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July 7, 2025 78 mins

Boo fam!!! WE ARE SO BACK. In the Season 3 premiere of Peaking, Jess looks back on her start as a podcaster, and how far she's come since her last episode 2.5 years ago. Now, she's at a crossroads, and she's using this space as a testing ground. Should she go full force at her passion project? Is this thing even on? Tune in for monthly episodes where she shares her innermost thoughts on side hustling, then hears from guests on how they're building their own businesses. Plus stay til the end for a reality TV rant you won't want to miss.


Today's guest is Nora McConnell-Johnson, the co-founder of Chicago's new Babe's Sports Bar. Nora is a former educator and public policy professional who recently entered the bar industry after noticing a gap in the market - there's legit nowhere to watch women's sports! Jess and Nora chat all things making a risky pivot, breaking ground on a new business, and redefining success. It's a peaking story that’s sure to make herstory.


~Credits/Links~

Meee: @jzdebakey

Podcasts: @peakingpodcast @not4everyonepod

Guest: @babesinchicago @noramcjo

Editor: @abinewhouse

Logo/Brand Design: @magiceightstudio

Photography: @thelocalnomads_

Music: "Have Mercy On Us" by Air Kid

Mark as Played
Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
The way that we have to crawl out of hard parts is not just
like by learning to do things that are better for us or like
finding ways to make our lives more aligned with our values.
All of that is in service of where you feel joyful.
Fun is an important part of it. Boo, fam, my heart is racing.

(00:35):
My heart is truly racing. I don't, I don't know.
Hi, hi, hi, hi. It's been like 2 1/2 years since
recording my last episode of Peeking.
Welcome. This is a podcast called
Peeking. I'm your host, Jess Debakey.
It's a podcast about the low moments in life that make us who
we are, that force us to grow, that honestly are our peaks

(00:57):
because they're where we have toreally dig deep and rebuild and
get better. That's the whole concept of
peaking. And maybe some of you know that
already, some of you have listened to previous seasons of
my show, but I have a feeling there's a lot of new people here
too, because I'm also the Co host of Not for Everyone podcast

(01:18):
hosted by a hater and a lover with my girl Caroline Winkler.
I'm bringing peeking back. It's just kind of cool that I
have people who know about me a little bit more now than when I
started it and I wanted to test and see like, will you come
here? Will you, will you be here with

(01:39):
me? Will I enjoy this?
Will I get something out of this?
Like I, I, I see this as a bit of an experiment to just feel
out whether doing peeking, doinga show on my own is something
that will be fulfilling or something that like I could do
without. I don't know yet.
We're going to find out together.

(01:59):
And I think that's what's going to be really cool about this
season of peeking. I'm planning to kind of treat
it. I I've always done this, I've
always done this, but I'm doing it in a more intentional way.
I want to treat it like my personal diary of what it's like
to be a person with a full time 9 to 5 corporate job and also

(02:21):
two podcasts building this passion project on the side.
What do I actually feel about that?
What are my actual thoughts on amonthly basis about how that's
going and if if I even still want to do it anymore?
Like is it worth it to chase your passion?
Does it stay my passion? Like am I even passionate about

(02:44):
this? I don't know.
I'm having fun right now, but does that mean I'm passionate?
I don't always have fun with it.We'll find out.
So there will be a new episode of peaking the first Monday of
every month moving forward. The first part of every peaking
episode, the first like 15 minutes or so, will be just me
talking to you about exactly what I just described.
My personal check in diary entryof how it's going, doing this

(03:09):
crazy thing of having a side hustle, working a full time job,
podcasting with a friend, podcasting on my own, trying to
be a content creator, whatever that freaking means.
Then from there, each episode will have a guest.
I'm going to do conversations with different people who I know
who I think are really interesting and really cool and

(03:31):
who I admire and who I've alwayswanted to know more about.
And those conversations are veryheavily going to be leaning on
the structure that I've always done on peeking, which is
talking to them about low moments that they've had that
have forced them to grow. And many of these guests are
actually small business owners, entrepreneurs, other content
creators. And so we'll get to hear from

(03:53):
them like what that process has been like.
What was it that made them take the leap?
Are they still struggling through it?
Or have they come out on top? Like what's their peaking
journey look like? So that'll be the bulk of these
episodes. And then I think I'm going to do
a little like 5 minute fun segment at the end.

(04:14):
Just me, Maybe I'll involve my guests, I don't know.
I want like a quick forum to publicly talk about my opinions
on TV shows and specifically reality TV, but I won't
pigeonhole myself there. Like next year when Severance is
back. I, I don't know if it's going to
take a year, it might take 2-3 years, but whenever Severance is

(04:36):
back, Severance will be an exception to the reality show
segment. Otherwise, it'll probably mostly
be like Love Island, but I'm going to leave some time at the
end of every episode for me to just rant and vent about
whatever my opinions are at thatmoment in time, OK?
That's what Peking's going to look like in this new

(04:57):
reincarnation season 3. I'm so excited you're here.
Diary entry #1. Alright, I think for this
episode, for this like first entry of my journal on Peking, I
want to talk a little more aboutwhy I decided to bring this back

(05:22):
and what I'm feeling about it 'cause I definitely have mixed
opinions, so maybe I need to give some grounding.
I don't know if everybody knows my story.
I'll make it quick. I know I'm a talker.
That's why this whole thing is happening.
OK, so I started peeking in 2021.

(05:43):
It was after the end of a situation ship.
I was really down bad dogs. I was really, really like sad
that this guy ended things with me.
And I remember sitting on my couch.
It was kind of like COVID. It was COVID was still very much
alive and it was winter. So we were all having to kind of

(06:06):
keep to ourselves and keep to our pods of people and wear
masks and everything. I was mostly in my apartment
keeping to myself. And this one night after the
situation ship ended things withme.
I was just sitting on the couch and I like kind of chuckled to
myself like, huh, I'm peeking right now mid tiers, like not
peeking in the way that we know it at all.

(06:27):
And something dawned on me whereI was like, as much as I'm
really sad and depressed and anxious and, like, feel alone
and feel like nobody will ever want to be with me.
And I can't even, like, go to a bar with my friends right now.
Like, the normal ways of coping are not available.

(06:49):
That's not a way of coping that I endorse.
OK, We're joking. Hey, the whole thing on Peking
is the same as not for everyone.Like, I don't take it too
seriously. Just just a reminder.
Just a reminder. OK, so I was feeling this way
and I thought to myself, I'm peaking kind of like
sarcastically. And then I realized that I

(07:09):
actually kind of was because as much as I was feeling that
depressive state, I was also feeling kind of motivated and,
like, fiery. I was kind of like, I'm gonna
prove him wrong. Like there was an ounce of me
that could access the anger and the wrath and the spite, which
I'm not saying are like the mosthealthy emotions to stoke, but I

(07:33):
don't know. I think there's something to
them because I think they are very productive emotions to
feel, unlike being sad. When I'm sad, I just like can't
fathom doing anything. When I'm pissed, I'm like ready
to run through a wall. And so there was this little
little fire underneath all the sadness that was feeling like

(07:54):
I'm actually ready to go. Like I'm about to show him what
he's missing and that's when something clicked like peeking.
Actually I kind of am. Why am I being sarcastic that
I'm peeking right now? I actually kind of AM.
And something about that clickedas an idea for a podcast.
I had always wanted to do a podcast.

(08:16):
I had done a little bit of standup comedy.
I had thought for a long time about how can I make my way into
the content space. I've watched YouTube since the
beginnings of YouTube. Like I've always loved that as a
platform and tried to imagine myself there, but couldn't quite
figure out what that would look like.
I don't know, quite frankly, like editing my own face videos

(08:40):
of my own face is really something that I struggle with.
I have tried. I don't know that I want to more
than this like talking to you podcast format.
And so I had wanted to do a podcast and this peaking concept
hit me because I started all of a sudden, like all these
thoughts started to rush to me of like you hear all the time

(09:02):
artists like musicians or creators or I don't know what
are other types of arts. I only listen to audio.
I only do like music and podcasts, but probably authors
and probably painters and also like business owners, like
anybody who's creating anything,you always hear that it was born

(09:28):
out of like a terrible time. It was born out of how miserable
they were at their last job. It was born out of a breakup and
having all this new time on their hands and feeling
completely lost and like they didn't know themselves and
needing to just like immerse themselves in something.
It was born out of an illness, like a time when they were
really sick or a family member was really sick and they they

(09:51):
got motivated to solve that problem, try to help other
people who were going through the same thing.
That's what I feel like every good creation, OK, maybe not
every, but many, many, many of them is born out of pain.
And something hit me of like, I am in pain right now, but I'm
going to make something of it. And that's the true definition

(10:13):
of peeking. So that's where this all
started. Did it for a couple seasons kind
of on and off casually. You can go back and listen to
all those episodes. Honestly, as much as I don't
want to go listen to them myselfbecause I'm sure they're cringy,
at the time I was very proud of them.
And there are still people who go back and listen to them who
have now kind of heard about it from Not For Everyone, which is

(10:36):
really where I've been focusing my podcasting outside of
corporate job time for the past 2 1/2 years and it it holds up.
People like it, people like the old episodes.
I don't think I'm ever going to touch them and listen to them
myself, but I also don't think I'm ever going to take them down
because they were really like real time processing of
everything I was going through. Shortly after I quit my

(10:59):
corporate job, I wanted to take intentional time off because I
felt like I was working towards something and I didn't really
know what it was and it just I was spinning my wheels and I had
been for years and I wasn't getting much out of it.
So I quit my job. I like dove into podcasting,
dove into comedy, tried my best to make it something, had a lot

(11:21):
of fun with it was processing all of that change live on the
air and we formed the Boo fam. That's what this community is
called. That's what I said at the
beginning. I did find some listeners who
weren't just people who I know, and we fostered this community
here that's all about personal growth and self development and

(11:42):
growing and getting better out of those painful moments.
Then Caroline and I decided to do not for everyone.
And it's like there's only so much time in life and I couldn't
keep doing this. But more recently I have been
feeling like I would love to have something of my own in the

(12:03):
same way that probably a lot of the people who are here know
Caroline through her YouTube. I would like to see whether
doing something on my own is funfor me.
Like I I have a pull to it. I've always had a pull to doing
this. And when I was working on
peeking alone in the first couple seasons, I actually felt

(12:23):
like, Oh my God, I really need aCo host.
Like this would be so much better if I had somebody the to
bounce off of and somebody to laugh with and somebody to share
their personal stories too. It's a lot of pressure for one
person to run a show like this. I'm very impressed by people who
have solo podcasts and come out with an episode every single
week 'cause it is a lot. And so at the time it was like,

(12:45):
please, please, please let me figure out who I could partner
with. And I found the perfect partner
in Caroline. But now that I have that, I'm
kind of missing the space for solo expression.
Like, I think there's room for both and I have a hypothesis
that it's going to be good, but I'm open to deciding after doing

(13:07):
however many of these episodes, like, oh, JKI, just want to go
back to my girly and my duo and like, rest my laurels there.
I'm open to that as much as I'm open to the idea of starting to
do more of this and starting to really work on it and grow it in
a big and intentional way. So we're just going to see

(13:30):
together. I think what I'm also struggling
with and processing right now islike I still have my corporate
job full time. And for a long time my attitude
about that was like, I have thatto provide stability and provide
structure to my day and to pay the bills.
And like really the thing that'sgoing to be my career and that

(13:52):
I'm going to put myself into fully and that I want to be my
future is podcasting and content.
And that still lives within me. Like I still, if I could make
that happen, I think I still want to, but it used to be like
a slam dunk. 100%. That's what I want to do.
I want to leave the corporate for good behind completely and

(14:15):
go into this world. And now I'm kind of like, I
don't know, I could do both forever.
I mean, it's a lot. It's a lot in terms of my time
and my energy. But I think I get a lot from
both. And I think having my corporate

(14:36):
job as like the fall back allowsme to take more risk, try new
things, care a little less what people think when it comes to
the content. I still care a lot and I'm still
calculated with my risks, but like there's just a nice balance

(14:57):
as much as it some weeks I'm really tired.
There is a nice balance of having both and not having to
put all of myself into one thing.
Caroline and I talk about this alot on not for everyone, like
the idea of diversified fulfillment, diversifying across
corporate job, not for everyone peaking my personal life and my

(15:20):
partner and my friends and my family and myself and any other
things that I like to do. Hobbies that I just do because
they're fun and not 'cause they generate any output for other
people to consume. Like I kind of need all of it.
And so there is a part of me that I didn't expect to pop up
who has entered the chat in the last few months and been like,

(15:44):
hey, you know, you don't have toever leave your corporate job.
Like you could just keep doing both of these things.
Right now I do both of these things because the podcast don't
pay the bills and this is capitalist America and I need to
pay my bills. If there came a time when the

(16:04):
podcasting could do that, would I go for it still and like leap
right into it? Or would I say, OK, I'll just
make a little more money, but doboth And not because of the
money, but because of that diversified fulfillment and like
having different parts of my personality satisfied and

(16:27):
splitting up my week and the time that I give to things in
multiple different ways. I don't know.
And it could also be fear of like, maybe it'll never happen
in the podcasting space. Maybe it will never be something
lucrative enough to support me full time.
And so maybe I just need to get comfortable with the idea that I

(16:49):
do this for fun and I do that for money, the corporate job for
for supporting my life. Maybe it's a little bit of that
talking a little bit of like, bereal dog like, are you really
gonna be able to leave corporatebehind forever and live the
lifestyle that you like to live?I don't know.
So I can't tell how much of it is that and how much of it is a

(17:13):
true change of heart. Change of heart is too strong of
a word because I'm not there yet.
I haven't like made any decisions, but just like a true
thing to consider. I don't know.
I'm considering it. I'm having these types of
thoughts recently and I think bringing back peaking is

(17:33):
actually like a key component oftesting that because I do want
to see like, are people interested in what I have to
say? Will they come and follow me to
different content outlets? Will they stay?
Will they enjoy it? Will I be able to get guests who

(17:54):
want to have fruitful conversations and really match
the vibe and the brand and like what my goal is, like, will I
enjoy it? Will it be too much time?
Will it take too much time for me?
Or will it take time? Sure.
But like, give me enough back. That's what we're testing here.
That's what we're testing. OK, I think that's that's your

(18:16):
intro this week. I feel like after my
conversation with my next guest,I might have some more to think
about, some more to like chew onin terms of finding those
answers. My guest today is Nora McConnell
Johnson, the founder of Babes, which is a new kind of sports
bar coming to Chicago. I met Nora just over a year ago

(18:38):
at our gym. We both were going to Above the
Bar. It's an inclusive gym and
community in Bucktown, Chicago, and it's like a place that means
so much to me. Then Nora specifically is a
person who as soon as I met her there, I felt like I had known
her for a really long time. She's super comfortable to be
around. She's not shy, quick to crack a

(18:59):
joke, came off as very self assured, came off as like
direct, no bullshit, which is a value for me.
And so I've always been interested to like, talk to her
more. I think also the reason she
really impressed me is because Ifound out soon after that she
was opening this bar, Babes and had not been in the bar and

(19:22):
restaurant industry before. Really difficult industry to
break into and have success in and stay in.
And I just admire people who want to take a leap like that
because they believe in what they're doing.
Babes is a sports bar specifically created for women.
Like rewriting the narrative of what a sports bar really is and

(19:43):
focusing on women as the clientele, women as the focal
point. As in like they're only showing
women's sports. This is to celebrate female
athletes. And I just think there's
something really cool about thatidea.
It's so timely. Women's sports are on the come
up and for good reason. And so I'm just interested to

(20:03):
hear from Nora. Like, how long has this idea
been brewing? Because I feel like she landed
on the exact right time when at least Chicago needs this.
But I think probably the countryand the world would do well with
places like this. So I've always wanted to ask
Nora more about why she decided to open the bar.

(20:23):
You know, what she was doing before.
I don't even know what her, likeprevious career was.
I don't know if she still has that job.
I don't know much about the details.
And my way of getting to know people at this time in my life
is just inviting them on my podcast.
So that's what we're doing. We'll talk about the ups and
downs of her journey to get hereand kind of what she's looking

(20:46):
forward to with the opening, what she's scared of with the
opening. And I think we're going to learn
a lot. So without further ado, Nora.
Hi, Nora. Hi, Jess.
We were just talking before recording about the intro I

(21:06):
wrote for you. And I feel like that's a good
place to start because I feel like when we met in the gym, it
was like in passing. And I felt like I had known you
for a long time. And we haven't really had very
many one-on-one conversations for a long period of time, if
ever. Really.
Yeah. And I think I just decided like,

(21:29):
I'm gonna make her talk to me bybeing on my podcast.
I'm gonna make her talk to me for 30 minutes to an hour,
'cause I have to ask you. I want, I have so many things I
wanna ask you. Yeah.
At least 30. I feel like it's like, I do
think there's this degree of like ambitious slash high
performing slash sociable women who like can clock each other
and be like God. Yep, Yep.
Same team you're that. Yep.

(21:50):
Yeah, like we like I see, I see you making shit happen, like
respect and like it. I feel like it is.
It happens especially with babesstuff.
It happens often, which is cool.It's just like.
Oh yeah, I get to meet so many cool women doing cool shit.
Yeah, That is something I wantedto ask you about.
That's a good jumping off point.Like it feels like, OK, we've

(22:11):
known each other maybe a year and a half from that point.
You were planning on babes and Ithink yeah, you were kind of
like looking for spaces and getting ready to start the
process of, like, building out this bar and thinking about what
it would look like and leaning towards opening.
And you have gotten a lot of press for a bar that doesn't

(22:31):
exist yet. So I wanna know more about that.
Like, how have you made that happen?
We'll get, we'll get to like, you know, how did the idea start
and, you know, where did you come from before?
But that since we got there, I just wanna know a little more
about like, you're so lucky, butalso it's because you have such
a good idea. Yeah, no, it's it is such a it's

(22:52):
a combo of so many things, including luck, like a good
idea, the right people. So like we met because I found
the gym we were at or the gym weboth remembers that above the
bar because I had reached out toa branding studio called Magic
8, which is our we are now mutual friend Julie Ostro runs
the studio and I had an idea fora women's sports bar.

(23:14):
I had a logo. It's like you can see it back
behind me. It's like the Barbie logo here.
I had a name and a logo, but it was like very self done DIY.
Like I have a friend who's a graphic designer who did the
logo for me. I knew I needed something to
hold on to in my hands to be able to talk about this idea.
And so then I met Jules for to think about branding and she is

(23:35):
the one who even like suggested above the bar is a gym for me.
And I was like, yeah, I was like, I was shopping for a gym
because I just quit rugby to to work on babes.
And I was like, well, how am I going to, I hate working out.
Like when am I going to find time to do this and make myself
do it? So I found the gym which was
actually like an incredible accelerant for me too, of just
like meeting such good people that ended up being so key to

(23:58):
Babe's success. But really, I think like a lot
of the publicity has been because the brand looks so good.
And that's like a lot in part tothe work that Julie did with the
like the logo refresh. She helped us do like a whole
like real like suite of sort of marketing and helped us really
Torah is my best friend who I'm doing this with our my Co
founder. And it was even just the

(24:19):
exercises we did with Julie about like what's the vibe we're
going for? What's the like, what do we want
people to feel when they're looking at our logo or like
things that we're posting? And that really forced Torah and
me to sit down and like be intentional about how we were,
what we were trying to do here. I love that you mentioned Julie
because she just redid the logo for this podcast for peeking.

(24:41):
So when I had peeking, when I started peeking like 3-4 years
ago, I did kind of a self-made logo and I, you know, it was
cute. I liked it enough.
Like it served me for the time, but I really wanted to revamp it
for this season 3 comeback. And Julie is like, is the person
I went to. And I feel like she transformed

(25:02):
it into something that just, like, looks more professional
and looks more like somebody would take it seriously when
scrolling through or, you know, I think that's part of getting
those opportunities for media and press is just like, you look
like you're a real business that's taking yourself
seriously. I think your logo and your brand
does so much of that work for you.

(25:24):
So yeah, shout out Magic 8 and shout out Jewels.
Yeah, That was the first real investment we made into babes.
It was like our first sort of like, OK, like we are putting
our own money into this to a degree and like making sure that
we are actually invested ourselves and this is the start,
start of that. I do want to know.
So you mentioned Tora, your bestfriend, who is your Co founder.

(25:47):
Have you guys always wanted to do something like this together,
work together? Has she been in the bar
industry? Have you like what's the origin
story of making this happen? Because if I if I remember
correctly, I think it's a pivot for you, right?
Oh, totally. Yeah, yes, very much so.
Yeah. Tora and I have been friends

(26:08):
since we were freshmen in college.
We went to we went to school in Portland, OR together, but we
are both from the Twin Cities, Minnesota.
And so we'd like met up before we had like a, there was like a
small, it's a small college called Reed.
It's like a 1200 kids school. And so we met up in Minnesota
with a, a few other like future classmates.
And so we knew each other from the get go and we both were like
nerdy athletes. And so we both, I feel similar

(26:29):
to like us clocking each other, you know, Tora and I were like,
OK, got it like intense, kind ofweird athletic girl.
Like we can be good friends. And so we we joined rugby
together because that was like the only real sport at Reed for
women to play. And it also suited both of our
like, intense attitudes really well.
Like, we both were like tacklingpeople is great for us.

(26:51):
We really were like a duo. It was so fun.
But so then we like, you know, left college and have like
always like been still very tight.
We like have done a done a lot of different travelling
together, been through a lot of like life changes together.
And she came on board. Actually.
It was like through a very sad event.

(27:11):
I'd moved to Chicago for grad school for public policy and I
had like graduated, had so much student debt.
Thanks you Chicago was working at the school district at
Chicago Public Schools downtown.I was like, oh, it turns out
working in an office is straighthell for me.
Like sitting at a desk is not sending emails is like sucking

(27:32):
my soul. So I was thinking like what it
could be like to do something else.
What year was this? This was in 2000 and like the
end of 2022, OK, beginning of 2023, OK.
Like, yeah, 2023. And then Tora's mom, Laura, who
was like, I loved Laura. She we went to Vegas together
when I was a senior in college. She took us to Vegas with Tora.

(27:54):
Like she's an icon I need to meet.
All of them. I need to be friends with these
people. Yeah, Tora's family is
incredible. They're hilarious.
And, well, it's so Laura. So Laura is for his mom, and she
unexpectedly passed, which was devastating.
It's also like actually so in line with sort of like the
babe's mission in some ways because her mom had a heart
attack, but her symptoms were not what we think of heart

(28:16):
attack symptoms because we are socialized to think of men,
men's heart attack symptoms and women present differently often.
And so that was like her mom passed.
I went home to I went back to Minnesota for the funeral to be
with her and like be with the family.
I like, you know, I love Tor's family after years of knowing
everybody. And so I was with them and it's

(28:37):
like a big Irish family. Tor's dad owns, he actually owns
Irish bars in New York. And so I was talking to him
about babes. Tor was like, dad, listen to
Nora's like idea, give her advice.
We're all grieving. We want to talk about something
else. So please, please, Nora, like,
tell us what you're working on. And I was filling them all in.
It was really fun, dad. Her dad was like peppering me

(28:58):
with questions and ideas. Torah and her husband Ravi, who
I love also like a lot of my friends.
I feel like I like joke with a lot of my friends that like I
like don't like any of my friend's husbands.
But Ravi, I actually really, I really do love him.
He's he's a riot. So that we were all just talking
about it as like an exercise of me being excited and Tora like,

(29:19):
you know, wanting to know more whatever.
And then she and Ravi Facetimed me like 2 days later.
And there had been a few other bad news things in Tora's life
in that moment. And so when they Facetimed me, I
was like, what now? Like, what is going on?
And they were like, we have beenthinking about it.
We, the two of us, Torin Ravi had wanted to, like, open a bar

(29:40):
at some point in our lives. But Ravi, like, works in
finance. Torah is like, well, she was
getting her doctorate and publichealth.
So they were like, it's probablynot happening.
For us, everybody leaves public health.
I'm I have a public health background and I'm like
podcasting, trying desperately to leave.
Well, she she was, yeah, she wasdoing a lot of NIH funded work.
So yeah, there's not a lot of not there, not right now.

(30:04):
But so they they were like, whatif we came on as silent partners
for babes? And I was like, yes, absolutely.
And they were like, well, do youwant to sleep on it?
No, I don't need to. No, please, I'm dying for
somebody else to actually be in this with me.
Please come work on this with me.
And so that like was really, that was probably, yeah, that
was like, I think November of 2023.

(30:27):
My favorite part of this story, I freaking knew it.
So like, I just feel like when Isee somebody, you know, we keep
describing like the recognition of each other when we first met
of like, OK, you're doing shit, I'm doing shit.
I feel like whenever somebody's taking a leap, like you are

(30:49):
leaving Chicago Public Schools, totally different field, totally
different vibe of work and goinginto the bar industry and not
only just going into the bar industry, but opening your own
bar for the first time. Yeah.
Whenever somebody does somethingkind of crazy like that, I'm
like, it was, it must have been born out of distress.

(31:11):
And so on one hand, like just the frustration with your job.
I want to know more about like the specific idea for babes and
where that came from because in my mind I'm like, you know,
obviously it's filling a gap andI want to know more about your
relationship to that gap, I guess.
And then also what you describedwith Torah going through all

(31:32):
this stuff with her family and losing her mom and like really,
really in the depths of despair at the funeral, talking about
this idea like nothing is more on brand from this podcast, to
be quite honest. Then like an amazing idea that
brings everybody together and like, it has legs and like keeps

(31:54):
moving forward to be born out ofall of that.
So I just totally like, I mean, I'm, I'm amazed by the whole
story, but I, I feel like I kindof knew that it must, it must
have come from something hard, you know?
Yeah, no, it did. And I think also like what
you're saying is like about the like theme of peeking and sort
of what you've been like noticing through these stories.

(32:14):
Also, I think like what is crucial to like the
conversations about climbing outof sort of hard parts is like
the need for fun and how actually like you like, and it's
I mean, joy is like the more true, I would say like way to
say it. But just like the way that we
have to crawl out of hard parts is, is not just like by learning

(32:36):
to like do things that are better for us or like finding
ways to make our lives more aligned with our values.
It's also about like all of thatis in service of where you feel
joyful, I think. And so it's like it really.
It also like, yeah, fun is an important part of it.
Yeah, do the really the thing that is fun or joyful to you,
even if it doesn't make a lot oflogical sense on paper or it's

(32:56):
not what somebody would recommend.
Like sometimes that's that's the.
The antidote, yeah, it's like if, if it's authentic and if
it's like bringing you joy, thatlike also is that that is the
that is good enough. Yeah.
And it's actually great. So talk more about the idea for
babes itself. I gave a little bit of an intro,
but I want to hear it in your words and I want to hear more

(33:18):
about like where that came from because you said it kept
floating to mind for you, like it kept coming back.
So when did that start? And like kind of what were you
noticing that made you think that this needed to happen?
Yeah, well, I the so Babes is a women's sports bar.
We'll only play women's sports. And it's something like for me,

(33:39):
contextually, that's important for people to know about.
Like why Babes is key for me is that just women's sports and
like the existence of women in sports has been a through line
for my entire life. Like in college, Torah and I,
our rugby team LED a Title 9 investigation against the we
filed a Title 9 complaint against the athletic center

(34:00):
because of discrimination towards the women's rugby team
and like preference giving and prioritization for the men's
rugby team. And that was really, I mean, in
high school, I played on a boys soccer team and experienced like
sexism that way on more like interpersonal level, not from my
teammates, but from like other teams that we played and their
parents. But in college, when we LED this

(34:21):
Title 9 investigation or sorry, launched a Title 9 complaint,
you know, I said like I was seenby president, like there, I
really had only up until that point in life had the experience
of when I have a problem, it gets fixed.
Like I, I can fix it. And this Title 9 investigation
resulted in the school. I mean, it was, it was such a

(34:43):
lesson for me. And just like what it looks like
to be fully shut out of an institution, which, you know, is
something that a lot of people experience a lot of times.
And I was really just like floored by it and how this
institution was able to turn itsback on women athletes because
it wasn't convenient for them tolike really respect us and
accommodate what we needed. And so that was like very like,

(35:06):
I would say radicalizing for me of being like, I was also a
sociology major. So I was like, oh, OK, like this
is like normative society keeping out the disruptors, like
period. So it was just very, it was very
catalyzed like it, I feel like it made helped me sort of really
clarify a lot of my experiences that I had up to that point and
be like, this is it's a systems thing.

(35:27):
And then in New Orleans, I movedto New Orleans after college.
I was playing rugby there and rugby was like my life, like my
friends were all my rugby teammates.
Like we just were like such a tight community.
We had so much fun. I had like, I just had the best
time with them and was so like, they were really like my family
in this other city and we were all really tight with each
other. We were like really had each

(35:47):
other's backs and like really tough times.
Like we, we went through a lot of life together.
And so when I moved to Chicago after living in New Orleans for
seven years, I was like, well, just I'll find that community
through rugby also in Chicago. Like I'm leaving such a rich
community that I love and it like I'm so happy to have.
And I thought I could just sort of like rebuild that easily in

(36:09):
Chicago. Yeah, which was not not the
case. I mean, I moved here.
I lived in Hyde Park, so I was like on way, way South of where
a lot of the teams play. So I was like, and having to
travel to like be playing. I also was in grad school.
So I was trying to like, you know, be a good grad student,
like have like my grad school life too.
And then the really a pandemic happened.

(36:29):
Like that's the actual actually what happened.
And so I just like say that to say that I, I wasn't able to
like find that same community inChicago.
That's like, I felt like I had so, so rich in my life in New
Orleans. And so that was like part of, I
would say like where I started to think like, how do people
build community here? Like, how is there like as an

(36:51):
adult, how do you find friends? Like how do you like, how do you
rebuild a life in a new city? How do you like make meaning in
a new city? How do you feel connected to a
place that like you haven't lived in for a long time?
And so it like, that was like the journey I was on of sort of
like figuring out like, can I rebuild that in Chicago, which
is really like what led me to thinking about.

(37:14):
I mean, I, I was sort of in thisphase where I, like, everything
was up in the air. I like, thought that I was
moving to Chicago with a plan, like, I was going to go to grad
school, graduate work. I like, honestly was like, I'll
just, I'll work at like, I wanted to like work at the
school district or like at the mayor's office.
Like I love, like city level policy and government.
Yeah. So I'd done everything that I'd
planned and I was miserable. I was like, so miserable.

(37:35):
I just, yeah, I think I was reevaluating everything.
I was thinking about moving backto New Orleans.
I was having active networking conversations with people in New
Orleans to move on back. And I forced myself.
I was like, OK, I'm gonna buy a car.
Thank God I was in a position tobe able to do that.
But I was like, I'm gonna buy a car.

(37:56):
I'm going to start antidepressants and I'm going to
join this volleyball team calledBump Set Dyke.
And the three pronged pro. Combo.
Yeah, I was like, these are my three, I'm gonna do it.
And if it doesn't work, I can move back to New Orleans.
I know I tried. I like did it, but maybe just
wasn't a good fit here. Yeah.
But so I did those three things and like the combo on having a

(38:18):
car, Unfortunately, it is like being able to like change my
dear friends. Yeah, yeah, so.
And I'm AI love public transit. Like that's my we'll die on that
hill. And unfortunately, like, that
was a big pivot for me. And my volleyball team did
become like a really great, like, queer community and space
for me to feel like I actually like belonged in this city, you

(38:40):
know, and had people who like, would invite me to hang out with
them and wanted to like sit on my couch and watch TV with me.
Like so important. And I think the.
Type of friend that's needed when you move to a new city,
It's like you might have friendswho will go to dinner with you
or go to a bar with you or whatever.
Yeah. But like, I need you to come sit
and scroll on your phone next tome.

(39:00):
That's friendship for me, yeah. Yes, I I've been I'm always
obsessed with think pieces aboutlike friendship and belonging.
Yeah, and there I just one just came out.
I'm sure it was like the Atlantic about like how we all
need like couch friends and actually like we can, we think
that we need restorative time tobe alone, but we can have
restorative time with other people.
Like it can also be friend time and be restorative.

(39:23):
And I love that. I like that's, yeah, that's for
me. I always like.
I know I've really made it with my friends when we hang out and
do nothing. Totally agree.
So OK, I feel like where you're headed is almost like, OK, you
found community, you started to find community here.
But I think what I'm hearing or anticipating is also that you
were basically planning to, like, build your own community.

(39:45):
Like, OK, the places that I feelhappiest and I feel most secure
and comfortable are when I'm on a team, becoming friends with
those people, whatever. Let me create a space that can
feel like that all the time. Like, is that kind of babes?
That it has ended up being that has ended up being such a nice
tie into the work that Babes is for me is like I, I really saw

(40:07):
Babes is just a project for me of like imagining at 1st and
like it can't, I mean, it came out of anger.
Like I like couldn't find a place.
I literally couldn't find a bar to watch the sky when we were
in, when we were in the playoffsfor the national championship
title, which we did win. This was like in 2021.
And so I knew that Babes needed to exist or the concept needed

(40:29):
to exist because of the lack of options for me frankly.
And like me, who was like a new to the sky fan and I'm was just
imagining how annoying and like it's not my first time trying to
find women sports in a bar and having it be so hard.
This this felt mostly like this was I feel like when the sky
we're running or in the in the playoffs for the national

(40:51):
championship, not being able to find them on TV in Chicago bars.
That was when it started to feellike actually like tipping point
disrespectful to me. It was like, this isn't what?
City they are from and they are in the championship.
Like that should at least happen.
Exactly. Exactly.
And then also, it was like I thesports bra is the first women's

(41:11):
sports bar that really, like, gave this idea sort of a home
and, like, showed the power of what these spaces can look like.
Where's that in Portland? In Portland?
It's in Portland, OR Yeah. And then Minnesota just had one
open almost a little over a yearago now called a bar of their
own. And it was just, like, lines
down the block to get in. And I was like, these places
that are my homes have these spaces.

(41:32):
So I'm like, you know, feeling jealous, first of all.
And like a just a sign or something like if you had
already came out it and then those are the two cities that
end up, yeah, creating it, yeah.Yeah.
And that also speaks to like, I think one of the things that I
have really leaned into with this process, I was already
like, fairly woo woo. But this process I'm like, OK,
so the universe has like played a big part in this actually.

(41:54):
Like I have like been dished up great people, great connections,
great things that have moved this process forward just from
run insurance and like it, it feels like, I feel, I feel like
when you're like, it's so hard not to talk about it and not
sound like I'm like a burnt out hippie, but I'm just like, yeah,
when you're like in alignment with your values, like the.
Word alignment was in my head. So if you're at least you're in

(42:15):
good company. I do think that when you're,
when you're in alignment, when you're doing the thing that I
hate even to use the words like that you're meant to do because
it's like, what does that mean? And how do we know and how do we
find it and whatever. But like you kind of just figure
out, I don't think you choose the thing knowing this is 100%

(42:36):
the right thing and the thing that I'm meant to do.
But you start doing it because you're like 50% of the way there
or something. And then as you go, you get
little signals of like, correct,correct.
Keep going. Here's a little help.
Here's a little help. This is a door that opened.
Take this path. I totally believe in that.
I think I've found that with with podcasting too.

(42:57):
It's like it seemed like a crazyidea to start.
And then things just started to happen where I was like, OK,
well, I'll just go a little for,I'll just keep going for a
little longer because this thingnow happened.
Or I'll just keep going for a little longer because now this
thing happened and I don't know.Yeah, I believe it.
No, it really they I feel like it's like one of those are the

(43:17):
things also that I think also are propelling, like they help,
they help me whenever those moments happen, it helps to move
forward. And the inverse, too, is like, I
think looking back at how unhappy I was and how stuck I
felt, it was also because I was like trying to force this life
to work that like at its core wasn't really wasn't working.

(43:37):
And so it's like, I feel like also the universe was being
like, no, like, this isn't good for you.
Yeah. You're unhappy because keep
kidding. Got to change this.
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
Like, no wonder you feel like luck is not on your side.
Yeah. And so we I I was noticing the
Portland sports bra bar there onMinneapolis was like wishing we
had it in Chicago was also unhappy in not just like my.

(44:00):
It wasn't just the job. I think it was also the sort of
like, I mean, the pandemic stirred up a lot of things for
everybody. I think for me, I was like
thinking about like success and like what I wanted.
I I really was like title oriented or like thought like,
OK, well, I need to go and like make an impact.
So I need to be like the director of something.
I need to be like, I need to go and be like in charge of things,

(44:21):
which is ironic that I'm like saying I gave up on that.
But yeah, so I like, was I, I thought that like what I wanted
was to like have recognition forbeing good at like my job in
like a, the part like the district or like political
setting. And I don't think that anymore.
And I think like, I think that the pandemic forced me to be
like, wait, do I think that or is that what I, like, thought

(44:44):
that I was supposed to do? Yes.
And I think it was, it's the latter, yeah.
And so I, I think that gave me the permission to think about
what else it could look like forme.
Like I've always been a really creative person, but have never
like really centered that for myself.
Like I was a middle school teacher for a long time.
And I think a lot about like thework that that took and the like

(45:06):
lesson planning aspect of it, But also it was about being
creative and it was about like flexing creativity and those
pieces. And I never like prioritized
that when I was thinking about like, so what's my dream job
after leaving the classroom? And it, and I noticed it missing
from like the life I had after grad school.
And so I think that was also a big part of like where babe

(45:26):
started to feel like a really good fit for me too as I started
working on it more and more. Yeah, I do want to hear more
about like the success, the relationship to success piece of
this. Like makes a lot of sense that
that shifted during the pandemicand was part of the motivator of
like I could do something different.
It could look different for me. And I'm curious maybe moving

(45:49):
more into like current day with babes you haven't opened yet.
We would like an update on that.But also also like, what has the
process of actually building it done for you in terms of like
fulfilling those things that youwere looking for, maybe creating

(46:11):
new obstacles that you didn't expect, maybe changing your
relationship to success even more?
Like, how have you changed in the process of now taking this
leap and doing this thing when you think about like, your own
career fulfillment, I guess. Yeah, Yeah.

(46:31):
I think I have a much more like meaningful relationship to the
concept of success now. Or like I see success is more
rooted in like what you're doingthat's meaningful both to your
own life and other people's lives.
And I think working both grads, going to grad school at U
Chicago with a bunch of like high achieving nerds and then

(46:55):
working at the school district and where I worked on the my
last in my last few years that Iwas working on the CE OS team.
So I was working with like all of the sort of top district
officials And I, it was very clear to me in both of those
spaces that there were, there were people who were like really
wanted to talk about their success.
And then there were also people who really wanted to do the work

(47:16):
that they knew was in service ofsuccess for whatever the mission
or vision was. And it, it just became very
clear to me that there were a lot of people.
And I think this is like it's, Iwas in a school for seven years.
So I think like we were really like committed to just doing the
work. And I wasn't in a lot of spaces
with people who wanted to talk about like titles and what
they'd done to be successful. And now that I've been in those

(47:38):
spaces, a lot of it, I'm like, OK, so many of you are like so
full of shit. Like so many of you want to talk
about how successful you are, how good you are at things, but
you aren't actually doing it. And and that to me like just
became, yeah, I think I just like, I, I similar to how we
clocked each other. I think it's like just like this
feeling of like, I can tell the people who like actually just

(47:59):
want to get the work done and doa good job versus the people who
want to like get the recognitionfor getting the work, for doing
the work. And it's like those two are
often not the same person, you know?
Yes, I've, I've never like described it in that way, but I
do think that's right. Like being successful at doing
the work or looking successful because you have the title at

(48:20):
the place that's supposed to do the work, you know?
Yeah, and I'm sure building babes is all work.
Yeah, exactly. It is, It is.
And it's like, and I think a lotof it is like slow work and not
glamorous work and like work that I have to like, I have to
know that we're doing it becauseit's in service of the end goal.
Even if it doesn't like feel like the most exciting or like

(48:44):
thing that I can really like be so proud of sharing that we did
that day, you know, like it's just like it, it's the
unglamorous side of it. And like, actually, I think
we're the real like meat and potatoes of how things end up
being successful down the road happens.
There's this quote. I'm, I'm pretty, I'm positive
it's Candace Parker after they won the national championship,
actually after this guy won, I'mlike 99% sure there's a quote

(49:06):
from a Tokyo NBA player. I'm pretty sure it's Candace
Parker where she's saying like, we didn't we got counted out a
lot this season. It's because we didn't talk
about ourselves. We didn't talk about like people
didn't see the success and see the people didn't see the work
that we were putting in behind the scenes.
And we were putting in that work.
And it's what it's what made us successful.
And like we didn't have to talk about it.

(49:27):
But but the evidence is here. We just won the national
championship. Like we were working hard.
And I think that for me has beenlike a real learning, like I
want to just make sure I'm like doing the work and in service of
the good product that we're striving.
For, Yeah. And like the long game, like we
might not get that recognition day-to-day, but once we arrive

(49:47):
at this goal and like, kind of prove that we did it, it'll be
visible how much work went into that.
And like, exactly. We'll reap the benefits then.
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
Like it's, it's, yeah, it's, I think it's just like, like I,
I'm much more up close and personal with like the real hard
work that goes on to get these, these things done.
And it has made it very clear tome that like, that's really what

(50:08):
I need to focus on if I'm going to get a good product.
I think so much of it too is like the team that you have
around you. And I'm curious if you're
comfortable to talk about or answer the question of what it's
been like to do this with your best friend.
I mean, it sounds like you guys have worked together in
different capacities before, butthat's still a really hard thing

(50:29):
to do. Like when I was starting out
podcasting, I did it on my own and then I was, it became really
clear to me it was going to be more fun, a better product,
something that I'd look forward to more that I'd have more
accountability towards if I had a partner.
And it was really, really trickyto think of and pick the right

(50:49):
person to be that partner. And I have it in my Co host of
my other podcast. But that didn't come it like she
wasn't my best friend. She wasn't like the obvious, oh,
this is the person I have banterwith and I love so much, so
we'll do it together. It was like a mix of, you know,
where we have these same interests and skills.

(51:10):
We also have very different skills and abilities.
We also have to, we've also run into hurdles and had to like
communicate through some confusing stuff and running a
business together. So yeah, I'm just curious what
your experience has been there. Yeah, it's been, I mean, it's
just been so good. I think you, you like the first
thing you said about it was withworking with your friend is like
it being fun. Like it really is work.

(51:32):
Having to work to survive in capitalism is so terrible.
So like if you can figure out how to do it with a friend like
it's. Like people you like?
Cheating, you know? Yeah, exactly.
And so that a is like it's, it'sso fun.
We also, Tor and I have a history of like being very frank
with each other. Like, we like the running joke
on our college rugby team was that that people would get like

(51:55):
freaked out by how just like aggressively we would speak to
each other and then be like, fine, we'd be fine.
We'd like, we'd like have like a, it would look like a fight,
like us going back and forth andthen we would be like, OK, got
it, cool, OK, great. And we'd be good.
And we'd and it's like, I think both of us are really like
little freaks in service of likewanting to know the truth of
what's it's like. Definitely neurodivergence.
Frankly, like we just are both, we like, we both just need to

(52:18):
know like what's going on at thecore.
And once we know we're good. Yeah.
And so we can like, go at each other as long as like, we're
doing it because we're trying tofigure out like, wait, what are
you saying here? And so that has really served us
in this relationship because we can speak really frankly to each
other, but also know that we're like same team the whole time,
you know? And we.
Yeah. And so I like really.

(52:39):
And I really need somebody who can talk to me that way,
honestly, like, like, I need to be reeled in often so she can do
it. She's not scared to do it.
That's great you have the trust.Yeah, yeah, we do.
And like, and also it's it's thetrust.
And also we know how to circle back and say like, hey, like
it's not like we don't hurt eachother's feelings.
Like it happens. And we have had to have

(53:00):
conversations. Both of us have had to say to
the other, like, that did not feel good for me.
And the other person has to say like, oh, got it.
Like I see where that or like, frankly, what's happened is
we've been like, well, my intentwas this.
And then it's like, oh, got it. Now I know why you were like
that. Cool.
We're good. Yeah.
And so it's it has been really nice that way.
She texted me before our big party.
She lives in New York also. That's important is like she she

(53:21):
lives in New York. So I also don't see her that I
don't see her super often. We talk every single day often,
like the entire day. But yeah.
So that that I think is like both helpful and that we're not
down each other's throats all the time.
And also like, it makes it. Yeah.
It's so interesting because my Not for Everyone Co host doesn't
live in Chicago either. She lives in DC and we have
talked about how that's like kind of maybe some sort of

(53:45):
secret sauce or like hack. Yeah, for working with a friend
like that. There's at the end of it,
there's distance. We talk all the time.
We have to do stuff. But then we have space.
So anyway, that's just really interesting.
Yeah, and you have to be intentional about like catching
her up. You know, it's like we like,
it's not, it's not easy because we have to make it.
We have to make time to like talk to each other about this.

(54:06):
Yes, which I think is helpful too.
Yeah, She took, we had this big,our first like big party.
I like the Galantine's. We had a big Galantine's Day
party that was like sort of likethe babe's like premiere into
the world. After we had our beer, our BFF
beer brewed and Torah texted me before and she was like wait
Nora, it's actually so importantthat you cute at this party.

(54:27):
Only your best friend can do that.
Honestly, it seems like sibling level sibling levels of honesty.
Sibling. Yeah, I I think I was like,
yeah, I was actually planning onbeing ugly, but thank you so
much for telling me that. I'll definitely work on it now.
Yeah, that's like when people say we are, we are sisters when
people say to be safe, like drive safe or something like,
yeah, I was planning on driving recklessly like thing.

(54:47):
Yeah, but I guess what else are you supposed to say?
No, that's awesome. That sounds like the perfect
mix. Cool.
Well, I feel like my last question I want to ask you is
kind of like in a year from now or five years from now, in some
amount of time, what do you needto see that Babes has done to

(55:13):
feel like it was worth it or it was the right choice or like,
you know, like it did what you wanted it to do?
Yeah, that's a great question. I mean, honestly, I already feel
so like sure that's the case just from like the we've had a
few events with people who want to come out and do different

(55:34):
things centered around women's sports and every event we've
had, I like have been so nervousthe night before that it was
going to be bad. And every event it's just like
the best people show up with thebest vibes and people leave with
new friends. We've already had like the first
babes relation, romantic relationship start.
Yeah, like just yeah, people arelike people are building

(55:55):
connections and building community and getting like to
experience that in the space that we're building.
And that is like that's all we're trying to do.
You know, I mean, more than thattoo.
We're also like, I really do believe that like we are trying
to play a big part in helping women's sports become more
accessible, become more of the norm.
But so that's like, I will say we're, I feel like we're already
on on track to feeling like I can say like, yeah, we did it.

(56:19):
We should open first before I say that.
The coolest part about it? That's like why I wanted to talk
to you so badly, because I'm like, from an outsider looking
in, it seems like you've alreadydone it and you're not open yet.
And that's the coolest. Yeah, that's the coolest.
Thing yeah, I love that yeah, yeah, it's it just makes me so
I'm like Oh my God, I'm done. People keep asking me when we're
open and I'm like, just so you know, I'm actually like, that's

(56:42):
the question I'm asking myself every single day.
Like the fact that we're not open yet is killing me inside.
But you are because the community, the community exists
and people are asking, which is like.
Yeah. Places open without either of
those two things in place. Totally.
You know, Totally. Yeah we yes I yeah, I really
think we are like it speaks to the fact that we are filling a

(57:02):
need for a lot of people or a gap, a gap in their lives for a
lot of people, which was it was a gap in my life too so it makes
sense. Okay, the question five years
down the road, I think honestly,like I had this moment when I
was teaching at my my last year in the classroom where I got
this new box of books in the mail for at school because we
were like starting a new unit and there were going to be like
new books that we were reading. And I was like unpacking them in

(57:24):
my room on a planning period. And one of my students grabbed
like came into my room on when Iwas supposed to be on planning
common, grabbed the saw that I had gotten a new like shipment
of books, grabbed one of the books, like stole it and then
ran into the math class and interrupted it and was like,
look, this is what we're readingnext.
And the class like erupted interrupt my like math teacher
hated that sort of. And I remember being like that's

(57:46):
never gonna show up on my test scores.
Like that moment is never gonna like be a data point in like a
whatever data set. And like that to me is like,
I've made it as a reading teacher, like my students just
like died. That's so amazing.
I love that. I love that, yeah.
And. It, I, it really was for me a
huge learning moment because I've always been like, it's

(58:08):
about the data. It's about like the, like, it's
about the quantitative. And I, I was like, no, this is
like, this is proof that like there is a culture of reading
and learning that I have facilitated.
And I think like same for babes five years down the road.
Like I like, I want people to gointo bars and be like disgusted
that. They're let's go to babes, you

(58:28):
know? Yeah, yeah.
We're like, yeah, that too. But I would like it if it was
like just also people were like becoming more like the standards
for other spaces were raised to because of babes.
Like that's for me where I'm like, let's, that's what we,
that's what we've done, what we wanted to do.
I love it. I love it.
I think you're gonna get there. I know you're gonna get there
cuz you're already ahead of thanks.

(58:49):
You're already ahead of getting to some of your goals and
metrics. So.
Yeah. Love it.
Thanks, Nora for coming on peeking and I loved just for
having me getting to finally know what the what the scoop was
behind everything you're workingon 'cause I'm watching from afar
and like admiring every single step of it.
So I can't wait to go to Babes and I hope everybody listening.

(59:09):
Thanks. Yeah, September, if not late
August. Yes, later.
It's coming soon. Later soon.
We'll still get to use the patio, don't worry.
Oh, that's a really good call out.
Yeah, September is like the bestweather in Chicago, so.
We must. Yeah.
We won't be dying out there. Yeah, exactly.
Exactly. It's actually perfect.
I'll post on the Peking Instagram whenever it does open

(59:30):
so that anybody who finds me there can find babes too.
All right, here we are towards the end of the episode, but I
promised my thoughts on reality TVI need a name for this last
little segment like reality. It can't be reality recap 'cause

(59:53):
that's what Nick Vial does. But, and it's not that original,
OK, I'm, it's not like I'm like,oh, he coined the phrase recap.
But give me an idea, some ideas for what this section should be
called. I'm going to try to keep it
brief, like 5 minutes that you can look forward to at the end
to hear my thoughts on what I'm watching.

(01:00:14):
And today, obviously what I'm watching is Love Island.
I am watching. Both Love Island UK and Love
Island USI have been a Love Island UK Stan like I've seen
every single season. I think there's twelve seasons.
It's my favorite reality show byfar.
This season. For whatever reason, Love Island

(01:00:36):
US Season 7 is something I'm really into, even more than the
current UK season, but there's room for that to improve.
So that's what I'm going to talkabout today.
I'm going to give you my predictions.
I'm going to give you my thoughts on the main couples.
Without further ado. Love Island US season 7.
My quick rundown. We got to start with my girl

(01:00:57):
Hooda, the Middle Eastern MiddleEast beast.
Can I just say that I have like 3 aunts named Hooda.
OK, I really have one, but I think I've met multiple.
It's just as soon as she came onthe screen episode 1, I was
like, she's from the Middle East.
I think she's Palestinian from her Instagram bio and she has a

(01:01:19):
couple of tattoos on her body that are in Arabic.
She reminds me of people who I'mrelated to.
She reminds me of some like second cousins.
Not that my second cousins are that unhinged.
I have no idea how they show up in their dating lives, but just
the way she carries herself and talks and her tattoos and her
styling. Like, I know people like Huda

(01:01:41):
and I love people like Huda, andshe has a really big heart.
OK, hot take. It's not that hot of a take at
the end of the season, I guess. But I feel like I saw in her the
whole time that she has a big heart.
And she's a very pained person who's been through a lot and has
not had like the support and therapy and whatever that she

(01:02:02):
needs to become better. But I feel like she has good
intentions and she just literally doesn't know how to
interact with other people. This is not an excuse for the
fact that she. Low.
Key High Key verbally abused a man in the first half of the
season. I would consider the way she
treated Jeremiah to be abuse. And I was a little bit perturbed

(01:02:24):
at the time about, like, the fact that we're all watching it
as entertainment and the fact that Love Island was allowing it
to continue to be televised as entertainment without they put
up a, you know, disclaimer at some point on an episode about
the audience not cyberbullying the contestants.
Great. But I do feel like they should

(01:02:45):
have put up some sort of disclaimer about just like the
fact that they acknowledge that this behavior is not something
they're promoting. Because I do think young people
watch this show. And especially now that the US
seasons are becoming are like gaining traction.

(01:03:05):
I do think it's a lot of people younger than me, even, like in
their 20s or even like late teens and college years who
watch this show. And maybe they relate to like
the intense emotion that somebody like Hooda's
experiencing. But then they see her behavior
and they think it's warranted because they haven't yet learned

(01:03:26):
that that's not the way you translate your intense emotions.
And for that to be televised without any disclaiming or
discussion, dialogue around the fact that like, really it was
verbal abuse on her part. I do worry that we are
normalizing that behavior. And I also think there's
something interesting about the fact that she's a woman and she

(01:03:48):
was being abusive to a man and how much society normalizes like
a woman being angry because a man fucked her over versus a man
being angry. And like, we would be quick to
label a man's behavior if it matched Hooda's behavior as
abuse, but we were not. Quick to label Hooda's.

(01:04:11):
Behavior in that way and I'm I recognize that the majority of
abuse is happening from men to women, but that doesn't mean
that like it doesn't happen in the other direction and I just
think there was an opportunity for dialogue and acknowledgement
there that didn't happen and whatever Love Island is a show

(01:04:31):
for entertainment it's a realityshow but they could have handled
that better. So anyway, all of this being
said, I hold Hoda to account forhow shittily she showed up and
how much work she needs to do onherself and how she probably
should not be on this show. And I also kind of love her and

(01:04:55):
have a soft spot for her 'cause I can see the pain and I can see
that she has a big heart and I can see that she's trying.
And yeah, the editing has probably added to the fact that
she's having this redemption arc.
Like, there's still a lot that we don't see, and it's
impossible for somebody to change overnight the way that
they kind of want us to think she has through the editing on

(01:05:15):
this show. But I do think she's growing.
I do believe the growth and I want to believe that people can
change and grow if they want to.And it feels like that's honest
from her. I don't think she should win.
Like I know there's a lot of Huda stands.
I think she has the most Instagram followers out of

(01:05:36):
anybody on the show right now. And I think a lot of people want
her to win. And I kind of don't want that
because I can't reward the behavior at the beginning.
But that doesn't mean I can't also like, appreciate her for
who she is and how she's growing.
Like I'm just holding space for both.
Both things can be true. Like she could have been

(01:05:59):
verbally abusive to Jeremiah andshe could also deserve love and
not deserve cyber bullying and whatever.
But yeah, I don't think she should win just cause like
that's messy a little bit for the show.
Speaking of mess, I'm already over 5 minutes.
Whatever I'm going to talk of. This could be its own episode.
Actually. That makes me think, if you are

(01:06:21):
interested in this content from me, would you listen to like a
full episode on just this, whether it's posted on the off
weeks from peaking or if it's posted on like Patreon or
something? I've thought about that.
I think the thing that keeps me from doing it is just that I
don't know how consistent I wantto be with it to churn out like

(01:06:44):
long form content on a regular basis around reality TV because
it's my escape and I don't want it to like start feeling like
work. But I'm doing it here.
So if you like it and you want more of it, just tell me that
I'm going to put the comments onon Spotify and you should be
following me or peeking podcast on Instagram.

(01:07:06):
So just DM me or tell me, OK? Speaking of mess, Sierra, now
I'm recording this on Sunday, July 6th, and tonight's episode
people are anticipating will reveal whether Love Island has
decided to give Sierra the boot or whether they have decided to
turn the other cheek and keep her.

(01:07:27):
Because some posts from her pastcame up, as they do, where she
was using a slur. A very gross slur that starts
with the letter C about Asian folks and describing her eyes in
this way. Very just like in bad taste and
in poor form and earlier in the season, very quickly Love Island

(01:07:52):
got rid of a contestant who was there on day one.
Her name was Ulyssa because postcame up of her using the N word
on a podcast and they were like ready.
Like she got the boot right awayas soon as that stuff came up.
The difference is now a few things.
First of all, Sierra is here towards the end of the season.
Second of all, Sierra has been afan favorite.

(01:08:14):
I've always had my questions about her not being racist cause
like we didn't have proof until now, but I had questions about
her being like genuine. I didn't think that she came off
as very genuine. She feels very PR trained which
is ironic for the fact that thisracist post came up but a lot of
people liked her. She's like cute and has good
style. She does have duck lips, but

(01:08:35):
like so does everyone. So there's this like
anticipation of are they going to keep her or not because she's
been there forever. She's really been well liked
until recently by the audience and she's in the only like true
locked in couple right now with Nick.
And so when this episode of Peking goes up tomorrow, like I

(01:08:57):
might already be out of date on what's going on with Sierra.
But as of now she's still in thevilla.
I do think for consistency's sake of like, if we're going to
take racism against black peopleseriously, then we should take
all races, all racism seriously,I do think.
It would behoove. Love Island to give her the
boot, but I also know how like business and industry works and

(01:09:22):
they could keep her. They could very well keep her
and just pretend it never happened because she's been a
star on the show and people, youknow, the same way I said like
man on woman abuse is taken moreseriously than woman on man
abuse. You know, racism against certain

(01:09:43):
groups is taken less seriously. I think it all, I'm not trying
to compare. I think it all should be taken
seriously, to be clear, But I think they can get away with it
more. They could get away with keeping
her and like turning the other cheek on this racist slur as
opposed to somebody using the N word.
That's like our society has for a long, long time drawn the line

(01:10:06):
there. Yeah.
So I wonder what will happen either way.
Putting that all aside about Sierra, I feel like she's the
biggest game player in this villa.
Yes, Ace is also a game player, but he's, like, almost obvious
about it. Like, he's not been hiding that
he thinks with strategy. And he has a view of how Love

(01:10:27):
Island should be 1 And I don't like it and I don't like him,
but I at least can commend him for like being straight up the
whole time. Sierra on the other hand is just
this media trained cutie girl who says all the right things in
every situation. She's so calm, cool, collected

(01:10:48):
with her friends and with her couple.
And she's understanding when Nick and Alondria kiss, even
though she's not understanding when like Hooda and Chris kiss.
It's just all backwards. And I think it's very much
because she is here to win this thing.
I think that she stood behind Taylor in like one of the most

(01:11:11):
recent episodes I've seen to save him because he's not a
threat to her winning. So she looks like a good friend
standing behind the guy who her couple, Nick is best friends
with. But she also isn't risking
anything for herself because he's been voted low so many
times that, like, he's not gonnawin.

(01:11:32):
So she doesn't mind keeping him around as opposed to saving
somebody who's a little more well liked by America and who
could pose a threat to her. So I'm just of the camp of like,
Sierra as a game player. She's not genuine, nobody says
the right thing that much. She's like the complete opposite
of Huda on the show and in that way she's an equal and opposite

(01:11:55):
problem. Like she is so disingenuous.
At least Huda's being herself herself happens to be kind of
terrifying sometimes, but at least it's herself.
On the other hand, Sierra is a monster in in the totally
opposite sense. Like, she, she knows how to win
this game. She's watched the show.
She has friends who have been onthe show.

(01:12:17):
Like all of this has been proven.
That takes me to my prediction and my favorite, and this is not
a hot take. Everybody agrees.
I think my girl Amaya is going to win this thing.
And it seems like she and Brian are about to couple up.
Brian stood up for her when all the guys were slandering her and

(01:12:37):
making fun of her and saying shewas too much and too emotional.
I was screaming at the TV as theperson that has been called too
much and too emotional. I always felt fine about Amaya
but in that moment I was like Ohmy God, I have to defend this
woman to the death. Like I will take down anyone who

(01:12:57):
says anything bad about her because I saw myself in her in
that moment. And Brian was the only guy,
really only person. I don't even think the women
were standing up for Amaya, but Brian was the only one to say,
hey, coming from a Hispanic household, I talk the way she
talks too. I'm very passionate.
I call people babe right right away.

(01:13:18):
Like, if you don't like it, you're not.
What did Amaya say? If I'm not your cup of tea, then
maybe I'm not the cup of tea youshould be drinking.
Like, I don't know. She loves her metaphors.
He speaks in those metaphors, too, and they just seem great
for each other. Is he on the Amaya bandwagon all
the sudden now that he sees her being?

(01:13:38):
The public's favorite. I don't know, it might be half
half. Like I think he was kind of into
her before and he defended her before, and then it came out and
became clear that she was the public's favorite and he
continued showing interest in her.
But I don't know, I don't think it's disingenuine.
He seems like a cool dude. Disingenuous, disingenuine is

(01:14:02):
how everybody on every reality show says that word.
And because I watch so much reality TVI almost like have
rewritten my knowledge and intelligence that that is not
the word. The word is disingenuous, but
they'll never say it correctly on Love Island anyway.
I think Amaya's winning. I think Huda stands a chance.

(01:14:24):
I, like I said before, I don't think Huda should win, and I
think there's enough people who feel like me where she probably
won't. Oh, I do think that Pepe and
Iris are gonna try. And the thing that's cool about
it is I actually do think that they seem like they're both
genuine, like they haven't fakedany relationships in here when

(01:14:45):
they haven't connected with someone They've like said it.
So that would be cool. I'd be OK with it.
But they are both a little bit boring.
Like they're fine, They seem nice.
They're I don't dislike them, but I don't think they deserve
to win, although I think they'reangling for it.
So my vote's with Amaya and I did download the Love Island app
for the first time because historically I've only watched

(01:15:08):
UK, which is I couldn't vote forUK as a American.
It's very political. Like I'm not registered to vote
there but now that I'm into USI have been voting and I'm with
the papaya, I think that's all Ihave.
I could talk about Taylor and Alondria but honestly I think

(01:15:30):
it's whatever. Like we all agree it's dead in
the water if she needs to stop caring.
And poor Clark for being caught in the mix.
She seems perfectly fine and respectful so I don't have a hot
take there. If you want to follow Nora and
Babes in their journey to opening, then you can go to

(01:15:53):
Instagram and follow Babes in Chicago.
Exactly how it sounds. Babes in Chicago, they post a
lot of great content about women's sports.
You'd be supporting a women owned business if you live in
Chicago. I'll probably be at the grand
opening, so you should find me there.
That is my recommendation at theend of this episode.
I also want to give a shout out to my friend Jules, the creator

(01:16:15):
of the Peking brand and new logo, as well as the Babes brand
and logo. So much of the growth and like
trajectory of our small businesses can be attributed to
the brand and so much of that isthanks to Jules and her team at
Magic 8. Follow them at Magic 8 Studio on

(01:16:36):
Instagram and reach out to them them if you need help with your
small business getting things going in terms of branding.
I also want to give a shout out to Emily Roska.
She was the photographer for my logo and she really put up with
a lot of my antics. I don't know how to pose.
I don't know what to be like in front of a camera.

(01:16:57):
She made it happen and I love the pictures we came out with.
You can follow our Instagram to see more of them.
But for Emily, go to the local Nomads under score on Instagram.
And finally, I have to give thanks to my editor, the Prince.
You know where you love her from.
Not for everyone. Abby Newhouse.
She is helping me out on this little solo endeavor and I

(01:17:17):
really wouldn't trust anybody else with listening to me trip
over my words every 5 seconds. So thank you Abby.
Follow her at Abby Newhouse, ABINewhouse on Instagram.
All of this stuff will be linkeddown below.
You can follow peeking on Instagram too.
Peeking podcast. Love you.
Thank you. See you in a month, Boo fam.

(01:18:10):
Oh my God, like I just truly drew a blank brain freeze.
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