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July 25, 2025 40 mins

The science behind your garden hydrangeas involves far more than just planting and watering. Dr. Lisa Alexander, a research geneticist with the USDA Agricultural Research Service, takes us on a fascinating journey from her first days pollinating chestnut trees in a 70-foot bucket truck to her current work revolutionizing hydrangea breeding at the National Arboretum.

Working from the heart of Tennessee's nursery country, Dr. Alexander explains how she's mapping the genetic diversity of oakleaf hydrangea across its six-state native range. Her team has identified six distinct genetic populations, some containing rare genes that might help plants survive drought or cold temperatures. This groundbreaking research comes at a critical time – they've discovered that urbanization has already caused these beautiful native plants to disappear from many previously recorded locations.

The economic stakes are significant. Hydrangeas represent a $155 million industry, ranking as the second best-selling woody shrub behind roses. By understanding the genetic blueprint controlling traits like plant size, flower structure, and environmental adaptations, breeders can develop improved varieties that combine beauty with resilience.

Dr. Alexander also discusses the exciting launch of "Hort Genomes" – a new initiative creating a dedicated home for specialty crop genomic data within the Journal of the American Society for Horticultural Science. This resource will accelerate research across horticultural fields by centralizing crucial genetic information previously scattered across publications or unavailable to the scientific community.

Whether you're a backyard gardener admiring your hydrangeas or a scientist breeding the next generation of ornamental plants, this episode reveals the remarkable intersection of traditional horticulture with cutting-edge genomics that's shaping the future of our gardens.

Read the JASHS article “Precipitation, Temperature, and Population Structure Influence Genetic Diversity of Oakleaf Hydrangea Throughout Its Native Range” at https://www.doi.org/10.21273/JASHS05255-22.



Learn more about the American Society for Horticultural Science (ASHS) at https://ashs.org/.
HortTechnology, HortScience and the Journal of the American Society for Horticultural Science are all open-access and peer-reviewed journals, published by the American Society of Horticultural Science (ASHS). Find them at journals.ashs.org.

Consider becoming an ASHS member at https://ashs.org/page/Becomeamember!

You can also find the official webpage for Plants, People, Science at ashs.org/plantspeoplesciencepodcast, and we encourage you to send us feedback or suggestions at https://ashs.org/webinarpodcastsuggestion.

Podcast transcripts are available at https://plantspeoplescience.buzzsprout.com.

On LinkedIn find Sam Humphrey at linkedin.com/in/samson-humphrey. Curt Rom is at https://www.linkedin.com/in/curt-rom-611085134/. Lena Wilson is at https://www.linkedin.com/in/lena-wilson-2531a5141/.

Thank you for listening!


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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Curt Rom (00:01):
Welcome to Plants, people Science.
A podcast of the AmericanSociety for Horticulture Science
where we talk about all thingshorticulture.

Samson Humphrey (00:11):
I'm Samson Humphrey.
I'm a PhD student researcher atthe University of Tennessee and
I'm one of your co-hosts.

Curt Rom (00:18):
Hi, samson, it's great to hear from you.
I'm your other co-host, kurtRoem University, professor of
Horticulture from the Universityof Arkansas.
We'd like to welcome ouraudience today, samson.
I'm so glad that they'rejoining us, because I think this
is going to be a veryinteresting conversation.

Samson Humphrey (00:35):
I think so too.
We're covering a couple ofdifferent topics.
It's going to be an interestingone.
Our guest today is ASHS memberDr Lisa Alexander, who's a
research geneticist from the USDepartment of Agriculture
Agricultural Research Service,that is, the USDA ARS, and she's
associated with the NationalArboretum.
Let's give this interview alisten.

(00:56):
Good morning, Dr Alexander.
Thank you for joining us.

Lisa Alexander (01:02):
Good morning.
Thank you for having me.

Samson Humphrey (01:05):
For our audience.
Could you please introduceyourself?

Lisa Alexander (01:07):
My name is Dr Lisa Alexander.
I'm a research geneticist andplant breeder with the US
National Arboretum and I breedwoody ornamental landscape
plants to support the nurseryindustry.

Curt Rom (01:20):
So you know I really love the National Arboretum.
It has a a wonderful historyand it's great.
But tell us how you became ahorticulture plant science?
There has to be a story behindthe science.

Lisa Alexander (01:34):
Well, there is.
I like to say.
One of the best parts abouthorticulture is horticulture
people, because they all have astory of how they got here, and
mine is that I have always beeninterested in the outdoors,
hiking, camping, learning aboutecosystems.
After high school I thought Iwanted to work on policy and

(01:55):
planning as it related to landuse.
Well, as part of my college'shonor program, I went to
University of Tennessee atChattanooga.
One summer.
I had to choose a professor foran independent research project
.
So you know, the bat guy was alittle weird and the fish guy I
just don't like.
Getting wet and trappingmammals was a no for me.

(02:18):
So I met a professor named DrHill Craddock who was
pollinating wild chestnut treesto make disease resistant
hybrids, and so that all seemedclean and neat and interesting
and I got to go outside.
So I went out with them.
And the very first day that Iwas out with the group, we show

(02:40):
up to this tree and there's likethis huge 70 foot bucket truck
standing there and everybodykind of standing around looking
at each other like who's goingup, and then they all sort of
looked at me.
So I went up.
Hopefully I was clipped in, butI had this apron with jars of
pollen and little brushes and alittle notebook and pen.

(03:01):
And the first time I cut backleaves to reveal the chestnut
tree flower and I pollinated itand replaced the bag up in the
canopy overlooking the tree line.
I was hooked.
I was hooked on plant breeding,on genetics, on chestnut trees,
and never looked back.
And I do want to take a secondto mention the role that ASHS

(03:25):
played in my journey to being ahorticultural scientist.
My advisor, dr Craddock, took agroup of us to a regional ASHS
meeting one year.
I was an undergrad, it was myfirst meeting and I remember all
the professors, all theimportant people sitting at a
round table talking about sometopic and Dr Craddock looked at

(03:46):
me, pulled out a chair and saidsit down and tell us what you
think.
So he didn't just give me mystart in research, he literally
gave me a seat at the table toempower me in my journey as a
scientist.
And ASHS provided the forum forthat to happen.

Curt Rom (04:04):
Dr Alexander, that's a great story, you know.
It just shows the power of thatrelationship between a faculty
member and a student and theimportance of finding that
mentor and being encouraged likethat.
So what were your next steps ingoing to graduate school and
finding your path towards yourcurrent position?

Lisa Alexander (04:26):
Absolutely Well.
I went to graduate school witha very focused goal in mind,
which was to be the head of theAmerican Chestnut Foundation
Breeding Project.
Right, no small goals here.
And even though you know,throughout my studies over my
four years at Purdue University,in their forestry department, I

(04:47):
had a great time, I was at theHardwood Tree Improvement and
Regeneration Center.
So I got to learn a lot aboutgrowing trees, a lot about sort
of the market and the industryand all these other facets.
I did a breeding project and amolecular genetics project, but
I learned so many more facetsoutside of breeding that sort of

(05:10):
changed the direction that Iwas looking at.
I was so interested in thegenetics.
It was really the time of thesequence explosion.
All of the new sequencingtechnologies had come out, the
pyrosequencing and all the youknow quicker genotyping, and so
that felt like such a revolutionto be a part of that I kind of

(05:32):
switched direction and went to amore classic molecular genetics
route which ended up a postdocat University of Tennessee,
breeding switchgrass there.
So I went from trees to grassand then, like every good
postdoc, I spent a lot of timesearching for a job and when

(05:54):
this job, I saw this job at theNational Arboretum and it just
fit everything.
It was woody species and treesbreeding molecular genetics.
At the time I thought, well,did I make a mistake studying
trees when I'm over herebreeding grass?
But it turned out everything Ihad learned in all the different
positions really fit togetherwell for this National Arboretum

(06:16):
breeding and genetics position.
So they were initially afraidthat species like hydrangeas or
dogwood was going to take toomuch time.
And I told him that I came fromforest trees.
So to me I'm you know, I'mworking very quickly through
these breeding cycles and Ireally enjoy it.

Curt Rom (06:35):
Well, that also shows a really strong importance of
kind of being broadly trainedand working with a number of
crops and you know you were justat the right place at the right
time.
Now you know, when you were ingraduate school and in your
postdoc, I mean it really wasthe molecular revolution in how
we can apply those tools and usethose tools.

(06:55):
So it had to be exciting and Ican see, you know, going from
trees to grass and now you'reback with woody species.
I think that probably addedkind of a rainbow of textures,
of things that you could learnand bring to your current
position for the USDA.
So how did you focus in onhydrangeas?

(07:17):
I just love hydrangeas.
My oak leaf hydrangeas are justprobably seven to 10 days away
from blooming in my yard.
So how did you get tohydrangeas?

Lisa Alexander (07:26):
Well, I got to hydrangeas because I got a lot
of advice from.
I sought out advice from otherscientists, from industry folks,
and they a lot of people gaveme a good piece of advice, which
is you need to work on a crop,at least one crop, that has some
high impact in the industry.

(07:49):
You know, you can't necessarilymake your whole career with you
know sort of rare Mahoniahybrids not that those aren't
great, and I'm only saying thatbecause I'm making them.
I'm not, I'm not deridinganybody but myself here.
And so roses, hydrangeas,dogwoods, those are some really

(08:12):
top impactful plants.
And then I just kind of took asurvey of what work was going on
and where gaps were.
And big leaf hydrangea, that's ahydrangea that we think about a
lot with the pink and the bluemophead and fluorescences.
There is a lot of work beingdone in that sphere.
But there are so many otherspecies of hydrangeas that in my

(08:35):
opinion, didn't have a lot ofthe genomic resources or
cultivar development enablingtechnologies that other you know
species had, and so I thoughtthere was a real opportunity to
leverage, you know, the marketsort of value and impact of big

(08:58):
leaf hydrangea but then sort ofalso bring in these other
species as well, and breedingcompanies are very excited for
Hydrangea paniculata, hydrangeaarborescens, hydrangea
quercifolia, which is OakleafHydrangea.
So that's one of the reasons Iwas there and then, when I
started working with it, I lovedthe plant.
So that also helps when youhave a passion for the plant,

(09:22):
especially Oakleaf Hydrangea.
I just think it's a greatornamental landscape plant
that's underutilized and itreally pushes me and gives me a
lot of joy to work with thatplant and to improve it.

Curt Rom (09:38):
Before we get deeper into the science.
But since you're working onhydrangea and you said it was
important to work on somethingimportant, isn't hydrangea like
one of the most important pottednursery plants in the industry,
so it has incredible economicvalue?
Is that right?

Lisa Alexander (09:58):
It does.
2019 Census of Horticulturerated it at $155 million impact
for just big leaf hydrangea,which makes it the second
best-selling woody shrub behindrose.
So roses, hydrangeas, those areabsolutely the top two.

(10:20):
And hydrangeas here we see thema lot as a landscape plant, but
worldwide they are very popularfor container plants, for
florist production at cutflowers.
So really, hydrangea has a rolein all of the aspects of the
green industry, from landscapeto floriculture to container

Curt Rom (10:43):
so you work for the National Arboretum.

Lisa Alexander (10:46):
Yes.

Curt Rom (10:46):
But you're not located at the National Arboretum I am
not.
Tell us again where you'relocated.
I just think it's spectacularthat the USDA has, you know,
stations that are dispersed andcan work in locations that are
valuable for the work to be done.

Lisa Alexander (11:02):
So tell us where you're at in locations that are
valuable for the work to bedone.
So tell us where you're at.
Absolutely, I'm located inMcMinnville, tennessee, which is
one of the centers of nurseryproduction in the United States.
I am co -located at a TennesseeState University facility.
It's called the Otis L FloydNursery Research Center and it's
really unique in that everyscientist here studies some

(11:23):
aspect of woody crops or nurseryproduction from entomology,
chemical, ecology, sustainableproduction, you know, weed
control substrates it's all herein one spot just for the
nursery industry,that were really big champions
of having a research facilityhere.

(11:45):
I mean they saw other types ofcrops, you know, getting lobby,
getting support, that kind ofthing and they, you know, said
we would like USDA support forour crop, for our production
system, and so this facility wasestablished with USDA and
Tennessee State University andthere have been USDA scientists

(12:07):
here from the very start.
And our research unit, which isthe Floral and Nursery Plants
Research Unit, is located inBeltsville, Maryland, and we
have many other scientists thatwork on, many other scientists

(12:29):
that work on breeding anddiseases and turf grass and all
sorts of interesting specialtycrop issues.
But myself and the otherscientists here are really
focused on breeding andproduction to support the woody
ornamental industry and beingable to walk out of my door and
walk into five or six or 10 or20 different nurseries has
really been really an amazingexperience and helps us be

(12:50):
successful and make sure thatour deliverables are really what
the stakeholders are lookingfor.

Curt Rom (12:58):
And I also think it's wonderful that you're co-located
with a public university.
One of the things that I'vereally enjoyed in my career is
the ability to work with USDAscientists that have a different
perspective.
They have more of a nationalperspective and an industry-wide
perspective and do morefundamental things that maybe I

(13:19):
can do.
But I can leverage thosepartnerships to address local
questions.
That partnership between theUSDA and state agencies and
public universities I just thinkit's spectacular.
So Tennessee State's lucky tohave you right there.

Lisa Alexander (13:36):
Well, we're lucky to have that partnership
as well, and TennesseeDepartment of Ag is here in our
facility, and so we really aretrying to serve the industry in
a real and tangible way.

(14:38):
Okay, so, Lisa, you're a memberof the American Society of
Horticulture Science, as we saythe ASHS.
Why did you join and whatbenefits do you see out of it?
Well, I joined initially because, as I
mentioned, my professor as anundergraduate took us there and
it really made me feel like Ihad a seat at the table and my

(15:02):
voice and my ideas wereimportant and that was a really
big deal as an undergraduate andI've always thought that the
atmosphere of the conferencesthey're big but not too big.
There's a lot going on but nottoo much.
I just always felt like it wasa really good place for me to
grow and thrive as a scientist areally good place for me to

(15:25):
grow and thrive as a scientist.
Also, the professional interestgroups ornamental plant
breeding, nursery crops, federalpartners they have been ways
for me to get to know colleagues.
You know we put togetherproposals and meeting tours and
you know you get to know peoplethat you wouldn't necessarily
maybe write grants orcollaborate with.
You get to know people that youwouldn't necessarily maybe
write grants or collaborate with.

(15:46):
It has broadened my network ofpeople that I have, like we were
working on a big grantspecialty crops grant and some
of the people that I thought weneed people to understand water
and water use.
On this, well, I knew who totalk to because ASHS and they
have a whole interest groupthere and also I like it because

(16:08):
I go to the conferences and Icome back with some new idea.
I think I took a picture of aposter last year that I thought
I'm going to change the way I doit, like this is better, this
is better than what I'm doing,and take that home and implement
it.
So I just think there's a wholeworld of reasons to join and
the more you put into it, themore you get out of it.

Curt Rom (16:29):
Yeah, I agree, it's good science and good people.
You know, the networks that webuild are really wonderful for
that.

Samson Humphrey (16:37):
Fantastic.
Yeah, your passion really comesout here in this conversation,
and I want to plug this becauseI enjoyed it so much.
You recently won the OrnamentalPublication Award for your
publication titled Precipitation, Temperature and Population
Structure Influence GeneticDiversity of Oak Leaf Hydrangea

(16:59):
Throughout Its Native Range.
So congratulations on that.
I don't think anyone was moredeserving, but I'm curious.
What does it look like toactually be there and to be in
your position?
What are you looking at everyday?
What are you seeing?

Lisa Alexander (17:15):
I look out my window and I see my fields and
one of the reasons I reallyenjoy where I work at this, the
Otis L Floyd Nursery ResearchCenter is that we are here among
our plants.
So one of the biggest things Isee right now is our range wide
collection of oakleaf hydrangea.
So we, as I mentioned, it's agreat plant.

(17:39):
I love the plant.
It is native to a six-stateregion in the southeast, so
right where we're located here,but it really has ornamental
merit nationwide.
So I'm looking at some.
Right now we have a range-widetest where we collected from the
Florida panhandle all the wayto the north end of the range,
so I can see the variability outmy window in both leaf out and

(18:02):
flowering.
What initiated that collectionis that we've bred oakleaf
hydrangea, we've developedresearch populations for it and
we've made some nice plantreleases.
But we noticed that theoffspring, when we are breeding
oakleaf hydrangea, they don'thave a huge range of genetic

(18:24):
variability.
That is, we didn't see thelarge ranges and traits like
size or form or flower structureor color that really define
other species of hydrangea andsort of lead to these novel
forms that make them sointeresting.
And really we hypothesized thatthat lack of genetic

(18:44):
variability was due to a lowlevel of variability in the
parents, meaning that all theoakleaf hydrangeas on the market
were just genetically verysimilar.
And as plant breeders, we'realways looking for ways to
increase the genetic variationon which our selection can act,
and that is through wildcollections.
Mutation breeding crosses allthe things that generate
variation and at the same timewe noticed that the number of

(19:07):
oakleaf hydrangea accessions inthe national germplasm system
was quite low, like in the teens, and this is a native plant.
So we worked with colleagues atthe University of Minnesota,
stan Hokanson and Andy Sherwood,to collect oakleaf hydrangea
throughout the native range,really trying to capture as much
genetic variability as possible.

(19:28):
So the paper that won the awardthe first author on that paper
was Andy Sherwood, who was agrad student at University of
Minnesota, so I want to givethem their proper credit for all
their hard work in this project.
So as part of Andy's work, helooked at thousands of genetic
markers in these populations andfound some very cool stuff.

(19:50):
Well, first I should say wefound that oakleaf hydrangea has
disappeared from a substantialnumber of previously recorded
locations.
So it was a real eye-opener,both for us as scientists and
also as conservationists, toreally take a look at how that
range has changed withurbanization and land use
changes over the years.

(20:10):
Among the remaining populations,we found six genetically
distinct groups.
Among the remaining populations,we found six genetically
distinct groups and a couple ofthe groups in the Florida
panhandle and one in Mississippihad really unique alleles,
meaning that they contain rarecopies of genes, and we also

(20:39):
found some populations withgenes that might help them
survive drought or grow betterin cold climates.
So one of the awesome thingsabout new plant breeding
technologies is that we can nowcombine that traditional data we
take on form and flower shape,color, all those visual metrics
with huge amounts of geneticdata.
We can combine that withimaging data and really get to
the answer to the question whatgenes are causing these

(21:01):
ornamental traits of interestand what genes are conferring
ecosystem services like droughtresistance or cold tolerance.
So it's an exciting time.
I look out on this plantpopulation and I see a lot of
work from past scientists, but Ialso see a lot of future um
technologies there that arereally going to answer some

(21:23):
interesting genetic questions,not only about Oakleaf
hydrangeas but about but aboutall plants.
Um and plant breeding is anumbers game, as we all know,
and it's really about the numberyou you kill and not the number
you keep.

Curt Rom (21:38):
I want to go back to your story about your
collaborations with theUniversity of Minnesota.
What is the native range of thespecies of hydrangea?
And in that work and in thispaper, what are some of the
unique characteristics or uniqueecotypes that you found, that
you think you might be able tobring into understanding the

(22:01):
background, the geneticbackground for those, and might
introduce some of thosecharacteristics to commercial
plants?

Lisa Alexander (22:07):
Sure, well, the native range extends from
northern Florida, louisiana, upthrough the southern part of
Tennessee, florida, louisiana,up through the southern part of
Tennessee.
It's a six-state region.
It's not huge, but there is ademand for the plants all over.
And so in Minnesota they'revery interested, as you know, in

(22:29):
cold hardiness, and so theyreally wanted to look at these
populations and say are theredifferences?
In midwinter, you know, coldesttemperature they can accept and
all these traits that have todo with cold tolerance.
And there were big differencesamong them for how they survived

(22:53):
in Minnesota and there are bigdifferences among them for how
they grow here.
Some of the differences aretheir size and form.
Many of them, from the Southernpopulations, have a low to the
ground, I would almost saytrailing, form.
There are some with very fastdigit or upright forms.

(23:14):
And with the genetic work welooked at thousands and
thousands of single nucleotidepolymorphisms and found that
some of these traits seem to berelated to the genes.
So, for example, some of theones in compact, small plants,
you know, tend to have clustersof genes in places that the

(23:34):
other plants don't.
And then we have some plantswhere they're from very dry
areas, climatically, a dry range, and they seem to have some
alleles that might causeadaptation to that drier weather
and we're currently testingthose to see, you know, do they
actually confer some kind ofdrought resistance in a

(23:57):
production setting, in alandscape setting?
So those are the kind of traitsthat we would like to bring in,
both novel forms and ecosystemservices, and then ultimately be
able to say here are the genesthat really influence these
traits, and then be able to haveplants with those traits but

(24:17):
also have those technologies togive to other scientists or
breeding companies and say herehere's a suite of you know 20,
25 genes, you know genotype forthese, and you'll have improved
drought resistance, less leafspot, whatever the trait is that
we're looking at.

Curt Rom (24:34):
Wonderful Thanks for explaining all that.
Yeah, there are.
You know, the diversity outthere in the wild and in nature
is really amazing.
And so you've got all thosephenotypes and you've obviously
done all of this molecular workso you understand the genotypes.
And that kind of brings me toanother subject I want to ask
you about.
So genomics.
You built up a huge databasejust on this one plant and you

(24:59):
know genomic information isbecoming very important kind of
across the board to so manycrops in so many plants and it
really helps launch us inresearch.
So the Journal of the AmericanSociety of Horticulture Science
is starting a new effort inpublishing genomic libraries and
genomic data.

(25:20):
You're kind of involved in that.
You were one of the people thathelped stimulate that idea.
Tell us what's going to go onwith that.

Lisa Alexander (25:28):
Sure, absolutely .
Like you said, genomics hascome such a long way in recent
years, come such a long way inrecent years and a lot of the
technology that was previouslyonly available for big ag is now
within the reach of specialtycrops.
And the expectation forpublishing crop genomes often

(25:49):
includes other really largecomponents like mapping
transcriptomics, like mappingtranscriptomics, multiple year
evaluations, and those are greatand excellent pieces of work.
But specialty crops sometimesdon't have the large funding

(26:11):
bases behind them for very large, complex, you know,
multi-institution projects.
But there are still scientistsand still breeders that are
working with those crops andwith those genomes for important
purposes.
Hort Genomes is really our wayof letting folks know that there
is now a home for publishingannotated genomes of specialty

(26:32):
crop species.
Of course we know they werealways welcome in our journal,
but I think Hort Genomes is justgoing to be a way to publicly
say this is the home forannotated specialty crop genomes
.
We envision this as a hub forapplied specialty crop genomics
where the genomes are the centerand it reaches out into marker

(26:55):
development, into pan genomes.
You know, in the large scaletranscript stomach studies and
maybe you're a pathologist andyou want to use raw RNA seed
reads, to look for viruses, ormaybe you study flowering and
you want to compare floweringtime genes across horticultural
crops.
The possibilities for how touse annotated genomes are

(27:16):
endless, and so having a placeto have them, to put them out
there for other scientists,breeders, folks to know hey,
these genomes exist, here's thisgreat data and here's where it
lives I think is really going tobe a great resource for our
community, and JASHS evenupdated the scope and aims to

(27:37):
reflect this emphasis on omicsand other technologies, just to
really underscore that this isthe home for horticultural crop
genomes.

Curt Rom (27:49):
So who do you envision would be submitting these kind
of databases and information?
Horticulturists, but you alsokind of mentioned plant
pathologists.
What do you envision?

Lisa Alexander (28:01):
Absolutely.
I envision any scientist thatis working on genomics,
transcriptomics, proteomics aspart of a project to be able to
publish in this, and that mightinclude, you know, folks working
at breeding companies.
Often have, you know, I seethose a lot.

(28:23):
We get posters, we getpresentations at our society
meetings, but often not going todo another big component to
their work.
If they have gotten, forexample, you know, enough reads
together to develop markers, itmight stop very soon after that,
and so I think this would be agood place for those folks to be

(28:45):
able to posit hey, we, you know, we've got a genome for this
crop and here it is.
It could be scientists that arepublishing completed works, or

(29:08):
they could just be publishingdata for use for other
scientists and directly applytechnology for breeding
companies.
So you might have a genome andyou annotated it and you say
these you know are in a databaseand they're ready, and somebody
like me, I'm always looking for, you know, powdery mildew
resistance genes, MLO genes.
If there's a new genome out,boy, I'm mining those things,
and so I just see it as a goodapplied resource.

(29:28):
And you don't know who's goingto use it.
Could be a pathologist, couldbe a breeder could be somebody,
a taxonomist.
That's reorganizing.
You know, the evolution of theEricales might want to use this
work, but if it's not out there,nobody knows it exists, then
it's not useful to anybody.

Curt Rom (29:46):
Yeah, I see it as being really novel and what a
service to science and to thosepeople that are interested in
breeding, because now, insteadof having to look at a whole
range of different sources whereyou might find the genomic
information, we've now got itconsolidated and really
aggregated in one location forspecialty crops.
That's really remarkable andthat'll be so helpful to help

(30:10):
science move forward andactually to help our industries
move forward.

Lisa Alexander (30:14):
Absolutely.
I look forward to it.
And you know, the more we showhow applied genomes are useful,
you know, the more sort ofimpetus and momentum we get
behind developing more of them,and then this really does become
a hub and a community forespecially crop genomics.

Samson Humphrey (30:31):
So, dr Alexander, why is it important
for researchers to publishgenomes?

Lisa Alexander (30:36):
on a more philosophical level, Genomes are
important because essentiallythey're the upstream blueprint
for everything else that happensin the plant.
So whether you're studyingmolecular biology or physiology
or cell division or really anybasic or applied aspect of plant

(30:57):
science, I mean the genome issort of the most upstream we'll
call it enabling technology thata species can have.
You know, I know that somepeople might think well, you
know, I don't have a lab.
I do applied work, even knowinghow are these species related.
You know how are you going togroups?

(31:20):
You know this is our corecollection.
You know these are susceptiblecultivars or these are tolerant
cultivars for, you know, adisease.

(31:40):
So the genetics of the plants,as represented by the actual
genomic data, is useful foralmost any downstream
application.
Useful for almost anydownstream application.

(32:01):
And now that I've genomes andthe use of genomes is not simply
with computational biologistsanymore, you can use them
through graphical userinterfaces and many different
kinds of software.
I think that it is a good ideathat other scientists always
keep in mind you know thatthere's this genome available
and that there's ways that theknowledge from the genomes will

(32:26):
impact their work.
And just like we are alwayskeeping in mind, you know, when
I'm selecting a plant.
I'm keeping in mind the otheraspects of horticulture, you
know, will this plant propagate?
Can a grower grow it?
It can't just be, you know thegreat plant.
So, as other scientists intheir distinct fields are

(32:47):
focusing on mainly on their ownproblem, always the genetics of
the plants and the speciesthey're dealing with are a
thought in their mind, and howthat research is structured so
they really enable you knowresearch for everybody.

Curt Rom (33:03):
Yeah, you know, I think genomics is real science.
I know sometimes some of usthat are laboratory and field
scientists we think that scienceis always experimentally based.
You know, I'm going to create ahypothesis, go test the
hypothesis, do an experiment andI publish the results of the
experiment.
Or I made a new innovation or anew technology or I discovered

(33:23):
something new.
But genomics is a realimportant discipline of our
science and so I'm glad thatwe're making a home for it in
the American Society ofHorticulture Science to
recognize that body of work,because probably going forward,
it's going to become more andmore fundamentally important to
understand how the rest of usare doing.

(33:44):
The science can interpret thatscience if we understand the
genome.
So I'm glad we finally have aplace for it.

Samson Humphrey (33:52):
Me too, absolutely, and thank you for
elaborating on that, drAlexander, because we have many
students that listen to thispodcast, young people who may be
in very different fieldsrelated to horticulture, that
they may have never looked atgenome data before and maybe
never have been interested in itor realized that it could be

(34:13):
valuable for them, and so thankyou so much for coming on and
helping expand people's horizonsWell it was my pleasure and
thank you for putting togetherthis podcast and getting plants,
people and science out into theworld.

(34:33):
Wow, that was so much fun.
I love talking to scientistsand learning from scientists who
do types of science that I havenever done myself.
This genetics related and andornamentals as well is so it
still feels so foreign to me.
It still feels so new to me.
It still feels so new to me,even though I'm a plant

(34:54):
scientist.
It was just so exciting to hearher thoughts and opinions and
about her current work.
What do you think, Kurt?

Curt Rom (35:03):
Well, you know, besides being a professional
horticulturist, I'm an avidgardener, so gardening is my
major hobby.
And as we were interviewing herand as we were preparing for
this, I was sitting on my ownpatio looking at my gardens and
I have a number of hydrangea.
I have several oak leafhydrangea but several other

(35:25):
species of hydrangea and it mademe pause and think.
Now I think of those as agarden plant and they look great
in my garden.
But behind every one of thoseplants there's a lot of science.
So in this particular case,this group of scientists look at
the ecological range and thediversity of these plants to

(35:48):
understand them and those plantsin my garden.
Somebody had to understand those.
Somebody had to make aselection on those varieties or
improve those varieties throughbreeding technique.
Then they had to figure out howto propagate it and how to grow
it and how to ship it andmarket it.
You know, the part I do, thegardening part, might be kind of

(36:13):
the simplest and it's the laststep in the display of that
plant.
But I really enjoyed hearingabout the work that Dr Alexander
does and I have to tell you I'mvery excited about this new
effort of the SHS on HortGenomes, the Hort Genomes
Project.
I think this is going to be agreat place for scientists to

(36:36):
put this information and to haveit published and have it
accessible through our opensource journals so that other
scientists can pull thatinformation and review it.
So it was really exciting to meon kind of the gardening level
and it was exciting to me on thescientific level.

Samson Humphrey (36:56):
Absolutely, and how she talked about, there
hasn't been a place for HortGenomes to be published like
this, and that this is just awonderful step forward for just
another way that the AmericanSociety for Horticultural
Science supports scientists andsupports the dissemination of

(37:19):
all of this amazing work thatall sorts of people are doing.
So so exciting, wonderful timeto be a part of the organization
For our listeners.
If you want to read more aboutthis topic, please check out Dr
Alexander's paper titledPrecipitation, temperature and
Population Structure InfluenceGenetic Diversity of Oakleaf
Hydrangea Throughout Its NativeRange, which is published in the

(37:42):
Journal of the American Societyfor Horticultural Science, also
called JASHS.
You can also find informationto publish your hort genomes on
ASHSorg.
On the about page for theJournal of the American Society
for Horticultural Science, linksto Dr Alexander's work and to
more information about hortgenomes will be in the show

(38:04):
notes.

Curt Rom (38:05):
If this interview resonates with you, I recommend
you renew your membership.
Or maybe you want to considerjoining the American Society for
Horticultural Science, and thenyou can join our interest
groups such as the OrnamentalPlant Breeding Group, the
Ornamental Turf and LandscapePlant Group, nursery Crops Group

(38:26):
, plant Genetics and GermplasmGroup or the Plant Biotechnology
Interest Group.
And also I encourage you totake a look at the various
sections of our open sourcejournals where you can find
information on now horticulturecrop, specialty crop genomes,
horticulture research,physiology, technology, breeding

(38:48):
, genetics, as well as teaching.
If you'd like more informationon the American Society for
Horticulture Science, Iencourage you to go to our
website, ashsorg.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
The ASHS podcast Plants, peopleand Science is made possible by

(39:09):
member dues and volunteerism.
Please go to ashsorg to learnmore.
If you're not already a memberof the ASHS, we invite you to
join.
Ashs is a not-for-profit andyour donations are
tax-deductible.

Samson Humphrey (39:27):
This episode was hosted by Samson Humphrey
and Kurt Rohn.
Special thanks to our audioengineer, andrew Sheldorf, our
research specialists Lena Wilsonand Andrew Sheldorf, our ASHS
support team, sarah Powell andSally Murphy, and our musician,
john Clark.
Thanks for listening.
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