In this episode of the Poultry Nerds Podcast, we’re joined by Danny from the Chicken Coop Company to talk all things predator prevention for backyard chickens. Whether you're battling raccoons, foxes, coyotes, or the real danger—your neighbor’s dog—this episode breaks down practical, real-world solutions to protect your flock.
We discuss coop design features that work, the best materials to use (like hardware cloth vs. chicken wire), how predators behave (from raccoons to hawks), and why infrastructure matters more than people realize. You’ll also hear some wild stories—from dogs trained not to chase chickens, to building coops strong enough to deter even the craftiest critters.
🔨 Coop building tips
🛡️ Anti-dig barriers and predator aprons
🦊 How foxes, raccoons, and hawks break in
📦 Shipping coops that assemble like IKEA
🐔 What not to do if you want to keep chickens safe
Don’t miss this funny, info-packed episode that’s perfect for both beginners and seasoned poultry pros.
chicken coop predator proofing, backyard chicken safety tips, raccoon proof chicken coop, chicken wire vs hardware cloth, how to keep chickens safe, predator apron for chicken coop, best chicken coop for backyard, chicken coop design tips, chicken predator prevention, Chicken Coop Company podcast, poultry nerds podcast
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jennifer (00:00):
Welcome poultry nerd.
We are here today to talk aboutpredator proofing your coops,
and we are here with Danny fromthe chicken Coop Company to help
us talk through some predatorsthat, that we need to all be
aware that are out there thatyou may not even know about.
Welcome, Danny.
Danny (00:22):
How you doing?
Jennifer (00:23):
We're good and Carey's here even though he is being
quiet,
Carey (00:27):
I'm just sitting over here like the chicken coop
company.
People say, they come up with acompany name and it's what does
that company do?
Jennifer (00:37):
Yep.
Carey (00:39):
It's the name of your company is Chicken Coop Company.
That, that's probably what youdo and do it really well.
Jennifer (00:47):
I guess this is over.
I thought he sold
Carey (00:49):
coffee.
Danny (00:51):
Oh yeah.
I thought actually I'm, Ithought we were talking about
rabbits today.
Jennifer (00:56):
So tell us about you and your wife is Netta, right?
Danny (01:00):
Yeah.
And you
Jennifer (01:01):
guys are in's Minnesota.
Minnesota.
Danny (01:04):
Yes, we have our fair share of predators here and cold
weather, but love it here.
Jennifer (01:11):
Aw, I'm sorry.
I don't wanna go up there whereit all snowy and cold and stuff.
Danny (01:16):
It's nice.
It's the best weather you couldask for six months out of the
year.
The rest
Carey (01:20):
of it?
Danny (01:20):
Yeah, just leave it.
Carey (01:23):
Jennifer, they don't have the humidity that we have.
Jennifer (01:27):
I have a grumpy husband in the cold, so I'll
take the humidity.
Danny (01:33):
We fit in well here.
'cause most people in the winterhere are grumpy it seems.
Jennifer (01:37):
Oh, okay.
I can't, I don't blame'em.
So tell us how this whole thingstarted.
If I had to guess I'd say yourwife got some chickens and
chicken math ensued.
Danny (01:49):
Nailed it.
I'm not gonna lie.
Literally this morning, justthis morning, she said,'cause we
have, we just moved three chicksinto the coop outside.
'cause you have to wait forcertain temps and right now it's
81 and sunny and beautiful andthey're ready to come out of the
house.
Literally, we moved the chicks.
Yesterday, today she said.
So next year I think I'm gonnado four, because if you have 11,
(02:13):
you might as well have 15.
Jennifer (02:15):
So do you just have a variety of chickens or do you
specialize does she specialize?
Yeah.
We've got a,
Danny (02:20):
we've got a whole mess.
Yeah, we've got a whole mess of'em.
And it's great.
They're a lot of fun.
But yeah, that's essentially howit started out.
She got her first.
How much was, I think it wasfive and then we were, before he
knew it, we were up to eight.
And yeah that's where the wholelove for chickens happened.
And what I realized is that sheloves them more than she loves
(02:42):
her dog.
And so we are now in thechicken.
We're now in the chickenbusiness, which is so much fun.
Jennifer (02:51):
And you didn't even know there was a whole
subculture of chicken businessat all, did you?
Danny (02:58):
Oh my goodness.
Not to the extent that it is nota chance.
It's out of control.
And what's really fun, just togive it some perspective, like
we live in an area where youwould think chickens are still
taboo, right?
Oh, you have chickens in yourbackyard, really?
But the funny thing is we, whenwe moved them,'cause we moved
(03:19):
houses a couple years ago andwhen we moved them to this
neighborhood and there was aquestion about it should we move
the chickens here?
Should we not?
But the neighbors like it.
We were scared to do it a littlebit.
And being in the business waslike, Uhuh, we're gonna practice
what we preach.
I don't care what the neighborsthink, we're gonna bring them
over.
And sure enough, I'm not joking,I'm not joking.
(03:39):
Right behind us, the fir thefamily, as soon as we moved them
over, they always said, I'vebeen looking, I've been thinking
about chickens.
I think it'd be great.
I'm gonna get'em.
And we're like, do it.
So then the neighbor behind usbought chickens.
And right now I'm looking out mywindow and I see a house across
the street.
They have chickens.
My house next door, just lastweekend, brought their chickens
outside for the first time andit's like taking over like
(04:01):
wildfire.
But there's a lot of, and Ithink that's partly what we're
gonna talk about today, butthere's, things people need to
think about when they're firstgetting chickens.
But it's just so exciting thatI'm so glad that everybody's
jumping in.
Jennifer (04:15):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Danny (04:15):
Like when people ask
Carey (04:17):
me, they're like, Hey, I'm thinking about getting some
chickens.
What advice do you have?
And I always tell'em, figure outhow many you want.
Then prepare to house triplethat amount when you're
building, getting whateveryou're doing with a coop.
And just be ready.
(04:38):
And they're like, triple.
We only want a few chickens tohave some eggs and stuff.
And I'm like, I understand that.
There's a thing called chickenmath and we joke about it
because it's sadly real and wecan't help but laugh.
But, you'll say I just wantthree checks.
(05:00):
I really want one, but I needthree or four.
So they keep each other company.
Yep.
You've got 50,
Jennifer (05:09):
well, or you could do like me, and you get five, and
then you have 25, and then youneed more acreage.
But then you need dogs toprotect it.
The dogs need goats.
Then as long as we've got goats,we might as well have cows.
The fence is already there.
And we'll, dang.
Now we just need a pig to goalong with it and we're set.
(05:29):
So that's where we are.
So chicken math expands,
Carey (05:34):
once, once chicken math hits the algebra.
You're full on farming?
Jennifer (05:45):
Alright, so both Carrie and I are in the south.
So what is the number onepredator where you are, that you
are concerned about?
Danny (05:54):
That's a tough question.
I can't speak for allMinnesotans.
Because if you're in the north,you're gonna have a different
mix.
Now we hear coyotes.
I'm here just south ofMinneapolis a little bit and we
hear coyotes all the time.
We have fox.
Fox are crafty, but they'repretty predictable on when they
come by.
(06:14):
Which is fine.
So I'm not too concerned aboutthe fox, at least in our
neighborhood.
'cause he's here, he lives here.
We just talked to the neighborsabout him yesterday actually.
I've never actually had a hawktake a chicken.
We have hawks and bald eagles,but I've never actually had one
take it.
But I'm not gonna say they'renot a threat.
They absolutely are.
I'm gonna be honest and I'mgonna say a neighbor's backyard
(06:36):
dog is probably one of mybiggest predators.
Or just risks, if you will.
You can protect againsteverything, but it's almost like
everything else in life aroundinsurance and risk tolerance for
it.
If you can build Fort Knox forthese chickens.
(06:57):
And do whatever you can toprotect them.
Or you can do the very bareminimum and you're willing to
take that risk.
And I think a fun conversationwe could have is, what's a happy
medium?
Or what's right, for where youare.
You ask me, what's right for me,where I'm at.
I don't really have to worryabout snakes, I don't really
have those up here.
I don't have to worry about someof the issues and some of the
(07:18):
challenges you all deal withdown in the south.
Alligators.
Not a chance, right?
I don't know what that lookslike in the south.
That's a real thing.
But yeah, I'd actually sayprotecting against neighborhood
dogs is probably the number onething that I have to do while
thinking about the rest.
Jennifer (07:34):
I saw a really horrible post just yesterday on
Facebook.
And the neighbor's pit bull tookout all of their chickens, their
ducks, their goats, their kid,the goat kids.
Everything they came home and itwas just, yeah.
So she actually put out thatpost and said, you've got to
(07:56):
know what is around you in orderto keep your animals safe.
And it's a hard lesson sometimesfor people.
Carey (08:05):
A lot of people don't think about it.
They think about raccoons andfoxes stuff like that more
commonly.
But the neighbor's dog will keepthose away.
And you, in the back of yourmind, it's, just the neighbor's
dog.
But that neighbor's dog, whodon't like chicken?
(08:27):
And if.
They're probably more of athreat than a raccoon or
anything like that.
We have coyotes, but they stayon the other side of the fence.
Luckily, in eight years, they'venever crossed.
And now I have a dog that'sbigger than most coyotes, it's
(08:48):
not an issue anymore.
I don't even have raccoon issueanymore that I have my
Anatolian.
That's great.
I've seen that son of a gun justtake off and I look at his GPS
collar and I'm like, that suckercan really run.
They can.
And then they leave stuff on thefront porch.
That's the downside.
But, it didn't eat, it didn'teat my chickens.
(09:09):
That's right.
Danny (09:09):
So
Carey (09:10):
what do you suggest?
I
Danny (09:11):
have a funny story actually.
So my, one of my best buddies,he has chicken math, hit him and
his wife real hard.
I don't even know what theyhave, but man, they went, they
did that whole, I'm moving tothree acres.
We're getting the thing, andthey bought a dog that they've
always wanted and it took'emyears to decide on which dog,
and it ended up being a birddog.
(09:32):
And they sent it to a huntingschool, but they told the school
to teach it to not chase birds.
And so they literally took abird dog and trained it to not
chase chickens.
And it worked.
And the guy said the trainer, hesaid, we're gonna break your dog
(09:53):
probably like it's not gonnaever hunt again.
And they were like, okay, that'sgood.
And now they have a great bigbird dog that loves their
chickens.
It's pretty, pretty incredible.
Now, I don't say, I think peopleneed to go through that'cause
it's probably expensive, I wouldimagine.
Jennifer (10:09):
Yeah.
Danny (10:09):
Hunting schools are not cheap, but that is one way to
train your dog.
Carey (10:15):
Getting a dog that's been bred for generations and
generations
to.
I am just gonna say hats off to the school.
Okay.
Because they, they basicallybroke that dog's genetics and
Jennifer (10:34):
Okay.
We are not condoning thatbehavior.
We think you should steer awayfrom bird chasing dogs, if you
can.
So in that sense, yeah.
What do you, or get a little,you as a coop designer, think
about how to prevent the dogsfrom breaking in.
What would be some suggestions?
Danny (10:55):
I would say number one it's knowing your surroundings
just like any other predator,knowing which dogs may or may
not be a threat.
So for example it's the threatsthat give chickens a hard life.
They have to be cooped, theylove to roam.
I was in Hawaii a long time ago,and on one of the islands,
Kauai, remember them saying, thepredator at the top of the food
(11:15):
chain is the chicken here.
Chickens are roaming ever.
There's nothing that can hurtyou.
There's no predators there thatcan ever cause you harm.
And they literally said the topof the food chain is the
chicken.
Wow.
On the animal side.
That's nice.
So those
chickens have it.
Those chickens have it.
Great.
And any chicken here probablyis, would be envious because
they just free range.
There's no threats to'em.
(11:36):
We have to ruin our chicken's.
Freedom.
Put'em in cages, put'em in runs,put'em in coops because of the
threats.
So I would, to answer yourquestion, I would just say.
Know your surroundings, knowwhen they can be out and when
they should be in.
And then when it comes to whatthey are in, just know that it's
strong enough and you've takentheir precautionary measures
based on the dog that's around.
(11:57):
For example, I have a littleFrench bulldog.
He doesn't bite him, he can't,but he just runs into him.
He just bull those him, right?
And so you don't have to worryabout him hurting him.
He just loves to just run aroundwith him.
He's not going to get into mycoop by ramming into it and
pushing through the door, right?
And so if you have a coop withvery flimsy wire or a couple
(12:21):
pallets stacked together, andyou have a German Shepherd who
lives next door, like it's.
You might as well have a bear.
And not, it's not gonna stop it.
So have a coop that deters itquickly so it loses interest.
That's what I always say.
If they're looking, they're notalways looking for a quick
snack.
They're just looking to have fundogs.
I had a dog busting a or I hearda story about a dog busting in a
(12:44):
coop, and he just, within 10seconds destroyed the entire
flock.
And it's, he wasn't there to eat'em, he just.
Was chasing him down and killinghim because Kerry, to your
point, bred for generations tokill birds.
So that's what he was doing.
And a lot of dogs, I would justsay, they just wanna play.
Jennifer (13:02):
Yeah.
Danny (13:03):
That's it.
That's right.
Jennifer (13:04):
And chicken wise, just know the
Danny (13:05):
risk that's around you.
Jennifer (13:08):
Chicken wire.
What's your opinion on chickenwire?
Danny (13:13):
I would say there's good, better, best or really bad.
Let's start where there mightbe.
Good medium.
Okay.
Chicken wire, bottom of thebarrel.
When it comes to protection, inmy opinion so many things have
broken through it, especially ifit's not vinyl coated, it's
gonna rust.
And when you get one little.
Joint that's rusty.
Now you have, instead of a oneby one inch square, you know you
(13:34):
have a two by two inch squareand that just cascades.
And I heard this horrible story.
Oh my goodness.
Our friends, so just west oftown is a small town called
Buffalo.
And she told this horrible storyof a raccoon can stick their
grubby little fingers in theirhands through one by one inch
chicken wire and pull and eat anentire chicken.
(13:59):
Through that hole.
Carey (14:01):
Wow.
So
Danny (14:01):
They'll slowly work the whole chicken through that hole.
I couldn't believe it.
Yep.
But they just got a hold of itand then started pulling and
started nibbling.
So one by one I would say is,the worst you should do.
It can keep things out, but noteverything.
And then if it's not vinylcoated one, it's gonna be super
janky and it's gonna you can'tpull it tight.
It's gonna rust.
(14:21):
And then I would.
Say one of the best is ahardware cloth that's half inch
by half inch.
That's just, that's what we use.
It limits what can reach inthere.
It limits what can do.
And then it's not just thinwire, it's thicker metal
galvanized metal that just, itlasts a lot longer.
And it gives you a much betterprotection.
And then you can staple it in,nail it, in, board it in a lot
(14:43):
better manner because it's asheet if you'll,
Jennifer (14:47):
I agree a hundred percent with that statement.
Carey (14:50):
You do.
So I'm a fan of hardware claws.
I like it and I've had peoplethat, everybody post those
pictures.
It's what got my chicken?
And like you just mystermagically know.
But they, a lot of people willbuy dog kennels.
Because
(15:11):
They,
they have thick wire, heavy gauge wire.
Yeah.
They're big.
They're tall and they're like,oh, my chickens are safe.
But that's not by itself becauselike what you were talking
about, chickens are dumb forone, and if they see a predator
(15:31):
outside that they're gonna wannasee it, they're gonna wanna
figure it out.
And they're gonna stick theirhead out the hole.
As soon as they do that,
it's
gone.
And then they'll pull the restof it through until they're not
hungry anymore.
Yep.
Jennifer (15:47):
So you mentioned foxes.
So I don't have, there are foxesin Tennessee, but I don't have
'em on my property.
So you said they were sneaky.
So what, tell us what you thinkabout foxes for somebody who
won't be familiar with them.
Like how do they get in?
Danny (16:06):
I would say there's probably two stories to that
question.
There's the country folk andthen there's the city folk.
Okay.
Because as you both know, a lotof city folk are getting
chickens.
And I'm one of'em.
And in the suburbs, our fox areprobably different than, the
ones where I grew up in northernMinnesota, in the middle of
nowhere.
They're domesticated almost,where they'll just stand there
(16:29):
and watch you as you come outthe back door and they won't
even spook or walk away.
They're just brave and they getreally comfortable around the
coop.
And that's a little bit scarybecause then when you run out,
they don't even run away.
They're gonna run if your doggets out.
But I would say, when I saythey're crafty, I would just say
they're just, they're reallybrave around here.
Jennifer (16:52):
I have to interrupt you because this, I just got a
mental I image of your littlefrench bulldog ram to a fox.
Danny (17:01):
We would try,
Jennifer (17:05):
that would be fun, a little helmet and send up there
for him.
Carey (17:10):
When, think about that.
But
When they're domesticated like that, to me, that changes
the fox from being.
Like what Jennifer and I wouldthink of a fox to put it more in
the neighbor's dog category
Jennifer (17:27):
or cat,'cause
Carey (17:29):
when they're just there and they're harmless, unless
they're hungry, you don't reallythink about it.
So your guard's down.
Jennifer (17:35):
Yeah.
So foxes, how do they get in?
Do they climb and try to go inthe hop?
Do they try to open like araccoon or dig?
What do they do?
Danny (17:46):
If it depends on what you've done to protect your
coop.
I'll give a good example usingchicken wire.
Okay?
So with chicken wire, you'regonna have seams, and this is
gonna sound like I'm, I don'twanna give them too much credit,
but you also have to thinkabout, who you're up against
and.
They will pull what I've heardseen and what I've heard is that
(18:08):
they pull and we've had a, we'vehad experience with foxes.
They'll try to rip your.
Chicken wire in your coop apartwith just by pulling at it.
And we can talk about protectivebarriers against digs, but
they'll just find the weak link.
They'll just find it.
And with chicken wire, if it'sjust held together with other
wire or zip ties you're gonnahave seams because those things
(18:29):
that those rolls are only threefeet.
Wide, sometimes less.
And they'll find the seam andthen they'll bust through it.
And they can, what we've seen isthat they'll drag chickens right
out through a hole, that's sixinches that they've just, they
broke open through that chickenwire.
Digging, just finding theweakness in your coop.
Jennifer (18:48):
Gotcha.
Makes sense.
All right what about yourneighborhood cat?
Do you have those problems inyour neighborhood?
Danny (18:58):
We do have cats around, but never had an issue with
them.
With a full grown bird.
We've seen'em stock'em.
Prowling
through the gardener prowling through the yard, but
they've never done anything withthem.
Have you ever had an experiencewith cats hurting your chickens?
Jennifer (19:13):
No, but I have LGDs here and I have two barn cats
that are probably over 20pounds.
So we don't really have apredator problem here.
So even though I live in thecountry in the middle of
nowhere.
I'm still ignorant to a lot ofthese problems that people have,
(19:34):
because in a good couple LGDswill fix a lot of those
problems.
But yeah, I have aerial, I havehawks, I, and we have yeah, I
would say hawks is probably ourbiggest thing here.
Danny (19:50):
How have you, how, what's your experience with, I wanna
say
Carey (19:53):
a haw.
I wanna say a hawk tried to takeoff one of your orpingtons.
Jennifer (19:58):
They probably, lemme know how
Carey (19:59):
that works out.
Jennifer (20:01):
So if you haven't seen my Orpingtons, they're very
large.
So what were you gonna ask me?
Danny (20:08):
I'm just curious if you've had a problem.
I didn't wanna give foxes toomuch credit.
I also wanna give chickens toomuch credit.
'cause there are definitely somedumb ones out there.
We, I don't know if you've everhad any less intelligent ones.
They stand out pretty quickly.
But
we've had some dumb ones, but even the dumb ones we've
seen we'll have our chickens outin the yard and then we'll see
(20:29):
'em all hiding under the AEs ofthe low level trees.
And we're like, what are theyall doing under there?
And sure enough, there's a hawksitting on the neighbor's
balcony just sitting there.
And we've found that they'repretty clever when it comes to
getting or knowing when hawksare around and getting under
protection.
I.
Something that's something maybefor people to think about if
(20:50):
they're just getting chickensfor the first time and they're
in a sub development and allthey have is their fence and not
a single tree over two yearsold.
That would definitely pose arisk if you don't have anything
for the chickens to hide under,because intuitively I think they
know when there's something upthere.
That's dangerous.
Our experience has been they'vetaken cover when they see
something or they can sense it.
(21:10):
We have yet to lose one to ahawk personally, and I haven't
heard many stories from ourcustomers.
Jennifer (21:16):
So I've got hawk stories here, but just while you
were talking, one of myorpingtons walked by the window
and it's sunny and everything.
They don't have a care in theworld here because they're just
much bigger than a hawk is gonnabe and they just won't mess with
'em.
But if you have normal sizedchickens, listen to your
(21:36):
roosters.
If you can have them, they'lltell the hens that there's
something going on.
And a lot of times you'll see'emcock their head and one eye's
looking straight up.
And they'll tell, and you'll,they'll tell the other ones and
they'll run for cover.
Carey (21:52):
So mine will make this noise.
That's like I.
Almost like what you hear, apterodactyl type sound.
It's like a grinding wine type.
And when I first started hearingit.
A few years ago, I was like,what the crap are they doing?
(22:14):
And it happened one time when Iwas outside and I see them
looking around and they'remaking that noise and the
roosters are going nuts.
And I'm like, trying to figureit out.
And I finally, I looked up and Isaw a hawk had landed in a tree
and it's like he was scoping outwhat was for dinner and yeah,
(22:36):
they're in that case.
Chickens are smart, but they'realso dumb.
Jennifer (22:42):
So let's talk about raccoons now.
They're pretty smart.
They can open latches and stuff,right?
Carrie hates raccoons.
He had so much trouble withraccoons.
So do you have any ideas on howto prevent raccoons from opening
latches and getting in coops?
Danny (23:01):
I, what do I need to know as far as raccoons doing Unlock
s Getting in?
Yeah.
How do you keep'em from over?
You know what, I, we haven'tfrom a, we, they just dig,
they're diggers here Really?
So they'll just dig under we,yeah.
I haven't had any of'em undo alatch.
I haven't heard many of thatstories.
(23:21):
So we use, I don't know whatkind of latches you use.
I'd love to hear what you'reusing, but just, like a barrel
latch, with the lever.
You lift up and then slide itover.
And then something that we usefor our nesting boxes are
carabiner latches.
So it's just a latch and thenyou lock with a carabiner.
Now I would love to see araccoon take a carabiner off
'cause I can barely do that.
Oh my gosh.
Jennifer (23:42):
We have a raccoon across the street at my son's
house, and he opens up the trashcans and digs around inside of
it.
So we have to keep a cinderblock on top of the trash can
over there.
So they're pretty smart.
They're,
Danny (23:59):
They're very motivated too.
I,
Jennifer (24:02):
I really hate those carabiners.
And I honestly didn't know whatthey were called until Carrie
told me.
I just always called them snapclips.
I didn't know.
So
Carey (24:15):
yeah, she was talking about snap clips one day.
I was like, what is that?
Jennifer (24:20):
Didn't know what they were called.
So you just make up names.
That's how we, that's how wemake new words.
We just make up names until theybecome a thing.
Oh, so what about digging then?
Like how do you prevent thedigging in?
Danny (24:35):
I, so good question.
I wanna be like, I have myopinion in my preferences, but
there are so many opinions andpreferences and things that I
don't know.
So as I tell you what I think,like I'm definitely, I don't
know the most, I'm not what Isay is not gospel truth.
All the time.
But it works for me and whatwe've seen, and we have, over
10,000 customers that have, haveexperience with our coops.
(24:58):
And so we, we provide servicesand different, solutions to
problems like this.
And so I would say for us ourpolicy when it comes to diggers
is try to make it hard for'em.
And if they're looking for aquick meal.
Don't give'em motivation, don'tlet'em work at it for 10, 15
minutes before they hit the endbarrier.
(25:18):
Or hit problems.
'cause then they're motivatedand now they're hungry.
It's if they're looking for aquick meal and they're walking
past the coop and they trydigging and they find something
right and they can't get in, andthey're deterred right away,
it's go move on to the rabbit.
There's a bunny in the bushright next door.
Just go take the bunny instead.
So what we do to keep diggersout is, the process of digging
12 inches down below your coopto then extend your chicken
(25:41):
wire, whatever it is you'reusing down, we just lay it right
on the surface or on theperimeter.
So we attach it to the bottomperimeter of the run and the
coop, and then lay it on thesurface and then you stake it.
So just have stakes that hold itdown to the ground and we load
it up.
We're talking 40 U stakes allaround the coop just to keep it
(26:02):
secure.
One, it keeps your coop tackdown if it's a smaller one.
And two, it's your grass or yourclippings or whatever it is that
you're on.
Just eventually grow right overit and you don't even see it
anymore.
And it becomes even stronger astime goes on because it now it
has the weight of.
Whatever material, earth, grass,dirt and that's proven to be
(26:24):
really effective.
We actually had a customer leavea review today and it said,
predator kit, that's what wecall it, is an absolute must
because it just, it gives youthat protection.
And we only go and you can tellme if you think this is enough,
but, or if you'd recommend more.
But we go 18 inches out from thecoop, so 18 inches out, if they
start digging, they're gonna hitit and hopefully hit this metal,
(26:46):
vinyl coated hardware cloth andbe like, nah I'm out.
I'm not messing around withthat.
Jennifer (26:50):
I see that a lot on social media.
I don't have aprons.
I had I've used somethingdifferent, but to me that seems
like it should work.
I shouldn't, I.
I wouldn't see a reason why itwouldn't work and worst case
scenario, you could turn somecinder blocks up and just plant
your herbs around the, make itpretty on top of that apron if
(27:11):
you were still concerned.
But I wouldn't, don't see areason why I wouldn't work.
I think that's highlyrecommended way to do it.
Danny (27:20):
Yep.
Yeah.
Or cinder blocks around it,just.
Again, just make it hard rightoff the bat.
Just get'em.
Make their lives difficult.
No easy meals here.
Jennifer (27:30):
And so we both preach a lot about just sitting and
observing, and you can learn alot about your situation by
doing that.
And that's gonna go for thesepredators too.
Sit down and look at how they'redoing it, and then come up with
a solution to divert them.
So in my case, we have a lot ofcoyotes because I have a lot of
(27:52):
farmland around me.
But the man that lives next dooris older.
He actually doesn't even livethere.
He just has it and he has cattleover there, and he doesn't have
donkeys or dogs or anything overthere with them.
And he is adamant that youcannot shoot the coyotes on his
property.
(28:12):
So the coyotes take his babiesdown, and to be honest, as long
as the meal is easier overthere, they have no reason to
come over here and mess with myLGDs because it's just easier
over there.
So as long as there's somethingeasier elsewhere.
That's all you are really after.
(28:33):
You don't wanna be the slowestone running away from something.
It's the same concept.
You just make it easierelsewhere.
Danny (28:43):
Yeah.
So what do you, so what do youthink about, so a person's
getting chickens for the firsttime.
And they're anxious and thespring hatch is happening.
Everybody knows there's nochicks available.
There's no chicks you got if thetractor, tractor Supply or
whoever has chicks or can't find'em online till July.
And so they find chicks and wegotta get'em right now.
(29:03):
Let's get'em.
Is it better to be prepared andhave a good structure and home
forum, or should people justjump right in?
What do you think, Carrie?
Carey (29:15):
So for.
If you want chicks and you findchicks, grab'em because you can
brood chicks in a plasticstorage container with a heat
plate and put'em some water andsome feed, and you got two or
(29:36):
three weeks to really preparethem in place.
But I think that if once it'stime to put that bird outside.
If you don't have a place to putthem that is strong enough to
keep your predator lockedinside, then you're doing your
(30:00):
birds a disservice.
And by what that, what I mean bythat is like.
If your big predators areraccoons, dogs, coyotes, if you
was to put that animal inside,what you're gonna put your
chickens in, if it can't getout, then it probably can't get
in.
(30:20):
So your chickens will be safe inthere.
But people that like they buychickens and they don't create a
safe environment to put them in.
I really wish they wouldn't evenget chickens and the people that
get chickens, because eggs areexpensive.
(30:42):
I'm gonna save some money.
I'm gonna save money on eggs.
If you got a family of 50, thenmaybe, but I would still say
you're not taking care of yourchickens.
Because.
Infrastructure is almost asexpensive or more so than a good
(31:06):
foundation trio of a really highquality bird.
Jennifer (31:11):
You struck a nerve with that one.
You do need to spend money oninfrastructure.
Otherwise you're just feedingthe wildlife and you might as
well just go buy some KFC andthrow it out the back door and
save yourself trouble.
Carey (31:28):
It's like for me in feed, people will say 25, 28, whatever
dollars, whatever they'relooking at is, that is so
expensive.
I'm like we're a premiumcompany.
We provide the nutrition thatthe birds need and they gripe
(31:48):
about it.
And there's been situationswhere I've seen that and they go
away.
And then another person's Ican't believe they just said
that.
And I said, what do you mean?
And.
Just last week, that man boughta pair of chickens for$1,800.
(32:10):
Oh my.
And I'm like, whoa, wait aminute.
You spend$900 a piece, wow.
On a chicken, but you want tofeed it a 10 or$12 bag of feet.
You got your priorities inorder, you know your priorities
are messed up.
And I feel the same way aboutinfrastructure because it is you
(32:35):
think about it, would you have afamily and go to nowhere or
would you take your family home?
And, at least we as people canfight off stuff predators.
My chickens don't have boxinggloves.
So they need a chance.
Jennifer (32:56):
They just have pterodactyl sounds, huh?
Carey (32:59):
Yeah, that's it.
Jennifer (33:01):
So tell us about your coop and how it would help keep
a chicken safe.
How did you design it?
Danny (33:09):
My coop.
Jennifer (33:10):
Yep.
Danny (33:11):
There's a couple factors.
It's the hardware cloth that wealready talked about that's an
absolute must.
It needs to be weighty too.
Like it can't be just easilylifted off the ground.
So we put that predator kitaround and stake it down.
That protects.
'cause we sell coops all overthe country, including
northwest.
We have bears, right?
(33:32):
It's really hard to keep a bearaway from a block of chicken.
Again, it's just keep'em, makeit not easy for'em.
But we'll do primarily theharbor cloth will make it a
little bit sturdy and heavy, soit's not just easily lifted off
the ground.
And then from an access point,limit your access points.
We have an access door in theback of the coop that we have
(33:55):
locks on and then you gotta gothrough the run.
So I'll give you an example.
We have a sliding door.
'cause when you think aboutpredators, and their little
grippers, I don't know, mostpeople have runs but out in the
country.
So Jennifer, do you have runs ordo you just have a house and
then you let'em outta the houseand they free range?
Jennifer (34:13):
I have runs.
Danny (34:15):
Okay, so just having, it's essentially dual entry,
right?
So you have a door on your runand then you have a door on your
coop.
So just eliminating thenighttime predators by having'em
in the coop at night and then anauto door or something that
automatically closes and locksbehind them.
Now a predator has to getthrough the run and through the
coop in order to get to'em.
(34:35):
So just a couple differentlayers of security, if you want
to call it that.
Jennifer (34:39):
All and then, so your coops, do they come in a kit or
are they ready to plop on theground?
How do they come?
Danny (34:47):
Yeah, that's the best part.
We actually ship it to you.
Oh my goodness.
We've, I dunno.
Have either of you ever moved acoop down the road before on a
trailer?
No,
Jennifer (34:58):
no, not me.
Oh, we
Danny (34:59):
did, and we one time had this a dog kennel carry that you
were talking about, but withhardware cloud wrapped around
it.
And it was a great one.
We actually inherited it fromsome, this was our first coop
that we ever got.
You should have seen us drivingdown the road with that thing on
a trailer.
'cause it's 12 feet long andit's nine feet up in the air.
We lost the roof on the coop, itflew off.
(35:21):
Moving coop is, it's no joke.
So to answer your question wedo, we actually, we ship the
coop in boxes to your door.
So imagine like as easy asputting together a piece of IKEA
furniture.
You're gonna do it wrong thefirst time, but the second time
around it goes togethersmoothly.
Just if you're instructionallyinclined or not.
But you put it together whereveryou want it set up, and you're
(35:42):
ready to rock
Carey (35:44):
nice if you're instructional, instructionally
inclined.
That is like the nicest, mostpolitically correct way to say.
If you read the instructions,you'll go together.
Jennifer (35:59):
If your wife is standing there telling you're
doing it wrong.
Carey (36:02):
Yeah.
Jennifer (36:04):
And she's holding the instructions.
Carey (36:06):
Hey, you might wanna listen.
Jennifer (36:10):
So your cook, my
Danny (36:13):
we're actually oops, sorry.
Do they come in
Jennifer (36:15):
multiple sizes?
Like for somebody who just wantsfive chickens versus 15
chickens?
Danny (36:22):
Yep.
There's small, medium, large,and not large enough.
We can we're launching a Carrie,you're right.
It's like you start with threechickens, then you have six,
then it's then you have 25.
And so feedback's always, Hey,can you make a bigger coop?
Hey, can you make a bigger coop?
It's I don't sell houses, Ican't sell a coop big enough, I
(36:43):
feel, but we're we're launchinga new coop that's 15 chickens
now.
Really excited about that.
But I was putting together, myprototype and I even made my own
instructions and I had a, a guywho was helping me with filming
and things, do it with me.
And I said, what are you doing?
And he hadn't even looked at anyof the words in the instruction.
He's just oh, I only look at thepictures.
And Carrie, to your point on theinstructional client, it's, I'm
(37:05):
the same way.
I'll read the words otherpeople, they won't even notice
'em.
Then now people are inclined towatch videos.
So we're trying, we're gonna dosome new videos with
instructional, but Jennifer it'sfun.
We have four chicken, sixchicken, and 10 chicken sizes.
All are too small'cause coopsare never big enough.
And but they work just fine foryour backyard flock.
(37:27):
We're we primarily, we serveeverybody, but we found our
biggest demographic are peoplein the suburbs.
Surprisingly we did a littleheat map in 2023 of where our
customers lived, and you justpick a major metro and it's just
exploded the color.
So that's primarily who weserve, just I think based on
(37:47):
size and also availability.
So if you're out in the countryand you have three pole barns,
you may just repurpose one.
You have a big structure.
That that's primarily who weserve
Jennifer (37:58):
well, and everybody is going to have a predator issue.
I lost an, almost an entireflock of turkeys to a mink
several years ago.
And so it's gonna happen.
It's not a, if it's gonnahappen.
And so a lot of things, onething that you can do is in is
(38:21):
have multiple coops.
So if you had say three of youknow the coops that hold five
birds and you had a predator getin one.
You're not completely out ofchickens.
You're just out of that.
Such
Carey (38:35):
an enabler.
God.
Jennifer (38:37):
Yeah.
Carey (38:39):
You're an enabler.
Jennifer (38:40):
I am.
And I only have.
31 coops now.
It's a, But Alright, so telleverybody where they can find
you and how to get in touch withyou and all that good stuff.
Danny (38:53):
Yeah.
Jennifer, this and Carrie, thiswas great.
You can find us easily.
Chicken coop company.com.
Again, we don't sell rabbithutches.
We sell chickens chicken coopcompany.com.
It's the best you can reach ourteam.
It's a small team, familycompany.
It's great at family.
At chicken coop company.com.
We're all
on the social channels.
We're trying to do better onsocial.
(39:14):
It's just so noisy out there and
creating
content.
We like it, but we're findingsome really great people who are
taking some great photos.
But you can find us on all thesocial platforms.
Give us a call, send us anemail.
We pick up.
And yeah, it's great.
Jennifer (39:29):
All right.
Thank you so much, Danny, forbeing here with us today.
Danny (39:33):
Yep.
I enjoyed it.
My pleasure.
We a lot of fun.
Jennifer (39:37):
All right.
See you guys later.
Danny (39:42):
Take care.
Welcome poultry nerd.
We are here today to talk aboutpredator proofing your coops,
and we are here with Danny fromthe chicken Coop Company to help
us talk through some predatorsthat, that we need to all be
aware that are out there thatyou may not even know about.
Welcome, Danny.
Danny (00:22):
How you doing?
Jennifer (00:23):
We're good and Carey's here even though he is being
quiet,
Carey (00:27):
I'm just sitting over here like the chicken coop
company.
People say, they come up with acompany name and it's what does
that company do?
Jennifer (00:37):
Yep.
Carey (00:39):
It's the name of your company is Chicken Coop Company.
That, that's probably what youdo and do it really well.
Jennifer (00:47):
I guess this is over.
I thought he sold
Carey (00:49):
coffee.
Danny (00:51):
Oh yeah.
I thought actually I'm, Ithought we were talking about
rabbits today.
Jennifer (00:56):
So tell us about you and your wife is Netta, right?
Danny (01:00):
Yeah.
And you
Jennifer (01:01):
guys are in's Minnesota.
Minnesota.
Danny (01:04):
Yes, we have our fair share of predators here and cold
weather, but love it here.
Jennifer (01:11):
Aw, I'm sorry.
I don't wanna go up there whereit all snowy and cold and stuff.
Danny (01:16):
It's nice.
It's the best weather you couldask for six months out of the
year.
The rest
Carey (01:20):
of it?
Danny (01:20):
Yeah, just leave it.
Carey (01:23):
Jennifer, they don't have the humidity that we have.
Jennifer (01:27):
I have a grumpy husband in the cold, so I'll
take the humidity.
Danny (01:33):
We fit in well here.
'cause most people in the winterhere are grumpy it seems.
Jennifer (01:37):
Oh, okay.
I can't, I don't blame'em.
So tell us how this whole thingstarted.
If I had to guess I'd say yourwife got some chickens and
chicken math ensued.
Danny (01:49):
Nailed it.
I'm not gonna lie.
Literally this morning, justthis morning, she said,'cause we
have, we just moved three chicksinto the coop outside.
'cause you have to wait forcertain temps and right now it's
81 and sunny and beautiful andthey're ready to come out of the
house.
Literally, we moved the chicks.
Yesterday, today she said.
So next year I think I'm gonnado four, because if you have 11,
(02:13):
you might as well have 15.
Jennifer (02:15):
So do you just have a variety of chickens or do you
specialize does she specialize?
Yeah.
We've got a,
Danny (02:20):
we've got a whole mess.
Yeah, we've got a whole mess of'em.
And it's great.
They're a lot of fun.
But yeah, that's essentially howit started out.
She got her first.
How much was, I think it wasfive and then we were, before he
knew it, we were up to eight.
And yeah that's where the wholelove for chickens happened.
And what I realized is that sheloves them more than she loves
(02:42):
her dog.
And so we are now in thechicken.
We're now in the chickenbusiness, which is so much fun.
Jennifer (02:51):
And you didn't even know there was a whole
subculture of chicken businessat all, did you?
Danny (02:58):
Oh my goodness.
Not to the extent that it is nota chance.
It's out of control.
And what's really fun, just togive it some perspective, like
we live in an area where youwould think chickens are still
taboo, right?
Oh, you have chickens in yourbackyard, really?
But the funny thing is we, whenwe moved them,'cause we moved
(03:19):
houses a couple years ago andwhen we moved them to this
neighborhood and there was aquestion about it should we move
the chickens here?
Should we not?
But the neighbors like it.
We were scared to do it a littlebit.
And being in the business waslike, Uhuh, we're gonna practice
what we preach.
I don't care what the neighborsthink, we're gonna bring them
over.
And sure enough, I'm not joking,I'm not joking.
(03:39):
Right behind us, the fir thefamily, as soon as we moved them
over, they always said, I'vebeen looking, I've been thinking
about chickens.
I think it'd be great.
I'm gonna get'em.
And we're like, do it.
So then the neighbor behind usbought chickens.
And right now I'm looking out mywindow and I see a house across
the street.
They have chickens.
My house next door, just lastweekend, brought their chickens
outside for the first time andit's like taking over like
(04:01):
wildfire.
But there's a lot of, and Ithink that's partly what we're
gonna talk about today, butthere's, things people need to
think about when they're firstgetting chickens.
But it's just so exciting thatI'm so glad that everybody's
jumping in.
Jennifer (04:15):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Danny (04:15):
Like when people ask
Carey (04:17):
me, they're like, Hey, I'm thinking about getting some
chickens.
What advice do you have?
And I always tell'em, figure outhow many you want.
Then prepare to house triplethat amount when you're
building, getting whateveryou're doing with a coop.
And just be ready.
(04:38):
And they're like, triple.
We only want a few chickens tohave some eggs and stuff.
And I'm like, I understand that.
There's a thing called chickenmath and we joke about it
because it's sadly real and wecan't help but laugh.
But, you'll say I just wantthree checks.
(05:00):
I really want one, but I needthree or four.
So they keep each other company.
Yep.
You've got 50,
Jennifer (05:09):
well, or you could do like me, and you get five, and
then you have 25, and then youneed more acreage.
But then you need dogs toprotect it.
The dogs need goats.
Then as long as we've got goats,we might as well have cows.
The fence is already there.
And we'll, dang.
Now we just need a pig to goalong with it and we're set.
(05:29):
So that's where we are.
So chicken math expands,
Carey (05:34):
once, once chicken math hits the algebra.
You're full on farming?
Jennifer (05:45):
Alright, so both Carrie and I are in the south.
So what is the number onepredator where you are, that you
are concerned about?
Danny (05:54):
That's a tough question.
I can't speak for allMinnesotans.
Because if you're in the north,you're gonna have a different
mix.
Now we hear coyotes.
I'm here just south ofMinneapolis a little bit and we
hear coyotes all the time.
We have fox.
Fox are crafty, but they'repretty predictable on when they
come by.
(06:14):
Which is fine.
So I'm not too concerned aboutthe fox, at least in our
neighborhood.
'cause he's here, he lives here.
We just talked to the neighborsabout him yesterday actually.
I've never actually had a hawktake a chicken.
We have hawks and bald eagles,but I've never actually had one
take it.
But I'm not gonna say they'renot a threat.
They absolutely are.
I'm gonna be honest and I'mgonna say a neighbor's backyard
(06:36):
dog is probably one of mybiggest predators.
Or just risks, if you will.
You can protect againsteverything, but it's almost like
everything else in life aroundinsurance and risk tolerance for
it.
If you can build Fort Knox forthese chickens.
(06:57):
And do whatever you can toprotect them.
Or you can do the very bareminimum and you're willing to
take that risk.
And I think a fun conversationwe could have is, what's a happy
medium?
Or what's right, for where youare.
You ask me, what's right for me,where I'm at.
I don't really have to worryabout snakes, I don't really
have those up here.
I don't have to worry about someof the issues and some of the
(07:18):
challenges you all deal withdown in the south.
Alligators.
Not a chance, right?
I don't know what that lookslike in the south.
That's a real thing.
But yeah, I'd actually sayprotecting against neighborhood
dogs is probably the number onething that I have to do while
thinking about the rest.
Jennifer (07:34):
I saw a really horrible post just yesterday on
Facebook.
And the neighbor's pit bull tookout all of their chickens, their
ducks, their goats, their kid,the goat kids.
Everything they came home and itwas just, yeah.
So she actually put out thatpost and said, you've got to
(07:56):
know what is around you in orderto keep your animals safe.
And it's a hard lesson sometimesfor people.
Carey (08:05):
A lot of people don't think about it.
They think about raccoons andfoxes stuff like that more
commonly.
But the neighbor's dog will keepthose away.
And you, in the back of yourmind, it's, just the neighbor's
dog.
But that neighbor's dog, whodon't like chicken?
(08:27):
And if.
They're probably more of athreat than a raccoon or
anything like that.
We have coyotes, but they stayon the other side of the fence.
Luckily, in eight years, they'venever crossed.
And now I have a dog that'sbigger than most coyotes, it's
(08:48):
not an issue anymore.
I don't even have raccoon issueanymore that I have my
Anatolian.
That's great.
I've seen that son of a gun justtake off and I look at his GPS
collar and I'm like, that suckercan really run.
They can.
And then they leave stuff on thefront porch.
That's the downside.
But, it didn't eat, it didn'teat my chickens.
(09:09):
That's right.
Danny (09:09):
So
Carey (09:10):
what do you suggest?
I
Danny (09:11):
have a funny story actually.
So my, one of my best buddies,he has chicken math, hit him and
his wife real hard.
I don't even know what theyhave, but man, they went, they
did that whole, I'm moving tothree acres.
We're getting the thing, andthey bought a dog that they've
always wanted and it took'emyears to decide on which dog,
and it ended up being a birddog.
(09:32):
And they sent it to a huntingschool, but they told the school
to teach it to not chase birds.
And so they literally took abird dog and trained it to not
chase chickens.
And it worked.
And the guy said the trainer, hesaid, we're gonna break your dog
(09:53):
probably like it's not gonnaever hunt again.
And they were like, okay, that'sgood.
And now they have a great bigbird dog that loves their
chickens.
It's pretty, pretty incredible.
Now, I don't say, I think peopleneed to go through that'cause
it's probably expensive, I wouldimagine.
Jennifer (10:09):
Yeah.
Danny (10:09):
Hunting schools are not cheap, but that is one way to
train your dog.
Carey (10:15):
Getting a dog that's been bred for generations and
generations
to.
I am just gonna say hats off to the school.
Okay.
Because they, they basicallybroke that dog's genetics and
Jennifer (10:34):
Okay.
We are not condoning thatbehavior.
We think you should steer awayfrom bird chasing dogs, if you
can.
So in that sense, yeah.
What do you, or get a little,you as a coop designer, think
about how to prevent the dogsfrom breaking in.
What would be some suggestions?
Danny (10:55):
I would say number one it's knowing your surroundings
just like any other predator,knowing which dogs may or may
not be a threat.
So for example it's the threatsthat give chickens a hard life.
They have to be cooped, theylove to roam.
I was in Hawaii a long time ago,and on one of the islands,
Kauai, remember them saying, thepredator at the top of the food
(11:15):
chain is the chicken here.
Chickens are roaming ever.
There's nothing that can hurtyou.
There's no predators there thatcan ever cause you harm.
And they literally said the topof the food chain is the
chicken.
Wow.
On the animal side.
That's nice.
So those
chickens have it.
Those chickens have it.
Great.
And any chicken here probablyis, would be envious because
they just free range.
There's no threats to'em.
(11:36):
We have to ruin our chicken's.
Freedom.
Put'em in cages, put'em in runs,put'em in coops because of the
threats.
So I would, to answer yourquestion, I would just say.
Know your surroundings, knowwhen they can be out and when
they should be in.
And then when it comes to whatthey are in, just know that it's
strong enough and you've takentheir precautionary measures
based on the dog that's around.
(11:57):
For example, I have a littleFrench bulldog.
He doesn't bite him, he can't,but he just runs into him.
He just bull those him, right?
And so you don't have to worryabout him hurting him.
He just loves to just run aroundwith him.
He's not going to get into mycoop by ramming into it and
pushing through the door, right?
And so if you have a coop withvery flimsy wire or a couple
(12:21):
pallets stacked together, andyou have a German Shepherd who
lives next door, like it's.
You might as well have a bear.
And not, it's not gonna stop it.
So have a coop that deters itquickly so it loses interest.
That's what I always say.
If they're looking, they're notalways looking for a quick
snack.
They're just looking to have fundogs.
I had a dog busting a or I hearda story about a dog busting in a
(12:44):
coop, and he just, within 10seconds destroyed the entire
flock.
And it's, he wasn't there to eat'em, he just.
Was chasing him down and killinghim because Kerry, to your
point, bred for generations tokill birds.
So that's what he was doing.
And a lot of dogs, I would justsay, they just wanna play.
Jennifer (13:02):
Yeah.
Danny (13:03):
That's it.
That's right.
Jennifer (13:04):
And chicken wise, just know the
Danny (13:05):
risk that's around you.
Jennifer (13:08):
Chicken wire.
What's your opinion on chickenwire?
Danny (13:13):
I would say there's good, better, best or really bad.
Let's start where there mightbe.
Good medium.
Okay.
Chicken wire, bottom of thebarrel.
When it comes to protection, inmy opinion so many things have
broken through it, especially ifit's not vinyl coated, it's
gonna rust.
And when you get one little.
Joint that's rusty.
Now you have, instead of a oneby one inch square, you know you
(13:34):
have a two by two inch squareand that just cascades.
And I heard this horrible story.
Oh my goodness.
Our friends, so just west oftown is a small town called
Buffalo.
And she told this horrible storyof a raccoon can stick their
grubby little fingers in theirhands through one by one inch
chicken wire and pull and eat anentire chicken.
(13:59):
Through that hole.
Carey (14:01):
Wow.
So
Danny (14:01):
They'll slowly work the whole chicken through that hole.
I couldn't believe it.
Yep.
But they just got a hold of itand then started pulling and
started nibbling.
So one by one I would say is,the worst you should do.
It can keep things out, but noteverything.
And then if it's not vinylcoated one, it's gonna be super
janky and it's gonna you can'tpull it tight.
It's gonna rust.
(14:21):
And then I would.
Say one of the best is ahardware cloth that's half inch
by half inch.
That's just, that's what we use.
It limits what can reach inthere.
It limits what can do.
And then it's not just thinwire, it's thicker metal
galvanized metal that just, itlasts a lot longer.
And it gives you a much betterprotection.
And then you can staple it in,nail it, in, board it in a lot
(14:43):
better manner because it's asheet if you'll,
Jennifer (14:47):
I agree a hundred percent with that statement.
Carey (14:50):
You do.
So I'm a fan of hardware claws.
I like it and I've had peoplethat, everybody post those
pictures.
It's what got my chicken?
And like you just mystermagically know.
But they, a lot of people willbuy dog kennels.
Because
(15:11):
They,
they have thick wire, heavy gauge wire.
Yeah.
They're big.
They're tall and they're like,oh, my chickens are safe.
But that's not by itself becauselike what you were talking
about, chickens are dumb forone, and if they see a predator
(15:31):
outside that they're gonna wannasee it, they're gonna wanna
figure it out.
And they're gonna stick theirhead out the hole.
As soon as they do that,
it's
gone.
And then they'll pull the restof it through until they're not
hungry anymore.
Yep.
Jennifer (15:47):
So you mentioned foxes.
So I don't have, there are foxesin Tennessee, but I don't have
'em on my property.
So you said they were sneaky.
So what, tell us what you thinkabout foxes for somebody who
won't be familiar with them.
Like how do they get in?
Danny (16:06):
I would say there's probably two stories to that
question.
There's the country folk andthen there's the city folk.
Okay.
Because as you both know, a lotof city folk are getting
chickens.
And I'm one of'em.
And in the suburbs, our fox areprobably different than, the
ones where I grew up in northernMinnesota, in the middle of
nowhere.
They're domesticated almost,where they'll just stand there
(16:29):
and watch you as you come outthe back door and they won't
even spook or walk away.
They're just brave and they getreally comfortable around the
coop.
And that's a little bit scarybecause then when you run out,
they don't even run away.
They're gonna run if your doggets out.
But I would say, when I saythey're crafty, I would just say
they're just, they're reallybrave around here.
Jennifer (16:52):
I have to interrupt you because this, I just got a
mental I image of your littlefrench bulldog ram to a fox.
Danny (17:01):
We would try,
Jennifer (17:05):
that would be fun, a little helmet and send up there
for him.
Carey (17:10):
When, think about that.
But
When they're domesticated like that, to me, that changes
the fox from being.
Like what Jennifer and I wouldthink of a fox to put it more in
the neighbor's dog category
Jennifer (17:27):
or cat,'cause
Carey (17:29):
when they're just there and they're harmless, unless
they're hungry, you don't reallythink about it.
So your guard's down.
Jennifer (17:35):
Yeah.
So foxes, how do they get in?
Do they climb and try to go inthe hop?
Do they try to open like araccoon or dig?
What do they do?
Danny (17:46):
If it depends on what you've done to protect your
coop.
I'll give a good example usingchicken wire.
Okay?
So with chicken wire, you'regonna have seams, and this is
gonna sound like I'm, I don'twanna give them too much credit,
but you also have to thinkabout, who you're up against
and.
They will pull what I've heardseen and what I've heard is that
(18:08):
they pull and we've had a, we'vehad experience with foxes.
They'll try to rip your.
Chicken wire in your coop apartwith just by pulling at it.
And we can talk about protectivebarriers against digs, but
they'll just find the weak link.
They'll just find it.
And with chicken wire, if it'sjust held together with other
wire or zip ties you're gonnahave seams because those things
(18:29):
that those rolls are only threefeet.
Wide, sometimes less.
And they'll find the seam andthen they'll bust through it.
And they can, what we've seen isthat they'll drag chickens right
out through a hole, that's sixinches that they've just, they
broke open through that chickenwire.
Digging, just finding theweakness in your coop.
Jennifer (18:48):
Gotcha.
Makes sense.
All right what about yourneighborhood cat?
Do you have those problems inyour neighborhood?
Danny (18:58):
We do have cats around, but never had an issue with
them.
With a full grown bird.
We've seen'em stock'em.
Prowling
through the gardener prowling through the yard, but
they've never done anything withthem.
Have you ever had an experiencewith cats hurting your chickens?
Jennifer (19:13):
No, but I have LGDs here and I have two barn cats
that are probably over 20pounds.
So we don't really have apredator problem here.
So even though I live in thecountry in the middle of
nowhere.
I'm still ignorant to a lot ofthese problems that people have,
(19:34):
because in a good couple LGDswill fix a lot of those
problems.
But yeah, I have aerial, I havehawks, I, and we have yeah, I
would say hawks is probably ourbiggest thing here.
Danny (19:50):
How have you, how, what's your experience with, I wanna
say
Carey (19:53):
a haw.
I wanna say a hawk tried to takeoff one of your orpingtons.
Jennifer (19:58):
They probably, lemme know how
Carey (19:59):
that works out.
Jennifer (20:01):
So if you haven't seen my Orpingtons, they're very
large.
So what were you gonna ask me?
Danny (20:08):
I'm just curious if you've had a problem.
I didn't wanna give foxes toomuch credit.
I also wanna give chickens toomuch credit.
'cause there are definitely somedumb ones out there.
We, I don't know if you've everhad any less intelligent ones.
They stand out pretty quickly.
But
we've had some dumb ones, but even the dumb ones we've
seen we'll have our chickens outin the yard and then we'll see
(20:29):
'em all hiding under the AEs ofthe low level trees.
And we're like, what are theyall doing under there?
And sure enough, there's a hawksitting on the neighbor's
balcony just sitting there.
And we've found that they'repretty clever when it comes to
getting or knowing when hawksare around and getting under
protection.
I.
Something that's something maybefor people to think about if
(20:50):
they're just getting chickensfor the first time and they're
in a sub development and allthey have is their fence and not
a single tree over two yearsold.
That would definitely pose arisk if you don't have anything
for the chickens to hide under,because intuitively I think they
know when there's something upthere.
That's dangerous.
Our experience has been they'vetaken cover when they see
something or they can sense it.
(21:10):
We have yet to lose one to ahawk personally, and I haven't
heard many stories from ourcustomers.
Jennifer (21:16):
So I've got hawk stories here, but just while you
were talking, one of myorpingtons walked by the window
and it's sunny and everything.
They don't have a care in theworld here because they're just
much bigger than a hawk is gonnabe and they just won't mess with
'em.
But if you have normal sizedchickens, listen to your
(21:36):
roosters.
If you can have them, they'lltell the hens that there's
something going on.
And a lot of times you'll see'emcock their head and one eye's
looking straight up.
And they'll tell, and you'll,they'll tell the other ones and
they'll run for cover.
Carey (21:52):
So mine will make this noise.
That's like I.
Almost like what you hear, apterodactyl type sound.
It's like a grinding wine type.
And when I first started hearingit.
A few years ago, I was like,what the crap are they doing?
(22:14):
And it happened one time when Iwas outside and I see them
looking around and they'remaking that noise and the
roosters are going nuts.
And I'm like, trying to figureit out.
And I finally, I looked up and Isaw a hawk had landed in a tree
and it's like he was scoping outwhat was for dinner and yeah,
(22:36):
they're in that case.
Chickens are smart, but they'realso dumb.
Jennifer (22:42):
So let's talk about raccoons now.
They're pretty smart.
They can open latches and stuff,right?
Carrie hates raccoons.
He had so much trouble withraccoons.
So do you have any ideas on howto prevent raccoons from opening
latches and getting in coops?
Danny (23:01):
I, what do I need to know as far as raccoons doing Unlock
s Getting in?
Yeah.
How do you keep'em from over?
You know what, I, we haven'tfrom a, we, they just dig,
they're diggers here Really?
So they'll just dig under we,yeah.
I haven't had any of'em undo alatch.
I haven't heard many of thatstories.
(23:21):
So we use, I don't know whatkind of latches you use.
I'd love to hear what you'reusing, but just, like a barrel
latch, with the lever.
You lift up and then slide itover.
And then something that we usefor our nesting boxes are
carabiner latches.
So it's just a latch and thenyou lock with a carabiner.
Now I would love to see araccoon take a carabiner off
'cause I can barely do that.
Oh my gosh.
Jennifer (23:42):
We have a raccoon across the street at my son's
house, and he opens up the trashcans and digs around inside of
it.
So we have to keep a cinderblock on top of the trash can
over there.
So they're pretty smart.
They're,
Danny (23:59):
They're very motivated too.
I,
Jennifer (24:02):
I really hate those carabiners.
And I honestly didn't know whatthey were called until Carrie
told me.
I just always called them snapclips.
I didn't know.
So
Carey (24:15):
yeah, she was talking about snap clips one day.
I was like, what is that?
Jennifer (24:20):
Didn't know what they were called.
So you just make up names.
That's how we, that's how wemake new words.
We just make up names until theybecome a thing.
Oh, so what about digging then?
Like how do you prevent thedigging in?
Danny (24:35):
I, so good question.
I wanna be like, I have myopinion in my preferences, but
there are so many opinions andpreferences and things that I
don't know.
So as I tell you what I think,like I'm definitely, I don't
know the most, I'm not what Isay is not gospel truth.
All the time.
But it works for me and whatwe've seen, and we have, over
10,000 customers that have, haveexperience with our coops.
(24:58):
And so we, we provide servicesand different, solutions to
problems like this.
And so I would say for us ourpolicy when it comes to diggers
is try to make it hard for'em.
And if they're looking for aquick meal.
Don't give'em motivation, don'tlet'em work at it for 10, 15
minutes before they hit the endbarrier.
(25:18):
Or hit problems.
'cause then they're motivatedand now they're hungry.
It's if they're looking for aquick meal and they're walking
past the coop and they trydigging and they find something
right and they can't get in, andthey're deterred right away,
it's go move on to the rabbit.
There's a bunny in the bushright next door.
Just go take the bunny instead.
So what we do to keep diggersout is, the process of digging
12 inches down below your coopto then extend your chicken
(25:41):
wire, whatever it is you'reusing down, we just lay it right
on the surface or on theperimeter.
So we attach it to the bottomperimeter of the run and the
coop, and then lay it on thesurface and then you stake it.
So just have stakes that hold itdown to the ground and we load
it up.
We're talking 40 U stakes allaround the coop just to keep it
(26:02):
secure.
One, it keeps your coop tackdown if it's a smaller one.
And two, it's your grass or yourclippings or whatever it is that
you're on.
Just eventually grow right overit and you don't even see it
anymore.
And it becomes even stronger astime goes on because it now it
has the weight of.
Whatever material, earth, grass,dirt and that's proven to be
(26:24):
really effective.
We actually had a customer leavea review today and it said,
predator kit, that's what wecall it, is an absolute must
because it just, it gives youthat protection.
And we only go and you can tellme if you think this is enough,
but, or if you'd recommend more.
But we go 18 inches out from thecoop, so 18 inches out, if they
start digging, they're gonna hitit and hopefully hit this metal,
(26:46):
vinyl coated hardware cloth andbe like, nah I'm out.
I'm not messing around withthat.
Jennifer (26:50):
I see that a lot on social media.
I don't have aprons.
I had I've used somethingdifferent, but to me that seems
like it should work.
I shouldn't, I.
I wouldn't see a reason why itwouldn't work and worst case
scenario, you could turn somecinder blocks up and just plant
your herbs around the, make itpretty on top of that apron if
(27:11):
you were still concerned.
But I wouldn't, don't see areason why I wouldn't work.
I think that's highlyrecommended way to do it.
Danny (27:20):
Yep.
Yeah.
Or cinder blocks around it,just.
Again, just make it hard rightoff the bat.
Just get'em.
Make their lives difficult.
No easy meals here.
Jennifer (27:30):
And so we both preach a lot about just sitting and
observing, and you can learn alot about your situation by
doing that.
And that's gonna go for thesepredators too.
Sit down and look at how they'redoing it, and then come up with
a solution to divert them.
So in my case, we have a lot ofcoyotes because I have a lot of
(27:52):
farmland around me.
But the man that lives next dooris older.
He actually doesn't even livethere.
He just has it and he has cattleover there, and he doesn't have
donkeys or dogs or anything overthere with them.
And he is adamant that youcannot shoot the coyotes on his
property.
(28:12):
So the coyotes take his babiesdown, and to be honest, as long
as the meal is easier overthere, they have no reason to
come over here and mess with myLGDs because it's just easier
over there.
So as long as there's somethingeasier elsewhere.
That's all you are really after.
(28:33):
You don't wanna be the slowestone running away from something.
It's the same concept.
You just make it easierelsewhere.
Danny (28:43):
Yeah.
So what do you, so what do youthink about, so a person's
getting chickens for the firsttime.
And they're anxious and thespring hatch is happening.
Everybody knows there's nochicks available.
There's no chicks you got if thetractor, tractor Supply or
whoever has chicks or can't find'em online till July.
And so they find chicks and wegotta get'em right now.
(29:03):
Let's get'em.
Is it better to be prepared andhave a good structure and home
forum, or should people justjump right in?
What do you think, Carrie?
Carey (29:15):
So for.
If you want chicks and you findchicks, grab'em because you can
brood chicks in a plasticstorage container with a heat
plate and put'em some water andsome feed, and you got two or
(29:36):
three weeks to really preparethem in place.
But I think that if once it'stime to put that bird outside.
If you don't have a place to putthem that is strong enough to
keep your predator lockedinside, then you're doing your
(30:00):
birds a disservice.
And by what that, what I mean bythat is like.
If your big predators areraccoons, dogs, coyotes, if you
was to put that animal inside,what you're gonna put your
chickens in, if it can't getout, then it probably can't get
in.
(30:20):
So your chickens will be safe inthere.
But people that like they buychickens and they don't create a
safe environment to put them in.
I really wish they wouldn't evenget chickens and the people that
get chickens, because eggs areexpensive.
(30:42):
I'm gonna save some money.
I'm gonna save money on eggs.
If you got a family of 50, thenmaybe, but I would still say
you're not taking care of yourchickens.
Because.
Infrastructure is almost asexpensive or more so than a good
(31:06):
foundation trio of a really highquality bird.
Jennifer (31:11):
You struck a nerve with that one.
You do need to spend money oninfrastructure.
Otherwise you're just feedingthe wildlife and you might as
well just go buy some KFC andthrow it out the back door and
save yourself trouble.
Carey (31:28):
It's like for me in feed, people will say 25, 28, whatever
dollars, whatever they'relooking at is, that is so
expensive.
I'm like we're a premiumcompany.
We provide the nutrition thatthe birds need and they gripe
(31:48):
about it.
And there's been situationswhere I've seen that and they go
away.
And then another person's Ican't believe they just said
that.
And I said, what do you mean?
And.
Just last week, that man boughta pair of chickens for$1,800.
(32:10):
Oh my.
And I'm like, whoa, wait aminute.
You spend$900 a piece, wow.
On a chicken, but you want tofeed it a 10 or$12 bag of feet.
You got your priorities inorder, you know your priorities
are messed up.
And I feel the same way aboutinfrastructure because it is you
(32:35):
think about it, would you have afamily and go to nowhere or
would you take your family home?
And, at least we as people canfight off stuff predators.
My chickens don't have boxinggloves.
So they need a chance.
Jennifer (32:56):
They just have pterodactyl sounds, huh?
Carey (32:59):
Yeah, that's it.
Jennifer (33:01):
So tell us about your coop and how it would help keep
a chicken safe.
How did you design it?
Danny (33:09):
My coop.
Jennifer (33:10):
Yep.
Danny (33:11):
There's a couple factors.
It's the hardware cloth that wealready talked about that's an
absolute must.
It needs to be weighty too.
Like it can't be just easilylifted off the ground.
So we put that predator kitaround and stake it down.
That protects.
'cause we sell coops all overthe country, including
northwest.
We have bears, right?
(33:32):
It's really hard to keep a bearaway from a block of chicken.
Again, it's just keep'em, makeit not easy for'em.
But we'll do primarily theharbor cloth will make it a
little bit sturdy and heavy, soit's not just easily lifted off
the ground.
And then from an access point,limit your access points.
We have an access door in theback of the coop that we have
(33:55):
locks on and then you gotta gothrough the run.
So I'll give you an example.
We have a sliding door.
'cause when you think aboutpredators, and their little
grippers, I don't know, mostpeople have runs but out in the
country.
So Jennifer, do you have runs ordo you just have a house and
then you let'em outta the houseand they free range?
Jennifer (34:13):
I have runs.
Danny (34:15):
Okay, so just having, it's essentially dual entry,
right?
So you have a door on your runand then you have a door on your
coop.
So just eliminating thenighttime predators by having'em
in the coop at night and then anauto door or something that
automatically closes and locksbehind them.
Now a predator has to getthrough the run and through the
coop in order to get to'em.
(34:35):
So just a couple differentlayers of security, if you want
to call it that.
Jennifer (34:39):
All and then, so your coops, do they come in a kit or
are they ready to plop on theground?
How do they come?
Danny (34:47):
Yeah, that's the best part.
We actually ship it to you.
Oh my goodness.
We've, I dunno.
Have either of you ever moved acoop down the road before on a
trailer?
No,
Jennifer (34:58):
no, not me.
Oh, we
Danny (34:59):
did, and we one time had this a dog kennel carry that you
were talking about, but withhardware cloud wrapped around
it.
And it was a great one.
We actually inherited it fromsome, this was our first coop
that we ever got.
You should have seen us drivingdown the road with that thing on
a trailer.
'cause it's 12 feet long andit's nine feet up in the air.
We lost the roof on the coop, itflew off.
(35:21):
Moving coop is, it's no joke.
So to answer your question wedo, we actually, we ship the
coop in boxes to your door.
So imagine like as easy asputting together a piece of IKEA
furniture.
You're gonna do it wrong thefirst time, but the second time
around it goes togethersmoothly.
Just if you're instructionallyinclined or not.
But you put it together whereveryou want it set up, and you're
(35:42):
ready to rock
Carey (35:44):
nice if you're instructional, instructionally
inclined.
That is like the nicest, mostpolitically correct way to say.
If you read the instructions,you'll go together.
Jennifer (35:59):
If your wife is standing there telling you're
doing it wrong.
Carey (36:02):
Yeah.
Jennifer (36:04):
And she's holding the instructions.
Carey (36:06):
Hey, you might wanna listen.
Jennifer (36:10):
So your cook, my
Danny (36:13):
we're actually oops, sorry.
Do they come in
Jennifer (36:15):
multiple sizes?
Like for somebody who just wantsfive chickens versus 15
chickens?
Danny (36:22):
Yep.
There's small, medium, large,and not large enough.
We can we're launching a Carrie,you're right.
It's like you start with threechickens, then you have six,
then it's then you have 25.
And so feedback's always, Hey,can you make a bigger coop?
Hey, can you make a bigger coop?
It's I don't sell houses, Ican't sell a coop big enough, I
(36:43):
feel, but we're we're launchinga new coop that's 15 chickens
now.
Really excited about that.
But I was putting together, myprototype and I even made my own
instructions and I had a, a guywho was helping me with filming
and things, do it with me.
And I said, what are you doing?
And he hadn't even looked at anyof the words in the instruction.
He's just oh, I only look at thepictures.
And Carrie, to your point on theinstructional client, it's, I'm
(37:05):
the same way.
I'll read the words otherpeople, they won't even notice
'em.
Then now people are inclined towatch videos.
So we're trying, we're gonna dosome new videos with
instructional, but Jennifer it'sfun.
We have four chicken, sixchicken, and 10 chicken sizes.
All are too small'cause coopsare never big enough.
And but they work just fine foryour backyard flock.
(37:27):
We're we primarily, we serveeverybody, but we found our
biggest demographic are peoplein the suburbs.
Surprisingly we did a littleheat map in 2023 of where our
customers lived, and you justpick a major metro and it's just
exploded the color.
So that's primarily who weserve, just I think based on
(37:47):
size and also availability.
So if you're out in the countryand you have three pole barns,
you may just repurpose one.
You have a big structure.
That that's primarily who weserve
Jennifer (37:58):
well, and everybody is going to have a predator issue.
I lost an, almost an entireflock of turkeys to a mink
several years ago.
And so it's gonna happen.
It's not a, if it's gonnahappen.
And so a lot of things, onething that you can do is in is
(38:21):
have multiple coops.
So if you had say three of youknow the coops that hold five
birds and you had a predator getin one.
You're not completely out ofchickens.
You're just out of that.
Such
Carey (38:35):
an enabler.
God.
Jennifer (38:37):
Yeah.
Carey (38:39):
You're an enabler.
Jennifer (38:40):
I am.
And I only have.
31 coops now.
It's a, But Alright, so telleverybody where they can find
you and how to get in touch withyou and all that good stuff.
Danny (38:53):
Yeah.
Jennifer, this and Carrie, thiswas great.
You can find us easily.
Chicken coop company.com.
Again, we don't sell rabbithutches.
We sell chickens chicken coopcompany.com.
It's the best you can reach ourteam.
It's a small team, familycompany.
It's great at family.
At chicken coop company.com.
We're all
on the social channels.
We're trying to do better onsocial.
(39:14):
It's just so noisy out there and
creating
content.
We like it, but we're findingsome really great people who are
taking some great photos.
But you can find us on all thesocial platforms.
Give us a call, send us anemail.
We pick up.
And yeah, it's great.
Jennifer (39:29):
All right.
Thank you so much, Danny, forbeing here with us today.
Danny (39:33):
Yep.
I enjoyed it.
My pleasure.
We a lot of fun.
Jennifer (39:37):
All right.
See you guys later.
Danny (39:42):
Take care.
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