September 20, 2023 • 39 mins
Today, on the show, we speak with the directors of Episode 8, Shari Springer Berman and Bob Pulcini.
We'll talk about crafting and putting together the split screen montage over the patter song. And we'll hear from editors Shelly Westerman and Payton Koch about that process. We'll talk about Loretta's emotional confession and also... working together as a married couple! Bob and Shari are married! Like us!
Just a heads up, there are spoilers for episode eight. So listeners, if you haven't watched, stream it now and come right back!
We’ll be back again on Friday for more Murders and to read your theories.
Don’t forget to subscribe, rate, review, and share the show with your friends!
Send us your thoughts and theories: onlymurders@strawhutmedia.com
Or chat with us on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/OnlyMurdersHulu/
From Straw Hut Media
We'll talk about crafting and putting together the split screen montage over the patter song. And we'll hear from editors Shelly Westerman and Payton Koch about that process. We'll talk about Loretta's emotional confession and also... working together as a married couple! Bob and Shari are married! Like us!
Just a heads up, there are spoilers for episode eight. So listeners, if you haven't watched, stream it now and come right back!
We’ll be back again on Friday for more Murders and to read your theories.
Don’t forget to subscribe, rate, review, and share the show with your friends!
Send us your thoughts and theories: onlymurders@strawhutmedia.com
Or chat with us on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/OnlyMurdersHulu/
From Straw Hut Media
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Straw media. Do you feel likeyou could piece together shredded paper from a
paper shoulder? I have never triedadding, do you I loved a shred
paper? She shreds her like posted. If I could everything you guys were
on the phone, I could showyou. The paper shod is literally right
by my feet right now. Hello, and welcome to Only Murders in the
(00:29):
Pod. I'm Meggie Bowls and I'mRyan Tillotson. This season is a little
different because we're not talking to thewriters or actors, but we're still mining
for clues and trying to figure outwho the killer is before all is revealed
in the season finale. As youknow, we're talking to directors, editors,
and other key members of the productionteam and piecing it all together.
Today on the show, we speakwith directors of episode eight, Sherry Springer
(00:51):
and Bob Poulcini. We'll talk aboutcrafting and putting together that split screen montage
of the patter song, and we'llhear from editors Shelley Westerman and Pete and
Cotch about that process too. We'lltalk about Loretta's emotional confession and also working
together as a married couple. Boband Sherry arm Right like us just I
guess all right, But first aquick meek out. Episode eight sits probe
(01:19):
new word for me, me too. We start with Loretta's voiceover. She
says theater is about choices, whatyou share and what you hide, and
we learn that she is Dickie's mother. She gave him up for adoption when
she was young, but she's beenfalling along with his life ever since,
and she even auditioned for the playto be close to him. It sits
probe, which means the cast isrehearsing with the orchestra. Loretta is planning
(01:42):
to tell Dickie who she is.She wrote in a letter, wondering if
maybe we could could talk later,you know, or I could just hand
you something that I wrote and runaway. The police have released Greg the
stoker and they've reopened the case.Meanwhile, Mabel is pretty sure she knows
who killed Ben. She thinks it'sDicky. Maxim, the critic, is
(02:04):
sitting in on the rehearsal to reviewthe show. Howard and Mabel realize the
spooky noise from opening night was thepaper shredder, and Howard offers to help
piece the shredded paper together. Whata task. Detective Williams is back.
He happy motherfuck us, and shewants to interview everyone in the show.
(02:25):
Charles and Oliver seem to be actinglike idiots trying to listen in on the
interviews, but it turns out tobe part of their plan and they set
up a GoPro so they can watchthe interviews later. So smart Loretta confronts
Oliver about him stealing the book,and Oliver apologizes and he tells her that
Mabel thinks it's Dicky that killed Ben, and so Loretta goes and talks to
(02:46):
Mabel. She tries to convince herthat it was not Dicky, but maybe
it was Bobo or Katti's a bitch, That's what she says. Kat what
a bitch could be? Charles recordsall two minutes and forty six seconds of
the Patter song, and it's evenwilder than we could have imagined. Angelic
little Triplets friends, Mabel and Howardmanaged to piece a page together, but
(03:13):
it doesn't make any sense. ThenMabel sees rat poison in Katie's office.
The Retta and Donna have a talkin the bathroom and Donna says something kind
of dubious about a mother doing anythingfor her child. Oliver tells Loretta he
loves her. Maxine says the showis pure Oliver Putnam. Dickie tells Loretta
about the relief he felt when hethought Ben was dead. Then during Loretta's
(03:36):
song, Charles and Mabel discover Loretta'sletter to Dickie telling him that she's his
mother. And Loretta sees the copstrying to take Dickie away, and she
trumps up. She stops singing,and she takes the blame for Ben's murder,
and the music comes to a halt, and then I killed Ben.
Oliver has a heart attack, andthen Oliver collapses. He has a heart
attack. A huge episodeliver him.Here are the directors of episode eight,
(04:24):
Sherry Springer and Bob Pulcini. Wehave just finished episode eight, so we
are caught up. Still don't knowwho the killer is. Big episode,
big, big episode. Oh mygosh, Okay, what's most fun?
Most fun? It's so much funand I can't believe we got paid for
it. It's one of those kindsof jobs and you know, you get
(04:48):
a call and it's like, sodo you want to do an episode with
Meryl Streep of Only Murders Building,Yes, like, let me check my
schedule. Yeah, and it didn'tdisappoint. It was as wonderful, if
not more wonderful, than we actuallyexpected. Yeah, because this is your
first time directing something for Only Murders, you're new on this season, we're
(05:12):
new. What was it like cominginto you know, it's I feel like
they've kind of established a lot already, you know, even though they're always
bringing new stuff in. What wasyour experience like coming into the Only Murders
Family crew team? Well, we'veboth been super fans and watching it since
season one, so we had nocatching up to do about who was who
(05:38):
and where the plot was. Butit's an incredibly welcoming, wonderful group of
people. I mean, John Hoffmanis just like the warmest, funniest,
kindest person, and then everybody whoworks around him echoes that, and then
the cast is so fun, sofunny, it just every day. At
(06:03):
the end of the day we werelike, I can't believe we just got
to do that. How much funwas that? And I really don't say
that all the time. I can'texpress how much Martin Short and Steve Martin
have meant to me over the years, like and obviously Meryl Streep and I
(06:23):
love Selena. The addition of SelenaGomez on the show, I mean,
she's just so phenomenal with all theirchemistry. But like, you know,
I grew up with all these idolizingthese people, and it was very hard
for me not to like try torecite the jerk word for or break it
to my you know, Jimmy Glickimitation's Like I know them all. I
(06:45):
grew up as like an SETV fanatic. I just these guys are such icons
to me. So I just youknow, I love the show and I
was just so thrilled when we gotthe call. I feel like you get
some really really I mean, Iguess every episode has some great Martin short
and Steve Martin bits, but thisepisode, with their like scheme to get
(07:06):
the go pro in the dressing room, I feel like they both get to
do some really good, hilarious physicalcomedy. There's no comedy. I hope
one day they come out with youknow, the outtakes, because I cannot
tell you how many things. Imean, you couldn't put it how many
(07:27):
all takes there were for both ofthem with physical comedy that I could have
just watched for hours. I mean, you have to call cut, right,
you have to stop and move on. But I didn't want to because
it was so amazing and I hopeit sees the light of day. I
mean, this was just our episode. I can't imagine for all this,
(07:47):
you know, episodes for all theseasons, how much great physical comedy and
just comedy in general. Watching bothof them go at it was amazing.
I mean, the scripts are fantastic, but some of the funniest things are
just like Steve Martin getting up outof a seat, you know, and
but he turns that in shore oryou know, or Martin short making fun
(08:11):
of Steve Martin like endlessly we do. There's some really good ones at That's
what I mean. It was likein the ongoing comedy show for us.
I bet that sounds great. Okay, So, like we were saying,
this is a big episode, alot of threads coming together. Can you
(08:33):
tell us about some of those piecesthat you had to connect? Challenges maybe
in that process? Sure, Imean, I don't know how technically,
let's do it. Ryan loves thetechnical stuff. Well, you know,
it was you know how people takehold of the narrative at certain points,
and this was what was exciting forus is that this was Loretta's taking,
(08:54):
you know, chance to take overthe narrative. So there was a kind
of shooting style that established no youngLoretta in her you know, New York
youth that we wanted to kind ofrecall and add too. So that was
something that was really fun. Andthen to kind of expand on that and
bring her into the story, youknow in a way that reflected her past
(09:20):
and her present and so I youknow, the kind of opening with the
voiceover was a really lovely opportunity tokind of compose really nice shots. And
you know, there's nothing more fulfillingthan telling a story without dialogue, you
know, as a filmmaker, andthey give you this great opportunity to do
that, you know, in theway they introduced each episode, and then
(09:43):
to add Meryl Streets voice you knowto those images is just like the gift
from God. And then later onwe also got to tell story without dialogue,
but which was very challenging, whichwas during the pattern s, which
of the big wid which of respondat the broad kill maybe get time were
(10:07):
you were you were you good,madded so quick Wig. I still have
not stopped hearing in my head howmany months later. I mean, it
was endless. It's just you can'tget it out of your head. It's
such a near worm. And soduring the patter song, which Steve brilliantly
(10:33):
performs, we have to then intercutall of these things happening, you know,
the GoPro, the hiding, thepolice coming into the audience of the
theater. There was an interaction betweenLoretta and Dicky. There was like all
(10:54):
these things happening, and they hadto sort of happen without any explanation,
just sort of under this patter song. So it was the timing of the
song was fixed, so we hadto kind of plan out those images and
how we could communicate all those thingsthrough dividing up the screen, you know,
(11:15):
while he's you know, nailing thepatter song. Finally, man,
it was really fun. We didlike some mockups of that presented it to
storyboards of like all these split screensare kind of thing like that. We
were talking to Shelley about it.Here's that conversation with two of those editors,
Shelley Westerman and Pete and Koch aboutthat process that one scripted, Charles
(11:37):
does his patter song, and asscripted, it's all split screens and we're
like, oh my god, howare we going to do this? Like
that's so dependent on the framing ofeach and at some point there's multiple it's
not just split in two, there'smultiples, like three screens, and then
they pop in and out and goall over and we're like, what are
(11:58):
we going to do? Luckily,thank god, we had Bob and Cherry
our directors, and Bob had aplan and he said, here's what I
think we should do, and hemapped it out in an email, and
we made title cards with each sceneand kind of because it's to a song
that's going to be consistent, wewere able to mock it up with title
(12:20):
cards and it was a joint effort. I started. Then Peyton jumped in,
Diana Hyatt, Peyton's assistant, jumpedin. We colored coded the title
cards so you could see like whataction was going where, and we had
the whole thing mocked up before theyeven shot it. This is another testament
(12:41):
to having that relationship with Bob andCherry and having that communication and trust and
kind of going back and forth withthem, and then so they brought that
to set into meetings before they shot, and we're able to say we have
a plan, this is how wehave to each bit to go in it,
(13:01):
and everybody was amazed and jeez,it was definitely a huge joint effort
and it looks great. I'm reallyproud of it. That's big. Oh
my gosh. Do you feel likeyou could do the Patter Song by heart?
Now? Do you think you knowit? Yes? You have no
(13:22):
idea. Those songs are like burnedinto our heads, like it's insane.
I went to bed singing them alot. Yeah, I've been singing the
Patter Song a lot. It couldbe a TikTok challenge for sure. Okay,
back to Bob and Cherry. Shelley'sgreat and we've worked with her before,
so we have like a long history. We worked years ago together and
(13:43):
it was fantastic working with her,and it was great to like plan this
out because I think if we hadn'tplanned it out, it would have been
a holy mess putting it together.So man, and it really worked like
our I think we wound up goingwith pretty much the exact split screen that
we down in pre production. Well, all right, it was really fun
to hear the patterns because we've heardit, you know, we heard Matthew
(14:07):
Broderick do a version of it.We heard Steve Martin in like episode rehearsing
it yet the first first, butit was fun to hear it like with
the full orchestra or you know,the whole the like the intro to it
was really great. And I mean, I just I'm I think I had
dreams about it last night and thendriving here, I was like, you
(14:30):
will not forget it. A monthfrom now, You'll still be singing.
Like part of me wants to learnall the lyrics. So just I have
it, you know, just inmy back pocket emergency. Well, Steve
was such a rock star doing itbecause he had to do it multiple times
through Oh my god, I canimagine, you know, on the stage
(14:52):
when we were shooting it, andone of the hardest things was, you
know, not ruining takes by laughings dark in the middle of it.
So it was it was really hardand did that happen often? Did it
happen? I'm pretty sure everybody laughI don't know if he was saying it
was a lot of like quiet tentionwhile he was doing that kind of the
(15:13):
way the characters, you know,because it's it's so hard and it's it's
long, and it's the first onelaughter. But the lyrics are so funny.
I mean every time he did it, I would hear another lyric that
I hadn't heard before, and Iyou know, it starts to chuckle and
and and and there was I thinkthe first time when he came out to
do it, there was like thesame tension that was happening for everybody in
(15:37):
the story, whereas like is hegoing to be able to get through this?
Is is this going to take?Because there's always time crunch and this
was a very ambitious episode with alot of singing and a lot of and
and he you know, were like, is he gonna make it? Is
it gonna is he gonna go tothat room? Over whatever? And he
made it. He was great andhe did it over no kuchikuchi ko?
(16:03):
What if none of it is true? Has my inspection been to cursory through
I look outside this nursery? Whatif none knocked up pick with crack?
Did it hold up modive in it? Hoo hoo? Whoo wow, Hi
show We're gonna take a quick break, and when we come back more with
(16:30):
Bob and Sherry, we'll talk aboutMabel and Loretta's moment backstage. In Steve
Martin's dedication to the show. Haveyou done a lot of music in the
past, like with your films,with other shows things like that. It
was a new experience, how wasit. We've done a lot of music
for our career, a lot ofa lot of for some reason, a
lot of performed music on screen kindof thing. So we had we had
(16:52):
a lot of experience with it.And I mean I was a musician before
I started filmmaking. So if there'smusic, I'm very excited. You know,
music is part of the actual story. Yeah, I'm really into it.
We even made a movie about Wemade a little movie about a straight
(17:12):
edge punk band. It was calledten Thousand Saints and and but Haley Steinfeld.
And it was really challenging, youknow, the music and it because
that music is not easy to sinkup. I mean, I don't want
to get too technical, but youknow, it's it was, but it
(17:33):
was That's why we love doing it. It was really fun. Interesting,
is it? Is it? INow I just have questions about this this
this straight edge punk thing. It'sbased on a really great book by Eleanor
Henderson called Ten Thousand Saints. Okay, it was a great book, really
mainstream kind of. Yeah. Yeah, music is really similar to the music
(17:56):
and only murders. Sorry, thepattern song and minor's threat have a lot
in common. They do, theydo. But from what I hear that
when you're shooting it that they're likeyou're using a mixture of like their live
recording and like the prerecorded stuff.Does that create any challenges? Oh god?
(18:18):
Yeah, well now this one too, there's the whole orchestra, which
makes it even more complicated, right, Yeah, especially Chris Steve, you
know, it was it's putting alot on his plate. And we had
a supervisor there who Ian, whowas amazing. It was fantastic, but
very strict. Really. He wasa lot of the breaths to be taken
at the right moment, and wewould have to redo takes because of the
(18:41):
breaths, you know, which ischallenging, you know, again on a
TV shoot schedule. But he wasamazingly exact, and then in post production
everybody was thrilled because it works sowell. Yeah, and then you choose
which pieces you use live and whichpieces you use for the prerecord. The
only person who didn't sing with thepre record was Merril, who wanted to
(19:06):
sing live, and you know,of course did it perfectly impossible too for
what she had. Yeah, shehad to performance performance breaks. I got
chills during that last one of Meryl'ssong in this episode to Helen back on
(19:32):
a Precious Lives is take time before. I never let him go saying no
from the same So I did it, and she did it again. She
did it, you know, youknow amazingly. It's really fascinating to watch
her because she I mean, whatcan you say about Meryl Street? But
(19:56):
Azabeth said, but you know shesee the process with every take, you
know, of her feeling the right, right kind of fit for the words,
and it changes and then it it'sperfection, you know what I mean.
Like it's it's really interesting too.It was really interesting for me and
(20:18):
for I think for us. Youknow, there's a certain level of like,
oh my god, it's Meryl Streepand she immediately kind of makes everybody
feel comfortable, you know, andmakes you feel like, oh, she's
okay, she's nice, she's gonnabe this is gonna be okay. She
goes out of her way to makeyou feel comfortable. Selna had this really
lovely scene with her that kind ofit's also quite funny and which of course
(20:41):
she nails, and but you knowit like she she she said, it's
like like I have to go backand find my lines because I realize I'm
looking at Meryl Streep. You knowthat that kind of yeah, the kind
of you know, the eye nicstatus that she brings I think for actors,
(21:03):
but she really goes out of herway to make everybody feel comfortable and
not intimidated. That's what we keephearing. You know. I was worried.
I tried to I tried to explainit to my son, like the
night before I have the sixteen yearold son. I was like, I
was like, it's like, youknow, she's like the Tom Brady of
actor. And he's like, oh, now I know why you're so nervous.
(21:30):
That's a great analogy. I thinkshe would appreciate that. Yeah,
and he got it. He gotit. Then he understood and he was
like, tell me more about Selenagirl. I imagine it was also hard
for Selena in that scene in thisepisode, the specific scene, because like
I feel like Meryl's kind of beinglike very subtle and things, but then
(21:52):
she's also being very funny with like, well Katie's a bit you know.
Well it was a hard scene.But Selena, you know, she totally
got it. She's such a pro. But it was a hard scene to
get the right sort of texture ofit, you know, the right it
was. There was like very subtlethings going on in it. Yeah,
(22:15):
Selena did this nice thing where shealmost Lareta almost brings her in, but
then she immediately gets out. Youknow, she's she's finding those moments I
think was you know, she's Ithink set. Yeah, you should notice
there is a guest much odder charactersaround this show. I'm just going to
(22:40):
throw a name out, Bobo.We don't really know Bobo, do we,
And he's the comic relief, buthe is the comedy hiding something sinister.
Allso poison was a woman's method?Oh yeah, right, right,
So Katie, what a bitch couldbe? I'm just trying to picture Dickie,
(23:03):
is it murderer? And hold on, hold on, hold on,
and no I can't. So atthe end of this episode, emotions are
running really high. Loretta has admittedto killing men, and Oliver has collapsed
and adding to that emotion, it'sthis long camera pull up the aisle of
(23:23):
the theater. We really wanted toget that the final shot of you know,
our episode, which was kind ofthis really fast pullback on down the
aisle of the theater, which waswhich was tricking, you know, the
(23:45):
way the theater was built in.The initial call was that it was going
to take way too long, andSteve was I think supposed to go home,
right, Yeah, it wasn't goingto take that long. But there
was a conversation the DPE kind ofsaid, well, it could take two
hours to set up, and Steveoffered to go to home and have dinner.
(24:07):
And I've never had I've never hadan actor offer to do that.
It was the nicest thing we haveto have to do it. I was
like, it was just the factthat he offered to do that was so
amazing. That's so sweet. Mostmost actors that leave don't ever want most
people, most crew people, anybody. Once you leave, you've gone for
(24:30):
the day. What a mention,What a man I loved In the opening
of the episode earlier, you weretalking about like, you know, telling
a story without words. And Ilove how there's the space between when the
picture starts and we see loretta innerapartment and her voice over starts, because
we've been waiting to hear from thischaracter for eight episodes. You know,
(24:53):
her apartment was really fun, youknow, the way it was designed to
shoot in it told her story.I think so well, and it's so
I mean, we live in NewYork and I know people actors many.
I worked very early, while Iwas still in film school, very early
(25:14):
in my career, I worked ata company called American Playhouse that did like
indie films and indie pbs like showsand stuff like that. And I remember
I worked with this woman who wasan actress who basically didn't really make a
career of you know, make aliving as an actress and worked for American
playhous as the receptionist. And Iwas young and like idealistic at the time,
(25:37):
and she invited me. She askedme to go back to we like
went out to get some lunch orsomething, and she said, oh,
I want to get something in myapartment. She had an apartment in the
Theater district, which was not farfrom our office and I had never seen
anything like that. She had Loretta'sapartment. She had this tiny apartment,
but everything was in a apartment.I remember she had this loft, this
(26:02):
like loft space with boxeswhere Yeah,it was it was so and she was
Loretta, I mean she except Idon't think she ever got the break.
You know. It's a little heartbreakingand very true. Yeah, that's one
of the things that John was tellingus about was that, you know,
everybody in the industry knows these peoplethat it's not a lack of talent or
(26:27):
you know, a lack of wantingor trying, that that they never get
their big break, their break,you know, and that there's this you
know, it's a brutal, abrutal career path, you know it is,
and yet yet they are who theyare and they can't stop, you
know, because because they love itso much. I mean, I mean,
(26:48):
as it's funny. You know,we've been directing for a long time
and there's a lot of times Iwould like we would audition back in the
old days when we actually did inperson auditions and not you know, and
people didn't send it self takes.But I mean, I loved the in
person, because you've got to actuallytalk to people, and you've got to
know people that you didn't cast.And there would be people who came in
(27:11):
who were fantastic, perfect, butfor one reason or another, just not
right for the role, you know, and you know, and it breaks
your heart because you can't get youcan only cast one person, and you're
like, this person's going to walkaway and they're not getting their chance and
they're not and you know, Idon't want them to be discouraged, but
(27:33):
so you know, I feel likeit's a very heartbreaking business. We'll be
back with Bob and Sherry after onemore quick break to talk a little bit
more about the technical side of allthe action unfolding during the song performance and
what it's like working with a spouse. I was very curious about that part
(28:02):
when you say you're going prepared andwe kind of touched on this briefly before
with your storyboards and stuff, specificallywith the patter song. Are you saying
like we need to get all theseshots during this these lines of the song.
Is that how you planning that outor I guess I'm just curious technical.
I like the technical stuff. Yeah, yeah, I mean this is
(28:23):
very technical. Basically, I hadShelley cut a split screen with words,
yeah, okay, what would behappening in all those different things. So
it would say and then we playpiece you know the right right like that,
it would say it, and thenlayered over it would be the patter
(28:44):
song and then it go wide andreveal uh, you know, the police
enter or whatever. There was justa lot of there was a lot of
like, how we're going to dothis given the time, and I said,
let's work backwards. Let's start withthe song, work backwards, start
dividing up the moments and see what. Let's make sure everything we have the
time for everything to fit. Oneof the hardest things to do in the
(29:06):
show was figuring out the timing betweenI mean, this is technical place the
timing of Selena and Steve finding thebook at Loretta's bag law Loretta is performing,
Yes, that was we had todo that while while Dickie is getting
questioned by the police, and whereMeryl's attention is at the moment, and
(29:30):
then timing the their realization, youknow, they're having the realization that Dickie
as her son simultaneous to them,so all of and then there's a song
involved, so all of that.That was one of the hardest at things
actually, because that actually, youknow, Meryl's live performance kind of led
that and that, you know,we kind of had to really struggle with
(29:55):
and the editing and she had toreally see because she had she had as
an actor to have her real intentionor whatever. She had to see the
police come up to to Dickie andtake him so she could say wait,
wait and break out of song.So it it all had to be timed.
(30:18):
It's a little it was. Itwas you know, even though it's
filmed, there was almost a theatricalaspect to it because things had to be
planned out so carefully, right,and you didn't and because she was singing
out live, you didn't. Youcouldn't rely on the pre record. I
guess like you could with the time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, right,
we didn't have a pre record topractice. Well yeah, m interesting.
(30:41):
Yeah. I have a question though, So you you are married,
yes, and you work together.Oh, I don't know if you know
this. He and I are married. Yeah, Well, there you go.
It's it's great, it's great.We've been married for just over a
(31:03):
year, but we've been together fora very long time. Congratulation, Thank
you so much. And we alsoworked together, and I was just curious
about working with your spouse, likedid you always work together? Has that
been a foundational part of your relationshipor is that something you guys both were
interested in the same field, soyou started working together. What's what's it
(31:23):
like working with your great question withyour partner. We met at Columbia Film
School, okay, many many yearsago, graduate school for film, and
we actually started working together. Firstwe sort of like our first project that
we had to do, which waslike some little video. Bob asked me
(31:45):
if I would act in it,and I was like sure, but then
you have to act, and thoughtwe should be a director. We made
short films and Sharry produced my shortfilm and I edited her short film,
and then we decided to start writingtogether. So we started kind of writing
together, and then we actually starteddirecting documentaries together. But we got married
(32:07):
before we started different and somewhere alongthat career path we got married, it
just became like, oh, we'respending so much time together. So I
always say that I don't know aboutyou, guys, but I always say
that I think it helped that weworked together first because we had our kind
(32:28):
of work relationship figured out, andthen the romantic thing came after. So
in a weird way, it evolvedfrom a work relationship. But as you
guys know, you never have tosay at the end of the day,
had your day go? It's like, which is there's something nice about that?
Because it's hard, you know.I know a lot of people were
in the arts and their spouse ortheir significant other isn't and it's sometimes very
(32:55):
hard to communicate those things to people. How long have you been married and
how long have you been working?I'm still interested in this topic. This
is encouraging for you guys. We'vebeen married twenty nine years. Holy cow.
R yeah, holy cow, it'spossible we could be working together probably
thirty years, you know for us. Yeah, well see, we got
(33:15):
this. So I'm also curious aboutanother question about this though. Do you
feel like you have similar strengths ordifferent strengths that you bring together to your
creative relationship, like maybe Bob's reallygood at one night one sort of aspect,
cherry you bring another aspect or doyou feel like, how do you
feel with that balance of creative power? I'll let you answer that yes we
(33:39):
do. I mean, it's it'sinteresting because it probably doesn't fall along gender
lines that people would imagine too,you know, like these assumptions people have,
but we've learned over the years likeoh, you've got this, you
take you take this, and I'lltake this, and you you you're good
(34:00):
with this actor or this actor.You know, it's nice having that kind
of discussions and realizing we know eachother well enough to know like this is
your meal you you shouldn't handle thisor it. And it's interesting, like
Sharry's got amazing producorial and schedule thingsthat I don't that I'm not good at,
(34:20):
so I know, like to lether lead in those areas. And
you know, on set, Ithink I tend to work more with the
visuals and like the DP and Charitytends to be like to be right in
the middle of everything with the actors, and which is very helpful because it's
good to have someone watching the shotsand watching the performance from that perspective,
(34:43):
and it's also really good to havesomeone there live and feeling it and feeling
with the actor's need. And myadvice to you because you kind of you
don't have to know all those things, but you'll discover them along the way.
You know, what your where yourstrengths are, and where your strengths
are. I love that that.Yeah, I've got one one more question.
You kind of you talked about oneof the things that was the most
(35:05):
difficult in this in shooting your episode, and I'm curious if there was something
that was what was like the mostfun? My god, it was all
fun. I can't I don't thinkI could pick, you know, like,
it was just all fun. Everythingabout it was fun. And I
think one of the you know,really surprising things, you know, because
(35:25):
the comedians are so brilliant a comedy, but like you know, seeing Martin
Short Meryl Streep in their chemistry togetherin the more emotional scenes was really fun
and really rewarding. And you know, I think, you know, in
those kinds of situations, that's like, let's see what they want to do,
you know, let's see where theywant to be, Let's see how
(35:47):
they want to play it, becausethey had such a kind of beautiful pour
with each other, you know,and it was very evident to me in
watching the previous episodes, you know, because a result, you know,
we had some nice scenes with themtogether and I was like, oh,
this is an interesting thread. Andwhen I saw them together, it just
(36:07):
made perfect sense, you know,and who would think, right, I
love seeing Yeah, I love seeingthat side of Martin Short. I don't
feel like I've ever seen that.You know, he's a really good actor,
really very really brought it. Yeah, I was saying, I think
I told John like that the MerylStreep and and Martin Short love story is
(36:30):
the thing I didn't realize I needed, but I needed it. It's so
good. It's so good. Ideletely agree. And they really take it
to another level. It's like it'slike real, it's realized. It's really
you really were rooting for them,you are? Yeah. And then and
this episode, I feel like isa very emotional one in that because Oliver
(36:53):
says I love you, which ishuge, and then Loretta takes the fall,
which is huge, and he hasa heart attack. Like this is
like this is so much. Thisa huge episode, you know, like
a lot to do. Yeah,it's like I love you, wait,
I did it. Yeah, Likeit's all be in like five minutes at
(37:15):
the end. I don't know manyshows that could pull that off, but
this show does exactly pull everything sucha specific tone that's so unique and rare
that it's just yeah, And youknow, it was also so much fun
is when we weren't shooting, whenthey were setting up and just sitting and
(37:39):
talking to these amazing actors and theseamazing legends. You know, just sitting
around like that was just amazing.I know, I bet I want to
I'd like to just be a flyon the wall for that. That'd be
great. Yeah, that's it fortoday. We'll be back later this week
with showrunner and co creator John Hoffmanto talk about the return of Detective Williams
(38:01):
and on earthings, some key piecesof evidence the trio will need to solve
Ben's murder, and of course yourtheories see them. By Only Murders in
(38:27):
the Pod is a production of strawHut Media. This episode was written,
edited, and hosted by Maggie Bollsand Ryan Tillotson, with additional editing and
sound mixing by Daniel Ferreira. Motiongraphics for promotional materials are by Ali Yamed,
with graphic design by Mohammed Samir.Our associate producer is Stephen Markley.
Original music by Kyle Merritt and OnlyMurders theme music by Sidartha Kosla. Big
(38:50):
big thanks to John Hoffman, JavierSalis, Emily lets yasmin As a Rakish,
Lydia McMahon, Cindy Neighbor, andthe rest of the Hulu team,
And thanks to Key and KK.We wish you were with us this season.
You miss you, do you,guys? I assume you do know
(39:15):
who the killer is? Now Ido know who the kill us, but
I will not yell it under anyI know, but I know because I've
heard people gossiping upset. I didn'tread the last the scripts that following ours.
I just didn't want to unless Ihad to for something that we've involved
in a distant you know, i'dread the scenes or something. But I
(39:37):
know I know who it is.I avoided trying to find out. I
just picked up things with people talkingafter they you know, read the scripts
and stuff. So yeah, Ihave a theory now, yeah, yeah, we'll see
Straw media. Do you feel likeyou could piece together shredded paper from a
paper shoulder? I have never triedadding, do you I loved a shred
paper? She shreds her like posted. If I could everything you guys were
on the phone, I could showyou. The paper shod is literally right
by my feet right now. Hello, and welcome to Only Murders in the
(00:29):
Pod. I'm Meggie Bowls and I'mRyan Tillotson. This season is a little
different because we're not talking to thewriters or actors, but we're still mining
for clues and trying to figure outwho the killer is before all is revealed
in the season finale. As youknow, we're talking to directors, editors,
and other key members of the productionteam and piecing it all together.
Today on the show, we speakwith directors of episode eight, Sherry Springer
(00:51):
and Bob Poulcini. We'll talk aboutcrafting and putting together that split screen montage
of the patter song, and we'llhear from editors Shelley Westerman and Pete and
Cotch about that process too. We'lltalk about Loretta's emotional confession and also working
together as a married couple. Boband Sherry arm Right like us just I
guess all right, But first aquick meek out. Episode eight sits probe
(01:19):
new word for me, me too. We start with Loretta's voiceover. She
says theater is about choices, whatyou share and what you hide, and
we learn that she is Dickie's mother. She gave him up for adoption when
she was young, but she's beenfalling along with his life ever since,
and she even auditioned for the playto be close to him. It sits
probe, which means the cast isrehearsing with the orchestra. Loretta is planning
(01:42):
to tell Dickie who she is.She wrote in a letter, wondering if
maybe we could could talk later,you know, or I could just hand
you something that I wrote and runaway. The police have released Greg the
stoker and they've reopened the case.Meanwhile, Mabel is pretty sure she knows
who killed Ben. She thinks it'sDicky. Maxim, the critic, is
(02:04):
sitting in on the rehearsal to reviewthe show. Howard and Mabel realize the
spooky noise from opening night was thepaper shredder, and Howard offers to help
piece the shredded paper together. Whata task. Detective Williams is back.
He happy motherfuck us, and shewants to interview everyone in the show.
(02:25):
Charles and Oliver seem to be actinglike idiots trying to listen in on the
interviews, but it turns out tobe part of their plan and they set
up a GoPro so they can watchthe interviews later. So smart Loretta confronts
Oliver about him stealing the book,and Oliver apologizes and he tells her that
Mabel thinks it's Dicky that killed Ben, and so Loretta goes and talks to
(02:46):
Mabel. She tries to convince herthat it was not Dicky, but maybe
it was Bobo or Katti's a bitch, That's what she says. Kat what
a bitch could be? Charles recordsall two minutes and forty six seconds of
the Patter song, and it's evenwilder than we could have imagined. Angelic
little Triplets friends, Mabel and Howardmanaged to piece a page together, but
(03:13):
it doesn't make any sense. ThenMabel sees rat poison in Katie's office.
The Retta and Donna have a talkin the bathroom and Donna says something kind
of dubious about a mother doing anythingfor her child. Oliver tells Loretta he
loves her. Maxine says the showis pure Oliver Putnam. Dickie tells Loretta
about the relief he felt when hethought Ben was dead. Then during Loretta's
(03:36):
song, Charles and Mabel discover Loretta'sletter to Dickie telling him that she's his
mother. And Loretta sees the copstrying to take Dickie away, and she
trumps up. She stops singing,and she takes the blame for Ben's murder,
and the music comes to a halt, and then I killed Ben.
Oliver has a heart attack, andthen Oliver collapses. He has a heart
attack. A huge episodeliver him.Here are the directors of episode eight,
(04:24):
Sherry Springer and Bob Pulcini. Wehave just finished episode eight, so we
are caught up. Still don't knowwho the killer is. Big episode,
big, big episode. Oh mygosh, Okay, what's most fun?
Most fun? It's so much funand I can't believe we got paid for
it. It's one of those kindsof jobs and you know, you get
(04:48):
a call and it's like, sodo you want to do an episode with
Meryl Streep of Only Murders Building,Yes, like, let me check my
schedule. Yeah, and it didn'tdisappoint. It was as wonderful, if
not more wonderful, than we actuallyexpected. Yeah, because this is your
first time directing something for Only Murders, you're new on this season, we're
(05:12):
new. What was it like cominginto you know, it's I feel like
they've kind of established a lot already, you know, even though they're always
bringing new stuff in. What wasyour experience like coming into the Only Murders
Family crew team? Well, we'veboth been super fans and watching it since
season one, so we had nocatching up to do about who was who
(05:38):
and where the plot was. Butit's an incredibly welcoming, wonderful group of
people. I mean, John Hoffmanis just like the warmest, funniest,
kindest person, and then everybody whoworks around him echoes that, and then
the cast is so fun, sofunny, it just every day. At
(06:03):
the end of the day we werelike, I can't believe we just got
to do that. How much funwas that? And I really don't say
that all the time. I can'texpress how much Martin Short and Steve Martin
have meant to me over the years, like and obviously Meryl Streep and I
(06:23):
love Selena. The addition of SelenaGomez on the show, I mean,
she's just so phenomenal with all theirchemistry. But like, you know,
I grew up with all these idolizingthese people, and it was very hard
for me not to like try torecite the jerk word for or break it
to my you know, Jimmy Glickimitation's Like I know them all. I
(06:45):
grew up as like an SETV fanatic. I just these guys are such icons
to me. So I just youknow, I love the show and I
was just so thrilled when we gotthe call. I feel like you get
some really really I mean, Iguess every episode has some great Martin short
and Steve Martin bits, but thisepisode, with their like scheme to get
(07:06):
the go pro in the dressing room, I feel like they both get to
do some really good, hilarious physicalcomedy. There's no comedy. I hope
one day they come out with youknow, the outtakes, because I cannot
tell you how many things. Imean, you couldn't put it how many
(07:27):
all takes there were for both ofthem with physical comedy that I could have
just watched for hours. I mean, you have to call cut, right,
you have to stop and move on. But I didn't want to because
it was so amazing and I hopeit sees the light of day. I
mean, this was just our episode. I can't imagine for all this,
(07:47):
you know, episodes for all theseasons, how much great physical comedy and
just comedy in general. Watching bothof them go at it was amazing.
I mean, the scripts are fantastic, but some of the funniest things are
just like Steve Martin getting up outof a seat, you know, and
but he turns that in shore oryou know, or Martin short making fun
(08:11):
of Steve Martin like endlessly we do. There's some really good ones at That's
what I mean. It was likein the ongoing comedy show for us.
I bet that sounds great. Okay, So, like we were saying,
this is a big episode, alot of threads coming together. Can you
(08:33):
tell us about some of those piecesthat you had to connect? Challenges maybe
in that process? Sure, Imean, I don't know how technically,
let's do it. Ryan loves thetechnical stuff. Well, you know,
it was you know how people takehold of the narrative at certain points,
and this was what was exciting forus is that this was Loretta's taking,
(08:54):
you know, chance to take overthe narrative. So there was a kind
of shooting style that established no youngLoretta in her you know, New York
youth that we wanted to kind ofrecall and add too. So that was
something that was really fun. Andthen to kind of expand on that and
bring her into the story, youknow in a way that reflected her past
(09:20):
and her present and so I youknow, the kind of opening with the
voiceover was a really lovely opportunity tokind of compose really nice shots. And
you know, there's nothing more fulfillingthan telling a story without dialogue, you
know, as a filmmaker, andthey give you this great opportunity to do
that, you know, in theway they introduced each episode, and then
(09:43):
to add Meryl Streets voice you knowto those images is just like the gift
from God. And then later onwe also got to tell story without dialogue,
but which was very challenging, whichwas during the pattern s, which
of the big wid which of respondat the broad kill maybe get time were
(10:07):
you were you were you good,madded so quick Wig. I still have
not stopped hearing in my head howmany months later. I mean, it
was endless. It's just you can'tget it out of your head. It's
such a near worm. And soduring the patter song, which Steve brilliantly
(10:33):
performs, we have to then intercutall of these things happening, you know,
the GoPro, the hiding, thepolice coming into the audience of the
theater. There was an interaction betweenLoretta and Dicky. There was like all
(10:54):
these things happening, and they hadto sort of happen without any explanation,
just sort of under this patter song. So it was the timing of the
song was fixed, so we hadto kind of plan out those images and
how we could communicate all those thingsthrough dividing up the screen, you know,
(11:15):
while he's you know, nailing thepatter song. Finally, man,
it was really fun. We didlike some mockups of that presented it to
storyboards of like all these split screensare kind of thing like that. We
were talking to Shelley about it.Here's that conversation with two of those editors,
Shelley Westerman and Pete and Koch aboutthat process that one scripted, Charles
(11:37):
does his patter song, and asscripted, it's all split screens and we're
like, oh my god, howare we going to do this? Like
that's so dependent on the framing ofeach and at some point there's multiple it's
not just split in two, there'smultiples, like three screens, and then
they pop in and out and goall over and we're like, what are
(11:58):
we going to do? Luckily,thank god, we had Bob and Cherry
our directors, and Bob had aplan and he said, here's what I
think we should do, and hemapped it out in an email, and
we made title cards with each sceneand kind of because it's to a song
that's going to be consistent, wewere able to mock it up with title
(12:20):
cards and it was a joint effort. I started. Then Peyton jumped in,
Diana Hyatt, Peyton's assistant, jumpedin. We colored coded the title
cards so you could see like whataction was going where, and we had
the whole thing mocked up before theyeven shot it. This is another testament
(12:41):
to having that relationship with Bob andCherry and having that communication and trust and
kind of going back and forth withthem, and then so they brought that
to set into meetings before they shot, and we're able to say we have
a plan, this is how wehave to each bit to go in it,
(13:01):
and everybody was amazed and jeez,it was definitely a huge joint effort
and it looks great. I'm reallyproud of it. That's big. Oh
my gosh. Do you feel likeyou could do the Patter Song by heart?
Now? Do you think you knowit? Yes? You have no
(13:22):
idea. Those songs are like burnedinto our heads, like it's insane.
I went to bed singing them alot. Yeah, I've been singing the
Patter Song a lot. It couldbe a TikTok challenge for sure. Okay,
back to Bob and Cherry. Shelley'sgreat and we've worked with her before,
so we have like a long history. We worked years ago together and
(13:43):
it was fantastic working with her,and it was great to like plan this
out because I think if we hadn'tplanned it out, it would have been
a holy mess putting it together.So man, and it really worked like
our I think we wound up goingwith pretty much the exact split screen that
we down in pre production. Well, all right, it was really fun
to hear the patterns because we've heardit, you know, we heard Matthew
(14:07):
Broderick do a version of it.We heard Steve Martin in like episode rehearsing
it yet the first first, butit was fun to hear it like with
the full orchestra or you know,the whole the like the intro to it
was really great. And I mean, I just I'm I think I had
dreams about it last night and thendriving here, I was like, you
(14:30):
will not forget it. A monthfrom now, You'll still be singing.
Like part of me wants to learnall the lyrics. So just I have
it, you know, just inmy back pocket emergency. Well, Steve
was such a rock star doing itbecause he had to do it multiple times
through Oh my god, I canimagine, you know, on the stage
(14:52):
when we were shooting it, andone of the hardest things was, you
know, not ruining takes by laughings dark in the middle of it.
So it was it was really hardand did that happen often? Did it
happen? I'm pretty sure everybody laughI don't know if he was saying it
was a lot of like quiet tentionwhile he was doing that kind of the
(15:13):
way the characters, you know,because it's it's so hard and it's it's
long, and it's the first onelaughter. But the lyrics are so funny.
I mean every time he did it, I would hear another lyric that
I hadn't heard before, and Iyou know, it starts to chuckle and
and and and there was I thinkthe first time when he came out to
do it, there was like thesame tension that was happening for everybody in
(15:37):
the story, whereas like is hegoing to be able to get through this?
Is is this going to take?Because there's always time crunch and this
was a very ambitious episode with alot of singing and a lot of and
and he you know, were like, is he gonna make it? Is
it gonna is he gonna go tothat room? Over whatever? And he
made it. He was great andhe did it over no kuchikuchi ko?
(16:03):
What if none of it is true? Has my inspection been to cursory through
I look outside this nursery? Whatif none knocked up pick with crack?
Did it hold up modive in it? Hoo hoo? Whoo wow, Hi
show We're gonna take a quick break, and when we come back more with
(16:30):
Bob and Sherry, we'll talk aboutMabel and Loretta's moment backstage. In Steve
Martin's dedication to the show. Haveyou done a lot of music in the
past, like with your films,with other shows things like that. It
was a new experience, how wasit. We've done a lot of music
for our career, a lot ofa lot of for some reason, a
lot of performed music on screen kindof thing. So we had we had
(16:52):
a lot of experience with it.And I mean I was a musician before
I started filmmaking. So if there'smusic, I'm very excited. You know,
music is part of the actual story. Yeah, I'm really into it.
We even made a movie about Wemade a little movie about a straight
(17:12):
edge punk band. It was calledten Thousand Saints and and but Haley Steinfeld.
And it was really challenging, youknow, the music and it because
that music is not easy to sinkup. I mean, I don't want
to get too technical, but youknow, it's it was, but it
(17:33):
was That's why we love doing it. It was really fun. Interesting,
is it? Is it? INow I just have questions about this this
this straight edge punk thing. It'sbased on a really great book by Eleanor
Henderson called Ten Thousand Saints. Okay, it was a great book, really
mainstream kind of. Yeah. Yeah, music is really similar to the music
(17:56):
and only murders. Sorry, thepattern song and minor's threat have a lot
in common. They do, theydo. But from what I hear that
when you're shooting it that they're likeyou're using a mixture of like their live
recording and like the prerecorded stuff.Does that create any challenges? Oh god?
(18:18):
Yeah, well now this one too, there's the whole orchestra, which
makes it even more complicated, right, Yeah, especially Chris Steve, you
know, it was it's putting alot on his plate. And we had
a supervisor there who Ian, whowas amazing. It was fantastic, but
very strict. Really. He wasa lot of the breaths to be taken
at the right moment, and wewould have to redo takes because of the
(18:41):
breaths, you know, which ischallenging, you know, again on a
TV shoot schedule. But he wasamazingly exact, and then in post production
everybody was thrilled because it works sowell. Yeah, and then you choose
which pieces you use live and whichpieces you use for the prerecord. The
only person who didn't sing with thepre record was Merril, who wanted to
(19:06):
sing live, and you know,of course did it perfectly impossible too for
what she had. Yeah, shehad to performance performance breaks. I got
chills during that last one of Meryl'ssong in this episode to Helen back on
(19:32):
a Precious Lives is take time before. I never let him go saying no
from the same So I did it, and she did it again. She
did it, you know, youknow amazingly. It's really fascinating to watch
her because she I mean, whatcan you say about Meryl Street? But
(19:56):
Azabeth said, but you know shesee the process with every take, you
know, of her feeling the right, right kind of fit for the words,
and it changes and then it it'sperfection, you know what I mean.
Like it's it's really interesting too.It was really interesting for me and
(20:18):
for I think for us. Youknow, there's a certain level of like,
oh my god, it's Meryl Streepand she immediately kind of makes everybody
feel comfortable, you know, andmakes you feel like, oh, she's
okay, she's nice, she's gonnabe this is gonna be okay. She
goes out of her way to makeyou feel comfortable. Selna had this really
lovely scene with her that kind ofit's also quite funny and which of course
(20:41):
she nails, and but you knowit like she she she said, it's
like like I have to go backand find my lines because I realize I'm
looking at Meryl Streep. You knowthat that kind of yeah, the kind
of you know, the eye nicstatus that she brings I think for actors,
(21:03):
but she really goes out of herway to make everybody feel comfortable and
not intimidated. That's what we keephearing. You know. I was worried.
I tried to I tried to explainit to my son, like the
night before I have the sixteen yearold son. I was like, I
was like, it's like, youknow, she's like the Tom Brady of
actor. And he's like, oh, now I know why you're so nervous.
(21:30):
That's a great analogy. I thinkshe would appreciate that. Yeah,
and he got it. He gotit. Then he understood and he was
like, tell me more about Selenagirl. I imagine it was also hard
for Selena in that scene in thisepisode, the specific scene, because like
I feel like Meryl's kind of beinglike very subtle and things, but then
(21:52):
she's also being very funny with like, well Katie's a bit you know.
Well it was a hard scene.But Selena, you know, she totally
got it. She's such a pro. But it was a hard scene to
get the right sort of texture ofit, you know, the right it
was. There was like very subtlethings going on in it. Yeah,
(22:15):
Selena did this nice thing where shealmost Lareta almost brings her in, but
then she immediately gets out. Youknow, she's she's finding those moments I
think was you know, she's Ithink set. Yeah, you should notice
there is a guest much odder charactersaround this show. I'm just going to
(22:40):
throw a name out, Bobo.We don't really know Bobo, do we,
And he's the comic relief, buthe is the comedy hiding something sinister.
Allso poison was a woman's method?Oh yeah, right, right,
So Katie, what a bitch couldbe? I'm just trying to picture Dickie,
(23:03):
is it murderer? And hold on, hold on, hold on,
and no I can't. So atthe end of this episode, emotions are
running really high. Loretta has admittedto killing men, and Oliver has collapsed
and adding to that emotion, it'sthis long camera pull up the aisle of
(23:23):
the theater. We really wanted toget that the final shot of you know,
our episode, which was kind ofthis really fast pullback on down the
aisle of the theater, which waswhich was tricking, you know, the
(23:45):
way the theater was built in.The initial call was that it was going
to take way too long, andSteve was I think supposed to go home,
right, Yeah, it wasn't goingto take that long. But there
was a conversation the DPE kind ofsaid, well, it could take two
hours to set up, and Steveoffered to go to home and have dinner.
(24:07):
And I've never had I've never hadan actor offer to do that.
It was the nicest thing we haveto have to do it. I was
like, it was just the factthat he offered to do that was so
amazing. That's so sweet. Mostmost actors that leave don't ever want most
people, most crew people, anybody. Once you leave, you've gone for
(24:30):
the day. What a mention,What a man I loved In the opening
of the episode earlier, you weretalking about like, you know, telling
a story without words. And Ilove how there's the space between when the
picture starts and we see loretta innerapartment and her voice over starts, because
we've been waiting to hear from thischaracter for eight episodes. You know,
(24:53):
her apartment was really fun, youknow, the way it was designed to
shoot in it told her story.I think so well, and it's so
I mean, we live in NewYork and I know people actors many.
I worked very early, while Iwas still in film school, very early
(25:14):
in my career, I worked ata company called American Playhouse that did like
indie films and indie pbs like showsand stuff like that. And I remember
I worked with this woman who wasan actress who basically didn't really make a
career of you know, make aliving as an actress and worked for American
playhous as the receptionist. And Iwas young and like idealistic at the time,
(25:37):
and she invited me. She askedme to go back to we like
went out to get some lunch orsomething, and she said, oh,
I want to get something in myapartment. She had an apartment in the
Theater district, which was not farfrom our office and I had never seen
anything like that. She had Loretta'sapartment. She had this tiny apartment,
but everything was in a apartment.I remember she had this loft, this
(26:02):
like loft space with boxeswhere Yeah,it was it was so and she was
Loretta, I mean she except Idon't think she ever got the break.
You know. It's a little heartbreakingand very true. Yeah, that's one
of the things that John was tellingus about was that, you know,
everybody in the industry knows these peoplethat it's not a lack of talent or
(26:27):
you know, a lack of wantingor trying, that that they never get
their big break, their break,you know, and that there's this you
know, it's a brutal, abrutal career path, you know it is,
and yet yet they are who theyare and they can't stop, you
know, because because they love itso much. I mean, I mean,
(26:48):
as it's funny. You know,we've been directing for a long time
and there's a lot of times Iwould like we would audition back in the
old days when we actually did inperson auditions and not you know, and
people didn't send it self takes.But I mean, I loved the in
person, because you've got to actuallytalk to people, and you've got to
know people that you didn't cast.And there would be people who came in
(27:11):
who were fantastic, perfect, butfor one reason or another, just not
right for the role, you know, and you know, and it breaks
your heart because you can't get youcan only cast one person, and you're
like, this person's going to walkaway and they're not getting their chance and
they're not and you know, Idon't want them to be discouraged, but
(27:33):
so you know, I feel likeit's a very heartbreaking business. We'll be
back with Bob and Sherry after onemore quick break to talk a little bit
more about the technical side of allthe action unfolding during the song performance and
what it's like working with a spouse. I was very curious about that part
(28:02):
when you say you're going prepared andwe kind of touched on this briefly before
with your storyboards and stuff, specificallywith the patter song. Are you saying
like we need to get all theseshots during this these lines of the song.
Is that how you planning that outor I guess I'm just curious technical.
I like the technical stuff. Yeah, yeah, I mean this is
(28:23):
very technical. Basically, I hadShelley cut a split screen with words,
yeah, okay, what would behappening in all those different things. So
it would say and then we playpiece you know the right right like that,
it would say it, and thenlayered over it would be the patter
(28:44):
song and then it go wide andreveal uh, you know, the police
enter or whatever. There was justa lot of there was a lot of
like, how we're going to dothis given the time, and I said,
let's work backwards. Let's start withthe song, work backwards, start
dividing up the moments and see what. Let's make sure everything we have the
time for everything to fit. Oneof the hardest things to do in the
(29:06):
show was figuring out the timing betweenI mean, this is technical place the
timing of Selena and Steve finding thebook at Loretta's bag law Loretta is performing,
Yes, that was we had todo that while while Dickie is getting
questioned by the police, and whereMeryl's attention is at the moment, and
(29:30):
then timing the their realization, youknow, they're having the realization that Dickie
as her son simultaneous to them,so all of and then there's a song
involved, so all of that.That was one of the hardest at things
actually, because that actually, youknow, Meryl's live performance kind of led
that and that, you know,we kind of had to really struggle with
(29:55):
and the editing and she had toreally see because she had she had as
an actor to have her real intentionor whatever. She had to see the
police come up to to Dickie andtake him so she could say wait,
wait and break out of song.So it it all had to be timed.
(30:18):
It's a little it was. Itwas you know, even though it's
filmed, there was almost a theatricalaspect to it because things had to be
planned out so carefully, right,and you didn't and because she was singing
out live, you didn't. Youcouldn't rely on the pre record. I
guess like you could with the time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, right,
we didn't have a pre record topractice. Well yeah, m interesting.
(30:41):
Yeah. I have a question though, So you you are married,
yes, and you work together.Oh, I don't know if you know
this. He and I are married. Yeah, Well, there you go.
It's it's great, it's great.We've been married for just over a
(31:03):
year, but we've been together fora very long time. Congratulation, Thank
you so much. And we alsoworked together, and I was just curious
about working with your spouse, likedid you always work together? Has that
been a foundational part of your relationshipor is that something you guys both were
interested in the same field, soyou started working together. What's what's it
(31:23):
like working with your great question withyour partner. We met at Columbia Film
School, okay, many many yearsago, graduate school for film, and
we actually started working together. Firstwe sort of like our first project that
we had to do, which waslike some little video. Bob asked me
(31:45):
if I would act in it,and I was like sure, but then
you have to act, and thoughtwe should be a director. We made
short films and Sharry produced my shortfilm and I edited her short film,
and then we decided to start writingtogether. So we started kind of writing
together, and then we actually starteddirecting documentaries together. But we got married
(32:07):
before we started different and somewhere alongthat career path we got married, it
just became like, oh, we'respending so much time together. So I
always say that I don't know aboutyou, guys, but I always say
that I think it helped that weworked together first because we had our kind
(32:28):
of work relationship figured out, andthen the romantic thing came after. So
in a weird way, it evolvedfrom a work relationship. But as you
guys know, you never have tosay at the end of the day,
had your day go? It's like, which is there's something nice about that?
Because it's hard, you know.I know a lot of people were
in the arts and their spouse ortheir significant other isn't and it's sometimes very
(32:55):
hard to communicate those things to people. How long have you been married and
how long have you been working?I'm still interested in this topic. This
is encouraging for you guys. We'vebeen married twenty nine years. Holy cow.
R yeah, holy cow, it'spossible we could be working together probably
thirty years, you know for us. Yeah, well see, we got
(33:15):
this. So I'm also curious aboutanother question about this though. Do you
feel like you have similar strengths ordifferent strengths that you bring together to your
creative relationship, like maybe Bob's reallygood at one night one sort of aspect,
cherry you bring another aspect or doyou feel like, how do you
feel with that balance of creative power? I'll let you answer that yes we
(33:39):
do. I mean, it's it'sinteresting because it probably doesn't fall along gender
lines that people would imagine too,you know, like these assumptions people have,
but we've learned over the years likeoh, you've got this, you
take you take this, and I'lltake this, and you you you're good
(34:00):
with this actor or this actor.You know, it's nice having that kind
of discussions and realizing we know eachother well enough to know like this is
your meal you you shouldn't handle thisor it. And it's interesting, like
Sharry's got amazing producorial and schedule thingsthat I don't that I'm not good at,
(34:20):
so I know, like to lether lead in those areas. And
you know, on set, Ithink I tend to work more with the
visuals and like the DP and Charitytends to be like to be right in
the middle of everything with the actors, and which is very helpful because it's
good to have someone watching the shotsand watching the performance from that perspective,
(34:43):
and it's also really good to havesomeone there live and feeling it and feeling
with the actor's need. And myadvice to you because you kind of you
don't have to know all those things, but you'll discover them along the way.
You know, what your where yourstrengths are, and where your strengths
are. I love that that.Yeah, I've got one one more question.
You kind of you talked about oneof the things that was the most
(35:05):
difficult in this in shooting your episode, and I'm curious if there was something
that was what was like the mostfun? My god, it was all
fun. I can't I don't thinkI could pick, you know, like,
it was just all fun. Everythingabout it was fun. And I
think one of the you know,really surprising things, you know, because
(35:25):
the comedians are so brilliant a comedy, but like you know, seeing Martin
Short Meryl Streep in their chemistry togetherin the more emotional scenes was really fun
and really rewarding. And you know, I think, you know, in
those kinds of situations, that's like, let's see what they want to do,
you know, let's see where theywant to be, Let's see how
(35:47):
they want to play it, becausethey had such a kind of beautiful pour
with each other, you know,and it was very evident to me in
watching the previous episodes, you know, because a result, you know,
we had some nice scenes with themtogether and I was like, oh,
this is an interesting thread. Andwhen I saw them together, it just
(36:07):
made perfect sense, you know,and who would think, right, I
love seeing Yeah, I love seeingthat side of Martin Short. I don't
feel like I've ever seen that.You know, he's a really good actor,
really very really brought it. Yeah, I was saying, I think
I told John like that the MerylStreep and and Martin Short love story is
(36:30):
the thing I didn't realize I needed, but I needed it. It's so
good. It's so good. Ideletely agree. And they really take it
to another level. It's like it'slike real, it's realized. It's really
you really were rooting for them,you are? Yeah. And then and
this episode, I feel like isa very emotional one in that because Oliver
(36:53):
says I love you, which ishuge, and then Loretta takes the fall,
which is huge, and he hasa heart attack. Like this is
like this is so much. Thisa huge episode, you know, like
a lot to do. Yeah,it's like I love you, wait,
I did it. Yeah, Likeit's all be in like five minutes at
(37:15):
the end. I don't know manyshows that could pull that off, but
this show does exactly pull everything sucha specific tone that's so unique and rare
that it's just yeah, And youknow, it was also so much fun
is when we weren't shooting, whenthey were setting up and just sitting and
(37:39):
talking to these amazing actors and theseamazing legends. You know, just sitting
around like that was just amazing.I know, I bet I want to
I'd like to just be a flyon the wall for that. That'd be
great. Yeah, that's it fortoday. We'll be back later this week
with showrunner and co creator John Hoffmanto talk about the return of Detective Williams
(38:01):
and on earthings, some key piecesof evidence the trio will need to solve
Ben's murder, and of course yourtheories see them. By Only Murders in
(38:27):
the Pod is a production of strawHut Media. This episode was written,
edited, and hosted by Maggie Bollsand Ryan Tillotson, with additional editing and
sound mixing by Daniel Ferreira. Motiongraphics for promotional materials are by Ali Yamed,
with graphic design by Mohammed Samir.Our associate producer is Stephen Markley.
Original music by Kyle Merritt and OnlyMurders theme music by Sidartha Kosla. Big
(38:50):
big thanks to John Hoffman, JavierSalis, Emily lets yasmin As a Rakish,
Lydia McMahon, Cindy Neighbor, andthe rest of the Hulu team,
And thanks to Key and KK.We wish you were with us this season.
You miss you, do you,guys? I assume you do know
(39:15):
who the killer is? Now Ido know who the kill us, but
I will not yell it under anyI know, but I know because I've
heard people gossiping upset. I didn'tread the last the scripts that following ours.
I just didn't want to unless Ihad to for something that we've involved
in a distant you know, i'dread the scenes or something. But I
(39:37):
know I know who it is.I avoided trying to find out. I
just picked up things with people talkingafter they you know, read the scripts
and stuff. So yeah, Ihave a theory now, yeah, yeah, we'll see
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