October 13, 2025 • 50 mins
If you’ve ever left a networking event thinking “Never again...” this one's for you.
In this episode, the tables are turned: I’m the guest this time, joining Jenn Wayboer Hart (winner of the 2024 PWR Impact Award for Businss Support Person of the Year) on her podcast, Your Next Business Bestie.
We get really real about why so many networking spaces feel disconnected, and how to find (or create) ones that feel supportive, intentional, and aligned with who you actually are. I also share the behind-the-scenes of how my Virtual Speed Networking events are designed to be introvert-friendly, value-driven, and genuinely fun.
You’ll hear about:
- The difference between performing and connecting
- How to follow up without sounding like a robot
- Why authenticity is more than a buzzword - it’s a business strategy
- What to do when your business has to pivot, pause, or rebuild
This episode is full of stories, mindset shifts, and practical tools to help you build a business that’s rooted in real relationships - the kind that feel good and lead to actual growth.
Loved this convo? Listen to more of Your Next Business Bestie HERE!
Want to practice this kind of connection in real life?
Come to the next PWR Virtual Speed Networking event (always the first Tuesday of the month.
For even deeper connections, more support and faster business growth, check out the Powerful Women Rising Business Growth Community!
Mentioned in This Episode:
- Nominations for the 2025 PWR Impact Awards are OPEN until 10/20/25!
- Listen to Jenn Wayboer Hartt's interview on the Powerful Women Rising podast!
- Learn more about Jenn and her services HERE!
Connect with Your Host!
Melissa Snow is a Business Relationship Strategist dedicated to empowering women in entrepreneurship. She founded the Powerful Women Rising Community, which provides female business owners with essential support and resources for business growth.
Melissa's other mission is to revolutionize networking, promoting authenticity and genuine connections over sleazy sales tactics. She runs an incredible monthly Virtual Speed Networking Event which you can attend once at no cost using the code FIRSTTIME
She lives in Colorado Springs with two dogs, her soul cat Giorgio and any number of foster kittens. She loves iced coffee, Taylor Swift, and Threads.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:04):
Welcome to Powerful Women Rising, a podcast for
female entrepreneurs ready to dobusiness their way.
Grab your coffee and join hostMelissa Snow, a business
relationship strategist andfounder of the Powerful Women
Rising community, as sheinterviews industry experts and
shares insights on strategy,marketing, mindset, and more.
(00:25):
Here you'll find the tools,strategies, and inspiration you
need to feel empowered, takebold action in your business,
and keep rising.
SPEAKER_01 (00:34):
Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode
of the Powerful Women RisingPodcast.
I'm your host, Melissa Snow,business relationship
strategist, founder of thePowerful Women Rising Business
Growth Community, and host ofthe monthly Powerful Women
Rising virtual speed networkingevents.
I am so happy to be here withyou guys today.
I know I say that all the time,but if you follow me on social
(00:55):
media or you know me in reallife, you know there's been a
lot of changes in my life in thelast six months, I don't know,
maybe the last two years Ishould say.
And uh yeah, it's just, I feellike coming back to this
podcast, as weird as it sounds,feels a lot like coming home.
It feels a lot like coming backto my people.
(01:16):
And I know we're not having atwo-sided conversation, but the
fact that I record thesepodcasts, knowing that there are
so many of you that show upevery other week to hear it and
be a part of this world means somuch to me.
I can't even tell you.
So today we're mixing things upa little bit because in case you
haven't heard, nominations arecurrently open for the Powerful
(01:38):
Women Rising 2025 Impact Awards.
There's a bunch of differentcategories that you can nominate
people in.
Yes, you can nominate yourself.
Yes, you can nominate as manypeople as you want in as many
categories as you want.
I'll put the link in the shownotes for more information.
But one of the winners from lastyear, uh, she actually won the
2024 award for best businesssupport person, is Jen Wabor
(02:02):
Hart.
And she's just an awesome humanbeing and she does so much to
help other business owners in somany ways.
She's one of those people who isoften behind the scenes creating
so much magic and probablydoesn't get enough credit for
it.
Uh, Jen has been on my podcast.
She was on my podcast last yearwhen she won the award.
I will link to that in the shownotes too, because that's a
(02:23):
great episode.
And I also was on her podcast,which is called Your Next
Business Bestie.
And I wanted to share theinterview that I did on her
podcast with you guys for acouple of reasons.
One, Jen is very much on mylevel when it comes to uh no
fluff and no BS and no smalltalk.
(02:44):
Like let's get to the real stuffthat's underneath the surface.
Let's share stuff that'sactually helpful for people and
let's tell our authentic storiesbecause when we do that, it
gives other people so muchpermission and safety to share
their own authentic stories andto accept where they are in
business and be okay with itrather than us always trying to
(03:09):
portray this image of like theperfect businesswoman who is
making so much money and haseverything together because that
is not realistic for anyone, nomatter who you are.
And really, all that does ismake other people feel bad about
themselves.
So Jen and I talked about somany things in this episode.
It was titled Don't Be a SalesyWeirdo.
(03:30):
Um, but really that encompassesso many different things.
And I'm excited for you guys tolisten to this podcast and to
connect with Jen, listen to herother podcasts because she
interviews some amazing women onthere who share some incredible
stories that are just soinspiring.
And reach out to me, let me knowif you listened to this episode
(03:51):
and what your takeaways werebecause I know there's some
amazing nuggets in here.
SPEAKER_02 (03:56):
All right, guys, here we go.
Hey, welcome back to your nextbusiness bestie.
My name is Jen Wabor Hart, andI'm your host.
I'm a creative strategist, yogateacher, wife, mom, and pet mom
located outside of ColoradoSprings, Colorado.
As a creative strategist, I helpbusiness owners take their big
crazy ideas and turn them intoreality.
Your next business bestie is allabout connecting you with
(04:19):
incredible business owners.
It is, of course, because oftheir business, but more than
that, it's because of theirstory.
I believe that the authenticsharing of stories has the power
to save lives.
And if you just get one storyfrom this podcast that makes a
difference in your life, I'llconsider it a success.
So thank you for being here.
Please consider taking a momentto subscribe, rate the podcast,
(04:43):
and maybe even share it withsomeone else who you think could
benefit from the story we'resharing this week.
So sit back and enjoy thisweek's episode of your next
business bestie.
(05:04):
I am super excited to introduceyou all to Melissa Snow this
week.
Hi, Melissa.
How are you?
SPEAKER_01 (05:10):
Hi, I'm great.
SPEAKER_02 (05:11):
Thank you so much for having me on your show.
Thank you for taking the time.
Melissa and I were just talking,and you put it perfectly.
We just kind of know each other.
We're not really completely surehow.
We know we both attended thesame extraordinary women ignite
event almost going on threeyears ago.
Which no, four years.
(05:33):
It'll be four years.
I don't know.
Time isn't real.
But now I have been on Melissa'spodcast and we are very much
connected in the digital space.
But Melissa, why don't you telleverybody what it is that you
do?
SPEAKER_01 (05:47):
Yeah.
So thank you again for having meon the show.
I'm super excited to talk toyou.
And I love, I love that we justknow each other because that's
one of my favorite things aboutnetworking.
It's like I meet a lot of peopleand they're like, how do I know
you?
I'm like, I don't know.
You just do magic.
So yeah, I am currently abusiness relationship
(06:07):
strategist.
So basically what that means isI help entrepreneurs grow their
business through networking.
And I think of networking asanything that you do that is
creating a connection withanother person.
So I'm all about what I say ishelping people find out how to
network like a human and notlike a salesy weirdo.
So how to do it in a way that isaligned with you, whether you
(06:29):
are an introvert or anextrovert, or you are socially
awkward, or you love people,you're confident, you're shy,
you're outgoing, you're not.
There's a way that you cannetwork that will not feel
terrible to you and also thatwill be effective for growing
your business.
And so that's really what Ifocus on in terms of speaking
and teaching and training.
(06:50):
And then I also run an onlinecommunity for female
entrepreneurs.
It's called the Powerful WomenRising Community.
And it's for any woman who has abusiness and they want to grow
their business with a communityof other women who also value
that connection, sharing wisdomwith each other, supporting each
other, referring each other,promoting each other.
(07:11):
So yeah, that's kind of theheart and soul of what I do.
SPEAKER_02 (07:15):
We'll get into all the details, but really quick,
because I know I have listenersall over the country.
Your online powerful womenrising, is that local?
Is it everywhere?
What's the geographical range ofwomen in that group?
SPEAKER_01 (07:29):
It's all over the place.
So I run a monthly virtual speednetworking event that is open to
the public.
You don't have to be a member ofthe powerful women rising
community to come to that.
And we have women who come tothat event from all over the
world every month.
I always ask if you're not inthe US, drop in the chat and
tell us where you're from.
And my mind is always blown withpeople from Nigeria and Israel
(07:51):
and the UK and all over theplace.
And then, yeah, in the powerfulwomen rising community, the
women who actually join thecommunity, we have women from
all over the world as well.
SPEAKER_02 (08:02):
Incredible.
You touched on so many importantthings.
As someone who's veryintroverted, my parents don't
believe me, but I am actuallyvery introverted.
I feel so awkward around groupsof people I don't know.
We actually just talked aboutthis.
But how did this become yourpassion?
SPEAKER_01 (08:19):
Yeah, so it's a long story, but I'll try to give you
the reader's digest version.
That's what my mom used toalways say to me when I was a
teenager and I'd tell herstories.
She's like, is there a reader'sdigest version of this story?
And I'm like, no, there is not.
You get to listen to the wholething, every unimportant detail.
I've I've I've become moreconcise as I've grown up.
(08:39):
So I got into entrepreneurshipby accident, as many of us do.
I was working full-time as apersonal injury paralegal, and I
started working on the side fora guy who had a business
basically where he wouldsubcontract for other people who
would write medical recordsummaries for personal injury
attorneys.
And so I started writingsummaries for him, which was a
(09:00):
great gig for him because hewould charge these law firms$60
an hour.
He would pay me$25 an hour toactually do the work.
And it was amazing.
And so he decided to take hisbusiness in a different
direction and basically askedme, Do you want my clients?
And I was like, sure.
So I became an entrepreneur in away that most people don't, with
(09:22):
a full client load the next day,consistently making money, never
having to advertise or market ordo sales calls or anything.
And I was like, being anentrepreneur is freaking
awesome.
Why doesn't everybody do this?
And around that same time, I wasalso getting my life coaching
certification.
And when I got my certification,I thought it would be the same
(09:43):
way.
I really thought I would just belike, I'm a life coach, who's
ready for coaching?
And then like all the peoplewould come and I would be rich.
And spoiler alert, it didn't gothat way.
I know you're surprised to hear.
Okay.
And I realized that there was alot more to it.
And I spent so much time andmoney, especially in the
(10:04):
beginning, doing all of thethings that I thought I needed
to do to grow my business.
Like, I need a logo, I need awebsite, I need branding photos,
I need business cards, I need totake this, this, and this
course, I need to do thismastermind, I need to hire this
expensive coach, like all ofthese things that I thought this
is what I need to grow mybusiness.
And looking back over the six,seven years that I was a dating
(10:28):
and relationship coach, what Irealized was the one thing that
had consistently made me moneyand brought me clients was the
relationships that I had built,the connections that I made
along my journey.
It wasn't any of those things.
And there is a time and placefor all of those things.
Like I'm not saying branding'snot important.
I'm not saying you don't need awebsite.
I'm not saying you don't need toknow how to sell.
(10:49):
But ultimately, I feel like thesimplest, most sustainable, but
also most underrated form ofbusiness growth there is is
networking.
And I think a big reason forthat is because there's a lot of
misconceptions about it.
There's a lot of people whodon't understand what networking
is or what the purpose of it isor how to do it effectively.
(11:10):
And so that's really what Iwanted to help women in
particular focus on is like, howdo we get you out there in a way
that you don't feel like you'repretending to be someone else?
Because I think that's a bigpart of why many of us don't
like networking.
You can go out there and beyourself, you can do it in a way
that feels good to you and alsostill use it to grow your
(11:32):
business at the same time.
SPEAKER_02 (11:35):
All of that.
I do want to touch on thebranding website.
All of that, I did an episode inDecember where I did 35 things
I've learned in 35 years.
And one of those things wasthere isn't a right order to do
your business in.
And I meet with a couple fellowentrepreneurs weekly, and their
businesses are much newer thanmine.
And they were a couple of themwere talking about getting their
(11:57):
websites up or their social orwhatever.
And I had this moment where Ishared with them, I didn't have
a website for the first two anda half or three years of my
business.
And that's because my businesswas has always been
referral-based, 100%.
And it comes back to thatnetworking piece.
And I think as time goes on,what you're saying is just
(12:18):
becoming more and more importantbecause people are tired of
being sold to, they're tired ofjust feeling like dollar signs,
and they want to know who youare as a human being.
So that's networking, that'sshowing them who you are as a
human, not just a businessowner, but who you are in your
personal life, what's importantto you.
So, how long ago did you makethis shift to focusing on
(12:40):
helping people with networking?
SPEAKER_01 (12:42):
Yeah, I shut down my dating and relationship coaching
business about three years ago,somewhat against my will.
It was one of those thingswhere, like, you get a little
whisper from the universe.
It's like, I don't think this iswhat you're supposed to be doing
anymore.
And you're like, I'm notlistening to you because I spent
a lot of time and money on thisand we're doing it.
And they just kept coming andkept coming.
(13:03):
And then over the summer, myFacebook account got deleted.
And I at that time had aFacebook group with like over
3,000 single women in it.
I had a book club for singlewomen that was really popular.
And I had almost a thousandwomen in that group.
And that was before we all knewlike, don't build your business
on Facebook.
And also before we were allsmart enough to make one of our
(13:25):
best friends another admin sothey could let us back in the
group if we got kicked out.
And there's a pro tip for y'all.
And so it was just all gone.
And after I was done feelingsorry for myself, I was like,
okay, maybe this is the universebeing like, I know you were
going to drag your feet on thisfor another year, and you're not
going to do that.
So you're done with this.
(13:47):
Like you're starting overanyway.
So you decide you want to startover with a new business or you
want to start this business overagain.
And so that was it.
I wasn't really sure what thenext business was going to be,
but I was working with a coachat the time who was helping me,
for lack of a better way to sayit, get out of my masculine
energy and more into my feminineenergy.
And so she was very much like,you know, this is your baby, and
(14:09):
you just have to let it be bornwhen it wants to be born and let
it come to you.
You can't force this.
And I was like, this is all soagainst my nature, but okay,
let's just let this baby beborn.
And slowly but surely, parts ofit came to me, parts of it came
together in full transparency.
I did a founding members launchthat January, January 23.
(14:34):
And I had, I think, 36 women inmy founding members launch.
They all paid for six months upfront.
And in return for the discount,they gave me feedback as we were
going.
And at the end of that six monthfounding members launch, three
of them decided to continue on.
And I was like, oh, this did notgo how I thought it was going
(14:54):
to.
And so definitely had toregroup, take a lot of their
feedback, figure out what wentwrong and what I needed to
tweak.
And we relaunched that October,and now we have about 50
members.
So I like to share that part ofthe story because I think a lot
of times as business owners, welike to be like, and then I
(15:16):
started a business and it'ssuper successful and I love it.
And then everybody listening islike, well, why did I have to
tweak mine like 94 times andit's still not working?
That's that's real life.
SPEAKER_02 (15:26):
And the tweaking happens forever, right?
And it's both sides.
One, we have to our businessesgrow and evolve.
And two, we get to because weget to have these businesses
pivot with our own lives, whichwas pretty cool too.
What was the experience likewith building that foundational
(15:47):
group, that beta group when youlaunched your business?
How did you find those 36 womento be part of this initial
group?
SPEAKER_01 (15:55):
I mean, a big part of it was because I'd done a lot
of networking before that.
And I want to be clear when Isay I'd done a lot of networking
before that.
I don't mean I had gone to abunch of networking events.
I was part of a thousandnetworking groups.
What I really mean is I had beenvery intentional about building
relationships with people that Imet in those spaces.
(16:17):
So it's really wasn't aboutquantity necessarily, but it was
about being intentional aboutwhat relationships I grew and
how I nurtured thoserelationships.
And I think that's importantbecause especially in this day
and age of so many likecelebrity coaches and you know
(16:37):
influencers that now all of asudden are business coaches and
they're like, I'll give you myfive steps that made me$10
million, blah, blah, blah.
And people ask me a lot, like,tell me exactly what you did to
grow your community.
And I'm like, I can't becauseyou're not me, right?
And these people that are like,I did these five things, they're
leaving out the part that theyalready had an audience of 40
(17:00):
million followers, or that theyalready had a background in
marketing, or you know, there'sa lot that we don't talk about.
And so for me, that that reallyis why I was able to launch with
36 founding members, I think, isbecause I already had a lot of
people that knew me and liked meand trusted me.
And so then when I was like,hey, here's this thing and it's
(17:22):
gonna be great, they were like,Okay, let's do it.
SPEAKER_02 (17:25):
Yeah, that trust piece is incredible.
I started off in direct sales.
I actually sold sex toys as myfirst job out of college.
I sold pure romance, and I oftenhear that I have people that
bought pure romance productsfrom me that have hired me for
creative strategy, or they stillrefer people out.
And in between there, I've donea lot.
(17:46):
I sold origami owls, I soldjewelry, where I had a team of
250 consultants, and I didLulaRel, for better or worse.
LulaRoe helped me move toColorado.
And I actually love directsales.
I think it has a really bad rap,but you can do it right.
But I have people that havefollowed me through all of these
steps, and it's simply becausethey trust me.
(18:08):
Like your 36 founding members,you have these relationships
with them.
They're like, oh, Melissa saysthis is gonna be great.
It's gonna be great.
I believe her.
And I think entrepreneurshipcomes down to that no like and
trust, as cliche as it mightsound.
And I think another importantpart of what you said is
everybody's story is different.
(18:28):
So judging our success based onsomeone else, you have to look
at their whole story, theirwhole background.
What do you bring to the tablethat they don't?
And what did they bring to theirtable that you don't, instead of
this comparison of highlightreels, uh, which we all can get
a little caught up in?
So, how would you approach aclient like me, let's say, who
(18:50):
is introverted, who hates goinginto space?
I'm not the person who's gonnago to a BI meeting and introduce
myself to 20 people.
And yeah.
So, how would you suggestnetworking?
Give us some tips and tricks forthe person who actually, let's
say, really dislikes traditionalnetworking.
SPEAKER_01 (19:08):
Yeah, that's a really easy question to answer
because that is a hundredpercent me.
I am all those things.
And people often are like,you're not an introvert.
I'm like, I'm confident and thatmakes you think I'm not an
introvert.
I'm not shy, and that makes youthink I'm not an introvert.
But believe me, on the inside,the inside of me is like, oh my
God, get me out of here.
(19:29):
So I've learned a lot through myexperiences.
And obviously, the first piece Ithink of anything is our
mindset.
I think it's what you'rethinking going into it.
You and I were talking before westarted recording about our
experience at that conferencethat we attended.
And I was telling you, like,maybe I didn't talk to you
because I was being very weirdthat weekend.
And part of that was I hadoverheard some women talking,
(19:52):
and I don't know for sure thatthey were talking about me, but
you know, I believed they were.
And they were saying basicallysomething along the lines of
like, I don't really see whatthe big deal is uh about her.
And I thought she would be a lotfriendlier than she is.
And that I'm sharing that storybecause I think it's so
interesting that when peoplehear, like, oh, she's the
(20:14):
networking queen, or like, oh,she teaches people how to
network.
I think people who don't know meimagine that I'm this like
schmoozer.
Like, I love walking into a roomfull of people I don't know and
just like charming the pants offof them and making them all my
client.
And that I just like love that.
That's like my worst nightmare.
So I would say getting into theright mindset of like knowing
(20:36):
that you don't have to go andtry to be somebody that you're
not, knowing that if you makeone connection at that event or
that meeting or wherever you'regoing to, that is a huge win.
I think that's sometimes what weget caught up in is like we we
left and we didn't meet everyonein the room.
And so we think we did it wrong.
You 100% didn't, because Ipromise half those people you
(20:57):
didn't want to meet anyway.
And so like really being clearabout what your intention is and
what your objective is there andallowing yourself to really be
yourself and letting go of theimposter syndrome is a huge one
because that that often actscauses us to act weird and not
(21:19):
like ourselves, or it's justwhat keeps us from going, right?
Like we were talking about Ineed a website, I need this, I
need this.
And a lot of times why we thinkwe need those things is because
we think that is going to showpeople that we're legit.
Like if I show up without any ofthose things, I don't have a
business card, I don't have awebsite, just like, hey, here's
my phone number.
They're all gonna be like, oh, Iknew she wasn't a real business
(21:41):
owner.
So getting all of that like headtrash out of the way first is
very helpful.
And the biggest thing I wouldsay is you have to try several
different, if we're talkingabout networking groups and
meetings and things, you have totry several different formats
and types and styles before youfind what works for you.
You know, there's a lot ofcrossover between what I worked
(22:03):
with my dating and relationshipcoach clients on and what I work
with business owners on, becausethey would go on a dating app
and be like, that was terrible.
I'm never doing that again.
And I'm like, okay, well, thatwas Tinder.
There's like 94 other ones thatare different than Tinder.
And networking is really thesame way.
Like a lot of people will go to,let's say, like a BI.
(22:25):
And I'm this is not a dig on BI,but BI is a very tends to be a
very polarizing group.
People either love BI or it'snot their vibe.
And so a lot of times peoplewill go to a BI meeting and then
they'll be like, no, I triednetworking.
It was not for me.
It was terrible.
Okay, well, there's a lot ofother groups that are different
than BI.
(22:46):
You know, there are some thatare it's similar, like Master
Networks is somewhat similar,but I think a little less
intense.
And then there are some that areon the complete other end of the
spectrum that are very, veryrelationship focused, very much
about connection and communityand sisterhood and not
necessarily about growing yourbusiness, although if that
happens, great.
(23:07):
And then there are a lot inbetween.
So you might find that you likenetworking virtually more than
you like networking in person.
I think that's true for a lot ofintroverts.
If you can find a good virtualnetworking event, I always joke
that I like networking virtuallybecause then if I'm
uncomfortable or I like saysomething ridiculous or
whatever, I can just be like,oh, my connection's bad.
(23:28):
Sorry, bye.
I can't do that for less.
SPEAKER_02 (23:31):
That's I mean, it would be funny if if you did.
I'm sorry, my connection's badand just scurry out of the way.
SPEAKER_01 (23:37):
I mean, I might, I might, given the right
circumstance.
So yeah, try virtual, tryin-person, try women-only
events, try co-ed events, trythe events where there isn't
really any structure.
Everyone just shows up and getsa drink and mingles.
Some people love those events.
Those events are my worstnightmare.
(23:58):
But you put me somewhere whereit's like, okay, you have the
number three.
So you sit at this table withall the other people who have
the number three, and we'regonna talk about this topic for
the next 10 minutes, and thenyou're gonna move tables.
I will do that all day long.
Like, I love that.
So try the different things andfind what works best for you and
(24:18):
your personality.
SPEAKER_02 (24:20):
It's insane.
BI is always what comes up whenpeople talk networking.
And one of my very best friends,she's been on the podcast, she
has also moved through herentrepreneurial journey with
several different businesses.
She owns the messy cookies, shedoes custom cookie designs, but
she also does virtual cookiedecorating classes, all kinds of
stuff.
(24:41):
And she loves BI.
She's been in BI pushing 10years, and her businesses thrive
in it.
And she's one of my very bestfriends.
And I completely dislike BI.
It does not work for me, it'stoo regimented.
So I lean towards thoserelationship focused because for
me, the relationships lead tothe referrals, which lead to
(25:03):
business growth.
And for her, those requiredone-on-ones that really strict,
like this is how manyone-on-ones you do a month, this
is how many business cards yougive out, works really well for
her.
And I love the analogy betweenthe dating apps and networking
because they're really there issomething for everybody.
You just have to be willing forsomething to not work so that
(25:25):
you can keep trying to find thething that does work.
Hey, podcast listener, I justwanted to take a quick break
from this week's show to talk toyou a little bit about what I do
as a creative strategist.
I hope you're loving this week'sconversation.
If you have a big idea for abusiness, or maybe it's to
launch something within yourexisting business, let's chat
(25:45):
and see if I can help you makethat happen.
We'll sit down together, we'lltalk about your big idea, and
you'll walk away with actionabletasks to set those wheels in
motion.
From there, I'll write upeverything we talked about and
give you even more ideas andmore tasks.
I'll also let you know what Icould do for you with my
background in social media,marketing, English, document
(26:07):
design, and corporate socialresponsibility.
But more than that, I'll connectyou with the business owners
that I think you need to know tomake your dream happen.
All of that is how this podcastwas born.
So if that sounds good andyou're interested in finding out
more, reach out at jen atgensway.com.
Now back to the show.
(26:29):
Now you mentioned at anetworking event, you believed a
group of women was talking aboutyou and talking about you
negatively.
How do you keep going to the netto the networking event and how
do you brush that brush that offfor lack of better term?
And show up at the next onethat's a big group of women and
(26:49):
just keep moving forward.
SPEAKER_01 (26:51):
Yeah, clearly I didn't that weekend, which is
why I told you, sorry if Ididn't talk to you, I was being
weird.
You know, fortunately, I wasattending that event with two of
my very best friends, and sothat was very helpful.
But I think a big part of it forme, that was really a good
learning experience in that atthe beginning of that event, I
(27:14):
was thinking, I want to putsomething like this on.
I think this would be reallycool.
I think I could do somethingsimilar to this, not the same
thing, but similar.
And then after that, and acouple other things that
happened that weekend, Ithought, why would I ever think
I would be the one to put thison?
You know, I was watching Cammyand she's amazing.
And I was like, this is likethis is not, why would why would
(27:35):
I think I could do this?
And the more I thought about it,the more I thought, this is
actually exactly why I would bethe person to do it, right?
Because there are so many womenout there who are entrepreneurs
who think I can't succeedbecause I don't check X, Y, and
Z box, right?
I'm not a, you know, you and Italked about Jess Sato.
(27:58):
She was speaking at thatconference we were at, and she's
one of my very best friends.
And we are such differenthumans.
Like she is so type A.
I'm not sleeping till I get thisdone.
I will be the best ateverything.
And she's been that way sinceshe was in high school.
And I love that about her.
And I've learned so much fromher.
And I am the person that's like,I'm not setting my alarm.
(28:22):
I'll wake up when I wake up.
I hate waking up in the morning.
Waking up in the morning is theworst thing ever in the world.
I've tried to make myself amorning person a thousand times.
I can't do it.
I, you know, I have ADHD, Imanage it well most of the time.
I have never been anoverachiever.
I've always been the one that'slike, I can study the night
(28:42):
before and get a C.
That's perfect.
What why why would I do morethan that?
That doesn't even make sense.
And so, like, really figuringout how to show other people
that there is a place for themtoo, that they can still be
successful without feeling likethey have to like fit the mold.
(29:03):
And it's okay that other peopledon't get you.
It's okay that you're not whatthey were expecting you to be
when they saw you on Facebook.
Like, I think it's probably safeto say most of us, if we're
being authentic, most of us arenot in real life exactly what
you're expecting from ourInstagram, right?
(29:24):
I mean, some of us are closerthan others.
SPEAKER_02 (29:27):
I'm pretty close.
I will say, I was gonna say, Iwould say at this point, you and
I are pretty close.
Yeah, but yeah, but it takes alot, it takes work to get there
though, to actually I meanthat's a whole nother
conversation, but showing uponline as you actually are.
Um but that's not something thatI know that's a whole part of
identity as an entrepreneur,too, and how you think you're
(29:47):
supposed to show up online whenreally like the more authentic
and aligned you can show uponline, that's a whole nother
piece to this.
That I I mean, you and I haveonly had a couple live
conversations, but I feel like Ireally try.
Truly know you because of ourinteractions online, because you
do show up probably 95% exactlyas who you are in person.
(30:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (30:08):
And that's one thing, like to go back to your
answer to the question of how doI keep going?
How do I keep showing up?
How do I keep being myself?
What I've found, especially inthe Powerful Women Rising
community and on these virtualspeed networking events, I think
it's really hard to find virtualnetworking events that are worth
your time.
And this one, like not to tootmy own horn, but toot toot, it
(30:30):
is.
It's amazing every single month.
And I think part of the reasonfor that is because I have
realized that the more I show upauthentically, the more I give
other women permission to do thesame thing.
And when they find a space whereit feels not even just like safe
and accepted, but likeencouraged for them to be
(30:52):
themselves, they want that.
They want to hang on to that.
They want to be a part of that.
They want more of it.
And so that's what I just keepreminding myself.
Some to go back to the onlinedating analogy.
When I would work with myclients on their like online
dating profiles, sometimes theywould say, I don't want to put
that on my profile.
Like that's going to turn peopleoff, or that's going to make
people think I'm blah, blah,blah.
(31:12):
I'm like, well, you are, you arethat.
And it's equally as importantthat you turn people off as it
is that you turn people on, orweird way to say that, but
especially when we're talkingabout online dating.
But you know, it's and that'swhat I keep telling myself is
like, if those women weretalking about me, they were
(31:34):
never my people to begin with,right?
But then I show up to the nextevent and I am my authentic
self.
For every one person that'slike, ew, what is she?
Why is she doing that?
Why is she like that?
She's not even funny.
There's 10 other people that arelike, oh my God, I love her.
I don't know why, but I want tobe around her.
SPEAKER_02 (31:52):
And even if it's the opposite, if there's 10 people
that are like, oh, she's not mypeople, that one person that's
like that feels seen by you,that feels that connection, is
so much better than if therewere 20 people who love you for
not being you.
And I I want, I'm gonna bringthis back to social media for a
second because I think this isreally important right now,
(32:13):
especially.
And I won't get too political,but this is something I I think
is so important as businessowners that you can share your
opinions and beliefs on socialfor this exact reason we're
talking about, though.
Because even if you turn off 10people and you lose 10 follows
because you share whatever's onyour heart, I don't care, I
don't care what side you're on,I don't care what your beliefs
(32:35):
are, you lose 10 people, thatone person that's like, oh, I
align with her, I see her, itcan make all the difference, not
just as a business owner, but asa human being, which is what
this is all about ultimately.
But every facet of yourself isso important.
And it's, I mean, the datinganalogy is perfect because let's
say you put the thing on your ordon't put the thing on your
(32:57):
profile because you're afraid ofit, and now you lose the chance
to connect to the person thatwould have loved that about you.
And so just be you and the grayarea is boring.
Be the most colorful, or maybeyou like muted colors, whatever
version of yourself.
And the people that are supposedto find you are gonna find you.
(33:19):
Like I get told I'm intimidatingall the time, which blows my
mind.
I remember I was at a yogastudio, and a couple of the
newer teachers were like, you'rejust you're so down to earth,
and we thought you were you wereso intimidating for so long.
And so I went through this shortperiod of time that is like, how
do I stop coming off asintimidating?
And then I was like, you knowwhat?
It's it's just who I am, andthat's okay.
(33:40):
And the people that are meant toget to know me on a deeper level
are going to see whatever thatintimidation is.
And you have to just keepshowing up, you have to keep
digging a little bit deeper andshowing those parts of you
because someone's gonna lovethem, whether it's a business
associate, a personalrelationship, whatever.
What makes your virtual eventsdifferent from other?
(34:03):
I know there's a video you haveout there of like you attending
a virtual event and then makingyour own because of how, right?
Uh, so what makes yoursdifferent?
What have you experienced invirtual events that makes them?
I mean, we've all experiencedbad virtual events, but in your
experience, what makes a virtualevent boring or a dud versus
what you do every month forpeople?
SPEAKER_01 (34:24):
Yeah, that's a great question.
Before I answer it, I just wantto say just because other people
are intimidated doesn't meanyou're intimidating.
SPEAKER_02 (34:32):
That's yes, that is an important reminder.
SPEAKER_01 (34:34):
People have been telling me I'm intimidated my
whole life.
That's mostly because I have anRBF.
You have to Google that if youdon't know what that stands for,
but I don't know if I'm allowedto swear here.
Yes.
Okay, so resting bitch face,yes, is apparently very
intimidating.
But you know, I I'm just like,just because you're intimidated
doesn't mean I'm intimidating.
Yeah, we all own our feelings.
(34:55):
Okay, so to answer yourquestion, I it's funny.
This is a funny story.
I went to a virtual event once,which was shortly after I
started doing my own.
And it was all for womenentrepreneurs.
And I was like, oh, this isgonna be amazing.
And I got on and like everythingleading up was like, this is
gonna be really good.
I got on and I was watching theparticipant count on Zoom go up
(35:17):
and up and up and up.
And I was like, what is thislady doing?
I mean, she had over 300 peopleon this virtual networking call.
And I was like, wow, like Ithought I was doing good.
At that point, I had like 50 or60 on mine.
And I was like, you are blowingthis out of the park.
I would say probably 250 ofthose women never turn their
(35:38):
cameras on.
And so she puts us in a break inour first breakout room.
I'm literally in a room withfive other people.
Four of them don't have theircameras on, one of them has her
camera on, and I can see her.
It's very dark, but I can seeher, but she's not speaking.
And no one's speaking.
And so me, I'm like, hi, how iseverybody today?
(36:02):
No one responds.
Like, I don't even know ifanyone's like paying attention.
I don't know what's happening.
And so I'm like, okay.
And so I sat there for a littlebit and then I was like, this is
so weird.
So I left the breakout room.
I went back to the main room andI was like, hi, nobody was
talking.
Everybody had their cameras off.
She's like, Oh, I'm so sorry.
Let me put you in another room.
Put me in another room.
Exact same thing.
And I was like, and I'm out.
(36:24):
So that's one of the reasons Ihave a rule on our virtual speed
networking event, you have tohave your camera on because
nobody wants to have aconversation with a black
screen.
It's so awkward.
Like, I will do it if I have to.
But even when I'm recording likeaudio only podcasts, I'm like,
can we still please put ourcameras on?
Because it's so weird to justhave this conversation, stay
(36:46):
either staring at my own face orlike staring at your name on the
black screen.
SPEAKER_02 (36:50):
And also ADHD, like I'm undiagnosed ADHD.
When I'm not seeing a face, I'mlike, I can get so easily
distracted.
Versus right now, I feel likeI'm talking to you.
So it's so much you've it's justeasier to stay engaged and see
how people respond, nodding yourhead, smiling, whatever, and
being human.
Anyway.
(37:11):
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (37:12):
So I give a little spiel at the beginning of every
event where I'm like, leave yourcamera on, make sure that you're
not distracted, make sure thatyou can hear people and other
people can hear you.
I don't love a virtualbackground.
I don't tell people you can'tuse a virtual background, but I
do say it's it's not the bestbecause a lot of times, like it
looks weird for starters.
(37:32):
Like we know you're not at thebeach.
Number two, a lot of times thoselike green screen ones, like if
you move just a little bit, allof a sudden we don't see like
half your head.
And you don't know that we don'tsee half your head, but we're
like trying to have a normalconversation with you and you've
disappeared into the palm tree.
So things like that, that I'mjust like, these are my
recommendations.
I always tell people, and thisis I think is good practice in
(37:54):
any virtual event, don't dropall your info in the chat unless
the host asks you to, becauseinevitably there is someone who
logs into that call and is like,hi, I'm Cindy.
I live in South Africa and I doweb design, and here's my
website, and I offer a freeconsultation, and here's the
link, and here's my phonenumber, and here's my email, and
here's my Instagram.
As soon as one person does that,everyone else sees that and is
(38:17):
like, oh, that's what we'redoing.
And now you have 80 people'sinformation in the chat.
And guess how many people haveseen yours?
Literally none.
None.
Yeah.
So I always tell people that,and that I think is very
different than a lot of virtualevents.
I send out several emails inadvance of the event, just
saying, like, this is what youshould expect.
This is what we're doing.
(38:38):
Don't come if you can't turnyour camera on, that kind of
stuff.
And just kind of outline somethings for them about like some
very simple things that they maybe doing without even knowing
it, that is creating a salesyweirdo vibe, like dropping your
information in the chat, or um,I provide a contact list to
everybody who attends the event.
So it's up to you whatinformation you share on that
(39:00):
contact list.
Um, but everyone shares whateverinformation they want to share.
And then I compile that, I sendit out to everyone who is
registered.
And I'm always very specificabout this is why you're getting
this information.
This is an appropriate use ofthis information.
This is not an appropriate useof this information.
Still, sometimes I'll getpeople, usually there's like six
(39:20):
people all in a row that willforward me an email like salesy
weirdo alert.
Cause I don't know, people justdon't believe me when I say it.
But so that's part of it too, islike I'm very specific with them
about like, here's how you can,here's who you should reach out
to from this list.
Here's how you should reach outto them in a personalized human
way without being a salesieweirdo.
(39:41):
And then the other thing is weusually get to at least three
breakout rooms.
So you have an opportunity tomeet between 12 and 15 other
women.
And I'm very specific aboutmaking sure that everyone has
enough time.
Don't be the person who talksthe whole time and then is like,
oh my gosh, we have 60 secondsleft.
I'm sorry nobody else got totalk.
Like that is such a bad look,you know, things like that to
(40:03):
make sure that you are having agood experience, that you're not
just answering the question andtalking while the other four
people in your breakout room areclearly doing something else on
their screen.
Like that's such a terriblefeeling.
And if we're here to createconnections, then let's create
connections.
And I always give them aquestion or a topic to discuss
(40:23):
in the breakout room.
And I try to make it somethingthat is allows them to learn
about each other's businesses,but also allows them to learn
about the person.
And there's there's a there's abalance there, right?
Like we don't, I don't want tojust put you in a room for you
to hear everybody's sales pitchor everybody's 60 second
elevator commercial, whateverwe're calling it.
But I also don't want to put youin a room to hear, like, if you
(40:46):
were an animal, what would yoube?
Like that's not that's notconnecting you with anyone,
that's not telling you muchabout who they are.
So I will ask things like, whydid you to share why you started
your business or why youcontinue on in your business?
Because that gives you anopportunity to talk about your
business, but then they also getto hear like the person and the
human and the heart behind thebusiness.
(41:07):
So I think the questions make adifference too.
SPEAKER_02 (41:12):
Sometimes networking groups have really weird
questions.
It's it's like the icebreakersfrom especially like high
school, those really weird,awkward questions.
And then it's it feels judgmentaround your answer versus if you
just asked me why I'm still inmy business, I can answer that
all day long.
SPEAKER_01 (41:30):
That's amazing.
I was on one once and they putus in breakout rooms and we were
supposed to share who ourcelebrity crush was.
And I was I literally laughed.
I was like, not only do I notwant to answer this question,
but I don't, I literally don'tcare about your answer.
SPEAKER_02 (41:45):
That's I mean, that's part of it too, is the
other people have to actuallycare to hear about it.
Right.
And why does it matter?
SPEAKER_01 (41:51):
No, I'm not gonna connect with you afterwards just
because I'm like, oh my God, youthink Kevin Costner is hot on
Yellowstone, so do I.
Let's connect.
Like that's not the foundationof business relationships.
SPEAKER_02 (42:04):
All right, a question that I always love to
ask because entrepreneurship ishard, or entrepreneurship can
get lonely.
I mean, your firstentrepreneurship
entrepreneurship experience, youwere handed a client list, which
is like, what do you mean thatyou would all?
Right?
If it had been this, you wouldhave been like, what are you
talking about?
I just had a business.
But what keep what's the fire?
(42:26):
What keeps you going when shitgets hard in entrepreneurship?
SPEAKER_01 (42:31):
Yeah, I think it I mean, this is probably what most
people say, but I I would say abig piece of it is going back to
the why, going back to thatfeeling that I felt when I heard
those women talking about me.
That feeling that I felt when Iwas in eighth grade.
I just shared this on Instagramrecently, and we switched
(42:51):
schools and I didn't knowanybody.
And I ate lunch in the bathroomby myself for the first two
weeks because I didn't want tosit out there by myself.
And I go back to that feeling,like all the times that I have
felt like I was too much or notenough or didn't belong or
something was wrong with me.
(43:11):
And I know that there are somany more adult women out there
who feel like that sometimestoo.
I mean, I still feel like thatsometimes.
And so I know how much valuethere is in having a space where
they don't feel like that, wherethey feel like they can show up
and be like, this is really,really hard.
(43:32):
And I'm really struggling withbasically everything in my
business without the women thatthey're networking with being
like, oh, I would never refer toher.
She's failing, you know?
Or show up and be like,sometimes they'll come to the
mastermind calls and they'll belike, I need ideas for how to
market this.
And somebody will be like, oh,do this, this, and this.
And they're like, I don't wantto do that.
(43:53):
Like, I just don't want to dothat.
And so to have that space whereyou feel like you can be honest,
you can be true to yourself, youcan be authentic, you are
encouraged to build a businessthe way that you want to build
it, as opposed to following thislike cookie-cutter script of how
it's supposed to be done.
I just think that's soimportant.
(44:13):
And I know that it's made adifference in my life.
And I've heard from so manywomen in my community how much
of a difference it's made intheir lives.
And even just my monthly speednetworking events.
Every time there I get at leastone email afterwards, usually
more, that are like, this is thefirst networking event I've ever
been to, and it was amazing.
I had someone tell me once,like, this is the first time
(44:35):
I've ever not felt completelyawkward and out of place at a
networking event or things likethat.
And so that's the kind of stuffthat like, and I I I tell the
women in the community this too,when they feel like they don't
want to keep going, is likethere is someone out there right
now who is suffering becausethey don't know that you exist.
They don't know that you existand that you have the solution
(44:59):
to their problem.
And so if you sit here today andyou give up or you decide I'm
done talking about my businessfor the next month or whatever
else, like you are this is thisis deep and not factually
accurate, but you areessentially allowing that person
to continue on in their miserybecause they don't know that you
(45:23):
exist.
And so I just always try toremember that for my own self
too.
Like, there's a woman, there's afemale entrepreneur out there
right now who maybe doesn't evenknow that she needs the powerful
women rising community, but assoon as she finds it, is gonna
be like, oh my god, I didn'teven know this was what I
needed.
And when I think about it thatway, how could I not keep going?
SPEAKER_02 (45:46):
You gave me goosebumps.
That's yeah, that's incredible.
How can people get involved inwhat you do?
Where can they find you?
When's the next virtual event?
Give us all the details.
SPEAKER_01 (46:00):
Sure.
So the easiest way is mywebsite,
powerfulwomenrising.com.
That will take you a link to mypodcast, which is also called
Powerful Women Rising.
There's an event section on thatpage, which will take you to the
next upcoming virtual speednetworking event.
I don't know when this isairing, but they're always on
the second Thursday of themonth.
So the next one is February13th.
SPEAKER_02 (46:20):
This will air right before that.
SPEAKER_01 (46:21):
So okay, perfect.
So join us February 13th.
If you've never been before, youcan use the promo code first
time and attend at no cost.
I mean, the tickets are onlyfive bucks.
We do that to help weird wheelweed out the salesy weirdos, but
we'd love to have you attend thefirst time using that promo
code.
And also have been doing a loton threads lately.
I really tried to make myselflove Instagram and I couldn't do
(46:44):
it.
And I'm loving threads.
So if you want to connect withme on threads, I would love to
connect with you over there too.
SPEAKER_02 (46:50):
I love your threads.
They're and you've built quite afollowing really quickly in
threads, which is amazing.
I actually saw somebody say likethreads isn't what I thought it
would be, and that made me sadbecause I think threads is one
of the happiest places on theinternet right now.
Like it truly is.
I posted a thread, this was acouple months ago now, that I
(47:11):
finally feel committed towriting my first book, which is
a goal of mine this year.
And the amount of support I gotfrom total and complete
strangers on threads was almostoverwhelming.
It was incredible.
I mean, I saw an author that isreleasing a new, I guess,
thriller or horror novel.
(47:32):
And Stephen King replied to herabout her novel.
And now his quote is going onher book.
And like, threads is a gem.
So if you are not on threads, Isuggest it.
There is political contentthere, there is whatever, you
know, there's the good and thebad, like any other platform.
But I have found it's reallyeasy to find your community on
(47:52):
threads.
SPEAKER_01 (47:53):
Yes.
And one of my favorite thingsabout threads, this here's
another pro tip is there's a notinterested button.
So if you see a post that'sabout politics and you're like,
I really don't want to see stuffabout politics, you just click
not interested, and there yougo.
SPEAKER_02 (48:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (48:06):
I love it so much.
SPEAKER_02 (48:07):
And it gets back to text.
I mean, you can post photos andvideos, but I don't see that
many photos and videos on mine.
It's back to like writtencontent.
And as an English major, assomeone who loves the written
word.
I like that I can just go overthere and post whatever random
thought has come my way.
There's no pressure of like, oh,I, you know, I already posted
(48:28):
today.
Who cares?
I have another random thought Iwant to share with the world.
So I'm going to.
So all that to say, if if you'renot on threads, go check out
threads.
All right, Melissa.
Well, I feel like you and Icould literally talk all day.
Uh, but I am very excited.
By the time this airs, I will bea new Colorado Springs resident.
So I am very much lookingforward to attending some
(48:50):
in-person stuff with you thisyear and getting to know you
better.
But I I so appreciate you takingthe time and sharing your
knowledge because you know,whether or not you have a
business or not, relationshipsare everything in life in
general.
And I think everything you'vesaid today really can apply to
business owners and non-businessowners.
It's kind of what we all need.
(49:11):
So thank you very, very much.
SPEAKER_01 (49:13):
Thank you.
Thank you.
I love chatting with you.
SPEAKER_02 (49:16):
And for everyone listening, if you want to hear
more about what I do as acreative strategist, you can
find me on Instagram atLifeGen's Way.
That also links to my threadsaccount, which again, love
threads.
Or my website is Jen atgensway.com.
Two ends on Jen always.
All right.
Thanks again, Melissa.
I look forward to what's next inthe networking world with you.
(49:40):
And for everyone listening,thank you so much.
And I'll talk to you next weekon your next business bestie.
Have a wonderful week.
SPEAKER_00 (49:49):
That's a wrap on this week's episode of Powerful
Women Rising.
Thanks for hanging out with us.
If you love the podcast, makesure to subscribe, share it with
a friend, write a review, or buyus a coffee.
Your support helps more womenlike you step into their power
and grow their businesses in away that feels real and true to
them.
Want to keep the party going?
(50:10):
Check out the show notes fordetails on our next virtual
speed networking event or joinus in the powerful women rising
community.
Until next time, remember thatbuilding a business your way is
the best way.
Welcome to Powerful Women Rising, a podcast for
female entrepreneurs ready to dobusiness their way.
Grab your coffee and join hostMelissa Snow, a business
relationship strategist andfounder of the Powerful Women
Rising community, as sheinterviews industry experts and
shares insights on strategy,marketing, mindset, and more.
(00:25):
Here you'll find the tools,strategies, and inspiration you
need to feel empowered, takebold action in your business,
and keep rising.
SPEAKER_01 (00:34):
Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode
of the Powerful Women RisingPodcast.
I'm your host, Melissa Snow,business relationship
strategist, founder of thePowerful Women Rising Business
Growth Community, and host ofthe monthly Powerful Women
Rising virtual speed networkingevents.
I am so happy to be here withyou guys today.
I know I say that all the time,but if you follow me on social
(00:55):
media or you know me in reallife, you know there's been a
lot of changes in my life in thelast six months, I don't know,
maybe the last two years Ishould say.
And uh yeah, it's just, I feellike coming back to this
podcast, as weird as it sounds,feels a lot like coming home.
It feels a lot like coming backto my people.
(01:16):
And I know we're not having atwo-sided conversation, but the
fact that I record thesepodcasts, knowing that there are
so many of you that show upevery other week to hear it and
be a part of this world means somuch to me.
I can't even tell you.
So today we're mixing things upa little bit because in case you
haven't heard, nominations arecurrently open for the Powerful
(01:38):
Women Rising 2025 Impact Awards.
There's a bunch of differentcategories that you can nominate
people in.
Yes, you can nominate yourself.
Yes, you can nominate as manypeople as you want in as many
categories as you want.
I'll put the link in the shownotes for more information.
But one of the winners from lastyear, uh, she actually won the
2024 award for best businesssupport person, is Jen Wabor
(02:02):
Hart.
And she's just an awesome humanbeing and she does so much to
help other business owners in somany ways.
She's one of those people who isoften behind the scenes creating
so much magic and probablydoesn't get enough credit for
it.
Uh, Jen has been on my podcast.
She was on my podcast last yearwhen she won the award.
I will link to that in the shownotes too, because that's a
(02:23):
great episode.
And I also was on her podcast,which is called Your Next
Business Bestie.
And I wanted to share theinterview that I did on her
podcast with you guys for acouple of reasons.
One, Jen is very much on mylevel when it comes to uh no
fluff and no BS and no smalltalk.
(02:44):
Like let's get to the real stuffthat's underneath the surface.
Let's share stuff that'sactually helpful for people and
let's tell our authentic storiesbecause when we do that, it
gives other people so muchpermission and safety to share
their own authentic stories andto accept where they are in
business and be okay with itrather than us always trying to
(03:09):
portray this image of like theperfect businesswoman who is
making so much money and haseverything together because that
is not realistic for anyone, nomatter who you are.
And really, all that does ismake other people feel bad about
themselves.
So Jen and I talked about somany things in this episode.
It was titled Don't Be a SalesyWeirdo.
(03:30):
Um, but really that encompassesso many different things.
And I'm excited for you guys tolisten to this podcast and to
connect with Jen, listen to herother podcasts because she
interviews some amazing women onthere who share some incredible
stories that are just soinspiring.
And reach out to me, let me knowif you listened to this episode
(03:51):
and what your takeaways werebecause I know there's some
amazing nuggets in here.
SPEAKER_02 (03:56):
All right, guys, here we go.
Hey, welcome back to your nextbusiness bestie.
My name is Jen Wabor Hart, andI'm your host.
I'm a creative strategist, yogateacher, wife, mom, and pet mom
located outside of ColoradoSprings, Colorado.
As a creative strategist, I helpbusiness owners take their big
crazy ideas and turn them intoreality.
Your next business bestie is allabout connecting you with
(04:19):
incredible business owners.
It is, of course, because oftheir business, but more than
that, it's because of theirstory.
I believe that the authenticsharing of stories has the power
to save lives.
And if you just get one storyfrom this podcast that makes a
difference in your life, I'llconsider it a success.
So thank you for being here.
Please consider taking a momentto subscribe, rate the podcast,
(04:43):
and maybe even share it withsomeone else who you think could
benefit from the story we'resharing this week.
So sit back and enjoy thisweek's episode of your next
business bestie.
(05:04):
I am super excited to introduceyou all to Melissa Snow this
week.
Hi, Melissa.
How are you?
SPEAKER_01 (05:10):
Hi, I'm great.
SPEAKER_02 (05:11):
Thank you so much for having me on your show.
Thank you for taking the time.
Melissa and I were just talking,and you put it perfectly.
We just kind of know each other.
We're not really completely surehow.
We know we both attended thesame extraordinary women ignite
event almost going on threeyears ago.
Which no, four years.
(05:33):
It'll be four years.
I don't know.
Time isn't real.
But now I have been on Melissa'spodcast and we are very much
connected in the digital space.
But Melissa, why don't you telleverybody what it is that you
do?
SPEAKER_01 (05:47):
Yeah.
So thank you again for having meon the show.
I'm super excited to talk toyou.
And I love, I love that we justknow each other because that's
one of my favorite things aboutnetworking.
It's like I meet a lot of peopleand they're like, how do I know
you?
I'm like, I don't know.
You just do magic.
So yeah, I am currently abusiness relationship
(06:07):
strategist.
So basically what that means isI help entrepreneurs grow their
business through networking.
And I think of networking asanything that you do that is
creating a connection withanother person.
So I'm all about what I say ishelping people find out how to
network like a human and notlike a salesy weirdo.
So how to do it in a way that isaligned with you, whether you
(06:29):
are an introvert or anextrovert, or you are socially
awkward, or you love people,you're confident, you're shy,
you're outgoing, you're not.
There's a way that you cannetwork that will not feel
terrible to you and also thatwill be effective for growing
your business.
And so that's really what Ifocus on in terms of speaking
and teaching and training.
(06:50):
And then I also run an onlinecommunity for female
entrepreneurs.
It's called the Powerful WomenRising Community.
And it's for any woman who has abusiness and they want to grow
their business with a communityof other women who also value
that connection, sharing wisdomwith each other, supporting each
other, referring each other,promoting each other.
(07:11):
So yeah, that's kind of theheart and soul of what I do.
SPEAKER_02 (07:15):
We'll get into all the details, but really quick,
because I know I have listenersall over the country.
Your online powerful womenrising, is that local?
Is it everywhere?
What's the geographical range ofwomen in that group?
SPEAKER_01 (07:29):
It's all over the place.
So I run a monthly virtual speednetworking event that is open to
the public.
You don't have to be a member ofthe powerful women rising
community to come to that.
And we have women who come tothat event from all over the
world every month.
I always ask if you're not inthe US, drop in the chat and
tell us where you're from.
And my mind is always blown withpeople from Nigeria and Israel
(07:51):
and the UK and all over theplace.
And then, yeah, in the powerfulwomen rising community, the
women who actually join thecommunity, we have women from
all over the world as well.
SPEAKER_02 (08:02):
Incredible.
You touched on so many importantthings.
As someone who's veryintroverted, my parents don't
believe me, but I am actuallyvery introverted.
I feel so awkward around groupsof people I don't know.
We actually just talked aboutthis.
But how did this become yourpassion?
SPEAKER_01 (08:19):
Yeah, so it's a long story, but I'll try to give you
the reader's digest version.
That's what my mom used toalways say to me when I was a
teenager and I'd tell herstories.
She's like, is there a reader'sdigest version of this story?
And I'm like, no, there is not.
You get to listen to the wholething, every unimportant detail.
I've I've I've become moreconcise as I've grown up.
(08:39):
So I got into entrepreneurshipby accident, as many of us do.
I was working full-time as apersonal injury paralegal, and I
started working on the side fora guy who had a business
basically where he wouldsubcontract for other people who
would write medical recordsummaries for personal injury
attorneys.
And so I started writingsummaries for him, which was a
(09:00):
great gig for him because hewould charge these law firms$60
an hour.
He would pay me$25 an hour toactually do the work.
And it was amazing.
And so he decided to take hisbusiness in a different
direction and basically askedme, Do you want my clients?
And I was like, sure.
So I became an entrepreneur in away that most people don't, with
(09:22):
a full client load the next day,consistently making money, never
having to advertise or market ordo sales calls or anything.
And I was like, being anentrepreneur is freaking
awesome.
Why doesn't everybody do this?
And around that same time, I wasalso getting my life coaching
certification.
And when I got my certification,I thought it would be the same
(09:43):
way.
I really thought I would just belike, I'm a life coach, who's
ready for coaching?
And then like all the peoplewould come and I would be rich.
And spoiler alert, it didn't gothat way.
I know you're surprised to hear.
Okay.
And I realized that there was alot more to it.
And I spent so much time andmoney, especially in the
(10:04):
beginning, doing all of thethings that I thought I needed
to do to grow my business.
Like, I need a logo, I need awebsite, I need branding photos,
I need business cards, I need totake this, this, and this
course, I need to do thismastermind, I need to hire this
expensive coach, like all ofthese things that I thought this
is what I need to grow mybusiness.
And looking back over the six,seven years that I was a dating
(10:28):
and relationship coach, what Irealized was the one thing that
had consistently made me moneyand brought me clients was the
relationships that I had built,the connections that I made
along my journey.
It wasn't any of those things.
And there is a time and placefor all of those things.
Like I'm not saying branding'snot important.
I'm not saying you don't need awebsite.
I'm not saying you don't need toknow how to sell.
(10:49):
But ultimately, I feel like thesimplest, most sustainable, but
also most underrated form ofbusiness growth there is is
networking.
And I think a big reason forthat is because there's a lot of
misconceptions about it.
There's a lot of people whodon't understand what networking
is or what the purpose of it isor how to do it effectively.
(11:10):
And so that's really what Iwanted to help women in
particular focus on is like, howdo we get you out there in a way
that you don't feel like you'repretending to be someone else?
Because I think that's a bigpart of why many of us don't
like networking.
You can go out there and beyourself, you can do it in a way
that feels good to you and alsostill use it to grow your
(11:32):
business at the same time.
SPEAKER_02 (11:35):
All of that.
I do want to touch on thebranding website.
All of that, I did an episode inDecember where I did 35 things
I've learned in 35 years.
And one of those things wasthere isn't a right order to do
your business in.
And I meet with a couple fellowentrepreneurs weekly, and their
businesses are much newer thanmine.
And they were a couple of themwere talking about getting their
(11:57):
websites up or their social orwhatever.
And I had this moment where Ishared with them, I didn't have
a website for the first two anda half or three years of my
business.
And that's because my businesswas has always been
referral-based, 100%.
And it comes back to thatnetworking piece.
And I think as time goes on,what you're saying is just
(12:18):
becoming more and more importantbecause people are tired of
being sold to, they're tired ofjust feeling like dollar signs,
and they want to know who youare as a human being.
So that's networking, that'sshowing them who you are as a
human, not just a businessowner, but who you are in your
personal life, what's importantto you.
So, how long ago did you makethis shift to focusing on
(12:40):
helping people with networking?
SPEAKER_01 (12:42):
Yeah, I shut down my dating and relationship coaching
business about three years ago,somewhat against my will.
It was one of those thingswhere, like, you get a little
whisper from the universe.
It's like, I don't think this iswhat you're supposed to be doing
anymore.
And you're like, I'm notlistening to you because I spent
a lot of time and money on thisand we're doing it.
And they just kept coming andkept coming.
(13:03):
And then over the summer, myFacebook account got deleted.
And I at that time had aFacebook group with like over
3,000 single women in it.
I had a book club for singlewomen that was really popular.
And I had almost a thousandwomen in that group.
And that was before we all knewlike, don't build your business
on Facebook.
And also before we were allsmart enough to make one of our
(13:25):
best friends another admin sothey could let us back in the
group if we got kicked out.
And there's a pro tip for y'all.
And so it was just all gone.
And after I was done feelingsorry for myself, I was like,
okay, maybe this is the universebeing like, I know you were
going to drag your feet on thisfor another year, and you're not
going to do that.
So you're done with this.
(13:47):
Like you're starting overanyway.
So you decide you want to startover with a new business or you
want to start this business overagain.
And so that was it.
I wasn't really sure what thenext business was going to be,
but I was working with a coachat the time who was helping me,
for lack of a better way to sayit, get out of my masculine
energy and more into my feminineenergy.
And so she was very much like,you know, this is your baby, and
(14:09):
you just have to let it be bornwhen it wants to be born and let
it come to you.
You can't force this.
And I was like, this is all soagainst my nature, but okay,
let's just let this baby beborn.
And slowly but surely, parts ofit came to me, parts of it came
together in full transparency.
I did a founding members launchthat January, January 23.
(14:34):
And I had, I think, 36 women inmy founding members launch.
They all paid for six months upfront.
And in return for the discount,they gave me feedback as we were
going.
And at the end of that six monthfounding members launch, three
of them decided to continue on.
And I was like, oh, this did notgo how I thought it was going
(14:54):
to.
And so definitely had toregroup, take a lot of their
feedback, figure out what wentwrong and what I needed to
tweak.
And we relaunched that October,and now we have about 50
members.
So I like to share that part ofthe story because I think a lot
of times as business owners, welike to be like, and then I
(15:16):
started a business and it'ssuper successful and I love it.
And then everybody listening islike, well, why did I have to
tweak mine like 94 times andit's still not working?
That's that's real life.
SPEAKER_02 (15:26):
And the tweaking happens forever, right?
And it's both sides.
One, we have to our businessesgrow and evolve.
And two, we get to because weget to have these businesses
pivot with our own lives, whichwas pretty cool too.
What was the experience likewith building that foundational
(15:47):
group, that beta group when youlaunched your business?
How did you find those 36 womento be part of this initial
group?
SPEAKER_01 (15:55):
I mean, a big part of it was because I'd done a lot
of networking before that.
And I want to be clear when Isay I'd done a lot of networking
before that.
I don't mean I had gone to abunch of networking events.
I was part of a thousandnetworking groups.
What I really mean is I had beenvery intentional about building
relationships with people that Imet in those spaces.
(16:17):
So it's really wasn't aboutquantity necessarily, but it was
about being intentional aboutwhat relationships I grew and
how I nurtured thoserelationships.
And I think that's importantbecause especially in this day
and age of so many likecelebrity coaches and you know
(16:37):
influencers that now all of asudden are business coaches and
they're like, I'll give you myfive steps that made me$10
million, blah, blah, blah.
And people ask me a lot, like,tell me exactly what you did to
grow your community.
And I'm like, I can't becauseyou're not me, right?
And these people that are like,I did these five things, they're
leaving out the part that theyalready had an audience of 40
(17:00):
million followers, or that theyalready had a background in
marketing, or you know, there'sa lot that we don't talk about.
And so for me, that that reallyis why I was able to launch with
36 founding members, I think, isbecause I already had a lot of
people that knew me and liked meand trusted me.
And so then when I was like,hey, here's this thing and it's
(17:22):
gonna be great, they were like,Okay, let's do it.
SPEAKER_02 (17:25):
Yeah, that trust piece is incredible.
I started off in direct sales.
I actually sold sex toys as myfirst job out of college.
I sold pure romance, and I oftenhear that I have people that
bought pure romance productsfrom me that have hired me for
creative strategy, or they stillrefer people out.
And in between there, I've donea lot.
(17:46):
I sold origami owls, I soldjewelry, where I had a team of
250 consultants, and I didLulaRel, for better or worse.
LulaRoe helped me move toColorado.
And I actually love directsales.
I think it has a really bad rap,but you can do it right.
But I have people that havefollowed me through all of these
steps, and it's simply becausethey trust me.
(18:08):
Like your 36 founding members,you have these relationships
with them.
They're like, oh, Melissa saysthis is gonna be great.
It's gonna be great.
I believe her.
And I think entrepreneurshipcomes down to that no like and
trust, as cliche as it mightsound.
And I think another importantpart of what you said is
everybody's story is different.
(18:28):
So judging our success based onsomeone else, you have to look
at their whole story, theirwhole background.
What do you bring to the tablethat they don't?
And what did they bring to theirtable that you don't, instead of
this comparison of highlightreels, uh, which we all can get
a little caught up in?
So, how would you approach aclient like me, let's say, who
(18:50):
is introverted, who hates goinginto space?
I'm not the person who's gonnago to a BI meeting and introduce
myself to 20 people.
And yeah.
So, how would you suggestnetworking?
Give us some tips and tricks forthe person who actually, let's
say, really dislikes traditionalnetworking.
SPEAKER_01 (19:08):
Yeah, that's a really easy question to answer
because that is a hundredpercent me.
I am all those things.
And people often are like,you're not an introvert.
I'm like, I'm confident and thatmakes you think I'm not an
introvert.
I'm not shy, and that makes youthink I'm not an introvert.
But believe me, on the inside,the inside of me is like, oh my
God, get me out of here.
(19:29):
So I've learned a lot through myexperiences.
And obviously, the first piece Ithink of anything is our
mindset.
I think it's what you'rethinking going into it.
You and I were talking before westarted recording about our
experience at that conferencethat we attended.
And I was telling you, like,maybe I didn't talk to you
because I was being very weirdthat weekend.
And part of that was I hadoverheard some women talking,
(19:52):
and I don't know for sure thatthey were talking about me, but
you know, I believed they were.
And they were saying basicallysomething along the lines of
like, I don't really see whatthe big deal is uh about her.
And I thought she would be a lotfriendlier than she is.
And that I'm sharing that storybecause I think it's so
interesting that when peoplehear, like, oh, she's the
(20:14):
networking queen, or like, oh,she teaches people how to
network.
I think people who don't know meimagine that I'm this like
schmoozer.
Like, I love walking into a roomfull of people I don't know and
just like charming the pants offof them and making them all my
client.
And that I just like love that.
That's like my worst nightmare.
So I would say getting into theright mindset of like knowing
(20:36):
that you don't have to go andtry to be somebody that you're
not, knowing that if you makeone connection at that event or
that meeting or wherever you'regoing to, that is a huge win.
I think that's sometimes what weget caught up in is like we we
left and we didn't meet everyonein the room.
And so we think we did it wrong.
You 100% didn't, because Ipromise half those people you
(20:57):
didn't want to meet anyway.
And so like really being clearabout what your intention is and
what your objective is there andallowing yourself to really be
yourself and letting go of theimposter syndrome is a huge one
because that that often actscauses us to act weird and not
(21:19):
like ourselves, or it's justwhat keeps us from going, right?
Like we were talking about Ineed a website, I need this, I
need this.
And a lot of times why we thinkwe need those things is because
we think that is going to showpeople that we're legit.
Like if I show up without any ofthose things, I don't have a
business card, I don't have awebsite, just like, hey, here's
my phone number.
They're all gonna be like, oh, Iknew she wasn't a real business
(21:41):
owner.
So getting all of that like headtrash out of the way first is
very helpful.
And the biggest thing I wouldsay is you have to try several
different, if we're talkingabout networking groups and
meetings and things, you have totry several different formats
and types and styles before youfind what works for you.
You know, there's a lot ofcrossover between what I worked
(22:03):
with my dating and relationshipcoach clients on and what I work
with business owners on, becausethey would go on a dating app
and be like, that was terrible.
I'm never doing that again.
And I'm like, okay, well, thatwas Tinder.
There's like 94 other ones thatare different than Tinder.
And networking is really thesame way.
Like a lot of people will go to,let's say, like a BI.
(22:25):
And I'm this is not a dig on BI,but BI is a very tends to be a
very polarizing group.
People either love BI or it'snot their vibe.
And so a lot of times peoplewill go to a BI meeting and then
they'll be like, no, I triednetworking.
It was not for me.
It was terrible.
Okay, well, there's a lot ofother groups that are different
than BI.
(22:46):
You know, there are some thatare it's similar, like Master
Networks is somewhat similar,but I think a little less
intense.
And then there are some that areon the complete other end of the
spectrum that are very, veryrelationship focused, very much
about connection and communityand sisterhood and not
necessarily about growing yourbusiness, although if that
happens, great.
(23:07):
And then there are a lot inbetween.
So you might find that you likenetworking virtually more than
you like networking in person.
I think that's true for a lot ofintroverts.
If you can find a good virtualnetworking event, I always joke
that I like networking virtuallybecause then if I'm
uncomfortable or I like saysomething ridiculous or
whatever, I can just be like,oh, my connection's bad.
(23:28):
Sorry, bye.
I can't do that for less.
SPEAKER_02 (23:31):
That's I mean, it would be funny if if you did.
I'm sorry, my connection's badand just scurry out of the way.
SPEAKER_01 (23:37):
I mean, I might, I might, given the right
circumstance.
So yeah, try virtual, tryin-person, try women-only
events, try co-ed events, trythe events where there isn't
really any structure.
Everyone just shows up and getsa drink and mingles.
Some people love those events.
Those events are my worstnightmare.
(23:58):
But you put me somewhere whereit's like, okay, you have the
number three.
So you sit at this table withall the other people who have
the number three, and we'regonna talk about this topic for
the next 10 minutes, and thenyou're gonna move tables.
I will do that all day long.
Like, I love that.
So try the different things andfind what works best for you and
(24:18):
your personality.
SPEAKER_02 (24:20):
It's insane.
BI is always what comes up whenpeople talk networking.
And one of my very best friends,she's been on the podcast, she
has also moved through herentrepreneurial journey with
several different businesses.
She owns the messy cookies, shedoes custom cookie designs, but
she also does virtual cookiedecorating classes, all kinds of
stuff.
(24:41):
And she loves BI.
She's been in BI pushing 10years, and her businesses thrive
in it.
And she's one of my very bestfriends.
And I completely dislike BI.
It does not work for me, it'stoo regimented.
So I lean towards thoserelationship focused because for
me, the relationships lead tothe referrals, which lead to
(25:03):
business growth.
And for her, those requiredone-on-ones that really strict,
like this is how manyone-on-ones you do a month, this
is how many business cards yougive out, works really well for
her.
And I love the analogy betweenthe dating apps and networking
because they're really there issomething for everybody.
You just have to be willing forsomething to not work so that
(25:25):
you can keep trying to find thething that does work.
Hey, podcast listener, I justwanted to take a quick break
from this week's show to talk toyou a little bit about what I do
as a creative strategist.
I hope you're loving this week'sconversation.
If you have a big idea for abusiness, or maybe it's to
launch something within yourexisting business, let's chat
(25:45):
and see if I can help you makethat happen.
We'll sit down together, we'lltalk about your big idea, and
you'll walk away with actionabletasks to set those wheels in
motion.
From there, I'll write upeverything we talked about and
give you even more ideas andmore tasks.
I'll also let you know what Icould do for you with my
background in social media,marketing, English, document
(26:07):
design, and corporate socialresponsibility.
But more than that, I'll connectyou with the business owners
that I think you need to know tomake your dream happen.
All of that is how this podcastwas born.
So if that sounds good andyou're interested in finding out
more, reach out at jen atgensway.com.
Now back to the show.
(26:29):
Now you mentioned at anetworking event, you believed a
group of women was talking aboutyou and talking about you
negatively.
How do you keep going to the netto the networking event and how
do you brush that brush that offfor lack of better term?
And show up at the next onethat's a big group of women and
(26:49):
just keep moving forward.
SPEAKER_01 (26:51):
Yeah, clearly I didn't that weekend, which is
why I told you, sorry if Ididn't talk to you, I was being
weird.
You know, fortunately, I wasattending that event with two of
my very best friends, and sothat was very helpful.
But I think a big part of it forme, that was really a good
learning experience in that atthe beginning of that event, I
(27:14):
was thinking, I want to putsomething like this on.
I think this would be reallycool.
I think I could do somethingsimilar to this, not the same
thing, but similar.
And then after that, and acouple other things that
happened that weekend, Ithought, why would I ever think
I would be the one to put thison?
You know, I was watching Cammyand she's amazing.
And I was like, this is likethis is not, why would why would
(27:35):
I think I could do this?
And the more I thought about it,the more I thought, this is
actually exactly why I would bethe person to do it, right?
Because there are so many womenout there who are entrepreneurs
who think I can't succeedbecause I don't check X, Y, and
Z box, right?
I'm not a, you know, you and Italked about Jess Sato.
(27:58):
She was speaking at thatconference we were at, and she's
one of my very best friends.
And we are such differenthumans.
Like she is so type A.
I'm not sleeping till I get thisdone.
I will be the best ateverything.
And she's been that way sinceshe was in high school.
And I love that about her.
And I've learned so much fromher.
And I am the person that's like,I'm not setting my alarm.
(28:22):
I'll wake up when I wake up.
I hate waking up in the morning.
Waking up in the morning is theworst thing ever in the world.
I've tried to make myself amorning person a thousand times.
I can't do it.
I, you know, I have ADHD, Imanage it well most of the time.
I have never been anoverachiever.
I've always been the one that'slike, I can study the night
(28:42):
before and get a C.
That's perfect.
What why why would I do morethan that?
That doesn't even make sense.
And so, like, really figuringout how to show other people
that there is a place for themtoo, that they can still be
successful without feeling likethey have to like fit the mold.
(29:03):
And it's okay that other peopledon't get you.
It's okay that you're not whatthey were expecting you to be
when they saw you on Facebook.
Like, I think it's probably safeto say most of us, if we're
being authentic, most of us arenot in real life exactly what
you're expecting from ourInstagram, right?
(29:24):
I mean, some of us are closerthan others.
SPEAKER_02 (29:27):
I'm pretty close.
I will say, I was gonna say, Iwould say at this point, you and
I are pretty close.
Yeah, but yeah, but it takes alot, it takes work to get there
though, to actually I meanthat's a whole nother
conversation, but showing uponline as you actually are.
Um but that's not something thatI know that's a whole part of
identity as an entrepreneur,too, and how you think you're
(29:47):
supposed to show up online whenreally like the more authentic
and aligned you can show uponline, that's a whole nother
piece to this.
That I I mean, you and I haveonly had a couple live
conversations, but I feel like Ireally try.
Truly know you because of ourinteractions online, because you
do show up probably 95% exactlyas who you are in person.
(30:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (30:08):
And that's one thing, like to go back to your
answer to the question of how doI keep going?
How do I keep showing up?
How do I keep being myself?
What I've found, especially inthe Powerful Women Rising
community and on these virtualspeed networking events, I think
it's really hard to find virtualnetworking events that are worth
your time.
And this one, like not to tootmy own horn, but toot toot, it
(30:30):
is.
It's amazing every single month.
And I think part of the reasonfor that is because I have
realized that the more I show upauthentically, the more I give
other women permission to do thesame thing.
And when they find a space whereit feels not even just like safe
and accepted, but likeencouraged for them to be
(30:52):
themselves, they want that.
They want to hang on to that.
They want to be a part of that.
They want more of it.
And so that's what I just keepreminding myself.
Some to go back to the onlinedating analogy.
When I would work with myclients on their like online
dating profiles, sometimes theywould say, I don't want to put
that on my profile.
Like that's going to turn peopleoff, or that's going to make
people think I'm blah, blah,blah.
(31:12):
I'm like, well, you are, you arethat.
And it's equally as importantthat you turn people off as it
is that you turn people on, orweird way to say that, but
especially when we're talkingabout online dating.
But you know, it's and that'swhat I keep telling myself is
like, if those women weretalking about me, they were
(31:34):
never my people to begin with,right?
But then I show up to the nextevent and I am my authentic
self.
For every one person that'slike, ew, what is she?
Why is she doing that?
Why is she like that?
She's not even funny.
There's 10 other people that arelike, oh my God, I love her.
I don't know why, but I want tobe around her.
SPEAKER_02 (31:52):
And even if it's the opposite, if there's 10 people
that are like, oh, she's not mypeople, that one person that's
like that feels seen by you,that feels that connection, is
so much better than if therewere 20 people who love you for
not being you.
And I I want, I'm gonna bringthis back to social media for a
second because I think this isreally important right now,
(32:13):
especially.
And I won't get too political,but this is something I I think
is so important as businessowners that you can share your
opinions and beliefs on socialfor this exact reason we're
talking about, though.
Because even if you turn off 10people and you lose 10 follows
because you share whatever's onyour heart, I don't care, I
don't care what side you're on,I don't care what your beliefs
(32:35):
are, you lose 10 people, thatone person that's like, oh, I
align with her, I see her, itcan make all the difference, not
just as a business owner, but asa human being, which is what
this is all about ultimately.
But every facet of yourself isso important.
And it's, I mean, the datinganalogy is perfect because let's
say you put the thing on your ordon't put the thing on your
(32:57):
profile because you're afraid ofit, and now you lose the chance
to connect to the person thatwould have loved that about you.
And so just be you and the grayarea is boring.
Be the most colorful, or maybeyou like muted colors, whatever
version of yourself.
And the people that are supposedto find you are gonna find you.
(33:19):
Like I get told I'm intimidatingall the time, which blows my
mind.
I remember I was at a yogastudio, and a couple of the
newer teachers were like, you'rejust you're so down to earth,
and we thought you were you wereso intimidating for so long.
And so I went through this shortperiod of time that is like, how
do I stop coming off asintimidating?
And then I was like, you knowwhat?
It's it's just who I am, andthat's okay.
(33:40):
And the people that are meant toget to know me on a deeper level
are going to see whatever thatintimidation is.
And you have to just keepshowing up, you have to keep
digging a little bit deeper andshowing those parts of you
because someone's gonna lovethem, whether it's a business
associate, a personalrelationship, whatever.
What makes your virtual eventsdifferent from other?
(34:03):
I know there's a video you haveout there of like you attending
a virtual event and then makingyour own because of how, right?
Uh, so what makes yoursdifferent?
What have you experienced invirtual events that makes them?
I mean, we've all experiencedbad virtual events, but in your
experience, what makes a virtualevent boring or a dud versus
what you do every month forpeople?
SPEAKER_01 (34:24):
Yeah, that's a great question.
Before I answer it, I just wantto say just because other people
are intimidated doesn't meanyou're intimidating.
SPEAKER_02 (34:32):
That's yes, that is an important reminder.
SPEAKER_01 (34:34):
People have been telling me I'm intimidated my
whole life.
That's mostly because I have anRBF.
You have to Google that if youdon't know what that stands for,
but I don't know if I'm allowedto swear here.
Yes.
Okay, so resting bitch face,yes, is apparently very
intimidating.
But you know, I I'm just like,just because you're intimidated
doesn't mean I'm intimidating.
Yeah, we all own our feelings.
(34:55):
Okay, so to answer yourquestion, I it's funny.
This is a funny story.
I went to a virtual event once,which was shortly after I
started doing my own.
And it was all for womenentrepreneurs.
And I was like, oh, this isgonna be amazing.
And I got on and like everythingleading up was like, this is
gonna be really good.
I got on and I was watching theparticipant count on Zoom go up
(35:17):
and up and up and up.
And I was like, what is thislady doing?
I mean, she had over 300 peopleon this virtual networking call.
And I was like, wow, like Ithought I was doing good.
At that point, I had like 50 or60 on mine.
And I was like, you are blowingthis out of the park.
I would say probably 250 ofthose women never turn their
(35:38):
cameras on.
And so she puts us in a break inour first breakout room.
I'm literally in a room withfive other people.
Four of them don't have theircameras on, one of them has her
camera on, and I can see her.
It's very dark, but I can seeher, but she's not speaking.
And no one's speaking.
And so me, I'm like, hi, how iseverybody today?
(36:02):
No one responds.
Like, I don't even know ifanyone's like paying attention.
I don't know what's happening.
And so I'm like, okay.
And so I sat there for a littlebit and then I was like, this is
so weird.
So I left the breakout room.
I went back to the main room andI was like, hi, nobody was
talking.
Everybody had their cameras off.
She's like, Oh, I'm so sorry.
Let me put you in another room.
Put me in another room.
Exact same thing.
And I was like, and I'm out.
(36:24):
So that's one of the reasons Ihave a rule on our virtual speed
networking event, you have tohave your camera on because
nobody wants to have aconversation with a black
screen.
It's so awkward.
Like, I will do it if I have to.
But even when I'm recording likeaudio only podcasts, I'm like,
can we still please put ourcameras on?
Because it's so weird to justhave this conversation, stay
(36:46):
either staring at my own face orlike staring at your name on the
black screen.
SPEAKER_02 (36:50):
And also ADHD, like I'm undiagnosed ADHD.
When I'm not seeing a face, I'mlike, I can get so easily
distracted.
Versus right now, I feel likeI'm talking to you.
So it's so much you've it's justeasier to stay engaged and see
how people respond, nodding yourhead, smiling, whatever, and
being human.
Anyway.
(37:11):
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (37:12):
So I give a little spiel at the beginning of every
event where I'm like, leave yourcamera on, make sure that you're
not distracted, make sure thatyou can hear people and other
people can hear you.
I don't love a virtualbackground.
I don't tell people you can'tuse a virtual background, but I
do say it's it's not the bestbecause a lot of times, like it
looks weird for starters.
(37:32):
Like we know you're not at thebeach.
Number two, a lot of times thoselike green screen ones, like if
you move just a little bit, allof a sudden we don't see like
half your head.
And you don't know that we don'tsee half your head, but we're
like trying to have a normalconversation with you and you've
disappeared into the palm tree.
So things like that, that I'mjust like, these are my
recommendations.
I always tell people, and thisis I think is good practice in
(37:54):
any virtual event, don't dropall your info in the chat unless
the host asks you to, becauseinevitably there is someone who
logs into that call and is like,hi, I'm Cindy.
I live in South Africa and I doweb design, and here's my
website, and I offer a freeconsultation, and here's the
link, and here's my phonenumber, and here's my email, and
here's my Instagram.
As soon as one person does that,everyone else sees that and is
(38:17):
like, oh, that's what we'redoing.
And now you have 80 people'sinformation in the chat.
And guess how many people haveseen yours?
Literally none.
None.
Yeah.
So I always tell people that,and that I think is very
different than a lot of virtualevents.
I send out several emails inadvance of the event, just
saying, like, this is what youshould expect.
This is what we're doing.
(38:38):
Don't come if you can't turnyour camera on, that kind of
stuff.
And just kind of outline somethings for them about like some
very simple things that they maybe doing without even knowing
it, that is creating a salesyweirdo vibe, like dropping your
information in the chat, or um,I provide a contact list to
everybody who attends the event.
So it's up to you whatinformation you share on that
(39:00):
contact list.
Um, but everyone shares whateverinformation they want to share.
And then I compile that, I sendit out to everyone who is
registered.
And I'm always very specificabout this is why you're getting
this information.
This is an appropriate use ofthis information.
This is not an appropriate useof this information.
Still, sometimes I'll getpeople, usually there's like six
(39:20):
people all in a row that willforward me an email like salesy
weirdo alert.
Cause I don't know, people justdon't believe me when I say it.
But so that's part of it too, islike I'm very specific with them
about like, here's how you can,here's who you should reach out
to from this list.
Here's how you should reach outto them in a personalized human
way without being a salesieweirdo.
(39:41):
And then the other thing is weusually get to at least three
breakout rooms.
So you have an opportunity tomeet between 12 and 15 other
women.
And I'm very specific aboutmaking sure that everyone has
enough time.
Don't be the person who talksthe whole time and then is like,
oh my gosh, we have 60 secondsleft.
I'm sorry nobody else got totalk.
Like that is such a bad look,you know, things like that to
(40:03):
make sure that you are having agood experience, that you're not
just answering the question andtalking while the other four
people in your breakout room areclearly doing something else on
their screen.
Like that's such a terriblefeeling.
And if we're here to createconnections, then let's create
connections.
And I always give them aquestion or a topic to discuss
(40:23):
in the breakout room.
And I try to make it somethingthat is allows them to learn
about each other's businesses,but also allows them to learn
about the person.
And there's there's a there's abalance there, right?
Like we don't, I don't want tojust put you in a room for you
to hear everybody's sales pitchor everybody's 60 second
elevator commercial, whateverwe're calling it.
But I also don't want to put youin a room to hear, like, if you
(40:46):
were an animal, what would yoube?
Like that's not that's notconnecting you with anyone,
that's not telling you muchabout who they are.
So I will ask things like, whydid you to share why you started
your business or why youcontinue on in your business?
Because that gives you anopportunity to talk about your
business, but then they also getto hear like the person and the
human and the heart behind thebusiness.
(41:07):
So I think the questions make adifference too.
SPEAKER_02 (41:12):
Sometimes networking groups have really weird
questions.
It's it's like the icebreakersfrom especially like high
school, those really weird,awkward questions.
And then it's it feels judgmentaround your answer versus if you
just asked me why I'm still inmy business, I can answer that
all day long.
SPEAKER_01 (41:30):
That's amazing.
I was on one once and they putus in breakout rooms and we were
supposed to share who ourcelebrity crush was.
And I was I literally laughed.
I was like, not only do I notwant to answer this question,
but I don't, I literally don'tcare about your answer.
SPEAKER_02 (41:45):
That's I mean, that's part of it too, is the
other people have to actuallycare to hear about it.
Right.
And why does it matter?
SPEAKER_01 (41:51):
No, I'm not gonna connect with you afterwards just
because I'm like, oh my God, youthink Kevin Costner is hot on
Yellowstone, so do I.
Let's connect.
Like that's not the foundationof business relationships.
SPEAKER_02 (42:04):
All right, a question that I always love to
ask because entrepreneurship ishard, or entrepreneurship can
get lonely.
I mean, your firstentrepreneurship
entrepreneurship experience, youwere handed a client list, which
is like, what do you mean thatyou would all?
Right?
If it had been this, you wouldhave been like, what are you
talking about?
I just had a business.
But what keep what's the fire?
(42:26):
What keeps you going when shitgets hard in entrepreneurship?
SPEAKER_01 (42:31):
Yeah, I think it I mean, this is probably what most
people say, but I I would say abig piece of it is going back to
the why, going back to thatfeeling that I felt when I heard
those women talking about me.
That feeling that I felt when Iwas in eighth grade.
I just shared this on Instagramrecently, and we switched
(42:51):
schools and I didn't knowanybody.
And I ate lunch in the bathroomby myself for the first two
weeks because I didn't want tosit out there by myself.
And I go back to that feeling,like all the times that I have
felt like I was too much or notenough or didn't belong or
something was wrong with me.
(43:11):
And I know that there are somany more adult women out there
who feel like that sometimestoo.
I mean, I still feel like thatsometimes.
And so I know how much valuethere is in having a space where
they don't feel like that, wherethey feel like they can show up
and be like, this is really,really hard.
(43:32):
And I'm really struggling withbasically everything in my
business without the women thatthey're networking with being
like, oh, I would never refer toher.
She's failing, you know?
Or show up and be like,sometimes they'll come to the
mastermind calls and they'll belike, I need ideas for how to
market this.
And somebody will be like, oh,do this, this, and this.
And they're like, I don't wantto do that.
(43:53):
Like, I just don't want to dothat.
And so to have that space whereyou feel like you can be honest,
you can be true to yourself, youcan be authentic, you are
encouraged to build a businessthe way that you want to build
it, as opposed to following thislike cookie-cutter script of how
it's supposed to be done.
I just think that's soimportant.
(44:13):
And I know that it's made adifference in my life.
And I've heard from so manywomen in my community how much
of a difference it's made intheir lives.
And even just my monthly speednetworking events.
Every time there I get at leastone email afterwards, usually
more, that are like, this is thefirst networking event I've ever
been to, and it was amazing.
I had someone tell me once,like, this is the first time
(44:35):
I've ever not felt completelyawkward and out of place at a
networking event or things likethat.
And so that's the kind of stuffthat like, and I I I tell the
women in the community this too,when they feel like they don't
want to keep going, is likethere is someone out there right
now who is suffering becausethey don't know that you exist.
They don't know that you existand that you have the solution
(44:59):
to their problem.
And so if you sit here today andyou give up or you decide I'm
done talking about my businessfor the next month or whatever
else, like you are this is thisis deep and not factually
accurate, but you areessentially allowing that person
to continue on in their miserybecause they don't know that you
(45:23):
exist.
And so I just always try toremember that for my own self
too.
Like, there's a woman, there's afemale entrepreneur out there
right now who maybe doesn't evenknow that she needs the powerful
women rising community, but assoon as she finds it, is gonna
be like, oh my god, I didn'teven know this was what I
needed.
And when I think about it thatway, how could I not keep going?
SPEAKER_02 (45:46):
You gave me goosebumps.
That's yeah, that's incredible.
How can people get involved inwhat you do?
Where can they find you?
When's the next virtual event?
Give us all the details.
SPEAKER_01 (46:00):
Sure.
So the easiest way is mywebsite,
powerfulwomenrising.com.
That will take you a link to mypodcast, which is also called
Powerful Women Rising.
There's an event section on thatpage, which will take you to the
next upcoming virtual speednetworking event.
I don't know when this isairing, but they're always on
the second Thursday of themonth.
So the next one is February13th.
SPEAKER_02 (46:20):
This will air right before that.
SPEAKER_01 (46:21):
So okay, perfect.
So join us February 13th.
If you've never been before, youcan use the promo code first
time and attend at no cost.
I mean, the tickets are onlyfive bucks.
We do that to help weird wheelweed out the salesy weirdos, but
we'd love to have you attend thefirst time using that promo
code.
And also have been doing a loton threads lately.
I really tried to make myselflove Instagram and I couldn't do
(46:44):
it.
And I'm loving threads.
So if you want to connect withme on threads, I would love to
connect with you over there too.
SPEAKER_02 (46:50):
I love your threads.
They're and you've built quite afollowing really quickly in
threads, which is amazing.
I actually saw somebody say likethreads isn't what I thought it
would be, and that made me sadbecause I think threads is one
of the happiest places on theinternet right now.
Like it truly is.
I posted a thread, this was acouple months ago now, that I
(47:11):
finally feel committed towriting my first book, which is
a goal of mine this year.
And the amount of support I gotfrom total and complete
strangers on threads was almostoverwhelming.
It was incredible.
I mean, I saw an author that isreleasing a new, I guess,
thriller or horror novel.
(47:32):
And Stephen King replied to herabout her novel.
And now his quote is going onher book.
And like, threads is a gem.
So if you are not on threads, Isuggest it.
There is political contentthere, there is whatever, you
know, there's the good and thebad, like any other platform.
But I have found it's reallyeasy to find your community on
(47:52):
threads.
SPEAKER_01 (47:53):
Yes.
And one of my favorite thingsabout threads, this here's
another pro tip is there's a notinterested button.
So if you see a post that'sabout politics and you're like,
I really don't want to see stuffabout politics, you just click
not interested, and there yougo.
SPEAKER_02 (48:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (48:06):
I love it so much.
SPEAKER_02 (48:07):
And it gets back to text.
I mean, you can post photos andvideos, but I don't see that
many photos and videos on mine.
It's back to like writtencontent.
And as an English major, assomeone who loves the written
word.
I like that I can just go overthere and post whatever random
thought has come my way.
There's no pressure of like, oh,I, you know, I already posted
(48:28):
today.
Who cares?
I have another random thought Iwant to share with the world.
So I'm going to.
So all that to say, if if you'renot on threads, go check out
threads.
All right, Melissa.
Well, I feel like you and Icould literally talk all day.
Uh, but I am very excited.
By the time this airs, I will bea new Colorado Springs resident.
So I am very much lookingforward to attending some
(48:50):
in-person stuff with you thisyear and getting to know you
better.
But I I so appreciate you takingthe time and sharing your
knowledge because you know,whether or not you have a
business or not, relationshipsare everything in life in
general.
And I think everything you'vesaid today really can apply to
business owners and non-businessowners.
It's kind of what we all need.
(49:11):
So thank you very, very much.
SPEAKER_01 (49:13):
Thank you.
Thank you.
I love chatting with you.
SPEAKER_02 (49:16):
And for everyone listening, if you want to hear
more about what I do as acreative strategist, you can
find me on Instagram atLifeGen's Way.
That also links to my threadsaccount, which again, love
threads.
Or my website is Jen atgensway.com.
Two ends on Jen always.
All right.
Thanks again, Melissa.
I look forward to what's next inthe networking world with you.
(49:40):
And for everyone listening,thank you so much.
And I'll talk to you next weekon your next business bestie.
Have a wonderful week.
SPEAKER_00 (49:49):
That's a wrap on this week's episode of Powerful
Women Rising.
Thanks for hanging out with us.
If you love the podcast, makesure to subscribe, share it with
a friend, write a review, or buyus a coffee.
Your support helps more womenlike you step into their power
and grow their businesses in away that feels real and true to
them.
Want to keep the party going?
(50:10):
Check out the show notes fordetails on our next virtual
speed networking event or joinus in the powerful women rising
community.
Until next time, remember thatbuilding a business your way is
the best way.
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