March 26, 2020 • 18 mins
We take a look at your what good posture really means, and if your chair is really up to the job of keeping you in tip-top shape.
Alison Heller-Ono is President and CEO of Workplace International, an ergonomics consulting firm providing onsite and online ergonomics services and training. Alison is a Board Certified Professional Ergonomist and Physical Therapist, and a global speaker on ergonomics - a renowned expert in her field!
Your host is James Crow from PostureStars.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
James Crow (00:00):
Hi everybody, I'm James from Posture Stars, and
(00:02):
today we'll be talking withAlison Heller-Ono, who's
president and CEO of WorksiteInternational Incorporated,
which is an ergonomicsconsulting firm providing on
site and online ergonomicsservices and training. Alison is
a Board Certified Professionalergonomist and a physical
therapist. Her company recentlylaunched its online ergonomics
(00:25):
training academy for employeeand professional development.
And Alison is also a globalspeaker on ergonomics, and a
renowned expert in her field.
Good day to you, Alison.
Alison Heller-Ono (00:36):
Good morning.
Good afternoon. Good evening,James, how are you?
James Crow (00:41):
I'm very well, thank you. Good morning, good
afternoon, and good evening toyou and to all our listeners,
depending on where you are inthe world. That is right, you're
over in the east coast ofAmerica, and I'm in the north of
England. And we're bringing thispodcast to everybody with the
miracle that is the internet anda bit of wizardy pokery. Let's
ask our first three questions.
My first question I will ask iswhat is posture? Then I will ask
(01:04):
you, what do you do to helppeople's posture? And finally,
I'll ask if you could give onesimple piece of posture advice
for our listeners right now.
What would that be? So Alison,what is posture?
Alison Heller-Ono (01:19):
Well, that's such a great question, James.
And it probably means a lot ofdifferent things to each person.
You know, in my experience,posture is the body's efficient
alignment of the musculoskeletalsystem. So your muscles and your
bones and joints. It's really abalance between the muscles and
joints, in my opinion. So onething I want to point out is
(01:42):
that posture is really howhumans support themselves. You
know, the term Homo Erectus?
Have you heard that?
James Crow (01:50):
I'm familiar with the term Homo Erectus, yes.
Alison Heller-Ono (01:53):
So literally, that's the erect man, so to
speak. Yes. And so that, that isreferencing posture, everybody.
So there are several differenttypes of postures, in my
opinion. So for example, goodposture, or neutral posture,
there's bad posture, which mightbe awkward or non-neutral, or
(02:17):
what we call static orsustained, where you stay in a
position for too long. So youcan describe posture in various
ways. There's also what youwould want to consider
anatomical posture. And this isthe inherent design of the axial
skeleton from your head and yourspine, as it changes through
(02:37):
life. So anatomical posture, tome is not something you can
really control. Like it may beaffected by something at birth,
or an injury, or an illness ordisease process, like scoliosis
or arthritis. So posture canchange as a result of having
(02:57):
those congenital problems, ormedical problems. You know,
posture, just, it doesn't justpertain to the spine, though,
either. So a lot of people thinkit's just, you know, how I'm
sitting or how I'm standing. Butit also pertains to the
extremities or the appendicularskeleton. Probably that's a
complex word for people, butreally, don't worry so much
(03:18):
about that. It's really how, forexample, we hold our shoulders
and our arms and our wrists, ourlegs, our hips, they have
posture, too. So that's, in anutshell, what I think posture
is.
James Crow (03:31):
So it's a brilliant answer, you know, you've come at
it from various perspectives,including, you know, a lot of
people say, "Oh, look at me,I've got great posture", and
they'll adopt a static pose,which, of course, is useless to
get them through the rest of theday, that pose might be great to
pose for an Instagram selfie,but it's not going to help them
get that box off the top oftheir kitchen cupboard without
(03:53):
struggling is it? So you'vemoved into dynamic posture as
well. And I really like thatconcept of you having a central
core and then going out totjeposture of your shoulders,
arms and the rest of you aswell. It's really good way of
answering Alison,
Alison Heller-Ono (04:05):
Well, most people don't realise it, but we
have working postures, whilewe're performing tasks, or
activities at work or at home.
You know, posture, this isreally, really interesting, I
think. Posture is based onvision and reach. So when your
eyes need to see a visualtarget, or see what your hands
are doing, like typing on akeyboard or looking at a
(04:27):
monitor. So if the monitor oryour visual target is not
centred to you, it will alteryour posture because your head
follows your eyes and your bodyfollows your head. So it's like
a chain reaction.
James Crow (04:42):
Yeah, absolutely.
Your head follows your eyes andyour body follows your head. If
you take a cat and hold itupside down, perish the thought,
please do not try that at home.
But were our listeners to hold acat upside down and drop the
poor thing, it's eyes wouldrotate, followed by its head and
finally the body, to allow it toland in an appropriate posture.
Alison Heller-Ono (05:03):
Yeah, you see? That's right. So he's
validated my definition.
James Crow (05:09):
Please don't try that at home, anybody. Please do
not hold any humans upside downand drop them to see if they
right themselves because we'renot responsible and my insurance
will not cover that. I'mguessing that yours doesn't as
well Alison,
Alison Heller-Ono (05:21):
I stay away from cats. I have bad allergies
to cats.
James Crow (05:26):
I'm sorry for bringing them up. Yeah, I have a
few friends who have catallergies, as well. Best avoided
then! So you and your team, youhelp people in the workplace
with their posture. That'sright, isn't it?
Alison Heller-Ono (05:39):
That's correct. Now, as a physical
therapist, and an ergonomist,I'm acutely aware of people's
postures, I look at it all thetime, not just for work, but
like at a restaurant or outshopping. I see people
overreaching, bendingincorrectly, just holding their
hands on their devices too long,you know, looking down at their
(06:00):
phone. So it's like, it's justsomething I can't get away from,
you know, so it's, it's kind offunny, but I'm, I'm good at it,
and I enjoy it. So the firstthing you know, that I think is
to be aware of, of your ownposture, you know, where your
body is in space. And mostpeople have very poor body
(06:22):
awareness. And you, you probablyheard the term of postural
awareness. So with posturalawareness, for example, is your
head in line with yourshoulders, or forward of your
shoulders, like a turtle like aforward head. That's such a
typical posture. You know, youngpeople I see, you know, working
looking at their phones, lookingdown at their phones, and
(06:45):
texting with their thumbs. Theirposture is usually really in a
poor forward head and slouch,where the shoulders are rounded,
the back is rounded. So you canyou know, be aware of that
position. But most peoplearen't. Unless, you know, you
point it out to them. Beingaware of how you're sitting,
whether you're slouching, orlike sitting forward in your
(07:07):
chair. So many people really arenot mindful of sitting, of their
sitting postures. So forexample, you know, where are
your legs, your hips, yourbuttocks, when you're seated.
Are your feet on the floor, oryour arms close to your trunk
and resting on the armrest, ifyou are at rest. So those are a
couple of examples of how I helppeople. The next thing I do is
(07:30):
to help correct awkward or nonneutral postures, which goes
back to the first thing I said,which is about you know,
correcting the non neutralalignment. So correcting posture
is rather complex. You know, itdepends on whether it's a
functional and dynamic postureor a stationary posture. So for
(07:53):
listeners, you know, likesitting in a chair is a
stationary posture, whilelifting a box or moving a cart
is a dynamic functional posture,where there's movement, right?
So people typically have poorpostural habits, whether it's
static or dynamic, but theyoften move in the same way all
(08:13):
the time. Like if you typicallyhave to bend and lift boxes,
you're going to do it the sameway all the time, you'll
probably bend at your backinstead of your hips and your
knees. Or if you have to stockshelves or reach for things high
and low, you're probably justgoing to do it the same way all
the time until you have somekind of discomfort, right?
James Crow (08:35):
Yeah, totally. So first of all, as a guy who works
in posture myself, all I do islook at people's posture. It's a
curse, once you've been in theposture business. The first
thing you notice about someoneis is their posture. And it's
really hard not to judge,because for most people, they're
not aware of their posture intheir day to day activities, and
to judge them meanly as we cando is just a little unfair. And
(09:00):
when I work in private practice,I always tell my clients not to
tell off the people they lovewith the stuff that I've taught
them because it's just going toannoy those other people. With
regards to when your'e seatedyou can pay attention to your
posture for a short time. Butthen when most people are
looking into a screen, they getlost in the work that they're
doing and they lose thatpostural awareness. So having
(09:22):
the environment set up well isreally key. And also improving
that person's ability to payattention to themselves, I find
is really key as well. Would yousay that's fair?
Alison Heller-Ono (09:33):
Yes, I would.
For example, I totally agreewith that. And one thing I also
help is to find the best chairfor people to use when seated at
the computer. You could call mea chair whisperer, in a sense.
Yep, a chair whisper.
James Crow (09:51):
You heard it here first. Alison. Heller-Ono, the
chair whisperer. Whispering atchairs near you soon. I know
exactly what you mean. So you'vegot you've got some online
programmes. You can help peopleto make sure that their chairs
are set up, right, and thatthey've got appropriate seating
is that right?
Alison Heller-Ono (10:06):
That's true, you know, but before we go, let
me answer that in a little bit.
But I can tell immediately how achair fits or doesn't fit
someone. If they have bothered,or to adjust it correctly or
not. I can assess the person intheir chair, assess their
posture, while they're sitting.
And they don't even realise thatI'm doing that. And I get so
(10:28):
much information from that, ofhow that chair fits, whether
they're using it appropriatelyor not. And then from there, I
can assess the person bymeasuring them in sitting, and
use the measures to select thebest chair, which will match and
fit them correctly. And I callthat chair fitting,
James Crow (10:47):
You must be very popular with chair manufacturers
I'd imagine.
Alison Heller-Ono (10:50):
Well, there's so much to the science of chair
fitting, chair assessment,selection and fit, basically.
Yeah, I mean, it's a reallyimportant foundation. If you
think about working at acomputer and sitting, in my
opinion, the chair isfoundational to seated work,
right? Yeah. And if the chairisn't right, then the ergonomics
(11:15):
will never be right of thatworkstation. So you have to get
the chair fit and the posture ofthe individual to work together.
And then you can work onimproving the ergonomics of that
workstation.
James Crow (11:28):
I get it. So you're looking holistically at the
relationship between theindividual and the chair rather
than just the chair as a thingon its own and the person is a
thing on their own?
Alison Heller-Ono (11:38):
Exactly. You have to match them. And that's
the value of ergonomics is allabout fitting the task to the
human or the design of a tool tohuman use. And that's what a
chair is, a chair is a tool.
Right? It's a productivity tool,isn't it?
James Crow (11:58):
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah. Yeah. Not quite asexpensive as the individual sat
on it. But absolutely, it is aproductivity tool. You reminded
me of some sort of dating guruand you match up individuals and
chairs for them like theMillionaire Matchmaker or
something?
Alison Heller-Ono (12:12):
The chair Matchmaker,
James Crow (12:14):
The chair matchm aker, there you go, you can you
can have that one.
Alison Heller-Ono (12:18):
That's great, James, thank you.
James Crow (12:20):
My third question for you. And this is for our
listeners right now who they maybe in any sort of position or
doing anything at the moment. Ifyou could give them one simple
piece of postural advice, whatwould that be?
Alison Heller-Ono (12:33):
Well, I would tell your listeners to be
mindful of their posture, tohave posture awareness,
particularly during stationarytasks, and activities as well as
functional tasks. So it's easyto experience postural strain
from overreaching or bendingawkwardly, or sitting
unsupported for an extendedperiod of time. And you know,
(12:53):
like most people don't becomemindful or aware of their
posture until something startsto hurt, or something's not
quite right, you know. So inaddition, being aware of
workstation ergonomics, or thetasks or performing the
placement of equipment, that'sas important, as it predicates
the posture that the person willbe working in. So I like to say
(13:17):
if the chair isn't right, thenthe ergonomics of the
workstation will never be right.
And neither will your posture.
So this leads to problems likemusculoskeletal fatigue, or
tension, tightness, andultimately an injury. And it can
manifest in many differentplaces. So not just like the
neck or the shoulders, upperback, mid lower back, or your
(13:38):
wrist or forearm or elbow. So itcan occur many different ways.
So another expression many of usergonomists like to say, or
posture people like you and I,is that your next posture is
your best posture, right. So inother words, the body is
designed to move so get up andmove. Recently, you know,
(13:59):
there's been a lot of talk aboutsitting as being bad for your
health. Maybe you've heard theterm sitting is the new smoking.
It's not quite that but it candefinitely contribute, though to
many physiological changes ifyou sit too long. So it's not
just about poor posture, it'sabout how long you stay in that
posture and what you're doingwhile you're in that posture.
(14:22):
And for this reason, I want yourlisteners to remember this:
Basically, sit stand move andgroove, right?
James Crow (14:30):
Sit stand move and groove, we love it!
Alison Heller-Ono (14:32):
Sit stand move and groove, you have to do
all of it through the course ofyour day. By doing so you'll be
more mindful of your posture andimprove your overall health.
James Crow (14:41):
That's such great advice. I love that. So we're
seeing a shift towards homeworking at the moment. And a lot
of people, when they're at homedon't have the interruptions
that they would normally have atwork and they're likely to spend
a lot of time just sitting thereworking. So you heard it here,
folks, get up out of your chair,move and groove, get some water
in and water out, if you needto, and get that body moving.
(15:03):
You could use a little breaktimer maybe to give yourself
advice on when it is time tomove. Those are widely available
on your computers. Or you couldset something on your phone or a
little egg timer or whatever itis that you've got available.
But please do keep moving.
Alison Heller-Ono (15:17):
James, I wanted to just answer that one
question that you brought upabout some of the training that
we offer about chairs. We have achair assessment specialist
masterclass for professionalslike yourself, people that work
with individuals around postureand posture awareness, and maybe
workstation ergonomics, there'sso much behind the science of
(15:40):
chair assessment, selection andfit. And we've created what's
called the chair assessmentsystem. And that system helps
employers as well as vendors,and anyone that buys chairs or
literally even uses a chair,(which would be most of us or
almost all of us) to assess thequality and competency of a
chair, whether it should remainin the workplace or continued to
(16:03):
be used. So the chair assessmentsystem is an inventory asset
management tool for chairs only.
And it helps you to inventorythe quality and competency of a
chair to determine whether itshould be kept in the workplace,
should be repaired, or replaced.
So it's a great system. And thatsystem is part of the Worksite
(16:25):
International Chair AssessmentSpecialist Masterclass. And if
you don't want to become a CASP,then we have the classes
separately just for chairassessment, and or just for
chair fitting.
James Crow (16:37):
Chairs are an inventory item. And I think
people just assume that thatonce I've got a chair that
certain it's going to keep themgoing forever.
Alison Heller-Ono (16:44):
Chairs have a life cycle. And they remain in
the workplace far too long. Andour chair assessment system
helps employers to determine,you know, when they should be
replaced. And then once they'rereplaced, how to do a fitting.
And so we have the training thatsupports all that. It's really
fantastic. We've gotten greatfeedback from practitioners,
(17:04):
from vendors who sell chairs,who helped their customers
determine what chairs should bereplaced, and many other people
like facilities and purchasingpeople. So I hope you'll check
that out atWorksiteinternational.com.
James Crow (17:17):
And for those of you who work for yourself and work
from home, and nobody's going tobe buying you a new chair. have
a quick look at your chair now.
Just judge it. Is it a sorry oldsaggy horse that needs taking to
the knackers yard? Or is it aFerrari that's gonna keep you
going at great speed, for someperiod of time?
Alison Heller-Ono (17:35):
That's exceptional. James, you're
right. It's like do you have, isyour chair like a clunker? Or a
junk car? Or is it the super hotmodel? That's so funny that you
you identified that becausethat's how I like to look at
chairs. I would like to tellyour listeners that if you go to
my website atWorksiteinternational.com, I do
(17:55):
have a free trial. There's ademo video and a download to
assess to up to 10 chairs onyour own. So you could really
assess your home office chairand determine whether to keep,
repair, or replace it.
James Crow (18:08):
It sounds like a really good idea. So there you
go. You can keep repair orreplace. Please keep our
podcasts top of mind. We'rereally keen to keep you going
and listen to our next ones. Soit just remains for me to say
thank you so much, AlisonHeller-Ono, I've learned loads
from you today. It's been reallyfascinating. So thank you very
(18:29):
much for joining us.
Alison Heller-Ono (18:30):
Well, thank you James for inviting me. This
has been a great opportunity andI look forward to chatting with
you again soon, and yourlisteners: have a great day and
watch your posture!
James Crow (18:40):
Yep, watch your posture guys. Take care. Bye bye
Hi everybody, I'm James from Posture Stars, and
(00:02):
today we'll be talking withAlison Heller-Ono, who's
president and CEO of WorksiteInternational Incorporated,
which is an ergonomicsconsulting firm providing on
site and online ergonomicsservices and training. Alison is
a Board Certified Professionalergonomist and a physical
therapist. Her company recentlylaunched its online ergonomics
(00:25):
training academy for employeeand professional development.
And Alison is also a globalspeaker on ergonomics, and a
renowned expert in her field.
Good day to you, Alison.
Alison Heller-Ono (00:36):
Good morning.
Good afternoon. Good evening,James, how are you?
James Crow (00:41):
I'm very well, thank you. Good morning, good
afternoon, and good evening toyou and to all our listeners,
depending on where you are inthe world. That is right, you're
over in the east coast ofAmerica, and I'm in the north of
England. And we're bringing thispodcast to everybody with the
miracle that is the internet anda bit of wizardy pokery. Let's
ask our first three questions.
My first question I will ask iswhat is posture? Then I will ask
(01:04):
you, what do you do to helppeople's posture? And finally,
I'll ask if you could give onesimple piece of posture advice
for our listeners right now.
What would that be? So Alison,what is posture?
Alison Heller-Ono (01:19):
Well, that's such a great question, James.
And it probably means a lot ofdifferent things to each person.
You know, in my experience,posture is the body's efficient
alignment of the musculoskeletalsystem. So your muscles and your
bones and joints. It's really abalance between the muscles and
joints, in my opinion. So onething I want to point out is
(01:42):
that posture is really howhumans support themselves. You
know, the term Homo Erectus?
Have you heard that?
James Crow (01:50):
I'm familiar with the term Homo Erectus, yes.
Alison Heller-Ono (01:53):
So literally, that's the erect man, so to
speak. Yes. And so that, that isreferencing posture, everybody.
So there are several differenttypes of postures, in my
opinion. So for example, goodposture, or neutral posture,
there's bad posture, which mightbe awkward or non-neutral, or
(02:17):
what we call static orsustained, where you stay in a
position for too long. So youcan describe posture in various
ways. There's also what youwould want to consider
anatomical posture. And this isthe inherent design of the axial
skeleton from your head and yourspine, as it changes through
(02:37):
life. So anatomical posture, tome is not something you can
really control. Like it may beaffected by something at birth,
or an injury, or an illness ordisease process, like scoliosis
or arthritis. So posture canchange as a result of having
(02:57):
those congenital problems, ormedical problems. You know,
posture, just, it doesn't justpertain to the spine, though,
either. So a lot of people thinkit's just, you know, how I'm
sitting or how I'm standing. Butit also pertains to the
extremities or the appendicularskeleton. Probably that's a
complex word for people, butreally, don't worry so much
(03:18):
about that. It's really how, forexample, we hold our shoulders
and our arms and our wrists, ourlegs, our hips, they have
posture, too. So that's, in anutshell, what I think posture
is.
James Crow (03:31):
So it's a brilliant answer, you know, you've come at
it from various perspectives,including, you know, a lot of
people say, "Oh, look at me,I've got great posture", and
they'll adopt a static pose,which, of course, is useless to
get them through the rest of theday, that pose might be great to
pose for an Instagram selfie,but it's not going to help them
get that box off the top oftheir kitchen cupboard without
(03:53):
struggling is it? So you'vemoved into dynamic posture as
well. And I really like thatconcept of you having a central
core and then going out totjeposture of your shoulders,
arms and the rest of you aswell. It's really good way of
answering Alison,
Alison Heller-Ono (04:05):
Well, most people don't realise it, but we
have working postures, whilewe're performing tasks, or
activities at work or at home.
You know, posture, this isreally, really interesting, I
think. Posture is based onvision and reach. So when your
eyes need to see a visualtarget, or see what your hands
are doing, like typing on akeyboard or looking at a
(04:27):
monitor. So if the monitor oryour visual target is not
centred to you, it will alteryour posture because your head
follows your eyes and your bodyfollows your head. So it's like
a chain reaction.
James Crow (04:42):
Yeah, absolutely.
Your head follows your eyes andyour body follows your head. If
you take a cat and hold itupside down, perish the thought,
please do not try that at home.
But were our listeners to hold acat upside down and drop the
poor thing, it's eyes wouldrotate, followed by its head and
finally the body, to allow it toland in an appropriate posture.
Alison Heller-Ono (05:03):
Yeah, you see? That's right. So he's
validated my definition.
James Crow (05:09):
Please don't try that at home, anybody. Please do
not hold any humans upside downand drop them to see if they
right themselves because we'renot responsible and my insurance
will not cover that. I'mguessing that yours doesn't as
well Alison,
Alison Heller-Ono (05:21):
I stay away from cats. I have bad allergies
to cats.
James Crow (05:26):
I'm sorry for bringing them up. Yeah, I have a
few friends who have catallergies, as well. Best avoided
then! So you and your team, youhelp people in the workplace
with their posture. That'sright, isn't it?
Alison Heller-Ono (05:39):
That's correct. Now, as a physical
therapist, and an ergonomist,I'm acutely aware of people's
postures, I look at it all thetime, not just for work, but
like at a restaurant or outshopping. I see people
overreaching, bendingincorrectly, just holding their
hands on their devices too long,you know, looking down at their
(06:00):
phone. So it's like, it's justsomething I can't get away from,
you know, so it's, it's kind offunny, but I'm, I'm good at it,
and I enjoy it. So the firstthing you know, that I think is
to be aware of, of your ownposture, you know, where your
body is in space. And mostpeople have very poor body
(06:22):
awareness. And you, you probablyheard the term of postural
awareness. So with posturalawareness, for example, is your
head in line with yourshoulders, or forward of your
shoulders, like a turtle like aforward head. That's such a
typical posture. You know, youngpeople I see, you know, working
looking at their phones, lookingdown at their phones, and
(06:45):
texting with their thumbs. Theirposture is usually really in a
poor forward head and slouch,where the shoulders are rounded,
the back is rounded. So you canyou know, be aware of that
position. But most peoplearen't. Unless, you know, you
point it out to them. Beingaware of how you're sitting,
whether you're slouching, orlike sitting forward in your
(07:07):
chair. So many people really arenot mindful of sitting, of their
sitting postures. So forexample, you know, where are
your legs, your hips, yourbuttocks, when you're seated.
Are your feet on the floor, oryour arms close to your trunk
and resting on the armrest, ifyou are at rest. So those are a
couple of examples of how I helppeople. The next thing I do is
(07:30):
to help correct awkward or nonneutral postures, which goes
back to the first thing I said,which is about you know,
correcting the non neutralalignment. So correcting posture
is rather complex. You know, itdepends on whether it's a
functional and dynamic postureor a stationary posture. So for
(07:53):
listeners, you know, likesitting in a chair is a
stationary posture, whilelifting a box or moving a cart
is a dynamic functional posture,where there's movement, right?
So people typically have poorpostural habits, whether it's
static or dynamic, but theyoften move in the same way all
(08:13):
the time. Like if you typicallyhave to bend and lift boxes,
you're going to do it the sameway all the time, you'll
probably bend at your backinstead of your hips and your
knees. Or if you have to stockshelves or reach for things high
and low, you're probably justgoing to do it the same way all
the time until you have somekind of discomfort, right?
James Crow (08:35):
Yeah, totally. So first of all, as a guy who works
in posture myself, all I do islook at people's posture. It's a
curse, once you've been in theposture business. The first
thing you notice about someoneis is their posture. And it's
really hard not to judge,because for most people, they're
not aware of their posture intheir day to day activities, and
to judge them meanly as we cando is just a little unfair. And
(09:00):
when I work in private practice,I always tell my clients not to
tell off the people they lovewith the stuff that I've taught
them because it's just going toannoy those other people. With
regards to when your'e seatedyou can pay attention to your
posture for a short time. Butthen when most people are
looking into a screen, they getlost in the work that they're
doing and they lose thatpostural awareness. So having
(09:22):
the environment set up well isreally key. And also improving
that person's ability to payattention to themselves, I find
is really key as well. Would yousay that's fair?
Alison Heller-Ono (09:33):
Yes, I would.
For example, I totally agreewith that. And one thing I also
help is to find the best chairfor people to use when seated at
the computer. You could call mea chair whisperer, in a sense.
Yep, a chair whisper.
James Crow (09:51):
You heard it here first. Alison. Heller-Ono, the
chair whisperer. Whispering atchairs near you soon. I know
exactly what you mean. So you'vegot you've got some online
programmes. You can help peopleto make sure that their chairs
are set up, right, and thatthey've got appropriate seating
is that right?
Alison Heller-Ono (10:06):
That's true, you know, but before we go, let
me answer that in a little bit.
But I can tell immediately how achair fits or doesn't fit
someone. If they have bothered,or to adjust it correctly or
not. I can assess the person intheir chair, assess their
posture, while they're sitting.
And they don't even realise thatI'm doing that. And I get so
(10:28):
much information from that, ofhow that chair fits, whether
they're using it appropriatelyor not. And then from there, I
can assess the person bymeasuring them in sitting, and
use the measures to select thebest chair, which will match and
fit them correctly. And I callthat chair fitting,
James Crow (10:47):
You must be very popular with chair manufacturers
I'd imagine.
Alison Heller-Ono (10:50):
Well, there's so much to the science of chair
fitting, chair assessment,selection and fit, basically.
Yeah, I mean, it's a reallyimportant foundation. If you
think about working at acomputer and sitting, in my
opinion, the chair isfoundational to seated work,
right? Yeah. And if the chairisn't right, then the ergonomics
(11:15):
will never be right of thatworkstation. So you have to get
the chair fit and the posture ofthe individual to work together.
And then you can work onimproving the ergonomics of that
workstation.
James Crow (11:28):
I get it. So you're looking holistically at the
relationship between theindividual and the chair rather
than just the chair as a thingon its own and the person is a
thing on their own?
Alison Heller-Ono (11:38):
Exactly. You have to match them. And that's
the value of ergonomics is allabout fitting the task to the
human or the design of a tool tohuman use. And that's what a
chair is, a chair is a tool.
Right? It's a productivity tool,isn't it?
James Crow (11:58):
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah. Yeah. Not quite asexpensive as the individual sat
on it. But absolutely, it is aproductivity tool. You reminded
me of some sort of dating guruand you match up individuals and
chairs for them like theMillionaire Matchmaker or
something?
Alison Heller-Ono (12:12):
The chair Matchmaker,
James Crow (12:14):
The chair matchm aker, there you go, you can you
can have that one.
Alison Heller-Ono (12:18):
That's great, James, thank you.
James Crow (12:20):
My third question for you. And this is for our
listeners right now who they maybe in any sort of position or
doing anything at the moment. Ifyou could give them one simple
piece of postural advice, whatwould that be?
Alison Heller-Ono (12:33):
Well, I would tell your listeners to be
mindful of their posture, tohave posture awareness,
particularly during stationarytasks, and activities as well as
functional tasks. So it's easyto experience postural strain
from overreaching or bendingawkwardly, or sitting
unsupported for an extendedperiod of time. And you know,
(12:53):
like most people don't becomemindful or aware of their
posture until something startsto hurt, or something's not
quite right, you know. So inaddition, being aware of
workstation ergonomics, or thetasks or performing the
placement of equipment, that'sas important, as it predicates
the posture that the person willbe working in. So I like to say
(13:17):
if the chair isn't right, thenthe ergonomics of the
workstation will never be right.
And neither will your posture.
So this leads to problems likemusculoskeletal fatigue, or
tension, tightness, andultimately an injury. And it can
manifest in many differentplaces. So not just like the
neck or the shoulders, upperback, mid lower back, or your
(13:38):
wrist or forearm or elbow. So itcan occur many different ways.
So another expression many of usergonomists like to say, or
posture people like you and I,is that your next posture is
your best posture, right. So inother words, the body is
designed to move so get up andmove. Recently, you know,
(13:59):
there's been a lot of talk aboutsitting as being bad for your
health. Maybe you've heard theterm sitting is the new smoking.
It's not quite that but it candefinitely contribute, though to
many physiological changes ifyou sit too long. So it's not
just about poor posture, it'sabout how long you stay in that
posture and what you're doingwhile you're in that posture.
(14:22):
And for this reason, I want yourlisteners to remember this:
Basically, sit stand move andgroove, right?
James Crow (14:30):
Sit stand move and groove, we love it!
Alison Heller-Ono (14:32):
Sit stand move and groove, you have to do
all of it through the course ofyour day. By doing so you'll be
more mindful of your posture andimprove your overall health.
James Crow (14:41):
That's such great advice. I love that. So we're
seeing a shift towards homeworking at the moment. And a lot
of people, when they're at homedon't have the interruptions
that they would normally have atwork and they're likely to spend
a lot of time just sitting thereworking. So you heard it here,
folks, get up out of your chair,move and groove, get some water
in and water out, if you needto, and get that body moving.
(15:03):
You could use a little breaktimer maybe to give yourself
advice on when it is time tomove. Those are widely available
on your computers. Or you couldset something on your phone or a
little egg timer or whatever itis that you've got available.
But please do keep moving.
Alison Heller-Ono (15:17):
James, I wanted to just answer that one
question that you brought upabout some of the training that
we offer about chairs. We have achair assessment specialist
masterclass for professionalslike yourself, people that work
with individuals around postureand posture awareness, and maybe
workstation ergonomics, there'sso much behind the science of
(15:40):
chair assessment, selection andfit. And we've created what's
called the chair assessmentsystem. And that system helps
employers as well as vendors,and anyone that buys chairs or
literally even uses a chair,(which would be most of us or
almost all of us) to assess thequality and competency of a
chair, whether it should remainin the workplace or continued to
(16:03):
be used. So the chair assessmentsystem is an inventory asset
management tool for chairs only.
And it helps you to inventorythe quality and competency of a
chair to determine whether itshould be kept in the workplace,
should be repaired, or replaced.
So it's a great system. And thatsystem is part of the Worksite
(16:25):
International Chair AssessmentSpecialist Masterclass. And if
you don't want to become a CASP,then we have the classes
separately just for chairassessment, and or just for
chair fitting.
James Crow (16:37):
Chairs are an inventory item. And I think
people just assume that thatonce I've got a chair that
certain it's going to keep themgoing forever.
Alison Heller-Ono (16:44):
Chairs have a life cycle. And they remain in
the workplace far too long. Andour chair assessment system
helps employers to determine,you know, when they should be
replaced. And then once they'rereplaced, how to do a fitting.
And so we have the training thatsupports all that. It's really
fantastic. We've gotten greatfeedback from practitioners,
(17:04):
from vendors who sell chairs,who helped their customers
determine what chairs should bereplaced, and many other people
like facilities and purchasingpeople. So I hope you'll check
that out atWorksiteinternational.com.
James Crow (17:17):
And for those of you who work for yourself and work
from home, and nobody's going tobe buying you a new chair. have
a quick look at your chair now.
Just judge it. Is it a sorry oldsaggy horse that needs taking to
the knackers yard? Or is it aFerrari that's gonna keep you
going at great speed, for someperiod of time?
Alison Heller-Ono (17:35):
That's exceptional. James, you're
right. It's like do you have, isyour chair like a clunker? Or a
junk car? Or is it the super hotmodel? That's so funny that you
you identified that becausethat's how I like to look at
chairs. I would like to tellyour listeners that if you go to
my website atWorksiteinternational.com, I do
(17:55):
have a free trial. There's ademo video and a download to
assess to up to 10 chairs onyour own. So you could really
assess your home office chairand determine whether to keep,
repair, or replace it.
James Crow (18:08):
It sounds like a really good idea. So there you
go. You can keep repair orreplace. Please keep our
podcasts top of mind. We'rereally keen to keep you going
and listen to our next ones. Soit just remains for me to say
thank you so much, AlisonHeller-Ono, I've learned loads
from you today. It's been reallyfascinating. So thank you very
(18:29):
much for joining us.
Alison Heller-Ono (18:30):
Well, thank you James for inviting me. This
has been a great opportunity andI look forward to chatting with
you again soon, and yourlisteners: have a great day and
watch your posture!
James Crow (18:40):
Yep, watch your posture guys. Take care. Bye bye
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