When a “Noisy Ghost” Becomes a Siege: Inside the Enfield Haunting, Skepticism, and 14 Months of Evidence

A modest council house on Green Street shouldn’t turn into a stage for flying toys, hot marbles, and a chair that slides on command—but that’s where our night begins. We pull apart the Enfield Haunting with a clear lens: not just what was claimed, but who saw what, when, and how the story held together across months of pressure, fatigue, and scrutiny. From neighbors who fled next door, to a police constable who watched a chair move, to a photographer who took a Lego to the eyebrow, the details pile up—and so do the questions.

We walk through the turning points: the Society for Psychical Research arriving with Maurice Grosse and later Guy Playfair; strange interference that kills video yet allows photos; knocks that track movement; marbles that land hot and refuse to bounce; a child at the center of the storm. Then the voice arrives—deep, gravelly, and eerily specific—identifying itself as “Bill,” later matching a former occupant’s death. Doctors argue false vocal folds; tests with taped lips and water complicate the easy answers. Some moments can be staged; the girls admit the pressure to perform. But other moments—curtains twisting like hands, stones manifesting in the garden, the medium’s cleanse coinciding with a slow fade—refuse to be filed away as tricks.

Rather than force a verdict, we explore three frames: a human spirit with unusual ability, a layered haunting where something non-human rides the chaos, and a psychosocial amplifier centered around a bright, stressed child on the edge of puberty. The label “poltergeist” starts to feel less like a species and more like a weather pattern: conditions where a house becomes conductive, technology misbehaves, and people of all stripes witness things they can’t quickly explain.

If you enjoy careful, grounded storytelling about the paranormal—sourced, skeptical, and still open to wonder—this one’s for you. Hit follow, share with a friend, and tell us: which single detail would make you a believer?

Thank you for listening to the Paranormal Peeps Podcast.  Check us out on Facebook Paranormal Peeps Podcast or Coldspot Paranormal Research and on Instagram coldspot_paranormal_research

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Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_04 (00:00):
Between the realm of the dead and the journeys of the
living, join Josh, Jamie, andElisa as they delve into the
vast world of the paranormal andbreathe life back into the
history of the departed.

SPEAKER_05 (00:11):
Hey everybody, welcome back to the Paranormal
Peeps Podcast.
I'm Josh.

SPEAKER_00 (00:15):
I'm Jamie.
And I'm Elisa.

SPEAKER_05 (00:18):
And what are we gonna be covering tonight,
Elisa?

SPEAKER_00 (00:22):
We are going to be talking about the infilled
hauntingslash um poltergeist.
In my opinion, I mean everybodyhas different opinions about
ghost hunting and things, but inmy opinion, I don't really
believe in poltergeist.
Why is that?
Because I feel like people tryto separate them into categories

(00:43):
of of different types of ordifferent ghosts or different
spirits.
Yeah.
I think they're all spirits nomatter what.
And I don't think I think thatsome are just more advanced than
others.
I feel like some have moreabilities than others.
More experience.
Yeah, maybe they've been dead aheck of a lot longer.

(01:05):
I don't know.
But I just feel like some, youknow, have the abilities to move
things and whatever andmanipulate objects or
electricity or whatever, whathave you.
Or just be a regular ghost.
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (01:20):
Maybe it's just like ghosts, the TV show where they
only got one guy that canactually push and move things.

SPEAKER_00 (01:26):
Yep.
Press the buttons on thekeyboard.

SPEAKER_05 (01:28):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
The one that smells like crap whenever you walk past
him and smells like diarrhea.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's what I kind of feel thatit is, is just they just have
different abilities, just likepeople do.
People have different talents,different abilities.
So why wouldn't that be anydifferent on the other side?

SPEAKER_04 (01:44):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:44):
I don't think it's a specific type.

SPEAKER_04 (01:47):
So is it the is it just the name poltergeist?
Because it's a German wordmeaning noisy ghost, or is it
the definition that they putbehind the word?

SPEAKER_00 (01:58):
Well, I think it's the way that people have been
perceiving.
Okay.
I think people are starting to,or have been, changing what the
meaning actually is.
Instead of it just being a noisyghost, they've changed it into
it's one type of ghost, andthat's what that ghost only
does.
Right.
So they kind of warped it intoits own thing.

(02:19):
Yeah, and I don't I don't feelthat's it.
Okay.
I just feel like it's probablysomebody who has a stronger
ability to be able to do thosethings and is able to manipulate
objects and what have you.

SPEAKER_05 (02:30):
I would imagine too that the movie poltergeist
didn't help at all with thispart of definition.

SPEAKER_00 (02:37):
None of those movies help with any of this.
I mean, they're fun andentertaining to watch.
Sure.
As far as like reality goes,it's not.

SPEAKER_05 (02:44):
Unless you're five and your dad lets you watch it.

SPEAKER_00 (02:46):
Yeah, that's like a terrible decision.

unknown (02:49):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (02:50):
Like terrible.
Younger than the girl that wasin the movie.
So yeah, we're gonna be talkingabout the Enfilled Haunting.
It's a very popular um hauntingof a place in the UK.

SPEAKER_04 (03:04):
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (03:05):
And it's like the most documented haunting in the
UK that they have so far.
Really?
So there was so much informationabout it.
And I've known the story for along time, right?
Once you really dive in, there'sa lot.
It is so well done with theyhave so many recordings because

(03:27):
they did a ton of audiosrecordings in there, and the
people practically lived there.
So it's like us going tosomebody's house that's having
crazy experiences, and weliterally are there day and
night, and we live there formonths getting all this info.
Like, how freaking cool wouldthat be?

SPEAKER_04 (03:48):
I ain't gonna lie.
That would be so cool.
I mean, if we ever if we everget that opportunity to like,
hey, we're having some issues,come on out, stay for a couple
weeks, stay for a week.
Yeah, even a week, right?

SPEAKER_00 (04:02):
Like, I mean, I'm in there.

SPEAKER_05 (04:03):
I think they did a show like that, like where they
took some of the ghost huntersand and they put them in a place
for like 30 days.

SPEAKER_00 (04:11):
Yeah.
Oh, that'd be so cool.

SPEAKER_05 (04:13):
I think Shane Pittman was part of that group.

SPEAKER_00 (04:15):
I think you're right.
I'd be all in 30 days.
Way fun because at that pointyou're getting so many different
types of information and ways toinvestigate.
You have time.
Yes.
You're not rushed, you're notyou wouldn't be missing anything
because you'd be there theentire time.
You're not regulated to likefive hours.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (04:35):
Right.

unknown (04:36):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (04:37):
I mean, I've done ghost hunts and stuff where I
have well, we've all done themwhere we've stayed 12 hours,
what have you.
Sure.

SPEAKER_05 (04:43):
And that's a long night.

SPEAKER_00 (04:45):
It is, but imagine being there day and night.
Day and night.
Day and night.
Day and night.

SPEAKER_05 (04:51):
Well, yeah, because then you get rest, right?
Like the the worst part aboutdoing a 12-hour or 18-hour
investigation is like by thetime you get done, you're tired
and worn out, and you're like,that was rough.

SPEAKER_00 (05:04):
That's why I think we would like if you actually
did something like that, youwould flip your schedule.
You'd be sleeping during the dayand awake all night long.
Heck yeah.
I I almost guarantee it.
Heck yeah.
It'd be worth it.
It'd be such a cool thing to do.

SPEAKER_05 (05:18):
We're getting a place for 30 days.
Let's go.

SPEAKER_00 (05:21):
Who wants us?
All right, so let's start.
So the lady that owned the home,her name is Peggy Hodgson.
She was born in 1934 inEdmonton, England, and at the
age of 43, she found herselfdivorced and a single mother.
It's not clear how long she hadbeen divorced for, but in 1977,

(05:44):
she lived on 284 Green Streetwith her four children,
Margaret, she's 13, Janet 11,Johnny 10, and Billy 7.
Peggy did her best to providenecessities for her two sons and
two daughters.
She was said to be quiet andreserved, but very independent
and in good standing with thecommunity.

(06:05):
And I think with that, that hasa good base for her because when
you aren't known by yourcommunity, when you're not
trustworthy, can you imaginecoming up and telling people
that your house is haunted andpeople being like, oh, sure.
And like not wanting to hangaround, not wanting to hear or

(06:28):
not believing anything you'resaying.
Right.
So I think that gives like I Ilistened and not listened, but I
really read a lot of actualstatements and watched actual
statements, like interviews ofneighbors and people around that
said that she was very, verytrustworthy, very, very
independent, never wanted helpfrom anybody, never asked for

(06:52):
help from anybody.
So this was like a huge deal.
Right.
So she lived just a few housesdown from her brother, who
worked at a local hospital.
So that really helped a ton forher.
Um, the brother and his wife.
So Peggy's eldest daughter,Margaret, had the reputation for
being bright, but was alsofairly quiet.

(07:15):
Janet, her 11-year-old daughter,on the other hand, was
extroverted.
Her personality was described asanimated, and she was physically
active and gymnastics was herforte.
Johnny 10, he was the eldest ofthe two boys and wasn't often
home.
He attended a boarding school,which kept him away from the
house, except for schoolholidays and on the weekends,

(07:37):
which made him mostly absentduring the infilt haunting.
And I really didn't find muchinformation about him through
the entire process of thehaunting.
So very little for him.
Yeah, they don't even mentionhim.
I wonder why.

SPEAKER_05 (07:52):
Well, if he's not home, I guess it makes kind of
sense.

SPEAKER_00 (07:55):
I suppose.
But like weekends and stuff, Idon't know.
Maybe he would just stay thereduring the weekends for the most
part.
Yeah.
During that time.
I don't know.
But Billy, the youngest, he wasonly seven.
He suffered from a s a severespeech disability, and I think
he was semi-handicapped to thepoint where you couldn't

(08:17):
converse with him very well.
Um, the Hodginsons were anordinary family, and the kids
were mostly um staying out oftrouble.
Peggy worked tirelessly toprovide for her children, and
the neighborhood was just likeany other.
The neighbors, Vic and PeggyNottingham, lived in 282 Green

(08:38):
Street.
The families would occasionallysocialize and remain supportive
of the Hodgson family bothduring and after the infilled
haunting.
And they were their houses wereconnected.
So they were like a bunch ofduplexes, basically.

SPEAKER_04 (08:53):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (08:54):
And their house is touched.
Everything was normal until itbegan in the night of August
30th, 1977.
Night had fallen over the 284Green Street, a modest council
house in Enfield.
In one upstairs bedroom,11-year-old Janet Hodgson
complained that her and herbrother's bed was trembling.

(09:17):
Peggy thought that they werejust up to no good and ignored
the comment and made him go backto bed.
But the next night wasdifferent.
9 30 p.m.
Peggy had just put the childrento bed.
She heard a loud crash andbooked it over to her daughter's
room to tell them to knock itoff and to go to bed, because
those the two girls shared aroom.
And sometimes the boy wouldsleep in there too.

(09:39):
But they in their room they had,if you can imagine, you open the
door, and to the right, there'stwo beds, one on one wall, one
on the other, one next to awindow, one next to the door.
And then in front of that, andwhen you open the door, in front
of the door is where the dresseris.

(09:59):
Okay.
And that kind of you need tokind of keep that in mind
throughout the story.
When she went into the room, achest of drawers moved towards
her, which looked as if it wastrying to block her from coming
in.
When she pushed it back, itagain came at her.
Determined she shoved it backagain.
But apparently this spirit wasjust as determined as she was

(10:20):
because for the third time itcame at her, but this time, even
with all her weight behind it,she couldn't make it budge.
In a recorded interview, sherecalled what happened.
I just couldn't believe it.
In fact, I pushed it back twice,and the third time I couldn't
move it.
Scared the family rushed out ofthe house to the neighbor's
house.
Vic decided to take a look forhimself.

(10:40):
He insisted on looking for arational cause.
He explored the bedroom alone,but then emerged shaken.
He claimed he had heard adistinct knocking sound that
seemed to follow him around thehouse.
No loose floorboards couldexplain the tap tap tapping that
echoed behind him through thecorridors.
Vic came out, hair standing onend, to tell Peggy that he
hadn't seen a trick or a trap,just something extraordinary.

(11:03):
He explained what he witnessed.
I heard the knocking as I walkedout the front door.
I went all over the house and Icouldn't make out what it was,
so in the end I thought there'sonly one thing.
I'll call the police.
So at one AM on september first,two uniformed officers received
a radio message to come to thehouse.
The kitchen smelled of cold teaand old carpet.

(11:26):
The policeman swept through eachroom with flashlights, flipping
light switches and checkingdoors.
Constable Caroline Heaps heardknocking on the wall and backed
up into the that backed up intothe neighbor's house.
There were four distinct taps onthe wall, and then nothing, no
logical cause was found.
As they prepared to leave, theofficer stood in the living

(11:48):
room.
The oldest boy pointed to thechair that was next to the sofa,
eyes fixed.
Suddenly the chair began towobble upright on its legs, and
then smoothly slid about a meteracross the floor by itself.
The officers exchanged stunnedlooks.
No one had touched the chair,yet it lay in the middle of the

(12:09):
room.
Caroline went around the chairand inspected the area to make
sure it wasn't attached toanything.
The police were baffled.
Peggy realized they too hadwitnessed the impossible.
She described what happened toher.
And this is the female policeofficer.
It came off the floor, maybehalf an inch I would say, and I

(12:30):
saw it slide off to the rightabout three and a half to four
feet before it came to rest.
Can you imagine?

SPEAKER_05 (12:36):
That's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 (12:40):
I mean I've seen furniture move.
Yeah.
But to that extent, I have not.
Like nothing crazy like that.
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (12:48):
I don't think I've ever seen furniture move.

SPEAKER_04 (12:51):
No, I saw a boar slide across the floor.
Yeah, lucky.

SPEAKER_05 (12:56):
Yeah, yeah, that's true.
But yeah, it's yeah, I don'tthink I've ever heard any
furniture.
I mean, have seen any furnituremove.

SPEAKER_00 (13:04):
I've been on a chair and it moved.
Oh, that's crazy.
Probably about two inches, youknow.
Yeah.
That's what you generally see.
If you're gonna see furnituremove, that's generally what it
is.
It's just a little bit.
A little tiny and you're like,whoa.
And then part of you is like,did that actually happen?
Right.
It's so minute.
It's yeah, it's so small.
It just reminds me of like withthe ghost show.

(13:26):
He's trying so hard to like pushsomething that's so little,
making all that effort, it'slike barely moves, just kind of
wobbled a little bit.
The officers really wanted tohelp, but told them there was
nothing that they could dobecause they didn't see anyone
actually physically breaking in.

(13:48):
Vic, the neighbor, continuedcalling the press.
And finally on the night ofSeptember 4th, reporters Douglas
Spence and photographer GrahamMorris of the Daily Mirror came
to investigate.
They weren't told what was goingon.
Just that things were happeningin the home.
The family huddled at theneighbor's house while the
journalist sat alone in thedark.

(14:10):
For hours all was silent.
They went out to the car toleave, but then Vic came running
out.
He he told them to come back in,they went inside, and decided to
wait until Peggy and the kidscame back in.
They returned at 2 30 AM, andinstantly chaos erupted.
A scatter of toy bricks, soLegos, and marbles burst into

(14:33):
flight across the living roomfloor.
Graham Morris, focusing ontaking as many pictures as he
could, was hit on the corner ofhis eyebrow with the corner of a
Lego brick that flew and hithim.
So rude.
Yeah, and it left a welt forlike three days.

unknown (14:53):
Wow.

SPEAKER_00 (14:54):
That's how hard it hit.
Had some speed.
Like I watched, I watched theinterview of the guy and he's
like, it flew right at me.
He's like, but it didn't scareme because I was just so focused
on taking pictures.

SPEAKER_04 (15:04):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (15:05):
And he was just snapping, snapping, snapping,
and when the Lego hit him.
But he just kept going.
He didn't even stop.
Wonder what kind of sound thatmade.
Right.
If it hit that hard.
Right?

SPEAKER_05 (15:15):
I can't.
I don't think I can throw a Legohard enough to leave a welt for
three days on somebody.

SPEAKER_00 (15:19):
Well, and it had to hit because it literally hit him
in the corner of his eyebrow,right here.
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (15:25):
Yeah, right out of the corner of the eye.

SPEAKER_04 (15:26):
So with the corner of the Lego brick.

SPEAKER_05 (15:30):
That's a sensitive spot to get hit, too.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 (15:32):
Yeah, but that thing had to been flying.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (15:34):
Like I mean 80 mile an hour Lego brick.

SPEAKER_04 (15:38):
Had one of those speed guns on it.
Whoa, 98 miles an hour.
Lego.

SPEAKER_00 (15:44):
And some of them flew overhead, nearly striking
anyone that was in the room.
Everyone ducked as more smalltoys flew from unseen corners.
When they tried to pick them up,they were hot to the touch.
Isn't that crazy?
That's nuts.

SPEAKER_05 (16:00):
That is weird.

SPEAKER_00 (16:01):
So they were trying to pick up marbles, and the
marbles were hot.

SPEAKER_04 (16:05):
Glass marbles.

SPEAKER_00 (16:09):
The reporters and neighbors stared in awe and
fear, and no prank could havethrown so many objects at once.
Now they reported that thesewere coming out of nowhere.
So it's dark.
They keep the lights off.
Yeah.
And out of nowhere they seethese toys coming out.

(16:32):
Basically, I don't want to saythey're coming out of the walls,
but they're appearing out ofnowhere.
Just like manifesting.
Yeah, manifesting and gettingchugged at them.
So it's like, how do you dodgethat?
You don't.
They're coming from all aroundthe room.

SPEAKER_04 (16:44):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (16:45):
It's wild.

SPEAKER_04 (16:45):
You're not gonna dodge them all.

SPEAKER_00 (16:47):
No.
So Douglas returned the next dayexplaining that there was
nothing that they could do.
So they called inreinforcements.
The Society for PsychicalResearch, SPR.
The group was set up in 1882 toinvestigate anything that was
not explainable.
They don't have any said ideasor opinions or matters, and

(17:10):
anyone can join.
So it's just basically a bigopen group, and they have a
building that they go and meetat, and anyone can come.
You don't have to believe in thesame things that they do, but
for the most part, most of thembelieve in the paranormal.
But it's it's so big that theyhave their own building and it's
been going on for a hundredyears.

(17:31):
Over.
It's a hundred and two.
I mean, I don't know if it'sstill going, but at that point,
yeah.
Like how cool is that?
By September 5th, members of theSociety for Psychical Research
had arrived.
They assigned Maurice Gross tothe case.
Maurice had lost his daughter,also named Janet, the year

(17:52):
before.
He went out of his way to get toknow the family.
He stepped into the dim livingroom that evening as the family
huddled on the sofa underblankets.
The wallpaper was damp withcondensation.
One chair lay tipped in thecorner from an earlier incident.
I found chaos, Maurice lateradmitted.
He saw bottles toppled, gamesscattered, a rocking chair

(18:16):
removed from its corner, marblesand Legos again being thrown
around the room.
He noticed that when the marblewas thrown and landed on the
ground, it didn't bounce.
It just stopped.
Isn't it?
So it's like it had to have hadcontrol over that marble the
entire time.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (18:37):
Or a really sticky ground.
Ew.

SPEAKER_00 (18:40):
Yeah, that's gross.
I doubt that.
She was actually really clean.
So I doubt the floors weresticky.
The family clutched each otheras he spoke.
Calm, I'll figure this out, hesaid quietly.
Peggy clung to her batteredteddy bear as Maurice offered no
judgment, only his calm presenceand promise to help.

(19:02):
At one point, even thethree-piece suite was flipped
over as well.
Can you imagine?

SPEAKER_04 (19:09):
Couches flipped over, chair flipped over,
everything.

SPEAKER_05 (19:12):
Just toss on a whole living room.

SPEAKER_00 (19:14):
Yeah, pretty much.
Yeah, he talked to his brotherand sister-in-law, talked to her
brother and sister-in-law thatlived down the street, and they
said that if they sat on thechair, that it would turn them
around, and that if the kid saton it, it actually threw one of
the kids out.
Now keep in mind this chairthroughout the entire time that

(19:35):
I'm going to be talking aboutthis investigation.
Okay.
It plays a key role.
Three nights later, on September8th, at 115 AM, a tense hush
settled over the girl's bedroom.
Janet and Margaret lay asleepunder thick quilts on their bed.
Suddenly from the corner of theroom, a loud crash shattered the

(19:56):
silence.
The investigators and familyrushed in with flashlights.
In the corner lay the samewooden chair, overturned and
moved nearly a meter from whereit had been.
Janet and Margaret slept on,breathing softly.
The bedroom, once neat, was nowa mess.

(20:16):
Books lay scattered on thecarpet.
The crash had come from thatchair flying through the air in
the shock and dim light.
Maurice and everyone therefinally understood.
Something real, somethingunexplainable was happening in
this house.
In the weeks that followed, eachnight brought new dread.
During an EVP session, Mauriceasked if it was playing a game

(20:40):
with him.
Right then, Maurice got hit inthe face by a cardboard box and
a pillow.
So I actually watched that.
And all of a sudden, there's soI didn't there's no video
evidence.
It's all pictures.
Yeah.
And you'll find out later why.
But all of a sudden there's acardboard box right in front of

(21:04):
his face.
And then as he's talking,they're showing it as he's
talking in the EVP session.
And he's like, I just got hit bya cardboard box and a pillow.

SPEAKER_04 (21:14):
Like very matter of fact.

SPEAKER_00 (21:16):
Very matter of fact.
It was too funny.
So gathered around the livingroom, a drawer in the cabinets
opened by itself.
And that's what people were trstarting to understand was these
things were not explainable.
The things that were happeningweren't things that the kids
could just do on their own.

SPEAKER_04 (21:35):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (21:36):
The floorboard started to groan under invisible
footsteps.
Doors refused to stay shut.
They would actually slam open bythemselves.
So, like, I'm assuming likehitting the walls when they
would open.
Yeah.
And in the hallway behindPeggy's bedroom, cold drafts

(21:58):
felt like icy fingers brushingthe back of one's neck.
The family learned to speak inwhispers.
Little things began to carrygreat meaning.
A flicker of electricity.
The air in the house feltchanged and charged, as if it
were holding its breath forsomething to come.
The girls had fallen asleep intheir room, and Morris went in

(22:19):
and set up his cameras in theirroom and stood quietly with the
reporters and Peggy.
The curtain started to move awayfrom the window.
Maurice started taking pictures.
It reached across the head ofthe bed like an arm, and it
pulled off one of the girls'covers.
This is when Maurice knew heneeded more help.
Now I actually saw the picturesof that too, and he's going

(22:42):
snap, snap, snap.
And it looks like there's an armin the curtain that comes out
and is going for the bed.
It's wild.
Wild.
So he needed more help withsomeone that had more experience
than him.
One of the reporters said thatif he hadn't seen him, seen it

(23:03):
himself, he would not believethe photograph was real.

SPEAKER_05 (23:07):
Don't believe that.

SPEAKER_00 (23:08):
Yeah.
So what's interesting I findthough in this whole
investigation is there's alwaysthe two reporters and then
Maurice the investigator.
And now they're gonna addanother one.
But it's always them.
They're staying throughoutthroughout this entire
investigation for months andmonths and months.
14 months.

SPEAKER_04 (23:29):
Jeez.
Dang.

SPEAKER_00 (23:31):
Yeah.
Like they don't, they don't giveup.
And it's wild.
Like I've never heard a storylike this.
That's why there's so muchdocumentation.
It's so neat.
So Maurice was at the meetingwith SPR learning about
poltergeist.
And at the end of the meeting,he stood up and stated that he
was working on a difficult caseand needed help.

(23:51):
But the room went really silentand for too long.
And there's this guy named GuyLion Playfair, and he had just
finished working on a case inanother country and wrote a book
about it.
And he was like, I wanted to bedone.
But because the room was silentfor so long, he was like, All

(24:11):
right, I'll help.
And he's like, I'll help out fora few days, maybe a week, and
legit, that turned into 14months.

SPEAKER_04 (24:20):
Dang.

SPEAKER_00 (24:21):
Guy Playfair opened his book on Enfield with a
description of what it's like toexperience a poltergeist.
So after this 14 months, he didend up writing a book.
What would you do if a piece ofyour furniture suddenly slid
along the floor on its own infront of your eyes?
Think for a moment and be honestwith yourself.
What would you actually do?

(24:41):
Maybe after getting over theinitial shock, you would shrug
your shoulders, assume it musthave been something to do with
mice or an earthquake, and justhope it doesn't happen again.
But it does happen again andagain and again.
All sorts of even odder thingshappen as well.
Stones fall on your kitchenfloor as if they had come

(25:02):
through the ceiling.
Somebody or something startsbanging on the wall.
Things disappear and reappearsomewhere else.
Before long, you realize that itcan't be anything to do with
earthquakes or mice, but must besomething else, something wholly
unexplainable and veryfrightening.
You know these things can'thappen, yet you also know they

(25:22):
are happening.
Whatever you do next or like tothink that you would, I can tell
you what people who have foundthemselves in these predicaments
have done.
As word spreads around thatsomething spooky is going on in
your house, you suddenly findyour friends pointedly looking
in the other way when you passthem on the street.

(25:43):
People give you funny looks inthe local shops.
Passers by stop to stare at yourhouse.
You receive malicious phonecalls and threatening letters.
In short, your life is ruined.
On September 10th, it reachednational news, and it was also
on the front page of the DailyMirror with a full page spread
and the title The House ofStrange Happenings.

(26:04):
The mirror was respectablenewspaper.
You didn't get crazy, untruthfulstories in it, so when people
read it, it was more believed.
It was unlike any story thatthey had covered in the past,
and no one had seen an articlelike this before.
The journalists were reportingon their own experiences.
Graham Morris, a photographer,started having issues with his

(26:29):
camera.
He charged all of his flashes,and when he started taking
pictures, they all discharged atonce.
So which is impossible.

SPEAKER_04 (26:39):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (26:40):
They're not connected.

SPEAKER_02 (26:41):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (26:42):
You can only have one flash.
For I mean, can thinking back inthe day, right?
Right.
And they all go off at once, andthey are completely drained.
The batteries are totallydrained.

SPEAKER_04 (26:56):
That's nuts.

SPEAKER_00 (26:57):
They also had an infrared video camera to record
in the dark.
And when they pressed record,all the lights would turn on.
So they literally have no videoevidence.
None.
In the 14 months, somethingalways happened to the the video

(27:18):
recorder so that it neverworked.

SPEAKER_04 (27:21):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (27:21):
So whatever's doing it wanted to make sure of that.
It was like it's it's like ithad control over what they could
and couldn't do.

SPEAKER_04 (27:30):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (27:31):
Because he could take all the pictures that he
wanted pretty much.

SPEAKER_04 (27:34):
But no video.

SPEAKER_00 (27:35):
But no video.

SPEAKER_04 (27:37):
That's nuts.

SPEAKER_00 (27:38):
Right?
Yeah.
So Janet seemed to be the centerof it all, the common
denominator.
It always happened when she wasaround.
The reporters helped the kidswith their homework because they
pretty much lived there.
And they said that she was thebrightest of the bunch.
She was learning two differentlanguages.
She would come back from schooland tell them that things were

(28:00):
starting to happen there too.
And when she was at the store,she would see cans fly off the
shelves.
But it's actually notsurprising.
When this kind of rare activityhappens, it's most common around
kids about to hit puberty.
And the reporters of the SPRnoticed that.
They gave Janet a red cushionand asked her to put it at the

(28:21):
bottom of the stairs.
So I believe she was in her roomwhen they asked her to do this.

SPEAKER_04 (28:26):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (28:28):
But it wasn't what happened.
Eyewitnesses that were walkingoutside reported that a red
cushion appeared out of nowhere,hovering over the roof.
Yeah.
They were all in shock.
In their minds, they couldn'tbelieve it, but they knew it
happened.
In the same day, the SPRs askedher if she could make something

(28:50):
go through the floor into theroom below.
But instead, they reported thatshe herself went through the
wall into the house next door.
And she told them in perfectdescription of what the room
looked like and that she hadleft something behind.
They went over there, no one washome, everybody was gone.

(29:13):
She described the roomperfectly.
And they found a book thatbelonged to her in that room.
And the title of the book wascalled Fun Games with Children.

SPEAKER_04 (29:26):
Oh jeez.

SPEAKER_00 (29:28):
Oh man.
So what I found interesting isthe four people that were always
there were like, yes, thishappened.
We don't know how this happened.
And then the people that weren'tthere that were even a part of
the paranormal group were like,that's impossible.

(29:49):
She can't just unmaterialize andrematerialize in another house.
Like that is not physicallypossible.
But yet for People saw it andthey're all it happened, like we
saw it.
And when they were talking aboutthe red cushion, the red

(30:12):
cushion, the guy tried to debunkit and was like, well, what if
she like went out the window andtossed it and it wouldn't work?
The window was closed.
He's like, I couldn't even tossit even if I wanted to.

SPEAKER_04 (30:26):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (30:27):
So things crazy things are starting to happen.
So determined to make contact,Maurice and Guy Line Play
Playfair resorted to oldspiritual tricks in November.
One moonless night, Peggy spreadpens and notepads on each bed
and gathered everyone for aseance.

(30:48):
Minutes passed intense silence,then suddenly a scrap of paper
appeared pinned to therefrigerator door.
A stark warning scrawled acrossit.
I will stay in this house.
Do not read this to anyone, or Iwill retaliate.
The letters were thick andjagged as if dragged by an
unseen fingertip.
Peggy's eyes were filled withtears, and the message was

(31:10):
clear.
The entity felt threatened anddemanded respect.
The family huddled together,shaken by the voice from beyond.
Things in the house started toescalate if it wasn't already
escalated enough.

SPEAKER_04 (31:22):
Right?
It's like this is alreadyintense.
How much further we want to gohere?

SPEAKER_00 (31:29):
The levitating started.
It started small and it gotworse over time.
And it started with the girlsjust sliding off their beds.
Then they were tossed off theirbeds.
And it quickly turned into Janetbeing thrown about five feet
across the room with thepictures to boot.

(31:51):
So mind you, what they do isthey wait for the kids to go to
sleep.
Once the kids go to sleep, theyall go in the room and will just
they'll set up their cameras andthen wait.
Because they're noticing thatJanet is the source of this.

SPEAKER_04 (32:10):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (32:11):
So they're trying to figure out what's going on.
There was a a woman who theycall the lollipop lady.
Her name's Hazel Short.
She was a crossing guard workingin front of the house.
Looking up, during her break,she gasped.
Through the bedroom window, shesaw Janet's body rising and

(32:32):
falling in midair.
The girl's limbs lay horizontalas if someone invisible held her
back and tossed her legs upward.
Hazel described it.
Janet was going up and down asthough someone had gotten a hold
of her legs and back and wasthrowing her up and down.
Meanwhile, another passerby,John Rainbow, also witnessed the

(32:55):
body of Janet floating off ofthe bed.
He too was convinced that shecould not have jumped that high
on her own.
On the night of November 26th, ahaunting took on a new, surreal
quality.
After one particular frighteningepisode, Janet had been given a
strong sedative by the doctor.
Just before dawn, Janet's uncleJohn crept quietly up the

(33:18):
staircase to check in on her.
In the pale glow of aflashlight, he found something
impossible.
Janet lay asleep, limp andunconscious, on top of a turned
on radio sitting atop a chest ofdrawers.
The radio dial glowed faintly inthe darkness.

(33:39):
Graham Morris snapped a quickphoto to document it.
Even sedated, Janet wasbalancing atop a noisy radio as
if carried there by invisiblehands.
No doubt remain remained for anyskeptic.
The house power had lifted thegirl and placed her on that
device.
It legit looked like you took alike a cat, picked it up by its

(34:02):
stomach, and just put it on topof the radio.
Weird.
That's exactly what she lookedlike.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (34:10):
And we're not talking about like a little
boombox radio.
We're talking about a big decentsize fashion radio.

SPEAKER_00 (34:19):
Yeah, but it and it wasn't like tall tall, right?
So I mean, she was probably fourfoot, I'm guessing, in the air.
Maybe a little bit more, becauseI'm not sure how tall the men
were.
But comparing it to them, I'mguessing like the top of the
radio is about four and a halffeet in the air.
And it's sitting on top of adresser.

(34:40):
So and that the radio isprobably a foot high.

SPEAKER_04 (34:46):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (34:46):
And they're not like flat either.

unknown (34:49):
No.

SPEAKER_00 (34:50):
No.
No, they're like curved and theyhave like antique designs and
stuff.
And she's like on that.
And I don't know how.
I guess because she did have asedative, but how you could stay
asleep on something like that?
It just blows my mind.

SPEAKER_05 (35:09):
Was she flat, like straight?

SPEAKER_00 (35:11):
No.
She was like it's literally likea limp noodle on top of my.

SPEAKER_05 (35:15):
Oh my gosh.
Okay.
Yeah.
So she's bent in it.
She's breathed over it.
She's yeah, she's bent backwardsover it.

SPEAKER_00 (35:20):
I don't know if she was backwards or she was.
I think she was more for like onher belly.

SPEAKER_05 (35:24):
Oh, okay.
Still.
I mean I mean, I've seen our kidfall asleep weird like that, but
when they're little.

SPEAKER_00 (35:35):
When they're little, you're not eleven.

SPEAKER_05 (35:37):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (35:38):
A few nights later, the spirit struck again.
On November 28th, as Peggy andMargaret slept upstairs, a
violent jolt hurled Janet acrossthe room.
With a shriek, Peggy bolted outof her bed and the girls'
mattresses had been flipped, andJanet had been flung onto the
floor.
In the half light, Peggy foundher daughter lying at the bottom

(36:01):
of the stairs.
The bedroom door stood wideopen, and no human hand was to
be seen.
Janet was shaken and bewildered,but unhurt.
In the eerie silence that night,only the ticking clock of
Janet's soft and Janet's softsobs filled the air.
Once more the empty house hadflung a child as if weightless.

(36:22):
Now that's some pretty powerfulcrap.

SPEAKER_02 (36:25):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (36:26):
To throw her off the bed and then to pick her up and
throw I don't know if he threwher, but she was at the bottom
of the stairs.

SPEAKER_05 (36:35):
Drugged, thrown, carried.

SPEAKER_00 (36:36):
Either way, it doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_05 (36:39):
And the fact that she I mean she wouldn't have
fallen down the stairs, right?
Because you figured that wouldhave woke somebody up.
So to even carry someone gentlyand place them at the bottom of
the stairs while they're stillasleep.

SPEAKER_00 (36:50):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (36:51):
Pretty impressive.

SPEAKER_00 (36:52):
Yeah.
Suddenly the haunting acquired avoice.
On the night of December tDecember 10th, Maurice and the
psychologist, John Belof, set uptape recorders and quietly urged
the spirit to speak throughJanet.
At first only soft whistles andlow growls replied.

(37:13):
Then Janet's lips parted, and adeep, gruff male's voice
answered clearly through herwhile awake and totally alert.
It scared her.
She couldn't feel the voice inher throat.
She felt it coming from thelower back of her head.
The old man's voice spoke inclipped, precise words.

(37:34):
It identified itself as JoeWatson, and answered questions
distinctly, even though Janet'slips and tongue had remained
still.
The group froze.
This was no child mimicking anold man.
This was the voice of a spiritclaiming to be trapped in that
girl's body.
They had experts coming in,throat doctors, ventriloquists.

(37:56):
The throat doctor said thesounds were coming from her
false vocal cords in the back ofher throat.
But if it were coming from her,she would have been hoarse
within a few seconds.
And she would have been clearingher throat, and no one would be
able to continue speaking likethat.

(38:16):
But she would do this for anhour straight, days on end,
never clearing her throat andnever getting hoarse.
So I actually heard therecordings and I watched.
There is video evidence of that.
And you would hear, I mean, it'sdeep.

(38:39):
I don't know if a a girlphysically that young could go
that deep.

SPEAKER_04 (38:44):
Could go that deep.
Yeah.
With the voice.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (38:46):
And it would talk um like this.
Eh, uh, uh when it would talk.
Yeah.
And um, the guy, uh Maurice, hetried to do it and he could only
do it for a few seconds and thenhad to start clearing his
throat.
He's like, there's no way.
Like we would sit there and askher questions for an hour.

(39:08):
And at one point, they did itfor three hours.
Not once did she clear herthroat, and not once did she go
hoarse.
Because in between, she wouldtalk normal to them.
She'd be like, I don't know whythis is going on.
Like, I feel it, and she'd showthem, like, she's like, I feel
it right here.
I don't feel it in my throat.
Isn't that odd?
That is so odd.

SPEAKER_05 (39:29):
So, so strange.

SPEAKER_00 (39:32):
By the next night, the spirit revealed its true
identity.
On December 13th, 1977, Janetsat in a trance, speaking in a
gravelly accent.
When Maurice whispered to her,What happened when you died?
The voice answered, I wentblind, and I had a hemorrhage,

(39:53):
and I fell asleep, and I died ona chair in the corner
downstairs.
I came here to see my family,but they are not here.
I heard that recording.
It's wild.

SPEAKER_04 (40:12):
That's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 (40:13):
Wild.
The investigators exchangedgrave looks.
Through the frightened mouth ofthe eleven-year-old, they now
had the name and story.
The restless soul was WilliamBill, aka Bill Wilkins, who
claimed to have died in thatvery house decades ago.
Janet, speaking in that oldman's voice, continued the

(40:36):
narrative softly under herbreath.
The discovery sent chillsthrough everyone present.
They actually never looked thisup.
But Guy wrote it in his bookabout a and it was just a book
on Enfield.
And after it was published, aman came to him and said, I

(40:58):
think that's my dad.
We used to live in that house.

SPEAKER_02 (41:01):
Oh my.

SPEAKER_00 (41:02):
And that's exactly how he died.

SPEAKER_04 (41:04):
Oh jeez.

SPEAKER_00 (41:07):
And that chair is the same chair that they still
had in there.
Same chair.
Those nights that followed werea blur of terror.
On December 17th, psychicMatthew Manning spent hours
conversing with Bill throughJanet and observing the room.
He saw objects move on theirown.

(41:29):
Guy Playfair's tape recorderleapt off the table and crashed
to the floor, then vanished,only to be found moments later
under a toppled chest ofdrawers.
On December 23rd, another shock.
The Hodgshins discovered boththeir goldfish floating dead in
their tank.
The glass bowl lay cracked andwarm to the touch.

(41:52):
The family was heartbroken.
When they questioned Janet,still in a trance, Bill chuckled
through her.
I did that, he said calmly,claiming that he had
electrocuted the creatures witha jolt of spirit energy.
The room was deathly quiet, noone wanted to perform another
dangerous test.

(42:13):
But Maurice could not resist.
He half filled Janet's mouthwith water and taped her lips
shut to prevent ventriloquism.
Still, when Bill spoke throughher on tape, the voice remained
clear and accurate.
Wow wild.

(42:34):
Christmas Day nineteen seventyseven brought another new
horror.
Later that afternoon, the girlsat quietly by the living room
window when the curtains besideJanet suddenly began to twist.
In an instant they coiled slowlyaround her wrists and neck,
pinning her against the sash.
Eight times during this case,the heavy drapes would spiral

(42:58):
like ropes around one of thechildren, and each time Peggy
had to rush forward, prying thefabric off of her daughters.
There is video, or not video,there is photographs of this.

SPEAKER_04 (43:11):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (43:12):
So when the first instant that I told you about
with it going over her bed andpulling off her covers, it was
twisted.
You saw it come out and twist,and then you see it reach out
and grab the blanket.
It's wild.
Wild.

SPEAKER_05 (43:31):
That's so weird.

SPEAKER_00 (43:33):
An ominous message appeared on the back of the
bathroom door.
Strips of copper-coloredinsulating tape had been
painstakingly arranged to spellout the words I am Fred.
Twenty strips of tape made thatword.
The tape had been locked in acabinet, and no one in the
family had been in that bathroomthat night.

(43:54):
The message was high and out ofreach.
The investigator stood in awe,convinced that only the
poltergeist could have cut andplaced each piece of tape.
Through the winter and into thespring, Peggy became a vigilant
record keeper.
By April 1978, she had loggedover 155 incidences in her

(44:14):
notebook.
She wrote of small fires thatwould burst into flame for no
reason, and of looming shapesmoving at the edge of your
vision.
One entry described torches oforange flame springing to life
in the unit's fireplace and evendancing on cold matchboxes.

(44:36):
And one of the investigatorsactually saw that.

SPEAKER_04 (44:48):
Nope.

SPEAKER_00 (44:49):
No.
And with things being hot totake a touch?
In another, she noted that palehuman silhouettes had appeared
momentarily in the hallwaycorners.
The investigators were amazed,and the small fires and the
fleeing apparitions once rarewere now a commonplace.
It seemed the spirits wereshowing itself more boldly than

(45:12):
ever.
On may thirtieth, nineteenseventy eight, it brought a new
kind of terror.
That afternoon, Janet andMargaret were playing quietly in
the back garden.
Suddenly, without a warning, ashower of stones came hurling
over the fence.
A fistful of pebbles pinged intothe patio around their feet.
Then larger rocks came, one ofthem a brick sized chunk of

(45:33):
concrete flew through the air,landing with a thud.
Shrieking the girls fled intothe house as stones kept
materializing in the garden.
Neighbors even ran out,bewildered.
One even accused an imaginaryassailant of throwing the rocks
at him.
But when he went outside, no onewas there.
For minutes it seemed to be asif invisible hands were lobbying

(45:54):
the stones.
Then as suddenly as it hadbegun, it stopped.
The only evidence left werechips of mortar and two
frightened little girls.
In July 1978, Janet went to thehospital to get some tests done.
With Janet safely away, thehousehold finally grew still.
Doctors at the hospital rantests on Janet but found nothing

(46:16):
physically amiss.
She was healthy mentally and wasgetting the rest that she
needed.
In her absence, the cold spots,slamming doors, and flying
objects stopped.
The family almost began tobreathe again.
But when she came back home, thefamily went on a little vacation
to Essex.
Peggy's brother John was lookingafter the home and thought for

(46:39):
sure that Janet's gone, nothingwould happen at the house.
But he was about to be provedwrong.
Morris recorded his story.
This is uh what I heard him sayverbatim on a recording.
I went into the house toretrieve a clock.
I got up to the bedroom door,the door opened on its own.

(47:01):
I saw the doorknob twist, likesomebody was turning the
doorknob from the other side.
As I walked into the room, thedoor closed behind me.
I collected the alarm clock,turned around, walked towards
the door, and the door handleturned on its own and opened
wide enough for me to walk outnormally.
I quickly went down the stairsand I left.

(47:22):
But if that wasn't enough toscare him off, he went back a
second time.
He said, I saw something sittingthere at the living room table,
a man.
He was sitting with his backtowards me, sitting on the chair
at the table.
He had a white and blue stripedshirt on, grey hair, not too

(47:44):
thick.
I looked at him and in my mind Ithought, What is your game,
mate?
What are you doing here?
I was about to say something,but then realized the house I
was in, and I closed my eyes fora second and blinked and he was
gone.
I left the house like a rocket.
I was scared.
I came back and said to my wife,I'm sorry, there is no way I'm

(48:06):
going back inside that house.
I believe that place is haunted.
Janet was alone in the darkkitchen when she suddenly
exclaimed that she saw someonestanding in the corner.
When Peggy rushed in, the roomwas empty, but Janet described
the figure, a pale young boy,maybe ten years old, standing

(48:26):
motionless in the shadows.
He made no sound.
Peggy and the adults searchedeverywhere but found no one.
Whatever it was, the ghost orspectre appeared to be keeping
watch the moment she steppedback inside.
The house had stirred again atJanet's return.
A fortnight later, on octobersecond, nineteen seventy eight,

(48:50):
the family called in a Dutchmedium, Donno Mailing, to
cleanse the house.
Donno walked quietly to thegirl's room alone, muttering
soft prayers and waving his armsas if brushing away cobwebs.
Twenty minutes later, he simplyannounced it is finished.
To everyone's amazement, afterthat day, the violent incidents

(49:12):
all but ceased.
No longer did furniture crash orvoices bellow.
By November, only occasionalcreaks and small knocks were
heard.
Events so mild that theneighbors barely noticed.
The fact that the neighbors arenoticing, that tells you.
Because they did have incidenceswhere the neighbors could hear
the knocks and they could hearthe crashes.

SPEAKER_04 (49:33):
So it was pretty loud.

SPEAKER_00 (49:34):
So it was very loud.
Yeah.
And what I also find interestingis that the spirits that are
that they're seeing are allmale.
And when the voice would comeout of her, it was male.
It was male.
And then the written name on thewall.

(49:57):
Male.
Male.
One Sunday in late 1978, anewspaper even ran a brief piece
noting that the house wasquieting down at last.
The age of nightly terror seemedover.
Janet later said that for thefirst time in years she was able
to sleep through the nightwithout fear.

(50:19):
Indeed, after October 1979,there were only rare isolated
incidences.
The house had finally fallensilent.
Maurice Gross recorded some ofhis thoughts on the Enfield
case.
Quote, Miss Hodgson had been avery strong character.
If it hadn't been for herstrength, I doubt whether we

(50:41):
would have continued with thisinvestigation as far as we've
gotten.
I think that in some respectthis case has been remarkable
for the amazing way that thepeople were involved in it.
The Hodgson family, theBurkhams, and the Nottinghams
have behaved during the wholeinvestigation.

(51:02):
They have behaved with enormousamount of common sense.
The incredible lack of hysteriaat any time has been quite
remarkable.
Considering that some of thesethings have happened have been
very frightening indeed.
The Hodgsons have evidence thatthe poltergeist wasn't confined
to the house, even though it wasthere more than anywhere else.

(51:25):
So its existence outside of thehouse undermined the motive to
change locations.
They had lived in that house formore than a decade without
previous poltergeist activity,and moving would have taken them
away from their friends andtheir family in the area.
Furthermore, they had two SPRinvestigators working with them,
Gross and Playfair, who hadaccess to other people who could

(51:50):
help and other resources, andthose investigations would often
stay in the house with theHodgsons and help them in other
ways.
Moving would have risked losingor diminishing that sort of
support, which would beproblematic in the poltergeist
if the poltergeist followed themto where they went.
The Hodgsons were a low-incomefamily living in a public

(52:12):
housing, and trying to get movedto another house on the basis of
an alleged poltergeist wouldarouse suspicion.
Throughout the ordeal, theHodgsons and the investigators
remained unwavering in theirbelief that this was no hoax,
but a genuine haunting, fromPeggy's first terrified call in
August 1977 to the Dutch mediumin 1979.

SPEAKER_05 (52:34):
That's kind of a crazy set of stories, though.

SPEAKER_04 (52:38):
Well, it's one big story.
Well, yeah.
But yeah, the uh the happeningsof it all is just it's kind of
mind-boggling.
It's one thing after anotherafter another after another.
Consistent.

SPEAKER_05 (52:52):
But you know, it has a similar feeling.

SPEAKER_04 (52:55):
What's that?

SPEAKER_05 (52:57):
To uh Andrea Perone.

SPEAKER_04 (53:00):
Mm.
Okay.

SPEAKER_05 (53:02):
To the Perone family.
Which is why I don't think thiswas William or Bill or Fred.
I don't think it was human atall.

SPEAKER_04 (53:15):
Maybe not, just given well, and it seemed to
have a like a mean streak.

SPEAKER_00 (53:21):
Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_04 (53:22):
Like if it was really like William, okay, and
he's like, oh, I I died here,this is what happened, and I
came back and I'm looking for myfamily, but they're not here.
Okay, that's one thing.
But the streak of cruelty aboutit, like electrocuting the fish?

SPEAKER_05 (53:40):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (53:40):
Well, see, in my opinion, I do think that guy
came in at some point.
At a point.
I think he saw an opportunity,took that opportunity, went with
it.
But I also think it's hard forspirits in general to have that
much energy to continue that allthe time.

(54:02):
Exactly.
So, in my opinion, I when itcomes to evil things, there's
never just one.
Oh yeah, there's multiple.
I mean for I shouldn't saynever, but for the most part,
they come in groups.
Yeah.
And they'll get you from allsides.
And I'm sure they all wanted inon this.

(54:25):
This was a perfect primeopportunity for them.

SPEAKER_04 (54:27):
Oh, and they were having fun with it.
Oh yeah.
You know they were.

SPEAKER_00 (54:30):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 (54:32):
Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_05 (54:34):
It's just interesting, like, because yeah,
there's there is the reportednature of hauntings and and
paranormal activity, especiallyamongst females, right, around
puberty.

SPEAKER_02 (54:48):
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (54:51):
But why the stop?
Like that's the part that islike Okay, I get the start, but
it's just like the medium comesin, has a conversation, it's
over.

SPEAKER_00 (55:05):
I wonder also, though, if things were already
starting to die down andhormones are starting to get
regulated.
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (55:18):
Yeah, it's been two years.
It started in 77 and ended in79.

SPEAKER_00 (55:23):
Yeah, but it was like a year and a half, if a
little less than a year and ahalf, actually.
But I I really wonder if it waslike they rode that train for as
long as they could.
And then once the medium camein, it was like, let's just be
done with this.
Yeah.
And that's where it ends.
And it, but it at the same time,it didn't actually completely
end.

SPEAKER_05 (55:43):
Kind of just pittered.

SPEAKER_00 (55:44):
It pittered.
And there were other things thathappened for the years to come
after that, but were just sominute.
They're like, meh.
Right compared to everythingelse.
It's not clean.
Meh.
Like, it's fine.

SPEAKER_05 (55:59):
People like you know, just disappearing of
matter and reappearing inanother spot and then
reappearing back where itstarted.

SPEAKER_00 (56:07):
But there is also the fact that there are people
that are disputing this, sayingthat the girl that did this,
she's the one that's theextrovert.
She's the one that lovedgymnastics.
Who's to say she didn't flop ontop of that radio herself and
just slept walk?

SPEAKER_02 (56:28):
Sure.

SPEAKER_00 (56:29):
Because that is a thing with you know, people take
ambient and they sleepwalk, orthey, you know, they'll fight it
and then fall asleep wherever.
You know, who's to say thatdidn't happen?

SPEAKER_05 (56:39):
And okay, so that can account for the one in the
case.
But let's count for that.
Right.
Like, and that's fine.
Like that can be understandable,right?
Like, yeah, you take a heavysedative, like an ambient.
Of course, it's a pre-ambien,right?
But sure, could be a good one.
Could have had the same effect.
She could have woke up at thebottom, she could have fallen
asleep or sleptwalked down thestairs, fallen asleep.
Sure.
I mean, heck.

(56:59):
When I was a kid or a teenager,I sleptwalked from my friend's
house to my house in the middleof winter.

SPEAKER_00 (57:08):
That's impressive.

SPEAKER_05 (57:09):
And woke up in my bed.

SPEAKER_00 (57:10):
That's impressive.

SPEAKER_05 (57:11):
Now, granted, it's not that far.
It was like half a block, butstill, it's still the middle of
a North Dakota winter.

SPEAKER_00 (57:17):
That's so cold.

SPEAKER_05 (57:19):
I'm like, where are my shoes?

SPEAKER_00 (57:21):
How'd I get here?

SPEAKER_05 (57:22):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (57:23):
But also, if you think like um her getting thrown
out of bed, they have videoevidence, or not video.
I keep saying that.
Pictures.
Picture evidence.

SPEAKER_05 (57:35):
Photographic evidence.

SPEAKER_00 (57:36):
Yes, of that happening.
Like rapid fire.
If you look at it, there's likefour pictures or so of that
happening.
If you look, it looks like she'sjumping out of the bed.
Sure.
It definitely looks like the waythat her legs are and they tuck
and then they go back down.
It looks like she's jumping outof the bed.

SPEAKER_04 (57:54):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (57:55):
But also, because she is a gymnast or just likes
gymnastics in general, maybethat's just a natural movement
for her.
Is like she's getting thrown soshe tucks her feet so she
doesn't hit anything and thenputs them down when she lands.
Right.
Because you're trained to dothat.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (58:14):
But that explains in some of these instances, right?
Like you can explain some ofthem away.

SPEAKER_04 (58:20):
You can explain a lot of it.
But yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (58:21):
How do you explain her going to the neighbor's
house and back?
How do you explain the cushionbeing seen by bystanders on the
top of the building?

SPEAKER_00 (58:32):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (58:32):
Like it's those things that don't those things
don't add up.

SPEAKER_00 (58:37):
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (58:37):
Like you can you could explain away the other
ones as okay, she's prankingsome of the things.
Or how about you f you coverthat lady's mouth with tape and
fill it full of water or hermouth full of water.

SPEAKER_04 (58:52):
And the voice still.
And the voice is still comingout.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (58:55):
And the thing is, is if you ever watch a
ventriloquist when they'retalking, right?
Even if their mouth is closedwhen they're doing it or very,
very open, you can see theirthroat moving.
You can see the the motion ofspeech.

SPEAKER_00 (59:11):
They tested her and her vocal cords were not being
used.

SPEAKER_05 (59:16):
Yeah, so like they were trying to do all of the
scientific things.
So like it's like, okay, explainthat one.
Explain the cushion.
Explain the book.

SPEAKER_04 (59:25):
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (59:28):
Those are the ones that are like fantastical.
The other ones, sure.
See you could you could kind ofexplain away as circumstantial.

SPEAKER_00 (59:37):
In my mind also, though, if I'm I typically like
to debunk, right?
And in my mind, she alreadyprobably knows what the
neighbor's house looks like.
And she may have already leftthat book in there from a
previous time that she had beenin the house.
So for me, it's like I I could sI could venture that one away.

(01:00:02):
I could see how she coulddescribe that room to a T and
have a book left in there,knowing that she had already
left a book in there previously.
Like in my mind, I could explainthat away.
But also you have four grown menthat saw that happen.

SPEAKER_05 (01:00:19):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (01:00:20):
How d how does that I mean I've never heard of a
person actually going through awall like a real person, yeah.
Spirits, of course.
Sure.
Yeah.
But an actual person I've never.
Yeah.
This is the only incident thatI've ever heard of.

SPEAKER_05 (01:00:35):
But it's fantastical in that sense.

SPEAKER_00 (01:00:39):
How do you explain the chair?
The police officer experiencingit.

SPEAKER_02 (01:00:44):
Seeing it.

SPEAKER_00 (01:00:44):
30 people.
30 people have been in thathouse, have witnessed something.
30 people.

SPEAKER_02 (01:00:51):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:00:51):
How do you explain that?
I can't.
Well, that's the thing, right?

SPEAKER_05 (01:00:57):
Like, if you have people that are living there,
staying there, right?
And they're documenting itbecause they're doing it as
investigative reporters, asinvestigators, right?
It's like, okay, this door, noone's been in all night.
We stayed at someone was up theentire night.
No one's been in that room.
And oh, by the way, there's tapeon the wall saying, I am Fred,

(01:01:20):
and it's at a position and aheight that's not possible for
the kids to do.

SPEAKER_04 (01:01:25):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (01:01:26):
Not with like a ladder, a little step stool or
something.

SPEAKER_02 (01:01:28):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (01:01:29):
But then you also have to think they're a poor
family.
They probably don't have a tonof stuff.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (01:01:34):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (01:01:35):
And it's not like they own the house.
So why would they actually needa ladder?
You know?
Like you have to kind of putinto perspective some of these
things that it to debunk what'sgoing on.
The lady, she's a like she kepther house clean.
And so there it's not like thetoys were out everywhere all
over the floor.

SPEAKER_04 (01:01:55):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:01:56):
And to have these people witness it and
everybody's huddled together andtoys are flying everywhere.
From all directions.
From all directions coming outof the darkness.
Like, how do you explain that?
You can't.
The marbles being hot.
How do you explain that?
You can't.

SPEAKER_05 (01:02:14):
No.
And and that's the part thatlike we know spirits can make
things hot or cold, depending onwhat they w what type of energy
they're using.

SPEAKER_00 (01:02:25):
Right.
I've been in I have investigateda home where the fish tank um
heat was turned up and killedall the fish by a spirit.

SPEAKER_05 (01:02:37):
And that was a uh like a three, right?
In type three?

SPEAKER_02 (01:02:42):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (01:02:43):
Right.
And so that's why I'm sayingthat I think this is more of a
type three style of hauntingthan a human spirit.
Just from the from the evilnature of things, plus the
power.
Like it seemed like non-endingpower.

SPEAKER_00 (01:03:00):
Well, and I wonder if it was just one spirit after
another after another.
Taking their turn.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (01:03:06):
I mean And they could have.
I mean, it could have just beenlike, all right, you got
tonight, you got tomorrow night,you got the night after that,
and then I'm I'll have my energyback, so we'll just kind of like
rotate.

SPEAKER_00 (01:03:18):
And I r I that's how I think it happened.
I don't see it happening withone particular entity.
I really don't.
As a multitude.
Yeah.
Because if you think about it,they're selfish.

SPEAKER_05 (01:03:32):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:03:33):
There's no way they're just gonna let one of
them have all the fun.

SPEAKER_05 (01:03:36):
Right.
They're gonna enjoy it.
It's gonna be a party time.

SPEAKER_00 (01:03:39):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (01:03:39):
It's it's interesting though, is the
question of us is why.
Generally speaking, threes needto be invited in that in in
somewhat some form of fashion.

SPEAKER_00 (01:03:50):
Who's to say it wasn't?
Who's to say it wasn't?
Well, if we just don't know whatit is.

SPEAKER_05 (01:03:53):
We just don't know, right?
Right.
We just don't know what she wasdealing with, how she was
feeling, what her her mindsetwas, what she was doing at
school.

SPEAKER_00 (01:04:02):
Well, and the question is for me too, is maybe
she was sensitive to this stuff.
Maybe she was like how I wasgrowing up.

SPEAKER_02 (01:04:09):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:04:10):
And maybe because she's sensitive, she is a target
because that's how it was forme.
When I started becoming ateenager, it got insane for me.
I had to do everything in mypower to keep it at bay.
And it still would come.
So if you can imagine maybe sheis the type that is sensitive

(01:04:35):
and maybe she doesn't have anyreligion in her home or what
have you, because it doesn'ttalk about religion at all.
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (01:04:42):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (01:04:43):
And for me, I grew up very, very religious, and
maybe that was like a shield forme, some sort of protectant.
So it could only get so far.
Where if maybe she didn't havethat, it was almost like an open
playing field.

SPEAKER_05 (01:05:01):
Yeah.
Is she still alive?

SPEAKER_00 (01:05:05):
I mean, she'd be I believe Janet died in 2006.

SPEAKER_05 (01:05:11):
Okay.
So she would have died younger,because like in she would have
been born in the sixties, and sothat she'd be eighty today.
No, sixtiesome today.
So she would have died young.

SPEAKER_00 (01:05:25):
Shoot yeah, yeah.
I mean, she was eleven inseventy seven.

SPEAKER_05 (01:05:31):
She was born in sixty-six, sixty-five.
So that's only sixty years ago.

SPEAKER_00 (01:05:37):
Yep.

SPEAKER_05 (01:05:38):
Wow.

unknown (01:05:42):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:05:43):
Maybe it was 2016.

SPEAKER_05 (01:05:46):
But still, I mean, still that's still when you when
you consider the age of things,you still consider that young.

SPEAKER_00 (01:05:52):
Yeah.
But they never denied it.
None of them.
The family, the daughters, and Ithink the daughters um were the
one of them, I believe, is stillalive.
The oldest one.
Um but the mom and I believe thedaughter is dead, but so maybe

(01:06:18):
it was just the mom that died.

SPEAKER_05 (01:06:20):
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (01:06:20):
So there's So it says AI says she is not dead.

SPEAKER_05 (01:06:25):
Okay.
So So there's me okay, so she'syeah, she we she should be in
her sixties, and I wonder if howopen she is to talking about her
experiences.
Like sometimes things are sotraumatic and so rough that you
just don't ever want to talkabout it again.

SPEAKER_04 (01:06:44):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (01:06:45):
Well, I could see that Yeah, I couldn't blame
anybody for not wanting to to totalk and say, hey, look, you
know, that's in the past.
I'm done with that.
I don't want to I don't want todiscuss that anymore.

SPEAKER_04 (01:06:58):
I don't want to bring it up because it's like
reliving it.

SPEAKER_05 (01:07:01):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:01):
Well, and I wonder, um, I think they've done
interviews because of theConjuring 2.

SPEAKER_05 (01:07:08):
Was that on the infield?

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:09):
Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_05 (01:07:10):
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:12):
And um I think it the one that I didn't see any of
them, but I saw a picture and Ibelieve it was Margaret the
older one.
I don't know if Jana actuallywas a part of that interview or
not.
I mean, you would think herpicture would be the main
picture that they showed, notMargaret.

(01:07:35):
But I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 (01:07:38):
Nuts.
Absolutely.
Nuts, nuts, nuts.

SPEAKER_05 (01:07:42):
It's such a good story though.
It is.
Like when you consider like thethe level of of information out
there on it.
And it's probably w probably oneof the most well-known
paranormal stories out there.

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:56):
Oh no.
It says it's Janet and Margaret.
They are both they both do theinterview.
Oh, nice.
Okay.

SPEAKER_05 (01:08:07):
We'll have to watch that.

SPEAKER_04 (01:08:08):
Yeah, something we can look up and watch.
Yeah, I'd be interested to seethat interview.

SPEAKER_05 (01:08:18):
Yeah, that's a little crazy.
I can't imagine going throughthose things.
And experiencing that and thenseeing stuff.
Yeah, stuff not just moving,right?
But like moving a lot and far ina lot of stuff.
Or being pelted in the face by amarble that got tossed from

(01:08:39):
somewhere.

SPEAKER_04 (01:08:40):
That was a Lego.

SPEAKER_05 (01:08:42):
Either way.

SPEAKER_04 (01:08:43):
Um The marbles were hot.
Yeah, the marbles are hot.

SPEAKER_05 (01:08:46):
But I think the other thing too, though, is like
if you okay, if you want todiscount some of the stuff that
was happening, right?
The ones that doesn't make anysense is what about the arm
coming from the drapes?

SPEAKER_02 (01:09:00):
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (01:09:00):
And those things that they have photographic
evidence of things, unlesseverybody's in on a hoax.

SPEAKER_00 (01:09:07):
That'd be a lot of people.

SPEAKER_05 (01:09:09):
Be a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 (01:09:10):
Well, and the fact that I watched so many actual
interviews with theinvestigators and uh with the
reporters, and they were likejust as wanting to debunk things
as I am.
And when you watch them, theywere like, there were times when

(01:09:32):
um we would catch the girlsbending spoons on their own and
trying to create evidencebecause um newspapers and you
know uh news stations would comein and they would feel like they
had to be a monkey, like dancemonkey dance.

(01:09:54):
Right.
And they would have to makethings happen.
And so the girls did admit thatthere was a couple of times
where they felt like they had toperform because they didn't want
to be felt like they were liars.
Right.
So if nothing happened, thenthey didn't want to be look be
looked at as a liar.

(01:10:14):
And they're young.
And I can I I get that becausewhen I used to um take people on
investigations all the time, youreally feel like you have to
perform.
Like you feel like if you if youdon't make something happen,
then everybody's gonna bedisappointed and they're gonna
want to go home and leave.

SPEAKER_04 (01:10:35):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:10:35):
Or they're gonna say this was a terrible time.
But I never faked any evidence,but you really try as hard as
you can to get things to happen.
Yeah.
So that everybody has a goodtime and enjoys it.
And I can imagine when you'rethese two girls in this
situation, that there wereprobably a couple times where

(01:10:56):
they were like, Well, I don'tknow, what should we do?
And there are two young girlstrying to figure this out in a
problem that they shouldn't havebeen having to deal with in the
first place.
Right.

SPEAKER_05 (01:11:06):
And the other thing too, though, is when we think
about it, right?
So the Daily Mirror's there,they're doing their thing,
right?
But another newspaper comes in,they're only there for three
hours in an interview, nothinghappens, other girls are liars.
And they it's a joke, right?

SPEAKER_00 (01:11:25):
Did come to try to debunk.

SPEAKER_05 (01:11:26):
And then so they they go away, and now all of a
sudden they're liars, andeverything is false.
And so obviously, the you youwant people to believe you that
the real stuff is happening.
So you yeah, I can I could seetrying to fake stuff just to
just so people would take youserious with everything else.

SPEAKER_04 (01:11:47):
Well, yeah, and just given their age, too.

SPEAKER_05 (01:11:49):
Yeah.
It's one thing when you're 11and 13 doing it, it's another
thing when you're 40 years oldand doing it.

SPEAKER_00 (01:11:56):
Yeah.
Yeah, don't do it.
Yeah, because by the time it allended, it started when the mom
was 43, and so she wasforty-five when it ended.
And the kids were 11, 12, 13.
Ended when they were like 13 and15-ish.

SPEAKER_05 (01:12:17):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 (01:12:18):
Yeah.
Crazy stuff, man.

SPEAKER_05 (01:12:22):
Crazy stuff.
But if you guys enjoyed thisstory, which we really hope you
did, because this was a goodone.
Um please uh please like andsubscribe to us.
And as always, stay ghosty mypeeps.

SPEAKER_03 (01:12:41):
Hello.
Hello.
Yeah.

unknown (01:13:04):
Wow.

SPEAKER_03 (01:13:07):
Oh shit.
Oh, it's like me talking.

(01:15:24):
Like gonna come.
Come on.
Special window.
Yeah, back on the whole that I'mgonna.

(01:15:45):
Oh god.
Come on with the crowd, I goback to crab, Mr.
Crab, Mr.
Club Mr.

SPEAKER_01 (01:16:10):
Cross Mr.
Cross Quick Mr.
Gross! Oh, it's not like that.
She was not leaf.
She's not me.