February 4, 2025 • 24 mins
In this episode:
Discover the power of empathy in leadership with our insightful guest, Ellen Ramsey. As an associate professor from Lynn University, Ellen shares her journey into project management, revealing how authenticity and kindness can transform both professional and personal spheres. She speaks to the significance of vulnerability and connection, offering listeners a fresh perspective on fostering creativity and positivity within teams.
Throughout our conversation, we explore the challenges of communication in the workplace and how adaptability can create unexpected opportunities. We discuss favorite tools like Canva and empathy maps that streamline communication and inject creativity into design projects, encouraging us to work smarter, not harder.
Our discussion touches on building community within project management, emphasizing the vital role of sharing experiences and resources. By learning from each other, we can foster a sense of solidarity and motivation, ultimately growing into empowered leaders. Join us to uncover these insights and more, and remember to subscribe to the PM-Mastery Podcast for continued growth and community engagement.
Favorite Tools:
- Canva - https://www.canva.com/
- Canvas - https://www.instructure.com/canvas
- Empathy Maps - https://www.interaction-design.org/literature/article/empathy-map-why-and-how-to-use-it?
Links:
- Connect with Ellen on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ellenramseyphd/
- Ellen's Website: https://ellenramseyphd.com/
- Check out Ellen's PURE course: https://www.puremanagementalliance.com#675860294fa10
PM-Mastery Links:
- For a full podcast episode list, visit here: PM-Mastery Podcast Episodes.
- For a full list of blog posts, go here: PM-Mastery Blog Posts
- Become a PURE PM: https://pm-mastery.com/pure
- Check out Instructing.com for all your PM course needs: https://www.instructing.com/?ref=bd5e5c
- Get your free PDU Tracker here: https://pm-mastery.com/resource_links/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Intro/Outro (00:12):
Welcome to the PM Mastery Podcast.
This podcast is all abouthelping you master your project
management skills by sharingtips, tricks, tools and training
to get you to the next level,while sharing the stories of
other project managers on theirjourney in project management.
And now here's your host, waltSparling.
Walt Sparling (00:36):
Welcome everybody, to the current
edition of PM Mastery, and todaywe have with us Ellen Ramsey.
Welcome, Ellen.
Ellen Ramsey (00:44):
Thank you, Walt.
I'm really happy to be here.
Appreciate you asking me.
Walt Sparling (00:47):
Glad to have you on, so let's talk a little bit,
starting off with a little bitabout yourself.
Ellen Ramsey (00:55):
Okay, well, I've lived in South Florida since the
80s.
I'm aging myself.
I moved from the up north andso I've been in the Boca Raton,
delray Beach area for quite sometime.
My family and I did move to theOrlando area for my then
husband's job, and then we movedback about my daughter and I
(01:16):
back around 2019.
So I've been in that area towhere I also work at Lynn
University, but I was workingremotely, which I can get into
later.
But so I've done a lot ofdifferent things.
But a little bit about me.
I know people start with beingphilosophical, but I guess I
tend to think of myself as alifelong learner and how can I
(01:37):
be remembered?
As far as a legacy, maybe, thatI could leave behind someday,
many years from now, I hope.
But I do believe in the powerof connection, growth and
leadership and, beyond my work,I'm someone who values
authenticity and kindness andthat ripple effect that we have
from lifting others up.
Walt Sparling (01:56):
Awesome.
And so you work at a university, so you teach.
Ellen Ramsey (02:01):
I do.
I'm in the College of Businessand Management at Lynn
University.
It's a small private school,it's about 3,500 students now we
do have an international baseand I would gather around 500 or
so faculty and staff and so myrole there.
I have a couple of differenthats, but as far as being an
associate professor ofleadership and management, I'm
(02:22):
in that specialization where Iteach mostly our MBA students,
you know, with leadership andchange and management and
strategic management.
And then my undergrads are inbusiness strategy as well as
organizational behavior, and Iteach the capstone classes too.
So it's great to see thosestudents as they get to the end
(02:43):
of the program and what projectsthey'll create that way.
And my other role is an academicadministrator of adjunct
faculty and that's where I began, based on industry.
Over 30 years ago I was apart-time instructor, so I do
know what they might value whenI can teach them.
You know hands-on what wassomething that was necessary.
(03:04):
So, like they come to me withany issues or concerns and just
any positive things too, I do anewsletter for them so that they
feel valued and appreciated.
So just different things likethat.
I try to think outside the boxof what people might need, or
just positivity to encouragethem to tap into their own
creativity, which then alsohelps our students.
So it's like a win-win-win.
Walt Sparling (03:26):
So I was going to jump into the why, but you kind
of like explain the why just inyour chat there.
Ellen Ramsey (03:34):
That's the most I've talked all day, so I'll let
you lead.
Walt Sparling (03:37):
Well then you should.
Yeah, you're rested and readyto go, all right.
So you love helping others, youlove educating.
That's going to be part of yourlegacy many years from now.
Ellen Ramsey (03:49):
Many years from now.
Walt Sparling (03:50):
Yes, so we know you're an instructor and saying
you teach, but how do you keepup with your own learning?
You indicated earlier that youwere a lifelong learner, so what
are the resources you use tocontinue to learn?
Ellen Ramsey (04:04):
Yeah, I look, thank you.
I look at some of the journalsthat are in my profession.
I also go to Udemy or withLinkedIn premium, there are some
courses there that might be ofinterest.
I also attend conferences,whether they're virtual
sometimes that's at this pointin my life that's a good thing
to continue to find any.
(04:26):
Sometimes you're bombarded withemails, but if there's any
conferences that I canparticipate in or be at, it's
just helpful.
It's also a great networkingtool.
So that's a range of thingsthat I look through.
Walt Sparling (04:41):
So some of my favorites are also Udemy and
LinkedIn Learning.
I've been on LinkedIn, I think,for 20 years and 20 plus, and I
was about three years ago I hadlike 700 connections and I
thought I was like woohoo.
And then now with this, I'mgetting up there and my goal is
to grow as much as I can.
That's amazing and my goal isto grow as much as I can.
(05:02):
But it's amazing for networkingand connections and some of the
groups that we are both in isphenomenal people in there.
So I've got to meet a lot ofreally cool people.
Ellen Ramsey (05:18):
So you must have seen LinkedIn grow a lot over 20
years from where it is now.
Walt Sparling (05:24):
They've.
I don't know when you're in itall the time, the changes are
subtle, but some of the thingsis the way they've changed the
technology, like the learningthey got that from lyndacom and
LinkedIn is actually owned byMicrosoft, which I don't know if
(05:44):
a lot of people knew that.
It's an interesting changethere.
And then how you use the postsand how the groups operate.
That's changed over the years.
Ellen Ramsey (05:56):
I'm just learning that myself now.
It's almost like a differentlanguage to learn, having
certain people in a differentnetwork, because I have my
higher ed network and then Ihave project management network
and I have students.
So it actually does flow witheverything that I'm doing, which
maybe it's my mindset to seehow it weaves through, because
(06:18):
with our students it'sleadership and management and
obviously project management,but the principles and how I
like to lead with empatheticrigor.
And so I'm now delving intoempathetic leadership because we
all are vulnerable at differenttimes in our lives and there
might be people who might bequiet or they have something to
(06:39):
say.
And that's why, on teams, ifpeople, if you can read the room
and make sure people have theirvoice and it's a diverse group
and they feel comfortable doingso that just might have more of
that incentive to have thatinnovation spark.
Walt Sparling (06:53):
If they feel like that you know, I don't want to
say safe space, but just feelinglike their leaders respect them
and want to hear what they haveto say say and I'd love that
because I know when I left mylast job, when I was trying to
explain to my manager why I wasleaving, and this is something
I've learned over the years.
I don't know if I'm using theright terminology, but I say I'm
(07:16):
empathic because I'm veryempathetic.
You have to tell me if thewords are wrong, but empathy is
a big thing, so I can talk tosomeone and feel their emotions
and they affect me.
So when my team was happy, Iwas happy.
When my team was depressed, Iwould take that on and it would
change my mood.
Ellen Ramsey (07:36):
That's an empath, yeah, empath.
Walt Sparling (07:37):
Empath and I that's what I told him I believe
, and so he was like I think Ido and I go.
Well, this last year has kickedmy butt.
I, you know, I just I can'tcontinue like this.
My friends and family are allsaying you need to change jobs.
And I've let everyone else'sfrustration and anger and
whatever go into myself and Isaid I just can't be in this
(07:59):
environment anymore.
Ellen Ramsey (08:00):
Yeah, you have to separate it as much as you can.
But yeah, it's hard, it'seasier said than done,
especially when people arehurting.
That's a different, wholedifferent podcast, but physical
pain that you can't take awayfrom someone you know that's the
, that's the worst.
Walt Sparling (08:14):
But maybe I'll try.
I'll start one called theempathy factor.
Ellen Ramsey (08:17):
Yeah, that sounds good.
Walt Sparling (08:19):
All right.
So challenges with all the busystuff you're doing and the
various roles you, you got tohave some challenges.
Ellen Ramsey (08:29):
I do.
It's what I used to have was.
The funny thing is I alwaysprided myself on getting back to
students or staff via email.
I do teach remotely right nowand I do go.
I do go to campus for collegemeetings or different other
committees, but this has beenvery helpful for me.
(08:50):
But because we have the remotelearning with all different time
zones and the students you knowthey say students, but they
could be older than me or alsoin transition of work and they
need to know have a questionbefore they can continue on with
the assignment.
So I've always prided myself ongetting back too soon.
I got to the point where when Ididn't get back to someone in
(09:12):
two days, they wanted to makesure if I was OK, or actually a
day and a half, you know,because I set the bar high for
myself.
So my challenges are to, youknow, reset and recharge.
I just need to do that more andI have been doing that and it's
just like putting that, thatproverbial oxygen mask on first
(09:32):
and then you can take care ofother people.
So that's what I'm doing.
And sometimes challenges arecommunication, you know,
especially work.
We all know about communicationissues, whether emails, they
lack voice inflection, so youhave to kind of know what are
you making sure that?
who you're directing that tochallenge?
(09:53):
I might be too detailed, and inan email it's because, well,
there's no room for questioningI've got everyone to get what
they need.
So so you know it's, it's alearning curve at times, but I'm
always open to learning andchange.
You know, I am objective, mycourse evaluations are high, but
I get to look and see ifthere's something that I can
(10:15):
improve.
That's, you know, realistic,not like, oh, we don't like the
final paper.
Well, I can't, I can't changethat.
But you know, just make, makeadjustments where necessary.
And that's if they're inbusiness and they rather do a
project that relates to theirjob.
Or if they I had a student do aproject that relates to their
(10:36):
job.
Or if they I had a student, hewas a manager and he said I
really love this assignment, butcan I tweak it a little bit
because I'd love to have thisspecific topic to bring to my
team.
I said, absolutely, if it'sgoing to help you and we're in
the grading rubric, it's fine,because I rather you do it with
your passion rather than just agrade, so things like that when
I was in high school.
Walt Sparling (10:53):
I was, um, the scheduling software, whatever
was mixed, messed up and I gotput into a drawing class.
It was a drafting class and Iwas like I don't want to be in
this class, I want to be in adifferent class.
And they're like we'll sit inhere for a couple of weeks until
we can get things.
A lot of people got messed up,so I found out.
I really enjoyed it.
And so I found out I reallyenjoyed it and I was making like
(11:18):
great straight A's and theinstructor was very.
He didn't give a perfect gradenever gave a perfect grade and
he would sometimes go through mydrawings and he would scour
them and he'd get out amagnifying glass and he'd look
at the corners and go, oh, thisfillet isn't right, you know 98,
and I'll be like what.
But he was, he was awesomebecause he really motivated me.
That was a six or a half a termor two terms, and I went
(11:41):
through that term and then I waslike they're going to move me
to another class and I go no, Ilove this, I want to stay.
And the only other class theyhad was an advanced class that
another student was in and wenever met each other, but we
were always competing with whowas getting done first.
And when I got put in his class, him and I became best friends
and we flew by everybody in theclass and the teacher started
(12:02):
letting us do our own projects.
We built a little model homeand so it was really fun.
So his driving you knowperfection and perfectionist
type stuff really gave me anopportunity and that's how I
ended up where I did in theindustry.
Ellen Ramsey (12:16):
So we'll see.
What you said started like as amistake actually wasn't.
It was a reward.
So you never know where lifetakes us, where it's supposed to
be.
Walt Sparling (12:26):
So tools now for all these different things, and
I ask that because I happen tonotice one of your tools that
you listed was the empathy mapswhich we just talked about.
Empathy.
Ellen Ramsey (12:39):
Yeah, I remember having that activity for the
undergrads, but then we made ita little bit more advanced when
I say advanced more to alignwith the MBA, bloom's taxonomy
and all those fun words.
But what I like about theempathy map, we have a scenario,
whether it's an organization ora business, because we have
(13:02):
students also taking courses asan elective, but then it's also
their major, so I have them picksomething of interest and then
put themselves in that person'sshoes, that role, and they might
not do that in life normally.
And it's a great exercisebecause you know, people
sometimes don't think about whatsomeone might be going through
(13:25):
positive or negative and then ifyou just step outside of
yourself and into someone else'sshoes, like, say, walt, you
know what you've done, you knowand and then it's also a way of
finding out more things thatmight be of interest to you that
you never would have thought ofbefore.
That's, that's a real basicanswer to you, but you'll see
(13:45):
the intrinsic value of it.
Walt Sparling (13:49):
And then any other specific tools that you're
kind of your favorites.
Ellen Ramsey (13:54):
Well, one thing I'm doing and I know this is
more fun and design, and youknow, as we're talking now, I'm
sure there's another programthat's being made, but I happen
to enjoy Canva.
I create my newsletters withthat, just just at work.
You know, for the adjuncts Iswitched to bi-monthly, so every
two months now rather than oncea month, so I can get more time
(14:16):
for me to get my content in.
And then it's just morejam-packed versus having to,
because I think I'm like you.
I can see you give it more than100%, maybe 150%.
One issue I spent eight hourson.
I'm thinking, no, this is not agood value for my time, because
no one would know that.
(14:37):
It's just more detail, soworking smarter than harder at
times.
But yes, I like Canva.
We have, I like Studio for thevideos, for LMS is Canva Canvas.
So I know Canvas and Canva twodifferent things.
So we've used that, but I'mstill looking at other different
tools.
Do you have any that yourecommend that you like to
(15:00):
dabble in?
Walt Sparling (15:01):
Well, canva I just started using this year and
I talked to a bunch ofdifferent people who are doing
newsletters and art and Istarted doing so.
I looked at a bunch ofdifferent products and I ended
up getting Canva so I could docarousels and then, when I
looked at what the yearly costwas and some of the other
products, I decided to go withCanva.
And now I know there's so manyother possibilities I can do
(15:23):
with it.
It's just a matter of the time,because I've got my hands in 20
different things Daily.
I use my three, I would saythis, are Outlook, excel and
Snagit, and Snagit is a graphicsprogram.
You can do videos or orscreenshots with it, but you can
annotate the crap out of themand all these people are in
(15:46):
there using Microsoft snippetand they're doing stuff and they
go.
How do you?
Ellen Ramsey (15:48):
do that on yours.
Well, I just learned somethingI never knew about Snagit and
Excel and Outlook, or just youknow, daily.
I didn't think of those astools, but yeah, they're
constant In OneNote, In Outlook,are just you know daily.
Walt Sparling (15:57):
I didn't think of those as crudels.
Ellen Ramsey (15:58):
but yeah, they're constant In OneNote In.
Walt Sparling (16:00):
OneNote, yeah, which is going to go away, so
hopefully I'll be retired by thetime it does, but I've got so
much in it that some point downthe road are going to have to
probably convert it, so okay,okay, now, before we get to the
(16:23):
big question at the end.
I know that one of the reasonsI asked you to come on here was
that we are in a joint programand I've already had a couple of
podcast interviews out there onthe peer program I'm sorry,
peer project manager by the PeerManagement Alliance and you are
one of the instructors, so Iwas hoping you could share a
little bit about the course thatyou teach in the program.
Ellen Ramsey (16:44):
Sure.
Thank you again, walt.
Yeah, it's amazing how I cameacross being part of this
initiative and I'm very indebtedto Joe for taking me on.
I thought that was very nice ofhim.
We had a nice conversation withAmanda, so all went well with
that.
But what I did is try to thinkof, well, what could be of value
to anyone taking this programand all the several different
(17:08):
courses and mine is entitledInnovative Project Management
Empowering Leadership andEnhancing Team Dynamics and what
my course focuses on is thecreating that real, actionable
takeaways that the students orparticipants can connect.
On a personal level and I doencourage self-reflection, like
I do with our courses, you knowon my full-time job, but that
(17:30):
way is helping leaders discoverhow they can truly empower their
teams and lead with purpose.
And I do get into empatheticleadership as well.
You know how you can genuinelyconnect their teams and lead
with purpose, and I do get intoempathetic leadership as well.
You know how you can genuinelyconnect with teams on that human
level.
Walt Sparling (17:44):
I have not started yours yet, but I did see
the promo so I'm excited abouttaking that, and especially on
the empathy, empathy part.
Maybe I'll learn a littlesomething there.
How long is your course?
Ellen Ramsey (17:57):
Mine is about 35 hours.
I'm just kidding, it's notquite.
I think it's two hours andseven minutes.
Okay, the good news is I doknow that you can speed it up if
you so desire.
Walt Sparling (18:12):
Yes, I'm actually going to do an episode on tips
and tricks for people that aredoing it Some of the instructors
have we've been talking andtricks for people that are doing
it.
Some of the instructors havewe've been talking and we've all
created these different formsfor how to track your PDUs, your
hours, your time, how to sorteverything so you can take all
the small ones first and orgroup them by topic.
(18:33):
So I know at least two otherinstructors.
In fact, your friend Tanya hasalready created one.
She showed it to me last nightand then I told her about Brooks
, who created another one, andhim and I were collaborating on
that a little bit.
He did it all.
I just offered a couplesuggestions and I have a PDU
tracker on PM Master.
(18:54):
I've had it for years and I'mgoing to try to implement some
of what both of them have doneinto that so you can kind of
have a dedicated tab just forpure, because there's a lot to
it.
Ellen Ramsey (19:05):
That's a great idea.
Walt Sparling (19:05):
60 hours is a lot of PDUs.
Ellen Ramsey (19:07):
Absolutely no for sure, and I know this is a
serious topic and I made alittle joke there.
But I mean, you gave me an ideatoo of making possibly a little
toolkit or a PDF that could gowith this, like back in the day,
something called Cliff's notes.
I don't even know if that'sstill around, but you know,
after you go through it it'ssomething that you can look back
at.
You know, like when you havethose laminated little project
(19:29):
management.
Walt Sparling (19:32):
Yeah, you figure how how big PMI is and how it's
grown over the years and youthink, you know, with this
program, I think it's gonna, Ithink it's going to be amazing.
Ellen Ramsey (19:41):
So Absolutely, I do too.
And just the how I got startedwith project management, you
know we're always doing projectsand don't even realize the
actual.
The initiative did start withour university.
Our Dean actually actually thehigher eds with the
administration went to our deanto mention about how important
project management is.
(20:02):
So he wanted all of us, youknow, encouraged us all to get
our cap, them to start, and sowe had training and on the side
I actually invested in JoePhillips Joe's course, not even
knowing that that would havebeen something that I would be
part of.
And talking to him today, it'samazing where life takes you.
So the little stepping stone wasthrough our university and then
(20:25):
I didn't pass it the first time.
I do admit that because I toldthe dean sometimes I'm not a
great test taker but I was verydetermined for myself that it
wasn't a failure, it's anopportunity.
I just not to sound falsepositivity, but I said I'm not
going to allow that for myselfbecause I invested too much time
.
I finally took Joe's courseagain along with the other
(20:48):
training we had, and that's whatI felt got me through it.
And I was so happily surprisedwhen on the screen it pops up
that you pass actually sat thereto say print that out.
I need to make sure that mydean knows that I passed so
anyway.
After that, it's just you'realways a lifelong learner.
Even though I have a PhD.
There's things that you canlearn, and obviously project
(21:11):
management.
Several years back was you knowthe principles and the key
components, so that's what gotme involved and I haven't looked
back as far as how I apply thisto my courses and to other
areas of of my life.
Walt Sparling (21:25):
Awesome.
So I'm looking forward to thatcourse and many, many more, and
we're going to get to your lastand final question, which is do
you have a?
Did you know that you can share?
Ellen Ramsey (21:41):
I do, and hopefully people will enjoy this
one.
Because let's see, do you know,geese fly in a V formation
because it makes flying 70%easier.
It's perfect example ofteamwork, because that's when
one leads, the others benefitand when they get tired they
switch.
So we can also use this as akind of a dynamic to help teams
(22:04):
create where everyone can belifted up.
So next time you look up in thesky, see that V versus any S's
or other shapes yeah, the V isdoing much better.
Yes.
Walt Sparling (22:18):
Awesome.
It kind of makes me think ofaerodynamics.
Things are pointed and it kindof flows air and water and all
that.
Ellen Ramsey (22:26):
I find I know we're getting off track, but I
love nature.
I don't know, as I'm gettingolder, I'm appreciating more,
just nature how you can justreset and how geese do that on
their own a V formation.
You can just reset, and howgeese do that on their own a v
formation.
I mean, you know, it's just,and we do that with technology
or, as you said, robotics orwhatever it be.
This is uh, nature doing whatworks well well, I appreciate
(22:49):
you coming on.
Walt Sparling (22:51):
I I will add some links in the show notes,
hopefully a link to your courseson pure or course on pure and
uh.
Share your LinkedIn profile Ifyou don't mind for people to
connect with you.
Ellen Ramsey (23:04):
Absolutely.
I was going to thank you forthat and also I hope there were
some good takeaways and the mainpart is having some value here
and, uh, I'm always eager toconnect with anyone who might
like to talk further about othertopics.
Walt Sparling (23:19):
No, I love it and that's kind of my goal when I
started this was to connectpeople in the in the community.
They don't have to be a projectmanager, but if they're in
project management in some formand we can all learn from each
other, and part that's part ofthe reason why I share the tools
and challenges, so that otherpeople say or see that, hey, I'm
(23:41):
not alone.
Ellen Ramsey (23:42):
Absolutely, that's true, and hopefully, at the end
of when all is said and done,if you think about what makes
you get up in the morning tojust feel what drives your
energy.
So hopefully, whatever you'vetaken life as far as channeling
passion and growing into aleader is whatever can be the
best.
So thank you again for yourtime and what you do for other
(24:05):
people.
Walt Sparling (24:06):
I appreciate that .
Thank you and for everyone else, we will see you on the next
episode of PM Mastery.
Intro/Outro (24:11):
Thanks for listening to the PM Mastery
podcast at wwwpm-masterycom.
Be sure to subscribe in yourpodcast player.
Until next time, keep workingon your craft.
Welcome to the PM Mastery Podcast.
This podcast is all abouthelping you master your project
management skills by sharingtips, tricks, tools and training
to get you to the next level,while sharing the stories of
other project managers on theirjourney in project management.
And now here's your host, waltSparling.
Walt Sparling (00:36):
Welcome everybody, to the current
edition of PM Mastery, and todaywe have with us Ellen Ramsey.
Welcome, Ellen.
Ellen Ramsey (00:44):
Thank you, Walt.
I'm really happy to be here.
Appreciate you asking me.
Walt Sparling (00:47):
Glad to have you on, so let's talk a little bit,
starting off with a little bitabout yourself.
Ellen Ramsey (00:55):
Okay, well, I've lived in South Florida since the
80s.
I'm aging myself.
I moved from the up north andso I've been in the Boca Raton,
delray Beach area for quite sometime.
My family and I did move to theOrlando area for my then
husband's job, and then we movedback about my daughter and I
(01:16):
back around 2019.
So I've been in that area towhere I also work at Lynn
University, but I was workingremotely, which I can get into
later.
But so I've done a lot ofdifferent things.
But a little bit about me.
I know people start with beingphilosophical, but I guess I
tend to think of myself as alifelong learner and how can I
(01:37):
be remembered?
As far as a legacy, maybe, thatI could leave behind someday,
many years from now, I hope.
But I do believe in the powerof connection, growth and
leadership and, beyond my work,I'm someone who values
authenticity and kindness andthat ripple effect that we have
from lifting others up.
Walt Sparling (01:56):
Awesome.
And so you work at a university, so you teach.
Ellen Ramsey (02:01):
I do.
I'm in the College of Businessand Management at Lynn
University.
It's a small private school,it's about 3,500 students now we
do have an international baseand I would gather around 500 or
so faculty and staff and so myrole there.
I have a couple of differenthats, but as far as being an
associate professor ofleadership and management, I'm
(02:22):
in that specialization where Iteach mostly our MBA students,
you know, with leadership andchange and management and
strategic management.
And then my undergrads are inbusiness strategy as well as
organizational behavior, and Iteach the capstone classes too.
So it's great to see thosestudents as they get to the end
(02:43):
of the program and what projectsthey'll create that way.
And my other role is an academicadministrator of adjunct
faculty and that's where I began, based on industry.
Over 30 years ago I was apart-time instructor, so I do
know what they might value whenI can teach them.
You know hands-on what wassomething that was necessary.
(03:04):
So, like they come to me withany issues or concerns and just
any positive things too, I do anewsletter for them so that they
feel valued and appreciated.
So just different things likethat.
I try to think outside the boxof what people might need, or
just positivity to encouragethem to tap into their own
creativity, which then alsohelps our students.
So it's like a win-win-win.
Walt Sparling (03:26):
So I was going to jump into the why, but you kind
of like explain the why just inyour chat there.
Ellen Ramsey (03:34):
That's the most I've talked all day, so I'll let
you lead.
Walt Sparling (03:37):
Well then you should.
Yeah, you're rested and readyto go, all right.
So you love helping others, youlove educating.
That's going to be part of yourlegacy many years from now.
Ellen Ramsey (03:49):
Many years from now.
Walt Sparling (03:50):
Yes, so we know you're an instructor and saying
you teach, but how do you keepup with your own learning?
You indicated earlier that youwere a lifelong learner, so what
are the resources you use tocontinue to learn?
Ellen Ramsey (04:04):
Yeah, I look, thank you.
I look at some of the journalsthat are in my profession.
I also go to Udemy or withLinkedIn premium, there are some
courses there that might be ofinterest.
I also attend conferences,whether they're virtual
sometimes that's at this pointin my life that's a good thing
to continue to find any.
(04:26):
Sometimes you're bombarded withemails, but if there's any
conferences that I canparticipate in or be at, it's
just helpful.
It's also a great networkingtool.
So that's a range of thingsthat I look through.
Walt Sparling (04:41):
So some of my favorites are also Udemy and
LinkedIn Learning.
I've been on LinkedIn, I think,for 20 years and 20 plus, and I
was about three years ago I hadlike 700 connections and I
thought I was like woohoo.
And then now with this, I'mgetting up there and my goal is
to grow as much as I can.
That's amazing and my goal isto grow as much as I can.
(05:02):
But it's amazing for networkingand connections and some of the
groups that we are both in isphenomenal people in there.
So I've got to meet a lot ofreally cool people.
Ellen Ramsey (05:18):
So you must have seen LinkedIn grow a lot over 20
years from where it is now.
Walt Sparling (05:24):
They've.
I don't know when you're in itall the time, the changes are
subtle, but some of the thingsis the way they've changed the
technology, like the learningthey got that from lyndacom and
LinkedIn is actually owned byMicrosoft, which I don't know if
(05:44):
a lot of people knew that.
It's an interesting changethere.
And then how you use the postsand how the groups operate.
That's changed over the years.
Ellen Ramsey (05:56):
I'm just learning that myself now.
It's almost like a differentlanguage to learn, having
certain people in a differentnetwork, because I have my
higher ed network and then Ihave project management network
and I have students.
So it actually does flow witheverything that I'm doing, which
maybe it's my mindset to seehow it weaves through, because
(06:18):
with our students it'sleadership and management and
obviously project management,but the principles and how I
like to lead with empatheticrigor.
And so I'm now delving intoempathetic leadership because we
all are vulnerable at differenttimes in our lives and there
might be people who might bequiet or they have something to
(06:39):
say.
And that's why, on teams, ifpeople, if you can read the room
and make sure people have theirvoice and it's a diverse group
and they feel comfortable doingso that just might have more of
that incentive to have thatinnovation spark.
Walt Sparling (06:53):
If they feel like that you know, I don't want to
say safe space, but just feelinglike their leaders respect them
and want to hear what they haveto say say and I'd love that
because I know when I left mylast job, when I was trying to
explain to my manager why I wasleaving, and this is something
I've learned over the years.
I don't know if I'm using theright terminology, but I say I'm
(07:16):
empathic because I'm veryempathetic.
You have to tell me if thewords are wrong, but empathy is
a big thing, so I can talk tosomeone and feel their emotions
and they affect me.
So when my team was happy, Iwas happy.
When my team was depressed, Iwould take that on and it would
change my mood.
Ellen Ramsey (07:36):
That's an empath, yeah, empath.
Walt Sparling (07:37):
Empath and I that's what I told him I believe
, and so he was like I think Ido and I go.
Well, this last year has kickedmy butt.
I, you know, I just I can'tcontinue like this.
My friends and family are allsaying you need to change jobs.
And I've let everyone else'sfrustration and anger and
whatever go into myself and Isaid I just can't be in this
(07:59):
environment anymore.
Ellen Ramsey (08:00):
Yeah, you have to separate it as much as you can.
But yeah, it's hard, it'seasier said than done,
especially when people arehurting.
That's a different, wholedifferent podcast, but physical
pain that you can't take awayfrom someone you know that's the
, that's the worst.
Walt Sparling (08:14):
But maybe I'll try.
I'll start one called theempathy factor.
Ellen Ramsey (08:17):
Yeah, that sounds good.
Walt Sparling (08:19):
All right.
So challenges with all the busystuff you're doing and the
various roles you, you got tohave some challenges.
Ellen Ramsey (08:29):
I do.
It's what I used to have was.
The funny thing is I alwaysprided myself on getting back to
students or staff via email.
I do teach remotely right nowand I do go.
I do go to campus for collegemeetings or different other
committees, but this has beenvery helpful for me.
(08:50):
But because we have the remotelearning with all different time
zones and the students you knowthey say students, but they
could be older than me or alsoin transition of work and they
need to know have a questionbefore they can continue on with
the assignment.
So I've always prided myself ongetting back too soon.
I got to the point where when Ididn't get back to someone in
(09:12):
two days, they wanted to makesure if I was OK, or actually a
day and a half, you know,because I set the bar high for
myself.
So my challenges are to, youknow, reset and recharge.
I just need to do that more andI have been doing that and it's
just like putting that, thatproverbial oxygen mask on first
(09:32):
and then you can take care ofother people.
So that's what I'm doing.
And sometimes challenges arecommunication, you know,
especially work.
We all know about communicationissues, whether emails, they
lack voice inflection, so youhave to kind of know what are
you making sure that?
who you're directing that tochallenge?
(09:53):
I might be too detailed, and inan email it's because, well,
there's no room for questioningI've got everyone to get what
they need.
So so you know it's, it's alearning curve at times, but I'm
always open to learning andchange.
You know, I am objective, mycourse evaluations are high, but
I get to look and see ifthere's something that I can
(10:15):
improve.
That's, you know, realistic,not like, oh, we don't like the
final paper.
Well, I can't, I can't changethat.
But you know, just make, makeadjustments where necessary.
And that's if they're inbusiness and they rather do a
project that relates to theirjob.
Or if they I had a student do aproject that relates to their
(10:36):
job.
Or if they I had a student, hewas a manager and he said I
really love this assignment, butcan I tweak it a little bit
because I'd love to have thisspecific topic to bring to my
team.
I said, absolutely, if it'sgoing to help you and we're in
the grading rubric, it's fine,because I rather you do it with
your passion rather than just agrade, so things like that when
I was in high school.
Walt Sparling (10:53):
I was, um, the scheduling software, whatever
was mixed, messed up and I gotput into a drawing class.
It was a drafting class and Iwas like I don't want to be in
this class, I want to be in adifferent class.
And they're like we'll sit inhere for a couple of weeks until
we can get things.
A lot of people got messed up,so I found out.
I really enjoyed it.
And so I found out I reallyenjoyed it and I was making like
(11:18):
great straight A's and theinstructor was very.
He didn't give a perfect gradenever gave a perfect grade and
he would sometimes go through mydrawings and he would scour
them and he'd get out amagnifying glass and he'd look
at the corners and go, oh, thisfillet isn't right, you know 98,
and I'll be like what.
But he was, he was awesomebecause he really motivated me.
That was a six or a half a termor two terms, and I went
(11:41):
through that term and then I waslike they're going to move me
to another class and I go no, Ilove this, I want to stay.
And the only other class theyhad was an advanced class that
another student was in and wenever met each other, but we
were always competing with whowas getting done first.
And when I got put in his class, him and I became best friends
and we flew by everybody in theclass and the teacher started
(12:02):
letting us do our own projects.
We built a little model homeand so it was really fun.
So his driving you knowperfection and perfectionist
type stuff really gave me anopportunity and that's how I
ended up where I did in theindustry.
Ellen Ramsey (12:16):
So we'll see.
What you said started like as amistake actually wasn't.
It was a reward.
So you never know where lifetakes us, where it's supposed to
be.
Walt Sparling (12:26):
So tools now for all these different things, and
I ask that because I happen tonotice one of your tools that
you listed was the empathy mapswhich we just talked about.
Empathy.
Ellen Ramsey (12:39):
Yeah, I remember having that activity for the
undergrads, but then we made ita little bit more advanced when
I say advanced more to alignwith the MBA, bloom's taxonomy
and all those fun words.
But what I like about theempathy map, we have a scenario,
whether it's an organization ora business, because we have
(13:02):
students also taking courses asan elective, but then it's also
their major, so I have them picksomething of interest and then
put themselves in that person'sshoes, that role, and they might
not do that in life normally.
And it's a great exercisebecause you know, people
sometimes don't think about whatsomeone might be going through
(13:25):
positive or negative and then ifyou just step outside of
yourself and into someone else'sshoes, like, say, walt, you
know what you've done, you knowand and then it's also a way of
finding out more things thatmight be of interest to you that
you never would have thought ofbefore.
That's, that's a real basicanswer to you, but you'll see
(13:45):
the intrinsic value of it.
Walt Sparling (13:49):
And then any other specific tools that you're
kind of your favorites.
Ellen Ramsey (13:54):
Well, one thing I'm doing and I know this is
more fun and design, and youknow, as we're talking now, I'm
sure there's another programthat's being made, but I happen
to enjoy Canva.
I create my newsletters withthat, just just at work.
You know, for the adjuncts Iswitched to bi-monthly, so every
two months now rather than oncea month, so I can get more time
(14:16):
for me to get my content in.
And then it's just morejam-packed versus having to,
because I think I'm like you.
I can see you give it more than100%, maybe 150%.
One issue I spent eight hourson.
I'm thinking, no, this is not agood value for my time, because
no one would know that.
(14:37):
It's just more detail, soworking smarter than harder at
times.
But yes, I like Canva.
We have, I like Studio for thevideos, for LMS is Canva Canvas.
So I know Canvas and Canva twodifferent things.
So we've used that, but I'mstill looking at other different
tools.
Do you have any that yourecommend that you like to
(15:00):
dabble in?
Walt Sparling (15:01):
Well, canva I just started using this year and
I talked to a bunch ofdifferent people who are doing
newsletters and art and Istarted doing so.
I looked at a bunch ofdifferent products and I ended
up getting Canva so I could docarousels and then, when I
looked at what the yearly costwas and some of the other
products, I decided to go withCanva.
And now I know there's so manyother possibilities I can do
(15:23):
with it.
It's just a matter of the time,because I've got my hands in 20
different things Daily.
I use my three, I would saythis, are Outlook, excel and
Snagit, and Snagit is a graphicsprogram.
You can do videos or orscreenshots with it, but you can
annotate the crap out of themand all these people are in
(15:46):
there using Microsoft snippetand they're doing stuff and they
go.
How do you?
Ellen Ramsey (15:48):
do that on yours.
Well, I just learned somethingI never knew about Snagit and
Excel and Outlook, or just youknow, daily.
I didn't think of those astools, but yeah, they're
constant In OneNote, In Outlook,are just you know daily.
Walt Sparling (15:57):
I didn't think of those as crudels.
Ellen Ramsey (15:58):
but yeah, they're constant In OneNote In.
Walt Sparling (16:00):
OneNote, yeah, which is going to go away, so
hopefully I'll be retired by thetime it does, but I've got so
much in it that some point downthe road are going to have to
probably convert it, so okay,okay, now, before we get to the
(16:23):
big question at the end.
I know that one of the reasonsI asked you to come on here was
that we are in a joint programand I've already had a couple of
podcast interviews out there onthe peer program I'm sorry,
peer project manager by the PeerManagement Alliance and you are
one of the instructors, so Iwas hoping you could share a
little bit about the course thatyou teach in the program.
Ellen Ramsey (16:44):
Sure.
Thank you again, walt.
Yeah, it's amazing how I cameacross being part of this
initiative and I'm very indebtedto Joe for taking me on.
I thought that was very nice ofhim.
We had a nice conversation withAmanda, so all went well with
that.
But what I did is try to thinkof, well, what could be of value
to anyone taking this programand all the several different
(17:08):
courses and mine is entitledInnovative Project Management
Empowering Leadership andEnhancing Team Dynamics and what
my course focuses on is thecreating that real, actionable
takeaways that the students orparticipants can connect.
On a personal level and I doencourage self-reflection, like
I do with our courses, you knowon my full-time job, but that
(17:30):
way is helping leaders discoverhow they can truly empower their
teams and lead with purpose.
And I do get into empatheticleadership as well.
You know how you can genuinelyconnect their teams and lead
with purpose, and I do get intoempathetic leadership as well.
You know how you can genuinelyconnect with teams on that human
level.
Walt Sparling (17:44):
I have not started yours yet, but I did see
the promo so I'm excited abouttaking that, and especially on
the empathy, empathy part.
Maybe I'll learn a littlesomething there.
How long is your course?
Ellen Ramsey (17:57):
Mine is about 35 hours.
I'm just kidding, it's notquite.
I think it's two hours andseven minutes.
Okay, the good news is I doknow that you can speed it up if
you so desire.
Walt Sparling (18:12):
Yes, I'm actually going to do an episode on tips
and tricks for people that aredoing it Some of the instructors
have we've been talking andtricks for people that are doing
it.
Some of the instructors havewe've been talking and we've all
created these different formsfor how to track your PDUs, your
hours, your time, how to sorteverything so you can take all
the small ones first and orgroup them by topic.
(18:33):
So I know at least two otherinstructors.
In fact, your friend Tanya hasalready created one.
She showed it to me last nightand then I told her about Brooks
, who created another one, andhim and I were collaborating on
that a little bit.
He did it all.
I just offered a couplesuggestions and I have a PDU
tracker on PM Master.
(18:54):
I've had it for years and I'mgoing to try to implement some
of what both of them have doneinto that so you can kind of
have a dedicated tab just forpure, because there's a lot to
it.
Ellen Ramsey (19:05):
That's a great idea.
Walt Sparling (19:05):
60 hours is a lot of PDUs.
Ellen Ramsey (19:07):
Absolutely no for sure, and I know this is a
serious topic and I made alittle joke there.
But I mean, you gave me an ideatoo of making possibly a little
toolkit or a PDF that could gowith this, like back in the day,
something called Cliff's notes.
I don't even know if that'sstill around, but you know,
after you go through it it'ssomething that you can look back
at.
You know, like when you havethose laminated little project
(19:29):
management.
Walt Sparling (19:32):
Yeah, you figure how how big PMI is and how it's
grown over the years and youthink, you know, with this
program, I think it's gonna, Ithink it's going to be amazing.
Ellen Ramsey (19:41):
So Absolutely, I do too.
And just the how I got startedwith project management, you
know we're always doing projectsand don't even realize the
actual.
The initiative did start withour university.
Our Dean actually actually thehigher eds with the
administration went to our deanto mention about how important
project management is.
(20:02):
So he wanted all of us, youknow, encouraged us all to get
our cap, them to start, and sowe had training and on the side
I actually invested in JoePhillips Joe's course, not even
knowing that that would havebeen something that I would be
part of.
And talking to him today, it'samazing where life takes you.
So the little stepping stone wasthrough our university and then
(20:25):
I didn't pass it the first time.
I do admit that because I toldthe dean sometimes I'm not a
great test taker but I was verydetermined for myself that it
wasn't a failure, it's anopportunity.
I just not to sound falsepositivity, but I said I'm not
going to allow that for myselfbecause I invested too much time
.
I finally took Joe's courseagain along with the other
(20:48):
training we had, and that's whatI felt got me through it.
And I was so happily surprisedwhen on the screen it pops up
that you pass actually sat thereto say print that out.
I need to make sure that mydean knows that I passed so
anyway.
After that, it's just you'realways a lifelong learner.
Even though I have a PhD.
There's things that you canlearn, and obviously project
(21:11):
management.
Several years back was you knowthe principles and the key
components, so that's what gotme involved and I haven't looked
back as far as how I apply thisto my courses and to other
areas of of my life.
Walt Sparling (21:25):
Awesome.
So I'm looking forward to thatcourse and many, many more, and
we're going to get to your lastand final question, which is do
you have a?
Did you know that you can share?
Ellen Ramsey (21:41):
I do, and hopefully people will enjoy this
one.
Because let's see, do you know,geese fly in a V formation
because it makes flying 70%easier.
It's perfect example ofteamwork, because that's when
one leads, the others benefitand when they get tired they
switch.
So we can also use this as akind of a dynamic to help teams
(22:04):
create where everyone can belifted up.
So next time you look up in thesky, see that V versus any S's
or other shapes yeah, the V isdoing much better.
Yes.
Walt Sparling (22:18):
Awesome.
It kind of makes me think ofaerodynamics.
Things are pointed and it kindof flows air and water and all
that.
Ellen Ramsey (22:26):
I find I know we're getting off track, but I
love nature.
I don't know, as I'm gettingolder, I'm appreciating more,
just nature how you can justreset and how geese do that on
their own a V formation.
You can just reset, and howgeese do that on their own a v
formation.
I mean, you know, it's just,and we do that with technology
or, as you said, robotics orwhatever it be.
This is uh, nature doing whatworks well well, I appreciate
(22:49):
you coming on.
Walt Sparling (22:51):
I I will add some links in the show notes,
hopefully a link to your courseson pure or course on pure and
uh.
Share your LinkedIn profile Ifyou don't mind for people to
connect with you.
Ellen Ramsey (23:04):
Absolutely.
I was going to thank you forthat and also I hope there were
some good takeaways and the mainpart is having some value here
and, uh, I'm always eager toconnect with anyone who might
like to talk further about othertopics.
Walt Sparling (23:19):
No, I love it and that's kind of my goal when I
started this was to connectpeople in the in the community.
They don't have to be a projectmanager, but if they're in
project management in some formand we can all learn from each
other, and part that's part ofthe reason why I share the tools
and challenges, so that otherpeople say or see that, hey, I'm
(23:41):
not alone.
Ellen Ramsey (23:42):
Absolutely, that's true, and hopefully, at the end
of when all is said and done,if you think about what makes
you get up in the morning tojust feel what drives your
energy.
So hopefully, whatever you'vetaken life as far as channeling
passion and growing into aleader is whatever can be the
best.
So thank you again for yourtime and what you do for other
(24:05):
people.
Walt Sparling (24:06):
I appreciate that .
Thank you and for everyone else, we will see you on the next
episode of PM Mastery.
Intro/Outro (24:11):
Thanks for listening to the PM Mastery
podcast at wwwpm-masterycom.
Be sure to subscribe in yourpodcast player.
Until next time, keep workingon your craft.
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