S4 BONUS: Visions of Sugar Plums

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Conor Perkins (00:47):
Hello, happy holidays, and Merry Christmas.
Welcome to Poor UnfortunatePodcast, where Disney is what we
do...
it's what we live for! We'rethe two besties you never knew
you needed.
I'm Conor Perkins.

Caroline Aimetti (01:00):
And I'm Caroline Aimetti.
This is a Disney podcast forgrown ups because we believe
magic gets better with age.
Listener discretion is advised.

Welcome to all of our returning listeners and
viewers.
Thanks so much for joining usonce again.
And welcome to any newlisteners or viewers.
Thank you so much for joining.
Please make sure that you hitfollow or subscribe wherever
you're listening or watching thepodcast.
And if you're on YouTube, optin for notifications so you
don't miss out on anything.
And then once we get to the endof the episode, or right now,
if you're feeling it, hit fivestars, leave a written review,

(01:31):
and leave a comment whereveryou're watching or listening to
the podcast.
It's one of the best things youcan do to help us get seen in
search results, help the podcastget pushed to other people, and
we would really appreciate it.
But there's another reason whyyou should really do it, and
that's because today isChristmas Eve, which is a more
important holiday here at PoorUnfortunate Podcast.

(01:52):
And that is the birth of ourLord and Savior, Caroline
Aimetti.
Happy birthday, Caroline.

Thank you.

This is our first video uh birthday celebration
with you.

Just trust and believe we have been wearing
these sweaters every Christmasbonus.
You just wouldn't know.

You would never know.
But we always wear these forthe past, like, what is it?
Is it five years ago?

Yeah, yeah.

My mom got them for us in 2020.
In the pandemic.
In the pandemic.

Come on, Walmart.
Come on, Walmart.

But yeah, happy birthday, Caroline.

It's so this is like one of my favorite
things that we do.
Me, honestly, me too.
And it's so nice to spend itwith you, Conor, and with all of
you listening and watching.
Um, and yeah, if you couldleave a little review for a
birthday present, that wouldthere's that's honestly the only
thing I actually genuinely wantat this point, anyway.

Yeah, that and then send this to a friend.
Like send this episode or anepisode that you think that said
friend will like.
Yeah, do that as a lovelylittle birthday gift to
Caroline.
She would appreciate it.

Yes.

Uh, and Caroline, what have you been what have
you been doing?
How did you ring in uh thisbirthday?
What are you been doing it theright way, right?

Yeah.
So I decided there's no betterway for it to turn midnight on
my birthday than to be sittingin a theater watching

Wicked (03:07):
For Good for the fifth time.

Fifth time.
So you finally caught up to me.

Yes.
Yes.
Especially because it's comingout, it's coming out on Prime
soon.
So I was just like, I gotta getone more movie theater viewing
in there.

So yeah, I've got I think two more in me that I
gotta get.

Yeah.

So Caroline spent the beginning of her birthday
doing it the right way atWicked: For Good.
And so now we're going to spendit with you all doing our
annual holiday Christmas bonus.

And I got a special gift this year from
Conor.

She's got a special gift this year.
Tell them what it is.

This year, for the first time in forever, we
don't have to play our game ofyes and no...
of 20 questions.

Which I know so many of our listeners.
So many of you love.

And you know what?
I'm sorry, it's not yourbirthday, it's mine.
She just wants a break thisyear.
I just need a break.
That game was pushing me to theedge of my sanity in so many
different ways.
And I needed a break.
So we're doing somethingdifferent this time, and I'm
actually really excited for it.
So, can I tell them what we'redoing?

Tell them what we're doing.
Because you're kind of in thisera right now.

Oh, yeah.
We'll talk about that too.
So, much like we did for we dida birthday bonus for Conor
where we did a D-Brief of aDisney movie he's never seen.
Um, and so we did A GoofyMovie.
And so this time we're doing aD-Brief for me too of a movie
I've never seen, but that Conorand I have talked about at
length before I ever even sawit.

(04:37):
And that is 2018's TheNutcracker and the Four Realms.

Yeah.

Heard of it?

Heard of it?

Maybe you don't even remember it.

It happened.

It happened.
Did you see it in movietheaters?

No.

Oh, I thought you did.
Okay.

Okay.
No.

Okay.
Yeah.
I remember at the time beingvery, I think I remember seeing
the trailer and looking at theaesthetic, and I was like, yeah,
I want to go see that.
And I just never did.
And it's taken me this long.

So yeah, for Caroline's birthday, we are
going to be talking and doing afull D-Brief of Nutcracker in
the Four Realms.
So obviously, spoilers areahead.
If you haven't watched it, it'savailable for you to watch on
uh Disney Plus.
So you could watch it.
Or if you don't want to, youcan just keep listening.

Listen to us talk about it.

But if you want to take a pause and watch it for
yourself, we'll take a littlebreak right now and we'll be
right here when you come back.
And welcome back.

Conor's gonna give you background information
as we always do, but one thing Ijust wanted to note before he
does that is that I amapproaching this from a very
interesting place because I'mlike having a very strange,
strange nutcrackery Christmasthis year because I watched this
for the first time.
I just saw with my family umthe Trans Siberian Orchestra

(05:55):
live, which was like um a drugtrip.
And I'm also reading, I'm alsoreading the sluttiest
nutcracker.
I'm reading the sluttiestnutcracker right now.
I'm reading A Court of Sugarand Spice, and uh I'm obsessed
with that.
And the craziest thing is likeit is just so taking over my

(06:16):
brain that like I'm trying tokeep the versions of these
characters from from like thisand that streaking.
Let's be very clear.

Clara's a child in this.
Clara's a child.

Yeah.
Oh my god.
So yeah, uh, I'm very much inmy nutcracker era.
I've but I've always loved it.
Like there was there were otherversions of it that I loved as
a kid too.
Like there was the BarbieNutcracker, there was, I don't
know, there was something elsethat I used to get from
Blockbuster, a version of ananimated version.
So yes, in my nutcracker era.

I was a big nutcracker kid.
Me too.
Big nutcracker.
We would watch Nutcracker onIce.

Oh my god.

Oh, Nutcracker on Ice.
We had that VHS that was supergood.
That was on NBC when they likebroadcast it on NBC.

I remember that.

So we had that, I would watch that, and then when
I was in second grade, we didlike a little nutcracker in
school thing.

Lucky.

And we picked parts out of a hat.
We put our names in the hat forthe character, and I was pissed
because I was like, that is nothow we should be doing this.
I'm like, I want to be thenutcracker prince.
And I didn't get it.
I was furious.

We when we did my church Christmas pageant, we
pulled names out of the hat.
And what happened was therewere two categories of kids.
There were like the older kidswho would have the parts, and
there were the younger kids whowould be like the sheep.
And my birthday's on Christmas,and I was right on the edge.
And I'm like, I'm absolutelynot gonna be in the ensemble of
this.
Like, I'm going with the olderkids.
And then my name gets pulledout of the hat to be Mary.
And I was like, fuck yeah.

(07:44):
And the other kid, the girl whowas ended up playing Gabriel
was pissed.
And she was like, She is notthe right age for this, but I I
figured it out and I was Mary.

And that is the main character energy that we
are claiming in this next yeararound the sun.
That is the main characterenergy we are claiming in 2026.
Be like little Caroline, makingsure that she gets put yourself
where you feel like you belong.
Yeah, go get Mary.
Well, I put myself where I feltlike I belonged, and I still
got shot in the ass.
So, but no, I was a huge, hugenutcracker kid.

(08:19):
And this for the past couple ofyears, our holiday decorations
at our house have all been likeI love that theme.

I think it's cute.

It's all like sugar plums, like land of sweets
and everything.

We'll talk about it more when we talk about
the movie, but that aestheticis it's good.
It's it's good, very cute.

It's good.
So yeah, we're both we're bothcoming from a deep love of the
nutcracker and I'm notnutcracker.
I remember when they announcedthis film, I was super duper
excited for it.

It really has you and I kind of written like
on paper, written all over it.
Yeah.

And it's also like an obvious choice.
Like, of course, Disney's gonnatackle the nutcracker.

No one else has really I agree.
Yeah, I agree with you.

Gone for it.
Like gone for it, gone for it.

I agree.

So, as we usually do, we are going to give you
all some background information.

Thank you so much.

The Nutcracker in the Four Realms premiered on
October 29th, 2018, in LosAngeles and was released in
theaters on November 2nd, 2018,the United States.
I'm gonna go through a wholebunch of people who worked on
this film, and I am going to becrediting some of their other
things just so that you can seethat like serious people worked
on this film.
So it was directed by LasseHallström, who directed What's

(09:28):
Eating Gilbert Grape, The CiderHouse Rules, Casanova, and
almost all of the ABBA musicvideos.
And it was directed by JoeJohnston, who did Honey I Shrunk
the Kids, Jumanji, and CaptainAmerica: The First Avenger.
He was also an industrial lightand magic designer behind the
designs of the Millennium Falconand Boba Fett.
Those are our directors forthis film.

(09:50):
It was produced by Mark Gordon,who did The Day After Tomorrow,
The Patriot, and the newHercule Poirot films, starring
Kenneth Brannaugh, and LarryFranco, who did Batman Begins
and Jurassic Park 3.

Wow.

It was written by Ashleigh Powell.
This is, I think, her firstscreenwriting credit.

I did look into her and I didn't see
anything else.
Yeah.

I didn't see anything else.
Yeah.
It's based on the Nutcrackerand the Mouse King by E.T.A.
Hoffman and the NutcrackerBallet by Marius Petipa, with
music by Pyotr IlyichTchaikovsky.
The cinematography is by LinusSandgren, who is the Academy
Award-winning cinematographerfor La La Land, No Time to Die,
American Hustle, Salt Burn, andthe upcoming films of next year,

Wuthering Heights and Dune: Part Three. (10:32):
undefined

I was wondering if you were gonna say
Wuthering Heights.

Oh shoot!

Wow.

The production design is by Guy Hendricks Dyas,
who did Inception andElizabeth: The Golden Age.
The costumes are by AcademyAward winner Jenny Beavan, who
was the Academy Award winner forA Room with a View, Mad Max,
Fury Road, and Cruella.
She also did costumes for 1995Sense and Sensibility.
And gave us the Drew Barrymoreball gown with wings in Ever

(11:04):
After.

Okay.

Mm-hmm.

Okay.
Serious people on this film.
Okay.

The music was adapted in part from
Tchaikovsky's The Nutcracker andfeatured new original music by
James Newton Howard, who is oneof my favorite composers.
He did The Village, the entireHunger Games series, Batman
Begins, and The Dark Knightalongside Hans Zimmer, and
Maleficent.
But also James Newton Howardand I, we share a birthday.
So Gustavo Dudamel conductedthe London Philharmonia

(11:37):
Orchestra and appears in thefilm as the conductor with Lang
Lang as the piano soloist.
It features the original song"Fall On Me", performed by
Andrea Bocelli and his sonMatteo Bocelli.

There's a really, really long-standing
inside joke between us aboutthis that we couldn't even get
explained now, but it's it'sstill No, we I'm gonna take the
moment.

You all deserve to know.
I don't know if we've explainedit on the I don't think so.
Okay, if we have, I apologize.
But so when this song came out,I was really super into it.

I was like, We were both you introduced me to
it, and we were both like, oh mygod, this song is gorgeous.

I'm like, it's it's stunning.
And Caroline was like, Who isit by?
I'm like, it's Andrea Bocelli,and it's actually his husband,
who's much younger.
And I'm like, it's like kind oflike his nurse, I guess, sort
of someone to take care of himin his old age, but they love
each other.
And I had to say, Oh my god,okay, that's beautiful.
She goes home to her mother,God bless Lori Aimetti, and she

(12:35):
was like, plays the song for hermom.

I'm like, did you know that?

And she's like, it's it's it's a duet between
him and his husband, and shegoes, That's his son, and then
calls me and goes, What's wrongwith you?
You're sick.
That beautiful song is betweenthat man and his son.

Oh my god.
So fall in the world.
So now every time I see thevideo with it, I think about the
imaginary nurse husband ofAndrea Bocelli.

Lover nurse.
Everyone, everyone deserves alover nurse in their old age.

Just the fact that you add it in nurse.
I can't.
I'm gonna lose it.
I'm gonna actually lose it.

Okay.
The budget for this film was$120 to $130 million, and the
box office was $174 millionglobally.
We're gonna get it together.
It stars among others MackenzieFoy as Clara Stahlbaum, Keira
Knightley as the Sugar PlumFairy, Jaden Fowara- Knight as

(13:36):
Captain Philip Hoffman, theNutcracker, Helen Mirren as
Mother Ginger, Morgan Freeman asDrosselmeyer, Eugenieo Derbez
as Hawthorne, Richard E.
Grant as Shiver, MatthewMacfadyen as Clara's father,
Benjamin Stahlbaum.
There's a little uh Pride andPrejudice reunion moment
happening in this.

(13:56):
And Misty Copeland as theballerina.

Beautiful, beautiful.

And let's talk about some reception here.
Yeah.
Now we're gonna have our ownopinions about this, but I think
it is important to note some ofthe context of this as a whole.

Yeah.

So this was considered a box office flop
with Disney losing over 65million dollars on this film
when all was said and done.
It's blamed in part by itsrelease date, which is two days
after Halloween.

Right.
I was like, wait a minute, waita minute, what are we doing?

They didn't even wait until after Thanksgiving.

So silly.

A huge budget, and then just sort of like a
general lack of interest in thenutcracker concept.

And I think I read this online too, and I have
to disagree with that.
There is interest.
Maybe I'm talking about us.

I think the general lack of interest also
kind of goes in part with thetiming of it.
People aren't really looking tostart doing nutcrackery type
things two days after Halloween.

Absolutely not.

A week before for Thanksgiving, maybe sure.

2018 was also Mary Poppins Returns around the
holidays.
So I think therein lies theproblem.
Yeah.
Yep.

Yeah.

Too light, like live action, you know.

Yeah, I think they just they overstuffed the
schedule.
Yeah.
I I think they should have heldoff on this one, actually.

Yeah.

Uh the film received largely negative
reviews for the most part,calling out the story and Keira
Knightley's performance inparticular, while giving some
praise to the visuals and theoverall aesthetic.
Currently has a 32% tomatometer score and 36% popcorn
meter score on Rotten Tomatoes.
With an average rating of 5.1out of 10.
Cinema score gave the film anaverage grade of B.

Oh, that's not so bad.

Well, that's an average.
Uh typically, typically, Disneyfilms seldom go under A minus.

Okay, okay.

So yeah, I have a plot synopsis that I have
pulled from the Disney Wiki.
And so we're just gonna gothrough the plot and we're just
gonna sort of talk about thingslike as they come up.

So my God.

Before we get started, first initial thoughts,
impressions.
What what what did you what didyou what did you think?

You know, you know, I put this on the other
day.
I started it the other day.
I was like in a Christmassymood.
I I uh I my appetizer wasMuppet Christmas Carol, and then
I was like, and I'm gonna rollinto Nut cracker in the Four
Realms after this.
I'm in a Christmassy mood.
That was a choice.

Um you need to reverse it.

Yeah.
You know, I think I am a littlebit influenced by when I when I
hear like, you know, scores inthe 30s, I'm like, I'm not
sitting here saying that'sincorrect at all.
However, I think I'm just like,I I guess this comes from me
being a true, like I'm a bignutcracker fan.
I I am I really enjoy Christmasmaterial that is more, I guess,

(16:47):
like classical in nature.
Like, I don't need everythingto be like Frosty and Santa.
Like I'm usually looking for alittle something else.
And so when this opened and Isaw these visuals, I was like,
you know, I'm gonna like this.
And also like Mackenzie Foy,like I was a very I was like, I
think she's a great Clara.

I think she's a fantastic Clara.
Also, her dialect work isamazing.
I did not know I did not knowthat she's British.
I thought she was British aswell.
Yeah, and I'm like, more ofthat, please.
We can do British.

We can.
Thank you, Mackenzie, forholding it down.

Thank you.

I guess first of all, if we're talking about
overall, one of the things thatI take issue with is like, yes,
we need to we need to saynutcracker in the title so
people know what it is.
But my God, the nutcracker wassidelined majorly.
And I remember, I rememberseeing the promotional stuff for
this back in 2018.
And I'm like, oh, like, youknow, they're the same age.
We're gonna do a little.
I get that she's a child, butI'm like, we're gonna do a

(17:42):
little bit of like a child-likeromance.
Because yes, in the in theballet, he can be older and
she's younger, and he's justlike more of her guide, and you
know, that's that.

I thought there, I always thought that there was
a vibe.

But I know that I'm me, and I think there
should always be a vibe betweenthem.
And so then I saw these twoactors, and I'm like, oh, nice.
Like, we're gonna have thesetwo people who are the same age,
we're gonna have a vibe.
We didn't do that.

And I thought their chemistry was like it was
good.
It was good.

He didn't get developed enough.

No, there wasn't enough for him.

He, I don't what do you tell?
I couldn't tell you one thingabout him.

Yeah, it felt like sort of overall, uh it felt
like they didn't want to leaninto the romance, like the
romance aspect, but there is alevel of romance there is like
not uh not lowercase R romance,but like capital R romance of
the movement, like exactly thatis involved in the not crack.

And we're sampling pieces from the
Tchaikovsky score, like it'syes, like you said, it's
inherently romantic.

Yeah.

Okay.
But I think I just thinkoverall, too, I think that
applies to like my god, thiscast is so stacked, but that's
what you did to Morgan Freeman.
How dare! And and Drosselmeyeris such an interesting
character.

That has always been what I have aspired to be
as an uncle and godfather.

I'm like, give me an eye patch, give me a
cape, let me have fantastic,semi-magical parties, parties,
and toys and inventions.

Like, absolutely.
And okay, you know what?
We're gonna we're just nowgonna start going into it
because yeah, yeah, yeah.
Because we're kind of gettingthere.

But and not to and not to spoil my book that
I'm reading, but like it getsrevealed very early on.
If you're trying to read ACourt of Sugar and Spice, cover
your ears.
And I'm saying you should readit.
Um, he I think there's just alot to be minded in that
character because he's thevillain in that.
And I think it's possiblebecause he's an interesting
dude.

Yes, there is like a there is like a little
bit of a there's a weirdness,like there's an edge to him.
He has an eye patch.

He has an eye patch and he has huge parties,
but he's like a reclusive likeinventor.
Like, tell me more.

Slash bachelor.
Slash bachelor.
Gay.

Gay.

Gay.

Okay.

Uh all right, so yeah, tell everybody about the
biggest.
Let's dive into the into theplot synopsis.
So in Victorian England, as theresidents of London prepare for
Christmas Eve, BenjaminStahlbaum gives his children
Louise, Clara, and Fritz,Christmas presents.
To fulfill his wife Marie'sdying wish.
Clara receives a handcraftedegg-shaped box, which she is
unable to unlock.

(20:07):
In the package, she discovers anote from Marie that states
that the inside of the egg isall she would ever need.
So we open, we've got this, andI'm just gonna say right off
the bat, I was really kind ofupset with the way that this
film opened and all of the useof the heavy CGI in the episode.
Oh, I was gonna say the samething.

The peo- the CGI people.

The CGI people, because because here's the
thing.
And I I'm gonna take this.
Uh I I saw this quote fromAlonso Duralde, who was writing
for the rap in his review of it.
And he said, "' the childtravels to a magical land and
learns thing' trope has been thebasis of many beloved stories
from The Wizard of Oz to ThePhantom Tollbooth to The

(20:51):
Chronicles of Narnia, but it'snot a foolproof device,
particularly when the magicalland in question never makes
much narrative sense.
Besides, how can the fourrealms be magical when the
London where Clara already livesis so obviously a cartoon?
Both the real world and thefake one are ugly, overdone, and
lacking any visual connectionto gravity, let alone reality."

(21:12):
Now, I don't agree with all ofthis, but I can't see anyone who
would not fault it where it'slike the reason that a child
would need to escape to amagical world is because the one
that they're currently livingin is lacking, or from their
perspective, it is lacking.
And so they need to gosomewhere else to learn things

(21:34):
that then they can bring backand see their world in a
different way.
And we know that a magicalworld that's the land of
flowers, the land of sweets, theland of amusements, and the
land of snowflakes.

Snowflakes.

We know we're gonna be CGI heavy in that
world.
Why are we not hyper, hyperrealistic in the real world?
And I think to open with CGIwas just such a was such a a
waste.
And I know it's because theywanted to give us some of the
music and the sweeping shots ofLondon and everything, but I

(22:07):
don't think that that reallyhelps where Clara is supposed to
be.
She's supposed to feel like herworld is small and stifled.
And I don't think we needed tosee as much of London as we
needed to like feel more likeClara.
I like that we got the littlelike introduction of her as an
inventor in the attic.
We got to see a little mouse,little nods here and there.

Oops, yeah.
The CGI of it all and the tone.
It's so funny.
This feels to me, in a way, Ifeel like the flop of this like
marked the end of this era oflike the 2010s, where a lot of
family-oriented, fantasticalperiod pieces looked exactly.
Exactly the same.
It was all feeling like it wascoming down from the Alice, the

(22:54):
Tim Bird and Alice inWonderland.
Maybe a little bit of Narnia.
All of those films are like,you know, studios were like,
that was a success.
We need these family-friendly,sweeping tales of like a period
setting, and then the maincharacter goes to this fantasy
world.
And this feels like the end ofthat in a way, because I can't
really name a lot after thisthat are that feel like they are

(23:15):
part of that that lineage.
And it was just so interestingbecause I was like, yeah, this
is what every time, and I wouldalways get drawn in by these
because I'm a big period piecekind of gal.
And I was like, Yeah, Iremember when so many movies
looked like this.
And now, as much as I love it,when it's as much as I love
like, you know, the aesthetic ofDrosselmeyer's party, the
beginning, like you said, in theCGI of it all makes me remember

(23:39):
why it needed to be over.

Yeah, the CGI was just like really rough.
And I and I was just, it was sodisheartening because I'm like,
the Clara's house, the theinterior, the production design
of it all, it was so beautiful.

Yeah.

And but at the same time, I'm like, I saw there
was like a darkness to it.
Like things were kind of muted.
There was a lot of shadow.

Yeah.

So I'm like, all of those things are present
already in terms of you knowmaking us feel like Clara,
feeling like she's kind ofovershadowed by this feeling of
grief at the passing of hermother.
All of that's there.
And it, I think it would havebeen so much stronger to just
like put us there and then letthe big sweeping stuff let that

(24:25):
be in the fantasy world.
We don't need that in London.
Or maybe we get that in Londonwhen she comes back out of it.
She's finally able to see herworld a little bit clearer.
I don't know.

Yeah, I mean, we'll talk about this later as
well.
But when she comes back, Ithink that's part of the issue
as well.
Yes, I I understand part of itis like the odds of it all of
like you had it within you thewhole time.
And it's so obvious that it'slike, yes, of course, that's
what they're trying to say.
But beyond that, I'm kind oflike, what changed for her in
this journey?
I guess she came back and shesaw her father in a new light,

(25:01):
but I don't really know why.

Yeah.

Um, so just I don't know the the what she got
out of this whole adventure waslacking for me.

Yeah.
So after that, we go to theChristmas Eve ball.
The family heads the ChristmasEve ball, which is hosted by the
children's godfather andskilled engineer Drosselmeyer,
refusing to dance with Benjamin.
Clara scurries from the crowdto ask Drosselmeyer how to
unlock her egg.
He then reveals to her that itwas a creation of his that he

(25:31):
gifted to Marie when she wasyounger, and that her wish was
to bestow the gift to Clara.
So we get this reallyinteresting.
There's also this owl.

There's just this owl.

There's just this owl.

Yeah.

That's there.
Uh I do enjoy that they havegiven Clara's mother the name
Marie because Marie and Claraare both names that are used
interchangeably in theNutcracker story.
So you can go see a ballet, andsometimes Clara is actually
referred to as Marie.
Uh, or there's short stories.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And yeah.
But uh these these scenes ofthe young girl sort of like
pushing against the boundariesof the world that she has
inherited, it's hard to not makethem all feel the same.
Like, so much of what I wasseeing in this was the scenes

(26:26):
with Alice in the Tim BurtonAlice in Wonderland.

Some of the shots were like the same.

And I'm just like, how is Clara not Alice?
I'm like, that's what I want toknow.
And she was an adventure.
I'm like, that's great.
But you also just like Disney,you recently just gave all the
invention stuff to Belle inBeauty and the Beast.
So I'm like, it doesn't reallyfeel like Clara is her own
figure.
And this scene withDrosselmeyer.

There's so much potential to be, you know?

She absolutely does.
And I think everything thatMackenzie Foy is doing, she's
trying to find that.
She's trying to show us that.
But I think it's just sort oflike baked into the script that
there's a lot of these tropesthat Disney has been sort of
like putting into the mill andlike churning out over and over
again in these films.
And Clara has become the sortof like amalgamation of like a
little bit of Alice, a littlebit of of Belle.

(27:18):
And it's like, yeah, but who isClara?
And this scene withDrosselmeyer is our opportunity,
I think, to see who she is.

And she's got a really I this is lower on the
importance scale, but she's gota really beautiful, potentially
iconic look.

Costume.
That costume is gorgeous.
That purple.

That dress.
That's why when you said thatthe that the designer did Drew
Barrymore's dress in Ever AfterAfter.
That is one of the costume inEver After.

Yes.
Like that is one of thosedresses.

This has potential.

This I love this dress.
There's actually many costumesin this film that are beautiful.
Actually, a lot of Clara'slooks in general.
The the ballet look isincredible.

Coronation, whatever that was at the end.

At the end is beautiful, but I also love her
in the soldier outfit with theponytail.
I'm like, this is her looks arefantastic.

Her looks are great.
Yeah.
Yep.
100%.

And I'm just like, it it just felt like we
had a bunch of pieces.
We had an actor who could doit.
We had costumes who knew whatthey were doing.
We had so many things allworking together.

We had fantastic source material that
just like other successful film,and I understand this is live
action, but other successfulfilms, such as The Swan
Princess, such as SleepingBeauty, can be based on these
classical ballet scores and justbe really good.
It's good source material.

We had all of these people ready to rise to
this character and doing thatwork, but we just didn't have
that character fully formed.

Yeah.

Which and and see, you know what?
I don't even fully blame thescreenwriter because this feels
like Disney.
This feels like this feels likeproducing.

Well, I did wonder when I read a little bit
about reshoots happening.
I'm like, it feels likesomething was going on behind
the scenes that we might notknow about, of just like the
story and the idea and the arcof this film getting messed with
a little bit.
And I'm wondering if that'spart of what this is.

I'm I would not be surprised if maybe this was
more of a romance and then theytook the turn to try and make it
something else.
And I and maybe it strips of itbecause if Clara was a
romantic, that is actuallysomething that we're missing
from these heroines of this inthe live action period of Disney
in this time.
We don't have young heroineswho really fall in love in this.

Yes, and I I understand that I'm always very
pro-romance, but I think itwould make sense for her story
of like she always felt like hermother really understood her
and she understood her mother.
So it would be her journey offinding that maybe you can you
can find that in another person,someone who really understands
you.
And I'm wondering if, becauseof the title of this movie, I'm
like, if this had beensuccessful, would this have been

(30:05):
the beginning of a saga?
Of like we see Clara age, andthen it's like the nutcracker in
this, the nutcracker in that.
Like it that's what it feelslike to me almost of like this
was supposed to be the beginningof something and it never
happened.

So returning to the ballroom, Clara gets scolded
by Benjamin, her father, fornot dancing with him.
She calls him self-absorbed andobsessed with his family's
image since Marie's passing.
A scene that plays out verysimilarly to Alice and her
mother at the like engagementparty, after which Drosselmeyer
announces it being time forchildren to receive their gifts.

(30:40):
First off, this ballroom put methere.
I want Drosselmeyer's house.

You know, I wrote that in my notes.
I was like, drop me inside theaesthetic of this ball because
this is this is the vibe.

The orchestra placed inside the swan carriage
thing.

Absolutely.

A stage with like classic spinography.

This is a dream.
Yeah, this is my dreamChristmas party.
This is my dream Christmasaesthetic.
This is it.

It's so the the That's why we started in such a
great place.

I was just like, yes, the vibe is right,
baby.
Like lush, luxurious, classicalChristmas.

And listen, we're gonna probably go in pretty
hard on this film if we haven'talready.
But I will say, having watchedthis now, I think three times in
my life, it was not as bad as Iremember it being the first
time.

It's not like it's the the rating it has
online is like this is absolutegarbage.

This is just like forgettable.

It's just forgettable and not fl not a
fleshed out story, is what itis.
Yes, it's which is upsettingagain when the source material
is so good.
It has so much potential.
Yeah.

There's yes, that's the thing of this film.
The frustration that I have forit is the wasted potential.

Yeah.

The wasted potential of the source material
and the wasted potential of allof these incredible people and
artists who are working on thisfilm.
100% feels it just feels likestudio hands.

None of these iconic award-winning actors are
used to their potential, likeeven close to like half of their
potential.
And that is a crime.
It's a crime.
No.

So Clara goes to receive her gift.
She goes outside to this likebeautiful Christmas tree, and
they do this, the they do thething where she finds the string
with her name on it, signifyingher gift, and she follows the
string all throughout the house.

I don't want to go to the realms, I want to
stay here.
But I guess again, maybe thatis in the source as well.
Because the Drosselmeyer'sChristmas party is always lit.

Yeah.
So as part of like Marie'sdying wish, he's sending Clara
into the realms that Marieescaped to in her childhood and
in her life.

Yeah, a little unclear, but we'll talk about
that later too.

So this scene is actually like I kind of I dig
this.
Like she goes through thishallway, and the wallpaper has
the owls, and then the owlsshift to mice.

Yeah.

Super duper cool.

Yeah.

And then she keeps following the string until
she is in the Christmas treeforest.
Uh and she like comes out.

Still beautiful, still beautiful.

Very beautiful.
She comes out of like sort oflike an uprooted tree.
Like she's coming out of likethe roots of a tree.
So she is nowin the Four Realms.
She's in the this Christmastree forest in a parallel world
where she sees the key, the keythat unlocks this egg that her
mother left her.
But before she can grab itinside this like Christmas tree

(33:30):
that's sort of like illuminatedby lights, fairies, fireflies,
unclear.

That we never see again.

We never see them again.
A mouse snatches it, and unableto reach him because he crosses
a little frozen lake, Claraapproaches Captain Philip
Hoffman, who is a nutcrackercharged with guarding the
entrance to the fourth realm.

Okay, wait.
I just thought of something.
Okay.
Cause I was gonna say, listen,part of the fun, I understand
that the fun of some of the ofadapting some of these stories
is like, what's what's the newway of looking at this?
But I'm like, a lot of the funof the nutcracker is that in her
world, he's a nutcracker, andin this world, he is her friend.

But we didn't see him in the real world in a
split second.
Stop.
No, Fritz receives a nutcrackersoldier and comes up to and
he's just like putting it in.

Oh god, you're right.

He's putting it in Clara's face.
And if you the lighting is alittle bit strange.
So you can't really tell thatit's like a it is a black
nutcracker.

Okay.

That is our only that is our only clue.

Okay.
Damn, right.
I forgot about that.

The nutcracker is gifted to Fritz, not right.

I was gonna say it's not Clara's.
And also there's noestablishing at any point the
connection between like a la,you know, any of these stories,
but like Wizard of Oz, themovie, you know, things from the
real world being differentversions in the fantasy world.
So I guess it doesn't matter,but at the end of the day, we're
still calling this thenutcracker.

Yeah.

And he's never really a nutcracker, but okay.

Yeah, she calls him a nutcracker soldier, and
that's the only way that wewould know that he is a
nutcracker soldier.
Is she?

Yeah, he just looks like a soldier.
And he has like a like a lipliner on that I'm like, is it
supposed to allude to like anutcracker's mouth?
I don't know.

Uh so Captain Philip Hoffman, he identifies
Clara as a princess and followsher orders uh when she demands
that he lead her across thebridge into the fourth realm
where the mouse ran off with thekey.
Uh they are unable to obtainthe key from the mouse once they

(35:42):
get into the fourth realm,which is like a creepy, creepy,
sort of like broken down, likehaunted looking forest.
And they get chased away by themouse king, which is realized
by all of these mice in therealm, sort of like coming
together to create this sort oflike beast figure.

(36:04):
Cool concept, very coolconcept.
I really liked the way thatthat was realized.
And I was reading some stuffabout like how they arrived at
that because they were like,Yeah, in some of those stories,
the Mouse King is identified ashaving like seven to nine heads
and things like that.
And they're like, how do we dothat and not make it terrifying,
terrifying, but still scary andintimidating?
And I'm like, I think they dida really good job.

Because also, I'm like, when the thing is
holding her and the mice arejust like running over her, it
was oh, I was like, at first,especially because at first,
never having seen this, I fullyexpected a la the original that
the rat this formation of micewas gonna be the villain in some
way.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So I was like, oh my god, I'm that's what's
interesting.
I don't need everything to beexactly the same.
However, I don't know.
I feel like that was anotherthing that was like established
in a cool way and then wentnowhere.
Like, yes, the mice slash ratking, whatever ended up help
being super helpful and heroicin some ways, but it's just it's
this concept that then we justditched.

There's a lot of like really, really great ideas.
And they go like nowhere.

Nowhere.

We're like, throw this in, this and and I'm like,
no, these are great, but let'sfollow the the thread.
And how are they connectingback to one another?
And if they're not connectingback to one another, maybe we
don't need to do it in the firstplace.

Yeah.

But then we also get to see this like really
creepy, like mother gingering,like metal thing.

Hated it, so scary.

Also, I thought it was like kind of cool.

I was Oh no, no, no, like loved, but hated
because I was like, this ishorrifying.
It's horrifying.
It's terrifying.

But I'm like, this is a this is another really
cool way of realizing themother ginger character from the
ballet where all of thechildren come out of like under
her skirts and everything.

So smart.
Yeah.
Again, word work, we've gotgood ideas.

Yeah, it's a mother ginger metal big top.

Yeah, I'm into it.
Yeah.

So Clara and Captain Philip, they manage to
get away from this Mouse Kingconglomeration of mice and
escape the fourth realm, butthey can't get the key.
They weren't able to get thekey.
So now she's like, I don'treally know what to do.
And he's like, We're gonna goto the palace and we're gonna,
you know, see what's up.

(38:11):
So he guides her to the palacewhere she meets the three
regents of each land.
So we've got Shiver, who is theregent of the land of
snowflakes.
We have Hawthorne, who's theregion of the land of flowers,
and we have the sugar plumfairy, who is the region of the
land of sweets.

And at this point, I'm still I'm still with
it.
Yeah.
I'm like trying to track whenthey uh when I when I lost it,
and I was still with it at thispoint.

The costumes are super awesome and the thing.
They're what you would want.

And this like fantasy, sweetsy, wintry, yes,
all good, good, good.
Yeah.

So the regents tell Clara that they are at war
with the land of amusements,which is now only referred to as
the fourth realm.
And Clara imparts theinformation that the people have
not received that her mother,Queen Marie, has passed, which
they all sort of are devastatedby because they have been

(39:05):
anxiously awaiting for her toreturn to their world.
Uh, so Clara now is beingtasked with being the new
leader, the new queen of theland.
And so she watches a balletthat tells the story of their
world's creation and the sugarplum fairy region of the land of
sweets.
She explains to Clara thatMarie created this world as a

(39:27):
young girl.
And then later in the film,Clarifies it like she animated
everyone with a machine that canturn toys into real people.

And so that's it should have been more clear.

Yeah, it wasn't super clear that like the sugar
plum fairy was a toy.

It wasn't.
It wasn't clear that it's likeeverything that has manifested
here was like a toy or like asuite or a something from her
world.

Because and I think it's because some of the
like organic stuff feels soorganic.

Yeah.

Where I'm like, it would be interesting if it
like she took a flower and thenthe flower.
Like almost.
Yeah, it's almost like um likehoney I shrunk the kids kind of
yeah yeah yeah it's kind of it'san interest it's a really
interesting concept but I'm likeI think I need to introduce a
little bit sooner but before wemove on also she eats her hair
which is she eats her hairhilarious let's talk about the

(40:18):
ballet yes this is I think likethe strongest portion I think
like of the film in general forme it's beautiful yeah because
it is such they've realized kindof like the perfect homage in
film to the Nutcracker balletright and it starts with even

(40:39):
referencing other things thatDisney has done with the
Nutcracker where we see theconductor walk out and in
silhouette which is a referenceto Fantasia where they do the
Nutcracker suite and it'sanimated.
So I'm like we've gotreferences to Disney and the
Nutcracker.
It's so smart.
And then you have MistyCopeland who is oh my god just

(41:00):
one of the most beautifulperformers just performers in
general that I've ever seenabsolutely the aesthetic of the
dance of the the the stage thatshe's dancing on creating the
flowers and the snowflakes andthe sweets under her feet as
she's on point.

It's beautiful.

It's beautiful.

It's also just a great device for giving us
backstory on this because thisis a pretty short for what we're
trying to do here.
This is too short of a film.
And I think even more so thiscould have provided some actual
backstory for us of like had itor I don't know how it was
create how the land was createdhow it all fell apart.

Like that's that's kind of the thing is like
we get sort of the bare bonesof it where it's like Mother
Ginger she wanted to rule therealms for herself like that
sort of stuff.
But it's just sort of like yourmother created this world and
I'm like no one's asking howright right I don't know Clara
also learns that time movesdifferently in this world when
Sugar Plum takes her to theclock and turns out that they

(42:03):
are like inside the clock ofDrosselmeyer's home.
She gets this little rightmoment where she sees her father
sitting in the corner sad andit's kind of like a moment where
we see I'm like okay here we'retrying to track this character
arc moment of her having moresympathy and patience with her

(42:23):
father that other people youknow experience grief
differently.

There's just like so many things that she has
to like for but also notenough.

Right, exactly exactly sugar plum fairy's
costume her aesthetic love itlove yeah love it I love it like
I remember when the firstimages for this film came out
and I saw the three regents andI was like this is the shit.
This looks sick it looks sogood.
I mean if I was younger I wouldwant a doll of the sugar plum

(42:55):
fairy I mean she looks amazinguntil you see the sugar plum
fairy in action and thecharacter and some of the
choices that happen it just it'snot all meshing together.
The scripts the character thethe realization maybe the
direction as well it it's justyeah it it feels she feels very

(43:16):
outside of even this world thatwe've created in a way that like
Shiver, Mother Ginger andHawthorne feel very grounded
more grounded yeah in this worldsugar plum fairy feels like
she's doing something else whichmaybe that is intentional maybe
that is a choice to like makeher feel that but I maybe
there's another way that wecould have done it.

I think the trap is almost that the Sugar
Plum Fairy in the ballet is likethe big feature like she's like
the ultimate like princess roleof the ballet and I understand
sorry we're this is a spoilerjumping ahead into the plot
which we're gonna talk about ina moment anyway but like turning
her into the villain I get ityou want to do this a bold

(43:56):
change.
You want to make the bigprincess character into the
villain fine.

But then I think I think there is some the the
dance of the sugar plum fairy isalways like a little bit eerie
the the music itself so I'm likeokay I can see where you're
pulling from to try and do that.

Yeah yeah I just think the pre-villain sugar
plum we get needs to be so muchmore alluring.
Like she needs to be like theultimate like you just want to
like be around her you want totalk to her you want to like
she's got to have that pull andthat's not what this character
was.

Yeah she was very saccharin like from the
beginning which I'm like I I getwhere it's she's from the land
of sweets like I kind of get itbut it's like I don't know the
sugar plum fairy needs to belike a sweet that you want
another hit of again and again.
She needs to be like QueenFrosty yeah yeah where like
there's a little bit of mysteryto her something like that.

She's yeah and she can certainly be sweet but
it felt like almost sugar plumwas trying too hard which I mean
again again I think then you'resupposed to be like oh I see it
in hindsight that she wastrying too hard because she's
evil but she's trying too hardbecause she's evil or she has
attachment issues and that'swhat got her into this situation
in the first place but I'm justlike I'm just like I don't
think that's the strongestchoice for sugar plum fairy and

(45:15):
I think I think that's thestrong choice for her if her arc
doesn't end up being thevillain.
If you want to just have her bethis like comical sweetie girl
I'm down with it.
But then she can't become thevillain.

I I agree I agree with that.
So after the ballet Clara goeswith Sugar Plum Fairy and Sugar
Plum Fairy explains that hermother used this device that
would turn toys into real lifepeople and that they can use it
to defend the other three realmsagainst Mother Ginger, the

(45:45):
regent of the fourth realm whois set upon claiming all of the
realms for herself.
Clara notices that the keyholethat runs the machine matches
the one of her egg and ismissing and that that's the only
thing that's keeping them fromusing this machine.
So she's like okay we need togo get this key not just for my

(46:09):
egg but for this machine to savethe world so in order to do
that she's got to go to thefourth realm.
She and her soldiers sheassembles them all they all go
suddenly she knows how to lead aregiment.
She just suddenly just like andride a horse so she leads them
all across the bridge whichanother thing this palace I love

(46:32):
the palace.
Yeah you know it's somethingnew like that I think that's
also what I look for in like afantasy castle I'm looking for
something new and like havingall of the Russian influence to
it but then also that it is onthis like peak of a waterfall
perpetual waterfall.
Clara she leads this regimentover into the fourth realm.

And I think this was the point where I was
like oh because I I checked thetime left and I was like crap I
literally think the rest of thismovie is just going to be about
the engine and the key and thatjust feels a little meh to me.
Like I get it it is a majorconflict it's the realms against
each other going to war.

(47:12):
Yet at the same time it justfelt so small.
Well get the key feels so smallto me.

And I think that's also the the trap of it
you're calling it Nutcrackerand the Four Realms but it's not
a she's she spends most of hertime either in the castle or in
the land of amusements in thefourth realm.
This isn't a journey throughall four realms it's just like
we only see her visit the theland of snowflakes, the land of
flowers and the land of sweetsin at the end in that like well

(47:39):
in a quick little montage momentduring the ballet where it's
like oh she's like getting herpresentation but they're really
like blinking you miss it sortof moments.

Oh my god lost that that's all happening
during the ballet too that's ahuge part of the story that
would make this feel biggerwhich is like she's getting
presented as the new queen ofall four realms like what is
that like and like but theysmashed that into into the
ballet montage that is sostrange.

(48:08):
Just like at the I noticed andI you know what that happened so
fast I didn't even clock it butat the end she had this very
very two second long coronationmoment and I was kind of just
like well what happened therelike and then she leaves she
leaves and then she's like byethanks for the thanks thanks for
the kingdom bye bye God youknow you know the trauma that

(48:30):
you have of my mom leaving youand then going off and dying go
ahead and do that.

I'm gonna go ahead and do that for you real
quick.

All right so she gets they go over into the
fourth realm they have this likecreepy battle in the woods nope
everything that I hate aboutAlice in Wonderland was starting
to happen in this and I waslike oh no no we get Mouse Rinks
the Mouse Mouse Rinks MouseRinks and I'm kind of just like

(48:58):
why the name of the mousehonestly like why can't he be
the Mouse King and then theformate he makes a formation of
a giant mouse but like whycouldn't he just be called the
Mouse King I don't know becauseagain why was that thing called
the Mouse King he's not the kingand also there is a queen he's
not the king and like his namewasn't even Mouse Rex which I'd
be like oh Mouse Rex Rex beingbeing king but no it's like

(49:22):
Mouse Rex.

It's like Mouse Rex or something it's it's why
is he the Mouse?

Why is that formation of mice the mice the
Mouse King that he's not theking everybody there is a clear
structure of leadership here.

He's not a king in any way shape or form yeah
they kind of feel like more oflike a commune yes yeah so
they're doing this sort of likebattle in in the forest in the
mist and everything and Claracontinuing to look for the key
sees that the key goes into thecreepy run down of amusements of
all these like rusted amusementrides and carnival stuff.

Which I don't dislike but again is it over
kind of an overdone aestheticthe broken down carnival I've
kind of seen it before yeah itdoesn't feel super creative to
me.

And I'm also just like how did it all get broken
down?
Right because it's just likesupplies have been cut off to
that realm I suppose of magicwho knows I'm like what what
keeps the things oiled and cleanand how did mother ginger get
her face crack her face crackface crack of the century.
Yeah so Clara goes into theMother Ginger big top she sees

(50:29):
the like Punchinella uh yeahbloop bloop bloop bloop funny
funny clown thing nightmare fuelshe goes like up this little
staircase thing stairs thatthing was cool invention I'm
like I would ride it would rideand then she comes face to face
with Mother Ginger.

(50:49):
So she sees Mother GingerMother Ginger has the key and
they sort of have this littlelike face-off moment and then
Philip comes in causes adistraction she grabs the key
and hustles her ass out of therefrom motherfucking I don't even
know how that happened let melet my want my mind wandered a

(51:10):
little bit I was like oh she'sout with the key okay literally
Mother Ginger like Philip comesin he starts battling the clowns
on the ground floor motherginger looks away she grabs the
key and then she slams herselfinto the little seat little
swirly seat and then she goesall the way back down they run
out.

There were too many battle sequences in this
and I again I get that'sactually in the source material
but for me it was in favor ofplot development.
So it was just like half of themovie I felt like I was
watching the sword fights and Ijust not interested in that.

Yeah I almost kind of wish that like she
didn't go into the fourth realmthat she hadn't already been in
the fourth realm.

Agree.

That if this was the first time like if if when
she was with the nutcracker hetook her straight to the palace
and we skipped it.

Yes we didn't need any of the rest of it
anyway completely agree.
Yes.
And I almost wish that then wecould cut out these little
clowny guys it would almost becooler if she's walking I mean
even though I do love thegigantic Mother Ginger thing and
I wouldn't trade it.
If it's like Mother Ginger isjust like in the woods and they
just like come face to face liketwo women just like walking on

(52:14):
foot and it's like she'ssurprised to just like see her
walking around like a normalperson.

You know like so that it could be more of a
personal that feels very Oz thegreat and powerful too where
it's like you think that the badwitch is Glinda and you meet
her in the graveyard andeverything.

Yes.
These are all sorry I forgot tomention that film at the
beginning too of like all thethings that feel like they're in
the same line Oz the Great andpowerful is in this line too.

Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah okay so they
escape from Mother Ginger andClara and Philip they go off and
she's able she's got her keyand she opens up her her egg and
it turns out that it is a musicbox and it's disappointing to
her and it's it's playing thethe sort of like love theme

(53:01):
between the nutcracker lovetheme.
It's the first it's the it'sthe duet that I love that that
the nutcracker and Clara danceafter he's been transformed into
the prince.

Yeah like this is a Disney movie.
He's a prince I was gonna sayit's a Disney movie where we
have a prince transformation andwe're like nah let's not okay
what?
Okay.

So Clara's disappointed she's like I don't
give a fuck about this this keyanymore just take it back to
sugar plum and everything andand Philip's like no you should
you should come back too andeverything and Clara's just
feeling all down about herself.

She's constantly like I'm kind of
gonna leave all the time.

Yeah it's it's it's constantly kind of gonna
leave it's constantly I'm apiece of shit it's constantly
I'm not my mother which is okaylike then we really just have to
like fully make that her thingbecause then she's way too
confident leading these troops.

Yeah yeah because I'm like no no you were
acting very much like a queen itwas working for me it seems
like you can do it but her wholething is like I can I'm not my
mother but she's doing it she'sdoing it.

Yeah yeah yeah that that arc wasn't mapped
which needed to be if that's theif that's the theme which it is
the theme that they're goingfor of her lesson to learn that
like you have a menu.
Yeah and your mother always waslike you are the greatest thing
ever like yeah uh so she goesback to the castle gives the key
to sugar plum fairy who usesthe machine to turn some tin

(54:26):
soldiers into life size onesthat will obey her every command
because they don't haveanything in them.
Phil I thought that was aninteresting line that Philip
points out he's like he's likethey're made of tin they're
hollow and she's like exactlythey'll do everything I want and
they'll obey her commandsincluding the one to attack the
fourth realm.
Mm-hmm and now we get thereveal that Sugarplum is

(54:50):
actually the one who wants torule the realms and why is not
very the why behind that is notvery solid to me.
It's just like I miss Marie shetold us to play nice and I
don't want to it's just it seemsit seems like it's coming from

(55:10):
a place of sugar plum believedin Marie with everything and she
was abandoned and she was likeI don't want to follow any of
the rules I don't want to bebeholden to any leader because
they just let you down.

So I'm well when you describe it that way
I'm like that's solid but itwasn't clear.
I know it just felt likechaotic for for no reason.

Well because also the script has really weird
things happening that feel veryout of place where she's like
hello boys and she's like I wasjust gonna say what and she's
constantly like she actuallysays the line like she says
hello boys and then she was likea man in uniform and these
boys.
She refers to them as boys too.

It's weird it's so strange.
It's very out of place I thinkeven in this world yes the
villain who says that is avillain who was like jilted by a
lover or something and that'snot her I'm like is she
attracted to these tingesoldiers I don't yeah like she
was just constantly likesexualizing them in a weird way
it was so strange.

Also she's a sugar plume fairy and she only
flies two times and one time sheopened up her wings I was like
I was like uh so sugar plumreveals that the machine can
also turn this world's peopleback into toys and that she
intends to do that to the otherregents and that she had lied

(56:32):
about Mother Ginger.
I'm like but they're not theydon't look like toys okay and
Mother Ginger with her people ofthe land of amusements had
resisted against Sugar PlumFairy's plan and that's why she
made sure that she was on theAlps Clara is like this shit
ain't happening this is fuckedand Sugar Plairy is like fine

(56:55):
I'll throw you in prison.
So she puts Clara Philip Shiverand Hawthorne into prison which
is like the attic it's likevery beautiful rooms it's
beautiful ver.

Verdi for and this could have been the moment
before Shiver, Shivers whateverand Hawthorne arrive this could
have been again even if we'renot gonna lean full-fledged
romance this could have been areally beautiful connection
scene between Philip and Clarabeing like it's us we're gonna
do this together like I got youbut now we've got these two

(57:27):
older men who are also presentfor it.
And it's just kind of likeslash also I think they wanted
to not even have that be in ourminds so they give the moment
like if it's not all of themit's Clara by herself and that's
when Clara opens her music boxagain and she discovers that the
top flips to reveal a mirrorillustrating that she all she

(57:49):
needed was herself which we allknew from the get yeah yeah so
she and the other prisonersescape using physics cool scene
and I'm like again my brainturned off I'm like yeah they
got out I don't how I don't knowit's it's taking too long

(58:11):
there's no plot I don't careabout these action sequences
please I'm truly my mindwandered I don't even know what
I was thinking about.

So they're escaping prison and she's like I
gotta stop this I gotta setthis right I gotta stop sugar
plum and so she is trying tomake her way back into the the
room where Sugar Plum's makingall this shit meanwhile Mother
Ginger has sent mouse ricksmouse rinks mouse mouse mouse
mouse mouse the mouse the bigmouse head mouse a rink mousy

(58:45):
she sent Mousy over to thecastle to be like shit's gonna
go down keep an eye on it andnow Philip's like oh mousey
you're my friend and he's likewe need to the romance was truly
between the two of them the waythat Mouse A rinks like cuddles
him at the end of the movie Iwas like they're in love.
They're in love.

They're in love.
Which you know sure I mean ifyou want to give me that version
of the story the Mouse King andthe nutcracker maybe that is
book two of the sluttiestnutcracker it's uh it's the in
this it would never work thatway the mouse in this book the
mice in this book are disgustingoh disgusting I was gonna say
heated rivalry has nothing onthe nutcracker the nutcracker is

(59:27):
beyond horny for Louisa so it'snever gonna happen Louisa yes
never heard of her the sisterClara is busy with the sugar
plum fairy but I digress sugarplum fairy's a man but he but he
is very very bi who does he getwith every everybody do you get

(59:50):
a by scene um do he well I'monly halfway through the book so
who knows who knows but hetells her but he tells her about
like he's been with everybodyhe has pink hair he has Black
nails, like it's over.
So, all this to say, I'm verymuch not against people taking
these established characters anddoing something new.

(01:00:11):
You gotta build it for me, andI will come.
I mean, that's added wrong.

Conor Perkins (01:00:26):
Thank you for joining us on Poor Unfortunate
Podcast.
This is our final episode.

Caroline Aimetti (01:00:34):
Get me out of here, okay?

I cannot believe that happened.

I can't.
I I can't go on.
Okay.
My brain is Patreonnutcrackered out, okay?
I just don't know what's goingon anymore.
But yeah, so what I'm trying tosay is do something different
with these characters.
I am I am not against that, butyou have to like you gotta have
some character developmentbehind it.

Yeah.

I gotta know who they are.
That's it.

Okay, so Mousy is like, okay, I'm gets Mother
Ginger.
Mother Ginger and Sugar PlumFairy like are preparing for
battle.
Sugar Plum's invading with allthe tin soldiers, and Mother
Ginger has all of her mice.

And of course, she's become a mad, a mad ruler
now because her hair is a mess.
Like some also I'm like, thiswoman would never have a hair
out of place, but never, butwhatever.

Uh so the land of amusements, the people of the
land of amusements are likefighting them off.

Yeah.

Meanwhile, Clara, she is sneaking back into the
machine room.
She stops the like flow, thefactory flow with water brain
turned off.

I don't know.
What was happening?

And surprise, Mother Ginger was hiding in one
of the little like Russian dolltype of.

Oh my god, when when Helen Mirren pops out
of that, I was like, oh my god,stop doing this to Helen Mirren,
please.
The way that she had to likejump.

But also, like Mother Ginger, I love Mother
Ginger.
I'm like, she was she wasbadass.
The makeup was sick.

The outfit is amazing, like the like the vest
and the pants.
The like whip was super cool.
Absolutely.

I was like, I was into I was into Mother Ginger.

Helen Mirren is Mother Ginger, yes.
That sounds exactly right.

And then when her aesthetic changes when she's a
region at the end of the filmagain, I love more than her
region outfit was exactly right.

I was like in the flow.
Yes.

It's flow.

The costumes were telling a story and very
little else was.

So Mother Ginger comes into the room.
Clara enters the machine room.
She shuts down the machinewhile fighting off the soldiers.
Mother Ginger, she comes to heraid.
The sugar plum fairy ultimatelyfigures out some shit's going
back down the machine room.
So she flutters her littlewings.
And the only the second time weever see her wings ever.
She comes back and then she'slike, stop, no, don't.

(01:03:03):
And then please.

Um, and then I'm a fairy now, but I'm just
gonna go.

So then she gets she basically traps Mother
Ginger and is like, I'm gonnaturn you first back into a damn
toy.

Right.

Meanwhile, Clara has been doing this little
reversal on the machine to makeit do something else.

I mean, your guess is as good as mine.
I have no idea what you're eventalking about, and I watched it
today.

Well, she changes the thing so that it like the
direction, the direction, whichis like an allusion to the when
the swans were moving in thebeginning, in the beginning when
she fixes the thingin Drosselmeyer's...

Very kind.
Sure.
I guess so.
I don't know.
Okay, I'm looking, I oh my god.
Yeah, okay.

Yeah, so uh Mother Ginger is like about to
like get it, and Clara comesout, which I like this little
moment where Clara she doesn'tlet Sugar Plum like just go
ahead and do it.
She tries to get Sugar Plum,she gives her one last chance to
like stop doing it on her own.
She's yeah, she appeals to herand she's like, Don't do this.
My mother would have wouldn'thave wanted this.
And uh Sugar Plum Fairy islike, I don't care, she's not

(01:04:12):
here anymore, she dead.

And then she abandoned me.
Uh uh.

She pushes the button to zap Mother Ginger back
into a porcelain doll, butinstead the machine tilts upward
and zaps sugar plum, and shegets turned back into a doll.
And yeah, uh Mother Ginger issaved, and all the tin soldiers
magically.

Yes, I was gonna say, how convenient,
right?
Like somehow they're connected.
If if you are connected likethat to all of the beings you
have created, then we've got awhole nother set of rules in
this world that we also haven'tfollowed in other ways.
So it doesn't work.

Because in that case, they all should have died
when Marie died.

Yeah, thank you.
Yes, Clara would have walkedinto a world full of dead
bodies.
It would have been terrible.

Actually, that kind of would have been your
favorite movie, too.
That the little the little girlstaring at the dead body in the
haunted mansion would have beenlike, ah, take me there.
Clara and the Four Realms ofcorpses.

Yeah, so very convenient, but it doesn't, it
doesn't make any sense.

So, Mother Ginger, she's she's saved, peace
has been restored to therealms.
Clara promises to visit them inthe future, and then she
returns back to London, wheretime has hardly passed at all
since she left.

Yeah.

She approaches her father, apologizes for her
earlier behavior, and asks himto dance.
He accepts and she opens hermusic box when he becomes
emotional.
And the song plays what he saysis the first song that he and
Marie ever danced to.

So I'm like, Are you the nutcracker prince?

Yes.
I was like, wait, are you thenutcracker prince?
And she took you out of there,but he's not.

No.

Because we don't believe in love in this.

Okay, listen to me.
That could have beeninteresting.
Where the she's disconnectedfrom her father in the real
world, and is he's thenutcracker prince in this other
world, and suddenly they're likebuddies and adventure pals, and
that's what helps her connectwith her father when she comes
back.
Um I can get into that.

Yeah.

That would be a that's good.

Yeah, I think it if they wanted to tell that
story, but then that story isnot the same as like her finding
herself.
Then it's a father, it's afather-daughter story.
But I think that actually wouldhave been really cool.
Is it would have been cool.
Like she goes into this, intothis world and like something
happens, and then all of asudden, like her father, like is
like, I know where she is, orlike he he's getting memories

(01:06:34):
back or something like that.
Like very kind of likeHook-esque, like Peter Pan
getting his memory, likememories back, like not having a
recollection of this at all.
Then he is using it as a way tostay in touch with her mother,
where he's been like avoidinggrieving the mother, where it's
like, no, you need to embraceit.

Or it's like, yeah, that's the thing they that
was a land they both were intouch with in some way, and he
can't bear to like go there nowthat she's gone, and Clara is
the one who brings him backthere.
Which also, you know, if we'regoing with the the the source
material version of like thenutcracker is usually older and
Clara's a girl, it works outperfectly.
It's like her alternate father.

Yeah, and and then we could have we could have
done something with like amouse steals the key or
whatever, and then the mouseking like captures her and
starts pulling her into therealms, and you could have a
battle between like her fatherand the mouse king, and then
that's when we are realizing,oh, father is the nutcracker.

Yeah, I think and then that leaves a lot of
potential.

Matthew Macfadyen as a nutcracker would have just
been like baller.

Take my money, yeah.
That would have been fantastic.
And then we could have playedaround with the Sugar Plum being
something else reallyinteresting.
Who knows what?
But yeah, it just opens up itopens up the options.
I'm into that.

And so then they just they dance, and then the
movie's over.

Yeah.

I love the end credits of this film.

Oh, great.

We get another, we get another ballet sequence.

Yes, I even love the animations once we get
to the actual credits rolling.
I'm like, I love these, butthese are from a different
movie, as is "Fall On Me.""Fall On Me" has promised me an
entirely different movie.

Well, "Fall On Me", again, the song is
a duet between a father andson.

Right.

It's it's a duet, and Clara's story has been
pretty much a solo one.
I think "Fall On Me" would makeeven more sense to be
associated with a story betweena father and a daughter.

Absolutely, because then it's also like
they're they're both peoplegrieving, and it's like, fall on
me, I'll fall on you.
Like we we'll get through ittogether.
Like when we feel like we can'tgo on through this, we will
together.

I would not be surprised if Ashleigh Powell,
who wrote this, was like, Yeah,no, I wrote this as a
father-daughter um thing.
And then the studio was like,No, we need a we need a strong
female character, like a likeput Clara at the center.

We're still gonna have the nutcracker, quote
unquote, look at her longinglyenough that I was like, okay,
they're trying not to do aromance, but I bet you he's
gonna grab her hand, he's gonnakiss her hand or kiss her on the
cheek.
Nope.
But I'm just we just had himstare at her, and I'm like, I
know what you're trying to say,so just do it.
Have him do it.
Even if she's not interested,he can still have feelings for

(01:09:30):
her, because he clearly does.

And and I'm just like, they could have solved
that issue if that was somethingthat they didn't want to do, if
they didn't want to go into theromance route, they could have
solved that issue entirely bymaking the Nutgregor her father.
And maybe he's confronting likehaving left the realm and
realizing that he's doing thesame thing with his children,

(01:09:53):
where he's like leaving them intheir time of grief.

And the heart of the whole story is like a
transformation, and like I feellike that's like a lot of what
grief is, and she's transformedin the way she views her father.
So it's just a very cleanconnecting line between those
things.

You could even do a thing where like he slowly is
starting to turn back into anutcracker, and he needs to go
to the to the realms in order tolike restore the magic.

That's what happens in my book.
He's constantly like going backand forth between uh, you know,
his real form and a nutcracker,which is a very interesting
thing.

Yeah, it reminds me of like once upon a time,
because that's one of the thingsthat happens with Pinocchio is
Pinocchio is like he's startingto turn wooden again as the
magic is like leaving.

And but but we've completely ignored the
nutcracker of it all in this, soit doesn't even matter.
And it's in the title, yes,because they had to tell because
at first I was like, call thisClara and the Four Realms, but
nobody would know what it was,and I don't think it mattered
anyway.
And "Fall On Me", yes, I loveit as like this is this this is
the end credit song about thisfather-daughter story.
I'm in 100%, but again, it'sanother thing that inherently is

(01:11:03):
romantic, it's romantic soundsromantic.

It's why I thought it was between Andrea
Bacelli and his young lovernurse.

I I didn't know, I know I think you did you
say at one point you're like,this could totally be a
candidate for a song at mywedding, and I was like, I'm on
board with you.

Right now, it is like literally, if I ever marry,
"Fall On Me" is low-key, like amajor contender for a wedding
song for me.

Yeah, so the end credits, there are there are
just pieces of this wholething.
I think this is a good, that'sperfect way to sum it up.
It's like there are just piecesof this, and we'll never know.
There's some hidden thing herewith reshoots.
There are pieces of this thatfeel so right on the right
track, and then they just getcompletely muddled.
Yeah.
And it comes out in dribs anddrabs in these like glorious

(01:11:49):
costumes, in this use of thescore from the ballet, in this
beautiful sweeping and creditsmusic.
It's just like, what movie isthat?
Because I want to see thatmovie.

In the like concept art, the production
design, the images of it all.

And even the trailer.
But again, it's a differentmovie.
It's a movie about a about agirl making figuring out who she
is and blah, blah, blah.

And I'm just like, we did that.
We did that with Alice inWonderland.
And Alice and Tim Burton'sAlice in Wonderland, we are
gonna talk about this at somepoint because it's been on my
list for a while to talk aboutthis film.

I know, yeah.

Because I thoroughly enjoy Tim Burton's
Alice in Wonderland, and I thinkit was executed really, really
well.
And it just feels like this istrying to be that.
And I'm like, we don't need tobecause we already did it.

And where this falls again in the timeline of
Disney is right around the timewhen folks started being like,
Disney has abandoned romance,Disney doesn't want to do
romance anymore.
And that feels like that'swhat's happening here.
And it's sad because a Disneysweeping, adventurous, romantic,
fantastical version of thestory of the Nutcracker is

(01:12:53):
completely 1000% something Iwant to see.

Yeah.

Like that the that article that I also read
the same thing that's like, oh,maybe it was because of a lack
of interest in the Nutcrackerproperty.
I just don't see that being thecase.
I think ballets are excellentsource material for animated
films, Disney films.
It's a it's a it's the choice.
Well, because it's a greatchoice.

Because there is no there there is a story, but
there is no like dialogue oranything.
So you really can do whateveryou want with it.
Because it's dance and dance isinterpretive.
There are a million differentways in which you can read even
the same story or interpret itthrough dance.
That's why choreographychanges.
It's you you can change momentsjust in the way that people are

(01:13:36):
dancing.
So it it feels even more sothan writing a story down more
universal because it's it's notcontained by language and
letters, it's it's contained bymovement.
It's a different thing.

Yeah, this just makes me want to maybe on
stage, maybe a book.
I don't know.
Ma wants me to make thishappen.

Yeah, honestly.

I really want it to happen.

Honestly, I'm I was I was kind of surprised that
Disney did not attempt to makean animated feature of the
nutcracker as source material.

Yes, I totally agree.
It's kind of obvious to me.
I even think about my god, thesteadfast tin soldier is one of
my favorite things like on thisactual planet.
Beautiful, all on the planet.
I love it so much.
And it manages to like be thestory, be kid friendly, but also
is so poignant andheartbreaking.
And I feel like a Disneyversion of the Nutcracker could
be all of those things.

(01:14:32):
And I really think that Disneykind of needs something like
this in the lineup that'sactually good because there's a
lot of there's a lot ofChristmas, but again, it's
either like it's like frozenwhen we love this, so maybe I'm
biased, but it's like frozenversion of Christmas, or it's
the Santa Claus, or it's likeprep and land.

There's nothing living in this world, and I
think Disney needs to fill inthis gap in the Christmas
programming that is this whereit's like this is a story that
takes place around Christmas,but is not about making the
holiday happen.
The holiday just exists.
This is a story that takesplace at this time of year,
yeah, not about this time ofyear.

Yep, a hundred percent.
Is this I know that I am alwaysputting my romance agenda on
things, but this it's just it'sall it's already and and I think
again, what you were sayingearlier was so great.
The capital R romantic appliesto a potential father-daughter
story about grief.
Yes, which I think isbeautiful, beautiful.

Because you know what?
And I think there's a perfectexample of this in musical
theater.
It's bonkers, but somethingthat takes source material that
is not about this and turns itinto it being about this is
Beetlejuice, the musical.
It takes the story ofBetelgeuse, the film, and turns
it into being all about therelationship between a father

(01:15:53):
and a daughter around grief andyes.
And I think that's kind of theway that you gotta do this,
where it's like if we're notdoing the nutcracker, what other
story are we telling with it?
And it has to be about somesort of relationship because Oh,
yeah, this isn't about arelationship.
Even the original nutcracker,it's the relationship between

(01:16:16):
Clara and this nutcracker.
Like it is about this love for,like the story ends with like
Clara saying, like, she wouldswore to protect this nutcracker
until the day that she dies.

And it almost feels like it's some in some
ways, it's almost about her andDrosselmeyer too.

And I think that they've tried to just be like,
we're gonna strip it all away,and this is just about Clara.
But then that's not thenutcracker.
That's a Clara origin story.

It's Clara and the four rows.

Or it's just Clara, but like you're not
telling the story of theNutcracker, and if you're
telling the story of Clara thatis not Clara and the Nutcracker,
the events of the Nutcrackerhave to take place as we know
them.
Does that make sense?
Where it's like if we're doingsort of like an origin story,
like a character study of aparticular character, yeah, the

(01:17:04):
thing that we are we are leapingoff from in order to tell that
story, we need to maintain as itis as a reference point.

Yeah.
Yep.

So if we are telling a Clara origin story or
something like that, it has tobe that the events of the
Nutcracker take place as writtenin the fairy, like in the fairy
tale, in the story, in theballet, with all of the romantic
things involved.

Or if you want to give me a Clara origin
story, let's say we're doingthat and we're playing around
with it a little and the eventsof the Nutcracker ballet as we
know them haven't happened yet.
So we're just focusing on herorigin story in some way.
I guess then we're not going tothe fantastical world.
So it's canceled out, but justgo with me.
Then we can make this more of aseries and have her age so that

(01:17:50):
you feel more comfortable oncethe events of the nutcracker
happen, having it be a romancebecause we've seen other aspects
of her character first.
We have her origin story.
We've established what we'retrying to do with her here,
which is her being a strongyoung woman and like, you know,
and see, and if you want tobreak the rules, then maybe the
nutcracker events, maybe she hasbeen there before.
Maybe she's just never met theNutcracker Prince.
I don't know.

And see, that's exactly why Tim Burton's Alice
in Wonderland is so good, isbecause it is referencing Alice
in Wonderland.
The events of Alice inWonderland as we know them have
taken place.
Alice just has no memory of anyof it.

100%.
Yep, yep, yep, yep.

So it's like we we now have, we now have a
vocabulary.
We have a common language ofthis world because we already
know how it is, because we'reusing things we bring to it.
We can't really bring much tothis nutcracker world because we
don't know who the nutcrackeris.

We don't know we don't there's nothing because
we didn't even get to see anyof them as toys in her real
life.
No.
Because then we have at least atenuous connection to them.

And I will say, you know, a lot of people have
have claimed that this is sortof a trap of trying to adapt
this story in that these realms,the the land of sweets, the
land of flowers, the land ofsnowflakes, the land of
amusements.
They when you look at like theballet of the nutcracker,
basically all of the actiontakes place in like the first
act, and then they get into theland of snowflakes, and then

(01:19:16):
it's just like a whole bunch ofdances as the court is
presenting themselves to Clara.
Right.

And then which is the what happens that like
people think about they thinkabout Swan Lake and they think
about Swan Princess the movie,but so much of Swan Lake is a
bunch of different nationspresenting themselves to Prince
Siegfried.
Like that's just what it's aballet.
What do you want?

Like And it's like we want to, yeah, we want
to show off different styles ofdance.
We want to show off differentstyles of music.

And we did that, and we shoehorn that into
Swan Princess with the ball, andbut it was perfect.

Princess is on parade, princess is on parade.
We've got it.
Oh my god.
But the trap of this is thatit's very loosey-goosey from the
beginning, these realms areall.
Kind of they are kind of weirdand disjointed, and so a lot of
people are like, Well, this wasalways going to happen because
of this, but I don't think it'sa good thing.

But you can make the you can make the rules,
it's your mo it's youradaptation of it, it's your
film, you can make it lessloosey-boosey.

You can I'm like, we can find a through line
between snowflakes, flowers,sweets, and amusements.
There, yeah, if those were thefour things that originated
within the original story,clearly somebody saw something
that connects all of themtogether.
If if anything, it's just it'sChristmas that brings them all
together.
Snow, flowers, some beautifulgarlands and things like that.

(01:20:37):
Suites and amusements.

Right.

Those are like the four principles of a
Christmas party.
Sure.
It baffles me, I think, whenfor as imaginative as our
industry and our business issupposed to be, yeah, how much
of a lack of imagination thereis.

Very interesting.
Yep, especially with suchstrong source material.

I feel bad for Ashleigh Powell because I don't
necessarily think that this filmis the story that she wanted to
tell.
It just reeks of studioinvolvement.

We might have to get her.
We need to talk to her.
I would like to talk to her.
I actually would really like toknow.

Yeah.
Well, now you've seen theNutcracker and the Four Realms.

Well, listen, in the in the moments when I
turned off my brain and I staredat it, I mean, I had a good
enough time.
You know me.
I love a vibe.

And hey, it's another nutcracker story.
Yeah.
Because there aren't that manymainstream versions of the
nutcracker that are narrative ina way that like isn't just the
ballet.

This might be the jumping off point for me.
I might have to take this intomy own hands.

I kind of was hoping you would say that.
Because as someone, listen,listen, y'all, as someone who
has seen, heard, and read, likeread Caroline's writing and
style of writing, the Nutcrackeris so perfectly your aesthetic.
Write that down.

Is today the day?

And then you can you can say, like in your
history of like how it'shappening, you'd be like, I was
radicalized after watching theNutcracker and the Four Realms.

And reading a Court of Sugar and friggin'
Spice.
Happy.
But I'm glad we it's I mean,it's been long enough.
Every year at Christmas, you'realways like, have you watched
watched it yet?
And I'm like, no, I haven't.
This was this is when it neededto happen, and we needed to be
able to hop on and talk about itdirectly afterwards.
So I'm so glad that we did.
It was fun to talk about it.

(01:22:29):
It was fun to talk about itwith you.
Because this wasn't the kind ofthing where I was like, oh, I
abhor this.
It's just like, oh it's likethe kind of thing that you and I
love to dissect.
Yes.
So it was fun.

And and there's something like even when I was
reading like the negativereviews of this as I was
prepping just the loosebackground information,
everything, I was feeling veryprotective of it.
I was just like, no.

And when when they were like Because this very
much could have been our thing.
Like it has us written all overit.

When they're like, there's no there's a lack
of interest in the nutcracker.
And I'm like, that's not wrong.

Incorrect.

I'm like, that's not like how can you say there's
a lack of interest in thenutcracker when every fucking
year every ballet company acrossthe United States is producing?
I'm like, everyone is lookingfor the nutcracker.

It's another fairy tale for us.
People, it's still a fairytale.

There's interest.
It's a Christmas fairy talethat's not Rudolph, Frosty,
Santa Claus, or Jesus.

Right.
Like, right, thank you.

Yes.
Because those ones we we knowthem all.
We know those ones really,really well.

My fingers are itching.
I might have to do somethingabout this.
Stay tuned.

Stay tuned.

It's gonna keep me up tonight for sure.
Thank you for doing this.

Thank you all so much for joining us.
We really appreciate you beinghere.
Thank you.
If you liked this episode, makesure that you hit follow or
subscribe wherever you'regetting the podcast.
Opt in for those notificationson YouTube.
And then this is that moment.
Hit five stars, leave a writtenreview, leave a comment as a
happy birthday present to ourdearest Caroline, who may or may

(01:23:59):
not be embarking on redoing anentire Nutcracker story for
posterity because it needs to bedone and she's probably the one
to do it.
So, and then also make surethat you share this with
somebody.
We hope that this episode haskept you company for a little
bit over the holiday season andmaybe exposed you to a film that

(01:24:20):
you really never thought thatyou were gonna ever watch.

Exactly.
I hope that somebody stumblesacross this somewhere and
they're like, I was kind ofhoping somebody would talk about
this.
I think I watched that once.
That's why we're here.

And people talking about who aren't just
gonna like sit there and bash onit the whole time and talk
about what could be good aboutit.
So share this with somebody whoyou think would enjoy that
perspective.
And while you're at it, we havealso created a playlist of all
of our holiday themed episodes.
Yes.
So you can go to our website,poorunfortunatepodcast.com,

(01:24:51):
click on listen, and theplaylist is curated for you
right there.
Or you can head over to ourYouTube channel and it's a
playlist on our on our YouTube.
So yeah.

So if you miss the game of yes and no, we have
a bunch for you.

I can guarantee you probably will you will not
remember.

I would I would play that.
I could play that fresh today.
I wouldn't remember a damnthing.
That's what we should havedone.

I could just read, I could just give it.

You could read me the same ones, and I'd be
like, I have no idea what thisis.
Amazing.
And another great birthdaypresent for me, if you have not
done this yet, would be tofollow us on social media.
We are at @PoorUnfortunatePodcast everywhere.
Instagram, Facebook, TikTok,threads, blue sky.
We would love to talk aboutNutcracker and the Four Realms

(01:25:35):
with you.
So, like, leave us a comment,send us a DM.
We'll make some content aroundthis to get the conversation
going.
And it's just the way to growthe podcast these days.
As we bring more opportunitiesto you all that we hope you've
been enjoying, people want tosee who's looking at our stuff.
So it just goes a long way.
It's a free way for you to helpus out.
And so we thank you so much forthat.

(01:25:55):
And if you want even more PoorUnfortunate Podcast in your
life, please join either ourprivate Facebook group or our
Discord channel, the PoorUnfortunate Fam.
So that is where our listenersgather to talk about the
episodes, talk about a range ofother subjects that we've all
found we have in common, whichis so much fun.
And it's just a fantastic wayfor Conor and I to find out

(01:26:15):
who's out there listening andwhat you're interested in.
So we can keep bringing youwhat you love about Poor
Unfortunate Podcast.
So we hope to see you there.

And if you're looking for merch, the Poor
Unfortunate Shop is open,poorunfortunatepodcast.com/shop.
And as I always say, it doestake us a little bit of money to
keep the podcast up and runningand coming to you.
We do have a PayPal accountlinked in our episode
description and in the websitelinks in our social media
accounts.
Anything you have to spare goesa long way for us.
It could be a dollar, fivedollars, ten dollars more than

(01:26:45):
that.
One time donation, monthlydonation, it all just goes right
back into the podcast, helpingus keep it free.
And to all of our monthlydonors who have been donating to
this all year long, whetheryou've been here for a month,
whether you've been here fromthe beginning.
Thank you.
Thank you.
We are not able to do thiswithout you.
And uh I hope that some of youwho have been enjoying the

(01:27:07):
podcast thus far will considerin the new year if you have a
little bit extra that you mightbe able to throw our way.
It helps us so much.
It helps us so, so, so much.
So thank you very much forthat.
Thank you.
All right, we hope you have ahappy and safe Christmas and
holiday season.

Happy holidays, you all.
We love you.

And Caroline, happy birthday.

Thank you.
I have a feeling it's gonna bea really good birthday.

Yeah, this one's gonna be a good year.
It has to, right?

Yeah, because I'm writing the nutcracker.

There you go.
Stay tuned for this time nextyear.
We'll we'll see.
Uh maybe, maybe we'll we'll doa maybe our Christmas movie.

Yeah, fantastic.
See you there.
Or that'll be on the Patreonfive days.

Yeah, that'll be on a Patreon.
Absolutely.
Yeah, absolutely.
All righty, thanks so much forjoining us.
We will be back soon withanother episode.

And until then, beluga sevruga!

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Dateline NBC

Stuff You Should Know

The Bobby Bones Show

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}S4 BONUS: Visions of Sugar Plums

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}Dateline NBC

Stuff You Should Know

The Bobby Bones Show

All Episodes

S4 BONUS: Visions of Sugar Plums

Dateline NBC