March 5, 2025 • 62 mins
This episode of Our Community, Our Mission was recorded prior to the incident on March 4th, in which an unsheltered neighbor was injured during a city-mandated encampment abatement. Our hearts are heavy over what happened, and while we are deeply grateful that he is okay, we are saddened that this situation occurred at all.
We are also incredibly thankful for the many partners and boots on the ground advocates in our community who care deeply and work tirelessly to support our unsheltered neighbors with compassion and dignity. But this incident is a stark reminder of what happens when decisions are made by elected officials without careful strategic measures and proper continuum of care community housing options, making it difficult on staff that are required to carry out their directives.
The conversation in this episode reflects the very concerns that so many have been voicing for so long—concerns about the need for a thoughtful, community-driven approach to homelessness. This is why collaboration, compassion, and real solutions matter.
Also, in this episode of Our Community, Our Mission, we sit down with Kaleb Chockley, TRM Board Member and Topeka firefighter, to discuss his transformative journey from burnout to renewed purpose. Kaleb shares his experiences responding to 911 calls for the unsheltered in central Topeka, the struggles of compassion fatigue, and how faith reshaped his perspective.
With raw honesty, Kaleb reflects on the struggle many Christians face in truly stepping into opportunities to love others. He challenges believers to move beyond easy answers and embrace the complexity of homelessness with humility, grace, and an open heart. He reminds us that the same mercy available to us is available to everyone, and no matter our position, we are called to lead boldly in faith and love others as God does.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Dear Heavenly Father, we thank you, lord, for this
day and this time, lord, to justcome together and have a
conversation, lord, about theincredible people that partner
with the Topeka Rescue Mission.
Lord, I pray your blessing overthis time and, lord, that ears
that would hear would beencouraged in one way or another
.
Lord, we just thank you and wepraise your name.
Amen.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hello everybody, Thank you for joining us.
Another edition of OurCommunity, Our Mission, a
podcast of the Topeka RescueMission.
I'm your host today, BarryFeeker.
It's Wednesday, March the 5th2025.
This is episode number 258.
I'm here this morning withLaManda Cunningham, CEO of
Topeka Rescue Mission.
Good morning, LaManda.
Good morning, how are you?
Speaker 3 (00:43):
I'm good.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
There's a lot going on in Topeka right now isn't
there.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
There is, I think there always is, though I'm not
sure what we do if we ever havea podcast where we're like, yeah
, there's not really a lot goingon.
Probably not.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Yeah, I don't think so.
Not going to happen in yourworld.
That's Some really importantupdates and then a really cool
guest that we have today, but wewant to talk about the research
and development department'shard work that they put into
every single week trying to findout what's really important
about today.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
You lay it on thick.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
sometimes I do I really do, and so Josh is down
here with research anddevelopment.
I always like to give credit toIsaiah though.
Yeah, that's right, Just incase it's kind of goofy.
So anyway, I know many of youtune in to be able to hear
what's important about WednesdayMarch the 5th.
Well, one thing is reallyimportant is Ash Wednesday, and
so Ash Wednesday, as many peopleknow, is the six weeks before
(01:34):
Easter that people then begin toget prepared for celebrating
the resurrection of Jesus Christ, and so that's a very, very
important and serious time torecognize, and so some people
are beginning to go intosacrificing and fasting and
getting ready just to be able tobe grateful for that holy day.
(01:56):
But there's also a couple ofother days that I wasn't aware
of until the very importantresearch and development
department of Tepica rescuemission.
It's real film day, and it'snot R E A L, it's R E E L.
You knew about that, didn't you?
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Because you're sure you're movie buff right.
Yeah, I woke up this morning Isaid, man, I can't wait to
celebrate real day.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Yeah, really, I mean, it's this, this, knowing about
this.
It's always celebrated on March, the 5th um celebrated in the U
?
S with the film screenings andshowcasing events organized by
the independent cinemas acrossthe country.
Don't they have enough awardstuff that they do?
I mean the Grammys, the I don'tknow if they, I don't know the
Oscars, what they'd have herethe other night, something with
a bunch of people hugging eachother, you know, and getting
(02:38):
awards and mad and dressing.
Really weird and so, but anyway, real film day.
R-e-e-l.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
Uh-huh, do you like movies?
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Uh-huh, I've never heard you talk about movies,
yeah.
Yeah, well, we could talk aboutmovies, I know.
So I wonder if our guests cancome back next week.
That's right.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Let's not.
Let's not and say we did.
I do like the movies.
I like them in color too.
You are the only one thatremembers them before they were.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Was freaky in black and white.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
I want to tell you that's true.
Traumatized as a kid, thosecrazy monkeys.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
One more thing from our research in the Bell
department learn what your namemeans.
Day Today, on the 5th of March,this is a day that you should
learn what your name means.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Amanda, what's your name mean?
I have absolutely no clue.
Oh, I have some clues, the brat.
Yeah, I don't know.
You know, in the eightiesAmanda was extremely popular
Amanda, and then Chris for a boy, and so my mom liked the name
Amanda and then somehow ended upknowing someone else and that
(03:50):
person had like a babysitter orsomething named LaManda and it
stuck with my mind.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
So you were actually named Manda to start with, and
then they meant this Frenchperson to go LaManda.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
So now it's the Amanda, I guess.
I don't know, but I don't knowwhat it means.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
A quick Google search LaManda is likely a variation
of the name Manda, which,depending on the context, can
mean lovable or promise.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Oh, that's exactly how I describe myself.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Well, you have a better day.
I know what's going to happenevery March 5th now.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Unlovable day.
Unlovable day.
Yeah, so do you know what Barrymeans?
I could maybe have some guesses.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
No, go ahead, we're going to move on, we're going to
move on.
So it's two things Uh-huhCourage, and the other is water
bearer.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
Water bearer yeah, so you need a drink, okay, I got a
bottle of water right here, sowe're good.
I knew we could always count onyou.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
So now that we set the stage for important things
that we like to talk about, laManda, we've had a lot of
activity going on that you'vebeen involved in, a number of
other people have been involvedin, in regards to the homeless,
which is no surprise, but therehas been some continuation of
(05:00):
cleaning homeless camps.
We talked pretty extensivelyand took a deep dive on that
last podcast, but this week someof those camps are being
cleared.
There was also a very importantpress conference this week with
Topeka Jump in regards to theAffordable Housing Trust Fund
and some commitments.
It appears to be at the citycouncil level to go ahead and
find ways to utilize the milliondollars in the trust fund to be
(05:23):
able to create some affordablehousing in our community.
So a lot going on.
People are talking all over thecommunity about this issue, but
what about the camps?
What's been happening?
How?
There has been some need forcontinued communications between
the rescue mission and the cityof Topeka on these things.
Not everything is pretty atthis point, but camps are
getting cleared.
(05:44):
What's the latest?
Speaker 3 (05:46):
Man, I feel like we should to devote a whole podcast
to just that right.
But kind of in a nutshell, youknow, a couple of years ago in
September, city council kind offollowed suit of the county of
putting some ordinances in place.
Particularly county looked atit from a trails perspective.
Mostly city then did the samething.
(06:09):
And so you know, I think it'simportant to say that myself as
CEO, but also TRM as a whole, wehave never said that our city
shouldn't have an ordinance.
We've never said that, you know, we shouldn't have some safety
parameters in place.
Those, those are valued.
What I as the CEO, and what wehave TRM, have repeatedly said
(06:31):
is can we do this verysystematically and logically by
a couple of different examples,other communities who have done
it well, also other communitieswho have not done it well.
Looking back, you know severalyears ago, when you all embarked
on needing to do this for TentCity and how that was done, with
a lot of partnerships and over,you know, 12 months, and so
(06:53):
unfortunately, that request tonot put the cart before the
horse just has continued.
And you know I've been askedhere lately are you going to the
county about this?
Well, I do think the county hasa part in this right.
They're also our government andthe city of Topeka lies within
the county, so I get it, but theother side is what's mostly
(07:16):
impacting TRM right now arethese encampment cleanups that
are being done by the city ofTopeka, not the county.
So, that being said, there'sreally just been this consistent
request on our behalf to cityleadership, and let me let me
explain here and I'm not tryingto sound more pointed, but I do
(07:37):
want to be very clear we,meaning our community, have
incredible boots on the ground,teams made up of everywhere.
So you've got incredible bootson the ground, people from Code
Compliance.
You've got incredible peopleboots on the ground from EAS.
You've got incredible boots onthe ground people from our
outreach team Vallejo, tbd'sBehavioral Health Unit, outreach
(08:00):
all of those things right,reach, all of those things right
.
These are teams who doincredible work together, but
also are trying to be asrespectful to the ordinance and
do things accordingly.
But it's also hard becausethere are decision makers making
decisions and none of thosedecision makers are here when
(08:20):
these enforcements are done.
None of them.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Not boots on the ground, are they?
Speaker 3 (08:24):
And yet the boots on the ground, people are the ones
that are having to face ourneighbors and be, on one hand,
gaining trust for weeks andmonths, and sometimes years,
right To get to know their story, to walk with them as they're
waiting on the EAS waiting list,to walk through them, through
possible relapses, or walkingthem through job applications.
(08:44):
All of those things and thosethings take time.
And then, in the midst of this,we have not put any type of
continuum of care, housingoptions in place.
We've not added anything, we'venot taken a risk to say, hey,
let's do a low barrier shelter,or let's do some tiny home
pilots, let's do a designatedcamping area.
(09:06):
None of that's been done.
So we've continued thesecleanups.
Because of what?
Decision makers have continuedto be vocal and wanting,
enforced, saying that's whattheir constituents want.
Well, I don't.
I don't wake up every day andsay, man, I can't wait to see
what strife I cause, but Iabsolutely am called by the Lord
to be a voice for those thatare not being heard.
(09:28):
And right now we have a lot ofpeople in our community that are
starting to speak up to say,hey, we know people are saying
they don't like the trash.
We know people don't like this,that and the other, but we're
here to say we don't like all ofthis enforcement.
That's happening with no optionother than relocating people.
So that's kind of where we'reat right now is it's it's pretty
(09:51):
strenuous, but I'm also hopeful.
Barry, you know historicallywhat we've had.
It's not been consistent, butat times we, as in social
service providers, have hadabout a 30-day notice.
It comes down from someleadership in the city of Topeka
(10:11):
goes to the behavioral healthunit.
They let us know 30-day noticeon what?
That a specific encampment isgoing to be cleaned up.
What happened with this one andwhy I was very concerned from a
public safety viewpoint butalso the dignity of our folks,
was because we did not receive aspecific date at all formally
(10:36):
until last Thursday that thiswas going to occur on Monday and
equipment was coming Tuesday.
So we're talking a five daynotice.
Now to back that up, I found outinformally from a Facebook post
of council leadership and to meit's not professional when
we're all working together andit is on the livelihoods of
(10:57):
people.
We need to follow that process.
So I started digging deep toknow is this social media
informal post?
Is that really our trigger, asall the social service agencies,
to be doing this?
And why did we not have the 30day notice?
And this is the last phase,meaning there's now nowhere for
(11:19):
people to go.
So anywhere they relocate isgoing to be illegal or it's
going to be unsafe for ourneighborhoods, because they're
coming into our neighborhoodsNot that they're bad people, not
that they're there but now theyhave no resources, no place to
call home and there's nowherefor them to go.
So the reason why this one gotcontroversial is when I started
questioning that, it was well,you knew this phase was coming,
(11:44):
correct.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
But when we're talking with people, Someday,
but didn't know when the daywould be, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
And then the problem with this is, you know, in
December, when we start kind ofhearing these rumors and that
there's communications that moreis coming, if we started doing
something, then people that arein the midst of trauma,
regardless of what the trauma is, they can't think through 90
days or 75 days.
(12:12):
And then if we would haveoutreached in December the cold
weather, all of that when theystarted first saying they were
going to do this, then you havetransition, you have people that
leave, are in and out, and sothat's why this kind of what I'm
going to call a sweet spot ofthe 30 days is that's a way that
your social service agents cantruly go out and outreach and
(12:35):
connect to resources.
But the other side of it isthat's also how we're able to
logically say these resourceshave been offered or these
resources we don't have, like,let's really call a spade a
spade, and then we're able tosay if there were resources,
people did not take them.
Well, that's when you'veexhausted right the humanity
(12:58):
piece, the compassionate piece,and then it really is okay, we
have to move to citations,because we do have to have
cleanliness and all of that.
But you would have providedoptions.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
Correct Before citation yes, and that didn't
happen.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
No, and so then the other predicament, now that
we're in, is this is the lastcleanup, and so they're still
doing cleanups.
And then, two weeks ago, theychose to strengthen the
ordinance, and the same argumentthat I'm saying now that I said
back before they did this insummer of 23, was we have no
(13:35):
options If we issue thisbeautiful statement of nope.
We've had outreach teams outthere connecting them to
resources.
Well, we're connecting them toresources, not housing options.
So we have people on the EASwait list Well, that's great,
we've put them on the wait list.
Speaker 2 (13:55):
We're on a wait list.
They're on a wait list.
That's not housing, and theycould go to mobile access
partnership get a shower, get ameal, those kind of things,
that's a resource.
Get a meal, those kinds ofthings, that's a resource.
But then they go where?
After they leave there, they'rein the TRMs full, and so there
is no housing option here.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
Right.
And there's this.
You know I'm going to I don'tknow people's hearts, right?
So I'm just going to say maybeit's just a misconception that
TRM is just against this or thatwe're not working with cleanups
.
That is not accurate.
My team, every time when we havethe 30 day notice, my shelter
directors go out, on the UTV orthe trucks, depending on where
(14:33):
the encampment cleanups are.
They go out, they interface,regardless if it's two
individuals or 22.
And we talk to them about dothey have a restriction at the
shelter?
If so, we will automaticallylift it.
Do they want to come in?
Can they come in?
But then there's limitationsthere, whether it's the person's
cognitive ability at that time,whether it's the fact that
(14:54):
we're going over variants, butwe're doing that because we
realize they have no place to go.
Animals, which is not somethingthat insurance, wise, liability
and all of that I can't allowanimals in.
There's a lot of obstaclesthere.
But our team goes out and doesthis and we come back and we
report to other boots on theground hey, we have done our
part, we've tried to connectthem.
(15:15):
They either couldn't accept itor they're not ready for that,
those kinds of things.
And then we recognize thatthere's, you know, struggles,
then whatever, whatever's next,and we walk through that.
So we are all about the processwhen it is truly people
centered.
But we cannot be a part of stuffwhen we continue to do the
(15:37):
cleanups and there's nowhere togo and then we talk so poorly
about people because now they'reon Wanamaker, they're behind
Menards, they're off of 21stStreet.
Well, that's for two reasons,barry.
One you said it four or fiveyears ago now the national trend
is increasing.
You also went before counciland other people and explaining
(15:58):
and in that is also a grayinghomeless the age is increasing.
You've done all that.
I've said it since I took overafter you.
The other side of it is I needlisteners to know if you are
seeing homelessness now in yourarea and you haven't before, it
is absolutely because of theordinance and the fact that, not
the ordinance alone, but thefact that we did not have
housing options in place beforedoing the movements.
(16:23):
So, all of that being said, myheart as CEO stands the same.
We still have the power tochange it.
Now I don't want to continue totalk about what's been done.
I want us to look at this andgo okay, so it could have been
done differently.
We can't go back now.
But let's really make thisright.
As leaders moving forward andmyself when I'm talking about
(16:46):
myself and other leaders in thecommunity, including council,
commissioners, city manager,mayor, whoever leadership we
want to talk about I still standfirm, ready to partner with
them and listen to their points,understand their questions and
their concerns.
I'll give them my expertisethat I have for moving forward.
The other side of it is I willnot be muted for this cause, and
(17:13):
that is not me trying to beberating, that's not me trying
to be disrespectful.
It's also not me trying tocause division.
But if we don't moving forward,do things differently again,
not your boots on the ground.
People they're truly, they aresome incredible people right now
(17:35):
.
So I'm not talking that.
I'm talking myself and othercity leadership that have
decisions, that have the powerto make decisions and we are
entrusted, and if we are goingto use our power in a way that
harms people, I want no part ofit.
Now, if we are at a differentplace and I'm hopeful, I'm very
hopeful with our city manager wewant to be supportive of that,
(17:57):
that moving forward.
Before we do more encampmentcleanups, we should all be
coming together and take a riskof what housing options do we
want to start making for ourcommunity?
That's needed and I'm hopefulthat that's going to happen and
we'll do that, walking inexcitement and anticipatory, you
know, thoughts of like, heylook what we can do, we can be
an example.
(18:18):
But the other side of it is ifwe, if that does not come to
fruition and we continue to dothese things where we can just
say, well, we have the authorityto do it and we're doing it TRM
does not want to be a part ofthat because it's not right.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
You know, to many people.
They're beginning to take areal look at this and ask the
legitimate question what sensedoes it make to move people out
of one place with no place forthem to go?
I mean, it's a little bit ofcommon sense there that they
don't just disappear, they don'tjust get better, they don't
just go away.
And so you've described it.
They can be in variousdifferent places, which they
(18:52):
already are starting to be inthose various different places,
and it didn't solve the problem.
And so common sense would saylet's come together, let's do
clean up our city, let's do helppeople to move into something
better, but that takes some time.
Yes.
And that doesn't happenovernight, when your shelter's
full and there's no other placeto go.
(19:13):
Then what you've done is you'vetraded one problem for another,
and there's some humansuffering in the process of that
.
So, lamanda, yeah, I think thatpeople are hearing you say what
you're saying.
You're not just playing it,nice, but you're being nice.
You're just trying to say let'sdo this together, let's do some
common sense here and let'sfind ways for solutions.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
And you know we have a lot of listeners that are
passionate right now, and youknow I think that you know we
see some of the things on theKSNT threads or the WIBW threads
the KSNT threads or the WIBWthreads and there is everything
from very mean comments aboutindividuals experiencing
homelessness, and then we havethe other side of it.
(19:52):
That is why are we doing this.
Why are we doing this withoutplaces to go?
We have people that are beingmore vulnerable now saying, hey,
that used to be me.
This isn't okay.
I just read through several thismorning and I thought are we
giving and again decision makersvoice to the people who are
saying, hey, we don't want thisdone that way?
(20:13):
And I don't think we are.
I think we're listening to theconstituents who have said this,
this and this, and the nimbyismnot in my backyard.
And so my, my advice tolisteners that are like hey, we
are not for what's being done tothese people Um, you have every
right to communicate that.
I just ask that we do thatrespectfully.
(20:34):
We don't have to act like otherpeople do when they are, um,
belittling our people or withwith cuss words and ugliness.
We don't have to do that, butyou can absolutely share your
concerns with leadership.
You can bring them to me and Ican connect you to the right
people too, because ourcommunity should be moving
(20:55):
forward, tackling the concernsof homelessness with the right
voice and not negative peoplewho speak the loudest.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
There's been many situations in every community,
including this one, that thingsgot very uncomfortable.
People didn't always make theright decisions, but people came
together to make a betterdecision.
That's one evidence is you havea Topeka rescue mission in
Topeka.
That wasn't always here and itwasn't always like it is today,
because things had to getuncomfortable before we got
(21:23):
comfortable with doing thingsbetter.
And that's where we are again.
So well, amanda, there's, asyou said, we could do a whole
podcast on this, which we didlast week, so there's going to
be more on this, but it'simportant that people get an
update, and so thank you forthat.
Story's not over.
We're still going to be movingforward for better solutions
than this one and, in theprocess, we pray for those who
(21:45):
are making decisions, that theymake the right ones, and we pray
for those who are beingaffected by those decisions,
because it could be very, very,very, very unfortunate for them.
So, lamanda, we're going toswitch gears now and talk about
Topeka Rescue Mission inparticular, and one of the
things that, for nearly threeyears now, you have been working
with a board of directors whichis not just a rubber stamp.
(22:06):
Here you go, lamanda, go for it.
That was the way it was when Iwas here.
They just rubber stampedeverything you know.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
So.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
I've never had an issue, not, so.
These are important people foryou to be able to share your
vision with, to share just likewhat you shared with us, and
then come up with a officialdecision from that governing
body about what's to be done.
So, um, amanda, talk about, uh,the importance of the board to
you and, uh, what you've learnedin this last three years.
Speaker 3 (22:35):
So you know, I think the um, the easiest way to say
is I have eight bosses, right,Um and so sometimes it's hard
enough to have one, but thenwhen you multiply that by a lot,
it could be something that'shard.
However, I am truly blessed byquote unquote my bosses, and not
(22:59):
because everything is, you know, always doves and peace, but I
have board members that theircharacters outside of these
board meetings are stellar.
They are authentic.
They are people who have beenborn again and understand that,
(23:20):
and for the most part, theyrelate so much to our cause,
those we serve, the struggle,all of that.
And so I love how reflectiveour board is, because sometimes
the ideas or even the strugglesthat we're facing, I never have
to worry about bringing it tothe board and go, man, they're
(23:40):
not going to understand this orthey're not going to be able to
relate to this because theirhearts are so driven by what we
do.
And so it's been a learningcurve for me, and it still is.
I just told them one or twoboard meetings ago I'm like I'm
still new at this.
I'm trying to figure out whatyou guys want to know, what you
just trust me to lead, and allof that.
(24:01):
So we have some growing painsevery now and then where I'm
like I'm probably telling themway too, much and they're just
like we trust you do your job.
And then the other thing is I'malways like, oh shoot, I forgot
to tell them that and how did Iforget to tell them that?
So you know, it's this dancethat we learn.
But I, honestly, am so thankfulfor my board, and I'm what I'm
(24:23):
most thankful for is they're notjust a yes board.
They ask me questions, theywant to know.
Sometimes we table things topray in process and I appreciate
just the genuineness of ourboard members.
But I think I also need to behonest and say we all joke that
every time we leave a boardmeeting we all need ibuprofen
(24:43):
because it's a lot right, butthey're great people.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Yeah, well, speaking of eight bosses, one of them is
here today, your newest boardmember, caleb Chalkley.
Welcome to our podcast heretoday.
Our community, our mission.
Thanks for having me.
So, yeah, thank you for waitingon all this for us to unpack,
(25:06):
to get to you today.
Caleb, you know I woke up thismorning getting out of bed
feeling kind of old.
That's what happens, but Ireally feel old now after
getting a chance.
I met you a couple of monthsago at the Night of Praise,
briefly, and I got to thinkingabout your name, chalkley, and I
asked you the question today,do you know a Jeff Chalkley?
And you said yeah, that's mydad.
And I mentioned an Angie andthat's your aunt, and I was
their youth pastor, your dad'syouth pastor, amanda.
(25:29):
You kind of kid me all the time.
I do.
I told you, yeah, I'm an oldgoat or something like that.
So here we got this kid overhere.
He's a board member at SpeakerRescue Mission and I was his dad
and his aunt's youth pastor.
Now, keep in mind, I was a kidmyself at the time of 20, 21
years old, okay so anyway, I'llstay a kid, that's right, Caleb,
(25:54):
welcome again to this program.
You you're a new board member.
I want to talk about that, butyou're also the Topeka fire
department firefighter, and sohow long have you been on the
Topeka fire department?
Speaker 4 (26:01):
I've been at TFD since 2020, pretty much right in
the heat of COVID, I think itwas April was my hire date.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
Oh yeah, but that wasn't your first service in
firefighting.
You also served somewhere elsebefore that.
Speaker 4 (26:14):
Yep, I started the whole career in 2014 at Silver
Lake Fire as a volunteer slashpart-time guy and then, after I
got my EMT, I worked on anambulance for five years and a
mix between Riley County andPotts County.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
So you are kind of a local kid, so to speak, and
you're a Silver Lake Eaglegraduate Eagles and that's a
pretty big rivalry Rossville,silver Lake, the whole thing
there.
So we'll get into that rightnow, but anyway, so you came on
in 2020.
Pandemic came over to Topeka.
You've been serving here sincethat time, which we appreciate.
(26:53):
The fire department I meangoodness, their first response
between AMR fire departmentcoming in.
Sometimes one gets here beforethe other, but that's always a
joint effort, whether it's inshelter, on the streets or
whatever.
And and so, um, caleb, um, howdid you find out about Topeka
rescue mission?
Um, and then what, uh, what gotyou directed towards being a
(27:16):
board member?
Speaker 4 (27:17):
Oh man.
So to start, I'm going to starta ways back, okay, so obviously
Can't go too far back.
Right.
So obviously I knew that TopekaRescue Mission was here since I
was a child.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
My pastor when I was growing up worked at DRM for a
while.
Darren Johnson pastor.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Silver Lake Baptist.
Yep, yep.
So I heard about it, knew aboutit, but when I got on the fire
department, the city of Zbika,as you know, is very, very busy,
right.
So I think last year we hadmaybe 27,000 calls, wow.
So there comes a point, orthere came a point for me as a
(27:57):
Christian, where I had burnoutfor I don't want to say for the
job, but to be blunthomelessness, burnout about
homelessness, burnout forrunning calls, running calls for
homelessness.
So at the time I was working inCentral Topeka at Station 4, and
(28:21):
, man, I could just you get wokeup in the middle of the night
for your sixth call or whatever,and it's something that I don't
see as an emergency, and so I'mimmediately bitter, I get in
the truck, I'm mad the whole waythere.
I get there, I have to care forthis person with compassion,
while I not an ounce of me, ifI'm being honest wants to.
(29:02):
So I could feel that and again,as a Christian, I knew
wholeheartedly every singleperson I deal with in my line of
work, or any line of work, ismade in the image of God,
deserving of love, respect,compassion.
And it just kind of hit a wallwhere I was like, dude, I'm like
an angry person for selfishreasons, like for essentially
having to do my job right, butso I kind of just there was a
lot of stuff that happened allat once, but one of the first
(29:23):
things that happened was I juststarted praying.
I would say for months I wasjust praying for eyes to see
people the way God sees them anda heart to break for what
breaks is.
And while I was doing that, Ialso started reading one proverb
every day.
I don't remember who turned meon to it, but there's 31.
(29:44):
So it's perfect to just gothrough a month reading a
proverb every day and, man, Iwas like mind blown immediately
with just how much there is inProverbs about serving the poor
or the less fortunate, and oneverse that hit me in particular
I think you have your Bible openLike Proverbs 21.
(30:07):
You're not going to believe it,but I'm in Proverbs 21, 13, I
think, is what it is.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
What a coincidence.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
Because I had something I wanted to share, and
I never do that but 21, 13.
The one who shuts his ears tothe cry of the poor will himself
also call out and not beanswered.
Speaker 4 (30:25):
Yeah, so I read that Okay.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
And I'm like oh right , yeah, richard, yeah, so I read
that.
Speaker 4 (30:28):
Okay, and I'm like right and so, um, those are not
my words, right.
Right, that's, that's the textspeaking, not me.
So it hit me really hard.
And then one of the things thatreally hit me the hardest, that
I would say kind of changed mywhole view on homelessness, was
I think it was springtimebecause it was super cold, but
(30:50):
not cold enough to snow.
It was raining and we ran acall for like a spider bite or
something.
And again, every day I'm stillpraying these same prayers and
we ran this call for a spiderbite.
We get to this house, lady runsout out.
She's like it's not me, it'sover there by the dumpster.
(31:12):
So we go to the dumpster andthere's a guy laying under a
tarp soaking wet and he'sscreaming in pain.
And the first thing I notice isthat he's screaming for his mom
.
This guy's probably mid-60s and, uh, I don't know, maybe
weighed 70 pounds, like he wasin rough, rough shape, and he
(31:33):
was crying for his momcontinuously.
That's all.
He hardly would answer aquestion because he's just
screaming.
And I'm like man, this dude isin one of the lowest places one
could be and his single instinctis to cry for his mom like a,
like a motherly.
He's longing for a motherlylove, right, and so, while
(32:00):
sitting there talking to him, itwas a situation where we were
waiting on amr for a very longtime, um, and we're kind of our
hands are kind of tied at thatpoint, right like we can't.
We can't transport, but you'renot medevac and so sitting there
in the cold I don't want to bein the cold either so I'm like
this dude must be.
I mean again, he just won'tstop screaming, won't stop
(32:22):
screaming, soaking wet.
And after it caught my eye thatthis guy is crying for his mom
at 60-something years old.
He has obviously no shelter.
He's got a tarp that's doingnothing for him.
He's laying in a puddle.
Essentially he had like a canof beans or something, maybe
(32:43):
with a knife, that he had triedto open, pretty unsuccessfully.
He's hungry and can't get tothe food.
And then next to that was aporn magazine.
And I remember thinking just howevident for me, how evident the
(33:06):
battle of the spiritual realm.
I guess this guy, who manypeople would say has nothing, is
that pretty much the lowestspot a human could be and crying
for his mom still has satan,still has this grip on him like
no food, no shelter, this gripon him Like no food, no shelter.
(33:28):
Yet this bondage is still justclinging and I was like wrecked
and I remember tearing up on thecall, which is insane.
I mean I've run thousands ofcalls over the last 10 years and
many really horrible horrormovie type things, and I've
never teared up on a call likethis and I remember immediately
(33:50):
being like God, do not answerthis prayer, like this Cause
that's what it was.
I was like oh, this is God'slike.
Oh yeah, you know that you,that prayer you've been asking.
Here it is, buddy, here it is.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
But not right now, not this way.
I don't have time to be crying.
Speaker 4 (34:02):
I don't do this, and so that was like the kickstart
for me and I just keptnavigating through the Proverbs
and I read a book at the timecalled Under the Overpass, by
something Yankowski I think.
Yeah, I read him, great bookand some of the most alarming.
(34:25):
Essentially, the story of thebook is this guy wanted to bring
awareness to homelessness andessentially started living on
the street.
He did have kind of a board ofpeople that would like pray for
him.
Him and another guy did this.
He went out and hit the streetsyeah, went to the underpasses.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 4 (34:42):
Yep, essentially a social experiment, and some of
the most alarming things in thatbook was how he was treated not
by people but by the church.
That's right.
And um, romans talks about hownobody's without excuse right
when it comes to God.
And um, I think, in the realmof loving people, it is insane
(35:09):
to see how many of us Christianspunt on it.
We're offered opportunitiesevery single day that God places
in front of our face to lovethe person next to us, whether
it's a homeless guy or the guyat the grocery store, whatever,
and we punt.
And this is me, this is justthe church as a whole and and I
(35:31):
remember obviously I'm notsaying everybody like people do
awesome at this.
We have people like lamanda inthe world that are just rock
stars, but I just these thingswere just hitting me like bricks
and every single time I waslike thanks God.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
Like well, why are we doing this?
I was better off when I was mad.
Speaker 4 (35:51):
That's right, and so I I kind of changed my tone from
being burnout to you know what.
God's given me theseopportunities, rather than being
mad every single time I run acall for a homeless person or a
brush fire, because I worked atstation two for a while, which
is one of the two brush trucksin the city, so we'd go put out
(36:17):
campfires quite a bit.
That a lot of them, never mindthat we I just changed my
perspective of how I saw thesituation.
Rather than feeling the burnout, seeing it as an opportunity to
like just see that person, evenif it's literally eye contact,
(36:37):
I feel like is an insane.
Speaker 2 (36:40):
Kayla, what was frustrating you about them
before you had this kind of Justselfishness Battle yourself?
Encounter of just selfishnessbattle yourself encounter.
I mean, were you like the guythat, um, that was crying for
his mom and and, uh, before thisencounter that God was kind of
having you you go through to toget you where you are today?
(37:01):
What would?
What was frustrating you aboutthis?
I mean, cause I think this iswhere a lot of people probably
are.
They're frustrated with whatthey see.
You were right there amongstthem.
You're here in fire station,you're a job, and I think this
is what kind of goes into how Ifound out about the board.
Speaker 4 (37:36):
But I was telling Greg Armbruster I mean he's the
vice president of the boardabout.
I think homelessness is one ofthe most complex problems in our
society that we continuouslythrow the most simplistic
answers at.
Speaker 2 (37:55):
That's well put.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
And so get a job is a very common, simplistic answer,
right, but okay, how manyvariables have to line up
perfectly for somebody to get ajob?
okay, how many variables have toline up perfectly for somebody
to get a job.
First of all, I have no ideathe person I'm screaming at to
(38:19):
get a job.
Where is their mental capacityat?
Chances are there's plenty ofhomeless people who the issue is
so deep that a job isn't evenin the conversation yet.
Like the thought of a career isinsane.
Um, so for me, that's justwhere my that's I guess that
would have been.
My irritation was like thesepeople are just so like just go
(38:44):
get a job and we wouldn't behere, and so I guess, to answer
your question in a longroundabout way, that would be.
That would be.
It is that I was justoversimplified.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
A very complex situation is what we, what we
tend to do when we don'tunderstand what we're looking at
Exactly, so we get frustratedwith it because it doesn't
change, it doesn't fix itself.
You can't ordinance your wayout of this, you can't hope your
way out of this, you can't bemad your way out of this as a
community.
So we have to take a deep dive.
But it sounds like for you,because of your faith, because
(39:18):
of your relationship with Christ, this wasn't something that was
probably going to comenaturally.
Something happened with you, asyou are kind of coming under
conviction to some degree.
Oh, no doubt.
And like maybe I need to lookat this a little bit differently
.
And was it that night thatthings started really gelling,
with the man who was crying andasking for his mom and that
battle?
Did that really begin thetrajectory you're on now?
Speaker 4 (39:41):
Yeah, I think that was.
There was definitely a switchflipped that night and I
remember asking that guy wellwhy don't you just go to the
mission, like there's a greatresource?
And he said that.
I think he said he had a sexcrime at the time, which I
didn't know what that was, andhe could have peed in public.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
Right, you just never know, or whatever the case is,
they could look very different.
Speaker 4 (40:04):
So the switch flipped for sure at that time.
The switch flipped for sure atthat time, and then just
continuous prayer of God justbeing like, yeah, man, like, I
guess, just almost convictionsbeing answered or like ideas
that I already had or, somewhatin the depth of my soul, thought
(40:27):
or believed God was justconfirming them.
Speaker 3 (40:30):
For me it's time to think differently.
These are humans.
Speaker 4 (40:35):
Yes, show and tell with a lot of show.
Now, exactly, and I don'tremember what I was going to say
.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
Well, thank you for sharing that.
I mean, that's so transparentand I think that there are many
people who are part of what'scalled the body of Christ.
You were raised in church.
You've been around this a lot.
You exposed to the Bible, youexposed to church.
I'm sure that you have heardMatthew 25 over and over and
over again, and on and on and on, and it was the first time you
(41:04):
ever heard a proverb before, butit was really clicking with you
right now because you were kindof forced into dealing with it.
Yep, you're going to deal withit one way or the other.
You're going to deal with itthe way you had been dealing
with it, by frustration, oryou're going to say God, how do
I look at this frustrationdifferently?
How do I see this frustration?
And you chose to be vulnerablebefore the Lord?
Yeah, and he made you realvulnerable, yeah.
Speaker 4 (41:25):
Yeah, yeah.
I could choose to be bitterevery single day for the rest of
my life if I wanted to, butthat's not going to fix anything
.
That wasn't working for you,was it yeah?
Speaker 2 (41:32):
And so I think, LaManda, I think a lot of people
what they do is that, just likeCaleb was, get a job, get over
it, get out of my way is thatthat's an easy path to take on
this, and so, by and large,they'll call a council member,
whatever, and get them out of myway.
I don't want to see it anymoreand it doesn't get out of the
way it doesn't.
And so, as a community, justlike Caleb not just like Caleb,
(41:56):
because he's definitely on thefront lines of this, but we're
being faced and forced to dealwith this in a way that isn't
going away and is making useither better or bitter in this
regard, and so there's such aspotlight on this.
Well, Caleb, you came on theboard.
Was that part of?
(42:18):
I want to know more, I want toserve more?
What was the reason for sayingyes to Topeka Rescue Mission
Board?
Speaker 4 (42:23):
Yeah, a combination.
I don't remember.
I was in a Bible study withGreg Armbruster, like I
mentioned, and we were eating atHanover Pancake House and
somehow homelessness got broughtup and I went on a hardcore
rant about how I think it'sinsane, how it's kind of what I
just said.
We just think that there's somany quick fixes for this
(42:45):
massive issue.
And he said you sound likeyou'd be a good fit for the
board.
And I, who really understoodthe gospel in 2018, up until
that point, I had read one bookin my entire life so he said you
sound like a good fit for theboard.
And I said first of all, Idon't know what a board is.
(43:06):
Second of all, he also I thinkhe said the name.
I think he used the worddirectors too.
So, board of directors and I'mlike if you mentioned that to
any of my teachers in the past,they'd have a stroke and I'm
like I don't know what thatmeans, but sure.
And so he connected me withLamanda.
I met with her, kind of sharedmy heart and she opened my eyes
(43:31):
to so many things that themission does that nobody knows
about, and that's one awesomething that's been cool for me to
take to work is talking aboutum, the career readiness program
for example, or yes, orrehousing, like these things are
not the things.
For whatever reason, we love badnews and so, for whatever
(43:52):
reason these things aren'tpreached about the rescue
mission, like for whateverreason you can talk about the
hundreds of insanetransformations and fresh starts
that people have, and forwhatever reason, they get bypass
and then we focus on the nextproblem.
(44:13):
Yeah, and so until we get sickand tired of the next problem.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
Yeah, exactly, then we'll find another one, like
somebody did.
Speaker 4 (44:20):
So, uh, talked with her and she invited me to a
board meeting and she pitched itas you're just going to come
kind of tell these people yourshare, your testimony, tell them
why you want to be here, and Iwas like cool, didn't think
anything of it day of show up tothe meeting.
There's cops in the room, soI'm like great what are we doing
(44:41):
in my defense?
I didn't know about that parteither but no, then LaManda's
presented with an award andeverybody's crying and I'm like
man, I got to follow this.
I'm like this is brutal.
And then LaManda says so I toldCaleb I'm going to give him
like 20 to 30 minutes to shareand I'm like I am not prepared
(45:02):
for this at all.
I'm expecting like a two minute.
My name's Caleb, hey type ofthing.
Speaker 3 (45:08):
And I set him right next to me.
I was like you're going to dofine.
I'm right here, within reachingdistance.
Speaker 4 (45:14):
Yeah, it was wild times.
How long has that been now?
Oh gosh, I don't know.
A few months.
It's really funny.
Speaker 3 (45:21):
I don't even the end of last summer.
Speaker 2 (45:25):
So I know you were on board a night of praise,
however long ago that's beenbefore that, yeah.
Speaker 3 (45:29):
I think it was July.
That sounds right.
I think it was July and metwith them the month before.
Yeah, yeah that sounds right.
Speaker 2 (45:37):
Yeah, so two questions, one for you, one for
Lamont.
What have you learned sinceyou've been in this position on
the board, which your teacherswould have never pictured you
doing?
What have you learned?
Speaker 4 (45:53):
What's different about Caleb Chalkley today?
So what I've learned?
That's a really big, broadquestion because in however many
months that's been, it's kindof like drinking out of a fire
hose.
I still go into meetings andI'm like what is that?
I think you might know whatthat would mean.
I like write down cause I got acheck with the man.
Speaker 2 (46:15):
It's like drinking out of a fire hose.
That's a.
Speaker 3 (46:17):
I'm like it's okay, fred, I got your back, Just ask
the question, it's okay.
Speaker 2 (46:21):
So you're still, it's still a big learning curve.
Speaker 4 (46:23):
Yeah, but I think the biggest things is just how
massive the mission really isand it's a well-oiled machine
and people might disagree withthat, but it's the people that
see the things that they want tosee.
For example, the problems.
It's the ones who want to ignoreor look into absolutely nothing
(46:45):
on the amazing things that havehappened, that continue to
happen, and reconnected with afamily member from however many
(47:09):
years ago, or somebody that Godtransformed years and years and
years go by through the missionthat now has this awesome
success story I guess, for lackof a better term and so I think
just learning just how importantthe mission is has been a huge
thing and just how I mean it's Ican't describe how big it is.
Speaker 2 (47:35):
So your your prayer to the Lord.
He begins to open your eyes.
You're in a strategic place onthe ground seeing these
situations.
He touches your heart in a waythat you probably weren't too
cool with.
But you're here now.
What do you think God is doingwith you?
Not only going from a streetexperience that you had that
(47:55):
began to change your directionto being where you are on TRM
board.
What does that say about God inyour life?
Speaker 4 (48:05):
That he's constantly working.
True, and the grace is for thejourney, which I think is
everybody's story.
The same grace that I have isthe same grace that you and the
next guy needs.
And just to see a mindset changethat I'm not working on, like
(48:28):
I'm not actively, like I've gotto change my mindset.
It's it's very clearly Godchanging it, cause I'm not
having to work for it, right,right, it's just you gotta be
willing to go with the flow,though, right, yeah, yeah, and
it's much better to just notfight God, cause he seems to be
a little stronger than me,because he seems to be a little
stronger than me.
And so, yeah, I think, justseeing how active he is in
(48:54):
changing my mindset, and just itseems like there's new truths
or information revealed dailythat's just like wow, that is
insane.
Speaker 2 (49:02):
Amanda, what's it mean to have a board member like
Caleb on the team?
Speaker 3 (49:08):
It's a full time job.
No, I'm joking.
Speaker 4 (49:10):
She's like I was hoping he'd leave 20 minutes ago
.
That's right.
Speaker 3 (49:13):
No, you know, I know it sounds cliche, but just even
listening to him talk andthinking back to our first time
of meeting and stuff, I wouldjust say that it is I don't know
how else to say it, other thanit is a blessing.
Like when I think of beingblessed, it's stuff that's like
so undeserving, something thatdoesn't make sense, something
(49:36):
that provides us so muchreassurance or joy and all of
that.
And that's Caleb.
I am blessed to have hismentality and you know he jokes
with me all the time, whetherit's we're going over the
finances piece or whatever,because he has all these
questions.
But that stuff is learned byall of us, right, I didn't know
(50:00):
how to do all of that when I waslearning it from you.
And sometimes society wise, weput such an emphasis on the
resume, the experience, theknowledge and all those things
and and those things are.
There's nothing wrong with it,but in this line of work I think
there absolutely is.
If we put more weight on that,then we do the heart and um.
(50:23):
So I love so many things aboutCaleb, but what I love most is
he fully recognizes thissanctification process that he's
on.
He's so honest with the otherjust magnitude.
You know we talked about TRNbeing massive.
It is.
And when you talk about thismassiveness, he's one eighth of
the person that's governing it.
(50:44):
So I understand his learningcurve on that and as CEO I want
to help him with that.
I'm still learning some of it.
But what's incredible about himis him understanding the
sanctification process of likeman.
I went from this piece where Iwas burned out and thought this
of them and now I'm here.
But I know my understanding isstill going to be deeper a year
(51:06):
from now.
And what's incredible about himis when I'm talking about
stories of like hey, just aheads up, I want to let the
board know, because there's somenames that the board knows
people by names.
That's how involved my board is, right, and so sometimes I tell
them I know you've heard metalk a lot about so-and-so.
I want to let you know theywent into treatment, he gets it.
(51:30):
And then there's sometimeswhere I'm able to say we're just
not there yet.
I had a board member who hasworked so many shifts at the
warming centers that he knew oneof the females from three
warming centers ago and shewasn't in this one to one of the
females from three warmingcenters ago and she wasn't in
this one and he brought that up,not this last board meeting,
(51:51):
but the board meeting beforethat, and I was able to unpack
this woman's story right andthis is why you didn't see her.
She's in the midst of, probably, domestic violence and she's in
this and she's in this and soshe's with this group of men now
and I was able to share thatwith the board and just looking
at their level of empathy andthis level of honestly sadness,
(52:18):
right, like oh, we hate that forher.
That brings me back to what'sincredible about Caleb, and not
just him, but all of them.
They see their ownsanctification process and they
value it.
But then they understand othersand to me that is so invaluable
(52:50):
as a CEO because I know I cancome to them about a program, an
initiative or a person that'staking a long time to get there
right or that is on their ownjourney, or an initiative that
I'm like please trust me, we'renot seeing the outcomes yet, but
I know it's coming right.
We just have to revise this orwe're having to make revisions
and they get it.
And Caleb, I think, is a bigleader right now for our board
and his transparency that webetter continue to be empathetic
(53:12):
on people as they are in theprocess of their own change If
they haven't quote unquotereached it yet.
Because if you look at all ofus, regardless of how mature we
are in our faith or whatever, wedon't quote unquote reach it
until we're made whole again.
And Caleb applies his own.
(53:33):
He calls it ignorance a lot.
I'm just ignorant with this,could you help me with this?
But he applies that and it'sturned into this beautiful
empathy and passion and advocacyfor others.
And it's because of people likeCaleb that the margin lessens
and the gap lessens because hecould be talking about his
(53:55):
professionalism, all theincredible stuff that he and his
amazing wife do, like he couldbe putting their lives on a
pedestal.
And I continually see Caleblessen and lessen and and lesson
himself, to be able to get to aplace where he fully, as much
as possible, understands thehurt of what our people
experience.
(54:15):
And to me that is invaluable asa CEO to have that as a board
member.
Speaker 2 (54:23):
Absolutely.
You know, we, in any kind ofwork and social services or just
in general in society, we tendto fall back to the need for
strategy.
How are we going to make thiswork?
How are we going to make thatwork?
How are we going to get themoney for this?
How are we going to create this?
And sometimes we lose the heartof the matter and strategy
(54:44):
takes over heart.
And so, um, you have to dostrategy, you have to budget,
you have to um, are we going tofix this?
Are we going to build this?
Are we going to addresshomelessness this way or
whatever it is?
Are we going to feed morepeople?
We're going to feed less people?
On and on and on.
But when we bring the heartinto, it is the reason and the
(55:04):
foundation for it.
Um, then it gives us themotivation to do it the very
best that we can.
And, caleb, I think and I agreewith LaManda, having been
involved with boards and theTopeka Rescue Mission board for
a very long time while you're inthe learning curve still,
everybody's learning from you aswell, because what you're doing
is bringing the authentic, rawheart of somebody who had an
(55:25):
encounter with Christ in a placethat you weren't expecting
about, an assignment that youother board members have staff
members, volunteers, topekaRescue Mission and hopefully
more and more people in thecommunity to love our neighbor
as ourself, right where they are, without judgment, without
(55:47):
wanting it just to go away.
And so I've not heard yourtestimony before.
I'm blessed to visualize whatyou experienced and the position
that you've been in as afirefighter and to be there and
God still flourishing what yousaid, yes to what you were
(56:11):
hungry for.
I want to know your way, god.
And if we try to white knucklethis thing and just do it
strategically, it won't get done.
But if we do it with the heart,the motivation behind it,
people who are listening rightnow you may listen to this
podcast about strategy andwhat's the latest thing going on
at the mission and who's theguest and who you're talking to
(56:31):
and those kind of things.
But pray to the Lord that hewill show you his heart in
everything that's being donehere, We've got a great many
things happening at TopekaRescue Mission.
You're still learning them,caleb.
It'll take a while to reallylearn all those incredible
things that God has put togetherand people have said yes to,
but if we avoid the hard partwhich is the hard part the hard
(56:54):
part is the hard part then wewill never get where we need to
go.
Lamanda, you got your finger onyour Bible right now.
Speaker 3 (57:01):
I do.
I think this might be the firsttime I've ever done this on a
podcast, because I thinksometimes there can be there can
just be issues, right, if wejust throw scripture out there
and without going into contextand all of that.
But this morning I felt veryled to bring my Bible for the
(57:22):
podcast.
I was kind of like God, whatare you doing?
Because normally we would needa whole podcast to explain
scripture so that we make surewe're not taking it out of
context.
But with many counselors thereis deliverance.
And I had a little footnote inmy.
(57:53):
This is kind of.
I have two different Bibles thatI go back and forth.
One is a leadership Bible thatI was blessed with by the board
when I came on, and then I alsohave one that's about women
leadership, so that we reallyunderstand there's beauty in
submission, but also we have towalk in what God's called us to
do.
And so this is the woman'sBible.
But the footnote on here saysthe phrase many counselors is
(58:15):
actually, in this context,considered an advisor, a
deliberator or a personconsidering action and in
purpose, implying wisdom,reflection and skill.
So again, the Proverbs withoutguidance, a people will fall.
But with many counselors,there's deliverance, and now
(58:38):
that God's revealed that to me,I'm like how fitting is that
that?
That really should describe theTopeka Rush Commission Board of
Directors right, they are agroup of counselors when we
think they've got to have theheart.
Exactly what you just saidimplies this proverb we have to
have the heart, we have to bedoing what the Lord's called us
to do, but that also comes inaction.
(58:59):
It also comes in purpose and itcomes in wisdom and skill.
Those don't have to be separate, and this proverb shows that.
But I also think that it is areminder for all of us in
leadership, in whatever positiongovernment, other nonprofits,
businesses, churches that if weare leaders, whether we are in
(59:25):
ministry or not, and even ifit's more secular, if we call
ourselves Christians, we havegot to find the balance of not
denying the truth and what God'scalling us to do, to do the
position, and I think that issomething I recognize.
I'm blessed to be able to be ascourageous in my faith because
(59:49):
I am a leader in a ministry, andso I recognize that.
But the other side of it isthere were times that I wasn't
in a ministry and God stillcalled me to walk boldly in my
faith, regardless of whatposition he allowed me to be in,
and so I hope that this is areminder to anybody in our
(01:00:12):
community that is a believer whois also a leader that if we are
not guiding and not a guidingtalk based on what God has
called us to do, in thoseprinciples, people will fall.
And that's on us, because toomuch has been given, much is
expected, but the other side ofit is where there is many
(01:00:34):
counselors it doesn't say one,it doesn't say the.
Where there are many, manyadvisors, many people that are
in deliberation, many peoplethat are using wisdom.
What will happen?
There is deliverance, and so Ithink we can use that as a
practical level, which is whatGod wanted us to take away these
(01:00:56):
truths right.
These aren't scriptures, justbiblical things that happened a
long time ago, especially whenyou're in the book of Proverbs,
there's deliverance.
So what could this look like?
It could be tied to encampments, it could be tied to housing,
it could be tied to all thesebreakthroughs that our community
could come deliverance.
But you better believe that Idon't care if we're in a secular
world or a ministry world, ifwe are a Christian and we're a
believer.
This also tells us where we areand if we're doing what we're
(01:01:19):
supposed to, there's deliverance.
These encampments, all of thesethings are controversial and
all of that.
This also is a spiritualwarfare, and this is an
opportunity for us to bringkingdom, difference on this
earth that we've been given.
And so I love that Proverbs,I'm convicted by it, I'm
challenged by it and I'm alsoencouraged that there is hope.
(01:01:41):
If we do, regardless of ourposition, what God's called us
to do and we act as thesecounselors, there will be
deliverance.
If we don't, and there is notguidance of those that are
called into leadership, peoplewill fall.
Speaker 2 (01:01:58):
Yes and amen.
You brought your Bible andpreached today, so that was good
.
Lamanda, thank you, I thinkwhat we've heard today and,
caleb, thank you so much foragain your transparency, just
laying it on the line.
I think that people today whohave listened to what you've
said are going to really bethinking about what they need to
(01:02:22):
be talking to God about, and Iknow me as well just to say be
talking to God about, and I knowme as well just to say, god, am
I being authentic with you andshow me your heart?
And so, as we've said, the hardpart is the heart part.
We can do a lot of really goodthings, but what is the heart of
God?
And so thank you for saying yesout there on the street, thank
(01:02:42):
you for saying yes to the boardof directors to pick a rescue
mission, and I know that you'repretty excited about more yeses
to come yeah, yeah, so anythinglast you would like to say for
our listeners today.
Speaker 4 (01:02:55):
I don't know, not really, I guess okay, I've been
man I was.
When she was talking previously,I was thinking about just for
me and my faith and just kind ofnavigating this conversation.
I have been a complete schmuckin the past and I will continue
to do schmuck things in thefuture, and what has been so
(01:03:19):
cool for me is just the lens ofgrace has changed for me.
So in a past of shame and guilt, anytime I messed up, it is
completely 180 to where.
Now, when I mess up, which weall will continue to mess up
throughout this life, it opensmy eyes to just how awesome his
(01:03:40):
grace is.
Rather than leading me deeperinto shame and guilt, it pushes
(01:04:01):
me closer to him, just seeinghow incredible his grace is and
how he continues to beManda.
But there's like this child'squote.
That's like it's like anillustration of like Jesus
versus religion and the religion.
One says I screwed up.
I hope my dad doesn't find out,and Christianity is I screwed
(01:04:22):
up.
I need to go talk to my dad.
And man, that's just how.
To me, that's just the lens ofgrace and just seeing how
massive it is and how necessaryit is for me and as well as the
next guy.
Speaker 2 (01:04:43):
Yes.
Well, thank you for going toyour dad and talking to him and
being willing to say, yes,you're a good father in heaven.
So if you are listening todayand you're a schmuck, you're in
a great spot.
Speaker 4 (01:04:55):
Child of God that does schmuck things, because God
can use schmucks If you don'trecognize that you're a schmuck.
Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
you need to humble yourself and realize that God
uses schmucks.
We have to look that up in ournext time to identify what the
definition of schmuck is.
We may be trying to blank out alot of things here, Josh.
I hope not, but anyway, it'sall about humbling ourselves.
Amanda, thank you for sharingyour passion, your heart.
Thank you for being in themiddle of the storm here.
Thank you for leading the way,and thank you for recognizing a
(01:05:23):
multitude of counselors is partof what this is all about.
You may be a part of themultitude of counselors today,
wherever you are listening tothis podcast, whether it's in
your church, your neighborhood,your place of work, whatever the
case might be, god's got aheart for Topeka Kansas.
He's got a heart for those whosuffer.
He's got a heart for you, andso just know that, in spite of
(01:05:43):
schmuckism, god loves us all.
Thank you for listening to ourcommunity, our mission.
If you'd like more informationabout the Topeka Rescue Mission,
you could go to trmonlineorg.
That's trmonlineorg.
Thank you for listening today.
Dear Heavenly Father, we thank you, lord, for this
day and this time, lord, to justcome together and have a
conversation, lord, about theincredible people that partner
with the Topeka Rescue Mission.
Lord, I pray your blessing overthis time and, lord, that ears
that would hear would beencouraged in one way or another
.
Lord, we just thank you and wepraise your name.
Amen.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hello everybody, Thank you for joining us.
Another edition of OurCommunity, Our Mission, a
podcast of the Topeka RescueMission.
I'm your host today, BarryFeeker.
It's Wednesday, March the 5th2025.
This is episode number 258.
I'm here this morning withLaManda Cunningham, CEO of
Topeka Rescue Mission.
Good morning, LaManda.
Good morning, how are you?
Speaker 3 (00:43):
I'm good.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
There's a lot going on in Topeka right now isn't
there.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
There is, I think there always is, though I'm not
sure what we do if we ever havea podcast where we're like, yeah
, there's not really a lot goingon.
Probably not.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Yeah, I don't think so.
Not going to happen in yourworld.
That's Some really importantupdates and then a really cool
guest that we have today, but wewant to talk about the research
and development department'shard work that they put into
every single week trying to findout what's really important
about today.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
You lay it on thick.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
sometimes I do I really do, and so Josh is down
here with research anddevelopment.
I always like to give credit toIsaiah though.
Yeah, that's right, Just incase it's kind of goofy.
So anyway, I know many of youtune in to be able to hear
what's important about WednesdayMarch the 5th.
Well, one thing is reallyimportant is Ash Wednesday, and
so Ash Wednesday, as many peopleknow, is the six weeks before
(01:34):
Easter that people then begin toget prepared for celebrating
the resurrection of Jesus Christ, and so that's a very, very
important and serious time torecognize, and so some people
are beginning to go intosacrificing and fasting and
getting ready just to be able tobe grateful for that holy day.
(01:56):
But there's also a couple ofother days that I wasn't aware
of until the very importantresearch and development
department of Tepica rescuemission.
It's real film day, and it'snot R E A L, it's R E E L.
You knew about that, didn't you?
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Because you're sure you're movie buff right.
Yeah, I woke up this morning Isaid, man, I can't wait to
celebrate real day.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Yeah, really, I mean, it's this, this, knowing about
this.
It's always celebrated on March, the 5th um celebrated in the U
?
S with the film screenings andshowcasing events organized by
the independent cinemas acrossthe country.
Don't they have enough awardstuff that they do?
I mean the Grammys, the I don'tknow if they, I don't know the
Oscars, what they'd have herethe other night, something with
a bunch of people hugging eachother, you know, and getting
(02:38):
awards and mad and dressing.
Really weird and so, but anyway, real film day.
R-e-e-l.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
Uh-huh, do you like movies?
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Uh-huh, I've never heard you talk about movies,
yeah.
Yeah, well, we could talk aboutmovies, I know.
So I wonder if our guests cancome back next week.
That's right.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Let's not.
Let's not and say we did.
I do like the movies.
I like them in color too.
You are the only one thatremembers them before they were.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Was freaky in black and white.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
I want to tell you that's true.
Traumatized as a kid, thosecrazy monkeys.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
One more thing from our research in the Bell
department learn what your namemeans.
Day Today, on the 5th of March,this is a day that you should
learn what your name means.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Amanda, what's your name mean?
I have absolutely no clue.
Oh, I have some clues, the brat.
Yeah, I don't know.
You know, in the eightiesAmanda was extremely popular
Amanda, and then Chris for a boy, and so my mom liked the name
Amanda and then somehow ended upknowing someone else and that
(03:50):
person had like a babysitter orsomething named LaManda and it
stuck with my mind.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
So you were actually named Manda to start with, and
then they meant this Frenchperson to go LaManda.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
So now it's the Amanda, I guess.
I don't know, but I don't knowwhat it means.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
A quick Google search LaManda is likely a variation
of the name Manda, which,depending on the context, can
mean lovable or promise.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Oh, that's exactly how I describe myself.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Well, you have a better day.
I know what's going to happenevery March 5th now.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Unlovable day.
Unlovable day.
Yeah, so do you know what Barrymeans?
I could maybe have some guesses.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
No, go ahead, we're going to move on, we're going to
move on.
So it's two things Uh-huhCourage, and the other is water
bearer.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
Water bearer yeah, so you need a drink, okay, I got a
bottle of water right here, sowe're good.
I knew we could always count onyou.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
So now that we set the stage for important things
that we like to talk about, laManda, we've had a lot of
activity going on that you'vebeen involved in, a number of
other people have been involvedin, in regards to the homeless,
which is no surprise, but therehas been some continuation of
(05:00):
cleaning homeless camps.
We talked pretty extensivelyand took a deep dive on that
last podcast, but this week someof those camps are being
cleared.
There was also a very importantpress conference this week with
Topeka Jump in regards to theAffordable Housing Trust Fund
and some commitments.
It appears to be at the citycouncil level to go ahead and
find ways to utilize the milliondollars in the trust fund to be
(05:23):
able to create some affordablehousing in our community.
So a lot going on.
People are talking all over thecommunity about this issue, but
what about the camps?
What's been happening?
How?
There has been some need forcontinued communications between
the rescue mission and the cityof Topeka on these things.
Not everything is pretty atthis point, but camps are
getting cleared.
(05:44):
What's the latest?
Speaker 3 (05:46):
Man, I feel like we should to devote a whole podcast
to just that right.
But kind of in a nutshell, youknow, a couple of years ago in
September, city council kind offollowed suit of the county of
putting some ordinances in place.
Particularly county looked atit from a trails perspective.
Mostly city then did the samething.
(06:09):
And so you know, I think it'simportant to say that myself as
CEO, but also TRM as a whole, wehave never said that our city
shouldn't have an ordinance.
We've never said that, you know, we shouldn't have some safety
parameters in place.
Those, those are valued.
What I as the CEO, and what wehave TRM, have repeatedly said
(06:31):
is can we do this verysystematically and logically by
a couple of different examples,other communities who have done
it well, also other communitieswho have not done it well.
Looking back, you know severalyears ago, when you all embarked
on needing to do this for TentCity and how that was done, with
a lot of partnerships and over,you know, 12 months, and so
(06:53):
unfortunately, that request tonot put the cart before the
horse just has continued.
And you know I've been askedhere lately are you going to the
county about this?
Well, I do think the county hasa part in this right.
They're also our government andthe city of Topeka lies within
the county, so I get it, but theother side is what's mostly
(07:16):
impacting TRM right now arethese encampment cleanups that
are being done by the city ofTopeka, not the county.
So, that being said, there'sreally just been this consistent
request on our behalf to cityleadership, and let me let me
explain here and I'm not tryingto sound more pointed, but I do
(07:37):
want to be very clear we,meaning our community, have
incredible boots on the ground,teams made up of everywhere.
So you've got incredible bootson the ground, people from Code
Compliance.
You've got incredible peopleboots on the ground from EAS.
You've got incredible boots onthe ground people from our
outreach team Vallejo, tbd'sBehavioral Health Unit, outreach
(08:00):
all of those things right,reach, all of those things right
.
These are teams who doincredible work together, but
also are trying to be asrespectful to the ordinance and
do things accordingly.
But it's also hard becausethere are decision makers making
decisions and none of thosedecision makers are here when
(08:20):
these enforcements are done.
None of them.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Not boots on the ground, are they?
Speaker 3 (08:24):
And yet the boots on the ground, people are the ones
that are having to face ourneighbors and be, on one hand,
gaining trust for weeks andmonths, and sometimes years,
right To get to know their story, to walk with them as they're
waiting on the EAS waiting list,to walk through them, through
possible relapses, or walkingthem through job applications.
(08:44):
All of those things and thosethings take time.
And then, in the midst of this,we have not put any type of
continuum of care, housingoptions in place.
We've not added anything, we'venot taken a risk to say, hey,
let's do a low barrier shelter,or let's do some tiny home
pilots, let's do a designatedcamping area.
(09:06):
None of that's been done.
So we've continued thesecleanups.
Because of what?
Decision makers have continuedto be vocal and wanting,
enforced, saying that's whattheir constituents want.
Well, I don't.
I don't wake up every day andsay, man, I can't wait to see
what strife I cause, but Iabsolutely am called by the Lord
to be a voice for those thatare not being heard.
(09:28):
And right now we have a lot ofpeople in our community that are
starting to speak up to say,hey, we know people are saying
they don't like the trash.
We know people don't like this,that and the other, but we're
here to say we don't like all ofthis enforcement.
That's happening with no optionother than relocating people.
So that's kind of where we'reat right now is it's it's pretty
(09:51):
strenuous, but I'm also hopeful.
Barry, you know historicallywhat we've had.
It's not been consistent, butat times we, as in social
service providers, have hadabout a 30-day notice.
It comes down from someleadership in the city of Topeka
(10:11):
goes to the behavioral healthunit.
They let us know 30-day noticeon what?
That a specific encampment isgoing to be cleaned up.
What happened with this one andwhy I was very concerned from a
public safety viewpoint butalso the dignity of our folks,
was because we did not receive aspecific date at all formally
(10:36):
until last Thursday that thiswas going to occur on Monday and
equipment was coming Tuesday.
So we're talking a five daynotice.
Now to back that up, I found outinformally from a Facebook post
of council leadership and to meit's not professional when
we're all working together andit is on the livelihoods of
(10:57):
people.
We need to follow that process.
So I started digging deep toknow is this social media
informal post?
Is that really our trigger, asall the social service agencies,
to be doing this?
And why did we not have the 30day notice?
And this is the last phase,meaning there's now nowhere for
(11:19):
people to go.
So anywhere they relocate isgoing to be illegal or it's
going to be unsafe for ourneighborhoods, because they're
coming into our neighborhoodsNot that they're bad people, not
that they're there but now theyhave no resources, no place to
call home and there's nowherefor them to go.
So the reason why this one gotcontroversial is when I started
questioning that, it was well,you knew this phase was coming,
(11:44):
correct.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
But when we're talking with people, Someday,
but didn't know when the daywould be, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
And then the problem with this is, you know, in
December, when we start kind ofhearing these rumors and that
there's communications that moreis coming, if we started doing
something, then people that arein the midst of trauma,
regardless of what the trauma is, they can't think through 90
days or 75 days.
(12:12):
And then if we would haveoutreached in December the cold
weather, all of that when theystarted first saying they were
going to do this, then you havetransition, you have people that
leave, are in and out, and sothat's why this kind of what I'm
going to call a sweet spot ofthe 30 days is that's a way that
your social service agents cantruly go out and outreach and
(12:35):
connect to resources.
But the other side of it isthat's also how we're able to
logically say these resourceshave been offered or these
resources we don't have, like,let's really call a spade a
spade, and then we're able tosay if there were resources,
people did not take them.
Well, that's when you'veexhausted right the humanity
(12:58):
piece, the compassionate piece,and then it really is okay, we
have to move to citations,because we do have to have
cleanliness and all of that.
But you would have providedoptions.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
Correct Before citation yes, and that didn't
happen.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
No, and so then the other predicament, now that
we're in, is this is the lastcleanup, and so they're still
doing cleanups.
And then, two weeks ago, theychose to strengthen the
ordinance, and the same argumentthat I'm saying now that I said
back before they did this insummer of 23, was we have no
(13:35):
options If we issue thisbeautiful statement of nope.
We've had outreach teams outthere connecting them to
resources.
Well, we're connecting them toresources, not housing options.
So we have people on the EASwait list Well, that's great,
we've put them on the wait list.
Speaker 2 (13:55):
We're on a wait list.
They're on a wait list.
That's not housing, and theycould go to mobile access
partnership get a shower, get ameal, those kind of things,
that's a resource.
Get a meal, those kinds ofthings, that's a resource.
But then they go where?
After they leave there, they'rein the TRMs full, and so there
is no housing option here.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
Right.
And there's this.
You know I'm going to I don'tknow people's hearts, right?
So I'm just going to say maybeit's just a misconception that
TRM is just against this or thatwe're not working with cleanups
.
That is not accurate.
My team, every time when we havethe 30 day notice, my shelter
directors go out, on the UTV orthe trucks, depending on where
(14:33):
the encampment cleanups are.
They go out, they interface,regardless if it's two
individuals or 22.
And we talk to them about dothey have a restriction at the
shelter?
If so, we will automaticallylift it.
Do they want to come in?
Can they come in?
But then there's limitationsthere, whether it's the person's
cognitive ability at that time,whether it's the fact that
(14:54):
we're going over variants, butwe're doing that because we
realize they have no place to go.
Animals, which is not somethingthat insurance, wise, liability
and all of that I can't allowanimals in.
There's a lot of obstaclesthere.
But our team goes out and doesthis and we come back and we
report to other boots on theground hey, we have done our
part, we've tried to connectthem.
(15:15):
They either couldn't accept itor they're not ready for that,
those kinds of things.
And then we recognize thatthere's, you know, struggles,
then whatever, whatever's next,and we walk through that.
So we are all about the processwhen it is truly people
centered.
But we cannot be a part of stuffwhen we continue to do the
(15:37):
cleanups and there's nowhere togo and then we talk so poorly
about people because now they'reon Wanamaker, they're behind
Menards, they're off of 21stStreet.
Well, that's for two reasons,barry.
One you said it four or fiveyears ago now the national trend
is increasing.
You also went before counciland other people and explaining
(15:58):
and in that is also a grayinghomeless the age is increasing.
You've done all that.
I've said it since I took overafter you.
The other side of it is I needlisteners to know if you are
seeing homelessness now in yourarea and you haven't before, it
is absolutely because of theordinance and the fact that, not
the ordinance alone, but thefact that we did not have
housing options in place beforedoing the movements.
(16:23):
So, all of that being said, myheart as CEO stands the same.
We still have the power tochange it.
Now I don't want to continue totalk about what's been done.
I want us to look at this andgo okay, so it could have been
done differently.
We can't go back now.
But let's really make thisright.
As leaders moving forward andmyself when I'm talking about
(16:46):
myself and other leaders in thecommunity, including council,
commissioners, city manager,mayor, whoever leadership we
want to talk about I still standfirm, ready to partner with
them and listen to their points,understand their questions and
their concerns.
I'll give them my expertisethat I have for moving forward.
The other side of it is I willnot be muted for this cause, and
(17:13):
that is not me trying to beberating, that's not me trying
to be disrespectful.
It's also not me trying tocause division.
But if we don't moving forward,do things differently again,
not your boots on the ground.
People they're truly, they aresome incredible people right now
(17:35):
.
So I'm not talking that.
I'm talking myself and othercity leadership that have
decisions, that have the powerto make decisions and we are
entrusted, and if we are goingto use our power in a way that
harms people, I want no part ofit.
Now, if we are at a differentplace and I'm hopeful, I'm very
hopeful with our city manager wewant to be supportive of that,
(17:57):
that moving forward.
Before we do more encampmentcleanups, we should all be
coming together and take a riskof what housing options do we
want to start making for ourcommunity?
That's needed and I'm hopefulthat that's going to happen and
we'll do that, walking inexcitement and anticipatory, you
know, thoughts of like, heylook what we can do, we can be
an example.
(18:18):
But the other side of it is ifwe, if that does not come to
fruition and we continue to dothese things where we can just
say, well, we have the authorityto do it and we're doing it TRM
does not want to be a part ofthat because it's not right.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
You know, to many people.
They're beginning to take areal look at this and ask the
legitimate question what sensedoes it make to move people out
of one place with no place forthem to go?
I mean, it's a little bit ofcommon sense there that they
don't just disappear, they don'tjust get better, they don't
just go away.
And so you've described it.
They can be in variousdifferent places, which they
(18:52):
already are starting to be inthose various different places,
and it didn't solve the problem.
And so common sense would saylet's come together, let's do
clean up our city, let's do helppeople to move into something
better, but that takes some time.
Yes.
And that doesn't happenovernight, when your shelter's
full and there's no other placeto go.
(19:13):
Then what you've done is you'vetraded one problem for another,
and there's some humansuffering in the process of that
.
So, lamanda, yeah, I think thatpeople are hearing you say what
you're saying.
You're not just playing it,nice, but you're being nice.
You're just trying to say let'sdo this together, let's do some
common sense here and let'sfind ways for solutions.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
And you know we have a lot of listeners that are
passionate right now, and youknow I think that you know we
see some of the things on theKSNT threads or the WIBW threads
the KSNT threads or the WIBWthreads and there is everything
from very mean comments aboutindividuals experiencing
homelessness, and then we havethe other side of it.
(19:52):
That is why are we doing this.
Why are we doing this withoutplaces to go?
We have people that are beingmore vulnerable now saying, hey,
that used to be me.
This isn't okay.
I just read through several thismorning and I thought are we
giving and again decision makersvoice to the people who are
saying, hey, we don't want thisdone that way?
(20:13):
And I don't think we are.
I think we're listening to theconstituents who have said this,
this and this, and the nimbyismnot in my backyard.
And so my, my advice tolisteners that are like hey, we
are not for what's being done tothese people Um, you have every
right to communicate that.
I just ask that we do thatrespectfully.
(20:34):
We don't have to act like otherpeople do when they are, um,
belittling our people or withwith cuss words and ugliness.
We don't have to do that, butyou can absolutely share your
concerns with leadership.
You can bring them to me and Ican connect you to the right
people too, because ourcommunity should be moving
(20:55):
forward, tackling the concernsof homelessness with the right
voice and not negative peoplewho speak the loudest.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
There's been many situations in every community,
including this one, that thingsgot very uncomfortable.
People didn't always make theright decisions, but people came
together to make a betterdecision.
That's one evidence is you havea Topeka rescue mission in
Topeka.
That wasn't always here and itwasn't always like it is today,
because things had to getuncomfortable before we got
(21:23):
comfortable with doing thingsbetter.
And that's where we are again.
So well, amanda, there's, asyou said, we could do a whole
podcast on this, which we didlast week, so there's going to
be more on this, but it'simportant that people get an
update, and so thank you forthat.
Story's not over.
We're still going to be movingforward for better solutions
than this one and, in theprocess, we pray for those who
(21:45):
are making decisions, that theymake the right ones, and we pray
for those who are beingaffected by those decisions,
because it could be very, very,very, very unfortunate for them.
So, lamanda, we're going toswitch gears now and talk about
Topeka Rescue Mission inparticular, and one of the
things that, for nearly threeyears now, you have been working
with a board of directors whichis not just a rubber stamp.
(22:06):
Here you go, lamanda, go for it.
That was the way it was when Iwas here.
They just rubber stampedeverything you know.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
So.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
I've never had an issue, not, so.
These are important people foryou to be able to share your
vision with, to share just likewhat you shared with us, and
then come up with a officialdecision from that governing
body about what's to be done.
So, um, amanda, talk about, uh,the importance of the board to
you and, uh, what you've learnedin this last three years.
Speaker 3 (22:35):
So you know, I think the um, the easiest way to say
is I have eight bosses, right,Um and so sometimes it's hard
enough to have one, but thenwhen you multiply that by a lot,
it could be something that'shard.
However, I am truly blessed byquote unquote my bosses, and not
(22:59):
because everything is, you know, always doves and peace, but I
have board members that theircharacters outside of these
board meetings are stellar.
They are authentic.
They are people who have beenborn again and understand that,
(23:20):
and for the most part, theyrelate so much to our cause,
those we serve, the struggle,all of that.
And so I love how reflectiveour board is, because sometimes
the ideas or even the strugglesthat we're facing, I never have
to worry about bringing it tothe board and go, man, they're
(23:40):
not going to understand this orthey're not going to be able to
relate to this because theirhearts are so driven by what we
do.
And so it's been a learningcurve for me, and it still is.
I just told them one or twoboard meetings ago I'm like I'm
still new at this.
I'm trying to figure out whatyou guys want to know, what you
just trust me to lead, and allof that.
(24:01):
So we have some growing painsevery now and then where I'm
like I'm probably telling themway too, much and they're just
like we trust you do your job.
And then the other thing is I'malways like, oh shoot, I forgot
to tell them that and how did Iforget to tell them that?
So you know, it's this dancethat we learn.
But I, honestly, am so thankfulfor my board, and I'm what I'm
(24:23):
most thankful for is they're notjust a yes board.
They ask me questions, theywant to know.
Sometimes we table things topray in process and I appreciate
just the genuineness of ourboard members.
But I think I also need to behonest and say we all joke that
every time we leave a boardmeeting we all need ibuprofen
(24:43):
because it's a lot right, butthey're great people.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Yeah, well, speaking of eight bosses, one of them is
here today, your newest boardmember, caleb Chalkley.
Welcome to our podcast heretoday.
Our community, our mission.
Thanks for having me.
So, yeah, thank you for waitingon all this for us to unpack,
(25:06):
to get to you today.
Caleb, you know I woke up thismorning getting out of bed
feeling kind of old.
That's what happens, but Ireally feel old now after
getting a chance.
I met you a couple of monthsago at the Night of Praise,
briefly, and I got to thinkingabout your name, chalkley, and I
asked you the question today,do you know a Jeff Chalkley?
And you said yeah, that's mydad.
And I mentioned an Angie andthat's your aunt, and I was
their youth pastor, your dad'syouth pastor, amanda.
(25:29):
You kind of kid me all the time.
I do.
I told you, yeah, I'm an oldgoat or something like that.
So here we got this kid overhere.
He's a board member at SpeakerRescue Mission and I was his dad
and his aunt's youth pastor.
Now, keep in mind, I was a kidmyself at the time of 20, 21
years old, okay so anyway, I'llstay a kid, that's right, Caleb,
(25:54):
welcome again to this program.
You you're a new board member.
I want to talk about that, butyou're also the Topeka fire
department firefighter, and sohow long have you been on the
Topeka fire department?
Speaker 4 (26:01):
I've been at TFD since 2020, pretty much right in
the heat of COVID, I think itwas April was my hire date.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
Oh yeah, but that wasn't your first service in
firefighting.
You also served somewhere elsebefore that.
Speaker 4 (26:14):
Yep, I started the whole career in 2014 at Silver
Lake Fire as a volunteer slashpart-time guy and then, after I
got my EMT, I worked on anambulance for five years and a
mix between Riley County andPotts County.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
So you are kind of a local kid, so to speak, and
you're a Silver Lake Eaglegraduate Eagles and that's a
pretty big rivalry Rossville,silver Lake, the whole thing
there.
So we'll get into that rightnow, but anyway, so you came on
in 2020.
Pandemic came over to Topeka.
You've been serving here sincethat time, which we appreciate.
(26:53):
The fire department I meangoodness, their first response
between AMR fire departmentcoming in.
Sometimes one gets here beforethe other, but that's always a
joint effort, whether it's inshelter, on the streets or
whatever.
And and so, um, caleb, um, howdid you find out about Topeka
rescue mission?
Um, and then what, uh, what gotyou directed towards being a
(27:16):
board member?
Speaker 4 (27:17):
Oh man.
So to start, I'm going to starta ways back, okay, so obviously
Can't go too far back.
Right.
So obviously I knew that TopekaRescue Mission was here since I
was a child.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
My pastor when I was growing up worked at DRM for a
while.
Darren Johnson pastor.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Silver Lake Baptist.
Yep, yep.
So I heard about it, knew aboutit, but when I got on the fire
department, the city of Zbika,as you know, is very, very busy,
right.
So I think last year we hadmaybe 27,000 calls, wow.
So there comes a point, orthere came a point for me as a
(27:57):
Christian, where I had burnoutfor I don't want to say for the
job, but to be blunthomelessness, burnout about
homelessness, burnout forrunning calls, running calls for
homelessness.
So at the time I was working inCentral Topeka at Station 4, and
(28:21):
, man, I could just you get wokeup in the middle of the night
for your sixth call or whatever,and it's something that I don't
see as an emergency, and so I'mimmediately bitter, I get in
the truck, I'm mad the whole waythere.
I get there, I have to care forthis person with compassion,
while I not an ounce of me, ifI'm being honest wants to.
(29:02):
So I could feel that and again,as a Christian, I knew
wholeheartedly every singleperson I deal with in my line of
work, or any line of work, ismade in the image of God,
deserving of love, respect,compassion.
And it just kind of hit a wallwhere I was like, dude, I'm like
an angry person for selfishreasons, like for essentially
having to do my job right, butso I kind of just there was a
lot of stuff that happened allat once, but one of the first
(29:23):
things that happened was I juststarted praying.
I would say for months I wasjust praying for eyes to see
people the way God sees them anda heart to break for what
breaks is.
And while I was doing that, Ialso started reading one proverb
every day.
I don't remember who turned meon to it, but there's 31.
(29:44):
So it's perfect to just gothrough a month reading a
proverb every day and, man, Iwas like mind blown immediately
with just how much there is inProverbs about serving the poor
or the less fortunate, and oneverse that hit me in particular
I think you have your Bible openLike Proverbs 21.
(30:07):
You're not going to believe it,but I'm in Proverbs 21, 13, I
think, is what it is.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
What a coincidence.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
Because I had something I wanted to share, and
I never do that but 21, 13.
The one who shuts his ears tothe cry of the poor will himself
also call out and not beanswered.
Speaker 4 (30:25):
Yeah, so I read that Okay.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
And I'm like oh right , yeah, richard, yeah, so I read
that.
Speaker 4 (30:28):
Okay, and I'm like right and so, um, those are not
my words, right.
Right, that's, that's the textspeaking, not me.
So it hit me really hard.
And then one of the things thatreally hit me the hardest, that
I would say kind of changed mywhole view on homelessness, was
I think it was springtimebecause it was super cold, but
(30:50):
not cold enough to snow.
It was raining and we ran acall for like a spider bite or
something.
And again, every day I'm stillpraying these same prayers and
we ran this call for a spiderbite.
We get to this house, lady runsout out.
She's like it's not me, it'sover there by the dumpster.
(31:12):
So we go to the dumpster andthere's a guy laying under a
tarp soaking wet and he'sscreaming in pain.
And the first thing I notice isthat he's screaming for his mom
.
This guy's probably mid-60s and, uh, I don't know, maybe
weighed 70 pounds, like he wasin rough, rough shape, and he
(31:33):
was crying for his momcontinuously.
That's all.
He hardly would answer aquestion because he's just
screaming.
And I'm like man, this dude isin one of the lowest places one
could be and his single instinctis to cry for his mom like a,
like a motherly.
He's longing for a motherlylove, right, and so, while
(32:00):
sitting there talking to him, itwas a situation where we were
waiting on amr for a very longtime, um, and we're kind of our
hands are kind of tied at thatpoint, right like we can't.
We can't transport, but you'renot medevac and so sitting there
in the cold I don't want to bein the cold either so I'm like
this dude must be.
I mean again, he just won'tstop screaming, won't stop
(32:22):
screaming, soaking wet.
And after it caught my eye thatthis guy is crying for his mom
at 60-something years old.
He has obviously no shelter.
He's got a tarp that's doingnothing for him.
He's laying in a puddle.
Essentially he had like a canof beans or something, maybe
(32:43):
with a knife, that he had triedto open, pretty unsuccessfully.
He's hungry and can't get tothe food.
And then next to that was aporn magazine.
And I remember thinking just howevident for me, how evident the
(33:06):
battle of the spiritual realm.
I guess this guy, who manypeople would say has nothing, is
that pretty much the lowestspot a human could be and crying
for his mom still has satan,still has this grip on him like
no food, no shelter, this gripon him Like no food, no shelter.
(33:28):
Yet this bondage is still justclinging and I was like wrecked
and I remember tearing up on thecall, which is insane.
I mean I've run thousands ofcalls over the last 10 years and
many really horrible horrormovie type things, and I've
never teared up on a call likethis and I remember immediately
(33:50):
being like God, do not answerthis prayer, like this Cause
that's what it was.
I was like oh, this is God'slike.
Oh yeah, you know that you,that prayer you've been asking.
Here it is, buddy, here it is.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
But not right now, not this way.
I don't have time to be crying.
Speaker 4 (34:02):
I don't do this, and so that was like the kickstart
for me and I just keptnavigating through the Proverbs
and I read a book at the timecalled Under the Overpass, by
something Yankowski I think.
Yeah, I read him, great bookand some of the most alarming.
(34:25):
Essentially, the story of thebook is this guy wanted to bring
awareness to homelessness andessentially started living on
the street.
He did have kind of a board ofpeople that would like pray for
him.
Him and another guy did this.
He went out and hit the streetsyeah, went to the underpasses.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 4 (34:42):
Yep, essentially a social experiment, and some of
the most alarming things in thatbook was how he was treated not
by people but by the church.
That's right.
And um, romans talks about hownobody's without excuse right
when it comes to God.
And um, I think, in the realmof loving people, it is insane
(35:09):
to see how many of us Christianspunt on it.
We're offered opportunitiesevery single day that God places
in front of our face to lovethe person next to us, whether
it's a homeless guy or the guyat the grocery store, whatever,
and we punt.
And this is me, this is justthe church as a whole and and I
(35:31):
remember obviously I'm notsaying everybody like people do
awesome at this.
We have people like lamanda inthe world that are just rock
stars, but I just these thingswere just hitting me like bricks
and every single time I waslike thanks God.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
Like well, why are we doing this?
I was better off when I was mad.
Speaker 4 (35:51):
That's right, and so I I kind of changed my tone from
being burnout to you know what.
God's given me theseopportunities, rather than being
mad every single time I run acall for a homeless person or a
brush fire, because I worked atstation two for a while, which
is one of the two brush trucksin the city, so we'd go put out
(36:17):
campfires quite a bit.
That a lot of them, never mindthat we I just changed my
perspective of how I saw thesituation.
Rather than feeling the burnout, seeing it as an opportunity to
like just see that person, evenif it's literally eye contact,
(36:37):
I feel like is an insane.
Speaker 2 (36:40):
Kayla, what was frustrating you about them
before you had this kind of Justselfishness Battle yourself?
Encounter of just selfishnessbattle yourself encounter.
I mean, were you like the guythat, um, that was crying for
his mom and and, uh, before thisencounter that God was kind of
having you you go through to toget you where you are today?
(37:01):
What would?
What was frustrating you aboutthis?
I mean, cause I think this iswhere a lot of people probably
are.
They're frustrated with whatthey see.
You were right there amongstthem.
You're here in fire station,you're a job, and I think this
is what kind of goes into how Ifound out about the board.
Speaker 4 (37:36):
But I was telling Greg Armbruster I mean he's the
vice president of the boardabout.
I think homelessness is one ofthe most complex problems in our
society that we continuouslythrow the most simplistic
answers at.
Speaker 2 (37:55):
That's well put.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
And so get a job is a very common, simplistic answer,
right, but okay, how manyvariables have to line up
perfectly for somebody to get ajob?
okay, how many variables have toline up perfectly for somebody
to get a job.
First of all, I have no ideathe person I'm screaming at to
(38:19):
get a job.
Where is their mental capacityat?
Chances are there's plenty ofhomeless people who the issue is
so deep that a job isn't evenin the conversation yet.
Like the thought of a career isinsane.
Um, so for me, that's justwhere my that's I guess that
would have been.
My irritation was like thesepeople are just so like just go
(38:44):
get a job and we wouldn't behere, and so I guess, to answer
your question in a longroundabout way, that would be.
That would be.
It is that I was justoversimplified.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
A very complex situation is what we, what we
tend to do when we don'tunderstand what we're looking at
Exactly, so we get frustratedwith it because it doesn't
change, it doesn't fix itself.
You can't ordinance your wayout of this, you can't hope your
way out of this, you can't bemad your way out of this as a
community.
So we have to take a deep dive.
But it sounds like for you,because of your faith, because
(39:18):
of your relationship with Christ, this wasn't something that was
probably going to comenaturally.
Something happened with you, asyou are kind of coming under
conviction to some degree.
Oh, no doubt.
And like maybe I need to lookat this a little bit differently
.
And was it that night thatthings started really gelling,
with the man who was crying andasking for his mom and that
battle?
Did that really begin thetrajectory you're on now?
Speaker 4 (39:41):
Yeah, I think that was.
There was definitely a switchflipped that night and I
remember asking that guy wellwhy don't you just go to the
mission, like there's a greatresource?
And he said that.
I think he said he had a sexcrime at the time, which I
didn't know what that was, andhe could have peed in public.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
Right, you just never know, or whatever the case is,
they could look very different.
Speaker 4 (40:04):
So the switch flipped for sure at that time.
The switch flipped for sure atthat time, and then just
continuous prayer of God justbeing like, yeah, man, like, I
guess, just almost convictionsbeing answered or like ideas
that I already had or, somewhatin the depth of my soul, thought
(40:27):
or believed God was justconfirming them.
Speaker 3 (40:30):
For me it's time to think differently.
These are humans.
Speaker 4 (40:35):
Yes, show and tell with a lot of show.
Now, exactly, and I don'tremember what I was going to say
.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
Well, thank you for sharing that.
I mean, that's so transparentand I think that there are many
people who are part of what'scalled the body of Christ.
You were raised in church.
You've been around this a lot.
You exposed to the Bible, youexposed to church.
I'm sure that you have heardMatthew 25 over and over and
over again, and on and on and on, and it was the first time you
(41:04):
ever heard a proverb before, butit was really clicking with you
right now because you were kindof forced into dealing with it.
Yep, you're going to deal withit one way or the other.
You're going to deal with itthe way you had been dealing
with it, by frustration, oryou're going to say God, how do
I look at this frustrationdifferently?
How do I see this frustration?
And you chose to be vulnerablebefore the Lord?
Yeah, and he made you realvulnerable, yeah.
Speaker 4 (41:25):
Yeah, yeah.
I could choose to be bitterevery single day for the rest of
my life if I wanted to, butthat's not going to fix anything
.
That wasn't working for you,was it yeah?
Speaker 2 (41:32):
And so I think, LaManda, I think a lot of people
what they do is that, just likeCaleb was, get a job, get over
it, get out of my way is thatthat's an easy path to take on
this, and so, by and large,they'll call a council member,
whatever, and get them out of myway.
I don't want to see it anymoreand it doesn't get out of the
way it doesn't.
And so, as a community, justlike Caleb not just like Caleb,
(41:56):
because he's definitely on thefront lines of this, but we're
being faced and forced to dealwith this in a way that isn't
going away and is making useither better or bitter in this
regard, and so there's such aspotlight on this.
Well, Caleb, you came on theboard.
Was that part of?
(42:18):
I want to know more, I want toserve more?
What was the reason for sayingyes to Topeka Rescue Mission
Board?
Speaker 4 (42:23):
Yeah, a combination.
I don't remember.
I was in a Bible study withGreg Armbruster, like I
mentioned, and we were eating atHanover Pancake House and
somehow homelessness got broughtup and I went on a hardcore
rant about how I think it'sinsane, how it's kind of what I
just said.
We just think that there's somany quick fixes for this
(42:45):
massive issue.
And he said you sound likeyou'd be a good fit for the
board.
And I, who really understoodthe gospel in 2018, up until
that point, I had read one bookin my entire life so he said you
sound like a good fit for theboard.
And I said first of all, Idon't know what a board is.
(43:06):
Second of all, he also I thinkhe said the name.
I think he used the worddirectors too.
So, board of directors and I'mlike if you mentioned that to
any of my teachers in the past,they'd have a stroke and I'm
like I don't know what thatmeans, but sure.
And so he connected me withLamanda.
I met with her, kind of sharedmy heart and she opened my eyes
(43:31):
to so many things that themission does that nobody knows
about, and that's one awesomething that's been cool for me to
take to work is talking aboutum, the career readiness program
for example, or yes, orrehousing, like these things are
not the things.
For whatever reason, we love badnews and so, for whatever
(43:52):
reason these things aren'tpreached about the rescue
mission, like for whateverreason you can talk about the
hundreds of insanetransformations and fresh starts
that people have, and forwhatever reason, they get bypass
and then we focus on the nextproblem.
(44:13):
Yeah, and so until we get sickand tired of the next problem.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
Yeah, exactly, then we'll find another one, like
somebody did.
Speaker 4 (44:20):
So, uh, talked with her and she invited me to a
board meeting and she pitched itas you're just going to come
kind of tell these people yourshare, your testimony, tell them
why you want to be here, and Iwas like cool, didn't think
anything of it day of show up tothe meeting.
There's cops in the room, soI'm like great what are we doing
(44:41):
in my defense?
I didn't know about that parteither but no, then LaManda's
presented with an award andeverybody's crying and I'm like
man, I got to follow this.
I'm like this is brutal.
And then LaManda says so I toldCaleb I'm going to give him
like 20 to 30 minutes to shareand I'm like I am not prepared
(45:02):
for this at all.
I'm expecting like a two minute.
My name's Caleb, hey type ofthing.
Speaker 3 (45:08):
And I set him right next to me.
I was like you're going to dofine.
I'm right here, within reachingdistance.
Speaker 4 (45:14):
Yeah, it was wild times.
How long has that been now?
Oh gosh, I don't know.
A few months.
It's really funny.
Speaker 3 (45:21):
I don't even the end of last summer.
Speaker 2 (45:25):
So I know you were on board a night of praise,
however long ago that's beenbefore that, yeah.
Speaker 3 (45:29):
I think it was July.
That sounds right.
I think it was July and metwith them the month before.
Yeah, yeah that sounds right.
Speaker 2 (45:37):
Yeah, so two questions, one for you, one for
Lamont.
What have you learned sinceyou've been in this position on
the board, which your teacherswould have never pictured you
doing?
What have you learned?
Speaker 4 (45:53):
What's different about Caleb Chalkley today?
So what I've learned?
That's a really big, broadquestion because in however many
months that's been, it's kindof like drinking out of a fire
hose.
I still go into meetings andI'm like what is that?
I think you might know whatthat would mean.
I like write down cause I got acheck with the man.
Speaker 2 (46:15):
It's like drinking out of a fire hose.
That's a.
Speaker 3 (46:17):
I'm like it's okay, fred, I got your back, Just ask
the question, it's okay.
Speaker 2 (46:21):
So you're still, it's still a big learning curve.
Speaker 4 (46:23):
Yeah, but I think the biggest things is just how
massive the mission really isand it's a well-oiled machine
and people might disagree withthat, but it's the people that
see the things that they want tosee.
For example, the problems.
It's the ones who want to ignoreor look into absolutely nothing
(46:45):
on the amazing things that havehappened, that continue to
happen, and reconnected with afamily member from however many
(47:09):
years ago, or somebody that Godtransformed years and years and
years go by through the missionthat now has this awesome
success story I guess, for lackof a better term and so I think
just learning just how importantthe mission is has been a huge
thing and just how I mean it's Ican't describe how big it is.
Speaker 2 (47:35):
So your your prayer to the Lord.
He begins to open your eyes.
You're in a strategic place onthe ground seeing these
situations.
He touches your heart in a waythat you probably weren't too
cool with.
But you're here now.
What do you think God is doingwith you?
Not only going from a streetexperience that you had that
(47:55):
began to change your directionto being where you are on TRM
board.
What does that say about God inyour life?
Speaker 4 (48:05):
That he's constantly working.
True, and the grace is for thejourney, which I think is
everybody's story.
The same grace that I have isthe same grace that you and the
next guy needs.
And just to see a mindset changethat I'm not working on, like
(48:28):
I'm not actively, like I've gotto change my mindset.
It's it's very clearly Godchanging it, cause I'm not
having to work for it, right,right, it's just you gotta be
willing to go with the flow,though, right, yeah, yeah, and
it's much better to just notfight God, cause he seems to be
a little stronger than me,because he seems to be a little
stronger than me.
And so, yeah, I think, justseeing how active he is in
(48:54):
changing my mindset, and just itseems like there's new truths
or information revealed dailythat's just like wow, that is
insane.
Speaker 2 (49:02):
Amanda, what's it mean to have a board member like
Caleb on the team?
Speaker 3 (49:08):
It's a full time job.
No, I'm joking.
Speaker 4 (49:10):
She's like I was hoping he'd leave 20 minutes ago
.
That's right.
Speaker 3 (49:13):
No, you know, I know it sounds cliche, but just even
listening to him talk andthinking back to our first time
of meeting and stuff, I wouldjust say that it is I don't know
how else to say it, other thanit is a blessing.
Like when I think of beingblessed, it's stuff that's like
so undeserving, something thatdoesn't make sense, something
(49:36):
that provides us so muchreassurance or joy and all of
that.
And that's Caleb.
I am blessed to have hismentality and you know he jokes
with me all the time, whetherit's we're going over the
finances piece or whatever,because he has all these
questions.
But that stuff is learned byall of us, right, I didn't know
(50:00):
how to do all of that when I waslearning it from you.
And sometimes society wise, weput such an emphasis on the
resume, the experience, theknowledge and all those things
and and those things are.
There's nothing wrong with it,but in this line of work I think
there absolutely is.
If we put more weight on that,then we do the heart and um.
(50:23):
So I love so many things aboutCaleb, but what I love most is
he fully recognizes thissanctification process that he's
on.
He's so honest with the otherjust magnitude.
You know we talked about TRNbeing massive.
It is.
And when you talk about thismassiveness, he's one eighth of
the person that's governing it.
(50:44):
So I understand his learningcurve on that and as CEO I want
to help him with that.
I'm still learning some of it.
But what's incredible about himis him understanding the
sanctification process of likeman.
I went from this piece where Iwas burned out and thought this
of them and now I'm here.
But I know my understanding isstill going to be deeper a year
(51:06):
from now.
And what's incredible about himis when I'm talking about
stories of like hey, just aheads up, I want to let the
board know, because there's somenames that the board knows
people by names.
That's how involved my board is, right, and so sometimes I tell
them I know you've heard metalk a lot about so-and-so.
I want to let you know theywent into treatment, he gets it.
(51:30):
And then there's sometimeswhere I'm able to say we're just
not there yet.
I had a board member who hasworked so many shifts at the
warming centers that he knew oneof the females from three
warming centers ago and shewasn't in this one to one of the
females from three warmingcenters ago and she wasn't in
this one and he brought that up,not this last board meeting,
(51:51):
but the board meeting beforethat, and I was able to unpack
this woman's story right andthis is why you didn't see her.
She's in the midst of, probably, domestic violence and she's in
this and she's in this and soshe's with this group of men now
and I was able to share thatwith the board and just looking
at their level of empathy andthis level of honestly sadness,
(52:18):
right, like oh, we hate that forher.
That brings me back to what'sincredible about Caleb, and not
just him, but all of them.
They see their ownsanctification process and they
value it.
But then they understand othersand to me that is so invaluable
(52:50):
as a CEO because I know I cancome to them about a program, an
initiative or a person that'staking a long time to get there
right or that is on their ownjourney, or an initiative that
I'm like please trust me, we'renot seeing the outcomes yet, but
I know it's coming right.
We just have to revise this orwe're having to make revisions
and they get it.
And Caleb, I think, is a bigleader right now for our board
and his transparency that webetter continue to be empathetic
(53:12):
on people as they are in theprocess of their own change If
they haven't quote unquotereached it yet.
Because if you look at all ofus, regardless of how mature we
are in our faith or whatever, wedon't quote unquote reach it
until we're made whole again.
And Caleb applies his own.
(53:33):
He calls it ignorance a lot.
I'm just ignorant with this,could you help me with this?
But he applies that and it'sturned into this beautiful
empathy and passion and advocacyfor others.
And it's because of people likeCaleb that the margin lessens
and the gap lessens because hecould be talking about his
(53:55):
professionalism, all theincredible stuff that he and his
amazing wife do, like he couldbe putting their lives on a
pedestal.
And I continually see Caleblessen and lessen and and lesson
himself, to be able to get to aplace where he fully, as much
as possible, understands thehurt of what our people
experience.
(54:15):
And to me that is invaluable asa CEO to have that as a board
member.
Speaker 2 (54:23):
Absolutely.
You know, we, in any kind ofwork and social services or just
in general in society, we tendto fall back to the need for
strategy.
How are we going to make thiswork?
How are we going to make thatwork?
How are we going to get themoney for this?
How are we going to create this?
And sometimes we lose the heartof the matter and strategy
(54:44):
takes over heart.
And so, um, you have to dostrategy, you have to budget,
you have to um, are we going tofix this?
Are we going to build this?
Are we going to addresshomelessness this way or
whatever it is?
Are we going to feed morepeople?
We're going to feed less people?
On and on and on.
But when we bring the heartinto, it is the reason and the
(55:04):
foundation for it.
Um, then it gives us themotivation to do it the very
best that we can.
And, caleb, I think and I agreewith LaManda, having been
involved with boards and theTopeka Rescue Mission board for
a very long time while you're inthe learning curve still,
everybody's learning from you aswell, because what you're doing
is bringing the authentic, rawheart of somebody who had an
(55:25):
encounter with Christ in a placethat you weren't expecting
about, an assignment that youother board members have staff
members, volunteers, topekaRescue Mission and hopefully
more and more people in thecommunity to love our neighbor
as ourself, right where they are, without judgment, without
(55:47):
wanting it just to go away.
And so I've not heard yourtestimony before.
I'm blessed to visualize whatyou experienced and the position
that you've been in as afirefighter and to be there and
God still flourishing what yousaid, yes to what you were
(56:11):
hungry for.
I want to know your way, god.
And if we try to white knucklethis thing and just do it
strategically, it won't get done.
But if we do it with the heart,the motivation behind it,
people who are listening rightnow you may listen to this
podcast about strategy andwhat's the latest thing going on
at the mission and who's theguest and who you're talking to
(56:31):
and those kind of things.
But pray to the Lord that hewill show you his heart in
everything that's being donehere, We've got a great many
things happening at TopekaRescue Mission.
You're still learning them,caleb.
It'll take a while to reallylearn all those incredible
things that God has put togetherand people have said yes to,
but if we avoid the hard partwhich is the hard part the hard
(56:54):
part is the hard part then wewill never get where we need to
go.
Lamanda, you got your finger onyour Bible right now.
Speaker 3 (57:01):
I do.
I think this might be the firsttime I've ever done this on a
podcast, because I thinksometimes there can be there can
just be issues, right, if wejust throw scripture out there
and without going into contextand all of that.
But this morning I felt veryled to bring my Bible for the
(57:22):
podcast.
I was kind of like God, whatare you doing?
Because normally we would needa whole podcast to explain
scripture so that we make surewe're not taking it out of
context.
But with many counselors thereis deliverance.
And I had a little footnote inmy.
(57:53):
This is kind of.
I have two different Bibles thatI go back and forth.
One is a leadership Bible thatI was blessed with by the board
when I came on, and then I alsohave one that's about women
leadership, so that we reallyunderstand there's beauty in
submission, but also we have towalk in what God's called us to
do.
And so this is the woman'sBible.
But the footnote on here saysthe phrase many counselors is
(58:15):
actually, in this context,considered an advisor, a
deliberator or a personconsidering action and in
purpose, implying wisdom,reflection and skill.
So again, the Proverbs withoutguidance, a people will fall.
But with many counselors,there's deliverance, and now
(58:38):
that God's revealed that to me,I'm like how fitting is that
that?
That really should describe theTopeka Rush Commission Board of
Directors right, they are agroup of counselors when we
think they've got to have theheart.
Exactly what you just saidimplies this proverb we have to
have the heart, we have to bedoing what the Lord's called us
to do, but that also comes inaction.
(58:59):
It also comes in purpose and itcomes in wisdom and skill.
Those don't have to be separate, and this proverb shows that.
But I also think that it is areminder for all of us in
leadership, in whatever positiongovernment, other nonprofits,
businesses, churches that if weare leaders, whether we are in
(59:25):
ministry or not, and even ifit's more secular, if we call
ourselves Christians, we havegot to find the balance of not
denying the truth and what God'scalling us to do, to do the
position, and I think that issomething I recognize.
I'm blessed to be able to be ascourageous in my faith because
(59:49):
I am a leader in a ministry, andso I recognize that.
But the other side of it isthere were times that I wasn't
in a ministry and God stillcalled me to walk boldly in my
faith, regardless of whatposition he allowed me to be in,
and so I hope that this is areminder to anybody in our
(01:00:12):
community that is a believer whois also a leader that if we are
not guiding and not a guidingtalk based on what God has
called us to do, in thoseprinciples, people will fall.
And that's on us, because toomuch has been given, much is
expected, but the other side ofit is where there is many
(01:00:34):
counselors it doesn't say one,it doesn't say the.
Where there are many, manyadvisors, many people that are
in deliberation, many peoplethat are using wisdom.
What will happen?
There is deliverance, and so Ithink we can use that as a
practical level, which is whatGod wanted us to take away these
(01:00:56):
truths right.
These aren't scriptures, justbiblical things that happened a
long time ago, especially whenyou're in the book of Proverbs,
there's deliverance.
So what could this look like?
It could be tied to encampments, it could be tied to housing,
it could be tied to all thesebreakthroughs that our community
could come deliverance.
But you better believe that Idon't care if we're in a secular
world or a ministry world, ifwe are a Christian and we're a
believer.
This also tells us where we areand if we're doing what we're
(01:01:19):
supposed to, there's deliverance.
These encampments, all of thesethings are controversial and
all of that.
This also is a spiritualwarfare, and this is an
opportunity for us to bringkingdom, difference on this
earth that we've been given.
And so I love that Proverbs,I'm convicted by it, I'm
challenged by it and I'm alsoencouraged that there is hope.
(01:01:41):
If we do, regardless of ourposition, what God's called us
to do and we act as thesecounselors, there will be
deliverance.
If we don't, and there is notguidance of those that are
called into leadership, peoplewill fall.
Speaker 2 (01:01:58):
Yes and amen.
You brought your Bible andpreached today, so that was good
.
Lamanda, thank you, I thinkwhat we've heard today and,
caleb, thank you so much foragain your transparency, just
laying it on the line.
I think that people today whohave listened to what you've
said are going to really bethinking about what they need to
(01:02:22):
be talking to God about, and Iknow me as well just to say be
talking to God about, and I knowme as well just to say, god, am
I being authentic with you andshow me your heart?
And so, as we've said, the hardpart is the heart part.
We can do a lot of really goodthings, but what is the heart of
God?
And so thank you for saying yesout there on the street, thank
(01:02:42):
you for saying yes to the boardof directors to pick a rescue
mission, and I know that you'repretty excited about more yeses
to come yeah, yeah, so anythinglast you would like to say for
our listeners today.
Speaker 4 (01:02:55):
I don't know, not really, I guess okay, I've been
man I was.
When she was talking previously,I was thinking about just for
me and my faith and just kind ofnavigating this conversation.
I have been a complete schmuckin the past and I will continue
to do schmuck things in thefuture, and what has been so
(01:03:19):
cool for me is just the lens ofgrace has changed for me.
So in a past of shame and guilt, anytime I messed up, it is
completely 180 to where.
Now, when I mess up, which weall will continue to mess up
throughout this life, it opensmy eyes to just how awesome his
(01:03:40):
grace is.
Rather than leading me deeperinto shame and guilt, it pushes
(01:04:01):
me closer to him, just seeinghow incredible his grace is and
how he continues to beManda.
But there's like this child'squote.
That's like it's like anillustration of like Jesus
versus religion and the religion.
One says I screwed up.
I hope my dad doesn't find out,and Christianity is I screwed
(01:04:22):
up.
I need to go talk to my dad.
And man, that's just how.
To me, that's just the lens ofgrace and just seeing how
massive it is and how necessaryit is for me and as well as the
next guy.
Speaker 2 (01:04:43):
Yes.
Well, thank you for going toyour dad and talking to him and
being willing to say, yes,you're a good father in heaven.
So if you are listening todayand you're a schmuck, you're in
a great spot.
Speaker 4 (01:04:55):
Child of God that does schmuck things, because God
can use schmucks If you don'trecognize that you're a schmuck.
Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
you need to humble yourself and realize that God
uses schmucks.
We have to look that up in ournext time to identify what the
definition of schmuck is.
We may be trying to blank out alot of things here, Josh.
I hope not, but anyway, it'sall about humbling ourselves.
Amanda, thank you for sharingyour passion, your heart.
Thank you for being in themiddle of the storm here.
Thank you for leading the way,and thank you for recognizing a
(01:05:23):
multitude of counselors is partof what this is all about.
You may be a part of themultitude of counselors today,
wherever you are listening tothis podcast, whether it's in
your church, your neighborhood,your place of work, whatever the
case might be, god's got aheart for Topeka Kansas.
He's got a heart for those whosuffer.
He's got a heart for you, andso just know that, in spite of
(01:05:43):
schmuckism, god loves us all.
Thank you for listening to ourcommunity, our mission.
If you'd like more informationabout the Topeka Rescue Mission,
you could go to trmonlineorg.
That's trmonlineorg.
Thank you for listening today.
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