July 2, 2025 • 59 mins
Veteran screenwriter and author David Silverman 'How to be A Rockstar Screenwriter' takes us through his incredible journey in Hollywood, sharing on the Papamutes Podcast insider stories and practical advice for aspiring writers. His decades of experience across beloved shows like The Jeffersons, One Day at a Time, Mork and Mindy, Alf, and South Park offers valuable insights into the craft of screenwriting and the business of television. And don't miss the chance to download Silverman's book for free on Kindle from July 4th through July 8th, 2025.
show notes: susan morrison authored lorne: herb solow was head of mgm:
“THE OPINIONS EXPRESSED OR VIEWS EXPRESSED BY GUESTS DO NOT NECESSARILY REFLECT OR REPRESENT THOSE OF THE HOST;
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Papamutes (00:00):
You're listening to Unmuted with Papa Mutes.
Welcome to Papa Mutes everybody.
Today, my guest is DavidSilverman.
David is a writer and author ofhow to Be a Rockstar
Screenwriter or at least Pay theBills Mindset Tools and
Strategies for a SuccessfulScreenwriting Career.
David has worked a variety ofHollywood jobs and I'm thrilled
to have him on.
David, welcome to Papa Mutes.
David Silverman (00:21):
Hey, I'm really happy to be here, thank you.
Papamutes (00:24):
Yeah, my pleasure.
So let's get right to it.
David Silverman (00:40):
I mean, what are some of the shows and films
you have worked on that peoplewould recognize that are
listening or watching?
Yeah, so a lot of TV, theJeffersons One Day at a Time,
alf, newhart, south Park,gilbert Duckman, a whole bunch
of other stuff, and created fiveTV shows.
Papamutes (00:55):
One of them was the Wild Thornberries.
David Silverman (00:57):
It's a kids' show, yeah animated show.
And some films.
Right, yeah, I worked on, itwas Steven Spielberg on the
Flintstones movie.
There were several movies basedon our Wild, thoroughbred
characters, so there areprobably three of those all
(01:19):
together, Sweet sweet.
Papamutes (01:20):
So how did you crack the bubble of Hollywood?
I mean, it's not an easy bubbleto crack.
David Silverman (01:24):
No, I think it's harder now than it was for
me, but yeah, I would still.
So, yeah, I taught a wholeclass at UCLA on breaking in and
yeah.
So the trick is you have tohave a good writing sample.
That's the first step.
So it's either if you want tobe a screenwriter, like a
(01:47):
feature writer, then you have towrite a movie script, and if
you want to be a TV writer whichI advise is a good idea,
there's more jobs there you needa sample script from a TV show
or a pilot.
They're preferring pilots now,but back when I broke in, my
partner and I wrote a taxi specand a Barney Miller spec, which
(02:09):
then, when I say spec, thatmeans we dreamed up our own
episode idea for it and wrote it, and it was on speculation, so
we weren't paid or anything forthose, but those were the
samples that got us jobs.
And then, once we got the jobs,we got William Morris came.
You know they called us rightup.
These guys are getting hired onstaff at one date at a time.
(02:34):
You know, we were like 20s inour 20s back then.
Yeah, the agents will find youif you have a good enough deal.
Papamutes (02:42):
But how did you?
I mean, you submitted thesescripts but you're unknown.
I mean, how did you get youknow there's a million people
that want to submit scripts?
How did you get people to seeit?
David Silverman (02:54):
Yeah, so there's a couple chapters on
that in the book how to be ascreenwriter.
And yeah, when you're juststarting out and you know we
didn't have an agent when westarted out or a manager or
anything, so there's a form youcan get for free on the Internet
.
It's a release form.
It releases anybody who readsyour script from.
(03:17):
You know you're not going tosue them, that's what it tells
them, so you can read this and Iwon't sue you if something
similar comes up.
And so, yeah, we used those.
Read this and I won't sue youif something similar comes up.
And so, yeah, we used those.
We sent our taxi and ourburning Miller specs to people
in the business and and aspeople started liking them a lot
(03:38):
and very lucky there, we wereinvited to pitch work in Mind
Mindy, the TV show with RobinWilliams, and then, once we got
that job, we sold the storythere it's kind of like there's
a word of mouth when we gotinvited to the Jeffersons and so
(04:00):
so far we have no agent oranything setting these things up
.
But when we did pitch theJeffersons, I brought those two
scripts with me the spec scriptsthat I talked about, and down
the hall all the Norman Learshows were in the same building.
The Day to Time was another showwith Valerie Bertinelli, and so
(04:23):
I took those two scripts, and,of course, the release forms,
down to this story editor'soffice For one day at a time his
name was Bud Weiser, which is astrange name Bud Weiser.
Papamutes (04:39):
Gotta love that.
David Silverman (04:39):
That was it, anyway.
I left the two scripts on hisdesk and we got a call saying to
come in.
We sold them a script and wewrote it and then they said we
like what you're doing and wewant to hire you on staff.
Papamutes (04:57):
So who calls the shot ?
As far as payment, you soldthem the script.
Are you saying this is what Iwant, or are they saying this is
the rate that we give peoplewho are unknown?
David Silverman (05:08):
yeah, that was lucky.
Uh, bud weiser and the twoshowrunners yeah, they're.
Apparently they were lookingfor somebody at that time, so a
lot of it was timing sure um,yeah, a couple of people had
left the show and they needed tofill that space.
Yeah, they decided that what wewere writing was good enough.
(05:30):
It was on the level of the show, even though we were newbies.
So they hired us for a wholeyear and that's how we got our
first real staff job intelevision.
Papamutes (05:43):
So I mean, just briefly prior to, you went to
Stanford right to studypsychotherapy and you end up at
USC to study film.
I mean that's a goodprerequisite for dealing with
Hollywood.
David Silverman (05:53):
Yeah that's true, yeah, so I started out.
You know, as a kid my familywent to therapy like every two
weeks because my brother had OCDand so I was in there, we were
all talking about, you know,psychology issues and I started
get used to it and I liked itand I thought, and then my
(06:16):
brother miraculously was cured.
You know, he doesn't have thatproblem anymore.
So I was very impressed, yeah.
So when I got to Stanford Ithought I would major in
psychology.
So I did psychology there.
They had the best you know, theteachers there were the number
one psychology department.
(06:37):
So anyway, I graduated thereand then also, towards the end
of my four years there, I took acourse with Scott Turow who
wrote Presumed Innocent creativewriting, and I liked it a lot
and I started writing some sortof funny short stories.
Anyway, then the summer afterStanford I made a short film and
(07:03):
my brother and sister were init.
It's like just kind of amateurhour.
But I sent the script to USCand I got into their film
department, which was again likethe number one department in
the country.
A lot of luck involved theretoo.
Papamutes (07:19):
Yeah Well, timing is everything right.
Networking and timing.
So you fast forward to today.
We'll get through other stuff,but your book how to be a rock
star screenwriter.
What separates that from, inyour opinion, from other you
know plethora of screenwritingbooks.
In fact, I have one right overthere I'm sure you've heard save
(07:39):
the cat.
David Silverman (07:40):
You know that's like oh yeah, that's number one
yeah, you loved reading that.
Papamutes (07:43):
I think I have the second one.
Save the Cat Strikes Back.
Anyway, what's your book?
David Silverman (07:50):
So those books are very good.
I recommend them In my book.
I recommend a few books besidesmine and they focus on how to
write the script and nothingmore really.
So my book's more about some ofthe psychology of it.
It's very hard, usually likethe typical writer breaks in on
(08:12):
their seventh or eighthscreenplay.
So they're going through aperiod where they're writing six
or seven scripts and nobody'sthat interested.
So it's a tough thing for awriter to keep going after like
getting zero feedback that helpsor validation.
So I talk about the zen ofscreenwriting, that part of it
(08:33):
where you have to.
You know you're not going tosell this script but you have to
consider all the otheradvantages of writing it.
It's going to be your samplescript.
It will get you an agent.
Possibly it will get you into aproducer who then can sell a
script to them.
So I try to work on thepsychology.
(08:53):
This is why you have to keepwriting, because it's easy to
give up.
A lot of people do.
After three or four scriptsNothing happens.
Papamutes (09:04):
Do you feel it's absolutely necessary to move to
hollywood or new york to becloser to the industry?
I mean even today yeah.
David Silverman (09:13):
So there's two different answers to that.
If you're writing screenplays,you don't have to live here.
If you want to write ontelevision show, you do have to
live here, because, because mostTV shows are written, like,
with a staff of writers andthere's a thing they call the
room.
You know where they have, like,typically, a staff is, you know
(09:38):
, 10 to 15 writers.
All the creative stuff happensin the room, so they break
stories in the room.
They stuff happens in the room,so they break stories in the
room, they rewrite scripts inthe room, like on a comedy show.
There's tons of rewrites, likewe would have a rehearsal on
Tuesday and I would stay up lateTuesday night to fix all the
(10:00):
stuff that didn't work, and it'srarer than when you have a
script that's just 100% andkicks ass.
So Tuesday nights we sometimesstay until 3, 4, or 5 in the
morning trying to fix everything, and that's where the room
comes in handy.
You have all these voices andmore people can pitch ideas and
jokes.
You can also send YouTube.
(10:22):
Guys go off and rewrite thatscene and come back, and you
know there's like a lot ofdifferent ways to use the room.
But if you're living in LA toanswer your question, that's
your best shot at getting a TVjob.
Papamutes (10:37):
I'm sure Right Now who I mean?
You know everyone wants to makemoney.
Just who I mean?
If you think about being rich,you probably won't make it
because you've got to focus onwriting etc.
But who makes the money?
A showrunner, director, actor,producer, writer who's cashing
in?
If you had to really narrowthat down, yeah, well, the
(11:01):
showrunner in television.
David Silverman (11:03):
anyway he's making the most money because he
created the show and like infact, we created five shows
together, my partners and I.
Papamutes (11:14):
But isn't that like a producer, or is that two
different things.
David Silverman (11:16):
Yeah, they call them executive producer, but
they're also showrunners andhead writers there's multiple
names for it.
But yeah, you make good money.
We had a couple of successesand then Fox hired us in a
development deal.
They paid us a million dollarsa year to create more shows.
(11:37):
So that's big money.
For writers, that's probably asgood as it gets.
I mean, a guy like Dick Wolfwho creates Law and Order.
He's probably getting $10million to develop.
He's established right, right,but yeah.
(11:57):
The other people who do makemoney, the actors tend to.
You can read about $20 millionsalaries for like Leonardo
DiCaprio or big stars.
Papamutes (12:07):
Far and few between, but still, I mean you can cash
in definitely.
Do you think entering ascreenplay contest is worth it?
David Silverman (12:16):
Yeah, that's a good question.
I think it could be.
There's three the Nichols, theAustin and the Page.
I mean there's the Austin andthe.
Papamutes (12:26):
Page.
I mean there's big ones andthen you know like Philadelphia
has one, you know Pittsburgh hasone.
There's all kind of screenplaycontests, but I mean the Nichols
, I mean there's a ton of peopletrying out.
David Silverman (12:35):
Yeah, no, it's true it's hard to win that one,
but if you do, you're probablygoing to get your movie made.
Those three have the most cloutwith producers and people who
buy and make movies.
Papamutes (12:51):
But do you feel I mean you consult on scripts and
stuff.
Would it be better if someonecame to you with all your
experience?
Or trying to throw a dart atthe board at a screenwriting
contest?
I mean it seems like a longshot.
David Silverman (13:04):
There's a chapter in my book where I talk
about how you get better as awriter.
That's why you know thescreenwriters don't sell their
first script.
They get better because afterwriting six of them you start to
learn the craft a little bitbetter.
But the other thing that willreally help you learn is to have
a professional read your script.
(13:26):
I do that.
Eric Bork does that.
He's really good at it.
He wrote Band of Brothers forHBO.
The TV show Won an Emmy for it.
He's really excellent.
Papamutes (13:44):
Now, have you ever not to be a dick?
But have you ever read a scriptthat someone sent you?
You don't know this person andit's like ugh, sorry, this is
not your way off.
It's your way off.
It's not even close.
I mean, you've got to tellthese people straight up, right?
I know?
David Silverman (14:00):
That's hard.
But you know I'm pretty goodwhen I do consult like that.
I'm pretty good at coming upwith ways to fix it and make it
better, so I help out that way.
But it's true, a lot of peopleyou know they should read Save
the Cat.
You know that's great, yeah.
Or Sid Field has a good booktoo, I think it's just called
(14:23):
Screenplay.
But yeah, you've got to learnall the fundamentals early on.
Papamutes (14:33):
I'm sure it can't hurt, but not a screenwriting.
Creative writing class isbeneficial.
I would think it would be.
David Silverman (14:41):
Yeah, when I was at USC I took a whole bunch
of writing classes and uh, thething about usc like as a
chapter in my book about shouldyou go to film school or should
you take that money and make amovie you know there's different
approaches.
I know, um, uh, yeah, there's alot of examples of writers who,
(15:02):
instead of going to film school, they made a film.
Guys like, uh well, spike leemade, uh, his first movie, do
the right thing.
And lena dunham made some moviecalled furniture.
Uh, she didn't go to filmschool, but she's very
successful.
She had the tv show girls and acouple other projects.
Papamutes (15:24):
So it's not absolutely necessary.
It can't hurt, but it's notlike it's.
You know you better do it oryou're never going to make it
Right?
David Silverman (15:31):
Yeah, you could like.
In my book I suggest a coupleof things you could do instead.
So I taught at UCLA Extensionand they have affordable
screenwriting courses on theirin their extension.
So you don't have to get in.
You don't have to have a GPAand high SAT scores or anything
(15:52):
to get into that program.
I recommend it Because the goodthing about UCLA and USC is
you're learning fromprofessionals.
Papamutes (16:01):
Sure.
David Silverman (16:01):
They hire guys who have a track record and have
written lots of scripts andsold them.
Papamutes (16:08):
Plus, you make friends and networking is huge.
David Silverman (16:11):
Yeah, that's where I met my writing partner.
We wrote that Taxi Spec and theBurning Lips Spec together.
We were pretty lucky because wegot interest.
It took us maybe a year to getthose together and we got
interest.
Like, it took us maybe a yearto get those together and we got
hired right away so I can um goahead sorry no, I mean,
(16:34):
sometimes it does happen.
You can like we didn't sellthose scripts to taxi or barney
miller but you got us into Maxior Barney Miller but they got us
into all these shows.
They liked the writing on them.
Papamutes (16:48):
Nice.
Have you ever seen the Poor andHungry the?
David Silverman (16:52):
Poor and Hungry .
Papamutes (16:54):
Yeah, it's the first film.
Have you heard of Hustle andFlow?
You've heard of that movieright.
David Silverman (17:00):
Yeah.
Papamutes (17:00):
Hustle and Flow.
Well, the director I thinkDwyer, I might be mispronouncing
it he made this poor and hungryfilm with a video camera.
I mean a regular home videocamera.
David Silverman (17:14):
Yeah.
Papamutes (17:14):
But it's really good.
It's black and white, it'sreally good.
But someone saw it and that ledto him getting the hustle and
flow and anyway, anybodylistening.
I recommend the poor and hungry.
It's, it's on youtube, it's,it's really I'll check it out
yeah, it's very uh guerrillafilmmaking, but good, you know,
the guy knew what he was doing.
He just only had a home moviecamera or home video, right?
(17:36):
Yeah, it's very good uh, highlyrecommend it um yeah, a lot of
people.
David Silverman (17:41):
When you do that, instead of going to film
school, they make a movie.
I know I think it was LenaDunham's parents say here, you
can have this money, you caneither make a movie or go to
film school.
And they gave her enough moneyto make that short film.
It was actually a feature.
I think it's called Furniture.
Papamutes (17:58):
I mean nowadays, you know, with the phones, you know
you can make a movie on yourphone, yeah, you, and literally
put it on Final Cut Pro and atleast get something you know the
interest of people.
Yeah, back in the day, I meanyour home movie cameras were.
David Silverman (18:12):
Sure, yeah, there's a film called Tangerine
that was made all on an iPhone,and you can find that on YouTube
as well.
Papamutes (18:20):
Yeah, a lot of really good movies get done Pretty
wild.
David Silverman (18:23):
Yeah, that's your entry point too, Once you
finish something like that.
Papamutes (18:32):
it's a sample of your work and people are impressed,
like you said, with Hustle Flow.
Yeah, love that movie.
But you could not be living inLA, right, make your film and
somehow show someone online andback in the day, I mean you'd
have to get that film to thehands of people to watch it.
David Silverman (18:50):
It's a whole different animal now but still
not an easy yeah.
Yeah, I have friends who, likeI have one friend who lives in
nashville and he writes, uh,movies.
Um, he usually writes lowbudget sort of actions, but
they're sort of comedic also,and Bob Sands is his name.
He's written a whole bunch ofmovies and he still lives in
(19:12):
Nashville.
He didn't have to come out here.
You might have to fly out herefor the meeting, you know, but
there's Zoom now so you mightnot need to actually be there.
You go exactly.
You did the animation too,right oh yeah.
Papamutes (19:24):
yeah, there's Zoom now, so you might not need to
actually be there.
There you go.
Exactly, you did feature films.
You did the animation too,right?
David Silverman (19:27):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, my partner and I wrote
for a whole bunch of animatedshows.
Winnie the Pooh was anEmmy-winning TV show that Disney
made and, yeah, my partner wonan Emmy for that Nice.
And then, yeah, based on that,we were asked to produce a
couple animated uh TV shows andwe also sold, uh, the Wild
(19:50):
Thornberries, which is animateduh, now, what's your feeling on,
like when I'm growing up, youknow?
Papamutes (19:56):
I mean I don't know how old you are, but you're, you
know, you're close to me.
I'm guessing I could be wrong.
But my point is back in the day, you know, bugs, bunny, the
Roadrunner, tom and Jerry, allthese, they're pretty violent.
Now I'm watching these cartoonswith my grandchildren and it's
pretty sedated.
Do you think, like when I waswatching these cartoons back in
(20:16):
the day I wasn't going out andbashing my friends in the head?
You know, from watchingcartoons it seems really, I
don't know, boring to me.
These cartoons.
David Silverman (20:24):
Yeah, I know what you mean.
Things are changing.
There's a lot of pc culturestuff kicking in and yeah, it's
kind of dilutes the uh, the funof some of these.
There's still some goodcartoons.
I mean south park is reallygood, yeah, that's still good.
But yeah, kids cartoons getaffected that way a lot.
(20:44):
Yeah, well, embrace was areally fun experience.
They, let us do kind of adulthumor if you really most of the
cartoons even for kids cartoonsthey have have adult level jokes
.
We all try to get things inthere.
Papamutes (21:04):
Sure, what do you find harder to write Comedy,
drama or movies?
David Silverman (21:11):
Movies to me are harder.
I spent 30 years in television.
I kind of know how to breakdown a TV show and how to do it
right.
Movies are a little trickier.
The act work structures aredifferent and they're longer.
You really need to.
But for people who are writingmovies, I would suggest low
(21:34):
budget.
Right now there's a tendency ofthe big movie studios they just
want to hire the A-list guysthat they know and so they keep
using those guys over and over,so guys with a track record.
So it's hard for a newbie tobreak in.
But low budget and specificallylow budget horror, that's an
(21:58):
easy show to sell.
Uh, tv, I mean a movie to sellcompared to everything else,
because you don't need a bigstar for a horror movies like
you can have, like the blairwitch project there's nobody.
Nobody knew those people'snames and it was a huge hit and
they're.
They're also inexpensivecompared to you know, one actor
can raise the budget by 20 grand.
Papamutes (22:20):
Sure sure.
In fact, that movie I wasmentioning the Poor and Hungry,
he spent $20,000.
David Silverman (22:27):
Wow, that's great.
Papamutes (22:29):
This is back in the 90s, but it obviously led to
more for him.
Yeah, it's good stuff.
David Silverman (22:35):
Yeah sure, robert Rodriguez like wrote his
film.
He said El Mariachi stuff.
Yeah sure, robert Rodriguezwrote his film.
He said El Mariachi for $7,000.
Papamutes (22:45):
He had a lot of friends working for free.
Oh, that's what you got to do,right it's hard to do that now
Harder.
David Silverman (22:52):
He probably did that in the 80s.
Papamutes (22:55):
So when you're on a TV show, you're writing, you're
acting, whatever.
80s.
You're on a TV show, you'rewriting, you're acting Whatever.
The magic number correct me ifI'm wrong is 100 episodes to get
to syndication.
That's more money.
How does that work?
In general, as far as payment,I'm not talking numbers, I'm
(23:15):
saying let me ask you this.
When you're you know whenyou're on let me ask you this
when you're on a TV show andyou're writing, whether you're
head writer or not, how do youget paid?
Is it a weekly thing, everyother week, every month, every
episode?
Or does it depend on the person?
David Silverman (23:30):
Right.
So, yeah, I really recommendtelevision for people who want
to, because it's the easiest wayto make the most money.
So when you're on staff, you'regoing to write, you're going to
get a weekly salary, right.
So you're going to get usuallyin the $100,000 range for a year
For a rookie.
(23:50):
Well, not always for a rookie,but yeah, most of the jobs I had
we were making that much money.
I'm not sure why, but early onthat's pretty good money.
And then you get paid for theepisode you write.
It's a whole different thingand the Writers Guild has a
payment breakdown for that.
(24:10):
And then every time it rerunsthat's why that magic number of
100 is a huge goal forsyndicated TV shows you get so,
let's say you get 30,000 thefirst time you write for the
script.
That's sort of a typical sitcombreakdown and the next time it
(24:31):
reruns you get half of that.
You get $15,000 and it keepsgoing like that.
Mathematically.
Next time it's like 7.5thousand, keeps going in half
until you know.
Papamutes (24:43):
I get checks now for like two cents even the show
runner I mean all those peopleare still.
David Silverman (24:51):
They get chopped down too well, yeah,
after you'd three run like tentimes.
You know it gets kind of low,but the first time, the first
rerun, is half of what you gotfor writing the script.
That's usually in theneighborhood of $15,000, which
is nice.
You didn't do anything, youjust got to rerun and then the
next one will be $7,000.
(25:11):
I know it adds up if you'rewriting like 30 episodes like my
partner and I did.
That money adds up.
Sure, I got a writer's skillpension also.
Papamutes (25:24):
There you go.
I was going to say, I mean, Idon't need numbers, but you're
benefiting from syndicationyourself, oh yeah.
David Silverman (25:33):
Yeah, the one that did the best, ironically,
was the Wild Thornberrys, whichis animated, and there were
eight seasons of that and threeor four movies based on the
characters.
So I keep getting checks forthose Every once in a while.
I'll get a check for $3,000 orsomething.
That's nice and the pension isgreat, the Writer's Guild
(25:54):
pension.
I think I'm getting like$35,000 a year.
Papamutes (26:00):
Nice.
Now who keeps?
I mean, who keeps track of that, so you know you're not getting
screwed?
I mean you know you're notsitting around watching every
show that's syndicated.
Right, right I mean I'm surethere's a trust level somewhere.
David Silverman (26:14):
Yeah, so that's another interesting point.
I'm glad you brought that up.
There's non-Writers Guild showsand there's Writers Guild shows
, so the WGA protects thewriters, makes sure they have
these things called minimums sothey keep you from getting
screwed over and they keep trackof all your sales.
(26:36):
Good, screwed over and theykeep track of all your sales.
That's why I'm getting $35,000a year from them now, because
they know everything.
You have to pay your dues tothe Writers Guild.
It's not very much.
Every time you get paid theytake a little something out of
(26:56):
it.
I think they keep track Did thewriter's strike affect you.
Oh yeah, the writer's strikes.
There were several, I mean theones back in the 90s.
That's a period when there wasno work for maybe nine months.
That was really rough.
That's when my partner and Idecided to write cartoons,
(27:20):
because that's a totallydifferent guild, so animation
guild, the writers guild, wga isfor, yeah, live action usually,
so animation.
They don't pay quite as muchfor half an episode, but so we
(27:42):
started writing those and that's.
It ended up with us beingcontracted to create those
animated shows.
Papamutes (27:52):
Is it harder to write ?
I think I asked this question.
But comedy or drama, is thatharder?
I mean comedy, I think would beharder, but I don't know.
David Silverman (28:01):
Yeah, comedy is harder.
That's why they have a big roomfull of writers to come up with
better jokes.
You know there's a lot of jokesthat don't work when you do the
run-throughs on Tuesday and theactors put it on its feet and
then you see what's not working.
(28:21):
So you have to go into thewriter's room with all the other
guys and try to figure out howto fix everything.
It's tough.
It's hard the drama.
You know you don't usually haveto worry about the dialogue
that much because you knowthere's not a lot of jokes and
dramatic writing, but sometimesthe story needs rewrites.
(28:43):
I'm sure they have their ownroom full of writers and they
fix problems in the room.
Papamutes (28:50):
Is it true for a comedy sitcom to you have to
have a laugh every I don't know30 seconds or something.
I mean, it sounds ridiculous,but is that true?
David Silverman (29:01):
Yeah, a lot of the shows I wrote for had laugh
tracks I hate that fucking laughtrack.
Papamutes (29:06):
I know right, it's awful, I mean.
David Silverman (29:11):
I guess they've done tests and people like the
show better if there's somesprinkling of laughs, I mean if
you watch some comedies, youknow I watch the show better if
there's some sprinkling oflaughs.
Papamutes (29:18):
If you watch some comedies, I watch the show and
I'm like that's not funny, butthey're just throwing a laugh in
.
David Silverman (29:24):
I know and I'm like that's not funny.
They call it sweetening, that'sthe term they use.
It's funny, but yeah, there's aguy with a box and they have
all kinds of different laughs,laughs, and then they choose
what they think would work thebest.
Yeah, I didn't usually takepart in that, but yeah, there's
(29:46):
people who do it.
Like I say, the studies haveshown people enjoy them.
The show's better.
I know it pisses you off and Idon't particularly like it
either.
Papamutes (29:58):
Yeah, I mean, sometimes I like and it's funny
and there's a laugh track, andsome I'm like, oh my God, the
laugh track is killing me.
David Silverman (30:06):
I know what you mean.
Papamutes (30:09):
When you were writing on these shows?
Yes, and the show's being taped.
Were you there?
David Silverman (30:14):
Yeah, usually yeah.
Papamutes (30:17):
That had to be cool.
David Silverman (30:22):
I mean that's a cool show.
Were you there?
Yeah, usually, yeah, that hadto be cool.
I mean, yeah, yeah, liveaudience and it was fun to watch
.
You know, sometimes with infront of the audience, jokes
don't work.
Usually this is when the staffis.
They want the staff there onfilming nights.
It's a fixed problem.
So there's a lot of cases wherewe come up with another joke to
fix things.
You can't get them all,unfortunately but yeah, you know
(30:42):
what?
that's right, it's not live likesaturday night live no, it
doesn't go right out, so you canedit it later I read actually
just read a good book calledlorn, about uh, I think susan
miller's her name, but LordMichaels.
Papamutes (30:57):
I mean really detailed.
I mean that guy put up a lot ofshit but he got to where he
wanted to get.
Yeah, so in your book, I meanthe second part of your book is
at least pay the bills.
Oh yeah, at what point?
What level?
You know, everybody wants to befamous screenwriter, but at
what level do you need to be toat least pay the bills?
David Silverman (31:19):
right, right.
So tv works for that.
Like you, you get a lot ofmoney in television.
Like you say, all my jobs wereat least a hundred thousand
dollars, so that was.
I recommend that to people andthe other benefits of tv.
You get to write something andthen see it on its feet filmed
(31:39):
maybe two weeks later.
But movies it takes yearssometimes to get the funding and
get the right stars in thereand so it takes forever and
sometimes the paydays are better, but not that much better.
I remember getting paid $50,000for a movie that I sold on a
pitch with my wife.
(31:59):
That's not a lot of moneycompared to TV money.
Papamutes (32:05):
When you were on these TV, were you the head
writer?
I'm sure there's differentlevels of cash flow.
Head writer Joe Schmo For the100G.
Were you the head writer?
David Silverman (32:17):
Which show.
Papamutes (32:19):
When you were making $100,000 a year.
David Silverman (32:21):
Oh yeah, Was that your?
Papamutes (32:21):
head writing position .
David Silverman (32:23):
Yeah, that was just a regular writer.
I think my partner and I had tosplit that.
But yeah, if you're a writeryou can expect those kinds of
salaries.
Yeah, we were story editors onOne Day at a Time.
That was our very first staffshow, yeah.
And then you work your way up.
They start changing the titlesthere's like associate producer,
(32:50):
producer, supervising producer,executive producer, and those
titles carry more weekly moneywith them.
The higher, you get Nice.
Yeah, it adds up.
There's a lot of money intelevision.
Papamutes (33:06):
Now I mean also I mean that's good cash flow, but
LA is not cheap either to livefrom what I've heard, that's a
good point.
David Silverman (33:15):
It's true, yeah .
I mean you've got to pay, uncle.
Papamutes (33:20):
Sam.
David Silverman (33:24):
Right, yeah, taxes you.
From what I've heard, that's agood point it's true.
Papamutes (33:25):
Yeah, I mean you got to pay, uncle sam.
You know you got right.
David Silverman (33:26):
Yeah, texas, you got it you got other things
going on like life.
Yeah, sure, but it's still agood check.
I mean, you know, yeah, that'strue.
True, yeah, it's uh.
Yeah, I don't know how somepeople do it, I know people do
now.
Papamutes (33:33):
I mean when, when you were starting out and you got
this writing job, did youcontinue?
Because when a show stops thisis a second actor, for instance,
he's acting in a show it stopsit's like ugh, there's no
guarantee he's going to move onto the next show, so he's got to
make the dough before they go.
You know what I mean.
Did you ever have that gapwhere you're like oh, fuck man,
(33:54):
what am I going to do now?
David Silverman (33:59):
Yeah, like, oh, fuck man, what am I gonna do
now?
Yeah, it happened all the timein our career.
Uh, because the shows like theshows we created, for example,
um, there's one called the superservice guy which judge, judge
reinhold and ellen claghorn.
With ellen claghorn and thosetwo, they went one season, 18
and out, and they didn't getpicked up.
So after that we had to go findand we were creators on that
(34:24):
show and showrunners.
Papamutes (34:28):
So I mean, if you're pocketing the cash, you know,
and you have a little bank full,fine.
But if you're just starting outand you're on a show, it's like
, yeah, ba-da-ba-doo, let's go,let's go party, let's you know,
uh, cocaine hookers the wholenine yards, right, or whatever,
whatever you're into.
And then the show stops.
It's like, oh shit, gotta makethat car payment I know yeah, I
mean, that's part of the gig.
I'm not you know.
I'm sure something's in yourbook to, at least you know, uh,
(34:51):
bring the reality to it.
It's not easy to get into andand there's pitfalls I know.
David Silverman (34:57):
That's why I recommend this sort of a long
view, because it's easy to getuh upset when like that happens,
for example, and then quit, andit happens to writers a lot and
they, they don't, maybe theydon't uh the show they're on
ends and they don't get uh, theydon't get picked up on a
(35:17):
different show for a year, twoyears and three years and then
they start to, you know, go backto their old jobs, you know
what is a good job to have whileyou're trying to live in la and
still, still.
Papamutes (35:32):
You know you're not working constantly, but you know
you're trying to getestablished.
What's a good day job that youknow?
David Silverman (35:37):
yeah, the day jobs I recommend are, uh, you
know, for somebody who's movedout here and he's looking to get
hired on a tv show, for example, there's a couple of jobs that
like, for example, on the showsthat we uh created, we hired
(35:59):
writer's assistants, whichthey're the guy in the room
who's you know, they're notwriters, but usually they want
to be writers and they have specscripts and they're working
closely with us.
The showrunners and writers arepitching ideas and they write
everything down and they're theones that take notes basically
(36:22):
on everything that happens inthe room and that's a tough job
but I highly recommend itbecause on the two shows we
created we gave those guysepisodes.
So you know, one of these guyswent on to write for De.
So you know, one of these guyswent on to write for Dexter, you
know, but his first paying job,screenwriting job, came as a
(36:48):
perk for being a writer'sassistant.
So that gets you started, thatgets you an agent.
Papamutes (36:55):
So as an assistant you're getting paid.
This is not like an internshiptype thing.
David Silverman (36:59):
Oh yeah, that's a paid job.
I recommend it for somebody whowants to break into television.
That's a great job.
Writer's assistant.
The other guy that was in ourroom working, eric Shaw, went on
to write for Spongebob and hewon an Emmy for another show.
So we give these guys theirfirst paid screenwriting gig,
(37:24):
which is the key to breaking in.
Once you get paid to writesomething in Hollywood, people
are interested.
Agent Swann, like they may.
You know the agents have todecide between, like, taking on
a newbie writer who's never soldanything and uh, you know that
takes a lot of their time.
(37:44):
They're working with that, thatguy and trying to improve his
writing and come up with ideaswhat shows should you target,
and that sort of thing.
Papamutes (37:54):
But I mean that's a great gig if you can get it
right.
I mean let's just say you can'tget that.
Oh yeah, I mean are we talkingbeing a waiter and all that
bullshit?
I mean you know?
I mean that's the perfect gig.
You're in the pizza shop.
They make the pizza.
You might as well roll thedough for the guy.
I mean you know what I mean?
Uh, outside of that job, isthere anything?
David Silverman (38:14):
yeah, there's a couple other jobs.
When I, when I was like afterusc like one of the classes they
teach you how to write, theycall it coverage for script.
That's when you read ascreenplay and kind of grade it
for you know the dialogue andthe story and all the other
things that go into characterarcs and things.
(38:35):
So I learned how to do that atUSC and then I applied to
different studios.
I got hired at AmericanInternational Pictures and every
day I went in to pick up a newscript and I was a bartender at
the same time.
So I'd pick up a script or anovel Sometimes they gave me
(38:56):
novels to read and then I wouldwrite coverage for it, which
involves writing a summarythat's really short but you want
it to capture all the as muchas possible the flavor of the
work, which is not easy.
I would usually go home 10 barI'd be reading the scripts
behind the bar while I waswaiting for customers to order,
(39:18):
and then I'd go home at like twoin the morning and write the
coverage.
And then I go home at like twoin the morning and write these,
the cover, and then you've gotto grade the, like I said, the
dialogue and the story andcharacters on a scale of 10.
So every day I had to do that,and then every day the next
morning I drove down to AmericanInternational Pictures and
dropped it off and got anotherscript to read.
(39:39):
So I was pretty busy at thatpoint.
Papamutes (39:42):
Sure yeah, you gotta.
You gotta hump, you gottahustle, you gotta write.
Dropped it off and got anotherscript to read, so I was pretty
busy at that point?
David Silverman (39:46):
Sure, yeah, you gotta.
You gotta hump, you gottahustle, you gotta write, write,
write, write.
But that's a really good jobfor somebody.
You really learn a lot abouthow to write when you're
evaluating other people'sscreenplays.
Papamutes (39:55):
So let's just say someone's listening and they're
like, oh yeah, where do wherewould you go to try to get that
job?
Or is it a matter of knowingsomebody?
Where would you actuallyphysically go?
I'm in la, you know where do Igo to see if that is available
yeah.
David Silverman (40:09):
So, uh, you do what I did, uh, you learn how to
write the coverage and youwrite a sample.
So I was kind of I think I wastrying to be clever and I got
William Goldman came out with abook called Magic and I thought,
well, everything he writesturns into a brilliant movie,
(40:31):
like Butch Cassidy and all thesethings.
So I recommended it highly inmy coverage and I praised all
the writing and everythingbecause it was William Goldman,
this guy that wrote all thesegreat scripts.
Anyway, they did make a movieout of that later.
So that was the sample I sentaround to all the studios and
they read it and said, oh, thisguy likes you know, he knows the
(40:54):
format, it's easy to read hiswriting all that stuff.
So that's how I got that jobnice, and you send it.
You can can get the addressesand emails for all the studios.
There's a studio department inevery studio.
So that's how you do it.
Papamutes (41:10):
And then there's the dreaded rejection.
I mean, you're not going tojust send it and like oh yeah,
we'll take it.
There's the dreaded rejection,and you're going to pound the
payment again and again.
David Silverman (41:19):
There's a lot of that.
Yeah for sure.
It's very true.
That's another thing I talkabout in the psychology of how
to handle all those rejections.
So one thing that does help, Ithink, is just knowing that it
happens to the best writers too.
You know guys like Stephen King.
(41:46):
They collected rejectionscripts, like hundreds of them,
and yeah and yeah, somehow allit takes is one person that's
one of the things I say in thebook is all it takes is one?
Papamutes (41:50):
yes, that's right.
You got to crack that bubble.
I mean you got to take a chanceand see what happens anything
in life, but especially withthat.
I mean jesus yeah.
David Silverman (42:00):
No, it's hard on people emotionally to want to
stick with it and do their bestwork, because they know.
Let's say, you've written sixscripts and they all got
rejected and you know you'rethinking all right, I'm gonna
write another script, numberseven.
Papamutes (42:14):
They're probably thinking it's not gonna sell, uh
, so you know, when you werewriting as a young man, right,
right, did you love writing?
I think you've got to love itright.
You can't just say I want to bea writer, just to you know,
tell your girlfriend, I mean,you've got to love it right.
David Silverman (42:28):
Yeah, that's true.
It does help because the guyswho get hired you know I had
some friends, amazing friends.
Yeah, they loved writing somuch.
Papamutes (42:42):
I don't love it as much as a lot of other people.
They've got to have a passionfor it.
David Silverman (42:46):
Yeah, you do, you have to really love it.
When I was in college as a kidI loved the Marx Brothers.
I loved all these comedy moviesthat came out.
I could quote the dialogue andthat sort of thing.
I even wrote my honors thesison a comedy writer and that's
(43:12):
damn nice and yeah.
So I just I knew so yeah, Ikind of, uh, I worshipped the.
You know the guys who wrotethose scripts.
Papamutes (43:16):
So some of those comedies yeah, those comedies
back in the day, or as you know,I mean you're probably watching
the same ones I was, and thennow they're.
Even those are sedated a littlebit, now a lot, actually.
The comedies are not as yeah,what's the word you know?
David Silverman (43:32):
edgy, edgy, right, yeah, you know you got to
worry about this person andthat person.
Papamutes (43:35):
I mean, you know, just uh, the mike myers films
are just like over the tophilarious, but yeah, someone's
going to get offended.
It's like come on.
David Silverman (43:43):
I know right, yeah, Blazing Saddles is the
classic.
Papamutes (43:46):
Blazing Saddles.
David Silverman (43:48):
Yeah, you probably could not get that
movie made right now, which is ashame.
Papamutes (43:52):
But you know, I mean, you probably noticed it.
I think Richard Pryor actuallywas behind that, he wasn't just
in it.
David Silverman (43:58):
Yeah, true, he helped he was, he wasn't just in
it.
Yeah, true, he helped, he wasin the writer's room.
Yeah, in the writer's room.
Sorry, yeah, yeah, brooks wrotemovies like tv shows.
Papamutes (44:11):
He had three or four guys on that, I can't remember
the other guys.
David Silverman (44:12):
But yeah, prior was in it and uh, yeah, I don't
think they had in my mind, forI think he's a black sheriff and
that is remembering thatcorrectly, that's a classic
movie.
Yeah, so funny.
But yeah, he was in thewriters' room.
I think they tried to castother guys.
But yeah, eventually he endedup in that role and yeah he was
great in that.
Papamutes (44:34):
Did you ever meet a gentleman named Herb Solo?
David Silverman (44:37):
Herb Solo, I don't think so.
Papamutes (44:39):
Head of Paramount Pictures at one time.
David Silverman (44:41):
Oh, okay.
Papamutes (44:43):
I'm going to bring that up because I had another
gentleman on here, a directorguy, who he came out of college
and bugged him long story shortuntil the guy actually said,
okay, come and you'll be a PA.
He was persistent with hisconstant trying to get into the
bubble when I gave him a break.
David Silverman (45:05):
For all the studios Disney, paramount, mgm,
sony, the Norman Lear shows andall the Mary Tyler Moore.
Papamutes (45:14):
This would be back in the early 70s, judging from the
Mark Travis who came on and wastalking about his beginnings,
so to speak.
I have a little segment Icreated.
I want to see if you can goalong with this called Name
Association.
I'm going to give you a name.
David Silverman (45:30):
Okay.
Papamutes (45:31):
Now, I'm assuming I'm not assuming you know all these
people, but if you have a quoteor a feeling or a story, great,
it might just be one word, onesentence.
But, um, let's give it a shot.
It's the first time I'm doingthis.
David Silverman (45:45):
Here we go name association right let's see uh,
robin williams ah, brilliant,yeah, genius love that.
Yeah, I've seen him.
Uh, I think I saw him at.
Uh, I think I saw him at like,there was a payphone in Studio
City and we were having hot dogsat the Papoose Hot Dog Show and
(46:10):
, yeah, he put on a show,talking to this non-existent
person on the other end of theline, like for 40 minutes.
It was hilarious.
Papamutes (46:17):
So you're saying he was just outside?
David Silverman (46:18):
Yeah, that was not even on the show.
He was just like like doingfunny stuff.
Papamutes (46:26):
Was he Robin Williams ?
The famous Robin Williams atthat time?
David Silverman (46:29):
Well he was Mork and Mindy famous.
Papamutes (46:31):
That's famous.
I mean that was pretty big, itwas the number one show at the
time.
So you recognized him?
Oh yeah yeah, yeah.
David Silverman (46:39):
so yeah, that guy, yeah, yeah, probably nobody
like richard prior, maybe it'sclose now you've worked on
morgan mindy, or no?
Sold the story to them.
Yeah, so we went in a pitch.
Papamutes (46:51):
So like one episode.
Yeah, for one episode.
David Silverman (46:54):
Yeah, I remember it's about white lies
okay, cool, great.
Papamutes (46:59):
Did you ever meet robin williams though?
David Silverman (47:02):
yeah, yeah, not , not in the, not at the studio,
but outside the studio in thephone booth yeah, watching him
put on the show for everybodyamazing, like unbelievable.
No scripts, you know nothing,just oh, he was, he was improv
yeah, king of the yeah, allright.
Papamutes (47:18):
How about um john good?
David Silverman (47:20):
John Goodman.
Yeah, I worked with him also onthe Flintstones.
Papamutes (47:26):
Seems like a good guy .
David Silverman (47:27):
Yeah, he was great.
Yeah.
Yeah, flintstones was a funshow to work on at that time, so
we were some of the writers onthe script, kind of like Mel
Brooks.
They had a room full of writersfor Flintstones and so the
director asked us to show up onthe set.
So we got to meet and we gotElizabeth Taylor who played
(47:51):
Fred's mother-in-law.
On that we got to meet allthese actors and Rick Moranis
played Barney.
So, rick, we were assigned tohim.
My partner and I said he has afew questions and problems about
writers to improve on.
So we went around figuring outwhat and we wrote up
(48:13):
alternatives.
Papamutes (48:14):
What about Steven Spielberg?
David Silverman (48:16):
Oh yeah, Spielberg was fun.
We pitched the story for theFlintstones directly to him and
he was really nice.
I got him to autograph a copyof Back to the Future.
He wrote Back to the Past withthe Flintstones on there, Cool.
Papamutes (48:36):
And yeah.
David Silverman (48:37):
So yeah, very nice guy.
He's not over the top oranything, just sort of.
You know, real sweet how aboutbob newhart yeah, newhart was
also a regular guy, buthilarious yeah old school right
right.
Yeah, my partner and I had someinput on the final episode of
(48:57):
newhart where he wakes up nextto emily.
I don't know if you rememberthat.
It's kind of a famous episode.
They were looking for a B storyfor that.
My partner and I had this ideaof what if somebody wants to
come in and turn that town thatNewhart lives in, turn it into
(49:19):
what's that?
Papamutes (49:21):
Bedrock.
David Silverman (49:22):
Yeah, not, not Bedrock, but something similar
like Solvang.
Yeah, so our pitch was theywant to buy the town and turn it
into Solvang, so they used that.
They changed it a little bit,but they used that part.
So we, you know, marginallyinvolved in that.
But, yeah, another comic book,how about Richard Dreyfuss?
Papamutes (49:41):
Richard Dreyfuss marginally involved in that, but
yeah, another comics man, yeah,how about Richard Dreyfuss?
David Silverman (49:45):
Richard Dreyfuss yeah, I don't think we
ever met him, okay, but yeah, Imean I admire his work.
He's a terrific actor, Good guy.
Papamutes (49:54):
Pee Wee Herman.
David Silverman (49:55):
Oh yeah, Pee Wee we worked with.
That was really fun.
He had a pilot idea that hewanted to write and after we had
some, you know, we created fiveshows.
So we had kind of a reputationfor being guys that could make
that work.
(50:16):
And they set us up at theHollywood Roosevelt Hotel and we
got the top floor the MayorBradley Suite, I think it was
called and we ordered roomservice and we were there all
day writing with him and he washilarious.
Another hilarious guy.
Papamutes (50:33):
Supposedly, from what I've read, he had a ton of
different characters, but PeeWee Herman was the one that a
studio or somebody wanted to gowith, so he got stuck with that,
so to speak yeah, I know it's.
David Silverman (50:45):
There's a really good documentary on maybe
that's what I actually that's.
Papamutes (50:54):
You know what?
That's probably where I gotthat information from.
Yeah, yeah yeah, he was a trip.
How about Norman Lear?
David Silverman (51:00):
yeah, you know, uh, we worked on at least two,
maybe three of his shows.
We never saw him, which wasinteresting, wow.
But you know, he had somethinglike six or seven shows going at
the same time and that guy soyeah, he didn't actually come in
and break stories with us.
Papamutes (51:21):
How about Roseanne?
David Silverman (51:22):
Oh, roseanne, that's uh, that's another
interesting story.
I, my partner and I, worked onthe Tom Arnold show and she was
the exec producer on that andshe also acted in it.
She played a stalker, I think.
Uh, somebody was coming afterTom's character.
That's kind of a funny idea.
But yeah, she's kind of a funnyidea.
(51:44):
But yeah, she's kind of quirky.
My partner and I was astar-sick in silver, most people
call this.
My partner had really longblack hair and she called us the
hippie and the Jew.
I don't think she knew ournames.
Papamutes (52:00):
How about Drew Carey?
David Silverman (52:02):
Yeah, Drew Carey was a lot of fun to work
with.
We worked with him on a showcalled the Good Life.
This was before the Drew.
Carey show and before the Priceis Right.
Yeah, interesting guy, he was aMarine before he went into
acting.
I know we went to his apartmentonce just to hang out.
I think Norm MacDonald came tothat.
A lot of black people went intoacting.
(52:23):
I know we went to his apartmentonce just to hang out.
I think norm mcdonald came tothat uh, a lot of people, and
they were smoking pot again.
This is before he was like abig, big shot all right, um no
relation.
I'm assuming sarah silvermanyeah, sarah Silverman Not
related to me directly, but sheplayed a stalker on another show
(52:47):
.
It's called Manhattan AC, whichis a very funny show.
It has a former actor whodecides he wants to be a sheriff
in real life, so he kind ofbuys this town and it was Chad
Everett that played him.
Chad Everett, wow, yeah, andthere was an episode where Sarah
(53:13):
Silverman played the stalker.
Now, did you?
Papamutes (53:17):
ever meet?
Sorry to interrupt, I don'tneed a name, but I'm sure
everybody's not nice.
Did you ever meet?
Sorry to interrupt.
No, go ahead.
I don't need a name, but I'msure everybody's not nice.
Did you ever meet someone whowas famous and you were like
fuck this guy or this girl, whatan asshole.
David Silverman (53:32):
Yeah, some actors are.
You know, there was one guylike when he worked in ALF, the
guy who played the father onthat show Willie Tanner is his
name on the show and he was kindof bipolar One day he'd be okay
and then some days he'd be verydifficult to work with.
(53:53):
So one day in particular he wassupposed to say something to
Alf.
That was kind of derogatory andI don't remember the joke or
the line.
But he said I would not saythat to Alf.
He knows the relationshipbetter than anybody because he's
the actor.
He said I would not.
(54:15):
I refuse to say that line.
I forget what it was, but helocked himself in his dressing
room the whole day and he hadthe camera guys who were there
getting paid uh, it's not cheap,you know, thousands and
thousands of dollars.
I mean he couldn't show theshoot, the episode.
He locked himself in there andthe next day I guess this is
where the manic and the you know, the mood swings come in he
(54:39):
brought, brought a box of DomPerignon and gave one to
everybody and apologized no,that's good, that's nice.
But he must have cost, thebudget must have gone way up for
that one.
Papamutes (54:50):
Yeah, I'm sure, I'm sure.
So look, before I wrap this up,you mentioned Elf.
Who was controlling Elf?
Who played Elf?
How'd that work?
David Silverman (55:02):
Oh, yeah, yeah, so yeah, that's what's his name
again, anyway, he's the onethat created the show with.
Papamutes (55:12):
But I mean it was like a it's a puppet, a puppet
kind of I mean.
David Silverman (55:17):
There was a version.
Was there a?
Papamutes (55:18):
hand in there.
What was going on?
Yeah, a hand mostly.
David Silverman (55:20):
They did have an elf suit and you move fit
into the suit.
They didn't.
He's a very tiny guy and theydidn't use that very often, but
yeah, mostly, and they had aspecial stage design so it came
about chest high.
That was the floor of the livingroom in the tanner household
(55:44):
and so this guy could stand upand, like you know his, his head
was basically floor level theycould hold the puppet up like
that and there were remotecontrols on his eyes and stuff
in his ears that made them movearound, and there's a whole
group of people you know withthe remote eyes and stuff and
his ears that made them movearound, and there's a whole
group of people you know withthe remote controls and stuff
(56:06):
and doing that during this.
So it was really involved.
But yeah, he was hilarious.
Paul Fusco is the guy whocreated the off show and he was
really funny so, and Tom Patrickcreated the show with him.
Papamutes (56:24):
It was a really fun show to work on.
Yeah, classic.
Um.
So what's going on currentlyfor you?
Um, that I mean, besides thebook which I recommend, uh, how
to be a rock star screenwriter,at least pay the bills.
I mean, I read portions of itthat's online, you know, before
it cuts off and uh, I'm like, oh, I gotta keep reading this, but
anyway, you know what's goingon, um, besides wanting to get
(56:46):
the book out there, anythingelse.
David Silverman (56:48):
oh, right, right, well, I should announce
this actually, sure, so the bookis, the kindle version is going
to be free, uh, from july 4ththrough july 8th, and so it's
kind of a experiment to see howthat works and see if a lot of
people pick it up for free.
But if you're at all interested, if you know a screenwriter, if
(57:11):
you have a son or a nephew orsome some poor guy who has
decided he wants to be ascreenwriter, you know you need
all the advantages, uh, you needall the good advice you can get
, and that's sort of what is inthe book.
That's why I created the bookfor people and all the things
(57:32):
we've talked about during theshow, the rejections and how to
keep your head in the gameregardless of all the tough
stuff you have to endure.
Papamutes (57:43):
I mean it's a huge talking points.
I mean these are great advice.
Advice, if you uh, you want toget into that scene.
It's not easy, but you know,you know you love it.
David Silverman (57:52):
You got to do it, I mean, and this book sounds
like it's right in the pathwayum, yeah, it's great for anybody
who wants to become ascreenwriter or a television
writer, so I talk about both.
There's also a chapter on olderwriters.
Sometimes I know a lot ofpeople in their 40s and 50s.
There's some advice on how tobreak in.
(58:12):
It's easier to break in writinglow-budget movies than it is
otherwise, because the TV staffsare populated by
twenty-somethings andthirty-somethings I'm sure, and
when people hire more writersfor that, they generally looking
for people who kind of fit in.
Unfortunately, there's a ageismissue in Hollywood.
(58:36):
So there's a lot of good advicedepending on what your ideas
are, how old you, if you want towork from Nebraska or come out
here, if you're thinking aboutfilm school, you're not sure
there's advice on that.
Papamutes (58:51):
Nice, excellent.
Well, dave, I really appreciateyou coming on.
This has been a great, greattalk.
David Silverman (58:56):
Oh great.
Thank you very much for havingme.
I appreciate it.
It was a lot of fun.
Papamutes (59:00):
This has been an Unmuted podcast with Papa Mutes.
You're listening to Unmuted with Papa Mutes.
Welcome to Papa Mutes everybody.
Today, my guest is DavidSilverman.
David is a writer and author ofhow to Be a Rockstar
Screenwriter or at least Pay theBills Mindset Tools and
Strategies for a SuccessfulScreenwriting Career.
David has worked a variety ofHollywood jobs and I'm thrilled
to have him on.
David, welcome to Papa Mutes.
David Silverman (00:21):
Hey, I'm really happy to be here, thank you.
Papamutes (00:24):
Yeah, my pleasure.
So let's get right to it.
David Silverman (00:40):
I mean, what are some of the shows and films
you have worked on that peoplewould recognize that are
listening or watching?
Yeah, so a lot of TV, theJeffersons One Day at a Time,
alf, newhart, south Park,gilbert Duckman, a whole bunch
of other stuff, and created fiveTV shows.
Papamutes (00:55):
One of them was the Wild Thornberries.
David Silverman (00:57):
It's a kids' show, yeah animated show.
And some films.
Right, yeah, I worked on, itwas Steven Spielberg on the
Flintstones movie.
There were several movies basedon our Wild, thoroughbred
characters, so there areprobably three of those all
(01:19):
together, Sweet sweet.
Papamutes (01:20):
So how did you crack the bubble of Hollywood?
I mean, it's not an easy bubbleto crack.
David Silverman (01:24):
No, I think it's harder now than it was for
me, but yeah, I would still.
So, yeah, I taught a wholeclass at UCLA on breaking in and
yeah.
So the trick is you have tohave a good writing sample.
That's the first step.
So it's either if you want tobe a screenwriter, like a
(01:47):
feature writer, then you have towrite a movie script, and if
you want to be a TV writer whichI advise is a good idea,
there's more jobs there you needa sample script from a TV show
or a pilot.
They're preferring pilots now,but back when I broke in, my
partner and I wrote a taxi specand a Barney Miller spec, which
(02:09):
then, when I say spec, thatmeans we dreamed up our own
episode idea for it and wrote it, and it was on speculation, so
we weren't paid or anything forthose, but those were the
samples that got us jobs.
And then, once we got the jobs,we got William Morris came.
You know they called us rightup.
These guys are getting hired onstaff at one date at a time.
(02:34):
You know, we were like 20s inour 20s back then.
Yeah, the agents will find youif you have a good enough deal.
Papamutes (02:42):
But how did you?
I mean, you submitted thesescripts but you're unknown.
I mean, how did you get youknow there's a million people
that want to submit scripts?
How did you get people to seeit?
David Silverman (02:54):
Yeah, so there's a couple chapters on
that in the book how to be ascreenwriter.
And yeah, when you're juststarting out and you know we
didn't have an agent when westarted out or a manager or
anything, so there's a form youcan get for free on the Internet
.
It's a release form.
It releases anybody who readsyour script from.
(03:17):
You know you're not going tosue them, that's what it tells
them, so you can read this and Iwon't sue you if something
similar comes up.
And so, yeah, we used those.
Read this and I won't sue youif something similar comes up.
And so, yeah, we used those.
We sent our taxi and ourburning Miller specs to people
in the business and and aspeople started liking them a lot
(03:38):
and very lucky there, we wereinvited to pitch work in Mind
Mindy, the TV show with RobinWilliams, and then, once we got
that job, we sold the storythere it's kind of like there's
a word of mouth when we gotinvited to the Jeffersons and so
(04:00):
so far we have no agent oranything setting these things up
.
But when we did pitch theJeffersons, I brought those two
scripts with me the spec scriptsthat I talked about, and down
the hall all the Norman Learshows were in the same building.
The Day to Time was another showwith Valerie Bertinelli, and so
(04:23):
I took those two scripts, and,of course, the release forms,
down to this story editor'soffice For one day at a time his
name was Bud Weiser, which is astrange name Bud Weiser.
Papamutes (04:39):
Gotta love that.
David Silverman (04:39):
That was it, anyway.
I left the two scripts on hisdesk and we got a call saying to
come in.
We sold them a script and wewrote it and then they said we
like what you're doing and wewant to hire you on staff.
Papamutes (04:57):
So who calls the shot ?
As far as payment, you soldthem the script.
Are you saying this is what Iwant, or are they saying this is
the rate that we give peoplewho are unknown?
David Silverman (05:08):
yeah, that was lucky.
Uh, bud weiser and the twoshowrunners yeah, they're.
Apparently they were lookingfor somebody at that time, so a
lot of it was timing sure um,yeah, a couple of people had
left the show and they needed tofill that space.
Yeah, they decided that what wewere writing was good enough.
(05:30):
It was on the level of the show, even though we were newbies.
So they hired us for a wholeyear and that's how we got our
first real staff job intelevision.
Papamutes (05:43):
So I mean, just briefly prior to, you went to
Stanford right to studypsychotherapy and you end up at
USC to study film.
I mean that's a goodprerequisite for dealing with
Hollywood.
David Silverman (05:53):
Yeah that's true, yeah, so I started out.
You know, as a kid my familywent to therapy like every two
weeks because my brother had OCDand so I was in there, we were
all talking about, you know,psychology issues and I started
get used to it and I liked itand I thought, and then my
(06:16):
brother miraculously was cured.
You know, he doesn't have thatproblem anymore.
So I was very impressed, yeah.
So when I got to Stanford Ithought I would major in
psychology.
So I did psychology there.
They had the best you know, theteachers there were the number
one psychology department.
(06:37):
So anyway, I graduated thereand then also, towards the end
of my four years there, I took acourse with Scott Turow who
wrote Presumed Innocent creativewriting, and I liked it a lot
and I started writing some sortof funny short stories.
Anyway, then the summer afterStanford I made a short film and
(07:03):
my brother and sister were init.
It's like just kind of amateurhour.
But I sent the script to USCand I got into their film
department, which was again likethe number one department in
the country.
A lot of luck involved theretoo.
Papamutes (07:19):
Yeah Well, timing is everything right.
Networking and timing.
So you fast forward to today.
We'll get through other stuff,but your book how to be a rock
star screenwriter.
What separates that from, inyour opinion, from other you
know plethora of screenwritingbooks.
In fact, I have one right overthere I'm sure you've heard save
(07:39):
the cat.
David Silverman (07:40):
You know that's like oh yeah, that's number one
yeah, you loved reading that.
Papamutes (07:43):
I think I have the second one.
Save the Cat Strikes Back.
Anyway, what's your book?
David Silverman (07:50):
So those books are very good.
I recommend them In my book.
I recommend a few books besidesmine and they focus on how to
write the script and nothingmore really.
So my book's more about some ofthe psychology of it.
It's very hard, usually likethe typical writer breaks in on
(08:12):
their seventh or eighthscreenplay.
So they're going through aperiod where they're writing six
or seven scripts and nobody'sthat interested.
So it's a tough thing for awriter to keep going after like
getting zero feedback that helpsor validation.
So I talk about the zen ofscreenwriting, that part of it
(08:33):
where you have to.
You know you're not going tosell this script but you have to
consider all the otheradvantages of writing it.
It's going to be your samplescript.
It will get you an agent.
Possibly it will get you into aproducer who then can sell a
script to them.
So I try to work on thepsychology.
(08:53):
This is why you have to keepwriting, because it's easy to
give up.
A lot of people do.
After three or four scriptsNothing happens.
Papamutes (09:04):
Do you feel it's absolutely necessary to move to
hollywood or new york to becloser to the industry?
I mean even today yeah.
David Silverman (09:13):
So there's two different answers to that.
If you're writing screenplays,you don't have to live here.
If you want to write ontelevision show, you do have to
live here, because, because mostTV shows are written, like,
with a staff of writers andthere's a thing they call the
room.
You know where they have, like,typically, a staff is, you know
(09:38):
, 10 to 15 writers.
All the creative stuff happensin the room, so they break
stories in the room.
They stuff happens in the room,so they break stories in the
room, they rewrite scripts inthe room, like on a comedy show.
There's tons of rewrites, likewe would have a rehearsal on
Tuesday and I would stay up lateTuesday night to fix all the
(10:00):
stuff that didn't work, and it'srarer than when you have a
script that's just 100% andkicks ass.
So Tuesday nights we sometimesstay until 3, 4, or 5 in the
morning trying to fix everything, and that's where the room
comes in handy.
You have all these voices andmore people can pitch ideas and
jokes.
You can also send YouTube.
(10:22):
Guys go off and rewrite thatscene and come back, and you
know there's like a lot ofdifferent ways to use the room.
But if you're living in LA toanswer your question, that's
your best shot at getting a TVjob.
Papamutes (10:37):
I'm sure Right Now who I mean?
You know everyone wants to makemoney.
Just who I mean?
If you think about being rich,you probably won't make it
because you've got to focus onwriting etc.
But who makes the money?
A showrunner, director, actor,producer, writer who's cashing
in?
If you had to really narrowthat down, yeah, well, the
(11:01):
showrunner in television.
David Silverman (11:03):
anyway he's making the most money because he
created the show and like infact, we created five shows
together, my partners and I.
Papamutes (11:14):
But isn't that like a producer, or is that two
different things.
David Silverman (11:16):
Yeah, they call them executive producer, but
they're also showrunners andhead writers there's multiple
names for it.
But yeah, you make good money.
We had a couple of successesand then Fox hired us in a
development deal.
They paid us a million dollarsa year to create more shows.
(11:37):
So that's big money.
For writers, that's probably asgood as it gets.
I mean, a guy like Dick Wolfwho creates Law and Order.
He's probably getting $10million to develop.
He's established right, right,but yeah.
(11:57):
The other people who do makemoney, the actors tend to.
You can read about $20 millionsalaries for like Leonardo
DiCaprio or big stars.
Papamutes (12:07):
Far and few between, but still, I mean you can cash
in definitely.
Do you think entering ascreenplay contest is worth it?
David Silverman (12:16):
Yeah, that's a good question.
I think it could be.
There's three the Nichols, theAustin and the Page.
I mean there's the Austin andthe.
Papamutes (12:26):
Page.
I mean there's big ones andthen you know like Philadelphia
has one, you know Pittsburgh hasone.
There's all kind of screenplaycontests, but I mean the Nichols
, I mean there's a ton of peopletrying out.
David Silverman (12:35):
Yeah, no, it's true it's hard to win that one,
but if you do, you're probablygoing to get your movie made.
Those three have the most cloutwith producers and people who
buy and make movies.
Papamutes (12:51):
But do you feel I mean you consult on scripts and
stuff.
Would it be better if someonecame to you with all your
experience?
Or trying to throw a dart atthe board at a screenwriting
contest?
I mean it seems like a longshot.
David Silverman (13:04):
There's a chapter in my book where I talk
about how you get better as awriter.
That's why you know thescreenwriters don't sell their
first script.
They get better because afterwriting six of them you start to
learn the craft a little bitbetter.
But the other thing that willreally help you learn is to have
a professional read your script.
(13:26):
I do that.
Eric Bork does that.
He's really good at it.
He wrote Band of Brothers forHBO.
The TV show Won an Emmy for it.
He's really excellent.
Papamutes (13:44):
Now, have you ever not to be a dick?
But have you ever read a scriptthat someone sent you?
You don't know this person andit's like ugh, sorry, this is
not your way off.
It's your way off.
It's not even close.
I mean, you've got to tellthese people straight up, right?
I know?
David Silverman (14:00):
That's hard.
But you know I'm pretty goodwhen I do consult like that.
I'm pretty good at coming upwith ways to fix it and make it
better, so I help out that way.
But it's true, a lot of peopleyou know they should read Save
the Cat.
You know that's great, yeah.
Or Sid Field has a good booktoo, I think it's just called
(14:23):
Screenplay.
But yeah, you've got to learnall the fundamentals early on.
Papamutes (14:33):
I'm sure it can't hurt, but not a screenwriting.
Creative writing class isbeneficial.
I would think it would be.
David Silverman (14:41):
Yeah, when I was at USC I took a whole bunch
of writing classes and uh, thething about usc like as a
chapter in my book about shouldyou go to film school or should
you take that money and make amovie you know there's different
approaches.
I know, um, uh, yeah, there's alot of examples of writers who,
(15:02):
instead of going to film school, they made a film.
Guys like, uh well, spike leemade, uh, his first movie, do
the right thing.
And lena dunham made some moviecalled furniture.
Uh, she didn't go to filmschool, but she's very
successful.
She had the tv show girls and acouple other projects.
Papamutes (15:24):
So it's not absolutely necessary.
It can't hurt, but it's notlike it's.
You know you better do it oryou're never going to make it
Right?
David Silverman (15:31):
Yeah, you could like.
In my book I suggest a coupleof things you could do instead.
So I taught at UCLA Extensionand they have affordable
screenwriting courses on theirin their extension.
So you don't have to get in.
You don't have to have a GPAand high SAT scores or anything
(15:52):
to get into that program.
I recommend it Because the goodthing about UCLA and USC is
you're learning fromprofessionals.
Papamutes (16:01):
Sure.
David Silverman (16:01):
They hire guys who have a track record and have
written lots of scripts andsold them.
Papamutes (16:08):
Plus, you make friends and networking is huge.
David Silverman (16:11):
Yeah, that's where I met my writing partner.
We wrote that Taxi Spec and theBurning Lips Spec together.
We were pretty lucky because wegot interest.
It took us maybe a year to getthose together and we got
interest.
Like, it took us maybe a yearto get those together and we got
hired right away so I can um goahead sorry no, I mean,
(16:34):
sometimes it does happen.
You can like we didn't sellthose scripts to taxi or barney
miller but you got us into Maxior Barney Miller but they got us
into all these shows.
They liked the writing on them.
Papamutes (16:48):
Nice.
Have you ever seen the Poor andHungry the?
David Silverman (16:52):
Poor and Hungry .
Papamutes (16:54):
Yeah, it's the first film.
Have you heard of Hustle andFlow?
You've heard of that movieright.
David Silverman (17:00):
Yeah.
Papamutes (17:00):
Hustle and Flow.
Well, the director I thinkDwyer, I might be mispronouncing
it he made this poor and hungryfilm with a video camera.
I mean a regular home videocamera.
David Silverman (17:14):
Yeah.
Papamutes (17:14):
But it's really good.
It's black and white, it'sreally good.
But someone saw it and that ledto him getting the hustle and
flow and anyway, anybodylistening.
I recommend the poor and hungry.
It's, it's on youtube, it's,it's really I'll check it out
yeah, it's very uh guerrillafilmmaking, but good, you know,
the guy knew what he was doing.
He just only had a home moviecamera or home video, right?
(17:36):
Yeah, it's very good uh, highlyrecommend it um yeah, a lot of
people.
David Silverman (17:41):
When you do that, instead of going to film
school, they make a movie.
I know I think it was LenaDunham's parents say here, you
can have this money, you caneither make a movie or go to
film school.
And they gave her enough moneyto make that short film.
It was actually a feature.
I think it's called Furniture.
Papamutes (17:58):
I mean nowadays, you know, with the phones, you know
you can make a movie on yourphone, yeah, you, and literally
put it on Final Cut Pro and atleast get something you know the
interest of people.
Yeah, back in the day, I meanyour home movie cameras were.
David Silverman (18:12):
Sure, yeah, there's a film called Tangerine
that was made all on an iPhone,and you can find that on YouTube
as well.
Papamutes (18:20):
Yeah, a lot of really good movies get done Pretty
wild.
David Silverman (18:23):
Yeah, that's your entry point too, Once you
finish something like that.
Papamutes (18:32):
it's a sample of your work and people are impressed,
like you said, with Hustle Flow.
Yeah, love that movie.
But you could not be living inLA, right, make your film and
somehow show someone online andback in the day, I mean you'd
have to get that film to thehands of people to watch it.
David Silverman (18:50):
It's a whole different animal now but still
not an easy yeah.
Yeah, I have friends who, likeI have one friend who lives in
nashville and he writes, uh,movies.
Um, he usually writes lowbudget sort of actions, but
they're sort of comedic also,and Bob Sands is his name.
He's written a whole bunch ofmovies and he still lives in
(19:12):
Nashville.
He didn't have to come out here.
You might have to fly out herefor the meeting, you know, but
there's Zoom now so you mightnot need to actually be there.
You go exactly.
You did the animation too,right oh yeah.
Papamutes (19:24):
yeah, there's Zoom now, so you might not need to
actually be there.
There you go.
Exactly, you did feature films.
You did the animation too,right?
David Silverman (19:27):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, my partner and I wrote
for a whole bunch of animatedshows.
Winnie the Pooh was anEmmy-winning TV show that Disney
made and, yeah, my partner wonan Emmy for that Nice.
And then, yeah, based on that,we were asked to produce a
couple animated uh TV shows andwe also sold, uh, the Wild
(19:50):
Thornberries, which is animateduh, now, what's your feeling on,
like when I'm growing up, youknow?
Papamutes (19:56):
I mean I don't know how old you are, but you're, you
know, you're close to me.
I'm guessing I could be wrong.
But my point is back in the day, you know, bugs, bunny, the
Roadrunner, tom and Jerry, allthese, they're pretty violent.
Now I'm watching these cartoonswith my grandchildren and it's
pretty sedated.
Do you think, like when I waswatching these cartoons back in
(20:16):
the day I wasn't going out andbashing my friends in the head?
You know, from watchingcartoons it seems really, I
don't know, boring to me.
These cartoons.
David Silverman (20:24):
Yeah, I know what you mean.
Things are changing.
There's a lot of pc culturestuff kicking in and yeah, it's
kind of dilutes the uh, the funof some of these.
There's still some goodcartoons.
I mean south park is reallygood, yeah, that's still good.
But yeah, kids cartoons getaffected that way a lot.
(20:44):
Yeah, well, embrace was areally fun experience.
They, let us do kind of adulthumor if you really most of the
cartoons even for kids cartoonsthey have have adult level jokes
.
We all try to get things inthere.
Papamutes (21:04):
Sure, what do you find harder to write Comedy,
drama or movies?
David Silverman (21:11):
Movies to me are harder.
I spent 30 years in television.
I kind of know how to breakdown a TV show and how to do it
right.
Movies are a little trickier.
The act work structures aredifferent and they're longer.
You really need to.
But for people who are writingmovies, I would suggest low
(21:34):
budget.
Right now there's a tendency ofthe big movie studios they just
want to hire the A-list guysthat they know and so they keep
using those guys over and over,so guys with a track record.
So it's hard for a newbie tobreak in.
But low budget and specificallylow budget horror, that's an
(21:58):
easy show to sell.
Uh, tv, I mean a movie to sellcompared to everything else,
because you don't need a bigstar for a horror movies like
you can have, like the blairwitch project there's nobody.
Nobody knew those people'snames and it was a huge hit and
they're.
They're also inexpensivecompared to you know, one actor
can raise the budget by 20 grand.
Papamutes (22:20):
Sure sure.
In fact, that movie I wasmentioning the Poor and Hungry,
he spent $20,000.
David Silverman (22:27):
Wow, that's great.
Papamutes (22:29):
This is back in the 90s, but it obviously led to
more for him.
Yeah, it's good stuff.
David Silverman (22:35):
Yeah sure, robert Rodriguez like wrote his
film.
He said El Mariachi stuff.
Yeah sure, robert Rodriguezwrote his film.
He said El Mariachi for $7,000.
Papamutes (22:45):
He had a lot of friends working for free.
Oh, that's what you got to do,right it's hard to do that now
Harder.
David Silverman (22:52):
He probably did that in the 80s.
Papamutes (22:55):
So when you're on a TV show, you're writing, you're
acting, whatever.
80s.
You're on a TV show, you'rewriting, you're acting Whatever.
The magic number correct me ifI'm wrong is 100 episodes to get
to syndication.
That's more money.
How does that work?
In general, as far as payment,I'm not talking numbers, I'm
(23:15):
saying let me ask you this.
When you're you know whenyou're on let me ask you this
when you're on a TV show andyou're writing, whether you're
head writer or not, how do youget paid?
Is it a weekly thing, everyother week, every month, every
episode?
Or does it depend on the person?
David Silverman (23:30):
Right.
So, yeah, I really recommendtelevision for people who want
to, because it's the easiest wayto make the most money.
So when you're on staff, you'regoing to write, you're going to
get a weekly salary, right.
So you're going to get usuallyin the $100,000 range for a year
For a rookie.
(23:50):
Well, not always for a rookie,but yeah, most of the jobs I had
we were making that much money.
I'm not sure why, but early onthat's pretty good money.
And then you get paid for theepisode you write.
It's a whole different thingand the Writers Guild has a
payment breakdown for that.
(24:10):
And then every time it rerunsthat's why that magic number of
100 is a huge goal forsyndicated TV shows you get so,
let's say you get 30,000 thefirst time you write for the
script.
That's sort of a typical sitcombreakdown and the next time it
(24:31):
reruns you get half of that.
You get $15,000 and it keepsgoing like that.
Mathematically.
Next time it's like 7.5thousand, keeps going in half
until you know.
Papamutes (24:43):
I get checks now for like two cents even the show
runner I mean all those peopleare still.
David Silverman (24:51):
They get chopped down too well, yeah,
after you'd three run like tentimes.
You know it gets kind of low,but the first time, the first
rerun, is half of what you gotfor writing the script.
That's usually in theneighborhood of $15,000, which
is nice.
You didn't do anything, youjust got to rerun and then the
next one will be $7,000.
(25:11):
I know it adds up if you'rewriting like 30 episodes like my
partner and I did.
That money adds up.
Sure, I got a writer's skillpension also.
Papamutes (25:24):
There you go.
I was going to say, I mean, Idon't need numbers, but you're
benefiting from syndicationyourself, oh yeah.
David Silverman (25:33):
Yeah, the one that did the best, ironically,
was the Wild Thornberrys, whichis animated, and there were
eight seasons of that and threeor four movies based on the
characters.
So I keep getting checks forthose Every once in a while.
I'll get a check for $3,000 orsomething.
That's nice and the pension isgreat, the Writer's Guild
(25:54):
pension.
I think I'm getting like$35,000 a year.
Papamutes (26:00):
Nice.
Now who keeps?
I mean, who keeps track of that, so you know you're not getting
screwed?
I mean you know you're notsitting around watching every
show that's syndicated.
Right, right I mean I'm surethere's a trust level somewhere.
David Silverman (26:14):
Yeah, so that's another interesting point.
I'm glad you brought that up.
There's non-Writers Guild showsand there's Writers Guild shows
, so the WGA protects thewriters, makes sure they have
these things called minimums sothey keep you from getting
screwed over and they keep trackof all your sales.
(26:36):
Good, screwed over and theykeep track of all your sales.
That's why I'm getting $35,000a year from them now, because
they know everything.
You have to pay your dues tothe Writers Guild.
It's not very much.
Every time you get paid theytake a little something out of
(26:56):
it.
I think they keep track Did thewriter's strike affect you.
Oh yeah, the writer's strikes.
There were several, I mean theones back in the 90s.
That's a period when there wasno work for maybe nine months.
That was really rough.
That's when my partner and Idecided to write cartoons,
(27:20):
because that's a totallydifferent guild, so animation
guild, the writers guild, wga isfor, yeah, live action usually,
so animation.
They don't pay quite as muchfor half an episode, but so we
(27:42):
started writing those and that's.
It ended up with us beingcontracted to create those
animated shows.
Papamutes (27:52):
Is it harder to write ?
I think I asked this question.
But comedy or drama, is thatharder?
I mean comedy, I think would beharder, but I don't know.
David Silverman (28:01):
Yeah, comedy is harder.
That's why they have a big roomfull of writers to come up with
better jokes.
You know there's a lot of jokesthat don't work when you do the
run-throughs on Tuesday and theactors put it on its feet and
then you see what's not working.
(28:21):
So you have to go into thewriter's room with all the other
guys and try to figure out howto fix everything.
It's tough.
It's hard the drama.
You know you don't usually haveto worry about the dialogue
that much because you knowthere's not a lot of jokes and
dramatic writing, but sometimesthe story needs rewrites.
(28:43):
I'm sure they have their ownroom full of writers and they
fix problems in the room.
Papamutes (28:50):
Is it true for a comedy sitcom to you have to
have a laugh every I don't know30 seconds or something.
I mean, it sounds ridiculous,but is that true?
David Silverman (29:01):
Yeah, a lot of the shows I wrote for had laugh
tracks I hate that fucking laughtrack.
Papamutes (29:06):
I know right, it's awful, I mean.
David Silverman (29:11):
I guess they've done tests and people like the
show better if there's somesprinkling of laughs, I mean if
you watch some comedies, youknow I watch the show better if
there's some sprinkling oflaughs.
Papamutes (29:18):
If you watch some comedies, I watch the show and
I'm like that's not funny, butthey're just throwing a laugh in
.
David Silverman (29:24):
I know and I'm like that's not funny.
They call it sweetening, that'sthe term they use.
It's funny, but yeah, there's aguy with a box and they have
all kinds of different laughs,laughs, and then they choose
what they think would work thebest.
Yeah, I didn't usually takepart in that, but yeah, there's
(29:46):
people who do it.
Like I say, the studies haveshown people enjoy them.
The show's better.
I know it pisses you off and Idon't particularly like it
either.
Papamutes (29:58):
Yeah, I mean, sometimes I like and it's funny
and there's a laugh track, andsome I'm like, oh my God, the
laugh track is killing me.
David Silverman (30:06):
I know what you mean.
Papamutes (30:09):
When you were writing on these shows?
Yes, and the show's being taped.
Were you there?
David Silverman (30:14):
Yeah, usually yeah.
Papamutes (30:17):
That had to be cool.
David Silverman (30:22):
I mean that's a cool show.
Were you there?
Yeah, usually, yeah, that hadto be cool.
I mean, yeah, yeah, liveaudience and it was fun to watch
.
You know, sometimes with infront of the audience, jokes
don't work.
Usually this is when the staffis.
They want the staff there onfilming nights.
It's a fixed problem.
So there's a lot of cases wherewe come up with another joke to
fix things.
You can't get them all,unfortunately but yeah, you know
(30:42):
what?
that's right, it's not live likesaturday night live no, it
doesn't go right out, so you canedit it later I read actually
just read a good book calledlorn, about uh, I think susan
miller's her name, but LordMichaels.
Papamutes (30:57):
I mean really detailed.
I mean that guy put up a lot ofshit but he got to where he
wanted to get.
Yeah, so in your book, I meanthe second part of your book is
at least pay the bills.
Oh yeah, at what point?
What level?
You know, everybody wants to befamous screenwriter, but at
what level do you need to be toat least pay the bills?
David Silverman (31:19):
right, right.
So tv works for that.
Like you, you get a lot ofmoney in television.
Like you say, all my jobs wereat least a hundred thousand
dollars, so that was.
I recommend that to people andthe other benefits of tv.
You get to write something andthen see it on its feet filmed
(31:39):
maybe two weeks later.
But movies it takes yearssometimes to get the funding and
get the right stars in thereand so it takes forever and
sometimes the paydays are better, but not that much better.
I remember getting paid $50,000for a movie that I sold on a
pitch with my wife.
(31:59):
That's not a lot of moneycompared to TV money.
Papamutes (32:05):
When you were on these TV, were you the head
writer?
I'm sure there's differentlevels of cash flow.
Head writer Joe Schmo For the100G.
Were you the head writer?
David Silverman (32:17):
Which show.
Papamutes (32:19):
When you were making $100,000 a year.
David Silverman (32:21):
Oh yeah, Was that your?
Papamutes (32:21):
head writing position .
David Silverman (32:23):
Yeah, that was just a regular writer.
I think my partner and I had tosplit that.
But yeah, if you're a writeryou can expect those kinds of
salaries.
Yeah, we were story editors onOne Day at a Time.
That was our very first staffshow, yeah.
And then you work your way up.
They start changing the titlesthere's like associate producer,
(32:50):
producer, supervising producer,executive producer, and those
titles carry more weekly moneywith them.
The higher, you get Nice.
Yeah, it adds up.
There's a lot of money intelevision.
Papamutes (33:06):
Now I mean also I mean that's good cash flow, but
LA is not cheap either to livefrom what I've heard, that's a
good point.
David Silverman (33:15):
It's true, yeah .
I mean you've got to pay, uncle.
Papamutes (33:20):
Sam.
David Silverman (33:24):
Right, yeah, taxes you.
From what I've heard, that's agood point it's true.
Papamutes (33:25):
Yeah, I mean you got to pay, uncle sam.
You know you got right.
David Silverman (33:26):
Yeah, texas, you got it you got other things
going on like life.
Yeah, sure, but it's still agood check.
I mean, you know, yeah, that'strue.
True, yeah, it's uh.
Yeah, I don't know how somepeople do it, I know people do
now.
Papamutes (33:33):
I mean when, when you were starting out and you got
this writing job, did youcontinue?
Because when a show stops thisis a second actor, for instance,
he's acting in a show it stopsit's like ugh, there's no
guarantee he's going to move onto the next show, so he's got to
make the dough before they go.
You know what I mean.
Did you ever have that gapwhere you're like oh, fuck man,
(33:54):
what am I going to do now?
David Silverman (33:59):
Yeah, like, oh, fuck man, what am I gonna do
now?
Yeah, it happened all the timein our career.
Uh, because the shows like theshows we created, for example,
um, there's one called the superservice guy which judge, judge
reinhold and ellen claghorn.
With ellen claghorn and thosetwo, they went one season, 18
and out, and they didn't getpicked up.
So after that we had to go findand we were creators on that
(34:24):
show and showrunners.
Papamutes (34:28):
So I mean, if you're pocketing the cash, you know,
and you have a little bank full,fine.
But if you're just starting outand you're on a show, it's like
, yeah, ba-da-ba-doo, let's go,let's go party, let's you know,
uh, cocaine hookers the wholenine yards, right, or whatever,
whatever you're into.
And then the show stops.
It's like, oh shit, gotta makethat car payment I know yeah, I
mean, that's part of the gig.
I'm not you know.
I'm sure something's in yourbook to, at least you know, uh,
(34:51):
bring the reality to it.
It's not easy to get into andand there's pitfalls I know.
David Silverman (34:57):
That's why I recommend this sort of a long
view, because it's easy to getuh upset when like that happens,
for example, and then quit, andit happens to writers a lot and
they, they don't, maybe theydon't uh the show they're on
ends and they don't get uh, theydon't get picked up on a
(35:17):
different show for a year, twoyears and three years and then
they start to, you know, go backto their old jobs, you know
what is a good job to have whileyou're trying to live in la and
still, still.
Papamutes (35:32):
You know you're not working constantly, but you know
you're trying to getestablished.
What's a good day job that youknow?
David Silverman (35:37):
yeah, the day jobs I recommend are, uh, you
know, for somebody who's movedout here and he's looking to get
hired on a tv show, for example, there's a couple of jobs that
like, for example, on the showsthat we uh created, we hired
(35:59):
writer's assistants, whichthey're the guy in the room
who's you know, they're notwriters, but usually they want
to be writers and they have specscripts and they're working
closely with us.
The showrunners and writers arepitching ideas and they write
everything down and they're theones that take notes basically
(36:22):
on everything that happens inthe room and that's a tough job
but I highly recommend itbecause on the two shows we
created we gave those guysepisodes.
So you know, one of these guyswent on to write for De.
So you know, one of these guyswent on to write for Dexter, you
know, but his first paying job,screenwriting job, came as a
(36:48):
perk for being a writer'sassistant.
So that gets you started, thatgets you an agent.
Papamutes (36:55):
So as an assistant you're getting paid.
This is not like an internshiptype thing.
David Silverman (36:59):
Oh yeah, that's a paid job.
I recommend it for somebody whowants to break into television.
That's a great job.
Writer's assistant.
The other guy that was in ourroom working, eric Shaw, went on
to write for Spongebob and hewon an Emmy for another show.
So we give these guys theirfirst paid screenwriting gig,
(37:24):
which is the key to breaking in.
Once you get paid to writesomething in Hollywood, people
are interested.
Agent Swann, like they may.
You know the agents have todecide between, like, taking on
a newbie writer who's never soldanything and uh, you know that
takes a lot of their time.
(37:44):
They're working with that, thatguy and trying to improve his
writing and come up with ideaswhat shows should you target,
and that sort of thing.
Papamutes (37:54):
But I mean that's a great gig if you can get it
right.
I mean let's just say you can'tget that.
Oh yeah, I mean are we talkingbeing a waiter and all that
bullshit?
I mean you know?
I mean that's the perfect gig.
You're in the pizza shop.
They make the pizza.
You might as well roll thedough for the guy.
I mean you know what I mean?
Uh, outside of that job, isthere anything?
David Silverman (38:14):
yeah, there's a couple other jobs.
When I, when I was like afterusc like one of the classes they
teach you how to write, theycall it coverage for script.
That's when you read ascreenplay and kind of grade it
for you know the dialogue andthe story and all the other
things that go into characterarcs and things.
(38:35):
So I learned how to do that atUSC and then I applied to
different studios.
I got hired at AmericanInternational Pictures and every
day I went in to pick up a newscript and I was a bartender at
the same time.
So I'd pick up a script or anovel Sometimes they gave me
(38:56):
novels to read and then I wouldwrite coverage for it, which
involves writing a summarythat's really short but you want
it to capture all the as muchas possible the flavor of the
work, which is not easy.
I would usually go home 10 barI'd be reading the scripts
behind the bar while I waswaiting for customers to order,
(39:18):
and then I'd go home at like twoin the morning and write the
coverage.
And then I go home at like twoin the morning and write these,
the cover, and then you've gotto grade the, like I said, the
dialogue and the story andcharacters on a scale of 10.
So every day I had to do that,and then every day the next
morning I drove down to AmericanInternational Pictures and
dropped it off and got anotherscript to read.
(39:39):
So I was pretty busy at thatpoint.
Papamutes (39:42):
Sure yeah, you gotta.
You gotta hump, you gottahustle, you gotta write.
Dropped it off and got anotherscript to read, so I was pretty
busy at that point?
David Silverman (39:46):
Sure, yeah, you gotta.
You gotta hump, you gottahustle, you gotta write, write,
write, write.
But that's a really good jobfor somebody.
You really learn a lot abouthow to write when you're
evaluating other people'sscreenplays.
Papamutes (39:55):
So let's just say someone's listening and they're
like, oh yeah, where do wherewould you go to try to get that
job?
Or is it a matter of knowingsomebody?
Where would you actuallyphysically go?
I'm in la, you know where do Igo to see if that is available
yeah.
David Silverman (40:09):
So, uh, you do what I did, uh, you learn how to
write the coverage and youwrite a sample.
So I was kind of I think I wastrying to be clever and I got
William Goldman came out with abook called Magic and I thought,
well, everything he writesturns into a brilliant movie,
(40:31):
like Butch Cassidy and all thesethings.
So I recommended it highly inmy coverage and I praised all
the writing and everythingbecause it was William Goldman,
this guy that wrote all thesegreat scripts.
Anyway, they did make a movieout of that later.
So that was the sample I sentaround to all the studios and
they read it and said, oh, thisguy likes you know, he knows the
(40:54):
format, it's easy to read hiswriting all that stuff.
So that's how I got that jobnice, and you send it.
You can can get the addressesand emails for all the studios.
There's a studio department inevery studio.
So that's how you do it.
Papamutes (41:10):
And then there's the dreaded rejection.
I mean, you're not going tojust send it and like oh yeah,
we'll take it.
There's the dreaded rejection,and you're going to pound the
payment again and again.
David Silverman (41:19):
There's a lot of that.
Yeah for sure.
It's very true.
That's another thing I talkabout in the psychology of how
to handle all those rejections.
So one thing that does help, Ithink, is just knowing that it
happens to the best writers too.
You know guys like Stephen King.
(41:46):
They collected rejectionscripts, like hundreds of them,
and yeah and yeah, somehow allit takes is one person that's
one of the things I say in thebook is all it takes is one?
Papamutes (41:50):
yes, that's right.
You got to crack that bubble.
I mean you got to take a chanceand see what happens anything
in life, but especially withthat.
I mean jesus yeah.
David Silverman (42:00):
No, it's hard on people emotionally to want to
stick with it and do their bestwork, because they know.
Let's say, you've written sixscripts and they all got
rejected and you know you'rethinking all right, I'm gonna
write another script, numberseven.
Papamutes (42:14):
They're probably thinking it's not gonna sell, uh
, so you know, when you werewriting as a young man, right,
right, did you love writing?
I think you've got to love itright.
You can't just say I want to bea writer, just to you know,
tell your girlfriend, I mean,you've got to love it right.
David Silverman (42:28):
Yeah, that's true.
It does help because the guyswho get hired you know I had
some friends, amazing friends.
Yeah, they loved writing somuch.
Papamutes (42:42):
I don't love it as much as a lot of other people.
They've got to have a passionfor it.
David Silverman (42:46):
Yeah, you do, you have to really love it.
When I was in college as a kidI loved the Marx Brothers.
I loved all these comedy moviesthat came out.
I could quote the dialogue andthat sort of thing.
I even wrote my honors thesison a comedy writer and that's
(43:12):
damn nice and yeah.
So I just I knew so yeah, Ikind of, uh, I worshipped the.
You know the guys who wrotethose scripts.
Papamutes (43:16):
So some of those comedies yeah, those comedies
back in the day, or as you know,I mean you're probably watching
the same ones I was, and thennow they're.
Even those are sedated a littlebit, now a lot, actually.
The comedies are not as yeah,what's the word you know?
David Silverman (43:32):
edgy, edgy, right, yeah, you know you got to
worry about this person andthat person.
Papamutes (43:35):
I mean, you know, just uh, the mike myers films
are just like over the tophilarious, but yeah, someone's
going to get offended.
It's like come on.
David Silverman (43:43):
I know right, yeah, Blazing Saddles is the
classic.
Papamutes (43:46):
Blazing Saddles.
David Silverman (43:48):
Yeah, you probably could not get that
movie made right now, which is ashame.
Papamutes (43:52):
But you know, I mean, you probably noticed it.
I think Richard Pryor actuallywas behind that, he wasn't just
in it.
David Silverman (43:58):
Yeah, true, he helped he was, he wasn't just in
it.
Yeah, true, he helped, he wasin the writer's room.
Yeah, in the writer's room.
Sorry, yeah, yeah, brooks wrotemovies like tv shows.
Papamutes (44:11):
He had three or four guys on that, I can't remember
the other guys.
David Silverman (44:12):
But yeah, prior was in it and uh, yeah, I don't
think they had in my mind, forI think he's a black sheriff and
that is remembering thatcorrectly, that's a classic
movie.
Yeah, so funny.
But yeah, he was in thewriters' room.
I think they tried to castother guys.
But yeah, eventually he endedup in that role and yeah he was
great in that.
Papamutes (44:34):
Did you ever meet a gentleman named Herb Solo?
David Silverman (44:37):
Herb Solo, I don't think so.
Papamutes (44:39):
Head of Paramount Pictures at one time.
David Silverman (44:41):
Oh, okay.
Papamutes (44:43):
I'm going to bring that up because I had another
gentleman on here, a directorguy, who he came out of college
and bugged him long story shortuntil the guy actually said,
okay, come and you'll be a PA.
He was persistent with hisconstant trying to get into the
bubble when I gave him a break.
David Silverman (45:05):
For all the studios Disney, paramount, mgm,
sony, the Norman Lear shows andall the Mary Tyler Moore.
Papamutes (45:14):
This would be back in the early 70s, judging from the
Mark Travis who came on and wastalking about his beginnings,
so to speak.
I have a little segment Icreated.
I want to see if you can goalong with this called Name
Association.
I'm going to give you a name.
David Silverman (45:30):
Okay.
Papamutes (45:31):
Now, I'm assuming I'm not assuming you know all these
people, but if you have a quoteor a feeling or a story, great,
it might just be one word, onesentence.
But, um, let's give it a shot.
It's the first time I'm doingthis.
David Silverman (45:45):
Here we go name association right let's see uh,
robin williams ah, brilliant,yeah, genius love that.
Yeah, I've seen him.
Uh, I think I saw him at.
Uh, I think I saw him at like,there was a payphone in Studio
City and we were having hot dogsat the Papoose Hot Dog Show and
(46:10):
, yeah, he put on a show,talking to this non-existent
person on the other end of theline, like for 40 minutes.
It was hilarious.
Papamutes (46:17):
So you're saying he was just outside?
David Silverman (46:18):
Yeah, that was not even on the show.
He was just like like doingfunny stuff.
Papamutes (46:26):
Was he Robin Williams ?
The famous Robin Williams atthat time?
David Silverman (46:29):
Well he was Mork and Mindy famous.
Papamutes (46:31):
That's famous.
I mean that was pretty big, itwas the number one show at the
time.
So you recognized him?
Oh yeah yeah, yeah.
David Silverman (46:39):
so yeah, that guy, yeah, yeah, probably nobody
like richard prior, maybe it'sclose now you've worked on
morgan mindy, or no?
Sold the story to them.
Yeah, so we went in a pitch.
Papamutes (46:51):
So like one episode.
Yeah, for one episode.
David Silverman (46:54):
Yeah, I remember it's about white lies
okay, cool, great.
Papamutes (46:59):
Did you ever meet robin williams though?
David Silverman (47:02):
yeah, yeah, not , not in the, not at the studio,
but outside the studio in thephone booth yeah, watching him
put on the show for everybodyamazing, like unbelievable.
No scripts, you know nothing,just oh, he was, he was improv
yeah, king of the yeah, allright.
Papamutes (47:18):
How about um john good?
David Silverman (47:20):
John Goodman.
Yeah, I worked with him also onthe Flintstones.
Papamutes (47:26):
Seems like a good guy .
David Silverman (47:27):
Yeah, he was great.
Yeah.
Yeah, flintstones was a funshow to work on at that time, so
we were some of the writers onthe script, kind of like Mel
Brooks.
They had a room full of writersfor Flintstones and so the
director asked us to show up onthe set.
So we got to meet and we gotElizabeth Taylor who played
(47:51):
Fred's mother-in-law.
On that we got to meet allthese actors and Rick Moranis
played Barney.
So, rick, we were assigned tohim.
My partner and I said he has afew questions and problems about
writers to improve on.
So we went around figuring outwhat and we wrote up
(48:13):
alternatives.
Papamutes (48:14):
What about Steven Spielberg?
David Silverman (48:16):
Oh yeah, Spielberg was fun.
We pitched the story for theFlintstones directly to him and
he was really nice.
I got him to autograph a copyof Back to the Future.
He wrote Back to the Past withthe Flintstones on there, Cool.
Papamutes (48:36):
And yeah.
David Silverman (48:37):
So yeah, very nice guy.
He's not over the top oranything, just sort of.
You know, real sweet how aboutbob newhart yeah, newhart was
also a regular guy, buthilarious yeah old school right
right.
Yeah, my partner and I had someinput on the final episode of
(48:57):
newhart where he wakes up nextto emily.
I don't know if you rememberthat.
It's kind of a famous episode.
They were looking for a B storyfor that.
My partner and I had this ideaof what if somebody wants to
come in and turn that town thatNewhart lives in, turn it into
(49:19):
what's that?
Papamutes (49:21):
Bedrock.
David Silverman (49:22):
Yeah, not, not Bedrock, but something similar
like Solvang.
Yeah, so our pitch was theywant to buy the town and turn it
into Solvang, so they used that.
They changed it a little bit,but they used that part.
So we, you know, marginallyinvolved in that.
But, yeah, another comic book,how about Richard Dreyfuss?
Papamutes (49:41):
Richard Dreyfuss marginally involved in that, but
yeah, another comics man, yeah,how about Richard Dreyfuss?
David Silverman (49:45):
Richard Dreyfuss yeah, I don't think we
ever met him, okay, but yeah, Imean I admire his work.
He's a terrific actor, Good guy.
Papamutes (49:54):
Pee Wee Herman.
David Silverman (49:55):
Oh yeah, Pee Wee we worked with.
That was really fun.
He had a pilot idea that hewanted to write and after we had
some, you know, we created fiveshows.
So we had kind of a reputationfor being guys that could make
that work.
(50:16):
And they set us up at theHollywood Roosevelt Hotel and we
got the top floor the MayorBradley Suite, I think it was
called and we ordered roomservice and we were there all
day writing with him and he washilarious.
Another hilarious guy.
Papamutes (50:33):
Supposedly, from what I've read, he had a ton of
different characters, but PeeWee Herman was the one that a
studio or somebody wanted to gowith, so he got stuck with that,
so to speak yeah, I know it's.
David Silverman (50:45):
There's a really good documentary on maybe
that's what I actually that's.
Papamutes (50:54):
You know what?
That's probably where I gotthat information from.
Yeah, yeah yeah, he was a trip.
How about Norman Lear?
David Silverman (51:00):
yeah, you know, uh, we worked on at least two,
maybe three of his shows.
We never saw him, which wasinteresting, wow.
But you know, he had somethinglike six or seven shows going at
the same time and that guy soyeah, he didn't actually come in
and break stories with us.
Papamutes (51:21):
How about Roseanne?
David Silverman (51:22):
Oh, roseanne, that's uh, that's another
interesting story.
I, my partner and I, worked onthe Tom Arnold show and she was
the exec producer on that andshe also acted in it.
She played a stalker, I think.
Uh, somebody was coming afterTom's character.
That's kind of a funny idea.
But yeah, she's kind of a funnyidea.
(51:44):
But yeah, she's kind of quirky.
My partner and I was astar-sick in silver, most people
call this.
My partner had really longblack hair and she called us the
hippie and the Jew.
I don't think she knew ournames.
Papamutes (52:00):
How about Drew Carey?
David Silverman (52:02):
Yeah, Drew Carey was a lot of fun to work
with.
We worked with him on a showcalled the Good Life.
This was before the Drew.
Carey show and before the Priceis Right.
Yeah, interesting guy, he was aMarine before he went into
acting.
I know we went to his apartmentonce just to hang out.
I think Norm MacDonald came tothat.
A lot of black people went intoacting.
(52:23):
I know we went to his apartmentonce just to hang out.
I think norm mcdonald came tothat uh, a lot of people, and
they were smoking pot again.
This is before he was like abig, big shot all right, um no
relation.
I'm assuming sarah silvermanyeah, sarah Silverman Not
related to me directly, but sheplayed a stalker on another show
(52:47):
.
It's called Manhattan AC, whichis a very funny show.
It has a former actor whodecides he wants to be a sheriff
in real life, so he kind ofbuys this town and it was Chad
Everett that played him.
Chad Everett, wow, yeah, andthere was an episode where Sarah
(53:13):
Silverman played the stalker.
Now, did you?
Papamutes (53:17):
ever meet?
Sorry to interrupt, I don'tneed a name, but I'm sure
everybody's not nice.
Did you ever meet?
Sorry to interrupt.
No, go ahead.
I don't need a name, but I'msure everybody's not nice.
Did you ever meet someone whowas famous and you were like
fuck this guy or this girl, whatan asshole.
David Silverman (53:32):
Yeah, some actors are.
You know, there was one guylike when he worked in ALF, the
guy who played the father onthat show Willie Tanner is his
name on the show and he was kindof bipolar One day he'd be okay
and then some days he'd be verydifficult to work with.
(53:53):
So one day in particular he wassupposed to say something to
Alf.
That was kind of derogatory andI don't remember the joke or
the line.
But he said I would not saythat to Alf.
He knows the relationshipbetter than anybody because he's
the actor.
He said I would not.
(54:15):
I refuse to say that line.
I forget what it was, but helocked himself in his dressing
room the whole day and he hadthe camera guys who were there
getting paid uh, it's not cheap,you know, thousands and
thousands of dollars.
I mean he couldn't show theshoot, the episode.
He locked himself in there andthe next day I guess this is
where the manic and the you know, the mood swings come in he
(54:39):
brought, brought a box of DomPerignon and gave one to
everybody and apologized no,that's good, that's nice.
But he must have cost, thebudget must have gone way up for
that one.
Papamutes (54:50):
Yeah, I'm sure, I'm sure.
So look, before I wrap this up,you mentioned Elf.
Who was controlling Elf?
Who played Elf?
How'd that work?
David Silverman (55:02):
Oh, yeah, yeah, so yeah, that's what's his name
again, anyway, he's the onethat created the show with.
Papamutes (55:12):
But I mean it was like a it's a puppet, a puppet
kind of I mean.
David Silverman (55:17):
There was a version.
Was there a?
Papamutes (55:18):
hand in there.
What was going on?
Yeah, a hand mostly.
David Silverman (55:20):
They did have an elf suit and you move fit
into the suit.
They didn't.
He's a very tiny guy and theydidn't use that very often, but
yeah, mostly, and they had aspecial stage design so it came
about chest high.
That was the floor of the livingroom in the tanner household
(55:44):
and so this guy could stand upand, like you know his, his head
was basically floor level theycould hold the puppet up like
that and there were remotecontrols on his eyes and stuff
in his ears that made them movearound, and there's a whole
group of people you know withthe remote eyes and stuff and
his ears that made them movearound, and there's a whole
group of people you know withthe remote controls and stuff
(56:06):
and doing that during this.
So it was really involved.
But yeah, he was hilarious.
Paul Fusco is the guy whocreated the off show and he was
really funny so, and Tom Patrickcreated the show with him.
Papamutes (56:24):
It was a really fun show to work on.
Yeah, classic.
Um.
So what's going on currentlyfor you?
Um, that I mean, besides thebook which I recommend, uh, how
to be a rock star screenwriter,at least pay the bills.
I mean, I read portions of itthat's online, you know, before
it cuts off and uh, I'm like, oh, I gotta keep reading this, but
anyway, you know what's goingon, um, besides wanting to get
(56:46):
the book out there, anythingelse.
David Silverman (56:48):
oh, right, right, well, I should announce
this actually, sure, so the bookis, the kindle version is going
to be free, uh, from july 4ththrough july 8th, and so it's
kind of a experiment to see howthat works and see if a lot of
people pick it up for free.
But if you're at all interested, if you know a screenwriter, if
(57:11):
you have a son or a nephew orsome some poor guy who has
decided he wants to be ascreenwriter, you know you need
all the advantages, uh, you needall the good advice you can get
, and that's sort of what is inthe book.
That's why I created the bookfor people and all the things
(57:32):
we've talked about during theshow, the rejections and how to
keep your head in the gameregardless of all the tough
stuff you have to endure.
Papamutes (57:43):
I mean it's a huge talking points.
I mean these are great advice.
Advice, if you uh, you want toget into that scene.
It's not easy, but you know,you know you love it.
David Silverman (57:52):
You got to do it, I mean, and this book sounds
like it's right in the pathwayum, yeah, it's great for anybody
who wants to become ascreenwriter or a television
writer, so I talk about both.
There's also a chapter on olderwriters.
Sometimes I know a lot ofpeople in their 40s and 50s.
There's some advice on how tobreak in.
(58:12):
It's easier to break in writinglow-budget movies than it is
otherwise, because the TV staffsare populated by
twenty-somethings andthirty-somethings I'm sure, and
when people hire more writersfor that, they generally looking
for people who kind of fit in.
Unfortunately, there's a ageismissue in Hollywood.
(58:36):
So there's a lot of good advicedepending on what your ideas
are, how old you, if you want towork from Nebraska or come out
here, if you're thinking aboutfilm school, you're not sure
there's advice on that.
Papamutes (58:51):
Nice, excellent.
Well, dave, I really appreciateyou coming on.
This has been a great, greattalk.
David Silverman (58:56):
Oh great.
Thank you very much for havingme.
I appreciate it.
It was a lot of fun.
Papamutes (59:00):
This has been an Unmuted podcast with Papa Mutes.
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