Maria Barrera read an article in the New York Times about rising suicide rates among eight-year-olds and found her life path permanently altered. This Stanford-educated mechanical engineer caught the wave of new tech sweeping through education and began developing a system in which every child has access to the wellness support they need when they need it.
Today, as CEO of Clayful Health, Barrerra has rolled out a school-based online coaching and support system that removes barriers that keep students from asking for help and can connect them with the support they need as little as 60 seconds, even after-hours away from school. It's a revolutionary concept in a challenging post-pandemic world where for every 1,200 students there is only school psychologist and waitlists for support can be as long as four to six months. Barrera hopes to provide schools across the country with a new tool to support their students while taking the increasing load off of educators who can often find themselves spending more time reacting to student behaviors and wellness issues than they are actually teaching.
Find out more about Maria and Clayful Health at clayfulhealth.com.
"Outliers in Education" is a project of CEE, The Center for Educational Effectiveness. Find out more at effectiveness.org.
Produced by Jamie Howell at Howell at the Moon Productions.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
AD VO (00:00):
Outliers in Education is brought to you by CEE, the
Center for EducationalEffectiveness - Better Data,
Better Decisions, BetterSchools. To find out more visit
effectiveness.org.
Eric Price (00:14):
The kids are not alright. That's the report
coming in from schools acrossAmerica. Now imagine a school
where every single student hadaccess to the wellness support
they need when they need it.
That's exactly what we'll beimagining on this episode of
Outliers in Education.
AD VO (00:30):
I think we really need to change how we look at what we do
in schools, everything that wedo as educators, it just comes
back to people. I love it evenwhen it's hard, especially when
Eric Price (00:40):
Thank you for joining us on another episode of
it's hard. Ultimately, I mean,this is about what's best for
Outliers in Education. I'm Ericprice here is always with my
kids.
hard working big brained andkind hearted co host from the
Center for educationaleffectiveness. Eric Bolz. Hey,
Bolzie. Did I hear right thatyou're moonlighting, right now?
Erich Bolz (01:04):
I'm moonlighting.
Right now I'm writing about it.
It's a long story, but ourproducer told us to keep it
short. So bottom line,supporting a former student and
a principal role as a viceprincipal, unretired for 20 days
just to help the school Istarted teaching at make it
through their last little bit ofthe school year, really enjoying
the experience. It's a lot moretrying physically than I would
(01:25):
have imagined,
Eric Price (01:26):
I imagine and have you seen some of your own
wellness in that experience?
AD VO (01:31):
I feel like I should be losing more weight given the
amount of steps I'm putting in.
But I feel like this podcast isactually just perfectly timed
given the really unfortunateescalating behaviors that we're
seeing that I'm directly seenwith students in the field.
Eric Price (01:45):
Yeah, I think that I think we are coming into this
age and education, wherewellness and mental well being
is really rising to the top ofthe menu for educators and for
administrators.
AD VO (01:58):
Coinciding with student need, right? I mean, we're
seeing escalating student needpost pandemic. So I think,
again, this will be a timelyepisode for our folks who are
kind enough to listen to usmonth after month.
Eric Price (02:10):
Yeah, and that's exactly what we're gonna be
talking about today. And here tohelp us get right into that is
an expert in addressing thechallenges of providing wellness
support to our studentpopulation. Maria Barrera, she
is CEO of playful health. Maria,welcome to the show.
Maria Barrera (02:26):
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. I'm
so excited to get into it withyou all.
Eric Price (02:30):
Well, this is a place where I know there's a ton
of need, and I don't have a lotof information and knowledge. So
could you kind of give us alittle bit of a primer on what
mental health and wellness isfrom your perspective?
Maria Barrera (02:43):
Yeah, you started with the kids or not all right.
And that's, that's true. Andwellness is not about being
happy or Okay, all the time.
Right? The way we think aboutit, it's really about
resilience. It's about theability to come back. It's
about, hey, things happen inlife, and it's okay, and things
are gonna get hard. And that'sokay, too. How do you get back
(03:06):
to where you started? How do youmove through those emotions? How
do you identify named them andwork through them? Without
hopefully lashing out? I'm suresome of what Eric is seeing,
and, and get to a place of sortof well being once again.
AD VO (03:27):
Maria, tell us kind of what led you down this path? How
did you end up devoting yourlife to this work knowing that
the little bit I know about you,this seems like your hard left?
Maria Barrera (03:37):
Yeah, I've taken what some may call a non
traditional path to get here. SoI, I've always been a problem
solver. And I thought theproblem I wanted to solve was
that of self driving cars, so orflying cars. So I did my
undergrad and Master's inmechanical engineering. And was
that at Stanford at the timedoing learning all about, you
(04:00):
know, the biggest breakthroughsin technology and innovation.
And I met the founder ofNearpod. There. And as I got to
meet him and understand sort ofthe impact that technology was
having in the classroom, it wasthis big aha moment when like,
oh, like, you know, in SiliconValley, we're all talking about
(04:21):
these like life changingtechnologies that are going to
literally change the world thatwe live in. And here we have
technology getting into theclassroom that's changing how
students are learning and howteachers are interacting in
their day to day. And it'ssomething that at that time felt
so simple, right? It's how touse iPads and Chromebooks in the
(04:44):
classroom, and has truly, trulyrevolutionized education as a
whole. And it was such apowerful moment to realize that
bringing technology intoeducation can have these huge
effects. And huge impact in bothstudent learning and educator
happiness. So I joined thatteam, as they were just starting
(05:08):
out, that was the Nearpod. Team.
Yeah, the Nearpod team. And Igot to be at the forefront of
really, this technology wave ineducation. So as you can
imagine, I learned a ton throughthat process, I most
importantly, learned how tobuild a product that students
really want to use and love touse, that teachers will make
time for their classrooms. Andthat administrators can pay for
(05:32):
and find value in and you know,all those things are now at the
forefront of what we're doing.
But I, you know, through thepandemic sort of saw the, the
challenges that teachers werefacing and that students were
going through and how and howschool was completely changed by
(05:54):
COVID. And how that affectedstudents at the core. So it was
actually an article in The NewYork Times about the rising
suicide rates and eight yearolds, that ultimately was I
guess, like the aha moment, I'mlike, oh, I need to go work on
this now. And I didn't know whatit was going to look like. But I
(06:17):
spent a lot of time talking toeducators to parents, to kids,
teachers, and learning andseeing, you know, where there
was an opportunity to supportand to work through this problem
together. And that became whatwe're doing today.
Eric Price (06:33):
That's, that's crazy. And I think we're when I
talk with leaders in theschools, and educators, I think
one of their biggest I thinkbehaviors a big issue, but I
think, a kind of an adjacent orconnected issue. Is this
wellness, like mental wellnessand well being. So and they're,
(06:54):
they're saying, we just needmore help. So tell us a little
bit about playful? How does thatfit in with with some of that
need?
Maria Barrera (07:01):
Yeah, I mean, if you think about it behaviors and
acting out, it's really justtheir unmet needs, right? Kids
aren't just lashing out inclassroom because they're bored.
Right? It's because there'sother stuff going on. So we've
really think about clay fall interms of the school system, and
(07:21):
are working within the placewhere students are spending a
majority of their time toprovide support to every student
when and when they need it.
Eric Price (07:30):
And a kid just can go on whenever they want to.
Maria Barrera (07:34):
Exactly, I mean, demand is so high. And you can
imagine today, I mean, Eric,you've probably seen this in the
last couple of weeks, as you'vebeen in the in the school
building, kids are coming inwith all sorts of things that
they want to talk about that arebothering them. And there's just
not enough people hence why Ericis in this role to meet that
demand. Because the demand hasgotten so high. So we're really
(07:56):
looking at, okay, how do webring technology into the school
building, meet kids wherethey're at, and shift even the
access points for students toget support, right? Like,
typically, you have to gothrough a really long referral
form and make an appointment fornext Tuesday at lunchtime. And
it turns out that you needsupport, like right now. So how
(08:18):
do we help the student get thatsupport right now, so that they
don't lash out on the classroom,and help them work through it so
that they're developing a muscleof oh, here's like coping skills
that I can use, here are somestrategies that I might use to,
you know, talk to my friend whosaid something mean about me.
And that way, we were helpingthem as little things are
(08:40):
snowballing so that they don'tbecome big things on the road,
thereby making it easier.
Eric Price (08:44):
Is it like an online material that they're going
through them to help them withthat?
Maria Barrera (08:48):
Yeah, so there's an application but they can
either download on their phonesor use on their schoolish
device. So depending on thedevice policy, they can use
either or, and they log on, theyget connected to a coach within
60 seconds. So immediatesupport. So there's an actual
coach on the other end. Yep. Onthe other hand, there's, there's
someone there waiting to chatwith them and talk about
(09:11):
whatever's on their mind.
Eric Price (09:12):
Wow. Wow, that's amazing.
AD VO (09:15):
Well, and as I learned, as I started to learn about
playful, I think we need lots oflayers to put the onion back
together. And to me just havingaccess to something else really
made a lot of sense. And thenwhat I'm seeing directly in
schools today, I cannot believethe amount of time I spend
reacting. So I've got four daysunder my belt now. And I don't
think I don't think I've had twohours to work on anything other
(09:37):
than essentially responding toattendance, student issues.
Oftentimes, the principal'sworking on an other issue, that
counselor may be working on athird issue. The school is
incredibly well organized in thecontext of response. They have
really highly trained classifiedstaff who are fabulous with
students, but just having onemore thing to say, hey, as you
come in here, and you're, youknow, you're somewhat regulated
(09:59):
to be able to Have studentsaccess, you know, somebody else
outside of the school in themoment, I think would be just a
really incredibly helpful thing.
So you know that that along withstrategies that we see in our
whole educator series, you know,more personnel, more trained
personnel, I mean, all thesethings together could ultimately
work in concert, I think to helpus along. So switching gears a
little bit. You've been around alittle while, tell us how long
(10:21):
and share a success story foryou wonderful anecdote from a
student or a family or a schoolwhere, while we've seen some
pretty incredible things happen,I hope so many I know it's hard
to peg, I'll share three.
Maria Barrera (10:34):
Great. So one thing that I want to emphasize
is that a lot of students arenot ready to talk to someone in
person. So particularly, whenthey're experiencing high, you
know, high social anxiety, itmeans like looking someone in
the eye can be really scary. ordepression, things that like
(10:56):
we've been taught as a societyto be ashamed of having another
layer of support, where youdon't have to look someone in
the eye and you can just chatyour feelings. You know,
oftentimes kids come to us andsay, like, this is the first
time I've said this to anybody,but like I've been feeling this
way. So I'll start with the mostone of the most acute
situations, because, you know,while we're aiming to support
(11:19):
students, before they become bigthings, we also recognize that
in today's world, there are alot of big things that are
happening and that our studentsare feeling. So a couple of
weeks ago, a student came inthat was really struggling with
bullying and family relatedchanges. And they expressed that
they were thinking aboutsuicide. And this isn't
(11:41):
obviously why none of us gotinto education and wanting to
support students, but it's avery real thing that's happening
right now. And there, theyactually talked to a friend
about it, and they said, oh, youshould try clay fall like clay
vo could be helpful here, whichI just love that that students
are, you know, tell each otherwhere to go. makes me so happy.
(12:03):
So they came on, and they toldthe coach and we were sort of
taught, you know, we do a riskassessment to try to understand,
Okay, have you do have a plan?
Do you have the means Do youhave a timeline, and, and they
said that they're, you know,they've been trying to
communicate it to their family,how they were feeling. Their mom
kind of knew how they werefeeling, but may not know how
bad it really is. And they justsaid like, what they needed the
(12:26):
most in that moment. This was an8pm on a Friday. What they
needed was the counselorsupport. So right away, we get
on a text, start with thecounselor, the counselor calls
the family, they the studentgets to talk to the counselor,
the counselors were talked tothe mom and really sort of
supported the mom in the processof like, how to support the
(12:46):
student throughout the weekendand through, you know, these
very dark feelings, and theywere able to get the support
that they needed.
Eric Price (12:56):
Wow. And that was after hours. Yeah. Oh, that's
amazing. Where do you get yourcoaches? And what kind of
training do they go through?
Maria Barrera (13:04):
Yeah, there's two big buckets. One, they're either
former educators, a lot offormer educators coming on,
wanting to still have an impactin a student's lives. And we do
they have to go through all ourtraining, which is all CBT, DBT,
AC T base, all research based,
Eric Price (13:21):
What are those, I'm not sure what those are.
Maria Barrera (13:23):
they're all different types of therapies
specifically designed for thatare the most effective, actually
against depression and anxiety.
And for this age range, inparticular, as well as through a
medium that is chopped basedwhere like, we can't really see
your body language, but we talka lot about the impact of words
and how you talk to yourselfand, and sort of shifting the
(13:43):
mindset. And, hey, I'm not goodat this, too. I'm not good at
this yet. But the little thingsthat can that can make a really
big difference. So have formereducators and the rest are
mental health professionals. Soyou could see, you know,
licensed social workers,counselors, people who are
getting their licensing hours.
(14:03):
And we've actually heard, I'veheard a couple of examples,
people who have been goingthrough the licensing process,
and it can be so arduous to gothrough all these processes,
that doing this work has reallyreinvigorated their desire to be
in this space and sort of givingthem that extra push to stay in
the mental health profession. Sothat's a whole nother layer of
(14:26):
the value that we're creating,creating incredible coach
community that cares so deeplyabout supporting kits.
Eric Price (14:33):
Is it through zoom, or is it just audio or just
through chat?
Maria Barrera (14:37):
So, it's text.
They're essentially texting backand forth? Yeah.
Eric Price (14:41):
Okay. Wow. And I imagine that kind of that
threshold of speaking to someonereally is lowered that way. Just
it isn't as intimidating right?
Yeah.
Maria Barrera (14:48):
So, I'll share another story. That just
happened last week. Actually, astudent we just launched with a
school because they are lookingfor summer support. So even
though it's late in the schoolyear that like you What we're
going to do to get it out andhave our students get the
support over the summer. Andthis student had been thinking
about this for six months, andhad not had the courage to have
(15:12):
a conversation with their familymember. And they came in the
first week that we launched camein, like three or four times a
day to see like how fearful theywere about this conversation and
what what got all thesestrategies from my breathing
exercises, to feel less anxiousto little like sentence starters
on how to have the difficultconversation to role playing.
(15:35):
And they did it, they had theconversation.
Eric Price (15:39):
That is awesome.
Maria Barrera (15:41):
And then at the end, the family member was like,
You didn't there was nothing tobe afraid of like you didn't you
didn't need to do that. Youdidn't need to go through these
like very sort of dark thoughtpatterns along the way. And it
was just really powerful to seethem one taking that risk and
having the conversation thencoming back after to tell us
(16:01):
like it went well.
Eric Price (16:02):
Yeah, right. Yeah.
But that must be huge, right fora kid to be talking about those
kinds of Yeah, that's justgiant.
Maria Barrera (16:09):
I mean, all because all these things,
especially when you're in middleschool, in high school, like all
these things are big things.
Eric Price (16:14):
Thank you so much, Maria. We're going to take a
quick break, and then we'll beright back because there is so
much here to talk about, stickaround for more from outliers in
education.
AD VO (16:29):
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(17:12):
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Eric Price (17:31):
Welcome back, everybody. We're talking with
the amazing Maria Barrera, CEOof playful health.
AD VO (17:37):
So I'm a principal, I'm listening this podcast and I'm
sold. Yeah, I absolutely wantone more layer of support. Talk
us through what does theimplementation look like when I
commit to adding the solution atthe school level,
Maria Barrera (17:49):
we so most of us are former educators on the
team. So we are very, very awareof sort of the systems and the
challenges of implementing andeducation have made it as easy
as humanly possible to get thisrolling out. With that in mind,
we also want to make it reallyeasy for the school, and the
students to get that supportright away without adding more
(18:11):
friction. So for implementation,we actually have every student
create an account using theirschool email. So we know who
they are right? In case anythingneeds to be escalated. And we
now have weekly lessons thatteachers can do in like an
advisory period, or in othersorts of Meantime, to that are
responding to the student needs.
So if students are talking a lotabout bullying, then the next
(18:34):
week, we'll have a lesson onbullying.
Eric Price (18:38):
So that's, that's just what we're sensing in the
schools, you're talking aboutbullying. Okay. Right.
Maria Barrera (18:43):
Exactly. Exactly.
And we, every week, we have adifferent lesson. So it's not
like a preset scope andsequence, but rather, that's
responding specifically to whatstudents need. So it becomes a
lot more effective. And studentsactually are using the
strategies. So that's a big partof a successful implementation.
Because one, you're remindingkids on a weekly basis that
like, oh, by the way, remember,this thing is here for you to
(19:03):
we're teaching them we're usingthe same strategies and those
lessons that we do in coaching.
So you start seeing the samethings over and over again,
start to exercise those muscles,and three, the people are
sharing them with each other. Sothen students mean teachers also
are doing the lessons and youknow, we're like Trojan horsing
these two teachers, they'resharing it their families. So it
(19:26):
becomes like a whole communitysystem now all working on these
things together. But again,trying to make it like the
lessons are all self pacedstudents off base with the
teachers are not shipped teachanything, which is big value
prop for you at a time wheneducators are really
overwhelmed.
Eric Price (19:44):
Some real estate that I'm an administrator and I
think ballsy, just set the tableof how busy we are and how many
things that you know admin haveto do as well as teachers. But
there's so much here, wherewould you suggest that we start
on As educators with trying toget things better in this world,
Maria Barrera (20:04):
I mean, aside from talking to us, which we're
gearing up for, for the fall andkicking up a bunch of new
schools, look, you all talk alot about the importance of
student relationships and howone student can make one
relationship can make all thedifference. And we see that day
in and day out. And like, what'sinteresting with us is like,
(20:26):
it's not even one relationship,it's like one conversation can
make a difference. So I knowyou're all super busy. I know
there's a ton going on. And knowthat the conversations that you
have, and the relationships thatyou build, likely have a bigger
impact that you even realize
Eric Price (20:45):
Just when you see a kid and you have that
conversation.
Maria Barrera (20:48):
Mm hmm. Yeah.
That can make their day. Yeah.
So just continue doing thatwork. Because that's, that's
where the magic happens. So as
AD VO (20:56):
He made a hard left moved into this arena of supporting
students, clarion call beingtragic article and suicide
rates, escalating eight yearolds, what would need to change
at the policy level across ourcountry to really make a big
inroads in terms of supportingstudent mental health?
Maria Barrera (21:16):
Yeah, they've know that this is a big priority
for the administration rightnow. And I mean, look, SEL has
had a unfortunate negative sortof connotation attached to it
recently, I think there's a lotof loss of trust and
transparency between sort offamilies and educators. And or
(21:39):
just like the education systemthat is sort of getting in the
way of providing the best mentalhealth support for students. And
different states are definitelyputting funding to play into
play for school based mentalhealth support, in particular.
So I think that's a huge avenue.
And I think the more that we canhave increased transparency and
(22:01):
ground ourselves in the goalthat we're trying to accomplish,
I we're really all here tosupport kids. And if that's what
we're here for, then let'sground ourselves in that
reality, and define sort of theprocesses and the tools and
programs that best support thatend goal. But let's stop coming
to the table with differentagendas that are not serving
(22:24):
kids. I think, like, that'swhere some of the biggest
challenges that you know,talking to superintendents face
and board meetings, and the morethat we can continue to go back
to, okay, let's bring it back tothe kids. I think the better
that will be or the faster we'llbe able to move forward and
really meet them where they'reat and give them their support.
(22:44):
Like, just listen to that. Wetalk about that too, right? Like
student voice if you if you ifyou ask kids what they need,
they will tell you.
Eric Price (22:52):
Yeah, student voice is coming back again. So this is
just a personal question. Butwhy do you think there is such
an uptick in this negativemental wellness with our
students?
Unknown (23:04):
There's a combination of a lot of things, definitely
the pandemic and the lack ofsort of social interactions. And
honestly, like fear that goingthrough our pandemic, and having
a community like that was thatwas real, right. So that has a
huge effect, of course, like,impact of climate change, where
there's a lot of like societalthings. We talk a lot about
(23:26):
social media, and the impactthat social media has both on
our ability to say things we maynot necessarily say in person,
and then how that permeatesitself its way into our day to
day life. Right? Whether itbecause you know, just because
someone doesn't say to yourfaces, I mean, it hurts any
less. But social media allows usto like have a shield of well, I
(23:49):
can say mean things and like,it's not as hard, right? So I
think that's a big part of it.
And honestly, there's, you know,different social media platforms
that have really made it easierfor students to get access to,
frankly, like damaginginformation, whether it's like
(24:09):
the Tick Tock therapy or thelike, how to eat 100 calories a
day without passing out likeit's real stuff, and it's scary.
So the kind of we create morerobust digital citizenship
courses that like were to teachkids how to navigate that online
world in a way that is notharmful to them.
Eric Price (24:33):
What if I said, loneliness? And how does that
play into your thinking in someway? How would you respond?
Unknown (24:41):
Yeah, I think about that a lot with like, social
anxiety too. So both both ofthose five together because when
you're not used to interactingwith people on a day to day
basis, it becomes you becomeeven less likely to interact
with them because it's scary,right?
We've replaced sort of humaninteraction with, let's say,
(25:05):
like media interaction. Andthey're not the same. Right? And
frankly, that's one of thethings like AI. I'm like, you
know, I see some of what peopleare posting on SNAP AI. And
like, oh, look, it's my new bestfriend. Like, that's not a real
person. All right, and and whatis it going to be when you get
upset with your best friend fornot answering you in 30 seconds?
(25:28):
Because you're expecting them tobe almost like a bot to? So how
do we continue to like fosterhuman deep relationships so that
we don't end up in a placewhere, you know, we're lonely
and experiencing social anxietywith any new relationship that
we want to build?
Eric Price (25:45):
It almost seems like we don't know. Or we're not
training our kids how to torelate to to fill those needs,
those relational needs. Andwe're continuing to have a
greater will it just as a lack,just like you said, with a
similar? Yeah, wow. That's,that's really crazy.
Maria Barrera (26:02):
I mean, I'll even share that one of the our most
active time during the day islunchtime, when kids are looking
for connection. And then one ofthe big questions we get like,
how do I make friends and how doI talk to someone new? So kids
want to do it is just they maynot know how,
Erich Bolz (26:22):
So, Maria, I can see implementing this tomorrow at
the elementary school or I'mworking at what grade levels? Do
you have success? Is thissomething that a kindergartener
can can jump on and access andaccess benefit from?
Unknown (26:34):
Typically we work on upper elementary through high
school because they have to beable to read and type. So being
kindergarteners have greatreading and writing skills. Yes,
but But the earliest we've goneso far as fourth graders.
Eric Price (26:49):
Maria, this is a ton here. And I know that again,
administrators and educators,they would say this is just such
a huge need. And I love the waythat you are attacking this in
anytime, anywhere. And and Ithink it is, this is only going
to become I think, exponentiallya greater need for our kids and
(27:09):
honestly for our adults as wellin the system. So this is
fantastic. This is the time andthe show Maria, where we move to
our wizard of wrap up so ballsy.
What do you have for us inwrapping up today's thoughts?
Erich Bolz (27:24):
I shouldn't have shaved because when I when I let
the whiskers grow, and I do looka little bit like a wizard at
this advanced age. So really,starting off the bat really
appreciated the definition ofwellness, that really is
equivalent to resilience. And itdoesn't mean that we're always
happy, I think I think lots ofus just have conflicting
operational definitions aroundaround wellness and having sort
(27:45):
of that succinct definitiongrant grounding the show is
incredible. Maria's story ispretty incredible. She went to
Stanford EP and I did not Ivisited a couple of times.
Alright, I digress. But the leftturn from mechanical
engineering, but really bringingthat engineering background and
solution to to an edtechadjacent company and then
(28:08):
starting playful things a veryinteresting and compelling
personal story. Again, theclarion call being the New York
Times article with suicide ratesescalating and eight year olds
is, you know, is something thatwe should all be highly
concerned about. I think Mariajust just absolutely nailed
this, the sales conundrum for adtech or at adjacent companies,
(28:29):
we got to have products andservices that kids like teachers
will use an admin will pay for.
So only three big hurdles. Justwanted to point that out to any
of our big vendors, maybelistening. Acting out equals
unmet needs. We know that, butit's always good to hear it
again, loved this idea of a justin time tech platform, getting
to a real time coach inside of60 seconds. i The question I ask
(28:50):
is what school couldn't benefit?
I mean, what what is the harm inproviding that additional layer
of support in critiquing my ownwork lately, and summarizing, I
think I've been a little remissin time to the outlier study. So
you know, what I really lookedat today was, boy, this tool is
a catalyst for change, anddefinitely something that
something that challenges thestatus quo, which are big themes
(29:12):
inside of the common conditionsof our outlier study. My my CE
brain went kind of crazy forlove to be able to use our EES
student SEL solution and ourscreener solution to see what
impact does this make in schoolsover time, I can see control
schools and all kinds ofpossibilities with the data. I
think we could really support inthe synergies great. I love what
(29:36):
Maria had to say about it's noteven necessarily relationship. I
mean, it's maybe one, it's maybeone conversation over text and I
really harken back to whatDarren Peppard had to say in
Episode 20. And know his beliefthat we change the world one
conversation at a time. I don'teven know what snap AI is, but I
infer that I could finally maybestart making friends even if
they're bots. I just got intochat GPT last week I'm a, I'm a
(30:00):
little behind the curve, Maria,maybe maybe another call to help
remediate some of that. I thinkit's slightly. It's slightly
saddening, but also hearteningthat peak use of the solution
sometimes happens around lunch.
Because, you know, we know thatthere are kids in that lunchroom
setting, seeking connection. Andthey may be new. But I think the
more we're into this digitalworld, and we think about kind
(30:21):
of the interruption forchildren, that was the COVID
pandemic, they just may not havethe tools to introduce
themselves and begin to fosterauthentic friendships. So again,
being able to reach out, youknow, in a chat platform to to
fill that void and getting someconstructive supports from
adults all make a lot of sense.
(30:41):
I'm sure I could have covered awhole lot more ground. I think
this was an incredibly powerfulepisode seems like such a
pragmatic tool. And we'd like togive you the opportunity to fill
in any gaps that you may havebeen listening for, as I did my
best to summarize all your greatthoughts.
Maria Barrera (30:57):
You really are the wizard, I am impressed.
Erich Bolz (31:00):
I just I was paying attention. I just looked like
I'm not.
Eric Price (31:03):
even without even without the beard, Maria,
Maria Barrera (31:05):
even without the beard. No, I didn't say this
before. But I'll just leave uswith the fact that we're always
firefighting. And I'm sureyou're seeing this over the last
four days. There's so muchfirefighting that goes on in
schools. And really my one callto action is how can we take a
step back and think aboutpreventative solutions so that
(31:26):
we could stop just putting outfires, and actually stop the
fires from happening in thefirst place. And that's really
what our ultimate goal, andwe're here to be your partners
along the way.
Eric Price (31:36):
Oh, that that is fantastic. Maria, I see huge,
huge future horizons for you asan educator and as a leader, I
just think that this is itreally fills a bunch of needs,
checks a bunch of boxes. So Ithink we're gonna hear a lot
more from you in the future. Andthere's gonna be a lot of people
just clamoring for yourservices. So thank you, Maria,
(31:58):
for being on the show. It'sreally amazing. And I think
you're really trying to do theright thing. Listen to kids love
kids and support them. So thankyou very much. It's really
amazing to meet you.
Maria Barrera (32:07):
Thank you so much for having me. If you'd like
Eric Price (32:09):
to find out more about Maria and playful go to
playful.co/outliers
AD VO (32:15):
and thanks to all of you for joining us today on outliers
in education. You can find thisepisode and more anywhere you
listen to your favorite podcastor visit us
online@effectiveness.org. Untilnext time, this has been
outliers and education.
If you'd like to find out how togather the data you need to help
(32:37):
drive positive change in yourschool or district. Take a
moment to visit C E The Centerfor Educational
effectiveness@effectiveness.orgBetter data, better decisions,
better schools effectiveness.org
Outliers in Education is brought to you by CEE, the
Center for EducationalEffectiveness - Better Data,
Better Decisions, BetterSchools. To find out more visit
effectiveness.org.
Eric Price (00:14):
The kids are not alright. That's the report
coming in from schools acrossAmerica. Now imagine a school
where every single student hadaccess to the wellness support
they need when they need it.
That's exactly what we'll beimagining on this episode of
Outliers in Education.
AD VO (00:30):
I think we really need to change how we look at what we do
in schools, everything that wedo as educators, it just comes
back to people. I love it evenwhen it's hard, especially when
Eric Price (00:40):
Thank you for joining us on another episode of
it's hard. Ultimately, I mean,this is about what's best for
Outliers in Education. I'm Ericprice here is always with my
kids.
hard working big brained andkind hearted co host from the
Center for educationaleffectiveness. Eric Bolz. Hey,
Bolzie. Did I hear right thatyou're moonlighting, right now?
Erich Bolz (01:04):
I'm moonlighting.
Right now I'm writing about it.
It's a long story, but ourproducer told us to keep it
short. So bottom line,supporting a former student and
a principal role as a viceprincipal, unretired for 20 days
just to help the school Istarted teaching at make it
through their last little bit ofthe school year, really enjoying
the experience. It's a lot moretrying physically than I would
(01:25):
have imagined,
Eric Price (01:26):
I imagine and have you seen some of your own
wellness in that experience?
AD VO (01:31):
I feel like I should be losing more weight given the
amount of steps I'm putting in.
But I feel like this podcast isactually just perfectly timed
given the really unfortunateescalating behaviors that we're
seeing that I'm directly seenwith students in the field.
Eric Price (01:45):
Yeah, I think that I think we are coming into this
age and education, wherewellness and mental well being
is really rising to the top ofthe menu for educators and for
administrators.
AD VO (01:58):
Coinciding with student need, right? I mean, we're
seeing escalating student needpost pandemic. So I think,
again, this will be a timelyepisode for our folks who are
kind enough to listen to usmonth after month.
Eric Price (02:10):
Yeah, and that's exactly what we're gonna be
talking about today. And here tohelp us get right into that is
an expert in addressing thechallenges of providing wellness
support to our studentpopulation. Maria Barrera, she
is CEO of playful health. Maria,welcome to the show.
Maria Barrera (02:26):
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. I'm
so excited to get into it withyou all.
Eric Price (02:30):
Well, this is a place where I know there's a ton
of need, and I don't have a lotof information and knowledge. So
could you kind of give us alittle bit of a primer on what
mental health and wellness isfrom your perspective?
Maria Barrera (02:43):
Yeah, you started with the kids or not all right.
And that's, that's true. Andwellness is not about being
happy or Okay, all the time.
Right? The way we think aboutit, it's really about
resilience. It's about theability to come back. It's
about, hey, things happen inlife, and it's okay, and things
are gonna get hard. And that'sokay, too. How do you get back
(03:06):
to where you started? How do youmove through those emotions? How
do you identify named them andwork through them? Without
hopefully lashing out? I'm suresome of what Eric is seeing,
and, and get to a place of sortof well being once again.
AD VO (03:27):
Maria, tell us kind of what led you down this path? How
did you end up devoting yourlife to this work knowing that
the little bit I know about you,this seems like your hard left?
Maria Barrera (03:37):
Yeah, I've taken what some may call a non
traditional path to get here. SoI, I've always been a problem
solver. And I thought theproblem I wanted to solve was
that of self driving cars, so orflying cars. So I did my
undergrad and Master's inmechanical engineering. And was
that at Stanford at the timedoing learning all about, you
(04:00):
know, the biggest breakthroughsin technology and innovation.
And I met the founder ofNearpod. There. And as I got to
meet him and understand sort ofthe impact that technology was
having in the classroom, it wasthis big aha moment when like,
oh, like, you know, in SiliconValley, we're all talking about
(04:21):
these like life changingtechnologies that are going to
literally change the world thatwe live in. And here we have
technology getting into theclassroom that's changing how
students are learning and howteachers are interacting in
their day to day. And it'ssomething that at that time felt
so simple, right? It's how touse iPads and Chromebooks in the
(04:44):
classroom, and has truly, trulyrevolutionized education as a
whole. And it was such apowerful moment to realize that
bringing technology intoeducation can have these huge
effects. And huge impact in bothstudent learning and educator
happiness. So I joined thatteam, as they were just starting
(05:08):
out, that was the Nearpod. Team.
Yeah, the Nearpod team. And Igot to be at the forefront of
really, this technology wave ineducation. So as you can
imagine, I learned a ton throughthat process, I most
importantly, learned how tobuild a product that students
really want to use and love touse, that teachers will make
time for their classrooms. Andthat administrators can pay for
(05:32):
and find value in and you know,all those things are now at the
forefront of what we're doing.
But I, you know, through thepandemic sort of saw the, the
challenges that teachers werefacing and that students were
going through and how and howschool was completely changed by
(05:54):
COVID. And how that affectedstudents at the core. So it was
actually an article in The NewYork Times about the rising
suicide rates and eight yearolds, that ultimately was I
guess, like the aha moment, I'mlike, oh, I need to go work on
this now. And I didn't know whatit was going to look like. But I
(06:17):
spent a lot of time talking toeducators to parents, to kids,
teachers, and learning andseeing, you know, where there
was an opportunity to supportand to work through this problem
together. And that became whatwe're doing today.
Eric Price (06:33):
That's, that's crazy. And I think we're when I
talk with leaders in theschools, and educators, I think
one of their biggest I thinkbehaviors a big issue, but I
think, a kind of an adjacent orconnected issue. Is this
wellness, like mental wellnessand well being. So and they're,
(06:54):
they're saying, we just needmore help. So tell us a little
bit about playful? How does thatfit in with with some of that
need?
Maria Barrera (07:01):
Yeah, I mean, if you think about it behaviors and
acting out, it's really justtheir unmet needs, right? Kids
aren't just lashing out inclassroom because they're bored.
Right? It's because there'sother stuff going on. So we've
really think about clay fall interms of the school system, and
(07:21):
are working within the placewhere students are spending a
majority of their time toprovide support to every student
when and when they need it.
Eric Price (07:30):
And a kid just can go on whenever they want to.
Maria Barrera (07:34):
Exactly, I mean, demand is so high. And you can
imagine today, I mean, Eric,you've probably seen this in the
last couple of weeks, as you'vebeen in the in the school
building, kids are coming inwith all sorts of things that
they want to talk about that arebothering them. And there's just
not enough people hence why Ericis in this role to meet that
demand. Because the demand hasgotten so high. So we're really
(07:56):
looking at, okay, how do webring technology into the school
building, meet kids wherethey're at, and shift even the
access points for students toget support, right? Like,
typically, you have to gothrough a really long referral
form and make an appointment fornext Tuesday at lunchtime. And
it turns out that you needsupport, like right now. So how
(08:18):
do we help the student get thatsupport right now, so that they
don't lash out on the classroom,and help them work through it so
that they're developing a muscleof oh, here's like coping skills
that I can use, here are somestrategies that I might use to,
you know, talk to my friend whosaid something mean about me.
And that way, we were helpingthem as little things are
(08:40):
snowballing so that they don'tbecome big things on the road,
thereby making it easier.
Eric Price (08:44):
Is it like an online material that they're going
through them to help them withthat?
Maria Barrera (08:48):
Yeah, so there's an application but they can
either download on their phonesor use on their schoolish
device. So depending on thedevice policy, they can use
either or, and they log on, theyget connected to a coach within
60 seconds. So immediatesupport. So there's an actual
coach on the other end. Yep. Onthe other hand, there's, there's
someone there waiting to chatwith them and talk about
(09:11):
whatever's on their mind.
Eric Price (09:12):
Wow. Wow, that's amazing.
AD VO (09:15):
Well, and as I learned, as I started to learn about
playful, I think we need lots oflayers to put the onion back
together. And to me just havingaccess to something else really
made a lot of sense. And thenwhat I'm seeing directly in
schools today, I cannot believethe amount of time I spend
reacting. So I've got four daysunder my belt now. And I don't
think I don't think I've had twohours to work on anything other
(09:37):
than essentially responding toattendance, student issues.
Oftentimes, the principal'sworking on an other issue, that
counselor may be working on athird issue. The school is
incredibly well organized in thecontext of response. They have
really highly trained classifiedstaff who are fabulous with
students, but just having onemore thing to say, hey, as you
come in here, and you're, youknow, you're somewhat regulated
(09:59):
to be able to Have studentsaccess, you know, somebody else
outside of the school in themoment, I think would be just a
really incredibly helpful thing.
So you know that that along withstrategies that we see in our
whole educator series, you know,more personnel, more trained
personnel, I mean, all thesethings together could ultimately
work in concert, I think to helpus along. So switching gears a
little bit. You've been around alittle while, tell us how long
(10:21):
and share a success story foryou wonderful anecdote from a
student or a family or a schoolwhere, while we've seen some
pretty incredible things happen,I hope so many I know it's hard
to peg, I'll share three.
Maria Barrera (10:34):
Great. So one thing that I want to emphasize
is that a lot of students arenot ready to talk to someone in
person. So particularly, whenthey're experiencing high, you
know, high social anxiety, itmeans like looking someone in
the eye can be really scary. ordepression, things that like
(10:56):
we've been taught as a societyto be ashamed of having another
layer of support, where youdon't have to look someone in
the eye and you can just chatyour feelings. You know,
oftentimes kids come to us andsay, like, this is the first
time I've said this to anybody,but like I've been feeling this
way. So I'll start with the mostone of the most acute
situations, because, you know,while we're aiming to support
(11:19):
students, before they become bigthings, we also recognize that
in today's world, there are alot of big things that are
happening and that our studentsare feeling. So a couple of
weeks ago, a student came inthat was really struggling with
bullying and family relatedchanges. And they expressed that
they were thinking aboutsuicide. And this isn't
(11:41):
obviously why none of us gotinto education and wanting to
support students, but it's avery real thing that's happening
right now. And there, theyactually talked to a friend
about it, and they said, oh, youshould try clay fall like clay
vo could be helpful here, whichI just love that that students
are, you know, tell each otherwhere to go. makes me so happy.
(12:03):
So they came on, and they toldthe coach and we were sort of
taught, you know, we do a riskassessment to try to understand,
Okay, have you do have a plan?
Do you have the means Do youhave a timeline, and, and they
said that they're, you know,they've been trying to
communicate it to their family,how they were feeling. Their mom
kind of knew how they werefeeling, but may not know how
bad it really is. And they justsaid like, what they needed the
(12:26):
most in that moment. This was an8pm on a Friday. What they
needed was the counselorsupport. So right away, we get
on a text, start with thecounselor, the counselor calls
the family, they the studentgets to talk to the counselor,
the counselors were talked tothe mom and really sort of
supported the mom in the processof like, how to support the
(12:46):
student throughout the weekendand through, you know, these
very dark feelings, and theywere able to get the support
that they needed.
Eric Price (12:56):
Wow. And that was after hours. Yeah. Oh, that's
amazing. Where do you get yourcoaches? And what kind of
training do they go through?
Maria Barrera (13:04):
Yeah, there's two big buckets. One, they're either
former educators, a lot offormer educators coming on,
wanting to still have an impactin a student's lives. And we do
they have to go through all ourtraining, which is all CBT, DBT,
AC T base, all research based,
Eric Price (13:21):
What are those, I'm not sure what those are.
Maria Barrera (13:23):
they're all different types of therapies
specifically designed for thatare the most effective, actually
against depression and anxiety.
And for this age range, inparticular, as well as through a
medium that is chopped basedwhere like, we can't really see
your body language, but we talka lot about the impact of words
and how you talk to yourselfand, and sort of shifting the
(13:43):
mindset. And, hey, I'm not goodat this, too. I'm not good at
this yet. But the little thingsthat can that can make a really
big difference. So have formereducators and the rest are
mental health professionals. Soyou could see, you know,
licensed social workers,counselors, people who are
getting their licensing hours.
(14:03):
And we've actually heard, I'veheard a couple of examples,
people who have been goingthrough the licensing process,
and it can be so arduous to gothrough all these processes,
that doing this work has reallyreinvigorated their desire to be
in this space and sort of givingthem that extra push to stay in
the mental health profession. Sothat's a whole nother layer of
(14:26):
the value that we're creating,creating incredible coach
community that cares so deeplyabout supporting kits.
Eric Price (14:33):
Is it through zoom, or is it just audio or just
through chat?
Maria Barrera (14:37):
So, it's text.
They're essentially texting backand forth? Yeah.
Eric Price (14:41):
Okay. Wow. And I imagine that kind of that
threshold of speaking to someonereally is lowered that way. Just
it isn't as intimidating right?
Yeah.
Maria Barrera (14:48):
So, I'll share another story. That just
happened last week. Actually, astudent we just launched with a
school because they are lookingfor summer support. So even
though it's late in the schoolyear that like you What we're
going to do to get it out andhave our students get the
support over the summer. Andthis student had been thinking
about this for six months, andhad not had the courage to have
(15:12):
a conversation with their familymember. And they came in the
first week that we launched camein, like three or four times a
day to see like how fearful theywere about this conversation and
what what got all thesestrategies from my breathing
exercises, to feel less anxiousto little like sentence starters
on how to have the difficultconversation to role playing.
(15:35):
And they did it, they had theconversation.
Eric Price (15:39):
That is awesome.
Maria Barrera (15:41):
And then at the end, the family member was like,
You didn't there was nothing tobe afraid of like you didn't you
didn't need to do that. Youdidn't need to go through these
like very sort of dark thoughtpatterns along the way. And it
was just really powerful to seethem one taking that risk and
having the conversation thencoming back after to tell us
(16:01):
like it went well.
Eric Price (16:02):
Yeah, right. Yeah.
But that must be huge, right fora kid to be talking about those
kinds of Yeah, that's justgiant.
Maria Barrera (16:09):
I mean, all because all these things,
especially when you're in middleschool, in high school, like all
these things are big things.
Eric Price (16:14):
Thank you so much, Maria. We're going to take a
quick break, and then we'll beright back because there is so
much here to talk about, stickaround for more from outliers in
education.
AD VO (16:29):
School districts across the country are turning their
focus to social emotionallearning like never before. But
who is the time? Now you dothanks to the whole educator
series, an online SEL trainingthat you take at your own pace
six modules packed with provenstrategies that will make a
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content was amazing. Thisworkshop is going to make you a
(16:51):
better educator, taught by SELexpert, Dr. Greg Benner, the
whole educator series deliversstrategies to ease the stress on
you while bringing out the bestin your students. These
strategies they work, you'll beamazed at the results, not only
with the youth you serve, butalso in your own life.
He's telling us strategies thatwe can implement tomorrow,
(17:12):
Absolutely a home run.
Professional development at thespeed of life. Check out the
whole educator series online SELtraining available now from CEE
at effectiveness.org/workshops.
That'seffectiveness.org/workshops.
Eric Price (17:31):
Welcome back, everybody. We're talking with
the amazing Maria Barrera, CEOof playful health.
AD VO (17:37):
So I'm a principal, I'm listening this podcast and I'm
sold. Yeah, I absolutely wantone more layer of support. Talk
us through what does theimplementation look like when I
commit to adding the solution atthe school level,
Maria Barrera (17:49):
we so most of us are former educators on the
team. So we are very, very awareof sort of the systems and the
challenges of implementing andeducation have made it as easy
as humanly possible to get thisrolling out. With that in mind,
we also want to make it reallyeasy for the school, and the
students to get that supportright away without adding more
(18:11):
friction. So for implementation,we actually have every student
create an account using theirschool email. So we know who
they are right? In case anythingneeds to be escalated. And we
now have weekly lessons thatteachers can do in like an
advisory period, or in othersorts of Meantime, to that are
responding to the student needs.
So if students are talking a lotabout bullying, then the next
(18:34):
week, we'll have a lesson onbullying.
Eric Price (18:38):
So that's, that's just what we're sensing in the
schools, you're talking aboutbullying. Okay. Right.
Maria Barrera (18:43):
Exactly. Exactly.
And we, every week, we have adifferent lesson. So it's not
like a preset scope andsequence, but rather, that's
responding specifically to whatstudents need. So it becomes a
lot more effective. And studentsactually are using the
strategies. So that's a big partof a successful implementation.
Because one, you're remindingkids on a weekly basis that
like, oh, by the way, remember,this thing is here for you to
(19:03):
we're teaching them we're usingthe same strategies and those
lessons that we do in coaching.
So you start seeing the samethings over and over again,
start to exercise those muscles,and three, the people are
sharing them with each other. Sothen students mean teachers also
are doing the lessons and youknow, we're like Trojan horsing
these two teachers, they'resharing it their families. So it
(19:26):
becomes like a whole communitysystem now all working on these
things together. But again,trying to make it like the
lessons are all self pacedstudents off base with the
teachers are not shipped teachanything, which is big value
prop for you at a time wheneducators are really
overwhelmed.
Eric Price (19:44):
Some real estate that I'm an administrator and I
think ballsy, just set the tableof how busy we are and how many
things that you know admin haveto do as well as teachers. But
there's so much here, wherewould you suggest that we start
on As educators with trying toget things better in this world,
Maria Barrera (20:04):
I mean, aside from talking to us, which we're
gearing up for, for the fall andkicking up a bunch of new
schools, look, you all talk alot about the importance of
student relationships and howone student can make one
relationship can make all thedifference. And we see that day
in and day out. And like, what'sinteresting with us is like,
(20:26):
it's not even one relationship,it's like one conversation can
make a difference. So I knowyou're all super busy. I know
there's a ton going on. And knowthat the conversations that you
have, and the relationships thatyou build, likely have a bigger
impact that you even realize
Eric Price (20:45):
Just when you see a kid and you have that
conversation.
Maria Barrera (20:48):
Mm hmm. Yeah.
That can make their day. Yeah.
So just continue doing thatwork. Because that's, that's
where the magic happens. So as
AD VO (20:56):
He made a hard left moved into this arena of supporting
students, clarion call beingtragic article and suicide
rates, escalating eight yearolds, what would need to change
at the policy level across ourcountry to really make a big
inroads in terms of supportingstudent mental health?
Maria Barrera (21:16):
Yeah, they've know that this is a big priority
for the administration rightnow. And I mean, look, SEL has
had a unfortunate negative sortof connotation attached to it
recently, I think there's a lotof loss of trust and
transparency between sort offamilies and educators. And or
(21:39):
just like the education systemthat is sort of getting in the
way of providing the best mentalhealth support for students. And
different states are definitelyputting funding to play into
play for school based mentalhealth support, in particular.
So I think that's a huge avenue.
And I think the more that we canhave increased transparency and
(22:01):
ground ourselves in the goalthat we're trying to accomplish,
I we're really all here tosupport kids. And if that's what
we're here for, then let'sground ourselves in that
reality, and define sort of theprocesses and the tools and
programs that best support thatend goal. But let's stop coming
to the table with differentagendas that are not serving
(22:24):
kids. I think, like, that'swhere some of the biggest
challenges that you know,talking to superintendents face
and board meetings, and the morethat we can continue to go back
to, okay, let's bring it back tothe kids. I think the better
that will be or the faster we'llbe able to move forward and
really meet them where they'reat and give them their support.
(22:44):
Like, just listen to that. Wetalk about that too, right? Like
student voice if you if you ifyou ask kids what they need,
they will tell you.
Eric Price (22:52):
Yeah, student voice is coming back again. So this is
just a personal question. Butwhy do you think there is such
an uptick in this negativemental wellness with our
students?
Unknown (23:04):
There's a combination of a lot of things, definitely
the pandemic and the lack ofsort of social interactions. And
honestly, like fear that goingthrough our pandemic, and having
a community like that was thatwas real, right. So that has a
huge effect, of course, like,impact of climate change, where
there's a lot of like societalthings. We talk a lot about
(23:26):
social media, and the impactthat social media has both on
our ability to say things we maynot necessarily say in person,
and then how that permeatesitself its way into our day to
day life. Right? Whether itbecause you know, just because
someone doesn't say to yourfaces, I mean, it hurts any
less. But social media allows usto like have a shield of well, I
(23:49):
can say mean things and like,it's not as hard, right? So I
think that's a big part of it.
And honestly, there's, you know,different social media platforms
that have really made it easierfor students to get access to,
frankly, like damaginginformation, whether it's like
(24:09):
the Tick Tock therapy or thelike, how to eat 100 calories a
day without passing out likeit's real stuff, and it's scary.
So the kind of we create morerobust digital citizenship
courses that like were to teachkids how to navigate that online
world in a way that is notharmful to them.
Eric Price (24:33):
What if I said, loneliness? And how does that
play into your thinking in someway? How would you respond?
Unknown (24:41):
Yeah, I think about that a lot with like, social
anxiety too. So both both ofthose five together because when
you're not used to interactingwith people on a day to day
basis, it becomes you becomeeven less likely to interact
with them because it's scary,right?
We've replaced sort of humaninteraction with, let's say,
(25:05):
like media interaction. Andthey're not the same. Right? And
frankly, that's one of thethings like AI. I'm like, you
know, I see some of what peopleare posting on SNAP AI. And
like, oh, look, it's my new bestfriend. Like, that's not a real
person. All right, and and whatis it going to be when you get
upset with your best friend fornot answering you in 30 seconds?
(25:28):
Because you're expecting them tobe almost like a bot to? So how
do we continue to like fosterhuman deep relationships so that
we don't end up in a placewhere, you know, we're lonely
and experiencing social anxietywith any new relationship that
we want to build?
Eric Price (25:45):
It almost seems like we don't know. Or we're not
training our kids how to torelate to to fill those needs,
those relational needs. Andwe're continuing to have a
greater will it just as a lack,just like you said, with a
similar? Yeah, wow. That's,that's really crazy.
Maria Barrera (26:02):
I mean, I'll even share that one of the our most
active time during the day islunchtime, when kids are looking
for connection. And then one ofthe big questions we get like,
how do I make friends and how doI talk to someone new? So kids
want to do it is just they maynot know how,
Erich Bolz (26:22):
So, Maria, I can see implementing this tomorrow at
the elementary school or I'mworking at what grade levels? Do
you have success? Is thissomething that a kindergartener
can can jump on and access andaccess benefit from?
Unknown (26:34):
Typically we work on upper elementary through high
school because they have to beable to read and type. So being
kindergarteners have greatreading and writing skills. Yes,
but But the earliest we've goneso far as fourth graders.
Eric Price (26:49):
Maria, this is a ton here. And I know that again,
administrators and educators,they would say this is just such
a huge need. And I love the waythat you are attacking this in
anytime, anywhere. And and Ithink it is, this is only going
to become I think, exponentiallya greater need for our kids and
(27:09):
honestly for our adults as wellin the system. So this is
fantastic. This is the time andthe show Maria, where we move to
our wizard of wrap up so ballsy.
What do you have for us inwrapping up today's thoughts?
Erich Bolz (27:24):
I shouldn't have shaved because when I when I let
the whiskers grow, and I do looka little bit like a wizard at
this advanced age. So really,starting off the bat really
appreciated the definition ofwellness, that really is
equivalent to resilience. And itdoesn't mean that we're always
happy, I think I think lots ofus just have conflicting
operational definitions aroundaround wellness and having sort
(27:45):
of that succinct definitiongrant grounding the show is
incredible. Maria's story ispretty incredible. She went to
Stanford EP and I did not Ivisited a couple of times.
Alright, I digress. But the leftturn from mechanical
engineering, but really bringingthat engineering background and
solution to to an edtechadjacent company and then
(28:08):
starting playful things a veryinteresting and compelling
personal story. Again, theclarion call being the New York
Times article with suicide ratesescalating and eight year olds
is, you know, is something thatwe should all be highly
concerned about. I think Mariajust just absolutely nailed
this, the sales conundrum for adtech or at adjacent companies,
(28:29):
we got to have products andservices that kids like teachers
will use an admin will pay for.
So only three big hurdles. Justwanted to point that out to any
of our big vendors, maybelistening. Acting out equals
unmet needs. We know that, butit's always good to hear it
again, loved this idea of a justin time tech platform, getting
to a real time coach inside of60 seconds. i The question I ask
(28:50):
is what school couldn't benefit?
I mean, what what is the harm inproviding that additional layer
of support in critiquing my ownwork lately, and summarizing, I
think I've been a little remissin time to the outlier study. So
you know, what I really lookedat today was, boy, this tool is
a catalyst for change, anddefinitely something that
something that challenges thestatus quo, which are big themes
(29:12):
inside of the common conditionsof our outlier study. My my CE
brain went kind of crazy forlove to be able to use our EES
student SEL solution and ourscreener solution to see what
impact does this make in schoolsover time, I can see control
schools and all kinds ofpossibilities with the data. I
think we could really support inthe synergies great. I love what
(29:36):
Maria had to say about it's noteven necessarily relationship. I
mean, it's maybe one, it's maybeone conversation over text and I
really harken back to whatDarren Peppard had to say in
Episode 20. And know his beliefthat we change the world one
conversation at a time. I don'teven know what snap AI is, but I
infer that I could finally maybestart making friends even if
they're bots. I just got intochat GPT last week I'm a, I'm a
(30:00):
little behind the curve, Maria,maybe maybe another call to help
remediate some of that. I thinkit's slightly. It's slightly
saddening, but also hearteningthat peak use of the solution
sometimes happens around lunch.
Because, you know, we know thatthere are kids in that lunchroom
setting, seeking connection. Andthey may be new. But I think the
more we're into this digitalworld, and we think about kind
(30:21):
of the interruption forchildren, that was the COVID
pandemic, they just may not havethe tools to introduce
themselves and begin to fosterauthentic friendships. So again,
being able to reach out, youknow, in a chat platform to to
fill that void and getting someconstructive supports from
adults all make a lot of sense.
(30:41):
I'm sure I could have covered awhole lot more ground. I think
this was an incredibly powerfulepisode seems like such a
pragmatic tool. And we'd like togive you the opportunity to fill
in any gaps that you may havebeen listening for, as I did my
best to summarize all your greatthoughts.
Maria Barrera (30:57):
You really are the wizard, I am impressed.
Erich Bolz (31:00):
I just I was paying attention. I just looked like
I'm not.
Eric Price (31:03):
even without even without the beard, Maria,
Maria Barrera (31:05):
even without the beard. No, I didn't say this
before. But I'll just leave uswith the fact that we're always
firefighting. And I'm sureyou're seeing this over the last
four days. There's so muchfirefighting that goes on in
schools. And really my one callto action is how can we take a
step back and think aboutpreventative solutions so that
(31:26):
we could stop just putting outfires, and actually stop the
fires from happening in thefirst place. And that's really
what our ultimate goal, andwe're here to be your partners
along the way.
Eric Price (31:36):
Oh, that that is fantastic. Maria, I see huge,
huge future horizons for you asan educator and as a leader, I
just think that this is itreally fills a bunch of needs,
checks a bunch of boxes. So Ithink we're gonna hear a lot
more from you in the future. Andthere's gonna be a lot of people
just clamoring for yourservices. So thank you, Maria,
(31:58):
for being on the show. It'sreally amazing. And I think
you're really trying to do theright thing. Listen to kids love
kids and support them. So thankyou very much. It's really
amazing to meet you.
Maria Barrera (32:07):
Thank you so much for having me. If you'd like
Eric Price (32:09):
to find out more about Maria and playful go to
playful.co/outliers
AD VO (32:15):
and thanks to all of you for joining us today on outliers
in education. You can find thisepisode and more anywhere you
listen to your favorite podcastor visit us
online@effectiveness.org. Untilnext time, this has been
outliers and education.
If you'd like to find out how togather the data you need to help
(32:37):
drive positive change in yourschool or district. Take a
moment to visit C E The Centerfor Educational
effectiveness@effectiveness.orgBetter data, better decisions,
better schools effectiveness.org
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