July 10, 2025 • 56 mins
Pastors' Perspective is a one-hour call-in program where listeners can call in and get answers to questions about the Bible, Christianity, family, and life. The program is live Monday through Friday from 3:00 PM - 4:00 PM Pacific. You can call 888-564-6173 to ask your questions.
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Speaker 1 (00:19):
Hello and welcome to Pastor's Perspective. I'm your host, Brian Perez.
It is Wednesday, but it feels like a Friday because
Cheryl Broderson is here with Pastor Brian Broderson. How did
that happen?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Well, I'm here at the church all week long doing
vacation Bible school, and I have, I am on the
blue team and I've got. Are you wearing a blue shirt.
There are the people who make me breakfast, yeah, yeah, yeah, but, um.
I'm on the blue team. Let's explain what that means
2nd and 3rd graders and uh they're just the best.
(00:58):
I love the class that I have. We have uh
16 kids and they are absolutely amazing. So we, we
do all these activities we're talking about the mystery of God.
So day one was the mystery of God's, um.
The mystery of God's identity. The second day is the
(01:21):
mystery of God's power, and today was the mystery of God's, um, mercy.
But when we say mystery, we're talking about the revelation.
So it's just like a great storyline and I have
to say that the whole curriculum that we're doing, can
you tell I've had 3 cups of coffee just to
be ready for the kids.
But the curriculum that we're doing was actually written by
(01:43):
the staff of Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa and it was
also illustrated by the staff of Calvary Costa Mesa. We've
got this band that's playing and the lead guitarist is.
Our 14 year old grandson and one of the dancers
happens to be our granddaughter Evelyn and I mean we
(02:03):
are just, I have to say that I'm keep myself
from crying because it is the curriculum is so good
and I'm so blessed by the cooperation of everybody to
make this happen. It's just absolutely amazing. And I also
think that it's really very tender.
When you consider that we all get to meet like
(02:25):
this in a group and we fall in love with
the kids and you think about the tragedy in Texas.
Where they were doing something just like this, you know,
studying the Bible, learning about God and nature, and this
flood came. And so I think it makes you even
more appreciative and more like in awe of what we
(02:47):
have here is really tender, very special, and not to
be just taken lightly. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
And uh I think empathetic too because you know, the
kids that you're with and you think of those other
children and the families and that, you know, that's always the,
the most challenging part of these things, you know, I've
just thought a lot about the family, you know, the
parents and the siblings and the grandparents and you know
(03:16):
everybody and I mean you, you know, you think you
send your child off to.
Bible camp for the week and they don't come home
because of the catastrophe and that that's difficult stuff to
to wrestle with and somebody was asking me about that
and I said, you know, yeah, it's it's very difficult
(03:38):
and there's no, you know, there is no easy answer like, well,
you know, hey, God has a better plan and but,
but there is the reality that.
There is heaven.
And that those, um, you know, whose lives were lost
in that, in that tragic situation, they've gone, they have
(04:01):
literally gone into the presence of the Lord to be forever.
Comforted and very safe, safe,
yeah,
Speaker 2 (04:12):
and you think about how you know in Revelation it
talks about how Jesus will wipe every tear from our
eyes and there will be no more sorrow, no more pain,
no more tragedy. I mean just the the safety and
the love and then I like to think of um
Psalm 16.
Where it says at his right hand are pleasures forevermore
(04:33):
like heaven is full of delights and pleasures and then
there's plans that you know we're not gonna be in
heaven forever we're gonna come back to earth totally improved
and we're gonna be part of the improvement process for
1000 years and then a new heaven and a new
earth where righteousness dwells and I mean.
(04:55):
I think about Jesus said I've said this that you
might have eternal life. I was just thinking, you know,
Jesus talking to the disciples because I'm in John 13
right now, my personal devotions just about eternal life like wow,
you know, it's already with us it's in us, um,
reading about those two sisters that were found clinging to
(05:16):
each other with a rosary in their hands just clinging
to each other, you think that is so so.
Precious and you know they believed in Jesus you know
they're in the presence of the
Lord.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
I just read as you know I just I just
read a book by Ray Ortland um.
Finding God at rock bottom.
And um it's such a great book, but the, the
final chapter is, you know, the the chapters are about
like difficult life experiences. So one chapter is betrayed, um,
(05:48):
another chapter is trapped, another chapter is um lonely. The
final chapter is dying, and he, you know, he just
talks about the inevitability of death, but
He also talks about the reality of the glory of
death and in in ways that only Ray could do,
you know, he's just painting these pictures of, you know,
(06:10):
people hooting and hollering and jumping and doing backflips and like,
you know, when you get there, it's like, oh my gosh,
this is the greatest party that that you get nobody
could even imagine. And and you think like, yeah, we
need to think more about that reality of
Of heaven, the presence of the Lord, and like you said,
Psalm 16 in your presence is fullness of joy At
(06:30):
your right hand is pleasure forevermore.
That is the
That's the
The
Speaker 2 (06:39):
hope and glory.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Yeah, the, that's the lining, the silver lining in the
dark cloud. Well,
Speaker 2 (06:45):
you know, in Titus, um, Paul starts out, you know,
Paul is a servant of of the Lord Jesus Christ,
and then he talks about how his call and his
apostleship is all, um, to tell people about the eternal
hope that they have through Jesus Christ, um, and God,
who God who cannot lie has promised us even before
(07:06):
the world began.
God had a plan to make men and women live
forever in glory and you just think about OK, God's
intention is glory forevermore.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Yeah, and the book is Good News at Rock Bottom. Yes,
just found it online. Good news at Rock Bottom. I keep,
I keep giving the wrong title. I know Rock Bottom
is in there. OK.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
One of the reasons he's giving the wrong title is
we were in New York until Sunday, and he got
so sick while we were in New York and so
he's just in recovery. Now
Speaker 1 (07:43):
he is better.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Yeah, he tried to give it away.
He tried really hard to give it away and I'm
on every weird vitamin. I I have this stuff called
coldop that I take and Lysine that I take and
vitamin C that I take. I mean, I am turning
into just one large vitamin at this point just to
(08:05):
keep all the germs at bays what you do. That's
why I get it. Well, especially because you're working with
kids every day.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Yeah, yeah.
All right, uh, let's open the lines 888-564-6173, but first, uh,
somebody wrote in through the Kwave.com pastor's perspective page on
the same topic we were just discussing. So let me
read Evan's question. He listens to us on the Kwave
app in South Pasadena.
And he writes, I have some questions regarding God's will
(08:33):
and plan, as we've all heard of the tragedy regarding
the flooding in Texas and in particular the deaths of
the campers and counselors at Camp Mystic, a Christian summer camp.
My question is that we always hear God has a
plan for us and things that happen are God's will.
How can one explain
God's plan and this tragedy to the victims' families and
loved ones. Also, how can this be God's will? This
(08:55):
was not like a mass shooting where some explained that
these evil people have free will, so I have a
difficult time understanding this. Also, how does one explain that
it was a miracle when someone is saved in tragedies,
as it seems to imply.
God was watching out for the one who was saved
versus the others who perished. It seems to me that
(09:16):
Christianity also lost out as these 27 people that passed
would have spread the word of God had this not
happened and potentially converted many to God. So I don't
understand how these things can be God's will or His
plan for these victims.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
I
don't think it is God's will. I mean, if, if
it's not God's will that any should perish, but I'll
come to eternal life, and I think that's a mistake
we made because
Um, it says in Romans 8:28 that God will work
together all things to his goodwill. So not everything that
(09:50):
happens is God's will. We've got to remember that Satan
is the prince of the air, and I want you
to think for a second about the book of Job, right?
So Satan says, I want to, I want to show
you that Job is not sincere.
And I want to show you that he's only serving you, God,
because of the good you do. So God says, OK,
(10:12):
what's your plan of action? And Job said, just let
me have, I mean, Satan said, Let me have it, Job.
Let me have free reign to do. And you know,
it's interesting because Satan is merciless when it comes to Job.
He sends this, uh, this, this wind that falls in
on the house and kills all Job's children.
(10:32):
He sends the Sybeans in to steal all of Job's crops,
and it just goes from bad to worse. Job gets sores,
and Job, like Job's friends, mistakenly concludes that this is
God doing this to him and even that this is
God's will, and it's not till the end of the
book that we realize none of this was God's will,
(10:54):
none of it. But what God says is, I'll take
the worst that has happened to you, Job, and I
will make it.
I will compensate you on earth, and I will hold
you and and bring you into heaven. And so what
I think that God wants us to know is not
(11:15):
all tragedy is His will. Satan is the prince of
the air and he is always trying to destroy God's work.
So I think what you could say is, well, why
did God allow it? Well,
There's certain things that are just going to happen in
this world because it's a consequence. Sometimes it's a consequence
(11:39):
of men not making the right preparations for flooding, right?
I read so many articles that they were warned that
this could happen and nobody made the proper precautions and
the other people didn't even know that this was a possibility.
So I think you've got a lot of of um
factors that are going into this and.
(12:01):
That um we cannot conclude that this is God's plan,
but what we can conclude is that God will take
tragedy and he'll compensate, especially in heaven, for every terrible
thing that happens on earth.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Evan, thank you for sending in your question through the
Kwave.com pastor's perspective page. 888-564-6173 is our number, and, uh,
now we're gonna talk to Laura, who is in Upland
listening on FM 107.9 Kwave. Hey, Laura, what's going on? Oh.
Can you hear me? Yeah.
(12:37):
Great. So, I know demonic activity is supposed to increase,
especially in the last days.
And I'm experiencing something with my husband. This is the
3rd time over the weekend at my dad's house, where
he has gone to sleep and then shortly after he's
been paralyzed in his sleep and he opens his eyes
and he can see light.
(12:59):
And he's struggling to move and it wakes me up
and scares me because he's trying to grab me. I
have no idea what's going on and I'm trying to
figure out is this some sort of psychosis or is
this demonic warfare because I keep telling him about idols
and not having idols in the house, and I've witnessed
to my dad recently as well.
And this happened in his house. The other two times
(13:21):
were at our own house.
So, and, and so what happens like when he wakes up?
Uh, he opens his eyes and he can't move. He's paralyzed.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Even in the morning, like
Speaker 1 (13:35):
it's in the middle of the night. OK,
Speaker 2 (13:37):
but when he wakes up in the morning, does he
remember it?
Speaker 1 (13:40):
Well, yes, because I sit up and I talk to
him about it in the middle of the night because
it freaks me out so is, is, um.
So what, what's his life like the rest of the time, uh,
you know, during the day? Does he just go about
a normal life? Does he go to work? Does he?
And what are these idols that you say he has
(14:03):
in his house, in the house? Um, they, they could
be just things that are offensive to God, maybe a
drug paraphernalia type of a company. Um, I don't want
to give all the companies.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Right, got it.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Uh, you know, people that might support Planned Parenthood or
outright kind of stuff like that. Yeah, well, you know,
things like that. Yeah, those, none of those things are
are necessarily gonna, you know, bring like heavy demonic presence
or activity.
Um, I think, you know, there's he's doing on the side.
(14:40):
That's what I don't know. Yeah, but what's he like normally?
Is he just a normal guy apart from these episodes
when he's sleeping?
Uh, for the most part, yeah. OK. Now, you know,
you know, there are different things that, um, there, there's
something called night terrors, for example, um, and, you know,
(15:00):
there are people who walk in their sleep. So there,
there are things that happen sometimes in the context of
sleep that we don't necessarily understand exactly what they are,
but they're they're real experiences, they're weird experiences, but
Um, you know, who, who knows what or why. So
(15:21):
I wouldn't
I wouldn't say that, I mean, it's bizarre what's happening,
but I wouldn't say, oh, it's automatically demonic because this
is just so, so weird. I would think that there's
probably some other explanation for it. And the fact that
he's like you're saying, I mean, you know, he's relatively
normal apart from these episodes, um, I think that you're
(15:45):
just dealing with something that's either
Um, rooted in things that are going on in his body.
It could be, you know, to some degree, psychological or emotional,
but uh, I don't think it's directly
demonic.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
You know, we had a weird experience with one of
our children. I actually gave one of our children, um.
It was half of a um what do you want
to say an antihistamine kind of a fizzy thing. It
was an Alka-Seltzer Plus, but it was something that they
took off the market since.
And I gave him a half of one and it
seemed to stay in the system for over what was
it 2 years, at least a year, and he would get,
(16:25):
he would like fall asleep and then he would get
up and he would talk to you and you thought,
you know, something's just a little off and then he
called us, what did he call us like Frank and
and Carol or he gave us these weird names this
one time like I know who you are. Oh, you're
Hank and Kathy and we're like uh no.
And then he said, you know, you've got to stop
(16:46):
those machines from um taking our house down the machines
are outside and so we began to realize that he
was getting up and he was sleepwalking constantly and it
was hard to tell when he was awake when he
was asleep and though we knew it wasn't demonic, we
knew it was brought out by these, you know, obviously
we went to the doctor and he said it's the antihistamine,
(17:06):
this is dangerous.
But my husband kept taking them to the elders of
the church, and for every time we'd have an episode,
my husband would take our son back to the elders
of the church. They would lay hands on him and
they would pray. And, you know, he and I, uh,
Brian and I would pray for our son every time
we would just lay hands. And you know, it wasn't
(17:29):
like an immediate deliverance, but we knew that the constant
prayer and the laying on of hands was what in
the end.
the healing and the deliverance. So it might be all
sorts of factors. It might be a psychosis, it might be, um, biological.
He might be doing something like you said on the side,
(17:49):
which is actually causing this, and God is allowing it
for his chastening so he can be saved.
But at the end of the day, seeking the Lord
is always the first and the best, and the Lord
will direct you from there, you know, Jesus said, seek
first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all
(18:10):
these things will be added to you and.
Matthew chapter 6 verse 33. So I would say keep praying,
keep praying. And then when he wakes up and starts doing,
start praying out loud, start saying, Lord, you see what
he is, he's paralyzed. We're calling on you right now.
I don't know what he's done. I don't know what
he's doing. I don't know if this is something he's
(18:31):
bringing on himself. I don't know if this is demonic,
but we give this to you in the name of Jesus,
and we're asking for your intervention and help, and that's
what I would do, I mean.
I grew up in a family that, you know, you
fall down my mom automatically started praying. I mean, we
prayed about literally everything and you know.
(18:52):
It worked.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Laura, what do you think?
Yeah, I think that's great. I do think that there's
something else going on. I had him read Joshua 24,
the whole chapter last
night.
It's about the idols and obeying God. Yeah, struggling right now,
I think with obeying God back and
Speaker 2 (19:12):
forth. Yeah, well, this, this ought to get him
Speaker 1 (19:14):
straight.
Yeah, I mean, you know, this obeying God is never
a good idea so.
If this is what it takes to get him right
with the Lord, then you
Speaker 2 (19:24):
know, this might be one of those prayers, Lord, do
whatever it takes the Lord's going, OK, here we go.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
Laura, thanks for calling in today on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173
is our number. It's Wednesday. I know you're hearing Cheryl,
so you might think this is a rerun from some
previous Friday, but no, she's here with us on this Wednesday,
and Brian Broderson's her too. And so, you know, you
ask the question.
Initially, how did you end up here today, Cheryl? And
(19:51):
she told you the story of VBSS, but she never
actually that's true because
Speaker 2 (19:57):
I'm here because of VBS. I happened to be at
the church and then I came over to eat lunch
Speaker 1 (20:01):
with you here because we were together upstairs drove
Speaker 2 (20:06):
separately
Speaker 1 (20:06):
office and we were
Speaker 2 (20:09):
office.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
I like that. You were doing some business stuff. I
was doing some stuff and then
I got a message from you that our friend Ed
Stetzer was not going to be with us today. And
so then there was a little bit of panic like,
oh no, what are we gonna do? And I said,
don't worry about it. I can take care of it.
(20:31):
And you wholeheartedly agreed, but then I thought, well, look,
Cheryl is right here.
I will grab her and she can come and do
the radio. What
Speaker 2 (20:41):
he said is that I was, I was grabbing my
keys and I've got some chicken here for our dog Barnabas,
and I heard, come on. And I said, we didn't
drive together and he said, no, we're doing K-wave right now.
I said, it's not Friday, which is maybe what the
listeners are saying right now, but it's not Friday. And
he said, it doesn't matter. Ed can't make it. You're
(21:01):
his replacement. I'm like, oh, I'm Ed.
Stetzer's
Speaker 1 (21:05):
replacement and Ed
would be, he would be proud for replacement. You're you're
one of his
favorites.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Ed is so thrilled right now. If he could hear
if he could only hear.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
All right, 888-564-6173. Here's Tony listening to us in Altaloma
on the Kwave app. Hey, Tony, how can we help
you today?
Good afternoon. I guess my question has to do with
evolution and creation with um some of my friends that
are teetering with their faith or maybe some that have
(21:37):
lost it and they're agnostic. I would just simply say
to them, Well, what do you think crossed with a
giraffe that give it its long neck? You still see.
You see a tuna trying to jump out of the
water and all of a sudden walk around and legs
pop out of its body. Why do snakes not have
any legs, if so, and I'm just kind of wondering
(22:00):
if I'm correct in thinking this way and and telling
my friends this, you know, just look around, look at
all of the creation that that's out there, the fact
that we laugh, that we get goosebumps, that
We love and have all these emotions. Yeah, I, I
think all of that stuff is great. I just keep,
you know, just keep sharing with them and you know, it's,
(22:23):
it's so funny to think that that people are still
gravitating toward these alternative.
Views of of reality and so forth. But um and
I say it's funny because there there are so many
people who are um
(22:44):
Intellectuals, uh, people who have been very um openly aggressively
against the Christian faith and uh who are now
You know, completely rethinking everything. They've written books against the faith,
they've written books in support of naturalism and so forth.
(23:06):
And now they're saying, yeah, I don't know, I think
I might have got a lot of that stuff wrong,
you know, so, so it's just funny to me that
people are, are at the present moment going, yeah, I
think I'll, I think I'll go for this theory when
so many people who were the main proponents of the
theory for decades are now saying,
Yeah, I, I don't think
that's
Speaker 2 (23:26):
you know what Brian and I were just in New
York last week, and we actually our daughter lives with
a forest right behind it backs up to her house
and we would cross this highway, little dangerous and there
was a neighborhood there that we could walk in and
we saw a fawn, we saw bunnies we saw all
(23:48):
sorts of birds and.
Um, just nature, we were so surrounded by nature and
we were so.
In awe and you know when you're surrounded by nature
like when has man ever made a tree or when
has man ever made a bunny rabbit, right? And it's like,
(24:08):
you know, start with the same ingredients God used, but
they haven't even done it in a science lab. They
can't create all the same beauty. They can't replicate the
life and.
I once heard a Bible study by a scientist named
Tom Merton who just talked about the miracle of one
(24:28):
bird feather, and then he was talking about the different
feathers that birds have, but he was just talking about
how ingenious bird feathers are, and he said, I can
convince you that there's a creator with a feather.
And I'm telling you by the end of his talk,
and I was already convinced, but by the end of
(24:49):
his talk all you could say was wow glory and
you think about all the different types of birds God
has created and all those feathers and the glory and
you know we were looking at pine trees and oak
trees and mulberry trees and uh maple trees and just.
(25:12):
Thinking about how glorious our God is and of course
daffodils grow wild there in New York and just taken
back by all the glory actually my son-in-law has a
gym there and he was saying they saw a couple
bear cubs that uh they have glass and they were
looking out and they saw bear cubs and you're just thinking, Lord,
you are amazing.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
And, and.
You know,
Speaker 2 (25:36):
so I'm with you, Tony. I think that's a great
way
Speaker 1 (25:39):
to speak about it, you know, to.
Take it to the idea of um
You know, where there's a design or where would you
ever see a design without a designer? Um, you know,
in anything that we know today that is our son, uh,
(26:01):
one of our sons is a, um,
He's a computer guy. He's a coder. And sometimes, you know,
he will talk to me about how, you know, code
is so, it's, it's so it's it's, it's like an
evidence that, you know, nothing can naturally develop on its own.
(26:25):
Somebody has to give the input.
And of course, when you look at DNA DNA is
the most complex, um,
The thing in the world, you know, it contains this
unbelievable code of millions of letters and so forth, and
that is how everything is designed through DNA.
(26:47):
And so how could you think that you could have
and his, his thing is how could you have a
code without a
coder? Yeah,
Speaker 2 (26:54):
and you think about every single cell of your body
has a DNA every single cell, you know, just think
about um creation, um, I'm talking about a baby and
how a baby starts with, you know, um, these two
cells that come together and they join and then somehow
these cells begin to replicate.
And some of those cells go excuse us, we're gonna
(27:15):
be leaving you now we're the brain cells and these
other ones go, oh, and we're the heart cells and
they all came out of just two cells combining and
then they begin to replicate and the others are going,
excuse me, we're.
Part of the skeletal system. Oh, I'm gonna go down
to the phalanges, you know, and they go to these
different parts and they become, you know, 12 systems and
(27:40):
organs and, and they all cooperate together, you know, and
you're just thinking I am fearfully and wonderfully made, uh, somebody, um,
Doctor Wilder Smith wrote a book years ago called He
Who Thinks Has to Believe.
And um it's excellent. I read another book that was
(28:01):
just talking I Doctor Jeffrey something on just your anatomy.
He's a Christian, a scientist, he's German, and he wrote
this book. I read it. I remember.
I would have to close each chapter and just begin
to praise the Lord for the awesomeness of creation, and
that was just my own creation as he was talking
(28:22):
about how the body is so intricately created by.
God and all the systems working and it was um
just amazing. Yeah, and,
Speaker 1 (28:33):
and you know, there, there's so much we're
just and that's not even the surface like you said,
the
Speaker 2 (28:38):
giraffe with a long neck.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
There's, there's so much um material as well, so many
brilliant minds. Um, look up this guy online, uh, Doctor
James Tour, T O U R.
Um, he's probably the world's foremost chemist, and he is
a solid believer, and I, I see him on Instagram
(29:03):
all the time, and he does his little, you know, he,
he has his little post of him discussing something, answering
a question, and he's absolutely brilliant, and he's, um, you know,
I think you will find that, uh, encouraging yourself and
you can pass that off to your friends, but also
remember this.
(29:23):
These kinds of things are basically excuses for why I
really just don't want to follow God. So, you know,
I want to do my thing and so I'm gonna
latch on to this, this debunked theory, but I'm gonna
hold on to it because it'll give me a little
space to do what I want rather than do what
(29:44):
God wants me to do. So that's really what's underneath
it all.
Tony, thanks for your phone call today on Pastor's Perspective.
We've got to take a break. We'll be back in
a few minutes with more of your questions. Call in.
We are live on this Wednesday, the 9th of July
at 888-564-6173 with Brian and Cheryl Broderson.
(30:05):
You know,
Welcome back to Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is the number to
call us today. We're here live until 4 o'clock on
(30:25):
this Wednesday, and we would love to talk to you, 888-564-6173.
Let us go now to Sean, who is calling in
from Lake Forest, listening on FM 107.9K wave. What's your
question for us today, Sean?
Hey guys, um, I was calling because I, I heard
Cheryl mention earlier about God having a plan for men
(30:47):
to live forever. Um, I know I've always struggled with
this if that's the right one or omni,
Speaker 2 (30:54):
one
Speaker 1 (30:54):
of the
Speaker 2 (30:55):
one
of those omni words.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
And it's like, if he had a plan, then that,
then he's God. So, uh, he knew if he, he knew,
obviously when he was gonna, he knows he sees everything
with the foreknowledge. So this is, whatever happened was supposed
to happen. He didn't create Adam and Eve and was
surprised by what happened. He had, obviously, he knows, I
want man to live forever. He created Adam, he created Eve,
(31:20):
and sin fell into the world and we were cursed forever,
and then Jesus came. I get that, but
Whenever I say God, here's what he wanted and it's
almost like he intervened with Jesus, he, that was the plan.
I mean, he knew that he doesn't need to intervene
on something that he already knew was gonna happen, you
know what I mean, if that makes any
sense.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
Yeah, but he did but it says that Jesus was slain.
Um, from the foundation of the earth, God knew that
there would have to be a plan of salvation. So
I think what, what the problem is, is we're stopping
the plans of God right here where we are right now,
instead of recognizing that the plans of God are eternal,
(32:03):
that there's something up ahead that we're not yet seen.
It's like reading half the book.
And we don't know the next chapter and the chapter
after that. And I think that's why we have revelation
in the Bible too, to show us that this is
only part of it, but it's necessary according to God's
righteousness and His justice that he do it.
(32:26):
The way he did it, so you've got to understand too,
because I think one of the things that we say
is that God is not limited, but God is limited
in the fact that he always has to work according
to righteousness and according to justice and we're told in
the Bible God who cannot lie.
So because he's a God of truth, he cannot lie.
(32:49):
And so, uh, you know, there's just these things that
we cannot with our finite mind understand and as Tim
Keller said, if we could understand God or all his ways,
he would be our equal and not our superior. So
we've got to laugh for some mystery in this relationship
with God because he is God, but.
(33:12):
It has to do really with his righteousness because if
man only served him because there was no other choice,
if man only loved him.
Because there was no other choice, then it wouldn't be sincere,
it wouldn't be authentic. And so God had to make
these allowances for a fall. He had to, to do
(33:33):
all this to bring us to the glory that he
intends to yet be. I hope that makes sense because
on some days to me it totally makes sense, and
on other days I'm struggling with it to be really honest.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
Does that make sense,
Sean?
Yeah, to an extent, I mean, she said if God
big enough from small enough for me to understand its
big enough for me to worship, but sometimes when they
say like.
He saw that this happened, but it's like, he knew,
he knows like, I don't know what's gonna happen and
I don't know where I'm headed. Boy, I have faith
(34:08):
that I am, but he knows the ultimate choice and
he knows.
But sometimes when I hear he had a plan, or
initially was the plan, like, I don't know if that
was the initial plan per se, because he knew that
was gonna fall into the world and some people would perish.
So I don't. Yeah, well, you know, it's interesting if
you think about it, and I, and I don't know
that we, we think about it this way too often,
(34:31):
but if you think
So like Cheryl referred to the passage of Jesus being
a lamb slain before the foundation of the world. So before,
before there's ever a creation, I, I think sometimes we
kind of start with creation. Well, God created the world,
he created it all beautiful and then it all went wrong,
and then he, you know, he, he had a plan.
But before he ever created anything,
(34:52):
He already knew, you know, so he's gonna create a
world where he is going to have creatures that he
will have eternal relations with, but he also knows that
in in
In the, you know, the process of doing this, um,
sin is gonna enter the world and these creatures are
gonna rebel against him, and he's gonna redeem them through
(35:14):
his son. So all of this is already known. So right,
there's there's nothing that God is taken by surprise with,
but I think where people sometimes get tripped up is
God knowing versus God causing. So some people think, well,
you know, why did God cause that to happen?
Well, he didn't cause it to happen, but he knew
(35:36):
it would happen, and he allowed it to happen, so.
But you know, these are things that people have been
grappling with for centuries, so it's not, it, it's not
a wrong that at times you can't get your head
around it. Like Cheryl said, sometimes it's also so clear
and you're just like, oh this is amazing. And then
other times you're like, wait, OK, what?
Speaker 2 (35:57):
Yeah, come back to me, to me, come back, yeah,
and a lot of it has to do with the
fact that he gives us free.
Choice and had it not been for that if we
if he didn't give man free choice there would not
be sin in this world there wouldn't be um people
making bad choices, but he gives us the dignity to
(36:21):
make a choice even if it's against him, you know, um,
my mother had dementia and I remember taking her to
the doctor and.
Um, she, she refused any medication that could have, um,
slowed the progress, and of course that, you know, broke
my heart and the heart of the sibling I was
with at the time, and the doctor called us aside
(36:43):
and he said, there's something that you can give your
mother right now, and that's her dignity, and that's the
ability to make decisions even if they're wrong decisions or
even if they're decisions you don't agree with. You're giving
her the right.
To make decisions and God actually dignifies creation, you know,
men and women, men and women by allowing them to
(37:07):
make even bad decisions and that's a hard thing to
wrap your, your head around but it's part of his,
his goodness it's part of his righteousness and it's part
of his justice.
That he gives men and women the right and the
dignity even to make wrong decisions and all of that
(37:29):
had to be in order to bring us in to
the ultimate um.
The ultimate purposes of God. Do we live in a
world that um where God's purposes are constantly seen? No,
but we do have enough of the residual beauty that
(37:52):
God created that makes us responsible uh to make a
choice for God.
Speaker 1 (37:58):
Would you say that dignity is similar to how parents
have to give their kids the choice to make wrong
decisions eventually? I mean, especially, yeah, yeah, not when they're
3 and they want to run into
Speaker 2 (38:11):
the middle of this is where I bring Galatians in
like the law was there until you were old enough,
you know, until you became an adult. And so I
believe that, you know.
Children are under the law until they're wise enough to
make wise decisions. But yeah, you have to, you know,
our kids are all grown and we don't agree with
every decision, but we have to support those decisions, even
(38:34):
the ones we don't agree with, you know, uh, we
have a grandson that's not living a life that we
would like to see and we know that he's in,
in some of his decisions, he's really hurting himself, so
we keep offering the right decisions to him.
But we love him no matter what, but we know
it's in his best interest if he made better decisions,
(38:54):
and we suggest those better decisions to him constantly but
you know we do not, you know, we don't force him,
we don't try to force him, we don't say, hey,
we're not giving you a Christmas present unless you know
you do what grandma and grandpa said, uh, we're just
kind of like, look, we love you no matter what,
but we do think some of your choices are hurting you,
(39:14):
you know.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Sean, thanks for your phone call today here on
Speaker 2 (39:17):
thanks for thinking so deeply and keep it up because
the Lord has an answer for you and so I
would continue to pray and talk to the Lord say, Lord,
these are things that I don't understand. One of the
things I love is that it says in Luke 24
that he opened up their understanding. And so just say
to the Lord, Lord, open up my understanding, and he
(39:40):
will because remember.
Our relationship with Jesus is relational, he said. My sheep
hear my voice. He wants to speak into you. He
wants to speak over you, and he wants to make
certain things so understandable and so clear. So pray for
those insights, and God will give them to you. Like
I said, I have my days that everything's so clear.
Speaker 1 (40:03):
888-564-6173. Stanley in Los Angeles, you're next on Pastor's Perspective.
Thanks for calling in.
Hi. Um, thank you so much. I tried to call
many times because
I had to give a thank you for all your
pastors because uh 3, like 3 weeks ago, my cousin
(40:25):
uh uh as a surgeon's uh officer killed by 44
or 5 to try to help others.
Speaker 2 (40:31):
Oh, I'm so sorry.
Speaker 1 (40:34):
Uh, um, but thank you.
Well, uh thank you for your prayer and asking the question. Um,
my sister-in-law, new sister-in-law, I thank you. I, um.
Um, thank you. Um, the question I had is, uh, because, uh,
(40:59):
since all the elderly uncles, they all die, um, on
the left that my cousin's father who in the senior
home is 86 years old. Uh, his mind good. He
just physical condition no good. We had you know start
(41:20):
July 24.
Um, well, we've been talking with my cousins. They plan on,
first of all, they are not believers, and I need
to let you guys pray for them because
Um, for me, before I become a Christian, is I
don't believe God. Then after my father, I was in
(41:42):
the military, my father died. That's tragedy bring me into
the restaurant business and I met the Christian and bring
me into.
Christ. And from that, all my brothers, my mother, my
family all except the Lord. Matter of fact, my brother
even served in the church. So I praise the Lord
(42:04):
and all His glory. But my thing is this though,
first I need today finish up, the question is, first,
do we have to tell him and my cousin, they
said they're going to tell.
Um, I pray for asking your perspect, should we tell
or not, because if they we take him to the
(42:25):
over there, we don't wanna get shocked.
Mhm. Mhm. OK, so the question is, do you tell
him about the death of your cousin? Is that, is
that his my uncle, uncle,
Speaker 2 (42:41):
yeah.
Speaker 1 (42:42):
Oh,
he's 50 year old. OK, so, so this is his,
his son who died.
Yes, the, the police officer. OK, wow, yeah. So what
is the what is the immediate family say that they
want to do? They want to tell him?
Calling and I wanna know what respect for you guys
(43:03):
and also the mother is a dimension and she knows
her son if he that funeral we're taking her to
the funeral because there's no mother taking it because the
funeral is still on July 24 if I take her,
you want to be.
She would only tell her to bring or not. I mean,
(43:26):
I just, I mean they, the, the immediate my uh
my cousin, they said they're gonna take it. I just want. That's,
that's question. And then the one for my uh is
11 more thing is I ask you pray for my cousin. Oh,
Speaker 2 (43:42):
absolutely,
Speaker 1 (43:44):
because they not believer, I try to.
Preaching many times, share this gospel, they never believe. I
even shared my, my uncle before too, in his senior home.
Oh I'm saying this in this short time, I want
them to know that because we are, we are, I'm
a 60 group, ages are like group. I mean, we,
(44:08):
how long you live for this earth? We don't, we
need to know the Lord Jesus Christ. Yeah. What would
you guys say to Stanley?
Well
Speaker 2 (44:19):
it sounds like Stanley's got an anointing, and I think
that he's got the gospel down and I would say
if the Lord gives him a way to present it.
To his uncle with uncle, you know, your son.
You know, has gone and you know we in times
(44:40):
like this where we don't know if a person is
saved or not, we fall back on the mercy of
the Lord and just hope that they called out to
the Lord.
Speaker 1 (44:48):
Yeah, and I, I think that.
You know, with his, his, his son, his immediate family.
Your cousins, so forth. I think in some ways you
just have to let them do whatever they feel is
best to do. Yeah, and then you just have to
(45:12):
trust in and just be there to, you know, just
be the person that you are in Christ and see
what God will do. But, um, you know, we're gonna
pray for this situation.
Because it is very challenging and Lord, so we just
ask that you would help in this situation, give wisdom
and and you know, comfort, and we pray through the
(45:36):
the service, the funeral, the memorial service, we pray through
all of it, that somehow you would be um magnified
and that people would turn their hearts.
In faith toward you in Jesus' name,
Speaker 2 (45:52):
Lord, we also thank you that Stanley is a light
to this family that he knows you, that he knows
what it was to walk in darkness and now to
walk in light. Father, we pray that you would give
him the right words, the, uh, the right, um, Lord,
just everything that he needs, the right comfort in this
(46:13):
situation to speak over and speak into his family.
The words of life bless Stanley. Comfort him as he
seeks to bring the comfort of the Holy Spirit to
his family, and we thank you for him, and we
thank you for his, his life, Lord, and um, we
just pray that you would use him as, as, as
(46:35):
an ambassador of Jesus Christ to bring your comfort, um,
in this terrible tragiced in Jesus' name.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
Amen. Amen.
Amen. 888-564-6173. Here is Martha, who's listening to us on
the Kwave app in Santa Ana. Hi, Martha, thanks for
calling in today.
Hi, thank you for taking my call. Hi Cheryl and.
Hi Brian. I'm Brian. Hi. OK, well, I wanted to, um,
(47:05):
I wanted to, uh, your opinion on Zachariah 7,
Speaker 2 (47:10):
um, 9 through
Speaker 1 (47:11):
10, and Jeremiah 22 and 3.
They are, um,
Speaker 2 (47:18):
you probably know that they talk about how um we're
supposed to, um, you know, defend, defend the oppressed, and
I wanted to know what you think about because I'm
being confronted, well, being put in a, in a situation
where
(47:38):
I feel like
Like I'm questioning myself. All my life, I've been taught
the Lord to, you know, to love him with all
my heart and soul and to love one another. And um,
so when all the situation, what the world is um
happening right now with the detained and the, and the undocumented,
(48:03):
and we know that, you know,
That, that they, they, the what is occurring is a
civil um matter, um but um but the way it's
going about and um not giving them the due process, it,
(48:25):
I feel that the Lord has given me this compassion
towards them to pray for them, to ask for prayer
for them.
In the situation that they are being put, um, many
of them have been years trying to get their paperworks, um,
but it's hard to get your even a green card
(48:46):
or anything, um, to, and, and then for them to,
you know, you hear about the process when they're, they
have an appointment.
And,
Speaker 1 (48:57):
and then the judge drops it and then they get
arrested right there.
So what's your question for us, Martha?
My, my question is,
Speaker 2 (49:05):
is it OK to use these scriptures to say that
it's OK for us to pray for them? It is
Well, of course we should be praying for them. Yeah, yeah,
the only reason I'm saying this, Cheryl, is because I'm
I'm being questioned by sisters that I love. I know,
(49:25):
I know. I mean, is there, I know this is
another thing, unfortunately, that I'm seeing so much division over
and this is what we feel, that every person.
Man and woman, no matter what color, no matter what place,
no matter where they're living, they are, they are, um,
(49:47):
made by God in the image of God. And again,
you know, we're talking about dignity and if God gives
us each of dignity, um, I think that we owe
that and I think that there is a better way
to go about what's being done. I'll probably be in
trouble for saying that just like you're in trouble.
But I think that we owe every man and woman
(50:10):
their dignity and um you know I have got little
kids that can't come to Sunday school right now right?
because of what's going on in Santa Ana because they're
scared um we have Spanish fellowships that have been decimated
because the people are scared, is that right? Absolutely no.
And so I think that um.
(50:33):
You know, this is a really, really difficult situation. And yes,
we're glad for those who are able to come in legally,
but we do understand in certain parts of the country
that system is, is, is um.
Overly um taxed and you know like it it's hard
and it's difficult so I think the answer like you're
(50:56):
saying Martha is what you're saying is it all right
to have compassion? Absolutely. And what is compassion look like
for believers? Well, it's gonna look different for each of
us as the opportunity arises, isn't it? And I think
this is one of those situations, another scripture I would
give you is we have to obey God rather than man.
(51:16):
And whatever that looks like, I don't know, but I
know that that every man and woman on this earth.
Is my brother and sister as created by the Lord
Jesus Christ, and I owe them dignity. I owe them
(51:38):
respect and so I think that's um I think you
can definitely use those scriptures and just say this is
how I feel, this is what the Lord has given
me towards the situation.
And I think that's a great place to land. I
don't think, Martha, that you can go wrong with love.
I don't think you can go wrong with love or grace.
(51:59):
I think you're in the right company whenever we're acting
in love and grace, we're in the right company. And
so that's, it's a hard situation. It's a terrible place.
I'm like.
And like I said, I'm, you know, it's just um.
It's just really heartbreaking and we are praying, you know,
(52:21):
it says that in um.
First Timothy chapter 2. Paul says, I would that every
man give up wrath and doubting and just lift their
hands to the Lord and pray, and I think the
answer for this situation is we need to pray.
And we need to pray for our brothers and sisters
in Christ to have compassion and to show dignity. We
(52:42):
need to pray for our government to show dignity and
I think that we, we can be the, we can
be we can be the hands and the voice of
Jesus if we will just love and show compassion.
Speaker 1 (52:57):
Pastor Bryan, any thoughts?
Um, I, I mean, I, I agree. I think, um, I,
I read a quote the other day from a, a
person that I follow and think he's got a lot
of wisdom. He said he's, he's actually an attorney as well.
And he said, you know, there has to be a
way to um uphold the law.
(53:21):
And maintain um the dignity of a of a person simultaneously.
These are not mutually exclusive. And I think that that's
what we need to um strive for. Yeah, we need
to strive for, and we, you know, we've talked about
this a few times because this has been going on
a while, and I think, you know, one of the,
what we can do is as believers, we lead with compassion,
(53:44):
we lead with love, we lead with mercy. That's just
how we lead.
And then how do we, but how do we fix this,
the bigger problem, you know, uh, and that's where we
can pray that God would send somebody into the midst of, um,
you know, say ICE or whatever other aspect of law
(54:07):
enforcement it is, that would have a wiser approach, or
just say, hey, no, we, you know, we don't want
to do it that way, we want to do it
this way.
So, uh, this is such a complicated thing and there's
so many different perspectives and ideas and, you know, everybody
is an expert about everything these days, so they, everybody
thinks they know how to fix it and what, what
(54:28):
should be done. And we, we really don't. So our,
our role is to, you know, be Christians and, and
treat people as Jesus would have, uh, as Jesus would
treat them and, and, you know, how we should treat
them the same way as well and pray.
For the authorities that God will help them to do.
(54:49):
To do things in a way that's honoring human dignity.
Speaker 2 (54:53):
And don't you feel too that unfortunately we have these
two extremes and you're thinking both extremes are wrong. Could
we quit being extremists? And I mean, I feel like,
you know, when we come to vote they only give
us two extremes and
Speaker 1 (55:07):
we're like, well, Elon's going to fix that, you
know, he's gonna give us a
Speaker 2 (55:12):
let's go with Jesus instead.
Speaker 1 (55:14):
Yeah, Jesus, I'll take Jesus. Yes, indeed, Martha, thanks for calling.
in today on Pastor's Perspective, we're out of time, but
we will be back tomorrow between 3 and 4 and
would love to speak with you then if you are
watching today on Facebook or YouTube or Instagram. Thank you
for doing that. Make sure you like and subscribe and
you'll get notified every time we put out a new
(55:35):
video on YouTube, and we'll be back tomorrow from 3
to 4 for Brian and Cheryl Broderson. Thank you so
much for listening today. I'm Brian Perez. God bless.
Hello and welcome to Pastor's Perspective. I'm your host, Brian Perez.
It is Wednesday, but it feels like a Friday because
Cheryl Broderson is here with Pastor Brian Broderson. How did
that happen?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Well, I'm here at the church all week long doing
vacation Bible school, and I have, I am on the
blue team and I've got. Are you wearing a blue shirt.
There are the people who make me breakfast, yeah, yeah, yeah, but, um.
I'm on the blue team. Let's explain what that means
2nd and 3rd graders and uh they're just the best.
(00:58):
I love the class that I have. We have uh
16 kids and they are absolutely amazing. So we, we
do all these activities we're talking about the mystery of God.
So day one was the mystery of God's, um.
The mystery of God's identity. The second day is the
(01:21):
mystery of God's power, and today was the mystery of God's, um, mercy.
But when we say mystery, we're talking about the revelation.
So it's just like a great storyline and I have
to say that the whole curriculum that we're doing, can
you tell I've had 3 cups of coffee just to
be ready for the kids.
But the curriculum that we're doing was actually written by
(01:43):
the staff of Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa and it was
also illustrated by the staff of Calvary Costa Mesa. We've
got this band that's playing and the lead guitarist is.
Our 14 year old grandson and one of the dancers
happens to be our granddaughter Evelyn and I mean we
(02:03):
are just, I have to say that I'm keep myself
from crying because it is the curriculum is so good
and I'm so blessed by the cooperation of everybody to
make this happen. It's just absolutely amazing. And I also
think that it's really very tender.
When you consider that we all get to meet like
(02:25):
this in a group and we fall in love with
the kids and you think about the tragedy in Texas.
Where they were doing something just like this, you know,
studying the Bible, learning about God and nature, and this
flood came. And so I think it makes you even
more appreciative and more like in awe of what we
(02:47):
have here is really tender, very special, and not to
be just taken lightly. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
And uh I think empathetic too because you know, the
kids that you're with and you think of those other
children and the families and that, you know, that's always the,
the most challenging part of these things, you know, I've
just thought a lot about the family, you know, the
parents and the siblings and the grandparents and you know
(03:16):
everybody and I mean you, you know, you think you
send your child off to.
Bible camp for the week and they don't come home
because of the catastrophe and that that's difficult stuff to
to wrestle with and somebody was asking me about that
and I said, you know, yeah, it's it's very difficult
(03:38):
and there's no, you know, there is no easy answer like, well,
you know, hey, God has a better plan and but,
but there is the reality that.
There is heaven.
And that those, um, you know, whose lives were lost
in that, in that tragic situation, they've gone, they have
(04:01):
literally gone into the presence of the Lord to be forever.
Comforted and very safe, safe,
yeah,
Speaker 2 (04:12):
and you think about how you know in Revelation it
talks about how Jesus will wipe every tear from our
eyes and there will be no more sorrow, no more pain,
no more tragedy. I mean just the the safety and
the love and then I like to think of um
Psalm 16.
Where it says at his right hand are pleasures forevermore
(04:33):
like heaven is full of delights and pleasures and then
there's plans that you know we're not gonna be in
heaven forever we're gonna come back to earth totally improved
and we're gonna be part of the improvement process for
1000 years and then a new heaven and a new
earth where righteousness dwells and I mean.
(04:55):
I think about Jesus said I've said this that you
might have eternal life. I was just thinking, you know,
Jesus talking to the disciples because I'm in John 13
right now, my personal devotions just about eternal life like wow,
you know, it's already with us it's in us, um,
reading about those two sisters that were found clinging to
(05:16):
each other with a rosary in their hands just clinging
to each other, you think that is so so.
Precious and you know they believed in Jesus you know
they're in the presence of the
Lord.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
I just read as you know I just I just
read a book by Ray Ortland um.
Finding God at rock bottom.
And um it's such a great book, but the, the
final chapter is, you know, the the chapters are about
like difficult life experiences. So one chapter is betrayed, um,
(05:48):
another chapter is trapped, another chapter is um lonely. The
final chapter is dying, and he, you know, he just
talks about the inevitability of death, but
He also talks about the reality of the glory of
death and in in ways that only Ray could do,
you know, he's just painting these pictures of, you know,
(06:10):
people hooting and hollering and jumping and doing backflips and like,
you know, when you get there, it's like, oh my gosh,
this is the greatest party that that you get nobody
could even imagine. And and you think like, yeah, we
need to think more about that reality of
Of heaven, the presence of the Lord, and like you said,
Psalm 16 in your presence is fullness of joy At
(06:30):
your right hand is pleasure forevermore.
That is the
That's the
The
Speaker 2 (06:39):
hope and glory.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Yeah, the, that's the lining, the silver lining in the
dark cloud. Well,
Speaker 2 (06:45):
you know, in Titus, um, Paul starts out, you know,
Paul is a servant of of the Lord Jesus Christ,
and then he talks about how his call and his
apostleship is all, um, to tell people about the eternal
hope that they have through Jesus Christ, um, and God,
who God who cannot lie has promised us even before
(07:06):
the world began.
God had a plan to make men and women live
forever in glory and you just think about OK, God's
intention is glory forevermore.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Yeah, and the book is Good News at Rock Bottom. Yes,
just found it online. Good news at Rock Bottom. I keep,
I keep giving the wrong title. I know Rock Bottom
is in there. OK.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
One of the reasons he's giving the wrong title is
we were in New York until Sunday, and he got
so sick while we were in New York and so
he's just in recovery. Now
Speaker 1 (07:43):
he is better.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Yeah, he tried to give it away.
He tried really hard to give it away and I'm
on every weird vitamin. I I have this stuff called
coldop that I take and Lysine that I take and
vitamin C that I take. I mean, I am turning
into just one large vitamin at this point just to
(08:05):
keep all the germs at bays what you do. That's
why I get it. Well, especially because you're working with
kids every day.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Yeah, yeah.
All right, uh, let's open the lines 888-564-6173, but first, uh,
somebody wrote in through the Kwave.com pastor's perspective page on
the same topic we were just discussing. So let me
read Evan's question. He listens to us on the Kwave
app in South Pasadena.
And he writes, I have some questions regarding God's will
(08:33):
and plan, as we've all heard of the tragedy regarding
the flooding in Texas and in particular the deaths of
the campers and counselors at Camp Mystic, a Christian summer camp.
My question is that we always hear God has a
plan for us and things that happen are God's will.
How can one explain
God's plan and this tragedy to the victims' families and
loved ones. Also, how can this be God's will? This
(08:55):
was not like a mass shooting where some explained that
these evil people have free will, so I have a
difficult time understanding this. Also, how does one explain that
it was a miracle when someone is saved in tragedies,
as it seems to imply.
God was watching out for the one who was saved
versus the others who perished. It seems to me that
(09:16):
Christianity also lost out as these 27 people that passed
would have spread the word of God had this not
happened and potentially converted many to God. So I don't
understand how these things can be God's will or His
plan for these victims.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
I
don't think it is God's will. I mean, if, if
it's not God's will that any should perish, but I'll
come to eternal life, and I think that's a mistake
we made because
Um, it says in Romans 8:28 that God will work
together all things to his goodwill. So not everything that
(09:50):
happens is God's will. We've got to remember that Satan
is the prince of the air, and I want you
to think for a second about the book of Job, right?
So Satan says, I want to, I want to show
you that Job is not sincere.
And I want to show you that he's only serving you, God,
because of the good you do. So God says, OK,
(10:12):
what's your plan of action? And Job said, just let
me have, I mean, Satan said, Let me have it, Job.
Let me have free reign to do. And you know,
it's interesting because Satan is merciless when it comes to Job.
He sends this, uh, this, this wind that falls in
on the house and kills all Job's children.
(10:32):
He sends the Sybeans in to steal all of Job's crops,
and it just goes from bad to worse. Job gets sores,
and Job, like Job's friends, mistakenly concludes that this is
God doing this to him and even that this is
God's will, and it's not till the end of the
book that we realize none of this was God's will,
(10:54):
none of it. But what God says is, I'll take
the worst that has happened to you, Job, and I
will make it.
I will compensate you on earth, and I will hold
you and and bring you into heaven. And so what
I think that God wants us to know is not
(11:15):
all tragedy is His will. Satan is the prince of
the air and he is always trying to destroy God's work.
So I think what you could say is, well, why
did God allow it? Well,
There's certain things that are just going to happen in
this world because it's a consequence. Sometimes it's a consequence
(11:39):
of men not making the right preparations for flooding, right?
I read so many articles that they were warned that
this could happen and nobody made the proper precautions and
the other people didn't even know that this was a possibility.
So I think you've got a lot of of um
factors that are going into this and.
(12:01):
That um we cannot conclude that this is God's plan,
but what we can conclude is that God will take
tragedy and he'll compensate, especially in heaven, for every terrible
thing that happens on earth.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Evan, thank you for sending in your question through the
Kwave.com pastor's perspective page. 888-564-6173 is our number, and, uh,
now we're gonna talk to Laura, who is in Upland
listening on FM 107.9 Kwave. Hey, Laura, what's going on? Oh.
Can you hear me? Yeah.
(12:37):
Great. So, I know demonic activity is supposed to increase,
especially in the last days.
And I'm experiencing something with my husband. This is the
3rd time over the weekend at my dad's house, where
he has gone to sleep and then shortly after he's
been paralyzed in his sleep and he opens his eyes
and he can see light.
(12:59):
And he's struggling to move and it wakes me up
and scares me because he's trying to grab me. I
have no idea what's going on and I'm trying to
figure out is this some sort of psychosis or is
this demonic warfare because I keep telling him about idols
and not having idols in the house, and I've witnessed
to my dad recently as well.
And this happened in his house. The other two times
(13:21):
were at our own house.
So, and, and so what happens like when he wakes up?
Uh, he opens his eyes and he can't move. He's paralyzed.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Even in the morning, like
Speaker 1 (13:35):
it's in the middle of the night. OK,
Speaker 2 (13:37):
but when he wakes up in the morning, does he
remember it?
Speaker 1 (13:40):
Well, yes, because I sit up and I talk to
him about it in the middle of the night because
it freaks me out so is, is, um.
So what, what's his life like the rest of the time, uh,
you know, during the day? Does he just go about
a normal life? Does he go to work? Does he?
And what are these idols that you say he has
(14:03):
in his house, in the house? Um, they, they could
be just things that are offensive to God, maybe a
drug paraphernalia type of a company. Um, I don't want
to give all the companies.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Right, got it.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Uh, you know, people that might support Planned Parenthood or
outright kind of stuff like that. Yeah, well, you know,
things like that. Yeah, those, none of those things are
are necessarily gonna, you know, bring like heavy demonic presence
or activity.
Um, I think, you know, there's he's doing on the side.
(14:40):
That's what I don't know. Yeah, but what's he like normally?
Is he just a normal guy apart from these episodes
when he's sleeping?
Uh, for the most part, yeah. OK. Now, you know,
you know, there are different things that, um, there, there's
something called night terrors, for example, um, and, you know,
(15:00):
there are people who walk in their sleep. So there,
there are things that happen sometimes in the context of
sleep that we don't necessarily understand exactly what they are,
but they're they're real experiences, they're weird experiences, but
Um, you know, who, who knows what or why. So
(15:21):
I wouldn't
I wouldn't say that, I mean, it's bizarre what's happening,
but I wouldn't say, oh, it's automatically demonic because this
is just so, so weird. I would think that there's
probably some other explanation for it. And the fact that
he's like you're saying, I mean, you know, he's relatively
normal apart from these episodes, um, I think that you're
(15:45):
just dealing with something that's either
Um, rooted in things that are going on in his body.
It could be, you know, to some degree, psychological or emotional,
but uh, I don't think it's directly
demonic.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
You know, we had a weird experience with one of
our children. I actually gave one of our children, um.
It was half of a um what do you want
to say an antihistamine kind of a fizzy thing. It
was an Alka-Seltzer Plus, but it was something that they
took off the market since.
And I gave him a half of one and it
seemed to stay in the system for over what was
it 2 years, at least a year, and he would get,
(16:25):
he would like fall asleep and then he would get
up and he would talk to you and you thought,
you know, something's just a little off and then he
called us, what did he call us like Frank and
and Carol or he gave us these weird names this
one time like I know who you are. Oh, you're
Hank and Kathy and we're like uh no.
And then he said, you know, you've got to stop
(16:46):
those machines from um taking our house down the machines
are outside and so we began to realize that he
was getting up and he was sleepwalking constantly and it
was hard to tell when he was awake when he
was asleep and though we knew it wasn't demonic, we
knew it was brought out by these, you know, obviously
we went to the doctor and he said it's the antihistamine,
(17:06):
this is dangerous.
But my husband kept taking them to the elders of
the church, and for every time we'd have an episode,
my husband would take our son back to the elders
of the church. They would lay hands on him and
they would pray. And, you know, he and I, uh,
Brian and I would pray for our son every time
we would just lay hands. And you know, it wasn't
(17:29):
like an immediate deliverance, but we knew that the constant
prayer and the laying on of hands was what in
the end.
the healing and the deliverance. So it might be all
sorts of factors. It might be a psychosis, it might be, um, biological.
He might be doing something like you said on the side,
(17:49):
which is actually causing this, and God is allowing it
for his chastening so he can be saved.
But at the end of the day, seeking the Lord
is always the first and the best, and the Lord
will direct you from there, you know, Jesus said, seek
first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all
(18:10):
these things will be added to you and.
Matthew chapter 6 verse 33. So I would say keep praying,
keep praying. And then when he wakes up and starts doing,
start praying out loud, start saying, Lord, you see what
he is, he's paralyzed. We're calling on you right now.
I don't know what he's done. I don't know what
he's doing. I don't know if this is something he's
(18:31):
bringing on himself. I don't know if this is demonic,
but we give this to you in the name of Jesus,
and we're asking for your intervention and help, and that's
what I would do, I mean.
I grew up in a family that, you know, you
fall down my mom automatically started praying. I mean, we
prayed about literally everything and you know.
(18:52):
It worked.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Laura, what do you think?
Yeah, I think that's great. I do think that there's
something else going on. I had him read Joshua 24,
the whole chapter last
night.
It's about the idols and obeying God. Yeah, struggling right now,
I think with obeying God back and
Speaker 2 (19:12):
forth. Yeah, well, this, this ought to get him
Speaker 1 (19:14):
straight.
Yeah, I mean, you know, this obeying God is never
a good idea so.
If this is what it takes to get him right
with the Lord, then you
Speaker 2 (19:24):
know, this might be one of those prayers, Lord, do
whatever it takes the Lord's going, OK, here we go.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
Laura, thanks for calling in today on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173
is our number. It's Wednesday. I know you're hearing Cheryl,
so you might think this is a rerun from some
previous Friday, but no, she's here with us on this Wednesday,
and Brian Broderson's her too. And so, you know, you
ask the question.
Initially, how did you end up here today, Cheryl? And
(19:51):
she told you the story of VBSS, but she never
actually that's true because
Speaker 2 (19:57):
I'm here because of VBS. I happened to be at
the church and then I came over to eat lunch
Speaker 1 (20:01):
with you here because we were together upstairs drove
Speaker 2 (20:06):
separately
Speaker 1 (20:06):
office and we were
Speaker 2 (20:09):
office.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
I like that. You were doing some business stuff. I
was doing some stuff and then
I got a message from you that our friend Ed
Stetzer was not going to be with us today. And
so then there was a little bit of panic like,
oh no, what are we gonna do? And I said,
don't worry about it. I can take care of it.
(20:31):
And you wholeheartedly agreed, but then I thought, well, look,
Cheryl is right here.
I will grab her and she can come and do
the radio. What
Speaker 2 (20:41):
he said is that I was, I was grabbing my
keys and I've got some chicken here for our dog Barnabas,
and I heard, come on. And I said, we didn't
drive together and he said, no, we're doing K-wave right now.
I said, it's not Friday, which is maybe what the
listeners are saying right now, but it's not Friday. And
he said, it doesn't matter. Ed can't make it. You're
(21:01):
his replacement. I'm like, oh, I'm Ed.
Stetzer's
Speaker 1 (21:05):
replacement and Ed
would be, he would be proud for replacement. You're you're
one of his
favorites.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Ed is so thrilled right now. If he could hear
if he could only hear.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
All right, 888-564-6173. Here's Tony listening to us in Altaloma
on the Kwave app. Hey, Tony, how can we help
you today?
Good afternoon. I guess my question has to do with
evolution and creation with um some of my friends that
are teetering with their faith or maybe some that have
(21:37):
lost it and they're agnostic. I would just simply say
to them, Well, what do you think crossed with a
giraffe that give it its long neck? You still see.
You see a tuna trying to jump out of the
water and all of a sudden walk around and legs
pop out of its body. Why do snakes not have
any legs, if so, and I'm just kind of wondering
(22:00):
if I'm correct in thinking this way and and telling
my friends this, you know, just look around, look at
all of the creation that that's out there, the fact
that we laugh, that we get goosebumps, that
We love and have all these emotions. Yeah, I, I
think all of that stuff is great. I just keep,
you know, just keep sharing with them and you know, it's,
(22:23):
it's so funny to think that that people are still
gravitating toward these alternative.
Views of of reality and so forth. But um and
I say it's funny because there there are so many
people who are um
(22:44):
Intellectuals, uh, people who have been very um openly aggressively
against the Christian faith and uh who are now
You know, completely rethinking everything. They've written books against the faith,
they've written books in support of naturalism and so forth.
(23:06):
And now they're saying, yeah, I don't know, I think
I might have got a lot of that stuff wrong,
you know, so, so it's just funny to me that
people are, are at the present moment going, yeah, I
think I'll, I think I'll go for this theory when
so many people who were the main proponents of the
theory for decades are now saying,
Yeah, I, I don't think
that's
Speaker 2 (23:26):
you know what Brian and I were just in New
York last week, and we actually our daughter lives with
a forest right behind it backs up to her house
and we would cross this highway, little dangerous and there
was a neighborhood there that we could walk in and
we saw a fawn, we saw bunnies we saw all
(23:48):
sorts of birds and.
Um, just nature, we were so surrounded by nature and
we were so.
In awe and you know when you're surrounded by nature
like when has man ever made a tree or when
has man ever made a bunny rabbit, right? And it's like,
(24:08):
you know, start with the same ingredients God used, but
they haven't even done it in a science lab. They
can't create all the same beauty. They can't replicate the
life and.
I once heard a Bible study by a scientist named
Tom Merton who just talked about the miracle of one
(24:28):
bird feather, and then he was talking about the different
feathers that birds have, but he was just talking about
how ingenious bird feathers are, and he said, I can
convince you that there's a creator with a feather.
And I'm telling you by the end of his talk,
and I was already convinced, but by the end of
(24:49):
his talk all you could say was wow glory and
you think about all the different types of birds God
has created and all those feathers and the glory and
you know we were looking at pine trees and oak
trees and mulberry trees and uh maple trees and just.
(25:12):
Thinking about how glorious our God is and of course
daffodils grow wild there in New York and just taken
back by all the glory actually my son-in-law has a
gym there and he was saying they saw a couple
bear cubs that uh they have glass and they were
looking out and they saw bear cubs and you're just thinking, Lord,
you are amazing.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
And, and.
You know,
Speaker 2 (25:36):
so I'm with you, Tony. I think that's a great
way
Speaker 1 (25:39):
to speak about it, you know, to.
Take it to the idea of um
You know, where there's a design or where would you
ever see a design without a designer? Um, you know,
in anything that we know today that is our son, uh,
(26:01):
one of our sons is a, um,
He's a computer guy. He's a coder. And sometimes, you know,
he will talk to me about how, you know, code
is so, it's, it's so it's it's, it's like an
evidence that, you know, nothing can naturally develop on its own.
(26:25):
Somebody has to give the input.
And of course, when you look at DNA DNA is
the most complex, um,
The thing in the world, you know, it contains this
unbelievable code of millions of letters and so forth, and
that is how everything is designed through DNA.
(26:47):
And so how could you think that you could have
and his, his thing is how could you have a
code without a
coder? Yeah,
Speaker 2 (26:54):
and you think about every single cell of your body
has a DNA every single cell, you know, just think
about um creation, um, I'm talking about a baby and
how a baby starts with, you know, um, these two
cells that come together and they join and then somehow
these cells begin to replicate.
And some of those cells go excuse us, we're gonna
(27:15):
be leaving you now we're the brain cells and these
other ones go, oh, and we're the heart cells and
they all came out of just two cells combining and
then they begin to replicate and the others are going,
excuse me, we're.
Part of the skeletal system. Oh, I'm gonna go down
to the phalanges, you know, and they go to these
different parts and they become, you know, 12 systems and
(27:40):
organs and, and they all cooperate together, you know, and
you're just thinking I am fearfully and wonderfully made, uh, somebody, um,
Doctor Wilder Smith wrote a book years ago called He
Who Thinks Has to Believe.
And um it's excellent. I read another book that was
(28:01):
just talking I Doctor Jeffrey something on just your anatomy.
He's a Christian, a scientist, he's German, and he wrote
this book. I read it. I remember.
I would have to close each chapter and just begin
to praise the Lord for the awesomeness of creation, and
that was just my own creation as he was talking
(28:22):
about how the body is so intricately created by.
God and all the systems working and it was um
just amazing. Yeah, and,
Speaker 1 (28:33):
and you know, there, there's so much we're
just and that's not even the surface like you said,
the
Speaker 2 (28:38):
giraffe with a long neck.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
There's, there's so much um material as well, so many
brilliant minds. Um, look up this guy online, uh, Doctor
James Tour, T O U R.
Um, he's probably the world's foremost chemist, and he is
a solid believer, and I, I see him on Instagram
(29:03):
all the time, and he does his little, you know, he,
he has his little post of him discussing something, answering
a question, and he's absolutely brilliant, and he's, um, you know,
I think you will find that, uh, encouraging yourself and
you can pass that off to your friends, but also
remember this.
(29:23):
These kinds of things are basically excuses for why I
really just don't want to follow God. So, you know,
I want to do my thing and so I'm gonna
latch on to this, this debunked theory, but I'm gonna
hold on to it because it'll give me a little
space to do what I want rather than do what
(29:44):
God wants me to do. So that's really what's underneath
it all.
Tony, thanks for your phone call today on Pastor's Perspective.
We've got to take a break. We'll be back in
a few minutes with more of your questions. Call in.
We are live on this Wednesday, the 9th of July
at 888-564-6173 with Brian and Cheryl Broderson.
(30:05):
You know,
Welcome back to Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is the number to
call us today. We're here live until 4 o'clock on
(30:25):
this Wednesday, and we would love to talk to you, 888-564-6173.
Let us go now to Sean, who is calling in
from Lake Forest, listening on FM 107.9K wave. What's your
question for us today, Sean?
Hey guys, um, I was calling because I, I heard
Cheryl mention earlier about God having a plan for men
(30:47):
to live forever. Um, I know I've always struggled with
this if that's the right one or omni,
Speaker 2 (30:54):
one
Speaker 1 (30:54):
of the
Speaker 2 (30:55):
one
of those omni words.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
And it's like, if he had a plan, then that,
then he's God. So, uh, he knew if he, he knew,
obviously when he was gonna, he knows he sees everything
with the foreknowledge. So this is, whatever happened was supposed
to happen. He didn't create Adam and Eve and was
surprised by what happened. He had, obviously, he knows, I
want man to live forever. He created Adam, he created Eve,
(31:20):
and sin fell into the world and we were cursed forever,
and then Jesus came. I get that, but
Whenever I say God, here's what he wanted and it's
almost like he intervened with Jesus, he, that was the plan.
I mean, he knew that he doesn't need to intervene
on something that he already knew was gonna happen, you
know what I mean, if that makes any
sense.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
Yeah, but he did but it says that Jesus was slain.
Um, from the foundation of the earth, God knew that
there would have to be a plan of salvation. So
I think what, what the problem is, is we're stopping
the plans of God right here where we are right now,
instead of recognizing that the plans of God are eternal,
(32:03):
that there's something up ahead that we're not yet seen.
It's like reading half the book.
And we don't know the next chapter and the chapter
after that. And I think that's why we have revelation
in the Bible too, to show us that this is
only part of it, but it's necessary according to God's
righteousness and His justice that he do it.
(32:26):
The way he did it, so you've got to understand too,
because I think one of the things that we say
is that God is not limited, but God is limited
in the fact that he always has to work according
to righteousness and according to justice and we're told in
the Bible God who cannot lie.
So because he's a God of truth, he cannot lie.
(32:49):
And so, uh, you know, there's just these things that
we cannot with our finite mind understand and as Tim
Keller said, if we could understand God or all his ways,
he would be our equal and not our superior. So
we've got to laugh for some mystery in this relationship
with God because he is God, but.
(33:12):
It has to do really with his righteousness because if
man only served him because there was no other choice,
if man only loved him.
Because there was no other choice, then it wouldn't be sincere,
it wouldn't be authentic. And so God had to make
these allowances for a fall. He had to, to do
(33:33):
all this to bring us to the glory that he
intends to yet be. I hope that makes sense because
on some days to me it totally makes sense, and
on other days I'm struggling with it to be really honest.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
Does that make sense,
Sean?
Yeah, to an extent, I mean, she said if God
big enough from small enough for me to understand its
big enough for me to worship, but sometimes when they
say like.
He saw that this happened, but it's like, he knew,
he knows like, I don't know what's gonna happen and
I don't know where I'm headed. Boy, I have faith
(34:08):
that I am, but he knows the ultimate choice and
he knows.
But sometimes when I hear he had a plan, or
initially was the plan, like, I don't know if that
was the initial plan per se, because he knew that
was gonna fall into the world and some people would perish.
So I don't. Yeah, well, you know, it's interesting if
you think about it, and I, and I don't know
that we, we think about it this way too often,
(34:31):
but if you think
So like Cheryl referred to the passage of Jesus being
a lamb slain before the foundation of the world. So before,
before there's ever a creation, I, I think sometimes we
kind of start with creation. Well, God created the world,
he created it all beautiful and then it all went wrong,
and then he, you know, he, he had a plan.
But before he ever created anything,
(34:52):
He already knew, you know, so he's gonna create a
world where he is going to have creatures that he
will have eternal relations with, but he also knows that
in in
In the, you know, the process of doing this, um,
sin is gonna enter the world and these creatures are
gonna rebel against him, and he's gonna redeem them through
(35:14):
his son. So all of this is already known. So right,
there's there's nothing that God is taken by surprise with,
but I think where people sometimes get tripped up is
God knowing versus God causing. So some people think, well,
you know, why did God cause that to happen?
Well, he didn't cause it to happen, but he knew
(35:36):
it would happen, and he allowed it to happen, so.
But you know, these are things that people have been
grappling with for centuries, so it's not, it, it's not
a wrong that at times you can't get your head
around it. Like Cheryl said, sometimes it's also so clear
and you're just like, oh this is amazing. And then
other times you're like, wait, OK, what?
Speaker 2 (35:57):
Yeah, come back to me, to me, come back, yeah,
and a lot of it has to do with the
fact that he gives us free.
Choice and had it not been for that if we
if he didn't give man free choice there would not
be sin in this world there wouldn't be um people
making bad choices, but he gives us the dignity to
(36:21):
make a choice even if it's against him, you know, um,
my mother had dementia and I remember taking her to
the doctor and.
Um, she, she refused any medication that could have, um,
slowed the progress, and of course that, you know, broke
my heart and the heart of the sibling I was
with at the time, and the doctor called us aside
(36:43):
and he said, there's something that you can give your
mother right now, and that's her dignity, and that's the
ability to make decisions even if they're wrong decisions or
even if they're decisions you don't agree with. You're giving
her the right.
To make decisions and God actually dignifies creation, you know,
men and women, men and women by allowing them to
(37:07):
make even bad decisions and that's a hard thing to
wrap your, your head around but it's part of his,
his goodness it's part of his righteousness and it's part
of his justice.
That he gives men and women the right and the
dignity even to make wrong decisions and all of that
(37:29):
had to be in order to bring us in to
the ultimate um.
The ultimate purposes of God. Do we live in a
world that um where God's purposes are constantly seen? No,
but we do have enough of the residual beauty that
(37:52):
God created that makes us responsible uh to make a
choice for God.
Speaker 1 (37:58):
Would you say that dignity is similar to how parents
have to give their kids the choice to make wrong
decisions eventually? I mean, especially, yeah, yeah, not when they're
3 and they want to run into
Speaker 2 (38:11):
the middle of this is where I bring Galatians in
like the law was there until you were old enough,
you know, until you became an adult. And so I
believe that, you know.
Children are under the law until they're wise enough to
make wise decisions. But yeah, you have to, you know,
our kids are all grown and we don't agree with
every decision, but we have to support those decisions, even
(38:34):
the ones we don't agree with, you know, uh, we
have a grandson that's not living a life that we
would like to see and we know that he's in,
in some of his decisions, he's really hurting himself, so
we keep offering the right decisions to him.
But we love him no matter what, but we know
it's in his best interest if he made better decisions,
(38:54):
and we suggest those better decisions to him constantly but
you know we do not, you know, we don't force him,
we don't try to force him, we don't say, hey,
we're not giving you a Christmas present unless you know
you do what grandma and grandpa said, uh, we're just
kind of like, look, we love you no matter what,
but we do think some of your choices are hurting you,
(39:14):
you know.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Sean, thanks for your phone call today here on
Speaker 2 (39:17):
thanks for thinking so deeply and keep it up because
the Lord has an answer for you and so I
would continue to pray and talk to the Lord say, Lord,
these are things that I don't understand. One of the
things I love is that it says in Luke 24
that he opened up their understanding. And so just say
to the Lord, Lord, open up my understanding, and he
(39:40):
will because remember.
Our relationship with Jesus is relational, he said. My sheep
hear my voice. He wants to speak into you. He
wants to speak over you, and he wants to make
certain things so understandable and so clear. So pray for
those insights, and God will give them to you. Like
I said, I have my days that everything's so clear.
Speaker 1 (40:03):
888-564-6173. Stanley in Los Angeles, you're next on Pastor's Perspective.
Thanks for calling in.
Hi. Um, thank you so much. I tried to call
many times because
I had to give a thank you for all your
pastors because uh 3, like 3 weeks ago, my cousin
(40:25):
uh uh as a surgeon's uh officer killed by 44
or 5 to try to help others.
Speaker 2 (40:31):
Oh, I'm so sorry.
Speaker 1 (40:34):
Uh, um, but thank you.
Well, uh thank you for your prayer and asking the question. Um,
my sister-in-law, new sister-in-law, I thank you. I, um.
Um, thank you. Um, the question I had is, uh, because, uh,
(40:59):
since all the elderly uncles, they all die, um, on
the left that my cousin's father who in the senior
home is 86 years old. Uh, his mind good. He
just physical condition no good. We had you know start
(41:20):
July 24.
Um, well, we've been talking with my cousins. They plan on,
first of all, they are not believers, and I need
to let you guys pray for them because
Um, for me, before I become a Christian, is I
don't believe God. Then after my father, I was in
(41:42):
the military, my father died. That's tragedy bring me into
the restaurant business and I met the Christian and bring
me into.
Christ. And from that, all my brothers, my mother, my
family all except the Lord. Matter of fact, my brother
even served in the church. So I praise the Lord
(42:04):
and all His glory. But my thing is this though,
first I need today finish up, the question is, first,
do we have to tell him and my cousin, they
said they're going to tell.
Um, I pray for asking your perspect, should we tell
or not, because if they we take him to the
(42:25):
over there, we don't wanna get shocked.
Mhm. Mhm. OK, so the question is, do you tell
him about the death of your cousin? Is that, is
that his my uncle, uncle,
Speaker 2 (42:41):
yeah.
Speaker 1 (42:42):
Oh,
he's 50 year old. OK, so, so this is his,
his son who died.
Yes, the, the police officer. OK, wow, yeah. So what
is the what is the immediate family say that they
want to do? They want to tell him?
Calling and I wanna know what respect for you guys
(43:03):
and also the mother is a dimension and she knows
her son if he that funeral we're taking her to
the funeral because there's no mother taking it because the
funeral is still on July 24 if I take her,
you want to be.
She would only tell her to bring or not. I mean,
(43:26):
I just, I mean they, the, the immediate my uh
my cousin, they said they're gonna take it. I just want. That's,
that's question. And then the one for my uh is
11 more thing is I ask you pray for my cousin. Oh,
Speaker 2 (43:42):
absolutely,
Speaker 1 (43:44):
because they not believer, I try to.
Preaching many times, share this gospel, they never believe. I
even shared my, my uncle before too, in his senior home.
Oh I'm saying this in this short time, I want
them to know that because we are, we are, I'm
a 60 group, ages are like group. I mean, we,
(44:08):
how long you live for this earth? We don't, we
need to know the Lord Jesus Christ. Yeah. What would
you guys say to Stanley?
Well
Speaker 2 (44:19):
it sounds like Stanley's got an anointing, and I think
that he's got the gospel down and I would say
if the Lord gives him a way to present it.
To his uncle with uncle, you know, your son.
You know, has gone and you know we in times
(44:40):
like this where we don't know if a person is
saved or not, we fall back on the mercy of
the Lord and just hope that they called out to
the Lord.
Speaker 1 (44:48):
Yeah, and I, I think that.
You know, with his, his, his son, his immediate family.
Your cousins, so forth. I think in some ways you
just have to let them do whatever they feel is
best to do. Yeah, and then you just have to
(45:12):
trust in and just be there to, you know, just
be the person that you are in Christ and see
what God will do. But, um, you know, we're gonna
pray for this situation.
Because it is very challenging and Lord, so we just
ask that you would help in this situation, give wisdom
and and you know, comfort, and we pray through the
(45:36):
the service, the funeral, the memorial service, we pray through
all of it, that somehow you would be um magnified
and that people would turn their hearts.
In faith toward you in Jesus' name,
Speaker 2 (45:52):
Lord, we also thank you that Stanley is a light
to this family that he knows you, that he knows
what it was to walk in darkness and now to
walk in light. Father, we pray that you would give
him the right words, the, uh, the right, um, Lord,
just everything that he needs, the right comfort in this
(46:13):
situation to speak over and speak into his family.
The words of life bless Stanley. Comfort him as he
seeks to bring the comfort of the Holy Spirit to
his family, and we thank you for him, and we
thank you for his, his life, Lord, and um, we
just pray that you would use him as, as, as
(46:35):
an ambassador of Jesus Christ to bring your comfort, um,
in this terrible tragiced in Jesus' name.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
Amen. Amen.
Amen. 888-564-6173. Here is Martha, who's listening to us on
the Kwave app in Santa Ana. Hi, Martha, thanks for
calling in today.
Hi, thank you for taking my call. Hi Cheryl and.
Hi Brian. I'm Brian. Hi. OK, well, I wanted to, um,
(47:05):
I wanted to, uh, your opinion on Zachariah 7,
Speaker 2 (47:10):
um, 9 through
Speaker 1 (47:11):
10, and Jeremiah 22 and 3.
They are, um,
Speaker 2 (47:18):
you probably know that they talk about how um we're
supposed to, um, you know, defend, defend the oppressed, and
I wanted to know what you think about because I'm
being confronted, well, being put in a, in a situation
where
(47:38):
I feel like
Like I'm questioning myself. All my life, I've been taught
the Lord to, you know, to love him with all
my heart and soul and to love one another. And um,
so when all the situation, what the world is um
happening right now with the detained and the, and the undocumented,
(48:03):
and we know that, you know,
That, that they, they, the what is occurring is a
civil um matter, um but um but the way it's
going about and um not giving them the due process, it,
(48:25):
I feel that the Lord has given me this compassion
towards them to pray for them, to ask for prayer
for them.
In the situation that they are being put, um, many
of them have been years trying to get their paperworks, um,
but it's hard to get your even a green card
(48:46):
or anything, um, to, and, and then for them to,
you know, you hear about the process when they're, they
have an appointment.
And,
Speaker 1 (48:57):
and then the judge drops it and then they get
arrested right there.
So what's your question for us, Martha?
My, my question is,
Speaker 2 (49:05):
is it OK to use these scriptures to say that
it's OK for us to pray for them? It is
Well, of course we should be praying for them. Yeah, yeah,
the only reason I'm saying this, Cheryl, is because I'm
I'm being questioned by sisters that I love. I know,
(49:25):
I know. I mean, is there, I know this is
another thing, unfortunately, that I'm seeing so much division over
and this is what we feel, that every person.
Man and woman, no matter what color, no matter what place,
no matter where they're living, they are, they are, um,
(49:47):
made by God in the image of God. And again,
you know, we're talking about dignity and if God gives
us each of dignity, um, I think that we owe
that and I think that there is a better way
to go about what's being done. I'll probably be in
trouble for saying that just like you're in trouble.
But I think that we owe every man and woman
(50:10):
their dignity and um you know I have got little
kids that can't come to Sunday school right now right?
because of what's going on in Santa Ana because they're
scared um we have Spanish fellowships that have been decimated
because the people are scared, is that right? Absolutely no.
And so I think that um.
(50:33):
You know, this is a really, really difficult situation. And yes,
we're glad for those who are able to come in legally,
but we do understand in certain parts of the country
that system is, is, is um.
Overly um taxed and you know like it it's hard
and it's difficult so I think the answer like you're
(50:56):
saying Martha is what you're saying is it all right
to have compassion? Absolutely. And what is compassion look like
for believers? Well, it's gonna look different for each of
us as the opportunity arises, isn't it? And I think
this is one of those situations, another scripture I would
give you is we have to obey God rather than man.
(51:16):
And whatever that looks like, I don't know, but I
know that that every man and woman on this earth.
Is my brother and sister as created by the Lord
Jesus Christ, and I owe them dignity. I owe them
(51:38):
respect and so I think that's um I think you
can definitely use those scriptures and just say this is
how I feel, this is what the Lord has given
me towards the situation.
And I think that's a great place to land. I
don't think, Martha, that you can go wrong with love.
I don't think you can go wrong with love or grace.
(51:59):
I think you're in the right company whenever we're acting
in love and grace, we're in the right company. And
so that's, it's a hard situation. It's a terrible place.
I'm like.
And like I said, I'm, you know, it's just um.
It's just really heartbreaking and we are praying, you know,
(52:21):
it says that in um.
First Timothy chapter 2. Paul says, I would that every
man give up wrath and doubting and just lift their
hands to the Lord and pray, and I think the
answer for this situation is we need to pray.
And we need to pray for our brothers and sisters
in Christ to have compassion and to show dignity. We
(52:42):
need to pray for our government to show dignity and
I think that we, we can be the, we can
be we can be the hands and the voice of
Jesus if we will just love and show compassion.
Speaker 1 (52:57):
Pastor Bryan, any thoughts?
Um, I, I mean, I, I agree. I think, um, I,
I read a quote the other day from a, a
person that I follow and think he's got a lot
of wisdom. He said he's, he's actually an attorney as well.
And he said, you know, there has to be a
way to um uphold the law.
(53:21):
And maintain um the dignity of a of a person simultaneously.
These are not mutually exclusive. And I think that that's
what we need to um strive for. Yeah, we need
to strive for, and we, you know, we've talked about
this a few times because this has been going on
a while, and I think, you know, one of the,
what we can do is as believers, we lead with compassion,
(53:44):
we lead with love, we lead with mercy. That's just
how we lead.
And then how do we, but how do we fix this,
the bigger problem, you know, uh, and that's where we
can pray that God would send somebody into the midst of, um,
you know, say ICE or whatever other aspect of law
(54:07):
enforcement it is, that would have a wiser approach, or
just say, hey, no, we, you know, we don't want
to do it that way, we want to do it
this way.
So, uh, this is such a complicated thing and there's
so many different perspectives and ideas and, you know, everybody
is an expert about everything these days, so they, everybody
thinks they know how to fix it and what, what
(54:28):
should be done. And we, we really don't. So our,
our role is to, you know, be Christians and, and
treat people as Jesus would have, uh, as Jesus would
treat them and, and, you know, how we should treat
them the same way as well and pray.
For the authorities that God will help them to do.
(54:49):
To do things in a way that's honoring human dignity.
Speaker 2 (54:53):
And don't you feel too that unfortunately we have these
two extremes and you're thinking both extremes are wrong. Could
we quit being extremists? And I mean, I feel like,
you know, when we come to vote they only give
us two extremes and
Speaker 1 (55:07):
we're like, well, Elon's going to fix that, you
know, he's gonna give us a
Speaker 2 (55:12):
let's go with Jesus instead.
Speaker 1 (55:14):
Yeah, Jesus, I'll take Jesus. Yes, indeed, Martha, thanks for calling.
in today on Pastor's Perspective, we're out of time, but
we will be back tomorrow between 3 and 4 and
would love to speak with you then if you are
watching today on Facebook or YouTube or Instagram. Thank you
for doing that. Make sure you like and subscribe and
you'll get notified every time we put out a new
(55:35):
video on YouTube, and we'll be back tomorrow from 3
to 4 for Brian and Cheryl Broderson. Thank you so
much for listening today. I'm Brian Perez. God bless.
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