January 6, 2025 • 43 mins
Welcome to the season 3 premiere of Pastor to Pastor! Join hosts Pastor Jason Watson (Cross Pointe Church, NC) and Pastor Seth Odom (Reliant Church, NC) as they dive into the theme of pursuing God's presence and living out true discipleship in 2025. This episode reflects on:
- Sermon Reviews: Insights into their New Year messages, including Pastor Jason's exploration of Ezekiel 47 and the progression into deeper waters of faith and God's presence.
- Fasting and Seeking God: Why fasting is more than a seasonal activity and how it aligns with discipleship.
- India Mission Reflections: Stories of powerful encounters with God’s presence overseas.
- Navigating Change: Pastor Seth's practical wisdom on trusting God through life's transitions.
Be inspired as they share heartfelt discussions on repentance, humility, and the importance of being a presence-driven church that seeks God's face above all else.
Don’t forget to like, share, and subscribe to stay updated on new episodes of Pastor to Pastor. Your support helps us bring these powerful discussions to a wider audience.
#PastorToPastor #GodsPresence #Discipleship #SermonReview #FaithJourney #ChurchLeadership #ChristianPodcast #HolySpirit #Ezekiel47 #SeekGod #MinistryLife #IndiaMission #NavigatingChange #PresenceDrivenChurch
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
I can't believe it.
It is another episode of Pastorto Pastor.
Here we are in season three.
Come on, man, pastor Seth man.
Look, hey, I'm Pastor Jason, ifyou're not familiar, pastor
Jason, crosspoint Church here inNorth Carolina.
Along with me, co-host PastorSeth Odom Reliant Church here in
North Carolina as well.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Look, we're so excited to be having the third
season can you believe thatwe're still friends at the third
season?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
man, I'll tell you hey, well, you know it is what
it is.
But uh, look, man, I think thisyear we've kind of talked about
it and kind of looked over somedifferent things and and and
knowing what we preach onsundays is just the kind of the
surface, I think, of what wereally are getting into with our
congregation anyway, havinglike a sermon review is really a
(00:54):
good thing to get into, and sothat's kind of what we talked
about doing for season three, atleast initially, is just kind
of doing some sermon reviews,kind of recapping, and digging a
little bit deeper into what wepreached on Sunday.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Yeah, there's some trending things that are
happening around the communityand things like that around the
world that impact people's lives.
We'll definitely add thosethings in there.
But it's kind of like you know,podcasting becomes this thing
that you manufacture, but whenyou do the sermon, reviews and
things, it's things that arealready on your heart, things
that God's already revealing,and we want to make it a little
(01:27):
more widespread than just ourcongregation, because I don't
know about you, but I think mysermons can help other people as
well.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Not just in my flock that God's entrusted me with,
but with other people as well.
I think.
The same thing with yoursermons.
I think you do all rightpreaching I do.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Okay, you know I do what I can you do.
What you do what you do, youcan do it.
Actually it's funny.
I preached today.
I said I'm not ferdick and I'mnot billy graham, I'm jason and
I'm just, I'm giving you whatgod has given.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Uh, and anyway it ain't coming from the
refrigerator, coming from therefrigerator.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
manual sermon centralcom you know what I'm
saying?
I ain't typing my sermon.
That's right, i'll'll tell youthat I hear you, no, man.
So let's kick it into gear, man.
Let's talk about how was yourholidays.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
It was good.
Yeah, I know that holidayseason gets like the Christmas.
It gets so hectic for peopleChristmas and New.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Year's, all this kind of stuff Especially.
Not only are you going toholiday events, but you know
when it comes to ministry,you're planning holiday events.
So now you're you're wide openduring the holiday season.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
Yep, all your teams are wanting to have their own
individual Christmas parties andgive stuff.
Yeah, I get it.
It's pretty hectic for the mostpart but as far as our family
and stuff, man, we had a greattime.
It wasn't hectic for us.
We kind of have our scheduleand our things that we do, that
we don't run ourselves to death.
But we had a great time.
Man had the family together andNew Year's.
(02:52):
I don't know about you but Ididn't party hard like you
probably did.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
I was in bed over like 10 o'clock.
You know what I'm saying.
I'm a little bit dude.
When the bedtime comes around,it comes around, and if I want
to be worth anything the nextday, I better go to bed when it
comes around.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
That's right.
You could have just took a dayoff, like you do any other day.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
You wake up and decide you don't want to go to
work.
I hear you Now what about you?
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Did you have a good time?
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Man, we had a great time Holiday season, full of
family man, full of of fun, butyeah, very busy but very blessed
.
That's that's how I pretty muchsum up.
Anytime somebody says how youdoing, we're busy, but we're
blessed, amen, and so that'sthat kind of wraps it up.
Man, we had a great time withfamily, great food, of course,
you know I like the food so youknow you do.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
You talk about food when you got in the studio yes,
yes, pizza, yeah, yeah, well youknow we're coming in out of all
the eating season and now mostministries are going into a
fasting season.
I wonder if that's by design.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Is it really because we're going into a new year, or
is it?
Just like you feel bad aboutthe gluttony you did from
Thanksgiving to Christmas.
Right yeah, Right.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
So our ministry, we're going to launch a
seven-day fast starting nextMonday, and we're excited about
that.
Teaching on fasting what's thepurpose of it?
Why prayer is strategicallyinvolved in fasting and really
fasting being a reality of that,we're not getting more of God,
we're giving God more of us sothat he can take the things that
(04:21):
we have and really make somechanges in our lives and stuff.
So is your ministry, you guys,guys, going through some fasting
and stuff.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Currently no, and I know that we're probably one of
the very few churches not likepushing a fast right now.
Man, look for me at the end oflast year and I can't believe
we're already saying last year,it's already what?
The 5th of 2025.
Yeah, christmas will be hereagain for you, you know it.
But going into the new year atthe end of last year, going into
(04:54):
this year, just God impressedupon me the importance of his
presence and seeking his faceand discipleship, and so our
focus for this current year andthere will be I'm trying to
create disciples in the sensethat it's not a seasonal thing
we do, but it's something that'sa part of our lifestyle, and so
that's kind of what I'm growing.
I was talking with anotherpastor, our worship leader, our
(05:14):
worship pastor Cedric.
We were talking this morningbefore service and I'm like I
don't want to be, I don't wantcross point, I don't want my own
life, I don't want us to belike a flash in the pan.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
We're hot one minute, the heat's off and we're cold
the next.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Like I, want to create like a slow burn, if
there's a if that's the only wayI can say it but create a
sustainable fire.
Where we are, we are constantlylike we're fasting all the time
, Not because it's it's the coolthing to do at 21, but because
it's a part of who we are.
Um, and so that's kind ofreally our focus.
We are focused right now on thepresence of God, seeking his
face, and that requires a fast.
I think we'll certainly hit itas we talk about discipleship
(05:51):
over 2025, which is the focusfor us is discipleship.
We'll talk about it, butcurrently that's a long way to
say no, we aren't starting aquote-unquote fast, but anyway
how about you?
Speaker 2 (06:01):
It's such an encouragement because when we
talked about this prepre-recording is that fasting
shouldn't be just one thing youdo at the beginning of the year
and then that's it.
Yeah, we, we need to be peopleof fasting once a month or
whatever.
What get get this continualfast going, um, and there's all
types of different fasting andwe're going to break that down
for our church of biblical fastand stuff like that, that.
(06:23):
But I think it's so importantas Christians that we, when you
talk about pursuing the presenceof God, some of the greatest
times and the strongest presenceyou could feel is in those
moments where you take awaythings that you've been chasing
every other day of the week andset aside and say, in that time
I'm going to be chasing afteryou, pursuing you in prayer and
worship.
So, yeah, I think it'simportant for all of us to
(06:44):
continue to fast, not just oncethe first year, but, hey, at
least 12 times a year.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
There's some type of fast happening in your life,
right right and we started doingthis thing called Friday Night
Fire.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Oh my God.
Well, you know something'sgoing to happen there.
You throw fire in there, fridayNight Fire.
In fact, we had Friday NightFire.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
We had it this past Friday yeah all the strangers we
had a decent turnout, you know,for the first one, but it was
quite interesting.
Some people showed up andthey're like I thought there was
going to be like a fire outsideand I said no, no, no, the
fire's on the inside.
That's right.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
So it's kind of comical.
You had the Pentecostal churchtoo.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
You had the Pentecostal church.
That's right.
But yeah, so we do.
And my encouragement to ourCrosspoint people here is that
when we especially I mean, thisis a one-time-a-month thing, but
I want you to do it all thetime but specifically what I'm
asking is, on the Friday nightfires, that those days you fast,
you pray, you seek the face ofGod.
So, when we come in here topray.
You know your mind is right andyou're focused, and so there are
(07:44):
times where we are preparingfor a fast, but, like I said,
man, I want this to become apart of our lifestyle and not
just something we do.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Yeah, I love it, man.
So let's talk about some sermoncontent.
Man, I know you're excited tokick off the first sermon of
2025.
You put the gas pedal down, son, and laid it down, right.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah, in fact, my head's still kind of hurting
from preaching earlier today.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
I hear you, let's hear about it, man.
What did you talk about?
Speaker 1 (08:09):
So, again, we were going into 2025, and our goal
really is to seek the face ofGod.
So for us, I kind of opened up.
I've been in this book calledGod Chasers and this is a very
it.
It's a.
I can't remember when it wasright I want to say 90s, written
in the 90s, so it's an olderbook and but, man, it is.
(08:31):
It is full of insight, it isfull of fire, and if you read
that book and it doesn't makeyou want to seek the face of god
more, then I don't know.
I don't know what it's to tellyou to read.
We need to put a link somewherefor these people yeah, we should
, but it was man, it was anawesome book and it really
gassed me up, I think, goinginto this because I already knew
(08:51):
discipleship was where we wereheaded Right and his presence
was where we were headed.
So this book hit at the righttime, the right nerves, the
right scriptures we needed and Ijust kind of pulled from it and
for this particular sermon andwe were going to went to Ezekiel
47, where he talks about theangel, or the angelic man, the
heavenly host, like carrying himto the front door of the temple
(09:13):
.
And from the temple was flowingthis, this living water.
And the further they went outinto the water, the it touched
the, the first his ankle, andthen he went a little bit
further, another thousand cubits, and it hit him in the knees
and then he went out anotherthousand cubits.
He was in water up to his waistand he went out another
thousand cubits to where it wasuncrossable because the flow,
(09:36):
the stream, the river was sostrong, the current was so
strong he said you couldn't passit.
And so what we were talkingabout was the presence of God
and how some people will stopwhen they dip their toe in the
water.
Some people will stop when theylet their ankles get in the
water, they'll stop at theirknees, they'll stop at their
waist, because we still havecontrol Right, because at that
(09:57):
point, at any moment, we stillhave our feet on the ground, we
still have our feet in the soil,so we can maneuver, we can back
out of the river if we want to,we can do whatever.
We're still in control.
But I said, what if a churchbecame so saturated with God?
We saw, we, we sought his faceso hard that we just jumped into
(10:18):
the river and allowed the Holyspirit to take us wherever he
desired for us to go.
And so that's really kind ofwhat I, in a quick sense man,
it's kind of what I was talkingabout today, about how we need
to be seeking the face of God,like in Romans 11.33,.
I'll read this real quick.
Hold on.
Let me hit him real quick withthe first one of the 2025.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
Come on back to Bible .
Speaker 1 (10:40):
Come on, somebody, give it to him, give it to him.
So in Romans 11, 33, Paul saysthis.
He says oh, the depth of theriches of both the wisdom and
the knowledge of God.
How unsearchable are hisjudgments and his ways past
finding out.
And that's really what I talkedabout.
I dug into the deep things ofGod, how we will stop at the
(11:03):
door.
We won't go in.
And even Jesus talks about someof the Pharisees You'll stand
in the door of salvation and youwon't let others enter in.
He calls them hypocrites.
And so I talk about how, whenGod shows up, when we get a
message in tongues, whensomeone's shouting, whatever the
case is, we stop right therebecause we think man, god's here
, and then we start looking forother signs or we start looking
(11:26):
for other gifts.
I said but push past the gifts,stop seeking the hands of God
and how he can minister to you,and seek the face of God and how
you can minister to him.
That's right and that's reallyman kind of.
The topic of today was how dowe do that?
Isaiah said this we talk aboutthe presence of God in services.
(11:46):
You remember India?
You remember that service inIndia where the presence of God
was so strong.
I haven't had a service beforeit like that, and I ain't had
one after like that.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
It was amazing.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
And for that lady, for me to have that vision of
Jesus standing behind that lady,and then for that lady to give
that message in tongues, thentranslate it in Telugu, for me
to have that vision of Jesusstanding behind that lady, and
then for that lady to give thatmessage in tongues, then
translate it in Telugu, for itto be translated to us, and then
another pastor come off thestage, come over and say I heard
exactly what she said, but heheard it in English, and then
translate it in English.
It's like we were in Acts.
(12:20):
Yeah, I mean, it was like waveafter wave after wave of God's
glory, just feeling the spacewhere we were.
I remember, pastor, that wewere concerned that the building
was on fire because we weresmelling smoke, and it wouldn't
have surprised us, I don't think, had we found the building on
(12:40):
fire because the presence of God.
I've never been in one of thoseservices, man, and I haven't
been since and I just, I wonder,I long really for the presence
of God in that capacity, because, even though we were scared, we
knew we were right, where wewere supposed to be, we were, we
were in the presence of thefather in that moment.
And I wonder?
(13:00):
I've wondered so oftentimes whydon't we experience that
anywhere else we go?
Why do we have to cross theocean to go to places that are
hungry and thirsty?
Why can't we be hungry andthirsty here?
Why can't we seek the face ofGod so strongly?
Because I'm telling you, ifpeople were to experience today
(13:22):
what we experience there, youwon't have to market your church
.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Yeah, the way they would approach the presence of
God would be completelydifferent.
Now, I'm not saying that we doit perfectly at all times when
it comes to approaching thepresence of God.
As pastors, we miss it all thetime.
But once you taste and see onceyou get involved in that.
There's always this hunger formore and honestly, it's like
kind of what you you're saying,it's like never satisfied here
(13:46):
because you've experienced itover there and it's like man,
we're missing it, like we thinkwe have these throw down
services where god is everywhere, but it's like it's not this,
not, even touch, dude.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
When in the presence of god it's like.
It's like isaiah said.
When isaiah comes into the, thevision in the presence of God,
he says he's like woe is me, forI'm a man of unclean lips.
In Isaiah 6, I covered thattoday.
Man, I talked about it inIsaiah 6, 1, where he said I saw
the Lord sitting on his throne,high and lifted up, and the
train of his robe filled thetemple.
(14:18):
His glory, his power, hissovereignty, his majesty filled
the temple.
And we skip down to verse 4.
It says and the posts of thedoor were shaken by the voice of
him who cried out and the housewas filled with smoke.
And then he says the firstthing that he notices in the
(14:39):
presence of God and I sharedthis in a sermon today it's not,
oh, I'm going to ask God thisor I'm going to ask God that.
No, the first thing that Isaiahnoticed was his sin and he's
like woe is me, for I'm a man ofunclean lips and, if you
remember, we've got an actualvideo clip and I don't have to
(15:00):
do some digging to find it.
But there are people at thealtar during that service and
they're screaming yes, say I,yes, say I, yes, say I.
They're screaming the name ofJesus in Telugu, because that's
what they witnessed.
They're asking for Jesusbecause the first thing you
notice is your sin when you'rein the presence of God, like
that.
And so, man, if we were toexperience the presence and it's
(15:27):
still filtered, because youknow there's no way we could be
in his full presence and live.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
But even if, man, if we could experience that, what
the house of God would be like?
Speaker 2 (15:39):
Yeah, I think some of our issues as the modern day
church is.
There's two key components thatwe need when we approach the
presence of God.
I believe one, that is,repentance.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
And that is humility.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
And we're in this trending and following grace
field all this stuff where wemake it about us Right, and when
you start making church andservices and the presence about
ourselves, we're very selfishpeople.
It's about us and not aboutChrist.
You're going to get thisfiltered version of the Holy
(16:13):
Spirit.
It's this manufactured is whatI like to say.
A lot of churches have, wherewhen I say manufactured, I mean
it's nothing but emotion.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
It's just nothing but hype.
It's nothing but just usbuilding ourselves up instead of
just humbling ourselves at thefeet of the Father and just
letting him minister to us.
That's the difference.
That's where we're missing it.
The humility, the repentance,the making it about Jesus.
Yes, say I, yes, say I.
All we want, all we need is you.
I don't care who is going topersecute me when I leave right
(16:43):
now, because they see meworshiping jesus here in this
church.
I don't care what who's aroundme I'm all I need is jesus right
now.
That's when you know that you'rein the right vein.
That's when you know you're inthe right place, when all you
care about is what jesus has foryou in that moment being in his
presence yeah, and that's thatour hearts not burned right when
(17:03):
we, when we heard him speak.
When he was with us, man, yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
And so, man, I go back to that moment.
I've been to that momentseveral times, thinking back
through it.
I remember, leading up to thatmoment, we weren't even going to
preach that night and you werelike no, we're here to preach,
I'll preach, you know so.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Y'all were like hey, we talked while you were down
there While you were in thebathroom.
Okay, I'll preach and Iremember I know y'all are tired,
but we'll preach and we wereexhausted.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
We were exhausted, that's what I was going to say I
don't know if you remember ornot, but yeah, you do.
We were so exhausted and we hadbeen there for a few days.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
So it's not like I.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
I think it was something in the spirit.
We were so tired.
And then, while I'm thinkingabout this, the other day it
came to me when Jesus was on thetop of the mountain of
transfiguration, the discipleswere doing what?
Sleeping, they were fallingasleep.
And when we were on the way tothat service, we were falling
(18:02):
asleep.
And so I don't know what is inthat.
I don't know.
There's something there, though.
There's some lines, somestrings.
I need to research in that.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
But yeah, I was the only saved that day.
Y'all were just sleeping and Iwas trying to embrace the
presence of the Lord.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yeah, but you remember, man, our buddy's nose
just started pouring blood inthe middle of the service.
We had to leave because hisnose wouldn't, and so when you
get in the presence of God likethat, you realize all this.
We stop at the gifts, man.
We stop at the gifts and welook for his hands and the gifts
that he has us instead ofseeking his face, man, I don't
(18:40):
know If we could have bottledthat up that day and brought it
back here and shared with people.
It would have it for me,solidified that we don't have.
We think we know who God is,but he is just too indescribable
.
He's too powerful, he's toosovereign, he's too holy.
We cannot begin to fully fathomand understand the power of
(19:03):
Yahweh, the power of God that weserve.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Amen, yeah, we need it.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
But man, that's what we talked about.
We just hit on that and nottalked about what being in the
flow does for people.
Basically, when you get furtherin Ezekiel 47, he says when I
return, talking about along theriverbanks, he said there were
many trees on one side and onthe other.
And he said to me, the waterflows toward the eastern region,
(19:28):
goes down the valley and entersinto the sea.
When it touches the sea sea,its waters are healed and it
shall be, uh, that every livingthing that moves wherever the
river goes will live.
I told people today you knowwhat, if you want a healing,
your healings in his presence.
If you need a, if you need ablessing financially, your that
(19:48):
blessing is wrapped up in hispresence.
And so, instead of seeking thehealings, instead of seeking the
blessings, instead of seekingthose things, seek his face seek
him, because those things comewith him but they're not him.
There are benefits and blessingsto being tapped into the vine,
and blessings that come with theHoly Spirit, but the blessings
(20:11):
are just a byproduct of hispresence.
Let's seek his presence andthen let's go further.
Let's go from his presence andbe like Moses and let me see
your glory.
Take me from here to there,from glory to glory, from faith
to faith.
And I didn't even share this,so you're getting a little extra
, but I prayed, man, I'm likeLord.
What is 1,000 cubits?
Why are we measuring?
(20:32):
Why are we measuring?
Why are we measuring?
Because it's a measure of faith.
You go further in faith andfurther in faith and further in
faith, and to the point whereyou're like.
You know, you're like SmithWigglesworth.
Everybody thinks crazy, buthe's operating at a level and
he's in the presence of God, ata level that nobody else is,
because he's operating in thatmeasure of faith, that gift.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
It's that gift of faith.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
Are you trying to make me that?
Speaker 2 (20:54):
might be when you reach the gift of faith.
Hey, come on man.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
Yeah, yeah yeah, you know, I'm tethered here on a
cord, I can't go so far.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
So don't get me gassed up anymore.
Don't leave me now.
Don't take a lap around thechurch while we're here.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
But anyway, man, that's been our vision.
That was a sermon today.
This is our vision going into2025.
I'd love to tell you, man, thatthe walls fell and that
everybody was slain in thespirit and God showed up, but
his presence it was almost likelighting a match.
I can't tell you that we wereengulfed by any stretch by any
means compared to thatexperience that we had in India,
(21:29):
but I'm starting to realizethat it's like John Wesley said.
He said I will set myself onfire and others can come and
watch me burn.
And that's where I'm at.
I'm seeking the face of God sohard this year that people may
think I'm crazy.
People can think whatever theywant to think.
At the end of the day, we haveto stand before God.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
And none of these people looking at us will be
there with us, and so thebeautiful thing about his
presence, jay, is that yourexperience in his presence can
change based off the need andbased on where you are
spiritually.
There are moments in hispresence where all I do is cry.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
Right.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
All I do is just embrace him.
There's moments where all I dois just talk.
There's moments where I'm justsilent, I'm just listening.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
There's moments where I'm just silent, I'm just
listening.
There's moments where I'm justfired up.
What you're talking about,there's no cookie-cutter way
when you're in the presence.
This is what happens Because Godlooks at the individual.
There's different ways that thepresence is expressed to you,
based on your need, and so Iwant to encourage you.
Pastor Jason's encouraging hiscongregation, we want to
encourage you today to startseeking the face of the Father.
Seek his presence.
Pastor Jason said the blessingsare found in his presence.
(22:39):
Don't just go look for theblessing.
Actually, the blessing is hispresence.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Absolutely.
Who is the man that you aremindful of him?
Speaker 2 (22:47):
He is our reward yeah , who is the man that you are
mindful of, him, that you wouldeven consider dwelling with us?
That is the blessing, right.
And we know that the greatestblessing we have is that God is
with us at all times, that hispresence is tangible at times
where we can feel him and sensehim in the midst of our troubles
.
Seek him today, yeah, pursuehis presence.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
In the book of Exodus and I think it's chapter 20,
because in one verse, a fewchapters before, they're told
not to go to the mountain.
But a little bit further inchapter 20, there's an
opportunity where the peoplehave an option with Moses.
When God descends on themountain and there's a cloud,
there's thunder and there'slightning, there's all these
different things where theycould go and see God, where they
(23:28):
could go on the mountain and gosee God, they get scared and
they send Moses.
They're like no, no, no, no, no, you do the talking for us.
We're going to stay back herewhere it's safe and safely
distant from God.
But man, look, I'm encouragingour people that when God shows
up, we run in, we run into hisglory, we don't run away.
That's right, and so, man,that's kind of a nutshell of
(23:50):
what I preached on today.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
I love it, man, that's good.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
Yeah, so that's where we're headed in.
2025 is right now.
We're talking over all the yearabout discipleship, becoming
true disciples of Christ.
We had a leadership meetingright after, and that was my
question to them Like what areas?
When you think of a disciple,what does that remind you of?
What comes to mind when I saydisciple?
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
And then, where are you in your discipleship?
What are you lacking?
To be like Peter.
What are you lacking to be likePaul?
Speaker 2 (24:17):
I got a question for you.
Go ahead.
Okay, you know most churches.
When you look on their websiteor you look up who they are,
their vision and things likethat, you'll see this phrase a
presence-driven church.
What defines a presence-drivenchurch?
What defines a presence-drivenchurch?
I know I'm throwing thisquestion to you off the cuff,
(24:38):
but you're in a topic ofpresence and what your church is
pursuing.
What defines a church being apresence-driven church?
Speaker 1 (24:47):
And I would assume and then I don't know, because I
can't think of any websitesthat I've seen any churches say
that.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
But when I hear presence through— Well, I ain't
about to call them out, but theyare there.
Well, I don't know man, I don'tknow because— you see it a lot
in the charismatic churches.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
I would say, because they would think that it's a
spirit-led or a church, anapostolic kind of.
We speak in tongues, we do this, we do that, and so all the
gifts, shema.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Lema Ding Dong.
We believe.
Well, easy now.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
We believe in the gifts right, but I would assume
that that's what they mean.
It's really more of a giftingchurch than it is a spiritually
gifting church.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
So what would define a church to actually be a
presence-driven church?
What does that church look like?
Speaker 1 (25:35):
I think to me, man, when I think of a
presence-driven church, it's achurch where we create space to
let God do what God wants to do.
Amen, when I have an outline.
But you know what?
I'm going to stand here until Ifeel God move.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
You don't give him room, you give him the room, the
room exactly.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Yeah, to me, me, that's a presence driven church.
Yeah, and, and, and.
When we closed that 2024, Itold him things are going to
probably look different 2025because and not to say that we
don't have, uh, an outline, andnot to say that we don't come in
with a plan, but at any givenmoment I told him this if god
doesn't show up, we might aswell not show up.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Might as well, go home, son.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
Yeah, because if he doesn't show up we are wasting
our time.
And even if the gifts show up,dude, I have seen people man
wallow around in the floor andtalk about, oh man, that was a
service that was good, and thengo and start gossiping at lunch
(26:31):
about somebody that is not you.
The presence of god changes us.
We will never be the samebecause of that service we were
in right and, and we will neverbe the same because christ lives
in us.
But when, man, when you are,when you are, when you truly
enter the raw, real presence ofgod, man, man, when you have a
(26:51):
true encounter, it changes whoyou are.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Yeah, amen.
And the reason I ask thatquestion is because I know that
people are still looking forchurches and looking for
ministries and I wanted them tobe able to determine what—we're
talking about the presence, whenyou see that I'm a
presence-driven church be ableto determine what is the true
presence of God, what are welooking for?
What determines that?
And just give people someclarity of what we mean by that.
(27:15):
It's not just the giftsoperating and people shouting,
but it is people who are humblycoming to the presence of God,
pursuing him, giving him theroom to do whatever.
It is Unapologetically Right.
Don't apologize for anythingthat the Lord does that
interrupts the service.
Because here's the truth we arevery limited in our own self
but we give space to the HolySpirit to lead us in moments God
(27:37):
can do the impossible, in thepeople that come to these
services.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
In my prayer, man, even last night, this morning
it's like God if you don't do itthrough me, do it through
somebody.
Come on, what's that?
Speaker 2 (27:46):
song, whatever you're doing in this season.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
Don't do it without me.
They ain't heard the real goodverse.
They ain't heard.
Yeah, that's right, I love it,man.
But, brother, tell me, man,tell me, that's a little bit
about crosspoint.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
I don't know if we need to hear my sermon boy,
that's what I'm talking about,but anyway, yeah, I'll tell you
briefly what we're at right now.
You know we were.
This is the season of changeit's the season of transition.
Everybody's got a New Year'sresolution.
I tell our church January 1,we'll start resolutions and
January 4, we'll figure out thatwe are powerless and we will
break them all.
(28:22):
And it's a season of change andeverybody's making these
commitments and stuff.
So we're going on a seriescalled Navigating Change and I
hit five points of change and uh, I hit five points of of change
and things, and uh, becausewhat we know to be true is that
change is going to happen ineverybody's life, whether it's
good, it's bad, it's ugly.
Change is going to happen and,um, uh, the one thing I said
(28:43):
you've got to look for god andchange every change that is
happening in your life.
Look for god in it, god, whatare you teaching me?
What are you showing me?
What is the things that arehappening in my life that you
are part of?
And let me see you in it?
Jeremiah 29, 13 says that ifyou look for me in earnest, you
will find me.
When you seek me, earnest meansto long for or to with
(29:06):
intensity.
So if I'm looking for you ineverything of my life, I'm going
to find you.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
Right, that's being intentional.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Yeah, if you look for Jesus, you'll find him in
everything, and so we talkedabout that.
Second thing we talked aboutwas asking God for wisdom While
changes are happening andtransitions are happening in
your life.
Ask God for wisdom.
Ask God for wisdom.
What am I missing here?
You know the things that youdidn't plan, the things you
didn't want, the things thathappened just out of the blue.
(29:32):
You have to say this to theLord what are you wanting me to
get out of this situation?
That is wisdom asking God.
Don't let me miss, don't let mewaste this situation.
Let me see what it is thatyou're trying to do, and you
know, when you ask for wisdom,what you're really doing is
you've got to change the way youthink.
This is how I put it.
To our congregation, I said todo what you've never done.
(29:55):
You've got to think like you'venever thought.
Right, the renewing of the mind, are you?
transformed by the renewing ofyour mind, because what we know
is, every action that takesplace was a thought first,
(30:20):
no-transcript, and we have aproblem with somebody or a
situation.
Why are we going to the worldto get opinion Right?
Why are we going to people whoare unbelievers trying to get
their opinion about things thatChristians are going through?
Speaker 1 (30:36):
Yeah, yeah, because you no longer take your
instruction from the world.
You take your instructions fromGod.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
From his word.
So how does that?
Should be the question.
How does the word say I shouldhandle this?
Yep?
That's the renewing of yourmind.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Absolutely.
And so when you're seekingwisdom from the Lord, you'll
always look at things, thesesituations wrong.
I mean from the world.
You look at the situationswrong, but when you ask wisdom
from the Father, he'll give youa clear line, a clear sight of
why this is happening this way,to see beyond what your flesh
can see.
And you've got to change theway you think.
Be Christlike in your thoughts.
(31:07):
Your thoughts become actions.
Before you said the thing youshould have said, before you
done the thing you should havedone, all those things were a
thought first Right and let's behonest, we are horrible judges
sometimes at what really is theproblem.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Sometimes we are worried about the symptoms of
what we see and not the sourceof what we see.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
That's right.
Well, you can preach that thinga little bit.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
I preached it, don't you worry.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
I laid it down.
You, I laid it down, you get alittle you get a toddler version
of this thing, that's right.
And so then I said the thirdpoint was don't ask why, but ask
what.
Don't ask why, why is thequestion of explanation what?
Speaker 1 (31:46):
is the question of education.
God, what are you teaching?
Speaker 2 (31:47):
me in this situation, in this change that I'm going
through right now.
What are you teaching me?
It's an opportunity for us togrow in every situation, when
you're not questioning why, butyou're questioning okay, god,
what?
Because we know God doesn'twaste anything the good, the bad
, the ugly, all those things Goddoes not waste.
And so you've got to ask Godwhat is it that you're trying to
(32:10):
teach me in these moments righthere?
And you know, here's the truthYou'll either grow bitter or
you'll grow better, and a lot ofpeople are spending their whole
life trying to change oneletter.
Yeah, bitter, from bitter tobetter, right, and you waste
your whole life trying to changethat one letter because you
look at it the wrong way.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Well, eyes, the bitter is looking at eye,
exactly Right.
Speaker 2 (32:32):
Exactly.
Look at you preaching my sermonhey come on somebody and the way
you respond would determinewhether or not you'll grow from
it or it'll take things from you.
So what we don't need to focuson is the circumstances.
You've got to focus on yourcharacter.
I'm going to read this verbatimwhat I taught our church Don't
(32:56):
focus on the problem.
Focus on your personality.
Don't focus on the other person.
Focus on your response.
Don't focus on what's going onaround you.
Focus on what God is doing inand through you.
That's the difference when youview change in a way that it's
not the why, it's the what.
What am I trying to learn?
We talked about learningthrough contentment.
We talked about learning fromcharacter.
Because here's the truth bynature, you're content with
yourself.
You think about yourself.
(33:17):
It's not your nature to becontent.
It's natural for you to onlycare about you.
And so I'm not by naturecontent.
You're not by nature content.
By nature, I want to take careof my needs.
I'm not thinking about you, I'mthinking about me.
I'm thinking about my needs, myhurts, my pains, my wants, my
desires.
I could care less about youbecause life is about me.
(33:40):
That's naturally.
But when you give your life toChrist, god changed what is
natural fleshly and now putskingdom fruit in you.
That makes you now change theway you think and change the way
that you act.
So we talked about that andcharacter learning to care what
your character is.
And we talked through that howchange exposes our character.
(34:03):
People say when you get money,it exposes who you were in the
very beginning.
Character.
Situations expose yourcharacter, how you respond,
where you are with the lord andum.
So we talked through that andthen we, we hit, we hit with two
more.
We said become a promisedperson.
Again, we're talking aboutchange.
(34:23):
How do we navigate throughchange?
And with situations that wedon't like things, we didn't
plan things, we didn't uh, itjust happened, whether it was
because of a person or we lost ajob, what those things are
become a promise for a person.
Don't focus on the situation.
Focus on what never changes andwhat never changes.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
God.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
God.
There are three things that arefound in Jesus that doesn't
change.
It is God's love, it's God'spromises and it's God's purposes
for you.
None of those things change,and so, when you focus on the
things that do not change, whatis changing around you doesn't
change you Right, because you'refocusing your identity on
Christ.
Your purpose is in Christ.
(35:03):
Christ is love for you.
All those things are yes andamen, and we went through a list
.
I don't know if our listenersknow this, but there are more
than 7,000 promises in the Biblefor you and I.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Let's go ahead and hit number one.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
All right number one Number 6,790.
That's been a long podcast, bro.
My wife called me.
Where are you?
Speaker 1 (35:24):
at.
Speaker 2 (35:24):
Hey, I'm only on 1,287.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
We only got 5,000 more to go, yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
And so I talked about how you can bank on the
promises of God.
And so I talked about how youcould bank on the promises of
God.
But you know, when I talkedabout change, one thing that I
really hit on change that Ireally believe really steps on
people's toes it stepped on mineas well is that when change
comes, what happens is you havean issue with a person or you
(35:50):
have a problem with thissituation.
Instead of looking inward onwhat God is trying to do with me
, you're always trying to pointand blame the other person.
And I talked about this.
I said the reason why many ofus go through the same cycle of
problems.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
It's a victim mindset yeah it's a victim mindset.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
I talked about not being a victim, but be a victor,
and I said the world is full ofvictims.
Be a victor, right, yeah?
And so what happens is you gothrough this cycle of the same
problems.
Let's just think logically,pastor Jay.
If you have the same problemwith multiple people, you can't
keep blaming people.
That's right.
You've got to look inwardly.
(36:26):
This is where you look at thewisdom of God.
Okay, god, what?
Speaker 1 (36:30):
is it.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
So if I'm going through the same cycle of the
same problems, I need to startasking okay, what about me?
God's trying to change and thereason why we go through the
same cycle of problems isbecause we're yet to change in
the problem.
We're yet to actually lookinward.
Well, we've heard the story ofthis preacher who has preached
the same sermon for four weeksin a row and his congregation
says why in the world are youpreaching the same sermon?
(36:53):
He said well, when I see thatyou've actually understood and
got this sermon, I'll changewhat I'm preaching.
But you haven't got it yet.
That's the same thing, thatsometimes I think You're going
through the same cycle of thingsbecause you haven't learned
anything from it.
There's been no change in youat all, and so we've got to
mature as Christians,spiritually mature.
Look at our situationsdifferent.
(37:14):
Don't have this.
Woe is me mentality.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
One thing my dad always taught, and he's not a
theologian by any stretch.
But one thing he did say andwhen we're talking about you
said, think of it logically isone thing he always said was, if
everybody around you is theproblem, then everybody around
you is not the problem.
And so at that point you needto look inside and say, okay, am
I the problem?
Yeah, and so at that point youneed to look inside and say,
okay, am I the problem?
Where am I not growing in what?
Where?
What area of my life do I needto grow in?
Speaker 2 (37:41):
yep so anyway yeah, yep, and so the last thing that
we talked about was no matterwhat trust in god and, uh, I
talked about the journey of ofbeing in ministry for 12 years.
Church planning is not what Ithought it was.
Being a Church planning is notwhat I thought it was being a
lead pastor is not what Ithought it was, the stresses all
the things that you walkthrough in leadership and in
(38:01):
ministry.
You just never know what oneweek's going to be like.
And I talked about the weightof it I said but what I know to
be true is that God knew allthis before.
God had a plan.
We can trust God, no matterwhat we face, no matter what we
come in, God has a plan.
God has ordered our steps.
The Bible says he delights inthose steps and so he has
(38:23):
ordered those steps.
And when he's ordered our stepsand we know that, whether it's
good, it's bad, it's ugly Godhas been in it.
He's graces for.
Okay, God, I can trust you, nomatter what, because I know
you've got a plan.
I may not understand it, I maynot see it right now, but when I
look back from years ago, I canlook back all over my life and
see, okay, God had a purpose.
God used that situation forthis and it made me stronger.
(38:43):
And so we talked about nomatter what, you trust in God.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
No matter the situation, no matter the changes
that are happening in your life.
I don't know if man, and maybeI don't know if many, and maybe
I haven't talked to enough ofthem, I don't know, but I don't
know of any pastors that I canthink of that if I went and sat
down and said, do you feel likeyou're qualified to do what you
do?
I don't know many of them thatsay, yeah, man, I'm ready.
Yeah, woohoo.
It requires you to depend onthe Lord.
Oh, for sure it requires you tosubmit to him and say Lord, this
(39:14):
is too heavy for me, because itis, it's got to be done by God.
I told somebody we had ameeting with a nice couple who's
been coming to the church for awhile now.
I wanted to sit down with themand do some one-on-one and so we
met Anna and I met with them atStarbucks yesterday and this is
Sunday, we're recording.
So we met with them Saturdayand we were talking.
I said I've done lawenforcement for almost 20 years
(39:35):
and pastoring is way harder.
It is so much harder.
And even when you're theassociate pastor, if you were on
the board, if you were Sundayschool superintendent, it don't
matter what you'll be, I've hadthem all right and I'm telling
you you are not prepared forpastoring until you are in the
seat of pastor.
Oh yeah, and then you even man.
(39:56):
I think Mark Anthony preachedit perfectly.
It is what did he say?
Sweet slavery.
It is a calling.
God calls you to this.
If you do this for money, ifyou do this for fame, if you do
this for any other reason thanit being a calling, you are
going to fail.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
Oh yeah.
Because none of those reasonsare good enough to do it yep, I
had a guy come up to me a fewfew months ago.
He uh had some questions andthings about the church and just
he was like he started offsaying he said, listen, I know
you have the hardest job on theplanet yeah and then he said I
think teachers have the secondhardest.
he said, but you know, I don't.
I would never be able to dowhat you do.
He said I think teachers havethe second hardest.
(40:34):
He said, but you know, I wouldnever be able to do what you do,
he said.
So don't take this as criticism.
I'm just trying to learn andunderstand and, you know, put a
perspective in me, because Ireally never thought of it that
way.
It's the hardest job on theplanet, but you know, the more I
think about it, man, Well, Ithink it's like this.
Speaker 1 (40:50):
It's pretty tough.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
I think it's like this.
It's pretty tough.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
It is man and I think it's like this man when God
puts a flock under you andyou're the under shepherd.
You're trying to marry God'swill and God's presence with
people and you're constantlytrying to connect those two,
your conduit between those two,and it's like having a family
that you see better in than theysee in themselves.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
You want more for them than they want for
themselves.
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (41:19):
And it's just like you're trying to connect those
two ends, but you're just oneman.
Speaker 2 (41:26):
And you can't give everybody a knuckle sandwich or
nothing.
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
I said we should bring back the pasta's paddle.
That's right, yeah, that'sright, but anyway, yeah that was
our sermon.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
We got one more part for this three-part series, but
I'm super excited for wherewe're at as a church and where
we're at as a body of Christ.
Speaker 1 (41:47):
So, yep, yeah, I'm looking forward to maybe us
getting to partner on someprojects this year and doing
some things, some joint servicesor something.
Man, I think it'd be great.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
I can't wait to lay you out on the altar.
Hope you got a big boy to catchme now.
Your holy ghost hurt Anyway,heavy holy hands.
Brother, if you're good, we'regoing to bless them and send
them on their way.
Speaker 1 (42:08):
Hey you know how we do here at Crosspoint.
We like to wrap up with givingyou the priestly blessing.
Speaker 2 (42:13):
Well, that is not Crosspoint, okay.
This is pastor to pastor.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
Oh yeah, it is we at Crosspoint.
Speaker 2 (42:18):
Look at him.
He's shouting out his church.
You know what we like to do Areliant church.
Oh, we're at the reliance.
Okay, at 15501.
Speaker 1 (42:27):
Yeah, no.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
In fact it's funny because, bro, I say Crosspoint
point so much.
I went to your church, waspreaching.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
It was like here at cross point and they were like
oh, yeah, I'm at reliance.
Speaker 2 (42:42):
I was in india.
It was like not jason up here,cross pointians right, I love it
.
Speaker 1 (42:44):
Brother, let's bless you here on the pastor, the
pastor how about that?
Yeah, we read from numbers uh 6, 24 through 26.
It says the lord bless you andkeep you.
The lord make his face shineupon you and be gracious to you.
The Lord lift up his countenanceupon you and give you peace
amen hey, we're so grateful thatyou have tuned in today, that
you decide to listen, look like,share, follow, subscribe,
(43:07):
whatever it is, look and sharethis with people, because
there's no doubt if this blessedyou, this will certainly bless
other people.
Hey, but join us again nexttime on the next episode,
episode two, season three pastof the past past of the past.
God bless you, guys.
I can't believe it.
It is another episode of Pastorto Pastor.
Here we are in season three.
Come on, man, pastor Seth man.
Look, hey, I'm Pastor Jason, ifyou're not familiar, pastor
Jason, crosspoint Church here inNorth Carolina.
Along with me, co-host PastorSeth Odom Reliant Church here in
North Carolina as well.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Look, we're so excited to be having the third
season can you believe thatwe're still friends at the third
season?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
man, I'll tell you hey, well, you know it is what
it is.
But uh, look, man, I think thisyear we've kind of talked about
it and kind of looked over somedifferent things and and and
knowing what we preach onsundays is just the kind of the
surface, I think, of what wereally are getting into with our
congregation anyway, havinglike a sermon review is really a
(00:54):
good thing to get into, and sothat's kind of what we talked
about doing for season three, atleast initially, is just kind
of doing some sermon reviews,kind of recapping, and digging a
little bit deeper into what wepreached on Sunday.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Yeah, there's some trending things that are
happening around the communityand things like that around the
world that impact people's lives.
We'll definitely add thosethings in there.
But it's kind of like you know,podcasting becomes this thing
that you manufacture, but whenyou do the sermon, reviews and
things, it's things that arealready on your heart, things
that God's already revealing,and we want to make it a little
(01:27):
more widespread than just ourcongregation, because I don't
know about you, but I think mysermons can help other people as
well.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Not just in my flock that God's entrusted me with,
but with other people as well.
I think.
The same thing with yoursermons.
I think you do all rightpreaching I do.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Okay, you know I do what I can you do.
What you do what you do, youcan do it.
Actually it's funny.
I preached today.
I said I'm not ferdick and I'mnot billy graham, I'm jason and
I'm just, I'm giving you whatgod has given.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Uh, and anyway it ain't coming from the
refrigerator, coming from therefrigerator.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
manual sermon centralcom you know what I'm
saying?
I ain't typing my sermon.
That's right, i'll'll tell youthat I hear you, no, man.
So let's kick it into gear, man.
Let's talk about how was yourholidays.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
It was good.
Yeah, I know that holidayseason gets like the Christmas.
It gets so hectic for peopleChristmas and New.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Year's, all this kind of stuff Especially.
Not only are you going toholiday events, but you know
when it comes to ministry,you're planning holiday events.
So now you're you're wide openduring the holiday season.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
Yep, all your teams are wanting to have their own
individual Christmas parties andgive stuff.
Yeah, I get it.
It's pretty hectic for the mostpart but as far as our family
and stuff, man, we had a greattime.
It wasn't hectic for us.
We kind of have our scheduleand our things that we do, that
we don't run ourselves to death.
But we had a great time.
Man had the family together andNew Year's.
(02:52):
I don't know about you but Ididn't party hard like you
probably did.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
I was in bed over like 10 o'clock.
You know what I'm saying.
I'm a little bit dude.
When the bedtime comes around,it comes around, and if I want
to be worth anything the nextday, I better go to bed when it
comes around.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
That's right.
You could have just took a dayoff, like you do any other day.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
You wake up and decide you don't want to go to
work.
I hear you Now what about you?
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Did you have a good time?
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Man, we had a great time Holiday season, full of
family man, full of of fun, butyeah, very busy but very blessed
.
That's that's how I pretty muchsum up.
Anytime somebody says how youdoing, we're busy, but we're
blessed, amen, and so that'sthat kind of wraps it up.
Man, we had a great time withfamily, great food, of course,
you know I like the food so youknow you do.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
You talk about food when you got in the studio yes,
yes, pizza, yeah, yeah, well youknow we're coming in out of all
the eating season and now mostministries are going into a
fasting season.
I wonder if that's by design.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Is it really because we're going into a new year, or
is it?
Just like you feel bad aboutthe gluttony you did from
Thanksgiving to Christmas.
Right yeah, Right.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
So our ministry, we're going to launch a
seven-day fast starting nextMonday, and we're excited about
that.
Teaching on fasting what's thepurpose of it?
Why prayer is strategicallyinvolved in fasting and really
fasting being a reality of that,we're not getting more of God,
we're giving God more of us sothat he can take the things that
(04:21):
we have and really make somechanges in our lives and stuff.
So is your ministry, you guys,guys, going through some fasting
and stuff.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Currently no, and I know that we're probably one of
the very few churches not likepushing a fast right now.
Man, look for me at the end oflast year and I can't believe
we're already saying last year,it's already what?
The 5th of 2025.
Yeah, christmas will be hereagain for you, you know it.
But going into the new year atthe end of last year, going into
(04:54):
this year, just God impressedupon me the importance of his
presence and seeking his faceand discipleship, and so our
focus for this current year andthere will be I'm trying to
create disciples in the sensethat it's not a seasonal thing
we do, but it's something that'sa part of our lifestyle, and so
that's kind of what I'm growing.
I was talking with anotherpastor, our worship leader, our
(05:14):
worship pastor Cedric.
We were talking this morningbefore service and I'm like I
don't want to be, I don't wantcross point, I don't want my own
life, I don't want us to belike a flash in the pan.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
We're hot one minute, the heat's off and we're cold
the next.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Like I, want to create like a slow burn, if
there's a if that's the only wayI can say it but create a
sustainable fire.
Where we are, we are constantlylike we're fasting all the time
, Not because it's it's the coolthing to do at 21, but because
it's a part of who we are.
Um, and so that's kind ofreally our focus.
We are focused right now on thepresence of God, seeking his
face, and that requires a fast.
I think we'll certainly hit itas we talk about discipleship
(05:51):
over 2025, which is the focusfor us is discipleship.
We'll talk about it, butcurrently that's a long way to
say no, we aren't starting aquote-unquote fast, but anyway
how about you?
Speaker 2 (06:01):
It's such an encouragement because when we
talked about this prepre-recording is that fasting
shouldn't be just one thing youdo at the beginning of the year
and then that's it.
Yeah, we, we need to be peopleof fasting once a month or
whatever.
What get get this continualfast going, um, and there's all
types of different fasting andwe're going to break that down
for our church of biblical fastand stuff like that, that.
(06:23):
But I think it's so importantas Christians that we, when you
talk about pursuing the presenceof God, some of the greatest
times and the strongest presenceyou could feel is in those
moments where you take awaythings that you've been chasing
every other day of the week andset aside and say, in that time
I'm going to be chasing afteryou, pursuing you in prayer and
worship.
So, yeah, I think it'simportant for all of us to
(06:44):
continue to fast, not just oncethe first year, but, hey, at
least 12 times a year.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
There's some type of fast happening in your life,
right right and we started doingthis thing called Friday Night
Fire.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Oh my God.
Well, you know something'sgoing to happen there.
You throw fire in there, fridayNight Fire.
In fact, we had Friday NightFire.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
We had it this past Friday yeah all the strangers we
had a decent turnout, you know,for the first one, but it was
quite interesting.
Some people showed up andthey're like I thought there was
going to be like a fire outsideand I said no, no, no, the
fire's on the inside.
That's right.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
So it's kind of comical.
You had the Pentecostal churchtoo.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
You had the Pentecostal church.
That's right.
But yeah, so we do.
And my encouragement to ourCrosspoint people here is that
when we especially I mean, thisis a one-time-a-month thing, but
I want you to do it all thetime but specifically what I'm
asking is, on the Friday nightfires, that those days you fast,
you pray, you seek the face ofGod.
So, when we come in here topray.
You know your mind is right andyou're focused, and so there are
(07:44):
times where we are preparingfor a fast, but, like I said,
man, I want this to become apart of our lifestyle and not
just something we do.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Yeah, I love it, man.
So let's talk about some sermoncontent.
Man, I know you're excited tokick off the first sermon of
2025.
You put the gas pedal down, son, and laid it down, right.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah, in fact, my head's still kind of hurting
from preaching earlier today.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
I hear you, let's hear about it, man.
What did you talk about?
Speaker 1 (08:09):
So, again, we were going into 2025, and our goal
really is to seek the face ofGod.
So for us, I kind of opened up.
I've been in this book calledGod Chasers and this is a very
it.
It's a.
I can't remember when it wasright I want to say 90s, written
in the 90s, so it's an olderbook and but, man, it is.
(08:31):
It is full of insight, it isfull of fire, and if you read
that book and it doesn't makeyou want to seek the face of god
more, then I don't know.
I don't know what it's to tellyou to read.
We need to put a link somewherefor these people yeah, we should
, but it was man, it was anawesome book and it really
gassed me up, I think, goinginto this because I already knew
(08:51):
discipleship was where we wereheaded Right and his presence
was where we were headed.
So this book hit at the righttime, the right nerves, the
right scriptures we needed and Ijust kind of pulled from it and
for this particular sermon andwe were going to went to Ezekiel
47, where he talks about theangel, or the angelic man, the
heavenly host, like carrying himto the front door of the temple
(09:13):
.
And from the temple was flowingthis, this living water.
And the further they went outinto the water, the it touched
the, the first his ankle, andthen he went a little bit
further, another thousand cubits, and it hit him in the knees
and then he went out anotherthousand cubits.
He was in water up to his waistand he went out another
thousand cubits to where it wasuncrossable because the flow,
(09:36):
the stream, the river was sostrong, the current was so
strong he said you couldn't passit.
And so what we were talkingabout was the presence of God
and how some people will stopwhen they dip their toe in the
water.
Some people will stop when theylet their ankles get in the
water, they'll stop at theirknees, they'll stop at their
waist, because we still havecontrol Right, because at that
(09:57):
point, at any moment, we stillhave our feet on the ground, we
still have our feet in the soil,so we can maneuver, we can back
out of the river if we want to,we can do whatever.
We're still in control.
But I said, what if a churchbecame so saturated with God?
We saw, we, we sought his faceso hard that we just jumped into
(10:18):
the river and allowed the Holyspirit to take us wherever he
desired for us to go.
And so that's really kind ofwhat I, in a quick sense man,
it's kind of what I was talkingabout today, about how we need
to be seeking the face of God,like in Romans 11.33,.
I'll read this real quick.
Hold on.
Let me hit him real quick withthe first one of the 2025.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
Come on back to Bible .
Speaker 1 (10:40):
Come on, somebody, give it to him, give it to him.
So in Romans 11, 33, Paul saysthis.
He says oh, the depth of theriches of both the wisdom and
the knowledge of God.
How unsearchable are hisjudgments and his ways past
finding out.
And that's really what I talkedabout.
I dug into the deep things ofGod, how we will stop at the
(11:03):
door.
We won't go in.
And even Jesus talks about someof the Pharisees You'll stand
in the door of salvation and youwon't let others enter in.
He calls them hypocrites.
And so I talk about how, whenGod shows up, when we get a
message in tongues, whensomeone's shouting, whatever the
case is, we stop right therebecause we think man, god's here
, and then we start looking forother signs or we start looking
(11:26):
for other gifts.
I said but push past the gifts,stop seeking the hands of God
and how he can minister to you,and seek the face of God and how
you can minister to him.
That's right and that's reallyman kind of.
The topic of today was how dowe do that?
Isaiah said this we talk aboutthe presence of God in services.
(11:46):
You remember India?
You remember that service inIndia where the presence of God
was so strong.
I haven't had a service beforeit like that, and I ain't had
one after like that.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
It was amazing.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
And for that lady, for me to have that vision of
Jesus standing behind that lady,and then for that lady to give
that message in tongues, thentranslate it in Telugu, for me
to have that vision of Jesusstanding behind that lady, and
then for that lady to give thatmessage in tongues, then
translate it in Telugu, for itto be translated to us, and then
another pastor come off thestage, come over and say I heard
exactly what she said, but heheard it in English, and then
translate it in English.
It's like we were in Acts.
(12:20):
Yeah, I mean, it was like waveafter wave after wave of God's
glory, just feeling the spacewhere we were.
I remember, pastor, that wewere concerned that the building
was on fire because we weresmelling smoke, and it wouldn't
have surprised us, I don't think, had we found the building on
(12:40):
fire because the presence of God.
I've never been in one of thoseservices, man, and I haven't
been since and I just, I wonder,I long really for the presence
of God in that capacity, because, even though we were scared, we
knew we were right, where wewere supposed to be, we were, we
were in the presence of thefather in that moment.
And I wonder?
(13:00):
I've wondered so oftentimes whydon't we experience that
anywhere else we go?
Why do we have to cross theocean to go to places that are
hungry and thirsty?
Why can't we be hungry andthirsty here?
Why can't we seek the face ofGod so strongly?
Because I'm telling you, ifpeople were to experience today
(13:22):
what we experience there, youwon't have to market your church
.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Yeah, the way they would approach the presence of
God would be completelydifferent.
Now, I'm not saying that we doit perfectly at all times when
it comes to approaching thepresence of God.
As pastors, we miss it all thetime.
But once you taste and see onceyou get involved in that.
There's always this hunger formore and honestly, it's like
kind of what you you're saying,it's like never satisfied here
(13:46):
because you've experienced itover there and it's like man,
we're missing it, like we thinkwe have these throw down
services where god is everywhere, but it's like it's not this,
not, even touch, dude.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
When in the presence of god it's like.
It's like isaiah said.
When isaiah comes into the, thevision in the presence of God,
he says he's like woe is me, forI'm a man of unclean lips.
In Isaiah 6, I covered thattoday.
Man, I talked about it inIsaiah 6, 1, where he said I saw
the Lord sitting on his throne,high and lifted up, and the
train of his robe filled thetemple.
(14:18):
His glory, his power, hissovereignty, his majesty filled
the temple.
And we skip down to verse 4.
It says and the posts of thedoor were shaken by the voice of
him who cried out and the housewas filled with smoke.
And then he says the firstthing that he notices in the
(14:39):
presence of God and I sharedthis in a sermon today it's not,
oh, I'm going to ask God thisor I'm going to ask God that.
No, the first thing that Isaiahnoticed was his sin and he's
like woe is me, for I'm a man ofunclean lips and, if you
remember, we've got an actualvideo clip and I don't have to
(15:00):
do some digging to find it.
But there are people at thealtar during that service and
they're screaming yes, say I,yes, say I, yes, say I.
They're screaming the name ofJesus in Telugu, because that's
what they witnessed.
They're asking for Jesusbecause the first thing you
notice is your sin when you'rein the presence of God, like
that.
And so, man, if we were toexperience the presence and it's
(15:27):
still filtered, because youknow there's no way we could be
in his full presence and live.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
But even if, man, if we could experience that, what
the house of God would be like?
Speaker 2 (15:39):
Yeah, I think some of our issues as the modern day
church is.
There's two key components thatwe need when we approach the
presence of God.
I believe one, that is,repentance.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
And that is humility.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
And we're in this trending and following grace
field all this stuff where wemake it about us Right, and when
you start making church andservices and the presence about
ourselves, we're very selfishpeople.
It's about us and not aboutChrist.
You're going to get thisfiltered version of the Holy
(16:13):
Spirit.
It's this manufactured is whatI like to say.
A lot of churches have, wherewhen I say manufactured, I mean
it's nothing but emotion.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
It's just nothing but hype.
It's nothing but just usbuilding ourselves up instead of
just humbling ourselves at thefeet of the Father and just
letting him minister to us.
That's the difference.
That's where we're missing it.
The humility, the repentance,the making it about Jesus.
Yes, say I, yes, say I.
All we want, all we need is you.
I don't care who is going topersecute me when I leave right
(16:43):
now, because they see meworshiping jesus here in this
church.
I don't care what who's aroundme I'm all I need is jesus right
now.
That's when you know that you'rein the right vein.
That's when you know you're inthe right place, when all you
care about is what jesus has foryou in that moment being in his
presence yeah, and that's thatour hearts not burned right when
(17:03):
we, when we heard him speak.
When he was with us, man, yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
And so, man, I go back to that moment.
I've been to that momentseveral times, thinking back
through it.
I remember, leading up to thatmoment, we weren't even going to
preach that night and you werelike no, we're here to preach,
I'll preach, you know so.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Y'all were like hey, we talked while you were down
there While you were in thebathroom.
Okay, I'll preach and Iremember I know y'all are tired,
but we'll preach and we wereexhausted.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
We were exhausted, that's what I was going to say I
don't know if you remember ornot, but yeah, you do.
We were so exhausted and we hadbeen there for a few days.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
So it's not like I.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
I think it was something in the spirit.
We were so tired.
And then, while I'm thinkingabout this, the other day it
came to me when Jesus was on thetop of the mountain of
transfiguration, the discipleswere doing what?
Sleeping, they were fallingasleep.
And when we were on the way tothat service, we were falling
(18:02):
asleep.
And so I don't know what is inthat.
I don't know.
There's something there, though.
There's some lines, somestrings.
I need to research in that.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
But yeah, I was the only saved that day.
Y'all were just sleeping and Iwas trying to embrace the
presence of the Lord.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yeah, but you remember, man, our buddy's nose
just started pouring blood inthe middle of the service.
We had to leave because hisnose wouldn't, and so when you
get in the presence of God likethat, you realize all this.
We stop at the gifts, man.
We stop at the gifts and welook for his hands and the gifts
that he has us instead ofseeking his face, man, I don't
(18:40):
know If we could have bottledthat up that day and brought it
back here and shared with people.
It would have it for me,solidified that we don't have.
We think we know who God is,but he is just too indescribable
.
He's too powerful, he's toosovereign, he's too holy.
We cannot begin to fully fathomand understand the power of
(19:03):
Yahweh, the power of God that weserve.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Amen, yeah, we need it.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
But man, that's what we talked about.
We just hit on that and nottalked about what being in the
flow does for people.
Basically, when you get furtherin Ezekiel 47, he says when I
return, talking about along theriverbanks, he said there were
many trees on one side and onthe other.
And he said to me, the waterflows toward the eastern region,
(19:28):
goes down the valley and entersinto the sea.
When it touches the sea sea,its waters are healed and it
shall be, uh, that every livingthing that moves wherever the
river goes will live.
I told people today you knowwhat, if you want a healing,
your healings in his presence.
If you need a, if you need ablessing financially, your that
(19:48):
blessing is wrapped up in hispresence.
And so, instead of seeking thehealings, instead of seeking the
blessings, instead of seekingthose things, seek his face seek
him, because those things comewith him but they're not him.
There are benefits and blessingsto being tapped into the vine,
and blessings that come with theHoly Spirit, but the blessings
(20:11):
are just a byproduct of hispresence.
Let's seek his presence andthen let's go further.
Let's go from his presence andbe like Moses and let me see
your glory.
Take me from here to there,from glory to glory, from faith
to faith.
And I didn't even share this,so you're getting a little extra
, but I prayed, man, I'm likeLord.
What is 1,000 cubits?
Why are we measuring?
(20:32):
Why are we measuring?
Why are we measuring?
Because it's a measure of faith.
You go further in faith andfurther in faith and further in
faith, and to the point whereyou're like.
You know, you're like SmithWigglesworth.
Everybody thinks crazy, buthe's operating at a level and
he's in the presence of God, ata level that nobody else is,
because he's operating in thatmeasure of faith, that gift.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
It's that gift of faith.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
Are you trying to make me that?
Speaker 2 (20:54):
might be when you reach the gift of faith.
Hey, come on man.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
Yeah, yeah yeah, you know, I'm tethered here on a
cord, I can't go so far.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
So don't get me gassed up anymore.
Don't leave me now.
Don't take a lap around thechurch while we're here.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
But anyway, man, that's been our vision.
That was a sermon today.
This is our vision going into2025.
I'd love to tell you, man, thatthe walls fell and that
everybody was slain in thespirit and God showed up, but
his presence it was almost likelighting a match.
I can't tell you that we wereengulfed by any stretch by any
means compared to thatexperience that we had in India,
(21:29):
but I'm starting to realizethat it's like John Wesley said.
He said I will set myself onfire and others can come and
watch me burn.
And that's where I'm at.
I'm seeking the face of God sohard this year that people may
think I'm crazy.
People can think whatever theywant to think.
At the end of the day, we haveto stand before God.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
And none of these people looking at us will be
there with us, and so thebeautiful thing about his
presence, jay, is that yourexperience in his presence can
change based off the need andbased on where you are
spiritually.
There are moments in hispresence where all I do is cry.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
Right.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
All I do is just embrace him.
There's moments where all I dois just talk.
There's moments where I'm justsilent, I'm just listening.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
There's moments where I'm just silent, I'm just
listening.
There's moments where I'm justfired up.
What you're talking about,there's no cookie-cutter way
when you're in the presence.
This is what happens Because Godlooks at the individual.
There's different ways that thepresence is expressed to you,
based on your need, and so Iwant to encourage you.
Pastor Jason's encouraging hiscongregation, we want to
encourage you today to startseeking the face of the Father.
Seek his presence.
Pastor Jason said the blessingsare found in his presence.
(22:39):
Don't just go look for theblessing.
Actually, the blessing is hispresence.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Absolutely.
Who is the man that you aremindful of him?
Speaker 2 (22:47):
He is our reward yeah , who is the man that you are
mindful of, him, that you wouldeven consider dwelling with us?
That is the blessing, right.
And we know that the greatestblessing we have is that God is
with us at all times, that hispresence is tangible at times
where we can feel him and sensehim in the midst of our troubles
.
Seek him today, yeah, pursuehis presence.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
In the book of Exodus and I think it's chapter 20,
because in one verse, a fewchapters before, they're told
not to go to the mountain.
But a little bit further inchapter 20, there's an
opportunity where the peoplehave an option with Moses.
When God descends on themountain and there's a cloud,
there's thunder and there'slightning, there's all these
different things where theycould go and see God, where they
(23:28):
could go on the mountain and gosee God, they get scared and
they send Moses.
They're like no, no, no, no, no, you do the talking for us.
We're going to stay back herewhere it's safe and safely
distant from God.
But man, look, I'm encouragingour people that when God shows
up, we run in, we run into hisglory, we don't run away.
That's right, and so, man,that's kind of a nutshell of
(23:50):
what I preached on today.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
I love it, man, that's good.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
Yeah, so that's where we're headed in.
2025 is right now.
We're talking over all the yearabout discipleship, becoming
true disciples of Christ.
We had a leadership meetingright after, and that was my
question to them Like what areas?
When you think of a disciple,what does that remind you of?
What comes to mind when I saydisciple?
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
And then, where are you in your discipleship?
What are you lacking?
To be like Peter.
What are you lacking to be likePaul?
Speaker 2 (24:17):
I got a question for you.
Go ahead.
Okay, you know most churches.
When you look on their websiteor you look up who they are,
their vision and things likethat, you'll see this phrase a
presence-driven church.
What defines a presence-drivenchurch?
What defines a presence-drivenchurch?
I know I'm throwing thisquestion to you off the cuff,
(24:38):
but you're in a topic ofpresence and what your church is
pursuing.
What defines a church being apresence-driven church?
Speaker 1 (24:47):
And I would assume and then I don't know, because I
can't think of any websitesthat I've seen any churches say
that.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
But when I hear presence through— Well, I ain't
about to call them out, but theyare there.
Well, I don't know man, I don'tknow because— you see it a lot
in the charismatic churches.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
I would say, because they would think that it's a
spirit-led or a church, anapostolic kind of.
We speak in tongues, we do this, we do that, and so all the
gifts, shema.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Lema Ding Dong.
We believe.
Well, easy now.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
We believe in the gifts right, but I would assume
that that's what they mean.
It's really more of a giftingchurch than it is a spiritually
gifting church.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
So what would define a church to actually be a
presence-driven church?
What does that church look like?
Speaker 1 (25:35):
I think to me, man, when I think of a
presence-driven church, it's achurch where we create space to
let God do what God wants to do.
Amen, when I have an outline.
But you know what?
I'm going to stand here until Ifeel God move.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
You don't give him room, you give him the room, the
room exactly.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Yeah, to me, me, that's a presence driven church.
Yeah, and, and, and.
When we closed that 2024, Itold him things are going to
probably look different 2025because and not to say that we
don't have, uh, an outline, andnot to say that we don't come in
with a plan, but at any givenmoment I told him this if god
doesn't show up, we might aswell not show up.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Might as well, go home, son.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
Yeah, because if he doesn't show up we are wasting
our time.
And even if the gifts show up,dude, I have seen people man
wallow around in the floor andtalk about, oh man, that was a
service that was good, and thengo and start gossiping at lunch
(26:31):
about somebody that is not you.
The presence of god changes us.
We will never be the samebecause of that service we were
in right and, and we will neverbe the same because christ lives
in us.
But when, man, when you are,when you are, when you truly
enter the raw, real presence ofgod, man, man, when you have a
(26:51):
true encounter, it changes whoyou are.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Yeah, amen.
And the reason I ask thatquestion is because I know that
people are still looking forchurches and looking for
ministries and I wanted them tobe able to determine what—we're
talking about the presence, whenyou see that I'm a
presence-driven church be ableto determine what is the true
presence of God, what are welooking for?
What determines that?
And just give people someclarity of what we mean by that.
(27:15):
It's not just the giftsoperating and people shouting,
but it is people who are humblycoming to the presence of God,
pursuing him, giving him theroom to do whatever.
It is Unapologetically Right.
Don't apologize for anythingthat the Lord does that
interrupts the service.
Because here's the truth we arevery limited in our own self
but we give space to the HolySpirit to lead us in moments God
(27:37):
can do the impossible, in thepeople that come to these
services.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
In my prayer, man, even last night, this morning
it's like God if you don't do itthrough me, do it through
somebody.
Come on, what's that?
Speaker 2 (27:46):
song, whatever you're doing in this season.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
Don't do it without me.
They ain't heard the real goodverse.
They ain't heard.
Yeah, that's right, I love it,man.
But, brother, tell me, man,tell me, that's a little bit
about crosspoint.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
I don't know if we need to hear my sermon boy,
that's what I'm talking about,but anyway, yeah, I'll tell you
briefly what we're at right now.
You know we were.
This is the season of changeit's the season of transition.
Everybody's got a New Year'sresolution.
I tell our church January 1,we'll start resolutions and
January 4, we'll figure out thatwe are powerless and we will
break them all.
(28:22):
And it's a season of change andeverybody's making these
commitments and stuff.
So we're going on a seriescalled Navigating Change and I
hit five points of change and uh, I hit five points of of change
and things, and uh, becausewhat we know to be true is that
change is going to happen ineverybody's life, whether it's
good, it's bad, it's ugly.
Change is going to happen and,um, uh, the one thing I said
(28:43):
you've got to look for god andchange every change that is
happening in your life.
Look for god in it, god, whatare you teaching me?
What are you showing me?
What is the things that arehappening in my life that you
are part of?
And let me see you in it?
Jeremiah 29, 13 says that ifyou look for me in earnest, you
will find me.
When you seek me, earnest meansto long for or to with
(29:06):
intensity.
So if I'm looking for you ineverything of my life, I'm going
to find you.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
Right, that's being intentional.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Yeah, if you look for Jesus, you'll find him in
everything, and so we talkedabout that.
Second thing we talked aboutwas asking God for wisdom While
changes are happening andtransitions are happening in
your life.
Ask God for wisdom.
Ask God for wisdom.
What am I missing here?
You know the things that youdidn't plan, the things you
didn't want, the things thathappened just out of the blue.
(29:32):
You have to say this to theLord what are you wanting me to
get out of this situation?
That is wisdom asking God.
Don't let me miss, don't let mewaste this situation.
Let me see what it is thatyou're trying to do, and you
know, when you ask for wisdom,what you're really doing is
you've got to change the way youthink.
This is how I put it.
To our congregation, I said todo what you've never done.
(29:55):
You've got to think like you'venever thought.
Right, the renewing of the mind, are you?
transformed by the renewing ofyour mind, because what we know
is, every action that takesplace was a thought first,
(30:20):
no-transcript, and we have aproblem with somebody or a
situation.
Why are we going to the worldto get opinion Right?
Why are we going to people whoare unbelievers trying to get
their opinion about things thatChristians are going through?
Speaker 1 (30:36):
Yeah, yeah, because you no longer take your
instruction from the world.
You take your instructions fromGod.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
From his word.
So how does that?
Should be the question.
How does the word say I shouldhandle this?
Yep?
That's the renewing of yourmind.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Absolutely.
And so when you're seekingwisdom from the Lord, you'll
always look at things, thesesituations wrong.
I mean from the world.
You look at the situationswrong, but when you ask wisdom
from the Father, he'll give youa clear line, a clear sight of
why this is happening this way,to see beyond what your flesh
can see.
And you've got to change theway you think.
Be Christlike in your thoughts.
(31:07):
Your thoughts become actions.
Before you said the thing youshould have said, before you
done the thing you should havedone, all those things were a
thought first Right and let's behonest, we are horrible judges
sometimes at what really is theproblem.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Sometimes we are worried about the symptoms of
what we see and not the sourceof what we see.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
That's right.
Well, you can preach that thinga little bit.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
I preached it, don't you worry.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
I laid it down.
You, I laid it down, you get alittle you get a toddler version
of this thing, that's right.
And so then I said the thirdpoint was don't ask why, but ask
what.
Don't ask why, why is thequestion of explanation what?
Speaker 1 (31:46):
is the question of education.
God, what are you teaching?
Speaker 2 (31:47):
me in this situation, in this change that I'm going
through right now.
What are you teaching me?
It's an opportunity for us togrow in every situation, when
you're not questioning why, butyou're questioning okay, god,
what?
Because we know God doesn'twaste anything the good, the bad
, the ugly, all those things Goddoes not waste.
And so you've got to ask Godwhat is it that you're trying to
(32:10):
teach me in these moments righthere?
And you know, here's the truthYou'll either grow bitter or
you'll grow better, and a lot ofpeople are spending their whole
life trying to change oneletter.
Yeah, bitter, from bitter tobetter, right, and you waste
your whole life trying to changethat one letter because you
look at it the wrong way.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Well, eyes, the bitter is looking at eye,
exactly Right.
Speaker 2 (32:32):
Exactly.
Look at you preaching my sermonhey come on somebody and the way
you respond would determinewhether or not you'll grow from
it or it'll take things from you.
So what we don't need to focuson is the circumstances.
You've got to focus on yourcharacter.
I'm going to read this verbatimwhat I taught our church Don't
(32:56):
focus on the problem.
Focus on your personality.
Don't focus on the other person.
Focus on your response.
Don't focus on what's going onaround you.
Focus on what God is doing inand through you.
That's the difference when youview change in a way that it's
not the why, it's the what.
What am I trying to learn?
We talked about learningthrough contentment.
We talked about learning fromcharacter.
Because here's the truth bynature, you're content with
yourself.
You think about yourself.
(33:17):
It's not your nature to becontent.
It's natural for you to onlycare about you.
And so I'm not by naturecontent.
You're not by nature content.
By nature, I want to take careof my needs.
I'm not thinking about you, I'mthinking about me.
I'm thinking about my needs, myhurts, my pains, my wants, my
desires.
I could care less about youbecause life is about me.
(33:40):
That's naturally.
But when you give your life toChrist, god changed what is
natural fleshly and now putskingdom fruit in you.
That makes you now change theway you think and change the way
that you act.
So we talked about that andcharacter learning to care what
your character is.
And we talked through that howchange exposes our character.
(34:03):
People say when you get money,it exposes who you were in the
very beginning.
Character.
Situations expose yourcharacter, how you respond,
where you are with the lord andum.
So we talked through that andthen we, we hit, we hit with two
more.
We said become a promisedperson.
Again, we're talking aboutchange.
(34:23):
How do we navigate throughchange?
And with situations that wedon't like things, we didn't
plan things, we didn't uh, itjust happened, whether it was
because of a person or we lost ajob, what those things are
become a promise for a person.
Don't focus on the situation.
Focus on what never changes andwhat never changes.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
God.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
God.
There are three things that arefound in Jesus that doesn't
change.
It is God's love, it's God'spromises and it's God's purposes
for you.
None of those things change,and so, when you focus on the
things that do not change, whatis changing around you doesn't
change you Right, because you'refocusing your identity on
Christ.
Your purpose is in Christ.
(35:03):
Christ is love for you.
All those things are yes andamen, and we went through a list
.
I don't know if our listenersknow this, but there are more
than 7,000 promises in the Biblefor you and I.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Let's go ahead and hit number one.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
All right number one Number 6,790.
That's been a long podcast, bro.
My wife called me.
Where are you?
Speaker 1 (35:24):
at.
Speaker 2 (35:24):
Hey, I'm only on 1,287.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
We only got 5,000 more to go, yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
And so I talked about how you can bank on the
promises of God.
And so I talked about how youcould bank on the promises of
God.
But you know, when I talkedabout change, one thing that I
really hit on change that Ireally believe really steps on
people's toes it stepped on mineas well is that when change
comes, what happens is you havean issue with a person or you
(35:50):
have a problem with thissituation.
Instead of looking inward onwhat God is trying to do with me
, you're always trying to pointand blame the other person.
And I talked about this.
I said the reason why many ofus go through the same cycle of
problems.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
It's a victim mindset yeah it's a victim mindset.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
I talked about not being a victim, but be a victor,
and I said the world is full ofvictims.
Be a victor, right, yeah?
And so what happens is you gothrough this cycle of the same
problems.
Let's just think logically,pastor Jay.
If you have the same problemwith multiple people, you can't
keep blaming people.
That's right.
You've got to look inwardly.
(36:26):
This is where you look at thewisdom of God.
Okay, god, what?
Speaker 1 (36:30):
is it.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
So if I'm going through the same cycle of the
same problems, I need to startasking okay, what about me?
God's trying to change and thereason why we go through the
same cycle of problems isbecause we're yet to change in
the problem.
We're yet to actually lookinward.
Well, we've heard the story ofthis preacher who has preached
the same sermon for four weeksin a row and his congregation
says why in the world are youpreaching the same sermon?
(36:53):
He said well, when I see thatyou've actually understood and
got this sermon, I'll changewhat I'm preaching.
But you haven't got it yet.
That's the same thing, thatsometimes I think You're going
through the same cycle of thingsbecause you haven't learned
anything from it.
There's been no change in youat all, and so we've got to
mature as Christians,spiritually mature.
Look at our situationsdifferent.
(37:14):
Don't have this.
Woe is me mentality.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
One thing my dad always taught, and he's not a
theologian by any stretch.
But one thing he did say andwhen we're talking about you
said, think of it logically isone thing he always said was, if
everybody around you is theproblem, then everybody around
you is not the problem.
And so at that point you needto look inside and say, okay, am
I the problem?
Yeah, and so at that point youneed to look inside and say,
okay, am I the problem?
Where am I not growing in what?
Where?
What area of my life do I needto grow in?
Speaker 2 (37:41):
yep so anyway yeah, yep, and so the last thing that
we talked about was no matterwhat trust in god and, uh, I
talked about the journey of ofbeing in ministry for 12 years.
Church planning is not what Ithought it was.
Being a Church planning is notwhat I thought it was being a
lead pastor is not what Ithought it was, the stresses all
the things that you walkthrough in leadership and in
(38:01):
ministry.
You just never know what oneweek's going to be like.
And I talked about the weightof it I said but what I know to
be true is that God knew allthis before.
God had a plan.
We can trust God, no matterwhat we face, no matter what we
come in, God has a plan.
God has ordered our steps.
The Bible says he delights inthose steps and so he has
(38:23):
ordered those steps.
And when he's ordered our stepsand we know that, whether it's
good, it's bad, it's ugly Godhas been in it.
He's graces for.
Okay, God, I can trust you, nomatter what, because I know
you've got a plan.
I may not understand it, I maynot see it right now, but when I
look back from years ago, I canlook back all over my life and
see, okay, God had a purpose.
God used that situation forthis and it made me stronger.
(38:43):
And so we talked about nomatter what, you trust in God.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
No matter the situation, no matter the changes
that are happening in your life.
I don't know if man, and maybeI don't know if many, and maybe
I haven't talked to enough ofthem, I don't know, but I don't
know of any pastors that I canthink of that if I went and sat
down and said, do you feel likeyou're qualified to do what you
do?
I don't know many of them thatsay, yeah, man, I'm ready.
Yeah, woohoo.
It requires you to depend onthe Lord.
Oh, for sure it requires you tosubmit to him and say Lord, this
(39:14):
is too heavy for me, because itis, it's got to be done by God.
I told somebody we had ameeting with a nice couple who's
been coming to the church for awhile now.
I wanted to sit down with themand do some one-on-one and so we
met Anna and I met with them atStarbucks yesterday and this is
Sunday, we're recording.
So we met with them Saturdayand we were talking.
I said I've done lawenforcement for almost 20 years
(39:35):
and pastoring is way harder.
It is so much harder.
And even when you're theassociate pastor, if you were on
the board, if you were Sundayschool superintendent, it don't
matter what you'll be, I've hadthem all right and I'm telling
you you are not prepared forpastoring until you are in the
seat of pastor.
Oh yeah, and then you even man.
(39:56):
I think Mark Anthony preachedit perfectly.
It is what did he say?
Sweet slavery.
It is a calling.
God calls you to this.
If you do this for money, ifyou do this for fame, if you do
this for any other reason thanit being a calling, you are
going to fail.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
Oh yeah.
Because none of those reasonsare good enough to do it yep, I
had a guy come up to me a fewfew months ago.
He uh had some questions andthings about the church and just
he was like he started offsaying he said, listen, I know
you have the hardest job on theplanet yeah and then he said I
think teachers have the secondhardest.
he said, but you know, I don't.
I would never be able to dowhat you do.
He said I think teachers havethe second hardest.
(40:34):
He said, but you know, I wouldnever be able to do what you do,
he said.
So don't take this as criticism.
I'm just trying to learn andunderstand and, you know, put a
perspective in me, because Ireally never thought of it that
way.
It's the hardest job on theplanet, but you know, the more I
think about it, man, Well, Ithink it's like this.
Speaker 1 (40:50):
It's pretty tough.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
I think it's like this.
It's pretty tough.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
It is man and I think it's like this man when God
puts a flock under you andyou're the under shepherd.
You're trying to marry God'swill and God's presence with
people and you're constantlytrying to connect those two,
your conduit between those two,and it's like having a family
that you see better in than theysee in themselves.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
You want more for them than they want for
themselves.
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (41:19):
And it's just like you're trying to connect those
two ends, but you're just oneman.
Speaker 2 (41:26):
And you can't give everybody a knuckle sandwich or
nothing.
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
I said we should bring back the pasta's paddle.
That's right, yeah, that'sright, but anyway, yeah that was
our sermon.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
We got one more part for this three-part series, but
I'm super excited for wherewe're at as a church and where
we're at as a body of Christ.
Speaker 1 (41:47):
So, yep, yeah, I'm looking forward to maybe us
getting to partner on someprojects this year and doing
some things, some joint servicesor something.
Man, I think it'd be great.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
I can't wait to lay you out on the altar.
Hope you got a big boy to catchme now.
Your holy ghost hurt Anyway,heavy holy hands.
Brother, if you're good, we'regoing to bless them and send
them on their way.
Speaker 1 (42:08):
Hey you know how we do here at Crosspoint.
We like to wrap up with givingyou the priestly blessing.
Speaker 2 (42:13):
Well, that is not Crosspoint, okay.
This is pastor to pastor.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
Oh yeah, it is we at Crosspoint.
Speaker 2 (42:18):
Look at him.
He's shouting out his church.
You know what we like to do Areliant church.
Oh, we're at the reliance.
Okay, at 15501.
Speaker 1 (42:27):
Yeah, no.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
In fact it's funny because, bro, I say Crosspoint
point so much.
I went to your church, waspreaching.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
It was like here at cross point and they were like
oh, yeah, I'm at reliance.
Speaker 2 (42:42):
I was in india.
It was like not jason up here,cross pointians right, I love it
.
Speaker 1 (42:44):
Brother, let's bless you here on the pastor, the
pastor how about that?
Yeah, we read from numbers uh 6, 24 through 26.
It says the lord bless you andkeep you.
The lord make his face shineupon you and be gracious to you.
The Lord lift up his countenanceupon you and give you peace
amen hey, we're so grateful thatyou have tuned in today, that
you decide to listen, look like,share, follow, subscribe,
(43:07):
whatever it is, look and sharethis with people, because
there's no doubt if this blessedyou, this will certainly bless
other people.
Hey, but join us again nexttime on the next episode,
episode two, season three pastof the past past of the past.
God bless you, guys.
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