November 11, 2025 • 33 mins
What happens when a lifelong dream collides with an unexpected diagnosis? For David Suarez, the path seemed clear from the age of six: become a cardiovascular surgeon and heal broken hearts. But when David was fast-tracked into Brown University’s prestigious medical school, a sidelining diagnosis and an aha from God showed him that there was more than one way to fix a broken heart.
A shower of surrender showed David an entirely new way to see God and deal with his narcolepsy diagnosis. And he found a natural antidote in sharing Jesus with others that led David down an entirely new career path.
David is now a high school Bible teacher as well as published apologist. See how God guides David from one passionate career choice to another, and how he is now fixing broken hearts.
Some of David’s Books:
David’s Book, Worldview Review: A Guide to Worldview Formation, Christian Apologetics, Comparative Religion, and Evaluating Competing Belief Systems
David’s Book, The Death of Allah, 10 paradoxes that dismantle Islamist theism
What Should a Muslim Believe? a field guide for Christians
The Sleepy Seminarian, apologetics questions and answers by David
Helpful Links:
Reformed University Fellowship
Let us know what you thought of the show!
Follow One80 on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or our website.
Never miss a One80. Join our email list.
Follow us on Instagram.
Share One80, here's how!
OneWay Ministries
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Announcer (00:02):
Welcome to One80.
Transforming testimonies fromnext door to across the globe.
Be amazed at how God works tobring people to Himself.
Share today's One80 with afriend.
It might be the best news theyhear today.
David Suarez (00:19):
Since I was six years old, I wanted to be a
cardiovascular surgeon.
I wanted to see people's heartsget better.
That's what I wanted.
Ever since I was six years old,I worked so hard straight days
through elementary, middle, andhigh school, going to every
single nerd group I could,trying to get to a good college
so I can work and finally helppeople's hearts get better.
I wanted to work on hearts.
(00:41):
And now the thing that I needto do that, a functioning awake
brain, God has taken away fromme.
Margaret Ereneta (00:52):
David Suarez had dreams of becoming a
cardiovascular surgeon, whichwere soon becoming a reality as
he was a student at BrownUniversity, fast-tracked into
their prestigious medicalschool.
But a God-given dream and asidelining diagnosis made David
wonder if there was more thanone way to fix a broken heart.
(01:16):
This is your host, MargaretEreneta.
Welcome to David's One80.
David Suarez (01:30):
And I am so excited to be on this podcast to
talk about the wonderful workof God in someone who once did
not know him very well, despitebeing surrounded by him my whole
life.
I was completely surrounded.
I was born in a place that wascalled the city of churches,
actually, and there was churchesat every corner, and I was
raised in the church since I wasa very young kid in a more
(01:52):
Pentecostal background, uh,assemblies of God type
environment with all the flagsand the twirling and the
tambourine and everything.
And, you know, I was surroundedby believers.
I was surrounded by Christians,and I was a believer as a very
young kid.
One of the most important earlymemories that I had after my
parents had divorced when I wasfour was around the age that I
(02:14):
was six.
And I was in kids' ministry atmy church, and it was so
wonderful.
Pastor Gary was speaking.
I loved each moment.
And then he tells us this storyabout a man named Solomon.
And I was so shocked by thisstory as a little kid because
God offers all these differentoptions to Solomon, and Solomon
instead chooses wisdom, wisdomto follow God.
(02:36):
And as a little kid, I rememberthe moment I heard that story,
I just started weeping.
And I couldn't really explainwhy I was weeping, but I just
started crying and weeping.
And I, you know, there is alittle altar call for all of us
little kids, you know.
So a little six-year-old mewalks over and is still crying a
ton, it's not running down myface.
And I say, Pastor Gary, pleasepray that I have wisdom.
(02:57):
I want to have wisdom.
And then he starts crying too,and he doesn't know why.
And then he prays for me and hesays, God will give you wisdom.
And that was a prayer andperhaps even a promise, because
as the years went on, I learneda lot about the scripture.
Margaret Ereneta (03:14):
This is a little confusing.
You might think here that Davidbecomes a Christian, but it's
actually much later.
This is head knowledge, andhe's going to clarify the
difference between headknowledge and heart knowledge
later on in the story.
Listen in.
David Suarez (03:27):
I memorized uh a lot of the scripture for this uh
interesting competition calledJunior Bible quiz, JVQ.
So I did that for a couple ofyears, and I was part of the
leadership teams at my church,and I was part of all these
different ministries.
And yet, it wasn't really untilhigh school that I started to
understand a little bit moreabout God.
(03:49):
And even then, as I'm goingthrough high school, it's just
because I'm surrounded bynon-believers.
And now that I see there's alot more non-believers, I start
to say, oh, I see that noteverybody agrees with uh me
about the faith.
Well, that's new, but uh Iwasn't really too keen on trying
to explain my faith to anybody.
So I went through my highschool years pretty quietly, uh,
not too loud and proud to be aChristian.
(04:10):
And then it wasn't untilcollege that I started to
realize that I knew very littleabout God.
So much so that my first yearof college, I didn't even choose
to join any ministry in theuniversity at all.
I went to Brown University, uh,Ivy League school, very
secular, very, very secular.
And I chose to just stay awayfrom a lot of the Christian
(04:32):
communities for the first, youknow, year and a half.
And I was not doing that well.
I was embroiled in my own sin,my own uh addictions and
struggles.
And instead of actuallystruggling against those sins, I
kind of just let them overtakeme in this new environment.
And I started to occasionallywatch the Sunday service from
back home every Sunday bymyself, but still no ministry
(04:55):
community, no evangelisticcommunity, nothing that's
pushing me to really study thescripture, study God, ask
questions about God, pursue God.
And as people asked mequestions about my faith,
surrounded by so manydisbelievers, I didn't know what
to say.
Margaret Ereneta (05:09):
So David's so frustrated, he's not able to
explain Christianity, and he'sabout to endure a big trial.
David Suarez (05:18):
And this all came to a head when around my first
attempt at my junior year atBrown University, and that
phrase there, first attempt, iskey to the story.
I was working and trying to getthrough all of my uh medical
biology classes and physiologyand all that, only to find that
I couldn't stay awake.
(05:39):
No matter what.
I could not stay awake.
I would take multiple energydrinks and take multiple
espresso shots.
And after taking three or fourespresso shots and a full energy
drink, can I could not stayawake in class.
No matter how much sleep I got,I couldn't stay awake.
As a matter of fact, it wassometimes so bad that I actually
couldn't tell if I was dreamingor awake because my dreams and
(06:00):
my awake state sort of fusetogether.
So there was actually uh onevery strange, extremely strange
story where a guest speaker cameto one of our medical
disability classes, and as theguest speaker was talking, I'm
looking at them, and this isafter like a month and a half of
these, you know, really strangesymptoms of me constantly being
tired happen.
And I'm looking at them, thenall of a sudden, everything
(06:20):
changes while my eyes are stillopen, everything changes.
And it's almost like this personis part of a Pokemon Go game,
and I'm trying to catch themwith a Pokeball.
But I have my notebook in frontof me.
This person is on the stage,and apparently, this whole time
that I'm imagining all thishappening, on the notebook, I'm
actually doing this becausethat's what you do on the
Pokemon Go game.
(06:41):
You throw a ball and toss it atthe person.
And I was just imagining myselfdoing that.
And then eventually, someonebumped me on the shoulder and I
like woke up from this littlehallucination dream thing, and
they said, Are you okay?
And I'm like, No, I don't knowwhat just happened.
I think I'm going crazy.
So I was completelyexhausted. Dream and reality
(07:05):
were starting to fuse together,and I thought, what is going on?
I I why is God letting thishappen?
And then it gets worse becausenow I have to take a medical
leave year.
I thought it would be a fewmonths, but it became a whole
gav year as I came back home andhad to wait for doctors to find
an answer to what was happeningto me.
And ironically enough, when Icame back home, I was reaching
(07:27):
out to every doctor I could, andthey all just so happened to be
on vacation or sick at theexact same time.
So I'm like, okay, this isstrange.
Maybe God is calling me to prayfor healing as a way to, you
know, show his glory.
So I pray every single day forwhat, at that point, like three
(07:47):
months, every single day, everymorning and night, praying in
the shower, crying out to God,praying every single day for God
to heal me, just heal me.
I know I have faith more than amustard seed, surely.
So just heal me.
Why won't you do that?
Margaret Ereneta (08:01):
So David is praying incessantly for healing
and it's not coming.
Listen in.
David Suarez (08:08):
And then after about three months of crying out
every single day, I'm I'm justcrying on the shower floor and
thinking, I just don't get it.
Like, what's the point of Godgiving me this desire to go to
medical school since I was sixyears old?
Since I was six years old, Iremember specifically stating I
(08:28):
wanted to be a cardiovascularsurgeon.
I wanted to see people's heartsget better.
That's what I wanted.
Ever since I was six years old,I worked so hard straight days
through elementary, middle, andhigh school, going to every
single nerd group I could,trying to get to a good college
so I can work and finally helppeople's hearts get better.
I wanted to work on hearts.
(08:48):
And now the thing that I needto do that, a functioning awake
brain, God has taken away fromme, it seems.
God, why would you give me adesire that I can't fulfill?
And as I'm crying out to God,literally crying in the shower,
that's where I would go sofamily wouldn't hear me crying.
I heard this sermon from aspeaker, a preacher, who to this
(09:11):
day I don't know who it was,um, but it was playing on my
phone.
I guess I had my YouTube feedopen and it skipped to the very
next video on my random feed.
And there was this pastortalking.
And this pastor was speakingabout the Garden of Gethsemane,
and he said that our Lordhimself, the perfect innocent
(09:32):
one, Jesus Christ, when in thegarden, is crying out according
to the Gospel of Luke.
He has drops of sweat likeblood falling from his skin in
agony for the true agony that'sthat's awaiting him.
And he says," let this cuppass from me this free hour, and
yet, not my will, but yours bedone, Father".
(09:55):
And I realized something.
I had never actually prayedlike that.
My whole life, my entire life,I have never prayed that.
I've always prayed for what Iwant, all the things I want, but
I never prayed that God's willwould be done.
(10:17):
And so, in that moment, I said,I'm gonna pray like that.
Because clearly, my will is notthat good.
So I'm going to pray like that.
God, not my will, but yours bedone.
And I kid you not, since thatday, I felt peace.
I felt peace in pursuing whatGod had for me.
Margaret Ereneta (10:40):
So David has this powerful prayer in the
shower.
He comes out transformed, he'spouring through the Bible, and
he finds apologetics.
David Suarez (10:49):
See what happens when he starts using apologetics
himself after I had finallygiven my illness and this
condition to God, and mind you,this is before I even knew what
it was, uh, because there wereno doctors around to tell me
what it was.
I got out of the shower and Isaid, God, I don't think I
(11:10):
understand you.
But I love you.
So I started from that dayreading the scripture every day.
And then I started to berealize that I was quite
confused about various verses.
So then I would look online totry to find how people would
explain these various verses.
And then I would find YouTubevideos in which people explained
(11:32):
these verses, and these peoplewere called apologists, and I
did not know what on earth thatwas.
I'm like, what is an apologist?
What are they sorry for?
I thought the word apologistmeant someone who apologized, so
I didn't know any better.
And so I see that there's thisone guy, and his name was like
Ravi, and I'm like, what aninteresting name.
I don't know who this guy is.
So I click on it and he'stalking about Jesus and he's
explaining the Trinity so simplyto this atheist that on this
(11:56):
stage, and I'm like, oh, thisguy's pretty cool.
And then I started to realize,wait, Christians can do that?
Like, we can just give answersto people's questions.
And then in that feed, I seeanother video recommended to me
by a guy called Dr.
Frank Turek.
And I'm like, who's this guy?
He's talking to all thesecollege students too.
And it wasn't just onequestion, there was like 20 or
(12:17):
30 college students going up tothis microphone, and I'm
thinking, oh man, this is soterrifying.
I would never put myself inthat situation.
And then he's just answering alltheir questions so simply by
showing how Christianity gives amore consistent answer to the
question than their eight ownatheistic worldview does.
And I'm watching these guysevery day.
I kid you not, I wake up, I putone of them on, and I'm
(12:40):
listening to them, and I'm and Istart to, you know, I start to
just sit back and be like, wow,I feel so much peace just
knowing that there's thesepeople who know so much about
the Bible and about God and theycan answer these questions.
And then it hits me.
Why can't I do that?
Like, I can't just rely onthese people my whole life,
right?
I actually have to learn howhow how do they think that way?
(13:01):
Like, what what is it in theirbrain that allows them to think
in this deep, rational way?
So then I start to look uponline how does you know someone
become an apologist?
What do they read?
What are some resources?
And then I am just reading onething after another, and I have
a science background, so thisstuff kind of starts to fit with
me.
I'm like, oh, it's just answersto questions.
But I just I feel this burningin my heart to start telling
(13:24):
people about God.
I start going to coffee shops,I start going to libraries when
it's the part that they let youspeak louder.
And I would just be studying myBible and all these theology
textbooks, and then go to anatheist and just start talking.
And I just couldn't help butsay, hey, you know what?
God loves you.
And I don't just believe in aGod who's some sort of guy with
a beard and a cloud, I believein a God who's who's got all
(13:46):
these attributes and who's areal personal being and we see
his fingerprint in creation.
And the atheist was like, Allright, well, tell me about him.
I'm like, okay.
And then I and after that firsttime, which my heart was
racing, my hands were so shaky.
Uh, but after that first time,I realized how awake I felt.
And I was like, I forgot whatthis felt like.
(14:07):
I haven't even taken a sip ofmy coffee yet.
Why am I so awake?
Not that coffee worked on mebecause uh I didn't have the
medicine at the time.
So I'm like, why do I feel soawake?
And then I realized when Italked about God, I just feel
awake.
This is the craziest thing.
I'm gonna start tellingeverybody about Jesus.
And so, perhaps for slightly uhselfish reasons, I was telling
(14:28):
people about Jesus because ithelped me stay awake.
Um, yeah, it was so fun.
I loved it.
I felt this insatiable need tostudy the Bible, to study
apologetics, to study whatChristianity is, how to defend
my faith, how to present it topeople in a logical, reasonable
way.
And it was shocking to me thatsomeone like me could be raised
in the church, surrounded by Godmy whole life, totally
(14:50):
God-honoring mother who uhserved God with all her heart,
and and brothers in the churchas well, uh, despite our
struggles here and there.
And I was surrounded by thiswonderful Christian community.
Yet, despite all the verses Imemorized for those Bible
competitions, I couldn'tunderstand any of them until I
was like 19 or 20.
(15:12):
It wasn't until I was throwninto the pool, right?
Thrown into a life ofdifficulty and medical challenge
and a lot of people whodisagreed with me.
That was the time that Ifinally learned how to explain
my faith and how to live it out.
And after all those months,finally a doctor who wasn't on
vacation or and who wasn't sickcame around and they were able
(15:33):
to discover during my medicalleave year that I had a type of
sleep disorder, a narcolepsy.
Type two narcolepsy.
So there's narcolepsy type one,where someone is pretty good
throughout the day, but thenthey, if you excite them too
much or if you make them laughor anything like that, then
their muscle tone just getsdropped and they just fall to
(15:54):
the ground, they fall asleep.
People who are like very awakeor you know, somewhat awake and
then fall asleep randomly.
I had type two narcolepsy, somepeople call it hypersomnia, so
just super sleepy.
And so I was just alwaysexhausted.
You know, there's no like highand then a drop.
I'm just always at the bareminimum level of awake.
And yet, while I am coming torealize about this diagnosis,
(16:16):
before they even give me anymedical treatment, I noticed
that I was okay and awake if Italked to people about God.
Whenever I was going to thesecoffee shops, it wasn't the
coffee that helped me, I know,because I tested it out.
Uh I come from a sciencebackground, right?
at Brown University, I wouldslice mouse brains to analyze
their cells to see if there wasalso a way to convert kidney
(16:37):
cells to neuron cells, right?
Uh I was I was very intoscientific methodologies and uh
academic rigor.
So I was testing all this outand I realized the only
consistent thing that allows meto stay awake without any
medication was speaking topeople about God and teaching
people about God.
So then I'm so confused, right?
Because I'm like, thank you,God.
The I know I didn't want tohave this medical leave year
(16:59):
off, but now I had a chance tostudy apologetics every day,
read the Bible every day, prayand fast and everything.
This was really good for me.
But now it's time to, you know,go back to college and uh get
ready for the life that I hadplanned.
And the life that I had plannedwas, again, to go to medical
school.
But then I started to think asmedical school loomed, because I
(17:20):
was part of a program at BrownUniversity where they had
automatically accepted me tomedical school.
If I just made it through Brown,I wouldn't have to take the
MCAT at all.
They would just accept meimmediately to the medical
school.
So I'm I'm still pursuing thisfield of cardiology.
I want to study cardiology andfix people's hearts.
But then as I uh go back toBrown and I'm going through my
(17:41):
last, my second attempt atjunior year, which went way
better, I was still wondering inmy head, God, this doesn't make
sense.
I mean, I have medicaltreatment now, I've got medicine
that allows me to kind of stayawake, but it's never the same
as when I'm just talking aboutGod.
When I talk about God, I stayawake for a long time and very
alert.
How is it that I am gonna makeit through medical school when
now I have this desire to tellpeople about Jesus all the time?
(18:04):
And then during my senior yearat Brown, because I had a
decision to make about if Iwould go to medical school right
after Brown University orwithhold for a year.
And so I was fasting, doing aDaniel fast, and then I had a
very strange dream.
And in the dream, it became veryclear to me that the thing
which seems like it has my nameright in front of me would
(18:24):
actually be the death of me.
But it became extremely clearthat what was before me was not
for me, because it would itwould be the death of me.
So I decided to let the schoolknow I won't go to medical
school at least for a year.
I need a year to think aboutit.
And so I graduated from BrownUniversity, still trying to
figure out why God would give mea desire to see hearts fixed,
and then also give me the onlyway out of my narcolepsy, which
(18:47):
is to talk to people aboutJesus.
I'm like, I can't do this in amedical setting.
It's just it's a no-go.
I'm not allowed to.
And so I take a year uh after Igraduate just to work at a
clinic to see if I want to go toministry.
I start to think, well, maybethat ministry is something to
do, you know, seminary, you cando apologetics.
But I go to the clinic because adream that I've had since I was
(19:09):
six years old is really hard tolet die, you know.
So I'm really trying super hardto hold on to this little
dream.
And after about, you know, sixmonths of 70 hour weeks every
week, I decided, no, I I'm I'mgoing to ministry, I'm gonna go
to seminary.
And I felt so much peacebecause the day I left that
(19:30):
clinic and I went back home, Ileft Brown.
I had graduated from Brown withmy bachelor's in premedical
health and human biology, and Iwas signed up for seminary at
Southern Evangelical Seminary,and I finally felt this peace
from God.
And then I realized in thatmoment, oh my goodness, there's
more than one way to fix aheart.
And that thought blew my mind.
(19:52):
There is more than one way tofix a heart.
You don't always need a scalpeland a suture to fix up a heart.
Sometimes it's just thescripture and a good word.
And I went to seminary.
I uh just this year, earlierthis year, graduated with my
master's in Christianapologetics.
Margaret Ereneta (20:09):
Isn't it cool how David's illness pointed him
to a whole new career and wasable to put away his dream from
six years old to doing somethingfor the Lord and it's actually
healing his illness too.
David Suarez (20:25):
I think apologetics made me realize how
little I had thought of Godbefore.
Uh it's not until you'reconfronted with questions and as
I often say, thrown into thepool without floaties that you
start to realize just how littleyou do or don't know.
And the moment I started tosubmit to Christ as my king, and
(20:47):
even letting my mind, my minditself, be transformed by Christ
instead of being conformed tothe likeness of this world, but
instead being renewed throughthe reading of his word, I
started to realize that Christis just true.
He is good, and all the littleexperiences I had of Christ as a
kid, and all those wonderfulworship songs and everything,
Christ is good, but he's alsotrue.
(21:09):
And that was really shocking.
Uh, in in studying apologetics,pursuing my masters, I realized
that I saw Christ for so muchof my life as a savior to give
me comfort in times of struggle,which is a blessing about two
and a half years ago.
I said, God, I'm going throughmy seminary, but I need a job
(21:30):
where I can teach people aboutGod or talk about God.
If there's a pastoral job outthere, please send it my way.
I'm praying and I'm praying,and suddenly I get a text about
this opening at a localChristian high school.
And who would think?
It's for a Bible teacher.
Someone who gets to teach OldTestament and New Testament's
survey, uh, apologetics,worldview ethics, the works of
(21:53):
C.S.
Lewis, uh, chapel ministry.
And I taught them aboutapologetics theology, uh,
philosophy, how to argue foryour beliefs in a logical way,
how to learn how to change yourmind, because you do have to
learn how to change your mind.
It's not exactly an easy thing.
As a matter of fact, a lot oftimes when you're incorrect
about something you hold toostrongly, and you start to
(22:14):
realize that you're incorrectabout it, you kind of feel like
you're dying.
I did 152 debates with studentsat the previous school.
Uh, we we I taught throughdebate.
I realize that a lot of them intheir debates would just the
moment you could see they'reabout to consider it, then
they're like, no, no, no, no,no.
It doesn't matter what you'resaying because I know I'm right,
even though they just provethat they're they're not.
(22:36):
I realize you have to teachpeople that it's okay.
You like you don't have toresist that dying, right?
You can actually accept thatlittle process of the little
deaths that we die every day,where you realize that the thing
you thought you knew was wrong.
And that's cool because thedeath we choose at the end, we
actually don't get a chance tochoose, right?
The many deaths we die is alittle thing to those who live
(22:57):
forever, right?
Christ will uh and has given useternal life.
And so I always rest on thatknowledge after all the ways
I've had to change my mind aboutChrist in my life, you know,
from just a cosmic vendingmachine who gave me what I
wanted, if I prayed hard enough,to now seeing him as my Lord
and Savior, King of all, youknow, King of Kings and Lord of
(23:18):
Lords.
I realize, you know what?
It's okay to be wrong if you'rein pursuit of the truth.
You know, I get to tell mystudents about Islam, which they
deal with all the time, uh, thenumber of times they it'll be
late at night and they'll sendme TikToks, random TikToks,
saying, Oh, Mr.
David, Mr.
David, I I don't know what todo.
There's this Muslim TikTok Ijust saw, and it sounds like
(23:40):
they're making a really goodpoint.
Is Christianity false?
And I'm like, calm down, calmdown.
Uh no, they're actually makinga serious fallacy here, and so
I'll explain uh whatever theissue is.
My students are like, oh,that's nice.
So I taught them how toevangelize to Muslims, how to
speak better, and evangelize toatheists.
And some of them have actually,you know, some were atheists
and now they're Christian.
(24:00):
And other ones uh who haveMuslim friends, they've been
evangelizing.
And I got a message earlierthis summer, about a month and a
half ago, and one of mystudents said, Hey, I
evangelized to a Muslim and hebecame a Christian.
It's awesome.
I was like, Wow, you see, ourlessons matter.
You can learn a ton if you payattention in class.
Margaret Ereneta (24:17):
David Suarez is an author and he has some
books out, and one is calledWorldview Review, and he's gonna
take us through how that bookunfolded, and it's a cool story.
David Suarez (24:29):
Yeah, I I still do go to coffee shops, but now
with my wife who is pregnant.
Um and as a result of beingwith my pregnant wife, I don't
do all the things I used to doat coffee shops.
Uh I used to go to coffee shopsand I would spend hours and
hours and hours at these coffeeshops talking with atheists,
(24:51):
trying to explain Christiantheology and the Christian world
view to them.
I started to realize somethingthat happens a lot.
And it's not just talking to theatheists at the coffee shops
that I would go to, but also,you know, the Muslims I would
talk to as well, is that it'salmost as if we were talking
past each other, right?
I was trying to explain truthand morality and beauty and all
this evidence for God.
And a lot of times it's it's asif they just either are
(25:13):
unwilling to understand what I'mtrying to argue for, or they
really just don't have theability quite yet to understand
it.
I was wondering why it is itthat we're talking past each
other?
And I was sitting there and Iwas praying, God, please give me
wisdom.
Just like when I was a littlekid, I guess.
God, please give me wisdom.
I I I can't get it.
I I feel like there's got to bean easier way to describe your
(25:36):
truth to people, and also for meto better understand them so
that I'm not so shocked whenthey have different opinions.
And I and I'm praying and andpraying to God, and then out of
nowhere, all of a sudden, I havethis little chart in my head.
And it's it's a really simplechart.
It's it's three columns andit's just one row, right?
So it's a really simple chart,and and the uh the chart title,
(25:58):
you know, it's just each of thecolumn titles is uh truth,
morality, and free will or freereasoning.
And underneath each one, forthe objective truth one, that
column, it has knowable orunknowable.
Objective morality has knowableor unknowable, and the free
reasoning one, it's by itself.
And I realize I can just askpeople how they feel about
(26:20):
truth, morality, and free will.
Because based on the way thatthey answer their questions,
these questions about truth,morality, and free will, I can
understand what their worldviewis.
It made everything so much moreclear because every single
worldview, without exception,every worldview tries to answer
(26:40):
these three questions, whichbreak down into other questions.
They try to answer doesobjective truth exist?
And if so, is it knowable?
Does objective morality exist,right?
Is there true good and trueevil?
And if it does exist, is itknowable to us?
And are we able to freely reasonand freely choose between
better and worse true and falseoptions?
Like, do we have the kind ofbrains that were designed to
(27:02):
freely reason about the truth?
Do we have brains that weredesigned to find the truth?
Or are brains just chaotic andwho knows what they were
designed for?
Right?
For the Buddhists, they wouldsay that, you know, in some
forms of Buddhism, that thetruth is not accessible to us.
In many forms of Hinduism, uh,there's Maya, right?
Depending on which version ofHinduism, there's maya, which
means illusion.
Like the true reality is notaccessible to our minds until we
(27:25):
become enlightened to realizethat we're Brahmin, right?
We're we're God too.
But the issue is if I can'tknow truth, then I can't know at
what point I start to knowtruth, which means I can never
know truth.
But if I can never know truth,I have an untrue or an
inconsistent worldview, right?
Because I reject objectivetruth.
And then I realized my chartisn't just helpful, it actually
(27:46):
shows what worldviews areimpossible.
Any worldview that denies truthas being accessible to us is a
worldview that makes knowledgeimpossible, which means it's an
unin or unknowable,unknowledgeable worldview.
And nobody wants to hold to anunknowable or unknowledgeable
worldview, right?
And if your worldview stops youfrom being able to reason, you
(28:06):
have an unreasonable worldview.
And that's something I taughtmy students.
And my book is actually writtenso that even middle schoolers
could understand it, and my highschoolers love it to bits at
the new school I'm teaching at.
Because all you have to do isrealize some worldviews aren't
even really worth arguing aboutbecause they defeat themselves
on step one.
That's why I call itpre-apologetics.
Some things are just soself-destructive,
(28:30):
self-contradictory, that they'renot even worth giving these
long, expansive arguments for.
Just tell them, well, here'sthe issue with your worldview.
And here's how it, you know,you're sitting on a tree, you're
cutting the branch you'resitting on with your worldview.
Jump to Christianity.
This is actually a good branchon a good tree with deep roots,
you know?
This is this is a better way toapproach reasoning in the first
(28:51):
place.
Because our worldview, at thevery least, is reasonable.
As in, it makes us able toreason.
And so that's that's where Igot that idea just from, again,
a coffee shop and a prayer.
And I've been using that littletable, that little chart, for
like what, now two and a halfyears, because that little table
led me for the last two and ahalf years to work on a book and
(29:11):
to test it out with people fromdifferent faiths and even, you
know, Christian foundations, butfrom atheism and agnostics.
And I started to realize thiswas a really good and simple
approach for people, you know.
So it it made evangelism a loteasier because I could
understand people better, butalso they were able to
understand their own worldviewbetter and see that Christianity
(29:31):
is not just true, but it's alsobeautiful and reasonable and
awesome and cool, which isgreat.
Uh, and so that's why, youknow, this this all of it
started with just a coffee shop,a barista who had to get back
to work, and a prayer and anapkin, which I scribbled very
quickly.
Margaret Ereneta (29:49):
For my last question, I asked a difficult
one to David.
What would you say to somebodywho is realizing they have a lot
of head knowledge and not a lotof heart knowledge?
David Suarez (30:01):
It's really, really difficult having a lot of
head knowledge when you'reyounger and immature.
Because head knowledge does notequate to wisdom, number one.
I'll tell you that veryclearly.
And I think parents know thatvery well if they have very
smart children.
Well, smartness and headknowledge doesn't equate to
wisdom, you know, the rightapplication of knowledge.
But for somebody who has a lotof head knowledge but not much
(30:23):
heart knowledge, I would pressthem to start thinking about the
beauty of God or the beauty ofthe beliefs they're holding to.
Because beauty is very deepintellectually, but also
profound emotionally, right?
Uh God isn't just true,although that's good, but God is
also beautiful.
(30:44):
Think about the vast expanse ofthe one perfect eternal being,
God, coexistent as these threepersons who one of these persons
chose to take on a human natureand dwell amongst his creation,
so that, as the early churchfathers said, he can redeem the
fullness of the human life forus.
Now, yes, that isintellectually true, but it's
(31:07):
alsobeautiful.
At the very foundation of thesethings, I would just want to
live for a God like that.
A God who was willing to diefor me, of course I would want
to live for him.
Hey, started to realize thatbeauty isn't just some sort of
emotional reaction to, you know,something that's wonderful, but
it's also just a description ofthe nature of God.
(31:29):
But number two, realizing thatthis isn't just an intellectual
pursuit or an academic game.
We're talking about a God whodied for you, right?
And rose again, so that hecould justify freely forever
those who would come onto himand abide in Jesus Christ, our
Lord and Savior.
Head knowledge will often giveyou a lot of what's.
(31:50):
Here's what I believe, here'swhat the Bible says about this
topic, here's what this says.
But how often are we pushed toanswer why?
Often our churches don'tprepare us for a lot of whys.
I was raised in the church andI was not ready for a single
why.
And when uh one of my bestfriends sent me a text in
college saying, Wow, the God ofthe Old Testament is a really
(32:12):
brutal god, I said like fiveheresies trying to respond to
him.
I said five heresies justtrying to respond to my friend.
And I was raised in the churchand I couldn't answer or give a
response to this singlestatement he made.
I started to realize headknowledge doesn't actually mean
head understanding.
And when you start tounderstand something and see it
(32:32):
as good and beautiful, that'swhen it starts to move to the
heart.
So I started to see God as goodand beautiful, and I started to
pursue understanding ratherthan just knowledge.
Margaret Ereneta (32:46):
Thanks for listening to the show today.
I really do want to have youcheck out the show notes for
this one.
There's so much that David'sprovided for us.
Not only his books, there'smore than the one he mentioned,
but he also has some coolministries.
An apologetics ministry onYouTube.
He has a young adults ministryon Instagram, and a lot of
(33:06):
helpful tools for you.
So check out our show notes onthis show and share it with a
friend.
It may be the best news theyhear today.
Welcome to One80.
Transforming testimonies fromnext door to across the globe.
Be amazed at how God works tobring people to Himself.
Share today's One80 with afriend.
It might be the best news theyhear today.
David Suarez (00:19):
Since I was six years old, I wanted to be a
cardiovascular surgeon.
I wanted to see people's heartsget better.
That's what I wanted.
Ever since I was six years old,I worked so hard straight days
through elementary, middle, andhigh school, going to every
single nerd group I could,trying to get to a good college
so I can work and finally helppeople's hearts get better.
I wanted to work on hearts.
(00:41):
And now the thing that I needto do that, a functioning awake
brain, God has taken away fromme.
Margaret Ereneta (00:52):
David Suarez had dreams of becoming a
cardiovascular surgeon, whichwere soon becoming a reality as
he was a student at BrownUniversity, fast-tracked into
their prestigious medicalschool.
But a God-given dream and asidelining diagnosis made David
wonder if there was more thanone way to fix a broken heart.
(01:16):
This is your host, MargaretEreneta.
Welcome to David's One80.
David Suarez (01:30):
And I am so excited to be on this podcast to
talk about the wonderful workof God in someone who once did
not know him very well, despitebeing surrounded by him my whole
life.
I was completely surrounded.
I was born in a place that wascalled the city of churches,
actually, and there was churchesat every corner, and I was
raised in the church since I wasa very young kid in a more
(01:52):
Pentecostal background, uh,assemblies of God type
environment with all the flagsand the twirling and the
tambourine and everything.
And, you know, I was surroundedby believers.
I was surrounded by Christians,and I was a believer as a very
young kid.
One of the most important earlymemories that I had after my
parents had divorced when I wasfour was around the age that I
(02:14):
was six.
And I was in kids' ministry atmy church, and it was so
wonderful.
Pastor Gary was speaking.
I loved each moment.
And then he tells us this storyabout a man named Solomon.
And I was so shocked by thisstory as a little kid because
God offers all these differentoptions to Solomon, and Solomon
instead chooses wisdom, wisdomto follow God.
(02:36):
And as a little kid, I rememberthe moment I heard that story,
I just started weeping.
And I couldn't really explainwhy I was weeping, but I just
started crying and weeping.
And I, you know, there is alittle altar call for all of us
little kids, you know.
So a little six-year-old mewalks over and is still crying a
ton, it's not running down myface.
And I say, Pastor Gary, pleasepray that I have wisdom.
(02:57):
I want to have wisdom.
And then he starts crying too,and he doesn't know why.
And then he prays for me and hesays, God will give you wisdom.
And that was a prayer andperhaps even a promise, because
as the years went on, I learneda lot about the scripture.
Margaret Ereneta (03:14):
This is a little confusing.
You might think here that Davidbecomes a Christian, but it's
actually much later.
This is head knowledge, andhe's going to clarify the
difference between headknowledge and heart knowledge
later on in the story.
Listen in.
David Suarez (03:27):
I memorized uh a lot of the scripture for this uh
interesting competition calledJunior Bible quiz, JVQ.
So I did that for a couple ofyears, and I was part of the
leadership teams at my church,and I was part of all these
different ministries.
And yet, it wasn't really untilhigh school that I started to
understand a little bit moreabout God.
(03:49):
And even then, as I'm goingthrough high school, it's just
because I'm surrounded bynon-believers.
And now that I see there's alot more non-believers, I start
to say, oh, I see that noteverybody agrees with uh me
about the faith.
Well, that's new, but uh Iwasn't really too keen on trying
to explain my faith to anybody.
So I went through my highschool years pretty quietly, uh,
not too loud and proud to be aChristian.
(04:10):
And then it wasn't untilcollege that I started to
realize that I knew very littleabout God.
So much so that my first yearof college, I didn't even choose
to join any ministry in theuniversity at all.
I went to Brown University, uh,Ivy League school, very
secular, very, very secular.
And I chose to just stay awayfrom a lot of the Christian
(04:32):
communities for the first, youknow, year and a half.
And I was not doing that well.
I was embroiled in my own sin,my own uh addictions and
struggles.
And instead of actuallystruggling against those sins, I
kind of just let them overtakeme in this new environment.
And I started to occasionallywatch the Sunday service from
back home every Sunday bymyself, but still no ministry
(04:55):
community, no evangelisticcommunity, nothing that's
pushing me to really study thescripture, study God, ask
questions about God, pursue God.
And as people asked mequestions about my faith,
surrounded by so manydisbelievers, I didn't know what
to say.
Margaret Ereneta (05:09):
So David's so frustrated, he's not able to
explain Christianity, and he'sabout to endure a big trial.
David Suarez (05:18):
And this all came to a head when around my first
attempt at my junior year atBrown University, and that
phrase there, first attempt, iskey to the story.
I was working and trying to getthrough all of my uh medical
biology classes and physiologyand all that, only to find that
I couldn't stay awake.
(05:39):
No matter what.
I could not stay awake.
I would take multiple energydrinks and take multiple
espresso shots.
And after taking three or fourespresso shots and a full energy
drink, can I could not stayawake in class.
No matter how much sleep I got,I couldn't stay awake.
As a matter of fact, it wassometimes so bad that I actually
couldn't tell if I was dreamingor awake because my dreams and
(06:00):
my awake state sort of fusetogether.
So there was actually uh onevery strange, extremely strange
story where a guest speaker cameto one of our medical
disability classes, and as theguest speaker was talking, I'm
looking at them, and this isafter like a month and a half of
these, you know, really strangesymptoms of me constantly being
tired happen.
And I'm looking at them, thenall of a sudden, everything
(06:20):
changes while my eyes are stillopen, everything changes.
And it's almost like this personis part of a Pokemon Go game,
and I'm trying to catch themwith a Pokeball.
But I have my notebook in frontof me.
This person is on the stage,and apparently, this whole time
that I'm imagining all thishappening, on the notebook, I'm
actually doing this becausethat's what you do on the
Pokemon Go game.
(06:41):
You throw a ball and toss it atthe person.
And I was just imagining myselfdoing that.
And then eventually, someonebumped me on the shoulder and I
like woke up from this littlehallucination dream thing, and
they said, Are you okay?
And I'm like, No, I don't knowwhat just happened.
I think I'm going crazy.
So I was completelyexhausted. Dream and reality
(07:05):
were starting to fuse together,and I thought, what is going on?
I I why is God letting thishappen?
And then it gets worse becausenow I have to take a medical
leave year.
I thought it would be a fewmonths, but it became a whole
gav year as I came back home andhad to wait for doctors to find
an answer to what was happeningto me.
And ironically enough, when Icame back home, I was reaching
(07:27):
out to every doctor I could, andthey all just so happened to be
on vacation or sick at theexact same time.
So I'm like, okay, this isstrange.
Maybe God is calling me to prayfor healing as a way to, you
know, show his glory.
So I pray every single day forwhat, at that point, like three
(07:47):
months, every single day, everymorning and night, praying in
the shower, crying out to God,praying every single day for God
to heal me, just heal me.
I know I have faith more than amustard seed, surely.
So just heal me.
Why won't you do that?
Margaret Ereneta (08:01):
So David is praying incessantly for healing
and it's not coming.
Listen in.
David Suarez (08:08):
And then after about three months of crying out
every single day, I'm I'm justcrying on the shower floor and
thinking, I just don't get it.
Like, what's the point of Godgiving me this desire to go to
medical school since I was sixyears old?
Since I was six years old, Iremember specifically stating I
(08:28):
wanted to be a cardiovascularsurgeon.
I wanted to see people's heartsget better.
That's what I wanted.
Ever since I was six years old,I worked so hard straight days
through elementary, middle, andhigh school, going to every
single nerd group I could,trying to get to a good college
so I can work and finally helppeople's hearts get better.
I wanted to work on hearts.
(08:48):
And now the thing that I needto do that, a functioning awake
brain, God has taken away fromme, it seems.
God, why would you give me adesire that I can't fulfill?
And as I'm crying out to God,literally crying in the shower,
that's where I would go sofamily wouldn't hear me crying.
I heard this sermon from aspeaker, a preacher, who to this
(09:11):
day I don't know who it was,um, but it was playing on my
phone.
I guess I had my YouTube feedopen and it skipped to the very
next video on my random feed.
And there was this pastortalking.
And this pastor was speakingabout the Garden of Gethsemane,
and he said that our Lordhimself, the perfect innocent
(09:32):
one, Jesus Christ, when in thegarden, is crying out according
to the Gospel of Luke.
He has drops of sweat likeblood falling from his skin in
agony for the true agony that'sthat's awaiting him.
And he says," let this cuppass from me this free hour, and
yet, not my will, but yours bedone, Father".
(09:55):
And I realized something.
I had never actually prayedlike that.
My whole life, my entire life,I have never prayed that.
I've always prayed for what Iwant, all the things I want, but
I never prayed that God's willwould be done.
(10:17):
And so, in that moment, I said,I'm gonna pray like that.
Because clearly, my will is notthat good.
So I'm going to pray like that.
God, not my will, but yours bedone.
And I kid you not, since thatday, I felt peace.
I felt peace in pursuing whatGod had for me.
Margaret Ereneta (10:40):
So David has this powerful prayer in the
shower.
He comes out transformed, he'spouring through the Bible, and
he finds apologetics.
David Suarez (10:49):
See what happens when he starts using apologetics
himself after I had finallygiven my illness and this
condition to God, and mind you,this is before I even knew what
it was, uh, because there wereno doctors around to tell me
what it was.
I got out of the shower and Isaid, God, I don't think I
(11:10):
understand you.
But I love you.
So I started from that dayreading the scripture every day.
And then I started to berealize that I was quite
confused about various verses.
So then I would look online totry to find how people would
explain these various verses.
And then I would find YouTubevideos in which people explained
(11:32):
these verses, and these peoplewere called apologists, and I
did not know what on earth thatwas.
I'm like, what is an apologist?
What are they sorry for?
I thought the word apologistmeant someone who apologized, so
I didn't know any better.
And so I see that there's thisone guy, and his name was like
Ravi, and I'm like, what aninteresting name.
I don't know who this guy is.
So I click on it and he'stalking about Jesus and he's
explaining the Trinity so simplyto this atheist that on this
(11:56):
stage, and I'm like, oh, thisguy's pretty cool.
And then I started to realize,wait, Christians can do that?
Like, we can just give answersto people's questions.
And then in that feed, I seeanother video recommended to me
by a guy called Dr.
Frank Turek.
And I'm like, who's this guy?
He's talking to all thesecollege students too.
And it wasn't just onequestion, there was like 20 or
(12:17):
30 college students going up tothis microphone, and I'm
thinking, oh man, this is soterrifying.
I would never put myself inthat situation.
And then he's just answering alltheir questions so simply by
showing how Christianity gives amore consistent answer to the
question than their eight ownatheistic worldview does.
And I'm watching these guysevery day.
I kid you not, I wake up, I putone of them on, and I'm
(12:40):
listening to them, and I'm and Istart to, you know, I start to
just sit back and be like, wow,I feel so much peace just
knowing that there's thesepeople who know so much about
the Bible and about God and theycan answer these questions.
And then it hits me.
Why can't I do that?
Like, I can't just rely onthese people my whole life,
right?
I actually have to learn howhow how do they think that way?
(13:01):
Like, what what is it in theirbrain that allows them to think
in this deep, rational way?
So then I start to look uponline how does you know someone
become an apologist?
What do they read?
What are some resources?
And then I am just reading onething after another, and I have
a science background, so thisstuff kind of starts to fit with
me.
I'm like, oh, it's just answersto questions.
But I just I feel this burningin my heart to start telling
(13:24):
people about God.
I start going to coffee shops,I start going to libraries when
it's the part that they let youspeak louder.
And I would just be studying myBible and all these theology
textbooks, and then go to anatheist and just start talking.
And I just couldn't help butsay, hey, you know what?
God loves you.
And I don't just believe in aGod who's some sort of guy with
a beard and a cloud, I believein a God who's who's got all
(13:46):
these attributes and who's areal personal being and we see
his fingerprint in creation.
And the atheist was like, Allright, well, tell me about him.
I'm like, okay.
And then I and after that firsttime, which my heart was
racing, my hands were so shaky.
Uh, but after that first time,I realized how awake I felt.
And I was like, I forgot whatthis felt like.
(14:07):
I haven't even taken a sip ofmy coffee yet.
Why am I so awake?
Not that coffee worked on mebecause uh I didn't have the
medicine at the time.
So I'm like, why do I feel soawake?
And then I realized when Italked about God, I just feel
awake.
This is the craziest thing.
I'm gonna start tellingeverybody about Jesus.
And so, perhaps for slightly uhselfish reasons, I was telling
(14:28):
people about Jesus because ithelped me stay awake.
Um, yeah, it was so fun.
I loved it.
I felt this insatiable need tostudy the Bible, to study
apologetics, to study whatChristianity is, how to defend
my faith, how to present it topeople in a logical, reasonable
way.
And it was shocking to me thatsomeone like me could be raised
in the church, surrounded by Godmy whole life, totally
(14:50):
God-honoring mother who uhserved God with all her heart,
and and brothers in the churchas well, uh, despite our
struggles here and there.
And I was surrounded by thiswonderful Christian community.
Yet, despite all the verses Imemorized for those Bible
competitions, I couldn'tunderstand any of them until I
was like 19 or 20.
(15:12):
It wasn't until I was throwninto the pool, right?
Thrown into a life ofdifficulty and medical challenge
and a lot of people whodisagreed with me.
That was the time that Ifinally learned how to explain
my faith and how to live it out.
And after all those months,finally a doctor who wasn't on
vacation or and who wasn't sickcame around and they were able
(15:33):
to discover during my medicalleave year that I had a type of
sleep disorder, a narcolepsy.
Type two narcolepsy.
So there's narcolepsy type one,where someone is pretty good
throughout the day, but thenthey, if you excite them too
much or if you make them laughor anything like that, then
their muscle tone just getsdropped and they just fall to
(15:54):
the ground, they fall asleep.
People who are like very awakeor you know, somewhat awake and
then fall asleep randomly.
I had type two narcolepsy, somepeople call it hypersomnia, so
just super sleepy.
And so I was just alwaysexhausted.
You know, there's no like highand then a drop.
I'm just always at the bareminimum level of awake.
And yet, while I am coming torealize about this diagnosis,
(16:16):
before they even give me anymedical treatment, I noticed
that I was okay and awake if Italked to people about God.
Whenever I was going to thesecoffee shops, it wasn't the
coffee that helped me, I know,because I tested it out.
Uh I come from a sciencebackground, right?
at Brown University, I wouldslice mouse brains to analyze
their cells to see if there wasalso a way to convert kidney
(16:37):
cells to neuron cells, right?
Uh I was I was very intoscientific methodologies and uh
academic rigor.
So I was testing all this outand I realized the only
consistent thing that allows meto stay awake without any
medication was speaking topeople about God and teaching
people about God.
So then I'm so confused, right?
Because I'm like, thank you,God.
The I know I didn't want tohave this medical leave year
(16:59):
off, but now I had a chance tostudy apologetics every day,
read the Bible every day, prayand fast and everything.
This was really good for me.
But now it's time to, you know,go back to college and uh get
ready for the life that I hadplanned.
And the life that I had plannedwas, again, to go to medical
school.
But then I started to think asmedical school loomed, because I
(17:20):
was part of a program at BrownUniversity where they had
automatically accepted me tomedical school.
If I just made it through Brown,I wouldn't have to take the
MCAT at all.
They would just accept meimmediately to the medical
school.
So I'm I'm still pursuing thisfield of cardiology.
I want to study cardiology andfix people's hearts.
But then as I uh go back toBrown and I'm going through my
(17:41):
last, my second attempt atjunior year, which went way
better, I was still wondering inmy head, God, this doesn't make
sense.
I mean, I have medicaltreatment now, I've got medicine
that allows me to kind of stayawake, but it's never the same
as when I'm just talking aboutGod.
When I talk about God, I stayawake for a long time and very
alert.
How is it that I am gonna makeit through medical school when
now I have this desire to tellpeople about Jesus all the time?
(18:04):
And then during my senior yearat Brown, because I had a
decision to make about if Iwould go to medical school right
after Brown University orwithhold for a year.
And so I was fasting, doing aDaniel fast, and then I had a
very strange dream.
And in the dream, it became veryclear to me that the thing
which seems like it has my nameright in front of me would
(18:24):
actually be the death of me.
But it became extremely clearthat what was before me was not
for me, because it would itwould be the death of me.
So I decided to let the schoolknow I won't go to medical
school at least for a year.
I need a year to think aboutit.
And so I graduated from BrownUniversity, still trying to
figure out why God would give mea desire to see hearts fixed,
and then also give me the onlyway out of my narcolepsy, which
(18:47):
is to talk to people aboutJesus.
I'm like, I can't do this in amedical setting.
It's just it's a no-go.
I'm not allowed to.
And so I take a year uh after Igraduate just to work at a
clinic to see if I want to go toministry.
I start to think, well, maybethat ministry is something to
do, you know, seminary, you cando apologetics.
But I go to the clinic because adream that I've had since I was
(19:09):
six years old is really hard tolet die, you know.
So I'm really trying super hardto hold on to this little
dream.
And after about, you know, sixmonths of 70 hour weeks every
week, I decided, no, I I'm I'mgoing to ministry, I'm gonna go
to seminary.
And I felt so much peacebecause the day I left that
(19:30):
clinic and I went back home, Ileft Brown.
I had graduated from Brown withmy bachelor's in premedical
health and human biology, and Iwas signed up for seminary at
Southern Evangelical Seminary,and I finally felt this peace
from God.
And then I realized in thatmoment, oh my goodness, there's
more than one way to fix aheart.
And that thought blew my mind.
(19:52):
There is more than one way tofix a heart.
You don't always need a scalpeland a suture to fix up a heart.
Sometimes it's just thescripture and a good word.
And I went to seminary.
I uh just this year, earlierthis year, graduated with my
master's in Christianapologetics.
Margaret Ereneta (20:09):
Isn't it cool how David's illness pointed him
to a whole new career and wasable to put away his dream from
six years old to doing somethingfor the Lord and it's actually
healing his illness too.
David Suarez (20:25):
I think apologetics made me realize how
little I had thought of Godbefore.
Uh it's not until you'reconfronted with questions and as
I often say, thrown into thepool without floaties that you
start to realize just how littleyou do or don't know.
And the moment I started tosubmit to Christ as my king, and
(20:47):
even letting my mind, my minditself, be transformed by Christ
instead of being conformed tothe likeness of this world, but
instead being renewed throughthe reading of his word, I
started to realize that Christis just true.
He is good, and all the littleexperiences I had of Christ as a
kid, and all those wonderfulworship songs and everything,
Christ is good, but he's alsotrue.
(21:09):
And that was really shocking.
Uh, in in studying apologetics,pursuing my masters, I realized
that I saw Christ for so muchof my life as a savior to give
me comfort in times of struggle,which is a blessing about two
and a half years ago.
I said, God, I'm going throughmy seminary, but I need a job
(21:30):
where I can teach people aboutGod or talk about God.
If there's a pastoral job outthere, please send it my way.
I'm praying and I'm praying,and suddenly I get a text about
this opening at a localChristian high school.
And who would think?
It's for a Bible teacher.
Someone who gets to teach OldTestament and New Testament's
survey, uh, apologetics,worldview ethics, the works of
(21:53):
C.S.
Lewis, uh, chapel ministry.
And I taught them aboutapologetics theology, uh,
philosophy, how to argue foryour beliefs in a logical way,
how to learn how to change yourmind, because you do have to
learn how to change your mind.
It's not exactly an easy thing.
As a matter of fact, a lot oftimes when you're incorrect
about something you hold toostrongly, and you start to
(22:14):
realize that you're incorrectabout it, you kind of feel like
you're dying.
I did 152 debates with studentsat the previous school.
Uh, we we I taught throughdebate.
I realize that a lot of them intheir debates would just the
moment you could see they'reabout to consider it, then
they're like, no, no, no, no,no.
It doesn't matter what you'resaying because I know I'm right,
even though they just provethat they're they're not.
(22:36):
I realize you have to teachpeople that it's okay.
You like you don't have toresist that dying, right?
You can actually accept thatlittle process of the little
deaths that we die every day,where you realize that the thing
you thought you knew was wrong.
And that's cool because thedeath we choose at the end, we
actually don't get a chance tochoose, right?
The many deaths we die is alittle thing to those who live
(22:57):
forever, right?
Christ will uh and has given useternal life.
And so I always rest on thatknowledge after all the ways
I've had to change my mind aboutChrist in my life, you know,
from just a cosmic vendingmachine who gave me what I
wanted, if I prayed hard enough,to now seeing him as my Lord
and Savior, King of all, youknow, King of Kings and Lord of
(23:18):
Lords.
I realize, you know what?
It's okay to be wrong if you'rein pursuit of the truth.
You know, I get to tell mystudents about Islam, which they
deal with all the time, uh, thenumber of times they it'll be
late at night and they'll sendme TikToks, random TikToks,
saying, Oh, Mr.
David, Mr.
David, I I don't know what todo.
There's this Muslim TikTok Ijust saw, and it sounds like
(23:40):
they're making a really goodpoint.
Is Christianity false?
And I'm like, calm down, calmdown.
Uh no, they're actually makinga serious fallacy here, and so
I'll explain uh whatever theissue is.
My students are like, oh,that's nice.
So I taught them how toevangelize to Muslims, how to
speak better, and evangelize toatheists.
And some of them have actually,you know, some were atheists
and now they're Christian.
(24:00):
And other ones uh who haveMuslim friends, they've been
evangelizing.
And I got a message earlierthis summer, about a month and a
half ago, and one of mystudents said, Hey, I
evangelized to a Muslim and hebecame a Christian.
It's awesome.
I was like, Wow, you see, ourlessons matter.
You can learn a ton if you payattention in class.
Margaret Ereneta (24:17):
David Suarez is an author and he has some
books out, and one is calledWorldview Review, and he's gonna
take us through how that bookunfolded, and it's a cool story.
David Suarez (24:29):
Yeah, I I still do go to coffee shops, but now
with my wife who is pregnant.
Um and as a result of beingwith my pregnant wife, I don't
do all the things I used to doat coffee shops.
Uh I used to go to coffee shopsand I would spend hours and
hours and hours at these coffeeshops talking with atheists,
(24:51):
trying to explain Christiantheology and the Christian world
view to them.
I started to realize somethingthat happens a lot.
And it's not just talking to theatheists at the coffee shops
that I would go to, but also,you know, the Muslims I would
talk to as well, is that it'salmost as if we were talking
past each other, right?
I was trying to explain truthand morality and beauty and all
this evidence for God.
And a lot of times it's it's asif they just either are
(25:13):
unwilling to understand what I'mtrying to argue for, or they
really just don't have theability quite yet to understand
it.
I was wondering why it is itthat we're talking past each
other?
And I was sitting there and Iwas praying, God, please give me
wisdom.
Just like when I was a littlekid, I guess.
God, please give me wisdom.
I I I can't get it.
I I feel like there's got to bean easier way to describe your
(25:36):
truth to people, and also for meto better understand them so
that I'm not so shocked whenthey have different opinions.
And I and I'm praying and andpraying to God, and then out of
nowhere, all of a sudden, I havethis little chart in my head.
And it's it's a really simplechart.
It's it's three columns andit's just one row, right?
So it's a really simple chart,and and the uh the chart title,
(25:58):
you know, it's just each of thecolumn titles is uh truth,
morality, and free will or freereasoning.
And underneath each one, forthe objective truth one, that
column, it has knowable orunknowable.
Objective morality has knowableor unknowable, and the free
reasoning one, it's by itself.
And I realize I can just askpeople how they feel about
(26:20):
truth, morality, and free will.
Because based on the way thatthey answer their questions,
these questions about truth,morality, and free will, I can
understand what their worldviewis.
It made everything so much moreclear because every single
worldview, without exception,every worldview tries to answer
(26:40):
these three questions, whichbreak down into other questions.
They try to answer doesobjective truth exist?
And if so, is it knowable?
Does objective morality exist,right?
Is there true good and trueevil?
And if it does exist, is itknowable to us?
And are we able to freely reasonand freely choose between
better and worse true and falseoptions?
Like, do we have the kind ofbrains that were designed to
(27:02):
freely reason about the truth?
Do we have brains that weredesigned to find the truth?
Or are brains just chaotic andwho knows what they were
designed for?
Right?
For the Buddhists, they wouldsay that, you know, in some
forms of Buddhism, that thetruth is not accessible to us.
In many forms of Hinduism, uh,there's Maya, right?
Depending on which version ofHinduism, there's maya, which
means illusion.
Like the true reality is notaccessible to our minds until we
(27:25):
become enlightened to realizethat we're Brahmin, right?
We're we're God too.
But the issue is if I can'tknow truth, then I can't know at
what point I start to knowtruth, which means I can never
know truth.
But if I can never know truth,I have an untrue or an
inconsistent worldview, right?
Because I reject objectivetruth.
And then I realized my chartisn't just helpful, it actually
(27:46):
shows what worldviews areimpossible.
Any worldview that denies truthas being accessible to us is a
worldview that makes knowledgeimpossible, which means it's an
unin or unknowable,unknowledgeable worldview.
And nobody wants to hold to anunknowable or unknowledgeable
worldview, right?
And if your worldview stops youfrom being able to reason, you
(28:06):
have an unreasonable worldview.
And that's something I taughtmy students.
And my book is actually writtenso that even middle schoolers
could understand it, and my highschoolers love it to bits at
the new school I'm teaching at.
Because all you have to do isrealize some worldviews aren't
even really worth arguing aboutbecause they defeat themselves
on step one.
That's why I call itpre-apologetics.
Some things are just soself-destructive,
(28:30):
self-contradictory, that they'renot even worth giving these
long, expansive arguments for.
Just tell them, well, here'sthe issue with your worldview.
And here's how it, you know,you're sitting on a tree, you're
cutting the branch you'resitting on with your worldview.
Jump to Christianity.
This is actually a good branchon a good tree with deep roots,
you know?
This is this is a better way toapproach reasoning in the first
(28:51):
place.
Because our worldview, at thevery least, is reasonable.
As in, it makes us able toreason.
And so that's that's where Igot that idea just from, again,
a coffee shop and a prayer.
And I've been using that littletable, that little chart, for
like what, now two and a halfyears, because that little table
led me for the last two and ahalf years to work on a book and
(29:11):
to test it out with people fromdifferent faiths and even, you
know, Christian foundations, butfrom atheism and agnostics.
And I started to realize thiswas a really good and simple
approach for people, you know.
So it it made evangelism a loteasier because I could
understand people better, butalso they were able to
understand their own worldviewbetter and see that Christianity
(29:31):
is not just true, but it's alsobeautiful and reasonable and
awesome and cool, which isgreat.
Uh, and so that's why, youknow, this this all of it
started with just a coffee shop,a barista who had to get back
to work, and a prayer and anapkin, which I scribbled very
quickly.
Margaret Ereneta (29:49):
For my last question, I asked a difficult
one to David.
What would you say to somebodywho is realizing they have a lot
of head knowledge and not a lotof heart knowledge?
David Suarez (30:01):
It's really, really difficult having a lot of
head knowledge when you'reyounger and immature.
Because head knowledge does notequate to wisdom, number one.
I'll tell you that veryclearly.
And I think parents know thatvery well if they have very
smart children.
Well, smartness and headknowledge doesn't equate to
wisdom, you know, the rightapplication of knowledge.
But for somebody who has a lotof head knowledge but not much
(30:23):
heart knowledge, I would pressthem to start thinking about the
beauty of God or the beauty ofthe beliefs they're holding to.
Because beauty is very deepintellectually, but also
profound emotionally, right?
Uh God isn't just true,although that's good, but God is
also beautiful.
(30:44):
Think about the vast expanse ofthe one perfect eternal being,
God, coexistent as these threepersons who one of these persons
chose to take on a human natureand dwell amongst his creation,
so that, as the early churchfathers said, he can redeem the
fullness of the human life forus.
Now, yes, that isintellectually true, but it's
(31:07):
alsobeautiful.
At the very foundation of thesethings, I would just want to
live for a God like that.
A God who was willing to diefor me, of course I would want
to live for him.
Hey, started to realize thatbeauty isn't just some sort of
emotional reaction to, you know,something that's wonderful, but
it's also just a description ofthe nature of God.
(31:29):
But number two, realizing thatthis isn't just an intellectual
pursuit or an academic game.
We're talking about a God whodied for you, right?
And rose again, so that hecould justify freely forever
those who would come onto himand abide in Jesus Christ, our
Lord and Savior.
Head knowledge will often giveyou a lot of what's.
(31:50):
Here's what I believe, here'swhat the Bible says about this
topic, here's what this says.
But how often are we pushed toanswer why?
Often our churches don'tprepare us for a lot of whys.
I was raised in the church andI was not ready for a single
why.
And when uh one of my bestfriends sent me a text in
college saying, Wow, the God ofthe Old Testament is a really
(32:12):
brutal god, I said like fiveheresies trying to respond to
him.
I said five heresies justtrying to respond to my friend.
And I was raised in the churchand I couldn't answer or give a
response to this singlestatement he made.
I started to realize headknowledge doesn't actually mean
head understanding.
And when you start tounderstand something and see it
(32:32):
as good and beautiful, that'swhen it starts to move to the
heart.
So I started to see God as goodand beautiful, and I started to
pursue understanding ratherthan just knowledge.
Margaret Ereneta (32:46):
Thanks for listening to the show today.
I really do want to have youcheck out the show notes for
this one.
There's so much that David'sprovided for us.
Not only his books, there'smore than the one he mentioned,
but he also has some coolministries.
An apologetics ministry onYouTube.
He has a young adults ministryon Instagram, and a lot of
(33:06):
helpful tools for you.
So check out our show notes onthis show and share it with a
friend.
It may be the best news theyhear today.
Popular Podcasts
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.