Ever wondered how the delicate art of positive reinforcement can ignite a child’s intrinsic motivation? Let us take you by the hand and walk you through the enchanting world of PBIS, where our second-grade heroes, Lynda Jones and Susan Zifer, weave tales of triumph, heartfelt reasons for choosing the teaching path and the sheer magic of personalized acknowledgment systems. Their approach isn’t just about doling out rewards; it’s about using peer interactions and the power of recognition to foster strong relationships and encourage students to take ownership of their behavior and learning.
Imagine a place where students not only learn but also lead, and where their growth is as visible to them as it is to their teachers. Our discussion unfurls the transformative potential of student binder organization, a project that evolved over time from a skeptic's trial to a robust self-managed system that propels young learners toward setting goals and celebrating their personal journey. These binders, brimming with achievements and reflections, illustrate how a simple organizational tool can develop into a source of pride and a stepping stone for self-motivated learning.
Finally, these tools not only empower students to articulate their progress but also serve as precious keepsakes of their academic and personal milestones. Whether you're in the classroom, at home, or simply passionate about education's potential, this episode promises insights and inspiration to help you start small and build impactful educational practices. Join us and tap into the wisdom that Lynda and Susan, share, as we celebrate the spirit of teaching and the incredible capacity of our students to learn, lead, and grow.
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Speaker 1 (00:10):
Welcome to PBIS.
Journey to Genius.
Are you in the process ofimplementing PBIS?
Are you wondering where tostart?
You're in the right place.
We are here to support you.
Stay tuned.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Welcome everyone.
This is PBIS Journey to Genius.
I am Diane Farrell and I'm herewith Diane Ruff and we put a
podcast together.
We've worked together for manyyears and we put PBIS into our
schools and received a lot ofawards and recognition over the
years, and we put this podcasttogether to share our trials and
(00:55):
our successes so that you mightuse those to help you in your
positive behavioral journey.
We also share current issuesand behavior management today
and how those can help ongoingstruggles.
So, diane, who do?
Speaker 1 (01:06):
we have with us today .
Well, today we have two of oursecond grade teachers joining us
.
We want to talk about again theacknowledgement system.
We've talked a few times aboutthe acknowledgement system but
there's so much to it and thatreally, I think, is the genius
of PBIS.
So, talking about personalizingthe acknowledgement system for
students to drive that intrinsicmotivation.
(01:30):
So we have Linda Jones andSusan Zypher Welcome.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Hello, Hello.
They are second grade teachersof ours and they're going to
spend a minute telling usbecause we ask all of our guests
why they got into education,because we've all been together
for several years here inMinerva and these teachers are
veteran, fabulous teachers.
But we're going to make them goback in time a minute and say
why did you go into education?
(01:57):
So, Mrs Jones, you want tostart us out.
Why did you get into education?
Speaker 3 (02:01):
Okay, my story is probably not how most would
start off, but I went to OhioState and I wanted to go into
interior design and my mothersaid you may not do a two year
degree, that you absolutelycan't, so you need to pick
something else.
So, after thinking about things, I chose education.
I have I have people that werein education in my family.
My sister is Mrs Farrell whichis me, I'm her sister how about
(02:24):
that?
And my aunt, and there wereother things that interest me.
And then, once I started, Irealized it was because I am
interested in the way thingslearn.
How do we get from point A topoint B?
And that's obviously what yousee every day in education.
Oh, I love that.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Yeah, that's great.
All right, Mrs Zephyr, yeahthat's great.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
All right, Mrs Zephyr .
Speaker 4 (02:45):
Susan, what did you get into education?
I decided to be a teacher.
Actually, when I was in thirdgrade I had a learning
disability and I couldn't readat all and I was mortified every
day and I also was picked on alot because lefties weren't
allowed to be left-handed, so Icouldn't write either.
And in third grade my teachertook me aside and she stayed
after school for free to tutorme and I learned how to read and
(03:07):
right then I decided that's theteacher I wanted to be.
And then my love has stayed,because I love that every day is
different.
So every day I learn somethingnew from the kids and then they
learn something from me.
I love that.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
That is awesome.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
And you both have a sense of humor and we all need
that in teaching.
We all need that.
That is awesome.
And you both have a sense ofhumor and we all need that in
teaching.
We all need that, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
So like an aha moment whether it was a long time ago
or just this year when you'reworking with students.
What keeps you coming backevery single day?
Speaker 3 (03:39):
I think my first aha moment was when, I think, I've
been around for a while, so whenwe used to teach, you
instructed and then you allowedkids to have hands on.
But now, after doing multi-ageclassroom and watching kids
today, they will listen to me.
But listening to each otherhelps them learn.
So if we have a child who can'texplain anything or can't
(04:02):
understand anything, if someoneother than me, another child,
explains it, it moves it so muchfaster, which is not something
I would have thought wouldhappen.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Yeah, that's great, that's an aha.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
I love that.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
Mine.
I knew that you had to buildrelationships first, but I
started the morning meetings andI was doing it once a week for
a while and then actually I doit every single morning and my
moment is I actually have thekids lead them now and they will
(04:35):
bring up problems like at homeor recess or with each other,
and we all work together to findlike a solution to their
problem.
So I do that every singlemorning and my kids actually
love each other.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
So that both of those things are just so powerful and
we have talked about.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
If you've looked at our previous podcast, we've
talked about our classroommeetings and Susan has taken.
That is not required, by theway, here for all of you.
People go a meeting everymorning.
You're requiring that.
No, we require them twice amonth.
But it's teachers, it's whatthey want to do and what they
feel comfortable with.
Some do once a week.
Susan does it every morning,but it is that relationship
(05:11):
building piece which we'vetalked about so big in PBIS.
So again, these rock stars havetaken it to a higher level and
you know, learning from oneanother.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
That's huge too, that when we recognize that kids can
learn from one another and theylisten to each other.
So again, buildingrelationships in the classroom
and then amongst their friends,that's both.
That's genius in both areas.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Absolutely.
So you know, right now ourpodcasts have all been about
tier one so far.
Tier two is our future, buttier one is what we've been
working on and the reward systemthat we have going on in
Minerva.
Elementary we've had differentlevels talk about how they use
it, but we've never had secondgrade.
So we're having second grade.
(05:55):
Talk about the 10-day rewards,the overall acknowledgement
system, how they use it in theirclassrooms.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
So whoever wants to go first, Mrs Jones, okay for
our 10-day rewards.
I know that I don't know.
No other grade level has beenhere before, I guess, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Yeah, okay, we've had different ones, we've just not
had second grade, just notsecond grade, okay.
Speaker 3 (06:14):
I didn't realize who had been here.
So in my room and I thinkSusan's is different Is it the
same Exactly?
Well, what we do is our kidshave a calendar that they mark
for the day how their day went.
So they put a certain color X,and it doesn't always turn out
to be too negative.
But they will put a red X ifthey happen to have a couple of
(06:36):
poor choices during the day.
They know it's not the end ofthe world, anything like that,
but they will count their own Xsand when they get 10 of their
own, they will bring them up tome at the end of the day.
That's where we're the same.
I think I do individualmeetings about behavior charts
and what their goals are bythemselves, but their 10-day
rewards come when they get their10th day.
(06:56):
Because I am impatient myselfand didn't like to have to wait.
If I got my 10-day on a Mondayand it wasn't until Friday, we
were doing 10 day rewards.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
And that is different .
So we have had Mrs Hunt comeand talk in first grade.
They do it to get.
Now, that's the differencebetween first and second, you
know, being that self-managementthat you're letting your little
guys do, which is fabulous, butshe does it in the behavior
conference and she does herconferences weekly.
But now Mrs Jones is sayingwhen that little 10 day rewards
come up, they get to come to you.
(07:25):
That's self-management.
My time is here and here's mytime Right.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
So that's the way I do it.
And, like I said, theindividual conferences I know
some of them do them all on thesame day and everyone and I
divide it up in betweendifferent points throughout the
week.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
So yeah, it's a great idea.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
I also do every 10 days.
They will come up at the end ofthe day If they've had a yellow
day, which is one poor choicemark, or a red day, which is two
or more.
They actually don't color it ontheir own.
They come up to my desk, wecolor it in.
I asked why?
I pretend like I don't know.
They always tell me why andthen I always say what could we
(08:06):
do maybe to improve that?
So I kind of do a behaviorconference with yellow and red
days, but I also do one every 10days when we, when they get to
the 10, I'll say hey, do we likethis goal?
You want to try something else?
And then that's when I switchedtheir goal.
Okay, yeah, I actually do itevery 10 days.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
So I like this and we can talk about this, even
though building wide.
The expectation is everyonedoes 10 day rewards, everyone
does behavior conferences, buthow often and to what is the
autonomy of the?
Speaker 1 (08:36):
teacher, yes, and what works in the classroom, and
you might even change it fromyear to year depending on your
kids and what they want to do.
So, again, allowing thatflexibility and honoring
classroom management with theteachers.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
Because sometimes I think when people start out PBIS
, they think that you're goingto manage my classroom, you're
going to tell me exactly what todo all the time.
But the flexibility is there,it's just the goals are
consistent throughout thebuilding.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
And then I love the fact that when we share, we've
had lots of teachers share andthen sharing with all of you out
there.
You know, and I would love tohear from teachers that are
listening to us, send us anemail, tell us how you do things
, because we learn from eachother, and I really just think
that's powerful.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Absolutely.
We'll talk about that at theend.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
But if you email us, we can even hook you up with
teachers that'll email you back.
They have done that.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
We have heard from some kindergarten teachers that
have.
Yeah, absolutely, so we'removing on to the leadership
binders Diane.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
So leadership binders we added that this year, so
children, kids start trackingtheir goals.
I know I think second gradeactually started at last year.
You've done it A couple ofyears.
This is your third year, so youare more of the pioneers of
this.
You've worked out the kinks andthen the rest of the building
has learned from second gradeand I think a teacher in fifth
(09:55):
grade had started it.
So this year our whole buildingwas required to have leadership
binders.
But again, teachers haveflexibility in how they want to
do that.
So today we kind of want totalk about how second grade
handles leadership binders andhow the children view their
binders and just what they gleanfrom that, because it builds
intrinsic motivation and I thinkit's really wonderful that
(10:18):
children are very proud of theirgoals, where they're going, and
I love to hear them share withme and they'll say I'm on this
level right now, but this is thelevel I want to be at and they
know this, so go ahead, you wantto share.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Okay, sure, yeah.
Well, we started the Bindersabout three years ago and I will
say when we first said yes tothe Binders I was thinking that
it was going to be way too muchwork.
Stop, susan, slow down.
I actually took some stuff outand then I made it manageable
(10:53):
for the first year.
Then the second year I added afew more things and this year my
binders actually are reallygood and easy and my kids
actually control the binders.
I honestly don't have to do muchof anything and they're seven
and eight years old.
They'll know what tab it goesto and when I give them a
writing, they know that's thewriting tab and they tell me and
(11:13):
they repeat the color back tome.
Then they go and put the stuffin.
So if I have an Alexiacertificate, they said, well,
that's my achievement.
And I said, yes, where's I goIn the back?
They'll go and get the binder,open it up and close it.
I did have a lot falling apartin the beginning.
It's not that big of a deal.
You just put it back togetheragain.
But now I don't have any.
They know how to do it.
(11:34):
Sometimes they'll say, hey, canyou help me find it and I'll do
it.
My binders have.
They have in there their growthgoals.
So that'd be Lexia SRCSightWords.
It has their behavior chartsall throughout the year which
they love going through becausethey like to see, if you look at
their behavior charts, how it'simproved.
Most of them are all green now.
(11:54):
They have writing samples inthere.
That's the one that makes themgiggle.
That's their favorite part ofthe binder.
They like to look because Ihave a monthly writing plus
another two writings.
Every month we have about threewritings we put in and they
like to watch the growth andthey all love to go to their
first writing and giggle.
They like I make them draw apicture in the beginning of the
year.
They like to see how theirtheir drawings have gotten
(12:16):
better.
Um, I do a coloring page toshow them how they used to color
at seven and they love to sharethat.
We share it with Mrs Pearson,which is in second grade, and we
also share it with akindergarten room.
This is um.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Hannon.
Speaker 4 (12:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Yes, and you know, I just I love, I love that.
I think you know we hear allthe time in education how can we
make kids care?
They don't care, they don'tcare about learning, they don't
want to learn.
And but when we do stuff likethis, this builds the fact that
they really want to learn,because they become very proud
of what they're doing.
And I think that's true for anyage, even in the high school
(12:52):
level.
If they're keeping track oftheir growth and somebody is
noticing it and they're able toshare, they're very proud of it.
We're proud ourselves when weshare things about our classroom
.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
So I don't think kids even know they grow.
No and now they can see the bar, so they see it.
I know, yes, they don't know it.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Last year, coming up on that last year, I have one
sheet that we put our Dibblesgoal and then for each time of
the year beginning of the year,middle of the year, end of the
year and we do the same thingwith mappers.
And when it's in there lastyear at the end of the year,
nobody was looking at, I said,okay, everybody, open up your
(13:30):
binder to this page, let's lookat your first number for mappers
in reading.
And then I said, all right, nowlook at your last one.
And they were like wow, likethey didn't think in their head,
even though every time we takethe map test we talk about this
was your first number, this isyour goal, let's work on this
and we talk about it.
But they could see that growthfor the year and that's last
(13:52):
year's class, that's what gotthem the most excited.
The light bulb didn't come ontill they saw that big thing,
because sometimes it varies, youknow, the day of the test
sometimes they didn't feel Iwish I could have gone higher,
or the goal was I was two pointsoff.
And they think that's the endof the world.
When we're going, no, that'sokay, two points is okay, but I
think that is they going?
(14:12):
No, that's okay.
Two points is okay, but I thinkthat is.
They really liked that part.
They liked that page.
I added this year for the firsttime because, like I said, we've
moved a lot of things around.
One thing that Susan has inhers is a monthly sheet.
So at the top of the sheet itsays September, october,
november and they have a promptthat they write each month.
I took that out because I feltlike that was a lot for me to
(14:34):
manage with the other writing.
She's a better writing teacherthan I am, so that moved smooth
for her.
I took it out this year.
I regret that it's not in there.
I feel like I should have leftit in, so I will put it back in
next year.
But one thing that I did add wastwo years ago.
Two or three years ago we cameup with weekly binder or weekly
(14:57):
goals, and I never put them inthe binders.
But they get a sheet every weekthat said this is how many
units in Lexia I need to do,this is how many numbers and
mappers I need to go up and thisis how many SRC points I should
try to get, and every week whenthey meet them they get a big
star and they get to put theminto their binder when they meet
it.
(15:17):
Well, at the first couple ofweeks I didn't, because we were
just starting out and then westarted to put them in and then
when they take out their bindersthey'll be like how many goal
sheets do you have?
Look at all my goal sheets.
So it was a good they'repromoting themselves because
they can see how many they'vedone, because it's okay if you
don't meet your goals for oneweek.
If it's two weeks, we usuallyhave a conference about it.
(15:38):
But then they get to say lookhow many times I've done this,
and it's more of a you know.
That makes them want to do itmore.
So we don't meet with anotherclass, but they will talk about
what's in their binders theybring them to me any every time
we do a conference have you guysshared your binders with
parents?
Speaker 1 (15:54):
have you had the like ?
Have they had the opportunity?
Speaker 2 (15:57):
so kind of talk about that.
Yeah, that's what I was nextlike do you use them at
conferences?
Like where?
Where do you use them besidesthe kids looking at them?
Speaker 3 (16:05):
we've done them both we've done them at conferences
and our family.
Speaker 4 (16:08):
I do it at my family lunch.
Oh okay, oh I don't.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
I don't do it there, I didn't think about that.
We do it at my family lunch.
Oh, I don't do it there, Ididn't think about that.
We do it during our open houseSecond grade open house.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
They share, they share yes.
Speaker 4 (16:18):
And conferences yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Yeah, so at conferences do the kids a lot of
times come with their parentsto conferences, or just
sometimes, yeah, yes, and sothey're able to share.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
I actually have.
If the kids come, I actuallyinvite the children.
This used to be called aportfolio assessment in the 90s.
It did.
I know it all comes back around.
So, I'm, I use it like that.
So if they come, I have themactually do the most of the
conference and go through theirbinder and they they usually
know what they should have hadand their goal that they set and
(16:53):
didn't meet.
And then I'll just sit thereand the parents, of course, will
say why isn't it set, whydidn't you achieve it?
And then they actually tellthem well, I was messing around
or I was talking.
They actually tell them thebinders are great because they
don't lie, so it helps.
But we also do that every threemonths, I think.
We do a family lunch, so agrandparent will come in or an
(17:19):
aunt or an uncle and they'll goto their cubby and pull it out
and they'll go through it whilethey eat together.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
So I have them do that, so it's just like a
personal scrapbook that they canshare.
So I mean, what a cool thingfor conferences though, Because
even if a parent calls up andgoes, I want to have a
conference, you go like, okay,because I already have this
ready.
And I remember back in the daywe were talking about getting
ready for conferences, trying toget all those pieces together,
putting this piece where it'spretty much done.
(17:41):
So for people who go, oh, Ijust don't have time to do that.
If you think about what you hadto do to get these types of
pieces ready.
Anyway, you just have themready.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
And I think it's just so empowering to the student to
be able to share their learningand then, like you, said
they're pretty honest.
Speaker 4 (17:59):
No, they're honest.
They're in charge of theirlearning.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
All right, where else are we?
So we talked about them beingexcited about their growth.
You said that, like every time,they see, and we talked about
the fact that kids don't evenknow they grow all the time and
then they see that.
I mean, we see that all thetime as teachers because we see
all their pieces of work, butkids don't.
Do you see them wanting toshare with other kids?
(18:26):
You said you share with othergrade levels, but do they like
to?
You said look at all that Ihave.
Do they like to?
Speaker 4 (18:42):
They love to share to the younger grades.
But when I did the second gradesome of mine were a little
embarrassed, so I I don't knowif I recommend that or not.
Now I actually, after I did it,the other teacher and I both
were like oh, Because it almostturned into comparing instead of
sharing.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
I can understand that .
Speaker 4 (18:56):
So I think I'm going to continue doing either
kindergarten or first grade oreven the older grades, but I
don't think I'm going to dosecond grade again.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
Yeah, no, and that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Yeah, I like that idea, because the little ones
are looking up at like, oh wow,look what you've learned, look
what you've been able to doversus others in the same
situation.
Maybe they're not that far,maybe they haven't grown that
much.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
And then the older ones.
You know, if we prep them, theycan like.
When you go to kindergarten youcan say all right, your
kindergartners are going to bevery excited to share.
You need to, you know,compliment them and give them
words, so that makes the littlekindergartner feel like, wow,
okay.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
But how this all fits into PBIS, though, is the
relationship you actually buildwith the students over their
binders, because no matter whothey're sharing, or you know
whatever they know, you know allthat about them.
Mm-hmm, Personally.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Well, and I think again, it cuts down on
misbehavior, you know, becausethey care about their learning
and they want to do well andthey know that people are
looking teachers interested ifI'm sharing with other kids and
so they genuinely care.
So you probably don't see asmuch misbehavior going on in the
(20:11):
classroom.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
Right, I actually just had a conference with a
student who's wonderful but hadquite a bit of yellow as the
beginning of the year was comingaround on his chart, and there
was a month that maybe we hadtwo black exes which in the
pirate room it counts as goodbut black is good, so you need
to know she's a pirate.
(20:34):
Yes, my classroom is decoratedwith pirates, but the black Xs
were good and then there wereyellow.
He didn't have red, which itwas good for him, and we talked
about that during that time, buthe brought up his binder and we
were sitting there talking andhe goes.
You know what?
Mrs Jones, I was looking back,october was a really bad month
for me.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
Look at all these yellows, but look at this month.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
It was February, he goes.
I don't have any yellows.
And I was like, yes, that'swhat we were trying to do.
Yeah, I hope I can do it forMarch.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
And I was like oh, me too.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
Me too.
But he was putting it togetherbecause, honestly, you can ask a
kid sometimes how they wereyesterday and they can't
remember, yeah, but then he canlook back and say, oh, yeah.
Or you can use it as look, thiswhole month has been pretty
yellow, we need to really workto go back to another month, or
(21:25):
you can do better, and it doeswork that way too.
But that part made me laughbecause he was honestly going
you should have seen all theyellow I had.
It was just cute.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
And that is cute because kids will go.
Did you have a difficult?
No, yeah.
I was absolutely fine today.
But whenever they look back atthat, like we are looking at it
as all academic, because we'relooking at is their growth in
their writing and all that kindof stuff.
But putting the behavior chartsin there makes a big difference
when they can see that growthin behavior, especially for
those little kids who struggleat the beginning of the year,
(21:55):
you know, and they do have a lotof struggle with their behavior
coming back off of summer breakand stuff, and then they get it
together, which we as teacherssee, you know.
But that's that's very coolthat he was able to put that
together.
So it does influence theirbehavior because they can see
the growth in that too it doesinfluence their behavior because
they can see the growth in thattoo.
Speaker 1 (22:14):
So you know we have teachers out there that are
listening that maybe you knowthink oh my goodness, I don't
know if I can put together aleadership binder or a portfolio
, a learning portfolio, sowhat's some advice you have?
Speaker 4 (22:27):
Yeah, Well, the advice we should have taken when
we started.
That's the best advice.
That's the best advice.
That's the best Was.
You don't have to make itperfect and it doesn't have to
be full.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
I love that.
Speaker 4 (22:40):
I actually will say the writing samples are my
favorite and the behavior charts, and then from that you can
start adding yes, the writing'seasy, I just put holes in it.
I will either make a copy of itand send one home or put holes
in it and put in the binder.
But even as a parent, I wish Ihad this for my children.
(23:01):
I would love this.
Not the behavior charts I wouldlook at those but the writing
it's like a storybook of theentire year and it's adorable.
Yeah, so that I would start.
Just don't think you have to doit all because we messed up in
the beginning it was hard.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
It was, yeah, I will say that.
Um, I had a teacher in ourbuildings child from last year,
and it happens to be one ofthose children that goes home
and you say how was your day?
And they go good and they haveno information whatsoever.
And she said that when she sawher binder, she cried because it
showed there was writing andthere was.
You know the behavior chartsand artwork.
(23:40):
Yeah, there were art, there wasartwork in there and she said I
just had a whole overlay of whatthe year he had done when it
comes home separately one pieceat a time.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
You look at it, you put it on the fridge.
Yeah, it's not the same.
It's not the same.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
And we have put in pictures of the kids We've had.
It's almost like an autographbook at the end of the year,
yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
So they'll autograph.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
We'll put pictures of everybody in the class so that
they get that.
So hopefully they can keep itand you have it, just like you
said you'd had it for your kids.
So it's for them to take home,which is a nice end of the year
thing.
Parents appreciate it then, andthen all year, like we said, we
use it all the time.
Now again, it wasn't easy tobegin with because in today's
(24:26):
teaching world it's justsomething extra, but it doesn't
turn out to be once you commit.
I'm going to use this and Iknow teachers that use it and it
does work and the kids can doit.
Like she said, the dropping ofthe binder and 50,000 sheets
going all over the floor ismildly frustrating.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
And it happens, yes.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Yeah, and the three ring thingy is click, click,
click, click, click Boy.
That's so much fun when you getit out, but it doesn't.
It will go away.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
And it is amazing if you we did have fifth grade do.
Miss Autumn Thomas didleadership binders in the fifth
grade.
So if you're listening outthere, this is a second grade
perspective you can get on ourpodcast leadership binders at
the older level, but small, andthen her and her cooperating
teacher grew with every year.
So, um.
So just take that advice.
(25:10):
Like you don't have to startwith this masterpiece, you know,
of a binder, to start withsomething small, grow each year.
If you'd like more informationabout that, you can email us and
(25:32):
we would love to hook you upwith any of our teachers here
that do them and can help youget started.
So please, please, do that,please do that if you're
interested in this.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
All right.
Well, I think that we're aboutout of time, so again we want to
thank Mrs Jones and Mrs Zephyrfor being here with us today.
Thank you for listening to ourshow.
We would love to hear from you.
Look for us on Facebook orInstagram or email us at
PBISjourneytogenius at gmailcom.
This is Diane Farrell and thisis Diane Ruff.
You have been listening to PBIS.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Journey to.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Genius, thank you.
Welcome to PBIS.
Journey to Genius.
Are you in the process ofimplementing PBIS?
Are you wondering where tostart?
You're in the right place.
We are here to support you.
Stay tuned.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Welcome everyone.
This is PBIS Journey to Genius.
I am Diane Farrell and I'm herewith Diane Ruff and we put a
podcast together.
We've worked together for manyyears and we put PBIS into our
schools and received a lot ofawards and recognition over the
years, and we put this podcasttogether to share our trials and
(00:55):
our successes so that you mightuse those to help you in your
positive behavioral journey.
We also share current issuesand behavior management today
and how those can help ongoingstruggles.
So, diane, who do?
Speaker 1 (01:06):
we have with us today .
Well, today we have two of oursecond grade teachers joining us
.
We want to talk about again theacknowledgement system.
We've talked a few times aboutthe acknowledgement system but
there's so much to it and thatreally, I think, is the genius
of PBIS.
So, talking about personalizingthe acknowledgement system for
students to drive that intrinsicmotivation.
(01:30):
So we have Linda Jones andSusan Zypher Welcome.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Hello, Hello.
They are second grade teachersof ours and they're going to
spend a minute telling usbecause we ask all of our guests
why they got into education,because we've all been together
for several years here inMinerva and these teachers are
veteran, fabulous teachers.
But we're going to make them goback in time a minute and say
why did you go into education?
(01:57):
So, Mrs Jones, you want tostart us out.
Why did you get into education?
Speaker 3 (02:01):
Okay, my story is probably not how most would
start off, but I went to OhioState and I wanted to go into
interior design and my mothersaid you may not do a two year
degree, that you absolutelycan't, so you need to pick
something else.
So, after thinking about things, I chose education.
I have I have people that werein education in my family.
My sister is Mrs Farrell whichis me, I'm her sister how about
(02:24):
that?
And my aunt, and there wereother things that interest me.
And then, once I started, Irealized it was because I am
interested in the way thingslearn.
How do we get from point A topoint B?
And that's obviously what yousee every day in education.
Oh, I love that.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Yeah, that's great.
All right, Mrs Zephyr, yeahthat's great.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
All right, Mrs Zephyr .
Speaker 4 (02:45):
Susan, what did you get into education?
I decided to be a teacher.
Actually, when I was in thirdgrade I had a learning
disability and I couldn't readat all and I was mortified every
day and I also was picked on alot because lefties weren't
allowed to be left-handed, so Icouldn't write either.
And in third grade my teachertook me aside and she stayed
after school for free to tutorme and I learned how to read and
(03:07):
right then I decided that's theteacher I wanted to be.
And then my love has stayed,because I love that every day is
different.
So every day I learn somethingnew from the kids and then they
learn something from me.
I love that.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
That is awesome.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
And you both have a sense of humor and we all need
that in teaching.
We all need that.
That is awesome.
And you both have a sense ofhumor and we all need that in
teaching.
We all need that, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
So like an aha moment whether it was a long time ago
or just this year when you'reworking with students.
What keeps you coming backevery single day?
Speaker 3 (03:39):
I think my first aha moment was when, I think, I've
been around for a while, so whenwe used to teach, you
instructed and then you allowedkids to have hands on.
But now, after doing multi-ageclassroom and watching kids
today, they will listen to me.
But listening to each otherhelps them learn.
So if we have a child who can'texplain anything or can't
(04:02):
understand anything, if someoneother than me, another child,
explains it, it moves it so muchfaster, which is not something
I would have thought wouldhappen.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Yeah, that's great, that's an aha.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
I love that.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
Mine.
I knew that you had to buildrelationships first, but I
started the morning meetings andI was doing it once a week for
a while and then actually I doit every single morning and my
moment is I actually have thekids lead them now and they will
(04:35):
bring up problems like at homeor recess or with each other,
and we all work together to findlike a solution to their
problem.
So I do that every singlemorning and my kids actually
love each other.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
So that both of those things are just so powerful and
we have talked about.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
If you've looked at our previous podcast, we've
talked about our classroommeetings and Susan has taken.
That is not required, by theway, here for all of you.
People go a meeting everymorning.
You're requiring that.
No, we require them twice amonth.
But it's teachers, it's whatthey want to do and what they
feel comfortable with.
Some do once a week.
Susan does it every morning,but it is that relationship
(05:11):
building piece which we'vetalked about so big in PBIS.
So again, these rock stars havetaken it to a higher level and
you know, learning from oneanother.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
That's huge too, that when we recognize that kids can
learn from one another and theylisten to each other.
So again, buildingrelationships in the classroom
and then amongst their friends,that's both.
That's genius in both areas.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Absolutely.
So you know, right now ourpodcasts have all been about
tier one so far.
Tier two is our future, buttier one is what we've been
working on and the reward systemthat we have going on in
Minerva.
Elementary we've had differentlevels talk about how they use
it, but we've never had secondgrade.
So we're having second grade.
(05:55):
Talk about the 10-day rewards,the overall acknowledgement
system, how they use it in theirclassrooms.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
So whoever wants to go first, Mrs Jones, okay for
our 10-day rewards.
I know that I don't know.
No other grade level has beenhere before, I guess, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Yeah, okay, we've had different ones, we've just not
had second grade, just notsecond grade, okay.
Speaker 3 (06:14):
I didn't realize who had been here.
So in my room and I thinkSusan's is different Is it the
same Exactly?
Well, what we do is our kidshave a calendar that they mark
for the day how their day went.
So they put a certain color X,and it doesn't always turn out
to be too negative.
But they will put a red X ifthey happen to have a couple of
(06:36):
poor choices during the day.
They know it's not the end ofthe world, anything like that,
but they will count their own Xsand when they get 10 of their
own, they will bring them up tome at the end of the day.
That's where we're the same.
I think I do individualmeetings about behavior charts
and what their goals are bythemselves, but their 10-day
rewards come when they get their10th day.
(06:56):
Because I am impatient myselfand didn't like to have to wait.
If I got my 10-day on a Mondayand it wasn't until Friday, we
were doing 10 day rewards.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
And that is different .
So we have had Mrs Hunt comeand talk in first grade.
They do it to get.
Now, that's the differencebetween first and second, you
know, being that self-managementthat you're letting your little
guys do, which is fabulous, butshe does it in the behavior
conference and she does herconferences weekly.
But now Mrs Jones is sayingwhen that little 10 day rewards
come up, they get to come to you.
(07:25):
That's self-management.
My time is here and here's mytime Right.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
So that's the way I do it.
And, like I said, theindividual conferences I know
some of them do them all on thesame day and everyone and I
divide it up in betweendifferent points throughout the
week.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
So yeah, it's a great idea.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
I also do every 10 days.
They will come up at the end ofthe day If they've had a yellow
day, which is one poor choicemark, or a red day, which is two
or more.
They actually don't color it ontheir own.
They come up to my desk, wecolor it in.
I asked why?
I pretend like I don't know.
They always tell me why andthen I always say what could we
(08:06):
do maybe to improve that?
So I kind of do a behaviorconference with yellow and red
days, but I also do one every 10days when we, when they get to
the 10, I'll say hey, do we likethis goal?
You want to try something else?
And then that's when I switchedtheir goal.
Okay, yeah, I actually do itevery 10 days.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
So I like this and we can talk about this, even
though building wide.
The expectation is everyonedoes 10 day rewards, everyone
does behavior conferences, buthow often and to what is the
autonomy of the?
Speaker 1 (08:36):
teacher, yes, and what works in the classroom, and
you might even change it fromyear to year depending on your
kids and what they want to do.
So, again, allowing thatflexibility and honoring
classroom management with theteachers.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
Because sometimes I think when people start out PBIS
, they think that you're goingto manage my classroom, you're
going to tell me exactly what todo all the time.
But the flexibility is there,it's just the goals are
consistent throughout thebuilding.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
And then I love the fact that when we share, we've
had lots of teachers share andthen sharing with all of you out
there.
You know, and I would love tohear from teachers that are
listening to us, send us anemail, tell us how you do things
, because we learn from eachother, and I really just think
that's powerful.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Absolutely.
We'll talk about that at theend.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
But if you email us, we can even hook you up with
teachers that'll email you back.
They have done that.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
We have heard from some kindergarten teachers that
have.
Yeah, absolutely, so we'removing on to the leadership
binders Diane.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
So leadership binders we added that this year, so
children, kids start trackingtheir goals.
I know I think second gradeactually started at last year.
You've done it A couple ofyears.
This is your third year, so youare more of the pioneers of
this.
You've worked out the kinks andthen the rest of the building
has learned from second gradeand I think a teacher in fifth
(09:55):
grade had started it.
So this year our whole buildingwas required to have leadership
binders.
But again, teachers haveflexibility in how they want to
do that.
So today we kind of want totalk about how second grade
handles leadership binders andhow the children view their
binders and just what they gleanfrom that, because it builds
intrinsic motivation and I thinkit's really wonderful that
(10:18):
children are very proud of theirgoals, where they're going, and
I love to hear them share withme and they'll say I'm on this
level right now, but this is thelevel I want to be at and they
know this, so go ahead, you wantto share.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Okay, sure, yeah.
Well, we started the Bindersabout three years ago and I will
say when we first said yes tothe Binders I was thinking that
it was going to be way too muchwork.
Stop, susan, slow down.
I actually took some stuff outand then I made it manageable
(10:53):
for the first year.
Then the second year I added afew more things and this year my
binders actually are reallygood and easy and my kids
actually control the binders.
I honestly don't have to do muchof anything and they're seven
and eight years old.
They'll know what tab it goesto and when I give them a
writing, they know that's thewriting tab and they tell me and
(11:13):
they repeat the color back tome.
Then they go and put the stuffin.
So if I have an Alexiacertificate, they said, well,
that's my achievement.
And I said, yes, where's I goIn the back?
They'll go and get the binder,open it up and close it.
I did have a lot falling apartin the beginning.
It's not that big of a deal.
You just put it back togetheragain.
But now I don't have any.
They know how to do it.
(11:34):
Sometimes they'll say, hey, canyou help me find it and I'll do
it.
My binders have.
They have in there their growthgoals.
So that'd be Lexia SRCSightWords.
It has their behavior chartsall throughout the year which
they love going through becausethey like to see, if you look at
their behavior charts, how it'simproved.
Most of them are all green now.
(11:54):
They have writing samples inthere.
That's the one that makes themgiggle.
That's their favorite part ofthe binder.
They like to look because Ihave a monthly writing plus
another two writings.
Every month we have about threewritings we put in and they
like to watch the growth andthey all love to go to their
first writing and giggle.
They like I make them draw apicture in the beginning of the
year.
They like to see how theirtheir drawings have gotten
(12:16):
better.
Um, I do a coloring page toshow them how they used to color
at seven and they love to sharethat.
We share it with Mrs Pearson,which is in second grade, and we
also share it with akindergarten room.
This is um.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Hannon.
Speaker 4 (12:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Yes, and you know, I just I love, I love that.
I think you know we hear allthe time in education how can we
make kids care?
They don't care, they don'tcare about learning, they don't
want to learn.
And but when we do stuff likethis, this builds the fact that
they really want to learn,because they become very proud
of what they're doing.
And I think that's true for anyage, even in the high school
(12:52):
level.
If they're keeping track oftheir growth and somebody is
noticing it and they're able toshare, they're very proud of it.
We're proud ourselves when weshare things about our classroom
.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
So I don't think kids even know they grow.
No and now they can see the bar, so they see it.
I know, yes, they don't know it.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Last year, coming up on that last year, I have one
sheet that we put our Dibblesgoal and then for each time of
the year beginning of the year,middle of the year, end of the
year and we do the same thingwith mappers.
And when it's in there lastyear at the end of the year,
nobody was looking at, I said,okay, everybody, open up your
(13:30):
binder to this page, let's lookat your first number for mappers
in reading.
And then I said, all right, nowlook at your last one.
And they were like wow, likethey didn't think in their head,
even though every time we takethe map test we talk about this
was your first number, this isyour goal, let's work on this
and we talk about it.
But they could see that growthfor the year and that's last
(13:52):
year's class, that's what gotthem the most excited.
The light bulb didn't come ontill they saw that big thing,
because sometimes it varies, youknow, the day of the test
sometimes they didn't feel Iwish I could have gone higher,
or the goal was I was two pointsoff.
And they think that's the endof the world.
When we're going, no, that'sokay, two points is okay, but I
think that is they going?
(14:12):
No, that's okay.
Two points is okay, but I thinkthat is.
They really liked that part.
They liked that page.
I added this year for the firsttime because, like I said, we've
moved a lot of things around.
One thing that Susan has inhers is a monthly sheet.
So at the top of the sheet itsays September, october,
november and they have a promptthat they write each month.
I took that out because I feltlike that was a lot for me to
(14:34):
manage with the other writing.
She's a better writing teacherthan I am, so that moved smooth
for her.
I took it out this year.
I regret that it's not in there.
I feel like I should have leftit in, so I will put it back in
next year.
But one thing that I did add wastwo years ago.
Two or three years ago we cameup with weekly binder or weekly
(14:57):
goals, and I never put them inthe binders.
But they get a sheet every weekthat said this is how many
units in Lexia I need to do,this is how many numbers and
mappers I need to go up and thisis how many SRC points I should
try to get, and every week whenthey meet them they get a big
star and they get to put theminto their binder when they meet
it.
(15:17):
Well, at the first couple ofweeks I didn't, because we were
just starting out and then westarted to put them in and then
when they take out their bindersthey'll be like how many goal
sheets do you have?
Look at all my goal sheets.
So it was a good they'repromoting themselves because
they can see how many they'vedone, because it's okay if you
don't meet your goals for oneweek.
If it's two weeks, we usuallyhave a conference about it.
(15:38):
But then they get to say lookhow many times I've done this,
and it's more of a you know.
That makes them want to do itmore.
So we don't meet with anotherclass, but they will talk about
what's in their binders theybring them to me any every time
we do a conference have you guysshared your binders with
parents?
Speaker 1 (15:54):
have you had the like ?
Have they had the opportunity?
Speaker 2 (15:57):
so kind of talk about that.
Yeah, that's what I was nextlike do you use them at
conferences?
Like where?
Where do you use them besidesthe kids looking at them?
Speaker 3 (16:05):
we've done them both we've done them at conferences
and our family.
Speaker 4 (16:08):
I do it at my family lunch.
Oh okay, oh I don't.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
I don't do it there, I didn't think about that.
We do it at my family lunch.
Oh, I don't do it there, Ididn't think about that.
We do it during our open houseSecond grade open house.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
They share, they share yes.
Speaker 4 (16:18):
And conferences yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Yeah, so at conferences do the kids a lot of
times come with their parentsto conferences, or just
sometimes, yeah, yes, and sothey're able to share.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
I actually have.
If the kids come, I actuallyinvite the children.
This used to be called aportfolio assessment in the 90s.
It did.
I know it all comes back around.
So, I'm, I use it like that.
So if they come, I have themactually do the most of the
conference and go through theirbinder and they they usually
know what they should have hadand their goal that they set and
(16:53):
didn't meet.
And then I'll just sit thereand the parents, of course, will
say why isn't it set, whydidn't you achieve it?
And then they actually tellthem well, I was messing around
or I was talking.
They actually tell them thebinders are great because they
don't lie, so it helps.
But we also do that every threemonths, I think.
We do a family lunch, so agrandparent will come in or an
(17:19):
aunt or an uncle and they'll goto their cubby and pull it out
and they'll go through it whilethey eat together.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
So I have them do that, so it's just like a
personal scrapbook that they canshare.
So I mean, what a cool thingfor conferences though, Because
even if a parent calls up andgoes, I want to have a
conference, you go like, okay,because I already have this
ready.
And I remember back in the daywe were talking about getting
ready for conferences, trying toget all those pieces together,
putting this piece where it'spretty much done.
(17:41):
So for people who go, oh, Ijust don't have time to do that.
If you think about what you hadto do to get these types of
pieces ready.
Anyway, you just have themready.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
And I think it's just so empowering to the student to
be able to share their learningand then, like you, said
they're pretty honest.
Speaker 4 (17:59):
No, they're honest.
They're in charge of theirlearning.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
All right, where else are we?
So we talked about them beingexcited about their growth.
You said that, like every time,they see, and we talked about
the fact that kids don't evenknow they grow all the time and
then they see that.
I mean, we see that all thetime as teachers because we see
all their pieces of work, butkids don't.
Do you see them wanting toshare with other kids?
(18:26):
You said you share with othergrade levels, but do they like
to?
You said look at all that Ihave.
Do they like to?
Speaker 4 (18:42):
They love to share to the younger grades.
But when I did the second gradesome of mine were a little
embarrassed, so I I don't knowif I recommend that or not.
Now I actually, after I did it,the other teacher and I both
were like oh, Because it almostturned into comparing instead of
sharing.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
I can understand that .
Speaker 4 (18:56):
So I think I'm going to continue doing either
kindergarten or first grade oreven the older grades, but I
don't think I'm going to dosecond grade again.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
Yeah, no, and that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Yeah, I like that idea, because the little ones
are looking up at like, oh wow,look what you've learned, look
what you've been able to doversus others in the same
situation.
Maybe they're not that far,maybe they haven't grown that
much.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
And then the older ones.
You know, if we prep them, theycan like.
When you go to kindergarten youcan say all right, your
kindergartners are going to bevery excited to share.
You need to, you know,compliment them and give them
words, so that makes the littlekindergartner feel like, wow,
okay.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
But how this all fits into PBIS, though, is the
relationship you actually buildwith the students over their
binders, because no matter whothey're sharing, or you know
whatever they know, you know allthat about them.
Mm-hmm, Personally.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Well, and I think again, it cuts down on
misbehavior, you know, becausethey care about their learning
and they want to do well andthey know that people are
looking teachers interested ifI'm sharing with other kids and
so they genuinely care.
So you probably don't see asmuch misbehavior going on in the
(20:11):
classroom.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
Right, I actually just had a conference with a
student who's wonderful but hadquite a bit of yellow as the
beginning of the year was comingaround on his chart, and there
was a month that maybe we hadtwo black exes which in the
pirate room it counts as goodbut black is good, so you need
to know she's a pirate.
(20:34):
Yes, my classroom is decoratedwith pirates, but the black Xs
were good and then there wereyellow.
He didn't have red, which itwas good for him, and we talked
about that during that time, buthe brought up his binder and we
were sitting there talking andhe goes.
You know what?
Mrs Jones, I was looking back,october was a really bad month
for me.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
Look at all these yellows, but look at this month.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
It was February, he goes.
I don't have any yellows.
And I was like, yes, that'swhat we were trying to do.
Yeah, I hope I can do it forMarch.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
And I was like oh, me too.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
Me too.
But he was putting it togetherbecause, honestly, you can ask a
kid sometimes how they wereyesterday and they can't
remember, yeah, but then he canlook back and say, oh, yeah.
Or you can use it as look, thiswhole month has been pretty
yellow, we need to really workto go back to another month, or
(21:25):
you can do better, and it doeswork that way too.
But that part made me laughbecause he was honestly going
you should have seen all theyellow I had.
It was just cute.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
And that is cute because kids will go.
Did you have a difficult?
No, yeah.
I was absolutely fine today.
But whenever they look back atthat, like we are looking at it
as all academic, because we'relooking at is their growth in
their writing and all that kindof stuff.
But putting the behavior chartsin there makes a big difference
when they can see that growthin behavior, especially for
those little kids who struggleat the beginning of the year,
(21:55):
you know, and they do have a lotof struggle with their behavior
coming back off of summer breakand stuff, and then they get it
together, which we as teacherssee, you know.
But that's that's very coolthat he was able to put that
together.
So it does influence theirbehavior because they can see
the growth in that too it doesinfluence their behavior because
they can see the growth in thattoo.
Speaker 1 (22:14):
So you know we have teachers out there that are
listening that maybe you knowthink oh my goodness, I don't
know if I can put together aleadership binder or a portfolio
, a learning portfolio, sowhat's some advice you have?
Speaker 4 (22:27):
Yeah, Well, the advice we should have taken when
we started.
That's the best advice.
That's the best advice.
That's the best Was.
You don't have to make itperfect and it doesn't have to
be full.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
I love that.
Speaker 4 (22:40):
I actually will say the writing samples are my
favorite and the behavior charts, and then from that you can
start adding yes, the writing'seasy, I just put holes in it.
I will either make a copy of itand send one home or put holes
in it and put in the binder.
But even as a parent, I wish Ihad this for my children.
(23:01):
I would love this.
Not the behavior charts I wouldlook at those but the writing
it's like a storybook of theentire year and it's adorable.
Yeah, so that I would start.
Just don't think you have to doit all because we messed up in
the beginning it was hard.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
It was, yeah, I will say that.
Um, I had a teacher in ourbuildings child from last year,
and it happens to be one ofthose children that goes home
and you say how was your day?
And they go good and they haveno information whatsoever.
And she said that when she sawher binder, she cried because it
showed there was writing andthere was.
You know the behavior chartsand artwork.
(23:40):
Yeah, there were art, there wasartwork in there and she said I
just had a whole overlay of whatthe year he had done when it
comes home separately one pieceat a time.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
You look at it, you put it on the fridge.
Yeah, it's not the same.
It's not the same.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
And we have put in pictures of the kids We've had.
It's almost like an autographbook at the end of the year,
yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
So they'll autograph.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
We'll put pictures of everybody in the class so that
they get that.
So hopefully they can keep itand you have it, just like you
said you'd had it for your kids.
So it's for them to take home,which is a nice end of the year
thing.
Parents appreciate it then, andthen all year, like we said, we
use it all the time.
Now again, it wasn't easy tobegin with because in today's
(24:26):
teaching world it's justsomething extra, but it doesn't
turn out to be once you commit.
I'm going to use this and Iknow teachers that use it and it
does work and the kids can doit.
Like she said, the dropping ofthe binder and 50,000 sheets
going all over the floor ismildly frustrating.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
And it happens, yes.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Yeah, and the three ring thingy is click, click,
click, click, click Boy.
That's so much fun when you getit out, but it doesn't.
It will go away.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
And it is amazing if you we did have fifth grade do.
Miss Autumn Thomas didleadership binders in the fifth
grade.
So if you're listening outthere, this is a second grade
perspective you can get on ourpodcast leadership binders at
the older level, but small, andthen her and her cooperating
teacher grew with every year.
So, um.
So just take that advice.
(25:10):
Like you don't have to startwith this masterpiece, you know,
of a binder, to start withsomething small, grow each year.
If you'd like more informationabout that, you can email us and
(25:32):
we would love to hook you upwith any of our teachers here
that do them and can help youget started.
So please, please, do that,please do that if you're
interested in this.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
All right.
Well, I think that we're aboutout of time, so again we want to
thank Mrs Jones and Mrs Zephyrfor being here with us today.
Thank you for listening to ourshow.
We would love to hear from you.
Look for us on Facebook orInstagram or email us at
PBISjourneytogenius at gmailcom.
This is Diane Farrell and thisis Diane Ruff.
You have been listening to PBIS.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Journey to.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Genius, thank you.
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