October 18, 2024 • 52 mins
We’re keeping the conversation going on Season 4 Episode 8, Lifeboat! We’ll hear from Showrunner and Co-creator John Hoffman and the final member of the Sauce Family, Desmin Borges who plays Alfonso Olivera!
We'll talk about the legend of Tony Danza in the Only Murders universe, the philosophical conundrum of Dudenoff's death, and… the beginnings of a new Mabel Mora mural!
You know the drill: There are spoilers for episode eight ahead. So listeners, if you haven't watched yet, stream it now and come right back!
Send us your thoughts and theories (in a voice memo!?): onlymurders@strawhutmedia.com
Or chat with fellow fans on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/OnlyMurdersHulu
The Giveaway
Want to win tickets to the Only Murders themed escape room!?
There are locations in both Los Angeles and New York. If you’re located around one of those two cities and you’d like to test your mystery solving chops with 3 of your best buds, here’s how you enter.
Leave this podcast a rating and review on Apple or Spotify — wherever you listen from — take a screenshot, and email it to us at onlymurders@strawhutmedia.com. Include which city you want to visit the Escape Room in — either NYC or LA.
We’ll pick 2 winners in LA and 2 in NYC. Each winner will get four tickets. We’ll choose the lucky detectives right before the season finale! Good luck!
We'll talk about the legend of Tony Danza in the Only Murders universe, the philosophical conundrum of Dudenoff's death, and… the beginnings of a new Mabel Mora mural!
You know the drill: There are spoilers for episode eight ahead. So listeners, if you haven't watched yet, stream it now and come right back!
Send us your thoughts and theories (in a voice memo!?): onlymurders@strawhutmedia.com
Or chat with fellow fans on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/OnlyMurdersHulu
The Giveaway
Want to win tickets to the Only Murders themed escape room!?
There are locations in both Los Angeles and New York. If you’re located around one of those two cities and you’d like to test your mystery solving chops with 3 of your best buds, here’s how you enter.
Leave this podcast a rating and review on Apple or Spotify — wherever you listen from — take a screenshot, and email it to us at onlymurders@strawhutmedia.com. Include which city you want to visit the Escape Room in — either NYC or LA.
We’ll pick 2 winners in LA and 2 in NYC. Each winner will get four tickets. We’ll choose the lucky detectives right before the season finale! Good luck!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Straw Media.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
I saw three amigos well before I was supposed to,
and I used to walk around and make everybody call
me ned Nita Lander.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
Thank you, Hello, and welcome to the Only Murders in
the Building Podcast.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
I'm Ryan Tillotson and I'm Maggie Bowles, and we are
looking behind the scenes and mining for clues as we
meet the cast and creators of the Hula original series
Only Murders in the Building.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Today on the show, we're continuing the conversation all about
season four, episode eight, Lifeboat.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
We'll hear from showrunner and co creator John Hoffmann and
Desmond Borjees, who plays Alfonso Olivera, the final member of
the Sauce family.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
We'll talk about the legend of Tony Danza in the
Only Murders Universe, the philosophical conundrum of Dudinoff's death, and
the beginnings of Mabel's new mural.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
So let's talk about episode eight, four oh eight Lifeboat,
another episode where the film mentioned in the title factors
pretty heavily into the episode. I think like it kind
of book ends it. We get it at the beginning
and at the end.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
I mean, I didn't know anything about life but I've
never also never seen.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Never seen it, although I hear it's one of Alfred
Hitchcock's most underrated films. Ah, yes, it is, so tell
us about lifeboat Lifeboat.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
Well, it's interesting because I was hoping, you know.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
This is John Hoffman, showrunner, co creator.
Speaker 4 (01:31):
I think everyone has expectations when you hear we're going
to be niming titles of each of these episodes movies,
and certainly rear Window would be the Hitchcock title that many,
I think, would expect to find in this group, and
I would too. I would normally think, great, let's put
rear Window in. And it might have made sense. It
probably made sense for some of the others. Some things
(01:52):
just landed and the way they did. But when we
came around to this episode eight, which was written by
Kristin Newman and Jake Schnezel, we were really knowing we
were going into this idea of people bonded together in
a tough situation and hanging onto each other and making
calls that are only within the certain situation that requires
(02:16):
intense need and love or other things. So that kind
of hotbed situation felt right the actual script. And I
feel bad because we don't have a Martin SCROSSESEI title
in the group, but at the time the script was written,
it was called Gangs of New York. And the further
(02:40):
we got into it, though thematically, I was finding myself
distanced from what the content of the episode was with
Gangs of New York. And then when we started editing
and putting together this voiceover that would be our thematic
and putting it to the Gangs of New York thing,
I was just like, something feels like a disconnect to me.
And so I at the very last minute, really in
(03:04):
editing decided like, I feel like this is more lifeboat
and made the segue over to that, and I really
like was delighted, and so is Kristin and Jake and
I sort of walked them through the new voiceover that
reflected that, and it all felt of a piece. I love.
The idea of a lifeboat can also look like a
(03:28):
pre war apartment building or an affordable apartment on the
Upper West Side, you know, And what would you do
to hang on to that? What would you do to
hold on to something like that if if the people
around you were that important, if you're all hanging in
together to survive that felt like perfectly time for our
rent controlled story that we were telling an eight.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Yeah, I get it.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
I get it too.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
In New York City, a lifeboat can look a lot
like an affordable apartment in a nice building on the
Upper West Side.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
In this episode, we see a set. We see Charles's
apartment that we found out we talked to Patrick he
rebuilt it, which I thought was crazy.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
About that he's a wizard.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
He's a wizard, which I loved hearing. But I want
we wanted to talk about the prop table. On the set,
you see a lot of stuff from season one and
I'm curious, curious if that was you, Like how did
you decide what got put in there?
Speaker 4 (04:33):
It's so great? Like now the show is the show? Right?
So I watched this progression and you must know, like,
being in charge of the show, I'm trying to sort
of at the beginning, like say, explain like why these
things are important and all the details of everything are important.
And then people watch the show and they recognize it.
And you have artists like the brilliant Diana Burton, our
(04:55):
prop master who worked this season for us, and just
perpetually like Susanna McCarthy before her delighted me. I'd walk
on sentence go oh my god. Or she would present
in a prop meeting, this is what we're thinking for this,
and you're they're thinking further along and ahead of all
the things they can have on that table that represent
(05:15):
a season one story based on a movie that's being made,
all of that, And I was like, oh my god.
So it's all really discovery for me now, whereas I
used to have to like walk people through and say, well,
what if it's this, what if it's this? Now we
have this history of the show that people can look
at and relate to and then pull from themselves, And
that's the greatest. When you walk in, you're completely surprised
(05:36):
by what's in front of you and you're like, well,
how many you made? Six of these? You know that
kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
So what is on that? What is on that prop
table that you that you think is like the most
niche maybe item on that, because I mean, we saw
the turkey. I love the morning turkey. There, we saw
the turkey. We saw some we saw the necklace and
some of the jewelry. We saw the bassoon case. I
think I saw some hardy boys books.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
Yes, right, all of this stuff. It makes my both
my heart open and like feel like, oh my god,
can you believe how far we've come since season one?
And then it also makes me, you know, have a
little ogita because I know what the writers went through
every time we had to say no, no, this is
the this is the ring that Zoe had on and
(06:23):
like and then the ring, like having to track rings
and jewelry over season one was like, I think we've
all talked about that, but yes, So a lot of
it makes my heart go like in the good way,
and then a lot of it causes palpitations because I
remember how much it was a challenge to sort of
make sense of all of it, you know, and and
(06:44):
have people understand like, Okay, this omelet is connected to
this story in Charles, and then it's going to spool
out this way. The rings are going to be this
multiple storyline thread and then anything. I love the Morning
Turkey though, The Morning Turkey is the greatest.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
Another weird thing in this episode is the Tony Danza
time to wear white Pants extrava Danza.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Who's I was expecting to see Tony Danza in this episode?
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Yeah, dance is the perfect Planza, I think tell us
about Tony Danza.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
Yeah, well sure. I again, this was one of those
things that like, wait, what are we doing? And you know,
you're sort of like, now you're following the writers who
have worked this thing out that they have like probably
too late in the day, and they they're punch drunk
or whatever, and they're on a Tony Danza riff. And
I remember reading and hearing about this pitch and thinking like,
(07:41):
wait a minute, what's going on with Tony Danza. Tony
Danza is the unofficial sort of arbiter of this was
this may not even be in the cut, but in
our story, Tony Danza is the unofficial arbiter of when
to you know, throwing the greatest parties in New York
and also when to where white after Labor Day? All
(08:01):
of the like, there's a whole thing about Tony Danza
in New York as a sort of seminole figure in culture.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
Is this is this only Murder's Law or this is
New York low?
Speaker 4 (08:12):
This is murder Law?
Speaker 3 (08:13):
Okay, okay, Yeah, So there's this whole history you guys
build about Tony Danza, like.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
Well, everyone follows Tony Danz's rule when you're like at
a party in the Hamptons, Like it's only done right
if Tony Danz is there and he's approved of the way,
you know, and when and where you're doing it. Like
this became a thing, so it got whittled down, of course,
like time wise and everything else, to like just this
notion of how to trap the Sauce family with the
(08:40):
who's the Sauce idea that Eugene Levy has and I
will personally just never forget. Like that was another one
of those moments in episode seven when Molly came in
and she was telling off the actors and Selena could
never keep a straight face. The breaking up of that
collection of brilliant acts throughout that scene on Charles's set
(09:02):
in episode eight, when Eugene Levy started talking about Tony
Danza and all of that, and Zach Galifanakis being utterly
annoyed every time you hear you're not going to talk
about Tony dance again, And then he's doing his crouching
bit behind him and working out his I don't know,
he's working out his quads. What do is he working on? Yeah,
(09:24):
I'm not sure glutes, I don't remember what it's but
that was one of those great memories. I just remember
coming up and they couldn't get through the scene.
Speaker 3 (09:33):
It's so funny because Eugene is just so straight talking
about like Tony Danza just so it's really funny.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
There's times when you just are in a room full
of the funniest people in the world and then you're like, Okay,
I can't believe this is the scene we gave them
to do. And then you watch them play it with
utter like only their personalities could do it, and you're like, Okay, well,
actually they sold this one.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
It's so good.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Well, and then later on we find out in the
in the Sauce Families flashback that Tony Danza is an
infests the Sauce. Is that what's the what's the connection there? Like,
are we going to learn more about that? Is Tony
Dance are going to show up?
Speaker 4 (10:17):
As I mean again, this goes to our lore of
Tony Danz's influence in New York culture, which unfortunately did
not make the final cut, but I think it would
have made a little more sense because Tony Danza seems
to be a bit ever present in the culture of
New York in our lore. So the idea that you know, yes,
there might be a little bit of a coincidence of like,
(10:38):
this is Eugene's plan and it also happens to be
what the Sauce family was about to make it trying
to make a deal with so that that whole thing
it feels funny to me in wild coincidence, but on
the other hand, it ties into the thing that may
be on the cutting room floor.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
It's very funny. It's very funny. It's very funny.
Speaker 4 (10:57):
And who's the Sauce who doesn't want to say that
a lot?
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Who's the I think we talked to Kristin and Jake
a little bit about all of the different Westies and
all of their different backstories. We did. Maybe you can
talk to us a little bit about that.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
That's it. We learn it all here right in this episode.
It's all like, you know, I think what feels like
coincidence to earlier episodes in many ways, I think across
the season when you're like, wait a minute, the brother
sisters know them and how to but it's all just
the way in which to me, when you're investigating something
(11:33):
and finding out like why are these people all here
and acting like a cult it's because they actually have
roots with each other that we explore in this episode
that but until then it all feels weird in certain
ways which feel like something to further investigate. And then
the idea to me that the brother sisters were a
(11:55):
part of this connection to Doudanoff and his film class
and being an intrinsic inspiration for them, and then to
sort of realize they took this movie because of this
building and because he lived in it and there was
a tie to him in that way. I felt that
(12:16):
was really cool as far as like just the things
that sort of at first on first look at something
feels like well that how how? And then the investigation
here is personal in episode eight and the story about
Dudenoff and what happened. Obviously by the end of episode eight,
for Dudenoff's end, we learn we learn has to have
(12:40):
like really deep rooted stories, backstories for all of them.
And I was very moved by you know, our resident
New York sort of research Maven in the room as
Madeline George, and she came in with so many any
stories like anecdotal stories of rent control schemes and rent
(13:05):
controlled plants or groups of people in apartment buildings gathering
to do something with a mutual interest that was shocking,
and it over and over again. We had stories like
that brought into the room, of people doing incredibly odd
things that become like eight people in an apartment building
on one floor, you know, cooked and boiled someone and
(13:28):
blah blah blah, you know, and did a whole thing
just to do this, and blah blah blah. These stories
seem a bit outlandish, and yet that's what we're playing
off of in some way, but in a sort of
like hanging to the emotional side of it with Dudanov
and the wish of a dream in companionship, and again
going to the sort of like core loneliness people finding
(13:51):
each other in New York City, you hang on to them. Yeah,
like a life boat.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
Okay, like a life.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
I don't know why I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
That, we're here for it, John.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
One of the recipients of that metaphorical lifeboat was Dudonov's
friend and neighbor, Alfonso olivera patriarch of the Sauce family
played by Desmond Borjez, and when we talked to him,
he hadn't yet seen this episode.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
I intentionally stay away from stuff so that I can
grow personal distance from it so that.
Speaker 4 (14:26):
My you know, crazy actor slash.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
I think I'm part elephant because I remember everything, like
every take, all the way down to the last detail.
So I really need to I like to remove myself
for a long time so that when I come to it,
it's been far enough away and I could actually enjoy
it as an audience member and not just go you know,
crazy actory nerdy about it, thinking about takes and possibilities
(14:51):
and things like that.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
So what they cut, what they didn't use?
Speaker 4 (14:54):
Yeah, yeah, well.
Speaker 2 (14:56):
That you know, I learned pretty early on that like
can't be too precious about anything, because once it's down
and it's on the tape and we move forward, they
it's to so many other people's discretions and not mine.
So I just try and make like everyone one that
I would be really excited to see pop up if
(15:17):
it happens to pop up. And I feel like that
was a pretty healthy mindset to develop pretty early on,
I think.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
So I am curious when I'm sure you have friends
and family who are watching the show. Do they come
to you with their theories? Do they ask you questions?
Do they like try to feel out or are they like,
don't tell me anything. I want to see how it
plays out.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
It's more like they'll broach the subject, and then as
soon as I start to figure out how I can
help satisfy scratching their itch without giving it away, they
see what's happening in my eyes and then they stop
me cold. So it's a fun little little game of
chicken we play.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
I'll bet, I'll bet so. In episode eight, we learn
the backstory of the Sauce family and and all the Westies,
including the final Westie who he had not met yet.
So can you describe to us how you think about
the Sauce family.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Oh, you know, I feel like the Sauce family represents
a lot of people that I've known throughout my life.
Like I grew up in Chicago and Logan Square in
the eighties when it wasn't hip to live there, right,
And the building that we grew up in was like
a seven flat Graystone. And my family's made up of
(16:41):
Puerto Ricans on my dad's side and Italians and Greek
second generation third generation on my mother's side, And it
was a mixture of all of us that we are
of living together. And one thing that I really realized
about being in that atmosphere that it's very fun, very boisterous,
and sometimes those those things sort of lend themselves to
(17:02):
sort of dangerous positions because everyone's really trying to do
their best at just sort of making it for their
family and for like the extended family that's in the building.
So I really like grasp onto that, like very very quickly, right, Like,
I feel like the Sauce family is just really doing
the best that they can to try and make their
(17:23):
dreams happen and you know, give their daughter the best
pathway forward that she can have. And so when you know,
they meet Dudent off right, they meet the other Westies,
we get that very sort of lovely, boisterous but somewhat
dangerous familial setting, right, and all of them are just
(17:44):
trying to do the best that they can for themselves
and for the collective group.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
And I don't see, you.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Know, as someone who lived in New York for quite
a long time, I see nothing wrong with anything that
they're doing, especially having a ham you know, some percutto
you know, just hamon Hagen. I wouldn't want that, you know,
just go in get a slice, you know, I mean
it's like meat butter. Why wouldn't you want a little
(18:11):
bit of that action in your life on a you know,
semi hourly basis.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Yeah, first hanging in the shower and then hanging on
the luggage cart two absolutely perfect places to hang a
harmon you.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
You got to put it somewhere.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Yeah, well, and you got to, you know, in the chaos,
you got to hope that they're looking somewhere else so
that they're not concentrating on you. I like to think
that that was like Alfonso's idea, but you know, I
don't want to take anything away from anybody else.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
What kind of sauce were you making? Do you know?
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Well, my favorite was, you know, like the PDPD sauce,
which is Portuguese, so it's sort of like smoky. Yeah,
it's kind of like their version of like Amatriciana, which is,
you know, like the tradition Roman red sauce that has
guancle in it, right, So it's very it's very similar
(19:05):
to that, although we had a red sauce and we
had a green sauce, but yeah, it kind of had
like a smoky, sort of salty tang to it.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
Just curious about. I mean, yeah, that's great.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
I mean I tasted all of them while I was there,
as you should. I wanted to know. I wanted to know, like,
are we good at making sauce? And you know, the
props department was excellent at making sauce. They had good
sauce on the stove.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
So after the break, who among the Westies did the
heavy lifting the best sauce on the set? And of
course theories.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Welcome back. There is a scene in this episode. It's
a part of Vince's flashback back to Judinov's class.
Speaker 6 (19:59):
Ye.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
The reason It's a Wonderful Wife is timeless comes down
to one thing.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Casting.
Speaker 5 (20:11):
You know, if you can populate your story with the
right people, your work will live forever.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
We wanted to hear John Hoffman's take on Milton Dudnoff's
feelings about It's a Wonderful Life.
Speaker 4 (20:26):
I feel there is a potency and like people who
love something. Dudenof is a film professor. Dudenoff loves film,
loves telling stories. And now it's clearly he's not going
to make films, so he can only inspire. So I
love teachers, I love like the idea of people who
love something so much but are perfectly happy living lives
(20:49):
where they hand that dream over to someone else and
encourage them. Is the most incredible thing to me. So
this idea that he's looking at that movie and saying
that that's what he feels is like the most important
thing about it is the casting of that movie because
of the way it makes you feel. Jimmy Stewart has
a quality that is so lifelong, warm and connective, and
(21:12):
everyone in that movie makes you feel something, and everyone
who watches it can help it be a wreck at
the end of it, all of those things. But that's
a universal sort of emotional thing that film can do.
And I think if you're a teacher and you have
a love of something, I love the idea of someone
when he's alone later in life and examining and looking
(21:34):
back on his life with some opportunity to do something
new or next after they've lost their spouse, putting together
a cast of people in making his own sort of
version of the film he wants to live in in
that building sort of felt sweet and profound in a
certain way and generous again from a sort of teacher's
(21:55):
sensibility to me. So I loved that character turn of
that's what he was doing for himself, and then he
had one request that it continue. And as he says
at the end of the episode down in the basement,
I never got a chance to do this, but I'm
going to make one movie that really means something for
(22:17):
this movie to continue, the movie that I've created up
here on this floor, that all of you stays in it.
And this is the way I think we can do that.
So that felt really deeply New York, deeply inspired by
what teachers do.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
I think, Yeah, yeah, I also think there's like probably
some some connection to like, you know, this pro like
only murders as a project and Steve Martin and Martin
short being such good friends and like casting each other
as the most important person in their lives, each other's
lives for the next life however many years, Like you know,
(22:54):
I feel like there's something something that reflects into reality.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
I never thought of it, right, it is it comes
right back to something like that. That's that's really true.
And again I think that's the intangible with the show,
is sort of the emotional quality that's happening between those
two guys who've known each other over thirty years and
they adore each other, and there's that underneath thing that
you feel that you can't create with other people who
(23:21):
don't have that.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
One of I think maybe my favorite moments of this episode.
I love watching Eugene mess with Steve. He's like a cat,
you know. It's like the way he pushes that little omelet.
Speaker 6 (23:39):
I love that.
Speaker 4 (23:41):
Yeah, I agree with you, and he relished it, which
made me really so happy because he like that whole
scene with the omelet and then kind of excited to
see him what does it look like? What does it
look like? Push him out of his comfort zone and
get him angry. The rage of a Canadian also was
(24:01):
exciting to me live in that space with Eugene Levy
for a bit. I loved every minute of that Tory
line for him.
Speaker 6 (24:10):
I'm a Canadian man connected to his rage right now
and good, it feels so good.
Speaker 4 (24:19):
Charles tantrum with me.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
No, no, no.
Speaker 6 (24:23):
They incinerated your friend, Charles, no, and then you with
word games from the New York Times.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
At the very end of the episode, we see Mabel
start to maybe start on a new mural. Is that
something we can we can look forward to? I think
I think her original mural was a very special thing.
Speaker 4 (24:50):
Yeah, well, I mean I like that we see her
drawing again and I feel like her it's a space,
you know, her growth to sort of find her own
independence and this odd space obviously that she's choosing to
do this in and it's hoping to sort of now
she knows the story of duden Off, the person who
was living there, and now she's sort of claiming it
(25:14):
in the spirit of At the end of episode eight,
I have to say, also, one of my favorite moments
maybe from the series, happens right before that, and it's
just this little moment and I almost think it was
a I think it was a thing Steve threw in,
but it was her at the elevator and we realized, oh,
wait a minute, she's on her floor, she's in her apartment.
(25:38):
The guys are going back to their apartments in the
other side of the building for the first real time
we've seen that, and so they all get in the
elevator and she's left outside of it, sort of independent
from them, and you just see Steve look back and
just say you good, and she nods, and she's claiming
some independence in it. But it's so sweet. I don't
(26:01):
know how to describe it. Those moments just like fell.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
Yeah, I agree. I think that's a really special moment.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
And that was just May decided on set, which I love.
I love those Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 4 (26:13):
Yeah that was Steve.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
I love it. It's very that's good.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Yeah, you got me in touch with my emotions.
Speaker 7 (26:19):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Well. It was an honor playing a small part.
Speaker 8 (26:23):
In bringing out your true self.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
And Charles, I won't.
Speaker 8 (26:27):
Alienate your audience by putting any of it on film, Hie, right,
you good?
Speaker 4 (26:42):
Yeah, I'm good.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
Well, okay, Mags, would you say Mabel is a Westino?
Speaker 1 (26:50):
I guess she. I guess she has to be. Maybe
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
Okay, Well, back to our Westy of the day, Alfonso
Sauce played by Desmond.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
We talked to Richard Kind before having seen episode eight,
and we've also talked to Daphne Rubin Vega, and we've
talked to Lilian Rabello. You're the last member of the
Sauce family that we're talking to.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
But also I was just, oh, no, I'm gonna have
to mess all this up. Now, what did they snatch?
Speaker 1 (27:20):
But I was thinking about because you said you have
you know, have the brain of an elephant maybe, And
Richard kind was very clear in telling us he remembers
nothing about anything, and so I'm curious what the experience
was like, you know, getting to know your fellow Westy's
on set. And then obviously I would love to hear
about the big, the huge scene where the Westies all
(27:43):
get to tell their stories to the two trios.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Well, first off, like I'm sure I'm not the only
one who's saying this on your podcast, Like it is
literally a dream come true on so many levels working
with the people that we get to work with on
this project, right like just before we get to the
West East as as a little dez, like I saw
three amigos well before I was supposed to, and I
(28:09):
used to walk around and make everybody call me ned
Nita Lander Like when I was young, I wanted to
be Martin Short and Rick moranis like Id's those are
just the two guys that I gravitated to in everything. So,
you know, being in the same room with him and
Steve and Eugene and Selena and Zach and Eva and
(28:31):
sort of watching like they're brilliant just sort of spill
over so easily and so naturally, Like sometimes I had
to remember, oh man, you got a line coming up,
let's stay hint. This sort of thing that was usually
just in the rehearsal process, not while we were filming,
but you know, trying to get a flow in a
field so that you could, you know, bring to the
(28:52):
table things that would not only help support, you know,
the overall story that we're telling, but also maybe surprise
them a little bit. Right.
Speaker 3 (29:02):
To be able to like make Steve or Marty laugh.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
At a moment that made them is like a total
total dream come true. But if we're talking specifically about
the Westies, I did my first major commercial in Chicago
with Richard Kind when I first got out of acting school.
It was Encore Frozen Foods. He had the he was
the spokesperson for the account. I still remember to this
(29:28):
day that when something happens on set, mister Kind, being
the lovely human that he is, he never curses. He
uses the word sugar incessantly, incessantly. It's amazing and hearing yeah, sugar, sugar,
(29:49):
you know, just not sugar.
Speaker 4 (29:51):
So it's and it didn't change, It hadn't change.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
It's like twenty years ago, right, So like so seeing him,
and then him remembering me as soon as he saw me,
because I was like someone jumping out of an airplane
crashing into a frozen foods aisle. And then he was like, hey,
you look like you're hungry. Here are some Encore frozen foods.
That's basically the commercial right. Let internet go find it
(30:17):
and have fun with it. So we have that, and then,
you know, I was a pretty big rent head as
a teenager, you know, like Jonathan Larson's Rent is up
there in one of the most magical theater experiences that
I ever got to, you know, experience, coming from Chicago
coming to New York checking it out. I saw the
(30:38):
original cast, and Daphne Rubin Vega is a queen among
queens as far as I'm concerned, So it wasn't difficult
for me to feel jealous that my wife enes in
the show was crushing on another guy, considering just how
otherworldly I consider her to be as a human and
(30:59):
as an artist. So it was fairly amazing. And then
kumel Man, I've been I've that dude. I can't say
enough like amazing things about him, Like he was, you know,
they were doing Silicon Valley while we were doing, You're
the worst, And we used to see each other sort
of at things in La a long time ago, and
(31:20):
to watch like what his career has done and just
how he's grown, Like I couldn't be more happier for
a fellow brown man on television, right, So, like it's
absolutely amazing from a personal standpoint, and then from an
artistic standpoint, all of them are crazy, crazy, ridiculous good
And if you know, John would and the directors, they'd
(31:42):
let us fly sometimes. So if you know someone was
feeling a moment and just wanted to keep going with it,
you couldn't ask for a better grouping of people just
to start going off the cuff with, you know, totally overall,
like what a little ridiculously amazed experience from top to bottom.
Speaker 3 (32:02):
Speaking of Camille, how was shooting that his A Few
good Men speech, Like I'm so curious to know, like how, yeah,
what it was like for you and for you in
that moment, because it's ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
It was phenomenal, absolutely phenomenal, And watching him change and
color it and then like stop and get an idea
and go back. And then he had alts upon alts
upon alts for everything and then watching him go through
those alts like it was like I was watching a
(32:36):
masterclass in acting, you know, and and but it was hilarious.
And that was the thing. All of us had to
like keep it together the entire time because depending on
what version of the shot you see, we're in the background,
right and we're invested in it, and as you know,
not only just as fellow same partners, but as fellow
Westy's we know this story right, and we want to
(32:57):
support him and have him tell it to the best
of visibility, to kind of, you know, keep our story
as a group afloat. And it was incredibly difficult with
all of them. It was incredibly difficult, especially the first
couple rounds, to kind of keep it together because you
hear them start doing stuff and it's just like, you know,
it's seriously what dreams are made of, seriously, without a doubt.
(33:20):
And I'm sure everyone else has said the exact same thing.
So I'm sorry listeners if I'm just repeating everything that
everyone has said. Every time you've listened to this podcast,
it went.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
Something like that. So you want answers, I think I'm entitled.
You want answers, I want the truth? You can't handle
the truth. Son.
Speaker 6 (33:38):
We live in a world that has walls, and those
walls need to be guarded by men with guns. Who's
going to do it?
Speaker 2 (33:42):
You?
Speaker 3 (33:43):
You, Lieutenant Weinberg. I have a greater I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Are you going to do the whole monologue?
Speaker 4 (33:47):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (33:48):
I was going to do the whole thing.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
I think it's worth it.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
I have a great Going back into your elephant brain archive,
what is what was your most memorable moment shooting this
entire season?
Speaker 4 (34:03):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (34:03):
Man, all right, there's so I mean, there's so many,
but you want one, so I'll give you one. It's
when we came back and turned the cameras around in
this scene in episode eight and Steve slowly starting to
fold the blanket and starting to lose his cool, right,
and then he comes over and they've got the bit
(34:24):
where they're not understanding him. They're thinking it's a game
of charades, and I think at one point he's like, yes,
you know, like that Steve Martin, like that face of despair,
and that's amazingly hilarious that he makes. Like watching him
(34:46):
do that from the rehearsal through every take was probably
the most amazing thing that I've ever witnessed being on
set ever, because you've seen it in its glory for
how many decades and then to watch it live happen
(35:07):
in front of you, watch the brilliance happen, and it
be different almost every time. You just feel lucky to
be in that room. And then we'd go over to
our chairs and hang out between setups, and then he
decided to do some sleight of hand magic tricks with
(35:30):
his card set for us, you know, and it's just
to kind of like wrap that whole entire experience together.
Like I could see it in everyone's eyes. It didn't
matter if you were like little boy Desmond or you know,
Eugene and Richard who have known him forever, Like there's
(35:50):
a magic that that man is able to bring to
everyone at any given moment. And just like being there
for that in that thing, I'll, you know, I, like
I said, I think it's the most memorable moment in
my entirety of my career thus far. Like that day
was just absolute magic in my mind.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
I love it that that was a great scene. I think,
you know, along with Eugene saying like I'm channeling him,
I can understand character. I can understand it's so funny.
Speaker 4 (36:23):
What else does he say that? This used to make
me left so hard.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
He was like, I'm a Canadian man getting in touch
with my raige, right, Like there's just you know, and
like when he would do it, like one eyebrow would
raise and the other one would kind of stay still,
you know, and it was just that, you know, yeah,
I but it. It's funny, but you know, like you
(36:49):
like watch them, do you know these brilliant, brilliant comedic things,
just like giving off one of each back and forth,
just giving it back and forth.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
Is like wow, yeah, wow.
Speaker 4 (37:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:03):
Earlier this week, we talked to writers Kristin Newman and
Jake Schnezl about the moral quandary of the episode, and
we're still on the side of the Westies and their
decision even after all this time.
Speaker 3 (37:16):
So these are not murders, no, but that one hell
of a podcast.
Speaker 2 (37:22):
And yes, we've been keeping up the rooms and oh god,
cashing his check.
Speaker 4 (37:28):
We're going to jail.
Speaker 1 (37:31):
Now, you're not.
Speaker 6 (37:33):
Guys.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
We used to be three lonely weirdos living in the Rconia.
The podcast brought us together. I don't want to use
it to tear them apart.
Speaker 9 (37:47):
So humanity is.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
More important to do than the podcast.
Speaker 4 (37:51):
What a Revelation, you know.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
I think the things about life in general that are
more somewhat digestible but technically illegal, really fall into like
what it's like to be a multi ethnic human in
a minerica. I feel like there's a lot of in
(38:16):
order in order to like move forward and to break
down doors, sometimes you have to do something that in
your heart of hearts you know is right, yet you
know the man will tell you that it's extremely wrong.
And I think one thing that was kind of, you know,
amazing about this is that these Westies know him and
(38:37):
trust him and love him so much that him coming
up with that idea, putting it forward to us, even
though we don't necessarily want to go along with it
because we don't want to see him go, we know
he knows best. And I think that's one thing that
a lot of people always take for granted that other
people live in their bodies and their skins and their
(38:58):
minds and their feelings for.
Speaker 3 (39:00):
Their entire lives.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
Right, But in that situation, you we we wanted to
help honor him to the best of our ability, and
if that was the way, then unfortunately that was the way,
not that it wasn't scarring, especially for our daughter.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
It is a it's a very big ask because you know,
what they don't what we don't see in the show
is like the actual physicality of performing that favor for someone,
which is like really harrowing to think about. So I'm
glad we didn't have to see that on camera because
that would have been a little too dark.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
Yeah, I think it's best to let the mind wander
with that one and let everyone make their own mental
pictures of you know how that would go about.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
Yeah, I assume it would be mostly Alfonso and Rudy
doing the heavy lifting in that. I would assume maybe,
you know, that's that's where my mind goes.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
I mean, I'm I'm you know, in my mind, I
think like Rudy probably picked him off up and draped
him over his shoulders like a barbell about to do
a hack squad, and then I was like, hold on,
hold on, I'll help you out. Right. There's like.
Speaker 1 (40:10):
It is a very philosophical episode, absolutely, you know, it
asks a lot of questions.
Speaker 5 (40:17):
And it's that you will all keep me alive. Well,
I mean, actually no, because I've just taken a hell
of a lot of pills. I want you tonight to
put my body in the incinerator. Yes, yes, And then
I want you to cash my Social Security checks and
(40:40):
I want you to tell everybody I just moved to Portugal.
Speaker 3 (40:46):
Do you know how it ends?
Speaker 2 (40:54):
The thing is if I say no, and that leads
listeners down a pathway where they could, you know, kind
of make assumptions about the Sauce family that I don't
think I want them making.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
Right, So there's no right answer here, No.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
Not at all. I mean, you know, if I say yes,
I know how it ends, then they're you know, let's
just say when I got the scripts and I was
downloading them and you know, chewing on them because they're
so delicious and amazing, right, Like, I really try to
go through the parts that the Sauce family wasn't directly
involved in so that when I do become an audience
(41:34):
member and I'm watching this, I feel like I'm watching
that part of the story for the very first time. Right, So,
like I would really i'd read them all and then
i'd really just like you know, laser in on anything
that had to do with the Westies and the Sauce
family and try to let my half human, half elephant
brain forget everything else that I read, which is pretty
(41:55):
difficult to do.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
All right, time to read some emails and share some.
Speaker 1 (42:08):
Theories, and I forgot about the East rag earlier. It
seems there is like a power outage over the opening
credits in the building.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
Interesting.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Yes, thanks for all of the emails. Thanks to Shelley J,
Trish T, Matti G, Katherine, Patricia G, Jennifer Y, Emily
P KK, Courtney, w tof H and Tim Why, our
Easter expert.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
All of them were Easter experts or just Tim.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
Tim Why has sent a bunch of emails about each
of the Easter eggs, and I appreciate it. He is
our expert.
Speaker 3 (42:43):
Vinnie s thinks Loretta as the killer, though I do
think this theory was from before episode eight, so I
wonder if he still thinks that.
Speaker 7 (42:50):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (42:51):
I can't imagine Loretta killing anyway. She's so I agree.
Ruth K. I'm sorry we failed you on the Billie
Joel references from UPSOT seven not being a huge I'm
sorry not being a huge billy, Joel expert. I didn't
even catch them, so we'll try and ask John about
it next time we talked to him.
Speaker 3 (43:08):
Vinya B. Thinks maybe Doreen and Marshall are in it
together and that maybe they had taken Dudenof's class possible.
She noticed two dolls with silver tinsel pom poms at
Doreen's house.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
She might be onto something because she also thought that
the Westies did not kill Dudenoff but did dispose of
his body.
Speaker 10 (43:29):
So onto something and that we learned just true in
this episode. Is so who knows Dan Dee has a
mastermind theory? He believes less of the Dorman might be it.
He noted that he's often taken for granted and that
he would know everything that goes on in the building.
So even though he might not be the one doing
the murdering, he may be the one pulling the strings.
Speaker 1 (43:48):
That's very interesting theory.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Laura B.
Speaker 1 (43:50):
Is thinking Bev and Marshall might be involved and that
Saz and Glenn were the targets, either because Bev is
breaking stuntman reunion rolls definitely and they knew, or because
Saz wrote the script and told Glenn about it.
Speaker 3 (44:03):
Interesting, very interesting. Liz S still thinks doctor Maggie is involved.
Speaker 1 (44:09):
We'll see if we see doctor Maggie again. And eb H,
thank you for telling us that Griffin Dunn is Joan
Didion's nephew. Of course, it's the same Griffin Dunn who
made the twenty seventeen documentary The Center Will Not Hold.
I wish we'd talked to griffind on this season.
Speaker 3 (44:25):
We should have reached out.
Speaker 1 (44:26):
We didn't know. What stupid stupid of us who produces
this show?
Speaker 3 (44:31):
Yeah, what idiots dumb. We also got a voice memo
two two voice memos.
Speaker 9 (44:35):
Hi, Maggie and Ryan, This is Trish Ryan. I completely
agree with you that Helga is not to be trusted.
She knew many obscure things that endeared her to Doudinov,
which is very suspicious. Also, her father has mentioned numerous times.
Fathers are a big theme of this season. I suspect
we will soon learn more about Helga's father and this
(44:56):
will connect Helga to Saz's murder and to Charles.
Speaker 11 (45:00):
On episode one, I have theorized that there is some
kind of metal poisoning going on, because Charles doesn't see
Sas until he's exposed to her ashes, and he specifically
said he would leave the jar open, so the water
could evaporate. Several times throughout this season so far, we've
been reminded of the jar. He will ei them, what
talk about it, or will be shown it. It's just
(45:21):
sitting in Charles's apartment, still open to the air, and
I think he's just kind of being poisoned that way. Secondly,
Richard Kine's character Vince mentions in passing that he has
an enlarged heart. This was like a throwaway comment at
the time, but a little Google search told me that
is a symptom of heavy metal poisoning as well. My
theory was pretty weak until we got the information about
(45:42):
Dudenov being ill. So if Dudnov was also ill when
he died, we know he had a metal joint, who's
to say that's not what caused his illness. And finally, GLENNS. Dobbins,
he seems to be hallucinating rats wherever he goes. Initially
kind of just seems it's in that bar, but he
also locinates them when he's in the elevator at the Alconia,
so it's everywhere. Now he's in the hospital, I am
(46:05):
convinced that we will discover that he has metal poisoning
and that is going to be the thing that connects everyone.
Speaker 3 (46:11):
Wow. Thank you so much Trish and Mikila for those
voice memos.
Speaker 1 (46:16):
Now, before we handed over to Hannah and the Only
Murder subreddit, here's what the writers of this episode, Kristin
Newman and Jake Shoneessel said about Reddit.
Speaker 12 (46:24):
We'd all love to give a shout out the Reddit
community because they often give us incredible credit for things
like anagrams.
Speaker 3 (46:33):
Lots of anagrams, all.
Speaker 12 (46:34):
Kinds of things that we're just going to take credit
for forever and that we carefully plat it plotted out,
and we're incredibly good and stuff. We strive to be
as intelligent as the reddit board things we are. They
talk with amazing things. I really think they should all
be hired.
Speaker 3 (46:50):
They think that as well. I would agree.
Speaker 12 (46:57):
Listen, if anybody wants to figure out season five, I
guess love it.
Speaker 3 (47:01):
Come on in, Okay, and now here's Hannah with the
Reddit scoop.
Speaker 7 (47:05):
Hey, Maggie, Ryan and everybody listening. We're getting so close
to the big reveal now and I really don't want
this season to end. But here are the latest theories
from the Only Murders in the Buildings. I've Reddit. This episode,
we finally meet Helga, and while she claims to be
an innocent Westy, our members have their doubts. Mom by
(47:25):
Mom says, I don't think episode eight clear to Helga
of suspicion. In fact, I'm more suspicious of her now.
The way she infiltrated the Westis was too obvious. She
already knew this obscure card game that they love. She
already knew the perfect stranger's theme song. She laid it
on thick with dudonof trying to force a father daughter's
(47:46):
surrogate relationship. And then there's the accent and the unusual
locksmith's skills. But it's really the plane ticket from SAS's
desk of clues that makes me sure that she's not
who she says she is. My theory is that she's
undercover FBI who infiltrated the Westies to investigate an older
crime in the building. She was probably looking at Dudonov
(48:09):
as a suspect, or maybe even Charles. Dudonov found out
she was FBI and forced her out. I mean, why
would her face have been scratched out of the photos
unless there was some kind of betrayal I think Helga
is one of the people watching the tree this season,
she flew out to La to talk to Saz to
find out what Sas knew since Sas was poking around
(48:29):
the Westies. Next, at the end of the episode, Helga
comes in with revelations that seemed to point to Glenn's Stubbins,
but member Heavenly Whale seems to think it's a red herring.
They say, I wonder if Glenn was harassing Saz, trying
to convince her there was something foul afoot, and he's
the reason she started investigating. And now that Saz was
(48:51):
taken out, the killer is after the only other person
who knew, which is Glenn. Next up, after the previous
episode Valley of the Dolts, some people grew suspicious of
Doreen and her husband, Big Mic and in Lifeboats we
are told about a certain project runconcoma Evelyn. The cat
(49:12):
Burglar points out Runkonkoma is a town in Suffolk County
in Long Island, and who lives in Suffolk County, Long Island,
Charles's sister Doreen and her husband Big Mike. Now, I
can't wait to find out if this means anything or not,
but I found that interesting. Now, despite what we found
out in Lifeboats, Marshall remains the subs number one suspect
(49:36):
at the moment. Evex Serif says the facts that Marshall idolizes.
Charlie Kaufman, a screenwriter famous for involving himself into scripts
and surprising ways, suggests to me that Marshall's involvement in
the plot goes beyond simply writing. It would be very
on brands to commit or otherwise orchestrate a murder that
(49:58):
you later write about. And finally, I've got to end
with a question from L three Raiser about the true
mystery of the episode. They say, the real mystery is
what are the nineteen functions of the Lady Longorian nineteen
and one multi tool? I kind of need to find
that out. So that was our thoughts for this week,
(50:18):
and I'll be back next week with the final season
four theories from the Only Murders in the Building subreddit.
Speaker 3 (50:31):
That's it for today. Thank you so much for listening.
Please send your thoughts and theories to us at Only
Murders at strawhatmedia dot com.
Speaker 1 (50:38):
Take a minute to subscribe, read the show, follow us,
leave us a review if you enjoy listening.
Speaker 3 (51:01):
Only Murders in the Building podcast is a production of
Strahat Media, hosted and produced by Ryan Tillotson and Maggie Balls.
Associate producer is Stephen Markley. Original music by Kyle Merritt.
Only Murders in the Building theme music by Siddartha Kosla.
Assistant editor is Daniel Ferrera. Production assistant is Carolyn Mendoza.
Speaker 1 (51:18):
Thank you to Desmond Borjez, Kristin Newman, and Jake Schnezzel
for talking with us, and big, big, big thanks as
always to John Hoffman and the entire Hulu team.
Speaker 3 (51:27):
See you next week.
Speaker 1 (51:28):
Sea.
Speaker 2 (51:37):
Not to quote Drake because that's ridiculous, but we started
from the bottom and now we're here right like whatever
here is like, you know, for us, it was great.
Speaker 3 (51:49):
I am curious how he makes a living because the
Sauce family makes sauce, Rudy makes very successfully. Rudy makes
his influencer workout videos. And what is Vince? How does he?
I mean his rent is really cheap, but I don't
know when.
Speaker 10 (52:07):
Yeah, I mean you probably don't have to make any
you know, with the rent they pay.
Speaker 3 (52:12):
Two it's a great deal. Come on, he might, you know,
he might just.
Speaker 2 (52:18):
Have I bet he gives weird speeches places and then
gets honorariums for him and that's.
Speaker 3 (52:23):
That might be enough income.
Speaker 2 (52:25):
Or you know, I think like guest speaker somewhere, or
maybe he got collects old maps of the neighborhood and
sells them on eBay.
Speaker 3 (52:35):
That's a good idea.
Speaker 2 (52:36):
And I'm not saying anything, but maybe we'll learn more
in season five.
Speaker 1 (52:40):
I don't know WHOA Oh, I hope.
Speaker 3 (52:43):
So are you in talks with the writers you already
maybe
Straw Media.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
I saw three amigos well before I was supposed to,
and I used to walk around and make everybody call
me ned Nita Lander.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
Thank you, Hello, and welcome to the Only Murders in
the Building Podcast.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
I'm Ryan Tillotson and I'm Maggie Bowles, and we are
looking behind the scenes and mining for clues as we
meet the cast and creators of the Hula original series
Only Murders in the Building.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Today on the show, we're continuing the conversation all about
season four, episode eight, Lifeboat.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
We'll hear from showrunner and co creator John Hoffmann and
Desmond Borjees, who plays Alfonso Olivera, the final member of
the Sauce family.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
We'll talk about the legend of Tony Danza in the
Only Murders Universe, the philosophical conundrum of Dudinoff's death, and
the beginnings of Mabel's new mural.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
So let's talk about episode eight, four oh eight Lifeboat,
another episode where the film mentioned in the title factors
pretty heavily into the episode. I think like it kind
of book ends it. We get it at the beginning
and at the end.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
I mean, I didn't know anything about life but I've
never also never seen.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Never seen it, although I hear it's one of Alfred
Hitchcock's most underrated films. Ah, yes, it is, so tell
us about lifeboat Lifeboat.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
Well, it's interesting because I was hoping, you know.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
This is John Hoffman, showrunner, co creator.
Speaker 4 (01:31):
I think everyone has expectations when you hear we're going
to be niming titles of each of these episodes movies,
and certainly rear Window would be the Hitchcock title that many,
I think, would expect to find in this group, and
I would too. I would normally think, great, let's put
rear Window in. And it might have made sense. It
probably made sense for some of the others. Some things
(01:52):
just landed and the way they did. But when we
came around to this episode eight, which was written by
Kristin Newman and Jake Schnezel, we were really knowing we
were going into this idea of people bonded together in
a tough situation and hanging onto each other and making
calls that are only within the certain situation that requires
(02:16):
intense need and love or other things. So that kind
of hotbed situation felt right the actual script. And I
feel bad because we don't have a Martin SCROSSESEI title
in the group, but at the time the script was written,
it was called Gangs of New York. And the further
(02:40):
we got into it, though thematically, I was finding myself
distanced from what the content of the episode was with
Gangs of New York. And then when we started editing
and putting together this voiceover that would be our thematic
and putting it to the Gangs of New York thing,
I was just like, something feels like a disconnect to me.
And so I at the very last minute, really in
(03:04):
editing decided like, I feel like this is more lifeboat
and made the segue over to that, and I really
like was delighted, and so is Kristin and Jake and
I sort of walked them through the new voiceover that
reflected that, and it all felt of a piece. I love.
The idea of a lifeboat can also look like a
(03:28):
pre war apartment building or an affordable apartment on the
Upper West Side, you know, And what would you do
to hang on to that? What would you do to
hold on to something like that if if the people
around you were that important, if you're all hanging in
together to survive that felt like perfectly time for our
rent controlled story that we were telling an eight.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Yeah, I get it.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
I get it too.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
In New York City, a lifeboat can look a lot
like an affordable apartment in a nice building on the
Upper West Side.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
In this episode, we see a set. We see Charles's
apartment that we found out we talked to Patrick he
rebuilt it, which I thought was crazy.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
About that he's a wizard.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
He's a wizard, which I loved hearing. But I want
we wanted to talk about the prop table. On the set,
you see a lot of stuff from season one and
I'm curious, curious if that was you, Like how did
you decide what got put in there?
Speaker 4 (04:33):
It's so great? Like now the show is the show? Right?
So I watched this progression and you must know, like,
being in charge of the show, I'm trying to sort
of at the beginning, like say, explain like why these
things are important and all the details of everything are important.
And then people watch the show and they recognize it.
And you have artists like the brilliant Diana Burton, our
(04:55):
prop master who worked this season for us, and just
perpetually like Susanna McCarthy before her delighted me. I'd walk
on sentence go oh my god. Or she would present
in a prop meeting, this is what we're thinking for this,
and you're they're thinking further along and ahead of all
the things they can have on that table that represent
(05:15):
a season one story based on a movie that's being made,
all of that, And I was like, oh my god.
So it's all really discovery for me now, whereas I
used to have to like walk people through and say, well,
what if it's this, what if it's this? Now we
have this history of the show that people can look
at and relate to and then pull from themselves, And
that's the greatest. When you walk in, you're completely surprised
(05:36):
by what's in front of you and you're like, well,
how many you made? Six of these? You know that
kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
So what is on that? What is on that prop
table that you that you think is like the most
niche maybe item on that, because I mean, we saw
the turkey. I love the morning turkey. There, we saw
the turkey. We saw some we saw the necklace and
some of the jewelry. We saw the bassoon case. I
think I saw some hardy boys books.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
Yes, right, all of this stuff. It makes my both
my heart open and like feel like, oh my god,
can you believe how far we've come since season one?
And then it also makes me, you know, have a
little ogita because I know what the writers went through
every time we had to say no, no, this is
the this is the ring that Zoe had on and
(06:23):
like and then the ring, like having to track rings
and jewelry over season one was like, I think we've
all talked about that, but yes, So a lot of
it makes my heart go like in the good way,
and then a lot of it causes palpitations because I
remember how much it was a challenge to sort of
make sense of all of it, you know, and and
(06:44):
have people understand like, Okay, this omelet is connected to
this story in Charles, and then it's going to spool
out this way. The rings are going to be this
multiple storyline thread and then anything. I love the Morning
Turkey though, The Morning Turkey is the greatest.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
Another weird thing in this episode is the Tony Danza
time to wear white Pants extrava Danza.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Who's I was expecting to see Tony Danza in this episode?
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Yeah, dance is the perfect Planza, I think tell us
about Tony Danza.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
Yeah, well sure. I again, this was one of those
things that like, wait, what are we doing? And you know,
you're sort of like, now you're following the writers who
have worked this thing out that they have like probably
too late in the day, and they they're punch drunk
or whatever, and they're on a Tony Danza riff. And
I remember reading and hearing about this pitch and thinking like,
(07:41):
wait a minute, what's going on with Tony Danza. Tony
Danza is the unofficial sort of arbiter of this was
this may not even be in the cut, but in
our story, Tony Danza is the unofficial arbiter of when
to you know, throwing the greatest parties in New York
and also when to where white after Labor Day? All
(08:01):
of the like, there's a whole thing about Tony Danza
in New York as a sort of seminole figure in culture.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
Is this is this only Murder's Law or this is
New York low?
Speaker 4 (08:12):
This is murder Law?
Speaker 3 (08:13):
Okay, okay, Yeah, So there's this whole history you guys
build about Tony Danza, like.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
Well, everyone follows Tony Danz's rule when you're like at
a party in the Hamptons, Like it's only done right
if Tony Danz is there and he's approved of the way,
you know, and when and where you're doing it. Like
this became a thing, so it got whittled down, of course,
like time wise and everything else, to like just this
notion of how to trap the Sauce family with the
(08:40):
who's the Sauce idea that Eugene Levy has and I
will personally just never forget. Like that was another one
of those moments in episode seven when Molly came in
and she was telling off the actors and Selena could
never keep a straight face. The breaking up of that
collection of brilliant acts throughout that scene on Charles's set
(09:02):
in episode eight, when Eugene Levy started talking about Tony
Danza and all of that, and Zach Galifanakis being utterly
annoyed every time you hear you're not going to talk
about Tony dance again, And then he's doing his crouching
bit behind him and working out his I don't know,
he's working out his quads. What do is he working on? Yeah,
(09:24):
I'm not sure glutes, I don't remember what it's but
that was one of those great memories. I just remember
coming up and they couldn't get through the scene.
Speaker 3 (09:33):
It's so funny because Eugene is just so straight talking
about like Tony Danza just so it's really funny.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
There's times when you just are in a room full
of the funniest people in the world and then you're like, Okay,
I can't believe this is the scene we gave them
to do. And then you watch them play it with
utter like only their personalities could do it, and you're like, Okay, well,
actually they sold this one.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
It's so good.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Well, and then later on we find out in the
in the Sauce Families flashback that Tony Danza is an
infests the Sauce. Is that what's the what's the connection there? Like,
are we going to learn more about that? Is Tony
Dance are going to show up?
Speaker 4 (10:17):
As I mean again, this goes to our lore of
Tony Danz's influence in New York culture, which unfortunately did
not make the final cut, but I think it would
have made a little more sense because Tony Danza seems
to be a bit ever present in the culture of
New York in our lore. So the idea that you know, yes,
there might be a little bit of a coincidence of like,
(10:38):
this is Eugene's plan and it also happens to be
what the Sauce family was about to make it trying
to make a deal with so that that whole thing
it feels funny to me in wild coincidence, but on
the other hand, it ties into the thing that may
be on the cutting room floor.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
It's very funny. It's very funny. It's very funny.
Speaker 4 (10:57):
And who's the Sauce who doesn't want to say that
a lot?
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Who's the I think we talked to Kristin and Jake
a little bit about all of the different Westies and
all of their different backstories. We did. Maybe you can
talk to us a little bit about that.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
That's it. We learn it all here right in this episode.
It's all like, you know, I think what feels like
coincidence to earlier episodes in many ways, I think across
the season when you're like, wait a minute, the brother
sisters know them and how to but it's all just
the way in which to me, when you're investigating something
(11:33):
and finding out like why are these people all here
and acting like a cult it's because they actually have
roots with each other that we explore in this episode
that but until then it all feels weird in certain
ways which feel like something to further investigate. And then
the idea to me that the brother sisters were a
(11:55):
part of this connection to Doudanoff and his film class
and being an intrinsic inspiration for them, and then to
sort of realize they took this movie because of this
building and because he lived in it and there was
a tie to him in that way. I felt that
(12:16):
was really cool as far as like just the things
that sort of at first on first look at something
feels like well that how how? And then the investigation
here is personal in episode eight and the story about
Dudenoff and what happened. Obviously by the end of episode eight,
for Dudenoff's end, we learn we learn has to have
(12:40):
like really deep rooted stories, backstories for all of them.
And I was very moved by you know, our resident
New York sort of research Maven in the room as
Madeline George, and she came in with so many any
stories like anecdotal stories of rent control schemes and rent
(13:05):
controlled plants or groups of people in apartment buildings gathering
to do something with a mutual interest that was shocking,
and it over and over again. We had stories like
that brought into the room, of people doing incredibly odd
things that become like eight people in an apartment building
on one floor, you know, cooked and boiled someone and
(13:28):
blah blah blah, you know, and did a whole thing
just to do this, and blah blah blah. These stories
seem a bit outlandish, and yet that's what we're playing
off of in some way, but in a sort of
like hanging to the emotional side of it with Dudanov
and the wish of a dream in companionship, and again
going to the sort of like core loneliness people finding
(13:51):
each other in New York City, you hang on to them. Yeah,
like a life boat.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
Okay, like a life.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
I don't know why I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
That, we're here for it, John.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
One of the recipients of that metaphorical lifeboat was Dudonov's
friend and neighbor, Alfonso olivera patriarch of the Sauce family
played by Desmond Borjez, and when we talked to him,
he hadn't yet seen this episode.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
I intentionally stay away from stuff so that I can
grow personal distance from it so that.
Speaker 4 (14:26):
My you know, crazy actor slash.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
I think I'm part elephant because I remember everything, like
every take, all the way down to the last detail.
So I really need to I like to remove myself
for a long time so that when I come to it,
it's been far enough away and I could actually enjoy
it as an audience member and not just go you know,
crazy actory nerdy about it, thinking about takes and possibilities
(14:51):
and things like that.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
So what they cut, what they didn't use?
Speaker 4 (14:54):
Yeah, yeah, well.
Speaker 2 (14:56):
That you know, I learned pretty early on that like
can't be too precious about anything, because once it's down
and it's on the tape and we move forward, they
it's to so many other people's discretions and not mine.
So I just try and make like everyone one that
I would be really excited to see pop up if
(15:17):
it happens to pop up. And I feel like that
was a pretty healthy mindset to develop pretty early on,
I think.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
So I am curious when I'm sure you have friends
and family who are watching the show. Do they come
to you with their theories? Do they ask you questions?
Do they like try to feel out or are they like,
don't tell me anything. I want to see how it
plays out.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
It's more like they'll broach the subject, and then as
soon as I start to figure out how I can
help satisfy scratching their itch without giving it away, they
see what's happening in my eyes and then they stop
me cold. So it's a fun little little game of
chicken we play.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
I'll bet, I'll bet so. In episode eight, we learn
the backstory of the Sauce family and and all the Westies,
including the final Westie who he had not met yet.
So can you describe to us how you think about
the Sauce family.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Oh, you know, I feel like the Sauce family represents
a lot of people that I've known throughout my life.
Like I grew up in Chicago and Logan Square in
the eighties when it wasn't hip to live there, right,
And the building that we grew up in was like
a seven flat Graystone. And my family's made up of
(16:41):
Puerto Ricans on my dad's side and Italians and Greek
second generation third generation on my mother's side, And it
was a mixture of all of us that we are
of living together. And one thing that I really realized
about being in that atmosphere that it's very fun, very boisterous,
and sometimes those those things sort of lend themselves to
(17:02):
sort of dangerous positions because everyone's really trying to do
their best at just sort of making it for their
family and for like the extended family that's in the building.
So I really like grasp onto that, like very very quickly, right, Like,
I feel like the Sauce family is just really doing
the best that they can to try and make their
(17:23):
dreams happen and you know, give their daughter the best
pathway forward that she can have. And so when you know,
they meet Dudent off right, they meet the other Westies,
we get that very sort of lovely, boisterous but somewhat
dangerous familial setting, right, and all of them are just
(17:44):
trying to do the best that they can for themselves
and for the collective group.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
And I don't see, you.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Know, as someone who lived in New York for quite
a long time, I see nothing wrong with anything that
they're doing, especially having a ham you know, some percutto
you know, just hamon Hagen. I wouldn't want that, you know,
just go in get a slice, you know, I mean
it's like meat butter. Why wouldn't you want a little
(18:11):
bit of that action in your life on a you know,
semi hourly basis.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Yeah, first hanging in the shower and then hanging on
the luggage cart two absolutely perfect places to hang a
harmon you.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
You got to put it somewhere.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Yeah, well, and you got to, you know, in the chaos,
you got to hope that they're looking somewhere else so
that they're not concentrating on you. I like to think
that that was like Alfonso's idea, but you know, I
don't want to take anything away from anybody else.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
What kind of sauce were you making? Do you know?
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Well, my favorite was, you know, like the PDPD sauce,
which is Portuguese, so it's sort of like smoky. Yeah,
it's kind of like their version of like Amatriciana, which is,
you know, like the tradition Roman red sauce that has
guancle in it, right, So it's very it's very similar
(19:05):
to that, although we had a red sauce and we
had a green sauce, but yeah, it kind of had
like a smoky, sort of salty tang to it.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
Just curious about. I mean, yeah, that's great.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
I mean I tasted all of them while I was there,
as you should. I wanted to know. I wanted to know, like,
are we good at making sauce? And you know, the
props department was excellent at making sauce. They had good
sauce on the stove.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
So after the break, who among the Westies did the
heavy lifting the best sauce on the set? And of
course theories.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Welcome back. There is a scene in this episode. It's
a part of Vince's flashback back to Judinov's class.
Speaker 6 (19:59):
Ye.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
The reason It's a Wonderful Wife is timeless comes down
to one thing.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Casting.
Speaker 5 (20:11):
You know, if you can populate your story with the
right people, your work will live forever.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
We wanted to hear John Hoffman's take on Milton Dudnoff's
feelings about It's a Wonderful Life.
Speaker 4 (20:26):
I feel there is a potency and like people who
love something. Dudenof is a film professor. Dudenoff loves film,
loves telling stories. And now it's clearly he's not going
to make films, so he can only inspire. So I
love teachers, I love like the idea of people who
love something so much but are perfectly happy living lives
(20:49):
where they hand that dream over to someone else and
encourage them. Is the most incredible thing to me. So
this idea that he's looking at that movie and saying
that that's what he feels is like the most important
thing about it is the casting of that movie because
of the way it makes you feel. Jimmy Stewart has
a quality that is so lifelong, warm and connective, and
(21:12):
everyone in that movie makes you feel something, and everyone
who watches it can help it be a wreck at
the end of it, all of those things. But that's
a universal sort of emotional thing that film can do.
And I think if you're a teacher and you have
a love of something, I love the idea of someone
when he's alone later in life and examining and looking
(21:34):
back on his life with some opportunity to do something
new or next after they've lost their spouse, putting together
a cast of people in making his own sort of
version of the film he wants to live in in
that building sort of felt sweet and profound in a
certain way and generous again from a sort of teacher's
(21:55):
sensibility to me. So I loved that character turn of
that's what he was doing for himself, and then he
had one request that it continue. And as he says
at the end of the episode down in the basement,
I never got a chance to do this, but I'm
going to make one movie that really means something for
(22:17):
this movie to continue, the movie that I've created up
here on this floor, that all of you stays in it.
And this is the way I think we can do that.
So that felt really deeply New York, deeply inspired by
what teachers do.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
I think, Yeah, yeah, I also think there's like probably
some some connection to like, you know, this pro like
only murders as a project and Steve Martin and Martin
short being such good friends and like casting each other
as the most important person in their lives, each other's
lives for the next life however many years, Like you know,
(22:54):
I feel like there's something something that reflects into reality.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
I never thought of it, right, it is it comes
right back to something like that. That's that's really true.
And again I think that's the intangible with the show,
is sort of the emotional quality that's happening between those
two guys who've known each other over thirty years and
they adore each other, and there's that underneath thing that
you feel that you can't create with other people who
(23:21):
don't have that.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
One of I think maybe my favorite moments of this episode.
I love watching Eugene mess with Steve. He's like a cat,
you know. It's like the way he pushes that little omelet.
Speaker 6 (23:39):
I love that.
Speaker 4 (23:41):
Yeah, I agree with you, and he relished it, which
made me really so happy because he like that whole
scene with the omelet and then kind of excited to
see him what does it look like? What does it
look like? Push him out of his comfort zone and
get him angry. The rage of a Canadian also was
(24:01):
exciting to me live in that space with Eugene Levy
for a bit. I loved every minute of that Tory
line for him.
Speaker 6 (24:10):
I'm a Canadian man connected to his rage right now
and good, it feels so good.
Speaker 4 (24:19):
Charles tantrum with me.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
No, no, no.
Speaker 6 (24:23):
They incinerated your friend, Charles, no, and then you with
word games from the New York Times.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
At the very end of the episode, we see Mabel
start to maybe start on a new mural. Is that
something we can we can look forward to? I think
I think her original mural was a very special thing.
Speaker 4 (24:50):
Yeah, well, I mean I like that we see her
drawing again and I feel like her it's a space,
you know, her growth to sort of find her own
independence and this odd space obviously that she's choosing to
do this in and it's hoping to sort of now
she knows the story of duden Off, the person who
was living there, and now she's sort of claiming it
(25:14):
in the spirit of At the end of episode eight,
I have to say, also, one of my favorite moments
maybe from the series, happens right before that, and it's
just this little moment and I almost think it was
a I think it was a thing Steve threw in,
but it was her at the elevator and we realized, oh,
wait a minute, she's on her floor, she's in her apartment.
(25:38):
The guys are going back to their apartments in the
other side of the building for the first real time
we've seen that, and so they all get in the
elevator and she's left outside of it, sort of independent
from them, and you just see Steve look back and
just say you good, and she nods, and she's claiming
some independence in it. But it's so sweet. I don't
(26:01):
know how to describe it. Those moments just like fell.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
Yeah, I agree. I think that's a really special moment.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
And that was just May decided on set, which I love.
I love those Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 4 (26:13):
Yeah that was Steve.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
I love it. It's very that's good.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Yeah, you got me in touch with my emotions.
Speaker 7 (26:19):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Well. It was an honor playing a small part.
Speaker 8 (26:23):
In bringing out your true self.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
And Charles, I won't.
Speaker 8 (26:27):
Alienate your audience by putting any of it on film, Hie, right,
you good?
Speaker 4 (26:42):
Yeah, I'm good.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
Well, okay, Mags, would you say Mabel is a Westino?
Speaker 1 (26:50):
I guess she. I guess she has to be. Maybe
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
Okay, Well, back to our Westy of the day, Alfonso
Sauce played by Desmond.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
We talked to Richard Kind before having seen episode eight,
and we've also talked to Daphne Rubin Vega, and we've
talked to Lilian Rabello. You're the last member of the
Sauce family that we're talking to.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
But also I was just, oh, no, I'm gonna have
to mess all this up. Now, what did they snatch?
Speaker 1 (27:20):
But I was thinking about because you said you have
you know, have the brain of an elephant maybe, And
Richard kind was very clear in telling us he remembers
nothing about anything, and so I'm curious what the experience
was like, you know, getting to know your fellow Westy's
on set. And then obviously I would love to hear
about the big, the huge scene where the Westies all
(27:43):
get to tell their stories to the two trios.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Well, first off, like I'm sure I'm not the only
one who's saying this on your podcast, Like it is
literally a dream come true on so many levels working
with the people that we get to work with on
this project, right like just before we get to the
West East as as a little dez, like I saw
three amigos well before I was supposed to, and I
(28:09):
used to walk around and make everybody call me ned
Nita Lander Like when I was young, I wanted to
be Martin Short and Rick moranis like Id's those are
just the two guys that I gravitated to in everything. So,
you know, being in the same room with him and
Steve and Eugene and Selena and Zach and Eva and
(28:31):
sort of watching like they're brilliant just sort of spill
over so easily and so naturally, Like sometimes I had
to remember, oh man, you got a line coming up,
let's stay hint. This sort of thing that was usually
just in the rehearsal process, not while we were filming,
but you know, trying to get a flow in a
field so that you could, you know, bring to the
(28:52):
table things that would not only help support, you know,
the overall story that we're telling, but also maybe surprise
them a little bit. Right.
Speaker 3 (29:02):
To be able to like make Steve or Marty laugh.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
At a moment that made them is like a total
total dream come true. But if we're talking specifically about
the Westies, I did my first major commercial in Chicago
with Richard Kind when I first got out of acting school.
It was Encore Frozen Foods. He had the he was
the spokesperson for the account. I still remember to this
(29:28):
day that when something happens on set, mister Kind, being
the lovely human that he is, he never curses. He
uses the word sugar incessantly, incessantly. It's amazing and hearing yeah, sugar, sugar,
(29:49):
you know, just not sugar.
Speaker 4 (29:51):
So it's and it didn't change, It hadn't change.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
It's like twenty years ago, right, So like so seeing him,
and then him remembering me as soon as he saw me,
because I was like someone jumping out of an airplane
crashing into a frozen foods aisle. And then he was like, hey,
you look like you're hungry. Here are some Encore frozen foods.
That's basically the commercial right. Let internet go find it
(30:17):
and have fun with it. So we have that, and then,
you know, I was a pretty big rent head as
a teenager, you know, like Jonathan Larson's Rent is up
there in one of the most magical theater experiences that
I ever got to, you know, experience, coming from Chicago
coming to New York checking it out. I saw the
(30:38):
original cast, and Daphne Rubin Vega is a queen among
queens as far as I'm concerned, So it wasn't difficult
for me to feel jealous that my wife enes in
the show was crushing on another guy, considering just how
otherworldly I consider her to be as a human and
(30:59):
as an artist. So it was fairly amazing. And then
kumel Man, I've been I've that dude. I can't say
enough like amazing things about him, Like he was, you know,
they were doing Silicon Valley while we were doing, You're
the worst, And we used to see each other sort
of at things in La a long time ago, and
(31:20):
to watch like what his career has done and just
how he's grown, Like I couldn't be more happier for
a fellow brown man on television, right, So, like it's
absolutely amazing from a personal standpoint, and then from an
artistic standpoint, all of them are crazy, crazy, ridiculous good
And if you know, John would and the directors, they'd
(31:42):
let us fly sometimes. So if you know someone was
feeling a moment and just wanted to keep going with it,
you couldn't ask for a better grouping of people just
to start going off the cuff with, you know, totally overall,
like what a little ridiculously amazed experience from top to bottom.
Speaker 3 (32:02):
Speaking of Camille, how was shooting that his A Few
good Men speech, Like I'm so curious to know, like how, yeah,
what it was like for you and for you in
that moment, because it's ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
It was phenomenal, absolutely phenomenal, And watching him change and
color it and then like stop and get an idea
and go back. And then he had alts upon alts
upon alts for everything and then watching him go through
those alts like it was like I was watching a
(32:36):
masterclass in acting, you know, and and but it was hilarious.
And that was the thing. All of us had to
like keep it together the entire time because depending on
what version of the shot you see, we're in the background,
right and we're invested in it, and as you know,
not only just as fellow same partners, but as fellow
Westy's we know this story right, and we want to
(32:57):
support him and have him tell it to the best
of visibility, to kind of, you know, keep our story
as a group afloat. And it was incredibly difficult with
all of them. It was incredibly difficult, especially the first
couple rounds, to kind of keep it together because you
hear them start doing stuff and it's just like, you know,
it's seriously what dreams are made of, seriously, without a doubt.
(33:20):
And I'm sure everyone else has said the exact same thing.
So I'm sorry listeners if I'm just repeating everything that
everyone has said. Every time you've listened to this podcast,
it went.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
Something like that. So you want answers, I think I'm entitled.
You want answers, I want the truth? You can't handle
the truth. Son.
Speaker 6 (33:38):
We live in a world that has walls, and those
walls need to be guarded by men with guns. Who's
going to do it?
Speaker 2 (33:42):
You?
Speaker 3 (33:43):
You, Lieutenant Weinberg. I have a greater I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Are you going to do the whole monologue?
Speaker 4 (33:47):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (33:48):
I was going to do the whole thing.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
I think it's worth it.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
I have a great Going back into your elephant brain archive,
what is what was your most memorable moment shooting this
entire season?
Speaker 4 (34:03):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (34:03):
Man, all right, there's so I mean, there's so many,
but you want one, so I'll give you one. It's
when we came back and turned the cameras around in
this scene in episode eight and Steve slowly starting to
fold the blanket and starting to lose his cool, right,
and then he comes over and they've got the bit
(34:24):
where they're not understanding him. They're thinking it's a game
of charades, and I think at one point he's like, yes,
you know, like that Steve Martin, like that face of despair,
and that's amazingly hilarious that he makes. Like watching him
(34:46):
do that from the rehearsal through every take was probably
the most amazing thing that I've ever witnessed being on
set ever, because you've seen it in its glory for
how many decades and then to watch it live happen
(35:07):
in front of you, watch the brilliance happen, and it
be different almost every time. You just feel lucky to
be in that room. And then we'd go over to
our chairs and hang out between setups, and then he
decided to do some sleight of hand magic tricks with
(35:30):
his card set for us, you know, and it's just
to kind of like wrap that whole entire experience together.
Like I could see it in everyone's eyes. It didn't
matter if you were like little boy Desmond or you know,
Eugene and Richard who have known him forever, Like there's
(35:50):
a magic that that man is able to bring to
everyone at any given moment. And just like being there
for that in that thing, I'll, you know, I, like
I said, I think it's the most memorable moment in
my entirety of my career thus far. Like that day
was just absolute magic in my mind.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
I love it that that was a great scene. I think,
you know, along with Eugene saying like I'm channeling him,
I can understand character. I can understand it's so funny.
Speaker 4 (36:23):
What else does he say that? This used to make
me left so hard.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
He was like, I'm a Canadian man getting in touch
with my raige, right, Like there's just you know, and
like when he would do it, like one eyebrow would
raise and the other one would kind of stay still,
you know, and it was just that, you know, yeah,
I but it. It's funny, but you know, like you
(36:49):
like watch them, do you know these brilliant, brilliant comedic things,
just like giving off one of each back and forth,
just giving it back and forth.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
Is like wow, yeah, wow.
Speaker 4 (37:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:03):
Earlier this week, we talked to writers Kristin Newman and
Jake Schnezl about the moral quandary of the episode, and
we're still on the side of the Westies and their
decision even after all this time.
Speaker 3 (37:16):
So these are not murders, no, but that one hell
of a podcast.
Speaker 2 (37:22):
And yes, we've been keeping up the rooms and oh god,
cashing his check.
Speaker 4 (37:28):
We're going to jail.
Speaker 1 (37:31):
Now, you're not.
Speaker 6 (37:33):
Guys.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
We used to be three lonely weirdos living in the Rconia.
The podcast brought us together. I don't want to use
it to tear them apart.
Speaker 9 (37:47):
So humanity is.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
More important to do than the podcast.
Speaker 4 (37:51):
What a Revelation, you know.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
I think the things about life in general that are
more somewhat digestible but technically illegal, really fall into like
what it's like to be a multi ethnic human in
a minerica. I feel like there's a lot of in
(38:16):
order in order to like move forward and to break
down doors, sometimes you have to do something that in
your heart of hearts you know is right, yet you
know the man will tell you that it's extremely wrong.
And I think one thing that was kind of, you know,
amazing about this is that these Westies know him and
(38:37):
trust him and love him so much that him coming
up with that idea, putting it forward to us, even
though we don't necessarily want to go along with it
because we don't want to see him go, we know
he knows best. And I think that's one thing that
a lot of people always take for granted that other
people live in their bodies and their skins and their
(38:58):
minds and their feelings for.
Speaker 3 (39:00):
Their entire lives.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
Right, But in that situation, you we we wanted to
help honor him to the best of our ability, and
if that was the way, then unfortunately that was the way,
not that it wasn't scarring, especially for our daughter.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
It is a it's a very big ask because you know,
what they don't what we don't see in the show
is like the actual physicality of performing that favor for someone,
which is like really harrowing to think about. So I'm
glad we didn't have to see that on camera because
that would have been a little too dark.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
Yeah, I think it's best to let the mind wander
with that one and let everyone make their own mental
pictures of you know how that would go about.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
Yeah, I assume it would be mostly Alfonso and Rudy
doing the heavy lifting in that. I would assume maybe,
you know, that's that's where my mind goes.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
I mean, I'm I'm you know, in my mind, I
think like Rudy probably picked him off up and draped
him over his shoulders like a barbell about to do
a hack squad, and then I was like, hold on,
hold on, I'll help you out. Right. There's like.
Speaker 1 (40:10):
It is a very philosophical episode, absolutely, you know, it
asks a lot of questions.
Speaker 5 (40:17):
And it's that you will all keep me alive. Well,
I mean, actually no, because I've just taken a hell
of a lot of pills. I want you tonight to
put my body in the incinerator. Yes, yes, And then
I want you to cash my Social Security checks and
(40:40):
I want you to tell everybody I just moved to Portugal.
Speaker 3 (40:46):
Do you know how it ends?
Speaker 2 (40:54):
The thing is if I say no, and that leads
listeners down a pathway where they could, you know, kind
of make assumptions about the Sauce family that I don't
think I want them making.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
Right, So there's no right answer here, No.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
Not at all. I mean, you know, if I say yes,
I know how it ends, then they're you know, let's
just say when I got the scripts and I was
downloading them and you know, chewing on them because they're
so delicious and amazing, right, Like, I really try to
go through the parts that the Sauce family wasn't directly
involved in so that when I do become an audience
(41:34):
member and I'm watching this, I feel like I'm watching
that part of the story for the very first time. Right, So,
like I would really i'd read them all and then
i'd really just like you know, laser in on anything
that had to do with the Westies and the Sauce
family and try to let my half human, half elephant
brain forget everything else that I read, which is pretty
(41:55):
difficult to do.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
All right, time to read some emails and share some.
Speaker 1 (42:08):
Theories, and I forgot about the East rag earlier. It
seems there is like a power outage over the opening
credits in the building.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
Interesting.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Yes, thanks for all of the emails. Thanks to Shelley J,
Trish T, Matti G, Katherine, Patricia G, Jennifer Y, Emily
P KK, Courtney, w tof H and Tim Why, our
Easter expert.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
All of them were Easter experts or just Tim.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
Tim Why has sent a bunch of emails about each
of the Easter eggs, and I appreciate it. He is
our expert.
Speaker 3 (42:43):
Vinnie s thinks Loretta as the killer, though I do
think this theory was from before episode eight, so I
wonder if he still thinks that.
Speaker 7 (42:50):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (42:51):
I can't imagine Loretta killing anyway. She's so I agree.
Ruth K. I'm sorry we failed you on the Billie
Joel references from UPSOT seven not being a huge I'm
sorry not being a huge billy, Joel expert. I didn't
even catch them, so we'll try and ask John about
it next time we talked to him.
Speaker 3 (43:08):
Vinya B. Thinks maybe Doreen and Marshall are in it
together and that maybe they had taken Dudenof's class possible.
She noticed two dolls with silver tinsel pom poms at
Doreen's house.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
She might be onto something because she also thought that
the Westies did not kill Dudenoff but did dispose of
his body.
Speaker 10 (43:29):
So onto something and that we learned just true in
this episode. Is so who knows Dan Dee has a
mastermind theory? He believes less of the Dorman might be it.
He noted that he's often taken for granted and that
he would know everything that goes on in the building.
So even though he might not be the one doing
the murdering, he may be the one pulling the strings.
Speaker 1 (43:48):
That's very interesting theory.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Laura B.
Speaker 1 (43:50):
Is thinking Bev and Marshall might be involved and that
Saz and Glenn were the targets, either because Bev is
breaking stuntman reunion rolls definitely and they knew, or because
Saz wrote the script and told Glenn about it.
Speaker 3 (44:03):
Interesting, very interesting. Liz S still thinks doctor Maggie is involved.
Speaker 1 (44:09):
We'll see if we see doctor Maggie again. And eb H,
thank you for telling us that Griffin Dunn is Joan
Didion's nephew. Of course, it's the same Griffin Dunn who
made the twenty seventeen documentary The Center Will Not Hold.
I wish we'd talked to griffind on this season.
Speaker 3 (44:25):
We should have reached out.
Speaker 1 (44:26):
We didn't know. What stupid stupid of us who produces
this show?
Speaker 3 (44:31):
Yeah, what idiots dumb. We also got a voice memo
two two voice memos.
Speaker 9 (44:35):
Hi, Maggie and Ryan, This is Trish Ryan. I completely
agree with you that Helga is not to be trusted.
She knew many obscure things that endeared her to Doudinov,
which is very suspicious. Also, her father has mentioned numerous times.
Fathers are a big theme of this season. I suspect
we will soon learn more about Helga's father and this
(44:56):
will connect Helga to Saz's murder and to Charles.
Speaker 11 (45:00):
On episode one, I have theorized that there is some
kind of metal poisoning going on, because Charles doesn't see
Sas until he's exposed to her ashes, and he specifically
said he would leave the jar open, so the water
could evaporate. Several times throughout this season so far, we've
been reminded of the jar. He will ei them, what
talk about it, or will be shown it. It's just
(45:21):
sitting in Charles's apartment, still open to the air, and
I think he's just kind of being poisoned that way. Secondly,
Richard Kine's character Vince mentions in passing that he has
an enlarged heart. This was like a throwaway comment at
the time, but a little Google search told me that
is a symptom of heavy metal poisoning as well. My
theory was pretty weak until we got the information about
(45:42):
Dudenov being ill. So if Dudnov was also ill when
he died, we know he had a metal joint, who's
to say that's not what caused his illness. And finally, GLENNS. Dobbins,
he seems to be hallucinating rats wherever he goes. Initially
kind of just seems it's in that bar, but he
also locinates them when he's in the elevator at the Alconia,
so it's everywhere. Now he's in the hospital, I am
(46:05):
convinced that we will discover that he has metal poisoning
and that is going to be the thing that connects everyone.
Speaker 3 (46:11):
Wow. Thank you so much Trish and Mikila for those
voice memos.
Speaker 1 (46:16):
Now, before we handed over to Hannah and the Only
Murder subreddit, here's what the writers of this episode, Kristin
Newman and Jake Shoneessel said about Reddit.
Speaker 12 (46:24):
We'd all love to give a shout out the Reddit
community because they often give us incredible credit for things
like anagrams.
Speaker 3 (46:33):
Lots of anagrams, all.
Speaker 12 (46:34):
Kinds of things that we're just going to take credit
for forever and that we carefully plat it plotted out,
and we're incredibly good and stuff. We strive to be
as intelligent as the reddit board things we are. They
talk with amazing things. I really think they should all
be hired.
Speaker 3 (46:50):
They think that as well. I would agree.
Speaker 12 (46:57):
Listen, if anybody wants to figure out season five, I
guess love it.
Speaker 3 (47:01):
Come on in, Okay, and now here's Hannah with the
Reddit scoop.
Speaker 7 (47:05):
Hey, Maggie, Ryan and everybody listening. We're getting so close
to the big reveal now and I really don't want
this season to end. But here are the latest theories
from the Only Murders in the Buildings. I've Reddit. This episode,
we finally meet Helga, and while she claims to be
an innocent Westy, our members have their doubts. Mom by
(47:25):
Mom says, I don't think episode eight clear to Helga
of suspicion. In fact, I'm more suspicious of her now.
The way she infiltrated the Westis was too obvious. She
already knew this obscure card game that they love. She
already knew the perfect stranger's theme song. She laid it
on thick with dudonof trying to force a father daughter's
(47:46):
surrogate relationship. And then there's the accent and the unusual
locksmith's skills. But it's really the plane ticket from SAS's
desk of clues that makes me sure that she's not
who she says she is. My theory is that she's
undercover FBI who infiltrated the Westies to investigate an older
crime in the building. She was probably looking at Dudonov
(48:09):
as a suspect, or maybe even Charles. Dudonov found out
she was FBI and forced her out. I mean, why
would her face have been scratched out of the photos
unless there was some kind of betrayal I think Helga
is one of the people watching the tree this season,
she flew out to La to talk to Saz to
find out what Sas knew since Sas was poking around
(48:29):
the Westies. Next, at the end of the episode, Helga
comes in with revelations that seemed to point to Glenn's Stubbins,
but member Heavenly Whale seems to think it's a red herring.
They say, I wonder if Glenn was harassing Saz, trying
to convince her there was something foul afoot, and he's
the reason she started investigating. And now that Saz was
(48:51):
taken out, the killer is after the only other person
who knew, which is Glenn. Next up, after the previous
episode Valley of the Dolts, some people grew suspicious of
Doreen and her husband, Big Mic and in Lifeboats we
are told about a certain project runconcoma Evelyn. The cat
(49:12):
Burglar points out Runkonkoma is a town in Suffolk County
in Long Island, and who lives in Suffolk County, Long Island,
Charles's sister Doreen and her husband Big Mike. Now, I
can't wait to find out if this means anything or not,
but I found that interesting. Now, despite what we found
out in Lifeboats, Marshall remains the subs number one suspect
(49:36):
at the moment. Evex Serif says the facts that Marshall idolizes.
Charlie Kaufman, a screenwriter famous for involving himself into scripts
and surprising ways, suggests to me that Marshall's involvement in
the plot goes beyond simply writing. It would be very
on brands to commit or otherwise orchestrate a murder that
(49:58):
you later write about. And finally, I've got to end
with a question from L three Raiser about the true
mystery of the episode. They say, the real mystery is
what are the nineteen functions of the Lady Longorian nineteen
and one multi tool? I kind of need to find
that out. So that was our thoughts for this week,
(50:18):
and I'll be back next week with the final season
four theories from the Only Murders in the Building subreddit.
Speaker 3 (50:31):
That's it for today. Thank you so much for listening.
Please send your thoughts and theories to us at Only
Murders at strawhatmedia dot com.
Speaker 1 (50:38):
Take a minute to subscribe, read the show, follow us,
leave us a review if you enjoy listening.
Speaker 3 (51:01):
Only Murders in the Building podcast is a production of
Strahat Media, hosted and produced by Ryan Tillotson and Maggie Balls.
Associate producer is Stephen Markley. Original music by Kyle Merritt.
Only Murders in the Building theme music by Siddartha Kosla.
Assistant editor is Daniel Ferrera. Production assistant is Carolyn Mendoza.
Speaker 1 (51:18):
Thank you to Desmond Borjez, Kristin Newman, and Jake Schnezzel
for talking with us, and big, big, big thanks as
always to John Hoffman and the entire Hulu team.
Speaker 3 (51:27):
See you next week.
Speaker 1 (51:28):
Sea.
Speaker 2 (51:37):
Not to quote Drake because that's ridiculous, but we started
from the bottom and now we're here right like whatever
here is like, you know, for us, it was great.
Speaker 3 (51:49):
I am curious how he makes a living because the
Sauce family makes sauce, Rudy makes very successfully. Rudy makes
his influencer workout videos. And what is Vince? How does he?
I mean his rent is really cheap, but I don't
know when.
Speaker 10 (52:07):
Yeah, I mean you probably don't have to make any
you know, with the rent they pay.
Speaker 3 (52:12):
Two it's a great deal. Come on, he might, you know,
he might just.
Speaker 2 (52:18):
Have I bet he gives weird speeches places and then
gets honorariums for him and that's.
Speaker 3 (52:23):
That might be enough income.
Speaker 2 (52:25):
Or you know, I think like guest speaker somewhere, or
maybe he got collects old maps of the neighborhood and
sells them on eBay.
Speaker 3 (52:35):
That's a good idea.
Speaker 2 (52:36):
And I'm not saying anything, but maybe we'll learn more
in season five.
Speaker 1 (52:40):
I don't know WHOA Oh, I hope.
Speaker 3 (52:43):
So are you in talks with the writers you already
maybe
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