September 23, 2025 • 53 mins
Ever wonder how someone becomes a successful project manager? Walt Sparling's remarkable journey from an accidental drafting student to a cross-industry PM expert reveals the unexpected path many professionals take into this dynamic field.
This is a unique episode where Walt, the host of the PM-Mastery podcast, let a former guest and friend interview him. During this interview, we discussed future goals of meeting each other in person, but due to the delayed posting of this episode, it actually happened, and Tanya was a guest at a milestone birthday party of mine this past summer. It was awesome to meet in person and finally create that personal bond that we had been building over the last couple of years.
Walt's story begins with childhood dreams of architecture that took a detour when an eye injury ended his military aspirations. From there, his career winds through mechanical engineering firms, an IT startup, and eventually into architectural project management. What makes his perspective so valuable is how each role built upon the last, creating a uniquely qualified professional who understands the complex connections that link different technical disciplines.
Throughout the conversation with host Tanya Boyd, Walt emphasizes how communication became his superpower. "If your attention to detail is good, you manage time well, and you're a great communicator—you can work in multiple industries," he explains. This insight reveals that successful project managers don't necessarily possess deep technical expertise in one area, but rather possess the ability to facilitate understanding among specialists and guide teams towards shared goals through influence rather than authority.
The discussion takes fascinating turns through Walt's PM Mastery podcast creation during COVID, his involvement with a men's mastermind group, and his role as an instructor for the Pure Project Manager credential. This innovative program brings together over 20 industry experts, each teaching their specialty rather than having "one person talk about 15 different topics." The result is practical, specialized knowledge from professionals passionate about their focus areas.
Whether you're an aspiring project manager curious about the field, a seasoned PM looking to broaden your perspective, or someone considering a career pivot, Walt's story demonstrates how adaptability, communication skills, and a willingness to learn can create opportunities across industries. Ready to take your project management skills to the next level? This episode provides both inspiration and practical insights to help you on your journey.
PM-Mastery Links:
- For a full podcast episode list, visit here: PM-Mastery Podcast Episodes.
- For a full list of blog posts, go here: PM-Mastery Blog Posts
- Become a PURE PM: https://pm-mastery.com/pure
- Check out Instructing.com for all your PM course needs: https://www.instructing.com/?ref=bd5e5c
- Get your free PDU Tracker here: https://pm-mastery.com/resource_links/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Intro/Outro (00:12):
Welcome to the PM Mastery Podcast.
This podcast is all abouthelping you master your project
management skills by sharingtips, tricks, tools and training
to get you to the next level,while sharing the stories of
other project managers on theirjourney in project management.
And now here's your host.
Tanya Boyd (00:33):
Hi, this is Tanya Boyd, and I'm hosting Walt
Sparling on his podcast, pmMastery today.
Both Walt and I are instructorswith the Pure Project Manager
credential and we're here totalk a little bit about how he
got involved in this and giveyou a little bit backstory into
who Walt is and how he gotstarted.
(00:54):
So thank you for allowing me tointerview you today, Walt.
How are you doing today?
Walt Sparling (00:59):
I'm doing great.
This is fun.
It's nice to be on the otherside of the table occasionally.
Tanya Boyd (01:04):
Absolutely.
You got to flip the screwssometimes.
So just tell me something alittle bit fun about your
hobbies and interests outside ofwork before we get into
everything.
Project manager-y.
Walt Sparling (01:14):
Well, sadly, project management is a little
bit of my hobby becauseobviously the podcast, the
website, so I do that when I'mnot working and then I do
project management when I work.
Other than that, I belong to amen's mastermind and we get
together and we do planninggoals and we do presentations
(01:39):
and it's kind of a success groupto help men grow and succeed in
different areas of their life.
So that's another thing I doevery three weeks and then I do,
like occasional, bourbon andcigars.
Tanya Boyd (02:00):
That sounds good.
So how long have you beeninvolved in the Men's Mastermind
?
For how many years now?
Walt Sparling (02:06):
We're coming up, I think, on the eighth year.
It's been crazy and we do a bigretreat every year, which we
didn't do this year.
There was all the storms andstuff that happened down here.
Everyone had damage and we kindof put it on the back burner.
We had hoped to schedule onelate and that didn't happen, so
we missed out this year.
Tanya Boyd (02:29):
So that was for 2025 , or do you have any plans to do
it later in 2025?
Walt Sparling (02:34):
We usually do it the last month.
So we do it the first weekendof December every year.
The weather's good and weusually find a big house
somewhere and it's usually eightor nine, sometimes 10 guys.
But this year half of thepeople had damage and were, you
know, had issues that they hadto get through.
(02:55):
So we tried to set it up inMarch and then some other things
happened and that didn't happen.
So we'll go back to our normalroutine and pick up again in 25
and do on, hopefully to ournormal schedule, which will be
the first week of December.
Tanya Boyd (03:12):
Well, hopefully Mother Nature plays a little bit
nicer this year.
I mean, even in projectmanagement, those enterprise
environmental factors it'ssomething that you know is a
risk of happening, but you cannever completely plan for it
when it does happen.
So I want to dive into yourwork history a little bit.
So you're just going throughyour LinkedIn, it looks like
(03:35):
you've got a diverse history inmechanical engineering and
architecture, so tell me how,from that, you evolved into
project management.
Walt Sparling (03:44):
All right, I'll try to make this short, but it's
been a career-long journey.
I started out wanting to be anarchitect when I was a kid.
Actually, I got put in adrafting class by accident and I
really loved it.
So I started drawing.
I was making straight A's, Iwas doing great.
I said, well, this is easy andfun.
(04:05):
So I decided I was going to bean architect.
But I went in the militarybecause I had also been in ROTC
and two weeks after I enlisted,of course I wanted to go in and
be like a naval architect youknow, do ships and all that and
my dad's like, no, you got to gointo technology.
And my dad's like, no, yougotta go into technology.
(04:30):
So, uh, anyway, I got injuredoutside.
I did an early enlistment, umwas injured on a weekend, lost
my eye, one of my eyes, my righteye and uh, they discharged me.
So I had spent years in rtccivil air patrol all getting
ready to go in the service.
I was already enlisted and twoweeks after I was out.
So I'm like all right.
I got out of the hospital, aschool called say hey, we're
(04:52):
looking at your grades.
You seem really good indrafting.
So I went to a school in Tampa,got out of there, couldn't find
a job right away with anarchitect, started with a
mechanical engineering firm as adrafter, really enjoyed that,
spent quite a few years doingthat and then transitioned.
I went back to school to try toget my degree for to become an
(05:15):
architect and during that time Iworked at another mechanical
firm and then I was doing a lotof IT stuff on the side, helping
firms, and I ended up startingan IT company.
So I left the mechanical roleand did this IT company for
(05:35):
about six years, hit a downturnin the economy, I had to let go
of a couple people and then allthe work work that I was trying
to get came in and it was justme and I was freaked out.
I sold the company to someone Iknew who was working with
another IT company and I went towork for a client and did ITs a
(06:00):
little bit more.
Then I went back and got a jobwith an architect doing actual
architectural work and that wasmy first title as a project
manager.
I mean, all the work I did hadproject management duties
related, but it never had thetitle, and so that was my first
title job and then I left therewhen the owner passed away a few
(06:21):
years after I was there, sowent to another architectural
firm passed away a few yearsafter I was there, so went to
another architectural firm andthen from there things didn't
work out.
Went to back to a mechanicalfirm, then an electrical firm
and then someone approached meand poached me from that one to
(06:41):
go to another electrical firm,poached me from that one to go
to another electrical firm.
So I've done architectural,mechanical, electrical plumbing.
The only thing I never reallydid much of is fire protection.
But so I'm very versed in thedesign portion because I've
(07:01):
spent almost well 30 years onthat side.
And my last job I was workingwith an electrical engineering
firm.
I knew the owner was going tobe retiring soon and I just
couldn't imagine me going backat the current age.
I was then back as a designersomewhere else and, uh, I
decided to go full out onproject management.
Get my pmp uh, learn more aboutthe formal side of it instead
(07:26):
of just the you know theeveryday that we did.
You know the accidental projectmanagers.
Tanya Boyd (07:35):
Right right.
Walt Sparling (07:36):
So during that process a friend of mine was a
PM and she said they werelooking for a PM at her firm and
it was a senior level.
And I'm like I it's not me, I'mstill, you know, kind of
learning the ropes.
And she said some veryflowerful words and said send
your resume.
So I did, I got hired and overseven years I worked my way up
(08:00):
through that to the team leadposition and then a regional
lead and then left there earlylast year and transitioned to a
new account Same role owner'srep, owner's rep slash project
manager in working onconstruction projects.
So it's been eight years withthis firm and probably a total
(08:26):
of 15 years doing projectmanagement officially.
Tanya Boyd (08:30):
I wanted to backtrack a little bit over some
of just the different story andthe different pieces of the
story that you've told me.
So first wanted to start bysaying thank you for your
service.
I know you admitted that youwere just it was honorable
discharge due to an injury, butI still want to acknowledge that
because I think the thought,the heart and the intent was all
(08:52):
there.
You know, and, that being said,even the resilience and
adaptability and going into allof these different roles, how
challenging was it for you toadapt to all those changes of
those different roles and whatwere some of the things in the
mindset that got you throughthose different periods?
Walt Sparling (09:15):
It's interesting.
I mean, I had to adapt when Ihad planned for years to go in
the military and then get inyou're sworn in, that's your
future and then to have thatcrushed in a couple weeks.
I put me in kind of a tailspinand then when the school
approached, that gave me alittle bit of brightness.
So went to school, got to moveaway from home and go out of
(09:38):
town into the big city, and somy whole life has been, you know
, one challenge after another,and not negative challenges,
some are negative, some arepositive.
But transitioning to when Icouldn't find a job with an
architectural firm.
I didn't have enough experience, no one wanted to take a chance
(09:59):
on me.
I found a mechanical firm thatdid, and they were super happy
they did, and so was I.
I learned a mechanical firmthat did, and they were super
happy they did, and so was I.
I learned a lot there.
When I left there, it wasbecause I decided to go back to
school, and so it wasn't one ofthose things where I lost the
(10:19):
job.
It was just hey, if I want togo back to school, I need to
spend time job.
It was just a hey, if I want togo back to school.
I need to spend time.
I need to move back homebecause I'm not going to be able
to afford to work and go toschool.
But I worked weekends.
I'd go back to Tampa and workon the weekend, stay with a
friend, then I'd go back toschool during the week, and I
did that for a while.
The company got really slow.
(10:42):
They didn't have any weekendwork for me, so I had to find
another job.
So I struggled for a littlewhile and I found another
mechanical job.
So that was a transition thatworked out very well.
I learned a ton of informationfrom the owner.
It was a small engineering firmfirm and he taught me a lot and
(11:09):
I greatly value the time Ispent there.
And then it was that while I wasthere that I started my company
and he actually encouraged it.
He, he let me take time off, hegoes.
I can tell you're passionateabout this.
He said you know why don't youwork four days a week and work
on your company one?
And then, um, then it went totwo and then he said well,
that's it.
If you're going to go more, youneed to go full time.
So I did and, uh, did that formany years and, um, like I said,
(11:36):
it was an uh economic thingthat made me change jobs there.
But I was always able to bounceback, whether it was uh, either
I was offered a role that was abetter fit and I would go, or I
hit some kind of uh negativedownturn and then had to spin,
(11:56):
or pivot, as they say, in into anew role.
But I always landed on my feet,which was good.
You know, it was sometimes astruggle for a little bit, but
just over time, uh, just keptfinding out, dealing with
whatever the hurdle was.
I've I've actually never, I'vealways.
I was laid off one time and allthe other times it was my choice
(12:20):
to leave a role.
And when I was laid off I wasso foreign to me, I was like
what?
And my wife was like you know,just take your time.
You've you've been to a lot ofdifferent roles.
Figure out what you want to do,don't worry about it.
A company offered me apart-time job just while, cause
(12:41):
they heard about me getting laidoff and they're like hey, we'll
give you some weekend work andyou can while you're searching.
And then they, when I went into talk to them about it, they
said you know, we changed ourmind, we just like to hire you
full time.
So it was in a trade I hadnever worked in which was
electrical.
Tanya Boyd (12:57):
Right.
Walt Sparling (12:58):
And they said we know your background so we'll
train you.
I learned I did.
I spent the next six yearsbetween there and one other firm
, because another firm called meand said would you be
interested in coming over here?
And so it was another positiveswitch and that ultimately led
me to the job that I have now,which I've been at just shy of
(13:20):
eight years.
Tanya Boyd (13:22):
Got another kind of theoretical question, but with
just the different changes thatyou've gone through.
If you were to give advice toincoming project managers, would
you tell them that having kindof that diversity in different
(13:42):
fields is a good thing?
You know, because there's allthe different industries the
agile talk, the generalist, thesubject matter expert I tend to
hold the opinion that havingexperience in multiple
industries can actually be ahuge benefit.
What's your thoughts?
Walt Sparling (14:04):
on that I agree, and that is a hugely debated
topic.
Some say specialize, some saygeneralize.
I, since I was young, I wasalways like I am.
You know, how does that sayinggo?
Tanya Boyd (14:19):
Jack of all trades, master of none.
Yeah, we call it Jill of allhills.
Walt Sparling (14:25):
Yeah.
So that is something a lot ofpeople say oh, no, you should
specialize, or no, no, youshould generalize.
I think everybody's path isdifferent.
So to just say that you shoulddo one or the other, you've got
to kind of see what is yourjourney like and is there?
I mean, do you have interest inlearning a lot of different
(14:45):
things?
I love learning new things.
So that's automatically goingto make me more general, because
I'm going to spend time on this, learn that and go.
Okay, I got a pretty goodhandle on it.
No, I want to learn this and dothat.
It has paid off for me becauseit's made me very flexible.
It paid off for me because it'smade me very flexible.
(15:06):
And when I've moved into newroles, even on the design side,
they appreciated the fact that Ihad done other trades, so I
knew how they interacted.
So I wasn't just doingelectrical without understanding
mechanical and plumbing.
I had already done that.
And because I had spent time inarchitecture and I had wanted
to be an architect, I had thatmindset as well, so I could
(15:29):
relate to how that's going toaesthetically look.
You know most people say, well,it's just a functional thing,
like, no, it's not going to lookgood or it's not, you know.
So learning that and thenunderstanding working with
facilities, people aboutmaintenance, making sure
equipment is easy to get to, andI also learned a lot of that
from the first engineer.
Second engineer at the firm Iworked with is he was very
(15:52):
practical and he was very detailoriented and an excellent
communicator.
So I picked up a lot of myknowledge when I worked with him
.
Tanya Boyd (16:04):
I'm just going to say, and you touched on another
point that made me think.
So you know, just before I askthat question, which version of
the Project Management Book ofKnowledge did you pass the P&P
on?
Walt Sparling (16:18):
I most on five, and just missed it, and it was
so late at the end of the bookthat I, when I went back to
retest, it was on six.
Tanya Boyd (16:35):
It was on six.
Well, when you were talkingabout how the different
industries that you worked onhelps you to basically see the
forest for the trees and howthings interconnect, you know
there was such a huge shift inPMBOK 7.
It was such a big departurefrom 6.
But I remember that one of thethings that they prioritized was
(16:58):
systems thinking.
You know and that's just forthose that may be listening
that's the ability to zoom inand out of projects so you can
go in deep, you can see all thedetails, but you can zoom back
and figure out the strategy andhow things are interconnected.
And I do think that's a benefitto working on different
(17:21):
projects, different industries.
You just get more of anoverview of how, the way the
world works and even differentpersonality types, which that
kind of brings me to my nextthing, which will bring us into
your courses shortly.
So at what point in your careerdid you really start
(17:43):
prioritizing communication, inrealizing how influential,
appropriate and effectivelistening and communication can
be on project success?
Walt Sparling (17:59):
I wanted to be funny, but you can be funny.
Tanya Boyd (18:02):
We appreciate fun here.
Walt Sparling (18:06):
I think it's a learned process.
But because of the diversity inmy job roles, uh I'm I dealt
with a lot of people, but Ithink my biggest, uh first, I
think the first experience waswith the one engineer who was
very detail oriented and he,when he would say why he did
(18:26):
things, he would say about howthat's going to minimize
confusion and it's going toclarify ideas.
We're going to get less phonecalls, things are going to go
smoother, and it's all becausewhat I determined later was that
is one form of communication isthe written and the visual that
you did on drawings.
So it's not just how you speak.
(18:49):
That you did on drawings, soit's not just how you speak.
So then when I was doing IT, Ihad my IT company and I dealt
with customers all over theplace.
Most of them were architectsand engineers, because that's
how I got in with them is theyknew me from the industry.
But I would build machines, setup networks, customize their
software, and so I dealt withthe end users.
(19:09):
I dealt with the owners of thecompany, I dealt with vendors
that we bought material from.
So there was a lot ofcommunication going on and you
just learn the way you interactwith someone, you can see the
benefit, you can see how theytreat you.
If you snap at someone or yousee someone else do it and you
see the other person react, okay, well, don't do that, because
(19:36):
that's not a good thing.
And you want to also minimizetime.
So if I can say something in adetailed way and they get it and
I don't just hey.
I don't go on and on aboutsomething, or I don't just give
a very short answer and go.
You know I want this.
Well, why do you want that?
You know, when do you need it?
You know it's okay, I need this, I want it here and this is
(19:57):
what I need it for that's.
Tanya Boyd (20:00):
It's the happy medium and figuring out with the
different stakeholders andtheir different personality
types what constitutes thathappy medium.
Well, before we jump into Pure,I wanted you to tell me a
little bit about how you gotinto podcasting and what were
some of the most interestingthings on getting started with
(20:23):
that journey, the challenges andwhat you learned about yourself
and other people.
Walt Sparling (20:28):
Well, I think with a lot of people during
COVID, I had a little bit ofspare time and I was working
from home, which I had not beenfor.
I was used to being in thefield or in the office on a
daily basis.
So I was a little stir crazyand we had taken a weekend trip
to visit family.
(20:49):
It was later on in covid and uh, I was like I had talked to
some friends online and um or onthe phone and they said you
should start a podcast.
I was like, well, why, nico,you got that voice, the radio
voice, you know.
And I'm like, okay, but I needa topic.
And so I was thinking about iton a trip and I thought, well,
(21:12):
wait, I'm big into projectmanagement.
I've been, you know, pushingpeople on it, I've been studying
for it, I've done pretty wellin it, so why not do that?
So that's what I did Once.
I got uh kind of tuned into thatI would wake up in the middle
of the night with ideas fortitles for the podcast, and I
(21:32):
had done websites before, so theblog and all that were easy
deal to set up.
It was just trying to learnabout podcasting, so I tend to
be one of those that dives inand I'm not a, you know, like a
lot of people say, fake it tillyou make it or, you know, don't,
(21:52):
don't wait, just dive in andfigure it out as you go.
And I've never been that kindof person.
I'm getting more that way now,but back then it was like I'm
going to learn everything thereis.
I researched mics, I researcheduh, researched the cords that
you use.
I researched the software, theediting, the recording.
I watched other podcasters, Ilistened to podcast coaches, and
(22:18):
I did that for about six monthsand then I, finally I talked to
a friend of mine, a PM that Iworked with, and asked her if
she would, you know, if she wasinterested in being involved and
maybe as a co-host, um, or atleast interview me on my first
interview.
And she did, and she'sco-hosted a few episodes with me
(22:39):
.
But once I got started, I had abunch of people lined up and, uh
, I, like I said, I had all mygear in place, I had practiced
and, uh, it went really well.
And then I did have, you know,a lot of people were excited
about it, but then they gotscared and they backed out and
the first year was very bumpyand second year got better,
(23:03):
third year got better and now,like right now, I'm in a lull
because we just bought a newhouse and we're trying to get
out of our old house and we'reexhausted, so I don't have a lot
of time to do recordings andeditings and and all that.
So it's been a very slow lastuh month or two, but I already
like today, I put out mynewsletter on LinkedIn and and
(23:25):
I've already got a bunch ofideas.
I'm collaborating with someother people on some potential
lives and then one that we havecoming is going to be really
interesting.
It's going to be interviewingthe spouses of PMs.
Tanya Boyd (23:43):
Oh, my God.
Oh yes, that should be a hottopic, Just to see what they've
picked up about projectmanagement, or if they do pick
up anything anymore.
If they just tune out theproject managers Because I think
that's a popular tacticsometimes is okay.
Let's not talk about work, youknow, and not everything's a
(24:03):
project.
Walt Sparling (24:04):
And it was.
It came up, you know, clintonBrooks, herman.
Tanya Boyd (24:10):
Yeah, I sure do.
Walt Sparling (24:11):
Yep, yep, his wife is the one that brought it
up and I was like, oh, I likethat idea.
And we started going back andforth brainstorming and then I
started reaching out to PMs thatI knew and it was surprising.
I started reaching out to PMsthat I'd interviewed in the past
, that I knew were married andhad heard a lot of their stories
.
So I was like would you thinkyour spouse would be interested
(24:33):
in coming on and doing this?
And they were.
Most of them were like, yes,but what I did find out is there
was a pretty decent sizeaudience that both were PMs.
Can you imagine two PMs in thesame relationship?
Tanya Boyd (24:51):
No, I couldn't.
That would be really really,really extra.
I you know so.
I'm a PM but I don't over planthings.
I have friends that color codetheir menus and everything they
do.
They put absolutely everythingon a Gantt chart and I'm like I
can't plan it down to that level.
Now it depends upon the project.
(25:12):
I imagine for moving houses youprobably did, because that's a
super huge project where a lotof these I did checklists.
Walt Sparling (25:21):
I'm a big checklist guy.
I didn't really do a Ganttchart, we just did.
I would schedule stuff and say,okay, this weekend you know I do
Google Keep a lot to make mynotes and then I'll transfer
them into Excel and into Outlookbut I would say, okay, this
weekend we're going to do this.
My wife was really instrumentalin helping with the moves.
(25:43):
I was more of logistics and,you know, manpower and uh, just
making sure.
Okay, like even when the moverscame, like this is how I want
you to pack the truck and likethese guys are professional
movers and I was like this ishow you want to do it, because
this is how I want to unload itand all that.
But they were good with it,right.
(26:03):
So yeah, there was a little bitof design on everywhere
everything goes.
(26:24):
No, but when I did my studio,which was one of the sad things
that I left behind.
I sketched that out on paperand then I created a little mini
schedule on that and a budgetwhich I blew.
Wow, yep.
But yeah, I'm a planner.
I'll spend almost as much timeplanning something as I do it,
but I do believe, over myexperience of being in design
for so long, that planning is sokey.
You can over plan, but when youunder plan, it will bite you in
(26:45):
the butt.
Tanya Boyd (26:46):
You're right.
I do that with road trips, likeI probably do plan road trips
differently.
Because I want to be.
I do so much research before toidentify where it is that I
want to visit and I almostbackwards pass my time that I've
got to figure out how I go toplaces and how I map it out to
get there, and then I'll insertmy project management joke that
(27:09):
sometimes I have to force myselfto be a little bit more agile
because it is vacation and Ineed to like come up off the
reins of that just to leave theunknown and the fun and the
non-routine in there, so thatthe vacation feels a little bit
more spontaneous thanover-architected.
Walt Sparling (27:33):
Do you schedule in some spontaneity?
Tanya Boyd (27:36):
I do, I do Well, and plus, there's a lot of times
that the Wi-Fi goes out or thatI'm not following the map
correctly, so I get lost, and so, you know's, as long as I'm not
wandering out in the woods withthe bears before dark, I try to
calm myself down and not freakout and just figure out how to
(27:57):
get out of there.
You know, but sometimes I'lltell you, some of my funnest
moments actually come from thoseareas of concern where you're
lost and then the trip that thatleads you on.
And so that's kind of the humorin life when things don't go
according to plan, sometimes weneed to adjust our mindset and
(28:17):
just figure out when we need tolaugh at it and not get really
upset like flat tires on NewYear's Day.
But thankfully there was a tireplace, one tire place that was
open in West Texas on that day,so that worked out.
I don't know how the storywould have been had that one
(28:39):
place not been open.
So, but I want to give us sometime to talk about the QR
Project Manager credential.
And so, for those of youlistening to the podcast, what
this is, this is a program thatwas put together with over 20
instructors.
It was Joseph Phillips who wasthe head of this.
(29:01):
Him and his wonderful team thatworked with over 20 of us that
came up with our own topics,learned how to do content
creation not just from thestoryboarding but also the
recording of our courses.
You know so, walt, how did youget first pulled into it?
(29:22):
And I'd love for you to tell usabout your topic and the
inspiration for that, about yourtopic and the inspiration for
that.
Walt Sparling (29:29):
So I am fortunate that I know Joseph Phillips and
I haven't known him forever,but I've known him for a few
years and I took one of hiscourses or a couple of his
courses when I was studying formy PMP years ago, and I happened
to join one of his Facebookgroups and one day we started a
(29:50):
side chat, I think I messagedhim about something and we would
occasionally chat DMs and wefound out that we were both into
cigars and bourbon and so wewould compare notes and if one
of us was sitting out on aweekend smoking a cigar I'd send
a DM to the other person.
And then I told him about mypodcast and didn't.
(30:11):
I was nervous about invitinghim because even then I was like
, oh, this guy's a big guy, youknow he's, he's huge.
He'll never come on the podcast.
So he called me one day and wehad chatted a lot and he said
hey, I've got a new book comingout.
Would you be interested inreviewing it for me?
You be interested in reviewingit for me?
And I'm like, wow, sure.
And I said, but there's acaveat If I review your book,
(30:40):
you have to come on my podcast.
So I actually had him on thepodcast and we hit it off.
We did a lot of, a lot oftalking and sharing and so we
became even closer.
So when this program came up, hehad hinted at it um, like six
months before something wascoming.
He couldn't share a lot, but hewould call me when it, when it
actually became real, and wewere out having cigars one night
(31:01):
when he, when he told me thisand I'm like I can't, I can't
imagine what this is going to be, and then he called me when he
kicked it off and told me whatwas going on, he goes you know,
come up with a topic that you'dlike to talk about and, uh,
let's get you on the program.
He explained what he was tryingto do and I'm like, oh, I love
that, that's a great way of uh,I haven't seen that approach.
(31:23):
So, with it being more reallife, people that give
day-to-day what I like to callboots on the ground experiences.
So if you have your PMP, youhave that theoretical experience
and the history of how theybuilt the PMP and changed it
(31:45):
over the years, and then youhave also practical knowledge
from people that are doing it ona regular basis.
So I think they'recomplimentary in that regards,
but it was exciting.
It was a lot of work creating it.
I did my inspiration.
(32:06):
Communication is one of mythings.
Communication and process aremy two kind of go-tos.
But I had just finished writinga chapter in a book for John
Connolly's Executing Excellenceand I thought, well, that's
(32:26):
pretty fresh.
Why don't I just take that andexpand on it and turn it into a
course?
So that's what I did.
I told Joe and I wrote up anoutline and sent it to him and
his team approved it and that'show I got into it.
Tanya Boyd (32:46):
Bring up the book Executed Excellence into it.
Bring up the book ExecutedExcellence, and I think that is
so cool too, because I wasconnected with.
I was connected with you, youknow, and a lot of the other
people in this program, likeJohn Connolly, melissa Chapman,
jeremiah Hammond, you know, andI know we're all contributors to
that book as well.
Can you speak a little bit andagain, imagine y'all were kind
(33:08):
of all working off sides but hadsome planning committees.
Can I ask you how that was,when y'all realized y'all were
back on another creative projectfor something new together,
because that had to be prettycool.
Walt Sparling (33:23):
Yeah, I was pretty excited when John reached
out to me and I know he had aton of followers and I didn't
have a lot of followers.
I was still trying to build upmy my rep and and it when we had
had a few conversations and Ihad had him on a panel, a live
panel, I had interviewed him, soit when he reached out to me
(33:52):
and asked me about doing thechapter, I was like wow, that's,
that's cool.
So I did it and got to interactwith, like you said, some of
the other authors in a privategroup on linkedin.
And then when joe did hisannouncement and brought
everybody together, it wasinteresting because in fact, I
did my first post on it rightafter it went live.
(34:13):
I'd say over half of theinstructors I've interviewed on
the podcast, some of themmultiple times, so it was kind
of cool to see, you know, whenwe did the first get together
the entire group when it waskicked off, and like oh, I know
that person and that person andI know them and I've just talked
with them the other day.
(34:33):
And then I saw a bunch of newfolks, Some of them I'd heard of
before but never interactedwith, and some were were
completely new to me and thensome of them we've gotten closer
Like I had never worked withDave Westgarth before.
Tanya Boyd (34:45):
But we hit it off Well, and that's this brings me
to another topic.
You know and this is really forour listeners too, because I
feel like it's something thatyou and I are both going to
agree with Would you yet?
I have met Ben Chan in person,because both he and I have been
(35:08):
at some of the larger PMI events.
Jeremiah and I talk all thetime, I have his book, but never
met him in person.
So what about you?
(35:28):
Have you met any of the othercreators in person yet?
And what would you say aboutthe power of LinkedIn and
networking and opportunities?
Walt Sparling (35:37):
Definitely believe in the LinkedIn,
networking and putting yourselfout there, and the more I'm out
there, the more people I follow.
I mean I'm getting followers,which is great, and then some of
them I follow back because Irealize that they're content
creators and sharers and notjust content for the purpose of
making money or getting famous,but because they have something
(35:58):
good to say and they have anopinion they want to share.
And I have learned a lot fromjust the people that I've
connected with and some of themhave grown into like you and I
have.
We've chatted a lot and we'venever met in person, like you
said, but when we get on, I'mgonna.
Tanya Boyd (36:15):
I need to figure that out because I and we've
never met in person, like yousaid, but when we get on the
phone, I need to figure that outbecause I'm like you're in
Florida, joe's in Florida,ellen's in Florida, jeff is in
Florida, adam's in Florida.
I'm like I need to work thisout at some point with the
schedule.
Walt Sparling (36:30):
We'll get that figured out out, but I yeah I
have not the only person I havemet in this entire circle in
person, other than, of coursejoe is um uh brooks clinton
brooks herman, yeah, yeah, he um, I actually was on a uh, um pmp
(36:52):
, um PMP course, a bootcamp withhim years ago.
Right, in fact you hadintroduced me to someone and
that we were talking about doingan interview.
Uh, she was in that same course.
Tanya Boyd (37:06):
Okay, I did not even realize that, and it's it is
the weirdest thing because itwinds up being a very small
world Like and and that's thecool thing with linkedin, I mean
, I I did have the fortune oftalking and I know, you know,
kayla mcguire, you were on thebook, you've interviewed her, I
had my first call with her a fewweeks ago and and I think she's
(37:30):
absolutely amazing, you know,and so it just for me realizing
how powerful LinkedIn is, howconnections can grow, and not
limiting yourself just to local,you know.
So, not even for the projectmanagement, education, but for
jobs.
You know, I know there's a lotof places that are going back to
(37:51):
the office, but there's stillplenty of remote work that, with
meeting the right people,having the right mindset and,
you know again, through theweird world, having the right
resume, there's still a lot ofdifferent possibilities that are
out there.
Walt Sparling (38:08):
Well, I just want to share something that I think
is interesting, especially ifthere's new people listening,
because I try to share thiswhenever I can.
I was at a dinner last nightwith my wife and with some of
her co-workers and they asked mewhat I did and I told them and
one of the salesmen said his sonwas going to school for an
actual project management degreeand later on in the evening I
(38:31):
told him about the podcast andsaid he might be interested in
checking it out.
So then all the questions cameout and a lot of people they ask
you you know, what do you do asI'm a project manager, and like
, oh, they don't like it.
Well, whatever that is, youknow.
And some ask you well, what doyou mean?
What do you?
What do you manage?
So trying to explain your storyis really interesting, but the
(38:53):
diversity in project managementis so great.
I mean there are projectmanagement professionals in
every industry.
There's so many opportunitiesand if you really learn the core
key skills mostly soft skills,but understand, I mean, if your
attention to detail, you're goodwith your time management and
(39:13):
you're a great communicator,which is one of my favorites you
can work in multiple industriesbecause you have that skill set
to listen and think thingsthrough and then help guide
people down a path of hey, wegot a schedule, we got a budget,
we got scope and a deadline,now let's get it done.
Tanya Boyd (39:35):
We've got a schedule , we've got a budget, we've got
scope and a deadline.
Now let's get it done Right.
And it's a tricky balance ofinfluence too.
I think that's the biggestthing that people mistake with
(40:00):
project management and influenceand guide people and really
learn that communication to askthe right questions, to try to
inspire some people to theirfinish line, to get the project
done, but without having theauthority.
Walt Sparling (40:08):
So it's yeah, Project managers a lot,
especially I've seen in youngerones.
It is not an authority thing.
You might have some in somecompanies, but most of the time
it's an influence.
And I've worked with a coupleof young PMs and they were like,
(40:29):
okay, my facilities people aremy contractor.
I'm like none of them are yours, None of them are yours.
None of their years, no you workwith them, you're all on the
same team and you're helpingmanage this project, but they
don't work for you they do not,and that's it's a tough to learn
and it's a tough pill toswallow.
Tanya Boyd (40:51):
and then even I remember when I was first
getting into project management,when people on other teams
weren't completing things to thelevel that they needed to
complete them, I always heldback from being, I guess, the
tattler.
You know I didn't want to raisethe red flag on them.
It's like I try to talk to themfirst and coach and motivate
(41:14):
and find out the real issue.
You know, but sometimes too youdo just have to note things and
get with their executives tooand sort of get past that
feeling of I'm throwing somebodyunder the bus, you know, but if
influence on any level andtrying to motivate people and
move them forward as best youcan, I think is some of the best
(41:38):
advice with project management.
Walt Sparling (41:42):
That's what I've seen, and it works.
Tanya Boyd (41:45):
Well, I wanted to say thank you for the time and
the level of detail that you'vegiven during this interview too.
I think I've gotten to learn alot about you as a friend too,
that I wouldn't have realizedhad we not had this opportunity.
So, and I want to give you thelast chance to say anything to
the audience, whether it's onpure or motivation or ideas.
Walt Sparling (42:10):
I didn't plan a speech.
No, I just want to say thatthere's a ton of great courses
in the peer program and I amhappy and honored to be a part
of it.
It was great also that Iactually taught mine with Joe.
(42:32):
It was interesting how thathappened and it's the only
course like that, um.
So that was a lot of fun and Ihave taken multiple of the other
courses.
I haven't completed them allyet, but great material and it
is very interesting to to hearthat material from someone who's
(42:55):
passionate about it and that'swhat they do and they firmly
believe in.
So instead of listening to oneperson talk about 10 different
topics or 15 different topics,you know, someone said okay, I'm
going to tell you aboutcommunication Tomorrow, I'm
going to tell you about risk.
The next day, I'm going to tellyou about schedule.
Next day, I'm going to tell youabout scope.
And it's like no, you havepersonhood.
(43:15):
Their whole focus iscommunication or their whole
focus is risk.
It's interesting because thereare a lot of cross classes in
here cross information.
When I started, and I came upwith the communication topic,
which I had already, like I said, I got the idea from the book
chapter that I did.
(43:35):
I got the idea from the bookchapter that I did.
I found out that MelissaChapman was doing something on
communication and I poked aroundin the instructor files and I
saw her outline and I was veryconcerned like oh God, we don't
want to have two of the same.
So Amanda, actually on the Pureteam, took our two outlines and
(43:57):
put them into chat, gpt andsaid compare these.
And it went and said these arethe areas that are the same,
these are the areas that aredifferent, these are
complimentary.
And and I was like oh good.
And then I reached out toMelissa and told her and I was
like you know, we're both doingand it seems like you're focused
on this and I'm focused on moreon this and she's like, yeah,
(44:18):
so I was like, all right, so wewon't have any conflicts,
they'll, they'll becomplimentary and there are
other courses in there that arelike that as well.
Tanya Boyd (44:25):
That makes sense, your trigger and thoughts Cause?
I remember I came onto theproject a little bit later I
think I had gotten asked inSeptember and September and my
first two ideas werecommunication and creativity,
and I remember seeing yours andMelissa's on communication and
Ben's on creativity, and so Istarted brainstorming other
things and landed on the risk torewards, which you know that
(44:49):
was just more me flipping, beingcreative and being positive
when you hit a lot of hurdles.
Creative and being positivewhen you hit a lot of hurdles.
So, but it was.
It was interesting howeverything played out with all
of it.
Walt Sparling (45:01):
And I yeah, and there's a lot of diversity in
here too, not just similarities,like Dave Westgarth's course on
, like I'm working on my ScrumMaster certification and and so
I'm doing anything I can.
That's in that agile world andbecause I've my, my world has
been waterfall forever, uh, butso I'm trying to broaden my
(45:23):
horizons because I talked to alot of uh, agile and and I
talked to a I know a high levelscrum master a couple years ago
I interviewed.
So the more I can learn aboutit, the more I can learn about
it, the more I can talk about itand ask the right questions.
So the diversity in thisprogram is also good because I
think it might take, especiallyif you're new, take something
(45:46):
you're thinking about gettinginto and then maybe you take a
course in one of these coursesand you go whoa, that is not
something I ever want to have todeal with.
Tanya Boyd (46:00):
Or that's something I love.
How do I get into doing workthat involves this?
So I agree, I agree, it is, youknow, and I'm just thinking
through that, you know, and I'mthinking of Candice with hers is
on on, you know startups, youknow.
so it's like differentindustries to Jeff's on
sustainability.
It's like a lot of them arecomplementary but then
completely different.
So I think that a lot of thatcredit goes to Joe and Amanda
(46:23):
and the team for selecting, youknow, different people to fuel
into this that were fromdifferent backgrounds, different
industries and even globally.
So that's one of the biggestvalues that I find is that not
everybody sounds the same.
We don't all talk the same andwe're all bringing our own
unique perspective, which doesmake it very different.
(46:47):
I haven't seen anything elsequite packaged the way that this
is.
Oh, no.
And I love the way that they'vedone this and just the
friendships that are forming andthe people that we're going to
help.
Walt Sparling (47:02):
Yeah, and I'm not trying to push it because I
think it's valuable, but I meanthe cost is also crazy.
You get your certification oryour credential.
You get all this diversetraining.
You get your certification oryour, your credential.
You get all this diversetraining.
You get your credly badge andyou get 60 PDUs.
So if you have any other PDUcredential right, you can apply
(47:29):
it to that.
And if you already have a bunchof them and you go over, well,
you can carry them into nextyear or not next year, but your
next renewal your next cycle?
yeah, so and if you're trackingthat stuff, if you go to the pm
mastery website, pm-mastercom,and you go to the resource page,
top link is a pdu tracker thatnot only you can track your
(47:53):
history, whether it it be a bookor a course or a podcast, even
there are.
There is a tab dedicated topure and it actually goes
through and it auto calculatesall it.
Well, you just put in the datethat you completed it and it
calculates your PDUs and thenyou can copy and paste the
specific cells into the matchingforms on the website.
(48:16):
So you don't even have to typeall that stuff out.
You just go to that tab copypaste.
Go to the.
You know who's the.
You know what's the course namecopy paste.
What's the description copypaste.
And what's the PDUs copy pasteor type in the number.
It tells you every category ofthe triangle.
So it's a very useful tool.
Tanya Boyd (48:37):
I think I'm going to download that too, because I
have been doing a lot betterwhen it first launched on study
and in this past few months Ineed to get myself caught back
up on it, and I probably do needthat tracker to keep me
accountable and keep it in frontof my face to make progress.
Walt Sparling (48:54):
Well, I know I've been using it for years for
myself and it helps me because Ican look at any time.
I don't have to log into thePMI site.
Some people are like, well, Ifinish a course, I log right in
and do it.
That's great If you're kind ofa collector of data and then you
go in.
I'll go in every few months,copy and paste everything in,
(49:15):
get a bunch of PDUs at oncefeels really good.
Or, like I did last year, I'lldo it two weeks before it's due.
Tanya Boyd (49:23):
And only if I do that.
I caution people against that,because you never know what's
going to happen or when you'regoing to forget.
But I love the idea that you'redoing it batch incrementally.
I agree you don't have to do itevery time you earn one PDU,
but yeah, do it a bunch of themat once helps.
But don't wait two weeks before.
(49:45):
Yeah it wasn't.
Walt Sparling (49:47):
I saw it and it goes oh, by the way, you have
four weeks left to entry.
And I'm like what, oh my God.
So I went over to my and a lotof the stuff I do a lot of,
obviously the podcast and thewebsite.
So I get credits, pdus, for allthat.
You have a limit.
I believe it's 25 of your PDUs,but I don't collect all those
(50:07):
when I do them.
I just that's why I batch them.
I go okay, I did four podcastsin the last two months.
I'm going to grab all four andput them all in my spreadsheet.
Podcasts In the last two months.
I'm going to grab all four andput them all in my spreadsheet
so that when it, when it came up, I thought I had another year.
I wasn't paying attention tothe date.
I'm like, oh, so I scrambledfor two weeks getting everything
entered and the cool thing is Idid not have to go back and
(50:28):
take any courses or sign up forany programs because I had met
everything, I had done all myvolunteer stuff, I had taken
enough courses at work andthrough LinkedIn and oh, shoot,
now I can't think of the one.
Anyway, I had taken enoughUdemy, taken enough material
over the three years that I hadeverything.
I just had to get it entered.
Tanya Boyd (50:50):
Right.
Walt Sparling (50:51):
Yeah, don't progress.
Tanya Boyd (50:52):
I'm going to share one more very quick tip.
I leapfrogged.
I'm going to share one morevery quick tip.
I leapfrogged so what thatmeans.
My leapfrog is I got my PMP in2014.
I got my 60 PDUs within threemonths, submitted them.
I've been doing thatconsistently since 2014, with
(51:12):
every cycle once it's renewed.
So my PMP is actually goodthrough 2030 at this point.
I don't think my cycle it bumpsyou up like a year if you do it
really quickly afterwards.
And that was the trick, becauseI've had people challenge me
and go there's no way you'rethrough 2030 and I was like yes,
(51:32):
I've it if you catch it rightas soon as you earn it or when
that cycle opens up.
You know like I think my cyclewill open back up for submission
in 2026.
You know so what I'll do atthat point is I'll apply,
because I'm always doing talks,I'm always doing training Every
(51:56):
three years, the eight yearsworking as a practitioner.
This I'll do it all at once andit'll jump me up ahead.
You know so it's just as soonas it opens.
But I'm like that witheverything, whether it's my
license, my registration sticker, as soon as it's due I'm on it,
because the world changesquickly and we forget quickly
(52:19):
and get busy.
So it's like I keep, I justkeep up with all of that.
And um, I realized later thatthat's a, that's a trick that
other people don't realize.
Walt Sparling (52:30):
Cool.
Well, I thank you for doingthis, and this was fun.
It was nice to be on the otherside again.
I don't get to do that toooften, but I appreciate it and I
appreciate everyone who'slistened.
Tanya Boyd (52:44):
And we will see you all in the next episode of PM
Mastery.
Walt Sparling (52:48):
Thank, you Tanya?
Tanya Boyd (52:49):
You're welcome.
Intro/Outro (52:50):
Thanks for listening to the PM Mastery
podcast at wwwpm-masterycom.
Be sure to subscribe in yourpodcast player.
Until next time, keep workingon your craft.
Welcome to the PM Mastery Podcast.
This podcast is all abouthelping you master your project
management skills by sharingtips, tricks, tools and training
to get you to the next level,while sharing the stories of
other project managers on theirjourney in project management.
And now here's your host.
Tanya Boyd (00:33):
Hi, this is Tanya Boyd, and I'm hosting Walt
Sparling on his podcast, pmMastery today.
Both Walt and I are instructorswith the Pure Project Manager
credential and we're here totalk a little bit about how he
got involved in this and giveyou a little bit backstory into
who Walt is and how he gotstarted.
(00:54):
So thank you for allowing me tointerview you today, Walt.
How are you doing today?
Walt Sparling (00:59):
I'm doing great.
This is fun.
It's nice to be on the otherside of the table occasionally.
Tanya Boyd (01:04):
Absolutely.
You got to flip the screwssometimes.
So just tell me something alittle bit fun about your
hobbies and interests outside ofwork before we get into
everything.
Project manager-y.
Walt Sparling (01:14):
Well, sadly, project management is a little
bit of my hobby becauseobviously the podcast, the
website, so I do that when I'mnot working and then I do
project management when I work.
Other than that, I belong to amen's mastermind and we get
together and we do planninggoals and we do presentations
(01:39):
and it's kind of a success groupto help men grow and succeed in
different areas of their life.
So that's another thing I doevery three weeks and then I do,
like occasional, bourbon andcigars.
Tanya Boyd (02:00):
That sounds good.
So how long have you beeninvolved in the Men's Mastermind
?
For how many years now?
Walt Sparling (02:06):
We're coming up, I think, on the eighth year.
It's been crazy and we do a bigretreat every year, which we
didn't do this year.
There was all the storms andstuff that happened down here.
Everyone had damage and we kindof put it on the back burner.
We had hoped to schedule onelate and that didn't happen, so
we missed out this year.
Tanya Boyd (02:29):
So that was for 2025 , or do you have any plans to do
it later in 2025?
Walt Sparling (02:34):
We usually do it the last month.
So we do it the first weekendof December every year.
The weather's good and weusually find a big house
somewhere and it's usually eightor nine, sometimes 10 guys.
But this year half of thepeople had damage and were, you
know, had issues that they hadto get through.
(02:55):
So we tried to set it up inMarch and then some other things
happened and that didn't happen.
So we'll go back to our normalroutine and pick up again in 25
and do on, hopefully to ournormal schedule, which will be
the first week of December.
Tanya Boyd (03:12):
Well, hopefully Mother Nature plays a little bit
nicer this year.
I mean, even in projectmanagement, those enterprise
environmental factors it'ssomething that you know is a
risk of happening, but you cannever completely plan for it
when it does happen.
So I want to dive into yourwork history a little bit.
So you're just going throughyour LinkedIn, it looks like
(03:35):
you've got a diverse history inmechanical engineering and
architecture, so tell me how,from that, you evolved into
project management.
Walt Sparling (03:44):
All right, I'll try to make this short, but it's
been a career-long journey.
I started out wanting to be anarchitect when I was a kid.
Actually, I got put in adrafting class by accident and I
really loved it.
So I started drawing.
I was making straight A's, Iwas doing great.
I said, well, this is easy andfun.
(04:05):
So I decided I was going to bean architect.
But I went in the militarybecause I had also been in ROTC
and two weeks after I enlisted,of course I wanted to go in and
be like a naval architect youknow, do ships and all that and
my dad's like, no, you got to gointo technology.
And my dad's like, no, yougotta go into technology.
(04:30):
So, uh, anyway, I got injuredoutside.
I did an early enlistment, umwas injured on a weekend, lost
my eye, one of my eyes, my righteye and uh, they discharged me.
So I had spent years in rtccivil air patrol all getting
ready to go in the service.
I was already enlisted and twoweeks after I was out.
So I'm like all right.
I got out of the hospital, aschool called say hey, we're
(04:52):
looking at your grades.
You seem really good indrafting.
So I went to a school in Tampa,got out of there, couldn't find
a job right away with anarchitect, started with a
mechanical engineering firm as adrafter, really enjoyed that,
spent quite a few years doingthat and then transitioned.
I went back to school to try toget my degree for to become an
(05:15):
architect and during that time Iworked at another mechanical
firm and then I was doing a lotof IT stuff on the side, helping
firms, and I ended up startingan IT company.
So I left the mechanical roleand did this IT company for
(05:35):
about six years, hit a downturnin the economy, I had to let go
of a couple people and then allthe work work that I was trying
to get came in and it was justme and I was freaked out.
I sold the company to someone Iknew who was working with
another IT company and I went towork for a client and did ITs a
(06:00):
little bit more.
Then I went back and got a jobwith an architect doing actual
architectural work and that wasmy first title as a project
manager.
I mean, all the work I did hadproject management duties
related, but it never had thetitle, and so that was my first
title job and then I left therewhen the owner passed away a few
(06:21):
years after I was there, sowent to another architectural
firm passed away a few yearsafter I was there, so went to
another architectural firm andthen from there things didn't
work out.
Went to back to a mechanicalfirm, then an electrical firm
and then someone approached meand poached me from that one to
(06:41):
go to another electrical firm,poached me from that one to go
to another electrical firm.
So I've done architectural,mechanical, electrical plumbing.
The only thing I never reallydid much of is fire protection.
But so I'm very versed in thedesign portion because I've
(07:01):
spent almost well 30 years onthat side.
And my last job I was workingwith an electrical engineering
firm.
I knew the owner was going tobe retiring soon and I just
couldn't imagine me going backat the current age.
I was then back as a designersomewhere else and, uh, I
decided to go full out onproject management.
Get my pmp uh, learn more aboutthe formal side of it instead
(07:26):
of just the you know theeveryday that we did.
You know the accidental projectmanagers.
Tanya Boyd (07:35):
Right right.
Walt Sparling (07:36):
So during that process a friend of mine was a
PM and she said they werelooking for a PM at her firm and
it was a senior level.
And I'm like I it's not me, I'mstill, you know, kind of
learning the ropes.
And she said some veryflowerful words and said send
your resume.
So I did, I got hired and overseven years I worked my way up
(08:00):
through that to the team leadposition and then a regional
lead and then left there earlylast year and transitioned to a
new account Same role owner'srep, owner's rep slash project
manager in working onconstruction projects.
So it's been eight years withthis firm and probably a total
(08:26):
of 15 years doing projectmanagement officially.
Tanya Boyd (08:30):
I wanted to backtrack a little bit over some
of just the different story andthe different pieces of the
story that you've told me.
So first wanted to start bysaying thank you for your
service.
I know you admitted that youwere just it was honorable
discharge due to an injury, butI still want to acknowledge that
because I think the thought,the heart and the intent was all
(08:52):
there.
You know, and, that being said,even the resilience and
adaptability and going into allof these different roles, how
challenging was it for you toadapt to all those changes of
those different roles and whatwere some of the things in the
mindset that got you throughthose different periods?
Walt Sparling (09:15):
It's interesting.
I mean, I had to adapt when Ihad planned for years to go in
the military and then get inyou're sworn in, that's your
future and then to have thatcrushed in a couple weeks.
I put me in kind of a tailspinand then when the school
approached, that gave me alittle bit of brightness.
So went to school, got to moveaway from home and go out of
(09:38):
town into the big city, and somy whole life has been, you know
, one challenge after another,and not negative challenges,
some are negative, some arepositive.
But transitioning to when Icouldn't find a job with an
architectural firm.
I didn't have enough experience, no one wanted to take a chance
(09:59):
on me.
I found a mechanical firm thatdid, and they were super happy
they did, and so was I.
I learned a mechanical firmthat did, and they were super
happy they did, and so was I.
I learned a lot there.
When I left there, it wasbecause I decided to go back to
school, and so it wasn't one ofthose things where I lost the
(10:19):
job.
It was just hey, if I want togo back to school, I need to
spend time job.
It was just a hey, if I want togo back to school.
I need to spend time.
I need to move back homebecause I'm not going to be able
to afford to work and go toschool.
But I worked weekends.
I'd go back to Tampa and workon the weekend, stay with a
friend, then I'd go back toschool during the week, and I
did that for a while.
The company got really slow.
(10:42):
They didn't have any weekendwork for me, so I had to find
another job.
So I struggled for a littlewhile and I found another
mechanical job.
So that was a transition thatworked out very well.
I learned a ton of informationfrom the owner.
It was a small engineering firmfirm and he taught me a lot and
(11:09):
I greatly value the time Ispent there.
And then it was that while I wasthere that I started my company
and he actually encouraged it.
He, he let me take time off, hegoes.
I can tell you're passionateabout this.
He said you know why don't youwork four days a week and work
on your company one?
And then, um, then it went totwo and then he said well,
that's it.
If you're going to go more, youneed to go full time.
So I did and, uh, did that formany years and, um, like I said,
(11:36):
it was an uh economic thingthat made me change jobs there.
But I was always able to bounceback, whether it was uh, either
I was offered a role that was abetter fit and I would go, or I
hit some kind of uh negativedownturn and then had to spin,
(11:56):
or pivot, as they say, in into anew role.
But I always landed on my feet,which was good.
You know, it was sometimes astruggle for a little bit, but
just over time, uh, just keptfinding out, dealing with
whatever the hurdle was.
I've I've actually never, I'vealways.
I was laid off one time and allthe other times it was my choice
(12:20):
to leave a role.
And when I was laid off I wasso foreign to me, I was like
what?
And my wife was like you know,just take your time.
You've you've been to a lot ofdifferent roles.
Figure out what you want to do,don't worry about it.
A company offered me apart-time job just while, cause
(12:41):
they heard about me getting laidoff and they're like hey, we'll
give you some weekend work andyou can while you're searching.
And then they, when I went into talk to them about it, they
said you know, we changed ourmind, we just like to hire you
full time.
So it was in a trade I hadnever worked in which was
electrical.
Tanya Boyd (12:57):
Right.
Walt Sparling (12:58):
And they said we know your background so we'll
train you.
I learned I did.
I spent the next six yearsbetween there and one other firm
, because another firm called meand said would you be
interested in coming over here?
And so it was another positiveswitch and that ultimately led
me to the job that I have now,which I've been at just shy of
(13:20):
eight years.
Tanya Boyd (13:22):
Got another kind of theoretical question, but with
just the different changes thatyou've gone through.
If you were to give advice toincoming project managers, would
you tell them that having kindof that diversity in different
(13:42):
fields is a good thing?
You know, because there's allthe different industries the
agile talk, the generalist, thesubject matter expert I tend to
hold the opinion that havingexperience in multiple
industries can actually be ahuge benefit.
What's your thoughts?
Walt Sparling (14:04):
on that I agree, and that is a hugely debated
topic.
Some say specialize, some saygeneralize.
I, since I was young, I wasalways like I am.
You know, how does that sayinggo?
Tanya Boyd (14:19):
Jack of all trades, master of none.
Yeah, we call it Jill of allhills.
Walt Sparling (14:25):
Yeah.
So that is something a lot ofpeople say oh, no, you should
specialize, or no, no, youshould generalize.
I think everybody's path isdifferent.
So to just say that you shoulddo one or the other, you've got
to kind of see what is yourjourney like and is there?
I mean, do you have interest inlearning a lot of different
(14:45):
things?
I love learning new things.
So that's automatically goingto make me more general, because
I'm going to spend time on this, learn that and go.
Okay, I got a pretty goodhandle on it.
No, I want to learn this and dothat.
It has paid off for me becauseit's made me very flexible.
It paid off for me because it'smade me very flexible.
(15:06):
And when I've moved into newroles, even on the design side,
they appreciated the fact that Ihad done other trades, so I
knew how they interacted.
So I wasn't just doingelectrical without understanding
mechanical and plumbing.
I had already done that.
And because I had spent time inarchitecture and I had wanted
to be an architect, I had thatmindset as well, so I could
(15:29):
relate to how that's going toaesthetically look.
You know most people say, well,it's just a functional thing,
like, no, it's not going to lookgood or it's not, you know.
So learning that and thenunderstanding working with
facilities, people aboutmaintenance, making sure
equipment is easy to get to, andI also learned a lot of that
from the first engineer.
Second engineer at the firm Iworked with is he was very
(15:52):
practical and he was very detailoriented and an excellent
communicator.
So I picked up a lot of myknowledge when I worked with him
.
Tanya Boyd (16:04):
I'm just going to say, and you touched on another
point that made me think.
So you know, just before I askthat question, which version of
the Project Management Book ofKnowledge did you pass the P&P
on?
Walt Sparling (16:18):
I most on five, and just missed it, and it was
so late at the end of the bookthat I, when I went back to
retest, it was on six.
Tanya Boyd (16:35):
It was on six.
Well, when you were talkingabout how the different
industries that you worked onhelps you to basically see the
forest for the trees and howthings interconnect, you know
there was such a huge shift inPMBOK 7.
It was such a big departurefrom 6.
But I remember that one of thethings that they prioritized was
(16:58):
systems thinking.
You know and that's just forthose that may be listening
that's the ability to zoom inand out of projects so you can
go in deep, you can see all thedetails, but you can zoom back
and figure out the strategy andhow things are interconnected.
And I do think that's a benefitto working on different
(17:21):
projects, different industries.
You just get more of anoverview of how, the way the
world works and even differentpersonality types, which that
kind of brings me to my nextthing, which will bring us into
your courses shortly.
So at what point in your careerdid you really start
(17:43):
prioritizing communication, inrealizing how influential,
appropriate and effectivelistening and communication can
be on project success?
Walt Sparling (17:59):
I wanted to be funny, but you can be funny.
Tanya Boyd (18:02):
We appreciate fun here.
Walt Sparling (18:06):
I think it's a learned process.
But because of the diversity inmy job roles, uh I'm I dealt
with a lot of people, but Ithink my biggest, uh first, I
think the first experience waswith the one engineer who was
very detail oriented and he,when he would say why he did
(18:26):
things, he would say about howthat's going to minimize
confusion and it's going toclarify ideas.
We're going to get less phonecalls, things are going to go
smoother, and it's all becausewhat I determined later was that
is one form of communication isthe written and the visual that
you did on drawings.
So it's not just how you speak.
(18:49):
That you did on drawings, soit's not just how you speak.
So then when I was doing IT, Ihad my IT company and I dealt
with customers all over theplace.
Most of them were architectsand engineers, because that's
how I got in with them is theyknew me from the industry.
But I would build machines, setup networks, customize their
software, and so I dealt withthe end users.
(19:09):
I dealt with the owners of thecompany, I dealt with vendors
that we bought material from.
So there was a lot ofcommunication going on and you
just learn the way you interactwith someone, you can see the
benefit, you can see how theytreat you.
If you snap at someone or yousee someone else do it and you
see the other person react, okay, well, don't do that, because
(19:36):
that's not a good thing.
And you want to also minimizetime.
So if I can say something in adetailed way and they get it and
I don't just hey.
I don't go on and on aboutsomething, or I don't just give
a very short answer and go.
You know I want this.
Well, why do you want that?
You know, when do you need it?
You know it's okay, I need this, I want it here and this is
(19:57):
what I need it for that's.
Tanya Boyd (20:00):
It's the happy medium and figuring out with the
different stakeholders andtheir different personality
types what constitutes thathappy medium.
Well, before we jump into Pure,I wanted you to tell me a
little bit about how you gotinto podcasting and what were
some of the most interestingthings on getting started with
(20:23):
that journey, the challenges andwhat you learned about yourself
and other people.
Walt Sparling (20:28):
Well, I think with a lot of people during
COVID, I had a little bit ofspare time and I was working
from home, which I had not beenfor.
I was used to being in thefield or in the office on a
daily basis.
So I was a little stir crazyand we had taken a weekend trip
to visit family.
(20:49):
It was later on in covid and uh, I was like I had talked to
some friends online and um or onthe phone and they said you
should start a podcast.
I was like, well, why, nico,you got that voice, the radio
voice, you know.
And I'm like, okay, but I needa topic.
And so I was thinking about iton a trip and I thought, well,
(21:12):
wait, I'm big into projectmanagement.
I've been, you know, pushingpeople on it, I've been studying
for it, I've done pretty wellin it, so why not do that?
So that's what I did Once.
I got uh kind of tuned into thatI would wake up in the middle
of the night with ideas fortitles for the podcast, and I
(21:32):
had done websites before, so theblog and all that were easy
deal to set up.
It was just trying to learnabout podcasting, so I tend to
be one of those that dives inand I'm not a, you know, like a
lot of people say, fake it tillyou make it or, you know, don't,
(21:52):
don't wait, just dive in andfigure it out as you go.
And I've never been that kindof person.
I'm getting more that way now,but back then it was like I'm
going to learn everything thereis.
I researched mics, I researcheduh, researched the cords that
you use.
I researched the software, theediting, the recording.
I watched other podcasters, Ilistened to podcast coaches, and
(22:18):
I did that for about six monthsand then I, finally I talked to
a friend of mine, a PM that Iworked with, and asked her if
she would, you know, if she wasinterested in being involved and
maybe as a co-host, um, or atleast interview me on my first
interview.
And she did, and she'sco-hosted a few episodes with me
(22:39):
.
But once I got started, I had abunch of people lined up and, uh
, I, like I said, I had all mygear in place, I had practiced
and, uh, it went really well.
And then I did have, you know,a lot of people were excited
about it, but then they gotscared and they backed out and
the first year was very bumpyand second year got better,
(23:03):
third year got better and now,like right now, I'm in a lull
because we just bought a newhouse and we're trying to get
out of our old house and we'reexhausted, so I don't have a lot
of time to do recordings andeditings and and all that.
So it's been a very slow lastuh month or two, but I already
like today, I put out mynewsletter on LinkedIn and and
(23:25):
I've already got a bunch ofideas.
I'm collaborating with someother people on some potential
lives and then one that we havecoming is going to be really
interesting.
It's going to be interviewingthe spouses of PMs.
Tanya Boyd (23:43):
Oh, my God.
Oh yes, that should be a hottopic, Just to see what they've
picked up about projectmanagement, or if they do pick
up anything anymore.
If they just tune out theproject managers Because I think
that's a popular tacticsometimes is okay.
Let's not talk about work, youknow, and not everything's a
(24:03):
project.
Walt Sparling (24:04):
And it was.
It came up, you know, clintonBrooks, herman.
Tanya Boyd (24:10):
Yeah, I sure do.
Walt Sparling (24:11):
Yep, yep, his wife is the one that brought it
up and I was like, oh, I likethat idea.
And we started going back andforth brainstorming and then I
started reaching out to PMs thatI knew and it was surprising.
I started reaching out to PMsthat I'd interviewed in the past
, that I knew were married andhad heard a lot of their stories
.
So I was like would you thinkyour spouse would be interested
(24:33):
in coming on and doing this?
And they were.
Most of them were like, yes,but what I did find out is there
was a pretty decent sizeaudience that both were PMs.
Can you imagine two PMs in thesame relationship?
Tanya Boyd (24:51):
No, I couldn't.
That would be really really,really extra.
I you know so.
I'm a PM but I don't over planthings.
I have friends that color codetheir menus and everything they
do.
They put absolutely everythingon a Gantt chart and I'm like I
can't plan it down to that level.
Now it depends upon the project.
(25:12):
I imagine for moving houses youprobably did, because that's a
super huge project where a lotof these I did checklists.
Walt Sparling (25:21):
I'm a big checklist guy.
I didn't really do a Ganttchart, we just did.
I would schedule stuff and say,okay, this weekend you know I do
Google Keep a lot to make mynotes and then I'll transfer
them into Excel and into Outlookbut I would say, okay, this
weekend we're going to do this.
My wife was really instrumentalin helping with the moves.
(25:43):
I was more of logistics and,you know, manpower and uh, just
making sure.
Okay, like even when the moverscame, like this is how I want
you to pack the truck and likethese guys are professional
movers and I was like this ishow you want to do it, because
this is how I want to unload itand all that.
But they were good with it,right.
(26:03):
So yeah, there was a little bitof design on everywhere
everything goes.
(26:24):
No, but when I did my studio,which was one of the sad things
that I left behind.
I sketched that out on paperand then I created a little mini
schedule on that and a budgetwhich I blew.
Wow, yep.
But yeah, I'm a planner.
I'll spend almost as much timeplanning something as I do it,
but I do believe, over myexperience of being in design
for so long, that planning is sokey.
You can over plan, but when youunder plan, it will bite you in
(26:45):
the butt.
Tanya Boyd (26:46):
You're right.
I do that with road trips, likeI probably do plan road trips
differently.
Because I want to be.
I do so much research before toidentify where it is that I
want to visit and I almostbackwards pass my time that I've
got to figure out how I go toplaces and how I map it out to
get there, and then I'll insertmy project management joke that
(27:09):
sometimes I have to force myselfto be a little bit more agile
because it is vacation and Ineed to like come up off the
reins of that just to leave theunknown and the fun and the
non-routine in there, so thatthe vacation feels a little bit
more spontaneous thanover-architected.
Walt Sparling (27:33):
Do you schedule in some spontaneity?
Tanya Boyd (27:36):
I do, I do Well, and plus, there's a lot of times
that the Wi-Fi goes out or thatI'm not following the map
correctly, so I get lost, and so, you know's, as long as I'm not
wandering out in the woods withthe bears before dark, I try to
calm myself down and not freakout and just figure out how to
(27:57):
get out of there.
You know, but sometimes I'lltell you, some of my funnest
moments actually come from thoseareas of concern where you're
lost and then the trip that thatleads you on.
And so that's kind of the humorin life when things don't go
according to plan, sometimes weneed to adjust our mindset and
(28:17):
just figure out when we need tolaugh at it and not get really
upset like flat tires on NewYear's Day.
But thankfully there was a tireplace, one tire place that was
open in West Texas on that day,so that worked out.
I don't know how the storywould have been had that one
(28:39):
place not been open.
So, but I want to give us sometime to talk about the QR
Project Manager credential.
And so, for those of youlistening to the podcast, what
this is, this is a program thatwas put together with over 20
instructors.
It was Joseph Phillips who wasthe head of this.
(29:01):
Him and his wonderful team thatworked with over 20 of us that
came up with our own topics,learned how to do content
creation not just from thestoryboarding but also the
recording of our courses.
You know so, walt, how did youget first pulled into it?
(29:22):
And I'd love for you to tell usabout your topic and the
inspiration for that, about yourtopic and the inspiration for
that.
Walt Sparling (29:29):
So I am fortunate that I know Joseph Phillips and
I haven't known him forever,but I've known him for a few
years and I took one of hiscourses or a couple of his
courses when I was studying formy PMP years ago, and I happened
to join one of his Facebookgroups and one day we started a
(29:50):
side chat, I think I messagedhim about something and we would
occasionally chat DMs and wefound out that we were both into
cigars and bourbon and so wewould compare notes and if one
of us was sitting out on aweekend smoking a cigar I'd send
a DM to the other person.
And then I told him about mypodcast and didn't.
(30:11):
I was nervous about invitinghim because even then I was like
, oh, this guy's a big guy, youknow he's, he's huge.
He'll never come on the podcast.
So he called me one day and wehad chatted a lot and he said
hey, I've got a new book comingout.
Would you be interested inreviewing it for me?
You be interested in reviewingit for me?
And I'm like, wow, sure.
And I said, but there's acaveat If I review your book,
(30:40):
you have to come on my podcast.
So I actually had him on thepodcast and we hit it off.
We did a lot of, a lot oftalking and sharing and so we
became even closer.
So when this program came up, hehad hinted at it um, like six
months before something wascoming.
He couldn't share a lot, but hewould call me when it, when it
actually became real, and wewere out having cigars one night
(31:01):
when he, when he told me thisand I'm like I can't, I can't
imagine what this is going to be, and then he called me when he
kicked it off and told me whatwas going on, he goes you know,
come up with a topic that you'dlike to talk about and, uh,
let's get you on the program.
He explained what he was tryingto do and I'm like, oh, I love
that, that's a great way of uh,I haven't seen that approach.
(31:23):
So, with it being more reallife, people that give
day-to-day what I like to callboots on the ground experiences.
So if you have your PMP, youhave that theoretical experience
and the history of how theybuilt the PMP and changed it
(31:45):
over the years, and then youhave also practical knowledge
from people that are doing it ona regular basis.
So I think they'recomplimentary in that regards,
but it was exciting.
It was a lot of work creating it.
I did my inspiration.
(32:06):
Communication is one of mythings.
Communication and process aremy two kind of go-tos.
But I had just finished writinga chapter in a book for John
Connolly's Executing Excellenceand I thought, well, that's
(32:26):
pretty fresh.
Why don't I just take that andexpand on it and turn it into a
course?
So that's what I did.
I told Joe and I wrote up anoutline and sent it to him and
his team approved it and that'show I got into it.
Tanya Boyd (32:46):
Bring up the book Executed Excellence into it.
Bring up the book ExecutedExcellence, and I think that is
so cool too, because I wasconnected with.
I was connected with you, youknow, and a lot of the other
people in this program, likeJohn Connolly, melissa Chapman,
jeremiah Hammond, you know, andI know we're all contributors to
that book as well.
Can you speak a little bit andagain, imagine y'all were kind
(33:08):
of all working off sides but hadsome planning committees.
Can I ask you how that was,when y'all realized y'all were
back on another creative projectfor something new together,
because that had to be prettycool.
Walt Sparling (33:23):
Yeah, I was pretty excited when John reached
out to me and I know he had aton of followers and I didn't
have a lot of followers.
I was still trying to build upmy my rep and and it when we had
had a few conversations and Ihad had him on a panel, a live
panel, I had interviewed him, soit when he reached out to me
(33:52):
and asked me about doing thechapter, I was like wow, that's,
that's cool.
So I did it and got to interactwith, like you said, some of
the other authors in a privategroup on linkedin.
And then when joe did hisannouncement and brought
everybody together, it wasinteresting because in fact, I
did my first post on it rightafter it went live.
(34:13):
I'd say over half of theinstructors I've interviewed on
the podcast, some of themmultiple times, so it was kind
of cool to see, you know, whenwe did the first get together
the entire group when it waskicked off, and like oh, I know
that person and that person andI know them and I've just talked
with them the other day.
(34:33):
And then I saw a bunch of newfolks, Some of them I'd heard of
before but never interactedwith, and some were were
completely new to me and thensome of them we've gotten closer
Like I had never worked withDave Westgarth before.
Tanya Boyd (34:45):
But we hit it off Well, and that's this brings me
to another topic.
You know and this is really forour listeners too, because I
feel like it's something thatyou and I are both going to
agree with Would you yet?
I have met Ben Chan in person,because both he and I have been
(35:08):
at some of the larger PMI events.
Jeremiah and I talk all thetime, I have his book, but never
met him in person.
So what about you?
(35:28):
Have you met any of the othercreators in person yet?
And what would you say aboutthe power of LinkedIn and
networking and opportunities?
Walt Sparling (35:37):
Definitely believe in the LinkedIn,
networking and putting yourselfout there, and the more I'm out
there, the more people I follow.
I mean I'm getting followers,which is great, and then some of
them I follow back because Irealize that they're content
creators and sharers and notjust content for the purpose of
making money or getting famous,but because they have something
(35:58):
good to say and they have anopinion they want to share.
And I have learned a lot fromjust the people that I've
connected with and some of themhave grown into like you and I
have.
We've chatted a lot and we'venever met in person, like you
said, but when we get on, I'mgonna.
Tanya Boyd (36:15):
I need to figure that out because I and we've
never met in person, like yousaid, but when we get on the
phone, I need to figure that outbecause I'm like you're in
Florida, joe's in Florida,ellen's in Florida, jeff is in
Florida, adam's in Florida.
I'm like I need to work thisout at some point with the
schedule.
Walt Sparling (36:30):
We'll get that figured out out, but I yeah I
have not the only person I havemet in this entire circle in
person, other than, of coursejoe is um uh brooks clinton
brooks herman, yeah, yeah, he um, I actually was on a uh, um pmp
(36:52):
, um PMP course, a bootcamp withhim years ago.
Right, in fact you hadintroduced me to someone and
that we were talking about doingan interview.
Uh, she was in that same course.
Tanya Boyd (37:06):
Okay, I did not even realize that, and it's it is
the weirdest thing because itwinds up being a very small
world Like and and that's thecool thing with linkedin, I mean
, I I did have the fortune oftalking and I know, you know,
kayla mcguire, you were on thebook, you've interviewed her, I
had my first call with her a fewweeks ago and and I think she's
(37:30):
absolutely amazing, you know,and so it just for me realizing
how powerful LinkedIn is, howconnections can grow, and not
limiting yourself just to local,you know.
So, not even for the projectmanagement, education, but for
jobs.
You know, I know there's a lotof places that are going back to
(37:51):
the office, but there's stillplenty of remote work that, with
meeting the right people,having the right mindset and,
you know again, through theweird world, having the right
resume, there's still a lot ofdifferent possibilities that are
out there.
Walt Sparling (38:08):
Well, I just want to share something that I think
is interesting, especially ifthere's new people listening,
because I try to share thiswhenever I can.
I was at a dinner last nightwith my wife and with some of
her co-workers and they asked mewhat I did and I told them and
one of the salesmen said his sonwas going to school for an
actual project management degreeand later on in the evening I
(38:31):
told him about the podcast andsaid he might be interested in
checking it out.
So then all the questions cameout and a lot of people they ask
you you know, what do you do asI'm a project manager, and like
, oh, they don't like it.
Well, whatever that is, youknow.
And some ask you well, what doyou mean?
What do you?
What do you manage?
So trying to explain your storyis really interesting, but the
(38:53):
diversity in project managementis so great.
I mean there are projectmanagement professionals in
every industry.
There's so many opportunitiesand if you really learn the core
key skills mostly soft skills,but understand, I mean, if your
attention to detail, you're goodwith your time management and
(39:13):
you're a great communicator,which is one of my favorites you
can work in multiple industriesbecause you have that skill set
to listen and think thingsthrough and then help guide
people down a path of hey, wegot a schedule, we got a budget,
we got scope and a deadline,now let's get it done.
Tanya Boyd (39:35):
We've got a schedule , we've got a budget, we've got
scope and a deadline.
Now let's get it done Right.
And it's a tricky balance ofinfluence too.
I think that's the biggestthing that people mistake with
(40:00):
project management and influenceand guide people and really
learn that communication to askthe right questions, to try to
inspire some people to theirfinish line, to get the project
done, but without having theauthority.
Walt Sparling (40:08):
So it's yeah, Project managers a lot,
especially I've seen in youngerones.
It is not an authority thing.
You might have some in somecompanies, but most of the time
it's an influence.
And I've worked with a coupleof young PMs and they were like,
(40:29):
okay, my facilities people aremy contractor.
I'm like none of them are yours, None of them are yours.
None of their years, no you workwith them, you're all on the
same team and you're helpingmanage this project, but they
don't work for you they do not,and that's it's a tough to learn
and it's a tough pill toswallow.
Tanya Boyd (40:51):
and then even I remember when I was first
getting into project management,when people on other teams
weren't completing things to thelevel that they needed to
complete them, I always heldback from being, I guess, the
tattler.
You know I didn't want to raisethe red flag on them.
It's like I try to talk to themfirst and coach and motivate
(41:14):
and find out the real issue.
You know, but sometimes too youdo just have to note things and
get with their executives tooand sort of get past that
feeling of I'm throwing somebodyunder the bus, you know, but if
influence on any level andtrying to motivate people and
move them forward as best youcan, I think is some of the best
(41:38):
advice with project management.
Walt Sparling (41:42):
That's what I've seen, and it works.
Tanya Boyd (41:45):
Well, I wanted to say thank you for the time and
the level of detail that you'vegiven during this interview too.
I think I've gotten to learn alot about you as a friend too,
that I wouldn't have realizedhad we not had this opportunity.
So, and I want to give you thelast chance to say anything to
the audience, whether it's onpure or motivation or ideas.
Walt Sparling (42:10):
I didn't plan a speech.
No, I just want to say thatthere's a ton of great courses
in the peer program and I amhappy and honored to be a part
of it.
It was great also that Iactually taught mine with Joe.
(42:32):
It was interesting how thathappened and it's the only
course like that, um.
So that was a lot of fun and Ihave taken multiple of the other
courses.
I haven't completed them allyet, but great material and it
is very interesting to to hearthat material from someone who's
(42:55):
passionate about it and that'swhat they do and they firmly
believe in.
So instead of listening to oneperson talk about 10 different
topics or 15 different topics,you know, someone said okay, I'm
going to tell you aboutcommunication Tomorrow, I'm
going to tell you about risk.
The next day, I'm going to tellyou about schedule.
Next day, I'm going to tell youabout scope.
And it's like no, you havepersonhood.
(43:15):
Their whole focus iscommunication or their whole
focus is risk.
It's interesting because thereare a lot of cross classes in
here cross information.
When I started, and I came upwith the communication topic,
which I had already, like I said, I got the idea from the book
chapter that I did.
(43:35):
I got the idea from the bookchapter that I did.
I found out that MelissaChapman was doing something on
communication and I poked aroundin the instructor files and I
saw her outline and I was veryconcerned like oh God, we don't
want to have two of the same.
So Amanda, actually on the Pureteam, took our two outlines and
(43:57):
put them into chat, gpt andsaid compare these.
And it went and said these arethe areas that are the same,
these are the areas that aredifferent, these are
complimentary.
And and I was like oh good.
And then I reached out toMelissa and told her and I was
like you know, we're both doingand it seems like you're focused
on this and I'm focused on moreon this and she's like, yeah,
(44:18):
so I was like, all right, so wewon't have any conflicts,
they'll, they'll becomplimentary and there are
other courses in there that arelike that as well.
Tanya Boyd (44:25):
That makes sense, your trigger and thoughts Cause?
I remember I came onto theproject a little bit later I
think I had gotten asked inSeptember and September and my
first two ideas werecommunication and creativity,
and I remember seeing yours andMelissa's on communication and
Ben's on creativity, and so Istarted brainstorming other
things and landed on the risk torewards, which you know that
(44:49):
was just more me flipping, beingcreative and being positive
when you hit a lot of hurdles.
Creative and being positivewhen you hit a lot of hurdles.
So, but it was.
It was interesting howeverything played out with all
of it.
Walt Sparling (45:01):
And I yeah, and there's a lot of diversity in
here too, not just similarities,like Dave Westgarth's course on
, like I'm working on my ScrumMaster certification and and so
I'm doing anything I can.
That's in that agile world andbecause I've my, my world has
been waterfall forever, uh, butso I'm trying to broaden my
(45:23):
horizons because I talked to alot of uh, agile and and I
talked to a I know a high levelscrum master a couple years ago
I interviewed.
So the more I can learn aboutit, the more I can learn about
it, the more I can talk about itand ask the right questions.
So the diversity in thisprogram is also good because I
think it might take, especiallyif you're new, take something
(45:46):
you're thinking about gettinginto and then maybe you take a
course in one of these coursesand you go whoa, that is not
something I ever want to have todeal with.
Tanya Boyd (46:00):
Or that's something I love.
How do I get into doing workthat involves this?
So I agree, I agree, it is, youknow, and I'm just thinking
through that, you know, and I'mthinking of Candice with hers is
on on, you know startups, youknow.
so it's like differentindustries to Jeff's on
sustainability.
It's like a lot of them arecomplementary but then
completely different.
So I think that a lot of thatcredit goes to Joe and Amanda
(46:23):
and the team for selecting, youknow, different people to fuel
into this that were fromdifferent backgrounds, different
industries and even globally.
So that's one of the biggestvalues that I find is that not
everybody sounds the same.
We don't all talk the same andwe're all bringing our own
unique perspective, which doesmake it very different.
(46:47):
I haven't seen anything elsequite packaged the way that this
is.
Oh, no.
And I love the way that they'vedone this and just the
friendships that are forming andthe people that we're going to
help.
Walt Sparling (47:02):
Yeah, and I'm not trying to push it because I
think it's valuable, but I meanthe cost is also crazy.
You get your certification oryour credential.
You get all this diversetraining.
You get your certification oryour, your credential.
You get all this diversetraining.
You get your credly badge andyou get 60 PDUs.
So if you have any other PDUcredential right, you can apply
(47:29):
it to that.
And if you already have a bunchof them and you go over, well,
you can carry them into nextyear or not next year, but your
next renewal your next cycle?
yeah, so and if you're trackingthat stuff, if you go to the pm
mastery website, pm-mastercom,and you go to the resource page,
top link is a pdu tracker thatnot only you can track your
(47:53):
history, whether it it be a bookor a course or a podcast, even
there are.
There is a tab dedicated topure and it actually goes
through and it auto calculatesall it.
Well, you just put in the datethat you completed it and it
calculates your PDUs and thenyou can copy and paste the
specific cells into the matchingforms on the website.
(48:16):
So you don't even have to typeall that stuff out.
You just go to that tab copypaste.
Go to the.
You know who's the.
You know what's the course namecopy paste.
What's the description copypaste.
And what's the PDUs copy pasteor type in the number.
It tells you every category ofthe triangle.
So it's a very useful tool.
Tanya Boyd (48:37):
I think I'm going to download that too, because I
have been doing a lot betterwhen it first launched on study
and in this past few months Ineed to get myself caught back
up on it, and I probably do needthat tracker to keep me
accountable and keep it in frontof my face to make progress.
Walt Sparling (48:54):
Well, I know I've been using it for years for
myself and it helps me because Ican look at any time.
I don't have to log into thePMI site.
Some people are like, well, Ifinish a course, I log right in
and do it.
That's great If you're kind ofa collector of data and then you
go in.
I'll go in every few months,copy and paste everything in,
(49:15):
get a bunch of PDUs at oncefeels really good.
Or, like I did last year, I'lldo it two weeks before it's due.
Tanya Boyd (49:23):
And only if I do that.
I caution people against that,because you never know what's
going to happen or when you'regoing to forget.
But I love the idea that you'redoing it batch incrementally.
I agree you don't have to do itevery time you earn one PDU,
but yeah, do it a bunch of themat once helps.
But don't wait two weeks before.
(49:45):
Yeah it wasn't.
Walt Sparling (49:47):
I saw it and it goes oh, by the way, you have
four weeks left to entry.
And I'm like what, oh my God.
So I went over to my and a lotof the stuff I do a lot of,
obviously the podcast and thewebsite.
So I get credits, pdus, for allthat.
You have a limit.
I believe it's 25 of your PDUs,but I don't collect all those
(50:07):
when I do them.
I just that's why I batch them.
I go okay, I did four podcastsin the last two months.
I'm going to grab all four andput them all in my spreadsheet.
Podcasts In the last two months.
I'm going to grab all four andput them all in my spreadsheet
so that when it, when it came up, I thought I had another year.
I wasn't paying attention tothe date.
I'm like, oh, so I scrambledfor two weeks getting everything
entered and the cool thing is Idid not have to go back and
(50:28):
take any courses or sign up forany programs because I had met
everything, I had done all myvolunteer stuff, I had taken
enough courses at work andthrough LinkedIn and oh, shoot,
now I can't think of the one.
Anyway, I had taken enoughUdemy, taken enough material
over the three years that I hadeverything.
I just had to get it entered.
Tanya Boyd (50:50):
Right.
Walt Sparling (50:51):
Yeah, don't progress.
Tanya Boyd (50:52):
I'm going to share one more very quick tip.
I leapfrogged.
I'm going to share one morevery quick tip.
I leapfrogged so what thatmeans.
My leapfrog is I got my PMP in2014.
I got my 60 PDUs within threemonths, submitted them.
I've been doing thatconsistently since 2014, with
(51:12):
every cycle once it's renewed.
So my PMP is actually goodthrough 2030 at this point.
I don't think my cycle it bumpsyou up like a year if you do it
really quickly afterwards.
And that was the trick, becauseI've had people challenge me
and go there's no way you'rethrough 2030 and I was like yes,
(51:32):
I've it if you catch it rightas soon as you earn it or when
that cycle opens up.
You know like I think my cyclewill open back up for submission
in 2026.
You know so what I'll do atthat point is I'll apply,
because I'm always doing talks,I'm always doing training Every
(51:56):
three years, the eight yearsworking as a practitioner.
This I'll do it all at once andit'll jump me up ahead.
You know so it's just as soonas it opens.
But I'm like that witheverything, whether it's my
license, my registration sticker, as soon as it's due I'm on it,
because the world changesquickly and we forget quickly
(52:19):
and get busy.
So it's like I keep, I justkeep up with all of that.
And um, I realized later thatthat's a, that's a trick that
other people don't realize.
Walt Sparling (52:30):
Cool.
Well, I thank you for doingthis, and this was fun.
It was nice to be on the otherside again.
I don't get to do that toooften, but I appreciate it and I
appreciate everyone who'slistened.
Tanya Boyd (52:44):
And we will see you all in the next episode of PM
Mastery.
Walt Sparling (52:48):
Thank, you Tanya?
Tanya Boyd (52:49):
You're welcome.
Intro/Outro (52:50):
Thanks for listening to the PM Mastery
podcast at wwwpm-masterycom.
Be sure to subscribe in yourpodcast player.
Until next time, keep workingon your craft.
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