November 26, 2024 • 41 mins
Ready to unlock the secrets of international Amazon success? Join us as Alex Karagiannis, founder of Lezzat and seasoned Amazon FBA seller, reveals the intricacies of scaling your Amazon business from the US to the bustling European markets. From overcoming language barriers to mastering regulatory compliance, Alex shares his expert insights on making a seamless transition across borders. Discover the strategic importance of entering through Germany and the nuances of maintaining consistency with ASINs to leverage existing reviews.
Our conversation with Alex delves into the pivotal Amazon Brand Registry process and the strategic adjustments needed for effective advertising in new regions. Learn why securing brand protection through the EU and UK IPOs is crucial, and how Amazon's IP Accelerator program can fast-track your international journey. We also shed light on adapting your marketing strategies to different languages and cultures, and the essential steps for understanding your total addressable market.
Finally, we unpack the complexities of European pricing strategies and the implications of competition laws on your business. With a focus on achieving higher margins and handling potential challenges like copycats, Alex offers a roadmap for successfully navigating the European marketplace. Whether you're an established seller or testing the waters, this episode is packed with actionable insights to help you thrive on the international Amazon stage.
You can learn more about Alex and Lezzat in the following links:
lezzat.co.uk
https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexandroskaragiannis/
Want to chat with us about this podcast? Send us a text message here
The Planet Amazon podcast, brought to you by Phelps United, addresses all things Amazon and other eCommerce marketplaces. In each episode, we talk with Brands, Agencies, and Sellers about Amazon news, new features, policies, brand policies, logistics, marketing, issues, and challenges, among other topics.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Announcement (00:00):
Welcome to the Planet Amazon podcast with Adam
Shaffer, where we explore theworld of Amazon and other
e-commerce marketplaces.
Join us as we delve into thelatest strategies and tactics
for successful selling on theworld's largest online
marketplace.
Adam Shaffer (00:18):
Hello, I'm Adam Shaffer, and welcome to Planet
Amazon, where we talk about allthings Amazon.
Today on Planet Amazon, we'rethrilled to welcome Alex
Karagiannis, the founder andowner of Lezzat, a UK-based
digital marketing agencyspecializing in Amazon services.
With a strong presence in boththe UK and Greece, lazat
(00:44):
supports brands across the globein navigating complexities of
the Amazon marketplace.
Alex himself is an Amazon FBAseller and the founder of the
Athens e-commerce meetup,bringing years of on-hands
experience and insights into theever-evolving e-commerce
landscape.
Today, we're diving into thecritical topic of managing
Amazon accounts for globalbrands, the challenges that come
(01:06):
with it and how companies canstay ahead of this dynamic
environment.
Announcement (01:11):
Alex, welcome to the show.
Adam Shaffer (01:11):
It's great to have you here.
This is an awesome topic totalk about, because I don't know
how many people talk to meabout hey, we're selling in the
US, but what do we do and how dowe start selling in Europe and
Asia on Amazon?
You guys are helping us sell inCanada, in Mexico, but we want
to break out because the marketsin the UK, Germany and France
(01:34):
and Japan are really big.
So this is the perfect topic,which is a great place to grow,
and Amazon kind of makes it easy.
So really, first, before we getinto that, I want to know and I
think everybody wants to know alittle bit more about you,
Lezzat, and what inspired you tostart Lezzat.
Alex Karagiannis (01:54):
Yeah, okay, well, thank you very much for
having me on the show.
So I started Lezzat a bit oversix years.
It really started from myjourney as an Amazon seller.
So at the time I was laid offfrom a previous company and all
things came together as such andI stumbled upon, basically,
(02:17):
amazon and a friend of mine toldme that he knows of a person
that's selling Tupperware onAmazon US and making, I think, a
bit over $6 million back then.
So that intrigued me.
I did a course, I startedlearning about Amazon and
started as an Amazon seller.
Soon I realized that it's moredifficult than you would expect
(02:38):
to sell on Amazon, and thatactually started the need to
create Lezat, which essentiallyhelps alleviate those problems
and makes it easier for sellersto sell on Amazon and grow on
Amazon.
So that's the story.
Yeah, no, that's great.
Adam Shaffer (02:54):
So you were doing it yourself and you realize that
Amazon is big, but it'sabsolutely not the easiest thing
to navigate and there's so muchcompetition and so much you
need to know, so it's like neverending.
So the thing is, let's focusmore on international.
Again, I think that most of thesellers not everybody, but most
(03:14):
of the sellers that are sellingare on the North American, or
at least the US, platform today.
Tell us about what's the keydifferences between managing
Amazon accounts in the EU versusthe US.
Alex Karagiannis (03:30):
Yeah, well, quite a few things there.
First of all, the language, Iguess, is probably the easiest
one and thing that most peopleare aware of.
So I guess one of the mainthings that people worry about
is uh.
Well, in the us I only have toworry about one language as such
(03:50):
on the on my listings, um, butin uh, in eu you have quite a
lot.
So you obviously have yourgerman, which is german is the
biggest amazon marketplace, andin europe, then followed by uk,
and then obviously you move intoFrance, spain and Italy, so all
of those you need to havelocalized content.
Now, it goes a bit beyond thisbecause there's also some other
(04:14):
complexities that come with it.
So it's also the regulatory andcompliance which is a big issue
for a lot of sellers.
How you do your fulfillment isalso a big issue, so how you
need to be VAT registered butalso use Amazon's warehouse, and
also where you're going to shipyour majority of your products
to.
So there is a few complexitiesthat are before selling on
(04:38):
Amazon, while you're going to beselling, and obviously making
sure that you know how to do itgoing forward, because managing
PPC in all these languages,restock, et cetera can be more
complex.
However, obviously the price isthere for the grabs, as I say
to our clients, because there'sless competition and actually
(05:00):
Amazon Europe is growing quitefast.
Each year there's more marketsadded to it.
Amazon Europe is growing quitefast.
Each year there's more marketsadded to it.
It's a growing market and it'ssomewhere where we see a lot of
demand for these sort ofservices expanding from US over
to Europe.
Adam Shaffer (05:14):
So if I was a US seller and I wanted to start
selling in Europe, kind of helpme understand in the sequence
that you need to do it.
What are the things?
Yeah, you would.
You mentioned a couple ofthings like compliancy,
regulatory, but I think the batregister report, like you, got
to get that going right yeahyeah that from the last uh, from
(05:36):
our last check, that's forgermany it's at three months.
Alex Karagiannis (05:40):
So this is something that people are not
aware of.
Is, for example, in the uk thatyou can get it done in 48 hours
?
No problem, it's very, veryeasy Online done.
Yeah, it's applications goesthrough, you can have it.
It's a matter of a couple ofdays give or take.
In Germany right now it's fourmonths.
It used to be more, it used tobe seven, so that's not very
(06:02):
easy.
So imagine having all the plansand all the work and everything
ready, only to be told that youhave to wait seven months for a
bureaucratic thing.
So I guess the first step thatpeople need to do is essentially
they need to understand theirtotal addressable market, the
segmented addressable marketthat they're going for, so that
they can understand.
Okay, well, if I take myproduct, which Amazon
(06:24):
marketplaces make sense?
Where do I start?
We usually recommend you startwith one, whether it's Germany
or UK.
Uk is the easiest one, sousually most people go for that,
but also Germany is verylucrative because it opens the
whole EU space.
So you can find distributors ofAmazon.
You can use your D2C websiteand actually translate it and
(06:46):
have a version of it in Germanlanguage.
So it's not just what I'd likelisteners to understand.
It's not when we say we want tostart selling on Amazon in
Europe, we're actually sayingwe're opening a whole new
chessboard in Europe and doingthe fulfillment and everything
right for Amazon means it's alsoapplicable to other retailers
(07:08):
offline, online and D2C.
So first step is understandingwhere.
Learn who your competitors arein each one of those
marketplaces, learn what pricethey're selling in.
If you're able to have sometools, like the leading tools
for searching data and marketsize, etc.
Use some of those to understandwhat's happening and then try
(07:30):
and realistically see whetheryour product, with the reviews
that it has, the USP that it hasand the positioning it has as a
brand, can actually stand there.
That's something I think a lotof people can do, even without
talking to a specialist agencyor using some external help.
That's something any ownercould do on their own.
Just a tip for your audienceObviously, make sure you use a
(07:53):
local postcode.
So if you're in Amazon Germany,find a postcode in Berlin, for
example, and use that so thatyou get the correct searches on
Amazon and not just any searches.
Adam Shaffer (08:07):
So we talked about getting VAT registered in
Germany takes longer than the UK.
Those are the two best marketsto start in.
But if you're selling let's sayif you're selling in Germany
and you have products at Amazon,fba, germany, even if you don't
have the VAT for the otherEuropean countries, can you sell
(08:31):
into them like in the US, or do?
Alex Karagiannis (08:31):
you need to get a VAT for every country.
Yeah, very good question.
Now here, what happens isthere's a threshold.
So the easy way of explainingthis and by all means it's not
that I'm an accountant by tradeas such, but this comes from my
experience and seeing what myclients also do, and I'm also
(08:54):
selling on Amazon Europe so theway it works is there's a
threshold from which you cansell from Germany to Italy, for
example, sell from Germany toItaly, for example, but then if
you exceed that threshold, thenyou need to start paying tax in
Italy for those products.
So there's a tool called OneStop Shop, the OSS, which is a
(09:17):
quick way to actually get VATregistered and attribute your
VAT to all those countries.
So essentially, what's going tohappen is the normal step.
The most common way that we seethings happening is some people
they just set up Amazon Germany.
They have a warehouse outsideof Amazon where they input the
goods, then they drip feedAmazon FBA Germany.
(09:39):
Once that is set up, then theyactivate the rest of the
countries, which is Italy,france, spain, poland, belgium
and Sweden.
It's not as big as the otherones.
They're catching up, but not asbig.
So Italy, france, spain andGermany is what we call the EU4.
So once they activate those,some sales start to come in.
(10:01):
Some sales start to come in.
If a product is very unique andthere's a match out of Amazon,
also a trend, et cetera, thenusually the sales pick up a bit
faster.
When you hit that 10,000 eurothreshold, then actually you
need to be VAT registered inthat specific country.
So it's always good to keep aneye on this, because regulatory
(10:22):
compliance can actually comewith fines and can actually be
something quite annoying forsellers at the beginning.
So it's something that youshould know and take it as a
positive thing, because the moreyou grow, the more you have to
comply with the taxman, and it'sone of those countries.
Adam Shaffer (10:42):
Yeah, okay, so I could start in Germany, but by
being in Germany I couldleverage all of Europe until I
get to 10,000 or thereabouts.
Amazon doesn't stop you.
You have to self-regulate.
Announcement (10:55):
Will Amazon keep on?
Adam Shaffer (10:55):
selling.
Will they suspend your item inthose countries?
Alex Karagiannis (10:59):
No, no, no.
So you guys, you got to managethat.
Amazon says it's yourresponsibility to pay that where
you should.
I don't care, okay, got it Gotit.
Adam Shaffer (11:09):
So that's interesting and so it's great.
And is Germany the place thatpeople go to put their products
at FBA to leverage Europe, orare they doing it in Poland.
Alex Karagiannis (11:22):
Yeah, so well.
The thing is, germany is themain one, and the reason behind
this is because, first of all,germany is, in terms of
population and location,actually is very central to
Europe, so countries like Poland, for example, would purchase,
austria would purchase, and soon.
Secondly, amazon has started toexpand.
(11:46):
There's a program, essentially,so in other countries where
Amazon doesn't have amarketplace, if you buy from
Amazon Germany, the freedelivery is up to 50 euros or
over, so actually it's prettyeconomical really to even
purchase from a country likeGreece to buy from Amazon
Germany your products and prettygood service in terms of
delivery.
So, as such, what has happenedis Amazon Germany has grown a
(12:07):
lot.
It's become the biggest one inEurope and continues to grow.
So that's where people focustheir effort and that's where we
would recommend they focus itas well and then localize it in
other countries.
Adam Shaffer (12:23):
Cool, so that's great, and my guess is, this is
why you need help, because itactually can be a little
complicated.
So I have a product.
It's doing great in the US.
It's got lots of reviews, fivestars.
I want to sell it in Englandand Germany.
What happens?
(12:43):
Am I able to port my reviews?
I'm always told I could portthe reviews over.
Is that true or not?
Alex Karagiannis (12:49):
Yeah, very good question.
So it depends on two methods.
One is the wrong method and oneis the correct method.
So the wrong method, but if youdo it, you're not going to get
the reviews across.
The wrong method is usually oneof the two problems people have
.
One is they create a new SKU.
It's a very, very small detailand it's one of those things
(13:13):
that gets slipped.
But if you don't have an Amazonexpert by your side or an
e-commerce expert, it mighthappen.
So they say, well, we have thisproduct.
Well, we're going to sell inGermany.
Okay, well, we need newpackaging.
Okay, well, new packaging.
Okay, well, new packaging meansuse barcode, and that's where
the issue becomes.
So when they create that newbarcode, then you cannot carry
those reviews with you, so thebarcode has to be the same so
(13:35):
your UPC has to be the sameright.
Yes, that's the uniqueidentifier of Amazon saying that
this product is linked withthis product.
Adam Shaffer (13:44):
So, basically, you're taking an ASIN you have
in the US and you're bringingthe same ASIN over.
You're not creating a brand newASIN, and by making it the same
exact ASIN, they let you bringthe reviews over.
Is that right?
Alex Karagiannis (13:58):
Exactly, you got it 100%, adam.
You got it yes.
And then, to comply with thelocal regulations, you can put
stickers on top of it to sayabout the warnings, the
suffocation warnings, thedistributor address, the local
address, local telephone line.
Adam Shaffer (14:13):
I was just going to ask you do you really need to
have separate packaging?
And you're saying you putstickers.
Alex Karagiannis (14:18):
You're saying you put stickers, no stickers.
Stickers is the best way to doit.
Or you could just have theversion of your packaging in the
other language, but thebarcodes remain the same.
Everything else is exactly thesame.
So that's how more people do it.
Adam Shaffer (14:33):
Yes, and do you get all the reviews, or they
only let you take some, all ofthem, all of them.
Okay, I mean, that's a hugebenefit, right?
I mean, if you worked so hardto get those reviews.
Alex Karagiannis (14:45):
Exactly, and that's why it's also you don't
start from step number one, sosome people might falsely
believe that, well, amazon wasso hard to start back in the day
to get this, I don't want to doit again and start from scratch
, and so on.
You actually have a very goodhead start with those reviews
going in, let alone some brandrecognition, let alone also
(15:09):
Amazon does.
I don't know if you're aware ofthis, but Amazon also has
incentives for US sellers, onethat gets all over in Europe,
and there's quite big incentivesin terms of cash back and
allowances, et.
Etc.
That they offer, usuallythrough approved agencies and
such.
But this is also a very clearwinner, essentially, and a
(15:31):
reason why people could comeover.
Adam Shaffer (15:33):
And if I'm in the US and I have products here that
I want to ship over to Germanyor UK, do I need to have a 3PL
or somebody on the ground there,or can I ship it directly to
FBA?
Alex Karagiannis (15:45):
Yeah, well, that's the other thing.
People do it.
So my usual recommendation istry not to even consider doing
Amazon Europe if you're notdoing at least 2 million and up
per annum on Amazon US.
The reason why I'm saying thisto you is because the correct
(16:10):
setup is you need to have alocal warehouse in EU.
Now you might want to have itin the Netherlands.
A lot of people have it therebecause they can actually just
arrive, it's quick to get yourEORI number and your VAT number
there and then while you applyfor your german and so on, and
also netherlands is a very, verygood hub for custom clearance
in europe, etc.
(16:30):
So the reason why this ishappening is I'll just give you
a real example of an actual casethat happened to us last week.
So we had an account came overand they had their account
closed because a previous expertdidn't know what they were
doing.
Anyhow, they put a lot of stockinto Amazon.
They had got a section three.
We unblocked the account.
(16:51):
Oh well, then we see thatthere's a lot of stock that they
sent.
They had sent pallets andpallets for the first order,
because Amazon as a new sellerallows you to send as much as
you want.
But then obviously it's aticket time bomb, because now
they have a lot of stock, nowthat client is not in a country,
in Bulgaria, so they don't havea marketplace there.
(17:12):
So we go into Amazon and say,well, remove some of that
inventory right, send it back tothe customer.
You can't.
Amazon says removal orders youcan only do on an Amazon
marketplace.
So Germany, france, italy,spain, netherlands, belgium,
sweden, poland, give me anaddress there, okay.
(17:34):
So that's a very common.
Adam Shaffer (17:38):
So if you're going to remove product, it's got to
go back to one of the Amazoncountries, Correct.
Otherwise you liquidate.
To remove product, it's got togo back to one of the Amazon
countries Correct.
Alex Karagiannis (17:43):
Otherwise you liquidate it or you dispose it,
and all of these come withever-increasing costs by Amazon.
So again, that's why I say,when you're trying to look at
opening a Europe Amazon Europe,try and think of it as opening a
new chessboard.
Amazon is a big thing of it,but also you want to utilize it
(18:04):
for other things as well.
So finding offline distributors, finding et cetera.
That way you can best utilizebig shipments sending to Europe,
your containers as such, and beable to move products much
faster in this continent.
Adam Shaffer (18:20):
Okay, I didn't realize that.
So you got to have some kind oflocal in one of the countries.
You got to have some localwarehouse, this 3PL, something
to hold your products and feedit to Amazon.
Alex Karagiannis (18:31):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, because in US it's like
remove order.
Okay, well, it's in Texas, okay, let's send it, I don't know,
in California, whatever, oh yes,but in Europe.
Oh yes, but in Europe that'snot the case.
Adam Shaffer (18:42):
You cannot send it anywhere you want and you
talked about, I guess,localization earlier.
But if you have an ASIN, let'sgo back to.
I have this ASIN in the US.
It's got five stars, it's gottons of reviews.
I'm going to turn it on inGermany, but I have it in
English.
Is Amazon, when I do, canada ittranslates it, or Mexico
(19:02):
translates it?
Is it going to translate it oram I going to have to redo the
entire copy?
Alex Karagiannis (19:08):
Well, I think you know the answer to that one.
Unfortunately, theauto-translation is not there,
and it's one of those mostcommon things.
Matt, I'm sure you'veunderstood how competitive
Amazon is also becoming, in thesense of bigger brands are
joining in.
(19:28):
They're using Amazon as a mainrevenue source.
They're optimizing listingkeywords.
This is exactly what'shappening over this side of the
Atlantic as well.
So therefore, your Germanlisting is not just a closed
translation, it's not just goingto cut it.
You need those keywords, youneed to speak the language of a
consumer, you need to use theterminology that people use for
(19:53):
the specific product, and so on.
That does include your A-pluscontent and your brand story and
your video and infographics, soit's very crucial.
Another tip for your audiencewhenever you do design work
whether it's with an agency orsomeone else, a third party or
in-house make sure you keepthose source files ready,
because you never know when youneed to reopen them and just
(20:15):
change the English to French orItalian and so on.
That's going to be very handy.
Adam Shaffer (20:21):
But you need to actually to be successful if you
want to have the right copy,the right SEO, you kind of have
to start from scratch and redothe copy.
Maybe the pictures are good,but the call-outs have to be
changed.
Alex Karagiannis (20:35):
Correct, it has to be in German language.
That's why I say UK is a biteasier, so UK, you don't really
have to do that.
Okay, a difference betweenamerican english and uk english
it's um, but very littledifferences and etc.
Maybe there are some changes inhow people search on amazoncouk
as opposed to dot com, but it'svery small compared to,
(20:57):
obviously, the othermarketplaces.
Um, so in germany, france,italy and spain you have to have
local English is not going tocut it.
Adam Shaffer (21:05):
So if I have brand registry in the US, do I need
to apply for brand registry inEurope?
Alex Karagiannis (21:12):
Yes, so you have what's called the EU IPO,
so European Union IntellectualProperty Office, which is over
in Madrid.
So you need to do that, whichis going to take.
Well, it depends on your case,etc.
Sometimes some big brands overin the US have global trademarks
.
If you have a global one, youalready have it.
If you only have US, you needto do the EU one and if you are
(21:36):
going to sell in UK, you needthe UK one.
So prices for those depend.
Really, if you do it alone,most sellers can do them DIY.
They can do them themselves.
It's pretty self-executive andeasy process to do and it can
take anywhere.
Really, from my experience,anywhere between three, maybe
(21:59):
four to five months.
It depends.
Adam Shaffer (22:01):
Really.
But you can't use the UStrademark.
You can't use a US trademark,no.
So you got to get an EU or aBritish trademark.
In the US they have thisprogram called IP Accelerator
where you could use an approvedlawyer, ip lawyer in the US and
before you get the trademarkcompleted, which could take a
(22:22):
while, in a couple of weeksyou're up on Amazon with brand
registry.
Does that exist?
Alex Karagiannis (22:27):
Yes, so in US the trademark process there's
more scrutiny around it.
In UK and EU it's a bit easierto go to navigate through this
and you can actually just putyour application number.
So even though it's pending, itstill goes through.
So then when it gets granted,it's automatically granted.
So it's one of those quickthings that you want to look at
(22:48):
together as you're doing yourVAT and your EORI, which is your
import code.
As such, you want to look atthat EU and UK IPO together.
Adam Shaffer (22:59):
But it's the same concept.
You need to have brand registryto have A-plus content.
You need to have brand registryto run certain advertising.
You need brand registry toprotect your content.
It's the same same old, sameold.
Yes, I mean, that's a big deal.
So part of getting the VAT, yougot to get brand registry
sorted out if you want to havegood content or you won't be
able to bring over your A-pluscontent, I imagine Correct.
Alex Karagiannis (23:22):
You won't be able to bring over your A-plus
content, I imagine.
Correct, wow, okay Again.
That's why I said there's areason why I set the threshold
before to this type of sellersto that level of revenue.
Yeah, because you will have asetup fee.
Right, whether you go with aspecialist agency like us or
anyone, a consultant or anything, you will need to do those
(23:42):
things because you want to dothem as professional as possible
to give the best chances thatyou can to grow in those
marketplaces.
And the first couple of monthsobviously is about setting,
getting that data back fromAmazon, advertising, ranking,
all of those things.
So realistic expectation isthere's going to be a couple of
months where you collect databefore you actually start seeing
those things.
So realistic expectation isthere's going to be a couple of
months where you collect databefore you actually start seeing
(24:05):
those results, very similar towhen you launch a new product on
Amazon.
Really, you don't expect monthone or month two to be high
profit, high revenue no, but I'mhoping with the reviews.
Adam Shaffer (24:15):
I'm hoping with the reviews and hopefully the
content, I could get somerunning start anyway.
Alex Karagiannis (24:22):
Absolutely Well.
The other thing that's good isyou can do Vine again, okay you
can do.
Vine again to get more reviews.
You can re-Vine them if youwant.
Adam Shaffer (24:32):
It's the same program in the countries.
Yeah, cool.
Okay, that's great.
Now you talked a little bitabout the advertising, but PPC,
so you're spending a lot ofmoney on advertising in the US.
Is there a way to go to schoolon the advertising that you've
been doing in the US and bringit over there, or are you really
(24:53):
starting from scratch?
Alex Karagiannis (25:03):
not, because what happens is on your, your
advertising.
You will have realized a fewthings around.
First of all, create.
Let's start from the creatives.
Okay, so the creative sides ofthe most more advanced type of
campaigns your sponsor brand,for example, or video, the
creatives that you have split abe tested.
Those will still apply.
Main image, which obviouslyapplies for your sponsor product
.
Again, speed data testing, yourmain image for CTR and so on.
(25:26):
Those experiments will stillapply.
So therefore, you can bringwith you lessons learned,
because an optimized Amazonimage is the same in US and in
Germany.
Now what you need to startlearning a bit more is your
other data, like yourcompetitors, or maybe the
category, or maybe the ASINyou're targeting or the keywords
(25:49):
you're targeting, that sort ofthing.
But again, you're not startingfrom scratch.
Also, you will have a betterunderstanding of how you're
doing your upper funnel, midfunnel and lower funnel in US
and how you're allocating budgetto those different type of
campaigns, so you can use asimilar structure as well.
So month one is going to looklike this.
(26:10):
Month six, my setup, should belooking something like this and
you can start to bring this inthat methodology, bring it in
into Europe as well, and fromour experience, it's less
competitive than US.
Us budgets are much higher forPPC and there's a lot more
(26:30):
competition in AI tools andagencies involved, whereas in
Europe it's significantly less.
So we tend to see very, verygood ROAS over here.
Adam Shaffer (26:41):
You know, one of the things we do for our clients
is we help them maintain whatthey call minimum advertised
price or MAP in the US, and wehelp them by creating a policy
that works for their channel.
And we help find unauthorizedsellers and find the source that
they're getting it from andgetting it off the platform to
make it a cleaner channel onAmazon.
(27:03):
But I think, and you tell me,in some of the countries you
can't have a minimum advertisedprice.
Is that right?
Alex Karagiannis (27:10):
No, you're right, this is a very, very,
very good question.
So, for example, in the UK,you've got the.
It's an anti-competition law,so you cannot say this.
So you cannot say, actually,well, this product, if I sell it
to distributors, thedistributors are not allowed to
sell it below this price, forexample.
That is not allowed and that isactually.
It's an offense.
You can actually have veryserious consequences with this.
(27:33):
Similar versions of this appliesto EU as well, to a different
extent in its country.
So the reason as such theenforcement of losing your buy
box and the enforcement ofmaintaining a price is a very
delicate process and somethingyou need to manage.
Now, it really depends on thesize of the clients.
(27:56):
Now we've seen clients thatcome over to Europe and say,
well, spain and Italy haveexclusivities, so we don't touch
those, we just update thelistings, update the content and
obviously their distributors,their exclusive distributors in
those countries, sell, and thenother countries, like Germany,
for example, is up for grabs, soin which case, they're the
(28:16):
exclusive seller.
Now there are procedures inplace.
If someone, for example, isselling your product, how to go
about it?
You buy one, you see if it'sexact where they get it from.
If need be, you can usetransparency, although I
wouldn't necessarily recommendthat.
But you don't get this issue ofwhat you see very often in the
(28:38):
US with hijackers and alsopeople selling a copycat of your
product.
It's easier done in the US thanit is in the EU and one of the
main reasons is there's a lot ofpaperwork involved when you're
setting up firstly in the EU.
So you're lucid.
Maybe you've heard of thatwhich has to do with recycling
(28:59):
and how you abide with recyclingregulations and plastic
regulations, etc.
So all of these are very, veryimportant and actually help make
it difficult to enter, but alsothe people that are makes it a
better room for them to growprofessionally professionally,
but it's the same story.
Adam Shaffer (29:20):
If you have a few different sellers on your ASIN,
the lower price is going to mostlikely win, as long as it's
prime right.
Alex Karagiannis (29:27):
But from where would you get them?
If you were never selling inEurope, where did you get these?
So it's probably you're goingto have two types of sellers.
You're going to have the personwho's selling, I don't know
let's say water bottles, andthen they're selling water
bottles that are unique, etcetera, and they're doing I
(29:48):
don't know something like 5million on Amazon per year.
They've never sold in Europe.
They had one time a distributorin the UK didn't do much.
Their product does not exist inEurope.
So those people, there's nevergoing to be anyone that competes
with them in Europe.
Adam Shaffer (30:07):
So the less distributed you are, the better
you are.
Alex Karagiannis (30:10):
Yeah, and then the bigger ones, the much, much
bigger ones, which are usuallywithin the top five in their
industry.
We were talking to one of thosein the pet category doing
exactly this.
They're very big, they'renumber one actually in their
respective category in the US.
(30:31):
And then in Europe they havesome other copycats.
They have some of their productbeing sold at a ridiculously
high price X5, et cetera.
So when they go into thatmarket then actually that's like
a cleanup process, becauseyou've got the original, you've
got the ownership, you've gotthe correct price, et cetera.
(30:54):
If anyone's trying to use thedesign, et cetera, you can get
those down.
So it's part of that process.
It's a slow process, but theproblem is not as big as it's
part of that process.
It's a slow process, but theproblem is not as big as it's
over in the US on similar cases.
Adam Shaffer (31:07):
And are you finding with pricing, if
somebody's selling something for$100 in the US, is it usually
just translated or are theytrying to make more money in
Europe?
What do you think is theaverage kind of thing out there?
So you mean, I'm selling it for$100, but I'm now going to
start selling it in the UK orGermany.
Do you think I'm able toconvert the price so I can make
(31:29):
$10 or $20 more, or am I goingto be probably on par with my US
pricing?
Can you make more margin inEurope?
Alex Karagiannis (31:36):
Yes, you can actually Again, because this
goes back to the first thingthat I mentioned in terms of how
you want to be doing yourmarket research before going in.
So you're in a very, very, verygood position if your products
are more in the premium range.
You're in a very good positionif you're one of the original
inventors of something, and thenyou don't have a lot of
(31:58):
competition.
So therefore, you can justifywhy the price is more expensive
in Europe rather than UKcompared to your listings.
So it's not a direct exchangerate conversion as such.
Adam Shaffer (32:12):
And when it comes to ASINs, could you be, I guess,
suspended or delisted for a SKUor an ASIN in one country and
not another?
Or is it, once you're delisted,you're delisted for a skewer in
one country and not another?
Or is it, once you're delisted,you're delisted?
Alex Karagiannis (32:24):
No, it's the first what you just said.
So you can get a, let's say,trademark violation, a policy
violation, and that takes downyour listing in Italy, but Spain
and France and Germanycontinues as normal, for example
.
Okay.
Adam Shaffer (32:38):
Very rare, but yeah, yeah, yeah, okay,
continues as normal.
For example very rare, but yeah, yeah, yeah, okay.
And when you're, if you'reagain an fba in germany but
you're somebody in another,another country's buying your
stuff, are they changing whatyou pay, amazon, or is it still
fixed?
You're, you go into the amazoncalculator, it tells you what
the fba price is and that's yourprice, or is it?
(32:59):
Is it changing if somebody'sbuying it from poland, from
germany, then germany to germany?
Alex Karagiannis (33:04):
so.
So there's different settingsin your, your shipment settings
in terms of if you send outsideof germany, what the charge is.
So usually there's deliveryfees involved.
So if I'm buying, let's say,something from greece, from
amazon germany, there's deliveryfees involved.
If I exceed the first, there'slike coupons, and then those are
(33:24):
waived.
And if I buy from Germany andI'm in Germany, it's obviously
free, with prime over a certainthreshold, or if I'm a member,
and so on.
It's very similar, I guess, tothe sense of if you're in US and
you buy from somewhere abroad,let's say somewhere in Latin
America, for example, or you buywithin the country in the US.
(33:46):
That's how that goes.
Adam Shaffer (33:49):
And so, going back to the markets, germany's
biggest UK, france, italy.
Alex Karagiannis (33:55):
Spain.
Yeah, so I mean just a bit fromthe top of my head just to give
you a bit in terms of how bigit is on a monthly user basis.
Now, these are just estimatednumbers based on the last data I
had.
But you're looking at somethingaround half a billion searches
(34:16):
on Amazon Germany per month.
Searches is on Amazon Germanyper month, and then you've got
something like 350 on UK, andthen it goes 160, 160.
So France and Italy is more orless the same, and then just a
tiny bit less is Amazon Spain,and then all the other ones are.
(34:38):
Then the gap is quite big.
So Netherlands is about 20,sweden is about 15, poland 15,
belgium 11.
And, just to give you anunderstanding, com is 2.2
billion.
So if I add all those together,roughly you could say that the
(35:00):
searches are about 60% of com isall of Europe.
But then next year we've gotIreland coming up.
So that's exciting becauseyou've got a country that has
quite a lot of spend onlineclose to UK.
Many other things that canactually work well and it keeps
on growing.
(35:20):
Turkey came online last yearand it's just continuing.
There's more and more countriesadded, so that number is going
to be growing higher and higher.
Adam Shaffer (35:33):
Cool, that's great .
And then just a quickie oncustomer service.
So you're dealing with multiplelanguages, multiple questions.
Are you able to deal with thiscentrally, or do you need people
in different countries?
How does that work?
Alex Karagiannis (35:46):
no, no, that's it.
That's, that's the easy bit.
That's that's where things likechat, gpt and your translators
are fine, because 99.9 is thesame question.
Right, I got my product isdamaged, or, uh, you send me
either wrong or I wanted an SDS.
Now that's something else.
If your products are chemical,for example, you may need the
(36:06):
MSDS or SDS as it's also called.
You'll save the data sheetsthose need to be translated over
to its language.
But customer service isespecially in FBA.
Most of the listeners, ifthey're selling on Amazon, they
know they rarely, rarely have amessage from someone on Amazon
Very rarely, because 99.9% it'ssomething like where's my
(36:28):
shipment?
I haven't received it, it'sdamaged, I need a replacement.
And this is where the beauty ofFBA comes in.
So, no, you don't need peoplethat speak the local language,
you can just go about with thetranslation.
It's fine.
And should the same sort ofquestions arise again and again
and again, let's say invoicing,et cetera you can just have a
(36:49):
template and use that how theycan self-service to get those.
Adam Shaffer (36:54):
Essentially, Okay, thanks, that's great, and what
are we missing?
What are we not talking about,alex, that people might want to
know about?
I mean, I'm sure we can go onforever about this and it's
really interesting, but tell me,like, what are the topics we're
not hitting right now that youwant to talk about?
Alex Karagiannis (37:13):
In terms of the EU expansion.
Yes, specifically, specifically.
So well, the the things thatwe're not talking about is one
uh, it's not understanding.
Your pricing is not going to bevery easy.
So people think is I'm justgoing to throw my products into
amazon germany and then I'mgoing to sell in amazon germany
(37:35):
and I'm just going to activatefrance, italy, spain, etc.
And then it's going to sendthat.
Okay, what's the fees involved?
Because if you send fromgermany to france, they're big
fees and they keep on increasing.
So really you're not going todo that.
It's going to be very expensive.
So if you just to give anunderstanding for something like
normal size, like, let's say,mobile phone size thing,
(37:56):
something that would be 380 ingermany, sending it to france
eight.
So is it really worth it?
You know, if you're sellingsomething for 800, yeah, okay,
but if most people that sellsomething for like 15, 20, 25,
30, you need to consider this.
So that's that's, that's a,that's something to consider
when you're at the initialstages, and not that registered
(38:18):
in france as well.
The other thing is for thebigger players that want to
expand, when you get VATregistered in France, italy,
spain, germany, so all of thosecountries together.
There's the benefit of what'scalled pan-European FBA, so
that's like a very, very highlevel program of Amazon that
(38:38):
unfortunately, was advertised assomething easy that anyone can
do, but really it's only forcompanies who are really big
that can utilize it, because youwant to be VAT-registered in
France, italy, spain and Germany.
So then Amazon just moves theinventory around to just make
sure you have enough for Prime.
The other thing that I wouldsay is, again, depending on your
(39:00):
size as a company, you want tostart preparing and getting
organized all your assetstogether, so videos that you
have, ugc, contents that otherpeople have created for you,
maybe you can get source filesof those You're in for graphics
and A-plus content all nice andtight in one place, with source
(39:20):
files of those.
Your infographics and A-pluscontent all nice and tight in
one place with source files.
So having everything neat isgoing to make the translation
localization much quicker andactually very, very efficient.
So that's very important.
Make sure you have very goodunderstanding of the regulatory
and compliance Use a veryprofessional agency that does
(39:41):
this and someone that knows whatthey're doing, and I think,
finally, make sure that you haveenough stock.
I think you hear a lot ofpeople that say this.
It's the number one rule.
It's probably the only thingthat we ask of sellers.
Do not run out of stock.
It's like building like yourlittle bonfire and then if it
(40:01):
just dies out, it's going totake a while to get it back up
To start it again.
Adam Shaffer (40:05):
I know that makes sense, yeah.
Alex Karagiannis (40:06):
Your honeymoon period, your launch your vine,
all of that stuff.
Adam Shaffer (40:11):
That is awesome.
Well, I've definitely learned alot and I can keep on asking.
I'll probably email you morequestions because I'm quite
interested in expanding outthere.
But for people that want tomake the jump and start selling
in Europe, how can they get intouch with you if they need some
help?
Alex Karagiannis (40:30):
Yeah, sure, okay, well, the easiest is
either through our website,lezzat.
co.
uk, or lezzat.
com, it's the same.
They can reach out to me onLinkedIn, alex karagiannis, so
you can find me there, or justemail me on, alex, at lesatcouk.
I'm happy to do an audit tojust show them if eu is right
(40:52):
fit for them so we can send thema personalized custom plan.
You're going to see my face onthat video, so it's not going to
be one video for all.
We're going to see my face onthat video, so it's not going to
be one video for all.
We're going to do it fullycustomized, to just make sure if
EU is right for them Is theright size.
Can it happen?
Is there anything to be awareof?
Maybe they just take somespecific SKUs and not their
(41:13):
entire catalog, what it wouldlook like, so happy to offer
that to anyone listening.
Adam Shaffer (41:20):
That is awesome.
I'm going to do the audit justso I can see your face.
That is great.
Yeah, it's quite a benefit.
So, with that, thank you forjoining planet amazon.
I mean, this is just an awesometopic and thanks for helping at
least explain some of theissues that people have and some
of the benefits they're goingto have.
It's really, really importantcool, cool, my pleasure.
Alex Karagiannis (41:40):
Thank you very much, adam.
Thank you for having me.
Announcement (41:44):
Thank you for watching another episode of the
Planet Amazon podcast, where wetalk all things Amazon.
If you want to learn about howto accelerate your sales on
Amazon, visit Phelps United'swebsite at phelpsunitedcom.
Welcome to the Planet Amazon podcast with Adam
Shaffer, where we explore theworld of Amazon and other
e-commerce marketplaces.
Join us as we delve into thelatest strategies and tactics
for successful selling on theworld's largest online
marketplace.
Adam Shaffer (00:18):
Hello, I'm Adam Shaffer, and welcome to Planet
Amazon, where we talk about allthings Amazon.
Today on Planet Amazon, we'rethrilled to welcome Alex
Karagiannis, the founder andowner of Lezzat, a UK-based
digital marketing agencyspecializing in Amazon services.
With a strong presence in boththe UK and Greece, lazat
(00:44):
supports brands across the globein navigating complexities of
the Amazon marketplace.
Alex himself is an Amazon FBAseller and the founder of the
Athens e-commerce meetup,bringing years of on-hands
experience and insights into theever-evolving e-commerce
landscape.
Today, we're diving into thecritical topic of managing
Amazon accounts for globalbrands, the challenges that come
(01:06):
with it and how companies canstay ahead of this dynamic
environment.
Announcement (01:11):
Alex, welcome to the show.
Adam Shaffer (01:11):
It's great to have you here.
This is an awesome topic totalk about, because I don't know
how many people talk to meabout hey, we're selling in the
US, but what do we do and how dowe start selling in Europe and
Asia on Amazon?
You guys are helping us sell inCanada, in Mexico, but we want
to break out because the marketsin the UK, Germany and France
(01:34):
and Japan are really big.
So this is the perfect topic,which is a great place to grow,
and Amazon kind of makes it easy.
So really, first, before we getinto that, I want to know and I
think everybody wants to know alittle bit more about you,
Lezzat, and what inspired you tostart Lezzat.
Alex Karagiannis (01:54):
Yeah, okay, well, thank you very much for
having me on the show.
So I started Lezzat a bit oversix years.
It really started from myjourney as an Amazon seller.
So at the time I was laid offfrom a previous company and all
things came together as such andI stumbled upon, basically,
(02:17):
amazon and a friend of mine toldme that he knows of a person
that's selling Tupperware onAmazon US and making, I think, a
bit over $6 million back then.
So that intrigued me.
I did a course, I startedlearning about Amazon and
started as an Amazon seller.
Soon I realized that it's moredifficult than you would expect
(02:38):
to sell on Amazon, and thatactually started the need to
create Lezat, which essentiallyhelps alleviate those problems
and makes it easier for sellersto sell on Amazon and grow on
Amazon.
So that's the story.
Yeah, no, that's great.
Adam Shaffer (02:54):
So you were doing it yourself and you realize that
Amazon is big, but it'sabsolutely not the easiest thing
to navigate and there's so muchcompetition and so much you
need to know, so it's like neverending.
So the thing is, let's focusmore on international.
Again, I think that most of thesellers not everybody, but most
(03:14):
of the sellers that are sellingare on the North American, or
at least the US, platform today.
Tell us about what's the keydifferences between managing
Amazon accounts in the EU versusthe US.
Alex Karagiannis (03:30):
Yeah, well, quite a few things there.
First of all, the language, Iguess, is probably the easiest
one and thing that most peopleare aware of.
So I guess one of the mainthings that people worry about
is uh.
Well, in the us I only have toworry about one language as such
(03:50):
on the on my listings, um, butin uh, in eu you have quite a
lot.
So you obviously have yourgerman, which is german is the
biggest amazon marketplace, andin europe, then followed by uk,
and then obviously you move intoFrance, spain and Italy, so all
of those you need to havelocalized content.
Now, it goes a bit beyond thisbecause there's also some other
(04:14):
complexities that come with it.
So it's also the regulatory andcompliance which is a big issue
for a lot of sellers.
How you do your fulfillment isalso a big issue, so how you
need to be VAT registered butalso use Amazon's warehouse, and
also where you're going to shipyour majority of your products
to.
So there is a few complexitiesthat are before selling on
(04:38):
Amazon, while you're going to beselling, and obviously making
sure that you know how to do itgoing forward, because managing
PPC in all these languages,restock, et cetera can be more
complex.
However, obviously the price isthere for the grabs, as I say
to our clients, because there'sless competition and actually
(05:00):
Amazon Europe is growing quitefast.
Each year there's more marketsadded to it.
Amazon Europe is growing quitefast.
Each year there's more marketsadded to it.
It's a growing market and it'ssomewhere where we see a lot of
demand for these sort ofservices expanding from US over
to Europe.
Adam Shaffer (05:14):
So if I was a US seller and I wanted to start
selling in Europe, kind of helpme understand in the sequence
that you need to do it.
What are the things?
Yeah, you would.
You mentioned a couple ofthings like compliancy,
regulatory, but I think the batregister report, like you, got
to get that going right yeahyeah that from the last uh, from
(05:36):
our last check, that's forgermany it's at three months.
Alex Karagiannis (05:40):
So this is something that people are not
aware of.
Is, for example, in the uk thatyou can get it done in 48 hours
?
No problem, it's very, veryeasy Online done.
Yeah, it's applications goesthrough, you can have it.
It's a matter of a couple ofdays give or take.
In Germany right now it's fourmonths.
It used to be more, it used tobe seven, so that's not very
(06:02):
easy.
So imagine having all the plansand all the work and everything
ready, only to be told that youhave to wait seven months for a
bureaucratic thing.
So I guess the first step thatpeople need to do is essentially
they need to understand theirtotal addressable market, the
segmented addressable marketthat they're going for, so that
they can understand.
Okay, well, if I take myproduct, which Amazon
(06:24):
marketplaces make sense?
Where do I start?
We usually recommend you startwith one, whether it's Germany
or UK.
Uk is the easiest one, sousually most people go for that,
but also Germany is verylucrative because it opens the
whole EU space.
So you can find distributors ofAmazon.
You can use your D2C websiteand actually translate it and
(06:46):
have a version of it in Germanlanguage.
So it's not just what I'd likelisteners to understand.
It's not when we say we want tostart selling on Amazon in
Europe, we're actually sayingwe're opening a whole new
chessboard in Europe and doingthe fulfillment and everything
right for Amazon means it's alsoapplicable to other retailers
(07:08):
offline, online and D2C.
So first step is understandingwhere.
Learn who your competitors arein each one of those
marketplaces, learn what pricethey're selling in.
If you're able to have sometools, like the leading tools
for searching data and marketsize, etc.
Use some of those to understandwhat's happening and then try
(07:30):
and realistically see whetheryour product, with the reviews
that it has, the USP that it hasand the positioning it has as a
brand, can actually stand there.
That's something I think a lotof people can do, even without
talking to a specialist agencyor using some external help.
That's something any ownercould do on their own.
Just a tip for your audienceObviously, make sure you use a
(07:53):
local postcode.
So if you're in Amazon Germany,find a postcode in Berlin, for
example, and use that so thatyou get the correct searches on
Amazon and not just any searches.
Adam Shaffer (08:07):
So we talked about getting VAT registered in
Germany takes longer than the UK.
Those are the two best marketsto start in.
But if you're selling let's sayif you're selling in Germany
and you have products at Amazon,fba, germany, even if you don't
have the VAT for the otherEuropean countries, can you sell
(08:31):
into them like in the US, or do?
Alex Karagiannis (08:31):
you need to get a VAT for every country.
Yeah, very good question.
Now here, what happens isthere's a threshold.
So the easy way of explainingthis and by all means it's not
that I'm an accountant by tradeas such, but this comes from my
experience and seeing what myclients also do, and I'm also
(08:54):
selling on Amazon Europe so theway it works is there's a
threshold from which you cansell from Germany to Italy, for
example, sell from Germany toItaly, for example, but then if
you exceed that threshold, thenyou need to start paying tax in
Italy for those products.
So there's a tool called OneStop Shop, the OSS, which is a
(09:17):
quick way to actually get VATregistered and attribute your
VAT to all those countries.
So essentially, what's going tohappen is the normal step.
The most common way that we seethings happening is some people
they just set up Amazon Germany.
They have a warehouse outsideof Amazon where they input the
goods, then they drip feedAmazon FBA Germany.
(09:39):
Once that is set up, then theyactivate the rest of the
countries, which is Italy,france, spain, poland, belgium
and Sweden.
It's not as big as the otherones.
They're catching up, but not asbig.
So Italy, france, spain andGermany is what we call the EU4.
So once they activate those,some sales start to come in.
(10:01):
Some sales start to come in.
If a product is very unique andthere's a match out of Amazon,
also a trend, et cetera, thenusually the sales pick up a bit
faster.
When you hit that 10,000 eurothreshold, then actually you
need to be VAT registered inthat specific country.
So it's always good to keep aneye on this, because regulatory
(10:22):
compliance can actually comewith fines and can actually be
something quite annoying forsellers at the beginning.
So it's something that youshould know and take it as a
positive thing, because the moreyou grow, the more you have to
comply with the taxman, and it'sone of those countries.
Adam Shaffer (10:42):
Yeah, okay, so I could start in Germany, but by
being in Germany I couldleverage all of Europe until I
get to 10,000 or thereabouts.
Amazon doesn't stop you.
You have to self-regulate.
Announcement (10:55):
Will Amazon keep on?
Adam Shaffer (10:55):
selling.
Will they suspend your item inthose countries?
Alex Karagiannis (10:59):
No, no, no.
So you guys, you got to managethat.
Amazon says it's yourresponsibility to pay that where
you should.
I don't care, okay, got it Gotit.
Adam Shaffer (11:09):
So that's interesting and so it's great.
And is Germany the place thatpeople go to put their products
at FBA to leverage Europe, orare they doing it in Poland.
Alex Karagiannis (11:22):
Yeah, so well.
The thing is, germany is themain one, and the reason behind
this is because, first of all,germany is, in terms of
population and location,actually is very central to
Europe, so countries like Poland, for example, would purchase,
austria would purchase, and soon.
Secondly, amazon has started toexpand.
(11:46):
There's a program, essentially,so in other countries where
Amazon doesn't have amarketplace, if you buy from
Amazon Germany, the freedelivery is up to 50 euros or
over, so actually it's prettyeconomical really to even
purchase from a country likeGreece to buy from Amazon
Germany your products and prettygood service in terms of
delivery.
So, as such, what has happenedis Amazon Germany has grown a
(12:07):
lot.
It's become the biggest one inEurope and continues to grow.
So that's where people focustheir effort and that's where we
would recommend they focus itas well and then localize it in
other countries.
Adam Shaffer (12:23):
Cool, so that's great, and my guess is, this is
why you need help, because itactually can be a little
complicated.
So I have a product.
It's doing great in the US.
It's got lots of reviews, fivestars.
I want to sell it in Englandand Germany.
What happens?
(12:43):
Am I able to port my reviews?
I'm always told I could portthe reviews over.
Is that true or not?
Alex Karagiannis (12:49):
Yeah, very good question.
So it depends on two methods.
One is the wrong method and oneis the correct method.
So the wrong method, but if youdo it, you're not going to get
the reviews across.
The wrong method is usually oneof the two problems people have
.
One is they create a new SKU.
It's a very, very small detailand it's one of those things
(13:13):
that gets slipped.
But if you don't have an Amazonexpert by your side or an
e-commerce expert, it mighthappen.
So they say, well, we have thisproduct.
Well, we're going to sell inGermany.
Okay, well, we need newpackaging.
Okay, well, new packaging.
Okay, well, new packaging meansuse barcode, and that's where
the issue becomes.
So when they create that newbarcode, then you cannot carry
those reviews with you, so thebarcode has to be the same so
(13:35):
your UPC has to be the sameright.
Yes, that's the uniqueidentifier of Amazon saying that
this product is linked withthis product.
Adam Shaffer (13:44):
So, basically, you're taking an ASIN you have
in the US and you're bringingthe same ASIN over.
You're not creating a brand newASIN, and by making it the same
exact ASIN, they let you bringthe reviews over.
Is that right?
Alex Karagiannis (13:58):
Exactly, you got it 100%, adam.
You got it yes.
And then, to comply with thelocal regulations, you can put
stickers on top of it to sayabout the warnings, the
suffocation warnings, thedistributor address, the local
address, local telephone line.
Adam Shaffer (14:13):
I was just going to ask you do you really need to
have separate packaging?
And you're saying you putstickers.
Alex Karagiannis (14:18):
You're saying you put stickers, no stickers.
Stickers is the best way to doit.
Or you could just have theversion of your packaging in the
other language, but thebarcodes remain the same.
Everything else is exactly thesame.
So that's how more people do it.
Adam Shaffer (14:33):
Yes, and do you get all the reviews, or they
only let you take some, all ofthem, all of them.
Okay, I mean, that's a hugebenefit, right?
I mean, if you worked so hardto get those reviews.
Alex Karagiannis (14:45):
Exactly, and that's why it's also you don't
start from step number one, sosome people might falsely
believe that, well, amazon wasso hard to start back in the day
to get this, I don't want to doit again and start from scratch
, and so on.
You actually have a very goodhead start with those reviews
going in, let alone some brandrecognition, let alone also
(15:09):
Amazon does.
I don't know if you're aware ofthis, but Amazon also has
incentives for US sellers, onethat gets all over in Europe,
and there's quite big incentivesin terms of cash back and
allowances, et.
Etc.
That they offer, usuallythrough approved agencies and
such.
But this is also a very clearwinner, essentially, and a
(15:31):
reason why people could comeover.
Adam Shaffer (15:33):
And if I'm in the US and I have products here that
I want to ship over to Germanyor UK, do I need to have a 3PL
or somebody on the ground there,or can I ship it directly to
FBA?
Alex Karagiannis (15:45):
Yeah, well, that's the other thing.
People do it.
So my usual recommendation istry not to even consider doing
Amazon Europe if you're notdoing at least 2 million and up
per annum on Amazon US.
The reason why I'm saying thisto you is because the correct
(16:10):
setup is you need to have alocal warehouse in EU.
Now you might want to have itin the Netherlands.
A lot of people have it therebecause they can actually just
arrive, it's quick to get yourEORI number and your VAT number
there and then while you applyfor your german and so on, and
also netherlands is a very, verygood hub for custom clearance
in europe, etc.
(16:30):
So the reason why this ishappening is I'll just give you
a real example of an actual casethat happened to us last week.
So we had an account came overand they had their account
closed because a previous expertdidn't know what they were
doing.
Anyhow, they put a lot of stockinto Amazon.
They had got a section three.
We unblocked the account.
(16:51):
Oh well, then we see thatthere's a lot of stock that they
sent.
They had sent pallets andpallets for the first order,
because Amazon as a new sellerallows you to send as much as
you want.
But then obviously it's aticket time bomb, because now
they have a lot of stock, nowthat client is not in a country,
in Bulgaria, so they don't havea marketplace there.
(17:12):
So we go into Amazon and say,well, remove some of that
inventory right, send it back tothe customer.
You can't.
Amazon says removal orders youcan only do on an Amazon
marketplace.
So Germany, france, italy,spain, netherlands, belgium,
sweden, poland, give me anaddress there, okay.
(17:34):
So that's a very common.
Adam Shaffer (17:38):
So if you're going to remove product, it's got to
go back to one of the Amazoncountries, Correct.
Otherwise you liquidate.
To remove product, it's got togo back to one of the Amazon
countries Correct.
Alex Karagiannis (17:43):
Otherwise you liquidate it or you dispose it,
and all of these come withever-increasing costs by Amazon.
So again, that's why I say,when you're trying to look at
opening a Europe Amazon Europe,try and think of it as opening a
new chessboard.
Amazon is a big thing of it,but also you want to utilize it
(18:04):
for other things as well.
So finding offline distributors, finding et cetera.
That way you can best utilizebig shipments sending to Europe,
your containers as such, and beable to move products much
faster in this continent.
Adam Shaffer (18:20):
Okay, I didn't realize that.
So you got to have some kind oflocal in one of the countries.
You got to have some localwarehouse, this 3PL, something
to hold your products and feedit to Amazon.
Alex Karagiannis (18:31):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, because in US it's like
remove order.
Okay, well, it's in Texas, okay, let's send it, I don't know,
in California, whatever, oh yes,but in Europe.
Oh yes, but in Europe that'snot the case.
Adam Shaffer (18:42):
You cannot send it anywhere you want and you
talked about, I guess,localization earlier.
But if you have an ASIN, let'sgo back to.
I have this ASIN in the US.
It's got five stars, it's gottons of reviews.
I'm going to turn it on inGermany, but I have it in
English.
Is Amazon, when I do, canada ittranslates it, or Mexico
(19:02):
translates it?
Is it going to translate it oram I going to have to redo the
entire copy?
Alex Karagiannis (19:08):
Well, I think you know the answer to that one.
Unfortunately, theauto-translation is not there,
and it's one of those mostcommon things.
Matt, I'm sure you'veunderstood how competitive
Amazon is also becoming, in thesense of bigger brands are
joining in.
(19:28):
They're using Amazon as a mainrevenue source.
They're optimizing listingkeywords.
This is exactly what'shappening over this side of the
Atlantic as well.
So therefore, your Germanlisting is not just a closed
translation, it's not just goingto cut it.
You need those keywords, youneed to speak the language of a
consumer, you need to use theterminology that people use for
(19:53):
the specific product, and so on.
That does include your A-pluscontent and your brand story and
your video and infographics, soit's very crucial.
Another tip for your audiencewhenever you do design work
whether it's with an agency orsomeone else, a third party or
in-house make sure you keepthose source files ready,
because you never know when youneed to reopen them and just
(20:15):
change the English to French orItalian and so on.
That's going to be very handy.
Adam Shaffer (20:21):
But you need to actually to be successful if you
want to have the right copy,the right SEO, you kind of have
to start from scratch and redothe copy.
Maybe the pictures are good,but the call-outs have to be
changed.
Alex Karagiannis (20:35):
Correct, it has to be in German language.
That's why I say UK is a biteasier, so UK, you don't really
have to do that.
Okay, a difference betweenamerican english and uk english
it's um, but very littledifferences and etc.
Maybe there are some changes inhow people search on amazoncouk
as opposed to dot com, but it'svery small compared to,
(20:57):
obviously, the othermarketplaces.
Um, so in germany, france,italy and spain you have to have
local English is not going tocut it.
Adam Shaffer (21:05):
So if I have brand registry in the US, do I need
to apply for brand registry inEurope?
Alex Karagiannis (21:12):
Yes, so you have what's called the EU IPO,
so European Union IntellectualProperty Office, which is over
in Madrid.
So you need to do that, whichis going to take.
Well, it depends on your case,etc.
Sometimes some big brands overin the US have global trademarks
.
If you have a global one, youalready have it.
If you only have US, you needto do the EU one and if you are
(21:36):
going to sell in UK, you needthe UK one.
So prices for those depend.
Really, if you do it alone,most sellers can do them DIY.
They can do them themselves.
It's pretty self-executive andeasy process to do and it can
take anywhere.
Really, from my experience,anywhere between three, maybe
(21:59):
four to five months.
It depends.
Adam Shaffer (22:01):
Really.
But you can't use the UStrademark.
You can't use a US trademark,no.
So you got to get an EU or aBritish trademark.
In the US they have thisprogram called IP Accelerator
where you could use an approvedlawyer, ip lawyer in the US and
before you get the trademarkcompleted, which could take a
(22:22):
while, in a couple of weeksyou're up on Amazon with brand
registry.
Does that exist?
Alex Karagiannis (22:27):
Yes, so in US the trademark process there's
more scrutiny around it.
In UK and EU it's a bit easierto go to navigate through this
and you can actually just putyour application number.
So even though it's pending, itstill goes through.
So then when it gets granted,it's automatically granted.
So it's one of those quickthings that you want to look at
(22:48):
together as you're doing yourVAT and your EORI, which is your
import code.
As such, you want to look atthat EU and UK IPO together.
Adam Shaffer (22:59):
But it's the same concept.
You need to have brand registryto have A-plus content.
You need to have brand registryto run certain advertising.
You need brand registry toprotect your content.
It's the same same old, sameold.
Yes, I mean, that's a big deal.
So part of getting the VAT, yougot to get brand registry
sorted out if you want to havegood content or you won't be
able to bring over your A-pluscontent, I imagine Correct.
Alex Karagiannis (23:22):
You won't be able to bring over your A-plus
content, I imagine.
Correct, wow, okay Again.
That's why I said there's areason why I set the threshold
before to this type of sellersto that level of revenue.
Yeah, because you will have asetup fee.
Right, whether you go with aspecialist agency like us or
anyone, a consultant or anything, you will need to do those
(23:42):
things because you want to dothem as professional as possible
to give the best chances thatyou can to grow in those
marketplaces.
And the first couple of monthsobviously is about setting,
getting that data back fromAmazon, advertising, ranking,
all of those things.
So realistic expectation isthere's going to be a couple of
months where you collect databefore you actually start seeing
those things.
So realistic expectation isthere's going to be a couple of
months where you collect databefore you actually start seeing
(24:05):
those results, very similar towhen you launch a new product on
Amazon.
Really, you don't expect monthone or month two to be high
profit, high revenue no, but I'mhoping with the reviews.
Adam Shaffer (24:15):
I'm hoping with the reviews and hopefully the
content, I could get somerunning start anyway.
Alex Karagiannis (24:22):
Absolutely Well.
The other thing that's good isyou can do Vine again, okay you
can do.
Vine again to get more reviews.
You can re-Vine them if youwant.
Adam Shaffer (24:32):
It's the same program in the countries.
Yeah, cool.
Okay, that's great.
Now you talked a little bitabout the advertising, but PPC,
so you're spending a lot ofmoney on advertising in the US.
Is there a way to go to schoolon the advertising that you've
been doing in the US and bringit over there, or are you really
(24:53):
starting from scratch?
Alex Karagiannis (25:03):
not, because what happens is on your, your
advertising.
You will have realized a fewthings around.
First of all, create.
Let's start from the creatives.
Okay, so the creative sides ofthe most more advanced type of
campaigns your sponsor brand,for example, or video, the
creatives that you have split abe tested.
Those will still apply.
Main image, which obviouslyapplies for your sponsor product
.
Again, speed data testing, yourmain image for CTR and so on.
(25:26):
Those experiments will stillapply.
So therefore, you can bringwith you lessons learned,
because an optimized Amazonimage is the same in US and in
Germany.
Now what you need to startlearning a bit more is your
other data, like yourcompetitors, or maybe the
category, or maybe the ASINyou're targeting or the keywords
(25:49):
you're targeting, that sort ofthing.
But again, you're not startingfrom scratch.
Also, you will have a betterunderstanding of how you're
doing your upper funnel, midfunnel and lower funnel in US
and how you're allocating budgetto those different type of
campaigns, so you can use asimilar structure as well.
So month one is going to looklike this.
(26:10):
Month six, my setup, should belooking something like this and
you can start to bring this inthat methodology, bring it in
into Europe as well, and fromour experience, it's less
competitive than US.
Us budgets are much higher forPPC and there's a lot more
(26:30):
competition in AI tools andagencies involved, whereas in
Europe it's significantly less.
So we tend to see very, verygood ROAS over here.
Adam Shaffer (26:41):
You know, one of the things we do for our clients
is we help them maintain whatthey call minimum advertised
price or MAP in the US, and wehelp them by creating a policy
that works for their channel.
And we help find unauthorizedsellers and find the source that
they're getting it from andgetting it off the platform to
make it a cleaner channel onAmazon.
(27:03):
But I think, and you tell me,in some of the countries you
can't have a minimum advertisedprice.
Is that right?
Alex Karagiannis (27:10):
No, you're right, this is a very, very,
very good question.
So, for example, in the UK,you've got the.
It's an anti-competition law,so you cannot say this.
So you cannot say, actually,well, this product, if I sell it
to distributors, thedistributors are not allowed to
sell it below this price, forexample.
That is not allowed and that isactually.
It's an offense.
You can actually have veryserious consequences with this.
(27:33):
Similar versions of this appliesto EU as well, to a different
extent in its country.
So the reason as such theenforcement of losing your buy
box and the enforcement ofmaintaining a price is a very
delicate process and somethingyou need to manage.
Now, it really depends on thesize of the clients.
(27:56):
Now we've seen clients thatcome over to Europe and say,
well, spain and Italy haveexclusivities, so we don't touch
those, we just update thelistings, update the content and
obviously their distributors,their exclusive distributors in
those countries, sell, and thenother countries, like Germany,
for example, is up for grabs, soin which case, they're the
(28:16):
exclusive seller.
Now there are procedures inplace.
If someone, for example, isselling your product, how to go
about it?
You buy one, you see if it'sexact where they get it from.
If need be, you can usetransparency, although I
wouldn't necessarily recommendthat.
But you don't get this issue ofwhat you see very often in the
(28:38):
US with hijackers and alsopeople selling a copycat of your
product.
It's easier done in the US thanit is in the EU and one of the
main reasons is there's a lot ofpaperwork involved when you're
setting up firstly in the EU.
So you're lucid.
Maybe you've heard of thatwhich has to do with recycling
(28:59):
and how you abide with recyclingregulations and plastic
regulations, etc.
So all of these are very, veryimportant and actually help make
it difficult to enter, but alsothe people that are makes it a
better room for them to growprofessionally professionally,
but it's the same story.
Adam Shaffer (29:20):
If you have a few different sellers on your ASIN,
the lower price is going to mostlikely win, as long as it's
prime right.
Alex Karagiannis (29:27):
But from where would you get them?
If you were never selling inEurope, where did you get these?
So it's probably you're goingto have two types of sellers.
You're going to have the personwho's selling, I don't know
let's say water bottles, andthen they're selling water
bottles that are unique, etcetera, and they're doing I
(29:48):
don't know something like 5million on Amazon per year.
They've never sold in Europe.
They had one time a distributorin the UK didn't do much.
Their product does not exist inEurope.
So those people, there's nevergoing to be anyone that competes
with them in Europe.
Adam Shaffer (30:07):
So the less distributed you are, the better
you are.
Alex Karagiannis (30:10):
Yeah, and then the bigger ones, the much, much
bigger ones, which are usuallywithin the top five in their
industry.
We were talking to one of thosein the pet category doing
exactly this.
They're very big, they'renumber one actually in their
respective category in the US.
(30:31):
And then in Europe they havesome other copycats.
They have some of their productbeing sold at a ridiculously
high price X5, et cetera.
So when they go into thatmarket then actually that's like
a cleanup process, becauseyou've got the original, you've
got the ownership, you've gotthe correct price, et cetera.
(30:54):
If anyone's trying to use thedesign, et cetera, you can get
those down.
So it's part of that process.
It's a slow process, but theproblem is not as big as it's
part of that process.
It's a slow process, but theproblem is not as big as it's
over in the US on similar cases.
Adam Shaffer (31:07):
And are you finding with pricing, if
somebody's selling something for$100 in the US, is it usually
just translated or are theytrying to make more money in
Europe?
What do you think is theaverage kind of thing out there?
So you mean, I'm selling it for$100, but I'm now going to
start selling it in the UK orGermany.
Do you think I'm able toconvert the price so I can make
(31:29):
$10 or $20 more, or am I goingto be probably on par with my US
pricing?
Can you make more margin inEurope?
Alex Karagiannis (31:36):
Yes, you can actually Again, because this
goes back to the first thingthat I mentioned in terms of how
you want to be doing yourmarket research before going in.
So you're in a very, very, verygood position if your products
are more in the premium range.
You're in a very good positionif you're one of the original
inventors of something, and thenyou don't have a lot of
(31:58):
competition.
So therefore, you can justifywhy the price is more expensive
in Europe rather than UKcompared to your listings.
So it's not a direct exchangerate conversion as such.
Adam Shaffer (32:12):
And when it comes to ASINs, could you be, I guess,
suspended or delisted for a SKUor an ASIN in one country and
not another?
Or is it, once you're delisted,you're delisted for a skewer in
one country and not another?
Or is it, once you're delisted,you're delisted?
Alex Karagiannis (32:24):
No, it's the first what you just said.
So you can get a, let's say,trademark violation, a policy
violation, and that takes downyour listing in Italy, but Spain
and France and Germanycontinues as normal, for example
.
Okay.
Adam Shaffer (32:38):
Very rare, but yeah, yeah, yeah, okay,
continues as normal.
For example very rare, but yeah, yeah, yeah, okay.
And when you're, if you'reagain an fba in germany but
you're somebody in another,another country's buying your
stuff, are they changing whatyou pay, amazon, or is it still
fixed?
You're, you go into the amazoncalculator, it tells you what
the fba price is and that's yourprice, or is it?
(32:59):
Is it changing if somebody'sbuying it from poland, from
germany, then germany to germany?
Alex Karagiannis (33:04):
so.
So there's different settingsin your, your shipment settings
in terms of if you send outsideof germany, what the charge is.
So usually there's deliveryfees involved.
So if I'm buying, let's say,something from greece, from
amazon germany, there's deliveryfees involved.
If I exceed the first, there'slike coupons, and then those are
(33:24):
waived.
And if I buy from Germany andI'm in Germany, it's obviously
free, with prime over a certainthreshold, or if I'm a member,
and so on.
It's very similar, I guess, tothe sense of if you're in US and
you buy from somewhere abroad,let's say somewhere in Latin
America, for example, or you buywithin the country in the US.
(33:46):
That's how that goes.
Adam Shaffer (33:49):
And so, going back to the markets, germany's
biggest UK, france, italy.
Alex Karagiannis (33:55):
Spain.
Yeah, so I mean just a bit fromthe top of my head just to give
you a bit in terms of how bigit is on a monthly user basis.
Now, these are just estimatednumbers based on the last data I
had.
But you're looking at somethingaround half a billion searches
(34:16):
on Amazon Germany per month.
Searches is on Amazon Germanyper month, and then you've got
something like 350 on UK, andthen it goes 160, 160.
So France and Italy is more orless the same, and then just a
tiny bit less is Amazon Spain,and then all the other ones are.
(34:38):
Then the gap is quite big.
So Netherlands is about 20,sweden is about 15, poland 15,
belgium 11.
And, just to give you anunderstanding, com is 2.2
billion.
So if I add all those together,roughly you could say that the
(35:00):
searches are about 60% of com isall of Europe.
But then next year we've gotIreland coming up.
So that's exciting becauseyou've got a country that has
quite a lot of spend onlineclose to UK.
Many other things that canactually work well and it keeps
on growing.
(35:20):
Turkey came online last yearand it's just continuing.
There's more and more countriesadded, so that number is going
to be growing higher and higher.
Adam Shaffer (35:33):
Cool, that's great .
And then just a quickie oncustomer service.
So you're dealing with multiplelanguages, multiple questions.
Are you able to deal with thiscentrally, or do you need people
in different countries?
How does that work?
Alex Karagiannis (35:46):
no, no, that's it.
That's, that's the easy bit.
That's that's where things likechat, gpt and your translators
are fine, because 99.9 is thesame question.
Right, I got my product isdamaged, or, uh, you send me
either wrong or I wanted an SDS.
Now that's something else.
If your products are chemical,for example, you may need the
(36:06):
MSDS or SDS as it's also called.
You'll save the data sheetsthose need to be translated over
to its language.
But customer service isespecially in FBA.
Most of the listeners, ifthey're selling on Amazon, they
know they rarely, rarely have amessage from someone on Amazon
Very rarely, because 99.9% it'ssomething like where's my
(36:28):
shipment?
I haven't received it, it'sdamaged, I need a replacement.
And this is where the beauty ofFBA comes in.
So, no, you don't need peoplethat speak the local language,
you can just go about with thetranslation.
It's fine.
And should the same sort ofquestions arise again and again
and again, let's say invoicing,et cetera you can just have a
(36:49):
template and use that how theycan self-service to get those.
Adam Shaffer (36:54):
Essentially, Okay, thanks, that's great, and what
are we missing?
What are we not talking about,alex, that people might want to
know about?
I mean, I'm sure we can go onforever about this and it's
really interesting, but tell me,like, what are the topics we're
not hitting right now that youwant to talk about?
Alex Karagiannis (37:13):
In terms of the EU expansion.
Yes, specifically, specifically.
So well, the the things thatwe're not talking about is one
uh, it's not understanding.
Your pricing is not going to bevery easy.
So people think is I'm justgoing to throw my products into
amazon germany and then I'mgoing to sell in amazon germany
(37:35):
and I'm just going to activatefrance, italy, spain, etc.
And then it's going to sendthat.
Okay, what's the fees involved?
Because if you send fromgermany to france, they're big
fees and they keep on increasing.
So really you're not going todo that.
It's going to be very expensive.
So if you just to give anunderstanding for something like
normal size, like, let's say,mobile phone size thing,
(37:56):
something that would be 380 ingermany, sending it to france
eight.
So is it really worth it?
You know, if you're sellingsomething for 800, yeah, okay,
but if most people that sellsomething for like 15, 20, 25,
30, you need to consider this.
So that's that's, that's a,that's something to consider
when you're at the initialstages, and not that registered
(38:18):
in france as well.
The other thing is for thebigger players that want to
expand, when you get VATregistered in France, italy,
spain, germany, so all of thosecountries together.
There's the benefit of what'scalled pan-European FBA, so
that's like a very, very highlevel program of Amazon that
(38:38):
unfortunately, was advertised assomething easy that anyone can
do, but really it's only forcompanies who are really big
that can utilize it, because youwant to be VAT-registered in
France, italy, spain and Germany.
So then Amazon just moves theinventory around to just make
sure you have enough for Prime.
The other thing that I wouldsay is, again, depending on your
(39:00):
size as a company, you want tostart preparing and getting
organized all your assetstogether, so videos that you
have, ugc, contents that otherpeople have created for you,
maybe you can get source filesof those You're in for graphics
and A-plus content all nice andtight in one place, with source
(39:20):
files of those.
Your infographics and A-pluscontent all nice and tight in
one place with source files.
So having everything neat isgoing to make the translation
localization much quicker andactually very, very efficient.
So that's very important.
Make sure you have very goodunderstanding of the regulatory
and compliance Use a veryprofessional agency that does
(39:41):
this and someone that knows whatthey're doing, and I think,
finally, make sure that you haveenough stock.
I think you hear a lot ofpeople that say this.
It's the number one rule.
It's probably the only thingthat we ask of sellers.
Do not run out of stock.
It's like building like yourlittle bonfire and then if it
(40:01):
just dies out, it's going totake a while to get it back up
To start it again.
Adam Shaffer (40:05):
I know that makes sense, yeah.
Alex Karagiannis (40:06):
Your honeymoon period, your launch your vine,
all of that stuff.
Adam Shaffer (40:11):
That is awesome.
Well, I've definitely learned alot and I can keep on asking.
I'll probably email you morequestions because I'm quite
interested in expanding outthere.
But for people that want tomake the jump and start selling
in Europe, how can they get intouch with you if they need some
help?
Alex Karagiannis (40:30):
Yeah, sure, okay, well, the easiest is
either through our website,lezzat.
co.
uk, or lezzat.
com, it's the same.
They can reach out to me onLinkedIn, alex karagiannis, so
you can find me there, or justemail me on, alex, at lesatcouk.
I'm happy to do an audit tojust show them if eu is right
(40:52):
fit for them so we can send thema personalized custom plan.
You're going to see my face onthat video, so it's not going to
be one video for all.
We're going to see my face onthat video, so it's not going to
be one video for all.
We're going to do it fullycustomized, to just make sure if
EU is right for them Is theright size.
Can it happen?
Is there anything to be awareof?
Maybe they just take somespecific SKUs and not their
(41:13):
entire catalog, what it wouldlook like, so happy to offer
that to anyone listening.
Adam Shaffer (41:20):
That is awesome.
I'm going to do the audit justso I can see your face.
That is great.
Yeah, it's quite a benefit.
So, with that, thank you forjoining planet amazon.
I mean, this is just an awesometopic and thanks for helping at
least explain some of theissues that people have and some
of the benefits they're goingto have.
It's really, really importantcool, cool, my pleasure.
Alex Karagiannis (41:40):
Thank you very much, adam.
Thank you for having me.
Announcement (41:44):
Thank you for watching another episode of the
Planet Amazon podcast, where wetalk all things Amazon.
If you want to learn about howto accelerate your sales on
Amazon, visit Phelps United'swebsite at phelpsunitedcom.
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