January 20, 2023 • 30 mins
On this episode of Our American Stories, since being released in 1983, Francis Ford Coppola’s film adaptation of S.E. Hinton’s coming-of-age novel The Outsiders has found continued popularity and has achieved official cult status. And now, in what is surely one of the most interesting pop culture intersections of all time, hip-hop artist Danny Boy O’Connor from the rap group House of Pain—best known for their iconic 1992 anthem “Jump Around”—purchased the Tulsa, Oklahoma home where much of The Outsiders film was shot.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:10):
And we continue here with our American story. Since being
released in nineteen eighty three, Francis Ford Coppola's film adaptation
of S. E. Hinton's coming of age novel The Outsiders
has found continued popularity and has achieved official cult status
and now, in what is surely one of the most
interesting pop culture intersections, hip hop artists Danny Boy O'Connor
(00:33):
from the rap group House of Pain, best known for
the iconic nineteen ninety two anthem jump Around, purchased the Tulsa,
Oklahoma home where much of The Outsider's film was shot.
Here to tell the story is the man himself. Here's
Danny Boy. My story really begins Los Angeles, California, nineteen
(00:56):
eighty three when I went unknowingly to a movie that
I had never heard of Woodland Hills, California, called The
Outsiders with my friend Steve Zikolski, who just happened to
read the book. I believe I was in seventh grade,
and so he was a fan of the book and
he wanted to see the movie. He said, Danny, you
want to go see a movie with me? And I thought, sure.
(01:17):
Steve Zikowski pretty cool junior high kid that I knew,
so I figured, you know, if he likes it, there's
probably something I liked. But I had no idea what
we were going to go see. I didn't have any
frame of reference. And on that full Saturday afternoon, we
went in and saw the movie, and I came out
a changed man, and people asked me all the time
what was my fascination with the Outsiders? And the movie
(01:42):
kind of hit me at a time where I definitely
felt out of place in, you know, the San Fernando
Valley in the eighties, being a native New Yorker who
who was moved to California at the age of six
and kind of always had like a a strong connection
to the East Coast. So southern California in the eighties
(02:06):
looked a lot different than New York City did. And
I don't know, I just always felt, you know, separate
and apart from and I got that from the movie
as well. And I grew up my father went to
prison when I was two months old. We moved in
with my grandparents. My mother worked nights at the Chase
Manhattan Bank, and so I never really had that foundation
(02:26):
or that family, you know, support or love, and you know,
I car that I carried that with me, even though
you know, I've had a pretty extraordinary life, you know
that that foundation, from the beginning, it's always felt unstable.
And so when I went to see The Outsiders, the
(02:50):
first thing I noticed was that they were a fractured family,
a broken family, and that despite that that they stuck
together and had each other's backs. And I felt, at
a thirteen or fourteen year old mindset was that if
I could just find that kind of friendship out in
the in the world, that maybe I wouldn't feel so
bad about my home life and the way we grew up.
(03:14):
And so that was the original hook for me for
that movie. That being said, Matt Dillon was the coolest
dude on the planet at that time. The cast was incredible,
whether it's Patrick swayzey Ralph Macho, Tom Cruise, Darren Dalton,
c Thomas Howe, Diane Lane, they were all. You know,
(03:35):
this was the first time I was really seeing them. Actually,
Leaf Garrett was the big star in my mind looking back,
because he was a seventies star and so really was
the only notable name that I knew prior to The Outsiders.
Then Matt Dylon. But that being said, you know, the
movie was was the coolest thing I'd ever seen, and
it stuck with me. I immediately went home and then
(03:56):
dug out a denim jacket that I may have had
from the seventies in New York and kind of adapted
that Dallas Winston Matt Dylan Swagger for the next few years.
But as fate would have it, I didn't really have
much of a game plan coming out of high school.
I dropped out in ninth grade. I hung out for
the next three year years at high school, never really
(04:17):
went in too much, gotten a little bit of trouble
with the law, and during the time where most of
my friends were graduating high school and heading off to
college or embarking on a career, I had no idea
what I was going to do. And so I connected,
reconnected with a high school friend who had had a
(04:37):
record out prior to me and him reconnecting, and we
started a band called House of Pain. And at the
time in hip hop, there wasn't anything on the landscape
like it. We were really, you know, kind of the
next wave of hip hop in the early nineties, but
at that time there wasn't any really, there wasn't really
(04:58):
any hard white boys, and we were like Irish American
tough white kids, and that was our stick and that
our deal was is that, you know, we were there
kind of like you know, boom bap, punch you in
your face type of hip hop that was missing, you know,
as as the eighties turned into the nineties and grunge
was a thing hip hop needed to reinvent. So US
(05:19):
and Cypress Hill were kind of like the next face
of that in that moment. And so it was very
successful with that and sold a few million records and
traveled all over the world and made a million bucks.
But you know, I like to say, what goes up
must come down, and it wasn't only you know, five
years later that I was back to where I started
(05:39):
even less because you know, doing music for a living,
especially as a creative director and an artist more than
I am a musician, it kind of left me empty
handed when the career was done, or the music career
was done in that moment, and I really had no
other life skills, and I unfortunately turned to drugs to
deal with that pain. So I spent the next you know,
five six years high on math amphetamans and drinking around
(06:04):
the clock, and it wasn't until about year two thousand
then I got sober. I stayed sober for about three
and a half years, and you know, first year was good.
Second year I started getting complacent and a little my
attitude started to come back and my expectations started to
come back. At around three three and a half years,
I decided to have a drink, and it was pretty
(06:24):
much the worst decision I'd ever made. It took me
one week to go back on drugs and took me
three years to get make it back to the twelve
step program. And it wasn't until two thousand and five
that I was able to get druss another sober breath.
And two thousand and five is when I began to
put another group together called the cocon Nostra. And it
(06:46):
was on that fateful tour that brought me to Tulsa, Oklahoma.
So when we got to Tulsa, Oklahoma, we were stuck
here for three days. And when I say stuck, I
mean stuck. But day two of the three days that
we were here, we began to get extremely bored, and
so I called down to the concierge's desk in the
lobby and asked them to call us a cab. They laughed,
(07:09):
there was no such thing as cabs. They were able
to wrangle us up a guy in a van that
took about an hour and a half to get to
the hotel, and then when he got there, we asked
him can he take us on a proper tour of Tulsa,
which he proceeded to say yes, and then took us
to the Woodland Hills Mall and to I can assure
you that didn't go over so well with a bunch
of forty year olds going to what was at that
(07:33):
point pretty uh, you know, the mall was kind of
shuttered as well, and so we went there for about
an hour, and as we were heading back to downtown Tulsa,
it occurred to me, Tulsa, Tulsa, Tulsa. Why does Tulsa
sound familiar to me? And it was at that moment
I had the epiphany and I said, excuse me, driver,
He said yes, I said, was the Outsiders filmed here?
And he almost like locked up the brakes. He was like,
(07:56):
he turned around and he said yes, absolutely. He says,
why do you know it? I said, I not only
know it, I love it. Do you know where any
of the filming locations are, and he said, I do
know where the driving is. So we proceeded to drop
off the rest of the group. I grabbed my road
manager said you're coming with me. I grabbed my laptop
and at the time, even in two thousand and nine,
(08:17):
there wasn't much on the internet to go on. It's
not like today. Two thousand and nine, I looked up
for locations for the Outsiders, and I found a Flicker
account or two, and I found a site called Tulsa
TV Memories which had a few of the locations and
the addresses were given up. The address I was most
interested in was the Outsider's house, which was not given
(08:37):
on that website. But they did tell us where the
driving was, and it did tell me where the park
in the movie was, the Cruetial neighborhood, And so we
went to the drive in and I couldn't imagine that
this thing was going to look anything like it did
in the movie. But not only was it, they felt
like it hadn't changed a bit. And my mind just
(08:57):
started to just melt, really because it looked exactly like
it would have in nineteen eighty two when they were
filming and exactly like it did, you know in the
sixties when they were trying to describe it. So it
was pretty good stuff anyway. So yeah, we got that
driver to take us around Tulsa. We were able to
find the drive in, we were able to find Crutchfield Park,
(09:21):
which was the park that Johnny stabs the Socian and
they had the confrontation with the Socials in and then
by finding the Bark, I was able to find the house.
And by finding the house, this is where the my
life starts to take a different turn. And when we
come back, we'll continue with the story of Danny Boy
O'Connor from the rap group House of Pain, his journey
(09:41):
back into his life. The movie The Outsiders filmed in
this town, Tulsa in Oklahoma. The rest of this story
continues here on our American stories, and we continue here
(10:10):
with our American stories and the story of Danny Boy O'Connor.
And my goodness, what a story it's been so far.
No father, a whole he's trying to fill because of that.
Sees this movie, sees this character in The Outsiders played
by Matt Dillon of all people, and the next thing
you know, a little bit later, he's in a big
(10:30):
hit band, house of pain and then drugs. And then
one day there's a stop in Tulsa, Oklahoma, where The
Outsiders was filmed, and the next thing you know, there
he is in front of the house where that movie
was filmed. Let's pick up where we last left off.
At the time, it was for sale for forty thousand dollars.
I can assure you you can't buy anything in Los Angeles, California,
(10:55):
with the word real attached to it for forty thousand dollars.
I could not believe that the house one would be
for sale, two would be forty thousand dollars, and three
that nobody understood its true value as an American classic
and a really a sacred hollow grounds. And that being said,
(11:16):
I knew that I was in no position to buy
a house Untils, Oklahoma, living in Beverly Hills, California, and
that I should just kind of take a photo and
soak it all in while I was here and then
and keep it keep moving. So that's exactly what I did.
I took a photo out front. We played Cane's Ballroom
the next night, and I also found out that there
(11:38):
was a hole in the wall that Sid Vicious had punched,
and nineteen seventy eight when the Sex Pistols played Cane's Ballroom,
and I put both of those photos on Facebook, which
was pretty much a new thing as well, and the
response I got was incredible, and in particular, everybody was
fascinated with the outsiders and that the house was not
only one still on Earth, but they couldn't leave that
(12:00):
it was still on the Warner Brothers lot, which I
had to correct a lot of people that it is, No,
it is not on the Warner Brothers Lawton Burbank. It
is actually still here in North Tulsa. And I made
sure I did not tell anybody that it was for
sale because I didn't want anybody else buying it, never
again thinking that I would end up buying it five
years later. But that's exactly what happened. So after finding
(12:21):
the house, we kind of I realized that there's some
there's some really cool stuff across America, and so it
really started here for me. But I started to urban
explore and I put a group together called the Delta
Bravo Urban Exploration Team, And what that is is it's
a page I started on Facebook and I put the
Outsider's house first, and I put it before and after photo,
(12:42):
told people the basics, you know, the Outsiders nineteen eighty two.
Here's the house that the Curtis brothers lived. Here's the address,
seven thirty one North Saint Louis Avenue, and here's a
before and after photo. And I found a lot of
support and made a lot of friends through this web
page that we started. And I found that there was
a lot of like minded people all over the world,
(13:04):
but here in particular in the US, that were at
a certain age where they were like really looking back
finally on all of the pop culture locations and all
of our collective history, which is really pop history. I
mean I was, if I'm honest, I was raised by
a television set in the radio. I mean, this is
where I got most of the stuff I was after,
you know, as a kid. This is where all my
(13:25):
information came from. So in two thousand and nine, I
used the tour bus as my personal like pop culture
location vehicle. And I figured, if I'm going to be
on this tour bus and everybody else is going to be,
you know, doing their thing, I'm gonna get highly caffenated
walk around every city we go to and I'm going
to look for culturally relevant undiscovered locations. And so that
(13:45):
was the birth of the Delta Brava Urban Exploration Team. Again,
it just was like a cool hobby that I could
do in my sobriety that really cost me nothing. And
it was like I was also able to kind of
like see all the undiscovered locations that I had always
wanted to see, like where Mary Tyler Moore's house was
in Minneapolis, where the son of Sam was arrested in Brooklyn,
(14:07):
and stuff like this. And because of the success of
that on the Internet, I got so much, you know,
so many accolades, and it met so many cool people.
We started to do it like pretty We took it
pretty serious. For a while. We were actually getting courted
by a lot of companies in Hollywood. They were trying
to turn it into a television show. It never really
(14:28):
kind of worked out television wise, but the group kept
growing and growing. So we started to go on group
trips and I meanwhile, I was still touring a lot.
So I was going back and forth across the US
and year after year, a minimum of twice a year,
but sometimes three or four times a year. I would
come back, whether on purpose or not, to Tulsa, Oklahoma,
(14:51):
and I'd always make a mission or pilgrimage to see
the Outsider's House and mostly some of the other locations
as well. And what I started to notice is that
year after year, this house was starting to deteriorate, and
that the neighborhood was starting to fall apart, and that
the Habitat for Humanity was coming through here and they
were clearing out a lot of these these streets and
these houses building new houses. I always like to qualify
(15:16):
that I am a fan of the Habitat for Humanities
and what they do, in particular making low income houses,
you know, affordable to people who wouldn't be able to
afford those um And that being said, I was worried
that nobody recognized this house for really what it was,
which was an American classic and a cinematic masterpiece, uh
(15:37):
you know, part of a bigger, you know picture. And
so at year five is when I got here and
started to get worried. I started to think, well, what
if they tear this house down, and what if nobody
recognizes that what what this thing really represents and what
it is and it's on the fifth year, when I
(15:58):
started to ask myself to question, said, well, why don't
you do something about it? And really I have no
expertise on any of this stuff. I just I was
just a fan who couldn't imagine the world without the
Outsider's House. There was really never a plan or a
blueprint or any of that. But what I did was
meet a couple of people here in Tulsa, Oklahoma. They
(16:18):
not only saw the vision that I had that this
should be some kind of like One it shouldn't it
shouldn't ever be torn down. Two, maybe it could be
restored and it could be somebody's house and we could
put a little display or some homage to the movie
that was filmed here in one of the rooms. And
the idea just kept getting bigger and bigger. But what
(16:39):
ends up happening is we end up getting the contact
information for the owner, who her husband bought the house
five years before I got here, and they basically did
a quick fluff and buff in hopes to use it
as a rental property. Unfortunately, her husband died, he gives
it to her in the will, and her and her
(17:00):
sister moved to Florida because they were not native to Tulsa,
and they've had no reason to stay here once her
husband was gone. I guess they were kind of like
absentee landlords. I mean, they were trying their best to
collect the rent, but the tenants weren't paying. There were
eight months behind in their rent. The house was in
terrible condition, and so by the time I found her
(17:21):
in two thousand and nine, she was ready to sell.
We called her. She told us she wouldn't take a
penny less than twenty thousand dollars. My buddy made the call,
so he said he wouldn't give her a penny more
than fifteen thousand dollars, to which she accepted. And at
that point I thought, man, we robbed this lady. I mean,
we bought an American treasure for fifteen thousand dollars. I mean,
(17:42):
where on earth can you buy a house for fifteen
thousand dollars, much less the house from the movie The Outsiders.
So yeah, so I buy the house for fifteen thousand dollars.
I buy it side unseen. I had never been in
the house. I had peeked in it a few times.
I'd been on the outside of The Outsider's house a
few times, but never really knowing that true condition of
the house, and also never understanding I'm when it comes
(18:04):
to the remodeling homes or anything that has anything to
do with that, I have no idea what I'm doing.
So this is not something that I would have been
like predisposed to do, or something that would have been
a likely thing for me to do. I was just
a passionate fan who couldn't imagine if they tore this
house down what the world would would be like without it.
And so I ended up giving the tenants, little by
(18:29):
little over a month to move them out, because again
they were eight months behind in rent, and it cost
me forty eight hundred dollars to get them out. When
I finally drove here a month later from California to
see my new house, I end up breaking in a
back window because they did not leave me keys. And
I realized that this was the worst mistake I had
ever made. And you just heard it from him. The
(18:50):
biggest mistake he'd ever made, was it. But we're going
to find out the rest of the story in a minute.
But what a story it's been so far. He was
raised on TV and a tour bus and for fifteen
thousand dollars. He thought he just bought a piece of
the American dream and certainly an American treasure. What happens next,
(19:11):
Danny Boy O'Connor's story continues here on our American stories,
(19:40):
and we continue with our American stories. In Danny Boy
O'Connor's story, he had just laid down fifteen grand on
a house in Tulsa, Oklahoma, a house with the Outsiders,
his favorite film, the film that had more influenced on
his life than any other. And we all have that film,
or that book or that song. Let's return to Danny
(20:02):
Boy's story. In Tulsa. Clearly the owner knew a lot
better than I did the condition of the house. If
there was any worry of me under paying for this house,
it was quickly erased when I got in here. I mean,
this house was in shambles. The only thing this house
needed was a brand new house, and it was in
terrible condition. And then the fact was that it didn't
(20:23):
it didn't look like it had been cleaned up in
the last hundred years. They were hoarding in here, and
it was in terrible condition, and I panicked, and at
that point I thought, well, basically I just flushed twenty
thousand dollars of my twenty eight thousand dollars life savings
down the drain. I had no work in the foreseeable
future for me. We weren't touring at that time, and
so my next thought was like, look at I'm going
to ask for help. And I often said, you know,
(20:46):
I'm a six foot six alpha male, and it's hard
to ask for help when people assume that you should
be able to do this type of work. But the
truth is, I don't know how to do this type
of work. And it was very it was very humbling,
and I had to really humble myself to that I
didn't know what I was doing and I was in
over my head, and that perhaps if there were a
few other outsiders fans on Earth like me, maybe they
(21:08):
could help me find a way to turn this into
a museum, to help pitch in, whether that was a
gift and kind or some cash or whatever. And so
we put a go fund me together and we started
to raise little money, and immediately the press got ahold
of the story. And if I thought I was one
a few outsiders fans on this planet, it didn't take
(21:30):
long for me to figure out that I was clearly
wrong on that. I mean, immediately the city council showed
up to the house, the Mayor of Tulsa showed up
of the house, the press came out of the woodworks,
and it just kept growing and growing and growing, and
before long, you know, here we were on our way
to turning this thing into a museum. Now, at first,
(21:50):
I want to tell you it was going to be
a movie museum because I had read the book. But
it was only a few years prior that I read
the book. But this book, again, it is an American classic.
It was written by a fifteen year old girl here
in Tulsa, Oklahoma, by the name of Susan Elouise Hinton.
The book is fifty one years old now. It has
(22:11):
never been out of print. At the time when Susie
got her publishing deal, they agreed with the publishers that
would be best if nobody understood that she was a female,
so they called her see Hinton to be ambiguous with that.
She was failing out of English when she wrote it
and got a D plus and creative writing. And I
think that's incredible because the hope is there, you know,
(22:33):
for everybody that great things can happen despite maybe a
few bad marks in a few classes. And really the
book is what brings most people to the house. People
love the movie without a doubt, and that movie, you know,
basically launched the Brat pack, which is all the actors
we've mentioned before, you know, Tom Cruise, Patrick Swayzey, Matt Dillon,
(22:57):
and Ralph Machio, c Thomas how Diane Lane, directed by
Francis Ford Coppola. The book seems to have way more
of a draw, or is equal, if not bigger draw
than the movie. And that was learning experience for me
as well, because on an average day, people come by
this house all the time to stop buying. It's usually
(23:20):
you know, a fifty year old, a forty year old
to seventeen year olds and a twelve year old, and
it's usually somebody's going to seventh grade and it's required reading.
Their older brother and sister read it five years ago
when they were in seventh grade, their parents remember reading
it when they got to junior high, and they also
were there to see the movie or saw it on
(23:41):
HBO when they were kids. And it's really the whole
family tree that comes to enjoy this whole story from
the book to the movie, and now I'm told it's
being turned into a Broadway musical, which is also incredible.
So so much stuff is as transpired since that first
day of me buying the house. But what ended up
happening is that the whole community kind of just puts
(24:04):
this thing on their back and runs with it. Plumbers
came by and helped me, plumb roofers roofed, gardener's gardened,
tile layers tiled, and contractors contracted, and everybody just started
to do what they could do. And it looked like,
you know, people would say, hey, listen, on Sunday after
my daughter soccer practice, I can come by and work
for two hours for free if you don't mind us.
(24:24):
So yeah, it would be fantastic. And so really this
is a communal project. You know, I get thanked everywhere
I go around town and around Oklahoma for you know,
saving the outsider's house. But I feel disingenuous by accepting
that praise, and I always tell them, and I think
they think I'm being you know, humble, or being you
know koi or whatever. But the truth is that this
(24:45):
thing happens because everybody pitched in and helped and it
was usually the people with the least to give given
the most. That being said, we are number one supporter.
Cash Wise is the author se hinting herself. And Jack
White also, you know, came by and told me he
(25:05):
loved what we were doing and loved the book. He
loves the movie and loves Tulsa, and he got us
over the hump. We were stuck at forty five thousand
dollars on our go fund me and we were looking
for seventy five thousand, and he said, I want to
give you thirty thousand dollars from last night's show and
get you over the hump. Which he did that and
changed everything. I mean, we were kind of we were
(25:27):
what I thought would take six to eight months to
complete took us three years. Two months ago we finally
were able to cut the ribbon. In between those last
three years, we've done three events to support the house.
We're both Ralph Macho, c Thomas Howe, Darren Dalton, all
of them in the movie had come back one or
two to three different times for three different events to
(25:48):
support this. And really what I found out is this
thing has become like a community center and had a
really good trickle down effect. I mean, when I got here,
the lawn was to my waist and trash all over
the place. We cut the lawn, got it down the size,
We removed all the debris, We cut down trees that
had fallen in upon themselves, and we basically cleaned this
(26:10):
house up so nice that everybody else in the neighborhood
started to get the drift and they started to clean
their stuff up, and before long it changed the face
of the neighborhood as well. And so if you come
here in North Tulsa on the corner of Independent in
Saint Louis, you'll you'll definitely you'll see what I'm talking about.
And it's it's it's it's a sight to behold. There's
a lot of there's just so many different layers to
(26:33):
this thing. I would have been bored a long time
ago if it was just a house from a movie.
And as much as I loved the film and loved
the book, if there's so much more greater at work here.
I love Tulsa, Oklahoma. I love that a fifteen year
old girl wrote this while she was failing out of
English and got a D plus and creative writing was
really going through a rough patch, and she wrote this masterpiece.
(26:56):
And this masterpiece is different than all others because it
really literally is the book that starts the young adult category.
It was the first time that a young adult ever
wrote about being a young adult for young adults, and
if I'm not mistaking, that is the most successful category
of books now on the market. For me, It's changed
(27:19):
my life. I spent the first let's call it first
forty five years of my life trying to build my
career and promote my brand and stay relevant in that way.
And finally it was a breath of fresh air to
discover that this thing could use somebody to champion. And
instead of championing you know, the fragments of my shattered
(27:42):
career or whatever you know in music, that I was
able to parlay all that experience that I thought was
like of no use in the end and kind of
pivot out and put it into Susie's legacy and in
particular saving the Outsider's House. And by taking this on,
it's opened my world to a whole bunch of other areas.
(28:06):
We're looking to do weddings here. We bring school children
through on the Monday through Friday, so schools will read this.
At seventh grade, they will go to the Circle Cinema,
which was also in a historic movie theater here that's
ninety one years old on the original Root sixty six
and it was also featured in the movie. They show
that movie to those seventh graders, and then the seventh
(28:27):
graders come here dresses greasers and soiss and they get
to experience the house, the museum, and I know that
they get truly inspired because they don't have a lot
of role models to look at and to say, hey,
this person is from my school or my city or
my town and they've became successful and they their legends
and make no mistake, se Hinton is there. That's their legend,
(28:50):
that's there that their mentor. They look and they go this,
this little girl did this here, and it gives them hope.
And so for me, I found a whole new purpose
in Tulsa, Oklahoma. I live here now full time. I
moved from Beverly Hills and I've been here for two
years and it only gets better for me. This town
has changed tremendously in the last ten years for the better.
(29:15):
There's a ton of cool things here Between Root sixty
six and Cane's ballroom and the Drillers Baseball Stadium where
the Dodgers double A team plays. There's good food, good people,
and affordable gas. What more can you want? And you
can buy a beautiful home here for one hundred and
fifty thousand dollars, which tell me where else you can
(29:35):
do that. So I'm Danny O'Connor. I'm the owner of
the Outsider's House, but I am the executive director of
the Outsider's House Museum. And yeah, this is my American story,
and what a story. Thanks to Danny Boy O'Connor for
telling it, and thanks to Greg Hanglier for putting this together.
By the way, make sure to go to the Outsider'shouse
(29:56):
dot com to learn more. Take a visit. If you're
driving across the mid West, stop in Tulsa. He took
a stop in Tulsa, all right, and he called it
his home. Danny Boy O'Connor's story of finding home. This
is our American stories m HM.
And we continue here with our American story. Since being
released in nineteen eighty three, Francis Ford Coppola's film adaptation
of S. E. Hinton's coming of age novel The Outsiders
has found continued popularity and has achieved official cult status
and now, in what is surely one of the most
interesting pop culture intersections, hip hop artists Danny Boy O'Connor
(00:33):
from the rap group House of Pain, best known for
the iconic nineteen ninety two anthem jump Around, purchased the Tulsa,
Oklahoma home where much of The Outsider's film was shot.
Here to tell the story is the man himself. Here's
Danny Boy. My story really begins Los Angeles, California, nineteen
(00:56):
eighty three when I went unknowingly to a movie that
I had never heard of Woodland Hills, California, called The
Outsiders with my friend Steve Zikolski, who just happened to
read the book. I believe I was in seventh grade,
and so he was a fan of the book and
he wanted to see the movie. He said, Danny, you
want to go see a movie with me? And I thought, sure.
(01:17):
Steve Zikowski pretty cool junior high kid that I knew,
so I figured, you know, if he likes it, there's
probably something I liked. But I had no idea what
we were going to go see. I didn't have any
frame of reference. And on that full Saturday afternoon, we
went in and saw the movie, and I came out
a changed man, and people asked me all the time
what was my fascination with the Outsiders? And the movie
(01:42):
kind of hit me at a time where I definitely
felt out of place in, you know, the San Fernando
Valley in the eighties, being a native New Yorker who
who was moved to California at the age of six
and kind of always had like a a strong connection
to the East Coast. So southern California in the eighties
(02:06):
looked a lot different than New York City did. And
I don't know, I just always felt, you know, separate
and apart from and I got that from the movie
as well. And I grew up my father went to
prison when I was two months old. We moved in
with my grandparents. My mother worked nights at the Chase
Manhattan Bank, and so I never really had that foundation
(02:26):
or that family, you know, support or love, and you know,
I car that I carried that with me, even though
you know, I've had a pretty extraordinary life, you know
that that foundation, from the beginning, it's always felt unstable.
And so when I went to see The Outsiders, the
(02:50):
first thing I noticed was that they were a fractured family,
a broken family, and that despite that that they stuck
together and had each other's backs. And I felt, at
a thirteen or fourteen year old mindset was that if
I could just find that kind of friendship out in
the in the world, that maybe I wouldn't feel so
bad about my home life and the way we grew up.
(03:14):
And so that was the original hook for me for
that movie. That being said, Matt Dillon was the coolest
dude on the planet at that time. The cast was incredible,
whether it's Patrick swayzey Ralph Macho, Tom Cruise, Darren Dalton,
c Thomas Howe, Diane Lane, they were all. You know,
(03:35):
this was the first time I was really seeing them. Actually,
Leaf Garrett was the big star in my mind looking back,
because he was a seventies star and so really was
the only notable name that I knew prior to The Outsiders.
Then Matt Dylon. But that being said, you know, the
movie was was the coolest thing I'd ever seen, and
it stuck with me. I immediately went home and then
(03:56):
dug out a denim jacket that I may have had
from the seventies in New York and kind of adapted
that Dallas Winston Matt Dylan Swagger for the next few years.
But as fate would have it, I didn't really have
much of a game plan coming out of high school.
I dropped out in ninth grade. I hung out for
the next three year years at high school, never really
(04:17):
went in too much, gotten a little bit of trouble
with the law, and during the time where most of
my friends were graduating high school and heading off to
college or embarking on a career, I had no idea
what I was going to do. And so I connected,
reconnected with a high school friend who had had a
(04:37):
record out prior to me and him reconnecting, and we
started a band called House of Pain. And at the
time in hip hop, there wasn't anything on the landscape
like it. We were really, you know, kind of the
next wave of hip hop in the early nineties, but
at that time there wasn't any really, there wasn't really
(04:58):
any hard white boys, and we were like Irish American
tough white kids, and that was our stick and that
our deal was is that, you know, we were there
kind of like you know, boom bap, punch you in
your face type of hip hop that was missing, you know,
as as the eighties turned into the nineties and grunge
was a thing hip hop needed to reinvent. So US
(05:19):
and Cypress Hill were kind of like the next face
of that in that moment. And so it was very
successful with that and sold a few million records and
traveled all over the world and made a million bucks.
But you know, I like to say, what goes up
must come down, and it wasn't only you know, five
years later that I was back to where I started
(05:39):
even less because you know, doing music for a living,
especially as a creative director and an artist more than
I am a musician, it kind of left me empty
handed when the career was done, or the music career
was done in that moment, and I really had no
other life skills, and I unfortunately turned to drugs to
deal with that pain. So I spent the next you know,
five six years high on math amphetamans and drinking around
(06:04):
the clock, and it wasn't until about year two thousand
then I got sober. I stayed sober for about three
and a half years, and you know, first year was good.
Second year I started getting complacent and a little my
attitude started to come back and my expectations started to
come back. At around three three and a half years,
I decided to have a drink, and it was pretty
(06:24):
much the worst decision I'd ever made. It took me
one week to go back on drugs and took me
three years to get make it back to the twelve
step program. And it wasn't until two thousand and five
that I was able to get druss another sober breath.
And two thousand and five is when I began to
put another group together called the cocon Nostra. And it
(06:46):
was on that fateful tour that brought me to Tulsa, Oklahoma.
So when we got to Tulsa, Oklahoma, we were stuck
here for three days. And when I say stuck, I
mean stuck. But day two of the three days that
we were here, we began to get extremely bored, and
so I called down to the concierge's desk in the
lobby and asked them to call us a cab. They laughed,
(07:09):
there was no such thing as cabs. They were able
to wrangle us up a guy in a van that
took about an hour and a half to get to
the hotel, and then when he got there, we asked
him can he take us on a proper tour of Tulsa,
which he proceeded to say yes, and then took us
to the Woodland Hills Mall and to I can assure
you that didn't go over so well with a bunch
of forty year olds going to what was at that
(07:33):
point pretty uh, you know, the mall was kind of
shuttered as well, and so we went there for about
an hour, and as we were heading back to downtown Tulsa,
it occurred to me, Tulsa, Tulsa, Tulsa. Why does Tulsa
sound familiar to me? And it was at that moment
I had the epiphany and I said, excuse me, driver,
He said yes, I said, was the Outsiders filmed here?
And he almost like locked up the brakes. He was like,
(07:56):
he turned around and he said yes, absolutely. He says,
why do you know it? I said, I not only
know it, I love it. Do you know where any
of the filming locations are, and he said, I do
know where the driving is. So we proceeded to drop
off the rest of the group. I grabbed my road
manager said you're coming with me. I grabbed my laptop
and at the time, even in two thousand and nine,
(08:17):
there wasn't much on the internet to go on. It's
not like today. Two thousand and nine, I looked up
for locations for the Outsiders, and I found a Flicker
account or two, and I found a site called Tulsa
TV Memories which had a few of the locations and
the addresses were given up. The address I was most
interested in was the Outsider's house, which was not given
(08:37):
on that website. But they did tell us where the
driving was, and it did tell me where the park
in the movie was, the Cruetial neighborhood, And so we
went to the drive in and I couldn't imagine that
this thing was going to look anything like it did
in the movie. But not only was it, they felt
like it hadn't changed a bit. And my mind just
(08:57):
started to just melt, really because it looked exactly like
it would have in nineteen eighty two when they were
filming and exactly like it did, you know in the
sixties when they were trying to describe it. So it
was pretty good stuff anyway. So yeah, we got that
driver to take us around Tulsa. We were able to
find the drive in, we were able to find Crutchfield Park,
(09:21):
which was the park that Johnny stabs the Socian and
they had the confrontation with the Socials in and then
by finding the Bark, I was able to find the house.
And by finding the house, this is where the my
life starts to take a different turn. And when we
come back, we'll continue with the story of Danny Boy
O'Connor from the rap group House of Pain, his journey
(09:41):
back into his life. The movie The Outsiders filmed in
this town, Tulsa in Oklahoma. The rest of this story
continues here on our American stories, and we continue here
(10:10):
with our American stories and the story of Danny Boy O'Connor.
And my goodness, what a story it's been so far.
No father, a whole he's trying to fill because of that.
Sees this movie, sees this character in The Outsiders played
by Matt Dillon of all people, and the next thing
you know, a little bit later, he's in a big
(10:30):
hit band, house of pain and then drugs. And then
one day there's a stop in Tulsa, Oklahoma, where The
Outsiders was filmed, and the next thing you know, there
he is in front of the house where that movie
was filmed. Let's pick up where we last left off.
At the time, it was for sale for forty thousand dollars.
I can assure you you can't buy anything in Los Angeles, California,
(10:55):
with the word real attached to it for forty thousand dollars.
I could not believe that the house one would be
for sale, two would be forty thousand dollars, and three
that nobody understood its true value as an American classic
and a really a sacred hollow grounds. And that being said,
(11:16):
I knew that I was in no position to buy
a house Untils, Oklahoma, living in Beverly Hills, California, and
that I should just kind of take a photo and
soak it all in while I was here and then
and keep it keep moving. So that's exactly what I did.
I took a photo out front. We played Cane's Ballroom
the next night, and I also found out that there
(11:38):
was a hole in the wall that Sid Vicious had punched,
and nineteen seventy eight when the Sex Pistols played Cane's Ballroom,
and I put both of those photos on Facebook, which
was pretty much a new thing as well, and the
response I got was incredible, and in particular, everybody was
fascinated with the outsiders and that the house was not
only one still on Earth, but they couldn't leave that
(12:00):
it was still on the Warner Brothers lot, which I
had to correct a lot of people that it is, No,
it is not on the Warner Brothers Lawton Burbank. It
is actually still here in North Tulsa. And I made
sure I did not tell anybody that it was for
sale because I didn't want anybody else buying it, never
again thinking that I would end up buying it five
years later. But that's exactly what happened. So after finding
(12:21):
the house, we kind of I realized that there's some
there's some really cool stuff across America, and so it
really started here for me. But I started to urban
explore and I put a group together called the Delta
Bravo Urban Exploration Team, And what that is is it's
a page I started on Facebook and I put the
Outsider's house first, and I put it before and after photo,
(12:42):
told people the basics, you know, the Outsiders nineteen eighty two.
Here's the house that the Curtis brothers lived. Here's the address,
seven thirty one North Saint Louis Avenue, and here's a
before and after photo. And I found a lot of
support and made a lot of friends through this web
page that we started. And I found that there was
a lot of like minded people all over the world,
(13:04):
but here in particular in the US, that were at
a certain age where they were like really looking back
finally on all of the pop culture locations and all
of our collective history, which is really pop history. I
mean I was, if I'm honest, I was raised by
a television set in the radio. I mean, this is
where I got most of the stuff I was after,
you know, as a kid. This is where all my
(13:25):
information came from. So in two thousand and nine, I
used the tour bus as my personal like pop culture
location vehicle. And I figured, if I'm going to be
on this tour bus and everybody else is going to be,
you know, doing their thing, I'm gonna get highly caffenated
walk around every city we go to and I'm going
to look for culturally relevant undiscovered locations. And so that
(13:45):
was the birth of the Delta Brava Urban Exploration Team. Again,
it just was like a cool hobby that I could
do in my sobriety that really cost me nothing. And
it was like I was also able to kind of
like see all the undiscovered locations that I had always
wanted to see, like where Mary Tyler Moore's house was
in Minneapolis, where the son of Sam was arrested in Brooklyn,
(14:07):
and stuff like this. And because of the success of
that on the Internet, I got so much, you know,
so many accolades, and it met so many cool people.
We started to do it like pretty We took it
pretty serious. For a while. We were actually getting courted
by a lot of companies in Hollywood. They were trying
to turn it into a television show. It never really
(14:28):
kind of worked out television wise, but the group kept
growing and growing. So we started to go on group
trips and I meanwhile, I was still touring a lot.
So I was going back and forth across the US
and year after year, a minimum of twice a year,
but sometimes three or four times a year. I would
come back, whether on purpose or not, to Tulsa, Oklahoma,
(14:51):
and I'd always make a mission or pilgrimage to see
the Outsider's House and mostly some of the other locations
as well. And what I started to notice is that
year after year, this house was starting to deteriorate, and
that the neighborhood was starting to fall apart, and that
the Habitat for Humanity was coming through here and they
were clearing out a lot of these these streets and
these houses building new houses. I always like to qualify
(15:16):
that I am a fan of the Habitat for Humanities
and what they do, in particular making low income houses,
you know, affordable to people who wouldn't be able to
afford those um And that being said, I was worried
that nobody recognized this house for really what it was,
which was an American classic and a cinematic masterpiece, uh
(15:37):
you know, part of a bigger, you know picture. And
so at year five is when I got here and
started to get worried. I started to think, well, what
if they tear this house down, and what if nobody
recognizes that what what this thing really represents and what
it is and it's on the fifth year, when I
(15:58):
started to ask myself to question, said, well, why don't
you do something about it? And really I have no
expertise on any of this stuff. I just I was
just a fan who couldn't imagine the world without the
Outsider's House. There was really never a plan or a
blueprint or any of that. But what I did was
meet a couple of people here in Tulsa, Oklahoma. They
(16:18):
not only saw the vision that I had that this
should be some kind of like One it shouldn't it
shouldn't ever be torn down. Two, maybe it could be
restored and it could be somebody's house and we could
put a little display or some homage to the movie
that was filmed here in one of the rooms. And
the idea just kept getting bigger and bigger. But what
(16:39):
ends up happening is we end up getting the contact
information for the owner, who her husband bought the house
five years before I got here, and they basically did
a quick fluff and buff in hopes to use it
as a rental property. Unfortunately, her husband died, he gives
it to her in the will, and her and her
(17:00):
sister moved to Florida because they were not native to Tulsa,
and they've had no reason to stay here once her
husband was gone. I guess they were kind of like
absentee landlords. I mean, they were trying their best to
collect the rent, but the tenants weren't paying. There were
eight months behind in their rent. The house was in
terrible condition, and so by the time I found her
(17:21):
in two thousand and nine, she was ready to sell.
We called her. She told us she wouldn't take a
penny less than twenty thousand dollars. My buddy made the call,
so he said he wouldn't give her a penny more
than fifteen thousand dollars, to which she accepted. And at
that point I thought, man, we robbed this lady. I mean,
we bought an American treasure for fifteen thousand dollars. I mean,
(17:42):
where on earth can you buy a house for fifteen
thousand dollars, much less the house from the movie The Outsiders.
So yeah, so I buy the house for fifteen thousand dollars.
I buy it side unseen. I had never been in
the house. I had peeked in it a few times.
I'd been on the outside of The Outsider's house a
few times, but never really knowing that true condition of
the house, and also never understanding I'm when it comes
(18:04):
to the remodeling homes or anything that has anything to
do with that, I have no idea what I'm doing.
So this is not something that I would have been
like predisposed to do, or something that would have been
a likely thing for me to do. I was just
a passionate fan who couldn't imagine if they tore this
house down what the world would would be like without it.
And so I ended up giving the tenants, little by
(18:29):
little over a month to move them out, because again
they were eight months behind in rent, and it cost
me forty eight hundred dollars to get them out. When
I finally drove here a month later from California to
see my new house, I end up breaking in a
back window because they did not leave me keys. And
I realized that this was the worst mistake I had
ever made. And you just heard it from him. The
(18:50):
biggest mistake he'd ever made, was it. But we're going
to find out the rest of the story in a minute.
But what a story it's been so far. He was
raised on TV and a tour bus and for fifteen
thousand dollars. He thought he just bought a piece of
the American dream and certainly an American treasure. What happens next,
(19:11):
Danny Boy O'Connor's story continues here on our American stories,
(19:40):
and we continue with our American stories. In Danny Boy
O'Connor's story, he had just laid down fifteen grand on
a house in Tulsa, Oklahoma, a house with the Outsiders,
his favorite film, the film that had more influenced on
his life than any other. And we all have that film,
or that book or that song. Let's return to Danny
(20:02):
Boy's story. In Tulsa. Clearly the owner knew a lot
better than I did the condition of the house. If
there was any worry of me under paying for this house,
it was quickly erased when I got in here. I mean,
this house was in shambles. The only thing this house
needed was a brand new house, and it was in
terrible condition. And then the fact was that it didn't
(20:23):
it didn't look like it had been cleaned up in
the last hundred years. They were hoarding in here, and
it was in terrible condition, and I panicked, and at
that point I thought, well, basically I just flushed twenty
thousand dollars of my twenty eight thousand dollars life savings
down the drain. I had no work in the foreseeable
future for me. We weren't touring at that time, and
so my next thought was like, look at I'm going
to ask for help. And I often said, you know,
(20:46):
I'm a six foot six alpha male, and it's hard
to ask for help when people assume that you should
be able to do this type of work. But the
truth is, I don't know how to do this type
of work. And it was very it was very humbling,
and I had to really humble myself to that I
didn't know what I was doing and I was in
over my head, and that perhaps if there were a
few other outsiders fans on Earth like me, maybe they
(21:08):
could help me find a way to turn this into
a museum, to help pitch in, whether that was a
gift and kind or some cash or whatever. And so
we put a go fund me together and we started
to raise little money, and immediately the press got ahold
of the story. And if I thought I was one
a few outsiders fans on this planet, it didn't take
(21:30):
long for me to figure out that I was clearly
wrong on that. I mean, immediately the city council showed
up to the house, the Mayor of Tulsa showed up
of the house, the press came out of the woodworks,
and it just kept growing and growing and growing, and
before long, you know, here we were on our way
to turning this thing into a museum. Now, at first,
(21:50):
I want to tell you it was going to be
a movie museum because I had read the book. But
it was only a few years prior that I read
the book. But this book, again, it is an American classic.
It was written by a fifteen year old girl here
in Tulsa, Oklahoma, by the name of Susan Elouise Hinton.
The book is fifty one years old now. It has
(22:11):
never been out of print. At the time when Susie
got her publishing deal, they agreed with the publishers that
would be best if nobody understood that she was a female,
so they called her see Hinton to be ambiguous with that.
She was failing out of English when she wrote it
and got a D plus and creative writing. And I
think that's incredible because the hope is there, you know,
(22:33):
for everybody that great things can happen despite maybe a
few bad marks in a few classes. And really the
book is what brings most people to the house. People
love the movie without a doubt, and that movie, you know,
basically launched the Brat pack, which is all the actors
we've mentioned before, you know, Tom Cruise, Patrick Swayzey, Matt Dillon,
(22:57):
and Ralph Machio, c Thomas how Diane Lane, directed by
Francis Ford Coppola. The book seems to have way more
of a draw, or is equal, if not bigger draw
than the movie. And that was learning experience for me
as well, because on an average day, people come by
this house all the time to stop buying. It's usually
(23:20):
you know, a fifty year old, a forty year old
to seventeen year olds and a twelve year old, and
it's usually somebody's going to seventh grade and it's required reading.
Their older brother and sister read it five years ago
when they were in seventh grade, their parents remember reading
it when they got to junior high, and they also
were there to see the movie or saw it on
(23:41):
HBO when they were kids. And it's really the whole
family tree that comes to enjoy this whole story from
the book to the movie, and now I'm told it's
being turned into a Broadway musical, which is also incredible.
So so much stuff is as transpired since that first
day of me buying the house. But what ended up
happening is that the whole community kind of just puts
(24:04):
this thing on their back and runs with it. Plumbers
came by and helped me, plumb roofers roofed, gardener's gardened,
tile layers tiled, and contractors contracted, and everybody just started
to do what they could do. And it looked like,
you know, people would say, hey, listen, on Sunday after
my daughter soccer practice, I can come by and work
for two hours for free if you don't mind us.
(24:24):
So yeah, it would be fantastic. And so really this
is a communal project. You know, I get thanked everywhere
I go around town and around Oklahoma for you know,
saving the outsider's house. But I feel disingenuous by accepting
that praise, and I always tell them, and I think
they think I'm being you know, humble, or being you
know koi or whatever. But the truth is that this
(24:45):
thing happens because everybody pitched in and helped and it
was usually the people with the least to give given
the most. That being said, we are number one supporter.
Cash Wise is the author se hinting herself. And Jack
White also, you know, came by and told me he
(25:05):
loved what we were doing and loved the book. He
loves the movie and loves Tulsa, and he got us
over the hump. We were stuck at forty five thousand
dollars on our go fund me and we were looking
for seventy five thousand, and he said, I want to
give you thirty thousand dollars from last night's show and
get you over the hump. Which he did that and
changed everything. I mean, we were kind of we were
(25:27):
what I thought would take six to eight months to
complete took us three years. Two months ago we finally
were able to cut the ribbon. In between those last
three years, we've done three events to support the house.
We're both Ralph Macho, c Thomas Howe, Darren Dalton, all
of them in the movie had come back one or
two to three different times for three different events to
(25:48):
support this. And really what I found out is this
thing has become like a community center and had a
really good trickle down effect. I mean, when I got here,
the lawn was to my waist and trash all over
the place. We cut the lawn, got it down the size,
We removed all the debris, We cut down trees that
had fallen in upon themselves, and we basically cleaned this
(26:10):
house up so nice that everybody else in the neighborhood
started to get the drift and they started to clean
their stuff up, and before long it changed the face
of the neighborhood as well. And so if you come
here in North Tulsa on the corner of Independent in
Saint Louis, you'll you'll definitely you'll see what I'm talking about.
And it's it's it's it's a sight to behold. There's
a lot of there's just so many different layers to
(26:33):
this thing. I would have been bored a long time
ago if it was just a house from a movie.
And as much as I loved the film and loved
the book, if there's so much more greater at work here.
I love Tulsa, Oklahoma. I love that a fifteen year
old girl wrote this while she was failing out of
English and got a D plus and creative writing was
really going through a rough patch, and she wrote this masterpiece.
(26:56):
And this masterpiece is different than all others because it
really literally is the book that starts the young adult category.
It was the first time that a young adult ever
wrote about being a young adult for young adults, and
if I'm not mistaking, that is the most successful category
of books now on the market. For me, It's changed
(27:19):
my life. I spent the first let's call it first
forty five years of my life trying to build my
career and promote my brand and stay relevant in that way.
And finally it was a breath of fresh air to
discover that this thing could use somebody to champion. And
instead of championing you know, the fragments of my shattered
(27:42):
career or whatever you know in music, that I was
able to parlay all that experience that I thought was
like of no use in the end and kind of
pivot out and put it into Susie's legacy and in
particular saving the Outsider's House. And by taking this on,
it's opened my world to a whole bunch of other areas.
(28:06):
We're looking to do weddings here. We bring school children
through on the Monday through Friday, so schools will read this.
At seventh grade, they will go to the Circle Cinema,
which was also in a historic movie theater here that's
ninety one years old on the original Root sixty six
and it was also featured in the movie. They show
that movie to those seventh graders, and then the seventh
(28:27):
graders come here dresses greasers and soiss and they get
to experience the house, the museum, and I know that
they get truly inspired because they don't have a lot
of role models to look at and to say, hey,
this person is from my school or my city or
my town and they've became successful and they their legends
and make no mistake, se Hinton is there. That's their legend,
(28:50):
that's there that their mentor. They look and they go this,
this little girl did this here, and it gives them hope.
And so for me, I found a whole new purpose
in Tulsa, Oklahoma. I live here now full time. I
moved from Beverly Hills and I've been here for two
years and it only gets better for me. This town
has changed tremendously in the last ten years for the better.
(29:15):
There's a ton of cool things here Between Root sixty
six and Cane's ballroom and the Drillers Baseball Stadium where
the Dodgers double A team plays. There's good food, good people,
and affordable gas. What more can you want? And you
can buy a beautiful home here for one hundred and
fifty thousand dollars, which tell me where else you can
(29:35):
do that. So I'm Danny O'Connor. I'm the owner of
the Outsider's House, but I am the executive director of
the Outsider's House Museum. And yeah, this is my American story,
and what a story. Thanks to Danny Boy O'Connor for
telling it, and thanks to Greg Hanglier for putting this together.
By the way, make sure to go to the Outsider'shouse
(29:56):
dot com to learn more. Take a visit. If you're
driving across the mid West, stop in Tulsa. He took
a stop in Tulsa, all right, and he called it
his home. Danny Boy O'Connor's story of finding home. This
is our American stories m HM.
Host
Lee Habeeb
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