December 9, 2024 • 34 mins
What happens when the body screams stop, but the mind charges ahead? Dr. Evan joins us to share his riveting tale of triumph over an ultra marathon, where unexpected cramps at mile 10 tested his limits and how pickle juice turned into an unlikely ally. Discover how this grueling race paralleled his work as a chiropractor, blending tales of extreme endurance with insights into mental resilience and emotional breakthroughs.
Have you ever tapped into hidden energy reserves you never knew you had? We explore the invigorating power of pushing personal boundaries and uncovering boundless energy, drawing from personal anecdotes and literature. From unexpected achievements fueled by friends' motivation to the serendipitous path into chiropractic care, this episode unravels the seductive allure of overcoming challenges and how life often has a way of unfolding perfectly.
As we journey through self-discovery, we reflect on the transformative power of mindfulness, meditation, and communication. Personal growth intertwines with professional evolution, leading to fascinating encounters and future collaborations with engaging figures like Caleb. The episode paints a holistic vision of proactive healthcare, emphasizing a shift towards empathetic, patient-centered practices that honor the intricate dance between body, mind, and spirit. Join us for a rich blend of personal insights, philosophical musings, and a fresh perspective on the interconnectedness of life's challenges and triumphs.
Stroll through the laid-back streets of the Palm Harbor community with this informative podcast, proudly brought to you by Donnie Hathaway with The Hathaway Group, your trusted guide and local expert in navigating the diverse and ever-changing property landscape of Palm Harbor.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Donnie Hathaway (00:00):
Dr Evan, welcome to the podcast.
Dr. Evan Rudd (00:02):
Thank you, Stoked to be here yeah.
Donnie Hathaway (00:04):
I'm excited, Caleb, and I have talked about
it.
He's like you got to get Evanon, you got to get Evan on.
Finally, I want to start withthe ultra marathon that you just
did, and I'll start with, likewe, when I met up with you guys
to run a few miles with you Ithink you were I don't know if
(00:26):
you were just starting throughsome pain at like mile 26 or
something like that and then youstill did another 20 miles on
top of that.
Like what was that ultra like?
And like what was it like tokind of like push through those
difficult miles?
Dr. Evan Rudd (00:36):
I never thought I would ever do something that
hard in my life and nor did Ireally understand how hard it
would be.
Like, yes, I knew it was goingto be hard, but I'd also heard
about people doing a hundredmilers and I'm like guys, it's
only 46.
I can do it, it's okay.
But my furthest training runmaybe my fault, maybe it's
(00:59):
exactly what was meant to happenwas only nine miles and it
wasn't even a consecutive run,it was spread out throughout the
day, so it was actually aroundthe 10, the nine mile mark felt
real good.
Mile 10 hit, dude, my legsstarted cramping hard and I've
had the water flowing.
I had the camelback on somehand.
Water bottles had electrolytesand I was like there's no way
(01:21):
this is a hydration thing.
This has just got to be my bodyin shock.
It's never done something likethis Mile 10 was rough.
It kept getting worse and worseand it wasn't just one leg Now,
it was both.
And it wasn't just those twospots, it was the entire leg.
And that's when you found me atthe end of the marathon mark.
That was where it was the worstand I had to walk that that
(01:46):
beginning of the second marathon.
But thankfully we had anexperienced ultra marathoner
there that was like okay, thisis, I need to take inventory of
what's happening.
She checked in with me.
I was like, oh, I've beencramping for a long time.
This sucks.
She's like okay, we need tothrow some food down the pipe
and we need to drink a ton ofpickle juice Saved me.
So I started feeling really goodagain on the back end of the
(02:08):
marathon, when I first startedcramping, I remember talking to
Caleb and I was like yo, this isthe worst pain I've ever felt
and I can't turn it off.
Even if I stopped moving, mylegs felt like they were falling
off.
I started to feel really good,body was back in it and then we
hit the 30, 36 mile mark.
(02:29):
We had 10 more miles to go.
We were on our way back andthat's when my mentality started
breaking.
It was fascinating to observe.
I'm a nature lover.
I'm what you would consider atree hugger.
Right, I think it's just a partof who we are.
I've never, ever genuinelythought I want to see the world
burn, and I thought it that day.
I was like I don't ever want tosee another tree again.
(02:49):
I hate this place.
Donnie Hathaway (02:51):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (02:52):
It was a reflection of how I was feeling
inside and it was beingprojected out into my reality
around me, and I see that happenoften with just being a
chiropractor too.
If people are in pain and itchanges how they respond and how
they react and how they engagewith the world and the people
around them, and I got a tasteof that.
It was again fascinating toobserve and I remember we had
(03:16):
about a mile left and I was just.
I looked at jordan and calebnext to me.
I was like guys, we made it.
We don't have to keep running.
We can walk this mile and stillmake it with plenty of time.
I'm done, I'm tapped, there'snothing left.
And somehow Caleb and Jitrojust didn't say a word and they
just kept jogging and I'm likewell, shit, okay, I got to keep
(03:40):
jogging then Can't be leftbehind, yeah.
Um, but, and then I saw thefinish line with my own eyes and
they were just like see, wemade it just keep running
through and I actually picked itup from a 15 minute mile pace
to a seven, 30 minute mile paceto finish, and I was just on
fire.
Donnie Hathaway (03:56):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (03:57):
Then I finished, and I don't know why, but I just
started bawling.
I just laid down on the grass.
I was like everyone knew not totalk to me, not to be near me.
I was like everyone knew not totalk to me, not to be near me.
I was processing something big,and it was just the fact that
I've done the hardest thing I'veever had to do.
Donnie Hathaway (04:13):
Yeah, and it was by far, by far, it was crazy
.
So, like the like the mile 10thing, like do you think like
how much is that is of it is islike mental, or is it like your
body like breaking down, or isit like just you're?
You're just like not used tothat?
So are you kind of creatingthat pain or is that like your
muscles are not activating orfunctioning properly?
Dr. Evan Rudd (04:35):
Yeah, that's a really good question.
I was like I said this is the,this is the hardest thing I've
ever had to do.
That's physical.
So I got to see the evolutionof how things break down and the
order of which they happen,that mile 10 mark.
Mentally and emotionally I wason fire.
It was early in the day, I washardly sweating, changed my
(04:56):
shoes, feet felt great,literally just a physical thing,
like legs were just tired.
This is the furthest they'veran and they know they got
another 30 miles on yeah.
Yeah, so that's, that part wasdefinitely physical.
And then that's where I thoughtlike, okay, this has got to be
the hardest part of it.
If I can get through this, Ican make it through the rest of
it.
Yeah, then the mentalitystarted to like fade around that
(05:20):
marathon mark where I was likeI, I got nothing left.
I've been cramping for 12 miles.
Yeah, then, way back when Isaid I like I wanted to see the
world burn, dude, that wasphysical has depleted mental,
mental has depleted, emotionalhas depleted.
Now I'm running on pure sourceenergy like pure spirit.
It was wild but, that was.
(05:41):
It was cool to see thebreakdown and the order of which
that all happened because itgives me an idea of like what
other people are going through,and maybe not such an extreme
case, but in a minor case theyraised up.
Donnie Hathaway (05:52):
Yeah, yeah, crazy.
What's your one big takeawayfrom that?
You've learned from runningthat the ultra dude, anyone can
do it.
Dr. Evan Rudd (05:59):
Yeah, anyone can do anything.
If any human has ever done it,that means you can do it.
Yeah, kind of like the um elliekipchoge, the.
He broke the two-hour marathonmark.
Before he did that, allexercise scientists, all
biomechanics, all like the topof the top researchers said that
it is impossible for the humanto break that.
(06:20):
It is physiologically andphysically impossible for the
body to break that barrier.
He did it and then everyonestarted doing it.
So, literally, if anyone hasever done anything, you can do
it, I promise yeah.
Donnie Hathaway (06:35):
Yeah, that's crazy, that's crazy.
So, yeah, I mean, just seeingyou guys like run, that it just
it kind of like motivates you toto like challenge yourself too
and and honestly, like that'swhen, when the first day we met,
when we were in the 15, likethat, with the reason I ran 15
that day, was because caleb waslike we're gonna, I want to do
something hard.
I'm just like in that phase oflike I want to challenge myself,
to do hard things or whatever,and like I'd just gotten back
(06:58):
into running and I'd only run 15miles, I think, once or twice
before, maybe once you looked onfire and yeah, and and I was
like okay, let's, you know, I'llgive it a try, let's go Right.
But yeah, you just kind of youget locked in and I mean the,
you know, the, the pain is thereright From from running and
being on your feet for that long.
But yeah, you can do, you cando perseverance.
(07:19):
Yeah, Even if you just push pusha little bit past like what I
think, probably just I.
I go back to like running andand maybe not as a certain
(07:40):
example of like one one time,but just like training for for
um half marathons, training fordifferent runs, and now like
starting to lift weights andstuff, like I've noticed that
right, like I feel like wealways have a lot more in us
than we actually think we do.
There's more juice there.
Dr. Evan Rudd (07:59):
There always is.
That's what I found out on thatrun.
It was just example afterexample, time after time, where
I thought I'd give up and I justsomehow didn't.
There was always more in thetank.
Donnie Hathaway (08:10):
There's um, I was reading the book recently I
can't think of the name rightnow, I think it was.
I think it was from this bookwhere they talk about we have
like an unlimited supply ofenergy.
And you know, even thoughyou're feeling tired or whatever
, like you you have the energyinside you.
Like you don't necessarily needsome caffeine or whatever to
kind of boost you and get you tothe through the day or whatever
(08:31):
it is like you have a ton ofenergy inside of you.
That's that's untapped.
And they gave the example oflike if something happened, like
some extreme, like if you werelike going about your day and
you just you needed this boostof energy, like some extreme
event happened, you could tapinto that source of energy and
pull from it.
You don't need any additionalresources or whatever.
(08:53):
So I go back to like you know,training and running and stuff.
Like we have a lot more energythan we give ourselves credit
for.
Dr. Evan Rudd (09:01):
I think the biggest piece to that just
studying the nervous system andthe human emotions and kind of
developing a language for how Ican better understand people's
experience came through my ownexperience and something that I
recognized that gives me a tonof energy.
I was brought back to when Iwas a kid, where I remember I
(09:23):
had one birthday.
I was maybe 15 or 16.
I was 16 because I was able todrive and we I had friends over
for a little slumber party.
We stayed up till like three or4am doing everything.
We were playing football in thestreets, we'd play manhunt at
night, um, then we'd go and likeplay video games and watch
movies and wrestle around in therooms and then we'd get two or
(09:46):
three hours of sleep and we'dwake up at six or seven am to
get breakfast and go toadventure island together and
somehow I was on fire.
Just, I don't need sleep, I'mready to go, I'm ready to have
fun and I think the the, anykind of excitement or novelty,
will pull that like last pieceof reserve energy out of you,
(10:09):
because it's just, I'm excitedfor something.
I have to be awake.
Donnie Hathaway (10:12):
it's almost like fomo, but it's the internal
side of it I I think back to Imean like, just like trying to.
So I I wake up at 4 30 if I'mgoing to go to the gym, like
that's my time to go go lift,and so I wake up at 4 30 and
it's easier when I'm excitedabout the workout or excited
about something right, or even,like you said, like if you're
waking up to do something thatthat is fun to you.
(10:35):
Whatever that is like it iseasy to wake up.
It's not even like a thought,it's just like okay, I'm awake,
let's go, let's do it you knowwhat time is it 2 am.
Who cares um?
Yeah, it's crazy all right, solet's, let's talk about, like
chiropractic and and how you,how you even got started in that
like, where did that come from?
Dr. Evan Rudd (10:55):
that was, uh, it all happened by happens,
happenstance, man, and even justlooking back on it now, I truly
do believe everything happensfor the, for a reason and
typically for you, at theperfect time that it needed to
happen at.
I went through all of undergradknowing that I wanted to help
people Didn't know exactly whatmy style was going to be.
(11:17):
I explored a little bit ofnursing, nurse, anesthetist,
physical therapy, occupationaltherapy, speech therapy and none
of it really landed.
And then I got my associatesfrom one undergrad school and
then I switched over to UCF inOrlando and that's where I
finished it out.
(11:38):
In that move a lot of likerelationships were broken,
friendships were kind of lost tothe wayside.
I kind of packed up my stuffand left without telling anyone.
I think it was me, my, my wayof unintentionally creating a
clean slate for me to get abigger picture of where I was
trying to go in life, cause Iknew I wasn't going to find it
(11:59):
there.
Donnie Hathaway (12:00):
So when I got to UCF, were you aware of it
during that time of like, tryingto like, let me, let me okay.
Dr. Evan Rudd (12:06):
No, I think I just needed.
It's like when you go to themountaintops it's just different
than your everyday life and allof a sudden there's a lot more
clarity around, like all thatpaperwork on my desk doesn't
matter.
Look at how big this world isright.
So that just that, offering thedifferent perspective, created
a clear slate and I thinkinternally I knew that's what
(12:27):
was needed, but I wasn'tconscious of that choice.
So I got to UCF.
It was probably the lowest pointin my life Very lonely, very
depressed, unmotivated, no ideawhat I was doing, didn't have
any social skills.
So I had a very hard timemaking friends, especially like
going into a college that you'realready a junior in.
(12:47):
You're already meeting peoplethat have their click in their
group.
And I actually remember one dayI played like I swear 16 hours
of video games one day and it Ijust noticed it and I I was like
what is this?
Is this how life is?
(13:07):
I hate this.
And then a couple days later itwas.
It was like what is this?
Is this how life is?
I hate this.
And then a couple days later,it was like one thing after
another, they started lining up.
A couple days later I was goingon a little walk around the
apartment complex and I lived onthe fifth floor.
I had to walk up five flightsof stairs and I was gassed at
the top.
I was like yo, this is not good, I'm in an exercise science
program.
(13:27):
This is not good.
I'm in an exercise scienceprogram.
This is not good for me.
To be winded at the top andgranted five flights of stairs
never gets easy, but itdefinitely gets harder.
And that's where I was.
Yeah, so it just started likesparking this concern and then I
started going to try toexercise more.
I started going to the schoolgym.
I started I bought a likelittle box bike from dick
sporting goods just to go out onthe trails and ride my bike a
(13:48):
little bit, and I started tofeel a little better, but I was
still so resistant to going tothe gym and taking care of my
health.
So I started asking deeperquestions like why can't I just
take care of myself?
Why do I keep coming up withall these excuses?
And that's when I started tolook to drugs more not no hard
drugs, but like marijuana and itstarted opening my mind to this
(14:11):
deeper side of life, wherethere's more than just this
physical plane of existence.
And I remember I didn't want to, like, keep smoking, so I
Googled how to get high on yourown supply.
Donnie Hathaway (14:23):
That's exactly what you typed in.
That's exactly what you typedin.
Dr. Evan Rudd (14:29):
I swear it was so funny and I've never heard
anyone say that it was just likean idea.
I, of course, saw a ton ofbreathwork videos, had no idea
what it was but and I didn'treally have a an itch to do it,
but everyone was suggestingmeditation.
So I would end up every day, ifnot every other day.
I would take my bike to thepark and I'd go into the deepest
(14:49):
part of the park I could andthere was this little bridge
with a little tiny babywaterfall and I'd sit there and
I downloaded this app calledheadspace, where they'd walk you
through like a little 10 minutemeditation and I would just sit
there and I remember they saidwatch your thoughts and think
about the clouds in the sky.
Clouds in the sky are there nowand they won't be in five
minutes, same with your thoughts, if you don't engage with them.
(15:10):
And I just thought that wasreally interesting and I think
that cued me into a lot ofbigger questions, like what is
life about?
What is this internal voice inmy head?
What is this inner realityversus external reality?
What is everything?
And I started getting reallycurious about meditation,
buddhism, all these things, andI was like man if only I had a
(15:32):
little monk mentor that couldjust sit here and hit me on the
back of the switch when I let mymind wander and I was like
that's just not realistic.
So I got to be my own mentor inthis and I started diving down
into philosophy books and justkind of exploring with an open
mind.
I never really I'm not greatwith religions.
I think I was more Christianwhen I was younger because my
(15:55):
grandparents and my parents butwe were more like Christer goers
, like Christmas, easter, so Inever really understood anything
that was going on in religion.
But when I heard about Buddhismit got me really interested and
then I started checking outlike all the religions, and I
was just like there's a similarmessage here and it's just
saying almost like you everheard of the tao?
(16:17):
the tao, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah umtalks about effortless effort,
and if you just open your mindup to letting these
opportunities come to you as youequally think about them, they
will find you effortlessly.
And again, it was all soperfectly timed.
I was coming up on my lastsemester at UCF and I was about
(16:38):
to graduate.
I had no clue what I was doing.
I had no job lined up and thelast semester I walked into one
of my first classes and therewas this guy that was a
chiropractor as my professor andhe said if you guys want to
come in to my office and checkout what I'm about, check out
chiropractic in the first twoweeks of school I'll give you a
free exam and give you anadjustment.
See how it goes.
(16:58):
And I have never been someonethat engaged in that sort of
invite and for some reason thiswas the first one.
I was just like I gotta go trythis out.
I gotta go check this out.
Guy's pretty cool.
So Dr Daniel Warner, I'll neverforget him.
He adjusted me or he did a fewexams and, like, showed me some
stuff.
I remember my shoulder couldn'traise up like any higher than
(17:19):
that.
Great that I was prettyunhealthy in the first place.
And he adjusted me and he goessee how high that can go.
I was like, wait, what yeah,what is?
Donnie Hathaway (17:29):
this what just happened.
Dr. Evan Rudd (17:30):
Yeah, how does this work?
So then I started asking moreand more questions about my body
and I just kept coming to seehim.
I was like I called my parentsand I was like yo, this guy just
offered me like a chiropracticcare plan.
I've never heard of it, neverheard of chiropractic.
I was 22 years old, never heardof it, I want to give it a try.
And they were like go for it.
So I saw him weekly, saw massivechange.
(17:51):
But the change for me wasdifferent.
I wasn't in pain.
It was like that brain fog,depression, loneliness, lack of
self-worth, almost and it juststarted clearing up where I
became more and more inquisitive, I became more and more excited
.
I became more and moremotivated to like, take care of
myself.
And one night he was like yo,palmer Chiropractic is where I
(18:15):
graduated.
They're coming to Cooper's Hawk.
If you want to go to a dinner,it's free.
They're just going to tell youabout the school, give out
little pamphlets or pamphlets orwhatever you want.
And I was just like, sure, Iwent, thought it was really cool
, applied probably the nextnight, crazy, and got in and I
was like, okay, there's the nextstep.
Donnie Hathaway (18:35):
Wow, yeah, it was wild.
How, how, how long of a timeperiod was that from, like, the
first time you met the doctortill you applied to chiropractic
school?
Probably?
Two or three months becausethat was as long as the semester
was okay, yeah, yeah it movedfast and that's again how I know
.
Dr. Evan Rudd (18:48):
It was just like effortless effort.
Yeah, there was something to it.
It didn't feel like work and itwas just falling into place in
front of my eyes.
It's like I gotta follow thispath.
Donnie Hathaway (18:56):
Yeah, it paid off, it's wild that you never
had experienced chiropracticbefore, never ran into it.
And then, just like timing, umof it all, I've I've talked to a
few different chiropractors andit seems like they like the.
No, I don't think anyone thatI've that I've spoken with has
like planned or wanted to grewup wanting to be a chiropractor.
(19:16):
You know it just kind of likecircumstances, things, their
path changes and thisopportunity is there and then it
they gravitate towards it,right, for, for you know, many
reasons, but it is interesting,do you think that's changing at
all?
Because I know, like the, theawareness around chiropractic
right, like the, the openness toit, I think is is changing, is
is, you know people are startingto utilize it more.
(19:38):
Um, do you see that changing atall since you've been a
chiropractor?
Dr. Evan Rudd (19:42):
Yeah, you, you hit the nail on the head.
A lot of people don't seekchiropractic.
It finds those individuals thatare placed perfectly in the
world to be that lighthouse orthat beacon for the people
around them, except for the onesthat come from a lineage of
chiropractors.
And those guys are typicallyfantastic chiropractors for
years and then he became a docand he's just taken off because
(20:04):
he's had so many years doing it.
To go back to the originalquestion, there are more and
more chiropractors out there andit's hard when you find a
chiropractor that's passionateabout what they do.
The kid rarely grows up notwanting to be a chiropractor.
You know, because it's likepersonally it's the greatest
career out there, it isunbelievable.
And if I lived in my truth andmy passion and I lived out of
(20:27):
integrity and my life was goodas good as life can get, because
there's some hard parts aboutit.
But a kid would see that and behighly inspired.
Be like I want to do whatyou're doing.
You're helping all these people.
You're the mayor of the townwithout being the mayor of the
town.
What is this?
So they'd always grow up andwant to be that.
So I do think it's growing forsure.
(20:52):
What do you love aboutchiropractic so much?
Oh, another good question.
I think about the empowermentaspect of it.
It truly gives people the powerand the education about the
fundamental.
It's almost the user manual forthe body.
How do we have a user manualfor our computer and our coffee
maker?
But we came into this worldwith the most complex technology
existence has ever seen and wedon't have a user manual for it.
Nor do we really have theaccess to the information.
(21:14):
We have to go through school,graduate school, to get that.
And then we live in this worldof technology where we have
billions of search pages come upwhen you say what diet should I
be on?
It's so overwhelming and beingsomeone, being a chiropractor,
that is integrity and embodiedin what I practice and what I
preach.
It allows me to speak from aplace of experience of hey, I
(21:37):
know what you're going through.
This worked for me.
Try this before you do anythingelse.
And typically chiropracticalways comes back down to it's
deductive in reasoning.
So it's you have this issue.
Well, let's not focus on thisissue.
Let's go back to the verybeginning of how the body
actually works.
The nervous system runseverything.
It is the master control centerof everything that happens in
(21:59):
your body and it's designed tobe perfect.
Lifestyle choices, habits,society they all create this
disconnect from man, thephysical and man, the spiritual
basically our highest self.
So when we are having a hardtime being healthy, we have
these crazy diseases come up,we're in pain and nothing's
really changing.
We have to go back to thefundamentals of the nervous
(22:21):
system has to be fully effectivein what it's trying to do in
order for you to even have achance to heal anything.
So it's so basic in itsunderstanding that, no matter
who walks in your door, I canhelp you.
Donnie Hathaway (22:33):
Right Period.
Dr. Evan Rudd (22:34):
Right, and it's.
It starts there.
It starts with let's clear thenervous system.
Then you do have to go home anddo the discipline and the the
taking care of yourself part.
That's the homework of it.
Yeah, I'm not Jesus, right?
No matter how much I want to be.
I love my people, I want tohelp them, but I'm here to make
sure that the nervous systemstays clear and I'm going to
give you every tool in my beltand I'm, as a human, I'm going
(22:57):
to help you find your answer andwhat you need next, and I think
that's really empowering forpeople.
And to add to that, likesurgeons, they're out there
saving people's lives all thetime.
But there's so much riskinvolved in being a surgeon that
you do a 16 hour surgery andyou go, try to sleep and you're
worried that that person's goingthrough post-op.
(23:17):
Okay, yeah, and you wake up andyou just have your fingers
crossed.
Donnie Hathaway (23:20):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (23:21):
I get to go home every single night knowing that
my people are safe and better.
Donnie Hathaway (23:25):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think that the like when
I first started seeing Dr Caleb, you know, it was just kind of
like that, like I want to behealthier and that sort of thing
, and it's, and it's progressedsince I've seen him too, Right,
and and like adding in theweight training and just
different movements and stuff,have like I think really just
like taking it up another levelon like how I feel, how my mind
(23:48):
is, like kind of throughout theday, and it's made it.
You know it makes a huge impact.
Do you guys see, I know likeyour practice, like what you
guys do, is a little bitdifferent than I think I think
most chiropractor offices, right, but like, do you see a lot,
like a lot of your patients?
Are they like they're coming toyou because an accident or are
they coming to you because of ofthey just want to be healthier
and be the best version ofthemselves?
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:10):
Yeah, most people are coming to a chiropractor
because there's pain involved.
Donnie Hathaway (24:13):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:14):
That's typically.
That's just how people insociety handle things nowadays
Just go, go, go until you can't.
Donnie Hathaway (24:21):
Yeah, do something about it when that
point comes.
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:23):
It's very reactive rather than proactive.
A piece of that is just beingeducated on what proactive means
and that proactive health isactually a choice.
You can be proactive about it.
You're just choosing to be morereactive, you know, and giving
that education behind why andhow.
Donnie Hathaway (24:42):
Yeah, yeah.
Where do you see chiropracticmedicine going in the next,
let's say five, 10 years?
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:48):
Like you said, we do things a little differently
at the source.
Donnie Hathaway (24:51):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:51):
I think this is what we call the new gen Kairos.
I think we're onto something.
Yes, it's getting away from thedoctor patient hierarchy, it's
getting away from treatment ofthings and it's getting to this
place of relatability betweensomeone that has answers and
someone that's seeking answers,so it's no longer so divided,
(25:13):
it's I'm a human being presentwith another human, and I'm not
invalidating your story.
I'm not saying I'm sorry youfeel this way, because that
inherently points to that thereis some way that they should be
feeling it's wow, that must beso hard.
I can't imagine what you'regoing through.
Or, if you can imagine, youjust say like little things that
(25:34):
, in your own language, say thesame thing that they just said
or make assumptions on.
Like I was talking.
I watched a Joe Rogan podcastand he was talking to JD, the
new vice president that Trumpwants, and JD was talking about
the day Trump asked him to bevice president and when he said
yes, joe was like, took it alayer deeper and was like yo,
(25:55):
how was that?
Like how much in that momentwhen you had that phone call,
how much was going through yourmind.
And then, right after that, howdid things change?
Like how was your day to dayafter that and I think Joe is a
master of communication andconnection and showing like he
is understanding of where you'recoming from.
He's an example of where Ithink chiropractic is going to
(26:16):
be going soon just the presence,connection and validity of
other people's experiences yeah,like is do the way that
americans think about healthcare, like, is that changing and
and shifting towards that?
Oh my, God, I hope so.
I hope so.
Yeah, there's some really goodprofessions out there, like
naturopaths, acupuncturists,herbal medicine people.
(26:40):
There's so many goodprofessions out there that are
working towards helping peoplejust handle life a little better
.
Donnie Hathaway (26:46):
Yeah, like more preventative, like you just get
, yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (26:49):
But there's also just this mass amount of people
that are still more reactivethan proactive about their
health, and I think it's thatthreshold.
So once enough people startbeing preventative about their
care, the whole table will startto turn.
Donnie Hathaway (27:03):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (27:04):
But right now we're still climbing towards
that threshold.
Donnie Hathaway (27:07):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (27:07):
Most healthcare people are moving in that
direction.
Donnie Hathaway (27:10):
Yeah, and I think I've seen this in some
insurance companies too, likehealth care insurance, like
they're offering incentives orwhatever for preventative care
maybe not to like go see achiropractor, like we'll cover
that cost, but like we'll offerdiscounts if you're healthy or
maintain this level of health,or whatever.
So they're get people to thinkabout being preventative.
Dr. Evan Rudd (27:30):
Yeah, well said the, the insurance game is tough
because they just try todictate, like what your care
needs and right.
Cause they aren't doing theexam.
Donnie Hathaway (27:39):
Right.
Dr. Evan Rudd (27:39):
They didn't go to school for anything and yet
somehow they have the ability totell you what they're going to
help you pay for and whatthey're not.
The wellness is the right is astep in the right direction.
I genuinely think we just haveto change the definition of
healthcare.
Healthcare is not taking careof your health when the wheels
have already fallen off.
Healthcare is taking care ofthe health right.
(28:01):
It's easier to keep you healthythan to get you out of disease
or fix your pain right.
Let's make sure that you stayhealthy.
That's the easiest way to do it.
I think one of the philosophiesin chiropractic is disease is
not a thing or an entity.
It is the lack thereof, it isthe lack of health you know, and
it's just a sign of symptom ofthat so yeah, we can take care
(28:23):
of our health yeah the more thatdefinition changes, I think the
mass understanding of proactivehealth would be changed yeah,
that makes sense.
Donnie Hathaway (28:31):
You, when you look at like your health and and
like what are you doing to bethe healthiest version of
yourself, Like what are youryour pillars?
Or, like your, the main thingsthat you're focused on or that
are important for you Basicsyeah, Absolute basics.
Dr. Evan Rudd (28:45):
So again, that's one of my favorite parts about
being a doctor is that it meansteacher, and if I can live my
experience, I get to teach that.
What I know to be true is thatif you focus on the basics, you
will see change.
Donnie Hathaway (28:59):
And what are those?
Dr. Evan Rudd (28:59):
basics.
So mostly movement, mindfulness, nutrition and recuperation.
If you can hit all, I'll add afifth one in there Community
Movement you have to do.
It's just what keeps our bodymoving.
Motion is lotion, movement'smedicine.
You have a better understandingof where your arms are in space
.
When you move your arms moreoften right, it's a skill you
(29:21):
will feel better.
Everything will be nice andloose.
And then we have themindfulness part, where we have
to pay attention to how ourthought patterns change us.
If you're in the gym and you'retrying to bench press something
heavy, you're just like oh,this sucks and you're pushing
through it.
That creates this massive stressresponse through the entire
body Just you saying this sucksone time If you are bench
(29:44):
pressing and it's just not goingwell, but you go, yes, and you
finish it and you rack it.
It doesn't do that whole stressresponse thing.
So I think, paying attention toyour thought patterns and how
you live your life a lot ofself-reflection.
Make sure that you're on theright growth path and spending
time how you want to do, makesure life is fulfilling that's a
big piece of mindfulness.
(30:05):
Nutrition, pretty commonplacenowadays in society of just we
need organic whole foods.
Yeah, the closer it is to itsraw form, the healthier it's
going to be for you, the more itgets away from that.
Like, even just cooking azucchini takes it away from that
raw form, even just a littlebit yeah take away or diminish
the the vitamins and nutrients.
(30:26):
Yeah, yeah so organic wholefoods.
Most of the time, I like to sayyou can have your cake and eat
it too.
Just balance.
And then the recuperation issomething a lot of people
struggle with.
Surprisingly, a lot of peoplethink of rest and sleep when
they think of recuperation.
But to give an example, ifyou're out with the boys or out
with the girls one night, you'renot thinking about the
(30:48):
responsibilities you have as anadult.
You're having fun in thatmoment.
That's very good for yourmental and physical well-being,
right?
So teaching people recuperationyou do have to have fun in life
, you do have to have a littlelike aha, wonder and excitement
like what fills your cup up,like what?
Donnie Hathaway (31:05):
what do you enjoy doing?
Dr. Evan Rudd (31:06):
yes, yeah, yeah, you have to have that yeah, and
that's why it's same with likefood you have, you can have your
cake and eat it too.
So, personally, uh, I move mybody somehow some way every day,
uh, whether it's just swinginga kettlebell around for 10
minutes, that's like my bareminimum, uh, or I go to the gym
for two hours.
It's like my my upper echelonday.
Yeah, uh, nutrition is prettybasic.
(31:28):
I found a good routine thatworks for me.
My go-to is is eggs, sweetpotatoes and ground beef.
Dude, I will have this.
Is that your breakfast?
Donnie Hathaway (31:36):
That's a lot of meals for me, every meal.
That sounds like yeah, I lovewe started doing pan fried.
Leah found this recipe, my wife.
We slice up the sweet potatoesand it's just like a garlic salt
and pepper seasoning orsomething like that, and you
just grill them and fry them inthe pan.
Dr. Evan Rudd (31:55):
A little bit of butter and they're so good, so
good, so good yeah, those aresweet potatoes, and uh, yams are
actually really good fortestosterone too oh, okay
building up the male hormonesokay but yeah, so that pretty
much stays clean.
I have a smoothie a day, so alot of fruit I'll put, like
spinach and peanut butter andgreek yogurt in there for some
(32:16):
extra protein and stuff yeah um,for recuperation.
Man, I love video games still.
I know I said it earlier, thatwas where a lot of my childhood
came from.
It's hard to put them down.
It just it lights me up somehow.
Uh, so, making sure that Istill have time to do that.
It's not every day, it's when Ihave time.
Sometimes it's 10 minutes,sometimes two hours.
I'll just take what I can.
Donnie Hathaway (32:38):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (32:38):
And then the.
The mindfulness is one of myfavorite aspects of health.
A lot of people call me prettyshot out and I have a lot of
weird questions for people, butthat's because I'm always
exploring this inner reality.
Donnie Hathaway (32:52):
Yeah, it's like what is everything?
You know, I'm I'm a bigphilosophy nerd, so it's like
that post you put out on or thestory you put out on social with
like the um, the differentuniverses, or like the amount of
universes.
It's like insane yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (33:05):
It's my favorite, I love it, but it takes so it
takes a lot of reflection.
Sometimes it's breathwork,meditation it's more often
breathwork, and then on, likebig days, journaling Journal
about whatever you're trying tofocus on.
So, for me, I've I had a veryhard time socializing as a kid
and even as a young adult.
(33:26):
Now that I'm in a professionalpeople business, I need to
communicate really well, so alot of my stuff is based on
communication.
So I'll take time every nightor every morning, whenever I can
, to reflect on what I'mfocusing on.
Donnie Hathaway (33:39):
Go hang out with Dr Evan.
Yes, awesome man, appreciateyou being here, dude.
That was fun.
This was awesome.
Yeah, cool little flow.
Yeah, I like it.
We'll do it again it we'll doit again, please.
I would love to.
Can we get like caleb ord-trail in here too?
So, kate, uh, we, caleb wetalked about that last time.
We were like we got to get likethe three of us in here, or
something like that.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we might have.
(34:00):
I don't know what we would dowith that, with that episode,
but like, yeah, we like I thethe one caleb that that's coming
out, uh, will be before, beforethis one's posted, but um it,
when we went for I think twohours or something like that,
wow, that's go.
We just sat down and we justkept going.
Dr. Evan Rudd (34:20):
He's such an easy guy to talk to.
Donnie Hathaway (34:23):
Yeah, for sure, Sweet Thanks man.
Dr Evan, welcome to the podcast.
Dr. Evan Rudd (00:02):
Thank you, Stoked to be here yeah.
Donnie Hathaway (00:04):
I'm excited, Caleb, and I have talked about
it.
He's like you got to get Evanon, you got to get Evan on.
Finally, I want to start withthe ultra marathon that you just
did, and I'll start with, likewe, when I met up with you guys
to run a few miles with you Ithink you were I don't know if
(00:26):
you were just starting throughsome pain at like mile 26 or
something like that and then youstill did another 20 miles on
top of that.
Like what was that ultra like?
And like what was it like tokind of like push through those
difficult miles?
Dr. Evan Rudd (00:36):
I never thought I would ever do something that
hard in my life and nor did Ireally understand how hard it
would be.
Like, yes, I knew it was goingto be hard, but I'd also heard
about people doing a hundredmilers and I'm like guys, it's
only 46.
I can do it, it's okay.
But my furthest training runmaybe my fault, maybe it's
(00:59):
exactly what was meant to happenwas only nine miles and it
wasn't even a consecutive run,it was spread out throughout the
day, so it was actually aroundthe 10, the nine mile mark felt
real good.
Mile 10 hit, dude, my legsstarted cramping hard and I've
had the water flowing.
I had the camelback on somehand.
Water bottles had electrolytesand I was like there's no way
(01:21):
this is a hydration thing.
This has just got to be my bodyin shock.
It's never done something likethis Mile 10 was rough.
It kept getting worse and worseand it wasn't just one leg Now,
it was both.
And it wasn't just those twospots, it was the entire leg.
And that's when you found me atthe end of the marathon mark.
That was where it was the worstand I had to walk that that
(01:46):
beginning of the second marathon.
But thankfully we had anexperienced ultra marathoner
there that was like okay, thisis, I need to take inventory of
what's happening.
She checked in with me.
I was like, oh, I've beencramping for a long time.
This sucks.
She's like okay, we need tothrow some food down the pipe
and we need to drink a ton ofpickle juice Saved me.
So I started feeling really goodagain on the back end of the
(02:08):
marathon, when I first startedcramping, I remember talking to
Caleb and I was like yo, this isthe worst pain I've ever felt
and I can't turn it off.
Even if I stopped moving, mylegs felt like they were falling
off.
I started to feel really good,body was back in it and then we
hit the 30, 36 mile mark.
(02:29):
We had 10 more miles to go.
We were on our way back andthat's when my mentality started
breaking.
It was fascinating to observe.
I'm a nature lover.
I'm what you would consider atree hugger.
Right, I think it's just a partof who we are.
I've never, ever genuinelythought I want to see the world
burn, and I thought it that day.
I was like I don't ever want tosee another tree again.
(02:49):
I hate this place.
Donnie Hathaway (02:51):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (02:52):
It was a reflection of how I was feeling
inside and it was beingprojected out into my reality
around me, and I see that happenoften with just being a
chiropractor too.
If people are in pain and itchanges how they respond and how
they react and how they engagewith the world and the people
around them, and I got a tasteof that.
It was again fascinating toobserve and I remember we had
(03:16):
about a mile left and I was just.
I looked at jordan and calebnext to me.
I was like guys, we made it.
We don't have to keep running.
We can walk this mile and stillmake it with plenty of time.
I'm done, I'm tapped, there'snothing left.
And somehow Caleb and Jitrojust didn't say a word and they
just kept jogging and I'm likewell, shit, okay, I got to keep
(03:40):
jogging then Can't be leftbehind, yeah.
Um, but, and then I saw thefinish line with my own eyes and
they were just like see, wemade it just keep running
through and I actually picked itup from a 15 minute mile pace
to a seven, 30 minute mile paceto finish, and I was just on
fire.
Donnie Hathaway (03:56):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (03:57):
Then I finished, and I don't know why, but I just
started bawling.
I just laid down on the grass.
I was like everyone knew not totalk to me, not to be near me.
I was like everyone knew not totalk to me, not to be near me.
I was processing something big,and it was just the fact that
I've done the hardest thing I'veever had to do.
Donnie Hathaway (04:13):
Yeah, and it was by far, by far, it was crazy
.
So, like the like the mile 10thing, like do you think like
how much is that is of it is islike mental, or is it like your
body like breaking down, or isit like just you're?
You're just like not used tothat?
So are you kind of creatingthat pain or is that like your
muscles are not activating orfunctioning properly?
Dr. Evan Rudd (04:35):
Yeah, that's a really good question.
I was like I said this is the,this is the hardest thing I've
ever had to do.
That's physical.
So I got to see the evolutionof how things break down and the
order of which they happen,that mile 10 mark.
Mentally and emotionally I wason fire.
It was early in the day, I washardly sweating, changed my
(04:56):
shoes, feet felt great,literally just a physical thing,
like legs were just tired.
This is the furthest they'veran and they know they got
another 30 miles on yeah.
Yeah, so that's, that part wasdefinitely physical.
And then that's where I thoughtlike, okay, this has got to be
the hardest part of it.
If I can get through this, Ican make it through the rest of
it.
Yeah, then the mentalitystarted to like fade around that
(05:20):
marathon mark where I was likeI, I got nothing left.
I've been cramping for 12 miles.
Yeah, then, way back when Isaid I like I wanted to see the
world burn, dude, that wasphysical has depleted mental,
mental has depleted, emotionalhas depleted.
Now I'm running on pure sourceenergy like pure spirit.
It was wild but, that was.
(05:41):
It was cool to see thebreakdown and the order of which
that all happened because itgives me an idea of like what
other people are going through,and maybe not such an extreme
case, but in a minor case theyraised up.
Donnie Hathaway (05:52):
Yeah, yeah, crazy.
What's your one big takeawayfrom that?
You've learned from runningthat the ultra dude, anyone can
do it.
Dr. Evan Rudd (05:59):
Yeah, anyone can do anything.
If any human has ever done it,that means you can do it.
Yeah, kind of like the um elliekipchoge, the.
He broke the two-hour marathonmark.
Before he did that, allexercise scientists, all
biomechanics, all like the topof the top researchers said that
it is impossible for the humanto break that.
(06:20):
It is physiologically andphysically impossible for the
body to break that barrier.
He did it and then everyonestarted doing it.
So, literally, if anyone hasever done anything, you can do
it, I promise yeah.
Donnie Hathaway (06:35):
Yeah, that's crazy, that's crazy.
So, yeah, I mean, just seeingyou guys like run, that it just
it kind of like motivates you toto like challenge yourself too
and and honestly, like that'swhen, when the first day we met,
when we were in the 15, likethat, with the reason I ran 15
that day, was because caleb waslike we're gonna, I want to do
something hard.
I'm just like in that phase oflike I want to challenge myself,
to do hard things or whatever,and like I'd just gotten back
(06:58):
into running and I'd only run 15miles, I think, once or twice
before, maybe once you looked onfire and yeah, and and I was
like okay, let's, you know, I'llgive it a try, let's go Right.
But yeah, you just kind of youget locked in and I mean the,
you know, the, the pain is thereright From from running and
being on your feet for that long.
But yeah, you can do, you cando perseverance.
(07:19):
Yeah, Even if you just push pusha little bit past like what I
think, probably just I.
I go back to like running andand maybe not as a certain
(07:40):
example of like one one time,but just like training for for
um half marathons, training fordifferent runs, and now like
starting to lift weights andstuff, like I've noticed that
right, like I feel like wealways have a lot more in us
than we actually think we do.
There's more juice there.
Dr. Evan Rudd (07:59):
There always is.
That's what I found out on thatrun.
It was just example afterexample, time after time, where
I thought I'd give up and I justsomehow didn't.
There was always more in thetank.
Donnie Hathaway (08:10):
There's um, I was reading the book recently I
can't think of the name rightnow, I think it was.
I think it was from this bookwhere they talk about we have
like an unlimited supply ofenergy.
And you know, even thoughyou're feeling tired or whatever
, like you you have the energyinside you.
Like you don't necessarily needsome caffeine or whatever to
kind of boost you and get you tothe through the day or whatever
(08:31):
it is like you have a ton ofenergy inside of you.
That's that's untapped.
And they gave the example oflike if something happened, like
some extreme, like if you werelike going about your day and
you just you needed this boostof energy, like some extreme
event happened, you could tapinto that source of energy and
pull from it.
You don't need any additionalresources or whatever.
(08:53):
So I go back to like you know,training and running and stuff.
Like we have a lot more energythan we give ourselves credit
for.
Dr. Evan Rudd (09:01):
I think the biggest piece to that just
studying the nervous system andthe human emotions and kind of
developing a language for how Ican better understand people's
experience came through my ownexperience and something that I
recognized that gives me a tonof energy.
I was brought back to when Iwas a kid, where I remember I
(09:23):
had one birthday.
I was maybe 15 or 16.
I was 16 because I was able todrive and we I had friends over
for a little slumber party.
We stayed up till like three or4am doing everything.
We were playing football in thestreets, we'd play manhunt at
night, um, then we'd go and likeplay video games and watch
movies and wrestle around in therooms and then we'd get two or
(09:46):
three hours of sleep and we'dwake up at six or seven am to
get breakfast and go toadventure island together and
somehow I was on fire.
Just, I don't need sleep, I'mready to go, I'm ready to have
fun and I think the the, anykind of excitement or novelty,
will pull that like last pieceof reserve energy out of you,
(10:09):
because it's just, I'm excitedfor something.
I have to be awake.
Donnie Hathaway (10:12):
it's almost like fomo, but it's the internal
side of it I I think back to Imean like, just like trying to.
So I I wake up at 4 30 if I'mgoing to go to the gym, like
that's my time to go go lift,and so I wake up at 4 30 and
it's easier when I'm excitedabout the workout or excited
about something right, or even,like you said, like if you're
waking up to do something thatthat is fun to you.
(10:35):
Whatever that is like it iseasy to wake up.
It's not even like a thought,it's just like okay, I'm awake,
let's go, let's do it you knowwhat time is it 2 am.
Who cares um?
Yeah, it's crazy all right, solet's, let's talk about, like
chiropractic and and how you,how you even got started in that
like, where did that come from?
Dr. Evan Rudd (10:55):
that was, uh, it all happened by happens,
happenstance, man, and even justlooking back on it now, I truly
do believe everything happensfor the, for a reason and
typically for you, at theperfect time that it needed to
happen at.
I went through all of undergradknowing that I wanted to help
people Didn't know exactly whatmy style was going to be.
(11:17):
I explored a little bit ofnursing, nurse, anesthetist,
physical therapy, occupationaltherapy, speech therapy and none
of it really landed.
And then I got my associatesfrom one undergrad school and
then I switched over to UCF inOrlando and that's where I
finished it out.
(11:38):
In that move a lot of likerelationships were broken,
friendships were kind of lost tothe wayside.
I kind of packed up my stuffand left without telling anyone.
I think it was me, my, my wayof unintentionally creating a
clean slate for me to get abigger picture of where I was
trying to go in life, cause Iknew I wasn't going to find it
(11:59):
there.
Donnie Hathaway (12:00):
So when I got to UCF, were you aware of it
during that time of like, tryingto like, let me, let me okay.
Dr. Evan Rudd (12:06):
No, I think I just needed.
It's like when you go to themountaintops it's just different
than your everyday life and allof a sudden there's a lot more
clarity around, like all thatpaperwork on my desk doesn't
matter.
Look at how big this world isright.
So that just that, offering thedifferent perspective, created
a clear slate and I thinkinternally I knew that's what
(12:27):
was needed, but I wasn'tconscious of that choice.
So I got to UCF.
It was probably the lowest pointin my life Very lonely, very
depressed, unmotivated, no ideawhat I was doing, didn't have
any social skills.
So I had a very hard timemaking friends, especially like
going into a college that you'realready a junior in.
(12:47):
You're already meeting peoplethat have their click in their
group.
And I actually remember one dayI played like I swear 16 hours
of video games one day and it Ijust noticed it and I I was like
what is this?
Is this how life is?
(13:07):
I hate this.
And then a couple days later itwas.
It was like what is this?
Is this how life is?
I hate this.
And then a couple days later,it was like one thing after
another, they started lining up.
A couple days later I was goingon a little walk around the
apartment complex and I lived onthe fifth floor.
I had to walk up five flightsof stairs and I was gassed at
the top.
I was like yo, this is not good, I'm in an exercise science
program.
(13:27):
This is not good.
I'm in an exercise scienceprogram.
This is not good for me.
To be winded at the top andgranted five flights of stairs
never gets easy, but itdefinitely gets harder.
And that's where I was.
Yeah, so it just started likesparking this concern and then I
started going to try toexercise more.
I started going to the schoolgym.
I started I bought a likelittle box bike from dick
sporting goods just to go out onthe trails and ride my bike a
(13:48):
little bit, and I started tofeel a little better, but I was
still so resistant to going tothe gym and taking care of my
health.
So I started asking deeperquestions like why can't I just
take care of myself?
Why do I keep coming up withall these excuses?
And that's when I started tolook to drugs more not no hard
drugs, but like marijuana and itstarted opening my mind to this
(14:11):
deeper side of life, wherethere's more than just this
physical plane of existence.
And I remember I didn't want to, like, keep smoking, so I
Googled how to get high on yourown supply.
Donnie Hathaway (14:23):
That's exactly what you typed in.
That's exactly what you typedin.
Dr. Evan Rudd (14:29):
I swear it was so funny and I've never heard
anyone say that it was just likean idea.
I, of course, saw a ton ofbreathwork videos, had no idea
what it was but and I didn'treally have a an itch to do it,
but everyone was suggestingmeditation.
So I would end up every day, ifnot every other day.
I would take my bike to thepark and I'd go into the deepest
(14:49):
part of the park I could andthere was this little bridge
with a little tiny babywaterfall and I'd sit there and
I downloaded this app calledheadspace, where they'd walk you
through like a little 10 minutemeditation and I would just sit
there and I remember they saidwatch your thoughts and think
about the clouds in the sky.
Clouds in the sky are there nowand they won't be in five
minutes, same with your thoughts, if you don't engage with them.
(15:10):
And I just thought that wasreally interesting and I think
that cued me into a lot ofbigger questions, like what is
life about?
What is this internal voice inmy head?
What is this inner realityversus external reality?
What is everything?
And I started getting reallycurious about meditation,
buddhism, all these things, andI was like man if only I had a
(15:32):
little monk mentor that couldjust sit here and hit me on the
back of the switch when I let mymind wander and I was like
that's just not realistic.
So I got to be my own mentor inthis and I started diving down
into philosophy books and justkind of exploring with an open
mind.
I never really I'm not greatwith religions.
I think I was more Christianwhen I was younger because my
(15:55):
grandparents and my parents butwe were more like Christer goers
, like Christmas, easter, so Inever really understood anything
that was going on in religion.
But when I heard about Buddhismit got me really interested and
then I started checking outlike all the religions, and I
was just like there's a similarmessage here and it's just
saying almost like you everheard of the tao?
(16:17):
the tao, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah umtalks about effortless effort,
and if you just open your mindup to letting these
opportunities come to you as youequally think about them, they
will find you effortlessly.
And again, it was all soperfectly timed.
I was coming up on my lastsemester at UCF and I was about
(16:38):
to graduate.
I had no clue what I was doing.
I had no job lined up and thelast semester I walked into one
of my first classes and therewas this guy that was a
chiropractor as my professor andhe said if you guys want to
come in to my office and checkout what I'm about, check out
chiropractic in the first twoweeks of school I'll give you a
free exam and give you anadjustment.
See how it goes.
(16:58):
And I have never been someonethat engaged in that sort of
invite and for some reason thiswas the first one.
I was just like I gotta go trythis out.
I gotta go check this out.
Guy's pretty cool.
So Dr Daniel Warner, I'll neverforget him.
He adjusted me or he did a fewexams and, like, showed me some
stuff.
I remember my shoulder couldn'traise up like any higher than
(17:19):
that.
Great that I was prettyunhealthy in the first place.
And he adjusted me and he goessee how high that can go.
I was like, wait, what yeah,what is?
Donnie Hathaway (17:29):
this what just happened.
Dr. Evan Rudd (17:30):
Yeah, how does this work?
So then I started asking moreand more questions about my body
and I just kept coming to seehim.
I was like I called my parentsand I was like yo, this guy just
offered me like a chiropracticcare plan.
I've never heard of it, neverheard of chiropractic.
I was 22 years old, never heardof it, I want to give it a try.
And they were like go for it.
So I saw him weekly, saw massivechange.
(17:51):
But the change for me wasdifferent.
I wasn't in pain.
It was like that brain fog,depression, loneliness, lack of
self-worth, almost and it juststarted clearing up where I
became more and more inquisitive, I became more and more excited
.
I became more and moremotivated to like, take care of
myself.
And one night he was like yo,palmer Chiropractic is where I
(18:15):
graduated.
They're coming to Cooper's Hawk.
If you want to go to a dinner,it's free.
They're just going to tell youabout the school, give out
little pamphlets or pamphlets orwhatever you want.
And I was just like, sure, Iwent, thought it was really cool
, applied probably the nextnight, crazy, and got in and I
was like, okay, there's the nextstep.
Donnie Hathaway (18:35):
Wow, yeah, it was wild.
How, how, how long of a timeperiod was that from, like, the
first time you met the doctortill you applied to chiropractic
school?
Probably?
Two or three months becausethat was as long as the semester
was okay, yeah, yeah it movedfast and that's again how I know
.
Dr. Evan Rudd (18:48):
It was just like effortless effort.
Yeah, there was something to it.
It didn't feel like work and itwas just falling into place in
front of my eyes.
It's like I gotta follow thispath.
Donnie Hathaway (18:56):
Yeah, it paid off, it's wild that you never
had experienced chiropracticbefore, never ran into it.
And then, just like timing, umof it all, I've I've talked to a
few different chiropractors andit seems like they like the.
No, I don't think anyone thatI've that I've spoken with has
like planned or wanted to grewup wanting to be a chiropractor.
(19:16):
You know it just kind of likecircumstances, things, their
path changes and thisopportunity is there and then it
they gravitate towards it,right, for, for you know, many
reasons, but it is interesting,do you think that's changing at
all?
Because I know, like the, theawareness around chiropractic
right, like the, the openness toit, I think is is changing, is
is, you know people are startingto utilize it more.
(19:38):
Um, do you see that changing atall since you've been a
chiropractor?
Dr. Evan Rudd (19:42):
Yeah, you, you hit the nail on the head.
A lot of people don't seekchiropractic.
It finds those individuals thatare placed perfectly in the
world to be that lighthouse orthat beacon for the people
around them, except for the onesthat come from a lineage of
chiropractors.
And those guys are typicallyfantastic chiropractors for
years and then he became a docand he's just taken off because
(20:04):
he's had so many years doing it.
To go back to the originalquestion, there are more and
more chiropractors out there andit's hard when you find a
chiropractor that's passionateabout what they do.
The kid rarely grows up notwanting to be a chiropractor.
You know, because it's likepersonally it's the greatest
career out there, it isunbelievable.
And if I lived in my truth andmy passion and I lived out of
(20:27):
integrity and my life was goodas good as life can get, because
there's some hard parts aboutit.
But a kid would see that and behighly inspired.
Be like I want to do whatyou're doing.
You're helping all these people.
You're the mayor of the townwithout being the mayor of the
town.
What is this?
So they'd always grow up andwant to be that.
So I do think it's growing forsure.
(20:52):
What do you love aboutchiropractic so much?
Oh, another good question.
I think about the empowermentaspect of it.
It truly gives people the powerand the education about the
fundamental.
It's almost the user manual forthe body.
How do we have a user manualfor our computer and our coffee
maker?
But we came into this worldwith the most complex technology
existence has ever seen and wedon't have a user manual for it.
Nor do we really have theaccess to the information.
(21:14):
We have to go through school,graduate school, to get that.
And then we live in this worldof technology where we have
billions of search pages come upwhen you say what diet should I
be on?
It's so overwhelming and beingsomeone, being a chiropractor,
that is integrity and embodiedin what I practice and what I
preach.
It allows me to speak from aplace of experience of hey, I
(21:37):
know what you're going through.
This worked for me.
Try this before you do anythingelse.
And typically chiropracticalways comes back down to it's
deductive in reasoning.
So it's you have this issue.
Well, let's not focus on thisissue.
Let's go back to the verybeginning of how the body
actually works.
The nervous system runseverything.
It is the master control centerof everything that happens in
(21:59):
your body and it's designed tobe perfect.
Lifestyle choices, habits,society they all create this
disconnect from man, thephysical and man, the spiritual
basically our highest self.
So when we are having a hardtime being healthy, we have
these crazy diseases come up,we're in pain and nothing's
really changing.
We have to go back to thefundamentals of the nervous
(22:21):
system has to be fully effectivein what it's trying to do in
order for you to even have achance to heal anything.
So it's so basic in itsunderstanding that, no matter
who walks in your door, I canhelp you.
Donnie Hathaway (22:33):
Right Period.
Dr. Evan Rudd (22:34):
Right, and it's.
It starts there.
It starts with let's clear thenervous system.
Then you do have to go home anddo the discipline and the the
taking care of yourself part.
That's the homework of it.
Yeah, I'm not Jesus, right?
No matter how much I want to be.
I love my people, I want tohelp them, but I'm here to make
sure that the nervous systemstays clear and I'm going to
give you every tool in my beltand I'm, as a human, I'm going
(22:57):
to help you find your answer andwhat you need next, and I think
that's really empowering forpeople.
And to add to that, likesurgeons, they're out there
saving people's lives all thetime.
But there's so much riskinvolved in being a surgeon that
you do a 16 hour surgery andyou go, try to sleep and you're
worried that that person's goingthrough post-op.
(23:17):
Okay, yeah, and you wake up andyou just have your fingers
crossed.
Donnie Hathaway (23:20):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (23:21):
I get to go home every single night knowing that
my people are safe and better.
Donnie Hathaway (23:25):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think that the like when
I first started seeing Dr Caleb, you know, it was just kind of
like that, like I want to behealthier and that sort of thing
, and it's, and it's progressedsince I've seen him too, Right,
and and like adding in theweight training and just
different movements and stuff,have like I think really just
like taking it up another levelon like how I feel, how my mind
(23:48):
is, like kind of throughout theday, and it's made it.
You know it makes a huge impact.
Do you guys see, I know likeyour practice, like what you
guys do, is a little bitdifferent than I think I think
most chiropractor offices, right, but like, do you see a lot,
like a lot of your patients?
Are they like they're coming toyou because an accident or are
they coming to you because of ofthey just want to be healthier
and be the best version ofthemselves?
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:10):
Yeah, most people are coming to a chiropractor
because there's pain involved.
Donnie Hathaway (24:13):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:14):
That's typically.
That's just how people insociety handle things nowadays
Just go, go, go until you can't.
Donnie Hathaway (24:21):
Yeah, do something about it when that
point comes.
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:23):
It's very reactive rather than proactive.
A piece of that is just beingeducated on what proactive means
and that proactive health isactually a choice.
You can be proactive about it.
You're just choosing to be morereactive, you know, and giving
that education behind why andhow.
Donnie Hathaway (24:42):
Yeah, yeah.
Where do you see chiropracticmedicine going in the next,
let's say five, 10 years?
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:48):
Like you said, we do things a little differently
at the source.
Donnie Hathaway (24:51):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (24:51):
I think this is what we call the new gen Kairos.
I think we're onto something.
Yes, it's getting away from thedoctor patient hierarchy, it's
getting away from treatment ofthings and it's getting to this
place of relatability betweensomeone that has answers and
someone that's seeking answers,so it's no longer so divided,
(25:13):
it's I'm a human being presentwith another human, and I'm not
invalidating your story.
I'm not saying I'm sorry youfeel this way, because that
inherently points to that thereis some way that they should be
feeling it's wow, that must beso hard.
I can't imagine what you'regoing through.
Or, if you can imagine, youjust say like little things that
(25:34):
, in your own language, say thesame thing that they just said
or make assumptions on.
Like I was talking.
I watched a Joe Rogan podcastand he was talking to JD, the
new vice president that Trumpwants, and JD was talking about
the day Trump asked him to bevice president and when he said
yes, joe was like, took it alayer deeper and was like yo,
(25:55):
how was that?
Like how much in that momentwhen you had that phone call,
how much was going through yourmind.
And then, right after that, howdid things change?
Like how was your day to dayafter that and I think Joe is a
master of communication andconnection and showing like he
is understanding of where you'recoming from.
He's an example of where Ithink chiropractic is going to
(26:16):
be going soon just the presence,connection and validity of
other people's experiences yeah,like is do the way that
americans think about healthcare, like, is that changing and
and shifting towards that?
Oh my, God, I hope so.
I hope so.
Yeah, there's some really goodprofessions out there, like
naturopaths, acupuncturists,herbal medicine people.
(26:40):
There's so many goodprofessions out there that are
working towards helping peoplejust handle life a little better
.
Donnie Hathaway (26:46):
Yeah, like more preventative, like you just get
, yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (26:49):
But there's also just this mass amount of people
that are still more reactivethan proactive about their
health, and I think it's thatthreshold.
So once enough people startbeing preventative about their
care, the whole table will startto turn.
Donnie Hathaway (27:03):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (27:04):
But right now we're still climbing towards
that threshold.
Donnie Hathaway (27:07):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (27:07):
Most healthcare people are moving in that
direction.
Donnie Hathaway (27:10):
Yeah, and I think I've seen this in some
insurance companies too, likehealth care insurance, like
they're offering incentives orwhatever for preventative care
maybe not to like go see achiropractor, like we'll cover
that cost, but like we'll offerdiscounts if you're healthy or
maintain this level of health,or whatever.
So they're get people to thinkabout being preventative.
Dr. Evan Rudd (27:30):
Yeah, well said the, the insurance game is tough
because they just try todictate, like what your care
needs and right.
Cause they aren't doing theexam.
Donnie Hathaway (27:39):
Right.
Dr. Evan Rudd (27:39):
They didn't go to school for anything and yet
somehow they have the ability totell you what they're going to
help you pay for and whatthey're not.
The wellness is the right is astep in the right direction.
I genuinely think we just haveto change the definition of
healthcare.
Healthcare is not taking careof your health when the wheels
have already fallen off.
Healthcare is taking care ofthe health right.
(28:01):
It's easier to keep you healthythan to get you out of disease
or fix your pain right.
Let's make sure that you stayhealthy.
That's the easiest way to do it.
I think one of the philosophiesin chiropractic is disease is
not a thing or an entity.
It is the lack thereof, it isthe lack of health you know, and
it's just a sign of symptom ofthat so yeah, we can take care
(28:23):
of our health yeah the more thatdefinition changes, I think the
mass understanding of proactivehealth would be changed yeah,
that makes sense.
Donnie Hathaway (28:31):
You, when you look at like your health and and
like what are you doing to bethe healthiest version of
yourself, Like what are youryour pillars?
Or, like your, the main thingsthat you're focused on or that
are important for you Basicsyeah, Absolute basics.
Dr. Evan Rudd (28:45):
So again, that's one of my favorite parts about
being a doctor is that it meansteacher, and if I can live my
experience, I get to teach that.
What I know to be true is thatif you focus on the basics, you
will see change.
Donnie Hathaway (28:59):
And what are those?
Dr. Evan Rudd (28:59):
basics.
So mostly movement, mindfulness, nutrition and recuperation.
If you can hit all, I'll add afifth one in there Community
Movement you have to do.
It's just what keeps our bodymoving.
Motion is lotion, movement'smedicine.
You have a better understandingof where your arms are in space
.
When you move your arms moreoften right, it's a skill you
(29:21):
will feel better.
Everything will be nice andloose.
And then we have themindfulness part, where we have
to pay attention to how ourthought patterns change us.
If you're in the gym and you'retrying to bench press something
heavy, you're just like oh,this sucks and you're pushing
through it.
That creates this massive stressresponse through the entire
body Just you saying this sucksone time If you are bench
(29:44):
pressing and it's just not goingwell, but you go, yes, and you
finish it and you rack it.
It doesn't do that whole stressresponse thing.
So I think, paying attention toyour thought patterns and how
you live your life a lot ofself-reflection.
Make sure that you're on theright growth path and spending
time how you want to do, makesure life is fulfilling that's a
big piece of mindfulness.
(30:05):
Nutrition, pretty commonplacenowadays in society of just we
need organic whole foods.
Yeah, the closer it is to itsraw form, the healthier it's
going to be for you, the more itgets away from that.
Like, even just cooking azucchini takes it away from that
raw form, even just a littlebit yeah take away or diminish
the the vitamins and nutrients.
(30:26):
Yeah, yeah so organic wholefoods.
Most of the time, I like to sayyou can have your cake and eat
it too.
Just balance.
And then the recuperation issomething a lot of people
struggle with.
Surprisingly, a lot of peoplethink of rest and sleep when
they think of recuperation.
But to give an example, ifyou're out with the boys or out
with the girls one night, you'renot thinking about the
(30:48):
responsibilities you have as anadult.
You're having fun in thatmoment.
That's very good for yourmental and physical well-being,
right?
So teaching people recuperationyou do have to have fun in life
, you do have to have a littlelike aha, wonder and excitement
like what fills your cup up,like what?
Donnie Hathaway (31:05):
what do you enjoy doing?
Dr. Evan Rudd (31:06):
yes, yeah, yeah, you have to have that yeah, and
that's why it's same with likefood you have, you can have your
cake and eat it too.
So, personally, uh, I move mybody somehow some way every day,
uh, whether it's just swinginga kettlebell around for 10
minutes, that's like my bareminimum, uh, or I go to the gym
for two hours.
It's like my my upper echelonday.
Yeah, uh, nutrition is prettybasic.
(31:28):
I found a good routine thatworks for me.
My go-to is is eggs, sweetpotatoes and ground beef.
Dude, I will have this.
Is that your breakfast?
Donnie Hathaway (31:36):
That's a lot of meals for me, every meal.
That sounds like yeah, I lovewe started doing pan fried.
Leah found this recipe, my wife.
We slice up the sweet potatoesand it's just like a garlic salt
and pepper seasoning orsomething like that, and you
just grill them and fry them inthe pan.
Dr. Evan Rudd (31:55):
A little bit of butter and they're so good, so
good, so good yeah, those aresweet potatoes, and uh, yams are
actually really good fortestosterone too oh, okay
building up the male hormonesokay but yeah, so that pretty
much stays clean.
I have a smoothie a day, so alot of fruit I'll put, like
spinach and peanut butter andgreek yogurt in there for some
(32:16):
extra protein and stuff yeah um,for recuperation.
Man, I love video games still.
I know I said it earlier, thatwas where a lot of my childhood
came from.
It's hard to put them down.
It just it lights me up somehow.
Uh, so, making sure that Istill have time to do that.
It's not every day, it's when Ihave time.
Sometimes it's 10 minutes,sometimes two hours.
I'll just take what I can.
Donnie Hathaway (32:38):
Yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (32:38):
And then the.
The mindfulness is one of myfavorite aspects of health.
A lot of people call me prettyshot out and I have a lot of
weird questions for people, butthat's because I'm always
exploring this inner reality.
Donnie Hathaway (32:52):
Yeah, it's like what is everything?
You know, I'm I'm a bigphilosophy nerd, so it's like
that post you put out on or thestory you put out on social with
like the um, the differentuniverses, or like the amount of
universes.
It's like insane yeah.
Dr. Evan Rudd (33:05):
It's my favorite, I love it, but it takes so it
takes a lot of reflection.
Sometimes it's breathwork,meditation it's more often
breathwork, and then on, likebig days, journaling Journal
about whatever you're trying tofocus on.
So, for me, I've I had a veryhard time socializing as a kid
and even as a young adult.
(33:26):
Now that I'm in a professionalpeople business, I need to
communicate really well, so alot of my stuff is based on
communication.
So I'll take time every nightor every morning, whenever I can
, to reflect on what I'mfocusing on.
Donnie Hathaway (33:39):
Go hang out with Dr Evan.
Yes, awesome man, appreciateyou being here, dude.
That was fun.
This was awesome.
Yeah, cool little flow.
Yeah, I like it.
We'll do it again it we'll doit again, please.
I would love to.
Can we get like caleb ord-trail in here too?
So, kate, uh, we, caleb wetalked about that last time.
We were like we got to get likethe three of us in here, or
something like that.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we might have.
(34:00):
I don't know what we would dowith that, with that episode,
but like, yeah, we like I thethe one caleb that that's coming
out, uh, will be before, beforethis one's posted, but um it,
when we went for I think twohours or something like that,
wow, that's go.
We just sat down and we justkept going.
Dr. Evan Rudd (34:20):
He's such an easy guy to talk to.
Donnie Hathaway (34:23):
Yeah, for sure, Sweet Thanks man.
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