November 20, 2025 • 56 mins
Pastors' Perspective is a one-hour call-in program where listeners can call in and get answers to questions about the Bible, Christianity, family, and life. The program is live Monday through Friday from 3:00 PM - 4:00 PM Pacific. You can call 888-564-6173 to ask your questions.
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Speaker 1 (00:15):
Hello and welcome to Pastor's Perspective. I'm Michael David in
for Brian Perez. On today's program, we have Pastor Brian
Broderson of Echoes of Mercy. You can get more information
about Echoes of Mercy's ministry.
At echoesof Mercy.com. And we also have Pastor Phil Metzger
from Calvary Chapel, San Diego, and you can get more
(00:35):
information about him at CalvarySD.com. If you'd like to talk
to them, the number to call is 888-564-6173. Again, 888-564-6173.
If you have a question about the Bible, the Christian faith,
or how to live the Christian life, you can call
now and get your answer and
We're one week away from Thanksgiving, so I'd love to
hear what you're thankful for too. So, uh, when you
(00:58):
call in, I definitely going to ask you, what are
you thankful for before you ask your question. You can
ask your question as well, but we definitely want to
know what you are thankful for as we are in
the season of Thanksgiving. So, Pastor Brian and Pastor Phil,
thank you for being on the program today before the
rain gets here. Well, Michael, David, it's great to be
here with you in the studio.
(01:19):
And Tuesday, I was actually in that room that Phil
is sitting in right now and we were just turned
the other way so the bookshelf was not in the
picture like it normally is. And I don't know about you, Phil,
but I just had, you know, just sitting on the
same chair, you sitting on my lap once in a
(01:39):
while and stuff. It really was a, a very intimate program.
It felt just like the good old days.
No, it was super fun. I mean, you know, sometimes
we're in the studio here together, but there was just
something about just sitting there looking into the camera together
with you that I thought, oh, this is a blast.
So I agree. It was so much fun. Hopefully it
(02:02):
came out as good as as it felt for us
because it was such a fun time. That was a
really fun episode too. Yeah. So, so I was down
at Phil's for 3 days. We had a thing called
a huddle, you know, where we get together with some guys, church,
you know, pastors and so forth, and
We just had a fantastic time, Phil and the staff
of Calvary SD. They, they spoiled us. It was just
(02:25):
so wonderful and we went out to Old Town San
Diego and had some crispy carnitas, which is about the best,
one of the best things I've ever eaten. And, uh, yeah,
so that was fun, but here we are, we're back.
I'm back up here, Phil, you know, honestly though, I,
I mean, of course, some, most people, not most people,
(02:46):
some people know. I used to, I lived in San
Diego County for 13 years, so I lived in North County, man, I,
I just forgot how far you live from North County.
It's like, wow, you are so far down there, you know,
we're driving up from Chula Vista and.
Like, you know, and almost like 45 minutes into the drive,
(03:08):
it's like we're not even to Oceanside yet. It's crazy.
I know, I know, yeah, I know, coming to Chula
Vista is you follow the signs that say you're about
to enter Mexico and right before you get to Mexico,
you make a quick left and you're in Chula Vista.
You could not be further south than we are. I mean, it's,
(03:29):
it is a long. I'll go to Carlsbad and it's
like an hour. It's an hour to get to Carlsbad.
That's so crazy. I, but for some reason when I
lived down there, I, I mean, I didn't go to
Chula Vista often, although I did go, but I just
didn't remember it being so far. So it was like, wow, that,
that is far.
But it just tells you how much I love you
when I come up to. I, I was thinking that
exact thing. I was thinking, you know, when he comes
(03:50):
up and is in the studio, but of course the,
the truth be told, you bring your wife to see
her mother, so that is the main reason you guys
normally come up. Yeah, I mean, yeah, it, yeah, you're,
you're like second for sure, yeah, that's right.
Right. Now, Mr. uh, Phil, I used to actually live
(04:11):
in San Diego, uh, not too far from Imperial Beach.
It was still San Diego where I was, so it
wasn't too far from Chula Vista, and I understand that
Calvary Chapel, San Diego, where you can get more information
at CalvarysD.com.
You guys not only sing in your sanctuary and learn
from the word of God in your sanctuary and pray
in your sanctuary, you guys also roller skate in your sanctuary.
(04:32):
Is that, is that right, Phil? It's, you're so right,
and I, I know exactly where you used to live
then when you told me San Diego proper, but next
to Imperial Beach is this little sliver that is still
San Diego, um, super bizarre, by the way, but hey, uh,
I know right where you have some.
Friends that live out there. I love living there. Yes, um, Michael,
(04:53):
why did you live there or when did you live there? Oh,
this was from, I lived in San Diego from 1994
to about 2003. Are you kidding me? OK, I've known
you for quite a while and I never knew that. Yeah,
so I lived there not too long before I started
working here. Yes, I love San Diego. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So,
so again, you were South San Diego. I was a
(05:16):
South Sane.
San Diego, you are a North San Diego man, Mr. Ryan.
So yes, yes, two different worlds, two completely different worlds. Totally. Yes,
22 beautiful worlds though. But yes, Mr. Bill, tell us
about that, uh, roller skating. When do you have that
one coming up? Yeah, we have one, well, we have
2 on the books, but we're gonna have a bigger
one we're gonna focus on, and later in December, I
(05:37):
think it's, uh, it's the 2nd Friday of December. I
don't remember, but it's on our, it's on our website
or it's on our.
SD. Can you see it on the screen? It should
be on the screen. You should be able to see
my screen, right? Oh, let me see, what does it say?
Oh yeah, OK, so December 19th, that's the one you
want to focus on. December 19th, it's a Christmas skate night,
and we turn our sanctuary into a roller skating rink.
(05:58):
I mean, and Brian and all the guys that came
down saw, we have these whole shelves of just roller skates. Yeah,
we saw the skates. I mean, they're multicolored, they're yellow
and green and blue and pink and
Yeah, it's wild. It is so fun, you guys, to
see family. I mean, and, and older people love to roller.
People love to roller skate. It's so fun. It'll be
all Christmas music and, um, it's all decorated for Christmas.
(06:21):
It's our way of just reaching out to the community
saying we're here, you're welcome to come over and roller skate.
It's really, really fun. Now, how do people roller skate
on the shag carpet you guys have in the sanctuary
at Calvary SD? It's a little tougher.
But you know, you just got to keep pushing a
little harder and you, you kind of grab the pews
and then you sort of pull yourself along and you can,
you can get some speed up, but the shag does
(06:43):
slow you down a little bit. It slows you down.
It's easier to roll than to skate, but that's a separate, yeah, uh, no,
it's all, it's, it's, um, it's a concrete floor. It's
a giant concrete floor that has got a basketball court
and pickleball and volleyball.
And we just put pads all the way around the room,
and um I'm telling you, actually, the truth is, you
get zoom in on those things because it's a concrete floor. So,
(07:05):
we have fun little like um walkers for kids that
are learning how to roller skate, and I tell you,
it is so much fun. December 19th, come on down. Yes,
and you can get all the details about that when
you go to CalvarySD.
Calm. All right, good. Got it. All right. Yes. So, uh,
(07:26):
and I also see you have it on there, SD
skating.com as well. So either one will get you there. So, uh, get,
check out that skating Christmas skate night at Calvary Chapel,
San Diego, Friday, December 19th from 5 to 8 p.m.
And if you'd like to talk to Pastor Phil Metzger
down in Calvary, San Diego or Pastor Brian Broderson.
At Calvary Chapel Costa, we are here at Calvary Chapel
(07:48):
Costa Mesa, but of echoes of Mercy.com. I am Pastor Emeritus.
Pastor Emeritus of Calvary Chapel. So you can go, you know,
I can, I can also hang with that title. Pastor
at large. Absolutely, absolutely. The number to call is 888-564.
6173. Remember, I want to also ask you what you're
(08:08):
thankful for since we're one week away from uh Thanksgiving
and we'll start with David from Tustin. David, what are
you thankful for?
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Yeah, I, I had a grandbaby last year and her
birthday is coming up. We're having a, a birthday celebration, um,
my first granddaughter, and she's incredible. God is just, I,
I just.
and blown away by God's
Creative. Just unreal. So anyways, that's what I'm thankful for,
plus many, many, many other things. Thank
Speaker 1 (08:40):
God. I think, I think Phil and I would chime
in on that, that we're thankful because I saw Phil
carrying his little grand.
Daughter around.
And that made me miss my six month old granddaughter, so.
We're all about the grandbabies, Brian, you and me. That's,
there's nothing better than those grandkids, man.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeah, it's just,
it's absolutely amazing to, to, to see how, how creative
God is just in that, and then how they grow
up and just make you laugh.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Yeah, totally.
Well, we're thankful for all of the grandchildren. Thank you, David,
for sharing what you're thankful for. And uh what is
your question for the pastors today?
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Yes, I've heard, uh, Pastor Chuck talk about this and, um,
the final borders that Israel is going to possess, uh,
where would I find that in the Bible, like what
that map looks like?
Speaker 1 (09:32):
That is a good question. Uh, well, we'll start with Phil.
What would you say?
There's several different, um, books in the scripture that describe
the border. So, um, Genesis gives border descriptions, Genesis chapter 15, um,
(09:53):
Exodus chapter 23 gives a border description, numbers, and the
book of Joshua, um, I don't remember where, but I
know both of them do that.
Um, is it clear in terms of like these are the, like,
here's the exact borders. I, I think you can't think
about the borders the Old Testament describes in the same
(10:15):
way that you would like the United States borders. Um, it's,
they're broadly, yes, they're defined and they're described, um, but
practically it's, when you get down to like the, the,
the land like specific, it gets a little bit trickier
to do that, so.
Um, it would be harder to do that, and I,
I think like, you know, when you live in like
(10:36):
um parts of Europe, you're used to the idea that
borders move a little bit here and there, they have
since the early 1900s with different world wars.
And so you know, you might have been born in
what was considered um Hungary, but then you ended up
living in what was considered Yugoslavia, which is now considered Serbia, so, uh,
you didn't move, but your, your country of origin did, uh,
(11:00):
and I think you gotta think of like the borders
of Israel are generally described, but in terms of like exactly, you, you,
you couldn't do that.
Yes, and I guess like generally it's like the borders
are like natural borders, some of them like the Mediterranean
Sea and stuff like that, is that right? Yes, a
sea to a mountain, a sea to a desert, things
like that. Yeah. OK. All right, uh, Brian, did you
(11:22):
want to say anything? Um, yes, I did, as a
matter of fact. No, I was just looking at the, the,
the passage Phil referenced in, in Genesis 15.
And it's right at the end of chapter 15. And,
you know, basically it lays it out. But, but again,
like Phil saying, this is OK, this is a little
(11:42):
bit challenging. OK, from the brook of Egypt. OK, which
brook of Egypt are we talking about? Some people thought
it was brook was not the right word. It should
have been the river. So some people thought it was
the Nile.
Um, and there's still debate about, you know, what, what
body of water in Egypt is being spoken of here.
But then from the brook of Egypt to the great river,
(12:05):
the river Euphrates. OK, wow, the river Euphrates, we, we
mostly know the river Euphrates because it flowed through Babylon,
and yet, OK, wow, it's a border to spread all
the way to Babylon, but it goes up near what
we would call Syria as well, so it's probably there.
But then,
It goes on and it says, uh, the land of
(12:27):
the Kennites, the land of the Kennezites, the land of
the Cadmanites, the Hethites, the Parasites, the Rephaim, the Amorites,
the Canaanites, the Gurgites, the Jebusites.
Now today, to actually map out exactly what those lands were,
we know that they were roughly what we call Israel today, right?
(12:50):
It's the land of Canaan. Um, but the, the, the
extent of the borders, and then I think, Phil, I
think too in Deuteronomy, I think there's a description in
Deuteronomy too, because Moses, you know, this is like the
last thing Moses wrote, and I think he's reminding them again.
But then I think also in Samuel because David extends
the borders of Israel to the extent uh further than
(13:15):
anybody ever did. So he, David almost succeeded in taking, uh,
spreading the the land of Israel out to what God
had stated in other places. But, but like you said,
it is um.
It it it is a little bit difficult because we
think of, you know, like when we talk about nations,
we have a very kind of a clear understanding of what,
(13:40):
what we're talking about. But Phil, I don't know if
you remember, but when Jeff, um,
Jeff Jackson was talking to us the other day and
he talked about nations and I thought it was great
that he just reminded us that these are not political
nations like we think of when, you know, go into
go into all the world, preach the gospel to every nation. The,
(14:03):
the Greek word is ethnos, which means basically preach it
to all people groups, um, not all, you know, geographical
regions with very clearly defined.
Political borders
Yeah, yeah, that was really good. And you know, the
idea that there's no nation state, it's just people groups.
I love that.
(14:23):
Yes, now I did see a picture somebody drew of what.
Those lines would be and it's a lot larger area
than the nation of Israel today. Yeah, yeah. And this
has been even like in the whole Palestinian conflict and
and not just the Palestinian conflict, but the, you know,
the neighbors of Israel. Sometimes you might hear a reference
(14:44):
to greater Israel. And so there's like a fear among
the Arabic nations like, oh, no, they're going to try
to expand to greater Israel.
Which would then include some of them, so they're paranoid
about that. Yes, yes, indeed. Well, great answers, David. Did
(15:05):
that answer your question?
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Yeah, yeah, that's good. Uh, where, where did you see
that map? Is that a Google?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
I just saw it online and I don't know if
it's right. OK, so you can just look online, you know, for,
you know, what the Bible says for maps, and actually
I saw two different maps that said two different things. So.
I'm not sure if it's accurate, but uh you can
just find those online if you just do a Google search. Yeah. And,
and you know, David, I, I, I'm not always into
promoting chat GPT, but at this moment, I will, because
(15:35):
I think if you just put that question into chat
GPT and ask it for kind of a modernized version
of what the, the Bible teaches about that, it would
probably be able to do that for you.
All right, David. All right. Thank you for calling at 888-564-6173.
(15:55):
If you have a question for Pastor Brian Broderson or
Pastor Phil Metzger, you can talk to him at 888-564-6173.
We're going to go from Tustin to Vista, Pastor Brian's
old stomping ground, and talk to Bernard. Bernard, first of all,
what are you thankful for, Bernard?
I am thankful for my salvation and my family's salvation.
(16:18):
Praise God. Praise God. That's a good thing to be
thankful for. All of us need to be thankful for
that as believers. All right, well, what's your question for
Pastor Brian and Pastor Phil? Yes, um, my question is,
I'm a little confused on this one. on, uh, Hebrews 9:27,
it says that we'll be judged right away when we
pass away, but then it says that to be absent
from the body is to be present with the Lord.
(16:38):
So I'm a little confused on that. So if you
guys could help me out on that.
All right, Pastor Brian, what would you say to Bernard?
Uh, yeah, I think Hebrews 9:27, I think, you know,
in the context, I think just more generally, um, just
as Christ was offered once for the sin of many,
so it is appointed to uh man to to die
(17:02):
once and after this, the judgment. So it doesn't necessarily mean, uh,
the minute you die, you get judged. But
But we, we, of course, we know that there's a
final judgment. The Book of Revelation talks about a final
judgment that will come. We, it's called the Great White Throne.
Um, we call it the great white throne judgment because
the picture that's given to us in Revelation is that
(17:24):
of a great white throne and one who's seated upon it,
and he's going to judge. Uh, Jesus also says that
when he returns in his glory, he is going to
sit on his throne in Jerusalem and he's going to
judge the nations.
(17:45):
And then we're told by Paul in Corinthians, uh, 2
Corinthians that we must all appear before the judgment seat
of Christ. Now here's the, here's the key here, um.
Paul's writing to Christians and he says Christians are gonna
appear before the judgment seat and people think, oh my gosh, I'm, I'm,
(18:05):
I don't know if I'm gonna make it past the
judgment seat. Well, the, the judgment seat, the Greek word
is the bema seat, and the bema seat was a
place where judges sat for a variety of different reasons,
but it was also a place where, um, rewards were.
Um, meted out for those who, uh, were victorious, say,
(18:27):
in like the Olympic type games or or something like that.
So when we think about it for Christians, we must
all appear before the judgment seat of Christ.
We think about it not in terms of oh that's
when I'm gonna find out whether I'm actually saved or
not no we we we find out we're saved in
this life we our salvation is secured once we believe
(18:50):
in Jesus the judgment seat of Christ will be in
a sense the reward seat so.
I don't know if that's helpful to Bernard. Bernard, was
that helpful? Yes, yes, it is. Thank you guys so much.
And I, and I was, uh, one more thing if
you guys could keep our, uh, my family in prayer, uh,
the Rios family, uh, we've lost the 3 members in
(19:13):
the last past 4 months. Oh my goodness. So, uh, yes, so, uh,
if you, you know, you guys keep our family in prayer,
you know, for comfort and peace and
You know, uh, yeah, it's, it's a terrible time right now.
Oh man, it sounds like it. Yeah, let's, we're, we're
gonna pray for you right now, OK, Bernard, thank you.
Thank you. OK, Father, we do pray for the Rios
(19:35):
family and
Gosh, thinking of that that many people, um, in that
short amount of time being taken, Lord, we know that
that must be, um, really, really dramatic and painful and
so Father, we pray for the comfort of the Holy
Spirit to come upon each member of the Rios family. Lord,
(20:00):
we thank you for the hope of heaven. We thank you, Lord, that.
Um, we have that confidence that to be absent from
the body is to be present with the Lord and
so me just.
Bless and encourage and comfort, uh, each and every one.
(20:20):
I pray in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. And you know,
I wanted to ask you, Brian, because I know you
asked a question about, you know, are we judged the
moment we pass away? I know some traditions teach soul sleep. What,
what is that? Yeah, I don't, I don't think soul
sleep is legit. Uh, you know, there are some people
who do kind of
You know, see that in some way, uh, because Paul
(20:41):
says to be absent from the body is to be
present with the Lord. So, you know, once you're absent
from the body, you're present with the Lord. To be
asleep in the Lord's presence, I mean, how would you
know you're in his presence if you're asleep? And then
when Paul is talking to the Philippians about his own desire, uh, he,
he's telling them they're, they're fearful that Paul's gonna be
(21:03):
executed because he's in prison and awaiting trial.
And Paul says, you know, I'm paraphrasing, but he, he
basically says, look, I, you know, I think everything's gonna
be OK, um, he said, but actually I'm, I'm torn
between the two things, um, because, and this is what
he says, to depart and be with Christ is far better,
(21:26):
but for your benefit, um, I, I believe that my,
you know.
Remaining here would would be what what God has, but
notice to depart and be with Christ. So you're departing
to be with Christ, you're not departing to go sleep somewhere.
So
(21:47):
Fair enough. Fair enough. And uh also when we die,
we can go to the, you said the great white
throne or the bema seat, right? Believers go to the
bema seat. Unbelievers ultimately will go to the great white throne. Yeah. OK,
so we all want to be to the bema seat.
That's where we all wanna be. Nobody wants to show
up at the great white throne for sure. That's what we.
(22:11):
That's what Jesus came to deliver us from because that
is the final judgment and um the books will be
opened it says and um you know everything everybody's ever
done is actually gonna be exposed so it it will
not be um a pleasant situation. Oh gosh, wow, yes,
(22:35):
and as a matter of fact I mean it says
you know it's it's, it's.
The language is probably some way um.
What's, what's the word I'm, I'm trying to think of here? It's, um, it's,
it's language that
Could be a little bit figurative, perhaps.
(22:59):
But it says, it says regarding the one who sits
on the throne, it says from him.
Um,
From his presence heaven and earth
Fled heaven and earth.
Disappeared.
(23:19):
In the presence of God, so I, I, I think
the intention there, whatever that looks like exactly, the intention
there is to show us how.
Awesome in every sense of the word that will be
awesome also in the sense of dreadful.
Wow, wow.
(23:41):
What a day we have coming for us. Yes, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, one day the world is going to be shocked
that there actually is a God, and he's
Everything he said is true.
Yes, yes, indeed. Sobering words, Pastor Brian. Yes, and uh
great question, uh, Bernard from Brian's Old Stomping Ground Vista.
(24:05):
So thank you for your call here on Pastor's Perspective.
He called at 888-564-6173 888-564-6173. We're going from Vista North
to Pomona and talk to Christian. Christian, welcome to the program.
And first of all, Christian, um, what are you thankful
for today?
Speaker 2 (24:25):
Oh, pastors, above all things, uh, of course, the salvation,
which I concur with the previous caller, but, um, 41
years of, uh, holy matrimony with my lovely wife, Cynthia
and myself, recently celebrated.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Well, congratulations. That is awesome. Yes, congratulations.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
Thank you.
Thank you so much.
Uh, my question, pastor, um, what would be your perspective
on the use of profanity amongst actors and actresses in movies,
and of course, the other activities that may be, um,
(25:06):
used in acting, uh, unappropriate, uh, inappropriate, uh, acting and.
But the language primarily uh using foul language, but professing
to be Christians are these actors. What, what's your
perspective?
Speaker 1 (25:24):
All right, Phil, what would you say to Christian?
OK, oh, so we're talking about Christians in real life
who in their acting career use profanity in their movies.
Got it. So let's stay focused on pro profanity. I
think the minute you open up like other, others, you know,
nudity or things like that, that's a whole, that really, that,
(25:46):
that takes it at a deeper level. So just on profanity.
Those are tricky ones. I wouldn't want to be in
a situation where I'm like judge and jury for a
Christian and their perspective on what they can and cannot
say or do in their, like that, you know, the
Bible doesn't want us using, you know, profane language and all. I,
I would say though, I, I would just argue the
(26:06):
point that like,
So movies, like, especially when you say movies, these are
like global phenomenons, right? And so there's words that I hear,
like I'll hear an American movie use language that I
know in the UK is like as bad as you
could ever say anything, but our American movies throw them
around just because it doesn't mean anything to us, and
(26:27):
yet it's terrible profanity, and I'll bet most American Christians
would say like, oh, it's no big deal that they
said that, because it doesn't mean anything to them, right?
Where other words tend to have greater value because of
our understanding of them. So, I think there is a
little bit of a global phenomenon that happens that we gotta,
I wanna be gracious to people in those situations because
I think they're, they're, they've got a lot that they're
(26:49):
trying to navigate and um, I wouldn't, you know, I
mean it's not my cup of tea, I'm not an
actor though, right? Nobody's, nobody wants me acting, um, uh,
I'm a preacher, you really don't want me acting, uh, um, so.
I do think though that like I, I would give
a little bit of latitude. Now again, um, I think
when the Bible speaks about like profane words, it's not
(27:10):
just about bad words like swear words. There's there's profaneness
that we can speak, you know, I think of somebody like,
I could call somebody something and it's not necessarily a
bad word, but it could be so, it's just profane
to say that to someone, and so, the Bible's um
Directive in, in, in bad language isn't like don't use
(27:31):
these words that we've defined as bad words in 2025,
it's that don't live like, and don't speak profanely about
people or about God or about life.
Destructively because I think that that, you know, the contrast
like Paul makes in Ephesians is, um,
You know, do not let any, um, destructive speech, that's
(27:58):
literally the translation of the word. Do not let any destructive, uh,
speech come out of your mouth. But that which is
good for building up. So the contrast he's making a
speech that tears down versus speech that builds up. And
we kind of, I taught this two weeks ago.
OK, right. And I was telling everybody that God's against
(28:21):
terror downers and he's for builder-uppers. Exactly. Because you can
think like, well, hey, I'm not cussing. I'm just, I'm
just destroying this person verbally, but I'm not cussing at him.
So I'm OK.
Now, I do want to ask the question. It's the Christian,
sometimes you have to be in roles where you're the
bad person, where you are telling the story. What about
(28:45):
that sort of thing? What do you guys say about that? Yeah,
I think, I think like Phil said, I think in that,
you know, I, I mean, I, you know, it's probably
a bit more challenging these days for people in the
acting profession because the culture has changed so much that
I mean it's it's hard to find like a modern
(29:07):
movie that doesn't, it's not just filled with what we
would consider profanity or or cussing or whatever, you know, um,
it's funny because Phil the music's playing. I'm telling you
I can hear it in my ear. I know you
can't I can't hear it.
But we were down the other day and Phil's always saying,
(29:27):
I can't hear the music. And then we're sitting there,
we're talking. Brian's like,
See you guys later. The show's over.
OK, we, we'll come back and pick up this really
important conversation about bad words. Yes, profanity and movies. We're Christian,
stay on the line. We're gonna talk to you on
the second half of the program. We're gonna be gone
(29:48):
for just a few minutes, but we'll be back with
the second half of pastor's perspective in a few minutes.
If you'd like to talk to the pastors, call now 888-564-6173.
That's 888-564-6173.
(30:17):
Hello and welcome back to the second half of Pastor's Perspective.
The number to call is 888-564-6173. Again, 888-564-6173. Before we
went to the break, we were talking to Christian and Pomona. Christian,
are you still there?
Christian
(30:39):
Maybe not, but his question was, uh, what is your
perspective on the use of profanity in movies? And, uh,
before we went to the break, uh, Brian wanted to
say a little more about, uh, that situation. So what's
your perspective on profanity in movies? And I think I
mentioned also.
If you're a bad guy in a Christian movie or
(30:59):
a regular movie and you're a Christian, you know, you
have to say mean things to people in the movie, um,
as part of your role. So, uh, Brian, you were
going to say something about the rest of, yeah, I mean, I,
I do like Phil said, I think, you know, we
need to give actors a break and not, you know,
stand in judgment over them on that. I mean, it is,
this is their job, they're acting, they're in a role.
(31:20):
It's not who they are.
Um, but I, but I think obviously, there are other
things where you would draw a line, and I think
there are actors who have done it. And I think I,
I respect them who have said, look, I'm not going
to have be in a sex scene.
Uh, with somebody in this film, and especially, you know,
(31:43):
actors that have been married, they've just said, no, I, I,
I don't do that. And I think, and, you know, they're,
they're risking their
At least their role in that movie. In some cases,
they could be risking their career because people just say, well,
I'm not gonna use them anymore because, you know, they're
gonna come up with some, well, I can't do this
or I can't do that. So, um,
(32:04):
You know, a high respect for those who would do that.
Ah, like I said, when it comes to language and
things like that, we live in a culture where.
You know, words that when I was a kid.
When an adult would say certain words when I was
a kid, it like rocked me internally. It was like,
(32:25):
oh my gosh, I can't believe it was, it was
like wow, that was kind of because, you know, you
just didn't expect those words to come out of adults' mouths.
Those same words are used like
At least one time in some people's every sentence today.
So the culture has so radically changed that language now
(32:47):
is just like, so, you know, I watch stuff where
every other word is like.
You know, it's, I'm just like, like, I'm sure you
could have found a different word for that and it
would have been much better. But the point that I
wanted to make is, you know, sometimes we watch Colombo
or sometimes we watch, um.
(33:10):
Murder, She Wrote or you know whatever or you know,
you look at movies back from, you know, years ago,
and it is actually possible to perfectly communicate, fully express
emotion and everything else without using.
The words that most people are using in films today.
And I just think, wow, how things have changed though
(33:32):
so radically and, and on TV, you know, Mike, you're
younger than I am, but not that much younger than
I am. Phil's younger than both of us, but not
that much younger. But Phil, even when you were a kid,
you're turning on TV. People were not cussing on TV.
People were not saying, like, you know, like the stuff
today on TV you're just like, wow.
(33:53):
I thought I was on a, like I didn't know
that was like network channels. I didn't know you could
say that that way, you can't say that on CBS.
You can't say that on NBC, but they do.
Michael, I was gonna say something to your question about like,
you know, can you play a bad guy at all?
I think, I think there's also something that we should
say about the art of being an actor. There's an
(34:16):
art behind that, right? Where, um, if we take aside
just that they said this or they were thinking that
or whatever, I think when you think about like playing
a bad, like a villain or whatever, you think of
somebody who immerses themselves in like, this is art for them, and,
and again, I, I think you can do that and
not have to.
Um, it doesn't have to always be profane and, um,
(34:38):
and foul and all that. Like, I think there's been great,
I mean, there's incredible actors who like scare the living
daylights out of you as a bad guy, and it's
more like, it's not even the words they use that
did that. So I, I, I think we got to
give people a lot of like grace, Christians who are
just really good at their art and, um, and not
(34:58):
like kind of judge their Christianity, you know.
Think of like, um, just say the, the Lord of
the Rings or, or say The Hobbit, or say Harry Potter, or,
you know, because all of those movies succeeded in depicting
like really bad people without having to go down into the,
(35:24):
you know, sewer with, with language.
Yep.
And they're terrifying. And that was great because it's art
and it's like there's something beautiful about depicting a mythical story.
So we, we have to give space for that. It's cool.
Great answers and thank you, Christian, for your call from Pomona. Uh,
the number to call is 888-564-6173. And uh I'm gonna
(35:47):
be asking you what you're thankful for because we're one
week from Thanksgiving. So all of you calling in, uh,
make sure to let me know what you're thankful for.
I didn't start the program with a Facebook question, so
I did want to get at least one that you
can send to us at facebook.com/pastor's perspective. And this is
from Monica, and he, and she has a question about
Leviticus chapter 5, verses 17 through 19, and this is
(36:10):
for Pastor Brian Broderson. OK.
Leviticus chapter 5, verses 17 through 19. Let me get there.
I'm close because I was actually had my Bible open
to numbers. So if you want to turn it home,
it's Genesis, it's Leviticus chapter 5, verse 17 through 19. OK.
(36:30):
And her question, Monica asked this, I was reading about
the guilt offering.
I'm kind of confused. It states if someone sins without
knowing it violates any of the Lord's commands concerning anything prohibited,
he's guilty, and then he will bear his iniquity. Then
(36:51):
states he must bring an unblemished ram from the flock.
And then the priest will make an atonement for the
error he has committed unintentionally, and he will be forgiven.
My question is in verse 19. It says that it
is a guilt offering. He is, he is indeed guilty
(37:12):
before the Lord. If he had been forgiven, why does
it state in verse 19 that it is a guilt offering?
He is indeed guilty before the Lord. Could you please
explain what that means? She says, Thank you. Is he
forgiven or is he not? What do you say, Pastor
Brian Broderson?
Uh, yes, he's forgiven. Uh, verse 19 is just summing
(37:33):
up what, what he has been saying is, you know,
what has happened and what is to now happen as
a result of that. And then verse 19 is just
like a reaffirmation that, you know, when, when this is done, uh,
the guilty person will be forgiven. But I think also it's,
it's good to point out here, um.
(37:56):
That, you know, if someone sins, uh, without knowing it
violates the Lord's command, um, if you don't know it, how,
how do you go take an offering? Well, obviously it's,
you didn't.
You weren't intentionally sinning. You weren't thinking like I'm gonna
sin right now, but you actually do sin and then
(38:18):
you're like, oh man, I sinned, you know, so you
come to the realization and then as you come to
the realization, so I think the point is just because
you didn't intend to do it doesn't mean it doesn't
need atonement. It still needs atonement, and I think when
you think of like just life in general, I mean.
(38:38):
You know, not everybody is out there intentionally sinning, but
everybody is sinning, and guess what? Everybody needs atonement whether
you meant to do it or not. Uh, it's like,
you know, the, the, the penalty has to be paid.
I have, um, received a speeding ticket. Um, I haven't
(38:59):
had one in decades, but I remember getting a speeding
ticket one time.
And when the, the officer pulled me over, I just said,
oh gosh, I'm sorry. I wasn't even paying attention to
how fast I was going. I, you know, I didn't
mean to do it. And he just said, yeah, OK,
that's great. Here, here's your ticket. You know, he did
not say, oh, well, since you didn't mean it, let
(39:23):
me just, uh, hey, we'll see you later. He didn't
do that. I still had the, I still got the
ticket and I had to pay for the ticket. So.
Yes, great, very, very true, very true. All right, thank you,
Pastor Brian, and answering Monica's question. Uh, continue connecting us
on Facebook, uh, at facebook.com/pastors to perspective. Before we go
(39:45):
to the, before we go to the phone calls, I
want to do one more Facebook question. And this one
I'm going to direct to Mr. Phil, and this is
from Fernando. Fernando writes, I would like to hear your
thoughts regarding AI.
Artificial intelligence. Is it OK for pastors to use AI
as an assisting tool to create sermons? Can AI be
seen just like if it was any other type of resource,
(40:10):
book or video? What would you say, Phil, since you
are a resident AI expert? What would you say about that? Expert, yeah,
just means I, I used it one day longer than
the rest of you. Yeah, um.
I would say like I, I, I don't mean to
parse the question, but I want to just so that
people really are clear on this. When you, his question
was to create sermons, I would be a little concerned
(40:33):
about using AI in the, in the creating of a sermon,
but as a tool that we use for studying, I
think every pastor should be using AI.
Now again, um, when I was first, you know, when
I first got saved and started really wanting to grow
in the scriptures, um, the, the, the common, the big book,
(40:55):
we had one big book that we were recommending to
everybody or was recommended to me, it's called The Strong's Concordance.
I still have a copy up here somewhere, it weighs
more than the shelf could probably handle, giant book, right,
this was the book on that, right? And then, um,
and then we had the Zodiades, if you remember the
Zodiades was a big deal in Greek.
Uh, words, and then, you know, listen, now Strong's is
(41:19):
available on my phone, right? I could do that on
my phone. So, do I have to keep the book
in order when it's now available on digital? No, I'm
gonna use the digital version, it's easier.
I traveled to Hungary and lived there, I couldn't take
my books with me, so I needed them digital. AI
is another tool, I use Google to look up directions,
I don't pull out the old Rand McNally. I use Google. Um,
(41:44):
AI should be used the same way, and now,
Are people using it in the wrong way? Of course
they are, and there's pastors that are kind of cheating
and jumping ahead and trying to get it to just
write a sermon. I've tried to use um AI uh
to write sermons, only I wanted to just see what
it would do, like what would it look like.
And the sermon was good, but it was hollow, it
(42:05):
was shallow, it was, it was AI. It, it's not,
it's not flesh and blood, it's not inspired by the spirit, so.
So use the tools, but like don't, don't create your sermon,
just use what God's already spoken into you, use it
to do language studies, use it to do culture studies,
use it to do historical context. It's brilliant for those things,
(42:26):
but uh yeah, don't create your sermons on there.
All right, Brian, do you wanna say something? Well, I, I,
I didn't use the Wren McNally, but I used my
Thomas guide, and I was getting lost all over Chula Vista.
I mean, it was so hard to get to from
my place to the coffee shop back to Phil's church.
So I'm gonna try Google next time. Yeah, it might
(42:47):
work better. Apple Maps might work. Try one of those, Brian.
All right, great question from Fernando on Facebook.com/pastor's perspective and
my producer Johnny Gordon saying go to the phone, so
I'm going to go to Terry in Huntington Beach. Terry,
first of all, what are you thankful for?
I'm thankful that a year and a half ago I started,
(43:09):
I came back to church after not going regularly for decades. Oh,
that's great.
Yeah, but I was afraid to go back to church.
I thought that the pastor would talk about politics, and
I went and I found a church where they really
just stick to the Bible and the picture. It's a
little church over in, uh, Santa Ana on Sunflower. Awesome.
(43:30):
It's just wonderful. That's what I'm thankful for. Good for you, Terry.
That's great, great.
All right, that is something great. That's one beautiful to
just hear from the word instead of politics. We want
to hear from the word of God. Yes, absolutely. Praise
God for that, Terry. Uh, and what is your question
for the pastors today? My question is, I'm married to,
my husband's Jewish. He's been married for 36 years. And
(43:52):
once we went to church and he called our pastor,
he said, call them past, um, rabbi. Is it OK
to like joke around with the pastor and say rabbi?
You know, or is that disrespectful? That's a good question.
How about, we'll ask both of you, how would you
feel if we called you Rabbi Brian and Rabbi Phil?
How would you guys feel about that?
(44:13):
Well, actually, Phil and I call each other rabbi. I mean,
it's a title of honor, so.
It's how we, it's how he saved in my phone,
the rabbi, and I think we're answering your question, by
the way. We, I think if a pastor doesn't have
a good sense of humor, that's, I think that's hilarious
that you call him rabbi. I love it. No, I, and,
(44:35):
and you know, honestly, people have done that for me, uh,
to me for over the years and probably to you feel,
you know, they're joking around. I think, hey, rabbi, you know,
I mean, the word rabbi means teacher. That, that's just
the meaning of, of the word. And so, um.
Cheryl and I were talking about that this morning about
Rabonai and you know, Mary Magdalene, um, at when she
(44:56):
recognizes Jesus after the resurrection in, um, John chapter 20
she refers to him as Rabonai, which means my teacher.
And so, you know, Mary is, you know, a little
more than just like, oh, teacher, she's like, oh, my teacher.
And so, yeah.
You're fine. Unless your pastor says, hey, don't call me rabbi.
(45:20):
That really bothers me.
Now, Brian, I know you have a Catholic background. I mean,
and I've heard some people call you with this on
you guys on the program, they call you Father Brian
or Father Phil. How do you guys feel about that?
Well, for many people these days, that is perfectly fine
because I'm like, they call me grandfather Brian is actually
a little more accurate with where I'm at in life. But,
(45:43):
you know, it's not, it's not a big deal. I mean, some,
you know, sometimes, and, and you know, maybe even, you know,
30 years ago or 40 years ago when I was younger,
I would have said, hey, don't call me, don't call
me father, you know, but nowadays you're just like, you
know what people mean. They're just trying to express their
appreciation of you and
Maybe they don't know the language and you don't wanna
(46:04):
make them feel, you know, bad or dumb or ashamed
because like, hey, you know, you're not supposed to call
me father. Yeah, you just roll with it, you know,
it's fine.
In Eastern Europe, um, there's no word for like pastor,
that's like, that's an actual shepherd, even though that's what
we mean, but it's actually like you're in a field shepherd,
and so every anybody who's in like ministry we're called
(46:27):
priests and so that was just the title like I
was a priest and so they would always, I mean
I was always called.
Father Phil, Pope Phil, Bishop, I mean, just whatever Catholic,
you know, and it was all in good jest, or
it was people who didn't know how to address me
and they're like, wait, are you a priest? Yes, I'm
a priest. Cool. Now I know who you are. And
(46:48):
we shouldn't, like you said, Brian, these things shouldn't bother us.
It's all good. I'm just glad people will still call me.
I don't care what they call me.
But does anybody walk up and say,
Shepherd Phil, can you lead me to the green pastures
and the still waters.
(47:09):
Thankfully that hasn't happened. Terry, did that answer your question?
Yes, it did. Thank you so much. All right, thank you, Terry,
for calling us at 888-564-6173 from Huntington Beach. We're going
to go from Huntington Beach to Ontario and talk to Chris. Chris, uh, first,
what are you thankful for?
Speaker 2 (47:30):
I am thankful that God allows U-turns at any point
in your life.
Speaker 1 (47:34):
Oh, praise God for that. Yes, indeed. Uh, I'm thankful
for that as well. Uh, great thing to be thankful for.
And uh what are you, uh, what's your question for
the pastors today?
Speaker 2 (47:46):
Well, first of all, I would like to thank Your
Eminences for taking my call.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
Yeah, we, that, that is great, Chris. We, we appreciate
that reference.
Speaker 2 (47:59):
Yes. Um, well, on a serious note, um, a month ago, my, uh,
18 year old daughter, uh, told my wife and I
on the way back from church that, uh, she was gay.
And we have had a lot of um.
I would say
(48:19):
My wife and I are trying to initiate conversations with
my daughter just about, you know, is this something that
you're struggling with? It turns out that she is of
the opinion that she, it's OK to be Christian. It's
OK to openly embrace homosexuality. She, as far as we know,
has not engaged in it.
(48:39):
Um, she has been listening to a lot of podcasts
from a lot of people, I think, who are coming
from a deconstructionist perspective. And the thing that we're having
a hard time with is when we asked her about,
and she brought it up recently last week to the
entire family, grandparents and aunts and uncles and cousins and everybody,
(49:02):
and when the conversation naturally moves towards, well, when the
Bible condemns homosexuality, how do you
How do you justify openly embracing it and calling yourself
a Christian? She said that the verses and all the
verses that she mentioned were all the ones, the standard ones,
whether it's the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, right, Paul's
(49:24):
letter to the Romans, the Corinthians, uh, Jude, everything she
said has been misinterpreted.
And the original Hebrew and the original Greek, she's gotta
be getting all this from, from this lady on this podcast. So,
my question is, how is it that someone can misinterpret
(49:44):
other than just through like blind deceit and confusion? What
is it that she's pointing to because she's using the
same verses we are and she's just saying it's all
been misinterpreted. Can we get some clarity?
Speaker 1 (49:58):
That's a great one, Fitz or Phil, what would you
say to that?
Uh, yeah, there's, gosh, there's so much to that, and I'm,
I'm really glad that you're having good conversations with your
daughter and that, you know, there's that open, open line
of communication, it's great. Um, definitely she's, you know, she's
getting this from whoever she's kind of being influenced by,
whatever the podcasts are, whatever.
(50:19):
Um, it tends to be the, the, the, it feels
like the place of like social media is where these
ideas seem to be able to thrive. They're harder to
thrive in like really serious academic or like kind of
Um, biblical circles because when they start to say, well,
the word really means this or that, that works OK
on like TikTok or Instagram. It doesn't really work in
(50:42):
like places where other people are like, no, that's not
what the word means, you know, you, you, you go
in a room of 8 Greek scholars, there's not going
to be one of them saying, well, this actually means,
you know, this. Even, even recently there was like a,
a pretty well known theologian who came out kind of
with these kinds of views.
And his, his case for that was more cultural and
(51:04):
not language-based. So, whenever I hear, you know, quote unquote
like podcast scholars, which I'm not saying you can't be
a scholar in podcasts, I'm saying this breeds that, that, that, that,
that environment where you're talking to people, you're, you're getting
clicks from people and likes from people that definitely don't
know the language, don't have any background in that, and
so it's much easier to, to use that, so.
(51:26):
I don't think that's a, I'm saying that for you,
I'm not saying that's something you should use to put
your daughter in her place, because I, I wouldn't want
you to do that. I just simply think that it's
good for you to know that like, the reason that
there's this feeling of that is because, uh, they're, they're
assuming people won't look into it and don't have access
to knowing that, and, um, but as it relates to,
(51:47):
you know, I mean, listen, that this is just one
of the issues where people will take the Bible and say, oh,
I have this view and I have this view, and
it doesn't at all make sense, it just fits perfectly.
But the idea of uh of practicing, uh, living a
lifestyle of homosexuality as it relates to the both New
Testament and Old Testament, it's antithetical. It does not, the
Bible does not, listen, the Bible reminds us that we're
(52:09):
all guilty before God, right? And I like to remind
people of that. Not only does the Bible say this
is wrong, but it says that is wrong and that
is wrong, we're all in need of Christ, and so,
Um, I am not able to justify any of my life, uh,
apart from God, except under the cross of Jesus Christ,
and that would be the same for your daughter.
(52:29):
Brian, did you want to say anything? Um, yeah, let's
go back to Chris and see. OK, uh, Chris, uh,
did that answer your question?
Speaker 2 (52:37):
Yeah, it did. And, and one of the things that
my wife and I are really, you know, spending a
lot of time praying about is loving her deeply the
way Jesus would love her irregardless of her beliefs. But
we also have to take a stand to not condone
where she wants to go with that, and that's just
the struggle that we have right now is there's a
(52:59):
lot of
I don't want to talk about it because I know.
And then there's, you know, I'm a teacher and there's
the academic part of me that says, well, you haven't
gone to college, you haven't learned Hebrew, you haven't mastered,
so I, I definitely know where you guys are coming from.
It's just hard when someone just comes out and says,
this is what I believe. I can still be a
Christian even though it runs counter to everything that she's
(53:22):
ever learned in church or from us or, or from,
you know, her own walk with the Lord.
Speaker 1 (53:26):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, it, it, and it is, you know, really, Chris, you're,
you're gonna kind of play the long game here, you know,
and I think just, you know, through continued love and,
and also, you know, pushing back, uh, not in a
mean way or you, you know, you, you get it.
I mean, you're, you're the dad, so, but pushing back
(53:48):
with like, well, actually, that's not right. Uh, I know,
I know that you think that that word, you know,
meant this or that or the other thing.
And, and of course, this is where it'll be beneficial
for you to do your own, your own research. Um, some,
we were talking about this the other day, maybe it
was on the air, I don't remember. But, um, you know,
(54:09):
there's a big thing right now where people are trying
to make a big deal of it. It's, it's been
around for a while, but that that the word homosexual, uh,
is not in the Bible and the Bible uses homosexual
and that's, you know, just completely out of line.
Because the word didn't even come into use and I
think the 1940s or something like that. And therefore, the
(54:33):
Bible's not condemning homosexuality. And I pointed out that the
word um
The in, uh, and I think that this is where
the newer translations are really helpful. The old King James
and New King James, sometimes the, the clarity is lacking
a little bit in what they're talking about. But I
love the NIV when the NIV talks about, uh,
(54:55):
Like homosexuality, it just simply says men having sex with
men that you can't really get a much clearer description
than that. But then people like, oh, well, this meant
like men and boys, or this meant men who didn't
really love each other and were commit committed to, uh,
you know, monogamous kind of a relationship. But that's just
(55:16):
reading all kinds of stuff into it. So, all that
to say.
Keep loving your daughter, pray for her, push back graciously.
Learn all you can so you can respond to her
and trust the Lord for the rest and Phil, the
music is playing, so we are leaving.
Yes, we are leaving. So Chris from Ontario, thank you
(55:37):
so much for your call. I think a lot of
people are in the situation you're in right now and
may God just continue to guide you as you uh.
Parent your young adult daughter. I'm Michael David in for
Brian Perez, for Phil Metzger and Brian Broderson. Thank you
for joining us. Early, happy Thanksgiving, and we'll see you
next time on Pastor's Perspective.
Hello and welcome to Pastor's Perspective. I'm Michael David in
for Brian Perez. On today's program, we have Pastor Brian
Broderson of Echoes of Mercy. You can get more information
about Echoes of Mercy's ministry.
At echoesof Mercy.com. And we also have Pastor Phil Metzger
from Calvary Chapel, San Diego, and you can get more
(00:35):
information about him at CalvarySD.com. If you'd like to talk
to them, the number to call is 888-564-6173. Again, 888-564-6173.
If you have a question about the Bible, the Christian faith,
or how to live the Christian life, you can call
now and get your answer and
We're one week away from Thanksgiving, so I'd love to
hear what you're thankful for too. So, uh, when you
(00:58):
call in, I definitely going to ask you, what are
you thankful for before you ask your question. You can
ask your question as well, but we definitely want to
know what you are thankful for as we are in
the season of Thanksgiving. So, Pastor Brian and Pastor Phil,
thank you for being on the program today before the
rain gets here. Well, Michael, David, it's great to be
here with you in the studio.
(01:19):
And Tuesday, I was actually in that room that Phil
is sitting in right now and we were just turned
the other way so the bookshelf was not in the
picture like it normally is. And I don't know about you, Phil,
but I just had, you know, just sitting on the
same chair, you sitting on my lap once in a
(01:39):
while and stuff. It really was a, a very intimate program.
It felt just like the good old days.
No, it was super fun. I mean, you know, sometimes
we're in the studio here together, but there was just
something about just sitting there looking into the camera together
with you that I thought, oh, this is a blast.
So I agree. It was so much fun. Hopefully it
(02:02):
came out as good as as it felt for us
because it was such a fun time. That was a
really fun episode too. Yeah. So, so I was down
at Phil's for 3 days. We had a thing called
a huddle, you know, where we get together with some guys, church,
you know, pastors and so forth, and
We just had a fantastic time, Phil and the staff
of Calvary SD. They, they spoiled us. It was just
(02:25):
so wonderful and we went out to Old Town San
Diego and had some crispy carnitas, which is about the best,
one of the best things I've ever eaten. And, uh, yeah,
so that was fun, but here we are, we're back.
I'm back up here, Phil, you know, honestly though, I,
I mean, of course, some, most people, not most people,
(02:46):
some people know. I used to, I lived in San
Diego County for 13 years, so I lived in North County, man, I,
I just forgot how far you live from North County.
It's like, wow, you are so far down there, you know,
we're driving up from Chula Vista and.
Like, you know, and almost like 45 minutes into the drive,
(03:08):
it's like we're not even to Oceanside yet. It's crazy.
I know, I know, yeah, I know, coming to Chula
Vista is you follow the signs that say you're about
to enter Mexico and right before you get to Mexico,
you make a quick left and you're in Chula Vista.
You could not be further south than we are. I mean, it's,
(03:29):
it is a long. I'll go to Carlsbad and it's
like an hour. It's an hour to get to Carlsbad.
That's so crazy. I, but for some reason when I
lived down there, I, I mean, I didn't go to
Chula Vista often, although I did go, but I just
didn't remember it being so far. So it was like, wow, that,
that is far.
But it just tells you how much I love you
when I come up to. I, I was thinking that
exact thing. I was thinking, you know, when he comes
(03:50):
up and is in the studio, but of course the,
the truth be told, you bring your wife to see
her mother, so that is the main reason you guys
normally come up. Yeah, I mean, yeah, it, yeah, you're,
you're like second for sure, yeah, that's right.
Right. Now, Mr. uh, Phil, I used to actually live
(04:11):
in San Diego, uh, not too far from Imperial Beach.
It was still San Diego where I was, so it
wasn't too far from Chula Vista, and I understand that
Calvary Chapel, San Diego, where you can get more information
at CalvarysD.com.
You guys not only sing in your sanctuary and learn
from the word of God in your sanctuary and pray
in your sanctuary, you guys also roller skate in your sanctuary.
(04:32):
Is that, is that right, Phil? It's, you're so right,
and I, I know exactly where you used to live
then when you told me San Diego proper, but next
to Imperial Beach is this little sliver that is still
San Diego, um, super bizarre, by the way, but hey, uh,
I know right where you have some.
Friends that live out there. I love living there. Yes, um, Michael,
(04:53):
why did you live there or when did you live there? Oh,
this was from, I lived in San Diego from 1994
to about 2003. Are you kidding me? OK, I've known
you for quite a while and I never knew that. Yeah,
so I lived there not too long before I started
working here. Yes, I love San Diego. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So,
so again, you were South San Diego. I was a
(05:16):
South Sane.
San Diego, you are a North San Diego man, Mr. Ryan.
So yes, yes, two different worlds, two completely different worlds. Totally. Yes,
22 beautiful worlds though. But yes, Mr. Bill, tell us
about that, uh, roller skating. When do you have that
one coming up? Yeah, we have one, well, we have
2 on the books, but we're gonna have a bigger
one we're gonna focus on, and later in December, I
(05:37):
think it's, uh, it's the 2nd Friday of December. I
don't remember, but it's on our, it's on our website
or it's on our.
SD. Can you see it on the screen? It should
be on the screen. You should be able to see
my screen, right? Oh, let me see, what does it say?
Oh yeah, OK, so December 19th, that's the one you
want to focus on. December 19th, it's a Christmas skate night,
and we turn our sanctuary into a roller skating rink.
(05:58):
I mean, and Brian and all the guys that came
down saw, we have these whole shelves of just roller skates. Yeah,
we saw the skates. I mean, they're multicolored, they're yellow
and green and blue and pink and
Yeah, it's wild. It is so fun, you guys, to
see family. I mean, and, and older people love to roller.
People love to roller skate. It's so fun. It'll be
all Christmas music and, um, it's all decorated for Christmas.
(06:21):
It's our way of just reaching out to the community
saying we're here, you're welcome to come over and roller skate.
It's really, really fun. Now, how do people roller skate
on the shag carpet you guys have in the sanctuary
at Calvary SD? It's a little tougher.
But you know, you just got to keep pushing a
little harder and you, you kind of grab the pews
and then you sort of pull yourself along and you can,
you can get some speed up, but the shag does
(06:43):
slow you down a little bit. It slows you down.
It's easier to roll than to skate, but that's a separate, yeah, uh, no,
it's all, it's, it's, um, it's a concrete floor. It's
a giant concrete floor that has got a basketball court
and pickleball and volleyball.
And we just put pads all the way around the room,
and um I'm telling you, actually, the truth is, you
get zoom in on those things because it's a concrete floor. So,
(07:05):
we have fun little like um walkers for kids that
are learning how to roller skate, and I tell you,
it is so much fun. December 19th, come on down. Yes,
and you can get all the details about that when
you go to CalvarySD.
Calm. All right, good. Got it. All right. Yes. So, uh,
(07:26):
and I also see you have it on there, SD
skating.com as well. So either one will get you there. So, uh, get,
check out that skating Christmas skate night at Calvary Chapel,
San Diego, Friday, December 19th from 5 to 8 p.m.
And if you'd like to talk to Pastor Phil Metzger
down in Calvary, San Diego or Pastor Brian Broderson.
At Calvary Chapel Costa, we are here at Calvary Chapel
(07:48):
Costa Mesa, but of echoes of Mercy.com. I am Pastor Emeritus.
Pastor Emeritus of Calvary Chapel. So you can go, you know,
I can, I can also hang with that title. Pastor
at large. Absolutely, absolutely. The number to call is 888-564.
6173. Remember, I want to also ask you what you're
(08:08):
thankful for since we're one week away from uh Thanksgiving
and we'll start with David from Tustin. David, what are
you thankful for?
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Yeah, I, I had a grandbaby last year and her
birthday is coming up. We're having a, a birthday celebration, um,
my first granddaughter, and she's incredible. God is just, I,
I just.
and blown away by God's
Creative. Just unreal. So anyways, that's what I'm thankful for,
plus many, many, many other things. Thank
Speaker 1 (08:40):
God. I think, I think Phil and I would chime
in on that, that we're thankful because I saw Phil
carrying his little grand.
Daughter around.
And that made me miss my six month old granddaughter, so.
We're all about the grandbabies, Brian, you and me. That's,
there's nothing better than those grandkids, man.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeah, it's just,
it's absolutely amazing to, to, to see how, how creative
God is just in that, and then how they grow
up and just make you laugh.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Yeah, totally.
Well, we're thankful for all of the grandchildren. Thank you, David,
for sharing what you're thankful for. And uh what is
your question for the pastors today?
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Yes, I've heard, uh, Pastor Chuck talk about this and, um,
the final borders that Israel is going to possess, uh,
where would I find that in the Bible, like what
that map looks like?
Speaker 1 (09:32):
That is a good question. Uh, well, we'll start with Phil.
What would you say?
There's several different, um, books in the scripture that describe
the border. So, um, Genesis gives border descriptions, Genesis chapter 15, um,
(09:53):
Exodus chapter 23 gives a border description, numbers, and the
book of Joshua, um, I don't remember where, but I
know both of them do that.
Um, is it clear in terms of like these are the, like,
here's the exact borders. I, I think you can't think
about the borders the Old Testament describes in the same
(10:15):
way that you would like the United States borders. Um, it's,
they're broadly, yes, they're defined and they're described, um, but
practically it's, when you get down to like the, the,
the land like specific, it gets a little bit trickier
to do that, so.
Um, it would be harder to do that, and I,
I think like, you know, when you live in like
(10:36):
um parts of Europe, you're used to the idea that
borders move a little bit here and there, they have
since the early 1900s with different world wars.
And so you know, you might have been born in
what was considered um Hungary, but then you ended up
living in what was considered Yugoslavia, which is now considered Serbia, so, uh,
you didn't move, but your, your country of origin did, uh,
(11:00):
and I think you gotta think of like the borders
of Israel are generally described, but in terms of like exactly, you, you,
you couldn't do that.
Yes, and I guess like generally it's like the borders
are like natural borders, some of them like the Mediterranean
Sea and stuff like that, is that right? Yes, a
sea to a mountain, a sea to a desert, things
like that. Yeah. OK. All right, uh, Brian, did you
(11:22):
want to say anything? Um, yes, I did, as a
matter of fact. No, I was just looking at the, the,
the passage Phil referenced in, in Genesis 15.
And it's right at the end of chapter 15. And,
you know, basically it lays it out. But, but again,
like Phil saying, this is OK, this is a little
(11:42):
bit challenging. OK, from the brook of Egypt. OK, which
brook of Egypt are we talking about? Some people thought
it was brook was not the right word. It should
have been the river. So some people thought it was
the Nile.
Um, and there's still debate about, you know, what, what
body of water in Egypt is being spoken of here.
But then from the brook of Egypt to the great river,
(12:05):
the river Euphrates. OK, wow, the river Euphrates, we, we
mostly know the river Euphrates because it flowed through Babylon,
and yet, OK, wow, it's a border to spread all
the way to Babylon, but it goes up near what
we would call Syria as well, so it's probably there.
But then,
It goes on and it says, uh, the land of
(12:27):
the Kennites, the land of the Kennezites, the land of
the Cadmanites, the Hethites, the Parasites, the Rephaim, the Amorites,
the Canaanites, the Gurgites, the Jebusites.
Now today, to actually map out exactly what those lands were,
we know that they were roughly what we call Israel today, right?
(12:50):
It's the land of Canaan. Um, but the, the, the
extent of the borders, and then I think, Phil, I
think too in Deuteronomy, I think there's a description in
Deuteronomy too, because Moses, you know, this is like the
last thing Moses wrote, and I think he's reminding them again.
But then I think also in Samuel because David extends
the borders of Israel to the extent uh further than
(13:15):
anybody ever did. So he, David almost succeeded in taking, uh,
spreading the the land of Israel out to what God
had stated in other places. But, but like you said,
it is um.
It it it is a little bit difficult because we
think of, you know, like when we talk about nations,
we have a very kind of a clear understanding of what,
(13:40):
what we're talking about. But Phil, I don't know if
you remember, but when Jeff, um,
Jeff Jackson was talking to us the other day and
he talked about nations and I thought it was great
that he just reminded us that these are not political
nations like we think of when, you know, go into
go into all the world, preach the gospel to every nation. The,
(14:03):
the Greek word is ethnos, which means basically preach it
to all people groups, um, not all, you know, geographical
regions with very clearly defined.
Political borders
Yeah, yeah, that was really good. And you know, the
idea that there's no nation state, it's just people groups.
I love that.
(14:23):
Yes, now I did see a picture somebody drew of what.
Those lines would be and it's a lot larger area
than the nation of Israel today. Yeah, yeah. And this
has been even like in the whole Palestinian conflict and
and not just the Palestinian conflict, but the, you know,
the neighbors of Israel. Sometimes you might hear a reference
(14:44):
to greater Israel. And so there's like a fear among
the Arabic nations like, oh, no, they're going to try
to expand to greater Israel.
Which would then include some of them, so they're paranoid
about that. Yes, yes, indeed. Well, great answers, David. Did
(15:05):
that answer your question?
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Yeah, yeah, that's good. Uh, where, where did you see
that map? Is that a Google?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
I just saw it online and I don't know if
it's right. OK, so you can just look online, you know, for,
you know, what the Bible says for maps, and actually
I saw two different maps that said two different things. So.
I'm not sure if it's accurate, but uh you can
just find those online if you just do a Google search. Yeah. And,
and you know, David, I, I, I'm not always into
promoting chat GPT, but at this moment, I will, because
(15:35):
I think if you just put that question into chat
GPT and ask it for kind of a modernized version
of what the, the Bible teaches about that, it would
probably be able to do that for you.
All right, David. All right. Thank you for calling at 888-564-6173.
(15:55):
If you have a question for Pastor Brian Broderson or
Pastor Phil Metzger, you can talk to him at 888-564-6173.
We're going to go from Tustin to Vista, Pastor Brian's
old stomping ground, and talk to Bernard. Bernard, first of all,
what are you thankful for, Bernard?
I am thankful for my salvation and my family's salvation.
(16:18):
Praise God. Praise God. That's a good thing to be
thankful for. All of us need to be thankful for
that as believers. All right, well, what's your question for
Pastor Brian and Pastor Phil? Yes, um, my question is,
I'm a little confused on this one. on, uh, Hebrews 9:27,
it says that we'll be judged right away when we
pass away, but then it says that to be absent
from the body is to be present with the Lord.
(16:38):
So I'm a little confused on that. So if you
guys could help me out on that.
All right, Pastor Brian, what would you say to Bernard?
Uh, yeah, I think Hebrews 9:27, I think, you know,
in the context, I think just more generally, um, just
as Christ was offered once for the sin of many,
so it is appointed to uh man to to die
(17:02):
once and after this, the judgment. So it doesn't necessarily mean, uh,
the minute you die, you get judged. But
But we, we, of course, we know that there's a
final judgment. The Book of Revelation talks about a final
judgment that will come. We, it's called the Great White Throne.
Um, we call it the great white throne judgment because
the picture that's given to us in Revelation is that
(17:24):
of a great white throne and one who's seated upon it,
and he's going to judge. Uh, Jesus also says that
when he returns in his glory, he is going to
sit on his throne in Jerusalem and he's going to
judge the nations.
(17:45):
And then we're told by Paul in Corinthians, uh, 2
Corinthians that we must all appear before the judgment seat
of Christ. Now here's the, here's the key here, um.
Paul's writing to Christians and he says Christians are gonna
appear before the judgment seat and people think, oh my gosh, I'm, I'm,
(18:05):
I don't know if I'm gonna make it past the
judgment seat. Well, the, the judgment seat, the Greek word
is the bema seat, and the bema seat was a
place where judges sat for a variety of different reasons,
but it was also a place where, um, rewards were.
Um, meted out for those who, uh, were victorious, say,
(18:27):
in like the Olympic type games or or something like that.
So when we think about it for Christians, we must
all appear before the judgment seat of Christ.
We think about it not in terms of oh that's
when I'm gonna find out whether I'm actually saved or
not no we we we find out we're saved in
this life we our salvation is secured once we believe
(18:50):
in Jesus the judgment seat of Christ will be in
a sense the reward seat so.
I don't know if that's helpful to Bernard. Bernard, was
that helpful? Yes, yes, it is. Thank you guys so much.
And I, and I was, uh, one more thing if
you guys could keep our, uh, my family in prayer, uh,
the Rios family, uh, we've lost the 3 members in
(19:13):
the last past 4 months. Oh my goodness. So, uh, yes, so, uh,
if you, you know, you guys keep our family in prayer,
you know, for comfort and peace and
You know, uh, yeah, it's, it's a terrible time right now.
Oh man, it sounds like it. Yeah, let's, we're, we're
gonna pray for you right now, OK, Bernard, thank you.
Thank you. OK, Father, we do pray for the Rios
(19:35):
family and
Gosh, thinking of that that many people, um, in that
short amount of time being taken, Lord, we know that
that must be, um, really, really dramatic and painful and
so Father, we pray for the comfort of the Holy
Spirit to come upon each member of the Rios family. Lord,
(20:00):
we thank you for the hope of heaven. We thank you, Lord, that.
Um, we have that confidence that to be absent from
the body is to be present with the Lord and
so me just.
Bless and encourage and comfort, uh, each and every one.
(20:20):
I pray in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. And you know,
I wanted to ask you, Brian, because I know you
asked a question about, you know, are we judged the
moment we pass away? I know some traditions teach soul sleep. What,
what is that? Yeah, I don't, I don't think soul
sleep is legit. Uh, you know, there are some people
who do kind of
You know, see that in some way, uh, because Paul
(20:41):
says to be absent from the body is to be
present with the Lord. So, you know, once you're absent
from the body, you're present with the Lord. To be
asleep in the Lord's presence, I mean, how would you
know you're in his presence if you're asleep? And then
when Paul is talking to the Philippians about his own desire, uh, he,
he's telling them they're, they're fearful that Paul's gonna be
(21:03):
executed because he's in prison and awaiting trial.
And Paul says, you know, I'm paraphrasing, but he, he
basically says, look, I, you know, I think everything's gonna
be OK, um, he said, but actually I'm, I'm torn
between the two things, um, because, and this is what
he says, to depart and be with Christ is far better,
(21:26):
but for your benefit, um, I, I believe that my,
you know.
Remaining here would would be what what God has, but
notice to depart and be with Christ. So you're departing
to be with Christ, you're not departing to go sleep somewhere.
So
(21:47):
Fair enough. Fair enough. And uh also when we die,
we can go to the, you said the great white
throne or the bema seat, right? Believers go to the
bema seat. Unbelievers ultimately will go to the great white throne. Yeah. OK,
so we all want to be to the bema seat.
That's where we all wanna be. Nobody wants to show
up at the great white throne for sure. That's what we.
(22:11):
That's what Jesus came to deliver us from because that
is the final judgment and um the books will be
opened it says and um you know everything everybody's ever
done is actually gonna be exposed so it it will
not be um a pleasant situation. Oh gosh, wow, yes,
(22:35):
and as a matter of fact I mean it says
you know it's it's, it's.
The language is probably some way um.
What's, what's the word I'm, I'm trying to think of here? It's, um, it's,
it's language that
Could be a little bit figurative, perhaps.
(22:59):
But it says, it says regarding the one who sits
on the throne, it says from him.
Um,
From his presence heaven and earth
Fled heaven and earth.
Disappeared.
(23:19):
In the presence of God, so I, I, I think
the intention there, whatever that looks like exactly, the intention
there is to show us how.
Awesome in every sense of the word that will be
awesome also in the sense of dreadful.
Wow, wow.
(23:41):
What a day we have coming for us. Yes, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, one day the world is going to be shocked
that there actually is a God, and he's
Everything he said is true.
Yes, yes, indeed. Sobering words, Pastor Brian. Yes, and uh
great question, uh, Bernard from Brian's Old Stomping Ground Vista.
(24:05):
So thank you for your call here on Pastor's Perspective.
He called at 888-564-6173 888-564-6173. We're going from Vista North
to Pomona and talk to Christian. Christian, welcome to the program.
And first of all, Christian, um, what are you thankful
for today?
Speaker 2 (24:25):
Oh, pastors, above all things, uh, of course, the salvation,
which I concur with the previous caller, but, um, 41
years of, uh, holy matrimony with my lovely wife, Cynthia
and myself, recently celebrated.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Well, congratulations. That is awesome. Yes, congratulations.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
Thank you.
Thank you so much.
Uh, my question, pastor, um, what would be your perspective
on the use of profanity amongst actors and actresses in movies,
and of course, the other activities that may be, um,
(25:06):
used in acting, uh, unappropriate, uh, inappropriate, uh, acting and.
But the language primarily uh using foul language, but professing
to be Christians are these actors. What, what's your
perspective?
Speaker 1 (25:24):
All right, Phil, what would you say to Christian?
OK, oh, so we're talking about Christians in real life
who in their acting career use profanity in their movies.
Got it. So let's stay focused on pro profanity. I
think the minute you open up like other, others, you know,
nudity or things like that, that's a whole, that really, that,
(25:46):
that takes it at a deeper level. So just on profanity.
Those are tricky ones. I wouldn't want to be in
a situation where I'm like judge and jury for a
Christian and their perspective on what they can and cannot
say or do in their, like that, you know, the
Bible doesn't want us using, you know, profane language and all. I,
I would say though, I, I would just argue the
(26:06):
point that like,
So movies, like, especially when you say movies, these are
like global phenomenons, right? And so there's words that I hear,
like I'll hear an American movie use language that I
know in the UK is like as bad as you
could ever say anything, but our American movies throw them
around just because it doesn't mean anything to us, and
(26:27):
yet it's terrible profanity, and I'll bet most American Christians
would say like, oh, it's no big deal that they
said that, because it doesn't mean anything to them, right?
Where other words tend to have greater value because of
our understanding of them. So, I think there is a
little bit of a global phenomenon that happens that we gotta,
I wanna be gracious to people in those situations because
I think they're, they're, they've got a lot that they're
(26:49):
trying to navigate and um, I wouldn't, you know, I
mean it's not my cup of tea, I'm not an
actor though, right? Nobody's, nobody wants me acting, um, uh,
I'm a preacher, you really don't want me acting, uh, um, so.
I do think though that like I, I would give
a little bit of latitude. Now again, um, I think
when the Bible speaks about like profane words, it's not
(27:10):
just about bad words like swear words. There's there's profaneness
that we can speak, you know, I think of somebody like,
I could call somebody something and it's not necessarily a
bad word, but it could be so, it's just profane
to say that to someone, and so, the Bible's um
Directive in, in, in bad language isn't like don't use
(27:31):
these words that we've defined as bad words in 2025,
it's that don't live like, and don't speak profanely about
people or about God or about life.
Destructively because I think that that, you know, the contrast
like Paul makes in Ephesians is, um,
You know, do not let any, um, destructive speech, that's
(27:58):
literally the translation of the word. Do not let any destructive, uh,
speech come out of your mouth. But that which is
good for building up. So the contrast he's making a
speech that tears down versus speech that builds up. And
we kind of, I taught this two weeks ago.
OK, right. And I was telling everybody that God's against
(28:21):
terror downers and he's for builder-uppers. Exactly. Because you can
think like, well, hey, I'm not cussing. I'm just, I'm
just destroying this person verbally, but I'm not cussing at him.
So I'm OK.
Now, I do want to ask the question. It's the Christian,
sometimes you have to be in roles where you're the
bad person, where you are telling the story. What about
(28:45):
that sort of thing? What do you guys say about that? Yeah,
I think, I think like Phil said, I think in that,
you know, I, I mean, I, you know, it's probably
a bit more challenging these days for people in the
acting profession because the culture has changed so much that
I mean it's it's hard to find like a modern
(29:07):
movie that doesn't, it's not just filled with what we
would consider profanity or or cussing or whatever, you know, um,
it's funny because Phil the music's playing. I'm telling you
I can hear it in my ear. I know you
can't I can't hear it.
But we were down the other day and Phil's always saying,
(29:27):
I can't hear the music. And then we're sitting there,
we're talking. Brian's like,
See you guys later. The show's over.
OK, we, we'll come back and pick up this really
important conversation about bad words. Yes, profanity and movies. We're Christian,
stay on the line. We're gonna talk to you on
the second half of the program. We're gonna be gone
(29:48):
for just a few minutes, but we'll be back with
the second half of pastor's perspective in a few minutes.
If you'd like to talk to the pastors, call now 888-564-6173.
That's 888-564-6173.
(30:17):
Hello and welcome back to the second half of Pastor's Perspective.
The number to call is 888-564-6173. Again, 888-564-6173. Before we
went to the break, we were talking to Christian and Pomona. Christian,
are you still there?
Christian
(30:39):
Maybe not, but his question was, uh, what is your
perspective on the use of profanity in movies? And, uh,
before we went to the break, uh, Brian wanted to
say a little more about, uh, that situation. So what's
your perspective on profanity in movies? And I think I
mentioned also.
If you're a bad guy in a Christian movie or
(30:59):
a regular movie and you're a Christian, you know, you
have to say mean things to people in the movie, um,
as part of your role. So, uh, Brian, you were
going to say something about the rest of, yeah, I mean, I,
I do like Phil said, I think, you know, we
need to give actors a break and not, you know,
stand in judgment over them on that. I mean, it is,
this is their job, they're acting, they're in a role.
(31:20):
It's not who they are.
Um, but I, but I think obviously, there are other
things where you would draw a line, and I think
there are actors who have done it. And I think I,
I respect them who have said, look, I'm not going
to have be in a sex scene.
Uh, with somebody in this film, and especially, you know,
(31:43):
actors that have been married, they've just said, no, I, I,
I don't do that. And I think, and, you know, they're,
they're risking their
At least their role in that movie. In some cases,
they could be risking their career because people just say, well,
I'm not gonna use them anymore because, you know, they're
gonna come up with some, well, I can't do this
or I can't do that. So, um,
(32:04):
You know, a high respect for those who would do that.
Ah, like I said, when it comes to language and
things like that, we live in a culture where.
You know, words that when I was a kid.
When an adult would say certain words when I was
a kid, it like rocked me internally. It was like,
(32:25):
oh my gosh, I can't believe it was, it was
like wow, that was kind of because, you know, you
just didn't expect those words to come out of adults' mouths.
Those same words are used like
At least one time in some people's every sentence today.
So the culture has so radically changed that language now
(32:47):
is just like, so, you know, I watch stuff where
every other word is like.
You know, it's, I'm just like, like, I'm sure you
could have found a different word for that and it
would have been much better. But the point that I
wanted to make is, you know, sometimes we watch Colombo
or sometimes we watch, um.
(33:10):
Murder, She Wrote or you know whatever or you know,
you look at movies back from, you know, years ago,
and it is actually possible to perfectly communicate, fully express
emotion and everything else without using.
The words that most people are using in films today.
And I just think, wow, how things have changed though
(33:32):
so radically and, and on TV, you know, Mike, you're
younger than I am, but not that much younger than
I am. Phil's younger than both of us, but not
that much younger. But Phil, even when you were a kid,
you're turning on TV. People were not cussing on TV.
People were not saying, like, you know, like the stuff
today on TV you're just like, wow.
(33:53):
I thought I was on a, like I didn't know
that was like network channels. I didn't know you could
say that that way, you can't say that on CBS.
You can't say that on NBC, but they do.
Michael, I was gonna say something to your question about like,
you know, can you play a bad guy at all?
I think, I think there's also something that we should
say about the art of being an actor. There's an
(34:16):
art behind that, right? Where, um, if we take aside
just that they said this or they were thinking that
or whatever, I think when you think about like playing
a bad, like a villain or whatever, you think of
somebody who immerses themselves in like, this is art for them, and,
and again, I, I think you can do that and
not have to.
Um, it doesn't have to always be profane and, um,
(34:38):
and foul and all that. Like, I think there's been great,
I mean, there's incredible actors who like scare the living
daylights out of you as a bad guy, and it's
more like, it's not even the words they use that
did that. So I, I, I think we got to
give people a lot of like grace, Christians who are
just really good at their art and, um, and not
(34:58):
like kind of judge their Christianity, you know.
Think of like, um, just say the, the Lord of
the Rings or, or say The Hobbit, or say Harry Potter, or,
you know, because all of those movies succeeded in depicting
like really bad people without having to go down into the,
(35:24):
you know, sewer with, with language.
Yep.
And they're terrifying. And that was great because it's art
and it's like there's something beautiful about depicting a mythical story.
So we, we have to give space for that. It's cool.
Great answers and thank you, Christian, for your call from Pomona. Uh,
the number to call is 888-564-6173. And uh I'm gonna
(35:47):
be asking you what you're thankful for because we're one
week from Thanksgiving. So all of you calling in, uh,
make sure to let me know what you're thankful for.
I didn't start the program with a Facebook question, so
I did want to get at least one that you
can send to us at facebook.com/pastor's perspective. And this is
from Monica, and he, and she has a question about
Leviticus chapter 5, verses 17 through 19, and this is
(36:10):
for Pastor Brian Broderson. OK.
Leviticus chapter 5, verses 17 through 19. Let me get there.
I'm close because I was actually had my Bible open
to numbers. So if you want to turn it home,
it's Genesis, it's Leviticus chapter 5, verse 17 through 19. OK.
(36:30):
And her question, Monica asked this, I was reading about
the guilt offering.
I'm kind of confused. It states if someone sins without
knowing it violates any of the Lord's commands concerning anything prohibited,
he's guilty, and then he will bear his iniquity. Then
(36:51):
states he must bring an unblemished ram from the flock.
And then the priest will make an atonement for the
error he has committed unintentionally, and he will be forgiven.
My question is in verse 19. It says that it
is a guilt offering. He is, he is indeed guilty
(37:12):
before the Lord. If he had been forgiven, why does
it state in verse 19 that it is a guilt offering?
He is indeed guilty before the Lord. Could you please
explain what that means? She says, Thank you. Is he
forgiven or is he not? What do you say, Pastor
Brian Broderson?
Uh, yes, he's forgiven. Uh, verse 19 is just summing
(37:33):
up what, what he has been saying is, you know,
what has happened and what is to now happen as
a result of that. And then verse 19 is just
like a reaffirmation that, you know, when, when this is done, uh,
the guilty person will be forgiven. But I think also it's,
it's good to point out here, um.
(37:56):
That, you know, if someone sins, uh, without knowing it
violates the Lord's command, um, if you don't know it, how,
how do you go take an offering? Well, obviously it's,
you didn't.
You weren't intentionally sinning. You weren't thinking like I'm gonna
sin right now, but you actually do sin and then
(38:18):
you're like, oh man, I sinned, you know, so you
come to the realization and then as you come to
the realization, so I think the point is just because
you didn't intend to do it doesn't mean it doesn't
need atonement. It still needs atonement, and I think when
you think of like just life in general, I mean.
(38:38):
You know, not everybody is out there intentionally sinning, but
everybody is sinning, and guess what? Everybody needs atonement whether
you meant to do it or not. Uh, it's like,
you know, the, the, the penalty has to be paid.
I have, um, received a speeding ticket. Um, I haven't
(38:59):
had one in decades, but I remember getting a speeding
ticket one time.
And when the, the officer pulled me over, I just said,
oh gosh, I'm sorry. I wasn't even paying attention to
how fast I was going. I, you know, I didn't
mean to do it. And he just said, yeah, OK,
that's great. Here, here's your ticket. You know, he did
not say, oh, well, since you didn't mean it, let
(39:23):
me just, uh, hey, we'll see you later. He didn't
do that. I still had the, I still got the
ticket and I had to pay for the ticket. So.
Yes, great, very, very true, very true. All right, thank you,
Pastor Brian, and answering Monica's question. Uh, continue connecting us
on Facebook, uh, at facebook.com/pastors to perspective. Before we go
(39:45):
to the, before we go to the phone calls, I
want to do one more Facebook question. And this one
I'm going to direct to Mr. Phil, and this is
from Fernando. Fernando writes, I would like to hear your
thoughts regarding AI.
Artificial intelligence. Is it OK for pastors to use AI
as an assisting tool to create sermons? Can AI be
seen just like if it was any other type of resource,
(40:10):
book or video? What would you say, Phil, since you
are a resident AI expert? What would you say about that? Expert, yeah,
just means I, I used it one day longer than
the rest of you. Yeah, um.
I would say like I, I, I don't mean to
parse the question, but I want to just so that
people really are clear on this. When you, his question
was to create sermons, I would be a little concerned
(40:33):
about using AI in the, in the creating of a sermon,
but as a tool that we use for studying, I
think every pastor should be using AI.
Now again, um, when I was first, you know, when
I first got saved and started really wanting to grow
in the scriptures, um, the, the, the common, the big book,
(40:55):
we had one big book that we were recommending to
everybody or was recommended to me, it's called The Strong's Concordance.
I still have a copy up here somewhere, it weighs
more than the shelf could probably handle, giant book, right,
this was the book on that, right? And then, um,
and then we had the Zodiades, if you remember the
Zodiades was a big deal in Greek.
Uh, words, and then, you know, listen, now Strong's is
(41:19):
available on my phone, right? I could do that on
my phone. So, do I have to keep the book
in order when it's now available on digital? No, I'm
gonna use the digital version, it's easier.
I traveled to Hungary and lived there, I couldn't take
my books with me, so I needed them digital. AI
is another tool, I use Google to look up directions,
I don't pull out the old Rand McNally. I use Google. Um,
(41:44):
AI should be used the same way, and now,
Are people using it in the wrong way? Of course
they are, and there's pastors that are kind of cheating
and jumping ahead and trying to get it to just
write a sermon. I've tried to use um AI uh
to write sermons, only I wanted to just see what
it would do, like what would it look like.
And the sermon was good, but it was hollow, it
(42:05):
was shallow, it was, it was AI. It, it's not,
it's not flesh and blood, it's not inspired by the spirit, so.
So use the tools, but like don't, don't create your sermon,
just use what God's already spoken into you, use it
to do language studies, use it to do culture studies,
use it to do historical context. It's brilliant for those things,
(42:26):
but uh yeah, don't create your sermons on there.
All right, Brian, do you wanna say something? Well, I, I,
I didn't use the Wren McNally, but I used my
Thomas guide, and I was getting lost all over Chula Vista.
I mean, it was so hard to get to from
my place to the coffee shop back to Phil's church.
So I'm gonna try Google next time. Yeah, it might
(42:47):
work better. Apple Maps might work. Try one of those, Brian.
All right, great question from Fernando on Facebook.com/pastor's perspective and
my producer Johnny Gordon saying go to the phone, so
I'm going to go to Terry in Huntington Beach. Terry,
first of all, what are you thankful for?
I'm thankful that a year and a half ago I started,
(43:09):
I came back to church after not going regularly for decades. Oh,
that's great.
Yeah, but I was afraid to go back to church.
I thought that the pastor would talk about politics, and
I went and I found a church where they really
just stick to the Bible and the picture. It's a
little church over in, uh, Santa Ana on Sunflower. Awesome.
(43:30):
It's just wonderful. That's what I'm thankful for. Good for you, Terry.
That's great, great.
All right, that is something great. That's one beautiful to
just hear from the word instead of politics. We want
to hear from the word of God. Yes, absolutely. Praise
God for that, Terry. Uh, and what is your question
for the pastors today? My question is, I'm married to,
my husband's Jewish. He's been married for 36 years. And
(43:52):
once we went to church and he called our pastor,
he said, call them past, um, rabbi. Is it OK
to like joke around with the pastor and say rabbi?
You know, or is that disrespectful? That's a good question.
How about, we'll ask both of you, how would you
feel if we called you Rabbi Brian and Rabbi Phil?
How would you guys feel about that?
(44:13):
Well, actually, Phil and I call each other rabbi. I mean,
it's a title of honor, so.
It's how we, it's how he saved in my phone,
the rabbi, and I think we're answering your question, by
the way. We, I think if a pastor doesn't have
a good sense of humor, that's, I think that's hilarious
that you call him rabbi. I love it. No, I, and,
(44:35):
and you know, honestly, people have done that for me, uh,
to me for over the years and probably to you feel,
you know, they're joking around. I think, hey, rabbi, you know,
I mean, the word rabbi means teacher. That, that's just
the meaning of, of the word. And so, um.
Cheryl and I were talking about that this morning about
Rabonai and you know, Mary Magdalene, um, at when she
(44:56):
recognizes Jesus after the resurrection in, um, John chapter 20
she refers to him as Rabonai, which means my teacher.
And so, you know, Mary is, you know, a little
more than just like, oh, teacher, she's like, oh, my teacher.
And so, yeah.
You're fine. Unless your pastor says, hey, don't call me rabbi.
(45:20):
That really bothers me.
Now, Brian, I know you have a Catholic background. I mean,
and I've heard some people call you with this on
you guys on the program, they call you Father Brian
or Father Phil. How do you guys feel about that?
Well, for many people these days, that is perfectly fine
because I'm like, they call me grandfather Brian is actually
a little more accurate with where I'm at in life. But,
(45:43):
you know, it's not, it's not a big deal. I mean, some,
you know, sometimes, and, and you know, maybe even, you know,
30 years ago or 40 years ago when I was younger,
I would have said, hey, don't call me, don't call
me father, you know, but nowadays you're just like, you
know what people mean. They're just trying to express their
appreciation of you and
Maybe they don't know the language and you don't wanna
(46:04):
make them feel, you know, bad or dumb or ashamed
because like, hey, you know, you're not supposed to call
me father. Yeah, you just roll with it, you know,
it's fine.
In Eastern Europe, um, there's no word for like pastor,
that's like, that's an actual shepherd, even though that's what
we mean, but it's actually like you're in a field shepherd,
and so every anybody who's in like ministry we're called
(46:27):
priests and so that was just the title like I
was a priest and so they would always, I mean
I was always called.
Father Phil, Pope Phil, Bishop, I mean, just whatever Catholic,
you know, and it was all in good jest, or
it was people who didn't know how to address me
and they're like, wait, are you a priest? Yes, I'm
a priest. Cool. Now I know who you are. And
(46:48):
we shouldn't, like you said, Brian, these things shouldn't bother us.
It's all good. I'm just glad people will still call me.
I don't care what they call me.
But does anybody walk up and say,
Shepherd Phil, can you lead me to the green pastures
and the still waters.
(47:09):
Thankfully that hasn't happened. Terry, did that answer your question?
Yes, it did. Thank you so much. All right, thank you, Terry,
for calling us at 888-564-6173 from Huntington Beach. We're going
to go from Huntington Beach to Ontario and talk to Chris. Chris, uh, first,
what are you thankful for?
Speaker 2 (47:30):
I am thankful that God allows U-turns at any point
in your life.
Speaker 1 (47:34):
Oh, praise God for that. Yes, indeed. Uh, I'm thankful
for that as well. Uh, great thing to be thankful for.
And uh what are you, uh, what's your question for
the pastors today?
Speaker 2 (47:46):
Well, first of all, I would like to thank Your
Eminences for taking my call.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
Yeah, we, that, that is great, Chris. We, we appreciate
that reference.
Speaker 2 (47:59):
Yes. Um, well, on a serious note, um, a month ago, my, uh,
18 year old daughter, uh, told my wife and I
on the way back from church that, uh, she was gay.
And we have had a lot of um.
I would say
(48:19):
My wife and I are trying to initiate conversations with
my daughter just about, you know, is this something that
you're struggling with? It turns out that she is of
the opinion that she, it's OK to be Christian. It's
OK to openly embrace homosexuality. She, as far as we know,
has not engaged in it.
(48:39):
Um, she has been listening to a lot of podcasts
from a lot of people, I think, who are coming
from a deconstructionist perspective. And the thing that we're having
a hard time with is when we asked her about,
and she brought it up recently last week to the
entire family, grandparents and aunts and uncles and cousins and everybody,
(49:02):
and when the conversation naturally moves towards, well, when the
Bible condemns homosexuality, how do you
How do you justify openly embracing it and calling yourself
a Christian? She said that the verses and all the
verses that she mentioned were all the ones, the standard ones,
whether it's the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, right, Paul's
(49:24):
letter to the Romans, the Corinthians, uh, Jude, everything she
said has been misinterpreted.
And the original Hebrew and the original Greek, she's gotta
be getting all this from, from this lady on this podcast. So,
my question is, how is it that someone can misinterpret
(49:44):
other than just through like blind deceit and confusion? What
is it that she's pointing to because she's using the
same verses we are and she's just saying it's all
been misinterpreted. Can we get some clarity?
Speaker 1 (49:58):
That's a great one, Fitz or Phil, what would you
say to that?
Uh, yeah, there's, gosh, there's so much to that, and I'm,
I'm really glad that you're having good conversations with your
daughter and that, you know, there's that open, open line
of communication, it's great. Um, definitely she's, you know, she's
getting this from whoever she's kind of being influenced by,
whatever the podcasts are, whatever.
(50:19):
Um, it tends to be the, the, the, it feels
like the place of like social media is where these
ideas seem to be able to thrive. They're harder to
thrive in like really serious academic or like kind of
Um, biblical circles because when they start to say, well,
the word really means this or that, that works OK
on like TikTok or Instagram. It doesn't really work in
(50:42):
like places where other people are like, no, that's not
what the word means, you know, you, you, you go
in a room of 8 Greek scholars, there's not going
to be one of them saying, well, this actually means,
you know, this. Even, even recently there was like a,
a pretty well known theologian who came out kind of
with these kinds of views.
And his, his case for that was more cultural and
(51:04):
not language-based. So, whenever I hear, you know, quote unquote
like podcast scholars, which I'm not saying you can't be
a scholar in podcasts, I'm saying this breeds that, that, that, that,
that environment where you're talking to people, you're, you're getting
clicks from people and likes from people that definitely don't
know the language, don't have any background in that, and
so it's much easier to, to use that, so.
(51:26):
I don't think that's a, I'm saying that for you,
I'm not saying that's something you should use to put
your daughter in her place, because I, I wouldn't want
you to do that. I just simply think that it's
good for you to know that like, the reason that
there's this feeling of that is because, uh, they're, they're
assuming people won't look into it and don't have access
to knowing that, and, um, but as it relates to,
(51:47):
you know, I mean, listen, that this is just one
of the issues where people will take the Bible and say, oh,
I have this view and I have this view, and
it doesn't at all make sense, it just fits perfectly.
But the idea of uh of practicing, uh, living a
lifestyle of homosexuality as it relates to the both New
Testament and Old Testament, it's antithetical. It does not, the
Bible does not, listen, the Bible reminds us that we're
(52:09):
all guilty before God, right? And I like to remind
people of that. Not only does the Bible say this
is wrong, but it says that is wrong and that
is wrong, we're all in need of Christ, and so,
Um, I am not able to justify any of my life, uh,
apart from God, except under the cross of Jesus Christ,
and that would be the same for your daughter.
(52:29):
Brian, did you want to say anything? Um, yeah, let's
go back to Chris and see. OK, uh, Chris, uh,
did that answer your question?
Speaker 2 (52:37):
Yeah, it did. And, and one of the things that
my wife and I are really, you know, spending a
lot of time praying about is loving her deeply the
way Jesus would love her irregardless of her beliefs. But
we also have to take a stand to not condone
where she wants to go with that, and that's just
the struggle that we have right now is there's a
(52:59):
lot of
I don't want to talk about it because I know.
And then there's, you know, I'm a teacher and there's
the academic part of me that says, well, you haven't
gone to college, you haven't learned Hebrew, you haven't mastered,
so I, I definitely know where you guys are coming from.
It's just hard when someone just comes out and says,
this is what I believe. I can still be a
Christian even though it runs counter to everything that she's
(53:22):
ever learned in church or from us or, or from,
you know, her own walk with the Lord.
Speaker 1 (53:26):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, it, it, and it is, you know, really, Chris, you're,
you're gonna kind of play the long game here, you know,
and I think just, you know, through continued love and,
and also, you know, pushing back, uh, not in a
mean way or you, you know, you, you get it.
I mean, you're, you're the dad, so, but pushing back
(53:48):
with like, well, actually, that's not right. Uh, I know,
I know that you think that that word, you know,
meant this or that or the other thing.
And, and of course, this is where it'll be beneficial
for you to do your own, your own research. Um, some,
we were talking about this the other day, maybe it
was on the air, I don't remember. But, um, you know,
(54:09):
there's a big thing right now where people are trying
to make a big deal of it. It's, it's been
around for a while, but that that the word homosexual, uh,
is not in the Bible and the Bible uses homosexual
and that's, you know, just completely out of line.
Because the word didn't even come into use and I
think the 1940s or something like that. And therefore, the
(54:33):
Bible's not condemning homosexuality. And I pointed out that the
word um
The in, uh, and I think that this is where
the newer translations are really helpful. The old King James
and New King James, sometimes the, the clarity is lacking
a little bit in what they're talking about. But I
love the NIV when the NIV talks about, uh,
(54:55):
Like homosexuality, it just simply says men having sex with
men that you can't really get a much clearer description
than that. But then people like, oh, well, this meant
like men and boys, or this meant men who didn't
really love each other and were commit committed to, uh,
you know, monogamous kind of a relationship. But that's just
(55:16):
reading all kinds of stuff into it. So, all that
to say.
Keep loving your daughter, pray for her, push back graciously.
Learn all you can so you can respond to her
and trust the Lord for the rest and Phil, the
music is playing, so we are leaving.
Yes, we are leaving. So Chris from Ontario, thank you
(55:37):
so much for your call. I think a lot of
people are in the situation you're in right now and
may God just continue to guide you as you uh.
Parent your young adult daughter. I'm Michael David in for
Brian Perez, for Phil Metzger and Brian Broderson. Thank you
for joining us. Early, happy Thanksgiving, and we'll see you
next time on Pastor's Perspective.
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The Brothers Ortiz
The Brothers Ortiz is the story of two brothers–both successful, but in very different ways. Gabe Ortiz becomes a third-highest ranking officer in all of Texas while his younger brother Larry climbs the ranks in Puro Tango Blast, a notorious Texas Prison gang. Gabe doesn’t know all the details of his brother’s nefarious dealings, and he’s made a point not to ask, to protect their relationship. But when Larry is murdered during a home invasion in a rented beach house, Gabe has no choice but to look into what happened that night. To solve Larry’s murder, Gabe, and the whole Ortiz family, must ask each other tough questions.