October 14, 2025 • 56 mins
Pastors' Perspective is a one-hour call-in program where listeners can call in and get answers to questions about the Bible, Christianity, family, and life. The program is live Monday through Friday from 3:00 PM - 4:00 PM Pacific. You can call 888-564-6173 to ask your questions.
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Speaker 1 (00:15):
Hello and welcome to Pastor's Perspective. I'm your host, Brian Perez,
back from serving my civic duty for a few days.
It is so good to be back in the studio
with you guys. Special thanks to Michael David for covering
the past few days that I was gone, and, uh, yeah,
so here we are. What is this program? It's called
Pastor's Perspective, and we have a couple of pastors here
(00:37):
in the studio to answer the questions you might have
about the Bible, the Christian faith.
Life in general. We're going to be here until 4
o'clock and we would love to chat with you. The
phone number to call is 888-564-6173, toll-free. I don't even
know if that matters anymore, but needless to say, it's toll-free. 888-564-6173.
(00:59):
I guess that just goes back to the days when
if I were to call you Brian Broderson, it might
cost 10 cents a minute or whatever, and then things changed, and, yeah, yeah,
I mean, I guess it depends on your
Who your service is, right, for your mobile phone as
the British say.
Um, yeah, but I wanted to say, you know, um,
(01:23):
Being sequestered away.
In um that hidden location for your jury duty, I
noticed they didn't give you any razors or shaving cream.
So no, uh, I, I opted and I had a
choice between razors or cookies, and I took the cookies, yeah, because, yeah,
so of course, of course, always choose the cookies, always.
(01:46):
That's my motto. I mean, I, you should see the
bumper sticker on my car. It says that. No, it doesn't.
All right, 888-564-6173. The other voice you just heard is
Phil Metzger. He's the pastor of Calvary San Diego, and
he's joining us on Zoom. How you doing, Phil? Doing great.
Good to see you guys. Got a nice, uh, kinda
wet day today, huh? Totally, yes, yeah, it seems like
(02:09):
February instead of October. That's it. Totally. I'm always telling Cheryl, like,
you know.
Um, summer is still here in October. We're gonna have
a week of 90 degree weather, and she always argues
with me about it, and I always win. But
She might win this month because, um, yeah, it's supposed
(02:31):
to warm up by the end of the week. It's
supposed to be high 70s, so we'll see, we'll see
what happens. We shall see crazy weather, but uh we're
still thankful to be here in Southern California. That's for sure.
All right, so give us a call at 888-564-6173. If
you're watching on Facebook, YouTube or Instagram. Thanks for watching.
Make sure to, uh, like and subscribe and all that
(02:53):
other good stuff. Share this page with your friends so
that they can call in and ask their questions at 888-564-6173.
You can also submit your questions online on Facebook, or, um,
Instagram or on our radio station's website, Kwave.com. Look for
the pastor's perspective page, and you can submit your question
(03:15):
that way. In fact, that is what William did. William
is in Chino.
And he asks what is the difference between the names
of God Adonai, Yahweh, Jehovah, Elohim Can each name be
used interchangeably for God the Father, God the Son, God
the Spirit, or the names used for the Trinity? Phil Metzger,
(03:35):
what do you say to William?
Um, there, it would be difficult in the, you know,
we try to keep our answers kind of brief, so
it'd be hard to say like, well, let me go
through all the names of God and give you the definitions. I,
I definitely recommend like a good, like a, we, we
call them a concordance or like a Bible dictionary, and
you could look it up all the names of God
and get all the great meanings. For instance, you'll see like,
(03:56):
I'll I'll use an example. Like sometimes you'll see the
word Adonai, that could be used for Lord um like human,
but it's also used to describe God.
Um, but then there's other names that are specific to
God and so, um, definitely get a, get a concordance
or a Bible dictionary and look them up, um, you're
not gonna go wrong, um, if you go to like
a great Christian bookstore or Amazon, who goes, I don't know,
(04:18):
do people go to bookstores? Maybe they do. Uh, Amazon's great.
And then in terms of the names interchangeable, um.
Yeah, I mean, you know, Jesus and especially the Gospel
of John, he referred to himself by a name that
God the Father used freak, you know, in the book
of Exodus, where he says, I am that I am,
and then Jesus referred to himself as the I am. Now,
(04:38):
we don't see that every name was interchangeable by all
of them.
Um, but they all, you know, God the Father, God
the Son, God the Spirit, our God in the fullest
sense of it. So yes. And yes, people do go
to Christian bookstores. In fact, we have one here on campus.
It's on the other side. I can see it from, well, no,
I can't. There's trees on the way, but the chapel
(04:58):
store of Calvary Chapel, Costa Mesa open here 7 days
a week, varying hours, but that includes Sunday after services. Good,
I'm glad you mentioned that because I was gonna do it,
but you did it. Um, yeah, so.
Yes, Phil, everything you said, great, right? Um.
Yahweh and Jehovah.
(05:19):
So, these are two different attempts at
Discerning what the actual name of God.
is
So in the in the Hebrew.
Script, you have only consonants and then you have vowel sounds.
(05:43):
You have markers that indicate the vowel. So, um,
So, Yahweh is like we would look at it as YHWH.
And so it seems like the proper vowels there would
end up spelling Yahweh. Um, Jesus means Yah is salvation.
(06:07):
That's the if Yeshua is, you know, Shua is salvation,
Yah is, um, the name of God. Uh, Jehovah was
an attempt to, uh, pronounce the name of God by
taking the vowels of Adoni.
And putting them with the consonants Y H W H.
(06:28):
And so I think most people agreed today that that
probably wasn't the best idea, that that didn't really express
what the name of God is. You know, among Hebrews,
Hebrews won't pronounce the name of God. Uh, they say Hashem,
which means God, but the name, they actually refer to
the name which they consider sacred.
(06:51):
And uh the reason why we don't know the actual
spelling or pronunciation is because I think it's a Jewish superstition.
Some people think, oh, they just reverenced God so much
they wouldn't actually spell out his name. Seems to me
to be more superstition than, um, you know, kind of, um, reverence,
(07:12):
but
Be that as it may, um, and then the other,
what was the, there was a 4th Elohim Elohim, yeah.
So Elohim, so Yahweh would be the name of God.
This is like, like Phil said, I am. It means,
it means I am that I am. And so that
Moses says, who to, I'm gonna go to Pharaoh, you're
(07:32):
telling me to go to Pharaoh, who do I say
sent me? And the Lord says, say I am that
I am has sent you. So, say Yahweh has sent you, um.
Elohim is God.
Just uh actually God, literally, if you translate Elohim, I
am in Hebrew is what S is to English. So
(07:55):
it pluralizes it. So L is God and uh Elohim
is God's plural. And so it's more where Yahweh's the
name of God, like Phil is the name of the
human Phil, um.
(08:17):
Uh, Yahweh, Yahweh is the name of God. So, and
so Elohim is used of, of God, um, mostly, but
it's also used sometimes of angels and men. And so
that's where you make the, let's see a little bit
of a difference there. So, so like Elohim would be
(08:40):
like God in general. So we're just talking about God, um,
in a general sense.
Uh, Yahweh is talking about God in a very specific
and personal sense. Phil, hm, that's great. No, I, I, OK,
so I have nothing more to add to the great conversation, Brian,
but I did want to say this. I worked at
the bookstore. Hmm.
(09:01):
Yes, I used to, I worked at that bookstore for years.
It was great, and, uh, I don't know why I, um,
forgot that we have a great bookstore there. Yes, well,
that's OK. Well, uh, next time you come by up
here to Orange County, we'll, uh, take you to the
bookstore and we'll send you, show you the new little
area that we added there, the little, little reading gallery. Well,
lots of years have transpired since then, Phil, and lots
(09:23):
of things have changed, so it's, we won't.
Hold your um forgetfulness against you. I have to tell
you one of my funniest moments of working at the bookstore,
this is funny, um, they're 24/7, like you said, bro
7 days a week, right? And so Christmas morning was
on a Sunday that particular year, and um, and Pastor
(09:43):
Chuck was determined that, hey, we're always open on Sunday
for people to go in to buy books if they
need to, we're gonna be open.
And so me and my brother and one of our
best buddies, we were all working at the bookstore at
the same time, and we all volunteered to work on Christmas.
We're all like, you know, 17 or whatever. We didn't,
and we were like, dude, we're getting like overtime and
like we're getting pay and a half and we opened
(10:05):
up the bookstore 3 services. Nobody ever came in. We,
it was just really nobody. I don't think anybody knew
we were open.
It was Christmas, but it was a great, great, and
then Chuck was like, well, you know, we're not gonna
pay those guys because nobody ever shows up that would
have happened, yes, probably I'm joking about that. All right, uh, William,
(10:26):
thanks for sending in your question through the pastor's perspective
page on Kwave.com, which you can easily get to by.
Scanning the QR code if you're watching right now on Facebook, YouTube,
or Instagram. Phone calls now, 888-564-6173 is the number to
call for the next 50 minutes or so. Here is
(10:47):
Courtney calling in from Menefee, and Courtney listens to us
on Alexa. How does that work, Courtney, you just say, Alexa,
play Kwave 107.9.
Yeah, we found out how to do that when my
son was like a baby, and when he was like 1.5, yeah,
(11:08):
we would just say Alexa play K-wave on tune in
and so his one of his first words was Doctor
Tony Evans because he wake up that sick. Oh man,
that is classic, yes.
Yeah, we love Brian Broderson. Now he wakes up a
little later cause he's a little older, so we listen
(11:30):
to Brian Broderson at 7, so he knows all the
different pastors' voices, which is pretty, pretty fun. 5 years old,
that is so.
That is so great. Doctor Tony Evans. That's, that's classic. Yeah,
we gotta send them this clip over there uh not mom,
not Dad. Doctor Tony. You're like, OK, wait, what, what
(11:51):
is he saying? He's saying, Doctor, Doctor what? Doctor? That's
so good, you know, um, lots of lots of kids.
Um, listen, you know, like your, your son listening to Kwave,
some of them driving to school in the morning and
so forth, you know, they listen to Pastor Chuck and
like kids literally thought like, this is God, he's on
(12:14):
the radio and I'm listening to him on my way
to school.
Oh, that's cute. I never asked him like, what do
you think God sounds like? That would be interesting. He
sounds like Pastor Jack. Yeah, you just might.
Well, um, yeah, we actually have a question about our
5 year old. Um, like many 5 year olds, I
(12:34):
think that, you know, they see like Minecraft everywhere and
my son loves Minecraft, but he's never played Minecraft, that
deprived child.
I know. So anyways, um, so we've kept him from
any devices like an iPad or like a phone or
(12:55):
any handheld device. Just, you know, that's like some conviction
that we've had with parents, but, um,
Lately we've been contemplating and praying about getting him a
video game console for our family to play together, like
after dinner, you know, like we sometimes watch TV for
like an hour together, and instead of like watching TV,
(13:19):
playing like a family friendly video game. What do you
guys think about that? All right, Phil, wanna start? Yeah,
I think that sounds really fun.
I think that sounds like a great fun way to
and now just make sure your husband's not saying it
and wanting to secretly play once you all go to bed. Uh,
just kidding. Um, I, I think that's a great idea.
(13:40):
That sounds like a lot of fun. It's, it really
is wisdom to kind of, um, keep, you know, keep
your five year old away from like devices as long
as you can. But then to introduce that as like
a part of like family time.
That's really great. I, I think that's a great, great
use of family time, you know, TV is fine, but
you know, we all realize like you end up just
kind of in your own world when you're watching, right?
(14:01):
So this is kind of like a fun way. I,
I think it sounds like a lot of like a
great idea. Phil, how old is your oldest grandchild? My
oldest is 88. OK, always 8 this week actually, next week, yeah.
So then you, you kind of would have that experience.
So my youngest grandchild, well, actually my second youngest grandchild
is 5.
(14:21):
And um he loves Minecraft. And um so I agree, I,
I think it's a great idea. And I think just
like I'm sure, Courtney, you're going to do with your husband,
you're gonna monitor things, you're gonna keep it in perspective
and balance, uh, because these things, uh, you know, obviously
they can, you know, get hold of you. Uh, so
(14:41):
my 5 year old grandson, um, he does have those
moments where
Um, I remember my other older grandson kind of sat
him down and showed him all the ropes of Minecraft,
and then, uh, you could not get him, uh, you know,
to put the phone down. Thankfully, he doesn't have his
own phone, so you could take it away. But, um, so,
(15:02):
you know, they, these things can be highly addictive and
I think sometimes
You know, it's easy for parents and grandparents to like, here,
just take my phone and be quiet because I'm doing
something else, you know. So I think we just have
to be wise when it comes to all of that
stuff and realize that there's a lot to be enjoyed, um,
(15:22):
but then there's some
You know, cautions that we, we need to take as well. Yeah,
and if you guys are going to do like an
hour a day, I would say stick to that because
there might be, oh, can I just play a few
more minutes or another hour or whatever, you know, as
time goes on, you can kind of be more flexible,
you know, my, my youngest son, he's uh he's a
(15:43):
What is he? He's a tech web.
Developer guy and he's uh she and I were talking
like from the time he was 3 years old, this
kid could
You know, he, he kind of has like his grandpa,
Chuck Smith, you know, everybody understands that Chuck really had
like a photographic memory and if any of the grandkids
(16:06):
got it, it was my son Braden because he just
from the time he was like 3 years old, he, I,
I would put um a code on my computer so
nobody could get in. He break the code, you know,
he's like, like 3 years old. I'm like, wait, what
are you doing on my computer? I locked it. He goes, yeah,
I know. I just did this, this, this and that,
and it didn't opened.
How did you do that?
(16:28):
So and then he was the kid who, you know,
his whole life, it was a big battle between video
games and us and like those are terrible, they're gonna
destroy your life. And now he's like, ha ha, you see, yes,
this is my job and I'm building your website, so
are you sorry for all those mean things you said
about that?
Well, that's the truth though. It's like such a shifting
(16:49):
world that like you realize, gosh, you know, there's a
place where a lot of people, they're gonna make their
livings on how they handle, you know, the computer and
so I, I get it, but yeah, yeah, dude, I
don't know any parent any Christian parent at least that
hasn't had the question or even just non-Christian, when do
you start letting kids use, you know, these things and
everybody's wrestling through it, but these guys, you guys sound
(17:11):
like you're doing a great job.
Oh, thank you. Thank you. Yeah, we definitely just want
to get good advice, so you guys always um provide that.
So thank you so much. All right, thanks, Courtney. Yeah,
thanks for calling in today to Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is
the number. Brian Perez here with Pastors Brian Broderson and
(17:33):
Phil Metzger until 4 o'clock. We're gonna go to New
Jersey now. Here is Sam, who listens to us on TuneIn.
The TuneIn app, I should say. Hey, Sam, how can
we help you today?
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Hey guys, so, um, yeah, my, my question is, um.
Uh, it, when it says vengeance and minds, says the Lord,
it's OK, I get that, but it's kinda like when
people hurt you in life, you forgive them, but, you know,
It's like some people think that oh if you're under
(18:05):
the blood, you know, that you're, you, you pretty much
get away with anything because you, you got extra forgiveness,
even if I hurt you, extra forgiveness, you're, you're, you're,
you know, you're good, you know.
And people on the other side of the tracks and
Christian faith that think like, no, you're gonna get it
when you get to heaven because you're responsible. I just
wanna know like where you, where you guys fall on
(18:28):
that and if God, if, if it's true on the
left side, and why I said on the left side,
then why, why, why did God say it at all?
It doesn't.
So yeah, it's kind of confusing. I don't know if
you got all that, but.
That's my question. All right,
Speaker 1 (18:45):
Pastor Brian, what would you say to Sam?
Well, Sam, there's a passage in Romans, I think it's
Romans 12, where, um, you know, the the Lord is saying, uh,
do not avenge yourself. So if somebody
Uh, harms us or cheats us, or, you know, does
(19:06):
something bad to us, whatever it might be.
The natural tendency, usually for most people would be to get,
get them back, you know, I'm gonna I'm, I'm gonna
do to them what they did to me. And the
Bible says, don't do that. Give place for God to
deal with it. That's, that's the whole point. The vengeance
(19:27):
is mine. And then Paul quotes that, he says, for
It is written, vengeance is mine, says the Lord, I
will repay. Therefore, if your enemy is hungry, feed him.
If he's thirsty, give him something to drink, uh, and
so forth. And, and in doing so, he says you
will heap coals of fire on their head. So, as
you do not repay evil for good, um,
(19:50):
Or do not repay evil with evil, but repay evil
with good. So, essentially what we're doing is we're leaving
that to God. We're putting that in God's hands. We're trusting, OK,
God will deal with this person. I don't have to
do it. I'm not to take up the cause against them.
I'm to let God um take care of that for me.
(20:13):
Phil Metzger, would you think that that means that Christians
aren't allowed to sue other people or to sue each other?
What would you say?
Well, as it relates to like suing each other, the
Bible kind of speaks to that issue, doesn't it? That
we shouldn't do that. Um, as it relates to like
outside of the Christian faith, I mean, there's, there's the
cases are so unique, you know, um, where sometimes that's
(20:35):
kind of like your only legal recourse for certain actions
and certain issues, but, but I definitely think it speaks
to the idea, um, and I, and Brian, um, you,
you touched on that.
The idea that like, listen, if, if, if vengeance belongs
to the Lord, but we're our call is to trust him, right?
And then when we're expecting him to bring judgment, you know,
(20:55):
God could also do some work of grace in that situation. And,
and so if we're so quick to like bring our
kind of vengeance, then we don't give any room for
God to do a work there that could be judgment,
but it could also be grace and um.
Yeah, I, I, I, I, I've always, um, that idea
of like vengeance is mine, made me feel good at
(21:15):
a certain time in my Christian life, like, good, God's
gonna get them, you know. If I don't get to
do it, God will do it for me. And in
a sense, it's true, but in another sense it's like, gosh,
God might want to do something even greater than than justice,
and that's grace. Mhm.
Yeah, and I think if our hearts are right, we're
going to welcome that, right? I mean, wouldn't, uh, you know,
even somebody who's your, your enemy, your foe, man, to
(21:39):
see him really come to Jesus and really repent and
really become uh a new person. I mean, that's like, hey, yeah, that's,
that's really what we want more than anything, but some
people are gonna resist that and so they will then
bring a judgment on themselves.
Sam, I hope that helps you. Thanks for calling in
(21:59):
today on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is the number to call
if you've got a question for Pastors Brian Broderson or
Phil Metzger. Let's talk to Sandra now, who's in Orange
County listening on the Kwave app. Hello, Sandra, thanks for
calling 888-564-6173.
(22:19):
Hello, thank you for taking my call. Yeah, um, my
question is, um, is there a difference when you lift
someone up in prayer or and um laying down your
prayer request for someone at the altar?
Hmm. Give us an example. What do you mean by that?
Um, well, I hear like, uh, um, sometimes I'll hear, uh,
(22:41):
like a pastor or someone in my church saying, we're
lifting them up to the Lord, or lay your concerns
at the altar of God.
OK. So I wanted to know if is there a difference? Yeah. Phil,
what would you say to Sandra and anybody else wondering
the same thing? Yeah, it's a great question. I don't
know that I've ever been asked that question before, so I,
I really appreciate that. I, I do think they are
(23:02):
two different phrases, though, you know, if we do, maybe
sometimes we would kind of overlap them into the same
thing maybe, but I think in the scripture the ideas
are two different ideas. The idea of laying something on
the altar is the idea of releasing control and giving
something fully over to the Lord.
Um, I think of like Romans 12:1 to by the
(23:23):
mercies of God that you present your bodies as a
living sacrifice holy and acceptable to God, right? We're to
lay our lives down. Um, first Peter cast all your
cares upon him because he cares for you. So it's
like an, it's a prayer as an act of surrender
to God. And then I would say like lifting somebody
up in prayer is, is more about like intercession.
(23:44):
Like for them, right? First Timothy, I urge that there
be prayers and intercessions and Thanksgiving made for all people.
So I think there is a difference, but I can't
speak to the fact that sometimes us pastors might overlap
the ideas in our, in how we say it, but
I do think there is a significant difference between the two.
Pastor Brian.
(24:05):
I think that was a superb answer on the part
of Phil, Pastor Phil. So I will just, I, Doctor Phil,
that's right. So I will just leave it with what
he said. That was perfect. All right, Sandra, thanks for
calling us today here on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is our number.
(24:25):
Like I said earlier, you can also send in your
questions online, including by scanning that QR code if you're
watching on Facebook, YouTube, or
Instagram right now. That'll take you right to the pastor's
perspective page on Kwave.com, where Maria in Monterey Park sent
in this question. Speaking of prayer, she writes, I'm requesting
prayer for help. I'm being bullied at work by two
(24:48):
co-workers and my supervisor and HR are not doing anything
about it. I ended up in trouble because they wrote
an email saying all kinds of lies against me, and
my supervisor put me in probation instead.
I have witnesses of them bullying me, but my supervisor
doesn't care. He wants me to forget about reporting me
(25:10):
being bullied, and those two coworkers feel empowered by him.
I keep praying for God to protect me from this evil.
Please pray for God to.
me from the situation. Sometimes I feel like God is
not listening to me and I keep praying, though, and
I say, I believe, help my unbelief. Thank you for
your prayers. So first of all, some advice for Maria.
(25:30):
Anything she can do about this? What would you say, Brian?
Well, you know, um, these things do happen and so we're,
we're told about these things in scripture. We're told, uh,
Peter writes and he says, um, he, he talks about,
you know, he's talking in the context of slaves and
masters and he's talking, uh, to slaves who have abusive
(25:54):
masters and he says, um,
You know, just
Honor God in your behavior, even when it is somebody
who is being unjust or being uh abusive, he said,
because in doing this, you're really following the example of
(26:14):
Jesus who did no sin, no deceit was found in
his mouth. When he was falsely accused, he did not,
you know, return an accusation, but he, he submitted himself
to the one who judges righteously.
And there are times in life where that is kind
of just where we end up, you know, it's like, man,
this is all so wrong and I'm on the receiving
(26:35):
end of the wrong. And not to say that you
can't decide like, OK, I'm, I'm gonna get out of
this situation, you could do that, um, but also it
might be that that God's calling you to seek his
grace through it and you, you kind of just navigate
it by the spirit and uh you know, praying that.
(26:56):
That we talked earlier about the whole vengeance is mine,
says the Lord, you know, praying that God will, uh,
vindicate the righteous and deal with the wicked in in
a case like this. So, so it's, it's not easy
at times. We go through these kinds of difficulties and
it doesn't always just go away because we think, well,
(27:17):
this is unfair. How is this happening? You know, unfair
things happen even to God's people.
And so we have to get wisdom from him and
and grace. If he's saying, stick it out and trust me,
then that's what you do. Um, but he might be saying,
it's OK, I'm gonna open another door for you Phil Metzger.
Uh, no, that was great. I, I was just to
(27:38):
add to like I was just thinking of that other
story of Jesus, um.
Asleep in a boat that he told his disciples, let's
go across together, and then the storm comes and
They go to wake him up and say like, you know,
don't you care that we're gonna die.
As if like he put them in a situation and
then didn't care. And it's kind of easy to be like,
(28:00):
oh my gosh, why would they ever think that? But
this is kind of, this is our story, isn't it?
Where it's like the Lord, you know, like I know
certain things like God's put me where I'm at, and
then something bad happens and I'm like, why would God
do that? You know, does he not care, you know,
and I think sometimes like we have to get back
to scripture back to just like you said, Brian, like
obedience and surrender to a sovereign God is, I mean.
(28:22):
is praying and believing he's faithful and he loves her.
Another story this reminds me of is, uh, Joseph in
the Book of Genesis, not, uh, Joseph and Mary, but
the Joseph in the Book of Genesis where. Yeah, and
I mean, that's a, it's a great way to just
kind of be reminded about how and, you know, at
the end of the story, um, I, I won't give
(28:44):
away the story because it's, it's just worth reading, you know,
go back to say, uh, Genesis 40 and, and pick
up and read there. You can go back a little
bit further to get the beginning of the story.
I think chapter 37, um, but.
You know, at the end of the whole thing, Joseph's,
the classic words to those who wronged him, you meant
(29:07):
it for evil, but God meant it for good. And
I think, man, that is it's such a powerful thing, yeah.
So if everyone listening and watching Pastor's perspective right now
can keep Maria in your prayers, that would be great
so that she can uh figure out what her next
move is. And if HR and your supervisor aren't doing
(29:30):
anything about it, I mean, yeah, you could take it
a step further. I'm sure maybe you could contact the
labor board or something like that if it's uh something
that egregious.
But, uh, yeah, we, uh, ask everyone listening and watching
to pray for Maria. Time to take a break here
on Pastor's Perspective. We'll be back in just a few
minutes with your questions. Call in, now's a good time.
888-564-6173 is the number. 888-564-6173. Michael Inventura, you will be next,
(30:00):
so don't hang up. This is Pastor's Perspective.
We're back on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is the number to call.
(30:24):
My name is Brian Perez, and answering your questions today,
we've got Phil Metzger, the pastor of Calvary San Diego.
He's joining us online via Zoom. Pastor Brian Broderson from
Echoes of Mercy.com disappeared. He was here a moment ago.
Thank you.
Forgot that we do two halves of the program. I
don't know. He'll be here in a moment, so call
in with your questions. It's a mutiny by me and
(30:45):
Brian Perez. Yes. 888-564-6173 is the number once again. So
let's get to Michael Inventura, who's watching us on YouTube,
so we'll wave to Michael Inventura. Thanks for watching online
and thanks for calling in today, Michael. How can we
help you?
Yes, hello, my brothers. I'm a first time caller. I've
been watching your show now up and on for about
(31:06):
a year. Nice. How'd you find out about us?
Um, I, I think, uh, to, uh, Calvary Chapel, just, uh,
watching and listening. Nice. Anyway, my question is this, I,
I've been safe since I was 16, I'm 68 years old,
and I've never heard this before. And I was watching YouTube,
this guy was debunking certain Christian pastors, and I just
(31:27):
kind of listen. I don't believe everything he says. But anyways,
he brought up a point, uh, about a certain pastor. Well,
I won't name because I don't believe him.
And he said, does God choose who will be saved
and who will be lost? This is predestination and he
brought up two scriptures, Ephesians 1:45, and Romans 8:29 to 3,
(31:47):
where it talks about God choose us before the creation
of the world and predestination. So the theory is, and
I believe it's a Calvinistic, uh, approach because I Google it.
Uh, they believe that, uh, uh, everyone's not saved. God
chooses who will be saved before the creation of the world,
and I don't think that's fair or right, otherwise, Jesus
wouldn't have died for everyone. I'd like to know your
(32:08):
thoughts on that. OK, Phil, we'll start with you.
Yeah, good, good question, and thanks for calling in and
um yeah, just a new listener, that's awesome. So
You're right that this is what we like kind of
like traditionally we call this um this perspective Calvinism, and
there's a lot more to that and certainly you can,
you can do research on that some more. But to
(32:29):
the idea that God chose, I, I wanna like I
wanna forget like the Calvinistic view of that for a
moment and let's be clear, like the Bible does say
that God chose, he chooses.
What happens though is then we, we, we end up
creating what we call like a systematic expression of this
where we, we try to like use human wisdom to
understand or to define if he chose, then that must
(32:51):
mean this, that and the other. And what ends up
happening is
Um, we try to like find a way to make
it all fit so beautifully and perfectly, where the Bible,
as you said, gives us kind of 22 really important truths, and,
and neither one overrides the other, that God has chosen
us before the foundation of the world, right? He, he cannot,
(33:14):
he cannot deny that he knows all things, that, that,
that is an impossibility. God knows all things, therefore, he chose.
But then the Bible also tells us, as you rightly
pointed out, that Jesus died for the whole world.
And so the Bible doesn't say, hey, God only God's
only caring about the people that he already knows. The
Bible tells us that God so loved the world that
(33:35):
whoever would believe would have eternal life. Now, how we,
how we reconcile those two things, I'm kind of, I'm
kind of like, I agree with like uh Charles Spurgeon.
He was a Baptist preacher who had the idea that like,
I don't need to reconcile friends. They, they, these are
not opposing ideas.
Uh, God is sovereign, God is in control. God sees
all things. He did choose us before the foundation of
(33:57):
the world. And so that's a beautiful truth. We should
like really enjoy that God, He chose you when you
were 16 years old. He knew you would choose Him
before the foundation of the world. That's powerful. But that
doesn't negate the fact that the Bible tells us God
so loves all people that whoever would repent and come
to Him would
Eternal life. So these are, these are not contradicting ideas. Um,
(34:19):
Calvinism is a system of theology that kind of emphasizes, uh,
a particular part of the sovereignty of God over other elements.
It's not all evil and, and wrong, it just has
a particular emphasis. Pastor Brian.
Good job, Phil. That was great. Um, I was thinking
when you mentioned Spurgeon, I was thinking of that illustration
(34:40):
that he used where, um, you know, the illustration was
like the gates of heaven, and as you're entering in
it says whosoever will, uh, you know, come and then
when you get across the threshold and turn around and
look at the backside of the gate, it says chosen
from the foundation of the world. So you know, both
(35:00):
of those things are true and.
But, but a real critical point, Phil, is, uh, you know,
what we believe to be universal atonement in the sense
that Jesus did provide atonement, not that everybody will in
the end be saved because of that, but, you know, his,
his death was for everybody, and not all Calvinists do
(35:24):
believe that, um, you know, some of the very rigid Calvinists,
of course, would say that, um,
It, it's a limited atonement. It's limited to the ones
that he chose. So he, he atoned for the ones
he chose. And when it says, um, for guts all
of the world, they would even, some of them would
even insert the world of the elect, but the text
(35:46):
doesn't say the world of the elect. It says the
world and
Ironically, John Calvert himself believed that Jesus died for everyone. Uh, so,
you know, here you got a system named after him
that some elements of it reject that, but, uh, the
guy who they claimed to be building their theology on
(36:07):
didn didn't believe what they're what they're believing, so.
And going back to your, uh, story of Spurgeon, um,
you don't see the inside of the gate or you know,
what's what's written on that side until you cross the threshold.
So that's why it's, it's one of those you could
keep walking back and forth by the gate and
Not walking through and but somebody might say, but if
(36:31):
you were chosen, well, no, you have to make that
choice first. Yeah, and I mean, I think that that
that is clearly what the Bible says. I think with
with any systematic theology, the challenge is, uh, to let
the theology conform to scripture rather than trying to force
scripture into the theology. And this is what you end
(36:51):
up having a lot of times with with theologies. You
have an idea.
And so we're going to trim down the scripture in
order to get the scripture to get in line with
the idea, but that's the wrong way about it. Let's like,
oh no, let's let's let our ideas, uh, you know,
(37:14):
maybe let's throw them aside if they don't fit with scripture.
Let's let's modify our idea rather than trying to modify
scripture to fit our.
Yeah, or, or even like acknowledge, OK, this doesn't fit,
you know, we still believe this because generally speaking, you know,
I mean, I think you and I both would agree
like that there's a beauty in just the truth that
(37:35):
like I've been chosen by God. That's a that's amazing beauty, dude,
that's unbelievable, right? But I don't wanna hold that to
the extent that I'm gonna look at other people as
they're probably not chosen because the Bible doesn't allow me
to do that. So it's like you said, Brian, we
have to like realign to like, what does the Bible say,
even if it feels to kind of contradict my system
a bit. Yeah.
Hard to do. What do you think, Michael?
(37:57):
I think that's great and you've answered my question, my brother,
so I appreciate that. Have a good day. All right,
thanks for calling in today to Pastor's perspective.
888-564-6173 is the number you can call to ask Brian
and Phil your questions. Here's one that was sent in
online on Facebook. It's from Martin, who writes, I have
(38:18):
a situation. My wife believes in Christ, and she prays
for God to reveal what is true and what's not true. Discernment.
However, she believes in extraterrestrial beings. She believes that there
are other ways to the Father. She believes that the
rapture is not what we as Christians believe. She believes
Jesus meant that we will be enlightened, that we will
(38:41):
become spiritual on earth and not taken up like the
Bible says.
She also doesn't believe that the God of the Old
Testament is the same as the one in the New Testament,
that God couldn't have been so cruel to kill the
innocent along with the wicked and the Old Testament. We
are empty nesters and enjoy being with each other, but
I can't sit and watch the YouTube videos she likes
(39:04):
that deal with all that she believes. So sometimes we
spend time apart in the same house, her downstairs, me upstairs,
watching TV or reading our books. My question is, how
should or can we get closer when our beliefs separate us? Brian,
what would you say? Cause you're the one that believes
in extraterrestrials at home and Cheryl doesn't. So how do
(39:26):
you guys handle this? No, I'm joking.
Well, you know, I just put on ET and, you know,
go into my room and watch it and.
Um,
Yeah, well, so I, I mean, just from the, from
the description, it sounds like, and of course we're only
(39:46):
hearing one side of the story, but you know, it
does sound like your wife has some, some pretty unorthodox beliefs,
to say the least. Now, you know, there's there's debate
among Christians about the rapture, that's understandable, that's fine. But
To turn it into like a time of enlightenment on
the earth, that's, that's kind of going in a direction
(40:07):
that I, I wouldn't have anticipated somebody going with that idea. And,
and some of the other things you mentioned are, um,
I think they're, you know, potentially very problematic. Well, well,
a great example would be coming to the Father in
another way than Jesus. And so, you know, I was
reading in Luke 10 today and it's that great passage,
(40:29):
it's also, you find it in Matthew 11.
But, but Jesus says, um, no one knows the Father
but the Son.
And no one knows the son but the father.
Uh, no one knows the son of the Father, and
no one knows the father but the Son, and the
one to whom the son wills to reveal him. So,
you can't know God, period, apart from Jesus. He is
(40:52):
the revelation of God. So to to come up with
the idea that somehow you could, that is a problem.
So I don't know if she's getting these ideas from
stuff she's watching on YouTube or like you said, she's
reading different books, um.
I, I think what I would do is say, um.
Hey, let's find something on YouTube that maybe will help
(41:18):
us to
See a better perspective on these things. You know, maybe
you watch like, uh, this Christianity still makes sense, or
you watch, uh, Wesley Huff, uh, who's a very popular
apologist at the time. You watch something together where these
kinds of things are being addressed and uh people are
(41:41):
giving good solid biblical answers. I, I don't know, Phil,
what do you think?
I think you're right on. I, I was thinking too.
I was kind of thinking back to the mom that
called the 5 year old and talking about technology and
kind of limiting usage and
You know, I'm, I'm in the phase of life where
like I have my baby is in college, so we're
kind of like empty nesters light, like almost at that,
(42:03):
you know, kind of phase, and I, I think like
there's a danger in little kids and their technology. I
think there's a danger as we get older in our
technology as well. I'll just be honest.
I think that like you can sit down and start
watching things and don't realize that the views that they're
made well, they sound interesting, it's kind of, you know, whatever,
(42:24):
just it can be a whole like myriad of of
of things, but it kind of piques your attention and
it gets you and then you realize like,
If if you're being discipled by YouTube or Instagram or
TikTok or Facebook or the news, you're being discipled in
a really, really terrible direction, plain and simple, um, and, and,
(42:44):
and I don't care if it's even just Bible studies
or different churches.
We were made for local con contextual relationships. We were,
we were made to be in relationship with people around us,
and that's what the church is. And I think, and again,
he didn't say if they were going to church or not.
I'm just saying if you're, if you guys are so
separated by like, you know, her watching YouTube, you upstairs
(43:07):
doing something else, I get it. We all have our
moments where we're kind of all doing our own thing,
that's fine, but I think it's discipling in a very
dangerous direction.
And I would say like it's time to go play
mini golf or something. I didn't even get away from
watching YouTube at all, like it's time to go mini
golf or I don't know, find some friends and go
on a date with them or go on a art,
(43:27):
you know, painting and dinner kind of a thing or something. Go,
go walk or I think we gotta get off the
tech stuff a little bit. It's, it's getting us a
little weird at times.
Yeah, I think, I think that's that's good advice. Well,
the only other thing I would say would be to, um,
you know, let's say take a book and, um, maybe
(43:48):
like she, she likes a particular book and say, OK,
let's read this together. And then, OK, we read it
and now, OK, then you, you take a book and say,
let's read this one together. And obviously you're gonna come
up with, you know, you're probably gonna come up with.
Whole different list of books and she's going to come
up with. And then you compare notes so you can,
you know, you can converse about those things. So, I mean, thankfully, um,
(44:11):
you know, my wife and I are are generally on
the same page when it comes to theological things. So
we do have our little disagreements here and there, but
you know, it's nothing significant or major. Uh, but when you're,
you know, you're talking about your spouse who just is
believing stuff that really is outside the realm of, of
Christian orthodoxy.
That is a challenge, and it needs to be challenged
(44:34):
in a gracious way because these ideas, if, if she
continues to follow these ideas out to their logical ends,
she's gonna end up outside of the Christian family rather than,
you know, being a part of it.
This conversation allows me to make my case for radio.
I do this every now and then because there's so
(44:55):
much kooky stuff out there on YouTube and TikTok, and wherever.
And here on Kwave, we vet all the pastors that
you hear on the station before we put them on,
we make sure that they align with what we believe
and uh there might be a few that, you know,
(45:16):
we don't see 100% on things, but we, I mean, overall,
they're great.
Um, and, but on YouTube or any of these other platforms,
anyone can upload anything without any oversight, with and without
any accountability, etc. We're not saying that only the pastors
(45:36):
on K-wave are legit. There are several out there that
are legit that are just not on K-wave, but rest assured,
if you hear them here on Kwave, they've got our,
you know, stamp of approval. That being said,
What do you say to people who perhaps like um
who was it? uh uh Martin, his wife might say, well,
(45:58):
you know what?
Uh, this radio station and, and our church, they're keeping
things from us. There's more out there. They the these,
these churches that tell us that only they know the truth. No,
I saw this YouTube video and it, it explained what
the rapture is. It explained, you know, all this other stuff.
(46:18):
So how do you tell them, what what would you
say to them?
Well, I, I think the simple uh solution to that
is you just have to go open your Bible and
you know, you can, you can read, um, 1 Corinthians 15,
you can read 1 Thessalonians 4, the two.
Rapture passages in the New Testament, the clear ones anyway, um,
(46:43):
and just see what it says. And OK, it, it's
not talking about a a a time of enlightenment on
the earth. That's not that's not part of the discussion there.
So you could just say, look, let's, you know, this
is the beautiful thing about scripture. The scripture keeps us
balanced because it, it, it says what it says, and
(47:05):
then if you start
You know, if you start adding to it in some way,
then
OK, well, wait, we're getting, we're getting away from scripture
here and we, we don't want to do that if
we want to get to the truth. Phil, yeah, I
was gonna say too like I think as a pastor.
This isn't like good or bad or better or worse.
It's just like the reality of difference here. As a pastor,
(47:26):
I'm not driven by like clicks and likes. um I'm
I want to help the people in my local contexts,
like genuinely help them. We're like.
When you're in the world of like when you need to, like,
it's an online like when your ministry is kind of online,
there is a need to, for a lot of people,
there is a need to kind of like, you gotta
make it like, what's the click bait to get them
(47:48):
to be even interested? And so you kind of have
to use those tools, and I'm not saying it's all bad,
sometimes it's super fun. You're like, like Wesley Huff, like
you mentioned, Brian, sometimes he'll put up a post and
he'll say something like that.
And it's there's nothing heretical, nothing wrong. It's great, and
it makes me go, oh man, now I gotta click
on it and find out what, what in the world
he's gonna say. It's great. Yeah. But I think that
(48:09):
can work in a negative as well, right? Where it's like, um,
you know, uh, they're, they're gatekeeping, like the church is
not gatekeeping. We're not gatekeeping any information, and I can
prove it to you. You have the Bible in front
of you, the same one I have, uh, read it,
like you said, Brian, like you, you all got access
to it, go for it.
Um, I think when people are like, we've got new information.
(48:29):
I'm always nervous about the new information, folk. Um, it
makes me nervous and, um, not just nervous, it's just like, oh,
come on. But people buy it and click baiting is
super popular and your algorithm will hit you. You click
on one of those things and it's over for the
next 8 hours. That's all you're gonna see on there.
You're gonna be convinced everybody's thinking of those things, and, um,
(48:51):
we just got to be super careful of that stuff.
Brian, any other thoughts? Ah, the algorithm, uh, no, no,
no other thoughts.
I'm, I'm moving away from this algorithm. I, I'm, I wanna,
I wanna move on. We clicked on this, but we're gonna,
we're gonna clicking and we're going to the next question.
(49:12):
How about we click on a phone call here, Bill,
who is watching us on YouTube in Canada? Really? Hey, Bill.
Hey, good afternoon. How are you? Great. What part of
Canada are you in? I'm on the west part in Calgary.
(49:32):
Near the Rocky Mountains. Great. So now where Justin Bieber
is vacationing.
With Justin Bieber's vacation. Have you seen him around at all?
No, I've never seen him before. Yeah, well, he'll be
the guy whose pants are falling off. So, um, that's
how you'll be able to spot him.
(49:53):
Right on.
So, my, my question is,
By the way, thanks for your program. I've watched you
for like 10 years. Oh my goodness, uh. That's great.
It's really helping the lot.
I have an estate question. My, my brother has stolen
some of my mother's estate, and I was finally appointed executor,
(50:20):
and he's been delaying.
And missing court appointments.
And we finally got the judgment in our favor.
And I just recently saw him at a funeral, and
I didn't speak to him.
And I think he was just trying to weasel his
(50:42):
way in.
To make himself look good, he's not a believer.
Uh, she's always been raised in the way of, you know,
do the right thing, but this temptation to steal land
really
Persuaded him to do it. So I'm wondering if I'm
(51:02):
in the right.
Not to speak to him, to treat him like a pagan.
To just let my lawyer deal with him.
Brian, what do you say to Bill?
So, like, what, what's your options, Bill? What like what?
(51:22):
You know, what, what's the other option?
Um, the other option is to embarrass myself and kind
of give in to his
Employees, he'll he'll say that he's always in the right
and that uh my mother gave him that inheritance when
(51:44):
she actually didn't.
Yeah, right. OK. I, I don't think that's a good
option to go go with his uh version of the story.
And so I, I do think, you know, these, I mean,
these are notoriously.
Difficult and unfortunately quite common, you know, whenever there's an inheritance,
(52:07):
there's a, it seems like there's always somebody.
That is trying to.
Swindle others and so I, I think, you know, that in,
in those kinds of cases, I think we need to do.
What we can do to prevent that from taking place and,
and obviously there's limitations to what we can do, right?
(52:30):
But so once you've hit the the limit, then you
just say, OK, Lord, you know, I'm gonna put this
in your hands, but I, but I do think that
we can.
We can do what all that's possible to do on
our part and then.
Leave it from there. Right. Phil Metzger, what do you
tell Bill?
I just agree with Brian there. Those things are so messy,
(52:53):
you know, when you, I, I heard one thing when
you said like, you know, oh, should I treat him
like a pagan? It's, you already said he is like
a pagan, like, I mean, he, he is an unbeliever,
so in one sense you're just praying for the Lord
to bring him to salvation and um but in relationship
to the estate and all the legal issues there, it's
better to probably let your lawyer deal with those things. Yeah, yeah,
(53:14):
there's nothing that would say you've got to let him.
Get away with ripping everybody off, you know, but someone
might say if you go through with a lawsuit or
something that might push him away, push him further from
the Lord, and then, well, you have to leave that
to God, you know, we're, we're not gonna, in the end,
we're not gonna be the ones that decide somebody's eternity.
(53:37):
It's gonna be between them and the Lord's, yeah, yeah, yeah. But,
but it's interesting that, uh.
You know, for the last 10 years, he's had no
relationship with his son, and when I started the lawsuit,
all of a sudden his son started talking to me. Mm, interesting.
I was able to like just put in like pastors
(53:58):
perspective podcast, and he's listening to them and everything. Great.
Well, that's good. Well, you know, God bless you. It's a,
it's a challenging situation and just, you know, I think
you're doing the right thing. You just keep trusting the Lord.
We're do what you can and you trust the Lord
for the rest. So Bill, I have a note here
that yesterday was Thanksgiving Day in Canada, so belated Happy Thanksgiving,
(54:23):
however you would say that. How do Canadians celebrate Thanksgiving?
What do you guys do there? Do you guys do the,
the turkey and the, what do you, what do you
guys eat there?
Yeah, we, we have the turkey, we have pumpkin pie, we,
we have almost everything that's identical to American Thanksgiving, except
we earlier. Yes.
(54:43):
Well, did you guys steal that from us or do
we steal it from you?
I, I think we had it first.
OK.
But they don't have any American football to watch after, uh,
do you guys watch like a hockey game afterwards or?
I don't, I don't, but I imagine people do that.
(55:05):
There you go. Very good. All right. Well, thanks for
calling in today with your question, Bill, and, uh, everybody
watching and listening, please keep Bill and his family in
your prayers. All right, we gotta go, but we will
be back tomorrow, so, uh, give us a call then
if we, especially if you couldn't call in today, we
would love to hear from you tomorrow. We're gonna be
here at the same time, 3 to 4 p.m. and
(55:26):
we hope.
Open up the phone lines about 7 minutes before 3,
and we would love to hear from you. You can
also send in your questions online, but hey, it's not
as much fun as talking to you. So call in
tomorrow 888-564-6173. For Pastor Brian Broderson from Echoes of Mercy.com
and Pastor Phil Metzger from Calvary San Diego. I'm Brian Perez, and, uh,
(55:49):
God bless you guys. We'll talk to you tomorrow on
Pastor's Perspective.
Hello and welcome to Pastor's Perspective. I'm your host, Brian Perez,
back from serving my civic duty for a few days.
It is so good to be back in the studio
with you guys. Special thanks to Michael David for covering
the past few days that I was gone, and, uh, yeah,
so here we are. What is this program? It's called
Pastor's Perspective, and we have a couple of pastors here
(00:37):
in the studio to answer the questions you might have
about the Bible, the Christian faith.
Life in general. We're going to be here until 4
o'clock and we would love to chat with you. The
phone number to call is 888-564-6173, toll-free. I don't even
know if that matters anymore, but needless to say, it's toll-free. 888-564-6173.
(00:59):
I guess that just goes back to the days when
if I were to call you Brian Broderson, it might
cost 10 cents a minute or whatever, and then things changed, and, yeah, yeah,
I mean, I guess it depends on your
Who your service is, right, for your mobile phone as
the British say.
Um, yeah, but I wanted to say, you know, um,
(01:23):
Being sequestered away.
In um that hidden location for your jury duty, I
noticed they didn't give you any razors or shaving cream.
So no, uh, I, I opted and I had a
choice between razors or cookies, and I took the cookies, yeah, because, yeah,
so of course, of course, always choose the cookies, always.
(01:46):
That's my motto. I mean, I, you should see the
bumper sticker on my car. It says that. No, it doesn't.
All right, 888-564-6173. The other voice you just heard is
Phil Metzger. He's the pastor of Calvary San Diego, and
he's joining us on Zoom. How you doing, Phil? Doing great.
Good to see you guys. Got a nice, uh, kinda
wet day today, huh? Totally, yes, yeah, it seems like
(02:09):
February instead of October. That's it. Totally. I'm always telling Cheryl, like,
you know.
Um, summer is still here in October. We're gonna have
a week of 90 degree weather, and she always argues
with me about it, and I always win. But
She might win this month because, um, yeah, it's supposed
(02:31):
to warm up by the end of the week. It's
supposed to be high 70s, so we'll see, we'll see
what happens. We shall see crazy weather, but uh we're
still thankful to be here in Southern California. That's for sure.
All right, so give us a call at 888-564-6173. If
you're watching on Facebook, YouTube or Instagram. Thanks for watching.
Make sure to, uh, like and subscribe and all that
(02:53):
other good stuff. Share this page with your friends so
that they can call in and ask their questions at 888-564-6173.
You can also submit your questions online on Facebook, or, um,
Instagram or on our radio station's website, Kwave.com. Look for
the pastor's perspective page, and you can submit your question
(03:15):
that way. In fact, that is what William did. William
is in Chino.
And he asks what is the difference between the names
of God Adonai, Yahweh, Jehovah, Elohim Can each name be
used interchangeably for God the Father, God the Son, God
the Spirit, or the names used for the Trinity? Phil Metzger,
(03:35):
what do you say to William?
Um, there, it would be difficult in the, you know,
we try to keep our answers kind of brief, so
it'd be hard to say like, well, let me go
through all the names of God and give you the definitions. I,
I definitely recommend like a good, like a, we, we
call them a concordance or like a Bible dictionary, and
you could look it up all the names of God
and get all the great meanings. For instance, you'll see like,
(03:56):
I'll I'll use an example. Like sometimes you'll see the
word Adonai, that could be used for Lord um like human,
but it's also used to describe God.
Um, but then there's other names that are specific to
God and so, um, definitely get a, get a concordance
or a Bible dictionary and look them up, um, you're
not gonna go wrong, um, if you go to like
a great Christian bookstore or Amazon, who goes, I don't know,
(04:18):
do people go to bookstores? Maybe they do. Uh, Amazon's great.
And then in terms of the names interchangeable, um.
Yeah, I mean, you know, Jesus and especially the Gospel
of John, he referred to himself by a name that
God the Father used freak, you know, in the book
of Exodus, where he says, I am that I am,
and then Jesus referred to himself as the I am. Now,
(04:38):
we don't see that every name was interchangeable by all
of them.
Um, but they all, you know, God the Father, God
the Son, God the Spirit, our God in the fullest
sense of it. So yes. And yes, people do go
to Christian bookstores. In fact, we have one here on campus.
It's on the other side. I can see it from, well, no,
I can't. There's trees on the way, but the chapel
(04:58):
store of Calvary Chapel, Costa Mesa open here 7 days
a week, varying hours, but that includes Sunday after services. Good,
I'm glad you mentioned that because I was gonna do it,
but you did it. Um, yeah, so.
Yes, Phil, everything you said, great, right? Um.
Yahweh and Jehovah.
(05:19):
So, these are two different attempts at
Discerning what the actual name of God.
is
So in the in the Hebrew.
Script, you have only consonants and then you have vowel sounds.
(05:43):
You have markers that indicate the vowel. So, um,
So, Yahweh is like we would look at it as YHWH.
And so it seems like the proper vowels there would
end up spelling Yahweh. Um, Jesus means Yah is salvation.
(06:07):
That's the if Yeshua is, you know, Shua is salvation,
Yah is, um, the name of God. Uh, Jehovah was
an attempt to, uh, pronounce the name of God by
taking the vowels of Adoni.
And putting them with the consonants Y H W H.
(06:28):
And so I think most people agreed today that that
probably wasn't the best idea, that that didn't really express
what the name of God is. You know, among Hebrews,
Hebrews won't pronounce the name of God. Uh, they say Hashem,
which means God, but the name, they actually refer to
the name which they consider sacred.
(06:51):
And uh the reason why we don't know the actual
spelling or pronunciation is because I think it's a Jewish superstition.
Some people think, oh, they just reverenced God so much
they wouldn't actually spell out his name. Seems to me
to be more superstition than, um, you know, kind of, um, reverence,
(07:12):
but
Be that as it may, um, and then the other,
what was the, there was a 4th Elohim Elohim, yeah.
So Elohim, so Yahweh would be the name of God.
This is like, like Phil said, I am. It means,
it means I am that I am. And so that
Moses says, who to, I'm gonna go to Pharaoh, you're
(07:32):
telling me to go to Pharaoh, who do I say
sent me? And the Lord says, say I am that
I am has sent you. So, say Yahweh has sent you, um.
Elohim is God.
Just uh actually God, literally, if you translate Elohim, I
am in Hebrew is what S is to English. So
(07:55):
it pluralizes it. So L is God and uh Elohim
is God's plural. And so it's more where Yahweh's the
name of God, like Phil is the name of the
human Phil, um.
(08:17):
Uh, Yahweh, Yahweh is the name of God. So, and
so Elohim is used of, of God, um, mostly, but
it's also used sometimes of angels and men. And so
that's where you make the, let's see a little bit
of a difference there. So, so like Elohim would be
(08:40):
like God in general. So we're just talking about God, um,
in a general sense.
Uh, Yahweh is talking about God in a very specific
and personal sense. Phil, hm, that's great. No, I, I, OK,
so I have nothing more to add to the great conversation, Brian,
but I did want to say this. I worked at
the bookstore. Hmm.
(09:01):
Yes, I used to, I worked at that bookstore for years.
It was great, and, uh, I don't know why I, um,
forgot that we have a great bookstore there. Yes, well,
that's OK. Well, uh, next time you come by up
here to Orange County, we'll, uh, take you to the
bookstore and we'll send you, show you the new little
area that we added there, the little, little reading gallery. Well,
lots of years have transpired since then, Phil, and lots
(09:23):
of things have changed, so it's, we won't.
Hold your um forgetfulness against you. I have to tell
you one of my funniest moments of working at the bookstore,
this is funny, um, they're 24/7, like you said, bro
7 days a week, right? And so Christmas morning was
on a Sunday that particular year, and um, and Pastor
(09:43):
Chuck was determined that, hey, we're always open on Sunday
for people to go in to buy books if they
need to, we're gonna be open.
And so me and my brother and one of our
best buddies, we were all working at the bookstore at
the same time, and we all volunteered to work on Christmas.
We're all like, you know, 17 or whatever. We didn't,
and we were like, dude, we're getting like overtime and
like we're getting pay and a half and we opened
(10:05):
up the bookstore 3 services. Nobody ever came in. We,
it was just really nobody. I don't think anybody knew
we were open.
It was Christmas, but it was a great, great, and
then Chuck was like, well, you know, we're not gonna
pay those guys because nobody ever shows up that would
have happened, yes, probably I'm joking about that. All right, uh, William,
(10:26):
thanks for sending in your question through the pastor's perspective
page on Kwave.com, which you can easily get to by.
Scanning the QR code if you're watching right now on Facebook, YouTube,
or Instagram. Phone calls now, 888-564-6173 is the number to
call for the next 50 minutes or so. Here is
(10:47):
Courtney calling in from Menefee, and Courtney listens to us
on Alexa. How does that work, Courtney, you just say, Alexa,
play Kwave 107.9.
Yeah, we found out how to do that when my
son was like a baby, and when he was like 1.5, yeah,
(11:08):
we would just say Alexa play K-wave on tune in
and so his one of his first words was Doctor
Tony Evans because he wake up that sick. Oh man,
that is classic, yes.
Yeah, we love Brian Broderson. Now he wakes up a
little later cause he's a little older, so we listen
(11:30):
to Brian Broderson at 7, so he knows all the
different pastors' voices, which is pretty, pretty fun. 5 years old,
that is so.
That is so great. Doctor Tony Evans. That's, that's classic. Yeah,
we gotta send them this clip over there uh not mom,
not Dad. Doctor Tony. You're like, OK, wait, what, what
(11:51):
is he saying? He's saying, Doctor, Doctor what? Doctor? That's
so good, you know, um, lots of lots of kids.
Um, listen, you know, like your, your son listening to Kwave,
some of them driving to school in the morning and
so forth, you know, they listen to Pastor Chuck and
like kids literally thought like, this is God, he's on
(12:14):
the radio and I'm listening to him on my way
to school.
Oh, that's cute. I never asked him like, what do
you think God sounds like? That would be interesting. He
sounds like Pastor Jack. Yeah, you just might.
Well, um, yeah, we actually have a question about our
5 year old. Um, like many 5 year olds, I
(12:34):
think that, you know, they see like Minecraft everywhere and
my son loves Minecraft, but he's never played Minecraft, that
deprived child.
I know. So anyways, um, so we've kept him from
any devices like an iPad or like a phone or
(12:55):
any handheld device. Just, you know, that's like some conviction
that we've had with parents, but, um,
Lately we've been contemplating and praying about getting him a
video game console for our family to play together, like
after dinner, you know, like we sometimes watch TV for
like an hour together, and instead of like watching TV,
(13:19):
playing like a family friendly video game. What do you
guys think about that? All right, Phil, wanna start? Yeah,
I think that sounds really fun.
I think that sounds like a great fun way to
and now just make sure your husband's not saying it
and wanting to secretly play once you all go to bed. Uh,
just kidding. Um, I, I think that's a great idea.
(13:40):
That sounds like a lot of fun. It's, it really
is wisdom to kind of, um, keep, you know, keep
your five year old away from like devices as long
as you can. But then to introduce that as like
a part of like family time.
That's really great. I, I think that's a great, great
use of family time, you know, TV is fine, but
you know, we all realize like you end up just
kind of in your own world when you're watching, right?
(14:01):
So this is kind of like a fun way. I,
I think it sounds like a lot of like a
great idea. Phil, how old is your oldest grandchild? My
oldest is 88. OK, always 8 this week actually, next week, yeah.
So then you, you kind of would have that experience.
So my youngest grandchild, well, actually my second youngest grandchild
is 5.
(14:21):
And um he loves Minecraft. And um so I agree, I,
I think it's a great idea. And I think just
like I'm sure, Courtney, you're going to do with your husband,
you're gonna monitor things, you're gonna keep it in perspective
and balance, uh, because these things, uh, you know, obviously
they can, you know, get hold of you. Uh, so
(14:41):
my 5 year old grandson, um, he does have those
moments where
Um, I remember my other older grandson kind of sat
him down and showed him all the ropes of Minecraft,
and then, uh, you could not get him, uh, you know,
to put the phone down. Thankfully, he doesn't have his
own phone, so you could take it away. But, um, so,
(15:02):
you know, they, these things can be highly addictive and
I think sometimes
You know, it's easy for parents and grandparents to like, here,
just take my phone and be quiet because I'm doing
something else, you know. So I think we just have
to be wise when it comes to all of that
stuff and realize that there's a lot to be enjoyed, um,
(15:22):
but then there's some
You know, cautions that we, we need to take as well. Yeah,
and if you guys are going to do like an
hour a day, I would say stick to that because
there might be, oh, can I just play a few
more minutes or another hour or whatever, you know, as
time goes on, you can kind of be more flexible,
you know, my, my youngest son, he's uh he's a
(15:43):
What is he? He's a tech web.
Developer guy and he's uh she and I were talking
like from the time he was 3 years old, this
kid could
You know, he, he kind of has like his grandpa,
Chuck Smith, you know, everybody understands that Chuck really had
like a photographic memory and if any of the grandkids
(16:06):
got it, it was my son Braden because he just
from the time he was like 3 years old, he, I,
I would put um a code on my computer so
nobody could get in. He break the code, you know,
he's like, like 3 years old. I'm like, wait, what
are you doing on my computer? I locked it. He goes, yeah,
I know. I just did this, this, this and that,
and it didn't opened.
How did you do that?
(16:28):
So and then he was the kid who, you know,
his whole life, it was a big battle between video
games and us and like those are terrible, they're gonna
destroy your life. And now he's like, ha ha, you see, yes,
this is my job and I'm building your website, so
are you sorry for all those mean things you said
about that?
Well, that's the truth though. It's like such a shifting
(16:49):
world that like you realize, gosh, you know, there's a
place where a lot of people, they're gonna make their
livings on how they handle, you know, the computer and
so I, I get it, but yeah, yeah, dude, I
don't know any parent any Christian parent at least that
hasn't had the question or even just non-Christian, when do
you start letting kids use, you know, these things and
everybody's wrestling through it, but these guys, you guys sound
(17:11):
like you're doing a great job.
Oh, thank you. Thank you. Yeah, we definitely just want
to get good advice, so you guys always um provide that.
So thank you so much. All right, thanks, Courtney. Yeah,
thanks for calling in today to Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is
the number. Brian Perez here with Pastors Brian Broderson and
(17:33):
Phil Metzger until 4 o'clock. We're gonna go to New
Jersey now. Here is Sam, who listens to us on TuneIn.
The TuneIn app, I should say. Hey, Sam, how can
we help you today?
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Hey guys, so, um, yeah, my, my question is, um.
Uh, it, when it says vengeance and minds, says the Lord,
it's OK, I get that, but it's kinda like when
people hurt you in life, you forgive them, but, you know,
It's like some people think that oh if you're under
(18:05):
the blood, you know, that you're, you, you pretty much
get away with anything because you, you got extra forgiveness,
even if I hurt you, extra forgiveness, you're, you're, you're,
you know, you're good, you know.
And people on the other side of the tracks and
Christian faith that think like, no, you're gonna get it
when you get to heaven because you're responsible. I just
wanna know like where you, where you guys fall on
(18:28):
that and if God, if, if it's true on the
left side, and why I said on the left side,
then why, why, why did God say it at all?
It doesn't.
So yeah, it's kind of confusing. I don't know if
you got all that, but.
That's my question. All right,
Speaker 1 (18:45):
Pastor Brian, what would you say to Sam?
Well, Sam, there's a passage in Romans, I think it's
Romans 12, where, um, you know, the the Lord is saying, uh,
do not avenge yourself. So if somebody
Uh, harms us or cheats us, or, you know, does
(19:06):
something bad to us, whatever it might be.
The natural tendency, usually for most people would be to get,
get them back, you know, I'm gonna I'm, I'm gonna
do to them what they did to me. And the
Bible says, don't do that. Give place for God to
deal with it. That's, that's the whole point. The vengeance
(19:27):
is mine. And then Paul quotes that, he says, for
It is written, vengeance is mine, says the Lord, I
will repay. Therefore, if your enemy is hungry, feed him.
If he's thirsty, give him something to drink, uh, and
so forth. And, and in doing so, he says you
will heap coals of fire on their head. So, as
you do not repay evil for good, um,
(19:50):
Or do not repay evil with evil, but repay evil
with good. So, essentially what we're doing is we're leaving
that to God. We're putting that in God's hands. We're trusting, OK,
God will deal with this person. I don't have to
do it. I'm not to take up the cause against them.
I'm to let God um take care of that for me.
(20:13):
Phil Metzger, would you think that that means that Christians
aren't allowed to sue other people or to sue each other?
What would you say?
Well, as it relates to like suing each other, the
Bible kind of speaks to that issue, doesn't it? That
we shouldn't do that. Um, as it relates to like
outside of the Christian faith, I mean, there's, there's the
cases are so unique, you know, um, where sometimes that's
(20:35):
kind of like your only legal recourse for certain actions
and certain issues, but, but I definitely think it speaks
to the idea, um, and I, and Brian, um, you,
you touched on that.
The idea that like, listen, if, if, if vengeance belongs
to the Lord, but we're our call is to trust him, right?
And then when we're expecting him to bring judgment, you know,
(20:55):
God could also do some work of grace in that situation. And,
and so if we're so quick to like bring our
kind of vengeance, then we don't give any room for
God to do a work there that could be judgment,
but it could also be grace and um.
Yeah, I, I, I, I, I've always, um, that idea
of like vengeance is mine, made me feel good at
(21:15):
a certain time in my Christian life, like, good, God's
gonna get them, you know. If I don't get to
do it, God will do it for me. And in
a sense, it's true, but in another sense it's like, gosh,
God might want to do something even greater than than justice,
and that's grace. Mhm.
Yeah, and I think if our hearts are right, we're
going to welcome that, right? I mean, wouldn't, uh, you know,
even somebody who's your, your enemy, your foe, man, to
(21:39):
see him really come to Jesus and really repent and
really become uh a new person. I mean, that's like, hey, yeah, that's,
that's really what we want more than anything, but some
people are gonna resist that and so they will then
bring a judgment on themselves.
Sam, I hope that helps you. Thanks for calling in
(21:59):
today on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is the number to call
if you've got a question for Pastors Brian Broderson or
Phil Metzger. Let's talk to Sandra now, who's in Orange
County listening on the Kwave app. Hello, Sandra, thanks for
calling 888-564-6173.
(22:19):
Hello, thank you for taking my call. Yeah, um, my
question is, um, is there a difference when you lift
someone up in prayer or and um laying down your
prayer request for someone at the altar?
Hmm. Give us an example. What do you mean by that?
Um, well, I hear like, uh, um, sometimes I'll hear, uh,
(22:41):
like a pastor or someone in my church saying, we're
lifting them up to the Lord, or lay your concerns
at the altar of God.
OK. So I wanted to know if is there a difference? Yeah. Phil,
what would you say to Sandra and anybody else wondering
the same thing? Yeah, it's a great question. I don't
know that I've ever been asked that question before, so I,
I really appreciate that. I, I do think they are
(23:02):
two different phrases, though, you know, if we do, maybe
sometimes we would kind of overlap them into the same
thing maybe, but I think in the scripture the ideas
are two different ideas. The idea of laying something on
the altar is the idea of releasing control and giving
something fully over to the Lord.
Um, I think of like Romans 12:1 to by the
(23:23):
mercies of God that you present your bodies as a
living sacrifice holy and acceptable to God, right? We're to
lay our lives down. Um, first Peter cast all your
cares upon him because he cares for you. So it's
like an, it's a prayer as an act of surrender
to God. And then I would say like lifting somebody
up in prayer is, is more about like intercession.
(23:44):
Like for them, right? First Timothy, I urge that there
be prayers and intercessions and Thanksgiving made for all people.
So I think there is a difference, but I can't
speak to the fact that sometimes us pastors might overlap
the ideas in our, in how we say it, but
I do think there is a significant difference between the two.
Pastor Brian.
(24:05):
I think that was a superb answer on the part
of Phil, Pastor Phil. So I will just, I, Doctor Phil,
that's right. So I will just leave it with what
he said. That was perfect. All right, Sandra, thanks for
calling us today here on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is our number.
(24:25):
Like I said earlier, you can also send in your
questions online, including by scanning that QR code if you're
watching on Facebook, YouTube, or
Instagram right now. That'll take you right to the pastor's
perspective page on Kwave.com, where Maria in Monterey Park sent
in this question. Speaking of prayer, she writes, I'm requesting
prayer for help. I'm being bullied at work by two
(24:48):
co-workers and my supervisor and HR are not doing anything
about it. I ended up in trouble because they wrote
an email saying all kinds of lies against me, and
my supervisor put me in probation instead.
I have witnesses of them bullying me, but my supervisor
doesn't care. He wants me to forget about reporting me
(25:10):
being bullied, and those two coworkers feel empowered by him.
I keep praying for God to protect me from this evil.
Please pray for God to.
me from the situation. Sometimes I feel like God is
not listening to me and I keep praying, though, and
I say, I believe, help my unbelief. Thank you for
your prayers. So first of all, some advice for Maria.
(25:30):
Anything she can do about this? What would you say, Brian?
Well, you know, um, these things do happen and so we're,
we're told about these things in scripture. We're told, uh,
Peter writes and he says, um, he, he talks about,
you know, he's talking in the context of slaves and
masters and he's talking, uh, to slaves who have abusive
(25:54):
masters and he says, um,
You know, just
Honor God in your behavior, even when it is somebody
who is being unjust or being uh abusive, he said,
because in doing this, you're really following the example of
(26:14):
Jesus who did no sin, no deceit was found in
his mouth. When he was falsely accused, he did not,
you know, return an accusation, but he, he submitted himself
to the one who judges righteously.
And there are times in life where that is kind
of just where we end up, you know, it's like, man,
this is all so wrong and I'm on the receiving
(26:35):
end of the wrong. And not to say that you
can't decide like, OK, I'm, I'm gonna get out of
this situation, you could do that, um, but also it
might be that that God's calling you to seek his
grace through it and you, you kind of just navigate
it by the spirit and uh you know, praying that.
(26:56):
That we talked earlier about the whole vengeance is mine,
says the Lord, you know, praying that God will, uh,
vindicate the righteous and deal with the wicked in in
a case like this. So, so it's, it's not easy
at times. We go through these kinds of difficulties and
it doesn't always just go away because we think, well,
(27:17):
this is unfair. How is this happening? You know, unfair
things happen even to God's people.
And so we have to get wisdom from him and
and grace. If he's saying, stick it out and trust me,
then that's what you do. Um, but he might be saying,
it's OK, I'm gonna open another door for you Phil Metzger.
Uh, no, that was great. I, I was just to
(27:38):
add to like I was just thinking of that other
story of Jesus, um.
Asleep in a boat that he told his disciples, let's
go across together, and then the storm comes and
They go to wake him up and say like, you know,
don't you care that we're gonna die.
As if like he put them in a situation and
then didn't care. And it's kind of easy to be like,
(28:00):
oh my gosh, why would they ever think that? But
this is kind of, this is our story, isn't it?
Where it's like the Lord, you know, like I know
certain things like God's put me where I'm at, and
then something bad happens and I'm like, why would God
do that? You know, does he not care, you know,
and I think sometimes like we have to get back
to scripture back to just like you said, Brian, like
obedience and surrender to a sovereign God is, I mean.
(28:22):
is praying and believing he's faithful and he loves her.
Another story this reminds me of is, uh, Joseph in
the Book of Genesis, not, uh, Joseph and Mary, but
the Joseph in the Book of Genesis where. Yeah, and
I mean, that's a, it's a great way to just
kind of be reminded about how and, you know, at
the end of the story, um, I, I won't give
(28:44):
away the story because it's, it's just worth reading, you know,
go back to say, uh, Genesis 40 and, and pick
up and read there. You can go back a little
bit further to get the beginning of the story.
I think chapter 37, um, but.
You know, at the end of the whole thing, Joseph's,
the classic words to those who wronged him, you meant
(29:07):
it for evil, but God meant it for good. And
I think, man, that is it's such a powerful thing, yeah.
So if everyone listening and watching Pastor's perspective right now
can keep Maria in your prayers, that would be great
so that she can uh figure out what her next
move is. And if HR and your supervisor aren't doing
(29:30):
anything about it, I mean, yeah, you could take it
a step further. I'm sure maybe you could contact the
labor board or something like that if it's uh something
that egregious.
But, uh, yeah, we, uh, ask everyone listening and watching
to pray for Maria. Time to take a break here
on Pastor's Perspective. We'll be back in just a few
minutes with your questions. Call in, now's a good time.
888-564-6173 is the number. 888-564-6173. Michael Inventura, you will be next,
(30:00):
so don't hang up. This is Pastor's Perspective.
We're back on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is the number to call.
(30:24):
My name is Brian Perez, and answering your questions today,
we've got Phil Metzger, the pastor of Calvary San Diego.
He's joining us online via Zoom. Pastor Brian Broderson from
Echoes of Mercy.com disappeared. He was here a moment ago.
Thank you.
Forgot that we do two halves of the program. I
don't know. He'll be here in a moment, so call
in with your questions. It's a mutiny by me and
(30:45):
Brian Perez. Yes. 888-564-6173 is the number once again. So
let's get to Michael Inventura, who's watching us on YouTube,
so we'll wave to Michael Inventura. Thanks for watching online
and thanks for calling in today, Michael. How can we
help you?
Yes, hello, my brothers. I'm a first time caller. I've
been watching your show now up and on for about
(31:06):
a year. Nice. How'd you find out about us?
Um, I, I think, uh, to, uh, Calvary Chapel, just, uh,
watching and listening. Nice. Anyway, my question is this, I,
I've been safe since I was 16, I'm 68 years old,
and I've never heard this before. And I was watching YouTube,
this guy was debunking certain Christian pastors, and I just
(31:27):
kind of listen. I don't believe everything he says. But anyways,
he brought up a point, uh, about a certain pastor. Well,
I won't name because I don't believe him.
And he said, does God choose who will be saved
and who will be lost? This is predestination and he
brought up two scriptures, Ephesians 1:45, and Romans 8:29 to 3,
(31:47):
where it talks about God choose us before the creation
of the world and predestination. So the theory is, and
I believe it's a Calvinistic, uh, approach because I Google it.
Uh, they believe that, uh, uh, everyone's not saved. God
chooses who will be saved before the creation of the world,
and I don't think that's fair or right, otherwise, Jesus
wouldn't have died for everyone. I'd like to know your
(32:08):
thoughts on that. OK, Phil, we'll start with you.
Yeah, good, good question, and thanks for calling in and
um yeah, just a new listener, that's awesome. So
You're right that this is what we like kind of
like traditionally we call this um this perspective Calvinism, and
there's a lot more to that and certainly you can,
you can do research on that some more. But to
(32:29):
the idea that God chose, I, I wanna like I
wanna forget like the Calvinistic view of that for a
moment and let's be clear, like the Bible does say
that God chose, he chooses.
What happens though is then we, we, we end up
creating what we call like a systematic expression of this
where we, we try to like use human wisdom to
understand or to define if he chose, then that must
(32:51):
mean this, that and the other. And what ends up
happening is
Um, we try to like find a way to make
it all fit so beautifully and perfectly, where the Bible,
as you said, gives us kind of 22 really important truths, and,
and neither one overrides the other, that God has chosen
us before the foundation of the world, right? He, he cannot,
(33:14):
he cannot deny that he knows all things, that, that,
that is an impossibility. God knows all things, therefore, he chose.
But then the Bible also tells us, as you rightly
pointed out, that Jesus died for the whole world.
And so the Bible doesn't say, hey, God only God's
only caring about the people that he already knows. The
Bible tells us that God so loved the world that
(33:35):
whoever would believe would have eternal life. Now, how we,
how we reconcile those two things, I'm kind of, I'm
kind of like, I agree with like uh Charles Spurgeon.
He was a Baptist preacher who had the idea that like,
I don't need to reconcile friends. They, they, these are
not opposing ideas.
Uh, God is sovereign, God is in control. God sees
all things. He did choose us before the foundation of
(33:57):
the world. And so that's a beautiful truth. We should
like really enjoy that God, He chose you when you
were 16 years old. He knew you would choose Him
before the foundation of the world. That's powerful. But that
doesn't negate the fact that the Bible tells us God
so loves all people that whoever would repent and come
to Him would
Eternal life. So these are, these are not contradicting ideas. Um,
(34:19):
Calvinism is a system of theology that kind of emphasizes, uh,
a particular part of the sovereignty of God over other elements.
It's not all evil and, and wrong, it just has
a particular emphasis. Pastor Brian.
Good job, Phil. That was great. Um, I was thinking
when you mentioned Spurgeon, I was thinking of that illustration
(34:40):
that he used where, um, you know, the illustration was
like the gates of heaven, and as you're entering in
it says whosoever will, uh, you know, come and then
when you get across the threshold and turn around and
look at the backside of the gate, it says chosen
from the foundation of the world. So you know, both
(35:00):
of those things are true and.
But, but a real critical point, Phil, is, uh, you know,
what we believe to be universal atonement in the sense
that Jesus did provide atonement, not that everybody will in
the end be saved because of that, but, you know, his,
his death was for everybody, and not all Calvinists do
(35:24):
believe that, um, you know, some of the very rigid Calvinists,
of course, would say that, um,
It, it's a limited atonement. It's limited to the ones
that he chose. So he, he atoned for the ones
he chose. And when it says, um, for guts all
of the world, they would even, some of them would
even insert the world of the elect, but the text
(35:46):
doesn't say the world of the elect. It says the
world and
Ironically, John Calvert himself believed that Jesus died for everyone. Uh, so,
you know, here you got a system named after him
that some elements of it reject that, but, uh, the
guy who they claimed to be building their theology on
(36:07):
didn didn't believe what they're what they're believing, so.
And going back to your, uh, story of Spurgeon, um,
you don't see the inside of the gate or you know,
what's what's written on that side until you cross the threshold.
So that's why it's, it's one of those you could
keep walking back and forth by the gate and
Not walking through and but somebody might say, but if
(36:31):
you were chosen, well, no, you have to make that
choice first. Yeah, and I mean, I think that that
that is clearly what the Bible says. I think with
with any systematic theology, the challenge is, uh, to let
the theology conform to scripture rather than trying to force
scripture into the theology. And this is what you end
(36:51):
up having a lot of times with with theologies. You
have an idea.
And so we're going to trim down the scripture in
order to get the scripture to get in line with
the idea, but that's the wrong way about it. Let's like,
oh no, let's let's let our ideas, uh, you know,
(37:14):
maybe let's throw them aside if they don't fit with scripture.
Let's let's modify our idea rather than trying to modify
scripture to fit our.
Yeah, or, or even like acknowledge, OK, this doesn't fit,
you know, we still believe this because generally speaking, you know,
I mean, I think you and I both would agree
like that there's a beauty in just the truth that
(37:35):
like I've been chosen by God. That's a that's amazing beauty, dude,
that's unbelievable, right? But I don't wanna hold that to
the extent that I'm gonna look at other people as
they're probably not chosen because the Bible doesn't allow me
to do that. So it's like you said, Brian, we
have to like realign to like, what does the Bible say,
even if it feels to kind of contradict my system
a bit. Yeah.
Hard to do. What do you think, Michael?
(37:57):
I think that's great and you've answered my question, my brother,
so I appreciate that. Have a good day. All right,
thanks for calling in today to Pastor's perspective.
888-564-6173 is the number you can call to ask Brian
and Phil your questions. Here's one that was sent in
online on Facebook. It's from Martin, who writes, I have
(38:18):
a situation. My wife believes in Christ, and she prays
for God to reveal what is true and what's not true. Discernment.
However, she believes in extraterrestrial beings. She believes that there
are other ways to the Father. She believes that the
rapture is not what we as Christians believe. She believes
Jesus meant that we will be enlightened, that we will
(38:41):
become spiritual on earth and not taken up like the
Bible says.
She also doesn't believe that the God of the Old
Testament is the same as the one in the New Testament,
that God couldn't have been so cruel to kill the
innocent along with the wicked and the Old Testament. We
are empty nesters and enjoy being with each other, but
I can't sit and watch the YouTube videos she likes
(39:04):
that deal with all that she believes. So sometimes we
spend time apart in the same house, her downstairs, me upstairs,
watching TV or reading our books. My question is, how
should or can we get closer when our beliefs separate us? Brian,
what would you say? Cause you're the one that believes
in extraterrestrials at home and Cheryl doesn't. So how do
(39:26):
you guys handle this? No, I'm joking.
Well, you know, I just put on ET and, you know,
go into my room and watch it and.
Um,
Yeah, well, so I, I mean, just from the, from
the description, it sounds like, and of course we're only
(39:46):
hearing one side of the story, but you know, it
does sound like your wife has some, some pretty unorthodox beliefs,
to say the least. Now, you know, there's there's debate
among Christians about the rapture, that's understandable, that's fine. But
To turn it into like a time of enlightenment on
the earth, that's, that's kind of going in a direction
(40:07):
that I, I wouldn't have anticipated somebody going with that idea. And,
and some of the other things you mentioned are, um,
I think they're, you know, potentially very problematic. Well, well,
a great example would be coming to the Father in
another way than Jesus. And so, you know, I was
reading in Luke 10 today and it's that great passage,
(40:29):
it's also, you find it in Matthew 11.
But, but Jesus says, um, no one knows the Father
but the Son.
And no one knows the son but the father.
Uh, no one knows the son of the Father, and
no one knows the father but the Son, and the
one to whom the son wills to reveal him. So,
you can't know God, period, apart from Jesus. He is
(40:52):
the revelation of God. So to to come up with
the idea that somehow you could, that is a problem.
So I don't know if she's getting these ideas from
stuff she's watching on YouTube or like you said, she's
reading different books, um.
I, I think what I would do is say, um.
Hey, let's find something on YouTube that maybe will help
(41:18):
us to
See a better perspective on these things. You know, maybe
you watch like, uh, this Christianity still makes sense, or
you watch, uh, Wesley Huff, uh, who's a very popular
apologist at the time. You watch something together where these
kinds of things are being addressed and uh people are
(41:41):
giving good solid biblical answers. I, I don't know, Phil,
what do you think?
I think you're right on. I, I was thinking too.
I was kind of thinking back to the mom that
called the 5 year old and talking about technology and
kind of limiting usage and
You know, I'm, I'm in the phase of life where
like I have my baby is in college, so we're
kind of like empty nesters light, like almost at that,
(42:03):
you know, kind of phase, and I, I think like
there's a danger in little kids and their technology. I
think there's a danger as we get older in our
technology as well. I'll just be honest.
I think that like you can sit down and start
watching things and don't realize that the views that they're
made well, they sound interesting, it's kind of, you know, whatever,
(42:24):
just it can be a whole like myriad of of
of things, but it kind of piques your attention and
it gets you and then you realize like,
If if you're being discipled by YouTube or Instagram or
TikTok or Facebook or the news, you're being discipled in
a really, really terrible direction, plain and simple, um, and, and,
(42:44):
and I don't care if it's even just Bible studies
or different churches.
We were made for local con contextual relationships. We were,
we were made to be in relationship with people around us,
and that's what the church is. And I think, and again,
he didn't say if they were going to church or not.
I'm just saying if you're, if you guys are so
separated by like, you know, her watching YouTube, you upstairs
(43:07):
doing something else, I get it. We all have our
moments where we're kind of all doing our own thing,
that's fine, but I think it's discipling in a very
dangerous direction.
And I would say like it's time to go play
mini golf or something. I didn't even get away from
watching YouTube at all, like it's time to go mini
golf or I don't know, find some friends and go
on a date with them or go on a art,
(43:27):
you know, painting and dinner kind of a thing or something. Go,
go walk or I think we gotta get off the
tech stuff a little bit. It's, it's getting us a
little weird at times.
Yeah, I think, I think that's that's good advice. Well,
the only other thing I would say would be to, um,
you know, let's say take a book and, um, maybe
(43:48):
like she, she likes a particular book and say, OK,
let's read this together. And then, OK, we read it
and now, OK, then you, you take a book and say,
let's read this one together. And obviously you're gonna come
up with, you know, you're probably gonna come up with.
Whole different list of books and she's going to come
up with. And then you compare notes so you can,
you know, you can converse about those things. So, I mean, thankfully, um,
(44:11):
you know, my wife and I are are generally on
the same page when it comes to theological things. So
we do have our little disagreements here and there, but
you know, it's nothing significant or major. Uh, but when you're,
you know, you're talking about your spouse who just is
believing stuff that really is outside the realm of, of
Christian orthodoxy.
That is a challenge, and it needs to be challenged
(44:34):
in a gracious way because these ideas, if, if she
continues to follow these ideas out to their logical ends,
she's gonna end up outside of the Christian family rather than,
you know, being a part of it.
This conversation allows me to make my case for radio.
I do this every now and then because there's so
(44:55):
much kooky stuff out there on YouTube and TikTok, and wherever.
And here on Kwave, we vet all the pastors that
you hear on the station before we put them on,
we make sure that they align with what we believe
and uh there might be a few that, you know,
(45:16):
we don't see 100% on things, but we, I mean, overall,
they're great.
Um, and, but on YouTube or any of these other platforms,
anyone can upload anything without any oversight, with and without
any accountability, etc. We're not saying that only the pastors
(45:36):
on K-wave are legit. There are several out there that
are legit that are just not on K-wave, but rest assured,
if you hear them here on Kwave, they've got our,
you know, stamp of approval. That being said,
What do you say to people who perhaps like um
who was it? uh uh Martin, his wife might say, well,
(45:58):
you know what?
Uh, this radio station and, and our church, they're keeping
things from us. There's more out there. They the these,
these churches that tell us that only they know the truth. No,
I saw this YouTube video and it, it explained what
the rapture is. It explained, you know, all this other stuff.
(46:18):
So how do you tell them, what what would you
say to them?
Well, I, I think the simple uh solution to that
is you just have to go open your Bible and
you know, you can, you can read, um, 1 Corinthians 15,
you can read 1 Thessalonians 4, the two.
Rapture passages in the New Testament, the clear ones anyway, um,
(46:43):
and just see what it says. And OK, it, it's
not talking about a a a time of enlightenment on
the earth. That's not that's not part of the discussion there.
So you could just say, look, let's, you know, this
is the beautiful thing about scripture. The scripture keeps us
balanced because it, it, it says what it says, and
(47:05):
then if you start
You know, if you start adding to it in some way,
then
OK, well, wait, we're getting, we're getting away from scripture
here and we, we don't want to do that if
we want to get to the truth. Phil, yeah, I
was gonna say too like I think as a pastor.
This isn't like good or bad or better or worse.
It's just like the reality of difference here. As a pastor,
(47:26):
I'm not driven by like clicks and likes. um I'm
I want to help the people in my local contexts,
like genuinely help them. We're like.
When you're in the world of like when you need to, like,
it's an online like when your ministry is kind of online,
there is a need to, for a lot of people,
there is a need to kind of like, you gotta
make it like, what's the click bait to get them
(47:48):
to be even interested? And so you kind of have
to use those tools, and I'm not saying it's all bad,
sometimes it's super fun. You're like, like Wesley Huff, like
you mentioned, Brian, sometimes he'll put up a post and
he'll say something like that.
And it's there's nothing heretical, nothing wrong. It's great, and
it makes me go, oh man, now I gotta click
on it and find out what, what in the world
he's gonna say. It's great. Yeah. But I think that
(48:09):
can work in a negative as well, right? Where it's like, um,
you know, uh, they're, they're gatekeeping, like the church is
not gatekeeping. We're not gatekeeping any information, and I can
prove it to you. You have the Bible in front
of you, the same one I have, uh, read it,
like you said, Brian, like you, you all got access
to it, go for it.
Um, I think when people are like, we've got new information.
(48:29):
I'm always nervous about the new information, folk. Um, it
makes me nervous and, um, not just nervous, it's just like, oh,
come on. But people buy it and click baiting is
super popular and your algorithm will hit you. You click
on one of those things and it's over for the
next 8 hours. That's all you're gonna see on there.
You're gonna be convinced everybody's thinking of those things, and, um,
(48:51):
we just got to be super careful of that stuff.
Brian, any other thoughts? Ah, the algorithm, uh, no, no,
no other thoughts.
I'm, I'm moving away from this algorithm. I, I'm, I wanna,
I wanna move on. We clicked on this, but we're gonna,
we're gonna clicking and we're going to the next question.
(49:12):
How about we click on a phone call here, Bill,
who is watching us on YouTube in Canada? Really? Hey, Bill.
Hey, good afternoon. How are you? Great. What part of
Canada are you in? I'm on the west part in Calgary.
(49:32):
Near the Rocky Mountains. Great. So now where Justin Bieber
is vacationing.
With Justin Bieber's vacation. Have you seen him around at all?
No, I've never seen him before. Yeah, well, he'll be
the guy whose pants are falling off. So, um, that's
how you'll be able to spot him.
(49:53):
Right on.
So, my, my question is,
By the way, thanks for your program. I've watched you
for like 10 years. Oh my goodness, uh. That's great.
It's really helping the lot.
I have an estate question. My, my brother has stolen
some of my mother's estate, and I was finally appointed executor,
(50:20):
and he's been delaying.
And missing court appointments.
And we finally got the judgment in our favor.
And I just recently saw him at a funeral, and
I didn't speak to him.
And I think he was just trying to weasel his
(50:42):
way in.
To make himself look good, he's not a believer.
Uh, she's always been raised in the way of, you know,
do the right thing, but this temptation to steal land
really
Persuaded him to do it. So I'm wondering if I'm
(51:02):
in the right.
Not to speak to him, to treat him like a pagan.
To just let my lawyer deal with him.
Brian, what do you say to Bill?
So, like, what, what's your options, Bill? What like what?
(51:22):
You know, what, what's the other option?
Um, the other option is to embarrass myself and kind
of give in to his
Employees, he'll he'll say that he's always in the right
and that uh my mother gave him that inheritance when
(51:44):
she actually didn't.
Yeah, right. OK. I, I don't think that's a good
option to go go with his uh version of the story.
And so I, I do think, you know, these, I mean,
these are notoriously.
Difficult and unfortunately quite common, you know, whenever there's an inheritance,
(52:07):
there's a, it seems like there's always somebody.
That is trying to.
Swindle others and so I, I think, you know, that in,
in those kinds of cases, I think we need to do.
What we can do to prevent that from taking place and,
and obviously there's limitations to what we can do, right?
(52:30):
But so once you've hit the the limit, then you
just say, OK, Lord, you know, I'm gonna put this
in your hands, but I, but I do think that
we can.
We can do what all that's possible to do on
our part and then.
Leave it from there. Right. Phil Metzger, what do you
tell Bill?
I just agree with Brian there. Those things are so messy,
(52:53):
you know, when you, I, I heard one thing when
you said like, you know, oh, should I treat him
like a pagan? It's, you already said he is like
a pagan, like, I mean, he, he is an unbeliever,
so in one sense you're just praying for the Lord
to bring him to salvation and um but in relationship
to the estate and all the legal issues there, it's
better to probably let your lawyer deal with those things. Yeah, yeah,
(53:14):
there's nothing that would say you've got to let him.
Get away with ripping everybody off, you know, but someone
might say if you go through with a lawsuit or
something that might push him away, push him further from
the Lord, and then, well, you have to leave that
to God, you know, we're, we're not gonna, in the end,
we're not gonna be the ones that decide somebody's eternity.
(53:37):
It's gonna be between them and the Lord's, yeah, yeah, yeah. But,
but it's interesting that, uh.
You know, for the last 10 years, he's had no
relationship with his son, and when I started the lawsuit,
all of a sudden his son started talking to me. Mm, interesting.
I was able to like just put in like pastors
(53:58):
perspective podcast, and he's listening to them and everything. Great.
Well, that's good. Well, you know, God bless you. It's a,
it's a challenging situation and just, you know, I think
you're doing the right thing. You just keep trusting the Lord.
We're do what you can and you trust the Lord
for the rest. So Bill, I have a note here
that yesterday was Thanksgiving Day in Canada, so belated Happy Thanksgiving,
(54:23):
however you would say that. How do Canadians celebrate Thanksgiving?
What do you guys do there? Do you guys do the,
the turkey and the, what do you, what do you
guys eat there?
Yeah, we, we have the turkey, we have pumpkin pie, we,
we have almost everything that's identical to American Thanksgiving, except
we earlier. Yes.
(54:43):
Well, did you guys steal that from us or do
we steal it from you?
I, I think we had it first.
OK.
But they don't have any American football to watch after, uh,
do you guys watch like a hockey game afterwards or?
I don't, I don't, but I imagine people do that.
(55:05):
There you go. Very good. All right. Well, thanks for
calling in today with your question, Bill, and, uh, everybody
watching and listening, please keep Bill and his family in
your prayers. All right, we gotta go, but we will
be back tomorrow, so, uh, give us a call then
if we, especially if you couldn't call in today, we
would love to hear from you tomorrow. We're gonna be
here at the same time, 3 to 4 p.m. and
(55:26):
we hope.
Open up the phone lines about 7 minutes before 3,
and we would love to hear from you. You can
also send in your questions online, but hey, it's not
as much fun as talking to you. So call in
tomorrow 888-564-6173. For Pastor Brian Broderson from Echoes of Mercy.com
and Pastor Phil Metzger from Calvary San Diego. I'm Brian Perez, and, uh,
(55:49):
God bless you guys. We'll talk to you tomorrow on
Pastor's Perspective.
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