December 9, 2024 • 28 mins
In today’s episode, Steve sits down with Brian Orr, a branding expert and founder of BrandingLab.co, to discuss the critical role of branding in podcasting and business growth. They explore the differences between branding and marketing, the importance of consistency, and how to effectively position yourself or your business in the minds of your audience. Whether you're a podcaster, entrepreneur, or interested in personal branding, this episode offers valuable insights into building a strong brand identity.
Key Takeaways:
- Understanding Brand vs. Marketing:
- Branding is about how your audience perceives and talks about you; it's their interpretation of your message.
- Marketing is the method by which people find you; it's about visibility and outreach.
- Consistency is Crucial:
- Maintaining consistent messaging, content, and promises is essential for building trust and a strong brand identity.
- Inconsistencies can lead to audience disengagement and dilute your brand's impact.
- Define Your Audience and Goals:
- Before starting a podcast or any marketing effort, clarify who you're trying to reach and what action you want them to take.
- Tailor your content to meet the needs and interests of your target audience.
- The Power of Personal Branding:
- People prefer to do business with people, not faceless companies.
- Developing a personal brand helps individuals connect authentically with clients and customers.
- Leverage Your Strengths and Delegate:
- Focus on what you do best and consider outsourcing tasks that don't align with your skills, such as podcast production.
- Collaborating with others who excel in areas where you don't can enhance your overall effectiveness.
- Storytelling as a Tool:
- Sharing stories of challenges and successes can position you as an expert and provide value to your audience.
- Decide whether you or your guests are the "hero" of your podcast to effectively connect with listeners.
What's Next?
Visit BrandingLab.co to learn more about Brian Orr's branding services, including corporate training and personal coaching. If you're looking to strengthen your brand identity, connect with Brian for expert guidance.
Stay Tuned:
Keep listening to Podcasting Badass for more expert insights on podcasting, branding, and business growth. Don't forget to subscribe and leave a review!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Steve (00:00):
Hey there and welcome to another episode of podcasting.
Bad-ass it's your host soberSteve, the podcast sky.
And today we are having a greatconversation with Brian or about
branding.
Brian is a branding mastermind.
And I can't wait to share thisamazing conversation that we had
talking about how to turn abranding as a concept into a
(00:22):
podcast, as well as howimportant branding is for
podcasters.
And what is your brand, how todefine what your brand is.
Versus managing that versus yoursocial media appearance, or your
episode structures and formatand style, and figuring out
where you stand in the grandscheme of the podcasting world.
So enjoy this episode and makesure you are following wherever
(00:42):
you listen.
So you can get these newepisodes when they come out
every single Monday.
Enjoy.
Hey there, it's Sober Steve heretoday with the branding master,
Brian Orr.
Hey Brian, how are you?
Hey Steve, what's going onbuddy?
Not much.
I had gotten the pleasure tomeet you recently at a local
networking event, but for mylisteners, why don't you
(01:02):
introduce yourself?
Brian (01:04):
Sure, my name is Brian Orr.
It was a long way to get towhere we are now.
But for, 20 some odd years, Iwas a professional DJ and I
built my personal brand before Iknew what that was back when I
was around 15 years old.
So that took me on a journey andit actually created a lot of
(01:24):
opportunities for me.
I had worked in a bunch ofdifferent countries with some
major brands and some media.
And over here recently, whatI've been realizing is there's a
lot of need.
For people and businesses tofocus on their brand.
The opportunities that brandingcreated for me put me on this
track to become an investor anda consultant for business
(01:49):
development and really whathappened, why I just started
seeing more and more of thatneed for branding.
So I said, maybe I can make abigger impact.
Maybe I can make a bigger splashif I could.
Help people in this area.
What I did so well for so manyyears.
So that's where we're at rightnow.
Steve (02:03):
Yeah.
And I definitely, when I heardwhat you did, my ears perked up
because branding is huge forpodcasters.
I know when I startedpodcasting, I had a huge
advantage doing sales andmarketing because you need to be
able to sales and market yourpodcast to be able to help it
grow efficiently.
But I didn't have brandingexperience.
Cause I worked for these bigcompanies that took care of
their branding.
I was just like, The puppet thatwas really good at repeating
(02:24):
things back.
So this was my first time reallylike doing my brand when I
started podcasting.
And so having to figure out whatthat was, took me over a hundred
episodes before I had to paysomeone to help me figure it out
for me or with me as to what itis and how to achieve it.
But that's when things startedreally taking off for me.
So what would you say yourrelationship with like podcasts
have been in terms of listening?
(02:45):
Tell me about your podcasting.
Brian (02:47):
Yeah, I'm a big fan of podcasting.
I'm a big fan of it as a, as aninfluence builder for a personal
brand or a corporate brand.
Really.
I liked the idea of the deliverymechanism.
I like everything aboutpodcasting.
I don't like producing my ownpodcast that I don't like.
So I did right before COVID.
(03:09):
I started building a podcast forbusiness development.
It was called, what was itcalled?
I don't even remember what it'scalled, man.
It was five years ago.
I, whatever it's called, itmight still be, it might still
exist somewhere on iTunes orsomething.
I can't remember what it was.
Yeah, it's probably out there inthe podcasting graveyard.
It's out there.
Yes.
So it was right before COVID andI was interviewing business
(03:30):
leaders and we were talkingabout these challenges that they
had in their business challengesthat they had in their personal
life and how they broke throughthese challenges.
That's essentially the premiseof what it was.
And I recorded something like, Irecorded like 30 episodes and I
aired about eight of them andCOVID hit and then everything
(03:54):
went haywire.
Plus there were like 7, 000 newpodcasts every day.
And for me, it just didn't, theROI wasn't there for me to
continue to do it alone, thedevelopment alone.
It was extremely hard back then,it might be easier now, but it
was extremely hard back then.
(04:14):
So I have a lot of airedepisodes, and I also have a lot
of dead episodes that are justsitting on a file on my drive
somewhere.
That maybe I'll bring them backto life at some point.
But as far as podcasting as amedium, I love it.
And I think it's superopportunistic for people who
either host or appear onpodcasts to develop their brand.
Steve (04:33):
Yeah.
Certainly, since I made aprofession of it would have to
agree now with what you do, howdo you feel branding plays into
podcasting?
Because as a podcast listenerand fan of podcast, have you
listened to podcasts where youliked the podcast content or
topic but struggled withlistening to it or staying
because they were having brandor identity issues?
Brian (04:55):
Yeah, I guess if we're talking podcast specifically,
there are some that have comeacross where it's like, They
brand themselves as a particularthing, but the content does not
always stay consistent with whatthey told you that they were
going to bring to you.
And when you're listening to itit's off the cup and it's not
necessarily delivering the valuethat you anticipated when read
(05:18):
or, clicked on it too.
To listen.
So that's one of the challengeswith everything with branding,
right?
Is the consistency.
So if you brand yourself, if youbrand yourself as a Rogan where
you just talk to a bunch ofdifferent people about a bunch
of different things, then peopletune in because they want to
hear different people talk aboutdifferent things.
(05:40):
But if you brand yourself as,let's say a marketing podcast,
but then you spend, hours andhours talking about, I don't
know, anything that's notmarketing you you're not likely
to sustain an audience.
And you're not likely tocommunicate and certainly not
convert if you're trying toeither sell through your podcast
(06:01):
or allow your guests to sellthrough their podcast.
So I think that branding isextremely crucial and it must
stay consistent with what you'repromising to your audience.
From your thumbnail.
Steve (06:12):
Yeah, I definitely agree.
Making sure that the title, theart and the topic all match.
And so oftentimes I find peoplewere one of those threes out of
date, not intentionally, butbecause they made some sort of
update or change.
Yeah.
So things can happen with that.
And I definitely can see thatbeing a deterrent.
So when someone comes to you tostart working with you, what are
some of the common issues thatthey're facing?
Brian (06:34):
So I work with people, individuals as a personal brand,
and I work with corporations,helping them build their
corporate brand.
Also, within a corporation, I dotraining as well.
For example, I've trained arecent one was a broker.
She had about 12 real estateagents that work for her, and
she brought me in to teach themabout personal branding.
(06:56):
So How they can brand themselvespersonally as a subset of the
organization.
But, as people are starting torealize nobody wants to do
business with a company, peoplewant to do business with people.
So they're actually puttingpeople forward ahead of the
corporation with the corporationsort of guidelines and backbone
there.
But putting the person forward.
(07:17):
So there's the personal brand.
Could be a variety of things.
Influencers entrepreneurs orsolopreneurs or, small business
owners who want to create moreof a demand tension by putting
themselves out front, which iswhat they should do.
Yeah.
And then there's the corporatewhere it's okay.
What are we going to do here?
I don't do design.
(07:38):
So that's where I've stopped.
I do thought work.
I do analysis.
I do strategy.
I don't do design when it getsto design They have their brand
guidelines so they could takethat to their design team.
They could take that to theirmarketing team I don't do any of
that I do all of that stuff thatshould be done first that
foundational stuff the mindsetstuff the thought stuff Of the
(07:59):
analysis the strategy and that'son a corporate level or a
personal level as well
Steve (08:04):
Yeah, and I know that especially since so many of my
clients and listeners are peoplethat are doing this for
businesses, whether it be theirpersonal businesses or their
franchises, they're podcastingfor business.
So it is oftentimes figuring outhow you can be a unique host as
well as stick to the corporateor the company brand.
And so what would you say ifsomeone.
(08:25):
What are signs and symptoms ofsomeone having an issue or
identity crisis with their brandand they might not realize it?
Oh, man.
Oh.
Cause I, I was having an issuefor years.
I like the question.
Yeah.
Cause I'll say like when I hadmy podcast for over a year and a
half with a hundred episodescalled Gay A, I thought I was so
(08:46):
clever because it was a play onAA and they were for gay people.
I didn't think about the SEO ofgay a not being friendly or
having any sort of extra wordsto add on to it.
So no one could find me unless Iwas like making them find me.
And even then it was verydifficult because they couldn't
just search those words.
So it's do things like add atitle extension.
But like I, I was wondering whyI was having these issues with
(09:07):
branding and why people can findme and why.
my social media content, whichlike one week is about the
episodes and another week aboutmy dog, why that wasn't flying
off or taking off.
And so I had to have someonelike you come and help that out.
So for someone who might begoing around life, blissfully
ignorant of their need forrebranding, what are some of
(09:27):
those signs and symptoms?
Brian (09:29):
Yeah, it's an excellent question.
And you just ran through alaundry list of signs and
symptoms, but let me clarifysomething that may help this
perspective.
Brand has nothing to do withpeople finding you online.
Okay.
Brand has to do with peopletelling other people about you.
Okay.
That's where brand is.
So let me explain that a littlebit more.
(09:49):
People talk often about buildinga brand.
You can't actually build abrand.
What a brand is the audience,the recipient, their
interpretation of the messagesthat you're communicating.
So you're trying to communicateyourself as the gay a play on
words, the talk about my dog,whatever it is that you're
(10:10):
putting out there, what woulddefine your brand is the way
that the listeners, the peoplewho have received the
information interpret that howthey position you in their
brain.
Do they position you as somebodywho's fun and engaging, who's
interesting, who comes off witha variety of topics that they
want to tune into every week, ordo you appear as someone who is
(10:31):
a little bit discombobulated?
You're not really sure whatyou're going to get.
And it's not quite appealing.
The same message can registertwo different ways or more, a
multitude of different ways.
In effect, what you're trying todo when people talk about
building their brand is developthis consistent type of position
in someone else's mind so theycan categorize you.
(10:51):
Our brains like to categorizeour brains, like to put things
in its place.
So our brain needs to know whereto put you.
You as you, Steve, and you,anyone that's listening to this.
In their brain, where do weposition you?
Do we position you as the personwe can go to if we need help
moving a refrigerator?
Do we position you as the personwe can go to if we want to talk
(11:12):
about our feelings, right?
Where do we position you?
And that's for you as anindividual or whatever your
service or product you'reproviding.
So that's what brand actuallyis.
And then when you get into SEO,when you get into how people
find you, that's marketing,right?
That's not branding.
Branding is how you defineyourself and the type of
(11:33):
influence that you want to haveto audience and the way that
audience essentially defines youand positions you.
That's where brand stops andeverything else beyond that.
Is marketing.
Steve (11:48):
Yeah, that definitely makes sense because I do like
with my clients, I don't have itall planned out or thought out
as you, but we do start withmore of just what, who are you,
what are you doing?
What do you want from yourpodcast?
What are your goals and how arewe going to get there in terms
of delivering information?
And then we figure out like thehouse and the marketing and all
of that kind of stuff.
So what would you say if someonewas to start a podcast would be
(12:10):
things to, to really thinkabout, to reflect on their, If
they were making a podcast fortheir business, what would it
be?
Things to reflect on beforehitting record?
Yeah.
Brian (12:20):
The first question is the podcast, the business, or is the
business something else?
Steve (12:26):
Generally, a lot of my clients, they already have a
business that exists and they'relooking for the podcast as a way
to grow it in a unique way tostand out as unique and
interesting in their industry.
Brian (12:35):
So the podcast is a marketing tool.
Yes.
So the podcast itself shouldhave its own brand identity.
All right.
That's when you're talking abouthow it's displayed to the world,
the thumbnails and the missionstatement or whatever it is that
you're communicating outwardly.
It should have consistency.
Of course, with whatever it is,it could be a variety of things,
(12:58):
or it could be one very specificthing.
Let's use a fitness examplebecause those are pretty easy to
use, if it's a gym owner or gymfranchise owner who wants to
start communicating throughpodcast medium to attract
attention to their gym, there'sa lot there.
It's so deep.
I, every time I want to saysomething out loud, I think I
should say something else thereyou, because.
(13:20):
Who are they trying to reachwith their podcast and how are
they trying to convert them tocustomers?
Are they just trying to becomewell known as individuals so
that they can go out and dospeaking engagements as
professional trainers?
Are they trying to bring peopleinto their gym?
Then you're doing very localkind of stuff, right?
You wouldn't be having thisglobal kind of communication
(13:41):
scale, even though the podcastcan reach globally.
It doesn't do you any good ifyou're in Florida and people are
in Minnesota and your conversionis to try to get them to come
into your gym.
So there's many levels as faras.
Like you mentioned who you are,who you're trying to reach, what
you're trying to get them to do.
And you have to go through thatfrom not only your corporation
(14:02):
or business, but yourself as anindividual, and then your
marketing tool, which is yourpodcast.
And they all have to work inunison to get to the ultimate
result of what you.
Want the person who's listeningto the action that you want them
to take.
Steve (14:18):
Yeah, that definitely makes sense.
And how might it be different ifit was someone doing a hobby
podcast about a passion oftheirs versus if it was a
corporate company that you wereworking with and consulting
with,
Brian (14:31):
I think the same question holds true.
It's what do you want theaudience to do?
Do you just want them to listento you?
Are you just trying to getpeople to listen to you?
Then you, that's what the newsis, right?
Then you would do shock and aweand fear and panic because
people will listen to thatstuff.
Will it get them to buyanything?
(14:52):
Probably not unless you'reselling emergency kits or
doomsday.
Bunkers or something, right?
All the gross stuff.
Yeah.
What?
Yeah, but it just depends onwhat you want the audience to
do.
What is the action that you wantthem to take?
So if you want them to buysomething from you, even if it's
just your presence, if you wantthem to hire you to speak
somewhere, or if you want themto hire you as a coach, then all
(15:14):
of the content from the podcast,even though it's a hobby podcast
or we could call it a personalbranding kind of podcast.
If what you're selling is you oryour business, your service or
your small products, right?
Then all of the communicationoutbound should be That chess
match to try to positionyourself in their brain.
So you become the person thatthey think of when that problem
(15:39):
comes about.
And even if we go back to theguy said, I don't know why I
said moving a refrigerator butit came out.
So let's say you were a muscleguy and you charged people a fee
to be manual labor.
You could do a podcast talkingabout all of the benefits of not
doing it yourself, right?
(15:59):
The hazards of doing ityourself.
You can hurt yourself,insurance, this, all these kinds
of things.
And all the benefits of beingable to dial, five, five, five
muscle and have the guy comeover and do the thing for you.
And there's a variety ofdifferent ways that you can
communicate that message, butultimately all of it is designed
to have the audience take someparticular action.
Steve (16:23):
Yeah, no, that definitely makes sense.
So if you wanted to start apodcast that you didn't have to
produce, what would the actionyou would want your listeners in
this podcast to do?
Brian (16:33):
Me personally?
Steve (16:34):
Yeah.
Brian (16:36):
If I was to start a podcast again, I think I would
want my audience, I'm a teacher.
I like to educate.
I'm not an actual teacher.
I just, as a personality, I liketo teach and I like to educate.
I would probably use a podcastfor myself as a way to educate
people on a lot of thepsychological elements behind
(16:56):
branding, a lot of the reasonsto and the pitfalls of not
having a brand, right?
So ultimately, does the actionfor that have them hire me as a
coach?
Potentially, does it have themhire me in some way?
Does it have them hire mycompany to come in and do some
corporate training?
Potentially, but I would have tothen continue to think about.
(17:19):
What type of audience am Iactually building?
Am I building listeners or am Ibuilding some kind of a funnel
that I want to convert, andthey're not mutually exclusive.
They could be the same thingwhere you start with a top of
funnel thing where you'reproviding education and value
and information through content,and then.
(17:39):
ultimately positioning yourselfas the person of influence for
that particular topic.
And then if somebody chooses towant to move further in a
personal brand or in a corporatetraining perspective, then they
would look to you to be theperson to do that.
So that's the map that I thinkthat I would go through and it
would start with education.
And I would probably do, Moreoften me personally, I would
(18:02):
probably do people like you,like that example that you had,
where you realized.
What could have been and likewasted time, wasted money,
wasted energy.
It had you just taking adifferent action sooner.
I would probably do a whole, ifI was to do it, it would be all
stories like that.
It would just be all failures.
That's what I'm thinking.
It would be all failures thatthen there's a recovery element
(18:25):
and a success element.
And then position myself as theperson or my company, as the
people to be able to facilitatethat transformation for you
before you fail.
Steve (18:37):
Yeah, for sure.
I definitely think that's agreat way of doing it.
That's three of the main waysthat I recommend my audience do
podcasts.
Cause oftentimes people come tome and they're like, I'm going
to do an interview podcast andjust ask questions and go around
acting like I don't know theanswers to anything.
And I try and explain like for abusiness, that's not always the
best way to come up.
With expert positioning.
So I love what you're talkingabout, like giving the advice
and the direct content.
(18:58):
But then also I feel like you'vebeen doing this long enough that
I'm sure you have some clientsthat can come on that you've
worked with that can do kind ofclient journey episodes where
you talk about the problems cameto you with and what it's been
like as their business has grownor as their brand has grown,
once they figure it out withyou, as well as if you're doing
consultations or doing freebieslike that, where you can meet
someone with a problem andbrainstorm together, like what
(19:20):
we're doing right now.
A potential client could beanother way to do episode
formats where you're always theone in the expert chair, because
that will definitely be the waywhere people are listening to
you.
They can listen to a mix of tipsand tricks and hints, as well as
you finding someone who's inhelp and starting the fixing
process, and then also gettingto hear stories of you fix them
already, but I can imagine itwith a good mix of that people
(19:41):
will be signing up for yourcoaching and help and branding
left and right.
Brian (19:47):
Yeah, I think so.
I think there's kind of two waysyou can go about it, right?
You can go about it where youposition yourself as the expert
and that's one strategy.
And that's very effective for alot of people in a lot of ways,
especially on a solopreneur or avery lean team.
And you're trying to funnelbusiness through your podcast.
I think that's a very successfulway, but I think if you're
(20:08):
trying to build your podcast asthe product, if that's the
product, then I would positionit where the stories are the
hero and that's why more peoplewill want to tune in to listen
to the podcast.
But again, this goes back towhat is the action that we want
them to take.
And then all of that psychologyand strategy and positioning.
(20:33):
Would align based on that.
So do I want to be the herowhere I get them into my
ecosystem?
So that way I'm positioned asthe expert and the go to for
this thing, or do I want toposition my podcast as the hero
where essentially the podcast isa product, but the audience
would be the hero or the guestswould be the hero through their
storytelling.
Does that make sense?
(20:53):
What I'm thinking you're theexpert in this.
I'm not the expert in this.
Steve (20:56):
I'm just, you're right.
It's the two podcasts that Ihave.
I have my business one for thisbusiness that we're like doing
right now.
Basically that is very much whatI explained and recommended for
you.
And then I have my gay, which Istill keep going.
Just now I call it the queersober hero show because it's
about having heroes and queersobriety on every single week
and it's their story.
And they are the hero in thepodcast is the brand, not me.
(21:20):
So it is I.
I'm using both approachesbecause it has different things.
This is part of my business andprofession, while the other one
is something that I do forservice as a hobby and while
helping keep me sober.
It is at the end of the day theintention as well of what you're
looking to do with your podcast.
Brian (21:36):
Yeah.
Hey, at least I know I've knowwhat I'm talking about a little
bit.
Steve (21:40):
Validated.
Steve.
Yes.
You are definitely validated.
I was like, if we work together,you don't have to take my
orientation course.
You pass already.
Brian (21:51):
So what's next,
Steve (21:52):
buddy?
I was going to say, do you haveany other, you said producing
was a big obstacle for you withpodcasting.
What did you mean by that?
Brian (22:00):
Yeah.
There's two things about me.
One is I am, if you're familiarwith the terms from the book
traction, EOS, a rocket fuelvisionary.
And if you want to think aboutit, some people that you might
know or stories that you mightknow, there's like the Walt
Disney and the Roy Disney WaltDisney, drew the mouse and Roy
(22:21):
Disney built theme park, right?
Like that kind of thing.
So I am the visionary.
I've taken these assessments.
I'm 98 percent visionary.
A lot of people are balanced,right?
They have some elements of,yeah, I can think of the stuff
to do, and then I can do thisstuff I am all about thinking of
the stuff to do and very littleabout doing the stuff.
(22:42):
So that's obstacle.
Number one obstacle.
Number two is.
When I feel a congestion oftraffic, I don't work well in
that capacity, meaning thepodcast for me at the time was
worth it in 2019, and it wasworth me putting that extra
(23:04):
effort into the production sideand into the marketing side and
all of this because I thoughtthat I could do it on my own and
manage all of the things, butwhen the world happened and the
market just started getting soflooded.
Not to say that it's not the waynow it is the way it's just for
me, that's the challenge is whenall of that flooding started to
(23:28):
come in with so many differentpeople at home talking to each
other on the computer.
Now, I said, is this really theway that I believe that I can
continue to carve a unique nichefor me based on my skill set and
my abilities?
And the answer was no.
It's the, all of the production,the management, the marketing,
(23:48):
all of that stuff is not my kindof forte, but should you start a
podcast if you could, and if youhad the capacity and if you had
the team and all of that, wouldthat be a good, yes, absolutely.
For me, personally, it's alittle tough.
It's a little tough to wrap myhead around doing it all over
(24:09):
again.
Steve (24:10):
No, and I especially remember what it was like when I
first started podcasting four orfive years ago.
I say that's when my graysstarted.
They started beforehand, but Isay that's what happened because
those first few programs that Iwas using and I was trying all
the free ones.
Or different ones that were likethe cheaper ones.
And even then, even when Ifinally got the nicer programs,
it was a lot more complicated.
(24:31):
And then they added more updatesand more updates as AI becomes
more of a thing.
And so the editing process hasgotten so much easier that's
when I've always been like a mixof the creative as well as the
back end producing side ofthings.
But yeah.
It's gotten to the point wherethe producing side has been so
easy for me that when I startedcoaching someone and they were
like, all right great.
Now I need to just talk to mywebsite guy who will then talk
(24:51):
to my graphic artist who willthen talk to my uploader who
will talk to like my editor, andshe had five or six different
people that were helping hermake her show.
I was like, I can do all ofthat.
And what I love is theseconversations are what light me
up or make me happy.
But I can be cool and chill inthe studio as well, listening to
some music in the background,doing editing and producing all
day long.
So I like that, I'm able tooffer my clients, I'll help and
(25:14):
take that off of your plate.
So you can be just thevisionary.
That's fantastic helpful.
Brian (25:19):
The balance is hard, man, because I don't even have a
balance.
It's so imbalanced.
Really?
There's a test.
It's called rocket fuel It's anextraction from the book and it
talks about the two types ofpeople that you need to have,
like the major businessdevelopment, major companies,
right?
Yeah.
It's the Steve Jobs and theSteve Wozniak, like the thinker
and the doer and I am all theway thinker and there's a test
(25:42):
on Rocket fuel, dot, whatever.
I don't know what the thing is,but anyway.
I encourage people to do itbecause it's part of branding
too.
The more you learn aboutyourself, self awareness is, the
first thing that I work onidentity, and that's the first
step that I work on because youhave to know who really you are,
not who you think you are,right?
There's tools that you can.
I have one of my domains, it'scalled the influence quiz.
(26:05):
com and you can go there andcheck how influential you are.
Some people I know scored reallywell on it.
Some people not so much.
I got an 84%.
Steve (26:14):
I was happy.
My coach would be very proud ofme.
Brian (26:20):
I love it.
Yeah, I saw your score.
I was like, it's sometimes youmeet people and then they take
the test and then you get toknow them and you're like, Oh,
yeah, it feels obvious.
I could have guessed what yourscore would have been.
But yeah, what I'm getting atwith all that was personally, I
don't even have a balance.
So when I fill my team in anyway, it's with the people who
(26:41):
are there.
The ones who love doing thething, and that's for anybody in
whatever capacity you havethings that you hate things that
are like the bane of yourexistence.
It could be spreadsheets, or itcould be ideas, or it could be
communication, or it could bewhatever.
Someone else out thereabsolutely loves it.
They do it.
They live, eat, breathe, andsleep it.
(27:03):
And the best advice that I cangive is to find that person who
does that, who loves that, whowants to, and then put them
right in that place and let themdo it for you.
And then you just be the geniusat whatever it is that you are
in whichever role it is.
And it's make a happy life.
I almost said happy wife.
She's back there, but happy.
Happy life for sure.
Steve (27:25):
Yeah, exactly.
Excellent.
I think that's a great place toend on.
So how would people find you ifthey wanted to connect Brian,
Brian (27:31):
go to branding lab.
co and that's where I'm buildingeverything out right now.
The new, the newer company wherewe do corporate training,
individual coaching.
I have a bunch of other coachesthat I work with and a lot of
happy clients.
So go there, branding lab.
co and all my connecting info ison there.
Steve (27:52):
All right.
Excellent.
I'll add that to the show notesas well.
So thank you so much.
Brian (27:55):
Thanks, Steve.
This was awesome.
Great conversation, bud.
Steve (27:59):
Yeah.
Thank you.
And thank you listeners fortuning in.
Hey there and welcome to another episode of podcasting.
Bad-ass it's your host soberSteve, the podcast sky.
And today we are having a greatconversation with Brian or about
branding.
Brian is a branding mastermind.
And I can't wait to share thisamazing conversation that we had
talking about how to turn abranding as a concept into a
(00:22):
podcast, as well as howimportant branding is for
podcasters.
And what is your brand, how todefine what your brand is.
Versus managing that versus yoursocial media appearance, or your
episode structures and formatand style, and figuring out
where you stand in the grandscheme of the podcasting world.
So enjoy this episode and makesure you are following wherever
(00:42):
you listen.
So you can get these newepisodes when they come out
every single Monday.
Enjoy.
Hey there, it's Sober Steve heretoday with the branding master,
Brian Orr.
Hey Brian, how are you?
Hey Steve, what's going onbuddy?
Not much.
I had gotten the pleasure tomeet you recently at a local
networking event, but for mylisteners, why don't you
(01:02):
introduce yourself?
Brian (01:04):
Sure, my name is Brian Orr.
It was a long way to get towhere we are now.
But for, 20 some odd years, Iwas a professional DJ and I
built my personal brand before Iknew what that was back when I
was around 15 years old.
So that took me on a journey andit actually created a lot of
(01:24):
opportunities for me.
I had worked in a bunch ofdifferent countries with some
major brands and some media.
And over here recently, whatI've been realizing is there's a
lot of need.
For people and businesses tofocus on their brand.
The opportunities that brandingcreated for me put me on this
track to become an investor anda consultant for business
(01:49):
development and really whathappened, why I just started
seeing more and more of thatneed for branding.
So I said, maybe I can make abigger impact.
Maybe I can make a bigger splashif I could.
Help people in this area.
What I did so well for so manyyears.
So that's where we're at rightnow.
Steve (02:03):
Yeah.
And I definitely, when I heardwhat you did, my ears perked up
because branding is huge forpodcasters.
I know when I startedpodcasting, I had a huge
advantage doing sales andmarketing because you need to be
able to sales and market yourpodcast to be able to help it
grow efficiently.
But I didn't have brandingexperience.
Cause I worked for these bigcompanies that took care of
their branding.
I was just like, The puppet thatwas really good at repeating
(02:24):
things back.
So this was my first time reallylike doing my brand when I
started podcasting.
And so having to figure out whatthat was, took me over a hundred
episodes before I had to paysomeone to help me figure it out
for me or with me as to what itis and how to achieve it.
But that's when things startedreally taking off for me.
So what would you say yourrelationship with like podcasts
have been in terms of listening?
(02:45):
Tell me about your podcasting.
Brian (02:47):
Yeah, I'm a big fan of podcasting.
I'm a big fan of it as a, as aninfluence builder for a personal
brand or a corporate brand.
Really.
I liked the idea of the deliverymechanism.
I like everything aboutpodcasting.
I don't like producing my ownpodcast that I don't like.
So I did right before COVID.
(03:09):
I started building a podcast forbusiness development.
It was called, what was itcalled?
I don't even remember what it'scalled, man.
It was five years ago.
I, whatever it's called, itmight still be, it might still
exist somewhere on iTunes orsomething.
I can't remember what it was.
Yeah, it's probably out there inthe podcasting graveyard.
It's out there.
Yes.
So it was right before COVID andI was interviewing business
(03:30):
leaders and we were talkingabout these challenges that they
had in their business challengesthat they had in their personal
life and how they broke throughthese challenges.
That's essentially the premiseof what it was.
And I recorded something like, Irecorded like 30 episodes and I
aired about eight of them andCOVID hit and then everything
(03:54):
went haywire.
Plus there were like 7, 000 newpodcasts every day.
And for me, it just didn't, theROI wasn't there for me to
continue to do it alone, thedevelopment alone.
It was extremely hard back then,it might be easier now, but it
was extremely hard back then.
(04:14):
So I have a lot of airedepisodes, and I also have a lot
of dead episodes that are justsitting on a file on my drive
somewhere.
That maybe I'll bring them backto life at some point.
But as far as podcasting as amedium, I love it.
And I think it's superopportunistic for people who
either host or appear onpodcasts to develop their brand.
Steve (04:33):
Yeah.
Certainly, since I made aprofession of it would have to
agree now with what you do, howdo you feel branding plays into
podcasting?
Because as a podcast listenerand fan of podcast, have you
listened to podcasts where youliked the podcast content or
topic but struggled withlistening to it or staying
because they were having brandor identity issues?
Brian (04:55):
Yeah, I guess if we're talking podcast specifically,
there are some that have comeacross where it's like, They
brand themselves as a particularthing, but the content does not
always stay consistent with whatthey told you that they were
going to bring to you.
And when you're listening to itit's off the cup and it's not
necessarily delivering the valuethat you anticipated when read
(05:18):
or, clicked on it too.
To listen.
So that's one of the challengeswith everything with branding,
right?
Is the consistency.
So if you brand yourself, if youbrand yourself as a Rogan where
you just talk to a bunch ofdifferent people about a bunch
of different things, then peopletune in because they want to
hear different people talk aboutdifferent things.
(05:40):
But if you brand yourself as,let's say a marketing podcast,
but then you spend, hours andhours talking about, I don't
know, anything that's notmarketing you you're not likely
to sustain an audience.
And you're not likely tocommunicate and certainly not
convert if you're trying toeither sell through your podcast
(06:01):
or allow your guests to sellthrough their podcast.
So I think that branding isextremely crucial and it must
stay consistent with what you'repromising to your audience.
From your thumbnail.
Steve (06:12):
Yeah, I definitely agree.
Making sure that the title, theart and the topic all match.
And so oftentimes I find peoplewere one of those threes out of
date, not intentionally, butbecause they made some sort of
update or change.
Yeah.
So things can happen with that.
And I definitely can see thatbeing a deterrent.
So when someone comes to you tostart working with you, what are
some of the common issues thatthey're facing?
Brian (06:34):
So I work with people, individuals as a personal brand,
and I work with corporations,helping them build their
corporate brand.
Also, within a corporation, I dotraining as well.
For example, I've trained arecent one was a broker.
She had about 12 real estateagents that work for her, and
she brought me in to teach themabout personal branding.
(06:56):
So How they can brand themselvespersonally as a subset of the
organization.
But, as people are starting torealize nobody wants to do
business with a company, peoplewant to do business with people.
So they're actually puttingpeople forward ahead of the
corporation with the corporationsort of guidelines and backbone
there.
But putting the person forward.
(07:17):
So there's the personal brand.
Could be a variety of things.
Influencers entrepreneurs orsolopreneurs or, small business
owners who want to create moreof a demand tension by putting
themselves out front, which iswhat they should do.
Yeah.
And then there's the corporatewhere it's okay.
What are we going to do here?
I don't do design.
(07:38):
So that's where I've stopped.
I do thought work.
I do analysis.
I do strategy.
I don't do design when it getsto design They have their brand
guidelines so they could takethat to their design team.
They could take that to theirmarketing team I don't do any of
that I do all of that stuff thatshould be done first that
foundational stuff the mindsetstuff the thought stuff Of the
(07:59):
analysis the strategy and that'son a corporate level or a
personal level as well
Steve (08:04):
Yeah, and I know that especially since so many of my
clients and listeners are peoplethat are doing this for
businesses, whether it be theirpersonal businesses or their
franchises, they're podcastingfor business.
So it is oftentimes figuring outhow you can be a unique host as
well as stick to the corporateor the company brand.
And so what would you say ifsomeone.
(08:25):
What are signs and symptoms ofsomeone having an issue or
identity crisis with their brandand they might not realize it?
Oh, man.
Oh.
Cause I, I was having an issuefor years.
I like the question.
Yeah.
Cause I'll say like when I hadmy podcast for over a year and a
half with a hundred episodescalled Gay A, I thought I was so
(08:46):
clever because it was a play onAA and they were for gay people.
I didn't think about the SEO ofgay a not being friendly or
having any sort of extra wordsto add on to it.
So no one could find me unless Iwas like making them find me.
And even then it was verydifficult because they couldn't
just search those words.
So it's do things like add atitle extension.
But like I, I was wondering whyI was having these issues with
(09:07):
branding and why people can findme and why.
my social media content, whichlike one week is about the
episodes and another week aboutmy dog, why that wasn't flying
off or taking off.
And so I had to have someonelike you come and help that out.
So for someone who might begoing around life, blissfully
ignorant of their need forrebranding, what are some of
(09:27):
those signs and symptoms?
Brian (09:29):
Yeah, it's an excellent question.
And you just ran through alaundry list of signs and
symptoms, but let me clarifysomething that may help this
perspective.
Brand has nothing to do withpeople finding you online.
Okay.
Brand has to do with peopletelling other people about you.
Okay.
That's where brand is.
So let me explain that a littlebit more.
(09:49):
People talk often about buildinga brand.
You can't actually build abrand.
What a brand is the audience,the recipient, their
interpretation of the messagesthat you're communicating.
So you're trying to communicateyourself as the gay a play on
words, the talk about my dog,whatever it is that you're
(10:10):
putting out there, what woulddefine your brand is the way
that the listeners, the peoplewho have received the
information interpret that howthey position you in their
brain.
Do they position you as somebodywho's fun and engaging, who's
interesting, who comes off witha variety of topics that they
want to tune into every week, ordo you appear as someone who is
(10:31):
a little bit discombobulated?
You're not really sure whatyou're going to get.
And it's not quite appealing.
The same message can registertwo different ways or more, a
multitude of different ways.
In effect, what you're trying todo when people talk about
building their brand is developthis consistent type of position
in someone else's mind so theycan categorize you.
(10:51):
Our brains like to categorizeour brains, like to put things
in its place.
So our brain needs to know whereto put you.
You as you, Steve, and you,anyone that's listening to this.
In their brain, where do weposition you?
Do we position you as the personwe can go to if we need help
moving a refrigerator?
Do we position you as the personwe can go to if we want to talk
(11:12):
about our feelings, right?
Where do we position you?
And that's for you as anindividual or whatever your
service or product you'reproviding.
So that's what brand actuallyis.
And then when you get into SEO,when you get into how people
find you, that's marketing,right?
That's not branding.
Branding is how you defineyourself and the type of
(11:33):
influence that you want to haveto audience and the way that
audience essentially defines youand positions you.
That's where brand stops andeverything else beyond that.
Is marketing.
Steve (11:48):
Yeah, that definitely makes sense because I do like
with my clients, I don't have itall planned out or thought out
as you, but we do start withmore of just what, who are you,
what are you doing?
What do you want from yourpodcast?
What are your goals and how arewe going to get there in terms
of delivering information?
And then we figure out like thehouse and the marketing and all
of that kind of stuff.
So what would you say if someonewas to start a podcast would be
(12:10):
things to, to really thinkabout, to reflect on their, If
they were making a podcast fortheir business, what would it
be?
Things to reflect on beforehitting record?
Yeah.
Brian (12:20):
The first question is the podcast, the business, or is the
business something else?
Steve (12:26):
Generally, a lot of my clients, they already have a
business that exists and they'relooking for the podcast as a way
to grow it in a unique way tostand out as unique and
interesting in their industry.
Brian (12:35):
So the podcast is a marketing tool.
Yes.
So the podcast itself shouldhave its own brand identity.
All right.
That's when you're talking abouthow it's displayed to the world,
the thumbnails and the missionstatement or whatever it is that
you're communicating outwardly.
It should have consistency.
Of course, with whatever it is,it could be a variety of things,
(12:58):
or it could be one very specificthing.
Let's use a fitness examplebecause those are pretty easy to
use, if it's a gym owner or gymfranchise owner who wants to
start communicating throughpodcast medium to attract
attention to their gym, there'sa lot there.
It's so deep.
I, every time I want to saysomething out loud, I think I
should say something else thereyou, because.
(13:20):
Who are they trying to reachwith their podcast and how are
they trying to convert them tocustomers?
Are they just trying to becomewell known as individuals so
that they can go out and dospeaking engagements as
professional trainers?
Are they trying to bring peopleinto their gym?
Then you're doing very localkind of stuff, right?
You wouldn't be having thisglobal kind of communication
(13:41):
scale, even though the podcastcan reach globally.
It doesn't do you any good ifyou're in Florida and people are
in Minnesota and your conversionis to try to get them to come
into your gym.
So there's many levels as faras.
Like you mentioned who you are,who you're trying to reach, what
you're trying to get them to do.
And you have to go through thatfrom not only your corporation
(14:02):
or business, but yourself as anindividual, and then your
marketing tool, which is yourpodcast.
And they all have to work inunison to get to the ultimate
result of what you.
Want the person who's listeningto the action that you want them
to take.
Steve (14:18):
Yeah, that definitely makes sense.
And how might it be different ifit was someone doing a hobby
podcast about a passion oftheirs versus if it was a
corporate company that you wereworking with and consulting
with,
Brian (14:31):
I think the same question holds true.
It's what do you want theaudience to do?
Do you just want them to listento you?
Are you just trying to getpeople to listen to you?
Then you, that's what the newsis, right?
Then you would do shock and aweand fear and panic because
people will listen to thatstuff.
Will it get them to buyanything?
(14:52):
Probably not unless you'reselling emergency kits or
doomsday.
Bunkers or something, right?
All the gross stuff.
Yeah.
What?
Yeah, but it just depends onwhat you want the audience to
do.
What is the action that you wantthem to take?
So if you want them to buysomething from you, even if it's
just your presence, if you wantthem to hire you to speak
somewhere, or if you want themto hire you as a coach, then all
(15:14):
of the content from the podcast,even though it's a hobby podcast
or we could call it a personalbranding kind of podcast.
If what you're selling is you oryour business, your service or
your small products, right?
Then all of the communicationoutbound should be That chess
match to try to positionyourself in their brain.
So you become the person thatthey think of when that problem
(15:39):
comes about.
And even if we go back to theguy said, I don't know why I
said moving a refrigerator butit came out.
So let's say you were a muscleguy and you charged people a fee
to be manual labor.
You could do a podcast talkingabout all of the benefits of not
doing it yourself, right?
(15:59):
The hazards of doing ityourself.
You can hurt yourself,insurance, this, all these kinds
of things.
And all the benefits of beingable to dial, five, five, five
muscle and have the guy comeover and do the thing for you.
And there's a variety ofdifferent ways that you can
communicate that message, butultimately all of it is designed
to have the audience take someparticular action.
Steve (16:23):
Yeah, no, that definitely makes sense.
So if you wanted to start apodcast that you didn't have to
produce, what would the actionyou would want your listeners in
this podcast to do?
Brian (16:33):
Me personally?
Steve (16:34):
Yeah.
Brian (16:36):
If I was to start a podcast again, I think I would
want my audience, I'm a teacher.
I like to educate.
I'm not an actual teacher.
I just, as a personality, I liketo teach and I like to educate.
I would probably use a podcastfor myself as a way to educate
people on a lot of thepsychological elements behind
(16:56):
branding, a lot of the reasonsto and the pitfalls of not
having a brand, right?
So ultimately, does the actionfor that have them hire me as a
coach?
Potentially, does it have themhire me in some way?
Does it have them hire mycompany to come in and do some
corporate training?
Potentially, but I would have tothen continue to think about.
(17:19):
What type of audience am Iactually building?
Am I building listeners or am Ibuilding some kind of a funnel
that I want to convert, andthey're not mutually exclusive.
They could be the same thingwhere you start with a top of
funnel thing where you'reproviding education and value
and information through content,and then.
(17:39):
ultimately positioning yourselfas the person of influence for
that particular topic.
And then if somebody chooses towant to move further in a
personal brand or in a corporatetraining perspective, then they
would look to you to be theperson to do that.
So that's the map that I thinkthat I would go through and it
would start with education.
And I would probably do, Moreoften me personally, I would
(18:02):
probably do people like you,like that example that you had,
where you realized.
What could have been and likewasted time, wasted money,
wasted energy.
It had you just taking adifferent action sooner.
I would probably do a whole, ifI was to do it, it would be all
stories like that.
It would just be all failures.
That's what I'm thinking.
It would be all failures thatthen there's a recovery element
(18:25):
and a success element.
And then position myself as theperson or my company, as the
people to be able to facilitatethat transformation for you
before you fail.
Steve (18:37):
Yeah, for sure.
I definitely think that's agreat way of doing it.
That's three of the main waysthat I recommend my audience do
podcasts.
Cause oftentimes people come tome and they're like, I'm going
to do an interview podcast andjust ask questions and go around
acting like I don't know theanswers to anything.
And I try and explain like for abusiness, that's not always the
best way to come up.
With expert positioning.
So I love what you're talkingabout, like giving the advice
and the direct content.
(18:58):
But then also I feel like you'vebeen doing this long enough that
I'm sure you have some clientsthat can come on that you've
worked with that can do kind ofclient journey episodes where
you talk about the problems cameto you with and what it's been
like as their business has grownor as their brand has grown,
once they figure it out withyou, as well as if you're doing
consultations or doing freebieslike that, where you can meet
someone with a problem andbrainstorm together, like what
(19:20):
we're doing right now.
A potential client could beanother way to do episode
formats where you're always theone in the expert chair, because
that will definitely be the waywhere people are listening to
you.
They can listen to a mix of tipsand tricks and hints, as well as
you finding someone who's inhelp and starting the fixing
process, and then also gettingto hear stories of you fix them
already, but I can imagine itwith a good mix of that people
(19:41):
will be signing up for yourcoaching and help and branding
left and right.
Brian (19:47):
Yeah, I think so.
I think there's kind of two waysyou can go about it, right?
You can go about it where youposition yourself as the expert
and that's one strategy.
And that's very effective for alot of people in a lot of ways,
especially on a solopreneur or avery lean team.
And you're trying to funnelbusiness through your podcast.
I think that's a very successfulway, but I think if you're
(20:08):
trying to build your podcast asthe product, if that's the
product, then I would positionit where the stories are the
hero and that's why more peoplewill want to tune in to listen
to the podcast.
But again, this goes back towhat is the action that we want
them to take.
And then all of that psychologyand strategy and positioning.
(20:33):
Would align based on that.
So do I want to be the herowhere I get them into my
ecosystem?
So that way I'm positioned asthe expert and the go to for
this thing, or do I want toposition my podcast as the hero
where essentially the podcast isa product, but the audience
would be the hero or the guestswould be the hero through their
storytelling.
Does that make sense?
(20:53):
What I'm thinking you're theexpert in this.
I'm not the expert in this.
Steve (20:56):
I'm just, you're right.
It's the two podcasts that Ihave.
I have my business one for thisbusiness that we're like doing
right now.
Basically that is very much whatI explained and recommended for
you.
And then I have my gay, which Istill keep going.
Just now I call it the queersober hero show because it's
about having heroes and queersobriety on every single week
and it's their story.
And they are the hero in thepodcast is the brand, not me.
(21:20):
So it is I.
I'm using both approachesbecause it has different things.
This is part of my business andprofession, while the other one
is something that I do forservice as a hobby and while
helping keep me sober.
It is at the end of the day theintention as well of what you're
looking to do with your podcast.
Brian (21:36):
Yeah.
Hey, at least I know I've knowwhat I'm talking about a little
bit.
Steve (21:40):
Validated.
Steve.
Yes.
You are definitely validated.
I was like, if we work together,you don't have to take my
orientation course.
You pass already.
Brian (21:51):
So what's next,
Steve (21:52):
buddy?
I was going to say, do you haveany other, you said producing
was a big obstacle for you withpodcasting.
What did you mean by that?
Brian (22:00):
Yeah.
There's two things about me.
One is I am, if you're familiarwith the terms from the book
traction, EOS, a rocket fuelvisionary.
And if you want to think aboutit, some people that you might
know or stories that you mightknow, there's like the Walt
Disney and the Roy Disney WaltDisney, drew the mouse and Roy
(22:21):
Disney built theme park, right?
Like that kind of thing.
So I am the visionary.
I've taken these assessments.
I'm 98 percent visionary.
A lot of people are balanced,right?
They have some elements of,yeah, I can think of the stuff
to do, and then I can do thisstuff I am all about thinking of
the stuff to do and very littleabout doing the stuff.
(22:42):
So that's obstacle.
Number one obstacle.
Number two is.
When I feel a congestion oftraffic, I don't work well in
that capacity, meaning thepodcast for me at the time was
worth it in 2019, and it wasworth me putting that extra
(23:04):
effort into the production sideand into the marketing side and
all of this because I thoughtthat I could do it on my own and
manage all of the things, butwhen the world happened and the
market just started getting soflooded.
Not to say that it's not the waynow it is the way it's just for
me, that's the challenge is whenall of that flooding started to
(23:28):
come in with so many differentpeople at home talking to each
other on the computer.
Now, I said, is this really theway that I believe that I can
continue to carve a unique nichefor me based on my skill set and
my abilities?
And the answer was no.
It's the, all of the production,the management, the marketing,
(23:48):
all of that stuff is not my kindof forte, but should you start a
podcast if you could, and if youhad the capacity and if you had
the team and all of that, wouldthat be a good, yes, absolutely.
For me, personally, it's alittle tough.
It's a little tough to wrap myhead around doing it all over
(24:09):
again.
Steve (24:10):
No, and I especially remember what it was like when I
first started podcasting four orfive years ago.
I say that's when my graysstarted.
They started beforehand, but Isay that's what happened because
those first few programs that Iwas using and I was trying all
the free ones.
Or different ones that were likethe cheaper ones.
And even then, even when Ifinally got the nicer programs,
it was a lot more complicated.
(24:31):
And then they added more updatesand more updates as AI becomes
more of a thing.
And so the editing process hasgotten so much easier that's
when I've always been like a mixof the creative as well as the
back end producing side ofthings.
But yeah.
It's gotten to the point wherethe producing side has been so
easy for me that when I startedcoaching someone and they were
like, all right great.
Now I need to just talk to mywebsite guy who will then talk
(24:51):
to my graphic artist who willthen talk to my uploader who
will talk to like my editor, andshe had five or six different
people that were helping hermake her show.
I was like, I can do all ofthat.
And what I love is theseconversations are what light me
up or make me happy.
But I can be cool and chill inthe studio as well, listening to
some music in the background,doing editing and producing all
day long.
So I like that, I'm able tooffer my clients, I'll help and
(25:14):
take that off of your plate.
So you can be just thevisionary.
That's fantastic helpful.
Brian (25:19):
The balance is hard, man, because I don't even have a
balance.
It's so imbalanced.
Really?
There's a test.
It's called rocket fuel It's anextraction from the book and it
talks about the two types ofpeople that you need to have,
like the major businessdevelopment, major companies,
right?
Yeah.
It's the Steve Jobs and theSteve Wozniak, like the thinker
and the doer and I am all theway thinker and there's a test
(25:42):
on Rocket fuel, dot, whatever.
I don't know what the thing is,but anyway.
I encourage people to do itbecause it's part of branding
too.
The more you learn aboutyourself, self awareness is, the
first thing that I work onidentity, and that's the first
step that I work on because youhave to know who really you are,
not who you think you are,right?
There's tools that you can.
I have one of my domains, it'scalled the influence quiz.
(26:05):
com and you can go there andcheck how influential you are.
Some people I know scored reallywell on it.
Some people not so much.
I got an 84%.
Steve (26:14):
I was happy.
My coach would be very proud ofme.
Brian (26:20):
I love it.
Yeah, I saw your score.
I was like, it's sometimes youmeet people and then they take
the test and then you get toknow them and you're like, Oh,
yeah, it feels obvious.
I could have guessed what yourscore would have been.
But yeah, what I'm getting atwith all that was personally, I
don't even have a balance.
So when I fill my team in anyway, it's with the people who
(26:41):
are there.
The ones who love doing thething, and that's for anybody in
whatever capacity you havethings that you hate things that
are like the bane of yourexistence.
It could be spreadsheets, or itcould be ideas, or it could be
communication, or it could bewhatever.
Someone else out thereabsolutely loves it.
They do it.
They live, eat, breathe, andsleep it.
(27:03):
And the best advice that I cangive is to find that person who
does that, who loves that, whowants to, and then put them
right in that place and let themdo it for you.
And then you just be the geniusat whatever it is that you are
in whichever role it is.
And it's make a happy life.
I almost said happy wife.
She's back there, but happy.
Happy life for sure.
Steve (27:25):
Yeah, exactly.
Excellent.
I think that's a great place toend on.
So how would people find you ifthey wanted to connect Brian,
Brian (27:31):
go to branding lab.
co and that's where I'm buildingeverything out right now.
The new, the newer company wherewe do corporate training,
individual coaching.
I have a bunch of other coachesthat I work with and a lot of
happy clients.
So go there, branding lab.
co and all my connecting info ison there.
Steve (27:52):
All right.
Excellent.
I'll add that to the show notesas well.
So thank you so much.
Brian (27:55):
Thanks, Steve.
This was awesome.
Great conversation, bud.
Steve (27:59):
Yeah.
Thank you.
And thank you listeners fortuning in.
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