October 21, 2025 • 38 mins
The Peace & Prosperity Podcast is a bi-weekly conversation with Jason Phillips, LCSW, licensed therapist and confidence expert in Raleigh, NC, discussing all things related to self-love and self-confidence, and how we can improve ourselves personally and professionally.
A quiet truth hides behind many “I’m fine” smiles: survival isn’t success.
Dr. Ulanda Phillips shares her journey from early marriage and domestic abuse to a life grounded in faith, boundaries, and self-worth. She opens up about red flags ignored, the cost of silence, and choosing peace over performance.
We explore how shifting from people-pleasing to self-respect transformed her life, the power of her “Feather” metaphor, and practical ways to spot patterns, set boundaries, and heal through writing and reflection.
If you’re navigating burnout, heartbreak, or trauma, this conversation offers language, tools, and hope to help you rebuild—anchored in truth and peace.
Plus, remember to join our podcast community—like, share, subscribe, and let us know what topics you want us to cover next. Engage with us, send a DM, or leave a review. Let's continue this journey towards peace and prosperity together.
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Visit Jason's website for a consultation:
Website -https://www.jasonlphillips.com
To book Jason to speak to your team or organization:
https://peaceprosperitycoaching.hbportal.co/public/660d8068c9d2d600253b215b/1-Inquiry
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
And then with the book, um, there were so many
different chapters of my life.
Um, there were so many thingsthat happened that writing this
book, I didn't realize that Iwasn't healed and I hadn't
forgiven because there were somechapters and some things that I
was writing, and it broke medown.
SPEAKER_02 (00:24):
Welcome to the Peace and Prosperity Podcast, where we
talk mental wellness,confidence, and real life tools
to help high achievers thrive.
I'm your host, Jason Phillips,licensed therapist, speaker,
coach.
I'm glad you're here.
Let's get into the episode.
Y'all, welcome back to anotherepisode of the Peace and
(00:46):
Prosperity Podcast.
I got an amazing guest today.
Family.
My favorite cousin.
SPEAKER_00 (00:55):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (00:55):
We call her Pookie, but she's better known as Miss
Yolanda Marie Phillips cuz.
SPEAKER_00 (01:01):
Hi, everybody.
Hello.
SPEAKER_02 (01:03):
So happy, so happy.
Dr.
Yolanda Marie Phillips.
Let me not let me not forgetthat, right?
Because I know how it's gonnabe.
Introduce yourself though.
Let everybody know who you are.
SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
I am Dr.
Apostle Yolanda Phillips.
I am Jason's cousin.
We're our first cousins, andhe's actually my favorite.
So we have a lot of funtogether.
We talk a lot.
So yeah, here I am finally onhis podcast.
Yeah.
It's been a long time coming.
So I'm excited to be here.
SPEAKER_02 (01:31):
I'm excited to be here too.
Um, it's so funny because it'sso there's so many things I can
ask you, and I'm just thinkingwhere to start.
And the reason why I wanted youto come on here is because of
your spirit.
Oh I mean, yes, you family, youmy favorite cuz, but I don't
just have anybody on here.
So, but your spirit is sorefreshing.
SPEAKER_00 (01:52):
Amen.
To God be the glory.
SPEAKER_02 (01:54):
And I think we we all want to know like how to,
well, one, how were you alwaysjust peaceful, or is that
something that you had to worktowards?
SPEAKER_00 (02:04):
Listen, I was still Pooky from the block back in the
day.
So that had to be truly, it tooka lot of work.
You know, it took a lot of workfor me to get to the place that
things didn't bother me.
It took a lot of work for me notto retaliate on things.
Because trust me, sometimespeople would see me and say,
even my kids sometimes will say,Mom, how does, you know, how do
(02:25):
you do that?
Like, how does somebody dosomething to you and you don't
res, and a lot of things I hadto take it in prayer.
I had to really focus on that,you know.
And over life, you learn, youknow, you live and you learn.
SPEAKER_02 (02:36):
And you are, you know, you have four kids.
Some of my favorite cousins,too.
And you've been married beforetoo.
SPEAKER_00 (02:44):
Yeah.
Yeah, I have.
And they were not all.
Let me just say this it was alesson learned.
They were lessons learned.
My last, my latest husband,should I say, and I know that
sound bad.
Like, how many times you didn'tmean?
Anyway, young age, life justtaught me.
My late husband passed away.
And and that was an experiencewithin itself.
(03:06):
So I learned how to adapt.
I learned how to just exist.
I learned how to take care, youknow, of a husband.
But what I didn't do, I didn'tmarry for love.
And that's the biggest mistakethat I think one could ever do.
SPEAKER_02 (03:22):
Can you expound expound on that a little bit?
SPEAKER_00 (03:25):
So we marry for situations sometimes.
We marry for some people marryfor money, some people marry for
just the engagement.
You know, they marry for thehype or the statistics of just
being married.
The vows.
We hear the vows at theceremony, but we don't always
(03:45):
take them seriously in the inthe marriage.
SPEAKER_02 (03:48):
Because how old were you?
Let's go back a little minute.
How old were you when you weretelling my age married the first
time?
SPEAKER_00 (03:54):
I was 18.
What?
I was 18, yes.
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (03:58):
Is that when y'all had on the white and the the the
wedding looked clean?
SPEAKER_00 (04:02):
I don't know which one that was.
SPEAKER_02 (04:05):
So at that time, 18 getting married, I mean, that's
a big deal.
SPEAKER_00 (04:08):
It is.
It it was at that time.
And I was young.
I just, I think I just did itbecause I was listening to the
older people.
Oh, well, y'all need to bemarried.
And and and besides that, I wasalready fresh high school
pregnant.
I was, and so when I gotmarried, it was a big thing in
the church, you know.
(04:29):
Back in those days, it was likeyou either got married, and this
was not the child's father, youknow.
But I learned through that.
I went through a lot, you know.
I went through a um, I have I'vehad an abusive relationship,
I've had a mental abusiverelationship, physical and a
stressful relationship, youknow.
So I had to learn.
I came a long way, and it wasn'tby myself.
(04:50):
The Lord did that for me.
SPEAKER_02 (04:52):
Now I didn't know that you were in an abusive
relationship.
SPEAKER_00 (04:55):
I was.
SPEAKER_02 (04:56):
How did you get out of it or how did you stay in it?
Because that's something thatpeople, you know, I've been a
therapist for almost 15 yearsnow.
And people, and maybe becauseI'm a man or just how what we're
they're coming in for, but werarely talk about somebody being
in an abusive relationship whilethey're in it.
(05:16):
So you were in it and youlearned to get out of it, or can
kind of walk us through theworld.
I was in it.
SPEAKER_00 (05:23):
I can honestly say being in it, I was young.
I didn't have the mindset, Ididn't have the resources that
we have today.
I didn't have the, I didn't havethe people, the, the support
team, the support system that Ihave, that we have today.
And it took me a long time toget fed up wanting to be in the
(05:43):
marriage, trying to do what'sright in God's eyesight, trying
to live right, trying to be thatwife.
And sometimes you have to get tothe point that you have to say,
listen, my life, my childrenmean more to me than just being
somewhere that I'm unhappy andI'm being physically and
(06:03):
mentally abused.
What kind of message is thatsending to my kids?
What is the per the perceptionfrom other people?
Like, I used to worry about allof those things.
But one day I got tired and gotfed up and said, No, I'm you
will not put your hands on meagain.
I don't care who it is.
And I and I got to that point.
But again, through prayer,because God was the only person
(06:24):
that made it easy.
SPEAKER_02 (06:25):
I was gonna ask, like, did people know you were
in an abusive relationship?
SPEAKER_00 (06:28):
Yeah, yeah, they knew.
They knew.
So I will say that it alwaysback in the day, it's just so
different from what it is now.
You were wrong for walking outon your marriage, you were wrong
for filing for divorce.
The wife has the and and let mesay this, let me clarify
something.
This is abuse is not a man or awoman thing.
(06:51):
Abuse is abuse.
It doesn't matter where it comesfrom, it's not right.
So, yeah, they knew and theykind of I kind of felt belittled
because I wanted to end themarriage.
I wanted to get out of it, youknow.
And I remember talking to um apastor that I was under back in
the day, and he said, Um, if Iknew this was happening, I would
(07:11):
have told you to leave a longtime ago.
SPEAKER_02 (07:14):
So and I kept things now your mindset seems like it's
changed a lot.
So kind of talk us through it.
Tell me like the difference inhow you think about being in a
relationship now as opposed towhen you were 18 in that abusive
relationship.
SPEAKER_00 (07:31):
I think now it's to the point that I see the flags.
Before I saw them and I didn'tacknowledge them.
So now I acknowledge the redflags.
SPEAKER_02 (07:41):
What were some of those flags that you would see
like from back then?
SPEAKER_00 (07:44):
The verbal abuse, the belittling, the physical
abuse, who wants to walk aroundwith a black eye?
You know, who wants to bechoked, who wants to be
mistreated.
SPEAKER_02 (07:56):
So, how did you heal from those things?
SPEAKER_00 (07:58):
I can tell you this.
It didn't happen overnight, butI had to be consistent in
praying.
I had to find a support team, asupport system, people that um
not so not necessarily they hadmy back, but had my mental
capacity in their mindset.
In other words, listen, we'renot gonna let you go down that
(08:19):
road again.
So if there were times that Iwanted to turn around, well,
maybe I was wrong, beingpersuaded, listening to other
people.
Sometimes you just gotta putyour foot down and say, listen,
I'm too good for that.
I'm I'm too good for that.
I don't deserve that.
SPEAKER_02 (08:32):
So the way you viewed yourself or view yourself
has changed significantly fromthe 18-year-old Yolanda to the
now 30-year-old.
SPEAKER_00 (08:43):
Yeah, absolutely.
I I can't even tell you.
It's to the point that my kids,my daughter always teased me,
she said, Mom, I they don't theyworry about me today still
because dating is hard, but Ihave zero tolerance and I don't
accept, I won't sell.
SPEAKER_02 (08:59):
So if you were to see some of those red flags now,
how would you address it?
SPEAKER_00 (09:04):
It's a one-shot call.
If I see the first red flag, I'mout.
I won't even entertain it.
Because when you are a giver andwhen you're a person that always
tries to see the bigger side ofother people, sometimes they use
that in against you and theytake advantage of that.
And so if I know that's aweakness for me, that's a
trigger.
And so for me, I know, up,that's it, cut it off.
(09:25):
Because what you allow and whatyou accept in the beginning is
more than likely it's what'sgonna continue.
And we're not doing that in2024.
unknown (09:34):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (09:34):
So it's not like you're gonna give this person,
okay, let me give them anotherchance to rectify that.
SPEAKER_00 (09:41):
Why should I?
I'm not obligated to.
And I know some people say,well, that's why she's gonna
stay by herself and things likethat.
And it's okay.
I've gotten to the place thatyou have to be all right with
being by yourself.
And when you're by yourself, youknow, you begin to see a lot of
things, you begin to findyourself.
Nobody can make you happy, onlyyou can make yourself happy.
(10:02):
And so a lot of times we getinto relationships thinking that
person is going to make us happyand we want the best wedding in
the world, we want the bestrelationship.
But sometimes we don't fixourselves first.
And so when we get into theserelationships, we carry a lot of
baggage and we carry a lot ofthe old issues, and then we
bring in the old relationshipswith us.
(10:24):
We can't do that anymore.
SPEAKER_02 (10:26):
So because you you jumped in, right?
Like out the gate saying, Hey,I'm married, it wasn't for love
before, and you took ownershipof that.
SPEAKER_00 (10:35):
I did.
SPEAKER_02 (10:35):
How did you even get to that place?
Because sometimes that take, Iknow that has to take work.
SPEAKER_00 (10:40):
It was something that just happened.
I I can't even tell you how orwhen, but at some point in time
I knew, okay, you know what?
This is not, this is not for me.
And even I want to say inministry, in just regular life,
you know, there are some thingsyou go to work.
There are some things that yourcoworkers may do or your boss
(11:02):
may do that's not acceptable toyou.
Are you gonna still deal withit?
Are you just gonna pacifyyourself or or put it up under
the the mat or the paper andjust ignore it?
Do you address it, or do youjust decide, listen, we have to
talk about this?
Do you accept it?
And that's the thing.
We we we become so acceptable ofbehaviors until we don't see the
(11:23):
damage that is causing us.
SPEAKER_02 (11:25):
So somebody I work with before said something
really powerful as far as likeaddressing something.
Is it an event or is it a trend?
SPEAKER_00 (11:35):
I think it's more of a I I guess it will be
determined who is coming from.
SPEAKER_02 (11:40):
You know what I'm saying?
Because I'm that's what I wantto ask you.
Like, how do you becausesometimes we struggle with
addressing something, especiallylike maybe you saw abuse growing
up, or maybe you're not thatperson who was just really
outspoken.
So you want to say something inyour mind, you're saying a whole
lot, but in real life, you'renot saying anything at all.
SPEAKER_00 (11:58):
Yeah, we become passive aggressive, and that's
what we we tolerate, you know,for a long time.
I would ignore things, and Iwould ignore them to the point
that um I no longer saw them,and that was damaging to me.
I saw the cheating, I saw this,I got the phone calls, I, you
know, all of this, but I didn'taddress it.
(12:21):
So for me, and I know peoplesay, oh, well, that's just this,
you will not know until you'vebeen there for a long time.
I had to figure out what is itthat Yolanda wants?
SPEAKER_01 (12:31):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:32):
What is it that Yolanda does not want?
You know, some people can say,Oh, I'll do this, this, that,
and I'm not gonna put up withthis, and I'm not gonna.
Sometimes it's easy to say whenyou are not in the situation and
that, you know, for a long timeyou are, well, hello there, sir.
How are you?
You're just coming.
Yes, sir.
Yes, sir.
(12:53):
I love snoop.
Snoop is me.
So I don't want to play rightnow.
I don't want to play.
But yeah, so sometimes you justhave to figure out, you know,
what it is that's gonna make youhappy, all in all.
When I say I accepted things, itwasn't because I had to.
It was because I didn't know anybetter and I didn't know what to
(13:14):
do.
I didn't know how the outcomewas gonna turn around.
I didn't know that later on inin life that it was gonna affect
me or it was gonna affect mychildren.
You know, there were differentthings that were that played a
part in all of that.
I believe strongly, and there'sa scripture, I can't call it
right now, but it says that, youknow, God will omit, he will
honor those that omit offenses.
And so hearing the old folkstalk about that, there were
(13:37):
certain things and certainperspectives behind that.
That doesn't necessarily meanthat you take the foolishness
from people, you take the abuse.
That does not mean that you haveto settle for anything.
We just don't want to wait onGod.
That is the main problem.
SPEAKER_02 (13:52):
Hey, I hope y'all listening.
So, cuz I want to ask you, youknow, you've seen a lot, you've
been through a lot.
SPEAKER_00 (13:59):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (14:00):
I want to get into the topic of being able to
forgive.
Because I don't, you know, whenwe talk, you often are not
bitter.
SPEAKER_00 (14:08):
No.
SPEAKER_02 (14:08):
Were you ever bitter about things that have happened
or things that you allowed orseen?
SPEAKER_00 (14:14):
I think for me, more so the hurt kind of camouflaged
the bitterness.
The hurt is what really took meto a different place mindset.
I had to really stop and thinkabout how much time, energy,
mental stress I allow to be putin being bitter, being not
(14:38):
forgiving.
That cost more time and energyin my life than just to forgive.
SPEAKER_02 (14:42):
So there was a time when you were bitter.
SPEAKER_00 (14:45):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
I can remember back in the day,I told you I was pooky from the
block.
I would drive my little car.
I literally, and I and I knowpeople are gonna say, why is she
saying this?
I literally, one relationship,let me just say this.
SPEAKER_02 (14:59):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (14:59):
When I caught the person cheating in my house, all
I know is they got in their carand I got in mine.
And before I know it, I was onthe lodge freeway.
And I literally tried to runthem off the road.
And I know then I had lost it.
And I said, never again will Iallow anybody to send me to that
(15:21):
point.
And I was still young, I wasstill young.
Nowadays, baby, I'm gonna pullover to the side and let them go
on by and just let them do whatthey do.
That's it.
I can't listen, too much stress,too much energy.
No, we ain't doing that.
SPEAKER_02 (15:34):
Yeah, no, this is good.
This is good.
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(15:57):
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(16:20):
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(16:42):
well-being.
So, yeah, we we getting into thetopic of forgiveness.
And the reason why, well, beforeI even get there, you said
something earlier that I gottago back to.
You said that you I think yousaid you ignored stuff to the
(17:05):
point where you didn't see itanymore.
What you mean by that?
SPEAKER_00 (17:09):
I saw it, I didn't acknowledge it, I didn't correct
it, I didn't even um think aboutit.
So it's almost like walking pasta stop sign and getting pulled
over because you didn't obey thestop sign.
SPEAKER_02 (17:24):
Yeah, like it's there, but you you've totally
erased it from your memory,suppressed it.
SPEAKER_00 (17:29):
I didn't erase it, but yeah, like more or less
suppressed.
And and even at that point, itreally wasn't suppressed because
when they weren't around, Ithought about it day and night.
SPEAKER_02 (17:39):
So I remember something you said to me a
couple years ago.
You know, sometimes people getupset with people, they may
block them, they may erase them.
And I actually shared this onInstagram because you said you
can erase them from your, what'dyou say, your phone, but they
still in your head?
Do you remember that?
What would you do?
SPEAKER_00 (17:58):
No, I don't remember, but it was something
like that.
SPEAKER_02 (18:02):
I gotta go back into my iTunes.
But that was so powerful becausepeople do, you know, we get
upset, we may block somebody orwe delete their number.
Yeah, but the memories are stillthere.
Absolutely.
And I hear that's what you'resaying, like, yeah, uh you
suppressed it, but the memorywas still there.
SPEAKER_00 (18:22):
Absolutely.
Yeah, absolutely.
And sometimes uh when we dothat, we create kind of like a
path that we stay on that samepath, and the same thing repeats
itself because we're doing thesame thing, we're taking the
same action and we're stillmoving in that same way.
Instead of, so some people say,and and and I applaud anybody
(18:45):
that can come in or that they gothrough these problems and they
nip it in the butt in the, youknow, in order to speak right
away.
But for some of us, we didn'thave strong support.
You know, we didn't have, we sawour parents go through things,
and it became like a learnedbehavior.
And so that was a downfall alongthe line.
SPEAKER_02 (19:05):
So now we're gonna we're gonna get into
forgiveness.
How do you define forgivenessand what does it mean to you
personally?
SPEAKER_00 (19:12):
Forgiveness for me is releasing it, it's becoming
in such a way, or in such a waythat I don't even think about it
anymore.
And it doesn't bother meanymore.
So for me, I don't allow thingsto penetrate me in that manner
anymore.
I'm not perfect, I'm not thisgreat person, I'm not any of
(19:36):
that, but I decide what I allowto linger in here.
SPEAKER_02 (19:40):
You talked about being abused, being in abusive
relationships.
I know you've had, you know,husband you lost.
How did you forgive what they'vedone to you?
SPEAKER_00 (19:49):
It was able, I was able to forgive them because I
stay in my word.
I stay um before the Lord.
That's who is the one that isresponsible for allowing me not
to hold everything.
So I know sometimes we say,okay, well, everybody don't
forgive like that.
And we're supposed to forgiveand forget.
If they look up Matthew chaptersix, actually verse 15, but you
(20:12):
can look up Matthew chapter sixand it'll go through the whole
act of forgiveness and showingyou how to forgive.
But to some people, forgivenesscomes in different measures.
It comes in different, differentforms for them.
Some people, such as myself, Ican forgive you quickly.
And the next time I see you, Iwon't even think about it.
There are some people who can'tforgive at all, or they forgive,
(20:33):
but they won't forget, or theyforgive and they get to a point
that I forgive them, but I don'twant to be around them.
I don't want to do anything withthem.
But for me, whatever measure youneed to take, if it's
counseling, if it's therapy, ifit's look at him, if it's just
embracing a new way to not allowcertain things to penetrate you,
(20:53):
to bother you, then by all meansdo it.
SPEAKER_02 (20:56):
Now, I know you also are a big writer too.
Did that help you withforgiveness?
SPEAKER_00 (21:01):
It did.
There was one book that I waswriting.
I haven't finished it yet, but Istarted writing it, and it's
called The Chambers Within theAbyss of My Heart.
And so this book, it was anillustration of a heart, a giant
heart, and it had the bloodvessels, the, but there were
chain links around each bloodvessel.
(21:22):
And each chain link representedan issue of life.
And so forgiveness was thebiggest thing.
And so I know that I try toplease God.
I'm not, you know, like I said,perfect, but I do strive to do,
you know, what I would think hewould be pleased with.
And so unforgiveness is just notan option for me.
I choose that.
(21:43):
The chain links represented somany aspects of life.
The abuse, how do I get overthat?
And I had to take that book andI had to sit and I wrote out
everything that happened in mylife.
There was the not only thephysical abuse, the mental
abuse, the psychological stress,there was rape.
(22:03):
There were so many things that Inever told anybody.
I had to take it to God.
There were things that I keptfrom my mother.
I can remember one day as achild.
I want to say I must have beenin the ninth grade, really and
truly.
And this is this is one for thebooks because I haven't shared
this.
This is going to be, it'sactually in the book.
I just haven't finished it.
(22:24):
I was coming home from schoolone day, and so I was walking
down Warren, um, near WarrenConnors area, but I was walking.
I went to Finney High School fora season, and I was walking, and
so one of my uncle's friendspulled up and he said, Hey, your
mom is sick and your dad andthem are at the hospital, and
your uncle told me to come andpick you up.
(22:44):
I'm so close to the house.
I didn't think anything of it.
And I knew this man as one of myuncle's great friends.
And so I believed him becausethere was no other reason why I
shouldn't believe him.
You know, he was over at thehouse all the time.
And so I got in the car and westarted going in a different
direction.
And so we um ended up, he tookme to there is a church on Van
(23:07):
Dyke.
I don't know the side street,but he pulled in the alley and
there was a garage back there.
And he made me get out the carand he dragged me in the garage
and he assaulted me in thegarage.
And I never ever forgot it.
And he took me right back andtold me, don't say anything, as
I'm gonna kill your mama.
I never, I was in the ninthgrade.
I never said a word.
(23:29):
And he dropped me right back atthe same place where he picked
me up at.
And I carried that for years.
When I say years, I never sharedthat because I was afraid that
he was actually gonna dosomething to my mother, you
know, and everything that I wentthrough, I think that's what
(23:49):
kind of helped me to, you know,I carried a lot of stuff.
And I didn't know how to, how doyou take things like that?
And so when people think I don'tunderstand, I understand.
When people think that, um, oh,you know, I have a reputation, I
honestly do.
People used to call me bougieall the time.
I'm like, why they calling mebougie, Lord?
I'm just like everybody else.
(24:10):
But I was one of those personsthat I used to let that bother
me, you know, but now I embraceit.
SPEAKER_02 (24:17):
I feel I gotta go back.
I mean, one, um, thank you forjust being so open and sharing.
God man, that's that had to be alot.
SPEAKER_00 (24:27):
It was.
SPEAKER_02 (24:28):
And just holding that and being able to work
through that.
Yeah, anybody from Detroit knowsWarren and Connor is not the
best area anyway.
SPEAKER_00 (24:38):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (24:38):
And then to experience that level of trauma
by somebody who you trusted andthought was somebody who had
your best interests at heart.
SPEAKER_00 (24:47):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (24:48):
And then to be able to talk about it today, yeah,
that definitely speaks toforgiveness.
SPEAKER_00 (24:53):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (24:53):
But how did you get to that point?
SPEAKER_00 (24:56):
Well, I will say at that age, it was so much going
on.
I never saw him again.
One, that that helped.
Two, I suppressed it.
You know, for years I suppressedit.
And when I began to talk aboutit, it was later with a doctor
that I talked about it.
And, you know, he was reallyunderstanding.
(25:19):
And actually, he encouraged meto talk to my mother about it.
But I never talked to her.
I started going to church.
I started going to church.
And when I tell you I laideverything at the altar, I laid
everything at the altar.
And then with the book, um,there were so many different
chapters of my life.
Um, there were so many thingsthat happened that writing this
book, I didn't realize that Iwasn't healed and I hadn't
(25:43):
forgiven because there were somechapters and some things that I
was writing and it broke medown.
I cried so hard.
There were times that I wassuicidal.
I didn't tell us all.
I was suicidal.
I literally had driven to the, Idon't know, the river walk.
I think where the where themiracle round is.
(26:03):
Right.
Okay.
Yeah.
And so, and I'm justfast-forwarding because there
are some pertinent things inthis book that I had to realize,
like, wow, kid, you've beenthrough some things.
And look where God has broughtyou from.
Look how He has delivered you.
Look how you begin to forgive,even forgive yourself.
And that's the biggest thing wedon't do.
We don't forgive ourselves.
And so, um, as I back up alittle bit, I literally went to
(26:25):
the river.
I was so distraught with all ofthis stuff.
I had crocodile tears that wereso big that I couldn't even see.
And so when I got to the rail,right, I was getting ready to
jump in and I heard look, and Icouldn't see.
Look again.
And when I looked, I could seethe ripples in the water, and I
(26:46):
could see the waves because itwas a choppy day, you know, the
you know, really hard waters.
And I saw this feather, it wasabout this long, white feather.
And I saw, and I began to hearthe Holy Spirit say, Look, and I
looked and he said, That's you.
I don't care how much the waterhad lapped over the feather, I
(27:09):
don't care how much the currentwas going, I don't care how much
the water just rocked back andforth.
That feather stayed on top ofthe water, never changed the
lane, never went out of sync.
It stayed in the same formation.
And the Holy Spirit, like,that's you.
Never ever move out of the way.
(27:31):
Stay right where you are.
That's you.
And so I named one of thechapters of my book, The
Feather.
And so that is where I got thatfrom because there are some
things that's gonna happen tous, no matter how hard things
are coming at us, no how nomatter how many times I there's
another thing I call the rippleeffect.
No matter how many times thatripple effect, the the issues of
(27:51):
life keep coming at you and keeptaking you back in a circular
motion, and we keep goingthrough the same thing over and
over again.
Stay in formation, just like thefeather.
SPEAKER_02 (28:02):
So you have writing.
Yeah, definitely God.
Yes, the doctor was amazing.
They helped you talk aboutthings.
And that was as ironic, that wasa male provider, too.
SPEAKER_00 (28:14):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (28:15):
Now, was he a physician or was this a
therapist?
SPEAKER_00 (28:17):
He was a physician.
SPEAKER_02 (28:18):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (28:19):
He was a physician, and um, he was very kind.
I was able um to talk to him.
I was just going for a checkup,and nothing had happened.
It was my turn to go for acheckup.
I think I needed a physical orsomething for school.
And then he said, Is thereanything else?
And I just said, I just need totalk to you.
And he was, you know, he satknee to knee.
It was not like it is today.
Well, we do still have doctorstoday that do, you know, we'll
(28:41):
sit with you.
But he really sat there andlistened.
He literally had tears in hiseyes, you know, when I began to
speak with him.
And at a young age, he I said,My mom doesn't know.
He said, Well, you know, by law,I'm supposed to, you know, talk
to protective services andthings like that.
And I begged him.
So I think he did anyway, butbecause they came to the school
(29:02):
and they did talk to me, I Igave them the information about
my uncle's friend, but you know,they did talk with my mom, but
she never said anything to me.
She just she embraced me eventhe more, you know, and she was
very, very protective.
She's very cautious, you know,with me.
She, you know, it was like,listen, if you go on, I'm going
(29:23):
with you, or you don't, youknow, I didn't go anywhere by
myself, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (29:27):
So and then knowing, you know, your dad, my uncles,
if they would have known.
SPEAKER_00 (29:32):
I think my dad would have been running to jail right
now.
He literally would have.
And they he was alive, you know.
So I but I never talked to him.
And I was a daddy's girl.
I tell my daddy everything.
But because of the protectionfor them, I kept it.
But when I talked to the doctor,he did not um, he didn't make me
feel bad.
My mom, when when they, I guesswhen um protective services
(29:54):
really um talked to her,everything was allegedly because
there was no person, theycouldn't find the person, it was
no.
You know, but they knew who itwas.
My uncle knew who it was.
SPEAKER_02 (30:03):
So if somebody were is listening and they maybe have
struggled with trauma assaultand they haven't shared
anything, what would you howwould you advise them or what
would you say to that personlistening?
SPEAKER_00 (30:14):
I would tell them to find someone that they sometimes
it's hard to say find peoplethat you trust because sometimes
people that you trust um may notalways be trustworthy, if that
makes sense.
Um I didn't want to tell anotherfamily member, you know.
I told somebody that didn't knowme and really didn't know my
family, you know.
(30:36):
For me, that's what I did.
However they um, you know, theylook at the situation, if they
if they have to find somebody totalk to, two things.
Let it be someone that they arecomfortable with and someone
that they will be able to comeback and see again, you know, or
(30:57):
they'll be able to really sitdown and and really express
everything, not somebody that'sgonna, you know, have them feel
like they're at fault or youshouldn't have did this and you
should because normally I hearthat.
Well, nowadays these young girlsdoing this and doing well, they
shouldn't have did this, andthey don't shouldn't get in the
car.
Yeah.
So for me, it was somebody thatI was used to seeing on a
(31:19):
regular basis.
You know what I'm saying?
It was somebody that I trusted.
My family trusted.
You understand what I'm saying?
So I would just advise them tofind someone that they feel
comfortable.
If it's the doctor, if it's apsychiatrist, if it's a
therapist, um, someone in theprofessional field, I would I
would encourage.
SPEAKER_02 (31:40):
Now, is therapy something that you've done and
and has it been helpful or nothelpful for you?
SPEAKER_00 (31:45):
I've never had therapy.
I've never had therapy.
I prayed, and when I tell you,when I gave everything to God,
when I really gave him a yes andreally put everything on the
altar, I didn't have to go back.
And sometimes you don't have tobe at church to have your own
altar.
You can pray in your floor, youcan, you know, talk to God.
He's always listening.
(32:05):
You know, I literally built up arelationship with him through
all of that.
SPEAKER_02 (32:09):
Now I gotta ask, how come you haven't been in
therapy?
SPEAKER_00 (32:13):
Well, there was really no need.
After everything, because therewas a a refreshing, right?
There was such a forgiveness andthere was such an openness that
whenever I thought about it,whenever you know, I f I I would
never feel bad anymore.
I would never um get to a placethat I wanted to, you know, take
(32:36):
revenge.
There are some things that if Icould do differently, I would,
but in learning, I had to figureout a way to help me survive
here.
And the only thing for me wasGod.
SPEAKER_02 (32:48):
Now I respect that.
It's just we, you know, some ofus are hearing that, okay, I
only can pray, or that's what'sgonna help, and then prayer is
not working, or it's not workingfast enough.
SPEAKER_00 (33:00):
Well, here's the thing
timing.
So sometimes certain situationswill have you um still waiting
and still listening, like it'sGod hearing me hears.
There are some times that Ididn't know what to do until
when the Lord did whatever hedid, I knew it was him because
(33:22):
it was, it was without a doubt.
For me.
SPEAKER_01 (33:24):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (33:25):
Now everybody does things in their own way.
You know, everybody perceivesthings, they they they take
things in their own measures,but for me, that's that's what
helped me.
That's what worked for me.
And there's, I don't even thinkabout things.
There are some people that havedone some horrible things to me.
I'm not perfect, I probably havedone some stuff to people too,
but for me, I don't even thinkabout it.
(33:46):
You know what I'm saying?
Like, gosh, I can't believe Iwent through that.
Oh my God, I got over that, youknow.
So, and over the time, somethings are not even meant for
you to even dwell on it.
It's just a lesson learned.
Like, what did you get out ofthat?
You know what I'm saying?
Did you repeat it?
SPEAKER_02 (34:00):
Are there any like specific principles that you
live by or go by to continue tolive and love the way you do?
SPEAKER_00 (34:08):
I can only tell you, I have to stay in my word.
I have to keep um myrelationship with God.
I for me, that's what works forme.
SPEAKER_02 (34:18):
And I hear you saying for me, is that because
you want to make sure that if itdoesn't work for somebody else,
you're not it's not necessarilyif it doesn't work for somebody
else, because God's gonna dowhat he's gonna do regardless.
SPEAKER_00 (34:28):
He's God, he's almighty, he's gonna do it.
Some people may not believe inGod.
And then there are some peoplethat have turned to the point
that they don't want to hearanything about God.
So if they're not listening orthey don't want to have anything
to do with God, unfortunately,that's that's really
unfortunate.
Um, they may find other ways.
Some people go to they use othermeasures to help them get over
(34:49):
things, you know.
Yeah, so I mean, to each itsown.
Um, but I would encourage them.
And then I had to repent.
I there were times that I hadfeelings and emotions and stuff
that weren't natural.
I had to repent.
And, you know, God, I don't meanto feel, I don't want to feel
like this.
I don't want to, you know, Idon't want to hurt them.
I don't want anybody to hurt,you know, I don't want to
(35:10):
retaliate on anybody else.
And and and there were timesthat I had to sit back and say,
listen, what are you gonna doabout it?
Like I said, even trying to runthose people off the road during
that time, I had to repent forthat.
Like, literally, this was somegangster stuff.
Like, what am I doing?
SPEAKER_02 (35:27):
And even, even I'm thinking too, when you say you
were at the point where you weresuicidal, and then thinking,
like, okay, if you jump, whatdoes this mean for you, your
family at the time?
SPEAKER_00 (35:39):
I didn't think about my family.
I didn't think about anything.
I could only think about that.
I didn't want to feel this painand I had to end this pain.
I didn't want it anymore.
And so some people would say,Well, where's all your prayers
and stuff?
Or what happens?
I wasn't hearing from Godbecause I wasn't in the mindset
that I could hear from him.
I wasn't in the mindset that Iwanted to do what's right.
(35:59):
I just wanted to do whatever itwas gonna take to get me out of
this pain.
But then I had to pray.
You know, I really wasn'tpraying.
I was letting the situationsoverwhelm me.
I became so enraged with justending it all.
I I really wasn't thinking aboutmy family.
Yeah, you know, and I had torepent about that, you know,
(36:19):
because that's not, you know,something that we would want to
do.
There are people who want lives,want their lives.
There are people dying fromdiseases every day.
There are people who um havebeen um going through things
that didn't have the option tosay whether they live or die.
And that wasn't fair, thatwasn't right, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (36:37):
So, cuz what do you see as being next for you in
your life?
SPEAKER_00 (36:42):
Well, I will say I'm moving in silence.
Let me just say that.
Just just keep an eye out.
Relationship-wise, I will saythat uh there are some things in
the making.
So I'm excited.
Let me just say that.
I'm excited.
SPEAKER_02 (36:56):
I can tell, I can tell.
And I was gonna ask you this.
I want to end on on this notebecause you have been through
different, you know, trials,tribulations, hardships, but you
don't seem like you've given upon.
SPEAKER_00 (37:09):
No, I have not.
Love is love.
I would say the right love won'tlet you give up.
SPEAKER_02 (37:18):
And I don't think we can end on a better note.
And because I really appreciatehaving you.
SPEAKER_00 (37:24):
I appreciate being here.
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_02 (37:27):
Yeah, y'all, we have wrapped up another episode of
the Peace and ProsperityPodcast.
Yes.
And as always, be blessed.
SPEAKER_00 (37:34):
Be blessed.
SPEAKER_02 (37:35):
Peace.
Good night.
Thanks for tuning in to thePeace and Prosperity Podcast.
If today's episode brought youclarity, encouragement, or even
a moment of calm, share it withsomeone who needs to hear it
too.
Your support helps us keep theseconversations going.
(37:57):
And remember, you don't have todo it all alone.
If you're navigating stress,burnout, or just need a space to
reset, I'm here to support you.
Connect with me atjasonlphillips.com or send me a
message on social media.
Until next time, protect yourpeace, pursue your purpose, and
(38:20):
keep showing up for you.
Be blessed.
And then with the book, um, there were so many
different chapters of my life.
Um, there were so many thingsthat happened that writing this
book, I didn't realize that Iwasn't healed and I hadn't
forgiven because there were somechapters and some things that I
was writing, and it broke medown.
SPEAKER_02 (00:24):
Welcome to the Peace and Prosperity Podcast, where we
talk mental wellness,confidence, and real life tools
to help high achievers thrive.
I'm your host, Jason Phillips,licensed therapist, speaker,
coach.
I'm glad you're here.
Let's get into the episode.
Y'all, welcome back to anotherepisode of the Peace and
(00:46):
Prosperity Podcast.
I got an amazing guest today.
Family.
My favorite cousin.
SPEAKER_00 (00:55):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (00:55):
We call her Pookie, but she's better known as Miss
Yolanda Marie Phillips cuz.
SPEAKER_00 (01:01):
Hi, everybody.
Hello.
SPEAKER_02 (01:03):
So happy, so happy.
Dr.
Yolanda Marie Phillips.
Let me not let me not forgetthat, right?
Because I know how it's gonnabe.
Introduce yourself though.
Let everybody know who you are.
SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
I am Dr.
Apostle Yolanda Phillips.
I am Jason's cousin.
We're our first cousins, andhe's actually my favorite.
So we have a lot of funtogether.
We talk a lot.
So yeah, here I am finally onhis podcast.
Yeah.
It's been a long time coming.
So I'm excited to be here.
SPEAKER_02 (01:31):
I'm excited to be here too.
Um, it's so funny because it'sso there's so many things I can
ask you, and I'm just thinkingwhere to start.
And the reason why I wanted youto come on here is because of
your spirit.
Oh I mean, yes, you family, youmy favorite cuz, but I don't
just have anybody on here.
So, but your spirit is sorefreshing.
SPEAKER_00 (01:52):
Amen.
To God be the glory.
SPEAKER_02 (01:54):
And I think we we all want to know like how to,
well, one, how were you alwaysjust peaceful, or is that
something that you had to worktowards?
SPEAKER_00 (02:04):
Listen, I was still Pooky from the block back in the
day.
So that had to be truly, it tooka lot of work.
You know, it took a lot of workfor me to get to the place that
things didn't bother me.
It took a lot of work for me notto retaliate on things.
Because trust me, sometimespeople would see me and say,
even my kids sometimes will say,Mom, how does, you know, how do
(02:25):
you do that?
Like, how does somebody dosomething to you and you don't
res, and a lot of things I hadto take it in prayer.
I had to really focus on that,you know.
And over life, you learn, youknow, you live and you learn.
SPEAKER_02 (02:36):
And you are, you know, you have four kids.
Some of my favorite cousins,too.
And you've been married beforetoo.
SPEAKER_00 (02:44):
Yeah.
Yeah, I have.
And they were not all.
Let me just say this it was alesson learned.
They were lessons learned.
My last, my latest husband,should I say, and I know that
sound bad.
Like, how many times you didn'tmean?
Anyway, young age, life justtaught me.
My late husband passed away.
And and that was an experiencewithin itself.
(03:06):
So I learned how to adapt.
I learned how to just exist.
I learned how to take care, youknow, of a husband.
But what I didn't do, I didn'tmarry for love.
And that's the biggest mistakethat I think one could ever do.
SPEAKER_02 (03:22):
Can you expound expound on that a little bit?
SPEAKER_00 (03:25):
So we marry for situations sometimes.
We marry for some people marryfor money, some people marry for
just the engagement.
You know, they marry for thehype or the statistics of just
being married.
The vows.
We hear the vows at theceremony, but we don't always
(03:45):
take them seriously in the inthe marriage.
SPEAKER_02 (03:48):
Because how old were you?
Let's go back a little minute.
How old were you when you weretelling my age married the first
time?
SPEAKER_00 (03:54):
I was 18.
What?
I was 18, yes.
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (03:58):
Is that when y'all had on the white and the the the
wedding looked clean?
SPEAKER_00 (04:02):
I don't know which one that was.
SPEAKER_02 (04:05):
So at that time, 18 getting married, I mean, that's
a big deal.
SPEAKER_00 (04:08):
It is.
It it was at that time.
And I was young.
I just, I think I just did itbecause I was listening to the
older people.
Oh, well, y'all need to bemarried.
And and and besides that, I wasalready fresh high school
pregnant.
I was, and so when I gotmarried, it was a big thing in
the church, you know.
(04:29):
Back in those days, it was likeyou either got married, and this
was not the child's father, youknow.
But I learned through that.
I went through a lot, you know.
I went through a um, I have I'vehad an abusive relationship,
I've had a mental abusiverelationship, physical and a
stressful relationship, youknow.
So I had to learn.
I came a long way, and it wasn'tby myself.
(04:50):
The Lord did that for me.
SPEAKER_02 (04:52):
Now I didn't know that you were in an abusive
relationship.
SPEAKER_00 (04:55):
I was.
SPEAKER_02 (04:56):
How did you get out of it or how did you stay in it?
Because that's something thatpeople, you know, I've been a
therapist for almost 15 yearsnow.
And people, and maybe becauseI'm a man or just how what we're
they're coming in for, but werarely talk about somebody being
in an abusive relationship whilethey're in it.
(05:16):
So you were in it and youlearned to get out of it, or can
kind of walk us through theworld.
I was in it.
SPEAKER_00 (05:23):
I can honestly say being in it, I was young.
I didn't have the mindset, Ididn't have the resources that
we have today.
I didn't have the, I didn't havethe people, the, the support
team, the support system that Ihave, that we have today.
And it took me a long time toget fed up wanting to be in the
(05:43):
marriage, trying to do what'sright in God's eyesight, trying
to live right, trying to be thatwife.
And sometimes you have to get tothe point that you have to say,
listen, my life, my childrenmean more to me than just being
somewhere that I'm unhappy andI'm being physically and
(06:03):
mentally abused.
What kind of message is thatsending to my kids?
What is the per the perceptionfrom other people?
Like, I used to worry about allof those things.
But one day I got tired and gotfed up and said, No, I'm you
will not put your hands on meagain.
I don't care who it is.
And I and I got to that point.
But again, through prayer,because God was the only person
(06:24):
that made it easy.
SPEAKER_02 (06:25):
I was gonna ask, like, did people know you were
in an abusive relationship?
SPEAKER_00 (06:28):
Yeah, yeah, they knew.
They knew.
So I will say that it alwaysback in the day, it's just so
different from what it is now.
You were wrong for walking outon your marriage, you were wrong
for filing for divorce.
The wife has the and and let mesay this, let me clarify
something.
This is abuse is not a man or awoman thing.
(06:51):
Abuse is abuse.
It doesn't matter where it comesfrom, it's not right.
So, yeah, they knew and theykind of I kind of felt belittled
because I wanted to end themarriage.
I wanted to get out of it, youknow.
And I remember talking to um apastor that I was under back in
the day, and he said, Um, if Iknew this was happening, I would
(07:11):
have told you to leave a longtime ago.
SPEAKER_02 (07:14):
So and I kept things now your mindset seems like it's
changed a lot.
So kind of talk us through it.
Tell me like the difference inhow you think about being in a
relationship now as opposed towhen you were 18 in that abusive
relationship.
SPEAKER_00 (07:31):
I think now it's to the point that I see the flags.
Before I saw them and I didn'tacknowledge them.
So now I acknowledge the redflags.
SPEAKER_02 (07:41):
What were some of those flags that you would see
like from back then?
SPEAKER_00 (07:44):
The verbal abuse, the belittling, the physical
abuse, who wants to walk aroundwith a black eye?
You know, who wants to bechoked, who wants to be
mistreated.
SPEAKER_02 (07:56):
So, how did you heal from those things?
SPEAKER_00 (07:58):
I can tell you this.
It didn't happen overnight, butI had to be consistent in
praying.
I had to find a support team, asupport system, people that um
not so not necessarily they hadmy back, but had my mental
capacity in their mindset.
In other words, listen, we'renot gonna let you go down that
(08:19):
road again.
So if there were times that Iwanted to turn around, well,
maybe I was wrong, beingpersuaded, listening to other
people.
Sometimes you just gotta putyour foot down and say, listen,
I'm too good for that.
I'm I'm too good for that.
I don't deserve that.
SPEAKER_02 (08:32):
So the way you viewed yourself or view yourself
has changed significantly fromthe 18-year-old Yolanda to the
now 30-year-old.
SPEAKER_00 (08:43):
Yeah, absolutely.
I I can't even tell you.
It's to the point that my kids,my daughter always teased me,
she said, Mom, I they don't theyworry about me today still
because dating is hard, but Ihave zero tolerance and I don't
accept, I won't sell.
SPEAKER_02 (08:59):
So if you were to see some of those red flags now,
how would you address it?
SPEAKER_00 (09:04):
It's a one-shot call.
If I see the first red flag, I'mout.
I won't even entertain it.
Because when you are a giver andwhen you're a person that always
tries to see the bigger side ofother people, sometimes they use
that in against you and theytake advantage of that.
And so if I know that's aweakness for me, that's a
trigger.
And so for me, I know, up,that's it, cut it off.
(09:25):
Because what you allow and whatyou accept in the beginning is
more than likely it's what'sgonna continue.
And we're not doing that in2024.
unknown (09:34):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (09:34):
So it's not like you're gonna give this person,
okay, let me give them anotherchance to rectify that.
SPEAKER_00 (09:41):
Why should I?
I'm not obligated to.
And I know some people say,well, that's why she's gonna
stay by herself and things likethat.
And it's okay.
I've gotten to the place thatyou have to be all right with
being by yourself.
And when you're by yourself, youknow, you begin to see a lot of
things, you begin to findyourself.
Nobody can make you happy, onlyyou can make yourself happy.
(10:02):
And so a lot of times we getinto relationships thinking that
person is going to make us happyand we want the best wedding in
the world, we want the bestrelationship.
But sometimes we don't fixourselves first.
And so when we get into theserelationships, we carry a lot of
baggage and we carry a lot ofthe old issues, and then we
bring in the old relationshipswith us.
(10:24):
We can't do that anymore.
SPEAKER_02 (10:26):
So because you you jumped in, right?
Like out the gate saying, Hey,I'm married, it wasn't for love
before, and you took ownershipof that.
SPEAKER_00 (10:35):
I did.
SPEAKER_02 (10:35):
How did you even get to that place?
Because sometimes that take, Iknow that has to take work.
SPEAKER_00 (10:40):
It was something that just happened.
I I can't even tell you how orwhen, but at some point in time
I knew, okay, you know what?
This is not, this is not for me.
And even I want to say inministry, in just regular life,
you know, there are some thingsyou go to work.
There are some things that yourcoworkers may do or your boss
(11:02):
may do that's not acceptable toyou.
Are you gonna still deal withit?
Are you just gonna pacifyyourself or or put it up under
the the mat or the paper andjust ignore it?
Do you address it, or do youjust decide, listen, we have to
talk about this?
Do you accept it?
And that's the thing.
We we we become so acceptable ofbehaviors until we don't see the
(11:23):
damage that is causing us.
SPEAKER_02 (11:25):
So somebody I work with before said something
really powerful as far as likeaddressing something.
Is it an event or is it a trend?
SPEAKER_00 (11:35):
I think it's more of a I I guess it will be
determined who is coming from.
SPEAKER_02 (11:40):
You know what I'm saying?
Because I'm that's what I wantto ask you.
Like, how do you becausesometimes we struggle with
addressing something, especiallylike maybe you saw abuse growing
up, or maybe you're not thatperson who was just really
outspoken.
So you want to say something inyour mind, you're saying a whole
lot, but in real life, you'renot saying anything at all.
SPEAKER_00 (11:58):
Yeah, we become passive aggressive, and that's
what we we tolerate, you know,for a long time.
I would ignore things, and Iwould ignore them to the point
that um I no longer saw them,and that was damaging to me.
I saw the cheating, I saw this,I got the phone calls, I, you
know, all of this, but I didn'taddress it.
(12:21):
So for me, and I know peoplesay, oh, well, that's just this,
you will not know until you'vebeen there for a long time.
I had to figure out what is itthat Yolanda wants?
SPEAKER_01 (12:31):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:32):
What is it that Yolanda does not want?
You know, some people can say,Oh, I'll do this, this, that,
and I'm not gonna put up withthis, and I'm not gonna.
Sometimes it's easy to say whenyou are not in the situation and
that, you know, for a long timeyou are, well, hello there, sir.
How are you?
You're just coming.
Yes, sir.
Yes, sir.
(12:53):
I love snoop.
Snoop is me.
So I don't want to play rightnow.
I don't want to play.
But yeah, so sometimes you justhave to figure out, you know,
what it is that's gonna make youhappy, all in all.
When I say I accepted things, itwasn't because I had to.
It was because I didn't know anybetter and I didn't know what to
(13:14):
do.
I didn't know how the outcomewas gonna turn around.
I didn't know that later on inin life that it was gonna affect
me or it was gonna affect mychildren.
You know, there were differentthings that were that played a
part in all of that.
I believe strongly, and there'sa scripture, I can't call it
right now, but it says that, youknow, God will omit, he will
honor those that omit offenses.
And so hearing the old folkstalk about that, there were
(13:37):
certain things and certainperspectives behind that.
That doesn't necessarily meanthat you take the foolishness
from people, you take the abuse.
That does not mean that you haveto settle for anything.
We just don't want to wait onGod.
That is the main problem.
SPEAKER_02 (13:52):
Hey, I hope y'all listening.
So, cuz I want to ask you, youknow, you've seen a lot, you've
been through a lot.
SPEAKER_00 (13:59):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (14:00):
I want to get into the topic of being able to
forgive.
Because I don't, you know, whenwe talk, you often are not
bitter.
SPEAKER_00 (14:08):
No.
SPEAKER_02 (14:08):
Were you ever bitter about things that have happened
or things that you allowed orseen?
SPEAKER_00 (14:14):
I think for me, more so the hurt kind of camouflaged
the bitterness.
The hurt is what really took meto a different place mindset.
I had to really stop and thinkabout how much time, energy,
mental stress I allow to be putin being bitter, being not
(14:38):
forgiving.
That cost more time and energyin my life than just to forgive.
SPEAKER_02 (14:42):
So there was a time when you were bitter.
SPEAKER_00 (14:45):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
I can remember back in the day,I told you I was pooky from the
block.
I would drive my little car.
I literally, and I and I knowpeople are gonna say, why is she
saying this?
I literally, one relationship,let me just say this.
SPEAKER_02 (14:59):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (14:59):
When I caught the person cheating in my house, all
I know is they got in their carand I got in mine.
And before I know it, I was onthe lodge freeway.
And I literally tried to runthem off the road.
And I know then I had lost it.
And I said, never again will Iallow anybody to send me to that
(15:21):
point.
And I was still young, I wasstill young.
Nowadays, baby, I'm gonna pullover to the side and let them go
on by and just let them do whatthey do.
That's it.
I can't listen, too much stress,too much energy.
No, we ain't doing that.
SPEAKER_02 (15:34):
Yeah, no, this is good.
This is good.
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(15:57):
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(16:20):
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(16:42):
well-being.
So, yeah, we we getting into thetopic of forgiveness.
And the reason why, well, beforeI even get there, you said
something earlier that I gottago back to.
You said that you I think yousaid you ignored stuff to the
(17:05):
point where you didn't see itanymore.
What you mean by that?
SPEAKER_00 (17:09):
I saw it, I didn't acknowledge it, I didn't correct
it, I didn't even um think aboutit.
So it's almost like walking pasta stop sign and getting pulled
over because you didn't obey thestop sign.
SPEAKER_02 (17:24):
Yeah, like it's there, but you you've totally
erased it from your memory,suppressed it.
SPEAKER_00 (17:29):
I didn't erase it, but yeah, like more or less
suppressed.
And and even at that point, itreally wasn't suppressed because
when they weren't around, Ithought about it day and night.
SPEAKER_02 (17:39):
So I remember something you said to me a
couple years ago.
You know, sometimes people getupset with people, they may
block them, they may erase them.
And I actually shared this onInstagram because you said you
can erase them from your, what'dyou say, your phone, but they
still in your head?
Do you remember that?
What would you do?
SPEAKER_00 (17:58):
No, I don't remember, but it was something
like that.
SPEAKER_02 (18:02):
I gotta go back into my iTunes.
But that was so powerful becausepeople do, you know, we get
upset, we may block somebody orwe delete their number.
Yeah, but the memories are stillthere.
Absolutely.
And I hear that's what you'resaying, like, yeah, uh you
suppressed it, but the memorywas still there.
SPEAKER_00 (18:22):
Absolutely.
Yeah, absolutely.
And sometimes uh when we dothat, we create kind of like a
path that we stay on that samepath, and the same thing repeats
itself because we're doing thesame thing, we're taking the
same action and we're stillmoving in that same way.
Instead of, so some people say,and and and I applaud anybody
(18:45):
that can come in or that they gothrough these problems and they
nip it in the butt in the, youknow, in order to speak right
away.
But for some of us, we didn'thave strong support.
You know, we didn't have, we sawour parents go through things,
and it became like a learnedbehavior.
And so that was a downfall alongthe line.
SPEAKER_02 (19:05):
So now we're gonna we're gonna get into
forgiveness.
How do you define forgivenessand what does it mean to you
personally?
SPEAKER_00 (19:12):
Forgiveness for me is releasing it, it's becoming
in such a way, or in such a waythat I don't even think about it
anymore.
And it doesn't bother meanymore.
So for me, I don't allow thingsto penetrate me in that manner
anymore.
I'm not perfect, I'm not thisgreat person, I'm not any of
(19:36):
that, but I decide what I allowto linger in here.
SPEAKER_02 (19:40):
You talked about being abused, being in abusive
relationships.
I know you've had, you know,husband you lost.
How did you forgive what they'vedone to you?
SPEAKER_00 (19:49):
It was able, I was able to forgive them because I
stay in my word.
I stay um before the Lord.
That's who is the one that isresponsible for allowing me not
to hold everything.
So I know sometimes we say,okay, well, everybody don't
forgive like that.
And we're supposed to forgiveand forget.
If they look up Matthew chaptersix, actually verse 15, but you
(20:12):
can look up Matthew chapter sixand it'll go through the whole
act of forgiveness and showingyou how to forgive.
But to some people, forgivenesscomes in different measures.
It comes in different, differentforms for them.
Some people, such as myself, Ican forgive you quickly.
And the next time I see you, Iwon't even think about it.
There are some people who can'tforgive at all, or they forgive,
(20:33):
but they won't forget, or theyforgive and they get to a point
that I forgive them, but I don'twant to be around them.
I don't want to do anything withthem.
But for me, whatever measure youneed to take, if it's
counseling, if it's therapy, ifit's look at him, if it's just
embracing a new way to not allowcertain things to penetrate you,
(20:53):
to bother you, then by all meansdo it.
SPEAKER_02 (20:56):
Now, I know you also are a big writer too.
Did that help you withforgiveness?
SPEAKER_00 (21:01):
It did.
There was one book that I waswriting.
I haven't finished it yet, but Istarted writing it, and it's
called The Chambers Within theAbyss of My Heart.
And so this book, it was anillustration of a heart, a giant
heart, and it had the bloodvessels, the, but there were
chain links around each bloodvessel.
(21:22):
And each chain link representedan issue of life.
And so forgiveness was thebiggest thing.
And so I know that I try toplease God.
I'm not, you know, like I said,perfect, but I do strive to do,
you know, what I would think hewould be pleased with.
And so unforgiveness is just notan option for me.
I choose that.
(21:43):
The chain links represented somany aspects of life.
The abuse, how do I get overthat?
And I had to take that book andI had to sit and I wrote out
everything that happened in mylife.
There was the not only thephysical abuse, the mental
abuse, the psychological stress,there was rape.
(22:03):
There were so many things that Inever told anybody.
I had to take it to God.
There were things that I keptfrom my mother.
I can remember one day as achild.
I want to say I must have beenin the ninth grade, really and
truly.
And this is this is one for thebooks because I haven't shared
this.
This is going to be, it'sactually in the book.
I just haven't finished it.
(22:24):
I was coming home from schoolone day, and so I was walking
down Warren, um, near WarrenConnors area, but I was walking.
I went to Finney High School fora season, and I was walking, and
so one of my uncle's friendspulled up and he said, Hey, your
mom is sick and your dad andthem are at the hospital, and
your uncle told me to come andpick you up.
(22:44):
I'm so close to the house.
I didn't think anything of it.
And I knew this man as one of myuncle's great friends.
And so I believed him becausethere was no other reason why I
shouldn't believe him.
You know, he was over at thehouse all the time.
And so I got in the car and westarted going in a different
direction.
And so we um ended up, he tookme to there is a church on Van
(23:07):
Dyke.
I don't know the side street,but he pulled in the alley and
there was a garage back there.
And he made me get out the carand he dragged me in the garage
and he assaulted me in thegarage.
And I never ever forgot it.
And he took me right back andtold me, don't say anything, as
I'm gonna kill your mama.
I never, I was in the ninthgrade.
I never said a word.
(23:29):
And he dropped me right back atthe same place where he picked
me up at.
And I carried that for years.
When I say years, I never sharedthat because I was afraid that
he was actually gonna dosomething to my mother, you
know, and everything that I wentthrough, I think that's what
(23:49):
kind of helped me to, you know,I carried a lot of stuff.
And I didn't know how to, how doyou take things like that?
And so when people think I don'tunderstand, I understand.
When people think that, um, oh,you know, I have a reputation, I
honestly do.
People used to call me bougieall the time.
I'm like, why they calling mebougie, Lord?
I'm just like everybody else.
(24:10):
But I was one of those personsthat I used to let that bother
me, you know, but now I embraceit.
SPEAKER_02 (24:17):
I feel I gotta go back.
I mean, one, um, thank you forjust being so open and sharing.
God man, that's that had to be alot.
SPEAKER_00 (24:27):
It was.
SPEAKER_02 (24:28):
And just holding that and being able to work
through that.
Yeah, anybody from Detroit knowsWarren and Connor is not the
best area anyway.
SPEAKER_00 (24:38):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (24:38):
And then to experience that level of trauma
by somebody who you trusted andthought was somebody who had
your best interests at heart.
SPEAKER_00 (24:47):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (24:48):
And then to be able to talk about it today, yeah,
that definitely speaks toforgiveness.
SPEAKER_00 (24:53):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (24:53):
But how did you get to that point?
SPEAKER_00 (24:56):
Well, I will say at that age, it was so much going
on.
I never saw him again.
One, that that helped.
Two, I suppressed it.
You know, for years I suppressedit.
And when I began to talk aboutit, it was later with a doctor
that I talked about it.
And, you know, he was reallyunderstanding.
(25:19):
And actually, he encouraged meto talk to my mother about it.
But I never talked to her.
I started going to church.
I started going to church.
And when I tell you I laideverything at the altar, I laid
everything at the altar.
And then with the book, um,there were so many different
chapters of my life.
Um, there were so many thingsthat happened that writing this
book, I didn't realize that Iwasn't healed and I hadn't
(25:43):
forgiven because there were somechapters and some things that I
was writing and it broke medown.
I cried so hard.
There were times that I wassuicidal.
I didn't tell us all.
I was suicidal.
I literally had driven to the, Idon't know, the river walk.
I think where the where themiracle round is.
(26:03):
Right.
Okay.
Yeah.
And so, and I'm justfast-forwarding because there
are some pertinent things inthis book that I had to realize,
like, wow, kid, you've beenthrough some things.
And look where God has broughtyou from.
Look how He has delivered you.
Look how you begin to forgive,even forgive yourself.
And that's the biggest thing wedon't do.
We don't forgive ourselves.
And so, um, as I back up alittle bit, I literally went to
(26:25):
the river.
I was so distraught with all ofthis stuff.
I had crocodile tears that wereso big that I couldn't even see.
And so when I got to the rail,right, I was getting ready to
jump in and I heard look, and Icouldn't see.
Look again.
And when I looked, I could seethe ripples in the water, and I
(26:46):
could see the waves because itwas a choppy day, you know, the
you know, really hard waters.
And I saw this feather, it wasabout this long, white feather.
And I saw, and I began to hearthe Holy Spirit say, Look, and I
looked and he said, That's you.
I don't care how much the waterhad lapped over the feather, I
(27:09):
don't care how much the currentwas going, I don't care how much
the water just rocked back andforth.
That feather stayed on top ofthe water, never changed the
lane, never went out of sync.
It stayed in the same formation.
And the Holy Spirit, like,that's you.
Never ever move out of the way.
(27:31):
Stay right where you are.
That's you.
And so I named one of thechapters of my book, The
Feather.
And so that is where I got thatfrom because there are some
things that's gonna happen tous, no matter how hard things
are coming at us, no how nomatter how many times I there's
another thing I call the rippleeffect.
No matter how many times thatripple effect, the the issues of
(27:51):
life keep coming at you and keeptaking you back in a circular
motion, and we keep goingthrough the same thing over and
over again.
Stay in formation, just like thefeather.
SPEAKER_02 (28:02):
So you have writing.
Yeah, definitely God.
Yes, the doctor was amazing.
They helped you talk aboutthings.
And that was as ironic, that wasa male provider, too.
SPEAKER_00 (28:14):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (28:15):
Now, was he a physician or was this a
therapist?
SPEAKER_00 (28:17):
He was a physician.
SPEAKER_02 (28:18):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (28:19):
He was a physician, and um, he was very kind.
I was able um to talk to him.
I was just going for a checkup,and nothing had happened.
It was my turn to go for acheckup.
I think I needed a physical orsomething for school.
And then he said, Is thereanything else?
And I just said, I just need totalk to you.
And he was, you know, he satknee to knee.
It was not like it is today.
Well, we do still have doctorstoday that do, you know, we'll
(28:41):
sit with you.
But he really sat there andlistened.
He literally had tears in hiseyes, you know, when I began to
speak with him.
And at a young age, he I said,My mom doesn't know.
He said, Well, you know, by law,I'm supposed to, you know, talk
to protective services andthings like that.
And I begged him.
So I think he did anyway, butbecause they came to the school
(29:02):
and they did talk to me, I Igave them the information about
my uncle's friend, but you know,they did talk with my mom, but
she never said anything to me.
She just she embraced me eventhe more, you know, and she was
very, very protective.
She's very cautious, you know,with me.
She, you know, it was like,listen, if you go on, I'm going
(29:23):
with you, or you don't, youknow, I didn't go anywhere by
myself, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (29:27):
So and then knowing, you know, your dad, my uncles,
if they would have known.
SPEAKER_00 (29:32):
I think my dad would have been running to jail right
now.
He literally would have.
And they he was alive, you know.
So I but I never talked to him.
And I was a daddy's girl.
I tell my daddy everything.
But because of the protectionfor them, I kept it.
But when I talked to the doctor,he did not um, he didn't make me
feel bad.
My mom, when when they, I guesswhen um protective services
(29:54):
really um talked to her,everything was allegedly because
there was no person, theycouldn't find the person, it was
no.
You know, but they knew who itwas.
My uncle knew who it was.
SPEAKER_02 (30:03):
So if somebody were is listening and they maybe have
struggled with trauma assaultand they haven't shared
anything, what would you howwould you advise them or what
would you say to that personlistening?
SPEAKER_00 (30:14):
I would tell them to find someone that they sometimes
it's hard to say find peoplethat you trust because sometimes
people that you trust um may notalways be trustworthy, if that
makes sense.
Um I didn't want to tell anotherfamily member, you know.
I told somebody that didn't knowme and really didn't know my
family, you know.
(30:36):
For me, that's what I did.
However they um, you know, theylook at the situation, if they
if they have to find somebody totalk to, two things.
Let it be someone that they arecomfortable with and someone
that they will be able to comeback and see again, you know, or
(30:57):
they'll be able to really sitdown and and really express
everything, not somebody that'sgonna, you know, have them feel
like they're at fault or youshouldn't have did this and you
should because normally I hearthat.
Well, nowadays these young girlsdoing this and doing well, they
shouldn't have did this, andthey don't shouldn't get in the
car.
Yeah.
So for me, it was somebody thatI was used to seeing on a
(31:19):
regular basis.
You know what I'm saying?
It was somebody that I trusted.
My family trusted.
You understand what I'm saying?
So I would just advise them tofind someone that they feel
comfortable.
If it's the doctor, if it's apsychiatrist, if it's a
therapist, um, someone in theprofessional field, I would I
would encourage.
SPEAKER_02 (31:40):
Now, is therapy something that you've done and
and has it been helpful or nothelpful for you?
SPEAKER_00 (31:45):
I've never had therapy.
I've never had therapy.
I prayed, and when I tell you,when I gave everything to God,
when I really gave him a yes andreally put everything on the
altar, I didn't have to go back.
And sometimes you don't have tobe at church to have your own
altar.
You can pray in your floor, youcan, you know, talk to God.
He's always listening.
(32:05):
You know, I literally built up arelationship with him through
all of that.
SPEAKER_02 (32:09):
Now I gotta ask, how come you haven't been in
therapy?
SPEAKER_00 (32:13):
Well, there was really no need.
After everything, because therewas a a refreshing, right?
There was such a forgiveness andthere was such an openness that
whenever I thought about it,whenever you know, I f I I would
never feel bad anymore.
I would never um get to a placethat I wanted to, you know, take
(32:36):
revenge.
There are some things that if Icould do differently, I would,
but in learning, I had to figureout a way to help me survive
here.
And the only thing for me wasGod.
SPEAKER_02 (32:48):
Now I respect that.
It's just we, you know, some ofus are hearing that, okay, I
only can pray, or that's what'sgonna help, and then prayer is
not working, or it's not workingfast enough.
SPEAKER_00 (33:00):
Well, here's the thing
timing.
So sometimes certain situationswill have you um still waiting
and still listening, like it'sGod hearing me hears.
There are some times that Ididn't know what to do until
when the Lord did whatever hedid, I knew it was him because
(33:22):
it was, it was without a doubt.
For me.
SPEAKER_01 (33:24):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (33:25):
Now everybody does things in their own way.
You know, everybody perceivesthings, they they they take
things in their own measures,but for me, that's that's what
helped me.
That's what worked for me.
And there's, I don't even thinkabout things.
There are some people that havedone some horrible things to me.
I'm not perfect, I probably havedone some stuff to people too,
but for me, I don't even thinkabout it.
(33:46):
You know what I'm saying?
Like, gosh, I can't believe Iwent through that.
Oh my God, I got over that, youknow.
So, and over the time, somethings are not even meant for
you to even dwell on it.
It's just a lesson learned.
Like, what did you get out ofthat?
You know what I'm saying?
Did you repeat it?
SPEAKER_02 (34:00):
Are there any like specific principles that you
live by or go by to continue tolive and love the way you do?
SPEAKER_00 (34:08):
I can only tell you, I have to stay in my word.
I have to keep um myrelationship with God.
I for me, that's what works forme.
SPEAKER_02 (34:18):
And I hear you saying for me, is that because
you want to make sure that if itdoesn't work for somebody else,
you're not it's not necessarilyif it doesn't work for somebody
else, because God's gonna dowhat he's gonna do regardless.
SPEAKER_00 (34:28):
He's God, he's almighty, he's gonna do it.
Some people may not believe inGod.
And then there are some peoplethat have turned to the point
that they don't want to hearanything about God.
So if they're not listening orthey don't want to have anything
to do with God, unfortunately,that's that's really
unfortunate.
Um, they may find other ways.
Some people go to they use othermeasures to help them get over
(34:49):
things, you know.
Yeah, so I mean, to each itsown.
Um, but I would encourage them.
And then I had to repent.
I there were times that I hadfeelings and emotions and stuff
that weren't natural.
I had to repent.
And, you know, God, I don't meanto feel, I don't want to feel
like this.
I don't want to, you know, Idon't want to hurt them.
I don't want anybody to hurt,you know, I don't want to
(35:10):
retaliate on anybody else.
And and and there were timesthat I had to sit back and say,
listen, what are you gonna doabout it?
Like I said, even trying to runthose people off the road during
that time, I had to repent forthat.
Like, literally, this was somegangster stuff.
Like, what am I doing?
SPEAKER_02 (35:27):
And even, even I'm thinking too, when you say you
were at the point where you weresuicidal, and then thinking,
like, okay, if you jump, whatdoes this mean for you, your
family at the time?
SPEAKER_00 (35:39):
I didn't think about my family.
I didn't think about anything.
I could only think about that.
I didn't want to feel this painand I had to end this pain.
I didn't want it anymore.
And so some people would say,Well, where's all your prayers
and stuff?
Or what happens?
I wasn't hearing from Godbecause I wasn't in the mindset
that I could hear from him.
I wasn't in the mindset that Iwanted to do what's right.
(35:59):
I just wanted to do whatever itwas gonna take to get me out of
this pain.
But then I had to pray.
You know, I really wasn'tpraying.
I was letting the situationsoverwhelm me.
I became so enraged with justending it all.
I I really wasn't thinking aboutmy family.
Yeah, you know, and I had torepent about that, you know,
(36:19):
because that's not, you know,something that we would want to
do.
There are people who want lives,want their lives.
There are people dying fromdiseases every day.
There are people who um havebeen um going through things
that didn't have the option tosay whether they live or die.
And that wasn't fair, thatwasn't right, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (36:37):
So, cuz what do you see as being next for you in
your life?
SPEAKER_00 (36:42):
Well, I will say I'm moving in silence.
Let me just say that.
Just just keep an eye out.
Relationship-wise, I will saythat uh there are some things in
the making.
So I'm excited.
Let me just say that.
I'm excited.
SPEAKER_02 (36:56):
I can tell, I can tell.
And I was gonna ask you this.
I want to end on on this notebecause you have been through
different, you know, trials,tribulations, hardships, but you
don't seem like you've given upon.
SPEAKER_00 (37:09):
No, I have not.
Love is love.
I would say the right love won'tlet you give up.
SPEAKER_02 (37:18):
And I don't think we can end on a better note.
And because I really appreciatehaving you.
SPEAKER_00 (37:24):
I appreciate being here.
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_02 (37:27):
Yeah, y'all, we have wrapped up another episode of
the Peace and ProsperityPodcast.
Yes.
And as always, be blessed.
SPEAKER_00 (37:34):
Be blessed.
SPEAKER_02 (37:35):
Peace.
Good night.
Thanks for tuning in to thePeace and Prosperity Podcast.
If today's episode brought youclarity, encouragement, or even
a moment of calm, share it withsomeone who needs to hear it
too.
Your support helps us keep theseconversations going.
(37:57):
And remember, you don't have todo it all alone.
If you're navigating stress,burnout, or just need a space to
reset, I'm here to support you.
Connect with me atjasonlphillips.com or send me a
message on social media.
Until next time, protect yourpeace, pursue your purpose, and
(38:20):
keep showing up for you.
Be blessed.
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