December 4, 2025 • 38 mins
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In this episode of Poultry Nerds, we sit down with Dr. M — our resident poultry vet — to get real about worms in backyard flocks. From the most common culprits (roundworms, tapeworms, cecal worms) to why a fecal float test matters, Dr. M breaks down:
- ✅ What types of worms chickens typically get — and how common each is.
- 🔬 How a fecal flotation test works: mixing droppings with solution so worm eggs rise — then viewing under a microscope to spot the parasites.
- 🎯 Why even free-range birds can have worms — and how worm eggs can linger in soil for years, reinfecting flocks.
- 🧹 Best practices for prevention: quarantine new birds, rotate pasture, clean or turn over soil — plus when to consider deworming.
- ⚠️ The risks of heavy worm loads — from reduced egg production to intestinal blockages, poor growth, or even death.
If you raise chickens — whether a small flock or a full backyard setup — this is essential listening. 🐣
➡️ Timestamps
- 0:00 — Intro & quick background on Dr. M
- 2:15 — Cold weather & worms — do they survive?
- 5:30 — What a fecal float test is & how to get one done
- 10:00 — Common worms: roundworms, tapeworms, cecal worms
- 16:45 — How worms spread & contaminate soil
- 22:00 — Treatment, dewormers, and why you must check withdrawal times
- 26:30 — Prevention: spacing, rotation, biosecurity
- 30:00 — Q&A: eggs, worms, wild birds, and natural remedies
Don’t forget: check the show notes for a link to the approved-meds site (FARAD.org) when using dewormers — especially for birds you plan to eat or collect eggs from.
Join Carey of Show Pro Farm Supply and Jennifer of Bryant's Roost as we delve into chickens and quail (mostly) to help you enjoy your birds more and worry less. Backyard chicken keeping shouldnt be stressfull, let's get back to the simple days
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jennifer (00:38):
Welcome poultry nerds.
We are back with the famous Dr.
M at this point.
She we're gonna have to give herlike, um, British MIA number,
what is it?
MI five number, MI six numbers.
Well, she can, oh, that would be
Carey (00:55):
fun.
Jennifer (00:57):
She can be our double O.
9 0 0 9.
I just mean it has a ring to it.
The top of my head.
Wait a minute.
Wasn't there a doctor M on oh ohseven, like the receptionist or
something?
Carey (01:14):
I think so.
Yeah.
There was a doctor.
Something.
Dr. Morishita (01:18):
Yeah, we're just being silly, but I think there
is a Dr.
MI don't know.
I'll have
Jennifer (01:25):
to look it up now.
We're gonna have everybodylooking.
Y'all look it up and get back tous so we don't have to look it
up.
Carey (01:32):
There you go.
Jennifer (01:33):
That's your homework for today.
So.
She is back today so we canlearn all about worms and what
to do with them and what not todo with them and all those good
things.
So welcome back.
It's good to have you backagain.
Thank you.
(01:55):
So she said it was cold outthere at 68 degrees and it's
like 27 here.
So do you have worms at 27?
Is, is worms an issue in coldweather?
Dr. Morishita (02:08):
Well, actually they are, and they like to, they
preserve longer.
Carey (02:14):
Well, that's not good.
Dr. Morishita (02:16):
You know, it's like.
You can, all these diseasecausing ages, they can be kept
in suspension by the cold.
So watch out for Dr.
M.
Carey (02:28):
What how can you identify.
I know there's several differenttypes of worms.
How do you know what the birdhas before it's too late?
Dr. Morishita (02:39):
So usually what is done is they perform a fecal
flotation test.
And that is mixing the feces orpoop with a solution and you mix
it for the solution.
That allows the solution, allowsall the worm eggs to float to
(03:04):
the surface.
So you have to keep it timebecause about 10 minutes is when
you would get all the eggs onthe surface of the liquid.
And then you take that slide andyou look at under the microscope
and from the shape of these, wecall'em ovum or eggs, the worm
eggs.
(03:25):
By the shape of them, you cantell what kind of worms you've
got.
So common ones for poultry wouldbe round worms, tape worms.
You have fecal worms, alldifferent types of worms.
Where do you get a fecal done?
You can get a fecal done at yourlocal vet hospital, or you could
(03:51):
go to a diagnostic lab.
Could you learn to do ityourself?
Not unless you learn how toidentify all the different worm
eggs.
Okay, that's fair.
And to distinguish them frompollen or something like that.
Carey (04:08):
I was gonna say, you can actually order the liquid that
you suspend it with.
On Amazon.
Jennifer (04:18):
Mm-hmm.
Carey (04:19):
And if you have a microscope that you can hook a
camera up to, you can take apicture of it and you can use
Google images to really narrowyour search down.
Jennifer (04:36):
Hey.
Carey (04:37):
But I'll say it's just like using ai.
It's not always right, and untilyou learn specifically what
those worms look like and yourbird's poop, if you think your
bird's sick, you need to get itchecked out by a pro.
(04:59):
If I was, just myself.
And I was checking my birds.
I would probably do the fecalfloat and if I saw something
floating, I would get some freshand take it to a vet or a lab or
somewhere and have it checked bya pro.
Jennifer (05:23):
Some load is normal, right?
No.
Dr. Morishita (05:27):
No, but you know, when you do a fecal float, you
could, you, these are somicroscopic, those eggs you
wouldn't be able to see.
But you know, and then plus,like you said, we have to have a
light microscope that's easy.
Gonna be over$2,000.
Hey, I
Carey (05:46):
didn't say it would be cheap, but if you're gonna be a
poultry nerd.
You need one.
Jennifer (05:53):
Okay.
So, no, but I,
Dr. Morishita (05:54):
I would say like if you went to a state
diagnostic lab, you know, a lotof states have programs for
backyard poultry owners, andsometimes they, it's more of a
discount too.
Oh yeah.
That would be their firstchoice, you know, because.
Every state is trying to monitordiseases within its state, so
(06:15):
Right.
A lot of the states have it at areduced cost.
I mean, you can check with yourstate,
Jennifer (06:22):
okay.
So let's go back for just aminute.
So no load, um, is, you don'twant any load worm load at all.
Dr. Morishita (06:32):
No, you don't because these worms can build
up.
Over time.
Jennifer (06:38):
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Morishita (06:39):
Especially if treatment, I think what you're
thinking about is anotherparasite called coccidia, where
you want a little of it.
Yeah.
So that you build up immunitybut you don't want a whole bunch
where then you'll start having,diarrhea, bloody diarrhea,
(06:59):
Foley.
Jennifer (07:00):
Right.
Diarrhea.
Gotcha.
So
Dr. Morishita (07:02):
that's, that's for another parasite called
coccidia.
That type of parasite is calledprotozoan.
Jennifer (07:10):
Gotcha.
Dr. Morishita (07:12):
So worms usually belong to the class called
nematodes.
So they're like circular.
Then you have the CTOs, whichare the tapeworms, and those are
flat and in segments.
Okay.
(07:32):
Tapeworms require like an insecthost, like a darkling beetle or
like an ant or a cricket thatingests a tapeworm eggs.
And then when a bird eats thatinsect, then they usually get a
tapeworm.
Jennifer (07:53):
Okay, so if they're a healthy bird though, do they, do
they expel the worm
Dr. Morishita (07:59):
Well, oh, so a bird that is born healthy and is
just hatched and is kept in aclean environment, you will not
have any worms at all.
That's why when you get poultryfrom different sources and
you're bringing on to your farm.
You always wanna have aquarantine period, and at that
time you do a fecal exam to makesure you don't have any worms.
(08:23):
If you do, you treat'em thenbecause once you bring it onto
your main farm area, thoseworms, like the round worms last
a long time.
Some records are like eightyears in the soil because they
have such a heavy duty shellthat they will survive in the
environment.
Cooler better.
(08:45):
But that's where a lot of theproblems lie.
You bring in some new bird, youdon't know if they have worms,
and then you have this, and ifyou keep them in a close
enclosed areas, that builds up alot of these worm eggs in the
soil so that when the birds peckon the ground or eating
something on the ground, theymight ingest these worm eggs and
(09:08):
then that worm eggs.
Hatches this larvae and it goesthrough the body and then it,
you know, into the adult form,and then it stays in the
intestine and it continues toshed eggs.
And that's how you seed orcontaminate your soil.
(09:30):
So the worms are a, a numbersgain.
You, they, you're there, they'rein the soil there longer.
You're gonna build up a lot ofworms in your birds.
Jennifer (09:41):
What my guess my question is, if you have free
ranging chickens, they'reeventually gonna come across
eating worms, but is it possiblefor them to eat them but not get
infested
Dr. Morishita (09:55):
you?
They have to eat the worm egg,so you can't see the worm eggs
in the soil.
See every bird that has a adultworm in its intestines, that
worm, that adult worm in theintestines is going to shed
eggs.
And those egg worm eggs, or whatwe call as oum or ova, those
(10:17):
would be shed into the soil andthose stand the soil.
And then that's where the birdcan ingest that when it has
infective larvae.
Then that cycle perpetuates inthe bird.
So if you had a free range, likea large area, the birds are
gonna be pooping all in thatarea.
(10:40):
So the concentration is less ifyou have a bigger yard.
But if I have a confined areaand I've got birds that have
worms and they keep on sheddingthis oum.
Into the soil and the area is asmall, let's say you got a nine
by nine foot, and over time it'sgonna build up a lot of those
(11:03):
warm eggs there.
So your flocks that are conconsistently staying on that
soil will get more exposure toworm eggs than one that has a
large yard.
Because they're running allover, the birds are running all
over the place.
They're not at a.
Concentrated area.
Carey (11:25):
So is there anything that you can do to treat the ground,
to kill those?
Dr. Morishita (11:31):
I mean, you could do very harsh chemicals, but
most people do not.
So what you would, if you have avery high worm load, you should
turn the top three inches ofsoil over, and that way you
reduce the exposure of wormsbecause.
Getting a worm infection is anumbers game.
The more you ingest, the morelikely you'll have more worms.
Jennifer (11:55):
Gotcha.
Okay, so let's talk about allthe different kinds.
But we all, we start with eggsfor all the different kinds.
They all start the same, right,
Dr. Morishita (12:05):
As they're ovum.
So you eat there and in that eggis like the living, the larvae.
It, they ingest that.
And then you have your wormsdeveloping in the intestines.
Jennifer (12:20):
Okay?
So there's a worm that is intheir throat, a GA worm.
How common are ga worms?
Dr. Morishita (12:28):
Ga worms.
You occasionally see it.
So again, you probably see itmore if you got a lot of.
Birds with ga worms in aconfined area.
So again, you can hear thatconfined area, more exposure,
more worm eggs coming out, morebirds pecking on the ground and
(12:50):
ingesting them and they getthem.
But of all the worms, I wouldsay the most common that we find
in chickens would be theroundworm.
If people have worms.
Jennifer (13:03):
And that's the one that looks like a big
Dr. Morishita (13:05):
ball of
Jennifer (13:05):
spaghetti, right?
Dr. Morishita (13:07):
Yes.
It looks like, let's say gummyworms, but so they're circular
and they're all, but they're allwhite.
Thin white,
Carey (13:16):
okay.
That just killed gummy worms forme for a while.
Like spaghetti.
It's
Dr. Morishita (13:20):
smaller.
It's smaller, thinner than, orsmaller diameter than spaghetti.
But when you treat it.
You've got such a heavy worm,they could form a ball and
that's what causes the death ofchickens because you'll have a
mass ball, like an impactionbecause they all die at the same
time and they're all adults, sothey form like a ball of
(13:43):
spaghetti, but the bird actually
Jennifer (13:46):
dies of impaction.
Right,
Dr. Morishita (13:49):
If you got a lot of worms in you, that's why they
say that you have to watch out.
To ha.
If you've got big numbers likethat, you can have a lot of
impaction for the sudden anddeath of all the birds that'll
form a mass in the intestines.
Okay.
I mean, hopefully nobody hasthat bad infection.
Hopefully, but it can be.
(14:10):
It can be.
If you don't, take care of yourbirds,
Carey (14:13):
that'd be a really bad, infectious way to
Dr. Morishita (14:16):
die.
Jennifer (14:17):
Okay.
What would be the second mostcommon after roundworms
Dr. Morishita (14:23):
then?
I would say maybe tapeworms,which is a flattened worm that
has a lot of little segmentsand, um, it's not that common
as, but you, occasionally youmight find it, but if you look
at the birds poop, you will seethese tiny little white of the
size of a grain of rice.
(14:45):
The little segments of thetapeworm and they, they move.
So we, we often see these in ourdogs and cats.
Yep.
I was just gonna say,
Jennifer (14:54):
I've seen that in a cat before.
Dr. Morishita (14:57):
They can move those little segments.
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer (15:01):
Okay.
So what do you do if you noticethese things?
Dr. Morishita (15:05):
Well, if you notice these things, then you
should treat them.
You should know, like howintense an infection that you
have, because again, you kill'emall at the same time.
They're all gonna be balling upand you get your spaghetti ball.
Jennifer (15:24):
So you wanna kill'em a little bit at a time?
Dr. Morishita (15:27):
The problem is you shouldn't get your infection
that bad.
And so you can tell how ma, howbad an infection you have.
By doing a fecal float.
And then you can see how manyworms, eggs that you have in
that fecal sample that you have.
Sometimes they'll, you might seethe version like maybe five eggs
(15:52):
per field.
Mm-hmm.
Microscope field, or then youmight have TNTC to numerous to
count.
You have two numerous to count.
That's probably means you got alot of adult worms in the
intestines.
Jennifer (16:09):
So is there a one, one med kills all worms or do you
have to get a specific dewormer?
Dr. Morishita (16:18):
Well, you could try one medicine, like, but when
you treat.
Worms.
That's why you should alwayswork a veterinarian because
there are approved use forworms.
So let's say for laying hands,if you have worms, you could use
Femazole, but you must check theF-A-R-A-D site because that one,
(16:43):
you need me to repeat that?
'cause I had those littlebounce.
Jennifer (16:47):
FA, it's F-A-A-R-D, right?
Dr. Morishita (16:50):
F-A-R-A-D, Farrad.
It's called Farrad, F-A-R-A-D.
So you look at Farrad and youlook at poultry because this is
a good site if you raise food,animals to always look there
because it tells you what drugsare approved for use in food,
(17:10):
animals, and the withdrawaltimes.
Jennifer (17:13):
We will put a link on the description below for that.
Okay.
So do some medicines havelifetime withdrawals?
Dr. Morishita (17:24):
That one would be if you look at the site,
different medicines havedifferent withdrawal times.
Withdrawal times means that yourlast treatment, you gotta wait a
certain number of days.
Before you can eat the productso that you would have to check
for each different ones.
And what is really important isthat, okay, as veterinarians, we
(17:49):
know that and we, we keep trackon the Ferd site to make sure
that we do that for clients.
So you, a drug might be approvednow, but maybe a year from now
it might not.
So that's why you always haveto.
Take a look at that and becurrent.
What would some,
Jennifer (18:10):
what would be some reasons why, uh, the drug you
treated the bird with might notbe safe to consume the eggs or
meat?
Dr. Morishita (18:18):
There could be when you treat with a drug,
sometimes some of it's chemicalbyproduct remains in the animal.
So I'm gonna give you anotherexample.
Not.
On worms, but on medications,antibiotics.
Okay, so we need a withdrawaltime because if there's a
(18:39):
antibiotic withdrawal time andyou don't follow it, some of
that antibiotic can remain inthe product.
And there are some people whoare allergic to medications and
they get allergic, and sometimesit can be fatal.
So that's why it's reallyimportant that you have, and a
good example would be likesulfur drugs.
(19:02):
Some people cannot take sulfurdrugs and they get allergic.
So there's been cases that Iknow of that people have eaten,
sulfur, the byproducts ofsulfur, and they didn't know
they were allergic and then theyhad kidney failure.
And I know that particularindividual passed away.
(19:23):
They don't know.
They, they take that, so that'swhy it's really good to look for
the withdrawal times.
And if the drug is not listed,you really can't do that, or the
veterinarian has to be justifiedto use that.
Jennifer (19:40):
It also kind of raises alarm bells for me because
people buy or trade adultanimals and you kind of don't
know their history a lot oftimes, and then you might take
'em home to eat'em, right?
Yeah.
Wow.
That's a whole nother ball ofworms.
(20:01):
A can of worms.
Yeah.
Dr. Morishita (20:03):
But that's for the medication.
That's why the withdrawal time'sreally important, mm-hmm.
It doesn't, you might not thinkit does, but it really matters
because who knows who's allergicto what.
Yeah.
You don't know.
Maybe there's some littlebyproduct of the drug meta, the
drug being breaking down.
(20:23):
And then you don't know like, ohmy God, I'm allergic to
femazole.
That's why we have thewithdrawal times for safety,
human safety, right?
So what is your, and some drugsdon't have withdrawal time or
they're not licensed to use.
No withdrawal times.
There have been no research onthat.
(20:43):
So they don't list a withdrawaltime.
Jennifer (20:47):
So now you're talking about off-label use, like using
goat dewormers.
Dr. Morishita (20:52):
So you know you have to watch out for yourself.
Jennifer (20:58):
So off-label, use
Dr. Morishita (21:01):
the what
Jennifer (21:02):
off-label use.
Like people would go to TractorSupply and buy safeguard for
goats or cattle.
And then try to do the math thatway.
What?
What's your opinion of that?
Dr. Morishita (21:14):
You mean by buy?
Do wormers for Sheep and goldcenter use it on poultry.
Yes.
That's your own risk.
You're taking your own risk.
So that
Jennifer (21:27):
would be another, your farm, your rules.
Exactly.
Carey (21:29):
People do it all the time.
Dr. Morishita (21:32):
Yeah.
Unfortunately.
That's the risk, that you, yourold risk, you take no.
Veterinarian would allow, woulddo that.
Jennifer (21:42):
What do you think about routine deworming?
Do you find that necessary?
Like some people wanna do itonce a month or with the seasons
or things like that?
What do you think about that?
Dr. Morishita (21:55):
Well, initially, if you've got worms, you're
gonna probably treat them.
The lifecycle of the worm isapproximately two weeks, so some
people treat as often trying tokill the adult so that there'll
be no eggs.
But if you don't clean theground and those birds are still
(22:15):
picking up the ova in theground, or you're gonna re
reinfection, you gotta continuethat forever.
I would say that if you've got anew flock, before you even bring
birds in, keep'em in aquarantine zone, test them, and
at that point you treat'emthere, you keep them.
(22:37):
If they got worms, you keep themfor two or three weeks later,
you treat them again and youkeep'em doing it until they're
negative.
Because I'll tell you, if you'vegot no worms and you, you can't
have birds with no worms.
It's cheaper for you.
You don't have to deworm themand you got a clean flock.
(22:58):
It's only when you startintroducing new birds in, that's
how you can affect your entireflock.
So if people got worms, try totreat them.
And we know that if they're incages, they're gonna get less
worms'cause they're not eatingtheir poop.
But then most people like tohave the birds free.
(23:21):
But if you have a lot of worms,then you gotta turn the top soil
over the top three inches tojust try and reduce the exposure
of your birds to the worm egg.
Jennifer (23:35):
Okay, so I just wanna kind of recap for one second
just to make sure I'munderstanding.
So the birds can eat a worm.
That's not a problem.
It's when they're digging aroundand they get a hold of a worm.
Egg is the problem, right?
So if you,'cause,
Dr. Morishita (23:53):
uh, those eggs have to mature, of course, when
you eat a worm, there might beworm eggs in there, but those
worm eggs have to mature to the.
The correct stage where itbecomes infective.
Gotcha.
Jennifer (24:05):
All right.
That makes sense.
Dr. Morishita (24:08):
But yeah, and usually the worms will stand
intestines unless you got somany.
Then they will, those, the adultworms may come out and we all
know that birds have that commonopening called the ika, and
that's where the, the end of thedigestive tract.
(24:29):
Meets the end of the urinarytrack, meets the end of the
reproductive track.
So sometimes when those adult,there's so many worms, those
adult worms come out and thenthey, they go back one of the
openings and they just happen togo into the reproductive track.
And that's how you can have eggsthat have these little
(24:54):
roundworms in them.
Now, most times commercially, wehave all those heavy duty like
Candling lights that all theeggs pass through.
And if you see something in theegg they poke it, take it out,
and then those never get intocommercial eggs that you see in
the grocery store.
(25:15):
But if you have your own farmand you have a heavy infection,
if you don't candle'em, youmight just crack open an egg and
you'll find.
The worm and the egg.
Jennifer (25:26):
If it's that extra
Dr. Morishita (25:28):
protein, extra protein, so instead of your
bacon, maybe you got.
Eggs and word.
Jennifer (25:36):
Oh, you're bad.
If, if the infestation is thatbad, is the bird treatable or
would it be a hard coal?
Dr. Morishita (25:49):
You can try and treat'em, but you would always
say that if you treat'em, ifthey have so many worms,
intestine, it could ball up andthey could die, right?
So you have to tell people therisk.
If your infection is so bad,then there's always a
possibility that all the wormswill die the same time when they
(26:09):
get exposed to the drug andthey'll form a little big bong
of impaction in the intestines.
Jennifer (26:18):
Um.
Okay, so the preventative toworms is space and clean ground
and clean surroundings.
Dr. Morishita (26:30):
Yeah.
So, you know, like let's say youkeep your pastured poultry and
cages and let's say you got alot of worm.
It's great that you start movingyour little tractor around so
that you have different spots.
But, you have to know your wormload because if you contaminate
all your soil, I mentioned thatthey live for a very long time,
(26:54):
given good conditions.
So when you come back there,they might get that infection
again.
So I guess traditionally, if yougot a lot of worms, you should
turn that topsoil over.
Let's just try to reduce thenumbers.
Is this just chickens?
But the best turkeys have this,they have a different round
(27:16):
worm.
The the chicken round worm iscalled Assia galli.
The Turkey is assia delis.
So they have the same kind ofround worms.
So the other thing too that youcan do, like you don't know,
like Carrie had asked about, youknow what, first of all, we
would do the flotation, butlet's say.
(27:39):
You don't have this microscope,how would you know you got worms
or not?
So what you could do is that ifyou happen to have a bird die,
you could always cut open theintestines and look for the
worms yourself, right?
Mm-hmm.
The only time you might not findit is that it's an early
infection within two weeks afterthey ingest the worm egg.
(28:02):
You might not see adult wormsyet.
But if you had just any animalthat die, whether you take it to
the diagnostic lab or you'recurious yourself, you should
always open the tested becauseyou learn a lot more whether
you've got this problem or not.
Okay?
So first thing, birds die.
(28:22):
Just be know why they died andcould be normal mortality, but
open up the intestines in thebest place to find worms.
Is that if you go you'll seetheir intestines and you'll see
like a duodenum, their pancreasin the in the center of their
duodenum.
And then you come down to theother intestines, and that's
(28:45):
called the jejunum.
And if you look carefully alongthe jejunum, you'll see this
little fleshy tag called.
Merkel's Diverticulum.
That's the remnant of the yolksack.
And if you find that littlefleshy tag and then it, the
intestines after Merkel's,diverticulum comes the ileum and
(29:08):
then the two secum.
Okay, but find that Merkel'sdiverticulum because if you've
got worms, they seem to belocated at that site first.
I've always found worms there.
Round worms.
Tape worms.
So cut open that area.
That's that Merkel's divereticulum.
And then you can see if you'vegot worms or not.
(29:32):
'cause some people don't wannacut open the whole intestines.
So you will
Jennifer (29:38):
do that.
What about ducks?
Do ducks get them too waterfowl?
Dr. Morishita (29:44):
We don't really have too much of a problem.
They can.
They have their, probably theirown worm.
But it's not much of a problemthat I see for ducks.
Ducks seem to have more viraldiseases.
Gotcha.
Or bacterial.
And what about quail That are,but they, but like go Geese can
(30:06):
have the tracheal worm, but theygot a different genus compared
to the chickens.
And what did you say Quail?
Jennifer (30:15):
Yeah, quail kept in cages up
Dr. Morishita (30:17):
off the ground, off of the ground.
Less likely the more your birdsare off the ground, less likely
worms.
Gotcha.
All right.
Jennifer (30:28):
Can we touch on blackhead for just a minute on
exactly what it is?
Dr. Morishita (30:34):
Yes.
And that's deals with a wormtoo?
So black worm.
Blackhead, also known ashistamines, is caused by a
protozoan called histo MEUs.
So this protozoan is very smart.
(30:57):
It doesn't live long in theenvironment, but it can live
longer than environment if it'sin.
The egg of a seco worm.
So Seco worm is a type of wormthat is found in the secum of
birds and it's, the worm's nameis called Heus.
(31:21):
And so this Heus who is locatedin the Secum if you have hiss it
also.
It is located in the secum ofchickens and turkeys, and the
seco worm ingests that, and thishisto gets incorporated into the
(31:44):
heus worm egg.
So the heus is like an adultworm.
It's shedding, its ovum into theground.
That's how, and so there's aworm egg and in it contains.
Protosome and hiss.
So when a chicken or Turkeycomes along and they eat it,
that's how they perpetuateinfection.
(32:07):
Now the interesting thing youshould know when you talk about
histo, while chickens can carryhistamines, they don't show
much.
It's rare that they showclinical signs, but if you have
chickens mixed with your.
Turkeys or pheasants or p fowlor quail.
(32:32):
Those chickens who are notaffected by the hiss usually can
give that infection and thoseother birds will show signs of
hiss.
And those birds will they saythat they have sulfur color
dropping, that's yellow colordroppings, and then they just
die suddenly when you open thosebirds up.
(32:54):
The liver has crater likelesions in the liver, so it's
like depressed, circular areaslike a little volcano.
And then their cecum, those twoblind ends will be filled of
this hardened pus.
(33:15):
And we call that SQL cores.
Okay.
Because birds have hard puss,not liquid puss like mammals,
and so that is histo.
Now, histo, like I said, is verysmart.
It can survive in theenvironment inside the worm, the
oum or the worm egg of thesequel worm, hetero acus.
(33:40):
But his tis is also smart.
Because earthworms that comealong eat the seco worm in the
soil and they can also cause,um, histo, if our turkeys powl,
(34:02):
pheasants quail eat theearthworm, then they can get
that the earthworm is ingested.
The sequel worm comes out.
And goes to the cecum, and thenyou got disease going in there
with hiss.
So hiss is a very complexparasite.
(34:23):
It can have indirect host, whichis the sequel worm host.
It can have the earthworm as atransport host, transporting it
in the environment, and it canalso spread.
In turkeys through directingestion.
If somebody, an infect Burgessmakes a poop, and then the
(34:47):
Turkey eats that near there,they can get direct ingestion or
by this process called clawdrinking.
That means their claw kind ofaverts on the ground where
there's a poop, and then theprotosome and parasite goes up
that way now, so that.
In a little nutshell is histo,
Jennifer (35:11):
is it a hundred percent fatal in turkeys
Dr. Morishita (35:16):
it, it usually is, and you don't really have
any early signs that just diesuddenly.
Jennifer (35:23):
Do wild birds carry all of these things too?
Dr. Morishita (35:28):
Wild birds.
Ha can have their own worms.
They have worms.
They might have worms in thegizzard different types of
worms.
Not the one that we see inpoultry.
Jennifer (35:42):
Okay, so wild birds flying over are not really an
issue with worms?
No.
No.
Gotcha.
Dr. Morishita (35:50):
More like mites.
Gotcha.
We're having a parasitic day.
Jennifer (35:59):
We are.
I think you have answered all ofour questions.
Okay.
Well, nope, there's one more.
So is there any natural remediesyou can do to help prevent worm
loads?
Dr. Morishita (36:13):
I.
I, you know, I'm, I'm gonna saylike to prevent your worm loads
is quarantine and inspectingyour birds before you put it on
the farm.
That is the best thing that youcan do and keep your farm
healthy.
There are some people that, andI don't know of any scientific
(36:34):
evidence to prove that, butthose that are trying to raise
their birds organically, theyuse a di tenacious earth.
You know, and hopefully that theation or kind of breaks down the
parasite.
Jennifer (36:49):
What about pumpkins and
Dr. Morishita (36:50):
squashes?
I'm not sure of that.
I know that some people haveused it, but I eat a lot of
pumpkin pie.
I mean, I'm sure we all are.
Jennifer (37:06):
I think you have answered all of our questions.
We will put the website to themedications in the description
and on our website too.
Dr. Morishita (37:15):
I mean, I wouldn't treat it unless you, at
your own risk, unless you were aveterinarian, that's fair.
Yep.
Jennifer (37:25):
All right.
Well, we appreciate you beinghere.
Oh, oh nine.
Dr. Morishita (37:29):
Yeah.
Somebody's gotta look up that.
Jennifer (37:32):
Yes.
Yep.
We'll find out before you comeback next time.
Dr. Morishita (37:37):
Okay?
Yeah.
Jennifer (37:39):
All right.
Well thank you for joining us.
Dr. Morishita (37:42):
Okay.
Have a good bye-Bye.
Afternoon.
Have some pumpkin pie andcoffee.
Welcome poultry nerds.
We are back with the famous Dr.
M at this point.
She we're gonna have to give herlike, um, British MIA number,
what is it?
MI five number, MI six numbers.
Well, she can, oh, that would be
Carey (00:55):
fun.
Jennifer (00:57):
She can be our double O.
9 0 0 9.
I just mean it has a ring to it.
The top of my head.
Wait a minute.
Wasn't there a doctor M on oh ohseven, like the receptionist or
something?
Carey (01:14):
I think so.
Yeah.
There was a doctor.
Something.
Dr. Morishita (01:18):
Yeah, we're just being silly, but I think there
is a Dr.
MI don't know.
I'll have
Jennifer (01:25):
to look it up now.
We're gonna have everybodylooking.
Y'all look it up and get back tous so we don't have to look it
up.
Carey (01:32):
There you go.
Jennifer (01:33):
That's your homework for today.
So.
She is back today so we canlearn all about worms and what
to do with them and what not todo with them and all those good
things.
So welcome back.
It's good to have you backagain.
Thank you.
(01:55):
So she said it was cold outthere at 68 degrees and it's
like 27 here.
So do you have worms at 27?
Is, is worms an issue in coldweather?
Dr. Morishita (02:08):
Well, actually they are, and they like to, they
preserve longer.
Carey (02:14):
Well, that's not good.
Dr. Morishita (02:16):
You know, it's like.
You can, all these diseasecausing ages, they can be kept
in suspension by the cold.
So watch out for Dr.
M.
Carey (02:28):
What how can you identify.
I know there's several differenttypes of worms.
How do you know what the birdhas before it's too late?
Dr. Morishita (02:39):
So usually what is done is they perform a fecal
flotation test.
And that is mixing the feces orpoop with a solution and you mix
it for the solution.
That allows the solution, allowsall the worm eggs to float to
(03:04):
the surface.
So you have to keep it timebecause about 10 minutes is when
you would get all the eggs onthe surface of the liquid.
And then you take that slide andyou look at under the microscope
and from the shape of these, wecall'em ovum or eggs, the worm
eggs.
(03:25):
By the shape of them, you cantell what kind of worms you've
got.
So common ones for poultry wouldbe round worms, tape worms.
You have fecal worms, alldifferent types of worms.
Where do you get a fecal done?
You can get a fecal done at yourlocal vet hospital, or you could
(03:51):
go to a diagnostic lab.
Could you learn to do ityourself?
Not unless you learn how toidentify all the different worm
eggs.
Okay, that's fair.
And to distinguish them frompollen or something like that.
Carey (04:08):
I was gonna say, you can actually order the liquid that
you suspend it with.
On Amazon.
Jennifer (04:18):
Mm-hmm.
Carey (04:19):
And if you have a microscope that you can hook a
camera up to, you can take apicture of it and you can use
Google images to really narrowyour search down.
Jennifer (04:36):
Hey.
Carey (04:37):
But I'll say it's just like using ai.
It's not always right, and untilyou learn specifically what
those worms look like and yourbird's poop, if you think your
bird's sick, you need to get itchecked out by a pro.
(04:59):
If I was, just myself.
And I was checking my birds.
I would probably do the fecalfloat and if I saw something
floating, I would get some freshand take it to a vet or a lab or
somewhere and have it checked bya pro.
Jennifer (05:23):
Some load is normal, right?
No.
Dr. Morishita (05:27):
No, but you know, when you do a fecal float, you
could, you, these are somicroscopic, those eggs you
wouldn't be able to see.
But you know, and then plus,like you said, we have to have a
light microscope that's easy.
Gonna be over$2,000.
Hey, I
Carey (05:46):
didn't say it would be cheap, but if you're gonna be a
poultry nerd.
You need one.
Jennifer (05:53):
Okay.
So, no, but I,
Dr. Morishita (05:54):
I would say like if you went to a state
diagnostic lab, you know, a lotof states have programs for
backyard poultry owners, andsometimes they, it's more of a
discount too.
Oh yeah.
That would be their firstchoice, you know, because.
Every state is trying to monitordiseases within its state, so
(06:15):
Right.
A lot of the states have it at areduced cost.
I mean, you can check with yourstate,
Jennifer (06:22):
okay.
So let's go back for just aminute.
So no load, um, is, you don'twant any load worm load at all.
Dr. Morishita (06:32):
No, you don't because these worms can build
up.
Over time.
Jennifer (06:38):
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Morishita (06:39):
Especially if treatment, I think what you're
thinking about is anotherparasite called coccidia, where
you want a little of it.
Yeah.
So that you build up immunitybut you don't want a whole bunch
where then you'll start having,diarrhea, bloody diarrhea,
(06:59):
Foley.
Jennifer (07:00):
Right.
Diarrhea.
Gotcha.
So
Dr. Morishita (07:02):
that's, that's for another parasite called
coccidia.
That type of parasite is calledprotozoan.
Jennifer (07:10):
Gotcha.
Dr. Morishita (07:12):
So worms usually belong to the class called
nematodes.
So they're like circular.
Then you have the CTOs, whichare the tapeworms, and those are
flat and in segments.
Okay.
(07:32):
Tapeworms require like an insecthost, like a darkling beetle or
like an ant or a cricket thatingests a tapeworm eggs.
And then when a bird eats thatinsect, then they usually get a
tapeworm.
Jennifer (07:53):
Okay, so if they're a healthy bird though, do they, do
they expel the worm
Dr. Morishita (07:59):
Well, oh, so a bird that is born healthy and is
just hatched and is kept in aclean environment, you will not
have any worms at all.
That's why when you get poultryfrom different sources and
you're bringing on to your farm.
You always wanna have aquarantine period, and at that
time you do a fecal exam to makesure you don't have any worms.
(08:23):
If you do, you treat'em thenbecause once you bring it onto
your main farm area, thoseworms, like the round worms last
a long time.
Some records are like eightyears in the soil because they
have such a heavy duty shellthat they will survive in the
environment.
Cooler better.
(08:45):
But that's where a lot of theproblems lie.
You bring in some new bird, youdon't know if they have worms,
and then you have this, and ifyou keep them in a close
enclosed areas, that builds up alot of these worm eggs in the
soil so that when the birds peckon the ground or eating
something on the ground, theymight ingest these worm eggs and
(09:08):
then that worm eggs.
Hatches this larvae and it goesthrough the body and then it,
you know, into the adult form,and then it stays in the
intestine and it continues toshed eggs.
And that's how you seed orcontaminate your soil.
(09:30):
So the worms are a, a numbersgain.
You, they, you're there, they'rein the soil there longer.
You're gonna build up a lot ofworms in your birds.
Jennifer (09:41):
What my guess my question is, if you have free
ranging chickens, they'reeventually gonna come across
eating worms, but is it possiblefor them to eat them but not get
infested
Dr. Morishita (09:55):
you?
They have to eat the worm egg,so you can't see the worm eggs
in the soil.
See every bird that has a adultworm in its intestines, that
worm, that adult worm in theintestines is going to shed
eggs.
And those egg worm eggs, or whatwe call as oum or ova, those
(10:17):
would be shed into the soil andthose stand the soil.
And then that's where the birdcan ingest that when it has
infective larvae.
Then that cycle perpetuates inthe bird.
So if you had a free range, likea large area, the birds are
gonna be pooping all in thatarea.
(10:40):
So the concentration is less ifyou have a bigger yard.
But if I have a confined areaand I've got birds that have
worms and they keep on sheddingthis oum.
Into the soil and the area is asmall, let's say you got a nine
by nine foot, and over time it'sgonna build up a lot of those
(11:03):
warm eggs there.
So your flocks that are conconsistently staying on that
soil will get more exposure toworm eggs than one that has a
large yard.
Because they're running allover, the birds are running all
over the place.
They're not at a.
Concentrated area.
Carey (11:25):
So is there anything that you can do to treat the ground,
to kill those?
Dr. Morishita (11:31):
I mean, you could do very harsh chemicals, but
most people do not.
So what you would, if you have avery high worm load, you should
turn the top three inches ofsoil over, and that way you
reduce the exposure of wormsbecause.
Getting a worm infection is anumbers game.
The more you ingest, the morelikely you'll have more worms.
Jennifer (11:55):
Gotcha.
Okay, so let's talk about allthe different kinds.
But we all, we start with eggsfor all the different kinds.
They all start the same, right,
Dr. Morishita (12:05):
As they're ovum.
So you eat there and in that eggis like the living, the larvae.
It, they ingest that.
And then you have your wormsdeveloping in the intestines.
Jennifer (12:20):
Okay?
So there's a worm that is intheir throat, a GA worm.
How common are ga worms?
Dr. Morishita (12:28):
Ga worms.
You occasionally see it.
So again, you probably see itmore if you got a lot of.
Birds with ga worms in aconfined area.
So again, you can hear thatconfined area, more exposure,
more worm eggs coming out, morebirds pecking on the ground and
(12:50):
ingesting them and they getthem.
But of all the worms, I wouldsay the most common that we find
in chickens would be theroundworm.
If people have worms.
Jennifer (13:03):
And that's the one that looks like a big
Dr. Morishita (13:05):
ball of
Jennifer (13:05):
spaghetti, right?
Dr. Morishita (13:07):
Yes.
It looks like, let's say gummyworms, but so they're circular
and they're all, but they're allwhite.
Thin white,
Carey (13:16):
okay.
That just killed gummy worms forme for a while.
Like spaghetti.
It's
Dr. Morishita (13:20):
smaller.
It's smaller, thinner than, orsmaller diameter than spaghetti.
But when you treat it.
You've got such a heavy worm,they could form a ball and
that's what causes the death ofchickens because you'll have a
mass ball, like an impactionbecause they all die at the same
time and they're all adults, sothey form like a ball of
(13:43):
spaghetti, but the bird actually
Jennifer (13:46):
dies of impaction.
Right,
Dr. Morishita (13:49):
If you got a lot of worms in you, that's why they
say that you have to watch out.
To ha.
If you've got big numbers likethat, you can have a lot of
impaction for the sudden anddeath of all the birds that'll
form a mass in the intestines.
Okay.
I mean, hopefully nobody hasthat bad infection.
Hopefully, but it can be.
(14:10):
It can be.
If you don't, take care of yourbirds,
Carey (14:13):
that'd be a really bad, infectious way to
Dr. Morishita (14:16):
die.
Jennifer (14:17):
Okay.
What would be the second mostcommon after roundworms
Dr. Morishita (14:23):
then?
I would say maybe tapeworms,which is a flattened worm that
has a lot of little segmentsand, um, it's not that common
as, but you, occasionally youmight find it, but if you look
at the birds poop, you will seethese tiny little white of the
size of a grain of rice.
(14:45):
The little segments of thetapeworm and they, they move.
So we, we often see these in ourdogs and cats.
Yep.
I was just gonna say,
Jennifer (14:54):
I've seen that in a cat before.
Dr. Morishita (14:57):
They can move those little segments.
Mm-hmm.
Jennifer (15:01):
Okay.
So what do you do if you noticethese things?
Dr. Morishita (15:05):
Well, if you notice these things, then you
should treat them.
You should know, like howintense an infection that you
have, because again, you kill'emall at the same time.
They're all gonna be balling upand you get your spaghetti ball.
Jennifer (15:24):
So you wanna kill'em a little bit at a time?
Dr. Morishita (15:27):
The problem is you shouldn't get your infection
that bad.
And so you can tell how ma, howbad an infection you have.
By doing a fecal float.
And then you can see how manyworms, eggs that you have in
that fecal sample that you have.
Sometimes they'll, you might seethe version like maybe five eggs
(15:52):
per field.
Mm-hmm.
Microscope field, or then youmight have TNTC to numerous to
count.
You have two numerous to count.
That's probably means you got alot of adult worms in the
intestines.
Jennifer (16:09):
So is there a one, one med kills all worms or do you
have to get a specific dewormer?
Dr. Morishita (16:18):
Well, you could try one medicine, like, but when
you treat.
Worms.
That's why you should alwayswork a veterinarian because
there are approved use forworms.
So let's say for laying hands,if you have worms, you could use
Femazole, but you must check theF-A-R-A-D site because that one,
(16:43):
you need me to repeat that?
'cause I had those littlebounce.
Jennifer (16:47):
FA, it's F-A-A-R-D, right?
Dr. Morishita (16:50):
F-A-R-A-D, Farrad.
It's called Farrad, F-A-R-A-D.
So you look at Farrad and youlook at poultry because this is
a good site if you raise food,animals to always look there
because it tells you what drugsare approved for use in food,
(17:10):
animals, and the withdrawaltimes.
Jennifer (17:13):
We will put a link on the description below for that.
Okay.
So do some medicines havelifetime withdrawals?
Dr. Morishita (17:24):
That one would be if you look at the site,
different medicines havedifferent withdrawal times.
Withdrawal times means that yourlast treatment, you gotta wait a
certain number of days.
Before you can eat the productso that you would have to check
for each different ones.
And what is really important isthat, okay, as veterinarians, we
(17:49):
know that and we, we keep trackon the Ferd site to make sure
that we do that for clients.
So you, a drug might be approvednow, but maybe a year from now
it might not.
So that's why you always haveto.
Take a look at that and becurrent.
What would some,
Jennifer (18:10):
what would be some reasons why, uh, the drug you
treated the bird with might notbe safe to consume the eggs or
meat?
Dr. Morishita (18:18):
There could be when you treat with a drug,
sometimes some of it's chemicalbyproduct remains in the animal.
So I'm gonna give you anotherexample.
Not.
On worms, but on medications,antibiotics.
Okay, so we need a withdrawaltime because if there's a
(18:39):
antibiotic withdrawal time andyou don't follow it, some of
that antibiotic can remain inthe product.
And there are some people whoare allergic to medications and
they get allergic, and sometimesit can be fatal.
So that's why it's reallyimportant that you have, and a
good example would be likesulfur drugs.
(19:02):
Some people cannot take sulfurdrugs and they get allergic.
So there's been cases that Iknow of that people have eaten,
sulfur, the byproducts ofsulfur, and they didn't know
they were allergic and then theyhad kidney failure.
And I know that particularindividual passed away.
(19:23):
They don't know.
They, they take that, so that'swhy it's really good to look for
the withdrawal times.
And if the drug is not listed,you really can't do that, or the
veterinarian has to be justifiedto use that.
Jennifer (19:40):
It also kind of raises alarm bells for me because
people buy or trade adultanimals and you kind of don't
know their history a lot oftimes, and then you might take
'em home to eat'em, right?
Yeah.
Wow.
That's a whole nother ball ofworms.
(20:01):
A can of worms.
Yeah.
Dr. Morishita (20:03):
But that's for the medication.
That's why the withdrawal time'sreally important, mm-hmm.
It doesn't, you might not thinkit does, but it really matters
because who knows who's allergicto what.
Yeah.
You don't know.
Maybe there's some littlebyproduct of the drug meta, the
drug being breaking down.
(20:23):
And then you don't know like, ohmy God, I'm allergic to
femazole.
That's why we have thewithdrawal times for safety,
human safety, right?
So what is your, and some drugsdon't have withdrawal time or
they're not licensed to use.
No withdrawal times.
There have been no research onthat.
(20:43):
So they don't list a withdrawaltime.
Jennifer (20:47):
So now you're talking about off-label use, like using
goat dewormers.
Dr. Morishita (20:52):
So you know you have to watch out for yourself.
Jennifer (20:58):
So off-label, use
Dr. Morishita (21:01):
the what
Jennifer (21:02):
off-label use.
Like people would go to TractorSupply and buy safeguard for
goats or cattle.
And then try to do the math thatway.
What?
What's your opinion of that?
Dr. Morishita (21:14):
You mean by buy?
Do wormers for Sheep and goldcenter use it on poultry.
Yes.
That's your own risk.
You're taking your own risk.
So that
Jennifer (21:27):
would be another, your farm, your rules.
Exactly.
Carey (21:29):
People do it all the time.
Dr. Morishita (21:32):
Yeah.
Unfortunately.
That's the risk, that you, yourold risk, you take no.
Veterinarian would allow, woulddo that.
Jennifer (21:42):
What do you think about routine deworming?
Do you find that necessary?
Like some people wanna do itonce a month or with the seasons
or things like that?
What do you think about that?
Dr. Morishita (21:55):
Well, initially, if you've got worms, you're
gonna probably treat them.
The lifecycle of the worm isapproximately two weeks, so some
people treat as often trying tokill the adult so that there'll
be no eggs.
But if you don't clean theground and those birds are still
(22:15):
picking up the ova in theground, or you're gonna re
reinfection, you gotta continuethat forever.
I would say that if you've got anew flock, before you even bring
birds in, keep'em in aquarantine zone, test them, and
at that point you treat'emthere, you keep them.
(22:37):
If they got worms, you keep themfor two or three weeks later,
you treat them again and youkeep'em doing it until they're
negative.
Because I'll tell you, if you'vegot no worms and you, you can't
have birds with no worms.
It's cheaper for you.
You don't have to deworm themand you got a clean flock.
(22:58):
It's only when you startintroducing new birds in, that's
how you can affect your entireflock.
So if people got worms, try totreat them.
And we know that if they're incages, they're gonna get less
worms'cause they're not eatingtheir poop.
But then most people like tohave the birds free.
(23:21):
But if you have a lot of worms,then you gotta turn the top soil
over the top three inches tojust try and reduce the exposure
of your birds to the worm egg.
Jennifer (23:35):
Okay, so I just wanna kind of recap for one second
just to make sure I'munderstanding.
So the birds can eat a worm.
That's not a problem.
It's when they're digging aroundand they get a hold of a worm.
Egg is the problem, right?
So if you,'cause,
Dr. Morishita (23:53):
uh, those eggs have to mature, of course, when
you eat a worm, there might beworm eggs in there, but those
worm eggs have to mature to the.
The correct stage where itbecomes infective.
Gotcha.
Jennifer (24:05):
All right.
That makes sense.
Dr. Morishita (24:08):
But yeah, and usually the worms will stand
intestines unless you got somany.
Then they will, those, the adultworms may come out and we all
know that birds have that commonopening called the ika, and
that's where the, the end of thedigestive tract.
(24:29):
Meets the end of the urinarytrack, meets the end of the
reproductive track.
So sometimes when those adult,there's so many worms, those
adult worms come out and thenthey, they go back one of the
openings and they just happen togo into the reproductive track.
And that's how you can have eggsthat have these little
(24:54):
roundworms in them.
Now, most times commercially, wehave all those heavy duty like
Candling lights that all theeggs pass through.
And if you see something in theegg they poke it, take it out,
and then those never get intocommercial eggs that you see in
the grocery store.
(25:15):
But if you have your own farmand you have a heavy infection,
if you don't candle'em, youmight just crack open an egg and
you'll find.
The worm and the egg.
Jennifer (25:26):
If it's that extra
Dr. Morishita (25:28):
protein, extra protein, so instead of your
bacon, maybe you got.
Eggs and word.
Jennifer (25:36):
Oh, you're bad.
If, if the infestation is thatbad, is the bird treatable or
would it be a hard coal?
Dr. Morishita (25:49):
You can try and treat'em, but you would always
say that if you treat'em, ifthey have so many worms,
intestine, it could ball up andthey could die, right?
So you have to tell people therisk.
If your infection is so bad,then there's always a
possibility that all the wormswill die the same time when they
(26:09):
get exposed to the drug andthey'll form a little big bong
of impaction in the intestines.
Jennifer (26:18):
Um.
Okay, so the preventative toworms is space and clean ground
and clean surroundings.
Dr. Morishita (26:30):
Yeah.
So, you know, like let's say youkeep your pastured poultry and
cages and let's say you got alot of worm.
It's great that you start movingyour little tractor around so
that you have different spots.
But, you have to know your wormload because if you contaminate
all your soil, I mentioned thatthey live for a very long time,
(26:54):
given good conditions.
So when you come back there,they might get that infection
again.
So I guess traditionally, if yougot a lot of worms, you should
turn that topsoil over.
Let's just try to reduce thenumbers.
Is this just chickens?
But the best turkeys have this,they have a different round
(27:16):
worm.
The the chicken round worm iscalled Assia galli.
The Turkey is assia delis.
So they have the same kind ofround worms.
So the other thing too that youcan do, like you don't know,
like Carrie had asked about, youknow what, first of all, we
would do the flotation, butlet's say.
(27:39):
You don't have this microscope,how would you know you got worms
or not?
So what you could do is that ifyou happen to have a bird die,
you could always cut open theintestines and look for the
worms yourself, right?
Mm-hmm.
The only time you might not findit is that it's an early
infection within two weeks afterthey ingest the worm egg.
(28:02):
You might not see adult wormsyet.
But if you had just any animalthat die, whether you take it to
the diagnostic lab or you'recurious yourself, you should
always open the tested becauseyou learn a lot more whether
you've got this problem or not.
Okay?
So first thing, birds die.
(28:22):
Just be know why they died andcould be normal mortality, but
open up the intestines in thebest place to find worms.
Is that if you go you'll seetheir intestines and you'll see
like a duodenum, their pancreasin the in the center of their
duodenum.
And then you come down to theother intestines, and that's
(28:45):
called the jejunum.
And if you look carefully alongthe jejunum, you'll see this
little fleshy tag called.
Merkel's Diverticulum.
That's the remnant of the yolksack.
And if you find that littlefleshy tag and then it, the
intestines after Merkel's,diverticulum comes the ileum and
(29:08):
then the two secum.
Okay, but find that Merkel'sdiverticulum because if you've
got worms, they seem to belocated at that site first.
I've always found worms there.
Round worms.
Tape worms.
So cut open that area.
That's that Merkel's divereticulum.
And then you can see if you'vegot worms or not.
(29:32):
'cause some people don't wannacut open the whole intestines.
So you will
Jennifer (29:38):
do that.
What about ducks?
Do ducks get them too waterfowl?
Dr. Morishita (29:44):
We don't really have too much of a problem.
They can.
They have their, probably theirown worm.
But it's not much of a problemthat I see for ducks.
Ducks seem to have more viraldiseases.
Gotcha.
Or bacterial.
And what about quail That are,but they, but like go Geese can
(30:06):
have the tracheal worm, but theygot a different genus compared
to the chickens.
And what did you say Quail?
Jennifer (30:15):
Yeah, quail kept in cages up
Dr. Morishita (30:17):
off the ground, off of the ground.
Less likely the more your birdsare off the ground, less likely
worms.
Gotcha.
All right.
Jennifer (30:28):
Can we touch on blackhead for just a minute on
exactly what it is?
Dr. Morishita (30:34):
Yes.
And that's deals with a wormtoo?
So black worm.
Blackhead, also known ashistamines, is caused by a
protozoan called histo MEUs.
So this protozoan is very smart.
(30:57):
It doesn't live long in theenvironment, but it can live
longer than environment if it'sin.
The egg of a seco worm.
So Seco worm is a type of wormthat is found in the secum of
birds and it's, the worm's nameis called Heus.
(31:21):
And so this Heus who is locatedin the Secum if you have hiss it
also.
It is located in the secum ofchickens and turkeys, and the
seco worm ingests that, and thishisto gets incorporated into the
(31:44):
heus worm egg.
So the heus is like an adultworm.
It's shedding, its ovum into theground.
That's how, and so there's aworm egg and in it contains.
Protosome and hiss.
So when a chicken or Turkeycomes along and they eat it,
that's how they perpetuateinfection.
(32:07):
Now the interesting thing youshould know when you talk about
histo, while chickens can carryhistamines, they don't show
much.
It's rare that they showclinical signs, but if you have
chickens mixed with your.
Turkeys or pheasants or p fowlor quail.
(32:32):
Those chickens who are notaffected by the hiss usually can
give that infection and thoseother birds will show signs of
hiss.
And those birds will they saythat they have sulfur color
dropping, that's yellow colordroppings, and then they just
die suddenly when you open thosebirds up.
(32:54):
The liver has crater likelesions in the liver, so it's
like depressed, circular areaslike a little volcano.
And then their cecum, those twoblind ends will be filled of
this hardened pus.
(33:15):
And we call that SQL cores.
Okay.
Because birds have hard puss,not liquid puss like mammals,
and so that is histo.
Now, histo, like I said, is verysmart.
It can survive in theenvironment inside the worm, the
oum or the worm egg of thesequel worm, hetero acus.
(33:40):
But his tis is also smart.
Because earthworms that comealong eat the seco worm in the
soil and they can also cause,um, histo, if our turkeys powl,
(34:02):
pheasants quail eat theearthworm, then they can get
that the earthworm is ingested.
The sequel worm comes out.
And goes to the cecum, and thenyou got disease going in there
with hiss.
So hiss is a very complexparasite.
(34:23):
It can have indirect host, whichis the sequel worm host.
It can have the earthworm as atransport host, transporting it
in the environment, and it canalso spread.
In turkeys through directingestion.
If somebody, an infect Burgessmakes a poop, and then the
(34:47):
Turkey eats that near there,they can get direct ingestion or
by this process called clawdrinking.
That means their claw kind ofaverts on the ground where
there's a poop, and then theprotosome and parasite goes up
that way now, so that.
In a little nutshell is histo,
Jennifer (35:11):
is it a hundred percent fatal in turkeys
Dr. Morishita (35:16):
it, it usually is, and you don't really have
any early signs that just diesuddenly.
Jennifer (35:23):
Do wild birds carry all of these things too?
Dr. Morishita (35:28):
Wild birds.
Ha can have their own worms.
They have worms.
They might have worms in thegizzard different types of
worms.
Not the one that we see inpoultry.
Jennifer (35:42):
Okay, so wild birds flying over are not really an
issue with worms?
No.
No.
Gotcha.
Dr. Morishita (35:50):
More like mites.
Gotcha.
We're having a parasitic day.
Jennifer (35:59):
We are.
I think you have answered all ofour questions.
Okay.
Well, nope, there's one more.
So is there any natural remediesyou can do to help prevent worm
loads?
Dr. Morishita (36:13):
I.
I, you know, I'm, I'm gonna saylike to prevent your worm loads
is quarantine and inspectingyour birds before you put it on
the farm.
That is the best thing that youcan do and keep your farm
healthy.
There are some people that, andI don't know of any scientific
(36:34):
evidence to prove that, butthose that are trying to raise
their birds organically, theyuse a di tenacious earth.
You know, and hopefully that theation or kind of breaks down the
parasite.
Jennifer (36:49):
What about pumpkins and
Dr. Morishita (36:50):
squashes?
I'm not sure of that.
I know that some people haveused it, but I eat a lot of
pumpkin pie.
I mean, I'm sure we all are.
Jennifer (37:06):
I think you have answered all of our questions.
We will put the website to themedications in the description
and on our website too.
Dr. Morishita (37:15):
I mean, I wouldn't treat it unless you, at
your own risk, unless you were aveterinarian, that's fair.
Yep.
Jennifer (37:25):
All right.
Well, we appreciate you beinghere.
Oh, oh nine.
Dr. Morishita (37:29):
Yeah.
Somebody's gotta look up that.
Jennifer (37:32):
Yes.
Yep.
We'll find out before you comeback next time.
Dr. Morishita (37:37):
Okay?
Yeah.
Jennifer (37:39):
All right.
Well thank you for joining us.
Dr. Morishita (37:42):
Okay.
Have a good bye-Bye.
Afternoon.
Have some pumpkin pie andcoffee.
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