December 18, 2024 • 59 mins
In this inspiring episode of Our Community, Our Mission, Pastor Marc Giffin of Rooted Community Church shares his journey of starting a church plant and stepping into a community to serve as "the Church" in action. Marc highlights the importance of answering the call to serve and asking, “What is our assignment?” He challenges us to live out our faith by showing up for others with intentionality, becoming part of the solution to their prayers, and praying with unwavering faith.
Marc also explores what it means to say "Yes" to God daily and reflects on the deep desire to love and serve the community we are planted in. He reminds us that being present and intentional allows us to truly embody the mission of faith—building relationships, meeting needs, and becoming a light to those around us. Tune in for thoughtful insight, encouragement, and a call to live with purpose and faith.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Dear Heavenly Father.
We thank you, lord, for thisday and your blessings and
provisions.
God, thank you for this timeagain to record this podcast and
for all of our faithfullisteners.
Lord, pray that they would beencouraged today and just
blessed by this episode.
Lord, we thank you forcommunity partners and God's
willingness to be in thetrenches and help do the work.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Father, bless this time.
In your holy name we pray Amen.
Amen In your holy name, we pray.
Amen, yeah Well, what's specialabout December 18th in regards
to life right now?
Speaker 3 (00:47):
Other than it's almost Christmas.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Yeah, have you ever heard of the 12 days of
Christmas I have?
We'll divide that by two,that's how many are left so
before Christmas, if I did mymath right.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
I know it's coming quickly, isn't it?
Speaker 2 (00:58):
So there's a lot of things happening right now,
around Christmas, at TopekaRescue Mission.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Absolutely.
You know, we're deliveringgifts to people in the community
that we've adopted from theUnited Ways Christmas Bureau.
We're planning parties for thepeople that are staying with us,
as well as the unshelteredneighbors that we have.
There's just so much going on.
It's a wonderfully busy time.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
I saw cars lined up at the warehouse getting gifts
to take to people yes, and justlines of people who are waiting
to help out and bless others inthe community.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
We've had such a blessing of volunteers, whether
it's been helping us put thingstogether, whether it's been
helping us decorate thedifferent buildings that we
occupy, whether it's thendelivering gifts to people,
handing out food to people thevolunteers have just been
amazing this year.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
We've had carolers come.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
I mean, it's just been, it's beautiful.
It's a wonderful time of year.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
It really is.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
Even if it looks absolutely nothing like
Christmas outside.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Well, that's okay right now, Is it?
I think maybe we'll get made upfor later with white stuff and
ice and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
Well, I don't want the ice.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
I stuff and ice and all that kind of stuff.
Well, I don't want the ice,just the white stuff, All right.
Well, anyway, speaking of we'reabout out of this year of 2024.
What is good for people?
To know about some of the needsstill currently in this year
and for next year.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
You know, barry, what we really try to do at the end
of each year is to meet ourbudget, obviously for 2024, year
is to meet our budget obviouslyfor 2024, and also to set
ourselves up for a strongbeginning of 2025 as well.
So end of year giving is veryimportant to us, whether it's
financial.
Financial is kind of what I'mtalking about now, but also just
having people really considerbringing food to us, bringing
(02:41):
all of those things that theydonate to us and keeping us in
their prayers.
You know, each day we walkthrough the work that we do.
We know that we need the Lordwalking right beside us.
And we can feel the prayers ofpeople around us when things get
challenging, when we're lookingat how do we really help folks
(03:01):
that are struggling sosignificantly, you know, and our
numbers are up in our shelters.
So we want to make sure thatwe're doing the best that we
possibly can, and we do thatbecause we know there are just
so many warriors out therepraying for us and, if they are
able to give us financial gifts,that's absolutely needed and
wanted as well.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
How can people do that?
Speaker 3 (03:22):
They can give online by going to trmonlineorg and
clicking the right hand cornerwhich says donate now.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Pretty easy.
It's very easy.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
They can send us checks.
We still do take checks weabsolutely do, and they can send
them to 600, north Kansas,topeka, kansas, 666-08.
Exactly, and you know, I neverreally remember the PO Box, but
I think it's PO Box 8350.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I think so, and it's Topeka, kansas, 666-08.
And if you're not sure, you cango to that website and be able
to verify that.
Yeah, you know, we're known tolove all people.
We love Czechs and Swedes andPoles, but especially the Czechs
.
And so, yes, send those checks.
I know I got that from a rescuemission director out of Omaha.
Speaker 3 (04:09):
That one was just a bit paid for it was.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
That was Speaking of corny, our research and
development department.
I know a lot of people.
They just tune in to our weeklybroadcast of our community, our
mission, to hear the mostimportant things about the day
that we're in.
So again, this is December 18thand, uniquely around the world,
it's called Answer the PhoneLike Buddy the Elf Day.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Answer.
What does that mean, miriam?
Speaker 3 (04:35):
I can't believe that you, if you've never watched the
movie Elf, you need to, becauseit's really very sweet.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
My parents didn't believe in TV.
Buddy the Elf.
What's your favorite color?
What's my favorite color?
Speaker 3 (04:45):
Well, that's how he answers the phone.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Buddy the Elf, what's your favorite color?
I've got to watch this movie, Iknow.
I depend upon the research anddevelopment partners to educate
me, and they did not educate meon this one, but everybody's
giving me a really hard timethat I did not know.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
The answer to this.
Okay, just going to put thatout there.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
Okay, Well, all right , I better watch that then I
think I'm having spaghetti realsoon.
So, anyway, it's Answer thePhone Like Buddy the Elf Day.
So watch the movie Elf to knowthat.
And Miriam, probably one ofyour favorite parts of the
research and developmentdepartment which you supervise
over them.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
I hear a terrible buzzing.
You hear a?
Speaker 2 (05:19):
buzzing they.
They have today is wear aplunger on your head day.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
And I am so glad that you are the one that offered to
do that on this very specialday.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
I like to go with the day you know to fit in right.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
And so you're going to be wearing the plunger today
huh, I have an addendum to this.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Wear a clean plunger on your head day.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
That would probably be very important.
Preferably not used.
Yes exactly.
Never, ever used.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Good one, josh, not a clean one, brand new.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Never used.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Fresh from the store.
Fresh from the store, proventhat it's never been used In the
wrapper.
So anyway, why would we have aday celebrating?
Wear a plunger on your head day?
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Mary, I have no idea Other than there must have been
a very, very, very slow day forsomeone.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
Well, actually it says here in the research and
development department that itsays about this day, there's no
good reason why you should weara plunger on your head.
Well then, but they had to havea day to fill something up.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
If life wasn't complicated Enough Enough.
Now we're complicated Wellanyway.
So we're just very glad forpeople who continue to pray and
continue to give and continue tovolunteer and all those things.
And so, as we get ready for allof our organizations in this
community to anticipate what'sahead for 2025, that's a good
(06:41):
time to finish Topeka RescueMission with your prayers and be
ready to pray up for the yearto come.
And so we are blessed by thejoining of the executive
director of Topeka RescueMission, lamanda Broyles.
You know, lamanda, they weregiving me kind of a hard time a
little bit.
They called me the late BarryFeaker.
Lamanda, you're the lateLaManda Broyles because, we've
(07:02):
already started this podcast.
Speaker 5 (07:03):
Better late than never, Barry.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yep Come on.
Kind of pins.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Kind of pins I know, I bet she was out being an elf.
Speaker 5 (07:11):
I was and I'm.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Lamanda, where's the plunger?
Speaker 5 (07:15):
Where's the plunger?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yeah.
By my toilet when plunger onyour head day, oh how did I miss
that memo?
Yeah, that's probably why itcame late.
Oh, that's so sad, probably,but you really set an example
around here.
Speaker 5 (07:25):
I have a couple of plungers at my house, but we
clarified, preferably brand newfrom this story.
That's right, you're going toput it on there.
Do you know I did.
I have worn a couple of cups onmy head.
So back when I was a preschoolteacher, you can put solo cups
and stack them on your head andthen put your hair around it and
(07:45):
you're kind of like a who fromthe Grinch yeah.
I think I've seen that, and soI've done that.
I used to do that as apreschool teacher and the kids
loved it.
Just so you have that visual.
Every now and then you scare usI know I was Cindy Lou who with
a little solo cup head.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Well, if that's your thing, go ahead.
Miriam's going to do theplunger thing.
Anyway, we need to get to ourreally awesome guest here today.
And so we have the lead pastorof a new church in our community
by the name of Rooted CommunityChurch Been around about 11
weeks now and that's Mark Giffen.
Mark, welcome to our community,our mission, thanks.
(08:22):
Good to be here.
Yeah, mark, we've kind oftalked a little bit about your
background before we startedhere.
But you for about 12 years,were the lead worship pastor at
Grace Point.
And what's a lead pastor atGrace Point in worship?
What was that like?
Speaker 4 (08:37):
Well, I don't know, that's my title change a number
of times over the years.
Most people would probably justrecognize it.
As you know, worship pastor atGrace when it was good.
It took on a lot of differentthings, but you know, I think
most of us that are in Americanchurches these days would
probably recognize generallywhat that means is I'm the guy
behind the microphone whenmusic's happening.
Speaker 5 (08:57):
Mostly that's the clearest picture we have With
other assigned duties right.
Speaker 4 (09:02):
Yeah, other duties as assigned, that's right With
other assigned duties, right.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Yeah, other duties as assigned, that's right Well
that's pretty good to run for 12years as worship pastor at a
great church in our community.
We've had a pastor here on thispodcast a couple of times
talking about the wonderful work.
And so Rooted Community Church.
You're the lead pastor startingthis out with the blessing of
Grace Point.
(09:23):
So, Mark, why another church inour community?
What's the reason for that, andhow did you know that it was
time to make a shift?
Speaker 4 (09:36):
Mark Bailey.
Well, how long do you have?
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Days, days and days.
Mark.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
Bailey, maybe not that long, mark.
Bailey, if only we hadn'twasted so much time talking
about plungers on our heads.
Speaker 5 (09:43):
We could have got to the good stuff.
Mark Bailey, my friend, we werenot that long.
If only we hadn't wasted somuch time talking about plungers
on our heads, so true.
Speaker 4 (09:46):
We could have got to the good stuff.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
My friend, we were not wasting time.
We have had more reviews aboutour R&D department and there's
some people that only tune in.
It's kind of like when's thebonus thing coming?
So we give the bonus up aheadof time.
So the rest of this is kind ofcoasting.
So just go ahead and tell uswhy it's important, it's
interesting.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I've never been into church planting it.
I tell people it interested meabout.
The same as when you're a kidat church on Sunday night and
they bring in a missionary fromMozambique and you have to grin
and bear it.
Right, it's not because it'snot important, it's not because
it's not good, it's not becauseit's not life changing, it's not
because the Lord isn't doingsomething amazing there.
It's because you're notinterested, because it's just
(10:24):
not content.
That grabs your attention.
When you're nine years old,right, so that's what church
planting was for me, basicallymy whole life.
Until a number of years ago Istarted hearing these crazy
statistics about church plants,or just like new, new works, new
expressions of faith, right.
So church plants reach peoplefor the gospel at a rate three
to four times higher thanexisting churches do, and that
(10:46):
rocked me enough to go.
Huh, that's interesting.
That's a pretty big difference.
It's a huge disparity.
So it's, you know, I know a lotof great churches.
I came from a great church.
I know a lot of great churchesare doing really, really great
ministry and reaching people forJesus and doing lots of good
stuff.
But by and large, the church inTopeka not each individual, you
(11:07):
know address that we gather inon Sundays, but the church in
Topeka by and large isn'tgrowing.
It's just not, I mean.
So what's that mean?
Well, the other statistics thatare crazy are, like you know,
churches generally grow like 80%with just transferred growth,
like they're just seeing peopleleave one church and go to
another and like every churchwould say that's not our
audience, that's not who we'retargeting and we're not shooting
(11:30):
to just gain people from thatchurch to come to ours.
You know we want people to cometo Jesus and come to faith in
whatever way we can help them doso.
So those two things kind ofjust began to gnaw at me and eat
at me and I just began to nodme and eat at me and I went well
, maybe we should just plantmore churches, not because I
don't think there are greatchurches in Topeka, there are
great churches in Topeka.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
I push people to other great churches in.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
Topeka all the time, but I also know that the church
in Topeka by and large is notgrowing.
So what that says to me is well, we should try something
different.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
Three to four times the growth rate of new people
coming in right.
Yeah, compared to existingchurches.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
What do you think that is?
Speaker 4 (12:12):
The statistics of church plants.
The new people coming to churchplants is actually something
like 60, 62 or some weirdpercent.
Don't fact check me on that.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Well you could, but you just confirmed that I'm
Research and developmentdepartment Probably right on
that thing Next week.
Speaker 4 (12:23):
So existing churches, their growth is 80 transferred
growth.
A new church is, their growthis 60, not transfer growth.
It's new people coming intotheir churches.
So interesting smarter peoplethan me need to figure out what
that means.
But uh, it, at leastgenerically, on the surface,
means to me that there's areason to start something new in
my wife and I found this to betrue.
(12:43):
A lot of people have come toour church who we've known.
I've been in Topeka a long time, we've known for a long time,
but they didn't come to myprevious church, not because we
didn't invite them.
We invited, I mean, we wantedthem to come, but for whatever
reason.
Once there was something new,they said, hey, can we check
that out?
And we went where have you beento bring you into this
community of faith, whateverexpression we were involved in
during those seasons of life?
(13:05):
But so it's, I mean, in thesmall sample size we have of 10
or 12 weeks.
it's bearing itself true mostly,I think that's interesting.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
There's some practical things that we can
think about.
People may want to check outthe new thing, or maybe it's new
in your neighborhood, ordifferent people who have
decided to shift over maybebring people in because of
relationships, and that you knowwhen you're talking about this.
I think sometimes what we'redoing in regards to church is we
get very comfortable where weare.
(13:37):
Not that being comfortable is abad thing you don't want to be
uncomfortable all the time butwe tend to want to play it safe
and stay in that one place, andsometimes safe is stagnant.
And I'm kind of wondering aboutwhen Jesus talked to the
disciples in the book of Acts,in chapter 1, verse 8, when he
(13:59):
said that we're to go into allthe world and not stay in one
spot.
Does that resonate at all withyou?
Speaker 4 (14:08):
Yeah, it's interesting.
I think one of the things that,like how that informs how we do
ministry is that we didn't lookfor, I think, what a lot of
Americanized churches.
And listen, I love the church,I think she's beautiful when she
gets it right.
I think she is absolutelygorgeous when she gets it right.
And there are things the churchdoes all the time that are
(14:29):
fantastic and right and thereare things that I go, ooh, we
probably missed that Right whenwe stop and evaluate and look
back.
But one of the things we set outto do was we weren't really
that interested in finding thebest curb appeal with the most
drive-by traffic.
We were interested in findingcommunity that we could be in.
Where we ended up planting youdon't drive by it.
I lived a block and a half fromit for three years of my life,
didn't know it existed, didn'teven know the building existed.
(14:52):
So we just kind of took on thisidea that rooted community
churches into that, yeah, whereour church now gathers.
But we just decided, going in,that we weren't really going to.
I think it works for somechurches, maybe at least for a
season, this attractional modelof let's just be the best
production around, let's havethe best building around, let's
be on the busiest street around.
Those are all good.
I think there's reasons forchurches to need to do those
(15:12):
kinds of things, but that's notthe assignment of every church.
Our church decided we were justgoing to dive into a
neighborhood and just love Um,so, uh, we kind of went more for
a let's go to them, then let'sthen the let's invite them to us
, kind of model, uh, and thethings that we, you know, we're
informed by the Acts Church likeall right, let's just be
together, let's be in community,in our community, but in
(15:34):
community with one anothertogether.
Uh, I don't know, it's adifferent way of thinking.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
It's not as glamorous , which you guys know.
All about that.
Working here it's all pretty.
You mentioned something here.
You know, sometimes when we sayour church does it this way,
your church does it that way,and there can be a tendency to
feel like, well, maybe we do itbetter than you do, or the other
guys do it better, but you saidnot the assignment for every
church.
There's something in thatunique.
(16:06):
What is the assignment?
Yeah, that may be differentthan someone else's.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Yeah, fun fact, the church I came from, which is a
great church, love it, love theleadership there, love, I mean.
I have only fond things andmemories to say.
Every day I was there, like itwas fantastic.
But this old guy, barry Feger,came and talked to us years ago
at a staff meeting.
Speaker 5 (16:28):
The late Barry Feger.
I think we got to watch out forhim.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Hey, I was here first today.
Speaker 4 (16:33):
That's fair.
What are you talking about?
So, and I don't I don't know ifyou remember that conversation,
cause for you it was just oneof probably lots of these
conversations you have withchurch teams and leadership
teams that sort of thing, butfor me it's very moving.
You actually use the wordassignment when we were trying
to figure out what our place wasto experience our full
(16:54):
redemptive potential in thiscity as a church and we were
just sitting around in a littlegroup of six or eight people as
a staff just talking and youwere there just kind of guiding
some conversation for us and yousaid well, every church and
every believer frankly needs to,needs to discern and spend time
wrestling with what is yourassignment in God's redemptive
plan.
You may not have used the wordredemptive plan, but you very
much clearly use the wordassignment and that very much
(17:16):
pierced me and I've sat with itfor now.
I don't know.
That was probably 10 years ago,I don't know how long ago it's
been.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
I remember that because you guys didn't fall
asleep when I talked, so it wasa good one.
Speaker 4 (17:27):
So I think it's.
I think it's relevant for us towrestle with as churches.
I think it's relevant for us towrestle with as families.
I think it's relevant for us towrestle with as organizations
and as individuals.
So we just decided well, notdecided.
I think the Lord decided for us.
We discerned that ourassignment was to go.
That can look really differentand you know, I think there's
(17:51):
lots of reasons for churches toexpress themselves.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
Kind of get in the weeds of that.
I really appreciate that.
I really do believe thatsometimes we can go through life
as a person who goes to churchevery single Sunday and sit on
the same pew but never reallyask God what am I supposed to do
?
Yeah, I think it's so valuable.
I know that the rescue missionthis is a big piece of what
we're all about here is bigpiece of what we're all about
here is God, what have youassigned us to do?
(18:12):
What is the assignment?
I mean, you know LaManda overhere.
She was a teacher and aprincipal and then her
assignment at that time was tobe those things and then it
changed.
But she was willing to ask thequestion what's my assignment?
Miriam's the same way, being adirector of another social
service agency, united Way, andon and on and on.
And a lot of people, I think,miss out when they don't ask the
(18:37):
Lord because they're afraid.
Man, if I ask God, what am Isupposed to do?
He may send me to Mozambique orsomething like that.
And I know some people who'vebeen to Mozambique and you know,
they know they're supposed tobe there.
Speaker 4 (18:48):
And I think it's hard to flesh that out, like to say
what is my assignment.
It's hard to flesh that out,like to say what is my
assignment.
That can be such a difficultthing to wrestle with, but I've
for me, I've clarified it andI've tried to have our church
like clarify this for themselvesas individuals, with a couple
of questions.
I've just been asking myselfeach day I wake up as Lord, what
does yes look like today?
What does yes look like to youtoday?
You'll present something infront of me that will need a.
(19:14):
It requires my obedience.
And the other thing that I askis who do you want me to show up
for today?
And I think those things beginto provide some clarity.
It's a difference.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
So when you ask that question, god.
Who do you want me to show upfor today?
What do you get?
What do you hear?
Do you hear anything?
Your audible voice.
Speaker 4 (19:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Wouldn't that be nice .
Speaker 5 (19:32):
I want you to go see Barry today.
Wouldn't that be nice?
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Through the smoke clouds Through the smoke clouds.
Wouldn't that be nice?
That wasn't me you all.
Speaker 4 (19:38):
You know.
I think it's a question youhave to continually ask.
I mean, you ask it first thingin the morning but you have to
continue to like marinate inthat right.
And I think it's amazing howmany opportunities the Lord puts
in front of us during the daythat if we don't ask that
question, if we're not aware ofGod's presence in us and around
us and before us, that we justdon't stop to answer, that we
just don't give it any attention.
(19:58):
And so, lord, who do you havefor me to show up for today?
As a question, I've actuallyended several of our church
services with hey guys, youleave this place this week, pray
this like, ask yourself thisquestion who are you supposed to
show up for today?
It's kind of amazing how oftenthe Lord will present that to
you.
And we spend a lot of our timepraying for people.
We don't spend a lot of ourtime being willing to be the
answer to people's prayers, andso I don't know.
(20:21):
I think it's just a shift tosee people.
I mean, I don't know, there'sprobably something way more
official to give you than what Ijust gave you, but I think it's
just a matter of justcontinually walking in the
spirit continually, even whenand let's be honest there are
times I don't feel the presenceof God, like I'm embarrassed to
say that.
It feels a little bit shamefulto say that, but there are times
(20:42):
, you know, you're just leftgoing.
I mean, I'm praying Lord.
It just feels like maybe mywords are just kind of drifting
out into space and thendissipating and are they ever
really reaching the Father right?
But I think it's praying withfaith that says, even when I
don't feel you, lord, I trustyou and I trust that you're
going to bring people in my paththat are specifically for me
today, and it's going to edifyme, it's going to grow me, but
(21:04):
it's also going to make adifference in them, and I don't
think that's unique to a churchthing and I think sometimes we
don't know that he's answered ituntil we've met the person and
after the fact we go oh there itis.
Speaker 3 (21:18):
There's the person that he put in front of me.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
I may not know it before it happens, but yeah, and
there's an answer for you in ittoo.
Yeah, like there's there'sintimacy with the father and
that for you as the one who isobedient, right, I mean that's
pretty huge.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
Yeah, I think it gives us an anticipation that if
we ask and we mean it, god putme in that place where I can be
available for that person orthat situation.
It makes our faith, our walkwith God, to be relevant every
day, not just on a Sunday, notjust on a special event, but
(21:57):
it's every single day to beavailable.
I mean, you just reflected backsomething that you heard
somebody say 10 years ago thatsometimes we may not know that
we had any impact until later,or maybe never know, but just
being faithful to be there.
Speaker 4 (22:10):
Yeah, and if your full picture of the gospel
represented in your city is I goto church, I sing songs for 25
minutes and the pastor preachesfor 30 minutes and I go home and
I go.
Well, that was nice, like you'vegot such a small, like such a
small little snapshot of whatthe gospel actually is, how it's
experienced and expressed in inyour world.
(22:31):
And I don't think anybody'swell maybe they are, I don't
think anybody's malicious thatthey're trying to trap it to be
that smaller, that minuscule,but the reality is there's just
so much more and that's kind ofwhat led us to do something new
and it's, but it couldn't bebreathed just from.
Hey, our church wants to dosomething new.
I think it first has to startin you as an individual, in you
(22:53):
as an individual, and that'swhere it was breathed, in myself
and my wife, and we justhappened to find a bunch of
people who thought the samething, whether they didn't know
how to lead that or how toarticulate that, to which I'd go
.
Well, we don't either, but canwe just try together A?
Speaker 2 (23:02):
lot of times people will say well, this church
started because people didn'tagree with the other church, and
that is so often church splits.
Whatever the case might, thatwasn't the case here, no and I
hate that narrative.
Speaker 4 (23:13):
And we have fought so hard, myself and the lead
pastor at Grace Point, tim,who's one of my dearest dudes,
like I love him to death.
I mean just an unbelievableleader to be willing to say.
I went to him one day I said,man, here's the deal, darren and
I need to start a church.
And I don't, like I wasn'tlooking forward to that
conversation, right, like I waslooking forward to getting it
off my chest, but I wasn'tlooking forward to telling my
(23:33):
boss, whom I love.
And we said for years, if heever left, I'd go with him.
I mean, we're very tight, we'regood friends, our daughters are
best friends, like we're.
And I said, well, it's time forus to start a church.
Man, we just feel like the Lordwants to do this in us,
obedient, like this is whatobedience requires of us.
And it really wasn't anultimatum, it wasn't a hey, you
can either get on board and getbehind this or we're doing it
(23:55):
without you.
But it maybe came out like that, sorry, tim, and he just it.
There was no pushback, there'sall right, dude.
Well, I'm not going to get inthe way of that.
How can we help?
So there there's total likeenergy and synergy and
unification around it.
We stood in front of our churchand told them together, guys,
we, as as Grace Point Church,we're doing this, not Mark and
(24:16):
Tara are leaving.
And I mean he said here, here'ssome, here's some resources and
, by the way, take anybody youwant and the most valuable
resource you have in the churchis the people that are sitting
in those seats right, he put norestrictions on it.
Our church board put norestrictions on it.
Speaker 2 (24:30):
They said hey whoever's going to go, whatever
it does to chop us off of theknees, we're okay with, and you
know it was beautiful.
I think it puts a big smile onGod's face when we do it that
way.
Yeah, I mean you talked aboutwhen the church gets it right.
That sounds like that's one ofthose evidences of it getting
(24:51):
right, because Tim Pastor, timHughes, has got a great thing
going on over there, had a greatworship pastor.
Speaker 4 (24:56):
And if he were sitting here right now, he would
tell you all the ways in whichGod has blessed them for their
obedience too.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
Yeah, and that's the other thing.
When we get in line with God,he opens the floodgates.
He promises that in his word,but sometimes we don't see that
clearly, or if we do see itclearly, we're afraid to step
into that.
Lamanda, you've been executivedirector at the Rescue Mission
coming up on in April threeyears, and so you get really
good people right, yeah.
Speaker 5 (25:23):
And you got a good Hold on.
I'm still thinking of the factthat I'm trying to make it to
three years.
No, I'm just kidding, I'm justkidding.
I'm just kidding You're goingto make it.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
You may be late, but you're going to make it.
Speaker 5 (25:32):
It's Christmas.
It's Christmas, we're surviving, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
So it's hard to keep the plate spinning all the time.
You've got to have the rightpeople in the right spots, yeah,
and when they feel like they'resupposed to go somewhere else,
talk about how challenging thatis and what you have to do
between you and God to say okayand bless them.
Speaker 5 (25:56):
Yeah, a lot of yelling.
No, I'm just kidding.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
Put a plunger on your forehead.
Put a plunger on the forehead.
You're about to step off intothe abyss.
You'll never be okay.
Speaker 5 (26:09):
And then I put the plunger on their back and I hold
on tight so they can't leave me.
You know, I think the keydifference is really just trying
to as much as humanly possible,having the perspective and the
heart of Christ through it all.
Like this, this world is not myworld, trm is not my
organization, it doesn't belongto me, it belongs to the Lord
(26:31):
and recognizing that, yes, wehave this mission to do and it's
incredible when God gives usamazing people to execute those
missions.
But the other side of it is Ihave to always look at every
individual staff member as theyare on their own journey with
the Lord, the Lord, andsometimes TRM is a part of their
(26:58):
journey for a lengthy amount oftime and sometimes it's not,
and that I, while I have themand while they leave me, I have
a responsibility to be a sisterin Christ and steward that as
easy as possible and asdifficult as it is.
So there's just.
There is realness to it,there's loss.
You're sad when you have peopleleave, that you're connected to
(27:19):
that, you love, that you train,that you mentor.
There is all of that right.
There is this human piece to itwhere it's like man.
That's a loss, been long beforeI came to the rescue mission.
If it doesn't hurt when youleave, you didn't do it right.
And so I remind myself of thatas this leader of every time it
(27:39):
hurts.
It hurts when people leave,whether it's they leave on their
own.
And you know, Barry, I thinkthe other thing that's prevalent
to say here is we still havejobs to do too, and sometimes
that is terminations, sometimesthat is people quitting and it's
not because of this amazingcalling from the Lord.
And my heart and my characterhas got to be the same in those
(28:05):
departures as it is when someoneis departing to take another
step with the Lord for a greatcause.
And so, yeah, you know it's achallenge, but I think the
kicker is to always perceive itand walk it out as much as
humanly possible with the eyesand the heart of the Lord and
(28:26):
recognizing everybody has theirown journey, being thankful when
TRM is a part of that journeyand being understanding when
it's not.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
We have responsibilities in whatever
we're doing, and sometimes thoseresponsibilities translate into
we own this, we never own it,we never own it.
That can change in a heartbeatin regards to, and literally a
heartbeat in regards to we don'town it, but there's this term
called steward or caretaking,and so we have that balance of.
(29:00):
This is not our property.
This is not our person, this isnot our church, it's not our
rescue mission.
This is God's.
And so how do we, in ourassignment, then step into that
place of caretaker for thisseason in that regard?
And so there's a balance in allthat, in leadership.
And so, 11 weeks in now, you'vegot that thing where it's been
(29:25):
blessed.
And so how are you processingMark in regards to the
responsibilities before you, andholding on tight to those
responsibilities, but notholding on too tight to where it
becomes your responsibility?
Speaker 4 (29:40):
Yeah, it's tricky, you know.
I'm going to touch on whatLaManda just said a second ago.
Someone said this a while backat a conference I was at.
There was this husband and wifepastor couple who had planted
numerous churches and one ofthose churches years ago.
A bunch of people left at thesame time and they were close
friends with those people andthey were hurt by it and they
didn't know why they left andthey never really got an
explanation.
But what they did, they went tocounseling for it.
(30:01):
They were actually thatbothered, they were that like
hurt and tore about it and acounselor laid something out for
them that I thought was reallymoving and it's actually really
informed me in what both of youjust said that these people
aren't ours.
They were never ours, they'renot property.
If they're anybody's property,they're Jesus's property, not
ours, right?
He said start treating peoplelike they're foster kids.
(30:22):
They said they're not your kids.
But when you welcome them intoyour house, what's your job with
them?
Love them, care for them ashard as you can, as well as you
can, for as long as you havethem and and especially a lot of
you know a lot of kids.
A lot of these people come in inour churches and in the mission
for sure come with trauma, comewith difficult experiences that
(30:44):
have brought them here, and sowe have this huge responsibility
to just love them well throughthat trauma, for whatever season
we get them.
I said we get them as thoughthey're ours, but to recognize
they're not ours and so if wecan treat them like foster kids,
we can sort of not, because wedon't want to be attached.
Of course we want to beattached.
There's a relational investmentcertainly in it, but I think it
(31:05):
.
I think it orients our, ourhearts and our minds to realize
that man, that man, the Lord hasblessed us to have these people
in our midst for the season weget them.
And our church is the same way.
I mean, I'm already 11 weeks ingoing.
Man, there's going to be a daysome of these people don't go
here.
I mean, the reality is there'sgoing to be a day that people
are like, well, yeah, mark, Isigned up to help get going, but
now I'm tired and I'm ready todo whatever else I was doing
(31:27):
before you know, but it's beenamazing, it's been good.
It's been good to really seepeople as the Lord's people, not
as rooted people, not as Mark'sparishioners.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
You know they're not mine.
I think you bring up somethingelse that I want to make sure we
don't go past, in that thechurch is made up of broken
people.
Some people think that in orderto be able to go to church, I
got to be that perfect person.
Or, unfortunately, people thinkthat if a person goes to church
and they're not perfect, thenthere's something wrong with the
(32:03):
whole church.
And so talk a little bit aboutthat.
The gospel, obviously good newsabout forgiveness of sins, but
that does not make us perfect,necessarily do everything right.
And so how do you lead a brokenpeople and what does it mean in
(32:26):
that regard, how the churchgets it right?
What does that look like?
Broken people, sinners,imperfection, people struggling
like everybody else does, butyet there's this assignment that
is Christ ownership, his church.
He said I will build my church.
You get to be a part of it.
(32:47):
How do we get that right?
Speaker 4 (32:49):
Yeah well, Jesus said a lot about what his church
would be.
I think chief among them, as hesaid, would be a house of
prayer.
So I think you have to batheall those things in prayer.
I tell our church probably notfrequently enough, but I tell
them, you know, if you've comehere tonight and first of all,
we're trying to reach people whodon't know Jesus.
Now is it great when peoplecome to our church who do know
Jesus and already are ready tojump in and contribute and be a
(33:11):
part, Like, yes, of course it isRight, but they're not the
target.
We feel blessed by that, wefeel honored to have them like
jump on with us.
But uh, it's cause they want tojump onto the mission of God,
Not because I hope, it's, notbecause they just think, oh,
those people are awesome, Um,it's just a way for them to to
be a part of the mission to God.
Here I tell people often youknow, we don't come here because
we have it figured out.
(33:31):
We come here because we don't.
We need a savior.
You know, I'm saved by grace,through faith.
I don't live in that depravityany longer.
However, I still need Jesus, Istill need the Lord to move.
I still need the Lord toincline his ear toward me when I
pray.
I still need to know that mysin, which has been covered for
eternity, is still something Iwrestle with.
(33:52):
It's still something I'minclined to sin.
I'm inclined to mess up and Ithink, as leaders, I think if we
can say that from the front ofthe room, I think it gives some
freedom for people to walk inand not have to play that I'm
perfect and I have this thingfigured out thing.
We want to create a spacethat's totally safe and yet we
also don't want to leave peoplein their sin.
(34:13):
We're not called to do that.
We're called to invite peopleinto something deeper with Jesus
.
But the reality is the HolySpirit is going to do the work
in their lives, not us.
If he chooses to use us in somemonumental way, man, I'd
celebrate that.
That's awesome.
If he chooses to use us to getthe heck out of the way like I'm
totally good with that too.
I think we just have to trustthat the Holy Spirit's the one
(34:34):
who condemns.
The Holy Spirit's the one whoconvicts.
Condemns is the wrong word.
The Holy Spirit is the one whoconvicts and changes hearts.
All we have to do is walk withpeople in love and grace and
truth and trust that that can beour role, but ours is a pretty
small one.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
So you talk about two kinds of people that would be
in rooted community church.
One is people who know Jesusand people who don't know Jesus.
Speaker 4 (35:03):
What does it mean to know Jesus?
Well, man, that is a.
That could be the most basicquestion you could ever ask, or
maybe the most complex oneyou've ever asked.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Because somebody's listening right now.
Speaker 4 (35:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:12):
May have heard you say there's people that will
come to my church and know Jesus, and there are people that
won't know Jesus.
Which one am I?
Speaker 4 (35:18):
Yeah, well, I.
So I think there's a clear lineof delineation between I think
most people, at least mostpeople listening to this right
now would say I know who God isright About him, at least I know
.
I know, I know that this Godexists, or that there are people
that think this God exists, Iknow of whoever, even if I don't
believe in him.
I know who that is they'rereferring to and I think that's
(35:40):
probably reasonable to say.
Anybody that has the ability tolisten to this today is
probably in that camp.
But I think there's a realstark difference between I know
of God and I know God because Iam God's, and I think we feel
sometimes like we have to makethat maybe more official than
(36:00):
probably what the Bible says.
I can't see in scripture whereit lays out the quote I'm
putting air quotes up right nowthe sinner's prayer Find that
for me, you know, we, we.
I don't know why we've donethat.
I think we've tried to createsome easy paths to show people
how to you know die tothemselves and how to you know
be less them and be more God.
I think that's just a guidedprayer, but at some point we try
(36:23):
to make this really officialthing and the reality is all it
means is I'm putting my faith ingod instead of in myself.
I'm trusting god not just withmy eternity, but I'm trusting
with trusting him with my today,right now and every day that I
get on this earth and every daythat I get after um.
To know jesus is to know hope.
Uh, to know jesus is to knowpeace, is to know hope.
To know Jesus is to know peace.
(36:45):
And in this Advent season, howrelevant is this right?
To know Jesus is to know love.
To know Jesus is to know joy.
I would say.
To not know Jesus is to nothave a shot at those things, and
we can try to over overstep orover spiritualize, and that
sounds really sacrilege for meto say right.
I don't mean to say it that way, there's probably a better way
(37:06):
to say it, but the truth is it'sreally as simple as I need a
savior, and one has come for meand I'm choosing to place my
life in his hands.
And there are people in ourchurch that have made that
decision and there are people inour church that haven't, and I
say to that thank you, lord.
The reason we're doing church isfor those who haven't.
The reason we're gathering isfor those.
(37:27):
I mean, I can gather with mychurch buddies all the time.
That's overstating it.
Church buddies doesn't meanthey're saved, right, I can
gather my saved friends all thetime, and I do.
I mean I'm sitting here withone of my best pals ever, josh,
like we can do that.
But if we're not extending ourhands to those who aren't saved
and I don't mean literally,although there's a big part of
(37:48):
that, that's literal, but youknow.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
Barry, I think, too, having a church that's mixed
like that of people that believethey know Jesus and people that
don't, the people that knowJesus can gain so much from
those people that don't, becausethey can see how things work
different.
They see Christ start to workin people's lives and there is a
fire that can be caught fromnew believers versus those of us
(38:15):
maybe who are cradle Christians.
Right, we've been in it ourentire lives.
Our homes were filled withJesus, our lives were filled
with Jesus, and so it's almostlike, yeah, I've known Jesus all
my life, but not Right.
I think it's that knowing of,and when you see new believers
(38:35):
catch Christ, catch that fire,there is something for me as a
believer, very convicting aboutthat.
Am I willing to put that kindof passion and energy into my
relationship with him?
And so I think there is much tobe learned from new believers.
(38:58):
For people who have beenwalking that a bit and maybe
what I'm hearing say also thepeople that aren't from new
believers.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
For people who have been walking that a bit, and
maybe what I'm hearing you sayalso, the people that aren't
even new believers they areseeking.
They will probably not come tothe church unless you're having
a dinner or a trunk or treat orwhatever.
They won't keep coming tochurch and not quote, unquote,
knowing Jesus, unless they'reinterested in finding out how
you get to know Jesus.
And you mentioned another term.
Mark, put you on the spot here,saved and unsaved.
(39:24):
What?
Speaker 4 (39:25):
does that mean.
Yeah, well, I guess we couldget real theological if you want
to.
I don't know that I'll drag usthat far into that, but you know
, this all comes down to theperson of Jesus, who isn't the
story of the gospel, isn't justthe story of good news.
It is the person of Jesus whoisn't the story of the gospel
isn't just a story of good news.
It is the person of Jesus.
The gospel is realized in theperson of Jesus.
The gospel meaning the goodnews of God, the incarnate God
(39:49):
putting on human skin, coming tobe with us.
That's the story of the gospelthat we were lost, we were gone,
we had no shot, we couldn'tmake our way to God, we couldn't
do enough, we couldn't be goodenough.
This is the difference in.
This is the difference in, youknow, christianity versus other
religions.
We don't just have to writeourselves so that we can be
before God.
No, Jesus was what makes usright.
(40:12):
We can be righteous before Godbecause, and only because of,
christ.
So to be saved is I am placingall of my trust from now and
forever, although that gets alittle tricky too, because I can
actually see plenty of placesin the scripture that says
listen, I'm not demanding yourlife, I'm demanding your today.
I'm asking you today, I'masking you to pick up your cross
daily.
I'm asking you to choose thisday whom you'll serve.
And I think we make it this big, old, long, lifelong commitment
(40:33):
when really I think the Lord'sgoing.
How about just today, liketomorrow's enough?
Let's not worry about tomorrow,just wake up each day with that
and to be saved just means myeternity is secure, my salvation
meaning this life I get to havein heaven with God, where this
rescue plan God put into actionon Christmas, when Jesus came,
(40:55):
when he put on skin to come tobe with us, to redeem us, to
restore us, so that we can berestored to the Father forever.
After all, sin jacked us all upwith the fall of Adam and Eve.
Right, it just says sin jackedus up.
Jesus came to fix that.
We received that as truth andnow we have wholeness.
We have what the old Testamentwould say shalom peace.
(41:18):
This wholeness, thiscompleteness, that comes only by
knowing Jesus and that's theonly way we can be saved, by
grace, through faith in Christ.
He's the way, he's the truth,he's the life, he's the only way
to heaven.
We can't do enough, we can't begood enough, we can't say the
right things.
It just has everything to dowith placing our lives, our
trust, in God.
That's how we're saved, notbecause of all the good things
we do.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
I think that's good and I think for someone who's
listening right now they couldbe listening here on December
18th or they could be listeninga year from now to this is that
the struggle.
A lot of people think that, youknow, I'm either going to go to
heaven or hell, based upon theprayer that I say or the
contract that I sign or thechurch that I affiliate with,
(42:10):
and it's something that, as yousay every single day, it is an
opportunity to connect with knowum, the creator of the universe
, because he desires to know usand wants himself revealed in us
.
And we get a chance to um asthe body of Christ.
Whether it's a rescue mission,a church or a, a business or
whatever, it is people who arein there to help people to
understand as we're all fosterkids that we were loved and that
(42:31):
we're cared for.
And LaManda Merriam, the rescueministry at Topeka Rescue
Mission, is going out to placeswhere people don't feel they're
loved, they don't feel likeanybody cares for them, they
feel like that they've been athrowaway.
And then giving an opportunitynot to try to get them quote,
quote to join the church or getsaved or whatever, but just to
(42:54):
know that God loves them.
It's pretty powerful.
Big responsibility, bigresponsibility.
Speaker 5 (42:58):
It is, and and it's one that is so hard to explain
and to try to, because of somany different reasons right,
whether it's we can't share alot of what we do because of
confidentiality or, um, becausewe're trying to protect dignity,
(43:18):
or sometimes it's just hard toexplain what we do, because it
could also look very differentwhat we do for this woman that
we find underneath the KansasAvenue Bridge than we do the
gentleman that is digging in thetrash at Burger King, and so
(43:56):
what is the same, though andthat's the message that I think
we try to put on our socialmedia when we do speaking events
, all of these things is we aretrying to get the community to
but the God that we serve whenwe all get in our best clothes
and we go on a Sunday morning ora Saturday night, and there are
things planned ahead of time,down to the minute of who's
singing and who's speaking andwho's praying and who's reading
scripture that same God thatwe're coming to learn about and
(44:21):
that we're coming to give gloryand that we're coming to praise.
We limit him, we as believers,we as Christians, we as leaders.
We limit him and what I think?
My role as the ED, ourleadership team here at the
Rescue Mission and us as a wholeteam here at the Rescue Mission
and us as a whole we are tryingto get the community,
(44:49):
particularly the church, tounderstand that that same God
that we do all of these thingsfor and with on Sundays is that
same God who loves the personwho will never set foot in a
building, who is alone on thestreets, who was just raped, who
just raped someone who's inaddiction, who is getting out of
their tent to go walk to thenearest bus stop to go to work
(45:13):
because they are working poor.
This same God that, if we trulybelieve in who Christ was as a
human created by the creator,truly believe in who Christ was
as a human created by thecreator, and then we're given
the Holy Spirit as the advocate,that same salvation is offered
to anybody outside the building.
And we have the blessing, theprivilege, the challenge, the
(45:37):
heartache of telling someone inthe midst of a high, in the
midst of a mental crisis, in themidst of feeling so lonely and
out of touch because they'vebeen isolated for so long, like
here is the person that died foryou.
(45:59):
Here's the story.
The story is the same for you,as it is the person who looks
beautiful sitting in a churchbuilding right now and there is
such a disconnect and I wouldlove for leaders to start
stepping out in risk and I'mtalking the church leadership to
start talking more about thechallenges and the
(46:22):
misconceptions that we bringforth as believers, Because
sometimes what we mean that isso good and those things are
good, when we're not looking attrying to go out and do those
outside of walls, we are missingample opportunities to share
the gospel with people that aredying and hurting every day on
(46:48):
the streets of Topeka and inShawnee County.
And you know, barry um, my worldhas been rocked here lately.
We have lost more peopleexperiencing homelessness in the
last 11 days, both inside theshelter, and I can't say a lot
(47:11):
about that, but we have stuffwhere people pass away because
life is life and death is death.
We have had shelter deaths, wehave had unsheltered deaths, we
have had people experiencinghomelessness, hit by cars, we
(47:34):
have had overdoses and that istough and that's not something
I'm going to make a Facebookpost about.
It's not something that we'regoing to talk social media on,
but when we talk about this hopeof who Christ is, that is
something that it almost tauntsme Is what happened to those
(47:59):
five or six that we've lost inthe last 11 days, and did we
miss an opportunity to share thegospel?
Because they're never going toset foot in a church building?
And so I'm wrestling right nowwith church leaders, I'm
wrestling with myself, I'mwrestling with what our roles
(48:20):
are.
But if we looked at all thechurches we had in Topeka, and
every church gave up one Sundayto take their hope that they
have in Christ to the streetsevery 52 weeks of the year, we
would have the gospel beingshared on the streets of Topeka
(48:41):
and Shawnee County versusexpecting people to walk indoors
.
And I have seen so manychurches do this well and love
well.
And I have also seen churchessay someone who's dirty or
messed up or in a crisis betternot ever come in and ruin our
service.
And if you look at the life ofChrist, it's not how he lived.
Speaker 4 (49:09):
That's not even how he came.
Speaker 3 (49:11):
Right.
Speaker 4 (49:11):
I mean, when you consider the message to the
shepherds, who really wereceremonially unclean and should
have never been welcomed therein this worship moment with God,
and yet the message to them wasto you, a child is born.
I mean, the dirtiest of us.
Yeah, it's a message we preachat Christmas.
(49:34):
I don't know if it's a messagethat enough churches are
activating their people to golive, but yeah, it's real, it's
out there.
Churches need to do better.
Speaker 3 (49:47):
And when you hear what both Mark and Lamanda are
saying, barry, it just remindsme.
You know, heaven is not our endgame, right?
It's really about ourday-to-day relationship with the
Lord and bringing that topeople.
It's not like we have to waittill we get to heaven or the
opposite if we don't have arelationship.
Loving Christ is not about thatend game.
(50:10):
Loving Christ is about what weget right now, today, in hope,
not the hope for the future, butthe hope for right now.
Speaker 4 (50:17):
And your kingdom come .
Your will be done today onearth, exactly On earth.
Speaker 1 (50:21):
Exactly Go ahead.
I was going to say I think thatcircles back to what you said
about the sinner's prayer.
We kind of made it like allright, you pray the prayer,
you're good.
Speaker 3 (50:27):
Yeah, that's it, that's it.
Speaker 2 (50:29):
End game done.
Speaker 3 (50:30):
check, we can go on to do the rest of life, because
to that saved from right, it'slike no, no.
The whole point of this is therelationship with and that
happens today.
Speaker 2 (50:48):
Jesus gave a parable about a master who had three
employees or servants and he wasgoing to go away and he said
I'm going to give you someresponsibilities while I'm gone
they call them talents and thenwhen I come back we'll check in.
And he checked in and somepeople took those daily and
invested them and one didn'tkind of end game.
I want to play it safe, I wantto make it to the end.
I don't want to risk it and therest is sold.
(51:12):
Yeah the late, so um, but no,it's um, we miss it if we just
want to get to the end game andheaven, fire insurance, whatever
the case might be.
We kind of went deep here today,but I think that some really
important points were broughtout.
In regards to what is thechurch, mark, you said when it
(51:32):
gets it right.
I really think that that'simportant.
What does it mean to get itright?
What does it mean to get itright and how do we, as people
who identify with Christ, calledChristians, get it right?
Whether it's out on the street,whether it's in a homeless
shelter, whether it's in a foodline, whether it's in a church
building, whether it's in aneighborhood, what does it mean
(51:56):
to get it right with God?
And that's a big, big need forus to continue to unpack what
that means.
Mark, what else should we knowabout Rooted Community Church?
11 weeks now old, and so stilla baby.
Where do you meet?
When do you meet?
And if somebody's curious aboutcoming over and checking you
(52:19):
out, how do they do that?
Speaker 4 (52:21):
Yeah, well, I'd warn you, if you're curious to come
check us out.
Um, I'll just own this, likewe're okay with this.
We're a young church, we are.
Our production quality is notthe best show in town.
Our preaching is not the bestpreaching in town, cause I'm the
one doing it.
Uh I don't know.
(52:43):
Our production is pretty great,josh and Jennifer.
That's fair.
Hurt him, shots fired, my bad.
But you know something Amandasaid a few minutes ago, one of
the.
In fact, I just, I just I justput a Facebook post out
yesterday and I don't post onFacebook hardly ever, usually
just silly things my kids say.
But I basically said you know,standing in, standing in
auditoriums on weekends andsinging to God is surely
glorifying to him, but I'm notsure it is.
(53:06):
If we walk out of there and wereturn back to our agendas that
have nothing to do with liftinga finger to help our neighbor,
I'm just not sure that's thekind of worship the Lord desires
.
That's not true.
I actually am sure that's notthe kind of worship the Lord
desires from us.
So you know, rooted rooted ourscorecard is really not about
and I've told our churches overand over and it's really weird
(53:27):
for a pastor to say this I don'treally care how big we grow, I
don't really care how manypeople sit in our seats, I do
care about how many people we'rebringing to heaven with us.
I do care about, you know,experience like stepping into
our redemptive potential in ourneighborhood, in our community,
in our workplaces.
If that brings them into ourchurch is great.
I think one of the things Ithink rooted has going for them.
(53:49):
I think for a lot of the peoplethat maybe don't feel like they
can step into a church buildingor just don't like you know,
they'll get struck by lightningif they do, or whatever, we meet
in a school building, in theold Topeka Lutheran school
building.
It's at 6th, well, 7th andRoosevelt, so just south of 6th
and just east of McVicar.
It's not glamorous, it's not,can I say, sexy.
Speaker 3 (54:12):
I just did.
I just did.
Josh will beep it out later,yeah right, but I think it's
welcoming.
Speaker 4 (54:18):
I think, uh, I think it's welcoming to anybody.
That's the feedback we'vegotten so far.
We actually meet on Saturdaynights.
I don't know if that makes itmore welcoming or less welcoming
, but we meet on Saturday nightsat five o'clock and it's just
an old gym, um, and it seems toseems to welcome who probably
comes to mind.
(54:39):
I hope this doesn't insultanybody, but probably, when we
think of who is Jesus speakingof when he said the least of
these, we're not getting a lotof, you know, white collar six
figure incomes walking throughour doors.
Probably somewhat.
Where we're located, probablysomewhat.
I'm not sure what to attributethat to, but that's fine,
because that was never our goal.
We're trying to find people whoneed Jesus too, but that's fine
(54:59):
, because that was never ourgoal.
We're trying to.
We're trying to find people whoneed Jesus.
If they come into our doors,great.
If not, we're at least tryingto make a presence in that
community so they know thatthere's somebody there who loves
them and cares for them andwe're willing to get outside of
our building and go be in theneighborhood with them and share
Jesus with them or share aholiday ham with them right Like
share, whatever their needs are.
In fact, we were blessed to be apart of your guys' Christmas
(55:20):
deliveries last Saturday.
We just said, heck with it,we're going, let's go.
And tons and tons of peoplejust came out and said, all
right, let's go, be in ourcommunity.
Speaker 5 (55:27):
And we're here.
Early I heard from my staff.
They were like man Rooted wason fire and I said why they were
here before they were supposedto.
They had their own system to doit.
We were able to execute,getting more deliveries done
than anticipated and I said,yeah, they, they walk the walk
and talk yeah.
Speaker 4 (55:44):
I don't know.
I think we just happened tostart the church with a bunch of
people who were like, aboutthat?
Right, like you know, one ofthe big churches that are
established are great, butthey're comfortable and
sometimes comfortable is toocomfortable.
We just started this trip.
We said here's what you'resigning up for if you're coming
here.
And they all went yeah, let'sdo it.
We're rooted.
(56:05):
So then when I say, all right,well, here's your chance to
really show up on this, they'reall about it.
So it doesn't say much about me.
I don't think.
No-transcript.
I was exposed on Saturday, likeyou guys see, the poorest of
(56:30):
the poor in this community.
I saw, like I think, what canonly be described as barely a
step higher than than homeless.
I mean I've seen some homelessconditions that were better than
houses than than homes.
I saw, right, like so it justreinforced for me.
I mean there's, there's so muchlove to be shown, so much, and
(56:50):
not just by saying, hey, do youknow Jesus?
That's huge, that's big, that'sthe best gift we can offer
somebody.
But, man, how credible can webe to offer them that gift if we
first offer them theopportunity of relationship and
restoration when some of thesethings are struggling with?
So that's kind of our pathforward with people.
So I?
That's a long answer.
Your question, how people comecheck out rooted.
You can come check out rooted.
(57:11):
You're like, you're welcome,we'd love you, we'd celebrate
you walking through our door.
But if you're coming to rooted,you're coming to love this city
, you're not coming to get acomfortable seat.
In fact, our seats aren'tcomfortable at all.
Speaker 2 (57:21):
They're not, they're really not.
Speaker 4 (57:24):
If you're coming to check out Rooted, you're coming
to give to Rooted, I just say,fine, you're actually checking
out the city, you're actuallygiving to our city.
So that's the shot we're goingfor, at least.
It's a long one, but we'regoing to keep firing Mark, we're
glad you didn't play it safe.
Speaker 2 (57:39):
Thank you for all you've done for all the years at
Grace Point and now steppingout and what do you understand
is your assignment and thelocation your assignment is in.
I think today what we've talkedabout is a lot of things that
are pretty deep, but it kind ofcomes back to this what does it
mean to be saved?
What does it mean to knowChrist?
(58:00):
What does it mean to get itright in the church?
And it's all about loving theones in front of us and being
available in the moment, nottrying to sign onto a contract
or even necessarily find theplace that's got the safest,
comfortablest chairs, but to beable to be relevant in the world
.
Today, topeka Rescue Missionloves leaders like you who can
(58:24):
talk to people, whatever theirwalk of life is, and let them
know how valued they are andwhen they have capability of
joining the efforts of TopekaRescue Mission to do what you
guys are doing, to be relevantevery single day over on
Roosevelt Street and to berelevant every day outside of
Roosevelt Street as well.
And so what a great time tohave you come and share with us
(58:47):
today about what's going on withRooted Community Church here in
our community meets on Saturdayevenings, and especially this
time of year, about six daysbefore the big day of Christmas.
But that's just the day that werecognize the advent of Christ
coming to this world.
Thank you for listening to OurCommunity, our Mission.
If you are interested inhelping Topeka Rescue Mission,
(59:08):
as Miriam said earlier, you cango to trmonlineorg.
That's trmonlineorg.
There's plenty of opportunitiesfor people to plug in, both
with their time, with their,their resources and especially
with their prayer.
Thank you for being a listenerto our community, our mission.
Dear Heavenly Father.
We thank you, lord, for thisday and your blessings and
provisions.
God, thank you for this timeagain to record this podcast and
for all of our faithfullisteners.
Lord, pray that they would beencouraged today and just
blessed by this episode.
Lord, we thank you forcommunity partners and God's
willingness to be in thetrenches and help do the work.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Father, bless this time.
In your holy name we pray Amen.
Amen In your holy name, we pray.
Amen, yeah Well, what's specialabout December 18th in regards
to life right now?
Speaker 3 (00:47):
Other than it's almost Christmas.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Yeah, have you ever heard of the 12 days of
Christmas I have?
We'll divide that by two,that's how many are left so
before Christmas, if I did mymath right.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
I know it's coming quickly, isn't it?
Speaker 2 (00:58):
So there's a lot of things happening right now,
around Christmas, at TopekaRescue Mission.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Absolutely.
You know, we're deliveringgifts to people in the community
that we've adopted from theUnited Ways Christmas Bureau.
We're planning parties for thepeople that are staying with us,
as well as the unshelteredneighbors that we have.
There's just so much going on.
It's a wonderfully busy time.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
I saw cars lined up at the warehouse getting gifts
to take to people yes, and justlines of people who are waiting
to help out and bless others inthe community.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
We've had such a blessing of volunteers, whether
it's been helping us put thingstogether, whether it's been
helping us decorate thedifferent buildings that we
occupy, whether it's thendelivering gifts to people,
handing out food to people thevolunteers have just been
amazing this year.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
We've had carolers come.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
I mean, it's just been, it's beautiful.
It's a wonderful time of year.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
It really is.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
Even if it looks absolutely nothing like
Christmas outside.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Well, that's okay right now, Is it?
I think maybe we'll get made upfor later with white stuff and
ice and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
Well, I don't want the ice.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
I stuff and ice and all that kind of stuff.
Well, I don't want the ice,just the white stuff, All right.
Well, anyway, speaking of we'reabout out of this year of 2024.
What is good for people?
To know about some of the needsstill currently in this year
and for next year.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
You know, barry, what we really try to do at the end
of each year is to meet ourbudget, obviously for 2024, year
is to meet our budget obviouslyfor 2024, and also to set
ourselves up for a strongbeginning of 2025 as well.
So end of year giving is veryimportant to us, whether it's
financial.
Financial is kind of what I'mtalking about now, but also just
having people really considerbringing food to us, bringing
(02:41):
all of those things that theydonate to us and keeping us in
their prayers.
You know, each day we walkthrough the work that we do.
We know that we need the Lordwalking right beside us.
And we can feel the prayers ofpeople around us when things get
challenging, when we're lookingat how do we really help folks
(03:01):
that are struggling sosignificantly, you know, and our
numbers are up in our shelters.
So we want to make sure thatwe're doing the best that we
possibly can, and we do thatbecause we know there are just
so many warriors out therepraying for us and, if they are
able to give us financial gifts,that's absolutely needed and
wanted as well.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
How can people do that?
Speaker 3 (03:22):
They can give online by going to trmonlineorg and
clicking the right hand cornerwhich says donate now.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Pretty easy.
It's very easy.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
They can send us checks.
We still do take checks weabsolutely do, and they can send
them to 600, north Kansas,topeka, kansas, 666-08.
Exactly, and you know, I neverreally remember the PO Box, but
I think it's PO Box 8350.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I think so, and it's Topeka, kansas, 666-08.
And if you're not sure, you cango to that website and be able
to verify that.
Yeah, you know, we're known tolove all people.
We love Czechs and Swedes andPoles, but especially the Czechs
.
And so, yes, send those checks.
I know I got that from a rescuemission director out of Omaha.
Speaker 3 (04:09):
That one was just a bit paid for it was.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
That was Speaking of corny, our research and
development department.
I know a lot of people.
They just tune in to our weeklybroadcast of our community, our
mission, to hear the mostimportant things about the day
that we're in.
So again, this is December 18thand, uniquely around the world,
it's called Answer the PhoneLike Buddy the Elf Day.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Answer.
What does that mean, miriam?
Speaker 3 (04:35):
I can't believe that you, if you've never watched the
movie Elf, you need to, becauseit's really very sweet.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
My parents didn't believe in TV.
Buddy the Elf.
What's your favorite color?
What's my favorite color?
Speaker 3 (04:45):
Well, that's how he answers the phone.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Buddy the Elf, what's your favorite color?
I've got to watch this movie, Iknow.
I depend upon the research anddevelopment partners to educate
me, and they did not educate meon this one, but everybody's
giving me a really hard timethat I did not know.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
The answer to this.
Okay, just going to put thatout there.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
Okay, Well, all right , I better watch that then I
think I'm having spaghetti realsoon.
So, anyway, it's Answer thePhone Like Buddy the Elf Day.
So watch the movie Elf to knowthat.
And Miriam, probably one ofyour favorite parts of the
research and developmentdepartment which you supervise
over them.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
I hear a terrible buzzing.
You hear a?
Speaker 2 (05:19):
buzzing they.
They have today is wear aplunger on your head day.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
And I am so glad that you are the one that offered to
do that on this very specialday.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
I like to go with the day you know to fit in right.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
And so you're going to be wearing the plunger today
huh, I have an addendum to this.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Wear a clean plunger on your head day.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
That would probably be very important.
Preferably not used.
Yes exactly.
Never, ever used.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Good one, josh, not a clean one, brand new.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Never used.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Fresh from the store.
Fresh from the store, proventhat it's never been used In the
wrapper.
So anyway, why would we have aday celebrating?
Wear a plunger on your head day?
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Mary, I have no idea Other than there must have been
a very, very, very slow day forsomeone.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
Well, actually it says here in the research and
development department that itsays about this day, there's no
good reason why you should weara plunger on your head.
Well then, but they had to havea day to fill something up.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
If life wasn't complicated Enough Enough.
Now we're complicated Wellanyway.
So we're just very glad forpeople who continue to pray and
continue to give and continue tovolunteer and all those things.
And so, as we get ready for allof our organizations in this
community to anticipate what'sahead for 2025, that's a good
(06:41):
time to finish Topeka RescueMission with your prayers and be
ready to pray up for the yearto come.
And so we are blessed by thejoining of the executive
director of Topeka RescueMission, lamanda Broyles.
You know, lamanda, they weregiving me kind of a hard time a
little bit.
They called me the late BarryFeaker.
Lamanda, you're the lateLaManda Broyles because, we've
(07:02):
already started this podcast.
Speaker 5 (07:03):
Better late than never, Barry.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yep Come on.
Kind of pins.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Kind of pins I know, I bet she was out being an elf.
Speaker 5 (07:11):
I was and I'm.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Lamanda, where's the plunger?
Speaker 5 (07:15):
Where's the plunger?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yeah.
By my toilet when plunger onyour head day, oh how did I miss
that memo?
Yeah, that's probably why itcame late.
Oh, that's so sad, probably,but you really set an example
around here.
Speaker 5 (07:25):
I have a couple of plungers at my house, but we
clarified, preferably brand newfrom this story.
That's right, you're going toput it on there.
Do you know I did.
I have worn a couple of cups onmy head.
So back when I was a preschoolteacher, you can put solo cups
and stack them on your head andthen put your hair around it and
(07:45):
you're kind of like a who fromthe Grinch yeah.
I think I've seen that, and soI've done that.
I used to do that as apreschool teacher and the kids
loved it.
Just so you have that visual.
Every now and then you scare usI know I was Cindy Lou who with
a little solo cup head.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Well, if that's your thing, go ahead.
Miriam's going to do theplunger thing.
Anyway, we need to get to ourreally awesome guest here today.
And so we have the lead pastorof a new church in our community
by the name of Rooted CommunityChurch Been around about 11
weeks now and that's Mark Giffen.
Mark, welcome to our community,our mission, thanks.
(08:22):
Good to be here.
Yeah, mark, we've kind oftalked a little bit about your
background before we startedhere.
But you for about 12 years,were the lead worship pastor at
Grace Point.
And what's a lead pastor atGrace Point in worship?
What was that like?
Speaker 4 (08:37):
Well, I don't know, that's my title change a number
of times over the years.
Most people would probably justrecognize it.
As you know, worship pastor atGrace when it was good.
It took on a lot of differentthings, but you know, I think
most of us that are in Americanchurches these days would
probably recognize generallywhat that means is I'm the guy
behind the microphone whenmusic's happening.
Speaker 5 (08:57):
Mostly that's the clearest picture we have With
other assigned duties right.
Speaker 4 (09:02):
Yeah, other duties as assigned, that's right With
other assigned duties, right.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Yeah, other duties as assigned, that's right Well
that's pretty good to run for 12years as worship pastor at a
great church in our community.
We've had a pastor here on thispodcast a couple of times
talking about the wonderful work.
And so Rooted Community Church.
You're the lead pastor startingthis out with the blessing of
Grace Point.
(09:23):
So, Mark, why another church inour community?
What's the reason for that, andhow did you know that it was
time to make a shift?
Speaker 4 (09:36):
Mark Bailey.
Well, how long do you have?
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Days, days and days.
Mark.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
Bailey, maybe not that long, mark.
Bailey, if only we hadn'twasted so much time talking
about plungers on our heads.
Speaker 5 (09:43):
We could have got to the good stuff.
Mark Bailey, my friend, we werenot that long.
If only we hadn't wasted somuch time talking about plungers
on our heads, so true.
Speaker 4 (09:46):
We could have got to the good stuff.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
My friend, we were not wasting time.
We have had more reviews aboutour R&D department and there's
some people that only tune in.
It's kind of like when's thebonus thing coming?
So we give the bonus up aheadof time.
So the rest of this is kind ofcoasting.
So just go ahead and tell uswhy it's important, it's
interesting.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I've never been into church planting it.
I tell people it interested meabout.
The same as when you're a kidat church on Sunday night and
they bring in a missionary fromMozambique and you have to grin
and bear it.
Right, it's not because it'snot important, it's not because
it's not good, it's not becauseit's not life changing, it's not
because the Lord isn't doingsomething amazing there.
It's because you're notinterested, because it's just
(10:24):
not content.
That grabs your attention.
When you're nine years old,right, so that's what church
planting was for me, basicallymy whole life.
Until a number of years ago Istarted hearing these crazy
statistics about church plants,or just like new, new works, new
expressions of faith, right.
So church plants reach peoplefor the gospel at a rate three
to four times higher thanexisting churches do, and that
(10:46):
rocked me enough to go.
Huh, that's interesting.
That's a pretty big difference.
It's a huge disparity.
So it's, you know, I know a lotof great churches.
I came from a great church.
I know a lot of great churchesare doing really, really great
ministry and reaching people forJesus and doing lots of good
stuff.
But by and large, the church inTopeka not each individual, you
(11:07):
know address that we gather inon Sundays, but the church in
Topeka by and large isn'tgrowing.
It's just not, I mean.
So what's that mean?
Well, the other statistics thatare crazy are, like you know,
churches generally grow like 80%with just transferred growth,
like they're just seeing peopleleave one church and go to
another and like every churchwould say that's not our
audience, that's not who we'retargeting and we're not shooting
(11:30):
to just gain people from thatchurch to come to ours.
You know we want people to cometo Jesus and come to faith in
whatever way we can help them doso.
So those two things kind ofjust began to gnaw at me and eat
at me and I just began to nodme and eat at me and I went well
, maybe we should just plantmore churches, not because I
don't think there are greatchurches in Topeka, there are
great churches in Topeka.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
I push people to other great churches in.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
Topeka all the time, but I also know that the church
in Topeka by and large is notgrowing.
So what that says to me is well, we should try something
different.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
Three to four times the growth rate of new people
coming in right.
Yeah, compared to existingchurches.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
What do you think that is?
Speaker 4 (12:12):
The statistics of church plants.
The new people coming to churchplants is actually something
like 60, 62 or some weirdpercent.
Don't fact check me on that.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Well you could, but you just confirmed that I'm
Research and developmentdepartment Probably right on
that thing Next week.
Speaker 4 (12:23):
So existing churches, their growth is 80 transferred
growth.
A new church is, their growthis 60, not transfer growth.
It's new people coming intotheir churches.
So interesting smarter peoplethan me need to figure out what
that means.
But uh, it, at leastgenerically, on the surface,
means to me that there's areason to start something new in
my wife and I found this to betrue.
(12:43):
A lot of people have come toour church who we've known.
I've been in Topeka a long time, we've known for a long time,
but they didn't come to myprevious church, not because we
didn't invite them.
We invited, I mean, we wantedthem to come, but for whatever
reason.
Once there was something new,they said, hey, can we check
that out?
And we went where have you beento bring you into this
community of faith, whateverexpression we were involved in
during those seasons of life?
(13:05):
But so it's, I mean, in thesmall sample size we have of 10
or 12 weeks.
it's bearing itself true mostly,I think that's interesting.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
There's some practical things that we can
think about.
People may want to check outthe new thing, or maybe it's new
in your neighborhood, ordifferent people who have
decided to shift over maybebring people in because of
relationships, and that you knowwhen you're talking about this.
I think sometimes what we'redoing in regards to church is we
get very comfortable where weare.
(13:37):
Not that being comfortable is abad thing you don't want to be
uncomfortable all the time butwe tend to want to play it safe
and stay in that one place, andsometimes safe is stagnant.
And I'm kind of wondering aboutwhen Jesus talked to the
disciples in the book of Acts,in chapter 1, verse 8, when he
(13:59):
said that we're to go into allthe world and not stay in one
spot.
Does that resonate at all withyou?
Speaker 4 (14:08):
Yeah, it's interesting.
I think one of the things that,like how that informs how we do
ministry is that we didn't lookfor, I think, what a lot of
Americanized churches.
And listen, I love the church,I think she's beautiful when she
gets it right.
I think she is absolutelygorgeous when she gets it right.
And there are things the churchdoes all the time that are
(14:29):
fantastic and right and thereare things that I go, ooh, we
probably missed that Right whenwe stop and evaluate and look
back.
But one of the things we set outto do was we weren't really
that interested in finding thebest curb appeal with the most
drive-by traffic.
We were interested in findingcommunity that we could be in.
Where we ended up planting youdon't drive by it.
I lived a block and a half fromit for three years of my life,
didn't know it existed, didn'teven know the building existed.
(14:52):
So we just kind of took on thisidea that rooted community
churches into that, yeah, whereour church now gathers.
But we just decided, going in,that we weren't really going to.
I think it works for somechurches, maybe at least for a
season, this attractional modelof let's just be the best
production around, let's havethe best building around, let's
be on the busiest street around.
Those are all good.
I think there's reasons forchurches to need to do those
(15:12):
kinds of things, but that's notthe assignment of every church.
Our church decided we were justgoing to dive into a
neighborhood and just love Um,so, uh, we kind of went more for
a let's go to them, then let'sthen the let's invite them to us
, kind of model, uh, and thethings that we, you know, we're
informed by the Acts Church likeall right, let's just be
together, let's be in community,in our community, but in
(15:34):
community with one anothertogether.
Uh, I don't know, it's adifferent way of thinking.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
It's not as glamorous , which you guys know.
All about that.
Working here it's all pretty.
You mentioned something here.
You know, sometimes when we sayour church does it this way,
your church does it that way,and there can be a tendency to
feel like, well, maybe we do itbetter than you do, or the other
guys do it better, but you saidnot the assignment for every
church.
There's something in thatunique.
(16:06):
What is the assignment?
Yeah, that may be differentthan someone else's.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Yeah, fun fact, the church I came from, which is a
great church, love it, love theleadership there, love, I mean.
I have only fond things andmemories to say.
Every day I was there, like itwas fantastic.
But this old guy, barry Feger,came and talked to us years ago
at a staff meeting.
Speaker 5 (16:28):
The late Barry Feger.
I think we got to watch out forhim.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Hey, I was here first today.
Speaker 4 (16:33):
That's fair.
What are you talking about?
So, and I don't I don't know ifyou remember that conversation,
cause for you it was just oneof probably lots of these
conversations you have withchurch teams and leadership
teams that sort of thing, butfor me it's very moving.
You actually use the wordassignment when we were trying
to figure out what our place wasto experience our full
(16:54):
redemptive potential in thiscity as a church and we were
just sitting around in a littlegroup of six or eight people as
a staff just talking and youwere there just kind of guiding
some conversation for us and yousaid well, every church and
every believer frankly needs to,needs to discern and spend time
wrestling with what is yourassignment in God's redemptive
plan.
You may not have used the wordredemptive plan, but you very
much clearly use the wordassignment and that very much
(17:16):
pierced me and I've sat with itfor now.
I don't know.
That was probably 10 years ago,I don't know how long ago it's
been.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
I remember that because you guys didn't fall
asleep when I talked, so it wasa good one.
Speaker 4 (17:27):
So I think it's.
I think it's relevant for us towrestle with as churches.
I think it's relevant for us towrestle with as families.
I think it's relevant for us towrestle with as organizations
and as individuals.
So we just decided well, notdecided.
I think the Lord decided for us.
We discerned that ourassignment was to go.
That can look really differentand you know, I think there's
(17:51):
lots of reasons for churches toexpress themselves.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
Kind of get in the weeds of that.
I really appreciate that.
I really do believe thatsometimes we can go through life
as a person who goes to churchevery single Sunday and sit on
the same pew but never reallyask God what am I supposed to do
?
Yeah, I think it's so valuable.
I know that the rescue missionthis is a big piece of what
we're all about here is bigpiece of what we're all about
here is God, what have youassigned us to do?
(18:12):
What is the assignment?
I mean, you know LaManda overhere.
She was a teacher and aprincipal and then her
assignment at that time was tobe those things and then it
changed.
But she was willing to ask thequestion what's my assignment?
Miriam's the same way, being adirector of another social
service agency, united Way, andon and on and on.
And a lot of people, I think,miss out when they don't ask the
(18:37):
Lord because they're afraid.
Man, if I ask God, what am Isupposed to do?
He may send me to Mozambique orsomething like that.
And I know some people who'vebeen to Mozambique and you know,
they know they're supposed tobe there.
Speaker 4 (18:48):
And I think it's hard to flesh that out, like to say
what is my assignment.
It's hard to flesh that out,like to say what is my
assignment.
That can be such a difficultthing to wrestle with, but I've
for me, I've clarified it andI've tried to have our church
like clarify this for themselvesas individuals, with a couple
of questions.
I've just been asking myselfeach day I wake up as Lord, what
does yes look like today?
What does yes look like to youtoday?
You'll present something infront of me that will need a.
(19:14):
It requires my obedience.
And the other thing that I askis who do you want me to show up
for today?
And I think those things beginto provide some clarity.
It's a difference.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
So when you ask that question, god.
Who do you want me to show upfor today?
What do you get?
What do you hear?
Do you hear anything?
Your audible voice.
Speaker 4 (19:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Wouldn't that be nice .
Speaker 5 (19:32):
I want you to go see Barry today.
Wouldn't that be nice?
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Through the smoke clouds Through the smoke clouds.
Wouldn't that be nice?
That wasn't me you all.
Speaker 4 (19:38):
You know.
I think it's a question youhave to continually ask.
I mean, you ask it first thingin the morning but you have to
continue to like marinate inthat right.
And I think it's amazing howmany opportunities the Lord puts
in front of us during the daythat if we don't ask that
question, if we're not aware ofGod's presence in us and around
us and before us, that we justdon't stop to answer, that we
just don't give it any attention.
(19:58):
And so, lord, who do you havefor me to show up for today?
As a question, I've actuallyended several of our church
services with hey guys, youleave this place this week, pray
this like, ask yourself thisquestion who are you supposed to
show up for today?
It's kind of amazing how oftenthe Lord will present that to
you.
And we spend a lot of our timepraying for people.
We don't spend a lot of ourtime being willing to be the
answer to people's prayers, andso I don't know.
(20:21):
I think it's just a shift tosee people.
I mean, I don't know, there'sprobably something way more
official to give you than what Ijust gave you, but I think it's
just a matter of justcontinually walking in the
spirit continually, even whenand let's be honest there are
times I don't feel the presenceof God, like I'm embarrassed to
say that.
It feels a little bit shamefulto say that, but there are times
(20:42):
, you know, you're just leftgoing.
I mean, I'm praying Lord.
It just feels like maybe mywords are just kind of drifting
out into space and thendissipating and are they ever
really reaching the Father right?
But I think it's praying withfaith that says, even when I
don't feel you, lord, I trustyou and I trust that you're
going to bring people in my paththat are specifically for me
today, and it's going to edifyme, it's going to grow me, but
(21:04):
it's also going to make adifference in them, and I don't
think that's unique to a churchthing and I think sometimes we
don't know that he's answered ituntil we've met the person and
after the fact we go oh there itis.
Speaker 3 (21:18):
There's the person that he put in front of me.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
I may not know it before it happens, but yeah, and
there's an answer for you in ittoo.
Yeah, like there's there'sintimacy with the father and
that for you as the one who isobedient, right, I mean that's
pretty huge.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
Yeah, I think it gives us an anticipation that if
we ask and we mean it, god putme in that place where I can be
available for that person orthat situation.
It makes our faith, our walkwith God, to be relevant every
day, not just on a Sunday, notjust on a special event, but
(21:57):
it's every single day to beavailable.
I mean, you just reflected backsomething that you heard
somebody say 10 years ago thatsometimes we may not know that
we had any impact until later,or maybe never know, but just
being faithful to be there.
Speaker 4 (22:10):
Yeah, and if your full picture of the gospel
represented in your city is I goto church, I sing songs for 25
minutes and the pastor preachesfor 30 minutes and I go home and
I go.
Well, that was nice, like you'vegot such a small, like such a
small little snapshot of whatthe gospel actually is, how it's
experienced and expressed in inyour world.
(22:31):
And I don't think anybody'swell maybe they are, I don't
think anybody's malicious thatthey're trying to trap it to be
that smaller, that minuscule,but the reality is there's just
so much more and that's kind ofwhat led us to do something new
and it's, but it couldn't bebreathed just from.
Hey, our church wants to dosomething new.
I think it first has to startin you as an individual, in you
(22:53):
as an individual, and that'swhere it was breathed, in myself
and my wife, and we justhappened to find a bunch of
people who thought the samething, whether they didn't know
how to lead that or how toarticulate that, to which I'd go
.
Well, we don't either, but canwe just try together A?
Speaker 2 (23:02):
lot of times people will say well, this church
started because people didn'tagree with the other church, and
that is so often church splits.
Whatever the case might, thatwasn't the case here, no and I
hate that narrative.
Speaker 4 (23:13):
And we have fought so hard, myself and the lead
pastor at Grace Point, tim,who's one of my dearest dudes,
like I love him to death.
I mean just an unbelievableleader to be willing to say.
I went to him one day I said,man, here's the deal, darren and
I need to start a church.
And I don't, like I wasn'tlooking forward to that
conversation, right, like I waslooking forward to getting it
off my chest, but I wasn'tlooking forward to telling my
(23:33):
boss, whom I love.
And we said for years, if heever left, I'd go with him.
I mean, we're very tight, we'regood friends, our daughters are
best friends, like we're.
And I said, well, it's time forus to start a church.
Man, we just feel like the Lordwants to do this in us,
obedient, like this is whatobedience requires of us.
And it really wasn't anultimatum, it wasn't a hey, you
can either get on board and getbehind this or we're doing it
(23:55):
without you.
But it maybe came out like that, sorry, tim, and he just it.
There was no pushback, there'sall right, dude.
Well, I'm not going to get inthe way of that.
How can we help?
So there there's total likeenergy and synergy and
unification around it.
We stood in front of our churchand told them together, guys,
we, as as Grace Point Church,we're doing this, not Mark and
(24:16):
Tara are leaving.
And I mean he said here, here'ssome, here's some resources and
, by the way, take anybody youwant and the most valuable
resource you have in the churchis the people that are sitting
in those seats right, he put norestrictions on it.
Our church board put norestrictions on it.
Speaker 2 (24:30):
They said hey whoever's going to go, whatever
it does to chop us off of theknees, we're okay with, and you
know it was beautiful.
I think it puts a big smile onGod's face when we do it that
way.
Yeah, I mean you talked aboutwhen the church gets it right.
That sounds like that's one ofthose evidences of it getting
(24:51):
right, because Tim Pastor, timHughes, has got a great thing
going on over there, had a greatworship pastor.
Speaker 4 (24:56):
And if he were sitting here right now, he would
tell you all the ways in whichGod has blessed them for their
obedience too.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
Yeah, and that's the other thing.
When we get in line with God,he opens the floodgates.
He promises that in his word,but sometimes we don't see that
clearly, or if we do see itclearly, we're afraid to step
into that.
Lamanda, you've been executivedirector at the Rescue Mission
coming up on in April threeyears, and so you get really
good people right, yeah.
Speaker 5 (25:23):
And you got a good Hold on.
I'm still thinking of the factthat I'm trying to make it to
three years.
No, I'm just kidding, I'm justkidding.
I'm just kidding You're goingto make it.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
You may be late, but you're going to make it.
Speaker 5 (25:32):
It's Christmas.
It's Christmas, we're surviving, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
So it's hard to keep the plate spinning all the time.
You've got to have the rightpeople in the right spots, yeah,
and when they feel like they'resupposed to go somewhere else,
talk about how challenging thatis and what you have to do
between you and God to say okayand bless them.
Speaker 5 (25:56):
Yeah, a lot of yelling.
No, I'm just kidding.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
Put a plunger on your forehead.
Put a plunger on the forehead.
You're about to step off intothe abyss.
You'll never be okay.
Speaker 5 (26:09):
And then I put the plunger on their back and I hold
on tight so they can't leave me.
You know, I think the keydifference is really just trying
to as much as humanly possible,having the perspective and the
heart of Christ through it all.
Like this, this world is not myworld, trm is not my
organization, it doesn't belongto me, it belongs to the Lord
(26:31):
and recognizing that, yes, wehave this mission to do and it's
incredible when God gives usamazing people to execute those
missions.
But the other side of it is Ihave to always look at every
individual staff member as theyare on their own journey with
the Lord, the Lord, andsometimes TRM is a part of their
(26:58):
journey for a lengthy amount oftime and sometimes it's not,
and that I, while I have themand while they leave me, I have
a responsibility to be a sisterin Christ and steward that as
easy as possible and asdifficult as it is.
So there's just.
There is realness to it,there's loss.
You're sad when you have peopleleave, that you're connected to
(27:19):
that, you love, that you train,that you mentor.
There is all of that right.
There is this human piece to itwhere it's like man.
That's a loss, been long beforeI came to the rescue mission.
If it doesn't hurt when youleave, you didn't do it right.
And so I remind myself of thatas this leader of every time it
(27:39):
hurts.
It hurts when people leave,whether it's they leave on their
own.
And you know, Barry, I thinkthe other thing that's prevalent
to say here is we still havejobs to do too, and sometimes
that is terminations, sometimesthat is people quitting and it's
not because of this amazingcalling from the Lord.
And my heart and my characterhas got to be the same in those
(28:05):
departures as it is when someoneis departing to take another
step with the Lord for a greatcause.
And so, yeah, you know it's achallenge, but I think the
kicker is to always perceive itand walk it out as much as
humanly possible with the eyesand the heart of the Lord and
(28:26):
recognizing everybody has theirown journey, being thankful when
TRM is a part of that journeyand being understanding when
it's not.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
We have responsibilities in whatever
we're doing, and sometimes thoseresponsibilities translate into
we own this, we never own it,we never own it.
That can change in a heartbeatin regards to, and literally a
heartbeat in regards to we don'town it, but there's this term
called steward or caretaking,and so we have that balance of.
(29:00):
This is not our property.
This is not our person, this isnot our church, it's not our
rescue mission.
This is God's.
And so how do we, in ourassignment, then step into that
place of caretaker for thisseason in that regard?
And so there's a balance in allthat, in leadership.
And so, 11 weeks in now, you'vegot that thing where it's been
(29:25):
blessed.
And so how are you processingMark in regards to the
responsibilities before you, andholding on tight to those
responsibilities, but notholding on too tight to where it
becomes your responsibility?
Speaker 4 (29:40):
Yeah, it's tricky, you know.
I'm going to touch on whatLaManda just said a second ago.
Someone said this a while backat a conference I was at.
There was this husband and wifepastor couple who had planted
numerous churches and one ofthose churches years ago.
A bunch of people left at thesame time and they were close
friends with those people andthey were hurt by it and they
didn't know why they left andthey never really got an
explanation.
But what they did, they went tocounseling for it.
(30:01):
They were actually thatbothered, they were that like
hurt and tore about it and acounselor laid something out for
them that I thought was reallymoving and it's actually really
informed me in what both of youjust said that these people
aren't ours.
They were never ours, they'renot property.
If they're anybody's property,they're Jesus's property, not
ours, right?
He said start treating peoplelike they're foster kids.
(30:22):
They said they're not your kids.
But when you welcome them intoyour house, what's your job with
them?
Love them, care for them ashard as you can, as well as you
can, for as long as you havethem and and especially a lot of
you know a lot of kids.
A lot of these people come in inour churches and in the mission
for sure come with trauma, comewith difficult experiences that
(30:44):
have brought them here, and sowe have this huge responsibility
to just love them well throughthat trauma, for whatever season
we get them.
I said we get them as thoughthey're ours, but to recognize
they're not ours and so if wecan treat them like foster kids,
we can sort of not, because wedon't want to be attached.
Of course we want to beattached.
There's a relational investmentcertainly in it, but I think it
(31:05):
.
I think it orients our, ourhearts and our minds to realize
that man, that man, the Lord hasblessed us to have these people
in our midst for the season weget them.
And our church is the same way.
I mean, I'm already 11 weeks ingoing.
Man, there's going to be a daysome of these people don't go
here.
I mean, the reality is there'sgoing to be a day that people
are like, well, yeah, mark, Isigned up to help get going, but
now I'm tired and I'm ready todo whatever else I was doing
(31:27):
before you know, but it's beenamazing, it's been good.
It's been good to really seepeople as the Lord's people, not
as rooted people, not as Mark'sparishioners.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
You know they're not mine.
I think you bring up somethingelse that I want to make sure we
don't go past, in that thechurch is made up of broken
people.
Some people think that in orderto be able to go to church, I
got to be that perfect person.
Or, unfortunately, people thinkthat if a person goes to church
and they're not perfect, thenthere's something wrong with the
(32:03):
whole church.
And so talk a little bit aboutthat.
The gospel, obviously good newsabout forgiveness of sins, but
that does not make us perfect,necessarily do everything right.
And so how do you lead a brokenpeople and what does it mean in
(32:26):
that regard, how the churchgets it right?
What does that look like?
Broken people, sinners,imperfection, people struggling
like everybody else does, butyet there's this assignment that
is Christ ownership, his church.
He said I will build my church.
You get to be a part of it.
(32:47):
How do we get that right?
Speaker 4 (32:49):
Yeah well, Jesus said a lot about what his church
would be.
I think chief among them, as hesaid, would be a house of
prayer.
So I think you have to batheall those things in prayer.
I tell our church probably notfrequently enough, but I tell
them, you know, if you've comehere tonight and first of all,
we're trying to reach people whodon't know Jesus.
Now is it great when peoplecome to our church who do know
Jesus and already are ready tojump in and contribute and be a
(33:11):
part, Like, yes, of course it isRight, but they're not the
target.
We feel blessed by that, wefeel honored to have them like
jump on with us.
But uh, it's cause they want tojump onto the mission of God,
Not because I hope, it's, notbecause they just think, oh,
those people are awesome, Um,it's just a way for them to to
be a part of the mission to God.
Here I tell people often youknow, we don't come here because
we have it figured out.
(33:31):
We come here because we don't.
We need a savior.
You know, I'm saved by grace,through faith.
I don't live in that depravityany longer.
However, I still need Jesus, Istill need the Lord to move.
I still need the Lord toincline his ear toward me when I
pray.
I still need to know that mysin, which has been covered for
eternity, is still something Iwrestle with.
(33:52):
It's still something I'minclined to sin.
I'm inclined to mess up and Ithink, as leaders, I think if we
can say that from the front ofthe room, I think it gives some
freedom for people to walk inand not have to play that I'm
perfect and I have this thingfigured out thing.
We want to create a spacethat's totally safe and yet we
also don't want to leave peoplein their sin.
(34:13):
We're not called to do that.
We're called to invite peopleinto something deeper with Jesus
.
But the reality is the HolySpirit is going to do the work
in their lives, not us.
If he chooses to use us in somemonumental way, man, I'd
celebrate that.
That's awesome.
If he chooses to use us to getthe heck out of the way like I'm
totally good with that too.
I think we just have to trustthat the Holy Spirit's the one
(34:34):
who condemns.
The Holy Spirit's the one whoconvicts.
Condemns is the wrong word.
The Holy Spirit is the one whoconvicts and changes hearts.
All we have to do is walk withpeople in love and grace and
truth and trust that that can beour role, but ours is a pretty
small one.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
So you talk about two kinds of people that would be
in rooted community church.
One is people who know Jesusand people who don't know Jesus.
Speaker 4 (35:03):
What does it mean to know Jesus?
Well, man, that is a.
That could be the most basicquestion you could ever ask, or
maybe the most complex oneyou've ever asked.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Because somebody's listening right now.
Speaker 4 (35:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:12):
May have heard you say there's people that will
come to my church and know Jesus, and there are people that
won't know Jesus.
Which one am I?
Speaker 4 (35:18):
Yeah, well, I.
So I think there's a clear lineof delineation between I think
most people, at least mostpeople listening to this right
now would say I know who God isright About him, at least I know
.
I know, I know that this Godexists, or that there are people
that think this God exists, Iknow of whoever, even if I don't
believe in him.
I know who that is they'rereferring to and I think that's
(35:40):
probably reasonable to say.
Anybody that has the ability tolisten to this today is
probably in that camp.
But I think there's a realstark difference between I know
of God and I know God because Iam God's, and I think we feel
sometimes like we have to makethat maybe more official than
(36:00):
probably what the Bible says.
I can't see in scripture whereit lays out the quote I'm
putting air quotes up right nowthe sinner's prayer Find that
for me, you know, we, we.
I don't know why we've donethat.
I think we've tried to createsome easy paths to show people
how to you know die tothemselves and how to you know
be less them and be more God.
I think that's just a guidedprayer, but at some point we try
(36:23):
to make this really officialthing and the reality is all it
means is I'm putting my faith ingod instead of in myself.
I'm trusting god not just withmy eternity, but I'm trusting
with trusting him with my today,right now and every day that I
get on this earth and every daythat I get after um.
To know jesus is to know hope.
Uh, to know jesus is to knowpeace, is to know hope.
To know Jesus is to know peace.
(36:45):
And in this Advent season, howrelevant is this right?
To know Jesus is to know love.
To know Jesus is to know joy.
I would say.
To not know Jesus is to nothave a shot at those things, and
we can try to over overstep orover spiritualize, and that
sounds really sacrilege for meto say right.
I don't mean to say it that way, there's probably a better way
(37:06):
to say it, but the truth is it'sreally as simple as I need a
savior, and one has come for meand I'm choosing to place my
life in his hands.
And there are people in ourchurch that have made that
decision and there are people inour church that haven't, and I
say to that thank you, lord.
The reason we're doing church isfor those who haven't.
The reason we're gathering isfor those.
(37:27):
I mean, I can gather with mychurch buddies all the time.
That's overstating it.
Church buddies doesn't meanthey're saved, right, I can
gather my saved friends all thetime, and I do.
I mean I'm sitting here withone of my best pals ever, josh,
like we can do that.
But if we're not extending ourhands to those who aren't saved
and I don't mean literally,although there's a big part of
(37:48):
that, that's literal, but youknow.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
Barry, I think, too, having a church that's mixed
like that of people that believethey know Jesus and people that
don't, the people that knowJesus can gain so much from
those people that don't, becausethey can see how things work
different.
They see Christ start to workin people's lives and there is a
fire that can be caught fromnew believers versus those of us
(38:15):
maybe who are cradle Christians.
Right, we've been in it ourentire lives.
Our homes were filled withJesus, our lives were filled
with Jesus, and so it's almostlike, yeah, I've known Jesus all
my life, but not Right.
I think it's that knowing of,and when you see new believers
(38:35):
catch Christ, catch that fire,there is something for me as a
believer, very convicting aboutthat.
Am I willing to put that kindof passion and energy into my
relationship with him?
And so I think there is much tobe learned from new believers.
(38:58):
For people who have beenwalking that a bit and maybe
what I'm hearing say also thepeople that aren't from new
believers.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
For people who have been walking that a bit, and
maybe what I'm hearing you sayalso, the people that aren't
even new believers they areseeking.
They will probably not come tothe church unless you're having
a dinner or a trunk or treat orwhatever.
They won't keep coming tochurch and not quote, unquote,
knowing Jesus, unless they'reinterested in finding out how
you get to know Jesus.
And you mentioned another term.
Mark, put you on the spot here,saved and unsaved.
(39:24):
What?
Speaker 4 (39:25):
does that mean.
Yeah, well, I guess we couldget real theological if you want
to.
I don't know that I'll drag usthat far into that, but you know
, this all comes down to theperson of Jesus, who isn't the
story of the gospel, isn't justthe story of good news.
It is the person of Jesus whoisn't the story of the gospel
isn't just a story of good news.
It is the person of Jesus.
The gospel is realized in theperson of Jesus.
The gospel meaning the goodnews of God, the incarnate God
(39:49):
putting on human skin, coming tobe with us.
That's the story of the gospelthat we were lost, we were gone,
we had no shot, we couldn'tmake our way to God, we couldn't
do enough, we couldn't be goodenough.
This is the difference in.
This is the difference in, youknow, christianity versus other
religions.
We don't just have to writeourselves so that we can be
before God.
No, Jesus was what makes usright.
(40:12):
We can be righteous before Godbecause, and only because of,
christ.
So to be saved is I am placingall of my trust from now and
forever, although that gets alittle tricky too, because I can
actually see plenty of placesin the scripture that says
listen, I'm not demanding yourlife, I'm demanding your today.
I'm asking you today, I'masking you to pick up your cross
daily.
I'm asking you to choose thisday whom you'll serve.
And I think we make it this big, old, long, lifelong commitment
(40:33):
when really I think the Lord'sgoing.
How about just today, liketomorrow's enough?
Let's not worry about tomorrow,just wake up each day with that
and to be saved just means myeternity is secure, my salvation
meaning this life I get to havein heaven with God, where this
rescue plan God put into actionon Christmas, when Jesus came,
(40:55):
when he put on skin to come tobe with us, to redeem us, to
restore us, so that we can berestored to the Father forever.
After all, sin jacked us all upwith the fall of Adam and Eve.
Right, it just says sin jackedus up.
Jesus came to fix that.
We received that as truth andnow we have wholeness.
We have what the old Testamentwould say shalom peace.
(41:18):
This wholeness, thiscompleteness, that comes only by
knowing Jesus and that's theonly way we can be saved, by
grace, through faith in Christ.
He's the way, he's the truth,he's the life, he's the only way
to heaven.
We can't do enough, we can't begood enough, we can't say the
right things.
It just has everything to dowith placing our lives, our
trust, in God.
That's how we're saved, notbecause of all the good things
we do.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
I think that's good and I think for someone who's
listening right now they couldbe listening here on December
18th or they could be listeninga year from now to this is that
the struggle.
A lot of people think that, youknow, I'm either going to go to
heaven or hell, based upon theprayer that I say or the
contract that I sign or thechurch that I affiliate with,
(42:10):
and it's something that, as yousay every single day, it is an
opportunity to connect with knowum, the creator of the universe
, because he desires to know usand wants himself revealed in us
.
And we get a chance to um asthe body of Christ.
Whether it's a rescue mission,a church or a, a business or
whatever, it is people who arein there to help people to
understand as we're all fosterkids that we were loved and that
(42:31):
we're cared for.
And LaManda Merriam, the rescueministry at Topeka Rescue
Mission, is going out to placeswhere people don't feel they're
loved, they don't feel likeanybody cares for them, they
feel like that they've been athrowaway.
And then giving an opportunitynot to try to get them quote,
quote to join the church or getsaved or whatever, but just to
(42:54):
know that God loves them.
It's pretty powerful.
Big responsibility, bigresponsibility.
Speaker 5 (42:58):
It is, and and it's one that is so hard to explain
and to try to, because of somany different reasons right,
whether it's we can't share alot of what we do because of
confidentiality or, um, becausewe're trying to protect dignity,
(43:18):
or sometimes it's just hard toexplain what we do, because it
could also look very differentwhat we do for this woman that
we find underneath the KansasAvenue Bridge than we do the
gentleman that is digging in thetrash at Burger King, and so
(43:56):
what is the same, though andthat's the message that I think
we try to put on our socialmedia when we do speaking events
, all of these things is we aretrying to get the community to
but the God that we serve whenwe all get in our best clothes
and we go on a Sunday morning ora Saturday night, and there are
things planned ahead of time,down to the minute of who's
singing and who's speaking andwho's praying and who's reading
scripture that same God thatwe're coming to learn about and
(44:21):
that we're coming to give gloryand that we're coming to praise.
We limit him, we as believers,we as Christians, we as leaders.
We limit him and what I think?
My role as the ED, ourleadership team here at the
Rescue Mission and us as a wholeteam here at the Rescue Mission
and us as a whole we are tryingto get the community,
(44:49):
particularly the church, tounderstand that that same God
that we do all of these thingsfor and with on Sundays is that
same God who loves the personwho will never set foot in a
building, who is alone on thestreets, who was just raped, who
just raped someone who's inaddiction, who is getting out of
their tent to go walk to thenearest bus stop to go to work
(45:13):
because they are working poor.
This same God that, if we trulybelieve in who Christ was as a
human created by the creator,truly believe in who Christ was
as a human created by thecreator, and then we're given
the Holy Spirit as the advocate,that same salvation is offered
to anybody outside the building.
And we have the blessing, theprivilege, the challenge, the
(45:37):
heartache of telling someone inthe midst of a high, in the
midst of a mental crisis, in themidst of feeling so lonely and
out of touch because they'vebeen isolated for so long, like
here is the person that died foryou.
(45:59):
Here's the story.
The story is the same for you,as it is the person who looks
beautiful sitting in a churchbuilding right now and there is
such a disconnect and I wouldlove for leaders to start
stepping out in risk and I'mtalking the church leadership to
start talking more about thechallenges and the
(46:22):
misconceptions that we bringforth as believers, Because
sometimes what we mean that isso good and those things are
good, when we're not looking attrying to go out and do those
outside of walls, we are missingample opportunities to share
the gospel with people that aredying and hurting every day on
(46:48):
the streets of Topeka and inShawnee County.
And you know, barry um, my worldhas been rocked here lately.
We have lost more peopleexperiencing homelessness in the
last 11 days, both inside theshelter, and I can't say a lot
(47:11):
about that, but we have stuffwhere people pass away because
life is life and death is death.
We have had shelter deaths, wehave had unsheltered deaths, we
have had people experiencinghomelessness, hit by cars, we
(47:34):
have had overdoses and that istough and that's not something
I'm going to make a Facebookpost about.
It's not something that we'regoing to talk social media on,
but when we talk about this hopeof who Christ is, that is
something that it almost tauntsme Is what happened to those
(47:59):
five or six that we've lost inthe last 11 days, and did we
miss an opportunity to share thegospel?
Because they're never going toset foot in a church building?
And so I'm wrestling right nowwith church leaders, I'm
wrestling with myself, I'mwrestling with what our roles
(48:20):
are.
But if we looked at all thechurches we had in Topeka, and
every church gave up one Sundayto take their hope that they
have in Christ to the streetsevery 52 weeks of the year, we
would have the gospel beingshared on the streets of Topeka
(48:41):
and Shawnee County versusexpecting people to walk indoors
.
And I have seen so manychurches do this well and love
well.
And I have also seen churchessay someone who's dirty or
messed up or in a crisis betternot ever come in and ruin our
service.
And if you look at the life ofChrist, it's not how he lived.
Speaker 4 (49:09):
That's not even how he came.
Speaker 3 (49:11):
Right.
Speaker 4 (49:11):
I mean, when you consider the message to the
shepherds, who really wereceremonially unclean and should
have never been welcomed therein this worship moment with God,
and yet the message to them wasto you, a child is born.
I mean, the dirtiest of us.
Yeah, it's a message we preachat Christmas.
(49:34):
I don't know if it's a messagethat enough churches are
activating their people to golive, but yeah, it's real, it's
out there.
Churches need to do better.
Speaker 3 (49:47):
And when you hear what both Mark and Lamanda are
saying, barry, it just remindsme.
You know, heaven is not our endgame, right?
It's really about ourday-to-day relationship with the
Lord and bringing that topeople.
It's not like we have to waittill we get to heaven or the
opposite if we don't have arelationship.
Loving Christ is not about thatend game.
(50:10):
Loving Christ is about what weget right now, today, in hope,
not the hope for the future, butthe hope for right now.
Speaker 4 (50:17):
And your kingdom come .
Your will be done today onearth, exactly On earth.
Speaker 1 (50:21):
Exactly Go ahead.
I was going to say I think thatcircles back to what you said
about the sinner's prayer.
We kind of made it like allright, you pray the prayer,
you're good.
Speaker 3 (50:27):
Yeah, that's it, that's it.
Speaker 2 (50:29):
End game done.
Speaker 3 (50:30):
check, we can go on to do the rest of life, because
to that saved from right, it'slike no, no.
The whole point of this is therelationship with and that
happens today.
Speaker 2 (50:48):
Jesus gave a parable about a master who had three
employees or servants and he wasgoing to go away and he said
I'm going to give you someresponsibilities while I'm gone
they call them talents and thenwhen I come back we'll check in.
And he checked in and somepeople took those daily and
invested them and one didn'tkind of end game.
I want to play it safe, I wantto make it to the end.
I don't want to risk it and therest is sold.
(51:12):
Yeah the late, so um, but no,it's um, we miss it if we just
want to get to the end game andheaven, fire insurance, whatever
the case might be.
We kind of went deep here today,but I think that some really
important points were broughtout.
In regards to what is thechurch, mark, you said when it
(51:32):
gets it right.
I really think that that'simportant.
What does it mean to get itright?
What does it mean to get itright and how do we, as people
who identify with Christ, calledChristians, get it right?
Whether it's out on the street,whether it's in a homeless
shelter, whether it's in a foodline, whether it's in a church
building, whether it's in aneighborhood, what does it mean
(51:56):
to get it right with God?
And that's a big, big need forus to continue to unpack what
that means.
Mark, what else should we knowabout Rooted Community Church?
11 weeks now old, and so stilla baby.
Where do you meet?
When do you meet?
And if somebody's curious aboutcoming over and checking you
(52:19):
out, how do they do that?
Speaker 4 (52:21):
Yeah, well, I'd warn you, if you're curious to come
check us out.
Um, I'll just own this, likewe're okay with this.
We're a young church, we are.
Our production quality is notthe best show in town.
Our preaching is not the bestpreaching in town, cause I'm the
one doing it.
Uh I don't know.
(52:43):
Our production is pretty great,josh and Jennifer.
That's fair.
Hurt him, shots fired, my bad.
But you know something Amandasaid a few minutes ago, one of
the.
In fact, I just, I just I justput a Facebook post out
yesterday and I don't post onFacebook hardly ever, usually
just silly things my kids say.
But I basically said you know,standing in, standing in
auditoriums on weekends andsinging to God is surely
glorifying to him, but I'm notsure it is.
(53:06):
If we walk out of there and wereturn back to our agendas that
have nothing to do with liftinga finger to help our neighbor,
I'm just not sure that's thekind of worship the Lord desires
.
That's not true.
I actually am sure that's notthe kind of worship the Lord
desires from us.
So you know, rooted rooted ourscorecard is really not about
and I've told our churches overand over and it's really weird
(53:27):
for a pastor to say this I don'treally care how big we grow, I
don't really care how manypeople sit in our seats, I do
care about how many people we'rebringing to heaven with us.
I do care about, you know,experience like stepping into
our redemptive potential in ourneighborhood, in our community,
in our workplaces.
If that brings them into ourchurch is great.
I think one of the things Ithink rooted has going for them.
(53:49):
I think for a lot of the peoplethat maybe don't feel like they
can step into a church buildingor just don't like you know,
they'll get struck by lightningif they do, or whatever, we meet
in a school building, in theold Topeka Lutheran school
building.
It's at 6th, well, 7th andRoosevelt, so just south of 6th
and just east of McVicar.
It's not glamorous, it's not,can I say, sexy.
Speaker 3 (54:12):
I just did.
I just did.
Josh will beep it out later,yeah right, but I think it's
welcoming.
Speaker 4 (54:18):
I think, uh, I think it's welcoming to anybody.
That's the feedback we'vegotten so far.
We actually meet on Saturdaynights.
I don't know if that makes itmore welcoming or less welcoming
, but we meet on Saturday nightsat five o'clock and it's just
an old gym, um, and it seems toseems to welcome who probably
comes to mind.
(54:39):
I hope this doesn't insultanybody, but probably, when we
think of who is Jesus speakingof when he said the least of
these, we're not getting a lotof, you know, white collar six
figure incomes walking throughour doors.
Probably somewhat.
Where we're located, probablysomewhat.
I'm not sure what to attributethat to, but that's fine,
because that was never our goal.
We're trying to find people whoneed Jesus too, but that's fine
(54:59):
, because that was never ourgoal.
We're trying to.
We're trying to find people whoneed Jesus.
If they come into our doors,great.
If not, we're at least tryingto make a presence in that
community so they know thatthere's somebody there who loves
them and cares for them andwe're willing to get outside of
our building and go be in theneighborhood with them and share
Jesus with them or share aholiday ham with them right Like
share, whatever their needs are.
In fact, we were blessed to be apart of your guys' Christmas
(55:20):
deliveries last Saturday.
We just said, heck with it,we're going, let's go.
And tons and tons of peoplejust came out and said, all
right, let's go, be in ourcommunity.
Speaker 5 (55:27):
And we're here.
Early I heard from my staff.
They were like man Rooted wason fire and I said why they were
here before they were supposedto.
They had their own system to doit.
We were able to execute,getting more deliveries done
than anticipated and I said,yeah, they, they walk the walk
and talk yeah.
Speaker 4 (55:44):
I don't know.
I think we just happened tostart the church with a bunch of
people who were like, aboutthat?
Right, like you know, one ofthe big churches that are
established are great, butthey're comfortable and
sometimes comfortable is toocomfortable.
We just started this trip.
We said here's what you'resigning up for if you're coming
here.
And they all went yeah, let'sdo it.
We're rooted.
(56:05):
So then when I say, all right,well, here's your chance to
really show up on this, they'reall about it.
So it doesn't say much about me.
I don't think.
No-transcript.
I was exposed on Saturday, likeyou guys see, the poorest of
(56:30):
the poor in this community.
I saw, like I think, what canonly be described as barely a
step higher than than homeless.
I mean I've seen some homelessconditions that were better than
houses than than homes.
I saw, right, like so it justreinforced for me.
I mean there's, there's so muchlove to be shown, so much, and
(56:50):
not just by saying, hey, do youknow Jesus?
That's huge, that's big, that'sthe best gift we can offer
somebody.
But, man, how credible can webe to offer them that gift if we
first offer them theopportunity of relationship and
restoration when some of thesethings are struggling with?
So that's kind of our pathforward with people.
So I?
That's a long answer.
Your question, how people comecheck out rooted.
You can come check out rooted.
(57:11):
You're like, you're welcome,we'd love you, we'd celebrate
you walking through our door.
But if you're coming to rooted,you're coming to love this city
, you're not coming to get acomfortable seat.
In fact, our seats aren'tcomfortable at all.
Speaker 2 (57:21):
They're not, they're really not.
Speaker 4 (57:24):
If you're coming to check out Rooted, you're coming
to give to Rooted, I just say,fine, you're actually checking
out the city, you're actuallygiving to our city.
So that's the shot we're goingfor, at least.
It's a long one, but we'regoing to keep firing Mark, we're
glad you didn't play it safe.
Speaker 2 (57:39):
Thank you for all you've done for all the years at
Grace Point and now steppingout and what do you understand
is your assignment and thelocation your assignment is in.
I think today what we've talkedabout is a lot of things that
are pretty deep, but it kind ofcomes back to this what does it
mean to be saved?
What does it mean to knowChrist?
(58:00):
What does it mean to get itright in the church?
And it's all about loving theones in front of us and being
available in the moment, nottrying to sign onto a contract
or even necessarily find theplace that's got the safest,
comfortablest chairs, but to beable to be relevant in the world
.
Today, topeka Rescue Missionloves leaders like you who can
(58:24):
talk to people, whatever theirwalk of life is, and let them
know how valued they are andwhen they have capability of
joining the efforts of TopekaRescue Mission to do what you
guys are doing, to be relevantevery single day over on
Roosevelt Street and to berelevant every day outside of
Roosevelt Street as well.
And so what a great time tohave you come and share with us
(58:47):
today about what's going on withRooted Community Church here in
our community meets on Saturdayevenings, and especially this
time of year, about six daysbefore the big day of Christmas.
But that's just the day that werecognize the advent of Christ
coming to this world.
Thank you for listening to OurCommunity, our Mission.
If you are interested inhelping Topeka Rescue Mission,
(59:08):
as Miriam said earlier, you cango to trmonlineorg.
That's trmonlineorg.
There's plenty of opportunitiesfor people to plug in, both
with their time, with their,their resources and especially
with their prayer.
Thank you for being a listenerto our community, our mission.
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