Elizabeth Welborn: Heritage, Style & Sustainability

Send us a text

Elizabeth Welborn's journey from the bayous of Louisiana to founding a sustainable polo lifestyle brand speaks volumes about passion, purpose, and the pursuit of conscious craftsmanship. Growing up with a love for horses that began during childhood rides in Scotland, Elizabeth found her calling when she discovered polo in Northern California – not just as a sport, but as a way of life worth celebrating and sharing.

The magic of Stick & Ball was born in 2011, when Elizabeth combined her international business background with her creative talents to craft a brand that captures polo's essence beyond the field. Starting with handmade ponchos and vegetable-tanned leather belts adorned with Argentine buckles, she built a collection that embodies the rugged sophistication and casual elegance that define the polo lifestyle.

What sets Stick & Ball apart isn't just its beautiful designs, but its unwavering commitment to sustainability. Elizabeth passionately details her choice to use vegetable-tanned leather – a months-long process using bark and berries instead of chrome's heavy metals – creating pieces that develop a beautiful patina like a cherished saddle. Her dedication extends to fighting microplastics by maintaining a plastic-free brand and partnering with artisans in Peru to create heirloom-quality alpaca wool products that last generations.

Elizabeth's story resonates with anyone who values craftsmanship and connection – whether designing collections, hosting field-side dinners under the stars, or playing polo herself across global destinations from Argentina to Mongolia. As she prepares for her next chapter with her children graduating, she looks forward to expanding her knitwear lines and returning to polo play, always guided by her "buy less, buy better" philosophy that challenges fast fashion's wasteful cycle.

Discover how polo's traditions can inspire sustainable luxury at stickandball.com, where Elizabeth's thoughtful creations celebrate the timeless connection between people, horses, and the beautiful spaces they share. Follow her journey as she continues to redefine what a modern polo lifestyle looks like – elevated, inclusive, and deeply rooted in purpose.

Support the show

About Hive₂O Hard Honey™
Hive₂O Hard Honey is a pioneering beverage company that brings the rich, balanced taste of honey to the forefront of the industry. With a focus on innovation, quality, and community, Hive₂O offers a range of hard honey and alcohol-free beverages designed to surprise and delight with every sip.

As a thank you for tuning into this episode of Outside The Boards Podcast, Hive₂O is offering listeners an exclusive online discount and free shipping on all four packs. Use code OTBPOLO24 in all caps at checkout. Visit hardhoney.com to explore products.

About Lineup Polo
Lineup Polo was built to revolutionize how polo is managed and experienced. With a mission to support the polo community and expand the sport’s reach, the platform digitizes processes and centralizes communication. Lineup Polo is committed to the game's future.

Available as a free app and web portal, Lineup Polo allows clubs to manage tournaments, automate leagues, payments, and memberships, building a new digital ecosystem for polo.

About Outside The Boards™
Founded after witnessing their first polo match in 2012, Outside The Boards™ seeks to share the sport’s beauty, intensity, and lifestyle while addressing industry fragmentation. Through best practices, insights, trends, and consulting, OTB™ helps stakeholders and brands unlock polo’s marketing potential and navigate the sport with clarity...

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
You are listening to the Outside the Boards podcast.
I'm Daniel Leary.
For most of my professionalcareer, I have worked in
mainstream sports for some ofthe world's leading sports
organizations and properties andblue chip brands, helping to
create award-winningomni-channel marketing campaigns
, result-driven sales strategiesand impactful brand building
initiatives.
But all that work doesn'tcompare to the fun, excitement

(00:25):
and challenges I've beenfortunate to experience working
for the king of all sports, polo.
For nearly a decade, I've putmy heart and ambition into
helping advance the sport ofpolo.
I've made lifelong friendships,met some incredible people,
traveled to memorable polodestinations and heard the
craziest stories.
My goal is to share thesepeople, places and stories with

(00:47):
you and provide a uniquebehind-the-scenes perspective of
the game that breaks all thecommon stereotypes, all while
discussing key issues affectingthe sport today and the
constructive sharing of ideas,insights, solutions and
best-case studies for thepurpose of advancing polo
globally.
Every week, I will have honestconversations with polo industry

(01:07):
leaders, enthusiasts andawe-inspiring people who make
this sport great and fun to bearound.
I hope, through their knowledgeand their unique perspectives,
they will motivate and inspireyou.
Together, we will explore waysyou can make small tweaks to
boost your polo business,whether you are a club, event,
team or player.
That will amount to big changesin revenue, participation,

(01:37):
attendance and exposure Saddleup.
Welcome to Outside the Boardswith me, daniel O'Leary.
Hi everyone, daniel O'Learyhere and welcome to Season 5 of
the Outside the Boards podcast.
On this episode of Outside theBoards, I'm excited to introduce
you to a true trailblazer atthe intersection of sport, style
and sustainability ElizabethWellborn, the founder of Stick

(01:59):
and Ball.
Based in the heart ofCalifornia's wine country,
elizabeth has created more thanjust a brand.
She's built a lifestyle rootedin the culture of polo, the
beauty of the countryside anddeep respect for craftsmanship
and community, with a backgroundin international development
and a love for horses thatstarted early.
Elizabeth found herselfinspired by the polo lifestyle,

(02:19):
not just for the sport, but itsvalues heritage, adventure,
elegance and connection.
For the sport, but its valuesheritage, adventure, elegance
and connection.
In 2011, she launched Stick'nBall as a luxury brand that
would reflect that spirit,blending equestrian influence
with globally inspired fashionand home goods.
From handcrafted leatheraccessories and alpaca wool
blankets to redefined appareldesigned for everyday elegance.

(02:40):
Stick'n Ball captures therugged sophistication of the
Polo lifestyle while championingsustainable production and
artisan partnerships acrossLatin America and the United
States.
But Elizabeth is more than justa founder she's a storyteller,
a community builder and anadvocate for slow fashion and
conscious consumerism.
Whether she's curatingcollections, hosting trunk shows

(03:01):
or playing polo herself, shebrings a grounded authenticity
to everything she touches andshe's helping to redefine what a
modern polo lifestyle lookslike Elevated, inclusive and
deeply rooted in purpose.
So, without further ado, let'swelcome Elizabeth Wellborn of
Stick and Ball to the show.
Enjoy.

Speaker 2 (03:24):
Hey, we're Rosanna and Alice, the co-founders of
Line Up Polo.
Before this episode starts, wewanted to introduce you to the
platform we've built for thesport we love.
Line Up is where modern polocomes together.
For club managers, there's apowerful web platform where you
can create and publishtournaments, fixtures and teams,
and that info instantly appearsin the Line Up app, where
players, fans and organisers cansee everything in one place,

(03:48):
from live scoring and team entryto player stats and schedules.
We've made it easy to run andfollow Polo, whether you're
organising games or just turningup to watch.
Lineup makes Polo moreconnected, accessible and future
ready.
Search for Lineup Polo on theapp or play store to get started
.

Speaker 1 (04:00):
Elizabeth Goodwin-Wellborn.
How are you doing today?

Speaker 3 (04:04):
Hi, good morning.

Speaker 1 (04:06):
Dan, how are you?
I'm doing well.
I'm doing very, very well.
Hope the spring weather hasmade it to you and you're
enjoying this slightly warm upof the seasons.
I mean, it's rainy here today,so a perfect day to be inside to
do a podcast interview.

Speaker 3 (04:22):
Yeah, you know, we got kissed with some nice warmth
early this year.
Like, I think, I planted mytomatoes in March and then all
of a sudden I think we're backto winter again here in Northern
California.
So I'm glad that I producealpaca garments.

Speaker 1 (04:36):
Oh wonderful.
So what is it there now?
Is it relatively cold, or?

Speaker 3 (04:41):
It's like, it's probably like you know.
It gets down to probably likethe high 40s at night and then
during the day we're in the 60s.
So we haven't.
You know, compared to where I'mfrom, which is South Louisiana,
we're not feeling the spring inthe last like couple of weeks.

Speaker 1 (04:57):
It's like a consistent fall weather.
It sounds like it's gotta be.
It's gotta be pretty beautiful.
Is everything starting to turngreen out there?

Speaker 3 (05:04):
Well, the funniest thing.
When I first came to SanFrancisco a long time ago, I
just kind of pictured the BeachBoys and lots of sunshine and,
funny enough, the first weekendI got here, some friends of
friends had this big yacht onthe bay and we were all drinking
champagne and I jumped into thewater thinking it's going to be
maybe, you know, like, maybekind of warm.

(05:26):
But oh my goodness, that was myfirst.
It was like the first likeshock effect of Northern
California weather and water.
It's always pretty chilly.

Speaker 1 (05:36):
That's nice, though I have my sister Mary.
She lives up in the SanFrancisco area and she always
brags about the NorthernCalifornia, whether going up
there for wine, hiking, justexploring the beaches up there.
It's absolutely beautiful.

Speaker 3 (05:49):
There's so much to do and I do actually appreciate
this cooler weather.
I mean, we have this what theycall diurnal range.
That's really big, so it'salmost always, no matter what
time of year, chilly at nightand then during the day it's
usually either, you know, maybea little chilly, but are

(06:12):
moderate.
Sometimes we get some reallywarm temperatures around the San
Francisco Bay, but because ofthe Pacific Ocean it ends up
keeping it just not completelyhot.

Speaker 1 (06:18):
Perfect for a parka.

Speaker 3 (06:20):
Yeah, perfect for a parka.

Speaker 1 (06:23):
Well, I'm excited to have you on this podcast.
I've actually wanted to haveyou on for a few years now
because I wanted to have someonefrom kind of the apparel,
accessory side of the sport.
There isn't, I want to say,which are really more focused

(06:46):
somewhat on equipment, jerseysand the gear that's associated
with it.
Very little has to do withlifestyle.
And someone might say to me Dan, you're wrong, you know Ralph
Lauren?
Okay, but I have to make itclear you know, when it comes to
Ralph Lauren and Polo, I don'tsee much of Ralph Lauren and
Polo, aside from Nacho Fregasas,who is a fragrance model for

(07:11):
years.
But, like in terms ofsponsoring, partnering, getting
involved with clubs, I never sawthat at all from that brand.

Speaker 3 (07:20):
I have a lot of respect for him with growing
such a strong, incredibleinternational brand and from
what I think I remember from hisstory I think Ralph began I
want to say it was in his 50sand he has just done an
incredible job of building areally big brand.
It is not easy to build afashion brand, I can tell you

(07:42):
that.
But yeah, I don't know.
I think polo is just such aninspirational as well as
aspirational sport and I don'treally know, I think, all of his
stories of how that became hisbrand.
But in starting stick and ballI fell hook line and sinker for
the sport and I think it'sbecause as a kid I loved horses

(08:04):
and I loved a kid, I lovedhorses and I loved being outside
and I loved sports and allthose things ever since I was
really young.
And when I happened upon thesport here in Northern
California very first day that Iwas at the club just close to
San Francisco in Petaluma, itall clicked and it wasn't too
long after that that that Istarted dreaming about a brand

(08:26):
that you know, really, trulyencapsulated like this feeling.

Speaker 1 (08:30):
Let's start from the beginning, then.
So you just mentioned it.
Now, where are you originallyfrom?

Speaker 3 (08:36):
So I'm originally from Louisiana, a small town
called Houma, south of NewOrleans, and you know, grew up
there.
My family, quite a fewgenerations, are from there,
french families that settledthere a long time ago, french
and Italian, and there's a longstory as to how I got here.
Which part do you want?

Speaker 1 (08:56):
Okay.
Well, what took you out of NewOrleans?
Was it school?
Yeah, School.

Speaker 3 (09:00):
first I went to a small Jesuit college in Mobile,
alabama, called Spring Hill.
I just loved my experiencethere.
It was awesome and you can callalmost everybody there Still
really close friends to this day.
And that school sent me abroadto study in Costa Rica.

(09:21):
So I learned Spanish down thereand also learned about weaving
down in Guatemala too.
So that was my first.
I would say like I mean, Iloved doing creative things when
I was young.
I sewed, I crocheted, I lovedpottery, I painted all those
things.
But really learning abouttextiles didn't start until, I
think, probably when I went toGuatemala.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
So you didn't major in anything textiles or fashion.

Speaker 3 (09:47):
No, I majored in international business in
Spanish, okay, and love businessas well.
I feel like I have a little bitof like right brain, left brain
, and it probably leans a lotmore toward the right brain
though, but I really enjoyedstudying business, and early on
in high school, my high schoolhad sent me to this entrepreneur
camp in Louisiana, and that'swhen it was just.

(10:10):
It was so exciting.
There were so many things aboutbusiness.
I loved branding and I lovedcommercial production and I
learned a lot about that there,and both I think the love of
textiles as well as having thatbusiness foundation, is what
probably gave me the courage tostart my own company.

Speaker 1 (10:31):
So how were you introduced to polo?
It doesn't sound like it wassomething that was generational.

Speaker 3 (10:36):
Oh no, not generational at all.
So, being from South Louisiana,almost everybody works in the
oil business in some sort of way.
You're either working in thebusiness or servicing people
within the business, and my auntand uncle were living in
Scotland at the time with aplatform fabrication company,
and so I went out there to visitthem and to live with them, and

(10:58):
that's where I learned how toride horses.
And so that was when I was 12.
And I just loved every single.
The first day that I went outto the stables, I knew that I
wanted horses to be a part of mylife in every way, so I wasn't
able to get into jumping.
After that, when I returnedhome, and just you know, anytime

(11:19):
friends and I could like go tosome stables that were not too
far away about 30 minutes awayand we would just ride the back
shell roads.
So I learned how to jump, youknow, learned how to jump
anything.
I mean, I just had no fear.
You know, barebacked on theNorth Sea every day and just
loved it.
But then it was a very, verydifficult transition, because

(11:41):
when I came back you know when Isay I was born on the bayou we
were right there, like a coupleblocks away from the bayou and
there's just no, there were nohorse pastures or anything.
And that was fun andadventuresome, but I still, like
, hadn't figured out how to gethorses back into my life full
time.
And I'll fast forward a littlebit.

(12:01):
After college I moved toColorado to work in the telecom
business.
That company then startedsending me down to Argentina,
and that was in the 90s, and sothat was.
I started to, you know, fall inlove with the Argentine culture
way back then.
But funny enough, even though Iwas going down there for work,
I really wasn't in the knowabout polo.

(12:23):
And so then my company moved meto Asia and I lived in Manila.
And when I was in Manila at theManila Polo Club, that was my
first polo match ever, and Ijust remember getting dressed up
, you know, to go to the match.
But then while I was on thesidelines wishing that I was out
there playing, but you know,back then this was in 97 and 98

(12:47):
when I was there, I mean, therewere no women playing, so I
didn't think that there was, youknow, a way to play, but still
I was daydreaming about it.
And then fast forward a littlebit more, my company brought me
back and then I moved toCalifornia and I was invited to
go to a small polo club inPetaluma and that was Cerro

(13:08):
Pompa Polo Club.
And when I got there I was justlike, wow, this is everything
that I love.
Because then there was, likeyou know, fun Mexican and
Spanish music and everybody wasdrinking mate and having a
barbecue.
And I'm like, oh my God, thisis paradise.

Speaker 1 (13:27):
And so I'm curious, though what was the motivating
factor to pick up polo?
When, early in your childhood,you were doing dressage, I was
jumping, yeah.
So like, what made you want toswitch?
Because you know you havepeople like if you're jumping,
for example, you're always goingto seek out those opportunities

(13:48):
, and what have you?
But jumping into the world ofpolo, that's a big leap.

Speaker 3 (13:54):
Well, I don't know, I think it can be a pretty
natural transition actually.
I mean, I think I wasdefinitely born with a lot of
courage and I wasn't too afraidof too many things.
I still, when I went toPetaluma, did not think that
women could play.
I mean, like when I was therefor the first few years, I mean
I was just like cooking andhelping with the charity events,

(14:16):
and you know that I starteddaydreaming about this brand
that I could make, and thenfinally there was one girl that
started playing there who's nowa really good friend.
And then finally there was onegirl that started playing there
who's now a really good friend,lauren Dickinson.
I'm like, wow, well, maybe,maybe, just maybe I could,
probably, you know, I can trythis, but the horses that they
had there were just kind ofcrazy.
I mean like really bucking andcrazy.
So I was still.

(14:42):
I was maybe a little bit scared, but then you know, so then I
was coming up with the idea forthe, for the brand and the
company, and I can't remember ifyou and I had talked about,
like, how I got started with it,but when I was making some
ponchos for one of the charityevents, you know everybody loved
the ponchos.
They always wanted to have, youknow, the ponchos after the
event I'm like, well, how funwould it be if I also made some
leather belts and had someblankets and that.

(15:04):
Just it kind of started andevolved naturally.

Speaker 1 (15:08):
At that point, were you just like doing what you've
already learned and youmentioned, like I was doing
crochet and things like that.
So were you just taking thingsat that point that you just knew
how to do in terms of creatingyour own apparel?

Speaker 3 (15:19):
Definitely and probably like, and also like
trying to figure out what is thenext step.
Like I really want to designsome wovens and I want to design
knitwear.
So where do I get started?
And so the place that I thoughtwould be a great place to get
started was Argentina, and soback in I think it was 2010 or
maybe it was spring of 2011.

(15:40):
I'm like I'm going to startthis brand and actually the
funniest thing too, dan, I'llrewind a little bit.
I had been working after telecom.
I began working for the Mondavifamily up in Napa and working
in wine and food, and so I'mlike you know, how fun would it
be for us to have this rosé?
You know, make this great roséwine, and a lot of people were

(16:01):
not drinking rosé at that time,but the Mondavis had introduced
it to me and I'm like how fun wecan have this really great new
wine and I could design thisbeautiful label and it can be
called stick and ball and it'sjust this easy wine that we can
drink after the game.
So that was one of my ideas.

Speaker 1 (16:19):
So really, stick and ball was probably a wine at
first.

Speaker 3 (16:22):
Literally the first thing I trademarked was wine and
olive oil.
And then, you know, when itcame to the creativity aspects,
I'm like, yeah, no, I think Ireally want to get into apparel
and accessories.
So I booked my flight down toArgentina and I'd already met a
lot of friends that introducedme to different people down

(16:43):
there.
And I'd already met a lot offriends that introduced me to
different people down there.
And vlogs, or blogs I thinkback then they were calling it
vlogs were like just gettingstarted on websites and I'm like
, well, if I'm going to startthis brand, I at least have to
hop on a horse and learn how tostick and ball right.
So I booked a lesson with LucaDiPaola I think he was like a
seven or eight goaler down inArgentina and went out to his

(17:06):
place and I had a girlfriendfrom Louisiana that was with me
and we got on the horses and hekind of left us.
He's like here's the mallet,you know.
Here's how you swing, have fun,you know.
And then he goes off to playchuckers.
Well, he finishes chuckers,comes back and we're still like
swinging at the balls and, likeyou know, trying to figure this

(17:27):
out because we had so much fundoing it.
We couldn't stop laughing.
It was the best feeling in theworld as soon as, of course, you
make ball contact and I knew atthat point I'm like I could
care less if any women areplaying.
I am going to play the sportLike this is just way too much
fun, and so I canceled all of myappointments in Argentina with

(17:47):
people in textiles and literallyplayed polo for the next week.
It was really funny.
By the end of the week, lucashad me on a horse in chuckers
and it was like you know, someof the best players from
Colombia and Argentina.
And I don't even know how Ihung on.

(18:08):
I definitely was not swingingat the ball, I was hanging on
for dear life, but it was justand I just knew I wanted to do
it forever.

Speaker 1 (18:16):
Well, it sounds as though, like up to that point,
you have a bit of a sense ofadventure.
Well-traveled, oh, totally yeah.
Entrepreneurial spirit, willingto take on risk.

Speaker 3 (18:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (18:26):
So maybe that's a defining personality with people
who play polo.

Speaker 3 (18:30):
Oh, I would probably say that for sure.

Speaker 1 (18:32):
Yeah, that risk taker , that entrepreneurial spirit,
that world traveler, adventurertype of individual.

Speaker 3 (18:40):
Well, I think, doesn't that go along with the
analytics in the polo industry?
It does.
Overwhelming majority of poloplayers are CEOs.
I think yeah.

Speaker 1 (18:50):
I forget who I had that conversation with.
I think it may have been fromthe girls with Line Up Polo.
We were talking about themindset of a polo player, and
just the sport in itself takesevery ounce of your mental and
physical capacity.
So in a day filled withmeetings, you know for your

(19:10):
business and what have you toescape to polo, which takes
every single ounce of you.
I can see why major CEOs,entrepreneurs, do that.
It's an entire escape, an entireescape.
So it's almost therapeutic in away to go ahead and do that.
It's an entire escape, anentire escape.
So it's almost therapeutic in away to go ahead and do it.

Speaker 3 (19:26):
Oh, it's a hundred percent therapeutic.
It was my therapy for many,many years.

Speaker 1 (19:32):
But now you've managed to take the sport and
create a clothing brand.
So now you get the best of bothworlds.
Now you're in it, in it.

Speaker 3 (19:38):
I don't think you can escape In every aspect, yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:45):
Yeah, in every aspect it's there P-O-L-O, so you're
kind of going down the path.
I feel like there was a breakin your career from like 2007 to
2011.
Yeah, there was Stick and Ballat one point.

Speaker 3 (19:54):
Was a wine and olive oil company, or could have been,
it could have been, it was youcould probably still pursue that
.

Speaker 1 (19:59):
I think you should still pursue that.
And when did Stick and Ballturn into officially a clothing
brand?

Speaker 3 (20:12):
And what was your first product?
Yeah, officially it ended upbeing the fall of 2011.
I, you know, in spite of melike canceling all my
appointments, I still pulledtogether.
Like I ended up purchasing somereally beautiful handcrafted
belt buckles while I was down inArgentina, and so when I got
back, I ended up, you know, handmaking a bunch of leather belts
and then incorporated theArgentine like belt buckles from

(20:36):
my travels.
Those were my first leatheraccessories and I'd already
started producing becauseearlier that spring, I had gone
to Peru and went to a textileshow and, after interviewing
what felt like hundreds ofdifferent people, I found the
people that I wanted to workwith to make my ponchos.
So I started with a poncho andthen that was the first thing

(20:58):
that I was producing.
It was actually working withsome incredible artisans in
Cusco that were part of a USAIDprogram that was helping in
education, in families andcommunities there in textiles,
so it was great to partner withthem.
They're still one of mypartners to this day.
They make a good bit of myponchos.

(21:18):
And then, yes, I incorporatedthe belts.
There's a funny story aboutthose belts.
Actually, I invited my bestfriend from college with me to
go celebrate my 40th birthday bygoing to the New Orleans Polo
Club.
I hadn't been.
You know as much as I was fromHouma in Louisiana.
I didn't even know about theNew Orleans Polo Club until I
started doing research.

(21:38):
And then I'm like I've got togo there.
That's where I want my 40th tobe.
And so she met me there andwe're at the, at the Royal
Sinesta hotel, and she comes inand she's like what in the hell
are you doing?
And I have leather and stufffor cutting and burnishing and
the stuff that it's all over thefloor of the hotel room.
She's like I thought we werehaving your 40th birthday.
You know, we first had tofinish making some belts,

(22:09):
finished making some belts, soit was that.
And then I also began with somethrows, some woven throws.
So I took the pattern of whatwas on a lot of the Argentine
horse saddle pads and thenstarted making some blankets.
And so those are my first threedesigns.

Speaker 1 (22:20):
So were you manufacturing all this by
yourself.

Speaker 3 (22:24):
So you were stitching and crafting belts in your
hotel room in New Orleans andsustainable textiles and, like
alpaca, is just one that's justso great to work with and it's

(22:46):
so soft and it lasts and itdoesn't pill and those sorts of
things.
So you know all the researchthat I did in the beginning
about textiles, I knew that Iwanted to work with that.
You know, in both our appareland in our home division.
And you were sourcing most ofyour stuff from where, did you
say again, and you were sourcingmost of your stuff from where,
did you say again yeah, so Iwould send my designs to the

(23:11):
artisans that I had met when Iwas in Peru earlier that year,
and then they produced thedesigns and some were done by
hand, and then I had others thatwere done by machine, and to
this day I still balancehandwork with some machine work
too.

Speaker 1 (23:21):
Now, is all of your material sourced out of Peru, or
is leather sourced fromsomewhere else?

Speaker 3 (23:26):
No, yeah, so different places.
So Peru is still like a bigstaple for our company in terms
of what they produce.
And then alpaca, peruviancotton, tanguise cotton.
They're just really great withthose specific textiles and they
are incredible knitters as wellas weavers.

(23:47):
Some of their wovens, I justthink, are so I mean you just
can't, you can't top them.
They're pieces that will lasthundreds of years.
They're heirlooms, for sure.
And then my leather.
Not too long after that I wentto Milan because I was buying
some US vegS, veg tan leatherbut what I was getting on the
market and I didn't know a lotof sources, so I was sourcing

(24:09):
locally but it was just a littlebit rougher than what I really
wanted.
So I heard that you know, milanhad the best leather show, and
so I went out to Milan and wascompletely overwhelmed because
it's like thousands andthousands of tanneries.
But I'm a good investigator andI was doing a lot of talking

(24:34):
with all the different vendorsand tanneries and what I learned
is that there's two differenttypes of leather.
There's chrome tanned leatherand then there's vegetable
tanned leather.
Chrome tanned leather isobviously with chrome.
It's with heavy metals.
I wanted to have clean productsand so I went with the
vegetable tanned tanneries,which use bark and berries to

(24:54):
preserve the leather, and it's alot more expensive, but it's so
much better for the environment, not just with the waste of you
you know, the water andeverything from the tanning but
also against your skin and then,as it decomposes, into the
environment.

Speaker 1 (25:10):
I'm just curious, like is that style tannery,
uh-huh, if that's the right wordto use.
Is that something that's new?
Has that been something that'sbeen done for years?

Speaker 3 (25:22):
Yeah, vegetable tanning is the most ancient
tanning out there.
I don't really remember whenchrome tanning started.
I want to say 100 years ago, Idon't know exactly, but when
chrome tanning started.
I mean it takes months topreserve a hide with the
vegetable tannins and it takeslike a day to do it with chrome,
and so it's definitely ashortcut.

(25:44):
It transforms the leather.
It's much different leatherafter, whereas the vegetable tan
leather to me was for sure itwas about the environment, but
it was also because to me italso just it looks like the
saddle right.
So when you get a brand newsaddle, you know, usually from
Argentina, they're that likereally kind of fleshy toned,

(26:04):
very light leather that once itgets into the sun the very first
day it starts to get darker.
Sun the very first day itstarts to get darker and as you
use it it starts to have its ownpatina and it's just so
beautiful.
I just I love saddles.
I could have them all around myhouse.
I love them so much, they're sopretty, and that's how I wanted
our leather accessories to beas well.

Speaker 1 (26:26):
Do you have like a wall that looks like a tack room
but isn't an attack room?
It's just for decor.

Speaker 3 (26:31):
I would.
I don't.
At the very moment it's my kidsand I and we're in a, you know,
not too large of a house, somost of my polo stuff is,
unfortunately, in my garage.
I do have some incredible coolsaddles that I did get from
Argentina.
They're more decorative.
I have a couple of those.
They're the gaucho stylesaddles, and then I have some

(26:53):
from Mongolia too.
So those are in my house.

Speaker 1 (26:56):
Oh wow.
The way that you describedmaking leather is just like the
same way that it's barrel agewhiskey.

Speaker 3 (27:06):
Yeah, isn't that also part of the beauty?
I mean, to me, part of thebeauty of making something is
just not throwing a bunch ofchemicals on it.
I mean, everything to me ispart of the story that makes
something in the process thatmakes it beautiful.
I mean, I don't want to beusing any products that I know

(27:29):
are going to make the waterdirty for us to drink or make it
toxic for animals.
I've always loved nature waytoo much for that, which, by the
way, we have our B Corp.
I don't know if you're familiarwith those.
It's called a B Corporation.
So instead of a C corporation,a B corporation really kind of

(27:50):
focuses on people, planet andprofit instead of just profit.

Speaker 1 (27:54):
Okay, no, that's great to hear.
Yeah, yeah, a certification andmovement for for-profit
businesses that prioritizesocial and environmental impact
alongside profit.
I did that quick Google searchright there.

Speaker 3 (28:04):
You did.

Speaker 1 (28:05):
Yeah, there's a lot of information, no.
But speaking of sustainability,though, I did read a great
article that you guys werefeatured in, I think, last year
in Forbes about sustainabilityand textiles.
Yep, how did that come about?

Speaker 3 (28:18):
That came about?
I was part of a group of brandsin New York during Fashion Week
last week and all of us aresustainable brands, and so that
Forbes editor was there andinterviewed each of us and
wanted to highlight the workthat we're doing, you know, and
taking this road of making cleanproducts it's the only way that

(28:39):
I would ever want to do thisbrand, by the way, but in doing
that, it's not easy and it, youknow, it does pinch your margins
and it's more expensive andeverything else, but it also is
so satisfying knowing that whatyou're making is not bad for the
planet.

Speaker 1 (28:53):
What would make the textiles leather not sustainable
?
What would be chemicals?
What would be used in them?

Speaker 3 (29:00):
that's With leather and with any textiles.

Speaker 1 (29:03):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (29:04):
Well, I mean, like one of the biggest polluters is
petrochemical based textiles.
So you're looking at thepolyesters and the nylons and
all of those and I'm so deepinto sustainability so forgive
me if I think right now it'skind of known among everyone
about how bad microplastics are.
Yeah, we have a majormicroplastic pollution problem

(29:27):
around the world now and it'sonly getting worse.
And you know a lot of theseyarns that are made.
They don't biodegrade, theyjust break up into small pieces
and then they go into the waterand then they go into the air
and they're in our bodies andneed right now to stop using
those.
You know, and even if they'rerecycled if they're recycled and

(29:52):
you're still putting it intothe washing machine, then
microplastics are still goinginto the water, you know.
So I chose when I first startedthe brand that I wanted to be a
plastic-free brand.
So I do whatever I can to tryto avoid plastics when I can.

Speaker 1 (30:07):
Okay, now you're opening up a great door, but
it's something I think to takethe opportunity to quickly talk
about, because you didn'tmention types of clothes like
polyester.
What were some of the otherones?
Polyester?

Speaker 3 (30:19):
Polyester, nylon.
I mean, there's so manydifferent types of petrochemical
products used.
There's also in leather,believe it or not, and I go into
this on our blog.
Actually, I just published onea couple of days ago talking
about this, or today I think itwas today I published.
But when I was in Italy thattime I was telling you about

(30:40):
Milan one of the things that Iwas being offered by almost any
of the chrome tanneries was alsosomething called PU coated
leather and it was a 10th, ifnot a 20th, of the price of the
vegetable tan leather.
And it's because it's coated inplastic and I didn't know that

(31:01):
this was going on.
But, like most brands are usingthis and it's just so cheap and
it doesn't matter how theanimal is being cared for.
It can have scars all over itbecause they're just going to
put plastic on the outside of it.
So the PU coated stuff made mepretty grossed out.
I definitely knew I didn't wantto go in that direction, but

(31:21):
that's also a pretty big problemin our industry as well.

Speaker 1 (31:26):
So nylon polyester.
I'm assuming clothes like dryfit clothing, things like that,
are all petrol based.
It's in everything.

Speaker 3 (31:36):
I mean.
You just got to start readingyour labels, you know.

Speaker 1 (31:39):
And when you're washing those materials, bits of
microplastic are coming out inyour washing machine and going
back into the water system.
Yeah, yes, there you go.
You've heard it everyone.

Speaker 3 (31:51):
I don't think it's a secret.

Speaker 1 (31:53):
But those details matter, they really do I really
do?

Speaker 3 (31:56):
I mean, it mattered to me even in the very beginning
.
It's why I've done things soslowly, so carefully, and I had
a lot of friends that weretelling me I don't think it
really matters, I don't think alot of people really care and
I'm like, I think, a betterenvironment at the end of the
day.

Speaker 1 (32:36):
Before we dive back in today's buzzing conversation,
we'd like to give a specialshout out to this season's
Outside the Boards podcastco-presenting sponsor, hive 2.0,
the pioneers of hard honey.
Where passion meets palate.
Hive 2.0 isn't just a beverage,it's a mission.
With over 30 years of flavorinnovation, hive 2.0 brings you
hard honey, a drink rooted inthe tireless work of their

(32:58):
in-house team, from beekeeper tofull cycle production.
They move hives, protect queensand steward honey with purpose,
crafting each can to be morethan a drink.
It's a story, a movement, avibe.
But Hive 2.0 doesn't stop atHard Honey, introducing their
new Manuka Water Collection, aline of refreshing alcohol-free
options that redefines hydration, infused with the natural

(33:21):
goodness of Manuka and inspiredby hive-born wellness.
These include Manuka ArtisanWater and Sparkling Spring Water
.
Both wines come in flavor,forward styles like sour wine,
hops and ginger beer.
All 0% ABV, so you can enjoythe buzz without the booze,
whether you're poolside,pitchside or post-ride.

(33:42):
These sparkling and stillwaters are the perfect sip for
any scene.
From historic Egyptian honeyremedies to modern
porch-pounding pleasures, hiveDuo celebrates flavor with
purpose.
So whether you are sipping onAtomic Berry's Tropical Tang,
the nostalgic hit of PB&J or theclean, crisp notes of Manuka
water.
Hive Duo has something forevery palate.

(34:03):
Raise a can to taste innovationand the bees.
Thank you, hive Duo, forsweetening our lives and now
hydrating them too.
Stick around to the end of theepisode for a special discount
code at hardhoneycom.
And now back to the interview.
Stay tuned, stay refreshed andstay curious.
I love that you brought upsustainability because I thought

(34:25):
to myself and this is from mylast season I spoke with
Alejandro Patro from Patro PoloFields and we could have had
another episode entirely on.
This was just aboutsustainability in polo in
general, and you know what doesthat mean to our sport.
You know we're in vast openareas and open land.
You know, are we usingchemicals?

(34:45):
Are we maintaining our fieldsin an environmentally friendly
way, to how things arefertilized and how clubs can
take the manure of horses and soon and so forth and make it
into fertilizer for your fields,and he was emphasizing like
there's ways to do this.

Speaker 3 (35:03):
There are ways.

Speaker 1 (35:04):
For Polo to really lead the sustainability effort.
If people would just make thatextra effort to do that.

Speaker 3 (35:10):
Yeah, you know one of the things so out here in
California, one of our naturalresources can sometimes be tough
to get and that's water.
If we're having a droughtseason, obviously polo fields
need a lot of water.
But we did a lot of researchyou know research back at the
club a long time ago the clubthat I was helping to manage and

(35:31):
we found a Bermuda fromAustralia.
I think it's even called likeBermuda number seven and it's
drought tolerant.
So sometimes it's just so,instead of just trying to feed
the problem that you have, it'sreally just try to solve it and
definitely I think from themanure that we already have at

(35:53):
clubs that can be used to manyother bioproducts that are out
there right now.
I was actually just speakingwith a friend of mine, bonnie
McGill.
She manages the UC Davis poloteam and her daughter was an ag
major and actually that's one ofthe things that she's doing
right now.
Raeann McGill, I think she'srepresenting a bio fertilizer

(36:15):
company out of Kansas, butthey're all there and because
I'm in this field andsustainability left right,
center, I'm hearing of differentcompanies coming up with
incredible solutions to problemsthat don't require us to throw
on chemicals onto the field, andI'll touch on that a little bit
more in that, being fromLouisiana, you know we're at the

(36:37):
Gulf of Mexico from theMississippi River.
All of the nitrogen that is,you know, this synthetic
fertilizer, so the nitrogen thatcomes from petrochemicals then
goes back down to Gulf of Mexicoand then we have hypoxia and so
you have thousands of squaremiles of dead water because of
it.
And so you know there aredefinitely ways that we need to.

(37:01):
We need to think beyondshort-term and we need to think
beyond just our local area, theimpact that these decisions that
we're making.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
Yeah, it's a great topic to cover.
It really is, and I applaudwhat you guys are doing in terms
of just the sustainabilityclothing in general and it's
beautiful as a result of it, andit's one of those things where
it's like, look, you don't haveto cut corners and mass produce
something and use petrol,chemicals and what have you.
When you stick with tradition,you can have a equal product

(37:34):
that lasts the same, if notlonger.

Speaker 3 (37:37):
Yeah, you know an interesting place to look to.
So a long time ago a friend ofmine was doing some photography
for National Geographic andwe're in in Cuba.
This was I don't know 25 yearsago and I was just amazed at the
beauty of the agriculture there.
And they didn't have access topetrochemicals because of the

(38:00):
embargo and they couldn't bringit in.

Speaker 1 (38:02):
It was just too expensive.

Speaker 3 (38:04):
And so there the farmers.
Because we're out there, youknow, shooting a lot of farmers
for the magazine and they'remaking teas for the land, and I
remember my grandfather and myparents even making some special
teas to use.
But then, you know, those werewhen I was really young.
And then when Home Depot startsto like here's this and here's

(38:25):
how you get rid of weeds andit's chemicals left, right,
center, you forget thosetraditions.
So I don't know how hard it isto make a huge tea for your
humongous polo field, but I dothink that there are just better
ways than the ones that arecreating toxicity in our
environment.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
Well, I mean, do we just say that because of the
embargo, cuba is probably one ofthe most environmentally
forward-thinking countries?
Still because of that embargo,the Cuban tobacco has never been
touched by chemicals.

Speaker 3 (38:56):
It's either earth or water or the human hand from
rolling it and working it andair drying it.

Speaker 1 (39:14):
That's incredible.

Speaker 3 (39:15):
It really is.

Speaker 1 (39:16):
Yeah, part of me even just polo in general is even to
build a case of, like you know,when I managed the Polo Club.
I mean it's beautiful out there, I mean it's untouched grounds
that are still being used.
I mean at one point there's 13,14 polo fields before they
became golf courses.
Because it's closed now.
Right, it's closed now, butlike, at one point during its

(39:37):
height, you know, it had so manypolo fields.
Then golf came in.
Naturally it became a reallyincredibly popular sport 40s,
50s, 60s and it began to kind ofwither down and only to a few
polo fields.
Now there's two of them thatexist out there.
But you know polo is open land,open spaces, open green spaces.

(39:58):
And those are really, reallyhard to find as the population
increased.
I mean the people who have polofields and they hold on to them
.
I mean, well, what stinks isthat you'll have people who
don't have dynasties, theirchildren, their grandchildren
won't pick up the sport.
Then you find them sellingtheir land to developers and
then it's gone, all that acresand acres of land pristine.

(40:21):
I mean just having people rideand horses in your backyard or
just around the area and thenpoof, it's all gone, just to
build a subdivision.

Speaker 3 (40:32):
We just lost.
It wasn't lost to build asubdivision, but we
unfortunately just lost theSerra Pompa Polo Club, which is
one of my favorites and that'swhere I started and that was in
Petaluma.
So was that a similar situationwhere it was someone retired, or
no, yeah, one of the familieswanted to get out of polo and so
I think it just kind of forcedeverything on the market.

(40:54):
So you know it's the Amesfamily, actually the foundation,
that bought it.
So the furniture, you know,beautiful, one of my favorite
modern furniture companies theyended up purchasing for the
foundation, but there's no plansof development.
It's actually a lot of it'sabout sustainability, so it's

(41:14):
tough to lose that one.
That was 30 minutes away fromSan Francisco, which you know.
That was one of the things Iknow you had mentioned.
You wanted to talk about what Ithought was what's one of the
challenges that we also face asa sport, and I think everybody
could probably agree that that'sone of them.
I mean, you know, for myself,like I actually I don't know if
I told you this I took the lastfour years off of playing, so

(41:36):
with my two kids you know Iwanted to be there for their
sports.
They're both really bigathletes.
My daughter was in volleyballand lacrosse, my son's football
and lacrosse, and so I I took abreak and my son's graduating
this year, so you're going toexpect me back on a horse this
summer, and they never took upthe sport huh.
We played and we even did thishuge like West Coast tour and

(42:01):
they played with me in JacksonHole and Aspen and Vancouver.
I mean we just had so much fun.
I just like had visions of,like the Von Trapp family my two
kids and me, you know playing,but it's just, they're in the
sports with their friends.
You know, part of the bestthing about sports is the
camaraderie and I'm so glad thatthey chose the sports they did,

(42:22):
because my daughter wasincredible at it.
She decided not to play incollege, but my son is going to
continue to play football.

Speaker 1 (42:29):
That's great.
And then there's somethingabout riding along with your
children on horseback, isn'tthere?

Speaker 3 (42:33):
Yeah, there is, there is, and I'm hoping that they'll
join me again sometime.

Speaker 1 (42:38):
I bet they will.
We've talked about that.
There's always a gap.
There is a gap always.

Speaker 3 (42:44):
But going back to Deanna the issue though now, so
I'm looking to get back into it,but I'm also, you know, I'm
working.
I have my company, I consultfor other companies as well, so
I'm super busy.
I'm not living on Serra Pompaat the Polo Club anymore, which
I did for a while and that waslike heaven, and so it's harder
for me in terms of, like,getting horses again and

(43:06):
maintaining those horses nowbeing over an hour away from a
club.
And so one of the things in thebusiness I was just going to
ask you, because I know you haveyour finger to the pulse on
this so much more is what is theUSPA doing to support the lease
horse program, Because I thinkthat's going to be integral for
me in getting back into polo.

Speaker 1 (43:27):
It's critical.
I think more and more.
I think like here in Chicago,for example, the Las Parisas
Farm and Polo Club they're biginto that to make it much more
accessible instead of thefeeling of, oh, you rode for a
year or two, now buy a horse.

Speaker 3 (43:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:43):
And feeling the sense that you're pressured into
doing so and that's just not theway to go about it.
That mentality needs to escapethe leasing programs better.
Other countries do it very,very well.
I just had a great conversationwith the folks at the Chantilly
Polo Club in France and they doit and they've been incredibly
successful at it.
And, granted, you need to havethat polo population and that

(44:06):
level of interest to sustain aleasing program for sure, but no
doubt about it, it's just goingto be far easier to bring
people in more and for longerperiods of time before anyone
decides to write a check to havetwo, three, four, five, six
horses.

Speaker 3 (44:26):
Well, and also there's that you know when
you're either just starting orfor me, I'm going to be getting
back into it.
I mean, I'm not going to wantlike super fast horses this
summer.
I definitely would preferprobably the ones in Mongolia
where I can kind of pop on, Ican play with like a 40 mallet,

(44:46):
but yeah, so I would not evenwant to be in the market right
now to buy horses, because Iwant to definitely level up my
skills again and my riding andeverything over the next year or
two.
So the lease horse program isreally important, but I know
that's something that I'm notthe only one that struggles with
that and wants to figure thatout.
We do have some options forleasing here, which is great.

(45:07):
I do know some clubs strugglewith that too.

Speaker 1 (45:11):
And even the breeding program I think in the US is
starting to get better.
It's at Cotterall Polo Club inUtah.
There's a wonderful breedingprogram that's out there and a
lot of those horses that aretrained become polo ponies and
go all throughout the entirecountry.
I think there's a place inTexas and in Virginia that are
trying to do the same as well,to replicate what's been

(45:32):
successfully done in Argentina.

Speaker 3 (45:34):
Aren't horses going to be tariffed now?

Speaker 1 (45:37):
Yeah, yeah, probably that's.
The other thing is that ChipMcKinney, who founded the Gay
Polo Club, who's a fantastic andone of the most brilliant minds
in the sport.
He's great, we've talked manytimes in his understanding of
the economics of the mostbrilliant minds in the sport.
He's great, we've talked manytimes in his understanding of
the economics of the game incomparison to how US operates
versus other countries.
And you know, the horse in theUS is now a luxury.

(45:59):
It's viewed as entertainmentand luxury.
It's no part of our everydayculture which makes it
incredibly expensive versusother countries and those are
just kind of just the naturalprogression of things.
It's sad.
I wish the united states didmore to celebrate the horse.
in my opinion, yeah the animalhas been with us through thick

(46:21):
and thin, and also a lot ofpeople are unaware of or
completely oblivious to theimportance of polo has had in
our armed forces and themilitary adventure and
exploration and things like that.
All you got to do is turn on1923 yeah yeah, I mean.
That's why I continue to followthe game.

(46:43):
You know, have interviews likethis.
Discuss it because I've fallenin love with the game.
The people the places areincredible.
People think that this is anelitist sport and look, it's
expensive.
I will give you that.
But there is a humbleness tothe game.
Even going to like there's ablue collar sense to it.
When you start to walk into thestables, you know where

(47:05):
everyone has horse shit on theirshoes and they're drinking beer
at a barbecue.
Part of me is like it's nodifferent than going to Mobile,
alabama, to watch a footballgame.
That's how I see it.
You know we can go and talk alittle bit about the marketing.
Side is that there aredifferent demographics and
interests in this game and someare exploited and some are not.

(47:27):
And it's the ones that are not,I feel like, have the best
stories and that the most peoplecan relate to.
And those are the reasons why Ifell in love with the game.
It wasn't wearing seersuckersuits and sucking down Vuclaco
champagne.
It was drinking a Yellow JacketCoors Banquet beer with my boss

(47:48):
, you know, on some foldingchairs in the back of a pickup.
I mean, it doesn't get anybetter.
And it's.
The camaraderie of the peopleis another thing.

Speaker 3 (48:00):
For a while there I was developing this whole
tailgate line.
I still do chairs and glassesand stuff like that, but yeah, I
mean that's just part of thefun, for sure.

Speaker 1 (48:16):
Yeah, no, absolutely the camaraderie of the sport.
I mean it is such a unique clubto be in and it's a club to
have a lot of pride in.
It's a club where you play thegame.
You can go anywhere in theworld and someone will saddle up
a horse for you to go playstick and ball, yep, anywhere in
the world.
I am not even a polo player byheart and I can call my friends
up in New Zealand, india,argentina, ireland, the UK,

(48:40):
anywhere.

Speaker 3 (48:41):
I've played in so many different countries and
clubs.
It's been such a gift.

Speaker 1 (48:47):
It's one of the most amazing things I mean.
From your perspective, though,are there things in the sport
that we're doing well or notdoing well?

Speaker 3 (48:56):
That's a broad question, but you know, first of
all I'm in California.
I'm very far away fromWellington.
I think that's where a lot ofstuff happens, right, that's
kind of the epicenter for polo.
I think that's where a lot ofstuff happens, right, that's
kind of the epicenter for polo.
So I'm not involved in knowingon a day-to-day like what's
really happening over there atthe center.
What I can say is just, I guess, from my perspective, what and

(49:31):
making things that peoplecherished was I was like a
recruitment headquarters forpolo out here.
I brought so many people intothe sport and it's, you know,
more of that, I think, can beused in the sport.
You know, just constantlytelling people and inviting them
.
Otherwise it's not somethingthat's on anybody's radar, you
know.
I mean, maybe they go to theRift Clique tournaments and they

(49:53):
have a lot of fun, but I don'tknow if at those events there's
also like hey, sign up if youwant a lesson.
So I think, for all of us toremember how we're actually
ambassadors of the sport, I'dpretty much say that anybody I
know does try to recruit friends, but maybe that's just

(50:14):
something.
It's something I look forwardto doing again once I have a
brick and mortar store once more.

Speaker 1 (50:19):
Yeah Well, I mean, if the idea is to break away from
normal society or the crowds andgo to a place where there's an
element of tranquility andquietness there there's small
groups of people that share thesame passion, the smell of the
bar and the smell of theoutdoors that polo is your game,

(50:46):
then it is your game.
It's an escape.
It really is, and you can drawin comparisons with either other
sports or other interests, likemy family's big lake life.
We will do anything to get tothe lake.
You know it's the same thing.
Anyone will do anything to getto the barn.
They will have their stuffpacked and they immediately will
leave after work and get outthere to escape the concrete
jungle that they're in.
So I think that's one of thebig recruitments.

(51:07):
It's not riding a horse, it'sjust the environment that you
get to escape to every day,every weekend.

Speaker 3 (51:15):
The other thing I think that we could do more of
is have more fields.
When I'm out and about anywhere, I'm always looking at
something, looking at a piece ofproperty.
I'm saying, hmm, yeah, thiscould be great.

Speaker 2 (51:28):
I can fly in that field.
Now I can fly in that field.

Speaker 3 (51:31):
I was actually at a resort recently in California
where I think I've planted theseed.
In terms of this just would bean incredible thing for your
resort, yeah.

Speaker 1 (51:42):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (51:43):
But incorporating it into resort life.
Actually, I think it'd be sucha great idea, because people are
on vacation, they are probablya little bit more adventuresome
and they're like okay, let me goahead and try this.
Like Mandarina down in Mexico,I've had so many friends that I
introduced to that resort andthey were so excited, even if
they just went to a game.

(52:03):
But for the ones that hopped ona horse and have taken lessons
too, it's something that they'llbe able to look fondly on that
memory forever.
And if they took up the sporttoo, I mean, that's also
incredible.
So we need to have those moreopportunities for people to get
involved.

Speaker 1 (52:20):
Yeah, I want to go back to you Stick and Ball real
quick.
I don't think you've answeredthe question.
How did you come up with thename stick and ball?
Everyone in Poland knows whatstick and ball is, but why did
you choose that name?

Speaker 3 (52:33):
You know, I think when I looked at the sport and
fell in love with it and fell inlove with the lifestyle and
wanted to create this lifestylebrand, what I thought was the
white space and the market hadto do with everything that we've
just been talking about.
Like, this community, thiscamaraderie, this casual aspect,

(52:54):
this almost hop on the horseand just hit the ball around
aspect of the sport hang outwith friends and stick and ball
is that more casual way ofgetting out on your horse and
knocking the ball around.
It's kind of like a pickupsport, kind of a you know form,
and I thought it was perfect forthe brand because, you know, I

(53:18):
don't create formal wear.
I create beautiful, elevated,everyday wear.
So, yeah, it alluded to thatcasual aspect.

Speaker 1 (53:28):
Totally makes sense.
That's, the sticking ball isthe casual side of the game,
that's for sure.
I was talking to I hope Iremember this correctly Benoit
Pierre, with the Chantilly PoloClub.
They had, I think they calledit, patio polo I think that's
what he called it which whichwas basically it was a
combination of arena polo but ongrass.

(53:49):
I think that's what the name ofit is.
I I'm going to regret if I gotit wrong, but it was a catchy
name that they called it.
So basically, what they did isthey took a polo field, cutting
it half and did three on three.
That's basically what it wasyeah, and they would play with
an arena ball.

Speaker 3 (54:05):
I'm looking them up.

Speaker 1 (54:08):
Hopefully I have that right French Valley Club.
Yeah, in France.

Speaker 3 (54:14):
I think my friend Guillermo Lee works there.
I'm pretty sure he's out there.
Yeah, I haven't been to thatclub yet.
I've played in Provence, whichwas really cool, and the family
there that's behind it.
They've been around in thesport for a few generations and
they're just the nicest peopleever.
But yeah, I haven't played inParis just yet or around.

Speaker 1 (54:36):
So, since 2011, when the second ball came about, at
what point did it blow up andyou started to do far more
different products, accessoriesDid it blow?

Speaker 3 (54:45):
up.
Did I miss something?
I feel like I've grown like ata snail's pace, but it's the
only thing I could do with.
You know, I'm a single mom, somanaging, trying to be an
incredible mom and growing abusiness at the same time and at
the time too, a long time ago,I was also managing the club.

(55:06):
We definitely haven't blown upand, kind of purposely, I don't
think I could have handled likehuge scale while also trying to
be there for my kids.
But when we started to probablybe more known is when I was
getting out on the road anddoing these pop-ups, especially

(55:26):
also when I was doing these bigdinners.
So I love, you know, growing upin Louisiana, food is such a
part of our culture, and so whenI got involved in the Polo Club
in Petaluma, that was one ofthe first things that I started
doing was like cooking andentertaining, and so I brought
that out onto the polo field andwe're literally taking the

(55:47):
tables and putting them onto thepolo field and having these
beautiful, fun dinners at nightunder the stars.
And so I was getting theserequests from clubs all over can
you come and do that for us?
It was so much fun, but let metell you that is no easy task,
especially when you have like ahundred people and the Jackson

(56:08):
Hole Polo Club we literallyCraig, gave me, like in the
cabin there's like a whatever, afour burner electric stove and
I don't know, like a hundredpeople it was so it was crazy.
So very long story.
Getting out and doing thosecommunity events is when we
started to get known and thenfrom there I was invited to be a
part of the Hampton Classic andGreenwich Polo Club and I kind

(56:32):
of started making this circuit.
I would get to the East Coast acouple of times a year, try to
get to Aspen or Jackson Hole.
I've been many times.
So that helped, I think.
And then I was starting to hearpeople say, like in
conversations oh yeah, I knowstick and ball, and when I would
hear that it would make me soexcited, and especially when I

(56:57):
was going somewhere and I wouldeither literally bump into
somebody at the airport that had, like you know, one of my
sweaters or ponchos or bags andthat made me really excited too.
So it's getting out there, it'samong certain groups, it's
where you put the energy andI've had to scale back quite a
bit in the last few years justtrying to be there for my kids.
But just wait, because they'rethey're graduating, so I'm back

(57:19):
in the saddle.

Speaker 1 (57:20):
You're going to be out, back out of the trail again
.
Yeah, totally.
Do you want to be small?
I mean, do you want to stayboutique?

Speaker 3 (57:27):
No, no, I definitely want to grow.
I just want to grow carefully.
You know I've been in thisbusiness now.
I've been in fashion for 14years now and the number of
brands that I've seen go under Ican't even count.
It is a like I told you, Ithink in the beginning it's very
, very difficult industry.
You're designing products.

(57:47):
You're putting all of yourmoney into making these products
.
You usually have to put yourmoney out there to whomever
you're making it with way inadvance, sometimes six months in
advance, depending.
Now I've been in the business along time.
I negotiate things muchdifferently.
But and then and then you haveto sell it right.
So then when you get the goods,you have lots of inventory and

(58:08):
you sell it slowly, piece bypiece.
Well, that's at least what youdo kind of in the beginning as a
brand.
But now it's much different andI have a lot of contacts.
I have contacts at the majordepartment stores.
I have contacts.
But I've I've said no to manyopportunities because of terms,

(58:28):
and there's the terms in theindustry can really put you
under.
If somebody's not going to payyou in a year after they receive
goods, which is part ofcommonplace in fashion then you
can go under.
I mean you just don't haveenough money to then produce for
the next season.
Didn't go under, I mean youjust don't have enough money to
then produce for the next season.
So I was purposeful to go back.

(58:52):
My first opportunity inwholesale was actually a local
boutique here in Mill Valley andI didn't know that they were
going through financialhardships at the time, but I was
getting an article published inthe San Francisco Chronicle and
so they were really excited totake on my brand and we sold so
much and I kept bringing productto them, they kept selling it
and then it took me four monthsto get my money back.

(59:16):
So, yeah, you have to be reallycareful for these pitfalls in
this business.
So negotiating your contractsand having a contract in place
is really important, and I alsowanted to do this industry
different from many other brands.
I mean, when I first got in it,I was speaking with a potential
salesperson who is a friend ofmine and she's just great and

(59:36):
she works for big brands in NewYork and she loved stick and
ball and she wanted to work withme sticking ball and she's she
wanted to work with me.
She's like okay, the firstthing I'm going to tell you is
you need to produce sixcollections a year and I'm like
wait what you know?
So not having had theexperience before I came in
maybe saved me Because, again,like if you're putting your cash

(59:58):
out there for six collections ayear and something like COVID
comes up or these tariffs, or Imean there's just so many things
that can just take you under,or a store that's just not
paying you back, yeah, Well also.

Speaker 1 (01:00:12):
I mean, look at the companies that you're working
with to produce these items.
They have a skill and a craftI'd imagine that it's not like
you're working with.
You know the manufacturers ofNike.
You know Nike shoes in China,so these are probably small
business individuals who alsoneed to be paid as well.

Speaker 3 (01:00:31):
I have a lot of artisan work.
I also do work with somefactories, so I have factories
to produce my knitwear.
They're all certifiedsustainable factories too.
But Banana Republic is acompany I did a collaboration
with a couple of years ago ayear and a half ago and that's
an example of you know, I'm alsoa proponent of being able to do
beautiful handcrafted things atscale, and we did.

(01:00:56):
You know, we produced lots ofthings for that.
It was a small collection, butmany numbers of those things for
them, and that was all done byhand.
We have a really wonderfulsupply chain in place and we
have this ability to do bothmachine-made garments and
handcrafted garments.
But I'm not in line with howfashion is right now, which we

(01:01:22):
don't even have six seasons ofthe year.
So what are we doing?
You know?
I mean I'm really big about how.
I think we all need to slowdown a little bit, buy less, buy
better.
I mean, that's what I've alwaysbeen about.

Speaker 1 (01:01:37):
Is there any sort of particular product that you're
looking to do in terms ofexpanding what you currently
offer?
Anything on the horizon?

Speaker 3 (01:01:47):
I love design so much so when I started the brand, I
was immediately into whatleather goods and home goods and
apparel, and I've even donejewelry as well.
So I've done quite a bit inmany different categories.
I think what I would like to dois to have a little bit more of
an expansion in women'sknitwear as well as men's

(01:02:11):
knitwear as well.
I did a run of linen shirtsfrom Italy one year and the guys
just loved it.
I actually have a lot of guysthat follow my brand, even on
their email, and I don't knowhow they've hung on for so long,
because I'm so slow to getstuff for guys.
It's not that I don't want to,but I'm not funded by a private
equity company.
I do it all myself.
So the expansion's slow, butthe linen shirts were such a hit

(01:02:36):
but it was really funny too.
This is another lesson.
I made them in Italy and so Iwas going based on.
They were actually hand-donelinen shirts.
It was an Italian fit andAmericans are not an Italian fit
.
They're so much bigger and so Isold out of, like you know,

(01:02:57):
double XLs and the XL like rightaway.
But to get through the otherones, I still even have some of
the small and the medium.
So so yeah, I've had so manylessons learned along the way
and I'm just so excited toreally sink my teeth into my
brand.
You know even more when Ibecome empty nest soon.

Speaker 1 (01:03:17):
Yeah, how about anything on the men's side?
Anything new on there?
Any recommendations?
Do you need recommendations?

Speaker 3 (01:03:23):
Recommendations?
Yeah, give them to me.
Like I do want to produce, Ihave access to, like some of the
most sustainable and beautifulcotton, and so I do want to do
some beautiful polo shirts, youknow, just like not just the
regular stuff, like some reallycool shirts that also just last
forever and don't have anyplastic in it.
So that's something I want todo.

(01:03:44):
They won't be cheap, but theywill be great pieces that you'll
have forever.

Speaker 1 (01:03:49):
I think I forgot to tell you this I still have your
socks that.

Speaker 2 (01:03:54):
I got from you, you do, I do.

Speaker 3 (01:03:56):
That was a while ago.

Speaker 1 (01:03:57):
That was a while ago that I remember getting I think
it was at the Houston Polo Clubyeah, I think, making your
rounds, and it was at theHouston Polo Club yeah, I think,
making your rounds, and I had apair of gray socks that I got
from you and I still have them.

Speaker 3 (01:04:07):
Yeah, they will last forever.
That's actually some of thatcotton that I was telling you
about.
It's the Pima cotton.
It's so beautiful, it is a longstaple cottons.
It doesn't break apart aseasily, and you know.
So, aside from the pilling, itjust lasts longer and it's just
so soft it's nice.
Yeah, I've been asked to wearsocks.

(01:04:28):
It's something on my list too.

Speaker 1 (01:04:30):
I do as much as I can no, you got to compete with the
bonobos, or I'm trying to thinkof the other one I know.
Right, that's been made popularout there these days.

Speaker 3 (01:04:40):
Some slippers I think bonobos is owned by Walmart.
Now right.

Speaker 1 (01:04:43):
Oh, is it Okay?
Have you ever been offered tobe bought at all?

Speaker 3 (01:04:48):
I get emails yeah, I do get emails Random people,
though and I have a lot ofpeople, especially out here,
that really believe in the brandtoo, so I have some mentors out
here that are great Like.
One of my mentors is the formerCEO of Banana.
She just did such an amazingjob of bringing that brand back
and putting quality back on theshelves as well, and I'm a part

(01:05:11):
of a lot of other incrediblegroups, like the Female Founder
Collective with Rebecca Minkoff,and so I have a lot of people
that really believe in the brand.

Speaker 1 (01:05:20):
Well, I have always been a big fan of the brand.
I always have.
I think getting involved is oneof the I think, the few brands
that are dedicated to the sportand its lifestyle, Gone in on
the ground early but still, Ithink is just one of the few
that is more into the lifestyleinstead of like gear for the
most part, which is relativelysaturated.

Speaker 3 (01:05:41):
So you gotta leave weird to the people that really.
I mean, it's so technical, LikeI don't want to make something
that could fail and causesomeone to get hurt.
I'll do saddle pads.
That could be pretty cool,Right?
But I'm a creative.
I like the fashion side ofthings.

Speaker 1 (01:05:57):
Yeah, you know what, elizabeth, I can't thank you
enough for joining me today andsitting down and talking about
yourself, the brand.
I really enjoy it.
The product is fantastic.
Everyone, please get a chanceto go to stickandballcom.
Some of the most beautifulponchos, belts, leather goods,
blankets that you're going towant.
I will probably go on a scarfshopping spree.

Speaker 3 (01:06:21):
Those are the greatest gifts.
They're so soft, they're sonice.

Speaker 1 (01:06:25):
For a guy that's in usually a sweater weather for
six months out of the year, orlonger.
In Chicago, those will go along, long way, that's for sure.
And the colors are phenomenal.
They're beautiful.

Speaker 3 (01:06:38):
Oh, thank you.
I do have like VIP codes forfriends and fellow polo players,
so feel free to DM me.

Speaker 1 (01:06:48):
Yeah, no, no doubt about it.
Like I was just on your website, I'm trying to think of the
color that it was that I think.
I would think it was either thecharcoal or a camel, yeah, even
the olive.
I mean, those are beautifulcolors.

Speaker 3 (01:07:01):
One of the things Dan back in that sustainability
side of stuff.
When I started picking, likethe natural colors of the alpaca
, it just kind of created thecolor palette, and the same with
the vegetable tannins.
They're all natural, soeverything kind of matches once
you go in that direction too.

Speaker 1 (01:07:17):
We could talk for hours.
I mean, we will have to haveanother conversation just on.
Just just talk about style yeah,exactly but again, thank you so
much for taking the time.
Encourage everyone to take alook at this brand.
It is absolutely stunning.
Men or women, decorate yourhome.
If you're looking to have thatelement of equestrian or polo in
your household, I know myoffice is filling up with it,

(01:07:41):
that's for for sure, thank you.
But thank you so much and heylook forward to getting together
soon.
My sister is in California Also.
A good buddy of mine owns awinery out there, lofty Wines in
Sonoma.

Speaker 3 (01:07:54):
Oh nice.

Speaker 1 (01:07:55):
So if you're looking to do a stick and ball wine, I
can make that introduction.

Speaker 3 (01:07:58):
You got it.
That sounds awesome, if youwant a rosé.

Speaker 1 (01:08:00):
They have a rosé, I think.

Speaker 3 (01:08:02):
They do.
I'll throw it one of these days.

Speaker 1 (01:08:06):
But I'll make sure I give you a call when I'm out
there, that's for sure.

Speaker 3 (01:08:10):
And same with Chicago .
I'll be going out there to dosome leather work, so I'll give
you a ring.

Speaker 1 (01:08:16):
All right, excellent.
Well, thank you Elizabeth,thank you, dan.
In 2012, the founders ofOutside the Boards witnessed
their first polo match and werestunned by the sport's beauty
and brutality.
Few sports, if any, have thesecombined qualities.
The sport's grace, intensityand warlike imagery create a

(01:08:36):
shock and awe viewing experiencelike none other.
Combine this with the sport'sparty-like atmosphere and
lifestyle and you have a recipefor success.
Today, the sport has yet towitness its full potential.
The industry is fragmented,riddled with politics and
inexperience.
Outside the Board was purposelydesigned to change all that and

(01:08:56):
bring clarity to the sport byintroducing best practices,
insights, trends and consultingservices to industry
stakeholders and interestedbrands so that they can reach
their marketing potential andbetter navigate the sport.
Whether you're a club seekingcustom sponsorship and marketing
solutions or simply looking forstrategic advice, we encourage
you to contact us today orsubscribe to gain access to

(01:09:19):
industry insights.
Visit us at OutsideTheBoardscomor to learn more, or email us
at info at OutsideTheBoardscom.
Let's change the game.
And that's a wrap for today'sepisode.

(01:09:42):
Our heartfelt thanks to ourseason sponsor.
And that's a wrap for today'sepisode.
Our heartfelt thanks to ourseason sponsor, hive 2.0, for
helping bring outside the boardsto life.
Hive 2.0 is reimagining what itmeans to drink with purpose,
with their signature hard honeyline and their brand new Manuka
water collection.
Made for those who crave flavorwithout compromise, whether
it's buzzworthy kick of hardhoney or the alcohol-free

(01:10:02):
refreshment of Manuka ArtisanWater and Sparkling Spring Water
, hive 2.0 delivers unmatchedtaste, backed by tireless
dedication of their hive-centricproduction team.
Choose from styles like sourwine, hops and ginger beer all
0% ABV and enjoy the sweetreward of nature's work at every
can.
Hive 2.0 celebrates theincredible efforts of the

(01:10:23):
honeybee, blending tradition andinnovation into every drop From
hive to hand.
This hydration and celebrationat its finest.
As a thank you for tuning in,hive 2.0 is offering outside the
boards listeners free shippingand exclusive online discount on
all four packs.
Use code OTBPOLO25 at all capsat checkout on hardhoneycom.

(01:10:48):
Don't miss the chance toelevate your drink experience
with Highto's delicious andpurpose-driven creations.
Stay refreshed, stay curiousand remember every sip counts
with Highto.
Until next time, take care, andwe'll see you on the polo field
.