March 11, 2025 • 46 mins
In this episode of Openly Spoken,I sat down with Sara Thornhill, a master meditation coach and founder of Queer Calm Collective. We explore the transformative power of meditation, the importance of addressing pain and trauma, and the journey of self-discovery and healing.
Sara shares her personal experiences with trauma, motherhood, and the significance of self-love and community in the healing process. The conversation emphasizes the interconnectedness of all beings and the importance of compassion in navigating life's challenges.
Just a few takeaways:
Pain can lead to growth and transformation.
Self-love involves listening to and nourishing oneself.
We are all interconnected, and our experiences reflect our inner worlds
----
Connect with Sara:
LGBTQ+ private group for heartbreak healing coaching — https://www.facebook.com/groups/2181421388855870/?ref=share_group_link
Free 15-min WEBINAR - https://webinar.sarawebbsays.com/s/Qi28p6
Social links / handles
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/SaraWebbSays
IG: https://www.instagram.com/queerheartsbreakharder?igsh=b2JucDJldGtrdHI3&utm_source=qr
FB: https://facebook.com/SaraWebbSaysLLC
Google: https://maps.app.goo.gl/wYskY2sSK8KuCuFKA?g_st=ic
YouTube: https://youtube.com/@SaraWebbSays?si=8Xcn_in69dPHWoz1
Amazon book: https://a.co/d/bmkoyBf
Website https://www.sarawebbsays.com
---
Watch this episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/TanZWnWseXk
---
Find some FREE self love resources here: https://selfexpressedbabe.com/resources/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to Openly Spoken, the podcast to help you show up, speak out, and be seen in healthy
(00:18):
relationships.
On this show, we talk about self-love, sexuality, relationship tips, including ending the cycle
of toxic relationships, and healing and thriving after heartbreak.
Hi, I'm your host Cilia and I'm a certified sex, love, and relationship coach helping
ambitious women with a history of toxic relationships feel deeply connected in healthy love.
(00:43):
These are such important topics that every woman deserves, so if you could leave this
show a rating and a review on Apple podcasts or Spotify to help more women find this, it
would mean the absolute world to me.
Thank you so much for being here today.
Now let's dive into the show.
(01:15):
We are recording.
Welcome to Openly Spoken, the podcast to help you show up, speak out, and be seen in
healthy relationships.
Today's guest is Sara Thornhill.
Sara Thornhill of Sara Web says is a master meditation coach and founder of Queer Calm
Collective.
Sara activates and empowers the LGBTQIA plus community to heal stress, anxiety, and depression.
(01:39):
Certified in NLP, trauma, and relationship attachment, Sara specializes in helping clients
uncover their innate ability to thrive by addressing the underlying causes of emotional
struggles and showing them how to revive their inner power.
Sara teaches pocket-sized techniques her clients can use anywhere to process stress
and improve daily happiness so they can bring the best version of themselves to their own
(02:05):
lives.
She says we've cultivated an inclusive, supportive culture designed to serve all humans with
a special focus on marginalized members of the LGBTQIA plus community worldwide.
As a sexual assault survivor, two-time divorcee, and someone who came out later in life, Sara
deeply understands the transformative potential of navigating major life changes.
(02:29):
She passionately believes that healing is a birthright, asserting that a life of thrive
is possible for everyone regardless of circumstances.
Sara resides in sunny Florida and travels internationally for workshops and speaking
engagements.
Yay!
We did it!
Welcome to the show, Sara.
(02:50):
Thank you so much.
I'm so excited to have you here today.
Delighted to be here.
Yes.
I'd love to know before we dive in just what is most alive in your heart right now as you
come here to this podcast today.
Well, I just led a really powerful guided meditation for some professionals who are
(03:11):
not queer.
Well, maybe some of them are.
I don't know, but that's not the point.
They're professionals in the middle of the workday.
I support in a variety of ways with desk yoga and guided meditation at another… well,
I won't mention the actual corporation, but it's a Fortune 50 corporation that's local
(03:35):
here that I'm really honored to be able to support virtually.
And meditation is just so powerful.
And so I'm feeling some of the literal vibrations that we cultivated in that session and really
excited to dive in and talk more about meditation and meditative states and the really power
that we have behind our eyelids.
(03:58):
Yes.
I feel that energy and that vibration.
And I love to see the little chakra chart behind you too.
I'm feeling those vibrations.
I use it to demonstrate for my clients like so, and I've got my mascot too because my
Florida…
Flamingo?
Yes, exactly.
Yeah.
(04:18):
Yeah.
Flamingos are actually really beautiful, like in person.
Actual flamingos.
I think they're so beautiful.
And they stand on one leg, which is something I'm actively doing all the time because I'm
on crutches right now.
I have a triple break in my left foot, heel, ankle, tibia.
(04:40):
And this literal injury has been, I mean, incredibly painful.
And one of the best things that's ever happened in my life, as many difficult things are,
like some of the things that you read in my bio, studies have shown that whenever we have
that like really tough vacation where we booked a beach vacation and it rained every day or
(05:05):
we got stuck on the side of the road changing a tire at midnight, those are the ones that
we laugh about five years down the road, 10 years down the road, and that we really remember.
Yeah.
I really try to teach my clients that grip without the grit is what I call it so that
you can kind of play with a difficult situation like a beach ball.
(05:30):
I get to solve this issue because the stress actually makes it hard for us to think.
And so this injury, of course, yeah, there's been a lot of pain, but there's also been
a lot of opening as a result of the closing off of what it's caused in my life.
(05:51):
So yes, the standing on one leg that my little mascot, I had no idea how symbolic and appropriate
that would be for me later on in life because my right leg is super strong now and my left
leg has withered.
You'll have to do some special muscle strength exercises once that foot is back.
(06:14):
Once they release me, yeah, I'm going to have a lot of PT, a lot of physical therapy, and
it's just not healing.
I actually had a re-injury recently where I fell down again.
I mean, I'm clumsy obviously already.
And then you put me on one leg with these things that if I get on the wrong surface
(06:34):
or a leaf underneath one of the crutches, I'm on the ground again.
So, you know, everything's a gift.
Pain is love.
Pain is showing us where to look.
Yeah.
And if we didn't feel pain, we wouldn't know that we were injured or to pay attention.
Yeah.
(06:54):
And what I think is so ironic about what you say about the pain and love thing is a lot
of times I've noticed this as a yoga teacher, as a relationship coach, and just in my own
life experience from what I've gone through and seeing friends and family go through,
we like to ignore pain.
We tend to ignore pain or not want to feel it or not want to really face it.
(07:19):
And the ironic thing is then that makes love and bliss and all the happy, good emotions
kind of wither down too.
And we kind of end up being numb.
And the more you learn to really step up to the plate for your own pain and for the moments
in life where in the moment you're like, this is awful.
(07:40):
The more you learn to step up to that, the more capacity you then have for love and for
joy.
And yeah, I would love for you to speak to that.
Absolutely.
You know, as far as the pendulum swings one way, it is going to swing the other way.
And if you have a crying baby and you put them in the closet, it's not going to make
(08:03):
the baby stop crying.
It's only going to exacerbate the problem.
And you're absolutely right.
If we ignore the signals of our body, because I mean, we are spiritual beings having a physical
experience.
The body is a portal.
(08:23):
It's here to send us messages.
I've been really digging into the work around this left heel foot tibia injury as to what
are the messages.
It's caused so many cataclysmic shifts, you know, since I guess maybe your audience is
a little bit more woo woo.
(08:43):
I'll speak directly to how it occurred.
I was leaving a yoga studio locally here in St. Petersburg, Florida, and I had been doing
some mantra meditation honoring the entity, the energy of Ganesh, which is that Indian
(09:04):
god with a child's body and an elephant's head.
And he is said to be the remover of obstacles.
Whether or not it's a god or a deity, I don't know.
I know that there's an energy to anger.
I know that there's an energy to joy.
And so there's an energy to removing obstacles.
And I had this incredible vision like I've never had before during it, which I won't
(09:27):
belabor, but came out was feeling great, kind of like wasn't really aware of where I was.
I was totally out of the meditation, but missed a step.
There were like three steps coming out of the studio, missed a step, didn't know I had
broken it for several days.
The yoga teacher came out who's a, you know, friend acquaintance of mine, I've been to
(09:51):
a lot of her classes.
I teach mantra meditation myself.
And she said, you just chanted to the remover of obstacles and you rolled over on your ankle.
And she said, you know, there's a message here.
And my goodness, you know, that somebody, people, they could say that this is an obstacle
that I'm dealing with.
It has caused so much opening.
Of course, I can't teach yoga right now.
(10:14):
I don't know if ever again, I'm not sure, but it's caused me to change my schedule entirely.
Now, instead of teaching in person, I'm teaching some desk yoga online and it's really allowed
me to focus on what's important.
And to do some generational trauma healing.
And so, you know, in answer to your question and, or you're prompting there about the
(10:39):
suppression of emotions, this ankle that I've rolled over on so many times in my life is
that act of not paying attention, not doing the work.
I didn't have the skills.
I didn't have the tools.
All those other times that I rolled over on my ankle, didn't get it checked out for about
10 days.
And I'm like, this swelling is not going down when gone to the X-ray.
(11:04):
And of course, the pain has caused so much joy in other ways.
And you're right.
If we deny, distract, dissociate, I say that this 3D world, those are the 3Ds, deny, distract,
dissociate.
You know, how are we going to be able to enjoy life fully?
Because if we're not allowing the pendulum to swing and experiencing those tough emotions,
(11:29):
then we're not going to have that release from within that's possible when we just allow
it to pass through.
You know, scientists have studied that it takes 30 to 90 seconds to feel an emotion
and let it pass through.
The only reason why it persists, it's because of the story that we're telling ourselves
(11:51):
about it.
Yeah.
And so often that story is like, this thing is bad or negative.
Like we see anxiety as that's bad or stress as that's bad.
I don't remember who the speaker was, but I was watching this TED talk about stress
and the person was saying that in this experiment, they found that people who had negative, who
(12:16):
put a negative meaning to stress had a worse experience with stress, but the people who
didn't think stress was bad, we're still able to bounce back quicker and able to regulate
their nervous system and not stay stuck in the stress.
Yeah.
So that's interesting.
Yeah.
It's all about the perception of it, right?
(12:37):
Like if you think about a roller coaster, physiologically, we're going into fight or
flight.
It's just that we feel safe.
We perceive ourselves as being safe.
If you think about an orgasm, that's a panic attack.
It just has to do with the way that we're perceiving it.
We feel safe in the moment.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(12:58):
But physiologically-
Because safety is needed for orgasm, at least for women.
I don't know if men need to feel safe.
I don't know.
But for women, safety is a huge piece and sometimes we don't feel safe.
And if we're in a safe environment, sometimes we don't feel safe when we have the mental
(13:19):
conditioning of some of the things we receive from being conditioned as women.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
And meditation is a good tool to really pause and stop and observe all that and create more
safety.
Yeah.
And when people have enlightening experiences, they say that an orgasm is the closest thing
(13:44):
to enlightenment as far as what's happening and the ida, the pingalish, the shishmana,
all the spiraling that's happening up the chakras, up the spinal cord, the cerebrospinal
fluid is.
And we tend to hold our breath.
We're breathing in and out of the mouth.
And so that energy actually shoots up the spine in a similar way.
(14:06):
When we experience orgasm, it's similar to that enlightening experience that Kundalini
yoga practitioners try to mimic, tantra practitioners.
And yes, when we meditate, we can have those super expansive experiences that don't have
any preconceived notions or shame or like you say, things that we were given free of
(14:33):
charge from our primary caregivers or the church or whomever.
I mean, I myself was raised very strict Southern Baptist, no drinking, no dancing, no boyfriends,
no Halloween.
Oh, wow.
Yeah.
It was really tight.
And I went to school there five days a week and I was singing in the choir and I was in
(14:57):
the youth group and I was there Sunday morning and Sunday night.
And we went there on Monday night for red beans and rice.
I basically lived there.
Wow.
And I was fed all this information and that's the reason why I didn't come out for 38 years.
I told my sister and my brother who I came out to, I said, listen, I didn't tell mom
and dad when I started having sex with boys, why would I tell them that a couple years
(15:20):
later I started having sex with girls?
This is none of their business.
It's only going to cause a wave.
And gosh, I mean, you can't go back, but I do wish I had come out much earlier because
I still struggle with my parents believing that I'm an abomination, telling me actively
(15:42):
every time we talk on the phone that I need Jesus.
And it's really painful to have a relationship with them because they shun me essentially
while trying to convert me.
And meditation has been a lifesaver for me.
And meditation saved my life unequivocally.
(16:07):
It is because I have been able to stop the downward spiral and learn to spin within.
I love that.
So where were you at in your life before you started meditating for the first time?
Well, I was actually pregnant when I first learned how to meditate formally from a meditation
(16:27):
coach that I paid a large sum of money to have private meditation coaching.
But I've been a yogi since I was 18, 19, 20 years old.
I can't remember exactly when in college it was.
How did your parents take that?
Because yoga is usually from a strict religious upbringing.
Yoga is usually labeled as witchcraft.
Very true.
(16:48):
And I found yoga.
You're being the devil into your body.
It's so true.
And it was in Louisiana when I was in college, because I'm from southern Louisiana.
And it was in Baton Rouge at Women's Gym where they had gym yoga that I found this incredible
yoga teacher that I went to for years all throughout college.
(17:09):
Then I moved to Dallas after Hurricane Katrina hit in 05.
And I was like, oh, I'll go to the yoga class at my gym.
And I was like, what is this?
This is not yoga.
She's like, and then you put your hand here.
And then you put your feet here.
There was no chakras or visualization or breath work or any of the delicious things that I
(17:32):
was accustomed to.
I was just so blessed to have this anomaly in Baton Rouge, Louisiana that was teaching
at this women's gym.
And so yeah, I don't know if my parents really even knew.
Yoga wasn't really in vogue then in the aught.
They were just going to the gym in their eyes.
Yeah, I mean, I was living outside of the house.
(17:54):
So I was in college and living about an hour and a half away.
And so yeah, I really loved yoga and took to it.
And so I had done meditations and I had my very first meditative experience during one
of those yoga classes where I saw something in my third eye.
It was like a purple light.
(18:14):
And I went up to my teacher afterwards and I'm like, what was that?
Where can I learn more about it?
And she said, read autobiography of a yogi.
And I picked it up and I started pouring into it and I was like, are you serious?
This is a joke.
And I put that book down.
I was like, this is ridiculous.
And then I picked it up later in my piece and I got more through the book, but it wasn't
(18:40):
until my early forties that I really read it again and started following.
And actually I'm a student of Paramahansa Yogananda now and have used some of his meditative
practices.
But, you know, meditation really entered my life fully almost nine years ago when I was
five months pregnant with my daughter and I heard a radio program on NPR that's now
(19:07):
defunct the actual Diane Rehm.
And she had a mindfulness expert and a transcendental meditation expert for the entire hour talking
about meditation.
And I didn't know that I had been trying mindfulness for years, that all these things that I had
been doing and it never worked for me.
I couldn't shut the thoughts off.
(19:27):
I couldn't.
And so I said, well, I'm going to try this TM with the mantra meditation that you just
repeat silently.
And that changed my life.
20 minutes twice a day from there on out.
Now I have been certified in multiple modalities and do all kinds of different meditations.
But it has saved me in more ways than one because there's only a couple of things that
(19:51):
you can control.
Very limited, your thoughts and your actions.
And meditation is one of those things that you can do instantaneously.
I mean, I meditate in the car, not driving, but it's a great place where in nine years
only two people have ever knocked on the window and said, are you okay?
Because you can find like a shaded area, turn off the engine and just relax.
(20:14):
And if you're a block away from home or before you leave work, you can take a few minutes.
Yeah, that's a good idea.
Just set your seat back a little bit and take a few minutes for yourself to decompress,
to listen to what your body's trying to tell you.
I always say, and I'm sure you've heard it, that prayer is talking to God and meditation
(20:36):
is listening.
It's opening yourself up to be that channel to receive from the quantum.
I've actually never heard that before.
Yeah.
Now you'll hear it everywhere.
I love it.
So you were pregnant when you found meditation formally.
(20:57):
What shifted in your relationship to yourself and your relationships with others once meditation
became a deeper practice for you?
I'll never forget when my daughter had just been born.
So I must have been meditating for four or five months.
I had just gotten her to sleep.
I was breastfeeding, sleeping very little in those first few months.
(21:19):
I had just filled up a crystal glass that I had gotten as a wedding gift.
Very expensive.
It was like a $25 Swarovski or whatever the national brand of crystal is glass that I
had gotten and filled it with water.
I was going to put it by my bedside and I dropped it and it shattered all over the floor.
(21:40):
I went and got the broom and I started sweeping it up.
In the midst of sweeping it up, I recognized that I hadn't gotten angry.
I hadn't perseverated or worried about now I'm going to get less sleep or the little
(22:01):
shards of glass that my cat might step on or my daughter might.
So I called my meditation teacher and I was like, what's happening?
He said, you're starting to witness.
I'm like, oh my gosh, this is amazing.
My ex-husband, my now ex-husband noticed that I was different, that I wasn't flying off
(22:21):
the handle.
I was taught to bottle it up, bottle it up, bottle it up, explode.
That's what my family taught me directly to do.
I wasn't doing that anymore.
I was much more even keel and he learned.
He was like, give me that meditation teacher's number.
Nice.
Yeah.
So it definitely shifted my relationship with myself and other relationships in my life.
(22:47):
Those moments are so cool.
They're like off the mat moments when you notice yourself paying attention or with your
yoga practice, when you notice that when you bend over the sink to wash your face, you're
doing it with proper form.
Right.
Yeah.
Pending at the hips instead of the waist.
(23:07):
Yes.
Yeah.
And it's so beautiful that just by shifting our own internal worlds, we show up differently
to a relationship and that has an effect on the other person.
Whether they ask you for the meditation teacher's number or not, I think it has an effect because
you're bringing a different relationship as two people and the energy you're bringing
(23:29):
in is now a little different.
And so that feedback loop of energy between you guys has shifted a little bit and I love
hearing about that.
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, I like to say there's really only one relationship and it's the one that you
have with yourself, but it ripples out like a pebble in a pond to all the relationships
(23:55):
that you have because if you're well fed and well rested, the way you reply, respond, react
to somebody else in your life is going to be vastly different from if you're hungry
and tired and stressed.
So that relationship of being able to nourish yourself and take the time for yourself is
(24:20):
going to affect whether or not you are able to actually show up authentically because
we are made of love.
God is love and we are drops of God, so we are made of love and that's our authentic
selves.
I always say when I'm at the end of Shavasana, memorize this vibration you've cultivated
(24:41):
because this is the more authentic you and see if you can scoop up some of it right now
so that that next time that that person says that thing, you can respond from this place
on your mat instead of from a place of stress.
Yeah.
It really illustrates how mindfulness is a practice in like being a human being, like
(25:05):
being human being.
Yeah, not a human doing, right?
Yeah.
I love what you said about, go ahead.
No?
You go ahead.
I was going to say I love what you said about that there's only one relationship and that
relationship with yourself and then it ripples out.
(25:26):
That also makes me think of how with my mindfulness practice and almost everyone that does a mindfulness
practice for an extended amount of time, you kind of get to this point where you realize
you are not separate from not only other people, but every literal single thing and you really
feel into thought of we are all one, everything is all one.
(25:52):
And I have this friend who has this theory that I believe and my husband believes it
too that we're actually all one being, but in like different, different, I guess, manifestations
of the same being and that we're all the same being having these experiences in different
parts of the world.
And I'd love to know what you think about that.
Absolutely.
(26:12):
I mean, life is a fractured mirror.
Yeah.
We just look separate.
So anybody that's showing up in my vibration, whether they're pleasing to me or displeasing
to me, that's an indication of my particular vibration.
I was taught to be a very negative person.
(26:37):
Now that doesn't say anything negative about my primary caregivers.
You can only give away what you have.
And I had a primary caregiver who wasn't my natural parent.
I have two biological parents who I still have a relationship with who I've spoken
of, but she was my primary caretaker for the majority of my young life and still works
(26:59):
for my parents.
She taught me really disempowering thinking about the world.
I didn't know it until I started on my own journey and started trying to untangle the
difficulties that I was having in life.
And because I've, it was like I had been working so hard on trying to be positive, be positive.
(27:23):
And then when I started meditating, everything shifted and I was like able to be positive
naturally without really having to try necessarily.
And now because I've practiced gratitude for almost 1800 days straight, I'm completely
alcohol and drug free.
I intentionally look for and appreciate the good because I want to activate my reticular
(27:48):
activating system to find, it's like an algorithm, right?
Find more of what I'm looking for.
Anytime I do slip into any kind of difficult vibration, everyone in my sphere changes instantaneously.
They are not the happy go lucky.
(28:08):
They are not the positive.
It's like, it is so obvious the difference in what I'm vibrationally putting out there
because my electromagnetic field, my aura, if you will, is so strong that if I let it slip,
as far as the pendulum swings one way, it can swing the other way very quickly.
(28:31):
And so I have to really watch my thoughts and pay close attention.
And this, it's like I was on such a high in life and this break in my left foot, it was
like the universe was saying, oh yeah, you think you're so strong?
All right, I'm going to throw something real at you now.
(28:52):
Let's see how you handle this.
And it was really tough those first few days when I finally was diagnosed and given the
crutches and a boot and a step up.
I mean, I used to wear high heels and I'm like so missing teaching.
It was just, and vibrationally I had so much frenetic energy from being able to walk and
(29:16):
do yoga and sit cross-legged and meditate and do breath work.
And I was literally like, I had so much, but I couldn't move and my hands have literal,
like they're starting to break and puncture.
But I've grown so much strength in my upper body from crunching myself around.
It's so much compassion for self and for everyone.
(29:41):
This country has amazing ADA laws and it needs work.
It's tough to get around.
It's tough to crutch up those ramps.
It's just, yeah, so much learning and expansion and the meditation of course has really carried
(30:02):
me through a lot of that.
So anyway, I think I went off on a tangent there from your prompting.
No, it's okay.
I think it's an interesting experience to have that, to notice that it's hard to crutch
around because it's not something we think about.
We don't really think about the experience of people who have disabilities if we are
(30:25):
able-bodied.
I think we do do it a little bit better than other countries.
I was just in Europe and there's this marketplace I went to where one of the alleyways was literally
this teeny and I'm like, a wheelchair could not fit in here.
Someone would sue you if this was in Los Angeles.
(30:46):
Right.
Yeah.
Basic needs.
I can't carry laundry.
I can't.
Oh yeah.
But wow, yeah, there's a lot that you don't think about.
Necessity is the mother of invention.
I have come up with so many different ways to carry my coffee cup because your hands
are occupied.
Yeah.
Wow.
The opening.
(31:10):
So what obstacle do you think was removed for you in this experience?
Well, the image that I had was of this incredible abundance.
Makes sense with Ganesha.
And it was like this sea.
It was like the sea was being parted, kind of like who was it?
(31:33):
Moses that parted the Red Sea.
And there was dry land in between me and this mountain, this city of gold, kind of like
in the Wizard of Oz in the distance.
But it was all just riches.
And I never made it through during that vision.
I never actually made it through.
(31:54):
But then I injured myself and my abundance has shifted because again, I'm not running
all over town teaching yoga for a couple of dozen bucks.
Even though that's very life giving to me, I am so filled to the brim after I teach yoga.
I shifted my focus and really narrowed my ability to produce income and serve at the
(32:21):
same time.
So there's been a lot of change.
I love that.
Yeah, teaching yoga classes for 20, 30, $40, $50 year in there is yeah, I used to do that
full time and it's not fun.
But to go a little bit to backtrack a bit to before our beautiful tangent here.
(32:47):
You mentioned earlier about having a caretaker that you received some, I don't know if the
words that you said was negative programming or negative thinking or something like that.
We talked about that and we talked also about this, how meditation gives you this experience
of we are all one, we are all connected.
(33:10):
And it kind of dissolves that delusion of separateness.
So my question is, how does dissolving the delusion of separateness help us heal from
these experience with caretakers where we realize that they had some negative effects
on us?
Great question.
I'm not certain I'm going to be able to answer it.
(33:31):
I'll just preface it with that.
I know that for me, shifting from judgment to compassion, or from judgment to curiosity
and asking that question, where am I this way?
And identifying that this is a part of me.
It's a fractured mirror that this is showing up in my vibration because it's showing me
(33:55):
something, it's triggering me or it's making me happy in some way.
It's a part of me.
And so, well, just because I was raped by eight men doesn't mean that I'm a rapist.
Where is it in my life that I'm taking from myself without permission?
Where am I giving myself away?
(34:17):
Where am I not attending to my needs?
Where am I not being heard?
And I can tell you that that is the message there.
And when I did the deep transformative work to forgive these men who I was still, you
know, underneath the surface, I had suppressed the anger.
(34:40):
I never went to the police.
I never dealt with it.
I just started drinking to cover it up because I could not do it.
I told my sister and, you know, but like that doesn't mean that...
So this whole idea of coming with compassion and curiosity and asking that question of,
(35:01):
okay, this is showing up in my vibration.
Where am I this way?
And how can I step out of judgment and into a space of love?
Because this may not actually be representative of me, but it's a metaphor for some way that
I have an opportunity to heal.
(35:23):
So I'm not sure if I really answered your question, but...
Yeah, no, I think you did because this illusion of separateness helps us ask the question
with these people that we view as people who've hurt us.
It helps us ask the question of how am I like that person in a metaphorical way?
(35:43):
It's not always literal.
And like you said about the fractured mirror, it's a mirror.
Each person that we have an interaction with, it's a mirror for us to look into ourselves.
Yeah, it's so interesting.
Yeah, so you definitely answered that question.
So I think for rape and sexual assault, it's such a...like I want to dive into that, but
(36:07):
we...I feel like the time...we don't have enough time.
But I do want to ask you that I've witnessed lately a lot of people who have had that experience
and because they've healed from it, they're just absolutely glowing, thriving, abundant,
(36:29):
and for someone who doesn't really fully understand how that is even possible, what would you
say to that person?
Healing requires injury.
Yeah.
Dr. Sue Mortar is where I got my very first coaching.
She wrote the energy codes and she calls it a bus stop conversation.
Like some people might say soul contracts.
(36:51):
She says there's this cosmic bus stop and we're sitting at the bus stop saying, oh,
what are you going to work on this lifetime?
I think I'm going to go for level 10 forgiveness.
Really?
That's big work.
What do you think is going to happen?
How are you going to choose that?
I don't know.
Maybe a drunk driver is going to kill my whole family.
Wow.
(37:12):
Okay.
That's big stuff.
That sounds like level 10 forgiveness.
Who wants to be my bus driver?
Somebody steps out from the back saying, I'll be your bus driver.
You know, so these agreements that we have for those guys, a stupid drunken night that
(37:32):
they drugged me, took advantage of me.
I had whispers.
I had wisps of they bent me over the back of a Jeep.
When I did the deep transformative work to heal it, I actually worked with a practitioner
and relived it and forgave each one of them, seeing their faces.
It was hours and hours of this beautiful, incredibly painful experience of being able
(37:59):
to heal.
So, you know, literally when we go to the gym or take a run, we're ripping our muscles
open.
And if you don't feed the muscles with protein and water and rest, they won't grow back
right.
But if you take those potentially negative experiences and nourish yourself in the proper
(38:22):
way with someone who understands, you can heal from within intentionally.
And so because I've had these atrocities, I'm able to hold space for people in my queer
community and beyond who have also experienced big T trauma.
(38:43):
Yes.
And this subconscious programming is kind of little T trauma.
But big events like that rock you to the core and cause you to not think about it for a
decade until you start meditating and it's like, excuse me, have you thought about this?
Have you dealt with this?
(39:03):
Right.
It's such a gentle way to look at it.
Yeah.
So yeah, the answer that I have for anyone who's experienced big T trauma is, again,
like you were saying, work with somebody that you trust so that you can cultivate a sense
of safety and stop putting that baby in the closet.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(39:24):
Because start today.
I love the baby in the closet analogy.
I meant to tell you that earlier because oftentimes all of the wounding goes back to inner child.
The inner child needs healing.
So I think the baby in the closet is the perfect visual for that.
Yeah.
I mean, I call this space between your ears, the itty bitty shitty committee.
(39:47):
Well, I mean, I have all my clients find a picture of themselves when they were kids
and I say it's really the itty bitty kiddy committee.
Here, I'll show you mine.
I have that one too.
Yep.
I do inner child work all the time.
Beautiful.
So cute.
(40:08):
So yeah, the way to combat that itty bitty shitty committee is to listen to that little
baby and say the adults are here.
Yeah.
We got you.
Yeah.
Thank you so much for sharing so vulnerably today.
I teared up earlier when you were talking about really facing your rape, what would
(40:32):
you call a person that does it?
Rapists.
Perpetrators.
Yeah.
Really facing them and forgiving them.
And I started tearing up.
Yes, it's a horrible experience, but it also sounds like the process of healing through
that and coming out on the other side sounds just so beautiful.
(40:54):
So beautiful.
Thank you for sharing that.
So to you, you're welcome.
It's been an honor to share space with you.
And I feel so connected across all these miles.
Yes.
Yes.
So to get just a couple more things in before our time is up, I'm going to ask you a couple
of closing questions.
(41:15):
You bet.
I'll ask you two and then we'll go into where people can find you online and connect with
you.
So the first question is what does self love mean to you?
I think it's listening to understand, listening to yourself.
I always say self with a capital S, listening to understand.
And then once you truly understand, learning to respond so that you can nourish yourself
(41:43):
with a capital S, you can build that sense of self.
So often as women, we're taught to deny what we need and to give.
So shifting that dynamic inside first.
Yes.
I love that because we are like, that's really crucial for external relationships.
(42:03):
So it makes sense to bring that internally as well first.
Yeah.
So the second question is, what is your favorite part about being a woman?
Breasts.
Yeah.
I think that's my favorite part about being a lesbian.
Let's see.
No, I honestly, so that was the silly answer.
(42:25):
I always say that as not only a woman, but as a mother, I am so incredibly blessed to
have the opportunity to have the full breadth of the human experience because I had the
opportunity to carry a human and push out a human and breastfeed a human who is one
(42:53):
of the most incredible people I have ever known.
Such a light being.
And it is the hardest and the best job in the world to be a mom.
So motherhood is the best part about being a woman.
And I know not all women have that opportunity.
(43:17):
Not all women want it.
Not all women are able to, but it is a potential gift.
And I always said I didn't want children.
And I've discovered in my life that anything I have resistance to is deep medicine.
How did carrying, birthing, and breastfeeding a human change your perspective about human
(43:38):
beings?
Because I can only imagine that must be just a total mind fuck to then go out in the world
and just be like, that angry man was once a breastfeeding baby.
Like to just realize that that experience you're having with your newborn baby, like
this is where it begins for everybody.
What you've said is so beautiful.
(44:01):
I think it was my first experience of selflessness.
And also it has taught me so much about that phrase that we hear all the time.
You can't pour from an empty cup.
You literally can't pour from an empty cup.
And you will begin to devolve if you try to pour when you don't have anything.
(44:28):
And so it has been such a balance.
You know, when my daughter was old enough, she's a force and she tries to control me.
I think she was my mother in another life.
But I used to like at the beginning of the weekend, I would be like, okay, you want to
do, you want to go to the park?
You want to go to the zoo?
You want us to play this game?
Because she's like holding court.
(44:49):
She's like in charge.
And so I would write out like, okay, well, these are the things that you want to do.
Mom needs to get in her meditation.
And now I have a wife and we share parenting and so we're able to handle the timing.
But initially I needed to get my sleep and I also needed to be able to meditate and her
to be safe.
(45:10):
Yeah.
So yeah, it's a delicate balance of being able to give to yourself and also pass on
everything that you've learned, not just by saying it, but by doing it.
Because they say actions speak louder than words, of course.
They're watching it.
They're modeling it.
Yeah, they're watching.
Yeah.
(45:31):
I could keep talking to you, but same for the people that have tuned in, let us know
where we can connect with you and anything you'd like to share about your work.
So you can find me in a lot of places at Sara Webb says S A R A W E B B S A Y S, but that's
changing because I'm Sara Thornhill now as a married woman.
(45:53):
So on YouTube, Queer Calm Collective is the name of our YouTube.
Also the name of our Instagram.
You can still find me on Facebook at Sara Webb says, and we have a group of 2500 queer
women loving women, whether you were born a woman or not, on a Facebook group called
(46:15):
Queer Hearts Break Harder.
And we host free events for heartbreak because heartbreak is a trauma and it's not the first
one.
Yeah.
It's caused by a relationship attachment that started in childhood with that itty bitty
shitty committee.
Yes.
Awesome.
So there's all of those links in the caption or the show notes.
Welcome to Openly Spoken, the podcast to help you show up, speak out, and be seen in healthy
(00:18):
relationships.
On this show, we talk about self-love, sexuality, relationship tips, including ending the cycle
of toxic relationships, and healing and thriving after heartbreak.
Hi, I'm your host Cilia and I'm a certified sex, love, and relationship coach helping
ambitious women with a history of toxic relationships feel deeply connected in healthy love.
(00:43):
These are such important topics that every woman deserves, so if you could leave this
show a rating and a review on Apple podcasts or Spotify to help more women find this, it
would mean the absolute world to me.
Thank you so much for being here today.
Now let's dive into the show.
(01:15):
We are recording.
Welcome to Openly Spoken, the podcast to help you show up, speak out, and be seen in
healthy relationships.
Today's guest is Sara Thornhill.
Sara Thornhill of Sara Web says is a master meditation coach and founder of Queer Calm
Collective.
Sara activates and empowers the LGBTQIA plus community to heal stress, anxiety, and depression.
(01:39):
Certified in NLP, trauma, and relationship attachment, Sara specializes in helping clients
uncover their innate ability to thrive by addressing the underlying causes of emotional
struggles and showing them how to revive their inner power.
Sara teaches pocket-sized techniques her clients can use anywhere to process stress
and improve daily happiness so they can bring the best version of themselves to their own
(02:05):
lives.
She says we've cultivated an inclusive, supportive culture designed to serve all humans with
a special focus on marginalized members of the LGBTQIA plus community worldwide.
As a sexual assault survivor, two-time divorcee, and someone who came out later in life, Sara
deeply understands the transformative potential of navigating major life changes.
(02:29):
She passionately believes that healing is a birthright, asserting that a life of thrive
is possible for everyone regardless of circumstances.
Sara resides in sunny Florida and travels internationally for workshops and speaking
engagements.
Yay!
We did it!
Welcome to the show, Sara.
(02:50):
Thank you so much.
I'm so excited to have you here today.
Delighted to be here.
Yes.
I'd love to know before we dive in just what is most alive in your heart right now as you
come here to this podcast today.
Well, I just led a really powerful guided meditation for some professionals who are
(03:11):
not queer.
Well, maybe some of them are.
I don't know, but that's not the point.
They're professionals in the middle of the workday.
I support in a variety of ways with desk yoga and guided meditation at another… well,
I won't mention the actual corporation, but it's a Fortune 50 corporation that's local
(03:35):
here that I'm really honored to be able to support virtually.
And meditation is just so powerful.
And so I'm feeling some of the literal vibrations that we cultivated in that session and really
excited to dive in and talk more about meditation and meditative states and the really power
that we have behind our eyelids.
(03:58):
Yes.
I feel that energy and that vibration.
And I love to see the little chakra chart behind you too.
I'm feeling those vibrations.
I use it to demonstrate for my clients like so, and I've got my mascot too because my
Florida…
Flamingo?
Yes, exactly.
Yeah.
(04:18):
Yeah.
Flamingos are actually really beautiful, like in person.
Actual flamingos.
I think they're so beautiful.
And they stand on one leg, which is something I'm actively doing all the time because I'm
on crutches right now.
I have a triple break in my left foot, heel, ankle, tibia.
(04:40):
And this literal injury has been, I mean, incredibly painful.
And one of the best things that's ever happened in my life, as many difficult things are,
like some of the things that you read in my bio, studies have shown that whenever we have
that like really tough vacation where we booked a beach vacation and it rained every day or
(05:05):
we got stuck on the side of the road changing a tire at midnight, those are the ones that
we laugh about five years down the road, 10 years down the road, and that we really remember.
Yeah.
I really try to teach my clients that grip without the grit is what I call it so that
you can kind of play with a difficult situation like a beach ball.
(05:30):
I get to solve this issue because the stress actually makes it hard for us to think.
And so this injury, of course, yeah, there's been a lot of pain, but there's also been
a lot of opening as a result of the closing off of what it's caused in my life.
(05:51):
So yes, the standing on one leg that my little mascot, I had no idea how symbolic and appropriate
that would be for me later on in life because my right leg is super strong now and my left
leg has withered.
You'll have to do some special muscle strength exercises once that foot is back.
(06:14):
Once they release me, yeah, I'm going to have a lot of PT, a lot of physical therapy, and
it's just not healing.
I actually had a re-injury recently where I fell down again.
I mean, I'm clumsy obviously already.
And then you put me on one leg with these things that if I get on the wrong surface
(06:34):
or a leaf underneath one of the crutches, I'm on the ground again.
So, you know, everything's a gift.
Pain is love.
Pain is showing us where to look.
Yeah.
And if we didn't feel pain, we wouldn't know that we were injured or to pay attention.
Yeah.
(06:54):
And what I think is so ironic about what you say about the pain and love thing is a lot
of times I've noticed this as a yoga teacher, as a relationship coach, and just in my own
life experience from what I've gone through and seeing friends and family go through,
we like to ignore pain.
We tend to ignore pain or not want to feel it or not want to really face it.
(07:19):
And the ironic thing is then that makes love and bliss and all the happy, good emotions
kind of wither down too.
And we kind of end up being numb.
And the more you learn to really step up to the plate for your own pain and for the moments
in life where in the moment you're like, this is awful.
(07:40):
The more you learn to step up to that, the more capacity you then have for love and for
joy.
And yeah, I would love for you to speak to that.
Absolutely.
You know, as far as the pendulum swings one way, it is going to swing the other way.
And if you have a crying baby and you put them in the closet, it's not going to make
(08:03):
the baby stop crying.
It's only going to exacerbate the problem.
And you're absolutely right.
If we ignore the signals of our body, because I mean, we are spiritual beings having a physical
experience.
The body is a portal.
(08:23):
It's here to send us messages.
I've been really digging into the work around this left heel foot tibia injury as to what
are the messages.
It's caused so many cataclysmic shifts, you know, since I guess maybe your audience is
a little bit more woo woo.
(08:43):
I'll speak directly to how it occurred.
I was leaving a yoga studio locally here in St. Petersburg, Florida, and I had been doing
some mantra meditation honoring the entity, the energy of Ganesh, which is that Indian
(09:04):
god with a child's body and an elephant's head.
And he is said to be the remover of obstacles.
Whether or not it's a god or a deity, I don't know.
I know that there's an energy to anger.
I know that there's an energy to joy.
And so there's an energy to removing obstacles.
And I had this incredible vision like I've never had before during it, which I won't
(09:27):
belabor, but came out was feeling great, kind of like wasn't really aware of where I was.
I was totally out of the meditation, but missed a step.
There were like three steps coming out of the studio, missed a step, didn't know I had
broken it for several days.
The yoga teacher came out who's a, you know, friend acquaintance of mine, I've been to
(09:51):
a lot of her classes.
I teach mantra meditation myself.
And she said, you just chanted to the remover of obstacles and you rolled over on your ankle.
And she said, you know, there's a message here.
And my goodness, you know, that somebody, people, they could say that this is an obstacle
that I'm dealing with.
It has caused so much opening.
Of course, I can't teach yoga right now.
(10:14):
I don't know if ever again, I'm not sure, but it's caused me to change my schedule entirely.
Now, instead of teaching in person, I'm teaching some desk yoga online and it's really allowed
me to focus on what's important.
And to do some generational trauma healing.
And so, you know, in answer to your question and, or you're prompting there about the
(10:39):
suppression of emotions, this ankle that I've rolled over on so many times in my life is
that act of not paying attention, not doing the work.
I didn't have the skills.
I didn't have the tools.
All those other times that I rolled over on my ankle, didn't get it checked out for about
10 days.
And I'm like, this swelling is not going down when gone to the X-ray.
(11:04):
And of course, the pain has caused so much joy in other ways.
And you're right.
If we deny, distract, dissociate, I say that this 3D world, those are the 3Ds, deny, distract,
dissociate.
You know, how are we going to be able to enjoy life fully?
Because if we're not allowing the pendulum to swing and experiencing those tough emotions,
(11:29):
then we're not going to have that release from within that's possible when we just allow
it to pass through.
You know, scientists have studied that it takes 30 to 90 seconds to feel an emotion
and let it pass through.
The only reason why it persists, it's because of the story that we're telling ourselves
(11:51):
about it.
Yeah.
And so often that story is like, this thing is bad or negative.
Like we see anxiety as that's bad or stress as that's bad.
I don't remember who the speaker was, but I was watching this TED talk about stress
and the person was saying that in this experiment, they found that people who had negative, who
(12:16):
put a negative meaning to stress had a worse experience with stress, but the people who
didn't think stress was bad, we're still able to bounce back quicker and able to regulate
their nervous system and not stay stuck in the stress.
Yeah.
So that's interesting.
Yeah.
It's all about the perception of it, right?
(12:37):
Like if you think about a roller coaster, physiologically, we're going into fight or
flight.
It's just that we feel safe.
We perceive ourselves as being safe.
If you think about an orgasm, that's a panic attack.
It just has to do with the way that we're perceiving it.
We feel safe in the moment.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(12:58):
But physiologically-
Because safety is needed for orgasm, at least for women.
I don't know if men need to feel safe.
I don't know.
But for women, safety is a huge piece and sometimes we don't feel safe.
And if we're in a safe environment, sometimes we don't feel safe when we have the mental
(13:19):
conditioning of some of the things we receive from being conditioned as women.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
And meditation is a good tool to really pause and stop and observe all that and create more
safety.
Yeah.
And when people have enlightening experiences, they say that an orgasm is the closest thing
(13:44):
to enlightenment as far as what's happening and the ida, the pingalish, the shishmana,
all the spiraling that's happening up the chakras, up the spinal cord, the cerebrospinal
fluid is.
And we tend to hold our breath.
We're breathing in and out of the mouth.
And so that energy actually shoots up the spine in a similar way.
(14:06):
When we experience orgasm, it's similar to that enlightening experience that Kundalini
yoga practitioners try to mimic, tantra practitioners.
And yes, when we meditate, we can have those super expansive experiences that don't have
any preconceived notions or shame or like you say, things that we were given free of
(14:33):
charge from our primary caregivers or the church or whomever.
I mean, I myself was raised very strict Southern Baptist, no drinking, no dancing, no boyfriends,
no Halloween.
Oh, wow.
Yeah.
It was really tight.
And I went to school there five days a week and I was singing in the choir and I was in
(14:57):
the youth group and I was there Sunday morning and Sunday night.
And we went there on Monday night for red beans and rice.
I basically lived there.
Wow.
And I was fed all this information and that's the reason why I didn't come out for 38 years.
I told my sister and my brother who I came out to, I said, listen, I didn't tell mom
and dad when I started having sex with boys, why would I tell them that a couple years
(15:20):
later I started having sex with girls?
This is none of their business.
It's only going to cause a wave.
And gosh, I mean, you can't go back, but I do wish I had come out much earlier because
I still struggle with my parents believing that I'm an abomination, telling me actively
(15:42):
every time we talk on the phone that I need Jesus.
And it's really painful to have a relationship with them because they shun me essentially
while trying to convert me.
And meditation has been a lifesaver for me.
And meditation saved my life unequivocally.
(16:07):
It is because I have been able to stop the downward spiral and learn to spin within.
I love that.
So where were you at in your life before you started meditating for the first time?
Well, I was actually pregnant when I first learned how to meditate formally from a meditation
(16:27):
coach that I paid a large sum of money to have private meditation coaching.
But I've been a yogi since I was 18, 19, 20 years old.
I can't remember exactly when in college it was.
How did your parents take that?
Because yoga is usually from a strict religious upbringing.
Yoga is usually labeled as witchcraft.
Very true.
(16:48):
And I found yoga.
You're being the devil into your body.
It's so true.
And it was in Louisiana when I was in college, because I'm from southern Louisiana.
And it was in Baton Rouge at Women's Gym where they had gym yoga that I found this incredible
yoga teacher that I went to for years all throughout college.
(17:09):
Then I moved to Dallas after Hurricane Katrina hit in 05.
And I was like, oh, I'll go to the yoga class at my gym.
And I was like, what is this?
This is not yoga.
She's like, and then you put your hand here.
And then you put your feet here.
There was no chakras or visualization or breath work or any of the delicious things that I
(17:32):
was accustomed to.
I was just so blessed to have this anomaly in Baton Rouge, Louisiana that was teaching
at this women's gym.
And so yeah, I don't know if my parents really even knew.
Yoga wasn't really in vogue then in the aught.
They were just going to the gym in their eyes.
Yeah, I mean, I was living outside of the house.
(17:54):
So I was in college and living about an hour and a half away.
And so yeah, I really loved yoga and took to it.
And so I had done meditations and I had my very first meditative experience during one
of those yoga classes where I saw something in my third eye.
It was like a purple light.
(18:14):
And I went up to my teacher afterwards and I'm like, what was that?
Where can I learn more about it?
And she said, read autobiography of a yogi.
And I picked it up and I started pouring into it and I was like, are you serious?
This is a joke.
And I put that book down.
I was like, this is ridiculous.
And then I picked it up later in my piece and I got more through the book, but it wasn't
(18:40):
until my early forties that I really read it again and started following.
And actually I'm a student of Paramahansa Yogananda now and have used some of his meditative
practices.
But, you know, meditation really entered my life fully almost nine years ago when I was
five months pregnant with my daughter and I heard a radio program on NPR that's now
(19:07):
defunct the actual Diane Rehm.
And she had a mindfulness expert and a transcendental meditation expert for the entire hour talking
about meditation.
And I didn't know that I had been trying mindfulness for years, that all these things that I had
been doing and it never worked for me.
I couldn't shut the thoughts off.
(19:27):
I couldn't.
And so I said, well, I'm going to try this TM with the mantra meditation that you just
repeat silently.
And that changed my life.
20 minutes twice a day from there on out.
Now I have been certified in multiple modalities and do all kinds of different meditations.
But it has saved me in more ways than one because there's only a couple of things that
(19:51):
you can control.
Very limited, your thoughts and your actions.
And meditation is one of those things that you can do instantaneously.
I mean, I meditate in the car, not driving, but it's a great place where in nine years
only two people have ever knocked on the window and said, are you okay?
Because you can find like a shaded area, turn off the engine and just relax.
(20:14):
And if you're a block away from home or before you leave work, you can take a few minutes.
Yeah, that's a good idea.
Just set your seat back a little bit and take a few minutes for yourself to decompress,
to listen to what your body's trying to tell you.
I always say, and I'm sure you've heard it, that prayer is talking to God and meditation
(20:36):
is listening.
It's opening yourself up to be that channel to receive from the quantum.
I've actually never heard that before.
Yeah.
Now you'll hear it everywhere.
I love it.
So you were pregnant when you found meditation formally.
(20:57):
What shifted in your relationship to yourself and your relationships with others once meditation
became a deeper practice for you?
I'll never forget when my daughter had just been born.
So I must have been meditating for four or five months.
I had just gotten her to sleep.
I was breastfeeding, sleeping very little in those first few months.
(21:19):
I had just filled up a crystal glass that I had gotten as a wedding gift.
Very expensive.
It was like a $25 Swarovski or whatever the national brand of crystal is glass that I
had gotten and filled it with water.
I was going to put it by my bedside and I dropped it and it shattered all over the floor.
(21:40):
I went and got the broom and I started sweeping it up.
In the midst of sweeping it up, I recognized that I hadn't gotten angry.
I hadn't perseverated or worried about now I'm going to get less sleep or the little
(22:01):
shards of glass that my cat might step on or my daughter might.
So I called my meditation teacher and I was like, what's happening?
He said, you're starting to witness.
I'm like, oh my gosh, this is amazing.
My ex-husband, my now ex-husband noticed that I was different, that I wasn't flying off
(22:21):
the handle.
I was taught to bottle it up, bottle it up, bottle it up, explode.
That's what my family taught me directly to do.
I wasn't doing that anymore.
I was much more even keel and he learned.
He was like, give me that meditation teacher's number.
Nice.
Yeah.
So it definitely shifted my relationship with myself and other relationships in my life.
(22:47):
Those moments are so cool.
They're like off the mat moments when you notice yourself paying attention or with your
yoga practice, when you notice that when you bend over the sink to wash your face, you're
doing it with proper form.
Right.
Yeah.
Pending at the hips instead of the waist.
(23:07):
Yes.
Yeah.
And it's so beautiful that just by shifting our own internal worlds, we show up differently
to a relationship and that has an effect on the other person.
Whether they ask you for the meditation teacher's number or not, I think it has an effect because
you're bringing a different relationship as two people and the energy you're bringing
(23:29):
in is now a little different.
And so that feedback loop of energy between you guys has shifted a little bit and I love
hearing about that.
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, I like to say there's really only one relationship and it's the one that you
have with yourself, but it ripples out like a pebble in a pond to all the relationships
(23:55):
that you have because if you're well fed and well rested, the way you reply, respond, react
to somebody else in your life is going to be vastly different from if you're hungry
and tired and stressed.
So that relationship of being able to nourish yourself and take the time for yourself is
(24:20):
going to affect whether or not you are able to actually show up authentically because
we are made of love.
God is love and we are drops of God, so we are made of love and that's our authentic
selves.
I always say when I'm at the end of Shavasana, memorize this vibration you've cultivated
(24:41):
because this is the more authentic you and see if you can scoop up some of it right now
so that that next time that that person says that thing, you can respond from this place
on your mat instead of from a place of stress.
Yeah.
It really illustrates how mindfulness is a practice in like being a human being, like
(25:05):
being human being.
Yeah, not a human doing, right?
Yeah.
I love what you said about, go ahead.
No?
You go ahead.
I was going to say I love what you said about that there's only one relationship and that
relationship with yourself and then it ripples out.
(25:26):
That also makes me think of how with my mindfulness practice and almost everyone that does a mindfulness
practice for an extended amount of time, you kind of get to this point where you realize
you are not separate from not only other people, but every literal single thing and you really
feel into thought of we are all one, everything is all one.
(25:52):
And I have this friend who has this theory that I believe and my husband believes it
too that we're actually all one being, but in like different, different, I guess, manifestations
of the same being and that we're all the same being having these experiences in different
parts of the world.
And I'd love to know what you think about that.
Absolutely.
(26:12):
I mean, life is a fractured mirror.
Yeah.
We just look separate.
So anybody that's showing up in my vibration, whether they're pleasing to me or displeasing
to me, that's an indication of my particular vibration.
I was taught to be a very negative person.
(26:37):
Now that doesn't say anything negative about my primary caregivers.
You can only give away what you have.
And I had a primary caregiver who wasn't my natural parent.
I have two biological parents who I still have a relationship with who I've spoken
of, but she was my primary caretaker for the majority of my young life and still works
(26:59):
for my parents.
She taught me really disempowering thinking about the world.
I didn't know it until I started on my own journey and started trying to untangle the
difficulties that I was having in life.
And because I've, it was like I had been working so hard on trying to be positive, be positive.
(27:23):
And then when I started meditating, everything shifted and I was like able to be positive
naturally without really having to try necessarily.
And now because I've practiced gratitude for almost 1800 days straight, I'm completely
alcohol and drug free.
I intentionally look for and appreciate the good because I want to activate my reticular
(27:48):
activating system to find, it's like an algorithm, right?
Find more of what I'm looking for.
Anytime I do slip into any kind of difficult vibration, everyone in my sphere changes instantaneously.
They are not the happy go lucky.
(28:08):
They are not the positive.
It's like, it is so obvious the difference in what I'm vibrationally putting out there
because my electromagnetic field, my aura, if you will, is so strong that if I let it slip,
as far as the pendulum swings one way, it can swing the other way very quickly.
(28:31):
And so I have to really watch my thoughts and pay close attention.
And this, it's like I was on such a high in life and this break in my left foot, it was
like the universe was saying, oh yeah, you think you're so strong?
All right, I'm going to throw something real at you now.
(28:52):
Let's see how you handle this.
And it was really tough those first few days when I finally was diagnosed and given the
crutches and a boot and a step up.
I mean, I used to wear high heels and I'm like so missing teaching.
It was just, and vibrationally I had so much frenetic energy from being able to walk and
(29:16):
do yoga and sit cross-legged and meditate and do breath work.
And I was literally like, I had so much, but I couldn't move and my hands have literal,
like they're starting to break and puncture.
But I've grown so much strength in my upper body from crunching myself around.
It's so much compassion for self and for everyone.
(29:41):
This country has amazing ADA laws and it needs work.
It's tough to get around.
It's tough to crutch up those ramps.
It's just, yeah, so much learning and expansion and the meditation of course has really carried
(30:02):
me through a lot of that.
So anyway, I think I went off on a tangent there from your prompting.
No, it's okay.
I think it's an interesting experience to have that, to notice that it's hard to crutch
around because it's not something we think about.
We don't really think about the experience of people who have disabilities if we are
(30:25):
able-bodied.
I think we do do it a little bit better than other countries.
I was just in Europe and there's this marketplace I went to where one of the alleyways was literally
this teeny and I'm like, a wheelchair could not fit in here.
Someone would sue you if this was in Los Angeles.
(30:46):
Right.
Yeah.
Basic needs.
I can't carry laundry.
I can't.
Oh yeah.
But wow, yeah, there's a lot that you don't think about.
Necessity is the mother of invention.
I have come up with so many different ways to carry my coffee cup because your hands
are occupied.
Yeah.
Wow.
The opening.
(31:10):
So what obstacle do you think was removed for you in this experience?
Well, the image that I had was of this incredible abundance.
Makes sense with Ganesha.
And it was like this sea.
It was like the sea was being parted, kind of like who was it?
(31:33):
Moses that parted the Red Sea.
And there was dry land in between me and this mountain, this city of gold, kind of like
in the Wizard of Oz in the distance.
But it was all just riches.
And I never made it through during that vision.
I never actually made it through.
(31:54):
But then I injured myself and my abundance has shifted because again, I'm not running
all over town teaching yoga for a couple of dozen bucks.
Even though that's very life giving to me, I am so filled to the brim after I teach yoga.
I shifted my focus and really narrowed my ability to produce income and serve at the
(32:21):
same time.
So there's been a lot of change.
I love that.
Yeah, teaching yoga classes for 20, 30, $40, $50 year in there is yeah, I used to do that
full time and it's not fun.
But to go a little bit to backtrack a bit to before our beautiful tangent here.
(32:47):
You mentioned earlier about having a caretaker that you received some, I don't know if the
words that you said was negative programming or negative thinking or something like that.
We talked about that and we talked also about this, how meditation gives you this experience
of we are all one, we are all connected.
(33:10):
And it kind of dissolves that delusion of separateness.
So my question is, how does dissolving the delusion of separateness help us heal from
these experience with caretakers where we realize that they had some negative effects
on us?
Great question.
I'm not certain I'm going to be able to answer it.
(33:31):
I'll just preface it with that.
I know that for me, shifting from judgment to compassion, or from judgment to curiosity
and asking that question, where am I this way?
And identifying that this is a part of me.
It's a fractured mirror that this is showing up in my vibration because it's showing me
(33:55):
something, it's triggering me or it's making me happy in some way.
It's a part of me.
And so, well, just because I was raped by eight men doesn't mean that I'm a rapist.
Where is it in my life that I'm taking from myself without permission?
Where am I giving myself away?
(34:17):
Where am I not attending to my needs?
Where am I not being heard?
And I can tell you that that is the message there.
And when I did the deep transformative work to forgive these men who I was still, you
know, underneath the surface, I had suppressed the anger.
(34:40):
I never went to the police.
I never dealt with it.
I just started drinking to cover it up because I could not do it.
I told my sister and, you know, but like that doesn't mean that...
So this whole idea of coming with compassion and curiosity and asking that question of,
(35:01):
okay, this is showing up in my vibration.
Where am I this way?
And how can I step out of judgment and into a space of love?
Because this may not actually be representative of me, but it's a metaphor for some way that
I have an opportunity to heal.
(35:23):
So I'm not sure if I really answered your question, but...
Yeah, no, I think you did because this illusion of separateness helps us ask the question
with these people that we view as people who've hurt us.
It helps us ask the question of how am I like that person in a metaphorical way?
(35:43):
It's not always literal.
And like you said about the fractured mirror, it's a mirror.
Each person that we have an interaction with, it's a mirror for us to look into ourselves.
Yeah, it's so interesting.
Yeah, so you definitely answered that question.
So I think for rape and sexual assault, it's such a...like I want to dive into that, but
(36:07):
we...I feel like the time...we don't have enough time.
But I do want to ask you that I've witnessed lately a lot of people who have had that experience
and because they've healed from it, they're just absolutely glowing, thriving, abundant,
(36:29):
and for someone who doesn't really fully understand how that is even possible, what would you
say to that person?
Healing requires injury.
Yeah.
Dr. Sue Mortar is where I got my very first coaching.
She wrote the energy codes and she calls it a bus stop conversation.
Like some people might say soul contracts.
(36:51):
She says there's this cosmic bus stop and we're sitting at the bus stop saying, oh,
what are you going to work on this lifetime?
I think I'm going to go for level 10 forgiveness.
Really?
That's big work.
What do you think is going to happen?
How are you going to choose that?
I don't know.
Maybe a drunk driver is going to kill my whole family.
Wow.
(37:12):
Okay.
That's big stuff.
That sounds like level 10 forgiveness.
Who wants to be my bus driver?
Somebody steps out from the back saying, I'll be your bus driver.
You know, so these agreements that we have for those guys, a stupid drunken night that
(37:32):
they drugged me, took advantage of me.
I had whispers.
I had wisps of they bent me over the back of a Jeep.
When I did the deep transformative work to heal it, I actually worked with a practitioner
and relived it and forgave each one of them, seeing their faces.
It was hours and hours of this beautiful, incredibly painful experience of being able
(37:59):
to heal.
So, you know, literally when we go to the gym or take a run, we're ripping our muscles
open.
And if you don't feed the muscles with protein and water and rest, they won't grow back
right.
But if you take those potentially negative experiences and nourish yourself in the proper
(38:22):
way with someone who understands, you can heal from within intentionally.
And so because I've had these atrocities, I'm able to hold space for people in my queer
community and beyond who have also experienced big T trauma.
(38:43):
Yes.
And this subconscious programming is kind of little T trauma.
But big events like that rock you to the core and cause you to not think about it for a
decade until you start meditating and it's like, excuse me, have you thought about this?
Have you dealt with this?
(39:03):
Right.
It's such a gentle way to look at it.
Yeah.
So yeah, the answer that I have for anyone who's experienced big T trauma is, again,
like you were saying, work with somebody that you trust so that you can cultivate a sense
of safety and stop putting that baby in the closet.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(39:24):
Because start today.
I love the baby in the closet analogy.
I meant to tell you that earlier because oftentimes all of the wounding goes back to inner child.
The inner child needs healing.
So I think the baby in the closet is the perfect visual for that.
Yeah.
I mean, I call this space between your ears, the itty bitty shitty committee.
(39:47):
Well, I mean, I have all my clients find a picture of themselves when they were kids
and I say it's really the itty bitty kiddy committee.
Here, I'll show you mine.
I have that one too.
Yep.
I do inner child work all the time.
Beautiful.
So cute.
(40:08):
So yeah, the way to combat that itty bitty shitty committee is to listen to that little
baby and say the adults are here.
Yeah.
We got you.
Yeah.
Thank you so much for sharing so vulnerably today.
I teared up earlier when you were talking about really facing your rape, what would
(40:32):
you call a person that does it?
Rapists.
Perpetrators.
Yeah.
Really facing them and forgiving them.
And I started tearing up.
Yes, it's a horrible experience, but it also sounds like the process of healing through
that and coming out on the other side sounds just so beautiful.
(40:54):
So beautiful.
Thank you for sharing that.
So to you, you're welcome.
It's been an honor to share space with you.
And I feel so connected across all these miles.
Yes.
Yes.
So to get just a couple more things in before our time is up, I'm going to ask you a couple
of closing questions.
(41:15):
You bet.
I'll ask you two and then we'll go into where people can find you online and connect with
you.
So the first question is what does self love mean to you?
I think it's listening to understand, listening to yourself.
I always say self with a capital S, listening to understand.
And then once you truly understand, learning to respond so that you can nourish yourself
(41:43):
with a capital S, you can build that sense of self.
So often as women, we're taught to deny what we need and to give.
So shifting that dynamic inside first.
Yes.
I love that because we are like, that's really crucial for external relationships.
(42:03):
So it makes sense to bring that internally as well first.
Yeah.
So the second question is, what is your favorite part about being a woman?
Breasts.
Yeah.
I think that's my favorite part about being a lesbian.
Let's see.
No, I honestly, so that was the silly answer.
(42:25):
I always say that as not only a woman, but as a mother, I am so incredibly blessed to
have the opportunity to have the full breadth of the human experience because I had the
opportunity to carry a human and push out a human and breastfeed a human who is one
(42:53):
of the most incredible people I have ever known.
Such a light being.
And it is the hardest and the best job in the world to be a mom.
So motherhood is the best part about being a woman.
And I know not all women have that opportunity.
(43:17):
Not all women want it.
Not all women are able to, but it is a potential gift.
And I always said I didn't want children.
And I've discovered in my life that anything I have resistance to is deep medicine.
How did carrying, birthing, and breastfeeding a human change your perspective about human
(43:38):
beings?
Because I can only imagine that must be just a total mind fuck to then go out in the world
and just be like, that angry man was once a breastfeeding baby.
Like to just realize that that experience you're having with your newborn baby, like
this is where it begins for everybody.
What you've said is so beautiful.
(44:01):
I think it was my first experience of selflessness.
And also it has taught me so much about that phrase that we hear all the time.
You can't pour from an empty cup.
You literally can't pour from an empty cup.
And you will begin to devolve if you try to pour when you don't have anything.
(44:28):
And so it has been such a balance.
You know, when my daughter was old enough, she's a force and she tries to control me.
I think she was my mother in another life.
But I used to like at the beginning of the weekend, I would be like, okay, you want to
do, you want to go to the park?
You want to go to the zoo?
You want us to play this game?
Because she's like holding court.
(44:49):
She's like in charge.
And so I would write out like, okay, well, these are the things that you want to do.
Mom needs to get in her meditation.
And now I have a wife and we share parenting and so we're able to handle the timing.
But initially I needed to get my sleep and I also needed to be able to meditate and her
to be safe.
(45:10):
Yeah.
So yeah, it's a delicate balance of being able to give to yourself and also pass on
everything that you've learned, not just by saying it, but by doing it.
Because they say actions speak louder than words, of course.
They're watching it.
They're modeling it.
Yeah, they're watching.
Yeah.
(45:31):
I could keep talking to you, but same for the people that have tuned in, let us know
where we can connect with you and anything you'd like to share about your work.
So you can find me in a lot of places at Sara Webb says S A R A W E B B S A Y S, but that's
changing because I'm Sara Thornhill now as a married woman.
(45:53):
So on YouTube, Queer Calm Collective is the name of our YouTube.
Also the name of our Instagram.
You can still find me on Facebook at Sara Webb says, and we have a group of 2500 queer
women loving women, whether you were born a woman or not, on a Facebook group called
(46:15):
Queer Hearts Break Harder.
And we host free events for heartbreak because heartbreak is a trauma and it's not the first
one.
Yeah.
It's caused by a relationship attachment that started in childhood with that itty bitty
shitty committee.
Yes.
Awesome.
So there's all of those links in the caption or the show notes.
Popular Podcasts
Boysober
Have you ever wondered what life might be like if you stopped worrying about being wanted, and focused on understanding what you actually want? That was the question Hope Woodard asked herself after a string of situationships inspired her to take a break from sex and dating. She went "boysober," a personal concept that sparked a global movement among women looking to prioritize themselves over men. Now, Hope is looking to expand the ways we explore our relationship to relationships. Taking a bold, unfiltered look into modern love, romance, and self-discovery, Boysober will dive into messy stories about dating, sex, love, friendship, and breaking generational patterns—all with humor, vulnerability, and a fresh perspective.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com