November 24, 2025 • 56 mins
Pastors' Perspective is a one-hour call-in program where listeners can call in and get answers to questions about the Bible, Christianity, family, and life. The program is live Monday through Friday from 3:00 PM - 4:00 PM Pacific. You can call 888-564-6173 to ask your questions.
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Speaker 1 (00:14):
Hello and welcome to Pastor's Perspective. I'm your host, Brian Perez,
and we are here in the studio, ready to take
your calls, questions about whatever it is you have on
your mind today, about the Bible, the Christian faith, your church.
Who knows? Call us up, 888-564-6173 is the number. Maybe
you were at church yesterday and you heard your pastor
(00:36):
say something that made you kind of
Scratch your head and yeah, I've never heard it like
that before. Yes, exactly. Tommy Coda providing the visual there. Uh, Tommy,
thanks for coming in. Yeah, good to be here on
a Monday. I'm usually here on a Friday or maybe
a Thursday, but yeah, I don't know if I've ever
been here. We want you to check off all the
dates on the calendar. We'll have you come in on
a Saturday or.
Sunday one of these days. Nobody will be here, but
(00:57):
at least he'll be, yeah, something will be going down. Yeah,
for sure, yeah, yeah. Tommy is the pastor of Hope
Alive Church in Santa Ana, and also joining us is
Justin Thomas, the president of the Calvary Chapel Bible College
in Bradenton, Florida. How are you doing, Justin?
I'm great, thanks. And you guys know each other? Are you,
do you guys know each other or is this good, yeah,
(01:17):
good friends, yeah, I love, love this guy, yeah, out
there doing the, the Bible college out there in Bradenton, Florida,
really excited about what the Lord's doing there and, and, uh, yeah,
just our, our friendship, man, it's been, it's been good.
We haven't been long time friends, but I think the
past few years, maybe 4 or 5 years or so,
we've gotten to know each other and.
(01:38):
You know, um, our hearts are aligned and, you know,
just we want to see people get saved and the
gospel flourish in people's lives and, you know, keep the
main thing the main thing, yeah.
And when you say you haven't been longtime friends, you're
not saying that you used to be enemies and then
you recently reconciled, and that, that's not what no he
was living in a different part of the world, I think.
I don't, I don't, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Tommy, you've probably never made it up
to Seattle. That's not really your hood.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Yeah, no, I was up in Seattle once, one time
up in Seattle, uh, and it's because it got lost. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
it could have been, yeah, years ago, yeah, and it's
a funny story too, because my wife and I, we
went up there and, and we were able to, um,
that's when the Neighborhood film had come out, and so
we were invited to go up there.
And I kind of share her testimony and get to
speak at a few churches and I think we were
(02:23):
up there like it was late September and um man
we got there it was freezing cold and yeah we
just weren't used to it and everybody else there in
Seattle was walking around in shorts and t-shirts, you know,
and it was like, you know, you know, 62 degrees
is like cold where I come from. They're like, oh
this is nice, too funny, of course now Justin's in Florida,
(02:43):
so it's summer year round, right?
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Yeah, yeah, I'm sure Tommy will be here any day
now just to hang out.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
Yeah, yeah, I've been out there in Florida a couple
of times too. Yeah, isn't it really nice? Yeah. All right,
so give us a call at 888-564-6173. You can also
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(03:13):
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out the form and send in your question. But we
(03:34):
prefer to speak with you, so call in, please, we're
gonna be here for an hour at 888-564-6173.
Here's a question that was sent in from Deirdre. She asks,
does the Holy Spirit have a name? And also, was
there anything by anyone being recorded about the Jews during
the 400 years between the Old Testament and the New Testament?
(03:58):
I saw a Rugrats cartoon on the Maccabees, and I
wondered if this was when they were around. Justin, what
do you say to Deirdre?
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yeah, uh, this is one place where Tommy Pickles and
friends can be trusted. Uh, yeah, so the, the 400
years between what we call the Old Testament and the
New Testament, uh, there are some writings there, including the
extra biblical books of 1st and 2nd Maccabees, and actually
I think one of the best places to go to
kind of get the history as it pertains to Israel
(04:29):
here is the complete works of Josephus. Josephus was a, uh,
a contemporary of.
The apostles, uh, who wrote a history of the Jews
for the Roman Empire, and he does a good job
of covering, uh, what we call the intertestamental years, the
years between the Old and New Testament, but yes, that
would include the events, uh, that the Jews still celebrate today, uh,
(04:52):
with Hanukkah.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Yeah,
yeah, you know, I, I think it's it's, I love that, uh,
that whole narrative, because you can really also read about
it in the book of Daniel.
And, um, and I believe it's in chapter number 8
where it kind of highlights, you know, this, this, uh,
as Daniel prophetically speaks, this Maccabean revolt, uh, which happened,
I think in 164 BC and, and it was because,
(05:14):
you know, um, um, Antius Epiphanes, you know, who, um,
he was a Seleucid, uh, king, uh, he was a
general of Alexander the Great, and he goes, he sieges Jerusalem, and, um,
and that's where, you know, he, he, um,
You know, kind of desecrated, you know, well, not kind of,
he did desecrated the temple there and, um, a few
(05:37):
years later is when the Maccabees led by Judas Maccabees, um,
as what Justin said, you know, these are highlighted in,
in the book of Maccabees, first Maccabees, and also some
of the extra-biblical, um, things, uh, like Josephus, um, but
he led a revolt. And, um, and the whole reason
why there's Hanukkah is, is because of this revolt and,
and recapturing.
(05:57):
The temple in Jerusalem and temple and cleansing and the whole, I,
I think the word Hanukkah, it means dedication and, and
so it's an 8 day, uh, kind of a festival
or 8 day celebration of this, you know, um.
Dedication, rededicating the temple back over to God and, and
all these things. Yeah, so that was really good. So,
(06:19):
and also I think there was another question, the name
of the Holy Spirit, is that, uh, yes, but let
me just, since we're on the topic of Hanukkah, let
me just ask a quick question. Uh, what is, what
does Hanukkah mean to Christians? Should we celebrate it? Should we, if,
if we know people who celebrate it, is, or does
it go against like we, or is there something we
would say, oh, no, no, that's anti-Christian. What, what would
(06:40):
you guys say?
Speaker 2 (06:42):
Yeah, I don't think it's, I don't think it has
a lot of significance for us as Christians. It's worth
pointing out in the Gospel of John in chapter 10,
Jesus actually attends the feast of dedication, Hanukkah, in Jerusalem.
Um, and he uses that occasion to speak to himself
like he does all the other Jewish holidays. Uh, now
(07:02):
if you're of Jewish descent and you're a believer in Messiah, uh,
then I think celebrating Hanukkah with your people makes a
lot of sense and you'd probably get a lot of
significance out of Jesus' speeches in John chapter 10.
He points to himself, but as Gentiles, we don't really
have a dog in that race, there's not a lot
of significance for us, um, even if we might be
(07:23):
able to connect the dots symbolically between the cleansing of
the temple and even Antiochus Epiphanes and the one day
victory of Jesus Christ over all, all his enemies.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Yeah.
Yes, perfect. And then the other question that Deirdre had was, yeah,
does the Holy Spirit have a name? Um, I
In the Gospel of John, Jesus, um, in the upper
room discourse, he, he talks to the disciples about a helper, and, um,
and he, and he references the Holy Spirit as the helper.
So he essentially what he's saying is like, you know,
(07:56):
it's important that he goes and he, he actually says,
I love, I, I think it's in chapter 14, maybe
in 15, but he says it's, it's to your advantage
that I go that I send the helper, and he's
speaking of the Holy Spirit, so that when he, he
dies on the cross and he ascends into heaven, then.
The Spirit of God, the Holy Spirit will come upon
the people. And, um, and so if there would be an,
(08:17):
you know, several different names, but the, the Helper really
stands out to me as, as like a, a, a
primary name if you're gonna, you know, say that the
Holy Spirit does have a.
Well, he's, he's the helper and he is to, to
the advantage of the church, um, collectively and also for
all of us individually because, you know, as a born
again believer, we need, you know, the help, we know
(08:38):
the help we can get. And so, um, the helper
of the Holy Spirit, he comes alongside to help us and, and, um,
that I think the Greek name is is Periclitus. So yeah, Justin.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
Yeah, uh, you know, the only reason that we think
of God the Son, Jesus having a first name is
because he became human, and he was given a human
Jewish name, you know, um, but, but the Father, what
we might think of as names for the father.
Uh, Elohim or Yahweh, those are always, always, always titles, uh,
(09:09):
and we get used to using the Hebrew words in
English for titles, but there is something that's worth noting
about how we refer to the Father, Son, and the
Holy Spirit, and that's that they all, um, assume relationally
one another, and so when we say the Father, it
makes us.
Go well there must be a child. When we say
the son, we assume the father, and even the spirit
(09:30):
is both referred to as the spirit of Christ, uh,
and in other occasion occasions the spirit of the father, and, uh,
you know, getting back to what Tommy was talking about
in the upper room discourse, there's this amazing concept that
Jesus lays out that he is in the Father and
that the Father is in him, and there's this, um.
There's this referential honoring of one another, it coexisting in
(09:53):
the Trinity that even, even their names as we know them, Father, Son, and,
and the Spirit, uh, refer to each other, they, they
don't stand alone.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
So when we pray, should we pray to the Father,
pray to the Son, or pray to the Holy Spirit?
And I, you know, we interchangeably sometimes we pray to
Father and then we're saying Jesus, and, and, but we
never mentioned the Holy Spirit, at least not as much.
So should we do more of that? What would you
guys say?
I, well, I know what when, when I pray, I,
(10:26):
my mind is like I, I'm praying to God and,
and it's understanding, I think, you know, the, the Holy
Trinity that God is, is one in, in three, you know,
distinct persons, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. And so when
I do pray, you know, I, I know that I'm
praying to God and I try to communicate this and
teach this there at the church, but there's also the
times where, you know, we, we often pray, you know,
(10:47):
whatever it is that prayer might be, we pray in
the name of Jesus and
Um, uh, a lot of times, you know, I will,
maybe not a lot of people, but I do, um,
I am conscious and aware and I would encourage other
believers too. It's like, hey, when you know, like, hey,
Holy Spirit, would you come into my life? Like just
also directing, you know, I need, I need the help.
(11:08):
In other words, I need help in my life. So,
and I know it's the God, the Holy Spirit who
comes upon me, who's in me, who will help me
in certain circumstances or whatever. So.
I, I think it's, it's not like, um, you know,
a strict thing to where you can only pray to
God or only to Jesus, but, you know, it's, it's
we're acknowledging God in three persons, you know, and, um,
(11:31):
and so yeah, I do at times would pray, you know, directly,
Holy Spirit, please come into my life because I desperately
need you. Yeah, Justin.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Yeah, I think, uh, I think that's very, uh, common,
and you know Jesus taught us to pray, uh, to
the Father, and I, I would say that the prayer
in the Christian life always has a trinitarian shape, a
reference to all three, because we always pray to the
Father in the name of the Son, by the power
of the Holy Spirit. That's what Christian prayer is, we
(12:01):
engage in that way.
Um, but I don't think it's problematic to, um, to identify, uh,
the Father, uh, Jesus himself, or, or the spirit in
our prayers, as long as we remember it's not like
they're handing off the phone to the other one and
being like, oh this isn't for me, this is for you,
you know. They're one in, in will, uh, they're one
(12:22):
in purpose, they're one in in movement, um, and, uh,
I think
Using even like Tommy said, referring to the Holy Spirit
and inviting him to have a deeper place in our life, um, that's,
that's in some sense for us, uh, it's, it's in
some sense for us in the same way that, uh,
the fact that God took on flesh and has a
(12:44):
face and embodies love and makes God known is for us, uh,
you know.
And so, so it, it's, you know, it's helpful if
it's helpful, and it's not problematic, um, but it is
interesting that there's very few places in the New Testament
where we find anyone addressed in prayer besides the Father
or in certain places where people are crying out to Jesus,
(13:07):
we maybe we could label that prayer, but generally we
pray to the Father in the name of the Son
by the power of the Holy Spirit.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Deirdre, thank you for sending in your questions on the
pastor's perspective Facebook Messenger. And uh here's another question that
was sent in online and then we'll go to the
phones at 888-564-6173. Flor sent this one in from Hurupa Valley,
and uh she writes, can you please explain why we
worship on Sundays and not on Saturdays? Is it a
(13:37):
sin to worship on the wrong day, Justin?
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Uh well, we should worship every day. Let's, let's start there,
as Paul says in 1 Corinthians, whatever we do, whether
we eat or drink or anything we do, we should
do to the glory of God, and so,
So worship should be 365, 7 days a week, every
breath we draw, um, but in terms of why we
worship on Sundays, uh, they're correct in recognizing that, uh,
(14:05):
the Sabbath for the Jews would begin on sundown Friday
night and roll through Saturday until sundown Saturday night, and
the reason we worship on Sunday, uh, as opposed to
that original Shabbat or Sabbath Saturday.
Um, is because one, Jesus rose on a Sunday, on
the first day of the week, as it says in
(14:27):
all four of our Gospels, that's the day that Jesus rose,
so as Christians we recognize and honor that day weekly.
But second, that's actually the practice we see in the
New Testament, and so in the book of Acts chapter
20 verse 7, it says the disciples came together to
break bread on the first day of the week, and
then when Paul in 1 Corinthians 16 is encouraging the
(14:50):
church to gather up an offering for the Jews, he says,
when you gather on the 1st day of the week,
pull together your resources, and so.
Uh, it appears even from the writings of the New
Testament that worship for Christians was already shifting to Sundays,
and so, um, you know, it's common in larger churches
these days to have a Saturday night service or, or
(15:12):
a Sunday morning service or a Sunday night service. That's
not as significant, um, uh, as, as who we worship.
Uh, and as Jesus says in John chapter 4, there's
coming a day where it won't be, we worship him
over there or over here, or we can say at
this time or that time, at 9:00 a.m. on a
Sunday morning or 7 o'clock at Saturday night, but those
(15:34):
who worship him must worship in spirit.
And in truth, uh, meaning that we need God's own
help to worship, that he actually has to regenerate us,
we have to receive the new birth so that our
worship is actually in sync with who he is, and
then in truth, that's again not about when, it's about who,
it's about worshiping God as he is as revealed in
(15:56):
Jesus Christ.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Yeah.
Any thoughts, Tommy? Yeah, I, I think there, there's a
passage in Colossians in chapter 2 where it says, um, let,
therefore let no one pass judgment on you in question
of food and drink or with regard to festival or
a new moon or a or a Sabbath. These are
a shadow of things to come, but the substance belongs
(16:18):
to Christ. And, uh, and so yeah, I think, you know, that's,
that's the one main thing is it doesn't matter whatever
day it is.
I think we ought to be coming to the Lord, um,
every single day wherever we might be at, you know,
and that Jesus fulfilled. It's all about, you know, it's,
it's really celebrating who Jesus is and it's not being
stuck in like this legalistic mode. And I know there's
(16:40):
a lot of churches, a lot of people that, that
will say, well, you, you have to, you know, like
1/7 Day Adventist, you know, you have to worship on
these days, any other days, you know, um, and they
also look to the kind of the dietary laws and
all these other things, but.
You know, um, Jesus fulfilled all the law, you know, and, uh, when,
when we think of the Sabbath, you know, this is
one thing that, um, you know, as far as like
(17:02):
a commandment, we don't really read in the New Testament
and we see it being exercised in the sense that the,
the church, Jesus rising on the first day and, and
the church continuing as what Justin said.
You know, in the book of Acts, um, to, to
come together on that first day to, to celebrate the
resurrection of Jesus and to come together as a church
(17:22):
and to grow as, as a ministry and so I
think um we can get very legalistic in uh in
in looking at some things like this and put, you know,
these unnecessary boundaries on us.
And then, you know, the enemy, that when I say
the enemy, the devil, he'll, he'll use all these things
to exploit, you know, even our own emotions like, oh man,
you know, I went to church on a Sunday. Oh,
(17:43):
God's gonna, you know, not forgive me or he doesn't,
you know, receive my worship, with, which that is not
true because it can, as Justin said, it can be
a Friday night, you know, in the middle of a
parking lot. It don't even matter.
Very true. Alright, uh, who was that? Flor? Thank you
for sending in your question through the pastor's perspective page
at kwave.com. And, uh, just one bit of clarification on that.
(18:06):
When we say that we should worship God every single day,
that doesn't mean we have to go to church every
single day, right? Yeah, because I think that might be
the what?
You can't do that, but no, we're just talking about, yeah, yeah,
and I, I think worship, you know, is, is, um,
sometimes we, we even think of the word worship as like, OK,
well that's, you know, music, you know, that song or
something like that, you know, I, I would say, well,
(18:26):
no worship is, is, um, you know, it's lived out,
you know, we can worshiply live out our life, you know, um,
wherever we might be at, and, you know, it's, it's
that constant acknowledgement of, of God's presence in our life,
you know, and so, and I get it, you know,
sometimes we're busy with work and all that stuff, so
we can't.
You know, I'm on my knees and your boss is like, hey,
what are you doing? You know, it's like, but you know,
(18:47):
in our hearts we can have this awareness of the
presence of God and I, I even think that, you know,
when we pray, that's a form of worship and, and,
and prayer is that is that constant, you know, practice of,
of the presence of heaven, if you will, you know,
and it's like, man, my, my, my mind is in
my heart is, you know, just connected to God. So
(19:09):
I, I really like that passage that Justin shared about,
you know, in John chapter 4 that we would, we
must worship the Lord in spirit and in truth, and
I think that's, you know, really essential and key. So
these churches that do a Saturday night service and a
Sunday morning service, it's more for convenience that they're doing it,
like for people who maybe work on a Sunday or whatever.
It's not that they're, you know, if anybody, you know,
(19:31):
I can think of one church off the top of
my head that does, or two churches now, I just
thought of another one that does a Saturday night and
a Sunday morning.
And if anybody goes to the Saturday night because they're thinking, oh,
that's the right one to go to, we would say, no,
that's not necessarily the case. I mean, if, if somebody
has the chance to go to both, I mean, it's
usually just a mirror, one is just a mirror of
(19:52):
the other. Justin, any thoughts on that?
Speaker 2 (19:55):
Yeah, I think it, I mean, in every case that
I can think of, it's about capacity.
Their building only seats so many people, more people come,
so they add another service, uh, and eventually you run
out of good slots on Sunday, and, and I think
Tommy and I can both tell you that, that more
than 2 services on a Sunday is exhausting for the
leaders who are running on it, running it, and
(20:15):
And so I've always been amazed at churches that run
all day Sunday and Saturday to make room for people.
I wish we'd just plant more churches, uh, but, um, but,
but yeah, I don't, I'm not aware of any church
that's even trying to appease people's conscience and be like, hey, if,
if you can't wrap your head around Sunday worship, we've
got a Saturday for you. I've never even heard that
as an option. It's, it's usually just about convenience, yeah.
(20:36):
Uh, but also about capacity,
Speaker 1 (20:38):
yeah, yeah, yeah, I, I remember when here at Cava
Chapa Costa Mesa, you know, um, that there was services
pretty much every night of the week, you know, it
was Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday. There was something
going on, you know, a time to
Come together as as the body of Christ. So yeah, it, yeah,
that's a, that's not necessarily a bad thing and it
is really pretty for the most part, it's, uh, you know,
(21:00):
out of necessity. Yeah. And when there's small groups in
the middle of the week or something, small group gatherings
at homes or whatever, that's always good too.
All right, 888-564-6173 is the number to call today on
Pastor's Perspective. I'm Brian Perez here with Pastor Tommy Coda
and Justin Thomas, the president of the Calvary Chapel Bible
College in Bradenton, Florida. Give us a call at 888-564-6173.
(21:25):
We're just a few days away from Thanksgiving, so if
you call in, I might ask you, what are you
thankful for? Uh, we're gonna begin with Carmen in Upland
who is listening on AM 11:10 K wave. Hey there, Carmen,
what are you thankful for?
Hi, I am thankful for God's faithfulness.
Awesome, yes.
(21:46):
For sure. And I'm thankful, yes. All right, and what's
your question for us today?
I have a question. I'm calling to ask for prayer
for my family.
We're gathering together, of course, for Thanksgiving and some are
not in right relationship with uh God, and I just
(22:07):
want all of us to get along. That's all. I'm
asking you to pray for my family. Have there been
instances in the past where arguments have broken out or
what happens at a typical family gathering?
That you want to be different this year.
I want people to really realize that God is there
(22:30):
for them. Yes, there have been arguments.
And you know, with the political scene.
And I just want everybody just, just get along and
realize how good God has been to us this year
cause we've had some ups and downs in family, but
(22:50):
I want them to really realize how good God is. Mm. Yeah.
Any thoughts on that, Tommy?
Yeah, you, you know, Carmen, we're definitely gonna be praying
for you and, and, um, I, I wanna just share
with you, Carmen, this is a such a, a great time.
My heart breaks for you because it's, you know, you
love your family and, um, as, as we should, and,
and that's a good thing that you're seeking the Lord and,
(23:12):
and all these things, and I wouldn't.
I would encourage you, you know, just continue to, you know,
express love there with your family, you know, and it
doesn't always have to be, you know, um, like, like in,
in words or, or only in action. I think it's both,
you know, it's, it's in our actions is in how
we treat, treat them, and you, you know, it could
(23:33):
be that the Lord's gonna use you, you know, to, uh, as,
as the springboard or the catalyst to, you know, to bring.
Sounds like reconciliation, you know, for, for your family, and, um,
you know, and I wanna encourage you, Carmen, and, and
anyone else who might be listening who's a little hesitant
to maybe go to a family gathering because of, you know,
(23:53):
for whatever reason.
You know, be prayed up, like pray before you, you know,
you go and, and I, I share this even with
my family sometimes when we go to different gatherings or
something I was like, OK, we, we kind of know
where we're gonna be going into. Let's, let's, um, you know,
let's pray and let's have a heart like a, like
be missional like we wanna be little tiny missionaries with
our family right now and, and just love in, in
(24:15):
the name of Jesus and serve and, and, you know, um,
represent Jesus well in these spaces.
You know, because God does the miracles, and I would say, Carmen, when,
when if you're, when you're prayed up and you're seeking
the Lord and all these things, you know, God's gonna
do that work, you know, I, I just love the
fact that when we look to the word of God,
like he tells us that his word doesn't return void,
(24:36):
you know, and so it's, you know, be, be filled,
be fed and, and be filled with the word of God,
you know, with the gospel message, and.
You know, just be missional, um, when you're there with
your family members and, um, you know, use the opportunity
maybe before the meals there and to, to say, hey,
can we pray and, you know, pray and, um, and
(24:56):
just ask the Lord to do a great work and,
and I'm sure that he will for sure.
Justin, would you say that it's OK to like put
boundaries or some, have some kind of parameters like if,
especially if there's gonna be a gathering at Carmen's house,
when she sends out the invitations or whatever, sends the texts,
makes the phone calls, whatever.
Um, where she just right up front says, by the way,
(25:19):
we're not discussing politics, we're just there to gather as
a family, to be thankful to God for our, for
the many blessings he's bestowed upon us. Is that something
that could be done in a way that doesn't come
across as, you know, Carmen's trying to run the show
or whatever? What would you say?
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Yeah, no, I think, I think that's good. I always
think of Thanksgiving culturally, not within the church, but culturally
as the last Christian holiday.
Uh, and what I mean is kind of like when
Paul finds that altar in Athens to the unknown god.
Thanksgiving is a holiday to the unknown god. They, they
may not know who they're thankful to, but they're all
thankful for these things, right? There's giving of thanks is
(25:58):
the whole purpose, uh, and so it assumes there's someone
we're thanking. Um, and it's unfortunate actually that Thanksgiving falls
so close to, uh, you know, election day, and we,
and politics, you know, tends to oversume, uh, overwhelm these
things and
Honestly, in, in a time like this, sometimes families don't
have close relationships and so gathering once a year, all
(26:22):
of those tensions and differences really come to the foreground,
but I think it's totally appropriate to say that, you know, we,
we want to get together to be thankful, you know,
and I, I used to have a big rule in
my church, I still have it in my family.
Uh, Black Friday does not begin on Thanksgiving, so, so
stay away from thinking about the things you do not
(26:43):
yet have and the things that you, you want. That's,
that's the greatest attack on Thanksgiving there could be, this
capitalistic capitalistic obsession we call Black Friday. Um, so Thanksgiving
is an opportunity to, to just focus on that and
to enjoy one another's company and yeah, Carmen, if you
get the opportunity to, to say to people, you know.
(27:04):
Whether they're aware of it or not, all of these
things that they are thankful for are provided by God,
who is the giver of all good gifts, the scriptures say,
that preaches, and they, they may not believe it, but
uh this is an opportunity for you to say to them,
you are thankful, and let me introduce you to the
one that you give thanks to.
(27:25):
Um, but, but yes, I think, uh, Brian, I think
putting boundaries around that is really wise and around ourselves
as well, because let's recognize we all have a seat
at the table, we all have opinions, we all have
bad history, and, uh, you know, uh, so there's always
the need, I think, to be able to set aside
the differences, to keep the main thing, the main thing,
(27:47):
which is just to enjoy family and be grateful for
another year.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
Yeah, Tommy, I'll give you one minute to pray for Carmen.
Oh yeah, OK, Father, Lord, we wanna just pray and
intercede for Carmen and also for her entire family, Lord, um,
this coming Thanksgiving as they, they gather as a family and, and, um,
I pray, Lord, that, uh, that you would just do
a supernatural work, um, in the heart of all her,
(28:14):
all her family members. Lord, whatever those differences or opinions
might be.
Lord, that those things would just be, um, not, not
highlighted at all, but, but Lord, that what would be
highlighted would be the goodness of God and the grace
of God and, and, and Lord, that you would do
a work of reconciliation as it seems that maybe there's
(28:34):
just uh there's strife or there's some just some challenges, Lord,
with arguments or whatever with different opinions. Lord, you're bigger
than all of those things and I pray God that
you would do that and that there would be the ministry.
Of reconciliation that would take place, uh, there in Carmen's home.
And so Father, um, would you bless her? Give her
words of wisdom too. Give Carmen words of wisdom, words
(28:56):
of grace, Lord, um, Father, I just think of that
how they're in Proverbs it says like those those words
of wisdom is like apples of gold, Lord, and, and
so God, I pray that you would just give her
those words and, and, um, and help her, Lord, to
just be that, that servant that brings glory to you, Lord.
We love you and we praise you in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen.
(29:18):
And if anybody's wondering why I only allowed Tommy to
pray for one minute, it's because it's break time here
on Pastor's perspective. I could have given him the rest
of the hour, but no, we have to take a break. And, uh,
so we did that. And when we come back here
on Pastor's.
Perspective, we'll take your calls at 888-564-6173. Perhaps a question
to kick off the second half of the program in
line with that theme of Thanksgiving. So Carmen mentioned, you know,
(29:41):
political things, but what happens if you're invited to someone's
house or they come over to your house and
You know, there's, there's a lot of talk of what
if somebody's going through a physical change, if you know
what I mean, as in transitioning from one sex to
the next, from one gender to the next, and that's
been happening so much lately, and how do you deal
(30:01):
with that? We'll talk about it when we come back
on Pastor's perspective.
All right, we are back on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is
(30:22):
the number to call, and we'll get to some more
of your questions in just a moment. We've got Pastor
Tommy Coda from Hope Alive Church in Santa Ana here today,
and Justin Thomas, the president of the Calvary.
Chapel Bible College in Bradenton, Florida, and we're 3 days
away from Thanksgiving, and the question that I posed right
before the break, and I'm gonna change it up a
little bit here, uh, so that I can get each
(30:42):
of your opinions on this. What happens if somebody comes
over to your home, uh, or they might even ask
in advance or they might just surprise you and, uh,
they show up with, for example, uh, a member of
the same sex because they announced earlier this year that
They're same-sex attracted and so that's come up a lot
lately where do I allow them to, am I condoning
(31:05):
by allowing them to come in and celebrate with us,
that kind of thing. Justin, what would you say?
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Yeah, I would say, you know, we need to follow Jesus'
example here, and um we find him around all sorts
of people that the religious of his day looked down
upon his association, you know, he was accused of being
a glutton and a wine bibber, a drunk because he
was around people who did those things, you know, uh,
(31:31):
when he goes to Simon the Pharisee's house.
Uh, and there's a woman washing his, his feet. Simon
thinks to himself, if, if Jesus was a prophet, he'd
know what type of woman that was and wouldn't let
her near him. You know, in John chapter 4, the
woman is 4 marriages deep and now living with a
man who's not her husband, and he has a conversation
with her. Uh, the, the way that we express Christ-like
(31:55):
behavior is not in who we avoid.
But in how we behave to all our neighbors and
even our enemies who we're called to love, and so,
especially in the context of Thanksgiving, I, I would say
that this is an area where there doesn't need to
be an agenda to hit the issues, like, like we
talked about with Carmen, um, you know, being able to
(32:17):
set those aside and just affirming your love for a person,
which is never the same thing as affirming.
Uh, their choices, uh, of being hospitable and wel welcoming
them as those who are created in the image of God.
There are places and times for conversations about these things,
and trust me as a pastor in Seattle, I've had
them more than most, uh, but I would say at the,
(32:40):
at the Thanksgiving table with an audience watching, it's not
the right place for those conversations. Instead, what needs to
be affirmed is, uh, that God is good, that God
is welcoming.
That his love is inexhaustible, um, and, and, and that
he wants to know each and every person at the
table and will meet them right where they are, and
he will never leave them the same, uh, you know,
(33:01):
if Jesus is alive today, everything you know is wrong,
that's always.
Gonna be the case, uh, but it's Jesus who came
for the sick, for the sinner, for the lost, and he's,
it's we who are called as his disciples to go
out into the highways and hedges and compel them to
come in because there's a table for them at the, uh,
or there's a seat for them at the table.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Yeah, Tommy, yeah,
no, that's a, that's a great question, Brian, and, um,
you know, I, I was thinking of.
Um, I, I have a, I have a very large
family and, um, you know, and I think just in the,
the season of life like our society and, and how
it is today, you know, um, and having a large family,
you're kind of, you're bound to have this kind of interaction,
(33:45):
you know, with people, whether it's, it's attraction to same
sex or there's drug addiction, there's alcoholism, there's, there's something
that obviously like, like, you know, um.
Like my, my heart, it's like, no, I, God saved
me from a lot of things, but I love what,
what Justin said is like, and I try to encourage,
you know, our church and myself this all the time
(34:06):
is like, how did Jesus treat me, you know, uh,
because I wasn't always a Christian, you know, uh, many
people know, know my background. I was, you know, in, in,
in prison and drugs, you know, uh, just living on
the streets, crim a lot of criminal activity that, that
I was involved with and.
You know, and God, God set me free, and I
was never, um, I was never not told that I couldn't,
(34:28):
you know, enter some of these spaces, some from some
family members because they did love Jesus and they wanted
to see me come to faith, you know, and, and
so they, they just.
Loved on me, you know, and I think that's exactly
what Jesus did, you know, with, with all the examples
that Justin had laid out, that was, that was his heart.
He wants to see people be, you know, uh, transformed
(34:48):
and changed, you know, um, that their, their life would
flourish and and blossom. So.
I just think of a lot of families that might
be listening right now. You might be listening and say, man,
you know, this is, you know, my, my, my nephew
who's coming over, you know, um, is, I know he's
probably gonna bring his, his partner or my niece or
my son or daughter, whatever that case might be. This
is a great opportunity, I think, not to close, close
(35:10):
the doors, but to, you know, obviously, you know, I
think you, they, they should, they probably know that you're
a Christian and that you love Jesus and you know,
but we still want to go to your house because
there's your family.
You know, and that's a great opportunity not just to
love on them, but again, if it being at your house, especially,
you know, that this is a great time before the
(35:30):
meal just to share a quick prayer, you know, share
the gospel very briefly, you know, and, and just to
plant the seed of, of God, you know, of the gospel, and, uh,
so those are, are great opportunities to do that, and
that's what God's called us to do, to be the
salt and light, you know, and just to share that
gospel message, yeah, Justin.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Yeah, I just wanted to encourage us away from this
instinct that I think we all have. I don't know
where it comes from, but culturally in Christianity in America.
I think we always feel the need, this urgency to
plant the faithfulness flag, to, to speak the truth as
quick as possible, to, you know, add to our co-worker. I,
I just need you to know that I don't condone,
you know, your lifestyle or something like that, uh, and,
(36:11):
and it just has no root in what we see
in the New Testament, you know, and I think what
it actually is, like I said, it's, it's a faithfulness flag,
we want to prove who we are and we wanna
make sure and do our duty.
Uh, but the only duties that Jesus calls us into
the new uh, in the New Testament, the things that
he calls us to do again is to love our neighbors,
(36:32):
even our enemies, to proclaim the gospel that Christ came
to save sinners of who I am chief, you know,
is how Paul puts it. We need to remember that
Jesus is an equal opportunity savior, which means that all
sins stand condemned in his sight and all sinners stand
available for his salvation, and so, you know what we
should say is congratulations, you're qualified.
(36:54):
Not because you can do anything to merit God's grace,
but because you bring your sins to the table and
Jesus brings his salvation.
Um, and, and that, that is, I think, a much better, uh,
description of faithfulness. In fact, our, our word that we're
called to be as disciples when it comes to other
people is as a witness, and we are a witness
(37:14):
of God's grace. We have a testimony of the fact
that we've been transformed, and it's always OK to share
those things. Uh, it's always OK to say, look, Jesus
loves you so much and I know he loves you
because this is how he's loved me.
Speaker 1 (37:27):
Yeah, that's it reminds me, um.
You know, I'd get to do a lot of, uh,
ministry here in the local high schools, and this happened
years ago and, um, there was a, a group of, uh,
young men and a couple of young ladies, but, you know,
they were, um, you know, LGBTQ and, and, uh, attending,
and they would come to the Christian club and it
(37:47):
just so happened that I, I, I met one of the,
the young men there, um, who identified, you know, as, uh,
you know, just transgender and all these things and, and, um.
You know, and I invited them. I said, you guys
wanna come and have some pizza at the Bible Club?
They're like, yeah. They sat down there and I was thinking, OK,
this is probably gonna be the last time they show up,
you know, because we went on with the Bible club.
(38:08):
They sat right there through the whole thing, and then
they returned again the next week, and the whole school
year they attended the Bible Club, and one of the,
just getting towards the end of the school year, and, um,
this young, this young boy, his, his, his name was, uh, Ruben.
I remember his name. He said, he asked me, he goes,
why are, why aren't, why aren't you mad at us?
How come you're not mad at us? And I was like,
(38:28):
why would I be mad? What'd you guys do? Why, why,
what'd you do, you know, uh, flatten my tires? What happened?
And he, and he said, no, it's because obviously we're all,
you know, LGBTQ, but you, you're not mad. Like you
don't attack us. And I was like, why would I
do that? You know, um, I, I want you guys
to know that God loves you, you know, and, um,
and I go, is that being clear, you know, and.
(38:50):
Uh, he loves, he loves us enough to bring, you know,
to deliver us, and I bring it right back to
the cross, you know, I kept on, you know, just,
that's what Jesus did for us when we confess, and,
and he goes, no, you know, we get that and everything,
but we just figured that, you know, um, that you
would want to attack us. But it goes back to
what Justin was saying. It was like, you know, we
just want to be that faithful witness, you know, and,
(39:11):
and that's it. I think when we love with the
love that Jesus loved us with, you know, that love
pushes past, you know, people's.
Sinful behaviors and all these other things and it, it
ministers to them, you know, even with these young people,
I think that's what their question came from this place
of like, wow, you're not even mad at us and
we want to know why, you know, and that opened
up the door for further conversation. And I think when
(39:33):
we have, you know, in our own homes, you know,
like I said, you know, with the society the way
it is today, and this is how it is, it
happens in our, in our home, you know, in our family,
we have, I have family members that.
That, that, um, you know, identify with LGBTQ and everything, but,
you know, we've just left past them, you know, and, um, it's, it's,
we just ask the Lord, God, you do the work.
(39:53):
He did it in us and he'll do it in them.
We believe it for sure. Justin.
Speaker 2 (39:57):
Yeah, I think on issues of sexuality in particular, and not,
not just LGBT but the entire modern non-Christian sexual ethic
with all of its pieces, one of the things that
we should be confident of is that it doesn't work.
It, it just doesn't, and the evidence of it is
all around us. We don't have to convince people that
their lives are going poorly. We don't have to convince
(40:20):
them that there's something greater than they've been able to discover.
We can recognize that they're looking in all the wrong places,
but we, we don't have to worry that they need to.
Ah, to kind of be shook shooken awake. Um, what,
what I found in these conversations and what I think
you can see in the relationship advice columns and literally
(40:40):
everywhere else, um, is that people are longing for something
that is stronger than just
Will you stick with me because of my sexual preferences, uh,
stronger than just, let's roll the dice on another and
another and another serial monogamous relationship, stronger than, you know, uh,
(41:01):
Netflix and chill or, or Friends with benefits or any
of these things, you know, and, um, it's interesting that
Jesus said that one of the signs that the world
would know his disciples by is our love for one another.
And I think that assumes that we have to let
the world get close enough to see our relationships with
(41:22):
one another, in our marriages, in our churches, around our,
you know, Thanksgiving table, and to go, they have something
that I want, you know, uh, and, uh, I think
that in and of itself should reframe our framework. Again,
I think we have kind of a, a, a purity
concept where we're worried about getting,
(41:43):
contaminated by who we hang out with and where we
go and these types of things, but there's actually a
possibility to, uh, you know, see what Paul talks about
in First Corinthians when he talks about the person who
hears someone prophesy in the church and says, surely God
is in this place, right? That's, that's the reverse happening,
where someone who doesn't know God is convinced of his
existence by just being in the presence of those who
(42:05):
know him personally, that, uh, I think is, uh, much
more powerful than we realize.
Speaker 1 (42:11):
Good conversation today on pastor's perspective. Let's go back to
the phones now. Jesse hung up. OK, so we'll go
to Tim in Anaheim, listening on the KWave app. Hello, Tim.
Thanks for calling 888-564-6173. What are you thankful for?
I am thankful for
(42:31):
My
Ability to get with my family, um, during the holidays, um,
able to travel to Las Vegas and get with my
daughter and
Her husband and the grandkids and all that super good time. Nice. Well,
how can we help you today? Thanks for calling in.
Yeah, you bet. Um, it, I have a friend, uh,
(42:55):
a neighborhood friend, and he came to me talking about
his mother. Uh, well, we were just talking, he was
talking about his mother. She went to a Buddhist retreat,
was there about 30 days, and she came back with, uh,
it sounds almost like demon possession where she's, and she
(43:15):
lives in a different house than he does, um.
But she would just like constantly chant in different tongues
and um they called 911 because they thought maybe it
was a a mental thing or something that, you know,
they could help with that way and when the the
paramedics show up, she snaps out of it immediately, talks normally,
(43:37):
and so they, they can't even transport her to any
kind of a psychiatric thing. So anyway, so I prayed
with them.
And he's not a believer yet, um, but I, I, uh,
went to the church, went to Calvary and everything, went
down and prayed with the folks there and I'm just
(43:58):
looking for kind of a next step, um, and, in
my mind my next step is to get him to
come to church and maybe this is the, this is
what's gonna be the catalyst to get him to.
Uh, look into it and, you know, uh, just see
the light. So, a quick question for you, Tim, how
do you know that this is a demonic thing and
(44:18):
not just, you know, when this person is chanting, maybe
they were just taught to say certain words or phrases
or whatever and they're just speaking a different language or something.
Yeah, it's uh he had video of where it's completely
out of control like she took all of her stuff
out of her house, the bed, everything, put it on
(44:39):
the front lawn, um, and just, I mean we're talking,
he said she chants, uh, and just talks in this
in just weird different languages for hours and hours and
hours on end and as soon as they try to
get professional help, a psychiatric, you know, like I said
911 or what have you.
Um, she just snaps out of it and because of
(45:01):
that then they say they can't transport her and everything
because she's responding, you know, oh no, everything's fine, I'm
doing well, right. All right, Justin, we'll start with you.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
Yeah, yeah, that's a challenging one, Tim, um, I, I
think you're right. I think, uh, you know, I'm so
grateful that you were able to be here for your
neighbor in this way and to lead him, uh, into prayer. Uh,
what a great opportunity, and, and I assume that the
openness you're seeing in him right now, yeah, a, a
next step of inviting him to church, uh, is, is
(45:32):
a really good thing. You know what, what we can
say with confidence, uh, just reading the New Testament honestly.
Um, is that demonic activity is, is real, um, and
that it can ruin lives, and then most importantly, you know, um,
when we look at Colossians.
Uh, Jesus on his cross triumphed over all powers and principalities,
(45:57):
putting them to open shame and disarming them, and so
in the name of Jesus Christ, just as we see
in the book of Acts over and over and over again,
there is deliverance from stuff like this.
Um, I, I will say though that in practice engaging
with these things, uh, there can be a lot of different, uh,
(46:20):
pieces and variables, and you mentioned Tim that you went
forward for prayer on Calvary, uh, to Calvary, which is great. Um,
I would encourage you if you do get the opportunity
to address this directly, don't, don't go alone. Um, bring
someone with you, see if a pastor would join you
and do a house visit.
Uh, you know, this is, this is another I think
(46:40):
significant pattern we see in the New Testament, um, but also,
you know, um, uh, it was, it was years of
my Christian walk that I, until I encountered demonic activity
and had to engage with these things, and I'll even
admit that that handful of times I did, it's been
relatively boring and stable, but I have friends where it's
been quite different experiences, and I have no doubt that
(47:03):
Tommy has had some of these experiences.
Uh, and so it's, it's good to go with people who, uh,
have encountered these things before, who, um, who can, uh,
read the scriptures that matter with confidence and, and can,
you know, instruct you in these ways. The power again
is Jesus's and that is available.
Speaker 1 (47:21):
Yeah, Tommy, yeah, you know, you know, Tim, um, that
was great, Justin, and, uh, Tim, I would, I would
say this, I wanna remind you, man, Jesus breaks chains.
You know, he does. And, um, when, when you're sharing your,
you know, this, uh, your, your phone call here and
your question, you know, I, I was thinking the same
thing in, um, in, in Ephesus in the book of Acts,
you know, the, the Ephesians there, they, they were, you know, chanting, uh,
(47:46):
you know, Artemis and great is the god of, you know, um, Diana,
the goddess Diana, and
You know, the gospel message went forth into this space
and into, uh, Ephesus there, and many people were told
in the book of, uh, of Acts that they, they
got saved and they came even with their books, you know,
of like black magic books and, and all these things, and,
(48:07):
and they, they burned them and they turned, they turned
to the.
Lord, but it didn't mean that everybody did, but many did. And,
and that's what I wanna share with you, Tim, is that,
you know, the gospel of Jesus Christ breaks these chains,
and it could so could very well be, you know,
there's nothing that happens that, you know, does nothing surprises God, right? He, he,
God knows what's going on in, in, in all of
(48:28):
our lives, everybody, and, and so it could very well
be that this is this moment, not just, you know, for,
for you, Tim, to be a witness to your neighbor,
but to, you know, um.
Well, well, yeah, to be a witness to your neighbor
and that your neighbor might just come to this place of,
of saving faith and, and, in Jesus Christ and, and
together be starting to pray with you and, and just
(48:48):
begin to see, you know, deliverance, not just for, for
your neighbor's life but also for his mom and, and
everything else, you know, kind of just this domino effect,
like a little revival that would take place and, and
this is something, you know, for, for me, um, personally
that that took place in my life. I, I know
that the, when I got saved, it was like.
You know my whole entire family that you know just
(49:10):
not my entire family but many of my family after
that was like wait a minute, Tommy got saved, you
know what, what, what's really going on, you know, and
just they started coming to church like I wanna go
see this church he was going to and they, they
hear the gospel and they get saved, you know, and
it's just like, you know.
So it could very well be that this is that
kind of opportunity for your friend, for your neighbor, you know, um,
(49:31):
but it's, it's the gospel message and Jesus breaks chains and,
and I, you know, you saying that you, you're praying, um,
continue to pray and, um, you know, because that's, that's
where we, we.
That's what we see those chains be broken too. We're
all products of prayer and, uh, so keep on praying.
Very nice. Tim, thank you for your phone call today
on Pastor's Perspective and looks like we have a first-time
(49:53):
listener calling in, Ty from San Fernando. How did you
find out about us, Ty?
Uh, well, I had to go to an event today, um,
and so because I work from home remotely and I'm
never during that time that you're on, I'm never in
my car, but today I happen to be and you guys,
(50:16):
I heard you and I'm like I wonder if I
can really call in there live because there's another show
that you could call but you have to call like
the week before and so I was.
delighted to hear that you guys actually take the calls
the same day you call. Yes, for sure, we're here
Monday through Friday from 3 to 4 p.m. Pacific time.
(50:37):
And if you can't listen on your radio, you can
download the KWave app. That's one way. Uh, now I'm
warning you now, this Thursday and Friday, we won't be
here because of the holiday, but normally Monday through Friday
from 3 to 4 p.m. Pacific time, we are here,
so you can listen to us as you are on AM.
11:10 or on the Kwave app. So what's your question
for us today, Ty?
(50:57):
OK, so it's taken me a while to find a
church that, uh, that really honors God's word and does,
you know, prayer, corporate prayer.
And so, um, I did find a church and it's
a lovely church. However, they were teaching on Corinthians, when
(51:19):
Paul was teaching the Corinthian church that about submission, um,
you know, uh, God, uh, is over Christ, Christ is
over men, men is over women, and the veil that
the women have to wear.
And so this church believes that in order for us
(51:40):
to join in prayer or prophesy, um, or actually even
be in church, um, it's not mandatory, but they look
at it as something that we need to do as
women that we need to wear the veil and I
don't agree with that, but.
And I did some research on it and I didn't
(52:01):
really find a lot, um, so I was wondering what
you guys think about that. All right, we'll start with you, Justin.
What would you say to Ty?
Speaker 2 (52:10):
Yeah, so Ty, if you read that chapter in 1
Corinthians 11, or if you get the opportunity to pick
up a good Bible resource like a commentary, if you
go to Blue Letter Bible.com, there's lots of resources that
help you look closer at that passage.
Uh, the first thing you need to know is that
that chapter is notoriously difficult. Uh, there are a lot
of pieces, uh, that are hard for us to understand today,
(52:32):
and that, that doesn't excuse the significance of that passage
or even the fact that at the end of the
day we still have to go, OK, what does this
mean for women in church? But here's what I would suggest, um,
two things. First, Paul's reasoning that he uses in the
passage is bigger than cultural.
Uh, so he's pointing to something that is true then, now, here, there,
(52:55):
in every setting and every time as his reasons, when
he explains that God has designed men and women's roles complementarian, uh,
compatible with one another and, and ordered in a way
that reflects the relationship God desires to have with his people,
so husbands and wives, uh, as well as, as within
the church.
(53:16):
Um, but here's what I would say, when it gets
to what that looks like in the church in Corinth,
that is clearly cultural, and it's clear that to his audience,
veils mean something on the first try. He's not introducing
a new habit to them, he's not, uh, he's not
imposing a new practice on them, he's taking something that
(53:36):
already makes sense in their context, like think of Muslim, uh,
and Islamic cultures today.
Uh, and saying in church this represents that, and this
is actually the essence of culture. Uh, my friend likes
to say if anyone puts on lipstick, they're saying something, right? Uh,
in the same way in some cultures, a veil is
a symbol of the relationship between a husband and a wife,
(53:58):
and he's saying you shouldn't be bucking against that symbol
just because you're in Christ, in fact, you should be.
Honoring it and expressing God's design in the way you dress,
but the truth is, inside a church or outside a
church Tie, today in this context, a veil doesn't mean that,
and we've already had a chance to talk about legalism
on the show, but this is another place where, uh,
(54:21):
where from a single verse that's hard to understand, people
draw a line and impose it on people and say
you can only faithfully follow God if, but that's just
not the God we follow.
Speaker 1 (54:31):
Yeah, Tommy, 45 seconds.
Yeah, you know, and, and I would just kind of
point out just, uh, to the part of, uh, of submitting,
you know, and, um, I think of, there's a passage
in in Ephesians there in chapter number 5 where he talks,
he says to submit to one another, you know, and
when we think of submitting, we, we think of sometimes
submitting as, as a, you know, almost like a bad word.
It's like, oh man, you know, it's like, hey, you know, submit,
(54:52):
you're under my rule and, and everything, but this is,
you know, it, it's, it's a willingness, it's a yielding, really,
it's a, it's a yielding to, to.
What God is wanting us to do and how God
wants us to interact with one another. So it's not
submitting in a sense of like you have to follow
these rules, but it's, it's more yielding. And I think
of Jesus, he was a great example of submitting to
(55:15):
the will of the Father.
Tia, thanks for calling in today on Pastor's Perspective. We
archive all of our episodes on Facebook, YouTube, Apple Podcasts,
and Spotify. If you want to go back and listen
to past episodes, we are so glad that you found us. We, uh,
hope that you listen more often and call in with
more questions. By the way, if you do live in
San Fernando, I went to Calvary Chapel.com and I use
(55:38):
the church locator.
Feature there and I typed in San Fernando, and there's
San Fernando's everywhere, like in Spain and everything else, so
make sure you choose the one in California. And I
found a couple of churches that you might want to
check out. One is in Sylmar, the other one is
in Northridge. So again, go to Calfrey Chapel.com to find those.
God bless you guys. Thanks for watching and listening. Tommy Coda,
Justin Thomas, great to be with you today here on
(56:01):
Pastor's Perspective.
Hello and welcome to Pastor's Perspective. I'm your host, Brian Perez,
and we are here in the studio, ready to take
your calls, questions about whatever it is you have on
your mind today, about the Bible, the Christian faith, your church.
Who knows? Call us up, 888-564-6173 is the number. Maybe
you were at church yesterday and you heard your pastor
(00:36):
say something that made you kind of
Scratch your head and yeah, I've never heard it like
that before. Yes, exactly. Tommy Coda providing the visual there. Uh, Tommy,
thanks for coming in. Yeah, good to be here on
a Monday. I'm usually here on a Friday or maybe
a Thursday, but yeah, I don't know if I've ever
been here. We want you to check off all the
dates on the calendar. We'll have you come in on
a Saturday or.
Sunday one of these days. Nobody will be here, but
(00:57):
at least he'll be, yeah, something will be going down. Yeah,
for sure, yeah, yeah. Tommy is the pastor of Hope
Alive Church in Santa Ana, and also joining us is
Justin Thomas, the president of the Calvary Chapel Bible College
in Bradenton, Florida. How are you doing, Justin?
I'm great, thanks. And you guys know each other? Are you,
do you guys know each other or is this good, yeah,
(01:17):
good friends, yeah, I love, love this guy, yeah, out
there doing the, the Bible college out there in Bradenton, Florida,
really excited about what the Lord's doing there and, and, uh, yeah,
just our, our friendship, man, it's been, it's been good.
We haven't been long time friends, but I think the
past few years, maybe 4 or 5 years or so,
we've gotten to know each other and.
(01:38):
You know, um, our hearts are aligned and, you know,
just we want to see people get saved and the
gospel flourish in people's lives and, you know, keep the
main thing the main thing, yeah.
And when you say you haven't been longtime friends, you're
not saying that you used to be enemies and then
you recently reconciled, and that, that's not what no he
was living in a different part of the world, I think.
I don't, I don't, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Tommy, you've probably never made it up
to Seattle. That's not really your hood.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Yeah, no, I was up in Seattle once, one time
up in Seattle, uh, and it's because it got lost. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
it could have been, yeah, years ago, yeah, and it's
a funny story too, because my wife and I, we
went up there and, and we were able to, um,
that's when the Neighborhood film had come out, and so
we were invited to go up there.
And I kind of share her testimony and get to
speak at a few churches and I think we were
(02:23):
up there like it was late September and um man
we got there it was freezing cold and yeah we
just weren't used to it and everybody else there in
Seattle was walking around in shorts and t-shirts, you know,
and it was like, you know, you know, 62 degrees
is like cold where I come from. They're like, oh
this is nice, too funny, of course now Justin's in Florida,
(02:43):
so it's summer year round, right?
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Yeah, yeah, I'm sure Tommy will be here any day
now just to hang out.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
Yeah, yeah, I've been out there in Florida a couple
of times too. Yeah, isn't it really nice? Yeah. All right,
so give us a call at 888-564-6173. You can also
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(03:13):
look for the.
Pastor's perspective page, fill out the form, that'll get your
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live right now, you see that barcode, scan that, I
shouldn't say barcode, I meant QR code, scan that and
that'll take you to the page where you can fill
out the form and send in your question. But we
(03:34):
prefer to speak with you, so call in, please, we're
gonna be here for an hour at 888-564-6173.
Here's a question that was sent in from Deirdre. She asks,
does the Holy Spirit have a name? And also, was
there anything by anyone being recorded about the Jews during
the 400 years between the Old Testament and the New Testament?
(03:58):
I saw a Rugrats cartoon on the Maccabees, and I
wondered if this was when they were around. Justin, what
do you say to Deirdre?
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yeah, uh, this is one place where Tommy Pickles and
friends can be trusted. Uh, yeah, so the, the 400
years between what we call the Old Testament and the
New Testament, uh, there are some writings there, including the
extra biblical books of 1st and 2nd Maccabees, and actually
I think one of the best places to go to
kind of get the history as it pertains to Israel
(04:29):
here is the complete works of Josephus. Josephus was a, uh,
a contemporary of.
The apostles, uh, who wrote a history of the Jews
for the Roman Empire, and he does a good job
of covering, uh, what we call the intertestamental years, the
years between the Old and New Testament, but yes, that
would include the events, uh, that the Jews still celebrate today, uh,
(04:52):
with Hanukkah.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Yeah,
yeah, you know, I, I think it's it's, I love that, uh,
that whole narrative, because you can really also read about
it in the book of Daniel.
And, um, and I believe it's in chapter number 8
where it kind of highlights, you know, this, this, uh,
as Daniel prophetically speaks, this Maccabean revolt, uh, which happened,
I think in 164 BC and, and it was because,
(05:14):
you know, um, um, Antius Epiphanes, you know, who, um,
he was a Seleucid, uh, king, uh, he was a
general of Alexander the Great, and he goes, he sieges Jerusalem, and, um,
and that's where, you know, he, he, um,
You know, kind of desecrated, you know, well, not kind of,
he did desecrated the temple there and, um, a few
(05:37):
years later is when the Maccabees led by Judas Maccabees, um,
as what Justin said, you know, these are highlighted in,
in the book of Maccabees, first Maccabees, and also some
of the extra-biblical, um, things, uh, like Josephus, um, but
he led a revolt. And, um, and the whole reason
why there's Hanukkah is, is because of this revolt and,
and recapturing.
(05:57):
The temple in Jerusalem and temple and cleansing and the whole, I,
I think the word Hanukkah, it means dedication and, and
so it's an 8 day, uh, kind of a festival
or 8 day celebration of this, you know, um.
Dedication, rededicating the temple back over to God and, and
all these things. Yeah, so that was really good. So,
(06:19):
and also I think there was another question, the name
of the Holy Spirit, is that, uh, yes, but let
me just, since we're on the topic of Hanukkah, let
me just ask a quick question. Uh, what is, what
does Hanukkah mean to Christians? Should we celebrate it? Should we, if,
if we know people who celebrate it, is, or does
it go against like we, or is there something we
would say, oh, no, no, that's anti-Christian. What, what would
(06:40):
you guys say?
Speaker 2 (06:42):
Yeah, I don't think it's, I don't think it has
a lot of significance for us as Christians. It's worth
pointing out in the Gospel of John in chapter 10,
Jesus actually attends the feast of dedication, Hanukkah, in Jerusalem.
Um, and he uses that occasion to speak to himself
like he does all the other Jewish holidays. Uh, now
(07:02):
if you're of Jewish descent and you're a believer in Messiah, uh,
then I think celebrating Hanukkah with your people makes a
lot of sense and you'd probably get a lot of
significance out of Jesus' speeches in John chapter 10.
He points to himself, but as Gentiles, we don't really
have a dog in that race, there's not a lot
of significance for us, um, even if we might be
(07:23):
able to connect the dots symbolically between the cleansing of
the temple and even Antiochus Epiphanes and the one day
victory of Jesus Christ over all, all his enemies.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Yeah.
Yes, perfect. And then the other question that Deirdre had was, yeah,
does the Holy Spirit have a name? Um, I
In the Gospel of John, Jesus, um, in the upper
room discourse, he, he talks to the disciples about a helper, and, um,
and he, and he references the Holy Spirit as the helper.
So he essentially what he's saying is like, you know,
(07:56):
it's important that he goes and he, he actually says,
I love, I, I think it's in chapter 14, maybe
in 15, but he says it's, it's to your advantage
that I go that I send the helper, and he's
speaking of the Holy Spirit, so that when he, he
dies on the cross and he ascends into heaven, then.
The Spirit of God, the Holy Spirit will come upon
the people. And, um, and so if there would be an,
(08:17):
you know, several different names, but the, the Helper really
stands out to me as, as like a, a, a
primary name if you're gonna, you know, say that the
Holy Spirit does have a.
Well, he's, he's the helper and he is to, to
the advantage of the church, um, collectively and also for
all of us individually because, you know, as a born
again believer, we need, you know, the help, we know
(08:38):
the help we can get. And so, um, the helper
of the Holy Spirit, he comes alongside to help us and, and, um,
that I think the Greek name is is Periclitus. So yeah, Justin.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
Yeah, uh, you know, the only reason that we think
of God the Son, Jesus having a first name is
because he became human, and he was given a human
Jewish name, you know, um, but, but the Father, what
we might think of as names for the father.
Uh, Elohim or Yahweh, those are always, always, always titles, uh,
(09:09):
and we get used to using the Hebrew words in
English for titles, but there is something that's worth noting
about how we refer to the Father, Son, and the
Holy Spirit, and that's that they all, um, assume relationally
one another, and so when we say the Father, it
makes us.
Go well there must be a child. When we say
the son, we assume the father, and even the spirit
(09:30):
is both referred to as the spirit of Christ, uh,
and in other occasion occasions the spirit of the father, and, uh,
you know, getting back to what Tommy was talking about
in the upper room discourse, there's this amazing concept that
Jesus lays out that he is in the Father and
that the Father is in him, and there's this, um.
There's this referential honoring of one another, it coexisting in
(09:53):
the Trinity that even, even their names as we know them, Father, Son, and,
and the Spirit, uh, refer to each other, they, they
don't stand alone.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
So when we pray, should we pray to the Father,
pray to the Son, or pray to the Holy Spirit?
And I, you know, we interchangeably sometimes we pray to
Father and then we're saying Jesus, and, and, but we
never mentioned the Holy Spirit, at least not as much.
So should we do more of that? What would you
guys say?
I, well, I know what when, when I pray, I,
(10:26):
my mind is like I, I'm praying to God and,
and it's understanding, I think, you know, the, the Holy
Trinity that God is, is one in, in three, you know,
distinct persons, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. And so when
I do pray, you know, I, I know that I'm
praying to God and I try to communicate this and
teach this there at the church, but there's also the
times where, you know, we, we often pray, you know,
(10:47):
whatever it is that prayer might be, we pray in
the name of Jesus and
Um, uh, a lot of times, you know, I will,
maybe not a lot of people, but I do, um,
I am conscious and aware and I would encourage other
believers too. It's like, hey, when you know, like, hey,
Holy Spirit, would you come into my life? Like just
also directing, you know, I need, I need the help.
(11:08):
In other words, I need help in my life. So,
and I know it's the God, the Holy Spirit who
comes upon me, who's in me, who will help me
in certain circumstances or whatever. So.
I, I think it's, it's not like, um, you know,
a strict thing to where you can only pray to
God or only to Jesus, but, you know, it's, it's
we're acknowledging God in three persons, you know, and, um,
(11:31):
and so yeah, I do at times would pray, you know, directly,
Holy Spirit, please come into my life because I desperately
need you. Yeah, Justin.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Yeah, I think, uh, I think that's very, uh, common,
and you know Jesus taught us to pray, uh, to
the Father, and I, I would say that the prayer
in the Christian life always has a trinitarian shape, a
reference to all three, because we always pray to the
Father in the name of the Son, by the power
of the Holy Spirit. That's what Christian prayer is, we
(12:01):
engage in that way.
Um, but I don't think it's problematic to, um, to identify, uh,
the Father, uh, Jesus himself, or, or the spirit in
our prayers, as long as we remember it's not like
they're handing off the phone to the other one and
being like, oh this isn't for me, this is for you,
you know. They're one in, in will, uh, they're one
(12:22):
in purpose, they're one in in movement, um, and, uh,
I think
Using even like Tommy said, referring to the Holy Spirit
and inviting him to have a deeper place in our life, um, that's,
that's in some sense for us, uh, it's, it's in
some sense for us in the same way that, uh,
the fact that God took on flesh and has a
(12:44):
face and embodies love and makes God known is for us, uh,
you know.
And so, so it, it's, you know, it's helpful if
it's helpful, and it's not problematic, um, but it is
interesting that there's very few places in the New Testament
where we find anyone addressed in prayer besides the Father
or in certain places where people are crying out to Jesus,
(13:07):
we maybe we could label that prayer, but generally we
pray to the Father in the name of the Son
by the power of the Holy Spirit.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Deirdre, thank you for sending in your questions on the
pastor's perspective Facebook Messenger. And uh here's another question that
was sent in online and then we'll go to the
phones at 888-564-6173. Flor sent this one in from Hurupa Valley,
and uh she writes, can you please explain why we
worship on Sundays and not on Saturdays? Is it a
(13:37):
sin to worship on the wrong day, Justin?
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Uh well, we should worship every day. Let's, let's start there,
as Paul says in 1 Corinthians, whatever we do, whether
we eat or drink or anything we do, we should
do to the glory of God, and so,
So worship should be 365, 7 days a week, every
breath we draw, um, but in terms of why we
worship on Sundays, uh, they're correct in recognizing that, uh,
(14:05):
the Sabbath for the Jews would begin on sundown Friday
night and roll through Saturday until sundown Saturday night, and
the reason we worship on Sunday, uh, as opposed to
that original Shabbat or Sabbath Saturday.
Um, is because one, Jesus rose on a Sunday, on
the first day of the week, as it says in
(14:27):
all four of our Gospels, that's the day that Jesus rose,
so as Christians we recognize and honor that day weekly.
But second, that's actually the practice we see in the
New Testament, and so in the book of Acts chapter
20 verse 7, it says the disciples came together to
break bread on the first day of the week, and
then when Paul in 1 Corinthians 16 is encouraging the
(14:50):
church to gather up an offering for the Jews, he says,
when you gather on the 1st day of the week,
pull together your resources, and so.
Uh, it appears even from the writings of the New
Testament that worship for Christians was already shifting to Sundays,
and so, um, you know, it's common in larger churches
these days to have a Saturday night service or, or
(15:12):
a Sunday morning service or a Sunday night service. That's
not as significant, um, uh, as, as who we worship.
Uh, and as Jesus says in John chapter 4, there's
coming a day where it won't be, we worship him
over there or over here, or we can say at
this time or that time, at 9:00 a.m. on a
Sunday morning or 7 o'clock at Saturday night, but those
(15:34):
who worship him must worship in spirit.
And in truth, uh, meaning that we need God's own
help to worship, that he actually has to regenerate us,
we have to receive the new birth so that our
worship is actually in sync with who he is, and
then in truth, that's again not about when, it's about who,
it's about worshiping God as he is as revealed in
(15:56):
Jesus Christ.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Yeah.
Any thoughts, Tommy? Yeah, I, I think there, there's a
passage in Colossians in chapter 2 where it says, um, let,
therefore let no one pass judgment on you in question
of food and drink or with regard to festival or
a new moon or a or a Sabbath. These are
a shadow of things to come, but the substance belongs
(16:18):
to Christ. And, uh, and so yeah, I think, you know, that's,
that's the one main thing is it doesn't matter whatever
day it is.
I think we ought to be coming to the Lord, um,
every single day wherever we might be at, you know,
and that Jesus fulfilled. It's all about, you know, it's,
it's really celebrating who Jesus is and it's not being
stuck in like this legalistic mode. And I know there's
(16:40):
a lot of churches, a lot of people that, that
will say, well, you, you have to, you know, like
1/7 Day Adventist, you know, you have to worship on
these days, any other days, you know, um, and they
also look to the kind of the dietary laws and
all these other things, but.
You know, um, Jesus fulfilled all the law, you know, and, uh, when,
when we think of the Sabbath, you know, this is
one thing that, um, you know, as far as like
(17:02):
a commandment, we don't really read in the New Testament
and we see it being exercised in the sense that the,
the church, Jesus rising on the first day and, and
the church continuing as what Justin said.
You know, in the book of Acts, um, to, to
come together on that first day to, to celebrate the
resurrection of Jesus and to come together as a church
(17:22):
and to grow as, as a ministry and so I
think um we can get very legalistic in uh in
in looking at some things like this and put, you know,
these unnecessary boundaries on us.
And then, you know, the enemy, that when I say
the enemy, the devil, he'll, he'll use all these things
to exploit, you know, even our own emotions like, oh man,
you know, I went to church on a Sunday. Oh,
(17:43):
God's gonna, you know, not forgive me or he doesn't,
you know, receive my worship, with, which that is not
true because it can, as Justin said, it can be
a Friday night, you know, in the middle of a
parking lot. It don't even matter.
Very true. Alright, uh, who was that? Flor? Thank you
for sending in your question through the pastor's perspective page
at kwave.com. And, uh, just one bit of clarification on that.
(18:06):
When we say that we should worship God every single day,
that doesn't mean we have to go to church every
single day, right? Yeah, because I think that might be
the what?
You can't do that, but no, we're just talking about, yeah, yeah,
and I, I think worship, you know, is, is, um,
sometimes we, we even think of the word worship as like, OK,
well that's, you know, music, you know, that song or
something like that, you know, I, I would say, well,
(18:26):
no worship is, is, um, you know, it's lived out,
you know, we can worshiply live out our life, you know, um,
wherever we might be at, and, you know, it's, it's
that constant acknowledgement of, of God's presence in our life,
you know, and so, and I get it, you know,
sometimes we're busy with work and all that stuff, so
we can't.
You know, I'm on my knees and your boss is like, hey,
what are you doing? You know, it's like, but you know,
(18:47):
in our hearts we can have this awareness of the
presence of God and I, I even think that, you know,
when we pray, that's a form of worship and, and,
and prayer is that is that constant, you know, practice of,
of the presence of heaven, if you will, you know,
and it's like, man, my, my, my mind is in
my heart is, you know, just connected to God. So
(19:09):
I, I really like that passage that Justin shared about,
you know, in John chapter 4 that we would, we
must worship the Lord in spirit and in truth, and
I think that's, you know, really essential and key. So
these churches that do a Saturday night service and a
Sunday morning service, it's more for convenience that they're doing it,
like for people who maybe work on a Sunday or whatever.
It's not that they're, you know, if anybody, you know,
(19:31):
I can think of one church off the top of
my head that does, or two churches now, I just
thought of another one that does a Saturday night and
a Sunday morning.
And if anybody goes to the Saturday night because they're thinking, oh,
that's the right one to go to, we would say, no,
that's not necessarily the case. I mean, if, if somebody
has the chance to go to both, I mean, it's
usually just a mirror, one is just a mirror of
(19:52):
the other. Justin, any thoughts on that?
Speaker 2 (19:55):
Yeah, I think it, I mean, in every case that
I can think of, it's about capacity.
Their building only seats so many people, more people come,
so they add another service, uh, and eventually you run
out of good slots on Sunday, and, and I think
Tommy and I can both tell you that, that more
than 2 services on a Sunday is exhausting for the
leaders who are running on it, running it, and
(20:15):
And so I've always been amazed at churches that run
all day Sunday and Saturday to make room for people.
I wish we'd just plant more churches, uh, but, um, but,
but yeah, I don't, I'm not aware of any church
that's even trying to appease people's conscience and be like, hey, if,
if you can't wrap your head around Sunday worship, we've
got a Saturday for you. I've never even heard that
as an option. It's, it's usually just about convenience, yeah.
(20:36):
Uh, but also about capacity,
Speaker 1 (20:38):
yeah, yeah, yeah, I, I remember when here at Cava
Chapa Costa Mesa, you know, um, that there was services
pretty much every night of the week, you know, it
was Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday. There was something
going on, you know, a time to
Come together as as the body of Christ. So yeah, it, yeah,
that's a, that's not necessarily a bad thing and it
is really pretty for the most part, it's, uh, you know,
(21:00):
out of necessity. Yeah. And when there's small groups in
the middle of the week or something, small group gatherings
at homes or whatever, that's always good too.
All right, 888-564-6173 is the number to call today on
Pastor's Perspective. I'm Brian Perez here with Pastor Tommy Coda
and Justin Thomas, the president of the Calvary Chapel Bible
College in Bradenton, Florida. Give us a call at 888-564-6173.
(21:25):
We're just a few days away from Thanksgiving, so if
you call in, I might ask you, what are you
thankful for? Uh, we're gonna begin with Carmen in Upland
who is listening on AM 11:10 K wave. Hey there, Carmen,
what are you thankful for?
Hi, I am thankful for God's faithfulness.
Awesome, yes.
(21:46):
For sure. And I'm thankful, yes. All right, and what's
your question for us today?
I have a question. I'm calling to ask for prayer
for my family.
We're gathering together, of course, for Thanksgiving and some are
not in right relationship with uh God, and I just
(22:07):
want all of us to get along. That's all. I'm
asking you to pray for my family. Have there been
instances in the past where arguments have broken out or
what happens at a typical family gathering?
That you want to be different this year.
I want people to really realize that God is there
(22:30):
for them. Yes, there have been arguments.
And you know, with the political scene.
And I just want everybody just, just get along and
realize how good God has been to us this year
cause we've had some ups and downs in family, but
(22:50):
I want them to really realize how good God is. Mm. Yeah.
Any thoughts on that, Tommy?
Yeah, you, you know, Carmen, we're definitely gonna be praying
for you and, and, um, I, I wanna just share
with you, Carmen, this is a such a, a great time.
My heart breaks for you because it's, you know, you
love your family and, um, as, as we should, and,
and that's a good thing that you're seeking the Lord and,
(23:12):
and all these things, and I wouldn't.
I would encourage you, you know, just continue to, you know,
express love there with your family, you know, and it
doesn't always have to be, you know, um, like, like in,
in words or, or only in action. I think it's both,
you know, it's, it's in our actions is in how
we treat, treat them, and you, you know, it could
(23:33):
be that the Lord's gonna use you, you know, to, uh, as,
as the springboard or the catalyst to, you know, to bring.
Sounds like reconciliation, you know, for, for your family, and, um,
you know, and I wanna encourage you, Carmen, and, and
anyone else who might be listening who's a little hesitant
to maybe go to a family gathering because of, you know,
(23:53):
for whatever reason.
You know, be prayed up, like pray before you, you know,
you go and, and I, I share this even with
my family sometimes when we go to different gatherings or
something I was like, OK, we, we kind of know
where we're gonna be going into. Let's, let's, um, you know,
let's pray and let's have a heart like a, like
be missional like we wanna be little tiny missionaries with
our family right now and, and just love in, in
(24:15):
the name of Jesus and serve and, and, you know, um,
represent Jesus well in these spaces.
You know, because God does the miracles, and I would say, Carmen, when,
when if you're, when you're prayed up and you're seeking
the Lord and all these things, you know, God's gonna
do that work, you know, I, I just love the
fact that when we look to the word of God,
like he tells us that his word doesn't return void,
(24:36):
you know, and so it's, you know, be, be filled,
be fed and, and be filled with the word of God,
you know, with the gospel message, and.
You know, just be missional, um, when you're there with
your family members and, um, you know, use the opportunity
maybe before the meals there and to, to say, hey,
can we pray and, you know, pray and, um, and
(24:56):
just ask the Lord to do a great work and,
and I'm sure that he will for sure.
Justin, would you say that it's OK to like put
boundaries or some, have some kind of parameters like if,
especially if there's gonna be a gathering at Carmen's house,
when she sends out the invitations or whatever, sends the texts,
makes the phone calls, whatever.
Um, where she just right up front says, by the way,
(25:19):
we're not discussing politics, we're just there to gather as
a family, to be thankful to God for our, for
the many blessings he's bestowed upon us. Is that something
that could be done in a way that doesn't come
across as, you know, Carmen's trying to run the show
or whatever? What would you say?
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Yeah, no, I think, I think that's good. I always
think of Thanksgiving culturally, not within the church, but culturally
as the last Christian holiday.
Uh, and what I mean is kind of like when
Paul finds that altar in Athens to the unknown god.
Thanksgiving is a holiday to the unknown god. They, they
may not know who they're thankful to, but they're all
thankful for these things, right? There's giving of thanks is
(25:58):
the whole purpose, uh, and so it assumes there's someone
we're thanking. Um, and it's unfortunate actually that Thanksgiving falls
so close to, uh, you know, election day, and we,
and politics, you know, tends to oversume, uh, overwhelm these
things and
Honestly, in, in a time like this, sometimes families don't
have close relationships and so gathering once a year, all
(26:22):
of those tensions and differences really come to the foreground,
but I think it's totally appropriate to say that, you know, we,
we want to get together to be thankful, you know,
and I, I used to have a big rule in
my church, I still have it in my family.
Uh, Black Friday does not begin on Thanksgiving, so, so
stay away from thinking about the things you do not
(26:43):
yet have and the things that you, you want. That's,
that's the greatest attack on Thanksgiving there could be, this
capitalistic capitalistic obsession we call Black Friday. Um, so Thanksgiving
is an opportunity to, to just focus on that and
to enjoy one another's company and yeah, Carmen, if you
get the opportunity to, to say to people, you know.
(27:04):
Whether they're aware of it or not, all of these
things that they are thankful for are provided by God,
who is the giver of all good gifts, the scriptures say,
that preaches, and they, they may not believe it, but
uh this is an opportunity for you to say to them,
you are thankful, and let me introduce you to the
one that you give thanks to.
(27:25):
Um, but, but yes, I think, uh, Brian, I think
putting boundaries around that is really wise and around ourselves
as well, because let's recognize we all have a seat
at the table, we all have opinions, we all have
bad history, and, uh, you know, uh, so there's always
the need, I think, to be able to set aside
the differences, to keep the main thing, the main thing,
(27:47):
which is just to enjoy family and be grateful for
another year.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
Yeah, Tommy, I'll give you one minute to pray for Carmen.
Oh yeah, OK, Father, Lord, we wanna just pray and
intercede for Carmen and also for her entire family, Lord, um,
this coming Thanksgiving as they, they gather as a family and, and, um,
I pray, Lord, that, uh, that you would just do
a supernatural work, um, in the heart of all her,
(28:14):
all her family members. Lord, whatever those differences or opinions
might be.
Lord, that those things would just be, um, not, not
highlighted at all, but, but Lord, that what would be
highlighted would be the goodness of God and the grace
of God and, and, and Lord, that you would do
a work of reconciliation as it seems that maybe there's
(28:34):
just uh there's strife or there's some just some challenges, Lord,
with arguments or whatever with different opinions. Lord, you're bigger
than all of those things and I pray God that
you would do that and that there would be the ministry.
Of reconciliation that would take place, uh, there in Carmen's home.
And so Father, um, would you bless her? Give her
words of wisdom too. Give Carmen words of wisdom, words
(28:56):
of grace, Lord, um, Father, I just think of that
how they're in Proverbs it says like those those words
of wisdom is like apples of gold, Lord, and, and
so God, I pray that you would just give her
those words and, and, um, and help her, Lord, to
just be that, that servant that brings glory to you, Lord.
We love you and we praise you in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen.
(29:18):
And if anybody's wondering why I only allowed Tommy to
pray for one minute, it's because it's break time here
on Pastor's perspective. I could have given him the rest
of the hour, but no, we have to take a break. And, uh,
so we did that. And when we come back here
on Pastor's.
Perspective, we'll take your calls at 888-564-6173. Perhaps a question
to kick off the second half of the program in
line with that theme of Thanksgiving. So Carmen mentioned, you know,
(29:41):
political things, but what happens if you're invited to someone's
house or they come over to your house and
You know, there's, there's a lot of talk of what
if somebody's going through a physical change, if you know
what I mean, as in transitioning from one sex to
the next, from one gender to the next, and that's
been happening so much lately, and how do you deal
(30:01):
with that? We'll talk about it when we come back
on Pastor's perspective.
All right, we are back on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is
(30:22):
the number to call, and we'll get to some more
of your questions in just a moment. We've got Pastor
Tommy Coda from Hope Alive Church in Santa Ana here today,
and Justin Thomas, the president of the Calvary.
Chapel Bible College in Bradenton, Florida, and we're 3 days
away from Thanksgiving, and the question that I posed right
before the break, and I'm gonna change it up a
little bit here, uh, so that I can get each
(30:42):
of your opinions on this. What happens if somebody comes
over to your home, uh, or they might even ask
in advance or they might just surprise you and, uh,
they show up with, for example, uh, a member of
the same sex because they announced earlier this year that
They're same-sex attracted and so that's come up a lot
lately where do I allow them to, am I condoning
(31:05):
by allowing them to come in and celebrate with us,
that kind of thing. Justin, what would you say?
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Yeah, I would say, you know, we need to follow Jesus'
example here, and um we find him around all sorts
of people that the religious of his day looked down
upon his association, you know, he was accused of being
a glutton and a wine bibber, a drunk because he
was around people who did those things, you know, uh,
(31:31):
when he goes to Simon the Pharisee's house.
Uh, and there's a woman washing his, his feet. Simon
thinks to himself, if, if Jesus was a prophet, he'd
know what type of woman that was and wouldn't let
her near him. You know, in John chapter 4, the
woman is 4 marriages deep and now living with a
man who's not her husband, and he has a conversation
with her. Uh, the, the way that we express Christ-like
(31:55):
behavior is not in who we avoid.
But in how we behave to all our neighbors and
even our enemies who we're called to love, and so,
especially in the context of Thanksgiving, I, I would say
that this is an area where there doesn't need to
be an agenda to hit the issues, like, like we
talked about with Carmen, um, you know, being able to
(32:17):
set those aside and just affirming your love for a person,
which is never the same thing as affirming.
Uh, their choices, uh, of being hospitable and wel welcoming
them as those who are created in the image of God.
There are places and times for conversations about these things,
and trust me as a pastor in Seattle, I've had
them more than most, uh, but I would say at the,
(32:40):
at the Thanksgiving table with an audience watching, it's not
the right place for those conversations. Instead, what needs to
be affirmed is, uh, that God is good, that God
is welcoming.
That his love is inexhaustible, um, and, and, and that
he wants to know each and every person at the
table and will meet them right where they are, and
he will never leave them the same, uh, you know,
(33:01):
if Jesus is alive today, everything you know is wrong,
that's always.
Gonna be the case, uh, but it's Jesus who came
for the sick, for the sinner, for the lost, and he's,
it's we who are called as his disciples to go
out into the highways and hedges and compel them to
come in because there's a table for them at the, uh,
or there's a seat for them at the table.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Yeah, Tommy, yeah,
no, that's a, that's a great question, Brian, and, um,
you know, I, I was thinking of.
Um, I, I have a, I have a very large
family and, um, you know, and I think just in the,
the season of life like our society and, and how
it is today, you know, um, and having a large family,
you're kind of, you're bound to have this kind of interaction,
(33:45):
you know, with people, whether it's, it's attraction to same
sex or there's drug addiction, there's alcoholism, there's, there's something
that obviously like, like, you know, um.
Like my, my heart, it's like, no, I, God saved
me from a lot of things, but I love what,
what Justin said is like, and I try to encourage,
you know, our church and myself this all the time
(34:06):
is like, how did Jesus treat me, you know, uh,
because I wasn't always a Christian, you know, uh, many
people know, know my background. I was, you know, in, in,
in prison and drugs, you know, uh, just living on
the streets, crim a lot of criminal activity that, that
I was involved with and.
You know, and God, God set me free, and I
was never, um, I was never not told that I couldn't,
(34:28):
you know, enter some of these spaces, some from some
family members because they did love Jesus and they wanted
to see me come to faith, you know, and, and
so they, they just.
Loved on me, you know, and I think that's exactly
what Jesus did, you know, with, with all the examples
that Justin had laid out, that was, that was his heart.
He wants to see people be, you know, uh, transformed
(34:48):
and changed, you know, um, that their, their life would
flourish and and blossom. So.
I just think of a lot of families that might
be listening right now. You might be listening and say, man,
you know, this is, you know, my, my, my nephew
who's coming over, you know, um, is, I know he's
probably gonna bring his, his partner or my niece or
my son or daughter, whatever that case might be. This
is a great opportunity, I think, not to close, close
(35:10):
the doors, but to, you know, obviously, you know, I
think you, they, they should, they probably know that you're
a Christian and that you love Jesus and you know,
but we still want to go to your house because
there's your family.
You know, and that's a great opportunity not just to
love on them, but again, if it being at your house, especially,
you know, that this is a great time before the
(35:30):
meal just to share a quick prayer, you know, share
the gospel very briefly, you know, and, and just to
plant the seed of, of God, you know, of the gospel, and, uh,
so those are, are great opportunities to do that, and
that's what God's called us to do, to be the
salt and light, you know, and just to share that
gospel message, yeah, Justin.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Yeah, I just wanted to encourage us away from this
instinct that I think we all have. I don't know
where it comes from, but culturally in Christianity in America.
I think we always feel the need, this urgency to
plant the faithfulness flag, to, to speak the truth as
quick as possible, to, you know, add to our co-worker. I,
I just need you to know that I don't condone,
you know, your lifestyle or something like that, uh, and,
(36:11):
and it just has no root in what we see
in the New Testament, you know, and I think what
it actually is, like I said, it's, it's a faithfulness flag,
we want to prove who we are and we wanna
make sure and do our duty.
Uh, but the only duties that Jesus calls us into
the new uh, in the New Testament, the things that
he calls us to do again is to love our neighbors,
(36:32):
even our enemies, to proclaim the gospel that Christ came
to save sinners of who I am chief, you know,
is how Paul puts it. We need to remember that
Jesus is an equal opportunity savior, which means that all
sins stand condemned in his sight and all sinners stand
available for his salvation, and so, you know what we
should say is congratulations, you're qualified.
(36:54):
Not because you can do anything to merit God's grace,
but because you bring your sins to the table and
Jesus brings his salvation.
Um, and, and that, that is, I think, a much better, uh,
description of faithfulness. In fact, our, our word that we're
called to be as disciples when it comes to other
people is as a witness, and we are a witness
(37:14):
of God's grace. We have a testimony of the fact
that we've been transformed, and it's always OK to share
those things. Uh, it's always OK to say, look, Jesus
loves you so much and I know he loves you
because this is how he's loved me.
Speaker 1 (37:27):
Yeah, that's it reminds me, um.
You know, I'd get to do a lot of, uh,
ministry here in the local high schools, and this happened
years ago and, um, there was a, a group of, uh,
young men and a couple of young ladies, but, you know,
they were, um, you know, LGBTQ and, and, uh, attending,
and they would come to the Christian club and it
(37:47):
just so happened that I, I, I met one of the,
the young men there, um, who identified, you know, as, uh,
you know, just transgender and all these things and, and, um.
You know, and I invited them. I said, you guys
wanna come and have some pizza at the Bible Club?
They're like, yeah. They sat down there and I was thinking, OK,
this is probably gonna be the last time they show up,
you know, because we went on with the Bible club.
(38:08):
They sat right there through the whole thing, and then
they returned again the next week, and the whole school
year they attended the Bible Club, and one of the,
just getting towards the end of the school year, and, um,
this young, this young boy, his, his, his name was, uh, Ruben.
I remember his name. He said, he asked me, he goes,
why are, why aren't, why aren't you mad at us?
How come you're not mad at us? And I was like,
(38:28):
why would I be mad? What'd you guys do? Why, why,
what'd you do, you know, uh, flatten my tires? What happened?
And he, and he said, no, it's because obviously we're all,
you know, LGBTQ, but you, you're not mad. Like you
don't attack us. And I was like, why would I
do that? You know, um, I, I want you guys
to know that God loves you, you know, and, um,
and I go, is that being clear, you know, and.
(38:50):
Uh, he loves, he loves us enough to bring, you know,
to deliver us, and I bring it right back to
the cross, you know, I kept on, you know, just,
that's what Jesus did for us when we confess, and,
and he goes, no, you know, we get that and everything,
but we just figured that, you know, um, that you
would want to attack us. But it goes back to
what Justin was saying. It was like, you know, we
just want to be that faithful witness, you know, and,
(39:11):
and that's it. I think when we love with the
love that Jesus loved us with, you know, that love
pushes past, you know, people's.
Sinful behaviors and all these other things and it, it
ministers to them, you know, even with these young people,
I think that's what their question came from this place
of like, wow, you're not even mad at us and
we want to know why, you know, and that opened
up the door for further conversation. And I think when
(39:33):
we have, you know, in our own homes, you know,
like I said, you know, with the society the way
it is today, and this is how it is, it
happens in our, in our home, you know, in our family,
we have, I have family members that.
That, that, um, you know, identify with LGBTQ and everything, but,
you know, we've just left past them, you know, and, um, it's, it's,
we just ask the Lord, God, you do the work.
(39:53):
He did it in us and he'll do it in them.
We believe it for sure. Justin.
Speaker 2 (39:57):
Yeah, I think on issues of sexuality in particular, and not,
not just LGBT but the entire modern non-Christian sexual ethic
with all of its pieces, one of the things that
we should be confident of is that it doesn't work.
It, it just doesn't, and the evidence of it is
all around us. We don't have to convince people that
their lives are going poorly. We don't have to convince
(40:20):
them that there's something greater than they've been able to discover.
We can recognize that they're looking in all the wrong places,
but we, we don't have to worry that they need to.
Ah, to kind of be shook shooken awake. Um, what,
what I found in these conversations and what I think
you can see in the relationship advice columns and literally
(40:40):
everywhere else, um, is that people are longing for something
that is stronger than just
Will you stick with me because of my sexual preferences, uh,
stronger than just, let's roll the dice on another and
another and another serial monogamous relationship, stronger than, you know, uh,
(41:01):
Netflix and chill or, or Friends with benefits or any
of these things, you know, and, um, it's interesting that
Jesus said that one of the signs that the world
would know his disciples by is our love for one another.
And I think that assumes that we have to let
the world get close enough to see our relationships with
(41:22):
one another, in our marriages, in our churches, around our,
you know, Thanksgiving table, and to go, they have something
that I want, you know, uh, and, uh, I think
that in and of itself should reframe our framework. Again,
I think we have kind of a, a, a purity
concept where we're worried about getting,
(41:43):
contaminated by who we hang out with and where we
go and these types of things, but there's actually a
possibility to, uh, you know, see what Paul talks about
in First Corinthians when he talks about the person who
hears someone prophesy in the church and says, surely God
is in this place, right? That's, that's the reverse happening,
where someone who doesn't know God is convinced of his
existence by just being in the presence of those who
(42:05):
know him personally, that, uh, I think is, uh, much
more powerful than we realize.
Speaker 1 (42:11):
Good conversation today on pastor's perspective. Let's go back to
the phones now. Jesse hung up. OK, so we'll go
to Tim in Anaheim, listening on the KWave app. Hello, Tim.
Thanks for calling 888-564-6173. What are you thankful for?
I am thankful for
(42:31):
My
Ability to get with my family, um, during the holidays, um,
able to travel to Las Vegas and get with my
daughter and
Her husband and the grandkids and all that super good time. Nice. Well,
how can we help you today? Thanks for calling in.
Yeah, you bet. Um, it, I have a friend, uh,
(42:55):
a neighborhood friend, and he came to me talking about
his mother. Uh, well, we were just talking, he was
talking about his mother. She went to a Buddhist retreat,
was there about 30 days, and she came back with, uh,
it sounds almost like demon possession where she's, and she
(43:15):
lives in a different house than he does, um.
But she would just like constantly chant in different tongues
and um they called 911 because they thought maybe it
was a a mental thing or something that, you know,
they could help with that way and when the the
paramedics show up, she snaps out of it immediately, talks normally,
(43:37):
and so they, they can't even transport her to any
kind of a psychiatric thing. So anyway, so I prayed
with them.
And he's not a believer yet, um, but I, I, uh,
went to the church, went to Calvary and everything, went
down and prayed with the folks there and I'm just
(43:58):
looking for kind of a next step, um, and, in
my mind my next step is to get him to
come to church and maybe this is the, this is
what's gonna be the catalyst to get him to.
Uh, look into it and, you know, uh, just see
the light. So, a quick question for you, Tim, how
do you know that this is a demonic thing and
(44:18):
not just, you know, when this person is chanting, maybe
they were just taught to say certain words or phrases
or whatever and they're just speaking a different language or something.
Yeah, it's uh he had video of where it's completely
out of control like she took all of her stuff
out of her house, the bed, everything, put it on
(44:39):
the front lawn, um, and just, I mean we're talking,
he said she chants, uh, and just talks in this
in just weird different languages for hours and hours and
hours on end and as soon as they try to
get professional help, a psychiatric, you know, like I said
911 or what have you.
Um, she just snaps out of it and because of
(45:01):
that then they say they can't transport her and everything
because she's responding, you know, oh no, everything's fine, I'm
doing well, right. All right, Justin, we'll start with you.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
Yeah, yeah, that's a challenging one, Tim, um, I, I
think you're right. I think, uh, you know, I'm so
grateful that you were able to be here for your
neighbor in this way and to lead him, uh, into prayer. Uh,
what a great opportunity, and, and I assume that the
openness you're seeing in him right now, yeah, a, a
next step of inviting him to church, uh, is, is
(45:32):
a really good thing. You know what, what we can
say with confidence, uh, just reading the New Testament honestly.
Um, is that demonic activity is, is real, um, and
that it can ruin lives, and then most importantly, you know, um,
when we look at Colossians.
Uh, Jesus on his cross triumphed over all powers and principalities,
(45:57):
putting them to open shame and disarming them, and so
in the name of Jesus Christ, just as we see
in the book of Acts over and over and over again,
there is deliverance from stuff like this.
Um, I, I will say though that in practice engaging
with these things, uh, there can be a lot of different, uh,
(46:20):
pieces and variables, and you mentioned Tim that you went
forward for prayer on Calvary, uh, to Calvary, which is great. Um,
I would encourage you if you do get the opportunity
to address this directly, don't, don't go alone. Um, bring
someone with you, see if a pastor would join you
and do a house visit.
Uh, you know, this is, this is another I think
(46:40):
significant pattern we see in the New Testament, um, but also,
you know, um, uh, it was, it was years of
my Christian walk that I, until I encountered demonic activity
and had to engage with these things, and I'll even
admit that that handful of times I did, it's been
relatively boring and stable, but I have friends where it's
been quite different experiences, and I have no doubt that
(47:03):
Tommy has had some of these experiences.
Uh, and so it's, it's good to go with people who, uh,
have encountered these things before, who, um, who can, uh,
read the scriptures that matter with confidence and, and can,
you know, instruct you in these ways. The power again
is Jesus's and that is available.
Speaker 1 (47:21):
Yeah, Tommy, yeah, you know, you know, Tim, um, that
was great, Justin, and, uh, Tim, I would, I would
say this, I wanna remind you, man, Jesus breaks chains.
You know, he does. And, um, when, when you're sharing your,
you know, this, uh, your, your phone call here and
your question, you know, I, I was thinking the same
thing in, um, in, in Ephesus in the book of Acts,
you know, the, the Ephesians there, they, they were, you know, chanting, uh,
(47:46):
you know, Artemis and great is the god of, you know, um, Diana,
the goddess Diana, and
You know, the gospel message went forth into this space
and into, uh, Ephesus there, and many people were told
in the book of, uh, of Acts that they, they
got saved and they came even with their books, you know,
of like black magic books and, and all these things, and,
(48:07):
and they, they burned them and they turned, they turned
to the.
Lord, but it didn't mean that everybody did, but many did. And,
and that's what I wanna share with you, Tim, is that,
you know, the gospel of Jesus Christ breaks these chains,
and it could so could very well be, you know,
there's nothing that happens that, you know, does nothing surprises God, right? He, he,
God knows what's going on in, in, in all of
(48:28):
our lives, everybody, and, and so it could very well
be that this is this moment, not just, you know, for,
for you, Tim, to be a witness to your neighbor,
but to, you know, um.
Well, well, yeah, to be a witness to your neighbor
and that your neighbor might just come to this place of,
of saving faith and, and, in Jesus Christ and, and
together be starting to pray with you and, and just
(48:48):
begin to see, you know, deliverance, not just for, for
your neighbor's life but also for his mom and, and
everything else, you know, kind of just this domino effect,
like a little revival that would take place and, and
this is something, you know, for, for me, um, personally
that that took place in my life. I, I know
that the, when I got saved, it was like.
You know my whole entire family that you know just
(49:10):
not my entire family but many of my family after
that was like wait a minute, Tommy got saved, you
know what, what, what's really going on, you know, and
just they started coming to church like I wanna go
see this church he was going to and they, they
hear the gospel and they get saved, you know, and
it's just like, you know.
So it could very well be that this is that
kind of opportunity for your friend, for your neighbor, you know, um,
(49:31):
but it's, it's the gospel message and Jesus breaks chains and,
and I, you know, you saying that you, you're praying, um,
continue to pray and, um, you know, because that's, that's
where we, we.
That's what we see those chains be broken too. We're
all products of prayer and, uh, so keep on praying.
Very nice. Tim, thank you for your phone call today
on Pastor's Perspective and looks like we have a first-time
(49:53):
listener calling in, Ty from San Fernando. How did you
find out about us, Ty?
Uh, well, I had to go to an event today, um,
and so because I work from home remotely and I'm
never during that time that you're on, I'm never in
my car, but today I happen to be and you guys,
(50:16):
I heard you and I'm like I wonder if I
can really call in there live because there's another show
that you could call but you have to call like
the week before and so I was.
delighted to hear that you guys actually take the calls
the same day you call. Yes, for sure, we're here
Monday through Friday from 3 to 4 p.m. Pacific time.
(50:37):
And if you can't listen on your radio, you can
download the KWave app. That's one way. Uh, now I'm
warning you now, this Thursday and Friday, we won't be
here because of the holiday, but normally Monday through Friday
from 3 to 4 p.m. Pacific time, we are here,
so you can listen to us as you are on AM.
11:10 or on the Kwave app. So what's your question
for us today, Ty?
(50:57):
OK, so it's taken me a while to find a
church that, uh, that really honors God's word and does,
you know, prayer, corporate prayer.
And so, um, I did find a church and it's
a lovely church. However, they were teaching on Corinthians, when
(51:19):
Paul was teaching the Corinthian church that about submission, um,
you know, uh, God, uh, is over Christ, Christ is
over men, men is over women, and the veil that
the women have to wear.
And so this church believes that in order for us
(51:40):
to join in prayer or prophesy, um, or actually even
be in church, um, it's not mandatory, but they look
at it as something that we need to do as
women that we need to wear the veil and I
don't agree with that, but.
And I did some research on it and I didn't
(52:01):
really find a lot, um, so I was wondering what
you guys think about that. All right, we'll start with you, Justin.
What would you say to Ty?
Speaker 2 (52:10):
Yeah, so Ty, if you read that chapter in 1
Corinthians 11, or if you get the opportunity to pick
up a good Bible resource like a commentary, if you
go to Blue Letter Bible.com, there's lots of resources that
help you look closer at that passage.
Uh, the first thing you need to know is that
that chapter is notoriously difficult. Uh, there are a lot
of pieces, uh, that are hard for us to understand today,
(52:32):
and that, that doesn't excuse the significance of that passage
or even the fact that at the end of the
day we still have to go, OK, what does this
mean for women in church? But here's what I would suggest, um,
two things. First, Paul's reasoning that he uses in the
passage is bigger than cultural.
Uh, so he's pointing to something that is true then, now, here, there,
(52:55):
in every setting and every time as his reasons, when
he explains that God has designed men and women's roles complementarian, uh,
compatible with one another and, and ordered in a way
that reflects the relationship God desires to have with his people,
so husbands and wives, uh, as well as, as within
the church.
(53:16):
Um, but here's what I would say, when it gets
to what that looks like in the church in Corinth,
that is clearly cultural, and it's clear that to his audience,
veils mean something on the first try. He's not introducing
a new habit to them, he's not, uh, he's not
imposing a new practice on them, he's taking something that
(53:36):
already makes sense in their context, like think of Muslim, uh,
and Islamic cultures today.
Uh, and saying in church this represents that, and this
is actually the essence of culture. Uh, my friend likes
to say if anyone puts on lipstick, they're saying something, right? Uh,
in the same way in some cultures, a veil is
a symbol of the relationship between a husband and a wife,
(53:58):
and he's saying you shouldn't be bucking against that symbol
just because you're in Christ, in fact, you should be.
Honoring it and expressing God's design in the way you dress,
but the truth is, inside a church or outside a
church Tie, today in this context, a veil doesn't mean that,
and we've already had a chance to talk about legalism
on the show, but this is another place where, uh,
(54:21):
where from a single verse that's hard to understand, people
draw a line and impose it on people and say
you can only faithfully follow God if, but that's just
not the God we follow.
Speaker 1 (54:31):
Yeah, Tommy, 45 seconds.
Yeah, you know, and, and I would just kind of
point out just, uh, to the part of, uh, of submitting,
you know, and, um, I think of, there's a passage
in in Ephesians there in chapter number 5 where he talks,
he says to submit to one another, you know, and
when we think of submitting, we, we think of sometimes
submitting as, as a, you know, almost like a bad word.
It's like, oh man, you know, it's like, hey, you know, submit,
(54:52):
you're under my rule and, and everything, but this is,
you know, it, it's, it's a willingness, it's a yielding, really,
it's a, it's a yielding to, to.
What God is wanting us to do and how God
wants us to interact with one another. So it's not
submitting in a sense of like you have to follow
these rules, but it's, it's more yielding. And I think
of Jesus, he was a great example of submitting to
(55:15):
the will of the Father.
Tia, thanks for calling in today on Pastor's Perspective. We
archive all of our episodes on Facebook, YouTube, Apple Podcasts,
and Spotify. If you want to go back and listen
to past episodes, we are so glad that you found us. We, uh,
hope that you listen more often and call in with
more questions. By the way, if you do live in
San Fernando, I went to Calvary Chapel.com and I use
(55:38):
the church locator.
Feature there and I typed in San Fernando, and there's
San Fernando's everywhere, like in Spain and everything else, so
make sure you choose the one in California. And I
found a couple of churches that you might want to
check out. One is in Sylmar, the other one is
in Northridge. So again, go to Calfrey Chapel.com to find those.
God bless you guys. Thanks for watching and listening. Tommy Coda,
Justin Thomas, great to be with you today here on
(56:01):
Pastor's Perspective.
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