see you again tomorrow.
Campers, oh, quickly though,before you go, make sure you
watch out for flesh-eating beesout there in the Clapocalypse.
You know what those are called,right, yeah, zombies For Camp
on Clap.
This is Camp Director Wileysigning off.
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