Ella Magers | Ella Magers on Breaking Stereotypes About Veganism and Fitness | PPAP27 - Plant Powered Athlete Podcast

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Hello and welcome everyone to the Plant Powered Athlete Podcast. I'm your host Robert Cheek and

(00:05):
I have an amazing guest today and I really do mean that. This is an incredible woman, a long time
friend of mine, a long time vegan advocate, and in fact before I even say her name I want to read
this long list of things that I wrote down about my incredible guest today. She is an author, she's

(00:26):
an athlete, she's a teacher, she's a coach, she's an international speaker, she's a yogi, she's a
model, she's a dog mom, she's a friend, she's a sanctuary co-founder and supporter, and she is the
wonderful Ella Majors. Welcome to the show, so great to have you. Oh I'm so happy to be here

(00:46):
Robert, thanks for having me on. Yeah absolute pleasure. Why don't we start by acknowledging
that we are twins? Not in the traditional sense but I wrote down all kinds of ways that we are
twins. Would you like me to read what I wrote or do you want to get started on? Oh no I'm dying to

(01:09):
hear what you wrote. Okay okay all right so I just wrote this like one minute ago before we started.
Okay. This will help our audience get to know you a bit more and how much we have in common.
I wrote down how many ways are we twins. Well we're the same age, we're vegan for the same length
of time, we became vegan at the same time for the same reasons on different sides of the country.

(01:32):
We're both blonde, we're both athletes, we're both authors, we're both international speakers,
we're dog parents and we're small dog parents, we're magazine models, we're vegan fitness
competitors, we're sanctuary supporters, we are anxiety disorder overcomers, we are go-gaggers,
we are flexers, we are smiling happy vegans, we love to travel, we are vegan cruisers and we have

(01:58):
so much more in common Ella. So you are someone I affectionately refer to as my twin. So again
welcome to the Plant-Powered Athlete podcast. Thank you and thank you for all the kind words and
yeah I mean that's just to name a few I feel like but yeah they're a big few. Well you've got a great
story, I've heard you tell it in already in multiple countries this year as we've been on

(02:22):
tour together, another thing we have in common. But for our listeners here we have this robust
community with Plant-Powered Athlete, it's growing, it's expanding, I'm happy to be a podcast host.
Can you tell us your vegan origin story? A lot of people are going to be hearing it for the first
time and I'd love to hear it again too. Absolutely. So it all started when I was seven years old.

(02:46):
I got in the car, my mom picked me up from school and she asked me how my day was as parents do
and I said mom you know what we learned about this guy named Daniel Boone and if anybody doesn't know
who Daniel Boone is let me tell you he's one of our first American folk heroes. He was a wilderness

(03:08):
guy, he wore a raccoon hat, he carried around a shotgun and I told my mom I said you know this guy
was supposed to be a hero but he wasn't. He was really mean mom, he killed animals and he ate them
and my mom, I kind of like have this memory of her looking back at me

(03:30):
and fortunately she was really honest and she said to me Ella you know we're very lucky we don't
have to do that ourselves anymore. We get to go to the grocery store to buy our meat
and Robert it was literally at that moment that I connected the meat on my plate with the animal
that it was and right then and there I was horrified. I told my mom I said I'm never doing

(03:56):
that again mom that's it and that was it. I never ate meat again and not only did I stop eating meat
it was like I kind of intuitively knew that it was my purpose here on earth to be a voice for animals
so when they would give us assignments in school I would always make them about animals. I have

(04:19):
writings that I did in second, third, fourth grade saying I don't understand why are we eating
animals? There's so many other things that we can eat why would we have to kill something? It doesn't
make any sense. It really didn't make any sense to me and I started just eating the side dishes
at the dinner table in my home and I got connected to some local animal rights organizations. I got

(04:44):
connected with PETA. This was back in so it was 1987 as you well know when we were both seven years
old so this was way before you know the internet and this information wasn't readily available but
I connected with vegan outreach and PETA and they started sending me materials and I started
handing them out in school and in middle school in eighth grade I was doing an anti-l'oreal

(05:08):
campaign because they tested on animals and I would hand out buttons you know and do my part and then
I started to really understand the connection between the meat industry and the dairy and the
egg industries so by the time I turned 15 I became fully vegan so that is my origin story.
Yeah me too age 15 what a what a time when the internet was just coming of age we didn't have

(05:36):
computers at home most of us we don't know how to use them we had to we had to take classes at
school to learn how to use a computer and this worldwide web and I was like oh my god I'm
so sorry. And now fast forward I mean almost three decades later and we have an incredible vegan

(05:59):
community with something like 75 million of us worldwide spreading this message of compassion
and what I gather from you is that you inherently and intrinsically care about animals you you did
and you were exposed to animal suffering you questioned it whether that's something we have

(06:20):
to do in our everyday life and you carved out a different path but I want to ask you like what
what does compassion mean to you now like why so many people burn out of whatever their passion is
whatever their cause is whatever they're they're a champion for or a warrior for they burn out

(06:41):
you've been going strong for 30 years as a vegan advocate and activist and someone who in your own
words uh where is it uh purpose driven and being a voice for animals which I just jotted down
what drives you today to keep on going yeah well it's interesting because I didn't think of myself

(07:02):
as very spiritual back then but I've been on this kind of yogic path for the last 15 years
and so something that I've it's taken a lot of work honestly to cultivate but
is this sense of compassion not only for animals because that came really easily like that was just
innate and people too but then there was this whole the in this is an experience for a lot of

(07:29):
people once they connect to that suffering allow that suffering into their hearts all the you know
the millions and billions trillions of animals that are dying each year that can create a lot of
despair that can create anger at the people that are perpetuating that suffering

(07:52):
not only the people that are involved in the industries but even you know our own friends
and family who are supporting those things that once you feel that connection so I think what's
really helped me is to understand that it is up to me to continually raise my own vibrations

(08:12):
to raise my frequency to raise my energy to to not pick and choose who I have compassion for
but to see us all on this earth and in this universe ultimately as one and so by having
this compassion not only for the animals but for myself which was kind of the last person that on

(08:34):
the earth that I started having compassion for but really everybody because love I mean when they
hashtag love wins I truly believe that is the case that if we can embody love that if we can
come from a place of love and compassion for every being on earth that includes ourselves that

(09:00):
includes the people that are still eating meat that that is going to have the greatest impact
ultimately and help reduce suffering ultimately is by being that example of love of light of joy
to the best of my ability so that's really kind of the stance I've taken that has allowed me to

(09:25):
to go on because the other the choice the other side of that is to you know come from a place of
fear or hate and that's not going to help anybody. Yeah it's that quote of consider the alternative
you know comes to mind of why do we do what we do it's it's it's hard it's difficult where one

(09:48):
percent of the global population who believes in this value system and worldview and everywhere we
go there's people who reject it and we have obstacles and we have people who sometimes
resent us or who are oblivious to the own the suffering they themselves are contributing to
even if they don't mean to and it's all around us and it's our loved ones as you mentioned it's

(10:10):
our friends our family and and all of that and that that is difficult and also I picked up
something from what you said and correct me if I'm wrong here because you're the second person
I've talked to this week when I do these interviews who said this that and maybe I misheard it but

(10:31):
you said you had almost a challenge or trouble having compassion for yourself like you had
compassion for animals and everyone else first and then you said but finding compassion for myself
was a little bit more difficult what why do you think why do you think that's the case
oh if I can figure out the why Robert I don't think I've quite figured out the why because

(10:52):
you know you look at trauma we all have trauma right I had incredible parents who are very loving
to me who are very supportive who actually ended up following my path on the vegan front
and supported me on every step of the way I mean imagine imagine my poor parents when I was a
teenage activist and I'm getting a little sidetracked here so if you want to reel me in

(11:15):
but it just reminded me you know imagine my my poor parents dropping their kid off before I could
drive I'm organizing protests I'm like no I got to go sit on the side of the road in a cage
to demonstrate the devastating conditions of farmed animals so I need a ride you know please drop
me off so I can sit on a cage on the side of the road and my parents did I mean how amazing is that

(11:37):
and I think that early connection to so much suffering and and the sensitivity I had to that
I mean I really felt it was like I could feel the pain of all the animals in the world and what they
were going through and it was really really devastating to me as a young person and then as

(11:59):
a teenager when I went and became an activist and in my young mind I thought well if surely if only
people knew what was going on behind the closed doors of factory farming of course they're going
to just immediately go vegan just like me and so that's that was my mindset setting out into that
activist world and when I came to find out and of course as an activist you know we did for a free

(12:22):
friday for example and so we're standing out with signs you know encouraging people to not buy fur
on black friday and you know the hates that we got you know people yelling at us and and that was
that's hard for anybody especially a young person so there was that and there was just it was such a

(12:45):
I knew my mission in life and and it was like everything was riding on me the world was kind
of on my shoulders and to have me feel like I was failing time and time again as a teenager
I think was really really hard and when I was 16 I got diagnosed with clinical depression

(13:06):
I got put on antidepressant medications because there was times when I couldn't get out of bed
so I think I really was really hard on myself and and I just didn't think about
you know having compassion for myself and and I started down a road of
dedicating my life to making a difference for animals but in the path of that I was pretty

(13:33):
self-destructive for many years like I said and and these were I made very poor choices for myself
that were not based in compassion for myself so why you know that's up for speculation
but how it manifested was definitely in quite a bit of self-destructive behavior

(13:56):
well I think what I'm hearing Ella is that it's another thing we've been doing for a long time
well I think what I'm hearing Ella is that it's another thing we have in common I'm discovering
I think you're you're probably an empath you're you you feel empathy and and sometimes that takes
precedent you feel empathy and you take on that energy or that that fear that that animals have

(14:18):
or that anyone who's suffering has I I'm the same way it's difficult for me to even drive around town
with you know when people are in need of help or asking for money or asking for help or whatever I
I've a very hard time saying no to anybody who needs assistance especially when I'm in a more
privileged position I have a difficult time with that and as a teenager when it came to

(14:45):
supporting animals they don't have a voice there's nobody who's organizing on their behalf except
our our species which has to go against our own personal interests of having dominion and control
and power over them and top of the food chain and all kinds of of of privilege from our position
we actually have to really as a society or even as a species go against our own selfish interests

(15:12):
based on how we use animals for utility and purpose and all that and exploitation and I
think that's probably why I think you have a large amount of empathy for the suffering of others I'm
sure you feel that for uh other human communities I mean we have a billion people who go to bed

(15:33):
hungry every night not knowing where their next meal is going to be in the developing world
that's something that weighs heavily on I also picked up something else from you Ella
uh I think you're one of those I would say lucky people actually uh who found your purpose at young
age you know uh me too me too um you know where I wanted to be a writer when I was eight years old

(15:57):
and you know here I am doing it um you wanted to help animals at seven years old you know
and here you are doing it and doing it in incredible ways and
I don't know that it's necessarily self-destructive behavior like you were saying where you weren't
compassionate for yourself but I think it's just an overflowing amount of empathy for others when

(16:17):
other people were not stepping up to do that now there's a lot more of us in the vegan world who
get we can kind of shoulder more of that weight so yeah so that's what I picked up from from what
you just shared and I and I also commend you for continuing to keep on going strong and I think
you're continuing to keep on going strong when you do deal with things like depression or have dealt

(16:40):
with that but let's let's let's switch gears for a moment because you're one of the fittest people
that I know you and I did some photo shoots with PCRM months ago and I was I thought I was in good
shape but I was basically embarrassed to be next to you my gosh that's just you just you're too
ripped you're in incredible shape I I can't even I you know keep up with you so tell me about your

(17:05):
fitness journey I mean where it started where you've been where you are now and how you're in
incredible shape now in your in your mid-40s like me yeah yeah yeah so I've been an athlete since I
was five years old so I started with gymnastics and swimming at five um I think I was competing

(17:26):
at five years old and swimming and then in gymnastics as well for several years did dance
as taekwondo I was super active I mean four hours a day of practices of one sorts or another um my
whole childhood uh transitioned over to volleyball in high school and in college I didn't play any

(17:46):
sports in college but I did um hit the gym and became uh well became a personal trainer after
college but but really started to hit the gym hard doing weight training strength training
um and then when I was 22 I discovered Muay Thai and so I've been a Muay Thai practitioner for

(18:07):
over 20 years I actually am recovering from ACL surgery right now from luckily I was so happy that
I tore my fully tore my ACL while sparring a young man um and it wasn't because he kicked my butt I
just twisted my knee wrong while I was kicking him so anyway um but yeah so then in my in my 20s I was

(18:30):
a personal trainer um I decided to compete uh in the bikini division of the fame world championships
it was uh it's no longer around I don't think but it was a bodybuilding competition I did the
bikini division I did the fitness division and they had a fitness model uh division and I I won
first place in the bikini division took second in the fitness and fitness model categories and I did

(18:54):
that not because I had any big lofty goals of being a bodybuilder but really this was 2007 when
at least in Miami there were still people who could didn't even know what the word vegan was
and when they heard I was vegan they were like no way you can do it and so I was like well just tell
me I can't do something and I will sure do it and I will do it until I win and luckily I won the first

(19:18):
competition I did so uh yeah so I competed into that doing Muay Thai and mostly strength training
and then by the time I was later in my 20s my body already started breaking down I mean Muay Thai
for anyone doesn't know it's a pretty brutal sport I mean you are and my first instructor who

(19:39):
took me under his wing and when I was talking about being self-destructive this was um yeah I
had moved to Miami I was engaged that didn't work out um I we're our finances were all mixed
together I ended up on somebody's couch my fiance like left and I started from the ground up in

(20:01):
Miami I'm from North Carolina originally so that's a pretty big culture shock going from North
Carolina to Miami and this Muay Thai instructor took me under his wing and he didn't I didn't
know people use sparring gear so I just was learning from him and he never said anything
about a shin guard or you know things that would actually protect your limbs a little bit while you

(20:23):
while you did these things so we were I was black and blue all over for for years doing Muay Thai but
I absolutely loved it it just was it made me feel so powerful it was really empowering I had this
great group of friends um and anyway my point is my body was breaking down I was also at in my 20s

(20:44):
um kind of uh had this disordered eating going on I had a body image issue uh I I saw fat on my body
that wasn't there so I was dealing with a lot and dealing with all of that without telling anybody
because I wanted to be the shining example that was my new way of fulfilling my life's purpose

(21:05):
was being the shining example of health and fitness and so if anybody knew I was struggling
then I was afraid they would blame it on me being vegan so I would hide all of that
um but that's when I got into yoga and that's years later it took me quite a while doing yoga
because I I had a trouble slowing down man I my MO was Miss Tough Girl Muay Thai fighter

(21:28):
and to slow down and do the whole like ohm thing and move slowly was really really hard and really
painful and yet I think that was really the catalyst for me to um to heal from all these
things I was struggling with in my 20s. Well as I'm jotting things down here Elle as I as I always

(21:50):
enjoy doing uh especially talking with you I'm again I'm picking up lots of things here
you listed all of these sports and aside from some that have a loose you know team capacity
they're almost all individual sports uh yes there's teams and gymnastics but it's very much an

(22:11):
individual thing gymnastics and swimming and dance and martial arts and weight training and Muay
Thai and bikini and fitness and all this except for volleyball that's where you rely on your your
that's where you rely on your your six other teammates or however many are out there on the
court and I think that that speaks to your personality you've always been this as you said

(22:35):
tough girl you've you've been this innovator you've been this in like strong individual person
and I think and again correct me if I'm wrong here that's just what I'm observing right now talking
to you that I think that probably dictated the sports that you were drawn to I'm going to go
do this thing and be a fighter I'm going to go do this thing and be a weightlifter and be a

(22:59):
champion at this and bodybuilding or bikini or modeling or whatever or swimming I want to be
faster than other people right dance I want to be more graceful than other people or whatever
whatever it is uh gymnastics I want to be able to do this is that something you've recognized
in your in yourself that the team sports versus individual sport path that you clearly chose is

(23:23):
that consciously uh or did you just gravitate towards that naturally it is so interesting
Robert that you would notice that because I really haven't ever given that any thought but it is so
so wow yes thank you thank you for tell me that I am a good listener then uh

(23:47):
absolutely no that's so interesting and it's so I mean no I think you hit that nail on the head
that's kind of who I am it's I'm striving to be the best version of myself right and I think that's
you know in some ways that's really great and really powerful and in other ways and it also
goes to speak to I mean maybe that speaks to also my feeling a little bit like an outsider

(24:13):
growing up right and and not feeling like I really belonged anywhere I had groups of friends of all
different types but I never really I never really feel like I fit in anywhere you know I was this
outspoken vegan who is not an angry vegan I was just excited about sharing the message and all
this but you know people didn't get it and so I wonder if that also had something to do with

(24:40):
the sports I chose um I don't know well let's let's dig deeper there for a moment because
I'm also noticing some other patterns that I think reflect your background in fitness
and fitness in sports in particular. So I'll just to touch on it a little bit. So I know a lot of

(25:05):
you've been in a lot of different sports, but I just want to give you a few examples of things
when you're in team sports I played a lot of them you rely on other people who are leaders
who are the captains who are the better athletes who are the better players you fill a role. I was
one of 11 on the soccer field one of five on the basketball court you know all the other sports

(25:27):
to rely on other people to lead the way for you.
You are a self-starter.
That's why you're an entrepreneur.
We'll talk about that later.
You're a founder.
You're an innovator.
You're a leader.
You're someone who initiates action.
You didn't wait for a team to start at age seven
to get you going on animal advocacy, right?

(25:47):
You didn't wait for a team of people
to take you out on a speaking tour
or to dive into the sport of Muay Thai,
which I'm super intimidated by,
but I love some of your photos.
Your action photos are super awesome.
We gotta include some of those in the podcast.
What do you think about that observation,

(26:08):
that your personality is more suited for individual sports
and that has led to your career decisions as well?
I'm not mistaken.
Oh, a thousand percent.
Now, again, hitting the nail on the head, Robert.
Absolutely, that is who I am.
And I'm somebody who doesn't like to wait around

(26:30):
or rely on other people.
Again, sometimes to a fault.
It's not always a positive thing, right?
And this point in my life,
I am really focused more on building more connections
and having more of a team atmosphere
and different things I'm doing.
But my natural kind of drive is to just get things done

(26:51):
and get them done on my timeline in the way that I feel best.
And like when I'm coming up with,
I just came up with a great mindfulness in motion,
mixed movement flow series,
and it's based in kind of my favorite things
that I've done in fitness.

(27:11):
So the calisthenics, the primal movements
and the animal flow, and I've trained in Budokan and yoga.
So I've taken the things that I find most intriguing,
the things that have helped me most,
and I've created kind of my own system,
my own type of class that doesn't exist anywhere else.

(27:33):
So yes, I'm going to get teacher certified
by the time this comes out,
I'll be a certified yoga instructor.
Will I probably teach straight yoga
exactly as I was trained in it?
Knowing me, probably not.
I'm probably gonna create my own system
and then share that with my people.
That's how I work.
So yeah, does that make sense?

(27:53):
It does.
And I was taking copious notes once again,
as you probably noticed me like looking down
and just frantically writing.
And you know why I think you said that Ella,
this is really fun, this conversation of discovery.
I learned things about myself too,
but I'm also learning about my twin.

(28:13):
What I got from that is that you're doing things
like offering group coaching and mentoring and teaching
because maybe I'm wrong,
you want to wrap your arms around other individuals
who are outsiders or on their own
and don't have that team to rely on.

(28:33):
You've spent your life in a lot of ways without a team.
Now in your wiser years, in your mid forties,
I'm hoping to get some wisdom one of these days myself,
are building teams and you're part of teams in some capacity.
But my gut reaction to what compels you

(28:55):
to want to coach, mentor, teach and bring people together.
And I know you've done this with people who suffered
from disordered eating and body image stuff
you've done in the past.
You want to wrap your arms around others and say,
hey, you are welcome.
You are part of this team.
You do fit in and I'm gonna make sure there's a spot
at the table for you.

(29:16):
Is there any accuracy to any of that?
Oh, for sure, for sure.
And it was so interesting.
I remember creating my first group coaching program
many years ago, 10 years ago or something
and thinking, well, who's gonna pay to be in a group
because thinking that it's so much more valuable

(29:37):
to get one-on-one coaching.
And so I'm thinking, I don't know if that's gonna work
because when people rather, they're gonna pay
for one-on-one coaching,
they're not gonna be paying for group coaching.
Well, after my first group coaching program,
it was all about the group.
I mean, that was the most valuable piece of it
was being in that community.

(29:57):
And because I was picking into,
I would have a call to bring people into that program
that I knew would make an incredible community
of like-minded people, people that were struggling
with the same things
that had the same sorts of aspirations.
And I was blown away by the power of the group.
And each one of those started with an individual call

(30:20):
where I got to really see that person,
really hear that person,
really help them discover some blind spots
and then be able to then have a group of people
that could support one another.
And yeah, and from there I was like,
okay, this group coaching thing is really way more powerful

(30:43):
than one-on-one coaching.
So that's why I've kept up with it
and have a new coaching program coming out in January.
Yeah, and we're gonna talk more about that,
your group coaching and your programs
and all the stuff you have launching soon.
But I wanna linger on this for a moment
because once again, it's another thing

(31:05):
I think we have a little bit in common.
This value in social community.
I'm also, even though I did team sports,
I did a lot of individual stuff,
bodybuilding, running, wrestling,
a lot of that was just for me and my work ethic
and my drive and whatever I could do
for my own performance and outcomes,
like I felt I had control over it.

(31:27):
But I've also felt quite a bit isolated at times
because I'm such an individual.
I sit down here in the basement, this is where I hang out,
and I write books and I moved to a new community
where I basically, about four and a half years ago,
I didn't have any friends here,
maybe one or two, or mostly my wife's friends,
but I somewhat became my friends too.

(31:49):
And I made this comment that I don't need friends here.
I just, I wanna do my work.
I wanna do my work and produce amazing books
that are gonna change the world.
But after a while, man, I started missing friends
and connection and granted this was all during COVID as well
and it was just amplified and it was a challenge.

(32:13):
And then, coming out of that and going on tour like crazy,
I mean, I've already seen you in multiple countries
and I don't even know how many cities.
I mean, I've seen you in Miami and in Toronto
and in Vancouver and in Seattle,
and it feels like elsewhere too, but at least those places.
Yeah.
Where do you see the value in social communities,

(32:36):
even if it's online, like your online groups
or within Zoom calls or whatever,
where is the value in just personal health and wellness
from that social network?
Yeah, and I will say that I'm a total introvert.
Like that's, that describes me to a T.

(32:59):
That doesn't mean I think there's a misconception
that says introverts don't need social interaction.
I think that's absolutely false.
That the thing that we need is plenty of time to recharge,
quiet time to recharge on our own,
but that social interaction is important for everybody.
That human connection is important for everybody.

(33:21):
And finding those people in your life,
and they talk about also, you know,
Brene Brown that talks about shame,
like we're all carrying some shame of one sort or another.
Shame can't survive being spoken.
And I know from my days when I was struggling
and I didn't feel like I could tell anybody,
that kind of makes the shame grow.

(33:43):
So there's so many layers here
to having that social interaction just from being able
to feed into other people's energy.
I mean, I love working out around other people.
I do take classes and I love doing that too.
But I just love being in the presence of other people
and being in people that have amazing energy, right?

(34:05):
Because we can absorb that energy.
It works all both ways,
but I think it's partly an energy thing.
I think it's partly a feeling of safety,
of being able to share who you really are,
giving you space to be authentic,
to be able to shine your light on other people,
to make a difference.

(34:26):
Everybody, I think, in their heart wants to make
a positive impact in the world.
And the healthier we are, the happier we are,
the more we can do that.
And sometimes that requires us to be in communities
and social groups.
So I think it's really important on so many levels
for us to be in the presence of others.

(34:48):
Yeah, and how important is it to choose the right community?
And we've worked a million times.
It's in every personal development book,
including ones we've written, I'm sure,
that we are the average of the five people
we spend the most time with.
If people we spend a lot of time with
are constantly complaining or they have a negative mindset

(35:08):
or pessimistic or they're constantly struggle
in one capacity or another,
we're likely going to fall into that.
That's just how it works.
If we are surrounded by optimistic go-getters,
leaders, thought leaders, entrepreneurs,
whatever, we tend to do that.
And I've gone in many different directions.
I've been around lots of successful entrepreneurs

(35:29):
and I found some ways to success there.
I've also been someone who has been very hard on myself,
very critical of myself.
I mean, you've seen it even just publicly,
me sharing recently with my recent book launch
that didn't reach my expectations
and sent me into a depression.
And then I think I hung around the people
who would listen to me and put up with me sharing

(35:50):
other than lifting me up in some other ways.
So I wanna ask you about that, how important it is to,
if we can choose the right community,
which is hard to do sometimes,
but also if you can address this too,
that I heard the stat recently,
probably from a psychologist,
I listened to a lot of psychology podcasts,

(36:11):
like hours a day sometimes,
that many of us don't have more than three close friends
that we can count on, like really count on.
We have like one or two people in our entire life,
that's maybe not immediate family.
Can you speak to some of those things
about the people we spend time with
and those who are in our closest circle?

(36:34):
Yeah, so I think it's really interesting.
I've been through so many phases, right?
Like right now in my life, I feel really empowered,
really, there's a lot of joy in my life.
I even know I'm working very hard,
many long hours right now on some exciting projects.
I feel energized and excited.

(36:54):
Well, two years ago, I thought I was in the same place
and then I hit burnout and I went through a phase
where I ended up in Peru doing ayahuasca
for six out of 11 nights at the temple of the way of life,
or temple of the way of light.
And so, life is such an adventure,

(37:17):
it's ups and downs and our energy shifts.
And sometimes what I'm saying is that sometimes
we really need to be intentional about being around people
who are in their best phase, right?
Who have that energy to spare, who have that support to give.
And other times when we're feeling really good,

(37:38):
we get to then help those and be around people
who are needing our support.
Does that make sense?
I'm not saying don't be friends with people at certain times,
but it's just where we're spending our energy
kind of depends on where we're at and who we can help.
Or if we're not in a place to really be very helpful

(37:59):
at that moment, then it's somebody else's turn
to be helpful to us.
So that gets to happen in cycles and phases
where sometimes we're strong enough to be around the people
whose energy is not so great,
but that's because we're meant at that moment
to be there for them and to help lift them up.

(38:19):
And other moments we get to rely on someone else to do that.
Does that make sense?
Yeah, absolutely.
And what I gathered from that is it's how we decide
to share our light.
Whether we have a bright light at the moment
and we see someone else's who's dim
and who could need more of that,
or when we're feeling dim and we're feeling burned out,

(38:39):
a word you actually used, our lights burned out.
We gotta be around those that have the brightest stars,
to help us out.
Hey, it's Nathan Crane, founder of Plant Powered Athlete.
And I wanna thank you for tuning in
to the Plant Powered Athlete podcast.
And as a special thank you,
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(39:00):
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(39:21):
you can use the word podcast at checkout,
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Thanks again for tuning in.
Another thing I wrote down is that,
what I got from you is how we use the charge of our battery.
Some people are really low

(39:42):
and they just need an extra 20%,
they need an extra 40% or 60%.
Sometimes we're really low
and we could use someone else's battery.
Other times, and sometimes Ella, it's a flip of a switch.
I just experienced this literally last week.
I felt my new book release,
The Impactful Vegan, you contributed to it, thank you,

(40:05):
was like the biggest project of my life.
It was like my make it or break it moment
and all this stuff and the book launch
did not go as planned.
I couldn't even bring myself to ask my publisher
for sales figures for the last two months
because I was just so disappointed and depressed.
You know what happened, Ella?

(40:26):
I finally gathered up the energy and courage.
I kept putting it off
and I'd think about it on a Thursday or Friday,
I'm like, well, I can't write on the weekend,
I'll try next week.
And Friday would come around, I'll try next week.
I finally wrote on maybe a Thursday.
It wasn't a Friday, so I had to email out in time.
And then I heard that I had sold
twice as many books as I thought.
I thought I sold 2,500.

(40:47):
I heard that I had sold over 5,090 days.
You know what that did to my light, my battery, my energy?
It completely changed because of how much I associated
my conditional self-worth with that result,
which I know is a problem of mine.
Maybe you've dealt with that too,
where my self-worth is wrapped up into how successful

(41:08):
this project is.
And you and I have both been on big stages,
speaking in different countries today,
this year, I should say.
And I know you and I have talked moments
before taking the stage, like, it's a nerve wracking thing,
let's see how this is gonna go.
Or coming off the stage, like nailed it, right?
Or like, man, that went so well.

(41:29):
And we've both been there.
So I like your analogy of you don't have to,
or your explanation, you don't have to always be around
that the happy go lucky, go getters, full of energy,
blissfully optimistic all the time.
That's not often what you always need.

(41:50):
And it's not what others need from you.
So I'm really glad you explained that.
And feel free if you have anything else to add on that.
No, I was just gonna say that I love our little talks
before you go up on stage,
because I'm striving to be the speaker that you are one day.

(42:10):
Like you are my speaker idol who can just go up there
and do your thing.
I mean, it's amazing.
You talk about anxiety on so many levels for you.
But when it comes to when you get up on that stage,
and I know this year you've tried out some different talks
that have been more challenging
and having to experiment with that.

(42:31):
And they haven't all come out across
the way you wanted them to, which was hard.
But just all in all, just wanted to throw that out there
because that is what I'm striving for.
And absolutely, I mean, I'm like you again,
in that I'm very hard on myself,
very much have to be intentional now

(42:51):
about shifting my mindset about my worth.
And that I think that shift has really helped me
create more happiness and join my life
because for so long, my self-worth was absolutely wrapped up
in what I did, what I accomplished.
And I really had to train myself to understand,

(43:12):
to really embrace the fact
that we all have inherent self-worth,
that we are worthy, not just because of what we do,
but just because of who we are.
We are worthy.
And I think that's something that doesn't come naturally,
not only to me, but to so many people.
And it's an intentional shift.
It's a reprogramming of our mind and our mindset

(43:37):
that will make one of the biggest differences in our lives
and how we just move through the world
when we realize that we are worthy just because we're here.
Yeah, Elliot, it reminds me of my late friend, Bridget Kosser,
who passed away a couple of years ago.
She was the entertainer on the vegan cruise

(43:57):
for 13 years in a row, the singer.
You must've met her a number of times.
Her slogan was just three words.
It was, you are enough.
You are enough.
And I think of that
because I don't always feel that way.
I don't always feel that I'm enough.
And it's a good reminder.

(44:18):
I also, maybe you could have some insight here,
something I struggled with this year,
Ella, and maybe you can help me out here
or help out our listeners too.
And again, I'm not trying to bring this back to me.
I'm just, this is something I think perhaps
your thoughts can be helpful to lots of people listening here.
I was saying for months and months and months

(44:40):
that with my book launch coming out
that I was going to let go of the attachment to the outcome.
I was convinced.
I've listened to all these psychology podcasts.
I'm a huge fan of Shankar Vidantam
from Hidden Brain and Rich Roll and Chris Williamson
and Stephen Bartlett and all these,
all these personal performance and psychology podcasts.

(45:00):
And I wanted to let go of attachment.
I wrote it in newsletters.
I posted it on social media for thousands to see.
And I couldn't do it.
I tried and I tried.
I'm letting go of attachment to the outcome.
I put it out in the world as almost like a scapegoat
for in case it doesn't go well.
I told everyone I'm letting go.
But I couldn't let go.

(45:22):
I couldn't even talk to anyone for days or even weeks perhaps
when I felt such disappointment
because of my conditional self-worth wrapped up
into the outcome of one particular project,
even though it's this much of who I am,
it was this much of who I am in that moment.
How do you let go of attachment to the outcome

(45:42):
when things don't go your way?
How are you okay at the end of the day?
Yeah, it's not easy, Robert.
It is not easy.
And I think you've made some really big steps
in moving in that direction.
But this is, if we think about, and I call it our programming,

(46:03):
that programming has been around for decades.
So listening to some podcasts, reading some books,
and saying it isn't necessarily going to flip the switch
and have you be able to truly do it, to really embody it.
And it's a part of the process.

(46:25):
It's just not going to happen overnight.
It's not going to happen in a week.
It's not going to happen in a month,
maybe not even in a year.
But if we look at the grand scheme of things,
and we're talking about a program again
that's been there for decades,
so we have to understand that it's in the moment
continually challenging our thoughts
and our thoughts create our emotions.

(46:47):
And our combination of our thoughts and emotions
drive our actions.
So the one thing we do have power over are our thoughts.
I'm not talking about being able to just not have a thought,
but I'm talking about being able to observe a thought
and then counter it, to challenge that thought,
to tell yourself, just because I have a thought

(47:08):
doesn't make it true.
That's a great mantra to think of.
Just because I have a thought doesn't make it true.
So it is work.
And I tell this to my clients, this is not a quick fix
and this is not an easy fix, but it is a permanent fix.
But it takes consistency and it takes practice
and it takes you continually challenging that programming

(47:30):
time and time again.
Sometimes there are some different ways we can do that.
I use my yoga practice as a whole hour long practice
to take a certain thing I'm trying to do.
I'm trying to reprogram and have that be the focus.
You can do it through movement.
You can do it through guided meditations.
You can do it through journaling.

(47:53):
There's so many different tools, sometimes tapping.
There's the EFT tapping that you can do to help
with the energy centers.
It's kind of like a manual acupuncture.
So there are lots of little tools and tricks
that may help the process along a little faster.
But when it comes down to it, we have to understand
that this is really truly reprogramming our mind,

(48:16):
programs that have been around for decades,
that now we have to challenge, challenge, challenge again.
And in order to do that, we've got to stay
in our conscious mind much more often.
We're used to walking around really going
on our subconscious programming.
And that usually runs the show 90 to 95% of the time.
90 to 95% of the time we're walking around

(48:37):
just on our subconscious programming.
And that's usually very self-sabotaging programming.
So if we can stay in our conscious mind,
continue to challenge those thoughts,
eventually our emotions will start to shift.
And like you said, like you had one moment, right?
Where you got that email or whatever,
you realized you sold over 5,000 copies

(48:59):
and all of a sudden your energy, your emotions,
they all shifted just like that.
Well, what if you had gotten that email, Robert,
and it said you had sold over 5,000 copies,
your emotions shifted, your energy shifted,
and your publisher was lying.
You had only sold 2,000.
So it had actually nothing to do with the actual outcome,

(49:20):
right?
It was a thought in your head that said,
I sold and now I'm worthy and now I'm happy, right?
So that's the power of our thoughts.
Our thoughts shift our emotions.
That was a thought you had.
It didn't even have to shift your emotions.
It didn't even have to be true,
but your emotion shifted
and then your actions probably shifted after that.

(49:41):
So that's the power of our thoughts.
So through my coaching programs,
we really learn how to self-coach ourselves,
to shift our programming,
and then to be able to take more intentional actions
in our life.
Is that why visualization is so important?
Because it doesn't have to be real,
but there's Joe Dispenza is really big on that.

(50:06):
My wife's a big fan of his.
She went to one of those five-day retreats
that are life-changing for a lot of people.
It was a five-day or seven-day, whatever it was, retreat,
where he talks about this idea
and many people talk about it.
Many sports psychologists,
many of the best athletes in the world use this practice.
So you visualize something happening

(50:27):
before it happens as if it's actually happening,
as if not even as it's happening,
but you confirm it's already been achieved.
Like you already have this affirmation that,
yeah, I've already done this thing.
It's in my mind.
I visualize all of it.
And he said there's something along the lines of

(50:48):
the brain waves or nervous system or something.
Can't tell the difference between
actually achieving something
and believing that you have.
But that also seems to be a little bit confusing
because you could just go through life
visualizing all this stuff that never actually happens

(51:09):
then feel disappointed.
So how do you rectify that?
Or how do you use the power of visualization
in a positive way that is not a misrepresentation
of reality in ways that don't adversely affect you?
Yes, I'm a big Dr. Joe fan as well.

(51:32):
Dr. Bruce Lipton, I reference him a lot in my talks
because he really talks about how most of our programming
is set by the time we're seven years old,
that our minds are kind of like a wiped hard drive
until then being programmed by the influencers in our lives,
which really helps us to understand our subconscious
and why it's not serving us.

(51:52):
And why it's important to change it.
And then thinking about that shift in energy.
You know, it's the law of attraction kind of thing.
The energy we put out is the energy we get back.
So how can we shift our energy?
Visualization is a great way to allow us to shift our energy
to start putting that energy out.

(52:13):
And that energy will come back to us in that same way.
Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow,
but the more we can put ourselves in the space,
and remember going back, the higher our energy is,
these are our frequencies as well,
you know, the more we get to shine our light on the world
and the more positive impact we get to make.
So at all, what is the, I mean, if we look at it,

(52:36):
what would be the downside?
What, we have to be real?
I mean, what is real?
What really is real, right?
And how much control do we have over this story,
this life that we're in?
Like, there's so much, I mean,
we could go down the rabbit hole of quantum physics,
and I'm not equipped to talk about that.

(52:58):
I watch a lot of documentaries and do a lot of research on it,
but I'm certainly not equipped to talk intelligently about it.
But it all makes a lot of sense to me that we're, you know,
this, we just look out, I mean, it's,
this world is a pretty wondrous place, right?
There's a lot of, a lot of suffering,

(53:18):
but there's also a lot of wonder.
I mean, just looking at different species
and how our bodies work.
I mean, this is amazing life that we're living, right?
And if we can move through the world with so much curiosity
and so much compassion and so much wonder, you know,
that anything is possible.

(53:40):
I mean, there's only good that can come out of that.
And yes, we could move through the world,
worrying about the worst case scenario,
but that's where our energy is going.
Why would we want to put energy into the worst case scenario
to protect ourselves?
Again, now we're, now we're operating from fear, not love.

(54:01):
Yeah, that is-
Those are the two options, love or fear.
That was a really good soundbite.
Note to the editor, that was awesome.
Yeah, cut and paste that.
That was really good, Ella.
I want to ask you along these same lines,
a really kind of maybe bizarre question.
Okay.

(54:21):
But it's something that I've thought about
and something that I'm considering practicing.
And I would love to hear your thoughts about this.
Okay, tell me.
This whole idea of self-worth wrapped up
into the success of projects and perfectionism
and workaholism and all of that.
I have this idea that I think I've only discussed

(54:43):
maybe with Chef AJ, who's helped me
with some of my anxiety stuff as well.
And this is the idea of intentionally, purposefully failing
to recognize that it's not the end of the world.
And I'm not saying to do this in major, major ways.
I'm not going to like throw all my books in the dumpster
or tell people like, stop by my books,

(55:06):
like return them all to the bookstore.
But I mean, sometimes not giving my best speech
or not doing my best interview
or being a little bit flustered here or there,
or just intentionally, it's not perfect.
Because we use this word striving.
You've used it today.
I often use it.

(55:26):
I don't know if I have until now,
but you and I, we tend to be these strivers,
these high performers.
And when I got diagnosed with anxiety,
which for the same reasons as you, I didn't talk about.
I didn't want people to associate it with veganism,
even though I probably dealt with it
way before I became vegan at age 15.
I was a nervous, anxious kid,
and I've dealt with this for my life

(55:49):
until it was finally diagnosed.
And the doctor said that it's due in part, perhaps,
because I'm such a high performer or high achiever
that everything has to be perfect.
And I cannot live in a world where my effort is not perfect.
That's very difficult for my psyche to handle.

(56:11):
So I'm considering intentionally failing.
Maybe the second half of this podcast,
I'll do a bad job hosting.
I'm already talking too much.
I can tell that.
I'll tell you that right now.
So what do you think about power of thoughts
and all these things I wrote down,

(56:31):
do the work, part of the process?
But what if part of the process is like,
hey, go give a bad talk sometime and see what happens.
See if everyone hates you or if they say, yeah, it was okay.
It's very interesting.
Very, very interesting, Robert.
Yeah, well, I think as an entrepreneur,

(56:52):
we are in a position to fail a lot.
We are just in that position.
And yeah, the more times you do it,
you could say the more you get used to it.
But if you're as high at an achiever as you and I are,
I've never gotten used to it.
I've had to be really intentional.
Now, here's the thing.
We could let that prevent us from trying, right?

(57:16):
From doing a new talk for you,
writing this book that's so different
than all the books you've written before, right?
This was a very different project for you.
The talk you gave at one of the Planted Expo,
a very different talk, right?
You gave yourself permission to do something,
not knowing if it was gonna be a success.

(57:38):
Now, did you go into that really setting yourself up
to be unattached to the outcome?
Maybe you did mentally, but maybe you didn't feel that, right?
But that's part of this process.
But that's the power of what I call declarations.
Some people call them mantras.
Some people call them affirmations.
I don't really like affirmations
because affirmations to me says,
I'm going to say something that I already believe

(58:00):
when usually what I'm talking about is saying things
that we don't actually believe.
So for example, it's progress over perfection.
I think that's a great mantra.
And having these things ready to coach yourself
after you have the thought,
and this is why you gotta be in your conscious mind.
You have the thought,
damn, that was not what I wanted it to be.

(58:22):
I get to observe that thought and say,
it's progress over perfection, Ella.
And I say that 100 times, 200 times, 300 times.
And eventually I will believe it, right?
Another one is there is no failure, only feedback,
very related to failure.

(58:42):
There is no failure, only feedback.
That makes a hell of a lot of sense, right?
Every time, I mean, we talk about it in fitness all the time.
Get out of your comfort zone.
You can't change your body
if you're staying in your comfort zone.
You challenge your body and push through tough times, right?
Until failure, right?

(59:02):
You do those biceps curl to failure.
It's not a bad thing.
It gives you feedback.
Doing things that are tough,
that you feel like you failed,
it is the opportunity for growth.
It is the opportunity to discovery,
to discover blind spots that are keeping you

(59:22):
from being your best self.
So only through failure do we get to grow.
So if we can say that's not failure, that's feedback.
And it's that reprogramming.
So I don't know if I need to set myself up
to definitely fail because I'm gonna fail many times anyway,
being the entrepreneur and doing new projects
and launching new challenges

(59:43):
like I'm launching that I've never done before.
I mean, maybe nobody shows up to this challenge.
Maybe what I thought would resonate with people
is not gonna resonate with people.
Maybe I'm working 80 hours on a project
that only two people are gonna listen to.
And then do I get to say that was not worth it?
Or do I get to say maybe I changed two people's lives?
Maybe it wasn't the outcome I thought,

(01:00:04):
but maybe it's just what I needed to learn
and to regroup and do it differently next time.
So I think, I mean, I fail all the time, but,
and it's gotten easier.
It's certainly gotten easier, but it's not easy.
Yeah.
And so maybe your conclusion is
you don't need to deliberately fail
because it comes to the territory so much

(01:00:27):
that you're just gonna absorb it.
Or at least for those of us who are ourselves out there,
we are taking risks, we're doing new things,
we're creating new programs like your coaching program
and your mindfulness program and all that.
And there's some uncertainty there.
Yes.
And we, and I guess we have,
I don't know if it's strength, the right word.

(01:00:48):
We have, like we have the, let's use strength for now.
We have the strength to be able to put ourselves out there
and absorb whatever happens,
whereas so many people will never get off the fence.
They just won't.
And that's okay.
There's just different personality types.
That's why there's go-getters.
And that's why there's people who are teammates
or people who follow leaders

(01:01:09):
or people who are carving a path as a leader themselves.
We're all different and we need all of us.
It just, it's how we all fit in.
And I think you and I are risk takers,
but we're strong enough,
even though we both deal with anxiety,
even though we both deal with failure,
we both deal with self-confidence
and whether we are enough,

(01:01:29):
we still say it's worth it for me to pursue this
because I have to know.
Because if it works, if it works,
it's going to change the world for someone else.
It's going to change the world for animals if this works.
It's going to change the world for a loved one
or a friend or someone who's in my program if it works.
It's going to change someone's life

(01:01:51):
if they absorb it and apply it
and allow that change to happen.
And that's worth it.
That's why we take these risks
when a lot of people are unwilling to do
the financial risk, the time involved.
What I described as what I just did,
I felt like I failed publicly.
I mean, I let everybody know how poorly I performed

(01:02:11):
because I felt I owed that to people
who were following along for months or years
and then saw it come crashing down.
We have whatever that is,
that strength or resilience maybe
is what I'm looking for to say,
you know what, I'm going to try it anyway.
And if it doesn't work,
I've got something else to do.

(01:02:32):
And speaking of those programs,
I want to talk about your programs,
but I also want to interject this quote.
It may not be totally apropos,
but it's another one from Chef AJ
when I was talking about perfectionism and workaholism
and I just want everything to be perfect.
She said, Robert, done is more profitable than perfect.
Just get it done.
And take the word profitable out if you want.

(01:02:55):
Done is more effective than perfect.
Done is more impactful than perfect.
Done is more fill in the blank.
Most of us, and I work with a lot of people,
and I work with all these,
I met a guy last night at a Johnny Cash Tribute musical show
who wants to write a book.
And I explained how I've written six.
You've got to just put in the work and let go of it,

(01:03:17):
even if it's not perfect, done is better than perfect.
So I wanted to interject that,
but I have so many questions to ask
and I know we're probably down to 20, 25 minutes.
I had all these questions about
what does being a plant-powered athlete mean to you
and how do you overcome obstacles
and push back with veganism
and why don't people change,
even when they're given or shown the information

(01:03:39):
about animal suffering,
why won't they change their habits?
And we can cover those,
but I also want you to tell us
about your new group coaching program in detail
and about your mindfulness in motion
mixed movement flow program
because those are coming up very soon
and I want to provide you the platform
to do that and also just want to say

(01:04:00):
how much I've enjoyed this conversation.
This has been really helpful for me too
in a kind of therapeutic way.
So thank you, Ella.
Yes, me too.
I kind of feel like we're back and forth
with a little in the therapy office or something.
Well, that's a twins do.
We're like on the same page in so many ways.
So tell us, you've got new coaching program
you've alluded to

(01:04:21):
and then you've got this mindfulness
in motion mixed movement flow.
Let's get some details on that.
Let's get some details, dates, details, website, info.
Yeah, and we don't have to talk a bunch about that.
We can talk about other things, but I will.
I do want to mention
I've got a brand new emergency cravings toolkit.
I think about things people really struggle with

(01:04:41):
on many levels and cravings are one of them.
Cravings from the standpoint of animal products
for people that are not yet plant-based
and who want to be plant-based.
Cravings based on emotions, so emotional eating.
Cravings based on addictions to products
that chef AJ talks about all the time.

(01:05:02):
You know, sugar, salt, oil, sugar, refined sugar.
So I've got this great new cravings toolkit
that's absolutely free.
So we will put the link in the show notes if we could
because I'd love people to invite people to grab that.
I've got a newsletter that I put out every Sunday

(01:05:22):
called the Soul Aligned Sunday Newsletter.
So I will say Sexy.
I do want to mention, you know, Sexy Fit Vegan
was the brand name I came up with in 2011.
I believe it was 2011 when I created that brand.
And at the time I was, you know, in Miami, I'm like,

(01:05:42):
all right, it's time I get to, you know, create a brand
and I want it to be appealing to everyone.
I want to bring veganism into the mainstream.
I want to break all the stereotypes about
what it means to be vegan, that vegans are scrawny,
that vegans are angry, that vegans have to be hippies
and yoga people, you know, all these stereotypes.

(01:06:03):
I'm like, no, vegan, that's sexy.
Compassion is sexy.
I want everybody to know that you can be sexy and have fun
and be fit as a vegan.
So hence Sexy Fit Vegan.
Since then, as my kind of spiritual journey is aligned,
I have created an acronym around Sexy
that I do want to share.

(01:06:24):
Sexy means soul aligned, embracing your body,
exploring life playfully and you being you.
So all about authenticity, all about just living life
to the fullest, about confidence and connecting
kind of on a soul level.
So my Sunday newsletter has been something

(01:06:47):
that people really enjoy.
I kind of share about my journey and put out things
that'll really help people resonate with people.
Some of the favorite products I'm using,
all vegan and cruelty-free, of course.
And I've had people respond and be like,
I look forward to this newsletter every week.
You're not trying to sell me anything.
This is really great reading.

(01:07:08):
So I definitely encourage people to sign up for that as well.
The Mindfulness in Motion series,
that's going to actually come out with the plant-based bundle.
So I think this will come out in time for people
to purchase the plant-based bundle,
but that'll be in that.
And then we'll be selling that separately as well,
but I'm not sure about the date.
And then we've got a great challenge coming up.
This is a challenge that is going to help people,

(01:07:32):
emotional eaters, eat more mindfully.
So we'll put that.
It's a free challenge as well.
That's happening the first weekend of July.
It's a free challenge as well. That's happening the first weekend of December.
And then the coaching program for emotional eaters will launch in January.
But what I encourage people to do is sign up for the challenge first
so you can get a little taste of what we do and what we teach

(01:07:54):
and get a lot of value.
It's an incredible challenge that is going to help you.
We all say, I need to slow down with my eating.
I need to eat more mindfully.
But then we don't really do it.
And mindful eating is one of the things.
It's not like I'm so sexy, but it has literally changed my life.
It helped me transform my relationship with food and my body.

(01:08:17):
And I just have so many good things to say about mindful eating.
I've had clients just by starting to eat mindfully
have lost weight without changing anything about what they ate.
They simply changed how they ate.
My one client, Jen, lost I think 10 pounds in the first six weeks.

(01:08:38):
And we didn't even talk about meal plan.
We didn't even talk about changing her food.
We literally helped her start to eat mindfully.
So it is a game changer.
So yeah, that was a lot, Robert.
Yeah. And I want to add to that.
Well, one first thing, so sexyfitvegan.com
where they can get the Sunday newsletter.

(01:08:59):
Yes.
We have a brand new URL for that as well.
But yes, if they go to sexyfitvegan.com,
there'll be a link to the newsletter.
Okay. And we'll put whatever links we can
in this description online as well.
But I just want to add to that, that when you saw me in Miami in February,

(01:09:20):
that was the lightest I'd been in a decade.
And I use a mindful eating approach.
I lost 27 pounds in almost three and a half, four months.
I mean, a very short amount of time.
And it was probably slightly different from your approach,
but that's the way I described it was mindful and thoughtful eating.
And it made a tremendous difference.

(01:09:42):
Now, I was so effective at fat loss and weight loss that as a bodybuilder,
and again, it goes back to self-image and self-worth,
I felt like I was too small.
We had dinner in Miami with Dan Bootner and from the Blue Zones,
and we were with PCRM.
And I was trying to tuck up my shirt and flex as much as I could

(01:10:03):
knowing I'm down 27 pounds.
But it is really, really effective.
So everyone listening out there, please check out Ella's program.
She's one of the best in the business and also just a wonderful person and dear friend.
And don't worry, this is not the end of the podcast.
We've still got 15 minutes.
I'm just grateful that you're sharing all these things,

(01:10:26):
emergency cravings, toolkit, all of that.
I deal with that myself.
When I get stressed out, I reach for something.
I can't get the technology right on the podcast.
I get stressed out and I'll grab, I've got like a chocolate bar right over there.
It's nice vegan chocolate bar.
It's looking at me.
No, stay there.
We're fine.
I'm doing fine.

(01:10:46):
It's with Ella.
I'm comfortable.
Okay, stay there.
So I do want to cover some of those things I just alluded to.
Yeah.
But now after all these years, what does being a plant-powered athlete mean to you?
Yeah, it's interesting.
I mean, I'm always experimenting with the way I eat, but I've come to a place in my

(01:11:13):
life where I really do eat very intuitively.
Food and eating doesn't take up a lot of space in my life.
I don't plan out my meals.
I don't do meal planning.
I don't do calorie counting.
I don't do macro counting.
I really eat in the ways that I know will nourish and fuel my body

(01:11:36):
that will support my fitness endeavors, which for me, it's all just fun.
I'm not competing anymore, but just hit my goal.
If you don't do pull-ups for a while, you lose them.
Right?
I mean, I'm not the only one who just, if you don't do your pull-ups,
next time you go to do pull-ups, you're like, dang, I can't do as many.

(01:11:56):
Well, I like to be able to pull my body weight.
So just hit my goal of my 10 pull-ups in a row.
So I'm doing like 30 pull-ups without any assistance a couple of times a week now.
I've got some other, a press handstand.
I've got skills that I'm trying to do.
I love to be strong.
I love to be flexible.
I love to be mobile.
I love to be well-rounded.

(01:12:16):
So doing the calisthenics and the primal movements.
Anyway, so really when I think about eating, it really is about,
okay, what can I do to feel really comfortable in my body
to support the goals that I have in my fitness, in my health for the long term?
And that's how I choose my foods.

(01:12:37):
Yes, I choose foods that are delicious, but I've trained my palate
to not have cravings for refined sugar.
I got rid of refined sugar, maybe six years ago.
I decided that, I really felt that urge to have something sweet after dinner every night.

(01:12:59):
And I would eat some no sugar added coconut milk ice cream, maybe.
But every night I felt like I needed some coconut milk ice cream.
And I didn't like that feeling.
So I said, let me see what happens if I just get rid of refined sugar for six weeks.
Did that, felt great.
Wasn't craving sweets anymore.
So I kept going.

(01:13:19):
Eventually, now I'm to the point, yes, I can have a piece of vegan cake every once in a while.
I had a vegan scone the other day, but I noticed how that made me feel.
It was delicious for the couple minutes of the day.
It was delicious for the couple minutes I was eating it.
And then I was like, now I don't feel so great.
That's going to happen.
But I don't crave it anymore.
So it's not about willpower.

(01:13:41):
And that's one of the big things.
We've got to get to this place where we're not constantly using willpower to try to eat healthy.
Got to get to a place.
I encourage people not to use cheat meals or not to use what we say is a treat, to not eat for reward.
Because when we say, okay, I'm going to be really good and then I'll have my cheat meal,

(01:14:06):
what that implies is the good part is a restriction.
And this is a very powerful way, a mindset around food.
If we're viewing all the other meals except our cheat meal as restriction,
then all we're doing is focusing on, I can't wait to get my cheat meal,
which is something usually unhealthy, that's not serving us,

(01:14:26):
that's not going to make us feel good.
So how is that a treat?
Number one, it's a treat for five minutes and then it's,
oh, now I don't feel good.
That wasn't aligned.
Now I'm going to feel guilty.
It's not much of a treat.
So I think reframing how we relate to food, how we relate to our bodies is really powerful

(01:14:48):
and really instrumental in creating a lifestyle and a way of eating that sets us up to be healthy
and fit for the long run.
And that's the way I live my life now.
And it's very refreshing, back from the bodybuilding days where you're like,
oh, Monday through Saturday, I'm going to be really good.
And then Sunday's my cheat meal and I'm going to watch all my bodybuilder friends eat

(01:15:08):
pizza, entire pizza.
And I'm going to have my granola and a jar of peanut butter and then feel like crap the next day.
Like I look back on those days, I'm like, wow, that's one way to do it.
And that's how a lot of people do it.
And now I look at how I live now and I can't wait to go have my salad, which I eat for breakfast

(01:15:31):
in the mornings because it makes me feel so good.
You know, that makes sense.
I just, I don't know if I can get salad for breakfast for myself off to run that by Karen.
We'll see how that
Yeah, I don't even have salad for lunch or dinner.
If you started eating this particular salad, I am telling you what, Robert, I know I'm going to send

(01:15:56):
you the recipe for this salad because this salad, I mean, Anne from Hogs and Kisses,
I and she's like, I don't like, I don't really like salad.
She's vegan, you know, for many, many years, but she's not a big salad fan.
And she's like, certainly not salad for breakfast.
Well, she's not a salad fan.
And she's like, certainly not salad for breakfast. Well, she started eating the salad and I got this voice message for her.

(01:16:18):
I saved it because she's like, Ella, what, what the hell is up with this salad?
She's like, I think I'm addicted to this salad.
This salad is so good.
What is it? Why is it?
This is incredible.
Like it was this.
Yes.
So I'm raving about my particular salad.
It is special and it is breakfast worthy.

(01:16:38):
Just saying.
Well, and I do need to incorporate more greens into my nutrition plan.
I'm, I'm well aware of that.
And by the way, I didn't forget, just so you know, I have multiple notes here that remind
that to ask about your animal sanctuary that.
So the hogs and kisses you just referenced, it's still in my notes.
Don't worry.

(01:17:00):
But while we're talking about the food thing real quick before, I think we'll finish with,
you know, mentioning the animal sanctuary that you work with and that kind of thing.
I do like that holistic and healthier approach that you take.
That's what I, that's what I gathered from what you just said.
And I feel a lot of the same way, intuitive eating,
moving away from that bodybuilder diet, enjoying food, being okay,

(01:17:23):
having a positive relationship with it.
And just enjoying what we're doing rather than all these different restriction things
are good or bad and putting things, foods into categories and all that.
So I appreciate that.
I just have a really, a few more questions here.
And maybe I have what five or six here.

(01:17:44):
So we'll just do maybe one minute answer if we can.
Okay, I'll do my best.
I never, I can never think of the term like fireball round.
What's it called?
Lightning round.
Oh, a lightning round.
Yeah.
I cannot remember that word.
If you watch like the last three or four podcasts, I keep calling like a fireball.
I can't figure.

(01:18:04):
Maybe I need more B12.
So more lightning round, even though it's for deep questions,
but just see what you can do in about a minute.
Okay.
Ella, why don't people change even when they know about animal suffering?
Why is it so hard for people to embrace veganism?
Yeah, it's all about the programming.

(01:18:25):
It's cognitive dissonance.
It's growing up in a society that says this is normal, natural, and necessary,
as Dr. Melanie Joy would say.
And we grow up accepting that that is the truth.
And it's much easier to accept that as the truth
than to believe that our thoughts and our beliefs are wrong.
And that makes us wrong.

(01:18:46):
And most of society is doing it so we can hide behind everyone else is doing it.
And it's easy to hide the way our food system is set up.
You know, we don't see it.
It's not in our face how that food is being produced.
We're very disconnected.
That's a very good answer.
Thank you.
That was fantastic.

(01:19:08):
So how do you or your clients or friends, colleagues,
overcome the obstacles that there is to embrace veganism
largely due to the pushback that you might receive
where there's a social cost to veganism,
where you might be the only one in your friends circle,

(01:19:29):
the only one in your family.
And maybe that's not true for you,
but true for clients or for friends or others who are struggling with.
I mean, I hear it all the time.
I want to be plant-based, but my partner's not,
or my family's not, or they're not supportive,
or society's not supportive.
I mean, look at airports.
You can't find anything.
How can I live this happy, comfortable life if it's so challenging?
So how do you overcome those obstacles and how do you coach other people

(01:19:55):
in the process of overcoming those obstacles and push back to veganism?
That's a big one.
It's a tough one.
I'll do my best to stay brief here,
but I think part of it is really standing in your belief of and being true
to who you are and what you believe to be in line with your values.
And if that's veganism, it's being really unapologetic about it

(01:20:18):
and putting a little bit of a lightness around it instead of making it so heavy.
I think we often, especially newbies, make it really heavy.
I don't know if I'm explaining that right, but for example,
a friend of mine just asked, she's vegan.
She said, I've got my grandparents and their friends staying with me over the hurricane.

(01:20:43):
And my house is animal-free.
Do I impose that on them when they're here?
And I said, I think it's absolutely, totally appropriate to say with a smile on your face,
just so you know, my house is animal and animal product-free.
I'm really excited that you're coming and that I get to share some of the amazing foods with you

(01:21:07):
that I eat.
If you want to make a list of some of your favorite fruits,
I'm going to make sure that we stock the kitchen with it and we'll experiment
and we'll have fun with it and all get to eat together.
I'm really excited about doing this.
So if you see how I spun that from something that could be like, oh, I'm so sorry.
I have to tell you, I don't allow foods in my house.

(01:21:30):
I'm so sorry you're going to suffer.
I know that's going to be really hard for you.
Instead of focusing on all of that, you get to put this really positive spin on it
and create an atmosphere around it that's going to be more adventurous
and more fun and more full of exploration.
I think the more heavy we make it and the more apologetic we are,

(01:21:52):
the less impactful we are.
That's another fantastic answer, Ella.
You are phenomenal.
Ding, ding, ding.
Yeah, this is great.
People are going to get so much value out of this.
Just a few more questions here.
What is now after 30 years of being a vegan advocate and activist,

(01:22:14):
doing all sorts of different things, even as a little kid sitting in a cage
on the side of the road to try to get people to understand
what animals are going through, through that visualization,
and all the other stuff you've done, but being a champion athlete,
even creating a sexy fit vegan brand, which by the way,
I love wearing that tank top around.
I feel like sexy fit vegan.

(01:22:34):
It fits you.
It fits you really well, Robert.
Thank you.
What is your favorite form of vegan advocacy today?
I don't know if I'd call it my favorite, but I think for me,
it's all about being a shining light and being an example of how good it feels,

(01:23:02):
how joyful it feels, how peaceful and freeing it feels
to live in line with the value of compassion for all beings,
to be able to use the opportunity we all have every time we pick up a fork
to be able to choose compassion over suffering.

(01:23:23):
And if I can show that that brings so much joy, peace, freedom,
and also allows you to have a healthy, fit, strong, lean body, combining those,
I think for me, that's the most effective way that I can promote veganism, just for me.

(01:23:47):
Yeah, I think that's true in so many areas of life when you lead by positive example
and just really believe what you're doing.
It's so hard, Ella, it's so hard to criticize veganism.
It's so hard to criticize someone who just truly believes in what they're doing
and they're doing good work.
When they're doing selfless, altruistic, empathetic, life-saving, life-changing work,

(01:24:12):
it's really hard to criticize someone who is out there just believing in themselves
and leading by example doing that.
And I want to thank you for taking that approach and for being an impactful vegan.
I've just got two last things here and then we'll talk about the sanctuary as we wrap up.
What's something that we can all do right now to be healthier?

(01:24:36):
And I mean, right now, like not tomorrow, not Monday, not the first, not January 1st.
Right now, what can I do as I'm listening to this, whenever this airs,
what can I do right now to become healthier?
I think I'm just going to go back to the mindful eating at your next meal.
Take the opportunity to slow down, to engage with your senses,

(01:25:00):
to consider where that food came from, how it got to your plate.
Connect with some gratitude around it.
Notice the colors, the shapes, the textures as you eat the food.
Be present with it.
Spend one meal a day, undistracted, building that relationship
with food and recognizing what it's going to do for your body,

(01:25:24):
how it's going to nourish your body or not.
Being really conscious about that.
And then that also gives you a better opportunity to recognize
when your body is fully nourished, when you're satiated.
If we stop when we're about 80% full, we will prevent overeating.
And if we think about just doing that, you probably reduce your calorie intake

(01:25:48):
without having to count a single calorie by 20, 30%.
So if there's body fat that you're looking to lose to be healthier,
that's going to help you do that.
So yeah, it's simple, not easy, but it's a game changer.
Yeah, really good advice.

(01:26:08):
And I hope listeners do take that to heart.
Everything you put on the edge of your fork matters.
Everything you put in your plate matters.
And it matters beyond our own health too, the health of the planet,
the health of the animals we share this planet with.
And also just a great way to reclaim our personal health
and have control over the outcomes as much as possible.

(01:26:28):
All right, Ella, last question before we hear about the animal sanctuary.
This one might throw you for a loop here.
And take, if you need 90 seconds, if you needed a few extra seconds
to answer this question.
Ella, if there was a movie made about your life, who would play you?

(01:26:57):
Like you're talking about an actor?
Yeah, actress, actor, a person that some of us might know
or could even be a loved one or a friend.
Who would play the role of Ella Majors in the story of her life?
If it can't be you, it's got to be someone else to represent you.

(01:27:19):
Who would that be?
This is a really challenging one for me.
Yeah, I've stumped you there.
You've had so many responses to questions that's been so helpful for our audience.

(01:27:42):
I like to finish with more of a playful one.
And I've actually got my twins stumped here.
You really do.
I mean, we'll keep thinking about it.
And I'm going to list a few more things here.
So you can find, you keep thinking about it.
I think you come up with an answer, but Ella is absolutely fantastic.

(01:28:04):
And you can find her on sexyfitvegan.com.
She has all kinds of group coaching programs coming up,
digital products, plant-based bundles, mindfulness programs.
She's an internationally touring speaker.

(01:28:24):
One of my favorite people that I get to see on a regular basis throughout the year.
In fact, didn't we play table tennis together in Miami?
Wasn't it table tennis we were playing at that after the world vegan bodybuilding champion?
Yes, we went, it was at the Cava place.
Oh my gosh.
And they got rid of their ping pong table.
And now I don't have anywhere to play ping pong.

(01:28:45):
And we have to play ping pong because I've been craving a ping pong match.
Yeah.
And I would like it to be with you because I thought we were very good matchup.
Yeah, we were.
And I was wearing these organic pineapple leather shoes that were a little too tight on me.
So I think I could have been a little bit more agile.
Okay.
All right.

(01:29:06):
That's my excuse for losing because I used to notice I didn't call it ping pong.
I used to, I take it very seriously.
I'm sorry.
Table tennis.
Yes.
Table tennis.
So I don't call it ping pong.
Yeah, no, you didn't either.
We call it table tennis.
And then you whooped me at that bar after the world vegan bodybuilding championships.
But Ella, do you have an answer?

(01:29:29):
And if not, that's okay.
I don't.
Well, I mean, this is the silliest answer.
It probably doesn't make any sense, but I'm just very connected to Fiona Oakes.
And I think she could, I mean, she doesn't dress up, but I think she could,
I think she could play any role.

(01:29:50):
If anybody doesn't know, I just visited her.
At her sanctuary.
Yes.
Yes.
You told me about that.
Outside of London.
And if you guys haven't seen the documentary Running for Good yet,
it's one of the most, have you seen it?
I haven't actually.
Oh, I haven't seen it.
I wrote about her in my book, The Plant Based Athlete.
She's got a whole section and her story is in my book.

(01:30:12):
And I've met her a number of times.
I drove her around in Hollywood along with Christine Vardaros.
When we were at a big vegan athlete meetup in Los Angeles.
That was some probably five years ago or so, but no, I have not seen the documentary.
It's unreal.
It is unreal.
Yeah.
Running for Good, you guys.
She is one of the most powerful humans on the planet.

(01:30:34):
So it's between her and maybe like Cameron Diaz.
So I don't know.
Okay.
All right.
So Cameron Diaz, both good answers and Oakes has been vegan for more than 50 years.
She's a very compassionate vegan.
Also a Guinness world record holder for running the.
Without a kneecap.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Born without a right kneecap.

(01:30:55):
Wasn't even expect to walk properly or run.
And yet she set marathon Guinness world records for the fastest accumulated time on all seven continents.
She's unbelievable.
Again, I wrote about her in my New York Times bestseller, The Plant Based Athlete, but also running for good.
And now talk about the sanctuary.
Bring us home here with Hogs and Kisses, the sanctuary that you are.

(01:31:17):
Are you a co-founder?
Are you a tell me the story?
I know part of the story, but tell me the rest of us as we finish up today.
I'm a founding board member.
So Ann is Ann Molina is one of my best friends and she lived in Miami and she went vegan,
I think around 13 years ago under my influence.

(01:31:40):
And so 10 years later, she moved to Virginia.
And I get a call from her and she goes, Ella, it's going to happen.
I'm going to create a sanctuary.
And will you be on the board?
And I just was on my balcony, started jumping up and down because as a vegan for as long as I have been,

(01:32:03):
and the way I make a difference isn't necessarily these days, very connected with the actual animals that I'm here to save and be a voice for.
So to be able to be a part of something like that, it's a micro sanctuary.
We call it Hogs and Kisses Farm Sanctuary.
So it's a small sanctuary, but it's an incredible place.

(01:32:26):
We are about to welcome two turkeys onto our sanctuary.
So we're very excited about that.
We've got farm pigs, we've got bunnies, and now we're about to open it up to feathered friends as well.
And we have a mini documentary that's out on YouTube we can link to that tells the story of how it all started and how two Miami girls,

(01:32:48):
you really know nothing about the farm life as you do, Robert.
So you can imagine the learning curve has been quite something.
But it's been quite an amazing adventure.
And I get to go up and relieve her when she goes on trips.
And I get to go up and hold down the Ford and spend time with these amazing souls and be a part of the decision making about how we run it.

(01:33:15):
But yeah, we bring in rescued farm animals and give them a home for the rest of their lives, the most loving home that we possibly can.
And it's an amazing place at Hogs Kisses on Instagram and does a great job of having you see what the what it's like to have a.

(01:33:36):
Have a sanctuary and what all is involved in that.
And it's been it's been a lot of fun and very, very gratifying.
I like the playful name to Hogs and Kisses.
That's very, very sweet.
Well, Ella, it's come to an end today.
We made it good. What, 90 minutes or more.

(01:33:59):
I want to thank you for your time.
I want to thank you for being an impactful vegan.
I want to thank you for all you do for animals and for all you do to inspire people to be the best versions of themselves.
So everyone listening, please go check out Ella's work, please support her work.
She is one of the best in the business.

(01:34:19):
And as you can tell from our conversation today, one of my favorite people in the world who I can't wait to see again soon.
And for on behalf of the Plant Powered Athlete podcast, I have been Robert Cheek.
My guest has been Ella Majors.
One of my favorites.
Ella, thank you again.
And I look forward to seeing you in the near future.
I appreciate you so much.

(01:34:41):
Thanks, everyone, for listening.
All right, everyone, we'll see you on the next episode of the Plant Powered Athlete podcast.
Until then, have a wonderful week.
See you next time.

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Ella Magers | Ella Magers on Breaking Stereotypes About Veganism and Fitness | PPAP27

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Stuff You Should Know

The Joe Rogan Experience

Dateline NBC

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