May 20, 2025 • 46 mins
Former professional football player Quinn Magnuson shares his journey from playing through multiple injuries to founding the Effort Over Results movement and coaching high performers. We explore how accountability to teammates drives athletes to push beyond their limits and why the mindset of focusing on effort rather than outcomes creates more resilient, confident individuals.
• Accountability to teammates and commitment to the team drives athletes to play through pain and injury
• Most humans don't realize how powerful the accountability of their immediate circle and environment is
• The true separator between good and great is doing the work when nobody is looking
• Today's culture overly emphasizes showcasing results on social media rather than celebrating the process
• When we praise children for talent rather than effort, we create "talented wimps" who crumble under adversity
• The "Paint Layer Theory" demonstrates how small daily efforts compound into significant growth over time
• Studies show children praised for effort choose more challenging tasks than those praised for intelligence
• Focusing on effort over results creates resilience when facing inevitable setbacks and failures
• Living with an identity rooted in performance creates fragility; focusing on inputs builds sustainable growth
• Parents and coaches should praise the process and effort rather than outcomes to develop mentally tough individuals
Check out Quinn's podcast "Effort Over Results" on all platforms, visit effortoverresults.com, or follow @effortoverresults on Instagram to learn more about his upcoming book and movement.
Follow Playing Injured on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/playinginjured/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right, welcome to another episode of Playing
Injured.
We have an exciting episode.
We have Mr Quinn Magnuson, whois a former professional
football player, turned highperformance coach to CEOs,
athletes, entrepreneurs.
He's the founder of the EffortOver Results movement and he
(00:21):
also has a podcast called EffortOver Results.
Mr Quinn, how are we feelingtoday?
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yes, sir.
Thank you, Josh, I appreciateit.
Just like I was telling you,when I saw the title of your
podcast, I had to be on it.
We got to talk about playinginjured and really just learning
from all those lessons.
So let's go.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, 100%.
And before we hit record, youare already letting me know
you've had over 11 surgeriesplaying football and going out
there and pushing your body tothe limit.
And I think when I firststarted this show, I wanted
folks to understand what was themindset behind going out there,
giving it your all, not being100%, sometimes making stupid
(01:04):
choices, right, what do youthink that was?
What was that mindset, when youlook back, that made you
continue to just go out thereand push it?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Yeah, you know, I think it's 5% stupidity.
I think a lot of it, though, isit's accountability to your
teammates, to the people aroundyou, and, and just knowing that
people are counting on you andand you're really counting on
yourself, and and so you pushyourself.
You know, even from the earlydays of playing sports as a kid,
(01:39):
you, you learn to play a littlebanged up and you eventually
build that body resiliency, butalso the pain tolerance it
builds up, and I think it'simportant for people to really
to push themselves, whether itbe in the gym.
I mean, I certainly don'texpect people to have so many
injuries as I've had, but Idon't think humans really
understand how, how resilientthe body is, um, and that
(02:03):
pushing the body to see what itcan do, it's, you know David
Goggin said.
I mean, we have no clue whatthe body can do with the mind
will stop first, right and uh.
So for me, you know being beingaccountable to my teammates,
accountable to myself,accountable, you know, when
you're younger, to your parentswho invested in you to be in
those sports.
Um, I think it's just importantto show people that you, you
(02:26):
are always going to be the kindof person they can count on and
and you know, in some cases,josh it you know, when you get
into college and into the prosyou really can't afford to be
hurt.
So you play hurt and injuredbecause you're the best
available option for thatposition for the team at that
time.
And then I found, actually whenI got into the pros I had one
of my teammates say to me youdon't make the club in the tub
(02:47):
right, and so you learn to playhurt there too.
So it's like I said, it's alittle bit of ignorance, trying
to ignore what really you shouldbe doing.
And I think in today's sportslike my son's a college football
player too they treat them alot better now and they handle
their injuries a lot differently.
But you know, back in the backin the 1900s, when I played it
(03:12):
was it was a little different.
So you had to push yourselfconcussions, you know, strained
ligaments, hamstring pulls,whatever.
You just did it because peopleare counting on you.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
Yeah, you know you say something that's that's.
I think that's the answer.
Right Is accountability andthat's I think that's the answer
there.
Right, it's accountability.
And I mean I remember breakingmy thumb and rushing to get back
, matter of fact, trying to getback out there, the game that I
broke it, trying to get back outthere and it was because of the
(03:40):
people around me.
It was the accountability ofthe group.
It was the accountability ofthe group and as humans, we
don't realize how powerful theaccountability of our immediate
circle in our environment is.
Right, and that's why it's sopowerful to be around amazing
people.
You know, I was out in MexicoCity for two weeks and I joined
(04:01):
a run club.
I just wanted to get out there,I wanted to meet people and, um
, I didn't know it was a seriousrun club.
I didn't know we were gonna runsix miles.
I thought it was gonna be alight jog, one or two miles.
I'm not the biggest runner and Ifound myself halfway through
this run like my mind wastelling me like, hey, I cannot
(04:21):
go any further, no way, I cankeep going, no way.
But I was around people who Ibarely knew and they were
amazing runners and I didn'twant to let them down.
I didn't want to let them downRight, and so I pushed my body,
my body pushed it and I made itthrough.
(04:42):
And it was just a beautifulexample of if I was here alone.
If I was doing this alone, thenI wouldn't have gone as far as
I did.
It's the African proverb rightIf you want to go fast, go alone
, but if you want to go far, gotogether.
And I think just theaccountability of a group will
(05:03):
take you so far, farther thanyou can even imagine, and you'll
even push yourself throughthings that you probably
wouldn't have if you were goingalone.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
And I think you know, I think there's two sides to
that story.
I think being pushed by othersand being accountable to others
is really important, and then Ithink there's also the can you
do the work when nobody'slooking right?
And we know that as athletes,you got you got to do the work
when no one's looking, and andthat's something that that is a
bit disappointing in in today'syoung athlete it feels like
(05:37):
every workout they do is onInstagram, you know, and when
they're getting recruited, it'son Twitter.
They're telling people how muchthey worked out that week, but
unfortunately, it's part of thegame.
But I think there's importanceto feeling accountable to those
around you, but then also beingaccountable to yourself too, in
those times when you're alone.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Yeah, I think that's the separator, right, that's the
separator.
It's so crazy that we are superaccountable to other people,
right?
I mean, that's how human beingsare wired um.
But how can we be accountableto ourselves?
How can we really have thatloyalty to ourselves and not let
ourselves down?
(06:17):
And it's so easy to just hitthe alarm clock, right, nobody's
watching.
I'm just letting myself down,right.
How crazy is that?
I'm just letting myself down,right.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Uh you know, and that's the number one person you
should be accountable to, right?
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:31):
100, that's the crazy part right, 100 right.
And so when you say things outloud, I think that's something
that we can start to do is, hey,when I, when I'm not doing
something that I'm supposed tobe doing and I know I need to do
it certain habits, how can Isay, oh, I'm letting myself down
and, like, really think aboutthat.
We won't let you know astranger down.
(06:52):
I didn't let eight otherstrangers down in Mexico City,
but it's so easy for me to justhit my alarm clock and let
myself down.
It's so amazing of how humanbeings are wired.
But, like you mentioned, that'sthe separator right there.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
Well, and there's a chapter in my book that's going
to be coming out at Christmasthat talks about literally the
origins of effort over results,and it talks about going back
thousands of years.
When you're in a community andeveryone has to count on
everybody, you don't have achoice.
And if you aren't accountableto the group, if you aren't
(07:29):
going out and doing your it'salmost like watching survivor,
right, if you aren't going outand you aren't doing your share
of the hunting or or theforaging or the gathering or
whatever, they'll basically kickyou out, like they'll just get
rid of you because you'reuseless to the group and and so
that's where that accountabilityto others that it's.
It's, it's historical, likeit's in our genetics, to be
accountable to each other in agroup setting.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Yeah, and then also too right that mechanism of
caring what what other peoplethink of you, Right.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
And yeah, and it's, it's, it's that one's a tough
one though, Josh, don't you?
think like like we, we, we hearconflicting messages and I know
you're much younger than I am,but you know it used to be care
what other people think.
And then it feels to me like inthe last decade it's been like
don't care what anybody thinks,it's all about you, and I think
that's it's a bit of a mixedmessage, and I don't think we're
(08:16):
trying to say don't care aboutanybody else.
What we're saying is make sureyou hold up your end of the
bargain within the entirepicture, right?
So it's yeah, man, there's thatalone time where you got to be
accountable to you and only you.
And then there's other timeswhere people expect you to show
up and that goes for work, thatgoes to your teammates, that
goes to your co-workers andeverything.
(08:37):
So that's what it's about.
It's about the effort.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Yeah, 100%.
Speaking of effort, effort overresults, right, yeah, yeah,
when you talk about it, right,it's almost like, especially in
today's age, and I think thatTwitter generation started kind
of when I was in high school.
You know, you get an offer, youget a letter, you want to take
(09:00):
a picture of it.
You know it's amazing, it is anaccomplishment.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Hashtag AGTG All glory to God.
Yeah, my seventh offer, yeah,okay.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
No, 100%.
And you want to show resultsright, yeah, you want to show it
, you want to show what I'vedone, what I've accomplished.
But very few people actuallywant to show the effort, the
process right and that's thebest part right.
But I think a lot of folks kindof live in results over effort.
(09:37):
How can I get the fastestresult?
I think that's life in general.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Yeah, yeah, people, people, live, people and once
again, this, this, this too isis in our genetics as well.
It's about, it's aboutachievement, it's about, you
know, getting results.
And and even more so once againwith the advent of social media
it's all about look at me, lookat me, look at me.
But they show the result Right.
(10:03):
And then, even when people showthe work that they're putting
in, for the most part it'salmost virtue signaling, right,
and it's that work you do whenno one's looking.
That really is the stuff thatactually counts.
Unfortunately, we live in aworld where these, these young
athletes, you know, coming outof high school, have to almost
put on their Twitter that howmuch work they're doing and show
(10:25):
their workouts so the coachescan see you know, you know what
they're, what they're, whatthey're doing in terms of
getting better.
But I still believe that, youknow, results are important.
So I don't want people to getmixed up when, when I say effort
over results and they, they,they mistake that with, well,
not goal setting or not, youknow, achieving anything.
No, what I'm saying is that youneed to be proud of yourself
(10:46):
for the effort you put in thatled to the result.
And so when we praise people,um, and give the messaging
especially young kids about youknow, oh, you're so talented,
that's a result statement.
Oh, you're so athletic, that'sa result statement.
Right, because you're you'reshowing what that the kid is, is
, is at the end of something youwon.
So athletic, that's a resultstatement.
(11:06):
Right, because you're showingwhat that kid is at the end of
something you won the race.
You're so athletic, you're sotalented, you're so smart.
What you should be messaging tothem really is I really loved
how you worked this week.
I love the work you put intoyour workouts, into your running
, into the lifting, intostudying for a test, instead of
just, oh, you got an A, here's20 bucks for getting an A, and I
think that's where we need asparents and educators, teachers,
(11:30):
coaches, employers need toreally start changing the
narrative is focus on lettingthose people that you're leading
know that you're proud of theeffort they put in, and that's
what you're looking for.
Yeah, even if they didn't getthe result, because there's
going to be days where you putin a ton of effort.
(11:50):
There's months, like when I'min a sales position, where I put
in a ton of activity and andnever get a sale, yeah.
And my leader says to me hey,quinn, I know you did the work,
it's okay, it'll happen nextmonth.
Same thing thing with athletes,you know, students, whatever.
So keep praising that effortand the results happen.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Yeah, and I feel like what that creates is a culture
of identity rooted inperformance, right In results.
I'm worthy if, and only if, Iget this result right.
Speaker 2 (12:23):
Yeah, and there's days you don't get results.
Josh, right, I mean, you knowthis.
It's as an athlete, you can putin.
I mean, even as a team.
You put in all the work, youget through the season only to
lose a championship game andeverybody focuses on the fact
you lost a championship game.
And it's like look at all, lookat it, look at everything we
learned this year, looking howwe came together as a team, look
how everyone got individuallybetter and that.
(12:43):
That.
That speaks to the process, andI I hate to use the hashtag
trust the process, but it's trueand and and.
Then it speaks to how this teamis going to be even better next
year because of all the workthey put in.
Don't get me wrong winning achampionship is fantastic.
Losing a championship sucks, um, but you know, I had a coach
that once said to me you know,if you lose and it doesn't hurt,
(13:05):
that says a lot about you.
That means you didn't put a lotof work in during the season.
It should hurt.
Losing should absolutely be oneof the most painful things you
experience in life because youput the work in right, and so
that's why we need to keepmessaging that, and I mean it's
you know studies become moreinnovative, they take challenges
(13:28):
on better, they want to take onmore work, because you're not,
you're not basically basingtheir existence and their worth
on a, on a single result.
Yeah, and that's.
That's where I think themessaging has to change yeah,
and you're not going to succeedevery time.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
I was actually looking at, um, I was looking at
a post that you put onInstagram.
Right, it's about Frank Sinatra.
Yeah, I got it right here.
Frank Sinatra, right?
He released 1,200 songs, 209hits that's 17%.
Babe Ruth 8,399 attempts, 714home runs that's 8.5%.
(14:08):
Pablo Picasso over 150,000pieces of work 1,170 hits that's
0.7%.
90% of their outputs is notpopular, so you have to keep
going right, and so, more timesthan not, you're probably going
(14:30):
to fail or lose or miss, uh, orget no showed, right, um, and so
it makes sense to praise theeffort over the results.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
Because then?
Because then that that personthat you're praising for their
effort will know, because theyknow they can control that,
right, josh, yeah, I can controlmy.
They.
Always coaches say you cancontrol two things your effort,
your attitude.
I can control my effort.
So if you, if I, keep gettingpraised for effort result, if
(15:06):
you only pray for me for none ofthis mattered, yeah, and that's
not the message we need to besending kids.
But I love that post and I'lltell you why is because
everybody and once again I keepreminding people of of what
social media has done to us.
It makes the world look perfect, right.
It makes all of our vacationslook outstanding.
(15:26):
It makes the world look perfect, right, it makes all of our
vacations look outstanding.
And what we need to realize isthat, you know, like Picasso,
150,000 works of art and 0.8%only really sold and became
famous.
Everybody should be goingthrough that.
It's the same thing withpodcasting.
I was so afraid to start mypodcast because I wanted the
first one to be absolutelyperfect Perfect lighting,
(15:49):
perfect microphones, everything.
And finally, uh, somebody justsaid to me just record it, just
go ahead and record it.
Who cares if it sucks?
If you've ever watched some ofthe first podcasts from, like
you know, joe Rogan or ChrisWilliamson or Scott Galloway or
all the famous podcasters, theirfirst podcast are horrible.
They're terrible but they justkept doing it and only it's like
(16:11):
only like 10% of podcasts makeit past the fourth recording.
You know things like that.
So we're both doing great, man,but yeah, we got it.
We got to definitely keepmessaging to the people that we
love and that we care for andthat we're trying to teach and
coach and educate.
Um, you know's all about justputting, putting in the work
yeah, you know you got methinking you're talking about
(16:32):
things.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
You can control effort.
Um, I'm thinking about attitude.
Right, you can control ourattitude, and if you're so
focused on the results, it'shard to keep a great attitude
versus the input.
Right, if you focus on theinput and you can pat yourself
on the back every day, it'spretty remarkable the results
(16:54):
you can get while also having agreat attitude along with the
effort.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
You're going to be batting 1,000,.
Man, if you're putting in thework every day, that's all that
matters.
You're always batting 1,000.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
And you know, it reminds me it's a book the great
Bill Walsh we don't know BillWalsh, one of the best coaches,
if not the best coach ever in,you know, nfl football, and he
has a book called the ScoreTakes Care of Itself.
And I remember reading thisbook, maybe two, three years ago
(17:31):
, and that title really struckme because it was all about the
process of all the little, smalldetails and habits that needed
to be built in order for thescore to take care of itself and
the results, the case, takecare of itself.
(17:51):
And, um, I think this is thesame message here, and I'm even
thinking about habits, right, um, along with effort.
Right, we talk about attitude,we talk about effort.
I'm thinking about habits.
Right, you can control on adaily basis Habits.
How important is that?
(18:12):
Right, where to start to focuson inputs, the inputs that we
have, and the habits?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
right, I don't know if you've ever read Atomic
Habits by James Clear, butobviously you know people in our
space are at least aware of thebook.
Um, I, I read it and and it ithelped reinforce, and I
referenced atomic habits in mybook.
Um, because it it it just talksabout.
You know, if you want to, youknow I'll even use this example,
(18:42):
like when I finished playingfootball, I was well over 300
pounds, um, and I wanted to loseweight and so I set a goal of
getting down to two 70 and Ifocused too much on on the two
70 part and so I jumped on ascale and I'd gained two pounds
and I was like I was so dejectedand so forth.
But but, um, the habits, it'seven even for people who are
like, I know I should go to thegym because I know it'll make me
(19:03):
healthier and I'll feel better,but I just have a hard time
getting to the gym.
Or they make an excuse.
You know it's like, well, Idon't have time to go to the gym
.
It's like, well, no, you dohave time, you just haven't made
a priority and and it comesdown to to, uh, environment and
cues, and when it comes tohabits, developing habits.
It's, it's about theenvironment you're, you're,
(19:24):
you're in on a daily basis.
But then also the little cues.
And so I came up with this,saying it's like just put your
gym bag by the door and whatthat means.
And I'll tell you a little storyabout my daughter.
So my daughter was a collegeathlete.
Um COVID shut her, her careerdown completely.
She came home and she stoppedgoing to the gym, stopped
working out, like she didn't gofor three years.
And in 2024, she I was like youknow Ann, and in 2024, I was
(19:48):
like you know Annika.
I said you used to be like thishigh-performance athlete man
and you're not even going to thegym at all.
And she's like I'm scared to.
Now I don't want to.
I'm so out of shape.
I said, well, how about this?
How about once a week you and Ijust go to the gym and watch
people work out?
Like are you serious?
I go, yeah, they've got.
(20:10):
Like are you serious?
I go, yeah, they got massagechairs there.
I said we'll go, sit in themassage chairs and we'll watch.
We'll just watch, we'll be inthe environment.
She's like okay, can we grabcoffee on the way?
I'm like sure.
So for the first couple ofsundays we just we just grabbed
coffees and went and sat at theyou know the pro shop or sat in
the massage chairs and watchpeople work out.
And she'd be sitting there andshe'd be like, oh, that, that
guy's form is terrible.
And she'd be sitting there andshe'd be like, oh, that, that
guy's form is terrible.
And she'd be like I can liftmore than that person.
(20:32):
And it kind of got her juicedagain, right.
And then, and then I said okay,I said next Sunday, I said I
just want you to put your gymbag by the door.
You don't have to bring it, butat least have it by the door
when I come to pick you up.
And so for Sunday she didn't.
Second Sunday I see her walkout of her apartment with her
gym bag in her hand and I'm like, okay, all right.
And that's the thing thatpeople don't get is like you
(20:53):
don't need to go to the gym andachieve everything in day one or
even in month one.
It is layers, it is just layersof effort that lead to where
you want to go.
But the people focus so hard onthe end, the finish line, the
end result, the goal, thateverything becomes a failure
(21:14):
because they feel like they'reso far away from it.
Instead of focusing on what'sright in front of them, they
focus on what's down the road,and so that put the gym bag by
the door.
It's it that goes for anything.
If you want to write a book,okay, well, maybe learn
something.
Spend 20 minutes learning.
You want to write a book?
Okay, well, maybe learnsomething.
Spend 20 minutes learning abouthow to write a book or write a
few words down.
Or if you're trying to learnhow to, you know, I don't know,
(21:37):
but there's so many examples andthen just take the smallest
little micro step, butconsistently.
Do it daily or weekly, so youget into a bit of a habit of
doing that, and then, at somepoint in time, your mind and
your body go this is now, thisis the norm, yeah, and.
And it escalates and it getsbetter, and and the best way I
can describe it, josh I alwaysit's funny my daughter and I
(22:00):
spent a lot of time together andI tell her are you stacking
layers today?
And she and we, we have thatsaying because I said if you
take a piece of paper and youtake, you know, dip your
paintbrush in and you go on thepaper.
If you look at the paper likethis, you won't see the paint
Because it's gone into the paper, it's flat.
Next day, another layer.
(22:20):
You don't see it.
Next day, another.
Okay, maybe by day eight you'renow starting to see a little
buildup Right, and by day 20,now, all of a sudden, you got
some thickness there and by daya hundred man, that that thing
is weighing the middle of thatpaper down because it's so thick
.
This is how we need to treat ourlives.
Stop focusing on the end result.
It'll happen if you put theeffort in.
So focus on the effort.
(22:41):
I'm not saying goals aren'tgood.
I'm not saying don't goal setor don't don't have something
you want to achieve, but set itand forget it.
And then day one, not one day,day one.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Yeah, set the goal, to set the intentions of what
you want to do every day.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Yeah, like, whatever the output is okay, now what are
the inputs?
And then just focus on theinputs.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
Yeah, that's an amazing analogy.
I've never heard that before,actually.
Speaker 2 (23:10):
I heard.
I heard.
I won't.
I'm not going to say that Icame up with that.
It was.
I believe it was Alex Hermosi.
I don't know if you know AlexHermosi, but I love Alex and he
I think he came up with that andit just made so much sense to
me Like you're not going to seethe paint for a few days, maybe
a month, who knows right.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
Yeah, yeah, and the patience right.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
Patience and you're going to have setbacks.
They're going to be.
Maybe you went to the gym fivedays a week for a month and then
maybe you had a bad week whereyou only got there once.
And then people are like, well,I had a crappy week and I
didn't get to the gym and now Ifeel like everything's gone.
Start again.
It's okay.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
Start again, build more layers up, it's okay, yeah,
how do you handle thosesetbacks?
Right, we talk about resilience.
You know handling setbacks,handling the failures, because
it's the reality is, most of uswere taught that results are
important.
Right and honestly, you knowlosing and failing, um, you know
(24:11):
, you know losing thatchampionship uh, not getting
that job, uh, not doing well onthe interview.
You know all the results thatwe actually wanted.
How can we handle those losses,those failures?
Speaker 2 (24:28):
I, I still am working on that, josh, I still am
working on.
You know, when I have setbacks,not letting it get to me, it's
tough.
I have to.
I have to keep reminding myselfthat, that I learned something
from it, or what can I learnfrom that?
And and I think, but the reasonwhy people get the mindset of
(24:50):
of feeling, you know, it's anegative feeling or feeling
dejected when there's a setbackis because of of how they've
been raised and the environmentsthey've been raised.
Right, if it.
Let me give you an example here.
Let's imagine a three-year-oldchild who's putting a puzzle
together, a very simple child'spuzzle, and they're not getting
(25:11):
it.
So the parent says to themthat's okay, you'll get it next
time.
What you've just said to thechild is you failed, you're
going to have to try again nexttime to see if you can get the
end result again.
It's still not a positivemessage to send to the child.
I would actually say to thechild, I would.
I would actually say to thechild I saw you working really
(25:34):
hard on that.
What would you try differentlynext time?
Get them to think through theprocess right?
Same thing with a 10 year old,with a 20 year old guys, our age
, your age, right, it's, it'syour.
The reason why they're calledsetbacks is because you've
basically thought that there'seither it's either win or lose.
But really it's win or learn.
And I know that sounds supercliche and I even cringe
(25:57):
sometimes when I hear win orlearn, because sometimes I want
to wallow in the lose right andI want to feel that sadness.
But it's taken me I'm 54 nowand it's taken me till the age
of probably 49, 50 to reallyunderstand that every setback
and once again cliche, sorryabout this, but every setback,
and once again cliche, sorryabout this, but every setback
(26:18):
has a comeback and it gives youan opportunity to try again, to
defeat that thing and and to andto, but to learn from it.
You can't just say I lost or Ifailed at it and now I'm going
to try again, hoping to win orlose again, depending on what
the the result is.
You want to do it again becauseyou're going to work harder at
it, you're going to learn fromthe last time you you didn't
(26:40):
achieve it and you're going tochange the way you approach it.
And and this is why you know,when you see young athletes, um,
that are just, they're justgifted, right, they just they
show up in the hockey rink andthey show up at the baseball
diamond or or the football field.
And they show up at thebaseball diamond or or the
football field and they just runcircles around kids, right,
they're the best at eight yearsold, the best eight-year-old on
the field.
Yeah, those kids, eventuallythe other kids catch up to them,
(27:02):
because those kids were werealmost hand hand, given by god
the ability to just be betterthan everybody without having to
work for it.
Those aren't the kids I want onmy team, necessarily, because
those are the kids that whenthey do eventually face
adversity, where now they get tothe age of, say, 12 or 13,
other kids have caught up in ageand speed and size and now
(27:25):
they're not winning every raceand they don't know what to do.
Yeah, they have no resilience,they have no way.
And and my daughter was one ofthose kids she came out of the
womb of those kids.
She came out of the womb, Iswear.
She came out of the room womb,throwing discus and swimming,
like, like.
She was incredibly athleticallytalented, smart, and we kept
telling her you're so smart,you're so talented athletic, and
(27:45):
so everything was I win or I'velost.
I win or I've lost.
I win or I've lost.
So when she finally got to theage of of 12, she was swimming
in a race against older girls.
She lost the race.
And she's in the corner bawlingher eyes out.
And I go over to her.
I said Annika, why are youcrying?
She's like I lost.
I came in last.
(28:06):
I said you broke your ownprovincial record for 12 year
olds in the race.
And she's like I did.
I'm like yeah, you just set theprovincial record for 12 and
under 50 meter breaststroke.
Who cares if you lost the race,you just achieved a personal
best.
And I said you should be happy,you've worked hard for this.
And she's like oh, okay, butthis is what I'm saying, josh,
is that these kids who are, whoare uber athletically talented
(28:29):
or or or educatedly talented,intelligent, they don't know how
to handle that adversity whenthey eventually do face a better
opponent, someone who's as goodas they are.
Yeah, and it's and that goesfor adults too right, there's
some people who are justnaturally gifted and then they
face the, and that's why I'mpreaching the effort or result,
(28:50):
saying and and it it's changedpeople because they go I didn't
win, but I got better, andthat's the only person you
really should be competingagainst is yourself 100%, 100%.
I ramble, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
No, you know, because there's so many thoughts that I
had.
It's a few things right.
I remember, especially incollege, my coach used to call
guys who were going up againstand they would probably be
averaging, you know, 25 points agame and we could look at the
film and he would show us allthe amazing shots that they made
(29:31):
Right.
And then he would show us clipsof some of these guys where
they didn't hustle or they gotout physical.
Somebody made them, you know,tap out, made them quit, and we
used to call them talented wimps.
And those were the guys thatyou knew you could get to them,
(29:53):
you knew you could, you could,you could break them.
Now, some guys who were just tootalented, there was nothing you
can do, but it was some guyswhere we understood that right,
where it was, like you said, theresults driven.
They relied on the results.
They relied on the externalthings as opposed to kind of
(30:16):
those intrinsic, um, yeah,skills that you develop through
adversity, through, um, thehabits that you build through um
, resilience and setbacks right.
You can always tell whensomebody has battled something
and they're battle tested.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
You know those are the teams that you fear well,
think about, think about, um,like you got recruited out of
high school, just like I did, wedidn't.
They didn't give us three orfour or five stars back then
they didn't know what those were.
But like my son, for example,um, you know, he was a three
star and but these four and fivestar kids they show, um, I want
(30:56):
a ton of three star kids.
Mean, that's how a lot ofcollege programs build a great
program is, with a bunch ofgrinders and kids who just don't
give up, they, they will, theyrefuse to to, you know, not be
in the weight room.
They're like those.
You got to mix in a lot of thosegreat grinding three-star kids
with your fours and fives toteach them a lesson, because if
(31:16):
your five-star kids are justshowing up and they're just
going through the motions, whata horrible, you know example to
set for your, for the rest ofthe team.
And that's why I mean, yeah,every, every coach wants the
five-star.
But man, I'll, I'll take, I'lltake, I'll take 80% of my team
being three stars first and andmix in some really, you know,
some really solid that's right.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Yeah, 100, 100.
So, um, tell me this, um, the,the.
You talk about effort overresults, movement.
What does that look like?
That movement?
What does that look like?
Um, what is the?
What is the future hold with?
It sounds like you have a bookcoming out as well.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Yeah.
So you know the theory and thephilosophy behind Effort to
Resolve any life coach.
You know your Tony Robbins,your Mel Robbins, your.
You know the people whoeverybody talks about, right,
simon Sinek, what they're sayingisn't anything new.
(32:17):
They're just putting in adifferent package and presenting
it in a way that's morepalatable to the world.
And so when I think abouteffort or results, and when I
was writing the book and, like Isaid, it's my first book, it's
going to be coming out in thefall Christmas I didn't want
people to think that this is myidea.
It isn't, because, as I'mwriting the book, I'm realizing,
(32:39):
when I'm doing the study andthe research and looking into
past studies and past theories,this really just it's boiled
down to.
It just boils down to workethic, it boils down to trusting
the process, it boils down toyou know, you can only control
your effort and your attitude.
So those are the two things youshould be focusing on the most.
But where, where?
Where?
The origins of this happened,josh, was because of my kids,
(33:02):
because I was a results guy myentire life, like I was.
I was fairly talented as a kid.
I, I, I threw shot, put it forteam Canada never lost.
I never lost a shot.
Put competition from the age of12 to the age of 19.
You know, and so it was likeresults, results, results.
I made senior football team inthe ninth grade.
You know I was the best highschool football player in my
(33:23):
province, if not Canada, got thescholarship and it was just all
results.
Realize the, the, the negativemessage of results only
parenting, let's call it, orresults only coaching, or
results only you know, employing.
And so in this last five years,as as my son was getting
(33:46):
recruited uh down in the statesfor football and my and my
daughter went down for discus,um, it dawned on me that when I
that, when I messaged to themabout I just want to see you put
the work in, I don't care whathappens, I don't care if you
earn the scholarship, I don'tcare if you you know, you know
win today's game or whatever.
I just want to know that youput your best effort into
(34:07):
everything.
And when I started messagingthat and this is shortly after,
you know, my daughter in theswimming uh episode that I told
you about.
But all of a sudden theirattitude changed and their work
ethic got stronger and theybecame more resilient.
I was like huh, that actuallyworks, and so I started looking
(34:27):
at it.
I was listening to a podcastwith Andrew Huberman, who I'm
sure most of your listeners arefamiliar with, but he talked
about the work of Dr Carol Dweck, the psychologist from Stanford
University, where he is, andshe wrote a book called Growth
Mindset.
And in Growth Mindset there's achapter dedicated to a study
that they did with grade schoolchildren.
(34:49):
I believe they were third gradeand they gave these 500 grade
school children all the sametest very simple test and in the
end they basically praised halfof the group for the effort
they put in.
I saw how hard you're workingon that.
How did you think of thatquestion?
And the other half, who didreally well, they basically just
praised them for the finalresult the A+, the 90+ that they
(35:13):
got on the quiz.
Final result the A plus, the 90plus that they got on the quiz.
Then they asked the same groupokay, we're going to give you
another test.
Would you like to have aslightly harder test, be a
little more challenging, or doyou want to take like the same
level type quiz or test?
The kids who were praised fortheir result took the easy test.
The kids who were praised fortheir effort for the most part
(35:37):
took the easy test because theyknew that there wasn't a
punishment for not doing well aslong as they put effort in.
And I, I, I read through thisstudy in its entirety and I'm
like that's brilliant.
When you, when you tell peoplethat they're that, they're being
, that, their, their successcomes from the work they put in,
(35:57):
they re, they know they cancontrol that.
But if you tell people thattheir success only comes from
the output, from the result, allof a sudden fear sets in.
Right, tighten up, yeah, yeah,they tighten up and they don't
want to take.
God forbid I take a harder testbecause if I fail now I look
bad.
Because I aced the first oneand so I took this.
(36:23):
I started applying it to my kids.
I started applying it to mykids.
I started applying to the kidsthat I coached and everywhere
around me I just saw peoplegetting better because of it,
and one in particular, and onlybecause he lives in my house, my
son.
When I finally told him becausehe was a horrible test taker,
smart kid, but couldn't he justhad test paranoia I told him.
(36:43):
I said, kid, I don't care howyou do on the test.
If I see you work your tail offstudying for it, he's like,
really he goes, what if I fail?
I go.
As long as I saw you study forit and you put in an honest
effort maybe you work with mebecause I was teaching at the
time I said I don't care whatthe result is.
So, sure enough, we starteddoing that and he was getting
sixties and seventies and I waslike and he's like, I said,
(37:04):
what'd you get on the last test?
He goes.
I don't want to tell you I gowhy he goes, cause I got like a
58 and I go.
Okay, I said we studied forthat test together.
You learn, because for twoweeks you learned this stuff.
You just had a bad day and hejust and you could see
everything just kind of relaxinghim and I thought, okay, I got
to take this further.
(37:25):
So the Effort Over Results,philosophy and the movement now
is this podcast, because it goesbeyond that.
It's about resilience, whichyou speak to.
It's about growth mindset,which I know you speak to as
well, and why I want podcastsand to co-host and guests on all
(37:45):
different platforms because weneed to get this message out and
I know I'm going to come upagainst people that say, well,
you should be results driven,everybody should be, have goals
and goal setting.
It's like, yes, but here's thehere's the negative setback to
that.
If you do so, the book's comingout in the fall, the podcast
speaks to it.
So the book's coming out in thefall, the podcast speaks to it.
I try to incorporate it into.
You know all the aspects of mylife where I'm a leader.
(38:08):
So, whether it's coaching,amateur sports, or even in the
workplace, or obviously with theclients, you know that I work
with one-to-one.
I keep getting them to juststop focusing so hard on end
results and I just said, okay,what are your inputs?
Then just do that.
I don't.
It's like.
It's like people who get on ascale every day.
They're on a diet, right.
(38:29):
That is the worst thing youcould possibly do, because now
you're just like beatingyourself down.
Right, did you?
Did you eat well today?
Good, that's the win, that'sthe win, right?
So, yeah, so it's.
I've given it a name and andthe here's the funny thing I
remember, um, and I'll end, I'll.
I'll end this answer on thisone.
But my son was at Arizona.
He's now in his fourth season.
(38:50):
He's a starter, arizonafootball and he's being
interviewed by the media andthey were asking him about his,
his, his journey, because hestarted out basically didn't
play for three years but henever, ever gave up.
He always put you know the workethic and never miss practices,
never makes workouts andanything.
He finally gets his chance tostart and they say what do you
(39:11):
attribute this to?
He goes.
Well.
It's like my dad always saideffort over results and I was so
proud of him in that moment Ihad a tear in my eye and I'm
like he actually said the termand I and and they said what do
you mean by that?
And he goes.
He just, he just preaches at methat I just got to keep putting
my effort in yeah and not worryabout what happens.
He goes.
I can't control what thecoaches think, I can only
control what I do and thatchanged everything for him and
(39:32):
and from then, that day on, Iwas like I got to get this
message out to everybody.
So that's, that's where itcomes from, man yeah, and it's,
I mean, for me.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
The reason why it hits home for me is because, you
know, my identity for most ofmy life is built on performance,
right, and you know, even asI'm growing up, you know, even
you know, as I grow older, I'mlike just going out and doing
(40:02):
things that make meuncomfortable, um, that I'm
scared to do.
Just just doing it, yeah, noteven worried about the outcome.
That's what makes me feel good.
Just doing it and doing it overand over again, right, and
getting over certain fears andnot worrying about the outcome.
It's just so important.
Speaker 2 (40:24):
And you're putting yourself in a vulnerable
position because, as as alphamales which we probably both are
and performance driven people,you, when you decide to try
something that you, you probablyknow you're going to fail out,
at the first time for sure,You're in a vulnerable position
and but I think that's soimportant, especially for for
for strong men and men ingeneral, to show that
(40:46):
vulnerability, to show to othersI'm not perfect, I'm not good
at it, and I think we need tohave those life experiences that
humble us, because that'sreally what puts us in the
position and tames the ego alittle bit and basically says to
us you're not perfect and younever will be, but as long as
you're trying, I'll give youcredit for that.
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Yeah, 100%.
And I just love the fact thatyou put it out there, like, hey,
getting a 58 on a test that cancrush somebody, right, yeah.
But for you to still be thereand say, hey, you put the effort
in and hey, it happens, you hada bad day.
You just handle certainsituations that are seen as
(41:29):
failure or seen as moments ofrejection or losses.
Just handle those things better, knowing that, hey, the effort
was what I was worried about.
Anyway, I already feel good,I've already accomplished it.
Now, like you said, hey,eventually, you know you
definitely want some results,right.
(41:50):
But to attach your identity tothe outcome, to the output, it's
a dangerous game, it is.
Speaker 2 (41:59):
Yeah, because that identity becomes cemented then,
like it's fully cemented, and Iwould much rather be known for
someone who you know, I I mean,don't get me wrong, I, I like
results too, but at the sametime I want I want people once
again we talk about thataccountability thing I want
people to say you know what?
He gives it his all, all thatevery time, regardless of the
outcome.
He always puts 100 to 100 andand and that's what I would
(42:21):
rather be known for.
And even when I coach, thoseare the kind of kids I wanted on
my team.
For sure.
It's like I know they're notthe best athlete out there, but,
man, you gotta, you gotta, havethat kid on your team because
everyone else around them getsbetter because of them and they
make others better so 100 quinn,where can people continue to
follow your journey, continue tofollow your movement?
Speaker 1 (42:44):
I do think this is very important, a very important
movement.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
Thank you.
So the podcast Effort OverResults podcast it's on YouTube,
just search Effort Over Results.
It's also on Spotify and Apple,so you can get them all there.
My website isEffortOverResultscom.
You can't mistake that.
Instagram effortoverresultscomCan't mistake that.
Uh.
Instagram effort over resultsCan't mistake that.
Uh and I.
(43:08):
I had a Twitter going, but Ijust find Twitter doesn't really
work for this space very welland so I took it down because it
wasn't really gaining anytraction and I and it was hard
to manage all these differentsocials.
So I tend to focus on Iobviously focus on the podcast
the most.
The website basically promotesthe podcast itself and then the
Instagram.
The Instagram is interestingand I know thank you for going
(43:29):
and checking that out.
But the Instagram, I wanted itto be more of just a
inspirational, motivational typething.
I didn't want my face on there.
I didn't want you know it to beme just talking about you know,
different platitudes and soforth.
I wanted it to be, um, justgreat inspirational messages,
right, that people can look atwhether I've reposted them from
someone else or it's somethingthat I came up with and and
(43:50):
threw up on there.
I wanted, I wanted people toread it and go.
Okay, I'm not failing, that'sgood.
Okay, I just have to put youknow, take the first step.
And and that's really what allpeople should feel is is from
from childhood through, you know, to their old age is like it's
just put in the effort each day,get a little bit better every
day, and if you have bad dayswhere you don't have the energy,
(44:14):
that's okay.
You'll find it a different day.
It's it's what frustrates me themost are people who just have
given up completely and theydon't put in any effort, like
literally they're just gaming 24, seven, eating Cheetos in their
parents' basement.
It's like the world the worldis right now is so much more
(44:34):
ripe for people to be successfulthan it was when I was, you
know, 20, because you haveliterally a world of information
at your fingertips.
Um, everything that I learnedabout podcasting and all this
stuff I got from the internet,because you have literally a
world of information at yourfingertips.
Everything that I learned aboutpodcasting and all this stuff I
got from the internet.
I got from chat, gpt and that'swhat.
That's what's out there andthat's what I tell my kids.
You I don't don't tell them,you can be anything you want,
cause I think that's that's.
I don't like that message.
(44:54):
I just tell them you want tolearn something, go learn it,
right, and so it's.
And that's that's the messageI'm trying to get out there and
what I think we, especiallywhere kids are involved you know
if you have students, um, youknow if you're a teacher or
you're a coach or, once again,you're a parent, stop praising
them only for the result.
Praise them for the work theyput in and and and you, you,
(45:18):
you'll be amazed at the, at theresult.
You'll be amazed at the resultsof.
You know how that turns out.
So I thank you for thisopportunity, man.
It's been awesome and I and Ilove it, and I, if we, if we got
to talking about my injuries,it would take another hour
because there was.
I've had both hips replaced andACL reconstruct, five shoulder
surgeries, a wrist surgery and aspleen taken out at the Rose
bowl.
Speaker 1 (45:39):
So we'll talk about that a different day.
Yeah, 100%, yeah, definitely.
You know when the book releases, I would love to have you back
on and we talk a little bitabout it.
I know you know, especially abook to really deep dive in some
of these topics, right, I thinkit'd be very dope to have that
(45:59):
conversation.
So we'd love to have you backon, and especially when their
book drops excellent.
Speaker 2 (46:05):
Thanks, man.
I appreciate it today and, andand you know what I think we're
gonna have you on the show too.
100, I would love it.
Speaker 1 (46:11):
I would love it.
Well, everybody, as you know,right playing injured.
Go follow quinn uh at effortover results on instagram.
Go to effort over resultscom.
Effort over results with uh,with uh Quinn on YouTube um,
effort over results everywhere.
So, quinn, we appreciate you.
(46:32):
Thank you, sir, have a great.
I love it.
All right, welcome to another episode of Playing
Injured.
We have an exciting episode.
We have Mr Quinn Magnuson, whois a former professional
football player, turned highperformance coach to CEOs,
athletes, entrepreneurs.
He's the founder of the EffortOver Results movement and he
(00:21):
also has a podcast called EffortOver Results.
Mr Quinn, how are we feelingtoday?
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yes, sir.
Thank you, Josh, I appreciateit.
Just like I was telling you,when I saw the title of your
podcast, I had to be on it.
We got to talk about playinginjured and really just learning
from all those lessons.
So let's go.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, 100%.
And before we hit record, youare already letting me know
you've had over 11 surgeriesplaying football and going out
there and pushing your body tothe limit.
And I think when I firststarted this show, I wanted
folks to understand what was themindset behind going out there,
giving it your all, not being100%, sometimes making stupid
(01:04):
choices, right, what do youthink that was?
What was that mindset, when youlook back, that made you
continue to just go out thereand push it?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Yeah, you know, I think it's 5% stupidity.
I think a lot of it, though, isit's accountability to your
teammates, to the people aroundyou, and, and just knowing that
people are counting on you andand you're really counting on
yourself, and and so you pushyourself.
You know, even from the earlydays of playing sports as a kid,
(01:39):
you, you learn to play a littlebanged up and you eventually
build that body resiliency, butalso the pain tolerance it
builds up, and I think it'simportant for people to really
to push themselves, whether itbe in the gym.
I mean, I certainly don'texpect people to have so many
injuries as I've had, but Idon't think humans really
understand how, how resilientthe body is, um, and that
(02:03):
pushing the body to see what itcan do, it's, you know David
Goggin said.
I mean, we have no clue whatthe body can do with the mind
will stop first, right and uh.
So for me, you know being beingaccountable to my teammates,
accountable to myself,accountable, you know, when
you're younger, to your parentswho invested in you to be in
those sports.
Um, I think it's just importantto show people that you, you
(02:26):
are always going to be the kindof person they can count on and
and you know, in some cases,josh it you know, when you get
into college and into the prosyou really can't afford to be
hurt.
So you play hurt and injuredbecause you're the best
available option for thatposition for the team at that
time.
And then I found, actually whenI got into the pros I had one
of my teammates say to me youdon't make the club in the tub
(02:47):
right, and so you learn to playhurt there too.
So it's like I said, it's alittle bit of ignorance, trying
to ignore what really you shouldbe doing.
And I think in today's sportslike my son's a college football
player too they treat them alot better now and they handle
their injuries a lot differently.
But you know, back in the backin the 1900s, when I played it
(03:12):
was it was a little different.
So you had to push yourselfconcussions, you know, strained
ligaments, hamstring pulls,whatever.
You just did it because peopleare counting on you.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
Yeah, you know you say something that's that's.
I think that's the answer.
Right Is accountability andthat's I think that's the answer
there.
Right, it's accountability.
And I mean I remember breakingmy thumb and rushing to get back
, matter of fact, trying to getback out there, the game that I
broke it, trying to get back outthere and it was because of the
(03:40):
people around me.
It was the accountability ofthe group.
It was the accountability ofthe group and as humans, we
don't realize how powerful theaccountability of our immediate
circle in our environment is.
Right, and that's why it's sopowerful to be around amazing
people.
You know, I was out in MexicoCity for two weeks and I joined
(04:01):
a run club.
I just wanted to get out there,I wanted to meet people and, um
, I didn't know it was a seriousrun club.
I didn't know we were gonna runsix miles.
I thought it was gonna be alight jog, one or two miles.
I'm not the biggest runner and Ifound myself halfway through
this run like my mind wastelling me like, hey, I cannot
(04:21):
go any further, no way, I cankeep going, no way.
But I was around people who Ibarely knew and they were
amazing runners and I didn'twant to let them down.
I didn't want to let them downRight, and so I pushed my body,
my body pushed it and I made itthrough.
(04:42):
And it was just a beautifulexample of if I was here alone.
If I was doing this alone, thenI wouldn't have gone as far as
I did.
It's the African proverb rightIf you want to go fast, go alone
, but if you want to go far, gotogether.
And I think just theaccountability of a group will
(05:03):
take you so far, farther thanyou can even imagine, and you'll
even push yourself throughthings that you probably
wouldn't have if you were goingalone.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
And I think you know, I think there's two sides to
that story.
I think being pushed by othersand being accountable to others
is really important, and then Ithink there's also the can you
do the work when nobody'slooking right?
And we know that as athletes,you got you got to do the work
when no one's looking, and andthat's something that that is a
bit disappointing in in today'syoung athlete it feels like
(05:37):
every workout they do is onInstagram, you know, and when
they're getting recruited, it'son Twitter.
They're telling people how muchthey worked out that week, but
unfortunately, it's part of thegame.
But I think there's importanceto feeling accountable to those
around you, but then also beingaccountable to yourself too, in
those times when you're alone.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Yeah, I think that's the separator, right, that's the
separator.
It's so crazy that we are superaccountable to other people,
right?
I mean, that's how human beingsare wired um.
But how can we be accountableto ourselves?
How can we really have thatloyalty to ourselves and not let
ourselves down?
(06:17):
And it's so easy to just hitthe alarm clock, right, nobody's
watching.
I'm just letting myself down,right.
How crazy is that?
I'm just letting myself down,right.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Uh you know, and that's the number one person you
should be accountable to, right?
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:31):
100, that's the crazy part right, 100 right.
And so when you say things outloud, I think that's something
that we can start to do is, hey,when I, when I'm not doing
something that I'm supposed tobe doing and I know I need to do
it certain habits, how can Isay, oh, I'm letting myself down
and, like, really think aboutthat.
We won't let you know astranger down.
(06:52):
I didn't let eight otherstrangers down in Mexico City,
but it's so easy for me to justhit my alarm clock and let
myself down.
It's so amazing of how humanbeings are wired.
But, like you mentioned, that'sthe separator right there.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
Well, and there's a chapter in my book that's going
to be coming out at Christmasthat talks about literally the
origins of effort over results,and it talks about going back
thousands of years.
When you're in a community andeveryone has to count on
everybody, you don't have achoice.
And if you aren't accountableto the group, if you aren't
(07:29):
going out and doing your it'salmost like watching survivor,
right, if you aren't going outand you aren't doing your share
of the hunting or or theforaging or the gathering or
whatever, they'll basically kickyou out, like they'll just get
rid of you because you'reuseless to the group and and so
that's where that accountabilityto others that it's.
It's, it's historical, likeit's in our genetics, to be
accountable to each other in agroup setting.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Yeah, and then also too right that mechanism of
caring what what other peoplethink of you, Right.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
And yeah, and it's, it's, it's that one's a tough
one though, Josh, don't you?
think like like we, we, we hearconflicting messages and I know
you're much younger than I am,but you know it used to be care
what other people think.
And then it feels to me like inthe last decade it's been like
don't care what anybody thinks,it's all about you, and I think
that's it's a bit of a mixedmessage, and I don't think we're
(08:16):
trying to say don't care aboutanybody else.
What we're saying is make sureyou hold up your end of the
bargain within the entirepicture, right?
So it's yeah, man, there's thatalone time where you got to be
accountable to you and only you.
And then there's other timeswhere people expect you to show
up and that goes for work, thatgoes to your teammates, that
goes to your co-workers andeverything.
(08:37):
So that's what it's about.
It's about the effort.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Yeah, 100%.
Speaking of effort, effort overresults, right, yeah, yeah,
when you talk about it, right,it's almost like, especially in
today's age, and I think thatTwitter generation started kind
of when I was in high school.
You know, you get an offer, youget a letter, you want to take
(09:00):
a picture of it.
You know it's amazing, it is anaccomplishment.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Hashtag AGTG All glory to God.
Yeah, my seventh offer, yeah,okay.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
No, 100%.
And you want to show resultsright, yeah, you want to show it
, you want to show what I'vedone, what I've accomplished.
But very few people actuallywant to show the effort, the
process right and that's thebest part right.
But I think a lot of folks kindof live in results over effort.
(09:37):
How can I get the fastestresult?
I think that's life in general.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Yeah, yeah, people, people, live, people and once
again, this, this, this too isis in our genetics as well.
It's about, it's aboutachievement, it's about, you
know, getting results.
And and even more so once againwith the advent of social media
it's all about look at me, lookat me, look at me.
But they show the result Right.
(10:03):
And then, even when people showthe work that they're putting
in, for the most part it'salmost virtue signaling, right,
and it's that work you do whenno one's looking.
That really is the stuff thatactually counts.
Unfortunately, we live in aworld where these, these young
athletes, you know, coming outof high school, have to almost
put on their Twitter that howmuch work they're doing and show
(10:25):
their workouts so the coachescan see you know, you know what
they're, what they're, whatthey're doing in terms of
getting better.
But I still believe that, youknow, results are important.
So I don't want people to getmixed up when, when I say effort
over results and they, they,they mistake that with, well,
not goal setting or not, youknow, achieving anything.
No, what I'm saying is that youneed to be proud of yourself
(10:46):
for the effort you put in thatled to the result.
And so when we praise people,um, and give the messaging
especially young kids about youknow, oh, you're so talented,
that's a result statement.
Oh, you're so athletic, that'sa result statement.
Right, because you're you'reshowing what that the kid is, is
, is at the end of something youwon.
So athletic, that's a resultstatement.
(11:06):
Right, because you're showingwhat that kid is at the end of
something you won the race.
You're so athletic, you're sotalented, you're so smart.
What you should be messaging tothem really is I really loved
how you worked this week.
I love the work you put intoyour workouts, into your running
, into the lifting, intostudying for a test, instead of
just, oh, you got an A, here's20 bucks for getting an A, and I
think that's where we need asparents and educators, teachers,
(11:30):
coaches, employers need toreally start changing the
narrative is focus on lettingthose people that you're leading
know that you're proud of theeffort they put in, and that's
what you're looking for.
Yeah, even if they didn't getthe result, because there's
going to be days where you putin a ton of effort.
(11:50):
There's months, like when I'min a sales position, where I put
in a ton of activity and andnever get a sale, yeah.
And my leader says to me hey,quinn, I know you did the work,
it's okay, it'll happen nextmonth.
Same thing thing with athletes,you know, students, whatever.
So keep praising that effortand the results happen.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Yeah, and I feel like what that creates is a culture
of identity rooted inperformance, right In results.
I'm worthy if, and only if, Iget this result right.
Speaker 2 (12:23):
Yeah, and there's days you don't get results.
Josh, right, I mean, you knowthis.
It's as an athlete, you can putin.
I mean, even as a team.
You put in all the work, youget through the season only to
lose a championship game andeverybody focuses on the fact
you lost a championship game.
And it's like look at all, lookat it, look at everything we
learned this year, looking howwe came together as a team, look
how everyone got individuallybetter and that.
(12:43):
That.
That speaks to the process, andI I hate to use the hashtag
trust the process, but it's trueand and and.
Then it speaks to how this teamis going to be even better next
year because of all the workthey put in.
Don't get me wrong winning achampionship is fantastic.
Losing a championship sucks, um, but you know, I had a coach
that once said to me you know,if you lose and it doesn't hurt,
(13:05):
that says a lot about you.
That means you didn't put a lotof work in during the season.
It should hurt.
Losing should absolutely be oneof the most painful things you
experience in life because youput the work in right, and so
that's why we need to keepmessaging that, and I mean it's
you know studies become moreinnovative, they take challenges
(13:28):
on better, they want to take onmore work, because you're not,
you're not basically basingtheir existence and their worth
on a, on a single result.
Yeah, and that's.
That's where I think themessaging has to change yeah,
and you're not going to succeedevery time.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
I was actually looking at, um, I was looking at
a post that you put onInstagram.
Right, it's about Frank Sinatra.
Yeah, I got it right here.
Frank Sinatra, right?
He released 1,200 songs, 209hits that's 17%.
Babe Ruth 8,399 attempts, 714home runs that's 8.5%.
(14:08):
Pablo Picasso over 150,000pieces of work 1,170 hits that's
0.7%.
90% of their outputs is notpopular, so you have to keep
going right, and so, more timesthan not, you're probably going
(14:30):
to fail or lose or miss, uh, orget no showed, right, um, and so
it makes sense to praise theeffort over the results.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
Because then?
Because then that that personthat you're praising for their
effort will know, because theyknow they can control that,
right, josh, yeah, I can controlmy.
They.
Always coaches say you cancontrol two things your effort,
your attitude.
I can control my effort.
So if you, if I, keep gettingpraised for effort result, if
(15:06):
you only pray for me for none ofthis mattered, yeah, and that's
not the message we need to besending kids.
But I love that post and I'lltell you why is because
everybody and once again I keepreminding people of of what
social media has done to us.
It makes the world look perfect, right.
It makes all of our vacationslook outstanding.
(15:26):
It makes the world look perfect, right, it makes all of our
vacations look outstanding.
And what we need to realize isthat, you know, like Picasso,
150,000 works of art and 0.8%only really sold and became
famous.
Everybody should be goingthrough that.
It's the same thing withpodcasting.
I was so afraid to start mypodcast because I wanted the
first one to be absolutelyperfect Perfect lighting,
(15:49):
perfect microphones, everything.
And finally, uh, somebody justsaid to me just record it, just
go ahead and record it.
Who cares if it sucks?
If you've ever watched some ofthe first podcasts from, like
you know, joe Rogan or ChrisWilliamson or Scott Galloway or
all the famous podcasters, theirfirst podcast are horrible.
They're terrible but they justkept doing it and only it's like
(16:11):
only like 10% of podcasts makeit past the fourth recording.
You know things like that.
So we're both doing great, man,but yeah, we got it.
We got to definitely keepmessaging to the people that we
love and that we care for andthat we're trying to teach and
coach and educate.
Um, you know's all about justputting, putting in the work
yeah, you know you got methinking you're talking about
(16:32):
things.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
You can control effort.
Um, I'm thinking about attitude.
Right, you can control ourattitude, and if you're so
focused on the results, it'shard to keep a great attitude
versus the input.
Right, if you focus on theinput and you can pat yourself
on the back every day, it'spretty remarkable the results
(16:54):
you can get while also having agreat attitude along with the
effort.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
You're going to be batting 1,000,.
Man, if you're putting in thework every day, that's all that
matters.
You're always batting 1,000.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
And you know, it reminds me it's a book the great
Bill Walsh we don't know BillWalsh, one of the best coaches,
if not the best coach ever in,you know, nfl football, and he
has a book called the ScoreTakes Care of Itself.
And I remember reading thisbook, maybe two, three years ago
(17:31):
, and that title really struckme because it was all about the
process of all the little, smalldetails and habits that needed
to be built in order for thescore to take care of itself and
the results, the case, takecare of itself.
(17:51):
And, um, I think this is thesame message here, and I'm even
thinking about habits, right, um, along with effort.
Right, we talk about attitude,we talk about effort.
I'm thinking about habits.
Right, you can control on adaily basis Habits.
How important is that?
(18:12):
Right, where to start to focuson inputs, the inputs that we
have, and the habits?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
right, I don't know if you've ever read Atomic
Habits by James Clear, butobviously you know people in our
space are at least aware of thebook.
Um, I, I read it and and it ithelped reinforce, and I
referenced atomic habits in mybook.
Um, because it it it just talksabout.
You know, if you want to, youknow I'll even use this example,
(18:42):
like when I finished playingfootball, I was well over 300
pounds, um, and I wanted to loseweight and so I set a goal of
getting down to two 70 and Ifocused too much on on the two
70 part and so I jumped on ascale and I'd gained two pounds
and I was like I was so dejectedand so forth.
But but, um, the habits, it'seven even for people who are
like, I know I should go to thegym because I know it'll make me
(19:03):
healthier and I'll feel better,but I just have a hard time
getting to the gym.
Or they make an excuse.
You know it's like, well, Idon't have time to go to the gym
.
It's like, well, no, you dohave time, you just haven't made
a priority and and it comesdown to to, uh, environment and
cues, and when it comes tohabits, developing habits.
It's, it's about theenvironment you're, you're,
(19:24):
you're in on a daily basis.
But then also the little cues.
And so I came up with this,saying it's like just put your
gym bag by the door and whatthat means.
And I'll tell you a little storyabout my daughter.
So my daughter was a collegeathlete.
Um COVID shut her, her careerdown completely.
She came home and she stoppedgoing to the gym, stopped
working out, like she didn't gofor three years.
And in 2024, she I was like youknow Ann, and in 2024, I was
(19:48):
like you know Annika.
I said you used to be like thishigh-performance athlete man
and you're not even going to thegym at all.
And she's like I'm scared to.
Now I don't want to.
I'm so out of shape.
I said, well, how about this?
How about once a week you and Ijust go to the gym and watch
people work out?
Like are you serious?
I go, yeah, they've got.
(20:10):
Like are you serious?
I go, yeah, they got massagechairs there.
I said we'll go, sit in themassage chairs and we'll watch.
We'll just watch, we'll be inthe environment.
She's like okay, can we grabcoffee on the way?
I'm like sure.
So for the first couple ofsundays we just we just grabbed
coffees and went and sat at theyou know the pro shop or sat in
the massage chairs and watchpeople work out.
And she'd be sitting there andshe'd be like, oh, that, that
guy's form is terrible.
And she'd be sitting there andshe'd be like, oh, that, that
guy's form is terrible.
And she'd be like I can liftmore than that person.
(20:32):
And it kind of got her juicedagain, right.
And then, and then I said okay,I said next Sunday, I said I
just want you to put your gymbag by the door.
You don't have to bring it, butat least have it by the door
when I come to pick you up.
And so for Sunday she didn't.
Second Sunday I see her walkout of her apartment with her
gym bag in her hand and I'm like, okay, all right.
And that's the thing thatpeople don't get is like you
(20:53):
don't need to go to the gym andachieve everything in day one or
even in month one.
It is layers, it is just layersof effort that lead to where
you want to go.
But the people focus so hard onthe end, the finish line, the
end result, the goal, thateverything becomes a failure
(21:14):
because they feel like they'reso far away from it.
Instead of focusing on what'sright in front of them, they
focus on what's down the road,and so that put the gym bag by
the door.
It's it that goes for anything.
If you want to write a book,okay, well, maybe learn
something.
Spend 20 minutes learning.
You want to write a book?
Okay, well, maybe learnsomething.
Spend 20 minutes learning abouthow to write a book or write a
few words down.
Or if you're trying to learnhow to, you know, I don't know,
(21:37):
but there's so many examples andthen just take the smallest
little micro step, butconsistently.
Do it daily or weekly, so youget into a bit of a habit of
doing that, and then, at somepoint in time, your mind and
your body go this is now, thisis the norm, yeah, and.
And it escalates and it getsbetter, and and the best way I
can describe it, josh I alwaysit's funny my daughter and I
(22:00):
spent a lot of time together andI tell her are you stacking
layers today?
And she and we, we have thatsaying because I said if you
take a piece of paper and youtake, you know, dip your
paintbrush in and you go on thepaper.
If you look at the paper likethis, you won't see the paint
Because it's gone into the paper, it's flat.
Next day, another layer.
(22:20):
You don't see it.
Next day, another.
Okay, maybe by day eight you'renow starting to see a little
buildup Right, and by day 20,now, all of a sudden, you got
some thickness there and by daya hundred man, that that thing
is weighing the middle of thatpaper down because it's so thick
.
This is how we need to treat ourlives.
Stop focusing on the end result.
It'll happen if you put theeffort in.
So focus on the effort.
(22:41):
I'm not saying goals aren'tgood.
I'm not saying don't goal setor don't don't have something
you want to achieve, but set itand forget it.
And then day one, not one day,day one.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Yeah, set the goal, to set the intentions of what
you want to do every day.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Yeah, like, whatever the output is okay, now what are
the inputs?
And then just focus on theinputs.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
Yeah, that's an amazing analogy.
I've never heard that before,actually.
Speaker 2 (23:10):
I heard.
I heard.
I won't.
I'm not going to say that Icame up with that.
It was.
I believe it was Alex Hermosi.
I don't know if you know AlexHermosi, but I love Alex and he
I think he came up with that andit just made so much sense to
me Like you're not going to seethe paint for a few days, maybe
a month, who knows right.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
Yeah, yeah, and the patience right.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
Patience and you're going to have setbacks.
They're going to be.
Maybe you went to the gym fivedays a week for a month and then
maybe you had a bad week whereyou only got there once.
And then people are like, well,I had a crappy week and I
didn't get to the gym and now Ifeel like everything's gone.
Start again.
It's okay.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
Start again, build more layers up, it's okay, yeah,
how do you handle thosesetbacks?
Right, we talk about resilience.
You know handling setbacks,handling the failures, because
it's the reality is, most of uswere taught that results are
important.
Right and honestly, you knowlosing and failing, um, you know
(24:11):
, you know losing thatchampionship uh, not getting
that job, uh, not doing well onthe interview.
You know all the results thatwe actually wanted.
How can we handle those losses,those failures?
Speaker 2 (24:28):
I, I still am working on that, josh, I still am
working on.
You know, when I have setbacks,not letting it get to me, it's
tough.
I have to.
I have to keep reminding myselfthat, that I learned something
from it, or what can I learnfrom that?
And and I think, but the reasonwhy people get the mindset of
(24:50):
of feeling, you know, it's anegative feeling or feeling
dejected when there's a setbackis because of of how they've
been raised and the environmentsthey've been raised.
Right, if it.
Let me give you an example here.
Let's imagine a three-year-oldchild who's putting a puzzle
together, a very simple child'spuzzle, and they're not getting
(25:11):
it.
So the parent says to themthat's okay, you'll get it next
time.
What you've just said to thechild is you failed, you're
going to have to try again nexttime to see if you can get the
end result again.
It's still not a positivemessage to send to the child.
I would actually say to thechild, I would.
I would actually say to thechild I saw you working really
(25:34):
hard on that.
What would you try differentlynext time?
Get them to think through theprocess right?
Same thing with a 10 year old,with a 20 year old guys, our age
, your age, right, it's, it'syour.
The reason why they're calledsetbacks is because you've
basically thought that there'seither it's either win or lose.
But really it's win or learn.
And I know that sounds supercliche and I even cringe
(25:57):
sometimes when I hear win orlearn, because sometimes I want
to wallow in the lose right andI want to feel that sadness.
But it's taken me I'm 54 nowand it's taken me till the age
of probably 49, 50 to reallyunderstand that every setback
and once again cliche, sorryabout this, but every setback,
and once again cliche, sorryabout this, but every setback
(26:18):
has a comeback and it gives youan opportunity to try again, to
defeat that thing and and to andto, but to learn from it.
You can't just say I lost or Ifailed at it and now I'm going
to try again, hoping to win orlose again, depending on what
the the result is.
You want to do it again becauseyou're going to work harder at
it, you're going to learn fromthe last time you you didn't
(26:40):
achieve it and you're going tochange the way you approach it.
And and this is why you know,when you see young athletes, um,
that are just, they're justgifted, right, they just they
show up in the hockey rink andthey show up at the baseball
diamond or or the football field.
And they show up at thebaseball diamond or or the
football field and they just runcircles around kids, right,
they're the best at eight yearsold, the best eight-year-old on
the field.
Yeah, those kids, eventuallythe other kids catch up to them,
(27:02):
because those kids were werealmost hand hand, given by god
the ability to just be betterthan everybody without having to
work for it.
Those aren't the kids I want onmy team, necessarily, because
those are the kids that whenthey do eventually face
adversity, where now they get tothe age of, say, 12 or 13,
other kids have caught up in ageand speed and size and now
(27:25):
they're not winning every raceand they don't know what to do.
Yeah, they have no resilience,they have no way.
And and my daughter was one ofthose kids she came out of the
womb of those kids.
She came out of the womb, Iswear.
She came out of the room womb,throwing discus and swimming,
like, like.
She was incredibly athleticallytalented, smart, and we kept
telling her you're so smart,you're so talented athletic, and
(27:45):
so everything was I win or I'velost.
I win or I've lost.
I win or I've lost.
So when she finally got to theage of of 12, she was swimming
in a race against older girls.
She lost the race.
And she's in the corner bawlingher eyes out.
And I go over to her.
I said Annika, why are youcrying?
She's like I lost.
I came in last.
(28:06):
I said you broke your ownprovincial record for 12 year
olds in the race.
And she's like I did.
I'm like yeah, you just set theprovincial record for 12 and
under 50 meter breaststroke.
Who cares if you lost the race,you just achieved a personal
best.
And I said you should be happy,you've worked hard for this.
And she's like oh, okay, butthis is what I'm saying, josh,
is that these kids who are, whoare uber athletically talented
(28:29):
or or or educatedly talented,intelligent, they don't know how
to handle that adversity whenthey eventually do face a better
opponent, someone who's as goodas they are.
Yeah, and it's and that goesfor adults too right, there's
some people who are justnaturally gifted and then they
face the, and that's why I'mpreaching the effort or result,
(28:50):
saying and and it it's changedpeople because they go I didn't
win, but I got better, andthat's the only person you
really should be competingagainst is yourself 100%, 100%.
I ramble, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
No, you know, because there's so many thoughts that I
had.
It's a few things right.
I remember, especially incollege, my coach used to call
guys who were going up againstand they would probably be
averaging, you know, 25 points agame and we could look at the
film and he would show us allthe amazing shots that they made
(29:31):
Right.
And then he would show us clipsof some of these guys where
they didn't hustle or they gotout physical.
Somebody made them, you know,tap out, made them quit, and we
used to call them talented wimps.
And those were the guys thatyou knew you could get to them,
(29:53):
you knew you could, you could,you could break them.
Now, some guys who were just tootalented, there was nothing you
can do, but it was some guyswhere we understood that right,
where it was, like you said, theresults driven.
They relied on the results.
They relied on the externalthings as opposed to kind of
(30:16):
those intrinsic, um, yeah,skills that you develop through
adversity, through, um, thehabits that you build through um
, resilience and setbacks right.
You can always tell whensomebody has battled something
and they're battle tested.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
You know those are the teams that you fear well,
think about, think about, um,like you got recruited out of
high school, just like I did, wedidn't.
They didn't give us three orfour or five stars back then
they didn't know what those were.
But like my son, for example,um, you know, he was a three
star and but these four and fivestar kids they show, um, I want
(30:56):
a ton of three star kids.
Mean, that's how a lot ofcollege programs build a great
program is, with a bunch ofgrinders and kids who just don't
give up, they, they will, theyrefuse to to, you know, not be
in the weight room.
They're like those.
You got to mix in a lot of thosegreat grinding three-star kids
with your fours and fives toteach them a lesson, because if
(31:16):
your five-star kids are justshowing up and they're just
going through the motions, whata horrible, you know example to
set for your, for the rest ofthe team.
And that's why I mean, yeah,every, every coach wants the
five-star.
But man, I'll, I'll take, I'lltake, I'll take 80% of my team
being three stars first and andmix in some really, you know,
some really solid that's right.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Yeah, 100, 100.
So, um, tell me this, um, the,the.
You talk about effort overresults, movement.
What does that look like?
That movement?
What does that look like?
Um, what is the?
What is the future hold with?
It sounds like you have a bookcoming out as well.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Yeah.
So you know the theory and thephilosophy behind Effort to
Resolve any life coach.
You know your Tony Robbins,your Mel Robbins, your.
You know the people whoeverybody talks about, right,
simon Sinek, what they're sayingisn't anything new.
(32:17):
They're just putting in adifferent package and presenting
it in a way that's morepalatable to the world.
And so when I think abouteffort or results, and when I
was writing the book and, like Isaid, it's my first book, it's
going to be coming out in thefall Christmas I didn't want
people to think that this is myidea.
It isn't, because, as I'mwriting the book, I'm realizing,
(32:39):
when I'm doing the study andthe research and looking into
past studies and past theories,this really just it's boiled
down to.
It just boils down to workethic, it boils down to trusting
the process, it boils down toyou know, you can only control
your effort and your attitude.
So those are the two things youshould be focusing on the most.
But where, where?
Where?
The origins of this happened,josh, was because of my kids,
(33:02):
because I was a results guy myentire life, like I was.
I was fairly talented as a kid.
I, I, I threw shot, put it forteam Canada never lost.
I never lost a shot.
Put competition from the age of12 to the age of 19.
You know, and so it was likeresults, results, results.
I made senior football team inthe ninth grade.
You know I was the best highschool football player in my
(33:23):
province, if not Canada, got thescholarship and it was just all
results.
Realize the, the, the negativemessage of results only
parenting, let's call it, orresults only coaching, or
results only you know, employing.
And so in this last five years,as as my son was getting
(33:46):
recruited uh down in the statesfor football and my and my
daughter went down for discus,um, it dawned on me that when I
that, when I messaged to themabout I just want to see you put
the work in, I don't care whathappens, I don't care if you
earn the scholarship, I don'tcare if you you know, you know
win today's game or whatever.
I just want to know that youput your best effort into
(34:07):
everything.
And when I started messagingthat and this is shortly after,
you know, my daughter in theswimming uh episode that I told
you about.
But all of a sudden theirattitude changed and their work
ethic got stronger and theybecame more resilient.
I was like huh, that actuallyworks, and so I started looking
(34:27):
at it.
I was listening to a podcastwith Andrew Huberman, who I'm
sure most of your listeners arefamiliar with, but he talked
about the work of Dr Carol Dweck, the psychologist from Stanford
University, where he is, andshe wrote a book called Growth
Mindset.
And in Growth Mindset there's achapter dedicated to a study
that they did with grade schoolchildren.
(34:49):
I believe they were third gradeand they gave these 500 grade
school children all the sametest very simple test and in the
end they basically praised halfof the group for the effort
they put in.
I saw how hard you're workingon that.
How did you think of thatquestion?
And the other half, who didreally well, they basically just
praised them for the finalresult the A+, the 90+ that they
(35:13):
got on the quiz.
Final result the A plus, the 90plus that they got on the quiz.
Then they asked the same groupokay, we're going to give you
another test.
Would you like to have aslightly harder test, be a
little more challenging, or doyou want to take like the same
level type quiz or test?
The kids who were praised fortheir result took the easy test.
The kids who were praised fortheir effort for the most part
(35:37):
took the easy test because theyknew that there wasn't a
punishment for not doing well aslong as they put effort in.
And I, I, I read through thisstudy in its entirety and I'm
like that's brilliant.
When you, when you tell peoplethat they're that, they're being
, that, their, their successcomes from the work they put in,
(35:57):
they re, they know they cancontrol that.
But if you tell people thattheir success only comes from
the output, from the result, allof a sudden fear sets in.
Right, tighten up, yeah, yeah,they tighten up and they don't
want to take.
God forbid I take a harder testbecause if I fail now I look
bad.
Because I aced the first oneand so I took this.
(36:23):
I started applying it to my kids.
I started applying it to mykids.
I started applying to the kidsthat I coached and everywhere
around me I just saw peoplegetting better because of it,
and one in particular, and onlybecause he lives in my house, my
son.
When I finally told him becausehe was a horrible test taker,
smart kid, but couldn't he justhad test paranoia I told him.
(36:43):
I said, kid, I don't care howyou do on the test.
If I see you work your tail offstudying for it, he's like,
really he goes, what if I fail?
I go.
As long as I saw you study forit and you put in an honest
effort maybe you work with mebecause I was teaching at the
time I said I don't care whatthe result is.
So, sure enough, we starteddoing that and he was getting
sixties and seventies and I waslike and he's like, I said,
(37:04):
what'd you get on the last test?
He goes.
I don't want to tell you I gowhy he goes, cause I got like a
58 and I go.
Okay, I said we studied forthat test together.
You learn, because for twoweeks you learned this stuff.
You just had a bad day and hejust and you could see
everything just kind of relaxinghim and I thought, okay, I got
to take this further.
(37:25):
So the Effort Over Results,philosophy and the movement now
is this podcast, because it goesbeyond that.
It's about resilience, whichyou speak to.
It's about growth mindset,which I know you speak to as
well, and why I want podcastsand to co-host and guests on all
(37:45):
different platforms because weneed to get this message out and
I know I'm going to come upagainst people that say, well,
you should be results driven,everybody should be, have goals
and goal setting.
It's like, yes, but here's thehere's the negative setback to
that.
If you do so, the book's comingout in the fall, the podcast
speaks to it.
So the book's coming out in thefall, the podcast speaks to it.
I try to incorporate it into.
You know all the aspects of mylife where I'm a leader.
(38:08):
So, whether it's coaching,amateur sports, or even in the
workplace, or obviously with theclients, you know that I work
with one-to-one.
I keep getting them to juststop focusing so hard on end
results and I just said, okay,what are your inputs?
Then just do that.
I don't.
It's like.
It's like people who get on ascale every day.
They're on a diet, right.
(38:29):
That is the worst thing youcould possibly do, because now
you're just like beatingyourself down.
Right, did you?
Did you eat well today?
Good, that's the win, that'sthe win, right?
So, yeah, so it's.
I've given it a name and andthe here's the funny thing I
remember, um, and I'll end, I'll.
I'll end this answer on thisone.
But my son was at Arizona.
He's now in his fourth season.
(38:50):
He's a starter, arizonafootball and he's being
interviewed by the media andthey were asking him about his,
his, his journey, because hestarted out basically didn't
play for three years but henever, ever gave up.
He always put you know the workethic and never miss practices,
never makes workouts andanything.
He finally gets his chance tostart and they say what do you
(39:11):
attribute this to?
He goes.
Well.
It's like my dad always saideffort over results and I was so
proud of him in that moment Ihad a tear in my eye and I'm
like he actually said the termand I and and they said what do
you mean by that?
And he goes.
He just, he just preaches at methat I just got to keep putting
my effort in yeah and not worryabout what happens.
He goes.
I can't control what thecoaches think, I can only
control what I do and thatchanged everything for him and
(39:32):
and from then, that day on, Iwas like I got to get this
message out to everybody.
So that's, that's where itcomes from, man yeah, and it's,
I mean, for me.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
The reason why it hits home for me is because, you
know, my identity for most ofmy life is built on performance,
right, and you know, even asI'm growing up, you know, even
you know, as I grow older, I'mlike just going out and doing
(40:02):
things that make meuncomfortable, um, that I'm
scared to do.
Just just doing it, yeah, noteven worried about the outcome.
That's what makes me feel good.
Just doing it and doing it overand over again, right, and
getting over certain fears andnot worrying about the outcome.
It's just so important.
Speaker 2 (40:24):
And you're putting yourself in a vulnerable
position because, as as alphamales which we probably both are
and performance driven people,you, when you decide to try
something that you, you probablyknow you're going to fail out,
at the first time for sure,You're in a vulnerable position
and but I think that's soimportant, especially for for
for strong men and men ingeneral, to show that
(40:46):
vulnerability, to show to othersI'm not perfect, I'm not good
at it, and I think we need tohave those life experiences that
humble us, because that'sreally what puts us in the
position and tames the ego alittle bit and basically says to
us you're not perfect and younever will be, but as long as
you're trying, I'll give youcredit for that.
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Yeah, 100%.
And I just love the fact thatyou put it out there, like, hey,
getting a 58 on a test that cancrush somebody, right, yeah.
But for you to still be thereand say, hey, you put the effort
in and hey, it happens, you hada bad day.
You just handle certainsituations that are seen as
(41:29):
failure or seen as moments ofrejection or losses.
Just handle those things better, knowing that, hey, the effort
was what I was worried about.
Anyway, I already feel good,I've already accomplished it.
Now, like you said, hey,eventually, you know you
definitely want some results,right.
(41:50):
But to attach your identity tothe outcome, to the output, it's
a dangerous game, it is.
Speaker 2 (41:59):
Yeah, because that identity becomes cemented then,
like it's fully cemented, and Iwould much rather be known for
someone who you know, I I mean,don't get me wrong, I, I like
results too, but at the sametime I want I want people once
again we talk about thataccountability thing I want
people to say you know what?
He gives it his all, all thatevery time, regardless of the
outcome.
He always puts 100 to 100 andand and that's what I would
(42:21):
rather be known for.
And even when I coach, thoseare the kind of kids I wanted on
my team.
For sure.
It's like I know they're notthe best athlete out there, but,
man, you gotta, you gotta, havethat kid on your team because
everyone else around them getsbetter because of them and they
make others better so 100 quinn,where can people continue to
follow your journey, continue tofollow your movement?
Speaker 1 (42:44):
I do think this is very important, a very important
movement.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
Thank you.
So the podcast Effort OverResults podcast it's on YouTube,
just search Effort Over Results.
It's also on Spotify and Apple,so you can get them all there.
My website isEffortOverResultscom.
You can't mistake that.
Instagram effortoverresultscomCan't mistake that.
Uh.
Instagram effort over resultsCan't mistake that.
Uh and I.
(43:08):
I had a Twitter going, but Ijust find Twitter doesn't really
work for this space very welland so I took it down because it
wasn't really gaining anytraction and I and it was hard
to manage all these differentsocials.
So I tend to focus on Iobviously focus on the podcast
the most.
The website basically promotesthe podcast itself and then the
Instagram.
The Instagram is interestingand I know thank you for going
(43:29):
and checking that out.
But the Instagram, I wanted itto be more of just a
inspirational, motivational typething.
I didn't want my face on there.
I didn't want you know it to beme just talking about you know,
different platitudes and soforth.
I wanted it to be, um, justgreat inspirational messages,
right, that people can look atwhether I've reposted them from
someone else or it's somethingthat I came up with and and
(43:50):
threw up on there.
I wanted, I wanted people toread it and go.
Okay, I'm not failing, that'sgood.
Okay, I just have to put youknow, take the first step.
And and that's really what allpeople should feel is is from
from childhood through, you know, to their old age is like it's
just put in the effort each day,get a little bit better every
day, and if you have bad dayswhere you don't have the energy,
(44:14):
that's okay.
You'll find it a different day.
It's it's what frustrates me themost are people who just have
given up completely and theydon't put in any effort, like
literally they're just gaming 24, seven, eating Cheetos in their
parents' basement.
It's like the world the worldis right now is so much more
(44:34):
ripe for people to be successfulthan it was when I was, you
know, 20, because you haveliterally a world of information
at your fingertips.
Um, everything that I learnedabout podcasting and all this
stuff I got from the internet,because you have literally a
world of information at yourfingertips.
Everything that I learned aboutpodcasting and all this stuff I
got from the internet.
I got from chat, gpt and that'swhat.
That's what's out there andthat's what I tell my kids.
You I don't don't tell them,you can be anything you want,
cause I think that's that's.
I don't like that message.
(44:54):
I just tell them you want tolearn something, go learn it,
right, and so it's.
And that's that's the messageI'm trying to get out there and
what I think we, especiallywhere kids are involved you know
if you have students, um, youknow if you're a teacher or
you're a coach or, once again,you're a parent, stop praising
them only for the result.
Praise them for the work theyput in and and and you, you,
(45:18):
you'll be amazed at the, at theresult.
You'll be amazed at the resultsof.
You know how that turns out.
So I thank you for thisopportunity, man.
It's been awesome and I and Ilove it, and I, if we, if we got
to talking about my injuries,it would take another hour
because there was.
I've had both hips replaced andACL reconstruct, five shoulder
surgeries, a wrist surgery and aspleen taken out at the Rose
bowl.
Speaker 1 (45:39):
So we'll talk about that a different day.
Yeah, 100%, yeah, definitely.
You know when the book releases, I would love to have you back
on and we talk a little bitabout it.
I know you know, especially abook to really deep dive in some
of these topics, right, I thinkit'd be very dope to have that
(45:59):
conversation.
So we'd love to have you backon, and especially when their
book drops excellent.
Speaker 2 (46:05):
Thanks, man.
I appreciate it today and, andand you know what I think we're
gonna have you on the show too.
100, I would love it.
Speaker 1 (46:11):
I would love it.
Well, everybody, as you know,right playing injured.
Go follow quinn uh at effortover results on instagram.
Go to effort over resultscom.
Effort over results with uh,with uh Quinn on YouTube um,
effort over results everywhere.
So, quinn, we appreciate you.
(46:32):
Thank you, sir, have a great.
I love it.
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