April 28, 2025 • 30 mins
Sexual violence leaves survivors searching for answers, often without a roadmap for what comes next. Cheyenne Wilson knows this firsthand. After her own assault, she desperately sought comprehensive guidance but found only fragmented resources. This experience sparked her creation of "We Are the Evidence: A Handbook for Finding Your Way After Sexual Assault" – the resource she wished had existed during her darkest moments.
The stark statistics are sobering. Nearly one in four women experience rape or attempted rape in their lifetime, with rates even higher among women of color and Indigenous communities. When survivors don't have clear information about definitions, resources, and options, confusion compounds trauma. Wilson's groundbreaking handbook addresses this critical need, offering clarity on everything from terminology to evidence collection to navigating the justice system.
Throughout our conversation, Wilson illuminates the power of language in a survivor's healing journey. Many people struggle with questions like "I didn't say no, was it still rape?" or "I didn't fight back, was it still assault?" By addressing these questions head-on and dispelling common myths, she empowers survivors to name their experiences. The handbook also distinguishes between community advocates (who provide confidential support) and victim witness advocates (who work with prosecution) – a crucial distinction many survivors don't understand.
What truly sets "We Are the Evidence" apart is its trauma-informed approach. The book incorporates mindful check-ins, diverse survivor perspectives, and acknowledgment that each healing journey looks different. Wilson emphasizes that survivors have choices at every step – from evidence collection to reporting to exploring alternatives like restorative justice. Most importantly, she reminds us that healing isn't linear and there's no single "right way" to recover from sexual violence.
Whether you're a survivor seeking guidance, a loved one wanting to provide support, or someone working in advocacy or law enforcement, this resource offers invaluable insights into the complex aftermath of sexual violence.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The subject matter of this podcast will address
difficult topics multiple formsof violence, and identity-based
discrimination and harassment.
We acknowledge that thiscontent may be difficult and
have listed specific contentwarnings in each episode
description to help create apositive, safe experience for
all listeners.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
In this country, 31 million crimes 31 million crimes
are reported every year.
That is one every second.
Out of that, every 24 minutesthere is a murder.
Every five minutes there is arape.
Every two to five minutes thereis a sexual assault.
Every nine seconds in thiscountry, a woman is assaulted by
someone who told her that heloved her, by someone who told
(00:43):
her it was her fault, by someonewho tries to tell the rest of
us it's none of our business andI am proud to stand here today
with each of you to call thatperpetrator a liar.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Welcome to the podcast on crimes against women.
I'm Maria McMullin.
According to the NationalSexual Violence Resource Center,
sexual violence is any type ofunwanted sexual contact,
including sexual assault andrape, and can include words and
actions like sexual harassment,street harassment and
non-consensual sharing ofprivate images, which is
(01:15):
sometimes called revenge porn.
Sexual violence impactseveryone.
In the United States, nearlyone in four women have
experienced rape or attemptedrape sometime in their lives.
29% of non-Hispanic black womenwere raped in their lifetime.
One in three Hispanic womenreported unwanted sexual contact
(01:35):
in their lifetime.
More than four of five American, indian and Alaska Native women
that's 84% have experiencedviolence in their lifetime, and
32% of adults with intellectualdisabilities have also
experienced sexual violence.
What's worse, survivors oftenknow the person who committed
(01:56):
the act of sexual violence tothem and many choose not to
report due to this complexity.
With so many individualsexperiencing crimes of sexual
violence, additional resourcesare always needed and welcome.
As we close the 2025 SexualAssault Awareness Month, we
offer our listeners a newresource authored by survivor
(02:17):
Cheyenne Wilson, who joins ustoday to discuss her book we Are
the Evidence At age 29,.
Cheyenne Wilson authored we Arethe Evidence a handbook for
finding your way after sexualassault a comprehensive and
accessible resource designed tosupport survivors and enhance
public understanding of sexualviolence.
Her personal experiences havedeeply shaped her commitment to
(02:39):
this cause, fueling her work toprovide critical resources,
survivor-centered education andsystemic advocacy.
She actively collaborates withorganizations to improve the
support systems available tosurvivors, ensuring they receive
the care and advocacy theydeserve.
Cheyenne Wilson BSN is apassionate advocate dedicated to
(03:01):
raising awareness about sexualassault and reducing the stigma
faced by survivors.
With a background in socialservices and nursing, she blends
empathy with professionalexpertise to drive meaningful
change in both the justice andhealthcare systems.
Cheyenne is also a presenter atthe 2025 Conference on Crimes
Against Women.
(03:21):
Her book we Are the Evidencewas a finalist in the 2025
Minnesota Book Awards in thenonfiction category.
This episode previously airedon Genesis, the Podcast, and is
a discussion about sexualviolence.
Cheyenne Wilson, welcome to thepodcast.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Thank you, I'm really excited to be here.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
And I'm excited to talk to you because you wrote a
book recently that I think is anincredible resource for
survivors and all people.
Actually, it's an educationalresource and it filled a gap for
something I didn't even knowthat we needed, but clearly it
has a purpose in supportingpeople with resources and lots
(04:03):
of information should theyexperience sexual violence.
So let's just get started andjump right in.
If you would tell us about thebook, we Are the Evidence and
why this topic is important toyou.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Absolutely.
I wrote we Are the Evidence tobe a comprehensive and easily
accessible resource to thosewho've experienced sexual
violence, their loved ones,potential jury members, anyone
who supports sexual assaultsurvivors.
And I wrote this after my ownsexual assault, looking for a
resource and not being able tofind again that comprehensive
(04:37):
resource and we've come a longway with creating resources for
survivors, but still somethingthat has that comprehensive
piece to it.
It is easily accessible, wasn'tthere, and I know how important
it is to have a resource likethis, because I didn't feel able
to report or seek therapy orany healing resources after my
(04:58):
assault because I couldn't findthis.
And it wasn't until I found adocument that was actually
written for attorneys on sexualassault myths that I finally
felt empowered to report, go totherapy and put a name to what
happened to me, and thatdocument was not something that
was available to anyone to read,so it was just really luck that
I found it and I realized howimportant something like this
(05:20):
would have been for me if Icould have found it right after
my assault.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Wow, that's a pretty powerful experience and I can't
imagine being in that situationlooking for something and then
having the idea that I shouldprovide this for others.
I think that's really admirableand I'm glad that you did it,
because the book is incredible.
I have read it and it has somuch information and it's not
(05:45):
just a list of resources or whatyou might think.
It's collaborative.
There are other people andopinions and information in the
book that you wouldn't expect,so we're going to get into that
too.
Now it starts out withsignificant context and
explanation about the languagewe use to describe sexual
assault and related situations.
(06:05):
I'd love to get an overview ofthat.
Can you give us an overview ofthose terms and why these become
critical when survivors orothers in this conversation talk
about the experience?
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Yeah, words have a lot of power and definitions
hold a lot of weight.
I think when you've experienceda trauma, you go looking for
some answers as to what justhappened to me, and definitions
that are overly limiting canthrow you off track, make you
feel like you can't report, makeyou feel like you can't look
for resources, and so I talk inthe book about how there's
definitions that are used inadvocacy spaces, and those are
(06:39):
kind of the terms that you and Iprobably use the most.
And then there's legaldefinitions that can be a lot
more narrow, and that's ifyou're reporting what they're
looking at for what that chargemight be and how those are
different and it's good to knowboth.
So, for example, sexual assaultincludes groping harassment.
It's going to include rapewhere rape is going to be
(07:01):
penetration specifics.
So all sexual like sexualassault includes rape, but rape
does not always include sexualassault, because sexual assault
can be a little bit more broad.
Harassment is a definitionyou're going to see a lot more
in workplaces and schools.
Abuse typically is tailoredtowards children who have
experienced ongoing abuse in asexual way.
And again, I think this mattersbecause when you look at
(07:21):
definitions and how they'vechanged, for a long time the
definition was the carnalknowledge of a female, which
means that men don't get to beincluded in that definition.
So they don't get to look atthe criminal justice process for
themselves, reporting and theymight not feel like they can go
to therapy for this specificthing or seek out resources
because it's so narrow, seek outresources because it's so
(07:46):
narrow.
And since then that's changedand I like to point that out
because one the reason itchanged and became more broad is
because of the work ofadvocates and pushing for that
change and now more people areable to seek healing and
resources and courting if theywould like.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
So give us an example of a changed definition.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
Absolutely so.
In 1927, the definition by thecrime report was the carnal
knowledge of a female forciblyand against her will.
So again that's meaning thatmen can't say that they
experienced sexual assault orrape.
It means that a lot of types ofsexual assault don't get put
under that definition.
And then that's been changedover time and currently it is
(08:23):
any non-consensual sexual actprescribed by federal, tribal or
state law, including when thevictim lacks capacity to consent
.
So again this is much morebroad and does not become gender
exclusive.
It does not mean that has to bevaginal penetration in order
for it to be raped.
So more people can accessresources.
More people can accessresources.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
And the definition that you just gave us.
Is that a federal definition ora state's definition?
Because I know that they can belike slightly different
depending on which state you'reliving in.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
That's the US Department of Justice and you're
right that it can vary by state.
And going to RAINNcom, theyhave a great page where you can
put in your state and see whatthe statutes are and the
different classifications forcrimes.
That's really helpful.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
That is a very helpful website.
There is a lot of resources onit and for our listeners it's
RAINN R-A-I-N-N.
Dot O-R-G if they need to getsome information there.
You mentioned advocacy when youwere talking about these terms
that we're trying to make clearand just expanding a little bit
on vocabulary, because the bookdoes spend a significant amount
(09:29):
of time on terms and vocabularyand definitions and who's
calling what different things.
Why was it really important foryou to include that in this
conversation?
Because, I mean, I realize itsets the table right for
discussions, but learning fromother survivors was that
(09:52):
something that people felt as asurvivor?
They did not really understandeven how to put what happened to
them in words.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Yeah, absolutely.
One of the biggest questions Iget asked when someone reaches
out to me is asking if they, ifI can help them define what
happened to them.
They'll say I didn't say no,was it still rape?
This happened, but I didn'tfight back.
Is it still sexual assault?
So trying to explain the sexualassault myths and say what
sexual assault and rape is isreally important, because so
(10:21):
many people after trauma aresitting there wondering what
just happened.
They don't have the definitionsand the words to put to it, and
I think that helps being ableto say what the definitions are,
what the myths are.
And even if you didn't say no,even if it's a loved one who
assaulted you, even if therewasn't a weapon involved, it's
still sexual assault.
But a lot of people don't knowthat, and so it is really
(10:42):
important to go into that, and Ithink it's also important to
talk about survivor versusvictim.
People are going to identifydifferently with different terms
and I want to give peoplepermission to use those words
interchangeably with what fitsbest for them and their
experience.
But yeah, I think that's a bigreason why it was important for
me is so many people end upconfused, which is natural after
experiencing sexual assault andsexual violence as to what
(11:05):
happened at them.
Explaining what grooming is isimportant because so many people
don't really see what happenedto them until afterwards when
they're looking back, because somany people don't really see
what happened to them untilafterwards when they're looking
back, and if they don't knowthose words, if they don't have
those terms to help them puttogether all the pieces of what
happened, it just adds to theconfusion.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
Absolutely so.
Yeah, I think that was a greatidea to include so much
information about theterminology.
Now, you did mention advocacyand I think that the ever
expanding role of the advocateright, they're doing so much
these days to work withsurvivors.
Let's talk about that role andthe importance of advocates.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
Yeah, so there's two types of advocates.
There's the community or sexualassault advocates.
Then there's the advocates thatare working with the
prosecution team, and part ofwhy it's so important to explain
both roles is because I didn'tknow that there's the two
different roles.
I kind of lumped them alltogether under what is like the
victim witness advocate rolethat's working with the
prosecution.
And a community advocate issomeone who's going to be there
(12:02):
for you as a survivor and theydo not report what you say to
them back to the prosecutionteam or back to law enforcement,
unless you're a minor and thenthey have to as a mandatory
reporter.
But they're there for you tohelp you understand the
resources available, sit withyou and explain to you what a
rape kit is, a sane kit andhaving that done, walking
(12:22):
through the process of reporting, and they can be with you
throughout that entire processof reporting, the investigation,
going to court and be in yourcorner.
And again, they have so manyresources available and they
know what locally is availableto you, which is a huge thing
that I like to point out.
When people reach out again forresources, I can share some of
the big nationwide ones, but ifyou're looking for those
(12:44):
in-person connections, talk toyour advocate in your area,
whereas a victim witnessadvocate with the prosecution.
What you say to them can bebrought back to the prosecution
team.
They're there to help supportyou again through the court
process, but a lot more of thelogistics.
So what to wear, what to expect?
Answer questions you might haveabout the ongoing investigation
(13:04):
victim compensation they'regoing to help with that justice
piece of it instead of you andyour needs regarding yeah, like
finding therapy, support groups,resources.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
So finding your community advocate, how
difficult do you think that is?
Speaker 3 (13:18):
Depends on where you're at.
I think of rural areas a lot.
I'm from a small town and Ithink about how hard it is to
find some of these resourceswhen you live in a small town.
If you call the National SexualAssault Hotline with RAINN,
they can help direct you to anadvocate in your area and that's
a good place to start.
So you can call 800-656-4673.
(13:38):
There's also an online chat,which is onlinerainnorg.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Perfect.
So let's narrow in a little bitmore on the experiences of
sexual assault, because I wantto try to understand how the
experience of reporting andpursuing justice for these
crimes is different for women ofcolor and indigenous women, as
opposed to, maybe, white women.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
I think it's important to remember all the
additional barriers that theymay face historically and,
unfortunately, even currently.
There's a lot of distrust withpolice and with the criminal
court system because people ofcolor have not been treated
fairly or kindly and have beenprosecuted or persecuted against
by these systems.
And, keeping that in mind, weknow that people of color
(14:28):
experience higher rates ofsexual violence but are
reporting at a much lower ratethan white people who do, and to
me that seems pretty obvious.
They don't feel safe.
They don't feel safe reportingand they've had to be so
intentional about building theircommunity that reporting
especially someone who's intheir community, where it might
(14:48):
bring harm or additionalnegative consequences to their
community, is frightening.
So they have a lot moreadditional barriers and when you
look at the generationalviolence that have been
committed to, for example,indigenous people, the Trail of
Tears and removing people fromtheir homes and putting them in
boarding schools where theyexperienced high rates of sexual
violence and they weren'tbelieved, they weren't supported
(15:11):
.
If they did report, nothingcame out of it, so they've lost
trust.
I have a couple experts whocontribute on these topics and
they do a great job doing so,but it's really important to be
intentional in creatingresources that are culturally
sensitive, that are available inthe spaces that people are in,
and to be able to bring theminto the conversations on how to
(15:32):
create better resources forthem.
And there are some additionalresources available that I
wanted to mention.
So the National Organization ofSisters of Color Ending Sexual
Assault is a great resource,therapy for Black Girls is a
great resource and Strong HeartsNative Hotline.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Yeah, those are great examples and those I can tell
you.
They're all in that book.
We Are the Evidence, and thereare a lot of personal stories
used in the book as well toillustrate what the needs are,
in specific cases, certain typesof survivors and how those can
be met through the types ofresources that you talked about.
(16:09):
Now, so often, documentation.
In cases of sexual assault, theburden is on the victim.
So, as your book title implies,the victim contains a large
portion of the evidence of proofthat a crime was committed and
while it is challenging andthat's really putting it very
mildly to submit this type ofevidence and endure its
(16:32):
collection, this process iscritical to pursuing justice and
potentially preventing futurecrimes by the perpetrator.
Can you lay out the process ofdocumenting a sexual assault and
help us understand how theevidence is used?
Speaker 3 (16:48):
Yeah, and I do like to point out that I am not a
former detective or a detectiveor lawyer, so the advice I give
is my own, from my ownexperience and talking to
experts in their fields.
But when you've been sexuallyassaulted again like we talked
about the beginning of theepisode so much of the time
you're just confused about whathappened and making a decision
(17:08):
like reporting, going to avictim advocate, going to the
hospital, might feeloverwhelming, and that's okay.
I was a delayed reporter myself.
I did not do any of these stepsright away.
But some things that you can do, whether it's by yourself or
again with the support of anadvocate, is document everything
that happened in a way that'llbe time-stamped, Document who
(17:29):
was there, where you were, thetimes, you remember the details
and you can send this in anemail because that'll be
time-stamped.
If it's easier to do like avoice note and email it to
yourself or to a safe person,that's another idea.
If you're going to not go tothe hospital right away, you can
take off your clothes and putthem in a Ziploc bag or
somewhere where they'll besealed and protected.
After sexual violence you feeldirty because your body is the
(17:53):
crime scene and it's verytempting and you want to shower
and scrub yourself clean.
If you've already done that andyou're listening to that,
that's perfectly okay.
You have not ruined yourchances to report or have a rape
kit done.
That's okay.
But if you can hold off becauseyou think you might want to
report, that is helpful for DNAcollection.
Trying to avoid to go to thebathroom if you're going to have
(18:14):
a rape kit done can be helpful.
But again, many people don'trealize they've been sexually
assaulted until later.
So if you've done these things,it's okay.
You can still go in and have arape kit done, Depending on the
state you're in a couple days toeven 10 days, I think in
Minnesota is what it is you canstill go in and have some DNA
potentially collected.
You can still go in and betested for STIs, physical
(18:38):
injuries have those examined andlooked at.
If you have a rape kit done, itdoes not mean that you're
reporting.
It just means that the data hasbeen, the DNA has been
collected and stored.
You can choose to report, butthat way it's there.
From there you can also talk toagain the victim advocate and
choose to make a report later.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
So you made an important point there.
At the end, even though you dothe rape kit and you go through
that whole process, that doesn'tmean you've reported the crime.
What is the next step thatwould need to be taken there?
Speaker 3 (19:09):
If you want to report , you can, and then you can tell
them that you had a rape kitdone.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
And when you say report, that means contacting
law enforcement, correct?
Speaker 3 (19:17):
Correct.
Okay, so those are two separateprocesses.
You can report without having arape kit done.
You can have a rape kit donewithout reporting.
Those are two differentprocesses.
One just collects the DNA, soif you get to court they can use
that there.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Got it.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
That's an important place for having a victim like a
community advocate is sohelpful because they can be
there with you.
Place where having a victimlike a community advocate is so
helpful because they can bethere with you.
And it's important to rememberthat you can say no to any part
of that process of having a rapekit done.
For example, if you want to goin and you don't want any of
like a pelvic exam done at all,you can say no.
You can say yes just to partsof it and say no to other parts.
If you don't feel ready, youcan ask for a break.
(19:52):
This is a place where you getto take some power and control
back, and having a safe personthere with you can make a really
big difference.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Yeah, absolutely.
You included some ideas in thebook that, to me, make it not
just a handbook but more of atrauma-informed one at that.
So, for instance, you point outin the book that in most cases,
survivors have options, as youjust were talking about.
Out in the book that in mostcases, survivors have options,
as you just were talking about.
They have options, and you alsoincluded thoughts from
(20:23):
survivors about theirexperiences and reactions to
them, and you built in pausesthroughout the book with prompts
for mindful check-ins.
So, while I can understand thevalue of all of these inclusions
, I'm curious why it wasimportant to you to offer them
in this resource.
Speaker 3 (20:36):
One thing I learned in this process is that I had my
experience, but I'm not anexpert in everything related to
sexual assault and everysurvivor has a different, unique
experience and their healing'sdifferent, and I wanted to
highlight that I didn't want thereader to feel like my
experience.
If it didn't look like theirexperience, they couldn't use it
.
So it's important to me to havethe validation and support of
(20:57):
other survivors through theirquotes, their thoughts, their
stories, but also to have thatmarked very clearly so if the
reader doesn't want to readthose sections because it's
triggering, they can skip overit.
I know personally after myassault, reading memoirs was not
something I could do because itwas too upsetting.
So I wanted the reader to beable to get the educational
information out of the book andsupplement it with the
(21:21):
validation of the survivor'squotes, without feeling forced
or tricked into reading those ifthey didn't want to.
But there's so much insight fromother survivors and, again, I
didn't talk to any survivorsafter my assault but hearing all
of the thoughts from otherpeople on why they did report,
why they didn't report whatworked for them with healing,
(21:42):
what didn't work, I'm hoping itcan provide support and
validation to the reader as towhatever their healing process
is looking like.
It's okay.
And then the mindful check-insat the end of each chapter was
important to me because, again,when I was trying to gather all
the information about reportingand what going to court would be
like, I kind of spent readthrough everything and I didn't
really take into considerationmy own mental health.
I didn't take pauses to checkin with myself.
(22:05):
And I wanted to encourage thereader to do that.
This isn't a sprint, this isvery much a marathon healing
from sexual trauma, so that wasa big part of it.
It was again trying to helpremind them to take care of
themselves, to breathe throughthis.
I tried to have littlehomework-like prompts, almost to
take down notes as they gothrough on what applies and what
(22:26):
doesn't.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Yeah, really important points.
And the other thing I reallylike about this guidebook is
that I can pick it up in anypart of the book and just start
learning from that point, so Idon't need to read it cover to
cover in one sitting all the waystraight through.
You can stop and start and findplaces in the book, just to
pick it up and open it up andread it from any point forward.
(22:49):
That's meaningful for you.
You also talk about in the workand in conversations you and I
have had about restorativejustice, and I'd like to talk
about restorative justice andmaybe you can give us an
overview of what survivors canexpect as they move through the
judicial process.
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Yeah, absolutely, and I'm very fortunate to have
experts who contribute in detailon what the investigation
process is looking like orreporting or going to court.
So I recommend those sectionstoo.
But one of the hardest thingsabout the criminal justice
process is the lack of control.
You feel as the victim of thecrime when you make that report.
Ultimately, the case thenbecomes that of the states and
(23:32):
you are a witness to that crime.
It's not your case and thatfeels really hard, because
sexual violence and trauma isabout control and not feeling a
sense of control of anything,including your own body, and so
that can be reallyre-traumatizing.
I still think that it's worthpursuing if it feels right to
you.
Just have a strong support teambehind you.
(23:53):
But that piece of not feelingcontrol of it is really hard.
So when you make the initialcall in, they'll take down the
immediate information.
They'll make sure you have asafety plan and that you're safe
.
You'll then have your reporthanded to a detective who will
do a more thorough interviewwith you.
This is another place wherethat victim advocate can be with
you if you'd like to helpprovide support, and then from
(24:14):
there the investigation begins.
That can take a wide range oftime, which again is hard,
because you're probably notgetting updates, frequent
updates, on what's happening.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
So you're kind of left wondering.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
I know for me I was really fortunate that my
detective did keep me moreinvolved and did give me like
check-ins to make sure I wasdoing okay.
But they don't have to do that.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
Right, and it can be an extremely long process,
depending on the circumstancesof each case.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
Yeah, and that part's really hard and I was like for
myself what the hardest part wasis after it was brought to
prosecution they decided to takeit to court.
That wait, because I think thatwas over a year and the trial
would get pushed back forvarious reasons and that part
was really hard.
Restorative and transformativejustice is a process where
(25:01):
you're working outside of thecriminal court system with a
facilitator the perpetrator, theperson who caused you harm, is
there, and then typically somecommunity members.
It depends on the circle orprocess format they can vary,
but where you have aconversation all together about
the harm that was caused, whathappened that led to that person
, about the harm that was caused, what happened that led to that
person causing the harm, andthen the impacts it has on the
(25:22):
community and trying to createlike an accountability plan.
And it's not going to beappropriate for everyone, but
just even having that option Ithink for survivors would be so
helpful, because so many peoplefeel like the only sense of
justice that they can have is bygoing through the criminal
court system and in reality,very few people who go through
(25:42):
the criminal court system end upwalking away with any sense of
procedural justice Whereasrestorative justice.
The idea is to be able to havethat conversation around
accountability and heal and beable to move forward.
So I'm excited about thoseconversations that are happening
, trying to make it moreavailable for sexual assault
survivors.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
How does one request that type of conversation?
Speaker 3 (26:05):
It depends on where you're at because, like I said,
it's not available everywhere.
So here in like I'm in themetro area of Minnesota, it's
not available for sexual assaultsurvivors but they're working
to make it available for themand by knowing Canada, they've
been having a lot more successwith making it available.
So it's going to vary whereyou're at, but talking to your
sexual assault advocate again isa really good place to see if
(26:25):
that's available and just startthat conversation.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Yeah, I would think talking to your elected
officials may be a good place togo as well and tell them that
it's important to you.
Yeah, maybe do some educationaround what it actually is and
how it would benefit.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Yeah, there's more organizations speaking out for
this and trying to make itavailable, which is really great
to see.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
Yeah, that's amazing.
I'm looking forward to meetingyou in person in May at the
conference on crimes againstwomen.
Because you're a presenter.
Is this your first timepresenting at the conference?
Speaker 3 (26:59):
It is.
I'm looking forward to it.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
How exciting.
Tell us what you're going to betalking about in your workshop.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Yes, I'm presenting with Justin Boardman, who
contributed to the book as well.
He's a retired detective, butwe are presenting on how we can
help keep survivors engaged inthe process as they're getting
ready to go to court, while alsogiving them a better sense of
procedural justice andsupporting the people who are
working in systems to avoidburnout.
(27:25):
And we're trying to help peoplethink outside the box on how
they can do this.
And we have again some of theexperts from the book sharing
some information for thepresentation.
For example, Angela Goins is aregistered dietitian who is
focusing on how trauma impactsour relationship with food and
for many survivors, eatingdisorders go hand in hand with
(27:47):
healing from trauma because wehave control over our food and
what we're putting in our body.
So if we can help give them thetools to have a better
nutritional knowledge, they'regonna be better set up to stay
engaged throughout the processof getting ready for court and
then feel more prepared to go tocourt, and that can help them
have that sense of proceduraljustice, feel supported
throughout that process.
Speaker 1 (28:08):
Yeah, that's an interesting example because it
does a lot of things.
I mean, proper nutrition reallydoes help to reduce some of
your trauma symptoms, and italso just the process of
learning how to eat and what toeat and preparing food and so on
can be very empowering.
And I love the idea and this iskind of woven throughout the
(28:30):
book too of taking some babysteps, if you will, little steps
that add up to bigger change or, you know, to achieving a goal
that you want, because maybe oneday it looks like just being
able to make your own foodchoices is really empowering,
and then the next day you needto call your elected officials
(28:52):
right.
So small things can truly addup and they certainly do in your
life and in the work thatyou've done to put this book
together and now get to thispresentation.
Let's give people your websiteand social media handles so they
can learn more and maybe get intouch.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
Absolutely.
The website iswearetheevidencecom and on
social media you can find me aswearetheevidence on Instagram,
tiktok.
On LinkedIn it's just CheyenneWilson, and I'm happy to connect
with people there, and then thebook is available.
Wherever you like to purchaseyour books, I always recommend
trying to support your localbookseller.
I think that's really important.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
And then I try to encourage people to call their
local library, make sure theyhave a copy available as well.
So many people, unfortunately,are experiencing sexual violence
at home and bringing a booklike this home is not an option.
But the library can be a safeplace where they can go and,
like you said, pick up the book,go to the section that they
need and then set it down andcome back to it later without
(29:56):
without again bringing it home,where it might be dangerous to
do so.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
Yeah, that's excellent advice, cheyenne.
I really enjoyed reading thebook and learning more about
your work, and I look forward toseeing you.
Speaker 3 (30:06):
I am too.
Thank you again for having me.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Thanks so much for listening.
Until next time, stay safe.
The 2025 Conference on CrimesAgainst Women will take place in
Dallas, Texas, May 19th throughthe 22nd at the Sheraton Dallas
.
Learn more and register atconferencecaworg and follow us
on social media at National CCAW.
The subject matter of this podcast will address
difficult topics multiple formsof violence, and identity-based
discrimination and harassment.
We acknowledge that thiscontent may be difficult and
have listed specific contentwarnings in each episode
description to help create apositive, safe experience for
all listeners.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
In this country, 31 million crimes 31 million crimes
are reported every year.
That is one every second.
Out of that, every 24 minutesthere is a murder.
Every five minutes there is arape.
Every two to five minutes thereis a sexual assault.
Every nine seconds in thiscountry, a woman is assaulted by
someone who told her that heloved her, by someone who told
(00:43):
her it was her fault, by someonewho tries to tell the rest of
us it's none of our business andI am proud to stand here today
with each of you to call thatperpetrator a liar.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Welcome to the podcast on crimes against women.
I'm Maria McMullin.
According to the NationalSexual Violence Resource Center,
sexual violence is any type ofunwanted sexual contact,
including sexual assault andrape, and can include words and
actions like sexual harassment,street harassment and
non-consensual sharing ofprivate images, which is
(01:15):
sometimes called revenge porn.
Sexual violence impactseveryone.
In the United States, nearlyone in four women have
experienced rape or attemptedrape sometime in their lives.
29% of non-Hispanic black womenwere raped in their lifetime.
One in three Hispanic womenreported unwanted sexual contact
(01:35):
in their lifetime.
More than four of five American, indian and Alaska Native women
that's 84% have experiencedviolence in their lifetime, and
32% of adults with intellectualdisabilities have also
experienced sexual violence.
What's worse, survivors oftenknow the person who committed
(01:56):
the act of sexual violence tothem and many choose not to
report due to this complexity.
With so many individualsexperiencing crimes of sexual
violence, additional resourcesare always needed and welcome.
As we close the 2025 SexualAssault Awareness Month, we
offer our listeners a newresource authored by survivor
(02:17):
Cheyenne Wilson, who joins ustoday to discuss her book we Are
the Evidence At age 29,.
Cheyenne Wilson authored we Arethe Evidence a handbook for
finding your way after sexualassault a comprehensive and
accessible resource designed tosupport survivors and enhance
public understanding of sexualviolence.
Her personal experiences havedeeply shaped her commitment to
(02:39):
this cause, fueling her work toprovide critical resources,
survivor-centered education andsystemic advocacy.
She actively collaborates withorganizations to improve the
support systems available tosurvivors, ensuring they receive
the care and advocacy theydeserve.
Cheyenne Wilson BSN is apassionate advocate dedicated to
(03:01):
raising awareness about sexualassault and reducing the stigma
faced by survivors.
With a background in socialservices and nursing, she blends
empathy with professionalexpertise to drive meaningful
change in both the justice andhealthcare systems.
Cheyenne is also a presenter atthe 2025 Conference on Crimes
Against Women.
(03:21):
Her book we Are the Evidencewas a finalist in the 2025
Minnesota Book Awards in thenonfiction category.
This episode previously airedon Genesis, the Podcast, and is
a discussion about sexualviolence.
Cheyenne Wilson, welcome to thepodcast.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Thank you, I'm really excited to be here.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
And I'm excited to talk to you because you wrote a
book recently that I think is anincredible resource for
survivors and all people.
Actually, it's an educationalresource and it filled a gap for
something I didn't even knowthat we needed, but clearly it
has a purpose in supportingpeople with resources and lots
(04:03):
of information should theyexperience sexual violence.
So let's just get started andjump right in.
If you would tell us about thebook, we Are the Evidence and
why this topic is important toyou.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Absolutely.
I wrote we Are the Evidence tobe a comprehensive and easily
accessible resource to thosewho've experienced sexual
violence, their loved ones,potential jury members, anyone
who supports sexual assaultsurvivors.
And I wrote this after my ownsexual assault, looking for a
resource and not being able tofind again that comprehensive
(04:37):
resource and we've come a longway with creating resources for
survivors, but still somethingthat has that comprehensive
piece to it.
It is easily accessible, wasn'tthere, and I know how important
it is to have a resource likethis, because I didn't feel able
to report or seek therapy orany healing resources after my
(04:58):
assault because I couldn't findthis.
And it wasn't until I found adocument that was actually
written for attorneys on sexualassault myths that I finally
felt empowered to report, go totherapy and put a name to what
happened to me, and thatdocument was not something that
was available to anyone to read,so it was just really luck that
I found it and I realized howimportant something like this
(05:20):
would have been for me if Icould have found it right after
my assault.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Wow, that's a pretty powerful experience and I can't
imagine being in that situationlooking for something and then
having the idea that I shouldprovide this for others.
I think that's really admirableand I'm glad that you did it,
because the book is incredible.
I have read it and it has somuch information and it's not
(05:45):
just a list of resources or whatyou might think.
It's collaborative.
There are other people andopinions and information in the
book that you wouldn't expect,so we're going to get into that
too.
Now it starts out withsignificant context and
explanation about the languagewe use to describe sexual
assault and related situations.
(06:05):
I'd love to get an overview ofthat.
Can you give us an overview ofthose terms and why these become
critical when survivors orothers in this conversation talk
about the experience?
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Yeah, words have a lot of power and definitions
hold a lot of weight.
I think when you've experienceda trauma, you go looking for
some answers as to what justhappened to me, and definitions
that are overly limiting canthrow you off track, make you
feel like you can't report, makeyou feel like you can't look
for resources, and so I talk inthe book about how there's
definitions that are used inadvocacy spaces, and those are
(06:39):
kind of the terms that you and Iprobably use the most.
And then there's legaldefinitions that can be a lot
more narrow, and that's ifyou're reporting what they're
looking at for what that chargemight be and how those are
different and it's good to knowboth.
So, for example, sexual assaultincludes groping harassment.
It's going to include rapewhere rape is going to be
(07:01):
penetration specifics.
So all sexual like sexualassault includes rape, but rape
does not always include sexualassault, because sexual assault
can be a little bit more broad.
Harassment is a definitionyou're going to see a lot more
in workplaces and schools.
Abuse typically is tailoredtowards children who have
experienced ongoing abuse in asexual way.
And again, I think this mattersbecause when you look at
(07:21):
definitions and how they'vechanged, for a long time the
definition was the carnalknowledge of a female, which
means that men don't get to beincluded in that definition.
So they don't get to look atthe criminal justice process for
themselves, reporting and theymight not feel like they can go
to therapy for this specificthing or seek out resources
because it's so narrow, seek outresources because it's so
(07:46):
narrow.
And since then that's changedand I like to point that out
because one the reason itchanged and became more broad is
because of the work ofadvocates and pushing for that
change and now more people areable to seek healing and
resources and courting if theywould like.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
So give us an example of a changed definition.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
Absolutely so.
In 1927, the definition by thecrime report was the carnal
knowledge of a female forciblyand against her will.
So again that's meaning thatmen can't say that they
experienced sexual assault orrape.
It means that a lot of types ofsexual assault don't get put
under that definition.
And then that's been changedover time and currently it is
(08:23):
any non-consensual sexual actprescribed by federal, tribal or
state law, including when thevictim lacks capacity to consent
.
So again this is much morebroad and does not become gender
exclusive.
It does not mean that has to bevaginal penetration in order
for it to be raped.
So more people can accessresources.
More people can accessresources.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
And the definition that you just gave us.
Is that a federal definition ora state's definition?
Because I know that they can belike slightly different
depending on which state you'reliving in.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
That's the US Department of Justice and you're
right that it can vary by state.
And going to RAINNcom, theyhave a great page where you can
put in your state and see whatthe statutes are and the
different classifications forcrimes.
That's really helpful.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
That is a very helpful website.
There is a lot of resources onit and for our listeners it's
RAINN R-A-I-N-N.
Dot O-R-G if they need to getsome information there.
You mentioned advocacy when youwere talking about these terms
that we're trying to make clearand just expanding a little bit
on vocabulary, because the bookdoes spend a significant amount
(09:29):
of time on terms and vocabularyand definitions and who's
calling what different things.
Why was it really important foryou to include that in this
conversation?
Because, I mean, I realize itsets the table right for
discussions, but learning fromother survivors was that
(09:52):
something that people felt as asurvivor?
They did not really understandeven how to put what happened to
them in words.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Yeah, absolutely.
One of the biggest questions Iget asked when someone reaches
out to me is asking if they, ifI can help them define what
happened to them.
They'll say I didn't say no,was it still rape?
This happened, but I didn'tfight back.
Is it still sexual assault?
So trying to explain the sexualassault myths and say what
sexual assault and rape is isreally important, because so
(10:21):
many people after trauma aresitting there wondering what
just happened.
They don't have the definitionsand the words to put to it, and
I think that helps being ableto say what the definitions are,
what the myths are.
And even if you didn't say no,even if it's a loved one who
assaulted you, even if therewasn't a weapon involved, it's
still sexual assault.
But a lot of people don't knowthat, and so it is really
(10:42):
important to go into that, and Ithink it's also important to
talk about survivor versusvictim.
People are going to identifydifferently with different terms
and I want to give peoplepermission to use those words
interchangeably with what fitsbest for them and their
experience.
But yeah, I think that's a bigreason why it was important for
me is so many people end upconfused, which is natural after
experiencing sexual assault andsexual violence as to what
(11:05):
happened at them.
Explaining what grooming is isimportant because so many people
don't really see what happenedto them until afterwards when
they're looking back, because somany people don't really see
what happened to them untilafterwards when they're looking
back, and if they don't knowthose words, if they don't have
those terms to help them puttogether all the pieces of what
happened, it just adds to theconfusion.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
Absolutely so.
Yeah, I think that was a greatidea to include so much
information about theterminology.
Now, you did mention advocacyand I think that the ever
expanding role of the advocateright, they're doing so much
these days to work withsurvivors.
Let's talk about that role andthe importance of advocates.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
Yeah, so there's two types of advocates.
There's the community or sexualassault advocates.
Then there's the advocates thatare working with the
prosecution team, and part ofwhy it's so important to explain
both roles is because I didn'tknow that there's the two
different roles.
I kind of lumped them alltogether under what is like the
victim witness advocate rolethat's working with the
prosecution.
And a community advocate issomeone who's going to be there
(12:02):
for you as a survivor and theydo not report what you say to
them back to the prosecutionteam or back to law enforcement,
unless you're a minor and thenthey have to as a mandatory
reporter.
But they're there for you tohelp you understand the
resources available, sit withyou and explain to you what a
rape kit is, a sane kit andhaving that done, walking
(12:22):
through the process of reporting, and they can be with you
throughout that entire processof reporting, the investigation,
going to court and be in yourcorner.
And again, they have so manyresources available and they
know what locally is availableto you, which is a huge thing
that I like to point out.
When people reach out again forresources, I can share some of
the big nationwide ones, but ifyou're looking for those
(12:44):
in-person connections, talk toyour advocate in your area,
whereas a victim witnessadvocate with the prosecution.
What you say to them can bebrought back to the prosecution
team.
They're there to help supportyou again through the court
process, but a lot more of thelogistics.
So what to wear, what to expect?
Answer questions you might haveabout the ongoing investigation
(13:04):
victim compensation they'regoing to help with that justice
piece of it instead of you andyour needs regarding yeah, like
finding therapy, support groups,resources.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
So finding your community advocate, how
difficult do you think that is?
Speaker 3 (13:18):
Depends on where you're at.
I think of rural areas a lot.
I'm from a small town and Ithink about how hard it is to
find some of these resourceswhen you live in a small town.
If you call the National SexualAssault Hotline with RAINN,
they can help direct you to anadvocate in your area and that's
a good place to start.
So you can call 800-656-4673.
(13:38):
There's also an online chat,which is onlinerainnorg.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Perfect.
So let's narrow in a little bitmore on the experiences of
sexual assault, because I wantto try to understand how the
experience of reporting andpursuing justice for these
crimes is different for women ofcolor and indigenous women, as
opposed to, maybe, white women.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
I think it's important to remember all the
additional barriers that theymay face historically and,
unfortunately, even currently.
There's a lot of distrust withpolice and with the criminal
court system because people ofcolor have not been treated
fairly or kindly and have beenprosecuted or persecuted against
by these systems.
And, keeping that in mind, weknow that people of color
(14:28):
experience higher rates ofsexual violence but are
reporting at a much lower ratethan white people who do, and to
me that seems pretty obvious.
They don't feel safe.
They don't feel safe reportingand they've had to be so
intentional about building theircommunity that reporting
especially someone who's intheir community, where it might
(14:48):
bring harm or additionalnegative consequences to their
community, is frightening.
So they have a lot moreadditional barriers and when you
look at the generationalviolence that have been
committed to, for example,indigenous people, the Trail of
Tears and removing people fromtheir homes and putting them in
boarding schools where theyexperienced high rates of sexual
violence and they weren'tbelieved, they weren't supported
(15:11):
.
If they did report, nothingcame out of it, so they've lost
trust.
I have a couple experts whocontribute on these topics and
they do a great job doing so,but it's really important to be
intentional in creatingresources that are culturally
sensitive, that are available inthe spaces that people are in,
and to be able to bring theminto the conversations on how to
(15:32):
create better resources forthem.
And there are some additionalresources available that I
wanted to mention.
So the National Organization ofSisters of Color Ending Sexual
Assault is a great resource,therapy for Black Girls is a
great resource and Strong HeartsNative Hotline.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Yeah, those are great examples and those I can tell
you.
They're all in that book.
We Are the Evidence, and thereare a lot of personal stories
used in the book as well toillustrate what the needs are,
in specific cases, certain typesof survivors and how those can
be met through the types ofresources that you talked about.
(16:09):
Now, so often, documentation.
In cases of sexual assault, theburden is on the victim.
So, as your book title implies,the victim contains a large
portion of the evidence of proofthat a crime was committed and
while it is challenging andthat's really putting it very
mildly to submit this type ofevidence and endure its
(16:32):
collection, this process iscritical to pursuing justice and
potentially preventing futurecrimes by the perpetrator.
Can you lay out the process ofdocumenting a sexual assault and
help us understand how theevidence is used?
Speaker 3 (16:48):
Yeah, and I do like to point out that I am not a
former detective or a detectiveor lawyer, so the advice I give
is my own, from my ownexperience and talking to
experts in their fields.
But when you've been sexuallyassaulted again like we talked
about the beginning of theepisode so much of the time
you're just confused about whathappened and making a decision
(17:08):
like reporting, going to avictim advocate, going to the
hospital, might feeloverwhelming, and that's okay.
I was a delayed reporter myself.
I did not do any of these stepsright away.
But some things that you can do, whether it's by yourself or
again with the support of anadvocate, is document everything
that happened in a way that'llbe time-stamped, Document who
(17:29):
was there, where you were, thetimes, you remember the details
and you can send this in anemail because that'll be
time-stamped.
If it's easier to do like avoice note and email it to
yourself or to a safe person,that's another idea.
If you're going to not go tothe hospital right away, you can
take off your clothes and putthem in a Ziploc bag or
somewhere where they'll besealed and protected.
After sexual violence you feeldirty because your body is the
(17:53):
crime scene and it's verytempting and you want to shower
and scrub yourself clean.
If you've already done that andyou're listening to that,
that's perfectly okay.
You have not ruined yourchances to report or have a rape
kit done.
That's okay.
But if you can hold off becauseyou think you might want to
report, that is helpful for DNAcollection.
Trying to avoid to go to thebathroom if you're going to have
(18:14):
a rape kit done can be helpful.
But again, many people don'trealize they've been sexually
assaulted until later.
So if you've done these things,it's okay.
You can still go in and have arape kit done, Depending on the
state you're in a couple days toeven 10 days, I think in
Minnesota is what it is you canstill go in and have some DNA
potentially collected.
You can still go in and betested for STIs, physical
(18:38):
injuries have those examined andlooked at.
If you have a rape kit done, itdoes not mean that you're
reporting.
It just means that the data hasbeen, the DNA has been
collected and stored.
You can choose to report, butthat way it's there.
From there you can also talk toagain the victim advocate and
choose to make a report later.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
So you made an important point there.
At the end, even though you dothe rape kit and you go through
that whole process, that doesn'tmean you've reported the crime.
What is the next step thatwould need to be taken there?
Speaker 3 (19:09):
If you want to report , you can, and then you can tell
them that you had a rape kitdone.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
And when you say report, that means contacting
law enforcement, correct?
Speaker 3 (19:17):
Correct.
Okay, so those are two separateprocesses.
You can report without having arape kit done.
You can have a rape kit donewithout reporting.
Those are two differentprocesses.
One just collects the DNA, soif you get to court they can use
that there.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Got it.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
That's an important place for having a victim like a
community advocate is sohelpful because they can be
there with you.
Place where having a victimlike a community advocate is so
helpful because they can bethere with you.
And it's important to rememberthat you can say no to any part
of that process of having a rapekit done.
For example, if you want to goin and you don't want any of
like a pelvic exam done at all,you can say no.
You can say yes just to partsof it and say no to other parts.
If you don't feel ready, youcan ask for a break.
(19:52):
This is a place where you getto take some power and control
back, and having a safe personthere with you can make a really
big difference.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Yeah, absolutely.
You included some ideas in thebook that, to me, make it not
just a handbook but more of atrauma-informed one at that.
So, for instance, you point outin the book that in most cases,
survivors have options, as youjust were talking about.
Out in the book that in mostcases, survivors have options,
as you just were talking about.
They have options, and you alsoincluded thoughts from
(20:23):
survivors about theirexperiences and reactions to
them, and you built in pausesthroughout the book with prompts
for mindful check-ins.
So, while I can understand thevalue of all of these inclusions
, I'm curious why it wasimportant to you to offer them
in this resource.
Speaker 3 (20:36):
One thing I learned in this process is that I had my
experience, but I'm not anexpert in everything related to
sexual assault and everysurvivor has a different, unique
experience and their healing'sdifferent, and I wanted to
highlight that I didn't want thereader to feel like my
experience.
If it didn't look like theirexperience, they couldn't use it
.
So it's important to me to havethe validation and support of
(20:57):
other survivors through theirquotes, their thoughts, their
stories, but also to have thatmarked very clearly so if the
reader doesn't want to readthose sections because it's
triggering, they can skip overit.
I know personally after myassault, reading memoirs was not
something I could do because itwas too upsetting.
So I wanted the reader to beable to get the educational
information out of the book andsupplement it with the
(21:21):
validation of the survivor'squotes, without feeling forced
or tricked into reading those ifthey didn't want to.
But there's so much insight fromother survivors and, again, I
didn't talk to any survivorsafter my assault but hearing all
of the thoughts from otherpeople on why they did report,
why they didn't report whatworked for them with healing,
(21:42):
what didn't work, I'm hoping itcan provide support and
validation to the reader as towhatever their healing process
is looking like.
It's okay.
And then the mindful check-insat the end of each chapter was
important to me because, again,when I was trying to gather all
the information about reportingand what going to court would be
like, I kind of spent readthrough everything and I didn't
really take into considerationmy own mental health.
I didn't take pauses to checkin with myself.
(22:05):
And I wanted to encourage thereader to do that.
This isn't a sprint, this isvery much a marathon healing
from sexual trauma, so that wasa big part of it.
It was again trying to helpremind them to take care of
themselves, to breathe throughthis.
I tried to have littlehomework-like prompts, almost to
take down notes as they gothrough on what applies and what
(22:26):
doesn't.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Yeah, really important points.
And the other thing I reallylike about this guidebook is
that I can pick it up in anypart of the book and just start
learning from that point, so Idon't need to read it cover to
cover in one sitting all the waystraight through.
You can stop and start and findplaces in the book, just to
pick it up and open it up andread it from any point forward.
(22:49):
That's meaningful for you.
You also talk about in the workand in conversations you and I
have had about restorativejustice, and I'd like to talk
about restorative justice andmaybe you can give us an
overview of what survivors canexpect as they move through the
judicial process.
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Yeah, absolutely, and I'm very fortunate to have
experts who contribute in detailon what the investigation
process is looking like orreporting or going to court.
So I recommend those sectionstoo.
But one of the hardest thingsabout the criminal justice
process is the lack of control.
You feel as the victim of thecrime when you make that report.
Ultimately, the case thenbecomes that of the states and
(23:32):
you are a witness to that crime.
It's not your case and thatfeels really hard, because
sexual violence and trauma isabout control and not feeling a
sense of control of anything,including your own body, and so
that can be reallyre-traumatizing.
I still think that it's worthpursuing if it feels right to
you.
Just have a strong support teambehind you.
(23:53):
But that piece of not feelingcontrol of it is really hard.
So when you make the initialcall in, they'll take down the
immediate information.
They'll make sure you have asafety plan and that you're safe
.
You'll then have your reporthanded to a detective who will
do a more thorough interviewwith you.
This is another place wherethat victim advocate can be with
you if you'd like to helpprovide support, and then from
(24:14):
there the investigation begins.
That can take a wide range oftime, which again is hard,
because you're probably notgetting updates, frequent
updates, on what's happening.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
So you're kind of left wondering.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
I know for me I was really fortunate that my
detective did keep me moreinvolved and did give me like
check-ins to make sure I wasdoing okay.
But they don't have to do that.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
Right, and it can be an extremely long process,
depending on the circumstancesof each case.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
Yeah, and that part's really hard and I was like for
myself what the hardest part wasis after it was brought to
prosecution they decided to takeit to court.
That wait, because I think thatwas over a year and the trial
would get pushed back forvarious reasons and that part
was really hard.
Restorative and transformativejustice is a process where
(25:01):
you're working outside of thecriminal court system with a
facilitator the perpetrator, theperson who caused you harm, is
there, and then typically somecommunity members.
It depends on the circle orprocess format they can vary,
but where you have aconversation all together about
the harm that was caused, whathappened that led to that person
, about the harm that was caused, what happened that led to that
person causing the harm, andthen the impacts it has on the
(25:22):
community and trying to createlike an accountability plan.
And it's not going to beappropriate for everyone, but
just even having that option Ithink for survivors would be so
helpful, because so many peoplefeel like the only sense of
justice that they can have is bygoing through the criminal
court system and in reality,very few people who go through
(25:42):
the criminal court system end upwalking away with any sense of
procedural justice Whereasrestorative justice.
The idea is to be able to havethat conversation around
accountability and heal and beable to move forward.
So I'm excited about thoseconversations that are happening
, trying to make it moreavailable for sexual assault
survivors.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
How does one request that type of conversation?
Speaker 3 (26:05):
It depends on where you're at because, like I said,
it's not available everywhere.
So here in like I'm in themetro area of Minnesota, it's
not available for sexual assaultsurvivors but they're working
to make it available for themand by knowing Canada, they've
been having a lot more successwith making it available.
So it's going to vary whereyou're at, but talking to your
sexual assault advocate again isa really good place to see if
(26:25):
that's available and just startthat conversation.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Yeah, I would think talking to your elected
officials may be a good place togo as well and tell them that
it's important to you.
Yeah, maybe do some educationaround what it actually is and
how it would benefit.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Yeah, there's more organizations speaking out for
this and trying to make itavailable, which is really great
to see.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
Yeah, that's amazing.
I'm looking forward to meetingyou in person in May at the
conference on crimes againstwomen.
Because you're a presenter.
Is this your first timepresenting at the conference?
Speaker 3 (26:59):
It is.
I'm looking forward to it.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
How exciting.
Tell us what you're going to betalking about in your workshop.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Yes, I'm presenting with Justin Boardman, who
contributed to the book as well.
He's a retired detective, butwe are presenting on how we can
help keep survivors engaged inthe process as they're getting
ready to go to court, while alsogiving them a better sense of
procedural justice andsupporting the people who are
working in systems to avoidburnout.
(27:25):
And we're trying to help peoplethink outside the box on how
they can do this.
And we have again some of theexperts from the book sharing
some information for thepresentation.
For example, Angela Goins is aregistered dietitian who is
focusing on how trauma impactsour relationship with food and
for many survivors, eatingdisorders go hand in hand with
(27:47):
healing from trauma because wehave control over our food and
what we're putting in our body.
So if we can help give them thetools to have a better
nutritional knowledge, they'regonna be better set up to stay
engaged throughout the processof getting ready for court and
then feel more prepared to go tocourt, and that can help them
have that sense of proceduraljustice, feel supported
throughout that process.
Speaker 1 (28:08):
Yeah, that's an interesting example because it
does a lot of things.
I mean, proper nutrition reallydoes help to reduce some of
your trauma symptoms, and italso just the process of
learning how to eat and what toeat and preparing food and so on
can be very empowering.
And I love the idea and this iskind of woven throughout the
(28:30):
book too of taking some babysteps, if you will, little steps
that add up to bigger change or, you know, to achieving a goal
that you want, because maybe oneday it looks like just being
able to make your own foodchoices is really empowering,
and then the next day you needto call your elected officials
(28:52):
right.
So small things can truly addup and they certainly do in your
life and in the work thatyou've done to put this book
together and now get to thispresentation.
Let's give people your websiteand social media handles so they
can learn more and maybe get intouch.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
Absolutely.
The website iswearetheevidencecom and on
social media you can find me aswearetheevidence on Instagram,
tiktok.
On LinkedIn it's just CheyenneWilson, and I'm happy to connect
with people there, and then thebook is available.
Wherever you like to purchaseyour books, I always recommend
trying to support your localbookseller.
I think that's really important.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
And then I try to encourage people to call their
local library, make sure theyhave a copy available as well.
So many people, unfortunately,are experiencing sexual violence
at home and bringing a booklike this home is not an option.
But the library can be a safeplace where they can go and,
like you said, pick up the book,go to the section that they
need and then set it down andcome back to it later without
(29:56):
without again bringing it home,where it might be dangerous to
do so.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
Yeah, that's excellent advice, cheyenne.
I really enjoyed reading thebook and learning more about
your work, and I look forward toseeing you.
Speaker 3 (30:06):
I am too.
Thank you again for having me.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Thanks so much for listening.
Until next time, stay safe.
The 2025 Conference on CrimesAgainst Women will take place in
Dallas, Texas, May 19th throughthe 22nd at the Sheraton Dallas
.
Learn more and register atconferencecaworg and follow us
on social media at National CCAW.
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